If one rips CDs to an Escient MX series media server can those files be copied over to a PC harddrive via the LAN for backup? If so, do the copied files show up as individual songs or are they organized by CD in separate folders?

thanks for any responses.

They are organized into separate folders...

Artist Folder>Album Folder>Individual Tracks

Thanks. Another question now. I converted a large amount of files to FLAC on my PC and am in the process of copying them to the MX's import folder. It is going to take a long time but I'm about halfway through. I went to look at the Music index on the MX and it still doesn't show any imported songs. Does it import to the MX when fies are in the process of being copied to the import folder or does it wait to import them to the MX hard drive until all copying to the import folder is finished? thx.

I'd recommend referring to Escient's "Music File Formats/Tagging Requirements" document...

http://www.escient.com/support/supportdocuments/DigitalMusicFilesFormats.pdf

I've got to say that I'm a little po'ed at this point. First I converted my library from aiff to wav because the manual said that the MXs can't deal with aiff. When the MX didn't copy those files over tech support told me that there is a glitch in the latest firmware so that it can only copy over FLAC. So I convert everything to FLAC and it still doesn't work. Then tech support tells me that WAV files don't have the tags required so the converted FLAC files wouldn't work.

This shouldn't be this hard.

At this point I think I'm just going to re-rip my entire library using the 777. As long as I can copy it from the MX hard drive to the PC it will work.

As cpoore said...read and understand

http://www.escient.com/support/suppo...lesFormats.pdf

The files you are going to import to your fireball MUST be tagged or you will be in the mud.

The only reqal problem I have ever had with pulling files off the fireball and storing them on a PC is that there is a "feature" where the fireball can create filenames that are too long for the PC to understand; happens mostly with classical music. This will poo poo the file transfer and is a PITA. One solution is to only rip on the PC and then transfer the tagged files to the fireball. Another, which I have not yet tried, but might work is to use an operating system which allows for long filenames (linux?) It should then be easy to write a script which will truncate the very long filenames.

I am going to try the linux thing this weekend. I have a few older fireballs that I keep around only to rip in real time, although it takes forever, I don't have to load discs. Anyway, I have almost 1600 cds in 4 cx777es and I want to rip them all and put them on a fireball pc server ( really a NAS that runs XP embedded ) I know there is a 300 track limit on rips from the changers, but that is ok as the fireballs don't have enough disk space to do a whole changer anyway; maybe 50 cds at a time. Still beats paying a buck a disc.

Right now I'm ripping in real time off the 777. I think ripping in real time, while taking forever to get through one's library, leads to much better sound quality. Still it takes so long. I was wondering if it is possible to connect the 777 to a PC and rip through the collection that way so as not to monopolize the music server.

For example, using Exact Audio Copy would one just rip one after the other from a fully loaded 777? Would EAC recognize the 777 as a drive like the MX series does?

Anyone have an idea?

Another question for you Escient veterans. I'm totally confused by all the different product lines and spending a bit of time (not a lot) at Escient's site hasn't cleared up the problem. In a nutshell what is the difference between the SE series, the media players, and the MX series?

Thanks for any responses.

No as far as I know EAC will not work with the cx777es.

In a nut shell:

SE-80 - no display, no changer control, has hard disk, no SACD - music only
SE-D1 - no display, has 1 changer control, no hard disk, no SACD - disc only

MX### - has display, has # changer control, has hard disk, no SACD - both

DVD-M - no display, 3 changer control, no hard disk, yes SACD - disc only

Whatever you do, remember to back up your music, I have several thousand cds ripped to flac and NEVER EVER EVER want to have to do that again...


My collection:
1 DVD-M
2 E-40
1 SE-80
1 ZP-1
1 Big NAS with embedded XP

No as far as I know EAC will not work with the cx777es.

In a nut shell:

SE-80 - no display, no changer control, has hard disk, no SACD - music only
SE-D1 - no display, has 1 changer control, no hard disk, no SACD - disc only

MX### - has display, has # changer control, has hard disk, no SACD - both

DVD-M - no display, 3 changer control, no hard disk, yes SACD - disc only

Whatever you do, remember to back up your music, I have several thousand cds ripped to flac and NEVER EVER EVER want to have to do that again...


My collection:
1 DVD-M
2 E-40
1 SE-80
1 ZP-1
1 Big NAS with embedded XP

So which method did you use to rip all those CDs? :D

And, as long as I seem to have your attention, what is the basic idea with multiroom set up? You have to place which Escient device in another room? Then you connect it via your LAN to the "base" Escient? And you have to connect it to another set of surround processor/amps (and of course speakers) in the remote room?

I guess if you have a remote that can control your "base" Escient (I have a Pronto TSU9800) then you could be in the other room listening and control your base Escient as it streams to the remote point. Is that more or less correct? If there is detailed information about this on the Escient site I haven't found it. Maybe I just missed it. Or do they expect that the authorized dealers are to explain all this to the end user? thx

EDIT: OK I think I found the Escient document that explains their networking set up. Reading it now. Sorry.

Jack,

Here is how the fireballs are deployed:

DVDM100 - Theater
ZP1 - Bar
SE-80 - Piano room,
E40 - Master Bedroom
E40 - Office

The pc based server is in the theater but will move to the basement when I finish installing a second boiler...oh joy...

As to ripping the cds, I have done all three...pc with EAC, via fireball, and real time via changer and fireball.

Any way you do it, it sux. Using the changer reduces my effort, at the expense of time.

I expect to rip about 800 cds for a friend. I will use 2 of his changers and my 2 E40s. It will be in batches of 30-40 cds at a time. Then copy all the files to the pc; then repeat.

Jack,

Here is how the fireballs are deployed:

DVDM100 - Theater
ZP1 - Bar
SE-80 - Piano room,
E40 - Master Bedroom
E40 - Office

The pc based server is in the theater but will move to the basement when I finish installing a second boiler...oh joy...

As to ripping the cds, I have done all three...pc with EAC, via fireball, and real time via changer and fireball.

Any way you do it, it sux. Using the changer reduces my effort, at the expense of time.

I expect to rip about 800 cds for a friend. I will use 2 of his changers and my 2 E40s. It will be in batches of 30-40 cds at a time. Then copy all the files to the pc; then repeat.

Salin,
Sorry but I must be too dense to get it. I have a MX-513 as my main unit and I'm ripping everything to that HD. If I want to play off that unit but in a different room which other Escient unit do I need? And I assume I need an amp in the other room as well. I assume that whichever other Escient I have in the second zone needs to be linked to my LAN. So what do I need? Sorry if I'm being dense about this but I just don't get it. the other thing is that I'm very concerned about sound quality. Would that affect which "remote" unit I put in that second zone? thx

Jack, you have a few choices.

With a PC you can use the web client ( just point the web browser on the pc to the fireball's ip, there is an option to to allow the pc to play back music. )

The least expensive solution for a new unit is a ZP-1 or FP-1 if you want to use an iPod as well. You can either hook up a tv to them or program macros on your remote to call up iRadio stations, playlist, artist, albums, etc. Another option is a wireless pda and control the fireball via the web interface. Works well, a bit slow.

The music does not have to exist all in one place. You can have your MX have a remote connection to the fireball pc. The next fireball that you add ( zp-1?) then connects to the MX. This way all of your music on the pc and MX is available on the ZP-1. You can only go 2 deep when you cascade the fireballs.

Another option is to find an old e-40. Update it to E2 software, easy to do. Then you can use an inexpensive VGA touch screen to control the fireball.

Lastly, use spdif from fireball and connect it to the second zone ( no concerns about hum and easier to make up long cables than it is with toslink. This is a viable solution if you only plan on listening in one place at a time or you want the same material in multiple places at the same time. You could also split off video if you want. I did this from the theater to the room my son plays in. Now he can watch all the annoying Barney and Noddy, and Fireman Sam DVDs and I don't have to worry about them getting covered in diaper goo.

Salin,
Thanks. This is helpful. I am intrigued by the idea of picking up another Escient to hook to a changer to do the real time ripping so that I won't monopolize my MX-531. I guess the cheapest way to do that would be with a MX-111. I guess I could link that to my LAN in my second room and then copy over the rips to my 531. Could the 111 also play back music from the 531 since I wouldn't be able to fit my entire collection on a 160gb hard drive. Also it would be neat to be able to control the 111 from my pronto touch screen. I have a script on the pronto that runs a very nice interface to control the 531. If it could control both then I would be having a lot of fun. thx.

Jack,

The pronto could control both, no problem. There are 4 possible remote codes for the fireball. You could set one to FB1 ( the default ) and one to FB2.

Yes you could buy a MX111 and another cx777es for ripping, not really a cheap solution; you could also buy 10 cheap refurb pc and rip cds like a mad man.

One thing to consider is that transfering files to/from the fireball is very slow, not sure why, but it is.

Jack,

The pronto could control both, no problem. There are 4 possible remote codes for the fireball. You could set one to FB1 ( the default ) and one to FB2.

Yes you could buy a MX111 and another cx777es for ripping, not really a cheap solution; you could also buy 10 cheap refurb pc and rip cds like a mad man.

One thing to consider is that transfering files to/from the fireball is very slow, not sure why, but it is.

Yeah but if I buy the PCs I don't know what to do with them once the ripping is done. Another MX gives me mult room options. I probably would just use the 777 I already have attached to my 531. Once I'm finished ripping I will reattach the 777 to the 531 and load up my SD movies.

You say copying to the FB is slow. When I'm copying does that mean I can't listen to music at the same time? Yet another bummer. Someone has to come up with a better solution to all this. There don't seem to be any "perfect" solutions! ;)

thx

Check out Dbpoweramp's batch Ripper :

http://www.dbpoweramp.com/batch-ripper.htm

I use the single drive version of DbPowerAmp - high quality metadata, accurate Rips, C2 drive integration (for error checking/handling).

I would imagine the batch product is nearly the same, capable of handling multiple rips running in parallel. One machine with a few readers going at the same time - sounds like fun!

I don't know how much it would cost but cheaper and faster probably than buying four or five escients and ripping in real time (depends on if you already have a windows machine with a lot of disk bays!). On average it takes me around 5 minutes to rip a CD to FLAC. And that is using a NAS for RAID5 storage plus an optional verification step.

Jack as I recall, you can listen to music and copy files at the same time.

I agree that the fireballs do have their share of "unique features". However most have work arounds.

Jack as I recall, you can listen to music and copy files at the same time.

I agree that the fireballs do have their share of "unique features". However most have work arounds.

Really? Huh. I'll have to check that out. As far as I remember, when I played around with it you can not get out of the recording screen when you are ripping. I thought you could only play the music you are ripping at the the time.

Jack, I'm sorry, I misunderstood your question. What you state is true. I was refering to moving files from your PC to the fireball while listening to music on the fireball.

Anyway...

I just found a sweet deal on a few sony 400 disc CD jukeboxes. Time to add move jukeboxes to the old E40s...There is just something neat about a wall of jukeboxes...besides at the prices you can pick up used ones for, it is cheaper than cd racks.

Jack, I'm sorry, I misunderstood your question. What you state is true. I was refering to moving files from your PC to the fireball while listening to music on the fireball.

Anyway...

I just found a sweet deal on a few sony 400 disc CD jukeboxes. Time to add move jukeboxes to the old E40s...There is just something neat about a wall of jukeboxes...besides at the prices you can pick up used ones for, it is cheaper than cd racks.

If I'm not mistaken, however, the only multiple CD changer you can use with an MX series is the Sony DVP CX777ES. Right?

Yes that is correct, you must use the CX777ES with the MX, DVDM fireballs. The older E series had several other options for CD changers.

The Sony is being discontinued and Escient told me that there is no currenet plan to make another multi disc player compatible with the Escients. It seems kind of hard to believe that they would just leave people hanging out to dry like that. It really is a very neat feature that their music servers can link up and control so many multi disc players. I don't see that the Vision series is going to make up for that. Sure you can now rip SD DVDs to the hard drive. So what? Most people are going to Blu-Ray now anyway. So it doesn't do a thing for me. When I decided to jump to Escient I considered the Vision but it just didn't seem worth it.

Jack,

There are always several cx777es changers on flea-bay. That is where I have been buying mine. Escient was/is selling them, but you had to buy a fireball along with it.

The whole thing about the cx777es being discontinued is a shame, a the fireball (mx or dvdm-100) was one of the few legal systems you could sell which would allow for control of a large video collection.

My feeling about the vision is similar to yours...too expensive for what it is.

If I'm ripping multiple CDs from the 777 and then I cancel, will it pick up where it left off if I start recording again? Do I have to use the "quick record" option to do this or will it just know where it stopped? In this example I am not adding any new CDs to the 777. thx.

I don't know...but I doubt it will. Perhaps cpoore knows?

fellows,

I wonder if you might consider giving me some advice. For the last five years I a have had a Technics SLMC 7 111 disc changer that sounded pretty good but recently bit the dust. (I currently have it in for repair but am starting to look forward). Can you answer some questions?

1. Can you comment on the sound quality of FLAC playback off the hard disk. I have a Rotel RCC 1055 for more serious listening, but I am considering the Escient MX series for random play of everything I have. For me, if the playback is questionable, I realy don't want to go down that road.

2. I am also considering an olive Opus No. 4. DVD organization is not important to me. Really what I want is a system that puts me in quick control playlists with solid sound.

3. Networking probably isn't important, but you never know what will become important if you have the capability.

4. What is the difference between the MX series and the AVX series (I am guessing now discontinued.

5. In short, what are the ins and outs.

Thanks guys, I am glad I found people who have lived with these things.

I'm ready to hang mysef (exaggeration). I've done three rounds of ripping in real time from the 777 to the MX 531. The problem is that in many cases the Escient has totally mis-identifiied the music. So if I play cd "a'" from the Escient menu it plays the music from one cd while presenting the song list and album art from the a different cd. What the F**k went wrong? !!! I've spent the last several weeks ripping in real time from the 777 to the Escient. This is totaly nuts! What the H have I done wrong?!!!!!

EDIT: Spoke with Escient tech support and I think the problem is as follows: After ripping the first batch of CDs I took them out of the 777 and put in new ones to be ripped. I then selected "record all" on the MX but I guess it just thought that I had the same cds in the 777 so it didn't check the tag information and then associated the music it ripped on the second go around with the tags it read on the first batch. Some of the tags and music are correctly linked but a lot of them aren't. The Escient tech said the easiest thing to do would be a factory reset to just wipe the drive and start over. The only other option is to go through each cd and see if the tags are correct.

So I guess the correct procedure is to load the 777, do a "read all" from the MX and then a "record all." Once that is finished I load another batch and do a "read all" and then "record all." Arrgh!

agent9215, I have never had a problem with the SQ of flac. Provided that you have good DAC in your system, it should sound the same. SACD does pose an issue as you are stuck with the DAC in the CX-777ES, which aren't bad but you might have better. All in all, I am very happy.

fellows,

I wonder if you might consider giving me some advice. For the last five years I a have had a Technics SLMC 7 111 disc changer that sounded pretty good but recently bit the dust. (I currently have it in for repair but am starting to look forward). Can you answer some questions?

1. Can you comment on the sound quality of FLAC playback off the hard disk. I have a Rotel RCC 1055 for more serious listening, but I am considering the Escient MX series for random play of everything I have. For me, if the playback is questionable, I realy don't want to go down that road.

2. I am also considering an olive Opus No. 4. DVD organization is not important to me. Really what I want is a system that puts me in quick control playlists with solid sound.

3. Networking probably isn't important, but you never know what will become important if you have the capability.

4. What is the difference between the MX series and the AVX series (I am guessing now discontinued.

5. In short, what are the ins and outs.

Thanks guys, I am glad I found people who have lived with these things.

I have a meridian processor, five Mcintosh monoblocks driving five BW 800 series speakers so I have a pretty revealing system. I have an Olive OPUS 5 (no longer sold) and am now in the process of setting up an MX-531.

I do not use the DACs in the Olive nor do I use them in the Escient as I connect via digital (coax). I only use the music servers as a transport.

When I got my OPUS way back when they first came to market I ripped my collection in AIFF in iTunes and then copied over to the Olive. Now I am re-ripping everything in real time directly to the hard drive of the Escient which it does in FLAC. I haven't done serious A/B testing but my initial impressions are that the sound is better from the Escient.

I can't say why for sure. I'm using the same DACs to listen to both servers (the ones in the Meridian). My theory is that it is real time ripping that I'm doing now vs the speeded up ripping I did before in iTunes. I also think that iTunes is probabaly a crappy way to rip if you have a good sound system. It's ok for an iPod but that's about it.

The OPUS 4 that you are considering does not have as good DACs as the OPUS 5 but Olive is talking about releasing an OPUS 6 which is supposed to have the same quality DACs as the OPUS 5. Again I can't tell you how good the 5's DACs are because I never used them.

I can tell you that the remote interface on the Escient is way better than the one on the Olive. The other thing you might find interesting is that Escient is owned by the same company that owns McIntosh. The McIntosh music server is, I'm told, pretty much a rebadged Escient. Maybe they have made some changes but I can't say for sure.

Hope that is of some help.

Only a guess:

Perhaps there is better error recovery in the 777 than in whatever pc you used to rip to itunes. Would seem reasonable.

When I get a chance (that is to say not in the near future as we have a newborn at home) I will compare a cd ripped from the fireball's internal drive to that ripped from the 777. It should be the same, but you never know. My plan is to rip the cd twice to flac( in the internal drive and the 777 ) then convert it back to wav and use a sound editing program to time align the two files. Then I can subtract on from the other...the result should be zero...

Factory reset is just about the best option when doing a rip to the internal hd on the fireball, if you then intend on pulling the files off and putting them on a fireballpc. To try to delete the individual music files would take a long time.

I have an MX-752 arriving tomorrow. I'm going to start ripping all over on my 531. Then I will copy over the files to the 752.

1. How do I configure the two units so they see each other?
2. Can I copy over files from the 531 to the 752 while the 777 is ripping to the 531 or do I have to stop the ripping process to transfer?

thanks.

PS good idea about testing the difference in ripping using software to compare the bits. Would be interested to hear about the results. I might even try it myself but I would have to spend a bit of time figuring out which software and how to do it.

Jack,

RTFM :)

Actually it is quite easy. Under setup, name the firebal. Then on the other fireball select it under remote server ( also under setup ( I think ))

To copy files, open the contents folder on 1 fireball and drag the files to the import folder on the other. The contents folder is read-only.

Jack,

RTFM :)

Actually it is quite easy. Under setup, name the firebal. Then on the other fireball select it under remote server ( also under setup ( I think ))

To copy files, open the contents folder on 1 fireball and drag the files to the import folder on the other. The contents folder is read-only.

You only need to select one of the two FBs under remote server if you want to stream from one to the other as is explained in the manual. To copy from one to the other they just have to be on the same subnet or your LAN as your pc. Then from the PC you can pull up the "content" folder from one and copy from it to the "import" folder of the other.

And BTW you can play from a unit at the same time that you are copying files to its hard drive.

A while back an Escient tech mentioned that there is a way to enter the service menu and do a factory reset which would wipe the hard drive. I want to do this but can't quite figure it out. He said something about using the code 8020 but I am not sure how to do it. Tried to send that code as the unit was booting up but it didn't do anything. Ideas? I don't think this is in the manual. ;)

EDIT: Ok I got it. In case anyone wants to do a factory reset (you will wipe the hard drive and lose all personal settings) you go into the setup menu and push 8020. Then you will get several options one of which is to restore factory defaults.

One thing I've noticed (coming from an iPod mentality) is that, while I like the Escient software, you can't seem to do random play on an individual artist unless you first create a group with that artist's CDs. Seems a bit of an extra hassle. Not a major complaint by any means but still seems like an unnecessary additional step.

BTW do they put out firmware upgrades with significant changes very often?