Artec T3A Pro NTIA CECB [Text View]

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tzank

03-29-08, 07:41 PM

I don't know why this DTV CECB has been discussed yet so I am starting this new thread. Here are some facts about this box:

It is available NOW.
It is the least expensive of the currently available CECBs at $44.99 from dtv.bsat.net
It runs on 12VDC so it can adapted to portable applications.
The Artec T3A Pro has a RS-232 interface for updating its firmware. This makes it easy to field update the firmware to correct bugs and also to hack to enable additional features. :D Other boxes may be very difficult to upgrade firmware on or not even possible.

Some negatives:
Only showing current program guide information.
No analog signal pass thru.
No s-video.

At this price and the RS-232 port, I think this CECB is worth considering. I have two on order. :)

EDIT: Specs and photos here: http://www.artectv.com/ehtm/products/t3apro.htm

Tim

bdfox18doe

03-30-08, 08:56 AM

. I have two on order. :)Tim

Tim, I have been looking this one too for the 12v aspect.. and wonder how well the order and service went with BSAT.. Of course, I did just get one of the 7" Insignia LCD portable DTv's on ebay for $50
delivered so not sure of my need, but for theafter-coupon cost may still do it.

tzank

03-30-08, 02:15 PM

Tim, I have been looking this one too for the 12v aspect.. and wonder how well the order and service went with BSAT.. Of course, I did just get one of the 7" Insignia LCD portable DTv's on ebay for $50
delivered so not sure of my need, but for theafter-coupon cost may still do it.

I just got the shipping notice and invoice. $19.41 for both boxes including the shipping.

Tim

jrelmore

03-30-08, 03:15 PM

Copied from another's post:
http://www.king-cart.com/
Artec T3A Digital to Analog Converter ----- "Operates great in weak signal areas.... [but] the more we run this unit...the more signal is required for proper operation. We were to quick to put down our likes and dislikes. As with most electronics, the heat it up, and then cool it down cycles, seem to be taking it's toll on this converter. It has some great features....But I don't think we will be offering this model."

tzank

03-30-08, 10:40 PM

It seems a number of CECBs have a heat problem. If it is so with this one, it would be one of the first mods to make in the box. ;) Just add new vent holes! This box may be perfect for modders. The price is right (2 for $20), the RS-232 interface, and the 12VDC power input.

troydog

03-30-08, 10:56 PM

I have two on order they should be here on the 1st. Order from this site they are free and the shipping was only about $8.00. I got them for in case the cable goes out. We get lots of storms here and the darn cable tv is always out.

http://www.consumerelecgroup.com/

troydog

04-01-08, 12:58 PM

Just got this box today. I gave it a short test and it did ok to me. The box is small about the size of a dsl modem. I can scan the manual if anyone would like me to

tuner:
input terminal: female 75 ohm f type connector
receiving frequency: 54 ~ 861mhz
rf channel: 8~69
demodulator: 8vsb

Video Processing:
mpeg-2 video decoding (mp@ml. mp@mh)
input format: supports 18 modes
output format ntsc 780x480i
composite video out
audio processing: dolby ac-3 audio decoding
digital mulit-lingual
epg: current program display by transparent graphic plane

close caption:
digital cc comply with eia-708-b english/spabisg/french

power input voltage: 12v dc
power consumption: 4.5e max

Power adapter input: 100-240v~0.3A 50-60hz
output 12v 0.5a

rear panal
dc in 12v
re in/out
channel 3 or 4 rf composite output
composite video & stero audio through rca jack
data port

6.42"w 3.94"d 1.18"h
0.22kg

jrelmore

04-01-08, 01:14 PM

newb question: How can the mpeg-2 decoder work -how to input mpeg-2? Is this an IP appliance?

bdfox18doe

04-01-08, 01:35 PM

newb question: How can the mpeg-2 decoder work -how to input mpeg-2? Is this an IP appliance?

MPEG 2 Gets to the decoder via an antenna and RF cable. :)

I need to order me one of these.

troydog

04-01-08, 11:48 PM

Now I have been playing with this box. I like it a lot. It has a few things I have not seen or read about on other box's out there.

The main thing I like is it has color settings for hue brightness contrast. At first I thought what good is that for. Well I found out or pbs network shows a lot of dark movies with this box I can bost up the brightness and not have to screw up my projector or my lcd tv settings. So I can just use the box.

It also has volume. Could be useful but I just use my tv or amp for sound no need for it.

It also can be worked from the box without the remote. It has on top up down for sound and Channels also power.

You can rescan to looks for more channels and not erase the ones it has saved.

I open the box up not much in there the chips are not labeled at all. The tuner says sanyo on it.

The thing is small super small. So you could take it with you on the road.

One thing I can say might be a put off it has a blue led light when it is on. No lights when it is off. This is a easy fix open the box two screws under the front feet. Us a maker to paint over the blue led.

Malouff

04-02-08, 01:02 AM

troydog,

You might not need to scan the manual?
mosquito a.k.a. John
Has the Artec T3A PRO and a non-functional link to the manual
http://www.freedtvshop.com/fdtv/converters/t3aproUM.pdf
I will ask him to fix it.

Can you could post a color settings picture for hue brightness contrast?

You are not saying the the box has a speaker but volume on the remote control.
"It also has volume. Could be useful but I just use my TV or amp for sound no need for it."

I was looking at the box and didn't see anything about that but did notice that
the back of the box shows a picture of the EPG (Electronic Program Guide) a Now/Next.

troydog

04-02-08, 04:27 AM

It has no built in speaker. The volume just turns up the out put level from the box.

The epg is nice. It workers to ways. One hit info and it shows what you are watching and tells about the show.

Hit epg. It shows a band on the top of the tv with all the channels you recive. Use left or right to go thought the channels. Use the up down buttons to see what is next or a few hours away from what is on now. Use ok button to go right to the channel you want to watch.

The first scan found all my networks.
But there is rescan. It saves what it found and add any new ones.

Also there is add a channel where you can type in the # for the network then save it.

Or total rescan it wipes every thing and starts over.

I get some photos right now the cam is charging up.

troydog

04-02-08, 04:32 AM

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/front.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/12.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/34.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/56.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/78.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/910.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/1112.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/1314.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/1516.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/1718.jpg

troydog

04-02-08, 04:33 AM

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/19.jpg

troydog

04-02-08, 07:58 AM

Here are some photos from my projector. Sorry if they look like crap. But man it is hard to take a photo off a screen.:)
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture017.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture018.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture019.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture020.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture021.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture022.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture024.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture025.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture026.jpg

troydog

04-02-08, 08:00 AM

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture027.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture028.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture031.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture033.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture034.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture036.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture039.jpg

wh5916

04-02-08, 08:27 AM

Thank you for posting the screenshots. The menus/graphics look very similar, identical in some instances, to the ones provided by the Zenith and Insignia converters

holl_ands

04-02-08, 03:03 PM

troydog,
----snip----
Artec T3A PRO User Manual:
http://www.freedtvshop.com/fdtv/converters/t3aproUM.pdf

EPG (Electronic Program Guide): Now/Next.
The link to the User Manual works now....but I had to retry after hang.

How many hours out does EPG work?
Manual only says NOW/NEXT....

Does the Analog Pass Thru work?
[Connect via coax CH3/4 output and turn converter OFF to use TV's tuner.]

Can you take a quick peak inside and let us know the part number(s)
on the tin-can tuner and also confirm LGDT1111 (C or D?) big chip?

Macro photos would also be of interest....

And of course we all would like to know whether there are any audio
problems (e.g Left channel distortion and/or chirping sound) as you
log more listening time.

troydog

04-02-08, 07:18 PM

The epg for nbc gave me from 7 am to about 11 pm then after that said info not available.

Well test that out. The projector has no type of tuner but I will run it into the dvd recorder tonight and test to see if it will pass the single to the dvd unit.

Sure I will open it up and try to get some photos I had it open once all ready it is a easy thing to open up.

I ran it in to my surround sound system and did not notice any audio problems at all. But I will test that a little more also. I will set the amp to left speakers only and then the right ones to give it a work out.

I also left the unit on all night and no heat problems or lost of single at all. I got it on a set of $5.00 rabbit ears and can get all my networks but cbs. Zip here is 42029 and looks like I am far from the cbs tower.

Now the remote is nice not great but nice. It will not power the tv but the thing has a nice layout to switch the box the buttons around the ok button are big and easy to find in the dark. Witch I like a lot. also once you get the hang of it the other ones are easy also they are grouped in a nice way so makes it easy to switch this thing.

I also took it to my dads house since he got the magnavox from wal mart. He likes this one a lot more then what he got at wal mart. Main thing he likes is the remote with the large channel buttons and also it did not cut out like the mag does. This to me is also a plus since the nbc network is strong and cuts out a lot on most other boxes and tv's.

I will get some inside photos of the box up soon.

dumbfeet57

04-02-08, 10:52 PM

Troydog:

Thanks for all the great info. I second the previous post that stated:

And of course we all would like to know whether there are any audio
problems (e.g Left channel distortion and/or chirping sound) as you
log more listening time.

Here is some additional info off another thread regarding the Zenith (Insignia) boxes that use (presumably) the same chip as the T3A:

[The sound problem] only occurs on certain shows that are broadcasting in DD 5.1. Not all shows do. Specific examples have been:

CBS's basketball coverage
NBC's Nightly News broadcast

Neither of these should be tape-delayed by your local stations, so you'd get the original encoded audio signal into the box not affected by some conversion by a local station.

Listen for "hissing S's" out of the left channel. Separately connect the line output for left and right to your stereo receiver instead of relying on your TV to properly decode MTS stereo over the RF connector...

Any observations one way or the other would be greatly appreciated.

troydog

04-03-08, 06:41 AM

Phoots are uploading but here is the info I see on the board and chips.

tuner
ubaooal
lot d v b w
sanyo
chips
eon
en29lv160at-70tcp
h258248
0802tsc

nanya 0802
nt50516m16c5-5t
740242robn tw

large chip

lg electronica
lgdt1111d
0802
p40823.00

board info
71v-1201-1a0g02 v92

Photos up soon and also will test to see if it can pass the analog single to the dvd tuner.

troydog

04-03-08, 06:56 AM

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture014.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture013.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture012.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture011.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture010.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture009.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture008.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture007.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture006.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture005.jpg

troydog

04-03-08, 06:58 AM

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture004-1.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture003-2.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture002-3.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture001-3.jpg

aethyrmaster

04-03-08, 08:29 AM

Is this similar to the Tivax box? It was supposed to have RS-232 as well.

Has anyone dialed into it yet using hyperterminal to see what kind of output they get?

holl_ands

04-03-08, 01:19 PM

Artec T3A Pro uses LGDT1111 chip, whereas Tivax STB-T9 uses Zoran....quite different.

aethyrmaster

04-03-08, 01:25 PM

Is there any concensus as to which chip is superior, or is that a moot point?

holl_ands

04-03-08, 02:42 PM

Other than obvious menu display functions, we don't know yet
and most boxes thus far in hand use LGDT1111 & Sanyo tuner.

ALL CECB boxes are required to meet some very tough performance
specs....far better than any so-called 5th Gen chips/tuners....

Other than the (probably) Quality Control problems in Magnavox
boxes uncovered by Microtune, none has clearly superior reception.

However, there are a few reports where someone will note that
one box gets a few more stations than another. Perhaps someone
can figure out if there is a particular pattern to these rare reports
that would exceed normally expected box-to-box variations...YMMV...

aethyrmaster

04-03-08, 02:49 PM

What it comes down to for me is this:

I have one coupon left. I want a box with an RS-232 port, just to satisfy my own curiosity. If the Artec, using the LG chip, has audio issues, I'll get the Tivax. If they both have audio issues, I'll get the Artec, because I can find it cheaper.

Is this question of whether or not the Artec has audio issues answerable at this time?

holl_ands

04-03-08, 02:58 PM

Of the three LGDT1111 based boxes currently available,
ALL have audio problems.

Anyone want to volunteer to see if Artec is any different????
Apparently it only occurs during DD5.1 encoded programs,
with some stations seemingly unaffected and YMMV....a lot....
So we might not find out until several more boxes are tested....

aethyrmaster

04-03-08, 03:57 PM

At any rate, my dilemma is solved. The "data port" and pin header just aren't enough to convince me to go that route. Tivax's dedicated 9 pin serial port gets my other coupon.

JWD-PEC

04-03-08, 04:23 PM

Wow, the prices all went up in just 5-6 days. :-(

Malouff

04-03-08, 06:10 PM

Of the three LGDT1111 based boxes currently available, ALL have audio problems.This really has me concerned as a lot of the CECB's use a LG SoC (System-on-Chip)

Also it sounds like this will impact the LG boxes that are coming....but are not yet on the CECB approved list....
Insignia NS-DXA1-APT (i.e. "Analog Pass Thru") and (cloned) Zenith DTT901.
Still using LGDT1111, but with new LG TDVG-H151G tin-can tuner.

So the new tuner will offer Analog Pass Thru but will will still have audio problems.

The other known SoC are:

ST Microelectronics STV0373 in Channel Master CM-7000 - closed captioning line (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13396219#post13589345)
Broadcom BCM3543 in then RCA DTA800B - audio has frozen up (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13472194#post13472194)
Auvitek AU8515 in the Sansonic FT300RT and FT300A ETA 4/10
Texas Instruments TVP9007 in MaxMedia MMDTVB03 - Not yet released but being sold
Zoran in the MicroGEM MG2000, and RCA DTA800A among others
MicroGEM is released but not reviewed yet
RCA DTA800A also released but not yet reviewed

tzank

04-03-08, 07:37 PM

There is a Tivax thread here: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1007580 I ordered two of those for my mother. The Tivax STB-T9 has a real RS-232 DB-9 port and is housed in a metal box. See the above thread for a link to a video demo.

Tim

aethyrmaster

04-04-08, 08:15 AM

holl_ands

04-04-08, 04:57 PM

This really has me concerned as a lot of the CECB's use a LG SoC (System-on-Chip)

Also it sounds like this will impact the LG boxes that are coming....
but are not yet on the CECB approved list....
Insignia NS-DXA1-APT (i.e. "Analog Pass Thru") and (cloned) Zenith DTT901.
Still using LGDT1111, but with new LG TDVG-H151G tin-can tuner.

So the new tuner will offer Analog Pass Thru but will will still have audio problems.

The other known SoC are:

ST Microelectronics STV0373 in Channel Master CM-7000 -
reports of low buzz (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13396219#post13396219)(may be audio)
Broadcom BCM3543 in the RCA DTA800B - audio has frozen up (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13472194#post13472194)
Auvitek AU8515 in the Sansonic FT300RT and FT300A ETA 4/10
Texas Instruments TVP9007 in MaxMedia MMDTVB03 - Not yet
released but being sold
Zoran in the MicroGEM MG2000, and RCA DTA800A among others
MicroGEM is released but not reviewed yet
RCA DTA800A also released but not yet reviewed

We need to be careful to distinguish whether problems are due to either:
a) Design deficiency
b) Defect in a particular box that is fixed by replacement and
c) May have an external cause.

The LGDT1111 audio problems are widely reported (hence design defect).
dmulvany also reported freeze up problems in both Zenith DTT900 and Insignia NS-DXA1.

DJ99 is the only one reporting a "low buzz" with his CM-7000 and says
that it may be due to his switcher. Unless someone else has this problem,
we shouldn't automatically attribute it to the CM-7000.
DJ99 says that he will try to isolate the problem this weekend.
It likely could be a ground loop problem and not the fault of the CM-7000.

Likewise, IIRC seatacboy is the ONLY ONE reporting RCA DTA-800B freezing up
and simply returned it without trying a replacement.
If anyone hears about freeze up problems in ANY BOX, please let us know....

BTW: Freeze up was a problem with FOX and some HD-STBs (e.g. Accurian).
It was fixed at the source---FOX, after calling several local Station Engineers.

BTW: We never figured out what the big RECTANGULAR chip was in the Accurian:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6330237&#post6330237
Perhaps something from Thompson or Philips....

Comparing experiences in forum threads is useful to "sort the wheat from the chaff".

Replay3030Owner

04-04-08, 05:43 PM

dmulvany also reported freeze up problems in both Zenith DTT900 and Insignia NS-DXA1.

I have an Insignia 15" LCD NTSC/ATSC TV that appears to use the same SoC as these tuner boxes, given the screen shots of the channel change and EPG that are shown. (The main menus are differnet but the sum of the features, like "rescan" and the appearance leads me to believe they are the same innards, though I have no intent of opening my LCD for obvious risks involved, unlike a converter box)

Anyway, on 2 occassions that TV has locked up due to noisy digital signals. One caused the pixels on all the on screen graphics to go wacky, then the set lock up, the other time the set just locked as it was losing signal and stuttering.

So, if in fact that set has the same SoC's, this could be a problem with these wherever they are implemented.

Sad that we've come to the point of having to reboot our TV's though :(

Avio

04-04-08, 06:00 PM

... dmulvany also reported freeze up problems in both Zenith DTT900 and Insignia NS-DXA1. ... I believe dmulvany reported that the freeze up's occured only when Digital Closed Captions were left on for an extended period of time. To my knowledge there have been no Zenith/Insignia freeze up's reported when CC was not being used. The causes of the freezes may be the boxes' error handling of bad CC data sent by the broadcaster.

Avio

jlpitch

04-04-08, 06:19 PM

I believe dmulvany reported that the freeze up's occured only when Digital Closed Captions were left on for an extended period of time. To my knowledge there have been no Zenith/Insignia freeze up's reported when CC was not being used. The causes of the freezes may be the boxes' error handling of bad CC data sent by the broadcaster.

Avio
I had a Zenith DTT900 that was freezing up and I never used the Closed Captions. I took it back to Circuit City, because I did not want to unplug it every time it hung up.

troydog

04-04-08, 08:37 PM

Done a test and the box does not do analog pass through.

As the audio goes I have not notices any odd sounds from the left or right channels at all.

Now if you turn the box volume all the way up to 100 you get audio over drive where it sounds like it cuts out a little. I found keeping it at 50 is about right for my amp. I know this since on the amp for dvd player I keep it at 8 and with the box at 100 I had to turn the amp down to about 2.

With the box at 50 and the amp at 8 it had the same output as the dvd player does.

I gave the audio a test by using left for 2 hour then right for 2 hour then both left right no audio problems at all. Also this was at night prim time tv I switched from abc to cbs to nbc all sounded great to me.

Also recorded the shows for a play back on my other tv and it had no audio problewms at all.

Just wonder if the other boxs with audio problems might have a volume feature on them? If so might be worth knowing what leave they have it set at.

Also no lines are cut from the video. I ran it side by side with my cable tv moxie box.

holl_ands

04-04-08, 09:17 PM

Other Zenith/Insignia users reduced internal box volume. Keep listening to
your new Artec....audio problems weren't heard in every DD5.1 pgm.
[And I suspect it MAY be related to the Missing Center Channel problem...]

Can you confirm LGDT1111 and tin-can tuner part numbers???

Malouff

04-05-08, 04:50 AM

Can you confirm LGDT1111 and tin-can tuner part numbers???Looking at the pictures troydog posted
SoC (System-on-Chip) (http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture007.jpg)
LG Electronics LGDT1111D 0802 P40823 . 00

tin-can tuner (http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/troydogtvtv/Picture002-3.jpg)
Sanyo UBA00AL LOT DVBW

So the LGDT1111 and UBA00AL are confirmed.

KenL also reporting RCA DTA-800B freezing up or maybe loosing audio (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13434500#post13434500)
Does this mean that Broadcom too has a Design deficiency?

So is it safe to say that all LG SoC have a Audio Design Deficiency then?

JWD-PEC

04-08-08, 12:18 PM

tzank

04-08-08, 06:40 PM

For those that ordered from BSAT, how long did it take for them to process the order and how long before you received the converter?

I ordered on last Thursday and they are still processing my order today.

I just got my order of two boxes today from BSAT. They were shipped by FedEx Ground. I ordered on March 28.

csgamer

04-11-08, 10:17 PM

The video wasn't there before; that's new to their site.

I know about that thread - I'm the one that started it!

I was debating Artec vs. Tivax, but the lack of a known type of data interface on the Artec settled it for me when it was pointed out to me yesterday. I'm definitely getting the Tivax.

I'm getting my coupons in about a week, and am debating the same thing Artec vs Tivax.

Why is there not more people interested in these, there the cheapest? Makes it difficult to choose, since the limited info.

I noticed the Artec doesn't have vents on the top like many other cecb's, can any of the owners of the Artec see if the box gets too hot?

The Artec and Tivax are so cheap that i could just buy both, but the wife checks all my purchases and will say why did you buy two. Yes she is that cheap.

aethyrmaster

04-14-08, 08:20 AM

Well, the debate is about hacking, for the most part. The Tivax has a DB-9 Serial port on it, and the artec has a 4-pin "data port." We're hoping to be able to turn on features, or just learn what we can, from those connections.

The Tivax doesn't have the LG chip and it's known "audio bug" (see other threads for that discussion), and it's vented and has a full metal case. The Artec has full controls on the device itself for volume, channel, and menu - which is good if you lose the remote.

sundazing

04-19-08, 08:24 AM

Now I have been playing with this box. I like it a lot. ..The thing is small super small. So you could take it with you on the road.

A past poster said:
'http://www.king-cart.com/
Artec T3A Digital to Analog Converter ----- 'Operates great in weak signal areas.... [but] the more we run this unit...the more signal is required for proper operation. We were to quick to put down our likes and dislikes. As with most electronics, the heat it up, and then cool it down cycles, seem to be taking it's toll on this converter. It has some great features....But I don't think we will be offering this model.''

For those of you who have the Artec, a few Qs:

1. Have you noticed the issue of 'the more we run this unit, the more signal is required for proper operation on extensive usage?'

2. Are the heat up and cool down cycles noticeable on extensive usage? How does it cool down? Is it taking a toll on the unit?

3. What's the dimensions of the unit?

4. Has anyone used this yet for a 12vdc application? If so, what was your setup and how did it perform?

Thanks a lot.

nestorph

04-21-08, 04:43 PM

Does anyone with an Artec been able to test it to see if it passes through Dolby encoding? I have a Zenith and it just provides basic stereo. This was confirmed with a call to Zenith tech support. Seems like a waste that I get excellent video but my audio has been cut back in terms of quality.

Scooper

04-21-08, 05:03 PM

That's what you get - specification of the CECB's

johnied

04-22-08, 06:02 PM

Hey fellas,
Anyone added ventilation to this box.?
IM curious as to how to get it open i cant see how,
Im just going to drill bigger holes in the plastic..This should make this
Puppy run cooler... Thanks John

zhenerale

04-22-08, 09:11 PM

The Artec and Tivax are so cheap that i could just buy both, but the wife checks all my purchases and will say why did you buy two. Yes she is that cheap.

Are we married to the same woman? :p

I'm looking to get both. Digitalstar.com (http://www.digitalstar.com/) appears to have both the cheapest. I don't know what the S&H is, hopefully there is combined S&H.

I think Consumerelecgroup.com (http://www.consumerelecgroup.com/) is the next combined lowest. They advised me that "It is $8.59 to ship 1, $12.12 for 2", but you may want to confirm that.

Malouff

04-22-08, 11:48 PM

zhenerale

04-23-08, 12:02 AM

zhenerale

It may be cheaper to get the Artec at www.data-action.com
and the Tivax at www.diamondhdtv.com

That is unless you do get a shipping discount from the other retailers.
If you do find out what shipping is at http://www.digitalstar.com please share.

To NJ:
Artrec @ Data-action = $3.99 after coupon + $8 S/H
Tivax @ DiamondHDTV = $9.99 after coupon + $9.99 S/H

I can get both at Consumerelecgroup for about $27 (after coupon w/ S&H)!

Malouff

04-23-08, 12:19 AM

Both at Consumerelecgroup is $27.99 (after two coupons w/ S&H) you will save about $3.98 that is not taking into account any possible sales tax.

Now what would it cost at http://www.digitalstar.com

zhenerale

04-23-08, 01:24 PM

Now what would it cost at http://www.digitalstar.com?

I e-mailed DigitalStar and they advised me that S&H [to NJ] is $7.50 for Artec and $8 for Tivax, or under $25 for both (after coupon w/ S&H).

Malouff

04-24-08, 04:37 PM

I was looking at the User Manual (http://www.freedtvshop.com/fdtv/converters/t3aproUM.pdf) for the Artec and on page 15 (21 in pdf) found the following interesting:

EPG (Electronic Program Guide) may provide
more than just current program.
1. Press the EPG buttons on the remote control to view detailed program information.
2. Use the ◄ ► buttons to select channel.
3. Use the ▼ button to display more programs with playing time.
4. Press the EPG buttons to close EPG guide.

Does this mean that the Artec has a more advanced EPG then the NOW/NEXT like the Zenith DTT900 & Insignia NS-DXA1 does.

How far does this Down Arrow let you go in the EPG?

DJ99

04-24-08, 05:48 PM

DJ99 is the only one reporting a "low buzz" with his CM-7000 and says
that it may be due to his switcher. Unless someone else has this problem,
we shouldn't automatically attribute it to the CM-7000.

As I mentioned in the CM-7000 thread, The buzz is coming either from my switch or crosstalk from another power source. When I removed the CM-7000 from the shelf and connected it directly to my TV, the hum went away.
Its not a problem with the box itself.

Malouff

04-26-08, 02:56 PM

Looks like troydog had already answered my question about the Artec having a more advanced EPG then the Zenith/Insignia simple Now/Next
The epg for nbc gave me from 7 am to about 11 pm then after that said info not available.
Does anyone know if the Zenith/Insignia also lets you press the down arrow like the Artec?

jjeff

04-26-08, 03:06 PM

I have a Zenith, but not sure what you mean by press the down arrow key like the Artec?
If you mean to see more than the next/now programs that's a no.
If you mean to see the continuation of a program description then that would be a yes.
Just read this thread and the answer to you question is no. The Zenith is a true now/next only box:(

pixelation

04-29-08, 03:00 PM

Does the Artec have a zoom mode that will squeeze 1080i/720p programs (16:9 to 4:3) but at the same time play 480i programs in its native 4:3 ratio?

pixelation

05-01-08, 02:43 PM

Anyone? Can someone tell me what the "Squeezed" option look like for 1080i/720p program and 480i programs?

I believe HD programs will look normal on 16:9 TVs. What would SD programs look like?

satpro

05-06-08, 06:00 PM

Sadly after waiting 3 weeks and finally receiving and testing today I can confirm after about 2 minutes that the artec t3a pro model does have the same annoying left channel 5.1 audio processing defect present on the insignia and zenith.

The program has no business allowing boxes like this to be continued as certified to participate in the program. What BS! :mad:

bdfox18doe

05-06-08, 06:39 PM

Sadly after waiting 3 weeks and finally receiving and testing today I can confirm after about 2 minutes that the artec t3a pro model does have the same annoying left channel 5.1 audio processing defect present on the insignia and zenith.

Sad to hear that. I was goin to get one of those for home usage.

compuguy1088

05-06-08, 09:15 PM

I had a Zenith DTT900 that was freezing up and I never used the Closed Captions. I took it back to Circuit City, because I did not want to unplug it every time it hung up.

I currently have one of the Insignia NS-DXA1 boxes (Made in March 08'), for the past 4 or so days...no real freeze ups.

Malouff

05-06-08, 10:51 PM

satpro I see from your bottom picture that the box does have some ventilation holes.
Does it still get hot like others have reported?

Can you please confirm that pressing ▼ will show more info in the EPG and it is indeed different than the LG EPG?

I am still wondering why the CoShip also with LG SoC doesn't have the same annoying left channel 5.1 audio processing defect as the Zenith/Insignia/Digital Stream/Artec

Thank you for taking the time to test and report for so many boxes ;)

johnied

05-07-08, 05:02 PM

The little artec box was running on the warm side, it seemed to me.. Today i opened the puppy up and took the plastic cover off took the top button circuit board off the lid..Then i put scotch tape(masking would work as well) on finished side to protect and proceeded to drill twelve small holes on each side of the button...put it back together im going to test it now.. see if it runs cooler will report back.

John

You know i just realized something..the rubber pads on this device dont leave any room for the thing to even cool from the bottom..i bet
some bigger pads from Radio Shack wuold help as well... Oh well good
thing i dont have only a few dollars into this thing.. might work out to be a good device with the mods. =P

satpro

05-07-08, 11:52 PM

Can you please confirm that pressing ▼ will show more info in the EPG and it is indeed different than the LG EPG?

I am still wondering why the CoShip also with LG SoC doesn't have the same annoying left channel 5.1 audio processing defect as the Zenith/Insignia/Digital Stream/Artec

pressing ▼ only goes to the next program

Have been running the coship tonight and it also has same LG audio problem it is just not as noticeable since the max volume setting on coship is much lower than on the artec.

Malouff

05-08-08, 12:31 AM

may_queen

05-08-08, 11:56 AM

Is it safe to say that Artec is the only cecb that has Advanced Picture Adjustments (hue, brightness, contrast)?

I am leaning towards Artec because of this feature!

Any comments appreciated....

satpro

05-08-08, 06:44 PM

The picture adjustment feature is horrible, the default setting is way off, and without color bars to setup to it will be nearly impossible, I tuned color bars and had to set my hue to 0 and had to change the other settings as well. This stuff should not be mucked with! Complete idiots must have designed this feature to be so off!

Tufur

05-11-08, 09:55 AM

Thank you for looking satpro

So the Artec is just a simple Now/Next and not advanced :(

The interface is very similar to the Zenith then except for the layout and advanced picture adjustment.

I wonder why the Artec User Manual page 15 (page 21 pdf) says you can press ▼ to display more programs with playing time.

The ▼ while in the EPG screen shows all the shows coming up one at a time in the next box for the channel you are on.. The 1/xx at the top of the next box is the position and number of shows in the list for that channel....
It appears more advanced than the zenith and some of the other now/next boxes.
Hope this helps.

Edit 5/14: I was able to see and scroll through 34 hours of programing, 47 shows on KCSM. On the other hand, I was only able to see 20 of 48 hours on KPIX. Both stations sit at the same level on the Sutro Tower. I determined the numbers of hours of programing being broadcast in the psip using a LG LST4200a set top box on the same antenna.

It also looks like you can do more with the Channel Information/Program Information screen using the ◄ ► and ▼ buttons too

The ◄ ► and ▼ buttons in the INFO screen only do what the manual says. The ▼ button brings down a box with the program's description if one is available. The ◄ ► buttons just bounce you back and forth between the now/next boxes with the program information box showing or not.

Malouff

05-11-08, 11:43 AM

Tufur THANK YOU for this information it does confirm the EPG :D

So it shows up as the first thing on the Next box then.
Looking at troydog's image it has (1/3) and the user manual has (1/15) now that you mentioned it I never noticed the xx/xx there before.

It also looks like you can do more with the Channel Information/Program Information screen using the ◄ ► and ▼ buttons too ;)

TraderGordo

05-15-08, 03:36 PM

Have multiple people confirmed this yet? What conditions trigger the problem exactly? Are people still buying this box despite this and why? I've got to use my coupon real soon. I guess I should go with the Tivax?

Sadly after waiting 3 weeks and finally receiving and testing today I can confirm after about 2 minutes that the artec t3a pro model does have the same annoying left channel 5.1 audio processing defect present on the insignia and zenith.

The program has no business allowing boxes like this to be continued as certified to participate in the program. What BS! :mad:

mandy's dad

05-15-08, 08:12 PM

Here is a quote from a user who installed this unit in his Class "C" motorhome.
"An update on testing/installation of my new Artec T3A Pro DTV
converter, which is now done. I cut off the AC brick from the 12V
cord, and soldered the cord to the existing 12V pigtail to the TV -
the Artec works fine from the coach battery. For connection to the TV,
I am using the RF output, since this provides the simplest
interconnect and fewest wires. To disconnect the Artec, I simply pull
three quick-disconnect plugs from the back, and reconnect the two RF
cables to each other with a bulkhead connector. Pull, pull, pull, push
and push, and the TV is reconnected for analog use. The Artec is so
small and unobtrusive, that I will just stash it away when not in use,
and leave it on the table in front of the TV while connected.

I also tested use via the composite video and line-level audio inputs,
and the picture is of course slightly better, but fast a-b testing is
needed to tell the difference. If your screen is significantly larger
than our 13" lcd, you might want to opt for this connection. In our
case, these inputs are already occupied by our DVD player, so it's not
worth the switchover hassle. BTW, the RF ch3 output is apparently in
stereo, as far as I can tell - this is not always the case with
modulator outputs, but may be a federal requirement for these units."

As usual, your mileage may vary;)

Tufur

05-16-08, 02:35 AM

Have multiple people confirmed this yet? What conditions trigger the problem exactly? Are people still buying this box despite this and why? I've got to use my coupon real soon. I guess I should go with the Tivax?

I just finished living with an Artec T3a Pro for 1 week and I didn't hear anything out of the normal. I expected to as it has the LG chip. So, I went back and read through all the zenith tt900 thread for how this sound problem thing started. First we hear about chirping and are given graphic capture of the chirp. Then sibilance is another sound heard and we are given a graphic capture of the sibilance. I believe these people that posted that information. The information was real. Fast forward to 5/6/08 zenith tt900 thread and now the boxes are coming back from zenith warranty repair and only sibilance is heard. Posters start hearing sibilance on their other full featured DTV converters...At this point it been one week and time to transplant the artec onto the van's tv. I hook my LG LST 4200a stb back up and I heard sibilance on a news channel. But it was the studio audio, not my equipment. It was a live broadcast. I never did hear the chirping. I believe some zenith units were sent out with faulty programing or a miss selected chip that caused the initial uproar. Its a mute topic for me now.
I think all the gov coupon boxes are good. I would look for a fullest EPG you can find. I was able to go out to 34 hours with the Artec, but without show desription. I'm waiting for a s-video coupon box for my computer now. My other tv welfare card is good until July.

troydog

05-16-08, 03:32 AM

Update I been using this box every day of the week since I got it. Not one audio problem for me at all. To me theses boxes are for older tv's. For my hdtv I am going to buy a hdtv box that is made with all the outputs. But for my older tv that is just a tv set no high end type this works. great.

I did hook it up to my hdtv and it looks great sounds great. The color video thing in the menu works fine for me. Heck if you can not look at a tv show and see if the color is off then you might need color bars. But as long as people are not blue or green and reds are red I am happy.

The box is so small you can hide it easy. For the projector I used strong stick tape and have it under a shelf. The unit has been on since day one only time it was off was when the power went out.

Local tv networks are hard to get here but it picks them up great. Zip if you wondering how far tv networks are is 42025. It is the only box that has picked up the cbs network with no drop outs at all. This thing is great.

I wish it had s video but not something I would need that much. Only other thing I would like to see on any box is a front display for the Chanel your watching. Would be nice if the tv is off but you were going to record something.

tc1

05-16-08, 10:19 AM

Rammitinski

05-16-08, 04:23 PM

Thank You! Second coupon is about to run out and this is the info I was waiting for to go ahead with the Artec. Have a 9" 12v TV for weather emergencies and that is primary need. Weather radio is helpful but the radar pics tell me exactly whats happening in relation to my location. Order placed :).Get a handheld, battery-operated radio scanner instead. Or at least for those times when the conditions inhibit your digital TV reception - or better yet, to add to the radar channel even when you are getting good reception. The live, storm spotters' reports on the county ESDA frequency can estimate when a storm front is about to hit you - usually right to the minute. They can also tell you specifically what kind of effects it's having - and if they are damaging, with every little detail. Can't beat that.

Then you can even follow your local utility companies progress when the power goes out, among many other potential scenarios.

tc1

05-16-08, 04:43 PM

Get a handheld, battery-operated radio scanner instead. Or at least for those times when the conditions inhibit your digital TV reception - or better yet, to add to the radar channel even when you are getting good reception. The live, storm spotters' reports on the county ESDA frequency can estimate when a storm front is about to hit you - usually right to the minute. They can also tell you specifically what kind of effects it's having - and if they are damaging, with every little detail. Can't beat that.

Then you can even follow your local utility companies progress when the power goes out, among many other potential scenarios.

Sounds interesting never looked at those. Before we get further OT can you provide a link for further investigation?

Rammitinski

05-16-08, 05:13 PM

Either www.uniden.com or www.radioshack.com. would be the most well-known makers and sellers. Uniden actually makes most (or all now) of Radio Shack's models. At this point I'd get a digital-capable one though, even if your local area emergency systems haven't gone digital yet. There are Federal frequences and such which are only digital. And it should have trunking capabilities (most digital scanners will, though). I suppose for just bare-bones usage, you could get by without all that, but you'd at least need one that goes up thru the 900 mhz frequencies in analog. Actually, all I have are analog ones, and I still pick up plenty of stuff with them.

You can check and see what kind of frequencies your area uses (digital/analog, what bands, etc.) at www.radioreference.com. Just check out the database. They also have a forum there you can check out, too.

(edit: Wow, I just checked, and I didn't even realize that RS is also selling Uniden scanners now. Looks like retail pricing for the digital ones, though - yikes! - 600 bucks! Also, it looks like the BC370CRS tabletop model uses batteries, too. 24 hrs. on 3 AA. It's designed specifically for what I'm talking about - weather and emergencies. Doesn't do digital though, so if your local police, fire (or utility companies, etc.) are digital-only, you won't be able to monitor them. Some are one or the other, or a combination, and some simulcast both. And some, especially the larger metro areas and counties, use trunked systems, while some don't. Trunking is akin to the frequency hopping of cordless and cellphones.)

edelske

05-16-08, 07:50 PM

I installed my Artec in my motorhome, also cutting off the 120V adapter. I put 3 diodes in the + lead to drop the voltage a bit to protect the box. My RV has an "amplified" Winegard antenna with an output for "set 2" that goes directly to the box. The Artec is connected with the 3 cables to my TV. Box selection is on the TV by choosing RFin or "game". It works fine. I had tested the unit at home (using the 120v adapter) here in Manhattan and had 20 channels. I ordered a second Artec for home use and they accidently shipped me a "Sansonic" - also tested with horrible results using same antenna. Sansonic shipped back! The little Artec mounts "upside down" under the TV's cabinet - so it's "on top" controls are useable - a bit of heavy duty velcro did the mount.
The antenna in the RV is rotatable - and the signal strength indicator (a bit sluggish) but quite useable for getting a good picture. Some "heat shrink" covers the diodes.
Ken

Malouff

05-16-08, 08:14 PM

Why are you guys cutting off the adapter?
So you are hooking it up to the battery using the exposed wires.

Why not use a DC adapter and plug into the cigarette lighter.
You could buy a universal adaptor and select the voltage and tip needed and keep the included adapter for Generator/AC use.

I was thinking of mounting the Artec (I don't have one) and found the controls on top to not be a good idea.

I like how the MicroProse has the controls on the front and you can also access the menu without the remote.

Not only that but I also like how they have ventilation on the sides so they don't get covered mounting it like the Artec would.

Analog PassThru is also always nice to have when traveling.

tc1

05-17-08, 07:42 AM

Why are you guys cutting off the adapter?
So you are hooking it up to the battery using the exposed wires.

Why not use a DC adapter and plug into the cigarette lighter.
You could buy a universal adaptor and select the voltage and tip needed and keep the included adapter for Generator/AC use.

Probably because they have a single use battery application.

My plan is to do as you sugest as I will be using it on a daily basis for my shop and excersise room. Hopefully will never have to use it off the battery because that would be a bad situation:eek:.

tc1

05-17-08, 07:44 AM

Rammitinski,

Thanks for the pointers.

pixelation

05-17-08, 06:35 PM

Can a owner tell me how this box handle aspect ratio? Can it display 1080i/720p signal as "Squeezed" while 480i signal as "Normal"? In other words, it will fully utilize the screen for all signals without the need of toggling aspect ratio.

tzank

05-19-08, 06:28 PM

Does any body plan to make a data cable for the Artec T3A Pro CECB? The Tivax box was found to have have a console menu via its RS232 port and it is quite likely the Artec T3A Pro has one too. I think a level converter chip may be necessary in making such a cable.

pixelation

05-19-08, 06:51 PM

I'm not sure what a level converter chip is. But I suppose you can make a RS-232 interface with 3 wires - Tx, Rx and Gnd (combined)?

whitepelican

05-20-08, 12:39 PM

I'm not sure what a level converter chip is. But I suppose you can make a RS-232 interface with 3 wires - Tx, Rx and Gnd (combined)?

I've been attempting this, and failing so far. Does anyone know the details of the "data port" pins? I have tried every combination of wiring those three pins to pins 2,3 & 5 of a DB9 connector. And then I've been trying every combination I can think of for terminal settings. I've gotten garbage out (in to my telnet session), but that's it.

I have noticed that the middle pin of the three will give some voltage out using either pin 1 or 3 as the common, so I'm guess that means the middle pin is Tx. But I'm not sure what that tells me as far as which one is Rx and which is Gnd. Maybe I'm just barking up the wrong tree entirely.

Does the Artec have a zoom mode that will squeeze 1080i/720p programs (16:9 to 4:3) but at the same time play 480i programs in its native 4:3 ratio?

Yes, in fact you can either do "squeeze" or "crop" on 16:9 content to dispaly it as 4:3. The 4:3 content is unaffected and always displays as 4:3 no matter what.

tzank

05-20-08, 03:14 PM

I've been attempting this, and failing so far. Does anyone know the details of the "data port" pins? I have tried every combination of wiring those three pins to pins 2,3 & 5 of a DB9 connector. And then I've been trying every combination I can think of for terminal settings. I've gotten garbage out (in to my telnet session), but that's it.

I have noticed that the middle pin of the three will give some voltage out using either pin 1 or 3 as the common, so I'm guess that means the middle pin is Tx. But I'm not sure what that tells me as far as which one is Rx and which is Gnd. Maybe I'm just barking up the wrong tree entirely.

I think you need the RS-232 level converter I mentioned in a previous post. Do a Google search on "RS232 Level Converter". Maxim Integrated Electronics makes such chips and there are a variety of instructions and projects available on the Web. Maxim is at http://www.maxim-ic.com/

You can even build a USB cable using a Prolific PL-2303 USB to Serial chip.

highpockets

05-21-08, 07:27 AM

Just spent a few hours with our recently received Artec T3A Pro, Sys. Version 1.0.4A (found in Menu > Options > Accessory). I'm pleased to find that listening even through a 120 watt stereo amplifier and 12" 3-way speakers at comfortable listening levels I hear no sibilance problem with the audio. We are equipped and situated as we described in Channel Master thread, post #236. I'm finding the signal level on all channels running at the dividing line between medium range and good on the indicator, much like on our HDTV. The performance of this box is entirely satisfactory, and without the curious sound skipping problem on channel 21 that we're having with our HDTV when connected to the same antenna cable. I also found that the factory default color settings in this Artec are just about spot-on, needing no touch-up.

In our situation DTV reception doesn't seem the least bit sensitive to orientation of our highly directional outdoor antenna, even with considerable multipath interference present in the signal on many channels. Though I'll probably be taking measures to improve the ventilation, I would say that the permanent performance degradation blamed on heat in a post early in this thread, was the result of a mfg. flaw in a semiconductor component that resulted in its very early decline. Heat does accelerate the inevitable in such cases. Overall, I'm very pleased with the Artec. Its compact size is very nice. I hope the CM-7000 I'm waiting for will do as well overall.

may_queen

06-03-08, 01:40 PM

I have been using Artec for over a week and have not seen any audio problems at all. Sensitivity is slightly less than Tivax stb9. Picture quality is also somewhat worse than Tivax stb9. But still this is a usable box and I wouldn't spend more money on this type of boxes given that they are pretty feature-poor. I bought from digital star local pickup (Total after coupons was $10 for Tivax and Artec)

prgood

06-05-08, 08:14 PM

My Artec came yeaterday fairly promptly from Bsat. Works well out of the box. No audio issues, PQ quite good, better sensitivity than my Samsung DLP. Very compact. EPG not very sophisticated. Overall quite pleased

CasualOTAer

06-25-08, 11:09 AM

I'd like to hear more about how the Artec is performing for users. I have a coupon with two weeks left before expiration. I'm interested in the Artec, in part, because of it's 12V power use.

More first-hand reports of the good and bad on this model would be helpful.

Thanks

TraderGordo

06-25-08, 03:22 PM

My coupons were going to expire soon, so I got this box, I like it, have not noticed any problems. Very compact, efficient (low-energy use), and like others here I can see myself using one in the car at some point... I recommend it.

tc1

06-25-08, 03:36 PM

Had mine for a few weeks and no complaints. Have an insignia also for a couple months and no complaints. Chose the Artec mainly for 12V use with small battery operated TV on a car battery in power outages. I live on the coast in hurricane land.

Had an old cigar lighter adapter with a plug that fit the Artec and it worked just fine off my boat battery.

Haven't tried and don't need use in a moving vehicle. All comments I have seen concerning moving vehicle application is that is it doesn't work well with anything for DTV.

CasualOTAer

06-25-08, 04:44 PM

tc1

06-25-08, 05:14 PM

No, But:

I haven't done a detailed comparison as the use of both is casual and sporadic and the pic is very good for both.

No dropout problems on either but note my use above. Also I have a clean, flat 19 mi shot with an arc of only 3 degrees for all my locals.:p For the little time I have watched them it would appear to me that both are better at locking on the stations then my 2 1/2 year old Toshiba plasma. Again no detailed study.

CasualOTAer

06-26-08, 10:10 AM

tc1

06-26-08, 10:31 AM

If you are new to OTA DTV Be aware that all your local stations will not have the same level of technical competance and investment in the proper equipment to produce the same quality of transmission. The local reception threads here on AVS are the place to learn about those problems :( and they can really mess up your conclusions.

lncaylor

07-11-08, 12:13 AM

I got 4 of the T3A Pros 14 days after ordering from Bsat. I paid a total of 44.76 for the 4 after coupons. $40 of that was for shipping.

They are easy to set up and have a good picture and good sensitivity similar to the Zenith DTT900 I have but with louder, improved sound. It also has an EPG that goes out as far as the PSIP info sent by the stations with program names and times but has a description for only the current and next programs. The picture was even better after I adjusted it.

It does not get that hot even though it only has vent holes on the bottom. Anyway it vents out around the openings for the connections, the place where the top connects to the case, and around the switch on top. I opened the unit up after it had been operating for several hours, I touched my finger to the LG SOC chip(while it was running) and it was hot but I could hold my finger on it without any real pain for as long as I wanted. I would guess it probably runs no more than 120 degrees F.

Overall I am pleased so far with this converter and it has a 12 month warranty that is longer than some others.

retiredTech

07-17-08, 10:01 PM

lcaylor... how do you open the T3A Pro case?
I'm afraid I will break the case.
Does it unsnap and how does it unsnap? I can't find any screws.

tc1

07-18-08, 07:14 AM

Peel the rubber foot tabs off the front, I think, edge on the bottom. Small screw under each. Don't remember if it snaps, but, "if you have to force it it ain't right".

retiredTech

07-18-08, 11:25 AM

tc1 thanks. I looked under the back feet, didn't think it would only have 2 screws.

lncaylor

07-18-08, 11:26 AM

tc1 is right there are 2 screws under the 2 front rubber feet that you remove after peeling the feet off. Then you can put a small screwdriver between the top and the strip that goes around the center of the unit. It prys up on the front of the unit first. It does take some force to get it off but it shouldn't break. Actually I just used my fingernail to pop the top off.

TheFranchise

07-19-08, 11:28 PM

Cut and paste of my early Artec observations from the DTVPAL thread:

Got a couple Artecs today. Not sure if they use the same LG chip as Zenith or Venturer or not.

Preliminary comparison: Artec is probably a hair sharper. I was unplugging the antenna and RCAs to each and not fast A-B switching with multiple connections, so there would be a minute lapse between eyeballing.

I was mainly watching MLB baseball on Fox, the local weather channel for lots of text, and some X-game type show on NBC. Being a little sharper doesn't necessarily mean better. The Artec seemed to have more jaggies, especially on the white edge of baseball uniforms when they moved, and it was horrendous on the straight edges of objects the X-game skateboarder was jumping around. Like playing a low-res computer game with no antialiasing.

The difference between the PAL and the Artec kind of reminded me of the difference between 720p and 1080i. One's generally better with less motion, the other is generally better with more motion. Or when watching Barbara Walters on The View, I guess. (soft focus.)

Having said that, I so far didn't notice the difference to be extreme or anything nor would put a big emphasis on either one being "better," just trying to give an example with the 720p/1080i comment.

The strangest part is how pink/red everything is on the Artec. I messed with the hue, messed with the colors and tint on the TV, and it's just annoying. Everyone looks like they just stepped out of a tanning booth. The text on Info and things is not the easiest to read, either. From the pictures I've seen, still better than the Tivax!

Artec was half the price of the DTVPAL, so that's good. But not diggin' the Artec remote. It looks cheap. it feels cheap. is there really no aspect ratio button on it?

Rammitinski said a good analog signal looks better to him than the digital SD on the PAL. I agree. A good analog signal also looks better than the Artec. I would expect a good analog signal to look better than digital on an analog set.

I haven't hooked the Artec to my HDTV yet. Hmm, I guess I'll go do that....

Rammitinski

07-20-08, 01:25 AM

I don't want anyone to think I think the Pal is absolutely terrible - I've seen much worse from SD ATSC tuners. It's just that I've seen better.

jrelmore

07-20-08, 08:03 AM

If you do find out what shipping is at http://www.digitalstar.com please share.

Update: Shipping for 2 is $12. Posted earlier Shipping for 1 is $7.50
Price is $2.95ea (CECB)

lncaylor

07-20-08, 10:34 PM

europabill

07-22-08, 12:51 PM

I've had my two Artec boxes for about a month now. They will stop working if there is too much heat. I had read in an earlier post of the problem and went ahead and drilled vent holes in the top on both sides of the on/off switch. With the Artec sitting on top of my satellite receiver there is just enough extra heat to cause the unit to shut down. It's still on, but all the channels show no signal. I moved it off the receiver to another shelf and the problem went away. I would strongly suggest you do not put the Artec where there is bad ventilation or an additional heat source. Other than that I've got two of them and they are working fine.....

tc1

07-22-08, 01:07 PM

Makes sense since the vent holes are on the bottom and heat rises. In any case like you describe right up and into the Artec.

KnowALittle

07-24-08, 12:44 AM

europabil, you said the Artec shuts down if it gets to hot. Can you use a cpu fan on it to keep it cool?

FaithlessX

08-20-08, 11:14 AM

tc1

08-20-08, 11:40 AM

Not sure I understand what you did. No DirectTV experience either so wild guess. I assume the directTV is connected by coax to TV ant in, put it back the way it was. Connect OTA ant. coax to Artec in and Composit out to TV. Use TV menu to switch between DirectTV input or Artec composit input. Clear as Mud? :)

CasualOTAer

08-20-08, 02:23 PM

I've been looking all over for someone with a similar issue with no luck. Here's my problem. My in-laws have Direct TV but don't want to pay for the local channels. They purchased the Artec T3a and from looking at it I thought you could simply run the Direct TV line into it, kind of like if you went through a DVD player or VCR.

When I connected it I get the Artec Welcome screen and was able to detect channels but the Direct TV didn't work. I messed with it a bit using some splitters and here's where I got stumped.

I took the Direct TV line from the wall and plugged it into a splitter, I then ran 1 cable into the Direct TV box, like it was before the splitter, and 1 cable to the Artec box. The Artec was then connected to the TV via the composite cables. If the Artec's video cable was unplugged, Direct TV came on fine but as soon as they were both connected, Direct TV went out.

I tried putting the Artec in several different configurations within the line to get it to work with Direct TV with no luck. Do they just not play nice together or am I just not hooking them up right?

If anyone can help, it would be greatly appreciated.

Danger Will Robinson!!!

For the type of hook-up you are describing, you shouldn't use a standard splitter. You'll need a diplexer in place of the splitter to run that way.

YOU MUST KEEP IN MIND that the DIRECTV receiver sends DC current up the cable to power the LNB amplifiers in the dish's feed. There are a couple of ways to isolate your Artec so that it doesn't see that DC voltage on its input, but using a diplexer, like
http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2103927&cp=&sr=1&origkw=diplexer&kw=diplexer&parentPage=search
is the usual approach.

I would not run a DIRECTV feed straight into a VCR, for the same reason. It *might* work, but only if it passes the DC voltage up to the dish unaffected.

Since you were able to detect channels, does that mean you have a separate OTA TV antenna on the roof diplexed into the coax feed at that point? Your basic DIRECTV dish would make an awful OTA antenna, IMO.

[Edit: You can get diplexers cheaper than this one at RS. For example, at Circuit City:
http://www.circuitcity.com/ssm/Philips-Satellite-Diplexer-Black-SDW5004/sem/rpsm/oid/158300/rpem/ccd/productDetail.do

Didn't want you to think they had to be pricey.]

tc1

08-20-08, 02:46 PM

FaithlessX,

I was also assuming you had a separate OTA antenna and lead in.

FaithlessX

08-20-08, 04:28 PM

Thanks for the replies. I haven't messed with Direct TV ever so I was just going off the existing setup and trying to work the Artec in the middle somewhere. I'm not even sure how everything is connected, I just know there's a jungle of wires behind the TV from the Direct TV installer... I'll have to check into diplexers. Thanks again!

oldsyd

02-24-09, 02:16 AM

Review of the Artec T3AP (not Pro!)

It pulls in all the channels my Insignia NS-DXA1-APT does, and to test it, I unplugged my preamp and rescanned, and the only station it missed was the same weak one the Insignia misses.

The menu and EPG look almost identical to the NS-DXA1-APT, with a now/next transparent look, using the same style boxes and fonts, weird. It's also much smaller than the NS-DXA1-APT, but all plastic. Only a power button on the unit, so don't lose that remote!

The power supply is a wall wart made by DVE. It says the output is 12VDC @ 0.5A. Testing with a multimeter shows 11.9VDC output. It has a diagram showing polarity of the plug on the wall wart also, so I see no reason why you couldn't make a power cord for a lighter socket. Here's a link to a similar model power supply made by the same company.

http://208.109.237.27/cat253/itemdetail.do?orgId=dveusa&itemId=286&categoryId=2

In my short test, I did notice the picture quality looked a bit dark and greenish, but in the menus there are adjustments for hue, contrast and brightness to correct that. A weird "feature" I've never seen before. Also noticed there's a video freeze button that freezes the picture. Another odd feature I can't see using for anything.

I'd give it a thumbs up for mobile 12VDC use I see no reason why it would not work.

There's a 3 pin jack on the back called "data port". Any idea what that is for?

jrelmore

02-24-09, 09:28 AM

12VDC: I believe earlier posters of this thread are using this in their RV directly wired to the 12v battery/alternator.
The data port is a rs232 port, most likely for firmware to be loaded at the mfg facility. I've seen nothing where end users have hacked this device.

I have drilled 1.4" hole in each top corner for cooling and have it mounted on its' side -zero issues so far.

oldsyd

02-24-09, 11:37 AM

Are there screws under the footpads?

mrpeter105

02-26-09, 07:24 PM

Hi:

I have been using a T3A PRO box since about sometime last summer and I am generally satisfied with the unit. However they've recently come out with the analog passthrough model. So I am wondering if they've updated the basic box in terms of firmware or in other respects other than just the analog passthrough. Any thoughts on that?

Also, some members were wondering about 12v or emergency usage for these units. I found the following webpages that will be of interest. They all feature the T3A Pro and how to hook it up for 12v. The second link even has them hooking it up to 2 lantern batteries and outputting it to one of those handheld tv's.

www(dot)ezdigitaltv(dot)com/RVs_and_Converter_Boxes.html

www(dot)digitaltvtrainer(dot)com/national/showme-battery-tv-converter

www(dot)digitaltvtrainer(dot)com/national/converter-car-rv

P.S. Sorry about the (dot) notation but I don't have enough privilege at
this time to post urls.

mntmst

02-26-09, 08:54 PM

Hi:

Also, some members were wondering about 12v or emergency usage for these units. I found the following webpages that will be of interest. They all feature the T3A Pro and how to hook it up for 12v. The second link even has them hooking it up to 2 lantern batteries and outputting it to one of those handheld tv's.

I use one in my Pilot connected the video1 input of a DDX812. I did use 2 diodes in serial to drop the voltage to 12 volts when the car is running. The remote still controls the unit under the passenger seat from the reflected IR.

mrpeter105

03-01-09, 06:14 AM

I use one in my Pilot connected the video1 input of a DDX812. I did use 2 diodes in serial to drop the voltage to 12 volts when the car is running. The remote still controls the unit under the passenger seat from the reflected IR.

Hi:

Thank you for replying. Sorry to get back to you somewhat after the fact. I'm curious about using the box while the engine is running. Is it really necessary to add those 2 diodes? In other words do you think it'll toast the box if you used it without those diodes, with the engine running?

My own interest in the 12v aspect is for when the power goes out. I have one of those booster packs with a 14-ah battery and a 5-inch b/w tv that runs off 12v. I just need to get the proper cord for the Artec.

rabbit73

03-01-09, 04:35 PM

I have been using a T3A PRO box since about sometime last summer and I am generally satisfied with the unit. Also, some members were wondering about 12v or emergency usage for these units. I found the following webpages that will be of interest. They all feature the T3A Pro and how to hook it up for 12v. The second link even has them hooking it up to 2 lantern batteries and outputting it to one of those handheld tv's.

www(dot)ezdigitaltv(dot)com/RVs_and_Converter_Boxes.html
www(dot)digitaltvtrainer(dot)com/national/showme-battery-tv-converter
www(dot)digitaltvtrainer(dot)com/national/converter-car-rv

I too am concerned about receiving the latest emergency news bulletins and need to run on battery power. I was using a small 5" B&W NTSC TV indoors, but my 8" digital TV requires an outdoor antenna. I knew about the first link, but I didn't know about the other two; thanks! I'll post them for you:

http://ezdigitaltv.com/RVs_and_Converter_Boxes.html

http://digitaltvtrainer.com/national/showme-battery-tv-converter

http://digitaltvtrainer.com/national/converter-car-rv

I would like to add this one from their excellent site:
http://www.digitaltvtrainer.com/national/showme-watch-tv-power-off

I'm using a small sinewave inverter, the Exeltech XP125, which comes with a cigarette lighter plug which fits the jack on my J900 and ES2500 12volt 17Ah jumper packs.

rabbit73

03-01-09, 11:28 PM

I'm curious about using the box while the engine is running. Is it really necessary to add those 2 diodes? In other words do you think it'll toast the box if you used it without those diodes, with the engine running?
To paraphrase holl_ands: Just because a piece of equipment has an input jack that is marked 12VDC, doesn't mean that it is a good idea to connect it to the 12V system of a vehicle.

The problem is the tolerance limits on the voltage. I have an 8" TV that has a regulated switchmode AC adapter that very closly regulates the 12V. I asked Audiovox what the tolerance on the 12volts was, but never got an answer. So, to be conservative, I decided to either use the AC adapter with an inverter, or make a battery pack that has a voltage regulator to duplicate the performance of the AC adapter.

I also asked the manufactuer of a CECB that needs 5VDC (not Zinwell) about the voltage tolerance limits if I run it DIRECTLY on batteries. The answer that I got was that I should use an inverter; not too helpful. The sales people in the US would have to ask an engineer overseas that question, which is not likely.
Even if the engineer was asked, he might not know because he had assumed that the box would always be used with the voltage regulated adapter.

One of the excellent links that you listed, talks about using a box on a lower voltage and it still behaves. But, what about using it on a higher voltage? How much is too much for a 12 volt box:---14 volts---15 volts---when will it fry? Which one of us is willing to keep increasing the voltage until our box goes up in smoke? The two diodes in series provide about a 0.6 volt drop for each, a total of 1.2 volts when the vehicle is running. The voltage in my car is about 12 volts when not running, and about 14.5 volts when recharging the battery after starting.

Last night I measured the input voltage and current of my Artec T3A Pro:
OFF: 12.04 volts @ 5.8 mA
ON: 11.96 volts @ 0.31 A
The current when off is lower than many other boxes. There still has to be a little current in order for the remote control to turn it ON. I measured the input voltage and current of my Zinwell ZAT-970A:
OFF: 5.08 volts @ 0.16 A
ON: 4.99 volts @ 0.69 A
Notice how much current it draws even when "OFF," almost 25 % of the ON current.

oldsyd

03-06-09, 02:08 PM

Any idea on what is different between the T3AP and the T3AP-LL models? Neither are the Pro version.

nicoge21

03-06-09, 05:56 PM

I have the T3AP Pro version with analog pass through and it works quite well.

Has anyone tried using a mobile adapter and plugging it in the cigarette lighter of a car?

oldsyd

03-06-09, 07:48 PM

This might be the wrong thread, but I think the only difference between the T3AP and the T3AP-PRO is that the pro has more buttons on the case. Today I got a T3AP-LL, and everything looks the same as the T3AP except the model number has the "LL" at the end.

Regarding 12VDC, yes you can power it on a cigarette lighter adapter, just make sure your TV does not have a positive ground. Read the motor home thread in this forum for more info.

pm3839

03-07-09, 08:07 AM

....I think the only difference between the T3AP and the T3AP-PRO is that the pro has more buttons on the case. Today I got a T3AP-LL, and everything looks the same as the T3AP except the model number has the "LL" at the end.......

i have both the ARTEC T3AP and the T3AP-PRO .....youre right, the only difference i can tell is the PRO has POWER/VOLUME/CHANNEL buttons on top....the non-pro version has only a POWER button on top...and both of mine have the same firmware version (sorry, i cant remember what it is)....

i've never heard of the LL version....maybe its the latest production version with newer firmware? the 2 i have were delivered about 6 weeks ago...

reduno

04-01-09, 09:18 PM

I'm looking at getting an Artec T3AP but didn't know if it was worth getting the Pro model with the buttoms on the case? The box will be used with a small black & white TV, both at home in the kitchen and on the road in our travel trailer. In the trailer I will need the remote anyway, since we will need to re-scan the channels at each stop. At home, the box will likely be on just one station.

Do these units remember the last station when they are turned off? If pressing the power buttom (to turn the unit on) brings back the same station, I probably won't need the remote at home. Also, is there a way to select mono sound on the RCA output for use with a TV set that only has one audio input?

Thanks, Red.

pm3839

04-09-09, 03:12 PM

I'm looking at getting an Artec T3AP but didn't know if it was worth getting the Pro model with the buttoms on the case? .......Do these units remember the last station when they are turned off? ...... Also, is there a way to select mono sound on the RCA output for use with a TV set that only has one audio input? Thanks, Red.

the POWER/VOLUME/CHANNELS buttons are nice to have....and very few if any other cecb's have buttons for all 3 functions....

yes, the Artec T3AP will remember last channel at power up....it also remembers all your channel memories and picture, etc etc settings.....including after a power failure or disconnect from AC power....one exception tho > i'm pretty sure it loses all epg data when turned off....

no, there is no mono audio option.....but it doesnt really matter....u wont notice any problems in most cases on most programs....if it is an issue for u just use the rf ch 3 or 4 coax output....i bet that is a mono left/right mix....

pm3839

04-09-09, 05:06 PM

The ▼ while in the EPG screen shows all the shows coming up one at a time in the next box for the channel you are on.. The 1/xx at the top of the next box is the position and number of shows in the list for that channel..........
Edit 5/14: I was able to see and scroll through 34 hours of programing, 47 shows on KCSM. On the other hand, I was only able to see 20 of 48 hours on KPIX. .....The ◄ ► and ▼ buttons in the INFO screen only do what the manual says. The ▼ button brings down a box with the program's description if one is available. The ◄ ► buttons just bounce you back and forth between the now/next boxes with the program information box showing or not.

to Tufur or anyone else who has the Artec T3AP boxes >

how were u able to see epg data that many hours ahead? both of my Artec T3AP Pro and non-Pro models only seem to have NOW/NEXT epg info....i tried everything i could think of to 'see' further ahead but nothing worked... how did u do this?

nicoge21

04-09-09, 05:53 PM

mine memorizes all the channels even when I unplug it on my own. There is some kind of bug in it though, when you adjust your antenna, if you lose any stations, it still picks them up and maps them when you do a scan.

So basically it locks in channels even with no signal

mrpeter105

04-12-09, 03:24 AM

to Tufur or anyone else who has the Artec T3AP boxes >

how were u able to see epg data that many hours ahead? both of my Artec T3AP Pro and non-Pro models only seem to have NOW/NEXT epg info....i tried everything i could think of to 'see' further ahead but nothing worked... how did u do this?

Hi:

Try this. Goto a strong channel that you receive well. Now, hit the
EPG button which will bring up the EPG guide. You will see NOW/NEXT
panels. Look into the NEXT panel. The first line you will see is a
1/xx where xx is the number of discrete different programs that are
listed in the EPG for that channel. The next line is the name of
the program and the final line is the start time and end time of
the program. Now, hit the CH - button once. Look at the NEXT panel
again. You will notice the first line has changed to 2/xx. The name
of the program should be different and the time will also reflect
the new start and end time. You can use the CH - button to go to
the end of the list which would be the xx'th entry which would show
as xx/xx. After that you will see a "No Program Information" in the
NEXT panel when you come to the end of the list. To go the other
way use the CH + button. So the EPG is just a simple list that you
navigate using the CH +/- buttons.

Also, for the PRO models I guess, the buttons on top allow you to
change channels and volume. They also allow you to access the
menus. If you hold down the left volume button and then hit the
channel button nearest the front of the unit the menu system will
come up. So I guess if you lose your remote you can still use the
buttons on the unit itself to do most things such as scan for new
channels etc. I haven't really played around with it to see what
else the buttons can do.

Even though this isn't one of the big name units out there I think
it's one of the better ones around. The capability to run on 12
volts directly, the better expanded EPG guide rather than just
NOW/NEXT and the capability to use the buttons on top in case you
lose the remote. These little things show that the engineers at
least paid a little more attention to detail than you get with most
of these units.

mrpeter105

04-12-09, 03:48 AM

One of the excellent links that you listed, talks about using a box on a lower voltage and it still behaves. But, what about using it on a higher voltage? How much is too much for a 12 volt box:---14 volts---15 volts---when will it fry? Which one of us is willing to keep increasing the voltage until our box goes up in smoke? The two diodes in series provide about a 0.6 volt drop for each, a total of 1.2 volts when the vehicle is running. The voltage in my car is about 12 volts when not running, and about 14.5 volts when recharging the battery after starting.

Hi:

Sorry to get back to you so late. I think the link said the Artec would work down to 7 or 7.5 volts. What you could do the would be to use a dc-dc voltage converter and run it at 7.5 volts. They have a switch to allow you to choose the output voltage usually 3-4.5-6-7.5-9-12. So running it at 7.5 would give you a 4.5 volt safety margin. I guess that could be done. Just a thought.

pm3839

04-14-09, 12:18 AM

...... So the EPG is just a simple list that you navigate using the CH +/- buttons.
Also, for the PRO models ...... If you hold down the left volume button and then hit the channel button nearest the front of the unit the menu system will come up. ......
Even though this isn't one of the big name units out there I think it's one of the better ones around. The capability to run on 12 volts directly, the better expanded EPG guide rather than just NOW/NEXT and the capability to use the buttons on top in case you lose the remote. These little things show that the engineers at least paid a little more attention to detail than you get with most of these units.

wow....it works!...woohoo!....lol....thanks for all that info, mrpeter105! i appreciate it....

i had probably tried that in my random 'button pushing' attempts but the box's response time is at least 2 or 3 seconds before the new epg data appears.....so my impatience led me to believe nothing was happening....i just didnt wait long enough,,,,does your ARTEC have this same delay?

and i agree....this box does work well, all things considered....

also, i was wondering how to use the top panel buttons to access the set-up menus and your tip works there too....so thanks again!

mrpeter105

04-15-09, 06:24 AM

,,,does your ARTEC have this same delay?

Yes. I think all the boxes take a bit to update the EPG.

equivocal

04-17-09, 01:57 AM

oldsyd

04-17-09, 02:09 AM

I thought the Dish Network CECB's did work with Digital TVGOS, if your local CBS affiliate is sending the data? :confused:

It better work with it for $70 :eek:

biker19

04-17-09, 07:20 AM

^ it might "work" if data is available but only to convert the data, not display it. I don't believe any CECB displays TVGOS info.

equivocal

04-18-09, 02:48 AM

Not just $70 up front, but an unknown subscription fee for TVGOS. At least, that's the way I read the blurb. Presumably that extra $ buys access to the "real" TVGOS digital stream and not the separate digitized analog VBI that the DTVPal apparently depends on.

biker19

04-18-09, 08:51 AM

There's no fee for TVGOS (any version) - and it's available in most markets. The only issue with the Pal is that it needs extra "stuff" added to the TVGOS signal to be able to convert it back to analog for legacy analog TVGOS devices. Displaying the TVGOS data itself is probably easy - but the price point of the CECBs is probably too low to allow for it.

equivocal

04-19-09, 03:11 AM

I realize now that the idea of a subscription fee came from the ezdigitaltv page (http://www.ezdigitaltv.com/Artec_T3APR-T_TVG.html). However, when I found the manual (http://207.210.85.226/~artectv/Service_e/nl/downloads/user_manuals/T3APR-T//T3APR-T.pdf) (PDF), the section about TV Guide (page 16, the 22nd page) instructs how to use G-Link and substitute ZIP codes to use TVGOS on your analog TV or DVR. So it became evident that this is same kind of solution provided by the DTVPal and not a substitute for a PSIP-based guide. I'd guess then that it has the same dependency on extra "stuff" as the DTVPal. Sounds like this is all old news though.

ss_sea_ya

04-20-09, 12:16 AM

One thing NOT noted so far here is I do not think the ARTEC T3AP-PRO (nor prob its siblings) have event/auto tune timers for recording to a VCR or DVR.

For me, not a big deal (and pob most others here), as I plan to use this on the boat (thus the desire for a box w/12VDC input). Prob only use to catch a sports game here and there (and maybe check out RADAR).
I think the buttons on the box are a big plus (Just make sure if you want that, that someone is not trying to sell/pass one of its siblings as this one. i.e. "Just like the TA3 PRO..." but it isn't the T3A-Pro...

Jim

pm3839

04-21-09, 01:03 AM

One thing NOT noted so far here is I do not think the ARTEC T3AP-PRO (nor prob its siblings) have event/auto tune timers for recording to a VCR or DVR......For me, not a big deal (and pob most others here), as I plan to use this on the boat ......I think the buttons on the box are a big plus (Just make sure if you want that, that someone is not trying to sell/pass one of its siblings as this one. i.e. "Just like the TA3 PRO..." but it isn't the T3A-Pro... Jim

youre right...there is no timer feature on any of the ARTEC T3AP boxes...and the epg is 'NOW/NEXT PROGRAM' only...u can look ahead several hours but that process is slow and awkward to use (in my opinion) and only gives program titles with no descriptions....if you can overlook this shortcoming the ARTEC T3AP is an excellent dtv converter box overall....

and yes, having on-the-box channel/volume/power buttons is a nice feature...but thats only on the ARTEC T3AP Pro model....the non-Pro model has only a single round POWER button on top...other than that the two versions are identical....

ss_sea_ya

04-22-09, 11:32 AM

Found this neat FAQ on the ARTEC website:

http://www.artectv.com/Service_e/nl/home/digital%20tv/FAQ_for_ATSC_STB.htm#ATSC_STB_17

"Does T3A Pro compatible with RV (Recreation vehicle) potable TV?

Yes, our converter box will work with your 12 volt TV, you may use the cigarette lighter in a car as the power supply; then use a right cable(as shown in the picture) to connect the converter box and the cigarette lighter."

(They show a pic of a cable similar to the radio shack cable which when I tried to post is, shows up huge for some reason.)

ron350

04-30-09, 01:42 AM

Artec T3AP-LL

Thanks Pm3839 for the information about the free Artec T3AP-LL CECB.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1134046

This is a nice CECB and the one I have has a picture equal to the DTT901 Zenith. As stated before the Artec and the Zenith share the same LG processor and very similar LG tuners. Both boxes only pull 3 watts when ON and almost nothing when OFF.
Running the Artec on alternative 12 volts is discussed above but remember it is going to pull around 3 watts whether you run it at 7 volts or 14 volts. Lower the voltage and watch the mA (current) go up and raise the voltage and watch the mA go down.
The warmest part in the Artic and the Zenith appears to be a surface mounted chip on the bottom side of the tuners circuit board. The Artec ran so warm in its little plastic case that I took it out of the case and put it on top of the TV. The Artec tuner can is mounted with the hot section hanging of the edge of the circuit board like the designers knew what they were doing. The hot chip is mounted under the shield where the 5 cooling holes are.
http://img131.imageshack.us/img131/2966/artec004a.jpg (http://img131.imageshack.us/my.php?image=artec004a.jpg)
http://img131.imageshack.us/img131/2966/artec004a.jpg

Both the Artec and the Zenith remote controls are a little small but I think the Artec is easier to use with one hand. The Artec uses the Up, Down, Right, and Left buttons to change channels and volume. The Zenith remote has separate rocker buttons to adjust the volume and change the channels that sometimes requires two hand to operate.

http://img131.imageshack.us/img131/576/artec002a.jpg (http://img131.imageshack.us/my.php?image=artec002a.jpg)
http://img131.imageshack.us/img131/576/artec002a.jpg

http://img123.imageshack.us/img123/7615/artec2003a.jpg
http://img123.imageshack.us/img123/7615/artec2003a.jpg

http://img123.imageshack.us/img123/8773/artec2001a.jpg
http://img123.imageshack.us/img123/8773/artec2001a.jpg

nicoge21

05-12-09, 01:16 AM

Hows everyone liking this box? I love mine. Very pleased with it so far. I ordered it off solidsignal or freetvsignal i think? (don't remember) and I got free shipping so I payed $0 w/coupon.

Anyone figure out what that little IR data port thing is in the back? In the box menu it says you can upgrade the firmware but it doesn't work.

This box is really really small like the size of a computer modem almost. Looks nice on my stand.

jafi1

05-23-09, 02:15 PM

Just noticed the Artec T3APR-T (http://www.artectv.com/ehtm/products/t3aprt.htm) which claims to have "TV Guide...Product". Is this supposed to be a guide based on TVGOS data rather than PSIP or another kludge like the DTVPal?

http://www.macrovision.com/dtv/10057.htm

The T3APR-T box is like the DTVPal. The TV Guide on Screen (TVGOS) functionality is to convert the SCTE-127 data being broadcast by selected CBS stations in their digital signal to a format that analog TVGOS enabled devices can use so they can still get the TV Guide program listings. If you don't have a TVGOS enabled device the feature doesn't do anything for you. The EPG the box displays is strictly PSIP based. Would love to hear if someone uses the Artec to deliver the TVGOS and if it works any better or differently than the Pal does.

ron350

05-26-09, 01:39 PM

Any information on the Artec T3AP-LS with a Sanyo tuner?

I just noticed that Free tv Signal place is advertising the free T3AP-LS with Sanyo High Definition Tuner?

https://secure.freetvsignal.com/viewBox.php?qty=1&productNo=dealOfTheDay

Lazza

05-26-09, 02:15 PM

The Artec T3AP-LS has been available from TigerDirect/CompUSA for some time at the price of $40.01 (excluding shipping). I thought all Artec CECBs came with a Sanyo tuner? It also seems that the Sanyo tuners are perhaps less sensitive than others out there. (The Zinwell 970A has a Sanyo tuner and folks have indicated its performance is good but not great.)

When I saw the Artec unit at a CompUSA retail out recently I was amazed at how small it was; it looked like a little toy! But it seems to be a pretty decent unit.

_Lazza

ron350

05-26-09, 07:40 PM

Thanks Lazza
Shoot I was hoping the LS model was something new.

Just ordered one so I will see what they send hope it is another LL model.

biker19

05-29-09, 07:48 AM

Just ordered one so I will see what they send hope it is another LL model.
Nope - just got my order - got the LS model (from freetvsignal).

ron350

05-31-09, 03:29 PM

sundazing

06-14-09, 03:03 PM

The Sanyo tuner in the T3AP-LS does not compare with the LG tuner in the T3AP-LL.
The LG tuner is more sensitive and has a cleaner crisper picture than the Sanyo tuner.

I am still looking for a T3AP-LL or another Artec that uses the same LG tuner.

Any one know what tuner is used in the T3AP Pro box?

Researching this issue today and found one site stating the Pro uses the Sanyo tuner. Only place I found that has LLs for govt coupons is: http://www.dtvboxanswers.com/artect3apro.html . They're in stock at $2.99 plus approx $7.50 for shipping. (Check out their restrictive return policy prior to ordering.) Amazon has some merchants selling them for $20 or less w/o coupon. LS are still totally free and available at several sellers online.

ron350

06-14-09, 11:43 PM

Sundazing thanks for the information that means I am only looking for a free LL model.
If I have to pay $10 I will just go to K-Mart and buy another Zenith DTT901.

kev4321

07-01-09, 02:43 PM

Saw an Artec converter box advertisement while looking at the TVGOS-based TV Guide listings:

---------------------------------------------------------
Artec logo

Digital Converter Box
Supports

"TV Guide logo" and "Guide Plus logo"

<picture of converter box with remote>

<picture of government coupon>

www.artecdtv.com
---------------------------------------------------------

Pressing left arrow to select the ad on the left changed the right panel to show:

---------------------------------------------------------
Artec Digital Converter Box Supports
TV Guide On Screen & Guide Plus Products

Purchase an Artec digital-to-analog converter box
that plugs into your existing television or VCR with
TV Guide On Screen or Guide Plus+ built in.

Now available for purchase at
www.artecdtv.com

Press right cursor > to return to Guide
---------------------------------------------------------

I've never seen something like this for the DTVPal.
So I thought it was interesting to see one for the Artec.

The DTVPal and the Artec T3APR-T are the only converter boxes with support for analog TVGOS devices, so far.

I've not heard anyone report on getting TVGOS listings from the Artec T3APR-T yet.

I imagine it works. But it would be nice to hear someone's experience with it.

for anyone curious:
TVGOS = TV Guide On Screen
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TVGOS

I used "DTVPal" as a catchall term for "Echostar TR-40", "DISH Network DTVPal", and "DISH Network DTVPal Plus", of course.

Rammitinski

07-01-09, 05:26 PM

Rammitinski

07-01-09, 05:30 PM

I've not heard anyone report on getting TVGOS listings from the Artec T3APR-T yet.

I imagine it works. But it would be nice to hear someone's experience with it.
There is somebody currently posting in the LG 3410a thread in the HDTV Recorders forum here that's trying to get one to work with his 3410a - but doesn't seem to be having any luck so far.

kev4321

07-01-09, 09:10 PM

There is somebody currently posting in the LG 3410a thread in the HDTV Recorders forum here that's trying to get one to work with his 3410a - but doesn't seem to be having any luck so far.

Thanks. I found that a little while after I posted my message.

I googled site:avsforum.com tvgos t3apr-t (http://www.google.com/search?num=100&q=site:avsforum.com+tvgos+t3apr-t)

But to find their first message I looked at the previous pages in the thread looking for their name.

rljohnsen (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=16701371#post16701371) from 6/22/09 looks to be the first.

I guess the reason google didn't find it was because it was spelled "T3ARP-T" instead of "T3APR-T".

Unfortunately since the LG 3410A has TVGOS 7 this person's success may not be that great.

For anyone that has a TVGOS device but is unsure which version it is:
This mentions how to enter TVGOS's diagnostic mode so that you can see what version of TVGOS you have.

systems2000

07-01-09, 10:24 PM

They're in stock at $2.99 plus approx $7.50 for shipping.
They want $10.74 to my door for S&H.

kev4321

07-05-09, 07:34 PM

Even more interesting: if you go to the "Meritline" site, they also have a more expensive model listed (underneath the regular TVGOS converting one) that supposedly has TVGOS built into it.

That's the way it appears to be worded, anyway - but it has to be some kind of mistake, as it seems highly unlikely such a thing really exists, because it's not even listed on the Artec site itself.

I just now finally got around to looking into this thing.

I googled meritline artec t3apr-t (http://www.google.com/search?num=100&q=meritline+artec+t3apr-t)

"Artec Digital-to-Analog Converter Box, Model T3APR-T(TVG), Analog Pass-Through, TV Guide Subscription required for TV Guide Program"
Artec Model T3APR-T(TVG)
Item Number: 201-128-001
Sale: $59.99 ($59.99 Ea)

2 PCS Artec T3APR with TV GUIDE
Item Number: 201-128-002
Sale: $119.99 ($60.00 Ea)

Despite what their partially useless words say:

the 1st for $ 60 includes one T3APR-T.
the 2nd for $120 includes two T3APR-T.

The 2nd costs twice as much because it includes two converter boxes.

Lets break down the description of the 1st by removing words that don't carry much weight (because they are common for many converter boxes). Here's what's left:

"Artec T3APR-T(TVG), TV Guide Subscription required for TV Guide Program"

What? There is no subscription required for TVGOS (TV Guide On Screen) reception. They don't know what they are talking about. So their words are of questionable value.

Next lets look at the description of the 2nd item they are selling:
"2 PCS Artec T3APR with TV GUIDE"

2 PCS is short for 2 pieces, I imagine. Meaning you will get 2 converter boxes.

Anyway, I don't think there is anything out of the ordinary about what they are selling. They just have some misleading ("subscription required") and unclear words ("2 PCS").

update1(
http://onelook.com/?w=PCS

finds:Stammtisch Beau Fleuve Acronyms for PCS
http://www.plexoft.com/SBF/P01.html#PCServ

PieCeS. Plurals of pc. and pc, resp.

which links to:pc., pc
PieCe. Traditional abbreviation uses period. Often used without period by packagers and shippers. Plural pcs.

I'm thinking people just weren't paying close enough attention to catch on to this. At least I'm not seeing the pieces (PCS :)) I put together as being that significant.
)

Yankee495

08-10-09, 01:15 PM

Yep Freetvsignal sent a T3AP-LS with a Sanyo tuner as advertised.
Sanyo tuner #
UBD00AL
LOT FVIP

The Sanyo tuner in the T3AP-LS does not compare with the LG tuner in the T3AP-LL.
The LG tuner is more sensitive and has a cleaner crisper picture than the Sanyo tuner.

Hopefully some more free T3AP-LL boxes with the LG tuner will show up somewhere in the future.

Edit:
I am still looking for a T3AP-LL or another Artec that uses the same LG tuner.

Any one know what tuner is used in the T3AP Pro box?

I just ordered two ARTEC T3AP-LL versions from meritline. Ok, so which is it...is the LS or LL the best tuner...

I hope I got the right ones. I've seen it both ways but more say the LL is better. By the way, the LS ones are like $2 higher. Did I screw up?

ron350

08-11-09, 12:21 AM

Yankee495 thanks for the post.

Please let us know if Meritline sends you the LL or the LS box.

Here is the link to their add.
http://www.meritline.com/searchnew.aspx?SearchTerm=artec+t3ap

Ron350

Yankee495

08-11-09, 08:21 AM

You bet I will. One is on its way already. I ordered a Sunkey and had them change it to an Artec also, so it will be a day later maybe.

But as you can see, they list them as LL & LS and the LS is $2.99 more!

Maybe they have it backwards like the pics that list the model as "TA3P" instead of the correct "T3AP"!

By backwards I mean, maybe they think the LS is the one people want!

I hope it's not me that screwed up.

So it is the LL everyone wants isn't it?

pm3839

08-12-09, 12:11 AM

.......So it is the LL everyone wants isn't it?

i dont know.....but i have the older/earlier version b4 i think any other was available and they work just fine....tuner sensitivity and picture quality are both excellent...as good as my DN TR40 anyways....so whichever one u get it should be fine....

i just looked at my Artec T3AP product box and the converter itself and it doesnt say LL or LS ....just Artec T3AP or Artec T3AP Pro....i thought it did somewhere but i couldnt find it...mine were bought 11/08 and 12/08....

Yankee495

08-12-09, 08:25 AM

Yes, I seen that they used to be just plain "T3AP". And then meritline has them labeled in the graphic as TA3P and I was confused real good for a minute. Then I was on the hunt for the difference between LS & LL.

I mean, the LS must be better for some reason, it cost $2.99 more, right?

Well from what I read you want the LL with the LG tuner. The LS is a Sanyo tuner. We really need to get this straight from someone with both as I am only going to have two LL's.

I have a Zinwell 970A without the hidden guide (0920) and it is a pretty fair box. It picks up good and good picture and sound.

I don't like the guide, now/next and no description.

I just noticed meritline has a Artec LL and a Tivax T8 for $85.99 and you can use two coupons...free shipping....meaning a Tivax and Artec for $5.99!

I missed the good EPG in the Zinwell and now this!

I have one more coupon for a Tivax but it's gonna cost me $9.99.

ron350

08-12-09, 01:11 PM

Yankee495 save your last coupon for now and see how you like the Artec box.

I have an iNet SSR1921 (same as Tivex) and I do not like it.

Yankee495

08-13-09, 05:30 PM

Just got my first T3AP-LL. The box is labeled (not a sticker) T3AP-LL.
It has System Version # 2.1.1B.

The picture of the guide on the back (and in the pdf manuals online and the manual that comes with it) is nothing like the guide in the STB!

The guide in the STB is as follows:

Hitting EPG brings up a channel list on the left with date and time above it.

On the right I have 1/13 at the top with a list of shows (13 on this channel)

Left and right arrows moves you from channel list to show list.

Up and down scrolls channels/shows depending if you are on the channel or show list.

Scrolling on the channel list changes the shows listed on the right.

Hitting info on either side takes you to the main screen with a banner at the top that list show title, time, date ,length, DTV channel (12.2), Call letters KNSF-DT, and icons for CC etc.

On the banner hitting down arrow drops a box with show description. Hitting right arrow moves you to the next show with description.

You cannot scroll down the list in EPG screen, where mine list 1/13 and select say #10 and hit info and get info on that show. It exits that to the banner with info on now and next show.

My point about the model number being printed on the box and not being a sticker is that they reprinted the whole box, but left the pics of the old guide on the box and in the manual. This is the first Artec I have ever seen, but the guide in the STB does not match any I have seen. It's better.

OK, a guide ain't worth nothng without a picture, right.

I have a Zinwell 970A and it has a now/next EPG. It has a really good sharp picture and picks up really well.

The T3AP picks up all the channels that the Zinwell does so far. It is day time and some go out in the daytime because of all the noise etc. I'm talking about channels 80 miles away.

Today, the Zinwell was getting channel 10 at 51% strength and 3% quality. It was cutting in and out a bit...short breakups 3 or 4 times a minute.

The Artec has not lost this signal in 1 and 1/2 hours. Neither box is getting channel 3,27 or 33 which I only get after dark or so, but real good then (day time noise you know...cell phones, computers, cars and the sun its self makes noise).

The Zinwell is a great box, except for EPG but I can live with it.

The Artec has a more sensitive tuner (not a lot, but it counts, I can tell), better picture, and a way better EPG.

Both have nice menus etc. Both have good scanning and editing features like scan, manual scan, add, edit and delete etc.

The Artec does not have favorites like the Zinwell. It also does not have numbers on the signal meter which I really like about the Zinwell. It just has Bad__________Good and your signal is between there somewhere (hopefully)!

The Artec also beeps while the signal is being displayed and there is a button on the remote for that. I might get used to the beeps! They should be able to be turned off but so far as I can tell you can't.

Now for the remotes. Both are laid out pretty well, though different, whatever you're used to you know.

The Zinwell can be pointed at the wall, ceiling, yourself, anywhere, it just bounces all over the room and works. No so with the Artec. It has to be not directly, but more directly pointed at the box to work.

This is in the bed room where the lights are off and you just wanna point it any old where and have it work.

All in all either box is a really good solid box. It depends what you want.

I want a good EPG and the best reception I can get so it looks like the Artec wins. The picture qualiy of either will do, but the Artec is better.

A few minor things. The Artec is slower at channel changing. The Zinwell, when you hit ok, brought up a channel list on the right with a PIP of the channel currently selected. You could scroll down the list and view the whole picture and channel surf fairly quick. Can't do that with the Artec, but then again you may not have to with that nice EPG!

The Artec also has excellent cropping (Aspect ratio). Very good. Put it in a smaller format then swith to cropped and there is very little picture lost...if you can even tell.

I didn't aim to make this a comparison of the Zinwell and the Artec but I have read so many people saying "the best I'v seen" etc...and I'm thinking compared to what? 1950 B&W?

I'll try and get a pic of the EPG up.

I'm very happy with it and glad I have another one coming tomorrow!

But I ain't gonna trash the Zinwell either....good box.

The Zinwell is a really good box for an older person that just wants to watch TV and see what is on next. You know, channel up/down, volume up/down, and that is the only thing they want to know...and power off.....It pops up now/next just by changing channels...No need to hit EPG, info, nothing.

Ok, so you all don't run out and buy one expecting to get channels from 80 miles away on rabbit ears...

I'm using a VU-190XR at about 25 feet to get these channels. It had some ice storm damage but I repaired it and one element is missing...no clue where it went....kids playing swords maybe!

I'll try and get some pics up tonight.

ss_sea_ya

08-13-09, 05:40 PM

Nice description!
I think the Zinwell has event timers and the ARTEC may not?

Lazza

08-13-09, 05:41 PM

Does the Artec run hot? It seems to me that in many ways the Artec is a poor man's Zenith DTT901. Clearly much of its user interface is shared with the Zenith. I own a Zenith, and its great, but I have never used an Artec. However I did see one at a store and dismissed it because the box itself seemed incredibly dinky; I feared it would suffer a meltdown before long. The Zenith runs only *slightly* warm.

Thanks.

_Lazza

Floydage

08-13-09, 06:20 PM

Yankee495

08-13-09, 07:55 PM

Hey Yankee, is your Artec supposed to be the "Pro?" I don't even know what the difference is supposed to be as Wiki doesn't show any obvious differences other than Energy Star compliance (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_CECB_units).

The Zinwell is one of the few boxes with a program timer; combining that unique feature with a decent overall box is probably why so many brag about it.

Thanks for the review!

The Pro has channel up/down and volume up/down on a little ring around the power button. These just have a round power button.

Also my remote is all black, not like the one in the pic.

Below are pics of the EPG, info, and the signal meter (don't like it, might get used to it). Sorry about the pics, from my phone...good camera dead and wanted to get these up for you guys.

Comment of the EPG please? Is it different then the ones you guys have seen? I mean actually in a STB, not a manual etc.

http://media.dtvconverterguide.com/Artec-T3A-Pro-large.jpg

Yankee495

08-13-09, 08:19 PM

No, I wouldn't say hot....slightly warm after several hours...

No these are not Pros, just plain T3AP's (LL version, there is a LS version too). The say LL is an LG tuner and LS is a Sanyo tuner. The LL with LG tuner is said to be better. Can someone verify this?

No, there are no event timers like the Zinwell has.

TheFranchise

08-14-09, 12:03 AM

Does the Artec run hot? It seems to me that in many ways the Artec is a poor man's Zenith DTT901. Clearly much of its user interface is shared with the Zenith.

I might even say the Zenith is a poor man's Artec since the Artec has a longer EPG. I've had two Artec non-pros for, I don't know, 10 months or whatever. No problem. Pic is much sharper than DTVPal, and the price was certainly right even back then. I don't know if the Zinwell is better since I don't have one.

Yankee495

08-14-09, 05:13 PM

Just got my second T3AP-LL and it seems to be as good as the first one.

I just seen a Sunkey 801. I ordered one and changed it to an Artec. Boy am I glad I did...

How about hearing from some of you LS guys?

ron350

08-14-09, 07:49 PM

System Version of your Artec?

I have 3 Artec boxes but I broke the first LL box.

#1 T3AP-LL received April 09
Serial # V1201W08480004##
073-0000-V12G02
System Version= ?
Did not have extended program guide.
LG tuner #TDVG-H152F .808A07111
Processor = LGDT1111T
0822
PA7967.00D

#2 T3AP-LS received May 09
Serial # V1202W08410006##
073-0000-V12G04
System Version = 2.0.1B
Has extended program guide.
Sanyo tuner # UBDOOAL LOT FVIP
Processor = LGDT1111T
0835
PB5193.00B

#3 T3AP-LL received August 09
Serial # V1201W09250012##
073-0000-V12G02
System Version = 2.1.1B
Has extended program guide just like above LS model.
LG tuner # TDVG-H152F .808A27110
Processor = LGDT1111T
0907
PB5201.00B

Yankee495

08-14-09, 11:36 PM

Yankee495

08-16-09, 06:24 AM

Look at the manual for this box. Looks like an Artec to me, LG tuner and all.
It does not have the extended EGP but it does have the show info and universal remote.
It also lists a table of the codes used to control the box. They are NEC.
If that remote ran an Artec....well...cool.
I can't find the box anywhere.

NEC Format (Carrier frequency=38KHz)
Custom Code: 01FE
FUNCTION KEY DATA FUNCTION KEY DATA FUNCTION KEY DATA
BOX POWER 00H - 19H DOWN 16H
MUTE 03H 0 0EH LEFT 14H
1 01H GUIDE 1AH RIGHT 17H
2 02H VOL + 18H MENU 0CH
3 06H VOL - 10H EXIT 0FH
4 04H CAPTION 1EH INFO 47H
5 05H FLASHBK 0DH AUDIO 41H
6 07H CH UP 13H RATIO 42H
7 08H CH DOWN 11H SIGNAL 1DH
8 0AH UP 15H
9 0BH ENTER 12H

Take a look. It may help us find a U-remote for the Artec.

http://www.ezdigitaltv.com/DAYTEK_CAX-03.html

Code table (for the box) is on page 20:
Codes for other devices are on page 21...etc.

http://www.ezdigitaltv.com/support-files/cax_o1_cax_03_cax_04_user_manual.pdf

Floydage

08-16-09, 04:41 PM

The tuner issue sounds similar to the Zinwells; 950As have a MicroTune silicon chip (i.e. LG) and 970As have that Samsung aluminum can tuner. The chip is 'theoretically' better but I think the can has 1 dB better (lower) noise figure. I have both Zinwells and couldn't tell much difference, seemd like one was better at UHF while the other was better at VHF, but overall both good.

The can tuners will be more susceptible to mfg process variation (one day built good, the next day not as good - luck of the draw!). One of my can Zinwells loses synthesizer lock, I've determined it to be sensitive to antenna input impedance (loosen antenna connector and jiggle it); it won't snap out of it unless the channel is reset (none of my other boxes have this problem). Anyone think I have any hope of warranty support on an obscure problem like this?

Hey, how many days is the EPG on that T3AP?

Yankee495

08-17-09, 06:00 AM

Hey, how many days is the EPG on that T3AP?

I have not seen days. It depends what the station sends. Some channels are 6 hours and others more.

The pic I posted of it shows 16 programs, I didn't count the hours.

Here is the pic:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=150016&d=1250207509

Floydage

08-17-09, 06:40 PM

I have not seen days. It depends what the station sends. Some channels are 6 hours and others more.

The pic I posted of it shows 16 programs, I didn't count the hours.

Here is the pic:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=150016&d=1250207509

Thanks, Yankee. I thought the "1/16" in the upper right corner might have been a page ref for multiple days. I like the outline format coupled with the ability to get individual show details.

Yankee495

08-18-09, 01:41 PM

Floydage

08-18-09, 02:41 PM

OK, I'm in. Just ordered one of the 'Pro-less' LLs for absolutely free from www.freetvsignal.com . The extra 10 bucks for the Pro was tempting since it has CH/VOL buttons and a set of A/V cables (how cheap Q though?) but not knowing the tuner type swayed my choice.

I jumped on it after I discovered it ran off 12V DC. My neighbor just gave me a portable 5" analog LCD that comes with a cig lighter adapter so I was trying to piece together a camping setup for my van (stationary). I did a little research based on the mfger's website http://www.artectv.com/ehtm/products/t3ap.htm :

1) Both the regular and Pro use only 4.5W max, excellent for portable apps.
2) The TVGOS version (T3APR-T) uses 7W max; must be an added chip for that function.
3) They DON"T specify them for automotive use so I would suggest NOT leaving it plugged in while the engine is running (13.6V+tolerance &noise with alternator spinning unless your car has a fancy 12V auxilliary device regulator).

Thanks to everyone, esp Yankee for the review and Ron for the vendor link.

Floydage

08-18-09, 02:55 PM

I have 2 new T3AP-LL's. Both are not getting 12-2. Both were.
I also have a Zinwell which does get it so it is broadcasting.

The LL's are showing no signal and it does not beep yet the meter is showing a very strong signal.

It does ID the channel and it does show the guide, with good signal but says no signal.

They have no picture.

I tried factory default. I scanned with no antenna and again with antenna.

It picks up the channel and adds it to the list but no picture.

I can't believe both boxes are broken unless it is a defect.

As I said, they are both new. One used for about a week and the other for 30 mins to test and make sure it worked ok.

I sure could use some help on this one!

It almost sounds like it's keeping old info in memory even though the signal may be too weak for it to properly pick up. You might try deleting whatever you can find about that channel (main and subs) and starting over. Wish I could help more but I don't have an Artec yet.

Those Zinwells are sneaky if a station changed something on you. I had a station change but my Zinwell still displayed the new station on the old virtual channel.

bluesloth

08-18-09, 02:56 PM

Both of my ArtecT3AP-LL's are:
T3AP-LL received August 09
Serial ##############
073-0000-V12G02
System Version = 2.1.1B
Has extended program guide.

I have not taken it apart but I assume it is like ron350's Aug 09 LL.

I bought a Artec T3AP-LL from Meritline last week, and have taken it apart (you just have to take off the two footpads at the front of the box to get to 2 screws, and pop the top off. It has an LG-Tuner inside.

Here's a photo of the circuit board if anyone is interested.
http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/9700/tr3apboardsmall.jpg

Yankee495

08-18-09, 02:57 PM

Thanks to everyone, esp Yankee for the review and Ron for the vendor link.

Thank you!

I believe my problem may be the station. We had a severe storm a couple of months ago that took down this stations tower and destroyed the building(tower fell into the studio and a house! Not a pretty site)! They were off air for over a month!

http://www.wirelessestimator.com/wifi/images/uploads/KSNF_TV_Tower_Collapse.jpg

They are using a sub channel of KODE 12 (12.1). It is KSNF 16 (12.2). They are getting their own channel going...I am getting it...16.1

I just can't figure out why the Zinwell gets 12.2 and both Artecs do not...they did get it just fine. I'm thinki9ng about calling the station and ask them if they are doing something. I just need to know if it is the Box (The zinwell working worries me).

Any help would be appreciated!

And Floydage, you're gonna love the LL's! (if this is not a defect!)

Yankee495

08-18-09, 03:03 PM

Those Zinwells are sneaky if a station changed something on you. I had a station change but my Zinwell still displayed the new station on the old virtual channel.

The LL has 3/4 signal but says no signal. You know....I didn't delete it from the Zinwell and try to get it back! Bingo, maybe?

Also see above about tower going down....I bet they are doing something and the Zinwell is still showing it....will report back...

It can't be my beloved Artecs!

Yankee495

08-18-09, 03:07 PM

Great Pic Bluesloth! All we need now is someone to wire up that 3 pin data port so we can screw'em all up!!!

Hahaha...

Yankee495

08-18-09, 03:15 PM

Floydage,

I was leaning toward some genius at the station. Now Zinwell has no sound. A rescan brought it back the same way, no sound.

Whew! I was worried for a minute!

And, I almost plugged the Artec power supply into the Zinwell! I don't think that would be a go! 12v into a 5v box...you guys watch out for that!

Yankee495

08-18-09, 03:40 PM

OK, the station has a picture on the Zinwell and no sound. It had color bars for about 10 secs and then no pic and then pic and no sound!

You can all relax now....it is not the LL's

Yankee495

08-18-09, 04:10 PM

I just check out freetvsignal and they list the LL as having an LG tuner. Meritline doesn't.

Also they list the specs as "3-4 channel switch x1", which it doesn't have a switch, it is in the menu which I like!

juddev

08-18-09, 10:26 PM

I cant seem to find a code on my ReplayTv 5040 that will change the T3A Pro channels.
Does anyone here have a ReplayTv working with the Pro box?
Thanks

Yankee495

08-18-09, 10:58 PM

I cant seem to find a code on my ReplayTv 5040 that will change the T3A Pro channels.
Does anyone here have a ReplayTv working with the Pro box?
Thanks

I tried a universal remote...it was a no go all the way.

The remote will power off a zinwell, but that is it.

juddev

08-18-09, 11:21 PM

I am sure the answer is the same for both, but I mean so the replaytv can tune in a channel for automatic recording.

What brand box works best with replayTv?

Thanks, I really miss automatic recording...

Floydage

08-19-09, 02:30 PM

I bought a Artec T3AP-LL from Meritline last week, and have taken it apart (you just have to take off the two footpads at the front of the box to get to 2 screws, and pop the top off. It has an LG-Tuner inside.

Here's a photo of the circuit board if anyone is interested.

Thanks and nice pic! You just voided your warranty but I won't tell. LOL

That's the same tuner listed for the Zenith/Insignia boxes, supposed to receive pretty good from what I've read. LG Decoder IC the same too (med pic Q per Consumer Reports).

Floydage

08-19-09, 02:41 PM

[QUOTE=Yankee495;17020907]http://www.wirelessestimator.com/wifi/images/uploads/KSNF_TV_Tower_Collapse.jpgQUOTE]

Ouch! Those things are horrendous when they come down, good thing most are out in the sticks. Guy wires are real killers when they snap too.

Good point on the DC connectors as I suspect it's a pretty common component. Ironically I was just looking at those for my 'RV' setup. I wish I knew what type it's called, was trying to explain to a friend over the phone (works for an auto electronics dist.).

Yankee495

08-19-09, 03:50 PM

Floydage

08-19-09, 06:32 PM

DC cable:

If you have a thrift store around go there! They have all kinds of power supplies (wall warts) and you can just find a plug that fits and cut the cord off!

I get them all the time for 50 cents!

We have a salvation army thrift store...they have a couple of boxes full...

WATCH THE POLARITY!

Good idea - thanks! Come to think of it I probably have a thrift store of this kind of stuff in my spare bed (storage) rooms; but hard to get myself to cut one up, never know if it belongs to something I'll need someday. 50c sounds better. Can also get a variety of voltage sizes to complete sort of a makeshift variable power supply set.

WeThePeople

08-20-09, 10:57 AM

I chose to get a couple of free boxes (with free S&H).
These are the folks that topped Google, so I tried them.
I ordered these two, and they arrived just fine, and free!

*** See model-specific AVSForum threads for info ***

Craig - CVD-508 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1172673)

Artec (Ultima, Jiangsu) - T3AP-LL (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=17032402#post17032402) (LG Tuner)

Note:

They put the two display boxes in a FedEx envelope bare,
they DID NOT provide the display boxes external boxing !
It wasn't even a "Bubble-Wrap" style envelope !

************************************************************
Free-TV Signal -AKA- Cerebral CorTech

Home:
https://secure.freetvsignal.com/index.php

All CECB's:
https://secure.freetvsignal.com/viewAll.php

Website Feedback:
admin@freetvsignal.com

Cerebral CorTech
Mark Bymaster
1718 Corporate Dr
Boynton Beach, FL 33426
561-572-2164
M-F 10A-5P Eastern
CerebralCorTech@gmail.com

************************************************************
Artec (Ultima, Jiangsu) - T3AP-LL (LL = LG Tuner)

External Product Information:

Model Sticker:
Ultima Electronics Corp.
Digital-to-Analog
Converter Box
Model No.: T3AP-LL
Input: 12V 0.5A
Made In China 18E-0012-V52G01

UPC Bargraph Sticker:
Serial: V1201W092500**** (Last four omitted for privacy)
Other: 073-0000-V12G02

Wall-Wart Sticker:
(Transformerless Switching-Mode Type)
DVE Switching Adapter
Model: DSA-9W-15 FUS 120050
Input: 100-240V ~ 50/60Hz 0.3A
Output: +12V = 0.5A
Level 3
I.T.E L.P.S
81GJ
E135856
Made In China

************************************************************
Notes:

Mobile-Friendly:
This unit is negative ground :)
(Some China TV's are POSITIVE ground, ALWAYS measure !!!)
16.31-Milliamp @ 11.98-VDC (0.19-W) - Standby (Wall-Wart)
223.8-Milliamp @ 11.93-VDC (2.66-W) - Running (Wall-Wart)
(231.6-Milliamp max while booting from flash boot sector)

The collor is negative,
and chassis ground.

The pin (Or center) is Positive 12-VDC.

Disassembly:
The bottom has four self-adhesive feet.
Remove just the FRONT TWO to reveal screws.
These two screws also pass through the PCB.
They chose to not use the rear tuner screw.

Tuner:
This LG design uses standard .010" spaced pins to connect.
Two shield mounts AND 16 (5+11) PINS MUST BE unsoldered...
If you do not own/use professional desoldering equipment,
DO NOT ATTEMPT THIS !!! (See pictures for fragile nature)

Worst Switch EVER (WSE):
Just look at the "Switch" pic, you won't belive it...

Back Panel Data Jack:
Three pins, #1 is farthest from tuner (Square solder pad)

#1 = TBA
#2 = TBA
#3 = Chassis Ground (Also 12-VDC supply Ground)

************************************************************

PCB Solder Side Numbers:

RU HT-D
94V-OE318580

************************************************************
PCB Component Side Numbers:

Note:
Sticker on Flash-RAM (Front edge) is the "System Version".
V2.11B (White Paper Sticker) = "System Version 2.1.1B"
Menu >>> Option >>> Accessory >>> Listed in right pane ...

SOC (System-On-a-Chip):
LG Electronics
LGDT1111T
0907
PB5201.00B

Info:
Sixth generation IC
ARM926EJ-STM host controller Processor core clocked at 200-Mhz
Built-in video scaling
Onboard Java bytecode accelerator
Integrated VSB and QAM demodulator
MPEG-2 MP@HL Video decoder
Dolby AC-3 audio decoder
Video format converter
NTSC video encoder
2D graphic processor
Two onboard UART's
system decoder
Include the uCOS-II RTOS
outputs for digital & Analog RGB, and CVBS with Stereo Audio
Memory interface = DDR : 256Mbit, 16bit I/F@175/200MHz
Memory interface = Flash 8bit only NOR for ARM Program
I2C (Master/Slave)x2
I2C (Master)x1 for Tuner
GPIOx8 for IR or Keypad
Power Consumption = 1.6-A @ 5-V

Reference Links:
http://www.fortetw.com/en/Product_d2a.htm

http://mvptek.koreasme.com/en/product/product_03.html

http://www.smi888.com/English/DZGXe-2.html

Used In:
Artec - T3AP = LGDT1111D
Artec - T3AP-LL = LGDT1111T
Artec - T3AP-LS = LGDT1111?
Artec - T3AP Pro = LGDT1111D
Casti - CAX-02 = LGDT1111D
Coship - N9900T = LGDT1111?
Daewoo - DAC-100 = LGDT1111C
Daewoo - DAC-200 = LGDT1111?
Daewoo - DAC-300 = LGDT1111?
Daytek - CAX-01 = LGDT1111D
Digital Stream - DSP-7500T = LGDT1111D
Digital Stream - DTX-9900 = LGDT1111D
Digital Stream - DTX-9950 = LGDT1111T
Insignia - LSX300-4DM = LGDT1111?
Insignia - NS-DXA1 = LGDT1111D
Insignia - NS-DXA1-APT = LGDT1111T
Jiuzhou - DTT6000 = LGDT1111?
Jiuzhou - DTT9001 = LGDT1111?
Microprose - MPI-500 = LGDT1111D
Microprose - MPI-500 = LGDT1111D
RCA - STB7766G1 = LGDT1111D
TRT - TACB-1009 = LGDT1111D
Venturer - STB7766G = LGDT1111D
Zenith - DTT-900 = LGDT1111D
Zenith - DTT-901 = LGDT1111T
(PM me with any corrections/updates please, WeThePeople)

RAM Memory:
Nanya 0913
NT5DS16M16CS-5T
84909600AP 3 TW

Info:
256-MB DDR RAM

Flash Memory:
EON
EN29LV160AT-70TCP
(IC has "Red" dot on it)

Info:
EON Silicon Solution, Inc.
16-Megabit Flash Memory
(2048K x 8-bit / 1024K x 16-bit)
With Boot Sector, CMOS 3.0-Volt

************************************************************

LG Innotek Tuner Housing Sticker (Green):
TDVG-H152F
.808A27110

Info:
?
(I have several E-Mail's out to LG developers requesting a PDF Datasheet)

Reference Links:
http://www.lginnotek.com/bin/product/cate_func_model_list.html

Tuner Numbers - Component Side:
5-Pin Inline Part (Plastic Package - Inside Tuner):
X6764X
EPCOS 6321 JZW7

Info:
The Epcos X6764N is a SAW (Surface Acoustic Wave) type of
bandpass IF filter for ATSC use dated 06-14-06.
Stands to reason the X6764X is just a newer version.
Here is the PDF specification sheet for the older X6764N

Reference Links:
http://www.epcos.com/inf/40/ds/mm/X6764N.pdf

2-Pin Inline Part - Crystal (Metal Can):
JY4M0827

Info:
Crystal for TI SN761668 tuner IC below

Component Numbers - Solder Side:
44-Pin DIP Surface Mount IC:

Texas Instrument Logo
87D4HETG4 (G4 Is underlined)
SN761668

Info:
The SN761668 is a low-phase-noise synthesized tuner IC.

Reference Links:
http://focus.ti.com/docs/prod/folders/print/sn761668.html

http://focus.ti.com/general/docs/lit/getliterature.tsp?genericPartNumber=sn761668&fileType=pdf

16-Pin DIP Surface Mount IC:
1372G
831
AH

Info:
Toshiba TSSOP16-Package
Most likely an RF-Modulator / APT-Switch...

************************************************************
Google Info:

Google Search - Ultima.Electronics.Corp
(The "Periods" force terms to be adjacent to each other)
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&num=100&newwindow=1&q=%2BArtec+%2BJiangsu&btnG=Search

Google Search - +Artec +Jiangsu
(The "Plus" symbols force each term into the results)
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&num=100&newwindow=1&q=%2BArtec+%2BJiangsu&btnG=Search

Google Search - +Ultima +Artec +Jiangsu
(The "Plus" symbols force each term into the results)
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&num=100&newwindow=1&q=%2BUltima+%2BArtec+%2BJiangsu&btnG=Search

Alternate Found:
Ultima Electronics Corporation
6F, NO.100, LI-DE ST.
CHUNG-HO CITY
TAIPEI HSIEN
TAIWAN, R.O.C. 235
KC Wang - Owner
886-(0)2-2225-6300 - Tel
886-(0)2-2225-2674 - Fax

************************************************************

Artec - T3AP Pro 5-Button Wiring Info:

For T3AP-LS (Sanyo tuner) ans T3AP-LL (LG tuner) the following is correct
Pin #1 is FARTHEST from the tuner / closest to LEFT side of equipment

For the T3AP Pro modelthe following is correct
Pin #1 is NEAREST to the tuner / FARTHEST from LEFT side of equipment

Determine which last pin/pad is chassis ground and Pin-7 as confirmation

1 - +3.28-VDC (Measured) for four function buttons (Vol Up/Dn, Ch Up/Dn)
2 - Power on - Switch goes from Pin-2 to Pin-7 chassis ground (Tuner casing...)
3 - Channel Up - Pin-3 To Pin-1
4 - Channel Down - Pin-4 To Pin-1
5 - Volume Down - Pin-5 To Pin-1
6 - Volume Up - Pin-5 To Pin-1
7 - Chassis ground, and ground for two jack support solder pads also

See NTSC's Post #236 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=17045830&postcount=236) for additional details & pics
This is what the T3AP-LL looks like without the surface mount style 7-Pin connector:
Ron350 confirms (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=17049154&postcount=239) earlier LS/LL units were populated with the surface mount 7-Pin male jack.
14 Artec - T3AP-LL - Button Pinout Info 1 (http://i27.tinypic.com/353doy9.jpg)
http://i27.tinypic.com/353doy9.jpg

Additional T3AP-LL info for my unit for additional reference.
Ron350 confirms (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=17049154&postcount=239) his T3AP-LS (Sanyo tuner) unit is wired the same.
15 Artec - T3AP-LL - Button Pinout Info 2 (http://i25.tinypic.com/2evra8k.jpg)
http://i25.tinypic.com/2evra8k.jpg

Here is the result combining NTSC (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=17045830&postcount=235)'s and Ron350 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=17049154&postcount=239)'s data with mine.
Credit goes to NTSC for the schematic drawing, I just annotated it...
16 Artec - T3AP-xxx - 5-Button Schematic (http://i30.tinypic.com/j9q692.jpg)
http://i30.tinypic.com/j9q692.jpg

The Pro is different than the LS/LL models,
note the oval metal can (Quartz Crystal for SoC) as reference
17 Artec - T3AP-Pro To T3AP-LL Comparison (http://i29.tinypic.com/30sc0bd.jpg)
http://i29.tinypic.com/30sc0bd.jpg

************************************************************

Artec.com.tw Contact Info:

Artec Headquarters:
Ultima Electronics Corporation
7F, No.100, Li De Street
Chung Ho City
Taipei, Taiwan R.O.C 235
886-(0)2-2225-8998 - Tel
886-(0)2-2225-2674 - Fax
info@ultima.com.tw - Sales & Marketing
service@ultima.com.tw - Customer Service
http://www.artectv.com

USA:
Artec Digital
39901 Eureka Dr.
Newark, CA 94560
510-897-8900 - Sales
510-897-8901 - Customer Service
510-897-8902 - Customer Service + Sales
info@ultima.com.tw - Sales
service@ultima.com.tw - Customer Service

Europe:
Ultima Electronic B.V.
Antennestraat 76
1322AS Almere, NL
31-653-179-698 - Tel
31-363-632-023 - Fax
sales@artec-europe.com - Sales
http://www.artec.com.tw - Web

Factory:
Artec Electronics (Jiangsu) Co., Ltd.
No.1057, Yun Li Road
Songling Town
Wujiang City 215200
Jiangsu, P.R.C.
86-512-6340-1988 - Tel
86-512-6340-2991 - Fax

************************************************************
Links:

"Ultima Electronic Corp. was founded in 1983 in Tu-cheng"
http://www.artectv.com/
http://www.artec.com.tw/

T3AP-LS (Sanyo Tuner), T3AP-LL (LG Tuner)
http://www.artec.com.tw/ehtm/products/t3ap.htm

T3APR-T (TVGOS-Able)
http://www.artec.com.tw/ehtm/products/t3aprt.htm

T3AP Pro
http://www.artec.com.tw/ehtm/products/t3appro.htm

************************************************************
AVS attachments:

150559
150560
150561
150562
150563
06 150565 Artec - T3AP-LL - Connection Options
07 150566 Artec - T3AP-LL - Transformerless Wall-Wart
08 150567 Artec - T3AP-LL - PCB Component Side
09 150568 Artec - T3AP-LL - PCB Solder Side
10 150569 Artec - T3AP-LL - LG-Tuner Component Side
11 150576 Artec - T3AP-LL - LG-Tuner Solder Side
12 150577 Artec - T3AP-LL - LG-Tuner ID Sticker
13 150578 Artec - T3AP-LL - WORST SWITCH EVER !!!

06-13 work properly, but AVS didn't parse attachment names correctly..

************************************************************

TinyPic.com posted pics:

http://TinyPic.com/WeThePeople

01 Artec - T3AP-LL - Display Box Front (http://i31.tinypic.com/242c1oj.jpg)
http://i31.tinypic.com/242c1oj.jpg

02 Artec - T3AP-LL - Display Box Back (http://i26.tinypic.com/9an7yv.jpg)
http://i26.tinypic.com/9an7yv.jpg

03 Artec - T3AP-LL - Display Box Features (http://i25.tinypic.com/28takg1.jpg)
http://i25.tinypic.com/28takg1.jpg

04 Artec - T3AP-LL - Flimsy Packaging (http://i26.tinypic.com/ru2r9c.jpg)
http://i26.tinypic.com/ru2r9c.jpg

05 Artec - T3AP-LL - Flimsy Remote (http://i30.tinypic.com/2pt3rx5.jpg)
http://i30.tinypic.com/2pt3rx5.jpg

06 Artec - T3AP-LL - Connection Options (http://i31.tinypic.com/152ji1h.jpg)
http://i31.tinypic.com/152ji1h.jpg

07 Artec - T3AP-LL - Transformerless Wall-Wart (http://i29.tinypic.com/2jevl1x.jpg)
http://i29.tinypic.com/2jevl1x.jpg

08 Artec - T3AP-LL - PCB Component Side (http://i28.tinypic.com/28lrl7t.jpg)
http://i28.tinypic.com/28lrl7t.jpg

09 Artec - T3AP-LL - PCB Solder Side (http://i31.tinypic.com/30mxsfb.jpg)
http://i31.tinypic.com/30mxsfb.jpg
Notice the really bad flux wash ???

10 Artec - T3AP-LL - LG-Tuner Component Side (http://i29.tinypic.com/2utkk6o.jpg)
http://i29.tinypic.com/2utkk6o.jpg

11 Artec - T3AP-LL - LG-Tuner Solder Side (http://i29.tinypic.com/rcvxps.jpg)
http://i29.tinypic.com/rcvxps.jpg

12 Artec - T3AP-LL - LG-Tuner ID Sticker (http://i32.tinypic.com/4j3l7r.jpg)
http://i32.tinypic.com/4j3l7r.jpg

13 Artec - T3AP-LL - WORST SWITCH EVER (http://i30.tinypic.com/2v8q2b4.jpg) !!!
http://i30.tinypic.com/2v8q2b4.jpg
Later, acronym'd WSE by a AVR poster.
After seeing the "Pro" PCB buttons insert,
I now see why this hack became a reality...

arxaw

08-20-09, 11:27 AM

You can post unlimited pics at http://www.tinypic.com
They even provide the code for your forum posts.
No registration needed.

ron350

08-20-09, 12:51 PM

Do you think vent holes voids the warranty? LOL
http://img29.imageshack.us/img29/4205/rocks003a.jpg

http://img29.imageshack.us/img29/3672/artecvents004a.jpg

Floydage

08-20-09, 01:29 PM

150576
150577
150578

You're hired - nice! Reminds me of when we dissected competitor products at my last job. We had the first product out so I didn't feel too bad about it.

Based on that switch design, maybe it's a good thing I didn't spend the extra money for the Pro (CH/VOL buttons); but then again I have to rely on that flimsy remote. LOL

I see the SOC power consumption equates to 8W. They must be running it at a lower consumption mode (lower supply voltage, duty cycle, etc.) and/or not using all of the functions. I take it the D and T suffixes describe different IC package types.

Thumbs up or thumbs down on the Craig? I can't find a thread on it performing a "Google Search AVS." The brand gives me visions of drug store cheap stuff (but hey, I read here that Zinwells were once sold in Albertsons!).

Floydage

08-20-09, 01:42 PM

Do you think vent holes voids the warranty? LOL

Should extend the warranty IMO. ;)
Holes on top look OEM - nice drill press work!

I wonder if a small heatsink can be thermal-glued to the top of the SOCs of these boxes? Might get in the way of the WSE (Worst Switch Ever) on these Artecs though.

Despite the distaste for wall-warts, they do remote power supply heat from the box.

Yankee495

08-20-09, 04:35 PM

It looks like it has a place to mount another switch...to the right of the firmware sticker...

But not enough to be the same board as a pro...

It also looks like straight back from the data port there is possibly a ribbon cable that could be added..maybe these are for the channel/volume switches...

Yankee495

08-20-09, 04:38 PM

Found a firmware bug.

Hit freeze. Leave it there for one minute. It will start motion video again but leave the "freeze" info up. Hit freeze again and it will freeze but the "freeze" will go away.

Hitting EPG blackes out all channels...with "no signal"....even if you exit.

It comes back in about 1 minute and is ok...

Yankee495

08-20-09, 04:43 PM

Hey Floydage,

Ole ron350 can put a switch anywhere he wants! Gotta enough holes!

Use the big hole for a fan, and put a small switch somewhere else!

Hahaha

No, really...looks nice...factory should've done that or something like that.

Mines runs pretty cool...Sunkeys run hot!

But you guys are right....heat is the enemy.

ron350

08-20-09, 04:48 PM

Floydage the plastic box and the switch arm just snap together so you can take the switch arm out and have extra room and an extra cooling hole.

Yankee495

See post number 145 for a picture of the older LL board and you can see what they left off.

Yankee495

08-20-09, 04:54 PM

It is a switch & connector...what for? Anyone push that button?

ron350

08-20-09, 05:06 PM

That missing switch acted like a reset button when pushed?
The box would blip off the back on just like you had pushed the power button twice. As far as I can tell no settings change when that button is pushed.
The Freeze feature only lasts for 1 minute even on the LS box.

Floydage

08-20-09, 06:08 PM

Indeed, #145 shows a cable connector and switch in the aforementioned optional spots. Might be a tiny LED in the 3rd open spot just NE of the RCA connector (bluesloth's LL pic). Maybe #145 is a Pro or older version with CH/VOL buttons?

Cool, has a Freeze function.

I doubt the code is thoroughly tested on CECBs. Can be pretty extensive, think of all the permutations.

Floydage

08-20-09, 06:12 PM

Darn, you just missed the free fancy $9.99 antenna with every Craig 508 purchase (today).

Yankee495

08-20-09, 06:53 PM

I'm thinking these LL's are just missing the cable and buttons for ch/vol.

A guy could very easily mount buttons in the case, cheaply too...

Some times I sit on the foot stool and flip channels on my sat STB. Remote is half a room away. Buttons would be nice...

Yankee495

08-20-09, 07:05 PM

We NEED to see the inside of a Pro.

NTSC

08-20-09, 07:05 PM

The 7 pin cable connector's definitely for the "Pro's" buttons. Here's a pict of my T3AP Pro. (w/Sanyo tuner.)

http://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd5/kenrap/switches.jpg

Yankee495

08-20-09, 07:07 PM

Now that is what I call fast service!
Looks like we have a useful mod here!

Yankee495

08-20-09, 07:20 PM

NTSC, Satpro posted this pic of a Pro in post #61 (5-06-08)(Old box)

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=109637&d=1210111029

Look at the power connector and the RCA jack block. No space between them.

Look at yours, looks like S-video maybe?

Neither have the reset switch, I guess we'll call it that.

I'll bet channel buttons can be made to work.

Yankee495

08-20-09, 07:34 PM

Some fancy buttons for ron350 to fill up holes with!!!!

http://www.apem.com/pushbutton.html

NTSC

08-20-09, 07:39 PM

And here's the switch side of the board. Wire tracing doesn’t look too difficult. There's a couple of surface mount components to contend with, one resistor (which is probably just a 0 ohm jumper), and two SMCs marked CB1 and CB2. Perhaps capacitors.

That space may be for an S-video jack, I'm not sure. I'd have open it back up to look. Fact is, I only had it open for a few minutes and I didn't notice those open pads until I looked at my pictures. LOL

I WILL open it back up though. (I'll try to find time tonight, if not, then tomorrow.)

http://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd5/kenrap/switchboard.jpg

Yankee495

08-20-09, 07:49 PM

We sure appreciate your help NTSC!

We don't have to have buttons, but if we can, we want to just because we can....

Yeah...we're a little mental..

Also, if you look at these newer LL's, there is a space there but it is not pads like yours. The old 08 box had no space!

ron350

08-20-09, 08:08 PM

NTSC thanks for the pictures.

That circuit board is a good bit different from my T3AP-LL and LS boxes that have the 7 pin white plug on the board.

How is the picture quality on your PRO box?

Yankee495

08-21-09, 10:49 AM

Ok, this 3 pin data port. I read a post somewhere that says one of the pins is +5 volt. If it was USB it would need:

+5 Volts
- Data
+ Data
- Ground

4 pins. The Zinwell has a 4 pin port inside it (one is +5 volt).
You can see the Zinwell board labeled RS-232, tx/rx/gnd/5v next to the tuner.
If they are TTL level then you need a TTL to RS-232 converter.

http://www.virtualvillage.com/1000m-600bps-rs232-to-ttl-converter/sku003602-008?utm_source=googlebase&utm_medium=shcomp&utm_campaign=1000m%20600bps%20RS232%20to%20TTL%20Converter#

With 3 pins the 5 volts could power the converter board (not the box), but then you just have Tx/Rx and no ground or anything...

Any ideas what these 3 pins are?

pm3839

08-21-09, 11:26 AM

Thank you! I believe my problem may be the station. .....I just can't figure out why the Zinwell gets 12.2 and both Artecs do not...they did get it just fine. I'm thinki9ng about calling the station and ask them if they are doing something. I just need to know if it is the Box (The zinwell working worries me). Any help would be appreciated!

its probably not your box....i had a somwhat similar problem a few months ago....for several days my local pbs station had audio but no video on my ARTEC but it was ok on my TR40 aka DTVPal....i re-scanned all channels, same problem....i even did a FACTORY DEFAULT on the ARTEC and re-did everything, same problem with that one station....

and others in my area reported just the opposite for the same station during that time period ....they had video but no audio....very weird, i know....

a few days later it was fixed and has been ok ever since then....all this digital stuff is still being de-bugged at the stations, i think....

Yankee495

08-21-09, 11:39 AM

pm3839,

Yes, mine did the exact same thing.

It was the station. No video & no sound, showing no signal, but it was strong on the meter.

Then video and no sound. Station ran on their sister channel that they has sound problems.

Zinwell lost sound.

But, at one time the Zinwell had it just fine and both Artecs didn't.

It's all good now!

Yankee495

08-21-09, 11:48 AM

Ok, from the back of the Artec pin one (far left)(123) shows as a common ground to the RCA & coax grounds. Zero resistance with a meter.

Pins 2 and 3 both show 3.30 volts using RCA or coax connecter ground.

Here is a simple RS232 null modem setup without handshaking, using 3 wires.

http://www.efarmoges.gr/site/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=110%3Ars232-details&catid=53%3Akarel-cables&Itemid=77&lang=en

Also look at the next one down, with loop back handshaking, also 3 wires. The loop back handshaking may be needed to let the computer/box know that there is a connection. Pins 1 and 4 are data carrier detect(1) and data terminal ready(4). See top diagram on link for pinout.

What about that 3.30 volts?

Floydage

08-21-09, 01:17 PM

Definitely a different PCB. Funny how they cut through the mounting holes like they oopsed on the dimensions (maybe an earlier version).

Switch PCB: RN is Resistor Network (IC pkg of Rs in various configs). D is Diode. CB, hmmm, Capacitor Bypass (noise filter) and/or for debouncing (ex: Channel Masters jump too many channels when pressed > design flaw). Odd a simple circuit like this has optional circuitry. Hope the switch code is in and/or activated on the non-switch boxes.

3.3V is a common logic level, I suspect the lines are 'pulled up' with high value Rs (current sources for the data signals).

Yankee495

08-21-09, 03:31 PM

My LL has no upgrade firmware in the menus. If we did get the data port working I see no way to load firmware.

But, the Tivax guys are doing all kinds of things like changing channels and volume...everything the remote can do.

Some people would want this for recording, unlimited event timers by PC.

I have a Polaroid DVR with 80 GB HD and DVD burner built in. It don't have a ATSC tuner but it has A/V, componet and svideo inputs.

I paid $200 three years ago, knowing I'd be plugging it into a sat/converter STB. It's hooked up to sat now. The burner is nice!

NTSC

08-21-09, 04:26 PM

NTSC thanks for the pictures.

How is the picture quality on your PRO box?

Picture quality is about the same as any of the better boxes I own. (As long as you’re not using s-video.) It's at least as good as any Apex or Tivax I've used.

NTSC

08-21-09, 04:27 PM

OK. I had a chance to re-open the T3AP Pro and get a good look at the pads for that missing connector. Unfortunately, it's not for an s-video connector, it's for a smart antenna connector. But don't go getting all excited, just filling the space with the proper connector won’t be enough. You'd still need that feature added to or enabled in firmware. (And it may still be missing some other small support components.) - Oh well, it WOULD have made the perfect converter for RV enthusiasts.

Also, this T3AP Pro's firmware version is 1.0.4B and does not exhibit any signs of the "freeze" firmware bug that Yankee495 found.

Yankee495

08-21-09, 04:44 PM

I had to get a new phone. I froze it to write down a phone # and that is how I found it.

Ah, smart antenna connector.

If they'd have just put this stuff in there it would be pretty close to the best!

The EPG should scroll out the bottom and back in the top...roll over you know.

Hitting OK in EPG should go to that channel and not need to hit exit...

Meter should have #'s.

Changing channels should pop up the info banner with the channel, time, show....just for a sec or two, instead of just channel.

Volume should move a little faster...have to hold it a long time to go from 100 to 75....

ron350

08-21-09, 11:12 PM

Yep it would be nice to have a faster response on the volume control for the Artec and the Zenith.

pm3839

08-22-09, 03:07 AM

WeThePeople

08-22-09, 04:10 AM

Yankee495

08-22-09, 12:24 PM

Yankee,
I am unable to reproduce the freeze problem on mine as stated in #204 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=17034779&postcount=204).
I am just posting this for comparison for you and others to track the "Bug"
You can find my firmware version and stuff at post #198 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=17032402#post17032402)

We have the same FW version.

Hit freeze...let it sit until it goes by itself.

You will have motion video and "FREEZE" on the screen.

Hit freeze again ,and freeze goes away but the motion stops.

Hit guide...

All channels will say no signal even though the meter shows a strong signal.

How many can reproduce this?

ron350

08-22-09, 12:38 PM

Yep even my old T3AP-LS box does that to.
I was not following your directions correctly.

Yankee495

08-22-09, 12:42 PM

one of the very good things about the ARTEC is how it handles channel #'s that were never scanned or ever found previously....u can enter any rf channel number (without going to any special menu first) and it will display it...this is great for dx'ing or checking channels (or sub-channels) that have been deleted from the memory....

if u try this with most other converters/tuners u will get an INVALID CHANNEL message....

the video FREEEZE FRAME is nice also....i use that a lot.....

every converter should have these features....they would add almost no cost to the unit so why not?

one glaring omission of the ARTEC is not displaying the program name/info when u change channels....not having that makes no sense....seems like a major oversight of a simple yet very useful function....u cant have everything, i guess....

but overall this is a very good unit at a great price....often found free after coupon....

I went to tvfool and got a chart of channels in my area. 41.1 was MIA! It was supposed to be strong enough for me to get, but nothing.

I was using a Zinwell...I got my artec and all I had to do to check it was punch in 41 (it is actually on 41 too). One day there it was! It had not been on the air yet! Very handy. And yes I checked...the Zinwell gets it too...it was not broadcasting.

And the Zinwell does pop up the show, time, channel, and signal when you change channels. I have a satellite receiver that does this too. Awsome feature. On the sat receiver it is called the dashboard.

Artec needs to hire us as consultants...We don't have to be real smart...just be able to spell a little bit with some common sense!

Like "Aspect ratio cannot be changed in this channel". It should be "The aspect ratio cannot be changed on this channel".

Speaking of MIA I will be till Sunday...It's my bday (dougs bday too) and were gonna throw a party! 20x20 foot big screen outside in a field (our redneck drive-in theater), live band, and lots of beer & food! Lots of country boys, with a few city folks thrown in for the fun of it!

Anyone near Joplin Missouri msg for directions!

NTSC

08-22-09, 07:19 PM

I circuit traced the wiring for the 5 switches on my T3AP Pro. I kept the wiring diagram as simple as possible. The switches are all momentary type push buttons. The capacitor in the schematic has a value of 0.1 uF. (A small ceramic disk capacitor will do nicely.) The schematic is accurate, but you'll need to determine its proper orientation, as some Artec boxes have the 1-7 pads/pins reversed.

http://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd5/kenrap/schematic.jpg

Wire #7 of the schematic above must go to the pad or pin on your board that goes to ground. This pad/pin will either be the one closest to the tuner case, or it will the one furthest from the tuner case. (So far, for most people it's the one furthest from the tuner case.)

With the box unplugged, and using a digital ohm meter (not analog), probe the two pads or pins at each end of the connector. When you've found the one that reads 0 ohms to ground (i.e. the tuner case), you've found number 7 on your board. Now that you know which one is number 7, you also know the numbers of the rest of them.

Also, now that you know in what direction yours are numbered, you can do a test to see if your board supports the extra buttons. Plug in your box and make sure it's turned OFF. Momentarily short the metal case of the tuner to your pad/pin #2. The box should turn on normally. If you have the output of the box connected to your TV, you should see it power up on the screen also.

This test is essentially the same as pressing the center (power) button on the Pro. If this test didn't work, you just saved yourself a bunch of time and trouble. If it did work, there's a good chance that your box will respond to all five of the buttons when wired in correctly.

As you can see though, these pads/pins are VERY small, be VERY careful! Don't even think of doing this test if you've just finished you fifth cup of coffee!!! And make sure you discharge any static by touching the metal tuner case first!

I've tried this test on mine and it does power on. No ill effects. (But then again, it's supposed to work on mine, I already have the Pro version.) Still, I take NO responsibility should you slip, or you box is not compatible in some way. Also, if this is your only box, you may not want to risk being without TV should something go horribly wrong.

The switches can be installed any way you wish. In a straight row, or something resembling the original design. Or maybe in a small separate box mounted to the top of the Artec. (Use the old button hole for wire passage.)

There are just a few things to keep in mind:

1) Keep all wires as short as possible.
2) When done the wiring, give the 7 wire bundle a few turns to reduce noise pickup.
3) And MOST important, choose/mount your switches with static electricity in mind! If you choose switches that have metal bezels and or metal cases, those bezels or cases "should" all be tied to a ground. This can be accomplished by using a separate wire that's connected to all of the switch cases at one end, and the other end is soldered to the tuner case. The first time you walk across the carpet to change channels you'll understand the importance of this. If that discharge were to find its way to the actual switch contacts and wires, you can probably kiss your board good-by. Of course, if your switches are of the all plastic variety, grounding isn't necessary.

Actually though, the hardest part of this mod will be soldering the 7 wires to the circuit board. If your box has the empty pads, soldering will be easier then if it's one that has the connector already installed. And, since this connector is surface mounted, removing it is probably not an option. Finding the proper 7-pin plug for your existing socket would be your best (and safest) bet.

I think that about covers everything. Since I'd hate to see someone's box get fried, please don't attempt this mod if there’s even the slightest doubt in your mind that your soldering skills are up to it.

[INSERT "DON'T HOLD ME RESPONSIBLE" DISCLAIMER HERE!]

Floydage

08-23-09, 01:16 PM

Nice reverse engineering!

I'm trying to figure out why a company would have different pin-outs for the same 'function' on multiple products; increases assembly inventory (cost) and decreases DFM (Design For Mfgerability). I could see it if for some reason the device the cable is connecting to is model dependent (i.e. Switch PCB); if so they better make the connectors at the other end unique to each model to prevent mishaps. Maybe it just appears different, the connector being rotated 180 degrees on some versions. Typically the dot or circle on the PCB is pin 1.

BTW, Meritline shows the Pro for $45 or two for $80 and free shipping BUT currently out of stock. Smaller to no price to pay to get the switches and it may come with an AV cable (per freeTVsignal but Meritline doesn't list contents). Worth watching for restock.

WeThePeople

08-23-09, 02:44 PM

We have the same FW version.

Hit freeze...let it sit until it goes by itself.

You will have motion video and "FREEZE" on the screen.

Hit freeze again ,and freeze goes away but the motion stops.

Hit guide...

All channels will say no signal even though the meter shows a strong signal.

How many can reproduce this?

OK, I'm through with button mods for a moment or so...

I did as you listed, replacing "Guide" with "EPG"

1 - Freeze, wait, observed motion with "Freeze" banner still at bottom
2 - Freeze again, observe freeze with "Freeze" banner missing
3 - Hit EPG, use up/dn and confirm channels missing

I can confirm first two (Freeze) firmware bugs.

The third (Guide/EPG) firmware bug fails to appear for me.

I see every channel through the edges of the guide without failure.
I tried a few times, and all channels all the way around the "Dial"
(Showing my age by saying "Dial"...aren't I...)

I hit signal after leaving EPG, all channels read fine too.
Did I misunderstand the last bug your describing?

ron350

08-23-09, 02:59 PM

Thanks NTSC your diagram works but Artec rotated the 7-pin connector 180* on my T3AP-LL and T3AP-LS.

Edit:

My old T3AP-LL and T3AP-LS boards, both with the white 7-pin connector, appear to be the same boards. The only differences are a few caps and resistors connected to the tuner.

The old and new T3AP-LL boards are the same except they left off the 7-pin white connector and the reset switch (unknown function switch). Any other empty tinned pads you see on the new T3AP-LL board are also empty on the old T3AP-LL board.

#1 T3AP-LL received April 09
Serial # V1201W08480004##
073-0000-V12G02
System Version= ?
Did not have extended program guide.
LG tuner #TDVG-H152F .808A07111
Processor = LGDT1111T
0822
PA7967.00D

#2 T3AP-LS received May 09
Serial # V1202W08410006##
073-0000-V12G04
System Version = 2.0.1B
Has extended program guide.
Sanyo tuner # UBDOOAL LOT FVIP
Processor = LGDT1111T
0835
PB5193.00B

#3 T3AP-LL received August 09
Serial # V1201W09250012##
073-0000-V12G02
System Version = 2.1.1B
Has extended program guide just like above LS model.
LG tuner # TDVG-H152F .808A27110
Processor = LGDT1111T
0907
PB5201.00B

http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/357/artec021a.jpg
Old T3AP-LL on the Left and T3AP-LS on the Right.

http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/9688/artec018a.jpg

http://img401.imageshack.us/img401/7030/artec019a.jpg
Mystery reset switch found in old T3AP-LL and T3AP-LS.

.

WeThePeople

08-23-09, 03:02 PM

Super Ron ! :)
Thanks for the LS confirmation

I deleted all temp posts,
and updated my original Post #198 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=17032402#post17032402)
to reflect what was learned today.

Heres one last question about these buttons you can answer.

Your earlier boards have an additional button you considered a reset button.
was there a matching pin hole for a paperclip in the case to press it too?

ron350

08-23-09, 03:35 PM

Any ides about the surface mount resistors and caps on the PRO switch board in post #217?

Buy the way great photos you guys are making.

WeThePeople

08-23-09, 03:53 PM

Any ides about the surface mount resistors and caps on the PRO switch board in post #217?

Buy the way great photos you guys are making.

if only my Sony - Mavica MVC-FD7 (http://www.interment.net/column/review/mavica/index.htm) Camera could hear that,
I'm amazed this ancient artifact can still spin a floppy disk.
I have to hold a magnifying glass between it and the board...

Yeah, NTSC determined the resistor was just a zero-ohm jumper,
and the caps were small RF shunts additions for the On/Off button.

did you catch my "Pinhole" question below?

You also answered another question with your Pic (http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/3626/artec011a.jpg).
Yours shows the cutout in both LL/LS jacks facing the PCB's front.

NTSC's Pro Pic (http://i29.tinypic.com/30sc0bd.jpg) shows the cutout facing the PCB back instead.
This confirms the pin reversal between LL/LS and the Pro models.

Additionally NTSC's Pic-2 (http://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd5/kenrap/switches.jpg) and Pic-3 (http://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd5/kenrap/switchboard.jpg) clearly show
the red #1 indicator wire orientated closest to the tuner
and connecting to the trace that leads to the center power button SW1.

Additionally, even SatPro posted a Pic (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=109637&d=1210111029) of a slightly different revision
of the Pro that has all the same indicators as the above examples.

It took a moment to piece that all together...
Bet you were scratchin' yer head for a moment too NTSC...

********************************************

I hope to purchase both an LS and a Pro next month for fun.
I like these little buggers.

I should point out to those that haven't followed my CECB landslide,
that I am one of the few that live in an area the Zenith DTT-900/901 just won't work.
I get steller performance fron the Channel Master CM-7000's though.

Of this round of two box purchase, the Craig is positively useless.
But I'm happy to report that unlike a half dozen others that couldn't work,
this LL model works almost as good as the the CM-7000.
Trust me, thats saying something good for this item!

NTSC

08-23-09, 05:35 PM

Any ides about the surface mount resistors and caps on the PRO switch board in post #217?

The lone resistor was just a jumper. But after further examination I now see that the two capacitors, which are actually in parallel, and total about 0.1 uF, go from pin #1 (the red wire) to ground (pin 7). Ground also includes the back of the board, and the majority of the front. (Thanks WeThePeople for catching that!)

I still say they can be ignored, as long as you twist your wiring harness 5 or 6 times.

WeThePeople

08-23-09, 05:56 PM

Th... to the non-etched back of the board. So except for the back's connection to the capacitors, the back is totally isolated from the front

I'm near certain that the back side of that will turn out to be ground.
How else could ground get the the center power On/Off button except
through plate through holes to a grounded backplane.

I can't be certain from your pic of the whole set connected
and switch board still screwed to the top.

But the non-trace circles I see appear to be plate through's
with standard-issue quad fusible link traces to the backplane.

Check your tuner casing to the other side of those capacitors and You should find it is a ground pane for shielding.

NTSC

08-23-09, 06:18 PM

I'm near certain that the back side of that will turn out to be ground.
How else could ground get the the center power On/Off button except
through plate through holes to a grounded backplane.

I can't be certain from your pic of the whole set connected
and switch board still screwed to the top.

But the non-trace circles I see appear to be plate through's
with standard-issue quad fusible link traces to the backplane.

Check your tuner casing to the other side of those capacitors and You should find it is a ground pane for shielding.

OK, after FURTHER examination... :D Yep, you're right. (Just needed a bigger magnifying glass! - And to get off my butt and pull out the meter.) :D

WeThePeople

08-23-09, 06:50 PM

Hey, It's Sunday.
Your soooo allowed to be casual.

Let me share an old joke with you.
Nothing personal meant, It's just funny (But true).

I (As example) chose a nick which means I am everyone,
yet still I am absolutely invisibly no one.

NTSC = Never Twice (The) Same Color

Floydage

08-24-09, 02:38 PM

But after further examination I now see that the two capacitors, which are actually in parallel, and total about 0.1 uF, go from pin #1 (the red wire) to ground (pin 7).

I see now, they filter the logic supply to the switches; one at the connector and one at the first switch the trace contacts, I suspect to prevent the trace from becoming an antenna. It looks like one cap is gray and one is brown unless that's due to the angle of the board in the pic (my thought is for broadband RF bypassing one would use a 0.1 uF and say a 0.001 uF in parallel).

0.1 uF are pretty common, littered all over most boards. If you have a schematic for some junk boards you can find them easily. For this value/app the physical size isn't important if you can get what you find to solder OK.

Floydage

08-24-09, 02:51 PM

But the non-trace circles I see appear to be plate through's with standard-issue quad fusible link traces to the backplane.

Ahhh, I think I know what you're talking about now, the vias (circles) with the skinny traces to the surrounding plane. That's a thermal relief patter for the solder process; a via connected solidly to a plane can heatsink too much resulting in a poor solder joint. A good example is something we called tombstoning (:D): CB2 would tend to flip up as one side of the cap soldered faster than the other side.

Floydage

08-24-09, 03:10 PM

I should point out to those that haven't followed my CECB landslide,
that I am one of the few that live in an area the Zenith DTT-900/901 just won't work.

That's interesting if the LL is working well for you as they have the same tuner/decoder chipset (LG) per Wiki. BUT Wiki does show that some 900s had the Sanyo tuner. If both are LG it makes me wonder if there are some user-adjustable RF settings? (ex: sensitivity vs multipath trade-off).

WeThePeople

08-24-09, 03:42 PM

Ahhh, I think I know what you're talking about now, the vias (circles) with the skinny traces to the surrounding plane. That's a thermal relief patter for the solder process; a via connected solidly to a plane can heatsink too much resulting in a poor solder joint. A good example is something we called tombstoning (:D): CB2 would tend to flip up as one side of the cap soldered faster than the other side.

Thats interesting to know and makes sense too.

I always saw them frying left and right in cheap overseas radars and sonar boards.
I always thought them to be fusible links by design as that is what they become quickly when electrons meet water or overload...

No, if the DTT-900 had the Sanyo tuner I probably would have kept it
(If late feb / early march production without the audio glitch).

Floydage

08-24-09, 04:21 PM

Thats interesting to know and makes sense too.

I always saw them frying left and right in cheap overseas radars and sonar boards.
I always thought them to be fusible links by design as that is what they become quickly when electrons meet water or overload...

Yeah, PCB designers will tend to use default patterns which might be too skinny for some circuits, gotta watch those guys. It's usually done when the completed circuit design is processed for DFM, etc. (i.e. they sneak it in on us when after we think we're done). Us RF guys don't like those at real high freqs either, the little traces become inductors.

I've seen strange stuff like you're talking about though, usually where the traces tie to connectors. Another weird one is odd shapes near connectors to make spark gaps for static, lightning, etc.