Brad - if you pull on one of those sconces, does it open a secret door somewhere?:)


Thanks to anyone who noticed and didnt point this out from the previously blurry pics.. it makes me feel like my efforts were somewhat sucessful so far.:D

One of the challenges I faced was balancing the symmetry of the room, for both the accoustical treatments and the sconces, due to the EQ room door.

So this was my work around...
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC05858.jpg
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC05856.jpg
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC05857.jpg

This door originally opened into the room and I had planned on communicating doors here. I figured that since this only went into the eq room I could eliminate the second door and just focus on a good seal without sacraficing any sound proofing efforts.. so I flipped the door, it now opens into the EQ. room.

I ended up sacraficing ~ 2" on the actual door height, and It may seem odd at this time where I chose to split the opening, but once the capitols, fluting and trim are on the seams and hinges will dissappear completely.

I still need to install an armoured door loop to get power to the sconces.

Here are a couple more shots of the work in process..
The door frame is 2 3/4" thick to accomodate the 2" perfsorber.
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC01396.jpg
Put in some 703 so I didnt have a hollow cavity
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC01397.jpg
Test fit to align the door skin with the wall panel
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC01387.jpg
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC01394.jpg

Mount the skin
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC01398.jpg
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC01399.jpg

Stop it! This is getting ridicules;). Really man this is quite impressive!

Brad, as usual, top notch work!

Are you worried about the carpet installers scratching up your beautiful wood work when they install the carpet? Maybe your carpet won't be as rigid as mine was, but my installers did mar up my door a little. They were worried about the fabric on my columns but I found some cardboard to shield the lower portion of the column and that worked out fine. Just something to think about.

Jeff.. Thats funny:D:D


Tom..Actually a close personnel friend and beer drinking buddy, (shown helping spread GG on the 1st page of the thread), owns a carpet store. He's the guy that helped carry all the sheet goods to the basement, and the one I call if I need a hand with something. He's got a lot of sweat in the room so also, If anyone is going to be careful.. it will be him.

Brad, I should have never doubted that you had a plan. :D

Old Thread Warning my ass. ;)

Looks gorgeous Brad - love that screen wall. Some fantastic creativity overall in the build. I haven't built the "wings" to mine yet, will after the screen is fitted - and this has me mulling ideas over. I've been concerned that just fitting a couple angled flat panels would look, well, flat. Hmm, what to do, what to do.

But...its kind of like reading a great book, wondering how its going to end, and then finding out someone ripped out the last chapter of the book. How does it end?? :D

I cant wait to see this when its all finished up...you gotta get some high res photos so we can all enjoy.

Brad / Matthew.. Thanks for the bump.. and the kick in the rear..:)

"Old Thread Warnings" have become an integral ingredient of this build thread.:rolleyes:

Brad - I'm sure whatever you decide for your side wings will look fantastic. Your theater has such clean lines that even a subtle details on the front will stand out.

I think working through the concept/design is the most enjoyable part of the build..

Matthew - I would settle for Low res photos of a completed theater at this point;)

Update:
I returned last week from 7 weeks in SE asia, and still recovering from the time change.

I received 3 full 4x8 sheets of perfsorber before I left, and started on the hush box. The hush box needs finished/mounted so I can complete the soffit face around the rear, and the perforber was needed to permanantly install the fabric frames and mound the sconces on the side walls.

Hopefully I'll post a couple pics in the next week or so... of something...:o

Brad

Welcome home! Man can only eat so many chickens feet, now open a good ole Miller Lite and have a few slices of your favorite pizza!

Welcome home! Man can only eat so many chickens feet, now open a good ole Miller Lite and have a few slices of your favorite pizza!

Bingo Dude!!! You've obviously been there!!

Its been several years since I ate chicken feet, I no longer feel the need to immerse myself completely in the local cuisine, but it is funny how I crave a pizza as soon as Im back.;)

Yep been there a few times, But never for that long of stint!

Brad - I'm sure whatever you decide for your side wings will look fantastic. Your theater has such clean lines that even a subtle details on the front will stand out.

Thanks Brad! I still have some extra vinyl and Chinchilla GoM, maybe I can figure out some way to utilize it into the side panels - without making it too much of a distraction. Hmm...

It's not a well known fact but Brad has been working night and day on his theater build and will soon be amazing us all with an immaculately executed and perfectly finished theater shortly before it appears on the cover of Home Theater Interiors....

... either that or he smoked one too many Thai peace pipe's on his recent trip and imagined it all :cool:

C'mon Brad, how about a picture or two of the hush box...

It's not a well known fact but Brad has been working night and day on his theater build and will soon be amazing us all with an immaculately executed and perfectly finished theater shortly before it appears on the cover of Home Theater Interiors....

... either that or he smoked one too many Thai peace pipe's on his recent trip and imagined it all :cool:

C'mon Brad, how about a picture or two of the hush box...

:eek: I was so excited after reading this post, I nearly fell down the steps running to see how the theater came out.

.....But alas it appears your second scenerio is most accurate:cool:





HushBox .. long story short.. (Latest entry to my "WTF" list of auspicious moments)

-Built "Beautiful oak box", sanded with love and carefully finished to match room.
-Basked in aura of light while admiring my craftsmanship.
-Hung Box, mounted projector and lens for test.
-Attempted to "shine an Image" -Result- bottom 12" of image cut off becasue front lip interfeared with "light beam".
-Interferance caused by combination of additional recess due to lens and lack of clearance due to desire to maintain head height under box.
-Proceded to "hack" out front of hush box with jig saw in not so graceful jet lagged fashion.. (ie.. box no longer beautiful, not picture worthy)


Post Mortum Root cause: poor planning combined with poor planning:rolleyes:

HushBox .. long story short.. (Latest entry to my "WTF" list of auspicious moments)

-Built "Beautiful oak box", sanded with love and carefully finished to match room.
-Basked in aura of light while admiring my craftsmanship.
-Hung Box, mounted projector and lens for test.
-Attempted to "shine an Image" -Result- bottom 12" of image cut off becasue front lip interfeared with "light beam".
-Interferance caused by combination of additional recess due to lens and lack of clearance due to desire to maintain head height under box.
-Proceded to "hack" out front of hush box with jig saw in not so graceful jet lagged fashion.. (ie.. box no longer beautiful, not picture worthy)


Post Mortum Root cause: poor planning combined with poor planning:rolleyes:

This really sounds like something I would do. I've managed to avoid it so far, but I think I'm coming to the part of my build where my attempts to build things without proper planning and my attitude of if it doesn't work or fit right I'll fix it later is going to get the best of me.

Your build is over the top amazing. Awesome work. By the way, what happened to the sidelights in the side pillars - It looks like it has been replaced with GOM or something.

KNKKNK - just saying your skills are great and very nice build.

-Mike, Thank you!

-SM2000, The sconces will be mounted over the GOM panels between the columns, I'm just waiting on the elves to show up and finish the accoustical treatments behind the GOM.:rolleyes:

Besides saving my thread from the archives of obscurity, I just wanted to take the opprotunity to say:

after paying almost $9 a foot, + investing a couple of hours of finish work in this 12' piece of oak.....


http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/100.jpg


making an upside down and backwards cut on a compound angle ..... always makes my butt pucker....:cool:

Hopefully it wasn't a "Doh!!!" moment. I cant even find my thread anymore, who knows where it's off to. I've made a bit of progress, but have kind of resided to updating it when it's done, for real. May never happen, I suppose.

making an upside down and backwards cut on a compound angle ..... always makes my butt pucker....:cool:

Measure once and cut twice .... or is it the other way around :confused:

I don't have the guts to make that cut with my $2 pieces! LOL

Hey, we can shamelessly bring each others threads back from the black hole. I looked back about 6 pages and didn't see mine so I quit looking. :)

I sort of feel the same. There's not much to show until I'm done. Unfortunately, cutbacks at work and a possible career change have put a hold on my spending. All I really needed was carpet and countertops. Oh well...we'll enjoy it this way until things change.

I'm trying to do little things that take time but not money. There's enough of those!

Hopefully it wasn't a "Doh!!!" moment.

Nope.. actually it turned out to be a "WTF!!!" moment. I had purcahsed 5 sticks of the crown many moons ago, Stained 4 of them to use for the theater. 2 had been put up already in the front of the room, and this was one of the ones for the rear. After I measured and made the first cut on this piece, I discovered that there was a signifigant difference in the profiles in 2 of the 5 pcs.

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC06438.jpg

This made joining/mitering or even coping to the pieces already installed impossible to any acceptable standards...:( So I had to take down one of the pieces I already had up and use it in the back on one side.. then stain the last piece and use the 2 with the smaller profile on the other side... Kinda one of those 2 steps foward one step back things..

Measure once and cut twice .... or is it the other way around :confused:

For this trim I was "sneaking" up on so it was more like.. cut 14 times.. with 14 trips from the basement to the saw.. I got calves like a chorus line dancer from going up and down the stairs:rolleyes:

I don't have the guts to make that cut with my $2 pieces! LOL

Hey, we can shamelessly bring each others threads back from the black hole. I looked back about 6 pages and didn't see mine so I quit looking. :)

I sort of feel the same. There's not much to show until I'm done. Unfortunately, cutbacks at work and a possible career change have put a hold on my spending. All I really needed was carpet and countertops. Oh well...we'll enjoy it this way until things change.

I'm trying to do little things that take time but not money. There's enough of those!

I hear ya.. I found my thread entering the black hole and grabbed it at the event horizon about a 1/2 a dozen post from the bottom of page 8.... :o

I'm still trying to post updates as I go, however various delays, like the trim shown above keep postponing any signifigant updates and also like the trim it seems anything I touch lately heads south on me... Like this jar of Dye I had mixed up.. I spun around with a piece of wood in my hands and knocked it off on the floor...
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC06439.jpg
I now have a large Pink spot in the middle of the shop where it stained the concrete.

Anyway here are a few shots of the RGB strips in the soffits.. Its really cool in person.. the entire room glows whatever color its on ....

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/157.jpg
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/158.jpg
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/156.jpg

My soffits are nearly complete around the entire room and the Hush box is in... After I get a couple more pcs of wood stained/put up.. Ill post a real update

On a side note... if anybody has any pointers for taking decent pictures in a dark room I'd like to hear em.. I see alot of great looking screen shots and other pics that I am not able to get close to. Wifes got a decent Sony camera so Im pretty sure I'm just missing some basics on which setting to use..

Brad

Reuben (sandman) had the most stunning photography of his room. I can't even get close to replicating.

I remember seeing a tripod, low lights and a long shutter speed, something like 30 seconds to a minute plus.

Brad, those LED strips light your soffits up very nicely! Do you have any reflective material on the back of the crown or did you just drop them in? Do you have a link handy for the strip LED's?

I realize it's a bit late now, but what about shaving the thicker pieces of crown on a jointer?

Tony.. agreed great pics of his theater.. Ill venture to say they were done by a prfessional photographer with more than a $400 digital camera..:)

I remember seeing a tripod, low lights and a long shutter speed, something like 30 seconds to a minute plus.

I did get a tripod, and saw an immediate improvement in all my pics, but when i slowed down the shutter the pictures got "Grainy":confused:

Brad, those LED strips light your soffits up very nicely! Do you have any reflective material on the back of the crown or did you just drop them in? Do you have a link handy for the strip LED's?

Hello you lucky "Completed" theater owner you!!,

No reflective material.. the white/beige stone i used does a decent job of reflecting light + i only ended up with a 1/4" reveal in front of the leds so my "lighting channel" is not that deep either.

Here is the ebay seller I got the lights from.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Reel-5M-SMD-RGB-LED-Strip-Controller-US-Seller-_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem35aadf3e01QQitemZ230500023809QQp tZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories

The strip is fairly standard, the controller and remote are a little on the cheezy side.. but whad'a expect for 38$, and this was good enough for concept validation. (Actually the first controller I received was a dud but the seller sent a new one immediately)

I've not taked the time to look at the loads or anything so there is still alot to do to integrate the leds into a real controller. My thought process was that as the popularity of leds continue to increase, additional (simple)solutions for integration into lutron/creston/graphic eye etc, would become available.

I ran cat 6's to the area I have the transformer and controller hidden so I could possibley play around with a DMX controller, but this is moving to the far end of my to do list, in the "things to piddle with later" category.. worst case I think I can use rf via a remote, for changing modes/colors etc.

I think us hoosiers still need a meet sometime.. but Im afraid if I wait until my theater is complete we would all need one of those Stairlifts to get to the basement:o

Are you are planning on visiting Cedia this year, sept 7-10? (or any of you other AVSDIYER'S)

I realize it's a bit late now, but what about shaving the thicker pieces of crown on a jointer?

Good Idea, I can see where that would have worked. I had actually tried to shim out the bottom of the thinner piece since I was using a small crown stop, and the shim could be hidden. This got it fairly close, but I still wasnt satisfied. To be honest, I wasted more time trying find a "workaround" then it took to remove what I had done previously and match the different profiles up on each side.

I just have a few extra nail holes to fill now, but hey.. whats an extra 20 when your talking about ~ 10,000:rolleyes:

Tony.. agreed great pics of his theater.. Ill venture to say they were done by a prfessional photographer with more than a $400 digital camera..:)

Ya, I remember him saying that he was having a friend or someone he knew in the biz coming in to take some pro pics. He may have had a nice camera too though, and the initial shots may have been his own.



I did get a tripod, and saw an immediate improvement in all my pics, but when i slowed down the shutter the pictures got "Grainy":confused:




I have a Sony SLR and they struggle with low light pics. They really shine outdoors, but even with normal ambient light indoors my Sony tends to have that grainy effect at times unless I break out the flash attachment. I don't have a tripod but I'll see if I can play with it a bit this weekend and see if I produce a decent low light shot.

Im compensating for lack of speed with picture in this update.. I did manage to get past 2 items that had me spinning my wheels.. the hush box and the reveal on the bottom of the soffit..

For the past several months, only the front ~ 10ft of the soffits were started.

The rear still looked like this:
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC01215.jpg

Once I built and mounted the hush box.. I finished the "boxes" for the rear soffits..

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/0702.jpg

I also added these little, "side wings" for the hush box.. the intake air for the hush box comes in through the little vents in the bottom of the wings..

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/067-Copy.jpg

You can see on this side where I either missed measured or Mis cut the length of the side box and had to add a 1/2" spacer:confused:

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/055-Copy.jpg
Note: the hack job on the front lip of the hushbox.. had to scrap the front plate that held the glass from edmonds.. Ill remake it later..

Next I finished running the stone/crown/ and corbels around to the hush box..

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/1382.jpg

Finished up another batch of wood....

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/1252.jpg

Put up an 8" wide strip with a 2" reveal around the room..

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/1292.jpg
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/1322-1.jpg

I wanted to build up the front of the reveal to add a little "meat" to the bottom of the soffit .. so I added another piece of trim at the front edge

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/059.jpg

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/1482.jpg

Then I used an 1 1/2" 1/2 round to finish off the front.. I lined it up with the cut in the other trim to get ~ 1/4 lip.. this worked out great for hiding the led strip without obscuring too much of the corbels..

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/088.jpg

Happy with the way this came out.. it makes for a nice clean line around the bottom...

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/082.jpg

Front.

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/094.jpg

Rear Corner:

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/122.jpg

Heres where it meets the side wing on the hush box
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/134.jpg

Notice the little panel in the side wing in the pic above..
Behind this is where I hid the transformer/controller for the RGB strips.

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/133.jpg

Still need to trim out the top of the hush box too..


Probably a list of reasons why I should not have done this.. but I divided the hush box into 2 compartments.. the rear one(shown without the divider) houses the "Cool Cube". I took this approach instead of building an access into the bottom of the soffits and placing it in there. Funny thing is since it moved the projector foward ~ 3 inches.. if I had done this first I wouldnt have needed to cut the front lip off of the box and scrap the portal plate..:rolleyes:

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/129-1.jpg


The cool cube is dual speed, you can see the thermal sensor near where the exhaust for the projector is, it kicks it on automatically once temp get up.
Still lots to do inside the box. lining etc..


http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/139.jpg

More to come eventually...:cool:
Movies by Christmas hopefully.... (yes Moggie.. This christmas!!:D)

Brad

Wow. :eek::eek:

That's almost exactly the way I did mine!

Except, of course, for the part about the awesome woodwork, corbels, stone, crown, reveal, hush box, cool cube and hidden vent. Well, and everything else that makes it look so great.

But other than that, it almost exactly like mine. Especially the part about having a PJ. That part is almost exactly the same for sure.

Definitely. Definitely.

http://i471.photobucket.com/albums/rr79/hanesian/05JoeBiden.jpg



<< skulks off in shame >>

Hello you lucky "Completed" theater owner you!!,

No reflective material.. the white/beige stone i used does a decent job of reflecting light + i only ended up with a 1/4" reveal in front of the leds so my "lighting channel" is not that deep either.

Here is the ebay seller I got the lights from.

You'd be done also if you weren't doing such a fricking detailed and beautiful job! :D For $38, I decided to order a set and see if I like them better than my blue led rope.

I am enjoying my theater but I did have a couple of issues I have been fighting, the biggest of which was my Emotiva amp shutting down. I don't want to pollute your thread too much but let's just say after much trial and error, I think I may have the intermittent shutdown problem solved. Short story - the Emotiva goes into protect mode when it sees a 3.5ohm load. My DIY speakers are "4 ohm nominal" but they do dip down to 3 ohms. Today, I hooked up two Carvin proamps to handle the front channels and I'll leave the Emotiva to handle the surrounds. Hope that does the trick!


I think us hoosiers still need a meet sometime.. but Im afraid if I wait until my theater is complete we would all need one of those Stairlifts to get to the basement:o

I think that would be cool! The meet not you in your depends on a stairlift. :D I'm about as far away from you I think while still being in Indiana. I'm in the southwest portion of the state, aren't you near Indy?

Are you are planning on visiting Cedia this year, sept 7-10? (or any of you other AVSDIYER'S)

No not me, no sense looking at more stuff that I shouldn't be buying now. I need to replace the HVAC system next year, I would like a standby generator to protect the "theater & entertainment complex" and my wife will need a new car soon...

Keep up the good work and I'm sure you will be able to get some 12 year old to show you how to work all those new fangled gadgets you will have by the time you are finished! :p

I
More to come eventually...:cool:
Movies by Christmas hopefully.... (yes Moggie.. This christmas!!:D)


Cool. That was a fun read... and I thought I had a lot of trim! I can just about get a feel for how the room is going to turn out now. I recall you using the phrase "old library" many months, ahem, may years ago ;) As always, really great work!

How are you planning to finish the ceiling? I know at one point you were thinking about a star field -- painted? I was wondering about some very low profile coffers or picture frame like (BigMouth has some interesting detail on his ceiling). Another idea would be to faux paint so it looks like a dome.

As far as the cutout on the hush box, why not make another simple frame and fix over the front so that it hides the cutout and adds depth to the front of the box? May end up looking better than a flat front anyway.

Please don't make us wait as long for the next installment.

Cheers!

Very creative design and awesome execution as usual. =)

The one thing you're missing re: low light photography: set the ISO to the lowest setting you have (mine is 100), that should get rid of the grain problem.

Hanes.. your welcome to stop by.. on Wednesdays we have fishsticks and lime jello.. :p

Tom.. I agree, I should have been done already.. I dont mind the building.. its the finishing everything that is starting to wear on me and delaying progress because its difficult to just start and stop if you only have a smaller time window.. so Im usually stuck waiting on the weekends to spray and if I happen to scrap something I basically loose a week waiting on finishing a new piece..

Hope the new Carvin amp solves your issues.. Im going to cedia hoping to learn a few things, I wont be buying anything yet..I've learned my lesson about buying equip before I actually need it:o and yup, Im in the pendleton area ~ 20 min NE of indy..

Moggie.. For the ceiling, I've resigned myself to the fact that Fiber is out.. I didnt plan properly for it and it would just be to difficult to get the fibers out there without major rework.. I did run power to the ceiling, I've tossed around the idea of building a coffer type of frame and "Paint" a star field then use the power for UV led's, but i need to study everything before I commit. In all honesty the celing is pushed towards the end of the list now, I figure I can address this area when the rest of the room is complete.

Regarding the front for the hush box.. the first one I built was kinda like a shadow box.. the sides angled top to bottom but the glass was held flat. I calculated the angle from the center of the lens to the center of the screen was ~ 12deg. so this put me in the 7-15 recommended range to prevent reflections..Im definately waiting until the projector and lens are in before building the next one.. My things to RE-DO list is getting as big as my to-do list..:rolleyes:

I'm on a mission now to complete the major room elements and get a picture on the wall.. my next major task is to complete the panels for the rear wall.. and tie everything into the side walls.. Ill install all the treatments and get the room functional, before completing some of the "Cosmetic" details that basically go ontop of the wall panels.. Ie capitols, fluted columns (and Ceiling)etc.. I made a promise to my youngest (my movie buddy) to be watching movies in there by christmas, so Im really under the gun now.. not to mention the 2 1/2 year build is becoming a joke with friends and family:(

Brad.. Thanks!! I've not played with any custom settings, I've just been trying the preset settings ie Auto, twilight, beach, etc.. I'll see if I can figure out how to change the ISO setting.. PS I thought ISO was related to the type of "FILM" for conventional cameras:confused:


"I'd rather have a bottle in front of me, than a frontal lobotomy"

Brad

Hanes.. your welcome to stop by.. on Wednesdays we have fishsticks and lime jello.. :p

OK. But we would have to be careful not to miss Judge Wapner. Fifteen minutes to Wapner.

15 minutes.

http://i471.photobucket.com/albums/rr79/hanesian/The_People_s_Court_Discarding_Personal_Property_Part_2_JUDGE _WAPNER_SPECIAL_APPEARANCE_.jpg

OK. But we would have to be careful not to miss Judge Wapner. Fifteen minutes to Wapner.

15 minutes.

http://i471.photobucket.com/albums/rr79/hanesian/The_People_s_Court_Discarding_Personal_Property_Part_2_JUDGE _WAPNER_SPECIAL_APPEARANCE_.jpg

Isn't he married to Judge Judy? Wow... there's an incredibly disturbing image... :)

I have GOT to come see this theater when you're all finished up. Its truly a work of art.

Brad,

Been a while since I have posted, but I'm keeping up with your build. Everything is looking phenomenal, top notch work. Keep it up, the effort is definitely worth it.

Regards,

RTROSE

I made a promise to my youngest (my movie buddy) to be watching movies in there by christmas, so Im really under the gun now.. not to mention the 2 1/2 year build is becoming a joke with friends and family:(

I hear you. My daughters birthday is coming up and I promised she could have a movie party and sleepover in the theater. Technically I promised her the party last year, but this year I'm definitely on track!

Keep pushing, I guarantee a big smile when you sit down there with family and watch your first proper movie...

... or if you are like me, sit there thinking, "should I install a curtain to remove that unwanted reflection" or "does that area needs a bit more trim" or "are the floor lights still too bright" or "was that a rattle in the right soffit". The eternal DIYer is never finished.

PS I thought ISO was related to the type of "FILM" for conventional cameras:confused:

Yes, film speed in film cameras - digital cameras emulate the same thing and still call it ISO:

For digital photo cameras ("digital still cameras"), an exposure index (EI) rating—commonly called ISO setting—is specified by the manufacturer such that the sRGB image files produced by the camera will have a lightness similar to what would be obtained with film of the same EI rating at the same exposure.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Film_speed#Digital_camera_ISO_speed_and_exposure_index

... or if you are like me, sit there thinking

Mostly I just sit there....:D

Brad.. Thanks for the link.. What ever happened to "Point and Click"?:rolleyes:

A bit late in the build, but sub!

Very awesome work! Really appreciate all the time you put into sharing it with others.

On a side note... if anybody has any pointers for taking decent pictures in a dark room I'd like to hear em.. I see alot of great looking screen shots and other pics that I am not able to get close to. Wifes got a decent Sony camera so Im pretty sure I'm just missing some basics on which setting to use..

Brad

Hi Brad - What type of digital camera do you have? I can certainly help you getting your exposure settings correct but I will say that you will need two things regardless of what type of camera you have. First a decent tripod and second, a remote control or trigger to actually take the picture so you actually don't have to touch the camera and push the button. Most of the better digital cameras will come with a tiny remote control when new. If you are like me you immediately exclaimed "What the Hell will I EVER need this for?" only to spend an entire Saturday afternoon on an electronic archaeology dig to locate it. And of course the battery will be dead, necessitating an immediate trip to Wal-Mart for a replacement. (LOL!)

Let me know your camera model number and I'll get back to you. Thanks and keep up the GREAT work!

TM, I'll be following your input here too! I'm using a D60 and have a remote. Awaiting the next step. :)

Thanks for the offer TMcG.. I'm trying to work with the Sony Cyber-shot DSC-H2, I have a tripod but no remote/trigger.

I did a couple of searches today, unfortunately what I remembered as an above average camera @6.2 mega pixels when I purchased it 5 years ago, is fairly lack luster by todays standards and can now be had for ~ 150:o

still not as bad as the .35 megapixel Fuji DS-7 I purchased for ~ 900 in 96:(

That'll teach me to buy a camera before the room is finished..:rolleyes:

Seriously though, any tips/pointers would be appreciated... If this camera wont cut the mustard, is there another you would recommend.

Brad

First of all, you have a very nice point and shoot camera for its time, but there is one inherent problem that will limit your picture-taking ability with this unit - and that is you cannot switch lenses. The fastest your lens will go is f2.8. An f1.8 lens doesn't sound like much, but it will make a big, big difference in low-light photography. For your next camera I would recommend a digital SLR with minimum 8 Megapixel and an ideal of 12+ Megapixel. The digital SLR should also have much higher ISO settings available for you - 1600+ a the minimum.

Now, to take the best picture with what you've got without overcomplicating the matter with complicated photography techno-jargon:
1. Use your tripod
2. Put your camera in manual mode
3. Shoot in RAW, if possible (greater data resolution for digital editing)
4. Turn the flash off
5. Use your highest ISO setting (1000 on your camera)
6. Decrease your lens aperture to the lowest setting and go up from there (f-stop). Start at f2.8 and go upward with the same settings until you see what you like and get a feel for the differences in the settings. You may have to use an aperture priority mode, fyi.
7. Turn on image stabilization since you do not have a shutter control cable or remote control
8. Practice, practice, practice.
9. Use image processing software to soften / eliminate grain from the image due to the higher ISO setting. In general, the higher the ISO the more grain. I say "in general" because there are some digital cameras that produce almost no grain even at ISO3200 settings!

One word of advice, if you are trying to get a screen shot while having some low lights on in the theater - don't. One trick all the pros use is to set up their camera, adjust the settings for the lights to be on and take a picture. Then the lights are turned out 100% and another photo is taken of the picture on the screen. Try to touch the camera as little as possible so to not adjust your physical settings. These two images are then composited together in photoshop or another software program to get the brilliant image in a well-lit theater.

I hope these tricks help. Let me know if you have any other questions, but I cannot stress enough how important it is to practice with the different manual features of your camera. Not only will you start taking better pictures of your home theater, but family vacation photos will begin to dazzle!!!

Best of luck!

You don't need a shutter control cable or a remote if you have a built-in delay. I'm not sure if your camera has it, but almost every one does now. Turn on the delay, click the picture to lock in the zoom, etc, wait a few seconds and it will snap the picture. I'm sure we've all done this routine trying to run around and jump onto the couch without knocking over the Christmas tree to get that perfect family photo.

First of all, you have a very nice point and shoot camera for its time, but there is one inherent problem that will limit your picture-taking ability with this unit - and that is you cannot switch lenses. The fastest your lens will go is f2.8. An f1.8 lens doesn't sound like much, but it will make a big, big difference in low-light photography. For your next camera I would recommend a digital SLR with minimum 8 Megapixel and an ideal of 12+ Megapixel. The digital SLR should also have much higher ISO settings available for you - 1600+ a the minimum.

Now, to take the best picture with what you've got without overcomplicating the matter with complicated photography techno-jargon:
1. Use your tripod
2. Put your camera in manual mode
3. Shoot in RAW, if possible (greater data resolution for digital editing)
4. Turn the flash off
5. Use your highest ISO setting (1000 on your camera)
6. Decrease your lens aperture to the lowest setting and go up from there (f-stop). Start at f2.8 and go upward with the same settings until you see what you like and get a feel for the differences in the settings. You may have to use an aperture priority mode, fyi.
7. Turn on image stabilization since you do not have a shutter control cable or remote control
8. Practice, practice, practice.
9. Use image processing software to soften / eliminate grain from the image due to the higher ISO setting. In general, the higher the ISO the more grain. I say "in general" because there are some digital cameras that produce almost no grain even at ISO3200 settings!

One word of advice, if you are trying to get a screen shot while having some low lights on in the theater - don't. One trick all the pros use is to set up their camera, adjust the settings for the lights to be on and take a picture. Then the lights are turned out 100% and another photo is taken of the picture on the screen. Try to touch the camera as little as possible so to not adjust your physical settings. These two images are then composited together in photoshop or another software program to get the brilliant image in a well-lit theater.

I hope these tricks help. Let me know if you have any other questions, but I cannot stress enough how important it is to practice with the different manual features of your camera. Not only will you start taking better pictures of your home theater, but family vacation photos will begin to dazzle!!!

Best of luck!

Wow TMcG - thanks a ton for that very informative post! I'm a complete camera novice but that gives a great and easy starting point.

@tmhouse: Good point! I always forget about that stupid (and yet conveniently brilliant) setting!

I have to disagree on one point: I would recommend using the camera's LOWEST ISO setting, not the highest - that way you have no grain to deal with.

And ditto to the use of the delayed shutter setting (the one cameras provide so you can push the button, and then run over to get in the picture before it snaps).

I have to disagree on one point: I would recommend using the camera's LOWEST ISO setting, not the highest - that way you have no grain to deal with.

And ditto to the use of the delayed shutter setting (the one cameras provide so you can push the button, and then run over to get in the picture before it snaps).

The amount of grain you get by boosting the ISO setting is directly related to the quality of camera you have. I personally never go higher than 800 for extremely low light on my point-and-shoot digital for this reason. On my digital SLR (Canon 7D), I could really see no appreciable difference between ISO settings until I go beyond 2400. Shooting in the RAW format will also allow for greater manipulation by the software to eliminate any potential graining should any occur. Plus, let's face it, once a high-resolution raw file is converted to a jpg for publication or posting on the web, any lack of resolution will all but disappear since the actual image is being greatly condensed.

You should just take a few pics at different ISO settings. Different cameras handle it to different degrees, but for the end user it's no more complicated than changing 1 setting and taking an additional photo. Find the amount of grain balanced with clarity that you like best.

Thanks everyone for the tips.

TMcG your post is greatly appreciated, I think many others will find it very informative also.

I studied the camera more and found most of the settings you detailed.




3. Shoot in RAW, if possible (greater data resolution for digital editing)



I'm not sure what is meant by "Shoot in the raw"




One word of advice, if you are trying to get a screen shot while having some low lights on in the theater - don't. One trick all the pros use is to set up their camera, adjust the settings for the lights to be on and take a picture. Then the lights are turned out 100% and another photo is taken of the picture on the screen. Try to touch the camera as little as possible so to not adjust your physical settings. These two images are then composited together in photoshop or another software program to get the brilliant image in a well-lit theater.



Thanks for the tips particullarly on the screen shots.. I kinda figured some of the images I see of the theaters (particullarly on EH) were composites becasue of the way the stair ceilings etc were showing up in fully lit rooms.

I'll practice with this camera to get a better feel for how the manual settings impact the picture (and with the shutter timer).. we'll see if there is an improvement in my next update.

It sounds like the wife will be getting a new SLR for christmas, she'll really like it!!, probably more than the bosch table saw I was planning on giving her...:D

Brad

First of all, you have a very nice point and shoot camera for its time, but there is one inherent problem that will limit your picture-taking ability with this unit - and that is you cannot switch lenses. The fastest your lens will go is f2.8. An f1.8 lens doesn't sound like much, but it will make a big, big difference in low-light photography. For your next camera I would recommend a digital SLR with minimum 8 Megapixel and an ideal of 12+ Megapixel. The digital SLR should also have much higher ISO settings available for you - 1600+ a the minimum.

Now, to take the best picture with what you've got without overcomplicating the matter with complicated photography techno-jargon:
1. Use your tripod
2. Put your camera in manual mode
3. Shoot in RAW, if possible (greater data resolution for digital editing)
4. Turn the flash off
5. Use your highest ISO setting (1000 on your camera)
6. Decrease your lens aperture to the lowest setting and go up from there (f-stop). Start at f2.8 and go upward with the same settings until you see what you like and get a feel for the differences in the settings. You may have to use an aperture priority mode, fyi.
7. Turn on image stabilization since you do not have a shutter control cable or remote control
8. Practice, practice, practice.
9. Use image processing software to soften / eliminate grain from the image due to the higher ISO setting. In general, the higher the ISO the more grain. I say "in general" because there are some digital cameras that produce almost no grain even at ISO3200 settings!


If you're on a tripod, then you want image stabilization OFF. It's not going anywhere so there's nothing to stabilize. Also, some implementations of IS will freak out when on a tripod trying to find something to stabilize, it's not pretty I don't recommend it.

A fast aperture doesn't matter if you're on a tripod. If it takes 2 minutes to gather the light for the shot with the depth of field you need, so be it. Also, lenses are generally sharpest a few stops up from wide open. If you're got a f/1.8 lens (in particular that Canon 50mm) then things are pretty blurry until you're past f/2.8 anyway. Besides for proper DoF on a room shot in a fairly normal-sized house you probably want to be at f/8, or possibly higher.

50mm on a crop body is somewhat of a telephoto anyway. On an SLR you're not going to have a terribly wide lens at f/1.8 without dropping major cash. Odds are the kit zoom is gonna be the widest thing you've got, and there's no way it's going anywhere near f/1.8.

It sounds like the wife will be getting a new SLR for christmas, she'll really like it!!, probably more than the bosch table saw I was planning on giving her...:D

Brad

Before you give her a Bosch 4100-09, be sure to check out the Ridgid R4510. I was initially looking at the 4100 until I saw the R4510 and Bosch immediately got dropped from my list. The Ridgid looks comparable or better in all aspects and is $100 cheaper. It definitely has a better fence, though I'm not much for the tape measure rail markings. The Ridgid also has a lifetime warranty.

Don't forget, Home Depot will take competitors coupons, specifically a 20% Harbor Freight coupon. You'll have a very tough time applying it to anything you have to order, but the cashiers will apply competitors coupons without dismay about "holding the line".

I actually wound up with the R4512 which is a completely different creature, but managed to get it for $375+tax with a HF Fourth of July 25% coupon. It's the same thing as the Craftsman 21833 + some bonuses. You're not going to find a better saw for your wife for under $900. Even then said option has all the same core anyway.

Biggest hassle with the R4512 is finding a HD with one in stock. Few HDs actually carry the thing as your average HD shopper isn't looking at anything on that end of the range.

I just bought a Canon s95 which is one of the best pocketable cameras out right now. It does well in low light with a f2 lens. It gets great reviews and you will take more pictures out of your house because it is easy to take with you...otherwise a dslr is the next step up.

@ the geek - I totally agree that the image stabilization should be off IF he uses the timed delay and no remote trigger. Suggesting to keep the stabilization on was only to counteract the physical movement of the camera if he was actually going to push the button on the camera to take the picture (another reason for a faster aperture setting).

My suggestions were only to give a starting point to take a decent low-light level picture vs. using the fully automatic settings of a point-and-shoot. Essentially a few first baby steps into using manual controls on a mid-range point-and-shoot which are probably being used for the first time. Entire books are written on the careful interplay between aperture and ISO which take years to truly master with the right equipment.

@ KNKKNK - Here is a link I found on the web with a nice description of the RAW image format: http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/article_pages/why_use_raw.html

Good luck and let's all see some posts as you experiment with your ISO and aperture settings!

~ 18 months in..

Front wall treatment - All surfaces behind screen wall covered with 2 layers of 1" Insulshield with 3 mil poly in between.

Shot of the poly covering the first layer.. (sorry for the blurry pic, its hard to take pictures of black with the exposure time and I couldnt find the tripod)

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC01136.jpg

Found the tripod ...

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC01170.jpg

Brad

Hi Brad. I'm going to be using the same approach behind my screen wall, as well as behind framed stretch fabric panels between columns on my left/right/rear walls (will be using Linacoustic instead of InsulShield due to availability/cost). I have a few questions on the details if you can remember:


What length button cap nails did you use, and were they different for the first and second layers?
It looks like you may have tacked the first layer of InsulShield and the poly down with a minimum number of nails and then secured all through the second layer of InsulShield, is that correct?
What nail pattern/spacing did you use?


Thanks,
DD

What length button cap nails did you use, and were they different for the first and second layers?
It looks like you may have tacked the first layer of InsulShield and the poly down with a minimum number of nails and then secured all through the second layer of InsulShield, is that correct?
What nail pattern/spacing did you use?


Thanks,
DD

Hi Dan, apologies for the delayed response, Just returned from a week in Disneyworld (Walked ~3000 miles, need a vacation now:rolleyes:).

I used the plastic cap roofing nails, the local menards had 2" ones in stock so I used these for both layers, they cause the second layer to "pucker" a little around the cap heads. (they make a 2 1/2" also. but these were not stocked)

I did tack the first layer with a minimun number just to hold it up. I also spotted the first layer and the poly with spray adhesive as I went, this worked well to help hold it up (particullarly the poly) until I put the second layer on.

The spacing is ~ 2 1/2' sq with a cap head in the middle, (like a 5 on a die face) . I held back about 8" or so from the edge of each strip to reduce the "pucker"

Lastly I added a black furring strip around the edge, I think this probably would have been enough to hold everything in place with just a couple of the cap heads and the spray adhesive. If you were closer Id give you the cap heads, I have ~ 1900 left out of the box of 2000 ...

Just an FYI.. The corner traps are frames with 2-1" layers with poly between also, and some fluffy fiberglass stuffed behind.

_________________________________________

On another note.. I no longer need to worry about the previous camera. It was mistakenly left in the seat pocket on the Disney safari ride. I picked up a new cyber shot to capture the rest of the trip. This one is far better than the previous one, with 14.1 mp, and it has a cool panoramic feature that automatically stitches the pictures together as you pan.

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/086.jpg

I'll still be in the market for a good SLR when I get the chance.

TheGeek.. Thanks for the suggestion on the Rigid, I never thought about HD accepting HF coupons.. I found the 20% off coupon online and Ill see if any of the local HD's have one of the saws in stock.

Brad

^^walked 3000 miles and how long did you stand in line for...3000 hours....!

Thanks a lot for the detailed breakdown Brad. Wow, you got the bucket pack! I think I can get 2 1/2 button caps locally. What you put together is too neat to cover up with a screen :)

Re Disney, we took our 3 1/2 year old daughter on her first trip in mid May. It was a blast! The crowd was small and the temp was mostly in the 80's. My biggest surprises were how much she liked the character autographs and her demanding to ride the Tower of Terror (and liking it).

DD

^^walked 3000 miles and how long did you stand in line for...3000 hours....!

With the exception of the water parks, the most we waited in one line was probably 15 min, we used the fast passes and traded waiting for walking from one side of the park to the other.


Re Disney, we took our 3 1/2 year old daughter on her first trip in mid May. It was a blast! The crowd was small and the temp was mostly in the 80's. My biggest surprises were how much she liked the character autographs and her demanding to ride the Tower of Terror (and liking it).

DD

Disneyworld is truly a magical place, and the level of customer service from the staff is world class.

Hats off to ya for doing Disney with a toddler, those can be tough times on occasion. I'm glad my boys are teen/pre-teen now, the only downside is thier refusal to order from the Kids menu still, but another year or two and they can push me around the parks in a stroller!:cool:

P.S.The picture they snapped of me on the T of T this year was far from flattering.. ..;)

"Demanding to ride the Tower of Terror (and liking it)"

This brought back a funny memory for me. Many years ago we took our youngest son to "WallyWorld (he is now 16). The tower of terror lived up to it's name. Weeks later after returning home - he was explaining his ride on the ToT with his grandmother. She asked if he was ever scared?

His response:
"I wasn't scared - but I wanted to scream" :)

Now back to our regularly scheduled discussions ....

I used the plastic cap roofing nails, the local menards had 2" ones in stock so I used these for both layers, they cause the second layer to "pucker" a little around the cap heads. (they make a 2 1/2" also. but these were not stocked)

I did tack the first layer with a minimun number just to hold it up. I also spotted the first layer and the poly with spray adhesive as I went, this worked well to help hold it up (particullarly the poly) until I put the second layer on.

The spacing is ~ 2 1/2' sq with a cap head in the middle, (like a 5 on a die face) . I held back about 8" or so from the edge of each strip to reduce the "pucker"

Lastly I added a black furring strip around the edge, I think this probably would have been enough to hold everything in place with just a couple of the cap heads and the spray adhesive. If you were closer Id give you the cap heads, I have ~ 1900 left out of the box of 2000 ...

Brad

Brad, one additional question -- did you cut out Insulshield where your speaker shelves contact the wall, or put on top and compress?

On the button caps, 1 3/4" is the longest that is stocked in my area. So I've resorted to buying 2 1/2" ring shank nails and 1 3/4" button caps, pulling the caps off the 1 3/4", and putting them on the 2 1/2" nails. Don't have time to order to stay on track with trades that are already scheduled.

Thanks,
DD

Brad, one additional question -- did you cut out Insulshield where your speaker shelves contact the wall, or put on top and compress?

DD

I cut out for the speaker shelves and mounted directly to the wall.

Brad

any updates?

Thanks for checkin Chase.. I finished building the last panel for the rear wall last night. Now I need to put the finish on all of the rear panels and mount them. Then on to the bottom of the soffits....which shouldn't take too long. So hopefully more pics in a week or so.

Pondering carpet and chairs.. it time to order but I'm waffling on design choices. Looked at all the manufacturers and sat in all the chairs at Cedia.. leaning towards fortress or elite.

For carpet.. I found one I like doing a google image search.. but it was a random picture in a blog that didn't have any reference to a manufacturer and I've not been able to locate it anywhere
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/carpet.jpg

Anyone see a carpet like this anywhere?


Brad

i spent a 1/2 hour bouncing around the net. no luck. BUT ! i would save image an send request to so called HT pro stores or go around town an see. I like that design. good luck,

Interesting carpet pattern. Have you considered going with more of a monochrome base carpet then laying a large (maybe 8'X10' or larger) Persian rug over top in front of the screen? The beautiful patterns available in a separate rug may tie in with the wonderful ornate finishing you have in store. REALLY looking forward to how this all comes together. Any chance you could step up the progress a little? :)

I also spent some time last night looking around for your carpet sample. From what I found on that guy's blog it appears to me that its carpet at the Nokia Theatre in LA. My guess is that it's a commercial grade carpet of somekind. I would guess the "home theatre" guys wouldn't know where to find it either. From my searching I would guess a commercial, hospitality or hotel carpeting outfit would be your best sources to explore. Also who knows how long that carpet has been there and it may have even been a special one off pattern as well.

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/carpet.jpg

Anyone see a carpet like this anywhere?


Brad
Brad, if you go to images.google.com you can drag and drop the jpeg into the search box, and google will search the web for it. Unfortunately, you'll be disappointed with the results. You'll get Jason's Blog, where it seems you found the image initially, and you'll get an animated gif on two different carpet websites, but none actually refers directly to that carpet (at least, nowhere I could find).

What is potentially of interest, however, is that google will also find visually similar images. This may not give you a good alternative, but it can't hurt to look.

Click here (http://images.google.com/search?hl=en&tbs=sbi:AMhZZiviTBuBLB-xjowro4faiQiMKuQyyZOBoMw_1U0TLuU-J00AqbQKBvOhqH6Vo3Aql1NnyNustz9ipYPEaEwpYVnAtipUFv26QDuPJpFk KnQrYK_1khsUdUm4wlFsgAjvqQ6rgw9TIShoLzbLY-LP26L21BKtH4PIke7zCnLE0eHS-9A5jI9bOhDNYw57qpQM23h7SnPJmBxR-Yq_1_1UXJA0FeIewjrdEs9hpiJW-g16aOyFBU05-eAhm12Tpl2wONyvoPD4TDXBoBf_18gVCvu_1K8LM2V50iJgAlUXxolqD1IKl E65OYehZ9KdvUpZGF64oGptqLFPA0pghVZL6gaZeiNGtLjEHGm53Ze0-ZciQv9kU0Mp_1HzCIwR_1DhvKWWF_1ryWfPBmKnMEM0PM0k8uMzFoftsPuOy CSp8hR1Kr4aRprlR2FYzE1119K2VKVC_1Ec5tfwmLJoyGqyULFE0GeQIHQKj ebjcpGjZ-QnmBvyfrHGOQHZ6pKgFSfaQ-D8SsG6cBTrrq33npt4VWSLarQk1-4XGwfQzEkMCCPQn0Dou_154HFs0cYTAa7ESN-sfI6dHoF5ZHr8P1eY1tCEDxn4pTH2KUV50oT3NmcacbHHvwGXtCuGzvHekZi bo3CvfW0wx8V8coYbG9Mapre4G2dLKuPsWfo8SHErtV2ZUzkKWDfTr4qYNau oJhWfgHRWa3QpiONLdEIIwhxJnQgxe8amp2D1nLdc0EzoM7NMBbancAXBaVa saLtbV_1hu4guuXrsemIEU1pXXwpLVQsIQBdullLrH-hwx2ZsqFLv3mqYpTZlk-0Zdsa8UeGXXt6_1w6ZN8hNp4XMVYcLg7oE9gRKRnMBCQtTdLe5D5U5HoS59i TPhG_1HR9is_1yVp9dngiThNgRVo5pDd1vQdj2clHnQVWqW3w982Z96istp2 XCK7GgKOoCMcbWT_1lvvtsGESAXPZ6uk-spqg6_1H8g2tdJnz5bUBMFz6q_1PvViakYcQYx1Rtacr7NygF1g1GerzFOxy CUfoF_129_1MX7U72he9iJKkIFOEPFIeq8EBytmMqFLs1hgIOtRTH3FZTiXZ QqzAuPaJhjXrT14hdcMInr4h10vts20Op2UjkYepEbyLgYcRptc-USdivtKMz4D4Vg9_1g4VRPGauwEVcjQCZO3tapW13JqvtwUm-Md9sMSPI6xfEAL6BTBWKq9mNN74z8H3XehGn2r0YwIbsN0R0uDLAA8W43jkp c8iVP6EZASsFwiUoJqQm4rvmmxVRSmr2zZqVBXzskuYcPYzEgpdyTDY8B4Lx QZ8lsm6zqRGqcxA&prmd=ivns&filter=0&biw=1366&bih=643)to skip dragging the image yourself, and go directly to the search results I generated. (not sure if the link will work, as it was generated while I was logged into my google account.) I think youcan add text to your search to refine the results. Visually similar image searching is new for google, and it's not terribly good, I'm afraid.

Hope that helps,

Fred

WOW guys.. thanks for the efforts!!

I had spent hrs searching.. commercial carpet.. casino carpet.. hotel carpet etc etc etc.. with no luck either.

Hopefulfred.. it seams to me that Jason (Jasons Blog) used an image from the other gifs you also found. his image is the exact ratio as the ones in the automated gifs (all the way down to the little yellow coffee cup pixel in the upper left of the image), so I doubt he took the pic. During my investigation I found the company that got the contract for Nokia flooring.. (something? Prince) but none of their products looked similar to the image. So I think Jason was a wild goose chase.
I sent emails to both carpet outlets last Thurs.. one responded they had no idea where the image came from, no word from the other.. last week was the first time I had ever played with the google image search.. its a neat tool to have in the bag.

DavidK.. you may be onto something, I had originally considered a black border with an insert due to some of the issues installers have lining up patterened wool carpets. Using a rug would probably give the same look and allow changes as desired.. definatley something to think about.

This is one of those situations where I wish I had never ran across that image becasue now nothing else seems like the right fit..:(

Any chance you could step up the progress a little? :) ummm......wellll....uhhhh....umm.. ;)

www.stantoncarpet.com

Check out their polypropylene carpets. Stanton bought Royal Dutch, and the "Royalton" stuff is what I'm specifically pointing you towards. They're typically under $5 a sqft and polypropylene is nearly impossible to stain. They feel like a million point area rug and I doubt you'll be disappointed. To do a room with the stuff will look very expensive, but really won't be all that bad.

Movies by Christmas hopefully

^^^^^^^^^
Quote from my overzealous post on July 25th.

Here's what I've accomplished in the last month...... I can actually see a light at the end of the tunnel for the room construction, the pieces are coming together a little quicker now..:cool:


Finished ~ 400 more ft of misc stuff... this completes ~ 95% of what Ill need to finish (thank goodness, getting tired of sanding / finishing...)
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/035.jpg

Trimmed out the fabric panels for one side wall. I ended up using the same 1 1/2" half round that I used for the soffit face rather than a panel profile.
Note the height of the fabric panels was dictated by the width of the 701 roll.. I've wasted very little fabric for my 15 panels so far.
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC01581.jpg

In this shot you can see the top and bottom supports for the sconce.
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC00281.jpg

Panel in place
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC00283.jpg

Staple and cut fabric for wiring.
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC00285.jpg

The sconces I chose were originally wired for a wall plug and foot switch.
So I cut off the plug, pulled out the wiring, punched a hole in the rear plate and stuck in a grommet for direct wiring
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC00287.jpg
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC00292.jpg

First sconce hung.
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC00293.jpg

I also finished off where the wall meets the soffit around the room.
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/022.jpg
I've been playing around with a faux paint on paintable wall paper trying to make it look like a copper/bronze with a pantina..gettin close to something usable, but worse case Ill finish the bottom of the soffit with black 701.

Heres one wall, (short the Bling) Like everyone else.. the pictures I take dont do the room justice..(I suck at taking pics and Im tired of messing around with camera settings.. ill wait until the room is done and then get someone who knows what their doing to come in and take decent pics)
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/059-1.jpg
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/076.jpg
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/075.jpg


and then this crash landed in my garage on Monday..
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/039.jpg

If I'm watching movies by christmas it'll be on lawn chairs without carpet in the room:rolleyes:

Im really hung up on the direction to go with the carpet and chairs... red carpet/black chairs.... black carpet/ red chairs.. black on black...:confused:

I've gotten a few sample of different reds for the carpet.. but they all seem to clash with the reddish color on the walls..

@ thegeek.. Ive requested a few samples from stanton ... well see what they look like when they arrive.. thanks for the tip.

Ill post a few more pics of the whole room after the remaining panels are trimmed and the rest of the sconces hung on the other wall..

Brad

Im really hung up on the direction to go with the carpet and chairs... red carpet/black chairs.... black carpet/ red chairs.. black on black...:confused:

I've gotten a few sample of different reds for the carpet.. but they all seem to clash with the reddish color on the walls..

My wood is stained a very similar color to yours. I had a hard time with carpet too. I wanted a red based carpet. At first I wanted something with a pattern (additional colors of gold/black/etc), but after picking my walls I knew that would be too busy. So I wanted a solid red carpet. It was hard to find the right red, most were way off.

What I ended up doing is putting a black border around my room that ties into the stage (same carpet as the stage). The border is about 2 feet (I can measure if you want to know for sure). The black border really goes well with the reddish stain color. If you're interested I'll try to look up the brand and color of the carpet I used.

Good luck, the room is looking awesome.

All I can say is Wow! The wood work and detail is fabulous. Stunning.

How about a super dark gray carpet with black accents, maybe a splash of red in it if you wish...then black chairs. Not a fan of red chairs especially against ALL that nice wood work in there. I think it would be too much, just my opinion though.

i am humbled by your skilllllll....an i can not even cut a 2x4 straight...

^^^^^^^^^

Im really hung up on the direction to go with the carpet and chairs... red carpet/black chairs.... black carpet/ red chairs.. black on black...:confused:

I've gotten a few sample of different reds for the carpet.. but they all seem to clash with the reddish color on the walls..

@ thegeek.. Ive requested a few samples from stanton ... well see what they look like when they arrive.. thanks for the tip.

Ill post a few more pics of the whole room after the remaining panels are trimmed and the rest of the sconces hung on the other wall..

Brad

Definitely black chairs. I think red chairs would look kind of gaudy in the beautiful, classy space you've created.

For carpet, I would be looking at something black or dark grey with some pattern or texture in the weave. Have you looked at damelon's thread ("Making the 'Bacon Race' Theater")? He has been agonizing over carpet and he and BigmouthinDC have posted a bunch of photos of different options. You might be able to take advantage of their research. For example, check out post 708: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1350179&page=24

Brad,

I actually had a sample of my carpet, it's from Floors To Go. Style is "Ashby Drive", color is "841 Persia Sweet". I can't find the exact carpet on their web site, this is the closest I could find Creative Elegance - Show Star - Cherrywood (http://www.floorstogo.com/categories/carpet/products/americanshowcase/glamouresque/camellia.aspx?{B5DB9D01-0E42-493F-A6CE-5154E7EF1F9F}={33AA4793-8BAD-4F67-9911-67BA70A653E0}&{4FD4016C-1AB0-445C-9401-58EFC6552B88}={F0B83B9F-E9BC-4325-9476-78E06EC5D2C9}&categoryID={F06020BC-BDC7-4C07-A975-AE5D040990E7}).

I actually like the pattern in the Show Star better than the pattern I have. The same "tone on tone" pattern gives the carpet some style, while not being overbearing. It allows the walls and screen to dominate, while giving you a nice base for black chairs.

+1 on the black chairs.

I also agree on black chairs. By the way, what happened to the translucent panels next to the lions? It looks like those are covered in fabric now.

Another vote for black chairs. I think most definitely that red chairs would not "fit" your room. Excellent progress the sconces (as does the rest of the room) looks great! As for carpet, if you go all black prepare for it to show everything and anything. I would go with a grey/charcoal color that has some type of pattern and "color specks" to break it up. Good luck.

Regards,

RTROSE

Wow.... wow.... I'm speachless at your skill and ability! Amazing! I sub'd this threat, and give a thumbs up Like for you and your efforts. simply amazing!

WOW! All i can say is I suck beyond belief..LOL WoW!

-P

Absolutely gorgeous woodwork. It's going to be a beautiful theater!

Good god man, finally... been checking back here ever day for months waiting for an update :D ;)

Absolutely fabulous work. Really classy.

I like ejhuzy's suggestion for the carpet -- install a black boarder carpet and then inlay a red carpet in the middle then deck with black chairs.

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC00281.jpg


Sorry if I missed this in a previous post, but was wondering if you can describe what you did with the 703 in this picture. How did you come by that pattern?

Thanks.

Thank you gentlemen, the feedback is greatly appreciated (and Motivating)

I feel Im getting really close now... I may not be 100% by my deadline of this Christmas, but I'm happy where I am now that the pieces are coming together quicker.

For the carpet it looks like Ill be going with.....Drum roll Please....
black border and red inset... Actually it will probably be a Maroonish color.. ill should be able to find something that gets close to the wall color without clashing with the black border between the inset and the wall.

I agree with everyone that red chairs may look a little Gaudy.. but sometimes you gotta run an idea up the flag pole, and this is a great place for honest feedback. Now Ill just need to decide on a chair style..

EJ.. thanks for re posting the link to your theater, I hadn't noticed at the time how you did the carpet in your room. (too busy looking at your bar)

Sometimes its hard to visualize and It helps tremendously to see an actual picture of a concept, after re examining your theater the deal was sealed.

I was originally looking at patterned wool carpets and a friend of mine (owns a carpet store) also recommend the border also to avoid the issues that sometimes arise when trying to seam the patterned carpets. I should be able to run 12' width and leave ~ 2'9" for a border on each side.


Have you looked at damelon's thread ("Making the 'Bacon Race' Theater")?

Oh Yea!! and it makes me wanna jump out my basement window when I think about how fast those 2 have built that theater.. you can tell its not their first rodeo..

I also agree on black chairs. By the way, what happened to the translucent panels next to the lions? It looks like those are covered in fabric now.

The stained glass looked good against the blonde unfinished wood, however once everything went red the colors didn't blend well..

Absolutely gorgeous woodwork. It's going to be a beautiful theater!

Back at ya Damelon.. Your room is fantastic and the Blazing fast timeline you guys have been on highlights the accomplishment even more.

Good god man, finally... been checking back here ever day for months waiting for an update :D ;)

Moggie.. Thanks Man!!.. Although I wasn't able to keep pace with your build, You've pretty much stuck with me for the entire endeavour.. and through several change of seasons:o

Your theater has definitely raised the bar, and provided a pinnacle for my aspirations.

I must admit... the speed of my progress increased exponentially once I hung the sign......

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC00356.jpg

"What would Moggie Do":D:D:D;)

Sorry if I missed this in a previous post, but was wondering if you can describe what you did with the 703 in this picture. How did you come by that pattern?

Thanks.

The product you see in that photo is sold by Quest Acoustical Interiors under the name of "Perfsorber". Its a hybrid absorber/diffuser that was recommended by Dennis Erskine.

Regarding the pattern, it is my "belief" that the science for the design of the persorber has it's "roots" in the work of D' Antiono and Cox. Their concept used a maximum length sequence to generate a binary pattern. The resulting Binary sequence with 1's representing reflective regions and 0's representing absorptive regions, will act as a diffuser by varying the phase of the reflected wave. This concept was realized in a product called a "Bad Panel" (binary amplitude diffuser) patented by RPG. The Bad panel was simply a hard faced reflective panel (think 1/8 inch masonite) with holes puched in the appropriate pattern, that allows a portion of the sound wave to reach the absorptive material behind the panel thus providing broadband diffusion. Kinects also sells a similar product called a "Tad Panel":rolleyes:

An interesting DIY application of this concept can be seen on the ceiling in this build.. http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=21019737#post21019737

I believe the perfsorber product would be considered a ternary diffuser. it also uses a random binary sequence, however the construction employs the technique of using two absorptive sheets rotated 180 degress out of phase with ~ 15 mil membrane between them. The resulting effect creates a pattern that can be represented by -1,0,+1, as compared to the binary design with is represented by 0,1.

the below graph shows the test data from Quest

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/perfsorber.jpg

Compared with test data from RPG's "Bad" panel
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/badpanel.jpg

Notice the significant improved scattering with the quest product.

Another benefit of the flat panel diffusers is that they dont require as much realestate (depth) as other types such as the quad type diffusers.

Just kind of a brief overview, If you do a search for pat number 7314114 you'll find more information for a design "SIMILAR" to the perfsorber, or search for binary amplitude diffusion for a more indepth explanation of the basic concept.


Thanks again guys

Brad

EJ.. thanks for re posting the link to your theater, I hadn't noticed at the time how you did the carpet in your room. (too busy looking at your bar)

Sometimes its hard to visualize and It helps tremendously to see an actual picture of a concept, after re examining your theater the deal was sealed.

I was originally looking at patterned wool carpets and a friend of mine (owns a carpet store) also recommend the border also to avoid the issues that sometimes arise when trying to seam the patterned carpets. I should be able to run 12' width and leave ~ 2'9" for a border on each side.


Brad,

Glad I could help. I think the black border and red inset will be perfect for your room (I may be a little biased though ;)). Just for kicks I went and checked my room and my black border is about 2' 1" around the room.

Good luck finding a red that meets your needs. That was the hardest part of my carpet search. Getting a red that matched my walls.

Sweet progress. The lighting turned out awesome (as everything seems to do with your golden touch). This will truly be a masterpiece once everything is done.

Brad,

Your latest update is absolutely fantastic. Where can I purchase a ticket to see a premier when you unveil this beauty ?

The detail and quality of the woodwork is simply amazing !!

Thanks for the write up on the Perfsorber. Do you have any initial thoughts on how the room sounds with them up?

"What would Moggie Do":D:D:D;)

What would I do? Think of a better acronym for the sign:
"Wonderful Wife Makes Decision"

So when is the carpet install planned?

Everything looks outstanding, looking forward to the next steps.

I tend towards more subdued color and pattern, so I would be concerned that more red in the room could detract from the great woodworking standing out.

Brad,

Your latest update is absolutely fantastic. Where can I purchase a ticket to see a premier when you unveil this beauty ?

~4hr Dr from Chicago, your welcome anytime.

Thanks for the write up on the Perfsorber. Do you have any initial thoughts on how the room sounds with them up?

I've only had a temp hookup back when the IB was initially installed, all I can say about that was it was loud and sounded bad in a drywall shell.. Hopefully I can install and test the real equip within the next month.

What would I do? Think of a better acronym for the sign:
"Wonderful Wife Makes Decision"

So when is the carpet install planned?
LOL.. Wisdom beyond your years.

Hopefully end of Nov or sooner for carpet.. still need to do the capitols, fluting, bases etc...ref: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=19513016#post19513016


Everything looks outstanding, looking forward to the next steps.

I tend towards more subdued color and pattern, so I would be concerned that more red in the room could detract from the great woodworking standing out.

Kinda why I discounted a Grey carpet, wanted to keep the color palette to a min. Im going to search for a "solid" red/maroon that's close to the wood, maybe towards the darker side.

YOU need to get a utube video up; an take a tour.

VIDEO..:confused: Slow your roll.. I kinda thought that picking up tools and sweeping the floor before my next update would be an improvement;)

VIDEO..:confused: Slow your roll.. I kinda thought that picking up tools and sweeping the floor before my next update would be an improvement;)


I'm with ya, figuratively and literally. After so long of using the basement as a war er ah I mean construction zone as well as misc. storage for just about everything I consider it a MAJOR step/accomplishment just to get everything cleaned up and to a point where it really looks like a room.

I am still amazed at the incredible wood work in your build, simply stunning. Those sconces are really impressive and have a great "feel" to them, very nice.

Regards,

RTROSE

Carpet Ordered!

Awesome! Looking forward to the end result.

50 Days to Christmas...:o Im on a mission now!

Went with a Black Border and Dark wine/burgundy/maroon insert for the carpet!!

Last Major piece of Equipment (for the time being) arrived today

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/003.jpg

Chairs is the only decision left to make.. Decided I wanted simple/clean lines in a solid black.. Kinda have it narrowed down to these 2. lead time ~60 days

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/deco01-1.jpghttp://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/matinee_2010a-1.jpg

My third option is significantly less coin ("similar" quality)and could probably be here by christmas

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/t_90196-04-2.jpg

Opinions on the best chair for the room?

Ah, Oppo 95 sweet! Very nice.

As for the chairs, I really like the one with the rounded arms, first picture. I like the other two as well. I really don't think you can go wrong with any of them, but if you must know by vote then I vote #1.

Regards,

RTROSE

I like all three as well. Aesthetically I'd choose #1 too, because it's more unique. However, I use the arms on my chairs to hold all sorts of things, and the rounded arm would not allow for that. Does it look like the cup holder is further back in the arm than the others? If so, that wouldn't work either. My drink needs to fall naturally into my hand like the gear shift of a well designed sports car. :) I know. Sounds like a nitpick, but after all is said and done, these little ergonomic details will make or break the whole project!

Please tell us more about the chairs. They are all 3 very nice and I am at the point of ordering chairs.

Absolutely one of my favorite theaters. It is stunning! Great job on all the woodwork.

A question about your IB configuration and why you went with two openings? I have not seen that set up before, only the more traditional 4 drivers in one opening. Is set up the same and are you driving all the subs as if it was a single opening/sub? Is there any concern about getting flutter in the screen from air movement??

I'm doing a similar sub in my theater and wondered whether it would move the screen. I posed the question to several people with similar setups and everyone said that there was no screen movement from the sub.

I don't have the same sub setup, but I have screen movement, and it's a real problem. :mad:

Holy cow! 103+ THOUSAND views.
They're all for that gardening post I bet, LOL That was hysterical!
Had tears in my eyes while reading that, I was laughing so hard.

I'm going to be contrary and suggest chair #2 (chair #3 as second choice). The first one is a little to modern to work in this room IMHO. The caveat is that my wife tells me I have no taste whatsoever -- despite the reminder that I married her.

I don't have the same sub setup, but I have screen movement, and it's a real problem. :mad:

Is your sub behind the screen. I scanned your build thread but didn't find it.

I like the two openings. It may allow me to have more of a slotted opening over being square. In doing that I may be able to keep it under the screen instead of behind it, reducing possible flutter??

Is your sub behind the screen. I scanned your build thread but didn't find it.

I like the two openings. It may allow me to have more of a slotted opening over being square. In doing that I may be able to keep it under the screen instead of behind it, reducing possible flutter??

The diagram on the first page of his thread has the sub positioned behind the screen.

Carpet choice sounds nice, in retrospect I kind of wish I has added a black border - not enough to add it now, but you know.

Chairs look nice too - any difference in back height? Mine are a little too high for my height, so you might want to give that some thought, to not impact surrounds.

I don't have the same sub setup, but I have screen movement, and it's a real problem. :mad:
I have a lowly 10" sub behind my AT screen and even though it isn't visible I can feel the fabric vibrate. With the monster bass some of you are pushing I don't doubt that it makes the screen dance.

More than you ever wanted to know about the meandering path of my chair decision....

Selecting the chairs, or more accurately, loosing sleep over which would be the right chair for the room has been a uphill battle. Going in I knew, I didn't want the Atypical overstuffed recliner. I just didn't feel it would blend well with the room motif.

This lead to me questioning the real "Need" for a recliner. I've been going to movies my whole life and have never sat in a recliner at the theater. So being somewhat unsure that a recliner was a prerequisite to a proper theater, I started looking at Chairs that would be more period appropriate in an "older style" atmosphere.

This lead me to the Art Nouveau /Deco/Neoclassical period, Club/Cigar type chair designs. To give you an Idea of the look I was searching for heres an couple examples of a neoclassical design and an art deco design.. Disregard the colors..
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/AAAAAjViZFQAAAAAAVVDqQ.jpghttp://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/images2.jpg

I thought something along these lines would be a perfect addition to the environment I was trying to create. So I started searching, with the understanding that I would propably need to get what ever I find reupholstered..

However this path was full of its own limitations/constraints..
1. Virtually Impossible to find these vintage chairs in anything other than pairs..
2. These chairs are big (wide).. I would not be able to place 4 (even if i could find them) in the room in with any type of symmetry.

Then I ran across "Fortress Seating", Fortress is one of the Higher end chair manufactures, and will customize your chairs to your specific style/dimensions.

What drew me to fortress was that their chair designs were based on the various period designs.. here are a couple of examples...

A set of art deco chairs from the 30's compared to the fortress "Alex"
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/images.jpghttp://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/alex.jpg

And another example of a club chair from the 40's compared to the Fortress "JR2"
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/dlblau-chairs.pnghttp://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/jr2.jpg

It appears that all of the fortress designs are based on period chairs, even their Oddball looking "Guild" (which I think they build at the request of TK) is eerily similar to a Stanley Weiss design from the turn of the century.

For those interested heres a link to all fortress models..
http://www.fortresseating.com/directory.php?cat_id=1

I looked and sat in nearly every chair at Cedia.. without a doubt there are only a few companies that produce the same quality of chair.. but the quality does come at a price.

If your comparing prices of Fortress to Berklines, Pallisers etc.. be ready for sticker shock... if looking at higher end chairs like Elite or CineAK.. Fortress is in the same price range.



The fortress Californian (my 3rd option above) is their entry level Quick ship chair, shipped as seen in Black 50/50 leather only. The other chairs are build custom on a per order basis, you tell them what you need, width, seat height, back height etc..

Although it looks like I'm going this way now.. I still remain unsure that the recliner is an integral requirement. This view may change as soon as I've watched a few movies. (wouldn't mind hearing differing opinions on the "Need" for a recliner still)


As for the chairs, I really like the one with the rounded arms, first picture.


Its really a tough decision for me,, like everything I've over analized and spent way to long trying to make "just the right decision" for just the right size, in just the right color, with just the right style, for just the right look...:o

Sounds like a nitpick, but after all is said and done, these little ergonomic details will make or break the whole project!

Doesn't sound like a nitpick at all.. The Devils in the details.!!

Please tell us more about the chairs.

After reading my post.. are you sorry you asked??:o

Absolutely one of my favorite theaters. It is stunning! Great job on all the woodwork.

A question about your IB configuration and why you went with two openings? I have not seen that set up before, only the more traditional 4 drivers in one opening. Is set up the same and are you driving all the subs as if it was a single opening/sub? Is there any concern about getting flutter in the screen from air movement??

Thanks Dude.. The dual Manifold is fairly common in this forum.. Check out, moggie, cathan and now Stock monkey's build.... I honestly can not answer your question about screen movement.. I've not had a screen in front of mine yet... I know I asked many people on many different forums including the Cult and every said they never had an issue...

Tony's recent post is the first report I've seen where someone states its an issue.. So Im keeping my fingers crossed..

Holy cow! 103+ THOUSAND views.
They're all for that gardening post I bet, LOL That was hysterical!
Had tears in my eyes while reading that, I was laughing so hard.

If you break it down on average daily basisover the nearly 3 years its taking me.... :rolleyes:

I'm going to be contrary and suggest chair #2 (chair #3 as second choice). The first one is a little to modern to work in this room IMHO. The caveat is that my wife tells me I have no taste whatsoever -- despite the reminder that I married her.
If someone held a gun to my head thats the choice Id make today. Fortress's most popular model also..


Carpet choice sounds nice, in retrospect I kind of wish I has added a black border - not enough to add it now, but you know.

Chairs look nice too - any difference in back height? Mine are a little too high for my height, so you might want to give that some thought, to not impact surrounds.

The carpet should arrive next Friday.. so Ill say that we'll know if it was the right decision before Thanksgiving..

Im glad you brought up the back height.. regardless of the chair I order I need to determine the correct height so it doesn't interfere with the surrounds.. Im at 6'0" even. The standard choices are 24", 26", 28" for a back height and 38", 40", and 42" for the overall chair height. ( although they will build to any dimensions desired).

I was going to ask the fortress guys but I wouldn't mind what you guys would recommend based on your experiences

Back height that can provide decent head support without to much interference..????

My next update should show a completed wall with all the "Bling"....:D:D

Thanks
Brad

Ah,

Just think, one day you will look back and just laugh at all of the agony you put yourself though "just trying to pick out seating" pfffttt.

All joking aside Mrs. RTROSE says I agonize over decisions regarding the theater more than any other decision period. I have to remind her this is serious stuff.

For the new round of chairs, I like the very first chairs and the chair in the last photo. Very unique look to them. As for the recliner part, I completely agree. I have yet to go to a multiplex and "recline" as for at home the only thing a recliner encourages me to do is fall asleep!

Good luck in your quest. I have complete faith that you will get the "right" chair, your previous decisions have got you to this point and I can say with certainty those have been fantastic.

Regards,

RTROSE

I like all three as well. Aesthetically I'd choose #1 too, because it's more unique. However, I use the arms on my chairs to hold all sorts of things, and the rounded arm would not allow for that. Does it look like the cup holder is further back in the arm than the others? If so, that wouldn't work either. My drink needs to fall naturally into my hand like the gear shift of a well designed sports car. :) I know. Sounds like a nitpick, but after all is said and done, these little ergonomic details will make or break the whole project!


Doesn't sound like a nitpick at all.. The Devils in the details.!!


Couldn't agree more, Once your enjoying your theater for extended periods of time, comfort will be the most important thing. That first chair reminds me of the first time I saw Elite seating, totally blown away by them, but with the cup-holders being that far back you will be find it odd placing and removing drinks from them during a movie.

I like seat 3.

I'd thought I'd offer my experience on the question of whether an IB sub behind the screen can result in screen movement.

My dual IB install (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=20064498#post20064498) is similar to Brad's but the subs are mounted lower and are almost completely under the screen I also have less distance between the screen wall and true wall than Brad's and most other builds. It is clear to me that the IB subs have the power to move cloth placed in front of them. In some silly testing I played some super intense Saturn rocket launch LFE effects and the GOM FR701 in front of the subs was visibly flapping. This is a very porous cloth.. During the same tests I put my hand on the screen cloth and could feel the vibrations but from the first row of seats could not make out any movement whatsoever. I also wonder if my curved screen is helping to minimize the movement since I would think that a large flat piece of cloth is more likely to vibrate with the pressure waves.

Hey Brad - I'm a little late to this seating party, but I looked into the Califonian as well. I assume you know already know this, but I don't think they're available with power recline. They were the right aesthetic for my room but the lack of power recline made me look elsewhere. Lots of people here told me how important the power recline was...I ended up getting powered chairs and they were right - being able to stop the seat anywhere between upright and full recline is a great feature. Just my 2 cents. Good luck with your choice!

Your theatre is gorgeous, man!!! WOW! :eek:

I LOVE those 40's club chairs. Did the carpet come in yet?

the californians can be ordered with motorized recline.

Your theatre is gorgeous, man!!! WOW! :eek:

I LOVE those 40's club chairs. Did the carpet come in yet?

The carpets in and in..

the californians can be ordered with motorized recline.

and they were..

Today marks 993 days since the start of my build thread, and the elves have been working at a feverish pace to complete the room before Christmas.

Lacking only the application of the FR701 to the exposed area at the bottom of the soffits and the arrival of the seats on Tue/Wed of next week.

The arrival of the seats will, at least in my book, officially bring phase one of my journey to an end.

So for you folks out there who have been following along at home, watching this wild and crazy action packed adventure unfold, the nail biting will soon be coming to an end:rolleyes:.. stay tuned for my next pictorial update on 12/1/2011 -MY....

1000 day Anniversary:cool:


... a simple quote for everyone building a room that find themselves pondering mass law, transmission loss, Delany and Bazley, the speed of sound, snells law, boundries, adiabatic vs. isothermic conditions, and particle velocity, then wondering why your 3 years into a build......

"The Romans would never have found time to conquer the world if they had been obliged first to learn Latin."
Heinrich Heine (1797 - 1856)

Happy Thanksgiving Everyone!!
Brad

I can honestly say that 1000 days for you has been 1000 days of quality workmanship. Thank you for sharing your build. It has been fun to follow.

Awesome, can't wait. Yours is truly an awesome build. The fruits of your labor are truly visible and well worth the effort.

Looking forward to your pictorial update.

Happy Thanksgiving.

Regards,

RTROSE

Brad - fantastic build and one of the inspirational ones on record. can't wait to see your Cali chairs in this space. Thx for sharing.

Love the pictures of the carpet in the "Show Your Screen Wall" thread. You made a great choice with the red carpet and I like the simple pattern in it. How do you like the black border (you know I like it :-) )?

Hey!

I just realized it is 12/6/2011 where is your 1000 day pictorial update? I'm not letting you off the hook that easy! We want pics.....we want pics.....we want pics......

The natives are getting restless.

Regards,

RTROSE

Love the pictures of the carpet in the "Show Your Screen Wall" thread. You made a great choice with the red carpet and I like the simple pattern in it. How do you like the black border (you know I like it :-) )?

I really like the way the carpet came out, the burgandy seems to go well with the woodwork, and I like the black border. It does show everything though!!



Hey!

I just realized it is 12/6/2011 where is your 1000 day pictorial update? I'm not letting you off the hook that easy! We want pics.....we want pics.....we want pics......

The natives are getting restless.

Regards,

RTROSE

I Know, I Know... Historically I'm know for being overzealous with my timelines.. 3 years to build a single room should tell ya something.....

Chairs were a week late, arrived last night. I had taken photos last week, but didnt think they portrayed the room very well. So the New Camera (Nikon D7000) arrived on Friday.. 6 gazillion buttons and settings, and a manual as thick as a phone book.. just starting to learn my way around it....

Here are the shots I put in the Show me your Screen wall thread

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/Screenwall1.jpg

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC_0081.jpg

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/Speakerlights.jpg

More to come...



Brad



ppssst... watched a movie last night.. it was all worth it!:D

Sexy with the lights off or lights on! Nice work!!

Looking good already, looking forward to the rest. Congrats!

Very cool Brad! I really like the black edging on the carpet -- it works perfectly. So what movie did you watch?

Wow, simply stunning. Everything is looking fantastic. Can't wait to see some more pics of your endeavor. Well done.

Regards,

RTROSE

Ill get more pics as soon as I get a little more time with the camera..

Very cool Brad! I really like the black edging on the carpet -- it works perfectly. So what movie did you watch?

The boys and I wanted to see "300", the wife wanted to watch "Avatar", so we were out voted 1 to 3.... Avatar it was...:cool:

The boys and I wanted to see "300", the wife wanted to watch "Avatar", so we were out voted 1 to 3.... Avatar it was...:cool:

lol. That is the universal truth, mars and venus kind of stuff... and why I'm always watch "my" movies by myself.

What? Avatar is a great movie.......300 is better but, er well ah I understand totally. Women...sheesh!

Regards,

RTROSE

:eek:

That looks fantastic! I'm so glad that you're in there and watching movies now! YEAH!

I am a new member and have just started to build my theatre room but after seeing yours I just want to quit! I think mine will look like the "dollar store" version compared to yours! You have some incredible skill!

I am a new member and have just started to build my theatre room but after seeing yours I just want to quit! I think mine will look like the "dollar store" version compared to yours! You have some incredible skill!

Hello and welcome.

First let me say you need not feel that way. There are many different skill sets, experience levels, and budgets here. That is what makes AVS such a great resource. I feel your pain though as looking at Brad's theater makes my own building skills quite pedestrian for sure. :o But like I said that is what it is all about.

I would encourage you to start a build thread to share your journey and to solicit advise from the wealth of information here.

Regards,

RTROSE

Hello and welcome.

First let me say you need not feel that way. There are many different skill sets, experience levels, and budgets here. That is what makes AVS such a great resource. I feel your pain though as looking at Brad's theater makes my own building skills quite pedestrian for sure. :o But like I said that is what it is all about.

I would encourage you to start a build thread to share your journey and to solicit advise from the wealth of information here.

Regards,

RTROSE

Thanks for the welcome. Brad's skill are pretty awesome.

I like you suggestion about starting a thread about my journey. As I have already seen I can get lots of feed back and help on here. Plus maybe somebody can learn from me or more to the point, learn from my mistakes!

I am a new member and have just started to build my theatre room but after seeing yours I just want to quit! I think mine will look like the "dollar store" version compared to yours! You have some incredible skill!

Hehehe, take a look at mine (my living room). I might have some good gear, but its been a long journey to get it. Otherwise its just furniture and paint on the walls......

Audio is a journey of a lifetime :).

P.S. I started with a HTIAB Sony setup. My first "real" step into audio was a pair of Polk Monitor 60's, a Polk CS2 Center, Polk Monitor 40 surrounds and that same Sony receiver.

I have put in lots more cash since then but its been 3 years as well. Everyones got to start somewhere....

P-H-E-NOMINAL! Very unique and seems like a special room. Congrats Brad.

In the pic below, your black border carpet looks like it laps over the patterned carpet; is that so?

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/Screenwall1.jpg

Thanks for the comments guys, its much appreciated.

I actually enjoyed Avatar more than 300, the visuals were superior. I also enjoyed it far more this time around than when we saw in the multiplex.:)

I am a new member and have just started to build my theatre room but after seeing yours I just want to quit! I think mine will look like the "dollar store" version compared to yours! You have some incredible skill!

Welcome Rock, actually it was only about 10% skill, 60% time and 80% money... wait... thats 150%... still seems right though. Like RT said, start a thread and you'll get all the advice/help you need from the forum.

Snip...

P.S. I started with a HTIAB Sony setup. My first "real" step into audio was a pair of Polk Monitor 60's, a Polk CS2 Center, Polk Monitor 40 surrounds and that same Sony receiver.

I have put in lots more cash since then but its been 3 years as well. Everyones got to start somewhere....

I know it's continuously echoed on the forum, but I would like to reinforce the importance of soundproofing, based on my personal experience, for people just beginning their journey.

Like many I spent 10's of thousands of $$$ on equip over the decades and inevitability was disappointed once things were home and set up. When I started my theater, I dont think I had ever been in a room that had been purposed built for either music or video. (even the demo rooms at your local equip dealer don't stack up) After finding AVS and reading the input from the pro's and the experiences of others, I basically took a leap of faith, and did as much as I could for sound proofing.

Over the last couple of weeks, I've been able to experience the difference it makes, I never realized what I was missing before, I had never heard alot of the nuances that are present in both both music and movies.

Roughly I figure the total cost for lumber/dwall/ Green Glue was ~ < 5k to build a room within a room with 2 dampening layers (OSB,GG,Dwall,GG). So say roughly a 3500 bump over costs for building a standard framed room.

This 3500 "investment" did more for the quality of the reproduction than any piece of equipment I had ever bought. Combine this with professionally designed room layout and treatments (available at ~ $600), and you have a winning combo, at a price point far less than even a mid range system. So keep your HTIB for now and put you money in the room... you'll be amazed.


P-H-E-NOMINAL! Very unique and seems like a special room. Congrats Brad.

In the pic below, your black border carpet looks like it laps over the patterned carpet; is that so?


Thanks Mike. I saw exactly what your seeing when I posted the pic. not sure why it looks that way, I think it was because of the way I vacuumed it or something.

I had spent a lot of time finding the "right" black with the same/similar cut as the center insert. Here's a close up of that same area

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC00533.jpg

I think the guys did a heck of a job, especially considering the pile of the carpet.

how did they get all the cuts the same? I assume that is something manually cut on site, right?

Amazing job Brad. You're a humble fellow, but we all are in awe of your vision and the skills needed to bring it.

Glad you're happy with the soundproofing

how did they get all the cuts the same? I assume that is something manually cut on site, right?

I cut a template from a piece of luaun that they used to cut one part of the radii(dont remember if he cut the black or burgandy first) then he overlayed this to cut the matching piece, and repeated for each corner.

you should have seen him roll his eyes when I told him what I wanted originally....


Amazing job Brad. You're a humble fellow, but we all are in awe of your vision and the skills needed to bring it.

Glad you're happy with the soundproofing

Thank you Ted, and I greatly appreciate the assistance from you and John over the last couple of years....

I have been following for about a year and this is really incredible Brad. Very inspirational. Well done sir!

Brad,

I'm late to applaud you on this EXCELLENT THEATER.
Clearly a stunning result.

Any chance we will see this in any of the publications, because it is more than worthy !

Brad,

Awesome job! I just noticed you finished. Don't know how I missed it. I really like how the carpet came out too. Very cool!

jim

Very unique and amazing theater, I love all the woodwork!

Thanks Guys, Im waiting on another lens and trying to figure out the camera to get some better room shots.

The QSC DSP322ua showed up on Friday and I installed it in the rack.

For Christmas, Im giving myself a visit from one of DE's guys. He will visit for a couple of days next week to EQ everything, set the room curves,etc.. I was really torn about jumping off of the DIY bandwagon on this, and although I enjoy the tweaking and fiddling, he will accomplish in 2 days what would have taken me several months with lesser results. After nearly 3 years I really want to start enjoying the theater to its fullest.

Brad,

Awesome job! I just noticed you finished. Don't know how I missed it. I really like how the carpet came out too. Very cool!

jim

I'm really not done done, but close enough to meet my commitment to the family for "Movies by Christmas".

Several large items on the to-do list:
I have plenty of room to move the seats forward or backwards, once we start tuning the room, the placement can be selected based on the best response.

Once the seat placement is finalized Ill be able to see exactly how much room I have to the rear wall and then I can decide on a small riser and a couple more seats or a bar and bar stools, or nothing..etc. My concern has always been the seats for "us" and I was never trying to squeeze in alot of seating for overflow.

I still have the front of the hush box and the ceiling to complete. Ill build the ceiling feature finished in sections and then just carry into the room and mount completed without disrupting anything in the room. I have power ran there already and Im toying with the idea of an led/fiber combo for a star ceiling insert. similar to Isky star ceiling panels, or I may just build something unique.

I also just ordered my perimeter seals and automatic door bottom for the entry.


I did take pictures of one of the room features that Im very happy with:
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC_0136_01.jpg

The entrance to the Equipment room...

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv100/Bradathomedotcom/DSC_0138_01.jpg

:D my kids think the hidden door is really cool..

The "craft room" has turned out EXCELLENT! I wish you and the family a lifetime of joy. Thanks for your tedious documentation here as well. You are certainly an asset to the community. :)

You know, there's no appropriate place on the forum for the continuation of all our hard work. So many threads go through an incredible build process only to die off once completed. We never document the real purpose of our theaters. I hope you will consider at least a report every once in awhile commenting on the use of the room. It would be interesting to hear, over time, which things worked better or not than planned for.

As a new member to the community and your new neighbor(moved to Indiana in March 2011), I had to stop by and say that I love your theater! The work you have done is Amazing! I'm actually having a house built right now and hopefully will be closing at the end of the month. I can't wait until I can actually start on my build. Great job and enjoy.

Good choice to bring a pro in for the EQ. You've earned it.

We never document the real purpose of our theaters. It would be interesting to hear, over time, which things worked better or not than planned for.
Definately a good point Tony. The "What I would do differently next time" thread started by Dennis has sort of died off. We follow every agonizing decision of the build but seldom find out what was important...or not...in the end.

As so many have already said, this theater is simply stunning.

The QSC DSP322ua showed up on Friday and I installed it in the rack.

For Christmas, Im giving myself a visit from one of DE's guys. He will visit for a couple of days next week to EQ everything, set the room curves,etc..

Brad, I assume from the QSC purchase that you are putting all channels through the EQ? Does that mean you are not using the Anthem ARC room correction? I'd be very curious to hear about the process the experts go through. Be sure to watch carefully and report back ;)

BTW I looked at your initial rendering in your first post and must they that you went of the tracks somewhere along the build and thank goodness you did. Incredible looking result. You are going to have fun showing it off to all the Christmas guests.

Tony / DavidK...

I have a whole basement left to finish, including a bar that I plan to build in a similar "ornate/wood" style as the theater, and the kids are already pushing for the bathroom so they dont have to go upstairs when their in the basement. (Am I the only one that pees in the sump pit here? ) If people are interested Ill keep the thread going.

Over the last year I've thought about what I would have done different on a regular basis. Ill write something up soon, I think your right people can benefit from our collective experiences.

Torrmar...

Welcome to the neighborhood, I'm ~ 20 min up I69 from Fishers. Took a peek at your build thread, you'll have a very nice space to work with. Along the lines of "what I would do differently", I would honestly recommend that you not drive a nail or purchase a single piece of equipment until you have a "Complete" start to finish "detailed" plan for your theater. This single piece of advice would have saved me a significant amount of both time and money.

Dave...

I'm oddly excited about Adam coming to tune everything.. not to mention it got me out of going to the in laws for Christmas.:cool:

Brad, I assume from the QSC purchase that you are putting all channels through the EQ? Does that mean you are not using the Anthem ARC room correction? I'd be very curious to hear about the process the experts go through. Be sure to watch carefully and report back ;)

BTW I looked at your initial rendering in your first post and must they that you went of the tracks somewhere along the build and thank goodness you did. Incredible looking result. You are going to have fun showing it off to all the Christmas guests.

Yup.. I fell off track a little.. mostly due to the lack of a plan initially and just rolling with it..that and the beer..;)

I'll be watching very closely.. my curiosity continues to build the more I play with the system and ARC-1 has me a little baffled with what it does.

I've ran ARC several times in its standard mode, The standard mode makes all decisions for you, your only task is moving the mic to a min of 5 positions separated by at least 2 feet..the ARC averages these points to make its "Decision" accordingly.

I've repeated this with the 5 points centralized around the 2 center seats and with them spread around the entire seating area, at listening position and in front then behind.. all of these positioning scenarios appear to have little impact on the settings ARC wants to make... I'm guessing its because of the averaging. just for kicks I was going to run it with the Mic at the same position (my seat) for the 5 tests to see how it impacts the automagic settings.

I honestly dont care for the results from ARC so far, and prefer the basic set up that I had originally put in the processor. ARC also didn't seem to play well when using both sub outputs for the IB.. and I ended up running one output to the EP and changed the dip switches from stereo to parallel mode, until I can get a "Y" XLR to feed the 2 channels in the BFD from a single output.

I've only started playing with the advanced mode in ARC the last couple of days. In the advanced mode you can force the room gain, cross overs, response cutoff etc..

This is all for Nil at this point, with Adam coming but it is good clean fun..:p

If I get ambitious this weekend I may run REW and we'll be able to compare the differences in the results from ARC and and what Adam does with the DSP.

On a side note.. i can say i have not seen any movement in the screen from the IB's but as you mentioned previously you can see a "little" in the 701 around the screen.. probably just the difference in tension of the material.

Congrats on finishing. Your not too far from me either, my sister is up in Anderson which is right around where you seem to be located.

Enjoy getting the EQ dialed in, thats when in all that accoustic works pays off.

One day I will have one of these threads, until then I just have to keep doing what I can about my room as I move from apartment to apartment (within the WAF limits of course :))

Congrats on finishing Brad! I have been in awe of your woodworking along the way. The results are incredible. Hope you relax and enjoy for a while.
One of DE's guys paying you a visit should be a very nice X-mas present.

If I get ambitious this weekend I may run REW and we'll be able to compare the differences in the results from ARC and and what Adam does with the DSP.

I for one would be very interested in the differences. I've been toying with the idea of running my LCR channels through an EQ and doing it manually. Audessey MultiEQ didn't wow me either although I do like the DSX wide speakers.

Merry Christmas.

Have you noticed any sag issues with the way you mounted the IB subs up front now that they have been in for a little while? I'm looking at doing a similar setup and mounting them the way you have yours would work out best for me. I didn't notice but did you end up adding in additional bracing for the boxes?

Vanice - you should start a build thread if you are thinking about an IB sub. Even if you are in the planning stages it would be a good time to start. We need more IB subs here.

The FI drivers are very stiff and doubt they would sag much. Even if they did, KNKKNK has so much headroom that even if he lost half the output he'd still likely never use everything he has left.

Planning to here shortly. Construction will start next week so I guess I had better get on it. Need to leave plenty of time for people to improve my design. :)

Sound better now that my buddy did some magic for you?

Sound better now that my buddy did some magic for you?

Arc-1: "Arky Smarky":rolleyes:

Haven't left the room in two days, and my jaw hurts from grinnin!

I lack the vocabulary to describe what Adam accomplished with the parametric eq so we'll stick with "magic".

The best way I can attempt to describe the results, is that I've gone from watching concerts/movies to being in the middle of them, regardless of the venue, the room is now able to recreate the ambiance of environments ranging from a small jazz clubs to large halls, with such realism that your easily transported to a different place and time. Watching "Adele Live at the Royal Albert Hall" is nothing short of "goose bumpy" now that I have front row seats "in" the hall.

We did end up moving the seating position back ~ 12" for improved response. After installation of the additional Triad in wall subs, Adam dialed them in with the IB and the tactile response of the room became indescribable. Jumping / Ducking have become normal activities during movies now. The experience is truly difficult to put into words, and a first for me.

The opportunity to watch Adam work did as much for my personal education as it did for the room. After a couple of years of digesting acoustical principals/theories from text and the forum, it was an enlightening experience to watch a true professional bridge the gap to practical application. Not to mention he accomplished this with a 6 foot, 180 pound monkey tethered to his backside for two days.

Overall I was exceptionally pleased with the room's performance. From memory, we found one rattle at ~ 39 hz in the arch, easily corrected with one screw, and another in one of sconces that I believe was around 48 hz. Some work to do on the hush box still, but other than that I believe an NC24 may have been the highest reading, and thats without the door seals. Honestly there were so many numbers flying around I need to wait on Adams official report for the technical details.

Originally I thought I was saving a couple of months by having Adam visit rather than running through the process myself. But now I feel that even if I had possessed the 50K or so worth of equipment he lugs around, I may never have achieved the same results, and I now view the entire process as "Art" mixed with supporting technology.

"How good is good?" ... Bottom line is, without having committed to this process I would never have known what I was missing, since I lacked a baseline for comparison.

Oh.. and i guess a good accoustical design never hurts either;)

Have you noticed any sag issues with the way you mounted the IB subs up front now that they have been in for a little while? I'm looking at doing a similar setup and mounting them the way you have yours would work out best for me. I didn't notice but did you end up adding in additional bracing for the boxes?

Cant say as I have noticed any Sag, but then again cant honestly say I've put much time in looking for it either... based on my limited understanding i dont believe that sag is as large a concern now with improvements in cone/suspension materials as it was several years ago..

an interesting comment about the IB and Adams recent visit... after the initial readings were taken, Adam modeled the room and the actuals were not lining up very well with the model. after some head scratching it was determined that below certain frequencies the front was was not the front wall, the front wall was actually the rear wall of the IB chamber... in retrospect this makes perfect sense considering the two big holes cut in the front.

Had Adam ever worked with a room with an IB sub before? Did he have any comments on the performance side? I would imagine that its something he does not see very often and usually works with commercially produced subs.

After several hours of pink noise.. Im not sure I heard everything he said...:cool:
He was very familiar with IB's, and didnt seem to have any issues at all phasing in the rears with them. I like most others chose probably the worst starting position for the IB/manifolds.. dead center on the front wall. (rather than at a quarter point as example) this placement also prevents us from building a baffle wall to reduce/eliminate SBIR.

We didn't discuss specific performance differences between these and sealed subs.. but 1/2 way through the second day his smile was nearly as big as mine, He truly enjoys his work.
I'm trying not to sound repetitive but the tactile feeling in the room is phenominal, and the LFs seem so so clean and effortless... unlike anything I've ever heard. The only specific comment I can remember is him saying "You can really pressurize this room"

The BFD was retired and everything ran through the QSC DSP, any reservations I myself may have had regarding the IB after my feeble attempts to eq were completely put to rest by the time he was finished. I wouldn't hesitate to do it the same way again.

I like most others chose probably the worst starting position for the IB/manifolds.. dead center on the front wall. (rather than at a quarter point as example) this placement also prevents us from building a baffle wall to reduce/eliminate SBIR.


Can you discuss this point a little further? I'm not sure I follow. Thanks.

Brad - This is going to sound backwards, but thank you very much for the opportunity to work in your room. The build and finish quality was easily on par with rooms I have been involved with that were designed and built by some of the best in the industry. You should be extremely proud of what you have accomplished. All of that, and a gracious host. Although I did mention a few design changes I would have suggested, the smile on your face and mine obviously prove any issues were far from insurmountable! Kudos also for recognizing when you needed additional outside advice/expertise and getting Dennis involved.

Brad was working in his home office the first few hours on the second day of the cal, so luckily he missed watching me throw all of my professionalism to the wayside, while I ignored my measurement equipment and demo material, and simply bounced around the room rocking out to some of my favorite personal tunes. I truly do have a great job.

There were a few difficult processes I needed to work through, and although the room was greatly improved at the end of the first day, I was certainly not satisfied. But after 10+ hours of listening and measuring, the ear-brain circuitry was starting to smoke. A good long chat that evening with co-conspirator Jamin helped clear up some thought paths, and I resurfaced the next morning with fresh ears. Within a few hours, both the IB's and Klipsch LCR's had been tamed.

The room certainly has a visceral impact to it now. I liked to describe it as a "growl". Drums and LFE special effects were incredibly Dynamic, and the Response was very smooth; upright bass riffs were accurate and very musical. It isn't always easy to accomplish both dynamics and smooth low freq response, as it requires a number of things to have been done right before the room is calibrated, and the right tools be available to the calibrator. Brad's room is definitely a good model to follow.

Of course, bass is not all there is to a quality dedicated home cinema. Dialogue Clarity is critical, and a good balance of Focus and Envelopment is required to provide reasonable suspension of belief and complete immersion into what ever you are watching or listening to. This room easily transports the listener from an intimate jazz club to a drafty cathedral in a blink of an eye and a press of the 'next' button.

Great fun, Brad. Enjoy it...you truly earned it!

Brad,

Your craftsmanship is spectacular and one who has dabbled in woodworking surely can appreciate the level of detail you have committed to. Truly outstanding.

While I enjoy the many pics of the front and sides of your threater, I cant help but wonder what the back of the room looks like...I dont seem to see many pics....got any?

Brad,

Your craftsmanship is spectacular and one who has dabbled in woodworking surely can appreciate the level of detail you have committed to. Truly outstanding.

While I enjoy the many pics of the front and sides of your threater, I cant help but wonder what the back of the room looks like...I dont seem to see many pics....got any?


Ah, now we will see KNKKNK's (Brad's) dirty little secret. The back of the theater is where he dumped all of his wood shavings, scrap wood and fabric. All who enter the theater are SWORN to a non disclosure agreement about it. :D

Actually this is a very good question and I'm curious too.

Regards,

RTROSE

Alright,

Well today I had the opportunity and pleasure of meeting Brad and getting a full demo of his theater. Let me tell you that there are very few times that I am speechless, seeing Brad's theater "in the flesh" was one of those times. Pictures of his space do not even come close to capturing the details, level of craftsmanship, and pride that has gone into his theater. His theater is truly stunning and we have not even gotten to the demo part yet! I was really looking forward to meeting Brad and seeing his space. I was especially looking forward to seeing the Lions in person and they are truly beautiful pieces of art. They fit his space perfectly. I can't even begin to cover all of the woodworking that Brad has included in his space, everywhere you look there is interesting woodworking details. Brad's theater is an extremely comfortable space with everything in proportion and it all "works" together. Brad's has some serious woodworking skills, but is completely humble and unassuming about his accomplishment. He is definitely like a lot of us who have to tend to some OCD tendencies when it comes to all things theater fussing over the smallest details. I can identify with that!

I don't know exactly how long I was at his home, several hours for sure, but we watched a wide variety of material and the image and audio were top notch. Brad has been holding out on us a little and he has added a couple of in wall subs as well as his four 18" driver IB sub setup. Let me tell you that his sub setup totally pressurizes his room and waves of LFE wash over you. I heard things in scenes I did not know were there. Watching a movie in Brad's theater is an "experience" or "event" you just don't simply watch a movie, it is much much more than that. One of the demos we watched was a live concert on BR and it was easy to lose yourself in the music. Brad had Adam Pelz come in and calibrate his room. You can tell that Adam worked his voodoo magic on the room as everything was in proportion and well balanced.

We also talked about life, work, and family. I had the chance to meet his family and eat some pizza. It is nice to meet another HT fanatic face to face and share a common interest.

Thanks again Brad for the opportunity to enjoy your space and for your hospitality.

Regards,

RTROSE

Thanks for sharing! I guess he is okay :) JK of course!

?..... I like most others chose probably the worst starting position for the IB/manifolds.. dead center on the front wall. (rather than at a quarter point as example).........

I'm considering an IB for my space, so this comment caught my attention. Seems like conventional wisdom on the other forums is to put it front and center. Where would you recommend putting an IB?

BTW, this is an awesome theater!

I'm considering an IB for my space, so this comment caught my attention. Seems like conventional wisdom on the other forums is to put it front and center. Where would you recommend putting an IB?

BTW, this is an awesome theater!

This research paper is quite easy reading.

Harman Kardon Paper (http://www.harman.com/EN-US/OurCompany/Technologyleadership/Documents/White%20Papers/multsubs.pdf)

According to this center wall placement is not necessarily bad; actually two subs center of two opposing walls is one of the recommended solutions.

Please keep in mind that this method does not necessarily produce FLAT bass response at seating locations, and most likely will not. What is does accomplish is a smooth/similar bass response from seat to seat, so global PEq can be applied effectively. Take note of the "Limiting Assumptions" slide.

Sorry Guys, I've been neglecting my thread:o
I'll get more pics of the rest of the room posted soon, back included;)

RT.. Wow! thanks for the kind words. I sincerely enjoyed your visit and our conversations, it was refreshing to show the theater to someone who appreciates all the various aspects of what goes into a room.

Jeff C.. Ah.. proof of life.. been waiting on your star ceiling update. Curious about your impressions of the light engine you chose. I've been contemplating a small star ceiling that I can implement with out having to run fibers back to a large illuminator.

I'm considering an IB for my space, so this comment caught my attention. Seems like conventional wisdom on the other forums is to put it front and center. Where would you recommend putting an IB?

BTW, this is an awesome theater!

JPA.. Please dont base any of your design desicions on my incoherant ramblings.. my earlier post was more of an overall refrence to having only a single sub on the front wall (like most) and the need to add the triads to smooth the response. Additionally at that time I was thinking that my manifold height was causing a frequency notch at my previous seating position because it was equidistant to both the ceiling and the side walls. :rolleyes:

Regardless of the placement of the IB (or any sub), I think the important thing to take away from the Welti paper Moggie posted is that Multible subs, with locations other than just the front wall, will be required to reduce the total variation across the seating area.

Using the Harmon paper to illustrate my overly simplistic, less technical, understanding of the "multiple subs" concept:

Configurations 1-5, 8 & 9 in investigation 4 from the paper where all subs are located on the front wall only, the results are similar for the MIN-Max variation regardless of the number of subs used. Although we can increase the number of subs or increase the SPL (think IB) at these locations, it wont necessairly (and most likely will not) improve the overall response across all seating positions becasue we are just adding more energy to any existing modal issues, additionally we end up needing to add more treatments to suck this excess energy back out of the room.

Another important behavior from the various placements can be observed in configurations 21 and 23 from investigation 6. (disregard SBIR issues with this placement for now) Note that although only a single sub is used, they have been moved away from the boundries more towards the center of the room and this configuration exhibits less min-max variation than configurations 22,24,25 where the subs are located "on" the front wall.

When the sub is moved away from boundries towards the center of the room the less energy we are feeding the room modes, so we get less variation in the SPL across a larger area, Although it's not practical in most situations to have a sub in the middle of your seating area, this general concept becomes important when considering the behavior of multible subs.

When two subs are located, say in opposing locations, such as in configuration 6, the resulting interaction of the 2 subs is very similar to the result you would get by placing a single sub in the center of the room.

These opposing subs create a single "imaginary sub" at a point between them, and through interfearence and reinforcement we in essence have moved thier combined output to the center of the room, thus realizing a similar reduction in the SPL variation that is seen with a sub actually placed away from the boundries.

And lastly as Adam pointed this consistancy does not necessairly translate into good but once the variation has been minimized, then parametric Eq can be used to flatten the response.

Also note that although the harmon paper emphasizes an even number subs at symetric locations there are other approaches that can be used to create this imaginary sub and a consistant response at your seating locations that may offer more flexibility in meeting specific needs/constraints of a room


I've not had any alcohal yet today, so hopefully this was somewhat coherant, I realize this is an extremely overly simplistic view of a complex subject, but this is how I got the need for "multiple subs" to fit into my box. Maybe others can correct any my misconceptions.

This research paper is quite easy reading.

Harman Kardon Paper (http://www.harman.com/EN-US/OurCompany/Technologyleadership/Documents/White%20Papers/multsubs.pdf)

According to this center wall placement is not necessarily bad; actually two subs center of two opposing walls is one of the recommended solutions.

Thanks Moggie.. Heres another refrence from cedia that has some cool depictions of the spatial deviation from various sub configurations.

http://www.cediacrosspoint.com/content/subwoofer-optimization

This one was eaiser for me to try to grasp ... because of the pictures:)

Thanks for the posts, Moggie and KNKKNK. I remember reading about that in Toole's book, but had forgotten it. So that was a good refresher for me. Sadly, it seems like there is always an, "It depends." So there's no one size fits all solution.

But it sounds like this will at least allow me to make some informed decisions about sub location.