I just don't understand how anyone can expect to be taken seriously claiming DVD looks stunning at 108 inches. Never mind to mention the fact that is with a 720 projector which can't truly show the viewer how good BD is compared to DVD. Maybe I am coming off as too much of an elitist but I am LMAO with some of the BS I see coming from that side still.


WOW. That is all I can say. This is one of the sadest comments I have read here on AVS. For years, people in the pojector forums have tweaked settings and used the best equipment possible (line doublers, Oppos, etc) to make SD DVDs look great on their large screens. Others in the HTPC forum have applied "unsharp mask" and various other filters to make SD look down downright HD.

Now you come along and say they "can't be taken seriously" because they stated DVD looks great on their larger screens.

5 years ago I bought my first 720p projector (Z2) and played DVDs on a 106 inch screen with my HTPC (a P4 procesor) and Zoomplayer. The concensus at that time was that it looked stunning. Even today I think most peolpe would be surprised. But all those people in all those forums who worked so hard in your mind "can't be tken seriously"....sad really.

Do they even sell SD 32" sets at Best Buy, Circuit City now?
I believe Best Buy & CC have them but they are in the bargain isle.

At Wal-mart though, they still sell 13-27" CRT TV's and have large letters on the box such as DIGITAL SDTV and right next to them are the digital converter boxes. :confused:
I bet that gets the wheels spining with J6P.

WOW. That is all I can say. This is one of the sadest comments I have read here on AVS. For years, people in the pojector forums have tweaked settings and used the best equipment possible (line doublers, Oppos, etc) to make SD DVDs look great on their large screens. Others in the HTPC forum have applied "unsharp mask" and various other filters to make SD look down downright HD.

Now you come along and say they "can't be taken seriously" because they stated DVD looks great on their larger screens.

5 years ago I bought my first 720p projector (Z2) and played DVDs on a 106 inch screen with my HTPC (a P4 procesor) and Zoomplayer. The concensus at that time was that it looked stunning. Even today I think most peolpe would be surprised. But all those people in all those forums who worked so hard in your mind "can't be tken seriously"....sad really.

very sad. some folks just got issues.

WOW. That is all I can say. This is one of the sadest comments I have read here on AVS. For years, people in the pojector forums have tweaked settings and used the best equipment possible (line doublers, Oppos, etc) to make SD DVDs look great on their large screens. Others in the HTPC forum have applied "unsharp mask" and various other filters to make SD look down downright HD.

Now you come along and say they "can't be taken seriously" because they stated DVD looks great on their larger screens.

5 years ago I bought my first 720p projector (Z2) and played DVDs on a 106 inch screen with my HTPC (a P4 procesor) and Zoomplayer. The concensus at that time was that it looked stunning. Even today I think most peolpe would be surprised. But all those people in all those forums who worked so hard in your mind "can't be tken seriously"....sad really.
I don't question that on some projector setups, SD probably looks great but this was BEFORE Blu-ray/HD came around & SD was the reference.
Now, if you take a reference PQ blu-ray and compare it against the SD DVD version, you seriously can't be saying that the SD DVD will look as good if not equal.

It seems lately due to the release of Toshiba's new upconvert player and their resistance to make a blu-ray player it has hardcore HD DVD supporters chanting SD DVD is "AS GOOD AS HD" and those buying blu-ray are wasting their time & money.
Again, they come and make these posts in the HDM forum where those who enjoy HD come to discuss issues. Not post spiteful retorts against blu-ray and HD and hold their Toshiba flag high.

I don't question that on some projector setups, SD probably looks great but this was BEFORE Blu-ray/HD came around & SD was the reference.
Now, if you take a reference PQ blu-ray and compare it against the SD DVD version, you seriously can't be saying that the SD DVD will look as good if not equal.

It seems lately due to the release of Toshiba's new upconvert player and their resistance to make a blu-ray player it has hardcore HD DVD supporters chanting SD DVD is "AS GOOD AS HD" and those buying blu-ray are wasting their time & money.
Again, they come and make these posts in the HDM forum where those who enjoy HD come to discuss issues. Not post spiteful retorts against blu-ray and HD and hold their Toshiba flag high.

again, afaik, no one here has said that dvds look as good as hdm.

That is excactly what I'm talking about.

WOW. That is all I can say. This is one of the sadest comments I have read here on AVS. For years, people in the pojector forums have tweaked settings and used the best equipment possible (line doublers, Oppos, etc) to make SD DVDs look great on their large screens. Others in the HTPC forum have applied "unsharp mask" and various other filters to make SD look down downright HD.

Now you come along and say they "can't be taken seriously" because they stated DVD looks great on their larger screens.

5 years ago I bought my first 720p projector (Z2) and played DVDs on a 106 inch screen with my HTPC (a P4 procesor) and Zoomplayer. The concensus at that time was that it looked stunning. Even today I think most peolpe would be surprised. But all those people in all those forums who worked so hard in your mind "can't be tken seriously"....sad really.

I don't question that on some projector setups, SD probably looks great but this was BEFORE Blu-ray/HD came around & SD was the reference.
Now, if you take a reference PQ blu-ray and compare it against the SD DVD version, you seriously can't be saying that the SD DVD will look as good if not equal.

It seems lately due to the release of Toshiba's new upconvert player and their resistance to make a blu-ray player it has hardcore HD DVD supporters chanting SD DVD is "AS GOOD AS HD" and those buying blu-ray are wasting their time & money.
Again, they come and make these posts in the HDM forum where those who enjoy HD come to discuss issues. Not post spiteful retorts against blu-ray and HD and hold their Toshiba flag high.

Yeah, thats why were here, to parade the Toshiba flag around.:rolleyes: Is there a rule to ban people that make utterly ridiculous statements in this forum, if not there should be one. Your really bringing the level of this fine forum down for no other reason than that you can't accept other persons views without becoming snide and insulting. It's time for the Mods to step in and put and end to this behavior, it's been going on for much to long now!

What do you expect from fanboys. If it ain't blu it is garbage in their opinion. I suppose we should all just throw our entire dvd collectioins in the trash can. It amazes me how all of a sudden a person with a $50K home theater system must suck because they don't just watch blu movies. Too many bitter people on here still after the war ended in early Jan.

And yes I still think that on my system "Finding Nemo" looks stunning sent to my lumagen in 480i and processed to 720p on a carada BW screen.

I don't think bd will be dead as the title suggests, so I will continue to by my highest wants on bd or if the price is low enough in the bargain bin $14.95 and under.

again, afaik, no one here has said that dvds look as good as hdm.

I agree with ya. The ban hammer must come down. People need to grow up and realize that certian beliefs may not be the belief of the next guy. Everyone has there own beliefs.

Heck Grubert stalked me. He took the time to dig a post up. Like it made any difference. I actually laughed my ass off when I saw what he posted. He isn't going to spend my money or change me and my family's mind. Heck neither of those movies are even on blu yet so he can't compare them.

This forum is looking like bluray.com again.

Yeah, thats why were here, to parade the Toshiba flag around.:rolleyes: Is there a rule to ban people that make utterly ridiculous statements in this forum, if not there should be one. Your really bringing the level of this fine forum down for no other reason than that you can't accept other persons views without becoming snide and insulting. It's time for the Mods to step in and put and end to this behavior, it's been going on for much to long now!

DVD's will always be $20.00 and $24.00 for the 2-3 Disc Special editon version, I always wait for a special edition if there is one.

Again a good player can't do any magical fairy dust processing to turn SD into HD. some folks may need a 1080p display to truly appreciate the difference between HD and SD. :cool:

So we are going to resort to calling people fanboiz. It seems like you have spent a lot time posting on the HD DVD subforums. I guess it just appears to me that you have an ax to grind against BD.

And now we are calling films coming out on BD shlock because the DVD catalog is so superior (because all DVD titles are classic cinema :D ). Why don't you tell me in a couple of weeks how "stunning" Coppola's Godfather restoration looks on DVD because I really don't care when the same title is being issued on a True HD format. I will happily be watching my shlock titles this fall like Godfather, The Dark Knight, Wall-E, etc.

For every "Godfather" in BD, there are about twenty slasher/Eminem debut/zombie bundle/Transformer-type films released. I suppose if I were twenty years old again, I would be more excited about Blu-ray. However, my purchases have dwindled to a trickle.

I agree, there is no reason that a blu ray player shold be $800.00 let alone 400, plus if the OEM lasers that are manufactured by outside parties cost $400.00 to make then maybe they could find another company willing to make them at a cheaper price (like the PS3's) light duty laser.

I saw the Insignia BD player at Best Buy for $229 today.....all the rest were upwards of $350....but it is the cost of the disc's I think as the prices have actually stayed the same or increased since HD DVD lost. I have no -plans to buy a Tosh XDE and to me it is just another upscaling player. I am going to get an LG BHD200 for $400.00 new.:)

I agree with ya. The ban hammer must come down. People need to grow up and realize that certian beliefs may not be the belief of the next guy. Everyone has there own beliefs.

Heck Grubert stalked me. He took the time to dig a post up. Like it made any difference. I actually laughed my ass off when I saw what he posted. He isn't going to spend my money or change me and my family's mind. Heck neither of those movies are even on blu yet so he can't compare them.

This forum is looking like bluray.com again.

The funny thing is there is a Blu ray forum right here at AVS where I'm sure they would get strong support for their opinions. However, they try to bring that same agenda over into this forum and try to dictate what should be dicussed here even though there is a wide diversity of opinions from other members that is relevant to all HDM and not just BD which is the way it should be. People should be allowed to post their views as long as it remains on topic to the appropriate thread without the fear of being ridiculed for it especially in this forum.

WOW. That is all I can say. This is one of the sadest comments I have read here on AVS. For years, people in the pojector forums have tweaked settings and used the best equipment possible (line doublers, Oppos, etc) to make SD DVDs look great on their large screens. Others in the HTPC forum have applied "unsharp mask" and various other filters to make SD look down downright HD.

Now you come along and say they "can't be taken seriously" because they stated DVD looks great on their larger screens.

5 years ago I bought my first 720p projector (Z2) and played DVDs on a 106 inch screen with my HTPC (a P4 procesor) and Zoomplayer. The concensus at that time was that it looked stunning. Even today I think most peolpe would be surprised. But all those people in all those forums who worked so hard in your mind "can't be tken seriously"....sad really.

Of course you are right, it did look great 5 years ago and still does today. So does my 5 year old PC with a 3GHz single core CPU and 4600 Nvidia Graphics card. My wife uses it every day and it meets her need. Of course I've moved on and up, but that's just me :D

The funny thing is there is a Blu ray forum right here at AVS where I'm sure they would get strong support for their opinions. However, they try to bring that same agenda over into this forum and try to dictate what should be dicussed here even though there is a wide diversity of opinions from other members that is relevant to all HDM and not just BD which is the way it should be. People should be allowed to post their views as long as it remains on topic to the appropriate thread without the fear of being ridiculed for it especially in this forum.

Still, this is the "Blu-ray & HD DVD Areas" and this section is IMO for new hardware (such as the article I posted a few days back on the new BD chipset and others like the advancement in Blue Laser technology - it should be here) and for HTPC owners running BD/HD-DVD drives and the software they use. This section is needed for this because it is very possible to have an HTPC (there already is an HTPC forum) that is NOT BD/HD-DVD based and would NOT belong in this section.

For every "Godfather" in BD, there are about twenty slasher/Eminem debut/zombie bundle/Transformer-type films released. I suppose if I were twenty years old again, I would be more excited about Blu-ray. However, my purchases have dwindled to a trickle.
That pretty much sums it up.
J

I think the problem is that most folks don't realize how compression works.

No.... most people don't CARE how compression works. They just want to watch a movie.... and dvd is just fine for those who don't care.

That's right sonny...they don't make um like they used to.
Well, back in my day we didn' need any fancy computer graphin tricks, no cussin and no sexin either. Just pure actin.
These folks today...the movie industry is headin for hell in a handbasket...why just the other day I was justin the rabbit ears on my tv and what did I see...

I saw the Insignia BD player at Best Buy for $229 today.....all the rest were upwards of $350....

I would avoid it. I bought the Magnavox (which is the same thing), and hate it. I have ahd problems with some discs and it can't play almost every AVCHD home movie I have. Look for an older Panasonic instead.

I don't question that on some projector setups, SD probably looks great...

Of course you are right, it did look great 5 years ago and still does today...

That is exactly what I'm talking about.

Glad to see most agree with me. Please don't rip everyone else on these forums because they find SD DVDs on their FPs enjoyable too.

again, afaik, no one here has said that dvds look as good as hdm.

+1

There seems to be this scorched earth attitude that if you do not post 100% good things about Blu, you are clearly against it. I think it is a derivative of another fan-based forum that tries to be like AVS.

Its weird too. There were some threads a while back about how most movie theaters show movies at resolutions just above DVD quality. Now my bet is that with some of the newer upscalers, you can make movies on DVD look better on you large screen at home, than they woud at many movie theaters (and yes, Blu would look even better). So to make the statement that you can't be "taken seriously", and have other agree, when you say that DVDs can look great on a large screen, is just not right.

So back to the OP.

I think in 5 years people will still be watching Blu-ray discs, DVDs and their treasured collections of laser discs.

again, afaik, no one here has said that dvds look as good as hdm.

Here you go. And this is not the only one. The mods have been kind to remove the other posts.

No one in their right mind would argue that SD DVD is as good as HDM (BD) when properly displayed.



And the mods have been doing their job.
They have been removing those spiteful retort posts regarding that SD DVD is as good as HDM or that VOD is as good as well.
The mods as well as many of us know that there is a DVD STANDARD DEF FORUM & VOD to discuss/praise those technologies but it seems some people feel the need to push their SD DVD & VOD greatness over HDM that they come here like it's a neutral battleground to push their SD DVD & VOD preferences/agenda.

Rememeber, this IS the HDM discussion forum and its main purpose is to be used for HDM discussions and not to make frequent comparisons and praise of how SD DVD & VOD is as good as HDM and J6P will be satisfied with those 2 technologies(And how many times has this phrase been posted in the HDM forum lately?).

And the mods have been doing their job.
They have been removing those spiteful retort posts regarding that SD DVD is as good as HDM or that VOD is as good as well.
The mods as well as many of us know that there is a DVD STANDARD DEF FORUM & VOD to discuss/praise those technologies but it seems some people feel the need to push their SD DVD & VOD greatness over HDM that they come here like it's a neutral battleground to push their SD DVD & VOD preferences/agenda.

Rememeber, this IS the HDM discussion forum and its main purpose is to be used for HDM discussions and not to make frequent comparisons and praise of how SD DVD & VOD is as good as HDM and J6P will be satisfied with those 2 technologies(And how many times has this phrase been posted in the HDM forum lately?).

Its hard to discuss BD without using DVD as a reference, even harder in a thread that has topic:"Blu ray will be gone in 5 years?" Were how much marketshare BD will take against DVD will be very crucial. Also how it works for different download services will also impact BD.

Its hard to discuss BD without using DVD as a reference, even harder in a thread that has topic:"Blu ray will be gone in 5 years?" Were how much marketshare BD will take against DVD will be very crucial. Also how it works for different download services will also impact BD.I understand that SD DVD can/will be used as a reference/comparison to blu-ray but it seems in most cases it's not used as a reference but a comment to insinuate that SD DVD is good enough for J6P or as good as HDM when upconverted.
These are the types of posts/remarks that start these debates and those making those type of remarks know that it will start a heated debate that will end badly or like the focus on SD DVD or VOD in the HDM forum.

I have been format neutral from the beginning and I did not "bet on the wrong horse". I love movies and bought movies from both sides so I didn't have to choose a side.


Sure.

A neutral person that in November 2007 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/member.php?u=7501811) predicts that

I think it is safe to say WB is going to go red so to ease any buying remorse the sooner the better.

Then, in January 2008 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=12682376&postcount=230), when Warner actually goes Blu, proclaims that

this is the end of hdm mass adoption.

Neutral? Puh-leeze.

I would avoid it. I bought the Magnavox (which is the same thing), and hate it. I have ahd problems with some discs and it can't play almost every AVCHD home movie I have. Look for an older Panasonic instead.

Of course.....but what I am saying is that there is a "affordable" option out there....who in their right mind would buy it I dont know.

So this forum would be just great if they ban people who post dissenting opinions from yours.

When the CRT/Digital debate was the hot topic. Never did such a thought cross the opposing views. Here we are on yet another technology topic but this time, if the views do oppose, ban hammer.

BTW (and not meant for you CraigW since you did not do it)

Is it "cool" to bold statement like they are going to accentuate rhetoric if the rhetoric is an opinion anyway?

Of course.....but what I am saying is that there is a "affordable" option out there....who in their right mind would buy it I dont know.

You can get bluray players for $200 right now if you search around. New out of the big box stores? No. but they are out there.

If you can't afford $200-300, then why did you spend >$1000 on an HDTV? If you spent 2-3K on an HDTV or HD setup, $200 really isn't that much more. It currently costs more to get an Oppo 983 DVD player than a BD player.

I went purple on my HTPC. I am getting a BD SA for the holiday. I am torn between getting a refurbished BD-P1200 with the Reon for $200, the S301 or BD-1400 for $230, and insignia for mid $200s or waiting until the Holiday sales to get a new one for around $200.

Some people use the "Affordability" as a crutch for not buying because they want it for free. Most won't be happy until it cost less than $100.

Contrary to some the complaints, these SAs are no longer having the same problems that they had upon launch. Current firmware updates fix this.

And people go nuts about it not being 2.0, yet most don't even know the difference. You do realize that if you are using a DVD player you are not going to miss anything with 1.0. If you are using an HD DVD player that is not hooked up for web features, you are basically using 1.1 unless you are not using the feature that allows you to save your favorite scene which means you are basically still at 1.0.

I have an HD805, an HD-A3 and xbox addon and have never used either of these functions. Anyone who actually used the web enabled functions will tell you they took a notoriously long time to load anyway.

If you don't want to go bluray because you are happy with DVD, fine. I still find DVD very watchable and yes I still buy DVDs. But don't spread false information or buy into it to justify your reasons. Just say you don't see the benefit in better resolution or sound in your setup. It is ok to admit that.

-----

I look at BD this way. I set up my home theater to be like a home theater. I want the closest that I can get to the real thing. I know my setup can't match the 100K 2K digital projectors with $20K sound systems with great light control lossless Jpeg2000 movies, but BD offers me the closest that I can get to this at the moment. I didn't set up my Home theater to have something that is just good enough.

Some people think BD offers more detail than is necessary. I personally think there is still room to improve. It is like saying because DVD was better than VHS, there was no room for improvement. At the launch of DVD, most folks (except the LD crowd) clamorred that we were finally getting cinema quality in our home.

So this forum would be just great if they ban people who post dissenting opinions from yours...

Isn't that the argument many fans here are making..."this is the HDM forum, if you like SD, then go away; you do not belong!"

Its like they do not want to hear any mention of SD DVD, HTPCs, downloads, etc.

I agree with...

Its hard to discuss BD without using DVD as a reference, even harder in a thread that has topic:"Blu ray will be gone in 5 years?" Were how much marketshare BD will take against DVD will be very crucial. Also how it works for different download services will also impact BD.

This is a forum. A great place to compare and contrast different formats, and it is hard to do that when some get upset when you mention any other format besides their favorite.

That's right sonny...they don't make um like they used to.
Well, back in my day we didn' need any fancy computer graphin tricks, no cussin and no sexin either. Just pure actin.
These folks today...the movie industry is headin for hell in a handbasket...why just the other day I was justin the rabbit ears on my tv and what did I see...

dagnabbit !,...ya gonna tell us? or what?:p

Isn't that the argument many fans here are making..."this is the HDM forum, if you like SD, then go away; you do not belong!"

Its like they do not want to hear any mention of SD DVD, HTPCs, downloads, etc.

I agree with...



This is a forum. A great place to compare and contrast different formats, and it is hard to do that when some get upset when you mention any other format besides their favorite.

+1 And if you are going to talk about the average joe which many of these topics do, there is NO WAY that you can't include the other formats!

Isn't that the argument many fans here are making..."this is the HDM forum, if you like SD, then go away; you do not belong!"

Its like they do not want to hear any mention of SD DVD, HTPCs, downloads, etc.

I agree with...



This is a forum. A great place to compare and contrast different formats, and it is hard to do that when some get upset when you mention any other format besides their favorite.
I believe it's not the mention or comparisons made between those other technologies and blu-ray but the constant remarks like:

"SD DVD upconverted is as good as HDM. There's no need for blu-ray HD."

"The consumer does not care about PQ and is satisfied with SD and blu-ray will die."

"Blu-ray is too expensive for the average consumer & they will not buy until player prices hit $50 and disc prices hit $5."

"VOD is the future and blu-ray will die soon."


You can see those type of remarks do nothing but welcome raging debates and not a healthy debate.

If those members feel that those other technologies are their "horse" to win, I do not see why they come to the HiDef Media forum, where we are here to discuss HiDef media, and provide spitefull remarks to push their preferred technology as the victor when there are forums to discuss those specific technologies.

if you're referring to me, i'm format neutral. it was the other guy who had the issues, not me. i'm a fan of all the formats.


Sorry buddy, but if HDM wants to succeed and to have a chance of getting a strong catalog like DVD we need a single format.

Those who went format neutral were not helping end the war. Granted they got great prices on some hardware and software in the process, but at some point HD DVD hardware will fail and the likelihood of finding a replacement player will be difficult. Toshiba already had a firesale.

Having two formats was only advantageous to early adopters looking for deals. In the end, Warner was wise enough to see that mass adoption would never happen with two formats. Remember SACD and DVD-A they failed because of consumer indifference.

I chose BD because I felt strongly that BD was superior tech-wise AND it had greater support out of the gate. The only holdout was Universal until Paramount took a bribe and I made a decision early on that I was not going to neutral just to get titles from one even two exclusive studios.

Are you such a movie fan that you bought CC's failed DIVX format? I am just as much a movie fan around as others. I just chose not to back a format I did not believe in.

I believe it's not the mention or comparisons made between those other technologies and blu-ray but the constant remarks like:

"SD DVD upconverted is as good as HDM. There's no need for blu-ray HD."

"The consumer does not care about PQ and is satisfied with SD and blu-ray will die."

"Blu-ray is too expensive for the average consumer & they will not buy until player prices hit $50 and disc prices hit $5."

"VOD is the future and blu-ray will die soon."


You can see those type of remarks do nothing but welcome raging debates and not a healthy debate.

If those members feel that those other technologies are their "horse" to win, I do not see why they come to the HiDef Media forum, where we are here to discuss HiDef media, and provide spitefull remarks to push their preferred technology as the victor when there are forums to discuss those specific technologies.

+1

I think these are often the same folks that used to take part in the console type wars when they were kids. Or Coke versus Pepsi.

The truth is there is no one media that is right for everyone as everyone has different tastes. I personally like a combination of VOD, DVD and HDM. I hope VOD gets better, I hope that DVD continues to get great transfers as has happened in recent years and I hope that BD continues to prosper and stays a viable format.

I watch the ones that I don't care about on VOD. (lazy saturday afternoons and such)
I watch the ones that I am hyped about on HDM.
I watch the ones that I do want to watch but am not hyped about on DVD.
I keep the ones that I want on a combination of DVD and HDM.

If there is one media that I am not all hyped about, it is downloads. If I buy something, I prefer to own it in a physical disk as opposed to the digital form. Is better, no.... just what I personally prefer. You may very well prefer the digital and that is just fine too.

I could give reasons why, but in reality it is probably a combination of logic and emotion including the combination of the look of having these movies in my media center (furniture not a PC) as well as "owning" the disk.

Isn't that the argument many fans here are making..."this is the HDM forum, if you like SD, then go away; you do not belong!"

But I have problems with people who try to convince others DVD is a "near" HD format. It is not. It never will be. Even with all the post processing trickery, DVD can never considered "near" when put side-by-side with a true HD source.

Heck, even Toshiba was not dumb enough to do that except at some low key press conference in Canada. They got heckled in Europe. Sony had a nice slam on them at Cedia: "We are not talking about upconverting. Everything we do is real HD."

And again if someone claims that SD looks stunning on a 108-inch screen with a 720p projector and then I see that they spent a lot of time on the HD DVD sub forums posting, well, let's just say you don't have to be rocket scientist to see they have an agenda against the HD format victor.

Maybe we should get back to the orginal topic?

+1 All we need now is for Universal and Microsoft to claim they were neutral the entire time as well :o


Wasn't Microsoft claiming that out of the gate though they tried their hardest to convince people here that a low bitrate VC-1 encode was all that was needed on HD DVD. Most of us could see that MSFT was trying to infillitrate the board to form a 'pro-HD-DVD' group.

Remember the '50GB' BDs defy physics and they will never work. Then it was disc yield, etc. They always pointed out BD flaws while never concentrating on fixing the problems in their own backyard.

I believe it's not the mention or comparisons made between those other technologies and blu-ray but the constant remarks like:

"SD DVD upconverted is as good as HDM. There's no need for blu-ray HD."

"The consumer does not care about PQ and is satisfied with SD and blu-ray will die."

"Blu-ray is too expensive for the average consumer & they will not buy until player prices hit $50 and disc prices hit $5."

"VOD is the future and blu-ray will die soon."


You can see those type of remarks do nothing but welcome raging debates and not a healthy debate.

If those members feel that those other technologies are their "horse" to win, I do not see why they come to the HiDef Media forum, where we are here to discuss HiDef media, and provide spitefull remarks to push their preferred technology as the victor when there are forums to discuss those specific technologies.

First off, my wife, god love her, repeatedly tells me your first two examples, so I am not sure what your point is. She has no stake in the format war and said the same thing about HD DVD too.

I think part of the problem is some here are EXTREMELY biased. They hate it when someone has the opinion that..."VOD is the future and blu-ray (or all HDM) will die soon".

The reality is, there is a chance VOD could eventually kill HDM.
The reality is, there are consumers that believe "SD DVD upconverted is as good as HDM. There's no need for HDM."
The reality is, there are consumers that believe "Blu-ray is too expensive for the average consumer & they will not buy until player prices hit $50"

I am not going agree with the above, but my wife and I discuss this all the time. I think she is far closer to the average consumer than I am (or even most people here).

Wasn't Microsoft claiming that out of the gate though they tried their hardest to convince people here that a low bitrate VC-1 encode was all that was needed on HD DVD.

The lower the easier to transition to HD Lite on Live probably ;)

Most of us could see that MSFT was trying to infillitrate the board to form a 'pro-HD-DVD' group

They certainly were successful at AVS. Thankfully not successful enough outside here :)

Remember the '50GB' BDs defy physics and they will never work. Then it was disc yield, etc. They always pointed out BD flaws while never concentrating on fixing the problems in their own backyard.

I've got some of that "science fiction" at home as we speak :p