I am a simple guy who HAD regular cable coming out my wall, split,one half into a cable box into my tv and one split into a DVD recorder and on into another input on my tv. I recorded my 8 programs a week and though this may have been VCR-like tech...I was quite happy.

Well rcn has decided every tv will now need a cable box (hmmm just a month a go they told me that would not be the case...) thus so will my dvd recorder....if I really want ti use it and NOT rent a dvr for $15 a month!

1) Is there a way I can still use my dvd recorder w/out having to have a second box? If I need a second box, must I set it the channel I want to record and leave the box on before I leave for work in the morning...of course after setting my recorder to record channel 4 at some predetermined time. Is there a way to hook this up>

2) The cable company said ALL tvs will need the box because they are getting away from analog signals bla bla bla. I said I thought they had 3 years to do that. They said I'd be in the same boat 3 years from now. I said I might have newer tvs with that new tuner that pics up those digital stations w/out a box. They say they are scrambling EVERYTHING so buy a tv without a tuner. Good grief! The JUNKY new boxes they installed on each tv in my house do not turn on/off the tv nor do their remotes do it well. You have to remember to turn BOTH on or off. Well, I am finding the kids shut the box but leave the darn tv on all the time...they forget because the screen goes black when they cable box is off. RCN says to teach them to just shut the tv and leave the cable box on all the time. The tech said it just an LED and won't cost anything to operate. Well these little 6 X6 clam shell like boxes get awefully warm even when off so something is going on in there. Is it true they coast near nothing if just left on with thetv off?

Thanks!!!

Monsieur LaPlume - Sorry to say but this is the way the industry is going. Most cable companies will keep a few analog channels, most likely on the lowest level of basic service, and in that respect they'll be the only providers that do so (as opposed to FIOS and Satellite which have always required boxes). The bandwidth they can use by getting rid of analog is just too valuable. No way around it, the future/present is digital - believe it or not it's a move they have to make to keep up with FIOS and Satellite so don't take it personally.

So two things. First, you can hang on to your analog setup until the bitter end. Though they say you need boxes now, they want to get you on board with digital ASAP so the changeover may indeed not happen for a couple of years. The risk you run is missing a couple of programs if they do switch over sooner than you realize.

Second, if you do have to get boxes, in spite of the annoyance of the extra cost, the cable DVR is really the way to go if you record regularly. It makes life a lot easier (not that you won't experience the occasional bug) particularly if you want to burn anything to disc.

no way to use my dvd recorder then eh?

Which DVD recorder is it?

No, the signal will be encrypted. However if you do record to DVR, you can then record from its output to your own recorder (if you're interested in saving the program).

You can technically do this now with your current cable box. What you have to do is set your box to the channel you want to record, leave it on and set up your DVD recorder to record the appropriate input at the appropriate time. It's a pain in the butt and invites mistakes aplenty - that's why I'd go with the cable DVR in spite of the cost.

I am a simple guy who HAD regular cable coming out my wall, split,one half into a cable box into my tv and one split into a DVD recorder and on into another input on my tv. I recorded my 8 programs a week and though this may have been VCR-like tech...I was quite happy.

Well rcn has decided every tv will now need a cable box (hmmm just a month a go they told me that would not be the case...) thus so will my dvd recorder....if I really want ti use it and NOT rent a dvr for $15 a month!

1) Is there a way I can still use my dvd recorder w/out having to have a second box? If I need a second box, must I set it the channel I want to record and leave the box on before I leave for work in the morning...of course after setting my recorder to record channel 4 at some predetermined time. Is there a way to hook this up> . . .

no way to use my dvd recorder then eh?

This depends upon a number of factors, including:

Does you cable box, in addition to the RF output, also have composite and S-Video outputs?

Does your DVD Recorder have a clear QAM (digital cable) tuner? Does your DVD Recorder have an unmodulated RF output that only passes through the signal from the RF input? Or, does your DVD Recorder have a modulated RF output that carries the DVD recorder's own output, the tuned channel, onscreen menus, and outputs the recorded DVD program, etc? Is your DVD Recorder connected to your TV with a composite, component, S-Video or HDMI connection? May your DVD Recorder's RF output be switched between a modulated or unmodulated status? (DVD Recorders and HDD/DVD recorders generally have unmodulated RF outputs. VHS/DVD combo recorders generally have modulated RF outputs or the RF output may be switched between unmodulated to modulated.)

Please provide the make and model name of your DVD Recorder.

This information may allow your situation to be addressed more specifically.

I'll have to get the model number. I rechecked how it was hooked up. I di not use a splitter. Cable went from wall to dvd recorder and the coax out of the recorder to the cable box. It I'd watch the dvd recorder on Input 1. I think I am stuck becaise the cable company will be scambling ALL channels as og 1/1/10.

Is there a way to buy a dvr and use it like a vcr....ie I buy the equipment and need not rent or pay monthly fees?

I am a simple guy who HAD regular cable coming out my wall, split,one half into a cable box into my tv and one split into a DVD recorder and on into another input on my tv. I recorded my 8 programs a week and though this may have been VCR-like tech...I was quite happy.

What are your 8 program recordings? If you are recording programs broadcast on ABC, CBS, Fox & NBC, for example, AND your cableco continues to offer those as analog signals in the channel 2-29ish range the set-up you have come to enjoy should serve your needs. If not, welcome to the club.

Is there a way to buy a dvr and use it like a vcr....ie I buy the equipment and need not rent or pay monthly fees?

For anything encrypted, you will need to rent something to decrypt the channels, be it a cable box, DVR, or a cableCARD. A cableCARD can be inserted into a user owned DVR such as a TiVo or Moxi DVR.

You'll pay a lot for your own DVR. TiVo has a "lifetime (of the DVR)" fee that is $400 on top of whatever box you buy. A Moxi is $800 for box and included service. But you will own it and not pay a monthly fee, other than the cableCARD (typically $2-$5 a month, though it varies.)

The other alternative is to build a Home Theater PC, but again, you need that card. There is no other way to get by the encryption.

You could see if they'll give you one "regular" cable box free. If not, it might be worth renting it, if it either has a built-in timer to change the channels on it, or a sort of "reminder" feature, which basically does the same.

Then, run it into a line input and set the timers on both the recorder and the cable box. Even if you do have to rent it, it should cost considerably less than their DVR.

Also, if your recorder has an "IR blaster", it may be able to change channels on the box with the use of that, and you won't have to worry about setting the programs on the box at all (the DTA's don't have timers, nor can they be controlled by most HDD/DVD recorder's IR blasters).

sounds like I need to suck it up and rent the DVR. My cable company will have EVERYTHING scrambled by 12/31/09. Even if you have a *new* tv with a (QAM) tuner and it currently picks up digital stations w/out a cable box...they said they will become scrambled. In other words, the tv no longer needs a tuner...the cable box is your tuner. I do not like this at all.....I would have thought I could rent an extra box and hook it to a 3rd party DVR that does not not have any monthly fees...guess this if is in!

(hmmm just a month a go they told me that would not be the case...)It probably was not going to be the case, within the scope of information available to CSRs back then. When you call any service provider for support, the folks you're talking to are trained explicitly to support the service provider's current offerings. They are not privy to proprietary strategies and plans which are not yet made public.

(From my time in the service industry, I remember that this was typically the policy for no other reason than it is impossible to keep so many people from blabbing sensitive information like that to competitors prematurely. And also, could they really trust all their customers, some of whom might actually work for competitors, to keep the information secret until they're ready to release it? Gosh no.)

I said I thought they had 3 years to do that.Federal regulations outline two choices: Continue providing all the local over-the-air broadcast channels via analog until at least 2012, OR provide no analog television channels whatsoever -- go truly "all-digital".

Beyond that, the major legacy service providers (Comcast, TWC, Charter, Cox, Cablevision, etc.) promised to choose that first option until at least 2012. RCN made no such promise AFAIK.

They said I'd be in the same boat 3 years from now.You mean with other providers? Maybe; maybe not.

They say they are scrambling EVERYTHING so buy a tv without a [QAM] tuner.That's good advice actually. The inclusion of QAM tuners in televisions, without CableCARD slots, is a bit deceptive on the part of some manufacturers, who highlight the inclusion of a QAM tuner without helping the customer understand that it won't help with encrypted signals, given that the law made it very clear the way of securing access to digital cable television services is via a means of separable security.

RCN says to teach them to just shut the tv and leave the cable box on all the time.This is good advice regarding all cable television host devices, for some reason. I won't comment on the energy issue; the functionality and reliability considerations are overriding.

I would have thought I could rent an extra box and hook it to a 3rd party DVR that does not not have any monthly fees...Did you even bother to read my post right above yours?

It tells you exactly how you may be able to do this.

Please tell us what model recorder you have, at least, if you want us to be able to help you.

My cable company will have EVERYTHING scrambled by 12/31/09.

That can't be true. According to the FCC, cable companies must pass your local channels (cbs, nbc, etc) "in the clear". The way that they do this is up to them, for the most part - analog, digital, HD, SD, whatever - but they must be there.

All the other channels that you currently receive, usually known as expanded basic, will be encrypted under digital, but some local feed must be present in the clear.

The inclusion of QAM tuners in televisions, without CableCARD slots, is a bit deceptive on the part of some manufacturers, who highlight the inclusion of a QAM tuner without helping the customer understand that it won't help with encrypted signals, given that the law made it very clear the way of securing access to digital cable television services is via a means of separable security.

I have to take exception to this remark. Technically speaking, there's no reason why the switch from analog to digital has to do away with the notion of a "cable ready TV". It's the broadcasters who demand that their digital programming by encrypted, since it's considered "high-value" and easily pirated. Fortunately for them, the average consumer doesn't understand the technology, and assumes that digital just always requires a cable box. That's why the only people who rant about this stuff are those in the know on forums like this.

People are free to purchase whatever kind of TV they want, but saying that giving people the option of basic digital cable ready is deceptive is, in itself, deceptive. It's the content producers that are setting the rules. Of course, the cable companies are willing to play by their rules, since they'll happily rent you as many boxes as you like. But that's a matter for another thread...

I have to take exception to this remark.You're not alone wishing that the laws were different.

sounds like I need to suck it up and rent the DVR. My cable company will have EVERYTHING scrambled by 12/31/09. Even if you have a *new* tv with a (QAM) tuner and it currently picks up digital stations w/out a cable box...they said they will become scrambled. In other words, the tv no longer needs a tuner...the cable box is your tuner. I do not like this at all.....I would have thought I could rent an extra box and hook it to a 3rd party DVR that does not not have any monthly fees...guess this if is in!

We offer advice based upon our own experience, often through trial and error.

Getting you set up is not rocket science. In fact, it may be pretty easy.

We need to know what DVD Recorder you have. The more we know the better we may serve you.

Yeah, just because the cablecos have made it tougher doesn't mean there aren't workarounds. You may have to do things differently, but it wouldn't hurt to try, would it?

since they'll happily rent you as many boxes as you like. But that's a matter for another thread...

or call them up and tell them that FIOS (or, if you don't have FIOS in your area, satelite) is knocking your door down offering FOUR digital cable boxes for the price you're paying for one.

I ended up with two free HD boxes from comcast. AND they started offering two free digital-to-analog converters if you have at least one box with the digital package (this box is like the OTA boxes you could get with the federal coupon). This at least allows me to watch the entire basic digital package (70) channels on my remaining analog sets.

i'll get the dvd recorder model.
Re:
That can't be true. According to the FCC, cable companies must pass your local channels (cbs, nbc, etc) "in the clear". The way that they do this is up to them, for the most part - analog, digital, HD, SD, whatever - but they must be there.

All the other channels that you currently receive, usually known as expanded basic, will be encrypted under digital, but some local feed must be present in the clear.


I will ask RCN about this. If this is true I'll dump the dvr and rehook up my recorder at that point...my recordings are all on ABC/CBS/NBS and FOX.

According to the FCC, cable companies must pass your local channels (cbs, nbc, etc) "in the clear". The way that they do this is up to them, for the most part - analog, digital, HD, SD, whatever - but they must be there.Actually, the cable company must present the one signal that the broadcaster designates.

i'll get the dvd recorder model.

Without knowing the DVD recorder model name this is my advice:

i'll get the dvd recorder model.
Re:
That can't be true. According to the FCC, cable companies must pass your local channels (cbs, nbc, etc) "in the clear". The way that they do this is up to them, for the most part - analog, digital, HD, SD, whatever - but they must be there.

All the other channels that you currently receive, usually known as expanded basic, will be encrypted under digital, but some local feed must be present in the clear.


I will ask RCN about this. If this is true I'll dump the dvr and rehook up my recorder at that point...my recordings are all on ABC/CBS/NBS and FOX.
+1 for me too!

It used to be I did 95% of all my recording from the big 4 nets, now it's more like 99%!? :D

I will ask RCN about this. If this is true I'll dump the dvr and rehook up my recorder at that point...my recordings are all on ABC/CBS/NBS and FOX.

Why not use an antennae ?

i'll get the dvd recorder model.
Re:
That can't be true. According to the FCC, cable companies must pass your local channels (cbs, nbc, etc) "in the clear". The way that they do this is up to them, for the most part - analog, digital, HD, SD, whatever - but they must be there.

All the other channels that you currently receive, usually known as expanded basic, will be encrypted under digital, but some local feed must be present in the clear.


I will ask RCN about this. If this is true I'll dump the dvr and rehook up my recorder at that point...my recordings are all on ABC/CBS/NBS and FOX.

Buy an antenna and a Dish DTVPal DVR for $299.99. It is a dual HD Tuner that copies OTA with no subscription fees. Then if you want to take it the next step you can cancel cable and use that $1,000 a year you were going to spend on cables fees and buy a nice flat panel HDTV with an ATSC tuner in it. Then get a Netflix account for $16.99 where they send you 3 DVDs at a time of your favorite movies or TV shows. I did this last November and I save a ton of money and don't miss cable a bit.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1099071