Grex Advanced video stabilizer vs Video Filter [Text View]

jim26

10-17-08, 04:25 PM

I just bought the DP-X7000 and hooked it up from my dvd player and the recorder.The picture quality is not as clear as i wanted it to be.There are green color bars in the background and i tried to adjust the picture settings on the unit but still there.Is it suppose to do that?I have been using a video converter (cmd-850) before this that is used to convert pal european tv signals into ntsc american tv signals when using a multi-region dvd player, or a pal vcr.As a benifit it bypasses the copy protection.Anyways,i hooked it up from my dvd player and dvd recorder and it does allow it to record 99 percent of the time.You loose a little bit of the color but not enought to really tell though.I want something that is made to by pass the recording stages.I think that the converter works better than the Dp-X7000.When i talked to the dealer that sold me the unit he says he never heard of it doing that and it may be defective.When i told him about the video converter he said it isn't suppose to do that.But it does.Does anyone have problems with their picture quality on the Dp-X7000?Do you see any green bars on your screen after hooking it up.Thanks for your input.

Rammitinski

10-17-08, 04:48 PM

Yes, I see them faintly with my Sima against a black background.

Some people say they don't see anything, so I don't know if it's a consistency thing or what.

I'd probably just return it then if the other one works 99% of the time and you can live with or adjust the color fade.

jjeff

10-17-08, 04:58 PM

CitiBear

10-17-08, 05:22 PM

The "Video Filter" is probably the best of the current options with its generally positive feedback, although its a tad pricey (worth it for the widescreen feature). The Grex has as many detractors as fans, ditto the World Import options. The Sima-based units do have a history of adding slight-to-moderate picture defects: it depends on your particular unit and what you think you can live with. After repeated failures with an array of expensive options, I ended up buying a second-hand Sima CT200 for $115 last year. It occasionally makes the image a little funky, but I'm willing to tolerate it for the filtering capability. One thing I can say for the Simas, nothing gets past them: they work every time against every CP scheme with every combination of source and recorder. I have been disappointed by other units, most notably the $500 DataVideo TBC-1000. The Simas may be slightly flawed but they're killer- if you get a decently functioning one at a reasonable price, they're golden.

jjeff

10-17-08, 05:31 PM

Citibear, have you had an opportunity to try your Sima with BR? For example playing a BR disc and recording it SD to a DVDR. I agree it's never failed me but then again I don't have a BR player.

joed32

10-18-08, 09:11 AM

I have a CT200 and a DP5000 and a DPX7000 and I don't see any green bars in any of them. Will they let you return it?

CitiBear

10-18-08, 11:22 AM

Sorry, jjeff, I don't have a BR player either so can't verify if the Simas are effective for that source. I would think they have as much chance of being effective as anything else out there, since SD recorders were never updated to be responsive to any newer analog protection schemes. The updated Blu-Ray CP specs are more targeted against digital-to-digital backup attempts with PCs.

jjeff

10-18-08, 06:30 PM

You're probably right although it would be nice to get a real world conformation. I remember when getting the Simas they it said it would be good for any current or future CP schemes since it totally recreated the vertical interlace signal, or something to that effect.

civilsavage

11-06-08, 01:21 PM

I just got DP-x7000 yesterday.

It seems to do all as advertised plus a couple other items that I wish it didn’t.

I don’t like what it has done to black levels. And although I have no "green bars" as the user stated above, The unit has added unwanted green to dark scenes. Normal and bright scenes seem ok or at least tolerable but I have to remember that my front projector shooting a 100" picture is not very forgiving.

Nonetheless I’m pleased that I can know backup my huge collection of animated children VHS's. It does great on those.

hermey

12-07-08, 12:27 PM

I am trying to record widescreen (16:9). When I plug in the power to the Grex Full I do get a widescreen (16:9) display for about 3 seconds then it goes back to standard (4:3). It is obvious that the Grex Full DOES carry a 16:9 display but how do I get it to keep the 16:9 setting (both my cable box and DVD recorder are set to 16:9)? I tried all three Operational modes (1, 2 & 3 and the FW version is v72) but it still goes from the (16:9) display for about 3 seconds back to standard (4:3) diplay. Does the Grex Full support 16:9 (widescreen) recording?

Rammitinski

12-07-08, 01:15 PM

If you're recording to DVD-RAM it should work, (it does for me with my Pannies and my Sima), but otherwise, the Grex will just letter box it in 4:3.

The Video Filter sounds like it might be the only one that will do it, but I'm not sure. Citibear could answer that better, I'm sure, since he has one.

hermey

12-07-08, 01:49 PM

Thanks Rammitinski... I have an external Sony DVD recorder hooked to my STB. Not sure what you mean by "recording to DVD-RAM".

hermey

Rammitinski

12-07-08, 02:44 PM

It's a disc format. No Sony's have ever used it, so forget about it. Looks like you're stuck with letterboxed widescreen using the Grex.

I think there may be some here that have "finagled" a widescreen picture out of it, between settings on the recorder and the TV's aspect ratio's, but I don't know how acceptable it really looks. You'll have to wait for some of them to see this and chime in.

I know just zooming it on the TV will work, but you do lose a lot of sharpness that way.

hermey

12-07-08, 05:56 PM

Thanks Rammitinski. That may be the only work around (zooming in). Hopefully, others may have some feedback...

kjbawc

12-08-08, 04:42 AM

Sounds to me like the Grex is filtering out the flag, so you need to manually switch your TV's picture to wide. I don't see how the Grex could letterbox something itself, it will just pass on an anamorphic signal, that is 16x9 squeezed into a 4x3 frame, if that is what is input to it.

Rammitinski

12-08-08, 04:48 AM

If I record from any recorder to one of my Pannies using the Sima and DVD-RAM, it always comes out true 16:9, if that's what the source is. Of course, I have to set the source player to output 16:9, too.

Most recorders will only letterbox it in 4:3 when you're using -/+R/RW, though.

So my Sima at least doesn't filter it out when I'm using DVD-RAM. I think it just depends on the media you use.

kjbawc

12-08-08, 05:50 AM

So my Sima at least doesn't filter it out when I'm using DVD-RAM. I think it just depends on the media you use.

How can a video filter know what sort of media you have in your DVDR? What if you record it to the HDD, then to disc? The filter couldn't know that either.

Rammitinski

12-08-08, 07:30 AM

How can a video filter know what sort of media you have in your DVDR?Now you're confusing me. I didn't quite say that.

I see what you're saying, though - that the filter either strips the widescreen flag or it doesn't. If it leaves it in, you should be able to record to any disc format, right? I wasn't really thinking. Lack of sleep.

Logic Design

12-08-08, 08:20 AM

There is a difference between the Grex and the Video Filter when it comes to Widescreen Signaling...The Grex doesn't have the ability to change the flag. It outputs what it comes in. On the other hand, the Viedo FIlter actually allows you to change the flag. Yo can set it to 4:3 or 16:9 with a switch progammed exactly to do that.

As far as different media, neither unit cares what media is used. It's a matter of what the recorder itself allows you to do with the media.

CitiBear

12-08-08, 12:57 PM

If it leaves it in, you should be able to record to any disc format, right? I wasn't really thinking. Lack of sleep.

Actually, I think you were right the first time (you usually are:D): many people, especially newbies, aren't familiar with the vagaries of different media types and how the recorders and copy protect schemes interact with the media. This is especially true of DVD-RAM, which is virtually unknown to video consumers unless they have a Panasonic recorder (or newer Pioneer) that promotes DVD-RAM. The video filters of course do not know what type of media you're using: instead, its a question of how your recorder is engineered to react to various kinds of media. At least in Panasonics case, I believe many of their recorders have optimized the full set of features for DVD-RAM, with less features for DVD-R and R/W. Using RAM media allows full 16:9 recording, while anything else is a gamble. With other machines, R/W media is allowed to record certain kinds of copy-protected broadcasts while DVD-R is locked out completely. This is the kind of arcane info spelled out in the instruction manuals that none of us ever reads until forced to by an issue like this.

Other than the early Toshibas and a handful of new ATSC-tuner models, no stand-alone DVD recorder can be relied on for predictable, consistent 16:9 capabilities. Even the new ATSC models are all over the place on this: some reduce 16:9 broadcasts to 4:3 letterbox, others record 16:9 intermittently, and pretty much none except the old Toshibas will do 16:9 properly via line inputs. Your recorder is a bigger factor than your CP filter: if the recorder cannot be switched manually to 16:9 or auto-sense 16:9 input using your preferred media type, it doesn't matter whether your filter passes 16:9 or not: the recorder will reduce everything to 4:3 letterbox. If you are very lucky, it will record 16:9 but without the flag, so the recording would be "squished" if played on older 4:3 displays. This is another reason DVD recorders are rapidly waning in USA popularity: people have long since made the move to 16:9 displays, and want their recorders to work reliably in that format. So far, they don't.

Rammitinski

12-08-08, 01:29 PM

Actually, I think you were right the first time..Yeah, that was my immediate thought. Once I started thinking about it too much, I confused myself. :)

hermey

12-08-08, 03:27 PM

I'm having a hard time finding the "Video Filter" searching the internet. Anyone have the link?

jjeff

12-08-08, 03:44 PM

The first post on this thread has a link for both the video filter and the Grex.

kjbawc

12-09-08, 07:00 AM

Other than the early Toshibas and a handful of new ATSC-tuner models, no stand-alone DVD recorder can be relied on for predictable, consistent 16:9 capabilities. Even the new ATSC models are all over the place on this: some reduce 16:9 broadcasts to 4:3 letterbox, others record 16:9 intermittently, and pretty much none except the old Toshibas will do 16:9 properly via line inputs.
All I know is that if I feed my Pio 640 an anamorphic signal, over the S-Vid, from whatever source, or copy a non-protected DVD directly to the HDD, either with "Disc Backup," or in real-time, then burn to disc, I get an anamorphic recording just like the original. Well, no DD 5.1 audio, of course... :D

But, I know nothing about setting the flag, since my Sammy DLP needs to be manually set to wide, or 4x3, no matter what I feed it, from whatever I feed it.

hermey

12-09-08, 11:36 AM

I get it now. I played around with the Grex last night and realized the 16:9 broadcasts ARE being squeezed into the 4:3 letterbox. Can't tell you how much I appreciate all of the feedback and the time and frustration you all have saved me. I'm returning the Grex and wanting to go with the Video Filter. Am I correct in assuming this will solve my problem. In other words does the Video Filter also squeeze the 16:9 broadcasts into the 4:3 letterbox or will it display full screen (w/o the squeeze effect?)... Btw. I have a Sony DVD Recorder (RDRGX330) and AT&T STB...

CitiBear

12-09-08, 12:25 PM

All I know is that if I feed my Pio 640 an anamorphic signal, over the S-Vid, from whatever source, or copy a non-protected DVD directly to the HDD, either with "Disc Backup," or in real-time, then burn to disc, I get an anamorphic recording just like the original.

Using "Disk Backup" mode doesn't count:D: thats just making a bit-for-bit digital copy of material already formatted professionally for 16:9. Pioneers based on the now-standard 640 chassis (the 550, 560, etc.) are as inconsistent as any other recorder when using the S-video input with an anamorphic source. You are lucky to benefit from a happy coincidence of a cable box and cable service that outputs 16:9 via the S-jack (most don't) in such a way that your particular 640 does not regress and reformat it as 4:3 letterbox on the fly. Even so, the 640 still doesn't embed the flag, which can cause problems on some displays and portable video devices if you attempt to re-purpose those recordings. Many members PM me to report their experiences with various Pioneers, the 16:9 thing comes up a lot in their notes.

Don't get me wrong, I love Pioneers, use three of my own and repair them for others as a hobby: great rugged machines. But the industry long ago made a decision NOT to actively support 16:9 in DVD recorders as a predictable, standard feature: sometimes it works, sometimes it don't, and a lucky few with the "perfect" set of hardware matchups manage successful workarounds. The old Toshibas were the only consumer recorders ever produced with direct, intentional control over correct 16:9 recording including the flag which is more important than most users think (RIP, Toshiba XS). Every other recorder then and now relies on the random response of an auto-detect aspect ratio algorithm which guesses wrong most of the time, and none inserts the flag still required by some playback devices. If you want true, accurate, compatible, non-sloppy 16:9 recordings you need to use a HTPC. Or, record on a Panasonic standalone using DVD-RAM and rip it to DVD-R in a PC authoring program.

Rammitinski

12-09-08, 01:15 PM

Am I correct in assuming this will solve my problem. In other words does the Video Filter also squeeze the 16:9 broadcasts into the 4:3 letterbox or will it display full screen (w/o the squeeze effect?)...Citibear? You said you have one, right?

Church AV Guy

12-09-08, 02:04 PM

I have a Video Filter, and a Sima (don't remember the model). they "work" the same as far as I can tell. I haven't done a good side-by-side comparison to see which looks better, so no comment there. Neither of these devices is capable of reformatting the video stream that they are given, and I really doubt the Grex is capable either. Remember, these things only work with a 480i video stream, and the recorders will only accept a 480i video stream.

The phrase "squeeze the 16:9 broadcasts into the 4:3 letterbox" is confusing to me and needs further explanation. Please elaborate. Is the full screen 16:9 widescreen image being pillarboxed into a 4:3 format, horizontally compressed? Is it being letterboxed on the 16:9 screen, but still full width, vertically compressed? Is it having both happening and has black bars on all four sides (postage-stamped)? Is the aspect ratio of the image changed so the picture is distorted?

From the description provided so far, it sounds like the Grex is filtering the formatting INFORMATION from the stream, which is causing the downstream components to change the way the stream is displayed. I really doubt that IT is reformatting the video stream.

CitiBear

12-09-08, 02:06 PM

Citibear? You said you have one, right?

No, not that one: I mentioned it as having mostly good feedback from members compared to some other units but I don't own it myself. The builder specifically claims to have incorporated true 16:9 widescreen passthrough, so I'm guessing that is the case or people would be all over this board bitching him out:rolleyes:.

Leaving aside 16:9 features, I have tried the Grex briefly: thought it was lame for the price, and too many members echoed that experience. I have tried expensive TBCs like the DataVideo TBC-1000 and found they let CP slip past them sporadically, so once again lame for the price. Eventually I settled on a second-hand Sima CT-200, cost me $115 but never fails- ever. Many of what appear to be alternative units are actually outright knockoffs of the Sima, which is why they share some of its flaws, chiefly a tendency towards giving dark nighttime scenes a greenish-tinged embossed appearance. Since this image issue seems to afflict 85% of the filters out there, I would guess that there is more to getting rid of digital CP than just blanking a line or two in the video feed: filtering out the digital CP must entail some impact on the video. For the time being, I rarely encounter situations where I need a digital CP filter, but when I do I tolerate the Sima's slight flaws because it filters all CP completely. Most of my CP exposure comes from analog Macrovision on my long out-of-print obscure VHS collection, I filter these thru cheap analog VHS-only black boxes I pick up for $10-20. Analog filtering was perfected years ago, so the cheapo boxes do an amazing job with very little image degradation. I use the pricey, degrading digital filters only when I encounter digitally protected cable broadcasts (rare) or need to make a real-time analog backup copy of a damaged commercial DVD too scratched for PC backup software to decode.

hermey

12-09-08, 02:50 PM

hermey

12-09-08, 05:52 PM

I'm going to check the way s-video out works on the at&t/magnovox stb. I'll hook the s-video out from the stb directly to my widescreen tv and see if it displays "full width" 16:9 or squeezed into the 4:3 with the black bars on all four sides before I go any further. It may also be the way the Sony DVD Recorder interprets and records the 16:9 feed via s-video... I'm getting a lot of good info here!

kjbawc

12-09-08, 11:25 PM

Using "Disk Backup" mode doesn't count:D: thats just making a bit-for-bit digital copy of material already formatted professionally for 16:9. Pioneers based on the now-standard 640 chassis (the 550, 560, etc.) are as inconsistent as any other recorder when using the S-video input with an anamorphic source. You are lucky to benefit from a happy coincidence of a cable box and cable service that outputs 16:9 via the S-jack (most don't) in such a way that your particular 640 does not regress and reformat it as 4:3 letterbox on the fly.

Yeah, I knew "disc backup" didn't really count.

I'm not really lucky enough to get anamorphic out on S-Vid from cable, since I have Comcast.

The anamorphic ins on S-Vid I speak of have come from 4 different DVD players, set to output to a 16x9 display. The reasons I have done this in realtime, instead of disc backup, are various. I have two players that convert PAL to NTSC, so I use those for making NTSC dubs on the Pio. Also, sometimes the Pio won't play a particular disc, but another player will, so I have to copy it in realtime, or, I may just want a short film or two from a disc with many. I'd guess I've done 30-40 such anamorphic dubs, at least, and they have all worked. These were both pressed commercial discs, and -R and +R discs.

Logic Design

12-10-08, 07:51 AM

hermey

12-10-08, 12:23 PM

Here is what you need to know regarding how the Video FIlter handles 16:9 or 4:3.
If the video coming in is 16:9 it will output 16:9. If it is 4:3, it will output 4:3. In other words, it doesn't change the aspect ratio at all. The difference between the Video Filter and all other units, is that the besides giving the user the ability to set the Copy Generation flag, it also allows you to set the aspect ratio flag so that any device downstream that responds to the flag (like some Pioneer recorders and maybe some TV's), will record or display the image at the aspect ratio you tell it that the video is at.
With the feedback from all of you I FINALLY realized what I was expecting to see wasn’t possible via composite or s-video. What I WAS expecting was to get my 40” Sony Wega to display a full (end to end, top to bottom) widescreen (16:9) display. From what I’ve read hear it appears THE ONLY way to accomplish this would be if I was using component out (from the STB) to component in on a DVD recorder (which I don’t have and not aware of a DVD recorder w/ this capability (that I can afford anyway)). I am successful at recording widescreen (16:9) that fits into the 4:3 frame (squeezed into the 4:3 with the black bars on all four sides) using the Grex. What I ended up doing was setting the Wega to Wide/Zoom and it fills the screen (end to end, top to bottom) with decent video quality. Thanks for your patience w/ this newbie and I apologize for any confusion…

Rammitinski

12-10-08, 03:03 PM

J-Co

12-18-08, 01:41 PM

Looks like the video filter link in the first post of this thread is dead. Does anyone have a working link to somewhere that still sells it? Thanks.

Logic Design

12-18-08, 02:35 PM

Brighthouse Networks just changed the web pages to a different area.

The new link is http://home.roadrunner.com/~filter

HollyHobby

02-11-09, 02:28 AM

Most of my CP exposure comes from analog Macrovision on my long out-of-print obscure VHS collection, I filter these thru cheap analog VHS-only black boxes I pick up for $10-20. Analog filtering was perfected years ago, so the cheapo boxes do an amazing job with very little image degradation.

I know this reply/question is a couple months late, but I'm new to the forum so hope people are still monitoring this thread.

CitiBear (or anyone who can help), would you mind explaining those boxes further to me? That is all I really need. I just purchased a DVD/VHS recorder so I can update my VHS collection to DVD (I will be keeping my VHS's for originals, of course). Obviously, the copy-protected ones won't copy so I was searching around the 'net for alternatives when I found your note. I would like to know more about these "black boxes" and what exactly they are called so I can try to find one. It's a real heartbreak to be able to copy my Die Hard 1 tape but not my Die Hard 2 and 3. :( Worse yet is Highlander 1 and 2 but not 3 and 4!

Thank you.

jjeff

02-12-09, 01:44 PM

HollyHobby

02-12-09, 07:51 PM

Yes for VHS you don't need an expensive DVD filter like the two in the title of this thread. Note depending on your "combo" you may or probably may not be able to insert the filter between your VHS and DVD section. AFAIK all Panasonic combos allow you to route the signal through a external filter but I don't think many other brands allow this.
I too was wondering what Citibear was talking about then he's spoke about these cheap VHS filters, then about a month ago he posted a link and sure enough they were ~$20. You might want to try searching on his name to look for that post. I can't remember where it was but it would have been in the DVDR forum for sure.

Yes, you are right about the routing problems. Fortunately, I've already figured that part out <:D> I have extra VCR's and DVD's here that I can hook up to the VCR/DVD combo unit as an auxillary component. It has the inputs because the unit can also accept camcorders, etc. I haven't tried it yet, but will as soon as I get a few more VHS tapes done.

Just for info's sake, I have a Toshiba DV-R610. It's has a couple idiosyncrasies, but nothing to really complain about. There aren't many editing capabilities, but it gets the job done. There is always this folder called "Empty" that just drives me batty (it would be nice if it got deleted when you finalized the disk) and if you copy things in the wrong order, you can't change what order they are listed in.

Anyway, back to the subject at hand. At the same time I wrote the group, I wrote CitiBear a private message. He answered me back today with a wonderful note and a link. He said Qualitek had units that get decent reviews (the only complaint being the shipping costs). They run $25-$45 and suggested that the $45 might be the better quality one to get (shipping for that would be $17.50). As I read about it, it looks like it will do copy-righted DVD's as well. I tried to post the URL, but since I'm new the forum won't let me. To help you find it, spelled out it is "qualitekindustries dot com". As I think about it, I think it might be nice to have one that will do that. I have a teenage daughter with a constant stream of friends and it might be nice to back-up their favorite movies so the originals can stay clean.

The other consideration is still the World Imports DP-X7000 that you are all talking about. That one seems to get the best reviews. Do any of you know about the differences between the two units that might make paying twice the price for the DP-X7000 worth it?

Here's a tidbit of info I found out today that you all might find amusing. I figured out that I can copy my Men in Black 2 video, but not Men in Black 1. Hmmmm, now that's interesting. Did someone at the company give up on the idea of protecting it?;)

wajo

02-12-09, 07:59 PM

Just for info's sake, I have a Toshiba DV-R610. It's has a couple idiosyncrasies, but nothing to really complain about. There aren't many editing capabilities, but it gets the job done. There is always this folder called "Empty" that just drives me batty (it would be nice if it got deleted when you finalized the disk) ...
You can get rid of the Empty Title by Overwriting it, as described here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=12327722&postcount=26).

HollyHobby

02-12-09, 08:08 PM

You can get rid of the Empty Title by Overwriting it, as described here.

Thanks, wajo! I have a tape in now. When I finish the second one (I am trying to put two movies to a DVD) I will give that a try.

jjeff

02-12-09, 08:16 PM

HollyHobby

02-13-09, 12:24 AM

You can get rid of the Empty Title by Overwriting it, as described here.

Well, it sort of worked. Not exactly as the directions said, but I got the gist of what they were trying to say and adapted it to my system. Worked like a charm. I think I'll see if there's a Toshiba forum here and post it there. There's one at Amazon so will post there as well.

Thanks, wajo. At least now my disks look a little more cleaned up.

HollyHobby

02-13-09, 07:18 PM

I have a older Sima CT-2 that I bought at BB for ~$100 a few years back. It works on everything I've tried and works quite well. Personally don't have any experience with any other filter but from what I've read the Video filter is probably best followed closely by the Grex. I'd be a little leary of anything priced too low but maybe someone else has personal experience with the one you're looking at. If not and you decide to get it please post back your impressions. People are always looking for cheaper alternatives:)

Thanks for the recommendation on the CT-2 and the warning on buying something too inexpensive. I admit that that is my fear with a lower priced unit, but I also hate to spend more unnecessarily (or have to spend more down the road because I didn't buy well the first time). With us being laid off and no job prospects (Detroit's flooded with laid off engineers, I'm afraid) I shouldn't even be spending the money that I am. However, I don't want to be stuck down the road not able to play or back-up my VHS's, either.

I'll definitely report back here once I make a decision and try out whatever I've purchased.

HollyHobby

02-17-09, 04:01 PM

Well, I promised to report back which filter I decided to get and how it's working.

I ordered the DP-X7000 on Saturday evening, no mail on Sunday, no mail on Monday and it shows up at my doorstep on Tuesday. I tell you, if their fast service was any indication of the unit quality, I knew it was going to work ... which it did splendidly.

It hooked up easily between my external VCR and VCR/DVD combo. The only adjustment I have to make is telling my combo unit which jacks to read from. I put in a tape that I knew was copy-protected and it worked perfectly.

I'll hook up the external DVD player and test that as soon as I can.

joed32

02-18-09, 08:40 AM

Thanks for reporting back, glad you like it.

hermey

02-23-09, 12:32 PM

jjeff

02-23-09, 04:33 PM

Another option would have been the Apple TV converter. It converts component WS to WS S-video and also has the added benefit of removing CP. I believe it costs a little more than the Video Filter but with the Apple your could use ANY DVDR, not just one with component inputs. Just another thought.
http://www.svideo.com/appletv2tv.html

hermey

02-23-09, 06:59 PM

Thanks jjeff! Haven't seen the Apple TV converter before however I do have the Grex (for s-video). I've never been able to get the Grex via S-Video to record w/o it squeezing the 16:9 into a 4:3 letterbox (surrounded by the black bars). From what I understand, it's not possible (at least w/ the Grex). Here is my correspondence w/ Dimax (Grex manufacturer):

My tv is displaying the feed from the DVD recorder (playing regular 16:9 DVD movies) and STB output in 16:9. It switches from 16:9 to 4:3 when I play the Grex recorded DVD. I do have the STB video out and Sony DVD recorder in set to 16:9. Thanks again and I'm looking forward to your reply.

Dimax Tech support response (BTW. I've never heard back from them going on 3 months): We are checking it and we did see some problems in transferring WS signal. I will be back soon to you with details and possible solution. More likely we will send you updated unit once we done our research and fix it.

jjeff

02-23-09, 07:37 PM

kjbawc

02-24-09, 06:46 PM

I managed to find a factory refurbed (80 bucks) Philips DVDR 80 (component in/out) and was able to see and record in full 16:9 (on stations w/o the copy protection signal) w/ out the letter boxing (squeezed into the 4:3 with the black bars on all four sides). I have also ordered the video filter to remove the copy protection. Can't thank you all enough for your "direction". Thanks again for all your patience. Hat's off mi amigos!

If the Philips craps out on you, or you just want a better DVDR, you can probably use the Philips as a converter, and feed its S-Vid out to another DVDR, and get an anamorphic feed that way.

jjeff

02-24-09, 07:07 PM

Just thinking, but do you think the Philips would strip the CP like the Apple TV device? Probably not but thought I'd ask. You're probably right though, it would be a cheaper component to S-video converter.

kjbawc

02-24-09, 07:08 PM

It shouldn't, but you never know until you try.

hermey

03-13-09, 02:09 PM

I think your problem isn't so much what the Grex is doing but rather the way your STB outputs Wide Screen to it's S-video or component outputs. Many STBs letter box WS material to any output other than component or HDMI/DVI outputs.
If you get a DVDR like you did with component inputs you're set otherwise the Apple TV device will convert from component to S-video while preserving the WS aspect.
I believe with your setup (DVDR w/component inputs) you'd be able to use either the Grex or Video filter in line with the component Y wire to remove CP.
Where the Video Filter comes in handy is it's able to set the WS bit on your DVDs. Doing this will allow correct playback on 4:3 TVs and not the vertically stretched playback.
I don't think the Apple TV device sets the WS bit on your DVDs.
Well jjeff good news and an update. Late last year I ordered the Dimax. Long story short I was having the "Letterbox" issue trying to record WS (16:9) via S-Video. I emailed Dimax and got the following response: "We are checking it and we did see some problems in transferring WS signal. I will be back soon to you with details and possible solution. More likely we will send you updated unit once we done our research and fix it.". I didn't hold out much hope but followed up w/ Dimax recently and they sent me a new unit w/ "the fix". Again I wasn't expecting it to work but much to my surprise "the fix" worked (and rather well I might add). I did a side by side comparision with the same clip (WS 16:9) w/ the Video Filter (160 buck unit - via componet) vs. the Dimax (90 buck unit - via S-Video). The Video Filter seemed "washed out" (not as crisp) compared to the Dimax (in my opinion, better overall picture quality w/ the Dimax). I did loose about 5% viewing area side to side and top to bottom w/ the Dimax but the quality makes up for it. Just thought "you all" should know about the Dimax fix...

jjeff

03-13-09, 05:11 PM

Nice to hear the Grex unit is working good for you. Do you have to flip a switch or something on your new Grex filter to tell it Wide Screen vs. 4:3? (sounds like on the Video Filter it has a switch?). You wouldn't want your 4:3 discs being encoded with the WS bit, otherwise you'd always get a stretched picture I would think.
You also mentioned using the video filter via component. Do you have one of the old DVDRs that has component inputs or did you just hook the output directly to your TV via component cables?

hermey

03-13-09, 05:21 PM

No switches on the Grex. I just set my STB and DVD recorded to 16:9. I'll try and set them both back to 4:3 and see how that works (I believe the Grex just passes whatever it gets straight through and yes, the Video Filter has a switch). For the component feed using the Video Filter, I managed to pick up a refurbed Philips 80 w/ componet in/out. (btw. My girlfriend has had to put up w/ all of my "video escapades" over the years. I asked her to opinion on the two (Grex vs Video Filter) and she liked the Video Filter picture better so, go figure huh?)

Rammitinski

03-13-09, 05:33 PM

Over the years? Even more surprising then, is that you would find a woman who would put up with you not marrying her after all these years.

It's not a knock - I'm actually envious.

hermey

03-13-09, 06:11 PM

but then she got to know me:(

stump69

03-18-09, 12:48 AM

I have 3 Sima CT-2s and haven't noticed any green bars, although they all slightly lighten the picture. The only time I really notice this is when I recorded some test patterns for checking contrast, the THX optimizer patterns that comes with some Pixar DVDs. I lost a few shades of gray.
Jim, are you using or does the DPX filter use S-video or just composite.

My Sima CT-2 produces no artifcacts whatsoever, and this is my second one. I burned up the first one by leaving it 'on' all the time. (There is no ON/OFF switch on the danged thing). :confused:

joed32

03-18-09, 09:02 AM

They can use S-video or composite. I leave mine on all of the time and hope they last.

jjeff

03-18-09, 02:11 PM

I ran a small extension cord where I can get to mine and just unplug the brick when I'm not using it. The Sima seems to get fairly warm after being left on for hours on end. I kind of want to baby mine since they're no longer available and the similar ones are >$100.

mml

04-04-09, 08:13 PM

I bought the model 200 and worked great until today... I can't get it to back up a dvd.... it won't record the audio.

Tatertot

07-17-09, 03:00 PM

Has anyone used the Video Filter for the NTSC/ATSC/PAL formats? I'd like to find something that will let me transfer Region 2 DVDs to a Region 1 format.

jjeff

07-17-09, 03:29 PM

The Sima won't change formats or regions it will just pass on the format it's fed. If you wanted to convert your region 2 discs to region one(actually no region) NTSC you'd need a player capable of playing region 2 PAL discs and then a converter to convert from PAL to NTSC. Finally you could record that signal with any line input DVDR. AFAIK you could put the Sima before or after the converter, I don't know if one way would produce a better picture or not, I'd try both ways. You can also buy DVD players that will play a region 2 disc and output it as NTSC which again you could feed into your Sima to remove the CP and then record that signal with any DVDR. I'm pretty sure that DVD players that do the conversion also pass on any CP, if not I guess you wouldn't need the Sima.

Tatertot

07-17-09, 04:11 PM

I have a region-free DVD player, and I have a Region 1 DVD recorder.

I was wondering if the the NTSC/ATSC/PAL version of the Video Filter that is offered on the website will allow me to convert my Region 2 DVDs. There's no way to contact the seller on the website to ask, so I was hoping someone in this forum had some experience with it.

jjeff

07-17-09, 04:32 PM

Sorry I thought you were talking about the Sima filter with the PAL/NTSC switch. I believe to contact Video Filter you need to PM Logic Design here on AVS.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/private.php?do=newpm&u=24744

kjbawc

07-18-09, 07:14 PM

The Sima won't change formats or regions it will just pass on the format it's fed. If you wanted to convert your region 2 discs to region one(actually no region) NTSC you'd need a player capable of playing region 2 PAL discs and then a converter to convert from PAL to NTSC. Finally you could record that signal with any line input DVDR.

There are lots of cheap DVD players, from Toshiba, Philips, and others, that can be easily made region free, and will convert PAL to NTSC, and vice versa. Converters are expensive. Much better to spend a like amount on an Oppo 980, a GOOD player, which converts, and can be easily made region free. Then, the filter would go on the output from the DVD player.

Tatertot

07-20-09, 12:05 PM

Thanks, kjbawc. As I indicated in my reply to jjeff, I already have a multi-region dvd player. I'm simply wondering if the new Video Filter is worth the additional $10 if it will allow me to convert Region 2 media in addition to overcoming the issues with DirecTV broadcasting putting Only Once limits on shows that shouldn't have them, and problems with recording purchased digital content.

kjbawc

07-20-09, 07:24 PM

I am assuming that your region-free player does NOT convert PAL to NTSC, by the questions you have asked. I highly doubt that the Video Filter converts PAL to NTSC, it just removes the copy protection signal, allowing you to record a dub of a Region 2 disc that is copy protected. You will need a converter, if you want to record a NTSC disc from a PAL disc.

As I said, converters are expensive. For the price of most converters, you could buy a really good region-free, converting DVD player, like the Oppo 980. Or, much cheaper than a converter, a cheap converting DVD player that can be made region-free. Often, there is little or no mention of the converting abilities of cheap DVD players in their literature. Lots of cheap Toshibas and Philips players do convert. You can go to www.videohelp.com, and click on "DVD Hacks" in the column on the left. Here you can find info to make these cheap players (and others) region-free.

addendum: when playing back a Region 2 disc, there is nothing in the signal that says "Region 2." That encoding on the disc is just read and used by the player, to decide whether to play the disc or not, it isn't passed along. Recording such a signal on a DVDR would produce a Region 0 disc.

snuggalbugg

07-27-09, 03:08 AM

microladyusa

07-27-09, 07:07 PM

Snuggalbugg: jjeff above said I believe to contact Video Filter you need to PM Logic Design here on AVS. Yes, you can do that. Logic Design can answer any questions you have.

I bought one a few months ago and have no complaints. It is shipped USPS Priority Mail (2-3 day delivery). When I went to the web site, I clicked on How to Get one, and also Satisfied Customers and read that. As far as being worried about a working product..there is a 30 day window to return it and the site tells you about that.

I also research before I buy anything...a lot of research, reading reviews, etc. You have to do what you are comfortable with. I did PM Logic Design myself to be sure I had the right website and got an immediate answer..so any questions you have...feel free to ask the designer himself.

I got one and have not regretted the purchase.

Hope this helps.

Church AV Guy

07-27-09, 07:27 PM

Hi,
I have been reading back through the posts on here about the different types of devices for dubbing vhs to dvd, cable/tv shows, etc.
I am ready to purchase the Video Filter and have gone to:
home.roadrunner (unable to list url site due to being a newbie)
but I noticed there is no contact info,
As has been said, PM Logic Design on this forum.
how long processing takes or the order to arrive and from where it's coming from?
It was pretty fast when I made my purchase. As far as where, I really have no idea. I'm sure it was on the return label, but I had the device, so I didn't really care.
They do have the Pay Pal linked up for payment.
I am just curious as to if anyone has recently purchased one of these units from this site and could lend some insight for me. :confused:
I got mine well over a year ago. It works just as advertised.
I am willing to purchase the unit, but worry if the sight is trustworthy. That's a good chunk of change to be out if no working product is recieved.
Thanks for all the great insight which helped me make the decision from the
video filter/grex/dp-700 units.
Hoping for the best! :)
From my experience, the site is trustworthy. Yes it's a lot of money, but you don't need to worry about not getting the Video Filter. It will come.

snuggalbugg

07-27-09, 10:52 PM

Thank you to all members for your help with the video filter. The purchase has been made, contact established and unit is on it's way. YEAH!! I can't wait to get it and hope the set up is easy for a rookie. :>)
I will be hooking it up between a Presidian VCR/DVD combo (as the VHS player) to a Panasonic DMR-EZ48V DVD Recorder combo. (as the recorder)
Feel free to give me any 'heads-up' on info that will assist me or be of important insight for me to know about. Thanks again to this forum and the members!!

Church AV Guy

07-28-09, 12:24 PM

Feel free to give me any 'heads-up' on info that will assist me or be of important insight for me to know about.
I should have mentioned it earlier, but the documentation is pretty sketchy. I had to fiddle withe the switches for a few minutes before I got it to work right (and I mean like five minutes, so not a real chore). Once I had it set, it has been really stable. It does not seem to overheat with prolonged use like my Sima does. I can't think of anything else right now. If you have any questions, ask Logic Design.

jjeff

07-28-09, 03:05 PM

I will be hooking it up between a Presidian VCR/DVD combo (as the VHS player) to a Panasonic DMR-EZ48V DVD Recorder combo. (as the recorder)

I'm not familiar with your Presidian combo but most combos only output VHS via the yellow composite output. For copying DVD's I'd personally use the S-video output(if available). It should give you a definite improvement in picture quality. S-video cables start at ~$4 at Menards or Monoprice.com.

microladyusa

07-28-09, 04:18 PM

I agree that S-Video is the superior picture; however, except for my 2001 Phillips VCR, I have no S-Video output on my other recorders. The business industry didn't want people to get a better picture so they restricted S-Video out to DVD players and recorders. (Wants us all to only buy DVDs).

My VCR/DVD combo has an S-Video out but the manual specifically says it will only output the DVD signal. I also am not familiar with your VCR/DVD model but if you have a S-Video out but can't get the VCR picture from it...that would be normal. It will not be because the Video Filter is set up wrong or doesn't work.

Check your manual about the video output for your VCR portion of the unit. Normally I would think you may only use the yellow video out to the filter and then the filter video out...into your DVD video in. The red and white audio cables do not go through the filter. They go directly from the VCR to the DVD.

Just some added information.

snuggalbugg

07-28-09, 04:54 PM

Hi, my presidian PDC-3286 does have a S-video hook up. I just checked the manual and it says: Coaxial, DVD Audio Out, S-Video Out & Component Video Out jacks are only useful in DVD mode. This is the unit I was going to play the VHS tapes in and send it to the Panasonic DMR-EZ48V.
As noted, I am a rookie to all this stuff and I apologize for my ignorance. I did order
the Video Filter.
In regards to microladyusa reply, Does this mean that with the Video Filter and the newly purchased Panasonic, that I still won't be able to update my collection?
Keeping my finger/toes crossed for the best. Once again, sorry for my lack of knowledge, but with all your kind help.. I am learning. (hopefully-not the hard way)

microladyusa

07-28-09, 05:10 PM

You will do just fine and should be able to do exactly what you want.

You will be using the VCR video out (yellow plug) to the Video Filter ..yellow plug in....then the Video Filter yellow plug out to your video in (yellow plug) DVD recorder. (It is easier to see when you have the actual Filter to look at).

All this boils down to is...your DVD picture will be the same quality as your VCR picture.

The S-Video would allow a picture probably better than the VCR picture but that's all. And, as with my equipment I see your S-Video is not available for outputting your VCR picture...so you will
just use what most of us do..the regular VCR Video out jack. It does not mean you can't set up your VCR and recorder just as you want to.

Frankly, it is worth it to me to get at least a VCR picture on a DVD. I have gotten good DVD recordings using the VCR video out jack.

Don't worry. You are all set to go. I think you will be very pleased with your results.

jjeff

07-28-09, 05:42 PM

Then I would use the yellow composite output for copying VHS tapes and the Presidian's S-video output for copying DVDs. No sense to degrade the quality of DVD backups as long as your combo has a S-video output for DVDs. The Video Filter supports both although I'm not sure if you'd have to disconnect cables or if it has a input selector like my Sima video filter does. With the Sima I have both S-video and composite hooked up and just push it's input selector to select either source. It also has both outputs although they are the same, that is whatever I have selected with the input selector button.

snuggalbugg

07-28-09, 06:26 PM

Thank you so much for all that have replied! I do agree, it is worth having at least VCR quality picture compared to nothing at all. I have printed out the suggested connections between the units and Vfilter to refer to. The presdian is a primative Radio Shack brand with the basics (no burner) and it's good to hear that I will still be able to accomplish my backup goals with the panasonic. I am sure I may be back this weekend with novice questions and I just want to THANK everyone in advance for your help and patience. :>)

microladyusa

07-28-09, 08:32 PM

Just to make sure it sounds clear to you about the video plugs.

To copy a VHS tape to a DVD, you will use the yellow video composite jacks and plugs for the video picture. Your video signal will come out of the VCR..go into the VF...come out of the VF and go into your DVD recorder. The Red and White jacks and cables are audio only. They will come out of the VCR audio jacks and go into the DVD recorder audio jacks. (The VF is really only for the video picture itself).

If you were to copy a DVD from your combo to your DVD recorder then for the best video picture, you would want to use the S-Video jacks instead of the yellow jacks.

The VF has a separate jack for S-Video and has one for the yellow composite video. And also there are 4 switches, which you probably saw in the photo on the website. Switches 1 and 4 control whether the yellow video is used or the S-Video is used. Switch 1 up and Switch 4 down should allow the VHS recording. Switch 2 sets up 16:9 or 4:3 aspect (wide-screen vs full screen). Switch 3 will be up so it is set to Copy Always.

Also the small instruction sheet for the VF said for connection information go to the website and click on Connections.

It is basically your Video Source goes In to the VF and the VF sends that signal Out to your DVD Recorder's Video In jack so the Recorder "sees" the VHS video. If your Recorder is connected to your TV, you should be able to see on your TV..what the Recorder is seeing coming from the VCR. I'm sure your manual talks about recording from an external source.

Just some more information I hope helps.

snuggalbugg

07-28-09, 11:49 PM

Thank you microladyusa for your very much needed insight. (printed it out) I feel better about connecting everything and think I just might be able to get the job done.
(I am not holding my breath though)
One little insight of mine own.... the people on this site are the BEST!
I will be back this weekend to touch base. (smile/wink)

microladyusa

07-29-09, 01:01 PM

One final thought.....if you have VHS tapes you haven't looked at in a while....it would be a good idea to FF and Rewind....a process I call unpacking. Some people find that in the middle of transferring tape to DVD...there may appear a tracking problem.. I believe running the tape forward to the end and then rewind to the beginning should settle the tape so it moves correctly.

My manual talks about checking the VHS tape for any tracking at the start and playing the tape a little to see how it goes. I know I dubbed a regular TV tape to DVD and saw the DVD recorded a tracking at the top of the screen. The rest of the picture was okay so it was good enough for me as far as that TV show. I do have some movie tapes I want to transfer so I will be more picky about those and try and make sure there is no tracking problem at the start, if possible.

I do know when my tapes for timeshifting start showing tracking problems, I do the unpacking suggestion above and then they play just fine for quite a while.

snuggalbugg

07-29-09, 11:30 PM

Thank you so much for the insight! I for sure will do 'unpacking' on the VHS tapes. To me that is a very clever idea and process to do. :>)

snuggalbugg

08-03-09, 05:44 PM

Okay, I failed in getting my units to work with the VF. I am not even sure if I have enough cables/hook ups at this point. I am a prehistoric rookie!!

When I hooked it up per manual on the Panasonic for adding another component, I got the 'unable to copy' message, but know I probably had something improperly hooked up.
I tried a few different hook ups and then recordered black/white static as I was veiwing the movie, but got no message. Me lost!
Can someone with allot of patience help me?

Here is my current hook up:
Slyvania TV=front jacks r/w/y (none in back for r/w/y) cables to Panasonic vhs/dvd burner 'Common Out r/w/y'. (below that is empty with r/w/y and S video that says IN1 that is not in use)
Back of TV=white/red cables to Panasonic 'Component-Video Out r/w. (above that is green/blue/red plug areas that are empty)
Back of TV=black coax cord to Panasonic RF out.
Back of TV= s.video to Panasonic 'Component-Video Out S-Video.
Panasonic Burner=Cable caox from wall into the RF IN.

The Presidian (radio shack) VHS/DVD player which will be the VHS player have the green, blue and red plug areas and so does the Panasonic under the 'Component-Video Out' area. I think I am suppose to use these areas right?

Do I need another set of r/w/y cables or black coax cord(s)? Or is two sets enough?
I am totally lost as to how to hook up the two units together as well as how
to adapt the VFilter. I thought I knew how to do it, but was I WRONG!!

If anyone can reply and help me with basic laymen terms as used above as to what I might have to purchase or how the color cords and others will hook up to VF and another unit, I greatly appericate your patience and insight.
Really feeling stupid at this point.......

kjbawc

08-03-09, 06:34 PM

snuggalbugg

08-03-09, 10:29 PM

The R/G/B cables are component out, which you do NOT want to use.

First question - does your VCR/DVD combo player output a signal on S-Vid, when playing a VHS tape? Probably not.

If yes, you will use the S-Vid output from the combo player, to the VF. Then another S-Vid cable from the VF to the Panny DVDR.

If no, you will use the composite video output, a yellow out, from your combo player, to the VF, and from the VF to the DVDR. That takes care of the video signal.

For audio, you can probably go direct from the combo player to the DVDR with the right and left audio outs, usually red and white, to the R/L audio ins on the DVDR. If instructions with the VF recommend it, you may want two sets of audio cables, to include the VF in the circuit, instead of going direct.

Then, to record, make sure you have selected the correct set of line inputs on the Panny, including either S-Vid, or composite. That should do it.

So if I have my tv and dvdBurner hooked up properly, I will need another set of r/w/y cables to hook up the second unit correct? (vhs player combo) Then will I need to purchase a seperate red, seperate white, seperate yellow for making the VFilter connection?
My s-video plays no factor in my hook ups, as it only works dvd on the radio shack/presidian player.

Previous post of mine:
Okay, I failed in getting my units to work with the VF. I am not even sure if I have enough cables/hook ups at this point. I am a prehistoric rookie!!

When I hooked it up per manual on the Panasonic for adding another component, I got the 'unable to copy' message, but know I probably had something improperly hooked up.
I tried a few different hook ups and then recordered black/white static as I was veiwing the movie, but got no message. Me lost!
Can someone with allot of patience help me?

Here is my current hook up:
Slyvania TV=front jacks r/w/y (none in back for r/w/y) cables to Panasonic vhs/dvd burner 'Common Out r/w/y'. (below that is empty with r/w/y and S video that says IN1 that is not in use)
Back of TV=white/red cables to Panasonic 'Component-Video Out r/w. (above that is green/blue/red plug areas that are empty)
Back of TV=black coax cord to Panasonic RF out.
Back of TV= s.video to Panasonic 'Component-Video Out S-Video.
Panasonic Burner=Cable caox from wall into the RF IN.

The Presidian (radio shack) VHS/DVD player which will be the VHS player have the green, blue and red plug areas and so does the Panasonic under the 'Component-Video Out' area. I think I am suppose to use these areas right?

Do I need another set of r/w/y cables or black coax cord(s)? Or is two sets enough?
I am totally lost as to how to hook up the two units together as well as how
to adapt the VFilter. I thought I knew how to do it, but was I WRONG!!

If anyone can reply and help me with basic laymen terms as used above as to what I might have to purchase or how the color cords and others will hook up to VF and another unit, I greatly appericate your patience and insight.
Really feeling stupid at this point.......

snuggalbugg

08-03-09, 10:38 PM

I went and viewed the hook up of the Grex, which has step by step instructions on how to hook up the Grex to a Panasonic DMR-EZ48V, it looks as if they are using the same vhs/dvd burner to play the vhs and burn all on the SAME unit. Does the video filter work the same way? I am currently trying to hook up 2 seperate combo units to my tv, plus the filter. Am I going bonkers here?

kjbawc

08-03-09, 11:09 PM

I am not familiar with that model of Panasonic. Most combo player/recorders will NOT let you insert a filter between the VHS outs and the DVD inputs. But, your combo is just a player, not a recorder, right? So, the filter needs to be on the line outs of the combo player, and those need to go to the line inputs of the DVDR (DVD recorder - we don't call them burners - burners are what you use with a computer.) That can make it difficult to get the output of the combo player to the TV too, unless it has more than one set of outs, or unless you use an AV receiver. But, there may be other ways.

The R/G/B outputs on the combo player and the Panny DVDR are video outs. If your TV has R/G/B (component) inputs, you can connect your combo, and/or your DVDR to the TV with them. But, you will still have to get audio to the TV. If your TV doesn't have R/G/B component inputs, you shouldn't have anything at all hooked up to the R/G/B outs on your combo player, or DVDR. Also, there should be no outputs from the TV running to the DVDR, or combo player.

To tell you how best to hook up your system, I would need to know what inputs, and how many, are available on your TV. Also, what outputs and how many, are on your DVDR and combo player.

snuggalbugg

08-04-09, 02:08 PM

Okay, here it goes.. I hope you will be able to instruct me on any additional items to purchase and how to hook up the 3 units together....

TV= r/w/y plugs on the front. Back of TV= w/r plugs, S-Video and I believe a 'rf', as a coaxial cable cord is in there. (runs to combo recorder rf out) Tv is high on wall mount, unable to see)

Panasonic Combo Recorder:
Front of unit: IN2 S-video, r/w/y plugs
Back of unit: RF in, RF out coxial cable hook ups
DVD/VHS Common Out: r/w/y plugs
IN1 has r/w/y plugs with S-Video
Component Video Out: green/blue/red plugs
DVD Priority Out: r/w/y plugs with S-Video

Standard VHS/DVD combo Player:
Manual Says: Coaxial, DVD Out, S-Video & Component Video Out are for DVD mode only.
Front of unit: r/w/y plugs
Back of unit: Digital Audio Out=coaxial plug
DVD: Audio Out with r/w & S-Video
Component Video Out: green/blue/red plugs
DVD/VCR Audio Out: w/r/y plugs
VCR Audio In: w/r/y plugs
Ant-In, Ant-Out and Coxial cable hook ups

Keeping fingers crossed+++++++++++++

microladyusa

08-04-09, 04:18 PM

Don't try to think of everything at once. To do what you want to do right now, forget the red, green, blue plugs/jacks. These have nothing to do with recording a VHS tape to a DVD.

Your main viewing is the TV and the Panasonic combo recorder.
Do not change any of these connections. I assume you can record to the VCR part and to the DVD part from your TV? And you can watch on the TV a VHS tape and a DVD disc? You do not need to change any of these connections to do what you intend. Have you changed any of these or are they working like they were?

The Video Filter does not have audio jacks, it only helps you on the video part of a tape.

Your Presidian VHS/DVD Player you intend to use to play a VHS tape on and record that tape on the Panasonic DVD Recorder. (Yes, to do what you want you need two separate units).

On the back of the Presidian should be audio/video jacks, shown as one yellow (video), one red (audio), one white (audio). This is called composite video connections. The Red cable and the white cable go from the Presidian audio out to and INTO the Panasonic red and white audio in jacks. This will send the audio from your tape to the Panasonic DVD recorder.

You will use a yellow video cable from the Presidian yellow video jack out to and into the Video Filter yellow video in (the jack next to the 4 switches). Then you will use an identical yellow video cable from the VF video out jack and it will go into the Panasonic yellow video in jack.

This set up your VHS tape audio and video to go from the Presidian to the Panasonic DVD recorder with the video going through the VF.

In your connection description words..it would be:
Presidian: DVD/VCR Audio out: w/r/y/ plugs

Panasonic: IN1 has r/w/y plugs with S-Video (forget S-Video).

Plug one end of a red cable into the Presidian OUT and the other end into the Panasonic IN1 (red color jacks). Do the same with a white cable using the white color jacks. This connects your audio.

Plug one end of a yellow cable into the Presidian Video OUT and now you plug the other end of this cable into the VF Video IN. Take another yellow cable..plug one end into the VF Video OUT and plug the other end into your Panasonic IN1 yellow video jack. This will send your VHS tape video through the VF to the Panasonic DVD Recorder.

Presiden: "DVD/VCR Audio Out; w/r/y plugs". These plugs are the yellow, red, and white plugs that will send your VCR video out (the yellow one) and your VCR audio out (the red and white ones) of the Presiden player to: (the yellow goes into the VF IN and you use another yellow cable from the VF OUT to go into your Panasonic "IN1 yellow plug". Use the red and white audio cable coming from your Presidian red and white

Panasonic: "IN1 has r/w/y/ plugs with S-Video". Forget the S-Video. Remember the "IN1" and also these 3 jacks are the yellow, red and white ones that you will be using.

(again, I am assuming you have left your TV alone and the RF connections so you can use the TV and the Panasonic like you have been). We are only dealing with the Presidian, the VF, and the Panasonic here.

I believe if my mind is back in order, your connections should be okay. Do not record and waste a DVD until you are sure your DVD recorder is seeing the VCR tape.

To see this, put a tape in your Presidan to play (any tape). To see what the DVD Recorder will see....on your Panasonic remote, go to the lowest TV channel you have, 2 or 3, then go lower on the channel down button until you see something like "IN1". If you see this on your channel selection on the front of your recorder as the current channel selected, then push Play on the VCR and have the TV on to the channel you usually watch your Panasonic DVD on. You should see the picture on your TV that is coming from the Presidian VCR. If you see the picture and hear the audio...you are all set to do a transfer from a VHS tape to a DVD. Put in a tape to copy in the VCR and put in a DVD in your recorder. Press Play on the tape and Record on the DVD and you should see the picture being recorded on the TV on the "VCR/DVD channel".

Print this all out and anyone else's suggestions are welcome.

Let us know what happens.

kjbawc

08-04-09, 06:54 PM

Microlady has accurately described how to connect the combo player to the VF and the Panny DVDR. However, from your description, I'm not so sure the rest of your connections are correct. So, here's what you should do:

Run the RF cable directly the Panny DVDR's RF input. Run another RF cable from the DVDR's RF output to the TV. This will just "pass through" the DVDR, unaffected. It will NOT output what is played back, or tuned, on the DVDR. It WILL allow you to watch one thing on the TV, while recording something else on the DVDR.

Run audio cables from the red and white audio outs on the DVDR to the back of the TV. Run a S-Vid cable from the yellow S-Vid output on the DVDR to the back of the TV.

Now, to select what you are watching on the TV, it may be as ML said, you might see something like "Line In" in the channel number selector of your TV. Or, you might use a button, or a menu, to select either "Antenna In," or "Line 1 (or 2) In." You will need to make sure you selected the inputs on the back, not the front of the TV. Further, you will probably need to select the S-Vid input, not the 'line,' or composite input.

Once you have selected that, you will be able to watch what is tuned, or played back, on your DVDR.

As ML says, on your DVDR, be sure you have selected the input from the Presidian combo player, and you can see that on your TV, and start a recording.

microladyusa

08-05-09, 03:58 PM

Just to let you know I just downloaded a copy of your manual and printed out Pages 6,7, and 28 so I can see what you are looking at on your Panasonic. Print out what I last posted to you and also kjbawc's post and answer my question about just the TV and Panasonic and how you use them now (without the VHS copy subject).

I see by your manual that you would not find the Presidian picture by using your channel up/down like other recorders can do. For you , by connecting the Presidian as above to the Panasonic IN1 3 jacks, you would see the Presidian picture on the Panasonic by using your remote control and pressing Input Select button and choosing IN1 as the input selected.

But first is to get your Presidian connected to your Panasonic with the 3 jacks. yellow, red, white, and the VF for the yellow as I described in my last reply.

I would like to know if your Panasonic and TV connections are the same as they were before the Presidian came into the picture. Also do you record and play off the Panasonic VCR and the Panasonic DVDRecorder? Or do you only use the DVDR? Do you record off TV with either or both recorders? Just want to make sure you have the setup okay to do all you want to do.

See if the above printouts help you and then see what questions you have. Keep posting. It can be done.

jjeff

08-05-09, 04:39 PM

I don't have a EZ-48(thank goodness:p) but on other previous Panasonics you are indeed able to toggle the various inputs by using the CH up or CH down buttons. Again on other Panasonics when you get to your highest channel pushing CH up will take you to input 1 followed by input 2 etc. etc. If you're on your lowest channel pushing CH down will take you to input 2 followed by input 2 etc. Note the SD reader and USB input are also in the scan list, I think they follow input 2 when pushing the CH up button.
Also with Panasonic combos you're able to insert a video filter between the VHS and DVD sections and I believe it was confirmed early in the EZ-48 thread that this was also possible with the EZ-48. You use the line output, run it through your filter and finally feed the line input. Push Play when watching your source(eg VHS) followed by pushing DVD on the remote, finally push REC on the remote. Of course for the input of the DVD recorder you want to select either Line input 1 or 2 (whatever you've hooked your video filter output to.
It sounds more complicated that it really is although it was much easier with a combo like the old ES-30v that had dual displays. You could monitor the progress of each side (VHS/DVD). Since all other combos only have one display you need to toggle with the remote to either VHS or DVD to see individual progress. The ES-30v is extremely handy in that respect and if I didn't have one I'd probably use a external source like your combo player to copy things.

Church AV Guy

08-05-09, 05:11 PM

Hey, jjeff, did that trick work with the EH75? I haven't tried it, didn't even think to try it.

I find this thread interesting. When I got my Fideo Filter, I just put it in the S-Video line and that was that--very simple. There are some people here with much more complex setups than I have I guess. It has worked flawlessly for me, and it has had no noticeable picture quality hit. To be fair, I could make the same comments about the first device of this type that I bought, a Sima. When I needed a second one, Sima was no longer available, and I thought that the Video Filter would be the best product, since I wanted the best quality result. Little did I know that the quality of the VCR playback was SO much more important than any of the other components. Sigh... live and learn. The difference between the Sima and the Video Filter is insignificantly trivial compared to starting with a good quality playback.

jjeff

08-05-09, 05:50 PM

The loop through trick should work between the VHS and DVD sections of a EH-75v but I'm quite sure it wouldn't work between say the DVD and HDD sections. At least it doesn't on my EH-50 or EH-55. For those to get a CP'd program to the HDD(or DVD) I need to use a external player attached to one of the line inputs.
On the EH-75v if you're able to play a VHS tape at the same time you're recording something different to the line input to the DVD side then the loop through should work just fine. Just make sure you do haven't selected the VHS input to be the DVD side while the DVD side is selected to be the VHS side, you'll get a nasty audio and video feedback situation. It's kind of cool watching the video feedback though, all kinds of weird patterns on the screen:eek:
I reread my ES-30v manual but couldn't find any documentation to support the loop back method, but it's the way I've always copied CP'd tapes on my ES-30v, it just made most sense to me since I treat the machine as 2 separate machines in one common case.

snuggalbugg

08-05-09, 11:08 PM

QUOTE=microladyusa;16949184]Just to let you know I just downloaded a copy of your manual and printed out Pages 6,7, and 28 so I can see what you are looking at on your Panasonic. Print out what I last posted to you and also kjbawc's post and answer my question about just the TV and Panasonic and how you use them now (without the VHS copy subject).

I see by your manual that you would not find the Presidian picture by using your channel up/down like other recorders can do. For you , by connecting the Presidian as above to the Panasonic IN1 3 jacks, you would see the Presidian picture on the Panasonic by using your remote control and pressing Input Select button and choosing IN1 as the input selected.

But first is to get your Presidian connected to your Panasonic with the 3 jacks. yellow, red, white, and the VF for the yellow as I described in my last reply.

I would like to know if your Panasonic and TV connections are the same as they were before the Presidian came into the picture. Also do you record and play off the Panasonic VCR and the Panasonic DVDRecorder? Or do you only use the DVDR? Do you record off TV with either or both recorders? Just want to make sure you have the setup okay to do all you want to do.

See if the above printouts help you and then see what questions you have. Keep posting. It can be done.[/QUOTE]

Hi, I currently have the TV and Panasonic Recorder hooked up together. I return to this hook up when I fail at adding the Presiden combo player.
I have programed the Panny recorder to do a scheduled taping during the day to DVD. It did work, although that's as far as I have ventured with it. I am learning to walk before I can crawl here. (sorry)

I do at times use the VHS part of the panny, but want to phase that out with the back ups to dvd. I mainly use the DVDR at this point for taping tv shows and playing dvd movies. I plan to only use the Presidian to make back up copies, in which I will draw myself a 'road map' to how everything is connected once I have a working 3some. I do plan to remove the Presidian when I am not making copies and follow the 'road map' to put it back to the way it is now. (space is too limited to leave all three units hooked up together all the time.)

Here is my current hook up between the TV and Panasonic:
Front of TV= y/w/r jacks going to the back of the Panasonic in the DVD/VHS Common Out y/w/r jacks
Back of TV= r/w jacks to back of Panasonic r/w DVD Priority Out.
Back of TV= S-Video to back of Panasonic S-Video Priority Out.
Back of TV= Coaxial Cable (RF) to back of Panasonic RF Out.
Cable from wall to Panasonic RF In

You are very kind to go the extra mile to print out the manual in efforts to get me through this. I am trying not to get discourged and return the VFilter
out of DEFEAT on my end.
With everyone's help and kindness here, which is going the extra mile, I am hanging in there to try and get this accomplished. When I do...... I'd like
to buy everyone some drinks!!:D

snuggalbugg

08-05-09, 11:18 PM

I have printed all the replies out and plan to take a stab at it again tomorrow morning being Thursday the 6th.
To everyone who has kindly replied, I do apologize for my prehistoric knowledge. I may be making this harder then it really is and will probably 'kick' myself over and over once the 3 units have been properly connected... but for right now, it's a whole new world to me and a tangle of unfamiliar wires. THANK YOU to everyone.

microladyusa

08-06-09, 11:57 AM

microladyusa

08-06-09, 12:16 PM

By the way, I want to compliment you on your "road map" idea...that is what I do all the time. Also that when your changes didn't work..that you restored your setup to the way it was before. No one said to do that but that is exactly the right thing to do. So don't beat yourself down...you are learning something new and are willing to try and figure it out...that deserves a compliment.

By the way, I have a VCR hooked up to my current combo. I just played a tape on the VCR and saw the combo picture on my TV and it was widescreen on the TV and a perfect picture. I didn't realize a VHS tape could show as widescreen but it did on my 32" LCD TV so I expect a DVD copy of it to also be widescreen.

So do not give up hope. Yes, once you see how the connections go that work...it will make more sense. And, I know you will make a road map of this setup, in case you want to hook the Presidian up in the future for the same reason you are doing it now.

snuggalbugg

08-12-09, 08:36 PM

Just a quick note from looking at the manual..that may help you.
The Presidian will connect to the Panasonic using the connections shown in the Panasonic manual on Page 7, Rear Panel, using the #7 jacks, r/w/y input jacks.(Sorry...remember the yellow video goes from the Presidian into the VF IN and VF OUT yellow goes to the Panasonic #7 yellow jack. The Presidian audio r/w goes directly to the Panasonic r/w #7 jacks).

Once the Presidian is connected to this, I believe if you turn on the Presidian and the Panasonic and choose on the Panasonic as input.... IN1, you should be able to play a tape on the Presidian and see the picture on the Panasonic DVD and/or VCR mode..but you want DVD cause that's the recorder. If you do see the tape you should be able to record it.

The VF has 4 switches, numbered 1 to 4. With this connection, you want to set the switches so they are: 1,2,3,4 equals UP,UP,UP,DOWN (they may also come this way and that's okay).

YEAH!!! I got the 3 items working! I am so excited! I did need to purchase 2 yellow, video jacks and another r/w jacks in order to make it work. I left everything else connected as it was and added the other 3 cords with the VF. I think that was my problem, I was thinking that I was changing around the cords that were already being used between the panasonic and tv. I was able to view the tape, the IN1 information and how to keep pressing the channel button until I got to IN1 was a big factor also! Thank You so Much!

I have two quick questions....
1st: If I wanted to copy a dvd from the combo player onto the panasonic, dvd recorder, I would need to switch some wires around right?, since I would be coping a dvd to dvd? Can you tell me which ones?
2nd: If I wanted to watch a tv show, can I watch it while the 3 components are working together and taping without it hurting the recording process?
Thank you all and special thanks to microladyusa for downloading the manual and going the extra mile for me!
Look forward to hearing about the two questions above. :)

microladyusa

08-14-09, 05:53 PM

DOUBLE YEAH!! Yes, you are right. You only need to leave everything connected as it was and just add the Presidian and the VF.

Remember, apparently you can press the channel button until you get to IN1. But you
Can also use on your Remote Control the Input Select Button – see Page 7, Remote Control Item#17. The Remote Select may be a faster way to get to IN1.

Question 1: If want to copy a DVD from the Presidian to the Panasonic DVD Recorder:
You can do this with the same wiring as now. You would use the DVD MODE on both units. You should be able to play a DVD on the Presidian and view it on the Panasonic. Again, if so, then you can copy it.

On your VHS tapes, you use VHS mode on Presidian and DVD Mode on Panasonic.
On DVDS you would use DVD Mode on both units.

(I don’t want to confuse what you just learned but there is added information on wanting to copy a DVD to a DVD…. Instead of using the yellow video, you could purchase S-Video cables and use the S-Video out on the Presidian to the VF S-Video In, VF S-Video Out to Panasonic S-Video In. Then you would flip a switch (switches 1 and 4) on the VF to let it know to send out the S-Video signal instead of the yellow one. This is supposed to give you a better video picture on the new DVD than using the yellow video. The yellow still MUST be used for VHS tapes.

If you are happy with the DVD picture using the yellow video cables then whether you are doing DVDs or VHS tapes….no wiring needs changing…only make sure to set the Mode right…VHS/DVD or DVD/DVD so you can see what is being recorded on your TV.)

Get comfortable copying your VHS tapes using the connections you just put together and you can also copy a DVD with these connections and look at the DVD picture compared to the original DVD and see whether it is worth switching cables back and forth.

(Don’t forget to make up your “road maps” on your new connections using the yellow video cables).

Question 2: I will look at your setup again. But there is no reason why you cannot watch TV at the same time you are recording something else..whether it is a different TV channel, or a External Unit VHS tape or DVD.

Right now, when you watch TV with your setup, do you ever record on the Panasonic VCR or DVD at the same time? Or, if you are recording, you don’t watch the TV? Whatever you are doing now, with the 3 unit connection you can still do the same thing.

Like I said before: DOUBLE YEAH!! I was really hoping you were not giving up cause I knew you could do it!

microladyusa

08-14-09, 06:04 PM

Just remember this easy thought:

What you are seeing on IN1....is what your DVD recorder is also seeing..the same picture. That is why it will record that picture.

So whether it will be a VHS tape or a DVD signal coming into the Panasonic IN1 input, it will always be what the Panasonic DVD Recorder is seeing coming in on that input.

snuggalbugg

08-14-09, 11:36 PM

[QUOTE=microladyusa;17001707]Right now, when you watch TV with your setup, do you ever record on the Panasonic VCR or DVD at the same time? Or, if you are recording, you don’t watch the TV? Whatever you are doing now, with the 3 unit connection you can still do the same thing.QUOTE]

HI! Great to hear back from you! At the moment when I am recording from vhs to dvd, I either turn the tv picture off or watch the movie. I was to afraid of messing something up while recording. Did not want to mess with a good thing. When I am not recording, I found that I can leave everything hooked up together and don't turn on the presidian or panasonic, I can watch tv normally.

I wanted to be sure before I got brave to watch a different tv station that it would not mess with the recording. I have done the road maps and have been very pleased with the turn out of all the movies so far.

Just to be sure, wont I have to change the input (IN1) on the remote in order to use the remote to switch to a channel I want to watch while it is recording? :confused:
I am so pleased you have taken the time to help me and your right, I don't want to get too ahead of myself, but to slowly creep towards advancements (if possible) to accomplish other tasks. (like not having to watch the movie being recording.)
Look forward to hearing back from you and I am so pleased with the VF and the help from this site!! :)

microladyusa

08-15-09, 05:05 PM

Just to be sure, wont I have to change the input (IN1) on the remote in order to use the remote to switch to a channel I want to watch while it is recording?

Don't get confused on your Remotes. To record from the Presidian to the Panasonic you use the Panasonic Remote and set the unit to record from IN1. This has nothing to do with your TV.

You would use your TV Remote to watch TV and change channels on the TV (You would not be changing "channels" on the Panasonic at all with the TV remote).

When you watch your TV, do you have to chose an input such as TV, A/V, etc? So when you want to watch TV you just turn it on to any channel or chose an input? (These questions are cause without a manual, I don't know what your TV allows).

You say when you are recording you watch the movie on the TV...what channel or input is the TV set to that you are able to watch the recorder?

With the setup of the Presidian, the VF, and the Panasonic, you should be able to set up a recording, and watch something else on TV at the same time. Just remember which Remote you are using.
Set the Panasonic on IN1 with the Panasonic Remote and then leave that Remote alone. Take your TV remote and see if your channels come in okay.

If you can see your TV channels without chosing a certain input, that is okay.

Watching TV should not affect the recording because the recording is using a signal that comes from the Presidian and ends in the Panasonic and is never sent to the TV. When you use the Panasonic Remote to tune to L1, you are asking the Panasonic itself to show you what it is seeing on that input Line and you can see it on the TV because you have gone where you have to go to see your DVD picture on the TV. Where that is I would like to know.

So I understand what your TV does, could you walk me through ..
1. Just turning on the TV only and what steps you take to see your TV channels. (My newer TVs require me to choose an input source).

2. What you do as far as the TV to watch your Panasonic DVD picture.

As far as your 2 questions are concerned, the easiest answer to each it this:

1. The way your 3 units are set up now, you can either copy a VHS or a DVD to your Panasonic, using the yellow video signal. You would not HAVE to change any cables to do this. You either set the Presidian for VCR mode or DVD mode and whichever you play something in...that signal will go to the Panny recorder.

(As I did say before there are more video options for recording DVDs but to keep it simple ..you can try a DVD and see what you think of the picture quality).

2. You should be able to watch any TV channel while your 3 units are working together and recording. You should be able to switch to the DVD channel to see how the recording looks and switch back to regular TV channels.

You have already set out what your connections are regarding the TV so I have those but I need to know exactly the steps you take to watch your TV, to watch the DVD recording on the TV. So I know what happens when only the TV is on and what happens when you want to watch a DVD on the TV.

Without a manual or seeing the actual setup it is kind of like flying blind but you have been good about setting out information when asked and that is a big help.

I have so many recorders, etc covering 2 different rooms yet all connected that sometimes it is hard to remember what the first simple setup was. My office room alone has 5 recorders and 1 TV and all work fine but to road map the connections took some doing.

That's why I can say you can do all you want to do as far as watching what you want and not having to watch only what you are recording, etc., cause I learned about doing that a long time ago.
But I do have to know how your TV works so I can visualize what the different video signals are able to do.

Talk to you soon. So very glad it is working for you and that you stuck with it. Hope the connections look easier to you as to what they are doing.

Just a little note of added info: The red and white audio cables are called RCA Stereo Audio plugs. By using them, if something you are copying was recorded in stereo then your copy would receive the stereo signal and copy it also. They can also be used to attach to outside stereo speakers. The color difference is Red is for a right speaker and white is for a left speaker and also if the sound is not stereo but is mono then only the white jack would receive the sound. I even have a couple of plain grey RCA audio cables that work just as well, as long as I plug them into the unit's white and red jacks. (An audio lesson for the day..hope you like information).

Let me know about your TV setup.

wernerh

10-16-09, 07:06 PM

OK - so I'll start that I'm a real "newbie" at this.

I've got AT&T U-Verse (which I like quite a bit)

Now - I've got some shows recorded to the DVR that I want to "Archive".

So - connect my Philips DVDR-3757H up - and of course Macrovision is there and it can't get the program.

In doing some searching - it looked like the "Video Filter" was a good option to get around this - so I ordered one.

But now - with the "video filter" installed between the U-Verse DVR and the Philips DVDR - the program STILL WON'T come through!

So the immediate question: Has anyone successfully used the "Video Filter" on an AT&T U-Verse DVR (Motorola box) to get shows recorded?

If yes - any info on Video Filter settings would be appreciated (I'm currently just using the component connection and tried both "copy all" and "copy once" settings on the filter.

Thanks for any guidance you may have.

NOTE: If I've posted in a bad forum - please advise.

Church AV Guy

10-17-09, 03:07 AM

I have use the Video Filter from many sources, but not U-Verse. Still, the source shouldn't matter. The box says that if you are using composite, use the two yellow RCA connectors. If you are using S-Video, use (obviously) the S-Video connectors, and if you are using component, then you must use the "Y" (usually green) signal, and the two RCA connectors.

I have never use component, just the other two. My switch settings are, looking at the connector side, from left to right, uuud. The device works fine for me, so I have two suggestions. Start testing it with composite and work up. Also, make sure you have the input and output connected properly. It will not work "in reverse".:D

Um, I forgot to ask: Are seeing any picture at all when it's hooked up? Of you are seeing a picture, then it is merely the switch settings. If you see no picture, then your connections are wrong.

jjeff

10-17-09, 08:40 AM

I might also suggest trying something else you know is protected, say a Disney or other major commercial DVD. If they work through your filter but not with a direct connection, that means your filter is working, if not maybe you have a defective filter in which case a warranty exchange or repair should be in order.

i86time

10-18-09, 01:22 PM

I can't comment directly on filters, but I've also had U-verse (switched from DirecTV) for the past 4 months. I think there is something screwy with how they either insert or pass along the copy flag in their data. I have recorded shows to my DMR-EH75V that indicate copy once (the large X in the navigator) from broadcast stations (NBC and local station KDOC). I was under the impression all broadcast, non-cable stations could never be anything other than copy freely. Also, some shows on basic cable have been marked as copy once (AMC) which I never had a problem with on DirecTV. All subscription services (Starz, Showtime, etc.) are copy once as they usually are. The reason I think it's U-verse is because for those broadcast stations, sometimes the shows record as copy freely and every once in a while they'll be marked as copy once. I'll even re-record them from the DVR to the DVDR and they'll still be flagged. I may post on one of the U-verse boards to see if this can be addressed. I assume a filter would fix this, but if it's something screwy with U-verse, maybe it won't??

microladyusa

10-18-09, 07:35 PM

church av guy has some good questions for you to answer. cant type much as cracked a fingerbone but wanted to add some things.....we are talking about analog output thru the filter. if you use component...green goes to the filter, blue and red go directly to the dvdrecorder. switches are up,up,up,dn

I did a google search on...AT&T U-Verse dvr analog output
and saw lots of comments on this device. specially liked a site called hectorowebblog..got a bookmark if you want it.

you might want to describe your actual connection setup here.

wernerh

10-19-09, 01:21 AM

Church, Jeff ...etc:

Many many thanks for your suggestions and information.

I'm happy to report that I've now got it working properly!

I switched to S-Video cables - but that wasn't the problem. The problem was that I had an HDMI connection to my U-Verse box (my standard U-Verse to TV set connection). Since I was going through the Philips recorder - I wasn't using this connection - but the HDMI copy protection stuff must have still come into play on the U-Verse system.

Basically - all I had to do was disconnect the HDMI between the TV set and the U-Verse box and my S-Video connection between U-Verse to Video Filter to Philips DVDR worked!!

I'm sure my previous Component connection would have worked too - it was just my un-used HDMI connection (un-used if I'm recording to the Philips that is) that was causing my issues.

Don't know exactly what it was doing - but I guess I really don't care since I now have a perfectly good recording setup.

By the way - picture quality through the Video filter looks good.

Thanks again, Werner

NOTE: Just for reference - the error I was getting with HDMI cable connection hooked up was just displaying a Big "TV" ICON with an X in it instead of getting an actual picture out the S-Video or Component outputs of the U-Verse box going through the Video filter and to my TV set.

ROUGH SETUP:

U-VERSE VIDEO FILTER: Dn Dn Dn Up TV

S-Video -------> S-Video In S-Video Out -----> S-Video IN
HDMI -----------------------------------------------> HDMI (this is the cable I had to remove)

wernerh

10-19-09, 01:37 AM

Re-drawing my U-Verse to Video Filter to Recorder setup so it looks right:

U-VERSE____VIDEO FILTER: Dn Dn Dn Up____DVDR
S-Video ------> S-Video In S-Video Out -----> S-Video IN

U-VERSE_______________________________TV
HDMI ------------------------------------------> HDMI
(this is the cable I had to remove to get a full picture)

jjeff

10-19-09, 03:56 PM

My guess is your U-verse box senses you've got a HDMI connection and when you do it disables the SD outputs(S-video/composite) U-verse outputs.
If this is the case it's HDCP at it's worst! In this case even if you wanted to just feed 2 TVs, a HDMI HDTV and a S-video/composite SDTV, you'd be screwed!
My guess is, if you wanted a better STB to TV connection would be to try the component output of your U-verse box. Since component doesn't have all the crap HDCP your U-verse STB shouldn't even know you're using it.
Good trouble shooting figuring out what was going on, I might not have though of disconnecting the HDMI cable to enable SD outputs.

microladyusa

10-19-09, 05:12 PM

glad to hear all is working okay.

microladyusa

10-19-09, 05:39 PM

just want to add jeff is right i think on the hdmi and sd not working together. my vcr/dvdr says if i use the hdmi connection, it will only output digital and do no analog conversion...and you need analog for the filter. glad you tried the hdmi disconnect. good job.

wernerh

10-20-09, 07:57 PM

Thanks again for your help. I also agree with your conjecture on the HDMI issues.

Yeah - although it's such a nice simple interface to connect - HDMI also sticks you with some of the worst copy management restrictions.

Figured I should pass on my experiences to other's that might end up in the same boat.

Happy recording to all!!

GOwenget

10-20-09, 09:41 PM

I'm attempting to backup my old collection of VHS skating videos (about 50 tapes) none of which are available on DVD.

I'm looking at using an ADVC 100 to connect to my MacBook via Firewire.

Does anyone know if this will bypass copy protection and if not what else I need to ensure that I can transfer the tapes.

Then what program do I actually need to capture the video?

These tapes mean a lot to me and I'd really like to be able to watch them without stuffing them up.

Thanks in advance.

datwyl01

03-20-10, 05:48 AM

Newbie here. So I have read this entire thread (all 5 pages). I am on the fence trying to decide on the dpx7000 and am now considering the Video Filter. Price-wise, the current pricing with shiping to Hawaii are pretty darn close.

As far as I can tell, the only visible differences between the 2 units has to do with the hookups. The dpx7000 allows for both audio and video connections through the unit. The VF only deals with the video connections - audio is done direct from the source to recorder. Correct? Does this have any consequence on recording quality? Has anyone experienced any lip-sync issues with either - I'm referring to when the audio does not match the picture - like in a bad chinese kungfu movie?

BTW, my main purpose (for now) is to copy an entire library of CP VHS tapes to DVD. I have a cheap VHS machine (Emerson EWV404) and a Sony VRD-MC5 DVD burner. I may later decided to copy DVDs as well using my Philips DVP5992 player as the source.

Can anyone give an honest opinion on both units along with their preference and why? Or anything else?

joed32

03-20-10, 08:25 AM

I don't have the Video filter but I use the DPX7000 and the older 5000 and Grex and Sima CT-200. They all work fine with no sync issues. The only difference to me is having to strip back the yellow wire when using composite. If you're using S-Video they're all the same. The Grex is cheaper though.

jjeff

03-20-10, 08:33 AM

My points will only be second hand, since I own neither but I have and do use a Sima filter which is similar in theory to both.
I believe the big advantage to the Video Filter brand is it has a switch to signal your recorder to set the 16:9 bit. The advantage of this is if you give your 16:9 DVDs(not ones copied from VHS but most commercial DVDs)to friends who don't have a 16:9 TV they won't see a picture that is vertically stretched. IOW the whole 16:9 frame squished inside their 4:3 screen. The bit will tell their player to letterbox the output so they will still see the 16:9 picture but with the letterboxing the aspect ratio will be correct. If the bit is set owners of 16:9 TVs also won't have to enable the stretch option on their TV to make the picture look the proper aspect.
My filter doesn't have this switch and I only have 16:9 TVs, I don't borrow my DVDs and have my DVD Player setup to stretch all 4:3 DVDs to 16:9.

AFA the audio, routing the audio through the filter won't effect any sync issues in fact I'd rather not route the audio through a filter, IMO it's just one chance to degrade the audio quality. Running the audio direct from player to recorder eliminates one set of cables and 2 sets of connections, which is a good thing in my mind. I really haven't had problems with audio sync with any of my dubs.
From what I've read I believe the Video Filter is more or less the top of the line, more expensive but better built. Cheap filters tend to really degrade the picture quality in various ways. They almost always slightly lighten the picture a tad, even good filters so don't expect a exact mirror copy. The only time I really notice this is during titles where white titles are on a black background, the background won't be a true black but rather grayish.
I'd also use S-video whenever possible, although not all new DVDRs(especially Sonys) don't have S-video inputs.

microladyusa

03-20-10, 03:55 PM

I have the Video Filter. Have had no audio issues and it does eliminate having to have an extra set of audio cables. It is easy to set up, works fine, and when I researched it, I could not find any negative comments about it from owners or anyone on any forum. I like the choices of using S-Video, Component or Composite, the 16:9 choice. It is easy to set up and use and best of all, it does what it is supposed to do. Have no problems with it.

I have not used anything else so I cannot comment on others but I see users are here and so are able to give you additional information so as to make your choice a pretty good informed one.

Good Luck with whatever you chose.

datwyl01

03-20-10, 04:36 PM

I really appreciate everyone's response so far. This entire thread has been very informative, especially posts from jjeff and microladyusa, among others. I should be making a decision soon. Still leaning towards either the VF or dpx7000 since I have read quite a bit on these 2 here. There's just something I can't put my finger on about the Grex that my gut is saying no to. Not sure why.

Off subject. I also have a Panasonic DMR-E50 DVD Recorder. Its about 7 or 8 ears old now, but stopped recording about 6 years ago - soon after the warranty expired. I contacted Panasonic customer support who suggested updating the firmware but this did not work. Right now it is huge paperweight on my file cabinet. If it was working I'd probably be using that to record instead of the Sony MC5 burner. Does anyone know of a fix for the Panny or should I just trash it?

jjeff

03-20-10, 04:46 PM

Depending on the symptoms it may just need a spindle cleaning. If you hear a grinding noise when trying to edit or finalize DVDs or if it's dirty enough even mounting a DVD can make quite a racket, it probably just needs the spindle cleaned.
Here's a thread by Digado talking about spindle cleaning and various pictures.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14479898#post14479898
Note this thread mainly concentrates on '05 and newer Panasonics, your '03 E50 may look different but I believe the general procedures should be the same.
It's also possible you have a failed laser in which case it isn't really feasible to repair. Note your E50 will only burn to RAM and -R discs, no RWs or + disc formats.

datwyl01

03-20-10, 05:48 PM

Thanks jjeff. No, no grinding noises. It just won't record. I get an error message, though its been a while so I don't recall exactly what it said, but something to the effect of unable to record. I would have to hook it back up to reproduce the error.

datwyl01

04-26-10, 05:32 PM

I have a Panasonic DMR-E50P. Looking for a firmware update. Unable to find it in Panasonic's website. Any suggestions?

slytrans69

05-11-10, 11:05 AM

So which device gives the best PQ? I am ready to copy my VHS movies to DVD on my Samsung DVD VR-357. I finally realize that I have some movies that will never be released on DVD.

microladyusa

05-11-10, 03:50 PM

I only have the Video Filter so cannot speak for anything else. I have found when copying a VHS tape to a DVD that my PQ on the DVD is exactly what I had on the VHS tape.

If the VHS tape is done using the best speed for quality...that's what the DVD looks like. I also found that some VHS tapes that had comedy shows I wanted to see again...because I recorded those on extended play, I did not like the PQ on the DVD but when I re-recorded them using SP speed, the DVD looks great.

Of course with movie tapes, they already have the best VHS quality and that's how the DVD should come out.

I believe these filters may also have a satisfaction guarantee if you want to try them...not sure..but you could ask or see on the web sites.
Good Luck...I think you will be pleased at your results.

Church AV Guy

05-11-10, 05:21 PM

So which device gives the best PQ? I am ready to copy my VHS movies to DVD on my Samsung DVD VR-357. I finally realize that I have some movies that will never be released on DVD.
I have a Sima and a Video Filter. The Video Filter is clearly better, but was a lot more expensive. I have never tried a Grex, so I don't know how it compares the others. I use the Video Filter exclusively now. (That name is just too generic sounding.:rolleyes:)

HDS

05-29-10, 01:29 AM

Thanks to all for posting a lot of valuable information in this thread.

I believe I am going to purchase the Video Filter but am in need of final clarification: it will enable me to transfer copy-protected shows from my cable company's DVR to
DVD-R on my separate DVD recorder, yes? Once the connections are made, I suppose all I do is access the show on my DVR's saved programs list and start playing it and it will transfer successfully to DVD-R. Thanks in advance for any confirmation on this.

jjeff

05-29-10, 08:09 AM

Yes you'll just push PLAY on your DVR and REC on your DVDR. Note any OSD on your player will show up on your copy(unless you pause your recorder) so other than pausing your recorder and maybe scanning through the commercials on your player, your best to just let things record.
If your recorder has a HDD the quickest way is to offload your DVR is to just record the whole program to your DVDRs HDD and once it's done edit out the commercials and finally burn a DVD in high speed lossless mode.
Take it from experience it's faster to FF through the actual program(on your DVDR) and edit out the commercials(on your DVDR) than watch the program in realtime pausing for commercials. Of course if your source has no commercials then it's just a matter of PLAY and REC.

microladyusa

05-29-10, 12:44 PM

And the last I read the Video Filter does have a guaranty although I haven't read anyone had to use it.

Logic Design

05-29-10, 04:38 PM

One year guarantee.

HDS

05-29-10, 06:47 PM

jjeff, microladyusa, Logic Design, thank you so much for your responses. I really appreciate it.

rainie789

05-31-10, 07:37 PM

After reading everything that I could, I ordered the video filter. I am having trouble getting the filter to work on anything. I tried using it with my U-verse, I have 3 STB in my home. The DVR is hooked up to the TV in the living room by HDMI cable. I am wondering if this is the problem?

Using the box in the office (without the main DVR) with the recorder hooked up. I have a Toshiba DR570ku recorder, a older Panasonic VCR and an older Panasonic tube TV (having only component hook-ups). There is also a cheapie magnavox DVD in there not hooked up.

Connections are:
co-ax from wall to STB to VCR to TV
component from STB thru filter to recorder back to TV
2nd hookup from VCR to recorder (changing over home movies that are still on VHS). This connection is switched with the DVD player as needed.

I tried using the filter to record shows off the DVR (movies and TV programs that were not able to copy prior to using the filter) error codes. I tried video on demand, error codes. Just to check I tried a DVD movie by hooking up the filter thru the DVD player and DVD recorder, error codes. I even found a VCR movie and once again error codes.

If anyone has an ideas how to get this to work please let me know. I have been playing to the cables and connections all weekend changing things around trying to get anything to record. The connection above is where it started and where it ended. Normally, I'm pretty good at this stuff but this one is escaping me.

i86time

06-01-10, 12:57 AM

I have the Video Filter and U-Verse and it works fine for me. Two things... 1) is the power cord plugged in (you'll see the video - if not it will be a black screen with audio only). From what you described though, it seems the input is showing properly. 2) do you have the dip switches on the back set correctly, for both whichever input you are using (S-Video vs composite) and for Copy Always? If so, and you see the video, but still get copy errors on your recorder, you're Video Filter is probably defective. I have my DVR hooked up via HDMI to my TV and to the Video Filter via S-Video (at the same time) and it works properly.

joed32

06-01-10, 07:47 AM

"component from STB thru filter to recorder back to TV"

Are you actually using component or composite ? It could be a bad filter but that would be a rarity. When I'm testing I just use the yellow composite from the player through the filter to the recorder to make sure I have everything set right. Have never seen error codes when going through the filter.

Logic Design

06-01-10, 10:27 AM

I doudbt if your recorder has components input so you must mean composite. I recommend you try S-Video and the switches set to DN UP UP UP for 1, 2, 3, 4 respectively.

rainie789

06-03-10, 10:04 AM

rainie789

06-06-10, 01:53 PM

Tried the S-video cables and their was no change. Anyone else have any ideas what I could try before I send this back.

jjeff

06-06-10, 04:46 PM

You might want to wait for Logic Design to reply, but if you're getting video through the filter but your CP warnings still persist I'd exchange it. It should block any CP that I know of, VHS, DVD, BR, U-verse, etc., at lease my Sima does(except I don't have U-verse to test) and the VF should be similar.

microladyusa

06-06-10, 05:30 PM

Rainie789:

PLease reread this thread and see if anything sounds like your situation. In particular, read Page 5, Post by WernerH dated 10/19, post #129. He was using U-Verse and found his problem with his HDMI. Check it out. I cannot think of a reason why you are not getting everything working unless like with WernerH, his HDMI copy protection was kicking in just by being connected as he said.

Remember, the Filter works only on analog connections. I have the Toshiba D560 and also a Toshiba DVR670 and no problems. I do not use an HDMI connection with this setup.
but WernerH did and he saw it was interfering with his analog signals. Hope this helps.

I still think you can do what you want. Again, you might wish to describe all connections involving the Video Filter.
But maybe WernerH's post will help you.

microladyusa

06-06-10, 06:24 PM

Also, I would suggest trying the simplest totally analog connection first...only using your STB out to the VF and the VF out to your Recorder. Make sure your switches on the VF reflect the S-Video or composite (or component) you are using from the box to the VF.
You mentioned an older TV...is the picture 4:3 or 16:9? Makes a difference on the switches.
The idea is you should see a picture that your recorder is seeing through its input..I assume your input to the recorder is an input line not the tuner. Then on your TV you should see what is coming in on the recorder's line input.

Besides possibly the HDMI interfering with the analog connections, I will say that last year I had a problem with a Toshiba DVR660 as it was saying copy protected on everything including OTA channels and refused to record. Toshiba sent me a DVR670 which never had the problem and I do have a D560 that also never had the problem.
I found out by recording from TV OTA with the D560 showing no errors or copy protection while at the same time I tried recording to the DVR660, same channel, same OTA signal and the 660 refused saying it was CP...the problem was with the DVR and nothing else.
If you can record to your DVR regular programs then your DVR should be okay so I still would be looking at the connections pathways and see exactly where the problem is.

Just some more thoughts for you. I really think you can do it but you may have to check it all out..one step at a time.

Again...hope this helps.

Church AV Guy

06-08-10, 06:31 PM

I looked at all your posts to get this working. And sorry that I said composite it was component. The filter is plugged in....and yes I can see a picture. I do see a picture when I have it on. Switches are U,U,U,D. Still continue to get an error message when recording and that is on local channels. I will try picking up S cables this afternoon and see if that helps.

Tried the S-video cables and their was no change. Anyone else have any ideas what I could try before I send this back.
Did you ever get your issue resolved? Is it now working for you?

rainie789

06-18-10, 07:31 PM

Sorry, I unexpectedly had to go out of town. I have been playing with the connections and trying to record different things to see what is working. I have tried a little of everything to see what I can do and what still gives me the error message. Error message is E25, which is not in the manual so I do have to call and see what that is.

Currently I have the STB to filter to recorder using S-video cords and composite out to the TV. At this time I can record anything off of the regular and even premium TV programming, including everything from the DVR that I tried. I am able to record some off on-demand service but not everything. I tried using the same hookup to the DVD and VCR removing the STB and just going to each. once again I can record somethings but still not others.

MicroladyUSA: Thank you for your help and suggestions. I did read wernerh's posts regarding the HDMI. The HDMI in question is on another TV and the main STB with the DVR. The recorder is in my office with a older TV, VCR and DVD player. I don't know if having the HDMI to STB on a completely different TV would cause problems, nor have I pulled it to see if it is. I can pull it and use another connection to see if it does if anyone thinks that it may help.

Once again, I always see a picture and hear sound on the TV no matter what hook up that I use through the filter. the TV is 4:3 and the set top box is set to 4:3, 420 no HD. I do not use the tuner so it does go to the input line using the STB for channels

microladyusa

06-19-10, 03:16 PM

Just a few things I thought of reading your post. Earlier when you first came on, it sounded as though you had trouble recording anything using the filter...now your recent post sounds as though you are doing pretty much okay. What is an example of something you cannot record?

Remember, the filter is not a descrambler and so you cannot get those items unless you do subscribe to them..then..maybe you can.

Error message E25, according to my DVDR560 Manual in the Timer recording section means "copy protected program". I would think that should mean like HBO or any on demand channel where one has to order it to see it. What programs give you an E25?

You also said you always see a picture on the TV. Are you seeing the picture from the Input Line 1 from the Recorder or from where?
Whatever your DVD Recorder shows you on Line 1 as the picture it "sees", that is the picture you should be able to record.

Again, you are saying now that you find you can record some things but still not others. Again, an example of what you can record vs what you cannot record would be helpful.

The filter mainly helps transfer VHS tapes to DVD or even copy a DVD to another DVD. Copying regular TV programs would not need a filter unless some broadcasters are inserting a no copy flag where they shouldn't, in which case, the filter should catch that.

You do sound as though you are copying pretty much everything as you said: "At this time I can record anything off of the regular and ever premium TV programming, including everything from the DVR that I tried". What is left?

joed32

06-20-10, 10:27 AM

A properly working Grex will allow you to record anything. I have never found an exception.

rainie789

06-23-10, 11:29 AM

jjeff

06-23-10, 07:10 PM

I would be really curious to try copying your HBO and max with one of my Panasonic DVDRs and Sima CT-2 filter. With my combination's I've never been restricted from copying any DVD/VHS or even BR (which I would think would have as strong of CP as anything else), I don't have pay TV.
It was my understanding that with a DVD filter anything you see, you should be able to record. Apparently that is not the case with your setup. Are you able to copy the same DVDs(that you can with the VF) without the VF? Remember that not all DVDs or even VHS have Macrovision CP. Particular DVDs may not copy on a computer but will copy with a standalone DVDR without any filter.
I first try without my Sima(because the Sima slightly lightens the blacks) and maybe 30% work this way, if I get a CP warning then I use my filter, which again copies 100% of the time for me. I do know though that newer Toshibas(ones built by Funai) along with Sony are VERY prone to CP and even false CP warnings, so that could be contributing to your failures.

i86time

06-23-10, 10:50 PM

MicroladyUSA once again thank you for your thoughts and suggestions!

For the recording I am doing pretty well, meaning I can get a lot of things that I was unable to before. An example of something that I can not record would be HBO and max on demand. (both I do subscribe too) Some standard DVDs from my collection can not be recorded. When I got everything working, I grabbed a handfull of DVDs and tried recording bits of them just to see. Out of the 10 I was able to record 7. I also tried with VHS movies, I was able to copy 9 out of 10. All of these are also the things that give me the E25 message.

I see pictures and hear sound thru the input line. I think that the ATT uverse puts in extra copy flags in their broadcasting. Prior to the filter I had problems with all the major network channels (CBS, ABC Fox etc). The DVR was filling up to fast so I was trying to put some of the shows on DVD to watch them before losing them to make space on the DVR. I was getting error messages with regular network cable shows, one episode I would be able to record then the next week I would not. I would have problems previously even getting those things to DVD, but with the filter that has resolved. So that was a big plus for me because prior to getting the filter working correctly, I was not able to do that.

So I can record all network TV without problem or error message (unlike previously where sometimes it would record and sometimes I wouldn't) I can record from the premium channels (which I subscribe to all) but not HBO or Cinemax on dmeand. All the other on demand I can do. I can record some DVDs and VHS.

As a U-Verse user, I understand that craziness completely. So I ended up purchasing a Video Filter and it's allowed me to reocrd everything so far; Showtime and TMC premiums, HD tiers and all the VOD I've tried. I don't subscribe to HBO/Cinemax, so I can't try that VOD content, but I can try the other stations content and report back. I can't imagine U-Verse (or the stations) are inserting any signal into only HBO/Cinemax VOD that isn't in any of the other channels.

But it is odd that you can't record ALL VHS and DVD that you try. Both formats have 'macrovision', which the filter should disable, and some DVD's (maybe all) also implement CGMS-A, which is what digital cable/etc. output and the Video Filter is designed to remove. Have you tried contacting Logic Design directly for an exchange?

microladyusa

06-24-10, 05:57 PM

Glad to hear you do have most of what you need..working.

You did mention having a HDMI with a DVR from the main STB to another TV. Even though it is in another room..the fact that your incoming signal to your STBs is from one source...it wouldn't hurt to go ahead and try pulling the HDMI completely and using a different connection and see if that helps anything at all. You can always put it back. Maybe since the "main STB" senses the HDMI, your source signal to all boxes sends the protection it would do on an HDMI connection.

Once you do that then see if you can record from your HBO VOD that you subscribe to and also check our your non-copy DVDs and VHS tapes.

I don't get HBO so can't check that out for you but I do have a Toshiba DR560 which is almost identical to your DR570 and if you want to give me a name of a popular DVD you own that you have trouble copying..I will see if I can get it from Netflix and see what my units say about the DVD...maybe I can get a clue about why you cannot do these copies with the filter. If you can see the DVD picture you should be able to record that picture. Maybe taking the HDMI out of all connections will solve that problem so try that first but if that gets you your VOD that you order but does not affect those few DVDs you mentioned..we can then check those out.

As far as VHS, I have a VHS tape of the movie Rocky and playing it on my DVDR.....shows a great picture and no errors. I know you said some tapes were okay but some were not. If I had a copy of the 'not' I would check that out for you but the best I can check using basically the same equipment would be a DVD that is available.

Let me know how the HDMI removal came out. By checking a DVD we could eliminate the possibility that your DVDR may have more sensitivity than it should.

My 560 has never given me E25. I did have a combo 660 last year that was defective because it showed almost everything OTA and/or cable was protected when it was not. Toshiba sent me their newer model, the 670 and I have not had the problem since. Me checking a DVD on my DVDR that you cannot record without getting an error...if I do not get an error..then we have learned something there.

i86time

06-25-10, 01:42 AM

Well, I recorded about 2.5 min. from one program under each of the VOD->Premium listings, minus HBO and Cinemax, using the Video Filter. All recorded without problems. However, I then bypassed the Video Filter and was able to record the same parts again without any error, so it appears there is no CGMS-A protection under those programs, unless it occurs randomly within the program. Quite curious. I'm using a Panasonic DMR-EH75V, S-Video input.

jjeff

06-25-10, 07:35 AM

I then bypassed the Video Filter and was able to record the same parts again without any error, so it appears there is no CGMS-A protection under those programs, unless it occurs randomly within the program. Quite curious. I'm using a Panasonic DMR-EH75V, S-Video input.

Good test and AFA random positioning of the CP bit, with DVDs anyway I've never seen it start after the program has started. That is if it's present it will restrict the recording right away. Note not necessarily every part of a commercial disc will be protected. I once had a commercial DVD that would let me copy the extras without my Sima but as soon as I started the main title my recorder would stop recording with a CP warning. No matter where in the movie I pushed REC the warning would prohibit copying. Generally though if a disc is CP'd everything is CP'd, but apparently it doesn't have to be.

Thinking this through, it may be possible for TV to start or stop the CP bit in the middle of the program. I remember when people were(are??) having problems with their recorders shutting off only during commercials of all things. People speculating about the music?? in them being copy protected. But to date I've not had this happen with commercial DVDs, which seem to be the whole title or nothing at all.

i86time

06-25-10, 11:48 AM

Well, talk about serendipity. I wake up this morning to a notice on U-Verse that HBO/Cinemax is having a free preview weekend, including VOD. So, I attempted to record one VOD from each (setup still bypassed the Video Filter), and my recorder doesn't even get 1 sec. into it (during those 30-60 sec previews before the movie actually begins) when it gives me the copy prohibited error. I then hooked the Video Filter back up and I recorded the same programs, no problem.

I may be off, but perhaps your recorder (which I have no experience with) is responding to something other than CGMS-A and Macrovision copy protection. By that I mean perhaps there is some data in the video you're trying to record which is mistakenly fooling the recorder into thinking it's some sort of unknown copy protection, when in fact it is not. If you have the VF CGMS-A bit set to 'copy freely' and it works for some (most) programs, then it's 'on' for everything you're attempting to record. If it's not working for those other programs, I'd think it would be because of the recorder. Can you get your hands on another brand/model of recorder to try out?

microladyusa

06-26-10, 03:43 PM

Very good responses from others here, giving examples of what works. I do still wonder about the STB having an HDMI out which has CP in it. I know some have had it hooked up without it interfering with other outputs but others did have it interfere with other outputs so I still am curious for Rainie789 to disconnect the HDMI completely and only use his analog outputs on his STB to the VF and see if it makes any difference. Each thing we think of to try either helps or we learn to eliminate that idea.

I did read on the Net about HBO saying only its VOD of HBO and Cinemax would have a Copy Never Flag but not its regular HBO (who may have copy once?). They say no one needs to copy VOD cause once they order it they can watch the program anytime...sounded reasonable until someone else pointed out...yeah, until HBO says things like...only available until (a date certain). Sounds like watching "anytime" can have a time limit.

Mike99

06-27-10, 01:11 AM

What happens if you feed a premium channel such as HBO into a Panasonic DVDR using a RAM disc? Will it record?

gastrof

06-29-10, 12:34 AM

What happens if you feed a premium channel such as HBO into a Panasonic DVDR using a RAM disc? Will it record?

If this isn't a case of using a filter of some kind, then maybe this could be asked in a forum aimed at your specific recorder.

Mike99

06-29-10, 01:51 AM

If this isn't a case of using a filter of some kind, then maybe this could be asked in a forum aimed at your specific recorder.

I figured if using a RAM disc solved the problem then perhaps a filter may not be needed. The Panasonic manual states that RAM discs are CPRM compatible. I cannot try it myself because I do not get any premium channels such as HBO.

This was offered as a possible suggestion to help those that were having problems.

Logic Design

06-29-10, 08:56 AM

CPRM means that the disc is capable of recording COPY ONCE material; Not COPY ALWAYS. So, if you have a show that is flagged as COPY ONCE, the RAM disc is supposed to be able to record it. This is alllowed since RAM disc are supposed to be used for temporary storage, not permanent. Of course they are also more expensive. If you record a show which is flagged COPY ONCE and tried to play it back, the player will set the COPY NEVER flag at it's output so that you can't record that show again.

jjeff

06-29-10, 04:58 PM

CPRM means that the disc is capable of recording COPY ONCE material; Not COPY ALWAYS.....

I think you meant RAM is capable of COPY ONCE, not COPY NEVER and I believe HBO or PPV would be the later.
You could try the RAM disc but even if it did work you wouldn't be able to copy it a more standard R/RW DVD.

Mike99

06-29-10, 06:06 PM

I think you meant RAM is capable of COPY ONCE, not COPY NEVER. Which is what I'd think HBO or PPV may use.
You could try the RAM disc but even if it did work you wouldn't be able to copy it a more standard R/RW DVD.

Would you be able to download the program to a PC and then, depending on software, burn a regular DVD? Again I cannot try any of this because I do not get any premium channels.

Church AV Guy

06-29-10, 06:12 PM

I think you meant RAM is capable of COPY ONCE, not COPY NEVER. Which is what I'd think HBO or PPV may use.
You could try the RAM disc but even if it did work you wouldn't be able to copy it a more standard R/RW DVD.
I agree, I'm pretty sure he meant COPY NEVER. At least that was what I thought as soon as I read his post.

jjeff

06-29-10, 07:17 PM

Would you be able to download the program to a PC and then, depending on software, burn a regular DVD? Again I cannot try any of this because I do not get any premium channels.

My guess is the CP bit may allow you to copy to HDD but not off your PCs HDD to a regular DVD(unless you use some type of CP bypassing software) but like you I don't have this issue so I couldn't verify.

i86time

06-30-10, 12:15 AM

I had a 'copy once' recording I transferred to DVD-RAM a while back. As I recall, I could not copy it to HDD using the typical programs (e.g. DVD Decrypter, DVDShrink), likely because of the different file structure, .VRO I think. I was able to directly copy the file to my HDD. But when I tried to play it, the audio was disjointed and 'screechy' and the video was a jumble of blocks, like when a non-decrypted .vob is played. I recall searching for software to fix it, but couldn't find any. The program played fine off the disc though.

gastrof

06-30-10, 12:51 AM

Sounds like playing the original (the DVD-RAM) thru a filter to another recorder might be the only way to "rescue" the recording and make it available to copying.

i86time

06-30-10, 11:30 AM

Sounds like playing the original (the DVD-RAM) thru a filter to another recorder might be the only way to "rescue" the recording and make it available to copying.

I'm not too worried about it, as that program came on again months later when I had a Video Filter, so no more CP.

But, yes, that might be the only way to do it. Perhaps if someone could modify standard DVD decrypting programs to accept a .VRO fileset, that may accomplish the same thing, but it doesn't look like that would happen so late in the RAM game.

I just found this (http://forum.slysoft.com/showpost.php?p=105238&postcount=6) while doing a quick search, but I can't seem to download the files... but that may be an option.

Logic Design

06-30-10, 12:05 PM

jjeff, You are correct in that I meant to say COPY NEVER instead opf COPY ALWAYS, a few posts ago.

datwyl01

07-07-10, 11:18 PM

Its been a while since I posted. My VF is working fine. I had an issue early on in that I couldn't copy a DVD to DVD. I was using a Toshiba Player and a Sony MC-5 burner. Max is awesome. We couldn't figure out what the problem was so he exchanged the unit with one that has updated firmware. Unfortunately, I think the problem is with the Sony. It some how is still picking up the copyright off of the dvd signals. It's wierd because VF works fine for VHS to DVD (still using the sony).

Recently, I discovered that occasisionally, I will get a copyright error on the sony when copying VHS. I found that by "resetting" the VF, the error is corrected. Simply unplug and replug the power. I've yet to try that for the DVD-DVD. But when I do, and if it works, I will let you all know.

As for PQ - I agree with the general thought that what ever it is on the VHS, that's what you'll get. The Sony has the option of setting the record quality (HQ, HSP, SP, etc.), but that really only allows for preset record times (60, 90, 120, etc.). Not sure how that plays into the PQ on the copy.

gastrof

07-08-10, 10:54 PM

...The Sony has the option of setting the record quality (HQ, HSP, SP, etc.), but that really only allows for preset record times (60, 90, 120, etc.). Not sure how that plays into the PQ on the copy.

Simple.

It's VERY similar to how things worked with VHS recorders.

The more time you want on the DVD, the lower your picture quality is because you're squeezing more digital information on the disc. Sacrifices have to be made to do that, so your picture quality isn't as good.

Using the HQ setting gives you the best results on your DVD. Using anything lower than that gives you, step by step, lower and lower picture quality.

A VHS example-

Normally storebought movies and TV shows on video tapes would be recorded at the "two hour" setting. (Called such because most VHS tapes would record two hours of material at that setting.)

The "six hour" setting wasn't anything like that, quality-wise. You were literally trying to squeeze three times the material onto each inch of video tape. You just couldn't do that, so what did get onto the tape couldn't produce the same type of picture on playback as the "two hour" setting would have allowed.

I once saw a really weird release of the Western mini-series "Lonesome Dove"...the entire thing on a single VHS tape, at the "six hour" speed.

The results were NOT what you'd expect from a storebought video.

The original was fine, naturally, but the lower recording setting worsened the picture.

You'll get the same results with a DVD recorder's various settings.

datwyl01

07-09-10, 12:29 AM

Make sense. So, I shouldn't try to squeez a multi-tape program onto one disc - for quality sake. For example, I have the VHS version of Titanic - 2 tapes. I should transfer it to 2 separate discs.

gastrof

07-14-10, 03:00 AM

Make sense. So, I shouldn't try to squeez a multi-tape program onto one disc - for quality sake. For example, I have the VHS version of Titanic - 2 tapes. I should transfer it to 2 separate discs.

How long is the movie? (I have no idea on the run time for that film.)

I make fine recordings even at the three hour DVD setting, but of course that's off broadcast. Doing it off a tape....ummmmm....

Here's an idea.

Use a RW disc and record the whole movie, using whatever setting is required to fit the whole thing on one DVD.

If you like the results, do it again with a non-rewriteable DVD, and make that your permanent copy.

joed32

07-14-10, 07:37 AM

Titanic's run time is 3:14. I would put it on 2 disks, especially since you already have it broken up into 2 tapes.

jjeff

07-14-10, 07:44 AM

^^^agreed. While generally I believe one can get up to 3hrs of decent quality full D1 with a Panasonic, that's with a clean source like digital TV or a DVD copy. With a noisier source like VHS I wouldn't push 3hrs and preferable stick closer to 2hrs(SP). With a 3:14 movie I'd probably use FR set for the length of each original tape(which might be around 1:37 min each). Using this speed you should get the needed bitrate for a good VHS conversion.
I'm all for trying to push the speed limit to fit the max on a disc but not at the noticeable expense of the picture quality.

svet

07-14-10, 12:27 PM

I know that Grex has special operation mode that force wide screen.
I suggest you to contact Dimax (www.xdimax.com) for details. I did it once but do not remember how exactly.

Church AV Guy

07-14-10, 12:55 PM

Titanic's run time is 3:14. I would put it on 2 disks, especially since you already have it broken up into 2 tapes.

^^^agreed. While generally I believe one can get up to 3hrs of decent quality full D1 with a Panasonic, that's with a clean source like digital TV or a DVD copy. With a noisier source like VHS I wouldn't push 3hrs and preferable stick closer to 2hrs(SP). With a 3:14 movie I'd probably use FR set for the length of each original tape(which might be around 1:37 min each). Using this speed you should get the needed bitrate for a good VHS conversion.
I'm all for trying to push the speed limit to fit the max on a disc but not at the noticeable expense of the picture quality.
If you left the closing credits off, it just might be under 3 hours. :D

Just saying...

datwyl01

07-14-10, 03:31 PM

Thanks everyone for the great info. It looks like I may have to copy each tape separately. My target drive is a Sony VRD-MC5, which does not have the FR capability. I can only use preset record times of 60 (HQ), 90 (HSP), 120 (SP), 180 (LP), and 360 (SLP). If Titanic is roughly 97 minutes each tape (194 total), I would have to use the SP setting for each tape. Unfortunately that would leave a lot of unused space on the disc (roughly 23 minutes). Forcing the entire program onto 1 disc wihtout any editing would force me to use the SLP setting, which is out of the question. If I edit out most of the credits and probably all of the opening sequence just before teh opening scene, I may be able to squeeze it into the LP. I probabaly will have to play with the tapes to see what I can get away with before copying. OR, hold off until I can by a Panny.

jjeff

07-14-10, 03:42 PM

I forgot to mention, with the Pannys you can record to DL media. No problem using SP which will give you over 3 1/2 hrs, more than enough room for both tapes.

i86time

07-14-10, 04:04 PM

Colloquor

07-14-10, 04:38 PM

I'd opt for buying the DVD also. I've seen a number of new and sealed Titanic DVDs on eBay for $10, and free shipping.

I'm in the process of dubbing a large number of SuperBeta Hi-Fi tapes to DVD, and for some, especially those with long playing times, I just went to either Amazon or eBay and bought the DVD. It's a lot easier, and the quality is better.

Church AV Guy

07-15-10, 01:01 PM

I have never owned or used a GREX, but I have and use the Video Filter occasionally.

[expositional story]
I have purchased an EH59 International Panasonic DVD recorder. This will also play back PAL disks. Recently I bought some region 2 PAL disks, and use my EH59 to play them back (in PAL). My Vizio displays PAL with no problem, so this works fine. The wife wanted to watch them in her room while working on her stuff. I needed to make NTSC copes of these. Even going through the PAL to NTSC converter, there was CP in the video stream that prevented me from making the copies.
[/expositional story]

I found out yesterday that the Viedo Filter will remove the CP from the NTSC stream that was converted from the PAL stream from the region 2 disk. I feared it might be different enough to not work, but that was unfounded. The Video Filter worked great. I only wish my PAL to NTSC conversion was as good. The difference between the original disks, and the converted ones is quite noticeable.:(

jjeff

07-15-10, 05:02 PM

My Sima CT-2 has a PAL/NTSC switch but it does no conversion. I believe it just enables the Sima to either work with PAL or NTSC and output the same.
I've read that DVD players that convert from PAL to NTSC do a better job than external converters. They are also quite cheap, along with my EH-59 I purchased a used JVC DVD player(for $29!) and as a bonus it advertises it will convert from PAL to NTSC. I also have a Pioneer 410 that can apparently be hacked(using Hkan's post) to play PAL and convert to NTSC, but since I have no PAL DVDs I haven't done it.
I'm just saying you might want to check into open box converting DVD players, for $30 I think it would be worth a try. The Pio is a upconverter but not the JVC.

Super Eye

07-15-10, 06:13 PM

I purchased a used JVC DVD player(for $29!) and as a bonus it advertises it will convert from PAL to NTSC. I also have a Pioneer 410 that can apparently be hacked(using Hkan's post) to play PAL and convert to NTSC, but since I have no PAL DVDs I haven't done it.

FYI:
As far as I know ALL North American Pioneer and JVC players will do a real time region free or region 1 PAL to NTSC conversion without any modifications or hacks. However not all North American JVC and PIO players will play "out of region" discs – for that you may need a hack.

Curios jjeff.
May I ask which JVC player you purchased?

jjeff

07-15-10, 08:14 PM

FYI:
As far as I know ALL North American Pioneer and JVC players will do a real time region free or region 1 PAL to NTSC conversion without any modifications or hacks. However not all North American JVC and PIO players will play "out of region" discs – for that you may need a hack.

Curios jjeff.
May I ask which JVC player you purchased?

I didn't know that, like I said I knew it was a feature but probably one I may never use. Don't get to Europe much these days:(
The JVC I ordered was a XV-N370B, which I know very little other than the price was good and I wanted a player who's remote wouldn't conflict with my Sonys and Pio. Hopefully I'll be able to display remaining time on the unit while it's silent OSD, apparently some/all?? JVCs had this feature but even if it doesn't it will be OK.

mirayge

07-16-10, 07:14 PM

Bought at rummage without power supply. Does anyone know what polarity and voltage I need?

DigaDo

07-16-10, 08:34 PM

Bought at rummage without power supply. Does anyone know what polarity and voltage I need?

The answer is yes, someone surely does have that information but I am not that person. Try Googling "Recoton V616 specifications" for that information.

mirayge

07-17-10, 03:05 AM

The answer is yes, someone surely does have that information but I am not that person. Try Googling "Recoton V616 specifications" for that information.
Been there, tried that. I was just hoping someone here had used one. There is a serious dearth of information on this unit. I finally searched ebay and a seller listed the model number of the transformer. Searching that yielded the answer: + tip, 9v, 200mA.

jjeff

07-19-10, 06:46 PM

The JVC I ordered was a XV-N370B, which I know very little other than the price was good and I wanted a player who's remote wouldn't conflict with my Sonys and Pio. Hopefully I'll be able to display remaining time on the unit while it's silent OSD, apparently some/all?? JVCs had this feature but even if it doesn't it will be OK.

:(I guess I got what I paid for:o
IMO the JVC was a P.O.C. Other than a nice slim profile it has very little going for it. It has NO remaining time, OSD or not, only elapsed. The PQ (only tested through S-video) was sub par and the tray is so skinny and flimsy it's hard to get DVDs out. It also has a few other odd quirks, all in all leading me to return it. I'm probably going to end up paying $10-15 shipping for this $29 player but I wouldn't even want it for $14 so I guess any money I get back is saved money.
I believe JVCs used to be built well, but apparently not anymore. I guess I should have known since I did try a $99 JVC BR player from Sams(was also of the very skinny design) and it was equally poor.
I didn't even try the PAL-NTSC conversion of it since the regular DVD playback was so poor I doubt the conversion was any good either:(

Nuanced

08-16-10, 10:15 PM

where can find info (specs, cost) on the Video Filter?

jjeff

08-16-10, 10:22 PM

Check post #2, that link seems to be still active.

mike28086

09-02-10, 07:35 PM

To anyone interested,

I received my Video Filter today, it works great! The best I have had. I owned a Sima in the past, have seen the GoDVD unit working at a friends house, and when I needed a new unit due to image degradation, I thought that I would try the 'Video Filter'. With this new unit, there is not the slightest video loss, not even the slightest loss, this is maybe one of the best purchases I have made.

Regards,

mike28086

jjeff

09-02-10, 07:53 PM

I guess the old saying is still true then, You get what you pay for:cool:
If my Sima CT-2(s) ever go I'd probably try the VF. My only complaint about the CT-2 is it slightly lightens the black level. If I had to guess I'd say something like a +4 IRE, which is most noticeable with white credits on a black background.
I might also try something like this (http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=101&cp_id=10114&cs_id=1011407&p_id=7114&seq=1&format=2) if it ever comes in stock. I would think it should strip the CP but isn't advertised as such. MP is guessing 9/17 ETA.

greaser

09-02-10, 08:12 PM

jjeff,please be aware that the COMP.video> c/s-video converter may be the Lenkeng converter,the price is what makes me suspicious that it is. It may or may not work for you.I hope for your sake that it does,cuz otherwise you won't be a happy camper! I have a Lenkeng,but it doesn't do what it should. Also make double sure that you can get your money back if you have problems.

I'm currently waiting for the new model being released by www.shinybowusa.com Model # SB3681n.It's supposed to come out on 9/21/10.No price listed yet but there is a 3yr. parts and labor warranty on it,so i'm guessing it'll probably be a good unit. From what iv'e read Shinybow manufactures high quality products. G.

jjeff

09-02-10, 09:08 PM

The only way I'd buy the one from MP is if it carried the same return policy as the rest of what they sell, which according to their website is:

For Refund: All returns must be authorized by Monoprice within 30 days of the delivery date. There is NO RESTOCKING FEE applied to any return item(s), however, S&H cost is not refundable. For Replacement: After 30 days, Monoprice only replace the item(s) for the same item(s) during its warranty period if it is defective. Sorry, we will not exchange an item with a different item. The Product ID (PID) must be the same.

The worst I'd see it I might be out the shipping. Personally I don't need the component to S-video converter but I'd use the CP removing part. Even if it introduced noise or messed with the black level I'd return it, I'm kind of fussy that way.

greaser

09-02-10, 09:23 PM

wisny

02-07-11, 12:55 PM

Hi all,

I've been reading this and a few other threads having to do with video stabilizers. I think I'm going to get the Video Filter by Logic Design.

I have a few questions not specifically about the filter, though. In reading about archiving copyrighted vhs tapes to dvds, some places talk about using a video stabilizer with a video capture card, saving to mpeg, then burning via your computer. Other places talk about using a video stabilizer with a dvd recorder, and burning direct from tape to dvd, no computer in between.

Is one way better than the other? If computer is better, can you recommend which video capture card and software to use?

If direct from vhs to dvd is better, can you help me pick which units to use? I have various decks at my disposal to use, none of them were top of the line, IIRC. I had been considering replacing a half broken (vcr works, dvd doesn't) with a new unit, primarily because I wanted to archive a bunch of vhs tapes, and was looking for one that would make good copies. Can someone tell me which decks would be best to use for copying direct from vhs to dvd, no computer in between? And should I buy a new unit, or is what I already have good enough to make clean dvd archive copies of vhs tapes? Here's the stuff I have available:

VCRs:

Panasonic DVD Video Recorder (combo dvdr/vcr) model no DMR-E75V (only the vcr side works)
Toshiba DVD Recorder/VCR (combo dvcr/vcr) model no DKVR60KU

DVD recorder:

Toshiba DVD Recorder/VCR (combo dvdr/vcr) model no DKVR60KU
Toshiba DVD Recorder (stand alone) model no D-R550

DVD player:

Dynex 19" LCD TV/DVD (combo tv/dvd player) model no DX-LDVD19-10A

I had been thinking of replacing the half broken DVDR/VCR with this model:

Toshiba DVD Recorder/VCR (combo dvdr/vcr) model no DVR670
(took out link, couldn't put URLs in yet, b/c of low post count)

But, I'm not sure if I need it, or if what I have already is okay, or if something else would be better.

I have probably a couple hundred vhs tapes I'd like to transfer. Any and all help would be greatly appreciated !

Best,
wisny :)

microladyusa

02-07-11, 02:16 PM

wisny

02-07-11, 02:39 PM

I have the Toshiba 670 and it does the job very well for me. I also use the Video Filter and this model copies VHS to DVD very easily. Remember, the quality of the DVD picture will be identical to the VCR picture. I don't know of any technique that can improve an original recording picture.

Your model Toshiba described as DKVR60 KU. Is that the model?
There is a DVR660KU that did have copy protection sensitivity that I sent back and Toshiba sent me the DVR670 which has performed perfectly for almost 2 years now. You might try your Toshiba60KU to see what kind of picture you get...just doing one VHS tape. I would use a -RW or +RW so if I don't like the result I can reuse the DVD by reformatting it.

I don't think going the other route using a computer would be worth that extra expense as I don't think you will get any better picture from the original VHS tape than you would with the Toshiba.

Wouldn't hurt to try one with the machine you have now that the VHS and DVDR sides both work. But wait to get the Video Filter before you try it.

Hi, microlady :) Thx for your answer !!

Yes, the DKVR60KU is the model I currently have, that has both sides working. I'm not sure if I can post links or not, but here is a link to the DKVR60 (no KU) on Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/Toshiba-Factory-Refurbished-DKVR60-Player/dp/B003Y814M8/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1297107107&sr=8-1). (edit: yay! I can post links now. LOL!) I couldn't find the KU model there. My KU has not tuner, so maybe that is the difference between the DKVR60 and DKVR60KU?

I'm not sure where I heard about the 670, but I think someone told me that it would be a good model for archiving the VHS's. Did I understand you correctly, that you are able to use just the 670 with the Video Filter, and not two separate units? I thought that I'd have to have a separate VHS player and DVD recorder, with the filter in between the two? You don't need separate decks with the Toshiba 670?

And, thanks for the comment re: computer. It does seem easier to just go deck to deck, and leave the computer out of it! LOL Glad to know it's not worth the investment and time to learn about and acquire a vid capture device and software :) to go the PC route.

I haven't ordered the Filter yet. I should go ahead and get that, right?

Is there a difference between the +RW and the -RW formats? I've never actually recorded on a dvd yet. :eek:

jjeff

02-07-11, 04:35 PM

microladyusa

02-07-11, 08:30 PM

Sorry about that. If you copy a regular VHS you recorded...you can just do the dubbing on one machine VHS to DVD. If you feel your recorder might think there is copy protection on the VHS, then you would need 2 separate machines with the Video Filter. You seem to have that already.

One connection I have is from my 670 VHS RCA video and audio out then the video goes into the Video Filter and from the Video Filter Video out to my Toshiba 570 DVDR RCA Video In. The audio just goes from the 670 audio out to the 570 audio in. Only the Video has to be "screened" for CP. This works fine.

I think you will need the Video Filter (which has a return policy if it doesn't do what you want), some RCA video and audio cables and the machines you already have. Plus some DVDs to try it out with.
You will have to read your manual to get the idea of recording to a DVD. I find the best to be setting the DVD to the Video format (which is what is used in DVD Rentals that play everywhere), and of course the recording speed should be set to get the whole VHS at one time. The +RW does not need to be finalized as has been pointed out, which makes it easier to record over it if it didn't do what you wanted. For your final transfer you might consider the +R or -R. These cannot be added to or erased but if you are making a permanent copy, these might be cheaper when doing a lot of tapes.

I couldn't find the specs on your machine so I do not know what your connections are but I assume they are the normal RCA at the least. The Video Filter can also do S-Video if you have a VHS player that has S-Video out and a DVD recorder that has S-Video in.

wisny

02-08-11, 12:22 PM

I would be surprised if you could put a filter or anything else between the VHS and DVD sections of your Toshiba combo. Panasonic had a couple models pre '07 that had that feature but AFAIK no current combos do.
AFA disc types, +RWs have the advantage of not needing to be finalized and is probably the preferred disc type with a Toshiba(Funai machines prefer + media). The recording quality will be the same with any DVD although if you use cheap media(CMC made, Memorex, and most store brands) you may get lockups or recording failures. I'd try and fine Verbatim or Sony discs if you can.

Thanks very much jjeff :) I ordered some Sony +RW discs from Amazon to get started. I really appreciate the info re: the disc formats, the Video Filter, and also Funai - I didn't know Toshiba was Funai!

Sorry about that. If you copy a regular VHS you recorded...you can just do the dubbing on one machine VHS to DVD. If you feel your recorder might think there is copy protection on the VHS, then you would need 2 separate machines with the Video Filter. You seem to have that already.

One connection I have is from my 670 VHS RCA video and audio out then the video goes into the Video Filter and from the Video Filter Video out to my Toshiba 570 DVDR RCA Video In. The audio just goes from the 670 audio out to the 570 audio in. Only the Video has to be "screened" for CP. This works fine.

I think you will need the Video Filter (which has a return policy if it doesn't do what you want), some RCA video and audio cables and the machines you already have. Plus some DVDs to try it out with.
You will have to read your manual to get the idea of recording to a DVD. I find the best to be setting the DVD to the Video format (which is what is used in DVD Rentals that play everywhere), and of course the recording speed should be set to get the whole VHS at one time. The +RW does not need to be finalized as has been pointed out, which makes it easier to record over it if it didn't do what you wanted. For your final transfer you might consider the +R or -R. These cannot be added to or erased but if you are making a permanent copy, these might be cheaper when doing a lot of tapes.

I couldn't find the specs on your machine so I do not know what your connections are but I assume they are the normal RCA at the least. The Video Filter can also do S-Video if you have a VHS player that has S-Video out and a DVD recorder that has S-Video in.

Thankyou again for the great info, microlady :). I wasn't sure if I was misunderstanding the Video Filter configuration. I went ahead and ordered the Video Filter, plus the +RW discs, plus I did go ahead and get the Toshiba 670 too. I'm going to have to port around one of the VCRs to do the copying with the filter, so I figured I go ahead and replace the combo that only has one side working. The blinking clock on the Panasonic is set up with the little Dynex that I use for an exercise tv, and the blink drives me nuts sometimes. LOL

Both the Panasonic (broken combo, only vcr side works), and the Toshiba I combo I currently have (the DKVR60KU) have S-video jacks, so I'll be able to output S-video to the Video Filter. I wasn't sure, but your comments re: specs made me go check. I'm going to test out the +RW discs on various configurations of vhs players with dvd recorders, and see which is the easiest to use, and/or which gives the best vid quality. It'll be a few days before I have everything I need to get started (the Video Filter, and the +RW discs), so I guess it'll be the weekend before I try it all out. I very much appreciate the help you and jjeff provided, as well as the wealth of info in the previous sima/video filter/other video stabilizer threads I found in the archive.

Just for the heck of it, I thought I'd update the available connections on the gear I have available (in case anyone searches for the model no's, and is wanting to know about connections). Copying from my post up above, I'll add in the available inputs/outputs on the decks:

VCRs:

Panasonic DVD Video Recorder (combo dvdr/vcr) model no DMR-E75V (only the vcr side works):
- front composite or S-video in
- back composite of S-video in
- back composite out - dvd or vcr output
- back composite or component or S-video out - dvd only - not sure from the diagram on the S-video out, if it's dvd only, or common, I'll have to try it out and see.

Toshiba DVD Recorder/VCR (combo dvdr/vcr) model no DKVR60KU (no tuner):
- front composite in
- front composite in
- front dv in
- back composite or S-video in
- back composite out
- back S-video or component out
- back hdmi out
(I can't tell from the diagram if all outputs are dvd and vhs, or if some are common and some are dvd only, I'll have to test them out and see)

DVD recorder:

Toshiba DVD Recorder/VCR (combo dvdr/vcr) model no DKVR60KU (no tuner):
- front composite in
- front composite in
- front dv in
- back composite or S-video in
- back composite out
- back S-video or component out
- back hdmi out
(I can't tell from the diagram if all outputs are dvd and vhs, or if some are common and some are dvd only, I'll have to test them out and see)
- discs will record:
1x-6x -RW (video mode and vr mode)
1x-16x -R
1x-4x +RW
1x-16x +R

Toshiba DVD Recorder (stand alone) model no D-R550 (ATSC/NTSC/QAM tuner):
- front composite or S-video in
- front dv in
- back composite or S-video in
- back composite or S-video or component out
- back coaxial digital audio out
- back hdmi out
- discs will record (speeds and types here are for Verbatim discs only, they give different speeds and types for Verbatim, Maxell, JVC, Sony, and TDK, and says performance of any other discs are not guaranteed. Also, only Verbatim has all four types listed):
2x -RW
8x -R
4x +RW
8x +R

** And I did purchase the Toshiba 670, but I'm not certain of all the available connections on that unit.

wisny

02-08-11, 12:29 PM

Oh, hey, I was wondering if any of you guys used a label making program to label and organize your archived discs? Any recommendations for a good program?

microladyusa

02-08-11, 03:19 PM

The 670 does have S-Video out. Normally my Sony combos only allowed S-Video out from the DVD side, which the manual shows when you look at connections. But the Toshiba 670 has all the connections you want. Also a good feature to know is this machine can actually use its ATSC tuner to record off an outside antenna to either the DVD section or the VCR section. Normally the older VCRs cannot record digital but this one can. Page 9 of the manual shows you the speeds of the DVDs it can record. A quirk of the Toshibas is if you use a timer record..you cannot set the end of one program to be the start time of program 2. You would have to allow 1 or 2 minutes between recordings else it probably would not even record. It talks about that in the manual.

My 670 has done well with Ridata DVD-RW 6x (I format as Video Mode), okay on a Memorex +RW 4x (auto formats in +VR Mode which is okay), Memorex +R 16x and -R 16x. I know Memorex is not considered the better ones but I only use them for temporarily recording TV to watch and erase. Although I have recorded a movie on a +R which came out fine.

As far as labels, I did get some Maxell +R Inkjet Printable and a printer to print directly to disc but have not set up the printer yet.
I have read you must be careful with labels on DVDs cause they can come off in your player so right now I just use a Sharpie to mark what is on a DVD, also I number them, like A1, A2, etc. then I can have a paper note on what I recorded so I can change the note if I
reuse the DVD. (labels are okay on CDs but you can search in this forum about DVD labels and see discussions on them).

When I have recorded a TV show I want to keep (like a standup comedy show), that's when I just dub from the VCR side to the DVD side and this has been just fine. I have a number of VCRs so I have a Video Control Center so I can send the output from any VCRs directly to my DVD recorders through my Video Filter. I can see that the VCR picture being recorded comes through good.

Actually, I have not had a problem with any of these brands and one reason I use them as I have had no problem with them as CDs and also I have been learning the ins and outs of DVD recording, by computer and by a standalone DVDR and if I made mistakes, I did not want to throw away expensive DVDs. So far, all these have recorded without any problem using my computer to copy a DVD, using my Toshiba 560DVDR and 670VCR/DVDR to record to DVD and also to copy from a VHS tape as well as record cable or antenna.

As far as setting a DVD recording speed it is the same idea as when you record a VHS and set it to SP, EP, etc (1 hour speed, etc). Page 45 of your 670 manual shows you the DVD speeds and how long they will record. So far I have read and used up to 4 hour with good results.

I think your 550 must be really close to my D-R560KU standalone as I see yours has an ATSC tuner also..which is what will record from an antenna signal your local broadcast stations. I think your 550 manual must also be very similar to my 560 one. I did some experimenting with DVD recording from cable analog to see what worked the best.

If you just want to convert your tapes to DVDs, I think with what you have and getting the Video Filter, you will be okay. You will be using the Red and White RCA audio cables, but you can get an extra S-Video or 2 cables if you want to move the signal through S-Video which may give you a better picture than the regular yellow RCA composite cable. As far as video cables, you would need one from your VCR out to the Filter and one more from the Filter to the DVDR, and then if you want to see it on your TV as it is recording, you would have a cable from your DVDR to your TV.

A good judge of it all is to know that what your DVDR "sees" to record is what you will be actually recording to the DVD. If you like that picture...the DVD should be fine.

wisny

02-09-11, 10:46 AM

microladyusa

02-09-11, 05:05 PM

I see that actually because of having 4 recorders (and 2 of them do not do a VHS S-Video out), that I switch around, I am using the RCA yellow video and not the S-Video but the manual appeared to show the 670 will do S-Video out of your VHS tape and the 550 DVDR should do a S-Video in okay. I do get a good picture with this setup. (Of course the Filter will be in between the two machines connections).

What I would do..before trying out an actual copy.. is set it all up so the VCR goes out to the Filter, Filter out to the DVDR in, DVDR out to my TV input. Then I would play a tape and watch it on the TV. With this setup your TV should be showing you what the DVDR "sees" on its input connection. What it sees will be what it records so if you like the picture quality, then go ahead and copy the VHS tape to the DVD Recorder. Then play the new DVD in your player and see how it looks on your TV. Try to set the recording speed to be no longer than 4 hours and if what you are taping is shorter, go ahead and use a shorter speed. I have not tried it but have read reviews about the longer recording speeds not always showing a good picture.

As far as the printer, I bought one on sale at Fry's a few months ago, an Epson Artisan 50. I already have 2 good printers set up with my 2 computers and I only would use this for disc label printing, so I have not set it up yet..don't really have room right now for 2 printers to one computer. I did get some Maxell Inkjet Printable DVDs to try out with it. These kinds of printers are really known to be ink hogs and the ink is not cheap, which is why I would only use it for disc labels and not my regular printing. As I said, search this forum using words like DVD Labels and you will see lots of suggestions on different things to do. There is a small printer that I also have and others like the will print black ink on a DVD, called Casio CW-K85. You can use Google and search for reviews on different printers that print directly to disk. The reason I got the Epson was a good sale and the fact that this does have its own tray and it will print an image file directly on the DVD..I think pictures make them look nicer. And yes, I have read about getting a tray on Ebay and getting special software to use it. This is mainly for non-Epson printers. Epson has the copyright on DVD printing and other companies like Canon also designed a printer to do that printing but they were stopped from selling here and many people had to order them from Canada, then they had to get a tray from ebay and find out how to unlock that feature the Epson required not be accessible in the US. Some HP printers have this and I don't think they had to lock it up..don't know why. Anyway, reviews of all these show no one is perfect so I just got the original company product by Epson and there is software on its CD to do the job and there is also outside software that works with many of these printers, that offers more choices of labels. I did a lot of reading about all this using Google and also this forum has lots of good info about printing to DVDs.

wisny

02-10-11, 05:16 PM

jjeff

02-10-11, 05:39 PM

DigaDo

02-10-11, 05:46 PM

...Also, I'm interested in the printer info. I did a search, and did find some threads, including, I think the thread where you first decided to purchase the Epson :).

I'm not going to order any printers yet, I'll wait until I see how it goes with copying...

I'm leaning towards the Canon printer for inkjetting labels directly onto the discs, sounds like you can get a tray off ebay and make it work. I did buy some printable discs, so after I get everything working, with the +RW discs, I'll start copying onto printable discs, and just use post-its to label them for now.

I purchased an Epson R300 printer back in 2004. I used the disc printing feature for a year or so. It worked well enough. This Epson was fine as long as we continued to use MS Windows MCE 2005.

Recently we purchased a Windows 7 Home Premium computer. We had to download updated software and drivers for using the R300 with W7. The R300 works well enough for regular printing. Printing to disc no longer functions. Even the latest drivers from Epson return an error when attempting to print to disc, something like "no driver installed for Print CD."

wisny

02-10-11, 06:05 PM

If you search on posts by ChruchAVguy you'll probably find several posts on a small printer that prints directly on a DVD. I believe it's relatively cheap and is standalone, IOW you don't need a PC. From what I remember the only drawback is the cost of the ribbons and the fact it's only one color at a time.

Hi jjeff :) Could that be the Dymo Discpainter? I was reading about this printer, it sounds like what you may be referring to. I really liked the single function of the unit, and the very small footprint, too! But, it seems like it's too expensive, especially the ink which I think I read you could only get about 20 discs or so from?

http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/public/1RqTkvt8u_H0qZeilcI8y_ioxugjbmBJAjmuNvcjCliLEUs8Js9hvS-fY6KERp55FbQVFCcF6wiclur4I64Jmf4EGzwfiDIMZE2-aqDmQhWOsfgnUegOsE0n_QdS5Q8cnbNlItz-0A32g0wZEkfmRcM_uGwbSorxumpkQ06MO6eiU_YUdsFiI7oMEOg-9La-vfRA

http://www.google.com/products/catalog?hl=en&q=dymo+discpainter&um=1&biw=1280&bih=584&ie=UTF-8&cid=1385141711911400085&ei=Cm1UTfuMF4jYgQeny-3BCQ&sa=X&oi=product_catalog_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CFEQ8wIwAA#

I have to admit, if money wasn't a factor, I'd buy that gadget !

I purchased an Epson R300 printer back in 2004. I used the disc printing feature for a year or so. It worked well enough. This Epson was fine as long as we continued to use MS Windows MCE 2005.

Recently we purchased a Windows 7 Home Premium computer. We had to download updated software and drivers for using the R300 with W7. The R300 works well enough for regular printing. Printing to disc no longer functions. Even the latest drivers from Epson return an error when attempting to print to disc, something like "no driver installed for Print CD."

Hi DigaDo :) I'm still on Windows XP (Media edition). I thought I heard that replacing cartridges on the Epson was hit and miss, mostly miss? The reviews on Amazon kept mentioning that it worked like a champ - until you had to change the cartridges. Or, maybe that was the Artisan? I can't remember now, it's all jumbled up in my mind. I've been trying to digest too much new, unfamiliar information ! LOL

Since I'm not on Win 7, do you recommend the R300?

I found the coolest article on modding the Canons, it sounds so simple, and the Pixma looks so easy to use. I watched a vid of a guy in the UK demonstrating the Canon's functions.

Article: http://www.cameratown.com/articles/canon_cd_printing.cfm

YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2VcHUh8M9vk

Now, that youtube is just one model, I think all the Pixmas can be modded? In reading the comments on the youtube, the guy was surprised that disc printing was disabled in the US. Unfortunately, he did not demonstrate that function of his Canon, I wish he did. He demonstrated scanning and photoprinting.

LOL I think it was this youtube that makes me lean towards the Canon, if I do purchase a disc printer. It seems like a good unit, not just for disc printing, but for photos and regular printing and scanning, too.

DigaDo

02-10-11, 06:16 PM

...I'm still on Windows XP (Media edition). I thought I heard that replacing cartridges on the Epson was hit and miss, mostly miss? The reviews on Amazon kept mentioning that it worked like a champ - until you had to change the cartridges. Or, maybe that was the Artisan? I can't remember now, it's all jumbled up in my mind. I've been trying to digest too much new, unfamiliar information ! LOL

Since I'm not on Win 7, do you recommend the R300?

Changing ink cartridges (six of them) is no big deal with the Epson R300 but selecting and attempting to maintain settings through the small LCD menu is terribly annoying. If the R300 is powered off all the preferred settings have to be reentered.

I doubt that the Epson R300 is still a current model after seven years.

jjeff

02-10-11, 06:17 PM

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1277975&highlight=printer
Thread talking about DVD printers(which is really where such talk should take place):)

wisny

02-11-11, 08:21 AM

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1277975&highlight=printer
Thread talking about DVD printers(which is really where such talk should take place):)

Thx for the link, jjeff :) You're right. I'll copy the relevant posts re: disc printers over there.

eta: I copied the relevant portions of the disc printer posts to the link jjeff posted. They're in the quoted post below:

Hi all,

I began a conversation about disc printers in a dvd recorder thread, and jjeff suggested that the conversation would be better suited to this thread. So, I'm copying the relevant posts below. :)

wisny

02-11-11, 08:26 AM

jjeff

02-11-11, 04:13 PM

How do you all keep the dust from getting into the connector side of the Video Filter? I was really surprised that side was open :eek:

I wouldn't worry about it. My guess is they leave it open do help dissipate the heat, some of the other similar devices really tend to run rather warm.
If you're really worried about dust I guess you could cut some type of filter material to cover the end but again that might trap in more heat than the mfg. wanted.

Church AV Guy

02-11-11, 07:07 PM

Logic Design

02-11-11, 07:22 PM

Wisny, Don't worry about dust or heat...It will not affect the performance of the unit.
The Video Filter draws very little power and you can leave it on all the time. The components used in the design, are very high quality and will not be affected by any of these two factors.

microladyusa

02-12-11, 06:31 PM

Wisny: I see that Logic Design gave you a good answer to your question. It sounds like you are getting all set. Let us know how things went. I really think you will find that you have all you need to do...what you want to do with the least fuss and expense.

(Just a small note since you showed the picture of that Dymo Printer..I was excited about it also, but didn't like the expense, but really didn't like the bad reviews at Amazon also.) No way I would get that one. This is FYI so no need to respond in this thread..just wanted to tell you.

wisny

02-13-11, 07:38 AM

I wouldn't worry about it. My guess is they leave it open do help dissipate the heat, some of the other similar devices really tend to run rather warm.
If you're really worried about dust I guess you could cut some type of filter material to cover the end but again that might trap in more heat than the mfg. wanted.

Wisny, Don't worry about dust or heat...It will not affect the performance of the unit.
The Video Filter draws very little power and you can leave it on all the time. The components used in the design, are very high quality and will not be affected by any of these two factors.

Thankyou, jjeff and Logic Design :) . That info is good to know.

Logic Design, may I ask you a question about the switches? The copy protection and aspect switches - you set them according to the characteristics of the input device, or what you want the output media to be?

I have got started yesterday (boy, it took me a looooonnnggg time to get that first disc outputted (is that a word? lol - but it had nothing to do with your device, purely operator error with the recorders *snort!*), and have finished a half dozen or so transfers due to the miracle of your little device! But, I have run into one that won't transfer, and weirdly, it's one that I copied myself along time ago.

I've started with exercise tapes (because I'd rather make my dvd mistakes on that collection ;-) ... ). One 'Callanetics' vhs, that is a copy I made myself many years ago won't copy. It shows a message that says "Recording error - this program is not allowed to be recorded". This really surprised me, b/c like I said, it's a copy I made myself. So, I was wondering, is it possible that a copy I made myself really won't transfer, or am I doing something wrong with the switches? The switch for copy protection is currently 'up', but I'm not certain I have that right.

This was the only homemade vhs tape that I've tried. The other ones were all store-bought tapes, and they've transferred just fine. I'm not sure though, by having that switch 'up', have I told the dvd copy that there's no copy allowed in the future? Or, has the switch position just told the filter that the source tape had 'no copy allowed' set on it?

Thx so much for your device, and for answering questions ! :) :)

And, ps: In case anyone reads this in the future, and is trying to decide b/w the video filter and the grexx - the unit does feel really solid, the shipping was SO fast, and very well packaged to avoid damage in shipping. No worries buying the video filter!

Wisny: I see that Logic Design gave you a good answer to your question. It sounds like you are getting all set. Let us know how things went. I really think you will find that you have all you need to do...what you want to do with the least fuss and expense.

(Just a small note since you showed the picture of that Dymo Printer..I was excited about it also, but didn't like the expense, but really didn't like the bad reviews at Amazon also.) No way I would get that one. This is FYI so no need to respond in this thread..just wanted to tell you.

Thx, microladyusa :) . I decided the same thing as you with regard to the Dymo. Not for me. I haven't thought any more about printing yet, but I will. I figured I'd just get started with the archiving, and worry about that afterwards. I'm just using post-its for now.

I had so much trouble with the darn cables on the Toshiba 550 yesterday ! LOL I couldn't get the S-video to show up. I kept switching it around, trying to figure out which S-video connector or cable was the problem. Finally, after hours - let me tell you, hours! - I said screw it, and tried the yellow composite video cable instead. Then, it worked. I was so puzzled. Could it really be possible that BOTH S-video inputs on the 550 didn't work? lol, the answer was no. There was actually a setting in the onscreen menu where you had to tell the thing to look for s-video input instead of video input. My husband figured that out in the afternoon (he wasn't there in the morning when I was switching and switching and switching cables. too bad, he'd have saved me hours, heheheheh ..)

After all that, the s-video inputs were finally working, then we switched it again for what we thought was the last time, to feed the combo into the filter, then into the recorder, then into the tv. And, ended up with black and white picture only. Tried making sure cables were firmly attached, tried switching a few cables, and then just quit and went back to yellow video. I remembered that you said there wasn't too much difference between s-video and composite, and this was just the exercise tapes collection, so I gave it up and went with the composite vid cable.

When the 670 comes, I'll try again to figure out if a cable got damaged with all the moving around of cables I did yesterday morning, but for now, I'm going with the combo (60KU) into the recorder (550), and using the yellow vid cable. And, yay! I have some archived discs!

This is so awesome, and I really can't thank you all, but in particular, you, enough ~ y'all rock! :D

Sugar Ray Leonard Boxout just transferred. This is a hoot, some of these vids are so old. Let me tell you, the getups on those ladies in the step aerobics vid - SOOOOOOO funny! Legwarmers, baby !

ps - a quick question on the 670 - I know you said it has S-video in, and composite in. Does it also allow component in for the vcr side? Or does it just have component out?

Logic Design

02-13-11, 11:04 AM

wisny

02-13-11, 11:42 AM

wisny, that callanetics copy you reffer to, may be degraded to the point where it could be triggering a false copy protection flag in the recorder. The switch in the UP position for Copy Control, will send the correct signal to the recorder but it may be overwritten by noise on the source video which is changing the the copy command state.

Thanks so much for the fast reply, Logic Design :). It is a really old tape, so what you say makes sense.

Could you clarify for me the function of the switches? It is telling the filter what is the copy protection on the source tape, correct? It isn't telling the filter what copy protection to put on the destination disc?

microladyusa

02-13-11, 12:45 PM

microladyusa

02-13-11, 12:49 PM

P.S. As far as that old tape you have trouble with..it could be a trigger as Logic Design said. I had a Toshiba 660 which falsely gave me copy protection errors constantly...it was so bad I sent it back to Toshiba and they sent me the newer 670 which has performed perfectly. So when you get your 670, you might and see if that tape will work using the 670 VCR to your 550 DVDR.

wisny

02-13-11, 03:29 PM

wisny: glad to hear things are working pretty good. Thank your husband for the S-Video tip on external recording. I hadn't used it and did not realize you have to tell the DVDR whether to use the S-Video jack or the RCA jack. I put a note in my manual on that one.

As far as the 670 on Page 11 of the manual, it says "caution on using S-Video, Component or HDMI connection on VCR. Only the playback audio/video is available with these connections." Since all you want to do is play a tape out to the DVDR in, looks like they will work. Remember, no matter what connections are set up, the picture you see on your TV is the final signal coming through so you can tell if something works or not.

My Filter switches are set UP UP UP DN for the yellow video...that is switches 1 and 4 which talk to the video. Maybe the difference you saw in S-Video is the fact that when you use S-Video switches 1 and 4 will be set as DN UP (the reverse of the RCA yellow setup). UP is Yes. You should get the color and picture just as if you were watching the VHS tape alone, no matter which video out you use but the Filter does have to be set one way for S-Video and the opposite way for either the RCA yellow composite or component. The setting for the composite or component is identical. Only the S-video has a different setting for switches 1 and 4.

I gave hubs the message, he smiled and said you're most welcome :). Thx for the info re: 670 connectors.

I have been using my switches UP DN UP DN. I guess the difference being you have widescreen set, but I used letterbox. I'm sorry, I know this was covered already, but I can't remember the answer - can vhs's record into widescreen? Or do you have to record letterbox? I thought they had to be box, b/c many of these exercise tapes are so old, they're from before widescreens existed. :D

P.S. As far as that old tape you have trouble with..it could be a trigger as Logic Design said. I had a Toshiba 660 which falsely gave me copy protection errors constantly...it was so bad I sent it back to Toshiba and they sent me the newer 670 which has performed perfectly. So when you get your 670, you might and see if that tape will work using the 670 VCR to your 550 DVDR.

Thx ! I will try it again when the 670 arrives. I wouldn't have thought to do that, I appreciate the tip.

jjeff

02-13-11, 03:59 PM

... - can vhs's record into widescreen? Or do you have to record letterbox? I thought they had to be box, b/c many of these exercise tapes are so old, they're from before widescreens existed. :D

AFAIK no anamorphic(horizontally squeezed) commercial VHS tapes were made. VHS tapes that were advertised as widescreen were only letterboxed(black bars on top and bottom) and if you had a 16:9 TV you could zoom the image to fill your screen(with the proper aspect). Zooming a picture degrades the picture quality since you're magnifying any flaws and you're also wasting tape space recording black bars.
Of course it is possible to record a anamorphic image to a VHS tape(just like we do with DVDs that are 4:3 by design) but again like most DVDRs(apparently not your Toshiba) the DVDs will look vertically stretched on a 4:3 TV because of the lack of the WS bit telling your DVD player to letterbox the output. Again AFAIK the WS bit was never part of the VHS standard so everything was letterboxed. I got out of VHS before purchasing a WS TV otherwise I'd probably be recording anamorphic VHS tapes just like I do with DVDs and just like my recorded DVDs anybody I borrowed those tapes to, with a 4:3 TV would see a vertically stretched image.

microladyusa

02-13-11, 08:07 PM

I would say your VHS tapes are not widescreen. I do set the flag myself cause I have both a wide screen TV and also a 4:3 TV. The flag is really for copying like a wide screen DVD that was recorded that way. I read a little about it on Google and mostly says if the flag is set correctly, it causes DVD players to display widescreen programs properly on 4:3 TVs..based on the setting choice for either letterbox or pan and scan. Viewing the display on a widescreen TV displays it as 16:9 properly. I got the impression that if one records a widescreen source and the flag is not set, then this recording will not play properly on a 4:3 display...meaning it would be squeezed instead of letterboxed or pan and scan.

I would think with VHS tapes and 4:3 TVs out of the picture, the flag would not be important. Since I gather it really is important for playback of recorded DVDs on a 4:3 TV so the original widescreen picture copied is displayed correctly on the smaller screen.

Maybe others can explain it better. I set mine cause it is important to me that what I watch on my widescreen TV does fill the screen.

I have copied from my 4:3 TV the SD cable signal of a show to a VHS tape and then I dubbed the tape to a DVD and it displays wide on my wide TV and normal on my smaller screen.
Hope this helps and that I have got the idea right. As I said, maybe others here can explain the widescreen flag purpose better. I learn a lot here myself and am always interested in what others have to day.

marquitos306

02-13-11, 09:13 PM

I just bought The Sony RDR-GX257 for $54 from Wallmart. com. I can record almost everything but HBO. This unit also have an 1080p comin out 3.1 Hdmi. I love this unit and for the price no camplains

joed32

02-14-11, 08:16 AM

I just bought The Sony RDR-GX257 for $54 from Wallmart. com. I can record almost everything but HBO. This unit also have an 1080p comin out 3.1 Hdmi. I love this unit and for the price no camplains

Interested me so I checked on it and found really bad reviews, but if it does what you want it to do that's all that counts.

wisny

02-14-11, 02:59 PM

AFAIK no anamorphic(horizontally squeezed) commercial VHS tapes were made. VHS tapes that were advertised as widescreen were only letterboxed(black bars on top and bottom) and if you had a 16:9 TV you could zoom the image to fill your screen(with the proper aspect). Zooming a picture degrades the picture quality since you're magnifying any flaws and you're also wasting tape space recording black bars.
Of course it is possible to record a anamorphic image to a VHS tape(just like we do with DVDs that are 4:3 by design) but again like most DVDRs(apparently not your Toshiba) the DVDs will look vertically stretched on a 4:3 TV because of the lack of the WS bit telling your DVD player to letterbox the output. Again AFAIK the WS bit was never part of the VHS standard so everything was letterboxed. I got out of VHS before purchasing a WS TV otherwise I'd probably be recording anamorphic VHS tapes just like I do with DVDs and just like my recorded DVDs anybody I borrowed those tapes to, with a 4:3 TV would see a vertically stretched image.

I would say your VHS tapes are not widescreen. I do set the flag myself cause I have both a wide screen TV and also a 4:3 TV. The flag is really for copying like a wide screen DVD that was recorded that way. I read a little about it on Google and mostly says if the flag is set correctly, it causes DVD players to display widescreen programs properly on 4:3 TVs..based on the setting choice for either letterbox or pan and scan. Viewing the display on a widescreen TV displays it as 16:9 properly. I got the impression that if one records a widescreen source and the flag is not set, then this recording will not play properly on a 4:3 display...meaning it would be squeezed instead of letterboxed or pan and scan.

I would think with VHS tapes and 4:3 TVs out of the picture, the flag would not be important. Since I gather it really is important for playback of recorded DVDs on a 4:3 TV so the original widescreen picture copied is displayed correctly on the smaller screen.

Maybe others can explain it better. I set mine cause it is important to me that what I watch on my widescreen TV does fill the screen.

I have copied from my 4:3 TV the SD cable signal of a show to a VHS tape and then I dubbed the tape to a DVD and it displays wide on my wide TV and normal on my smaller screen.
Hope this helps and that I have got the idea right. As I said, maybe others here can explain the widescreen flag purpose better. I learn a lot here myself and am always interested in what others have to day.

Thx, jjeff and microladyusa :). I haven't tried viewing one of my archived exercise tapes on my widescreen tv yet. I guess it didn't occur to me to check it out, b/c I knew I was copying old tapes, and I was looking at them on a box screen. I'll have to go put one of the finalized one into the player by the widescreen, see what it looks like. :eek:

Also, thankyou to jjeff for explaining what 'anamorphic' meant. I've seen it referenced on threads on this forum, but didn't know what it meant. I also didn't ask, b/c I figured I'd just concentrate on a few steps at a time, and whatever it meant, I thought it was more advanced that my current project of archiving exercise tapes. :D I'm happy to know what it means!