If the "artificial torch mode" in LCD screens "suckers in" so many buyers at BB then why don't PDP makers add one too just for sales purposes?

Oh yeah I forgot, plasma screens are too dim for "torch mode". Sounds like a brightness limitation. That is like a political campaign tactic, use your opponents strength and turn it into a weakness.

Its only a weakness in the eyes of the uninformed who think torch mode is actually a strength.
Which unfortunatly is the majority of shoppers.
Bad for plasma.
Good for LCD.

Its kinda like going to a club and meeting a woman that stands out big-time. She is all flashy and bright.
But when you get her home and all alone, the wig comes off, the false teeth come out, and you notice she has bad breath.

Unfortunatly, This kind of woman stands out in the dark club when you have had a few drinks.
Just like the LCD's stand out in the showrooms with 5 times the amount of ambient light as a normal household.

Meanwhile, that average looking girl named "plasmary" you walked right past at the club was really a supermodel wearing glasses and very plain looking clothes.
The guy that took her home is a happy man because the best is yet to come for him!:D

Have you seen Auditor's latest argument? He is on all sides of every issue, so of course he can always point to what he accidently got right. He is like the guy at the racetrack who touts every horse in the race, and then brags about how he predicted the winner.

Here is Auditor making the exact opposite argument, to what he has been making about why SED is needed.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=15808437&highlight=#post15808437

You can't take my post out of context. The bottomline, Plasma is no longer novel, period. Plasma is a commodity. Plasma TV's are like buying a hamburger from Mcdonald's. A Pioneer TV is a hamburger with "Grey Poupon" on it with high price. No one is willing to pay a high price for a hamburger.

In other words, the thrill is gone for plasma.

On the other hand, SED, just like the Apple Ipod, same concept here, Nano technology. Is new and exciting. New technology always come at a higher price initially. As told you before, the folks behind SED already cracked the secret to making low cost SED sets, but not initially.

In other words, the thrill is gone for plasma.

.

no its not.
Pioneer was a small piec of the pie when it comes to plasma.
And Vizio was not even worth mentioning IMO.

The thrill is still alive and kicking.
Heck everyone that I know that has bought a plasma has been thrilled and still is.

"Five Guys Burger and Fries"??
$4-$6 for just a burger and they have a thriving business. ;)
Some people are more than willing to pay for quality, many aren't.

I am so glad I pulled the trigger on my 5020 when I did....just an amazing diaplay.
I do have hope for OLED, but SED seems completely dead.

no its not.
Pioneer was a small piec of the pie when it comes to plasma.
And Vizio was not even worth mentioning IMO.

The thrill is still alive and kicking.
Heck everyone that I know that has bought a plasma has been thrilled and still is.

You really believe that?

Fujitsu
Sony
Vizio
Pioneer
Toshiba (I don't know if that's official, but I haven't seen a Toshiba plasma in a long time)
Phillips
NEC

All bit the dust plasma dust. Who's next, will it be Lg, Samsung or Panasonic?

Personally I believe Lg will be next, then Samsung and Panasonic will be the last company standing.

"Five Guys Burger and Fries"??
$4-$6 for just a burger and they have a thriving business. ;)
Some people are more than willing to pay for quality, many aren't.

I am so glad I pulled the trigger on my 5020 when I did....just an amazing diaplay.
I do have hope for OLED, but SED seems completely dead.

Most people that overspend because of perceived "better" quality are usually egomanical and wasteful.

Most people that overspend because of perceived "better" quality are usually egomanical and wasteful.

So, when you recently said, when asked how much would you be willing to pay for a 55inch 1080P SED display, and you replied: "the sky is the limit" you were just being "egomanical and wasteful". Good to see you coming clean. Confession is good for the soul.

Most people that overspend because of perceived "better" quality are usually egomanical and wasteful.

What do you call the people that wisely spend a little more to get real meat and fresh buns that taste 10x better than a burger from a competitor that only costs a little less?
Smart People is what I call them.

What do you call the people that wisely spend a little more to get real meat and fresh buns that taste 10x better than a burger from a competitor that only costs a little less?
Smart People is what I call them.

Amen to that. However, those fries can really add to the waistline if you don't watch it, especially the ones in the bag and not the cup!

On the other hand, SED, just like the Apple Ipod, same concept here, Nano technology. Is new and exciting. New technology always come at a higher price initially. As told you before, the folks behind SED already cracked the secret to making low cost SED sets, but not initially.

Replace "new" with "dead" and you'll have it about right.

You really believe that?
.

Of course i do!
The Television on the market right now with the best possible picture quality is a plasma. Thats a fact bud. Reviewers and calibrators confirm.

To be honest, I could care less what tech makes the best TV, I only care about picture quality.
Maybe yourself and the other first time buyers could care less about picture quality, but there are alot of us that do.

Oh and by the way, If your consider plasma a dead and pointless tech, then why do you talk about it so much and post in the plasma forum so much?

Its only a weakness in the eyes of the uninformed who think torch mode is actually a strength.


Not to agree with Auditor (who I honestly think is pretty clueless about all this), but the extra brightness headroom you get with LCD is a strength, not a weakness. Some ppl have set-ups where they need the ability to go brighter. Such as daytime viewing in a room with floor-to-ceiling glass, for example.

Plasma has a lot of strengths- motion, blacks, viewing angles. But LCD has its strengths as well, and if you want to be balanced, you have to recognize those alongside plasma's.

What the LCD makers are doing (successfully, it appears) is minimizing their own weaknesses vs plasma (240+Hz, LED) while maintaining their strengths. If plasma wants to thrive, they need to do the same. Which is why Panasonic's new brighter plasmas are pretty important- they take away an LCD strength by matching it.

It's easy to sit back and yell "LCD is crap!". But it isn't helpful. What is going to make a difference is smart moves in both the technology and marketing of plasmas.

You can't take my post out of context. The bottomline, Plasma is no longer novel, period. Plasma is a commodity. Plasma TV's are like buying a hamburger from Mcdonald's. A Pioneer TV is a hamburger with "Grey Poupon" on it with high price. No one is willing to pay a high price for a hamburger.

In other words, the thrill is gone for plasma.

On the other hand, SED, just like the Apple Ipod, same concept here, Nano technology. Is new and exciting. New technology always come at a higher price initially. As told you before, the folks behind SED already cracked the secret to making low cost SED sets, but not initially.

Look Auditor, I like your enthusiasim for SED, hell I wish it came out already! You can't honestly say that they "cracked the secret to making low cost SED sets". If they cracked it, then how come SEDs haven't hit the market yet? I was hoping that Canon was going to make an announcement at this years CES, but unfortunately they didn't.:(

It's easy to sit back and yell "LCD is crap!".

Noone said it was crap.
I actually like some LCD's.

If I had to settle with an XBR8, I think I might be ok if I stayed away from sports and movies. So I in no way do I think they are crap.
In fact I own two LCD's and love them. They work great as computer monitors.

I know the brightness of LCD is a strength to some people.
But to myself and most people that like thier TV accurate and adjusted properly, its not.

51fl is more than enought overall brightness for a normal household.

I hear from alot of LCD owners that when they get the LCD home they calibrate it and turn down the backlight.
I find that very strange. It basically takes away the brightness "advantage".

They could have just got themselves a plasma and got the same thing minus motion,viewing angles,blooming,and other issues.

^ I don't think you're quite as technology-agnostic as you maintain, but at least you're trying. :cool:

who I honestly think is pretty clueless about all this

Clueless about what? You know that's pretty laughable. You're only on your 553rd post and I have over 6k, I've probably had more post deleted:D than you have total post.

You really should read how I predicted what you see happen right now. I was attacked and mocked by many of the usual fanboys around here, but now you see what's happening.

Clueless about what? You know that's pretty laughable. You're only on your 553rd post and I have over 6k, I've probably had more post deleted:D than you have total post.

You really should read how I predicted what you see happen right now. I was attacked and mocked by many of the usual fanboys around here, but now you see what's happening.


Now that's a pretty incredible line...."I've had more posts deleted than you've got total posts"....wow...I couldn't stop laughing:D

Look Auditor, I like your enthusiasim for SED, hell I wish it came out already! You can't honestly say that they "cracked the secret to making low cost SED sets". If they cracked it, then how come SEDs haven't hit the market yet? I was hoping that Canon was going to make an announcement at this years CES, but unfortunately they didn't.:(

According to what I have read, SED displays can be manufacturer at a low cost.

You don't see SED displays because of the down turn. If the econony rebounds, look out.


“In regards to SED, we have a new production process we’re working on which is cost competitive with liquid crystal displays.” Said the Company President, Tsuneji Uchida, to Financial Times."

Again, they have cracked the secret to low cost SED production.

I have to say that I'm starting to believe that plasma will be out the door in a few years. Samsung's heart is clearly for LCD and it wouldn't surprise me one bit if they gave up plasma after this year. I could see LG jumping ship to (although I'm not really sure how much of us really care one way or the other). So basically the way I see it is Samsung is the glue keeping plasma around. I personally believe plasma delivers the best PQ but to the manufacturers it's not about the best PQ, it's about profit. And apparently LCD is where the profit is. :(

On a side note what happened to Hitachi? I thought Pioneer, Panasonic, and Hitachi all had 5 lumen tech this year? I've not heard a thing about Hitachi yet.

According to what I have read, SED displays can be manufacturer at a low cost.

You don't see SED displays because of the down turn. If the econony rebounds, look out.


“In regards to SED, we have a new production process we’re working on which is cost competitive with liquid crystal displays.” Said the Company President, Tsuneji Uchida, to Financial Times."

Again, they have cracked the secret to low cost SED production.

You should be as sceptical of these comments as you were of all of Pioneer comments!

Yeah, new process. We will wait and see if that is really true or someone looking for some press. Maybe in a few years and it needs to be cost effective, etc. etc.

You really should read how I predicted what you see happen right now. I was attacked and mocked by many of the usual fanboys around here, but now you see what's happening.

ROTFL.

Yea, it takes a real psychic to "predict" that a company that has never made a profit from selling something might actually be forced to stop selling it in the future....

Some of you guys kill me!!!:D:D:D

Now that's a pretty incredible line...."I've had more posts deleted than you've got total posts"....wow...I couldn't stop laughing:D

I laughed too when I read it. I don't think Auditor understands that he didn't really compliment himself there... :D
.

You really should read how I predicted what you see happen right now. I was attacked and mocked by many of the usual fanboys around here, but now you see what's happening.


It maybe time to call Vince McMahon and the WWE..
I think with all the people that are crawling out of the woodwork and saying that "they" predicted it. Is that "they" should be put on PPV in either a cage match or a battle royal, and that only the winner gets to claim that they made the prediction...;)

I laughed too when I read it. I don't think Auditor understands that he didn't really compliment himself there... :D
.

I fully understand. Its called self deprecation.:)

I fully understand. Its called self deprecation.:)

Don't bother deprecating yourself. We'll do that for you. :D

Well, let's throw another shrimp on the barbie... LG's announced that they may soon be pulling out of plasma:

http://www.pocket-lint.co.uk/news/news.phtml/22612/23636/lg-considering-pulling-out-plasma-business.phtml
.

Deathwatch: Any predictions on which TV maker is going to be the next to either

a) pull out of plasma
b) fold altogether

:confused:

It's basically like a demolition derby out there right now. :eek:
.

Deathwatch: Any predictions on which TV maker is going to be the next to either

a) pull out of plasma
b) fold altogether

:confused:

It's basically like a demolition derby out there right now. :eek:
.


I vote for MITS if the LV(aka LEMONVUE) is the bust it appears that it is. Their lcds don't even appear on the radar(eventhough I have a 46231 that has been excellent) and with dlp going r.i.p., LV could be their last stand.

I vote for MITS if the LV(aka LEMONVUE) is the bust it appears that it is. Their lcds don't even appear on the radar(eventhough I have a 46231 that has been excellent) and with dlp going r.i.p., LV could be their last stand.

Yeah, totally agree. I think Mitsubishi would definitely be in the crosshairs.

I don't really get what they're even trying to do... what is their reason for being in the TV market anymore? What's their identity?

Let's see... they're one of two companies still making DLP, which is a dying, niche TV tech these days. Their LCDs don't seem to have an identity or advantage of any kind- Sammy and Sony are the premium makes, Sharp and Toshiba are the "we're almost as good as premium, but cheaper" makes, and then you have the budget brands. Where does Mits fit in?

Seems like they charge the premium prices like Sammy and Sony, but aren't seen as being as good. Viewing them in stores, I've never been particularly floored... good sets, but not good for the money they're asking.

Guess LaserVue was their way out, and with it being delayed and having manufacturing problems... whoops. Also- a $7,000 set being intro'd during a major worldwide economic downturn? Wow, awesome timing.
.

no its not.
Pioneer was a small piec of the pie when it comes to plasma.
And Vizio was not even worth mentioning IMO.

The thrill is still alive and kicking.
Heck everyone that I know that has bought a plasma has been thrilled and still is.My Vizio plasma 32" has it all over my Regza 42". Onward with plasma!

My Vizio plasma 32" has it all over my Regza 42".

Onward with plasma!

You do know that Vizio announced that they're leaving the plasma market, right? :(
.

You do know that Vizio announced that they're leaving the plasma market, right? :(
.


Vizio has seen the light:)

Yeah, totally agree. I think Mitsubishi would definitely be in the crosshairs.

I don't really get what they're even trying to do... what is their reason for being in the TV market anymore? What's their identity?

Let's see... they're one of two companies still making DLP, which is a dying, niche TV tech these days. Their LCDs don't seem to have an identity or advantage of any kind- Sammy and Sony are the premium makes, Sharp and Toshiba are the "we're almost as good as premium, but cheaper" makes, and then you have the budget brands. Where does Mits fit in?

Seems like they charge the premium prices like Sammy and Sony, but aren't seen as being as good. Viewing them in stores, I've never been particularly floored... good sets, but not good for the money they're asking.

Guess LaserVue was their way out, and with it being delayed and having manufacturing problems... whoops. Also- a $7,000 set being intro'd during a major worldwide economic downturn? Wow, awesome timing.
.

"Mitsubishi The Big Screen Company" Which is why their DLP sets start at 65 inches. LCD flat screens are not their specialty but if you must have flat they will sell you one. What they do well with LCD's are front projectors.

"Mitsubishi The Big Screen Company" Which is why their DLP sets start at 65 inches.

That's fine and well, but worldwide RPTV marketshare is now 0.2% (LCD, plasma, and CRT have 99.8%, combined). And there's only two makers left in that segment. :(

http://www.digitimes.com/news/a20090219PR200.html
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