Specification

Connectivity
Bonjour
UPnP SSDP
UPnP AV
Windows Media Connect
Windows Media Player NSS
Samba
NFS
Media servers: myiHome, myiHomeLite, myiHomeMS (UPnP), MSP Portal
Third party media servers: WizD, SwissCenter, Llink, GB-PVR
********** P2P
Usenet downloader
NAS access: SMB, NFS, FTP

Web services
Video: YouTube, Vuze, Revision 3, Videocast, CNET TV, Mediafly, Veoh, Mevio, Bliptv, Cranky Geeks, Break Podcast, DLTV, CBS Evening News, CNN Anderson Cooper 360 Daily, CNN The Larry King Podcast, NBC Today Show, The CNN Daily, CNN In Case You Missed It, NBC Nightly News, NBC Meet The Press, CBS Face the Nation, Podfinder UK
Audio: Jamendo, iPodcast, BBC Podcast, Indiefeed, CNN News, ABC News
Photo: Flickr Photo, Picasaweb Photo, Pikeo, 23
RSS feed: Yahoo! Weather, NMT Forum, Bloglines, Cinecast, MSNBC News, Traffice Condition, Yahoo! Traffic Alerts, Yahoo! News, Weather Bug
Peer-to-peer TV: SayaTV
Internet Radio: Radio box, Live365 Radio

Media files supported
Video containers:
MPEG1/2/4 Elementary (M1V, M2V, M4V)
MPEG1/2 PS (M2P, MPG, DAT, VOB)
MPEG2 Transport Stream (TS, TP, TRP, M2T, M2TS, MTS)
AVI, ASF, WMV
Matroska (MKV)
MOV (H.264), MP4, RMP4

Video decoder:
XVID SD/HD
MPEG-1
MPEG-2 MP@HL
MPEG-4.2 ASP@L5, 720p, 1-point GMC
MPEG-4.10 (H.264)
BP@L3
MP@L4.0
HP@L4.0
HP@L4.1
WMV9
MP@HL
SMPTE 421M (VC-1)
MP@HL
AP@L3

Audio containers:
AAC, M4A
MPEG audio (MP1, MP2, MP3, MPA)
WAV
WMA
FLAC
OGG

Audio decoder:
Dolby Digital
DTS
WMA, WMA Pro
MPEG-1 Layer 1, 2, 3
MPEG-4 AAC-LC
MPEG-4 HE-AAC
MPEG-4 BSAC
LPCM
FLAC
Vorbis

Audio pass-through:
DTS, DTS-HD HR, DTS-HD MA
Dolby Digital, Dolby Digital Plus, Dolby True HD

Other formats:
ISO, IFO navigation
Adobe Flash Lite 3.1
AVCHD navigation
Blu-ray ready (requires addition of compatible BD-ROM and at least 1GB USB stick or internal HDD)

Photo formats:
JPEG, BMP, PNG, GIF

Subtitle formats:
SRT, MicroDVD SUB, SSA, SUB/IDX

DRM
Cardea DRM (WMDRM-ND)
Janus DRM (WMDRM-PD)

Chipset
Sigma Designs SMP8643, 667MHz CPU with floating point coprocessor.
Memory
512MB DDR2 DRAM, 256MB NAND Flash

Audio/Video outputs
HDMI v1.3a with CEC, 36bpp deep color, 12-bit xvYCC processing and HDCP 1.2 content protection
Component Video
S-Video
Composite Video
Stereo Analog Audio
S/PDIF Optical and Coaxial Digital Audio

Other Interface
192x64 dots white text on blue background LCD display, with software adjustable brightness and power off
Power button with standby, reset and full power down
2x USB 2.0 host at the front
2x USB 2.0 host at the back
1x USB 2.0 internal
2x SATA (one occupied by HDD tray)
3.5" HDD tray
Internal mounting for 2.5" HDD
2.4GHz RF Remote Control
Infra-Red Remote Control port (Infra-Red Remote Control optional)

Network
Ethernet 10/100/1000
miniPCI MII interface for 11n WiFi card (optional)

Power
100~240V AC, 50~60 Hz, max 2.5A
typical: 13 W (no additional device installed/attached)
maximum: 70 W

Dimension
Width x Depth x Height : 425mm x 290mm x 80mm (16.73" x 11.42" x 3.14")

Weight
3.7kg (8.3 lbs)

Package Content
Popcorn Hour C-200 (HDD not included)

IEC 60320 C13 power cord
1.5M length HDMI cable
RF Remote Control with 2 "AAA" batteries
Quick start guide

Looking at the pics, it better be a fake :D

3.7 kg, thats heavy.
Looks like it has a fan (back). Looks like it is not a real major improvement regarding playing mkv files. We will wait how the menu looks and scrolls. The conceptronic yuixx menu looks really cool.

It doesn't show up on popcorn hour site

It doesn't show up on popcorn hour site

Thats correct, it is announced only on www.networkedmediatank.com
Public release will be later.

quote

Hello all,

I am proud to announce first here on the NMT Forum, the next generation NMT, the Popcornhour C200.
This is only an first Info for the NMT Forum Users to get an overview of the new Device, i wont talk about the firmware or price currently, because this will be announced when we start the new Homepage, don't ask about an Date, because i wont answer it, when its ready it will get posted and thats it, so just take an first look now .

Regards,
Werner

3.7 kg, thats heavy.
Looks like it has a fan (back). Looks like it is not a real major improvement regarding playing mkv files. We will wait how the menu looks and scrolls. The conceptronic yuixx menu looks really cool.

No one knows that... at least it has a new chip Sigma Designs SMP8643, 667MHz CPU with floating point coprocessor.

Menus probably will be in HTML... :(

At this point I think I prefer the Yuixx... but lets see the reviews...

Looks like it is not a real major improvement regarding playing mkv files.

How do you figure? What improvements regarding mkv should it have?

How do you figure? What improvements regarding mkv should it have?

it doesnt runs L5.1 only up to HP@L4.1
I have a mkv file from planet earth 1080p and my Egreat m34a doesnt run it smooth.

All 1080p mkv files I have tried on popcorn A-110 ran, even the ones with as many as 12 reframes at L5.1, but would eventually crash the popcorn with a need for restart - but non conformant mkvs DO RUN more or less correctly!...are you saying that egreat has the hardware limitation same as WDTV?

All 1080p mkv files I have tried on popcorn A-110 ran, even the ones with as many as 12 reframes at L5.1, but would eventually crash the popcorn with a need for restart - but non conformant mkvs DO RUN more or less correctly!...are you saying that egreat has the hardware limitation same as WDTV?


I don't know. It could be. It does run it but not smoothly.
1080p with L4.1 is no problem. It uses the same sigma chip and software als popcornhour 110.

mytbyte

i have many files 1080p and heavy ones and i can play them without any problem

like planet earth that in some scenes it output like 37mbits!!! in a mkv that its allot....

3.7 kg. Shipping individual sets will be an issue. Unless the chain stores pick it up. By then prices will be on the heavy side.

3.7 kg, thats heavy.
Looks like it has a fan (back). Looks like it is not a real major improvement regarding playing mkv files. We will wait how the menu looks and scrolls. The conceptronic yuixx menu looks really cool.

Information in the thread over on NMT Forums indicates that there is a place for a fan but the unit does not require one. They put the spot in the design so users can add their own if they wish (and no doubt in case in the future they discover that a fan is in fact needed from the factory).

Later,
Jeff

I am surprised to see it will not come with a built in blur ray optical drive. I read over on MPC Club Hi-Jack said "the great thing about the C-200 is that we can remove the drive cage and replace it with a BD-Rom." So I suppose the reasoning is that not all users need an optical drive, so leave it out as standard and let users add their own if they so choose to.

I also hope that the release of this new unit will lower the price of the A-110 (either on clearance through PCH directly or if they start to appear on e-bay for below retail due to many folks upgrading).

like planet earth that in some scenes it output like 37mbits!!! in a mkv that its allot....

why do you think so? 37 mbps is nothing for Sigma, rgardless of mkv or m2ts, the trouble is with h.264 reframes, not bitrate!

Found this on Youtube, some guy showing the hardware in the box.. Too bad its not in English..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Ze4ZOMc6VY

http://74.125.91.132/translate_c?hl=en&sl=iw&tl=en&u=http://www.hometheater.co.il/article01524.%25D7%25A7%25D7%2591%25D7%259C%25D7%2595-%25D7%2590%25D7%25AA-%25D7%2594-C-200-%25D7%2594%25D7%259E%25D7%2596%25D7%25A8%25D7%2599%25D7%259E %25D7%2593%25D7%2599%25D7%2594&prev=hp&rurl=translate.google.com&usg=ALkJrhh_gOsNDCB2te5TXqtBWXtiE4gORA
i won't replace my A110 with this...at least not for quite a while! not worth it for me.

Is menu navigation any faster than the original popcorn hour? I gave up on the popcorn hour and replaced it with a real HTPC because the system was generally very slow and unresponsive.

I'm now convinced this fiction is fact. ANY info of shipping, to within the nearest quarter?

CD

Found this on Youtube, some guy showing the hardware in the box.. Too bad its not in English..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Ze4ZOMc6VY

Why don't these videos ever show the interface? It's the crappy UI that usually sinks these products.

Why don't these videos ever show the interface? It's the crappy UI that usually sinks these products.

I think you just answered your own question! ;)

CD

I have a A-100 and love how it plays everything. If this new one doesn't have a better UI I'll have to pass. If I can get A-100 playback with XBMC interface I would be in heaven.

Can this upcoming player play the BD with the menus, like the Dune does?
Or is it still only mt2s, and therefore no subtitle?

it doesnt runs L5.1 only up to HP@L4.1
I have a mkv file from planet earth 1080p and my Egreat m34a doesnt run it smooth.

I thought NMTs were bulletproof. :D

Good to know it's got some limitations. Makes me, an WDTV owner, feel a bit relieved. LOL!

does anyone know what the GUI will be like? Thats what killed it for me and the a-110. Those jukeboxes were too complicated to set up, I don't have all day to sit there and figure it out.
Thanks
Mo

I thought NMTs were bulletproof. :D

Good to know it's got some limitations. Makes me, an WDTV owner, feel a bit relieved. LOL!

As has been mentioned before, HP@L5.1 is outside the spec of most of the chips in the players, Blu-ray/HD-DVD's are encoded at L4.1, so a 4.1 -> 5.1 encode is totally worthless. It's not a limitation of the chip. It's the function of an improperly encoded release/video. The original Planet Earth wasn't even in L5.1

let's look at the specs for L5.1 shall we?

Level number 5.1
Max macroblocks per second Max frame size (macroblocks) 983040
Max video bit rate (VCL) for Baseline, Extended and Main Profiles 36864
Max video bit rate (VCL) for High Profile 240 Mbit/s
Max video bit rate (VCL) for High 10 Profile 300 Mbit/s
Max video bit rate (VCL) for High 4:2:2 and High 4:4:4 Predictive Profiles 960 Mbit/s
Examples for high resolution @ frame rate (max stored frames) in Level720 Mbit/s
1920x1080@120.5 (16)
4096x2048@30.0 (5)
4096x2304@26.7 (5)
link (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H.264)

From another board: "The problem with a lot of h.264 encodes downloaded from the Internet, is that many people tend to encode their h.264 stuff at high@L5.1, instead of Level 4.1. They don't really understand what 5.1 is for, but many guides say 5.1 gives better quality (which of course is true) so they do it. 5.1 is used for the aforementioned 120fps @ 1080p, but is really no use for todays normal HD content. (from BluRays and HD DVD)."

$299

http://www.popcornhour.com/onlinestore/index.php?pluginoption=catalog

does anyone know what the GUI will be like? Thats what killed it for me and the a-110. Those jukeboxes were too complicated to set up, I don't have all day to sit there and figure it out.
Thanks
Mo

From reading comments on the NMT forums, and watching that unboxing video on youtube, it will have the same GUI, just faster. Still will use HTML. It is amazing that the jukeboxes like YAMJ have come out since last model of the PCH launched yet the they are not going to be shipping the new players with a Jukebox loaded by default. Whoever designed YAMJ must not be much into marketing, because you think they would have sold it to Syabas.

So I agree, they should make these players plug n play out of the box, ready to scan the end users media files, get them loaded into a fancy GUI and scrape for TV/Movie covers and metadata.

I am not clear on this. Can it hold both a blu ray drive and a SATA drive?

The processor appears to be quite a bit faster than the one in the 110.

Price is set at $299. If it holds two drives, I"d be pretty interested.

Personally I'm going to wait for some feedback before I make my mind up if it's worth the price tag. :) With S/H it will be about 320$.

Here are some FAQ complements of the NMT forum:


Does the C-200 support the use of the harmony/universal remotes? - To use IR you will need an additional IR receiver, the unit out of the box only supports RF remotes.

Does the unit support Bluray? - The unit will play retail Blu-ray discs with the addition of a BD-rom.

Does the C-200 have a fan? - There is no fan, as it is not required (can be added by user if wanted though).

Can I install more RAM? - DDR2 RAM is not upgradable, there is no need for more RAM than the device is supplied with.

Will the C-200 support my HD files with High@L5.1? - no support for AVC High@L5.1 level.

Can I power up C-200 by remote? - Unlike the A-110/100, the C-200 supports full power up/down by remote.

Does the C-200 have a USB slave port? No.


Wireless/WiFi

Does the C200 have WiFi built-in? - No it does not as not everyone wants/needs it, so if you do have a need then you will need a wireless mini-pci card. The B110 had one so if you look in that section you will find more details on mini-pci networking. The spec is not known yet but we expect Atheros WiFi 'N' based card.

What is the Antenna on the back for then? - It is for the RF remote control. When inserting a mini-pci card you usually get the associated antennas. There are mounting holes for 3 antennas on the back of the C200 case.

Will WiFi be as slow as the A110? - No. The A110 is USB not mini-Pci, we hope for at least double the speed.


Can it hold both a blu ray drive and a SATA drive? - It has two SATA ports.

1) The external one can hold either a 3 1/2 in drive in the tray OR the tray is removed for a blu-ray drive.

2) The internal port can hold a 2 1/2 in laptop drive.

(So it can hold a Blu-ray drive and a 2 1/2 HDD at the same time, OR a 3 1/2 HDD and 2 1/2 HDD at the same time.)



Can I attach an HD-DVD and BD-ROM combo drive and play both retail hd-dvd's and Blu-Rays? - HD-DVD will not be supported , also Sigma at all doesnt support HD-DVD.

CPU Speed: Sigma Designs SMP8635 (Chip current generation uses) vs Sigma Designs SMP8643 (Chip in the C-200)


Host CPU Speed

SMP8635: 300 MHz MIPS

SMP8643: 667 + 333 MHz MIPS




Source and more info @: http://www.sigmadesigns.com/Products/selection_guide/selection_guide.html

From reading comments on the NMT forums, and watching that unboxing video on youtube, it will have the same GUI, just faster. Still will use HTML. It is amazing that the jukeboxes like YAMJ have come out since last model of the PCH launched yet the they are not going to be shipping the new players with a Jukebox loaded by default. Whoever designed YAMJ must not be much into marketing, because you think they would have sold it to Syabas.

So I agree, they should make these players plug n play out of the box, ready to scan the end users media files, get them loaded into a fancy GUI and scrape for TV/Movie covers and metadata.

Well WC, I think that assumes everyone will want it that "one" way; running the YAMJ GUI, scrapping whichever default DB, etc. I agree that is more user-friendly, but I think in this community the argument could be made that it is better to leave it "open", and let users decide.

CD

I know a lot of people are happy about the bay that allows for a BD drive, but what am I missing? I thought the whole idea behind ripping/streaming was to get away from discs; why would I want a BD disc-player also on my PCH? Now, if the fact that it will support a BD disc-player means that's the reason it'll also support BD .ISO...that I get (I'm not particularly excited about BD .ISO...why would anyone want all that extra crap...at the expensive of all that extra space...but I know a lot of people were clamoring for it. Hey, what do I know...I didn't see what all the fuss was behind BD Live either, so...).

The only thing that would excite me about having a BD drive in the bay would be if you could use it to rip...so you could eliminate the PC from the process, and run the file back to your networked location. But I can't imagine that's possible?

CD

I know a lot of people are happy about the bay that allows for a BD drive, but what am I missing? I thought the whole idea behind ripping/streaming was to get away from discs; why would I want a BD disc-player also on my PCH? Now, if the fact that it will support a BD disc-player means that's the reason it'll also support BD .ISO...that I get (I'm not particularly excited about BD .ISO...why would anyone want all that extra crap...at the expensive of all that extra space...but I know a lot of people were clamoring for it. Hey, what do I know...I didn't see what all the fuss was behind BD Live either, so...).

The only thing that would excite me about having a BD drive in the bay would be if you could use it to rip...so you could eliminate the PC from the process, and run the file back to your networked location. But I can't imagine that's possible?

CD

I had yet to think about the possiblity of having the ability to rip BD to the hard drive in the new PCH (since it is confirmed you can have both drives). That would be a huge bonus.

But to answer your question, having the option to add a BD drive to play commercial discs is a plus because I have not yet made the jump to Blu Ray (I know I might be one of the few left). Right now I am thinking, "if I need to get a new PC with a BD drive in order to rip discs to MKV anyway, I might as well build an HTPC instead of buying a PCH." But now with a PCH with BD drive, I could rent discs from netflix or local and just pop those in and watch (it would be nice to have if friends or family are coming over for a movie night eith a disc they bring and be able to pop it right in, not have to rip it first) AND have an option to stream downloaded files and music, all in one box in my entertainment center. I suppose I am in the minority that relies solely on downloaded MKV or WMV-HD files for movies and TV viewing.

To me, the addition of the option to install a BD drive moves this version of the PCH closer to the stand alone player market (like the LG BD 390 that can play MKV files off usb drive) and away from the "server front end" market.

I know a lot of people are happy about the bay that allows for a BD drive, but what am I missing? I thought the whole idea behind ripping/streaming was to get away from discs; why would I want a BD disc-player also on my PCH?

CD

because when the kids come over with friends and want to watch a BD disk that one of them brought over or just picked up at the local video store, they don't want to wait for it to be ripped.....................

I had yet to think about the possiblity of having the ability to rip BD to the hard drive in the new PCH (since it is confirmed you can have both drives). That would be a huge bonus.

But to answer your question, having the option to add a BD drive to play commercial discs is a plus because I have not yet made the jump to Blu Ray (I know I might be one of the few left). Right now I am thinking, "if I need to get a new PC with a BD drive in order to rip discs to MKV anyway, I might as well build an HTPC instead of buying a PCH." But now with a PCH with BD drive, I could rent discs from netflix or local and just pop those in and watch (it would be nice to have if friends or family are coming over for a movie night eith a disc they bring and be able to pop it right in, not have to rip it first) AND have an option to stream downloaded files and music, all in one box in my entertainment center. I suppose I am in the minority that relies solely on downloaded MKV or WMV-HD files for movies and TV viewing.

To me, the addition of the option to install a BD drive moves this version of the PCH closer to the stand alone player market (like the LG BD 390 that can play MKV files off usb drive) and away from the "server front end" market.

Ah, there ya go; I asked what I was missing, and there it is...I was missing the segment like you WC, who was just doing SD streaming, but still wants a BD player (and doesn't have one already).

CD

because when the kids come over with friends and want to watch a BD disk that one of them brought over or just picked up at the local video store, they don't want to wait for it to be ripped.....................

And again, I guess I was assuming people had a BD player, for stuff exactly like that. My mistake.

CD

I know a lot of people are happy about the bay that allows for a BD drive, but what am I missing? I thought the whole idea behind ripping/streaming was to get away from discs; why would I want a BD disc-player also on my PCH? Now, if the fact that it will support a BD disc-player means that's the reason it'll also support BD .ISO...that I get (I'm not particularly excited about BD .ISO...why would anyone want all that extra crap...at the expensive of all that extra space...but I know a lot of people were clamoring for it. Hey, what do I know...I didn't see what all the fuss was behind BD Live either, so...).

The only thing that would excite me about having a BD drive in the bay would be if you could use it to rip...so you could eliminate the PC from the process, and run the file back to your networked location. But I can't imagine that's possible?

CD


In other forums it's not likely in any way that you'll be able to rip from the BD player to the PCH since the BD player and disc will still have the same encryption as any stand-alone player has. As someone else mentioned; the only benefit to this function is one less 'box' in your system since you can watch BDs on it and stream. It's too bad for those that have HDDVDs can not put a HDDVD/BD player in to watch either format (it does not support HDDVD).

And again, I guess I was assuming people had a BD player, for stuff exactly like that. My mistake.

CD

It could make a great entry player in to Blu Ray for many. Same price as a PS3 ($299 plus around $100 for a BD drive) but with much better streaming / container support.

So really, with this player having not that much new from the A-110 in terms of playing networked files, I thought Syabas would be going after a more main stream crowd, but without new GUI or easier auto set up options, it must not be.

And again, I guess I was assuming people had a BD player, for stuff exactly like that. My mistake.

CD

good point.........that is what i have now but i want to also eliminate one box
(using ps3 for BD playback only)

will need the IR option though to integrate with home theater system prontoproNG unit............wish the IR was standard with RF as the option
(not sure i understand that choice)

will need the IR option though to integrate with home theater system prontoproNG unit............wish the IR was standard with RF as the option
(not sure i understand that choice)

+1 on the need for IR. I have a Harmony One and use a IR repeater system. No RF in my my set up.

I was waiting to see the new model before jumping into the NMT market. I think I'll wait and see how the C-200 does.

I agree with CD about the BD drive. I guess it's helpful, but it would be really helpful if I could rip with it.

same crapy gui and software from a-100 i think ill a pass on this huge player.

same crapy gui and software from a-100 i think ill a pass on this huge player.

I hate to say it, because I was as excited as anyone about a new PCH...and it's shiny and all (:D)...but I don't think I'm feeling it either. I, personally, don't have the need for the BD bay (again, that is unless you could hack the thing to run decryption and rip with it)...don't think the LCD on the front adds anything for me (I could see how it would be very useful, for audio streaming...as I always say this is one of the things keeping NMTs from being good all-in-one's, is they can't do audio navigation without a display being on...but I'm a long way away from giving up my SBs)...and, as others have mentioned, it's bigger, more expensive, but same 'ole GUI, etc.

The faster processor would be nice to have, but I don't use mine for any "labor-intensive" functionality; point it at a movie-cover in YAMJ and go. At the very least, it's probably a wait-and-see for me.

CD

it doesnt runs L5.1 only up to HP@L4.1
I have a mkv file from planet earth 1080p and my Egreat m34a doesnt run it smooth.

According to an email exchange with Xtreamer Support this evening, "We believe [the Xtreamer] should be no problem to play H. 264 HP@L5.1"

link (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=16660301&posted=1#post16660301)

http://www.engadgethd.com/ is reporting the cost will be $299 when it launches in July.

On the back I believe there is an IR port.

http://www.engadgethd.com/ is reporting the cost will be $299 when it launches in July.

On the back I believe there is an IR port.



Popcorn hour's new website is up.

http://www.popcornhour.com/onlinestore/


Yes it's 299$ (USD) confirmed from their website. You can also sign up to be notified when orders begin.

Can this upcoming player play the BD with the menus, like the Dune does?
Or is it still only mt2s, and therefore no subtitle?

same question...
Can this upcoming player play the BD with the menus?

Can this upcoming player play the BD with the menus, like the Dune does?
Or is it still only mt2s, and therefore no subtitle?

Per their web page and werner's comments it will be a "full-featured Blu-ray player" and support PGS subtitles on discs since that's part of supporting blu-ray. Whether that carries over to BD iso's, full folder structures on disk, m2ts, etc. is unknown at this point.

As has been mentioned before, HP@L5.1 is outside the spec of most of the chips in the players, Blu-ray/HD-DVD's are encoded at L4.1, so a 4.1 -> 5.1 encode is totally worthless. It's not a limitation of the chip. It's the function of an improperly encoded release/video. The original Planet Earth wasn't even in L5.1

let's look at the specs for L5.1 shall we?

From another board: "The problem with a lot of h.264 encodes downloaded from the Internet, is that many people tend to encode their h.264 stuff at high@L5.1, instead of Level 4.1. They don't really understand what 5.1 is for, but many guides say 5.1 gives better quality (which of course is true) so they do it. 5.1 is used for the aforementioned 120fps @ 1080p, but is really no use for todays normal HD content. (from BluRays and HD DVD)."

L5.1 isn't nescessarily outside the spec of most chips in players, it can be because it can support higher specs than L4.1, but those are the MAXIMUM...

Level number 5.1
Max macroblocks per second Max frame size (macroblocks) 983040
Max video bit rate (VCL) for Baseline, Extended and Main Profiles 36864
Max video bit rate (VCL) for High Profile 240 Mbit/s
Max video bit rate (VCL) for High 10 Profile 300 Mbit/s
Max video bit rate (VCL) for High 4:2:2 and High 4:4:4 Predictive Profiles 960 Mbit/s
Examples for high resolution @ frame rate (max stored frames) in Level720 Mbit/s
1920x1080@120.5 (16)
4096x2048@30.0 (5)
4096x2304@26.7 (5)

Level 4.1

Max macroblocks per second: 245760
Max frame size (macroblocks): 8192
Max video bit rate (VCL) for Baseline, Extended and Main Profiles: 50Mbit/s
Max video bit rate (VCL) for High Profile: 62.5Mbit/s
Max video bit rate (VCL) for High 10 Profile: 150Mbit/s
Max video bit rate (VCL) for High 4:2:2 and High 4:4:4 Predictive Profiles: 200Mbit/s
Examples for high resolution @
frame rate
(max stored frames)
in Level:
1280x720@68.3 (9)
1920x1080@30.1 (4)
2048x1024@30.0 (4)

I have a few mkvs that were encoded with L5.1, BUT they are encoded with just slightly aggressive settings, that otherwise would still be very inside L4.1. So in short, from my experiance L5.1 isn't nescessarily not supported, just settings above what L4.1 is capable of allowing. Now some media players may limit the level it can play, but they shouldn't, they should base it on the encode itself, as stated above L5.1 can be the same settings as L4.1.

Hi all,

High@L5.1 isn't blocked or something, because many High@L5.1 also work already on the A-100 and A-110 and the same and more will work on the C-200, the point is we cant write it on the homepage because we cant say that it is fully supported, which will never happen, also because it doesn't make sense to have High@L5.1 at all, or can you find any source which provides Movies with an higher Resolution then 1920x1080@30fps because then High@L5.1 makes sense, if pirated material is available and this group has no knowledge on how to encode an movie, then sorry, but then i think it would be better if you search for an different group ;) which has basic knowledge how to encode an movie, or you encode it yourself from your original BD.

To describe what High@L5.1 means here is an part of h264 on wiki http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H.264

Level number: High@L5.1
Max macroblocks per second: 983040
Max frame size (macroblocks): 36864
Max video bit rate (VCL) for Baseline, Extended and Main Profiles: 240 Mbit/s
Max video bit rate (VCL) for High Profile: 300 Mbit/s
Max video bit rate (VCL) for High 10 Profile: 720 Mbit/s
Max video bit rate (VCL) for High 4:2:2 and High 4:4:4 Predictive Profiles: 960 Mbit/s
Examples for high resolution @ frame rate (max stored frames) in Level: 1920x1080/120.5 - 4096x2048/30.0


about this profile we can talk again in some years ;)


Regards Werner
Syabas Technology Inc.
Popcornhour

Maybe I am trying to gild a lily....but it would be nice if there was support for DVD-Audio and SACD. It could replace my Panasonic BD-35 but not the Oppo 970. Whereas a dedicated unit like the new Oppo 83 could replace both those units (but would not have the playback flexbility of the PCH).

I am trying to reduce the number of units that I own.

I know that HD-DVD is dead...but it would still be nice to have some kind of player for these discs. Unless every label follows Warner and offers some kind of upgrade program.

I don't see what the fuss about the BD bay is all about. Standard it comes without BD drive so if you don't want one, you simply don't add one. Default it can hold a HDD, same thing there, don't want one, don't add one.

As for backing up, the backing up process is long for a BD (almost an hour for me on the laptop Dual Core 2.8) so backing up all 100 disks I have to storage is out of the question (for time and storage space I would need) yet I would want my kids to have their movies available (if I had any kids that is :-)) so they can simply select the movie to watch and in that case I'd need ISO files to make it easy on them instead of browsing BDMV folders and so on...

The trick is not to appraoch a player from your own personal needs only but in general, situations change and a player that is flexible (like supporting ISO, BDMB and Original disks) is flexible... Same goes for DVD backups or original, for network (SMB, NFS, Fixed links, discovery), hard drives (NTFS, EXT2/3), trick play (Time Seek, Time Search, jumps) and so on...

I believe the C-200 is quite well designed for this flexible environment so it will fit ealmost every possible environment at an affordable price. As far as the interface goes, yes it is still HTML but it has changed here and there in presentation and look. (no further comment). It is also a lot faster than the previous players to load and change between pages (hence the 2X more pôwerful chip).

Will it replace the high end units? No, (but then high end units cannot do what this c200 is able to do are they?). So looking at the unit and balance what possibilities it has against the price you pay should not be much of challenge to come our positive...

It will not be perfect and need to mature over some period, but it's promising and flexible. I look forward to challenge the C200 against the HDI units and the upcoming Yuixx (no BD) although expect the HDI units will have trouble keeping up with the Syabas which has quite few advantages, but looks less nice than HDI interface and units. (personal taste)

The C-200 for me is another Dune. or will be some kind of more advanced Dune.

The same reasons made me not to buy dune are the same reasons why i would not go for the C-200. PRICE and DVD Design.

I have the NMT already. I did not see much of a reason to go for this one, not now at least. I would recomend all to let it mature a little and see if the long awaited device met the expectations.

The C-200 for me is another Dune. or will be some kind of more advanced Dune.

The same reasons made me not to buy dune are the same reasons why i would not go for the C-200. PRICE and DVD Design.

I have the NMT already. I did not see much of a reason to go for this one, not now at least. I would recomend all to let it mature a little and see if the long awaited device met the expectations.

I said the same thing a few posts back; none of the new features make me want to run out and replace my A-110. It's a "wait and see" for me too. OTOH, if I were looking to buy my first PCH, I don't see any reason not to go ahead and get the C-200 vs. the A-110; for the ~$80 you do get the faster processor and somewhat increased flexibility.

CD

I don't see any reason not to go ahead and get the C-200 vs. the A-110; for the ~$80 you do get the faster processor and somewhat increased flexibility.

CD

How about the bigger weight, footprint? Who said that bigger and bulkier was better? Also if those factors influenced your decision, price would be another because you could pickup a cheaper A-110 now and get most if not all the functionality you need (depending on your needs, and so long as you don't care about BD-ROM)

The price is creeping up too. It seems I bought my first A-100 at something like $179.

How about the bigger weight, footprint? Who said that bigger and bulkier was better? Also if those factors influenced your decision, price would be another because you could pickup a cheaper A-110 now and get most if not all the functionality you need (depending on your needs, and so long as you don't care about BD-ROM)

Well, you left out quite a bit out of my original quote. In fact, you cut off part of the actual sentence, which is "if I were looking to buy my first PCH...". You almost, deliberately it seems, positioned me in favor of the C-200, which is not what I said at all.

I said the same thing a few posts back; none of the new features make me want to run out and replace my A-110. It's a "wait and see" for me too. OTOH, if I were looking to buy my first PCH, I don't see any reason not to go ahead and get the C-200 vs. the A-110; for the ~$80 you do get the faster processor and somewhat increased flexibility.

What I'm saying, and it's just my opinion, is if I had been holding off all this time, and I was looking to buy a PCH for the first time...and trying to decide between the A-110 at ~$215 and the new C-200 at ~$299, for me, I'd probably opt for the C-200. I guess my thinking is, for ~$80, I'd like to future-proof myself with the newer processor. I agree, right now it doesn't make me go running to replace my A-110, but what if a new buyer gets the A-110 and 6 months from now there are all kinds of cool Apps and GUIs, based on the new chip, and they won't work on the A-110? Then I'm sure a new buyer would have a bit of remorse.

OTOH, if the size and weight of the C-200 bother you, sure...opt for the A-110. But one of the biggest complaints I seem to read about the PCH, even as opposed to other NMTs, is it's built like a piece of junk...so I'm not so sure Syabas didn't set out to build a more solid machine on purpose. Just my .02

CD

Is anyone else concerned about DRM with this new device? For it to be a BD player, they need to get all the DRM/DMCA/AACS whatever approvals to play encrypted BD material. That means HDCP, a key, etc.

Also will they have to deal with the DTS HD/Dolby TrueHD license restrictions of only playing them un downconverted if from an AACS source? They will if they officially license those codecs, just like TMT/PDVD do.

Worse, they might have to retro-update the firmware in the A110 to bitstrip the audio codecs from DTS-MD/TrueHD if non-AACS.

This might be the beginning of the ned of the PCH... All models...

Is anyone else concerned about DRM with this new device? For it to be a BD player, they need to get all the DRM/DMCA/AACS whatever approvals to play encrypted BD material. That means HDCP, a key, etc.

Also will they have to deal with the DTS HD/Dolby TrueHD license restrictions of only playing them un downconverted if from an AACS source? They will if they officially license those codecs, just like TMT/PDVD do.

Worse, they might have to retro-update the firmware in the A110 to bitstrip the audio codecs from DTS-MD/TrueHD if non-AACS.

This might be the beginning of the ned of the PCH... All models...

What?? :eek: Are you trying to say, that by "overreaching" with the C-200, and including the drive bay, and allowing it to be a BD player, they may have somehow called attention to the fact that the A-100 and A-110 were not properly licensed...and that someone will be looking to shut down all the models over it?? :eek::eek:

Man, either I hope I am completely misinterpreting what you're saying...or that you are entirely wrong about it.

CD

I doubt that C-200 is made to defeat or legally support BD encryption since it's not packing a BD drive - it would be really be a suicide to pay licences for something that is not important for most users...if it came with a BD drive it would double as a BD player...which it is not...

I doubt that C-200 is made to defeat or legally support BD encryption since it's not packing a BD drive - it would be really be a suicide to pay licences for something that is not important for most users...if it came with a BD drive it would double as a BD player...which it is not...

That's the point - it supports full BD menus, and you can drop a BD drive in there.

In order to do play encrypted BD's from the drive, they'll need to get a valid license key to play the BD's, since they're encrypted.

Unless they will suddenly support running AnyDVD HD on the C-200, the C-200 will need to be a valid BD player with a valid key. To get that, they'll need to license everything legally, which would lead to rules around those licenses, which leads to the same nonsens we have with TMT and PDVD.

That's the point - it supports full BD menus, and you can drop a BD drive in there.

In order to do play encrypted BD's from the drive, they'll need to get a valid license key to play the BD's, since they're encrypted.

Unless they will suddenly support running AnyDVD HD on the C-200, the C-200 will need to be a valid BD player with a valid key. To get that, they'll need to license everything legally, which would lead to rules around those licenses, which leads to the same nonsens we have with TMT and PDVD.

I know it supports BD drives but doesn't come with one so it would be lunacy to pay licences if drive is not supplied and no-one intends to use it as a BD disc player...

since it's a streaming device, you can always install AnyDVD HD on a computer, share the comp's BD drive and suck the decrypted BD over LAN...that's what I did with the A-110 for retail DVDs...:D

I know it supports BD drives but doesn't come with one so it would be lunacy to pay licences if drive is not supplied and no-one intends to use it as a BD disc player...

http://www.blu-raydisc.info/flla_licensee_lists_ROM2.php

http://www.blu-raydisc.info/flla_licensee_lists_ROM2.php

More specifically, right here:
http://www.blu-raydisc.info/flla_licensee_lists_ROM2.php#bdrommovieplayer

They are definitely on the list.

So again I ask, isn't anyone concerned that this will corner them, just like TMT and PDVD, not just for the C-200, but for updates to the A110? Specifically in bitstreaming non-AACS material and bitstripping LPCM?

TMT and PDVD have to license the rights to bitstream DTS-HS and TrueHD, and part of that license (apparently) is that they can't bitstream anything without AACS. If Syabase ends up in the same boat, these devices will become mostly bricks.

More specifically, right here:
http://www.blu-raydisc.info/flla_licensee_lists_ROM2.php#bdrommovieplayer

They are definitely on the list.

So again I ask, isn't anyone concerned that this will corner them, just like TMT and PDVD, not just for the C-200, but for updates to the A110? Specifically in bitstreaming non-AACS material and bitstripping LPCM?

TMT and PDVD have to license the rights to bitstream DTS-HS and TrueHD, and part of that license (apparently) is that they can't bitstream anything without AACS. If Syabase ends up in the same boat, these devices will become mostly bricks.

+1 I would love to hear more about this. In a perfect world BD .ISO and Blu-ray would play nice side by side.

So presumably they would be able to bitstream as they do now without updates making the devices you have now even more valuable.

If the device does not function as a Blu Ray replacement when the drive is inserted....what is the use of including the Blu Ray SATA reader? Are there that many people burning their own Blu Ray discs.

I must be missing something.

More specifically, right here:
http://www.blu-raydisc.info/flla_licensee_lists_ROM2.php#bdrommovieplayer
TMT and PDVD have to license the rights to bitstream DTS-HS and TrueHD, and part of that license (apparently) is that they can't bitstream anything without AACS. If Syabase ends up in the same boat, these devices will become mostly bricks.


I wouldn´t worry. Syabas had the DTS-HD /TrueHD - Bitstreaming license (not decodign to lpcm, where Software player have their 16bit/48khz barrier...) for their Players and they paid for it.
Syabas got the Bluray-License for the new Player, so I think the other Licenses too. I don´t think it is possible that DTS and Dolby blackmail Syabas with the new contract to remove the Bitstreaming from their old non-aacs-players.

(PS...my special friend...we talked about that over 1 yr ago :) : my 4870 still swaps the surround channels...are there any news?)

So presumably they would be able to bitstream as they do now without updates making the devices you have now even more valuable.

No, you don't get it. The licenses to bitstream HD audio apparently require them to only bistream HD audio from AACS encrypted content, and only over PAVPs. That's the issue with TMT/PDVD.

So any MKV/M2TS files you have (which are non-AACS by definition) would no longer be able to bitstream HD audio, just like with TMT/PDVD. On both the C200 and A110.

This is a bad thing.

whats your intention with strewing that rumors? Had any Softwareplayer ever the posibility to stream HD-Audio non AACS content?

So any MKV/M2TS files you have (which are non-AACS by definition) would no longer be able to bitstream HD audio

How could this change without firmware changing?

whats your intention with strewing that rumors? Had any Softwareplayer ever the posibility to stream HD-Audio non AACS content?

Um, the PCH-A110. That's the point, pay attention.

"It couldn't, so you could just keep the current firmware forever, I suppose. But that would effectively kill the product."

Not if it works fine for you as it is. I have old sneakers, golf clubs, software that's no longer free, plenty of stuff I like that I don't want replaced. I said very early in the 110 thread I'm going to stockpile those things in case they ever become DRM'd.

Edit: Ah, apparently you're playing delete the post games.

"It couldn't, so you could just keep the current firmware forever, I suppose. But that would effectively kill the product."

Not if it works fine for you as it is. I have old sneakers, golf clubs, software that's no longer free, plenty of stuff I like that I don't want replaced. I said very early in the 110 thread I'm going to stockpile those things in case they ever become DRM'd.

Edit: Ah, apparently you're playing delete the post games.

I just deleted it because it was obvious...

Anyway, keeping golf clubs, a physical item, is different than keeping old firmware. If all the supporting apps around the A110 upgrade along with the firmware, and you don't upgrade the firmware, it quickly becomes obsolete.

IMO.

There will continue to be tech changes for audio, video, supporting software, etc., and the firmware will likely need upgrading to support these things.

Anyway, yes, you could lock it in time and keep using it, but that's not a great selling point for the product.

I'm raising these issues because I think this is the closest product I've found to being a reliable, easy to use movie streamer, and it would be a shame to see it go the way of TMT/PDVD so quickly.

As I said...


Not if it works fine for you as it is.

Many of us use this as a movie player. It has always been weak for music, pictures, etc. I for one will get plenty of use out of my three players if I never do another firmware update. This of course is looking at it from my perspective. You seem more concerned about selling points and the companies business decisions. If they go DRM and a void is left and there is demand I suspect other manufactures will step in. I see little reason to get overly concerned about this just yet.

Um, the PCH-A110. That's the point, pay attention.


I did....I asked that because you establish your opinion (A-110 will loos his DTS-HD License) with your comparison to software-players....but they never were able to stream any HD-Audio, since that your comparison and your opinion makes no sence: A-110 will never loose its DTS-HD and TrueHD License even without AACS abilities. The player has its license, it got payed and it is black on wite in a contract...and like annother user said: removing dts-hd would only be possible with a new firmware release...so there would be no control over it, so why should they worry about that

I'll be getting this. Always wanted a component sized unit to put into a MA rack and this could be it. Love my PCH A100 and this could be the natural progression.

Thats correct, it is announced only on www.networkedmediatank.com
Public release will be later.

quote

Hello all,

I am proud to announce first here on the NMT Forum, the next generation NMT, the Popcornhour C200.
This is only an first Info for the NMT Forum Users to get an overview of the new Device, i wont talk about the firmware or price currently, because this will be announced when we start the new Homepage, don't ask about an Date, because i wont answer it, when its ready it will get posted and thats it, so just take an first look now .

Regards,
Werner


* Will this offer resolution passthrough for those of use with external video processors (this is pretty much a must for me??

* Can you stream BD.iso's over Ethernet?

* Any estimations for the speed improvement using YAMJ over the 110?

I'll be getting this. Always wanted a component sized unit to put into a MA rack and this could be it. Love my PCH A100 and this could be the natural progression.

Ditto... most likely. I have a full size component stack, so a standard-size unit is MUCH preferable to yet another dinky little box I have to figure out where to put safely.

I'm not thrilled by the lack of a GUI out of the box, though. I get the desire for flexibility, but how does pre-loading a GUI (which I assume can be changed easily by those who prefer to tinker) hurt anything? Installing a GUI now, manually, doesn't seem to be hurting the units that are already out there, or locking into becoming one-trick ponies, so other than helping people who DON'T want to tinker, how does pre-loading a GUI hurt anything?

I do wonder if the external SATA connection can be used to connect to a SATA RAID box, though... anyone know? Sometimes 1.5 tb just isn't enough. LOL Similarly, does anyone know if this network streamer can work the OTHER direction? If, say, I connect a SATA drive with a big library of files on it directly to this, rather than directly to a computer, can this unit stream out to a computer (and other TVs), in addition to playing the files on the drive directly?

Currently I hang drives off a Mac and share/stream out to other computers and an AppleTV over the network, which works great... it would be nice to have a hardware solution and take the Mac out of the equation, however, and still have everything available full time. (Sort of like NAS, but connected directly to the TV as well.)

I've been considering biting the bullet on the a-110 but have always been bothered on the no pass-thru of video resolution :rolleyes:. If this c200 has pass-thru i may get it. I as suprised they never fixed that on the a-110 though. I have no need for the extra drives or blu ray drive due to having a nas for drive failure protection.

I've been considering biting the bullet on the a-110 but have always been bothered on the no pass-thru of video resolution :rolleyes:. If this c200 has pass-thru i may get it. I as suprised they never fixed that on the a-110 though. I have no need for the extra drives or blu ray drive due to having a nas for drive failure protection.

Wha? A110 doesn't pass thru video resolution? Since when?

Can the blu-ray drive fit within the unit or does it have to be external?

Wha? A110 doesn't pass thru video resolution? Since when?

Since forever.

Since forever.

It's obvious I'm not understanding what you're 'saying' since I can see 'video' just fine w/my A110.

what i meant was you have different resolution videos on tap but the a-110 has to be set with a certain resolution output... it can't pass thru different native resolutions and allow a better scaller to do the job. This is kind of a big deal for me right now... i'm sure i'll get over it though.

You have only one choice of output resolution like 1080p or 820p or 480p, whatever. Many people have better de-interlacers and/or scalers in their sources, displays or video processors and would prefer the A-110 pass through through whatever native resolution is input.

I've been considering biting the bullet on the a-110 but have always been bothered on the no pass-thru of video resolution :rolleyes:. If this c200 has pass-thru i may get it. I as suprised they never fixed that on the a-110 though. I have no need for the extra drives or blu ray drive due to having a nas for drive failure protection.

It passes through 24p for 24p, and everything else at whatever you set (e.g. 30i, 60p, whatever).

This is more than adequate, isn't it? Especially since it does a more-than-adequate job at SD upconversion.

It passes through 24p for 24p, and everything else at whatever you set (e.g. 30i, 60p, whatever).

This is more than adequate, isn't it? Especially since it does a more-than-adequate job at SD upconversion.

I have mine set to send the native 'size' so it may send 1080p/23.9 etc but when I stream a DVD from my PC the screen size is VERY small but blu-rays fill the screen (and the professional calibrator who calibrated my TV advised me to have it as such). The only time I notice any difference is PQ is some BD rips will play back and certain sections/scenes the person/thing will 'stutter'. I don't attribute it to the A110 but the ripped file. Case in point is the two Sony CGI movies I have stutter throughout the entire movie to the point I will only watch them using the physical media.

Many people have reported a better picture passing through native and processing after that.

The only point i'm making is if you have equipment that is better at upconversion than the a-110 then you want to use it. I am no expert on the a-110 (i don't own one) but from the 100 pages i've read it is "ok" at upconverison....which is what i would expect in the price point. I will just be rreeeeaaalllyyy suprised if they don't add this pass through feature on the c200, that's all.

I have mine set to send the native 'size' so it may send 1080p/23.9 etc but when I stream a DVD from my PC the screen size is VERY small but blu-rays fill the screen (and the professional calibrator who calibrated my TV advised me to have it as such). The only time I notice any difference is PQ is some BD rips will play back and certain sections/scenes the person/thing will 'stutter'. I don't attribute it to the A110 but the ripped file. Case in point is the two Sony CGI movies I have stutter throughout the entire movie to the point I will only watch them using the physical media.

1) Set the A110 to "Full Screen" in the A/V setup, then DVD's will fill the screen.

2) The stuttering you're seeing is most likely the SMB limitations of the A110. Use something like LLink to stream the HD video and your stuttering will go away. (The A110 SMB implementation can't handly much above about 25mb/s, where HTTP streamers can go to the limits of your PC network card/network.)

The only point i'm making is if you have equipment that is better at upconversion than the a-110 then you want to use it. I am no expert on the a-110 (i don't own one) but from the 100 pages i've read it is "ok" at upconverison....which is what i would expect in the price point. I will just be rreeeeaaalllyyy suprised if they don't add this pass through feature on the c200, that's all.

Absolutely, and I do. There are basically 3 groups of resolutions for most media:

1) 24p content - the A110 will play that natively always (if you set it to)
2) 1080i content - you can set the A110 to default to 1080i for non-24p content, so this is native
3) 480i/p content - you can either let the A110 upconvert to 1080p, bypassing your VP, or set the A110 to 1080i, allowing your VP to clean it up - you get a good amount of VP from your superior VP this way

The only issue left is 720p content, but that's a very small minority of content in terms of movies and videos.

So if the c200 doesn't offer native pass through for all sources then i'll be buying the A-110 and performing the operations you've just suggested. Thanks.

You are talking about constantly switching the output resolution of the A-110. With passthrough you don't have to be bothered with that. Furthermore if you output 480i content as 1080i this is what is happening -

480i -> 480p -> 1080p -> 1080i -> display -> 1080p

de-interlacing twice = not good

You are talking about constantly switching the output resolution of the A-110. With passthrough you don't have to be bothered with that. Furthermore if you output 480i content as 1080i this is what is happening -

480i -> 480p -> 1080p -> 1080i -> display -> 1080p

de-interlacing twice = not good

No I'm not.

You set it so it does exactly what I describe above, once. You never fiddle with it again.

And that path you listed above has nothing to do with reality, it goes:
480i->1080i->VP
So there's one, minor additional processing step for what is already pretty low quality content. If your VP can't clean that up as 1080i, then the A110 is probably better anyway, and let it do:
480i->1080p

And that path you listed above has nothing to do with reality, it goes:
480i->1080i->VP


Incorrect. Only progressive images are scaled.

So if you set the PH to 1080p output:

480i->480p->1080p->TV
1080i->1080p->TV
1080p->TV

This may be why i've read it's IQ is "ok" on less than 1080p source material. "ok" is still good in my book just not as good as a VP.

Correct.

It is OK since de-interlacers and scalers have gotten better and cheaper. It may still be no match for your display or VP though which is why native passthrough in the C-200 is a good thing.

1) Set the A110 to "Full Screen" in the A/V setup, then DVD's will fill the screen.

2) The stuttering you're seeing is most likely the SMB limitations of the A110. Use something like LLink to stream the HD video and your stuttering will go away. (The A110 SMB implementation can't handly much above about 25mb/s, where HTTP streamers can go to the limits of your PC network card/network.)

Hm. I stream DVD's from my PC but the ripped BDs are played directly from the internal HD on my A110 - the stuttering occurs from those Sony CGI BD's, not the streaming DVDs.

Hm. I stream DVD's from my PC but the ripped BDs are played directly from the internal HD on my A110 - the stuttering occurs from those Sony CGI BD's, not the streaming DVDs.

Clean your BD and try ripping again. Errors during the ripping process usually cause this.

CJ

* Will this offer resolution passthrough for those of use with external video processors (this is pretty much a must for me??

* Can you stream BD.iso's over Ethernet?

* Any estimations for the speed improvement using YAMJ over the 110?

They are currently working on an update to the current models to allow passthrough.

Though the final specs haven't been released yet, it appears that you should be able to stream BD .iso files over ethernet, assuming you have everything configured correctly.

Based on the chip speed, I would say it would run YAMJ at least twice as fast as the current models.

CJ

Clean your BD and try ripping again. Errors during the ripping process usually cause this.

CJ

Tried that - multiple times. Others have confirmed that Open Season and Open Season 2 stutter all the way through the movie.

Though the final specs haven't been released yet, it appears that you should be able to stream BD .iso files over ethernet, assuming you have everything configured correctly.

Pretty sure that's not true. It will play legal BD's using an optional BD drive, but it won't stream them.

In order to stream an ISO, it would need AnyDVD HD to do this, and there's no way they are licensing AACS, DTS HD, and TrueHD (which they have to do to play BD's from a drive) on a device that will also ship/enable AnyDVD HD.

Pretty sure that's not true. It will play legal BD's using an optional BD drive, but it won't stream them.

In order to stream an ISO, it would need AnyDVD HD to do this, and there's no way they are licensing AACS, DTS HD, and TrueHD (which they have to do to play BD's from a drive) on a device that will also ship/enable AnyDVD HD.

You don't need AnyDVD HD on the NMT to do this. That is used only when you ripped it to a HD, which is done on a separate component (computer). All the C-200 would know is that it is playing an unprotected medium.

Am I misunderstanding what you are saying?

CJ

They are currently working on an update to the current models to allow passthrough.
CJ

:eek: If this is correct that would be Great :D Many people would benefit from this and probably tip them over the edge on buying one :cool:.

Well, I just returned my WDTV and was going to buy the A110. (Oh and main reason to return my WDTV because it doesn't support True HD, HDMI 1.3). So, now what is a better buy $80 more for the C200?
I don't like the fact it is big and heavy but i am assuming add a dvd drive will allow me to sell my old dvd player and can save some money there? Again, is it worth to get the C200 and add a 2.5" hard drive with a dvd drive or just get the A110?

Well, I just returned my WDTV and was going to buy the A110. (Oh and main reason to return my WDTV because it doesn't support True HD, HDMI 1.3). So, now what is a better buy $80 more for the C200?
I don't like the fact it is big and heavy but i am assuming add a dvd drive will allow me to sell my old dvd player and can save some money there? Again, is it worth to get the C200 and add a 2.5" hard drive with a dvd drive or just get the A110?

I personally think, for most people the a110 is more than enough.

And the C200 isn't out yet, so no one really knows what it will/won't do. The only things published make it sounds like an A110 with a slot for a BluRay drive. Other than that, all the published features are pretty much identical.

Also, if you want one any time soon, get the A110. If you can wait a couple months, consider the C200.

AbMagFab, thanks for the reply...yes, you are right about the only benefit...well, lets see how it is, when its out...oh, and i thought i was to be released this month and not couple of months ??

AbMagFab, thanks for the reply...yes, you are right about the only benefit...well, lets see how it is, when its out...oh, and i thought i was to be released this month and not couple of months ??

Right, but even if they release it on time, it will take a while before production ramps up to meet even moderate demand. Most likely there will be back-orders for at least a couple months.

I would presume that the C-200 will eventually become a pretty good blu-ray player. Otherwise I am not clear where the benefit it relative to the A-110.

I really liked my A-100 (which I sold) and really like my A-110. So I am rooting for Popcorn Hour/Syabas.

I'm really hoping the C-200 will convert DTS-HD HR, DTS-HD MA, and True HD to LPCM for Blu-Rays rather then just pass-thru. Looks like a great unit I've read that the processor is something like 5x as powerful as the one in the A110 that should open up a lot of new options for the gui.

Well, I just returned my WDTV and was going to buy the A110. (Oh and main reason to return my WDTV because it doesn't support True HD, HDMI 1.3). So, now what is a better buy $80 more for the C200?
I don't like the fact it is big and heavy but i am assuming add a dvd drive will allow me to sell my old dvd player and can save some money there? Again, is it worth to get the C200 and add a 2.5" hard drive with a dvd drive or just get the A110?

When the C-200 comes out, I'll sell you my HDX-1000 for less than the PCH A110 :)

CJ

I'm really hoping the C-200 will convert DTS-HD HR, DTS-HD MA, and True HD to LPCM for Blu-Rays rather then just pass-thru. Looks like a great unit I've read that the processor is something like 5x as powerful as the one in the A110 that should open up a lot of new options for the gui.

or just make it more responsive

Well, I just returned my WDTV and was going to buy the A110. (Oh and main reason to return my WDTV because it doesn't support True HD, HDMI 1.3). So, now what is a better buy $80 more for the C200?
I don't like the fact it is big and heavy but i am assuming add a dvd drive will allow me to sell my old dvd player and can save some money there? Again, is it worth to get the C200 and add a 2.5" hard drive with a dvd drive or just get the A110?

i don't know that many poeple looking to buy dvd players, might not get much for it. I'm an hd junkie myself

3) 480i/p content - you can either let the A110 upconvert to 1080p, bypassing your VP, or set the A110 to 1080i, allowing your VP to clean it up - you get a good amount of VP from your superior VP this way


That is incorrect ... the damage has already been done. At best, your VP is going to output what the A110 would have at 1080p. A VP can't 'clean it up'.

That is incorrect ... the damage has already been done. At best, your VP is going to output what the A110 would have at 1080p. A VP can't 'clean it up'.

Perhaps yours can't. Mine does a lot of cleanup of 1080i content.

And there's minimal "damage" done from upconverting a 480i source.

Got to stop with these absolute statements.

Perhaps yours can't. Mine does a lot of cleanup of 1080i content.

And there's minimal "damage" done from upconverting a 480i source.

Got to stop with these absolute statements.

Unless I'm completely mistaken, there is no such thing as scaling of interlaced sources. This is what happens for a DVD iso using an NMT set to 1080i:

* 480i is deinterlaced to 480p by the NMT (this introduces deinterlacing artifacts)

* 480p image is scaled to 1080p by NMT (scaling algorithm not the best)

* 1080p interlaced to 1080i by NMT (This should a simple filter, and not 'damage' anything at the pixel level. However, the output cadence will be based on what cadence it originally believed the 480i content to be in).



So at this point, the scaler is receiving a 1080i image that has deinterlacing artifacts (from the 480i->480p), with those artifacts ingrained in the image which was then scaled to 1080p (which besides the original deinterlacing artifacts, adds its own since the scaling is inferior), and then reinterlaced.

How can a video processor 'fix' that? From the VP’s point-of-view, it is simply receiving a 1080i stream that it needs to deinterlace to 1080p. For all it knows, the data is native 1080i. It can’t know how the image was originally deinterlaced and scaled to somehow correct for it.

Unless I'm completely mistaken, there is no such thing as scaling of interlaced sources. This is what happens for a DVD iso using an NMT set to 1080i:

* 480i is deinterlaced to 480p by the NMT (this introduces deinterlacing artifacts)

* 480p image is scaled to 1080p by NMT (scaling algorithm not the best)

* 1080p interlaced to 1080i by NMT (This should a simple filter, and not 'damage' anything at the pixel level. However, the output cadence will be based on what cadence it originally believed the 480i content to be in).



Is there an echo in here?

You are not mistaken. Only progressive images are scaled.

Unless I'm completely mistaken, there is no such thing as scaling of interlaced sources. This is what happens for a DVD iso using an NMT set to 1080i:

* 480i is deinterlaced to 480p by the NMT (this introduces deinterlacing artifacts)

* 480p image is scaled to 1080p by NMT (scaling algorithm not the best)

* 1080p interlaced to 1080i by NMT (This should a simple filter, and not 'damage' anything at the pixel level. However, the output cadence will be based on what cadence it originally believed the 480i content to be in).



So at this point, the scaler is receiving a 1080i image that has deinterlacing artifacts (from the 480i->480p), with those artifacts ingrained in the image which was then scaled to 1080p (which besides the original deinterlacing artifacts, adds its own since the scaling is inferior), and then reinterlaced.

How can a video processor 'fix' that? From the VP’s point-of-view, it is simply receiving a 1080i stream that it needs to deinterlace to 1080p. For all it knows, the data is native 1080i. It can’t know how the image was originally deinterlaced and scaled to somehow correct for it.


Yep, scaling the interlaced source would introduce some really nasty jaggies that would be worse than what your described..... scaling interlaced sources just does not work well because most of the adjacent pixel info needed to scale is missing (its in the other field).

Sean

Is there an echo in here?

You are not mistaken. Only progressive images are scaled.

Well, AbMagFab seemed to be disregarding your post ... so I thought I'd reinforce it :p

It needs to be reinforced. However if you have ever seen an image de-interlaced twice it's quite noticeablebly worse on any reasonably good display.

How can a video processor 'fix' that? From the VP’s point-of-view, it is simply receiving a 1080i stream that it needs to deinterlace to 1080p. For all it knows, the data is native 1080i. It can’t know how the image was originally deinterlaced and scaled to somehow correct for it.

the VP can't 'fix' it.........the key is to pass the 480i directly to the VP when the source if 480i because the VP almost certainly has more horsepower and more powerful de-interlacing algorithms available.......and yes, i've seen the difference between an 863x based chip and a good VP

my sage hd200 media streamer has a native resolution mode that passes 480i on as 480i, 480p as 480p, etc....................there is no reason except priorities in development why the popcorn hour can't do the same

To all who have been wondering about BD iso support ...

it's in there :eek:




the VP can't 'fix' it.........the key is to pass the 480i directly to the VP when the source if 480i because the VP almost certainly has more horsepower and more powerful de-interlacing algorithms available.......and yes, i've seen the difference between an 863x based chip and a good VP

I was saying that to get the OP to think about it. I too have seen the difference (I manually switch my NMT to 480 output for DVD iso). :)

I've actually been very vocal regarding native rate output over at the NMT forums, and have been hounding them to hopefully add it to the current line ... and if not, at least to the C-200.

To all who have been wondering about BD iso support ...

it's in there :eek:



where did you hear/see this? i dont see it mentioned anywhere on their website or the forum. I have seen your posts in the main thread, however.

http://www.networkedmediatank.com/showthread.php?tid=23731&pid=215266#pid215266

Specifically (though the entire post is a great read):


Add any BD Drive? add any DVD Drive? use the HDD Tray? many wont use an Drive at all, so it wont make the price so much higher with this kind of license, if they don't use it, many will use it still only for there Files, TV Records, DVD Backups and BD backups if it is legal in there country, thats the main reason for the License, or would you really think that you would be more happy, if you could buy BD function for 150 - 200 USD, which then includes special BD Drive + special license?


A little while later, when responding to someone who asked about BD iso support again (that poster hadn't seen the info tucked inside) ... Werner responded with:

http://www.networkedmediatank.com/showthread.php?tid=23731&pid=215420#pid215420

i think some kind of info is in my last answer ;)
http://www.networkedmediatank.com/showthread.php?tid=23731&pid=215266#pid215266



Based on the second response, it's clear the hidden gem wasn't a mistake.

This thing is going to be AWESOME!!!

From C-200 FAQ at:
http://www.networkedmediatank.com/showthread.php?tid=23797

Will the unit play BD backups/BD ISO with menus etc?
Yes it will.

Pop the champagne!

It seems to me it is good if

1. You do not already have a BD player in you setup
2. You do not mind using the additional HD space
3. You crave BD ISO menus

Otherwise you can save a lot of money going with the A-110.

BobSalita,

Sweet! They hadn’t updated the FAQ when I posted.

It should be noted, one of the other things listed under ‘Unanswered questions’ was retail DVD support (via a DVD/BD player). Looks like that’s a yes as well!






Gary J,

I suppose, though I’m not sure I’d consider $84 as ‘a lot’. While I do intend to use it for BD iso support, I consider the (much) faster processor and Flash Lite support to be worth the price difference alone.

Anyone know if it will support multi-channel FLAC within a MKV? This is one of the things that the HDi Dunes does very well but the PCH does not.

Whats the deal with RF remote support only..... u think they would learn after the PS3. Hopefully there is some adapter because I use universal IR remotes to control everything... There are no RF standards for remote control beyond z-wave for lighting that I know of....

Sean

Whats the deal with RF remote support only..... u think they would learn after the PS3. Hopefully there is some adapter because I use universal IR remotes to control everything... There are no RF standards for remote control beyond z-wave for lighting that I know of....

Sean

they have officially stated that you can use IR remotes with an adapter. Dont remember if they will be selling one or not, but they said that there will be one thats compatible.

they have officially stated that you can use IR remotes with an adapter. Dont remember if they will be selling one or not, but they said that there will be one thats compatible.

They will be selling one, and they said that they would sell it at their cost (i.e., not making any money off of it). I would think that it would also be compatible with standard IR extenders.

CJ

[QUOTE=Gary J;16867070]It seems to me it is good if

1. You do not already have a BD player in you setup
2. You do not mind using the additional HD space
3. You crave BD ISO menusQUOTE]

uh...That would be me...but...then again to point out one thing I think everyone has to at least have a BD player in their PC's or the rest of the discussion is moot.

Wow this is looking very cool...Thanks for sharing all the information.

Cheers,

Requis

Whats the deal with RF remote support only..... u think they would learn after the PS3. Hopefully there is some adapter because I use universal IR remotes to control everything... There are no RF standards for remote control beyond z-wave for lighting that I know of....

Sean

I thought PS3 Was Blue tooth?....and you couldn't easily convert Blue tooth Signalling to a more traditional RF signal like from an RF remote...but from a remote perspective why is this a bad thing....you just need a receiver...or in my case an MX6000....macros' baby its all about the macro...RF is actually easier from my perspective, Bar area, Games Area...Lighting Macros' etc...Where I was going is what are your concerns with wireles..IR...
Cheers,

Requis

I thought PS3 Was Blue tooth?....and you couldn't easily convert Blue tooth Signalling to a more traditional RF signal like from an RF remote...but from a remote perspective why is this a bad thing....you just need a receiver...or in my case an MX6000....macros' baby its all about the macro...RF is actually easier from my perspective, Bar area, Games Area...Lighting Macros' etc...Where I was going is what are your concerns with wireles..IR...
Cheers,

Requis

bluetooth is an RF protocol. which makes the PS3 and other devices that use RF, BT, WIFI or anything other than IR incompatible with most of the universal remotes in existance.

Since they are going to provide an adapater its all cool...

not sure what your MX6000 has to do with anything. It can't just natively talk to some other vendors RF device can it? So are you saying an MX6000 can control a PS3 and DirecTV HR20 without additional adapters...

Sean

To my knowledge the C-200 has a standard IR jack in the back. So you should be able to use and standard IR receiver. You may want to wait until people confirm compatibility though (or simply get the one they will sell).


Also, for those that have a higher end RF universal remote (who's RF receiver box has IR ports for hooking up 'blasters') ... you should be able to bypass using an IR transmitter and receiver entirely, and simply connect it directly with a cable.

release date?

Several European retailers have pushed their shipping date to Aug 25th-Sept 4th. You can take that as a pretty good indication on estimated release date.

Im a little annoyed at my HTPC setup and the constant issues. I would love to have blu ray iso support along with DTS HD and HD audio pass through. with a nice GUI to top it off. I have Control4 controlling my switching in my home and this woudl be a nice Gui to switch to as needed or until C4 comes out with a 2 way driver to select movies in PCH from control4.

Anyone have anything they see on the C200 that we should not be so excited about? seems like a dream player to me.

Anyone have anything they see on the C200 that we should not be so excited about? seems like a dream player to me.

The two or three issues that they have not addressed or fixed are the 601 vs. 709 issue with HD files, the 24hz stuttering on high bitrate blu-ray rips, and the lack of multi-channel flac support.

I just threw a $30 video card into the HTPC...lo and behold the darn thing started acting much better. It was a gigabyte card with the 3450.

Which does not take away from this new box....just responding to nrk7001's comment. But in my case I am more tempted to start using the HTPC as a HD DVD playback device again (I had been converting files using ToNMT).

The two or three issues that they have not addressed or fixed are the 601 vs. 709 issue with HD files, the 24hz stuttering on high bitrate blu-ray rips, and the lack of multi-channel flac support.

What 24p stuttering? I'm on about my 50th BluRay, always at 24p, always 1:1 with HD audio, and no stuttering at all.

The only stuttering I ever had was network/server related. Since I switched to Apache as my HTTP server for high bitrate HD files, no more stuttering.

What 24p stuttering? I'm on about my 50th BluRay, always at 24p, always 1:1 with HD audio, and no stuttering at all.

The only stuttering I ever had was network/server related. Since I switched to Apache as my HTTP server for high bitrate HD files, no more stuttering.

http://www.networkedmediatank.com/showthread.php?tid=10602&page=1

I have seen it on Casino Royale and a few others.

http://www.networkedmediatank.com/showthread.php?tid=10602&page=1

I have seen it on Casino Royale and a few others.

Looks entire like:

1) People downloading lousy rips (illegal, shame on them)
2) People doing their own bad rips
3) Network issues

I don't think this is a device issue, it's a source data issue.

You make it sound like there are rips that are legal. Anyway the video decoding chip is the same one used in most Blu-ray players.

Looks entire like:

1) People downloading lousy rips (illegal, shame on them)
2) People doing their own bad rips
3) Network issues

I don't think this is a device issue, it's a source data issue.

1) Read that thread carefully, it's not a rip. I tried with my own copy. Same issue.
2) I tried it with my own retail disk and made a rip just to verify, same issue.
3)It happened to me on; USB drive, Gigabit, and on retail disk.

The issue does not happen on a borrowed Sony Blu-ray player (not PS3).

On that thread several people verified it and even one of the developers verified it.

Correction: By retail disk I mean ISO disk.

The other issue that has not been corrected and they (developers) are aware of is the color space issue. If you rip your Disk to an ISO it will use the correct color space of 709. But if you make an MKV or play any other form of direct file it will revert back to 601 SD.

This is a huge issue if you color calibrate and start seeing colors that do not look right.

I'm reading in a lot of places it will play BR iso files though not officially confirmed by PCH from what I can see. If it can play the original iso's, does it still down convert the color space as well as hd audio? Seems like isos would be the way to go on this one versus mkv.

I'm reading in a lot of places it will play BR iso files though not officially confirmed by PCH from what I can see. If it can play the original iso's, does it still down convert the color space as well as hd audio? Seems like isos would be the way to go on this one versus mkv.

PCH has verified it several times that ISO will work on the C-200. I think it's even on the C-200 FAQ thread.

As far as the color space on the C-200 that is not unknown but on the 110 it does use the wrong one on MKV's and if you rip your disk into a file structure and play the individual file. On ISO it does seem to use the correct one but I have not verified it on every single disc. This was verified using AVS 709.

I'm reading in a lot of places it will play BR iso files though not officially confirmed by PCH from what I can see. If it can play the original iso's, does it still down convert the color space as well as hd audio? Seems like isos would be the way to go on this one versus mkv.

They never downconvert HD audio.

The two or three issues that they have not addressed or fixed are the 601 vs. 709 issue with HD files, the 24hz stuttering on high bitrate blu-ray rips, and the lack of multi-channel flac support.

Actually, we have no idea whether those have been addressed in the C-200 or not. New HW, new firmware.


You make it sound like there are rips that are legal.

Most people consider ripping your own discs for personal use (ie. onto a server for whole-house distribution), to be a grey area. Regardless of whether it is technical legal or not, the point is there is no justification for ethical qualms in doing it.

Actually, we have no idea whether those have been addressed in the C-200 or not. New HW, new firmware.

This is true. The developers have said that they have tested both the color and skipping issues but they never said if the problems were fixed.

In reality, we currently know zip about the actual firmware for the C-200. No info on features, no info on the UI, etc.

All we have are some HW specs, and limited info on media support.

In reality, we currently know zip about the actual firmware for the C-200. No info on features, no info on the UI, etc.

All we have are some HW specs, and limited info on media support.

Some of the NMT forum threads are filed with hints and verifications as to what the C-200 can and may do. Like I said, the stuttering problem with 24hz has been acknowledged and they are testing it. It may take a few weeks after the release of the C-200 for all the beta testers to completely de-bug everything. Beta-testers do not have C-200's in their hands yet so other than the developers we can only go by what they are telling us.

I plan to pre-order one ... hopefully it will be soon.

I already have my pre-order for the Dune Prime 2.0 but I will jump on the C-200 if they address those issues before the Prime gets shipped. I only need a media streamer as I already rip & remux all my BD discs to my media server.

Does anyone know if this supports corded headphones and volume can be controlled with the remote? I currently don't have a receiver and my plasma has no headphone jack.

It does not have a headphone amp in it.

First pics and videos showing UI, photos, music playback, blu ray Playback and multitasking : http://www.networkedmediatank.com/showthread.php?tid=23731&page=1

anyway great work Werner and PCH I cant wait for my player

Most people consider ripping your own discs for personal use (ie. onto a server for whole-house distribution), to be a grey area. Regardless of whether it is technical legal or not, the point is there is no justification for ethical qualms in doing it.

I am not a legal expert nor do I live in the US, but isn't the law there pretty clear on this issue? You might think it's not reasonable but the consequences seem to be serious.

pmcd

Correct on all counts.

when is this thing coming out? september?

I am not a legal expert nor do I live in the US, but isn't the law there pretty clear on this issue? You might think it's not reasonable but the consequences seem to be serious.

pmcd

The law on selling the software to circumnavigate the protection is most likely illegal. The actual act of backing up your videos is the gray area (no precedence yet).

CJ

First pics and videos showing UI, photos, music playback, blu ray Playback and multitasking : http://www.networkedmediatank.com/showthread.php?tid=23731&page=1

anyway great work Werner and PCH I cant wait for my player

OMFG. I can't wait to get this player. Love the new interface and multi tasking.

new videos about high bitrate playback and multitask

It has been verified by werner that the PCH C-200 will NOT play multi-channel flac.

http://www.networkedmediatank.com/showthread.php?tid=23731&pid=229301#pid229301

Post #1499 for those that are not registered on their site.

Major FAIL on their part since the Dune Prime (also on the Base and Center) can already do this with no issues.

It has been verified by werner that the PCH C-200 will NOT play multi-channel flac.


epic FAIL

Unless you have no interest in flac.

Unless you have no interest in flac.

There is a lot of us that want this feature. The HD to mkv thread is very popular.

Thanks for the info Killroy and too bad I won't be getting the C-200.

but he doesnt say that it wont come ;)

but he doesnt say that it wont come ;)

On another thread (the Multi-channel FLAC thread) he basically told me that they had no interest in doing it and then he said that it would be impossible to do.

Even though HDi already has it on their firmware so it is possible.

My feelings and opinions are that the Syabas developers have no clue how HDi was able to add multi-channel flac to their firmware and they just can't duplicate the feature. The older machines are almost identical in hardware. The new machines should be identical so it is a developer (firmware) issue and not a hardware issue.

he said that it is impossible on the A Series, think about it specially on ram side there is an big difference between HDI and the NMT, also dont forget that Syabas uses older libs (2007), where HDI first jumps up as the libs where already stable and that was late 2008.

The fact that the c-200 has 4x the ram and a much better processor means that it could very well be possible to do multi channel FLAC. As stated previously, it was more of a hardware contraint than anything for them to not support it on the A series.

Syabas and everyone working on the c-200 has been very busy with the GUI and blu-ray support. They have stated that they just want to get what they have announced out as fast and as fully functioning as possible without adding or implementing new features. Im sure when the device comes out, and they have time to implement new features, such as the flash UI and database media sorting (which they have announced they are working on after the release), they will work on multi channel FLAC since that has been pretty much their biggest request that has not been filled.

Yes, it does suck that its not a release feature, but I dont doubt that it'll be a feature in due time. Once people start flocking the request section with multi channel FLAC for the c-200 they will know how many people want it. I suggest all of you who want it express yourselves when the device comes out, because werners excuse is that its not a high priority because not enough people want it.

Hello Valued Customer,

We are pleased to inform you that we will be launching C-200 for public order on 27th August 2009 (12:00am PST).
Please visit http://www.popcornhour.com on 27th August 2009 (12:00am PST) onwards to begin the ordering process.
Your credit card will only be charged when the product is available and ready for shipping.
We estimate that the upcoming batch will be available around 3rd of September 2009.
Depending on which batch your order falls into, your credit card will be charged accordingly.

If i add an internal HD and an internal BDread/DVDwriter drive to the C200, will i be able to copy video files from the HD to the DVD and viceversa?

If i add an internal HD and an internal BDread/DVDwriter drive to the C200, will i be able to copy video files from the HD to the DVD and viceversa?

Mike -

The answer is no. The C200 is a Bluray player and a media streamer. It is not a ripper or recorder. The same question was asked on the NMT forums and that was the answer.

Laters,
Jeff

Will this play blu ray iso's?

JD -

Again from the NMT forums (ya all really should go there if you want the most up to date information) yes but they will not show a video of it (illegal in the country of the mod who is posting all the vids) nor will it ever be an advertised feature or in the official specs. I believe that this is to keep the "powers that be" from looking to closely at the C200 streaming capabilities. Their official response is along the lines of the blu ray chip does not really know if the storage device is the blu-ray drive, the HDD, or some other mount point. Read into that what you will.

Until we get some of the C200's in the hands of users perhaps this feature should be in the very possible but needs to be tested category.

Laters,
Jeff

Looking to start storing my dvds to hard drive for playback. As far as I understand PS3 can do this. I have a PS3. Is there any reason I should get this and use it over the PS3? What advantages does it have over the PS3? Just wondering if its worth the investment or if I should stick with what I have.

Will anybody be getting a custom Middle Atlantic Faceplate made for the C-200?

What advantages does it have over the PS3? Just wondering if its worth the investment or if I should stick with what I have

About 1/10th the power consumption.

Better expandability , the more open nature of the device means there's a community willing to invest their time in adding features above and beyond what the manufacturer releases.

Greater audio/video codec and container support

Playback from .iso

IR remote support out of the box

I own a PS3, but have pre-ordered the C-200. Mainly because I'm an AVS geek and want soemthign to tinker with, not because I think it'll inherently make my media consumption experience that much greater.

About 1/10th the power consumption.

Better expandability , the more open nature of the device means there's a community willing to invest their time in adding features above and beyond what the manufacturer releases.

Greater audio/video codec and container support

Playback from .iso

IR remote support out of the box

I own a PS3, but have pre-ordered the C-200. Mainly because I'm an AVS geek and want soemthign to tinker with, not because I think it'll inherently make my media consumption experience that much greater.


I think that is what will cause me to purchase the C200 as well.

Will anybody be getting a custom Middle Atlantic Faceplate made for the C-200?

Not right away, but I probably will once I finally get around to trimming out my rack.

CJ

IR remote support out of the box



the a-100 and a-110 have IR remote support out of the box, but the c-200 does not. you will need to purchase the $12 IR eye when you buy it, because it has an RF remote. They said they were only charging cost when selling it, but since it includes an IR remote, its $12. Kind of a stupid decision, since the only people who are buying the IR eye are the ones with a universal remote.

logitech harmony RF remotes or any other universal RF remotes will not work with the c-200's RF.

Thanks for the update on the IR sensor. I thought it was included, although not used.

Looks like pre-orders start today. Check this Engadget link (http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/26/popcorn-hour-c-200-launch-nearly-upon-us-preorders-start-tomorr/#continued) for interface videos if you haven't seen them already.

Google Order #5588511116065xxx

Pre-ordered mine today too. There was quite a response and the site was down when I tried at 3:00am. It's back up now.

CJ

Yeah I got my order in at about 7:30AM EST. Hopefully I'm not too far down the list.

Yeah I got my order in at about 7:30AM EST. Hopefully I'm not too far down the list.

Same for me...around 730a EST (after trying from 3-4a, 5a, 530a, 7a :o). The question is was the site down, and these later times represent the first of the orders, or were some people able to get through since the announced Midnight PST time?

CD

For me it did not work from about 7-7:15am. Worked about 7:20am.

Any suggestions for an internal drive and BD-ROM? I'm probably going to get a WD Scorpio 320 Blue and a LITE-ON iHOS104-08, but (since I'm guessing we're going to see a little debugging when the first batch arrives) I'd like to match whatever hardware is most commonly being used.

I had a 6:30AM meeting this morning so I couldn't afford to mess around with staying up last night. It was just my dumb luck that the site went down for most :D

BTW Werner is saying over at the NMT forum that as of 8:30AM or so everyone is still in the first batch, so it looks like we're good to go :)

i had a 6:30am meeting this morning so i couldn't afford to mess around with staying up last night. It was just my dumb luck that the site went down for most :d

btw werner is saying over at the nmt forum that as of 8:30am or so everyone is still in the first batch, so it looks like we're good to go :)

HUZZAH!!! :D We get to catch all the slings and arrows.

CD

Impressive device :)

HUZZAH!!! :D We get to catch all the slings and arrows.

CD

heh, yeah there are some people over there who aren't too pleased with the server issues; me, I couldn't be happier about it. I stumble into work, hit "Buy" and checkout oblivious to any issues. Apparently there were many people who didn't get their order in till way after me because the site was cached or something. Anyhow I think they may still be on the first batch. Must have made a shitload of them for the first orders.

I'm still working on my room so I don't need it right now but I'm really looking forward to the first test results.

CDLehner,

Really lookin forward to your review on the c-200.. I been waiting to here some peoples reviews on the c-200 so I can decide if the 110 or the 200 is best for me.

Is there any versions that might be released that will rip the dvd/bd's straight from the pch, like how a kaliedascape does? or will we have to continue ripping from our PC's?

I tried looking for what HDD and wi-fi cards might be good but it seems nobody knows much of anything. They are saying wait until people have the player and post what works well in the wiki.

Any SATA or USB connected HDD should work fine.

how much is the unit thanks?

Is it that hard to go to popcornhour.com and find out?

Any SATA or USB connected HDD should work fine.

Unless they don't. That's why they keep compatibility lists.

how much is the unit thanks?

Here you go (http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Popcorn+Hour+store&l=1).

I'm a huge fan of my a-100. Nothing but positive experiences with it. That said, I really think that the c-200 pricing is too high. It is certainly a very capable machine, but there is alot more competition at the $299 price range. Add in the fact that it could cost over $100 more for all of the features you may want ($12 if you use an IR universal remote, ~$30 for wifi, ~$60 for bluray) means that it doesn't compare as favorably to other products.

It could just be me, but one of the primary reasons I bought the a-100 was b/c it was priced well for the features it offered ($179.99). I just don't see that with the c-200.

Add in the fact that it could cost over $100 more for all of the features you may want ($12 if you use an IR universal remote, ~$30 for wifi, ~$60 for bluray) means that it doesn't compare as favorably to other products.


That trick it out part is the best thing about it. Make as little or much out of it that you want. The faster processor and Blu-ray iso is what sold me though. I'm hoping switch sources is a lot faster now. I agree the price is creeping up though.

That trick it out part is the best thing about it. Make as little or much out of it that you want. The faster processor and Blu-ray iso is what sold me though. I'm hoping switch sources is a lot faster now. I agree the price is creeping up though.


Very true, the hardware customization capabilities are something that you won't see in many major CE manufacturer products. And no doubt the increased processor speed will help with the speed of the interface.


I do wish PCH luck with the new product, but it just doesn't appear to be for me. I would love to see a smaller & cheaper streaming only device though. That would be something I would pick up quickly.

I would love to see a smaller & cheaper streaming only device though. That would be something I would pick up quickly.

Refurbished Popcorn Hour A-100
Popcorn Hour A-100 allows you to pull in digital video, audio and photos from various sources for your enjoyment on your HDTV or Home Theater setup.

You can stream or playback your digital media content from a variety of sources, such as your PC, NAS, digital camera, USB mass storage devices (Flash drive, HDD, DVD drive) , internal HDD (HDD not included) and even directly from the Internet via the Media Service Portal.
> Learn More

Unit Price : USD 99.00

Quantity : 12345

Is there any versions that might be released that will rip the dvd/bd's straight from the pch, like how a kaliedascape does? or will we have to continue ripping from our PC's?

I'm not CD, but I hope that an answer from me would work as well :)

They will never release a version that allows you to rip a dvd or BR directly to the drive while they are based in the UK (or the US or similar areas) as it is against the law in that country.

CJ

I tried looking for what HDD and wi-fi cards might be good but it seems nobody knows much of anything. They are saying wait until people have the player and post what works well in the wiki.

I think that it would be safe to assume that the hard drives on the compatibility list as working well for the A-100 and A-110/B-110 would work well for the C-200 as well. I also read that they are going to release their own list of what BluRay drives work well with the C-200.

CJ

And the PCI wireless adapters. I'm not assuming anything until I see it hit the lists though.

Refurbished Popcorn Hour A-100
Popcorn Hour A-100 allows you to pull in digital video, audio and photos from various sources for your enjoyment on your HDTV or Home Theater setup.

You can stream or playback your digital media content from a variety of sources, such as your PC, NAS, digital camera, USB mass storage devices (Flash drive, HDD, DVD drive) , internal HDD (HDD not included) and even directly from the Internet via the Media Service Portal.
> Learn More

Unit Price : USD 99.00

Quantity : 12345


I know, I already have a couple of a-100s. But you don't get the faster processor & bluray ISO support. Plus it appears as if firmware development has pretty much stopped on those series of units. An a-200 would be nice though :)

I know, I already have a couple of a-100s. But you don't get the faster processor & bluray ISO support.

Oh you want that and cheaper too. Good luck with that.

I can't believe you have to pay more to get infrared sensor.

$300 + $40 shipping + taxes is already a lot.

Radio-frequence remote? what? You'll have to glue the infrared sensor on the side of the unit?

So this will stream dvd and bluray iso's from a PC?

So this will stream dvd and bluray iso's from a PC?

Yes, it will.

Originally Posted by Fiasco View Post
So this will stream dvd and bluray iso's from a PC?
Yes, it will.

Source/ link, pls?

Originally Posted by Fiasco View Post
So this will stream dvd and bluray iso's from a PC?


Source/ link, pls?

It's not something Syabas can confirm for legal reasons. So there is no concrete proof that it will work. You'll have to wait for the first batch to be delivered before there will be widespread confirmation. I have a BD image waiting on my drive for just this purpose.

Can you remotely control this unit via RS232 or Ethernet? (for automation purposes)

It's not something Syabas can confirm for legal reasons. So there is no concrete proof that it will work. You'll have to wait for the first batch to be delivered before there will be widespread confirmation. I have a BD image waiting on my drive for just this purpose.

Yes there is:
http://www.networkedmediatank.com/showthread.php?tid=26760&pid=234762#pid234762

CJ

Can you remotely control this unit via RS232 or Ethernet? (for automation purposes)

You can via Ethernet. There is no RS232 control (directly), though you could use something like a Xantech RS232A to take in the serial commands and translate them into IR.

CJ

Yes there is:
http://www.networkedmediatank.com/showthread.php?tid=26760&pid=234762#pid234762

CJ

NICE!! :D

I had not read that yet.

You can via Ethernet. There is no RS232 control (directly), though you could use something like a Xantech RS232A to take in the serial commands and translate them into IR.

CJ

Have they published com protocols for the device? I'm interested in integration using a central server running eventghost.

I'd prefer to avoid IR if possible.

Kinda new to this.
I was under the impression that the max file size is 4GB.
Does that mean a bluray iso would need to be broken up into mulitple files?

Kinda new to this.
I was under the impression that the max file size is 4GB.
Does that mean a bluray iso would need to be broken up into mulitple files?
No. I suppose that you are talking about Fat32 format drives.

Doh, you're right. I had that number in my head as the max for the oppo bdp-83, which requires Fat32 format. Nevermind...

So this will stream dvd and bluray iso's from a PC?

It's not something Syabas can confirm for legal reasons. So there is no concrete proof that it will work. You'll have to wait for the first batch to be delivered before there will be widespread confirmation. I have a BD image waiting on my drive for just this purpose.

Yes there is:
http://www.networkedmediatank.com/showthread.php?tid=26760&pid=234762#pid234762

CJ

I don't see where that post says that it will, or any post in that thread or any post anywhere.

I don't see where that post says that it will, or any post in that thread or any post anywhere.

http://www.networkedmediatank.com/showthread.php?tid=26760&pid=234768#pid234768

I have played a BD folder and BD ISO over a network. Der Untergang and Something About Mary worked fine.

Will anybody be getting a custom Middle Atlantic Faceplate made for the C-200?

Not sure it would need to be custom, but I can look into it to see if one already will work...I have quite a few in the garage of all sorts of sizes, why do you suppose it would need a custom?

Cheers,

Requis

It's 9/1 and still haven't received any notice from PH. Anybody know when they start to send out the pre-orders?

It's 9/1 and still haven't received any notice from PH. Anybody know when they start to send out the pre-orders?

Supposedly the 4th. I read that somewhere, if I run across it again I'll send you a link.

Edit* **** man :( make that the 9th. :( :(
http://www.networkedmediatank.com/showthread.php?tid=26992

quick question - other than anydvd hd what software is the preferred application to backup a blu ray disk to an .iso file? If there is a link that goes through the process that would be super de duper..:)

I don't honestly know this forum's stance on linking people to instructions on copy protected BD. So I'll tell you that from what I read AnyDVD HD is the preferred software and if you want a step by step you can probably find that by browsing videohelp.com. Now I need to go read forum rules again. Some places really freak over this stuff. :O

Good grief, the day they make one of these for a CPU-challenged guy like me they'll sell em' like hotcakes.

Many know my deal: I've been back and forth between a Media Player and BD changer for months now. The reality is I WANT a MP. I realize it's the future and a changer, while a beautiful, idiot-proof, plug n play device to someone like me, is a bit dated at this point.

So, enter the C-200. When I heard it would incorporate a BD drive, I thought many of my issues/apprehensions were resolved! I thought: "great, now I can simply utilize this internal drive to rip my existing BD's to the internal/external HDD and be done."

Well, no. Of course not.

Now, here I am. Again. I have a laptop that PLAYS BD's, does that mean I can rip them to an uncompressed file that the C-200 can play? Yes, correct? And this process is pretty straightforward, I'm assuming? I'm not buying a new laptop to rip BD's to files this thing can playback.

Then, once these are on an external HDD, all I need to do is plug it into the C-200 and I'm pretty much good to go?

Well, after of course I install a GUI (I haven't read anything about one coming pre-installed) on the C-200.

And then, I know I'll need multiple HDD's back things up. I hope integrating all of them and backing them up is not over my head.

And now, can I have ALL of the contents of the BD I paid for, with properly functioning FF, RW, and PAUSE functionality? I'm hoping so.

I will mostly likely purchase this device, so please take it easy on me. My fear is though that after I buy it, the IR remote receiver, the external HDD's I'm going to need for 300 BD's, and everything else, I'm going to have spent a considerable amount of money on something I cannot manipulate to its potential.

I can follow instructions and want to make this work. I'd appreciate someone putting my mind at ease.

It's much of the above that still has me timid.


James

That's all correct. It does come with a GUI but you may want to install a better one from the user development community.

Supposedly the 4th. I read that somewhere, if I run across it again I'll send you a link.

Edit* **** man :( make that the 9th. :( :(
http://www.networkedmediatank.com/showthread.php?tid=26992

The way I read it some will be moved to the 9th.

Yeah, you can rip your Blu-rays 1:1 and play them on your C200 with menus and all. What I wasn't sure of was whether you could do this over a network as an iso file or if they had to be local to the C200. Well as it turns out it works either way.

The drawback is putting all your BDs on a hard disk. These things are upwards of 25GB and I'm pretty sure there are a few BD50s out in the wild so that's a huge amount of space. What many people do is extract the video stream with the audio and sub tracks they want and get rid of the fluff so that they can reduce the file size. The C200 works with these smaller files (and the video/audio quality isn't sacrificed), but you lose the menu functionality.

Anyhow, once you have the files on your HDD you are pretty much good to go. If you have the files in the raw m2ts format, you don't even have to have any of the media jukebox or BD playing apps installed on your C200 (if I'm not mistaken) but in order to play 1:1 BD .ISO files or to play original disks from a BD drive internal to the C200 you have to have the BD software installed on the C200 which requires a HDD of some sort installed to the C200. You can easily create the images from the laptop you already own.

Keep in mind this is all from reading what people have said over at network media tank, which are the developers and users of the C200 so far. What I've stated may not be 100% accurate but what I do know is that you absolutely can do what you've stated you want to do with the C200 my facts just may be a little off.

Here is a link to the FAQ (http://www.networkedmediatank.com/showthread.php?tid=23797)

There are really helpful people on that site and I'm sure that with a little help you'll be able to do all the things you want to do and then some.

The way I read it some will be moved to the 9th.

Yeah well I'm more a doom and gloom guy myself so I have full confidence that if any are moved to the 9th mine will be in that lot :lol:

What I wasn't sure of was whether you could do this over a network as an iso file or if they had to be local to the C200. Well as it turns out it works either way.


I still would not be certain of that because it depends on the quality of the network too. Just because someone has done it on one wired network does not mean it will work on a different one without issues.

Yeah well I'm more a doom and gloom guy myself so I have full confidence that if any are moved to the 9th mine will be in that lot :lol:

I got my order in 7:20am the first day if that makes a difference. Ordering was supposed to come up well before that but I don't think it did.

...but in order to play 1:1 BD .ISO files or to play original disks from a BD drive internal to the C200 you have to have the BD software installed on the C200 which requires a HDD of some sort installed to the C200.

Or a USB/flash drive..

CJ

first, thanks for entertaining this conversation. I realize that most here are more advanced than folks like me, but seeing this thread is dedicated to this product, I think assistance to those interested in its purchase is worthwhile.

My biggest fears lie in not being able to properly rip my blu rays and duplicate their playback functionality with the C-200. It appears after some research that ANYDVD seems to be popular for this? Now, seeing these are rather large fiels (25+ GIGS) can I rip these onto my external HDD immediately, or do I have to rip them to my CPU's HDD and then transfer them to my external (yep, I'm that green)?

And these ISO's, can ANYDVD extract these as well as keep them all together with these m2ts files?

I'm going to head over to the NMT site and see what I can learn there.

My new "fear" is the amount of time I'm reading that it takes to rip a blu-ray.

insane!!!?

James

Yes rip either files or ISO to an external with Anydvd HD. Time varies with the quality of your PC.

Investigating my cost:

1. C-200 with IR: $350ish
2. Storage, at 25 BD's per TB: 12 TB's: $1200

Ouch!

I'm wondering if I should actually get a changer AND a C-200 to play my non-BD (internet) files?

Damn this is so tough for me!

Does anyone here with 2-300 blu rays actually have their entire library ripped to HDD? Seems like it could take an eternity to accomplish?

James

You own the Blu-rays, so why bother with the 1:1 rips? If I were you I'd look at ripping just the streams you want to get you down in more the 10GB per BD range, netting you more like 99 BDs per TB. Remember, if there is some special feature from the disk you really want to see you can always just pop it in the drive :)

Not sure I have seen any 10GB main movie .m2ts files.

me neither. mine are all 18G-40G.... The average is 28G and creeping up.... most of the newer releases are using all the space on the disc.....

Sean

thanks guys. I thought I had researched this extensively, and most seem to agree that to effectively duplicate blu ray quality you're dealing with 25-30 GIG per-film averages. Again, I'm considering the time, space, and money to buy 12 HDD's!
crikey!

James

wow!! I was basing that on a 1080p .mkv file, jeesh :S craziness.

wow!! I was basing that on a 1080p .mkv file, jeesh :S craziness.


ok, I'll play. What does that mean to a MP-noob like me?

If that means that this is some type of compressed file that is inferior to BD-quality playback, then I'm not interested.

And if it's not, why wouldn't rather well-versed gentlemen like the ones above be utilizing these much smaller files?

James

Well I guess for a good quality encode with .mkv you'd really be looking at more like 14-15GB but that should be good enough to get you a 15mb/s and at a bitrate like that you're not going to be seeing much if any difference from the source. This is of course for a good 1080p encode.

Sorry if I was misleading before as I know a raw m2ts file is going to be huge, but going with mkv you can at least double the number of films on a 1TB drive and not notice a difference. I watch my files on a 100" screen and on some 720p files I can see artifacting but on larger 1080p files I've not been able to see any at all.

Edit* I've never watched an uncompressed m2ts file NOT on an original disk. I plan to mess with this stuff extensively once I have the C200 in my hands.