I hoping to order a new receiver soon (the Sony STR-DA4400 to be exact). I'll be replacing my 9 year old receiver, which doesn't have a 5.1 channel input nor HDMI. I have been collecting SACDs for many years, even though I was only able to listen to them in 2ch. With the new receiver, I hope to start enjoying some of the multi-channel recordings I have. But, I have two setup options, and I wanted to get opinions on which might be preferred.

I have two players capable of multi-channel SACD playback. One is a Sony SCD-C222ES 5-disc changer with 5.1 output, and the second is a PS3 (a SACD capable model). Would it be better to use the SACD changer with the 5.1 analog into the receiver, or have the PS3 converting DSD to 5.1 PCM and sending it to the receiver over HDMI?

Thanks for any input. I'm looking forward to having this new capability.

HDMI is always preferable for multi-channel hi-res audio. Analog inputs will bypass the receiver's DSP and bass management, meaning that your speaker setup will also be bypassed, not to mention arguably inferior audio quality inherent with analog connects. Your Sony player is old, and so are it's D-A converters, meaning that better technology is certainly available.

As to using a PS3 for SACD, I can't help you there but converting to PCM over HDMI is not necessarily a bad solution. But in your situation, assuming a new player is out of the question, the thing to do is try both setups and decide for yourself.

I'd expect that having a good set of 5.1 well-matched and properly set up speakers will have a greater impact on your listening pleasure than any of the above variables.

Thanks for the tips. I do have a full set of matched speakers, that could be better, but that I'm quite happy with. For now, a new player is out of the question, as I wasn't anticipating buying a new receiver right now. Money has been supporting my car and photography hobbies lately, and the receiver dying was not a welcome development. But, when given lemons...

I will listen to both setups, but you do make a good point about my changer having old D/A converters. Thanks again.

Well assuming your new AVR has enough inputs, you can do both.

It has more inputs, than I will need, so it looks like I'll be all set. Thanks.

My advice would be to try both. The scd-c222es is a very good sounding player even though old.

My advice would be to try both. The scd-c222es is a very good sounding player even though old.

I agree, I am using an older sony dvp 999es with analog outs and it smokes my ps3 using hdmi.

I agree, I am using an older sony dvp 999es with analog outs and it smokes my ps3 using hdmi.

Interesting. Do you mind elaborating on what specifically you like about the 999ES output over the PS3?

Interesting. Do you mind elaborating on what specifically you like about the 999ES output over the PS3?

I have the 999es using analog outs and the ps3 using hdmi into an integra 9.8 pre/pro going to a classe cav150 with b&w matrix speakers. The difference between the two is mostly with 2 channel sacd's. The 999es has a more warm presentation compared to the ps3, please understand the ps3 is no slouch, but on my system when I want to listen criticly to cd or sacd the 999es just sounds better. One of my favorite comparison sacd's is pink floyd dark side of the moon both in 2 channel and multi channel, the 999es is much more solid in the bottom end, drums have more impact and the overall sound is more detailed.

HDMI is always preferable for multi-channel hi-res audio.Definitely may have its advantages, but it is not ALWAYS preferable. What is best varies from situation to situation.


Analog inputs will bypass the receiver's DSP and bass management, meaning that your speaker setup will also be bypassed.............Most hirez players have at least some sort of bass and time management for their analog outputs.


..........not to mention arguably inferior audio quality inherent with analog connects.What is inferior about analog audio interconnects?


Your Sony player is old, and so are it's D-A converters, meaning that better technology is certainly available.How "old" could an SACD player be?



.............you do make a good point about my changer having old D/A converters.No, he doesn't.

I have the 999es using analog outs and the ps3 using hdmi into an integra 9.8 pre/pro going to a classe cav150 with b&w matrix speakers. The difference between the two is mostly with 2 channel sacd's. The 999es has a more warm presentation compared to the ps3, please understand the ps3 is no slouch, but on my system when I want to listen criticly to cd or sacd the 999es just sounds better. One of my favorite comparison sacd's is pink floyd dark side of the moon both in 2 channel and multi channel, the 999es is much more solid in the bottom end, drums have more impact and the overall sound is more detailed.
Are the crossover points and slope identical in the player and the pre-pro? This would affect the bass output (from a little to a lot, depending on the settings).

Definitely may have its advantages, but it is not ALWAYS preferable. What is best varies from situation to situation.


Most hirez players have at least some sort of bass and time management for their analog outputs.


What is inferior about analog audio interconnects?


How "old" could an SACD player be?



No, he doesn't.
Thanks for posting your differing opinion. I do plan to run through the different setups myself. For two channel SACDs, I do plan to use my DVP-9000ES running to the receiver of some high quality analog audio interconnects. I have always found the output of that unti preferrable to the 222ES. I'm just asking the new multi-channel capability I'm looking forward to adding.

Are the crossover points and slope identical in the player and the pre-pro? This would affect the bass output (from a little to a lot, depending on the settings).

Great question, and one that I have no idea what the answer is, the 999es has since been moved to my dedicated 2 channel system and the ps3 will stay with the kids system. As far as just straight two channel cd or sacd (using no bass management) the 999es is a much better sounding player, does this mean the dac's in the 999es are better? Does it mean the analog output stage of the 999es is better than the one in the integra? I am not sure other than the fact is the 999es makes better sounding music.

Are the crossover points and slope identical in the player and the pre-pro? This would affect the bass output (from a little to a lot, depending on the settings).

Not only that, but the LFE setting in the Integra which is not universal will affect bass as well. This feature is rather misunderstood, and poorly explained in the manual too. [This of course would only matter with MCH tracks with dedicated LFE.] And then there is the Audessey, but he didn't say if he use that feature, which is not available on the external analog inputs BTW.

As far as just straight two channel cd or sacd (using no bass management) the 999es is a much better sounding player, does this mean the dac's in the 999es are better? Does it mean the analog output stage of the 999es is better than the one in the integra? It means you prefer the sound of the Sony, there is simply no overwhelming conclusion regarding the hardware in question that can be drawn based on your opinion, by any other person.

Just to provide an update. I got everything hooked up this weekend and did some preliminary listening. So far, the sound is quite similar between the PS3 and 222ES. I hope to have time for further tests next weekend. But, the preliminary results showed me the difference is not great, and the convience of the changer is not something I am paying a penalty for in the quality coming out of my setup.

I have recently received my new Arcam AVR 600 HDMI receiver and have been trying to set it up properly. Everything is going well except that I cannot get SACD's to play at all on my SACD capable PS3. I can access the regular cd layer on hybrids and play them in stereo but nothing on the SACD layers. Can anyone who is using a PS3 thru HDMI please give me their settings on the PS3 and any ideas why no signal plays thru on the Arcam - could it be an HDMI conflict with the monitor, etc? Thanks.

It means you prefer the sound of the Sony, there is simply no overwhelming conclusion regarding the hardware in question that can be drawn based on your opinion, by any other person.

It means the D/A converter on the Sony ES is better than that of the Integra.

What model PS3 do you have? The only ones that work with SACD are the original ones that came out the 20GB and 60GB. The newer 40, 80 and 120GB ones do not support SACD.

It means the D/A converter on the Sony ES is better than that of the Integra.
No. It means that with his gear, set up the way it is currently, he prefers the sound from one configuration over another. There is not anywhere near enough information available in the posts (or even with his set up) to draw the unequivocal conclusion you've made.

What model PS3 do you have? The only ones that work with SACD are the original ones that came out the 20GB and 60GB. The newer 40, 80 and 120GB ones do not support SACD.
There is also an 80 GB model that plays SACD (I own one) but it is no longer in production.

The PS3 I own is a CECHE01 model which is 80gb and does indeed support SACD and if fact has the SACD logo printed right on the machine. It shows 176khz output coming into the receiver but no sound - it has been suggested that I change the HDMI output from auto to manual and disable the 176 khz output - any ideas?? Thanks.

It means the D/A converter on the Sony ES is better than that of the Integra.No, it doesn't.

No. It means that with his gear, set up the way it is currently, he prefers the sound from one configuration over another. There is not anywhere near enough information available in the posts (or even with his set up) to draw the unequivocal conclusion you've made.
Exactly.

The PS3 I own is a CECHE01 model which is 80gb and does indeed support SACD and if fact has the SACD logo printed right on the machine. It shows 176khz output coming into the receiver but no sound - it has been suggested that I change the HDMI output from auto to manual and disable the 176 khz output - any ideas?? Thanks.

What's the model of receiver you're trying to connect it to?

PS3 is connected by HDMI to an Arcam AVR 600.

My friend has an ARCAM receiver, and it doesn't support any audio over HDMI. I'm not sure which model his is, but are you sure yours supports HDMI 1.3? His is only 1.0.