I'm debating picking up the Pioneer Pro-141FD or waiting for one of the Sony XBR9 series tvs with 240hz refresh rate.

My question is which one is better for sports? I'm sure this question may have been asked before and if you'd rather point me in the right direction than answer that's cool too.

I currently have a Sony KDL-40V2500 and I am annoyed by the pixels around the sports players. I was told by a rep in the Magnolia Best Buy center that I wouldn't have that problem with a plasma and that the refresh rate was something like 5x better on the Pioneer. I'm curious if this guy new what he was talking about.

Any help is greatly appreciated.

Joe

this site is in LOVE with anything kuro-esk plasma so sports is all about plasma, regardless. the best buy guy is right. for once.

By "pixels around the players" do you mean macroblocking, as in you're seeing pixel-shaped artifacts during fast movement?

If so, that's not your TV's fault. It's almost certainly source related. Cable/satellite providers are notorious for the issue, and no matter how good your TV is it's not going to make that problem go away.

Beyond that, any decent plasma will do just fine with sports, Pioneer included.

go for pioneer, XBR are overpriced and no matter what LCD offer in performance the off axis viewing angle is not going to better than plasma.

By "pixels around the players" do you mean macroblocking, as in you're seeing pixel-shaped artifacts during fast movement?
.

I do have Directv it's not during fast movement so it's not pixelating. It's just around the players like dots around them. Almost like an outline but not a clear or definite outline.

I just got a new TV and got a Plasma mainly because it's better at sports.

I own both a Panny 850U and I just got the Pioneer 5020. To say these TV's are over hyped is ridiculous. Words cannot express how good the Pioneer is. Once you get it in your home, I PROMISE you will be speechless and it is worth EVERY SINGLE PRAISE IT GETS.

I do have Directv it's not during fast movement so it's not pixelating. It's just around the players like dots around them. Almost like an outline but not a clear or definite outline.
That sounds to me like ringing, which is another artifact caused by excessive compression. The artifact is often described as "mosquito noise." Some sets have post processing options to mitigate it.

Does it look like this (http://content.answers.com/main/content/img/CDE/_MSQNOIS.JPG) (left side)?

No question about it...plasma is not only better for sports, but also for movies and games. The only advantage lcd has is that it's better suited as a pc monitor...which is why I have a 20" one in front of me right now.;)

Have you noticed that all lcd's have a really long laundry list of "features"? Those are actually a combination of useless marketing buzzwords and some legit technology that is trying to eliminate the flaws in the technology. Instead of dumping money into ways to increase viewing angles and motion blur....plasma makers have been concentrating on picture quality and panel life.

I say go for the 141FD or KRP-600M. Both are monitors.

Chris

That sounds to me like ringing, which is another artifact caused by excessive compression. The artifact is often described as "mosquito noise." Some sets have post processing options to mitigate it.

Does it look like this (http://content.answers.com/main/content/img/CDE/_MSQNOIS.JPG) (left side)?

That's exactly what it looks like. Will the Pioneer help reduce that? The Best Buy Salesman said it would but I didn't know if it was from the source and nothing can be done.

That's exactly what it looks like. Will the Pioneer help reduce that? The Best Buy Salesman said it would but I didn't know if it was from the source and nothing can be done.
It is from the source, a compression artifact.

The best advice I could give you would be to ask the salesman to show you a PDP with DirectTV hooked up to it, so you could see for yourself.

I personally observe fewer compression artifacts with my Pioneer (151), even with all the processing features disabled. In contrast, I find the LCDs -- at least those at the stores, so perhaps this is an unfair statement because those are always in torch mode -- that show digital cable feeds (which are invariably excessively compressed) look repulsive.

That's exactly what it looks like. Will the Pioneer help reduce that? The Best Buy Salesman said it would but I didn't know if it was from the source and nothing can be done.

No the TV can't reduce compression artifacts. They will always be there it is the source, DirectTV is super compressed. The only way a TV can hide that is if it has such a blurry picture that it blends it in. But then you will have a blurry picture.

I own both a Panny 850U and I just got the Pioneer 5020. To say these TV's are over hyped is ridiculous. Words cannot express how good the Pioneer is. Once you get it in your home, I PROMISE you will be speechless and it is worth EVERY SINGLE PRAISE IT GETS.
I promise many could be quite disappointed with ANY plasma (incl. Pioneer) if they are sensitive to the following issues:
- phosphor trails (visible on games or any fast movement of high contrast scene)
- strong ambient light reflections (annoying during day-light watching)
- high energy consumption
- high-pitched noise (technology related but many people don't even hear it)
- heat emissions (a no-issue if you have air-condition ;))
- picture burn-in (when using pillar box or letter box, issues with static elements in games such as speedometer, status bar etc.)

If you don't mind them than you are a happy plasma owner.
But until a better technology arrives (OLED?) I still prefer LCD :)

As a Kuro owner with extremely sensitive eyes and ears:

- phosphor trails (visible on games or any fast movement of high contrast scene)

I've never noticed even a hint of this on games or any other content.

- strong ambient light reflections (annoying during day-light watching)

On some models, agreed. It's very nearly a non-issue with the Elite's AR coating. Some LCDs are worse than many plasmas.

- high energy consumption

Sure, plasmas are more power hungry, but how much of a real-world difference are we talking? $5 a month maybe? And that's if you watch a lot TV.

- high-pitched noise (technology related but many people don't even hear it)

A definite possibility, but I wouldn't call it a common issue. My set buzzes but it can only be heard within a foot of the set.

- heat emissions (a no-issue if you have air-condition )


Eh, my stereo receiver gets much hotter than the TV does, and even it's not enough to affect the room temperature. It'd be nice if it did during the current season.

- picture burn-in (when using pillar box or letter box, issues with static elements in games such as speedometer, status bar etc.)

This should not be an issue at all on most modern plasmas as long as they were properly broken in. I've yet to see even a slight bit of it.

I agree with you that some of the issues are not that serious, I just wanted to list them all for completeness' sake.

Unfortunatelly (mainly for me) I can see the phosphor trails and, what's even worse - I better put up with the LCD smearing than this. And >=100Hz LCD deal with it reasonably well

You're right that some LCDs (Samsung) have worse screen reflections than some plasmas. I haven't yet decided what my future TV will be (I still watch an old Sony CRT) and still incline towards LCD, mainly some Sony again.

My screen will reside opposit a wall with several windows (the only possible place) and I watch a lot during daylight. So a matte Sony's screens seem to be much better option for me. What's your room layout and how well can Elite eliminate reflections on a dark screen (end credits for example) during a bright day?

Thank you

I've seen phosphor trails on older plasmas, but I can't say that I've ever seen the effect on a modern set, although I've only critically viewed the higher-end models.

As far as reflections go, I can't tell you how well an Elite would do in your room. What I can say is that during the day with the blinds open and every light turned on in my livingroom reflections are not a significant distraction. With direct light on the screen, you will get reflections, but they are far less drastic than on an average plasma. I actually (surpisingly) think that the Elite holds up better than my old DLP did under bright conditions. The DLP was essentially immune to reflections, but the picture would get washed out far more than the plasma does.

Just remember that direct light on ANY tv is very far from ideal, so which technology is the lesser of two evils in your environment is up to you.