Ok, I'm finally getting my home theater room underway and I have some questions regarding IR products. I have a separate room adjacent to the theater room for all of the household AV/Networking gear. I see IR kits with a single receiver and multiple emitters but if I have a Harmony remote, why can't I just have a single receiver and a single emitter pointed at my rack in the other room? Wouldn't it function the same as if I had the remote in the room pointed at the rack? I can't see paying a hundred bucks for what is essentially just extending my remote, but maybe I am over-simplifying it all.

If it is possible, can someone point me in the direction of some decent yet affordable products? Or if there is another thread that explains it, that would be helpful as well, I couldn't find one.


Thanks
J

Ok, I'm finally getting my home theater room underway and I have some questions regarding IR products. I have a separate room adjacent to the theater room for all of the household AV/Networking gear. I see IR kits with a single receiver and multiple emitters but if I have a Harmony remote, why can't I just have a single receiver and a single emitter pointed at my rack in the other room? Wouldn't it function the same as if I had the remote in the room pointed at the rack? I can't see paying a hundred bucks for what is essentially just extending my remote, but maybe I am over-simplifying it all.

If it is possible, can someone point me in the direction of some decent yet affordable products? Or if there is another thread that explains it, that would be helpful as well, I couldn't find one.


Thanks
J

A receiver is a device which, as you might imagine, receives the IR signal and relays it to your equipment. The receiver is what you point your remote at. This is the costly part of the package.

Emitters are very inexpensive, and come in single, double, and triple varieties. Essentially an IR repeater system consists of 3 components:

An IR receiver, a connecting block, and IR emitters (also called blasters). The receiver is connected by a wire (either the supplied wire if the run is short enough, or cat5 for longer runs) to a connecting block. The connecting block is plugged into an outlet. A connecting block has mini-jack inputs for IR emitters. The emitters get plugged into the connecting block on one end via mini-jack, and the other end gets stuck onto the IR sensor of the component you are trying to control.

The most popular brands of repeater systems are Xantech and Hot Link. A google search of either of these brands should further your education, and help you choose the right product. I personally use a Xantech system, with a 4-input connecting block. The cost was somewhere around $100. I'm sure you can get systems for a bit less, but I have a long run and Xantech is very reliable.

Depending on what Harmony remote you have, and what type of batteries it uses, you may want to check out a product from Next Generation that converts IR remotes into RF remotes, so you can do everything wirelessly and inexpensively. However, Next Gen is not compatible with all remotes, and I believe you are limited to one mini-jack input for IR emitters (which means you are essentially limited to three emitters). The base, however, is also an IR blaster, so you may be able to get away with it. Again, you can google Next Generation RF and you'll be able to see if it will work in your application.

Personally, I think if it's easy to do a wired connection (as it sounds like it would be in your setup), wired IR repeaters are the most reliable, fool proof method.

Thanks for the info


The emitters get plugged into the connecting block on one end via mini-jack, and the other end gets stuck onto the IR sensor of the component you are trying to control.

I remember this type of setup a while ago when I needed my Tivo to change channels on a cable box. Why is it though that with the Harmony remote, when I press "Watch TV" and that blasts out the IR codes in sequence to turn on the TV, Receiver, etc. that I can't just have a single emitter a couple feet away from the rack and have it control all the devices? If my remote would normally be powerful enough to perform this action if all the devices were 15 feet away from the seating area in the room - don't they make an emitter that is at least powerful enough to do the same thing from a couple feet away from the rack?

It seems a bit ugly to be sticking a bunch of little emitters to each device instead of just a single one on the opposite wall or something. And yes - the wiring is easy, I'd prefer to keep it a wired setup.

Something like this should work: http://www.xantech.com/files/manuals/127_39020_manual.pdf

You could use the setup as illustrated in Figure 1 (no connecting block required).

Ok, yeah that's more what I was thinking of. Reading the PDF, it mentions "not all devices are compatible" short of buying it and finding out it doesn't work, how do you know what devices are compatible? Or is that just a standard disclaimer and in your experience it works with most everything?

Thanks for the info

I remember this type of setup a while ago when I needed my Tivo to change channels on a cable box. Why is it though that with the Harmony remote, when I press "Watch TV" and that blasts out the IR codes in sequence to turn on the TV, Receiver, etc. that I can't just have a single emitter a couple feet away from the rack and have it control all the devices? If my remote would normally be powerful enough to perform this action if all the devices were 15 feet away from the seating area in the room - don't they make an emitter that is at least powerful enough to do the same thing from a couple feet away from the rack?

It seems a bit ugly to be sticking a bunch of little emitters to each device instead of just a single one on the opposite wall or something. And yes - the wiring is easy, I'd prefer to keep it a wired setup.

I dont have experience with emitters, but Im pretty sure I perceive the technology OK.

I follow what you are saying as far as having your Harmony IR remote control 3-4 devices from your seating position (couch). The thing is, you are probably 10-15 feet away from these devices so the Line of Sight or "blasting" radius of the IR emitter in your remote allows it to control all of these devices. Once you put your equipment in a closet, an IR emitter is likely going to be closer to 4-6" or closer to your equipment. Try putting your remote 6" from your TV and pressing the same activity - im pretty certain the IR's range from the Harmony isnt going to reach your STB or DVD player, or whatever other devices. This causes the need for you to have separate emitters for each device in the closet rack.

Someone with more knowledge on the subject, please correct me if Im wrong.

Ok, yeah that's more what I was thinking of. Reading the PDF, it mentions "not all devices are compatible" short of buying it and finding out it doesn't work, how do you know what devices are compatible? Or is that just a standard disclaimer and in your experience it works with most everything?I've never used this IR blaster, but I would bet it will work fine unless you have some devices that use an oddball frequency .I use the "ugly" stick on emitters.;)

drvnbysound - Right, I would agree that I couldn't put a single emitter a couple inches from the rack and expect it to control everything. I was hoping that placing the emitter a couple of feet away (2-3) would work though.

I'm not opposed to the separate emitters, it just adds more wires and little parts hanging off stuff - not as clean of a look. I also thought perhaps a single reciever/emitter would be cheaper than a multi setup.

Looking at the xantech website - they have TONS of different products but it doesn't look like you can buy direct? I see Smarthome on google for their products, is that a decent source?

drvnbysound - Right, I would agree that I couldn't put a single emitter a couple inches from the rack and expect it to control everything. I was hoping that placing the emitter a couple of feet away (2-3) would work though.

I'm not opposed to the separate emitters, it just adds more wires and little parts hanging off stuff - not as clean of a look. I also thought perhaps a single reciever/emitter would be cheaper than a multi setup.

Looking at the xantech website - they have TONS of different products but it doesn't look like you can buy direct? I see Smarthome on google for their products, is that a decent source?I have gotten a lot of my xantech IR products here: http://www.garrett-smarthome.com/index.php

I have always been pleased with the service and prices.

drvnbysound - Right, I would agree that I couldn't put a single emitter a couple inches from the rack and expect it to control everything. I was hoping that placing the emitter a couple of feet away (2-3) would work though.

I'm not opposed to the separate emitters, it just adds more wires and little parts hanging off stuff - not as clean of a look. I also thought perhaps a single reciever/emitter would be cheaper than a multi setup.

Looking at the xantech website - they have TONS of different products but it doesn't look like you can buy direct? I see Smarthome on google for their products, is that a decent source?

Smart home is great - I get all my stuff from them.

I don't see a problem with individual emitters - it's definitely the most reliable. You can barely see them (the wire runs underneath the back of the component). You could try just sticking one on the wall opposite the compnonent rack - it may emit a signal strong enough to control everything.

Keep in mind that the emitters are the cheapest part of the system. A double emitter with visual feedback should only cost $10.

I see IR kits with a single receiver and multiple emitters but if I have a Harmony remote, why can't I just have a single receiver and a single emitter pointed at my rack in the other room? Wouldn't it function the same as if I had the remote in the room pointed at the rack? I can't see paying a hundred bucks for what is essentially just extending my remote, but maybe I am over-simplifying it all.

If it is possible, can someone point me in the direction of some decent yet affordable products? Or if there is another thread that explains it, that would be helpful as well, I couldn't find one.


I have this remote extender (http://www.amazon.com/gp/redirect.html?ie=UTF8&location=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.amazon.com%2Fgp%2Fproduct%2FB000C1 Z0HA%2Fsr%3D8-1%2Fqid%3D1154968916%2Fref%3Dpd_bbs_1%2F104-8479880-9721508%3Fie%3DUTF8&tag=5336055023-20&linkCode=ur2&camp=1789&creative=9325). It'll work with most remotes, including Harmony remotes that DON'T use a rechargeable battery pack. I have the receiver placed in the line of sight of the components on the rack in my basement and without using any emtter cables it can flash them all easily.

The transmitter resides in the battery compartment of your remote (as opposed to other two piece remote extenders you may have seen) so there's no line of sight requirement from the room you're controlling from.

drvnbysound - Right, I would agree that I couldn't put a single emitter a couple inches from the rack and expect it to control everything. I was hoping that placing the emitter a couple of feet away (2-3) would work though.

I'm not opposed to the separate emitters, it just adds more wires and little parts hanging off stuff - not as clean of a look. I also thought perhaps a single reciever/emitter would be cheaper than a multi setup.

Looking at the xantech website - they have TONS of different products but it doesn't look like you can buy direct? I see Smarthome on google for their products, is that a decent source?

Depending on the emitter, you can place it a few feet away. I think that maybe the reason most IR distribution emitters are designed to stick right next to each component is because usually the components are hidden away in a closet or other room. So the precision of placement takes precident over looks (since nobody sees it anyway). Either way, the emitters are dirt cheap ... the cheapest part of an IR dist. system.

I have found the cheapest IR distribution components at www.a1components.com I use their plasma proof targets along with their 4 emitter hub.


I have this remote extender (http://www.amazon.com/gp/redirect.html?ie=UTF8&location=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.amazon.com%2Fgp%2Fproduct%2FB000C1 Z0HA%2Fsr%3D8-1%2Fqid%3D1154968916%2Fref%3Dpd_bbs_1%2F104-8479880-9721508%3Fie%3DUTF8&tag=5336055023-20&linkCode=ur2&camp=1789&creative=9325). It'll work with most remotes, including Harmony remotes that DON'T use a rechargeable battery pack. I have the receiver placed in the line of sight of the components on the rack in my basement and without using any emtter cables it can flash them all easily.

The transmitter resides in the battery compartment of your remote (as opposed to other two piece remote extenders you may have seen) so there's no line of sight requirement from the room you're controlling from.

The Next Gen extenders are great. This is definitely the easiest and cheapest option, and they really are quite reliable. The fact that you don't even need a line of sight to a target makes it even better. Its an amazing little product. I would still be using mine if I hadn't upgraded to a Harmony One. They need to come out with a Harmony One rechargeable battery version. I'd be all over that!

Vin - I have the Harmony 880, so it doesn't look like that option will work since the 880 uses it's own rechargables?

Thanks for the info everyone else - I'll check out the links and do some more research.

There is another option I'm looking into. Some A/V kit has IR "inputs." Essentially, you plug a mono-mini to mono-mini cable from the "blaster" to the IR input on the device. This eliminates the need for the stick-on emitters.

However, I'm having some difficulty getting a Monster/Harmony IR-repeater (omnilink) to work in this manner.

Anyone know anything about this option?

There is another option I'm looking into. Some A/V kit has IR "inputs." Essentially, you plug a mono-mini to mono-mini cable from the "blaster" to the IR input on the device. This eliminates the need for the stick-on emitters.

However, I'm having some difficulty getting a Monster/Harmony IR-repeater (omnilink) to work in this manner.

Anyone know anything about this option?

Why/how are you having problems.

3.5mm mono (or stereo - sometimes mono is hard to find) cable M to M.
Connect one end to extender and other end to back of component.

The IR input jack is totally passive.

The IR receiver in the device is a simple IR to electricity photocell. It converts the IR pulses sent by a remote to electrical pulses. The electrical pulses are measured and that is how the device "knows" what you want it to do.

The IR input simply eliminates the conversion from electricity -> IR (remote) -> IR window -> electricity.

It literally is nothing more than a 3.5mm jack wired in parallel to the IR window.

My only grief is that EVERY CE device doesn't have an IR input because the cost to implement in bulk is something like $0.10 per device.

I have my Onkyo-705 connected by cheap 3.5mm (minijack) stereo cable between the IR input and the 890 extender.

One thing to try:
Try using a stereo cable. Not sure why but some devices are expecting a stereo input. Seems foolish to me but I remember it worked for someone else. If you don't want to buy a stereo cable most cheap computer speakers use one to connect to soundcard so you may be able to try that first.