Since Jason gave us a hint about JVC's next model in the comparison thread,

And we appreciate it! I'll ear mark an RS65 for you next year. (Note: I made that model up...I don't know anything).

we may as well get this started. I've been thinking about replacing my Planar 8150 but with CEDIA 2010 getting closer and closer, I don't want to buy anything prematurely.

Any hints about what the new JVC will bring?!? I know Jason says he made that up, be we ALL know better!!!

:D:p

(I LOVE THIS STUFF)

RS65/HD1000 Speculation/Wish list!

LED light engine.

Variable(user adjustable)dimming of light source with mechanical 100% auto light shutter(perfect fade to black possible) no more user adjustable vari-iris in lens.

Auto Calibration feature with optional Colorimeter.

Several zoom/focus/ HV position memories like the Panasonic.

Improved FI.

Faster panel.

4th panel or sandwiched 6 panel design(3 +3) that sends ANSI CR to new heights.

Improved Polarizers.

2554 x1080 high end model:D

Under $1000 price tag

who cares about this. im sure the panny ae4000 will best it in every regard, especially sharpness, seeing that it will ONLY be a 4k machine. :eek:

My post in the other thread was hilarious and was clearly intended in good fun. It was deleted. I am not upset but it is a shame most of you guys missed it. Tell you what, since you can`t read it, if you want a good laugh watch the Washington Redskins on offense on Monday Night Football this week.

My post in the other thread was hilarious, It was deleted.

If you don't beleive me, just ask me. :) :)

Ask thorr. He read it.

…
Auto Calibration feature with optional Colorimeter.
…
I'm honestly amazed that none of the projector manufacturers have this.

They could have a tuned colorimeter that clips on like a lens cap and automate the calibration process. Even better, it could be set to run every time you turn the projector off to keep it at its best. (doing it when turning off should mean the projector has warmed up sufficiently)

Marantz had theis feature onthe 12S3 if I remembe correctly.It was dropped on the 12S4.
A true calibration must be done off of the screen. To do it right, a very very expensive spectroradiometer is required although good results can be obtained with things like the Eye One.most consumers aren`t concerned with truly accurate colorimetry and color spaces that match the source,hi Aunt Martha, and do not want to pay for this feature.

I'm honestly amazed that none of the projector manufacturers have this.

They could have a tuned colorimeter that clips on like a lens cap and automate the calibration process. Even better, it could be set to run every time you turn the projector off to keep it at its best. (doing it when turning off should mean the projector has warmed up sufficiently)

Patience is a virtue. Good things come to those who wait!!!...................

A true calibration must be done off of the screen. To do it right, a very very expensive spectroradiometer is required although good results can be obtained with things like the Eye One.most consumers aren`t concerned with truly accurate colorimetry and color spaces that match the source,hi Aunt Martha, and do not want to pay for this feature.
With a neutral screen (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=15585092&postcount=88), I wouldn't have thought there would be a problem calibrating at the lens. There could also be the ability to set up a screen offset for the calibration process.

Unless you have a very high-end meter, measuring off the screen is not going to calibrate low %stim very well at all.

A tuned/profiled colorimeter should be more than accurate enough. A spectro is useful for when the display is an unknown quantity, but a tuned colorimeter should outperform any consumer-level spectro.


I would have thought a colorimeter could be made inexpensive enough that it would be included as standard with the projector. Most consumers don't care about accuracy because they don't know what they are missing out on. People that aren't into AV at all can see the advantage of calibration when they have looked at my own displays. (‘how did you get the picture looking so good?’ etc.)

The process could be almost entirely automated for regular consumers, with advanced options available for the kind of person that visits this site.

Compared to no calibration, and probably a large % of DIY calibration, having the projector automate the process is probably going to produce much better results, even if the screen is not completely neutral.

Oh man...what the heck have I started. :)

If you want a really good laugh watch the Detroit Lions in any game.

If you want a really good laugh watch the Detroit Lions in any game.

No no, if you want the BEST laugh watch the Toronto Maple Leafs, they will set a record this year for the 1st team in history not able to win just even 1 game! :D

Joerod, will you review this new JVC soon? :D

Joerod, will you review this new JVC soon? :D

Might as well start planning to. :D

That might be because one of our friends here is no longer playing for them. But if you go back long enough to when the NHL expanded from 6 teams (BOSTON,NEW YORK, DETROIT,CHICAGO, TORONTO,and MONTREAL), those expansions teams It hink hardly ever if at al lbeat one of the non expansion 6 the first year. And atleast the team`s you mention score touch downs. Detroit beat the REDSKINS. Last week the skinsdid kick a touch down.

the RS65 will be better in that the parts will be cherry picked from all the RS35s lines, and these better parts will yeild a better PQ:)

RS65 = RS35 with 20% more on/off contrast and a 4 year warranty :D

One thing if JVC is listening would be going back to a lens that exits the case allowing manual fine focus of the lens and close placement of an anamorphic.

RS65/HD1000 should be the first ht laserprojector. This will be how JVC stays ahead in the contrast game by increasing
1 on/off
2 takes a leap in ANSI cr
3 introduces a JVC´s version of DynamicBlack

no special glasses for 3D would be an added bonus but that might have to wait until RS95. :)

RS65 will be the RS35 with the super duper hand picked parts

Isn't ANSI contrast what sets ultra high end apart from current line of JVC products?

In my mind, it would make most sense if they improved the ANSI contrast and light output.

It will be marketed as a Runco and have smoothscreen.......

Dick Fogg

You are an idiot. JVC will not be marketed as a Runco. it will be marketed as Planar. Hell it has been marketed recently as Pioneer and presently Anthem and a few others. Helll maybe AVS should market it as a house brand.

wow, the swine flu jab must increase agression going by some comments in threads in the last few hours. must be the mercury in them lol

At this point it is too early for the RS65 to contemplate LED or laser light source.

Lets focus on what is urgent (:D), the following two things:

1) Real mechanical convergence alignment to allow for a close to perfect panel alignments, ½ a pixel is not enough.
2) 800:1 to 1000:1 Ansi contrast.

This is too funny.

Is it too early for the RS75 rumor thread?

Isn't ANSI contrast what sets ultra high end apart from current line of JVC products?

For Immediate Release
Press contact Mark Pescatore

ATLANTA, September 10, 2010
JVC updates its award-winning line of D-ILA home theater projectors with the introduction of a new Projector Line
Features Top Model With 10,000:1 Native Contrast
JVC announced yesterday that the RS65 will directly compete with high end DLP projectors. In answer to DLP fan boy's criticism they will drop the native contrast below 10k and increase the ANSI to 600:1. The pinnacle of this low performance is found in the new DLA-RS65. This projector will offer the lowest performance yet of any D-ILA home theater projector, with a native contrast ratio of 10,000:1. This unparalleled low performance is achieved in part by using components that are rejected from our other product lines This includes the selection of only the worst performing optical assemblies, the selection and mismatching of the D-ILA devices, and final missadjustment by highly trained JVC monkeys. In addition, the DLA-RS65 will come without a warranty.

Mark Pescatore, JVC Professional Product manager is quoted as saying, "We intend to completely dominate the DLP fan boy market with a new line up of low contrast, big Woop line of projectors."


JVC PROFESSIONAL PRODUCTS COMPANY, located in Wayne, New Jersey, is a leading manufacturer and distributor of a complete line of broadcast and professional equipment. For more information about this, or any other JVC PROFESSIONAL PRODUCTS COMPANY product, contact JVC at (800) 582-5825; or Deirdre Breakenridge or Candace Vadnais at PFS Marketwyse 973-812-8883, or visit JVC’s Web site at http://www.jvc.com/pro .

For Immediate Release
Press contact Mark Pescatore

ATLANTA, September 10, 2010
JVC updates its award-winning line of D-ILA home theater projectors with the introduction of a new Projector Line
Features Top Model With 10,000:1 Native Contrast
JVC announced yesterday that the RS65 will directly compete with high end DLP projectors. In answer to DLP fan boy's criticism they will drop the native contrast below 10k and increase the ANSI to 600:1. The pinnacle of this low performance is found in the new DLA-RS65. This projector will offer the lowest performance yet of any D-ILA home theater projector, with a native contrast ratio of 10,000:1. This unparalleled low performance is achieved in part by using components that are rejected from our other product lines This includes the selection of only the worst performing optical assemblies, the selection and mismatching of the D-ILA devices, and final missadjustment by highly trained JVC monkeys. In addition, the DLA-RS65 will come without a warranty.

Mark Pescatore, JVC Professional Product manager is quoted as saying, "We intend to completely dominate the DLP fan boy market with a new line up of low contrast, big Woop line of projectors."


JVC PROFESSIONAL PRODUCTS COMPANY, located in Wayne, New Jersey, is a leading manufacturer and distributor of a complete line of broadcast and professional equipment. For more information about this, or any other JVC PROFESSIONAL PRODUCTS COMPANY product, contact JVC at (800) 582-5825; or Deirdre Breakenridge or Candace Vadnais at PFS Marketwyse 973-812-8883, or visit JVC’s Web site at http://www.jvc.com/pro .

thanks! i think the increase in ANSI will be awesome! ;)

RS65/HD1000 should be the first ht laserprojector. This will be how JVC stays ahead in the contrast game by increasing
1 on/off
2 takes a leap in ANSI cr
3 introduces a JVC´s version of DynamicBlack

no special glasses for 3D would be an added bonus but that might have to wait until RS95. :)

Ohlson, glad to see you back in action! I agree that it's time for a laser-driven RSxx.

HDI has already announced a 100" laser-lighted lcos rptv that also is 3D to boot. How far behind can a front projector version of this be?

Isn't ANSI contrast what sets ultra high end apart from current line of JVC products?ANSI CR maybe some, but probably more high MTF at full resolution or close to full resolution, which is only somewhat related to ANSI CR. MTF at full resolution or close to full resolution is more like high contrast detail in very small areas (a 1x1 pixel black and white or black and green checkerboard for instance).

--Darin

Ohlson, glad to see you back in action! I agree that it's time for a laser-driven RSxx.

HDI has already announced a 100" laser-lighted lcos rptv that also is 3D to boot. How far behind can a front projector version of this be?

See the writeup here: http://displaydaily.com/2009/04/08/hdi-develops-3d-lcos-laser-projector/

ANSI CR maybe some, but probably more high MTF at full resolution or close to full resolution, which is only somewhat related to ANSI CR. MTF at full resolution or close to full resolution is more like high contrast detail in very small areas (a 1x1 pixel black and white or black and green checkerboard for instance).

--Darin

What does MTF stand for? I am just getting into front projection

What does MTF stand for? I am just getting into front projectionIt is Modulation Transfer Function. I haven't read the following writeup, but here is one example of something on the internet about it:

http://www.normankoren.com/Tutorials/MTF1A.html

For the way I used it in my post above you can think of it like the contrast ratio between the black and white lines in a pattern with each color only one pixel wide, then 2 pixels wide, etc.

ANSI CR is like MTF at very low resolution (the boxes are 480 pixels by 270 pixels for 1080p). As the patterns get much tighter (smaller detail) different things come into play than for ANSI CR. An effect may make ANSI CR low and also make MTF at full resolution low, but there are also effects that will make one low while not making the other one low. For instance, a white room can kill ANSI CR since 50:1 ANSI CR is considered poor. But since 10:1 CR during a full resolution MTF test would be considered very good a white room isn't likely to take great MTF at full resolution from a projector and make it poor off the screen. But a bad lens could make both MTF at full resolution and ANSI CR be poor.

Hope that makes sense.

--Darin

For Immediate Release
Press contact Mark Pescatore

ATLANTA, September 10, 2010
JVC updates its award-winning line of D-ILA home theater projectors with the introduction of a new Projector Line
Features Top Model With 10,000:1 Native Contrast
JVC announced yesterday that the RS65 will directly compete with high end DLP projectors. In answer to DLP fan boy's criticism they will drop the native contrast below 10k and increase the ANSI to 600:1. The pinnacle of this low performance is found in the new DLA-RS65. This projector will offer the lowest performance yet of any D-ILA home theater projector, with a native contrast ratio of 10,000:1. This unparalleled low performance is achieved in part by using components that are rejected from our other product lines This includes the selection of only the worst performing optical assemblies, the selection and mismatching of the D-ILA devices, and final missadjustment by highly trained JVC monkeys. In addition, the DLA-RS65 will come without a warranty.

Mark Pescatore, JVC Professional Product manager is quoted as saying, "We intend to completely dominate the DLP fan boy market with a new line up of low contrast, big Woop line of projectors."


JVC PROFESSIONAL PRODUCTS COMPANY, located in Wayne, New Jersey, is a leading manufacturer and distributor of a complete line of broadcast and professional equipment. For more information about this, or any other JVC PROFESSIONAL PRODUCTS COMPANY product, contact JVC at (800) 582-5825; or Deirdre Breakenridge or Candace Vadnais at PFS Marketwyse 973-812-8883, or visit JVC’s Web site at http://www.jvc.com/pro .

What a half-assed effort! It's still a 3-chip LCOS! They really need to drop down to one chip and add a colorwheel and simulated dither. Without rainbows to give you seizures, I just can't see them competing in that market at all.

If they could incorporate wobulation, then they REALLY might have a winner!

I'd like the new RS65 to come with an "OH SH*T" button on the remote. You know, for those special porn moments that get interrupted by the wife, kids, mother-in-law, cat, or police who come down the stairs at the most inopportune moments. What the button does is turn any image on the screen to "Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs" (In stunning blu-ray, naturally) and, from a secret compartment under the RS65, release a fullsized throw onto your lap.....to hide any incriminating evidence. :) :D :p :eek:

I'd like the new RS65 to come with an "OH SH*T" button on the remote. You know, for those special porn moments that get interrupted by the wife, kids, mother-in-law, cat, or police who come down the stairs at the most inopportune moments. What the button does is turn any image on the screen to "Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs" (In stunning blu-ray, naturally) and, from a secret compartment under the RS65, release a fullsized throw onto your lap.....to hide any incriminating evidence. :) :D :p :eek:

I used to think that porn on a big screen would be cool. Then I tried it and realized certain things are just not meant to be blown up to 5' tall.

I'd like the new RS65 to come with an "OH SH*T" button on the remote. You know, for those special porn moments that get interrupted by the wife, kids, mother-in-law, cat, or police who come down the stairs at the most inopportune moments. What the button does is turn any image on the screen to "Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs" (In stunning blu-ray, naturally) and, from a secret compartment under the RS65, release a fullsized throw onto your lap.....to hide any incriminating evidence. :) :D :p :eek:

You're weird.

You know I just purchased the Bluray and DVD set of Snow White. Cost $13 through Amazon.

It is Modulation Transfer Function. I haven't read the following writeup, but here is one example of something on the internet about it:

http://www.normankoren.com/Tutorials/MTF1A.html

For the way I used it in my post above you can think of it like the contrast ratio between the black and white lines in a pattern with each color only one pixel wide, then 2 pixels wide, etc.

ANSI CR is like MTF at very low resolution (the boxes are 480 pixels by 270 pixels for 1080p). As the patterns get much tighter (smaller detail) different things come into play than for ANSI CR. An effect may make ANSI CR low and also make MTF at full resolution low, but there are also effects that will make one low while not making the other one low. For instance, a white room can kill ANSI CR since 50:1 ANSI CR is considered poor. But since 10:1 CR during a full resolution MTF test would be considered very good a white room isn't likely to take great MTF at full resolution from a projector and make it poor off the screen. But a bad lens could make both MTF at full resolution and ANSI CR be poor.

Hope that makes sense.

--Darin

It does. Thanks.

You know I just purchased the Bluray and DVD set of Snow White. Cost $13 through Amazon.

Your taste in porn is disturbing. :eek:

Is it too early for the RS75 rumor thread?


That one could have a led or laser based lamp:)

You know I just purchased the Bluray and DVD set of Snow White. Cost $13 through Amazon.

Just after a post on porn this could be badly interpreted. :D

ANSI CR maybe some, but probably more high MTF at full resolution or close to full resolution, which is only somewhat related to ANSI CR. MTF at full resolution or close to full resolution is more like high contrast detail in very small areas (a 1x1 pixel black and white or black and green checkerboard for instance).

--Darin
You are right MTF is a more meaningful measure than Ansi. Sadly this is much harder thing to measure even more to compare. I am pretty sure that most reviewers don't even pop the required test patterns during their evaluation.

Throwing big numbers has more marketing punch this is why even the DLP projector manufacturers don’t even publish their Ansi contrast anymore.

There are test patterns which can be used to evaluate to some extent optical quality. There are I believe 2 on DVE. Resolution and line pairs. Measuring MTF is a whole other ball game requiring special equipment,considerable skill, and extensive mathematical processing (fourier analysis). A project is underway among some forum members led by Mark Peterson (who recently purchased some MTF test equipment) to evaluate .sevearal projectors of interest here. The results will be published on Mark's blog.

It was the Disney Snow White. I haven`t seen it since I was very very young. Old school animation.

The MTF testing will not be done on the lenses as seperate entities but will be on the entire projector because it will function as the light source. MTF will actually consist of the MTF of the test pattern feed and the connecting HDMI cable as well.

I suspect the testing will not be entirely accurate final number but will be useful in making comparisons between projectors. I suspect MTF will be very useful in evaluating the video quality of each projector and much more useful and important than things like ANSI CR. Projectors with single chips and great lenses should score very high. Misconvergence of three chippers could lower the MTF score but I suspect the highest influencing parameter will be lens qualty. i don`t know because I don`t have much expertise in MTF measurement other than the stuff you guys can find and read on the internet, Professional expert MTF testing is expensive and requires considerable expertise to do it right. Its a shame manufacturers don`t have it done but there may be good reasons other than just the costs. In the sub $10K category I suspect most projectors won`t score all that well being severly limited by lens quality. I am really looking forward to Marl's results.

Before you all start babbling about can you test this one and that, the biggest problem will be getting a projector to test. So say if one wants this or that to be tested, be prepared to lend the tester one for a few weels. This is being done regarding several projectors of interest tothis forum.`

There are test patterns which can be used to evaluate to some extent optical quality. There are I believe 2 on DVE. Resolution and line pairs. Measuring MTF is a whole other ball game requiring special equipment,considerable skill, and extensive mathematical processing (fourier analysis). A project is underway among some forum members led by Mark Peterson (who recently purchased some MTF test equipment to evaluate .sever projectors of interest here. The resultswill be published on Mark's blog.

The only test pattern I use to evaluate lens quality is the following:

http://www.graphics.cornell.edu/~westin/misc/ISO_12233-reschart.pdf

I'd like the new RS65 to come with an "OH SH*T" button on the remote. You know, for those special porn moments that get interrupted by the wife, kids, mother-in-law, cat, or police who come down the stairs at the most inopportune moments. What the button does is turn any image on the screen to "Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs" (In stunning blu-ray, naturally) and, from a secret compartment under the RS65, release a fullsized throw onto your lap.....to hide any incriminating evidence. :) :D :p :eek:

Blu' on BluRay no doubt!:D

I'd like the new RS65 to come with an "OH SH*T" button on the remote. You know, for those special porn moments that get interrupted by the wife, kids, mother-in-law, cat, or police who come down the stairs at the most inopportune moments. What the button does is turn any image on the screen to "Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs" (In stunning blu-ray, naturally) and, from a secret compartment under the RS65, release a fullsized throw onto your lap.....to hide any incriminating evidence. :) :D :p :eek:

put Snow White on a different source and just press the button on your HDMI switcher. easy! ;)

the full-sized throw hiding incriminating evidence, you'll have to figure out for yourself or wait for the RS65