Hi Guys,

I am looking to buy a top of the line media player for my living room/home theatre. I am looking for something that essentially does what the Popcorn Hour A-110 does but has far better audio and video playback, along with a better interface. Cost is not an issue within reason (sub $2500).

It needs to do the following:

Perfect FLAC playback... as good as a Classe or Lyngdorf Cd Player
Excellent Video Playback... Playing Ripped Blu Rays and various media types (avi, mpeg...)
Excellent Interface.... Something like a Kaleidescape Interface
Ethernet Connectivity... to Connect to a Media Server


Your help is much appreciated!

Hi Guys,

I am looking to buy a top of the line media player for my living room/home theatre. I am looking for something that essentially does what the Popcorn Hour A-110 does but has far better audio and video playback, along with a better interface. Cost is not an issue within reason (sub $2500).

It needs to do the following:

Perfect FLAC playback... as good as a Classe or Lyngdorf Cd Player
Excellent Video Playback... Playing Ripped Blu Rays and various media types (avi, mpeg...)
Excellent Interface.... Something like a Kaleidescape Interface
Ethernet Connectivity... to Connect to a Media Server


Your help is much appreciated!

Farris, not to be a cynic, because lately I'm being accused of being too negative...but honestly, what you are looking for simply doesn't exist. Don't you think your expectations are WAYYY too high? You want audio playback equivalent to 4-figure CD players, a plethora of file types supported...and an interface to rival a 5-figure video streamer? And you want it for under $2500. Probably the only thing that would come remotely close is something you would build yourself.

But even then, you couldn't get the kind of audio playback you seek. IMO, the only FLAC streamers that will get you the kind of SQ you're looking for are a Squeezebox or Sonos into a good external DAC, or a Transporter. And NONE of them do video.

Just out of curiousity, what makes you think the PCH has anything less than excellent video playback, and a sexy GUI in YAMJ? My A-110 looks FLAWLESS on my Kuro, and I'm getting ready to test it on the big screen in the HT.

CD

I have read reviews of the popcorn hour and it seems to have mediocre sound quality and some smearing on HD movies.

So there is no kind of high end popcorn hour? Is there one available at any price point?

As I am spending about $50k on other equipment I want something really good quality.




Farris, not to be a cynic, because lately I'm being accused of being too negative...but honestly, what you are looking for simply doesn't exist. Don't you think your expectations are WAYYY too high? You want audio playback equivalent to 4-figure CD players, a plethora of file types supported...and an interface to rival a 5-figure video streamer? And you want it for under $2500. Probably the only thing that would come remotely close is something you would build yourself.

But even then, you couldn't get the kind of audio playback you seek. IMO, the only FLAC streamers that will get you the kind of SQ you're looking for are a Squeezebox or Sonos into a good external DAC, or a Transporter. And NONE of them do video.

Just out of curiousity, what makes you think the PCH has anything less than excellent video playback, and a sexy GUI in YAMJ? My A-110 looks FLAWLESS on my Kuro, and I'm getting ready to test it on the big screen in the HT.

CD

I think your better off getting something like a mac mini with plex or something.

I heard that it doesn't have problems playing 1080p blue-ray rips, but can stutter occasionally? depending on the processor you got in the mini.

Mo

I am looking to buy a top of the line media player for my living room/home theatre. I am looking for something that essentially does what the Popcorn Hour A-110 does but has far better audio and video playback, along with a better interface. Cost is not an issue within reason (sub $2500).
[/B]

Hi Farris,

I am in a similar boat. I have spent the past 12 years in various phases of home theater development including 3 gun CRTs (prior to digital projectors), HTPCs, video calibration, etc. One area that I haven't focused on is the content side other than renting or buying media. Media streamers are something I have recently become interested in, however, they must be on par with the rest of my system from both an audio and visual perspective.

My current system:

DIY Statement speakers (replaces Magnepan 1.6QR 5.1 system) http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php4?t=29968
Parasound 2205A amp (soon to be replaced by DIY 400W Hypex Monoblocks)
Velodyne DD18 sub
Lumagen Radiance video processor
JVC RS-1 projector
DTV HDDVR
Panasonic 35(?) Blu-ray
Toshiba HD DVD XA2
B&K Reference 70 (replaces highly modified EAD TheaterMaster)
PreDAC (successor to the TADAC) on order

I am interested in the PCH provided that it doesn't impact the video quality of my Lumagen which I have used to calibrate the gray scale and remap the color coordinate system for the JVC RS1 in addition to providing excellent video processing. I have no reason to believe that it would but the PCH is doing some video processing and I am not clear yet on what that is. I have seen a couple of threads questioning the audio quality (at least for MP3s - which I don't care about). However, the TADAC (and hopefully it's successor the PreDAC) has been noted for it's ability to take a poor transport and make it sound like a high end model. So in the end, I may just buy one of these bad boys and try it out. At the price point they are selling for, it doesn't seem like a huge risk.

Mike

Take a look at the Netgear EVA9150. It just came out. I just got one, but have been too busy working to fully test it yet. It does support menus on iso's of DVD video, plays m2ts and ts files (Blu-Ray rips), supposedly can bitrstream at least some higher bitrate audio format through HDMI, and the video output can be adjusted (black level, contrast, saturation, hue). It has built in networking (wired and wireless a,b,g,n) and multi-room functionality (if you have more than one unit).

The menu structructure is somewhate convoluted and confusing, but it seems to work well.

I don't want a mac. I am a PC guy and need something that I can put in the rack and access via a pronto 9800 in the living room

The popcorn seemed perfect, but I think it might be a little bit too low end for my equipment.

dayvo,

Thanks for that.

Farris,

Setting high expectations is what drives our hobby forward ;)

Mike

I have read reviews of the popcorn hour and it seems to have mediocre sound quality and some smearing on HD movies.

So there is no kind of high end popcorn hour? Is there one available at any price point?

As I am spending about $50k on other equipment I want something really good quality.

Well, I'll vouch for the mediocre SQ...like I said, for the kind of audio you're looking for, I simply don't think you can go with a one-box solution. As far as video, the PCH might not offer absolutely perfect playback, but I think it's as good as any other streamer you're going to find. One thing you have to keep in mind with some of these reviews, is a streamer is very much a garbage-in, garbage-out kind of prospect. You don't know if the review you're reading is from some 17 year-old kid, who's compressing the hell out of a file, re-muxing, re-encoding, etc., etc. Like I said, straight .m2ts rip, no touching of the original file...my PCH looks fantastic on my Kuro...and I'm not someone who takes these things lightly either. Now, whether the PQ will hold up through my PJ, on the big stage and big screen, remains to be seen.

CD

I'd be real cautious about getting the Netgear product. A little reading about the two previous Netgear streamers would prove enlightening, and I speak from experience. They will abandon the hardware when it's half finished. Given that the 9150 is the same basic hardware as a PCH, this means that the performance won't be better, and oh yeah, Netgear is at least 6 months behind on firmware updates.

Jim L

Well, I'll vouch for the mediocre SQ...like I said, for the kind of audio you're looking for, I simply don't think you can go with a one-box solution. As far as video, the PCH might not offer absolutely perfect playback, but I think it's as good as any other streamer you're going to find. One thing you have to keep in mind with some of these reviews, is a streamer is very much a garbage-in, garbage-out kind of prospect. You don't know if the review you're reading is from some 17 year-old kid, who's compressing the hell out of a file, re-muxing, re-encoding, etc., etc. Like I said, straight .m2ts rip, no touching of the original file...my PCH looks fantastic on my Kuro...and I'm not someone who takes these things lightly either. Now, whether the PQ will hold up through my PJ, on the big stage and big screen, remains to be seen.

CD

Please let me know how it looks on the PJ. I am going to be using it with a 50 inch pioneer and a JVC HD 750 on a 110" wide screen.

Have you heard of this: http://www.logitech.com/index.cfm/speakers_audio/wireless_music_systems/devices/3163&cl=gb,en#

Would I need this and a popcorn hour? Is it overkill?

I don't want a mac. I am a PC guy and need something that I can put in the rack and access via a pronto 9800 in the living room

The popcorn seemed perfect, but I think it might be a little bit too low end for my equipment.

Oh oh...

I don't want a mac. I am a PC guy and need something that I can put in the rack and access via a pronto 9800 in the living room
um, is there any special reason you wouldn't just load XP on the mini?
The popcorn seemed perfect, but I think it might be a little bit too low end for my equipment.
well then the solution is simple...
Kaleidescape has a very nice 1080P player (http://www.kaleidescape.com/products/players/1080p/) that will fit right in with your other equipment...

Another noobie question here, I do like the PCH but I have heard that you need to be pretty tech savvy to use it, which i am absoutely not. I have a company putting in a $25k system into my new house that is Control4 based.

Do you guys think a novice can run the PCH or do I need to be tech savvy. I just want to have my movies accessible fro mthe couch and I need some help putting them on whatever I need to put them on. Everything Ive read on the PCH seems very technical to me.

thanks for the help

Farris, as everyone else on the thread has pretty much suggested, the single box you are looking for does not exist. I was looking for the same system but ended up with three servers for multi-room audio and one for video.

For my audio, I have a transporter for my dedicated media room. For casual listening I use a PC with Xonar STX card and a digital out to a $400 DAC.

For video, I use a DVICO Tvix M-6500A which handles all the video formats I have thrown at it. I was contemplating getting a Netgear EVA9150 because it could go into my rack but since both boxes use the same chip, I decided to wait. I haven't encountered many problems with my M-6500A and use it quite extensively to watch videos of many different formats including ISO.

um, is there any special reason you wouldn't just load XP on the mini?

well then the solution is simple...
Kaleidescape has a very nice 1080P player (http://www.kaleidescape.com/products/players/1080p/) that will fit right in with your other equipment...

Very Interesting!

May I ask a few questions please:

Kaleidescape:

- Will the Kaleidescape 1080p Player play both music and movies off the server?

- Will it only work with other Kaleidescape products such as the Kaleidescape server or can in work in conjunction with my own custom build server?

- Will it have the awesome Kaleidescape Interface similar to what I have seen before on the non 1080p models?

- What is the difference between this and the mini player (http://www.kaleidescape.com/products/players/1080p-mini/)?

- Does it have 2 way communication with a philips pronto 9800?

Thanks for the help and the cool suggestion. :D

For my audio, I have a transporter for my dedicated media room. For casual listening I use a PC with Xonar STX card and a digital out to a $400 DAC.

Just curious, why not a Squeezebox SBR or Classic?

CD

Very Interesting!

May I ask a few questions please:

Kaleidescape:

- Will the Kaleidescape 1080p Player play both music and movies off the server?

- Will it only work with other Kaleidescape products such as the Kaleidescape server or can in work in conjunction with my own custom build server?

- Will it have the awesome Kaleidescape Interface similar to what I have seen before on the non 1080p models?

- What is the difference between this and the mini player (http://www.kaleidescape.com/products/players/1080p-mini/)?

- Does it have 2 way communication with a philips pronto 9800?

Thanks for the help and the cool suggestion. :D


Just out of curiousity, what is it that has lead you to the conclusion that a Kaleidescape will have audio playback "as good as a Classe or Lyngdorf Cd Player"? Does it even stream FLAC??

CD

Very Interesting!

May I ask a few questions please:
you may ask, but I may not have the answers, as I do not have a Kaleidescape setup... its out of my price range...

- Will the Kaleidescape 1080p Player play both music and movies off the server?
probably, but why would you want too? you will be much better off using a product that was meant for audio... like the K Music Player (http://www.kaleidescape.com/products/players/music/) or the transporter...

- Will it only work with other Kaleidescape products such as the Kaleidescape server or can in work in conjunction with my own custom build server?
the one big drawback with the ultra high end is that it is pro installed only, and I doubt a pro would even consider hooking it up to your custom server... (assuming it even could be... which I kind of doubt)

- Will it have the awesome Kaleidescape Interface similar to what I have seen before on the non 1080p models?
yep


- What is the difference between this and the mini player (http://www.kaleidescape.com/products/players/1080p-mini/)?
mostly just size I think... does the mini even have the built in DVD drive?

- Does it have 2 way communication with a philips pronto 9800?
its pro installed, it will have 2 way com with whatever you tell the installer to make it have 2 way com with... hence the $$,$$$ price tag...

just a couple of things to consider:
Big K is the only Legal way to stream DVD's, they are the only company that has a CSS license and all the other legal crap needed...
our Benevolent Media Overlords do not like that Big K is able to do this, so when HD DVD & Bluray came out, they made sure that loop hole was closed, so there are no legal ways to stream Bluray, and so Big K does not stream bluray...

Farris, CD,

This site is really out of control! I stopped coming here because of this kind of stuff. I picked today to see if maybe the situation had improved but it has not.

Where is a site moderator when you need one?

Agreed. Good luck with your set-up.

CD

CD,

Can you please delete the posts relating to our bickering session, as I have. It would really help get this thread back on track.

In case anyone's still reading this thread for any reason beside entertainment value of the mudslinging...the OP might look into the ReQuest line.

Above the original budget, but less so than the kaleidescape. AFAIK, neither does blu-ray at the present time (could be wrong, my wife says I always am).

Just a suggestion, no flames please. :)

Just out of curiousity, what is it that has lead you to the conclusion that a Kaleidescape will have audio playback "as good as a Classe or Lyngdorf Cd Player"? Does it even stream FLAC??

CD

It has become clear that the Kaleidescape won't cut it for the following reasons:

- Won't stream blu ray rips
- Can't stream FLACs without another Kaleidescape Module
- It still probably won't be as good for audio as the Transporter you pointed out
- Probably won't work with my own custom built media server.

CD,

Can you please delete the posts relating to our bickering session, as I have. It would really help get this thread back on track.

Done. Should I leave a pic of the Saleen up; after all, everyone can appreciate a fine automobile. ;)

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee136/CDLehner/saleens7twinturbotwin_revise.jpg

CD

It has become clear that the Kaleidescape won't cut it for the following reasons:

- Won't stream blu ray rips
- Can't stream FLACs without another Kaleidescape Module
- It still probably won't be as good for audio as the Transporter you pointed out
- Probably won't work with my own custom built media server.

Seriously, if you can afford it...here's what you want http://www.psaudio.com/ps/products/detail/perfectwave-dac?cat=audio

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee136/CDLehner/PWD-full-2.jpg

or in combination with this http://www.psaudio.com/ps/products/detail/perfectwave-transport?cat=audio. The Transporter is no slouch, but PSA chief Paul McGowan is a digital streaming nut, and I think these units are really going to represent the current start-of-the-art, and best the Transporter by a bit.

CD

Please correct me if I am wrong.

It seems that the popcorn hour is the only hardware option currently available, except for a computer, that can stream and play video and audio.

As all my hardware is rack mounted in a closet, I need something that has an interface on my TV or on my Pronto 9800.


May I ask the following questions:

Whould it be better to go with custom built PC or Mac (someone mentioned earlier in this thread) and something like Windows Media Center with the My Movies add on (http://www.mymovies.dk/screenshots.aspx) to do the streaming and playback than a Popcorn Hour?

If so can someone recommend some good components for this purpose please?

Can someone also please let me know if there is better software available for this purpose than Media Center with My Movies?

I would really be interested in the pros and cons of the PC vs Popcorn Hour.

THANKS GUYS!

Seriously, if you can afford it...here's what you want http://www.psaudio.com/ps/products/detail/perfectwave-dac?cat=audio

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee136/CDLehner/PWD-full-2.jpg

or in combination with this http://www.psaudio.com/ps/products/detail/perfectwave-transport?cat=audio. The Transporter is no slouch, but PSA chief Paul McGowan is a digital streaming nut, and I think these units are really going to represent the current start-of-the-art, and best the Transporter by a bit.

CD

Wow... This DAC is sweet! Are there any special deals available on this? Anyone know where one can buy an ex-demo?

Once I buy the tvs, projectors, amps, speakers... My budget is getting tight and this will probably need to be an upgrade later on (unless a great deal is available).

CD and Others,

May I ask for some advice:

The gear I am likely going to buy is as follows:

Video:
JVC HD750

Pioneer 6090 x2


Audio:
- Lyngdorf TDAI 2200
- Lyngdorf SDA-2175
- Lyngdorf DP-1 Speakers (Front Left and Right)
- Lyngdorf W-210 Subs x 2 (Music)
- Onkyo 906 for Center, Surrounds and Sub (Lyngdorf Subs don't go deep enough for movies but kick ass for music IMHO).
- Sunfire XT Series Center and Dipole Surrounds
- 1 Sunfire True Signature EQ sub (Movies and Games)[/I][/B]


I have about $4k left in my budget to purchase anything else I might need

Do you think a DAC like the the Perfect Wave would be necessary to do justice to my equipment? Would a Transporter be sufficient?

Is the Onkyo outclassed by the rest of the gear for what it is doing? If so what would you recommend I substitute it with (please keep in mind the budget is tapping out)?

Would you recommend any changes to my equipment and are there any other pieces of kit that would really help enhance what I am buying?

Based on the above equipment, what is the ideal candidate for a music and video player (seperate components, pc or single peice of kit)? I realize this might be a repetative question, but I thought it might change after reviewing my kit.
- The player/players need to have a TV or Pronto 9800 interface

I hope the above isn't repetative and I appreicate your help

It seems that the popcorn hour is the only hardware option currently available, except for a computer, that can stream and play video and audio.
well that's just not true... there are tons of options, the only issue is why??? the 'perfect' video will probably have marginal audio usability at best, they are very different things... for video you really need your TV/Projector/whatever turned on, but for audio, having the display on is distracting at best... for audio having a the ability to create and manage a play list is vital, but for video its a non issue really... its all a question of using the correct tool for the job... just curious, why do so many people just want to use one really big hammer for everything?

anyway, Vidabox (http://www.vidabox.com/products_roomclienthd.php)looks like they have some cool toys... may be worth looking into...

Sages HD theater (http://www.sagetv.com/hd_theater.html) thing is cool to, and it can be a PVR also... but while it can do audio, I wouldn't use it for that... its just not the right tool...

well that's just not true... there are tons of options, the only issue is why??? the 'perfect' video will probably have marginal audio usability at best, they are very different things... for video you really need your TV/Projector/whatever turned on, but for audio, having the display on is distracting at best... for audio having a the ability to create and manage a play list is vital, but for video its a non issue really... its all a question of using the correct tool for the job... just curious, why do so many people just want to use one really big hammer for everything?

anyway, Vidabox (http://www.vidabox.com/products_roomclienthd.php)looks like they have some cool toys... may be worth looking into...

Sages HD theater (http://www.sagetv.com/hd_theater.html) thing is cool to, and it can be a PVR also... but while it can do audio, I wouldn't use it for that... its just not the right tool...

How would I be able to see and select my music with a Transporter in the rack well away from my living/cinema room?

I was looking for an all in one video and audio solution because these tend to use a TV or Pronto 9800 as a display/selection device.

I am certainly not against having seperate pieces of kit for audio and video, as long as I can keep them rack mounted and access them in rooms well away fromt he rack.

wow... This dac is sweet! Are there any special deals available on this? Anyone know where one can buy an ex-demo?

These are as new as it gets; i wouldn't expect any deals or demos yet. :(

once i buy the tvs, projectors, amps, speakers... My budget is getting tight and this will probably need to be an upgrade later on (unless a great deal is available).

cd and others,

may i ask for some advice:

the gear i am likely going to buy is as follows:

video:
jvc hd750

pioneer 6090 x2


audio:
- lyngdorf tdai 2200
- lyngdorf sda-2175
- lyngdorf dp-1 speakers (front left and right)
- lyngdorf w-210 subs x 2 (music)
- onkyo 906 for center, surrounds and sub (lyngdorf subs don't go deep enough for movies but kick ass for music imho).
- sunfire xt series center and dipole surrounds
- 1 sunfire true signature eq sub (movies and games)[/i][/b]


i have about $4k left in my budget to purchase anything else i might need

do you think a dac like the the perfect wave would be necessary to do justice to my equipment? Would a transporter be sufficient?



is the onkyo outclassed by the rest of the gear for what it is doing? If so what would you recommend i substitute it with (please keep in mind the budget is tapping out)?

would you recommend any changes to my equipment and are there any other pieces of kit that would really help enhance what i am buying?

based on the above equipment, what is the ideal candidate for a music and video player (seperate components, pc or single peice of kit)? I realize this might be a repetative question, but i thought it might change after reviewing my kit.
- the player/players need to have a tv or pronto 9800 interface

i hope the above isn't repetative and i appreicate your help

The PW DAC is as new as it gets; I wouldn't expect any deals or demos yet. :( If you want to spend $1500 instead of $3k, the Transporter is more than fine. Are you planning to use the Onkyo 905 as Pre/Pro and amplification of 5 channels, Center and 4 Surrounds? If so, yes, I'd say this will be the weak spot in your system. OTOH, if you're mostly about music and HT is an after-thought then you might be fine.

As has been said several time, and I know it's not what anyone wants to hear, but there really isn't ONE box that does everything, and does everything "the best". The best streamers for music are a Squeezebox or Sonos Receiver, run through an external DAC if you're really going for very, very revealing, high-level audio...or a Transporter, and none of them do video.

As for video, I know it's hard to believe the $215 PCH can represent the best streamer right now, but I think the PQ is great...provided you know what you're doing; it's a garbage-in, garbage-out kind of device. I mean, are you into ripping BD, and up on all your HD Audio codecs and stuff...or does the Ferrari keep you too busy for all that nonsense. :p If so, PCH probably isn't for you...and that's probably where you get all that "the PCH is no good" talk...from those who don't know how to use it, or thought they would plug it in and press play like a DVD player.

Hope that helps,
CD

The PW DAC is as new as it gets; I wouldn't expect any deals or demos yet. :( If you want to spend $1500 instead of $3k, the Transporter is more than fine. Are you planning to use the Onkyo 905 as Pre/Pro and amplification of 5 channels, Center and 4 Surrounds? If so, yes, I'd say this will be the weak spot in your system. OTOH, if you're mostly about music and HT is an after-thought then you might be fine.

Yes I was going to use the Onkyo 906 as a Pre/Pro and amplification for 5 channels. I am really into movies and music. My use is 50% Movies, 35% Music, 15% Video Games.

Would an upgrade to a Denon 4308A be good enough in your opinion or would I need something like an Arcam AVR 600


As has been said several time, and I know it's not what anyone wants to hear, but there really isn't ONE box that does everything, and does everything "the best". The best streamers for music are a Squeezebox or Sonos Receiver, run through an external DAC if you're really going for very, very revealing, high-level audio...or a Transporter, and none of them do video.

Forgive my Noobness... So do I need a DAC and a Transporter or just a Transporter? Can the Transporter be rack mounted and controlled by a pronto 9800 or on my TV?

As for video, I know it's hard to believe the $215 PCH can represent the best streamer right now, but I think the PQ is great...provided you know what you're doing; it's a garbage-in, garbage-out kind of device. I mean, are you into ripping BD, and up on all your HD Audio codecs and stuff...

Yes, I am into ripping blu rays and try to keep my codecs up to date. I will take your recommendation and go for the PCH. I just need to figure out how I can access my music with a transporter in the rack.?

or does the Ferrari keep you too busy for all that nonsense. :p If so, PCH probably isn't for you...and that's probably where you get all that "the PCH is no good" talk...from those who don't know how to use it, or thought they would plug it in and press play like a DVD player.

Hope that helps,
CD

Thanks CD and sorry for drilling you with a million questions :p

I have never been a fan of the Sunfire subs... they just sound bad... well, they sound ok as long as you don't have anything else to compare them too... but still...
but I know nothing of the EQ subs... haven't heard them, haven't seen them... maybe they have gotten better? also I am not really a fan of EQ'ing subs... not saying that its bad or anything, but if you have the choice, its better to fix the room...
note, I am not against Sunfire in general... I have and I am perfectly happy with their 2 & 5 channel amps... so just for the record, I am not Bashing Sunfire... I'm just not that impressed with their subs....
have you looked at the Rythmik (http://www.rythmikaudio.com/)Subs? they are fairly cheap, but have amazing 'cleanness' or whatever you would call it to their sound... good for movies & music...

mixing and matching speakers seems like a bad idea... at the very least the LCR should all be meant to work together.

the only reason to use an external DAC would be if the DAC in your AV Processor sucked...

also, just a FWIW, but assuming you are running digital out of your audio streamer (either into your AV processor, or into CD cool DAC) there will be no audible difference between the Transorter & any other streamer (even an old el-cheap-o SB classic... so you are technically just paying for looks... and the transporter does look excellent...

and while I could be wrong on this, I could of sworn that I saw a Squeezebox app somewhere that totally integrated with the Pronto... CD or one of the other SB fanboys will hopefully chime in with details....

I had a Prono once... my dog ate it:(

I don't want a mac. I am a PC guy and need something that I can put in the rack and access via a pronto 9800 in the living room

The popcorn seemed perfect, but I think it might be a little bit too low end for my equipment.

It sounds like you've moved past this, but why does it matter what OS is under your media player app? You set it to boot Plex on startup and never need to bother with the underlying OS. It's just an appliance with extra flexibility at that point.

It's the best such device I've used for DVD or Blu rips.

I have never been a fan of the Sunfire subs... they just sound bad... well, they sound ok as long as you don't have anything else to compare them too... but still...
but I know nothing of the EQ subs... haven't heard them, haven't seen them... maybe they have gotten better? also I am not really a fan of EQ'ing subs... not saying that its bad or anything, but if you have the choice, its better to fix the room...
note, I am not against Sunfire in general... I have and I am perfectly happy with their 2 & 5 channel amps... so just for the record, I am not Bashing Sunfire... I'm just not that impressed with their subs....
have you looked at the Rythmik (http://www.rythmikaudio.com/)Subs? they are fairly cheap, but have amazing 'cleanness' or whatever you would call it to their sound... good for movies & music...

mixing and matching speakers seems like a bad idea... at the very least the LCR should all be meant to work together.

the only reason to use an external DAC would be if the DAC in your AV Processor sucked...

also, just a FWIW, but assuming you are running digital out of your audio streamer (either into your AV processor, or into CD cool DAC) there will be no audible difference between the Transorter & any other streamer (even an old el-cheap-o SB classic... so you are technically just paying for looks... and the transporter does look excellent...

and while I could be wrong on this, I could of sworn that I saw a Squeezebox app somewhere that totally integrated with the Pronto... CD or one of the other SB fanboys will hopefully chime in with details....

I had a Prono once... my dog ate it:(

Yeah I too am not so sure about the Sunfire Sub. I think I might go with a JL F112 instead.

In regards to the center channel, Lyngdorf (http://www.lyngdorf.com/downloads/catalogue/BW-1%20+%20DP-1%20brochure.pdf) don't make an LCR speaker, just stereo. I also need an on-wall or inwall solution for the center and surrounds. I thought the sunfire XTs (http://www.sunfire.com/productdetail.asp?id=19) would be a good match becuase, although they have ribbon tweeters, they, like the Lyngdorfs, sound very open and transparent.

You might just try this http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee136/CDLehner/untitled-3.jpg or this http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee136/CDLehner/31_img_bu150.jpg...plus this http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee136/CDLehner/untitled1-1.jpg instead.

For those keeping score at home, that's a Squeezebox Duet (http://www.slimdevices.com/pi_duet.html), Sonos ZP90 and Controller (you don't need the ZP120 http://sonos.com/whattobuy/ZP90/) and PS Audio DL III DAC (http://www.psaudio.com/ps/products/detail/digital-link-3-dac?cat=audio).

CD

I haven't seen anyone mention this one yet:

http://www.datoptic.com/cgi-bin/web.cgi?product=limHD310s&detail=yes

It is the Tomacro limHD310s

That company also offers a couple other models. I am tempted to get one of these, as it seems that it might do what I need.

Has anyone here tried one or heard of this one? Pros, cons?

http://www.datoptic.com/images/lim310s.jpg

I haven't seen anyone mention this one yet:

http://www.datoptic.com/cgi-bin/web.cgi?product=limHD310s&detail=yes

It is the Tomacro limHD310s

That company also offers a couple other models. I am tempted to get one of these, as it seems that it might do what I need.

Has anyone here tried one or heard of this one? Pros, cons?

http://www.datoptic.com/images/lim310s.jpg

Well...it looks, more or less, like any one of about a dozen or so NMTs; same chipset, etc., etc. Except it costs more than a PCH, and no one has ever heard of or posted about it. So why choose this over anything else? Is this really the kind of thing where you want to blaze the new trail?

CD

CD, I ended up with the STX and digital out to DAC solution because I needed multi-room audio and was also interested in listening to see which setup was better. There's so much noise out there about computer based audio, dedicated boxes like the transporter, and going through a professional DAC that I decided to try a few solutions knowing that none would sound bad and I could then decide which room would get which option.

For anyone that might be interested and keep in mind, this is purely my opinion, I found that conventional wisdom holds. Better priced equipment sounds better but the marginal increase in quality comes at much higher prices.

I originally used on-board PC audio and then a Xonar D2 card. As expected, the D2 card blew away the PC audio. The STX sounded clearer and sharper than the D2 but incremental. The optical out to $400 DAC was more than incrementally better than the STX and the transporter was incrementally better than the DAC solution but noticeable even to my untrained ears. My conclusion is your best value and largest jump in audio is probably digital out to a good mid-range DAC. Even though my DAC has the same D-A chip as the STX, the hi-fi knowledge in assembling the rest of the device seemed to make a difference.

Farris, I use a Pronto 9600 to control my PC audio and transporter. There are 1 or 2 inexpensive programs you can buy to control any squeezenetwork device. As for video, I assume, I will be in the same room so I just use the IR out to control my DVICO Tvix M6500-A.

Well...it looks, more or less, like any one of about a dozen or so NMTs; same chipset, etc., etc. Except it costs more than a PCH, and no one has ever heard of or posted about it. So why choose this over anything else? Is this really the kind of thing where you want to blaze the new trail?

CD

Well, I just did a search for it ( limHD310s ) here on the avsforum and you're probably right. Many people who got it seem to complain now that the company left them hanging with not many firmware updates, and support is now lacking.

The other one that looked curious to me was the new Netgear one that was previously mentioned here.

If Sony ever came out with one of these, I bet it would be top notch. I have a Sony ES series audio receiver, Sony LCD TV, SonyHD camcorder, Sony Blueray player, Sony CRT projector, and I've owned many Sony devices over the years, and I've always known Sony's upper-end gear to be very high quality and long lasting, and even some of their budget gear has earned high marks in my opinion. If they only made a content streamer. Hey, a guy can wish can he?

Well, I just did a search for it ( limHD310s ) here on the avsforum and you're probably right. Many people who got it seem to complain now that the company left them hanging with not many firmware updates, and support is now lacking.

The other one that looked curious to me was the new Netgear one that was previously mentioned here.

If Sony ever came out with one of these, I bet it would be top notch. I have a Sony ES series audio receiver, Sony LCD TV, SonyHD camcorder, Sony Blueray player, Sony CRT projector, and I've owned many Sony devices over the years, and I've always known Sony's upper-end gear to be very high quality and long lasting, and even some of their budget gear has earned high marks in my opinion. If they only made a content streamer. Hey, a guy can wish can he?

Sony did make a "content streamer"...it's called the PlayStation 3!

CD

Would the Dune be of interest? Perhaps it's audio performance would not be to your liking.

http://hdi.co.il/fullhd_players/72-dune-bd-prime.html

Would the Dune be of interest? Perhaps it's audio performance would not be to your liking.

http://hdi.co.il/fullhd_players/72-dune-bd-prime.html

Looks interesting.

Cd,

What are your thoughts mate?

I guess playback woud be very similar to a popcorn hour

Looks interesting.

Cd,

What are your thoughts mate?

I guess playback woud be very similar to a popcorn hour

Farris, the big selling point of the Dune is it supposed to be the first player to handle BD .ISO. That seems to be a big deal for some people, because if you're not familiar with .ISO, it allows you to rip a complete image of the entire BD; that means you'll get menus and extras, etc. It's not such a big deal for many, because really, who needs all that extra crap taking up space on the hard drive anyway; most of us just want the movie, so .ISO is not a big deal.

But this box, or any other like it, presents the same problems we've already discussed, with audio. They're not built for audio, and I wouldn't trust their DAC or output stage as far as I could throw them. The guys recommending these devices for audio fall into one of two categories: 1) they think "bits is bits", or 2) they listen to their audio on a $300 AVR.

And that's fine, either way...they're entitled to their opinion...but based on your OP I know you're looking for more. So stick with the devices we've already talked about for audio...and then only you can decide if this is better for your video, than say a PCH, because of the BD .ISO (which I don't believe has been proven yet anyway).

CD

I have no direct knowledge about the products mentioned in the current issue of Stereophile. One is the Musical Fidelity V-DAC (~$200) and the other one compared to it I forget (but was ~300). Definitely high praise for both.

I know it's not one box for everything, but you gotta get past that.

http://www.musicalfidelity.com/

. . . Netgear EVA9150 . . . . supposedly can bitrstream at least some higher bitrate audio format through HDMI . . .

What I've heard: DTS-HD MA works, but not Dolby TrueHD. Do you any different info?

Well, I'll vouch for the mediocre [I]SQ[/]

I hope that you are referring to the PCH's analog audio out (which I have no intention of using). They haven't screwed up lossless audio over HDMI, have they?

I have no direct knowledge about the products mentioned in the current issue of Stereophile. One is the Musical Fidelity V-DAC (~$200) and the other one compared to it I forget (but was ~300). Definitely high praise for both.

I know it's not one box for everything, but you gotta get past that.

http://www.musicalfidelity.com/

That's just a DAC, not a streamer. :rolleyes:

CD

I hope that you are referring to the PCH's analog audio out (which I have no intention of using). They haven't screwed up lossless audio over HDMI, have they?

He's talking about music audio, not movie sountracks.

CD

Ι am using the Dune Center and the interface is great. It gets connected with my home-made server and I get the following interface http://www.mymovies.dk/documentation/wiki.aspx?Page=My%20Movies%20and%20HDI%20Dune
For audio I have a squeezebox classic and I am controlling it with a Philips TSU 9800, via digital output to my Lexicon. My other setup has a second Squeezebox and the digital output goes into my Audio Synthesis DAC.

ps: I don't think spending all that money and having different brands for the 3 front speakers is a good idea.

He's talking about music audio, not movie sountracks.

CD

Sorry. I'll modify the question:
I hope that you are referring to the PCH's analog audio out (which I have no intention of using). They haven't screwed up digital over HDMI, have they?

But this box, or any other like it, presents the same problems we've already discussed, with audio. They're not built for audio, and I wouldn't trust their DAC or output stage as far as I could throw them. The guys recommending these devices for audio fall into one of two categories: 1) they think "bits is bits", or 2) they listen to their audio on a $300 AVR.
wow, you just totally got that horribly wrong...
1) the "bits is bits" people wouldn't even use the DAC in the box (well, maybe Scientist would:p), most sane people would keep it digital for as long as possible... so the internal DAC on the box is totally irrelevant... the DAC could be a total PoS safety hazard that is about to burst into flames and kill everyone in a 1 mile radius, we still wouldn't care as we wouldn't use it anyway...
2) the cost of the gear (audio or video) is irrelevant... it really comes down to the age old "separates" vs. "The One Device to Rule Them All" (and in the darkness bind them?) argument...

in the end I think it really just comes down to usability, and user interface... some people are willing to sacrifice this, just to save a $ or to just have one box, or the "why should I pay $ for an audio box, when my video box can play audio too" not realizing that when they go that route, they have just doomed their audio listening experience... ie if your audio UI/usability sucks, you wont listen to as much music as you would of had you chosen wisely... you may still think you are happy though... but those of use who had chosen wisely are much happier....

NOTE: the "You"'s above aren't really referring to CD as he did in fact choose wisely (well close enough at least... Sonos would have been a wiser choice:D), it's just more of a random, general "you"...

wow, you just totally got that horribly wrong...
1) the "bits is bits" people wouldn't even use the DAC in the box (well, maybe Scientist would:p), most sane people would keep it digital for as long as possible... so the internal DAC on the box is totally irrelevant... the DAC could be a total PoS safety hazard that is about to burst into flames and kill everyone in a 1 mile radius, we still wouldn't care as we wouldn't use it anyway...
2) the cost of the gear (audio or video) is irrelevant... it really comes down to the age old "separates" vs. "The One Device to Rule Them All" (and in the darkness bind them?) argument...

in the end I think it really just comes down to usability, and user interface... some people are willing to sacrifice this, just to save a $ or to just have one box, or the "why should I pay $ for an audio box, when my video box can play audio too" not realizing that when they go that route, they have just doomed their audio listening experience... ie if your audio UI/usability sucks, you wont listen to as much music as you would of had you chosen wisely... you may still think you are happy though... but those of use who had chosen wisely are much happier....

NOTE: the "You"'s above aren't really referring to CD as he did in fact choose wisely (well close enough at least... Sonos would have been a wiser choice:D), it's just more of a random, general "you"...

And where we differ here SWL, and I know I do with many, is that there is more to the output stage than just the S/PDIF...and I don't put much faith in the one from some Tai-built, all-in-one, mostly for movies, god knows what they use for QC, gizmo. But we are close on this argument, in principle, and I am too busy to have it yet again.

CD

No offense CDLehner, but most of the audio advice you've provided here is incorrect based on his system. There is really no purpose in buying a DAC for such a system as the Lyngdorf, which is a digital amp / DAC (I have a similar system, the TacT 2150XDM). Without getting too much into the technical mumbo jumbo, the Lyngdorf/TacT devices are essentially DACs that generate enough output to drive speakers directly; they have a pulse-width modulation stage that amplifies the digital signal to high enough levels to directly drive loudspeakers. I suppose you could buy another DAC, and then run the digital output through the Lyngdorf's unit's AD to re-convert that back to digital (if the Lyngdorf supports that; my TacT amp does not have room for the AD module when the room correction module is installed), but that would very likely degrade sound quality, irregardless of the DAC used, based on the extra DA to AD conversion cycle.

Also, regarding the PS Audio components, a few corrections as I've been closely following these products via their message boards (and kudos to PS Audio owner Paul McGowan for being open and answering questions directly from customers). They are offering a trade-in program towards either the PWT or PWD, up to $1k credit each, based on original MSRP of either a disc player or DAC, respectively. So that does help to reduce the price if you have some extra gear you'd like to get rid of. But be aware that the functionality in the PWD to read files from a NAS (the so-called "bridge") won't be available until at least November of this year. And unfortunately, at least for those like me and Farris who don't really have a need for the PWD, the PWT won't be able to read files from a NAS for quite some time. PS Audio is planning a separate, stand alone lens product that incorporates the bridge functionality (and reclocks multiple digital sources), but there is no ETA on that and I'd venture to guess it won't make it to market until next year.

Hi Guys,

I am looking to buy a top of the line media player for my living room/home theatre. I am looking for something that essentially does what the Popcorn Hour A-110 does but has far better audio and video playback, along with a better interface. Cost is not an issue within reason (sub $2500).

It needs to do the following:

Perfect FLAC playback... as good as a Classe or Lyngdorf Cd Player
Excellent Video Playback... Playing Ripped Blu Rays and various media types (avi, mpeg...)
Excellent Interface.... Something like a Kaleidescape Interface
Ethernet Connectivity... to Connect to a Media Server


Your help is much appreciated!

Many media players out there use the Sigma designs SMP86xx
SOC/chipset family. This includes the HDi Dune, PCH and its Syabas
firmware based cousins, WDTV, and TViX

The exception is the Apple TV which uses an X86 with a
Broadcom chipset.

Then there is the HTPC, but I guess that is a discussion for another
forum....

(The Xbox360 or PS3 , I assume is out because of FLAC support.)

The PCH A110 is a tinkerer's box. The Syabas firmware is work in progress.
It does handle H.264 m2ts streams very well and handles streaming of
the new high def audio codecs (TrueHD, DTS-HD/MA) to a preamp/AVR
via HDMI.

In terms of the ability to support a wide variety of video formats the
platform is great. Its audio abilities is not part of its strengths.

All PCM audio goes thru the onboard DSP and you can alter the volume
via the remote. It does mangle the sound especially at the higher
sample rates and bit depths such as 24bit @96kHz

It does not support video source direct mode, the quality of the scaling is
about average. Picture quality of the scaled video is similar to the early
BD players such as the Sony BDPS300 which uses a similar Sigma based
chipset.

24p is supported at 1080p via HDMI (not sure about the component output).
Auto switch between PAL and NTSC refresh rates supported for 720p
and 1080p via HDMI

3/2 pulldown of 24p material works and is decent

Networking performance is pretty poor. Data transfers top out
at about 65mbits/s. Sufficient for video streaming but is slow for large file
transfers to the internal or USB attached disks

The interface can be greatly improved but you have to do the work
yourself such as setting the YAMJ jukebox. The default interface out
of the box is quite limited.

You also may need to put some time into making sure the files you feed it
is of the right format eg H.264, XVID and DiVX5. Real video RMVB,
Flash Video (Hulu/Youtube) and WMV8 codecs do not work on this thing.

There is a lot of small annoying things that is unfixed such as audio/video
falling out of sync if you fast forward, seek or skip. Usually happens on
video containers that do not have mandatory timecodes such as AVI files.

This is made worse by the a bookmark function that cannot be turned off
in the current firmware, so it keeps dropping back to the point the stream
was stopped from.

Uh, here it is - at less than $1,500. Pair it with a great DAC (MSB PowerDAC) and you are going to be about as good as it gets...

http://www.niveusmedia.com/products/zone.html

Uh, here it is - at less than $1,500. Pair it with a great DAC (MSB PowerDAC) and you are going to be about as good as it gets...

http://www.niveusmedia.com/products/zone.html

VERY INTERESTING! The interface looks awesome (a lot like the Kaleidescape)

If one does not need the Blu Ray Player would this be ideal? http://www.niveusmedia.com/products/vail.html

Forgive the noobness, how does the above differ from a Popcorn Hour (apart from the Blu Ray Player?

Tong,

Thanks! That's useful information. :cool:

Farris, not to be a cynic, because lately I'm being accused of being too negative...but honestly, what you are looking for simply doesn't exist. Don't you think your expectations are WAYYY too high? You want audio playback equivalent to 4-figure CD players, a plethora of file types supported...and an interface to rival a 5-figure video streamer? And you want it for under $2500. Probably the only thing that would come remotely close is something you would build yourself.

But even then, you couldn't get the kind of audio playback you seek. IMO, the only FLAC streamers that will get you the kind of SQ you're looking for are a Squeezebox or Sonos into a good external DAC, or a Transporter. And NONE of them do video.

Just out of curiousity, what makes you think the PCH has anything less than excellent video playback, and a sexy GUI in YAMJ? My A-110 looks FLAWLESS on my Kuro, and I'm getting ready to test it on the big screen in the HT.

CD

Hi CD,

It has been a while since I posted back here, but I have been very busy sorted out the AV throughout my house.

I took your recommendations across the board. All music is going through squeezeboxes and for movies I have a popcorn in each room and am using myihome and YAMJ to organize and find the covers.

This is where I am having a big problem and I hope you can help.

On my server all my movie files are organised with the exact movie name on the folder and all ISO, MKV files, etc are named with the exact name of the movie. There is nothing else in the folders

Even with the organized folders and files, myihome is labelling everything incorrectly :mad: It looks ok in MS-DOS when updating but it never gets it right.

Do you know how to fix this problem?

I really appreciate the help!