I just purchased 10 gauge speaker cable from Blue Jeans. I was expecting something fairly thick (maybe even unwieldy). Anyhow, what I received was thinner than a pencil - basically the thinnest speaker cable I've ever seen.

Either I misunderstand the way gauge works (I thought the lower the number, the thicker the cable) or it's correct and the difference is that they don't use much in the way of shielding.

Also had them terminated with banana plugs that do not fit any of my speakers or amps...

Very puzzled, can someone enlighten me?

Thx

I just purchased 10 gauge speaker cable from Blue Jeans. I was expecting something fairly thick (maybe even unwieldy). Anyhow, what I received was thinner than a pencil - basically the thinnest speaker cable I've ever seen.

Either I misunderstand the way gauge works (I thought the lower the number, the thicker the cable) or it's correct and the difference is that they don't use much in the way of shielding.

Also had them terminated with banana plugs that do not fit any of my speakers or amps...

Very puzzled, can someone enlighten me?

Thx

in 35 yrs of buying spker cable, i've never bought, seen, or heard of it with shielding. thats for component interconnects (u know, with the rca/xlr plugs)

i think u're probably ok with what u got except for the banana plugs, dont know what to say there.

edit-10 gauge seem like overkill. what kind of speakers/lengths r u going for?

You're correct about the lower the number, the thicker the cable. You can always change the banana plugs to a different size yourself.

in 35 yrs of buying spker cable, i've never bought, seen, or heard of it with shielding. thats for component interconnects (u know, with the rca/xlr plugs)

i think u're probably ok with what u got except for the banana plugs, dont know what to say there.

edit-10 gauge seem like overkill. what kind of speakers/lengths r u going for?

I'm sure he meant "jacketing", not "shielding".

10 gauge is a bit thick unless you're going for REALLY long runs in excess of 60 feet. In most circumstances, 12 gauge is all that you should ever need.

Also had them terminated with banana plugs that do not fit any of my speakers or amps.....Are you certain? The banana plugs they usually use ARE the usual standard ones. I'd be surprised if they are wrong. Are you certain you ordered "speaker cable" and with the correct "ends"? Perhaps your order got mixed up and they sent you someone else's RCA terminated interconnnects. What color is your cable's jacket? What cable did you order, exactly?

As far as the thickness, 10ga is probably about the thickness of a pencil.

I just purchased 10 gauge speaker cable from Blue Jeans. I was expecting something fairly thick (maybe even unwieldy). Anyhow, what I received was thinner than a pencil - basically the thinnest speaker cable I've ever seen.

Either you got the wrong stuff, or you've been using jumper cables for speaker wire.

Some speaker wire is misleading because it has very thick jacket/insulation, but thin conductor so it only looks impressive.

If you doubt what you got, the internet is full of wire gauge tables. Measure the conductor (not jacket/insulation) diameter and compare to the wire gauge table. The conductor portion of 10ga wire should be about 2.6mm diameter.

By the way 10 gauge is very, very thick. It is thicker than what is used in home electrical wiring. It is unlikely that you need wire that thick if the speakers are in the same room (or same building) as the amplifier. Don't worry about the gauge. It is more than enough.

Bananas are standard. Your speakers may not have banana jacks, I don't know. If they do and if you have banana plugs on your wire, they will fit. Some bananas tighten so you might need to loosen them to get them to work.

OK, let me address some of the questions:

Shielding vs jacketing: yes, I should have said jacketing. I guess I'm used to MIT speaker cables which are about as thick as a quarter. Mind you, my MIT cables are bi-wired so that accounts for a major chunk of the difference I'm sure.

What I bought: Belden 5000 series (10-gauge 5T00UP). This has gray jacketing that has a sort of natural 'twist' to it.

I purchased a 30' run for in-wall (going from 5.1 to 7.1 in my home theater) and wanted to avoid the high cost of brand speaker cable (e.g. MIT). I simply didn't expect that both wires inside the jacket would be thinner than electrical cable and figured I needed 'shielding' when going in-wall. Maybe not?

As for the banana plugs: I've been using banana plugs (and spades) for years and are very familiar with them, but have never seen this kind. As it turns out, it was my bad - the plugs are fine. I had noticed that the tip covers were not screwed on tight and I tightened them - which expands the thickness of the tip for a tighter connection. Duh! Nice system actually - I was just ignorant.

Thanks for enlightening me, guys.

You're correct about the lower the number, the thicker the cable.Wrong!

It is not the thickness of the "cable", it is the thickness of the "wire" inside the cable!

10 gauge seem like overkillIt is massive overkill!! Assuming the OP is using 8Ω speakers at 30ft, he could be using 18ga wire with no deleterious effect. :eek:

See http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm

http://gray.mb.ca/AVS/SpeakerWire.jpg

Wrong!

It is not the thickness of the "cable", it is the thickness of the "wire" inside the cable!

I used the same terminology as the OP to avoid confusion. Of course, I meant the wire thickness.

I had noticed that the tip covers were not screwed on tight and I tightened them - which expands the thickness of the tip for a tighter connection. Duh! Nice system actually - I was just ignorant.Yeah, those are "locking" plugs. You must have specified them when you ordered. You insert them, then screw down the sleeve to lock them into place. IMO, they are a pain in the ass to deal with.

I purchased a 30' run for in-wall (going from 5.1 to 7.1 in my home theater) and wanted to avoid the high cost of brand speaker cable (e.g. MIT).

10 gauge is not excessive for 30-foot runs. You will want to minimize the impedance between amp and speakers in order to prevent frequency response problems. Speakers like B&Ws for example specify a maximum speaker cable impedance (0.1Ω in case of the power-hungry Model 802D); obviously there's a reason for that recommendation. I have 25 foot runs between my main amp and speakers, which present a severe phase angle and load that drops as low as 2.7Ω. My speaker cables are 9 gauge.

Oh oh. Here we go again...........

10 gauge is not excessive for 30-foot runs.:rolleyes: Don't let the facts get in the way! Speakers like B&Ws for example specify a maximum speaker cable impedance (0.1Ω in case of the power-hungry Model 802D)So what's your point?? 30ft of 12ga pair = 0.1Ω

[QUOTE=cavu;13785987]It is massive overkill!! Assuming the OP is using 8Ω speakers at 30ft, he could be using 18ga wire with no deleterious effect. :eek:---end quote]
yesterday, i was gonna suggest 14 or even 16 gauge depending on the length.

Ya know, all these gauge charts are nice and stuff, but I don't think anyone is gonna go out and buy different gauge wire for all of the varying lengths that one needs in a 5.1 or 7.1 setup.

But I'd rather error on the side of having wire a bit thicker than what I "may" need, so I just went to Monoprice (Parts Express is just as good), and ordered a few spools of 12 gauge for everything. The price difference between 14 gauge and 12 is pretty small.

I don't think anyone is gonna go out and buy different gauge wire for all of the varying lengths that one needs in a 5.1 or 7.1 setup.I agree. Calculate for the longest distance and use that size for all your runs. That's why I use 14ga "Romex" - I used it for just about all my household wiring !!

But don't get suckered into thinking that you have to buy "9ga" <!?> (http://www.residtronics.com/page/SR/PROD/SPEAKERCBL/WRLD-EQS) for everything (or even anything!). :rolleyes:

But don't get suckered into thinking that you have to buy "9ga" <!?> (http://www.residtronics.com/page/SR/PROD/SPEAKERCBL/WRLD-EQS) for everything (or even anything!). :rolleyes:

Why stop there when you can get Transparent's Opus MM speaker wire at an 8 foot length for only..............................$23,000.00.

Who cares if it is excessive or not? The OP already bought it. It will work fine. He specifically wanted the Belden 5000 series (10-gauge 5T00UP) that BJC sells and that is what he got. It is 10ga.. So what?

Who cares if it is excessive or not? The OP already bought it.:confused: Uhhh ... he asked??

"Very puzzled, can someone enlighten me?"

Funny how we get caught up in our own stuff. The OP never asked about what gauge he should use. This all started when Westgate said that 10g was overkill and we ran with it from there.

:confused: Uhhh ... he asked??

"Very puzzled, can someone enlighten me?"He did NOT ask if 10ga was excessive. Read his post. He was "puzzled" as to why it was not even THICKER and as to why his bananas didn't work.

It was others (including yourself) who felt the need to unnecessarily editorialize.
"It is massive overkill!!"

He did NOT ask.Technically correct.

I answered the OP's initial question regarding the thickness of 10 gauge wiring which was confusing him.

Subsequent responses were, as lwien points out, to westgate, et al.

But, OTOH, WTFC!

Unless you want us to discuss why you feel the need to discuss why we are discussing this topic at all. :p

Funny how we get caught up in our own stuff. The OP never asked about what gauge he should use. This all started when Westgate said that 10g was overkill and we ran with it from there.

i didnt say it was overkill, i said it seems like overkill. just my opinion based on years of experience. but as they say, to each his own.

and as screamin' jay hawkins (or someone) used to sing, 'don't put that thang on me!'

correction- 'ole screamin' jay used to sing 'constipation blues'.

But, OTOH, WTFC!Exactly. See post#20.............. again.

i didnt say it was overkill, i said it seems like overkill. just my opinion based on years of experience. but as they say, to each his own.I agree. You made it clear that that was your opinion. You didn't get your panties all in a wad about it, start using exclamation points, and hijack the thread. ;)

Neener, neener............neener ! ;)

I think we all revert to playing hopscotch or 4 square on the playground again when we come in here, no?

Neener, neener............neener ! ;)

I think we all revert to playing hopscotch or 4 square on the playground again when we come in here, no?eat dirt! :p

[QUOTE=lwien;13786970]Neener, neener............neener ! ;) end quote]

i saw that in another thread just yesterday. its catching! i like it!
:)

I think he bought a perfectly fine cable. In fact, I believe that if he had bought that, instead of the MIT, for his other runs, he would have had money left over for something else, and still have the same sonic experience. But, that's water under the bridge -- the important thing is that the OP learned that it's the copper, not the plastic, that matters (and is measured), and that he figured out the banana plugs.

...... and that he figured out the banana plugs.

As long as he now realizes that thicker is not necessarily better, and found out along the way why his plugs didn't fit, we should now feel confident that, at least, he won't do himself any harm, right? :eek:!

As long as he now realizes that thicker is not necessarily better.................Why is (was) it important that he realize that? He bought the cable he wanted. Where does his original post indicate that he wanted to know what gauge wire is (or is not) sufficient?

Why is (was) it important that he realize that? He bought the cable he wanted. Where does his original post indicate that he wanted to know what gauge wire is (or is not) sufficient?

Errr............joke............sarcasam.........tongue in cheek.........just makin a bit of fun with a bit of sexual overtones........(pls re-read my post above with that in mind).

Accchhhhhhhhh..............I hate explaining punch lines:p

Errr............joke............sarcasam.........tongue in cheek.........just makin a bit of fun with a bit of sexual overtones........(pls re-read my post above with that in mind).

Accchhhhhhhhh..............I hate explaining punch lines:psry i need a spoon

Errr............joke............sarcasam.........tongue in cheek.........just makin a bit of fun with a bit of sexual overtones........(pls re-read my post above with that in mind).

Accchhhhhhhhh..............I hate explaining punch lines:p

maybe keep yer day job?:p

maybe keep yer day job?:p

Ya think? ;)

OK guys, not to throw coals on the fire or anything, but I too have a qestion.

***NOTE*** I am asking for OPINIONS, not scientific figures telling me what the atomic number is of copper that runs through wire at an impediance of 1.30765 Ohms while floating in a vacuum of air under 23.97 psi when listening to music at a volume of 40.324 decibles...or anything like that....hehe

Just simply your opinions from your previous experiences and expertise. So, here it goes.....

I have surround speakers with about 35 ft runs form the wall plate behind my wall unit. I used 14 guage wires for those runs in the ceiling and down the wall. Now I have to run from the wall plate to the receiver for those surrounds, 2 mains, and center. In your guys opinions, should I just stick with the 14 guage, or use 16 guage? The longest run will be about 15-16 ft, and the shortest will be about 4-6 feet.

Another thing, will there be a problem having the right speaker closest to the receiver with a 4 ft run and the left speaker with like a 16 ft run. Will this affect sound quality in any way?

Thnks for your help in advance, you guys always help out!!!!!!

DMAN

I have to run from the wall plate to the receiver for those surrounds, 2 mains, and center. In your guys opinions, should I just stick with the 14 guage, or use 16 guage?What impedance are your speakers? 4 ft run and a 16 ft run. Will this affect sound quality in any way?No!

cavu,

8 Ohms Infinity Primus series speakers, Onkyo 604 receiver....

8 OhmsYou will have no issues with either 14ga or 16ga !

***NOTE*** I am asking for OPINIONS, not scientific figures
Okay, so my opinion is that switching from 14 to 16 AWG will cause a rolloff in the high frequencies. And using cables of different lengths will cause the sound to be out of sync.

That's my opinion. Now what are you going to do?

Out of sync? LOL !!

9" .... thats the approximate length a signal travels in a nanosecond.

Timing really doesnt matter on resistance...just length.

I am sticking with 10awg speaker wire just because it was given to me.

FREE = PERFECT SIZE

9" .... thats the approximate length a signal travels in a nanosecond.

Really doesnt matter on resistance...just length.

I am sticking with 10awg speaker wire just because it was given to me.

FREE = PERFECT SIZE

what if they had given u 18 or 20 gauge?:p

Then I would have sold it and bought 12 awg

i eat boogers

Wow - what an interesting thread. OP - I have the same wire and banana plugs you do. Problem with 10g wire is it is too thick - you definitely can't bi-wire with it, and it's hard to work with.

When our house was built - 16 gauge wire was used. The runs are around 35 feet.

I've used my 10-gauge by-passing the wiring for the surrounds (the 16gauge 35 foot runs) and take a guess einsteins - ZERO - zip, no sonic difference whatsoever. Did it blind too btw. The chart on the previous page is a guideline, but really, it means diddly squat for regular home applications, 16 gauge wire will do just fine. If you have more money than you know what to do with, and you don't even listen to speakers that list for less than $50,000 a pair, then by all means go with the cable that costs thousands of dollars. Someone needs to make the commission :D

I bought the 10 gauge because I thought I'd try it - it's cheap enough. And for all you who think it's over kill - well guess what - so is a 500 watt/ channel amp, but people get them for the 'headroom', so our speaker wire has 'headroom', what's the big deal?

Wow - what an interesting thread. OP - I have the same wire and banana plugs you do. Problem with 10g wire is it is too thick - you definitely can't bi-wire with it, and it's hard to work with.

When our house was built - 16 gauge wire was used. The runs are around 35 feet.

I've used my 10-gauge by-passing the wiring for the surrounds (the 16gauge 35 foot runs) and take a guess einsteins - ZERO - zip, no sonic difference whatsoever. Did it blind too btw. The chart on the previous page is a guideline, but really, it means diddly squat for regular home applications, 16 gauge wire will do just fine. If you have more money than you know what to do with, and you don't even listen to speakers that list for less than $50,000 a pair, then by all means go with the cable that costs thousands of dollars. Someone needs to make the commission :D

I bought the 10 gauge because I thought I'd try it - it's cheap enough. And for all you who think it's over kill - well guess what - so is a 500 watt/ channel amp, but people get them for the 'headroom', so our speaker wire has 'headroom', what's the big deal?

for my home audio setup, i've been using 16 gauge spkr wire and a 35 year old 4 channel amp rated at 25 watts/channel rms, all channels driven, for most of that 35 yrs with absolutely no issues. currently, i'm running 30 foot lengths for home audio/ht setup.

the largest gauge spkr wire i ever used was 14 gauge for connecting concert p.a. low and mid hz bins (and 16 gauge for high freq horns) to their respective power amps, years ago. again, no issues.

but, again, to each his own.

Wrong!

It is not the thickness of the "cable", it is the thickness of the "wire" inside the cable!

Finally a good answer to people who shop by wire gauge. :D

Finally a good answer to people who shop by wire gauge. :DWhat else is there to "shop by"? :confused:

:confused:

What else is there to "shop by"? :confused:

Price. :eek:

Finally a good answer to people who shop by wire gauge. :D

What else is there to "shop by"? :confused:

Price. :eek:

OIC

So, I guess "price" is why you recently switched from 24ga to 18ga wire. :rolleyes:

Okay, so my opinion is that switching from 14 to 16 AWG will cause a rolloff in the high frequencies. And using cables of different lengths will cause the sound to be out of sync.

That's my opinion. Now what are you going to do?
mcnarus,

I will kindly say thank you for your opinion, that's what I'll do....NOW!

Yes, DMAN, but do you know whether what I said was correct?

Has anyone tried the KASA Kable Silver Plated Speaker Wire?

Has anyone tried the KASA Kable Silver Plated Speaker Wire?Oh why oh why do you want to go there@#$%^&"the KASA Kable - 462 Silver Plated Oxygen Free Copper strands per conductor. Silver (Ag) is possibly the finest material one can use for hi-fi audio applications. Its distinctive vocal/mid range enhanced response is the result of lower surface resistance within the cable."

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes: :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

What a load of crap.

Hunt's crushed tomatoes make the best sauce.

Yes, DMAN, but do you know whether what I said was correct?
mcnarus,

No, I don't know if what you said is correct. That is particularly why I am here asking for opinions. Of course, if you threw a bunch of numbers at me telling me all kind of technical stuff like: length to weight ratios of wire impediance over 10 ft long,,,,OR,,,,ohms compared to wire size running through sheetrock 1/2" thick,,,,,,OR,,,,some other really big "important" info about wires, receivers, power distribution, speakers,,,etc...., I wouldn't know if that was correct either.

It is apparent to me that some in this forum know more than others, that's exactly why I come here. I trust that you guys who MAY OR MAY NOT know more than me will give me your opinions (sometimes backed by info), and do it at least honestly based on all that info that YOU know is correct,,,,or not. Up until now, all the info I received and read here seems to be very good info.....and VERY helpful to me.

BESIDES--- I have come to realize in short time I've been around this forum that there is always somone who knows better than somone else. Example: Read this thread....


Anyways,,,,I appreciate you taking time to give me your opinion, and I thank you for any help you can give me in the future.

THX.....DMAN

My point was that unsupported opinion of anonymous Web posters is not a particularly reliable source of information. I said one thing; cavu said something else. Who ya gonna believe? If you reject scientific explanations a priori, you've got no basis for making any judgments at all. (I suppose you could take a poll, but that depends on trusting that a majority of the people who would bother to answer know what they're talking about.)

BTW, what I said was technically correct. But it's also irrelevant, because the magnitude of the effects fall well below the level of audibility.

"a priori"???? is that even English??

That is exactly why I don't ask for all the scientific stuff,,,, I don't understand it. Some people are just too smart.....They start throwing out all kind of info that no one (except other scientific people) understand to show us how really smart and informed they are. As for me, I don't understand all that stuff, so yes, I trust the knowledge of web posters (anonymous or otherwise) here and on other forums to a certain degree. Fortunatley for me and others though, sometimes the case is that,,,,

"a majority of the people who would bother to answer know what they're talking about."

BTW,,,is this
=====>"what I said was technically correct. But it's also irrelevant, because the magnitude of the effects fall well below the level of audibility" <======

a fancy way of saying this
=====>"You will have no issues with either 14ga or 16ga !" <=======

Cause if it is,,,,that's what cavu said.....

THANKS AGAIN!!!!! DMAN

"a priori"???? is that even English??
No, it's Latin. It means, "from before"—i.e. (id est, "that is," also Latin) you rejected scientific explanations even before hearing them.

BTW,,,is this
=====>"what I said was technically correct. But it's also irrelevant, because the magnitude of the effects fall well below the level of audibility" <======

a fancy way of saying this
=====>"You will have no issues with either 14ga or 16ga !" <=======
Of course.

Boring thread. :rolleyes:

Boring thread. :rolleyes:lol :D

You should be studying Raymond. BTW, what area are you pursuing?

You should be studying Raymond. BTW, what area are you pursuing?PE