Hi all,

I plan to buy a WD TV HD player box that can hook up external hard drive to play movie from there. Question is does it support to play a folder "Video_TS" or not? cuz I have a lot movies that ripped out in DVD format which is "Video_TS" and "Audio_TS" folder.

NO, it will not. It is NOT a DVD player (I wish people would stop trying to make it into one). It will however play the .vob files in the video_ts folder.

It does but it only reads main movie without menus

alrite thanks guys

NO, it will not. It is NOT a DVD player (I wish people would stop trying to make it into one).

Why do you wish people not to want .IFO support on the wdtv?

The wdtv is not intrinsically limited from supporting .IFO, it is just a matter of software. Now, I have wdtv connected to one input on my tv, and a mvix player connected to another input - just to support .IFO so that I will have the DVD menu structure for various tv series sets that are stored on the mvix. If the wdtv would add .IFO support, I could dump the extra mvix player.

It is fine if you don't need .IFO support on the wdtv, but why care if others still would like it?

Why do you wish people not to want .IFO support on the wdtv?

The wdtv is not intrinsically limited from supporting .IFO, it is just a matter of software. Now, I have wdtv connected to one input on my tv, and a mvix player connected to another input - just to support .IFO so that I will have the DVD menu structure for various tv series sets that are stored on the mvix. If the wdtv would add .IFO support, I could dump the extra mvix player.

It is fine if you don't need .IFO support on the wdtv, but why care if others still would like it?

It's not that I don't want support (it would be nice). It's that people just don't seem to understand that it is not a technical matter (it would be really easy to implement), it's a legal/license matter. To fully support DVDs, WD has to pay a license/royalty fees to the DVD forum plus it has to abide by their legal rules (which means a bunch of security features such as region coding and so on). The cost would also go up. I don't know the exact number, but the bulk of the cost associated with a lot of electronic devices is not the hardware itself, it is all the license and royalty fees that must be payed to all the IP holders.

...

It's not that I don't want support (it would be nice). It's that people just don't seem to understand that it is not a technical matter (it would be really easy to implement), it's a legal/license matter. To fully support DVDs, WD has to pay a license/royalty fees to the DVD forum plus it has to abide by their legal rules (which means a bunch of security features such as region coding and so on). The cost would also go up. I don't know the exact number, but the bulk of the cost associated with a lot of electronic devices is not the hardware itself, it is all the license and royalty fees that must be payed to all the IP holders.


since it isn't a dvd player (can't play dvds) they cannot put the dvd logos on it so no logo license. it won't pass logo tests.

no logo = not a dvd player so no player license.

since it doesn't play from disk anyway, there is no license for encryption keys and the keys cannot be revoked since they don't exist and aren't needed.

afaik there is no license fee for old codecs like mpeg2/ac3.

what is left?

... and a $20 walmart dvd player has full dvd licenses. if full license cost $2/player that would be 10% (a big chunk). what would be left after all the above licensing fees are gone?

no matter what level of support they throw in there (from just supporting vob playback to full dvd menus). it isn't a dvd player so no normal license fees.

you admit that it supports a subset of dvd already (some vob). so, is that dvd support? why no license fee now? how much of a dvd data structure needs to exist and be supported before it crosses the line from no license to license required?

you will need to provide a link to actually prove that there is any cost at all. i believe there is no fee at all since it will never actually be a dvd player... just interpreting files that don't meet full dvd specs anyway. no different then current vob support.

What is protected by the dvd license ip is not the disc but the DVD structure. Just because the DVD structure is not on a little round disc does not give you permission to just bypass the license.

Let me ask you this. DVD structure is one of the easiest and extremely standardized structure (it's been around for over a dozen years), it would be child's play to add this feature if they had no other hurdles to overcome. Don't you think they would have already done so since it is one of the most requested features? AFAIK there is not even one device similar to this that does this, I wonder why????

PCH fully supports DVD playback and where does it say they have a license to do so?

AFAIK there is not even one device similar to this that does this, I wonder why????

http://www.argosy.com.tw/product-detial.php?prod_id=135

Support complete DVD function including DVD menu

PCH fully supports DVD playback and where does it say they have a license to do so?

It is more then 2x the price, perhaps therein lies the reason why it can play the menus - they either payed for it or never bothered because they are a Chinese company so not sure they are obligated by Chinese law or agreement to adhere to DVD standard...gettng a DVD license needn't be regulated by a specific state law, it is an infringement of general copyright laws...PCH cannot play CSS encrypted DVD discs anyway (practically all commercial DVD discs on the market) so you re implying that they aplied and paid for the DVD license but without probably the crucial part of it to make it work for everyone...YOU CANNOT PLAY ORIGINAL DVD DISCS ON PCH SO THERE YOU GO...???

I'm oh so convinced that PCH never payed the DVD license because it is made in China for local market and is conveniently shipped overseas...why do you think you cannot exactly buy it in a brick and mortar shop...WD is a respectible US company which needs to abide by US regulations...hope you understand...

@zapster: your link connects to yet another chinese box (no disrespect intended) so my oppinion stands :D

Syabas is headquartered in Fremont, California, USA.

the pch is just manufactured in china (like a lot of things these days).

it is headquartered in US by choice probably, but where is it primarily registered, I wander?

Syabas did license something in regard to DVD. I forget the details, but I do remember that Syabas was removing such DVD support from future versions of the software development kit. Or maybe it was Sigma Designs. In any case, there was some posting regarding the various NMT hardware that they would lose DVD support if they upgraded to the new SDK.

Anyway, I'm not so sure that a license is required for .IFO support so long as CSS or the DVD insignia is not involved. The .IFO file is not encrypted, even on commercial DVDs. It is a file format subject to legal reverse engineering much like open office does with the microsoft word format.

So, my best guess is that reading and interpreting the non-encrypted .IFO file would not run afoul of any licensing. Again, provided that CSS and the DVD insignia is not used. A license is probably required for the mpeg2 audio/video decompressor, but that is a separate issue from the file format and apparently wdtv has that covered since it can play mpeg2 audio/video.

I think some there is some conflation of the licensing issues because in the case of all of the many hdd media players that support .IFO, it is for non-encrypted video files only - which is very much unlike that of a traditional stand-alone DVD player.

Syabas did license something in regard to DVD. I forget the details, but I do remember that Syabas was removing such DVD support from future versions of the software development kit. Or maybe it was Sigma Designs. In any case, there was some posting regarding the various NMT hardware that they would lose DVD support if they upgraded to the new SDK.

Anyway, I'm not so sure that a license is required for .IFO support so long as CSS or the DVD insignia is not involved. The .IFO file is not encrypted, even on commercial DVDs. It is a file format subject to legal reverse engineering much like open office does with the microsoft word format.

So, my best guess is that reading and interpreting the non-encrypted .IFO file would not run afoul of any licensing. Again, provided that CSS and the DVD insignia is not used. A license is probably required for the mpeg2 audio/video decompressor, but that is a separate issue from the file format and apparently wdtv has that covered since it can play mpeg2 audio/video.

I think some there is some conflation of the licensing issues because in the case of all of the many hdd media players that support .IFO, it is for non-encrypted video files only - which is very much unlike that of a traditional stand-alone DVD player.

the license they needed probably had something to do with their networked dvd player .... which really is a dvd player and not simply an iso file player....

http://www.syabas.com/solution_ndp.html

It is more then 2x the price, perhaps therein lies the reason why it can play the menus - they either payed for it or never bothered because they are a Chinese company so not sure they are obligated by Chinese law or agreement to adhere to DVD standard...gettng a DVD license needn't be regulated by a specific state law, it is an infringement of general copyright laws...PCH cannot play CSS encrypted DVD discs anyway (practically all commercial DVD discs on the market) so you re implying that they aplied and paid for the DVD license but without probably the crucial part of it to make it work for everyone...YOU CANNOT PLAY ORIGINAL DVD DISCS ON PCH SO THERE YOU GO...???

I'm oh so convinced that PCH never payed the DVD license because it is made in China for local market and is conveniently shipped overseas...why do you think you cannot exactly buy it in a brick and mortar shop...WD is a respectible US company which needs to abide by US regulations...hope you understand...


Just read oliverjg's comment (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=16352777#post16352777) about that, i agree with him.

@zapster: your link connects to yet another chinese box (no disrespect intended) so my oppinion stands :D

It's sold in the US -

http://www.buy.com/retail/product.asp?sku=210663746&listingid=37031769&dcaid=17902

The WDTV is also made in China.

And another -

http://www.seagate.com/theater/

DVD menu support mentioned in the video on the main page.

Hi all,

I plan to buy a WD TV HD player box that can hook up external hard drive to play movie from there. Question is does it support to play a folder "Video_TS" or not? cuz I have a lot movies that ripped out in DVD format which is "Video_TS" and "Audio_TS" folder.

Yes it will play the movie. All the hub bub is that is "all it will do". It will not start with a menu screen. It will start the movie directly. I usually rip my movies that way anyway.

get dvd2one and turn those folders into 1 big vod per movie(good for uniting 2 disks) rip the subs into srt's with subrip, then unpack the mpg/ac3 from the vod with tsmuxergui and repack it all with mkvmerge (the mpeg/ac3/srt)

at the end you got yourself an all digital subtitles with a well supported container and never a missing subtitle/skipped frames( issues that happen with the wdtv/ or any pc loads from one vod to the other since they are bits of 1 gig each)


long process( about 10 mins if you got a 4 core cpu/ 1 tb hdd(105/85 r/w)

but at least the end is worth it, WD TV plays them flawlessly just like any other mkv. Best part, no need to stay hours trying to turn it all to h.264(x.264) since you're just moving the same quality of sound/picture to another container.

Leny,

"get dvd2one and turn those folders into 1 big vod per movie(good for uniting 2 disks) rip the subs into srt's with subrip, then unpack the mpg/ac3 from the vod with tsmuxergui and repack it all with mkvmerge (the mpeg/ac3/srt)"

Can I kindly ask you to put that in plain terms so that the less technical people can use it. Seems like a great way to overcome what I believe is a WD TV shortcoming in playoing native DVDs. The investment of 10 minutes seems definitely worth it.

Tools needed
DVD2ONE (http://www.dvd2one.com/?loc=download) a video_ts to single VOB compiler (gotta buy, best to search for a free similar one if can't buy)
SubRip (http://zuggy.wz.cz/) a DVD subtitle ripper
tsMuxerGUI (http://www.videohelp.com/tools/tsMuxeR) a .VOB extractor
MKVtoolnix (http://www.videohelp.com/tools/MKVtoolnix) MKV maker

at least 10 gigs of HDD space free



Steps,

1: Once you have the ripped VIDEO_TS folder, convert it to 1 united .VOB .
To achieve this you need DVD2ONE (http://www.dvd2one.com/?loc=download)

1.a(with Subtitle optional steps): once the giant .vob is compiled, use SubRip (http://zuggy.wz.cz/) and extract the photo subtitles into a text .srt format ( this program reads the images and turns them to text)

2: Once you have this giant .VOB you must unpack the motion pictures ".mpeg" and the sound file ".ac3" into the folder you're sorting everything on, ussualy I do everything in the same folder i first compiled my big .VOB on. To do this you need a de-muxer(decompiler) called tsMuxerGUI (http://www.videohelp.com/tools/tsMuxeR) (remember on the output to select DEMUX)

3: Now that you have the .mpeg, .ac3, and the .srt if you ripped the subtitles its simply a matter of adding it all into a nice .mkv container. To do this you need MKVtoolnix (http://www.videohelp.com/tools/MKVtoolnix) once you install this, run MKVmergeGUI and "drag" the .mpeg, .ac3, and the .srt if you ripped the subtitles to imput files, one tip tho, remember to add the .mpeg first. And remember to identify what language they are down in the options that way WD TV knows and tells you.

4: Then select the name below with the .mkv press start muxing and after its finishes you got yourslf a trouble free dvd source quality movie in a state of the art trouble free container. At least trouble free for me.


Note: I have an issue when ripping subs, the new VOB subtitle color space shows all black but SubRip still detects the letters. A way to overcome this is if you have ripped the movie only then use subrip to rip the subs off the video_ts folder instead, and hopefully fully synched



So to sumarize;

Rip the DVD to Video_TS
Unite all the .VOB's into a single .VOB with DVD2one
Rip the subtitle from the single .VOB with SubRip
Extract the .mpeg and .ac3 from the .VOB with tsMuxerGUI
Compile it all with mkvToolnix(mkvMergeGUI) into .mkv format

All done!:eek: now see if the WD TV plays it all smooth and synched :)

Hope that helped.

too bad wdtv doesn't support dvd menus in iso. then the process is...

1) use dvdshrink or aydvd to rip to disk image.

:D

Ide pay extra if WD would come out with a program that does everything.

Rip movie from DVD disk, put to a file size i select 4-6 gigs, add a nice title cover and move it to the HDD ready to play.

There isnt one tool we can use to rip the dvd and package it nicly onto the WD drive so we could then just watch it later?

All in 1 WDtv DVD conversion tool

It figures it cant be easy though, i mean to make somthing work and be easy to use will probobly cost more then the popcorn hour.

Ide pay extra if WD would come out with a program that does everything.

Rip movie from DVD disk, put to a file size i select 4-6 gigs, add a nice title cover and move it to the HDD ready to play.

There isnt one tool we can use to rip the dvd and package it nicly onto the WD drive so we could then just watch it later?

All in 1 WDtv DVD conversion tool

It figures it cant be easy though, i mean to make somthing work and be easy to use will probobly cost more then the popcorn hour.

Not going to happen. There is that little pesky DMCA that keeps getting in the way. It makes it illegal to circumvent copy protection on DVDs. No US based company wants to get into a fight with the MPAA. Just not worth it to them.

Well it doesnt have to be WD, who ever makes it is fine.

Right now i think im using somthing called DVD43 with 1click, the 1click doesnt usualy work with out dvd43 being on.

I tried dvd43 with the software that came with the wdtv unit "arcsoft" media converter but it didnt work ofcorse. That one program "make MKV" worked ok but the files were larger then i wanted and i dont really want to spend 6 hours on 1 movie recompressing it to somthing smaller.

The 1click converts the dvd to a file size that i feel is decent and the quality of the sound and video is decent as well its just missing some things i guess that makes it perfect.

Im still new at this im sure ill figure it out eventualy. I need to do more reading and searching around is all to get to where you guys are. You all have a little bit more time with your units then i do.

So far its played all the movies ive ripped to it so far but "Top Gun" for some reason it wont play and im not sure why. need to rerip it i guess, somthing may be corrupt in the files.

If you really want to use something really easy to rip DVD straight into .mkv without re-encoding try using makemkv. It will allow you to select the video, audio and subtitle tracks. It will then rip them and mux them into a .mkv file that the WD will play without any issue. www.makemkv.com

If you really want to use something really easy to rip DVD straight into .mkv without re-encoding try using makemkv. It will allow you to select the video, audio and subtitle tracks. It will then rip them and mux them into a .mkv file that the WD will play without any issue. www.makemkv.com

Thanks! I'll try anything once. Well, almost anything.lol