Hey Guys,

So I made the jump and baught the panasonic 58V10. It arrives next weekend.

HOWEVER, Im starting to second guess my choice as the samsung PN58B850 is an amazing set also...

So the samsung has a better asthetic look (casing) as far as I can see, I like the one glass panel is sports and colors seem bright.

I do know there are many that are complaining about the samsung buzzing. This is whats keeping me away from it for the time being.


On the other hand, I just read some posts claiming that the panasonic has phosphor trail issues... is this true? Also, anyone here not happy with the asthetic look of the 58v10? Anyone struggle with this choice and what did you decide? Anyone switch from one to another etc?

I still have time to change my mind, would appreciate any input... :)

Cheers.

Why would you start this thread? All that will happen is Samsung and Panasonic fanboys will fight it out! There are numerous threads on both displays, including comparisons just like this thread. Here is a summary:
1. Both have great PQ (generally considered tied at 2nd, behind the discontinued Pioneer Elite Kuros, and ahead of all other brands).
2. There are pros and cons of each. Samsung has more accurate colors (although that may no longer be true following the firmware upgrade for THX mode on the V10, if you use THX mode); Panasonic has deeper blacks. I like that Samsung has a swivel base (Panny does not). Panasonic generally has a better reputation for reliability (especially given the buzzing issue with some Samsung plasmas, as you mention) and customer service. The latter is less of an issue if you buy an EW.
In the end, it's your choice and nobody can tell you which is best for you. If you read all the other threads, you'll get a good sense of the pros and cons.

Just get the V10 or an S1. Trust me.. for your own sake.

Just get the V10 or an S1. Trust me.. for your own sake.

LOL do explain :)

Went through 3 different B series Sammys. Three more then I should of.

Same problem for me. Couldn't decide. Went with the sammy. At home it buzzes a bit too much for me. Now I want to exchange for the V10, but after looking at the sets again, the sammy picture quality just seems better to me, sharper mainly. But the buzz pisses me off. Although watching the sammy at times, I seem to forget about the buzz til a quiet scene comes on, then it bugs me again. I wish, they had fixed the buzz issue, it would have been a no brainer then. I cannot express my disappointment for the issues with both sets. But lets see if I can get a V10 in the house and see and hear the difference. Hopefully it will be good enough.

^ I wholeheartedly agree

I guess I would be the most qualified person to answer your question since in the last couple months I've actually owned TWO PN50B850's ONE KDL52Z5100 and ended up settling for the 58V10.

Like someone mentioned above, the samsung and the panny might be the best HD sets out there, the bravia LCD mentioned above was crap!!.

Each set has their pros and cons and I will try to list as many as I can.

Picture quality wise I think that both sets are about the same with HD content, although I think that the sammy was better at displaying SD content (the samsung was a 50" while the panny is a 58" so that might have something to do with it). The samsung seems to have more pop to the color than the panny, so I guess its a matter of taste. Do you want vibrant colors? or something more natural looking.

Navigation through out the menus was very nice on the samsung, the menus on the panny are more simple and austere, tweakability of the sets however I think is very similar on both tv's.

The samsung is very thin, the pannasonic seems to be twice as thick. The sammy's base swivels but makes the tv feel kinda flimsy when you turn it or move it, it feels like its gonna fall or something, the panny on the other hand with its huge, sturdy base feels like its bolted to the ground :D and it doesnt look one bit less classy than the samsung.

One thing I liked about the samsung was the almost invisible buttons on the front, the pannasonic has them on the side which makes it a pain in the ass to access menus when you cant find the remote. On the samsung it's nice that they're on the front but you have to get really close to the set to see which ones you need to press.

The buzzing is VERY REAL!!

I returned my first sammy because it had two huge spots on the screen that were brighter than the rest of the screen, they were visible during dark scenes, kind of like burn in but they were an irregular shape, kind of like someone splashed bleach on a dark wall or something

Got my second set home, and inspected it for blotches and it had none so I was happy, a day later I'm playing FIFA09 and I notice this BUZZ! So I jump online and find out all about it. Go back to best buy to ask one of the reps about it, he says he's never heard anything like that, he takes me to where they have one on display and as soon as we are a couple feet away from the set he says "Oh I see what you're talking about". I had to get closer to notice it.

Took it back to get the bravia, skip forward and I settle for the panny.

One thing that impressed me about the panny is that compared to the samsung this one seems to be impervious to burn in. I remember watching a movie with subtitles on the sammy and within 10 minutes I could see the shades of the subtitles that had been there. With the panny I have never ever seen anything like that, not even after watching two movies in a row.

One more thing would be THX certification, I dont know if that actually makes it better or not, but hey, at least you can brag about it. lol

Forgot to mention that...

The Panny does not buzz at all. Let me rephrase that, the Panny does buzz like ALL TV'S DO, but the buzzing comes from the back and stays there. CRT's buzz too and it stays in the back too. I guess the reason why the sammy's buzz it's because of a design flaw. The TV is so thin that there must be something missing, like sound insulation or something like that, or maybe they soldered a component inside of it backwards, lol, that's why the buzz can be heard on the front of the tv.

I guess I would be the most qualified person to answer your question since in the last couple months I've actually owned TWO PN50B850's ONE KDL52Z5100 and ended up settling for the 58V10.

Like someone mentioned above, the samsung and the panny might be the best HD sets out there, the bravia LCD mentioned above was crap!!.

Each set has their pros and cons and I will try to list as many as I can.

Picture quality wise I think that both sets are about the same with HD content, although I think that the sammy was better at displaying SD content (the samsung was a 50" while the panny is a 58" so that might have something to do with it). The samsung seems to have more pop to the color than the panny, so I guess its a matter of taste. Do you want vibrant colors? or something more natural looking.

Navigation through out the menus was very nice on the samsung, the menus on the panny are more simple and austere, tweakability of the sets however I think is very similar on both tv's.

The samsung is very thin, the pannasonic seems to be twice as thick. The sammy's base swivels but makes the tv feel kinda flimsy when you turn it or move it, it feels like its gonna fall or something, the panny on the other hand with its huge, sturdy base feels like its bolted to the ground :D and it doesnt look one bit less classy than the samsung.

One thing I liked about the samsung was the almost invisible buttons on the front, the pannasonic has them on the side which makes it a pain in the ass to access menus when you cant find the remote. On the samsung it's nice that they're on the front but you have to get really close to the set to see which ones you need to press.

The buzzing is VERY REAL!!

I returned my first sammy because it had two huge spots on the screen that were brighter than the rest of the screen, they were visible during dark scenes, kind of like burn in but they were an irregular shape, kind of like someone splashed bleach on a dark wall or something

Got my second set home, and inspected it for blotches and it had none so I was happy, a day later I'm playing FIFA09 and I notice this BUZZ! So I jump online and find out all about it. Go back to best buy to ask one of the reps about it, he says he's never heard anything like that, he takes me to where they have one on display and as soon as we are a couple feet away from the set he says "Oh I see what you're talking about". I had to get closer to notice it.

Took it back to get the bravia, skip forward and I settle for the panny.

One thing that impressed me about the panny is that compared to the samsung this one seems to be impervious to burn in. I remember watching a movie with subtitles on the sammy and within 10 minutes I could see the shades of the subtitles that had been there. With the panny I have never ever seen anything like that, not even after watching two movies in a row.

One more thing would be THX certification, I dont know if that actually makes it better or not, but hey, at least you can brag about it. lol

Forgot to mention that...

The Panny does not buzz at all. Let me rephrase that, the Panny does buzz like ALL TV'S DO, but the buzzing comes from the back and stays there. CRT's buzz too and it stays in the back too. I guess the reason why the sammy's buzz it's because of a design flaw. The TV is so thin that there must be something missing, like sound insulation or something like that, or maybe they soldered a component inside of it backwards, lol, that's why the buzz can be heard on the front of the tv.

nice writeup. i've gone through 3 sammy's too, but I'm still waiting for my v10 to show up at BB.

I may be off in what I am writing and if so, there will be a legion of people ready to correct me.

I believe that Samsung uses only the sheet of glass that is part of the plasma display. This has the advantage of allowing more color and light through, although their color accuracy in theory should be related to the various circuitry, drive boards, etc. On the negative side, it seems this single pane of glass can, not always, allow certain harmonics from within the set to be heard (bzzzzz). Some sets seem to be worse than others and some people are more prone to hearing or being annoyed by this than others. The other negative of the single pane of glass is reflections. The Samsung seems to be more prone to glare, ambient light and reflection problems and possibly the IR problems. Although, the IR problem would typically be more of a problem with either the panel itself or some of the circuitry.

All Panasonic plasma have two panes of glass. The pane that is part of the display panel and an outer pane. This seems to have a disadvantage of ghosting on certain text or details reflected off of the outer pane. This is normally not seen when viewing from most normal angles but can be spotted when viewing very close or at an extreme angle. I had never noticed this until reading a posts from several users who could not stand this and returned the sets because of it. I went home and could see it on both my three year old Panasonic Plasma as well as my new V10, but only in the extreme circumstances as noted above. This has zero affect on my normal viewing as I sit approximately 15 feet away either directly on or at worst about a 45 degree angle. The other potential problem is the application of the anti-glare coating between the two sheets. Several users reported visible problems with this in earlier posts, but the vast majority have not or can not see it. This was either a very minor quality control problem or one of those artificats that some people are more sensitive to than others. The advantages of the second pane of glass are good to excellent handling of glare, ambient light and reflections. Also, the second pane of glass seems to help Panasonic's circuitry run cooler. My 50" V10 is mounted inside a cabinet and even after watching football for 10-12 hours on a Saturday or Sunday is only marginally warmer than the ambient room temperature to the touch. The second panel of glass also helps reduce the electronic buzz that is present in all displays but has noted more often in plasma sets using only the single pane of glass.

The so called single pane of glass on V10 50" and 54" sets refers to the outer layer which covers the entire front of the set.

I guess I would be the most qualified person to answer your question since in the last couple months I've actually owned TWO PN50B850's ONE KDL52Z5100 and ended up settling for the 58V10.

Like someone mentioned above, the samsung and the panny might be the best HD sets out there, the bravia LCD mentioned above was crap!!.

Each set has their pros and cons and I will try to list as many as I can.

Picture quality wise I think that both sets are about the same with HD content, although I think that the sammy was better at displaying SD content (the samsung was a 50" while the panny is a 58" so that might have something to do with it). The samsung seems to have more pop to the color than the panny, so I guess its a matter of taste. Do you want vibrant colors? or something more natural looking.

Navigation through out the menus was very nice on the samsung, the menus on the panny are more simple and austere, tweakability of the sets however I think is very similar on both tv's.

The samsung is very thin, the pannasonic seems to be twice as thick. The sammy's base swivels but makes the tv feel kinda flimsy when you turn it or move it, it feels like its gonna fall or something, the panny on the other hand with its huge, sturdy base feels like its bolted to the ground :D and it doesnt look one bit less classy than the samsung.

One thing I liked about the samsung was the almost invisible buttons on the front, the pannasonic has them on the side which makes it a pain in the ass to access menus when you cant find the remote. On the samsung it's nice that they're on the front but you have to get really close to the set to see which ones you need to press.

The buzzing is VERY REAL!!

I returned my first sammy because it had two huge spots on the screen that were brighter than the rest of the screen, they were visible during dark scenes, kind of like burn in but they were an irregular shape, kind of like someone splashed bleach on a dark wall or something

Got my second set home, and inspected it for blotches and it had none so I was happy, a day later I'm playing FIFA09 and I notice this BUZZ! So I jump online and find out all about it. Go back to best buy to ask one of the reps about it, he says he's never heard anything like that, he takes me to where they have one on display and as soon as we are a couple feet away from the set he says "Oh I see what you're talking about". I had to get closer to notice it.

Took it back to get the bravia, skip forward and I settle for the panny.

One thing that impressed me about the panny is that compared to the samsung this one seems to be impervious to burn in. I remember watching a movie with subtitles on the sammy and within 10 minutes I could see the shades of the subtitles that had been there. With the panny I have never ever seen anything like that, not even after watching two movies in a row.

One more thing would be THX certification, I dont know if that actually makes it better or not, but hey, at least you can brag about it. lol

Forgot to mention that...

The Panny does not buzz at all. Let me rephrase that, the Panny does buzz like ALL TV'S DO, but the buzzing comes from the back and stays there. CRT's buzz too and it stays in the back too. I guess the reason why the sammy's buzz it's because of a design flaw. The TV is so thin that there must be something missing, like sound insulation or something like that, or maybe they soldered a component inside of it backwards, lol, that's why the buzz can be heard on the front of the tv.

I would agree with most of this review. I own both a Panasonic and Samung and enjoy both. I started only considering the Panasonic and Pioneer for my latest TV and came around to the Samsung -- I had to overcome by personal bias, which competed against my gut appreciation for the look, picture and features of the latest Samsungs. Just a few qualifications:

1) Properly calibrated the Samsung color is as accurate (or slightly more) as the Panasonic, which is very. The calibration reports and shoot offs show this. So while it's true that it "pops" out of the box in vivid mode, it can get very accurate too. Overall most rational people and experts would say the final PQ capacity of both is a wash.

2) You are correct about the Samsung having better SD PQ -- this was one of the major tipping points for me. It has been noted in several of the reviews too. So it wasn't just because you were comparing different sized sets.

3) You mention the swivel stand as a bad thing. To our family this is our favorite feature. On our set it isn't flimsy at all and we take advantage of the ability to tilt the screen multiple times a day. Huge advantage for our room. So this is really a subjective area depending on your setup and typical use patterns.

4) The buzzing is real, for a significant minority of users. So if you want a higher likelihood of a hassle free purchase, go with the Panasonic this year. That said, a majority of people are not reporting a buzz issue. It is not a problem with my set at all, no matter how hard I tried to get it to be in my early testing. Don't believe me -- ask D-Nice; he hung out in front on my set with the volume off for hours. So if you really like the Samsung, just consider getting it from a place with a return policy and odds are you will be fine. That's no guarantee, just statistics.

5) IR varies widely from panel to panel and is not consistent within the same model even. Personally I would agree I have more IT on my Samsung than my Panasonic, though it never has been to a problem level -- i.e. you only saw it if you looked for it and it went away quickly -- and it has become more and more rare as the set has settled in to the point that I haven't seen it at all for over a month.

You won't go wrong with the Panasonic. You may or may not with the Samsung. Several posters above got burned by Samsung. Most of us don't. So if you are neutral, go with the easy call. If you prefer the Samsung overall, take a risk-free shot and see how it goes.

I would agree with most of this review. I own both a Panasonic and Samung and enjoy both. I started only considering the Panasonic and Pioneer for my latest TV and came around to the Samsung -- I had to overcome by personal bias, which competed against my gut appreciation for the look, picture and features of the latest Samsungs. Just a few qualifications:

1) Properly calibrated the Samsung color is as accurate (or slightly more) as the Panasonic, which is very. The calibration reports and shoot offs show this. So while it's true that it "pops" out of the box in vivid mode, it can get very accurate too. Overall most rational people and experts would say the final PQ capacity of both is a wash.

2) You are correct about the Samsung having better SD PQ -- this was one of the major tipping points for me. It has been noted in several of the reviews too. So it wasn't just because you were comparing different sized sets.

3) You mention the swivel stand as a bad thing. To our family this is our favorite feature. On our set it isn't flimsy at all and we take advantage of the ability to tilt the screen multiple times a day. Huge advantage for our room. So this is really a subjective area depending on your setup and typical use patterns.

4) The buzzing is real, for a significant minority of users. So if you want a higher likelihood of a hassle free purchase, go with the Panasonic this year. That said, a majority of people are not reporting a buzz issue. It is not a problem with my set at all, no matter how hard I tried to get it to be in my early testing. Don't believe me -- ask D-Nice; he hung out in front on my set with the volume off for hours. So if you really like the Samsung, just consider getting it from a place with a return policy and odds are you will be fine. That's no guarantee, just statistics.

5) IR varies widely from panel to panel and is not consistent within the same model even. Personally I would agree I have more IT on my Samsung than my Panasonic, though it never has been to a problem level -- i.e. you only saw it if you looked for it and it went away quickly -- and it has become more and more rare as the set has settled in to the point that I haven't seen it at all for over a month.

You won't go wrong with the Panasonic. You may or may not with the Samsung. Several posters above got burned by Samsung. Most of us don't. So if you are neutral, go with the easy call. If you prefer the Samsung overall, take a risk-free shot and see how it goes.


Okay so I have to ask ya... Which did D-Nice prefer? The samsung or the panny? :)

You have to ease up on the hero worship and develop your own brain brother.

Be a leader, not a follower!

Okay so I have to ask ya... Which did D-Nice prefer? The samsung or the panny? :)

In my house he was only working on the Samsung and thought it had a great picture (and the results which I've posted here demonstrate that). That said, I think it is well known he likes the Pioneers and has owned Panasonics personally. Though the Samsung (not the same model as mine) came out slightly better overall in the shoot-out.

I think trying to rank them on picture is futile -- they are so close in overall PQ capacity that it really becomes individual preference. The decision really comes down to some who like the features, looks and price of the Samsungs versus those who like the earned reputation for reliability (not just that it lasts but that it is likely to be free of "issues" like buzzing or bad IR, etc.) and support from the Panasonics. Neither is inherently wrong or better -- just different.

In my house he was only working on the Samsung and thought it had a great picture (and the results which I've posted here demonstrate that). That said, I think it is well known he likes the Pioneers and has owned Panasonics personally. Though the Samsung (not the same model as mine) came out slightly better overall in the shoot-out.

I think trying to rank them on picture is futile -- they are so close in overall PQ capacity that it really becomes individual preference. The decision really comes down to some who like the features, looks and price of the Samsungs versus those who like the earned reputation for reliability (not just that it lasts but that it is likely to be free of "issues" like buzzing or bad IR, etc.) and support from the Panasonics. Neither is inherently wrong or better -- just different.

Fair enough :) Thanks for the info... you've been a big help!
Up to this point, Ive owned 4 panasonics.... i think Im going to stick with the V10 and rack the panny count up to 5. Ive only had issue with one of my panny's and panasonic was great to deal with and resolved the issue for me. It arrives on Sat :)

Okay so I have to ask ya... Which did D-Nice prefer? The samsung or the panny? :)

The Pioneer was the best by quite a bit. The Sammy and Panny were very close, the Sammy coming out slightly better due to better color accuracy. But, the V10 has had a firmware upgrade that improves color accuracy in THX mode (which is what was used in the shoot-out), so all bets are off for a new shoot-out.

The Pioneer was the best by quite a bit. The Sammy and Panny were very close, the Sammy coming out slightly better due to better color accuracy. But, the V10 has had a firmware upgrade that improves color accuracy in THX mode (which is what was used in the shoot-out), so all bets are off for a new shoot-out.

Didn't they just do a new shoot-out? I thought I read that. Didn't study the results...

The Pioneer was the best by quite a bit. The Sammy and Panny were very close, the Sammy coming out slightly better due to better color accuracy. But, the V10 has had a firmware upgrade that improves color accuracy in THX mode (which is what was used in the shoot-out), so all bets are off for a new shoot-out.

So how do you perform the firmware update?

Didn't they just do a new shoot-out? I thought I read that. Didn't study the results...

Supposedly, but their website still only has the original results.

So how do you perform the firmware update?

You can't. Supposedly, all sets being bought now have the upgrade, but there is currently no way to upgrade existing sets.

Thats ridiculous business.Why call it firmware when you cant put it into your set.Its more like an upgrade making later built model better.So wait until just before 2010 models come out to buy a 2009 v10 and you will get the newest upgrade model.

Both tv's have a great picture but the 24p at 96hz is awesome on the Panny... thats the reason I love this tv... the sammy has had issues with that.. also the panny is so realistic and natural looking.. thats why i chose it. there has to be a reason why its sold out everywhre you look

My brother's in-depth research tells him 58V10 is really awesome, but he is also a fan of the new LED LCD from Samsung, both pretty expensive though, later is more expensive.