I have searched the threads for the subject of Panasonic dvd recorder versues the popular Philips dvd recorder with the hard drive and decided to start this thread in order for me to get guidance on what to buy.

Here are my needs.
Soon to arrive is a Panasonic TV 42" Plasma pz85u.

Need 1:
I have family vhs tapes that I want to put onto DVD's that can be viewed on those dvd players built back in 2005-2006 the cheapo types. Once I get those few VHS tapes transferred I don't think I'll need to use that archiving mechanism anymore as I'll transfer straight from camcorder. The camcorder is the mini tape variety (analog). I am lead to believe from my research that on a stand alone DVD recorder I can plug this camera into the S-jacks and record future tapes onto DVD's this way. Again I ask, can these DVD's be viewed onto the cheapo type DVD players?

Need 2:
For copying TV shows I won't be sharing those or worrying about whether they can play on other DVD players. However there are times I may need to "tape" a show for mother or in-laws who do not have a cable box recorder and because of the analog to dig conversion is probably never going to be able to tape shows themselves. (This is the big crux in this conversion as analog vcr's get dumped in the trash after February, true or not?) Perhaps depends on if cable company still broadcasts over the air channels?)

Need 3:
With the Panasonic Viera system I can opt for a Panasonic DVD recorder to get the "one remote" plusses of that system, unless the efficiencies of that completeness is just marketing hype.

Concerns:
I have a brand new spanking pc, and can edit my family movies on that I guess so perhaps I dont need the hard drive. Panasonic recorders put in "chapter" marks at the end of every tape session ends which is a drawback because some of my scenes are 2 minutes or less. Going the route of editing this on my Dell pc is whole new territory for me and I don't know how to burn the DVD's and again are they compatible with cheapo DVD players. And maybe tape my in-laws shows this way to (a Hallmark movie once every 3 month or so need, BTW)


DVD-R-RW? is that what I am going to burn to?

To sum up, if I find out what the capablities of my pc are as far as burning and to what medium and compatilbiity with cheapo DVD players, then that handles the copying function. Then what DVD recorder should I get?


Blu-Ray player is going to be purchased 12 months from now.

How important is the "single Panasonic remote" benefit to you? Because that will likely be the main difference between these two machines in your experience. Some people highly value the single-brand remote feature, other could care less. Answer that question first.

In terms of price, assuming you intend to purchase "new" at a store (and not used or open-box returns), Panasonics are a little expensive for what they offer, compared to the Phillips/Magnavox which are outright steals. A good Panasonic like the EZ-28 sells at around $180-220 and offers DVD-only recording. The Phillips 3576/Magnavox H2160 sell for about $250-275 and add the immensely useful hard disk feature. Its an old bromide repeated endlessly in this forum: everyone who thinks they don't need the hard drive feature is blown away by it once they try it. If you have a lot of time on your hands, it is true you can take any dvd to your computer and edit-reauthor it extensively. Many people prefer this workflow. But you'd be surprised how simple editing and authoring directly on a hard drive equipped recorder is WAY more efficient and gives results on par with simple PC authoring. The hard drive also makes timeshifting more flexible and allows better quality recording speeds, because you can delete bitrate-sucking commercials out of a recording before you burn the DVD, freeing up valuable DVD space for the actual program.

That said, some owners of flat screens like the Viera find the HDMI output of the Phillips/Magnavox unappealing. Also the Panasonics offer the option of DVD-RAM disc recording, which some find a great boon. Given the limited number of models you are deciding between, I suggest doing what many on this forum do: go to a chain store like Wal*Mart (or their website) and try the Phillips 3576/Magnavox H2160 first. The stores that sell these models have liberal return policies, if you find you don't care for it after a couple weeks, return it and buy a Panasonic.

DVD R/W can be a problematical format for playback on "other peoples" hardware. Once finalized it is expected to be compatible but often is not, especially if the disc has been recorded on and erased multiple times. Anything you have on DVD R/W that you want to pass around to other people should be duplicated on your PC from DVD R/W to a standard DVD-R blank. A few pennies spent on a DVD-R can save you from confused phone calls from friends/family. Also note DVD R/W is not as "archival" as ordinary DVD-R or DVD+R: anything you want to keep permanently should be recorded or duplicated onto write-once media. Any of your recorded discs (except maybe DVD-RAM) should be playable on your future BluRay hardware.

How important is the "single Panasonic remote" benefit to you?.
Indeed remote is only advantage than this is not an issue. If I only need to grab a different remote to do “Quick record” I can adjust.
That said, some owners of flat screens like the Viera find the HDMI output of the Phillips/Magnavox unappealing

What do you mean by this statement. HDMI is somehow unappealing? Isnt’t a Panny Recorder connected with HDMI also?

The hard drive also makes timeshifting more flexible and allows better quality recording speeds,
What do you mean by timeshifting? Watching one show and taping another?

I like the idea of big box return policy, but I was already sold on Philips/Magnavox, so I still may purchase online. I am already against the Panasonic with its chapter dividing inserts. The DVD-Ram is something I could care less about as I never save tv shows beyond their viewing time, so probably just watch off the hard drive.

Am I reading correctly in the forum with this unit you can still tape Tv shows to a separate connected analog VCR? Not concerned with quality of video, as long as I can see it at all. Thus Can I run tape over to in-laws house?

If you say I should copy to DVD-R than I’ll do that for home movies. Great to know.
Can I “dump” the contents of the Magnavox’s hard drive onto my computer avoiding any media? With no USB jack I infer you cannot. Or does the Philips have a USB, but Mag does not?

It is nice to know (I’ve read some forum on this) that my wife can miss the first 10 minutes of a 9:00 show I am taping onto the Magnavox, start watching the tape at 9:10 and catch up to the live broadcast, and in the first 10 minutes , I'm watching a football game on the tv’s tuner. Tivo, please go away with the expensive cell phone companies.

Just a note that at times I will hook up the laptop to the computer to watch old episodes of TV shows that I never taped, that CBS and ABC and NBC replay over the internet. (commercials are 15 seconds, not 4 minutes, every 20 minutes of show)


Of the list of 14 forum items listed on the Mag, does this mean the Phil has a usb port, #6?
What does item #10 mean about stops and buffer cleared.? What is pause live?
What is #7 about.
1.
2.
3.
4.
5.
6. No USB port.
7. No digital optical audio out (digital coax only).
8.
9.
10. AUTOSTART RECORDING replaces Pause Live TV. Continuous temp. rec. of channels you tune (up to 6 hours) while machine is on. Stops and buffer cleared when powered off, recording, editing, deleting titles (DVD only), dubbing, changing "input channels" (tuners or line inputs), and using certain menus. Whatever is in the 6-hour buffer can be viewed or saved to HDD.
11.
12.
13.

Thanks I looking forward to my new toys. If I remember correctly, I found this site from some customer review site, and I am forever grateful.

Am I reading correctly in the forum with this unit you can still tape Tv shows to a separate connected analog VCR? Not concerned with quality of video, as long as I can see it at all. Thus Can I run tape over to in-laws house?
Yes, you can set up with connection from the Mag/Philips to an analog DVDR and record WS digital channels, as described here. (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1016350)

If you say I should copy to DVD-R than I’ll do that for home movies. Great to know.
Can I “dump” the contents of the Magnavox’s hard drive onto my computer avoiding any media? With no USB jack I infer you cannot. Or does the Philips have a USB, but Mag does not?
Moving video files to a computer is normally by DVD... the USB ports in U.S. machines are "dumb" and only for playing certain stuff, like jpgs, etc. Here's more info on that process. (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=976050)

Of the list of 14 forum items listed on the Mag, does this mean the Phil has a usb port, #6?
What does item #10 mean about stops and buffer cleared.? What is pause live?
What is #7 about.
1.
2.
3.
4.
5.
6. No USB port.
7. No digital optical audio out (digital coax only).
8.
9.
10. AUTOSTART RECORDING replaces Pause Live TV. Continuous temp. rec. of channels you tune (up to 6 hours) while machine is on. Stops and buffer cleared when powered off, recording, editing, deleting titles (DVD only), dubbing, changing "input channels" (tuners or line inputs), and using certain menus. Whatever is in the 6-hour buffer can be viewed or saved to HDD.
11.
12.
13.
Yes, no USB port in the Mag 2160, and the Philips USB port is "dumb" as described above.

Autostart Recording "Stops" when the listed actions occur, like power-off, timer or timed (press REC multiple times) recording starts, editing, etc. so it just means nothing will be auto-recorded at or during those times.

Pause Live TV is deescribed here. (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=12298461&postcount=16)

#7 means the Mag 2160 only has digital coax audio output, whereas the 3576 also has optical audio out. These are used primarily or solely for playing commercial DVDs that have DD5.1 audio thru an AV receiver .

Except for recording 2 tv shows on at the same hour, why do people buy 2 of these?
Is upconverting dvd not part of the magnavox?

Record While Simultaneously Playing Other Recorded Shows or DVDs. Is this only true of Philips?

Except for recording 2 tv shows on at the same hour, why do people buy 2 of these?
Is upconverting dvd not part of the magnavox?
I've got three 3575's and we need two for sure just to cover our favorite shows that are on at the same time during prime season. The third one records specials that are also on at the same time as regular shows, my Sports, and my wife's "backup" copy of her daily Soaps (cuz one of our two ABC stations OFTEN cuts away to weather and stays there for hours, while the other one appears briefly then maintains a "warning" over her Soaps).

I reposted while you replied
Can you answer this question?

Record While Simultaneously Playing Other Recorded Shows or DVDs. and USB?

This is on Philips but not on magnavox? Correct?

No, BOTH units will sim. record and play.

One thing to note if you already have a Panasonic recorder in your system, UNFINALIZED DVDs won't be interchangeable for "multisession recording" as described here under "Recording to DVD in Multiple Sessions ..." half-way down page. (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=12298483&postcount=18)

Once Finalized, of course, discs from either machine will play in the other.

I found on Walmart answers/questions for the Magnovox
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=10104532#Customer+Product+Reviews
Someone misguided answering incorrectly.

Can you view one channel and record another program (different channel) at the same time? 3 days agoBy CadillacGirl

Answers
A: No, you can't record while you're watching something you have on the hard drive.
2 days agoBy gadgetgeek13 - Toms River, NJ

I found on Walmart answers/questions for the Magnovox
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=10104532#Customer+Product+Reviews
Someone misguided answering incorrectly.

Can you view one channel and record another program (different channel) at the same time? 3 days agoBy CadillacGirl

Answers
A: No, you can't record while you're watching something you have on the hard drive.
2 days agoBy gadgetgeek13 - Toms River, NJ
CadGirl is wrong Actually, CadillacGirl said you "CAN" record while watching... So, to repeat, you CAN record one channel while PLAYING something from the HDD or a DVD, so REC/PLAY is OK... it's called "simultaneous record and play."

You can't RECORD one channel while WATCHING a different channel in the 3576 or 2160... both require using the 3576/2160 tuner, and it can only be on one channel at a time. Need two tuner to watch and record diff. channels on the same machine.

If you set up per sketch #1 here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=12298409&postcount=10), you can also record one channel on the 3576/2160 while WATCHING another channel on the TV (using the TV's tuner).

#7 means the Mag 2160 only has digital coax audio output, whereas the 3576 also has optical audio out. These are used primarily or solely for playing commercial DVDs that have DD5.1 audio thru an AV receiver .

Thank you, but I still don't understand this one #7

If it is down to the 2 machines and money is no object, why do I want the magnavox?

Further I have a completely analog VCR only (not DVDR), and still want to record over the air programs to tape to give to someone after February 2009. I did read your descriptions and diagrams.
I cannot tape to a vhs tape a High Density signal, correct? Even if taping it to my hard drive first then routing later to an old junky vcr

Thank you, but I still don't understand this one #7

If it is down to the 2 machines and money is no object, why do I want the magnavox?

Further I have a completely analog VCR only (not DVDR), and still want to record over the air programs to tape to give to someone after February 2009. I did read your descriptions and diagrams.
I cannot tape to a vhs tape a High Density signal, correct? Even if taping it to my hard drive first then routing later to an old junky vcr
I've only done VCR > HDD transfers but there should be no reason you can't play a HDD title to a line input on your VCR... 99.44/100% confident! :) Each device, the DVDR and the VCR will convert an incoming signal to its required specs for recording.

On #7, digital coax audio output only... the 2160 has the normal Composite R/L, or red/white, RCA input and output connections for 2-channel stereo that have been common for many years, even on VCRs. However, with the advent of Dolby Digital 5.1 audio, which can feed 6 speakers to a surround-sound system, or AV receiver (separate box), players and recorders started adding digital audio connections to deliver that audio in one cable rather than 6, one for each speaker (the AV receiver splits the audio for each speaker). You need a digital coax, like a normal coax but with RCA end fittings, or an optical cable, like a fiber-optic cable, with square optical connectors. Some AV receivers have only one type of digital audio connector, so the 3575/3576 can feed DD5.1 thru either connector... don't need both. The 2160 has only dig. coax, which virtually all AV receivers have.

If you don't have an AV receiver now, it won't matter to you, and if you get one later and have the Mag, just make sure it has a digital coax audio connector.

Someone asked the same "which one to buy" question in the main Sticky thread and here's one answer from subeluvr who had both machines. (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=15089971#post15089971)

Ok so I am not at a disadvantage to buying the Mag if the new home theatre receiver has dig coax aud connector.

Also "someday" includes a Blue-Ray player, so I suppose that becomes my movie player and I gain benefits of Dolby then, probably using HDMI. (I am admitting I am dumb to this stuff, and today my boss is not watching me, this research is a 24/7 operation)
I will keep reading this forum and be an expert by Friday when the tv arrives:)

BTW I love your political whisms about Gore and the environment.

Also I have a JVC receiver from 1999 or so, (do you call those analog??) and will want to use my "rca jacks" and dont want to replace it with a new home theatre/audio receiver just yet. Will these RCA jacks work on either the Phil or Mag?

To get the best sound (dolby)out of a blue-ray movie would one need to have a new home theatre receiver?

Also magn will allow closed captioning to show up from digital broadcasts but Phil does not. We need that.

I am editing last post
Done editing

Ok so I am not at a disadvantage to buying the Mag if the new home theatre receiver has dig coax aud connector.

Also "someday" includes a Blue-Ray player, so I suppose that becomes my movie player and I gain benefits of Dolby then, probably using HDMI. (I am admitting I am dumb to this stuff, and today my boss is not watching me, this research is a 24/7 operation)
I will keep reading this forum and be an expert by Friday when the tv arrives:)

BTW I love your political whisms about Gore and the environment.

Also I have a JVC receiver from 1999 or so, (do you call those analog??) and will want to use my "rca jacks" and dont want to replace it with a new home theatre/audio receiver just yet. Will these RCA jacks work on either the Phil or Mag?

To get the best sound (dolby)out of a blue-ray movie would one need to have a new home theatre receiver?

Also magn will allow closed captioning to show up from digital broadcasts but Phil does not. We need that.
Yes, another advantage of the Mag is the digital CC recording. The Philips can DISPLAY digital CC but only RECORDS analog CC... a great feature for those who need CC.

Your Bluray will have its own connections for the TV video and audio.

Your RCA stereo jacks will work fine for most audio, unless your an elitist audiophile, i.e., a Republican! :D

thanks If I am speaking to the CEO of Philips, I understand your republican stance ;)

quick side question for hooking laptop's Monitor out jack to the tv I think I need a male vga to mail vga connector cable. should be about 12 dollars?

the 6 hour buffer,cc on recordings, and the quick start button sell me on the magnavox.

I wonder why only Walmart sells the Mag, and not even Amazon.

You might be wise not to have gone for the Samsung HDTV... I've read of quite a few that have HDMI "handshake" issues with a DVDR.

I think it's only Walmart cuz of a special production run, with 3576 parts, and one seller to keep marketing costs to essentially zero, thus the nice low price.

I agree that you'll prob. need a VGA cable, male for the TV for sure, prob. male also for your PC. My Vizio LCD has an "RGB" input for the VGA connection.

wajo has already covered most of your additional questions. One advantage of buying a Phillips/Magnavox is you can fall back on wajo's near-endless supply of info on how to get the best from these machines:).

But just to clear up an earlier remark of mine: yes, both the Panasonic and Phillips/Magnavox units have HDMI connectors. When I said some members here found the Phillips/Magnavox HDMI output "unappealing", I meant some people complain of the picture on that connection being darker or otherwise not as nice as the output thru component or analog connections. This is a fairly common complaint about several different brands and HDMI, not just Phillips/Magnavox. Panasonic seems to have somewhat fewer complaints than average, thats all I meant. Apparently many flat-panel displays require you to experiment with settings on either the display, the recorder, or both to get the best possible picture from HDMI: it isn't plug-and-play. I believe wajo covers this in several posts and in his FAQ page: check there for tips on how to get optimal HDMI output quality from a Phillips/Magnavox.

You can connect the analog (Video/Left Audio/Right Audio) outputs of any DVD/HDD recorder to the line inputs of any VCR to make a VHS copy of something you have on DVD or HDD, no problem. (Except they must be recordings you made yourself: commercial DVDs you rent or buy cannot be copied to VHS due to their embedded copy protection signals).