Raleigh, NC - HDTV [Text View] - Page 51

tarheelone

12-18-09, 12:45 PM

Here we go again:

Triangle cable-TV viewers could start a new year without channels such as FX, Fuel, Speed TV and Fox Soccer.

Media giants News Corp. and Time Warner Cable are fighting over money, and the dispute could lead to some Fox channels going dark on Jan. 1. The two companies are still in negotiations and their current contract expires Dec. 31.

News Corp. today began warning Time Warner Cable customers about the "very likely possibility" that they will lose access to Fox programming.

In some markets where News Corp. owns the local Fox stations, the dispute could affect Fox's flagship channel, home to popular shows such as "Glee," "House" and "American Idol."

But the Triangle's Fox 50 affiliate is owned by Raleigh-based Capitol Broadcasting and is not part of the dispute, said Time Warner Cable spokeswoman Melissa Buscher.

The bickering could lead to local cable customers losing other channels owned by News Corp., including FX, home to shows such as "Nip/Tuck" and "It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia." Other channels include Fuel, Speed TV, Fox Reality and Fox Sports World Espanol.

"We're hoping Fox will allow us to carry the programming even if negotiations continue past Dec. 31," Buscher said. "It's our hope that Fox won't punish our customers while they try to reach an agreement."

Scott Grogin, a spokesman with Fox Networks Group, confirmed that Fox 50 and Capitol Broadcasting aren't part of the transmission dispute, but declined further comment on whether other Fox channels could go dark.

Time Warner Cable will look for replacement programming for the channels if they are pulled, Buscher said. And the company will "educate" viewers about other ways to see shows, such as online streaming.

The cable provider serves more than 800,000 customers in the market that stretches from Raleigh to the coast.

The company, one of the country's largest cable-TV providers, recently started its own marketing campaign where it asked customers to vote whether it should "roll over or get tough" with broadcasters and programmers that are demanding more money. Those higher fees would result in costs passed on to customers, Time Warner argues.

News Corp. contends in a prepared statement it is "simply asking for fair compensation for the impressive value our Fox programming offers."

Earlier this month, Time Warner Cable announced that it reached a one-year extension of its transmission deal with Sinclair Broadcast Group. In the Triangle, that meant that cable-TV customers won't lose access to the CW and MyNetwork Television, two stations owned by Sinclair.

Last year, Time Warner Cable had a public spat with Viacom that nearly resulted in local customers losing access to channels such as MTV and Nickelodeon on Jan. 1. That deal was resolved at the last minute.

drewwho

12-18-09, 12:50 PM

Triangle cable-TV viewers could start a new year without channels such as FX, Fuel, Speed TV and Fox Soccer.

What about Fox News? If I knew my money wasn't going to NewsCorp to support Faux News, I might actually be *more* likely to subscribe to cable ;)

Drew

jspENC

12-18-09, 12:56 PM

Cable needs to be brought to their knees. Period. I hope News Corp takes then to the cleaners, like they take their customers. HaHaHa! or more like - Fa la la la LAAAAAAA la la la la! :D

vidiot1985

12-18-09, 01:32 PM

...The company, one of the country's largest cable-TV providers, recently started its own marketing campaign where it asked customers to vote whether it should "roll over or get tough" with broadcasters and programmers that are demanding more money. ...

Hm...are there broadcast stations that are actually demanding money for that content? Or are they still using "must carry" and giving the local channels to TWC for free?

I suppose TWC could be lumping together as "broadcasters" everyone who owns OTA channels as well as cable/sat-only channels.

kirkusinnc

12-18-09, 08:30 PM

WRAZ is having all kinds of problems during Dollhouse. Pixelation, black screen, loss of audio... Problem is occurring off-air, on TWC cable, and DirecTV. Happening on both the SD and HD signals...

Splat!

12-18-09, 09:10 PM

WRAZ is having all kinds of problems during Dollhouse. Pixelation, black screen, loss of audio... Problem is occurring off-air, on TWC cable, and DirecTV. Happening on both the SD and HD signals...

The TWC ESPNHD/ESPN2HD feed is pretty comical at well, and has now gone to black. Funny, I remember all those commercials about how TWC wouldn't lose signal when the weather is bad. (Yes, I know, it's likely their upstream feed.)

HDMe2

12-18-09, 10:57 PM

Hmmm... I DVRed Dollhouse because I didn't get home until 8:30. I've been watching ESPNHD on Dish and had no problems all night. I'll have to post back when I've watched Dollhouse if I have any issues.

FYI, I DVRed from the OTA feed and not the Dish SAT feed, so if it was an OTA issue I should see what the others saw with WRAZ. I sure hope not though!

pkscout

12-19-09, 08:13 AM

drewwho

12-19-09, 12:58 PM

What's the final verdict on how much of the two Dollhouse episodes where garbled? I haven't watched them yet, and if one or both of them is messed up, I'll probably just download them from Amazon on Demand to my TiVo.

At least the middle chunk of the first hour is gone (DVR'd both OTA and from TWC, same corruption in both). It was either a WRAZ downlink or a Fox uplink problem. Hulu to the rescue for me. I haven't tried the second hour yet.

And aside from the corruption, was anybody else irritated at how they did the closings crawl just after 8PM? First they shrink to SD with bars all around, then they stick an aspect-ratio distorting HD crawl over the top of that.

Drew

HDMe2

12-19-09, 03:00 PM

Aside from a couple of times of weird shrinkage for the closings crawl... There was probably close to 30 minutes of the first episode virtually gone. Really bad breakup for several chunks followed by some long black or "we know we are screwed up" slates...

The 2nd hour was mostly intact, but a minute or 2 of the pre-title-sequence segment was not there.

Looked to me like WRAZ was broadcasting fine the whole time BUT was having a problem with their FOX uplink... In several cases where the overall picture was breaking up, I observed a solid FOX50 logo on the screen which seemed to indicate it was a reception-of-FOX-transmission issue rather than a WRAZ broadcast issue.

I could be wrong about that guess... but ultimately it resulted in a confusing 1st episode where you wonder what happened after about 8:30!

dgmayor

12-19-09, 03:39 PM

For those that didn't get to see all of the first hour due to the break ups, here it is on Hulu.

http://www.hulu.com/watch/114775/dollhouse-stop-loss

zim2dive

12-19-09, 04:10 PM

jbwhite99

12-19-09, 04:49 PM

UPDATE: Finally got through and talked to a real person - and I now have a new Samsung cable box. One comment that the installer gave me is that the structured wiring was giving a lot of noise - he said that these boxes (I have USTec, installed by CPI only 2.5 years ago) go every once in a while, so make sure that your box is accessible. We bypassed it for the TV that has digital cable.

Thanks,
Brandon (and I have really enjoyed reading this forum - there are some seriously hardcore people in here that really know what they are talking about!)

dgmayor

12-19-09, 09:05 PM

You didn't miss much.. this shark has jumped (IMO) :(

Totally off subject of the thread, but I have to disagree. The show has gotten really good imo. It's just a shame it's already been canceled. At least they got warning and will be ending the storyline in the finale.

dookie1

12-26-09, 11:44 AM

One comment that the installer gave me is that the structured wiring was giving a lot of noise - he said that these boxes (I have USTec, installed by CPI only 2.5 years ago) go every once in a while, so make sure that your box is accessible. We bypassed it for the TV that has digital cable.

i am assuming you are referring to a distribution amplifier here? have seen the same issues with my leviton 2x8 distro amp...1st gen was not compatible with bi-drectional, levition exchanged for free, 2nd gen has adjustable gain and too much would amplify noise to the point that the digital boxes couldn't cope. had to either bypass (1st band-aid solution), or fine tune gain to be enough for analog TVs but not too much for digital. found that sweet spot and now everything is back on the distro amp.

Scooper

12-31-09, 10:03 PM

Happy New year and may your 2010 be better than 2009

StinDaWg

01-03-10, 08:53 PM

For those of you that have used both Time Warner and OTA how does the picture quality compare? I'm considering either dropping cable and going to the basic plan, or just getting an indoor antenna and hoping I get all the local HD channels in clear. Does Time Warner compress their stations like I hear so many other providers doing, and if so can you see a noticeable difference? Anyone have bitrate comparisons between the two? If there is a huge difference I'll probably go OTA, but for ease of use and knowing I'll always have a signal I may just keep basic cable with Road Runner (don't know if they install filters in this area as I've heard that sometimes if you have Road Runner you can get the QAM channels for free because they don't block the signal).

scsiraid

01-04-10, 07:51 AM

drewwho

01-04-10, 03:39 PM

I just got an HDHomerun, hoping to replace some of my PCI tuners. However, it is having a heck of a time getting Fox50 reliably. It is fine at times, but other times it is terrible. It seems fine at night, and terrible during the day, but I'm not sure if there is a real pattern yet.

I have an attic mounted CM4228 pointed at the towers (I'm 17 miles away). I get 17 perfectly (ss=93, snq ranges from 92 to 98). I get WRAL fine (ss=91, snq ranges from 74 to 85, no drops). But WRAZ is terrible (ss=85, snq ranges from 0 to mid 70s, lots of dropouts). Given that WRAZ and WRAL are only one channel apart (49 and 48), I'm surprised by the differences.

Is there some sort of interference that is common to channel 49 UHF?

FWIW, my PCI tuners do much, much better than the HDHR and keep a clean lock on WRAZ when the HDHR gets tons of breakups. I'm very disappointed to have to be debugging my antenna setup again.. Sigh..

Drew

Trip in VA

01-04-10, 04:00 PM

I've seen some tuners respond that way to severe multipath, which I've seen on my analyzer. I actually have the opposite problem here. Granted, my antenna is 90 degrees off from Raleigh, but when tropo is bringing it in, I can see WRAZ and not WRAL, and WRDC but not WLFL. (WLFL is the worst of the 4, WRAL usually comes in soon after WRAZ.) And when I look on the analyzer, it's obvious why, as the distortion causes a deep gouge in the middle of channel 27, a lesser gouge in 48, while 28 and 49 are simply tilted.

I think I'd need to provide pictures to make that paragraph make sense. Next time there's tropo I will try to do that.

I have some pictures from three Richmond stations which are coming from similar heights at the same tower site. You can see the huge differences even though they're on 22/25/26.

http://www.rabbitears.info/specan/dxpics/wric.gif
http://www.rabbitears.info/specan/dxpics/wtvr.gif
http://www.rabbitears.info/specan/dxpics/wrlh.gif

WRIC would decode if it was 10 dB higher. The others wouldn't. And when I was in New Jersey last week, most of the local signals looked pretty awful on the analyzer even if my DTT900 would decode them perfectly.

- Trip

drewwho

01-04-10, 04:20 PM

I've seen some tuners respond that way to severe multipath, which I've seen on my analyzer. I actually have the opposite problem here. Granted, my

That's what I'm afraid of. It is like I've stepped back in time with this tuner -- it is comparable to my 6 year old nxt2002 based PCI card :(

Any ideas on what sort of multipath would disappear between, say, 4pm and 8pm?

Drew

Trip in VA

01-04-10, 04:36 PM

Changes in atmospheric conditions can change the strength and form of the reflections, though I would not expect the changes to be huge.

- Trip

scsiraid

01-04-10, 05:58 PM

drewwho

01-05-10, 11:04 AM

A shot in the dark.... you may be getting an overload situation... perhaps add 3-6 db attenuation and see if the situation changes. You have a lot of antenna for only 17 miles.

The antenna goes to an amplified 4-way splitter. The amplification is adjustable. I tried reducing the amplification, and I didn't see any improvement in snq, just a drop in the signal strength.

Drew

drewwho

01-05-10, 11:18 AM

Changes in atmospheric conditions can change the strength and form of the reflections, though I would not expect the changes to be huge.

- Trip

I wrote a small script which connects to the HDHR every 16 minutes (off by one ) and gets the tuning stats. I started running about 22:30 last night. All is well until this morning, when the signal drops a little, and the snq drops like a rock:

08:07:00 tun: ch=8vsb:49 lock=8vsb ss=93 snq=91 seq=100 bps=19395584 ut=91 te=0 miss=0 crc=0
08:23:02 tun: ch=8vsb:49 lock=8vsb ss=93 snq=89 seq=100 bps=19394080 ut=90 te=0 miss=0 crc=0
08:39:05 tun: ch=8vsb:49 lock=8vsb ss=92 snq=86 seq=100 bps=19394080 ut=90 te=0 miss=0 crc=0
08:55:07 tun: ch=8vsb:49 lock=8vsb ss=92 snq=87 seq=100 bps=19394080 ut=92 te=0 miss=0 crc=0
09:11:09 tun: ch=8vsb:49 lock=8vsb ss=92 snq=87 seq=100 bps=19395584 ut=91 te=0 miss=0 crc=0
09:27:12 tun: ch=8vsb:49 lock=8vsb ss=90 snq=85 seq=100 bps=19394080 ut=91 te=0 miss=0 crc=0
09:43:14 tun: ch=8vsb:49 lock=8vsb ss=89 snq=79 seq=100 bps=19394080 ut=92 te=0 miss=0 crc=0
09:59:16 tun: ch=8vsb:49 lock=8vsb ss=87 snq=74 seq=100 bps=19395584 ut=90 te=0 miss=0 crc=0
10:15:19 tun: ch=8vsb:49 lock=8vsb ss=85 snq=71 seq=100 bps=19395584 ut=89 te=0 miss=0 crc=0
10:31:21 tun: ch=8vsb:49 lock=8vsb ss=81 snq=61 seq=100 bps=19395584 ut=90 te=5473 miss=11 crc=0
10:47:26 tun: ch=8vsb:49 lock=8vsb ss=83 snq=65 seq=100 bps=19394080 ut=90 te=49460 miss=165 crc=0
11:03:28 tun: ch=8vsb:49 lock=8vsb ss=85 snq=73 seq=100 bps=19394080 ut=91 te=7131 miss=17 crc=0

Based on previous days, I expect that it will start to improve around sunset, and by fine by evening.

According to tvfool, the towers are 122 from me, and that's where I (think I) have my antenna pointed. At this point in the winter, the sun ranges from about 120 to about 240 degrees. I'd think the sun would be more of a problem in the morning (when the towers are directly into the sun) than in the afternoon..

Drew

Trip in VA

01-05-10, 11:54 AM

Interesting. (I really need an HDHomeRun.) When you have the numbers for the evening, go ahead and post them. I'd be really curious to see them.

If it stays like this until sunset, I would guess it's atmospheric, though I could be wrong.

- Trip

drewwho

01-05-10, 07:38 PM

I couldn't resist moving the antenna around, and so I ruined the experiment. In its new position, just a few degrees off where it was before, WRAL is the "problem" channel, but the problem seems less severe. I seem to be trading off between WRAL and WRAZ, everything else seems fine...

Trip -- what tool are you using to visualize the signals? I really wish I could see something like that to tune my antenna position..

Drew

Trip in VA

01-05-10, 07:50 PM

jspENC

01-05-10, 08:22 PM

Sounds to me like bleeding in of the 48/49 together. The attic is not helping, if you can, yhou might want to get the ant. out of there.

Scooper

01-05-10, 08:45 PM

Sounds to me like bleeding in of the 48/49 together. The attic is not helping, if you can, yhou might want to get the ant. out of there.

Amen - I have a CM4221 4 bay with a Winegard 19dB preamp, and a VHF only Channel master (no amps here), outside on a chimney mount, and I have no problems pulling in anything in Garner, some small issues with WUNC/ WUNP (I'm about halfway between them as the crow flies). Outside in freespace is nearly always the best choice for antenna location.

jspENC

01-05-10, 08:56 PM

One thing that people are finding, (or TV stations from what I hear) is that with Digital, the people farther out get better reception than those closer in. Stations that used to be snowy at 60 miles are now rock solid with DTV. The VHF ones especially.

alex7577

01-06-10, 02:58 PM

jimholcomb

01-06-10, 07:08 PM

this really isn't HDTV specific, but anyone else noticing a HUGE Road runner slow down during the 4pm to 12am times. My 15 MB connection will go down to 1-2 MB, during the evening hours and it's really affecting my Netflix Roku box.

There are TONS of users complaining about the same issue all over the country in the dslreports.com forums.

My guess is its node congestion, but getting TWC to fix that is damn near impossible.

Interestingly, a friend at work was telling me late this afternoon that his speed was suddenly dropping to 2Mbps, it turned out to be Mozy (online backups) was trying to transfer a 50GB file.

Jim

VisionOn

01-06-10, 07:43 PM

this really isn't HDTV specific, but anyone else noticing a HUGE Road runner slow down during the 4pm to 12am times. My 15 MB connection will go down to 1-2 MB, during the evening hours and it's really affecting my Netflix Roku box.

My speed is up and down all the time and has been for the past few weeks. Rebooting the modem usually gives back some speed.

How are you getting 15Mb in this area? RR tiers top out at 10Mbps.

vidiot1985

01-07-10, 08:51 AM

...
My guess is its node congestion, but getting TWC to fix that is damn near impossible.

Yep--I guess the series of tubes are getting filled up by people watching netflix, hulu, etc. when they come home from school or work until they go to bed.

drewwho

01-07-10, 09:58 AM

I have a spectrum analyzer. Specifically, a Sencore SLM1456CM. It's such a useful tool for this sort of thing.

If it wasn't so far for me, I'd offer to visit with it. I bet it would explain a lot to actually see what's going on with the signals.

- Trip

I appreciate that.. It is too bad you're so far away. I found a new position a few feet away where I get a much better signal, and have about 24 hours of good scan data for most channels. The only remaining glitches I seem to have are on WTVD (VHF 11) where the HDHR tools will show a strong signal strength and signal quality, but I'll very regularly (like every minute or two) have a very small number of uncorrectable errors. The command line looks something like this after 1 minute on WTVD:

tun: ch=8vsb:11 lock=8vsb ss=94 snq=91 seq=100 dbg=11594-12113-1414
dev: resync=0 overflow=0
ts: bps=19394080 ut=96 te=131 miss=3 crc=0

Whereas a station where I expect problems (WUNC, 25, off the back of the antenna) will have more severe dropouts which are totally irregular. After a minute of tuning with a dropout, the HDHR counters look like this:

tun: ch=8vsb:25 lock=8vsb ss=93 snq=84 seq=100 dbg=12777-12114-1556
dev: resync=20464 overflow=0
ts: bps=19395584 ut=96 te=16524 miss=43 crc=0

If I watch the gui while tuned to 11, the snq is relatively stable and stays green the entire time, and the seq will flash to red occasionally (like once every minute or two). This is different than how WRAZ was behaving and how WUNC behaves In that case, the snq would visibly drop to red in conjunction with the seq dropping to red, and the te count would increment by thousands, rather than just a few. The weird thing is that the tuner errors on 11 happen very regularly.

This tuner is soo, soo picky. Almost enough to drive me back to QAM

Drew

PS: A bit more stats.. Over the last 24 hours, I've got about 165 samples from each station, where each sample represents 1 minute tuned to a particular station. Most stations have no tuning errors at all. Of the stations with errors, 11 had errors in 70 1 minute periods, but all errors were minor (like the example above). WUNC had errors in 20 1 minute periods, and most of them were severe (like the example above).

Trip in VA

01-07-10, 11:30 AM

WTVD is probably getting minor dropouts related to electrical interference, like light switches being flipped and things of that nature. Those sorts of things usually result in smaller number of errors than when signal distortion becomes too severe for a clean decode.

The big problem with making a trip like this is that I don't have a car and thus have to be able to justify it to my parents. I might be able to justify a trip to the Raleigh area if there was money involved, as my mother was prepared to let me travel more than an hour each way to visit someone with the analyzer while we were in New Jersey so long as money was involved.

Maybe if there were others in the area who wanted to see it, I could justify it too, but then I'd not be able to stay as long. And if my parents insisted on money being involved, then with multiple people, each could be responsible for less.

And my time grows limited. I go back to school on the 17th probably, and I'm busy on the 11th and 12th, plus maybe the 9th. Plus other days yet to be determined.

I dunno, just tossing ideas out there. I'd really like to help out if possible.

- Trip

alex7577

01-07-10, 01:10 PM

My speed is up and down all the time and has been for the past few weeks. Rebooting the modem usually gives back some speed.

How are you getting 15Mb in this area? RR tiers top out at 10Mbps.
Well, I guess I meant to say I have RR Turbo which will burst your up to 20MB, for about 1 and then throttle you back down to 10 MB.

drewwho

01-07-10, 03:16 PM

Lee L

01-07-10, 03:35 PM

Trip, after your post, I just checked your age in your profile and you are the most decent level headed "kid" I have run across on the net. Especially considering all your posts from years back when you were in your teens. :cool:

Trip in VA

01-07-10, 04:55 PM

Please don't worry about making a trip, Trip!

Are you kidding? I want to! I love excuses to use my spectrum analyzer; I'd sleep with it if I didn't think the power cord to charge it could strangle me. Haha. :)

I guess the big question I have is how do I isolate either the HDHR or the antenna, or both, from the electrical interference? It seems to be a factor no matter where I aim the antenna. Odd that it doesn't seem to bother my other tuners at all (Dvico Fusion HDTV5 Gold, Pinnicale 800i)..

Drew

I'm not sure there's much you can do. The Pinnacle in my computer shows lots of errors on the VHF signals (WBRA-3 and WSET-13) sporadically during the day, but in watching on other tuners, I never see them. I imagine there are ways of filtering, but I've never investigated. And now that WBRA's signal doesn't drop out so bad that the Zeniths lose audio, I have no incentive to do so for myself.

Trip, after your post, I just checked your age in your profile and you are the most decent level headed "kid" I have run across on the net. Especially considering all your posts from years back when you were in your teens. :cool:

Thank you! I appreciate your kind words. :) I do my very best. My website puts me in constant contact with lots of people inside the industry and those with interest in it, and so I try to share as much of the information as I am allowed to in order to help make everyone more knowledgeable.

I remember one of the guys in the Cleveland thread commenting on me one time.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14747264#post14747264

Unbelievable. A 19 year old who listens to his dad! You're wise way beyond your years, young man. Very rare to find someone like that.

Now there has got to be a "but" here. You wear your hair in a mohawk and you got your nipples and nose pierced? Your hair is purple? Your pubic hair is purple?

Please tell me what the defect is. Because if there isn't you may become somebody who does something good with their life.

:D

- Trip

rollcage

01-10-10, 11:40 AM

Just getting around to posting this ... did anyone else have issues watching the NHL Winter Classic last week? My 8300HD rebooted constantly during the game when tuned to the HD channel ... I've never experienced this before (or since). I was able to watch it in SD via the DVR without issue.
My HDTV can't decode any of the TWC 17.x channels, so I couldn't watch it in HD with the DVR bypassed. Is this common?

scsiraid

01-10-10, 12:51 PM

StinDaWg

01-10-10, 04:13 PM

I can't find CBS on QAM. It's not on channel 5.1. Any ideas?

scsiraid

01-10-10, 04:18 PM

I can't find CBS on QAM. It's not on channel 5.1. Any ideas?

Its on QAM channel 85 (591 Mhz) if that helps. Did you try a rescan?

StinDaWg

01-10-10, 04:55 PM

Yes, ch 85 is a blank screen. I'm hooking the cable up directly to my Panasonic tv. Got rid of the cable box for now. I also don't get PBS HD, just the 2 subchannels 4.3 and 4.5.

rollcage

01-11-10, 08:01 AM

Did you do a channel scan on your HDTV recently (when direct attached to cable of course)? TWC moved 17 to a different QAM which requires a new scan.

Aha ... that fixed that issue. Thanks for the tip! I'll pay closer attention to QAM scanning posts in the future. I typically just stick with the DVR, so haven't paid much attention to the antenna/QAM posts.

Now for my other issue ... Was anyone successfully able to watch the NHL Winter Classic in HD via DVR? I didn't call TWC because I didn't want them pushing me to a DVR that doesn't support external HDs. Even with their new "sorting by favorites" feature regression, the 8300HD is tops in my book (for DVRs from TWC) given they haven't broken external HDs ... yet.

Wilson-Flyer

01-11-10, 04:53 PM

Its on QAM channel 85 (591 Mhz) if that helps. Did you try a rescan?

Proving yet again that just about time TW finally gets it to some similance of correctness, they'll screw with it just to mess it up again. Un-freakin'-believable!

Every re-map gets back right except WRAL. I don't know who WRAL pi$$ed off at TW, but it must have been somebody pretty important a LONG time ago. :mad:

Wilson-Flyer

01-12-10, 05:45 AM

Looks like they finally fixed the re-maps on 5.x sometime last night.

drewwho

01-13-10, 02:05 PM

Hey Russ,

Will TWC be adding "extra" unencrypted HD QAM channels for winter olympics coverage, and dropping the encryption on some of the existing NBC HD cable channels for the duration of the games? Like they did in '08 for the summer Olympics?

Thanks,

Drew

texas_nightowl

01-14-10, 08:55 PM

So, can anyone reassure me that an indoor antenna will work well enough from zip code 27615 to grab the local channels? I'm in an apartment, so figure an indoor antenna is the best to try. The recent TWC price hikes have made me re-evaluate my choices. I only have "broadcast" cable and RR basic (1.5 down) and where it was $46/month, it is now $55/month. For no more service than I have, that $9/month raise is just too much.

I've already ordered DSL (naked/dry loop/whatever) from AT&T which should be activated next week. I didn't have any rabbit ears or anything around, so I ordered an indoor/outdoor antenna from Monoprice that had really good reviews. I'm hoping this works for me as I would really enjoy telling TWC to shove it.

pkscout

01-14-10, 09:54 PM

So, can anyone reassure me that an indoor antenna will work well enough from zip code 27615 to grab the local channels?

AntennaWeb (http://www.antennaweb.org) should be able to tell you. You can put in your exact address and get back a report of direction and antenna needs for your location.

texas_nightowl

01-14-10, 10:54 PM

AntennaWeb (http://www.antennaweb.org) should be able to tell you. You can put in your exact address and get back a report of direction and antenna needs for your location.

Ok, well if I understand correctly then I have a good chance of getting everything except PBS. I'm holding off cancelling TWC until the antenna arrives and I can see how it goes.

HDMe2

01-14-10, 10:57 PM

Ok, well if I understand correctly then I have a good chance of getting everything except PBS. I'm holding off cancelling TWC until the antenna arrives and I can see how it goes.

I'm at 27616... and have an indoor setup that gets me: 4,5,11,17,22,28,30,40,50 (sometimes 40 is not so strong).

What I'm doing is a 2-antenna combined situation. I have a directional Terk-type pointed at the antenna farm in Clayton/Garner direction + a small UHF omni-directional (quarter wave like for UHF remotes). Both feed into a splitter (used as a combiner) and then the amp that came with the Terk before going into my Dish receiver.

The Terk gets everything for me except 4/40. So I need that additional antenna for channel 4 (don't care if I get 40).

texas_nightowl

01-14-10, 11:25 PM

I'm at 27616... and have an indoor setup that gets me: 4,5,11,17,22,28,30,40,50 (sometimes 40 is not so strong).

What I'm doing is a 2-antenna combined situation. I have a directional Terk-type pointed at the antenna farm in Clayton/Garner direction + a small UHF omni-directional (quarter wave like for UHF remotes). Both feed into a splitter (used as a combiner) and then the amp that came with the Terk before going into my Dish receiver.

The Terk gets everything for me except 4/40. So I need that additional antenna for channel 4 (don't care if I get 40).

Thanks. Guess I need to look up and see what Terk-type is. But this is def. promising. I'd like to get 4, but can live without if I can tell TWC off. This is the link to the antenna I purchased from Monoprice:

http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=109&cp_id=10901&cs_id=1090102&p_id=4730&seq=1&format=2

HDMe2

01-15-10, 06:17 AM

Thanks. Guess I need to look up and see what Terk-type is. But this is def. promising. I'd like to get 4, but can live without if I can tell TWC off.

The Terk I'm talking about looks like this:

http://rsk.imageg.net/graphics/product_images/pRS1C-3056909_rshalt1_dt.jpg

I also recommend trying antennas from somewhere like Radio Shack that will let you return ones that don't work. That way you can try multiple types until you get a good config.

HDMe2

01-16-10, 10:27 AM

Obviously I snoozed through an OTA change recently.

I was vaguely aware that WRAY had switched from being a shopping channel to a religious programming one sometime last year.

But today I had a glitch and had to rescan my OTA channels... and found that there is now a 30.2 subchannel broadcasting in 1080i.

30.1 and 30.2 have different programming. Nothing in real HD on 30.2 yet, just stretch-o-vision from what I've seen... but I'll have to check back and see.

This must have happened (the new 30.2 channel) within the last week as I had scanned my OTA channels sometime within the last week prior to today for another glitch I had last week.

ENDContra

01-16-10, 03:46 PM

scsiraid

01-17-10, 12:33 PM

dgmayor

01-17-10, 03:39 PM

What happened to the BlueHighways Channel (134)? Got a message on my TiVo that it had been removed. Checked and it was true... no longer available on TiVo or on the TWC box. It was just added a couple weeks ago and now its gone..... ;)

How about that RFD HD channel that I like to make fun of ><. Ever since it's been added, I always just get the "RFD HD is currently unavailable Please Try Again Later" SDV screen. I've never once been able to tune it in to mock it!:D

Bruce Watson

01-17-10, 04:28 PM

Todays Raycom broadcast of the Clemson-State game on WRAL was widescreen SD. This is the first time Ive seen Raycom do this, although it was listed in their schedule as being broadcast in HD. Was this actually produced in SD, or was the fail on WRALs end somehow?

I saw that too. The later game was clearly using better cameras, so I doubt WRAL was completely at fault. Then again, the first game was a regional broadcast, and the later one was a national broadcast. Still I'm surprised -- the video quality was just atrocious -- fuzzy, lack of dynamic range, and very muted colors -- the reds were pathetic (or the paint on the floor has experience 25 years worth of fading in the last week). Either they are too cheap for words, or they think we are too stupid to notice. Either way they are majorly disrespecting the audience.

scsiraid

01-17-10, 04:37 PM

How about that RFD HD channel that I like to make fun of ><. Ever since it's been added, I always just get the "RFD HD is currently unavailable Please Try Again Later" SDV screen. I've never once been able to tune it in to mock it!:D

I tuned RFDHD just fine on my TiVo (not that I would ever want to)... However, I cant tune it from the TWC box. i just get a black screen.

Splat!

01-18-10, 05:05 PM

How about that RFD HD channel that I like to make fun of ><. Ever since it's been added, I always just get the "RFD HD is currently unavailable Please Try Again Later" SDV screen. I've never once been able to tune it in to mock it!:D

I've never tuned it, because I don't subscribe to the HD Plus tier that they put it on.

I'm still trying to figure out why RFD HD is a better semi-premium channel than something like HDNet/HDNet Movies.

scsiraid

01-18-10, 05:31 PM

dgmayor

01-18-10, 07:26 PM

I've never tuned it, because I don't subscribe to the HD Plus tier that they put it on.

I'm still trying to figure out why RFD HD is a better semi-premium channel than something like HDNet/HDNet Movies.

Ha!! I didnt realize that RFD was on the HD Plus Tier... Now thats funny...

Hrm. I don't have the plus tier, but those channels give me the "to get this channel call twc" screen. RFD always gives me the SDV failure screen.

nitdawg

01-20-10, 08:04 AM

Did the QAM freq for wraz-dt1 get changed last night or do I need another cup of coffee.

vidiot1985

01-20-10, 08:32 AM

Did the QAM freq for wraz-dt1 get changed last night or do I need another cup of coffee.

WRAZ's HD channel is coming in fine on my TV without a rescan, so I assume it hasn't changed frequency recently (or if it did, it got changed back without me noticing it :-).

nitdawg

01-20-10, 08:52 AM

Well now I'm showing the CaryTV 11 at 50.1...media center gone batty! This was the longest stretch for no QAM hiccups in 7MC so its not all bad. I had to go back and add 92.4 and reassign it to 50.1 and nuke the CaryTV. Strange, but resolved.

ziltink

01-21-10, 09:25 AM

I'm in 27616 as well and I have a cheap ($34, not so cheap I guess) RCA amplified indoor antenna at the top of my attic (one level house). I guess antenna height has a lot to do with it. I am picking up all of the same channels in addition to 47 ion. 47 is a little jumpy, but my box does well with this signal. I have the same issue with 40 also, a low signal. 11 is a little jumpy also, but no problems. All others are pretty decent in signal strength, even 4 which surprised me.

I've thought about getting an outdoor antenna, but since I haven't had many problems since the switch over, I'm sticking with my indoor antenna. Plus, this antenna feeds the whole house.

Yay DTV! :)

I'm at 27616... and have an indoor setup that gets me: 4,5,11,17,22,28,30,40,50 (sometimes 40 is not so strong).

What I'm doing is a 2-antenna combined situation. I have a directional Terk-type pointed at the antenna farm in Clayton/Garner direction + a small UHF omni-directional (quarter wave like for UHF remotes). Both feed into a splitter (used as a combiner) and then the amp that came with the Terk before going into my Dish receiver.

The Terk gets everything for me except 4/40. So I need that additional antenna for channel 4 (don't care if I get 40).

Bruce Watson

01-23-10, 03:01 PM

Todays Raycom broadcast of the Clemson-State game on WRAL was widescreen SD.

Well they beat that -- 4:3 SD is what's on right now -- the BC - VT game. What is WRAL thinking? Or, why isn't WRAL thinking?

This is the worst video quality I've seen in a decade! OK, for most of the last decade I didn't even have TV. But this is why! These cameras must have come from some 1970s junkyard. And that's where they should have stayed.

This is the problem with HD. People want it. They want the resolution, they want the wide screen, they want the dynamic range, they want the shadow detail, they want the huge gamut. And they get used to it, and they don't want SD anymore. When you stick them with the old tech, they see it and know what they are missing, and know they are being dissed by the broadcaster.

Sorry WRAL. You lost an audience member today. Can't watch crappy video quality like that. Not any more.

HDMe2

01-23-10, 05:58 PM

Same thing (SD) for the Wake Forest v Virginia game today as well.

I was surprised neither of these games were in HD.

But there's a noon game tomorrow, Raycom, and I wonder if they still only have the one truck/set of equipment and are taking it to that game... which meant no HD today?

AndThenScottSays

01-23-10, 07:36 PM

But there's a noon game tomorrow, Raycom, and I wonder if they still only have the one truck/set of equipment and are taking it to that game... which meant no HD today?My guess is that. If it is available in high definition you best believe WRAL will air it that way.

texas_nightowl

01-23-10, 08:29 PM

So, can anyone reassure me that an indoor antenna will work well enough from zip code 27615 to grab the local channels?

Just figured I'd give folks an update. Looks like I am very likely giving TWC the heave-ho next week! I did receive the antenna from Monoprice on Wednesday and immediately hooked it up. It did immediately detect basically everything. After the initial scan, it picked up:

4.1
4.2
4.3
5.1
5.2
11.1
11.2
11.3
17.1
17.2
17.3
22.1
28.1
30.1
30.2
40.1
40.2
47.1
47.2
47.3
47.4
50.1
50.2
50.3

Initially I had the antenna just sitting on an end table in the corner of the room...only maybe 2.5 feet off the ground. And by the way, I'm in a first floor apartment.

Now, of those channels, to be honest I don't care about 22, 28, 30, 40 and 47. Basically I only care about 4, 5, 11, 17, and 50.

Of those, the glitchiest ones initially were 4 and 17.

Since then I've elevated the antenna another 2 or 3 feet by attaching it to a pole lamp I have (initially, just for experimental purposes...plan to eventually put on the wall, but if the pole works... ) So, concentrating on 4, 5, 11, 17 and 50, the signal strength (as read from my Panasonic Plasma) on 5 (WRAL) and 50 (WRAZ) are generally the strongest...hardly a surprise I think. Of the remaining channels, 4, 11, and 17, it is hardest to strike a balance between a usable signal on 4 and 11. This is probably not that surprising given that 4 comes out of Chapel Hill.

Anyway, the current signal strengths I have, as of right now this minute, are:

4.1: 79-86%
5.1: 95-100%
11.1: 92%
17.1: 95-100%
50.1: 95-100%

47.1: 53%
40.1: 91%
30.1: 53-60%
28.1: 100%
22.1: 96-100%

So, I'm going to leave it alone for a few more days and see how they go, but likely TWC will get a cancellation call from me sooner rather than later.

(My DSL also got hooked up Friday and is working so far which takes care of internet.)

Trip in VA

01-23-10, 09:26 PM

Sorry WRAL. You lost an audience member today. Can't watch crappy video quality like that. Not any more.

Yes, it couldn't possibly be that the game was not available to WRAL in HD. ;)

I was told the games were only made available to stations in SD. The engineer from my local CBS station posted to let everyone know so there would be no complaints to the station from AVS about it.

- Trip

Bruce Watson

01-24-10, 12:17 PM

The engineer from my local CBS station posted to let everyone know so there would be no complaints to the station from AVS about it.

Why shouldn't we complain to the station(s) about poor quality video? The local stations are the ones broadcasting the signal -- they put their stamp of approval on it by the very act of broadcasting it. It's not Raycom's fault for supplying the games in SD. It's the stations' fault for not rejecting such crap.

The stations won't know this is a problem unless the viewers complain about it. Since the AVS crowd cares more than most, they should be sure to make their voices heard.

Trip in VA

01-24-10, 12:45 PM

So you'd rather see no game at all? I can't imagine most viewers share that opinion.

- Trip

HDMe2

01-24-10, 12:48 PM

So much for my theory... We are getting widescreen for today's game, but it is in SD... and fairly poor SD at that.

ENDContra

01-24-10, 01:07 PM

^And this game was scheduled to be broadcast in HD...I guess Raycom thinks that we wont know any better (sadly, some people dont).

Sorry WRAL. You lost an audience member today. Can't watch crappy video quality like that. Not any more.
Plenty of things you can blame WRAL for, but this isnt one of them. They air the broadcasts that Raycom makes available to them...whether thats HD or SD.

My guess is that. If it is available in high definition you best believe WRAL will air it that way.
WRAL preempts HD college basketball just about every weekend. They preempted two HD games just yesterday so you could see two Raycom games in glorious upconverted SD. At the same time, the "sister" station FOX50 aired some syndicated filler crap. So yeah, theres one of the aforementioned things you can blame WRAL for...being a ball hog.

AndThenScottSays

01-24-10, 03:07 PM

WRAL preempts HD college basketball just about every weekend. They preempted two HD games just yesterday so you could see two Raycom games in glorious upconverted SD. At the same time, the "sister" station FOX50 aired some syndicated filler crap. So yeah, theres one of the aforementioned things you can blame WRAL for...being a ball hog.It's a little something called a "contract." They are required by Raycom to take it all or take none.

Bruce Watson

01-24-10, 03:26 PM

Well, I already got an answer from Steve Hammel, the VP-General Manager of WRAL. He indicated that he was surprised at the video quality of the games yesterday and said he was already working on it.

What he can do, I have no idea. But at least he showed his concern and acknowledged the problem. On a Sunday no less.

Now if some of you other guys will let him know that it's more than just me that have a problem with this, maybe he can bring more pressure to bear on Raycom. IDK. But it can't hurt to try.

If they don't know that we think it's a problem, they don't know to fix it.

And yes Trip, I did turn the game off. I can't watch that low quality video any more. And yes I know that not many will have the courage of their convictions. But that's the reason those that do should act -- not to sit back and take it. Who is going to tell them, if not us?

Trip in VA

01-24-10, 03:37 PM

I've always considered WRAL to be a leader in the field of HD (first HD station on the air in the whole country, first HD newscast in the whole country, etc) so I wouldn't suspect them to need complaints before yelling at the Raycom people. That's my take on it, anyway.

- Trip

jspENC

01-24-10, 03:52 PM

I had the game on WRAL for a short while yesterday as well, and it was a terrible transmission from Raycom. I too didn't watch for long. It looked so dark and looked like something we used to get when HD was still in the early stages... I was wishing I was back in East Carolina watching WCTI.

ENDContra

01-24-10, 10:44 PM

It's a little something called a "contract." They are required by Raycom to take it all or take none.
MAYBE...if so, they have something specific to WRAL though. Raycom does not require "all or nothing" from its affiliates...hence why they have a local affiliates list on their website for each game. In previous years, Raycom games have occasionally been aired on FOX50, and I recall one year when Raycom had a football game at the same time that CBS had the US Open, MyRDC carried the Raycom game.

AndThenScottSays

01-25-10, 01:28 AM

MAYBE...if so, they have something specific to WRAL though. Raycom does not require "all or nothing" from its affiliates...hence why they have a local affiliates list on their website for each game. In previous years, Raycom games have occasionally been aired on FOX50, and I recall one year when Raycom had a football game at the same time that CBS had the US Open, MyRDC carried the Raycom game.http://www.wral.com/wral-tv/blogpost/6795965/

The contract apparently applies to basketball.

gstelmack

01-25-10, 11:07 AM

Wouldn't the best bet be to stop watching ACC basketball and write the ACC (who does the contracts with Raycom) that you'll stop watching until they get their act together and learn how to broadcast a top-tier sport?

nitdawg

01-25-10, 11:41 AM

Poor TV quality is tearing us apart...jk.

In all seriousness I think the complaints should at least start with WRAL (i sent them an email). The onus should not be on the viewer to track down the culprit, is it the ACC corp, Raycom, etc.? In the end if WRAL thinks that the poor PQ is costing them viewership/add revenue then they are in the best position to up the pressure on Raycom or whomever. I presume Raycom and the ACC have a long term deal, I'm not sure what incentives Raycom has on delivering a better product. Sunday's game was awful and I turned it off somewhere in the first half. You almost could not even read the team names in the scorebox. The leader in HD, except for our moneymaking basketball coverage.

ENDContra

01-25-10, 02:03 PM

http://www.wral.com/wral-tv/blogpost/6795965/

The contract apparently applies to basketball.
There are plenty of Raycom affiliates that do not carry every single game. If WRAL is required to, its because they asked for it. Id take anything in that link with a grain of salt anyhow...keep in mind who its targeted to.

Glad they changed back to airing preempted stuff overnight rather than on WRAL LowDef, even though I dont watch anything on CBS that would ever be affected. It does baffle me how many people dont realize they can set their DVR to record a show long, and you know exactly how much longer based on when the news starts.

abward

01-25-10, 02:07 PM

Was it just me or was the sound all distorted on Emma last night on WUNC? I have DirecTV. They are not rebroadcasting it, that I could find, so I cannot try to record it again.

HDMe2

01-25-10, 03:57 PM

I think we have to be considerate and adult about it... but I believe complaints about the poor quality of the Raycom broadcasts should be directed at WRAL.

If we complain to the ACC or to Raycom, it will likely fall on deaf ears because we (the viewers) have no pull with either entity. ACC contracts Raycom and Raycom contracts the local affiliate... so as long as they have those contracts, you and I mean nothing.

BUT... complaints to WRAL let WRAL know viewers care and have other viewing options... and they in turn can bring that up at contract time... so WRAL is in the best position to get the problem fixed even though it is apparently not their fault.

vidiot1985

01-26-10, 08:01 AM

Was it just me or was the sound all distorted on Emma last night on WUNC? I have DirecTV. They are not rebroadcasting it, that I could find, so I cannot try to record it again.

The only audio problems my wife noticed were the severe weather warning messages that appeared periodically during the program.

According to my BeyondTV DVR guide (based on TWC), there are multiple re-showings of the first 120 minute program between now and the final 60 minute program on 1/31.

I don't know if DirecTV has the same schedule though.

I suppose the TWUNCED maps to 4.3 OTA and the last three map to 4.1 OTA, so whatever on DirecTV maps to those should have it as well.

Channel: 203 TWUNCED
Airtime: 1/28/2010 9:00:00 PM (120 mins)

Channel: 201 TWUNCHD
Airtime: 1/30/2010 2:00:00 AM (120 mins)

Channel: 4 WUNC
Airtime: 1/30/2010 2:00:00 AM (120 mins)

Channel: 200 WUNCDT
Airtime: 1/30/2010 2:00:00 AM (120 mins)

abward

01-27-10, 06:18 AM

Thanks vidiot! These were not in the DirecTV search last Sunday night.

Bruce Watson

01-27-10, 02:37 PM

If anyone saw the State-Carolina game last night, *that* is what I'm talking about. That's true HD content -- 1080i sharp, vibrant reds, excellent shadow detail, solid blacks but without crushing, clean whites, solid graphics. That's the signal quality WRAL is known for; that's all I'm asking for.

So Raycom *can* do it. They really didn't rent all their good cameras to NBC and send them to Vancouver for the Olympics. At least one set stayed here. ;)

HDMe2

01-27-10, 09:20 PM

jaydro

01-28-10, 01:11 PM

Was it just me or was the sound all distorted on Emma last night on WUNC? I have DirecTV. They are not rebroadcasting it, that I could find, so I cannot try to record it again.
It wasn't just you. WUNC has had audio problems on DirecTV for at least a couple of weeks now. By the time I get around to trying to complain to the right person, DirecTV has usually fixed problems, but I'm not so sure in this case.... (and I had first wanted to find out if it was also an OTA problem)

Bruce Watson

01-28-10, 04:42 PM

Yep... Last night was exactly like the previous week for the Duke vs NC State game. Sharp HD.

Not sure what is happening lately with Raycom on the weekend games. Some days 4:3, other days widescreen... but SD on the weekend games for some reason.

Surely folks at Raycom know by now that they were doing a poor job on those weekend games, right?

They do. WRAL's Hammel told me that he talked to them. He also said that Raycom has revised their schedule by upgrading two weekend games from SD to HD, these being the VT-Miami game on 31-Jan-2010 at 1:00pm, and the NCSU-GT game on 6-Feb at 4:00pm. He did not say that these two events were related, or that he talked to them because some of us were complaining about the quality of the game coverage from Raycom.

What I know is that some of us complained, and that the schedule changed (we'll have to wait and see to verify). Are these cause and effect? IDK. What I *do* know is that I'm grateful for Mr. Hammel's efforts on our behalf, and I'm grateful that Raycom has decided to upgrade at least some of it's games.

Everybody is stepping up. We did good y'all.

HDMe2

01-28-10, 06:36 PM

Cool.

I can't remember who I've talked to at WRAL before... but they have always been responsive to complaints and suggestions, especially regarding their HD broadcasts and the things (like from Raycom) that they re-transmit from other sources.

I didn't actually complain this time around since I knew others here already were and I figured piling on wasn't necessary this time.

efranklin002

01-28-10, 10:28 PM

I live in Durham and I've got broadcast cable and I just recently did a re-scan and I seem to be picking up more digital channels than I did before. Not that I'm complaining but I am now picking up Fox News HD, Showtime Beyond, TNT (TNT was very fuzzy before but now it's clear), WGN (can't remember if I got that one before but I don't think I did) and I'm picking up A&E, however it is very fuzzy and not really watchable. Is anyone else with just broadcast cable picking up these stations now? Or anything new?

NCCaniac

01-29-10, 11:53 AM

nitdawg

01-29-10, 04:37 PM

Maybe TWC is running some sort of free preview? The sat companies do this from time to time to encourage you to upgrade to higher tier.

I saw FoxNewsHD as well. Not too long ago BBC america in HD was out there. I think from time to time you see sporadic QAM channels appear.

drewwho

01-29-10, 08:08 PM

They're wrecking the last Dollhouse right now, running a distorted, SD version on their HD station. This is miserable. It'll probably look better on hulu..

Argh.

Drew

HDMe2

01-30-10, 10:41 AM

nitdawg

01-30-10, 10:55 AM

Pure speculation on my part, but...

WRAL broadcasts in 1080i, whereas WRAZ broadcasts in 720p.

I have a nasty feeling like the crawl technology WRAL implemented for channel 5 does not work to mix with a 720p... Notice not only Dollhouse, but the 10pm channel 50 news as well was not HD to run the crawl.

I just have a nasty suspicion that the equipment the parent company invested in does not play well with their 720p equipment for the WRAZ broadcast.

Now I like that idea. Any clue as to why there are two HD broadcast standards anyway? I don't want to spark an argument as to which format is better, but why did the FCC set it up this way versus sticking with one format?

Trip in VA

01-30-10, 10:59 AM

The Fox splicer does not allow local stations to provide overlays in HD. The new splicer that is to be rolled out this year is supposed to support such things.

- Trip

HDMe2

01-30-10, 01:50 PM

The Fox splicer does not allow local stations to provide overlays in HD. The new splicer that is to be rolled out this year is supposed to support such things.

That was my 2nd thought... but I wasn't sure if the FOX splicer was in play for the local-only broadcasts like the 10pm news.

Trip in VA

01-30-10, 01:52 PM

HDMe2

01-30-10, 01:53 PM

Any clue as to why there are two HD broadcast standards anyway? I don't want to spark an argument as to which format is better, but why did the FCC set it up this way versus sticking with one format?

I'm probably oversimplifying, but...

Essentially there were 2 camps when the HD broadcast standard was being discussed.

One group wanted the highest resolution possible in the allotted 6MHz-per-channel OTA bandwidth... while the other group was set on progressive (instead of interlaced) even at lower resolution.

So... after fighting for a while, they eventually compromised to just accept both 720p and 1080i in the broadcast spec and let stations choose.

IF they could have waited another couple of years... they might have been able to settle on MPEG4 instead of MPEG2, and then we might have had 1080p only and been done with it... but alas, that was not possible at the time all these things were being discussed.

HDMe2

01-30-10, 01:56 PM

I... don't know. I know all material from inside the station is supposed to pass through the splicer before being fed out to the transmitter, but I don't know if it accepts HD inputs or what. I imagine foxeng knows the answer.

I've always been vague as to just where that FOX splicer went... which is why I wasn't sure.

My initial feeling was that the splicer was purely related to what the local stations received from FOX for network programming... and that perhaps it was something "not in use" for syndicated or locally produced stuff.

But, the more I hear... the more it sounds like the FOX splicer is part of the system no matter what... and then we get the limitations that we are now thinking possible like the inability to add the scroll/ticker during broadcast.

Bruce Watson

01-30-10, 07:09 PM

I'm probably oversimplifying, but...

Essentially there were 2 camps when the HD broadcast standard was being discussed.

One group wanted the highest resolution possible in the allotted 6MHz-per-channel OTA bandwidth... while the other group was set on progressive (instead of interlaced) even at lower resolution.

So... after fighting for a while, they eventually compromised to just accept both 720p and 1080i in the broadcast spec and let stations choose.

IF they could have waited another couple of years... they might have been able to settle on MPEG4 instead of MPEG2, and then we might have had 1080p only and been done with it... but alas, that was not possible at the time all these things were being discussed.

They played with "standards" for over 30 years (that's three decades -- yikes!). And what we ended up with is 8VSB modulation -- aka multiplath hell. Coulda had COFDM like everyone else, but no, we had to be different. Granted, there is a non-negligible power efficiency to 8VSB (IIRC it's something like 25%, as in you can cover the same area for 25% less power), but the cost is steep -- multipath problems effectively impede OTA reception (especially close in to the transmitter which is opposite from the analog days), and would be practically impossible on a moving platform such as a high speed train. Oh, wait, we don't have any of those. Yet. So why learn from the Europeans or the Japanese and plan for it? :rolleyes:

MPEG4 could have been implemented if I remember the time table. Coulda and shoulda. MPEG4 showed up in the late 1990s IIRC so was available for a good nine or 10 years before the great analog - digital switch over. I have no idea why this wasn't done.

The fight over "i" vs. "p" was largely a turf war between TV and computer companies. TV wanted to keep "i" (as in: "interlaced is the way we've always done it") while computer companies had already shown that "p" was a much better technology (as in "we tried interlaced but found that progressive scan cured things like flicker, resolution, motion, etc."), especially for computer games. We recovered, such as it is, with blu-ray. Which shows just how good 1080p really is in comparison to either 1080i or 720p. 1080p trumps the others if you are interested in video quality, no question. If you are interested in protecting your turf, maybe no so much.

Perhaps we'll learn something from all this and the next standard (long after I'm dead I'm sure) will be 2048p with MPEG4+ on a COFDM modulated carrier. I'm a gonna hold my breath for that one. :D

BTW, can anyone tell me how we got 1080 instead of 1024? I'm thinking I knew once what the significance of 1080 was, but I've forgotten.

And why 16:9 and not something that makes a modicum of sense like maybe 16:10 (the golden ratio) or 2.24:1 (sqrt(5), related to golden ratio), or maybe 1:85:1 ("flat" 3 perf pull down for 35mm film), or even 2.39:1 (anamorphic 4 perf pull down for 35mm film)? I'm sure it's an average of what was being used at the time (1980s maybe? -- decades before implementation of course), but why do we always react to the past as opposed to planning for the future? I mean, think about it: how much longer do you think cinema will be using 35mm film anyway? And if you're going to go digital, why not pick an aspect ratio that makes a modicum of sense, or at least has some bit of logic in it?

Feh. Please forgive me. I've been trapped inside all day and evidently it's made me somewhat cranky.

ziltink

01-31-10, 08:00 AM

Anyone have any bad reception with the snow that fell recently? I was expecting some bad results since my antenna is in the attic. I was pleasantly surprised and almost didn't even noticed a difference until I was watching channel 11 yesterday. Channel 11 was quite a bit more jumpy and almost unwatchable for a while, but it came back. Not sure if it was the snow or something else. My roof is completely covered with snow and sleet but I get all the channels this morning with no noticeable problems. Just curious how other peoples experience was with DTV and snow on the roof (if you have an attic antenna).

Retspin

01-31-10, 08:48 AM

pkscout

01-31-10, 09:41 AM

No antenna issues here. Mine is on the roof.

HDMe2

01-31-10, 10:50 AM

Indoor antenna here too... but also no problems with my Satellite Dishes on the roof.

Scooper

01-31-10, 11:19 AM

No issues either OTA or satellite (all antennas outdoor).

nitdawg

01-31-10, 12:32 PM

Feh. Please forgive me. I've been trapped inside all day and evidently it's made me somewhat cranky.
Come on, the weather is just lovely.

Thanks for all the info regarding 720p vs 1080i standards...I figured it would be something along the lines of not making much sense in the long run. I never understood the 16:9, not that I quite get why there are numerous widescreen film formats, but at least go with some standard that is used widely. Prior to 16x9 sets and TV stations switching to that format what other sources even used 16x9?

Whats the data comparison to 1080i MPEG2 versus 1080p MPEG4?

ENDContra

01-31-10, 01:17 PM

They do. WRAL's Hammel told me that he talked to them. He also said that Raycom has revised their schedule by upgrading two weekend games from SD to HD, these being the VT-Miami game on 31-Jan-2010 at 1:00pm, and the NCSU-GT game on 6-Feb at 4:00pm. He did not say that these two events were related, or that he talked to them because some of us were complaining about the quality of the game coverage from Raycom.
VT-Miami game is in SD today, although widescreen....I guess this is supposed to qualify as HD?

I realize you guys were angry about the crappy 4:3 broadcasts, and rightfully so, but Im more angry that there have now been 3 broadcasts that Raycom indicated would be in HD that weren't...as if they think we are really going to be fooled by this. If these games were listed as being in SD only, then widescreen SD would be acceptable, but theres no excuse for trying to fool viewers like this.

jspENC

01-31-10, 01:50 PM

The basketball games are the same widescreen junk on WYDO and WSFx also.

larc919

01-31-10, 04:40 PM

I saw FoxNewsHD as well. Not too long ago BBC america in HD was out there. I think from time to time you see sporadic QAM channels appear.I'm not seeing anything different in QAM except the addition of FoxNewsHD on channel 101.1. Betting that will be gone sometime tomorrow as soon as TWC discovers it's in the clear.

Bruce Watson

01-31-10, 04:54 PM

VT-Miami game is in SD today, although widescreen....I guess this is supposed to qualify as HD?

Not in my book. I was disappointed by this too. Hard to look at. Not sharp, no shadow detail (it took me a while to realize that the VT team was wearing dark purple and not black).

I realize you guys were angry about the crappy 4:3 broadcasts, and rightfully so, but Im more angry that there have now been 3 broadcasts that Raycom indicated would be in HD that weren't...as if they think we are really going to be fooled by this. If these games were listed as being in SD only, then widescreen SD would be acceptable, but theres no excuse for trying to fool viewers like this.

Oh, I'm with you there. Raycom is making WRAL look stupid, and WRAL is letting it happen for some reason (contract most likely).

I'm sure that Steve Hammel has heard it enough from me however. Shoot him an email and tell him what you see and express your lack of enthusiasm for his video quality. You can find his email on the WRAL website (http://www.wral.com/wral-tv/page/1007423/) -- he's the general manager (last on the "Comments about WRAL-TV" list). Seems like a nice guy who's actively concerned about how we perceive his station's quality. What have you got to loose? At least we can give him some ammunition for when it comes time negotiate the next contract with Raycom, yes?

larc919

01-31-10, 05:15 PM

Ha! FoxNewsHD gone at 5:12 PM. Didn't take TWC until tomorrow to learn they were giving something away. Takers, not givers that crowd.

SRJ1957

02-01-10, 08:57 AM

Just wanted to keep this in the forefront..if anybody cares that it is..:(

http://keepfreetvfree.com/

Next they will start charging for radio...

pkscout

02-01-10, 09:35 AM

Just wanted to keep this in the forefront..if anybody cares that it is..:(

http://keepfreetvfree.com/

Next they will start charging for radio...

I'd like to see some actual sources for that speculation. I know the FCC has been looking into taking more OTA spectrum for last mile internet service, and if internet service to 100% of homes could replace TV broadcasts and emergency alert services that might not necessarily be a bad thing. But to say the FCC is about to make you pay for cable TV or satellite is just plain not true as far as I can tell.

Trip in VA

02-01-10, 04:30 PM

internet service to 100% of homes could replace TV broadcasts and emergency alert services

I am 21 and I don't think I'll live to see the day that happens.

- Trip

jspENC

02-01-10, 04:35 PM

Just wanted to keep this in the forefront..if anybody cares that it is..:(

http://keepfreetvfree.com/

Next they will start charging for radio...

Last I heard they (FCC) had kind of backed off on it, but I would not let our guards down till the fat lady sings.:(

Blu-ray J

02-01-10, 10:40 PM

I really hope that gaudy ABC11 ticker for closings and such doesn't take over the screen during the Lost broadcast tomorrow night but I'm doubtful.

posg

02-02-10, 11:47 AM

I really hope that gaudy ABC11 ticker for closings and such doesn't take over the screen during the Lost broadcast tomorrow night but I'm doubtful.

I emailed the General Manager. Suggest you do the same. There is really no need for these crawls on TV. Check for weather closings on the internet, if you can't do that, use the phone. Most businesses have recordings advising of closings. Why in the hell would anybody sit through 500 closings on a TV station to maybe catch the one they're interested in. :mad::mad::mad:

posg

02-02-10, 11:56 AM

I am 21 and I don't think I'll live to see the day that happens.

- Trip

I'm 58 and I'm thinking that I might.

jspENC

02-02-10, 11:58 AM

I emailed the General Manager. Suggest you do the same. There is really no need for these crawls on TV. Check for weather closings on the internet, if you can't do that, use the phone. Most businesses have recordings advising of closings. Why in the hell would anybody sit through 500 closings on a TV station to maybe catch the one they're interested in. :mad::mad::mad:

If you were rude in your letter, I doubt you get the response out of it you are looking for. The stations have to serve the public interest in times of hazard. It is frustrating for everyone looking at those non stop crawls.

posg

02-02-10, 12:21 PM

If you were rude in your letter, I doubt you get the response out of it you are looking for. The stations have to serve the public interest in times of hazard. It is frustrating for everyone looking at those non stop crawls.

I remember when TV stations were required to "serve the public interest" all the time, not just in times of hazard.;) Are CW and MyTV affiliates exempt from the hazard requirement? Why?:confused:

Blu-ray J

02-02-10, 01:11 PM

If you were rude in your letter, I doubt you get the response out of it you are looking for. The stations have to serve the public interest in times of hazard. It is frustrating for everyone looking at those non stop crawls.
There is a difference between the crawl that say, WRAL has and the monstrosity that ABC has.

As of right now ABC is showing a soap that doesn't have it so maybe that is a good sign.

nitdawg

02-02-10, 01:38 PM

There is a difference between the crawl that say, WRAL has and the monstrosity that ABC has.

As of right now ABC is showing a soap that doesn't have it so maybe that is a good sign.

I always thought this was somewhat of a joke (outside of school and Gov't closings). It is free advertising...Saul's Plumbing is closed today. What a waste.

Lee L

02-02-10, 04:04 PM

I remember when TV stations were required to "serve the public interest" all the time, not just in times of hazard.;) Are CW and MyTV affiliates exempt from the hazard requirement? Why?:confused:

Funny also how almost always, the hazzard (or at least the need to communicate it) magically goes away during all commercials. ;)

Trip in VA

02-02-10, 06:22 PM

I'm 58 and I'm thinking that I might.

Then you must plan to be the oldest person on Earth! :eek:

I never expect to see national Internet infrastructure reach that level. They might very well cut OTA TV and the phone lines (going all VoIP), thus leaving rural people like me in the cold, but that's definitely not the same as national Internet infrastructure.

- Trip

ziltink

02-02-10, 07:10 PM

Anyone know what happened to ion (47)? I noticed they dropped their Worship channel and are down to three channels now. I guess this could be related to channel 30 adding an extra religious channel.

texas_nightowl

02-02-10, 07:26 PM

I really hope that gaudy ABC11 ticker for closings and such doesn't take over the screen during the Lost broadcast tomorrow night but I'm doubtful.

dang...I just flipped to ABC11 and wow they run a huge scrawl...this could suck for Lost tonight.

Scooper

02-02-10, 07:47 PM

Anyone know what happened to ion (47)? I noticed they dropped their Worship channel and are down to three channels now. I guess this could be related to channel 30 adding an extra religious channel.

Actually - what 30 was doing (the last time I looked) was running an SD and an HD feed of the same program - religious in nature. But that was late last week too....
I haven't looked at 47 since then either.

texas_nightowl

02-02-10, 08:04 PM

Yes! We're 4 minutes into the Lost summary and no scrawl!

Trip in VA

02-02-10, 08:53 PM

vidiot1985

02-02-10, 09:45 PM

Funny also how almost always, the hazzard (or at least the need to communicate it) magically goes away during all commercials. ;)

Yeah, pretty curious that :-).

In my case, it's not so much the crawl that bothers me, but the inexcusable change of aspect ratio that accompanies it! I know a lot of folks don't care about aspect ratio as long as the entire screen is filled, but it bugs me to no end.

I wish they'd just show black bars on the sides of the main program being crawled under so that for example on the Grammy Awards Lady Gaga doesn't end up looking like one of the Lullaby League.

Lee L

02-04-10, 03:13 PM

Well, kudos to WTVD for a flawless Lost telecast! Also, noticed The Middle and Modern Family with no crawl last night.

tarheelone

02-04-10, 04:36 PM

Well, kudos to WTVD for a flawless Lost telecast!

I was cussing WTVD out right after the first break and Lost came back on with Kate in the tree with the "funky" audio. My first thought was to blame WTVD before realizing that was the way the scene was suppose to be. :D

jspENC

02-04-10, 07:19 PM

If you have a lot of RAM and a digital internet connection, check out this Longley Rice coverage map of WTVD. (give it time to load all the colors) http://www.rabbitears.info/contour.php?appid=1333712&map=Y

That is the construction mod higher power map. Red color areas are very hard to tune. Go to the RabbitEars.info site and click "Listings" for more markets, channels and maps. Very interesting!

scsiraid

02-04-10, 08:23 PM

Trip in VA

02-04-10, 09:19 PM

Here's a better list of stations for which I have maps: http://coverage.rabbitears.info/

Raleigh is market 30.

- Trip

Scooper

02-04-10, 09:45 PM

Interesting maps - about what I would have expected for my location.

One comment - I seem to do OK on getting some "red" channels (mostly WUNC/ WUNP) anyway, and I wouldn't consider my antenna / pre-amp anything too extreme.

Trip in VA

02-04-10, 09:50 PM

Bear in mind the maps are run at a height of 13 feet rather than the FCC standard of 30 feet.

- Trip

Scooper

02-04-10, 09:57 PM

Why are you running that low ? - I'd like to see the 30 feet maps as well. My antennas are at 30-35 feet AGL.

Trip in VA

02-04-10, 10:07 PM

The maps are designed to deal with indoor antennas better. :)

- Trip

drewwho

02-05-10, 08:19 AM

In the last week or so, it looks like Fox 50 dropped their bandwidth on 50.1 from 13.6Mb/s to about 11.9Mb/s. Fox primetime shows had been coming in at about 6.16GB/hr and are now coming in at about 5.3GB/hr. Here are some actual file sizes from shows recorded OTA. Note the same was also true for at least one of the American Idles, and Bones. I didn't notice if House and 24 were smaller.

% ls -lt /video/tv/HumanTarget-*.mpg /video/tv/Fringe-*.mpg
-rw-r--r-- 1 sagetv sagetv 5371824128 Feb 4 22:00 /video/tv/Fringe-Jacksonville-1157240-0.mpg
-rw-r--r-- 1 sagetv sagetv 5367855104 Feb 3 20:59 /video/tv/HumanTarget-Sanctuary-1157246-0.mpg
-rw-r--r-- 1 sagetv sagetv 6151188480 Jan 28 21:59 /video/tv/Fringe-TheBishopRevival-1149359-0.mpg
-rw-r--r-- 1 sagetv sagetv 6152935424 Jan 26 21:59 /video/tv/HumanTarget-EmbassyRow-1157245-0.mpg
-rw-r--r-- 1 sagetv sagetv 6168299520 Jan 20 21:59 /video/tv/HumanTarget-Rewind-1131712-0.mpg

Was this a change from the Fox network? For some reason, I thought that the individual affiliates had no control over their primetime HD bandwidth due to the "Fox splicer" that Trip mentioned.

Drew

jspENC

02-05-10, 08:36 AM

Do they have the higher power online yet?

I heard that they do have it on, and have for a while.

scsiraid

02-05-10, 04:22 PM

Wow... It looks like the WRAL fiber to TWC may be tanked... TWC Channel 255 is a MESS... 5-1 OTA is fine though.

HDMe2

02-05-10, 10:19 PM

Ok... who kept turning off the HD during Smallville on CW22?

The first hour was mostly ok... but much of the 2nd hour tonight was SD.

vidiot1985

02-06-10, 01:37 PM

In the last week or so, it looks like Fox 50 dropped their bandwidth on 50.1 from 13.6Mb/s to about 11.9Mb/s. Fox primetime shows had been coming in at about 6.16GB/hr and are now coming in at about 5.3GB/hr. ...
Drew

Interestingly, it seems WRAL 255 has cranked up its bandwidth, perhaps in anticipation of the Super Bowl?

The Late Show and Late Late Show are at 7GBytes/hour recently where they were more like 6Gbytes/hour before.

jspENC

02-06-10, 05:30 PM

Interestingly, it seems WRAL 255 has cranked up its bandwidth, perhaps in anticipation of the Super Bowl?

The Late Show and Late Late Show are at 7GBytes/hour recently where they were more like 6Gbytes/hour before.

Maybe the cable people did it?

scsiraid

02-06-10, 05:50 PM

Maybe the cable people did it?

OTA bitrates are up too... Sizes have been running around mid 5GB to 6GB for an hour show... Numbers was 7.1 GB last night.

drewwho

02-07-10, 08:21 AM

OTA bitrates are up too... Sizes have been running around mid 5GB to 6GB for an hour show... Numbers was 7.1 GB last night.

Looks as if they turned off the useless, pointless, bandwidth wasting mobile DTV. According to my HDHR, 5.1 is at 16.5Mb/s and 5.2 is at 2.4Mb/s

Let's all email them, and ask them to keep it off :)

Drew

vidiot1985

02-07-10, 08:56 AM

It looks like UNC HD 201 on TWC has a lower bitrate now, with a one hour program being about 5.5GB/hour.

The audio stream looks like it's been cut in half as well.

Music shows like Soundstage when shown in HD had been 384Kbps audio, but now seem to be 192Kbps (which is the rate that had been used on the digital SD showings). But interestingly, Austin City Limits was still at 384Kbps last night. Maybe they changed something at 1AM this morning between those two shows? Or maybe it is particular to the show.

texas_nightowl

02-07-10, 09:00 PM

Hmm...anyone got a problem right now with OTA 4.1 UNC? Earlier today it was fine...watched America's Test Kitchen this afternoon. Right now, all I'm getting is Channel Not Available. No 4.2 or 4.3 either.

vidiot1985

02-08-10, 07:09 AM

Stress

02-08-10, 07:19 AM

Did anyone else see a lot of stuttering during the superbowl?

My HDHomerun tuner showed TWC 255 in the 90 +/-2 percent in signal quality.

For the first quarter or so, it seemed that whenever there was a pass reception or tackle on a run, the picture would hiccup right at the key moment. Man, was that frustrating. I guess the horizontal panning stressed the signal weakness.

The hiccuping wasn't so bad later on in the game even though the signal quality numbers weren't noticeably better.

I noticed that, too. Bits of video kept flying out of the picture during the first quarter or so. I was worried it had something to do with some new "cheaper" HDMI cables I just installed. But, you're right, it went away later in the game.

scsiraid

02-08-10, 07:46 AM

Did anyone else see a lot of stuttering during the superbowl?

My HDHomerun tuner showed TWC 255 in the 90 +/-2 percent in signal quality.

For the first quarter or so, it seemed that whenever there was a pass reception or tackle on a run, the picture would hiccup right at the key moment. Man, was that frustrating. I guess the horizontal panning stressed the signal weakness.

The hiccuping wasn't so bad later on in the game even though the signal quality numbers weren't noticeably better.

No. It was clean for me. Excellent PQ. I wish WRAL would leave the bitrates like this all the time. Actually though, I watched it OTA. However, I did check the other recording before it finished and it was 0 RS Uncorrected.

jspENC

02-08-10, 08:42 AM

Did anyone else see a lot of stuttering during the superbowl?

My HDHomerun tuner showed TWC 255 in the 90 +/-2 percent in signal quality.

For the first quarter or so, it seemed that whenever there was a pass reception or tackle on a run, the picture would hiccup right at the key moment. Man, was that frustrating. I guess the horizontal panning stressed the signal weakness.

The hiccuping wasn't so bad later on in the game even though the signal quality numbers weren't noticeably better.

I am a member of WRAL Facebook, and they (WRAL) made a comment that they had problems with "digital breakup" during the superbowl, and called TW on it, and people blasted them good.

drewwho

02-08-10, 09:10 AM

No. It was clean for me. Excellent PQ. I wish WRAL would leave the bitrates like this all the time. Actually though, I watched it OTA. However, I did check the other recording before it finished and it was 0 RS Uncorrected.

It was clean for me as well (OTA also).

Please, please, please email WRAL and tell them how nice their signal looked this weekend. Their chief engineer is Peter Sockett (psockett at wral dot com).. If anything, it would make sense for Capital City to move the mobile DTV stuff to WRAZ, and eliminate the useless 50-3 SD-mirror of 50-1 to recover some bandwidth.

Drew

PS: The *only* reason I watched WRAL (and their ads) is because they upped their bandwidth. Otherwise, I'd have just watched it on WFMY from Greensboro.

NCCaniac

02-08-10, 11:25 AM

Did anyone else see a lot of stuttering during the superbowl?

My HDHomerun tuner showed TWC 255 in the 90 +/-2 percent in signal quality.

For the first quarter or so, it seemed that whenever there was a pass reception or tackle on a run, the picture would hiccup right at the key moment. Man, was that frustrating. I guess the horizontal panning stressed the signal weakness.

The hiccuping wasn't so bad later on in the game even though the signal quality numbers weren't noticeably better.

I saw the same thing at a friend's house I was at for a Super Bowl party. They had TWC and there was frequent pauses, breakup, etc. Seems like TWC had a bandwidth issue. :rolleyes:

Bruce Watson

02-08-10, 11:54 AM

It was clean for me as well (OTA also).

Please, please, please email WRAL and tell them how nice their signal looked this weekend. Their chief engineer is Peter Sockett (psockett at wral dot com).. If anything, it would make sense for Capital City to move the mobile DTV stuff to WRAZ, and eliminate the useless 50-3 SD-mirror of 50-1 to recover some bandwidth.

+1.

Sent my email earlier this morning. When they turn the bit-rate up they have an outstanding signal (at least OTA, I have no idea how much of that makes it through TWC). All the games this weekend benefited from their excellent signal quality -- we should let them know that we see it, and appreciate it. It only takes a few minutes to send a congratulatory email, so why not do it?

I second the wish to keep bandwidth high on the flagship signal (5-1) at least, and push the non-HDTV stuff to WRAZ. What is the purpose of 50-3 anyway?

drewwho

02-08-10, 12:37 PM

I second the wish to keep bandwidth high on the flagship signal (5-1) at least, and push the non-HDTV stuff to WRAZ. What is the purpose of 50-3 anyway?

I had thought it was to send the network 4:3 SD feed to the cable company, so the cable company doesn't have to crop/letterbox/downconvert the 16:9 HD subchannel for SD viewers. But many stations don't have this sort of SD mirror (5-1 being one of them), so I don't understand why they still need it on WRAZ.

Drew

cucamelsmd15

02-08-10, 12:38 PM

drewwho

02-08-10, 12:39 PM

I saw the same thing at a friend's house I was at for a Super Bowl party. They had TWC and there was frequent pauses, breakup, etc. Seems like TWC had a bandwidth issue. :rolleyes:

I wonder what the deal was. They obviously have enough bandwidth (or did the last time I checked) to carry a 16.5Mb/s subchannel in a 38Mb/s qam channel that is otherwise empty. Some other local HD channels (22, 28) broadcast at a higher bitrate than that, and I don't think they have those problems with them.

Drew

DonB2

02-08-10, 02:09 PM

If anyone was recording on PBS 4.1 last night they will find that it was out around 9 pm for about an hour.

NCCaniac

02-08-10, 04:02 PM

I wonder what the deal was. They obviously have enough bandwidth (or did the last time I checked) to carry a 16.5Mb/s subchannel in a 38Mb/s qam channel that is otherwise empty. Some other local HD channels (22, 28) broadcast at a higher bitrate than that, and I don't think they have those problems with them.

Isn't cable bandwidth shared among all users off the same main line? This Super Bowl was the highest rated TV show ever, so if you had a lot of neighbors all watching the same TWC HD feed on nice new HD TVs....plus people writing Facebook updates and chatting online on their RoadRunner connections...

drewwho

02-08-10, 04:07 PM

Isn't cable bandwidth shared among all users off the same main line? This Super Bowl was the highest rated TV show ever, so if you had a lot of neighbors all watching the same TWC HD feed on nice new HD TVs....plus people writing Facebook updates and chatting online on their RoadRunner connections...

You're thinking about how road-runner works, that is not how the TV side of digital cable works. In our area WRAL has a dedicated QAM-256 channel (85). That channel has 38Mb/s available. The 38Mb/s is there if all viewers are watching, or none. It is not split or subdivided based on the number of viewers. The last I looked, TWC was wasting about 1/2 of the channel (eg, just re-broadcasting the 19Mb/s OTA signal). Perhaps they've put something else alongside WRAL, and WRAL got throttled, but it seems unlikely.

There was a post earlier saying it looked like WRAL's fiber connection to TWC was hosed. Maybe that was the problem? Eg, maybe they didn't have enough bandwidth going from WRAL to TWC?

Drew

drewwho

02-09-10, 09:30 AM

It looks like UNC HD 201 on TWC has a lower bitrate now, with a one hour program being about 5.5GB/hour.

My recording of "Secrets of the Dead" last night came in at about 6.5GB/hr OTA, and has 384Kb/s audio. Is the bitrate still low on TWC?

Drew

drewwho

02-09-10, 09:31 AM

OTA bitrates are up too... Sizes have been running around mid 5GB to 6GB for an hour show... Numbers was 7.1 GB last night.

WRAL-HD is back down to a lousy 6GB/hr now. I guess I'll go back to WFMY..

Drew

DonB2

02-09-10, 12:25 PM

I am curious if anyone else has seen a large loss in signal strength from Pax/Ion 47.1?

A month ago I got it at around 5 bars and now I am lucky to see 1 bar with same set up and get the No Signal message.

HDMe2

02-09-10, 07:06 PM

I can't get it in my living room anymore, but it was borderline before. I honestly haven't tried to get the PAX channels lately, though because I had to sacrifice quality elsewhere even when I could bring them in.

vidiot1985

02-10-10, 07:45 AM

My recording of "Secrets of the Dead" last night came in at about 6.5GB/hr OTA, and has 384Kb/s audio. Is the bitrate still low on TWC?

Drew

I recorded "Blueprint America: Beyond the Motor City" last night and it's about 6.3GB/hour on TWC, with 384Kb/s stereo audio.

VisionOn

02-10-10, 08:30 AM

Isn't cable bandwidth shared among all users off the same main line?

Now if it was on an SDV channel then there may have been a node explosion, depending on where you live.

CCsoftball7

02-10-10, 09:50 AM

ESPNU-HD looked HORRIBLE last night. I switched over from D* to watch on TWC, wow, was I ever disappointed in the PQ.

drewwho

02-10-10, 10:37 PM

I noticed that 28-1 seems to be down to about 15.5Mb/s in the last few days (OTA), but they don't seem to have added any subs. Anybody know what's going on with them?

Drew

Trip in VA

02-10-10, 10:37 PM

Probably preparing to add The Cool TV.

http://www.thecooltv.com/THECOOLTV_SinclairTelevisionGroup.php

- Trip

DonB2

02-11-10, 10:03 AM

HDME2,

Thanks for the feedback on Pax.

As per a early post of mine about another station 4.1 that was offline Sunday night. I went to PBS's website and caught up on the show missed via internet. Kind of nice to have a backup when OTA fails.

HDMe2

02-11-10, 11:56 AM

You're welcome. I wish I had a better answer on PAX for you... but since it had always been marginal for me, I wasn't too surprised when it became even harder to receive as I had mostly given up trying.

jrelmore

02-12-10, 08:59 PM

NBC17 HD OTA Is anyone else seeing this audio delay?

Especially noticeable during the Olympic programing, also during commercials.

drewwho

02-13-10, 08:33 AM

NBC17 HD OTA Is anyone else seeing this audio delay?

Especially noticeable during the Olympic programing, also during commercials.

Yes. We're watching last night's opening show on the DVR this morning, and I see some lip synch issues when the talking heads are on screen. Highly annoying.

Drew

toadfannc

02-13-10, 06:50 PM

Anyone else getting "Not Available" on about half the HD TWC channels today? It's been all day for me.

VisionOn

02-13-10, 07:16 PM

SDV coming through here. Viewers in your area might be sucking up the bandwidth on the node.

Blu-ray J

02-13-10, 11:52 PM

Anyone else getting "Not Available" on about half the HD TWC channels today? It's been all day for me.
Same here.

toadfannc

02-14-10, 06:16 AM

Same here.

This AM, it's just Hist Int HD (227), Food Network (278), and TBS (282)-- I'm giving TWC one more day. Their "advanced" products (SDV, Start Over) are a joke.

jspENC

02-14-10, 09:32 AM

Jump over to Greensboro and check out the mess they are getting on the Olympics! Dime wanter can sure talk the talk, but can't walk the walk with their "Advanced Fiber Network"!

Yea right!

scsiraid

02-14-10, 09:59 AM

This AM, it's just Hist Int HD (227), Food Network (278), and TBS (282)-- I'm giving TWC one more day. Their "advanced" products (SDV, Start Over) are a joke.

All three of those are fine here in Apex via TiVo.

JMN322

02-14-10, 08:55 PM

Watching the Olympics on 217. Channel seems to reboot every 10-15 minutes since Friday. Is this a DVR problem or a TWC box problem?

jimholcomb

02-14-10, 10:15 PM

Watching the Olympics on 217. Channel seems to reboot every 10-15 minutes since Friday. Is this a DVR problem or a TWC box problem?

This happened during the 2008 Olympics too. If I remember right TWC gave me a second box to watch the Olympics, I don't remember if if was the MDN or ODN boxes that had the problem, my MDN box is working fine.

kosekjm

02-14-10, 11:23 PM

I'm betting that you have the 8300 HD box, right?

I have that problem on anything NBC shows on HD with my 8300 HD DVRs (Non-C models). If the program is over an hour (Or so) long, then I get random reboots. This only occurs on NBC 17 HD. I've posted here: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=14718451#post14718451 about it and was told this seems to be a bug in the DVR. One would have hoped that TWC had fixed it, but so far for me I still get this.

When watching something like a football game, I have to keep changing the channels to clear the buffers. So I'll watch until a commercial and then jump two stations up or down. When I come back to NBC17 the DVRs buffers are cleared and then I'm good again. I need to do this every commercial, or the box reboots. I've had technicans out to check wiring, signal strength, etc. I've had different boxes swapped out (All only 8300 HD boxes) The box is the culprit. Friends of mine that have the HDC version of this box have even more problems than I, so I just keep the box (And tend to skip NBC's programming).

I keep hoping that TWC would eventually fix this bug, but as is most things that TWC does, they don't really seem to care.

Perhaps someday they'll either get some competition (Doubtful) or I'll end up in a house where I can get line of site for satellites again (Current apartment has no viable mounting locations) or TWC might even one day rool out a real DVR.

One can hope right?

vidiot1985

02-15-10, 08:49 AM

Watching the Olympics on 217. Channel seems to reboot every 10-15 minutes since Friday. Is this a DVR problem or a TWC box problem?

I don't have their DVR or other STB, but while 217 was fine showing the Olympics earlier in the day, the prime time show was stuttering a lot, especially as the pairs figure skating was running. It got better later in the show.

NBC17ENG

02-15-10, 10:37 AM

Reboots? TWC claimed they resolved that issue. We worked with them, and they brought in a dude from Charlotte, and we hooked up their equipment here and oddly they concluded closed captioning was causing the boxes to reboot. Sounds just as odd now as it did then.

Lip sync was horrible on Opening Ceremonies and varied ahead and behind. NBC's natural response, "not us!" Re-booted our IRD's so maybe that would resolve it.

They had video glitches near the end. Heavy snow band in Raleigh. Wasn't enough time to switch to C-band.

I watched WITN yesterday. Numerous video glitches during the afternoon.

I had switched to an indoor antenna before the Opening Ceremonies since most people complain with them. Reception was excellent. Go figure!

JMN322

02-15-10, 11:26 AM

Technician is coming out tonight. Seems that switching out the box may help (if they fixed the bug). If not, seems that changing channels and then back again during commercials will help some.

I'll report back on the results tonite as I'll be watching the Olympics again on 217. Should be a good test as it only happens on 217!

Thanks for the replies.

Bruce Watson

02-15-10, 02:44 PM

In watching the Olympics on 17.1 (OTH from Raleigh) I've noticed some interesting artifacts. Not sure what to call them, or what the cause may be.

I first saw it during speed skating -- they would show the skaters from one end as they rounded the oval on the other end. The camera would track the skater of course so everything was moving at pretty high speed except for the skater's torso. The artifact was around the skates themselves. I can only call it grainy -- where the skates were moving pretty quickly against a background which was moving very quickly. It's like the picture in that region lost resolution and also lost "smoothness".

It didn't look like what I've grown to think of as macroblocking. The blocks (if that's what they are) are too small and too regular in shape and distribution.

Did anyone else see it? And if you did, do you know what it's called and what the cause might be?

DonB2

02-15-10, 02:55 PM

I noticed the lip sync on OTA during the opening ceremony but have not really noticed it since. I do find the background sound to be almost as loud as the announcer during the outside event coverage. And during the opening ceremony all the voice both talking and singing were hard to understand. It was like the mike was at the other end of the stadium from the performer.

Coverage over all seems to be a big improvement over previous years. At least I am seeing more coverage of sports I like - ok, maybe a little too much Luge :)

And I must add that pre coverage on 17.2 leading up to the Olympics has been real nice.

drewwho

02-15-10, 05:03 PM

Did anyone else see it? And if you did, do you know what it's called and what the cause might be?

Yes, I saw it also. I think the problem is just that way too much motion is happening for them to be able to compress it down to 15Mb/s Mpeg2. I'll be the NBC master feed (40Mb/s mpeg4 ??) is smooth as silk, and artifact free.

Drew

willobandb

02-15-10, 05:49 PM

Reboots? TWC claimed they resolved that issue. We worked with them, and they brought in a dude from Charlotte, and we hooked up their equipment here and oddly they concluded closed captioning was causing the boxes to reboot. Sounds just as odd now as it did then.

...

I have the 8300HD DVR from TWC and I have had the same problem with TWC Channel 217 (Channel 17 HD Feed), can't watch the NBC Evening News without a reboot during the newscast. Was at a friends house in Cary recently and I found out that he avoids that channel as well with his 8300HD DVR. Would be interesting to know how many other folks are still having that problem. TWC may have "resolved" that issue but the "fix" didn't make it to all of us! :-(

NBC17ENG

02-15-10, 05:57 PM

I agree with Drew. I just re-provisioned the bitrates to boost HD to just under 16 Mbps and Universal Sports down to 4 Mbps max. I have not seen US go much over 3.1 Mbps anyway, and I am not impressed with the SD resolution on it at 5, but the HD video has been pretty impressive considering (1) the motion and (2) details.

P.S.
The only audio error they reported was during the Today Show this past weekend by the Production crew. My sister station WFLA also reported the lip sync error in the Opening Ceremonies.

jimholcomb

02-15-10, 06:39 PM

JMN322

02-15-10, 06:49 PM

I'm starting to remember things ... for those of you with the rebooting problem - do you have closed captioning set to On with Mute? I think that's what I had my 8300HD set to.

Jim

Nope, no cc set to on with mute. Hopefully the technician coming in a few minutes will have some encouraging information about swapping out the Explorer 8300HD (with a bug free version?)....

kosekjm

02-15-10, 10:58 PM

Hi Jim,

I've had the box reboot with CC on with Mute as well as when that is set to off. It seems not to matter. Whenever I watch anything on 217 on either of my boxes, I get to play the will it reboot game.

I have not watched anything from the Olympics, but all during football season, the Sunday night game on NBC was a constant battle of watch 5 minutes and switch channel. Watch five minutes and switch the channel. Oops I forgot to switch the channel and now the box is rebooting.

I've seen it happen during SNL as well as during Jay Leno's Final (Or not so final) Tonight Show. I personally have not seen it during a 30 minute show (like the news).

If I keep switching the channels (and I have to switch twice to clear both DVR buffers), then I could watch the game just fine. Seems odd that if it was a CC issue, that clearing the DVR buffer by switching the channel could stop that from occuring.

Again this is only an issue on 217. CBS, FOX, ABC, ESPN, SciFi (Or whatever they call it these days), Discovery, any of the other HD channels are fine. I only get the box rebooting on 217.

This has now happened across two different apartments. Last year I was in Olde Towne apartments and had this issue. This year (Since May or so of 2009) I'm now at Cross Timbers in Morrisville and I still have the rebooting. I've been fighting the rebooting since I moved up here in 2007.

If TWC fixed the issue, then they obviously did not push it out to everyone.

drewwho

02-16-10, 08:48 AM

I agree with Drew. I just re-provisioned the bitrates to boost HD to just under 16 Mbps and Universal Sports down to 4 Mbps max

Thanks for boosting the bitrate! There wasn't much on last night that I wanted to see (due to the delays for the speed skating). I'll check it out tonight.

The only audio error they reported was during the Today Show this past weekend by the Production crew. My sister station WFLA also reported the lip sync error in the Opening Ceremonies.

Maybe I'm just extra sensitive, but the audio sync on NBC17 always appears to be just a little off to me, and has been since as far as I can remember. It seems to be just far enough off that you can tell something is wrong, but not quite so far off that you can tell that the video is ahead of or behind the audio. There's just a nagging "there is something wrong here" feeling if you look too close. I don't see these problems on WRAL, WFMY or WUNC (other 1080i stations), so I don't think it is my electronics equipment.

I'm just the kind of person that can see mpeg motion artifacts, bad interlacing/deinterlacing, DLP color wheel rainbows, uneven black levels in our Sony LCD,etc. You name an imperfection, and I can see it :( It drives my wife nuts, because we'll be watching something she'll think is perfect, and I'll point out some flaw. Then she'll see it too, and I'll have ruined it for her. I need to just learn to keep my mouth shut. I guess its the curse of 20/15 vision and knowing how things work..

Drew

PS: I just watched something from a few weeks back, during the winter weather. Kudos for doing your closing crawl in HD, and for preserving the proper aspect ratio and size of the broadcast.

gstelmack

02-16-10, 09:56 AM

Maybe I'm just extra sensitive, but the audio sync on NBC17 always appears to be just a little off to me, and has been since as far as I can remember. It seems to be just far enough off that you can tell something is wrong, but not quite so far off that you can tell that the video is ahead of or behind the audio. There's just a nagging "there is something wrong here" feeling if you look too close. I don't see these problems on WRAL, WFMY or WUNC (other 1080i stations), so I don't think it is my electronics equipment.

I am noticing this as well during the Olympics broadcasts. Worse on some bits, almost-but-not-quite-there on others. There also seemed to be some audio drop-outs where stuff just went silent over the weekend, although I did not notice that issue at all yesterday while watching.

This is on the HD channel, 217, on TWC.

JMN322

02-16-10, 09:59 AM

Replaced box with Explorer 8340HDC and no more reboot problems.

Talked with TWC cable tech and he said that the reboot issue is only a problem with NBC 217 and the older box I had (8300HD). At least that is the complaint he hears from customers with the reboot issue.

So now that my problems are over I'm curious as to why it's an issue (I'm kinda geeky that way), but really not so much anymore since it been fixed by the upgraded unit

JMN322

02-16-10, 10:01 AM

Thanks for boosting the bitrate! There wasn't much on last night that I wanted to see (due to the delays for the speed skating). I'll check it out tonight.

Maybe I'm just extra sensitive, but the audio sync on NBC17 always appears to be just a little off to me, and has been since as far as I can remember. It seems to be just far enough off that you can tell something is wrong, but not quite so far off that you can tell that the video is ahead of or behind the audio. There's just a nagging "there is something wrong here" feeling if you look too close. I don't see these problems on WRAL, WFMY or WUNC (other 1080i stations), so I don't think it is my electronics equipment.

I'm just the kind of person that can see mpeg motion artifacts, bad interlacing/deinterlacing, DLP color wheel rainbows, uneven black levels in our Sony LCD,etc. You name an imperfection, and I can see it :( It drives my wife nuts, because we'll be watching something she'll think is perfect, and I'll point out some flaw. Then she'll see it too, and I'll have ruined it for her. I need to just learn to keep my mouth shut. I guess its the curse of 20/15 vision and knowing how things work..

Drew

PS: I just watched something from a few weeks back, during the winter weather. Kudos for doing your closing crawl in HD, and for preserving the proper aspect ratio and size of the broadcast.

I agree about the lip sync...it's just enough to bother you 'cause it doesn't quite match up....

NCCaniac

02-16-10, 10:56 AM

I noticed the lip sync on OTA during the opening ceremony but have not really noticed it since.

It had been OK most of the time, but was really bad last night again OTA when interviewing Bode Miller after the downhill race. Lip synch was at least 1 second off.

DonB2

02-16-10, 12:05 PM

rollcage

02-16-10, 12:57 PM

Add another to your list of those with the 8300HD reboot issue. I don't watch 217 often, except for Heroes and sports. The reboots occurred all during the NHL Winter Classic and weekend hockey games. I'm also frequently experiencing the issue during the Olympics. I've never had the problem during Heroes, but then again, I record it and watch later.

NBC17ENG

02-16-10, 05:28 PM

After talking with the NBC Principal Engineer and Audio Architect who gave me some suggestions to look for, I found the MPEG encoder audio delay was set to 50 m seconds after the upgrade. I changed it to match my Dolby encoder delay of 187 ms and audio lip sync looks dead on now.

TWC called earlier and I mentioned your 8300 box reboots. They assumed all boxes had received the updated code that took care of the reboots. If you are still having that issue, call their Customer Care Center. I'm not sure if they can flash an update while on the phone, but they can at least compare your software version with the latest version.

I have a TiVo with cablecards in my office, so I can't compare, but perhaps any 8300 users without the reboot issue can post their code version here and you can determine if your box needs an update.

NBC17ENG

02-16-10, 05:31 PM

I second the lip sync with Bode - it was terrible.

In regards to audio drop out. I also notice that. And I have noticed it for quite awhile on 17.2 but put up with it because I am happy to have Olympic style sports available to watch on 17.2

I resolved the dropouts on 17-2 months ago. I have not caught a single drop on that channel since I converted it from discrete video/audio to an embedded stream into the encoder.

vidiot1985

02-17-10, 08:52 AM

drewwho

02-17-10, 09:23 AM

I'm watching the Today show on TWC 217 and the audio seems ever so slightly ahead of the video.

It seems to be that way on both my TV's tuner as well as my HD Homerun tuner.

I just took a peek. I think it is as good (or better than) it ever was on NBC17, but you're right, something seems just a hair off. This was via my Sony's internal tuner, as well as SageTV.

Drew

vidiot1985

02-17-10, 01:06 PM

I just took a peek. I think it is as good (or better than) it ever was on NBC17, but you're right, something seems just a hair off. This was via my Sony's internal tuner, as well as SageTV.

Drew

For what it's worth, and with NBC17ENG's mention of his Dolby encoder, both of my tests were with stereo downmixes of what I assume is an incoming 5.1 audio stream.

Maybe that contributes to it too.

rollcage

02-17-10, 01:54 PM

TWC called earlier and I mentioned your 8300 box reboots. They assumed all boxes had received the updated code that took care of the reboots. If you are still having that issue, call their Customer Care Center. I'm not sure if they can flash an update while on the phone, but they can at least compare your software version with the latest version.

I called customer care (919-595-4892, Atlantic Ave, Raleigh) and the gentleman said he couldn't find any information concerning an update for a channel 217 issue. He suggested I power off the box then hold power + select to get the box to grab any software updates it may have missed. He said he couldn't check my software version remotely to see if I have the latest (I'm at work, so couldn't look it up myself). My box was "upgraded" in the last couple months to remove the sorely missed Sort by Favorites feature :mad:, so shouldn't I have the fix for 217 by now?

Is there anyone out there with an 8300HD that is NOT experiencing reboot issues on 217? What is your software version?

tarheelone

02-17-10, 02:06 PM

Is there anyone out there with an 8300HD that is NOT experiencing reboot issues on 217? What is your software version?

I've watched quite a bit of the Olympics on 217 and haven't had any reboots on my 8300HD. I'll check all my software versions when I get home tonight.

DonB2

02-17-10, 03:08 PM

"I resolved the dropouts on 17-2 months ago. I have not caught a single drop on that channel since I converted it from discrete video/audio to an embedded stream into the encoder."

That sounds about right since I have strayed from 17-2 for a spell :)

Thanks for getting it fixed. I like that simulcast channel !!

Bruce Watson

02-17-10, 04:17 PM

My wife was watching the figure skating last night on 17.1 (OTA) and she said it looked somewhat smoother than before. So even she can see the improvement in the bitrate.

Hats off to NBC 17, and thanks for the better signal!

That's one of the things I like about this forum. Every once in a while things improve because we have perceptive people and interested engineers interacting. And that's a very good thing.

dgmayor

02-17-10, 04:47 PM

Is there anyone out there with an 8300HD that is NOT experiencing reboot issues on 217? What is your software version?

I've watched way too much of the Olympics on 217 and no reboots here on my 8300HD.

jimholcomb

02-17-10, 08:02 PM

Is there anyone out there with an 8300HD that is NOT experiencing reboot issues on 217? What is your software version?

I have an 8300HD, version 2.4.6-19 and I'm not seeing any reboots and I usually watch 217 every night from 6pm to 7:30pm and of course all during the Olympics.

I did have the problem during the 2008 Olympics but not this time.

Jim

rollcage

02-17-10, 10:24 PM

I also have 2.4.6-19, but unfortunately still suffer the reboots. One just occurred as the lone Canadian was snowboarding on the halfpipe. Out of curiosity, does anyone without the reboots have an eSATA connected? Does anyone with the reboots have a stock DVR with no eSATA? I have an eSATA drive connected, as seen in my signature.

DonB2

02-18-10, 10:34 AM

Does anyone recall if the last Winter Olympics was broadcast in HD? I believe it was and I thought I recalled a lot of pixelization during parts of it. Not sure what channel it was on either.

All I know is NBC is doing a great Job with the Olympics. - They should get a Gold Medal :)

tarheelone

02-18-10, 10:52 AM

Lee L

02-18-10, 11:03 AM

thescotchzombie

02-18-10, 01:17 PM

JMN322

02-18-10, 03:30 PM

I had reboots three times last night watching the Olys on NBC HD with my 8300HD. I have had reboot problems with this unti before but never noted whether they were focused on this channel and longer events. Making sense though.

I'm not sure I understand why it was just NBC 217 that caused the 8300HD DVR to reboot, but I haven't suffered one reboot since the DVR was switched out on Monday to a 8340HDC. I had/have no eSata drives attached, just the HDMI connection to the TV, and it only happened on 217.

Crazy, isn't it?

rollcage

02-19-10, 02:37 PM

NBC17ENG

02-19-10, 03:18 PM

These reboots are infuriating. I tried the "clear cache" method sited in an earlier post during figure skating last evening and the DVR rebooted just minutes later.

NBC17ENG, could you facilitate discussion between TWC and those of us with this issue? Perhaps pass along a direct TWC contact, with their permission? Thanks!

Call their Customer Care line at 866-489-2669, or better yet your local billing center. Call them, but DO NOT use instant chat or email as you may be connected with an out-sourced data center with no clue what you are talking about. Call the local center and tell them about the problem and they should be able to help.

Don't overlook the fact that too low or too high signal strength will also make those boxes burp.

scsiraid

02-19-10, 03:29 PM

Call their Customer Care line at 866-489-2669, or better yet your local billing center. Call them, but DO NOT use instant chat or email as you may be connected with an out-sourced data center with no clue what you are talking about. Call the local center and tell them about the problem and they should be able to help.

Don't overlook the fact that too low or too high signal strength will also make those boxes burp.

Im watching 217 right now on an 8300HDC and it is breaking up like crazy. My TiVo S3 on 17-1 and 217 is perfect....

jimholcomb

02-19-10, 08:19 PM

Call their Customer Care line at 866-489-2669, or better yet your local billing center. Call them, but DO NOT use instant chat or email as you may be connected with an out-sourced data center with no clue what you are talking about. Call the local center and tell them about the problem and they should be able to help.

Don't overlook the fact that too low or too high signal strength will also make those boxes burp.

Good luck guys, but 2 years ago I finally had to file a complaint with the Better Business Bureau to get my reboot problem resolved. That and 8 box swaps ...

The fix was apparently signal related.

Jim

scsiraid

02-19-10, 08:38 PM

I heard thru the grapevine that the root issue with the rebooting was a non EIA compliant closed captioning stream from the source overflowing the box buffers causing a reboot. The new code for the 8300 was supposedly a patch to cope with the resulting buffer overflow.

HDMe2

02-19-10, 09:36 PM

I happily left cable way behind long ago when I moved into my new home. Sadly, I almost had cable here except they screwed themselves.

When I moved into the new neighborhood, and called to schedule a cable install... I was put on a waiting list and told it would be a month. I was going to accept that until a new neighbor told me they were told more of a wait than that... and it turned out Time Warner had never ran cable to this neighborhood AND had no plans to do so unless and until enough new owners signed on to that same waiting list... but meanwhile they weren't going to tell anyone that was what they were doing.

So I called and got a satellite install 2 days later! Been very happy ever since.

In my old home there was a long history of cable/signal problems that they would deny anyone else was reporting... until the intermittent problem became a complete neighborhood problem and forced them to fix it.

Sadly, based on talking to my father... it seems Time Warner hasn't changed much in the years since I left them behind.

pen15nv

02-19-10, 10:37 PM

Yep, Torino was in HD and I beleive Salt Lake in 2002 was also or at least parts of it.

I got my first HDTV just in time for the 2004 summer games, and the only HD from those games was a daily updated loop of stuff that had aired the previous day. There was no live HD coverage in 2004 (even the opening ceremonies were delayed a day) so I doubt there was any in 2002

drewwho

02-20-10, 08:32 AM

I got my first HDTV just in time for the 2004 summer games, and the only HD from those games was a daily updated loop of stuff that had aired the previous day. There was no live HD coverage in 2004 (even the opening ceremonies were delayed a day) so I doubt there was any in 2002

"An updated loop of stuff that aired the previous day" is essentially what all American networks always show for the Olympics. I grew up in Buffalo, near the Canadian boarder, and we'd always watch the Olympics on Canadian TV. They had multiple events live on multiple OTA channels, and not long Oprah-ish features about American athletes interspersed with taped coverage, and a rare live event (usually cut to only when an American or the event favorite is competing). I really miss being able to get Canadian TV..

NBC17 has come a long way from the 2004 Olympics. I remember watching the women's gymnastics in 2004 on NBC17 in HD. The macro-blocking was so bad that in many cases, the athlete looked like a moving swarm of pixels.

Drew