Depending if the offer plan exceeds comcast's.

Received a letter from Comcast that I'm going to have 3 channels that my family frequently watches, is being moved to the "Digital Starter" package, :mad: I know I should join the 90's and get digital :). I have not needed to get a box in 20 years. Called Comcast to see what my converted costs would be $73/m 1st year $79/m 2nd year.

Want to see if I could get a better deal with directv, to be determined.....HD DVR package ($49.99 base cost)

If I go with directv, how does the Philips 3575 live with this setup ?

What should prepare for being able to do or not with the 3575?

One of the reasons I've been reluctant to switch is I love the capabilities of my 3575. One of the best investments I've done ! In the 2 years I've owned this I can only remember one mess- up HD>DVD conversion (probably my fault ?) I've been very impressed with the picture quality of the Philips Qam tuner.

The 3575 will be hooked up with my HDTV, I do have a DPX-7000, only have used it for VHS to DVD backup (works fine). I plan to have a HD-DVR also involved in this hook-up. Any problems with connecting these components working together ?

Thanks again to Wajo, for the continued support of my Philips !

Steve

DirecTV works great with DVD recorders as far as no copy protection, correct aspect ratio and great picture quality. Use S-video to connect the D* box to the philips and you'll be golden. However, you can forget about using the tuner in the philips anymore unless you hook up an antenna.

I assume you plan to do most or all your recording on the D* DVR and archiving on the philips. Using the philips as your main DVR simply won't work as the D* DVR has no timers or auto-tune function.

DirecTV works great with DVD recorders as far as no copy protection, correct aspect ratio and great picture quality. Use S-video to connect the D* box to the philips and you'll be golden. However, you can forget about using the tuner in the philips anymore unless you hook up an antenna.

I assume you plan to do most or all your recording on the D* DVR and archiving on the philips. Using the philips as your main DVR simply won't work as the D* DVR has no timers or auto-tune function.

Thanks for you help !!

That was my plan, I do enjoy watching TCM and archiving those ol' movies ! I think I remember reading somewhere that dumping recorded stuff on the D* to the philips would be real-time ? Then editing like I do now on the philips. I also do time-shifting as well probably 40% of the time, but I could use the HD DVR for that.

Steve

The DirecTV DVR is superior in every way for timeshifting. There will be little reason to use the Philips except when you want to burn a program to DVD. To do that, you would press play on the DirecTV DVR and then press record on the Philips to record the DVR's s-video output in real-time.

DirecTV's current HR21/HR22/HR23 DVRs do exhibit poor responsiveness (compared to Dish Network and TiVo DVRs), which some people find very frustrating. DirecTV's current DVRs are all based on Broadcom CPUs from 2007, and their latest DVR software really pushes that platform to the limit. DirecTV is expected to release a next-generation DVR with significantly improved performance in early 2010, but that doesn't help you now. DirecTV charges existing customers $199 to add/upgrade to a new DVR.

DirecTV DVRs support external expansion (eSATA), so if/when you go that route, I would budget around $100 for a 1.0-1.5TB drive with 200-300 HD hours of storage. You could even add a 2TB drive for 400+ HD hours of storage. You can store high-definition recordings for many months, even years, before you watch them, as DirecTV places no restrictions on the amount of time you can save a recording.

If it were me in your situation, I would find out whether Comcast uses Motorola equipment in your area. If so, I would ask for whatever digital TV promotion they offer (ex: $33 digital TV service for 6 months) and get their new Motorola DCX3400 DVR with its 320GB hard drive. That would allow you to retain use of the Philips' built-in tuner for local channels, and it would give you a dual-tuner DVR for general purpose use. When the promotion expires, move to DirecTV or FiOS with their next-generation DVR.

Keep in mind that DirecTV requires a two-year commitment with service.

...I remember reading somewhere that dumping recorded stuff on the D* to the philips would be real-time?Correct.

A few things to remember during transfer are to turn off things that could pop up on screen, like caller ID, and to press exit as soon as you start playback in order to hide the progress bar.

Transfers from HD material are very good. However, SD on D* (like TCM) generally sucks. D* compresses the heck out of their SD channels. If TCM is the bulk of your recording, other providers like FIOS, UVerse and possibly even cable will be better. On the other hand, unless you have a fairly large TV you may not notice.

DirecTV's current HR21/HR22/HR23 DVRs do exhibit poor responsiveness (compared to Dish Network and TiVo DVRs), which some people find very frustrating. DirecTV's current DVRs are all based on Broadcom CPUs from 2007, and their latest DVR software really pushes that platform to the limit. DirecTV is expected to release a next-generation DVR with significantly improved performance in early 2010, but that doesn't help you now. DirecTV charges existing customers $199 to add/upgrade to a new DVR.


I just upgraded to D* HD in July so I did a check on a couple of D* forums to see what HD receiver to get.


The D* DVR is an absolute POS. Many people were very vocal about this. 1-2 minute (!) wait when you change channels. MANY people complain they lose everything recorded on the DVR for absolutely no reason.

When I upgraded to HD service I asked the D* installer what he thought. *He* told me to stay away from the DVR's. He convinced me to just get the regular HD receiver.


From what I read, D* tried to stick too many functions into these things before they ironed out the basics.

Hopefully next years models will work correctly. This years models are crap.

I would find out whether Comcast uses Motorola equipment in your area.

bfdtv, When I called to check my costs to move to a digital package. The CSR did say yes on the Motorola box (she did seem confused at times), at the time I was talking just their "Digital Starter" package ($73/m) that included 3 boxes, no DVR ($14/m HD $11/m SD). So cost was becoming a factor , I'm paying $61/m now.

DirecTV DVRs support external expansion (eSATA)
That is a consideration.

Transfers from HD material are very good. However, SD on D* (like TCM) generally sucks. D* compresses the heck out of their SD channels. If TCM is the bulk of your recording, other providers like FIOS, UVerse and possibly even cable will be better. On the other hand, unless you have a fairly large TV you may not notice.

mdavej, This does concern me:confused: as a said I mainly dub to DVD TCM. I figured with HD the picture quality would improve TCM, even they don't broadcast in HD (some areas do), I was generally happy with results I was getting in my present setup. I do have FIOS internet, but the area I live in won't let FIOS TV in.:mad: and yes you guess it, I do have a large 40" HDTV . I do realize allot of these movies are 80 yrs old.

Thanks for the help !!

Steve

mdavej, This does concern me:confused: as a said I mainly dub to DVD TCM. I figured with HD the picture quality would improve TCM, even they don't broadcast in HD (some areas do), I was generally happy with results I was getting in my present setup. I do have FIOS internet, but the area I live in won't let FIOS TV in.:mad: and yes you guess it, I do have a large 40" HDTV .SD channels look noticeably worse on satellite than they do on most Comcast digital systems. Comcast delivers most of its SD channels at 528x480 or 544x480 resolution, whereas Dish Network and DirecTV downconvert all of their SD channels to 480x480. If you want good picture quality on satellite, then you need to subscribe to (and watch) the HD versions of your channels.

TCM launched a HD channel, but it's not available through satellite yet. It should launch on DirecTV in Q1 2010.

bfdtv, When I called to check my costs to move to a digital package. The CSR did say yes on the Motorola box (she did seem confused at times), at the time I was talking just their "Digital Starter" package ($73/m) that included 3 boxes, no DVR ($14/m HD $11/m SD). So cost was becoming a factor , I'm paying $61/m now.That sounds like their standard rates.

If cost is a major consideration, you should take a look at Dish Network. They offer a number of programming packages starting at $40/mo. Unfortunately, it looks like you have to step up to their $53/mo ($38/mo for first 12 months) plan in order to get TCM. HD adds $10/mo.

Dish Network's "Classic Silver" package with 200+ channels (incl. AMC) would cost $53/mo, plus $10 for HD versions of 70 channels, plus $5.99/mo for their HDTV DVR, plus $14/mo total for two additional satellite set-top boxes. Dish Network's DVR can output two different channels to two different TVs simultaneously (controlled by two different remotes), so if one of your other TVs is in range of a s-video or composite run, then that would eliminate the need for one set-top box.

Dish Network currently offers the best DVR outside of TiVo. When paired with the optional OTA module, the Dish ViP722K can record four different channels simultaneously (two satellite, two OTA); it will output two different channels to two different TVs, or picture-in-picture to one TV. You can use an external USB hard drive to offload/archive recordings (although not to a computer). The ViP722K is based on a relatively new Broadcom CPU and suffers from none of the performance problems seen on DirecTV's current DVRs.

Dish Network Classic Silver 200 (http://www.dishnetwork.com/packages/detail.aspx?pack=AT200) ($53/mo)
HD 70-channel add-on for Silver ($10/mo)
Dish ViP722K HDTV DVR (http://www.dishnetwork.com/downloads/pdf/product_brochures/722_brochure.pdf) with dual outputs for two different TVs ($5.99/mo)
SD or HD receiver for third TV ($7.00/mo)
---------------
$75.99/mo ($60.99/mo for first 12 months)

If you have two TVs within range of the DVR, and don't care about DirecTV's exclusive sports package, then Dish Network sounds like the best bet to me. For an extra $15/mo, you significantly improve on your number of SD and HD channels; you also add a quad-tuner DVR that can record four different programs (two satellite, two OTA) simultaneously.

Before you switch to Dish or DirecTV, I would call Comcast one more time to ask about a promo on digital service with the Motorola DVR. But if they won't budge, be prepared and willing to leave for Dish or DirecTV. I would be hesitant to switch to DirecTV until their next-generation DVR is available early next year.

The D* DVR is an absolute POS. Many people were very vocal about this. 1-2 minute (!) wait when you change channels. MANY people complain they lose everything recorded on the DVR for absolutely no reason.The functionality / features of the DirecTV DVR are very good. The problem is the performance / responsiveness; many common operations lag badly on their HR21/HR22/HR23.

DirecTV keeps adding new features to their DVR, seemingly without regard for the effect it has on responsiveness. DirecTV will undoubtedly improve performance some through optimization, but I doubt these DVRs will ever be as responsive as some would like.

The Broadcom CPU in Dish Network's relatively new ViP722K is twice as fast as that in the DirecTV DVRs, and Broadcom has announced even faster DVR CPUs for early next year. The next DirecTV DVR should offer 2-3x the performance of their current DVRs, and have no problem running their software with a high degree of responsiveness. For those that don't like the DirecTV software, they'll also offer the TiVo software as an option on the new model.

Wow :eek:

Thanks bfdtv for the detailed information, I posted in this forum to see if my Philips could exsist with D*.

Now you've introduced a interesting option. hadn't thought of Dish. I am not interested in any premium sports packages, I do love Hockey which with D* and versus we know what going on there :mad:.

I've have grow tired of C*, some of the channels D* offers that would appeal to me, I would have to add more to my base costs if I stayed with C*.I felt I could switch and get more for my $$$$

Does the philips coexist well with dish ?
Can you dump recording onto the philips ?
As mdavej pointed out with D* TCM sd "generally sucks" anybody with Dish, whats your opinion ?

The dual-tuner of the 722 DVR does interest me, as my wife still uses the VCR (she's familar with) and I always use the philips. I could teach her how to use the Dish DVR.

The main considerations
1. D*-C*-Dish working with Philips 3575
2. Keeping costs around the same as currently spending ($61)
3. Being able to dump recordings from a DVR to the Philips DVR to archive onto a DVD. Mostly TCM
4. Get more choices with the money spending (More channels)

Thanks for the info !!

Steve

I was quite amazed when bfdtv stated neither of the satellite companies carried TCM in HD. A search of both companies website showed this the case and even TCMs own site didn't mention HD, but I assume it's available if only on cable?
I'm also interested in mdavej's point about the poor quality of satellite SD channels. Are you saying D*'s SD is worse than C*'s SD or even analog signal? Steve, I'm assuming? you're currently watching TCM on analog cable, I guess if you're OK with that now you may be OK with something less than HD.

Does the philips coexist well with dish ?It co-exists just as well as any other cable or satellite box.

Can you dump recording onto the philips ?If by "dump," you mean press play on the DVR and record on the Philips, then yes. You can do that. No cable or satellite box will ever support more than that with a standalone DVD recorder.

The external storage support on the Dish ViP722 DVR allows you to selectively move recordings to any USB external drive. If you had, say, 100 TCM movies on the DVR, you could move just those 100 movies to a particular external drive. Then you could connect another drive to store different recordings. This provides for a form of archival. As long as you have your original Dish DVR, you can access the recordings on an unlimited number of external drives.

As mdavej pointed out with D* TCM sd "generally sucks" anybody with Dish, whats your opinion ?The quality of the SD channel won't be as good as what you get with Comcast digital, but when they add TCM HD, the quality of that should be noticeably better than the SD channel. TCM-HD doesn't plan to offer actual HD before late 2010, but they do offer upconverted SD, some of it in full 16:9.

The dual-tuner of the 722 DVR does interest me, as my wife still uses the VCR (she's familar with) and I always use the philips. I could teach her how to use the Dish DVR.The Dish ViP722K DVR is very easy to use. Press guide to bring up the program guide. Use the day +/- buttons to jump through the schedule for the next 12-14 days. Use up/down/left/right to highlight the program you want.

When you've found the program you want, press the record button once to record that single program, or press it twice to record that series whenever it shows. There are no timers to setup. If you want more record options (ex: new episodes only, keep only last 3 episodes, etc), press select on the program rather than record. You can display a list of all recordings -- each with the program name, episode title, and program/episode description -- on the DVR by pressing a single button on the remote.

If you get the optional OTA module (~$50 option) that plugs into the back of the Dish ViP722K DVR, you can record two additional channels from an off-air antenna at the same time. That would allow you and your wife to watch two separate channels, in two different rooms at the same time, while you each record a second program (i.e. 4x tuners total). In each room, you can use pause, instant replay, rewind, etc on live and recorded programs. It's a bit like having four Philips DVDRs combined into a single box with two independent outputs and a much more intuitive interface.

I was quite amazed when bfdtv stated neither of the satellite companies carried TCM in HD. A search of both companies website showed this the case and even TCMs own site didn't mention HD, but I assume it's available if only on cable?Very few cable operators currently offer TCM-HD. As mentioned in the previous post, the channel only offers upconverted SD for now; they don't offer any actual HD yet, and won't for another year or so. I'm sure you'll see more operators add the channel before they add HD content.

I'm also interested in mdavej's point about the poor quality of satellite SD channels. Are you saying D*'s SD is worse than C*'s SD or even analog signal? Steve, I'm assuming? you're currently watching TCM on analog cable, I guess if you're OK with that now you may be OK with something less than HD.The SD on Dish/DirecTV is worse than the digital SD on most (not necessarily all) Comcast systems. Analog SD channels are subject to RF interference, so quality on those channels isn't consistent from home to home. Satellite may or may not offer a better picture than what you're accustomed to with analog channels.

"I was quite amazed when bfdtv stated neither of the satellite companies carried TCM in HD. A search of both companies website showed this the case and even TCMs own site didn't mention HD, but I assume it's available if only on cable?"


I was checking the status of TCM-HD, I thought I found on AVS Forums http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1152849 that where I read about it.

Steve, I'm assuming? you're currently watching TCM on analog cable, I guess if you're OK with that now you may be OK with something less than HD.

You are correct I'm viewing TCM in SD/Analog Cable, I'm generally OK with the PQ, considering most of the movies are old. I have no problem with buying the DVD if its a must buy (i.e. - Little Caesar) but I love the capablities of the Philips 3575 and creating a viewable personal copy of movie I like. I've been happy with the results, would I like better copies, of course ! If D* - Dish is going to be worse in SD/Digital than - Analog Cable, I don't know. I'm hoping with the increase of technology it would be an upgrade for me !

Thanks for helping a lost soul ;)

Steve

bfdtv If by "dump," you mean press play on the DVR and record on the Philips, then yes. You can do that. No cable or satellite box will ever support more than that with a standalone DVD recorder.

Yes, that's what I meant, I realize the squeeze is being put on us by companies

bfdtv The external storage support on the Dish ViP722 DVR allows you to selectively move recordings to any USB external drive. If you had, say, 100 TCM movies on the DVR, you could move just those 100 movies to a particular external drive. Then you could connect another drive to store different recordings. This provides for a form of archival. As long as you have your original Dish DVR, you can access the recordings on an unlimited number of external drives.

I'll have to read more about this, but it sounds perfect to me :)


bfdtv The quality of the SD channel won't be as good as what you get with Comcast digital, but when they add TCM HD, the quality of that should be noticeably better than the SD channel. TCM-HD doesn't plan to offer actual HD before late 2010, but they do offer upconverted SD, some of it in full 16:9.

As I responded to jjeff I'm on Analog Cable, so the PQ should be better that that on D* or Dish.

I'm trying to avoid "paralysis by analysis" when it comes to all this. I was happy with my setup for now.

You've been a very big help !!!! :D

Steve

After kicking around my options, decided to go with Dish. Install date of Monday the 26th.

Thanks to bfdtv for your detailed information in helping me.

I hope the combination of my flexibility of my Philips DVR will live in harmony with Dish.

After weighing different packages of Comcast - Directv - Dish Network, which I realized would all work with my Philips. I went with Dish cause of the DuoDVR so my Wife and I have the capabilties to DVR programs. Cost was also a factor. All plans will increase $$$ spent, but I think I'll get more for that dollar I was spending !!

Thanks again, I guess when everything gets setup I'll be back with more questions.....:eek:

Steve

After weighing different packages of Comcast - Directv - Dish Network, which I realized would all work with my Philips. I went with Dish cause of the DuoDVR so my Wife and I have the capabilties to DVR programs. Cost was also a factor. All plans will increase $$$ spent, but I think I'll get more for that dollar I was spending !!

Thanks again, I guess when everything gets setup I'll be back with more questions.....:eek:
I don't know if they allow you to request it, but if so, you should ask for the ViP722K. Note the K.

Dish Network has three "DuoDVRs" -- the ViP622 (320GB), ViP722 (500GB), and ViP722K (500GB). The ViP622 and ViP722 are older models, whereas the ViP722K is a design refresh with a new, faster CPU. This new CPU can support Dish Network's upcoming HD UI (http://i299.photobucket.com/albums/mm314/ilovehdtv/Other/ViP922/vip922_guide1.jpg?t=1256351775), whereas the CPUs in the older models cannot.

If you already placed the order via the web, you might call and ask to whether they can specify the ViP722K on your order. They may or may not be able to do that. I know with DirecTV, you just get whatever model the installer has on hand.

Only thing is, with the "K" model, you'll have to purchase the separate ATSC tuner - but it's still worth it if you want it. As I understand it, it feeds both TV's - the older, built-in models wouldn't feed the second TV (bfdtv can confirm if everything is correct).

Only thing is, with the "K" model, you'll have to purchase the separate ATSC tuner - but it's still worth it if you want it. As I understand it, it feeds both TV's - the older, built-in models wouldn't feed the second TV (bfdtv can confirm if everything is correct).The ViP622, ViP722, and ViP722K all feed two TVs. Other models do not.

The ViP622 and ViP722 have two satellite tuners and one OTA tuner. The ViP722K has two satellite tuners and a slot for a dual OTA tuner module; when this module is installed, it can record from all four tuners simultaneously.

I know they are all dual-independent satellite tuners - but I was talking specifically about the older models having only one, built-in ATSC tuner feed to one TV.

Probably should've been clearer.

I don't know if they allow you to request it, but if so, you should ask for the ViP722K. Note the K.

Dish Network has three "DuoDVRs" -- the ViP622 (320GB), ViP722 (500GB), and ViP722K (500GB). The ViP622 and ViP722 are older models, whereas the ViP722K is a design refresh with a new, faster CPU. This new CPU can support Dish Network's upcoming HD UI (http://i299.photobucket.com/albums/mm314/ilovehdtv/Other/ViP922/vip922_guide1.jpg?t=1256351775), whereas the CPUs in the older models cannot.

If you already placed the order via the web, you might call and ask to whether they can specify the ViP722K on your order. They may or may not be able to do that. I know with DirecTV, you just get whatever model the installer has on hand.

Thanks bfdtv

When I ordered I did specify the 722k Duo-dvr for the main TV's and for the kids room/basement a 222k ! The CSR did seem impress with the preparedness :). Thanks to the internet I say, and the help here of course !!

Thanks
Steve