I didn't see much discussion on this message board regarding the new ION drum set for the Rock Band games. I was wondering if anyone has pre-ordered it, and if anyone has any "expectations" for the set? Also, is anyone holding off on purchasing it for any reason?

https://www.drumrocker.com/products/index.php

I pre-ordered it almost immediately, but the Joystiq unboxing has me a little nervous about the quality of the cymbals. I'm sure it'll come out as a fluke. I have high hopes for a set that's going to cost $400+.

http://www.joystiq.com/photos/ion-drum-rocker-unboxing-and-set-up-2/997759/

A second unboxing.

http://game.blogdig.net/archives/articles/August2008/25/ION_Drum_Rocker__Unboxing_and_initial_impressions.html

If I was Ion, I'd be a little pissed that I sent the drumset over and got hundred word articles in response, but hopefully there'll be more info soon (in time to cancel my order in case of disaster.)

I do plan on purchasing the Ion kit but going to hold off for some solid reviews and the hope that Santa will deliver me a set. Its hard for me to spend $300+ on a video game accessory without knowing if it will perform.

I do plan on purchasing the Ion kit but going to hold off for some solid reviews and the hope that Santa will deliver me a set. Its hard for me to spend $300+ on a video game accessory without knowing if it will perform.

It's also a real kit that can be modded with real (better) accessories. Don't like the included cymbals? Buy new, better ones. It's just a 1/4" jack and the MIDI data from the ones with the color bands on them is exactly the same as the MIDI data from ones without yellow/blue/green on them.

Someone in the Rock Band thread mentioned maybe waiting to see if the 360 brain becomes available to then buy a much higher quality kit and install it on that to use for the game and real drumming.

I expect to hear Tom screaming all the way up here in NY when his cymbals break.

i just have a tough time believing it is worth 300+

I expect to hear Tom screaming all the way up here in NY when his cymbals break.
An accurate assessment.

It's also a real kit that can be modded with real (better) accessories. Don't like the included cymbals? Buy new, better ones. It's just a 1/4" jack and the MIDI data from the ones with the color bands on them is exactly the same as the MIDI data from ones without yellow/blue/green on them.

Someone in the Rock Band thread mentioned maybe waiting to see if the 360 brain becomes available to then buy a much higher quality kit and install it on that to use for the game and real drumming.

I understand that but I dont want to spend $300 on a kit to play rock band then dump more money into it to get it working correctly.

i just have a tough time believing it is worth 300+

it's iderntical to a simmons low end kit that sells for 400 only this one has a custome xbox brain instead of a drum brain. It's a real set fo e-drums(low end ones of course but the version sold in music stores gets used in practice spaces all the time).

the only thing i can see that might be better is a RB2 set upgraded with goodwood mesh pads + madcatz cymbals.

hoping definitive opinion hits the street before 9/15.

the only thing i can see that might be better is a RB2 set upgraded with goodwood mesh pads + madcatz cymbals.

hoping definitive opinion hits the street before 9/15.

well mesh heads are undeniably better but the home made ones aren't quite as durable as roland or yamaha pro pads. When they start selling the console specific brains sperately we'll start seeing more and better mods.

Has there been any confirmation on whether or not the set will be fully compatible with the new Guitar Hero World Tour game? If there's 100% confirmation on that, then it'll make the decision a lot easier to shell out $300 for this set, because you could potentially spend about $200 alone for 2 sets of drums, each from Rock Band 2 and the new Guitar hero.

However, I see there being a good amount of risk in deciding whether or not to buy this ION set...

On one hand, if you get Rock band 2 without the drum set ($60) and this ION set turns out to be a flop, then you could end up waiting 6 months before Harmonix releases their stand alone drum set. However, if you get the full Rock Band 2 package ($190) with the drums, and then this ION set turns out to be awesome, then you've just wasted about $80 for the Rock Band 2 drum set to be included in the bundle.

On one hand, if you get Rock band 2 without the drum set ($60) and this ION set turns out to be a flop, then you could end up waiting 6 months before Harmonix releases their stand alone drum set.

The Rockband 2 drumset is slated to be released a couple days before the game for $89.99.

Has there been any confirmation on whether or not the set will be fully compatible with the new Guitar Hero World Tour game? If there's 100% confirmation on that, then it'll make the decision a lot easier to shell out $300 for this set, because you could potentially spend about $200 alone for 2 sets of drums, each from Rock Band 2 and the new Guitar hero.

Yeah, it would be a much much easier purchase if you could use it as 4 pads in RB2 (plus the extraneous cymbals that duplicate pads) and 3 pads in GH:WT with the two cymbals recognized as distinct notes as the GH:WT set will do.

The Rockband 2 drumset is slated to be released a couple days before the game for $89.99.

Is that true? Last I heard was that Harmonix wasn't releasing the RB2 bundle until mid-October - mainly because supply issues for the peripherals. Keep in mind that with the RB1 release, it took months before the peripherals were readily available in stores.

Also, given that there isn't really any press coverage on the actual drum design for RB2, I'm concerned that the set most definitely won't find its way into stores for the game-only release in mid-September.

The Bundles will be released in October. The separate instruments will be released the same time as the game in Sept.

Has there been any confirmation on whether or not the set will be fully compatible with the new Guitar Hero World Tour game? If there's 100% confirmation on that, then it'll make the decision a lot easier to shell out $300 for this set, because you could potentially spend about $200 alone for 2 sets of drums, each from Rock Band 2 and the new Guitar hero.


There has been no confirmation just a firm "probably". It's been said that the new GH will use the same drum program as RB, but has not been confirmed.

I keep looking for a "your order has shipped" email from Ion. Only two weeks and a few days until RB2... :D

As for expectations, I expect this kit to kick major arse. I'm hoping there isn't an issue with the pad or cymbal voltages having a lot of variation between specific pads/cymbals since there isn't any kind of "trim" function in the brain to dial them in.

Seems like Ion could've had a real money-maker on their hands if they would've made the Xbox controller with this functionality so that you could use any ePads. I guess that's just asking for a Customer Service nightmare, though, what with a bunch of freaking video gamer morons constantly calling because they can't bother to break out the manual and figure out how to set the limits. Just peruse the official RockBand forums for any topic to see what I mean.

I keep looking for a "your order has shipped" email from Ion. Only two weeks and a few days until RB2... :D

As for expectations, I expect this kit to kick major arse. I'm hoping there isn't an issue with the pad or cymbal voltages having a lot of variation between specific pads/cymbals since there isn't any kind of "trim" function in the brain to dial them in.

Seems like Ion could've had a real money-maker on their hands if they would've made the Xbox controller with this functionality so that you could use any ePads. I guess that's just asking for a Customer Service nightmare, though, what with a bunch of freaking video gamer morons constantly calling because they can't bother to break out the manual and figure out how to set the limits. Just peruse the official RockBand forums for any topic to see what I mean.

If you read their FAQ they claim that the reason they don't want to sell the brains to people with any e-drum kit is because of all the voltage issues and what not. That being said it does sound like they're going to sell them because of people that want to be able to user their ION with more than 1 platform.

If you read their FAQ they claim that the reason they don't want to sell the brains to people with any e-drum kit is because of all the voltage issues and what not. That being said it does sound like they're going to sell them because of people that want to be able to user their ION with more than 1 platform.

If you read their info, they are hard-setting the voltage response levels of the brain to their specific pad's output. The downside to this approach if that if there is any real variance in voltage levels in their production pads, there is no way to zero it out and make the pads or cymbals usable.

Plus I was saying that if they added this ability to set the trigger levels, then they could really sell the brains on their own because this added funcionality would allow you to set the trigger levels for any pad/trigger.

Has there been any confirmation on whether or not the set will be fully compatible with the new Guitar Hero World Tour game? If there's 100% confirmation on that, then it'll make the decision a lot easier to shell out $300 for this set, because you could potentially spend about $200 alone for 2 sets of drums, each from Rock Band 2 and the new Guitar hero.

There has been no confirmation just a firm "probably". It's been said that the new GH will use the same drum program as RB, but has not been confirmed.I think I would feel safe and call this confirmation that the set will be cross-compatible:

http://www.engadget.com/2008/08/19/microsoft-says-rock-band-2-guitar-hero-world-tour-and-rock-re/

I know it's still a 'soft' confirmation but Microsoft wants to keep up with Sony's announcement offering the same for the PS3. It's obvious that the issue can be fixed via software... just too bad they won't force the developers to offer patches for those of us content with our original Rock Band instruments.

I think I would feel safe and call this confirmation that the set will be cross-compatible:

http://www.engadget.com/2008/08/19/microsoft-says-rock-band-2-guitar-hero-world-tour-and-rock-re/

I know it's still a 'soft' confirmation but Microsoft wants to keep up with Sony's announcement offering the same for the PS3. It's obvious that the issue can be fixed via software... just too bad they won't force the developers to offer patches for those of us content with our original Rock Band instruments.

I'd bet too that it'll be partially compatible. Aka, I'd bet that it'll play right in RB2... The question is whether in GH:WT whether it collapses it down from 5 notes plus pedal like the standard GH drums to 4 notes plus pedal like for the RB2 standard drums.

Looks & sounds great but I will not invest $400 until I see somebody beat the heck out of it and have it hold up ;) .

- Jason

I think Amazon has it with free shipping so you don't end up paying the extra $50... not positive though.

I don't like the ION website.. as it makes me WANT to buy the drum set. I mean how can I play RB and NOT have this drumset!!

Before I pull the trigger and purchase, I want to clear up something.

The orginial RB drum kit will work for RB2 and GHWT. Great. Then you can purchase a 2 or 3 cymbal kit for either the RB set or ION set. Cooler!

But in terms the drumming gameplay, the drumming in RB2 will still be the same RED, YELLOW, BLUE, GREEN buttons with the cymbals being used as alternates. So instead of hitting yellow pad you can hit yellow cymbal. Correct?

FYI: Didn't order the drums. But shipping to Ontario Canada is $45 via UPS Ground. Since its being shipped via UPS, one would assume you'll have to add customs fees on top of that. For a Canadian, we'll probably spend $400 with shipping and duties. Hmm....

http://www.joystiq.com/2008/08/25/ion-drum-rocker-unboxing-and-initial-impressions/

I don't like the ION website.. as it makes me WANT to buy the drum set. I mean how can I play RB and NOT have this drumset!!

Before I pull the trigger and purchase, I want to clear up something.

The orginial RB drum kit will work for RB2 and GHWT. Great. Then you can purchase a 2 or 3 cymbal kit for either the RB set or ION set. Cooler!

But in terms the drumming gameplay, the drumming in RB2 will still be the same RED, YELLOW, BLUE, GREEN buttons with the cymbals being used as alternates. So instead of hitting yellow pad you can hit yellow cymbal. Correct?

A couple clarifications as I understand things:

- You can't purchase the cymbal kit for the RB1 set... only for the upcoming RB2 kits.
- The ION kit comes with 2 cymbals, and you can purchase an optional 3rd cymbal
- The cymbals are duplicates of the corresponding colored pad, except in free-form sections in RB2*, just before overdrive. In freeform, the cymbals will activate crash/ride/high-hat, and the toms will be only toms. I believe this is true for the training sections too.

* I haven't heard if this is also true in RB1, but I don't think so... anyone? :confused:

Someone please correct me if I'm misunderstanding any of this.

Now that I think of it, the ION drum set may not be compatible with the new Guitar Hero game.

I looks like the new RB2 set uses the cymbals as "duplicates" of one of the 4 drums.

However, in GHWT, there are 5 distinct drum/cymbal inputs, along with a petal. In other words, the cymbals aren't duplicates of the drum inputs like in RB.

Thus, if you used the ION set with GHWT, you may still be able to "use" the drums, but you won't get to use 5 separate inputs as the game intended.

Here's a screenshot of the WT gameplay, with 5 drum/cymbal inputs + pedal:
http://www.joystiq.com/2008/08/27/joystiq-hands-on-guitar-hero-world-tour/

Here's a screenshot of how the inputs will work on the ION drumset, where it doesn't look like there are 5 distinct inputs for cymbals and drums - only 4 drum inputs with "duplicate" cymbal inputs:
http://www.engadget.com/photos/ion-drum-rocker-premium-drum-set-hands-on/997472/

So, my opinion is that the new GHWT will have a "crippled" mode for the drums, where if you use the ION or old RB1 set, they only present the player with 4 drum inputs + pedal, instead of the 5 inputs with the dedicated GHWT set.

So, my opinion is that the new GHWT will have a "crippled" mode for the drums, where if you use the ION or old RB1 set, they only present the player with 4 drum inputs + pedal, instead of the 5 inputs with the dedicated GHWT set.

Yes, this is how it works according to the developer awhile back.

Now that I think of it, the ION drum set may not be compatible with the new Guitar Hero game.

I looks like the new RB2 set uses the cymbals as "duplicates" of one of the 4 drums.
The drums identify each cymbal as a unique input. It's up to the game to decide what to do with that information. While you can use the cymbals or toms in normal gameplay for Rock Band for either color, in the fills and drum trainer they're treated separately. If the Guitar Hero people want, they can definitely program the game to accept the Ions as 6 inputs instead of 5.

The drums identify each cymbal as a unique input. It's up to the game to decide what to do with that information. While you can use the cymbals or toms in normal gameplay for Rock Band for either color, in the fills and drum trainer they're treated separately. If the Guitar Hero people want, they can definitely program the game to accept the Ions as 6 inputs instead of 5.

but if you look at the picture over at Engadget for the ION set (http://www.engadget.com/photos/ion-d...nds-on/997472/) it appears that there are only 4 unique inputs for the drums. Then there are 3 "cymbal" inputs; however, each of those map to one of the 4 drum inputs, meaning that each cymbal is a duplicate of one of the 3 drums.

From the ION FAQ:

Q: Will it be possible to remap the hi-hat to red for the appropriate songs? (such as Run to the Hills, Orange Crush, Outside...)? Even if we could plug in the hi-hat cymbal to the red snare drum's input jack or something, that would be great.

A: There is no cymbal input that corresponds to the red input for the game, and the sensitivity level of the cymbal input is different than the input for the pads, so you can’t simply plug the yellow cymbal into the red pad input and get the effect you’re after. In those rare instances where Rock Band maps the hi-hat to the red pad, you will have to play the part on the red Drum Rocker pad, just as you would with the standard RockBand kit.

Q: Will it be compatible with Guitar Hero 4:World tour?

A: Drum Rocker was designed specifically for use with the Rock Band franchise. However, if other music games use the same standard drum controller mapping that Rock Band uses, then Drum Rocker should work with those games as well.


Q: Will there be a way to differentiate between the cymbals and the toms while playing in game?

A: The gameplay in Rock band doesn't differentiate between cymbal and tom pads, so you're free to hit whichever feels most comfortable to you. There are some gameplay modes (like the new drum trainer in Rock Band 2) that use software to intelligently determine when you are hitting a cymbal vs. a drum, and provide the appropriate sounds accordingly.

but if you look at the picture over at Engadget for the ION set (http://www.engadget.com/photos/ion-d...nds-on/997472/) it appears that there are only 4 unique inputs for the drums. Then there are 3 "cymbal" inputs; however, each of those map to one of the 4 drum inputs, meaning that each cymbal is a duplicate of one of the 3 drums.
That's not true. The brain has 8 unique, separately labeled inputs, as evidenced from that photo. As I said, they send out separate signals, this has been confirmed, and it's up to the game to decide how to read those. They work separately within Rock Band 2 itself during fills and the drum trainer.

So, my opinion is that the new GHWT will have a "crippled" mode for the drums, where if you use the ION or old RB1 set, they only present the player with 4 drum inputs + pedal, instead of the 5 inputs with the dedicated GHWT set.

I agree with your opinion here. It would be simple enough for Activision/Neversoft to recognize 3 drumpads + 2 cymbals + 1 pedal from the Ion kit, but they will choose to treat the Ion kit as a RB1 kit and only give you 4 pads + 1 pedal of support.

I expect nothing more from Act/Never. Their track-record with the Les Paul shows that they are not interested in peripheral interoperability, and I am certain they will do the absolute minimum possible to comply with the Microsoft mandate.

And yes, I am a pessimist by nature. :)

That's not true. The brain has 8 unique, separately labeled inputs, as evidenced from that photo. As I said, they send out separate signals, this has been confirmed, and it's up to the game to decide how to read those. They work separately within Rock Band 2 itself during fills and the drum trainer.

Sure 8 inputs, but they match the following colours
-- Blue/Green/Yellow (Drum Cymbal)
-- Red (Drum)
-- Orange (Pedal)

So its looks like within RB the game play its 4 colour input with same colour group sounds. But for the drum trainer, it'll take 8 inputs each with different sounds.

Sure 8 inputs, but they match the following colours
-- Blue/Green/Yellow (Drum Cymbal)
-- Red (Drum)
-- Orange (Pedal)

So its looks like within RB the game play its 4 colour input with same colour group sounds. But for the drum trainer, it'll take 8 inputs each with different sounds.

The fills during gameplay (to activate overdrive) also recognize all 8 triggers separately and play cymbal/hi-hat and tom sounds appropriately.

Sure 8 inputs, but they match the following colours
-- Blue/Green/Yellow (Drum Cymbal)
-- Red (Drum)
-- Orange (Pedal)

So its looks like within RB the game play its 4 colour input with same colour group sounds. But for the drum trainer, it'll take 8 inputs each with different sounds.

There are 8 separate inputs on the ION kit, but I think that the device that connects to the xbox (shown in the engadget picture) merges the inputs for the yellow/blue/green inputs so that the little xbox-connector just recognized the drum and cymbal as the same input. However, you do have 8 separate cables connecting the drums and cymbals, so if you had a separate device then yeah, you could have 8 separate channels - it's just that the xbox-connector doesn't process the signal that way.

There are 8 separate inputs on the ION kit, but I think that the device that connects to the xbox (shown in the engadget picture) merges the inputs for the yellow/blue/green inputs so that the little xbox-connector just recognized the drum and cymbal as the same input. However, you do have 8 separate cables connecting the drums and cymbals, so if you had a separate device then yeah, you could have 8 separate channels - it's just that the xbox-connector doesn't process the signal that way.

Could you quote a source for what was bolded?

It's my understanding that the RockBand2 game/software recognizes 4 pads, up to 3 cymbals and a kick drum as separate items.

The main game still has 4 lanes (colors) plus kick. Most of the time the cymbal(s) are duplicates of whichever color pad(s) you choose (red being the exception). This is done in software, not the xbox connector.

In the drum training mode and freeform sections, toms/pads and cymbals are individual with unique sounds for each.

Could you quote a source for what was bolded?

It's my understanding that the RockBand2 game/software recognizes 4 pads, up to 3 cymbals and a kick drum as separate items.

The main game still has 4 lanes (colors) plus kick. Most of the time the cymbal(s) are duplicates of whichever color pad(s) you choose (red being the exception). This is done in software, not the xbox connector.

In the drum training mode and freeform sections, toms/pads and cymbals are individual with unique sounds for each.

this joystiq article details the application of the cymbals for RB2 http://www.joystiq.com/2008/08/30/guitar-hero-director-knocks-rock-band-2-cymbals/

this joystiq article details the application of the cymbals for RB2 http://www.joystiq.com/2008/08/30/guitar-hero-director-knocks-rock-band-2-cymbals/

That's interesting about the standard set, thanks for the link.

Here's the info about how RockBand2 game sees the ION set (from the Drum Rocker website FAQ):

Q: Will there be a way to differentiate between the cymbals and the toms while playing in game?
A: The gameplay in Rock band doesn't differentiate between cymbal and tom pads, so you're free to hit whichever feels most comfortable to you. There are some gameplay modes (like the new drum trainer in Rock Band 2) that use software to intelligently determine when you are hitting a cymbal vs. a drum, and provide the appropriate sounds accordingly.

I'm wondering if this is something only the ION set does, or does the standard kit+cymbal add-on also do this? I notice that RockBand2 is differentiating pads vs. cymbals through software... anyone have any idea how this could be done? :confused:

this joystiq article details the application of the cymbals for RB2 http://www.joystiq.com/2008/08/30/guitar-hero-director-knocks-rock-band-2-cymbals/

That's the GH director slamming the competition. Harmonix (and Ion) have stated a few times that while the game still has only four lanes for gameplay, the cymbals are recognized as unique inputs and give unique sounds during fills, the drum trainer, and freeplay (which is really just a part of the drum trainer).

*EDIT*
Here (http://www.rockband.com/rockers_blog_entry/hmxspraynwipe/379911)'s just one of the places this has been stated (this is one of the dev blogs on rockband.com):
Q: "RE: DRUMS AND ANNOUNCED CYMBALS
I understand the optional cymbals are just secondary inputs for the existing pads, but what about during fills and the "drum trainer" modes? Will those two things recognize the cymbals as unique inputs or will every part of RB2 just recognize the cymbal attachments as secondary pads?" - babywolf

A: While they're mapped to the same colors for the note charts, the Drum Trainer and fills in-game treat these surfaces are unique - hitting the yellow cymbal triggers a hi-hat, and hitting the yellow pad plays a tom. Same goes for all the inputs on the Ion kit and other third-party kits in development.

Bright condemns Rock Band 2's cymbals for being "dual-mapped", meaning they'll share the functions of one of the pads of the standard kit, making the attachments somewhat unneccessary.

Yep... I guess I'll still with the RB kit then.

Article about the GH drum set.. Interesting... Let the Drum Kit Wars begin..

http://www.joystiq.com/2008/05/24/rockers-show-off-guitar-heros-velocity-sensitive-drum-kits/

Attn fellow Canadians, the ION Rocker Drum set is going to be available on Oct 3 from Future Shop!

http://www.futureshop.ca/catalog/proddetail.asp?sku_id=0665000FS10112380&catid=26884&logon=&langid=EN#

There's a really good user-review here:

http://www.2old2play.com/News/Rockin__Out_With_My_Ion_Out___The_Ion_Drum_Kit_Review

Attn fellow Canadians, the ION Rocker Drum set is going to be available on Oct 3 from Future Shop!


Ughhhh... it's pretty much the same price as buying directly off of drumrocker with shipping costs, yet it seems so much more expensive at 349.99!

I really want to try them out before taking the dive... hopefully FS will have some display models as of Oct 3.

I can't justify the $300 if the set isn't fully compatible with the new guitar hero game. Based on the ION configuration, you'll have to play the drums in "crippled mode" in the new guitar hero 4 game. So instead of have 2 smaller, plastic drum sets sitting around, I'd have a massive ION set and then the smaller GH4 set.

Ughhhh... it's pretty much the same price as buying directly off of drumrocker with shipping costs, yet it seems so much more expensive at 349.99!

I really want to try them out before taking the dive... hopefully FS will have some display models as of Oct 3.

Hey at least you can buy the set from FS and if you don't like them, you can return them... thats probably what I'm going to do.

Buy them, try them out and if I like, keep, if not, return...

The future shop site is having as after hours site sale from Saturday 27 - 5pm to Sept 28 noon and Sept 28 - 5pm to Sept 29 noon.

So you can get the drum set for $314.99 instead of $349.99. Sure its close to the price you get it directly. But no customs no shipping charges PLUS you can return if you don't like it.