WD TV - RELEASE Firmware - 1.02.07 [Text View] - Page 2

sda_gr

05-07-09, 01:58 PM

If you haven't formatted it to NTFS, do it. If you have, but not with 64K clusters, do it again. This is done by writing this

format x: /fs:NTFS /a:64K

on a command prompt - On Windows. If you're on OSX or Linux, i don't know how that is done :(

Remember x = the drive letter

Another good thing is to defragment the drive after you place the files inside.

What would the differences be in speed and network performance by making 64kb clusters?

I have 2 x 1tb and 1 x 500gb usb connected to a little D410 notebook acting as a server (XP prof), and all on a GB network.
The 2 x 1tb are media disks, the later is for everything other than media files.

I did a bit of reading on this,and also tested a smaller 320GB disk I had, but didn't notice any improvement in speed or performance.

Cheers

sda_gr

05-07-09, 02:03 PM

Sorry GreenDream but... how old are you? Jesus...

Our ongoing saga :)

Could I join in, haven't whined for a couple of days, and I'm missing it :D

Cheers

gmanvbva

05-07-09, 02:45 PM

And "whining" about the "whining" about the "whining" is going to improve matters how exactly? ;)

I am "hoping" people get the oh so subtle "hint"! :D

gmanvbva

05-07-09, 02:46 PM

What would the differences be in speed and network performance by making 64kb clusters?

I have 2 x 1tb and 1 x 500gb usb connected to a little D410 notebook acting as a server (XP prof), and all on a GB network.
The 2 x 1tb are media disks, the later is for everything other than media files.

I did a bit of reading on this,and also tested a smaller 320GB disk I had, but didn't could notice any improvement in speed or performance.

Cheers

There is a thread devoted to it running around here somewhere. Might want to try and search for it. Someone tested the read/write times using various cluster sizes.

Here is the thread.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1138318&highlight=wdtv+cluster+size

Also, I think most of that testing was prior to the FW updates that helped reduce startup/load/scan times.

sda_gr

05-07-09, 03:05 PM

Read enough, doing 64k now :)
Thanks

eoghann

05-07-09, 04:28 PM

On the other hand people are still waiting for answers to questions asked many times over like the lack of DVD menu support being related to restrictions imposed by the DVD Forum.

There are many reasons why he may not be able to answer a particular question.

For example (and this is pure speculation) WD may not wish to address the DVD menu support issue because the only reason anyone would need that would be if they are violating the DCMA. They're not actively stopping people from ripping stuff, but they may not wish to be seen as encouraging it.

Again speculation on my part. I could be completely wrong. The bigger point is that Scott does not own or run WD. It's unreasonable to attack him for things that are likely outside his control. But that's what people have been doing.

fred_be9300

05-07-09, 04:38 PM

based on post by wd team on http://wdtv.uservoice.com/pages/17442-general/suggestions/182946-dts-downmix-and-hdmi-pass-through

that say's

"The current product is not capable of decoding DTS. DTS licensing model switched after the implementation of WD TV and requires a very specific chipset. We hear this request loud-and-clear and it is planned for future products"

i have to say to wd team :

it's a BIG LIE ... and it's only license and software problem

we have to put hand by hand money and pay a hacker to do that :)

duh, that thread has now disappeared from uservoice !!?

EDIT: Correction, the thread still exists, but for some reason no longer appears in the overview list & RSS feed. I can still access with a link in my browser history. Oh well, maybe it's better like that.

We now know WD's position on the matter: DTS will never happen on this WDTV model. It would be a waste of votes, to still vote for it, from the perspective that the voting should benefit development & prioritising for this WDTV model

aidken

05-07-09, 09:19 PM

blackie84 - what are the relative options in menu settings? There arn;t that mjuch settings to play with. There is audio/video setting, which i tried but not much changes and video setting that does not provide much either.

techflaws

05-08-09, 01:16 AM

For example (and this is pure speculation) WD may not wish to address the DVD menu support issue because the only reason anyone would need that would be if they are violating the DCMA.
Seems like lawyer logic to me (blaming someone for enabling others instead of those actually comitting the offense) which by definition is flawed. Believe it or not, there are commercial DVDs out there without copy protection and there's also a lot of selfmade DVDs with menus, e.g. I've just gotten a very nicely authored wedding DVD of a friend with animated menus, easter eggs and stuff.

I'm not familiar with fair use execptions in american law but I'm almost certain it's allowed to copy over commercial DVDs you've paid for to another medium for private use. In any case, no judge is ever gonna stop me from doing that.

You're right of course that attacking ScottWD is pointless and childish.

wicker_man

05-08-09, 04:50 AM

Believe it or not, there are commercial DVDs out there without copy protection and there's also a lot of selfmade DVDs with menus, e.g. I've just gotten a very nicely authored wedding DVD of a friend with animated menus, easter eggs and stuff.

I've ran across several spanish and portuguese dvds that have no copy protection, and are even multizone.

GreenDream

05-08-09, 08:00 AM

I am "hoping" people get the oh so subtle "hint"! :D

Did you ever stop to think that the ones you are whining about are doing the same thing? hoping the whiners they are whining about get the oh so subtle "hint". If it doesn't work for them, why do you think it'll work for you?

GreenDream

05-08-09, 08:04 AM

I'm not familiar with fair use execptions in american law but I'm almost certain it's allowed to copy over commercial DVDs you've paid for to another medium for private use. In any case, no judge is ever gonna stop me from doing that.

From my layman's understanding of fair use in american law it is allowed for private use however, circumventing the copy protection is not under the DMCA (Digital Millennium Copyright Act) - which means, for most commercial DVDs sold in America you have to break the law (the DMCA) inorder to make your fair use copy.

gmanvbva

05-08-09, 08:17 AM

Did you ever stop to think that the ones you are whining about are doing the same thing? hoping the whiners they are whining about get the oh so subtle "hint". If it doesn't work for them, why do you think it'll work for you?

Because they aren't. They are arguing and attempting to justify their position over the others or are attempting to invalidate the other opinion...

Just like your copyright argument. Everyone knows there are holes large enough to sail an aircraft carrier through in the copyright/digital rights issue. Not to mention a fair amount of people using this product and "reproducing" media are not in the US. Absolutely pointless discussion and essentially just rhetoric to support "your position".

It ends up being a back and forth exchange of nothing useful and is exactly why this will be my last comment on the subject. I challenge others to do the same.

GreenDream

05-08-09, 09:25 AM

Because they aren't. They are arguing and attempting to justify their position over the others or are attempting to invalidate the other opinion...

And you aren't? pull the other one why don't you.

Just like your copyright argument. Everyone knows there are holes large enough to sail an aircraft carrier through in the copyright/digital rights issue. Not to mention a fair amount of people using this product and "reproducing" media are not in the US. Absolutely pointless discussion and essentially just rhetoric to support "your position".

It ends up being a back and forth exchange of nothing useful and is exactly why this will be my last comment on the subject. I challenge others to do the same.

Eh? what Arguement and position and I making? I merely pointed out what the american law is (as I, a non-legal scholar, understand it) in response to someone who said (and I quote) "I'm not familiar with fair use execptions in american law". It just so happens that american law is contradictory (you have fair use on the one hand but on the other laws that make it technically illegal in certain circumstances to actual use that fair use).

It's a good thing this is your "last comment on the subject" because your previous comments did nothing to add to the conversation and apparently were based on your reading into other peoples posts arguements and positions that they were not making or taking.

whiteboy714

05-08-09, 09:36 AM

From my layman's understanding of fair use in american law it is allowed for private use however, circumventing the copy protection is not under the DMCA (Digital Millennium Copyright Act) - which means, for most commercial DVDs sold in America you have to break the law (the DMCA) inorder to make your fair use copy.

Who cares, are you a cop or something.

gmanvbva

05-08-09, 09:38 AM

The comments were aimed at the overall discussion here. I used the term "your" in the middle paragraph in a general sense (referring to whoever was making the argument). It was not aimed directly and solely at yourself.

GreenDream

05-08-09, 09:59 AM

Who cares, are you a cop or something.

Not a cop (I would hope any cop would have more than a layman's understanding of the law). Someone said they were unfamiliar with what the american law had to say on the issue, so I was being kind enough to point it out. Why do you have a problem with that? Guilty conscience?

Afrsa

05-08-09, 10:14 AM

Thats enough!!! Stop spamming people!!!!

This thread is about 1.02.07 firmware... not about laws and cops and sh**t!!!

Afrsa

05-08-09, 10:25 AM

Those two films worked ok in 1.01.02 and now on 1.02.06 they crash:

Formato : Matroska
Tamanho do arquivo : 11,7 GiB
Duration/String : 1h 46mn
Taxa de Bits Total : 15,7 Mbps
Data da codificação : UTC 2009-03-13 00:49:25
Codificador : mkvmerge v2.5.3 ('Boogie') built on Mar 7 2009 15:00:41
Biblioteca de codificação : libebml v0.7.7 + libmatroska v0.8.1

Vídeo
ID : 1
Formato : AVC
Formato/ : Advanced Video Codec
Format_Profile : High@L4.1
Format_Settings_CABAC/String : Sim
Format_Settings_RefFrames/String : 4 frame
MuxingMode : Container profile=Unknown@4.1
CodecID : V_MPEG4/ISO/AVC
Duration/String : 1h 46mn
Taxa de bits : 13,9 Mbps
Largura : 1 920 pixels
Altura : 798 pixels
Proporção da imagem : 2.406
Taxa de quadros : 23,976 fps
Resolução : 24 bits
Colorimetry : 4:2:0
ScanType/String : Progressivo
Bits/(Pixel*Quadro) : 0.378
StreamSize/String : 10,3 GiB (88%)
Biblioteca de codificação : x264 core 67 r1127M 8d82fec
Config. da codificação : cabac=1 / ref=4 / deblock=1:-2:-2 / analyse=0x3:0x113 / me=umh / subme=9 / psy_rd=1.1:0.0 / mixed_ref=1 / me_range=24 / chroma_me=1 / trellis=2 / 8x8dct=1 / cqm=0 / deadzone=21,11 / chroma_qp_offset=-2 / threads=6 / nr=0 / decimate=0 / mbaff=0 / bframes=5 / b_pyramid=0 / b_adapt=2 / b_bias=0 / direct=3 / wpredb=1 / keyint=250 / keyint_min=25 / scenecut=40 / rc=crf / crf=20.0 / qcomp=0.60 / qpmin=10 / qpmax=51 / qpstep=4 / vbv_maxrate=38000 / vbv_bufsize=30000 / ip_ratio=1.40 / pb_ratio=1.30 / aq=1:1.00

Áudio
ID : 2
Formato : DTS
Formato/ : Digital Theater Systems
CodecID : A_DTS
Duration/String : 1h 46mn
Taxa de bits : 1 510 Kbps
Canal(s) : 6 canais
Posições de canal : Front: L C R, Surround: L R, LFE
Taxa de amostragem : 48,0 KHz
Resolução : 24 bits
StreamSize/String : 1,12 GiB (10%)

Texto #1
ID : 3
Formato : UTF-8
CodecID : S_TEXT/UTF8
/ : UTF-8 Plain Text

Texto #2
ID : 4
Formato : UTF-8
CodecID : S_TEXT/UTF8
/ : UTF-8 Plain Text

2.

Formato : Matroska
Tamanho do arquivo : 11,7 GiB
Duration/String : 1h 46mn
Taxa de Bits Total : 15,7 Mbps
Data da codificação : UTC 2009-03-13 00:49:25
Codificador : mkvmerge v2.5.3 ('Boogie') built on Mar 7 2009 15:00:41
Biblioteca de codificação : libebml v0.7.7 + libmatroska v0.8.1

Vídeo
ID : 1
Formato : AVC
Formato/ : Advanced Video Codec
Format_Profile : High@L4.1
Format_Settings_CABAC/String : Sim
Format_Settings_RefFrames/String : 4 frame
MuxingMode : Container profile=Unknown@4.1
CodecID : V_MPEG4/ISO/AVC
Duration/String : 1h 46mn
Taxa de bits : 13,9 Mbps
Largura : 1 920 pixels
Altura : 798 pixels
Proporção da imagem : 2.406
Taxa de quadros : 23,976 fps
Resolução : 24 bits
Colorimetry : 4:2:0
ScanType/String : Progressivo
Bits/(Pixel*Quadro) : 0.378
StreamSize/String : 10,3 GiB (88%)
Biblioteca de codificação : x264 core 67 r1127M 8d82fec
Config. da codificação : cabac=1 / ref=4 / deblock=1:-2:-2 / analyse=0x3:0x113 / me=umh / subme=9 / psy_rd=1.1:0.0 / mixed_ref=1 / me_range=24 / chroma_me=1 / trellis=2 / 8x8dct=1 / cqm=0 / deadzone=21,11 / chroma_qp_offset=-2 / threads=6 / nr=0 / decimate=0 / mbaff=0 / bframes=5 / b_pyramid=0 / b_adapt=2 / b_bias=0 / direct=3 / wpredb=1 / keyint=250 / keyint_min=25 / scenecut=40 / rc=crf / crf=20.0 / qcomp=0.60 / qpmin=10 / qpmax=51 / qpstep=4 / vbv_maxrate=38000 / vbv_bufsize=30000 / ip_ratio=1.40 / pb_ratio=1.30 / aq=1:1.00

Áudio
ID : 2
Formato : DTS
Formato/ : Digital Theater Systems
CodecID : A_DTS
Duration/String : 1h 46mn
Taxa de bits : 1 510 Kbps
Canal(s) : 6 canais
Posições de canal : Front: L C R, Surround: L R, LFE
Taxa de amostragem : 48,0 KHz
Resolução : 24 bits
StreamSize/String : 1,12 GiB (10%)

Texto #1
ID : 3
Formato : UTF-8
CodecID : S_TEXT/UTF8
/ : UTF-8 Plain Text

Texto #2
ID : 4
Formato : UTF-8
CodecID : S_TEXT/UTF8
/ : UTF-8 Plain Text

Does anyone have any idea why?

BogdanH

05-08-09, 11:08 AM

Hi Afrsa,

I can't tell why those two MKV's crash. Now, as I assume, those two have been downloaded from 'somewhere', here's what I would do...
Try to remux MKV again (it's 10min job). By doing this, you can narrow down which of muxed files (if any) is troublemaker. For example:

Extract MKV content and then remux h264 file alone into MKV. Then try to play that movie -obvious, it won't have any sound.
If now plays fine, then add DTS file and try to play MKV again. If there's a crash now, then something with DTS is wrong -convert it to AC3 (3minutes job) and mux AC3 into MKV... and try again. Etc. etc.

Why I am recommending this? Because, I (too) have 'downloaded' MKV files containing corrupt DTS files! -and MediaInfo doesn't know about that. When converting such erratic DTS file into AC3, errors will/can arise -meaning: DTS isn't perfect. Btw. VLC player is capable to play 'bad' DTS -because it was made that way.

Greetings

GreenDream

05-08-09, 11:23 AM

Thats enough!!! Stop spamming people!!!!

This thread is about 1.02.07 firmware... not about laws and cops and sh**t!!!

There's no spam in this thread (do you even know what the term means???). There is parts of the conversation that are tangential, even straying to off-topic, but no spam.
Yes this thread is about the firmware, So your complaint about l(non-existant) spam, laws and cops is much more off-topic than the conversation that spawned it. If you'll go back in the thread you'll see the discussion about laws came about because someone speculated as to why the firmware didn't support something could be due to legalities. Their speculation may have been off-base, but it was atleast relevant to the conversation and is what sent the thread into a tangent.

Afrsa

05-08-09, 11:23 AM

Tut_Ank

05-08-09, 11:52 AM

And you aren't? pull the other one why don't you.

Eh? what Arguement and position and I making? I merely pointed out what the american law is (as I, a non-legal scholar, understand it) in response to someone who said (and I quote) "I'm not familiar with fair use execptions in american law". It just so happens that american law is contradictory (you have fair use on the one hand but on the other laws that make it technically illegal in certain circumstances to actual use that fair use).

It's a good thing this is your "last comment on the subject" because your previous comments did nothing to add to the conversation and apparently were based on your reading into other peoples posts arguements and positions that they were not making or taking.

I’m not a legal scholar either, and don't even live on the American continent, but the thing is that although the DMCA (Digital Millennium Copyright Act) forbids circumventing the copy protection of CDs and DVD. There are other laws in the US, like the Consumer protection laws and even international laws and treaties signed by the US, like the Free trade of the World Trade Organization, not that the DMCA affects me in any way, but think about this:

CDs:
All Copy protection schemas in CD are deviations from the Orange Book (That is the document that defines the standard for writable discs published by Philips and Sony) so is Philips’ definition of what a CD is. (Remember that they are the inventors of and copyright holders of the CD and Compact Disc Digital audio). The Orange book can be found here:
http://csrc.ncsl.nist.gov/publications/secpubs/rainbow/
This standard are there to make sure that all players that follow the standard can read all the CD DA discs.
So when you buy a CD Digital Audio disc that claims to be a CD DA and it has a Copy protection system you are not getting what the box says in the label, so they are selling you a product that is not really a CD bribing you to think that is a CD.
After selling you a product that is not what they claim it is can they invoke the DMCA that prevents you from copying a CD? After all you didn’t get a CD!!! Is only what they claim it is and what you thought it was, but is not such strictly speaking.
DVD:
There are 9 region codes:
1 United States of America, Canada
2 Europe, including France, Greece, Turkey, Egypt, Arabia, Japan and South Africa
3 Korea, Thailand, Vietnam, Borneo and Indonesia
4 Australia and New Zealand, Mexico, the Caribbean, and South America
5 India, Africa, Russia and former USSR countries
6 Peoples Republic of China
8 Airlines/Cruise Ships
(7 and 9 unused)

HD DVD has not region coding, but the format is dead anyway.

As for Bluray there are 3 regions, roughly:
-America plus Japan and south East Asia
- EMEA (Europe, Middle East and Africa )
-Asia except Japan and south East Asia
And we have the Free trade agreement which is part of the international law and signed by the US that forbids them to build artificial boundaries that prevent the free circulation from goods, so they sell you a product that doesn’t comply with international and US law, then do you think they have the right to invoke a obscure and local law to preventing you for circumventing an illegal copyright protection scheme?
They do, but I’m not sure that rightfully…

Edit:

Thats enough!!! Stop spamming people!!!!

This thread is about 1.02.07 firmware... not about laws and cops and sh**t!!!

Sorry Afrsa, but I think it's relevant to the question.
And to go back to the subject, Yes, I think the new firm is and improvement, they are moving in the right direction, and even if it still has glitches and lots of room for improvements is a step forward, I just hope that making the Beta official they won’t stop development and stay still for another 4 months. In the few weeks since they released the first beta they advanced more than in the previous months together, they need to continue listening to the people as competitors are also moving and the market is in a very special situation at this moment.

high_definitely

05-08-09, 01:39 PM

Just for the record: I watched another 1080p movie (.mkv) with external subtitles yesterday, and had no problems whatsoever.

wicker_man

05-08-09, 01:43 PM

Just for the record: I watched another 1080p movie (.mkv) with external subtitles yesterday, and had no problems whatsoever.

Did it have a DTS audio track? Apparently the 1080+dts+external srt combo seems to be too much, now.

Afrsa

05-08-09, 01:43 PM

Just for the record: I watched another 1080p movie (.mkv) with external subtitles yesterday, and had no problems whatsoever.

So can you tell me the problem with those files I posted? The movie after some minutes starts to shutter... then slow mo... and then crash... i really dont know what the problem is...

xj0hnx

05-08-09, 02:34 PM

So can you tell me the problem with those files I posted? The movie after some minutes starts to shutter... then slow mo... and then crash... i really dont know what the problem is...

I am only guessing here, but it could be that you have a DTS-HD track there, and the WD can not transcode the core for pass through, and DTS-HD/True-HD can not pass through a optical cable.

If you want to find out if this is the case, you can demux the movie, then extract the core with eac3to

eac3to input C:\~movie.dts output C:\~movie.dts -core (where ~ is the rest of the directory)

Then remux with the video file, and attempt play.

whiteboy714

05-08-09, 02:47 PM

Not a cop (I would hope any cop would have more than a layman's understanding of the law). Someone said they were unfamiliar with what the american law had to say on the issue, so I was being kind enough to point it out. Why do you have a problem with that? Guilty conscience?

Ok well maybe I took it the wrong way, thought you were trying to come down on people doing these types of things.

Plenty of more important things to worry about in the world then movie piracy, I hate when people come on here and talk this holier then though bs. Not you just in general.

high_definitely

05-08-09, 02:53 PM

Did it have a DTS audio track? Apparently the 1080+dts+external srt combo seems to be too much, now.

Yes, it does have a DTS (1536kbps) audio track.

Afrsa

05-08-09, 03:17 PM

Yes, it does have a DTS (1536kbps) audio track.

So can you see the problem in that files? They were working in 1.01.02...

Afrsa

05-08-09, 03:18 PM

I am only guessing here, but it could be that you have a DTS-HD track there, and the WD can not transcode the core for pass through, and DTS-HD/True-HD can not pass through a optical cable.

If you want to find out if this is the case, you can demux the movie, then extract the core with eac3to

eac3to input C:\~movie.dts output C:\~movie.dts -core (where ~ is the rest of the directory)

Then remux with the video file, and attempt play.

Its not DTS-HD... just normal DTS... that I know...

xj0hnx

05-08-09, 03:22 PM

Its not DTS-HD... just normal DTS... that I know...

Did you rip it from the source, and extract the core yourself?

Regardless, I'd still look towards the DTS as the culprit since it is reporting 1 510 Kbps, and should be 1536, maybe it is corrupt.

Afrsa

05-08-09, 03:36 PM

Did you rip it from the source, and extract the core yourself?

Regardless, I'd still look towards the DTS as the culprit since it is reporting 1 510 Kbps, and should be 1536, maybe it is corrupt.

It can be a possibility... but why then this movie worked perfectly ok in 1.01.02?

high_definitely

05-08-09, 03:42 PM

So can you see the problem in that files? They were working in 1.01.02...

There is no problem with those files per se, as they are within specs. However, I do notice that both have internal subs already. So maybe, just maybe (speculation on my side) having both subtitles types, internal and external, at the same time causes the problem.

Again, this is just an idea, and needs to be tested, of course.

xj0hnx

05-08-09, 03:49 PM

There is no problem with those files per se, as they are within specs. However, I do notice that both have internal subs already. So maybe, just maybe (speculation on my side) having both subtitles types, internal and external, at the same time causes the problem.

Again, this is just an idea, and needs to be tested, of course.

That would kind of make sense to, and since they have been messing with the firmware, something they did in hte 01.02.** may now be causing a conflict. East enough to find out, just remove the external sub, and use the internal.

xj0hnx

05-08-09, 03:50 PM

It can be a possibility... but why then this movie worked perfectly ok in 1.01.02?

Newer firmware could be less tolerant, hard to say.

greiland

05-08-09, 04:14 PM

We're both using DVDFab 5 dvdfab.com/dvd-fab-new.htm . There's a Mobile add-on for this application which makes ripping and encoding one step. Both of these files play just fine on my Vista and Windows 7 boxes btw (and as stated, 1.02.02 and .03 as well as the previous .01 releases). The link above takes you to the version history page, giving you an idea of the great support his company gives, as well as the feature set. I've also found it to be faster than handbrake in encoding.

As the incompatibility has shown up in recent firmware, I'm guessing the cause for the error is NOT DVDfab's encoding library, Lavf52.17.0, but rather WDTV. Of course, I could be wrong!
I re-ripped a couple DVDs into MKVs that were not working in version .07. I used DVDFab to make an ISO, then coverted to MKV using Handbrake this time using some options mentioned here: http://wdtvforum.com/main/index.php?topic=7.0

These new MKVs work fine on FW .07. So there's something in the way that DVDFab converts to MKV that WDTV doesn't like in the latest FW. When I originally used DVDFab to covert to MKV, I used the presets for generic h264 direct audio copy.

Just thought I'd pass this info on.

jmpa

05-08-09, 04:36 PM

I am having a lot of problems with 1080p+DTS+.srt. For example, in .02 I play this movie well and now at begining of movie on the first fast scene it start crashs and the sound stop (my receive loose signal). When the action turns again slow it plays ok and when comes more action he crash again (sorry for my english):

General / Container Stream # 1
Total Video Streams for this File -> 1
Total Audio Streams for this File -> 1
Video Codecs Used -> AVC
Audio Codecs Used -> DTS
File Format -> Matroska
Play Time -> 2h 24mn
Total File Size -> 13.1 GiB
Total Stream BitRate -> 13.0 Mbps
Encoded with -> mkvmerge v2.2.0 ('Turn It On Again') built on Mar 4 2008 12:58:26
Encoding Library -> libebml v0.7.7 + libmatroska v0.8.1
Video Stream # 1
Codec (Human Name) -> AVC
Codec (FourCC) -> V_MPEG4/ISO/AVC
Codec Profile -> High@L4.1
Frame Width -> 1 920 pixels
Frame Height -> 798 pixels
Frame Rate -> 23.976 fps
Total Frames -> 207455
Display Aspect Ratio -> 2.406
Scan Type -> Progressive
Colorimetry -> 4:2:0
Codec Settings (Summary) -> CABAC / 4 Ref Frames
QF (like Gordian Knot) -> 0.312
Codec Settings (CABAC) -> Yes
Video Stream Length -> 2h 24mn 3s 958ms
Video Stream BitRate -> 10.9 Mbps
Video Stream BitRate (Nominal) -> 11.5 Mbps
Bit Depth -> 24 bits
Video Stream Title -> x264 - 2 passes
Video Encoder -> x264 - core 60 r886M 1075536
Video Encoder (Settings) -> cabac=1 / ref=4 / deblock=1:-3:-3 / analyse=0x3:0x113 / me=umh / subme=7 / rdcmp=psy / brdo=1 / mixed_ref=1 / me_range=16 / chroma_me=1 / trellis=0 / 8x8dct=1 / cqm=0 / deadzone=9,6 / chroma_qp_offset=0 / threads=6 / nr=0 / decimate=0 / mbaff=0 / bframes=3 / b_pyramid=1 / b_adapt=1 / b_bias=0 / direct=1 / wpredb=1 / bime=1 / keyint=250 / keyint_min=25 / scenecut=40(pre) / rc=2pass / bitrate=11470 / ratetol=2.0 / rceq='blurCplx^(1-qComp)' / qcomp=1.00 / qpmin=10 / qpmax=51 / qpstep=4 / cplxblur=20.0 / qblur=0.5 / vbv_maxrate=38000 / vbv_bufsize=30000 / ip_ratio=1.40 / pb_ratio=1.30 / aq=2:1.00
Video Stream Language -> English
Audio Stream # 1
Codec -> DTS
Codec (FourCC) -> A_DTS
Audio Stream Length -> 2h 24mn 12s 630ms
Audio Stream BitRate -> 1 536 Kbps
Audio Stream BitRate Mode -> CBR
Number of Audio Channels -> 6
Audio Channel's Positions -> Front: L C R, Surround: L R, LFE
Sampling Rate -> 48.0 KHz
Bit Depth -> 24 bits
Audio Stream Title -> DTS - 1536 kbit/sec
Audio Stream Language -> English

thomfam

05-08-09, 04:39 PM

This is the top vote winner on the WDTV Customer Feedback page: http://wdtv.uservoice.com/pages/17442-general

It doesn't Copy/paste too well here but this is a request which it seems is going to be acted upon. The "planned" has been added by WDTV. It is the top ranked request.

1,368 votes
How many votes?

Full DVD ISO Menu support planned
12 comments | by AGM | created on 05.06.2009

jmpa

05-08-09, 04:46 PM

Idiot request in my opinion...

I bought WDTv to see HD, no SD stuff ..

Afrsa

05-08-09, 04:52 PM

For those here having trouble to read 1080p movies +DTS+External subs, please tell if your external disks are in HFS+...

That could be the problem... try the same file with a NTSF external disk!

whiteboy714

05-08-09, 05:36 PM

Idiot request in my opinion...

I bought WDTv to see HD, no SD stuff ..

word

xj0hnx

05-08-09, 06:30 PM

For those here having trouble to read 1080p movies +DTS+External subs, please tell if your external disks are in HFS+...

That could be the problem... try the same file with a NTSF external disk!

Did you? And if so, did it fix your problem?

Afrsa

05-08-09, 07:21 PM

Did you? And if so, did it fix your problem?

Those files I posted back there where in a HFS+ external disk of a friend of mine... so I remember to ask for people to try those same files in a NTFS disk... to see if the problem comes from the HFS+ format

xj0hnx

05-08-09, 07:26 PM

Those files I posted back there where in a HFS+ external disk of a friend of mine... so I remember to ask for people to try those same files in a NTFS disk... to see if the problem comes from the HFS+ format

How can we try them if we don't know what they are? You can PM a link, or name.

Afrsa

05-08-09, 07:45 PM

How can we try them if we don't know what they are? You can PM a link, or name.

I think I didn't explained myself correctly...

I said if someone is having trouble seeing 1080p movies +DTS+External subs, to check if their external disks are in HFS+ format (those specs i posted back there are related to files in a HFS+ disk)... if so, I asked people to try to put their movies in a NTSF disk and see if issues remain... just to see if the trouble is HFS+ related.

MrMod

05-08-09, 09:29 PM

I re-ripped a couple DVDs into MKVs that were not working in version .07. I used DVDFab to make an ISO, then coverted to MKV using Handbrake this time using some options mentioned here: http://wdtvforum.com/main/index.php?topic=7.0

These new MKVs work fine on FW .07. So there's something in the way that DVDFab converts to MKV that WDTV doesn't like in the latest FW. When I originally used DVDFab to covert to MKV, I used the presets for generic h264 direct audio copy.

Just thought I'd pass this info on.

A better way with DVDfab is to do DVD to Mobile, Generic, pick the title, audio, and subs, then in Conversion Setting choose vob, vob.passthrough

This will give you the title in one vob file and subs in a VobSub (idx/sub) file pair. Then use mkvtoolnix to remux into a MKV. The advantage is that the audio and video are bit identical to what's on the disc without recoding to h264. If you want the subs to look decent you'll need to adjust the palette in the idx file (convert RGB to YUV, rearrange as UYV and let Y=Y/2 + 128). Make sure to use 2.7.0 build 20090507-125 for the VobSub bug fix.

DJFresh82

05-08-09, 11:22 PM

The Video Stream "VC 1" plays smooth, but the WMA 3 doesn't play at all, it say's Unsupported audio. is there a way to convert the audio to AC3?

General
Complete name : \Movies\HD Movies\Superman Doomsday 1080pDD.wmv
Format : Windows Media
File size : 6.98 GiB
Duration : 1h 17mn
Overall bit rate mode : Variable
Overall bit rate : 12.9 Mbps
Maximum Overall bit rate : 36.6 Mbps
Encoded date : UTC 2008-11-19 21:32:55.474

Video
ID : 2
Format : VC-1
Format profile : AP@L3
Codec ID : WVC1
Codec ID/Hint : Microsoft
Description of the codec : Windows Media Video 9 Advanced Profile
Duration : 1h 17mn
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 12.0 Mbps
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16/9
Frame rate : 23.976 fps
Resolution : 24 bits
Colorimetry : 4:2:0
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.241
Stream size : 6.50 GiB (93%)
Language : Dutch

Audio
ID : 1
Format : WMA3
Format profile : M2
Codec ID : 162
Codec ID/Info : Windows Media Audio 3
Description of the codec : Windows Media Audio 10 Professional - 640 kbps, 48 kHz, 5.1 channel 24 bit 2-pass CBR
Duration : 1h 17mn
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 640 Kbps
Channel(s) : 6 channels
Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
Resolution : 24 bits
Stream size : 356 MiB (5%)
Language : Dutch

high_definitely

05-08-09, 11:35 PM

To bring a rather important bug back on the agenda, let me add that true 24 fps files (24.000 fps, and not 23.976 fps, like the majority of progressive media) play back perfectly at 1080p/24, as expected. No stuttering at all, including the "40 sec stutter" of 23.976 fps files, as discussed earlier (and elsewhere (http://wdtvforum.com/main/index.php?topic=340.0)). Watched a 24.000 fps movie recently, and it played back perfectly, like it should be.

I still hope that WD is finally going to fix this.

DJFresh82

05-09-09, 12:22 AM

Been searching through the forums, and found that xvid4psp, Super and tsmuxer works, pretty simple, don't mind whenever i run into wmv vc-1 with wm-3 audio. As long as I can get it to work on the wdtv hd. I don't mind the work arounds, as long as it runs the resulting video's smooth!!

BogdanH

05-09-09, 12:26 AM

To Afrsa

I see, you didn't try to extract/remux your MKV yet... why not?

And looking at your MediaInfo data again, there's some info missing about your DTS: Bit rate mode.
For DTS I have (checking with latest MediaInfo), I can read:

....
Codec ID: A_DTS
Duration: 1h 59min
Bit rate mode: Constant
Bit rate: 1510kbps
Channel(s): 6 channels
....

-maybe that's not important, but anyway.

Greetings

Bonecrusher52

05-09-09, 12:44 AM

Does anybody know where can I find 1.01.02 firmware? I like to go back to 1.01 because 1.02 firmware can't play some 1080p mkv video properly.

cibermito

05-09-09, 01:03 AM

djfresh,
would you care to explain how you solved the audio problem?

techflaws

05-09-09, 01:32 AM

It just so happens that american law is contradictory (you have fair use on the one hand but on the other laws that make it technically illegal in certain circumstances to actual use that fair use).
It's actually quite similar to the situation in Germany. I'm still not convicend though WD is dropping menu support due to preemptive obedience but rather due to license terms imposed by the DVD Forum.

So there's something in the way that DVDFab converts to MKV that WDTV doesn't like in the latest FW.
Would you mind ripping one of those with DVD Shrink to see if those ISOs work? Thanks.

Make sure to use 2.7.0 build 20090507-125 for the VobSub bug fix.
What bug is that?

Idiot request in my opinion. I bought WDTv to see HD, no SD stuff ..
Right, so there's you and 1,368 idiots who prefer to also watch their old material from HDD instead of being DJ. Do the math.

jbs1077

05-09-09, 05:09 AM

Does anybody know where can I find 1.01.02 firmware? I like to go back to 1.01 because 1.02 firmware can't play some 1080p mkv video properly.

go to www.wdtvhd.com, they keep an archive of previous firmware releases

fred_be9300

05-09-09, 05:21 AM

Does anybody know where can I find 1.01.02 firmware? I like to go back to 1.01 because 1.02 firmware can't play some 1080p mkv video properly.

WD is still hosting it too : http://support.wdc.com/download/wdtv/WDTV_FW_1_01_02.zip

(see also http://wdtv.wetpaint.com/page/Firmware+1.01)

akosoft

05-09-09, 06:50 AM

Overall i like the wd player. Good video and ok sound even without hd ma or thrue hd.

Too bad it doesnt play wmv files with audio...

Does anybody know a free tool that can convert wmv to mkv and is quick? :)

lightning69

05-09-09, 08:01 AM

MrMod

05-09-09, 08:22 AM

WD mentioned that the best thumbnail size is 120x180...but isn't that a little too small. Is 120x180 optimum for both 720P and 1080P?

If it is the same size for both 720p and 1080p, then it should look smaller on the 1080p tv?

How do I get the thumbnails for folder to work? Should the folder.jpg be place in the folder or outside?

The 120x180 image is scaled to appear the same size for both 720 and 1080.

The folder.jpg goes inside the folder. Otherwise it wouldn't know what folder the folder.jpg should be associated with. Just as a reminder, the file is actually named folder.jpg and not the name of the folder.

toolman2k10

05-09-09, 09:17 AM

WD TV 2 announced with LAN:
http://www.homecinemachoice.com/blogs/team+hcc/western+digital+confirms+wdtv+version+2+adds+ethernet+sneake rnet+hit+08+05+09

guess we wont be seeing LAN support in the current WD....

high_definitely

05-09-09, 09:42 AM

guess we wont be seeing LAN support in the current WD....

Err...who in their right mind was actually expecting that, knowing that the WD TV-HD does not even have an ethernet port? No company will add a feature which requires third party hardware 'addons' (USB - ethernet adapter) to work.

greiland

05-09-09, 09:52 AM

A better way with DVDfab is to do DVD to Mobile, Generic, pick the title, audio, and subs, then in Conversion Setting choose vob, vob.passthrough

This will give you the title in one vob file and subs in a VobSub (idx/sub) file pair. Then use mkvtoolnix to remux into a MKV. The advantage is that the audio and video are bit identical to what's on the disc without recoding to h264. If you want the subs to look decent you'll need to adjust the palette in the idx file (convert RGB to YUV, rearrange as UYV and let Y=Y/2 + 128). Make sure to use 2.7.0 build 20090507-125 for the VobSub bug fix.
One of the reasons I'm converting to MKV is to save space. If I use your method, won't the file size be the same as the original DVD?

Thanks.

lightning69

05-09-09, 12:16 PM

The 120x180 image is scaled to appear the same size for both 720 and 1080.

The folder.jpg goes inside the folder. Otherwise it wouldn't know what folder the folder.jpg should be associated with. Just as a reminder, the file is actually named folder.jpg and not the name of the folder.
Thank you

toolman2k10

05-09-09, 03:40 PM

Err...who in their right mind was actually expecting that, knowing that the WD TV-HD does not even have an ethernet port? No company will add a feature which requires third party hardware 'addons' (USB - ethernet adapter) to work.

errr. since it is listed on wdtv.userchoice.com with the status of under review. if it was not possible (it is possible with an usb lan stick) they would simply say so, just like with usb or dts. to me it seems like they keep it on review to keep the hopes up...but im pretty sure they wont, since the new wd would not offer much new then.

Afrsa

05-09-09, 05:28 PM

I have more specs of 2 movies 1080p and DTS that doesnt work well with subs "on". The subs are portuguese and SRT. With subs "off" the movies play ok!

1.

Video
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L5.1
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames : 5 frames
Muxing mode : Container profile=Unknown@5.1
Codec ID : V_MPEG4/ISO/AVC
Duration : 1h 32mn
Bit rate : 10.6 Mbps
Nominal bit rate : 10.8 Mbps
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 816 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 2.35
Frame rate : 23.976 fps
Resolution : 24 bits
Colorimetry : 4:2:0
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.281
Stream size : 6.79 GiB (85%)
Writing library : x264 core 60 r886M 1075536

Audio
ID : 2
Format : DTS
Format/Info : Digital Theater Systems
Codec ID : A_DTS
Duration : 1h 32mn
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 1 536 Kbps
Channel(s) : 6 channels
Channel positions : Front: L C R, Surround: L R, LFE
Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
Resolution : 24 bits
Stream size : 1 012 MiB (12%)

2.

Video
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L4.1
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames : 5 frames
Muxing mode : Container profile=Unknown@4.1
Codec ID : V_MPEG4/ISO/AVC
Duration : 1h 43mn
Bit rate : 9 159 Kbps
Nominal bit rate : 9 402 Kbps
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 816 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 2.35
Frame rate : 23.976 fps
Resolution : 24 bits
Colorimetry : 4:2:0
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.244
Stream size : 6.65 GiB (84%)
Writing library : x264 core 66 r1114 a933a3e

Audio
ID : 2
Format : DTS
Format/Info : Digital Theater Systems
Codec ID : A_DTS
Duration : 1h 43mn
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 1 536 Kbps
Channel(s) : 6 channels
Channel positions : Front: L C R, Surround: L R, LFE
Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
Resolution : 24 bits
Stream size : 1.12 GiB (14%)
Title : DTS
Language : English

Those movies are in an external NTFS WD 1Tb.

high_definitely

05-09-09, 05:41 PM

Have you tried external subtitles from a different source? Maybe the subs are faulty, not that uncommon actually. You could also check them with the subtitle program of your choice.

Afrsa

05-09-09, 05:50 PM

Have you tried external subtitles from a different source? Maybe the subs are faulty, not that uncommon actually. You could also check them with the subtitle program of your choice.

Hmmmm... i will have to ask (files are not mine)... but he was having trouble with a lot of movies so its a bit of coincidential... but I know again if they mux the subs into the MKV, the movie plays ok! So probably its not subs fault...

So once again its the 1080p+DTS+external subs combo having trouble...

I asked the friend of mine who sent me those specs to defragment his external disk or to copy one of those movies in to a new disk or pen and try if the movie play ok... so I am waiting for the feedback. If the trouble persist, I think its firmware problem.. once again I think it may be because of the processing needed to render the subs...

Bonecrusher52

05-09-09, 07:15 PM

WD is still hosting it too : http://support.wdc.com/download/wdtv/WDTV_FW_1_01_02.zip

(see also http://wdtv.wetpaint.com/page/Firmware+1.01)

Thank you very much for the link. :)

DJFresh82

05-10-09, 12:58 AM

djfresh,
would you care to explain how you solved the audio problem?

hey, sure i would,

First u have to download xvid4psp full
second, download "Super"
Third download tsmuxer

you can easily search through the forums or through google search to find them.

run xvid4psp, drag the .wmv file or open it like normal in xvid4psp, under the audio tab u can select what u want the WM-3 audio converted to, i chose AC3 640k, so i can preserve the 5.1 channels. u can select a lower bitrate if u want a smaller overall size .m2ts. go to Audio in the file menu than click on Demux, save it anywhere u want, close xvid4psp. Next, open up "Super", drag .wmv file to Super, on the audio box, be sure to select disable Audio, the Video Box select Stream copy so the video won't be re-encoded to anything, just demuxed basically. be sure .MKV is selected under "Encode to File Format" than click on Encode, be sure to set Where to save in the options menu. after that's done, close Super. Now open up TSmuxer, drag the newly created .mkv file that was made with Super and the new .ac3 file u made with xvid4psp, Set the languages or it will be presetted already, be sure to Output to .m2ts muxing. than click on Start Muxing, ure newly created .m2ts should run flawlessly with no quality Loss at all!!!

There may be another way to do this but this way works for me!

xj0hnx

05-10-09, 09:44 PM

yvzrgntv

05-11-09, 01:42 AM

I have more specs of 2 movies 1080p and DTS that doesnt work well with subs "on". The subs are portuguese and SRT. With subs "off" the movies play ok!

Are you sure embedded subs are ".srt"? There is usually no problem in playing file with an external subtitle in ".srt" format. This was my problem with so many movies. ".sub" either embedded or external does not allow the movie to play with the latest firmware. So I used external subtitles with ".srt" format and removed ".sub" subtitles and everything went OK.

Afrsa

05-11-09, 03:45 AM

Afrsa, another common theme I am seeing in your encodes is 5 reframes, this is already pushing compliance, so between internal, AND external subs, and needlessly high reframes, it is looking more and more like combination of issues. Really though, your issue isn't even an issue since they play fine without one sub or the other, just get over it.

Sorry but its an issue... and most 1080p movies have more than 5 reframes so if WD TV now cant read even 1080p with 5 reframes, thats really bad... lots of people in Portugal (as they say) are unable to watch 1080p(max 5 reframes)+DTS+External sub without having problems in playback... let me tell you that lots of people here is thinking in returning the WD TV... so dont tell them this is not an issue...

Afrsa

05-11-09, 03:48 AM

Are you sure embedded subs are ".srt"? There is usually no problem in playing file with an external subtitle in ".srt" format. This was my problem with so many movies. ".sub" either embedded or external does not allow the movie to play with the latest firmware. So I used external subtitles with ".srt" format and removed ".sub" subtitles and everything went OK.

No... the problem is with external subs... with embedded subs seems that the trouble dissapear... I'm not sure...

The thing is that people dont know or dont want to have the extra hassle of muxing the subs, or reencoding the movies, etc... and I (even if I see all my movies perfectly) as a costumer, understand them.

silvom

05-11-09, 05:04 AM

No... the problem is with external subs... with embedded subs seems that the trouble dissapear... I'm not sure...

The thing is that people dont know or dont want to have the extra hassle of muxing the subs, or reencoding the movies, etc... and I (even if I see all my movies perfectly) as a costumer, understand them.
I can confirm that 1080p-DTS-external .srt on 1.02.7 IS a problem. But I am afraid that WD now has more important priorities than fixing problems for some so called whiners...

yvzrgntv

05-11-09, 09:16 AM

well can't say so many things about the subtitle problem. (???????)

but here is a device that people might find interesting about DTS sound (€ 129,-)

"Decoder Station"

http://www.teufel.eu/PC-Multimedia/decoderstation-3.cfm

http://www.teufel.eu/images/upload/decoder_main_black_300x300x72.jpg

Integrated Dolby Digital/ProLogic/dts decoder
Three digital inputs, optical and coaxial
Three analogue inputs
Infrared remote control
Solid metal casing

jotavip

05-11-09, 10:05 AM

Hmmmm... i will have to ask (files are not mine)... but he was having trouble with a lot of movies so its a bit of coincidential... but I know again if they mux the subs into the MKV, the movie plays ok! So probably its not subs fault...

So once again its the 1080p+DTS+external subs combo having trouble...

I asked the friend of mine who sent me those specs to defragment his external disk or to copy one of those movies in to a new disk or pen and try if the movie play ok... so I am waiting for the feedback. If the trouble persist, I think its firmware problem.. once again I think it may be because of the processing needed to render the subs...

Mux the subtitle file in the mkv, and it will play fine. I did this in all my movies, watched 3 of them this weekend and no problems happened. Is annoying to demux and mux every movie, but today is the only and simple solution. Hope they will fix this in the next firmware release.

high_definitely

05-11-09, 10:11 AM

xj0hnx

05-11-09, 10:26 AM

Sorry but its an issue...

No, it isn't.

and most 1080p movies have more than 5 reframes so if WD TV now cant read even 1080p with 5 reframes, thats really bad...

Actually, no, most 1080p have 4 or less, at least when done by competent encoders that know how to follow standards. I looked through a number of encodes last night, and most have 4 reframes. Regardless 5 works according to you, if it has one or the other external, or internal subs, so it DOES in FACT live up to what it says it does which is play 1080p+DTS+subs.

lots of people in Portugal (as they say) are unable to watch 1080p(max 5 reframes)+DTS+External sub without having problems in playback... let me tell you that lots of people here is thinking in returning the WD TV... so dont tell them this is not an issue...

Or, they could remux them into internal subs, or demux them and remove the internal subs, either way they play fine, with 1080p, and DTS, this is what YOU said.

DJFresh82

05-11-09, 10:34 AM

You can get a low-end receiver for that price (or just a few bucks more), most likely the better investment in the long run.

hey,
This is very similar to http://us.creative.com/products/product.asp?category=4&subcategory=136&product=9468. Which was made years ago and now discontinued, I own one of these, of course it doesn't decode or support any of the new HD audio formats, which i don't think i'm missing out on really. My set up has one of these with the first version of Logitech Z5300 in my bedroom, and it really rocks, beleive it or not, it decodes everything with no problems, even has Neo DTS upconversion for 2 to 4 channel sources, which is a big plus!!!, Of course i didn't pay $129.00 retail for it. WOrks great with the WDTV HD

Afrsa

05-11-09, 10:47 AM

No, it isn't.

Its an issue to all the people complaining about the 1080p+DTS+external sub combo issue... specially because they watched the same movies in 1.01.02 firmware without problems.

Actually, no, most 1080p have 4 or less, at least when done by competent encoders that know how to follow standards. I looked through a number of encodes last night, and most have 4 reframes. Regardless 5 works according to you, if it has one or the other external, or internal subs, so it DOES in FACT live up to what it says it does which is play 1080p+DTS+subs.

Sorry but I dont think so... most 1080p are 5 to 8 reframes...

Or, they could remux them into internal subs, or demux them and remove the internal subs, either way they play fine, with 1080p, and DTS, this is what YOU said.

Yes thats true... they can do that to the movies... but they prefer to return the WD TV and buy an Egreat M34A and dont have that extra hassle...

By the way... I'm starting to believe that the problem with some 1080p movies comes from movies that were enconded to be dvxa compatible... can anyone check that please?
Eureka releases are known to be dvxa compatible causing slow mo and breaks in WD TV or even in NMT's players.

xj0hnx

05-11-09, 10:53 AM

Its an issue to all the people complaining about the 1080p+DTS+external sub combo issue... specially because they watched the same movies in 1.01.02 firmware without problems.

Than use an earlier firmware if you want to have internal, and external subs, it still does what it says it does.

Sorry but I dont think so... most 1080p are 5 to 8 reframes...

What you think and encoding standards are two different things.

How many reference frames?

The maximum allowed number of ref frames depends firstly on the used resolution, like this:

1080p
1920*1080 (16:9) & 1920*1040 (1.85:1): 4 ref frames
1920*816 (2.35:1) & 1920*800 (2.4:1): 5 ref frames

720p
1280*720 (16:9) & 1280*688 (1.85:1): 9 ref frames
1280*544 (2.35:1) & 1280*528 (2.4:1) 12 ref frames

Other aspect ratios

1080p
1792*1080 (1.66:1): 4 ref frames
1440*1080 (4:3): 5 ref frames

720p
1200*720 (1.66:1): 9 ref frames
960*720 (4:3): 12 ref frames

However, using any number of B-frames decreases the maximum number of ref frames by 1.
Using B-pyramid further decreases that maximum number by 2.

In the end, given that both B-frames and B-pyramid are important features, you need to subtract 3 from the ref frame numbers stated above. For example, for 1920x1080 only 4-3=1 ref frame is allowed.

Note that even if it is allowed, it is not necessarily useful to go above 5 ref frames. Maximizing ref frames is only important for animated (CGI/anime/cartoon) content.

Yes thats true... they can do that to the movies... but they prefer to return the WD TV and buy an Egreat M34A and dont have that extra hassle...

Has anyone even confirmed that it can play those files? And oh wait a minute, the WD could too, hmmm

By the way... I'm starting to believe that the problem with some 1080p movies comes from movies that were enconded to be dvxa compatible... can anyone check that please?
Eureka releases are known to be dvxa compatible causing slow mo and breaks in WD TV or even in NMT's players.

Nope, DXVA compliance will almost guarantee that it WILL play.

Afrsa

05-11-09, 11:02 AM

What you think and encoding standards are two different things.

Your suposed encoding standards doesnt tell me nothing... most of 1080p movies are 5 - 8 reframes... thats a fact... just check in the internet...

Nope, DXVA compliance will almost guarantee that it WILL play.

Why?? Do you even know what is dxva compliance movie?

All eureka releases are causing breaks in WD TV! Did you knew that? of course you didnt... did you knew that dxva compliance movies couses breaks even in NMTs? And if you tell me if NMTs are less compatible than WD TV, I think we dont need to argue anymore.

pack21

05-11-09, 11:42 AM

From ScottWD Twitter

""I mentioned we have great things planned for the WDTV product family. Stay tuned!""

Stay Tuned!...:D:D

Ericthegreat777

05-11-09, 11:55 AM

Wonder if he means a new WDTV when he says product family or if he means a new update? I'd prefer the update.

pack21

05-11-09, 12:05 PM

Wonder if he means a new WDTV when he says product family or if he means a new update? I'd prefer the update.

Thats the point...

When he said Stay tuned, must be something to be release soon...

and WDTV2, we know is to be release in final of the year.
http://www.homecinemachoice.com/blogs/team+hcc/western+digital+confirms+wdtv+version+2+adds+ethernet+sneake rnet+hit+08+05+09

So, What is? ......to be Stay Tuned!

Rob_Holland

05-11-09, 12:14 PM

Hello All,

I try play my music collection with the WD TV Media Player but it is not possible to play the music i have ripped to my hard disk without a gap between each number (file). Every simple and cheap MP3 player and IPOD plays the music gap-less but the WD TV Media Player does NOT. I tried the support of WD but the can not help me to. Does anybody now a way (except to make one big file from my Cd's) how i can play it without the gap. Or does anybody know that it will be possible with a future firmware update??

Regards Rob

fred_be9300

05-11-09, 12:37 PM

From ScottWD Twitter

""I mentioned we have great things planned for the WDTV product family. Stay tuned!""

Stay Tuned!...:D:D

Don't be fooled! He's alluding to a new model of WDTV. Not to a firmware upgrade for existing users.

The full quote is:
"@greenythebeast I mentioned we have great things planned for the WDTV product family. Stay tuned!"

and was an answer to (link (http://twitter.com/greenythebeast))
"@srader http://*******/tgUBB Is this true?"

or in other words - loosely rephrased:
- Hey Scott, I read this article were a representative of WD supposedly said that WD is planning a new model WDTV with ethernet included.
- Hey back. Well, I've said before we're planning all sorts of things, including producing new products in the WDTV lineup. Sorry, but I can't be specific right now, so feel free to interpret whichever way you like best.

xj0hnx

05-11-09, 12:56 PM

Your suposed encoding standards doesnt tell me nothing... most of 1080p movies are 5 - 8 reframes... thats a fact... just check in the internet...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=972503

Why?? Do you even know what is dxva compliance movie?

Sure do, it's to offload decoding from the cpu to the gpu and I know 100% for a fact that I have NEVER had one that doesn't play on the WD, even though it is to make sure it can play on a computer, and not for the WD.

All eureka releases are causing breaks in WD TV! Did you knew that? of course you didnt... did you knew that dxva compliance movies couses breaks even in NMTs? And if you tell me if NMTs are less compatible than WD TV, I think we dont need to argue anymore.

Without getting into talking about pirated material, I'll just say that your problem isn't the WD, especially after that statement.

Afrsa

05-11-09, 01:02 PM

"Sure do, it's to offload decoding from the cpu to the gpu and I know 100% for a fact that I have NEVER had one that doesn't play on the WD, even though it is to make sure it can play on a computer, and not for the WD."

Hmmm... lets see where is the gpu in the WD TV... seems I cant find it...

"Without getting into talking about pirated material, I'll just say that your problem isn't the WD, especially after that statement."

And now you agree that dxva causes troubles?

Look xj0hnx... you won!

Seriously... go find a job as WD sales man... seems you've been born to do that! (If you already work or sell WD hardware, ignore my phrase)

pack21

05-11-09, 01:03 PM

Don't be fooled! He's alluding to a new model of WDTV. Not to a firmware upgrade for existing users.

The full quote is:
"@greenythebeast I mentioned we have great things planned for the WDTV product family. Stay tuned!"

and was an answer to (link (http://twitter.com/greenythebeast))
"@srader http://*******/tgUBB Is this true?"

or in other words - loosely rephrased:
- Hey Scott, I read this article were a representative of WD supposedly said that WD is planning a new model WDTV with ethernet included.
- Hey back. Well, I've said before we're planning all sorts of things, including producing new products in the WDTV lineup. Sorry, but I can't be specific right now, so feel free to interpret whichever way you like best.

I not said, its a fw, where did you see that?
I just said: i thing, same think, will be release soon (stay tuned!!!). That ScottWD answer is for everyone, he knows his answers to someone, have a global public impact.;)

We will see....who is fooled!:cool:
.

xj0hnx

05-11-09, 01:19 PM

"Without getting into talking about pirated material, I'll just say that your problem isn't the WD, especially after that statement."

And now you agree that dxva causes troubles?

Nope, dxva doesn't, more accurately encoding for dxva compliance doesn't cause the problems. What I am saying is that solutions have been given to you in triplicate, and it isn't the WD, or the files, as many people have posted that they can indeed play the same spec videos, and the same "problem" video/audio/sub combo that you are having trouble with.

Look xj0hnx... you won!

Seriously... go find a job as WD sales man... seems you've been born to do that! (If you already work or sell WD hardware, ignore my phrase)

It isn't a contest, and I am not selling anything, started out trying to help you with your problem, as have many here, but it just gets ridiculous seeing you over and over blaming the device when other people, myself included can play the exact same files no problem.

Afrsa

05-11-09, 01:41 PM

Nope, dxva doesn't, more accurately encoding for dxva compliance doesn't cause the problems. What I am saying is that solutions have been given to you in triplicate, and it isn't the WD, or the files, as many people have posted that they can indeed play the same spec videos, and the same "problem" video/audio/sub combo that you are having trouble with.

It isn't a contest, it just gets ridiculous seeing you over and over blaming the device when other people, myself included can play the exact same files no problem.

I am not blamming the device!!! Read what I wrote and dont stop when I say "WD TV cant"...

And no one said they could play perfectly the movies I posted here with portuguese subtitles...

I know what to do to put those files working... and I'm going to say again that those are not my movies... and its confirmed that same files causes trouble with diferent people...

Your WD TV plays 100% of your files? Great! Congratulations... go now see a movie, ok?

I am just posting here to ScottWD and GuyWD see that trouble is happening with some files with this firmware, I'm not asking for help in this particulary subject... do you understand now? Jesh....

Afrsa

05-11-09, 01:53 PM

GuyWD and ScottWD:

With this 720p movie I have audio sync error of 1 or 2 seconds around the middle of the movie... I have 1.02.07 firmware. With Firmware 1.01.02 I had no audio sync error. However, if I FFW 1 second of the movie, the audio goes back to normal.

Format : Matroska
File size : 4,37 GiB
Duration : 1h 42mn
Overall bit rate : 6 096 Kbps
Encoded date : UTC 2007-04-24 07:31:55
Writing application : mkvmerge v2.0.0 ('After The Rain Has Fallen') built on Jan 13 2007 19:58:56
Writing library : libebml v0.7.7 + libmatroska v0.8.0

Vídeo
ID : 2
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L5.1
Format settings, CABAC : Sim
Format settings, ReFrames : 8 frame
Muxing mode : Container profile=Unknown@5.1
Codec ID : V_MPEG4/ISO/AVC
Duration : 1h 42mn
Bit rate : 5 205 Kbps
Nominal bit rate : 5 454 Kbps
Width : 1 280 pixels
Height : 528 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 2.424
Frame rate : 23,976 fps
Resolution : 24 bits
Colorimetry : 4:2:0
Scan type : Progressivo
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.321
Writing library : x264 core 54 svn-614
Encoding settings : cabac=1 / ref=5 / deblock=1:0:0 / analyse=0x3:0x133 / me=umh / subme=7 / brdo=0 / mixed_ref=1 / me_range=16 / chroma_me=1 / trellis=1 / 8x8dct=1 / cqm=2 / deadzone=21,11 / chroma_qp_offset=0 / threads=3 / nr=0 / decimate=0 / mbaff=0 / bframes=3 / b_pyramid=1 / b_adapt=1 / b_bias=0 / direct=3 / wpredb=1 / bime=1 / keyint=240 / keyint_min=24 / scenecut=40(pre) / rc=2pass / bitrate=5454 / ratetol=1.0 / rceq='blurCplx^(1-qComp)' / qcomp=0.60 / qpmin=10 / qpmax=51 / qpstep=4 / cplxblur=20.0 / qblur=0.5 / ip_ratio=1.40 / pb_ratio=1.30
Language : Inglês

Áudio
ID : 1
Format : AC-3
Format/Info : Audio Coding 3
Codec ID : A_AC3
Duration : 1h 42mn
Bit rate : 640 Kbps
Channel(s) : 6 canais
Channel positions : Front: L C R, Surround: L R, LFE
Sampling rate : 48,0 KHz

high_definitely

05-14-09, 05:57 PM

Today, I could finally reproduce the "1080p+DTS+external subtitles-bug" for the first time. The movie would stutter and totally stop during playback, especially during action scenes.

MediaInfo details:

Format : Matroska
File size : 8.74 GiB
Duration : 1h 44mn
Overall bit rate : 12.0 Mbps
Encoded date : UTC 2009-05-12 21:10:07
Writing application : mkvmerge v2.8.0 ('The Tree') built on May 9 2009 18:02:06
Writing library : libebml v0.7.7 + libmatroska v0.8.1

Video
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L4.1
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames : 5 frames
Muxing mode : Container profile=Unknown@4.1
Codec ID : V_MPEG4/ISO/AVC
Duration : 1h 44mn
Bit rate : 10.3 Mbps
Nominal bit rate : 10.5 Mbps
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 800 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 2.400
Frame rate : 23.976 fps
Resolution : 24 bits
Colorimetry : 4:2:0
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.279
Stream size : 7.46 GiB (85%)
Writing library : x264 core 59 r861M 7331ea4
Encoding settings : cabac=1 / ref=5 / deblock=1:-3:-3 / analyse=0x3:0x113 / me=umh / subme=7 / me-prepass=0 / brdo=1 / mixed_ref=1 / me_range=16 / chroma_me=1 / trellis=0 / 8x8dct=1 / cqm=2 / deadzone=6,4 / chroma_qp_offset=0 / threads=3 / nr=0 / decimate=1 / mbaff=0 / fgo=12 / bframes=16 / b_pyramid=1 / b_adapt=1 / b_bias=0 / direct=3 / wpredb=1 / bime=1 / keyint=250 / keyint_min=25 / scenecut=40(pre) / rc=2pass / bitrate=10509 / ratetol=1.0 / rceq='blurCplx^(1-qComp)' / qcomp=1.00 / qpmin=10 / qpmax=51 / qpstep=4 / cplxblur=20.0 / qblur=0.5 / ip_ratio=1.40 / pb_ratio=1.14 / aq=2:1.00
Language : English

Audio
ID : 2
Format : DTS
Format/Info : Digital Theater Systems
Format profile : ES
Codec ID : A_DTS
Duration : 1h 44mn
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 1 510 Kbps
Channel(s) : 7 channels
Channel positions : Front: L C R, Rear: L C R, LFE
Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
Resolution : 24 bits
Stream size : 1.10 GiB (13%)

I cured the problem by integrating the subtitles in the .mkv, using mkvmerge. I don't know what exactly is causing the problem yet though.

torrentjunkie

05-14-09, 06:26 PM

Well, I have the following problem with the latest firmware. I am using ssa subtitles, and whenever there are 2 lines to be displayed, it only shows one, so you miss half the sentence. I tried with different movies, and this happens with all ssa subtitles. So, I have to go back to the previous firmware.

Do you have the same issues?

torrentjunkie

05-14-09, 06:58 PM

I brought it back to 1.01.02, problem solved... still how can this happen in a new firmware release....

wicker_man

05-14-09, 10:48 PM

Today, I could finally reproduce the "1080p+DTS+external subtitles-bug" for the first time.
...
I don't know what exactly is causing the problem yet though.

Maybe too much data processing for the wdtv's memory? Remember the sub delay that was fixed, by apparently giving srts and such more memory allocated.

mytbyte

05-15-09, 02:48 AM

silvom

05-15-09, 03:14 AM

What was designed as a basic HARDWARE player ended up needing software workarounds to make out-of-spec mkvs play: more memory was required to host more re-frames, so less memory for subtitles all of which makes playback worse - one probelm solved only to directly influence another...ouch...a chian reaction :D and amount of memory in WD is very limited, not designed for additional tasks...
This only shows how incompetent are WD's developers.The proof for this is the fact that many NMT's using Sigma Design 6835 chip has no such issues that we complain about WD TV... Just remember the 'historical' achievment of releasing 1.02.2 after four month of 'active' development !!!

Fuelbomb

05-15-09, 03:39 AM

Do you think it will be possible to support IFO-File reading/DVD-menues? There are no official announcements so far. :(

toolman2k10

05-15-09, 03:49 AM

I brought it back to 1.01.02, problem solved... still how can this happen in a new firmware release....

so basically youre stuck with less features and your HDD spinning 24/7 because you want your movies to be sync....:o

toolman2k10

05-15-09, 03:59 AM

This only shows how incompetent are WD's developers.The proof for this is the fact that many NMT's using Sigma Design 6835 chip has no such issues that we complain about WD TV... Just remember the 'historical' achievment of releasing 1.02.2 after four month of 'active' development !!!

i cant add anything to this statement, but i agree with you 100%. in my opinion, WD has had their chance, it took off as a big succes...but they do nothing to support that succes (enough). bugs like this are proof of this....plus the fact they suddenly released a pre (which still has annoying -new- bugs) as an official release....:( it does have lots of potential and some features that make it unique even compared to the NMTs....but thats not enough to keep me from switching to another device. they launched a voting site, exactly like i suggested them too, after lots of bitching and complaining (this is not a coincidence). and in beginning there was some responses from WD. but now...nothing....no announcements,no activity....i guess they're too busy with the launch of their upcoming products. "thanks guys for giving us your money and your ideas, we'll use them both to launch new products"

even if im wrong on this one. and they are actually working on something (which i doubt highly, since only ONE "idea" is being worked on according the uservoice site)...then still they already lost the race. its too little too late. im more than happy to pay more if it spares me from all these annoying bugs and missing (basic/obvious) features.

imho.

wicker_man

05-15-09, 04:26 AM

Afrsa

05-15-09, 04:32 AM

Afrsa

05-15-09, 04:35 AM

toolman2k10

05-15-09, 04:38 AM

Is anyone here also on forums related to the wdtv's competitors? I'm curious to see if all that's said there is "how wonderful our player is" and "look, no bugs and now more features, great"... stuff like that.

im not related, im just comparing the devices, which both are not perfect. there are reports of things that dont work well and such too. But its alot less plus they have proven to be in development and actually solve stuff. however, WD's "progress" and attitude has made me non-believer. I know very well that other (N)mts are not perfect and also have bugs. But in their primary function, playing movies, they simply perform better and with less annoyances. Plus, they are miles ahead in terms of features (like framerate syncing) and have a more future proof future in development. its matters of hoping and waiting, based on faith alone and no proof or signs of progress, or choose to go for a, non perfect, but more mature player based on long history of updates.

jbs1077

05-15-09, 04:55 AM

silvom

05-15-09, 05:32 AM

I guess this is the price we have to pay for buying a cheaper product? :D
My father used to say : You are not so rich to buy cheap...

toolman2k10

05-15-09, 05:54 AM

I guess this is the price we have to pay for buying a cheaper product? :D

even a cheap product must do what its advertised/supposed to do. you cant expect only a ferrari to drive your from a to b. A volvo should do just the same :)

xj0hnx

05-15-09, 08:42 AM

im not related, im just comparing the devices, which both are not perfect. there are reports of things that dont work well and such too. But its alot less plus they have proven to be in development and actually solve stuff. however, WD's "progress" and attitude has made me non-believer. I know very well that other (N)mts are not perfect and also have bugs. But in their primary function, playing movies, they simply perform better and with less annoyances. Plus, they are miles ahead in terms of features (like framerate syncing) and have a more future proof future in development. its matters of hoping and waiting, based on faith alone and no proof or signs of progress, or choose to go for a, non perfect, but more mature player based on long history of updates.

Maybe if it were typical of the WD to not play the files, but since there are way more people that can play the files, than I would say that all this is, is a small minority that cries louder, and keeps repeating the same problem over, and over. Having to actively try to recreate a problem using edge of compatibility files, and then adding MORE to them so they can't play isn't proving that the WD doesn't do what it says, because it does. I guarantee there isn't a player that I couldn't encode something that wouldn't play on it. The funny thing is that Afsra's files that don't play, all he has to do is take out the external sub file, or remux them into the movie and it plays fine, but instead he keeps posting the same "Why doesn't this play?", it's ludicrous, you know why, and you know how to fix your pirated movies so they play fine.

Afrsa

05-15-09, 09:35 AM

Maybe if it were typical of the WD to not play the files, but since there are way more people that can play the files, than I would say that all this is, is a small minority that cries louder, and keeps repeating the same problem over, and over. Having to actively try to recreate a problem using edge of compatibility files, and then adding MORE to them so they can't play isn't proving that the WD doesn't do what it says, because it does. I guarantee there isn't a player that I couldn't encode something that wouldn't play on it. The funny thing is that Afsra's files that don't play, all he has to do is take out the external sub file, or remux them into the movie and it plays fine, but instead he keeps posting the same "Why doesn't this play?", it's ludicrous, you know why, and you know how to fix your pirated movies so they play fine.

I said million times that those specs were from files from people I know... And I was posting here for WD labs sees the problem and try to fix since those files played ok in 1.01.02... I know the workaround but that was not the point and you still doesnt understand the meaning of my posts... so forget my posts already... you are not helping...

By the way... you are talking about pirate copies... and I ask why?? Are you acusing me of illegaly download movies? You dont have the right to acuse me of anything, understand? And the next time, I will report you!

MrMod

05-15-09, 10:14 AM

I'd say most people live with the glitches or don't notice them (unless the video stops playing or something). And those that do notice probably aren't active on the forums at all (or know the forums exist).

Issues like internal/external subtitles, shouldn't exist and are baffling. The video/audio/sub streams should work whether they are internal/external or what container they are in. Renaming a file's extension to improve playback is also baffling. The same video/audio/sub streams should be delivered to Sigma no matter what container is used. These are basic flaws that are well documented.

I'm pleased the WDTV plays VobSub subtitles (not officially though). However, there are several issues:
1. color palette isn't used properly resulting in greyscale only (and having to tweak palette)
2. subtitle frames with no Stop Display cmd aren't displayed at all (they should be displayed until the next subtitle frame)

Almost every DVD out there will exhibit issue 2 when played on the WDTV (a sub that doesn't appear or flashes so fast you can't read it) since having no Stop Display cmd is a valid technique per the VobSub specifications and every DVD has a couple frames like this. I've written a selectable hack for mkvmerge (hopefully that will make it into the next release of mkvtoolnix) that adds a Stop Display cmd for these particular subs, making them appear on the WDTV (with just a slight flicker between 2 identical sub frames when it displays the 2nd frame, but better than having no sub displayed at all).

Another issue is interlaced film content in a MKV file. Some interlacing info is lost when delivered to my TV causing the 3:2 pulldown to judder. I can pause and play, see if it's smooth, pause and play again, see if it's smooth, until the playback does become smooth (subs on or off, doesn't matter). If I mkvextract the video as mpg, the judder never occurs. This bug has existed since day one and points to improper interlaced mkv decoding by the WDTV.

Whether the Sigma SDK includes VobSub support (doubtful because of these bugs) or WD implemented it themselves (but then why not list VobSub as supported), it clearly shows no testing being performed. They should have a test set of files to verify the WDTV player against for every code change, but indications are that they don't do this. And by verify I mean actual data captures and bit comparisons of the output, and not some guy simply viewing them on a TV and saying "looks ok to me".

xj0hnx

05-15-09, 10:22 AM

I said million times that those specs were from files from people I know... And I was posting here for WD labs sees the problem and try to fix since those files played ok in 1.01.02... I know the workaround but that was not the point and you still doesnt understand the meaning of my posts... so forget my posts already... you are not helping...

I seriously doubt "WD labs" are going to go downloading Eureka releases to make sure they play ok. Regardless the fact is that the WD CAN play 1080p+DTS+subs, it has trouble with files that are encoded borderline spec, or badly encoded and then have internal and external subs. They have actual problems to fix like the whole greek subtitle issue.

By the way... you are talking about pirate copies... and I ask why?? Are you acusing me of illegaly download movies? You dont have the right to acuse me of anything, understand? And the next time, I will report you!

Um, YOU are the one talking about Eureka releases, and how you can't get them to play with 1080p+DTS+internal and external subs. lol

Afrsa

05-15-09, 10:27 AM

I seriously doubt "WD labs" are going to go downloading Eureka releases to make sure they play ok. Regardless the fact is that the WD CAN play 1080p+DTS+subs, it has trouble with files that are encoded borderline spec, or badly encoded and then have internal and external subs. They have actual problems to fix like the whole greek subtitle issue.

Um, YOU are the one talking about Eureka releases, and how you can't get them to play with 1080p+DTS+internal and external subs. lol

"I said million times that those specs were from files from people I know"

Do you understand english?

"Um, YOU are the one talking about Eureka releases, and how you can't get them to play with 1080p+DTS+internal and external subs. lol"

That was the feedback from portuguese foruns... I was just trying to see if this was a common problem... to repost there.

Seriously... put me in your ignore list!

Afrsa

05-15-09, 10:44 AM

techflaws

05-15-09, 10:44 AM

And the next time, I will report you!
To whom? Man, I feel your frustration but don't be ridiculous!

Having to actively try to recreate a problem using edge of compatibility files, and then adding MORE to them so they can't play isn't proving that the WD doesn't do what it says, because it does.
As has been repeatedly said: no, it doesn't! WD TV officially supports srt subs but decided to skip parts of the standard ignoring tags like <i> and <b> which is embarassing.

I'm pleased the WDTV plays VobSub subtitles (not officially though). However, there are several issues:
1. color palette isn't used properly resulting in greyscale only (and having to tweak palette)

Right, I honestly don't know what's so difficult about proper playback considering my cheap standalone just does fine with those subs. Check out my screenshots (http://techflaws.wordpress.com/files/2009/03/wdtv-sub-rendering-rar.pdf) (right-click, save as, rename to rar).

They should have a test set of files to verify the WDTV player against for every code change, but indications are that they don't do this.
Same applies to the german UI which has a lot of bugs that would have been easily spotted by someone if they'd read it. So I've corrected it and sent to WD to be included in the next update. For those who don't wanna wait another four months I'm gonna up them to my blog soon ;)

xj0hnx

05-15-09, 12:55 PM

As has been repeatedly said: no, it doesn't! WD TV officially supports srt subs but decided to skip parts of the standard ignoring tags like <i> and <b> which is embarassing.

What I am talking about isn't whether or not they are italicized, or bolded, it's the fact that files with .srt subs do play, in 1080p movies with DTS sound, the standards aren't what is being debated, but rather failure to play. It is weak that they didn't go full boat on them, but they still work for the most part.

davidgood123

05-15-09, 01:11 PM

xj0hnx

05-15-09, 03:28 PM

Can WD developers fix the problem?

Probably not because I, and many others can play back almost all of our 1080p/DTS with .srt sub files. There's more to consider than just 1080p DTS and .srt.

MrMod

05-15-09, 03:44 PM

Can WD developers fix the problem?

I wouldn't hold your breath since WD is alluding to the next model of WDTV already. I hope I'm wrong.

Afrsa

05-15-09, 06:15 PM

Today I playback a 1080p+DTS+external .srt file with 1.02.07 firmware, from the beginning it was ok, but when playback time pass by about 15 mins, the video became slow motion and no sound.
I transformed the file with popcorn audio converter to change DTS sound to AC3, and find out it playback smoothly from the beginning to the end without any problem.
Can WD developers fix the problem?

I think they already know that problem and they will try to fix that for all the non english speakers... They just need to tune the subs... and since they will do that to fix the greek subs, you will have your problem solved... or not, and then the greeks can return the player.

mytbyte

05-16-09, 01:09 AM

To all the Greeks out there - if you do not get greek subtitles as you well should, why are you not returning the unit to the shop you bought it from under warranty and get your money back? If enough Greeks should return the player, the dealers might put the pressure on WD to fix things...however I am still under the imression that this was concieved as a primarily US product and that all WDTVs in Europe are imports rather than official distribution...

whiteboy714

05-16-09, 10:56 AM

Seriously... put me in your ignore list!

I think we'd all be better off doing that. :(

DJFresh82

05-16-09, 11:18 PM

Is there another work around for this one? The problem with this one, is the True HD track. I tried using Tsmuxer, but there are resynch bad frame error messages, it stops at 5%. Is there another way to extract the audio than downconvert it to ac3 core? eac3to gives error messages also. thanks

General
ID : 1
Complete name \Movies\HD Movies\The One 1080pDD.m2ts
Format : BDAV
Format/Info : BluRay Video
File size : 7.80 GiB
Duration : 1h 27mn
Overall bit rate : 12.8 Mbps
Maximum Overall bit rate : 35.5 Mbps

Video
ID : 4113 (0x1011)
Menu ID : 1 (0x1)
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L4.0
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames : 3 frames
Duration : 1h 27mn
Bit rate : 11.6 Mbps
Nominal bit rate : 8 603 Kbps
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16/9
Frame rate : 23.976 fps
Resolution : 24 bits
Colorimetry : 4:2:0
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.234
Stream size : 7.10 GiB (91%)
Writing library : x264 core 66 r1114M a933a3e
Encoding settings : cabac=1 / ref=3 / deblock=1:0:0 / analyse=0x3:0x133 / me=umh / subme=7 / psy_rd=1.0:0.0 / mixed_ref=1 / me_range=16 / chroma_me=1 / trellis=1 / 8x8dct=1 / cqm=0 / deadzone=21,11 / chroma_qp_offset=-2 / threads=12 / nr=0 / decimate=1 / mbaff=0 / bframes=3 / b_pyramid=0 / b_adapt=1 / b_bias=0 / direct=3 / wpredb=1 / keyint=250 / keyint_min=25 / scenecut=40(pre) / rc=2pass / bitrate=8603 / ratetol=1.0 / qcomp=0.60 / qpmin=10 / qpmax=51 / qpstep=4 / cplxblur=20.0 / qblur=0.5 / vbv_maxrate=25000 / vbv_bufsize=25000 / ip_ratio=1.40 / pb_ratio=1.30 / aq=1:1.0

Audio
ID : 4352 (0x1100)
Menu ID : 1 (0x1)
Format : AC-3
Format/Info : Audio Coding 3
Format profile : TrueHD
Duration : 1h 27mn
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 640 Kbps
Channel(s) : 6 channels
Channel positions : Front: L C R, Surround: L R, LFE
Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
Stream size : 400 MiB (5%)

DJFresh82

05-17-09, 01:27 AM

Don't know what's wrong with this one. It's just pixelated and stuttering, i converted it using tsmuxer to m2ts, but that didn't work, it was the same result. If there are workarounds anybody know of, please help, thanks

General
Complete name 1080pDTS.mkv
Format : Matroska
File size : 7.95 GiB
Duration : 1h 25mn
Overall bit rate : 13.3 Mbps
Movie name : Madagascar.2005.1080p.BluRay.DTS.x264-ESiR
Encoded date : UTC 2008-09-29 16:23:46
Writing application : mkvmerge v2.2.0 ('Turn It On Again') built on Mar 4 2008 12:58:26
Writing library : libebml v0.7.7 + libmatroska v0.8.1
Cover : Yes / Yes / Yes

Video
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L5.1
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames : 12 frames
Muxing mode : Container profile=Unknown@5.1
Codec ID : V_MPEG4/ISO/AVC
Duration : 1h 25mn
Bit rate : 11.4 Mbps
Nominal bit rate : 11.7 Mbps
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16/9
Frame rate : 23.976 fps
Resolution : 24 bits
Colorimetry : 4:2:0
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.229
Stream size : 6.82 GiB (86%)
Writing library : x264 core 60 r877M c74a8e2
Encoding settings : cabac=1 / ref=12 / deblock=1:-3:-3 / analyse=0x3:0x133 / me=umh / subme=7 / me-prepass=0 / brdo=1 / mixed_ref=1 / me_range=50 / chroma_me=1 / trellis=0 / 8x8dct=1 / cqm=2 / deadzone=8,8 / chroma_qp_offset=0 / threads=6 / nr=0 / decimate=1 / mbaff=0 / fgo=7 / bframes=16 / b_pyramid=1 / b_adapt=1 / b_bias=0 / direct=3 / wpredb=1 / bime=1 / keyint=250 / keyint_min=25 / scenecut=40(pre) / rc=2pass / bitrate=11667 / ratetol=1.0 / rceq='blurCplx^(1-qComp)' / qcomp=1.00 / qpmin=10 / qpmax=51 / qpstep=4 / cplxblur=20.0 / qblur=0.5 / ip_ratio=1.40 / pb_ratio=1.17 / aq=2:0.80
Language : English

Audio #1
ID : 2
Format : DTS
Format/Info : Digital Theater Systems
Codec ID : A_DTS
Duration : 1h 25mn
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 1 536 Kbps
Channel(s) : 6 channels
Channel positions : Front: L C R, Surround: L R, LFE
Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
Resolution : 24 bits
Stream size : 944 MiB (12%)
Title : Feature
Language : English

Audio #2
ID : 3
Format : Vorbis
Format settings, Floor : 1
Codec ID : A_VORBIS
Duration : 1h 25mn
Bit rate : 64.0 Kbps
Minimum bit rate : 64.0 Kbps
Maximum bit rate : 64.0 Kbps
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
Stream size : 39.3 MiB (0%)
Title : Commentary
Writing library : libVorbis 1.1.1/1.1.2 (UTC 2005-03-04)
Language : English

Text #1
ID : 4
Format : ASS
Codec ID : S_TEXT/ASS
Codec ID/Info : Advanced Sub Station Alpha
Language : English

Text #2
ID : 5
Format : ASS
Codec ID : S_TEXT/ASS
Codec ID/Info : Advanced Sub Station Alpha
Language : Bulgarian

Text #3
ID : 6
Format : ASS
Codec ID : S_TEXT/ASS
Codec ID/Info : Advanced Sub Station Alpha
Language : Danish

Text #4
ID : 7
Format : ASS
Codec ID : S_TEXT/ASS
Codec ID/Info : Advanced Sub Station Alpha
Language : Slovenian

techflaws

05-17-09, 01:32 AM

the standards aren't what is being debated, but rather failure to play.
Actually it is. As long as they are only half supported I consider the player to be at failure to work as advertized. In my book that means WD is obligated to fix it (and not just in the upcoming player).

expeditionaire

05-17-09, 02:07 AM

Hi. Bug: in this movie, english audio is no synchronized (delayed) in WD TV (it's OK if I play it in the computer):

General / Container Stream # 1
Total Video Streams for this File -> 1
Total Audio Streams for this File -> 2
Video Codecs Used -> AVC
Audio Codecs Used -> AC3 / AC3
File Format -> Matroska
Play Time -> 1h 54mn
Total File Size -> 4.73 GiB
Total Stream BitRate -> 5 923 Kbps
Title (Tag) -> www.HD-Spain.com - Revolutionary Road [BluRay 720p x264 AC3-Pal Dual.Subs][Grupo HD-Spain].mkv
Encoded with -> mkvmerge v2.5.1 ('He Wasn't There') built on Feb 22 2009 18:19:47
Encoding Library -> libebml v0.7.7 + libmatroska v0.8.1
Video Stream # 1
Codec (Human Name) -> AVC
Codec (FourCC) -> V_MPEG4/ISO/AVC
Codec Profile -> High@L4.1
Frame Width -> 1 280 pixels
Frame Height -> 544 pixels
Frame Rate -> 25.000 fps
Total Frames -> 171557
Display Aspect Ratio -> 2.35
Scan Type -> Progressive
Colorimetry -> 4:2:0
Codec Settings (Summary) -> CABAC / 5 Ref Frames
QF (like Gordian Knot) -> 0.265
Codec Settings (CABAC) -> Yes
Video Stream Length -> 1h 54mn 22s 280ms
Video Stream BitRate -> 4 588 Kbps
Video Stream BitRate (Nominal) -> 4 607 Kbps
Bit Depth -> 24 bits
Video Stream Title -> Revolutionary Road [BluRay 720p x264 AC3-Pal Dual.Subs][Grupo HD-Spain].mkv
Video Encoder -> x264 - core 67 r1148 400740b
Video Encoder (Settings) -> cabac=1 / ref=5 / deblock=1:0:0 / analyse=0x3:0x113 / me=umh / subme=7 / psy_rd=1.0:0.0 / mixed_ref=1 / me_range=16 / chroma_me=1 / trellis=1 / 8x8dct=1 / cqm=0 / deadzone=21,11 / chroma_qp_offset=-2 / threads=6 / nr=0 / decimate=1 / mbaff=0 / bframes=3 / b_pyramid=1 / b_adapt=1 / b_bias=0 / direct=3 / wpredb=1 / keyint=250 / keyint_min=25 / scenecut=40 / rc=2pass / bitrate=4607 / ratetol=1.0 / qcomp=0.60 / qpmin=10 / qpmax=51 / qpstep=4 / cplxblur=20.0 / qblur=0.5 / ip_ratio=1.40 / pb_ratio=1.30 / aq=1:1.00
Video Stream Language -> Spanish
Audio Stream # 1
Codec -> AC-3
Codec (FourCC) -> A_AC3
Audio Stream Length -> 1h 54mn 22s 280ms
Audio Stream BitRate -> 448 Kbps
Audio Stream BitRate Mode -> CBR
Number of Audio Channels -> 6
Audio Channel's Positions -> Front: L C R, Rear: L R, LFE
Sampling Rate -> 48.0 KHz
Audio Stream Title -> Ac3 Espa√±ol Grupo HD-Spain
Audio Stream Language -> Spanish
Audio Stream # 2
Codec -> AC-3
Codec (FourCC) -> A_AC3
Audio Stream Length -> 1h 54mn 22s 280ms
Audio Stream BitRate -> 640 Kbps
Audio Stream BitRate Mode -> CBR
Number of Audio Channels -> 6
Audio Channel's Positions -> Front: L C R, Rear: L R, LFE
Sampling Rate -> 48.0 KHz
Audio Stream Title -> Ac3 Ingles
Audio Stream Language -> English

mytbyte

05-17-09, 02:11 AM

I'm not sure there is anything standardized in the sense that coders would be legally prosecuted if they didn't adhere to it...the whole subtitle scene and even mkv, are so open that there can be as many way of preparing them as there are people in the world...you can easily upgrade a PC software player to read "jumbled-up" subtitles since there is enough raw power to iron out quirky files...there are simply too many documented standarsd but perhaps only too vaguely to prepare for ALL scenarios...frankly, what the hell do we need 10 subtitles formats for and only because some coder likes a particular format and the other some other format, we are doom to a perpetual damnation...I mean , I could (if i knew how :D) now devise a format, document it on the internet and start using it...why the frakk should WD support it?

You cannot expect any such product to work completely as advertised since there will always be unplayable file or files with quirks that WDTV (or other player's)programming didn't account for and need to adjust to...only a firmware or 2 ago Popcorn Hour didn't have some basic functionality, you could not FF/REW mkvs, also no automatic refresh until recently...and it's been polished for a year now I believe...

frankyH

05-17-09, 02:41 AM

[QUOTE=DJFresh82;16475974]Don't know what's wrong with this one. It's just pixelated and stuttering, i converted it using tsmuxer to m2ts, but that didn't work, it was the same result. If there are workarounds anybody know of, please help, thanks

General
Complete name 1080pDTS.mkv
Format : Matroska
File size : 7.95 GiB
Duration : 1h 25mn
Overall bit rate : 13.3 Mbps
Movie name : Madagascar.2005.1080p.BluRay.DTS.x264-ESiR
Encoded date : UTC 2008-09-29 16:23:46
Writing application : mkvmerge v2.2.0 ('Turn It On Again') built on Mar 4 2008 12:58:26
Writing library : libebml v0.7.7 + libmatroska v0.8.1
Cover : Yes / Yes / Yes

Video
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L5.1
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames : 12 frames
Muxing mode : Container profile=Unknown@5.1
Codec ID : V_MPEG4/ISO/AVC
Duration : 1h 25mn

The number of reframes is your problem it's to high

mytbyte

05-17-09, 03:45 AM

I believe some releases have pledged to abandon out-of-spec encoding regardless of the larger file size a conformed encoding brings since they feel trying to fit HD content on DVD-R (DL) has become somewhat irrelevant in the age of cheap mass storage media...so let's hope this will become a trend...

recoding for backup purposes is solely up to the person to understand that it is easier to adhere to standard to make sure each backup plays ok on a HW player...1:1 backups are compliant anyway...

martist

05-17-09, 05:58 AM

Hello , People

i want to buy the wdtv , to use his digital out for flac files to a dac.
Are the audio clipping problems solved in the wdtv?
i ve read about the tests , with the pictures off the clipping, but cant find that answer....

Can i better buy another mediaplayer to do that?

I only want to use it as a pre to dac for high quality mp3 and flac.

Regards from the netherlands...

Tony

dv08

05-17-09, 06:32 AM

...Are the audio clipping problems solved in the wdtv?...No

DJFresh82

05-17-09, 07:14 AM

How Can i convert it to normal reframes? which program to use?

[QUOTE=DJFresh82;16475974]Don't know what's wrong with this one. It's just pixelated and stuttering, i converted it using tsmuxer to m2ts, but that didn't work, it was the same result. If there are workarounds anybody know of, please help, thanks

General
Complete name 1080pDTS.mkv
Format : Matroska
File size : 7.95 GiB
Duration : 1h 25mn
Overall bit rate : 13.3 Mbps
Movie name : Madagascar.2005.1080p.BluRay.DTS.x264-ESiR
Encoded date : UTC 2008-09-29 16:23:46
Writing application : mkvmerge v2.2.0 ('Turn It On Again') built on Mar 4 2008 12:58:26
Writing library : libebml v0.7.7 + libmatroska v0.8.1
Cover : Yes / Yes / Yes

Video
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L5.1
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames : 12 frames
Muxing mode : Container profile=Unknown@5.1
Codec ID : V_MPEG4/ISO/AVC
Duration : 1h 25mn

The number of reframes is your problem it's to high