I am debating between these two (Panasonic TH-50PZ800U & TH50PZ85U) and leaning heavily toward the TH-50PZ800U for all the reasons discussed in several other threads, but there is one issue I've not seen discussed in any of the other threads... I need to mount whatever I get on a side wall which has huge picture windows on the adjacent front wall, so glare & reflection become potentially huge issues. I understand the TH50PZ85U has excellent glare reduction due to its screen's anti-relflective (relatively) matte finish. How do theese two compare interms of their screen's anti-reflective finish? I'll need to make my decision without being able to do a head-to-head in-store comparison, hence the need to solicit "the opinion of others" who may have been able to do so... (BTW, sure, I'd love to consider the new TH-50PZ850U, but I can get a much better deal on the TH-50PZ800U - and, at some point, price has to be a consideration...)

Thanks,
r-gordon-7

Here are a bunch of the same questions

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...t=pz85u+pz800u

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...t=pz85u+pz800u

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...pz85u+50pz800u

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1076407&highlight=85+800

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1082528&highlight=85+800

Thanks, omeletpants, but unfortunately, I can't get the first three links to work - and though the threads for the last two do discuss various differences between these sets, they don't seem to compare the anti-glare properties of the respective screens...

r-gordon-7

Try these links
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1082528&highlight=800+85

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1076407&highlight=800+85

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1025556&highlight=800+85

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1059097&highlight=800+85

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1036707&highlight=800+85

Thanks for the links. They led to info., which led to more info., which led to even more info, which led to a decision... Order now placed for a TH50PZ800U through a board sponsor... (and the anxious wait now begins... ;) )

Thanks,
r-gordon-7

Thanks for the links. They led to info., which led to more info., which led to even more info, which led to a decision... Order now placed for a TH50PZ800U through a board sponsor... (and the anxious wait now begins... ;) )

Thanks,
r-gordon-7

How do you place an order through a board sponsor?

How do you place an order through a board sponsor?Either online or by phone :)

went to the stores yesterday fully expecting to pull the triggers on the Samsung 650 LCDs that were on sale. I'd been researching LCDs exclusively for a year (never gave Plasma's a look at all because of the old burn in fears and the fact that when you go into stores, the brightest 'crispest' images always seemed to end up being LCDs)... so yeah, I thought I'd ended my search on those pretty and bright Sammy 650's.

So then i go in a store to get one and the sales guy asks me what will you be watching and how will you watch it?

My answers:

First, PRICE IS an issue with me...i've got a family and stuff and definitely dont make zillions. I was HOPING to spend around the $1500-1700 range, but could possibly be swayed up to the 1900-2000-ish range if what I was getting was deemed a truly 'great deal' and there were pretty much no serious concerns at all with whatever technology the tv happened to be (meaning i dont want any concerns as far as 'motion blur', 'detail', 'burn in', 'signal noise' go. Picture quality (and reliability of course) is mainly all i care about. Call me crazy, but If im gonna spend that much money i really feel i should NOT have to deal with those concerns in the picture. Dont care about the sound, i think I'm gonna run the sound through a system anyways.)

My Viewing habits will be: Mostly DVDs & BluRays (love mainly Sci Fi/fantasy & action), NFL Football via DircTV(HD when i get it), and some HD TV via DirecTV (again once i get upgrade to HD programming.) My son willl also have his PS3 hooked up to it quite often.

MY room: My room is not brightly lit by any means. NO sunlight gets in at all, and i have adjustable dimming lighting in it that i keep mostly rather low so i'm thinking reflections shouldn't be an issue. (when i get a TV, if watching with any lights on, i plan to have the lighting set-up so that the lamps that are on will actually be BEHIND the TV itself (to the left and right of the tv) with the lamps that are in front of the TV screen turned way down or completely off.

Sooooo the sales guy says, "well why not go Plasma?" and starts showing me the TH-50PZ800U and the TH-50PZ85U.

He says that the 'burn in' issues have been essentially fixed due to the new auto 'pixel moving' features they've added. So he's showing us these Panasonics in the store setting...and yeah they initially dont wow you quite as easily and quickly as the bright Samsung LCDs do of course, but then he whips out this handheld gadget that had two simulated tv screens on it, one Plasma screen and the other LCD screen. it simulates how the images on the TV screens will look in different room settings...in rooms with bright light, the LCD was definitely more impressive...but when he scrolled the 'room atmosphere' to show what the screens look like in a darker room setting, well then the Plasma screen looked more impressive...

at least thats what happened on his gadget thing anywayz

so now, at least based on that, i'm ALL messed up and im thinking i may have been wasting a year of my time looking at LCDs, when in reality, based on MY viewing needs perhaps a Plasma is more of what i need? my head starts reeling because some of the LCD sales where ending that day and i didn't have time to do serious research on the Plasmas before then.

i scramble...bounce from store to store. i try to find a computer in a store to try do SOME kind of abbreviated PLasma research, but im rushed, i dont have all of MY links. Pioneers look great but are way out of my price range. Samsung 650 PLASMAs are getting some decent online reviews, but guys in store say if i go Plasma go Panasonic (if Pioneer is not an option). its almost closing time. My wifes calling asking whats taking so long...

so i flipped several friggin coins and the "TH-50PZ800U" came up the initial winner. BUT of course it turns out they were sold out of that one! should get more this week. DOH!! 'alright then' I say...get the other panasonic plasma...the TH-50PZ85U....you guessed it, sold out/more this week. DANG. alright then, do i go back to LCD now??? arggg . but wait, turns out theres an 'open box' TH-50PZ85U over here that fits your lower price range. i'm so exhausted and confused i just say to hell with it and buy the open box Panny 85U. (they said they knew the history of that particular Open Box set because it was actually the store managers personal TV but he upgraded to a 58 inch version instead) I felt good price wise...it was in my lower range, buuut....since i didn't get time to do DEEP research i'm nervous about my picture concerns that i had mentioned above.

I was driving my compact car so i left the tv at the store and will pick up today or tomorrow...IF i decide to keep it.

Im planning on doing more research today and i'm starting that right HERE & right NOW....

ALRIGHT YOU EXPERTS...
based on my viewing habits, concerns (and my price range)...
if i can get (in varying scenarios) 46-52" versions of the following TVs that fall within my ideal price ($1500-1700) or my maximum price (2000-ish)...what do YOU think i should get??

TH-50PZ85U (50" Panny Plasma)
'red push' issues?

TH-50PZ800U (50" Panny Plasma)
'flicker issues' with BluRay/PS3 output?

PN50A650 (50" Sammy Plasma)
'guys in store' say if Plasma go Panny(or Pioneer if you can afford it/i cant)

LNA650 (46" or 52"<depending on sale} Sammy LCD)
do these bright LCDs really have the motion/judder thing fixed or are Plasmas still the hands down winner? With MY viewing habits & room environment will LCDs brightness not be so much of a benefit since i dont have a lot of brightness in the area?

go for it. let me have it....your honest opinions.

some more info about my tastes and viewing environment:

more viewing tastes and concerns
along with those concerns mentioned above ('motion blur', 'detail', 'burn in', 'signal noise') I want to be able to see detail in light & dark scenes. At least initially I seem to lean towards bright and un-muddy over rich but muddy. But again, thats based only on what i seen in the stores and i have no idea what their calibrations are from set to set or their source feeds etc. I must say that, in the store, i was indeed impressed with the TH-50PZ800Us crispness and brightness as far as the plasmas go. It wasn't as bright as the Sammy LCDs but it was still impressive on that front. But some initial post i saw somewhere on that 50PZ800U said something about it not being able to handle FULL output of Bluray or something like that?? they said something about it causing 'Flicker at 24p' mode and said that good LCDs can handle that, but this 800 plasma didnt do so well with it. I'm NOT a tech guy but since i DO plan on watching BluRays i was kinda concerned with that, but dont know enough at this point to understand HOW concerned i should be. Also I'm NOT a techie dude, so, unless there is an easy to digest calibration post for whatever tv i end up with, chances are i wont fiddle too much with the settings. (i've seen a few easy to understand bullet pointed calibration posts here on AVS for few sets though, so who knows maybe i will surprise myself and get in there and mess around with that junk after-all ;)

additional viewing environment details:
At least initially i plan to have the TV up pretty high sitting on TOP of my current entertainment system (approx 45" tall). The way our seating is, the seats and chairs tend to force viewers to 'lounge & lean back' in the couch & chairs anyway, so while the TV will technically be above their heads, since they are leaning back slightly already, i'm thinking the angle of 'looking up' at the TV wont be severe (and will even be an improvement over 'looking down' which is what they have to do now with my current old 27" STD def set which is a little over a foot off of the ground in the entertainment center.

so there...let me have it.
Tell me i'm an idiot. tell me i'm in over my head. tell me i'm stupid for even wasting time reading about LCDs for 12 months or that i'm a dummy for scrapping that year long LCD research in a matter of hours based on a sales guy or two. i dont care, call me names...i'll take it all, as long as ya help me get to what will be the right set for my viewing :) and I'll thank you forever!!

also...one last thing. While initially i was planning on buying from a brick and morter store, i've read some posts referencing that they bought through some of the AVS merchants. I may be open to that if any have consistently good reputations for info security/safe delivery/fair return policys. Any suggestions are welcome.

thanks in advance for any help you can give me. I'm stressed OUT over here and this is supposed to be FUN!!! :)

This is coming from a person that started out just like you - buying a new TV and buying LCD. Looked at the Samsung 650 - great reviews from CNET and Consumer Reports, didn't like the way the picture looked after playing around with it in the store - just my opinion but many on this forum speak highly of that TV. Took a Sony 4100Z home, loved the TV until I noticed the sparkles and red streaking problem. Sparkle issue has been solved, red streaking has not. I believe if you check out the 650 thread the Samsung has an issue with ghosting. If I am going to spend what I consider to be a lot of money on a TV then I expect it to do what it is promised. Took the Sony back and brought home a Panny Z85, started with 42" and ended with a 50". It does have a red push but it is easy to correct by using the settings you can find on its thread. Great TV, plasma handles motion sooo much better, I didn't realize this until I got one and compared it to the XBR4 I have upstairs. With a plasma in the house I found myself wanting to watch it instead of the LCD. I can't say anything negative about the Z85, great TV. I didn't look at the Samsung plasmas for a few reasons, first is reliability - still an issue. I know the odds are small, but Panasonic is know for making a quality plasma, Samsung is moving up but still has work to do according to reviewers. The screen on the Samsung plasma isn't as good as the Panny's in regards to light reflection - even in a room with few or no windows the lamp you have on will still cause a reflection. The other issue with Samsung is blacks, reviewers talk about their great color, but the blacks are not as good as Panasonic or Pioneer. Why are the blacks important? Every color has some black in it, if you have a TV that displays blacks well then the contrast and colors will look a lot better especially after calibration. I never realized this until the price dropped on a Pioneer I had been eyeing (5020) and I decided to return the Panny and go with the Kuro. After watching the Kuro for a week all I can say is wow - blacks do make a difference - sounds like a Pioneer ad. The Z85 is a great TV, but its blacks do not compare to the Kuro, but those blacks come at a cost. The difference was easy to see and I didn't even have them side by side to compare. I only mention this to emphasize the importance of the blacks, not to confuse you - blacks are a huge advantage that plasma has besides handling motion better than LCDs. The Panny's are known for offering good blacks - check out the CNET review on the Z85 - and LCDs haven't gotten close yet, LEDs are getting there but are expensive with poor off angle viewing. Improvements with IR and Burn-In shouldn't be an issue for your gaming needs after you break in the TV. Also, the Z85 is supposed to have zero lag-time when set to game mode, an important feature. Can't speak to the Samsung plasma as to lag or no lag. Most everyone is on a budget these days and you can get a great deal on the Z85 whether you go B&M or buy from a forum sponsor. The only advantage to B&M is the store I bought my TVs from had a 45 day return policy, from your reading you can see that I took advantage of it a few times :), plus if I had kept the Z85 I would have been able to save an additional $150 this week since a competitor dropped their price for a weekend sale - price match. Savings noted, in all fairness if I had bought it on-line, the price would still have been less and I would have saved more by avoiding sales tax. My advice - go with the Panny Z85, calibrate it using the settings on its thread, be sure to break-it-in and buy from a brick and mortar store if you what to be able to return it should you suffer from OCD like me or save $ and buy from a forum sponsor - based on reading numerous threads it seems as if everyone speaks very highly of Cleveland Plasma, Plasma Concepts, BestBuyPlasma, and Value Electronics. If you buy on-line, you may be able to move up to the 800U - GREAT TV for the money. One other important advantage to plasma - check out the HDGURU's tests on 2008 TVs Sept. 2008 - LCDs only display 600 lines or less of resolution (motion), most of the plasmas tested displayed 800 or more, Panny was 850 if I remember correctly. The Samsung LCDs failed one of his tests, supposedly they are issuing a firmware update to address the problem. Don't get hung up on the 24p thing - having two TVs that can do it I can honestly tell you I don't notice enough difference to base a buying decision on that feature. Also, see the GURU's test results - the Samsung 650 failed the 3:3 pulldown test. Sorry for the long reply, but your question was long one.

I have to say that the PZ800 is impressive. I don't doubt that the 5020FD is an excellent performer over the PZ85, but I will begin to say that by 2010-2011 black levels will become irrelevant in conversation. Although in today's displays there is a difference in black levels that is noticeable. I do find the PZ800 to be a little light on the blacks, but the overall shadow depth and detail is plenty for most casual viewers.

Chris

Sorry for the long reply, but your question was long one.

Sorry? what are you sorry for? THANKS for the awesome details and thought put into your reply!!! It will definitely help me make my final call :)

After doing some more un-rushed online research today, i feel like I am indeed leaning towards the Plasmas. I'm headed to the stores tomorrow for another in person eye check though, this time armed with more info and some calibration settings to look at thanks to many folks (like yourself) who have helped me gather this info :) Then i'll bring something home and test it in the house.

while i would kill to have one of those Pioneers (those were the ONLY Plasmas i even looked at way back over a year ago when i started my LCD focused research)...those Kuros are just way outta my pricerange at the moment...but they are indeed something to behold, both in the picture they deliver and in sublime design.

so we'll see what happens...
like i said, i got the 85U open box at a decent price, but had fallen for the 800U...if i cant talk them down on the price of the 800U at all i may go for one of the AVS online locations you suggested.

Thanks very much for taking the time to answer!!

ONe big consideration for me is screen glare. I like the Samsung A650 but apparently the Panny's have better anti-glare coatings.

My questions: is the anti-glare coating on the 50PZ85u, 50PZ80U and 50PZ800U the same?

I'm having trouble reconciling how the 800U can be worth the extra money.