Am beginning to wonder if buying coupon eligible converter boxes is worth it.

I have VCRs and TVs and just realized that the utility of VCRs are also going to be significantly diminished.

It appears to me the VCR will only be able to record the channel the converter box is set to. So the box has to stay on when the VCR finally begins its timed recording. It also means a separate box for VCR and TV if you want to see anything different on the TV at the time of the recording.

Wonder what options may cost a slight bit more (not 100's) but allow the ability to record one show while watching others. I'm not up what's out there but wonder if there are units like DVD recorders that will bring in the new digital stations plus give back the ability we got used to with VCRs.

I'd prefer a hard disk recorder but expect they will be very expensive. One key item is that i do not have cable or satellite, so am looking for solutions that will support outside/indoor antennas.

Looking forward to the feedback from members of this forum. They seem very up to date on all this stuff. Way ahead of us newbies just getting our heads around the real impact of this upcoming change!

Thanks in advance for your info, thoughts and suggestions

There are a handful of DVD recorders available that will record digital QAM/ATSC channels as SD. No DVD recorders can record or output HD. Unfortunately, these DVD recorder products are also limited to a single digital tuner, so you can't watch one channel while recording another, nor can you record two different channels simultaneously.

Dual-tuner technology is expensive. You're not likely to see a standalone, subscription-free dual-tuner product for less than $300 in 2008. The most promising new product in that category is the upcoming [Echostar] Sling TR-50 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=972197). We don't know how much it will cost, but it should cost under $500. The obvious alternative is the TivoHD, which is available now in a $250 version with fees or a $699 version with no fees.

Yyou can buy a dual QAM PC tuner to your Vista PC for ~$170 (http://www.silicondust.com/wiki/products/hdhomerun), and then use the built-in Media Center software to record programs to your hard drive. You can then play those programs back on your PC, or on a $250 Vista Media extender elsewhere in your home.

have any one receied there dtv coupons yet?

Yes, I saw a few postings this past week on several forums from folks who have received their coupons.

Most all of the converter boxes I've read are like you said, single channel and cannot change by themselves. I'm holding out hope for the Echostar TR-40, which will be free after coupon and is supposed to have some sort of VCR program scheduler. That is it will change channels as a specific time, by itself. Note it is still only one tuner, so no watching one program while recording a different one, unless your TV has a digital tuner.
As far as paying a little more, I'm currently using a Samsung 260 tuner(which I will be returning shortly). It's ~$180, not coupon eligible since it has HD output and the scheduler does not work very well at all. Basically only goes out 6 hrs up to about 2 days. I'm really holding out my hopes for the TR-40.
Oh and as far as the new DVDR's w/built in digital tuners. Save your money, most are so buggy you'll be fighting them more than using them.
Personally I'm waiting for both the TR-40 and 50. Hopefully a couple of each.

Lastly I see you are talking VCR's, I believe??? Panasonic combo's for sure, you CANNOT record from the digital channels to VCR, only DVD, for what ever reason. The EZ-47 Panny combo is ~$300(and can be very problematic). Check out the DVD recorder forum for more info on it, and others.

very helpful replies. thanks.

RE: recording to VCR...
I have a standard standalone stereo VCR and figured you'd be able to use a converter box's RF output on channel 3/4 as input to the VCR to record what the converter box is playing. Won't this work?

I got the impression from one of the responses that it might not. I read the post to state that you'd only be able to record converter box output on DVDs. If so, why? Did I misunderstand?

By the way, I got my coupons the other day. That's what started my "adventure" into DTV land. Trying to figure out what to do with them. It's starting to sound like the Echostar is the best choice but won't be available until my coupons expire! GREAT!!!! It's be interesting to hear if anyone is hearing of any changes in the expiration policy.

That's mainly why I've waited and will continue waiting to request the coupons.

I wouldn't expect any flexibility regarding expiration policy.

have any one receied there dtv coupons yet?

The info from the site says
Its in the mail

jwinters, sorry if my post was the one that confused you about being able to record digital channels to your VCR. I was only referring to Panasonic(and maybe others) combo's that contain a DVDR and VCR with a built in digital tuner. On those units it's not possible to record digital channels to the VCR, only the DVDR.
Yes you should be able to record from a converter box to your VCR. I would personally use the composite (yellow) output and audio outputs, instead of the coax. RF output. You should get better PQ using the composite output, and note this is the only way you will get a stereo recording. I don't believe(I could be wrong) that the converter boxes would have stereo rf modulator in them.
Yes I too am dreading the day my coupons will come. I applied Jan14 but am really waiting for the TR-40, which last I heard was expected in June/July at the earliest.

As other have said you certainly can use a coupon converter box to supply input to your VCR to record. This is certainly the cheapest avenue. However there are other ways to record digital broadcasts in SD. Most are much better quality than a VCR recording. I have a Phillips DVD burner that records digital broadcasts to DVDs in DVD quality widescreen. It cost $169 at Wal Mart. Wal Mart also has a digital broadcast hard disk recorder with a DVD burner from Phillips for $269 or so.

Rick R

Oh…it’s going to be a very interesting year! For those who haven’t heard, over-the-air analog TV transmissions will cease on February 17, 2009. Assuming you don’t have cable or satellite, without a DTV converter box on your old set, all you will see is snow.

I signed up for the DTV converter box coupons on Jan 2nd, 2008, and received them on March 10th. Apparently, the first wave of recipients now have the coupons in their hands and are descending on the stores to make their purchases. Most of the dealers, I saw, had a minimum of stock. They are going fast!

Although there is a long list of brands and models to choose from according to the government list, the reality as of today is, that the choices are few. Perhaps two or three brands are available from the leading dealers consisting of Wal-Mart, Radio Shack, and Best Buy.

The ones I’ve seen all have similar features and connections. Supposedly there are more expensive models available, or will be available, which can be used with the coupon, and which have S-video, and/or analog feed-through. The analog feed-through is a nice feature for now, but a year from now will be of little value, as everything will be digital.

With similar electrical features inside the boxes, one needs to consider the importance of the Remote Control Unit. Hopefully, you can persuade the dealer to show you the remote. Check out its button placement, feel, control, and range. It can make a big difference in the ease-of-use and friendliness of the system.

I chose a Magnavox Model TB100MW9 from Wal-Mart. They seemed to have the lowest price and a good Return Policy. The unit’s remote is fair, but then again, I haven’t seen many to compare it to.

I used the “RF” option and tuned my TV to Channel 4 to see the digital output, much like you do with a VCR. My concern is, “What do I do with my analog VCR, and DVD recorder? Yes, you can record a show at a particular time and channel using a combination of the VCR’s timer and the converter box tuner, but you apparently loose the ability to pre-program multiple shows on different stations.

I was also a little surprised at the heat generated by the Magnavox Model. I wouldn’t call it “Hot” but, for the 8 watts it supposedly generates, it seems very warm when powered up. There is an auto-shutdown mode, which is programmable, and will help to “save the planet”.

Speaking of “saving the planet”, the Government has been very good about introducing Digital TV, and providing coupons and information, but, from what I’ve read, has done nothing about the upcoming onslaught of TV’s being dumped into land-fills during the next few years. This may make computer dumping seem like a drop in the bucket. Yes it is true, folks do not have to get rid of their old sets, but there is some inconvenience in using the converter box. Take “My Dear Aunt Sarah”, for instance. She bought her solid walnut, console TV back in the Eighty’s and it has served her well ever since. She feels that adding “one more black box” to the top of her set will totally ruin the décor, and destroy any Feng Shui left in the room. This may put her “over the edge”. Aside from all the big sets, I am concerned about all those small kitchen portables, and the neat little Sony personal TVs. Converting them to digital just doesn’t pay. Not to mention all the VCR’s with analog tuners.

And now, for some good news…
The unit was easy to hook up. I could not believe the quality and the quantity of the stations received! With the same outside antenna installed, what were once fuzzy UHF channels now came in crystal-clear! It is truly amazing! All the local stations were there and additionally, there were weather stations, religious venues, new Public TV, Spanish broadcasts, and a shopping channel. An electronic index for each station detailed what was on, and in most cases included a schedule for the day.

As I said, it is going to be an interesting year,

Ron K

I went to the local Wal Mart and the one closest to me is now all out of converter boxes. Both the Magnavox and RCA unit were gone. They had a pile two weeks ago. I guess those that got their coupons got in and got theirs. Hope the boxes are replentished soon and kept in supply.

Rick R

have any one receied there dtv coupons yet?

Website says mine is in the mail
That was 2 weeks ago

I had signed up for my coupons on January 2, and received my coupons last week. I used one of the coupons to buy the Insignia box (made by LG, and identical to the Zenith sold at Circuit City) at Best Buy. $20 plus tax, with the coupon.

It's small, seems solidly built, connected easily, scanned the local channels quickly, and receives everything in the area flawlessly (with the exception of KLDT-DT, which comes in with no sound on most newer tuners due to some sort of PSIP mess up at the station).

Overall, they seem to have done a good job on designing a box that I believe will be easy for non-techies to decipher, and which performs well.

Interestingly, I've also talked to a couple of coworkers who bought boxes at full price and are extremely pleased with what they are getting. Since they were used to analog SD, they're blown away by the picture quality that they're getting with the converter boxes, and both were surprised to discover that they're receiving a few extra channels, since they had never heard of subchannels prior to connecting their converter boxes. This transition could prove to be a success after all -- and could be a great boon to OTA broadcasters if the reaction of my coworkers is typical.

By the way, there's a lot of discussion of the converter boxes going on in the HDTV Reception Hardware forum (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forumdisplay.php?f=25).

Website says mine is in the mail
That was 2 weeks ago

Just got mine yesterday (2 Coupons)

I got my coupons last week (applied for them Jan 2). Used them at HHgregg in Columbus, OH for two Zenith DTT900s. Cost $8 (including tax) each. They were on sale for about $47.

I can not believe how great the reception is. I have told all my neighbors and they are also impressed. At least a few of them are planning on buying the converters and dropping cable tv. Granted, you only get local channels (plus some extras that they broadcast) - but they really come in great and the cost (after you get the converter) is ZERO. I'd be concerned if I was a cable / sattelite tv exec.

I've been using my DTV converter box for some time now. What is really starting to bug me is the intentional increase in volume of the commercials on some of the UHF stations with digital. I don't mind a slight increase, but with one of the stations, the commercial volume increase makes me run for the remote!

Anyone else notice this? Anything I can do about it?

I've been using my DTV converter box for some time now. What is really starting to bug me is the intentional increase in volume of the commercials on some of the UHF stations with digital. I don't mind a slight increase, but with one of the stations, the commercial volume increase makes me run for the remote!

Anyone else notice this? Anything I can do about it?

I know what you mean. I think the problem is that the network show is running a Dolby 5.1 soundtrack and the commercials don't. So that's why you get the discrepancy.

The only thing to do is to lobby the FCC so that they fix it.

However, even if they do fix it, the result might not be all that great. I remember reading something about the UK (I can't quite remember all of the details) where they have laws about the sound volume of commercials. They did a study and the result was that commercials were no louder than the programs in terms of peak volume. The difference was that commercials stayed at the peak volume for the whole time, while programs typically have peaks and valleys. Either way, it is still annoying.

ft

I remember reading something about the UK (I can't quite remember all of the details) where they have laws about the sound volume of commercials. They did a study and the result was that commercials were no louder than the programs in terms of peak volume. The difference was that commercials stayed at the peak volume for the whole time, while programs typically have peaks and valleys.I've heard of studies in the US with the same results.  But there's no argument against a regulation on average volume instead of or as well as one on peak volume.

I've heard of studies in the US with the same results.* But there's no argument against a regulation on average volume instead of or as well as one on peak volume.

Ther's no easy way to measure average volume. And if there were, it would screw up real programming (loud scenes in movies) also.

There's no easy way to measure average volume.Good point, because there's the question of how to select the points in time between which the averages are taken.And if there were, it would screw up real programming (loud scenes in movies) also.Not to mention what it would do to live broadcasts.

A Hard Rain's A-Gonna Fall, Bob Dylan

The other night I attempted to watch a movie on ION Television, our local channel 61. The rain fell hard outside and, inside, my DTV picture and sound continually broke up. It was not a pleasant experience. This occurred with a signal strength of about 85, definitely in the "GREEN" zone. I had seen such an effect while watching satellite TV in a snow storm.

I switched sets and tried using a different antenna system- same results. It's true, I live far from the transmitters. Maybe if I lived in the city, reception would be better.

In any event, if this is going to be the quality of DTV at my house, it may be time for cable or FIOS.

Ron K