So the question is, will they continue to charge $6.95/month for the HD Plus package, drop the price, or put something else in its place?

From the TWC Raleigh channel change website:


May 31, 2009: HD Net (Channel 293) and HD Net Movies (Channel 294) will no longer be available on the Digital Cable HD Tier. The following channels will be added to the HD Tier:

Hallmark Movie Channel HD - Channel 246
Smithsonian Channel HD - Channel 293
MavTV - Channel 294

Does anyone else besides me have this problem on any of the newer HD channels on TWC? Most of the time if I change the channel and then come back, it will be there. This is very annoying and happens to me often, especially on USA HD (258) What's up with this?

Dish added MAVTV last week. I never complain when channels are added, as additions are always good and I don't have to watch what I don't like.

But as for trade value... MAVTV is not a good trade, in my opinion, for HDNet... and HDNet Movies is one of the better HD premium movie channels out there right now.

I see that the TVGoS is working in Durham. Has anyone gotten it to work in Raleigh with the TWC straight into the TV?
Thanks,
Brian

What happened to 50.3 and 5.2? 5.2 now has THIS network and 50.3 is showing 50.1?

What happened to 50.3 and 5.2? 5.2 now has THIS network and 50.3 is showing 50.1?

The tv listings on wral.com seem to indicate THIS Tv has shifted to 5.2.

http://www.wral.com/wral-tv/tv_schedule/

fwiw, I received this message recently from WRAL:

WRAL will start broadcasting in digital from the new main digital antenna at the top of the tower on June 13th on our new frequency assignment channel (channel 48). At that time, the signal coverage area will increase considerably (as compared to the standby digital antenna's coverage area).

The tv listings on wral.com seem to indicate THIS Tv has shifted to 5.2.

http://www.wral.com/wral-tv/tv_schedule/

My Zap2It (TMS) based SageTV listings have sort of caught up. They show "this" on both 5.2 and 50.3.

Does anybody know what they're planning to do with 50.3? Surely they don't plan to leave it as an SD mirror of 50.1. Even WNCN stopped doing that..

Drew

So WRAL dropped their newschannel and wxchannel? Maybe they will consolidate them into one channel now, and place it on 50.3? Moving ThisTV to 5.2 has left viewers who could get it on 50 OTA out of luck. Why would they want to do that??

Can someone call up WRAL and find out what the plan is? Honestly it makes more sense bandwidth-wise for the WRAL 2 to be on 50-3 (it would use less bandwidth and thus make 50-2 look better), but it doesn't sound like they've done that yet, if that's the plan at all.

My other question would be "why now?" Why not wait until June 12?

- Trip

Looks like LivewellHD may be gone now. 11.2 currently has WX (well, a radar picture with the NOAA audio loop) and 11.3 is news, no sign of Livewell. Maybe there were enough complaints.... Currently there's no HD on 11.1 so I can't tell if the picture has improved any from the overly soft one they have been sporting since Livewell.

Also, here's to hoping that 50.3 gets dumped and the bandwidth returned back to 50.1 as well.

Also, here's to hoping that 50.3 gets dumped and the bandwidth returned back to 50.1 as well.

50-1 would not benefit during network programming regardless of whether or not 50-3 went away. The Fox splicer constrains the bandwidth subchannels can use.

It would only improve 50-2.

- Trip

Looks like LivewellHD may be gone now. 11.2 currently has WX (well, a radar picture with the NOAA audio loop) and 11.3 is news, no sign of Livewell. Maybe there were enough complaints.... Currently there's no HD on 11.1 so I can't tell if the picture has improved any from the overly soft one they have been sporting since Livewell.

Wow. That was quick. The last time I watched 11x's, 11.2 looked horrible anyway. Full of noticeable blotchy patches. As you mentioned also, 11.1 was awfully soft. Good riddance to LIVEWELL!!

Looks like LivewellHD may be gone now. 11.2 currently has WX (well, a radar picture with the NOAA audio loop) and 11.3 is news, no sign of Livewell. Maybe there were enough complaints.... Currently there's no HD on 11.1 so I can't tell if the picture has improved any from the overly soft one they have been sporting since Livewell.

Also, here's to hoping that 50.3 gets dumped and the bandwidth returned back to 50.1 as well.

Well... 11.2 is still Livewell HD for me.... 11.3 is Channel 11 weather/news.

Yeah, I spoke too soon. 11.2 is now back to Livewell. Maybe they just run the WX stuff at certain times of the day or when they expect bad weather (although today seems clear). I wish Livewell would die though, I can't imagine the content they have running making them money. I've heard people not watching 11.1 because the HD is so bad (and I have too on occasion) so I hope they lose money on this stupid venture and return the quality back to their main.

Bummer about 50.1 already being maxed when network content plays.

Hello,

I will soon be getting a 63" Samsung Plasma TV. I want to have it ISF calibrated by somebody highly skilled who will used the correct equipment and fine tune everything perfectly.

Can anybody recommend a technician in the Raleigh/Cary area??

Thanks.

Hello,

I will soon be getting a 63" Samsung Plasma TV. I want to have it ISF calibrated by somebody highly skilled who will used the correct equipment and fine tune everything perfectly.

Can anybody recommend a technician in the Raleigh/Cary area??

Thanks.

Eliab calibrated my DLP and was excellent. However, he doesnt travel to NC anymore. I sent him an email asking for a referral and will post back his response. UMR (http://www.accucal.org/) is another forum member who is a traveling calibrator with excellent references.

I see that the TVGoS is working in Durham.
My DVR seemed to be receiving data for several days, but the listings are not filling in. So I am switching back to OTA for TVGOS.

I finally got my DTVPal DVR yesterday! Thanks Scooper and rhaben for the info on how the unit is performing with TVGOS in this area. How long should it take for the full guide data to populate? And will the guide have accurate info for all of the subchannels? I have the TV Guide symbol up in the corner of the banner but some info is not accurate. For instance, 17-2 is Universal Sports but my guide shows NBC17 Weather. And will TVGOS reflect that THIS network programming just switched from 50-3 to 5-2?

Eliab calibrated my DLP and was excellent. However, he doesnt travel to NC anymore. I sent him an email asking for a referral and will post back his response. UMR (http://www.accucal.org/) is another forum member who is a traveling calibrator with excellent references.

I will be in NC in September. I also offer excellent audio calibration services to complete the home theater experience.

I finally got my DTVPal DVR yesterday! Thanks Scooper and rhaben for the info on how the unit is performing with TVGOS in this area. How long should it take for the full guide data to populate? And will the guide have accurate info for all of the subchannels? I have the TV Guide symbol up in the corner of the banner but some info is not accurate. For instance, 17-2 is Universal Sports but my guide shows NBC17 Weather. And will TVGOS reflect that THIS network programming just switched from 50-3 to 5-2?

My experiance is TVGOS from WRAL takes somewhere around an hour to populate on the DTVPAL DVR, if that long. To get a full guide in the meantime, just tune to every major channel in the guide - this will get you the PSIP data.

TVGOS is only as accurate as the stations provide, so right now - what is being sent is what Macrovision gets. Usually takes a couple weeks to catch up to these changes. It WILL be accurate on the major channels.

What ever happened to them adding The Weather Channel HD? When they started adding channels it was listed as coming soon or something like that.

Is NBC17 DTV broadcasting on some other channel? It's been awhile since I been able to receive anything on 17.1 17.2. Not even a bad signal, All I get is "No Signal".
Is this simply poor reception? All other Garner DTV broadcasts are clear and strong here in Cary. Have had issues with NBC17 before, but nothing like this, signal strength 0 (zero)

I get 17.1, 17.2, and 17.3 OTA just fine. Did you try rescanning for channels? I don't think any of the local stations have changed frequencies yet, but it might help anyway.

Is NBC17 DTV broadcasting on some other channel? It's been awhile since I been able to receive anything on 17.1 17.2. Not even a bad signal, All I get is "No Signal".
Is this simply poor reception? All other Garner DTV broadcasts are clear and strong here in Cary. Have had issues with NBC17 before, but nothing like this, signal strength 0 (zero)

Leaves? If by "awhile" you mean since spring has sprung, leaves may be your answer. How long have you been in your current location?

Leaves? If by "awhile" you mean since spring has sprung, leaves may be your answer. How long have you been in your current location?

Interestingly enough... the arrival of the leaves actually improved my signal strength and SNR. I expected it to be the other way around.

17 went down by 50% on power in order to prepare for their move down to digital 17 about 3-4 months ago. If the only difference between then and now is leaves - there's your answer - you need a better antenna.

Also - when it's blowing - you may notice dropouts on all your digital channels - again, it's the leaves creating additional multipath.

I've had this ever since I moved into this place (I'm literally in a clearing in a forest).

Interestingly enough... the arrival of the leaves actually improved my signal strength and SNR. I expected it to be the other way around.

That's not necessarily unusual. It may increase or decrease your signal and may have no effect at all. I had my antenna installed during the winter, so there is a slight difference in the spring/summer (for the worse), but this may all change once the June 12 deadline comes.

I had a conversation with Ben Drawbaugh (at engadgetHD) and he said that cable companies are really trying to convert all of their NTSC channels to QAM. This would allow much more bandwidth on the existing backbone.

Since most TVs out there don't have QAM tuners, the cable companies would have to furnish free converter boxes to customers without QAM tuners. To get around this (and I can't remember how this thought is bridged), the cable companies would be relaxing the QAM encryption to limit the number of boxes that would have to go out. This would be good news, as those of us with TVs with clear QAM tuners would be able to get more than just channels 0-24 on TWC using clear QAM. Any thoughts on this?

Since most TVs out there don't have QAM tuners, the cable companies would have to furnish free converter boxes to customers without QAM tuners. To get around this (and I can't remember how this thought is bridged), the cable companies would be relaxing the QAM encryption to limit the number of boxes that would have to go out. This would be good news, as those of us with TVs with clear QAM tuners would be able to get more than just channels 0-24 on TWC using clear QAM. Any thoughts on this?

If they did that, they'd have to fully support their clear-QAM mappings now; train techs about it, tell people how to do a rescan, explain to people why their channels are someplace they may not expect. ("25-1? What's that?")

Given that, I'd be surprised if they actually went that route rather than just dictating that everyone gets a digital cable box.

17 went down by 50% on power in order to prepare for their move down to digital 17 about 3-4 months ago. If the only difference between then and now is leaves - there's your answer - you need a better antenna.

Also - when it's blowing - you may notice dropouts on all your digital channels - again, it's the leaves creating additional multipath.


I think I'm seeing a combination effect of leaves and lower power. Last spring/summer I was able to receive 17.1 okay most days. Now I get a much less usable signal, and sometimes no signal.

I noticed a step down in signal quality on 17.1 a few months ago, probably due to the reduced power, but when the leaves came out that really killed it. Strangely, I get other channels like 50.1 from the same antenna farm with no problems.

I've been using the same two antennas - a fixed CM4228 and a roto-mounted UHF Yagi - here in Cary for over a year, and this is the worst signal quality 17.1 has ever been for me. I've given up watching NBC17 off the air and now only watch NBC on Hulu.

Given that, I'd be surprised if they actually went that route rather than just dictating that everyone gets a digital cable box.

Clear QAM would also expose them to more competition to third-party DVRs and HTPCs without cablecards. No way they'll give up that revenue stream.

I'm sure they'll be pushing their own digital cable boxes.

Sorry everyone I'm just a "drive by" poster but saw that others here were looking for info about the TVGOS in the Raleigh area. I emailed the engineering department at WRAL (April 09) about when I'll get back / why I no longer received the guide info and they replied:

WRAL started transmitting the digital TVGOS signal on June 8th of last
year on over-the-air channel 5.1. Many A/V devices are not able to
decode and/or display digital TVGOS information, though. The following
webpage has information on compatible TVGOS devices:

[----Macrovision URL removed - low post count----]

We are still working with Time Warner Cable to enable the display of the
TVGOS information embedded within our signal over their system.

This feature was a huge selling point when I bought my plasma two years ago so I'm anxiously awaiting the return of this service.

Last week I emailed TWC inquiring about the TV GOS signal being available from WRAL but not broadcasted through their system. They replied with a very generic "we received your inquiry and are working hard to resolve the issue" etc etc. A few days later the service is working again and my on screen lineup has been populated. I'm on Cary's grid. :rolleyes:

I noticed on the AT&T site yesterday that if you click on U-verse, rather than asking for your home phone number, it now asks for your zip code. Entering 27513 (one zip code in Cary) took me straight to the U-verse page with package and price info. Once you actually go down the sign-up path, it asks for your phone number to see if it is available. (Not yet in my neighborhood.)

So, I wonder if this means the wider roll-out is coming soon?

God I hope so. I'm really itching to get rid of my TWC service and go all ATT. Ever since TWC went to their own firmware on the boxes I haven't been able to stand using the DVR. It's like they had a bunch of monkeys write it.

...This would be good news, as those of us with TVs with clear QAM tuners would be able to get more than just channels 0-24 on TWC using clear QAM. Any thoughts on this?

Thoughts? My first thought is "woo hoo!" :-).

Clear QAM would also expose them to more competition to third-party DVRs and HTPCs without cablecards. No way they'll give up that revenue stream.

I'm sure they'll be pushing their own digital cable boxes.

But if they stop analog transmission before 2012, wouldn't they have to provide free digital cable boxes until they're allowed to stop supporting analog customers?

I suppose they'd offer crappy, no-feature, SD-only boxes for free and expect folks to pay up for better boxes.

I've said it before and I'll say it again--if they make folks pay for set top boxes for every TV, they'll lose even more customers to satellite and other alternatives. Not having to have an STB is one of their few remaining advantages.

Well we have two TWC set top boxes and four others TVs on QAM. If they cripple QAM, TWC will have NO advantages other the other options available to us. After 12 years or so on TWC this may be the final straw.:mad:

Yes, it's been a few months. Had been a usable signal since last Summer, though marginal prior. Using a CM4228 rooftop with CM7778 amp. 17.x is the only problem ch#. The 6 gen. tuners do handle multi-path much better than the older T-150 1st gen. tuner. Even WRAL is high signal even though they're still transmitting from 600ft lower than normal & they'll broadcast from the new height next month.

Is this NBC17 power reduction permanent? News and Today Show are not
the same streamed through the MC/PC. We do stream all other NBC programming so will miss their news. (posted this ? @ http://dtv.myncblogs.com/2009/04/09/investigating-loss-of-signal/#comment-351)

17 went down by 50% on power in order to prepare for their move down to digital 17 about 3-4 months ago. If the only difference between then and now is leaves - there's your answer - you need a better antenna.

Also - when it's blowing - you may notice dropouts on all your digital channels - again, it's the leaves creating additional multipath.

I've had this ever since I moved into this place (I'm literally in a clearing in a forest).

Yes, it's been a few months. Had been a usable signal since last Summer, though marginal prior. Using a CM4228 rooftop with CM7778 amp. 17.x is the only problem ch#. The 6 gen. tuners do handle multi-path much better than the older T-150 1st gen. tuner. Even WRAL is high signal even though they're still transmitting from 600ft lower than normal & they'll broadcast from the new height next month.

Is this NBC17 power reduction permanent? News and Today Show are not
the same streamed through the MC/PC. We do stream all other NBC programming so will miss their news. (posted this ? @ http://dtv.myncblogs.com/2009/04/09/investigating-loss-of-signal/#comment-351)

I don't believe it is - it's only until everything is final.

Well we have two TWC set top boxes and four others TVs on QAM. If they cripple QAM, TWC will have NO advantages other the other options available to us. After 12 years or so on TWC this may be the final straw.:mad:

Well, they can't cripple it by removing the broadcast channels - they're legally required to provide those unencrypted. They're under no obligation to provide anything else unencrypted, though (and therefore, they don't).

I don't believe it is - it's only until everything is final.
reply from NBC17: "Our DTV is still at full power. We only reduced the analog transmitter since half of it is being converted to digital for June 12th."..."Once we switch down to channel 17 on June 12th, it should be a lot easier to pick up"

Always good to get the right story...

We have 6 meg RoadRunner only in Knightdale and lost almost all the digital channels on the cable in the last week or so. We still get 5.1 and 5.3 which are running an ad about the coming change to analog services. Anyone else loose theirs?

On another note, I saw the mentions of higher roadrunner speeds and rebooted my modem. I got 13171kbps at the roadrunner test site :-)!!!

I got very high download speed without rebooting my modem. I really don't wan't any download speed. I was happy with 7Mbps download. I'd prefer my upload speed double. That would improve my video broadcasting quality.

http://www.speedtest.net/result/486421791.png (http://www.speedtest.net)

reply from NBC17: "Our DTV is still at full power. We only reduced the analog transmitter since half of it is being converted to digital for June 12th."..."Once we switch down to channel 17 on June 12th, it should be a lot easier to pick up"

I'm planning an antenna upgrade from a RS U-75R to a Winegard HD 8800 just before June 12. I'll let you all know how it goes in receiving Raleigh channels. I'm 89 miles out. Right now, I can see 17 analog just barely, and only at certain times of the night can I get the digitals.

Anyone actually receiving any of the following?

Smithsonian HD (Channel 293)
MavTV HD (Channel 294)
Hallmark Movie Channel HD (Channel 246)

When I tune to these, it tells me to call Customer Care. I receive all other HD channels without issue. I have an 8300HD with a 500GB external add-on.

Anyone actually receiving any of the following?

Smithsonian HD (Channel 293)
MavTV HD (Channel 294)
Hallmark Movie Channel HD (Channel 246)

When I tune to these, it tells me to call Customer Care. I receive all other HD channels without issue. I have an 8300HD with a 500GB external add-on.

My father said he was getting Smithsonian, MavTV, and "some other channel" that he couldn't remember on Sunday. I had warned him about the impending drop of HDNet so while wandering around he noted the new channels.

So it seems N Raleigh is getting them apparently.

Anyone actually receiving any of the following?

Smithsonian HD (Channel 293)
MavTV HD (Channel 294)
Hallmark Movie Channel HD (Channel 246)

When I tune to these, it tells me to call Customer Care. I receive all other HD channels without issue. I have an 8300HD with a 500GB external add-on.

Yes but just like the channels they are replacing, HDNET and HDNET movies, you have to subscribe to the HD Plus Tier to receive them.

Anyone actually receiving any of the following?

Smithsonian HD (Channel 293)
MavTV HD (Channel 294)
Hallmark Movie Channel HD (Channel 246)

When I tune to these, it tells me to call Customer Care. I receive all other HD channels without issue. I have an 8300HD with a 500GB external add-on.

I get them in Cary. As stated before, do you have the HD Extra Tier?

I get them in Cary. As stated before, do you have the HD Extra Tier?

I do not have the HD Plus Tier. I wasn't aware that these weren't going to be free, but I've confirmed they aren't on the TWC website.
http://www.timewarnercable.com/carolinas/learn/programming/hdpremiumnetworks.html

I do not have the HD Plus Tier. I wasn't aware that these weren't going to be free, but I've confirmed they aren't on the TWC website.
http://www.timewarnercable.com/carolinas/learn/programming/hdpremiumnetworks.html

You should be reading this page:

http://www.timewarnercable.com/Carolinas/support/policies/channelchange.html

But everywhere I turn Time Warner has ads touting them as the home of Free HD. You mean it is not true? ;)

I haven't tried it since the March debacle, but I was wondering if anyone had experienced any success with hooking back up their eSATA drives lately.... Are they still a lost cause, or did TWC fix it yet?

(I realize this is probably an intensely stupid question, but hey...)

But everywhere I turn Time Warner has ads touting them as the home of Free HD. You mean it is not true? ;)

It's only "free" if you're already paying for it but don't know it's there. :D

I haven't tried it since the March debacle, but I was wondering if anyone had experienced any success with hooking back up their eSATA drives lately.... Are they still a lost cause, or did TWC fix it yet?

(I realize this is probably an intensely stupid question, but hey...)

you need to be here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=723830

Then you can see other people be disappointed instead of trying it yourself.

Has anyone been having trouble with HBO and Showtime On Demand recently? I haven't been able to access either over the past few days.

Hallmark HD was a stroke of genius on TWC's part. I was all set to drop the HD Plus Tier, and now my wife would kill me. Sigh.

you need to be here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=723830

Then you can see other people be disappointed instead of trying it yourself.

Hmmm... I'll take that as a "no," then. :)

Hallmark HD was a stroke of genius on TWC's part. I was all set to drop the HD Plus Tier, and now my wife would kill me. Sigh.

ditto...

You should be reading this page:

http://www.timewarnercable.com/Carolinas/support/policies/channelchange.html

Does anyone know the story on this from the above link?

"We are currently taking steps to ensure that all of our customers, regardless of equipment, will continue to be able to view WTVD-TV after the end of the broadcasters’ DTV transition on June 12th. However, it is possible that we may be required to cease carriage of WTVD-TV in analog format on channel 6 (for Durham, Chapel Hill), channel 9 (for Raleigh, Wake Forest, Youngsville, Knightdale, Wendell, Zebulon), channel 11 (for Farmville, Goldsboro, Henderson, Wilson, Bailey, Lake Gaston, Littleton, Spring Hope), channel 13 (for Carrboro, Cary, Garner) and channel 213. Regardless, WTVD-TV’s HD signal will remain available on channel 211 and channel 212 to customers with HD converters and will continue to be accessible on direct-connect digital televisions and other devices that include a QAM tuner."

You should be reading this page:

http://www.timewarnercable.com/Carolinas/support/policies/channelchange.html

I do read that page, but no where on that page does it formally state that the new channels were to be placed in the Plus Tier. My assumption was that the "HD Tier" they mention was the same Tier as all the free HD. Anyway, I don't care about any of those new channels, so its a wash for me.

Does anyone know the story on this from the above link?


I'll bet that ABC wants TWC to carry their "LiveWell" junk on analog cable, but TWC doesn't want to, so ABC is threating to withhold 11.1 from analog in retaliation.

Drew

Anybody get this info from TWC???

http://consumerist.com/5272933/time-warners-revised-subscriber-agreement-allows-for-consumption-based-billing

Added this to the Subscriber agreement:
6. Special Provisions Regarding HSD Service

(ii) I agree that TWC or ISP may change the Maximum Throughput Rate of any tier by amending the price list or Terms of Use. My continued use of the HSD Service following such a change will constitute my acceptance of any new Maximum Throughput Rate. If the level or tier of HSD Service to which I subscribe has a specified limit on the amount of bytes that I can use in a given billing cycle, I also agree that TWC may use technical means, including but not limited to suspending or reducing the speed of my HSD Service, to ensure compliance with these limits, and that TWC or ISP may move me to a higher tier of HSD Service (which may result in higher monthly charges) or impose other charges and fees if my use exceeds these limits.

(iii) I agree that TWC may use Network Management Tools as it determines appropriate and/or that it may use technical means, including but not limited to suspending or reducing the Throughput Rate of my HSD Service, to ensure compliance with its Terms of Use and to ensure that its service operates efficiently. I further agree that TWC and ISP have the right to monitor my bandwidth usage patterns to facilitate the provision of the HSD Service and to ensure my compliance with the Terms of Use and to efficiently manage their networks and their provision of services. TWC or ISP may take such steps as each may determine appropriate in the event my usage of the HSD Service does not comply with the Terms of Use. I acknowledge that HSD Service does not include other services managed by TWC and delivered over TWC's shared infrastructure, including Video Service and Digital Phone Service.



Not cool!!

I've been thinking of switching to DirecTV or Dish Network. Anybody care to recommend either? Not a whole lot of options for the internet though... basically just TWC and ATT DSL?? I won't go satellite internet. I really cannot wait for U-verse!

I've been thinking of switching to DirecTV or Dish Network. Anybody care to recommend either? Not a whole lot of options for the internet though... basically just TWC and ATT DSL?? I won't go satellite internet. I really cannot wait for U-verse!

I have had Dish Network for over 8 years after dropping TWC for TV. (I have internet over DSL with AT&T.) Dish is not perfect, but much better quality picture, in my experience, and less expensive than TWC. Customer service has varied from good to average, but in the last couple of years they seem to have really been trying to improve that. (Have not really needed customer service very often.) I have not stepped up to the HD packages yet as I am waiting to see price comparisons with u-Verse. The only real disadvantage of Dish over DirectTV that I can see is lack of NFL Sunday Ticket and MLB Extra Innings. If those are not critical for you, Dish is probably the better sat offering.

Thanks
Well I also have a landline and iphone through ATT, so I could get more of a discount on DirecTV. So if theyre comparable that may be the way to go.
I just don't know know if I want to keep TWC as internet while I await U-verse of if I should suffer through a couple months of ATT DSL while waiting on U-verse.

Anybody get this info from TWC???

http://consumerist.com/5272933/time-warners-revised-subscriber-agreement-allows-for-consumption-based-billing

Added this to the Subscriber agreement:


Not cool!!

I've been thinking of switching to DirecTV or Dish Network. Anybody care to recommend either? Not a whole lot of options for the internet though... basically just TWC and ATT DSL?? I won't go satellite internet. I really cannot wait for U-verse!

You may be able to get DirecTV from AT&T in bundle. It's worth checking into. I'm an Embarq customer and they offer Dish in a bundle. You might want to see if AT&T Uverse is available in your are too.

I do read that page, but no where on that page does it formally state that the new channels were to be placed in the Plus Tier. My assumption was that the "HD Tier" they mention was the same Tier as all the free HD. Anyway, I don't care about any of those new channels, so its a wash for me.

The "free HD" is part of the Digital Tier (or whatever it's called these days) and always has been. HD Suite has always been a pay package.

It might be more helpful if TWC stopped changing the package names to make everything sound better value when it's just exactly the same.

Anybody get this info from TWC???

http://consumerist.com/5272933/time-warners-revised-subscriber-agreement-allows-for-consumption-based-billing

Added this to the Subscriber agreement:


Not cool!!

I've been thinking of switching to DirecTV or Dish Network. Anybody care to recommend either? Not a whole lot of options for the internet though... basically just TWC and ATT DSL?? I won't go satellite internet. I really cannot wait for U-verse!

And that's one reason why I've never been interested in their price-lock guarantee. It doesn't protect you from any changes or charges they might make outside of your typical bill.

(TWC) ***HD is unavailable Please try later??? What's up with this? Normally, if I change the channel and then come back, it will be available. However, sometimes it's not. I was just watching a movie on AMC HD and during the commercial I switched to another channel. When I went back, I got the message. Whatever is causing this, it's annoying as hell!

(TWC) ***HD is unavailable Please try later??? What's up with this? Normally, if I change the channel and then come back, it will be available. However, sometimes it's not. I was just watching a movie on AMC HD and during the commercial I switched to another channel. When I went back, I got the message. Whatever is causing this, it's annoying as hell!

Welcome to the wonderful world of switched digital video.

I am getting all 3 on my TWC box, but only MAV and Smithsonian on my Windows Media Center CableCard tuners. This means that Hallmark Movies is being delivered using SDV.

Welcome to the wonderful world of switched digital video.

I am also unable to get several channels - AMC HD (244), FX HD (245), SCI HD (247), BIO HD (296), HIST HD (297) with the same message of
***HD is unavailable Please try later. I also have had some problems this weekend with Movies on Demand (501, 502).

Your comment indicated that this was possible related to SDV. Why do you think that this is a SDV issue? I understand what SDV is, but I don't understand the correlation. Would you provide some links that could give me some additional understanding to your comment? :confused:

Thank you,
James

I wonder how long before the backlash starts against the switched video.

Consider... Time Warner wouldn't credit you for time you don't spend watching TV... you have a flat rate per month, right? But when you can clearly demonstrate that you can't watch channels you are paying that flat rate to watch, isn't there likely a class-action lawsuit waiting to happen where people want credits for channels they pay for but cannot watch due to the mechanisms of switched video?

I'm not lawsuit happy myself... but this just sounds like bad PR all around if more people keep having problems.

Would you provide some links that could give me some additional understanding to your comment? :confused:

You're in one. Search this thread. We've been reporting on SDV issues like this since they started the roll out.

We've been reporting on SDV issues like this since they started the roll out.

Yeah, I'm seeing this on a Tivo w/a Tuning Adapter this afternoon - while not all SDV channels are out (woo, FSC!), most of the HD ones throw an error.

OK. The understanding that I have is using SDV, TWC doesn't send a signal for channels that no one is watching. If I select one of those channels, I thought that my box sent a signal request and the channel would be sent. If my understanding is correct, the sending part does not seem to be working correctly. Most of the time, when I switch to a channel and receive the message, if I switch to another channel and then back again, it will be there. Sometimes it may take 10 minutes for a signal to be sent. This is unacceptable to me. Suppose I had my DVR set to record on that channel. TWC has "cheaped out" using this technology instead of increasing capacity. As long as SDV works, no problem. If they can't get it to work properly, they need to put it back in the box!

OK. The understanding that I have is using SDV, TWC doesn't send a signal for channels that no one is watching. If I select one of those channels, I thought that my box sent a signal request and the channel would be sent. If my understanding is correct, the sending part does not seem to be working correctly. Most of the time, when I switch to a channel and receive the message, if I switch to another channel and then back again, it will be there. Sometimes it may take 10 minutes for a signal to be sent. This is unacceptable to me. Suppose I had my DVR set to record on that channel. TWC has "cheaped out" using this technology instead of increasing capacity. As long as SDV works, no problem. If they can't get it to work properly, they need to put it back in the box!

Are you using a TWC Cable box or a TiVo with a Tuning Adapter? One cause of the behavior you describe could be a poor "return path" making it hard for the box to talk back to the hub. If its a TiVo, go into TA diagnostics and hit select twice. The ninth line indicates the RDC power level... what do you see? RDC in the 50's would indicate a problem. I have 47 and all is fine. If its a TWC box, you can go into diags and also find the RDC value.

Anyone on here a F1 fan that watched or recorded the Turkish GP this afternoon? Did you notice any difference in the PQ? Normally F1 is shown on SPEEDHD but Fox has it for four races starting this weekend. It was on RAZHD 250 this afternoon. The general PQ is horrible compared to what I am used to seeing on SPEEDHD. Also I have noticed some jaggies on straight line items like signs, edges of the track, etc. Any ideas?

TWC has "cheaped out" using this technology instead of increasing capacity. As long as SDV works, no problem. If they can't get it to work properly, they need to put it back in the box!

I still think like my original post a few months back, that putting all these new channels on SDV was a case of having to rather than wanting to. If they waited until bandwidth became available their lineup would have been laughable at this point.

Their lack of investment in tangible infrastructure upgrades is now biting them in the ass - see the internet cap debacle for another example.

So since any chance of a serious network upgrade from TWC is a fairy tale the best we can hope for is that the digital switchover allows them to dump enough analog to free up something, somewhere to make SDV function as it should.

Anyone on here a F1 fan that watched or recorded the Turkish GP this afternoon? Did you notice any difference in the PQ? Normally F1 is shown on SPEEDHD but Fox has it for four races starting this weekend. It was on RAZHD 250 this afternoon. The general PQ is horrible compared to what I am used to seeing on SPEEDHD. Also I have noticed some jaggies on straight line items like signs, edges of the track, etc. Any ideas?

I don't get SPEEDHD, so I have nothing to compare it too, but I was vaguely disappointed by the quality. I wound up with a 13GB file size, so FOX did not shirk too much on bandwidth. Maybe there was some other problem, like going from a low bandwidth "Master feed" to mpeg2... I don't watch many sports on FOX, except for NFL football, and that looks considerably worse on FOX than it does on WRAL.

Drew

Does anyone know the story on this from the above link?

"We are currently taking steps to ensure that all of our customers, regardless of equipment, will continue to be able to view WTVD-TV after the end of the broadcasters’ DTV transition on June 12th. However, it is possible that we may be required to cease carriage of WTVD-TV in analog format on channel 6 (for Durham, Chapel Hill), channel 9 (for Raleigh, Wake Forest, Youngsville, Knightdale, Wendell, Zebulon), channel 11 (for Farmville, Goldsboro, Henderson, Wilson, Bailey, Lake Gaston, Littleton, Spring Hope), channel 13 (for Carrboro, Cary, Garner) and channel 213. Regardless, WTVD-TV’s HD signal will remain available on channel 211 and channel 212 to customers with HD converters and will continue to be accessible on direct-connect digital televisions and other devices that include a QAM tuner."

Now what about those old folks who were told by the tv cable "do not worry we will keep the tv signal coming into your analog tv after the ota analog is shut down"? When the cable tv is shutting down their analog channel; Is the tv cable going to give the old folks the set top box free at no extra charge?

If the charge one cent more for the box, they have broken a promise & are guilty of filthy lucre.

Now what about those old folks who were told by the tv cable "do not worry we will keep the tv signal coming into your analog tv after the ota analog is shut down"? When the cable tv is shutting down their analog channel; Is the tv cable going to give the old folks the set top box free at no extra charge?

If the charge one cent more for the box, they have broken a promise & are guilty of filthy lucre.

My understanding was that you have to have a digital TV with a QAM tuner or a set top box. I could be wrong, but I don't think that TWC ever promised to keep sending an analog signal.

We have had YEARS to prepare for the digital transition. It surprises me that, at the 11th hour, we have people who seem to be shocked at this as though this is the first time they have heard of it. I'll bet that if it were postponed for 5 more years, we would still have that 10% who would not be ready. Call me a hard ass, but I don't have much sympathy for them. Some are playing the "poor old folks card", but I'm 67 years old and I get it.

My understanding was that you have to have a digital TV with a QAM tuner or a set top box. I could be wrong, but I don't think that TWC ever promised to keep sending an analog signal.

I do not have a way to copy the tv adds. But if I could, I could show you their tv add of such a commitment. They have run & put them over the air attmepting to get new customers who still use the antenna only. But if they do not stand by the promise giving the older folks the same analog channels at the same price per month even if over a free box that they will maintain free from now on;' Then their tv adds are miss leading & they are guilty of filthy lucre.

My understanding was that you have to have a digital TV with a QAM tuner or a set top box. I could be wrong, but I don't think that TWC ever promised to keep sending an analog signal.

Nope. The FCC has mandated that the analog signal MUST be shown as it always has on cable for broadcast channels. This does not apply however to networks like TNT, CNN, ESPN etc. Only ABC, NBC, CBS, FOX, CW, UNC, and MyTV and anything else on there now that is being delivered off the analog towers.

I do not have a way to copy the tv adds. But if I could, I could show you their tv add of such a commitment. They have run & put them over the air attmepting to get new customers who still use the antenna only. But if they do not stand by the promise giving the older folks the same analog channels at the same price per month even if over a free box that they will maintain free from now on;' Then their tv adds are miss leading & they are guilty of filthy lucre.

Since I have a cable box, I haven't paid much attention to their ads so I'm probably wrong.

Nope. The FCC has mandated that the analog signal MUST be shown as it always has on cable for broadcast channels. This does not apply however to networks like TNT, CNN, ESPN etc. Only ABC, NBC, CBS, FOX, CW, UNC, and MyTV and anything else on there now that is being delivered off the analog towers.

When channel 5 stops broadcasting an analog signal for example, I assume that they will broadcast their signal digitally. So you are saying that when TWC receives this digital signal, they will have to convert it to analog. This seems to defeat the purpose of going digital.

When channel 5 stops broadcasting an analog signal for example, I assume that they will broadcast their signal digitally. So you are saying that when TWC receives this digital signal, they will have to convert it to analog. This seems to defeat the purpose of going digital.

TWC is to provide an analog channel of the current ch5. It can be done at the head end [the office] of the tv cable. The tv cable can go to complete digital but provide the box with an ch 3 analog box like the ota converter box. If that is done then it is defeating the purpose going to TV cable. Just get an OTA box & connect it to the antenna. Otherwise tvc cable is defeating their purpose. It smells like
filthy lucre.

When channel 5 stops broadcasting an analog signal for example, I assume that they will broadcast their signal digitally. So you are saying that when TWC receives this digital signal, they will have to convert it to analog. This seems to defeat the purpose of going digital.

It defeats the purpose in my opinion also, BUT some people don't like change...:rolleyes:

The cable companies have already converted to the digital signal, and are sending that in a much watered down state to the analog low end broadcast tier. People are fools to like that picture, or continue to pay for a signal like that if you ask me.

TV ANTENNA'S ARE THE WAY TO GO!

It defeats the purpose in my opinion also, BUT some people don't like change...:rolleyes:

The cable companies have already converted to the digital signal, and are sending that in a much watered down state to the analog low end broadcast tier. People are fools to like that picture, or continue to pay for a signal like that if you ask me.

TV ANTENNA'S ARE THE WAY TO GO!

I guess I don't get it. Technology is constantly changing and, in most cases, it requires us to upgrade our equipment (i.e. cassette decks, etc.) to enjoy the benefits. I can't see why the government, cable companies, etc. are bending over backwards to accommodate that 10% that don't want to change. I guess this is another case of political correctness causing the many to have to accommodate the few.:mad:

I guess I don't get it. Technology is constantly changing and, in most cases, it requires us to upgrade our equipment (i.e. cassette decks, etc.) to enjoy the benefits. I can't see why the government, cable companies, etc. are bending over backwards to accommodate that 10% that don't want to change. I guess this is another case of political correctness causing the many to have to accommodate the few.:mad:I guess they could be partly thinking of it as a public service. If not even cable provided analog signals anymore, landfills wouldn't be big enough to take all the devices with only analog tuners at once. I probably have over 500 lbs. of such stuff myself. ;)

This morning, I am unable to receive channel 279 (NGCHD) and excessive pixelation on channels 277 (HGTVD) and 278 (FOODHD). All other channels are fine as well as the non-HD channels for the three with issues.

TWC says dispatch but I was wondering if anyone else is having this issue. Send me a private message if you like.

Cheers

I don't get SPEEDHD, so I have nothing to compare it too, but I was vaguely disappointed by the quality. I wound up with a 13GB file size, so FOX did not shirk too much on bandwidth. Maybe there was some other problem, like going from a low bandwidth "Master feed" to mpeg2... I don't watch many sports on FOX, except for NFL football, and that looks considerably worse on FOX than it does on WRAL.

Drew

Anyone on here a F1 fan that watched or recorded the Turkish GP this afternoon? Did you notice any difference in the PQ? Normally F1 is shown on SPEEDHD but Fox has it for four races starting this weekend. It was on RAZHD 250 this afternoon. The general PQ is horrible compared to what I am used to seeing on SPEEDHD. Also I have noticed some jaggies on straight line items like signs, edges of the track, etc. Any ideas?

yes, i noticed a difference. i think F1 broadcast do not originate in HD, but are produced in widescreen SD. so the quality on speedHD isn't great to start with. but i do think it was noticably worse on FOX. not sure why, but a couple of guesses:
1) maybe some extra "conversions" were done for the FOX broadcast
2) the FOX broadcast was delayed ... maybe the recording and replay was lossy.

there is a replay today on speed. it would be interesting to see if the replay on speed is better than the delayed fox broadcast.

Is anyone else having problems with NBC (Digital 17.1, 17.2, 17.3) and analog channel 7 this morning? The digital channels are showing up blank, and channel 7 has no audio.

I'm on TWC in Garner.

Is anyone else having problems with NBC (Digital 17.1, 17.2, 17.3) and analog channel 7 this morning? The digital channels are showing up blank, and channel 7 has no audio.

I'm on TWC in Garner.

Either Barry's on his way to Progress Energy to pay the delinquent power bill, or perhaps it was a disgruntled recently released staffer with a pair of bolt cutters. Regardless, it's off the air.

UPDATE: TWC has scrambled to put the analog signal back up. It's the digital transmitter that's dead.

No NBC this morning...maybe they tried some local news in HD and melted the transmitter.

Those storms last night may have done some damage. WITN had problems early this morning with programming.

17.1 digital is off the air right now. the SD 17 is on Dish - probably a quick drop to the analog channel. 17.2 and 17.3 are on, 17.2 appears to be showing the normal 17.1 programming in SD

Sorry - dont know where else to post this question.

Complete NOOB here. I would like to watch free HDTV over the air. I noticed an old antenna in my attic (we moved into this new house a few months ago) (pictures below).

Can I simply connect my TV to this antenna and get HDTV for free or I am missing a bunch of key steps?

My details:
TV: Panasonic 42” Plasma (3 years old)
Zip Code: 28210 – Charlotte, NC
Location: on top of hill, no major blockages
Antenna location: Attic

Complete NOOB here. I would like to watch free HDTV over the air. I noticed an old antenna in my attic (we moved into this new house a few months ago) (pictures below).

Can I simply connect my TV to this antenna and get HDTV for free or I am missing a bunch of key steps?

My details:
TV: Panasonic 42” Plasma (3 years old)
Zip Code: 28210 – Charlotte, NC
Location: on top of hill, no major blockages
Antenna location: Attic

You can always try it. ;) Seriously, from those pictures, it looks like it is currently hooked up to bypass the amplifier and I assume the white cable eventually goes to where you can connect to your TV. If so, you should be able to just connect to your Panasonic's antenna input and then go into the TV's setup menu and have it scan for digital channels. Assuming that antenna can pick up enough signal for your location, you should be good to go on picking up over the air digital HD signals from your local stations.

Sorry - dont know where else to post this question.

Complete NOOB here. I would like to watch free HDTV over the air. I noticed an old antenna in my attic (we moved into this new house a few months ago) (pictures below).

Can I simply connect my TV to this antenna and get HDTV for free or I am missing a bunch of key steps?

My details:
TV: Panasonic 42” Plasma (3 years old)
Zip Code: 28210 – Charlotte, NC
Location: on top of hill, no major blockages
Antenna location: Attic

You may also want to post your question in the Charlotte-OTA forum. They'll be able to give you a lot more help than those of us here in Raleigh can.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=486246&page=67

Yup had NBC out here in Raleigh this morning when i first turned on my DirecTV box. good to know it wasn't just me.

Meanwhile right now its VERY jerky watching "Im a Celebrity Get Me Out Of Here" with the picture going out and right back on at times.

Can someone explain these maps? I looked them over for the Raleigh market and it appears when the switch occurs for some, the signal will improve while others will get worse. For example, UNC-TV and NBC17 appear to get worse after the change. There appears to be another map that shows they will improve at a later date.

http://www.fcc.gov/dtv/markets/

Thanks.

Can someone explain these maps? I looked them over for the Raleigh market and it appears when the switch occurs for some, the signal will improve while others will get worse. For example, UNC-TV and NBC17 appear to get worse after the change. There appears to be another map that shows they will improve at a later date.

http://www.fcc.gov/dtv/markets/

Thanks.

The ones who lose in the beginning are starting out at reduced power while they make adjustments. Some may not even be doing that still, like WTVD might just turn up to the full power map. I think UNC WRAL and WNCN may be starting on low. Anyone know for sure?

Last night got my new Winegard HD 8800 up, and could get 17 analog almost perfect. The digital high power channels from up at Garner were 30-40%. I was still able to view all the same channels but with much better signals than the U-75R gave. If you need to buy an antenna, this is the one. I modified mine, by making the rear screen continuous for VHF reception. WNCT went from 40% to 60% five feet off the ground when I added the three inch screen across the gap in the reflectors. Analog high VHF stations looked better than they did with my old VU-90XR. This 8800 is very directional, and I can't see any problems tuning channels over 40 with it. I tied back the feed system with a zip tie to get it away from the bowties. I carefully bent the feed lines toward the rear as well. Very happy with it, and saved about $50 at least, because if I had gone with seperate band antennas I would have needed more coax and joiners.

Can someone explain these maps?

I think the first one is what's anticipated to happen on transition day, and the next one is the anticipated final state of things, after pending construction, etc, is completed.

Does anybody remember how long WUNC is going to be at low power after the transition? It looks like it will be miserable for a while (45KW, low elevation). I guess its a good thing I have a lot of Sesame Street, Curious George, and Thomas queued up in case we can't get WUNC for a while.

Drew

The ones who lose in the beginning are starting out at reduced power while they make adjustments. Some may not even be doing that still, like WTVD might just turn up to the full power map. I think UNC WRAL and WNCN may be starting on low. Anyone know for sure?

Last night got my new Winegard HD 8800 up, and could get 17 analog almost perfect. The digital high power channels from up at Garner were 30-40%. I was still able to view all the same channels but with much better signals than the U-75R gave. If you need to buy an antenna, this is the one. I modified mine, by making the rear screen continuous for VHF reception. WNCT went from 40% to 60% five feet off the ground when I added the three inch screen across the gap in the reflectors. Analog high VHF stations looked better than they did with my old VU-90XR. This 8800 is very directional, and I can't see any problems tuning channels over 40 with it. I tied back the feed system with a zip tie to get it away from the bowties. I carefully bent the feed lines toward the rear as well. Very happy with it, and saved about $50 at least, because if I had gone with seperate band antennas I would have needed more coax and joiners.

WNCN and WRAL are both at lower transmitter power today while the other half of their existing transmitters are converted. WRAL has full ERP today because their half power transmitter is focused only on the western half of their coverage area. WNCN has to convert the other half of their ch17 analog to digital capability while WRAL has to their convert frequency on the other half of their existing digital transmitter. WRAL will be moving up to their new antenna and off the lower aux sidemount which should restore service to the east but ERP over the full circle will be half what it was in the western halfcircle today. On friday their power will remain the same but be fullcircle which cuts effective power in half.

Disclaimer... this is my understanding from reading the stuff on fcc submissions. subject to corrections by Russ and Pete (or Scooper ;) ).

WNCN and WRAL are both starting at lower power while the other half of their existing transmitters are converted. WNCN has to convert there ch17 analog to digital capability while WRAL has to their convert frequency on their existing digital transmitter. WRAL will be moving up to their new antenna and off the lower aux sidemount which should help to the east but ERP will drop from today. Today they are on half a transmitter but concentrated only on a halfcircle. On friday their power will remain the same but be fullcircle which cuts effective power in half.

Disclaimer... this is my understanding from reading the stuff on fcc submissions. subject to corrections by Russ and Pete.

Almost - Right now, WRAL is at Full 1 MW on the side aux, tomorrow they goto half power on the 2000' antenna, should result in a net gain of viewers. Expect the half power to full power before the end of the summer.

I don't remember the details on WNCN.

When channel 5 stops broadcasting an analog signal for example, I assume that they will broadcast their signal digitally. So you are saying that when TWC receives this digital signal, they will have to convert it to analog. This seems to defeat the purpose of going digital.

Well, the purpose of going digital was only for the actual over the air broadcasts for stations. It had nothing to do with Cable per se, except that cable companies are needing to make some adjustments in how the signal is delivered to compensate just like conumers are having to do. In some cases, the cable companies have been using the HD feed and converting it to analog or whatever their plant needs to get the SD signal out and this has resulted in a better picture than before.

There are lots of people with TVs that are 25 years old and they have a cable box sitting on top, the TV is tuned to Channel 3 and care nothing about HD or even stereo for that matter.

Almost - Right now, WRAL is at Full 1 MW on the side aux, tomorrow they goto half power on the 2000' antenna, should result in a net gain of viewers. Expect the half power to full power before the end of the summer.

I don't remember the details on WNCN.

Yes... Today... transmitter power is at half... but ERP is full power but only in the western semicircle. Less transmitter power but concentrated into half the area.

I wasnt clear that i was referring to transmitter power and not ERP.

Ill clean up my post. Thanks,

What time today should I do the rescan (i.e. when are they all done screwing around)? I see that WRAL is at 13:00, but I don't know when the rest are.

Eastern NC channel 12 WCTI will be going just after noon, so if you have VHF antennas, are east of Raleigh and are home, turn it down east and check it out. This will be one of the first to switch I believe. WRAL had to wait for them to get off channel 48 before coming on air.

http://www.fcc.gov/ftp/Bureaus/MB/Databases/fm_tv_service_areas/maps/DT1250678.jpg

What time today should I do the rescan (i.e. when are they all done screwing around)? I see that WRAL is at 13:00, but I don't know when the rest are.

From what I've been able to find -
WRAL - starts analog Nightlight at 1255, stop DTV on 53 at 1255, start DTV on 48 as soon as they can
WRAZ - shutoff analog 50 at 1300. They are already on their final DTV channel
WTVD - shutoff analog at 1230. move DTV from 52 to 11 as soon as they can
WNCN - shutoff analog 1230, move DTV from 55 to 17 as soon as they can
WUNC stations (all) - Midnight for all analog shutdowns / DTV moves
WRAY - analog off, already on final DTV

WLFL - analog off, moving from 57 to 27, I don't have a time
WRDC - analog off, moving from 27 to 28, I don't have a time
WLFL and WRDC will be happening at the same time.

WUVC - I don't know what time their analog is shutoff, but they are already on final DTV

WRPX -on Final DTV, but I don't know when they plan to shutoff analog
WFPX - I think that is ditto

Hi everyone. Now that the NHL playoffs are drawing to a close, its time for my summer ritual: Scaling back on cable TV. Last summer I pared down to basic cable and tried running a DVR on my HTPC. I was not at all pleased with the picture quality on the QAM tuner that I was using. It was a Avermedia dual hybrid job. The QAM video was essentially unawtchable. I'm pretty certain it was the tuner's fault because running the cable directly through the TV worked fine, and using an antenna provided great pictures through the ATSC tuner too, at least on the few stations I could get with rabbit ears.

I'd like to try this again with a better QAM tuner card. Does anyone have anysuggestions?

I have a couple of limitations: First, I don't think I can use an HD Homerun because my modem and router are in another room and its very difficult for me to run an ethernet cable to the HTPC. (I don't have a crawlspace and the attic is a nightmare to navigate.) So I'd be stuck with wireless-g only, which is not sufficient for 720p. At least that's what I've heard. Second, I can't really put an antenna in the attic and go OTA due to the aforementioned nightmarish attic.

So, if anyone has any thoughts on a good QAM tuner card or any other suggestions, I'd really appreciate it.

Thanks,

Marc

Hi everyone. Now that the NHL playoffs are drawing to a close, its time for my summer ritual: Scaling back on cable TV. Last summer I pared down to basic cable and tried running a DVR on my HTPC. I was not at all pleased with the picture quality on the QAM tuner that I was using. It was a Avermedia dual hybrid job. The QAM video was essentially unawtchable. I'm pretty certain it was the tuner's fault because running the cable directly through the TV worked fine, and using an antenna provided great pictures through the ATSC tuner too, at least on the few stations I could get with rabbit ears.

I'd like to try this again with a better QAM tuner card. Does anyone have anysuggestions?

I have a couple of limitations: First, I don't think I can use an HD Homerun because my modem and router are in another room and its very difficult for me to run an ethernet cable to the HTPC. (I don't have a crawlspace and the attic is a nightmare to navigate.) So I'd be stuck with wireless-g only, which is not sufficient for 720p. At least that's what I've heard. Second, I can't really put an antenna in the attic and go OTA due to the aforementioned nightmarish attic.

So, if anyone has any thoughts on a good QAM tuner card or any other suggestions, I'd really appreciate it.

Thanks,

Marc

Look at Hauppauge products. I've been very satisfied with them.

Caveat - I am NOT on cable and have not tried QAM tuners. But their analog and ATSC tuners are fine

Oh - in case you all didn't notice - it looks like 17 digital is back up completely. All 3 subchannels, etc...

Look at Hauppauge products. I've been very satisfied with them.

To the contrary, I've had very bad experiences with them. I find the DViCO products to be much better, though the software leaves something to be desired.

- Trip

Hi everyone. Now that the NHL playoffs are drawing to a close, its time for my summer ritual: Scaling back on cable TV. Last summer I pared down to basic cable and tried running a DVR on my HTPC. I was not at all pleased with the picture quality on the QAM tuner that I was using. It was a Avermedia dual hybrid job. The QAM video was essentially unawtchable. I'm pretty certain it was the tuner's fault because running the cable directly through the TV worked fine, and using an antenna provided great pictures through the ATSC tuner too, at least on the few stations I could get with rabbit ears.

I'd like to try this again with a better QAM tuner card. Does anyone have anysuggestions?

I have a couple of limitations: First, I don't think I can use an HD Homerun because my modem and router are in another room and its very difficult for me to run an ethernet cable to the HTPC. (I don't have a crawlspace and the attic is a nightmare to navigate.) So I'd be stuck with wireless-g only, which is not sufficient for 720p. At least that's what I've heard. Second, I can't really put an antenna in the attic and go OTA due to the aforementioned nightmarish attic.

So, if anyone has any thoughts on a good QAM tuner card or any other suggestions, I'd really appreciate it.

Thanks,

Marc
You could use an HDHR and hook it directly to the computer with an extra Ethernet port...

You could use an HDHR and hook it directly to the computer with an extra Ethernet port...

That's interesting. I do have an unused ethernet port. I had looked at this at some other time and it looked like it wasn't that straightforward. Is it? If it is, then this might be the best option.

Also, I noticed on the Silicon Dust site that the Homerun lists the QAM tuner as for "unencrypted digital cable TV". I'm concerned about the "digital" part. Does TWC send analog QAM for some channels? I guess the bottom line question is, will I get all the standard channels with this tuner or will I miss some? I understand that I will get no more than the clear QAM channels, but I want to be sure that I can get all of those.

Thanks for your help, and same for the other responses too.

Marc

That's interesting. I do have an unused ethernet port. I had looked at this at some other time and it looked like it wasn't that straightforward. Is it? If it is, then this might be the best option.

Also, I noticed on the Silicon Dust site that the Homerun lists the QAM tuner as for "unencrypted digital cable TV". I'm concerned about the "digital" part. Does TWC send analog QAM for some channels? I guess the bottom line question is, will I get all the standard channels with this tuner or will I miss some? I understand that I will get no more than the clear QAM channels, but I want to be sure that I can get all of those.

Thanks for your help, and same for the other responses too.

Marc

QAM, is 100% digital, just like ATSC. Wither encrypted or not, QAM is bits, not analog modulation.

HDHR Site also has a channel look up based on your zip code, take and look and see what is reported in your area, for clear QAM....

I just so happened to by on WLFL-DT at noon today. There was a quick screen that went something like "If you get this channel over the air then please rescan now." 15 seconds later I lost signal. Did a rescan and found WLFL-DT on it's new frequency.

Let the rescanning begin!

QAM, is 100% digital, just like ATSC. Wither encrypted or not, QAM is bits, not analog modulation.

HDHR Site also has a channel look up based on your zip code, take and look and see what is reported in your area, for clear QAM....

Thanks very much. That's exactly what I needed to know. I'll probably be hittin the web looking for an HDHR shortly.

11 and 17 went at 1230
1241 - 47 is off

Looks like 11 OTA is down for the count here in Youngsville - at least until I can do something.
edit again - SOME of my ATSC tuners are doing fine on 11, a couple aren't.

Transition in Raleigh is complete except for the WUNC stations.

WTVD-DT is coming in at 80 percent on channel 11 with my CM4221 UHF antenna. WNCN is up on channel 17 with close to 95 percent signal strength. I still plan to do some antenna adjusting after the dust settles.

To the contrary, I've had very bad experiences with them. I find the DViCO products to be much better, though the software leaves something to be desired.

- Trip

WinTV-2250 from Hauppage. I use it for QAM and its great...also great for OTA. It's also a hybrid split tuner, so you can watch and record at the same time. I've run it using Vista and Win7 media center with no problems. Figure out what frontend you want to use, WMC, Beyond, Meedio, Sage, Myth and make sure the card you use will work. Bundled software with TV tuners leaves much to be desired.

-NitDawg

Yeah, I'm going to need to tweak some when the dust settles. Channel 11 is lower signal than before since I don't have a proper VHF antenna in place at the moment.

I'm holding off on major tweaks until WUNC switches, though, since that is sometimes a bear for me to get... and affects how I get other channels depending on my antenna config.

That said, it looks like everything that was going to switch, switched (frequencies anyway, can't speak to analog cutoff)... just waiting on WUNC to switch tonight.

Everything has rescanned fine except WRAZ 50. I can manually tune to it (on real channel 49) but when I add it it says it can't. Is it possible WRAZ is not transmitting its RFID (or whatever it's called that does the real to virtual mapping)? Anyone else having this issue?

WinTV-2250 from Hauppage. I use it for QAM and its great...also great for OTA. It's also a hybrid split tuner, so you can watch and record at the same time. I've run it using Vista and Win7 media center with no problems. Figure out what frontend you want to use, WMC, Beyond, Meedio, Sage, Myth and make sure the card you use will work. Bundled software with TV tuners leaves much to be desired.

-NitDawg

Thanks. I've seen some good things about that card too. Looks like I have a couple of good options here.

Everything has rescanned fine except WRAZ 50. I can manually tune to it (on real channel 49) but when I add it it says it can't. Is it possible WRAZ is not transmitting its RFID (or whatever it's called that does the real to virtual mapping)? Anyone else having this issue?

Not here - everything scanned just fine.

DTV Trx:
NCN 17 coming in stronger than ever after rescan, had been 0 - 15 now a solid 90!

WRAL weak as ever. Watchable only with calm wind. They must be having issues lighting-up the higher antenna.

Everything has rescanned fine except WRAZ 50. I can manually tune to it (on real channel 49) but when I add it it says it can't. Is it possible WRAZ is not transmitting its RFID (or whatever it's called that does the real to virtual mapping)? Anyone else having this issue?

50 is fine here. SageTV says it is showing its PSIP. From my adapter6-ATSC.frq:
CH:16 major:50 minor:1 prog:3 phy:49 frq:683000000 #:WRAZ-HD
CH:17 major:50 minor:2 prog:4 phy:49 frq:683000000 #:RTN
CH:18 major:50 minor:3 prog:5 phy:49 frq:683000000 #:WRAZ-2

What kind of a tuner do you use?

Drew

50 is fine here. SageTV says it is showing its PSIP. From my adapter6-ATSC.frq:
CH:16 major:50 minor:1 prog:3 phy:49 frq:683000000 #:WRAZ-HD
CH:17 major:50 minor:2 prog:4 phy:49 frq:683000000 #:RTN
CH:18 major:50 minor:3 prog:5 phy:49 frq:683000000 #:WRAZ-2

What kind of a tuner do you use?

Drew

My HDHomeruns rescanned fine, but on my Pioneer 111FD it will not add WRAZ 50. I can go into the menu and manually tune to 49 and it displays fine but when I manually add it it says it can't find any channels - kind of like it doesn't see the PSIP. Removing all channels and doing a full rescan leaves out WRAZ as well.

Hi everyone. Now that the NHL playoffs are drawing to a close, its time for my summer ritual: Scaling back on cable TV. Last summer I pared down to basic cable and tried running a DVR on my HTPC. I was not at all pleased with the picture quality on the QAM tuner that I was using. It was a Avermedia dual hybrid job. The QAM video was essentially unawtchable. I'm pretty certain it was the tuner's fault because running the cable directly through the TV worked fine, and using an antenna provided great pictures through the ATSC tuner too, at least on the few stations I could get with rabbit ears.

I'd like to try this again with a better QAM tuner card. Does anyone have anysuggestions?

I have a couple of limitations: First, I don't think I can use an HD Homerun because my modem and router are in another room and its very difficult for me to run an ethernet cable to the HTPC. (I don't have a crawlspace and the attic is a nightmare to navigate.) So I'd be stuck with wireless-g only, which is not sufficient for 720p. At least that's what I've heard. Second, I can't really put an antenna in the attic and go OTA due to the aforementioned nightmarish attic.

So, if anyone has any thoughts on a good QAM tuner card or any other suggestions, I'd really appreciate it.

Thanks,

Marc

The QAM channels that we get through Time Warner are always breaking up. I've used the internal tuners on our Vizo TV, Sony TV, and Tivo Series 3 with poor results.

My HDHomeruns rescanned fine, but on my Pioneer 111FD it will not add WRAZ 50. I can go into the menu and manually tune to 49 and it displays fine but when I manually add it it says it can't find any channels - kind of like it doesn't see the PSIP. Removing all channels and doing a full rescan leaves out WRAZ as well.

Finally got WRAZ. It's a bug or something in the Digital Tuner part of the TV's menu. Doing the full main TV setup process again which includes scanning channels found them, however re-scanning from the Digital Tuner menu section would never pull it in.

WNCN 17 not found for me.

But WTVD 11 and WRDC 28 are found, and they are both listed below WNCN on the TVFool chart.

The QAM channels that we get through Time Warner are always breaking up. I've used the internal tuners on our Vizo TV, Sony TV, and Tivo Series 3 with poor results.

Hmmm... last summer I used the internal tuner on my Panasonic and it was fine as far as it did not constantly break up. Wasn't as good as the OTA picture, but it was a lot easier. Anyway, the problem I had with the Avermedia tuner wasn't that it would break up. The picture quality was just bad. The colors were washed out but, far worse, the picture/colors tended to bleed and swim. That's the best I can describe it without using a lot more words!

Anybody know if WTVD 11 is at full power? Tuner stats are indicating lots of FEC corrected errors. SNR is around 26db which should be good for OTA but the hits just keep coming at the rate of 2-3 per second. The good news is no uncorrected so the pic is fine... but I hate to be sitting on the edge of the cliff....

WNCN 17 is showing some correcteds too. WRAL and WRAZ is solid as a rock.

28-1 strong signal but black screen
22-1 no signal
4-1 no signal

EDIT: found that WTVD-DT 11 is at full power..........

WNCN 17 not found for me.

But WTVD 11 and WRDC 28 are found, and they are both listed below WNCN on the TVFool chart.Looks like I'm outta luck. The Gain/Loss map shows the northern fringe folks getting screwed by NBC. Damn.
TVFool missed the mark on that one.

http://www.fcc.gov/mb/engineering/maps/images/callsigns/WNCN.gif

Looks like I'm outta luck. The Gain/Loss map shows the northern fringe folks getting screwed by NBC. Damn.
TVFool missed the mark on that one.

http://www.fcc.gov/mb/engineering/maps/images/callsigns/WNCN.gif

I live outside of the contour of most of the out of the market stations that I get. Yet TVfool, predicted that I would get them and I do... Can you post your TVfool? What antenna/amp....

WNCN 17x's WRDC and WRAL rockin' and rollin down here in Jacksonville NC! :D

No sign of WTVD. WLFL won't quite come in.

I'm having a strange problem with WLFL on QAM. After I rescanned, 22.1 comes in fine unless I try to access it from favorites. No problems if I punch in 22.1. Could be a fault with the TV I guess.

Also, I noticed WRAL2 is now carrying THIS (5.2). I'm not familiar with it, but it looks similar to RTV on 50.2.

Thanks. I've seen some good things about that card too. Looks like I have a couple of good options here.

You should be here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forumdisplay.php?f=26

Plenty of user feedback in that subforum.

yes, i noticed a difference. i think F1 broadcast do not originate in HD, but are produced in widescreen SD. so the quality on speedHD isn't great to start with. but i do think it was noticably worse on FOX. not sure why, but a couple of guesses:
1) maybe some extra "conversions" were done for the FOX broadcast
2) the FOX broadcast was delayed ... maybe the recording and replay was lossy.

there is a replay today on speed. it would be interesting to see if the replay on speed is better than the delayed fox broadcast.

I have been off line for a few days... I have often wondered about the F1 broadcast on SPEEDHD. It looks better than the broadcast on SD SPEED, at least to me. But, SPEED is not in control of the feed. Its my understanding that there is one F1 approved international feed. I wonder what happens to the broadcast quality as the series moves from country to country. I missed the replay on SPEEDHD. Notice any difference?

I live outside of the contour of most of the out of the market stations that I get. Yet TVfool, predicted that I would get them and I do... Can you post your TVfool? What antenna/amp....

My TVFool (http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d663dd5cacc580e)
I don't know the antenna; I've had it for years, it was the biggest one RadioShack sold back then, a VHF/UHF combo. The amp is a mast-mounted type with indoor power supply. The specsheet says Gain VHF:28dB UHF:22dB

In Cary, I lost 11.1 and 17.1 on my UHF-only Antennas Direct 91XG (despite rescan and manual add). Oddly, if I rotate the antenna nearly 90 degrees from the tower direction, I get a low signal that is almost watchable.

However, my Channel Master CM4228 is picking up both 11.1 and 17.1 just fine along with all the other locals from the same antenna farm. It must have better performance down in the low UHF and high VHF.

My TVFool (http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d663dd5cacc580e)
I don't know the antenna; I've had it for years, it was the biggest one RadioShack sold back then, a VHF/UHF combo. The amp is a mast-mounted type with indoor power supply. The specsheet says Gain VHF:28dB UHF:22dB

You're way up in Virginia - reception should be possible (except maybe WTVD). But you're definately on the edge / close to it... 60 miles is PUSHING UHF.

Is anyone else here with TWC having trouble with the guide this evening? I can't get any data past 6:00 PM on 6/13.:mad:

You're way up in Virginia - reception should be possible (except maybe WTVD). But you're definately on the edge / close to it... 60 miles is PUSHING UHF.I get WTVD with no problem, signal strength 85 on my PalPlus converter box. It's not a matter of my antenna or amp or UHF limitations. I was getting digital WNCN 17 for the last 2 months, up until the transition today. My TVFool chart shows 5 stations at identical distance and compass reading from me. WNCN 17 is the only one of the 5 which does not tune.

After the switch I believe the signal strength is too low for me to pick up in North East Raleigh. I had previously had a signal around 75% to 100% with my Channel Master converter box. I have an indoor antenna mounted in the very top of my attic which has done pretty good for me. I pick up all channels in this area with it with a pretty good signal. I believe I read that UNC-TV should be up to a higher signal strength in October. Anyone have any recommendations for antenna types that may work well in my attic to pick up UNC-TV before October? Is October the date UNC-TV should be back to normal?

Thanks!

After the switch I believe the signal strength is too low for me to pick up in North East Raleigh. I had previously had a signal around 75% to 100% with my Channel Master converter box. I have an indoor antenna mounted in the very top of my attic which has done pretty good for me. I pick up all channels in this area with it with a pretty good signal. I believe I read that UNC-TV should be up to a higher signal strength in October. Anyone have any recommendations for antenna types that may work well in my attic to pick up UNC-TV before October? Is October the date UNC-TV should be back to normal?

Thanks!

I lost Ch 4 as well, north Cary, CM 4228 in the attic. Oddly my Dish DVR seems to still be pulling in all the OTA analogs? (I thought they were shut off now). ie I do have an OTA ch 004-0.. just not 004-1, 004-3, 004-5.

My TVFool (http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d663dd5cacc580e)
I don't know the antenna; I've had it for years, it was the biggest one RadioShack sold back then, a VHF/UHF combo. The amp is a mast-mounted type with indoor power supply. The specsheet says Gain VHF:28dB UHF:22dB

Who made the amp? How old is the coax (or is it twin lead, "two side by side wires") Are you aimed at the Raleigh towers at 200 degrees?

I lost Ch 4 as well, north Cary, CM 4228 in the attic.

I'm surprised, after a rescan here, I seem to actually have it, but with a low signal strength. This is on my "good" tuner (air2pc hd5000, LG 5th gen) and my WUNC Chapel Hill aimed CM4228 in the attic. This is based on 5 minutes of watching with clear sky. We'll see how well it does on some of my wife's favorites, which are queued for today..

Drew

I lost Ch 4 as well, north Cary, CM 4228 in the attic. Oddly my Dish DVR seems to still be pulling in all the OTA analogs? (I thought they were shut off now). ie I do have an OTA ch 004-0.. just not 004-1, 004-3, 004-5.

No more UNCTV for me over is Northeast Durham either. Hopefully when the get back to full power I'll be able to pick it up off the edge of my CM4228 (which is on the roof) as well. I know it would cost them, but I sure wish the UNC antenna was on the tower with the rest of the stations in this area.

My TVFool (http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d663dd5cacc580e)
I don't know the antenna; I've had it for years, it was the biggest one RadioShack sold back then, a VHF/UHF combo. The amp is a mast-mounted type with indoor power supply. The specsheet says Gain VHF:28dB UHF:22dB

If you have coax & do not know how old it is, it may be weaking the UHF signals.

If you have 300 ohm flat lead it will need 3 twist per foot. When using analog not using the twist may have caused some distortion but it did not keep you from watching it. But with digital it may go in & out or out all together with out the twist. 300 ohm has lower loss at UHF but it needs more care in the mounting the wire.

If you have coax & do not know how old it is, it may be weaking the UHF signals.

If you have 300 ohm flat lead it will need 3 twist per foot. When using analog not using the twist may have caused some distortion but it did not keep you from watching it. But with digital it may go in & out or out all together with out the twist. 300 ohm has lower loss at UHF but it needs more care in the mounting the wire.

He probably needs an antenna with more low UHF gain. Those old antennas were tuned for the upper channels on UHF a lot more than the newer models, and UHF only antennas. On channel 17, most combo antennas have very little gain, like about 5 dbs.

After the switch I believe the signal strength is too low for me to pick up in North East Raleigh. I had previously had a signal around 75% to 100% with my Channel Master converter box. I have an indoor antenna mounted in the very top of my attic which has done pretty good for me. I pick up all channels in this area with it with a pretty good signal. I believe I read that UNC-TV should be up to a higher signal strength in October. Anyone have any recommendations for antenna types that may work well in my attic to pick up UNC-TV before October? Is October the date UNC-TV should be back to normal?

Thanks!

FWIW (from http://www.unctv.org/)
Some viewers of UNC-TV's over-the-air digital signal in the Chapel Hill area -- the signal from WUNC Channel 25 -- are experiencing reception problems following the federally-mandated shutoff of all analog television signals.

We believe the interference is caused by the low-power signal from another broadcasting station in Durham. UNC-TV is actively working on technical modifications that we hope will resolve or improve the situation soon.

Thank you for your patience as we address this problem.

FWIW (from http://www.unctv.org/)
Some viewers of UNC-TV's over-the-air digital signal in the Chapel Hill area -- the signal from WUNC Channel 25 -- are experiencing reception problems following the federally-mandated shutoff of all analog television signals.

We believe the interference is caused by the low-power signal from another broadcasting station in Durham. UNC-TV is actively working on technical modifications that we hope will resolve or improve the situation soon.

Thank you for your patience as we address this problem.

That explains a few things. After the switch at midnight it was actually slightly stronger than normal here in NW Raleigh, but then it went down an hour or two later. It was back up for a bit around 6 this morning but then went back down. When it's "down" I am receiving a signal strength of about 18, as opposed to 75-80 or so when it's up.

So is WUNC now going to be known by its real frequency 25 instead of 4? After the switch last night all my devices pulled it in as 25.1, 25.2, 25.3 not 4.1, 4.2, 4.3. I know that's the real frequency but it was not being remapped.

So is WUNC now going to be known by its real frequency 25 instead of 4? After the switch last night all my devices pulled it in as 25.1, 25.2, 25.3 not 4.1, 4.2, 4.3. I know that's the real frequency but it was not being remapped.

A scan I did around 9:15 am showed it as being remapped to 4.x by SageTV. I noticed that they dropped the "NC/KD/TV" from their PSIP label. Eg, yesterday the Linux DVB "scan" utility picked them up as:

WUNC-DT, NC-Chapel Hill:743028615:8VSB:81:84:5
WUNC-DT, KD-Chapel Hill:743028615:8VSB:65:68:4
WUNC-DT, TV-Chapel Hill:743028615:8VSB:49:52:3

Where as today I see them all looking the same:

WUNC-DT, Chapel Hill:539028615:8VSB:81:84:5
WUNC-DT, Chapel Hill:539028615:8VSB:65:68:4
WUNC-DT, Chapel Hill:539028615:8VSB:49:52:3


Drew

We were at Target this morning, and the kid at the electronics desk told me converter boxes were selling like hotcakes today. A lady actually asked for advice on which one to get while I was asking him how they were selling.. I felt useless, since I didn't recall which ones had good chipsets..

Drew

I have an HDHomerun connected to Time Warner Cable in Raleigh and it does a great job of picking up the local HD channels. I only get TWCs cable channels 1-24, though. I was really hoping to get all the way up to 78. While this is a great tuner, you may be disappointed if you are paying for the "basic" package, hoping to watch CNN, for instance, on your HTPC. I'm hoping that TWC will convert these channels over to unencrypted QAM at some point as they shed analog channels.

That explains a few things. After the switch at midnight it was actually slightly stronger than normal here in NW Raleigh, but then it went down an hour or two later. It was back up for a bit around 6 this morning but then went back down. When it's "down" I am receiving a signal strength of about 18, as opposed to 75-80 or so when it's up.

So is WUNC now going to be known by its real frequency 25 instead of 4? After the switch last night all my devices pulled it in as 25.1, 25.2, 25.3 not 4.1, 4.2, 4.3. I know that's the real frequency but it was not being remapped.

Since the midnight turnover at UNC-TV I can't seem to pick it up at all (Morrisville)

They're at low power and a lower location on their tower for a short time. They have to have a tower crew remove the old channel 4 analog antenna and channel 59 digital antenna and replace both with a new channel 25 antenna. That signal will be stronger than the channel 59 digital signal it replaces.

- Trip

Hi everyone. Now that the NHL playoffs are drawing to a close, its time for my summer ritual: Scaling back on cable TV. Last summer I pared down to basic cable and tried running a DVR on my HTPC. I was not at all pleased with the picture quality on the QAM tuner that I was using. It was a Avermedia dual hybrid job. The QAM video was essentially unawtchable. I'm pretty certain it was the tuner's fault because running the cable directly through the TV worked fine, and using an antenna provided great pictures through the ATSC tuner too, at least on the few stations I could get with rabbit ears.

I'd like to try this again with a better QAM tuner card. Does anyone have anysuggestions?

I have a couple of limitations: First, I don't think I can use an HD Homerun because my modem and router are in another room and its very difficult for me to run an ethernet cable to the HTPC. (I don't have a crawlspace and the attic is a nightmare to navigate.) So I'd be stuck with wireless-g only, which is not sufficient for 720p. At least that's what I've heard. Second, I can't really put an antenna in the attic and go OTA due to the aforementioned nightmarish attic.

So, if anyone has any thoughts on a good QAM tuner card or any other suggestions, I'd really appreciate it.

Thanks,

Marc

I've had good results with my AVerTV Combo PCI-E M780 ATSC/NTSC tuner with both Vista Media Center and Win 7 Media Center. I did have to update Vista with the Windows Media Center TV Pack 2008 but Win 7 RC worked as is.

I record programs on my PC and play them back in HD to LinkSys Media Extenders in my kitchen and bedroom.

They're at low power and a lower location on their tower for a short time. They have to have a tower crew remove the old channel 4 analog antenna and channel 59 digital antenna and replace both with a new channel 25 antenna. That signal will be stronger than the channel 59 digital signal it replaces.

- Trip

That's interesting... and makes me wonder why they had not been better prepared for the change more in advance. I'm wondering, for example, why they wouldn't have done as WRAL did and put up the new antenna a while back and run in makeshift-mode on the old setup until this weekend and make the switch.

If they'd done that, then the problems would be in the past... instead of (I would guess) the next several months before they get it figured out.

Because they're removing the analog 4 antenna to put up the 25 antenna.

WRAL's auxiliary setup for channel 53 is on an antenna that can be used for channel 48 without too many adjustments. Any money UNC had spent on an alternate channel 4 or 59 antenna would have been thrown away, since neither would be reusable for channel 25. This setup gives them an alternate channel 25 antenna to use if the future primary one fails for some reason.

- Trip

FWIW (from http://www.unctv.org/)
Some viewers of UNC-TV's over-the-air digital signal in the Chapel Hill area -- the signal from WUNC Channel 25 -- are experiencing reception problems following the federally-mandated shutoff of all analog television signals.

We believe the interference is caused by the low-power signal from another broadcasting station in Durham. UNC-TV is actively working on technical modifications that we hope will resolve or improve the situation soon.

Thank you for your patience as we address this problem.

Hopefully when they resolve this maybe I'll get better reception. The FCC maps showed that even with the lower power the signal would extend to most of Wake County.

Thanks!

Hopefully when they resolve this maybe I'll get better reception. The FCC maps showed that even with the lower power the signal would extend to most of Wake County.

Thanks!

Im getting 4-1 off the back side of my attic antenna but its breaking up pretty bad. Lots of corrected and uncorrected errors. SNR in the low 20's.

I used to get WRAZ with excellent results. Snice the switchover, I get a lot of dropouts. Are they at low power like WRAL? I hope so as I don't want to have to adjust my antenna.

I used to get WRAZ with excellent results. Snice the switchover, I get a lot of dropouts. Are they at low power like WRAL? I hope so as I don't want to have to adjust my antenna.

WRAZ is at full power. They basically did nothing on Friday.... :D

50 and 5 are coming in great here in Apex. 22 and 28 are very good, 17 is good... 11 is a bit marginal and 4 is unwatchable.

I used to get WRAZ with excellent results. Snice the switchover, I get a lot of dropouts. Are they at low power like WRAL? I hope so as I don't want to have to adjust my antenna.

Start working on your antenna setup. WRAZ didn't have to do anything on their digital signal - they have been on final like "forever". WRAL's "low power" is 50% of their max. That should be fixed by the end of the summer, I think.

For myself - my problem station was WTVD (back on 11) - I think I got my issues sorted out for now.
WUNP is also not working as well as they did before friday. Same issue as WUNC, I'd imagine.

5,50, 22, 28, 47 are all great here, 17 not quite as good (but still quite acceptable), 11 is definately pulling up the rear (along with WUNP). 40 is gone for now, but after the leaves fall I expect it to come back.

WRAZ is at full power. They basically did nothing on Friday.... :D

50 and 5 are coming in great here in Apex. 22 and 28 are very good, 17 is good... 11 is a bit marginal and 4 is unwatchable.

OK...looks like a tweak of the antenna is in order. On the good side, I now get channel 2 out of Greensboro. :)

WUNP actually should have gone up in both height and power yesterday.

The issue there might be interference from WFPX-DT in Fayetteville...

- Trip

WUNP actually should have gone up in both height and power yesterday.

The issue there might be interference from WFPX-DT in Fayetteville...

- Trip

Where is WUNP located?

OK...looks like a tweak of the antenna is in order. On the good side, I now get channel 2 out of Greensboro. :)

My attic mount 4221HD isnt gonna cut it on VHF 11. Ill either have to go to a 4228HD or just break down and use 211 off of TWC.... no sport in that though.... 17 should be fine once they get the rest of the transmitter online. Has 17 given any indication of when that should happen?

Who made the amp? How old is the coax (or is it twin lead, "two side by side wires") Are you aimed at the Raleigh towers at 200 degrees?
If you have coax & do not know how old it is, it may be weaking the UHF signals.
My antenna is RadioShack VU-190XR (http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?PROD=VU-190XR)
My preamp is Philips Magnavox PM61112 (http://www.summitsource.com/product_info.php?cPath=&products_id=4686)
I can't verify 200degrees with a compass, but I am receiving ALL the other Raleigh stations with no troubles; so that tells me the antenna aim is OK. I have coaxial and it is maybe 12-15 years old. Please don't fixate on this as the obvious problem before considering my previous posts about my TVFool chart and all the other stations I am successfully receiving, and the gain/loss coverage chart published by the station in question.

He probably needs an antenna with more low UHF gain. Those old antennas were tuned for the upper channels on UHF a lot more than the newer models, and UHF only antennas. On channel 17, most combo antennas have very little gain, like about 5 dbs.Short of installing a new antenna, how can I test this theory of "insufficient gain on low UHF"? And what channels are considered low UHF? I'm getting stations on (real) 15, 27, 28; are those low?
I did manage to call the WNCN-17 station's DTV hotline; not sure how much was hard facts vs. canned answers: "Moderate signal...we might be having some trouble in that area...we're broadcasting at reduced power...the engineers will be tweaking things over the next 6 months...rescan, rescan, rescan." I'm just gonna sit tight for now. No need for me to muck around with antennas and cables and amps and whatnot when the station's setup isn't yet finalized. I'll try to contact an engineer at the station next week.

My antenna is RadioShack VU-190XR (http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?PROD=VU-190XR)
My preamp is Philips Magnavox PM61112 (http://www.summitsource.com/product_info.php?cPath=&products_id=4686)


Short of installing a new antenna, how can I test this theory of "insufficient gain on low UHF"? And what channels are considered low UHF? I'm getting stations on (real) 15, 27, 28; are those low?
I did manage to call the WNCN-17 station's DTV hotline; not sure how much was hard facts vs. canned answers: "Moderate signal...we might be having some trouble in that area...we're broadcasting at reduced power...the engineers will be tweaking things over the next 6 months...rescan, rescan, rescan." I'm just gonna sit tight for now. No need for me to muck around with antennas and cables and amps and whatnot when the station's setup isn't yet finalized. I'll try to contact an engineer at the station next week.

Go to this site http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ANTENNAS/comparing.html and look at the graphs of combo antenna's VS UHF only. Notice how the combo's start very low on the graph and get much higher in gain toward channel 40-60. This is what I am referring to. Notice how most UHF only bow ties start high and stay high up to channel 50. This is what you want if you are having signal problems with certain frequencies is an antenna that has high gain on that channel. You start by getting the good antenna before you try to amplify something that isn't getting captured to start with.

I was getting WRAL WNCN very well last night, but having problems with WRAZ. Weird... Must have been co channel interference.

Where is WUNP located?

Draw a line between the Garner towers and Roanoke Rapids. About 15 miles away from Roanoke Rapids along that line is where you'll find WUNP.

- Trip

Notice how the combo's start very low on the graph and get much higher in gain toward channel 40-60. This is what I am referring to. Notice how most UHF only bow ties start high and stay high up to channel 50. This is what you want if you are having signal problems with certain frequencies is an antenna that has high gain on that channel. You start by getting the good antenna before you try to amplify something that isn't getting captured to start with.That's a very good, informative link. Thanks. I understand your point. But I'm not sure if the root problem is my "weak" antenna or if the root problem is something funky WNCN-17 is doing (or not doing) with their transmission. Even the best of the best antenna can't receive a nonexistent signal. I'm not in a hurry to gamble $$ to prove the station is the cause vs. my antenna is the cause of my trouble. If there are some experiments/tests I could do to help narrow things down, I will try it.

Was WUNC having major problems this afternoon? I missed a recording at 2pm, and according to SageTV's logs, it couldn't get a lock on the signal:

Sat 6/13 14:00:07.313 DVB: Channel:25-4-1.
Sat 6/13 14:00:07.578 DVB couldn't get LOCK on try 0.
Sat 6/13 14:00:07.829 DVB couldn't get LOCK on try 1.
<...>

A later recording at 3pm seems fine, and live tv seems fine now..

Drew

I have an HDHomerun connected to Time Warner Cable in Raleigh and it does a great job of picking up the local HD channels. I only get TWCs cable channels 1-24, though. I was really hoping to get all the way up to 78. While this is a great tuner, you may be disappointed if you are paying for the "basic" package, hoping to watch CNN, for instance, on your HTPC. I'm hoping that TWC will convert these channels over to unencrypted QAM at some point as they shed analog channels.

TWC says "NO WAY" we need the money! The said some are cutting the cable off. They are not getting any of the simulas money so the only wat to get it is to increase the rates on those extra channels. They want to stop those trying to sneek those non OTA channels from going to those with the basic package. Thus the only way for you to get thtem is to pay for them.

I have an HDHomerun connected to Time Warner Cable in Raleigh and it does a great job of picking up the local HD channels. I only get TWCs cable channels 1-24, though. I was really hoping to get all the way up to 78. While this is a great tuner, you may be disappointed if you are paying for the "basic" package, hoping to watch CNN, for instance, on your HTPC. I'm hoping that TWC will convert these channels over to unencrypted QAM at some point as they shed analog channels.

I am happy that the HDHomerun is picking up all the QAMs. During the summer, we cut off all cable except for the very basics. I think its now called "broadcast cable." (Isn't that an oxymoron?) And then we get the mlb.tv package, which makes great use of our htpc. I am not expecting to get channels above 24 through the htpc. All I want to be able to do is get those channels (paid for of course), and use my htpc to record them.

I record programs on my PC and play them back in HD to LinkSys Media Extenders in my kitchen and bedroom.

Do you pipe those recordings to the extenders over wireless? If so, what kind of router do you have and does it work well? (Thanks for the help.)

You should be here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forumdisplay.php?f=26

Plenty of user feedback in that subforum.

Thanks. I have been looking over there too. But I am also interested to hear people's feedback on how well they get TWC's QAM stations through whatever tuners they are using.

QAM, is 100% digital, just like ATSC. Wither encrypted or not, QAM is bits, not analog modulation.

HDHR Site also has a channel look up based on your zip code, take and look and see what is reported in your area, for clear QAM....

Alright, now I'm confused again. If QAM is all digital, then is TWC's "analog cable" not QAM? <See TWC cable products and prices (http://www.timewarnercable.com/Carolinas/shop/pricing.html)> If not, what is it and will I not be able to tune it in using an hdhomerun (which doesn't have an NTSC tuner)? Can I tune it in with the Hauppauge 2250 (with an NTSC tuner)?

Marc

(I know I should just set up an antenna and get OTA, but there are reasons I really can't do that right now.)

Alright, now I'm confused again. If QAM is all digital, then is TWC's "analog cable" not QAM? <See TWC cable products and prices (http://www.timewarnercable.com/Carolinas/shop/pricing.html)> If not, what is it and will I not be able to tune it in using an hdhomerun (which doesn't have an NTSC tuner)? Can I tune it in with the Hauppauge 2250 (with an NTSC tuner)?

Marc

(I know I should just set up an antenna and get OTA, but there are reasons I really can't do that right now.)

I do understand that some stations had the analog top mounted & then added the digital as a side mount antenna. Some stations that were staying with the orginal channel thus when the analog was shut down they put the digital transmitter on the top mounted antenna. Once this is done the digital signal may get stronger. But I think most would have done the switch back the the first channel the station was assigned by 12-13-09. But those that wanted to keep the second channel [usually a uhf] & give up their first assinged channel [like VHF low 2 - 6 ] as a unused channel back to the FCC. They may remove the analog VHF low band antenna off the top & install the UHF on the top. That being the case you will get a much stronger signal because of the to is higher but also the pattern is much better than a side mount.

All that said you may get a better signal later this summer.

If you can not get any thing with a $3.00 bow tie & rabbit ears then I would go wiht the cheapest pk you can get from the cable. Thus when you are ready to use an antenna you will be adjusted to having lived with out 200 channels from the tv cable. That way you will be happy with what you get of the antenna

Alright, now I'm confused again. If QAM is all digital, then is TWC's "analog cable" not QAM? <See TWC cable products and prices (http://www.timewarnercable.com/Carolinas/shop/pricing.html)> If not, what is it and will I not be able to tune it in using an hdhomerun (which doesn't have an NTSC tuner)? Can I tune it in with the Hauppauge 2250 (with an NTSC tuner)?

...

Right, analog cable is not QAM.

Yes, a Hauppauge 2250 lets you tune either 2 clear QAM digital cable, 2 analog cable, or one of each type of channel at the same time. What you cannot mix together though is ATSC OTA digital with anything else because the 2250 has only one input (well, it has a second, but it is only for FM radio).

@David-the-dtv-ma and @vidiot1985,

Thanks a lot for your help. Seems like if I can't solve this issue of why analog feeds look so very lousy through my htpc, I may have to look into antenna options again.

mb

Great news!

- SPECIAL NOTICE -

As part of the final transition from analog to digital broadcast television required by the Federal Communications Commission, WUNC-TV – Chapel Hill permanently turned off its channel 4 transmitter located in northern Chatham county at midnight on June 12, 2009.

WUNC-TV also changed it digital broadcast transmission from channel 59 to channel 25. This requires that tuners in digital TV sets and converter boxes be re-scanned to allow them to acquire WUNC-TV (digital) on its new operating channel. It will still appear as 4.1, 4.2, etc when tuning TV sets and converter boxes.

During this transitory stage WUNC-TV digital channel 25 is operating at significantly lower power than the previous channel 59.

Equipment is currently being moved from other transmitter sites to allow the final operating power of WUNC-TV to be greater than it previously was. Antenna and transmission work is also being done on the WUNC-TV tower that will improve transmission power and antenna coverage.

An interim improvement in signal strength is expected within the week with full operating power being achieved by late summer.

Thank you for your patience as we address this problem.

http://www.unctv.org/

Because they're removing the analog 4 antenna to put up the 25 antenna.

WRAL's auxiliary setup for channel 53 is on an antenna that can be used for channel 48 without too many adjustments. Any money UNC had spent on an alternate channel 4 or 59 antenna would have been thrown away, since neither would be reusable for channel 25. This setup gives them an alternate channel 25 antenna to use if the future primary one fails for some reason.

- Trip

I wasn't questioning what they were doing... just when they are doing it. They are having to spend the money anyway, so it seems to me it would have made more sense to already have been working on it so that after the transition they would be done... instead of doing all the work after the transition.

That's all I was saying. The timing seems odd, since they had to have known they would be doing this for a year or two now. Seems like they could have been in temporary-makeshift mode with the channel 4 antenna for the past 6 months-year waiting for the cutoff instead of still having all that work ahead of them now.

I think they're planning to have the antenna replaced really soon. If my contact down there hadn't retired, I'd call him and ask what's going on. Just being on a top-mounted antenna (500 feet higher up, to be more specific) will help a lot. Then they're having the channel 59 transmitter retuned to channel 25, which will take a while because of the huge difference in frequency.

They're trying to recycle as much equipment as possible, so they couldn't really do a whole lot more beyond what they did. They bought a new transmitter for WUNU I think, and are moving its old channel 25 transmitter up to Chapel Hill in the near future, thus the extremely low power right now.

- Trip

I wasn't questioning what they were doing... just when they are doing it. They are having to spend the money anyway, so it seems to me it would have made more sense to already have been working on it so that after the transition they would be done... instead of doing all the work after the transition.

That's all I was saying. The timing seems odd, since they had to have known they would be doing this for a year or two now. Seems like they could have been in temporary-makeshift mode with the channel 4 antenna for the past 6 months-year waiting for the cutoff instead of still having all that work ahead of them now.

I think what was behind that is, the ch4 antenna was going to be canned. So they did not want to buy a 2nd ch 4 antenna to also be junk after 6-13-09. But buying a 2nd ch 25 uhf antenna would be a spare to install in case of antenna failure. So while they ar running on the temp side mount antenna they take the ch 4 off the top & install the ch 25. Then they dissconect the side mount antenna & connect the top mount antenna to the transmitter. Some make keep the side mount as a spare ready to go. Others would take it down & put it in the ware house with the spare tubes & transmitter parts.

But if they already had a spare ch 4 antenna [as some stations do] they could had mounted the spare ch 4 on the side a year ago to clear the top for the ch 25 antenna. It just comes down to money. They went with the lowest cost route. Maybe not the least effect on the service thou. But there is not a lot of spare money flowing now so I can understand their reason.

Thinking through the possible scenarios... If money was the driving factor, then it probably does make more sense. I know donations have been down (presumably true for most PBS stations around the country)...so if they didn't already have spare equipment, I could see not buying it to accomplish the temp-move of the ch4 antenna.

That said, I hope they get up and running better soon. I'm on Dish, so for the moment I'm unable to get channel 4 in HD and have decided it's not worth further tweaking if they will be improving things soon.

I did read somewhere that UNC is putting a translator at GAG (Garner Antenna Garden). Why didn't they get that done before 6-12 ???????

Because the FCC didn't approve it.

- Trip

Because the FCC didn't approve it.

- Trip


Because ???

Because ???

Because the FCC is slow to react?

They didn't say no, but they have yet to say "yes."

- Trip

Because the FCC is slow to react?

They didn't say no, but they have yet to say "yes."

- Trip

Poor planning on someone's part. Raleigh is for all practical purposes without a usable OTA PBS.

I did read somewhere that UNC is putting a translator at GAG (Garner Antenna Garden). Why didn't they get that done before 6-12 ???????

Will that be on a different "real channel" frequency? In Cary I get WUNC-DT fairly well off the back of my CM4228 pointed at Garner. I won't get two interfering signals will I?

No, they want to put a channel 30 translator in Garner, while the main signal will be on channel 25.

Both will map to 4-1 though. You'll just pick whichever is stronger and delete the other from your lineup.

- Trip

No, they want to put a channel 30 translator in Garner, while the main signal will be on channel 25.

Both will map to 4-1 though. You'll just pick whichever is stronger and delete the other from your lineup.

- Trip

Which "4.1" is which ?????:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

I haven't been able to receive WTVD ABC 11 since the transition. Apparently this is a problem all across the Triangle.

This is from the ABC 11 WTVD website:

ABC11 will be working with the Federal Communications Commission to increase our power so that we may reach every possible viewer.

The station is committed to reaching out to viewers and helping them through the DTV transition.

Message from ABC11 Chief Engineer Curtis Meredith:

On Friday at 12:30 p.m., WTVD ABC11 switched from channel 52 (UHF) to channel 11 (VHF) as assigned by the FCC.
This change also required us to substantially reduce our power level. Both of these factors have made it difficult for many viewers to receive a viewable signal.
This is especially a problem with indoor antennas. A UHF-only antenna probably won't work for channel 11 anymore. Since WTVD is the only station in this area assigned to a VHF channel, you may be able to receive all local stations but us.
I assume that you have already rescanned your TV or converter box.
If you have an all-channel indoor antenna, try to re-orient it or raise it to a higher level. If this doesn't work then you'll probably need an attic or outdoor antenna. The most important factor is that the antenna be designed for VHF channels as well as UHF channels.
All of us at ABC11 are very concerned about this loss of coverage and we are working to find a solution. At this time we're not sure what that solution will be or when it will happen but we are meeting with federal officials on Monday to work out an acceptable plan.

I hope that WTVD can get a power increase, even if I have got them back now. More power would make it easier.

Judging from the service contour maps on the FCC site, 312 kW ERP was expected to provide about the same coverage for WTVD on channel 11 (http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=TV574371.html) as 1000 kW ERP on channel 52 (http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=DT428490.html). On the surface, this seems a little like pie-in-the-sky expectations.

Judging from the service contour maps on the FCC site, 312 kW ERP was expected to provide about the same coverage for WTVD on channel 11 (http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=TV574371.html) as 1000 kW ERP on channel 52 (http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=DT428490.html). On the surface, this seems a little like pie-in-the-sky expectations.

312 was their analog power. Digital on 11 is 17.9 with a CP for 20.7. The FCC seems to be granting aggresive power increases for high (and low) band VHF's.

Not totally true. My Mom is picking up mt DTV 17, WLFL and WRDC equally well in Askewville in the center of Bertie County. That's almost 100 miles. I could not get a lock on WTVD, WRAL, or WRAZ though I was able to see some signal. In her area, she now gets more TV than ever before, and even stranger, is picking up us on the side of her antenna, and Norfolk on the back. It seems getting rid of those analogs helped bigtime downeast.

312 was their analog power. Digital on 11 is 17.9 with a CP for 20.7. The FCC seems to be granting aggresive power increases for high (and low) band VHF's.

Based on their FCC filing on Friday, I think WTVD is actually already at 20.7 kW, skipping right over the 17.9 kW permit they originally had.

Not sure, though.

- Trip

In north Cary, with my Dish 622DVR OTA tuner and with my attic(inside) CM 4228 (pointed at the Garner antenna farm)

I do get (most with 95+_ signal)
4-0 what the heck is this? I thought analog was off?
5-x
11-x
17-x
40-x
47-x
50-x

My scan picks up but cannot get a good enough signal to view
4-1, 4-3, 4-5
20-x
30-x

can't remember but think I also don't get 22, 28 (will double check tonite)

No, they want to put a channel 30 translator in Garner, while the main signal will be on channel 25.


It won't be a panacea though, especially for those of us in Cary. The maps that somebody (Trip?) linked to a few weeks ago showed that the strength of the translator will be very weak. Eg, its not even supposed to reach me here in Cary.

Oddly, aside from the one program on Saturday where my tuner could not get any lock at all, WUNC reception seems to be almost as good for me as it was pre-transition from the point of view of "glitches" (but the strength is much lower). The WUNC transmitter is directly across the RDU flight path from me (I'm about 5 miles from RDU), and I usually attribute any glitches I get to poor multipath rejection.

Drew

Based on their FCC filing on Friday, I think WTVD is actually already at 20.7 kW, skipping right over the 17.9 kW permit they originally had.

Not sure, though.

- Trip

Just looked at WTVD applications, and they have submitted something today having to do with an automatic testing authority, and have the 20.7 down.

I was thinking part of the problem might be the way it is sandwiched between WNCT and WCTI, but even to the west, it is not easy to get from what I have gathered.

You'll just have to wait and see what WUNC-DT 25 looks like at 1000 kW when that eventually happens. Just being at a lower frequency will help it get around terrain and buildings better than the channel 59 signal did.

Realize that the "duplication" power for the 893.2 kW channel 59 signal was only 404 kW on channel 25. That's how much of a difference it makes.

I know it's hard to wait, but I do think that the situation will be greatly improved on channel 25 when all is said and done, which may be a few months off.

- Trip

Just looked at WTVD applications, and they have submitted something today having to do with an automatic testing authority, and have the 20.7 down.

Remember that if it's dated today, it was filed Friday. ;) Updates from the previous day come in at midnight the morning after.

I was thinking part of the problem might be the way it is sandwiched between WNCT and WCTI, but even to the west, it is not easy to get from what I have gathered.

Yeah, I'm thinking this is a power issue. If you ask me, VHF stations should be allowed to operate at whatever 1/5 their analog power was. So for WTVD, they should be allowed 62.4 kW on channel 11, regardless of any interference that might be created. Then at least it would have a chance.

Otherwise, I think the VHF band should be thinned out, with some of those stations moving up to UHF. (I know a number of them want to do so anyway.)

- Trip

You'll just have to wait and see what WUNC-DT 25 looks like at 1000 kW when that eventually happens. Just being at a lower frequency will help it get around terrain and buildings better than the channel 59 signal did.

Realize that the "duplication" power for the 893.2 kW channel 59 signal was only 404 kW on channel 25. That's how much of a difference it makes.


I didn't realize any of that. So, the lower a UHF signal is, then the better it can get around things like terrain? How do things like airplanes affect high vs low UHF?

But I'm not complaining (yet). Aside from one episode Sat. afternoon which I'm convinced was a problem at WUNC, I'm actually getting WUNC just as well now as I ever did. The strength is lower, but the rate of glitches are about the same. I'm just wondering how it will do in a thunderstorm..

Drew

Dumb question, on TWC QAM I receive 4 UNC-TV channels: UNC-TV, UNC-kids, UNC-NC, and UNC-EDU. OTA I do not see the UNC-EDU channel...is that expected?

-NitDawg-

Yes

Dumb question, on TWC QAM I receive 4 UNC-TV channels: UNC-TV, UNC-kids, UNC-NC, and UNC-EDU. OTA I do not see the UNC-EDU channel...is that expected?

-NitDawg-

Yes, this is expected. UNC-ED is no longer available over the air.

- Trip

I didn't realize any of that. So, the lower a UHF signal is, then the better it can get around things like terrain? How do things like airplanes affect high vs low UHF?

Yes, lower UHF signals do better than higher UHF signals. I have first-hand experience with this in analog. Before the digital signals started signing on, with my roof antenna aimed at Raleigh, I could see 4/5/11/17/22 all the time, but nothing above that without tropospheric enhancement.

I think airplanes have similar effects, though I really have no experience with airports. I'm sorry I don't have a better answer to this.

- Trip

Yes, lower UHF signals do better than higher UHF signals

Ugh, then I guess it is unfortunate that WRAL and WRAZ are at 48/49 now. Before the cutover, Fox was my only real problem channel. Fox would cut out horribly on my oldest tuner (nxt2002 based Air2PC) during bad (windy, rainy) weather. I really need to get around to rotating my best tuner (xc5000 based) into my server, and that old nxt2002 based tuner out..

Drew

Yeah, I'm thinking this is a power issue. If you ask me, VHF stations should be allowed to operate at whatever 1/5 their analog power was. So for WTVD, they should be allowed 62.4 kW on channel 11, regardless of any interference that might be created. Then at least it would have a chance.

Otherwise, I think the VHF band should be thinned out, with some of those stations moving up to UHF. (I know a number of them want to do so anyway.)

- Trip

100% agreed with Trip on this!

I think the interference concerns should be second to getting the signal out to the edges of the area to be covered. I think would work a lot like FM radio, where you either get one station or another the frequency, not two on the same channel. I could be wrong, and it could horrible things at the edges of the DMAs too, but it maybe better then what is what happening now...

Ugh, then I guess it is unfortunate that WRAL and WRAZ are at 48/49 now. Before the cutover, Fox was my only real problem channel. Fox would cut out horribly on my oldest tuner (nxt2002 based Air2PC) during bad (windy, rainy) weather. I really need to get around to rotating my best tuner (xc5000 based) into my server, and that old nxt2002 based tuner out..

Drew

Well, the one good thing about those high channel numbers is that my favorite UHF antenna, the Antenna's Direct 91XG has massive gain at channels 48/49... Figuring out where your antennas peak gain, maybe of help in understanding why some channels are better then others. (of course, RF at frequencies, travels differently, but most antennas do not have equal gain from UHF 14-51)

Well, the one good thing about those high channel numbers is that my favorite UHF antenna, the Antenna's Direct 91XG has massive gain at channels 48/49... Figuring out where your antennas peak gain, maybe of help in understanding why some channels are better then others. (of course, RF at frequencies, travels differently, but most antennas do not have equal gain from UHF 14-51)

I almost wonder if the problem is the old tuner's poor multipath rejection in combination with my antenna's (CM4228) excellent gain for UHF 49. Eg, things are bouncing of the clouds, and getting picked up really strongly. I never had as many problems picking up WRAL on their temporary channel 53. At any rate, I'll wait until a thunderstorm and see what things look like now :)

Drew

Channels in the 40's aren't that hard to receive in my experience. Mid 50's to low 60's were the tough ones, and nothing is being broadcast over 51. I get a channel 51 outside of the signal contour with no issue with a 8 bay Winegard, and also did with a U-75R Radio Shack.

FOX 50 (49) is one of the hardest for me to get too for some reason... 48 comes in long before 49.

Is anybody able to get WRPX? They haven't shown up in any of my scans, and tuning directly to 15 doesn't show anything for them..

Drew

They're my best channel...
owing to they're only about 10 miles from me, compared to the Auburn antenna Farm (22 miles) / Roanoke Rapids (39 miles).

With the economy the way it is, I'm looking for ways to lower my budget and my mom suggested switching from satellite TV to broadcast, now that there are more channels. I live in the country about 60 miles north of Raleigh/Durham, about 70 miles south of Richmond/Petersburgh.

Can anyone tell me what kind of channels we might be able to pull in with a good antenna and amplifier? I've got three teens spoiled to death with all their kid's channels. How much of a culture shock would this be for them?

What antenna/amplifier would be recommended?

Thanks much.

Start with www.tvfool.com - that will give you an idea of what you might expect.

They're my best channel...
owing to they're only about 10 miles from me, compared to the Auburn antenna Farm (22 miles) / Roanoke Rapids (39 miles).

They're 40 miles from me, and about 60 degrees off where I have my CM4228 aimed. I could never get them solidly before the transition, but now I cannot even pick up any hint of them in channel scans, etc. I remember seeing them in scans quite a while ago. What was their pre-transition frequency?

Drew

They're 40 miles from me, and about 60 degrees off where I have my CM4228 aimed. I could never get them solidly before the transition, but now I cannot even pick up any hint of them in channel scans, etc. I remember seeing them in scans quite a while ago. What was their pre-transition frequency?


On Saturday I could still get them from up the street in the same neighborhood, using either of my antennas. They have had digital on 15 all along, as far as I can tell.

My coordinates are 35.843397, -78.904227. For the past year I've been using an indoor combo VHF/UHF antenna (Radioshack 15-1892) to pick up the local digital stations. Before the transition I was picking up the following channels at the following signal strengths:

4-1 WUNC 85-95%
11-1 WTVD 85-95%
22-1 WLFL 80-90%
28-1 WRDC 75-85%
50-1 WRAZ 70-80%
5-1 WRAL 65-75%
17-1 WNCN 55-65%

WUNC, WTVD, WLFL, WRDC, and WRAZ came in great with very little to no break ups. WRAL had a few breakups here and there but was fine. WNCN ranged between a few break ups to considerable break up depending on the day. I was hoping the transition switch over would boost WNCN and I'd be set. Instead, this is what I pick up now:

4-1 WUNC 85-95%
11-1 WTVD 0%
22-1 WLFL 75-85%
28-1 WRDC 80-90%
50-1 WRAZ 70-80%
5-1 WRAL 50-60%
17-1 WNCN 20-30%

Most channels actually lost signal strength. WNCN is now completely unwatchable. WRAL suffers from break ups constantly, and WTVD is completely gone! Reading through this thread I see that WNCN is still doing some work, so I'll have to wait and see what happens when they're completely done. Sounds like WRAL is finished with their change over, so I guess I'm screwed there, but at least there aren't really any CBS shows that I watch regularly. Losing WTVD sucks though. I watch a lot of shows on ABC. I've tried everything to pick it up with no success. I hope they're able to do something to boost their signal.

My coordinates are 35.843397, -78.904227. For the past year I've been using an indoor combo VHF/UHF antenna (Radioshack 15-1892) to pick up the local digital stations. Before the transition I was picking up the following channels at the following signal strengths:

4-1 WUNC 85-95%
11-1 WTVD 85-95%
22-1 WLFL 80-90%
28-1 WRDC 75-85%
50-1 WRAZ 70-80%
5-1 WRAL 65-75%
17-1 WNCN 55-65%

WUNC, WTVD, WLFL, WRDC, and WRAZ came in great with very little to no break ups. WRAL had a few breakups here and there but was fine. WNCN ranged between a few break ups to considerable break up depending on the day. I was hoping the transition switch over would boost WNCN and I'd be set. Instead, this is what I pick up now:

4-1 WUNC 85-95%
11-1 WTVD 0%
22-1 WLFL 75-85%
28-1 WRDC 80-90%
50-1 WRAZ 70-80%
5-1 WRAL 50-60%
17-1 WNCN 20-30%

Most channels actually lost signal strength. WNCN is now completely unwatchable. WRAL suffers from break ups constantly, and WTVD is completely gone! Reading through this thread I see that WNCN is still doing some work, so I'll have to wait and see what happens when they're completely done. Sounds like WRAL is finished with their change over, so I guess I'm screwed there, but at least there aren't really any CBS shows that I watch regularly. Losing WTVD sucks though. I watch a lot of shows on ABC. I've tried everything to pick it up with no success. I hope they're able to do something to boost their signal.

Not bad for receiving Raleigh market stations all the way in Rochester MN. :D

You arent much further from the antenna farm than I am. Ive got an extra CM 4038 (http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?PROD=ANCM4308 ) if you want to play with an attic antenna. Those number changes dont seem out of line. WRAL is down on power. WTVD moved to VHF high (I dont have good lock on them even with attic antenna).

WNCN is at the maximum power allowed by the FCC on our permanent channel now. We will not change anything.
Take a look at the signal strength for each of the stations listed below in your signal meter menu. Write each one down, then tweak your antenna for maximum signal from any of those with the "*" beside them. We are all on the same tower, or very near each other. Once you find the peak signal, re-scan to see if it brings things back in line. This will also help to identify if your antenna is having problems at the low or high end of the channels. It's common on the higher channels, and rare on the lower channels, but a comparison of our level to WTVD versus WLFL will tell you if you have something killing the lower channels. Finding that "something" can be a bit difficult, but trees, hills, buildings, splitters, amps and everything around you will cause issues. Experiment moving the antenna watching the signal meter, and things should lock in.

WTVD 11 VHF *

WRPX 15 UHF located near Louisburg

WNCN 17 UHF *

WUNC 25 UHF located in Chapel Hill, applied for low power 30 in Raleigh, pending

WLFL 27 UHF *

WRDC 28 UHF *

WUVC 38 UHF located in Fayetteville

WRAY 42 UHF located near Wilson

WRAL 48 UHF *

WRAZ 49 UHF *

NBC17ENG:

WUNC is on 25.

- Trip

NBC17ENG:

WUNC is on 25.

- Trip

You are correct as usual. They have applied for LP 30 here in Raleigh.

I think I'm ready to feed OTA to my HTPC and see how things go. I haven't minded the $13/month fee for basic (now broadcast) cable for my HDTV. There's nothing else I watch that comes with 'broadcast' cable package, it was just ease-of-mind knowing that when my wife turns on the TV she has a picture and not telling me to get in the attic. All looks pretty good with OTA for me here in Morrisville, so here we go.

Does anyone know if Microsoft updated the database for Media Center yet?

I have been off line for a few days... I have often wondered about the F1 broadcast on SPEEDHD. It looks better than the broadcast on SD SPEED, at least to me. But, SPEED is not in control of the feed. Its my understanding that there is one F1 approved international feed. I wonder what happens to the broadcast quality as the series moves from country to country. I missed the replay on SPEEDHD. Notice any difference?

i have the same understanding ... F1 produces the one and only feed, and then sells it to the broadcasters. like i said, i don't think that feed is HD. i have vague recollection its better than NTSC resolution, but not HD. maybe its PAL resolution ... isn't that like 540 lines of vertical rez instead of 480 for NTSC?

unfortunately, i did not catch the replay on SPEEDHD, so i don't know if it was better. the same test would apply to this week's british grand prix though. hopefully FOX figured out what was wrong and their broadcast is better quality this week.

Probably worth a mention, since I sense a little confusion...

When someone talks about low-vs-high UHF (or any frequency really) signals... they are talking about lower frequency vs higher frequency... not the elevation. I'm not 100% everyone was getting that.

Meanwhile...

I've got a funny indoor antenna situation.

On my bedroom TV I'm using a UHF "1/4 wave" type antenna that was actually intended for a Dish receiver UHF remote. With that, I am solidly getting 5, 11, 17, 22, 28, 50. I also get 30 and 47 at around 70 or so on my Dish receiver-o-meter and very watchable. Not worried about channel 40, and I've given up trying to get 4 until they figure things out.

The same 1/4-wave antenna on my HDTV in the living room gets me all of the above except channel 47. Funny how a slight difference in height and a few feet location do that.

My Dish receiver in the living room I actually have a better/higher indoor antenna setup... but since the transition I have lost 47 and 4 (as already discussed). I'll do more tweaking when 4 gets done (higher power on 25 or approval for 30, whichever comes first).

I'm fairly happy overall, except I do miss channel 4.

WNCN is at the maximum power allowed by the FCC on our permanent channel now. We will not change anything.Thanks for the clarity on this point. I have been wading through a virtual sea of conflicting information from numerous sources (including WNCN's own DTV hotline) since the Friday transition.

It actually makes sense, especially since some boxes have no issue and some do:

Regarding reception & signal problems with high VHF channels, the FCC is trying to determine if there is a pattern nationwide. They have identified one potential solution that has been successful in solving the majority of problems for some stations -- a “double rescan” the converter boxes. Here are the steps:
Detach antenna
Rescan converter box (to clear memory)
Detach converter box power cord for 1 minute (to ensure that memory is clear)
Reattach both power cord and antenna
Rescan again
FCC is considering issuing an advisory on this “double rescan” solution, but is trying to determine how to communicate this succinctly without creating more confusion(!).

Seems like someone at ABC-11 missed the clue train, thinking that switching back to a VHF frequency was a good idea. I've now lost them with my indoor UHF antenna, and have no reason to buy another antenna to pick up one station.

I'm in downtown Raleigh, and would be thrilled for UNC-TV to get on a UHF frequency the towers near Garner. Unless WTVD does something like that, they will loose a lot of OTA viewers who have an UHF only antenna for digital reception.

Just to throw more numbers into the mix, here are the signal strengths I observed for my channels last night. I'm in Apex and use a CM4228, a PCT 1x4 amplified splitter, and a DTVPal DVR. The antenna is as high as I can get it in my attic and pointed towards the WRPX tower since that is my weakest signal.

Low High
2 - WFMY 74 76
4 - WUNC 83 85
5 - WRAL 88 90
11 - WTVD 96 100
17 - WNCN 93 95
20 - WCWG 83 85
22 - WLFL 96 100
28 - WRDC 93 96
40 - WUVC 76 78
47 - WRPX 58 63 Some break up
50 - WRAZ 90 93

Besides WRPX still sucking, all the other channels are solid.

One of my viewers, Harriet, reminded me of another thing to check tonight. Make sure your TV or CECB is set AIR and NOT for Cable in the menus. She was only getting channels 40-50 in the cable mode. Check your menus, and you may get WTVD and us back!

There is a story on the Fayetteville Observer web site about the WTVD problem. To my knowledge this is the first coverage I've seen. Strange that nobody in the Triangle is covering this story. I'd share the link but I haven't posted enough to do that. It's under "Columns" on the fayobserver dot com website.

The ABC station in Durham has lost coverage area. Instead of using UHF, corporate engineers with the ABC-owned station group decided in 2004 to broadcast its digital signals on the VHF television band. Thus, WTVD, Channel 11, is now broadcasting on VHF Channel 11.

On Friday afternoon, the station switched its digital broadcast feed from Channel 52 (UHF) to Channel 11 (VHF), as assigned by the Federal Communications Commission.

Thing is, this conversion to the lower VHF band required the station to substantially cut power.

"We did have some concern about the power allocated by the FCC," said Rob Elmore, news director.

As of Monday afternoon, the station had fielded about 400 calls from viewers who can no longer pick it up, he said.

He said it was important for the station to remain on Channel 11, where WTVD has broadcast since 1954. "The thing that wasn't within our control here," he said, "was the FCC mandated a certain level of power. We like our viewers to know we're operating at the full power granted by the FCC. There's nothing wrong with the signal (that) we're putting out."

He said it was important for the station to remain on Channel 11, where WTVD has broadcast since 1954. "The thing that wasn't within our control here," he said, "was the FCC mandated a certain level of power. We like our viewers to know we're operating at the full power granted by the FCC. There's nothing wrong with the signal (that) we're putting out."

There's nothing wrong with the signal, except that it's on friggin channel 11. This is what happens when you let marketing boneheads make technical decisions. Guess what WTVD, WRAL is still "on" channel 5, and their customers can still receive the signal OTA. :rolleyes:

There's nothing wrong with the signal, except that it's on friggin channel 11. This is what happens when you let marketing boneheads make technical decisions. Guess what WTVD, WRAL is still "on" channel 5, and their customers can still receive the signal OTA. :rolleyes:

Any insight why they decided on 48, where other channels got lower frequencies, which, according to Trip, do better at getting around landscape features, etc? How much input did the stations have on which UHF frequency they got? Was this just a matter of keeping the WRAL and WRAZ frequencies next to each other, so it would be easy to share transmitter spare parts, etc?

Drew

There's nothing wrong with the signal, except that it's on friggin channel 11. This is what happens when you let marketing boneheads make technical decisions. Guess what WTVD, WRAL is still "on" channel 5, and their customers can still receive the signal OTA. :rolleyes:

Yeah, it would have been more accurate if he said there was nothing "technically" wrong with their signal. However, there is something "fundamentally" wrong with their signal. I have a hard time believing the suits at WTVD are satisfied with the decrease in viewers. Do they really think every OTA viewer in the Triangle is going to have an outdoor antenna installed for one channel?

There's nothing wrong with the signal, except that it's on friggin channel 11. This is what happens when you let marketing boneheads make technical decisions. :rolleyes:

Exactly... and to add insult to injury, there are no reasonable attic installable UHF/VHF antennas with decent performance in the VHF band. Channel Master discontinued the original 4228 which was the only 'decent' one around. The new 4228HD has half the VHF gain as the original per the numbers I have seen. My 4221HD is worthless for channel 11.

Exactly... and to add insult to injury, there are no reasonable attic installable UHF/VHF antennas with decent performance in the VHF band. Channel Master discontinued the original 4228 which was the only 'decent' one around. The new 4228HD has half the VHF gain as the original per the numbers I have seen. My 4221HD is worthless for channel 11.

Ya, that is what I have heard about the 4228HD... Really, just adding a VHF-HI yagi is the way to go for VHF-HI. The Winegard YA-1713 is a lite weight and great antenna... Install a couple of feet from the 4221 and call it good! I like the two antenna solution, in case the VHF stations are in a different direction then the UHF, allows for more fine tuning!

I was hopeful that my CM4221 would do it for channel 11 (it pulled in the analog "reasonably" well), but no-go. At least I do have a CM VHF antenna still up on the mast. And all I needed to do for distribution is remove a 6dB attenuator.

Any insight why they decided on 48, where other channels got lower frequencies, which, according to Trip, do better at getting around landscape features, etc? How much input did the stations have on which UHF frequency they got? Was this just a matter of keeping the WRAL and WRAZ frequencies next to each other, so it would be easy to share transmitter spare parts, etc?

Drew

I think it was more of a matter "what channel is available in our area" that the FCC would let them have. Secondary was your other possibilities.

From what I've read in the Greenville NC thread - being on 48 is not that big of a handicap - there's a guy in Jacksonville that can receive WRAL (and they are only at half power right now !) since the change to the omnidirectional antenna at 2000 feet on friday.

Sorry to interrupt the flow of OTA/CABLE discussion but I have a quick request of this community if anyone has knowledge of this type.

I am looking for a low-cost option to get OTA signaals to distribute to multiple TV's. We have about 20+ TV's at work that I would like to drop a signal to via a roof mounted antenna.

The issues I foresee are:
* Finding an insured and reputable outfit to mount the antenna onto a business building. This likely poses different challenges and legal requirements than mounting onto a home.
*Find a means to amplify the signal sufficient to distribute between the various TV's and also grow as we add in additional TV's.

We maintain the network, conduit and TV's and can therefore run the cable and manage the hook-ups to the TV's I just need some input on signal distribution and antenna help.

SOOO - Can someone point out a good website or few?

NOTE - This not being a personal item or even an item of general interest to the group I would prefer to be sent responses via private messages.

Thanks and now back to our normally scheduled 'fun'. :)

Bill

Ya, that is what I have heard about the 4228HD... Really, just adding a VHF-HI yagi is the way to go for VHF-HI. The Winegard YA-1713 is a lite weight and great antenna... Install a couple of feet from the 4221 and call it good! I like the two antenna solution, in case the VHF stations are in a different direction then the UHF, allows for more fine tuning!

I haven't checked my signal strength yet (Morrisville) but I haven't had any issues with ABC 11 with my attic mounted 4228HD. I even got up in the flood storm this morning to check out reception. I need to hook up my PC tuner to see what signal strength I'm pulling in, but so far so good. They do advertise this antenna for High VHF: From http://www.channelmaster.com/product-overview.php?proID=34&catID=33

Reception Range: Channels 7 thru 13 up to 45 miles and HD, and channels 14 thru 69 up to 60 miles and HD

But I agree...looks like the wrong people (ad execs maybe?) made the decision on staying on VHF.

Exactly... and to add insult to injury, there are no reasonable attic installable UHF/VHF antennas with decent performance in the VHF band. Channel Master discontinued the original 4228 which was the only 'decent' one around. The new 4228HD has half the VHF gain as the original per the numbers I have seen. My 4221HD is worthless for channel 11.

Fortunately for me I have one of those old 4228's on my roof. At my place WTVD went from 95% to about 70% signal strength, but I'm still getting it.