I asked what would be done about 24 fps content and they said that they were in committee and the Hollywood representatives were pushing for 144 hz triple flash accommodation within the format.They might have been referring to the Panasonic 3D displays since from what I have read the 3D Blu-ray player would send the 1080p24 3D video signal and it would be up to the display on how it is shown.

Richard that would be fantastic, how sure are you of that? The 103" plasma was definitely doing some 2/3 pullup to 120hz on UP and Grand Canyon.

Richard that would be fantastic, how sure are you of that?Well in terms of the 3D Blu-ray player I have seen that shown in a Panasonic document (http://www.nabanet.com/nabaweb/documents/agms/2009/P1_PFannon.pdf), Keith has mentioned the 3D formats supported by Blu-ray (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=17184547&postcount=196), and based on the mandatory 3D formats for HDMI 1.4 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=17191732&postcount=600). As for whether Panasonic is thinking of adding 144 Hz support to their 3D displays that depends on whether what they said was even partly accurate.

Panasonic announces UK 3D Blu-ray roadshow, full tour dates revealed

http://www.homecinemachoice.com/blogs/team+hcc/panasonic+announces+uk+3d+blu+ray+roadshow+full+tour+dates+r evealed+02+10+09

Panasonic's 3-D HDTV Among CEATEC Highlights

Panasonic's prototype 50-inch 1080p 3-D plasma display, which uses active shutter glasses that enable the viewing of theater-quality images, is set to reach the market next year. No pricing information was offered, but during a press seminar on the technology, Panasonic executives said it would be tagged for a consumer audience. Possible screen sizes have not been decided upon as yet.

The company noted that its new high-speed 3-D drive technology, which Panasonic claims enables rapid illumination of pixels while maintaining brightness, uses crosstalk reduction technology to minimize double-images that occur when left- and right-eye images are alternately displayed.

Panasonic highlighted its work with Hollywood studious to develop its FullHD 3-D technology, which it said works best with plasma displays.

The company noted that unlike analog TV or HDTV, broadcasters will not play a key role in introducing the new format. A 3-D-capable Blu-ray Disc drive, also set for next year and also without a suggested retail as yet, will play the premier role in introducing 3-D.

http://www.twice.com/article/356914-Panasonic_s_3_D_HDTV_Among_CEATEC_Highlights.php

here is a picture of the 3D BD player along with the shutter glasses that Panasonic is using for their 3D demos:

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x66/LeeAStewart/panasonic_3d_08.jpg

here is a picture of the 3D BD player along with the shutter glasses that Panasonic is using for their 3D demos:

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x66/LeeAStewart/panasonic_3d_08.jpg

The glasses in this article look much cooler...
http://www.electronichouse.com/article/panasonic_aims_for_3d_tv_dominance/D1/

But the red ones look like they could take a beating, great for families with small children.

They look very much like the ones Xpand Cinema uses:

http://www.xpandcinema.com/products/glasses/

here is a picture of the 3D BD player along with the shutter glasses that Panasonic is using for their 3D demos:

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x66/LeeAStewart/panasonic_3d_08.jpg

You really should really credit or link the source of images you get off the internet if you are going to repost them.

http://www.engadgethd.com/2009/09/11/panasonic-full-hd-3d-experience-eyes-on/

They look very much like the ones Xpand Cinema uses:

http://www.xpandcinema.com/products/glasses/

That is because they are XpanD glasses.
http://www.xpandcinema.com/news/23/

Is the max bitrate for 3D going to be exactly the same as on current 2D players? For compability with current players I suppose it has to (ie. spin the disc at the same speed), but for the same quality isn't 3D FULL HD going to need more max bitrate than current players?

Possibility;
3D BD in 2D playback on current machines extracting 24fps @ 1x speed.?
3D BD in 3D playback on future 3D machines extracts 48fps @ 2x speed.?

"Somewhat similar" to the DVD redlaser 1080p HD format; 3x speed ROM, from standard DVD discs for playback on HDDVD machines that had "varispeed" drives.

Is the max bitrate for 3D going to be exactly the same as on current 2D players? For compability with current players I suppose it has to (ie. spin the disc at the same speed), but for the same quality isn't 3D FULL HD going to need more max bitrate than current players?

I doubt this will be a problem, but you might have a point. I don't think any current movies come anywhere close to hitting the 40Mbps limit. So there should be plenty of room for 3D, which only uses about 30% more bits than 2D since only the difference of the second frame is stored.

I doubt this will be a problem, but you might have a point. I don't think any current movies come anywhere close to hitting the 40Mbps limit. So there should be plenty of room for 3D, which only uses about 30% more bits than 2D since only the difference of the second frame is stored.

Actually - it's 50%

The second channel stores only the data different from channel one, holding the increase in data volume to about 1.5 times

http://techon.nikkeibp.co.jp/article/HONSHI/20081030/160508/

I doubt this will be a problem, but you might have a point. I don't think any current movies come anywhere close to hitting the 40Mbps limit. So there should be plenty of room for 3D, which only uses about 30% more bits than 2D since only the difference of the second frame is stored.
Look at the video specification thread
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1155731&page=19

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1155731

The maximum video bitrates go over 40 (see the 1 second window graph).
Many titles have average video bitrates over 20 (one I saw is at avg 40).

I'm sure earlier in the thread people said that encoding a second stream (for the difference between the left & the right) would take an average of 50% more bitrate, but that the peak video bitrate needed would be double.

So to maintain the same quality surely you'd need on average 50% more bitrate, but also allow the maximum video bitrate to go up to something like 80 mbit/sec (double the current max video bitrate).

Look at the video specification thread
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1155731&page=19

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1155731

The maximum video bitrates go over 40 (see the 1 second window graph).
Many titles have average video bitrates over 20 (one I saw is at avg 40).

I'm sure earlier in the thread people said that encoding a second stream (for the difference between the left & the right) would take an average of 50% more bitrate, but that the peak video bitrate needed would be double.

So to maintain the same quality surely you'd need on average 50% more bitrate, but also allow the maximum video bitrate to go up to something like 80 mbit/sec (double the current max video bitrate).

Standard Technology

And, in fact, the technologies proposed by Panasonic for 3D imagery storage, transfer, etc, all utilize existing standard technology. Image encoding uses the two-channel encoding function implemented in Moving Picture Coding Experts Group Phase 4 Advanced Video Coding (MPEG-4 AVC) H.264. The second channel stores only the data different from channel one, holding the increase in data volume to about 1.5 times. The HDMI standard is used to transfer data from the player to the television, with left- and right-eye images alternated in single-field (single-frame) units. “All we have to do is define a flag to identify image data, equipment and other elements supporting 3D imagery. We really don’t need any other major changes,” explained Hiroshi Miyai, director, High Quality AV Development Center of Panasonic.

from my link above

So they admit that 3D will require 50% more data on average, they don't say whether or not it will require 100% more max data (peak data rate), and they're not going to make any changes to increase the data rates, therefore picture quality for 3D releases, including the 2D version which will just be stream 1, will be lower on average than current titles.

So they admit that 3D will require 50% more data on average, they don't say whether or not it will require 100% more max data (peak data rate), and they're not going to make any changes to increase the data rates, therefore picture quality for 3D releases, including the 2D version which will just be stream 1, will be lower on average than current titles.

That addmission has been well known for quite some time. ;)

And the PQ of the 2D extraction will not be crippled at all. it will be 1080x24P at the normal bite rate used for BD.

That addmission has been well known for quite some time. ;)

And the PQ of the 2D extraction will not be crippled at all. it will be 1080x24P at the normal bite rate used for BD.

Plus, the encoders get better with time. I'd bet a film encoded a year and a half ago could have a substantially lower bitrate with the same PQ today. Based on the numbers, a film with a 25Mbp/s average bitrate in 3D could fit on a single BD50. Put extras and the "Digital-Copy" on a separate disc.

Actually - it's 50%

http://techon.nikkeibp.co.jp/article/HONSHI/20081030/160508/

Great article, thanks.

HELLO everyone

Any news on the standard?

HELLO everyone

Any news on the standard?

Welcome CB666,

I'm not sure what the exact January dates for the 2010 CES are but we should be hearing something around the end of this month and actually seeing hardware sometime in January. I take it you are a 3D fan? There sure is a lot of bitterness from some on this topic but I look forward to getting a 3D set myself. I like the technology very much.

Panasonic wins then, based on announcement today on the BD 3D spec being finalized.

I am glad for this, as the Panasonic demos I saw were stunning.

I've been trying to find out the schedule for Panasonics truck tour. Anyone have that info?

I've been trying to find out the schedule for Panasonics truck tour. Anyone have that info?

The tour is currently underway - sort of. They have not published the official stops yet. It is supposed to run until March 2010. I suspect they will announce the stops at CES in 3 weeks.