I'm planning on getting a new sub soon and I've been looking primarily at SVS because they are one of the few Internet Direct brands with a Canadian distributor. I want something that goes fairly deep with a nice flat frequency response, but I am unlikely to play it very loud. I have 3 young children that sleep directly above the room that I watch TV in, so I tend to listen at low to moderate volume most of the time, about -30dB on my Denon 1909. My usage is probably 80% TV, 10% movies, and 10% gaming although movies are what I most care about for audio. My room is 14'x11'x8', but there is a 10'x6'8" opening on one side that opens out to a 14'x25'x8' room and an open stairway to the upstairs. I was initially looking at the PB10-NSD (about $640 shipped), but I might be able to increase my budget a bit to get the PB12-NSD ($840).

I realize that given the total cubic feet of the main room and adjoining room, neither is likely to pressurize the space. Given that assumption, and given that I'm not often going to turn the volume up high, would there be much point in spending an extra $200 on the PB12-NSD? I don't want to have regrets in the future, but I also don't want to spend an extra $200 if there would be little perceptible difference in my situation.

I doubt the two subs would sound very different when played at the same volume. They both will give you a reasonably flat frequency response to below 20hz. The primary difference would about 50% more output in favor of the 12. If you are certain you will not be playing loud, the 10 will serve you.

What happens in a few years when the kids are older, however? Will you (or they) want to play it louder?

At those levels, the PB10-NSD should be more than sufficient. The only reason you might want to go with the PB12-NSD is if there are times you can listen louder. I know for the most part you need to keep it down for the wife and kids. However, if there are times when the wife and kids are out and you get a chance to really crank it, it's good to know your sub can handle it. If you don't think you'll really have any opportunities (or the desire) to really let loose on occasion, I'd say save some dough and get the PB10-NSD. On the other hand, it really IS fun to turn the system up when no one is home, so if that appeals to you at all, you're probably better off with the PB12-NSD. Either way, you're getting a great sub!

I doubt the two subs would sound very different when played at the same volume. They both will give you a reasonably flat frequency response to below 20hz. The primary difference would about 50% more output in favor of the 12. If you are certain you will not be playing loud, the 10 will serve you.

What happens in a few years when the kids are older, however? Will you (or they) want to play it louder?

LOL, in a few years...

Mike, it's gotta be hard to even suggest that with a straight face considering the furious pace at which we are capable of upgrading subwoofers ;)

(LOL) We oldtimes have learned how addictive good bass is once you taste it.

It is entirely possible that it may get played louder in the future, but my youngest is under a year old right now so that future could be a very long time away. One possible plan I've considered would be to add a second sub in this distant future. If I were to do that, would two PB10-NSD's be able to pressurize my large space? Could two PB12-NSD's do it? Or would I likely just need to get something larger if I wanted more in the future?

With an open room, I wouldn't expect true pressurization with any combo. Pressurization is not required for satisfying bass, however.

Yes, you can add multiples at a later time for greater output.

It is entirely possible that it may get played louder in the future, but my youngest is under a year old right now so that future could be a very long time away. One possible plan I've considered would be to add a second sub in this distant future. If I were to do that, would two PB10-NSD's be able to pressurize my large space? Could two PB12-NSD's do it? Or would I likely just need to get something larger if I wanted more in the future?

I've actually had a single PB10 and gone to two PB10's in the past and I can say firsthand that the second PB10 made a big difference. Unfortunately, through prolonged exposure to this evil forum as well as simply being introduced to great, deep bass, I eventually wanted more than even two PB10's could offer and upgraded to something larger entirely, an Epik Castle. I think the "possible plans" you've laid out for yourself are quite plausible. In hindsight, it would have been cheaper in the long run to go straight to the Castle instead of going with a second PB10 first, but the second PB10 was easier on the wallet at the time.

A second sub considerably increases headroom. It allows for a good deal more output and also can improve the quality of bass by allowing each sub to work less hard for a given output level, increasing linearity and reducing dynamic compression and distortion. However, what adding a second sub does NOT do (in my experience) is make an absolute "night and day" improvement. It is certainly noticeable and is well worth it in my opinion, but you won't go from "eh, this bass is ok I guess..." to "holy crap, I can't believe this!" just by going from one PB10 to two. What WILL do that is upgrading to something like a PB13 Ultra.

Overall, that is way down the line and I honestly wouldn't worry too much about it right now. Given your current circumstances, a single PB10 or PB12 would be fine. You might want to check into sonic boom's return policy. I think the PB10-NSD is plenty, but if you could take it home and try it out with little to no risk that would be ideal just in case it turns out you really COULD benefit from the more powerful PB12-NSD. Best of luck to you.

Just throwing this out there. The PC12-NSD would be comparable with the PB12-NSD, but is $50 less, at least on SVS's website. I don't know for sure about your Canadian distributor. That would take the cost difference down to $150 though. It also takes up less floor, which may or may not be of benefit to you. Just something to consider. Good luck with your decision.

Just throwing this out there. The PC12-NSD would be comparable with the PB12-NSD, but is $50 less, at least on SVS's website. I don't know for sure about your Canadian distributor. That would take the cost difference down to $150 though. It also takes up less floor, which may or may not be of benefit to you. Just something to consider. Good luck with your decision.

I was thinking the same thing and almost recommended it but I checked Sonic Boom's website and the prices for the PB12-NSD and PC12-NSD are identical. That said, there's still the option of which form factor is more appealing...

I was thinking the same thing and almost recommended it but I checked Sonic Boom's website and the prices for the PB12-NSD and PC12-NSD are identical. That said, there's still the option of which form factor is more appealing...

Definitely. Do you think he would be able to negotiate at all since it's marked down on the SVS site?

(LOL) We oldtimes have learned how addictive good bass is once you taste it.

I'm sure I don't know what you are talking about ;).

I've actually had a single PB10 and gone to two PB10's in the past and I can say firsthand that the second PB10 made a big difference. Unfortunately, through prolonged exposure to this evil forum as well as simply being introduced to great, deep bass, I eventually wanted more than even two PB10's could offer and upgraded to something larger entirely, an Epik Castle. .

LOL, LaLaker. Didn't you say you were a young guy? Imagine then what you will have by the time you are say, I dunno, 40 yrs old? :eek:

Thanks for all the help. I have a couple of nice big spots that I could put a box subwoofer and I'm not sure I like the cylinder look anyways. I think I'll stick with the PB10-NSD based on what you all are saying. Maybe I'll start saving up some more money too, and by the time my kids are older and the upgrade bug bites me I will have saved enough for a PB13-Ultra. :)

Thanks for all the help. I have a couple of nice big spots that I could put a box subwoofer and I'm not sure I like the cylinder look anyways. I think I'll stick with the PB10-NSD based on what you all are saying. Maybe I'll start saving up some more money too, and by the time my kids are older and the upgrade bug bites me I will have saved enough for a PB13-Ultra. :)

That sounds like a sensible way to go about it. The PB10-NSD is a great performer and will still be capable of enough output to disrupt the family if you decide to push it at the wrong times ;). I think you'll enjoy it a lot. Keep us updated!

LOL, LaLaker. Didn't you say you were a young guy? Imagine then what you will have by the time you are say, I dunno, 40 yrs old? :eek:

I dunno...is 23 young?

And I have no idea what I'll have when I'm 40. I could have a better system, or I could be wishing I'd saved the Castle's shipping box so I'd have a place to live :cool:. A lot can happen in 17 years...

I dunno...is 23 young?

And I have no idea what I'll have when I'm 40. I could have a better system, or I could be wishing I'd saved the Castle's shipping box so I'd have a place to live :cool:. A lot can happen in 17 years...

23 is pretty young. I've been messing around with home theater subs almost as long as you've been around.:eek: Like 20 years+.

Well, I ended up changing my mind and ordering the PB12-NSD after all. I decided another $200 is worth spending now since I plan on keeping the sub for a long time and might want some extra output in the future. Besides, I want to do my part to help stimulate the economy. :)

Well, I ended up changing my mind and ordering the PB12-NSD after all. I decided another $200 is worth spending now since I plan on keeping the sub for a long time and might want some extra output in the future.

Better to be safe than sorry :). I think you'll really like the PB12-NSD.

Besides, I want to do my part to help stimulate the economy. :)

Way to be a team player :D

I'm buying two PB12-NSD's after reading this thread. We have a basement dedicated theater room of modest size that had 3 Atlantic Technology THX Ultra 2 subwoofers (2 in front, one in back) that were here for many years before we moved into this house (long story) but they were workhorses while they lasted. Unfortunately, one completely blew a few weeks ago (woke up to blasting noise from the sub, it's fried) and another had been increasingly sounding distorted on some frequencies for quite some time and seems to be getting worse now that it's down to just the two.

Once the PB12's are here I'm going to move the last remaining Atlantic Tech sub to the back, and try the SVS's up front and see what i think.

Honestly, i knew subs could get pricey but have been a little surprised by the costs (for something worthwhile); this is actually going to be my first ever sub purchase because the Atlantic Technology's came with the house at a discount and before that i was not "doing subs" (i was not yet enlightened) - i want the best for my theater and the PB12's are about as high as i can go if i'm buying 2, so i am hoping not to be disappointed (SVS seems like they probably make better subs than Atlantic Technology ever did, otherwise i'd be hearing more about Atl Tech around here).

oleus