Care to comment.

Here is the electrical plan for my basement & theater.

http://img131.imageshack.us/img131/2191/basementuc6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img131.imageshack.us/img131/2191/basementuc6.499483408d.jpg (http://g.imageshack.us/g.php?h=131&i=basementuc6.jpg)

Based on your experiences do you think I'm under loading the circuits? Code guidelines aside, because most will live in different areas, I'm looking for practicality of the design.

This will require me to add a sub panel, I only have room for 2 breakers (albeit I could use double breakers), I'm looking at 6 independant circuits.

Should hte Rack be alone? It'lll have an AMP, HTPC Fileserver on 24/7, XBOX, PS3, XBOX 360, 3 Satellite receivers

Should the Sub be alone?

Also, what recessed lighting should I use, I'm currently thinking the ones that take PAR20 bulbs, but in future I'll need to use compact fluorescent bulbs.

Should the refrigerator and freezer be on their own circuit?


Thanks in advance

FX

If your amp draw calculations are correct, you do not look like you are overloading however, having recently gone through the same decision making process and tapping the experience that dwells within these hollowed halls, here are a couple suggestions for thought based on feedback I recently received.

If you are putting in a new sub-panel (100 amp I'm guessing) you shouldn't run short of breakers so why not take advantage of them? I broke mine down this way. (note, all 20 amp on 12/2 wire)

1. Equipment Rack off of its own circuit
2. Electrical outlets on their own circuit(s) with no more than 8 on a circuit
3. Lighting on their on circuit(s) based upon watts (wound up with 2) you may also want to check on this one if you plan on running dimmers. They have maximums on watts that they can handle
4. Appliances on their own circuit(s)
5. Sub(s), looking at running 2, on their own.

On lighting, I think the best way is to just go to your local DIY store and look at the lighting and see which ones you like the best. I plan on 6 inch cans in the more open areas and 4 inch along walls or soffits.

Sorry if this wasn't a specific, "I'd do this if I were you" but maybe it will help point you in a direction that might make sense with what you have.

By the way, nice looking plan. Looks like something everyone will enjoy. Good luck with it.

Thanks for the feedback.

I actually managed to avoid the sub panel, SIEMENS makes breaker that take up less real estate within a panel but has more breakers. I actually bought 2 QUAD breakers, their half the size of the regular breaker, so removing 2 regular size breakers and using 2 new slots, I came up with 8 15 AMP breakers to work with; more than enough.

I drew it up with MS Visio, pretty straight forward, lots of fiddling around though ;)

I'll let you all know what I ended up with in the end.


If your amp draw calculations are correct, you do not look like you are overloading however, having recently gone through the same decision making process and tapping the experience that dwells within these hollowed halls, here are a couple suggestions for thought based on feedback I recently received.

If you are putting in a new sub-panel (100 amp I'm guessing) you shouldn't run short of breakers so why not take advantage of them? I broke mine down this way. (note, all 20 amp on 12/2 wire)

1. Equipment Rack off of its own circuit
2. Electrical outlets on their own circuit(s) with no more than 8 on a circuit
3. Lighting on their on circuit(s) based upon watts (wound up with 2) you may also want to check on this one if you plan on running dimmers. They have maximums on watts that they can handle
4. Appliances on their own circuit(s)
5. Sub(s), looking at running 2, on their own.

On lighting, I think the best way is to just go to your local DIY store and look at the lighting and see which ones you like the best. I plan on 6 inch cans in the more open areas and 4 inch along walls or soffits.

Sorry if this wasn't a specific, "I'd do this if I were you" but maybe it will help point you in a direction that might make sense with what you have.

By the way, nice looking plan. Looks like something everyone will enjoy. Good luck with it.

Thanks for the feedback.

I actually managed to avoid the sub panel, SIEMENS makes breaker that take up less real estate within a panel but has more breakers. I actually bought 2 QUAD breakers, their half the size of the regular breaker, so removing 2 regular size breakers and using 2 new slots, I came up with 8 15 AMP breakers to work with; more than enough.

I drew it up with MS Visio, pretty straight forward, lots of fiddling around though ;)

I'll let you all know what I ended up with in the end.

I'm not sure how familiar you are with electric work, so if you already knew this, please just disregard.

Be careful. Code allows a maximum of 42 circuits in a box. You also want to balance them on the neutral so that it is not carrying any amps.

CJ

Thanks for the heads up CJ

I'm not an electrician, but done electrical work before.

I had a friend electrician look over the plan and new breakers, he said it would be no problem.

I'm in Canada, not sure if the code is the same, but I'll count the breakers.

One thing you should note is you can only load any circuit to 80%, so a 15A breaker is good for 12A, 20A breaker = 16A and so on. I would suggest you split up your Orange & Black circuits as you show them each at 15A. The reason for this is you can't install more than one outlet on a 20A breaker unless its all lighting. As far as the rest of your circuit loads they are fine... but if it was my house I'd split or group the loads like McMurphy has suggeseted

One thing you should note is you can only load any circuit to 80%, so a 15A breaker is good for 12A, 20A breaker = 16A and so on. I would suggest you split up your Orange & Black circuits as you show them each at 15A. The reason for this is you can't install more than one outlet on a 20A breaker unless its all lighting. As far as the rest of your circuit loads they are fine... but if it was my house I'd split or group the loads like McMurphy has suggeseted


Thanks for the info.

The black won't have much running on it, a TV is ~150W, Bike and treadmill are low as well. I think that circuit is fine.

What I will do is place the sub on the black circuit and the Orange will have equipment rack, the projector will run on the existing basement circuit from the builder with all the basement lights removed.


I'll post my final setups

I make final calculations this weekend

The black won't have much running on it, a TV is ~150W, Bike and treadmill are low as well. I think that circuit is fine.



Check the treadmill to make sure that the startup cycle won't draw too many amps. I had a treadmill in a previous house that tripped the breaker every time it started up. It was only sharing a circuit with a overhead light (with 2 bulbs).

CJ

You also want to balance them on the neutral so that it is not carrying any amps.

CJ

CJ;
for my continuing electrical education can you help me grasp "balance them on the neutral" by real world example of what NOT to do?

I googled on "electrical circuit balance them on the neutral" and found these links:
Do dedicated circuits have to have a dedicated neutral also (http://www.electricalknowledge.com/forum/archives/725.asp)

When a 'neutral' isn't neutral (http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qa3726/is_200410/ai_n9452147)

I'm willing to read/learn, point me in the correct direction.
Thx!

CJ try searching "Edison 3 wire"

CJ;
for my continuing electrical education can you help me grasp "balance them on the neutral" by real world example of what NOT to do?

I wish I could help you, but I'm just passing on what he told me (hopefully correctly). I'll ask on Monday when I'm back at work.

Coopsav- thanks for the name. I am using a split-phase system, so that could be what he was talking about. I don't have time to read into it right now.

CJ

Yes basically you want to balance your loads between line 1 & line 2 to reduce the load on the neutral. Say you have 2 lighting circuits that each draw 10 amps and are on all the time (it will never happen in most homes unless your growing something :rolleyes:) and with both on line 1 you have potential for a unbalanced load depending on the other loads in the house.
The best way to avoid this is the turn every thing on and have your electrician check the line loads and adjust as needed.

Yes basically you want to balance your loads between line 1 & line 2 to reduce the load on the neutral. Say you have 2 lighting circuits that each draw 10 amps and are on all the time (it will never happen in most homes unless your growing something :rolleyes:) and with both on line 1 you have potential for a unbalanced load depending on the other loads in the house.
The best way to avoid this is the turn every thing on and have your electrician check the line loads and adjust as needed.

Let me confirm; my home uses (2) Homeline load box, each is a 200Amp model, on the RH and LH side there runs a seperate 120V supply, the middle is the neutral.

So, to "balance the neutral" I want to use the RH and then the LH side breaker (or vice-versa) if I knew a room was going to be using those circuits at same time.
Kinda like if you put a dual 60A breaker in for a dedicated sub-panel it actually pulls 120V from both sides, giving you 240V 60A service to the sub-panel, balanced.


http://ecatalog.squared.com/pubs/Electrical%20Distribution/Load%20Centers/Homeline%20Single%20Phase%20Load%20Centers/HOMVPL1_lg_lres.jpg

I'm not sure how familiar you are with electric work, so if you already knew this, please just disregard.

Be careful. Code allows a maximum of 42 circuits in a box. You also want to balance them on the neutral so that it is not carrying any amps.

CJ

X2. You are limited to 42 circuits in the panel regardless of how many you can make fit in there. Or whatever the manufacturer says, that has precedence. Some say 40.

I wouldn't worry too much about balancing the neutrals out. Unless you have some radically unbalanced stuff going on. The panel bars are staggered to encourage this naturally. The design of the panel forces you to put the subpanel breaker on opposite poles.

I'm an electrical contractor who wires lots of basements. Your plan looks pretty good. Only suggestion I'd make is to always try to wire general purpose receptacles seperate from your lighting. There are a few reasons for this.

First, it makes it easier to fire up some temporary lights while you are under construction.

Secondly, lighting loads are predictable. What you plug into an outlet is not. You're more likely to have an overload issue when 8 pot lights are burning and you plug in the vac than if you just plug in a vac with a few lamps or small electrics running. Its not a firm rule, just something that has worked well for us over the years and avoids temporary overloads by vacuum cleaners and stuff like that.

Avoid big surge loads like the motor on that treadmill being on the same circuit as any sensitive electronics. I always run dedicated circuits for the HT stuff as well as for any serious office. We usually wire treadmills on dedicated outlets or at least try not to put it on the same circuit as the office or HT.

Run 20 amp circuits wit 12 guage wiring to any heavy loads(small appliances, refrigerator, treadmill, etc). Lighting and GP outlets 15 amp 14 gauge. I usually run a 20 amp circuit to even a small HT rack. You never know what might be added down the road. We've done Home theaters that called for dedicated 60 amp panels before. :D