First, let me say thanks to AVS Forum members bradavon, stpat, and the entire group of BH200 owners who've helped me not only with my machine but also who inspired me to start this thread. A very special thanks to bradavon for his tireless work collecting and organizing information; I've based this thread on his model!

LG BH200: bug tracking thread
for non-disk specific issues

PURPOSE OF THIS THREAD & INFORMATION CONTAINED WITHIN:
*collect confirmed bugs and other irregularities in the LG BH200
*support other users with help for and/or confirmation of bugs
*provide LG employees who might be reading a chance to comment and/or make note of confirmed bugs for future firmware updates
*please note, this is for non-disk specific issues; to report a problem disk please use this thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1002769).
*for questions regarding the BH200's capabilities or what issues are related to what firmware, please use this thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1009104).
*whenever possible, before adding a bug to the "official" list, I will try to have it confirmed by at least two users, and when applicable with at least two different A/V setups (i.e. receivers, TV's, etc.)
*when posting a possible bug, please provide as much information as possible (i.e. firmware version, driver version, A/V setup, etc.)


REPORTED BUGS


Confirmed by multiple users (many people, different locations, with a wide variety of A/V equipment):

1. When sending uncompressed PCM 5.1 audio from a Blu-ray disk to a receiver via HDMI, audio channels are incorrectly reported as 7.1; no sound is output via "extra 2" rear speakers. For more details, click on this thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1026027).

2. When bitstreaming Dolby Digital Plus to a receiver via HDMI, there is sometimes a "motorboat" or "helicopter" sound. This has been confirmed by users with Onkyo, Pioneer, and Marantz receivers. While the vast majority of reports about this problem are related to the HD DVD format (probably because DD+ is much more common on HD DVD), it has been confirmed by at least one person on Blu-ray. The bug is not always repeatable at the same play time or even on the same disk in many instances. Click here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1031635) for a thread dedicated to this issue.

3. When viewing upscaled 4:3 SD DVD's via HDMI, images are incorrectly stretched into the 16:9 aspect ratio instead of being displayed in their native 4:3. Pending further research, some users suggest this can be defeated if your display allows you to select pillar box (4:3) when viewing content via the HDMI connection. Others have suggested that if 480i/p output is selected on the BH200, then the stretching does not occur. But as soon as any upscaling happens the incorrect 16:9 aspect ratio also happens. For more details and links to other threads, click here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13820945#post13820945).

4. There continue to be audio and video dropouts. While this got better with the March "beta" firmware and has gotten even better with the April firmware, it still happens too often. Most users report more video drops than audio. The drops are most often not repeatable at the same play time or even on the same disk. Ironically (perhaps), some of the most frequent video drops occur on the BH200's menu and home screens.

4(a). The issues with audio and video dropouts seem to be related to the fact that the BH200 is very "particular" with its HDMI handshake. Furthermore, while these issues still occur with HDMI 1.3 devices, they seem to be much more common and severe with older versions (1.1, 1.2) of HDMI. See examples here, (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=15348834#post15348834) here, (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=15353159#post15353159)and here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=16844121#post16844121), as well as in the Mini-FAQ (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1009104). UPDATE: As of 1/3/2010, the HDMI handshake issues still seem to be causing audio and/or video drops with the latest firmware and newest Blu-ray releases. See posting here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=17840447#post17840447) for more details.

Confirmed by limited users (fewer people, regional/localized, specific make or model of A/V equipment):

1. When the BH200 is connected to a Denon 4306 receiver via HDMI there's only stereo PCM audio sent and/or received instead of Multi-Channel. Testing shows that the 4306 will receive Multi-Channel PCM audio via HDMI from other devices including the PS3 and Toshiba HD-E1. Additionally, the newer Denon 4308 has no problems when paired with the BH200. So, this would seem to be something specific to only the 4306 and BH200 combination. As of now, this has only been confirmed with the European model of the Denon and the North American version of the LG. UPDATE: according to this post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=16158682#post16158682) it may be an issue with all Denon receivers from that model year and has been confirmed with the 2807.

2. If the BH200 is connected directly to a Mitsubishi WS 55315 and/or 65315 via HDMI/DVI, it turns the television off when booting up. If the HDMI is run through a receiver first, or the television is switched to a different input while the BH200 is booting up, this does not occur. The television is not capable of displaying 720p (only 480i, 480p, and 1080i). It is therefore suspected that the BH200's forced resolution setting is not working correctly and that when booting up it still sends a 720 "test signal" as though it was set to auto. This causes the television to turn off as a protective measure.

3. Hybrid Super Audio CDs are not read properly by European models of the BH200. The Hybrid SACD is recognized as a data CD and therefore does not play correctly. UPDATE: This has now been confirmed in the North American model as well (posted here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14026927#post14026927)). More details here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14015215#post14015215).

4. If CEA extensions to the display EDID data are not present (i.e. DVI-D with HDCP displays), the BH200 will not accept user selected output of 1080p; instead it reverts to 1080i. See this post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=16157583#post16157583) for more details.

4:3 SD DVD's are stretched during upconversion when they should not be. (This is a bug, not a feature.) April update/702 driver

AH! I've heard about this, but don't think of it too much as I don't have many SD DVD's that are 4:3. But, now that you mention it, I do have a few. I'll pop them in and see what happens.

Also, could you provide me a few links here on the forums where this has been discussed and confirmed? It's not that I don't trust you; just so I can include the links on the bug posting ... thanks! :)

-C.

4:3 SD DVD's are stretched during upconversion when they should not be. (This is a bug, not a feature.) April update/702 driver

Don't forget about the Dolby Digital + issue for some receivers. Hearing nothing but the helicopter sound....

Don't forget about the Dolby Digital + issue for some receivers. Hearing nothing but the helicopter sound....


Yes experienced this on the Onkyo 705. After successfully playing some BD's in PCM, DTS-MA and TRUEHD, they all played without a hitch. When I got the player on Sunday I didn't have a problem with it reading my HD DVD's at all wheter it was DD+ or TRUEHD. The second day I loaded some HD DVDs such as Bourne Supremacy and U-571 which I got the "helicopter" sound where you would see that the DD+ bitstream wasn't correctly being sent to the receiver. The 705 does not identify the bitstream being sent, you only get the noise.

Now I did also notice on U-571 that it also had the same issue when I tried to use the DTS track. Seems that the bitstreaming required a reboot of the player to correctly identify and play the discs.

I do want to make sure it's known that this is intermitent and does not happen everytime you load a disc.

In summary it seems that the bitstream is in connection with HD DVD's and not BD as i've not had a bitstream problem with the BD's i've played.

Has anyone found a work around for this?

AH! I've heard about this, but don't think of it too much as I don't have many SD DVD's that are 4:3. But, now that you mention it, I do have a few. I'll pop them in and see what happens.

Also, could you provide me a few links here on the forums where this has been discussed and confirmed? It's not that I don't trust you; just so I can include the links on the bug posting ... thanks! :)

-C.

Sure... here are a few random people from the owner's thread. The Sammy BD-UP5K does the same thing. The Toshiba players, the PS3 and (I believe) the Oppos are able to show upconvert 4:3 SD DVD's but show them (properly) as pillarboxed. The LG BH200 also stretches 4:3 standard def extras on Blu-Ray/HD DVD discs.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13815235#post13815235

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13650616#post13650616

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13625859#post13625859

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=13626089#post13626089

AH! I've heard about this, but don't think of it too much as I don't have many SD DVD's that are 4:3. But, now that you mention it, I do have a few. I'll pop them in and see what happens.

Also, could you provide me a few links here on the forums where this has been discussed and confirmed? It's not that I don't trust you; just so I can include the links on the bug posting ... thanks! :)

-C.

I'll confirm that it is happening on all 4:3 SD material (whether on a DVD, HD DVD or BD disc). I have my projector set to 'native' so the signal it is receiving is 720p stretched and up-converted image from the 4:3 SD source material.

It'd be nice if LG adds in a function to set it to "dot to dot" or "stretch". I like mine stretched for 4:3 as I totally do not like huge black areas on my screen.

Excellent work Casey.

Can I suggest users add to their signature what firmware and driver they use.

It would also be handy to add what your TV/Amp Make/Model is and what connection type too. You can edit your Signature here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/profile.php?do=editsignature

*for questions regarding the BH200's capabilities or what issues are related to what firmware, please use this thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1002769).
I presume this link should point here and not the disc problems thread? -

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1009104

Also, could you provide me a few links here on the forums where this has been discussed and confirmed? It's not that I don't trust you; just so I can include the links on the bug posting ... thanks!
As I understand it a 4:3 SD DVD is stretched vertically to 16:9 when BH200 outputs over HDMI in 1280x720p, 1920x1080i or 1920x1080p.

If you set the BH200 to output in 720x480 (or if available 720x576) the problem doesn't occur and a 4:3 SD DVD displays in 4:3. If you use a Component cable (which I think is only sent out as 720x480/720x576) the problem also doesn't occur.

It'd be nice if LG adds in a function to set it to "dot to dot" or "stretch". I like mine stretched for 4:3 as I totally do not like huge black areas on my screen.
Can we please reserve this thread to bugs not future requests :).

You prefer 4:3 DVDs stretched vertically to 16:9? Don't the stretched heads bother you? I do see where you're coming from but if I were to watch it that way I'd see if I could stretch it vertically to compensate (using the TV remote).

Hey - thanks for the links! When I get home tonight I'll do some testing on my own 4:3 disks and then post the bug info.

Thanks, again!

Sure... here are a few random people from the owner's thread. The Sammy BD-UP5K does the same thing. The Toshiba players, the PS3 and (I believe) the Oppos are able to show upconvert 4:3 SD DVD's but show them (properly) as pillarboxed. The LG BH200 also stretches 4:3 standard def extras on Blu-Ray/HD DVD discs.

Can I suggest users add to their signature what firmware and driver they use.

It would also be handy to add what your TV/Amp Make/Model is and what connection type too. You can edit your Signature here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/profile.php?do=editsignaturePutting our current firmware and such in the signature might be useful in other contexts, but in terms of bug reporting in this thread, it could be rather misleading. Unless I'm completely mistaken, a specific signature is *not* stamped on posts. Rather, the current signature is always appended to posts. Consequently, the signature and bug report would easily get out of sync (think a couple months down the road when a new firmware and/or driver is available...I update my sig...and now my bug reports incorrectly reference the new firmware/driver combo...not good).

That said, firmware/driver info is crucial to getting proper bug reports put together. My suggestion is that firmware/driver info be included with the post itself (i.e. it won't change when your signature is later updated).

Don't forget about the Dolby Digital + issue for some receivers. Hearing nothing but the helicopter sound....

Yes experienced this on the Onkyo 705. After successfully playing some BD's in PCM, DTS-MA and TRUEHD, they all played without a hitch. When I got the player on Sunday I didn't have a problem with it reading my HD DVD's at all wheter it was DD+ or TRUEHD. The second
[snip]
Now I did also notice on U-571 that it also had the same issue when I tried to use the DTS track. Seems that the bitstreaming required a reboot of the player to correctly identify and play the discs.

@volleybradt - could you please provide a few more details such as the make/model of your receiver, what disks you've had this happen on, etc.?

@davcole - thanks for your detailed posting! So just to clarify, you're having this problem with both Blu-rays and HD DVD movies and with audio formats other than DD+? May I assume you are using HDMI to your 705?

-C.

Thanks for putting this together casey.christian!

Here's a bit more info on the SD 4:3 issue:
SD 4:3 is stretched, not hi-def content. In other words, Casablanca on DVD is stretched, but not HD DVD. Extras on BD and HD DVD are another story as they aren't necessarily hi-def.

Essentially the BH200 is stretching all SD content. Stretching anamorphic content is the correct thing to do (otherwise anamorphic content would look squished). If the original aspect ratio is desired, the BH200 should only stretch *anamorphic* SD content rather than *all* SD content.

At least that's my understanding of what it should be doing vs. what it is doing.

Yeah, I quoted myself. :)

Reproducibility: Always
Firmware: All (so far BH02080402F, BH02080314B, and original)
Driver: 0702, 0701
Connection: HDMI (component does not upconvert, so it might not exhibit the same problem)

Can I suggest users add to their signature what firmware and driver they use.

It would also be handy to add what your TV/Amp Make/Model is and what connection type too.

Putting our current firmware and such in the signature might be useful in other contexts, but in terms of bug reporting in this thread, it could be rather misleading. Unless I'm completely mistaken, a specific signature is *not* stamped on posts. Rather, the current signature is always appended to posts. Consequently, the signature and bug report would easily get out of sync (think a couple months down the road when a new firmware and/or driver is available...I update my sig...and now my bug reports incorrectly reference the new firmware/driver combo...not good).

Yeah, I agree with you on this one oilblue. As time progresses and future firmware upgrades are released, this could become confusing. I think it's best just to keep all the pertinent information in our postings and not in our signatures.

-C.

That said, firmware/driver info is crucial to getting proper bug reports put together. My suggestion is that firmware/driver info be included with the post itself (i.e. it won't change when your signature is later updated).
You seem to be half right. The signature is only added to new posts (after the signature has been amended), old posts it doesn't appear on, even if you edit them. That said, I guess old posts will still show the firmware you were running at the time you created the post. That could cause confusion.

I've added text to my signature but it is not appearing on old posts at all. It would stop the constant questions: "what firmware/driver are you running" and "what Amp/Connection type). If the problem also occurred with older firmware that needs mentioning too.

It maybe safer to just put in your signature:

1. Your make/model of TV
2. Your make/model of Amp
3. How your TV and Amp are connected

Excellent work Casey.

Thank you! You've done such a great job, I feel like I have big shoes to fill! :D

I presume this link should point here and not the disc problems thread? -

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1009104

You are correct; sorry about that. I've corrected the link so it now points to the firmware thread instead.

As I understand it a 4:3 SD DVD is stretched vertically to 16:9 when BH200 outputs over HDMI in 1280x720p, 1920x1080i or 1920x1080p.

If you set the BH200 to output in 720x480 (or if available 720x576) the problem doesn't occur and a 4:3 SD DVD displays in 4:3. If you use a Component cable (which I think is only sent out as 720x480/720x576) the problem also doesn't occur.

Interesting. I'm going to do some testing of my own tonight when I get home from work. The only thing I won't be able to check is what happens when connecting via HDMI instead of component. I'm pretty sure I don't have any component cables laying around. Can anyone else out there give this a try?

Thanks, again!

-C.

bradavon:
The issue wasn't whether it would be added to old posts without a sig. The problem is, the current sig is the *only* sig that's ever displayed...on all posts wth a sig...regardless of what the sig was at the time the post was created (i.e. I don't think the sig contents are stamped on the post, only that a sig should be displayed).

Bottom line, anything in the sig cannot be accurately correlated to the content of a specific post. Particularly as time goes on (i.e. someone reading the bug list a month from now). IMO, if the firmware/driver/connection/equipment details are to be meaningful, that info should included in the body of the post.

re: helicopter on bitstreamed DD+ tracks (to Onkoyo receivers at least)
Has anyone found a work around for this?

In an earlier post you indicated that changing from 192kHz to 96kHz avoided the problem. Did it make a difference? Or is the helicopter happening anyway?

re: helicopter on bitstreamed DD+ tracks (to Onkoyo receivers at least)


In an earlier post you indicated that changing from 192kHz to 96kHz avoided the problem. Did it make a difference? Or is the helicopter happening anyway?

I thought it had but it didn't make a difference. The issue happens sporadically and only seems to be related to HD DVD's?

I think the Amp/TV info would be meaningful as that tends to rarely change for most users. Anyway back to bug discussion.

@davcole - thanks for your detailed posting! So just to clarify, you're having this problem with both Blu-rays and HD DVD movies and with audio formats other than DD+? May I assume you are using HDMI to your 705?

-C.

This is only happening with HD DVD bitstreaming so far only with DD+ and the DTS core (dts... only one disc). Yes, i'm using HDMI connection from BH200 to the Onkyo 705.

Most tv's have this option... they let the user decide how 4:3 material should be displayed.

It'd be nice if LG adds in a function to set it to "dot to dot" or "stretch". I like mine stretched for 4:3 as I totally do not like huge black areas on my screen.

@volleybradt - could you please provide a few more details such as the make/model of your receiver, what disks you've had this happen on, etc.?


I use a Pioneer Elite 92 receiver and the problem is limited of course to HD DVDs that use DD+. Also this is only in bitstreaming while connected to HDMI.

Most tv's have this option... they let the user decide how 4:3 material should be displayed.
Isn't the problem that this display mode isn't available? My TV has such a mode but the available modes change depending on the connection type, annoyingly.

Yes. What I meant was that LG probably doesn't need to implement a "dot to dot" or "stretch" option, because if they just fix the problem, then people should be able to do it with their TVs. No?


Isn't the problem that this display mode isn't available? My TV has such a mode but the available modes change depending on the connection type, annoyingly.

I see what you meant and yes agreed, fix the problem and people can use their TVs 4:3 mode. Which is how it's supposed to be done.

Yes. What I meant was that LG probably doesn't need to implement a "dot to dot" or "stretch" option, because if they just fix the problem, then people should be able to do it with their TVs. No?

Hm...it's weird. The TV still doesn't do it correctly. I had Armageddon DVD and it's "wide screen in a 4:3 ratio". You do "dot to dot" on the TV itself and it's normal 16:9 stretching. You do "stretch", and you can't imagine how ugly it looks. I'll see if I can take a picture sometime. But the TV's option doesn't fix the problem.

No, I what I meant was, if LG were to fix the stretch problem, then we could just use our tv's to control it. I didn't mean that the Tv would fix the problem.

Hm...it's weird. The TV still doesn't do it correctly. I had Armageddon DVD and it's "wide screen in a 4:3 ratio". You do "dot to dot" on the TV itself and it's normal 16:9 stretching. You do "stretch", and you can't imagine how ugly it looks. I'll see if I can take a picture sometime. But the TV's option doesn't fix the problem.

stpat -

Ah, gotcha. Sorry i misunderstood your statement.

(it's so nice to get a clarification of a comment rather than get a "snap-back-at-ya-are-you-stupid-or-what-that's-not-what-i-asked/said-you-moron" response back like in other forums. AVS is very cool. :D)

Thanks for doing this, Casey.

Regarding bug #1:

When sending uncompressed PCM audio from a Blu-ray disk to a receiver via HDMI, audio channels are incorrectly reported as 7.1 instead of 5.1; no sound is output via "extra 2" rear speakers.

Minor nit: I suggest that you edit the start of that sentence to read "When sending uncompressed 5.1 PCM audio...". If a disc happened to contain 7.1 audio, then the observed behaviour wouldn't be a bug (unless the back 2 channels were silent in that case too -- I don't think anyone has reported that).

Minor nit: I suggest that you edit the start of that sentence to read "When sending uncompressed 5.1 PCM audio...". If a disc happened to contain 7.1 audio, then the observed behaviour wouldn't be a bug (unless the back 2 channels were silent in that case too -- I don't think anyone has reported that).

Excellent point. I'll make that edit now. Thanks for your input!

-C.

Are you sure it's not your display device?

I'm watching 4:3 SD DVD content right now, and it's not stretched (black pillars on both side).

By default my tv was stretching, but I went into the tv menu and disabled it, and now it's displaying proper ratio.

My BH200 is set to 1080p, connecting via HDMI to my Onkyo 705 and then HDMI to my Sony 1080p LCD rear proj tv (hdmi switching thru the amp.)

-Stuart



Thanks for putting this together casey.christian!

Here's a bit more info on the SD 4:3 issue:

Reproducibility: Always
Firmware: All (so far BH02080402F, BH02080314B, and original)
Driver: 0702, 0701
Connection: HDMI (component does not upconvert, so it might not exhibit the same problem)

The BH 200 turns off my TV during boot up. I have a Mitsubishi WS 55315. I have no idea if it is a compatablity (resolution) issue, or if the simplink function is sending a signal that the TV is translating as a shut off signal.

This is Via a HDMI to DVI cable connection. And it happens with the resolution set at 1080i or AUTO on the BH200...

FIX THIS IN THE NEXT UPGRADE... PLEASE.

Are you sure it's not your display device?

I'm watching 4:3 SD DVD content right now, and it's not stretched (black pillars on both side).

By default my tv was stretching, but I went into the tv menu and disabled it, and now it's displaying proper ratio.

My BH200 is set to 1080p, connecting via HDMI to my Onkyo 705 and then HDMI to my Sony 1080p LCD rear proj tv (hdmi switching thru the amp.)

-Stuart

What are your video settings on the BH200....mine stretches the picture on 4:3 material on SD DVD when my projector is set to native. With the same projector setting, the projector shows 4:3 480i material from my DVR pillarboxed (both through HDMI through the same input on my amp). I'm using the April firmware with the 702 driver update, so there has to be some type of difference in the BH200.

By default my tv was stretching, but I went into the tv menu and disabled it, and now it's displaying proper ratio.
And there lies the problem. Many TVs don't let you choose the 4:3 mode when being sent a signal from an HDMI cable. Actually it may not be HDMI connected.

I know on my Samsung TV the Display modes change depending what source is being fed it, which is annoying to say the least. I've not tested the BH200 with it yet though.

You're lucky yours does.

Don't forget about the Dolby Digital + issue for some receivers. Hearing nothing but the helicopter sound....

Yes experienced this on the Onkyo 705. After successfully playing some BD's in PCM, DTS-MA and TRUEHD, they all played without a hitch. When I got the player on Sunday I didn't have a problem with it reading my HD DVD's at all wheter it was DD+ or TRUEHD. The second day I loaded some HD DVDs such as Bourne Supremacy and U-571 which I got the "helicopter" sound where you would see that the DD+ bitstream wasn't correctly being sent to the receiver. The 705 does not identify the bitstream being sent, you only get the noise.

[SNIP]

In summary it seems that the bitstream is in connection with HD DVD's and not BD as i've not had a bitstream problem with the BD's i've played.

This is only happening with HD DVD bitstreaming so far only with DD+ and the DTS core (dts... only one disc). Yes, i'm using HDMI connection from BH200 to the Onkyo 705.

I use a Pioneer Elite 92 receiver and the problem is limited of course to HD DVDs that use DD+. Also this is only in bitstreaming while connected to HDMI.

Thank you both for taking the time to provide more details. I've added this as the second "official" bug on the list. Could anyone provide me with links to a couple other threads where this has been discussed? I'd like to provide those as well if possible.

On a side note, I've watched Charlie & the Chocolate Factory, Alexander Revisited, Sleepy Hollow, Into the Wild, and a couple others that I can't think of right now in their entirety on HD DVD with DD+ bitstreaming to my Onkyo 705 and have yet to have an issue. Maybe I've just been lucky so far?

-C.

Are you sure it's not your display device?

I'm watching 4:3 SD DVD content right now, and it's not stretched (black pillars on both side).

By default my tv was stretching, but I went into the tv menu and disabled it, and now it's displaying proper ratio.

My BH200 is set to 1080p, connecting via HDMI to my Onkyo 705 and then HDMI to my Sony 1080p LCD rear proj tv (hdmi switching thru the amp.)

-Stuart
Totally not the display that was stretching it.

Are you also connected via HDMI? What resolution have you set?

480p/i should be fine. Component is probably OK too. Neither of those involve upconversion.

As soon as upconversion is involved, the SD 4:3 image is stretched as though it was anamorphic content...even though it's not.

I suppose it's possible the April firmware fixed that...pretty sure I tested it...but I'm not home right now so I can't verify. D'oh. I'll re-test this weekend.

@ davcole & volleybradt - one other question I just thought of. Have either of you (or anyone else reading) tried decoding the DD+ internally and then sending it via PCM Multi-Ch? Is it only a bitstreaming problem, in other words? Thanks!

-C.

I've gone ahead and posted this as bug #3, but please keep me posted. I'm interested to see everyone's findings. Is it an HDMI issue? Is it a 1080 upscaling issue? Can certain TV's display the 4:3 correctly, etc.? Thanks!

-C.

Totally not the display that was stretching it.

Are you also connected via HDMI? What resolution have you set?

480p/i should be fine. Component is probably OK too. Neither of those involve upconversion.

As soon as upconversion is involved, the SD 4:3 image is stretched as though it was anamorphic content...even though it's not.

I suppose it's possible the April firmware fixed that...pretty sure I tested it...but I'm not home right now so I can't verify. D'oh. I'll re-test this weekend.

As I understand it it's not an Upscaling issue but how the BH200 handles a 4:3 aspect ratio. I believe it does this as there are no 4:3 aspect ratios in the HD arena and it's designed to be an HD Player first, obviously LG should take account of 4:3 though.

And because of this 4:3 (or letterbox) material is treated as if it was 16:9. Even anamorphic content shouldn't be "forced" into 16:9. Obviously you're always going to want to but technically speaking you should be able to choose the 4:3 mode even with anamorphic content. Does that make sense?

The problem seems to be that because the BH200 is sending the wrong type of signal (maybe a missing flag) the TV gets the wrong signal and denies access to the 4:3 mode, in most/many TV cases.

Could anyone provide me with links to a couple other threads where this has been discussed? I'd like to provide those as well if possible.
You could use the posts you quoted as the source links :).

Have either of you (or anyone else reading) tried decoding the DD+ internally and then sending it via PCM Multi-Ch? Is it only a bitstreaming problem, in other words? Thanks!
Yes I'm sure I read it was a DD+ "Bitstream" problem.

Casey: I only see 2 (PCM 5.1 as and DD+) not 3?

Just posted it ... please read it and let me know what you think of the wording and if I explained it well. I understand what you're saying about it needing to handle 4:3 and not forcing everything into 16:9, but I just want to get all the facts and keep the actual bug posting as brief and concise as possible.

-C.

Cool.

What about Audio and Video drop outs? That bug needs mentioning.

Just posted it ...
Shouldn't it be 480p not 480i? Also you could say 480p/576p. I'm sure 576p would be fine too and when the BH200 outputs PAL it will be 576p (i.e - A Euro Player or Modified North American Player).

It reads fine. Agreed you want to be as concise as possible, to the point is best.

The BH 200 turns off my TV during boot up. I have a Mitsubishi WS 55315. I have no idea if it is a compatablity (resolution) issue, or if the simplink function is sending a signal that the TV is translating as a shut off signal.

This is Via a HDMI to DVI cable connection. And it happens with the resolution set at 1080i or AUTO on the BH200.

Thanks for your posting! Do you know if anyone else has experienced these problems with their TV? If so, is it only a Mitsubishi thing or does it happen with other makes as well? Please provide me with links if possible to other user's postings about this.

If not, I'll add your bug as reported by one person tomorrow. Thanks!

-C.

Agreed. I've never had an audio dropout, but I get video dropouts pretty regularly.

The odd thing is, it happens pretty frequently when in the BH200 home menu (a quick flash to black, and then the picture returns), but it doesn't happen that much when watching movies (although I have had a few).

-Stuart


Cool.
What about Audio and Video drop outs? That bug needs mentioning.

Re: My two pennies worth on "Confirmed by more than one user/Confirmed by one user":

While I think this works fine for "Disc Problems" it could open an Aladdin's Cave of possible bugs and before you know it the list is endless. Many/Some of these "one user" bugs could be incompatibilities.

In the case of "Disc Problems" I tend to only put on problems that affect the movie and/or extras. If for example it's a case of subs not being selectable from the menu but you can use the remote or the menus are a bit glitchy but otherwise work I'm not inclined to include them. So as to try and manage the amount of titles on the list.

That's just my opinion though :).

What about Audio and Video drop outs? That bug needs mentioning.

Do you think that qualifies as non-disk specific? Yeah, I'll just answer my own question ... yes, it qualifies! I'll add that tomorrow.

Shouldn't it be 480p not 480i? Also you could say 480p/576p. I'm sure 576p would be fine too and when the BH200 outputs PAL it will be 576p (i.e - A Euro Player or Modified North American Player).

You're probably right; following oilblue's lead, I changed it to read 480i/p. And, not to sound too "American centric" but I'll just leave the whole 576p out of it for now. Besides, you Europeans are smart enough to figure out what I'm talking about! ;)

Thanks, again for all your help and input!

-C.

Thanks for your posting! Do you know if anyone else has experienced these problems with their TV? If so, is it only a Mitsubishi thing or does it happen with other makes as well? Please provide me with links if possible to other user's postings about this.

If not, I'll add your bug as reported by one person tomorrow. Thanks!

-C.

I haven't been able to find anyone else with the issue, but of course I haven't been able to find anyone with the same TV that doesn't have the issue either. If someone has the same tv with no problems, then I may be able to narrow the solution down.
But I can say it is not a random thing, it happens 100% of the time, at the same time. So I'm not sure if it is a simplink signal, or if it is a handshake conflict.
For all I know it could be a signal being sent from the BH that is conflicting with the TV which is forcing a shut down, which of course can't be good.
So what I do , just in case, is leave the TV off until the BH has fully booted, or leave the TV on a different input during the boot up.
The Mitsu does not diplay 720i or p , so I'm wandering if the TV is protecting during the AUTO 720 scan, so to attempt to correct it I turned the AUTO resolution to 1080i, which did not work. So that could indicate that the forced resolution setting on the BH is not functioning correctly, and the BH is still AUTO setting. ANY IDEAS??? Does any on have the same Mits series TV?

THANKS....

As I understand it it's not an Upscaling issue but how the BH200 handles a 4:3 aspect ratio. I believe it does this as there are no 4:3 aspect ratios in the HD arena and it's designed to be an HD Player first, obviously LG should take account of 4:3 though.

And because of this 4:3 (or letterbox) material is treated as if it was 16:9. Even anamorphic content shouldn't be "forced" into 16:9. Obviously you're always going to want to but technically speaking you should be able to choose the 4:3 mode even with anamorphic content. Does that make sense?

The problem seems to be that because the BH200 is sending the wrong type of signal (maybe a missing flag) the TV gets the wrong signal and denies access to the 4:3 mode, in most/many TV cases.

Actually, upconverting is most likely part and parcel of this problem. I think someone posted that a resolution setting below 720p resulted in proper 4:3 aspect ratio.

With upconverting everything probably has to be forced into 16:9. The whole point of upconverting to 720p/1080i is that it's to a widescreen display. If it's not a widescreen display, then don't upconvert (select a resolution below 720p).

There isn't really a flag the BH200 could insert into a 720p/1080i signal. It just has to upconvert properly (i.e. maintain the aspect ratio).

Currently it looks like the BH200 treats all SD content as anamorphic, stretches that (as it should for anamorphic), and then upconverts it to either 720p or 1080i (as selected under Resolution).

AFAIK, the BH200 is not the only hi-def player with this problem.

In addition to verifying the problem with 4:3 source content this weekend, I'll check a widescreen non-anamorphic source (original Titanic DVD). Could prove interesting.

AFAIK, the BH200 is not the only hi-def player with this problem.

The machine that has a lot of fanboys -- PS3 -- has the same issue with SD material on Blu-ray discs...however, it treats 100% SD DVD's correctly.

@ davcole & volleybradt - one other question I just thought of. Have either of you (or anyone else reading) tried decoding the DD+ internally and then sending it via PCM Multi-Ch? Is it only a bitstreaming problem, in other words? Thanks!

-C.

Bitstreaming is the only issue, works when decoded internally...

And, not to sound too "American centric" but I'll just leave the whole 576p out of it for now. Besides, you Europeans are smart enough to figure out what I'm talking about! ;)
Don't forget Canadians North of the border too ;). If I kept the "disc problem" thread European focused it wouldn't have much on it and all the dates would be in a funny order ;). There'd probably be a revolution too :D. American's playing PAL discs will also output in 576i/p.

Anyway fair enough.

The Mitsu does not diplay 720i or p
That is unusual.

Have you tried a different HDMI lead and/or a Component lead? You could even test it with a Composite lead, just to see if it turns the TV off.

Actually, upconverting is most likely part and parcel of this problem.
It is indirectly but I was hypothesising that's it more the fact it's now an HD resolution than part of the Upscaling process. Which I guess indirectly you were too.

I'll check a widescreen non-anamorphic source (original Titanic DVD). Could prove interesting.
It will be interesting to see because with a non-anamorphic source you'd want to use your Zoom not 4:3 mode on your TV.

That is unusual.

Have you tried a different HDMI lead and/or a Component lead? You could even test it with a Composite lead, just to see if it turns the TV off.




No I haven't tried another cable yet, mostly because it's the same cable I used with my A30 with no problems at all.

Also I may have not been clear, but the Mistu only displays 480i, 480p and 1080i.

I could solve the problem by purchasing a new TV but, my plan is to add a projector later. But the problem I am having may be an indicator of a bug. As I said, it may indicate that the setting on the BH for forced resolution is not functioning properly. Can anyone test this on a TV that displays all of the resolution. Can you see if, when placing the BH on a forced resolution, that the BH still auto searches?

Hi,
here is another bug:
No "Multichannel-PCM" via HDMI, only "stereo" with Denon 4306 (european model)
My player: BH200 ,US-model, current driver/sw. Tried all settings (pass through, PCM etc.)
Confirmed by another user from norway (heja).
Greetings,
Andreas, Heidelberg, Germany

I haven't been able to find anyone else with the issue, but of course I haven't been able to find anyone with the same TV that doesn't have the issue either. If someone has the same tv with no problems, then I may be able to narrow the solution down.
But I can say it is not a random thing, it happens 100% of the time, at the same time. So I'm not sure if it is a simplink signal, or if it is a handshake conflict.
For all I know it could be a signal being sent from the BH that is conflicting with the TV which is forcing a shut down, which of course can't be good.
So what I do , just in case, is leave the TV off until the BH has fully booted, or leave the TV on a different input during the boot up.
The Mitsu does not diplay 720i or p , so I'm wandering if the TV is protecting during the AUTO 720 scan, so to attempt to correct it I turned the AUTO resolution to 1080i, which did not work. So that could indicate that the forced resolution setting on the BH is not functioning correctly, and the BH is still AUTO setting. ANY IDEAS??? Does any on have the same Mits series TV?

THANKS....

I have a Mits 65315 so, other than the screen size, it should be pretty much the same as the 55315. I have not experienced this problem but the HDMI outputs from both my DVR and the 200 are going into my Onkyo 875 receiver, not directly to the TV. Out of the 875, I have HDMI to DVI going to the TV. The 200 is set to 1080i.

Hey, all - sorry I've been kind of M.I.A. lately; very busy at work and at home it seems. I just added the audio and video drops bug. Please let me know if you think the wording is off or if there are any important details I missed. I'll try to get caught up with the other items this weekend.

On an unrelated (and off topic posting, I know ... I know) note, I just ordered my new television. After much research and consideration, I went with the Samsung PN50A550. I'm very excited! I've always had either Panasonic or Pioneer 42" plasmas before, but both the user and professional reviews have been so good that I just couldn't resist. It should be here sometime late next week. I'm feeling like a kid in a candy store right now!

-C.

Are video drop outs more common than audio ones?

Quick question, off topic: What type of tuner is common in American TVs? Analogue, Digital or both? 99.9% of UK TVs now have Digital (Aerial) and Analogue tuners.

I hope you like the new TV.

Hi,
here is another bug:
No "Multichannel-PCM" via HDMI, only "stereo" with Denon 4306 (european model)
My player: BH200 ,US-model, current driver/sw. Tried all settings (pass through, PCM etc.)
Confirmed by another user from norway (heja).
Greetings,
Andreas, Heidelberg, Germany

Maybe you can only get Multichannel PCM with HDMI 1.3. Works fine with my Onkyo 875. Anyone having this problem with a Denon 4308?

Maybe you can only get Multichannel PCM with HDMI 1.3. Works fine with my Onkyo 875. Anyone having this problem with a Denon 4308?

You should be able to get Multichannel PCM with any version of HDMI, but there does seem to be an issue with the Denon 4306 in particular (I don't know whether 4306 owners are able to get Multichannel PCM from sources other than the BH200?).

I have a Mits 65315 so, other than the screen size, it should be pretty much the same as the 55315. I have not experienced this problem but the HDMI outputs from both my DVR and the 200 are going into my Onkyo 875 receiver, not directly to the TV. Out of the 875, I have HDMI to DVI going to the TV. The 200 is set to 1080i.

Thanks, would it be possible to connect your 200 directly to you TV to test it? Hopefully it would be as simple as unplugging your HDMI from your reciever and plugging it into your 200. You can PM me direct if you would like.
Sounds like your Reciever may be filtering.
Thanks again. Oh what brand is your DVI to HDMI cable?

The HD DVD "helicopter" sound problem also exists with Marantz receivers and is not intermittent. It is constant with DD and DD+. TrueHD is fine. Running the latest firmware, 0702 driver, and a Marantz SR7002.

Are video drop outs more common than audio ones?

I think so. Granted, you probably spend a lot more time reading and posting on these threads than I do, but from everything I've read that seems to be the case. Certainly for me; I've had my BH200 about two months now and have only had video dropouts; not even one audio drop. I just finished watching The Bourne Identity on HD DVD and had just one video drop and no audio.

Could anybody else weigh in on this? Am I correct that video dropouts are more common than audio?

I hope you like the new TV.

Thanks! Me, too!!

-C.

Hi,

That's definitely the case for me. I get the occasional split-second video drop out, but I've never had an audio dropout.

-Stuart


I think so. Granted, you probably spend a lot more time reading and posting on these threads than I do, but from everything I've read that seems to be the case. Certainly for me; I've had my BH200 about two months now and have only had video dropouts; not even one audio drop. I just finished watching The Bourne Identity on HD DVD and had just one video drop and no audio.

Could anybody else weigh in on this? Am I correct that video dropouts are more common than audio?



Thanks! Me, too!!

-C.

Thanks, would it be possible to connect your 200 directly to you TV to test it? Hopefully it would be as simple as unplugging your HDMI from your reciever and plugging it into your 200. You can PM me direct if you would like.
Sounds like your Reciever may be filtering.
Thanks again. Oh what brand is your DVI to HDMI cable?

When I connected the 200 directly to the TV, it turned off the TV during boot-up just as you experienced. I was able to turn the TV back on after the 200 boot-up. Whatever signal from the 200 is shutting down the TV apparently is getting filtered out in the HDMI switching in my receiver. The only other device that has ever been connected directly to the TV via HDMI/DVI was my DVR and it caused no issues.

This is probably a bug but would be good if another DVI user could confirm. The BH200 forces PC Video levels when connected to a DVI device. The black level setting has no effect and always resets to off. Quite a few devices with DVI inputs use proper video levels so the black level setting should be made to work with DVI.

Thanks BobHD for testing it.

When I connected the 200 directly to the TV, it turned off the TV during boot-up just as you experienced. I was able to turn the TV back on after the 200 boot-up. Whatever signal from the 200 is shutting down the TV apparently is getting filtered out in the HDMI switching in my receiver. The only other device that has ever been connected directly to the TV via HDMI/DVI was my DVR and it caused no issues.

BobHD,
Thanks for testing that. You saved me time and $$$, so I won't need to try and track down different cables etc. I believe this is now a confirmed bug. Now can anyone think of any way to test if the forced resolution setting is actually functioning properly? My guess is that somewhere the 200 is sending a 720 signal that is causing the Mitsu to shut down (protection) but that is only a guess. It could be also simplink issue, because it looks like mitsu used the DVI cable for thier monitorlink feature. But if that was the case why would your reciever be blocking a function command signal? That is why I think it has to do more with the forced resolution issue.

Another way to test it ; if anyone has a Mitsu with 720 capabilites, and Monitorlink. If the TV shuts down, we can conclude it is a Simplink issue, (and most likely little can be done to correct it). If the TV does not shut down, then it seem it would be a forced resolution setting. Can anyone help?

Thanks again.

This is probably a bug but would be good if another DVI user could confirm. The BH200 forces PC Video levels when connected to a DVI device. The black level setting has no effect and always resets to off. Quite a few devices with DVI inputs use proper video levels so the black level setting should be made to work with DVI.
The black level setting also flips to off via HDMI. It's not just a DVI thing.

I thought the preferred option is to have blacker than black "off" (though it helps for calibration). Are you saying that even with it off, blacker than black is sent via DVI?

Wasn't clear to me, so I thought I ask in case DVI users have the same question.

The black level setting also flips to off via HDMI. It's not just a DVI thing.

I thought the preferred option is to have blacker than black "off" (though it helps for calibration). Are you saying that even with it off, blacker than black is sent via DVI?

Wasn't clear to me, so I thought I ask in case DVI users have the same question.

The manual says that the BH200's "Black Level" setting only applies to SD component output, it's not the BTB setting we're used to talking about with DVI, it's just confusingly named.

Krobar, how are you testing whether the BH200 passes BTB to your screen? Let me know, I have a DVI monitor and can test too.

YI don't know whether 4306 owners are able to get Multichannel PCM from sources other than the BH200?
The PS3 and Toshiba HD- E1 are working fine with MChPCM via HDMI so it is probably a specific Denon 4306 Problem, with the 4308 the BH200 is working well (see member AlfaGT). It is the question if it is a HDMI 1.1 Problem with the BH200-has anybody MultiCH PCM with BH200 and HDMI 1.1 Reciever? HDMI should always work with MultiCh PCM- like the 4306 does with PS3 and Toshiba. The sound via Toshiba (MultiCH PCM) is better (Yes I can hear that!), now via BH200 I have only the DTS-Core in Multichannel, for the rest (bitstream, PCM MCh via HDMI) the 4306 only understands "stereo".
Any help possible?
@casey: heja from norway had the same problem, I think it could be helpful, if others can read about the problem with Denon 4306 in the bug report before buying the BH200..thanks a lot
Andreas

The manual says that the BH200's "Black Level" setting only applies to SD component output, it's not the BTB setting we're used to talking about with DVI, it's just confusingly named.

Krobar, how are you testing whether the BH200 passes BTB to your screen? Let me know, I have a DVI monitor and can test too.

I have tested using DVE HD Basics (Bluray) and it is defnitely using PC levels so I suspect BTB wont work but I can check later.

Ok getting back to the "helicopter sound" when bitstreaming. Over the weekend I finally uploaded the new driver to the player and so far haven't had a problem bitstreaming DD+ or DTS from HD DVD. I'll cross my fingers hoping that is the resolution.

Oh, now I understand about the stretching of the 4x3 material. Yes, something definitely needs to be done about that!

The PS3 and Toshiba HD- E1 are working fine with MChPCM via HDMI so it is probably a specific Denon 4306 Problem, with the 4308 the BH200 is working well (see member AlfaGT). It is the question if it is a HDMI 1.1 Problem with the BH200-has anybody MultiCH PCM with BH200 and HDMI 1.1 Reciever?

Dear Mr.Truesound

Like you wrote, the Denon is capable of handle Multichannel PCM. I now own the Denon 4308 which handles Multichannel PCM and Bitstream from the LG like a king. Back when I had the 4306 I sent Multichannel PCM from my PS3 to the Denon and it worked fine.

So, it must be a specific issue with the combo 4306-BH200.
Perhaps it can't be wrong to search if there is a newer firmware for the 4306 available.

Sorry, I know I made a lot of propaganda on the german forum for the BH-200, so I think I am one of the reasons you bought the LG. Besides this problem, I hope you are however happy with the LG which is a wonderful machine.

Cheers
AlfaGT

Hi,
happy to have the LG200-no question. In Germany it is not possible to get one and now I can even change from Region A to B-very good! Thank you AlfaGT!:)
For the Denon 4306:the firmware is new-I already tried that.
I think it is a real BUG.
Now I'm waiting for a good AV-pre to upgrade with HDMI1.3...
Andreas

Hi,
happy to have the LG200-no question. In Germany it is not possible to get one and now I can even change from Region A to B-very good! Thank you AlfaGT!:)
For the Denon 4306:the firmware is new-I already tried that.
I think it is a real BUG.
Now I'm waiting for a good AV-pre to upgrade with HDMI1.3...
Andreas

You don't have to thank me. It's the work of others that the LG can be made code-free for SD-DVD and the Blu Region can be switched. I have only tested the hacks and codes other found on a Euro-Player. I think I was long time the only European with a BH-200, because the launch in Switzerland was month before the release in other EU countries. Perhaps it's an advantage not to be part of the EU ;)

Cheers

P.S. Im a huge Denon-Fan ;) and I really can recommend the 4308 - wonderful piece of hardware. Give it a try, it's worth the money.

In Germany it is not possible to get one
That's weird, when Switzerland is next door to Germany.

You don't have to thank me. It's the work of others that the LG can be made code-free for SD-DVD and the Blu Region can be switched.
You definitely helped too, what's this? -

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=13808465&postcount=33
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=13814541&postcount=64

The first one particularly led to working out how to make a Region A BH200 Region B.

Here's a bug that I have noticed lately on my BH200.When a movie (HDdvd) is loaded and the display button is pushed,their is no a red hi-lite bar in the display icon.Leaving me unable to move around and make changes.This is only happening with HDdvd discs.Bluray and dvd discs give me the red hi-lite bar in this icon.Anybody else experiencing this.I'am running the new April firmware.Is their a fix for this so that I may get the red hi-lite bar back with an HDdvd disc playing?

@casey: heja from norway had the same problem, I think it could be helpful, if others can read about the problem with Denon 4306 in the bug report before buying the BH200..thanks a lot
Andreas

I now own the Denon 4308 which handles Multichannel PCM and Bitstream from the LG like a king. Back when I had the 4306 I sent Multichannel PCM from my PS3 to the Denon and it worked fine.

So, it must be a specific issue with the combo 4306-BH200.


For the Denon 4306:the firmware is new-I already tried that.
I think it is a real BUG.

Hey, guys ... I added this to the bug list. I tried to include all the pertinent information so please take a look at it and let me know what you think about the wording. Do I need to add, delete, or change anything? Thanks!

-C.

Casey, what's the difference between? -

Confirmed by multiple users:
Confirmed by 2 to 5 (approximate) users:

Thanks.

Casey, what's the difference between? -

Confirmed by multiple users:
Confirmed by 2 to 5 (approximate) users:

Thanks.

Well, this is primarily because of your suggestion about not posting "single user" issues as they'd quickly become too much and might not actually be a bug at all but just incompatibility issues that aren't really a BH200 problem. I agree with you and think it's a valid point, but at the same time don't want anyone to feel their issue (which is, no doubt, very important to them) is being ignored.

Any way, I'm still thinking about the best wording.

-C.

EDIT - ok, changed wording a little and included description/definition. What do you think?

Thanks. Sorry I wasn't being sarcastic. I wasn't sure how they differed. The new wording is spot on.

Well, this is primarily because of your suggestion about not posting "single user" issues as they'd quickly become too much and might not actually be a bug at all but just incompatibility issues that aren't really a BH200 problem. I agree with you and think it's a valid point, but at the same time don't want anyone to feel their issue (which is, no doubt, very important to them) is being ignored.

Any way, I'm still thinking about the best wording.

-C.

EDIT - ok, changed wording a little and included description/definition. What do you think?

Casey, Do I get my confirmed bug listed.... I'm feeling left out.:( I still would like to see if someone can figure out a way to confirm if it is a simplink issue or a forced resolution issue...

Casey, Do I get my confirmed bug listed.... I'm feeling left out.:( I still would like to see if someone can figure out a way to confirm if it is a simplink issue or a forced resolution issue...

Sorry ... I haven't forgotten you, I promise! I was just waiting a bit to see how the thread shook out with the debate over what might be causing your issue. I try to get as much info as possible before I add a bug so I can keep the wording concise.

I'll try to get yours posted by the end of the day.

-C.

Thanks. Sorry I wasn't being sarcastic. I wasn't sure how they differed. The new wording is spot on.

No worries; I didn't think you were being sarcastic. I was just still working on the best way to separate everything. Thanks!

-C.

finally hooked up with Pioneer 9120TXH receiver, set to HDMI pass throu, result is "devastating" on HD DVD:

- ALL lossy HD sound (DD+, DTS HD HR) is helicopter noise, consistent issue
- lossless HD (TruHD, DTS HD MA) works fine, however Pan's Labyrinth has DTS HD MA 7.1, but only shown 5.1 on my receiver (first a few seconds is 7.1, could be receiver issue?)

on BD:

- PCM 5.1 shown as 7.1 on receiver
- TruHD works fine, shown as 5.1

If set to recode to PCM, is output lossy or lossless PCM? from what I can tell, it seems to be lossy.

Mr. LG, please fix these issues ASAP :D

btw, my BH200 has the latest firmware and driver

Bitstreaming

I thought after updating the driver that would take care of the issue. Ironically it was working after the driver update no problem. When I changed from the Qoed processor to personal settings then went back to play an HD DVD is when it started the helicopter sound again on DD+. As stated above, when I switched to TRUEHD on a DVD, there was no problem at all. Sadly I don't have a DTS-HD or DD+ BD to truly know if it's format or codec specific?

I think I will try to exchange for another unit (if available) as it doesn't seem to affect all players? One thing for sure it's better so far as a BD player than an HD DVD player when it comes to streaming.

If set to recode to PCM, is output lossy or lossless PCM? from what I can tell, it seems to be lossy.

PCM Multi-Ch depends on the decoding capabilities of the player. In the case of the BH200, it is both lossless and lossy:
- lossless for Dolby TrueHD since the BH200 can decode it
- lossy for DTS-HD since it can't decode that (so it does the lossy "core only)

See BD Player Audio Support Comparison

- ALL lossy HD sound (DD+, DTS HD HR) is helicopter noise, consistent issue
- lossless HD (TruHD, DTS HD MA) works fine, however Pan's Labyrinth has DTS HD MA 7.1, but only shown 5.1 on my receiver (first a few seconds is 7.1, could be receiver issue?)

on BD:

- PCM 5.1 shown as 7.1 on receiver
- TruHD works fine, shown as 5.1

If set to recode to PCM, is output lossy or lossless PCM? from what I can tell, it seems to be lossy.

Hi, wlee - thanks for taking the time to share! Sorry to hear you're having these issues with the "helicopter" noise when bitstreaming DD+. As you know, that's a well established bug that a lot of people have reported. I've personally never experienced it with my Onkyo 705 receiver. But, I still usually switch over to Multi-Chan PCM instead of Primary Pass-Thru on the LG if I'm having friends over and we're watching an HD DVD with DD+, just to be safe.

I think you are the first person to have problems with DTS-HD that I know of. Granted, it's pretty rare to see DTS-HD, especially on the HD DVD format. As for DTS-HD Master Audio, the Pan's Labyrinth disk is the only domestic HD DVD I'm aware of that has that audio codec. With my Onkyo 705 and the BH200 set to Primary Pass-Thru, I show 7.1 on Pan's; that might be a receiver issue.

Your experience with Blu-ray and PCM vs. TrueHD seems to be the same as everybody else's.

The BH200 is capable of internally decoding both DD+ and TrueHD as is required by the HD DVD spec. So, if you set the LG to Multi-Chan PCM instead of Primary Pass-Thru, you'll get DD+ and lossless TrueHD sent to your receiver. As for DTS-HD/MA, it will distract the core (1.5 mbps) audio and send that which should still sound pretty good; the only lossless codec you're giving up with internal decoding is DTS-HD Master Audio.

-C.

I realise it's a pain but you could always choose:

1. Primary Pass-Thru for DTS-HD and/or TrueHD
2. PCM Multi-CH for DD+ and/or TrueHD

I'd rather do that than lose DTS-HD (particularly DTS-HD MA), if my Amp supported DTS-HD.

Sadly I don't have a DTS-HD or DD+ BD to truly know if it's format or codec specific?

I think I will try to exchange for another unit (if available) as it doesn't seem to affect all players? One thing for sure it's better so far as a BD player than an HD DVD player when it comes to streaming.

I don't think it's a format specific issue, though I'm just guessing. Very, very few Blu-rays have DD+ (I can't think of any actually) so it's hard to test. But, my guess would be that if it's a problem on HD DVD it probably would be on Blu, too.

Personally, I'm not sure if you'd want to exchange it or not; it seems to affect most everyone. While I personally haven't experienced it yet with my Onkyo 705, that doesn't mean I won't. But, I'm thinking/hoping it will be resolved with a firmware or driver update.

-C.

I think when DTS-HD is mentioned it's about the CORE. I did notice the same when I played U-571 one time and got the same helicopter sound. I don't have a DTS-MA disc. I'm curious if those who have any DTS-MA hd dvd's have found this to be true?

I have no problem with the dts-ma on BD.

I think you are the first person to have problems with DTS-HD that I know of. Granted, it's pretty rare to see DTS-HD, especially on the HD DVD format. As for DTS-HD Master Audio, the Pan's Labyrinth disk is the only domestic HD DVD I'm aware of that has that audio codec. With my Onkyo 705 and the BH200 set to Primary Pass-Thru, I show 7.1 on Pan's; that might be a receiver issue.


I read somewhere DTS-HD HR is just a rebranded regular DTS at full rate 1.5mbps, BH200 reports it as dts-HD 5.1 or 6.1 by hitting Display key, all the disc I tried has the same helicopter noise issue as DD+: Top Gun, Face/Off, Riddick.

Regarding DTS-HD MA 7.1 on Pan's Labyrinth, I really hope it's BH200's "fault" and can be fixed by firmware, as I'm not sure if Pioneer 9120TXH is capable of firmware update ;) I played again, interestingly the beginning part (High Definition) before Menu is shown 7.1 source on my receiver and BH200 Display shows 7.1 too, however the movie itself is shown 5.1 source on receiver while BH200 Display shows 7.1.

I read somewhere DTS-HD HR is just a rebranded regular DTS at full rate 1.5mbps, BH200 reports it as dts-HD 5.1 or 6.1 by hitting Display key, all the disc I tried has the same helicopter noise issue as DD+: Top Gun, Face/Off, Riddick.


DTS-HD HR is apparently more than regular DTS. According to Wikipedia it goes up to 3mbps on HD DVD or 6mbps on BD, and can deliver 7.1 channels at 96khz/24-bit. The BH200 reports all kinds of DTS-HD as DTS-HD and doesn't seem to distinguish between HR and MA.

Regarding DTS-HD MA 7.1 on Pan's Labyrinth, I really hope it's BH200's "fault" and can be fixed by firmware, as I'm not sure if Pioneer 9120TXH is capable of firmware update ;) I played again, interestingly the beginning part (High Definition) before Menu is shown 7.1 source on my receiver and BH200 Display shows 7.1 too, however the movie itself is shown 5.1 source on receiver while BH200 Display shows 7.1.

That's the fault of the disc. There were many complaints about the 5.1/7.1 on Pan's for both Blu and Red.

Pan's is the only mainstream movie DTS-HD MA disc on HD DVD. However, there are quite a few music and concert discs from Surround Records and others that used DTS-HD MA (or HR) on HD DVD.

I heard DD+ on BD only supports 7.1 audio meaning most of the time it cannot be used, so DD5.1 is used.

I'm sure DTS-HD HR is different to DTS. There wouldn't be much point in re-branding DTS as DTS-HD HR. I've read several reviews saying the DTS-HD HR is only 1.5Mbps but my thinking is they're all picking up the Core and not knowing it.

Pan's is the only mainstream movie DTS-HD MA disc on HD DVD. However, there are quite a few music and concert discs from Surround Records and others that used DTS-HD MA (or HR) on HD DVD.
In North America ;). Studio Canal (France) put out nearly 30 HD-DVDs, all with DTS-HD MA. Many were ported across Europe and Australasia. Terminator 2 is one example. You can see a list here :) -

http://www.bulletsnbabesdvd.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=4441

That's the fault of the disc. There were many complaints about the 5.1/7.1 on Pan's for both Blu and Red.
What's wrong with the audio on Pan's Labyrthing? I plan to pick up the USA BD. Thanks.

The UK BD and HD-DVD has better PQ but only DD5.1.

I read somewhere DTS-HD HR is just a rebranded regular DTS at full rate 1.5mbps, BH200 reports it as dts-HD 5.1 or 6.1 by hitting Display key, all the disc I tried has the same helicopter noise issue as DD+: Top Gun, Face/Off, Riddick.

As someone else has already pointed out, there is a difference between DTS and DTS-HD, that's for sure. In fact, as I understand it, there's a bigger difference between DTS and DTS-HD than there is between DD and DD+. Wikipedia is a good source for all the technical details.

Regarding DTS-HD MA 7.1 on Pan's Labyrinth, I really hope it's BH200's "fault" and can be fixed by firmware, as I'm not sure if Pioneer 9120TXH is capable of firmware update ;)

That's interesting. I've never checked it on the BH200's display, just on my receiver. Like I said in my last post, I'm almost positive that my Onkyo 705 reported 7.1 correctly, but I'll double check tonight.

What's wrong with the audio on Pan's Labyrthing? I plan to pick up the USA BD. Thanks.

This is the first I've heard about there being a problem, so I'm not sure. But I can tell you that the audio sounds great! Whether or not it is correctly reported as 5.1 or 7.1 aside, I don't think it should make you reconsider your purchase as it certainly doesn't reflect negatively on what you'll hear.

-C.

Thanks Casey.

I'm a 5.1 user (well "currently" 5.0) so as long as that works I'll be happy. AFAIK the only difference between DD and DD+ is the latter support higher bitrates and up to 7.1.

Aren't DTS-HD HR and MA the same except one supports a higher lossless bitrate?

AFAIK the only difference between DD and DD+ is the latter support higher bitrates and up to 7.1.

Aren't DTS-HD HR and MA the same except one supports a higher lossless bitrate?

Yes, you are correct about DD+; it enhances DD by offering a maximum bitrate of 1.5 and up to 7.1 discrete channels. From a cynical standpoint, one could say that just makes DD as good as DTS has been from years; but I'm not complaining because a well done DTS soundtrack at 1.5 mbps can sound damn good.

As for the difference between DTS-HD and DTS-HD MA, I can't say I know for sure but I think it is more complicated than just lossy vs. lossless. There's an audio tech from LA that was posting in another BH200 related thread a while back and explained (in almost mind boggling detail) the difference between DTS-HD and Master Audio and why a machine might offer DTS-HD decoding but not MA. Something about extensions? I think. Needless to say, DTS-HD MA offers some fantastic sounding audio, but it's apparently very "processor intensive," to put it in computer terms.

-C.

EDIT: for some really interesting (and, to be fair, pretty geeky) reading, check out these links to Wikipedia that explain in great detail what DTS-HD Master Audio is capable of and also why Dolby TrueHD is different, even though they both offer lossless audio.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Theater_System#DTS-HD_High_Resolution_Audio
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dolby_TrueHD

What's wrong with the audio on Pan's Labyrthing? I plan to pick up the USA BD. Thanks.


DTS-HD MA caused some "issues" with receiver:

- titles from New Line on Denon/Pioneer/Sony: only able to detect 5.1 instead of 7.1 due to the way of encoding; some reports that on Onkyo, shown 7.1 but no sound from surround back
- DTS bomb on Onkyo/Yamaha due to faulty decoder chip

There are several threads in AVS, e.g. http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=967535
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1008620

There is always pain for early adopters ;)

Thanks Casey. As I understand it DTS is more processor intensive than DD5.1 on DVDs.

From a cynical standpoint, one could say that just makes DD as good as DTS has been from yearsIt wouldn't surprise me if Dolby considered this when thinking up DD+

DTS-HD MA caused some "issues" with receiver:

- titles from New Line on Denon/Pioneer/Sony: only able to detect 5.1 instead of 7.1 due to the way of encoding; some reports that on Onkyo, shown 7.1 but no sound from surround back
- DTS bomb on Onkyo/Yamaha due to faulty decoder chip
Thanks.

I have the DTS Bomb fix saved, in case I need it.

I believe this is now a confirmed bug. Now can anyone think of any way to test if the forced resolution setting is actually functioning properly? My guess is that somewhere the 200 is sending a 720 signal that is causing the Mitsu to shut down (protection) but that is only a guess. It could be also simplink issue, because it looks like mitsu used the DVI cable for thier monitorlink feature. But if that was the case why would your reciever be blocking a function command signal? That is why I think it has to do more with the forced resolution issue.

I've now added your bug report on the main page. After reading through the posts, I believe I understand what the problem is and why you think it might be happening. Please let me know if you think I got the wording right and if all the details have been included. Thanks!

-C.

2. When bitstreaming DD+ to a receiver via HDMI while watching a movie on HD DVD, there is sometimes a "motorboat" or "helicopter" sound. This has been confirmed by users with both Onkyo and Pioneer receivers. This seems only to affect DD+ on HD DVD and not Blu-ray. The bug is not always repeatable at the same play time or even on the same disk in many instances.

DD+ on blu-ray has "helicopter" sound with my Pioneer 9120TXH receiver, use a Dolby demo disc (http://www.demo-world.eu/news/index.php?/archives/49-Dolby-The-Sound-Of-High-Definition-Blu-RayHD-DVD.html)

FWIW, I tried some 4:3 aspect ratio standard dvd's on my setup which only uses component. The BH200 stretched the image as others have reported. Luckily I was able to change the aspect ratio to a correct image as my front PJ has a setting which it calls normal vs full were I normally have it set. My PJ is a Sanyo PLV 70 clone.

On my Dad's Sony HDD/DVD Recorder, when connected by HDMI (and only HDMI) ALL the TV display modes become inactive, meaning all aspect ratios cannot be altered BUT in the Sony menu under HDMI is specifically an option for 4:3 content over HDMI.

On you get 4:3, off you get it stretched to 16:9. It even says on-screen, use this is if your TV won't let you adjust the display mode when using HDMI.

It's a pity LG don't offer such a function on the BH200.

DD+ on blu-ray has "helicopter" sound with my Pioneer 9120TXH receiver, use a Dolby demo disc (http://www.demo-world.eu/news/index.php?/archives/49-Dolby-The-Sound-Of-High-Definition-Blu-RayHD-DVD.html)

I've corrected this on the main bug list. Thanks for letting me know!

-C.

Thanks to all those who have reported their problems. May I suggest also that those with issues report them to LG? There seems to be some evidence from the chat transcripts from 5K owners that their issues where heard by Samsung so letting LG know directly about our issues could hopefully bring about resolutions to our problems as well. I have reported the issues I have, hopefully with more reports these issues get fixed in future updates.

Hi. What Yamaha receivers have the DTS Bomb? The ones with HDMI inputs? I have a older unit, a 1400, and I hope I don't run into any sound issues.

Pat

A minor one but definitely a bug :D

BH200 Ouput mode: 1080I
Firmware: Janurary

Pixel / Overscan Results
Bluray 1080P: Perfect
HDDVD 1080P: Perfect
NTSC DVD: Clips top 4 Pixels
PAL DVD: Perfect

How on earth did you spot the top 4 pixels being missing?

My guess would be that Krobar has a display that doesn't have any overscan. I had an LCD like this and it was easy to tell when something was missing. :)

I thought that was it but 4 pixels has to be so minute I'm not sure I'd even spot it.

How on earth did you spot the top 4 pixels being missing?

My projector has no overscan and its very easy to spot with the appropriate test patterns on DVE.

French user BlackVador has mentioned Hybrid SACDs do not work in the LG BH200, at least on Euro models. I've tested this with my Belgium sourced player and annoyingly I get the same.

Hybrid SACDs have one Standard Redbook Audio CD layer and one SACD layer. I have never come across a DVD or CD Player that isn't able to pick up the Redbook Audio CD Layer before. This is annoying as I have a few Hybrid SACDs I was planning to continue to use on my BH200.

I've tried "Genesis: We Can't Dance" Hybrid SACD and the BH200 recognises it as a DATA Disc. It then obviously doesn't know what to do with it.

BlackVador's info is here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14015215#post14015215

I'm running the April Firmware and 0702 Driver.

I think I should report my "chapter skip" problem here. When I skip chapters (using the disc's menu, but it might also happen with the remote), sometimes my screen will go blank. The player will still show the spinning disc icon, but I'll get no video or sound. This happens on some HD DVDs, but I've yet to see it on any Blu-ray discs. In the end I have to power off the BH200 to get it to respond. Has anyone else experienced this?

I plan to do more testing this weekend. I'm not sure if this issue is disc-specific or not.

BH200 Ouput mode: 1080I
Firmware: Janurary

Pixel / Overscan Results
Bluray 1080P: Perfect
HDDVD 1080P: Perfect
NTSC DVD: Clips top 4 Pixels
PAL DVD: Perfect

Krobar - before posting your bug, I have a couple of questions for you. I noticed you said you were using the January firmware. Have you tested this with the April firmware? If so, same results? Also, any particular reason you haven't updated (this last one is really just more of my own curiosity)? Thanks!

French user BlackVador has mentioned Hybrid SACDs do not work in the LG BH200, at least on Euro models. I've tested this with my Belgium sourced player and annoyingly I get the same.

I have never come across a DVD or CD Player that isn't able to pick up the Redbook Audio CD Layer before. This is annoying as I have a few Hybrid SACDs I was planning to continue to use on my BH200.

Brad - I posted your bug. Do you know if anyone has tested this as of yet on a North American model? If not, anyone out there who would/could?

I think I should report my "chapter skip" problem here. When I skip chapters (using the disc's menu, but it might also happen with the remote), sometimes my screen will go blank. The player will still show the spinning disc icon, but I'll get no video or sound. This happens on some HD DVDs, but I've yet to see it on any Blu-ray discs. In the end I have to power off the BH200 to get it to respond.

DoctorMaustus - I'm holding off posting this until you do more testing. Please let us know what kind of result you end up with. Thanks!

Krobar - before posting your bug, I have a couple of questions for you. I noticed you said you were using the January firmware. Have you tested this with the April firmware? If so, same results? Also, any particular reason you haven't updated (this last one is really just more of my own curiosity)? Thanks!


Hi Casey,

I have not tried with the April firmware because it does not work with the HDDVD menus on quite a few BBC UK HDDVDs I have (Can't start main feature on some of them).

I will test with the April firmware once I've finished watching this Robin Hood HDDVD box set (Menus dont work properly on April).

Brad - I posted your bug. Do you know if anyone has tested this as of yet on a North American model? If not, anyone out there who would/could?
Thanks for adding it. No I don't know if anyone has tried it in a NA Player but I've not read anything. I'd be very surprised if it works, especially as the April firmware used in my Euro Player says it's for USA/Canadian models only, on the LG Service Sites (i.e - it's the same firmware), but like you say you never know.

I also have my LG BG200 set to the EEPROM code of 80, which makes it North American Region A. My country code (first 2 sets of values in the EEPROM) string is also 55 53 which translates to US. I didn't change this, it's how it arrived out of the box.

FYI:

I've just tested it using the January firmware and setting my EEPROM code to 00 (USA default) and I get exactly the same result. To double check I re-flashed it back to April (and put it back to 80) and again, same thing. I don't think the EEPROM code has anything to do with it.

I tried a different Hybrid SACD this time (War of the Worlds) too. I tried it three times to be sure. You can mention it's a fault for Euro Players with both April and January firmware.

If someone could try an Hybrid SACD in a North American Player and report back, please.

If someone could try an Hybrid SACD in a North American Player and report back, please.

Just tried Dark Side of the Moon - no joy. Reads as data CD

Thanks for testing it Dundas.

As DD+ bitstreaming to Pioneer 9120TXH has only 'helicopter" sound, choose PCM Decode, sometimes I can hear low volume poping sound, definitely not loud or DTS bomb, feel like BH200 decoding issue, does anyone have the same issue?

Do you mean PCM Multi-Channel or DTS Re-encode?

As DD+ bitstreaming to Pioneer 9120TXH has only 'helicopter" sound, choose PCM Re-encode, sometimes I can hear low volume poping sound, definitely not loud or DTS bomb, feel like BH200 decoding issue, does anyone have the same issue?

Why are you using re-encode? Just use PCM via HDMI and you still get TrueHD and/or DD+.

Do you mean PCM Multi-Channel or DTS Re-encode?

Why are you using re-encode? Just use PCM via HDMI and you still get TrueHD and/or DD+.

Sorry I meant PCM decode, let the player decode DD+ and PCM via HDMI.

So you're saying you get a "low volume popping sound" when using "PCM Multi-Ch" for DD+ material, understood. Does it only happen with DD+?

Sorry I cannot actually help with your problem though. I use Optical and do use DTS Re-encode.

OK. I played "Harsh Times" and "Killing Me Softly" over the weekend and didn't experience any chapter skip dropouts. My suspicion is that it's Universal International titles that are giving me problems, but I need to verify that. I'm going to try "Hot Fuzz" (UK) and "American Gangster" (UK) to see if I can replicate the problem.

Sorry I meant PCM decode, let the player decode DD+ and PCM via HDMI.

Multichannel PCM via HDMI works (so far) perfectly for me for DD+ and TrueHD, no helicopter and/or popping sounds.

Do we know whether or not the DD+ bitstream helicopter issue affects Blu-ray discs too?

Also, has anyone had any problems (either Blu-ray or HD DVD) bitstreaming DTS MA with the BH200? I only have Pan's Labyrinth HD DVD and it worked fine but one disc isn't a large enough of a sample pool :p .

Please report back how you get one.

I have the USA American Gangster as despite the annoying Combo disc format, I wanted both cuts. Hopefully Universals forthcoming BD will have both cuts in HD, although I bet it just has the DC (aka Theatrical Cut).

I'm surprised Killing Me Softly worked :D. Heather Graham (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001287/) is lovely but the film is far from anything close ;). I'm presuming Killing Me Softly is from Japan?

Yes, "Killing Me Softly" is a Japanese release, although I'm not sure why it was released there in high definition...OK...maybe I can think of two reasons...

Not a very good flick that's for sure. Even Heather Graham's numerous nude scenes couldn't save it.

Now I just need 3 hours or so free to watch American Gangster...*sigh*

Multichannel PCM via HDMI works (so far) perfectly for me for DD+ and TrueHD, no helicopter and/or popping sounds.

Do we know whether or not the DD+ bitstream helicopter issue affects Blu-ray discs too?

Also, has anyone had any problems (either Blu-ray or HD DVD) bitstreaming DTS MA with the BH200? I only have Pan's Labyrinth HD DVD and it worked fine but one disc isn't a large enough of a sample pool :p .

DD+ bitstream helicopter issue occurred in my case on Blu ray as well.

DTS HD MA works fine for me. Just curious, did you get 5.1 or 7.1 on the movie itself on Pan's Labyrinth? if 7.1, is there actual sound from rear speakers?

Please report back how you get one.

I have the USA American Gangster as despite the annoying Combo disc format, I wanted both cuts. Hopefully Universals forthcoming BD will have both cuts in HD, although I bet it just has the DC (aka Theatrical Cut).

I'm surprised Killing Me Softly worked :D. Heather Graham (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001287/) is lovely but the film is far from anything close ;). I'm presuming Killing Me Softly is from Japan?

The Universal BD will have both cuts in high def. (Post-edit note: I read this somewhere online. As usual, I can't find it now. I'm not sure whether it was Formatwarcentral or Highdefdigest, etc. Sigh.) Not to get off topic, but I loved combos. I could loan them out to all my friends that still had SD.

What issue are you having with AG? It plays w/o an issue in my April firmware US BH200.

I love combos too because I can watch the movie all around my house as I used to just have 1 high def player (not counting PS3) and like 8 DVD players spreadout all around the house. :)

Since this is the official bug tacking thread I'm going to list an issue that I opened a separate thread about: Image Retention. Here are my comments from the thread I opened:

I love my BH-200, but I have noticed a strange quirk; it seems to suffer from Image Retention. This is generally not something you would notice during the playback of a film, but when still opening credits or menus are displayed a small shadow of their shape will remain on-screen until a moving object erases this. I have Samsung LCD and previously used a Toshiba HD-A2 as my HDM Player and never had this problem using that combination. My connections and TV settings are the same; in fact when I got my 200 I simply removed my A2 and used the same HDMI cable and port (HDMI2) for my 200 that I had been using on the A2.

I have seen this occur on both HD DVDs and Blu-ray Discs. I initially noticed the problem when playing Lion's Gate BDs. I purchased a bunch of LG BDs a few months ago before I had a BD Player of any kind so when I got my BH-200 those were the first films I played. I noticed it during the opening credits on Saw, then on Saw 2, then on Young Guns and then on Total Recall. Since I never noticed anything like that n my HD DVDs while playing them on my A2 I figured that it was something related to the way LG BDs are authored. Then I put in "The Thing" on HD DVD and saw the same thing and have since discovered it happens on all my HDM. I have not tested any DVDs yet (didn't think to), but placing my QDeo setting on "user" seemed to help a little.

I have also tried changing the HDMI input, but I see the same "ghosting" or IR. Any suggestions about settings? Does anyone else have this issue?

Hello!

Is that normal that (when the AUTO modus is activated) the BH200 output a sd dvd with 24fps (1080p24) -> with stutter? Normally they should force the video output to 1080p60.

Udo

I Need Help!

Whenever I try to play a Blu-Ray disc with DTS-HD MA i get no sound a the picture freezes after about 3 seconds.

Normally I would just change the audio to DD like in Live Free or Die Hard (US), but in The Eye (US) the only option in english is DTS-HD MA so I couldn't watch it.

I have the lastest firmware and driver as well. I tried it using a HDMI cable from the player to the TV and an optical cable from my player through a receiver as well and still I get nothing.

Has anyone else ran into this problem?

Thanks

I Need Help!

Whenever I try to play a Blu-Ray disc with DTS-HD MA i get no sound a the picture freezes after about 3 seconds.

Normally I would just change the audio to DD like in Live Free or Die Hard (US), but in The Eye (US) the only option in english is DTS-HD MA so I couldn't watch it.

I have the lastest firmware and driver as well. I tried it using a HDMI cable from the player to the TV and an optical cable from my player through a receiver as well and still I get nothing.

Has anyone else ran into this problem?

Thanks

No. Are you using bitstream or DTS re-encode (which is likely as you have an optical cable)?

No. Are you using bitstream or DTS re-encode (which is likely as you have an optical cable)?

I've tried DTS Re-encode & Pass-through both don't work.

Should I be using bitstream? if so how do i change to it?

I've tried DTS Re-encode & Pass-through both don't work.

Should I be using bitstream? if so how do i change to it?

Bitstream directly to your display is asking for trouble since your display won't know what to do with anything other than DD or PCM. You should be using DTS re-encode for Toslink. What kind of receiver do you have? Does it accept full-bit rate DTS? BTW, this shouldn't be in the bug section, we should probably have this in the owner's thread.

Bitstream directly to your display is asking for trouble since your display won't know what to do with anything other than DD or PCM. You should be using DTS re-encode for Toslink. What kind of receiver do you have? Does it accept full-bit rate DTS? BTW, this shouldn't be in the bug section, we should probably have this in the owner's thread.

Ok, well I tried DTS re-encode for toslink and it doesn't work.
I just have a Sony receiver that came with my Sony 1-Disc HDMI Micro Home Theatre System. It's just an all-in-one thing. It has a DTS decoder.

I just thought that it could be a bug not a receiver problem because the sounds works fine from a PS3 just connected to a TV. Just wondering why the BH200 can't do the same.

I have a question?

Is it common when watching Special Features on a Java-enabled disc that you cannot interrupt the special feature and get back to the main menu by pressing either menu button? I know it works on non-java discs but it doesn't work on java discs. Is this normal?

Can this thread be left for confirmed bugs (i.e - you believe it's a bug) and the Owners thread or Mini-FAQ be used for general "user troubleshooting" please :).

Mini-FAQ: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1009104
Owners thread: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=926099

There's nothing stopping you asking in questions in one of these threads, then re-posting here when it's confirmed to be a bug.

I've deleted some of my off topic posts, as I realise I'm a fine one to talk at times.

Casey, can you update the first post with the update info on the SACD bug please:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14026927#post14026927

Casey, can you update the first post with the update info on the SACD bug please:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14026927#post14026927

Brad - I updated this for you. Sorry it took me so long to do it! I've been traveling a lot for work and haven't had much down time. Plus, I'm currently "in between" TV's and so, sadly, have been unable to test and enjoy my beloved BH200. It's been about a week, with another week to go (Friday, 6/27), until the new one arrives and I must admit, I think I'm going a bit daffy. And, just for the record, I do read quite a bit but I still miss TV!

At least you can take comfort in knowing it's not just the Euro folks who can't enjoy their SACD's! ;)

-C.

Thanks Casey.

The June firmware apparently introduced some color saturation and accuracy issues.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14429820#post14429820

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14433176#post14433176

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14433366#post14433366

Ok, I HOPE this thread is still being watched?

Here is the problem I am experiencing:

The BH200 was imediately updated to the latest June FW and driver 702 soon as I got it out of the box.

When using my Onkyo 805 (early model, so no FW update done to it because it is loader ver 1.00 = means have to send it to Onkyo, but did do the DSP update to fix the DTS HDMA "bomb" problem), I would occasionally get the bitstream signal from HD DVD movies only seen as a stereo signal by the 805 during pause/play or chapter change. All of this happens when the audio signal is lost during those moments, and when the HDMI handshakes again when the audio restarts, it is recognized as a stereo signal and I get loud modulating static coming from all my speakers.

BD and regular DVD all play just fine.
******************************

Bought a new Pioneer VSX-03TXH. Now ALL of my HD DVD movies, no matter DD+ or DTS HD (Bone Collector), the AVR shows recieving a stereo signal and loud modulating static from all speakers.

BD and regular DVD play just fine
*****************************

Exchanged VSX-03TXH for new Pioneer SC-05. Now all BD and HD DVD movies have audio problems. This time, the SC-05 shows sometimes it is receiving a stereo signal, other times it thinks it is getting a 192hz stereo signal! Get the same loud modulating static from all speakers with HD DVD movies, but the BD is slightly different. That is the one being recognized as being a 192hz stereo signal, and at first I cannot hear anything. When I turn up the volume louder, I can just barely hear audio very faintly, but it is also being drowned out by a slightly louder modulating static.

At this time, I can't recal if I even tried a regualr DVD, what was the use if both BD or HD would not play?????

With the SC-05, as it is a keeper, I tried various settings on the BH200, going into audio and changing what the SPDIF was sending out (not that it should matter, as I was using bitstream through HDMI???), and even set the audio frequency from 192>96>48, and nothing helped at all :(

When using the Toshiba A35, all HD DVD movies play just fine on the SC-05. Did have one or two with the VSX-03TXH have the stereo/static though.

Sent both Pioneer and LG an E-Mail. Response back from Pioneer (when I was using the VSX-03TXH with the HD DVD audio problem only) was that HD was a DEAD format, no further research will be done for fixing that format. I sent them another mail explaing the issues further, and asked them to send it up to the engineers, and got this reply back:

We did forward this information to service engineering so if there is anything that can be done at Pioneers end we will let you know. Did you also checked with LG since a 2nd HD DVD player works fine with the same movie it could also be the player.

I then sent Pioneer another new message concerning the SC-05 I now have on 9/13, and recieved this reply on 9/15:

Thanks for contacting Pioneer Electronics, Inc.

Based on your e-mail request, we feel that we can be of better assistance if you contact our Product Support line.

Please contact us at (800)421-1404 for further assistance.


As I had to return the BH200 before my 30 days were up at BB, I have no way to call them and do any troubleshooting as of now. I just *MIGHT* go back and re-purchase the BH200 if they still have it, for further testing, as I REALLY want to keep this player! But not sure yet what to do :(

What I got in reply from E-Mail sent to LG was the standard template message to call their CS line, which I did. As typically expected these days, I think I got Deli, not pastrami on rye deli, but NEW DEHLI!!! The person on the phone was a total idiot, and would not listen to a word I tried to get in between his blabering/drooling. I have been a PC tech for 18 years, and have done HT stuff for some years as well, so most likely knew way more than him, and already was 10 chapters ahead of him in troubleshooting. Eventually he tells me to take it to an LG authorized repair center that is local to me - but turns out to be just some Joe Schmoe's TV/VCR repair shop!

So for now, I gave up and returned the BH200 as I stated above. But, if anyone has any ideas on what else to try, maybe an older FW update that could be sent to me, I might try it again.

Thanks

Ooops, forgot to mention on thing - both Pioneer VSX-03TXH and SC-05 has something Pioneer calls "HDMI Jitter Reduction". Wonder if that could be effecting it???

ARGH!!!!!!!! Seems the BB I returned it to, it was either sold or shipped back somewhere because I went back today to try and buy it again and do more testing

Now I might have to try and find another one around somewhere . . . . .

No, I what I meant was, if LG were to fix the stretch problem, then we could just use our tv's to control it. I didn't mean that the Tv would fix the problem.

has anyone gotten this problem

with older sdvd during playback i get a lot of little red dots during dark scenes
i have to turn on black levels and then switch from 1080p to 720p then turn to manual from default (qdec) and back again in order to get the red dots out of the picture

Is LG aware of the 4:3 stretch issue?

And, if they are aware of it, has there been any indication that they will try to fix it?

Along the same lines, what's the best way to contact LG about this? The lge.com website does have a "Contact Us" link here:

http://us.lgservice.com/index_b2c.jsp

I've been watching this forum almost daily for any news of the 4x3 problem being fixed- it's the only thing keeping me from picking up one of these right now. If they don't ever fix it I'll just get a Blu-Ray-only player and maybe another HD-DVD player as backup.

Watch out for other players too though- my friend has a Panasonic Blu-Ray that puts GRAY bars on the side of 4x3 DVDs, and there's no way to make them black! He's got an LCD too so burn-in's not an issue.

I am very disappointed because I just tried my first 4X3 DVD and now I have found out about the 4X3 stretch issue, this sucks.

I've been watching this forum almost daily for any news of the 4x3 problem being fixed- it's the only thing keeping me from picking up one of these right now. If they don't ever fix it I'll just get a Blu-Ray-only player and maybe another HD-DVD player as backup.

Watch out for other players too though- my friend has a Panasonic Blu-Ray that puts GRAY bars on the side of 4x3 DVDs, and there's no way to make them black! He's got an LCD too so burn-in's not an issue.

I'm also considering the purchase of a stand-alone Blu-ray player.

For me, the BH200 has a lot of appeal since my display only has a single HDMI input and it would really simplify my set-up.

I initially refused to buy 2 separate players, but since HD-DVD is dead now I can live with that, I can even tolerate swapping HDMI cables if I have to. However I won't tolerate having to manually switch anything from 16x9 to 4x3 or vice-versa, I want that done for me automatically just as they're played in their correct shape on 4x3 TVs.

I have two BH200 both manufactured March 2008, running latest FW/SW, bought BB at $199.99 each open box. One is outputting 1080i via component to NEC50MP1 and the second outputting 1080i via HDMI to Panasonic 42 inch plasma. Both units have displayed thin horizontal lines (I can not reproduce them in the same spot on BD). When outputting sound via HDMI into panny there is noticeble 2-3 sec sound delay on a startup (picture is present - no sound). After 2-3 sec sound comes along just fine. I called LG about thin white lines but they were no help and said they never heard about this issue. Anybody?

I have two BH200 both manufactured March 2008, running latest FW/SW, bought BB at $199.99 each open box. One is outputting 1080i via component to NEC50MP1 and the second outputting 1080i via HDMI to Panasonic 42 inch plasma. Both units have displayed thin horizontal lines (I can not reproduce them in the same spot on BD). When outputting sound via HDMI into panny there is noticeble 2-3 sec sound delay on a startup (picture is present - no sound). After 2-3 sec sound comes along just fine. I called LG about thin white lines but they were no help and said they never heard about this issue. Anybody?

The sound issue is typical of HDMI handshaking. Whenever the HDMI mode changes, the player, (receiver if you have one) and TV will all do the dance again to make sure everyone is happy. Unfortunately that seems to take a couple of seconds (equipment dependent). It happens all the time with my DVD player too. You can try adjusting the HDMI resolution settings - maybe by avoiding the AUTO setting and picking "1080i" or something means the player doesn't have to re-think every time. Annoying, and probably not fixable, so you might just have to live with it.

As for the thin white line: have you tried a different output resolution, like 720p? I can't say I have read about that problem here before, but that doesn't mean others haven't experienced it.

As far as I recall, YMMV, etc,

shinksma

I bought one of these units a acouple of weeks ago and I have updated to the latest firmware. So far, I've watched three movies (Shaun of the Dead, Italian Job and Planet Earth) and each time I have suffered two or three two-second audio and video dropouts. I haven't had a "clean" viewing experience yet. It must be an HDMI issue, because when the dropout happens the input label appears as if I have changed sources. I used the same setup with a Tosh HD player with no issues, however. Any thoughts to what might be causing this?

My problem with the BH-200, screen all green with HDMI,component works fine.But I loose the upconversion on sd-dvds.Anybody else have this problem?Toshiba Hd-a30 and Samsung BDP-1400 no problem.

My problem with the BH-200, screen all green with HDMI,component works fine.But I loose the upconversion on sd-dvds.Anybody else have this problem?Toshiba Hd-a30 and Samsung BDP-1400 no problem.

Whuch firmware are you running? (This is a common problem with the old November firmware)

Thanx for the quick response. I'm running june firmware,meaby I should try to reinstall it.keep you posted.

As it turns out nothing wrong with the HDMI output on the Bh-200......My Olevia tv seems to have an issue with the Bh-200 and my cable box.I plugged the unit in a Sharp lcd NO PROBLEM..........Just a follow-up

As it turns out nothing wrong with the HDMI output on the Bh-200......My Olevia tv seems to have an issue with the Bh-200 and my cable box.I plugged the unit in a Sharp lcd NO PROBLEM..........Just a follow-up

It is the BH200's fault - They are overly sensitive to non-HDMI v1.3 TV's!

I have 2 and and they both are perfect on my 32" Sony LCD TV (HDMI v1.3) but play-up when connected to my Marantz AVR (HDMI v1.2) + 50" Pioneer Plasma (DVI-D w/HDCP).

You are right,I have a Toshiba Hd-a30 and a Samsung BDP-1400 and they're both fine with the Olevia HDMI input

Strange, I was having a lot of audio dropouts on Max Payne DVD tonight. I'm using HDMI to DVI-HDCP at 1080i and optical audio cable with Dolby Digital 5.1 and a Yamaha HTR-5250 receiver (ancient). Looks like the problem was with the DD5.1 stream, since the AVR wasn't detecting any disconnects in the data stream (ie: it said DOLBY DIGITAL all the time, never switched back to PRO LOGIC, meaning it never lost the digital signal).

I'm new to the BH200, and haven't watched many SD DVDs on it. Is this normal? I usually just watch HD DVDs using DTS re-encoding, so far without issue.

Thanks in advance. :)

Strange, I was having a lot of audio dropouts on Max Payne DVD tonight. I'm using HDMI to DVI-HDCP at 1080i and optical audio cable with Dolby Digital 5.1 and a Yamaha HTR-5250 receiver (ancient). Looks like the problem was with the DD5.1 stream, since the AVR wasn't detecting any disconnects in the data stream (ie: it said DOLBY DIGITAL all the time, never switched back to PRO LOGIC, meaning it never lost the digital signal).

I'm new to the BH200, and haven't watched many SD DVDs on it. Is this normal? I usually just watch HD DVDs using DTS re-encoding, so far without issue.

Thanks in advance. :)

No, this is not normal. Any audio/video drops reported are almost always while viewing HD DVD or Blu-ray. Play back of standard DVD is mostly flawless. That being said, all my components (TV, A/V receiver, etc.) are HDMI 1.3 so I don't use DVI, optical, etc. I think that may be one reason I don't have nearly as many drop out issues as some users.

I know that the BH200 is very picky about it's HDMI handshaking and doesn't play well with older versions (1.1, 1.2). I seem to remember someone saying that going from HDMI to DVI can cause issues to, though I can't point you to a specific post. Maybe someone else can help.

Also, have you had this issue with any other standard DVD's? Did the Max Payne come from Netflix or Blockbuster? Just wondering.

-C.

As it turns out nothing wrong with the HDMI output on the Bh-200......My Olevia tv seems to have an issue with the Bh-200 and my cable box.I plugged the unit in a Sharp lcd NO PROBLEM..........Just a follow-up

It is the BH200's fault - They are overly sensitive to non-HDMI v1.3 TV's!

I have 2 and and they both are perfect on my 32" Sony LCD TV (HDMI v1.3) but play-up when connected to my Marantz AVR (HDMI v1.2) + 50" Pioneer Plasma (DVI-D w/HDCP).

Hey, guys - I've updated the OP to reflect these issues with older versions of HDMI. Thanks!

-C.

Also, have you had this issue with any other standard DVD's? Did the Max Payne come from Netflix or Blockbuster? Just wondering.
Just to update, after reading this forum for a while, I think it was the seamless branching that was the problem. (discussed http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1080197&page=4 ) This DVD did have rated/unrated on the same side, and I have noticed the trend that I do get audio dropout at the branch points, even on SD DVDs. This particular DVD came from Redbox, btw.

So I guess it's somewhat normal. I also have Forgetting Sarah Marshal SD DVD, which has the same thing (rated/unrated). I'm willing to bet it will have audio dropouts as well.

No, this is not normal. Any audio/video drops reported are almost always while viewing HD DVD or Blu-ray. Play back of standard DVD is mostly flawless. That being said, all my components (TV, A/V receiver, etc.) are HDMI 1.3 so I don't use DVI, optical, etc. I think that may be one reason I don't have nearly as many drop out issues as some users.

I know that the BH200 is very picky about it's HDMI handshaking and doesn't play well with older versions (1.1, 1.2). I seem to remember someone saying that going from HDMI to DVI can cause issues too

-C.

I had a heap of dropout issues with normal DVD's @ 1080i before I got me edge scaler, now they are gone.

I had a heap of dropout issues with normal DVD's @ 1080i before I got me edge scaler, now they are gone.

Well, I stand corrected then. I'm sorry about that. I was aware that you had purchased the scaler (from your postings on other threads) but guess I missed that it was because of performance issues on standard DVD's. Did you only have that problem with 1080i output ... or, did you have the same issues from 720p or 1080p?

Thanks!

-C.

That's cool, most DVDs didn't cause problems but every now and again I'd play one that would have audio dropouts worse than any bd or hd movie and the resolution made no difference at all.

Thankfully the only issues I have now are usually related to grubby discs - I find bd movies to be the worst as I have to frequently clean them with an optical cloth before playback.

for osofast and the engineers in his office this week :D

I bought one of these units a acouple of weeks ago and I have updated to the latest firmware. So far, I've watched three movies (Shaun of the Dead, Italian Job and Planet Earth) and each time I have suffered two or three two-second audio and video dropouts. I haven't had a "clean" viewing experience yet. It must be an HDMI issue, because when the dropout happens the input label appears as if I have changed sources. I used the same setup with a Tosh HD player with no issues, however. Any thoughts to what might be causing this?

I get the same thing, although mine is probably averaging only 1 dropout per 3-4 movies I watch. My HDMI switch is 1.2, but that's because the 1.3 I had would not work at 1080p, so I dusted off the old 1.2 Monoprice I had sitting in a closet. It works fine, but with this very rare dropout.

Casey, can you add the following to your HDMI compatibility section please:

Fix the BH200 so that if the CEA extensions to the display EDID data are not present (eg DVI-D w/HDCP displays like my Professional 50" Pioneer Plasma Monitor), the BH200 will actually accept being told to output 1080p(@50/60/24) and not being too smart for its own good and constantly reverting to 1080i?

Casey, can you add the following to your HDMI compatibility section please:

Fix the BH200 so that if the CEA extensions to the display EDID data are not present (eg DVI-D w/HDCP displays like my Professional 50" Pioneer Plasma Monitor), the BH200 will actually accept being told to output 1080p(@50/60/24) and not being too smart for its own good and constantly reverting to 1080i?

Done.

casey, I'd like to expand the reported bug about the BH200 and the Denon 4806 to include all Denon AVRs from that model year. I have the Denon 2807 and it has the same problem with stereo being received when it shouldn't. (The 2807 is of the same model/year line as the 4806, just like the current models are numbered 2809, 3808 and 4808.) I would guess that the 3806 has the same problem as well, though no one has specifically reported it.

Done.

Thanks. :)

casey, I'd like to expand the reported bug about the BH200 and the Denon 4806 to include all Denon AVRs from that model year. I have the Denon 2807 and it has the same problem with stereo being received when it shouldn't. (The 2807 is of the same model/year line as the 4806, just like the current models are numbered 2809, 3808 and 4808.) I would guess that the 3806 has the same problem as well, though no one has specifically reported it.

Done. If you come across any other posts from people about other specific Denon models from that year, please let me know so that I can link to them. Thanks!

I actually just purchased one of these from BB for $99 anywho. Ive been reading about them for awhile now. Does anyone have one that plays movies without issues. My main issue is video loss for a few seconds and it is very hard to get the sound setup right (digital)
So im curious as to what audio settings you use on the BH200

If you're using HDMI connection search around, there's lots of comments regarding HDMI audio and video dropouts. Hopefully will be addressed soon.

The newest firmware with BD-Live functionality was released today. Sadly, the problems related to HDMI handshakes seem to have gone unaddressed. As you all test and play around with the new firmware, please make sure and post updates here so that I can keep the bug tracking up to date. Thanks!

-C.

Son of a gun... don't know how long this has been going on, let me explain.
Our BH-200 was pretty much relegated to playing movies ever since we've had it. Well, today I decided to listen to some music CDs... usually I just play them from my HTPC but today I wanted to listen to a CD that I hadn't yet bothered to rip to the HD, so I thought I'd pop it into the BH-200 and see how it handles music. During the first song I thought I could hear a damaged EMIT tweeter... when I walked up and place my ear near to the suspected tweeter it was plain that there was bad distortion coming from it. I was bummed. So then I decided to also check the other main speaker, sure enough it produced the same distorted high freqs... I check the center channel same thing, etc. So it was either my Onkyo or the BH-200. I then ripped the CD to the HTPC and upon replaying from the HTPC every note was crystal clear. To make a longer story not as long... I eventually discovered that if I switch the BH-200 HDMI Audio in the menu to PCM and then back to Pass-thru the problem fixed itself, every note is crystal. However if I ejct and then put in either the same or another disc the distortion happens again until I go back into the menu and manually switch to PCM and then back to Pass-thru. Even though I never really use this player for listening to CDs it still bugs me. Has anyone else noticed something similar happening with their BH-200? Is it yet another bug in the new firmware update or is it something that has always been there (a known issue)? This sucks!

I'd be happy to check it out, but can you try rolling back to an earlier version?

With the latest firmware I'm getting video dropouts. I've never had this issue before this update. Will revert back to an older firmware.

Saw my first full video/audio dropout with this player while watching the Aviator (near the beginning) HD DVD using latest firmware. Luckily, it didn't happen again...will be glad to move on from these dual format catastrophes after I finish watching my remainder of unopened HD DVDs.

Saw my first full video/audio dropout with this player while watching the Aviator (near the beginning) HD DVD using latest firmware. Luckily, it didn't happen again...will be glad to move on from these dual format catastrophes after I finish watching my remainder of unopened HD DVDs.

Were your bistreaming? That needs to be mentioned.

Negative, decoding with the player (PCM). DD+ and bitstreaming with Pioneer receivers = recipe for noise.

Have updated the OP with current example (1/3/2010) of HDMI handshake issue apparently still causing audio or video drops.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=17840447#post17840447

I just started having this exact problem last night. Mine is connected to an Onkyo 606 via hdmi and a vintage Sansui 5500 via RCA L/R. I was playing the CD's through the Sansui when I noticed it. At first I thought there was something wrong with my speakers until I switched to a different source. I unplugged the LG and tried the CD again and it was fine. I turned everything off and came back later and the problem re-occurred. THis time I just ejected the disc, re-inserted and it went away.

Haven't tried the Onkyo when this was happening to see if it's affecting that receiver but that's my next step. Any thoughts why this occurring? This receiver has been pretty much flawless with everything I've played through up to this point. Thank you.
Tiga

Son of a gun... don't know how long this has been going on, let me explain.
Our BH-200 was pretty much relegated to playing movies ever since we've had it. Well, today I decided to listen to some music CDs... usually I just play them from my HTPC but today I wanted to listen to a CD that I hadn't yet bothered to rip to the HD, so I thought I'd pop it into the BH-200 and see how it handles music. During the first song I thought I could hear a damaged EMIT tweeter... when I walked up and place my ear near to the suspected tweeter it was plain that there was bad distortion coming from it. I was bummed. So then I decided to also check the other main speaker, sure enough it produced the same distorted high freqs... I check the center channel same thing, etc. So it was either my Onkyo or the BH-200. I then ripped the CD to the HTPC and upon replaying from the HTPC every note was crystal clear. To make a longer story not as long... I eventually discovered that if I switch the BH-200 HDMI Audio in the menu to PCM and then back to Pass-thru the problem fixed itself, every note is crystal. However if I ejct and then put in either the same or another disc the distortion happens again until I go back into the menu and manually switch to PCM and then back to Pass-thru. Even though I never really use this player for listening to CDs it still bugs me. Has anyone else noticed something similar happening with their BH-200? Is it yet another bug in the new firmware update or is it something that has always been there (a known issue)? This sucks!

Does anyone know if the newer line of Pioneer Elite receivers decode dolby digital plus properly with this player? Specifically I am looking at the Pioneer Elite SC27 receiver. Thanks for your help

That would be good to know...though too late for me (already own an SC-05).

Not sure why they would not have addressed this issue as Dolby Digital Plus may turn into the next really popular broadcast format as True HD and Master Audio will likely not become standards anytime soon due to bandwidth limitations especially IF 3D gets big. It is already supported with the newest iterations of Windows Media Player so pc bitstreaming would be out. Have you tried to contact Pioneer? If yes, what was their answer? You may take the approach to Windows Media Player as the potentially changing factor in their decision.

I did last year...they denied any reports of the issue claiming I should go through the cumbersome task of taking it to a service center for diagnostic testing. I said no thanks. The CSR claimed he would look into the matter and report back if he heard anything, which of course didn't happen.

That is a little bit maddening from the perspective that it is listed as a working feature of the receiver but that it is actually not usable. Maybe I can take a player to demo somewhere and bring along a couple of discs. Does it drop frequently from your experience or only occasionally?

PCM is fine fortunately. Bitstreaming is the issue....it's more than a drop, it's completely unlistenable. It sounds as if the signal is being run through a lowpass filter IIRC (or there's an oscillating sound like it's been run through an LFO, my memory is hazy). This doesn't mean the SC-27 suffers from the same problem but it would be a good idea to demo in advance, or check in the owner's thread for more information.