Bigfoot48: Are you watching OTA or Cox cable? You have to customize the listings a bit. What Cox is carrying on channel 6, is 6-1 KUAT, and Nova was on at 8. On channel 706, Cox shows KUASDT. Nova was on 706 at 9, and in HD, even tho Titan didn't have the HD indicated.

Originally posted by AzRich
I've been checking out some DVD's that works with our Sony LCD. I've read some good things about your Zenith DVB318. Is there any chance it won't work with a Sony Wega? Does it have a HDMI output slot? Did you buy yours locally or over the internet? Does the picture look as good as HD? Rich

Some say the 318 is the most discussed device ever! The forum is here http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=400480
It should work with any TV, it upconverts to 1080i via component video or DVI, so no HDMI. However most postings indicate component is the way to go anyway and that's what I'm doing.

We bought ours through Amazon for about $160. At some point Zenith decided to stop upconverting and changed the firmware to do this, but that was easily bypassed by access to an earlier firmware (it's loaded into the player via a burned cd). I seem to recall they have stopped doing this and now they upconvert again. The forum discusses this issue.

The picture is amazing, and equals or betters HD broadcasts. However that may be a subjective evaluation based on content rather than picture! We're very happy with the performance of this player. We figured why shortchange the picture after spending all that money on the set, so we opted for the Zenith rather than a $50 Costco model.

Anyone reading this now - please post whether CH 9-1 is coming in and at what strength.

I am in contact with Paul in the newsroom right now who says the master controller is getting 9-1 just fine. First he said there was a translator problem but now he claims there is no problem.

However, I get NO SIGNAL whatsoever. I get readings around 11% at best with black screen. I've rebooted and reset the station - no go.

I always get 9-1 at 70% or higher with no problem. Of all nights for their signal to go down - the night ALIAS returns!! :mad: :confused: :( :rolleyes:

I'm getting channel 9 without any breakups but the signal is low. Normally the signal strength is in high 60's but it's in low 40's right now.

Thanks for the report. He did say their analog transmitter was on half power, but didn't say the digital changed any. Maybe they reduced both. I wonder why they picked tonight to do this?? I reported it again to him after verifying my setup and he said the master controller will be contacting the chief engineer. :rolleyes:

9.1 fine here. Level over 90%. Soooooo, one mo time.... The stations often have problems but sometimes its just reduced power. If your setup (RECEIVER) is marginal you will see this more often. Been there, done that, get a better receiver and all these problems will go away.

1) Some good news... KOLD will be in HD on Comcast by this Monday. Maybe even Friday if we can get the Transmitter to cooperate. Cox may be a couple more weeks, but this should be good for Comcast people .

2)In Digital, Transmission power only relates to distance. In other words, the higher the power output, the farther it will go. It has nothing to do with the quality of the signal, only the quantity. If power levels drop, the signal wont get as far, but everywhere it does go will be a good signal until it reaches the threshold point, or cliff, then it turns useless. Signal to Noise Ratios are usually the factor that makes the signal work. The better the ratio, the better the signal. A low ratio will cause data packets to be dropped, causing dropouts, and pixelation. Often SNR is more important than power level. Some receivers measure SNR for their "Signal Quality, or Strength". Some use RF levels. That makes it hard to tell what you're actually seeing, and why some see 90% while others see 30%.

3)CBS does not have the Superbowl this year, I think it's Fox's turn, but I'm not sure. (Sorry Carey )

Originally posted by West Avra Wiz
3)CBS does not have the Superbowl this year, I think it's Fox's turn, but I'm not sure. (Sorry Carey ) I just assumed it did because superbowl.com said "powered by" CBS sportsline.com. Stupid assumption, I guess. Well, at least 11-1 seems to be up and running. The question is whether SB is in HD (720p).

I'm glad to hear 13 will be on Comcast. I hope the other stations follow soon. Then I might get the box again as a backup.

Baba -
I'm using the MyHD-120 card with DVI and have digital recording capability with TIVO. I don't think the Walmart box will have same and I think it is only Component too. I may have my friend come over this weekend (he has that box) and do some A-B comparison of signal strength. I'm in a very fringe area on the west side, though most stations register normally at 60 to 80% with the MyHD. I use an 8-bay bowtie antenna with preamp on a rotor too.

Towards the last half hour of Alias I was receiving the signal at 20 to 25% and it locked in pretty good though started drop-outs toward the end. Amazing for that low of a signal. May be that 9-1 does have good S/N. In any case, my location is drastically affected by the weaker signal.

I am in oro Valley. Very bad for reception but I get them all. The problem is mostly multi-path, not signal to noise. It is signal to signal. If you don't have line of sight the receiver has to pick out one of many reflected signals of different phase and stay locked on to it. It does not have to be the highest level one. In Tucson most of us are actually pretty close to the transmitters but there are lots of reflections. The newer receiver designs use a lot of sophisticated digital signal processing techniques to lock on a signal. I am an engineer and I have tested and instrumented a number of them. The difference between receivers is dramatic.
Carey, I hope you get to run the test with the USDTV. Yes it only has Component but I can't see the differnce from DVI. You know DVI was invented to implement copy protection (one day) so when the source material is protected it will not work with TIVO. Let us know. BTW I use a similar antenna. I have found that preamps usually make it worse.

You are lucky.. I am in OV also (Rancho Vistoso) and could not get any.. Somehow I got lucky and all four local networks gave me waivers for distant networks on Directv so i get NY/LA digital feeds.

Well, I got the scoop on KGUN's status from their chief engineer if anyone is interested:

The problem right now is the icing up of the DTV antenna. They do not have a de-icer on it as they do on the analog antenna. They have a 200ft tower with the analog antenna at top and the D-35 lower power antenna near the bottom. The upper antenna melts and drips on the lower antenna and creates even more ice for it.

The ice has caused the power to go down to 20%. Funny that this is exactly what I measure on my receiver. Normally it has a 5KW signal, but now it is at 1KW. It's caused by a voltage standing ratio that reflects power back into the transmitter. They said this same thing occurred last winter. We just have to wait for the sun to thaw it out, but right now it's about 0° up there. They have no plans to install a de-icer for this antenna.
The upper analog antenna has 80% power at the moment.

The plan is for July 2005 for a new 200ft tower with the HDTV antenna at the top - at 195 ft, with de-icing. This should help clear most of the local mtn peaks and get to more people. It will also be at 10.5KW power! They also have plans for about a year from now to install a repeater tower on Tumamoc hill to supplement the northwest side on 9-1. New receivers should be able to choose the best lobe.

They have no plans to be ever on Comcast or any cable. It's a network decision. Looks like OTA is the only way anyone will get ABC in Hi Def around here.

Originally posted by Carey P
They have no plans to be ever on Comcast or any cable. It's a network decision. Looks like OTA is the only way anyone will get ABC in Hi Def around here. It's a power play and someone will blink sooner or later. There are a number of station owners that are trying to play hardball with cable in an attempt to get some cash for carriage rights. It's a gamble, but right now they have nothing to lose. HD sub numbers are still small and analog is still on cable.

Just came home from work & KOLD is locked strong @ 90% again, they must have corrected the power supply problem that West Avra Wiz was talking about (hopefully not just temporarily).

Babakanoosh: I agree with you wholeheartedly that the dish 811 has a low quality tuner in it, but I am so close to the towers that it has been pretty reliable. I have no doubt that the tuner you mentioned & others would do a much better job with poor signal quality, whether it be signal to noise (as West Avra Wiz described KOLD's problem), Low power or multipath. But I like having the program guide data integrated with my satellite channels & I like having the local OTA guide info as well. I also like to be able to toggle back & forth from say ESPN HD to OTA CBSHD with the channel recall button. These are the reasons why I choose to stay with this tuner. I would not recommend it to others , especially if you are not real close to the transmitters. Over all it works well for me though.

West Avra Wiz: Welcome to the discussusion, glad you are here. It will be nice to have your perspective on things.

Chris

Originally posted by AzRich
Our 3 year old Toshiba progressive scan DVD does a fair job with our Sony HDTV but the picture is a pit grainy. We have connected it to the TV with component video cables and have an optical audio cable.

I've been checking out some DVD's that works with our Sony LCD. I've read some good things about your Zenith DVB318. Is there any chance it won't work with a Sony Wega? Does it have a HDMI output slot? Did you buy yours locally or over the internet? Does the picture look as good as HD?

Thanks for your help. Comcast comes Thursday with the HD cable box and DVR. Hope it works well.

Rich

Did you ask Comcast about getting a CableCard instead of a box? I have heard on some of the forums that the tuner in the Sony tvs provides a superior picture to the box. I am waiting for them to install a CableCard in my TV next Monday, but I can tell you for sure the PQ from the cable plugged straight into the TV is much better than what the cable box provides.

You should try dropping your DVD player out of progressive scan mode and see if that looks any better. This also allows you to change more options regarding the upconversion the TV does on the input. So you might be able to tweak some settings and get a better picture output. I would closely compare the output from any upconverting DVD player, since the Grand Wega TVs will convert ALL signals input to them to their native format of 788p. So you in effect are converting the signal twice, once in the DVD player and again in the TV. Many people in the other forums here have found the Grand Wega tvs to have very good scalers built into them and find that a very good DVD player with interlaced component outputs looks as good or better than an upconverting player.

One of my friends in town has a Grand Wega and when he bought it he also bought a Denon progressive scan player to use with it. I recently asked him to do a A-B comparison of that player versus his 7 year old Sony DVP-S7000. He was pretty much unable to tell the difference in PQ. Granted, in its day the S7000 was the best PQ on a DVD player you could get.

On my Grand Wega I use a 4 year old Sony DVD player that is non-progressive and it looks pretty good. Personally, I would like to upgrade to a player that supports both SACD and DVD-A, but upconversion will not be on my list of "needed" features.

My feeling, and I have seen others with the same, is that a 2 - 4k TV that is built around a fixed resolution, HAS to have better scaling abilities than a 150 -300 dollar DVD player.

I also was on the phone with Comcast today, the guy on the phone told me that CBS in fact went live on Chan. 182 yesterday afternoon, something about "they" (meaning KOLD I am sure) had installed the last piece of hardware to send the signal over to Comcast. The same guy told me that Comcast is waiting for KVOA to do the samething, according to him, they also just have to install the last piece of equipment to transfer the feed to Comcast.

-Eric

Hello all,

As of about 5:00pm Thursday the 6th, KOLD HD appeared on Comcast channel 182.

We now have a full time Fiber line between KOLD and Comcast, so we can guaranty reception. The Fiber is full time, full bandwidth, and the Off-Air Transmitter receiver will be used as a back-up. At the moment, the Transmitter is working okay, not great, but okay, so there shouldn't be any major reception problems. We do hope to get back up to it early next week. It definitely needs optimizing, and we've only just begun.

Anything new happens, I'll let you know.

Eric,

Thanks for the suggestions concerning the DVD player. I didn't know you drop it out of progressive scan but will take a look at the manual about it. Also, I was not aware that you "might be able to tweak some settings and get a better picture output." Where might this "tweaking" begin?

This is all new to me: scalers - upconveting - interlaced component outputs - but I'm learning.

We have had a ReplayTv for over a year and after having a DVR where we can control when we watch things we didn't want to go without one. We haven't seen a commercial in months!! So when we saw that Comcast had the 2 tuner DVR box we decided to try it instead of getting the CableCard. Let me know how you like it next week. We figure that if it doesn't work for us we can get the CableCard.

We got the DVR yesterday. The HD channels are excellent. Digital channels are very good but analog channels are fuzzy. Not sure I want to ever watch analog after seeing HD. The two INHD channels have some unique programming - Imax travel shows with lots of great scenery, concerts (Ultra Music Festival from Miami), etc. The HD Discovery Channel is also a favorite. I was glad to see KOLD on Comcast when I came home and watched it tonight for a while. It looked good and when I compared it to our OTA reception there was only a slight difference. We get great OTA reception since I can see Mt Bigelow blinking red only 10 miles away. It would be great to have KVOA also on Comcast. The DVR will be of more use if the networks are on cable.

Last night I recorded a HD program about Hawaii. Later, I was recording two HD programs at the the same time and watching the show about Hawaii. I feel in control!!!!

I'll try the things you suggested and post again.

Rich

Rich,

The INHD channels repeat a lot, but I've found so much of the stuff to be so good, I've watch some several times. I even watched the Peter Gabriel concert last month more than once and I really only like the one song by him. The Great Canadian Rivers series on Discovery HD is another progrm I probably wouldn't have checked if not for HD and I've watched several of them more than once too. I've even checked out the websites and bookmarked them for retirement planning in 4 years. I recorded the Rings of Fire this week on INHD2, but haven't watched it yet. I did crank up the receiver to catch the very beginning and now I can't wait to watch the whole thing Sunday before the Packer game. :)

West Avra Wiz
Just curious, is KOLD DT at full power yet or do you plan to increase power before July.

Thanks Tom

Gee, I wish my HD tuner was working on my new Hitachi so I could join in the fun. Yes, for those who have noticed my saga, the 4th Hitachi 57S715 we got has failed, at least the tuner has. Hitachi is sending new software, allegedly, but it looks like a part failure, the second exact same failure in a row.

We will probably return to Sears and try the 57" Sony CRT RP.

What a nightmare this has been.

What a hassle with your Hitachi! If you want to come over and see our 50 in Sony Grand Wega before you go to Sears let me know and I'll post phone number for you to call. We are loving it. We got the Comcast dual tuner on Thursday and they gave us HBO for six months free. We watched a movie last night complete with popcorn! Felt like I was in the theater. Our average surround sound system never sounded like this before with the 5.1 dolby. Our parrot kept squawking at the noise of explosions and helicopters flying through the living room.

Let me know if you would like to see OTA on our Sony.

Richard

BigFoot48:

How has Sears been handling your problems? After a great experience with Sears handling a major problem, I've gone out of my way to purchase big items there and get the Ext. Warranty. However, it's been awhile since I've needed their help post-sale, so I may be making a mistake.

Are they making you deal directly with Hitachi, or are they expediting everything for you? Are they giving you the option for an immediate replacement or to swap out with a different model when you have a problem?

Just curious.

I currently live in OV but will be moving to Marana (hartman lane and linda vista area). When I move D* has told me I will lose my E/W DNS networks and I can't get them back. I am currently grandfathered in at this address. Anyway what is my best option for an antenna? I really want to get HD but I wan to know if that is even possible. The antenna will be plugging into my HR10-250.

Just curious, is KOLD DT at full power yet or do you plan to increase power before July.



Hello tockcc,

Unfortunately, KOLD-DT is at about as full power as we are going to be for probably a few more years. The power we DO have is not yet fully utilized. The transmitter needs quite a bit more work in the "Optimization" department, and the high power amps need better stabilization. We will get better, but we wont have more "power" for quite a while.

AzRich,

That Comcast Dual tuner DVR - is that the Motorola DCT6208?

Can it output one station on DVI/Component and the other on S-Video? Or is it a dual tuner so you can record one channel and watch another.

It sounded like you were watching a recording while recording two other channels at the same time. Is that really possible? Is this the same tuner you get for $10/mo+$5 for HD? Thanks.

Originally posted by CPanther95
How has Sears been handling your problems? After a great experience with Sears handling a major problem, I've gone out of my way to purchase big items there and get the Ext. Warranty. However, it's been awhile since I've needed their help post-sale, so I may be making a mistake.

Are they making you deal directly with Hitachi, or are they expediting everything for you? Are they giving you the option for an immediate replacement or to swap out with a different model when you have a problem?

Just curious. Sears has been truly outstanding! They have without hesitation replaced the sets within days. Each new set re-started the 30-60 day evaluation period.

#1 - Completely dead after 5 days. #2 - low cooling fluid over lens caused color blobs in corners. #3, #4 - Unable to access OTA tuner, difficult getting back to other inputs, both after about 2 weeks.

We really had high hopes for Hitachi (had our previous RP 11 years) and this model, hence re-selecting the same model over and over for replacement. I have not seen any other postings of problems like ours, so I can only assume we've had extremely bad luck. All of our hookups, antenna, and cabling is standard or new, with no unusual usage. It's just insane.

Hitachi had to fax us a 3 page legal document that we had to sign and send back before they would send a software upgrade. They apparently do the firmware on a as-needed basis, so there is no real assurance as to when we will get it, although the first CS rep said we might get it today - we didn't. They thought it might be software even though the set worked fine for weeks, and software either works or not.

However we just turned on the set after it was off all day and it immediately went off with the blue pilot light blinking. This was on Directv input, and this set had not done this before, only on antenna input. Fortunately it came back on the second time so we won't miss MI-5 tonight!

So, that's it, we are going to Sears tomorrow and getting something else. (Richard, I will contact you via email!). We are learning toward the Sony 57WS655 with the built-in OTA tuner, which is very much like our Hitach 57S715.

Two big thumbs up for Sears!

Patrick

Carey P,

The new Comcast DVR/Cable box is the Motorola DCT6412. Here is a website to answer questions you might have:

http://broadband.motorola.com/dvr/news_faq.asp#analog_basic

Yes, it is possible to record two programs and watch another recorded program. It says in its FAQ section:

Can the DCT6412 playback a high definition recording while another HD program is being recorded?

YES, in fact you can record two programs at once while watching a previously recorded program from the hard drive.

I have component cables connecting the DCT6412 to my Sony Grand Wega. I tried a DVI to HDMI cable but the PQ was not as good. The two tuners work without any input from me. It just knows what to do. Yes, you can record one channel with one tuner and watch another program using the other tuner.

I believe you have the prices correct. We already had a digital box so this one replaces it. I was amazed at the price. Its got Tivo beat!

Richard

AzRich,

Thanks for the info! Nice features, though it looks like it gets hot like the 6200 did.

Does it actually make a lot of noise when running or turned off? I may just have to try it out and see. Thanks.

Can someone please report if you experienced any audio dropouts during the FOX 11-1 playoffs today using Comcast Cable HD? They were only a few noted OTA, but very obvious as they lasted a few seconds.

I'm trying to decide whether this was a network issue or local OTA signal problem. It also may say whether Comcast receives their signal via OTA or direct fiber. Thanks for your help!

Carey,

The Comcast 6412 does not make any loud fan noise. It is no louder than the fan in our ReplayTV . I know that some people have had noisy fans but ours is very quiet.

Richard

Carey,
I had dropouts on both 182 and 183 (CBS, FOX) on Comcast. Most noticeable on audio but video pixelized also. On OTA it was solid. Problem was on all Comcast digital stations. You could even see a slight interference on the analog channels if you looked carefully. I have also noticed they varied over the day. Bad early, then better mid day, then bad again in evening. I have seen this before and the Chief Engineer at Comcast knows what it is. Apparently their local amplifiers will vary their gain with temperature change. If the signal level at your box gets too high (or low) this happens. They had a tech out to my area a few weeks ago and it appeared he fixed it. But yesterday and today it was back. I will contact comcast tomorrow. I recommend you do the same. It is a Comcast problem. I have a very bad feeling that they have an equipment problem they can't completely solve.
BTW did you also notice that the HD on FOX and CBS on Comcast was not in Dolby Digital. It is OTA. I will ask about this also.
Thank goodness I have the OTA working especially for football now.

babakanoosh,
Thanks for that very useful info. Actually, I don't have the Comcast box yet, but was thinking of getting it if it worked better than OTA. Sorry for the misunderstanding. I was hoping the Comcast box would guarantee a solid signal without dropouts of any kind. Currently, I'm just OTA and don't use any box with Comcast, though I tried an earlier version of it for about a month last year.

KOLD is not DD5.1 yet, as West Avra Wiz pointed out. It is only Dolby stereo, even OTA. You might want to recheck that. However, FOX is certainly 5.1 and it was very enjoyable during the game and especially 24, as you probably know. Looks like Comcast has their own set of problems.

What I meant to say earlier, is that I noticed some dropouts of audio during the game OTA on 11-1. There were no video dropouts that I could tell. There may have been a couple of brief audio/video dropouts earlier in the day on KOLD OTA during the Colts game. I attributed this to their very weak signal of late. It was at 40 to 50% at best.

To summarize, I've only noticed the audio dropouts frequently on FOX, even though their video signal is exceptionally solid at 70-80%. I'm thinking now that this is a different issue which may affect only certain OTA receivers, so I will do further testing. Thanks.

Yes, there were a few dropouts of audio and video on 11.1 OTA. The video ones were blank screen, not pixelizing so that means it was certainly at their end. It was not often enough to be annoying. The signal level on my receiver was very high.

Hope this posting works this time. I think I accidentally started my own thread when I tried to post this a few minutes ago!

I've recently upgraded to HDTV and need some basic questions answered. I live in Tucson so I'm posting here, but please point me to the correct forum if these questions do not apply here.

I have a DirecTV dish on my roof and subscribe to their HD package with a Samsung SIR-TS360 satellite reciever . However, I'd like to get OTA signals as well for local channels, esp. sports. I also have Cox high speed internet via a cable line.

I purchased a Terk external antenna that clips on the DirecTV dish and uses the same coaxial cables. This is important to me because my house is rammed earth with no attic so drilling new lines for an additional external antenna will be a big deal.

Anyway, I connected the Terk and put a splitter on the cable end in the house, then wired the two coaxial connections into the SAT and Air inputs on the back of the Samsung. I then went through the local channel setup procedure per the manual.

However, although I continued to get my Satellite HD channels I only picked up a few grainy analog signals. It would search for OTA digital signals, but couldn't seem to receive any. To make matters worse, wiring the antenna through the satellite and apparently cable coaxial knoocked my high speed internet out. When I disconnected the Terk, my internet connection came back up.

What, if anything am I missing.

Also, where can I find an easily discernible listing of OTA HDTV for Tucson.

Thanks in advance.

McGinty, I have read that the Terk antenna that clips on the dishes is useless. You need a UHF anntenna pointing toward the towers.

You just need to mount a UHF antenna like you might get at Radio Shack (we bought their cheapest roof antenna as we're near the towers) and run it through the satellite feed like I assume the Terk does. If the Terk included special splitters, you may need to buy two at Radio Shack that don't interfer with the satellite signal. They are expensive at about $22.

I'll edit this with the links to the HD listings and antenna pointing directions when I get to my other computer!

Good luck.

Pat

:)

Thanks for the quick reply!

Any ideas for what I need to do so that I don't knock my cable internet connection off line?

Thanks

again.

Originally posted by McGinty
Also, where can I find an easily discernible listing of OTA HDTV for Tucson.

Thanks in advance.

Go to this website and sign up for free listings based on your address:

http://titantv.com

Go here to see where the antennas are and what size antenna you might need. http://www.antennaweb.org/aw/welcome.aspx

I don't know about antenna signals co-existing with broadband. It would sure be nice if all this stuff was wireless!

McGinty-

I had basically the same setup you do when I first got HD from DirecTV. I found that the Terk clip-on antenna didn't work at all. So I replaced it with the Zenith Silver Sensor indoor antenna. For me the Silver Sensor does an outstanding job and gets all of the digital signals without a problem when aimed at Mt. Bigelow. It's pretty unobtrusive as well.

I've added a DirecTV HD-TIVO since the Samsung and am using a Silver Sensor for each receiver. Both work great.

Kirk

Just wanted to follow up on KGUN HD not coming to cable anytime soon. I decided to write to the General Manager of KGUN (Ray Depa), to see what the deal was with this, and to let him know that I felt it was a mistake. From my exchanges with him, it really sounds like KGUN is going to be in this for the long haul. They believe that there is a problem with the cable company's model of paying program providors but not paying local broadcasters. They view HDTV as their opportunity to correct this problem. This is at the local level as well - not just a case of "corporate ABC" making a decision and forcing KGUN to follow it.

I sure hope that Dave is right about sopmeone blinking sooner or later, but it's certainly not looking good so far.

Originally posted by Carey P
Well, I got the scoop on KGUN's status from their chief engineer if anyone is interested:
...
They have no plans to be ever on Comcast or any cable. It's a network decision. Looks like OTA is the only way anyone will get ABC in Hi Def around here.

There are plenty of ABC local HD channels on cable around the country. The negotiations are mostly with the station owners so it is not the local operations and not the networks that control this. KGUN is owned by Emmis and KVOA is owned by Evening Post Publishing. They own other stations too, of various networks. I did some spot checking and sure enough none of their digital stations are on cable. Unless consumer demand forces the cable companies to cave, time and the FCC rules will force the stations to allow it, but it might several years. Personally, I don't really see the point of the stations. It is broadcast free anyway and starting this year all the HD TVs have built in tuners. Although there are some people with reception problems, data I have seen says over 90% do not.

Wow, that is pretty sad.

I know many people who have HD sets and already have cable that will never see ABC in HD because they either will not, don't know how, or are not allowed to put an antenna on their roof (and they will definitely need one). This is aside from buying an extra tuner. Oh well.

Heck, I barely pick up 9-1 any more, since it became cold up there, though the lock is pretty good. KOLD is actually much worse for me now.

Personally, I don't like the idea of not knowing whether I will make it through an entire program in HD without weather, equipment or transmitter problems affecting the signal. Sounds like back in the 20th century before there was cable! I like the idea of a direct fiber connection from the station to the cable company for a reliable signal. Though I don't care for the fact that they have audio problems (11-1) at the moment. I was really hoping that some day I could get a digital cable box as backup, but now there doesn't seem much point for only 2 locals (possibly 3 with KVOA) and not even get correct audio.

Mind Voyager, I didn't say when they would 'blink', just that sooner or later, one or the other will. :)

If you happen to have a station owned by one of the companines making a stand, it will be a tough time for you. With D* putting up locals this year, I suspect they will also be faced with the problem. Of course, it's not as bad for them, since most of their customers just throw up an antenna and watch OTA.

Until cable HD numbers grow, there is not much pressure on cable to blink. They still have the analog and if these companies really want to make a stand, they'd pull the analog and then we'd really have some fun. An email campaign might help, but I suspect there are as many folks on cable's side as there are on the company's side.

Can anyone tell me why on my fancy new Sony TV, NCIS, which is shown as HD on Titan, and shows up as 1080i and 16x9 in the info screen on my set, has black bars on either side in "normal" aspect, rather than filling the screen automatically?

Doesn't 16x9 mean it should fill the screen? What am I missing?

Pat

I would say someone forgot to flip the switch and it is SD.

McGinty:

Like kirkcarp, I am using a Silver Sensor indoors and getting good reception on all Tucson HD locals. My receiver is Sony HD300. I live in Starr Pass.

Originally posted by Behrens77
I currently live in OV but will be moving to Marana (hartman lane and linda vista area). When I move D* has told me I will lose my E/W DNS networks and I can't get them back. I am currently grandfathered in at this address. Anyway what is my best option for an antenna? I really want to get HD but I wan to know if that is even possible. The antenna will be plugging into my HR10-250. You should be in reasonable shape at your new location. It appears that the Hartman/Linda Vista intersection is right at the edge of the shadow cast by Lemmon and other peaks in the Catalinas to the signals from Mt. Bigelow. That's certainly an improvement over Oro Valley. My situation (Dove Mountain) is slightly worse and I'm able to receive all of the Bigelow DT stations with a Channel Master 4221 (4-bay bow-tie array) with the assistance of a preamp (necessitated by a lengthy cable run). Try first with a Silver Sensor (aka Zenith) indoor antenna to see if you have anything to work with.

Originally posted by McGinty

Any ideas for what I need to do so that I don't knock my cable internet connection off line?
I'm not quite sure how you have all of this tied together but can tell you that generally the CATV services occupy the same spectrum that is being received by your off-air antenna. The two can't share the same coaxial feed unless appropriate filtering is installed to isolate the desired signals from both feeds. Of course, choosing to use an indoor antenna resolves the problem by avoiding the shared cable.

Originally posted by McGinty
Hope this posting works this time. I think I accidentally started my own thread when I tried to post this a few minutes ago!

I've recently upgraded to HDTV and need some basic questions answered. I live in Tucson so I'm posting here, but please point me to the correct forum if these questions do not apply here.

I have a DirecTV dish on my roof and subscribe to their HD package with a Samsung SIR-TS360 satellite reciever . However, I'd like to get OTA signals as well for local channels, esp. sports. I also have Cox high speed internet via a cable line.

I purchased a Terk external antenna that clips on the DirecTV dish and uses the same coaxial cables. This is important to me because my house is rammed earth with no attic so drilling new lines for an additional external antenna will be a big deal.

Anyway, I connected the Terk and put a splitter on the cable end in the house, then wired the two coaxial connections into the SAT and Air inputs on the back of the Samsung. I then went through the local channel setup procedure per the manual.

However, although I continued to get my Satellite HD channels I only picked up a few grainy analog signals. It would search for OTA digital signals, but couldn't seem to receive any. To make matters worse, wiring the antenna through the satellite and apparently cable coaxial knoocked my high speed internet out. When I disconnected the Terk, my internet connection came back up.

What, if anything am I missing.

Also, where can I find an easily discernible listing of OTA HDTV for Tucson.

Thanks in advance.

Not sure how your sat coax and cable coax are connected.. If you only have cable for internet, it should not be connected to your tv or sat receiver at all. Re the antenna and sat signal running on the same coax, splitters do not work. You need something called a diplexer at both ends.. They look just like splitters, but apparently are not the same inside.. I had pretty much the same setup you do for a while and had no problems.. If you are still having problems, pm me your email address..

bigbw

Originally posted by Behrens77
I currently live in OV but will be moving to Marana (hartman lane and linda vista area). When I move D* has told me I will lose my E/W DNS networks and I can't get them back. I am currently grandfathered in at this address. Anyway what is my best option for an antenna? I really want to get HD but I wan to know if that is even possible. The antenna will be plugging into my HR10-250.

Don't tell them you have moved.. Just go onto their website and change your billing address.. They will never know and you can keep your DNS. You will have to get a new dish and have it installed yourself, but that should not be a problem.. I found a guy to do mine for $50

I'm curious what others have seen during the games yesterday.

Jets @ Steelers on KOLD:

I'm aware of the network problems at the beginning of the game. But did anyone see the regular "blackouts" during the rest of the game on KOLD? These were not like dropouts, but a second or so of complete black. I think there was still audio. It would happen at crucial moments and more often during a camera change. I didn't see it reported in the reception forum, so is this a station problem or just me? Thanks.

Rams @ Falcons on KMSB:

Did anyone see this game in HD? I switched over to my regular TV when I saw the beginning was in SD. Was it ever in HD? It looks like a local problem with the station. If it's the same today, I'd be real worried about SB!

Jets/Steelers - saw the same "blackouts"

Rams/Falcons - they made the switch during the 1st quarter. First time I've seen it happen late like that. Couldn't remember which Phx. station is handling the engineering or would have called during pre-game.

Re KMSB SD/HD yesterday. (You can all thank me later).

The football game yesterday started in SD. I called KMSB and could only leave a message. I called KTVK in Phoenix (they provide the signal) and no answer. I have the direct number to the KTVK Director of Engineering (Jim Cole) so I called. To my great surprise he answered the phone on Saturday night! I have spoken to him many times before while waiting to get FOX HD here. Anyway he said "wow, thats not right, he'll go see why". A few minutes later it was in HD.

The local operation here does virtually nothing (except the transmitter) to affect the signal. It is sent via a fiber optic line from KTVK. A manual switchover is required so it is easy to see how this can get messed up. Problem is it always happens at night or on the weekends when no one answers the phone. I was just lucky this time.

A lot of times you will see the programs switching between SD or HD or other problems like Carey reported. These are on on the network feed. It seems to happen a lot on CBS.

bluestar48,

Thanks for the reply. I guess those "blackouts" must be a local problem I hope the station is aware of. West Avra Wiz taking note. ;)

Looks like KMSB is working a bit better today.

Another note for West Avra Wiz, if you're reading this. Is it possible for you to look into the following very annoying problem?:

Usually, during the last part of any CBS broadcast (9-10 pm), the news has to put on some advertisement at the bottom of the screen which somehow switches the HD to SD and then back again. I'm sure you have seen this.

This distrupts the program for 5 sec or more as it must resync both ways. Both audio and video skips several seconds It almost certainly happens during the most crucial moment in the plot! I hope this is an easy fix. Thanks for listening.

Edit; Baba - Thanks for that :) Maybe you can PM me his direct line in case of emergency during Superbowl! Thanks.

Looks like there is no audio for the Patriots Colts playoff game on KOLD (on Comcast 182)

-Adam

Hello all,

Yes I have seen the recent "Blackouts" on the HD from KOLD. We have been seeing it coming directly from the CBS HDTV Receiver. Calls have been made and CBS is looking into it. We will have it cleaned up before next weekend for sure. There was another problem with that receiver today that is another symptom of the same problem. That being that the audio locked up for a while during the Game.. I had the guys there reset the receiver, after I was finally called, and it seems to be okay at the moment. If it continues, I will put the backup receiver online to get around the errant receiver.

A for the 9:50ish promo insert, that is called an "Eyeliner", and there is very little I can do about that at the moment. Sources get switched to put that little thingie in, and those sources are not in HD, so it has to go SD, get inserted, then back to the HD Stream. The only way around it at the moment, is to not run it, but my Promo Department would get irritated, after all the work they do to get it on the air in the first place.


-Work in progress, work in progress-

Folks:

Many thanks for this wonderful site....and for helping each other spread the news about HDTV. I would like to clarify one point regarding KGUN-HD and our relationship with cable companies. Recently our Chief Engineer was quoted as saying something to the effect that you would "never" be able to watch KGUN-HD on Cox or Comcast. That is not the case. We would love to have our Channel 35 viewers be able to watch us on cable. However, the cable companies must treat local broadcasters the same way they treat national program providers....that is to say.....to pay retransmission fees. We are only asking for a tiny fraction of the fees that are doled out to ESPN, Lifetime, CNN, USA, etc. Yet, cable operators refuse in spite of the fact that most cable subscribers watch local stations. The issue is FAIRNESS. Cable companies are able to recover their investments in digital and HD....yet local broadcasters are not! I am sorry to have to put viewers in the middle of this fight, but we believe the future viability of "free, over the air television" is at stake. Ray Depa, Vice President & General Manager, KGUN-TV.

Ray,

Thanks so much for bringing this issue up, I hope you know you've opened a can of worms. I've wanted to discuss this subject with someone 'on the inside' for a long time. While I totally disagree with your position, I think I understand it and can't really fault you for taking it, even to the detriment of your viewers. FWIW, here are some of my thoughts on the subject in no particular order. None of my comments are intended as a personal attack on you or KGUN, I'm simply trying to understand why CABLE viewers should now pay for 'free' TV when they haven't all these years (though I suspect you and others never agreed with that either). Please feel free to correct any misconceptions on my part (or ignore the whole post if you want).

1. Analog KGUN is free OTA and while cableco's don't pay you cash for retransmission, they do provide you some consideration, though I am not privy to just what that is.

2. DTV is more expensive than analog and you are looking for a way to recoup your investment. Unfortunately, IMO you and others have chosen to make cable viewers do the paying rather than be forced to raise advertising rates.

3. Satco's are in the process of adding HD locals around the country. I assume you fully intend to charge them for the right to retransmit your signal and may even have agreements already in hand.

4. Cable and satellite are just conduits for transmission of your signal that allow your viewers to get all their programming from a single source and eliminate the need for an antenna. If cable provided nothing more than retransmission of local signals while charging the current basic cable rate, they would go out of business.

5. If all viewers wanted were local channels, they'd simply hang an antenna and be done with it. People do not subscribe to cable to get local stations, they subscribe to get all the other stuff and locals just make things a tad easier.

6. If cable didn't offer locals, then cable STBs would be just like satellite STBs and include an OTA tuner for antenna inputs. If that were the case, you couldn't make a case for charging us. However, once digital locals are added to satellite lineups, then their subscribers will be in the same boat as cable viewers, being asked to pay twice for the same product.

7. Cable and satellite viewers already pay the same price as OTA viewers for the products offered by your advertisers. Why should we have to pay another fee, no matter how small, just because we prefer not to put up an antenna?

8. Then, too, the price you are asking may seem small to you, but when all stations demand the same consideration, the result is an increase in cable and satellite rates, all caused by 'free' TV. Next you'll want a bigger piece of the 'local' pie based upon ratings.

9. While most cableco's certainly want to carry local signals of the national networks (ABC, CBS, etc.), they don't necessarily want to carry many of the others. Unfortunately, the 'must carry' rules don't allow them any leeway. And, those 'must carry' rules will eventually apply to the main digital channels once analog goes away.

10. The viewer IS caught in the middle. Cable doesn't want to pay for 'free' TV and have to raise their rates. You want them to pay so you don't have to raise ad rates. We don't want to pay because local TV is already paid for by ad rates. A nice little Catch-22 if you ask me.

11. Cable companies did not mandate the upgrade to digital TV, yet you expect cable and their viewers to reimburse you for your costs. I suspect you've always wanted cable to pay, but the current 'must carry' rules have been in the way. Now is just a perfect time to bring the subject to a head.

12. Satellite viewers just sit on the sidelines thinking this is only a headache for cable viewers. If you win and cable viewers lose, satellite viewers will be the next target.

13. While the lines between you and all the cable/sat channels who also advertise may be a bit blurry these days, there are still significant differences. Though I can't point them out, I know they are there in all the legal documents, agreements, etc., the biggest of which is probably the amount of ad dollars you can command.

14. In short, as a cable viewer, you'll never convince me that KGUN or any other station is going to go under if cable viewers don't pay a second fee. IMHO, this is nothing more than a ploy to get more dollars out of the viewing public and make cable the bad guy. It is not unlike new fees the government charges so they can say they aren't raising taxes.

Again, nothing personal here. I know you work for someone and I know you are simply applying pressure where you can to pay for the DTV upgrades. However, many local stations are already on cable systems around the country. KGUN's owners are one of the group that has chosen to draw a line in the sand with you on one side and cable viewers on the other. It's very sad that it has come to this, but so be it. Powers a lot bigger than me will sort it all out. Unfortunately for you, that may mean an overall loss IMO. I've already found that I can do without a lot of shows/channels I used to think were important. While I prefer not to give them up, I will join a growing list of 'ala carte' pricing advocates (who include Senator McCain) so I'm not forced to give into such demands. I pay for locals by buying the product advertised. Tha should be more than enough.

Originally posted by Ray Depa
I am sorry to have to put viewers in the middle of this fight, but we believe the future viability of "free, over the air television" is at stake. Ray Depa, Vice President & General Manager, KGUN-TV.

Ray,

I could understand your position on not allowing your digital channel 35 signal from being carried by the cable companies if the following things were not true. At this time and for the forseable future from what I have read your station is broadcasting OTA with inadequate power, with an inadequate antenna height and no deicing equipment that would allow the viewers in the Northwest areas to be able to receive your digital signal.

I have not been able to receive your signal for the last two or three weeks at all and prior to that rarely. I am able to receive the other stations digital channels OTA and now I can also get them through Comcast. I cannot understand why your station is unable to come to the same agreement that the other stations were able to reach with the cable company.

I would think that your main goal would be to try to hold on to your viewers not let them move to other stations that attempt to make HD viewing available to the consumer. I know if I can watch a show I always choose from the shows available in HD. I have found that I just never find myself watching your station al all any longer. I would think that a large number of upper scale viewers that have made a large investment in HD television equipment would be of interest to your advertisers.

Here is my 2 cents;
Ray, thank you very much for becoming visible on this Forum. The other station managers don't have the guts.

Personally, I don't agree with your position but I also don't care since my OTA reception is just fine (and free).

I think the argument for free local HDTV goes back to its origin, the FCC mandated the start of digital. Most of your investment is for that and there was never any intent for you to be able to recover those costs. In other words, you had to do it. It was, however, your choice to pass through the HD signals. You didn't have to do that. So, why did you?

There is legislation being proposed to make the carriage of digital signals on Cable mandatory just like the analog.

Ray, I think in the long run your position will not prevail. Eventually the analog stations will disappear and the digital will be "free" to cable.
But, thanks again anyway for throwing in here. I hope you stay and participate more in spite of the flack.

Haven't seen any mention of it... but the recent switch putting KOLD on 13 on cox seems kind of like a compromise to get the HD signal (giving them the same cable channel as their OTA signal...) Is this just wishful thinking, or will we get KOLD-HD in the near future?

babakanoosh, I don't think he's been given ANY flack. He opened the door and some of us have questions. I simply stated what I see as the current state of affairs and was hoping he'd respond with his thoughts on the subject. I'm more than willing to see their side of things, but right now I just see it as a way to get cable/sat viewers to pay for what has traditionally been free, OTA or otherwise. I might be more inclined to agree with them if all stations were involved and not just those owned by certain individuals/companies.

Chill DoubleDAZ. If you read my post you will see I was brief but I agreed with you. When Ray posted 3 of us responded against his position. I see he hasn't come back (yet). I hope he does.
KGUN is owned by Emmis Communications. Emmis has been one of the most anti FCC rules companies. They have put the minimum resources they could get away with and still comply with the FCC rules on Digital transmission. Notice KGUN has not implemented a program guide like the other stations. Ray has little do do with whether KGUN digital will go on Comcast. It is an Emmis corporate policy.

Originally posted by Qwijib0
Haven't seen any mention of it... but the recent switch putting KOLD on 13 on cox seems kind of like a compromise to get the HD signal (giving them the same cable channel as their OTA signal...) Is this just wishful thinking, or will we get KOLD-HD in the near future?
Quijib0 - if you go back to page 27 of this thread, you would find that on the 5th...
Originally posted by West Avra Wiz
1) Some good news... KOLD will be in HD on Comcast by this Monday. Maybe even Friday if we can get the Transmitter to cooperate. Cox may be a couple more weeks, but this should be good for Comcast people .
I wonder if they will wait until Feb 15th and do it the same time that they turn on Discovery HD for the people that didn't subscribe to it (pure speculation, NO facts to back that up).

Watching the inauguration on HD today on KGUN was certainly nice, although some face closeups certainly show the downside of this technology!

Originally posted by babakanoosh
Chill DoubleDAZ. I am chilled. I was just trying to figure out why you think listing some assumptions and questions is giving someone flack. I guess simply disagreeing with their position and saying so could be construed as flack though, was that your point? :)

I posted on this thread about a week ago and recieved some very good feedback. Unfortunately my basic problem remians - I can't seem to pick up OTA digital signals.

I'm using a Samsung SIR-TS360 reciever with DirecTV. I want to catch OTA HDTV broadcasts so I first tied a clip on Terk antenna. That did no good so I went with an indoor antenna. Again no luck. I've just put up a RadioShack 18 element, 50 in. antenna, with diplexers on the roof and indoors, and pointed to 35 degrees, a reading I got off of antennaweb. However, although I've gone through the setup on my receiver and it searches for the signals and channels, all it displays is the satellite signals and some fuzzy analog pictures. When it gets to an OTA digital station it searches for a while, but nothing comes in.

I have a feeling this is operator error on my part. Is there anything obvious, or not so obvious, I've missed. I REALLY want the Superbowl in HD.

Thanks

McGinty

McGinty,
Where are you located in Tucson. Do you know if you have line of sight to the transmitters on Mt. Bigelow? Can you get the KUAS signal from Tumamoc Hill?

I'm downtown about four blocks due south of TCC.

McGinty

McGinty,
I think from your location you should get everything. I have a few questions. I apologize if they are over simplistic.

1. I assume your receiver is connected properly to your TV because you are seeing an on-screen setup display(?). Is it on HD inputs, DVI or component? Are you getting HD on DirecTV (ESPN, Discovery)?

2. I am not familiar with DirecTV but I used to have Dish. The setup/search for OTA channels is a separate process/setting. I also used to have VOOM and getting the OTA channels to work required VOOM to send the proper channel frequency info to my box. This took 24 hours after I was installed.

3. Have you tried a direct antenna connection without the diplexers?

4. From where you are 35 degrees sounds about right. That is 35 degrees clockwise from north. Aim you antenna just to the east of Mt Lemmon.

5. Can you have your receiver try to search for a specific channel (rather than scan for all?) It should be able to because that is how you add stations. Look for KGUN ch 35 or KVOA ch 23.

McGinty, you might have a defective Samsung. You could either return it or pick up another tuner somewhere to test.

Thought that might be the problem so I wired the antenna directly into the TV that also has a tuner and had the same issues. I may try to get on the roof today and move the antenna around while my wife tells me if anything comes in. I must say I'm surprised it's this difficult to pick up OTA signals. It'd be lot easier if DirecTV sent local channels in HD when broadcast.

McGinty

McGinty,
Are you saying your TV has a built in ATSC (HDTV) tuner and it doesn't work either?

I thiunk so. Its a Sharp LC-26GA5U HDTV. The specs say it TV-standard (CCIR) = American TV NTSC System.

I also just got off of the phone wiht Samsung, and they told me it must be in the antenna. I've played with the angle a little, but somehow I don't think that's it. If I was off it was only by a degree or two.

Still trying in Tucson

McGinty

Before I throw in the towel I have a few more questions for the group.

When I search for digital broadcasts, I get nada, zero, zip. It seems I should pick up something like a low quality digital picture. Is this an indication I have a problem with my connections or set up or are digitals all or none?

Also my antenna is a roof mounted element unit. Will it do me any good to get a larger element antenna or some other type of antenna.

Thanks in advance

McGinty

McGinty,

To me, it sounds like your receiver isn't seeing your antenna at all. If you have enough cable, try running directly from the antenna to the receiver, with no splitters, or diplexers. If you still get nothing, it may be the receiver. In your location you really should get most channels, both Digital and Analog from an antenna indoors. There may be something you're doing up at the antenna, or in between, but is sounds like no signal is getting from A to B.

Originally posted by babakanoosh
McGinty,
Are you saying your TV has a built in ATSC (HDTV) tuner and it doesn't work either? I think he thinks so, but everything I read on Sharp's website says this TV needs an STB (cable, sat, OTA) to view HD. The built-in tuner is simply a standard cable-ready NTSC tuner. If he connected the antenna directly to it and still couldn't even get regular analog signals, it looks to me like something is wrong with the antenna itself, the cable from the antenna, or the way it's connected.

McGinty, can you see the antennas (at night the lights) on the mountain from your roof? If so, you should have a great signal. I think it may be in the cable. As advised, you should remove the diplexers which rob signal strength and test again, then, if that doesn't work, run a temporary RG-6 cable directly from the tuner to the antenna to test for a wiring problem.

You could also run it directly to your TV antenna input which should pick up some analog signals. The UHF end of your antenna should be pointing directly at Bigelow mountain, btw. The wires that connect the various antenna elements should not be touching anything and the connector at the antenna should be secure.

And I assume your Samsung is hooked directly to one of the Video Inputs on your TV.

And have you tried babakanoosh's suggestions?

Those are my current ideas. Good luck!

First of all, thanks everyone for your suggestions. Unfortunately I still don't have it working.

I disconnected the cable from the satellite dish and ran it directly from the antenna to the ant. plug in the receiver, i.e. I pulled both diplexers. Again a few fuzzy analog channels, but no digital.

I did find the Samsung receiver has a digital TV signal meter in it. I seem to get signals, but they max out at about 55%. Usually they are around 45%. Again, nothing shows up on the screen.

One other complicating factor I failed to mention is that in addition to the satellite on the roof I also use COX for my phone and high-speed INTERNET connection, but no TV signals. I'm now wondering if this isn't interfering with my digital OTA pickup.

Thanks again.

McGinty

You should have a viewable picture with signal strengths you are reporting. On my Hitachi I got pictures with it in the 40s. That's not to say that all these numbers mean the same thing. As my new Sony reports the same signals in the 70s! Go figure.

So you are getting a signal, but it's not getting to your TV. You should have some good analog signals. Have you tried your built-in tuner again with the direct wiring? You won't get HD/digital, but you again should get some reasonable analog, like 4 or 6.

I don't think Cox has anything to do with it, especially since you are going directly from the antenna to the receiver.

McGinty,
Hold onto your towel. This has to be a simple problem.

Don't play with your antenna yet, it is probably not your problem. It sure sounds like your receiver is either not setting up properly or defective (not likely). Since you have tried different antennas all that is left is the coax itself. Try a different one with your indoor antenna. Where you live the indoor may work just fine.

I looked up your TV and it does not have an ATSC tuner so you need an STB like you have, the Samsung. So running the antenna directly into your TV will not work.

I downloaded the manual for your receiver. On pg 47, step 4 you must choose the channel type. Choose Digital Sources (ATSC).

Are you getting the DirecTV HD channels, ESPNHD, DiscoveryHD?

Is it me or is the Falcons/Eagles not being shown in HD? :confused:

Originally posted by adamshipley
Is it me or is the Falcons/Eagles not being shown in HD? :confused: Someone fortunately woke up. I hope this doesn't happen during Superbowl! :rolleyes:

I have been selecting Digital and scanning for channels, but no luck.

Several folks have mentioned succuss using the Zenith Silver Sensor indoor antenna. I f I go that route, I bypass the diplexers and any potential conflicts with my INTERNET feed. Does anyone know where I can purchase one in Tucson?

McGinty

Try Sears, they carry them.

I doubt it will do any good though. You've already bypassed the diplexers, etc., used a known good cable (the one you get your D* signals on), and tried 2 different antennas. Since you also tried the antenna with your built-in tuner and get only some fuzzy analog, that would seem to indicate the Samsung tuner is probably okay too.

I don't suppose you have another TV sitting around that you could connect the antenna to and see if you can get any signals that way? You didn't say whether or not you tried scanning for analog channels, just digital. If you did and still get anything, it sure looks to me like there is something blocking all the signals (and it's not the cable modem connection). Did you go out at night to see if you can actually see the lights on the towers? Are there buildings or trees in the way?

Sears has the Silver Sensor for $39. I use it with our new Sony and it works great bringing in the local channels. Be sure to save box and receipt and Sears will take it back if it doesn't work for you.

Richard

I live in Oro Valley but may soon be moving to marana near linda vista and hartman lane. Would the silver sensor get me any HD feeds out there or do I have to get a roof mount antenna?

A few months ago Sears was selling it, I think for $40. You can buy it on-line for $30 but you can return the one at Sears. I have seen the Silver sensor work better than others but not to the extent to which you are having problems.
I really don't understand why you do not have good visibility of the towers. Have you determined whether you have clear line of sight to the transmitters on Mt Bigelow? Are you blocked by buildings or trees?

In cases of marginal reception, like my own and maybe like yours, it makes a big difference with your receiver design. All reeivers are NOT equal. I have never tested the TS360 but other Samsungs I have seen are not great performers in marginal conditions. The only way to verify this is to try a different one. On this forum I have recommended people try the USDTV receiver if for no other reason than to see if they can do better than their current receiver. You can buy it at Walmart for $200 and return it within their 60(?) day policy. It is only for OTA but it is an amazing performer. There are others that work well too, like the LG latest models. If the USDTV one doesn't work nothing you do with antennas is going to help. I strongly recommend you try this if you can.
I have also tested the Dish Network, another DirecTV receiver (I can't remember the model but I think it was a Sony) , and the VOOM receiver. Their performance was in the order I listed them (worst to best) but none were as good as the USDTV or the LG. I know people who have satellite and have had to purchase a separate OTA receiver to get good reception. BTW newer HDTV's, I think over 31", have built in OTA receivers. Of course if you want program guide integration with satellite you have to use one of theirs (if it works).

There is a new Silver Sensor coming out soon. Read more here:

http://www.press.ce.philips.com/apps/c_dir/e3379701.nsf/alle/0252CAB643C9D72BC1256F72003FE03A?opendocument

Sears at Park Place has them, but if you can't get a direct connection to your roof antenna to work I wouldn't expect it to help. There's something else wrong here.

If you haven't done it (per the Cox comment), you should string a completely separate coax temporarily to the roof to eliminate any possible interference.

Hang in there!

I can vouch for the USDTV receiver that babakanoosh talks about.

Though I have not yet tried it at my location, I had recommended it to a friend located at Houghton and Rita Rd. He has a direct line of site to Bigalow except for a neighbor's house in the way. For the antenna, he first tried a Silver Sensor from Sears but barely got one or two stations. He returned it and bought an 8-bay bowtie (like mine) mounted on his roof which he hand-pointed to the mountain. He now gets all the stations and doesn't need a preamp.

As a side note, he says CH 9-1 comes in at just 2 "clicks" less than max on his meter (unmarked) though he gets a few audio dropouts over the digital audio connection, as opposed to the analog L/R outputs. At my location on the west side, I barely receive 9-1 at 25% (was twice that before the last snow!), and I use a preamp. Though amazingly I can lock in at that level without audio dropouts using DD5.1 (MDP-120). When raining it seems to fall below 20% and I start losing the signal altogether.

Still fighting it.

Last night I went up on my roof and could see the lights from the Mt. Bigelow transmitters so I know my antenna was spot on. I then tried to reacquire the digital signals in the receiver's setup program but no good. I even turned the antenna 180 degrees on the off chance the antenna manual printed it backwards, but no luck. I then shot the antenna at Tummamoc Hill. There is a tree in between, but that's only about two miles away. Couldn't even pick up the PBS digital broadcasts.

Tonight I'll try to connect enough coaxial cable to run a line directly to the receiver from the antenna, but I'm not real hopeful. I'm still thinking this is operator error on my part but I've been through all the manuals and setup routines several times. It is creeping into my head that perhaps the receiver IS defective, but I'll try the coaxial cable first.

Frustrated in Tucson

(McGinty)

From your description of being able to see the towers you should be able to easily pick up everything with an indoor antenna like the silver sensor. My daughters can see the towers from near the freeway South of the base and gets all the channels on a silver sensor aimed towards Bigelow sitting on the TV in the living room. There are two walls in the way because the bedroom is between the antenna and the towers. Not only does she get all the digital off Bigelow she also still receives PBS on Tumamoc Hill and the Hispanic channel North of that.

McGinty, Now that we know you can see the towers, it cannot be your antenna. You should get all the stations easily with any antenna. You are so close to Tumamoc hill you should get it with a coathanger. I assume you are using UHF antennas. You have to try a different piece of coax.

An antenna on your roof is probably not necessary, A Silver Sensor sitting inside should work. And of course you wouldn't have the problem of a rotator.

Everything is then pointing at your receiver. You shouldn't just suspect it, you have to figure out how to get a diiferent one to try. It would be a very conclusive test. Even if it is operator error, trying a different receiver would show that. If it looks like a duck......................................

Finally some progress!

After trying every other combination I took babakanoosh's suggestion and coupled together enough coaxial cable to run a line directly from the antenna through a window to the receiver and was able to get very clear digital pictures. That tells me I won't be able to share a cable line with the satellite dish using diplexers.

I'll return the rooftop antenna and try the Silver Sensor. If it works it's about 1/3 the price anyway.

Thanks again. I'll check in when I get the Silver Sensor.

McGinty

Originally posted by McGinty
I disconnected the cable from the satellite dish and ran it directly from the antenna to the ant. plug in the receiver, i.e. I pulled both diplexers. Again a few fuzzy analog channels, but no digital. In view of your last post where you "strung together" enough cable to run from the antenna to the tuner, I guess I don't understand excatly what you were saying here. This sounded to me like you already tried a direct line from the antenna to the tuner, no?

Sort of.

In the past I'd disconnected the diplexers and ran the line from the antenna to the air in plug. However, it wasn't a new line. Rather it was the line that the satellite dish formerly was on so it went through the house into some black hole that sucked the OTA digital signals out! May have something to do with the cable INTERNET connection. Anyway it didn't work until I hung a new line directly from the antenna to the receiver. I still don't know why this all happened because I did receive my satellite signals the other way.

Anyhoo, I'm off to find a Silver Sensor and see how that goes.

McGinty

West Avra Wiz (or anyone else)

Do you have any further details on when Channel 13 HD is coming to Cox? Cox has put out a lot of information about their new lineup where they are shuffling around a lot of channels, but there has been no mention of 13 in HD anywhere.

Originally posted by McGinty
so it went through the house into some black hole that sucked the OTA digital signals out!ROTFLMAO! Great way of saying it. :)
May have something to do with the cable INTERNET connection. I still doubt it's the internet connection unless you have 1 or more splitters in play and not enough signal getting from the antenna to the OTA part of the tuner. It's pretty hard to tell withput knowing exactly how everything is connected and what cables are being used. Hopefully, the Silver Sensor will do the trick and you won't end up having to do some major cabling work.

I did some checking around today...

It seems our Corporate guys are still negotiating with their Corporate guys. Cox has gotten a liitle weird lately, and have changed their position several times. They're re-arranging channels all over the state. I will let you all know if anything happens, but I can't give any dates, since I have no idea how it's going.

-Work in Progress, Work in Progress-

Success!!!!

I went to Sears and picked up a Silver Sensor, plugged it in and am now picking up the local HD broadcasts! My only problem now is I need to get the antenna a little closer to a window because I live in a rammed earth house. The walls are two feet thick. No big deal because I have so much coaxial left from running a temporary line from my roof into the house!

Thanks everyone for your suggestions.

McGinty

Anyone receive CSI last night on CBS 13-1 either OTA or on Comcast?

Normally, I don't watch 9 PM CBS programs due to that "eyeliner" which pi$$ed me off for the last time a while ago. Are there now problems with 13-1 again in general? I recieved the signal at 53%, yet it was broken up and unwatchable 90% of the time. I noticed it was an SD broadcast when I could get the signal, so something is going on.

It seems like all the stations have now reduced power, including 11-1 (was 75%, now 50%). I'm still amazed I can get 9-1 with only a couple of dropouts or freezes at 25-30%. Any lower, and it's gone.

Anyone with Comcast know if DD5.1 is working yet on FOX (11) HD? Do you see the same problems noted above, on CBS (13) HD? Thanks.

Hi folks,

Just out of curiousity, does anyone live in Saddlebrooke. We will be moving there in about a year, currently living in Surprise. According to antennaweb.org looks like I will be SOL, sort of, in getting much in the way of HD OTA channels.
It only lists 18-1 and 42-1.....disappointing. However, I have found that antennaweb is not always accurate, so that's why I ask the question, hoping they are wrong.

TIA,

Rich

I was on the FCC site today and noticed some stations have started to file the channels they want to keep when analog is dropped. The following Phoenix and Tucson stations have chosen to stay on UHF, KASW-49,KTVK-24,KTTU-19,KMSB-25,KOLD,-32, AND KUAT-30. The others have not yet filed.
Tom

WOW! Just got a Samsung T451 and a Silver Sensor. I am picking up 11-1, 9-1, 4-1, and 18-1 with no problem. KOLD 13-1 is working but is very sensitive to the antenna location and sometimes breaks up even with a very strong signal. Is this normal for 13-1?

I have a clear line of sight to the Antennas and live at Valencia and Houghton.

Now I'm ready for the SUPERBOWL!!

Friday night, pixeling on 13-1, even with a strong signal level. Anyone else notice this? I just added some coax to my antenna and would like to rule that out as the cause. Other channels seem just fine.

KOLD problems tonight on Comcast same as OTA so it is not your setup.

Anyone in Tucson try the $200 US Digital box from walmart out? I want to go OTA for the superbowl and I have a roof mounted anntenna that gets most analog UHF channels. I live on the eastside North of Broadway and Camino Seco.

I live on the West Side off of Anklam past greasewood and had problems with 13-1 also.

My question is with 11-1. It was working fine but now it does not. All the other channels are working fine in the 80-90% range. I am not sure what the problem is. It has not been working for about 10 days but tonight i was surfing and it worked, came back later and it did not. Before it was reading in the 70-80% range and now 0%.

Is anyone else having problems with 11-1 in the last couple of weeks? And are there any solutions?

adash66,
I have posted a few times that the USDTV box is an excellent OTA receiver. It has component video output, no DVI (I can't see any difference). It has DD 5.1. Where you live you have a good chance of needing only an indoor antenna. This would help if you need to rotate your antenna to KUAS (PBS HD) or WB which are not on Mt Bigelow.

Hi folks, I am frustrated by trying to get my local hd channels in. I have first tried the amplified set top antenna and now I went to the Terk clip on unit. No go. Oh ya I have a Hitachi HD ready TV with a samsung t351 decoder. I live at La Canada and Orange Grove neer La Cima middle school. All I get is PBS...BOOOORing. I guess Comcast has a new unit out that I could get through my cable but they are out of boxes right now!!! Any ideas?

Thanks Baba,

I'm mostly concerned with the CBS, ABC and FOX HD feeds. So I'll try to get a cable run from my roof anntenna and keep the COX HD for PBS. Any word on progress for getting WB or UPN OTA?

AD

adash, WB says the middle of 2005. UPN as soon as KTVK (Phx) installs the equipment. I will check with them this week. Not much HD on those anyway.

riosrancho, read recent posts on this form about antennas. You haven't tried a good one yet. Where you live you are just on the edge of line of site to Mt. Bigelow. Since you get PBS, we know your setup is OK. Assume you know what direction to point. So, try these in order
1. Run a direct coax from antenna to receiver. No diplexers. No amplifier.
2. Try the Zenith Silver Sensor indoor.
3.Try a 4 element screen array for outdoor (ChannelMaster or Winegard)
4. Try a different (better) receiver like USDTV or LG

Thanks Baba.....I will give those a try.

Since this is a Tucson area forum, I thought I would ask if anyone has a recommendation for a heating and air conditioning repair company? Our old heat pump has decided to stop heating and I need to get someone to repair or replace it.

Any recommendations on honest, reasonable priced, service companies?

Pat

UPDATE: My neighbor ended up recommending someone (Al's Heating and Cooling) and he was out here in about an hour. Fixed the unit, replacing a relay, recharging, and it seems to be working again. It's 22 years old so it's "one day at a time" and every day it works is a blessing!

Hello Tucson

Im from the Omaha NE thread. Looks like we have the same problem. Emmis owns one of your stations (KGUN) in the area and they will not let them put there HD Channel on Cable as they want Money for a Free over the air channel.

Please help and Email Emmis and let them know what you think.

===============Pasted from the thread==============

Looks like over in the Omaha-Lincoln Ne Thread the Cox Cable Emmis issue is still alive.

Emmis pulled there CBS HD from Cox cable one year again demanding money for the free over the air channel.


Here is the thread:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/show...&pagenumber=130


Here is some info on who to Email- pated from the thread

Here are the EMAIL Addresses for the Top VPs at Emmis Corp (the ones who own KM3 and the ones who made them pull the HD).

Cut and Past Comma delimited:

rmena@emmis.com,desayian@emmis.com,kate@emmis.com,staffingde partment@emmis.com,ir@emmis.com,wzberger@emmis.com,rcummings @emmis.com

(below is a line by line list)

Please Email them weekly and ask for the free HD channel to be put back on.



KM3 and Emmis one year ago said they pulled there HD Feed because cox was charging for it and making money on it.

Things have changed in the last year.

Now all cable systems in a Emmis area offer the Local HD channels FREE unscrambled via free QAM channels.

This means the Emmis reasoning is no longer valid. They have no reason to demand money for a FREE OVER THE AIR HD Signal.

After all the Government, our tax money gave them the channel. We should be able to watch it free over the air and free on cable.

It is time for Emmis to add KM3 HD back to Cox.



rmena@emmis.com
desayian@emmis.com
kate@emmis.com
staffingdepartment@emmis.com
ir@emmis.com
wzberger@emmis.com
rcummings@emmis.com

I would like to hear from members living in the Northwest section of the Tucson area (center point would be Oldfather & Cortaro Farms). I am interested to find anyone who has been successful receiving HD signals OTA. I can receive 27.1 with a roof mount DB4 and while the scan finds all of the other channels, the rest merely say "no signal". How is it possible for people in the Phoenix area to get signals from Mt Bigelow when I can't at less than 30 miles away. Can they actually see the tower from their positions. You get the idea...

On Sunday we disconnected our HDTV from everything to install a new entertainment center from Ikea. We put everything back last night (Monday) and since then we cannot get a steady strong signal from KOLD 13.1 OTA with our Silver Sensor. We had no problem before this. I'm wondering if it is because we have moved the antenna higher or is it in the transmission. Tonight, on Comcast, the speech is not synchronized with the their lips on KOLD.

Could someone let me know if they are also having trouble or is your reception ok?

Thanks, Richard

13-1 was so bad on Sunday it caused my computer to crash with a BSOD, using the MyHD card. It took me several reboots just to get off the channel so I could finally use my tuner with the other stations.

I remember this happening long ago when their PSIP tables were all screwed up. The signal was all broken up as well, from what I saw of it. I won't go near that station again until I hear they are back to normal. Not this close to Superbowl, anyway! For now, it's off my list.

Let'er rip,
27.1 comes from Tumamoc Hill not Bigelow.
What kind of receiver are you using?
Are you saying your receiver scan finds all the digital channels but when you tune to them it says no signal?
Does it display a signal level? How do the levels compare with 27.1?
Where you live you will be lucky to get the Bigelow stations, but don't give up yet.

Some people in parts of Phoenix can get Tucson digital stations and same for the reverse. People up in Oracle can get Phoenix. You have to electronically see it, no obsticles, but it can be 100 miles way. The issues in receiving are complex, the main one being multipath. Multipath means you receive several signals from the same station at different phases from reflections off the terrain or buildings. One of them may be a line of sight signal. Where you live, it is probably all multipath. Your receiver has to pick out one and stay locked on it. This is hard if these signals are of similar strength. Antenna gain, directionality, and position are important. Higher up is not necessarily better. Sometime intentionally mis-aiming works better.
As you point out, in Tucson we are actually very close to the towers. We also get a lot of multipath from the mountains. In my own case where I live, Oro Valley, I was told it is impossible. It took a lot of work and experimenting but I now get everything, and very reliably. So give us more info and we will try to help you.

Thanks for the response, baba.
Here are the answers to your questions. The receiver is a Sony, SAT-HD200. Yes, the digital channel scan in setup finds 4.1, 6.1-5, 9.1, 11.1, 13.1, 18.1, and 58.1. I knew about the location of 27.1 and the signal strength is in the normal range (Bad-Normal-Good). When I tune to anyone of the other channels, the meter doesn't register and the display reads "No signal".
FYI - From a GPS standpoint, my antenna is pointing 75 degrees east of mag north. This was based on a crude calculation using the longitude/latitude of my house and Mt Bigelow.
Again thanks for the help. By the way, I don't plan on giving up period.:D

Let'er rip,
Sounds like you know what you are doing so I'll skip the simple stuff. I assume you have tried a direct coax, no diplexers or splitters. You are using the best antenna style.
In tough reception areas, I have found the most important factor is the receiver design. I am not familiar with the Sony SAT-HD200, but it appears to be a 2 or 3 year old model. Receiver design has changed an awful lot over that time period. I am guessing yours is a first generation design. The industry is now up to fourth or fifth. What the manufacturers have been working on is improving multipath rejection, exactly your problem. I have posted on this forum before about this. There is an enormous difference between them.
So, although this may seem a speedy analysis, I recommend you find a way to try a newer receiver. The best one to try is the USDTV sold at Walmart for $200. Their return policy is good. You can search earlier posts for details, but I have tested many receivers for OTA reception (including DirecTv, Dish, and Voom) and the USDTV is the best for OTA. I don't remember the model DirecTv one I tested but it was pretty bad, almost as bad as Dish. Newer LG models are very good also.

I spent considerable time a year ago trying to get OTA reception (with a Dish 811 box). I tried many antennas and amplifiers and mapped my whole yard for antenna placement. I was able to find different places for each station where it worked better. I used to move my antenna around a lot (on a little tripod). For other reasons also I was frustrated with Dish so I decided to try Voom. Their OTA reception was wonderful. The satellite system sucked so I dumped it quickly, but that started me on testing other receivers also for OTA.
So, again, your best chance is with a different receiver. I hope you can try it.

I have had the HD200 for about a year and a half now so your thoughts are probably right on. I will give the USDTV a try and let you know. Thanks again for you attention.

Hello All,

13.1 IS having a problem or two. Sometime over the weekend, the Waveguide from the receive antenna sprung a leak from ice damage, and took on water. This did a number of things, most noticeably being that the Transmitter is on, but not receiving a consistent stream. Water droplets act like switches blocking and passing the signal, until they are drained, or vaporized. We have a trip scheduled to assess the full amount of damage, and to see how much Waveguide needs to be replaced. We can patch around it for a little while, but the entire run of Waveguide will need to be replaced soon, and that's about 400ft of Waveguide and verrrrry expensive stuff.

I should have an answer to when the replacement can be done, by early next week. Cleaning up and patching will be done by this weekend, but then, nobody's gonna be watchin us this weekend sooooo.. hehe guess we wont miss much.

-Work in Progress, Work in Progress-

I recently purchased a HDTV (Toshiba 62HM84) and not knowing much about hi-def, thought I would be able to get it via cable (COX here in Green Valley). It was tough to find anyone at COX who knew about hi-def, but I finally determined that for an extra $25 per month (over and above the $40 per month for expanded basic service), I could get 3 or 4 hi-def cable channels along with KUAT, but no other local Tucson channels.

I then ordered a refurbished Samsung SIR-T351 ATSC receiver and a silver sensor antenna. The Samsung arrived yesterday and the silver sensor is on backorder from Amazon. Not wishing to wait forever, I powered up the Samsung and connected it (via a short piece of coax) to a small copper wire loop. WOW! I am able to receive KVOA, KUAT, KGUN, KMSB, KOLD (although it is very intermittent) and a couple of other Tucson stations. One would hope that I will get even better signal strengths when the silver sensor arrives.

I just found this forum today, and it looks like there is lots of good info for me to read (in my spare time).

Originally posted by West Avra Wiz
Hello All,

13.1 IS having a problem or two. Sometime over the weekend, the Waveguide from the receive antenna sprung a leak from ice damage, and took on water. This did a number of things, most noticeably being that the Transmitter is on, but not receiving a consistent stream. Water droplets act like switches blocking and passing the signal, until they are drained, or vaporized. Any chance the PSIP data was also updated about this same time to meet the 2/1 FCC deadline? Thanks.

babakanoosh
In some of your posts you have also mentioned LG. They have combo DVD/HDTV tuner (LST3510A). What do you know about this little feller and how does the tuner compare to the USDTV's?

Any chance the PSIP data was also updated about this same time to meet the 2/1 FCC deadline?

Actually no, Carey. We did not have to do any "updating" for the new FCC rules. Our PSIP has been compliant with "the Rules" for nearly year or so now. We've been running a three day guide for over a year, and all our ETT's, EIT's, DET's, VCT's are there, and our SST is less than one second off from GPS time.

Now, if we could just get the Transmitter from... umm... err... France to cooperate...

-Work in Progress, Work in Progress-

Hi all
There have been a few questions about reception on the NW side and what can and can not be received. I live near Thornydale and Linda Vista, N. Camino de Oste & Linda Vista to be specific (Mountain View H.S./ Arthur Pack golf course/park area). I can receive ALL of the local digital stations. Yes, ALL of them. From what I have read, and experience with friends in a 5 mile radius I must be in a sweet spot. I'm using a Channel Master 4228 8 bay bow tie, radio shack pre-amp, VOOM sat for OTA , and a Zenith OTA for back up (original before VOOM). My lowest signal ironically is on NBC which reads 89 signal quality, 84/14.03 S/NR. but it is the station with the least, if any problems. CBS every now and then gives the VOOM fits in which case I switch over to the Zenith and it works like a champ. I've noticed when CBS starts going haywire, I check the numbers on VOOM and the SNR is all out of whack, jumping from 23+ SNR to 0 and back. The VOOM box gives 3 different numbers, one for signal quality, one for signal strength, one for SNR (signal/noise ratio) My antenna is mounted on my chimney facing Mt Lemon/Bigelow at about 73-72 degrees. All channels signal strength is between 84 - 98, with FOX being the highest. If there is anything I can do to help anyone with their setup please ask. I have been enjoying local OTA now for a exactly a year on the 5th of this month. I have done much trial and error, with an assortment of antennas, pre amps and STB's ( which is becoming quite a collection if anyone needs equipment). And if you would like to see what each channels signals are doing using the VOOMs great different signal reading/numbers, you are welcome to come by. FYI when CBS goes out on the VOOM stb, the Zenith is rock solid and almost never drops, and is ALWAYS solid day or night on the other locals. For those trying to get digital OTA, keep trying, according to antenna web.org I should not be geting anything except PBS, which I can get with a coat hanger if need be. Try the Zenith stb. others have had luck with the walmart stb. I have not used it but can say that the Zenith has never lost CBS even when others on this board can not get it.
Good Luck

redHead

A lot of people have talked about the USDTV receiver which is available at Walmart. They were supposed to come out with 5th generation LG 8VSB tuner chipsets in them. Does anyone know how to tell if the unit has the old ATI tuner
or the new one?

Tom

Originally posted by tockcc
A lot of people have talked about the USDTV receiver which is available at Walmart. They were supposed to come out with 5th generation LG 8VSB tuner chipsets in them. Does anyone know how to tell if the unit has the old ATI tuner
or the new one?

Tom

The USDTV units with the LG 5th generation chip were going to be available no sooner than June 2005 and from what I have been reading the chip at this point is only going to be available in the ATSC built in tuner LG TV's. They are saying no STB's with the chip are planned at all at this point.

Let 'er rip (and REDHEAD).
I had tested the LG 3200A, worked well. Just like REDHEAD, my OTA reception was good with the VOOM box also. LG is Zenth so it is reasonable that newer Zenith STB's are good also. Its hard to compare tuners other than you lock on the signal or not. The various level indications cannot be compared across brands. They measure different things but for us here in parts of Tucson, like the Northwest,, multipath rejection is the problem and they don't measure that. My USDTV levels are >90% on all stations. The reason I have suggested the USDTV to try (to see if the problem is your receiver) is its local availability (Walmart), easy return policy, and low cost.

Actually I have found a minor problem with the USDTV. Every once in a while (once a month) it seems to lose the channel table. I think it is because it goes and scans for the USDTV channels (we have none here), and loses the whole table. If I unplug/plug it back it recovers. I can live with this. I used to have to do that with my Dish 811 quite often (for many problems) and I have also seen it with my Comcast box.

I have been gone for a couple of weeks and tried to watch channel 13-1 today and get no signal. All other channels work fine. Is channel 13-1 working for anyone? Do not want to go on the roof and see if the antenna got blow around for nothing.

Hello all,

Just to let everyone know, KOLD has had a problem for a while, but we are back up now. We still have to schedule a major re-work, to fix a broken Waveguide, but we need to dig up some serious money first. I will let you all know when that will happen, but it will very likely be before the Dreaded "March Madness" starts up.

Keep the comments coming, we need to know how we are doing...

-Work in Progress, Work in Progress-

Thanks for the reply on the USDTV tuner. I bought one just to try from Walmart.
Comparing it to a Samsung SIRT 151 it receives local signals much better than the Samsung. I am in Scottsdale and had trouble receiving some of the stations because of Multipath as I am aimed at Tucson. The USDTV is also slightly better on distant signals. Between Phoenix and Tucson the only channels that are some what weak are 9, and 11.
Guide is really good. It lists programs and information.
The only bad thing I see is twice since I got it yesterday it said no video on all channels and once I lost the sound on all channels. To fix you must unplug and replug. I believe this happened when I was on a weak station.

Tom

tockcc,
A few posts back I noted about the USDTV losing the channels. I have also seen it lose the sound. I have seen it lose the sound on one channel and then not work on the others. I have seen other brand receivers do this very same thing so it is not unique to USDTV. When it can't get a channel that is previously scanned, bad things can happen. I have also seen it happen when stations have messed up PSIP. KOLD had that a lot for a while last year.

Baba,

Thanks as well for the US Digital Box tip. While my rooftop anntenna needs to be repointed. I am getting by with a set of "rabbit ears" pulling all local digital around 80-90%. I even got KOLD during the Prez address. ;) I have noticed a slight shimmer or wave motion near the top horizontal inch of my 57" screen turning HD &SD signal less noticeable Thursday than on Wed. I will try and replace the cheap coax on my "rabbit ears." Was wondering if any others have noticed this effect ?

The white line at the top of the screen on the USDTV is on mine also and I have heard it mentioned before so might be on all of them.

tockcc, adash66
I checked my system, with USDTV receiver, and I don't see any white line or distortion at the top of the screen. Sounds like a problem in the TV. Just a thought, try changing the video mode of the USDTV between 1080i and 720p and see if that makes any difference.

So the latest is I just got the 8300hd PVR from COX and an HDMI to DVI cable from SWS. The new box from COX seems much better than the 3250hd. Since this freed up a Component input on the TV I switched the USDTV box to direct in to the Sony bypassing my Harmon Kardon Reciever switch. So far no white line at the top of the screen. Hopefully I should be in good shape for the big game on FOX.
Thanks again for all the help.
AD

babakanoosh,
I purchased the USDTV from Walmart, climbed up on the roof with the receiver and a video monitor and attempted to lock in on at least 11.1 (25). I spent a good two hours scanning and rotating. The best I ever did was momentary 75 to 80% signals on 13.1 and absolutely nothing anywhere else (not counting the obvious channels). My hookup was a 12 foot RG6 cable directly from the DB4 (about 2 feet above the peak of the second story roof) to the USDTV. What the heck am I doing wrong.

Let 'er rip,

Is the monitor HD ready? If not, that could be the problem, at least, that was my experience when I first attempted my testing.

HTH,

Rich

sytyguy.
The monitor was a cheapy portable DVD player with video/audio in capability. Why on earth would that make a difference? At the signal locking stage why would'n't it be enough that the receiver is ATSC. Additionally, I did lock on to PBS's 27.1 (28) ????

What's a DB4? Can you see the antennas?

Let 'er rip,

Sorry, my mistake!!! You are correct. I forgot that my first attempt to get HD signals was with using a 15" portable TV with no HD receiver, sometimes I even amaze myself.

Sorry, no help here,

Rich

Let'er rip,
It doesn't sound like you are doing anything wrong. You should be able to use an SD 4x3 monitor just for looking at the setup screens for signal level. The fact that you can lock on 27.1 says your setup is OK. And thats the good news. Otherwise it seems you will not be able to get the signals, unfortunately. Does this mean the USDTV works the same as your old receiver?
I looked up the BD4 and it is a 4 bay bow tie with a screen behind it. I have found that to be the best type of antenna to use.
I am almost out of suggestions. At this point though I am still surprised you can't see any levels (except 27.1). Of course 27.1 is so close and line of sight you could get that with rabbit ears. Which leads to one other remote possibility. What if your antenna is not working right or not hooked up properly. Its hard to have a bad antenna,only a piece of metal (I assume you have no preamps or splitters). Is there any way you can try a different antenna? By the way, do you get 58.1, WB also?

Originally posted by Let 'er rip
sytyguy.
The monitor was a cheapy portable DVD player with video/audio in capability. Why on earth would that make a difference? At the signal locking stage why would'n't it be enough that the receiver is ATSC. Additionally, I did lock on to PBS's 27.1 (28) ????

I use the Antenna's Direct DB4 antenna indoors and I get all the channels quite easily other than 9.1 that is rarely good. If you got 27.1 to come in that antenna is on Tumamoc hill near A mountain to the South of you. Your antenna should be pointing NNE not South to get the Bigelow stations. I am in the NW area near Cortaro and Silverbell. From what I have heard from others the areas along Ina road pretty much any where is a tough area because it falls in the area blocked by Mt. Lemon.

baba, et al,
The setup attempt was conducted on the roof. There were only a couple of feet between antenna and receiver - no splitters and no amplifiers. With the antenna facing pretty much 73 degrees (17 north of east) the auto scan sequence locked 27.1, 40.1, & 58.1. Attempts were then made to manually scan/lock 4.1, 9.1, 11.1, & 13.1. For each channel, I manually rotated the antenna first to the north all the way to 0 degrees and then back through the original placement to approximately 100 degrees. Each cycle took about 20 minutes as I moved slowly and lingered along the way. As I had indicated before, the 13.1 signal registered in spurts (sounds like a prostate problem) but never long enough to lock. I am beginning to think that I must either wait for Directv or Comcast or talk the Mrs into moving. Thanks to all for the encouragement and help.

Let'er rip,
Sorry it is not working. I have to tell you some of my experiences because you may want to try it. Before I got the USDTV I had a Dish then a Voom receiver. I had trouble getting all the OTA stations. I moved my antenna around in my yard and found dramatic differences. I had different "sweet spots" for CBS, ABC and NBC. Fox was never good. In fact before I discovered an even better receiver i was content to have my antenna on a little tripod which I moved around my yard. The point is, if you don't have line of sight, height of antenna is not necessarily better. One of my sweet spots was lying the antenna on a lounge chair on my patio. In general, at that time, lower was better. A move of just a few feet could make a difference. The wavelengths of these signals makes that understandable. Closer to the wall of the house worked better too. I am guessing that was becasue the house and patio acted as a reflector or the mesh in my stucco walls acted like the screen on the antenna you have.I will admit it took me many days with careful notes to map my yard. So, before you give up, you may want to try this. Good luck.

I have had my USDTV for several days now and it is working great. I posted earlier that I lost picture on all channels a couple times first day but hasen't happened since. Sound is way to low on full though and I couldn't program it to a master remote.
In Scottsdale I get perfect reception on all 21 channels except 9 and 11 which are still at low power as I understand. 9 is good most of the time though.
I am using 4 bow tie antenna with no rotor.

Tom

1st CSI (Repeat) at 7pm HD
2nd CSI (NEW) at 8pm SD :(
via OTA on KOLD DT 13.1

Well, at least "Without a Trace" (9-10PM) was HD :)

so CSI was supposed to be in HD...

I didn't catch the 7pm, turned on the 8 only to see it in SD, and so I assumed that since we aren't on ET or PT right now, KOLD can't timeshift HD.

Usually it's all HD then?

On KOLD the audio is way off from there lips. Is this my receiver or does anyone else have this problem.
Tom

KOLD has this problem all the time.

Another thing I observed is that when KOLD puts an overlay on the screen (e.g., to display a news bulletin or other text message), they drop back to SD during the period the overlay is displayed. I find this a bit annoying. They do seem to have the ability to overlay their call sign in the upper right corner of the screen in both SD and HD modes with no impact on the rest of the picture.

Originally posted by adash66
Any word on progress for getting WB or UPN OTA?

I haven't had any problem getting WB SD DT OTA (woah... way too many acronyms...) Are you referring strictly to HD broadcasts?

Are you guys actually watching 13-1? I haven't seen anything on it for days. 0% signal.

13-1 is just fine. The signal level is normal, quite high on my receiver. They have started broadcasting in "spread-o-vision", like ESPN used to do (drives me nuts). I can't imagine that has anything to do with your problem, but maybe it does. Does your receiver have an SD output you can check or can you change the output format to check it?

KVOA has started doing spread-o-vision on 4-1 also, 4-2 has 4x3 with black bars. Do you get 4-1?

Regarding the "spread-o-vision, I notice that KOLD DT (ch 182) on Comcast does not do this. It has the usual 4x3 picture with the black bars on the side for SD programs. Maybe W Avra Valley Whiz can explain that.

Spread-o-vision! That sounds absurd. You mean people will all be fat when watching SD material and commercials? Anyway, I just re-checked and see that I was scanning for 13 and not 32! It's coming in fine now. Duh! :rolleyes: That's what I get for taking it off my favorites list for so long.

Never mind. Now that I see the Grammy's aren't in HD, it's back off.

Why are the grammys in SD tonight on 13? TitanTV says they are HD?

Originally posted by glenngreen
Why are the grammys in SD tonight on 13? TitanTV says they are HD?

I watched it in HD in channel 13 (at least for the second half).

Another questions for your guys out there, any one know when the local WB and UPN stations will broadcast in HD? I have been looking through TV guide and would love to see some of the shows the networks are broadcasting in HD!

Go to www.titantv.com for that info! Unfortunately, the new HD reality has settled into the old media as of yet.

Hi West Avra Wiz,

Congratulation to your guys for getting the 13.1 signal steady.

I am wondering if you can provide some insights on the HD coverage of NCAA Basketball Tournament. There will be over 30 games broadcast in HD, according to CBS. Do you know how many games on 13.1 will be in HD?

TIA.

Originally posted by phlewt
Another thing I observed is that when KOLD puts an overlay on the screen (e.g., to display a news bulletin or other text message), they drop back to SD during the period the overlay is displayed. I find this a bit annoying. They do seem to have the ability to overlay their call sign in the upper right corner of the screen in both SD and HD modes with no impact on the rest of the picture.

I was just about to point this out. :)

If a bug can be overlayed on HD, why can't news teasers? It doesn't appear that they're using a moving teaser, so the same hardware that does the bug should be capable of plain text at the bottom, shouldn't it?

Do you know how many games on 13.1 will be in HD?

I'm not sure yet. CBS isn't sure yet, only that they have they capability. Soon, there will be schedule posted for the locations where the trucks will be, but no one knows yet what games will be where. When I get a schedule, I will post it here. The problem is, we will only be allowed to show games that are assigned to us. We can't pick what to show (sigh).


Why are the grammys in SD tonight on 13?

Our HD Delay server crashed. It has done that a lot lately. Since we have to delay programming from CBS, if if fails to start on time, we have lost Program material. So we have to go SD, until the delay catches up to the server. During the Winter it's a 1 hour delay, and in the Summer it's 2 hours. In the Summer, it's almost impossible to catch up. By the time we know it failed, 2 hours of Programming are gone, so we can only pass the last hour in HD. It's complicated, and messy, but it's what we got.

Another thing I observed is that when KOLD puts an overlay on the screen (e.g., to display a news bulletin or other text message), they drop back to SD during the period the overlay is displayed.

I also find this very annoying, but there is nothing we can do about it. The process for placing a Logo, or "Bug", into the HD Stream is very different from placing an Ad or Promotional "Eyeliner". The primary difference is in it's creation. We have a HD Encoder that can place static and animated Logo's anywhere into the Stream. The device itself stays entirely in the HD realm so it appears, then disappears, with no changes to the Stream. To insert moving video, or Promotional "Eyeliners", we would need to create them in the HD realm. We can't do that yet. We would need an HD Master Control Switcher, that is extremely expensive. It is in Next years budget, as well as last years budget, but it has not been approved yet. I dislike the "Eyeliners" intensely, but our Promo Department deems them a necessary evil, so we have to back down to SD, then insert the "Eyeliner", then go back up to HD. It's rather disruptive, but it must be done.

-Work in Progress, Work in Progress-

The other option is to change viewing preferences and watch a different channel between 9 and 10 pm. That's what I've done. Good bye CSI Miami, hello Medium :cool: It's just not worth the agrivation of missing a climactic scene 10 min before the end of a show. But that's just me. :D

West Avra Wiz,
Why is the sound on KOLD out of sync with the lips all of the time? I thought it might be my receiver but other people say they have this problem too. I'm in Scottsdale and thought this might be a problem because of the distance but I don't have this problem on the other Tucson stations.

Thanks Tom

Originally posted by tockcc
West Avra Wiz,
Why is the sound on KOLD out of sync with the lips all of the time? I thought it might be my receiver but other people say they have this problem too. I'm in Scottsdale and thought this might be a problem because of the distance but I don't have this problem on the other Tucson stations.

Thanks Tom

I haven't seen this yet. I've watched several prime time shows so far, and have yet to see a sync problem.

"KOLD out of sync with the lips all of the time? "

ALL of the time? I can assure you that for the last five months or so, our audio is in sync, and locked to video when it is encoded into the Transport Stream. It comes from CBS that way, and we do nothing to change it. Of course that doesn't mean that a great Network like CBS can't screw up occasionally, because they do. Different setups on the receiver end can cause problems, and sometimes there are differences in analog audio vs digital audio. I have known some HD receivers that have had bad Optical output ports, and I have seen some Audio receivers that introduce delay with certain streams. A lot of it depends on how different gear handles the information, or "data" that we are transmitting. In other words, I know for fact, that everything is in sync when it leaves the station.

-Work in progress, Work in Progress-

Tom, you Scottsdale easedroppers need to leave us good people in Tucson alone! :-)

West Avra Wiz
Could be a problem with my receiver, I'll have to play with. I have a new USDTV receiver and overall works much better than my old Samsung 151.
Thanks Tom

Oh gee..Oh gee.. I wonder if KVOA, KMSB, KOLD and KGUN will maybe think of putting up repeaters so that I can receive their HDTV signals OTA..hell how about Analog signals? Only KVOA provides that to us in Sierra Vista.

naaahhh..Too easy to just force us to watch their stations in analog on DirectTV or Cable since I am not provided any of the other 3 OTA's here..

40,000 people with only analog from KVOA...wow..and we are mandated to watch their stations now..

I can't wait to go shopping...

IN PHOENIX!

If you guys want to start accumulating info about the current OTA, Cable, etc. HDTV status in Tuscon - I've cleared the first few posts so you can post the info for easy reference at the beginning of the thread.

Just post it here and Carey P will be able to copy it into the first post(s). You can put all the pertinent info, stations, contacts, etc. in the first post or separate it into OTA, Cable, FAQ, etc. in different posts. Either way, as the thread gets larger, newbies can be directed to the first post(s) for key info instead of searching through many pages.

Scratch the "no lip-sync problem"... Last night I watched both CSI and WOT, and both shows-- commercials included had the video leading the audio by about 1/2 second, so (I think), that rules out a netowrk problem.

tockcc-- I also have a 151, perhaps it's related to it specifically?

edit: WAW-- I saw your post about optical ports-- I'll try the coax port tomorrow night-- thanks for the suggestion.

Qwijibo
My old receiver was a 151. I'm using a USDTV receiver now and it has the lip sync problem too,so it's not just the 151.

Tom

Originally posted by CPanther95
If you guys want to start accumulating info about the current OTA, Cable, etc. HDTV status in Tuscon - I've cleared the first few posts so you can post the info for easy reference at the beginning of the thread.

Just post it here and Carey P will be able to copy it into the first post(s). You can put all the pertinent info, stations, contacts, etc. in the first post or separate it into OTA, Cable, FAQ, etc. in different posts. Either way, as the thread gets larger, newbies can be directed to the first post(s) for key info instead of searching through many pages. Thanks! I almost forgot I volunteered for this :D
I'll try to put something together soon to get it going.

Ok, I have read through most of the 35 pages but I don't see an answer for this:

When will Comcast of Tucson retransmit KVOA/NBC HD ?

I have used a 151 since Nov and I have never had the lip sync problem when I watch CBS.

Originally posted by bbbobbb
Ok, I have read through most of the 35 pages but I don't see an answer for this:

When will Comcast of Tucson retransmit KVOA/NBC HD ? I don't think there is an answer. When I asked Comcast a couple of weeks ago, they would not tell me when, only that it will happen someday.

Sunkist,
There have been some long discussions in this Forum on when/how/why HD locals would wind up being carried on cable. Neither the local cable companies or local stations can say much about it because they don't know. These discussions are between corporate headquarters of both. KVOA is owned by Evening Post Publishing and KGUN is owned by Emmis Communications. The disagreement is (obviously) about money. The stations want to get paid for this and Comcast says it will not, the implication is that Belo Corp (KMSB and KTTU) and Raycom (KOLD) agree with Comcast. There was a recent discussion here about KGUN including a post by their GM stating their position.

I have spoken to a mid level manager at Comcast HQ about this. The status is, in general, the Tucson operation is not very high on the totem pole for priorities, Emmis is dug in and Evening Post only owns one station so it is lowest in priority.

So no one knows when. It could be years. Or not.

Anybody having luck receiving 13-1 tonight. It looks like I lost it sometime over the weekend. All other channels come in fine.

Originally posted by smsprague
Anybody having luck receiving 13-1 tonight. It looks like I lost it sometime over the weekend. All other channels come in fine.

My guess is that their transmitted power was lowered for some reason. I didn't get 13-1 at all yesterday, and this evening the signal was present, but not strong enough for me to receive. I'm still waiting for Amazon.com to deliver me a silver sensor antenna, and that might have been enough to make the difference for me this evening. In any case, you are not alone -- I also am having trouble pulling them in -- and like you, I find all the other digital Tucson stations to be OK.

Originally posted by smsprague
Anybody having luck receiving 13-1 tonight. It looks like I lost it sometime over the weekend. All other channels come in fine.

In addition to not getting channel 13, I could not get channel 6. Has any one else experienced the problem with channel 6 tonight (Mon. 2-21)? My voom STB just got updated. I hope the update did not mess up anything.

Channel 6 has been off the air for 2 days , at least I get no signal. Channel 13 power seems to have dropped quite a lot over the last couple days, it is breaking up bad for me.

Originally posted by tockcc
Channel 6 has been off the air for 2 days , at least I get no signal. Channel 13 power seems to have dropped quite a lot over the last couple days, it is breaking up bad for me.

Thanks for the info, Tom.

I thought there was something wrong with my STB. Now I can sleep better tonight.

Originally posted by tockcc
Channel 6 has been off the air for 2 days , at least I get no signal. Channel 13 power seems to have dropped quite a lot over the last couple days, it is breaking up bad for me.

Channel 6 (30) will be off for a little while-- there's a leak in the air supply to the waveguides that feed the antenna, and we're waiting for parts.

Good to know thanks for the heads-up, I miss my late night PBS-HD :(

KOLD DT has had a major failure in our Encoding system, and we are getting money together to fix our broken Waveguide. If all goes well, the Encoder problem will be fixed Wednesday afternoon, and the Waveguide within a week or two. All should be well in time for the dreaded March Madness.

-Work in Progress, Work in Progress-

Does anyone know if the Oscars are going to be in HD? The ABC website doesn't indicate that they are going to be, but searching the web I've found some pages that say the Oscars have been broadcast in HD the past two years. What's the deal?

Titantv.com says it is.

Tonight I am watching KOLD/CSI on 32-3. When did it move? Or is my TV mapping it wrong?

Is ER SD tonight or is it just my box?

"Tonight I am watching KOLD/CSI on 32-3."

Are you actually getting KOLD on 32.3? Is it in HD? It's possible, but you really shouldn't be able to. 32.3 is our actual RF Channel and Program numbers, but we had a Re Multiplexer failure so our DT Transport Stream is literally nonexistent. The Re multiplexer is the device that takes all our PSIP data, Video and Audio Streams, and combines them into a single Transport Stream, that is then transmitted. Without it, all that goes out is the Video and Audio. It's the PSIP data that tells receivers 13.1, or 13.2, or 4.1 for that matter, as well as the Program Guide, Caption information, what kind of video and audio, etc,. If you're getting us, your receiver targets RF first, then looks for the PSIP data to tell it where it is, and whats on. Some receivers work this way, while others look for the PSIP Data, and don't care about the RF channel it's on.

But, all in all, it's kind of a moot point, since after Tomorrow, the Transmitter will be shut down, while we make repairs to the waveguide. We will probably leave it off until our Re-Multiplexer comes back from friggin France, sometime next month, so that it will not confuse too many people, and receivers. We can transmit without the PSIP data, but it's not a good idea since it will confuse the receivers. Sorry all, but *%#@ happens, and we got caught in a *%#@ storm. We are doing everything we can to get things working again, before March Madness starts, but alas, no promises.

-Work in Progress, Work in Progress-

France! Well clearly you've identified the source of the problem!

Good luck.

Kuat is back up and running this morning.

Originally posted by adash66
Is ER SD tonight or is it just my box?

Was HD here....

West Avra Wiz

Yup 32-3 was in HD, I watched CSI, and part of what was on afterwards...

===KGUN which is owned by Emmis wont allow KGUN on Cable Update=====

The Cox cable regional manager meet in Omaha with a Emmis Manager.

Emmis is still demanding to be paid for there over the air signal that is free.
Emmis is also still planning on dropping to 480P and starting there new USDTV cable tv over the air pay service.

http://www.usdtv.com/

In the meeting the Emmis manager said that ALL station managers will be meeting in March to talk about the HD on Cable issue.

Folks, your Emails to the stations are working keep emailing and calling your Emmis station.

Originally posted by Azwldcats
West Avra Wiz

Yup 32-3 was in HD, I watched CSI, and part of what was on afterwards...

How do you get 13.3? I could not even get 13.1.

Originally posted by ScottChez
===KGUN which is owned by Emmis wont allow KGUN on Cable Update=====

The Cox cable regional manager meet in Omaha with a Emmis Manager.

Emmis is still demanding to be paid for there over the air signal that is free.
Emmis is also still planning on dropping to 480P and starting there new USDTV cable tv over the air pay service.

http://www.usdtv.com/

In the meeting the Emmis manager said that ALL station managers will be meeting in March to talk about the HD on Cable issue.

Folks, your Emails to the stations are working keep emailing and calling your Emmis station.

I just can't see a network affiliate not broadcasting HD. Perhaps I'm optimistic, but I'd think that if a network affiliate capable of passing HD doesn't in favor of making money on the side, the network would shop the market to switch affiliates.

Here's a couple of shots I found I had of the digital Ch. 27 transmitter and assoc. equipment on tumamoc hill. Thought they might be interesting to see.

The microwave uplinks (and stereo generator for analog 27)
http://www.u.arizona.edu/~jasonk/tv/tvsta2.jpg

The transmitter itself
http://www.u.arizona.edu/~jasonk/tv/tvsta3.jpg

The antenna
http://www.u.arizona.edu/~jasonk/tv/tvsta5.jpg


:)

Friday night and Saturday morning - I receive a very weak signal or no signal from channels 4.1, 11.1, and 13.1. Channels 4.1 and 11.1 will lock in for 5 or 10 seconds and then gone. I read above that 13.1 is having some major work done and would broadcast for a while. Anyone else having trouble with 4.1 or 11.1? I live in Sabino Canyon with direct view of Mt. Bigelow and have not had this type of problem before.

Thanks for any input.

Richard

I live in the Northwest area near Cortaro and Silverbell and 4.1 and 11.1 came in strong both last night and this morning. The only one an I cannot get is 13.1 and 9.1 is weak.

WestAvra Wiz
While your digital OTA is down, will the Comcast feed still have HD when available?

Originally posted by AzRich
Friday night and Saturday morning - I receive a very weak signal or no signal from channels 4.1, 11.1, and 13.1. Channels 4.1 and 11.1 will lock in for 5 or 10 seconds and then gone. I read above that 13.1 is having some major work done and would broadcast for a while. Anyone else having trouble with 4.1 or 11.1? I live in Sabino Canyon with direct view of Mt. Bigelow and have not had this type of problem before.

Thanks for any input.

Richard 4.1 and 11.1 working fine for us Sat afternoon.

Originally posted by BigFoot48
4.1 and 11.1 working fine for us Sat afternoon.

Same. Watched L&O last night-- signal was as strong as usual.

"While your digital OTA is down, will the Comcast feed still have HD when available?"



No problem there. Comcast gets us from a dedicated Fiber line directly from the Encoder. It doesn't use PSIP, so it doesn't care if there aint none. Cable is unaffected, and will still be there with CBS HD for Tucson.

I'm sure I'd see something here, but I have to ask if something's happened to KUAS. I was dinking with antennas over the weekend and now I get zero signal on 27.1. I didn't notice if I had it before the work I did or not.

Originally posted by tucson_bill
I'm sure I'd see something here, but I have to ask if something's happened to KUAS. I was dinking with antennas over the weekend and now I get zero signal on 27.1. I didn't notice if I had it before the work I did or not.

There were issues with microwave link late last week that had it down for a couple hours, but it's been up since then. Just turned it on to see, and I'm getting it fine.

Hey all,

I just got a new HD TV and want to try for all local channels. Living in Dove Mountain, NW Tucson, do I stand a chance in getting any of the local channels such as abc, cbs, nbc??????? Roof antenna, inside/outside??Direct Tv has the offer of HD receiver, dish and roof antenna for local for $399. I will pay for extra roof antenna if you think I will get? They will not refund if I don't get any.

Thank you.

If the Directv outside antenna is the one that clips on the dish then it's useless for everything except a bird perch. HD is also fairly limited from Directv so far, although they're starting to put more satellites up this year, so things should improve.

We love the HD from our outside antenna, and a neighbor on this forum has an indoor antenna (Silver Sensor) that is working well for him. Someone will probably comment on reception in the Dove Mtn. area. Good luck.

Originally posted by Qwijib0
There were issues with microwave link late last week that had it down for a couple hours, but it's been up since then. Just turned it on to see, and I'm getting it fine. Thanks. There's good reason to believe it's a problem with my antenna configuration, but with the currently unstable state of things I wanted to be sure I wasn't chasing someone else's problem.

Originally posted by West Avra Wiz
Tomorrow, the Transmitter will be shut down, while we make repairs to the waveguide. We will probably leave it off until our Re-Multiplexer comes back from friggin France, sometime next month, so that it will not confuse too many people, and receivers. We can transmit without the PSIP data, but it's not a good idea since it will confuse the receivers. Sorry all, but *%#@ happens, and we got caught in a *%#@ storm. We are doing everything we can to get things working again, before March Madness starts, but alas, no promises.

March Madness is getting close. Any update regarding the expected day that you will commence transmitting again?

Originally posted by zooie123
I just got a new HD TV and want to try for all local channels. Living in Dove Mountain, NW Tucson, do I stand a chance in getting any of the local channels such as abc, cbs, nbc??????? Roof antenna, inside/outside??Direct Tv has the offer of HD receiver, dish and roof antenna for local for $399. I will pay for extra roof antenna if you think I will get? They will not refund if I don't get any. As I noted in my PM, reception of locals is certainly possible in the Dove Mountain area (barring local obstructions), however it will take an antenna with fairly high gain and a preamp to make up for cable and splitter/combiner losses. I use a Channel Master 3021/4221 4-bay bow-tie. As someone else noted, the clip-on antenna the satellite people will want to provide will be useless. If they're willing to provide what's needed (even if at a reasonable cost premium), then terrific! As I also noted though, there is an issue with combining an amplified OTA antenna with a satellite system. The Channel Master 0065DSB and 0265DSB preamps are satellite receiver LNB voltage compatible.

March Madness is getting close.


Right now, as I type, two crews are on the mountain taking down the old Waveguide, and hanging the new line. If all goes well, we will then re-plumb the connections, set the grounding rods, and pressurize the line. Shortly there after we can optimize the dish between the Mountains, and recalibrate everything. In other words, we should be back up and running by this afternoon.

Also, after a lot of help, I've got the PSIP generator working again, so I would advise everyone to RESCAN, if you can't get 13.1.

-Work in Progress, Work in Progress-

Hello all,


This is to let you all know, KOLD-DT 13.1 is back on the air. A lot of work has been done, but, as promised, we are back up BEFORE March Madness! If you can't find us, or it keeps coming up 32.3, please rescan your receiver. We should come up as 13.1. Thanks all, for your patience.

-Work in Progress, Work in Progress-

Originally posted by West Avra Wiz
This is to let you all know, KOLD-DT 13.1 is back on the air.

Thank you for the notification, and thank you for your all your efforts to make it happen. Looking forward to March Madness in HD!! :D

KOLD coming in good here.

I can not get KOLD, tried a re-scan and just going to channel 32 and still no picture. I have been getting 13-1 for over a year until this most recent change. Anybody else getting 13-1 this afternoon.

Coming in fine here (NW), though at about 30% lower signal than the other stations. I didn't have to rescan. Also coming in fine at SE part of town on a USDTV receiver from what a friend just told me.

I too noticed the power level has dropped today. I'm getting some tiling.

Hello all, im new here and new to the HD world. Purchased my OTA antenna today and am getting great results from all but 13.1. I have read that they have been having problems with waveguides so is anyone else getting a signal?

Originally posted by CombatTalon2
Hello all, im new here and new to the HD world. Purchased my OTA antenna today and am getting great results from all but 13.1. I have read that they have been having problems with waveguides so is anyone else getting a signal? Just checked and it's still coming in as per above. Note the signal level is weaker than the other stations. Though I know someone at Houghton and Rita Rd. that gets it just fine with a USDTV receiver and an 8-bay bowtie on his roof.

Originally posted by Carey P
Just checked and it's still coming in as per above. Note the signal level is weaker than the other stations. Though I know someone at Houghton and Rita Rd. that gets it just fine with a USDTV receiver and an 8-bay bowtie on his roof.

Im getting 90-92% on 6.1 4.1 and 11.1 but about 49% Not locked and fluxing to 0 signal from kold... kinda strange????

Originally posted by CombatTalon2
Im getting 90-92% on 6.1 4.1 and 11.1 but about 49% Not locked and fluxing to 0 signal from kold... kinda strange???? Yes, I'm getting exactly 49% as well. To tell you the truth, when I first checked before, I saw 0%. Then I went to another channel and back again, and it was back at the usual 49%. It seemed to stay there for quite some time, so I thought it was just some anomaly at my end. Maybe there really is a fluctuation problem.

Originally posted by Carey P
Yes, I'm getting exactly 49% as well. To tell you the truth, when I first checked before, I saw 0%. Then I went to another channel and back again, and it was back at the usual 49%. It seemed to stay there for quite some time, so I thought it was just some anomaly at my end. Maybe there really is a fluctuation problem.

ok then, im not the only one. I moved my antenna up on to the peak of my roof, i still get 49% but atleast i get some picture...

I'm 39 miles from the broadcast antenna (according to antennaweb). I'm getting good signal strength on 13-1 (using a small attic antenna). There was a short time during the second half of this evening's CSI show when there was quite a bit of tiling and momentary loss of sync between audio and video. But after half a minute or so, all returned to normal. Signal strength remained good during this period.

Originally posted by CombatTalon2
Hello all, im new here and new to the HD world. Purchased my OTA antenna today and am getting great results from all but 13.1. I have read that they have been having problems with waveguides so is anyone else getting a signal?

Same here. I could not get strong enough signal to lock on to RF32 (channel 13.1). The signal level varies around 41%. The STB I am using is from Voom, which does not lock on anything below 80%. I could easily received 13.1 without any problem before. Is the 13.1 tower still not up to full strength? I really hope they would fix this mess before NCAA basketball tournament.

West Avra Wiz, will we see light at the end of the tunnel?

I'm also only getting fluctuation of 0%-49% and can't lock on. Before the signal went out I was getting around 70%-80%. I also really hope they fix this before the tournament.

Originally posted by CombatTalon2
Im getting 90-92% on 6.1 4.1 and 11.1 but about 49% Not locked and fluxing to 0 signal from kold... kinda strange????

I'm just east of Houghton on Fort Lowell I'm due south of the tower (+/- 2 degrees) about 10 miles. I can see it from my house when the weather's clear. I'm currently receiving everyone else on the tower off the back of an antenna pointed at the Santa Ritas. (There's a reason, but not worth talking about here. Bottom line is that it works.)

I get nothing from KOLD off of a uhf yagi pointed directly at the tower using two different receivers -- Sony TV built in tuner and a Samsung T151. The Sony doesn't have a signal strength meter, and I haven't checked the Samsung lately.
(Didn't see the point). I haven't seen KOLD since the recent outage began. Of course I also haven't unravelled why I no longer have KUAS. Same exercise -- up on the roof point to uhf directly at the tower. No result. Oh well, early adoption is fun.

West Avra Wiz,

I would really appreciate if you could let us know when 13.1 will be back in full power. It would be great if this happens before the NCAA tournament. If not, I need to make a contigent plan to catch some HD college hoops.

Pretty please with sugar on top?

Got 13.1 this morning at 81% and still there this afternoon. Hope it stays around now!

Yikes! Why have I lost signal for Fox 11.1? I could not receive an OTA signal last night and the HD broadcast of channel 11 on Comcast would not come in either. Tonight I get the Comcast signal but not the OTA. Also, tonight I receive an HD OTA picture on channel 9.1 but no sound when HD is being broadcast. When a regular broadcast commercial plays I get sound. Strange.

Someone tell me that someday soon all of these problems will be worked out .

Richard

Originally posted by CombatTalon2
Got 13.1 this morning at 81% and still there this afternoon. Hope it stays around now!

Here to. Oddly KUAS is back for me as well. Kinda makes you go "Hmmmmm".

Yes, 13.1 is back tonight. Signal strength comes in at 91 to 92. I am very happy for the timing.

West Avra Wiz, a big thank you to you and your coworkers at KOLD.

A strange night. CH 4-1 went to SD half way through American Dreams and 9-1 had no audio on Alias and then went to SD with audio. I noticed that 9-1 HD while the audio was not working was actually in sync with the analog audio signal. Normally it is delayed a few seconds. That must have been a symptom of the problem. I guess the only way they could get audio to work was to switch over to SD.:(

That's why embedded audio is so nice-- if you've got picture to a device, you've got sound to it as well-- and it's one less thing to troubleshoot.

Originally posted by dash2004
Yes, 13.1 is back tonight. Signal strength comes in at 91 to 92. I am very happy for the timing.

West Avra Wiz, a big thank you to you and your coworkers at KOLD.
Yes - I started receiving KOLD again yesterday in far north Phoenix.
Are they still having issues with the PSIP? My Mitsubishi integrated digital tuner shows it as channel 32.3.

I'm getting a good signal again in Scottsdale. My receiver shows it as 13.1.

Tom

I'm guessing that the KOLD delay server crashed again this evening (about half way through CSI). After a frozen advertisment that lasted a half hour or so, the broadcast changed to the SD feed.

I'm hoping that the final four games will be broadcast live and will not depend on this somewhat less than reliable delay server.

Lets hope. I was happy to have KOLD back to watch CSI in HD last night but it was not to be. I didn't wait to find out how long long the freeze up lasted this time, I just switched to SD before the commercial break was over. I am pretty sure you are correct about the tournament being a live feed so we got that going for us.
Chris

I just got an ATI HDTV Wonder yesterday (since I dont have a grand to drop on an HDTV+OTA STB tuner). After messing with the drivers for a few hours I got it to work and stuck the included Silver Sensor antenna out my window.

I can pick up every channel listed on antennaweb.org except KWBA-DT. All channels have atleast 3 out of 5 bars according to the signal meter in the software and playback is mostly smooth. I tried pointing the antenna in all different directions but it doesnt find KWBA-DT, which is too bad because there are a few shows on the WB i'd like to see in HD.

So i'm wondering if everyone else is getting KWBA-DT and if they ever broadcast in HD.

For the record I live near Winterhaven (Ft. Lowell and Country Club) in a single story house and the window my antenna sticks out points southwest, which I know isnt the right direction according to antennaweb but since it picks up every other channel I dont think thats a big deal.

Originally posted by OPO9
I just got an ATI HDTV Wonder yesterday (since I dont have a grand to drop on an HDTV+OTA STB tuner). After messing with the drivers for a few hours I got it to work and stuck the included Silver Sensor antenna out my window.

I can pick up every channel listed on antennaweb.org except KWBA-DT. All channels have atleast 3 out of 5 bars according to the signal meter in the software and playback is mostly smooth. I tried pointing the antenna in all different directions but it doesnt find KWBA-DT, which is too bad because there are a few shows on the WB i'd like to see in HD.

So i'm wondering if everyone else is getting KWBA-DT and if they ever broadcast in HD.

For the record I live near Winterhaven (Ft. Lowell and Country Club) in a single story house and the window my antenna sticks out points southwest, which I know isnt the right direction according to antennaweb but since it picks up every other channel I dont think thats a big deal.

I dont get the WB With my antenna, even if I point it in the direction of the transmitting antenna. Anyway, i dont think they broadcast anything in HD, but I might be wrong. According to Antenna web you would need a large directional antenna w/pre amp to pick it up.

good luck!

WB's antenna is near Sierra Vista and at this time the local WB channel does not broadcast any of the HD programs the network has available and has no plans to do so in the near future.

KAUS Channel 28 should show up as 27-1, but I receive it as 28-1. The station comes in without issues but I am wondering if anyone gets it as 27-1. Also anyone know if KUAT will show the local broadcast all the time and not switch to the HD Loop at 8:00 PM. It would be nice to get PBS in DTV all of the time.

Greetings,
I have been trying to get through all of this thread before I started to ask my newbie questions...here is the first set:

I live right near Swan and River. Yesterday I revived the ancient roof antenna and have it wired into my Sony 34xbr960 ( a great TV by the way...). (I only did this because I am an unhappy Comcast customer who can't get a straight answer on when the NBC/ABC DTV feeds will be added to the ridiculous $80 monthly fee I am paying. Take note Comcast people, the dozen or so (so called) HD channels aren't worth the $80...) In driving around the neighborhood there does not seem to be consensus on which way to orient off air antennae. I have seen every orientation... According to antennaweb.org, to get all the big UHF DTV (and HD) signals I can just point to 37 degrees.

Umm, is this the big end or the little end I should be pointing that way?
Since I only care about UHF does it even matter? My antenna is a flat 9 or 10 element standard antenna.

Currently I get high 70's, 80's, and 90's for NBC, CBS, PBS, FOX, UPN. With pretty stable signals, a few points + or -.

KGUN/ABC is iffy, this morning it was below 50 so it didn't lock, now it is fluctuating between sub 50 and mid 50's....according to the FAQ at the top of this thread ABC is on the same Mt. Bige(a)low tower.

Is this an ABC issue or something I need to address with a better, oriented correctly, or amplified antenna?

KGUN's "new" website, is, frankly, terrible...nothing about DTV, nothing about management, and the "top" news story is "Georgia Suspect Still on the Loose", oops that ended yesterday morning....

Thanks,
BB
P.S. West Avra Wiz, you are to be commended for posting on this forum and keeping us informed on KOLD issues! Thank you!

| | / /
| | / /
---------- >>> mountain
| | \ \
| | \ \

Point the right end, with all the weird UHF elements, toward the mountain!

Originally posted by RJRSW
WB's antenna is near Sierra Vista and at this time the local WB channel does not broadcast any of the HD programs the network has available and has no plans to do so in the near future.

antennaweb.org lists WB's site as being in "Sierra Vista", but I do not think that is an accurate description. It is actually between Mt. Hopkins and Elephant Head in the Santa Rita range, and has a good view of all of Tucson. In fact, it probably serves the northwest sector of Tucson better than Mt. Bigelow, although the distance is somewhat farther. This is the same location as the analog broadcast for FOX-11 (KMSB). So if you can receive a decent analog OTA signal from KMSB, you should also be able to pick up the WB (KWBA) digital broadcast on channel 44 (58.1).

Hey everyone...

I should know later today, tomorrow the latest, which NCAA games we will be providing in HD. We get "assigned" games so we can't pick which ones to run, unfortunately. I'll post a schedule for this week and weekend, as soon as we get one.

-Work in Progress, Work in Progress-

Okay Folks, here is the Line-up for Thursday March 17th:


Daytime game #1 From Tucson - Oklahoma vs. Niagara (available in HD)
game #2 From Boise - Washington vs. Montana (not in HD)

Night game #1 From Boise - Arizona vs. Utah State (not in HD)
game #2 From Tucson - Texas Tech vs. UCLA (available in HD)


As I said before, we don't get to pick the games, and it looks like there is no HD gear in Boise. The trucks are in Cleveland, Tucson, Worcester and Nashville, so ONLY games from those Venues will be in HD, this week. I'll let you know about the rest of the schedules as I get them.


-Work in Progress, Work in Progress-