2008 National Basketball League Championship 'The Finals' - On ABC

Eastern Conference Champion Boston Celtics
vs.
Western Conference Champion Los Angeles Lakers

All times 9:00pm ET
720p & DD5.1 (Circle Surround encoded)


Game 1 (June 5): L.A. at Boston
Game 2 (June 8): L.A. at Boston
Game 3 (June 10): Boston at L.A.
Game 4 (June 12): Boston at L.A.
Game 5 (June 15): Boston at L.A.
Game 6 (June 17): L.A. at Boston
Game 7 (June 19)*: L.A. at Boston

* if necessary

NBA Countdown will start at 8:30PM before every game.

Game 1 Summary:
Boston 98, L.A. 88 (Boston leads series 1-0)

Boston
Kevin Garnett - 24 points, 3 assists, 13 rebounds
Paul Pierce - 22 points, 2 assists, 4 rebounds
Ray Allen - 19 points, 5 assists, 8 rebounds

Los Angeles
Kobe Bryant - 24 points, 6 assists, 3 rebounds
Pau Gasol - 15 points, 4 assists, 8 rebounds
Derek Fisher - 15 points, 6 assists, 4 rebounds


Game 2 Summary:
Boston 108, L.A. 102 (Boston leads series 2-0)

Boston
Kevin Garnett - 17 points, 3 assists, 14 rebounds
Paul Pierce - 28 points, 8 assists, 4 rebounds
Ray Allen - 17 points, 2 assists, 2 rebounds

Los Angeles
Kobe Bryant - 30 points, 8 assists, 4 rebounds
Pau Gasol - 17 points, 4 assists, 10 rebounds
Lamar Odom - 10 points, 2 assists, 8 rebounds


Game 3 Summary:
L.A. 87, Boston 81 (Boston leads series 2-1)

Boston
Kevin Garnett - 13 points, 5 assists, 12 rebounds
Paul Pierce - 6 points, 3 assists, 6 rebounds
Ray Allen - 25 points, 2 assists, 5 rebounds

Los Angeles
Kobe Bryant - 36 points, 1 assists, 7 rebounds
Pau Gasol - 9 points, 2 assists, 12 rebounds
Lamar Odom - 4 points, 4 assists, 9 rebounds


Game 4 Summary:
Boston 97, L.A. 91 (Boston leads series 3-1)
Boston overcomes 24 point deficit (largest for a NBA Finals game)

Boston
Kevin Garnett - 16 points, 3 assists, 11 rebounds
Paul Pierce - 20 points, 7 assists, 4 rebounds
Ray Allen - 19 points, 2 assists, 9 rebounds

Los Angeles
Kobe Bryant - 17 points, 10 assists, 4 rebounds
Pau Gasol - 17 points, 2 assists, 10 rebounds
Lamar Odom - 19 points, 4 assists, 10 rebounds


Game 5 Summary:
L.A. 103, Boston 98 (Boston leads series 3-2)

Boston
Kevin Garnett - 13 points, 0 assists, 14 rebounds
Paul Pierce - 38 points, 8 assists, 6 rebounds
Ray Allen - 16 points, 2 assists, 2 rebounds

Los Angeles
Kobe Bryant - 25 points, 4 assists, 7 rebounds
Pau Gasol - 19 points, 6 assists, 13 rebounds
Lamar Odom - 20 points, 2 assists, 11 rebounds


Game 6 Summary:
Boston 131, L.A. 92 (Boston wins series 4-2)

Boston
Kevin Garnett - 26 points, 4 assists, 14 rebounds
Paul Pierce - 17 points, 10 assists, 3 rebounds
Ray Allen - 26 points, 2 assists, 4 rebounds

Los Angeles
Kobe Bryant - 22 points, 1 assists, 3 rebounds
Pau Gasol - 11 points, 2 assists, 8 rebounds
Lamar Odom - 14 points, 5 assists, 10 rebounds


The Boston Celtics win the 2008 NBA Championship.

The Celtics win their 17th NBA Title.

Paul Pierce named MVP of the NBA Finals.



From USA Today

For ABC, this classic series is a fortunate event.

Sometimes, you hide giddiness.

"We did not allow ourselves to root publicly," said John Skipper, ABC/ESPN executive vice president/content, when asked during a recent conference call if he had been pulling for a made-for-TV Boston Celtics-Los Angeles Lakers NBA Finals on ABC. "That's the extent of my comment."

But it's fair to say he and his colleagues now also believe in miracles.

ABC suffered through the lowest-rated NBA Finals last year, averaging 6.2% of U.S. TV households a game. That wasn't necessarily some grand verdict on the NBA's appeal: The low rating resulted partly from the San Antonio Spurs shutting down LeBron James' Cleveland Cavaliers in a four-game sweep — a ratings killer given that viewership, in any sport with postseason series, usually increases the longer any series lasts.

Now all ABC needs is a long series, preferably with games going into overtime periods — when ratings also usually spike.

Otherwise, ABC couldn't ask for more. The Lakers' Kobe Bryant is probably the NBA's best-known star and always-courtside Jack Nicholson is its best-known fan. Throw in that the Lakers play in the USA's No. 2 TV market and Boston is No. 7.

Then there's the series' big selling point: It will let baby boomers marinate in the resurrection of the once-famous rivalry that will let them reminisce about their youth. Plus they can tell today's youngsters about the great stars of the good old days, and today's youth presumably will have to play along if those baby boomers are paying for the game-time snacks.

The NBA, always savvy about trying to hype its heritage, is ready to help. Consider the choices for who will perform the national anthem: James Taylor for Game 1 and the Boston Pops for Game 2 — maybe Simon and Garfunkel could reunite if there's a Game 7.

But for all the feeling that a Celtics-Lakers Finals seems historic even before it tips off, ABC's on-air team doesn't exude TV stardom. While many big-time events have come with big-time narrators on TV — think John Madden, Keith Jackson, Pat Summerall, Al Michaels, Johnny Miller or Bob Costas — ABC's on-air team won't overshadow the games.

Mike Breen, a longtime New York Knicks announcer, replaced Al Michaels after ABC/ESPN famously let Michaels go to NBC's NFL coverage in a deal that let Disney reclaim rights to an old Disney cartoon character.

The analysts in a three-man booth — Mark Jackson and Jeff Van Gundy — seem closer to the game itself than to the TV business. Jackson was recently in the running to coach the New York Knicks — "I'm over a lot of things in my life," he says about not getting the job, "and I'm having the time of my life" — and Van Gundy has had a meteoric TV rise.

Announcers, unless they're enormously famous in their sports, often have to work their way up the TV ranks. But Van Gundy — albeit having already been a TNT analyst — last year joined ABC/ESPN's top-game TV team the day he was fired as Houston Rockets coach.

Still, the trio has an on-air advantage that's rare in broadcast booths — they've known each other for years.

And they say they like each other. Van Gundy recalls being a young assistant coach with the Knicks and that their two best players — Jackson and Patrick Ewing — "gave me respect before I ever deserved it." And Van Gundy offers refreshingly off-beat, albeit sometimes odd, on-air comments that you wouldn't hear from more cautious brand-name TV announcers.

Says Van Gundy: "I'm such a novice, I just say what I think. … And if you listen to my cockamamie ideas, you see there's no thought to it."

Says Jackson: "I actually thought he was funnier when he was coaching. … And I would vouch for what he's saying that he doesn't think about what he says — it just comes out of his mouth."

Sometimes, you get lucky.

Boston in 6

I think the Lakers will win in 6 games.

celtics in 5

I think the Lakers will win in 6 games.

I'm going with the same prediction. Seriously... how could anyone bet against LA in this series? Boston had trouble with a 37-win team in the 1st round, almost got beat by the Cavs in the 2nd round and finally had a decent series against Detroit. LA walked all over Denver in the 1st, beat an excellent Utah team in the 2nd in 6, and made the defending champion Spurs look like a JV HS team. Yeah, the Celtics are beating the Lakers lollllllllll. I'm thinking LA in 6, but I wouldn't be shocked if it ended in 5. Kobe will get his 4th ring and a series MVP trophy.

I'm thinking LA in 6, but I wouldn't be shocked if it ended in 5.
I agree completely.

I'm going with the same prediction. Seriously... how could anyone bet against LA in this series? Boston had trouble with a 37-win team in the 1st round, almost got beat by the Cavs in the 2nd round and had finally had a decent series against Detroit. LA walked all over Denver in the 1st, beat an excellent Utah team in the 2nd in 6, and made the defending champion Spurs look like a JV HS team. Yeah, the Celtics are beating the Lakers lollllllllll. I'm thinking LA in 6, but I wouldn't be shocked if it ended in 5. Kobe will get his 4th ring and a series MVP trophy.

That all sounds good but what happened in the early rounds go out the window! It's all about matchups, and other than Kobe and the center position the Celtics match up well. I see a 7 game series with the Celts winning at home:)

ABC's 720p seems very blotchy looking. is it just TWC Brooklyn/Queens, is it ABC in general? It shouldn't be my TV, I've got a 1080p LG.

WABC-DT NYC FIOS TV
The cable cam does not look that clean and the color temp seems off, more blue then the other HD cams.

Solid black background bug, I hope that goes away at tip off :mad:

What the heck happened to Mike Breem...he looks likes he was just released from the drunk tank.

That all sounds good but what happened in the early rounds go out the window! It's all about matchups, and other than Kobe and the center position the Celtics match up well. I see a 7 game series with the Celts winning at home:)

That's a pretty big "other than." :p

I would prefer to see KG get his first ring, but I really think it'll be Lakers in 6. As a Laker-hater, it pains me to say that.

Yea Mike Breen looks like he got in a fight before the show.

Yea Mike Breen looks like he got in a fight before the show.

Maybe he was at Fenway. :D

Looks like the abc bug isn't transparent. :mad:

PQ does not look very good. Watching on D*.

WABC-DT

I just don't like having the score bar at the bottom of the screen plus there is to much space under it it needs to be lowered.
Do we need that second annoying bar to pop above every 4min to tell us we are watching Game 1 of the NBA finals?

Just about everyone watching has a TV guide built into their dish or cable box telling them what the event is on now.

I'm getting artifacting on the abc logo.

This does not look good to me at all. Not particularly sharp, and frankly it just looks "off". Cablevision in NJ.

Anyone with D* getting all voice output from front L&R and none from center channel right now?

Also, poor, poor design.
As said, score bar towards bottom but not even at bottom, and black non-transparent ABC logo.

Just o.k PQ via D* in Allentown, PA.
Not much digital noise at all which is very nice, but the image is very soft almost unfocused looking.


Edit: Also getting tons of audio drops.

The score bug is positioned for if/when they use the ESPN on ABC BottomLine...

I hate the thought of them using a ticker using the finals... I've come to accept it during earlier series.

Watching WEWS-DT, Cleveland OTA (no subchannels) on a 50" 1080p plasma.

Main center court cam doesn't look sharp, seeing a lot of artifacts, when flashbulb goes off the picture breaks up.

Closeups look ok, but not "stunning" HD quality. They could switch this to 480p and nobody would know the difference.

Overall this is better PQ than the NBA playoffs on ESPN via D* MPEG2. Those games were really lousy looking.

Terrible PQ. TWC Binghamton, NY.

The score bug is positioned for if/when they use the ESPN on ABC BottomLine...

I hate the thought of them using a ticker using the finals... I've come to accept it during earlier series.

ESPN and ABC do not use tickers during NBA games full time. Only periodic updates every half hour or so.

THERE was no full time ticker during any ESPN NBA playoff game this year, the only exception being a ticker being put in if the game ran into Sportscenters time slot.

KIII here in Corpus has had multiple audio dropouts.

Lots of audio drop outs on SoCal TWC, KABC 7.

Audio drop-outs on WCVB Boston - Comcast HD. Only during the live game, not happening on commercials, so it seems it is originating in the production truck at the site. Kind of unacceptable for such a high profile broadcast.

Pathetic. Why is it that the 720P networks struggle with PQ?

This game looks absolutely horrible. Chicago comcast.

Anyone else receiving periodic audio dropouts during the game?

Is it the Garden or is it ABC that is causing the view to be so terrible. The cameras are so far from the court that it appears you are getting the view of a fan in the last row of the stadium. I haven't seen this perspective ever on TNT.

Check above your post....several of us are.

Why do the Lakers purple jerseys always show up as blue?

i've got multiple audio dropouts too, so annoying because my speakers pop everytime the audio kicks back in.

but what pisses me off a million times more is that my genius engineers just somehow switched to 480i sd. The game actually looks better on the sd channel than the hd channel....idiots...

Why do the Lakers purple jerseys always show up as blue?

Either your displays colors are off or your provider, but the Lakers are on many channels through the season and playoffs...are they blueish on all channels?
They are a rich purple as they are on my set.
Ofcourse with all the macroblocking I'm getting now how could I tell.

Is it the Garden or is it ABC that is causing the view to be so terrible. The cameras are so far from the court that it appears you are getting the view of a fan in the last row of the stadium. I haven't seen this perspective ever on TNT.

The main camera locations are the same that TNT or any other broadcaster would use.

WPTY, OTA, Memphis, just recently cut their HD feed from 16.6 mbps to 8.5 mbps with 9.6 mpbs null. You can only imagine how bad this looks.

homcom......showing my lack of knowledge, where in the line 'can' DNR be introduced?
I ask because this is one of the cleanest images I've ever seen for a game(when it isn't breaking up), yet the PQ ultimately isn't there.

It looks really good on WEWS HD in Cleveland Ohio. WEWS: 720p, DD5.1, no subchannels, Time Warner Cable. No audio dropouts.

The Lakers jerseys are a rich navy blue purple. Sort of like the old Barney purple rather than the newer purple purple Barney.

:)

homcom......showing my lack of knowledge, where in the line 'can' DNR be introduced?
I ask because this is one of the cleanest images I've ever seen for a game(when it isn't breaking up), yet the PQ ultimately isn't there.

Well it is predicated upon how you gauge Picture Quality. Are you looking for that 'pop.' Much of that has more to do with contrast ratio (HD is going to handle your whites and blacks better provided your camera imager can do it), but during a live event you have to take into account the ambient lighting, which even in newer venues often isn't that great, stray light hitting the lens (big problem with baseball stadiums). This is why sometimes HD on a bright sunny day (or Hockey with the white ice) will pop more than say an indoor college basketball game under terrible lighting. People often make the mistake that resolution and pixel count equal a snappy picture and that's not the case. Just watch GMA or The View. While it plays a factor, the qualitative factor of how good a picture looks in HD is generally predicated upon other external forces (lighting, engineering, lensing, compression scheme, backhaul method, etc) and not simply the native pixel count.

No, I correct myself. The Lakers wear a royal purple!

There is little if any difference in contrast between HD and SD. DNR is not typically used on live events like this. In post production DNR is usually added in the final stages. The lack of noise with softer detail tonight could be caused by a higher crispening (coring) in the cameras or settings in the backhaul encoder. My own preference is not to use coring.

Great game tonight.

the audio dropouts truly sucked. glad I wasn't the only one. RCN Chicago. and ABCHD (WLSDT) 7-1 OTA. dropped out too. The volume kept going up and down as well.

The commercials are fine though.

There is little if any difference in contrast between HD and SD. DNR is not typically used on live events like this. In post production DNR is usually added in the final stages. The lack of noise with softer detail tonight could be caused by a higher crispening (coring) in the cameras or settings in the backhaul encoder. My own preference is not to use coring.

Great game tonight.

Ok let me rephrase. You're right HD & Digital SD will both carry about the same physical contrast ratio. What I was alluding to is that I've found that HD cameras do a better job of resolving information in the blacks than SD CCD/CMOS, though physically the exposure latitude between absolute white and absolute black is still limited by the constraints of digital video.

I agree though that detail coring will produce the image results mentioned. But (and its obviously not an issue on a show like NBA Finals) I'm amazed at the engineers and techs I often run into on the road who are somewhat novice to HD, (but inexplicably end up as my V.C.'s) who may not understand something as rudimentary as Digital Black is 0 IRE not 7.5 or that 720p is (in broadcast) 60 frames per second and not 30. I had a TD futz with a DVEOUS for hours trying to create a 24p look, before realizing that he was trying to do a pull-down from 30fps, and this was an ESPN show at 60fps. I've also seen editors who have their timelines set to 30fps, while editing 720p material and wondering why there were flash frames and the video motion wasn't correct. Even among professionals sometimes the HD conversion is still a process.

I still say Celtics in 6 :)

PQ was sub-par. Seems like most games from Boston don't look good. I don't know if it's the lighting of the arena, distance of cameras from the court, or a combination of the two.

We also experienced audio drops here in Knoxville. I didn't know if it was from ABC, Comcast, or something else. Seems to be an ABC problem since many people across the country experienced it.

Ok let me rephrase. You're right HD & Digital SD will both carry about the same physical contrast ratio. What I was alluding to is that I've found that HD cameras do a better job of resolving information in the blacks than SD CCD/CMOS, though physically the exposure latitude between absolute white and absolute black is still limited by the constraints of digital video.

I agree though that detail coring will produce the image results mentioned. But (and its obviously not an issue on a show like NBA Finals) I'm amazed at the engineers and techs I often run into on the road who are somewhat novice to HD, (but inexplicably end up as my V.C.'s) who may not understand something as rudimentary as Digital Black is 0 IRE not 7.5 or that 720p is (in broadcast) 60 frames per second and not 30. I had a TD futz with a DVEOUS for hours trying to create a 24p look, before realizing that he was trying to do a pull-down from 30fps, and this was an ESPN show at 60fps. I've also seen editors who have their timelines set to 30fps, while editing 720p material and wondering why there were flash frames and the video motion wasn't correct. Even among professionals sometimes the HD conversion is still a process.Then explain to them how drop frame time code works and get ready for the inevitable question "What happens to the video frames that are thrown out"? At least we'll be done with setup as SD dies, but the .1% pulldown will be with us for a long time to come. NTSC color had alot of smart innovations but changing the frame rate wasn't one of them.

Well it is predicated upon how you gauge Picture Quality. Are you looking for that 'pop.' Much of that has more to do with contrast ratio (HD is going to handle your whites and blacks better provided your camera imager can do it), but during a live event you have to take into account the ambient lighting, which even in newer venues often isn't that great, stray light hitting the lens (big problem with baseball stadiums). This is why sometimes HD on a bright sunny day (or Hockey with the white ice) will pop more than say an indoor college basketball game under terrible lighting. People often make the mistake that resolution and pixel count equal a snappy picture and that's not the case. Just watch GMA or The View. While it plays a factor, the qualitative factor of how good a picture looks in HD is generally predicated upon other external forces (lighting, engineering, lensing, compression scheme, backhaul method, etc) and not simply the native pixel count.

'Pop' is not in my vocabulary....that is for LCD fans. :)

Was it me or was the commercials super loud. I was afraid my speakers were going to blow out. Oh and Lakers in 6 Kobe wont miss those shots again.

'Pop' is not in my vocabulary....that is for LCD fans. :)
Or folks from the Midwest.

Well it is predicated upon how you gauge Picture Quality. Are you looking for that 'pop.' Much of that has more to do with contrast ratio (HD is going to handle your whites and blacks better provided your camera imager can do it), but during a live event you have to take into account the ambient lighting, which even in newer venues often isn't that great, stray light hitting the lens (big problem with baseball stadiums). This is why sometimes HD on a bright sunny day (or Hockey with the white ice) will pop more than say an indoor college basketball game under terrible lighting. People often make the mistake that resolution and pixel count equal a snappy picture and that's not the case. Just watch GMA or The View. While it plays a factor, the qualitative factor of how good a picture looks in HD is generally predicated upon other external forces (lighting, engineering, lensing, compression scheme, backhaul method, etc) and not simply the native pixel count.

"Pop" is more a function of apparent sharpness, which doesn't always track the resolution of the camera. The difference in apparent sharpness between a daylight game and a night or indoor game is primarily a depth of field issue, allowing more high frequency energy to make its way through the camera system.

You mentioned GMA and a bunch of factors, but you forgot the fog and vanity filters, or Vaseline on the lens. The fog filters used on those cameras reduce the resolution to SD levels, or worse. The only thing "HD" about them is the aspect ratio. The Tonight Show is the same way. One of the few "talent" shows that doesn't use filtration is "Late Night with Conan O'Brien."

Ok let me rephrase. You're right HD & Digital SD will both carry about the same physical contrast ratio. What I was alluding to is that I've found that HD cameras do a better job of resolving information in the blacks than SD CCD/CMOS, though physically the exposure latitude between absolute white and absolute black is still limited by the constraints of digital video.

I agree though that detail coring will produce the image results mentioned. But (and its obviously not an issue on a show like NBA Finals) I'm amazed at the engineers and techs I often run into on the road who are somewhat novice to HD, (but inexplicably end up as my V.C.'s) who may not understand something as rudimentary as Digital Black is 0 IRE not 7.5 or that 720p is (in broadcast) 60 frames per second and not 30. I had a TD futz with a DVEOUS for hours trying to create a 24p look, before realizing that he was trying to do a pull-down from 30fps, and this was an ESPN show at 60fps. I've also seen editors who have their timelines set to 30fps, while editing 720p material and wondering why there were flash frames and the video motion wasn't correct. Even among professionals sometimes the HD conversion is still a process.
The commoditization of remote TV broadcasting (even in HD) has allowed more unqualified people to find their way into the business. Also, some qualified people will not take a job that doesn't pay well enough. There's always someone who will work cheaper. They will probably not be any better. A good VO can adjust the image enhancement so that you don't need much and can't tell that it's there until you turn it off. CBS was famous for too much detail in SD, and even NHK used too much detail in HD.

BTW, 720p editing is still iffy because time code is still 30 frames and assumes interlace. Editing systems will often try to keep you from making a "cross field" edit, and only edit in whole frame increments.

[QUOTE=hphase;14028203 The Tonight Show is the same way. One of the few "talent" shows that doesn't use filtration is "Late Night with Conan O'Brien."
[/QUOTE]

And it looks superb.

I still like the Lakers in 6 after that game 1 loss. They'll make adjustments and play better in game 2. Shots weren't falling for Kobe and the rest of the team late. I have a hard time seeing them doing that again. BTW, the most pathetic thing of the night was Pierce going down with a injury, coming back within a 2 minute time span and the commentators blowing it up like it was Willis Reed-esque. First of all Reed had a torn muscle, and second of all, he entered at the start of the game, in game 7. Pierce had a sprained knee, spent 2 minutes in the locker room and came right back out... in game 1. You'd be retarded to compare that to Willis Reed's return.

I had lots of sounds drop also...... And for some reason it always seemed to happen right when something "good" was going to be said. Ticked me off..

Good game thou!

For some reason, games in Boston always have crappy PQ

And it looks superb.

Scary, even.

I'm watching Game 1 on NBA TV HD right now and the PQ is superb. Looks a lot better than when ESPN replayed the game on Thursday night. I'm watching over D*.

Edit: As I was typing they switched it back to 4x3. Looks like crap :mad:

I'm watching Game 1 on NBA TV HD right now and the PQ is superb. I agree, the PQ on NBATV-HD (D*) was much better than what I saw of Game 1 OTA on WEWS Cleveland (no subchannels). Wouldn't call it "superb" though ... but it *is* 720p, so I should lower my expectations, right? :D

I agree, the PQ on NBATV-HD (D*) was much better than what I saw of Game 1 OTA on WEWS Cleveland (no subchannels). Wouldn't call it "superb" though ... but it *is* 720p, so I should lower my expectations, right? :D

I was under the assumption that NBA TV was a 1080i broadcaster...in that event you were seeing a cross-convert.

Compared to what a ESPN broadcast usually looks like over D* it was a lot better. I must of been caught up in the moment. :D lol.

Game 1 OTA Orlando, FL WFTV looked horrid

you guys that say the picture quality is always bad from boston,I disagree i believe its the ABC feed,i also had audio droouts. during the regular season onnba league pass the 25 to 30 games i saw on NBA league pass were excellent! on directv. What provider are you using?

I'm using OTA and Celtic games always look bad. Not just from a Lakers fan, the PQ is pretty bad. Same with Cleveland.

Comcast SportsNet does the home cable broadcasts for the Celts. They do a significantly better job than any of the networks (ABC/ESPN or TNT) do. The camera wells are fixed, so the base positions are the same - aside from the overhead cam that Comcast SportsNet does not use.

Obviously using the same video and production crew game after game creates an inherent advantage, as does home-court knowledge about lighting issues.

I still like the Lakers in 6 after that game 1 loss. They'll make adjustments and play better in game 2. Shots weren't falling for Kobe and the rest of the team late. I have a hard time seeing them doing that again.

The Celts weren't exactly setting the net on fire in the 4th quarter, either, with Garnett and Cassell going a combined 2-9. But unlike the Lakers, they defended for the full 24, contested most shots and fought for every rebound. There's a lot more to this game than hitting jump shots, and the Lakers will not win if they continue to live by the jump shot and not win the up-front battles.

BTW, the most pathetic thing of the night was Pierce going down with a injury, coming back within a 2 minute time span and the commentators blowing it up like it was Willis Reed-esque. First of all Reed had a torn muscle, and second of all, he entered at the start of the game, in game 7. Pierce had a sprained knee, spent 2 minutes in the locker room and came right back out... in game 1. You'd be retarded to compare that to Willis Reed's return.

Actually Reed had a "deep muscle bruise," not a tear. And another way the comparison doesn't work is that Willis started the game, hit a couple shots and then sat for the last 30 minutes while his teammates won the game for him. Whereas Pierce was hurt in the middle of the 3rd and came back to score 11 points over the last 13 minutes, including the two huge 3s that put the Celts up to stay. So I'll take Pierce's on-court contributions over Reed's, regardless of what that obnoxious asshat Phil Jackson has to say. :)

That said, Stuart Scott's insistence that a return to Game 1 action had the same impact as Willis firing up his teammates in Game 7 was a premature ejaculation at best, and downright silly at worst. But that's typical of ESPN, where the credo seems to be "Sports just didn't exist before we did, except in those specific instances when we say so - and even then it's better RIGHT NOW."

A Sunday night tipoff that isn't until after 9pm?? Do they not realize that the entire East Coast will tune out at halftime or the 3rd quarter by the latest?? It's Sunday, there's no reason they can't start an hour or two earlier.

what a surprise, the pre game show looks terrible
/sarcasm

PQ on D* for game 2 does not look good. At least the game is good between the Celtics and Lakers.

Viewing WXYZ-DT ABC Detroit OTA (main HD with two subchannels) Doesn't look too bad....

Viewing WXYZ-DT ABC Detroit OTA (main HD with two subchannels) Doesn't look too bad....
The constant (useless) crawl on the bottom doesn't help, though.

Game 2 PQ looks about the same as Game 1 .... very mediocre.

Also getting a missed frame effect when the main center court cam quickly pans from left to right across the court.

Watching WEWS-DT Cleveland, OTA (no subchannels) on a 50" 1080p plasma.

A Sunday night tipoff that isn't until after 9pm?? Do they not realize that the entire East Coast will tune out at halftime or the 3rd quarter by the latest?? It's Sunday, there's no reason they can't start an hour or two earlier.

by starting the game at 9 eastern - they get at least 2 hours of prime time in each time zone.


And 'the entire East Coast'?? c'mon...

leon powe!!! i watched him in person at cal.

I thought PQ was not very good and the audio I thought was horrible as it was hard to hear the announcers on my center speaker.

I sure hope the Celtics send Christmas cards to last night's officials. Wow, just wow. Home cooking at its best. I don't think i've ever seen a game officiated that badly before. Celtics: 38 FT attempts, Lakers: 10 FT attempts. If the fouls are that one-sided in favor of the Celtics on Tuesday, good luck to those refs getting out of the arena. It sure would be a shame to see one of those refs get it like Paul Pierce did back in 2000. Anyways, assuming the officiating is fair, I think the Lakers will come back and sweep all three home games and go into Boston in game 6 and win the title on the parquet.

I sure hope the Celtics send Christmas cards to last night's officials. Wow, just wow. Home cooking at its best. I don't think i've ever seen a game officiated that badly before. Celtics: 38 FT attempts, Lakers: 10 FT attempts. If the fouls are that one-sided in favor of the Celtics on Tuesday, good luck to those refs getting out of the arena. It sure would be a shame to see one of those refs get it like Paul Pierce did back in 2000. Anyways, assuming the officiating is fair, I think the Lakers will come back and sweep all three home games and go into Boston in game 6 and win the title on the parquet.

The actual fouls were Lakers 28 and Cerltics 21 so really not as bad as you make it out to be.

There were 7 more fouls called on the Lakers. The problem is that jump shooting teams rarely get a lot of free throw attempts. If the Lakers want to go to the free throw line, they have to attack the hoop. This holds true for all levels of the game.

I sure hope the Celtics send Christmas cards to last night's officials. Wow, just wow. Home cooking at its best. I don't think i've ever seen a game officiated that badly before. Celtics: 38 FT attempts, Lakers: 10 FT attempts. If the fouls are that one-sided in favor of the Celtics on Tuesday, good luck to those refs getting out of the arena. It sure would be a shame to see one of those refs get it like Paul Pierce did back in 2000. Anyways, assuming the officiating is fair, I think the Lakers will come back and sweep all three home games and go into Boston in game 6 and win the title on the parquet.

I guess you had no complaints of the referees during the Utah series, did you?

Kobe Bryant get more call than anyone else, you and Phil complaining is laughable.

The Celtics are more physical, Lakers are finesse.

This series is OVER.

This series is OVER.


'06 Finals.

I don't know that I'd say it's over, but the Celtics have good defense, 3 scorers and energy and experience off the bench. They are a perfectly constructed team.

I may be wrong but it looks like the cameras are Thomson LDKs. I don't think they look as good as the Sonys. I hope the LA games look better.

LA games should look better in HD. I hope Boston change cameras for games 6 and 7 because game 1 and 2 were atrocious.

Speaking of refs, the calls were heavily in favor of Boston in game two. It was overboard. Lakers are not just a "finesse" team, they usually get a lot of points in the paint. Boston gets away with a lot of contact especially at home. This effectively makes the visiting team a jump shooting team. When the visiting team is called touch fouls contantly (while the home team gets away with the same), the visiting team has cannot be as aggressive. It's difficult or impossible to win in such conditions against a good team like the Celtics.

'06 Finals.

Yup. I brought that up in the other forum I post at. Miami looked DEAD IN THE WATER after the first two games. I personally thought Dallas was a lock for the sweep or winning it in 5. But Miami battled back tough, persevered and eventually won the series. Oh yeah, while everyone has been talking about Boston's great home record, LA hasn't gotten much recognition for their undefeated 8-0 home record. I'll take the 8-0 home record over Boston's 2-6 road record hahahahaha. The road hasn't been to nice to the Celtics, has it?

Keep in mind that Wade was untouchable in last few games of that series.

Yup. I brought that up in the other forum I post at. Miami looked DEAD IN THE WATER after the first two games. I personally thought Dallas was a lock for the sweep or winning it in 5. But Miami battled back tough, persevered and eventually won the series. Oh yeah, while everyone has been talking about Boston's great home record, LA hasn't gotten much recognition for their undefeated 8-0 home record. I'll take the 8-0 home record over Boston's 2-6 road record hahahahaha. The road hasn't been to nice to the Celtics, has it?

Yeah the Lakers have an 8-0 record at home, but remember this is not the same Boston team with a 2-6 road record. The 2 wins on the road were at Detroit.

NY Times article on fans turning off the game early:
East Coast Dreams As Celts Snooze, Nearly Lose (http://www.Imadeupthisheadlinejustnow.com)

The Boston remote is using SuperShooter 25 (Monday Night Football/Oscar preshow truck) which has LDK-6000s. The LA remote is using Game Creek's brand new monster truck FXHD which has Sony HDC-1500's.

Gamecreek Video http://www.gamecreekvideo.com/specs.html

NEP Inc
http://guardian.nepinc.com/packages/ss25/index.php

I forgot what the Pregame/Sportscenter hit trucks are equipped with.

sirjonsnow....your link is dead.

Kobe Bryant get more call than anyone else, you and Phil complaining is laughable.

The Celtics are more physical, Lakers are finesse.

This series is OVER.

Wrong ! The "This series is OVER" quote is laughable !!!!

(looking around for a singing fat lady)

sirjonsnow....your link is dead.

Check out the address ;)


The foul difference was only 28-21, which is reasonable, so how was there a 38-10 free throw difference? Did Boston make "clean" fouls before shots, but the Lakers fouls came when Celtics were taking shots? If so, there shouldn't be such an uproar about the FT difference.

I wasn't 100% focused on the games, but all the calls I saw were good except possibly one time a defending Laker falling on top of a Celtic after a layup.

Yeah the Lakers have an 8-0 record at home, but remember this is not the same Boston team with a 2-6 road record...
How is this not the same Boston team?

Keep in mind that Wade was untouchable in last few games of that series.
Yeah, the Wade "forcefield" the refs imposed was absolutely ridiculous. I don't expect Kobe to get the same treatment but the free-throws awarded will be much more even in LA (if not favoring the Lakes). The Celts are more physical so far. If the euro-Lakers and Lamar Odom don't toughen up, the Celts will take this. It's not over yet by any means.

GO LAKERS!!!

Its always tough to win when its 8 on 5, the only thing missing from the first 2 games is the refs joining Boston during their timeout huddles and cheer for them. Something should be done about these refs, I am a big Laker fan and I will dissapointed to see the Lakers go to the line 40 times in game 3 because that will proove the refs dictate on who wins the games and not the players.

Anyone looking to the NBA for a model of consistent officiating is an absolute moron.

The Boston remote is using SuperShooter 25 (Monday Night Football/Oscar preshow truck) which has LDK-6000s. The LA remote is using Game Creek's brand new monster truck FXHD which has Sony HDC-1500's.

Gamecreek Video http://www.gamecreekvideo.com/specs.html

NEP Inc
http://guardian.nepinc.com/packages/ss25/index.php

I forgot what the Pregame/Sportscenter hit trucks are equipped with.

NEP SS11 in Boston and NEP SS27 in LA for the studio stuff. Both LDK-6000s

it's hard to blame this on the refs - it's not one guy parading to the line like Wade in '06. It's the whole team, which means they're playing aggressive ball.

This is just a bad matchup for the lakers because Pierce will cancel out whatever effect Kobe has, and Garnett will match Gasol...At that point you look at the supporting casts. Who is better? Ray Allen and co. or Lamar Odom and co.? So far it's been Ray Allen and co....more experience, higher basketball IQ.

I'm sorry, what did I miss. It's June and baseball, is this stupid basketball still going on?

Get it over with already. No reason to drag this thing out the way they did. After the Celtics won the East, they waited almost a week to start the Finals, then they wait 2-3 days to play game 2. I don't understand it.

I'm sorry, what did I miss. It's June and baseball, is this stupid basketball still going on?

i'd watch the nba's product over the mlb trash any day of the week.

baseball blows.

i'd watch the nba's product over the mlb trash any day of the week.

baseball blows.
QFT.

I'm not a fan like I used to be, but I at least watch the finals. And if you're not a fan at all, there's no need to complain, just don't watch.

The finals have been on in June for some time now. If they push it back a month, like they did in the eighties, it would likely be on tape-delay. That used to really suck. Can't have this competing with the May-sweeps, you know.

Celts take it 4-1.

Anyone else having constants sound drop outs tonight (game 3). Wanted to check before I started blaming my local comcast. Pre-game was fine, drop outs started right at 9:00 when they went to the game.

No audio dropouts for me. I'm watching on D*. PQ is slightly better tonight.

Ok thanks for the response. Pretty bad here on comcast (Delaware), both HD feeds in the house with the same issue so think comcast is common denominator. Same during the commercials so it's ABC in general right now. Looks like upstairs to the analog feed here soon....

Actually (hopefully not speaking to soon) but it appears it's back to normal now, most of the first quarter was near unwatchable though...

Yep spoke to soon. Called comcast to hear the "we are having known issues in your area message" so looks like it's a local issue.

Yeesh, so much for the theory that L.A. video is better than the video out of Boston ... This PQ out of LA tonight is pretty crappy looking on the main center court cam. Tons of artifacts. I'd say closeups look sharper than Boston, but it's probably a lighting thing; colors seem more vivid here.

Watching WEWS-DT Cleveland, OTA, no subchannels on a 50" 1080p plasma.

Center court cam doesn't look good. I can never really tell what could be attributed to the WCVB-DT upconversion to 1080i.

Totally disgusted with my Lakers. You let PJ Brown do that to you!! And you also receive part of the double technical called. Own your fricken house (court). The Lakers are too soft. BTW, KABC 7 LA looks good here in SoCal. OK picture, no audio drop outs.

***Getting no output from center channel nor surrounds, so I must be getting 2.1:eek:
Anyone else only getting 2.1?
D* -- Allentown, PA
Tons more video black outs, pixelization and a TON of audio drop outs as well.

Center court cam doesn't look good.Agreed; not looking too hot (OTA). The other cams are fine, though. BTW, enough with the GMC commercial-dude....he's quite annoying.

rezzy....are you getting 5.1DD?

Sorry, my set isn't currently connected to a surround amp. But besides stereo, there is at least one other channel available (por Espanol).

Thanks for answering quickly though. I appreciate that.

I am getting 5.1, but I would like the center to be more. It seems that all three front channels are equal volume. The surrounds kick butt. Nothing butt court/audience ambience.

Run4two...thank you very much for helping.
More proof, I believe, that either my local Philly guy/team is a bunch of people that just don't do their jobs 'and' don't care(I live less than an hour north in Allentown)....or my HR21-700(#2 for me already) is responsible.

Eagles, You are very much welcomed. I can only begin to tell you how much your posts have helped me. That being said, my pq is very grainy and I just received my first audio drop out. It was quick and went right back to 5.1. I have had a couple of problems in the last minute with the audio screwing with my receiver. The commercials look way better than the game.

:(

Like the Big devil guy movie preview I just watched with absolutely no voices?!?!
Even in PLIIX matrixed I had no sound for that whole commercial, then with the Kobe commercial it came back.
This is sickening, truly. :sad:

On a side note I am glad I have helped you in anyway, that is what I attempt to always do but sometimes my angst gets out of hand with this stuff. :)
It's hard to step back and remember this should be fun, what with all the money, time, and effort put into these set-ups. When you have issue arise that seem to be completely out of your control and seemingly 'no-one' cares from the big companies it gets bothersome.

Am I the only one that is getting this? It seems like volume is going up and down during game play. It is driving me nuts. It is occuring on my Philips LCD and my JVC RPTV. Every game this playoffs I have watched on ABC has been like this. I change to another channel, and its gone.

No voices here on any commercials and the game is in 2.1. All other channels are fine though so it's only the ABC DD feed that appears screwed up. Very annoying nonetheless.

Pasdabru.....Dover is definitely Philly based correct? You are getting 2.1 as well.
And all other channels at a glance appear fine?

Anyone else have a black bar in the bottom fourth of the screen for a little bit there?

I have been getting this very rapid audio glitch about every 30 seconds or so. Anyone else hear it? Sounds like the announcer become Darth Vader for a single word then returns to normal. PQ is better than BOS games. Lip sync is off. Watching on D*.

I wonder if the audio dropouts are from S&P aka censors.

No problem here in NorCal OTA KXTV, and I've already heard: "Peja was fouled at the end of that game with the Lakers."

Yep Dover is Philly based. Only 2.1, no voices on commericals that are normally HD. Did some checking and it's only ABC that is experiencing the issue right now.

I watched Game 2 and 3 at my brother n law's house and we had an audio problem also. The sound would go low and then increase in volume, only to go back low again. This happened with 2.0 stereo, TV speakers, as he does not have a 5.1 setup.

I'm sorry, what did I miss. It's June and baseball, is this stupid basketball still going on?

You're saying this while baseball has 162 games + playoffs? HAHAHA, no wonder why barely anybody has any interest in watching the World Series in freaking October. I follow the entire baseball season (i'm an A's and Mets fan) but I don't think i've ever watched a World Series in its entirety mainly due to better things going on like NFL, NCAAF and NHL hockey starting up.

The lighting in the Staples Center definitely plays to the camera better, especially during all the pregame activities. It's amazing what a little texture and backlight will do. The one thing I find distracting is the LED ribbon board behind Stuart Scott is screaming bright and the jib camera and his closeup are having a hard time with it.

The lighting in the Staples Center definitely plays to the camera better, especially during all the pregame activities. It's amazing what a little texture and backlight will do. The one thing I find distracting is the LED ribbon board behind Stuart Scott is screaming bright and the jib camera and his closeup are having a hard time with it.

The "Lights Out" thing they do at Staples really makes it look better.

I live in Wilmington, DE and this audio problem is VERY annoying. I have been calling Comcast for over a week and they continue to be clueless. They keep trying to send a signal to my box or have a tech come visit me. They said they did a search internally and didn't find anything about the issue. I told them to go use the Internet then call me back. They are freaking worthless.

For what it's worth, there are other people in New Castle County (Delaware) who I've talked to that are having the same issues. The game is being presented in DD2.1, which is wrong and dumb. The HD commercials are being presented in 5.1 but the center channel is completely missing. It sucks. It's very annoying.:mad:

I live in Wilmington, DE and this audio problem is VERY annoying. I have been calling Comcast for over a week and they continue to be clueless. They keep trying to send a signal to my box or have a tech come visit me. They said they did a search internally and didn't find anything about the issue. I told them to go use the Internet then call me back. They are freaking worthless.

For what it's worth, there are other people in New Castle County (Delaware) who I've talked to that are having the same issues. The game is being presented in DD2.1, which is wrong and dumb. The HD commercials are being presented in 5.1 but the center channel is completely missing. It sucks. It's very annoying.:mad:

If you're getting commercials in 5.1 it sounds like you should contact your local ABC affiliate.

I live in Wilmington, DE and this audio problem is VERY annoying. I have been calling Comcast for over a week and they continue to be clueless. They keep trying to send a signal to my box or have a tech come visit me. They said they did a search internally and didn't find anything about the issue. I told them to go use the Internet then call me back. They are freaking worthless.

For what it's worth, there are other people in New Castle County (Delaware) who I've talked to that are having the same issues. The game is being presented in DD2.1, which is wrong and dumb. The HD commercials are being presented in 5.1 but the center channel is completely missing. It sucks. It's very annoying.:mad:

IF center channel is missing, then its not true 5.1 plain and simple. Sounds almost like someone is only taking 2 channels of the 5.1 and synthesizing 5.1 even though they just need to pass it through. Center would be dialogue.
May be local affiliate issue. They must synthesize local programming and forgot to switch back for network.

IF center channel is missing, then its not true 5.1 plain and simple. Sounds almost like someone is only taking 2 channels of the 5.1 and synthesizing 5.1 even though they just need to pass it through. Center would be dialogue.
May be local affiliate issue. They must synthesize local programming and forgot to switch back for network.

The dialogue is the part that's missing. It's very strange. During just about every commercial for a movie (Incredible Hulk, Hellboy, Wanted etc...) there is absolutely no voice. It's all sound effects and surround audio. It happens on 2 different TVs in my house with 2 different STBs. It also happens to my brother who lives about 10 miles away.

I never thought to contact my local ABC affiliate. I will try that tomorrow. I'm sure nothing will come of it, but this really blows. So I will give it a try.

The picture may or may not be great, the audio may or may not be great; but, if the quality sucks and is questionable as to its integrity, does it matter?

...Oh yeah, while everyone has been talking about Boston's great home record, LA hasn't gotten much recognition for their undefeated 8-0 home record. I'll take the 8-0 home record over Boston's 2-6 road record hahahahaha. The road hasn't been to nice to the Celtics, has it?
?

Finally the Celtics got a clue to pull Rondo when he's not hot and to put Pierce on Kobe.

Did they say it was the final's biggest margin come back from behind victory? they were down 24 points at one time.

Did they say it was the final's biggest margin come back from behind victory? they were down 24 points at one time.

They said at one point that the first quarter margin was the largest in history. So, to overcome that, it had to be the biggest comeback. Pretty amazing stuff. Lakers will win the next one and the Celtics will close it out at home in 6.

Now that the local ABC affiliate in Memphis has cranked the bit rate back up to 17 mbps I can now comment on the HD PQ.

Terrible.

I think the Celtics close them out tomorrow night. The Lakers know the C's are a better team. They're demoralized. And that crowd in L.A. isn't exactly the kind that takes you to a higher level. The C's are hurting, they want this over. I just hope Pierce doesn't get too hyped wanting to win it in LA. He's been known to do that on occasion.

GO Celtics!!!!

They said at one point that the first quarter margin was the largest in history. So, to overcome that, it had to be the biggest comeback. Pretty amazing stuff. Lakers will win the next one and the Celtics will close it out at home in 6.While I think you are right about its being the biggest comeback, your logic doesn't make sense.

The first quarter margin was the largest first quarter margin in history, not the largest overall margin in history. Obviously, since the Celtics were down by 24 later in the game.

Hypothetically, another team could have been down 15 in the first quarter, 30 at the half, and then gone on to win. They would have come back from a greater overall deficit, even though the first quarter margin was lower than the first quarter margin in the Lakers-Celtics game.

While I think you are right about its being the biggest comeback, your logic doesn't make sense.

The first quarter margin was the largest first quarter margin in history, not the largest overall margin in history. Obviously, since the Celtics were down by 24 later in the game.

Hypothetically, another team could have been down 15 in the first quarter, 30 at the half, and then gone on to win. They would have come back from a greater overall deficit, even though the first quarter margin was lower than the first quarter margin in the Lakers-Celtics game.

I actually realized that it could be interpreted that way after I posted it, but didn't bother to do an edit 'cause I didn't think anyone would notice. Silly me. ;) At any rate, it was the biggest comeback in finals history, as well as the biggest first quarter deficit that was overcome, as well as the biggest halftime deficit that was overcome. Lots of records in this one. Makes me especially proud that I actually stayed awake long enough to witness it. :p

Am i the only one experiencing dropouts again on abc?

ABC has to keep putting up that banner telling us it's the NBA Finals and who has the series lead? In less then 2 min. it's been on screen twice.

The beginning of tonights game had bad dropouts but was quickly rectified...

Time Warner
WCPO Cincinnati
LG QAM Tuner

Still getting both audio and video dropouts on TWC Binghamton, NY. I also have OTA, so it's obviously ABC.

This is beyond frustrating

Still issues with regular audio from the TV speakers on the HD feed. Up and down on the volume during gameplay.

Still getting both audio and video dropouts on TWC Binghamton, NY. I also have OTA, so it's obviously ABC.

This is beyond frustrating

I don't think it is ABC...More than likely your affiliate...My video/audio has been rock solid since the dropouts were corrected...

Still issues with regular audio from the TV speakers on the HD feed. Up and down on the volume during gameplay.

Again...here in Cinti...total consistency with audio & video quality...

Checking in late here in Cleveland, WEWS-DT, Cleveland, OTA. No subchannels.

Audio is seriously hosed. Sounds like someone cranked up a small transistor radio to "11". I've never heard audio this bad on a professional sports broadcast from a major network (or any network). Between the horrible audio quality and lousy picture, ABC should have their contract yanked from ever doing the NBA Finals again. Disgusting.

Also getting that "skipped frame" effect as the main center court cam pans across the court. Been seeing that crap the whole finals.

This is so bad I think I'm going to watch it on ESPN Radio instead. This is unwatchable, giving me a headache.

Boston just seems to want it more. Good PQ on KABC 7 LA on TWC.

closeups from court level look great, but the wide shot is horrible - lots of noise, especially in the crowd where it's darker

I'm getting audio drop outs also but I think it's because if a player is swearing or about to they drop the audio for a second. In the 2nd Q when KG picked up his 3rd foul they dropped audio cause he obviously said the F word.

Man, I wanted this to end tonight! I'm tired of staying up late.

I said it before I will say it again.

Boston in 6.

I agree, on Directv the audio was just horrendous. Thought my audio system had something blown until I changed the channel.

Checking in late here in Cleveland, WEWS-DT, Cleveland, OTA. No subchannels.

Audio is seriously hosed. Sounds like someone cranked up a small transistor radio to "11". I've never heard audio this bad on a professional sports broadcast from a major network (or any network). Between the horrible audio quality and lousy picture, ABC should have their contract yanked from ever doing the NBA Finals again. Disgusting.

Also getting that "skipped frame" effect as the main center court cam pans across the court. Been seeing that crap the whole finals.

This is so bad I think I'm going to watch it on ESPN Radio instead. This is unwatchable, giving me a headache.

Lakers better shape up if they want to have any chance at this championship. They're playing with a lack of hoops-IQ, and truly weak defense. They shouldn't expect to get one of those 20-point early leads that allow them to hold on (or not! yikes!). The C's are just playing with more steady determination, as if they expect to win.

I cannot stand the thought of Bostonians claiming a major championship, so here's hoping the Lakers can snap out of it.

As long as the C's stay out of foul trouble they should take game 6 and wrap this up.

Look at the two losses -- Pierce and Garnett were in foul trouble

I cannot stand the thought of Bostonians claiming a major championship, so here's hoping the Lakers can snap out of it.Barring a miracle (Magic ripping off his shirt, revealing a big S on his chest), it aint gonna happen.

Barring a miracle (Magic ripping off his shirt, revealing a big S on his chest), it aint gonna happen.
Come on,you have to be a little scared,especially after the invincible Patriots choked away the Super Bowl. :D Miracles can(and do) happen. The Celtics are old,hurt,and tired. If Pierce has a mediocre game....look out.

I want to see the Lakers win, but most of all I want to see game 7. I want to see both of these teams play with their backs against the wall. Hopefully that happens.

One thing the past several days have suggested: Tiger Woods is more dominant in his sport than Kobe Bryant is in his.

Come on,you have to be a little scared,especially after the invincible Patriots choked away the Super Bowl. :D Miracles can(and do) happen. The Celtics are old,hurt,and tired. If Pierce has a mediocre game....look out.Pierce actually needs to step up his game more. But anyway, I'm a Colts fan; I was glad the Pats choked that one away. And Tiger is indeed more dominate in his sport, as Kobe is nothing more than a scorer. A prolific scorer, mind you, but that's all.

Pierce scored 38 on the road in LA..i think he's doing fine.

Like I said earlier, if the C's stay out of foul trouble, they'll be fine...the big 3 need to be on the floor for the majority of the game.

Pierce actually needs to step up his game more. But anyway, I'm a Colts fan; I was glad the Pats choked that one away. And Tiger is indeed more dominate in his sport, as Kobe is nothing more than a scorer. A prolific scorer, mind you, but that's all.


If you think Kobe is only a scorer you don't know basketball.

Someone started a thread last season when he dropped 81 points that one night. I said it then and I'll say it again: he's a great scorer. AND, his defense is pretty much non-existent. He certainly hasn't slowed down Pierce, who's not at all the fastest player in the league. But if he played any conscious defense, he'd be a greater player than MJ ever was, IMO.

Him getting nominations for defensive team seem token to me. Can't say I've ever seen him block anyone's shot when it really mattered. I'm not calling him a ball-hog as he certainly passes more than MJ did. And I would get on his bandwagon if his D was nearly intense as his offense.



If you think Kobe is only a scorer you don't know basketball.Please.....:rolleyes:

Man these games from Boston just do not look as good as the games from Los Angeles...

though I think the closeups on the pregame show look a little better, the LED ribbon boards at the Garden don't play hell with the cameras the way they did in LA.

Fios Northern VA the game isn't in HD.

I am also in NoVA and I am not getting an HD signal from Comcast.

Must be an ABC/ESPN issue.

HD broke for a second there after some audio issues. Back now.

Someone started a thread last season when he dropped 81 points that one night. I said it then and I'll say it again: he's a great scorer. AND, his defense is pretty much non-existent. He certainly hasn't slowed down Pierce, who's not at all the fastest player in the league. But if he played any conscious defense, he'd be a greater player than MJ ever was, IMO.

Him getting nominations for defensive team seem token to me. Can't say I've ever seen him block anyone's shot when it really mattered. I'm not calling him a ball-hog as he certainly passes more than MJ did. And I would get on his bandwagon if his D was nearly intense as his offense.



Please.....:rolleyes:

You don't know basketball if you think Kobe is even close to MJ. MJ is the greatest player ever and Kobe is the closest we will see, but he is still not close.

Yet another (but brief) audio drop out, here in MA on Comcast. PQ is on par with the rest of the series, which has not been amazing.

I'm also in NoVA with FIOS and no HD signal. Looks like the old school Magic/Bird days. I can barely make out the longer shorts so I am pretty sure I didn't time warp back to the 80s. = )

Phoenix-Cox-HD.. the audio has made the series almost unwatchable. The volume goes up and down every few seconds... you have to crank it up until your ears bleed to be able to hear it when it is low. Unbelievable. And only this NBA and only ABC. Everything was great for the TNT HD broadcasts.

I'm also in NoVA with FIOS and no HD signal. Looks like the old school Magic/Bird days. I can barely make out the longer shorts so I am pretty sure I didn't time warp back to the 80s. = )

Aaaaahh.. I've had to suffer with SD for almost a quarter now!! I think someone forgot to flip the HD switch - I just saw my screen flash some color bars that said ABC HD NY. But its STILL in SD! I can't get a hold of anyone at WJLA.

no hd on fios in prince georges county maryland.

I think someone @ABC/ESPN is going to lose their job..... biggest game of the season.

The DC ABC affiliate (WJLA) must not be putting out an HD signal because both my Fios and HD D* are not in HD. :eek:

THANKS WJLA! :mad:

Can ANYONE get a hold of WJLA?? I can't believe they dropped the ball on this one :(

I think someone @ABC/ESPN is going to lose their job..... biggest game of the season.

...?

No HD in Arlington, VA on Comcast. Way to blow it on one of the biggest games of the year! :mad:

...?

There's no HD signal but good ole SD here around DC. How gay.

Yeah, HD in DC only an hour late. :rolleyes:

HD back on Comcast in PG County, MD

sounds like a local issue (as all of you posters are in and around the DC metro area). I've had usual ABC HD the entire time and haven't noticed any audio issues other than the nat-sound/crowd sounds a little boomier than usual tonight -- that and Boston about to take LA out to the woodshed in the 2nd quarter.

I cannot say that I'm terribly inspired by the PQ coming from SS25 tonight (it's on par with what I normally get from ABC NBA telecasts, but compared to other high end ABC shows like the Oscars it's lacking). Like the blacks are crushed or something. I still think the HDC-1500's in the FXHD truck in LA combined with lighting that was obviously created for broadcasts by a Hollywood lighting guy/gal results in a prettier picture, though I'm the last person to say that SS25 can't put out a pretty picture, MNF had some great looking games last fall but if you watch the Sportscenter highlights and montages from Games 3, 4 & 5, they look stunning, even the high frame rate super slow-mo stuff.

You don't know basketball if you think Kobe is even close to MJ. MJ is the greatest player ever and Kobe is the closest we will see, but he is still not close.In case you weren't paying attention, Kobe is already a better scorer than Jordan was. Micheal's advantage is, he was great at defending. And I wouldn't call MJ the greatest-ever; Chamberlain, Bird & Magic would have a problem with that.

In case you weren't paying attention, Kobe is already a better scorer than Jordan was. Micheal's advantage is, he was great at defending. And I wouldn't call MJ the greatest-ever; Chamberlain, Bird & Magic would have a problem with that.

Michael had intangibles and his killer instinct which are unmatched. I really don't see that in Kobe.

But this is an AV board, I discuss the game elsewhere.

In case you weren't paying attention, Kobe is already a better scorer than Jordan was. Micheal's advantage is, he was great at defending. And I wouldn't call MJ the greatest-ever; Chamberlain, Bird & Magic would have a problem with that.

It's definitely arguable. From my memory Jordan was a much more efficient scorer than Kobe. Jordan only took impossible shots [for him] out of necessity and his post-up game was far superior to Kobe's. Kobe takes too many difficult shots each and every game. Also, while Kobe can jump he does not have the leaping ability that Jordan and Dominique had. However, Kobe has a long distance game that Jordan never had. I believe that Kobe's ball handling and off -the-dribble moves are far superior. While Kobe has emulated Jordan's fadeaway jumper, their overall offensive games are really nothing alike.

Michael was a better one-on-one defender. The only defensive area I believe Kobe exceeds Mike is shot blocking.

I think some have lost sight that the Kobe Bryant we are seeing since the All-Star break is not a full-strength Kobe. I never miss a Laker game and there is no doubt that Kobe's jump shooting and ball handling diminished since his pinky injury.

In my mind, Jordan is the best all-around player to ever play...hands down. However, in my mind Magic is the greatest to ever play. Another argument for another day. :cool:

Congrats Celts...it's your year!

Next year will be interesting with Bynum back. Lakers have got to get rid of at least one Euro (probably Radmonovic). I'd love to see Lakers and Celtics battle at full strength next year.

Michael had intangibles and his killer instinct which are unmatched. I really don't see that in Kobe.
Kobe probably has the fiercest killer instinct of anyone in the league today. However, I do agree that it is nowhere near Michael's.

man I wish that my ABC affiliate had their own tower back. I'm watching OTA via a MNTV affiliate that's running ABC HD on a second subchannel. So it's quite bitstarved. Better than DISH Network though, theirs is terrible since the tower went down.

Jordan is THE BEST EVER. Aside from the Wizards years, his career is immaculate. If Kobe could start over with everything he has seen and learned in 12 seasons, he would still not come close to what Jordan accomplished. PERIOD. END OF STORY.


edit: GO CELTICS!

I don't wanna add to this silly debate, but there's no comparing Kobe vs. Jordan. Kobe is the best player these days, but compared to Jordan, he's not on the same level.

What people forget about Jordan was his amazing quickness/speed. Kobe is a step or two slower, and that's something you either have or you don't. He played when defense was actually allowed in the NBA. These days if you breath on someone too hard it's a foul.. that wasn't the case when Jordan played. Jordan had a quickness that could let him get to the paint at will. Pure quickness is something you simply can't learn. Like others already said, he was also a shutdown defender (again, thanks to his quickness and drive).

Is kobe a great player? Sure. But, I would never say he's on the same level as Jordan. Jordan was incredibly gifted athletically, and he had the work ethic to go along with it.

This game is about as interesting as last year's Spurs/Cavs series...

in otherwords I'm off to bed...I suppose one can assume the combined championships of the Celtics & Red Sox can atone for the Patriots.

...I suppose one can assume the combined championships of the Celtics & Red Sox can atone for the Patriots.

No, not at all.

Is kobe a great player? Sure. But, I would never say he's on the same level as Jordan. Jordan was incredibly gifted athletically, and he had the work ethic to go along with it.

There will never be another Jordan....never. Kobe is an amazing player,if you don't agree you are a hater. I hate Boston but I give them credit,they deserve this title. Hopefully we will have a rematch next year. This is quite the ass whippin we are watching in game 6.

Him getting nominations for defensive team seem token to me. Can't say I've ever seen him block anyone's shot when it really mattered. I'm not calling him a ball-hog as he certainly passes more than MJ did. And I would get on his bandwagon if his D was nearly intense as his offense.
Please.....:rolleyes:

Kobe was 7th in the league in steals this year,defense is not all blocked shots,you clearly haven't watched Kobe enough.

Why does the audio keep getting turned off?
If the players are cursing why not just turn the mic near them off?

I could care less who wins this thing, and I realize the Celtics are kicking a$$ by 30 points, but the Celtics premature sideline celebrations show a certain lack of class. I saw a bunch of Celtics jumping up and down like little girls with about 3 minutes to go.

Good riddance to the Celtics, Lakers, and a piss poor ABC Finals broadcast.

Wow this is awful, Mike Breen is doing his final call of the last 4 seconds of the game and ABC keeps turing the audio feed off.

Wow this is awful, Mike Breen is doing his final call of the last 4 seconds of the game and ABC keeps turing the audio feed off.

I think it's because there's a lot of four letter words being spoken, i.e., Kevin Garnett's little "speech" right now with Tafoya.

Yeah, and it's the five second delay that's allowing them to bleep... making it impossible for them to isolate one mic. Just a guess, of course....

I understand censoring the cursing during interviews but they need a better system then just dumping the whole audio feed during game play.
Yeah the ending was a blow out but I would still like to have heard what Breen said.

I could care less who wins this thing, and I realize the Celtics are kicking a$$ by 30 points, but the Celtics premature sideline celebrations show a certain lack of class. I saw a bunch of Celtics jumping up and down like little girls with about 3 minutes to go.

Good riddance to the Celtics, Lakers, and a piss poor ABC Finals broadcast.

I don't care about the celebrating,thats to be expected,but the constant launching of 3's with a 35 point lead is definitely classless. Oh yeah,ABC's PQ(as well as AQ) was crappy once again this year ;)

ABC has no choice with this FCC. The delay is downstream of the truck feed.

Kobe's legacy takes a huge hit. At least Lebron was able to put up 50 with zero help in a game 7. Kobe couldn't even get there.

Kobe's legacy takes a huge hit. At least Lebron was able to put up 50 with zero help in a game 7. Kobe couldn't even get there.


If Lebron doesn't get some decent players around him,his legacy will be the same as Sir Charles. Great player.....0 rings.Kobe's legacy is just fine,but his ego took a nice hit.

I don't care about the celebrating,thats to be expected,but the constant launching of 3's with a 35 point lead is definitely classless. Oh yeah,ABC's PQ(as well as AQ) was crappy once again this year ;)

give me a break....how about vujacic jacking up 3s when they eliminated the spurs?

The lakers were beaten like a drum...no such thing as running up the score..play some defense and stop the other team.

This series was officially over when the score was 13-12 lakers, and kobe scored 11 of those.

If Lebron doesn't get some decent players around him,his legacy will be the same as Sir Charles. Great player.....0 rings.Kobe's legacy is just fine,but his ego took a nice hit.

Currently Kobe's legacy is a great player who won championships with Shaq but so far has not done it without him. That hasn't changed.

RE: Audio dropout: Apparently ABC has an "Audio Cleaner"... Which is a device that delays the audio and video and allows them them to selectively delete the audio... essentially it's a person in a room, listening to the game and when he/she hears a curse word, the "hit the button" and it dumps the entire audio signal...

My opinion... IT SUCKS! But what can you say or do when the FCC fines broadcasters ridiculous amounts of money per infraction?

Not only can ABC get fined for profanity the affiliates can get fined as well so they have no choice. I think its more telling that we live in a day and age when professional athletes and officials are so cavalier about their language and personal presentation while on the nation's biggest stage. Can you not at least wait till behind closed doors?

Currently Kobe's legacy is a great player who won championships with Shaq but so far has not done it without him. That hasn't changed.

That argument is so tired. Jordan never won a title without Pippen,so what.
Lebron will never win a ring until he gets another star player on his team,along with some much better role players.

Someone should have called 9 1 1 to stop this game!

Paul Pierce never could have stopped Jordan in his prime. Kobe fades against good, aggressive defenders. Anyone else get the idea that Rondo might yet become a decent player, maybe a breakout year next year?

PQ for every playoff game was horrible - tons of noise in the stands, I'm guessing because of the lighting and necessary filtering on the lenses.

Yeah the PQ was bad, I saw lots of snow effects during the series, yesterday I think was the worst.

Was it ABC or our local repeater? how did it look on Comcast/D*/E*?

In case you weren't paying attention, Kobe is already a better scorer than Jordan was. Micheal's advantage is, he was great at defending. And I wouldn't call MJ the greatest-ever; Chamberlain, Bird & Magic would have a problem with that.

I don't think they would...except for Wilt.
Michael also made everyone better and winners around him...Kobe does not.
Kobe also likes to belittle his players on the court when they make what he deems as bad choices or plays.
He is no Michael, I could think 0f at least 10 players ahead of Kobe on my all time totem poll.
And I hated Mike when he was playing, Charles was my guy.

Also, did anyone else think that was the worst post game on court interview ever after a championship?
And what's with the Celtics running and gunning up 30 with 4 minutes left? I know they were bench players, but win with some class.

Congrats Celtics fans, yet another championship for you all of a sudden lucky you know what's :)

How can anyone try to make the comparison between Jordan and Kobe.

Someone said Kobe is a better scorer. Kobe has only averaged 30 or more during 3 seasons. Jordan averaged 30 or more 8 times. Kobe's highest scoring average was 35.4. Jorand's was 37.1 and he had another season where he averaged 35. Jordan's overall average was 29.5 (30.7 if you exclude the blue period in Wash). Kobe's is 24.7.

Someone else said that Kobe was better at blocking shots. How did you arrive at that. Kobe averages .6 blocks per game (he averaged 1 block per game in 90. Jordan averaged .83 blocks per game over his career. He had 4 seasons with more than 1 block per game.

And I read where someone said Kobe passes the ball "way more than Jordan." Again, explain how you arrive at that conclusion. Jordan averaged 5.14 assists per game and Kobe averages 4.6 assists. Kobe has exactly 1 season where he averaged 6 assists per game. Jordan averaged more than 6 assists in 3 different seasons including 8 per game in 1989.

Jordan has 6 Finals MVP trophys. Kobe has 0.

Rebounds - Jordan
ft% - wash
fg% - Jordan
3% - Kobe (but Jordan was better in the playoffs).

I think Kobe is a great player, maybe the best today. But there is no aspect of the game that he does better than Jordan did - none.

How can anyone try to make the comparison between Jordan and Kobe.

Someone said Kobe is a better scorer. Kobe has only averaged 30 or more during 3 seasons. Jordan averaged 30 or more 8 times. Kobe's highest scoring average was 35.4. Jorand's was 37.1 and he had another season where he averaged 35. Jordan's overall average was 29.5 (30.7 if you exclude the blue period in Wash). Kobe's is 24.7.

Someone else said that Kobe was better at blocking shots. How did you arrive at that. Kobe averages .6 blocks per game (he averaged 1 block per game in 90. Jordan averaged .83 blocks per game over his career. He had 4 seasons with more than 1 block per game.

And I read where someone said Kobe passes the ball "way more than Jordan." Again, explain how you arrive at that conclusion. Jordan averaged 5.14 assists per game and Kobe averages 4.6 assists. Kobe has exactly 1 season where he averaged 6 assists per game. Jordan averaged more than 6 assists in 3 different seasons including 8 per game in 1989.

Jordan has 6 Finals MVP trophys. Kobe has 0's.

Rebounds - Jordan
ft% - wash
fg% - Jordan
3% - Kobe (but Jordan was better in the playoffs).

I think Kobe is a great player, maybe the best today. But there is no aspect of the game that he does better than Jordan did - none.

When Daniel Patrick Moynihan said "You are entitled to your opinion. But you are not entitled to your own facts", you must've really taken that to heart. I'm impressed.

Sorry, I browse more than a few message boards and I've been reading lots of Kobe is better than MJ threads lately. Luckily for you guys (or unluckily depending on your point of view), I happened to be on AVS forum reading this thread when I decided to respond.

That argument is so tired. Jordan never won a title without Pippen,so what.


You have that backwards...Pippen never won a title without Jordan...;)

Kobe was good but not great...He certainly isn't great now...He may be the most recognizable name in the game today...but Jordan is the most recognizable of all time...along with Bird...

The Celtics bench had every reason to run the score and show off that they too can score...They deserved to score just as much as any other team member...:)

PQ ans AQ was phenominal te whole series here on TWC using my QAM tuner/DVD combo unit...

Kobe was good but not great...He certainly isn't great now...

I think you just went off the deep end. You're talking about Kobe in the past tense..the guy is 30 years old, and is one of the best closers the game has ever seen.

One guy cannot beat a team as good as Boston..if Odom or Gasol had shown up, the series may have gone a little differently. The same thing applies to Dirk - this is a team game...if the other guys don't show up, you're going to get beat down.

Not at all...As MJ was winding down Kobe was the new 'best' but he never has been "great"...Certainly not in the same league as MJ...

My opinion is that basketball greatness is defined by the fourth quarter. The first three hardly matter and even the fourth quarter is largely weighed towards the last couple of minutes.

Being a fan of the Indiana Pacers in the 90's I never feared anyone more than Michael Jordan having the ball at the end of the game. He wasn't going to be denied.

Heck it took him sitting out a year before the much better (team wise) Pacers could make the finals. It felt like it come down to game seven every year in the playoffs... sure we could beat him for three games but when the clock was about to expire in the one that mattered he was taking it to the hole for a dunk or one of the referees would call a "Jordan" foul. :)

The best can only be agreed upon if you agree upon the definition of the best. Most championships? Scores the most points? Perhaps the one with the best Lenovo stat?

...but Jordan is the most recognizable of all time...along with Byrd...
Is that the Senator from West Virginia or the one that is famous for exploring the Antarctic? ;)

Is that the Senator from West Virginia or the one that is famous for exploring the Antarctic? ;)

OOPS!!!:o I meant Bird...:p

Kobe was 7th in the league in steals this year,defense is not all blocked shots,you clearly haven't watched Kobe enough.I watched enough to see Paul Pierce mop the court with him all finals long (PP's game is actually fine, but he could stand more physical conditioning, though). Anyways, great job, Celts! Never thought I would ever say that......!


edit: I want to clarify my statement without adding a new post. I never said Bryant's scored more points than MJ. For one, he's not done playing and had a three year (age 18) start on Jordan (age 21). What I meant is, he's a more flashy and efficient scorer, IMO. More fun to watch. But what he lacks is MJ's defensive intensity but it's still fun to see him score insane points.

Remember when he dropped 81 last year? And that one-week stretch two seasons ago when he scorched four consecutive teams for 50+ points? I'm guessing the last person to do that was Wilt, and I was probably a baby then.

OOPS!!!:o I meant Bird...:p
We knew you meant Bird, but that was too good to pass up. :)

BTW, Magic and Bird said MJ is the best player ever. Being as they played against him, are former All Stars, former multiple MVP’s, and are among the Top 50 players ever, I’ll take their word for it. IMO, Kobe doesn’t have to hold his head; he’s one outstanding BB player. However, his maturity as a team player does come into play, and I think that is his worst enemy. He’s come around a lot this year, but it may take retirement for him to get his ego in check. I think if he were more humble and could cast aside the perception that its all about Kobe he would win a lot of fan support. Until then...

There was a guy in the stands last night that goes by the name of Hondo. Did anyone ever see him play in his prime or for that matter at the end of his career? I did! If you want to judge greatness by how a player who is considered very good plays under pressure in championship games or when it is all on the line, look no further than no. 17. He has 9 championship rings to prove it and won them during both the Russell years and the Cowans years. I'd take him over any of the names mentioned in this thread but thats just me!

There was a guy in the stands last night that goes by the name of Hondo. Did anyone ever see him play in his prime or for that matter at the end of his career? I did! If you want to judge greatness by how a player who is considered very good plays under pressure in championship games or when it is all on the line, look no further than no. 17. He has 9 championship rings to prove it and won them during both the Russell years and the Cowans years. I'd take him over any of the names mentioned in this thread but thats just me!
One thing for sure, Hondo had more stamina than anyone on the court. I think he could’ve won the Triple Crown in horse racing. :) A great shooter with a soft touch, and would surprise you with this defensive quickness. However, he was a sixth man, and that will never get you into the discussion of the greatest of all time. Perhaps the greatest sixth man of all time...

kobe didn't show much in games 5 and 6. i thought he was a better player than that. he certainly didn't show he's in mj's league. looks like a very good, but not great player. he couldn't score when his team needed him most.

I'd like to stop the cr@pfest on the Lakers and focus on what they need to achieve greater success next year.

1) A healthy Andrew Bynum who can play rough and tough basketball.

2) Somehow trade Lamar Odom for a lesser physical player or players. Let's face it they have no Michael Thompsons, A.C. Greens or Kurt Rambises. Someone has to do some dirty work inside. You can hope for, but not count on the Euros (Vlade, Pau, and Ronie) to get it done. Didn't happen!

3) Offensive teams will have off games, defensive teams shouldn't. It's all about hustle, determination, and playing hard. The Lakers need to build a better defensive team.

4) That being said, they don't need to make major changes. A stronger mental game and more physical play and hustle. I don't want to see them try to rebuild what should develop into a dynasty.

One thing for sure, Hondo had more stamina than anyone on the court. I think he could’ve won the Triple Crown in horse racing. :) A great shooter with a soft touch, and would surprise you with this defensive quickness. However, he was a sixth man, and that will never get you into the discussion of the greatest of all time. Perhaps the greatest sixth man of all time...

Hello! He was a sixth man through his first few years of his career and was a starter after that. Won most of his championships as a starter! I know, I was at his games!

Hello! He was a sixth man through his first few years of his career and was a starter after that. Won most of his championships as a starter! I know, I was at his games!
True, he did start during the last half of his 16-year career, and a great one he was. The best? You live in MA., so what else would I expect. :)

6 championships as a sixth man, two as a starter.

True, he did start during the last half of his 16-year career, and a great one he was. The best? You live in MA., so what else would I expect. :)

6 championships as a sixth man, two as a starter.

Even when he was considered a sixth man, he still played most of the game. BTW that was a Celtic thing in calling it a sixth man, Red wanted one of his best players to come off the bench to demoralize the opponents and Hondo fit that need perfect, but just because he didn't start those years didn't mean he was not a full time player and shouldn't be considered one, in fact I believe he still played the most minutes out of anyone in Celtics history so trying to hold that against him really does not apply.

There was a guy in the stands last night that goes by the name of Hondo. Did anyone ever see him play in his prime or for that matter at the end of his career? I did! If you want to judge greatness by how a player who is considered very good plays under pressure in championship games or when it is all on the line, look no further than no. 17. He has 9 championship rings to prove it and won them during both the Russell years and the Cowans years. I'd take him over any of the names mentioned in this thread but thats just me!Saw my first finals as a kid, back in '76. Yes, Hondo and the Celts were great, though I was pulling for the Suns. I wasn't much of a BB fan then, but that series got me hooked. Those were the days!

Even when he was considered a sixth man, he still played most of the game. BTW that was a Celtic thing in calling it a sixth man, Red wanted one of his best players to come off the bench to demoralize the opponents and Hondo fit that need perfect, but just because he didn't start those years didn't mean he was not a full time player and shouldn't be considered one, in fact I believe he still played the most minutes out of anyone in Celtics history so trying to hold that against him really does not apply.
Hey, you aren’t going to get me to dis Hondo, I loved the guy. :) And I think you might be right, he did play more minutes than anyone else.

And what's with the Celtics running and gunning up 30 with 4 minutes left? I know they were bench players, but win with some class.


Or how about lose with some dignity. The Lakers stopped playing early in the 4th, and completely gave up with about 5 min left. It is not up to the winning team to stop scoring, it is up to the losing team to stop them from scoring. Sure maybe the Tony Allen dunk was a bit overboard, but these are guys who didn't play much, the crowd was going nuts, and the Lakers were letting them do what they pleased, so they went for it.

There is no such thing as running up the score in proffesional sports. You score as much as you can, for as long as you can, as long as you don't try to deliberately stop the clock to make it worse.

Hondo was one of the all time greats

Thought this would be appropriate considering who we were talking about at the end of this thread.

"This is really a great honor for me to be picked by this man for this occasion"

" There are three things I have to say about him"

1. He was the greatest competitor I have ever seen!
2. He was the greatest clutch player I have ever seen!
3. He will always be a great friend!

Those are the words of coach Bobby Knight in presenting the induction of John Hondo Havilcek to The New England Sports Museum Hall of Fame, last night June 24th 2008.

Thought this would be appropriate considering who we were talking about at the end of this thread.

"This is really a great honor for me to be picked by this man for this occasion"

" There are three things I have to say about him"

1. He was the greatest competitor I have ever seen!
2. He was the greatest clutch player I have ever seen!
3. He will always be a great friend!

Those are the words of coach Bobby Knight in presenting the induction of John Hondo Havilcek to The New England Sports Museum Hall of Fame, last night June 24th 2008.

Last night? I would have thought Hondo would already be in there! What took so long?

Or how about lose with some dignity. The Lakers stopped playing early in the 4th, and completely gave up with about 5 min left. It is not up to the winning team to stop scoring, it is up to the losing team to stop them from scoring. Sure maybe the Tony Allen dunk was a bit overboard, but these are guys who didn't play much, the crowd was going nuts, and the Lakers were letting them do what they pleased, so they went for it.

There is no such thing as running up the score in proffesional sports. You score as much as you can, for as long as you can, as long as you don't try to deliberately stop the clock to make it worse.

Good response! A team is not going to give up scoring because they have a large lead. The concept of running up a score on a team is something we only really think about for a high school or college team that is playing an inferior team. These two teams were the best in the NBA and there should never have been even the thought of one team being able to run up the score on another team at this level and in the championship finals.

IMO, it was the Lakers giving up more than the Celtics trying to run up the score. As full disclosure, I will mention that I have been a Celtics fan for nearly 50 years.

Last night? I would have thought Hondo would already be in there! What took so long?

Yeah, my mistake! He already is. It was for the New England Sports Museum's Lifetime Achievement Award.

Why does it sound like the announcers mics are out of phase or going thru a flanger. My God what a groove killer !!!::mad::mad::mad: Commercials sound fine so it must be the truck.

Why does it sound like the announcers mics are out of phase or going thru a flanger. My God what a groove killer !!!::mad::mad::mad: Commercials sound fine so it must be the truck.

This is last years thread, though I do wish the Celts were in it again. :D