Hi, I was calibrating a friend's HD750 today and had some issues that have not been presented while calibrating my own HD750 - which was a breeze by comparison. Using Eye One LT & Chromapure. He's using a 1.5 gain Carada screen, iris set at -9, light coloured walls and ceiling (yeah, I know!). 130 hours on bulb.

First of all I set contrast, brightness & colour & tint and then managed to get a very good greyscale. Then, moving on to the CMS things just went haywire. On several of the primaries and secondaries I had to have luminance almost maxed out. They were also well over saturated meaning that when I brought saturation down luminance dropped even further. This was especially the case with Green and another secondary (can't remember which) where even totally maxing out luminance still didn't get me close. Then when trying to set Gamma I had to use 2.6 to get me anywhere near my target of 2.2! I ran out of time while tweaking 2.6 but by the time I had to leave his house I managed to get it much closer to 2.2 (though I need to return in order to finish things off and get a better flat gamma response). On my own HD750 I selected 2.2 and Chromapure reported that it was actually quite close to 2.2 so that the tweaking didn't have to be anywhere near as radical.

So what's up? Has anyone any ideas what's going wrong? I'll try to post some graphs (alhough I didn't have time to take post calibration checks). I just couldn't believe how much different his HD750 performed while calibrating compared to my own. Would the fact that his DVE-HD Basics Blu-ray didn't seem to have the primary and secondary colour fields so that I had to resort to those on my Avia DVD make any difference? Your help is appreciated. Thanks.

Hi, I was calibrating a friend's HD750 today and had some issues that have not been presented while calibrating my own HD750 - which was a breeze by comparison. Using Eye One LT & Chromapure. He's using a 1.5 gain Carada screen, iris set at -9, light coloured walls and ceiling (yeah, I know!). 130 hours on bulb.

First of all I set contrast, brightness & colour & tint and then managed to get a very good greyscale. Then, moving on to the CMS things just went haywire. On several of the primaries and secondaries I had to have luminance almost maxed out. They were also well over saturated meaning that when I brought saturation down luminance dropped even further. This was especially the case with Green and another secondary (can't remember which) where even totally maxing out luminance still didn't get me close. Then when trying to set Gamma I had to use 2.6 to get me anywhere near my target of 2.2! I ran out of time while tweaking 2.6 but by the time I had to leave his house I managed to get it much closer to 2.2 (though I need to return in order to finish things off and get a better flat gamma response). On my own HD750 I selected 2.2 and Chromapure reported that it was actually quite close to 2.2 so that the tweaking didn't have to be anywhere near as radical.

So what's up? Has anyone any ideas what's going wrong? I'll try to post some graphs (alhough I didn't have time to take post calibration checks). I just couldn't believe how much different his HD750 performed while calibrating compared to my own. Would the fact that his DVE-HD Basics Blu-ray didn't seem to have the primary and secondary colour fields so that I had to resort to those on my Avia DVD make any difference? Your help is appreciated. Thanks.

Did you check if his f/w had been updated to V1.1?

things just went haywire.

Yes... check his fw. Sounds like the old days.

Hi, I was calibrating a friend's HD750 today and had some issues that have not been presented while calibrating my own HD750 - which was a breeze by comparison. Using Eye One LT & Chromapure. He's using a 1.5 gain Carada screen, iris set at -9, light coloured walls and ceiling (yeah, I know!). 130 hours on bulb.

First of all I set contrast, brightness & colour & tint and then managed to get a very good greyscale. Then, moving on to the CMS things just went haywire. On several of the primaries and secondaries I had to have luminance almost maxed out. They were also well over saturated meaning that when I brought saturation down luminance dropped even further. This was especially the case with Green and another secondary (can't remember which) where even totally maxing out luminance still didn't get me close. Then when trying to set Gamma I had to use 2.6 to get me anywhere near my target of 2.2! I ran out of time while tweaking 2.6 but by the time I had to leave his house I managed to get it much closer to 2.2 (though I need to return in order to finish things off and get a better flat gamma response). On my own HD750 I selected 2.2 and Chromapure reported that it was actually quite close to 2.2 so that the tweaking didn't have to be anywhere near as radical.

So what's up? Has anyone any ideas what's going wrong? I'll try to post some graphs (alhough I didn't have time to take post calibration checks). I just couldn't believe how much different his HD750 performed while calibrating compared to my own. Would the fact that his DVE-HD Basics Blu-ray didn't seem to have the primary and secondary colour fields so that I had to resort to those on my Avia DVD make any difference? Your help is appreciated. Thanks.

It sounds to me like the unit has the gamma drift that has been talked about often. The next time you are with the unit select another memory bank (as to not destroy your work) and set the gamma to 2.2. Then measure (in 5% increments, not 10%!) without any calibration. Please post the gamma graph (not the curve, but the one that should be a straight horizontal line if gamma is perfect across the range).

My guess is that it will look a bit higher on the low end, around 2.2 in the middle range, and then once over 75% it'll drop like a rock, probably as low as 1.5 by the time you get to 95%. You can however with a lot of work and patience dial in the gamma right where you want it using the custom gamma options.

Let us know what you find.

Did you check if his f/w had been updated to V1.1?

I didn't check, but I did start to wonder. I'll get him to check it.

I wonder if the contrast was set too high (or the RGB gains) which might cause the gamma to drop off higher up? Also is he using the same player as you (are the player's settings at default?), does it go through an amp/processor and/or switch on it's way to the HD750? Are you using the same colourspace settings and HDMI settings as your setup? All of these things can have an effect on the calibration...I suppose a final check would be to take your HD750 there if it's possible and compare.

I still don't understand someone having a HD750 and using it in a light coloured room though...

It sounds to me like the unit has the gamma drift that has been talked about often. The next time you are with the unit select another memory bank (as to not destroy your work) and set the gamma to 2.2. Then measure (in 5% increments, not 10%!) without any calibration. Please post the gamma graph (not the curve, but the one that should be a straight horizontal line if gamma is perfect across the range).

My guess is that it will look a bit higher on the low end, around 2.2 in the middle range, and then once over 75% it'll drop like a rock, probably as low as 1.5 by the time you get to 95%. You can however with a lot of work and patience dial in the gamma right where you want it using the custom gamma options.

Let us know what you find.

I think that's what I saw already. Using Chromapure I measured gamma at 2.2 and then over 75% it went down quickly to 1.5

I wonder if the contrast was set too high (or the RGB gains) which might cause the gamma to drop off higher up? Also is he using the same player as you (are the player's settings at default?), does it go through an amp/processor and/or switch on it's way to the HD750? Are you using the same colourspace settings and HDMI settings as your setup? All of these things can have an effect on the calibration...I suppose a final check would be to take your HD750 there if it's possible and compare.

I still don't understand someone having a HD750 and using it in a light coloured room though...

Contrast might have been set too high. I used AVIA DVD to set brightness & contrast because I don't like the usual ramp steps and prefer their moving bar thingy! Interesting thing is that this initially set contrast to 0 with HDMI at Standard. Then I changed HDMI to Enhanced and contrast was then set at 15 or 16 - which is how I have mine. He uses an Oppo Blu-ray player. HDMI was left at Standard on the player (I read in this thread a while back that some guys use the HD750 on Enhanced and the player at Standard and have followed it ever since).

Contrast might have been set too high. I used AVIA DVD to set brightness & contrast because I don't like the usual ramp steps and prefer their moving bar thingy! Interesting thing is that this initially set contrast to 0 with HDMI at Standard. Then I changed HDMI to Enhanced and contrast was then set at 15 or 16 - which is how I have mine. He uses an Oppo Blu-ray player. HDMI was left at Standard on the player (I read in this thread a while back that some guys use the HD750 on Enhanced and the player at Standard and have followed it ever since).

If you make another attempt, I suggest to try standard/standard. This should allow you to keep contrast/brightness at 0, and may help to rule out factors like a too high contrast. I could understand using enhanced/enhanced, but this causes problems with other sources, so I found the best settings to be standard/standard.

If you make another attempt, I suggest to try standard/standard. This should allow you to keep contrast/brightness at 0, and may helpto rule out factors like a too high contrast. I could understand using enhanced/enhanced, but this causes problems with other sources, so I found the best settings to be standard/standard.

Will do. Have you heard about folks using Enhanced/Standard? I think from memory that's what I have mine set at.

Will do. Have you heard about folks using Enhanced/Standard? I think from memory that's what I have mine set at.

Not from anyone whose advice I would trust, but if you can provide a link explaining the reasons to do this (I can't see any right now), I'm happy to have a look.

Not from anyone whose advice I would trust, but if you can provide a link explaining the reasons to do this (I can't see any right now), I'm happy to have a look.

I'll check out my own settings on this and confirm, but on reflection it may have been an idea I picked up when I had my HD100 - so the idea may have come from the RS2 thread.

I think that's what I saw already. Using Chromapure I measured gamma at 2.2 and then over 75% it went down quickly to 1.5

How was I able to know this was the case just from your post? Some people continue to think that gamma drift on these projectors is a non-issue. Amazing.

At any rate, the correct way to handle it is to set the gamma back to 2.2, then use the custom gamma menu to correct the steep drop off and fine tune the other areas. If you need more info just let me know.

Can someone advise me as to what the correct firmware number should look like. In the service menu my HD750 tells me:

Sub 2009.4.8.1-O

Gents....need your help please.

Was in the RS20/HD750 menu last night and in the 'Picture Adjust > Advanced Settings>Color Management' and I think I accidentally managed to turn the setting from 'On to Off'

Cannot turn it 'On' no matter what I do. I am almost 100% that the on/off setting was on prior to me fiddling with it.

How does one turn it back 'On'.

Thanks.

Take it out of THX mode and you should be able to turn it on. It is disabled in THX, IIRC.

Take it out of THX mode and you should be able to turn it on. It is disabled in THX, IIRC.

Thanks. I was out of THX mode, actually USER 2, but I still couldn't change it, it's hightlighted with the arrow, but nothing happens when 'Ok' is pressed!!:o

Thanks. I was out of THX mode, actually USER 2, but I still couldn't change it, it's hightlighted with the arrow, but nothing happens when 'Ok' is pressed!!:o

Strange. Try left and right arrows instead but either should work.

Maybe new remote batteries.

Apparently the 'Off' setting is non changeable. I must have been mistaken thinking I saw it in an 'On' mode!:o

Thanks anyway!

Just recently done a re-calibration.

What do you guys think is more important for color gamut of a primary color?

Brightness (mentioned in the SpectraCal manual being more important than Saturation/Hue for Primary Colors).

Or

CIE94 Delta E's? (where most people use).

I have the option of getting the Brightness spot on with Blue on my HD750 at the expense of a higher Delta E. Or a Lower Delta E but brightness more off.

Just recently done a re-calibration.

What do you guys think is more important for color gamut of a primary color?

Brightness (mentioned in the SpectraCal manual being more important than Saturation/Hue for Primary Colors).

Or

CIE94 Delta E's? (where most people use).

I have the option of getting the Brightness spot on with Blue on my HD750 at the expense of a higher Delta E. Or a Lower Delta E but brightness more off.

Which meter are you using? Blue is one of the most difficult colors to get right on the rs20. If you are sure your meter is right in low light, go for brightness, as long as hue is correct (I personally didn't change hue on my rs20, as it produced really weird effects, even if the primary was supposed to measure better).

Why don't you put the two calibrations (one with the best dE, one with the best brightness) in two presets, so that you can change instantly from one to the other (make sure all the settings are the same in the preset except the blue settings in the CMS) and chose the one that looks more correct? Make sure you check blue color ramps, and content with lots of blue (avatar comes to mind!).

Which meter are you using? Blue is one of the most difficult colors to get right on the rs20.

I'm using the iOne Display LT. So maybe the meter can't read the Hue of the blue properly in low light. I will try your suggestion and see which setting turns out better.

Thanks

Okay, I did another calibration of my HD750 last night. I took on board the advice about not having offsets above 0 because it affects black levels and managed to get an even better greyscale with average Delta E under 1.2. I checked my HDMI settings and found that it was set to Enhanced in the HD750 even though my HD-DVD & Blu-ray players were outputting standard. So I sorted that out - everything at standard now. Got the colours closer than before with the CMS too. All is good so far...

Just a couple of questions stand out and they relate to different results from 2 different test discs. First I used DVE (SD) version to set Brightness, Contrast and Color & Tint (I always preferred their moving bars to the standard ramp). This gave me Brightness of 0 and contrast of 1 or 2 if I remember rightly. Tint was 0 but Color was 7. I continued the calibration with my DVE-HD-DVD disc. After my calibration I tested the settings with a newly burnt copy of AVC709. I've never used this before but was delighted to find that it has everything I need - including lovely moving bars for setting the brightness and contrast! However this gave me different results. Brightness went up to 3 and Contrast came down to -3. Tint stayed at 0 but Color shot up to 13. Are these numbers in the right ballpark? I didn't see much difference in the onscreen colour TBH, but I did notice the leap in brightness. Blacks seemed less solid and, well, black, although the slight crushing noticed at 0 was no longer there. I preferred the less washed out look of 0, but AVC709 told me it was not reference! So which disc gives me the reference settings? Which is more accurate? Also, I wonder whether I should go back and change gamma from 2.2 to 2.3 to get deeper blacks? Would that help?

What do you guys think is more important for color gamut of a primary color?

Brightness (mentioned in the SpectraCal manual being more important than Saturation/Hue for Primary Colors).

Or

CIE94 Delta E's? (where most people use).

I have the option of getting the Brightness spot on with Blue on my HD750 at the expense of a higher Delta E. Or a Lower Delta E but brightness more off.CIE94 is an all-things-considered metric for color accuracy. The lightness component is just one element of that and not necessarily the most important. Even relatively small hue errors can result in much larger dEs than an equivalent lightness error.

I wouldn't adjust colour or tint as you have a CMS and are using a probe to measure anyway. It would be surprising if they need to be set anything other than 0 as colour decoding isn't usually an issue with the HDxxx models anyway. With the AVS disc I aim to just be able to make out the 17 bar flashing. This will also correspond to the highest brightness setting I can use without raising black level. Another check is to put up a 0 IRE pattern off the disc and move the brightness up or down one click. If you see the black level change when you go down, then this is the lowest you can set the brightness. One more click and the level won't change, so this is too far (go back up one click). The custom gamma setting shouldn't stop you seeing 17 IRE bar unless it's been adjusted severely, even then I think it's unlikely. I have to go near the screen to see the 17 bar as it's hard to see it from my seat, 18 being just about visible back there.

Contrast setting can also be a whole other arguement: Somelike to clip above 235, some allow upto 240 (my choice) and others all the way upto 254. Then after you've set your clipping level, it's also worth checking a few other things: Put up the smooth greyscale ramp and look for 'stripes' in the ramp. Lower your contrast from the max clipping setting by one click at a time and see if there is a 'sweet spot' where you get minimal 'stripes' or bands in the ramp. In my case it was one click down from max clipping, so I ended being able to see over 240, but with a smoother ramp.

Another check is with the probe you can see if you are 'running out' of one colour by putting up the 109IRE pattern and viewing the RGB in real time. As you increase the contrast you will find a point where one colour doesn't increase (usually red) and the others do.

Another thing re the brightness setting: I'd make sure your player's controls (if it has any) are set to neutral/default incase there is a brightness control in there as well.

Cheers Kelvin. Just to confirm - you would leave Tint and Color at 0?

Well I have no idea what's happening now. I've left color and tint at 0 and done a calibration as normal. I get a great grey scale then do my CMS stuff and everything is bang on there. Then I adjust the gamma to get 2.3 and pow! My grey scale is all shot through! Can any one advise? Why is adjusting my gamma destroying my grey scale? BTW, when I adjust the gamma I'm only touching the white controls. Is that an issue? Please, can some one advise. This is getting really frustrating!

Welcome to the frustration of early HDxxx gamma controls. :(

Yes, I did mean leave colour and tint at 0 as your CMS will do all the work and raising the colour control may introduce clipping anyway which I forgot to mention.

You may have to go round and round making small adjustments to the gamma and checking the greyscale (this is easier with Chromapure not sure what you're using if it's HFCR then I can understand your frustration even more). You may have to go into the individual red, green & blue gamma controls which you can use to fine tune your greyscale at various points throughout the range. There is a procedure by Delau (sp?) that has a recommended procedure for minimum hassle when using the gamma control.

I've just bought a Lumagen Mini3D to do all the main calibration adjustments (currently using the VideoEQ Pro) as I find the HD350 controls too finicky for my patience.

Thanks again Kelvin. Well I soldiered on and got very good results on greyscale and CMS. Chromapure reports that gamma is 2.3 on average but the line has a few kinks in it that need ironing out, although I can't spare any more time on it so it will have to do for now. We'll have to see whether I'm happier with the image. My offsets are a quite few notches lower than before (around about -8 or -9 from memory) as opposed to -4ish before, and during the few minutes I was able to watch a test Blu-ray the image certainly felt darker overall. Though I'm not sure that was wholly what I wanted because after AVCHD told me to raise brightness I just wanted more solid blacks.

>>> Just found leDahu's gamma thingy. From a quick glance I see that he proposes starting at the top first then working downward - but setting the gamma point indirectly by working on the point directly below it. This makes sense because it is so frustrating to see the JVC altering the gamma point above and below it that you've just set!! I'm not sure I understand how to use the table though. I must be thick, but I think I need someone to explain what numbers you put where and what order you do it in. Have you used the table Kelvin?

I wasn't really satisfied with my calibration yesterday so I had another go at calibrating this morning. I'm amazed. I did a complete calibration with fresh settings in an hour and the results are so much better than yesterday. I have a great greyscale with low DeltaE. The CMS calibrated great with low DeltaE. Most impressive of all is that, following leDahu's principles I managed to dial in a flat 2.22 gamma line in less than 15 minutes! I used my previous custom 2.22 gamma as a base and was perturbed to discover that what was just above 2.22 a couple of hundred hours ago had now sunk to about 2.0. Armed with the new technique it was pretty easy to sort it out this time though!

When I'd finished, as an after thought, I put my 750 into high lamp mode. I always run my lamp on standard and have my iris shut down to 5 now after 650 hours. Occasionally I'll open up the iris to see what it looks like but there isn't too much of a difference TBH. But blow me down! The vibrancy of the picture in high lamp mode, especially with the iris open, was fantastic! It reminded me of the vibrant picture I used to get from my Optoma HD80, which I loved. Damn, I wish the 750 had more lumens available! High lamp mode simply looked great although the fan noise was distracting (though no louder than my old HD80). I suppose the only other alternative is to get a high power screen but that's hard to do without any free cash and I'm a bit wary of sparklies etc.

Glad you found Le Dahu's procedure useful. It was the only way for me to adjust gamma on my rs20.

The controls are much better on the newer models though.

If you are using high lamp and a different iris position, you may want to check your calibration though, because it is very likely that greyscale, gamma and even gamut are affected.

On the rs50, one or two notches on the iris (for example from -15 to -13) have a huge efffect on the greyscale.

I can't check on the rs20 as I don't have mine anymore, but I would double check if I were you.

Usuallly it is recommended to calibrate in the lamp mode and iris setting you plan to use...

Cheers Manni. Yes, I realise that high lamp mode etc can make a difference so my 750 is back in calibrated mode. Just wish there could be more lumens available in standard mode. I take it that you have rs50 now? Do you find the 2d performance much of an improvement over the 750? On paper it has those extra lumens and I've heard that is has better sharpness.

Cheers Manni. Yes, I realise that high lamp mode etc can make a difference so my 750 is back in calibrated mode. Just wish there could be more lumens available in standard mode. I take it that you have rs50 now? Do you find the 2d performance much of an improvement over the 750? On paper it has those extra lumens and I've heard that is has better sharpness.

I personally wouldn't upgrade a 750/rs20 to an rs40/50 just for 2D. But if you're into 3D, an rs40 might give you more brightness. Not sure you'd get more brightness in 2D with an rs50. I didn't.

There seems to be quite a lot of unit to unit variations, so it's difficult to say for sure that you would get this or that.

The only thing you would get for sure is 3D, and it's pretty good on both models (in fact very good for a first gen product) if you can live with minimal ghosting depending on the titles.

I am very happy with my rs50 (in fact an X7), but I am a big fan of 3D, and in this regard the rs50 really delivers...

Thanks for the reflections. I'm not that into 3D I must confess. I've been pretty underwhelmed by what I've seen of it at the cinema - but then I'm underwhelmed by most of the 2D images I've seen at the cinema too ;) So may be 3D looks better at home with active glasses. Will have to check that out. But no, for the moment I'm only interested in 2D. So thanks for making me feel happier staying with my 750 for the time being! :D

I personally wouldn't upgrade a 750/rs20 to an rs40/50 just for 2D. But if you're into 3D, an rs40 might give you more brightness. Not sure you'd get more brightness in 2D with an rs50. I didn't.

There seems to be quite a lot of unit to unit variations, so it's difficult to say for sure that you would get this or that.

The only thing you would get for sure is 3D, and it's pretty good on both models (in fact very good for a first gen product) if you can live with minimal ghosting depending on the titles.

I am very happy with my rs50 (in fact an X7), but I am a big fan of 3D, and in this regard the rs50 really delivers...

I suppose the only other alternative is to get a high power screen but that's hard to do without any free cash and I'm a bit wary of sparklies etc.

Or a hush-box? BTW, The HP doesn't have a "sparklie" issue. I've never heard of an actual owner complaining of this. I've heard very few stories about one or two sparklies on a screen, but it seems to be a complete non-issue. Order a sample!

Or a hush-box? BTW, The HP doesn't have a "sparklie" issue. I've never heard of an actual owner complaining of this. I've heard very few stories about one or two sparklies on a screen, but it seems to be a complete non-issue. Order a sample!

Sounds good. Do you have a link for the screen?

Sounds good. Do you have a link for the screen?

I think people order samples directly from Da-Lite: http://www.da-lite.com/whos_who/

I wasn't really satisfied with my calibration yesterday so I had another go at calibrating this morning. I'm amazed. I did a complete calibration with fresh settings in an hour and the results are so much better than yesterday. I have a great greyscale with low DeltaE. The CMS calibrated great with low DeltaE. Most impressive of all is that, following leDahu's principles I managed to dial in a flat 2.22 gamma line in less than 15 minutes! I used my previous custom 2.22 gamma as a base and was perturbed to discover that what was just above 2.22 a couple of hundred hours ago had now sunk to about 2.0. Armed with the new technique it was pretty easy to sort it out this time though!

When I'd finished, as an after thought, I put my 750 into high lamp mode. I always run my lamp on standard and have my iris shut down to 5 now after 650 hours. Occasionally I'll open up the iris to see what it looks like but there isn't too much of a difference TBH. But blow me down! The vibrancy of the picture in high lamp mode, especially with the iris open, was fantastic! It reminded me of the vibrant picture I used to get from my Optoma HD80, which I loved. Damn, I wish the 750 had more lumens available! High lamp mode simply looked great although the fan noise was distracting (though no louder than my old HD80). I suppose the only other alternative is to get a high power screen but that's hard to do without any free cash and I'm a bit wary of sparklies etc.

Thanks for the report. Glad you had success with it. Regarding changing your lamp mode - just a heads up this typically changes the color temperature a few hundred degrees. You may not want to bother with it, but just wanted you to know.

Sorry I missed your post yesterday Jules. It sounds like you're sorted now anyway. I never used the table as by the time I was starting to calibrate properly I had my Lumagen HDQ and used that for gamma, then the VideoEQ Pro (and next the Lumagen Mini3D...does it ever stop? :D).

Are you already using the iris fully open with your new calibration? I found with my HD350 that it takes abouot 4 steps on the iris (in the service menu for us lowly HD350 owners ;)) to gain the same brightness as changing to high lamp mode. I also found it was about the same 4 clicks to match brightness between 16:9 and zoomed 2.35:1 as well if that's of any interest. I'd recommend getting a Tecpel 531 light meter if only to satisfy yourself how bright you image currently is and to monitor how the lamp ages. I aim for 95-100 Lux at screen centre which with my screen equals about 12-13fL. I found I'd been viewing at 5-6fL when I first got the meter, so the iris got opened up lots and I'm already using high power due to flicker in normal mode.

One final thought: Have you tried cleaing your lamp/prism? It can make quite a difference on some projectors depending on hours run. However it may well effect the colour temp and require another calibration, especially if you then close the iris a bit as well.

Thanks for the response LovingDVD.

Kelvin, interested to know what screen you are using. Mine is a DIY frame with 1.0 gain Harkness Hall Matt White material - 110" diag. Room is black and totally light controlled. Actually I tested a sample of Beamax 1.2 gain against it and my material appeared brighter. I checked the prism just before I recently sent the pj to JVC and it was clean as a whistle. Opening up the iris doesn't seem to make a big difference for me. Putting it into high power did, but then as LovingDVD says that impression of brightness may also have been the result of changing the colour temperature.

Thanks for the reflections. I'm not that into 3D I must confess. I've been pretty underwhelmed by what I've seen of it at the cinema - but then I'm underwhelmed by most of the 2D images I've seen at the cinema too ;) So may be 3D looks better at home with active glasses. Will have to check that out. But no, for the moment I'm only interested in 2D. So thanks for making me feel happier staying with my 750 for the time being! :D

You can't assess 3D from what you see in your local cinema. 3D in most cinemas is really bad. You have to go to the iMax to get a chance to see it done properly.

Size apart, the rs50 provides a better 3D experience than my local cinema, by far. More details, more brightness, better focus. Just like 2D, which is usually better than in most local cinemas.

What I hate in cinemas is these security lights which kill contrast. I went to see a movie today, and the blacks were grey.

The sound was much better, but the picture was only larger.

I'd say try to get a demo from a dealer who offers a good demo room before you rule 3D out. If you've only seen 3D in a local cinema or on a 60" screen TV, you're in for a surprise if you audition an rs50 in a good demo room.

Jules, my screen is the 1.5 gain version and it's 112" wide (2.35:1) which is the same width as a 128" diagonal 16:9. I believe this has been measured by some at nearer 1.3 so who knows what the 1.2 version really measures (maybe less than 1 judging by your comments?). Still surprised that opening the iris doesn't do it for you as 4 clicks should give you the same lumens gain, but high power will change the colour temp, which might slew the results subjectively.

This is why I like to use the Tecpel meter as even if I think the lamp might have dimmed, it's usually because it's just a dark film and when I check it I'm still at 95 Lux on a 100IRE test pattern.

Jules, my screen is the 1.5 gain version and it's 112" wide (2.35:1) which is the same width as a 128" diagonal 16:9. I believe this has been measured by some at nearer 1.3 so who knows what the 1.2 version really measures (maybe less than 1 judging by your comments?). Still surprised that opening the iris doesn't do it for you as 4 clicks should give you the same lumens gain, but high power will change the colour temp, which might slew the results subjectively.

This is why I like to use the Tecpel meter as even if I think the lamp might have dimmed, it's usually because it's just a dark film and when I check it I'm still at 95 Lux on a 100IRE test pattern.

I guess the wow factor was because I opened the iris from -5 to 0 AND put it into high power. Then of course we take into account the raising of the colour temperature.

You can't assess 3D from what you see in your local cinema. 3D in most cinemas is really bad. You have to go to the iMax to get a chance to see it done properly.

Size apart, the rs50 provides a better 3D experience than my local cinema, by far. More details, more brightness, better focus. Just like 2D, which is usually better than in most local cinemas.

What I hate in cinemas is these security lights which kill contrast. I went to see a movie today, and the blacks were grey.

The sound was much better, but the picture was only larger.

I'd say try to get a demo from a dealer who offers a good demo room before you rule 3D out. If you've only seen 3D in a local cinema or on a 60" screen TV, you're in for a surprise if you audition an rs50 in a good demo room.

Cheers, I'll reserve judgement until I can get a decent demo.

Please let me know if this forum has moved. I have a JVC 750, professionally calibrated, ceiling mount, 100 inch screen. 1200 hours on original bulb. The other night I noticed some red running down the left side of the screen, very light, but I noticed. When I ran the color test page on the projector, along with the red, I also saw some yellow bleeding into the white square top left of the test pattern. Adjusting the lens moved the red off the screen, still projected, but not longer seen on the screen. I cleaned the bulb and the prism (first time) and 97% of the yellow is gone. Please let me know if you have encountered this or have a solution. Thanks!

How did the air intake filter look? Any blockage?

It was a mess when I cleaned it. But there is still a hint of yellow bleeding into the white. The Red line down the left is now completely off screen, due to lens adjust, but still there. Do you think a better cleaning of the prism and bulb?

Yes, I think any possible cleaning is worth doing.

When my projector suffered fringing of a color band along one side, the end result was a replacement of the optical block by JVC under warranty.

One calibrator I spoke with suspected that these kinds of problems were heat related and he drilled into me a monthly cleaning on the air intake filter (whether it looked dirty or not) as a way to ensure good consistent cooling airflow.

Being frugal and knowing my warranty period would be over in a few months, I also upped my fan speed to "high altitude", figuring a little fan noise was preferable to the optical block going out a second time -- since the out of warranty repair price was such that it would likely be better to just replace the projector, if it happened again -- but I don't have that kind of budget.

I don't know that this is what's going on with yours, but I figure you posted here to get all the data and input and observations you could from owners of JVC projectors.

My hope is that a cleaning of what you have access to will help you.

However, if the unit is still under warranty, I would definitely send it to JVC.

I have to see if I am still under warranty...don't think so. Was hoping to avoid the JVC visit AND having to put out additional money...espcially a heavy cost. Out of curiosity, how long did they keep the projector for and how long did you own the projector before you got banding. Thank you.

Took about six weeks since these are now older units and they have to wait on the block to arrive from Japan. The unit was within six months of the end of warranty, to give you a sense of the age of the unit.

If you have that option (service under warranty), I 1000% recommend you do that. If not, then if I were you I'd do whatever cleaning I can, and see if that helps.

Really good advice. Will check the warranty...which I think is 2 years.

Thank you.

I wonder, has the rest of the forum members upgraded to different projectors?

I wonder, has the rest of the forum members upgraded to different projectors?

Not this one. Happy as a clam, except the greens are getting a little out of hand. I'm just too lazy to calibrate it. I'd rather watch.

Update: Still under warranty. Sent back to JVC for repair. Turns out that it is the Optical Block. Currently waiting for parts to arrive. Thank you for the advice and feedback.

Glad to hear it's getting worked out. That's a good solution.

Hi all - quick question. If I was to get my RS20 calibrated and then change the bulb would the projector need to be calibrated again? The bulb currently has 500 hours and is sytarting to look a little on the dim side.

Hi all - quick question. If I was to get my RS20 calibrated and then change the bulb would the projector need to be calibrated again? The bulb currently has 500 hours and is sytarting to look a little on the dim side.

Yes. A new bulb will have different brightness and color characteristics than a bulb with some hours. So periodic tweaking of the CMS is recommended.

-Alex-

Thanks for the quick reply, bairda.

Another question - as bulbs vary, does that mean the preset thx mode varies in accuracy from machine to machine? Or are they calibrated for each unit? I'm trying to work out whether it's worth calibrating now, or buying a new bulb, waiting for a few hundred hours, and then getting it done. If a calibrated machine that then gets a new bulb is better with its calibrated settings than with the preset thx mode i'll give it a shot now as I think this bulb has a few hundred hours left in it, otherwise i'll probably wait.

Via their certification of a particular product, THX claims they certify that all units will meet a certain closeness to the standard when in THX mode. Manufacturers do not individually calibrate the THX mode.

So THX mode is usually the most accurate default mode available, but several factors including bulb variations when new, or changes over time when aging, and different screen types, wall or ceiling color in the room, etc, can all be a factor, too.

I get a professional calibration after 100-150 hours on each new bulb, and then an annual check up during the life of the bulb.

I have some specific questions about the settings of my HDI Dune Smart B1 (lastest firmware) network player. For your information: I m running my Dune with a JVC RS20 projector.

Video settings:

1. Video Mode:
what do I have to choose here? Do I have to choose Auto or the highest my display can? (so in my case, jvc RS20 this would be 1080p60).

2. Aspect Ratio:
Auto or 16:9?

Framerate:
Auto or 24/50/60?

HDMI Color Depth:
Auto, 8,10 or 12?

HDMI CEC:
Disable or Enable?

Force DVI Output:
Yes or No?

Output Colorspace:
Auto, BT.609, BT.709, RGB-Full or RGB-Limited?

Default Decoder Colorspace:
Auto, BT.601 or BT.709?


Audio Settings:

Dynamic Range Control:
Off, Medium, High or Auto?

Volume Control:
Off, Best Quality or Allow Overload?


General Settings:

Fast Disc Access:
Disable or Enable?

Fast SMB Access:
Disable or Enable?

Blu-Ray Playback Improvements:
Disable or Enable?

Blu-Ray Bitstream Improvements:
Disable or Enable?

I know it s will be some work but is it possible that for the ones that know exactly what all settings DO that you guys give a further explanation of the specific settings I ask about?

Thanks for all help and input!

Greetings.

I believe this post would be more appropriate in the digital video area for Dune HD. The folks that use the Dune's would be able to elaborate on these settings.

That's fine, I have a Dune base 3.0 and although I don't have an rs20 anymore (I have an rs50), the settings for the rs20 should be mostly similar.

Before doing this, make sure you download and install the latest stable firmware for the dune (either download it from the dune website and put it on a USB stick, or from the internet from the dune directly, there is an option in the settings. I would also reset to factory defaults after the upgrade, just to make sure there is no old stuff left somewhere.

My suggestions below, after your questions:

I have some specific questions about the settings of my HDI Dune Smart B1 (lastest firmware) network player. For your information: I m running my Dune with a JVC RS20 projector.

Video settings:

1. Video Mode:
what do I have to choose here? Do I have to choose Auto or the highest my display can? (so in my case, jvc RS20 this would be 1080p60).
Depends on the material you play most often. If you play mostly blurays, set it to 1080p@23.97 Hz, with framerate on auto. If you play mostly NTSC DVDs, put it on 1080p60. In anycase, set auto framerate below to 24/50/60/.

2. Aspect Ratio:
Auto or 16:9?
Auto is fine, otherwise 16/9.
Framerate:
Auto or 24/50/60?
24/50/60, this will allow you to have the right framerate depending on the material played (24 for mkvs/blurays, 50 for PAL DVDs, 60 for NTSC DVDs). This will limit judder to the absolute minimum.

HDMI Color Depth:
Auto, 8,10 or 12?
Unless you are playing material specifically encoded in more than 8 bits, like some anime, I would chose 8 bits as it can allow for faster HDMI switching, and very little video material is encoded in 10or 12 bits, for example no DVDs or blurays are.

HDMI CEC:
Disable or Enable?
Disable unless you want the rs20 to switch on automatically when you switch on a compatible source, like a bluray player, which has to be set to CEC as well (or whateverthe manufacturer calls it).

Force DVI Output:
Yes or No?
No

Output Colorspace:
Auto, BT.609, BT.709, RGB-Full or RGB-Limited?
Auto unless you notice that the black level isn't right for some sources, but if you set HDMI to standard and not enhanced on the rs20 you shouldn't have any issues.

Default Decoder Colorspace:
Auto, BT.601 or BT.709?
Auto is fine

Audio Settings:

Dynamic Range Control:
Off, Medium, High or Auto?
Off

Volume Control:
Off, Best Quality or Allow Overload?
Off

General Settings:

Fast Disc Access:
Disable or Enable?
Leave default
Fast SMB Access:
Disable or Enable?
Disable unless you have network speed issues.
Blu-Ray Playback Improvements:
Disable or Enable?
Leave default
Blu-Ray Bitstream Improvements:
Disable or Enable?
Leave default
I know it s will be some work but is it possible that for the ones that know exactly what all settings DO that you guys give a further explanation of the specific settings I ask about?

Thanks for all help and input!

Greetings.

Update: Still under warranty. Sent back to JVC for repair. Turns out that it is the Optical Block. Currently waiting for parts to arrive. Thank you for the advice and feedback.
Hi Decny,

Did you know what they exactly repaired ? I have the same issues with RS20 but I am over warranty. My bulb is only 680 hours and I maintained filter to be clean before. If it will be whole optical block I will be very unhappy ....

By the way it is curious that JVC has such problems with heat and they are not installing any heat sensor which cost generally less then 2-3 USD. This projectors costs like small car and such issues shouldn't exists.

klausm...

It was the optical block that needed to be replaced, compared to the cheaper optical engine. To add insult to injury, the shipping and shipping insurance was really expensive as well. i have 1200 hours on the projector and was very surprised that this was a problem. The positive is that jvc did the repair very quickly out of california. The jvc website lists the optical block at $5000. I hope your repair is minor, sorry to hear that you are having a problem.

decny,
thank you for quick answer. I will see what will be answer from JVC service. I have read about few similar issue from newsgroup and it was optical block replaced like yours. Will see ...

should I upgrade my RS20 to this new firmware? I have a mac, and couldn't find a link that was mac-compatible. I'm not a serious tweaker, so when I get my 20 this next Sat. I should know if I should do this....any thoughts on this?

should I upgrade my RS20 to this new firmware? I have a mac, and couldn't find a link that was mac-compatible. I'm not a serious tweaker, so when I get my 20 this next Sat. I should know if I should do this....any thoughts on this?

If you're going to get it professionally calibrated, which you should 'cause these units clean up nicely, then the firmware upgrade is important... And many calibrators will do it for you if you discuss ahead of time.

Strange problem with HD DVD vs. Blu-ray. I have a Toshiba A2 HD DVD player and a Sony BDP-S1 Blu-ray player connected to my JVC DLA-RS20.

When I turn either of them on, the presented area is as expect and I get a native 16:9 image, and the RS20 reports an Aspect Mode of 16:9. I have a 2.40 screen and the RS20's 16:9 projected panel area is sitting full-height in the 2.40 screen.

If I put in a Blu-ray movie with 2.40 aspect I just zoom in to fill the 2.40 screen area. The Aspect Mode in the JVC menu continues to report Aspect Mode 16:9, and the content area aspect ratio is correct.

If I put in an HD DVD movie with 2.40 aspect the content aspect ratio is wrong and the content area appears to be squashed vertically. The JVC Aspect Mode reports 16:9, and if I change it to 4:3 the content area aspect ratio corrects itself, but the sides of the 2.40 movie is cut off. :eek:

What, if anything, am I do wrong, or what am I not doing that I need to be doing? The HD DVD movies I have tried include Batman Begins and Sky Captain.

Did you try to check the picture settings on the HD-DVD player? It looks like they are right on the BD player, and wrong on the HD DVD player. It should be set to 16/9, as is probably the BD player.

I took a nap, realized there has to be a Setup menu, located it on the A2, and found the video format was set to 4:3. I changed it to 16:9 and the video is now good. I then re-ran the video chain through the Denon 3312 for system integration.

Now I just need to determine why I am not getting Dobly True HD. The A2 lists PCM, Downmixed PCM, or Auto for HDMI audio transport, but the Denon isn't receiving what it expects as True HD audio even though I selected it in the Batman Begins disk.

When the above audio issue introduced itself, I tried PCM and Auto for HDMI Audio, but maybe something else is amiss. This is a three year old player I pulled out of storage after sitting there for 2 years.

I took a nap, realized there has to be a Setup menu, located it on the A2, and found the video format was set to 4:3. I changed it to 16:9 and the video is now good. I then re-ran the video chain through the Denon 3312 for system integration.

Now I just need to determine why I am not getting Dobly True HD. The A2 lists PCM, Downmixed PCM, or Auto for HDMI audio transport, but the Denon isn't receiving what it expects as True HD audio even though I selected it in the Batman Begins disk.

When the above audio issue introduced itself, I tried PCM and Auto for HDMI Audio, but maybe something else is amiss. This is a three year old player I pulled out of storage after sitting there for 2 years.

Try to see if you have an option for "best quality" versus "commentary" or something like that. Often the default is optional commentary, which means you don't get full HD bitstream.

In any case, if it doesn't work, select PCM, it's probably close to the quality you'd get with proper bitstreaming.

How do I update the firmware if I have a Mac? And if THAT'S possible, then I'd like to see how the whole update is done. I don't have any equipment to calibrate, and I just want to desaturate the colors just a tad. Anyone?

How do I update the firmware if I have a Mac? And if THAT'S possible, then I'd like to see how the whole update is done. I don't have any equipment to calibrate, and I just want to desaturate the colors just a tad. Anyone?

Some users used Parallel with success. Bootcamp should work as well. Just make sure you don't use Windows 64 bits, the fw update utility needs a 32 bits version of Windows (XP or more recent) to work.

If you just want to desaturate the colours without calibrating, why not use THX or another preset? You should find one that suits you.

I somewhat tweaked the THX settings to get what I want (for now). Basically, I bumped the color up to +20 and put in the Fifth element (my reference point for color...I've been using that for years). Now I have a more natural, more realistic presentation...I have the old CMS, and don't think I need it right now. I'm in pj nirvana......

Am I supposed to never have a positive offset on the rs20? My blue needs quite a boost (+6) on the offset to be correct according to Calman 4.3 and my Colormunki Spectro. Or have I likely screwed up some other setting for it to be needing a positive number for blue offset?

Instead of raising blue, lower green and red. Otherwise you'll hurt your black levels. Or you could raise blue and make sure you adjust brightness, but the control is coarse on the rs20 and you might risk losing shadow detail by lowering brightness even one notch.

Always lowering offsets usually works better. It can also help with your gamma.

Hello,Manni

I need a little bit of help from you,p[lease
I saw that on your previous HD 750 you made the correct gamut at 75% and 100% gamut.
How are you made to do that.You used 75% stimulus to correct RGB in CMS(H,S,B)?
I am very confused because when i used 100% stimulus pattern to check the chroma it is right,but for 25%,50%,75% is very wrong.
I can see in my picture that with real world material it is red deficient a little .
Sorry for my English but i am a newbie in this natter also there is a barrier language :(
Also after i adjust garyscale,is important to make Gamma in this particular order?

Best regards

Hello,Manni

I need a little bit of help from you,p[lease
I saw that on your previous HD 750 you made the correct gamut at 75% and 100% gamut.
How are you made to do that.You used 75% stimulus to correct RGB in CMS(H,S,B)?
I am very confused because when i used 100% stimulus pattern to check the chroma it is right,but for 25%,50%,75% is very wrong.
I can see in my picture that with real world material it is red deficient a little .
Sorry for my English but i am a newbie in this natter also there is a barrier language :(
Also after i adjust garyscale,is important to make Gamma in this particular order?

Best regards

Hi Maximus,

You'll never get an absolutely linear correction with any CMS. What you're after is the best compromise.

You will sometimes get better results calibrating to Rec-709 at 75% stimulus, and sometimes at 100% stimulus. However, most experienced calibrators do not target rec-709 exactly, because you are likely to get undersaturation at one level or another. You get very nice looking charts at the level youcalibrated at, but your actual calibration can be undersaturated, like you noticed on red in your case when measuring at other stimulus (or saturation) levels.

With the rs20, I found it was better to calibrate at 75% stimulus (if I remember correctly) otherwise 75% stim is undersaturated. This means that it will probably be slightly oversaturated at 100%, but you might get better results visually. You don't want red to be undersaturated, but you don't want it to be oversaturated either (I mean with real pictures, not patterns).

You could spend hours trying to get all stimulus or saturation levels right, but it won't happen.

Either calibrate to rec-709 at 75% stim, hoping that 100% will not get too oversaturated, or calibrate to 100% stim with a little oversaturation on the colors that bother you to compensate for the undersaturation at 75%.

The same applies for saturation, but depending on the calibration software you use, you might not be able to measure this. HCFR and Chromapure do it, Calman not yet.

By the way, Chromapure also allows you to calibrate to rec-709 at 75% of the target saturation wise (not stimulus), which could help in your case to find a better compromise. If you are using Chromapure, I recommend you try this. If you need more info about this, email their support or post in the chromapure thread, you'll get some help.

Re gamma, in general you can either do it after you do grescale, or just do the gains at 100% stim and do greyscale with the RGB gamma controls for the rest of the curve. Unfortunately, the gamma controls don't work on the rs20, so unless you want to try the complex LeDahu procedure detailed in this thread (see link in first post), leave them alone and try to get the closest gamma curve using the gamma presets. Although the CMS got fixed on the rs20, the gamma controls on the rs20 were not fixed until the next models (rs 25/35), so apart from following the LeDahu procedure it's a no go.

I don't have an rs20 anymore, so my memory may not serve me well. I'm sure other users will correct me if I'm not right.

Hi Maximus,

You'll never get an absolutely linear correction with any CMS. What you're after is the best compromise.

You will sometimes get better results calibrating to Rec-709 at 75% stimulus, and sometimes at 100% stimulus. However, most experienced calibrators do not target rec-709 exactly, because you are likely to get undersaturation at one level or another. You get very nice looking charts at the level youcalibrated at, but your actual calibration can be undersaturated, like you noticed on red in your case when measuring at other stimulus (or saturation) levels.

With the rs20, I found it was better to calibrate at 75% stimulus (if I remember correctly) otherwise 75% stim is undersaturated. This means that it will probably be slightly oversaturated at 100%, but you might get better results visually. You don't want red to be undersaturated, but you don't want it to be oversaturated either (I mean with real pictures, not patterns).

You could spend hours trying to get all stimulus or saturation levels right, but it won't happen.

Either calibrate to rec-709 at 75% stim, hoping that 100% will not get too oversaturated, or calibrate to 100% stim with a little oversaturation on the colors that bother you to compensate for the undersaturation at 75%.

The same applies for saturation, but depending on the calibration software you use, you might not be able to measure this. HCFR and Chromapure do it, Calman not yet.

By the way, Chromapure also allows you to calibrate to rec-709 at 75% of the target saturation wise (not stimulus), which could help in your case to find a better compromise. If you are using Chromapure, I recommend you try this. If you need more info about this, email their support or post in the chromapure thread, you'll get some help.

Re gamma, in general you can either do it after you do grescale, or just do the gains at 100% stim and do greyscale with the RGB gamma controls for the rest of the curve. Unfortunately, the gamma controls don't work on the rs20, so unless you want to try the complex LeDahu procedure detailed in this thread (see link in first post), leave them alone and try to get the closest gamma curve using the gamma presets. Although the CMS got fixed on the rs20, the gamma controls on the rs20 were not fixed until the next models (rs 25/35), so apart from following the LeDahu procedure it's a no go.

I don't have an rs20 anymore, so my memory may not serve me well. I'm sure other users will correct me if I'm not right.
Hello,again
Thanks for your reply.
It means it is better to take measurement at 75% stimulus also white level at 75% stimulus to calibrate CMS(R,G,Y,B,C,M)?
100% don't be used in the calibration process?(if it must be used where it can be used)?
Also i don't understand how gamma doesn't work on HD750,because if i choose one preset(exp 2.2),only use white level in gamma i can manage to do 2.19.
Also Tom had said if you take 2.3 gamma preset it was able to obtain 2.29 very easy,with little adjustment.
I have X-Rite EyeOne Display 3 PRO with ChromaPure Standard.

Best regards

Instead of raising blue, lower green and red. Otherwise you'll hurt your black levels. Or you could raise blue and make sure you adjust brightness, but the control is coarse on the rs20 and you might risk losing shadow detail by lowering brightness even one notch.

Always lowering offsets usually works better. It can also help with your gamma.

Thanks Manni. I did end up keeping the positive Blue offset but did take brightness down a few notches to compensate. I can still see 16 and higher on the AVS disc and checked for any black crush on my "Get Low" blu ray (lots of dark scenes that also include firelight...seems to be a good black detail checking disc).

By the way, when setting contrast with the AVS disc, should I be able to see the blinking bars all the way up to 254? I had thought I was supposed to up contrast until I could see 235 but no higher. I was told recently that I should be able to see all the way up... I was told that below 16 is never part of the signal but whites above 235 sometimes are.... is that correct?

You need to set the rs20 to hdmi enhanced to display whiter than white (or btb). Above 235 is far from being necessary, given the fact that there are very few titles which use it, and you end up limiting you brightness for most of the material you play, with no real benefit. Btb should never be visible. You only display it to set it at the right level.

My advice is to use hdmi standard as long as it allows you to set brightness and contrast properly. If you want to use enhanced, do not display up to 255 or you'll lose a lot of brightness. Up to 240 or 245 maybe is more than enough to preserve whiter than white in the very few instances where it will matter, and at least you're not losing too much brightness the rest of the time, ie for almost everything.

But of course everyone has their preference. This is just mine, as there is no "right" way to do it. Others might chime in and give you theirs.

Hello,Manni
X-Rite EyeOne Display 3 PRO with ChromaPure Standard
I have in chromapure 75% rec-709 option,it is better to calibrate in this way?
In precalibration process when i take the measurement,before make adjustment in grayscale(20-80%),also i have to take measurement on color decoding i think:100% or 75%?
There is some part in calibration process where i must make measurement with 100% color?
Thanks

Hello,

It is better to calibrate with HDMI on Standard or Enhanced?
Beside that everyone agreed that you will lose some light available if i use enhanced mode with scale all way out to 255 visible.
If i calibrate in Enhanced mode were i cal leave my Contrast and Brightness adjustments before adjust grayscale?
In Standard mode it is better to leave at default 0,0 and after adjustment for grayscale recheck?

Thanks

I have been running through a new configuration and have run into an issue that I cant seem to overcome. I have run out of blue by a long shot on the low end and, as mentioned above, I want to avoid pushing blue offsets into positive territory. Any suggestions?

I think my current settings are something like"
R gain -5
G Gain -45
B gain -75
R offset 0
G offset 0
B offset 0

Hello,

It is better to calibrate with HDMI on Standard or Enhanced?
Beside that everyone agreed that you will lose some light available if i use enhanced mode with scale all way out to 255 visible.
If i calibrate in Enhanced mode were i cal leave my Contrast and Brightness adjustments before adjust grayscale?
In Standard mode it is better to leave at default 0,0 and after adjustment for grayscale recheck?

Thanks

I recommend standard, with default at 0,0 (or very close).

I have been running through a new configuration and have run into an issue that I cant seem to overcome. I have run out of blue by a long shot on the low end and, as mentioned above, I want to avoid pushing blue offsets into positive territory. Any suggestions?

I think my current settings are something like"
R gain -5
G Gain -45
B gain -75
R offset 0
G offset 0
B offset 0

As already suggested, if you lower green and red you won't need to raise blue. Don't worry, it doesn't mean that youncurve will go down. It will balance itself, and you will keep the best possible black levels.

So just start with green gain and green offset lowered a good bit? Seems like those are where they are supposed to be according to the software... but I could absolutely be reading it incorrectly... I did notice that your new bulb settings posted at the beginning didnt remove much green.

Color temp (new lamp, probably not useful for most of you)
Gain R=-24, G=0, B=-54
Offset R=-1 G=-3 B=0


I did start on of the calibration sessions with green pushed down pretty far but during the session it ended up just coming back as I calibrated...

If you have a CMS, you can ignore color decoding.
Calibrate to the 75% Rec-709 target only if that results in a lower average dE throughout the entire color space.

X-Rite EyeOne Display 3 PRO with ChromaPure Standard
I have in chromapure 75% rec-709 option,it is better to calibrate in this way?
In precalibration process when i take the measurement,before make adjustment in grayscale(20-80%),also i have to take measurement on color decoding i think:100% or 75%?

Also - what I posted above are the absolute, not relative values, so I read that as it telling me that I simply dont have enough blue at the low end, regardless of what the other colors are set at... Am I interpreting that incorrectly?....

I have no way other than increasing the blue offset to raise blue on the low end.

So here are my relative and absolute readings at settings:

Gain R 0
Gain G -45
Garin B -79

Offset R -9
Offset G -8
Offset B 0

Relative graph looks perfect...but absolute is a mess at the low end. Is this fixable?

hmm looks like the fix is to mess with the custom gamma function... messing with that tonight...

hmm looks like the fix is to mess with the custom gamma function... messing with that tonight...

Absolute does take your gamma target into account, but make sure you follow LeDahu's procedure if you start messing with gamma on the rs20.

Good luck.

Cool thanks...I had totally overlooked Ledahu's spreadsheet...will try that tonight.

By the way, is it not possible to do a continuous read of a certain IRE level for gamma in Calman? Do I have to do a full run everytime?

What a horrible process the custom gamma feature is! Even with Ledahu's spreadsheet, which does help, its a terrible process as the numbers you select on the JVC dont stay the same once you go to a neighbor number and put in a new value. So if I select "794" for instance for the value at 80 IRE, then move to 70 IRE and change it from, say, 700 to 694, then 80 IRE all of a sudden also changes itself, maybe to 789 or something. So how on earth can I select the numbers I want if all the neighboring numbers are changing themselves? Or is something wrong with my projector? I didnt see this discussed, but maybe I just missed it?


EDIT - I see this has been discussed extensively... I had only been seeing Ledahu's post with his spreadsheet..didnt see the discussion.

Cool thanks...I had totally overlooked Ledahu's spreadsheet...will try that tonight.

By the way, is it not possible to do a continuous read of a certain IRE level for gamma in Calman? Do I have to do a full run everytime?

Instead of pressing the play button. Select the level you want to read and press the infinity button or similar (not near my computer for the week-end so can't be more precise).

Instead of pressing the play button. Select the level you want to read and press the infinity button or similar (not near my computer for the week-end so can't be more precise).

yeah it lets me do that when reading grayscale but i cant make it select a single IRE level on the gamma page.... hmm.....

Given what I have learned (just when you think you learn a ton about something, it only open up 100 more things to learn :)) - I am thinking of doing a brand new run from scratch.

Should I calibrate in this order:

Set brightness, contrast, custom gamma, grayscale, CMS?

Personal preference: white balance with 100% white, offsets to 0, CMS, check and set white balance, leDahu

Personal preference: white balance with 100% white, offsets to 0, CMS, check and set white balance, leDahu

I second that. You want to do CMS work before any gamma adjustment.

Always recheck white balance after any other adjustment (gamma/cms).

Personal preference: white balance with 100% white, offsets to 0, CMS, check and set white balance, leDahu

Hello,
Max that i can do for offset,to have a good white level, is R-4;G-4;B+1.
There is some trick that i am missing?
Thanks

Hello,
Max that i can do for offset,to have a good white level, is R-4;G-4;B+1.
There is some trick that i am missing?
Thanks

Perhaps you are not using leDahu procedure? It is not for the faint at heart though.

I have an HD 750 that has the dreaded red fringing down the left side of my screen. Unfortunately, my PJ is 2 years and 11 months old. JVC says i need to fill out the form and ship it to California for an estimate. Since it is most likely the optical block, it will cost more to repair than it is worth.

My Question is - Has anyone shifted the image off the screen and lived with it? How long did it last until it was no longer watchable?

Depressed!
Dave

Me too. Mine is more pink in color. Otherwise my RS20 is Stunning. Noticed it for about 3 months now. Just mask 2.5% then zoom out image to fill screen. Hopefully red/pink fringing doesn't expand. Never want to have to go to 5%. Just in case - I'm looking at new projectors - but this defect makes me gun shy to buy JVC again (probablly go w/ Sony 95).

I have an HD 750 that has the dreaded red fringing down the left side of my screen. Unfortunately, my PJ is 2 years and 11 months old. JVC says i need to fill out the form and ship it to California for an estimate. Since it is most likely the optical block, it will cost more to repair than it is worth.

My Question is - Has anyone shifted the image off the screen and lived with it? How long did it last until it was no longer watchable?

Depressed!
Dave

Me too. Mine is more pink in color. Otherwise my RS20 is Stunning. Noticed it for about 3 months now. Just mask 2.5% then zoom out image to fill screen. Hopefully red/pink fringing doesn't expand. Never want to have to go to 5%. Just in case - I'm looking at new projectors - but this defect makes me gun shy to buy JVC again (probablly go w/ Sony 95).

I haven't seen this and hope I don't, but if in more than one projector seems like a manufacturing defect rather than a regular use warranty issue.

Mike

I haven't seen this and hope I don't, but if in more than one projector seems like a manufacturing defect rather than a regular use warranty issue.

Mike

Warranties are for manufacturing defects.

I had the same issue, luckily before the warranty expired. And JVC replaced the optical block under warranty.

There is no definitive answer but one conjecture is that it is a use and heat based failure. I now clean my filter monthly, even if I have only put 20 hours on the unit, and keep the fan speed at high (high altitude setting). It's a little louder but I figure if it keeps the unit cooler and this optical block lasts a few more years, it's worth it.

I agree that it does make one gun shy, and that if I had to face paying retail to replace it, I could *almost* buy a new projector with equal or better specs. Or at least the price would be close enough that I'd justify in my head buying a new projector. I might get another JVC! I had a Sony Pearl, which was nice (even great, at the time for the price) but it too had one major warranty issue. No brand is perfect.

Greetings,

I was fortunate enough to buy a home that had an awesome theater setup that included the DLA RS20U. The whole setup has worked great for two years (well minus the Harmony One battery swelling and the ButtKickers seem intermittent) but today, as I'm screening Return of the Jedi for my girlfriend, I received the dreaded "lamp" message from my projector.

As it turned on, it was obvious that in the blackest parts of the image there moving red "threads" and the image seemed to flicker every now and and then as if it were going out. The lamp still seems very bright and had a great picture the last time I used it last week. Bright parts of the movie seemed unaffected except for the occasional flicker. No idea how many hours it has on it and until I read this board I didnt realize cleaning was indicated. I plan to do so immediately and in the future.

Despite the message, this does not seem like the lamp to me but seems like it might be more serious. Any thoughts on if replacing the lamp might help? Anything I can do with settings or calibration (or fan speed) that might help? The projector seems insistent that it is the lamp, but Im not sure this is a typical failure mode.

As I did not buy or install the projector, I'm coming at this a bit uninitiated but very interested.

Any assistance would be appreciated.

Despite the message, this does not seem like the lamp to me but seems like it might be more serious. Any thoughts on if replacing the lamp might help? Anything I can do with settings or calibration (or fan speed) that might help? The projector seems insistent that it is the lamp, but Im not sure this is a typical failure mode.

As I did not buy or install the projector, I'm coming at this a bit uninitiated but very interested.

Any assistance would be appreciated.

Interesting, lamp issues normally just cause flicker and dim pictures. Anything outside of that may be to do with something else. Any pictures to show?

Interesting, lamp issues normally just cause flicker and dim pictures. Anything outside of that may be to do with something else. Any pictures to show?

I am getting the flicker, and the lamp may be dimmer, but the red threads I am getting in the black areas are new and arose suddenly. On one restart I got the lamp warning and the whole screen was some sort of lavender haze with no picture. the lamp warning was fairly clear, just no obvious picture behind it.

I quickly shut down and let it cool down before restarting. Got the lamp message again and then the red threads returned.

Concerned I may need to repair or replace (is largely unwatchable) but really have little experience with how to proceed.

Further thoughts?

Hi; I had similar problems a few years ago with my Oppo BDP-83 into an Audiolab 8000AP and onto a JVC D-ILA 750, which I think is the European equivalent of your projector. I found that the 'red sparkles in the blacks' problem was solved once and for all by changing the colour space option in the menu to RGB Video - worth a try. Whilst you are in the menus you can also see how many hours you have on the lamp; post that up here so that people can form a view on whether lamp life might be relevant.

Good luck !

On a bit more research, I found that the red sparkles could be interference on the HDMI input. I had recently been setting up a second zone on my receiver and had run the component output from my Blu Ray to that zone.

The good news is that as of now it appears that the problem was with an underpowered (noisy) HDMI input to the AV receiver rather than the projector itself. The DVR input did not display the same issue and running the inputs through the AV differently seems to have abated the problem, at least for now. The flicker (also a sign of a poor HDMI connection) is also gone.

Upon seeing the red (or white) sparkles again, my first thought will be noise on the HDMI input. Does not appear to be a projector problem.

As for the lamp, it has 1900 hours on it. Still looks good to me, but what do I know as I have not seen it out of the box.

A few more ??? While I have you here:

I take it from the forums that cleaning the filter and the prism is recommended?

The prior owner had the settings on "natural", any thoughts as to the optimal settings for this projector? Any thoughts on the THX setting?

Any thoughts on lamp power at normal (where it is now) vs high?

Thanks again for the help.

I only clean the slide out filter; about every 20 hours. I have the projector set to 'THX' - which I love - and the lamp power to normal.

At 1,900 hours you will be losing brightness - I would advise calibrating at least brightness and contrast using the THX Optimiser - it is free on some DVDs, there is a list at http://www.thx.com/consumer/home-entertainment/thx-certified-releases/

Good luck !

I take it from the forums that cleaning the filter and the prism is recommended?

The prior owner had the settings on "natural", any thoughts as to the optimal settings for this projector? Any thoughts on the THX setting?

Any thoughts on lamp power at normal (where it is now) vs high?

Thanks again for the help.

Cleaning the Prism (very easy to do) should in most cases, give you a lot more light.

At 1900 hours, you'd probably want to run in HIGH lamp mode to get few more hundred hours out of it then change the lamp. However, if you're happy with the brightness, thats your call as well.

Natural setting is quite misleading, it gives you the natural gamut of the panel, which is quite wide and oversaturated. Nothing to do with the natural representation of the video. THX on the other hand, while close to the standard, is a bit undersaturated, and it locks out other settings that you may want to adjust like white balance.

Cleaning the Prism (very easy to do) should in most cases, give you a lot more light.

At 1900 hours, you'd probably want to run in HIGH lamp mode to get few more hundred hours out of it then change the lamp. However, if you're happy with the brightness, thats your call as well.

Natural setting is quite misleading, it gives you the natural gamut of the panel, which is quite wide and oversaturated. Nothing to do with the natural representation of the video. THX on the other hand, while close to the standard, is a bit undersaturated, and it locks out other settings that you may want to adjust like white balance.

Will try all suggestions. Thanks!

In an effort to share my experience I thought I'd pass this info along. My JVC RS20 is just under two years old and right under 1000 hours. It has had a large bright green band across the top of the image for a while. I finally broke down and sent it in for repair since the warranty runs out at the end of the month. Naturally I've been anxious about the whole thing. It arrived at JVC facility in Long Beach last Thursday. Finally showed up in their system late Monday. Interestingly, I received a call from a JVC rep today. The purpose? To tell me that my bulb looked "cloudy" and for about $265.00 the would put a new bulb in. When I inquired about the repair I was told a part was being replaced in the "optics." I finally agreed to the bulb deal. Good move? Or not? I had to ask myself if they really thought the bulb needed replacing or they just saw the hours and made a sales call. Thoughts?

For what's it's worth, I love my RS20 and can't wait to get it back!

I'd ask them to send the old bulb back with the projector. Then you can inspect it and keep it for a spare. But overall it sounds like a good example of warranty repair.

In an effort to share my experience I thought I'd pass this info along. My JVC RS20 is just under two years old and right under 1000 hours. It has had a large bright green band across the top of the image for a while. I finally broke down and sent it in for repair since the warranty runs out at the end of the month. Naturally I've been anxious about the whole thing. It arrived at JVC facility in Long Beach last Thursday. Finally showed up in their system late Monday. Interestingly, I received a call from a JVC rep today. The purpose? To tell me that my bulb looked "cloudy" and for about $265.00 the would put a new bulb in. When I inquired about the repair I was told a part was being replaced in the "optics." I finally agreed to the bulb deal. Good move? Or not? I had to ask myself if they really thought the bulb needed replacing or they just saw the hours and made a sales call. Thoughts?

For what's it's worth, I love my RS20 and can't wait to get it back!

To tell me that my bulb looked "cloudy" and for about $265.00 the would put a new bulb in. When I inquired about the repair I was told a part was being replaced in the "optics." I finally agreed to the bulb deal. Good move? Or not? I had to ask myself if they really thought the bulb needed replacing or they just saw the hours and made a sales call. Thoughts?


Not an uncommon issue with JVC blubs, the once clear glass housing gets "frosted". Normally due to heat.

Got my RS20 back from JVC yesterday. The optics were fixed. The green stripe is gone. Got it hung and plugged all my settings back in.

Gotta say...the new bulb made a huge difference! I couldn't get over the improved brightness, color, and contrast. In fact, even my wife noticed and she doesn't normally comment on these things.

Enjoyed "Girl With The Dragon Tattoo" last night. Very happy to have my trusty projector back!

Hi! I was wondering if anybody can tell me how to spot if I hv the new 1.1 firmware or not? Without resorting to taking down the pj and plugging it into my lappy. Thx!

Hi! I was wondering if anybody can tell me how to spot if I hv the new 1.1 firmware or not? Without resorting to taking down the pj and plugging it into my lappy. Thx!

You need to enter service mode (at your own risk!)

Up, down, right, left, enter on the remote or the PJ, in rapid succession, less than a second between each key.

Usually need a bit of practice to get the rythm right...

This will display the f/w version.

You need to enter service mode (at your own risk!)

Up, down, right, left, enter on the remote or the PJ, in rapid succession, less than a second between each key.

More like less than a second for the whole sequence! :) Get both fingers at the ready. Plan your sequence. Amp yourself up. Let 'er rip! Maybe I'm just old and slow (53).

I've got into the service menu. But didn't see where it actually says Firmware 1.0 or 1.1 Will look again tonight and tell ye what is actually written. I'm sure I've seen smth with just a load or numbers etc. But nth simple like 1.0 or 1.1.

I've got into the service menu. But didn't see where it actually says Firmware 1.0 or 1.1 Will look again tonight and tell ye what is actually written. I'm sure I've seen smth with just a load or numbers etc. But nth simple like 1.0 or 1.1.

You'll need help from a current user as I don't have my rs20 anymore, but if you look at the date it should say something like april 09 (coded in some way) for the main/CMS. If it's an earlier date (in 08), it's likely to be 1.0.

You'll need help from a current user as I don't have my rs20 anymore, but if you look at the date it should say something like april 09 (coded in some way) for the main/CMS. If it's an earlier date (in 08), it's likely to be 1.0.

Thx for the info Manni. Will take down the number and post it up here and maybe some genius will help me decipher it!

Ok updated firmware. I need to ask, is there anyway or trick to change the NR and Sharpness numbers in THX mode? Thx!

And also I take it that OOTB THX gamma can't be changed either? Unless with extra tools?

THX mode is pretty locked down. Most calibrators use a different mode, since just about everything is adjustable in the other modes (without going into the service menu). And since you are adjusting it all anyway, it doesn't matter that it starts off more poorly than in THX mode.

THX mode is pretty locked down. Most calibrators use a different mode, since just about everything is adjustable in the other modes (without going into the service menu). And since you are adjusting it all anyway, it doesn't matter that it starts off more poorly than in THX mode.

Thx for the reply. In my room conditions THX mode lacks depth and looks washed out and I was just seeing if I could tweak a bit, just to hv the colours and try and add a bit more depth to the image.

Thx for the reply. In my room conditions THX mode lacks depth and looks washed out and I was just seeing if I could tweak a bit, just to hv the colours and try and add a bit more depth to the image.

What about reading the first post of this thread? Every question you have is probably adressed with a direct link in the thread. All this has been discussed at length at the time :)

What about reading the first post of this thread? Every question you have is probably adressed with a direct link in the thread. All this has been discussed at length at the time :)

Yeah I've read a lot. Sometimes stuff seems spread out and hard to find smth definitive to some of my questions. :)

Bit newb to all this calibration stuff but I'm wondering if somebody can to me how to try some CMS settings without calibration tools at hand. I want to try out settings posted at the beginning of thread but dunno how to start lol. :D For example smth like

r 2 -26 10
y 5 -48 38
g 0 -44 33
c 4 -49 39
b 0 -24 10
m -1 -30 15

With the RS20, where and how do I put these figures in? Thx!

I strongly recommend not putting in values for the color space without measuring. And irric, THX mode actually has pretty accurate color settings OOTB.

The pop you are looking for is probably related to gamma.

I strongly recommend not putting in values for the color space without measuring. And irric, THX mode actually has pretty accurate color settings OOTB.

The pop you are looking for is probably related to gamma.

+1! THX mode is going to be way better than some other projector's numbers. There's just too much variability... large variability.

That's the thing. THX mode is flat and the gamma can't be adjusted. So will hv to go and adjust in a user mode.