Veggas................

What is the status on the HDMI out on the 8300HD?

Is it operational here in Vegas?

(Thanks I did a search did not come up with anything other than the great news about the SARA upgrade capability)

HiHoStevo,
HDMI status on 8300??? It was working last December when I first got the unit, and I've periodically connected many other displays to it for testing with no problems. Of concern is the fact that it's HDCP enabled, so your DISPLAY AND CABLE PATH must be HDCP compliant. The use of repeaters, hubs, powered switches amplifiers, etc or anything in the path altering the HDCP handshake are NOT supported and rejected. The approved standard length of HDCP over copper cables is limited to 4 meters. Some have gone longer, but it's hit or miss if you will have handshake problems. Physical connectors, adaptors, or manual switches will reduce your total overall working length. YMMV
Also, as your display is turned off, it breaks the HDCP handshake so it's required to shut off the outputs until a connection is re-established and the handshake is re-negotiated between the two devices. IMO, HDMI is only slightly better than component if you have a purely Digital display device that is native to the resolution you are viewing, which would only be a 1280x720P panel viewing a 1280x720P signal. Any other panel size, viewing any other resolution will have to scale the image, and degradation (including blocking done by the scaler) will easily be seen. Analog CRT screens natively displaying 1080i, but having an HDMI connection are likely to convert the digital signal back to analog internally to feed the tubes, so Component connections should look better. YMMV depending on your display type.

fasteddielv,
Cox Las Vegas (purchased from the old PRIME system) uses SARA Headend equipment. SARA is directly compatible with Scientific Atlanta HD Stb's. For HD, the typical STB's in use are the SA3250 and the 8000HD, and 8300HD series DVR's. The 3100HD is obsolete, and there are a few Pioneer STB's floating around, but I have not seen any HD versions available here, since that would require an overlay and use of valuable memory.
The Harmony remote is a good choice for non-technical users in your household. Once setup, it easily walks you through getting where you want to go - As long as you can see and press the buttons. A few hotels use these remotes in some suites, and that is the only complaint about them. IMO, I prefer the Home Theater Master series of remotes for the look, feel and overall powerful features and almost unlimited macros. It just fits my hand better than the Harmony.

Taz, lakerstan,
Yes, UniversalHD and TNTHD are supposed to be launched on October 13th, according to the flyer with the cable bill - At least one of you guys read that junk mail ... :rolleyes: .

doormat,
I asked around about PSIP info, but never heard anything specific back. What I heard was that some of the stations are recieved via an Antenna, along with an OTA PSIP stream that can be modified in that same format and sent out over the cable lines for compatible tuners, wheras the others are recieved via fiber, and a new remapped channel stream is actually created that the STB's can read. Not sure what to make of that info, but it's all I got right now. Sounds plausible? The system was designed for STB's in mind, and the remapping getting through is probably never even considered, since there were no tuners (QAM) available to use that data when the channels were launched.

Whew! Anything else?
Been busy/preoccupied lately with ripple effects from Katrina.

vegggas

Thanks Veggas...............

I have read in other "display" threads about folks having difficulty with their SA8300's so I figured you would know the answer.

For my own situation right at the moment I need to use DTV, but I do have a DLP projector whose native display is 1280x720..., however I also have a Gefen 4x1 DVI switch in the path and it is all connected to a 40' DVI cable that runs to the projector... so it sounds like my chances of getting the 8300 to work in my setup are pretty slim... but it might be interesting to try!

I'm glad you edited that post. Because if you hadn't it would probably have made even less sense than it does.

Don't you mean "it's great for the very non-tech savvy"?

or perhaps;

"it's great for the not very tech savvy"?

A bit of advice "fast"eddie----don't be in such a hurry. :rolleyes:


I so glad your glad! :D

Requarding the Logitach Harmony 880 remote.

What I really ment was that after initial set-up it's great for those not so technically inclined.

So Word I'd stay away from it if I was you!

Eddie

Veggas, I not sure you understodd my question.

I'm refering to the cable system out at Lake Las Vegas. It's not in the COX system. They have their own. I was at a clients house and seen a Motorola Cable box. Unable to tell what it was without tearing apart the A/V equipment rack.

Thanks for they reply though.

Eddie

Veggas, I not sure you understodd my question.

I'm refering to the cable system out at Lake Las Vegas. It's not in the COX system. They have their own. I was at a clients house and seen a Motorola Cable box. Unable to tell what it was without tearing apart the A/V equipment rack.

Thanks for they reply though.

Eddie

Ooops, I did misunderstand your question. I thought you were referring to "The Lakes of Las Vegas" development on the West side, but now I see you meant "Lake Las Vegas" East of town.
They have a satellite delivered and Fiber to the home deployed cable system, modem, phone and security services from a division of Eagle Broadband near Houston, Texas. I was actually at their Texas Headend on an unrelated engineering re-development project a few months ago and noticed the name and community and quizzed a tech about it. Not sure which exact recievers are in use, but there were a few variations scattered around the facility. If you really want specifics, I can call up my contact and ask around, but I think it's all SD content and bundled services. The Lake Las Vegas system is a small private network with hopes of expanding toward Henderson, but nobody has put up the capital to build another headend, or another sat substation then run fiber to dedicated developments. Without the capitol and potential large sum of customers, the venture will probably never expand beyond it's current limitations within Lake Las Vegas, so growth would probably be stagnant.

vegggas

I wonder if Cox would consider broadcasting the USA feed of the US Open on an HD channel. Tennis is really a great app for HD. It is almost a shame to watch it on SD USA.....

Universal HD is simulcasting the US Open. Won't get the channel until October 13th.

That Agassi/Blake match last night was simply awesome. I got to see most of it on Universal HD on my D* system, but they cut to regular programming before the match was over and I had to watch the rest of the 5th set on crappy USA. The USA feed from D* was showing other programming , but the Cox feed had the tennis match. The pic was almost unwatchable, compared to the HD pic. Anyway,, congrats to Andre...what an effort he gave after being down 2 sets to start. Hopefully he still has gas in his tank for the semis.

I agree, although I was bitter I had to watch it in SD, it was one for the ages. After he was down a break in the 5th set, I thought we were seeing the end of the era.


That Agassi/Blake match last night was simply awesome. I got to see most of it on Universal HD on my D* system, but they cut to regular programming before the match was over and I had to watch the rest of the 5th set on crappy USA. The USA feed from D* was showing other programming , but the Cox feed had the tennis match. The pic was almost unwatchable, compared to the HD pic. Anyway,, congrats to Andre...what an effort he gave after being down 2 sets to start. Hopefully he still has gas in his tank for the semis.

October 13th for UniversalHD and TNTHD
While I know most people in this thread are focused on HD content, I really hope at the same time Cox makes these alterations that they finally get the long-rumored improved VOD system online. So many other major and not-so-major cities get SVOD and Vegas is limited to the old PPV/Premium content.

While I know most people in this thread are focused on HD content, I really hope at the same time Cox makes these alterations that they finally get the long-rumored improved VOD system online. So many other major and not-so-major cities get SVOD and Vegas is limited to the old PPV/Premium content.
Huh?
I watch SVOD all the time. I especially like the HBO and SHO originals, and I will try out a sCinemax title once in a while since it can be fast forwarded :o .
HDVOD is on the horizon, but they need to get more fiber nodes in place to fulfill the bandwidth requirements first. There are a lot of older neighborhoods still using line extenders and multiple cascaded amps to reach distant runs. As fiber is laid down, new nodes can be installed and the content can be streamed to them, while serving a smaller customer base.
i.e. an old node area may have served 5,000 homes, wheras that area could be broken down with the installation of more fiber to 5 nodes feeding the same area, each with only 1000 customers. With the increased coverage, more users can use the services at the same time, and at higher data rates, such as HD streams.
One of the issues involving rollout is the fact that the construction crews are so heavily involved with new developments extending outward, that the inner core of the city is left with having to tear up roads and property to lay fiber, which takes a lot more money, time, and permits.
Damn, I rambled on again...
vegggas

Welcome Winston.............

The following list is from Dogpile.com

NV KVVU 5 Henderson/Las Vegas 9
NV KVBC 3 Las Vegas 2
NV KLAS 8 Las Vegas 7
NV KLVX 10 Las Vegas 11
NV KINC 15 Las Vegas 16
NV KVWB 21 Las Vegas 23
NV KFBT 33 Las Vegas 29
NV KBLR 39 Paradise/Las Vegas 40

This list is from Antennaweb.com

* yellow - vhf KTNV-DT 13.1 ABC LAS VEGAS NV 60° 2.9 12
* yellow - vhf KLAS-DT 8.1 CBS LAS VEGAS NV 60° 2.8 7
* yellow - uhf KINC-DT 16.1 UNI LAS VEGAS NV 59° 2.8 16
* red - vhf KLVX-DT 10.1 PBS LAS VEGAS NV 29° 6.9 11
* red - vhf KVBC-DT 3.1 NBC LAS VEGAS NV 29° 7.0 2
* blue - vhf KVVU-DT 5.1 FOX Henderson / Las Vegas NV 33° 6.8 9
* violet - uhf KBLR-DT 40.1 TEL PARADISE NV 29° 7.1 40


There may be a better list elsewhere.

I am curious as to what can be received over in the Anthem area... I am moving over there and have heard a rumor that a number of the digital signals "skip" over that area... I wonder if they can be picked up with a large Yagi section as they bounce off the mountains to the west?

Hello to the group. I have a question. I live in the area of 215 and Sunset (near Southern Hills Hospital) and cannot seem to get NBC OTA. I have tried two different OTA receivers and a couple of different attennas. I can't even sniff a signal let alone get something strong enough to watch. Is this just a dead spot for NBC or do I have some strange curse that forbids me from watching this channel. If anyone else is from the area and can confirm or refute this, please let me know. I unfortunately do enjoy some of the programming on NBC and would really like to be able to watch it. If someone else has an attenna that works, I'd be willing to go buy a new one.

Thanks.

Channel 3 comes in on ch. 2 frequency. This is the lowest frequency on the TV spectrum. The lower the frequency, the longer the wavelength. You will have the best luck with a conventional outdoor antenna. Indoor or rabbit ears are not going to work. I tried the Squareshooter antenna in your area, and it did poorly. Get an outdoor 35mile + antenna on a tall mast pointed at Black Mt. in Henderson and you should do fine.

Channel 3 comes in on ch. 2 frequency. This is the lowest frequency on the TV spectrum. The lower the frequency, the longer the wavelength. You will have the best luck with a conventional outdoor antenna. Indoor or rabbit ears are not going to work. I tried the Squareshooter antenna in your area, and it did poorly. Get an outdoor 35mile + antenna on a tall mast pointed at Black Mt. in Henderson and you should do fine.

Was trying to avoid an outdoor antenna if possible. Guess that's why I've failed thus far. I guess I need to go buy some supplies and try this one weekend. Thanks for the advice. If anyone else has found an indoor solution in the area, please post. I probably won't get around to an outdoor antenna for at least two weeks.

I have been 'renting' my 8300HD and 3250 from cox for a year or so now and have found one (8300) for sale through a friend from another state. Will it work with Cox here in Vegas if I get it activated? If not, are there some that will work here and how can I tell.
Thanks in advance.

I have been 'renting' my 8300HD and 3250 from cox for a year or so now and have found one (8300) for sale through a friend from another state. Will it work with Cox here in Vegas if I get it activated? If not, are there some that will work here and how can I tell.
Thanks in advance.
NO! DO NOT BUY IT!
STB authorization codes are sent to the Cable Co from the manufacturer. If your authorization code is not on the system, it will be a brick. This also prevents theft of devices, modifications and sales outside of market. Nearly all cable STB's in the US are leased only. A test program was set up so that a few markets could purchase them (before widespread rollouts) to offset the initial cost to cable co's, but those were rescinded back to leased status later in their home markets only.
Canadian STB's can be purchased, but the authorization codes will not work in he US.
AFAIK, the only cable DVR you can buy for digital services is the Sony CableCard unit. I do not reccomend that unit at this time, but others may like it. Read their specific forum about it's success/failure rate.

vegggas

The color on the local ABC affiliate looks washed out/paler than all the other channels both through the SA8300 and a direct cable input. My wife asked me if I changed the TV's color settings, which I hadn't. The other channels are fine.

please ignore last message...someone must have hit a switch.. all colors seem normal now on ABC/13

Any comments on last night's MNF game on ABC? HD crapped out on Cox 732 around halftime and never came back. Had the ugly 480p stretch-o-view the rest of the night..........was wondering if it was network or local problem? Vegggas????

Any comments on last night's MNF game on ABC? HD crapped out on Cox 732 around halftime and never came back. Had the ugly 480p stretch-o-view the rest of the night..........was wondering if it was network or local problem? Vegggas????
Check the main thread - It was a national problem. Many Local broadcasters decided to cut the HD feed entirely and leave it in SD mode to avoid problems.
Remember, Cox retransmits whatever the local channel is broadcasting - They do not modify or alter the signal.
vegggas

Thanks, I pretty much figured it wasn't Cox's fault. ABC for some reason has more problems with HD transmissions than other networks; I've seen HD dropped on Lost and Alias more than once....

I think ESPN only showed SD highlights of last nights game. Still can't figure out why Channel 13 refuses to drop the stretch-o-vision.

I think ESPN only showed SD highlights of last nights game. Still can't figure out why Channel 13 refuses to drop the stretch-o-vision.
I agree - I can't stand the Stretch-O-Vision either.
Maybe we should start contacting them and letting them know how we feel????

From the KTNV WEBSITE -CONTACT US WEBPAGE (http://www.ktnv.com/contactus/)
You can send your comments or questions directly to 13 Action News. We want to make our station better for you, so drop us an e-mail today.

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Community Calendar - communitycalendar@ktnv.com
Or write to us at 3355 S. Valley View Blvd. Las Vegas, NV 89102

vegggas

Which person should we send it to?

Huh?
I watch SVOD all the time. I especially like the HBO and SHO originals, and I will try out a sCinemax title once in a while since it can be fast forwarded :o .
Veggas, I was talking about the full SVOD package that other cities get, beyond the premium movie networks.

A number of Cox areas get subscription VOD "networks," currently consisting of Anime Network, a Pro Wrestling channel, and a GLBT channel. While Anime is the only one of those three that interests me, it's expected this kind of service will expand over time.

Here's an HDTV problem that I suspect is quite common., but differs in its severity, therefore is not always addressed by the owner of the TV.

I have a 55" Mitsubishi DLP. Picture clariy , definition, color, etc are all FINE. BUT......

When watching a letterboxed broadcast or DVD, I notice that the width of the black border at the top is not uniform, It is wider on the left side of the screen than it is on the right side by about 1". On the black border at the bottom, it's narrower on the left side of the screen than it is on the right side, (by about the same 1"). This has the effect of making the picture slope upwards as one scans it from left to right. Even text in the center of the picture has that same tilt. I'm sure the adjustment is quite simple., but the set is out of Warranty by about 4 days, and I don't want to be extorted to have it fixed. The problem existed from day one of my ownership. But I ignored it because I was "in thrall" of the beauty of a full screen picture.

Have any of you encountered a similar problem? And if you have, how did you solve or fix it?

WORD...You can find boatloads of info on your set in the RPCRT forum...good luck ..the answers you search for lie in various service menu adjustments, but not for the faint of heart.

I cancelled my basic analog service, but still use Cox's cablemodem service. If I'm not mistaken, they've installed some kind of filter outside to block their precious analog feed, yet still allow the cable Internet service through. If I hook up a tuner, can I still get unencrypted QAM channels, or will those be blocked also?

Here's an HDTV problem that I suspect is quite common., but differs in its severity, therefore is not always addressed by the owner of the TV.

I have a 55" Mitsubishi DLP. Picture clariy , definition, color, etc are all FINE. BUT......

When watching a letterboxed broadcast or DVD, I notice that the width of the black border at the top is not uniform, It is wider on the left side of the screen than it is on the right side by about 1". On the black border at the bottom, it's narrower on the left side of the screen than it is on the right side, (by about the same 1"). This has the effect of making the picture slope upwards as one scans it from left to right. Even text in the center of the picture has that same tilt. I'm sure the adjustment is quite simple., but the set is out of Warranty by about 4 days, and I don't want to be extorted to have it fixed. The problem existed from day one of my ownership. But I ignored it because I was "in thrall" of the beauty of a full screen picture.

Have any of you encountered a similar problem? And if you have, how did you solve or fix it?


There should be a "picture tilt" setting in one of the menus of your TV. If you cannot find it, its probably hidden in the service menu. Do a search on the model number of your TV with the words "service menu" to find out how you can access this on your set. The tilt setting is in my normal settings menu on my TV and is a breeze to correct. YMMV.

Bah! Cox moved around all their digital channels now - I have to surf 100 digital channnels - and I cant even find the HD channels! I see Fox HD, but no CBS, ABC, NBC or PBS high-def. If you can give me channel #s for the HD networks I'd appreciate it. ** the QAM channel #s, not the ones mapped on the STB) **

Bah! Cox moved around all their digital channels now - I have to surf 100 digital channnels - and I cant even find the HD channels! I see Fox HD, but no CBS, ABC, NBC or PBS high-def. If you can give me channel #s for the HD networks I'd appreciate it. ** the QAM channel #s, not the ones mapped on the STB) **
I can't use the search again to find the old frequencies, so I just scanned them with my STB. If I remember correctly, it looks like Cox is moving things around again and the frequencies are different. This is a good thing, because this happens right before a new channel launch, so maybe we are getting things earlier???
This will happen from time to time as bandwidth is juggled around, and two way tuners will get the new data for remapping channels automatically. Try rescanning again.

The new current scan reveals the following frequencies for the local HD channels.
Cox Channel 730 - CBS - is at frequency 669MHz - Freq chart says - 103
Cox Channel 731 - PBS - is at frequency 669MHz - Freq chart says - 103
Cox Channel 732 - ABC - is at frequency 663MHz - Freq chart says - 102
Cox Channel 733 - NBC - is at frequency 663MHz - Freq chart says - 102
Cox Channel 735 - FOX - is at frequency 723MHz - Freq chart says - 112
Cable Frequency charts are available with a google search.
Here is an example of a Frequency Chart (http://www.tinlee.com/FreqChart.htm)

vegggas

hmmm i'm getting no signal on 102 and 103 according to my tv. I hope this thing aint broke...

rescanned again, nothing on 102/103... ch 112 goes to 5-1 so I know that works...

Search now works, so I looked up my last information post. This post in August (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=5973288&&#post5973288) Shows the same information I just scanned and reported here. It looks like no changes have been made.
Hmmm, strange... Anyone else with a QAM tuner still able to see the locals to confirm they are still available, or if Doormat is having a problem with his set?
There IS a chance that the channels are being moved around on you local node for some reason, but that's not very common, since it's usually a global change.

vegggas

Thinking about getting the 8300HD DVR....does the digital optical work?.....I want to hook it up to my home theatre

Search now works, so I looked up my last information post. This post in August (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=5973288&&#post5973288) Shows the same information I just scanned and reported here. It looks like no changes have been made.
Hmmm, strange... Anyone else with a QAM tuner still able to see the locals to confirm they are still available, or if Doormat is having a problem with his set?
There IS a chance that the channels are being moved around on you local node for some reason, but that's not very common, since it's usually a global change.

vegggas


Here are my current QAM HD channels:

PBS 11-1 (103 renamed)
CBS 8-1 (103 renamed)
NBC 102-3
ABC 102-5
FOX 5-1 (112 renamed)

I have also picked up a new signal for 93-4 but haven't had it tuned long enough yet to figure out what channel is actually is. might be ppv or one of the new ones coming. If I remember right, I was able to pick up the NFL network channel about a month before Cox added it to the Box lineup.

finally got to see what 93-4 is...HBO family. must be unencrypted. mabey a free preview weekend for non-subscribers?

Doormat, Looks like GVC is getting the channels, so you should look into rescanning again.

Taz, the 8300 (AFAIK) does have optical out for all channels.

vegggas

Go figure, I turned on the TV this afternoon, punch in 102 on the remote, and let it sit for 10 seconds and then it magically starts to pick up the stations on 102. 103 works the same way. I dunno what is going on with my TV...

finally got to see what 93-4 is...HBO family. must be unencrypted. mabey a free preview weekend for non-subscribers?
Was Star Trek: The Motion Picture on that channel friday night? ;)

tazlv,

Yes, it has the digital audio out and the optical audio out.

There should be a "picture tilt" setting in one of the menus of your TV. If you cannot find it, its probably hidden in the service menu. Do a search on the model number of your TV with the words "service menu" to find out how you can access this on your set. The tilt setting is in my normal settings menu on my TV and is a breeze to correct. YMMV.

Well, that setting may be there, but its not accessible by the owner/user. Mitsubishi has "coded" the access to those service menus and only an authorized technician can access them.

However, Mitsubishi has acted very professionaly in this matter. I contacted their Customer Service (and unlike my dealings with Cox) I got immediate satisfaction. Even though the TV was about 1 week late in its warranty coverage, Mitsubishi chose to honor that warranty (said they do so for about 30 days after expiration of actual warranty). At no cost to me, they arranged with a local (in LV) electronics technician to repair the problem. I spoke to them on the phone and they said this was a very common problem, with an easy fix. I also asked about "calibration" of the set (you know that thing that Greg Loewens does), They said they handle that as well.. As much as I appreciate Mr. Loewens efforts, it's always better to deal with a local service company than someone almost 3000 miles away. And indeed. it WAS Mr. Loewens that suggested that I contact Mitsubishi directly and that they would probably honor the warranty. So I thank him for that.

The service technician will be here Wednesday.

I wouldn't trust a local tech to perform an in-depth greyscale calibration. He will probably only adjust contrast, brightness, color, and tint controls. One thing you can ask the tech is if he has ever heard of ISF (Imaging Science Foundation teaches the basic principles of calibrating video monitors). ALso, see if he knows anything about:

# Mechanical disconnection of SVM circuit
# Image centering
# Minimization of overscan
# Correction of major geometry errors
# Convergence touch up of all NTSC modes
# Electronic focus adjustments
# Mechanical focus adjustments
# Cleaning of optics
# Grayscale adjustment to 6500 D Kelvin
# Centering of front panel controls when ever possible
# Adjustment of front panel controls from within the service menu
# Color decoder adjustment where possible, either via service menu adjustment, EEPROM Reflashing (I2C Fix), or installation of a red push attenuator.
# Lens striping, when required, to achieve a color temperature variation of less than 500 Kelvin.

Gregg Loewen didn't do my TV (Eliab from http://www.avical.com/ did my Panny). There is a reason why these folks are so sought after and people are willing to fly them in to calibrate their TVs. They are true professionals. The local tech is probably making $10 an hour and will probably follow verbatim the "manual".

But with that said, you need to decide for yourself whether or not it is worth it. For me, it made a remarkable difference in the quality of the picture.






Well, that setting may be there, but its not accessible by the owner/user. Mitsubishi has "coded" the access to those service menus and only an authorized technician can access them.

However, Mitsubishi has acted very professionaly in this matter. I contacted their Customer Service (and unlike my dealings with Cox) I got immediate satisfaction. Even though the TV was about 1 week late in its warranty coverage, Mitsubishi chose to honor that warranty (said they do so for about 30 days after expiration of actual warranty). At no cost to me, they arranged with a local (in LV) electronics technician to repair the problem. I spoke to them on the phone and they said this was a very common problem, with an easy fix. I also asked about "calibration" of the set (you know that thing that Greg Loewens does), They said they handle that as well.. As much as I appreciate Mr. Loewens efforts, it's always better to deal with a local service company than someone almost 3000 miles away. And indeed. it WAS Mr. Loewens that suggested that I contact Mitsubishi directly and that they would probably honor the warranty. So I thank him for that.

The service technician will be here Wednesday.

I noticed that the IPG does not show the scheduled (ALL-NEW) NBC recordings in RED for the entire week. This was confirmed on both my 8300 and 8000 DVR units. I asked around other cities, and this appears to be a local issue with the IPG. The scheduled recordings list and actually highlighting the timeslot for scheduled shows that it is set to record, but they do not stay highlighted in RED.
Not sure if this is going to be a problem or not, but wanted to give everyone a heads up on the situation. If you have any recordings tonight, check them as early as possible...

vegggas

EDIT: After posting, I checked again, and now, after a few hours, everything looks normal again - False alarm??
v

I recently got a 32in LCD with a DVI input. The difference with the HDMI-DVI cable from component is night and day. However, because there is no overscan with the DVI I notice an incredibly distracting vertical green bar on the right edge when watching any ABC-HD programming on KTNV (OTA with a DirectTV H10). I've gone through and centered the picture so there are no artifacts on any other HD channel. It's not the source because the Saints-Giants game looked fine once coverage switched to ESPN-HD.

How many other people see this problem?

Just to clarify, the above listed channels are digital channels and not all are HD.
The only HD channels are:
NV KVBC 3 Las Vegas 2 NBC
NV KVVU 5 Las Vegas 9 FOX
NV KLAS 8 Las Vegas 7 CBS
NV KLVX 10 Las Vegas 11 PBS
NV KTNV 13 Las Vegas 12 ABC

Sometimes, WB offers HD programming, but it's been very inconsistant and hard to pick up - YMMV -
NV KVWB 21 Las Vegas 23 WB

Except for the WB, all local HD channels are available free via Cox cable (as a paid sub) if you have a QAM tuner. If not, an HD- STB can be rented.

vegggas

Now that the new tv season is starting I don't think KVWB deserves the inconsistent label. The problems with sound and missed hd switches have lessened. In the last three houses I've lived in the valley (NW, central, and now SW) I've never had the trouble picking up 21-1 OTA (btw I'm pretty sure the frequence is 22 not 23), but KVBC on 3-1 frequency 2 has always been the one that's troubled me.

Obviously if I could subscribe to Cox it wouldn't be an issue, but the last I called before I gave up and called DirectTV they said they wouldn't have service in Mountain's Edge for 6 months. That seems totally ridiculous considering it's a huge masterplanned community that they've known was coming for years. If Cox doesn't get their act together with new construction the home builders might as well preinstall the dish since within 2 weeks of moving in every single home will have one anyways.

I recently got a 32in LCD with a DVI input. The difference with the HDMI-DVI cable from component is night and day. However, because there is no overscan with the DVI I notice an incredibly distracting vertical green bar on the right edge when watching any ABC-HD programming on KTNV (OTA with a DirectTV H10). I've gone through and centered the picture so there are no artifacts on any other HD channel. It's not the source because the Saints-Giants game looked fine once coverage switched to ESPN-HD.

How many other people see this problem?

George..I do not see this problem on my set. I am using HDMI to HDMI from the H10 to my RPCRT set. But in my limited pic testing, I find the component hookup a bit brighter than the HDMI hookup from the H10 receiver. The HDMI signal just looks a bit dingy or dimmer to me. But, then again, I am also used to Cox's signal which is much better than with D*, IMHO.

George..I do not see this problem on my set. I am using HDMI to HDMI from the H10 to my RPCRT set. But in my limited pic testing, I find the component hookup a bit brighter than the HDMI hookup from the H10 receiver. The HDMI signal just looks a bit dingy or dimmer to me. But, then again, I am also used to Cox's signal which is much better than with D*, IMHO.

gvc, I don't expect it to show up on any crt or projection set since those types of displays will always have overscan from any input. I'm not suprised the component signal is brighter since they tv ought to have a seperate set of calibrations for each input if it's worth it's salt. For my set I had to adjust the contrast/brightness and turn down the red gain on each analog input to get the best picture. For me, using component in at hd resolutions showed many ringing artifacts and a slight rolling wave. Perhaps $$$ monster cables and power supplies could make the analog inteference unnoticiable, but a HDMI-DVI cable from Wal-mart is a much cheaper way to accomplish the same thing.

As far as Cox having a better signal, it's not relevant for the broadcast networks which come from the OTA tuner unless Cox further compresses them, so there is a common benchmark on those channels. And with all the run around I got from Cox, I wouldn't be suprised if DirectTV has their new satellites with the capacity for 500 HD channels up and running before they wire up Mountains Edge.

OK GeorgeLV, I'll Bite!
Ummm... Mountains Edge does have Cox cable service. It has been there for quite some time. I know a few people who live out there and have helped them set up their HD displays and STB's - For the last SUPERBOWL!
If your particular subdivision does not have service, I would probably ask the developer if they trenched in the lines to your neighborhood yet.

How is WB programming lately? I gave up a while ago. Too many dropouts and nothing ever actually available in HD. According to FREDFA's post in the weekly HOT OFF THE PRESS (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=4278280&&#post4278280) there looks to be about 9 hours of HD programming a week from the national network. How much programming does our local station provide, and is it working yet? The last I checked (6 months ago?), they were still selling about 1/3 of their OTA bandwidth to USDTV and it was crippling their local signal bitrate down to less than 12Mbs for both their HD and SD signals combined.

The green line you see on ABC is the result of not having overscan on your display, AND the fact that they stretch their SD image. KTNV's local studio equipment is SD, with SD graphics and overlays. You will also see this during the CBS news and other channels local programming. Very common to see the Closed Captioning information (line 21 of the video) across the top of the image on many channels too.

vegggas

OK GeorgeLV, I'll Bite!
Ummm... Mountains Edge does have Cox cable service. It has been there for quite some time. I know a few people who live out there and have helped them set up their HD displays and STB's - For the last SUPERBOWL!
If your particular subdivision does not have service, I would probably ask the developer if they trenched in the lines to your neighborhood yet.

How is WB programming lately? I gave up a while ago. Too many dropouts and nothing ever actually available in HD. According to FREDFA's post in the weekly HOT OFF THE PRESS (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=4278280&&#post4278280) there looks to be about 9 hours of HD programming a week from the national network. How much programming does our local station provide, and is it working yet? The last I checked (6 months ago?), they were still selling about 1/3 of their OTA bandwidth to USDTV and it was crippling their local signal bitrate down to less than 12Mbs for both their HD and SD signals combined.

The green line you see on ABC is the result of not having overscan on your display, AND the fact that they stretch their SD image. KTNV's local studio equipment is SD, with SD graphics and overlays. You will also see this during the CBS news and other channels local programming. Very common to see the Closed Captioning information (line 21 of the video) across the top of the image on many channels too.

vegggas

vegggas, Meritage has said many times they have done all their wiring for Sprint and Cox but they companies haven't connected up yet. Whichever one of those gets in first will get my money for broadband internet service.

The WB has about as much primetime HD programming as Fox (and for that matter ABC and NBC considering all their SD reality shows). Also they pass HD on the early Sunday catchup airings. The picture isn't as good as full bandwidth channels, but I'd say it's better than the usual local PBS-HD picture quality. I watch Gilmore Girls and am giving Supernatural a try. And before the storylines went entirely to hell I tried to like Smallville. So for me the WB-HDlite signal is well worth receiving. (Which my DirectTV H10 reciever can seemingly do with a coat hanger as it shows very high signal strength with a $10 pair of Wal-mart bunny ears)

Yeah, I get the closed captioned lines on SD programming, so I switch to an analog input which the tv will overscan enough to remove. KTNV-DT is the only channel that has an incredibly distracting green line at the edge of their signal when passing HD network programming. I wish they would fill their 5-10 wide pixels of unused area with black like every single other channel (but then again they won't listen to complaints about stretch-o-vision either). BTW, the green line only shows up when they pass network programming, but I'm fairly certain it is a local issue with thier HD encoder as the MNF double-header gave me an opportunity to view the exact same feed as it passed from ABC to ESPN-HD.

vegggas, Meritage has said many times they have done all their wiring for Sprint and Cox but they companies haven't connected up yet. Whichever one of those gets in first will get my money for broadband internet service.

I've been round and round with Sprint many times throughout the years here in Vegas, and don't like them. If neither they nor Cox can get service to you, it sounds suspect on the side of the builder or master planner and not either of them. I'm willing to bet there is a demarcation point for both companies, and there may be a development between them and you that is not yet complete. This is the main reason of phases of development. Companies can't lay fiber in areas that are going to be torn up for construction, so it has to be planned to be layed in stages.

The WB has about as much primetime HD programming as Fox (and for that matter ABC and NBC considering all their SD reality shows). Also they pass HD on the early Sunday catchup airings. The picture isn't as good as full bandwidth channels, but I'd say it's better than the usual local PBS-HD picture quality. I watch Gilmore Girls and am giving Supernatural a try. And before the storylines went entirely to hell I tried to like Smallville. So for me the WB-HDlite signal is well worth receiving. (Which my DirectTV H10 reciever can seemingly do with a coat hanger as it shows very high signal strength with a $10 pair of Wal-mart bunny ears).
Are they actually passing an HD picture for those programs, or is it just a digital 480P picture? PBS shows a lot of upconverted shows on the national loop, and typically 480i signals on the local loop (someone correct me if I'm wrong - I don't watch a lot of PBS) so quality varies with programming. I've pretty much retired my OTA reciever over the last 6 months, so I've not had the opportunity to scan the local area signals lately. There are numerous digital channels, but only the few listed were broadcasting HD signals. The WB HD programming was not stable, nor did it look good, so it was passed over in my synopsis. I also added that Your Milage May Vary, depending on your tastes and HD threshold.

vegggas

KVWB does pass the 1080i HD signal from the network. It might macroblock a bit more often than full bandwidth channels, but it is HD resolution. (btw, I think KVBC transmission of NBC HD has the worst macroblocking problem--would be nice if they turned off the weather subchannel when passing HD)

So how can I tell what each station is broadcasting in? I have the HD Tivo, is there a way to tell on there? Thanks.

So how can I tell what each station is broadcasting in? I have the HD Tivo, is there a way to tell on there? Thanks.

If you set the output to native the resolution light on the receiver will say if it's anything like the H10. However, since native mode increases the time to switch between channels on most tvs when the resolution changes (I personally set my reciever to only output 720p since that's what looks best on my lcd) I'll just tell.

KVBC 3.1 NBC HD 1080i
KVBC 3.2 NBC WX 480i
KVVU 5.1 Fox HD 720p
KVVU 5.2 Fox 5 Weather 480i
KLAS 8.1 CBS HD 1080i
KLVX 10.1 PBS HD 1080i
KLVX 10.2 PBS SD 480i
KTNV 13.1 ABC HD 720p
KTNV 13.2 ABC SD 480i
KINC 15.1 Univision 480i
KELV 15.2 Telefutura 480i
KVWB 21.1 WB HD 1080i
KFBT 33.1 Gold 33 480i
KBLR 39.1 Telemundo 480i

KTUD 25 UPN and KHDF 19 Azteca are not yet broadcast digitally in Las Vegas.
-edit, I think we have a PAX affialiate too, but I don't know the call letters and number since it's not sent in the DirectTV locals

Among subscription HD channels ESPN HD and ESPN2 HD send 720p and all others currently are 1080i. Fox will be launching FOXHD and National Geographic HD at 720p, however.

So for me the WB-HDlite signal is well worth receiving. (Which my DirectTV H10 reciever can seemingly do with a coat hanger as it shows very high signal strength with a $10 pair of Wal-mart bunny ears)
.

Even though I don't need the locals through D* since I am getting them through Cox, out of curiosity, I tried to hook up one of those "coat hanger" antennas to my H10, but could only get a signal on a couple of channels. The receiver kept "searching for the signal" on all the others. I probably need one of those amplified antennas to get the signals strength up.

I spoke to Gregg Loewen yesterday and he's planning a trip back around October 12. If you're interested in getting your set calibrated, you can contact him through his lionav.com website.

gvc, what you can do is go into the setup screen and play with the antenna signal meter. With bunny ears you need to play with the orientation a bit if you can't fully extend the dipoles horizontally in the direction of black mountain. Also play with the fine tuning dial if your set has them (I don't recommend the ones with the amplifier built in, they kill digital signals.) After about five minutes I was able to get the pair in my bedroom to pick up all the channels reliably. (i.e. people walking around won't cause an errors).

I've kept up with this forum, so I know that many of you guys have multiple systems for your HDTV. I've got a buddy who is moving to Pahrump and, since there is no cable at his new house, he's trying to decide between Direct TV and Dish. He's leaning toward Dish because of the free tuners/DVRs they offer with the package. So...what's the deal, should he go with Dish because of the better deal, or is Direct TV worth the initial investment.

So you know, he's interested in quality HD programming and he knows that he can only get the NFL Ticket on Direct TV.

Before you bust my chops for asking this in the wrong forum, allow your ego to be stoked by the fact that I know that you guys know your stuff in this forum, so I chose to ask this here (even if it is not the "most" appropriate thread).

Thanks in advance,

Joe

I've kept up with this forum, so I know that many of you guys have multiple systems for your HDTV. I've got a buddy who is moving to Pahrump and, since there is no cable at his new house, he's trying to decide between Direct TV and Dish. He's leaning toward Dish because of the free tuners/DVRs they offer with the package. So...what's the deal, should he go with Dish because of the better deal, or is Direct TV worth the initial investment.

So you know, he's interested in quality HD programming and he knows that he can only get the NFL Ticket on Direct TV.

Before you bust my chops for asking this in the wrong forum, allow your ego to be stoked by the fact that I know that you guys know your stuff in this forum, so I chose to ask this here (even if it is not the "most" appropriate thread).

Thanks in advance,

Joe

DirectTV carries more local channels (if you don't speak spanish then the main difference is that DirectTV has KTUD UPN 25 and Dish doesn't)

As far as HD programming goes:

DirectTV HD Pack: ESPNHD, ESPN2HD, Universal HD, Discovery HD Theater, HDNet, HDNet Movies

Dish HD Pack: ESPNHD, TNT-HD, Discovery HD Theater, HDNet, HDNet Movies

Both providers have HBO HD and Showtime HD with a subscription to those channels and have pay-per-view HD movies

DirectTV has Sunday Ticket Superfan
Dish has the 10 channel Voom HD pack

For sports fans I'd recommend DirectTV for the ESPN2HD and Sunday Ticket
Most forumers say Dish has better HD quality though

I have Directv and if I were him I would get Directv with the HD DVR. I don't know about the features of the Dish PVR but I really like the TiVo interface. Other than that you just have to figure out which service has the channels he wants to watch. Also remember that Directv has plans on doing local HD channels. While Vegas is not first on list that is something to remember in the future. I haven't heard what Dish's plans are in this area.

That's my .02

Awesome. Thanks George. I'll pass it on.

Joe

I have Directv and if I were him I would get Directv with the HD DVR. I don't know about the features of the Dish PVR but I really like the TiVo interface. Other than that you just have to figure out which service has the channels he wants to watch. Also remember that Directv has plans on doing local HD channels. While Vegas is not first on list that is something to remember in the future. I haven't heard what Dish's plans are in this area.

That's my .02

That reminds me that Dish's hardware, especially DVRs, have reputations for crashing more often that DirectTV and Digital Cable equipment. As far as the price goes once you get on with a CSR you should have no problem getting a basic DVR or HD box for free. I got a 4 room install including two HD recievers for basically free after all the credits I was offered. You will probably need to lay out some cash for an HD Tivo, but I think CSRs are allowed to discount it down to $99 in some situations.

Thanks to you too lvthunder.

George, pardon my ignorance, but what's a CSR?

Joe

Thanks to you too lvthunder.

George, pardon my ignorance, but what's a CSR?

Joe

Customer Service Representative

The Roy Jones Jr. fight this weekend is available in HD. No extra charge, of course, on Cable. D* may be charging $10 more for HD over SD, but I have not confirmed that myself.
Two more weeks until the addition of Universal-HD and TNT-HD... Anything worth watching (in HD) on those channels? I haven't been following those channels...

I never heard back from anyone at Cox regarding anything else happening in October for HD or extended services. I keep hearing that the phone service is being pushed the most, and that everything else is on the back burner. The good news is that for the phone service to work, the cable system has to be fault tolerant and more robust wherever it's launched.

vegggas

ABC - YOU SUCK!
No HD signal for LOST and No audio on the SD vesion!
Now I have to watch Mandy Patikin on CBS and DOWNLOAD an illegal copy of LOST for later viewing - without any advertising attached.
Thanks a bunch...

If anybody set their DVR to record LOST, there is NO data, so there is nothing recorded, if the recording started at all.

vegggas

EDIT: OK, so the audio thing was my fault and works on analog. In my rush to troubleshoot STB's and other devices, I pulled the Digital audio cable out of the reciever. Still, no HD signal at all sucks. The DVR(s)(8000 and 8300), indeed did not start recording the blank signal.

v

I Think its local, havent seen a picture on 732 for hours

Taz,
Thanks for the verification and report that there is no video for some time.
Looks like there is an SD digital signal on the sub-carrier, but nothing on the main channel.

vegggas

EDIT: It sounds like this will be down all night. I'm hearing KTNV has some problems that will take several hours to fix.
v

I am pi**ed! I was watching the Padre game and all excited to watch Lost at 10:00, when lo and behold, nothing! Do they replay Lost????


:mad: :mad: :mad:


Taz,
Thanks for the verification and report that there is no video for some time.
Looks like there is an SD digital signal on the sub-carrier, but nothing on the main channel.

vegggas

EDIT: It sounds like this will be down all night. I'm hearing KTNV has some problems that will take several hours to fix.
v

Last season they replayed on Saturdays.....they replayed this season's opener at 8:00 tonight...Maybe they will replay tonights episode next Wednesday at 8:00

We can hope for a replay next week, but it's doubtful. Saturday is replaying Invasion again... Maybe they will make an exception, but isn't that a network over a local decision? Checking the replay guide, there is only one episode next week at 9:00 called "Orientation". Tonights episode was called "Adrift".
I tried waching the SD digital version, but was too pre-occupied to follow too closely. Besides, I'm too used to seeing all the HD details and reading the main LOST post.
vegggas

The problem tonight was not ABC, but the ipeople at COX. The OTA broadcast worked fine for Lost, but the COX broadcast was a no go. 1 show a week is all that I "must" see in hd, and they dropped the ball.

The problem tonight was not ABC, but the ipeople at COX. The OTA broadcast worked fine for Lost, but the COX broadcast was a no go. 1 show a week is all that I "must" see in hd, and they dropped the ball.
Are you sure?
All I could pick up was the SD digital OTA signal. I couldn't find the HD signal anywhere (no PSIP data for HD channel). I do have a problematic original Sammy 150, but usually I can rescan for subchannels, although I was tearing through STB's looking for a signal...
Please advise. - Anyone watch the HD broadcast of Lost?
I'm finding some Washington state viewers had similar problems too (psip data corrupted = no channel lock)

vegggas

Veggas..........

I am using an HD-Tivo and my OTA was receiving LOST as I clicked through... sorry I did not stay long just clicking through as someone was leaving to look inside a "hatch" but it appeared to be in HD.... didn't happen to look at the audio receiver to see if it said Dolby Digital on the readout.

Come-on now. Don't act like little boys over the loss of Lost. As somebody on this forum is fond of saying to me "we can't always get what we want, when we want it"

If you wait about two years they'll ALL be released as DVDs.

Then you can watch them over and over again, to your hearts content.

I guess the only thing worse than losing Lost would be a loss of an NFL Football game.

And personally, I wish they'ld lose them all.

I called Cox last night around 9:10pm, the CSR said it was a network issue and 732 would be down until sometime today. So far he's right, 732 was not on this morning before I left for work. IMHO, without a doubt ABC and the local network broadcasts on 732 for the most part suck. Except for a few HD shows on weeknights and MNF, most everything else is in stretch-o-vision. CBS, NBC, and Fox have much better HD pictures, and of course, INHD and Discovery HD kicks butt.

For Vegggas,

TNT-HD has lots of movies, Law and Order, etc. and NBA basketball. I think Universal HD will have movies mostly.

The problem tonight was not ABC, but the ipeople at COX. The OTA broadcast worked fine for Lost, but the COX broadcast was a no go. 1 show a week is all that I "must" see in hd, and they dropped the ball.
No. All I use is OTA HD, it was down. ABC blows.

I was wondering when our ol' curmudgeon would pop up. The problem is that lost is a serial series with a story that runs the entire season. If you miss on episode, it is like skipping a chapter in a book.


Come-on now. Don't act like little boys over the loss of Lost. As somebody on this forum is fond of saying to me "we can't always get what we want, when we want it"

If you wait about two years they'll ALL be released as DVDs.

Then you can watch them over and over again, to your hearts content.

I guess the only thing worse than losing Lost would be a loss of an NFL Football game.

And personally, I wish they'ld lose them all.

I guess the only thing worse than losing Lost would be a loss of an NFL Football game.

And personally, I wish they'ld lose them all.


Well, I could say the same about your precious baseball games. :p


As far as ABC goes..the QAM tuner on my TV was showing the NBC HD feed on the channel that used to reserved for ABC HD, so 102-3 and 102-5 both were NBC HD. The same thing happed to me for FX channel on Tuesday night, but it wasnt network related. I had two shows set up to record at the same time, nip/tuck and Boston Legal. I had dozed off while watching the NFL channel. When I woke, the box had automatically switched to FX but there was absolutely no signal.. just a black screen. Boston Legal was recording ok.
I swithced over to the direct antenna input and FX was showing a signal with no problem. It was just the 8300 box that crapped out on that channel. It may be a bug related to having two recordings set up at the same time while watching a third channel. Dont know. The episode of Nip/Tuck was repeated at 11:00 so I was able to see the part that I had missed in the beginning, but there was still no signal on the 8300 until I rebooted.

The KTNV-ABC OTA signal for HD is still not working. I made a few calls this morning and found out they made some upgrades to their encoder system and blew out the PSIP info and lost the signal (maybe they were getting rid of stretch-o-vision?). I'm told that KTNV-ABC is working on the problem with the vendor this morning and should have a fix soon.

vegggas

GVC,
The FX channel was probably being moved around a bit (and converted to digital simulcast) and once your STB had the correct channel map (reboot) it was corrected. Currently, many channels are being simulcast digitally in different parts of the city. STB's get the remapping info during the night, but if the STB is in use, it will not get updated.
As for NBC on both QAM sub-channels, that was probably a byproduct of your QAM tuner not seeing any PSIP info, but having the channel in memory. If I had to guess, I would say that without the PSIP info, the tuner defaulted to the main channel for both subchannels (?).

vegggas

The Roy Jones Jr. fight this weekend is available in HD. No extra charge, of course, on Cable. D* may be charging $10 more for HD over SD, but I have not confirmed that myself.
Two more weeks until the addition of Universal-HD and TNT-HD... Anything worth watching (in HD) on those channels? I haven't been following those channels...

I never heard back from anyone at Cox regarding anything else happening in October for HD or extended services. I keep hearing that the phone service is being pushed the most, and that everything else is on the back burner. The good news is that for the phone service to work, the cable system has to be fault tolerant and more robust wherever it's launched.

vegggas

So when is Cox getting ESPN2HD? They seem to have more actual live sporting events than ESPNHD.

Mostly Universal HD has a zillion repeats of the Law & Order spinoffs and the District. However, every once and a while you get Monk and Battlestar Galactica and they provide the HD coverage for sports on the USA network.

TNT-HD has Nascar and I've heard complaints about stretch-o-vision, but since DirecTV doesn't carry this channel I don't really know too much about it.

I think only some Adelphia cable systems & D* carry ESPN2HD.......as far as I know no other cable system is carry it.

Here is one beef with the SA8000hd. Although my fault, I had three things set to record at 8:00. Alias, Survivor and the Padre game. Now, I completely forgot that Alias moved to Thursday night and tonight was the season premier. When I sat down to watch something at 9:00, I realized that Alias was on. Unfortunately, the 8000 decided to record the Padre game and Survivor. I wish it would issue a warning or something so you can catch this. I know when you initially try to do a "three-way" it will warn you, but when you have "season passes" set up, it apparently doesn't always give you a warning.

On another note, will they replay the Alias premier?

I watched Lost and Invasion on KTNV-HD OTA las night on a D*HD Tivo. And it was just fine. However on KLAS-HD CSI and Without a Trace tonight, had a bad audio stutter. I heard this problem a few nights ago. Did anyone else experience this? Again this was OTA. I have a question for Veggas: I don't know much about Cox. I do install TVs for Best Buy, and want to know why I can't find chs. 3-1, and 13-1 when I go direct cable on a quam tuner set. 5-1, 8-1 and 11-1 comes in fine. Thanks

There is no OTA PSIP information on those two channels for remapping to off air frequencies. They are either on QAM 103 or 106.
As for Lost last night - Are you SURE you were watching the 720P HD signal and not the 480 Digital signal? There was a report that the station OTA HD encoder was having problems until this afternoon. Not sure what exactly the problem was, but it affected OTA reception on most recievers and the vendor who did the upgrade yesterday was busy fixing it today.

Bad stuttter on CBS tonight. Unwatchable.

vegggas

Yes, I was watching 13-1 720p signal. I only have the primary HD channel programmed into my favorites list. As a matter of fact the shows are still on my Tivo! I watched perfectly clear 720p showing of Lost and Invasion off air.

As for Lost last night - Are you SURE you were watching the 720P HD signal and not the 480 Digital signal? There was a report that the station OTA HD encoder was having problems until this afternoon. Not sure what exactly the problem was, but it affected OTA reception on most recievers and the vendor who did the upgrade yesterday was busy fixing it today.

Bad stuttter on CBS tonight. Unwatchable.

vegggas

Sorry for the delay. My brother watched Lost OTA in HD. 100% sure. I called him at 8:30 to ask if his OTA feed worked, and it did. He uses a built in tuner in an Infocus 61md10.

CBS was horrid last night. It was like watching a dvd on a pentium II pc. Pure stutter...

Changing subjects-

Anyone attempt receiving OTA digitals in Boulder City (South end by the golf courses)? My folks live out there and he really wants those digital broadcasts without using Cox.

trevor_2k

I put up an off air antenna in the south end of Bouder City about a year ago for a D*customer. I pulled in every Digital signal from ch. 3 to 33 with full strength. I emailed Doug Kramer chief eng. at ch. 8 about the stutter. He replied to set my Scientific Atlanta box audio settings to normal to fix the problem. However I am not a Cox subscriber I use OTA with D*!

I watched both Lost and CSI and had no problems with either. I was watching OTA with a Terk indoor antenna.

Hmmm. Many strange things are afoot!
CBS definitely had stutter last night. On the COx STB's , I tried PCM and even analog outputs, but neither fixed the problem. Pulled out the OTA again, and was able to pull CBS and still had stutter there too. When I started changing the audio formats and used the analog out of the Samsung OTA, it cleared up.
On top of that, the KTNV-ABC problem appeared to be reciever specific too. Some are reporting that they could get it, while others, like myself, either could could only get the SD Digital signal or not pick it up at all. Looks like the HD-Tivo was error free though??? Weird.

vegggas

CBS - NUMBERS - Stuttering audio again.
My OTA STB is locking up on that channel now and I can't get it to playback anything once it hits that channel.
Getting stuttering and occasional freezes at the half hour mark with the three primary Cox HD STB types. The 8300DVR STOPPED recording and has no data after about 10 minutes. Pressing REW or Replay jumps back to the last bit of data saved.
Called my buddy who was working tonight and he told me Cox is aware of the issue and is notifying CBS.
Audio seems normal back at the 10:43 mark.
OTA reciever now no longer locking up on that channel and Audio and video are working fine. Whatever CBS did, it fixed the issue as soon as they were notified.

effseesee,
What tuner are you using that you didn't hear the stutter, and is it the HD channel? CSI started ok, but went bad as the show progressed. The SAME EXACT thing happened tonight with NUMBERS.

Overall, there appears to be a lot of problems this week, but they are flip-flopping between recievers and stations. Seems for the most part, only the HD-TIVO could pick up the ABC-HD feed, but is having problems with CBS audio stutter. A few people reported NO PROBLEMS with EITHER channels during the problem times, and I had problems with both channels with an old Samsung tuner.
I'm thinking (theorizing) that with ABC, the PSIP information was just gone, so any tuner trying to find the signal would not lock on. Tuners that had locked on earlier and retained that data stream, MAY have been able to lock the stream and display the programming.
For CBS, I'm thinking (again, theorizing) that the main digital audio carrier is having problems, but the secondary stereo audio is ok. Those recievers tuning the analog audio may not be seeing the problem, which is what I saw last night. Tonight, my OTA tuner was crapping out everytime I hit that channel, so I couldn't compare it again.

vegggas

I put up an off air antenna in the south end of Bouder City about a year ago for a D*customer. I pulled in every Digital signal from ch. 3 to 33 with full strength.

What type of antenna did you use? Roof mount, attic, or set top?

Audio Issue on FOX HD

Anyone else going crazy with the audio sync problems on Fox for the Yankee/Red Sox game?

I hope it's not my tv...

Go Sox!!!!

Joe

For Trevor_2k,, I used a rooftop 35mile + range outdoor antenna pointed toward Las Vegas. Actually, the customer already had it in place and it worked just fine.

Audio Issue on FOX HD

Anyone else going crazy with the audio sync problems on Fox for the Yankee/Red Sox game?
I hope it's not my tv...
Go Sox!!!!
Joe

Yes, it certainly was annoying. But since I know enough about baseball to understand what's going on without benefit of either Buck or McCarver, I simply turned the audio off.

I do know of a quick fix. Itworks, but I don't know why it does. If you momentarily switch to an SD (480i or 480p) transmission and then back to Fox-HD (735) the problem seems to fix itself.

Thanks Word, I'll try the channel change next time. It seemed to fix itself eventually.

My favorite part was when Joe and Tim announced A-Rod's base hit before he swung the bat.

Go Sox (and this time I mean both of them)!!!!

Joe

GVC,
The FX channel was probably being moved around a bit (and converted to digital simulcast) and once your STB had the correct channel map (reboot) it was corrected. Currently, many channels are being simulcast digitally in different parts of the city. STB's get the remapping info during the night, but if the STB is in use, it will not get updated.

I am in the southwest at Tropicana and Torrey Pines with the 8000. The only two-digit channels that come in digital form are 3, 5, 8 and 13. I confirmed that all others are analog by bringing up the "INFO" screen on the STB. I know that Cox is feeding many of the other basic cable channels in digital because I can get them in the clear on my HDTV QAM tuner card in my computer. I wonder why my STB isn't remapping to the digital version of these basic channels? Any ideas?

Full digital simulcast is not yet completed and not yet fully functional or in their permanent locations. Until those criteria are met, digital STB's will not be remapped due to failures that may occur with the remapping and loss of services. Local station remapping was done quite a while ago and is considered stable.
Also, I think that there has to be approval from each station that their signal is no longer being seen in it's analog form to digital subscribers. Carriage agreements are for analog carriage only and some dictate that they MUST be carried in analog form and be avaiable with no extra equipment. Agreements take a while to get approval and since there are probably over a dozen channels on a single QAM, it's likely that until all channels are cleared, they won't be turned on for simulcast.

vegggas

I was watching MNF and just under 8:00 minutes in the 1st quarter the hd came back on and it looked good.
The echo on CBS NUMBERS still drives me nuts. I was afraid it was my stuff. Then I thought it was the SA800HD from Cox. I was ready to call about getting a SA8300HD. Then I read here that it was a Cox problem.
What is better about the 8300 over the 8000? Should I switch it out?

I was watching MNF and just under 8:00 minutes in the 1st quarter the hd came back on and it looked good.
The echo on CBS NUMBERS still drives me nuts. I was afraid it was my stuff. Then I thought it was the SA800HD from Cox. I was ready to call about getting a SA8300HD. Then I read here that it was a Cox problem.
What is better about the 8300 over the 8000? Should I switch it out?

Missed MNF...
Numbers and stuttering audio problem was a problem with the encoders recieving the national feed from CBS, and nothing to do with Cox. The local commercials played back fine, but all content from the national feed was garbled. The CBS tech was able to do something around the :45 mark and it was reset and working again.
8300 vs. 8000
8300 is a better unit overall, and offers better speed, memory and a slightly cleaner picture (resolves the same, but has a more transparent overlay). On top of that, you can add external Hard Drive storage via the eSATA connection on the back with a 300GB or 160GB Maxtor Quickview expander, or try to make a homebrew kit like in my sig link (if you want to know a lot about those features, check out the links in my sig...)
I use both without many problems, and they both behave the same with the same software now. The only advantage the 8000 may have is that it may have bit more forgiving tuner when getting low signals, other than that, lots of advantages to the 8300. I keep both because I need to be able to record FOUR THINGS at once sometimes...

vegggas

The upcoming Corrales vs. Castillo II fight this weekend is being added to the HD PPV lineup on 701. Blackout was lifted today! Same price for HD (701) or SD (501).

vegggas

I'm currently in North Las Vegas and am using an RCA indoor HD antenna and get every channel clearly except CH 3 (the one I wanted most!!). Can anyone point me to an indoor antenna that may work better or somewhere I can get an outdoor antenna (along with someone to install it!). Any help would be appreciated.

thanks.

I'm currently in North Las Vegas and am using an RCA indoor HD antenna and get every channel clearly except CH 3 (the one I wanted most!!). Can anyone point me to an indoor antenna that may work better or somewhere I can get an outdoor antenna (along with someone to install it!). Any help would be appreciated.

thanks.

There is no such thing as an HD antenna, it's all marketing. I'm guessing it's a silver sensor clone which has basically no reception on low vhf. A $5 pair of bunny ears opened up horizontally to face black mountain is you best best to recieve KVBC with an indoor antenna. Because of the rather unique situation with frequency assignment that exists in Las Vegas you can use your analog reception for the channel to gauge what your digital reception will be (one slight exception is that you should tune to Channel 10 for Fox instead of Channel 5). If you need an outdoor antenna the easiest way is to have it done by a satellite installer or to subcribe to Cox which will carries most the HD locals with the exception of KVWB.

Any idea if/when Cox plans on adding KVWB?

Since I'm feeling bored...

HD Programming Available in Las Vegas

Locals
(Directv/Dish HD recievers have OTA tuners and the installer should set up an antenna)
NBC-HD -- 3-1 OTA, Cox 733
Fox-HD -- 5-1 OTA, Cox 735
CBS-HD -- 8-1 OTA, Cox 730
PBS-HD -- 10-1 OTA, Cox 731
ABC-HD -- 13-1 OTA, Cox 732
WB-HD -- 21-1 OTA

National Channels
Discovery HD -- Cox 700, Directv 76, Dish 9421
ESPNHD -- Cox 705, Directv 73, Dish 9424
ESPN2HD -- Directv 72
HDNet -- Directv 79, Dish 9422
HDNet Movies -- Directv 78, Dish 9423
TNT-HD -- Cox 709, Dish 9420
Universal HD -- Cox 708, Directv 74

Premium Channels
HBO-HD -- Cox 710, Directv 70, Dish 9456
Showtime-HD -- Cox 720, Directv 71, Dish 9460
Cinemax-HD -- Cox 711
Starz!-HD -- Cox 721

Exclusive Channels
Cox -- INHD1 706, INHD2 707
Directv -- Sunday Ticket HD 719-730
Dish -- Voom (ULTRA HD 9478, MONSTERS HD 9481, RAVE HD 9470, EQUATOR HD 9471, GALLERY HD 9472, ANIMANIA 9474, RUSH HD 9476, HD News 9482, GUY TV HD 9479, MAJESTIC HD 9480)

Part Time Channels
NFL Network HD (check you program guide, on Directv it appears on 98)

Any idea if/when Cox plans on adding KVWB?

As soon as Cox accepts the concept paying for local channels. In my mind the main holes in their line up are HDNet, ESPN2HD, and KVWB. Of course there's the next wave of HD channels that are expected to launch next year and it will be interesting to see who picks what up and if any channels get dropped.

TNT-HD -- Cox 709, Dish 9420
Universal HD -- Cox 708, Directv 74

Have those stations already appeared on Cox? If so, I don't have them yet.

TNT-HD -- Cox 709, Dish 9420
Universal HD -- Cox 708, Directv 74

Have those stations already appeared on Cox? If so, I don't have them yet.

I got the channel numbers from the Cox website. They should launch on the 13th.

There's a RUMOR floating around that there could be a third HD channel added soon. Maybe KVWB is reconsidering their fee?

Thanks Vegggas.
If I call Cox and tell them I want the SA8300HD and give back my SA8000HD will they do that?
I pay a pretty good amount each month to Cox so if it is acceptable I should probably switch. I just hate to give up my Highlander in HD that is recorded on the SA800. :D
I like the idea of adding the extra hard drive as there is never enough space ;)

Thanks Vegggas.
If I call Cox and tell them I want the SA8300HD and give back my SA8000HD will they do that?


You should be able to do that with no problem. Just go down to the main office and make the switch. I plan on doing the same thing once I get my new TV.

You should be able to do that with no problem. Just go down to the main office and make the switch. I plan on doing the same thing once I get my new TV.

As I understand it, both the 8000HD AND the 8300HD have been discontinued by Scientific Atlanta.. If that is true you probably will get a re-conditioned (or previously rented box). I would suggest that you stay with what yoiu have rather than risk additional and new, aggravation.

As I understand it, both the 8000HD AND the 8300HD have been discontinued by Scientific Atlanta.. If that is true you probably will get a re-conditioned (or previously rented box). I would suggest that you stay with what yoiu have rather than risk additional and new, aggravation.

Word,

Is there any information on the new boxes that will replace the 8000HD and 8300HD? I checked SA's website, and they still have the same info.

Word,

Is there any information on the new boxes that will replace the 8000HD and 8300HD? I checked SA's website, and they still have the same info.

I read about the discontinuance of the 8000HD and the 8300HD in an HDTV magazine.
Checking SAs website is normally an exercise in futility. That's unfortunately the LAST place to find updated information about their products.

Word,

Is there any information on the new boxes that will replace the 8000HD and 8300HD? I checked SA's website, and they still have the same info.

The 8000 is discontinued, but the 8300 is still the main DVR product platform from SA. They are starting to ship (low volume numbers until production ramps up) the multi-room DVR's, which is still the 8300 chassis, with an added module connected that allows for IP streaming (SD) over the RF connector to other SA Digital STB's within the home.
If anyone is considering swithing from the 8000 to the 8300, I would suggest keeping the 8000 for at least a few weeks while you get the 8300 installed and tested. This way, you can watch all your old programs on the 8000 and see if the 8300 is right for you, etc.

Anyone interested in a complete, New in Box, Mits Hi-Def D-VHS (HD2000)? I found one locally, but can't use it because my TV doesn't support firewire. I still considered buying it, but decided it may be several years before I upgrade to a firewire enabled display (or find a Mits Promis Module upgrade).

vegggas

edit re: D-VHS
I did not buy the D-VHS unit, but it's at a (specialty high end/low traffic) store here in South West Vegas. The box was partially opened, and I opened it fully to inspect that all contents were still there and internally sealed and never used.
v

Can anyone explain to me why Cox won't let you do a self install on a cable card installation. It's a lot more complicated to plug in a box then to put a card (which from what I can tell is the same as a laptop). My dad bought two nice HDTVs the other day. Before he bought them he called Cox and asked about the costs. They told him that the card was $1.99 a month and the digital package was $8.00. He said OK I'll call you back when I get my TV. So he goes and buys the TVs and calls them back and they tell him that it will cost $8.00 for both TV's not $5.00 for the second one. They also tell him that it will cost him $50 per TV for installation. This upset him and he told him to stick it up there ear (he propibly said worse). I can't image that it would cost that much just to send a tech over to someones house to plug in 2 cards. I mean he has been a customer of theirs for like 15 years. I think they should either do the install free (like Directv does) or make it where he can do it himself. A $100 is too much for the short amount of time the tech would be at his house.

Also if anyone knows a good place to get a Satallite Radio installed send me a PM.

Cable cards and cable card TV's are currently one way devices and have to be "Mated" to each other. Once the card and TV are mated, the Headend has to push the correct download and channel package to the card. Since this is one-way technology, there is no way to determine if the card accepted the correct download and package and is working correctly. The tech has to determine that it correctly works, and if not, re-authorize a new download to that serial ID. This process is not automatic and requires a specific person and software to be pushed to the card at a specific time, and then be authorized for services.
This is NOT PCMCIA technology, nor is it Plug-N-Play. Once mated, the cable card and TV work as a single unit, and the card can't be used in another display.

vegggas

Well I know it's not PCMCIA technology I just said it looked like it. The way you describe it sounds just like the card in every Directv receiver. They just say turn to this channel. Do you see a picture. OK Turn to this channel. Do you see a picture. In fact you can even change the package over the internet and 30 seconds later you are watching TV.

I can even understand the fee to send the tech out. What I don't understand is the $50 per TV. You can't tell me it's going to cost Cox $50 to get that second TV connected since the guy is already in the house. If you ask me they should just do like Directv does and install it for free but make you keep it for a year. Most everyone is already used to that with the cell phones anyways. Or at least they should tell you about the install charge when you call and ask what things cost.

I'm currently in North Las Vegas and am using an RCA indoor HD antenna and get every channel clearly except CH 3 (the one I wanted most!!). Can anyone point me to an indoor antenna that may work better or somewhere I can get an outdoor antenna (along with someone to install it!). Any help would be appreciated.

thanks.

Looks like I've got every channel with some creative repositioning on my antenna. Can anyone tell me what is an acceptable signal strenght to receive? I'm running my antenna though my D* HD Tivo.

I think as long as it is a steady locked number you should be fine. That generally happens in the 60-70 range. What you don't want is something that bounces around a lot.

lvthunder - Agreed about the price. They shouldn't charge double for two TV's in one service call, maybe a smaller charge for additional sets...
The biggest difference between CC nd D* is that D* stores their algorithym on the card, which can be duplicated, wheras, CC is based on the mac and algorithym associated with the TV tuner's digital ID talking to the card, which can't be duplicated like a smart card programmer.

vegggas

FYI

I just did a rescan of my TV and now I am picking up TNT HD on channel 83-2 from my QAM tunner. I know COX is adding this HD network along with Universal HD but it seems they might be testing and didn't scramble it. However I did look and could not find Universal HD during the rescan. Also it seems that COX is broadcasting the East coast feed of TNT. I found this out a little after 10pm and the movie Sugar & Spice was on and it wasn't scheduled till 1am.

Tune in and watch it while it lasts.

Yep,.found TNTHD on my TV also....Universal should be somewhere. They did the same thing with NFL network. It was being broadcast about a month before the official cable addition.

HD cable box question.... are the rental fees the same for all HD boxes or do they charge more for the DVR box ( just the box , not the service) . I was thinking if all you wanted was a regular HD receiver it would be a bit cheaper than getting one with a hard drive in it.

Looks like I've got every channel with some creative repositioning on my antenna. Can anyone tell me what is an acceptable signal strenght to receive? I'm running my antenna though my D* HD Tivo.

On the DirecTV H10 any ota signal that stays above 63 is fine.

On the DirecTV H10 any ota signal that stays above 63 is fine.

Helping out a co-worker who lives in Summerlin (Vegas Dr / Rampart). He has been having problems with the HD Tivo and OTA reception. He even just went as far as having an installer put up a 6' terk rooftop antenna. (I didn't get involved until after his purchase of the terd)

Model TV36, the specs are:
Dimensions: 103.25” L x 111” W x 25.5” H
CEA Color Code: Red
Operating Bandwidth: VHF: 54MHz-230MHz (Channels 2-13), UHF: 470 MHz-806 MHz (Channels 14-69)
HDTV Compatible
Elements: 33
Antenna Weight: 6.4 lbs

I have never dealt with satellite diplexing and things of that nature, but my understanding is that he has it diplexed by the satellite, then that runs through something like a 4x8 switch to send signal throughout the house, then it has a splitter to seperate the OTA feed by the tv?

When this happens, he gets 0% across the board, so I am guessing there is a problem in the wiring, since that antenna is overkill.

Any help here?

Helping out a co-worker who lives in Summerlin (Vegas Dr / Rampart). He has been having problems with the HD Tivo and OTA reception. He even just went as far as having an installer put up a 6' terk rooftop antenna. (I didn't get involved until after his purchase of the terd)

Model TV36, the specs are:
Dimensions: 103.25” L x 111” W x 25.5” H
CEA Color Code: Red
Operating Bandwidth: VHF: 54MHz-230MHz (Channels 2-13), UHF: 470 MHz-806 MHz (Channels 14-69)
HDTV Compatible
Elements: 33
Antenna Weight: 6.4 lbs

I have never dealt with satellite diplexing and things of that nature, but my understanding is that he has it diplexed by the satellite, then that runs through something like a 4x8 switch to send signal throughout the house, then it has a splitter to seperate the OTA feed by the tv?

When this happens, he gets 0% across the board, so I am guessing there is a problem in the wiring, since that antenna is overkill.

Any help here?


Here is what I do, I have the HDTIVO. I take one of the 2 lines from my sat and my ANT line, it goes to a little diplexer, then one line out of that into my house then I use another diplexer in reverse to split out the signal for the ANT and the sat. Here is the Radioshack version http://www.radioshack.com/product.asp?catalog%5Fname=CTLG&category%5Fname=CTLG%5F003%5F010%5F001%5F000&product%5Fid=16%2D2567
I got a set of 2 from Lowes I think for much cheaper.

Trevor,

The cleanest method for connecting an OTA antenna with satellite is to have a 5x8 switch in the distribution line. Four of the inputs are from the satellite that is needed for the HD setup and the fifth is the output from his OTA antenna. The 5x8 switch has a diplexer internally that will add the OTA signal to all of the outbound lines.

Then if you want to use the OTA signal you just put a diplexer on one of the lines going into the HD-Tivo which will split out the OTA signal and the satellite feed.

Voila.. you should be in business.........

If you are using a 4x8 then you have to combine the OTA and satellite feeds with a diplexer after the switch and then put a second diplexer before the Tivo to split the signal back out... using this method you only get the OTA signal on a single line however.

I have never dealt with satellite diplexing and things of that nature, but my understanding is that he has it diplexed by the satellite, then that runs through something like a 4x8 switch to send signal throughout the house, then it has a splitter to seperate the OTA feed by the tv?

When this happens, he gets 0% across the board, so I am guessing there is a problem in the wiring, since that antenna is overkill.

Any help here?

You need the diplexer on both ends of the cable run, it sounds like somewhere you're just using a regular splitter. I'd recommend testing with a pair of bunny ears just to make sure that the tuner in the reciever is working.

HiHo and Speco- Thank you both for the help. I will have him check on how it is wired at the house (4x8 or 5x8) and will print out both of your replies to give him. Thanks again!

Edit: Geroge- I just saw your post. It did work with the antenna sitting in his living room with a direct run of cable to the receiver. Thanks all!

no prob...... trevor!

How do you like your 61md10?

My brother just bought one a week or so ago...., any tips I should pass along to him? (I sent him a link to your 61md10.org).

Steve

Does the 8300HD have a DVI input or HDMI and is it active? My 8000HD is starting to go a little flaky on me and I'm going to switch it out when my new HDTV comes next week. I know Cox gives you component cables, but do they give you an HDMI or DVI to HDMI cable?

Does the 8300HD have a DVI input or HDMI and is it active? My 8000HD is starting to go a little flaky on me and I'm going to switch it out when my new HDTV comes next week. I know Cox gives you component cables, but do they give you an HDMI or DVI to HDMI cable?
The 8300 has HDMI OUT. During significant testing among various displays and display technologies, HDMI/DVI offered little, or no improvement at all on a majority of displays. Of those display with CRT based technologies, and those that actually convert the digital signal back to analog over DVI/Analog, the signal is actually WORSE over that connection.
Y_our M_ilage M_ay V_ary, and others with different combinations can chime in with their experiences. Consensus is that HDMI offers no benefit in most cases. The 8300, by default, offers a better pic quality over the 8000 on all HD outputs for most people.
I would keep the 8000 until you are satisfied with the 8300 and have watched all the programs on the old STB. Check the link in my sig for a long thread about the 8300... Also, the cable co's will not supply a DVI or HDMI cable.

vegggas

The 8300 has HDMI OUT. During significant testing among various displays and display technologies, HDMI/DVI offered little, or no improvement at all on a majority of displays. Of those display with CRT based technologies, and those that actually convert the digital signal back to analog over DVI/Analog, the signal is actually WORSE over that connection.
Y_our M_ilage M_ay V_ary, and others with different combinations can chime in with their experiences. Consensus is that HDMI offers no benefit in most cases. The 8300, by default, offers a better pic quality over the 8000 on all HD outputs for most people.
I would keep the 8000 until you are satisfied with the 8300 and have watched all the programs on the old STB. Check the link in my sig for a long thread about the 8300... Also, the cable co's will not supply a DVI or HDMI cable.

vegggas

That sounds a lot like marketing speak to me. There is a significant quality difference between component and HDMI/DVI on my 32in Syntax LCD. Component has noticible ghosting with the standard cables provided and the box. After market cables reduce that, but the picture is still a bit softer and has analog characteristics that you may or may no notice depending on your eyesight and your training to detect them. I agree that you won't notice the difference on a CRT since the end of the display path is analog anyways.

KVBC missed the switch almost all Saturday. They did the Busch race, but then they forget to send HD in primetime and didn't turn it on until the last segments of SNL. Shouldn't their be someone at Cox (or the satellite companies) who's job it is to monitor the signals and call up the local stations when they don't flip the switch?

George,
That's why I said Your Mileage May Vary, depending on the display used. People are discovering that many displays, (not just crt) will convert the digital input to analog for displaying through the component path and make the signal either the same, or worse than component. Also, any display (digital) that has to scale the image to fit it's native resolution (those not actually native 1280x720 or 1920x1080) will have the possibility of scaling induced video noise, hazing, or pixelation caused by the scaler. CRT, by default, has multiple native resolutions that can support various resolution between 480 through 1080, etc without scaling (YMMV) by direct component or RGBHV connections directly to the tubes.

Also, NO. There is no job associated with any provider to watch 500-odd channels to determine if the programming from that station is correct at any given time. At best, there is an automated warning if there is a loss of video service on any single channel source. It's up to the originator of the programming to ensure it's correctly sent out to viewers.

vegggas

Also, NO. There is no job associated with any provider to watch 500-odd channels to determine if the programming from that station is correct at any given time. At best, there is an automated warning if there is a loss of video service on any single channel source. It's up to the originator of the programming to ensure it's correctly sent out to viewers.

vegggas

I wasn't talking about 500 channels, I was talking about 6 local networks that send HD. I'm not saying there should be a specific job just watching programming to make sure it's correct, but it would seem reasonable to set up a few monitors and make sure someone takes a look at key times to make sure you the product you are selling is actually being delivered. Is it really an intractable problem to find someone to take a look at a few channels during sporting events and prime time? I'd think the cable company is in a better position to contact the right people at the local networks to get a flip switched than the viewers at home are. Since Cox is bound to answer a lot of calls from upset viewers whenever a football game drops to SD anyways, doesn't it make since to be a little bit proactive?

Hate to be the Devil's advocate, but George has a good point. If Cox is charging a fee for local HD, then they bear the responisibility to insure that that is what the customer gets if the program is available in HD. Otherwise, the customer should get an adjustment on their bill.

Well, it looks like Cox-LV disabled 83.2 for now... At least I'm unable to get it in South-West Vegas right now.

*Sigh* I was enjoying my east coast feed. =)

~

I am curious as to why they don't have an automatic sensor of some sort, or an automatic switch to switch to HD.



Hate to be the Devil's advocate, but George has a good point. If Cox is charging a fee for local HD, then they bear the responisibility to insure that that is what the customer gets if the program is available in HD. Otherwise, the customer should get an adjustment on their bill.

Hate to be the Devil's advocate, but George has a good point. If Cox is charging a fee for local HD, then they bear the responisibility to insure that that is what the customer gets if the program is available in HD. Otherwise, the customer should get an adjustment on their bill.
There is no charge for local HD! It is povided free with any level of digital service. Comparatively, D* charges an additional $10.99 for HD. Ultimately, it is up to the broadcaster to ensure that what they advertise as HD is actually HD. At any given time, the local station can drop to SD for any reason they want. There is NO GUARANTEE that any programming will be in HD. Be lucky we are not in a severe weather area that breaks in every 10 minutes (and down to SD) to show weather maps of storms in the area. When hurricanes, or tornados are in the area, sometimes the entire lineup will be in SD while a corner of the screen shows real time weather.

I am curious as to why they don't have an automatic sensor of some sort, or an automatic switch to switch to HD. This is done at the local station, and until the station broadcasts 100% HD, they have to manually switch from HD to SD for local commercial insertion and local origination programming. As for Cox, or any other cable/sat company, the incoming feed is ALWAYS in HD at 1080i, or 720p from the station. There is no way to "SENSE" if the local station feed has decided to upconvert the SD signal to HD resolutions, which is what we see.

vegggas

Universal HD (708) and TNT HD (709) are up and running.

I agree with you all that says Cox should watch what they are sending out. I know my boss watches what I send out. I can tell you that they will not do this. Heck I couldn't even get them to fix my parents email when there IP was rejected by the SMTP server. I response I got from the supervisor of the CSR was that email is a free service they offer so they wouldn't give them a credit for me being on the phone with them for two hours.

You just have to think of Cox as a middle man. There to collect your money and hook you up. You pay there fee to be connected and aren't guarenteed anything but a connection.

KVBC missed the switch again, they sent a new episode Leno in SD last night. Maybe that's not important enough for anybody to care, but what will happen when they're responsible for Sunday Night Football next year?

I stand corrected. I was not aware Cox did not charge for local HD. I do not subscride. So, does that mean I can call Cox and they can install a drop to my house (which I expect to pay the installation charge for) and they I can enjoy local HD channels only for free?

George,
See this thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=591442) about NBC's national problems with the feed out of NYC the last two days. Problems everywhere!

hdtvxpert,
You can get the LOCAL HD channels coming down the wire with a basic cable subscription (~$9 IIRC), provided you have a QAM tuner to pick them up. If not, you can lease an HD tuner from them, or lease a DVR and add DVR service to enable DVR functions (I think DVR's require a Digital Gateway [$5 if no other digital service is ordered] to enable functionality . If you get a Digitial subscription package for premium channels (HBOHD, SHOHD, StarzHD, etc.), they throw in DiscoveryHD, INHD1 &2, ESPNHD, UniversalHD, TNTHD, etc at no charge. Just like any service, you have to maintain a subscription to get any service whatsoever. You can't just get connected, then cancel service and expect to keep getting the channels.

vegggas

hdtvxpert: I think they would just need to remove the filter they put in at your house, which I doubt they will do for you to watch locals for free.

vegggas: what is a digital gateway?

Okay, I forgive KVBC since it seems there wasn't a hd feed to switch to, but what was the deal with the baseball game on Fox last night?

hdtvxpert: I think they would just need to remove the filter they put in at your house, which I doubt they will do for you to watch locals for free.

vegggas: what is a digital gateway?

If you subscribe to only analog services (Basic or Expanded Basic), there is no two-way communication or access to digital channels. If you subscribe to ANY digital services, such as HBO, etc, then you automatically are on the digital gateway to enter those services. If you DON'T subscribe to any digital services, then you have to have a digital gateway to access the digital content and services.
You might think of it as a Local Area Network (LAN) in your home, as compared to an outside Wide Area Network (WAN) to access services beyond your basic area. The Digital Gateway is, if I'm presuming correctly, the license allotted to the BigBand Networks system (controls all digital data, including video) and SARA control to send digital services to a specific mac address for reception of services, whereas analog video is just piped out via an RF cable like an antenna. I believe that the equipment may be free or with little cost associated, but each MAC has to be licensed and a fee associated with it - This way smaller cable systems can use the same equipment w/o getting penalized by huge upfront costs.

How does that sound?

vegggas

Okay, I forgive KVBC since it seems there wasn't a hd feed to switch to, but what was the deal with the baseball game on Fox last night?

I was wondering the same thing about Fox's "HD" broadcast last night, George. Very disappointing to say the least. Hopefully it will get resolved tonight.

Noticed that TNT HD is mostly stretched SD programming. NASCAR was in HD tonight.
Seems nothing worthwhile is on Universal HD. We need ESPN2 HD.

Noticed that TNT HD is mostly stretched SD programming. NASCAR was in HD tonight.
Seems nothing worthwhile is on Universal HD. We need ESPN2 HD.

What we need is HDNET and HDNET Movies.

If you subscribe to only analog services (Basic or Expanded Basic), there is no two-way communication or access to digital channels. If you subscribe to ANY digital services, such as HBO, etc, then you automatically are on the digital gateway to enter those services. If you DON'T subscribe to any digital services, then you have to have a digital gateway to access the digital content and services.
vegggas

So...If someone only subcribed to basic analog cable services, they wouldn't be able to pick the local unencrypted HD local channels even if they had a QAM capable tuner in their television? But....If they did have digital cable in their main family room only, they still would be able to receive those unencrypted channels in another room/outlet even without subscibing to additional outlet gateway?

"Digital gateway" is just a ploy by cable companies to get more money out of you. QAM locals are always available with the minimum level of service (ie glorified antenna super-basic analog) as per FCC regulations. Whether or not you subscribe to digital on one or more outlets is irrelevant.

You have a digital gateway if you rent a cable box (STD DEF or HDTV) without any premium channels. This gives you a better quality audio/video on local digital channels the ability to order PPV, with a HDTV gateway you also get local HDTV channels. It's pretty cheap, I believe just the cost of a box rental.

GVC, AS I see it,
IF you have a QAM tuner, you MAY pick up un-encrypted QAM channels. The locals are unencrypted, but at a higher frequency and you MAY have reception problems with connections (YMMV) and wiring, etc. Other channels might be unencrypted, but there are not very many, and those you can currently see, should be encrypted eventually (except locals - Unless local stations decide to charge for viewing over cable) to keep a closed system.
The Digital Gateway, as I described, is for licensing each ADDRESSABLE MAC for authorization to receive encrypted digital services. All hardware needing to decrypt a signal needs a unique digital gateway address. This is true for Digital STB's, Cable Cards, etc. The fee is absorbed, however, if you subscribe to a premium network or service that requires a digital connection to get that service - i.e. HBO, SHO, etc. Your OWN QAM tuner does not need a digital gateway because you can manually seek the channels up in the 100's, but a rented STB or cable card with remapping data, does.
Anytime a digital gateway is used, the STB is authorized to get all digital two-way services (cable card TV's are not 2-way capable yet). This gives you access to the IPG, music, PPV, whatever is free in the digital packages, etc.

coyoteaz,
I'm learning that there is a licensing fee associated with the hardware makers (that send out the encryption data) for EACH piece of addressable hardware authorized to receive services. This falls in line with the fee associated with a digital gateway as each converter is licensed to receive digital services.

vegggas

GVC, AS I see it,
IF you have a QAM tuner, you MAY pick up un-encrypted QAM channels. The locals are unencrypted, but at a higher frequency and you MAY have reception problems with connections (YMMV) and wiring, etc. Other channels might be unencrypted, but there are not very many, and those you can currently see, should be encrypted eventually (except locals - Unless local stations decide to charge for viewing over cable) to keep a closed system.

There are so many unencrypted channels, its not funny. Maybe they'll be encrypted one day, but for now enjoy tons of digital "FTA" channels with a QAM decoder.

coyoteaz,
I'm learning that there is a licensing fee associated with the hardware makers (that send out the encryption data) for EACH piece of addressable hardware authorized to receive services. This falls in line with the fee associated with a digital gateway as each converter is licensed to receive digital services.

vegggas
That should be included in the price of the box rental. Also, that doesn't explain the difference in price for each additional digital STB. If the licensing fee is per box, then each box should require a ($6?) digital gateway fee, not the $2 per outlet or whatever bogus amount Cox charges. At least they don't charge for additional analog outlets as was done in the past. DBS killed that off pretty quickly as it allowed MSOs to advertise free programming on additional outlets while showing how much each additional DBS box was.

That should be included in the price of the box rental. Also, that doesn't explain the difference in price for each additional digital STB. If the licensing fee is per box, then each box should require a ($6?) digital gateway fee, not the $2 per outlet or whatever bogus amount Cox charges. At least they don't charge for additional analog outlets as was done in the past. DBS killed that off pretty quickly as it allowed MSOs to advertise free programming on additional outlets while showing how much each additional DBS box was.
Yes, each hardware device has to be licensed. Hence, each additional digital outlet, which requires a digital STB with a unique mac address will have a fee. If you have 20 STB's, you will have to license 20 spots on the digital Big Band Network's access list. STB rental is only about $4 for a digital converter.

COX LV Digital pricing webpage (http://www.cox.com/lasvegas/digitalcable/pricing.asp) Check this link for Cox's digital pricing
Digital Gateway - (Does not include any tiers or Discovery Channels) $5.00*
45 channels of Music Choice, 6 Talk Radio Networks, Access to Entertainment On Demand and Pay-Per-View, and Interactive Program Guide.

Digital Programming on an Additional Outlet** $7.95
Digital Gateway Programming on an Additional Outlet** $5.00

Digital Receiver - Monthly Rate $4.20

* A minimum subscription to Cox Basic and does not include equipment rental.
** Additional outlet requires a digital cable box.


also, additional analog outlets have been free (IIRC) since from the late 80's when TV's began incorporating cable ready tuners around 1987-ish (at least in the South-Eastern states where I worked at the time). Outlet fees were charged for analog STB's used as tuners because TV's would not properly tune the cable bands to get all programming. Most cable companies followed this fee schedule since before DBS was even available. This was back when I was installing C-Band (BUD) dishes (1987-ish) and then the first medium/small sized Primestar, Hughes and DirecTV Sat Networks around 1994-95.

How did we get so far off-topic and start talking about pricing?
vegggas

Well, all I know is that Cox quoted me $18 to add HD to an upstairs bedroom. 9.95 for the box and 7.95 for the digital service (additional outlet). That seems a bit steep to me. Thats why I was wondering if I could still pick up those local HD channels for free if I just hooked up a QAM capable TV to the existing analog outlet in that room.

Well, all I know is that Cox quoted me $18 to add HD to an upstairs bedroom. 9.95 for the box and 7.95 for the digital service (additional outlet). That seems a bit steep to me. Thats why I was wondering if I could still pick up those local HD channels for free if I just hooked up a QAM capable TV to the existing analog outlet in that room.

I don't think you should have any problem. I have expanded basic and am using my QAM tuner for the locals in HD

Much thanks to KLAS for switching to the HD coverage of the Patriots game when the Chargers game ended and for showing the HD SEC games on 8-1 when the Rebels are on analog. There must be a football fan in that engineering room.

There are so many unencrypted channels, its not funny. Maybe they'll be encrypted one day, but for now enjoy tons of digital "FTA" channels with a QAM decoder.
Is this sarcasm? I tried a PC tuner card a while ago and wasn't impressed. Does anybody have a list of what's available?

Well, all I know is that Cox quoted me $18 to add HD to an upstairs bedroom. 9.95 for the box and 7.95 for the digital service (additional outlet). That seems a bit steep to me. Thats why I was wondering if I could still pick up those local HD channels for free if I just hooked up a QAM capable TV to the existing analog outlet in that room.

Yep, way too much. Cox better rethink this pricing soon.
And where in the hell is the MR unit coming out?

Will I have to go back to DTV when MPG4 and the HD media server is rolled out?
The ugly old dish is still up there.

Is this sarcasm? I tried a PC tuner card a while ago and wasn't impressed. Does anybody have a list of what's available?
I think they are in the process of starting digital simulcasting the analog tier for public deployment on digital STB's. If I were to guess, I would say they haven't started encrypting them yet, but they will eventually. This means that you can see all the wild feeds until they are about ready for deployment. Since there are seperate fees for basic, and then more for expanded basic, I'm sure they will eventually encrypt them so that they can continue to charge for those tiers, and people with QAM tuners won't bypass the tier fee.

GVC,
If you have a QAM tuner, just plug it in and see what you can pick up.
As for the price quote, it looks like they are charging $10 for a rental HD STB (as opposed to $4 for SD) and $8 to mirror the programming you have on another, established STB ($5 for Digi GW and $3 for mirrored programming).

vegggas

Is this sarcasm? I tried a PC tuner card a while ago and wasn't impressed. Does anybody have a list of what's available?

I get a lot of unencrypted digital video feeds. 102 and 103 are where HD channels can be found. At channels 76-79, I see video on demand (both regular and adult). In the 80s there are some unencrypted simulcasts of the analog tier. I dont see much in the 90s, likewise, there isnt much above the HD channels anyways.

Yep, way too much. Cox better rethink this pricing soon.
And where in the hell is the MR unit coming out?

Will I have to go back to DTV when MPG4 and the HD media server is rolled out?
The ugly old dish is still up there.

You'll need a new dish for the spaceway sats if those features bring you back.

OT CableCard question: Is the one-way cablecard married to the particular TV it is installed or, once installed, can it be removed from one TV and put into another TV (same house, same cox account ) without re-installation? If the card is indeed "married" to the particular DCR television it is originally installed in, would it be able to function in a second DCR tv of the same brand/mfg (different model#)?

OT CableCard question: Is the one-way cablecard married to the particular TV it is installed or, once installed, can it be removed from one TV and put into another TV (same house, same cox account ) without re-installation? If the card is indeed "married" to the particular DCR television it is originally installed in, would it be able to function in a second DCR tv of the same brand/mfg (different model#)?
They are mated. The cable card has to get the digital stream info from the TV tuner and it will only accept the stream from that particular ID of the tuner. To enable it on another TV, it has to be flashed and cleared of memory and then re-installed on a new TV.

vegggas

Excuse me if I sound ignorant on the subject. But, what is the purpose of a cable card? I guess I had thought all along that it was a way to make your cable package "portable". Sounds like anything but portable to me. Perhaps someone could clue me in as to the upside of having a cable card vs. regular cable company STB. Thanks.

Excuse me if I sound ignorant on the subject. But, what is the purpose of a cable card? I guess I had thought all along that it was a way to make your cable package "portable". Sounds like anything but portable to me. Perhaps someone could clue me in as to the upside of having a cable card vs. regular cable company STB. Thanks.
CableCard is the hardware/software decryption key used in opencable systems. The same hardware basically exists within the STB's. With cablecard, you use your own tuner and display, and the mpeg stream encryption data along with the qpsk downstream data gets authenticated by the Cable Card. This means the QAM tuner in your display will do all the work and the CableCard will authenticate the decryption scheme so it will be vieable, based on your subscription data.

vegggas

I'd steer away from cable cards until there is a viable standard for two way communication.

I don't have one yet, but I'm planning on getting a cablecard for my second TV. I don't need 2 way communication on every TV and when you use a plasma you won't need a box. Otherwise, I would need another box just to watch HDTV since I can't get local OTA due to my location and I'd want ESPNHD anyway. I wouldn't be afraid of a cablecard as long as you know the limitations.

Even with 2-way, I would not use one unless it was in a PVR machine like an HD-Tivo, but then again - the SA8300HD does just fine.

Anyone notice that there is an Adult VOD channel available now on cable (CH 589)?
Not HD, but worth a mention... If you're into that.
The GOTW NFL games are ok too. Still not HD, but worth a mention.

vegggas

Anyone know of a time frame for DTV to roll out the MPEG 4 HDTV in Las Vegas?

Thanks, Eddie

Anyone know of a time frame for DTV to roll out the MPEG 4 HDTV in Las Vegas?

Thanks, Eddie
Not exactly sure, but I heard it was 1st or 2nd qtr of 2007 (15 - 18 months after initial launch based on hardware availability and production) for Las Vegas DMA and will be the top 4 stations - ABC, CBS, NBC and FOX. National Network feeds will no longer be available if local is available (which they are). Detroit is said to be a BETA Test Market soon and maybe a rollout in November for them.
Neilson had us ranked as the 51st ranked DMA when D* decided on the schedule. D* was focusing on the top 50 DMA's for rollout of conus and hardware. Since then, Sept 24th 2005 to be exact, we have moved up to #48 in the Neilson DMA rankings (http://www.nielsenmedia.com/DMAs.html) . Not sure if D* will change any plans based on changing DMA statistics, but you never know.
Others will have more specific information in the coming weeks and months and you should take the above as a probable explanation, but not absolute truth.
vegggas

Anyone know of a time frame for DTV to roll out the MPEG 4 HDTV in Las Vegas?

Thanks, Eddie

The MPEG4 boxes and 5LNB dish could be available to everyone in mid-2006 if Spaceway 2 sucessfully launches and if it is turned over to DirecTV in a reasonable time frame and if they decide to place national programming on those birds. Currently HD LiL is in testing in Detroit and the plans for the top 12 DMAs to be upgraded first. Beyond that I'm hopefull DirecTV will add HD LiL in the top 50-ish DMAa as soon as they have retransmist agreements and uplink facilities in place. DirecTV rarely makes announcements about service until it is ready to go.

THanks for the replies!
I hate finding out something a year in advance. But then again it is something to look forward too.
I know someone that wants to dish (pun) the Cable service at Lake Las Vegas and go with Sat.
I'm thinking maybe a minimal install and then wait for the new DTV HD service. Just bites buying equipment and installing, then 6mos later do it again.
I'd really like to get ahold of the 5LNB and install that on the first go around if possible.

Nov.9th Launch
Launch window: TBD
Launch site: ELA-3, Kourou, French Guiana

The Arianespace Ariane 5 ECA rocket will launch the Spaceway 2 communications satellite for The DIRECTV Group and the Indonesian Telkom 2 communications satellite. The Boeing-built Spaceway 2 spacecraft will use its Ka-Band payload to expand and enhance DIRECTV's direct-to-home television service and provide broadband services across the United States. The Orbital Sciences-built Telkom 2 has 24 C-band transponders to transmit telecommunications services to Indonesia. Delayed from June 24 due to Telkom problem. Delayed from late Oct.

From http://spaceflightnow.com/tracking/

Anyone notice that there is an Adult VOD channel available now on cable (CH 589)?
Not HD, but worth a mention... If you're into that.
The GOTW NFL games are ok too. Still not HD, but worth a mention.

vegggas

Cool, but the preview button does not work! :D

I need a little help. New to this forum and this thread is really long. I am trying to get OTA HD signal with an indoor anttena but didn't have much luck. I live in summerlin ( inetrsection Alta and Town Center). I got Terk HDTV anttena and still have to move it to different places in the house to get each channel.
The problem is mostly with VHF channels: (2,5,8,13).

Do you have any recommandation for the anntena? Thanks.

mnlv,

Recommend you return or trash the Terk. They have a reputation for poor performance in any situation. Particularly where you live, you need a good metal outdoor antenna roof mounted. Get a 35-45 mile range Winegard or Channel master antenna. Channel 3 will be the hardest to receive as it is channel 2 DT at the bottom of the VHF band with the longest wavelength. An indoor antenna simply will not cut it. Try Lowe's, Radio Shack, Kiesub Electronics- they are a Winegard dealer.

mnlv,

Recommend you return or trash the Terk. They have a reputation for poor performance in any situation. Particularly where you live, you need a good metal outdoor antenna roof mounted. Get a 35-45 mile range Winegard or Channel master antenna. Channel 3 will be the hardest to receive as it is channel 2 DT at the bottom of the VHF band with the longest wavelength. An indoor antenna simply will not cut it. Try Lowe's, Radio Shack, Kiesub Electronics- they are a Winegard dealer.


Got mine at Lowes wikth a nice tall mast. Planted it in a 5 gal bucket of Quickrete, and wire tied to edge of roof to help keep it upright and I get all stations easy. I am close to you so I know it can be done.
Also all those years we had an outdoor ant I thought u point the arrow to the station, but nope its the othe way. I was dumb!!!

Non-amplified bunny ears give the best indoor reception in Las Vegas. The silver sensor type indoor antennas are a better choice in most other cities, but since so many DT stations are on VHF here it's not an option. To receive KVBC you'll need to extend the bunny ears 4 to 6 feet apart which is very difficult to do in many rooms. From my house in Mountain's Edge I can sucessfully receive all of the english language DT channels with bunny ears, but in other areas an outdoor antenna will be required.

Has there been any news if any more local stations are going 5.1?

Currently only KVVU and KTNV are 5.1, right?

Thanks everyone for your comments. I will check Lowes tomarrow morning for an outdoor antenna and will return the Terk one.

With bunny ear indoor anttena I can get all the channels including 2.1, but for each channel I have to replace the anttena. Hopefully an outdoor anttenna will solve the problem.

I have my SA 8300HD connected to a Sharp Aquos via an HDMI cable. There are
three settings on the box for Audio Digital Out. The only one that lets
me hear any sound is HDMI. The other two settings, Dolby Digital and
Other do not send any sound. Does this mean that I can not get Dolby
with an HDMI connection. I assume I will get it if I use component
connections, but I would rather keep the HDMI if possible.

Hask

I was flicking through the channels and almost thought hell had frozen over because KTNV decided to end their stretch-o-vision, but it came right back on for the commercials. In any case America's Funniest Home Videos is being shown in the proper 4:3 aspect ratio, hopefully ABC is encouraging them to send all of the network programming correctly.

Hask,
If you connected your TV via HDMI, then your TV dictates what type of signals it can accept through that cable. The HDMI output can have any type of signal, but the TV will not accept the manual settings you are attempting. By choosing HDMI, you are letting the TV choose the type of audio it can accept, instead of the manual overides you are attempting.
There is link in my sig about the 8300.

GeorgeLV,
AFAIK, KVBC has been 5.1 for some time now, so three of the big 4 are broadcasting Dolby Digital, except CBS. CBS is nationally doing 5.1, but not the local affiliate. Interestingly enough, CBS is the station with the most frequent audio dropouts too. Don't know what to say about you viewing 4x3 on KTNV. Maybe it was a network feed instead of alocal feed??? I'm sure if they change, we will all know about it soon enough.

vegggas

Thanks for your quick response. I am waiting for the Dolby Digital receiver that I ordered. Once it arrives, I will try to set it up according to your recommendation. Your notes and suggestions about the 8300 are great! Thanks again.

Hask

[QUOTE=vegggas]Hask,
If you connected your TV via HDMI, then your TV dictates what type of signals it can accept through that cable. The HDMI output can have any type of signal, but the TV will not accept the manual settings you are attempting. By choosing HDMI, you are letting the TV choose the type of audio it can accept, instead of the manual overides you are attempting.
There is link in my sig about the 8300.

GeorgeLV,
AFAIK, KVBC has been 5.1 for some time now, so three of the big 4 are broadcasting Dolby Digital, except CBS. CBS is nationally doing 5.1, but not the local affiliate. Interestingly enough, CBS is the station with the most frequent audio dropouts too. Don't know what to say about you viewing 4x3 on KTNV. Maybe it was a network feed instead of alocal feed??? I'm sure if they change, we will all know about it soon enough.

vegggas

Yeah, I'm betting the guy in the control room threw put on the ABC network feed "by mistake" and will get a talking down to by his superior for having the audicity to let hdtv viewers see a program in the proper aspect ratio. Unless Joural Broadcating honestly think they'll face liability for screen burn in, I can't understand why they've ignored the overwhelming feedback to dump the stretch-o-vision (and get rid of 13-2 while they're at it).

Well, so much for UHD. its been completely off air on the Cox system the last couple of days with a message stating that the service interruption was beyond their control. That would suggest it was UHD's problem, but it is still up and running on the D* system.

UHD seems to be working for me??? Then again, nothing seemingly worth watching, so I haven't been looking lately. Any spare time is used catching up on my DVR's shows. Even with 460GB (300GB external maxtor SATA), my drive was almost filled after the launch of the new network season, HBO and SHO series...
Anyone else notice a LARGE amount of Comcast commercials for "Comcastic" service - What's up with that? Are they just blasting national spots or something?

Gripes section... I'm noticing a few bad trends. What do you guys think?

Audio dropouts - 95% of my audio dropouts are on CBS. They also convert the Dolby Digital national feed to PCM stereo for local broadcast - Coincidence? I have to force the Digital Audio out to "Other" to maintain a decent audio consistency on that channel. 2nd for me is Fox programming. Not the live sports, but the episodic programming.
Audio Video Breakups - NBC gets the big thumbs down for their Ku band sat dish uplink/downlinks. They are using the smaller style dishes to make it more convienant for operators and to keep it off C-Band big dishes. With all the rainstorms in the North East, the signal has been hit or miss at times with Rain fade. Also, watching recordings of Leno, I have noticed that the PQ will shift from HD to what appears to be SD with the same Aspect Ratio. After the monologue, when he is at his desk it will start in HD, then suddenly, the background and coffee cup writing will go blurry, then seemingly go back to HD a few seconds later. Weird.
Switching to SD before the end of the show, and/or late switching. ABC and Fox seem to dominate this category. Don't seem to notice it on CBS or NBC...


Anybody have any other gripe categories or am I just crabby from trying to catch up on four weeks of primetime programming?

vegggas

4. Stretch-o-vision - Nobody wants you to stretch the picture for them KTNV

5. Useless subchannels - NBC Weather Plus makes live sports unwatchable on KVBC. Fox 5 Weather don't actually affect anything since Fox reserves the bandwidth, but c'mon everybody with an digital tuner has an internet connection and can check the weather. KTNV SD simulcast: unless their translators are using it, all it does is degrade the picture on Monday Night Football.

How could I forget stretch-o-vision! I guess that since I refuse to watch that channel when it's stretched that I forgot about it!
Sub-channels reduce the amount of bandwidth available for the main HD channel, so by default - those suck because it can potentially reduce picture quality when full bitrate is required to display fast motion.
I thought I remember that FOX was already broadcasting a reduced bitrate to their affiliates, so that they would never come close to using their full bandwidth. This would make a bandwidth limited subchannel not have any affect on their local systems. I hate to admit, that I have switched to that channel a few times (On COX 125) to check the long range forcast while on the phone making travel plans. If any station were to have to have a weather subchannel, I would rather it be FOX than a 1080i station.
NBC and ABC, on the other hand, do have issues with a subchannel stealing available bandwidth. ABC has an easier time with a 720P signal, so it has less overhead, but they decided to get rid of the useless ABC news subchannel because of a lack of viewership and rate reduction. NBC needs all the bandwidth it can get. They CAN look good at times with scenes with low action, but you are correct - sports DO suffer at times.
I have still never watched the WB-HD network... How are they doing with their 11.2 Mbps main channel bandwidth? They sold part of their bandwidth (~8Mbps) to USDTV to retransmit subscription services and left little room for their main channel. Anyone care to comment on HD quality and reliability? I don't think they do any sports, so that helps, but what about episodic programming?

vegggas

vegggas, KVWB only has two USDTV subchannels on it, 99-10 Lifetime and 99-50 Starz, these days. I'm assuming that beyond being encrypted they also down rez them to 480x480 or 320x480 so that they only take 2-3 megabits each. Since the WB is mostly low motion dramas their HDTV picture looks okay, it just doesn't have the pop of a full bandwidth channel. For the show that I watch they have been very reliable with switching. They've also fixed their audio problems about 99% of the way, the lipsync has been fixed at the expense of a popping sound every 15-30 minutes or so, presumably to resync the audio.

Thanks for the clarification. I thought they (USDTV/KVWB) were running 3 subchannels at VBR rates capped at 2.75Mbps for a total aggregate max load of 7.5 with some overhead for the stream data.
It sounds like what you are saying is that the HD is correct aspect ratio and better than 480P native resolution. Should we call this HD-lite, or can it stay on par with other locals?

vegggas

vegggas, I'd put KVWB on par with the DirecTV HD channels. It's a vast improvement over SD, but it doesn't have that window quality you get with, say, CSI on CBS. If I was buying programming for Cox, I'd rather pay the carriage fee to Sinclair for the WB in HD than for the 24-hour Law and Order SVU rerun channel, Universal HD.

More like half The District and half Law and Order on UHD

My guess is that Cox is providing us with TNT and Universal HD because THEY got them CHEAP.
But ESPN 2 HD is a no-no. I'm sick of it.

And DirecTV customers like me are waiting for TNT-HD.

One word to describe the overall experience of NBC's Breeder's Cup HD coverage via Cox. "Horrible". At least most of the featured race at the end was decent. But dropouts and tiling were frequent during a majority of the broadcast. Strange mic setup for the 5.1, also. Interesting, but strange.

My guess is that Cox is providing us with TNT and Universal HD because THEY got them CHEAP.
But ESPN 2 HD is a no-no. I'm sick of it.

Nothing really that good on those channels.
UHD is a complete waste of time so far.

One word to describe the overall experience of NBC's Breeder's Cup HD coverage via Cox. "Horrible". At least most of the featured race at the end was decent. But dropouts and tiling were frequent during a majority of the broadcast. Strange mic setup for the 5.1, also. Interesting, but strange.

I only watched a few mins of this off and on, and I can say I saw problems on my OTA feed, so I dont think it was a total cox issue for u.

One word to describe the overall experience of NBC's Breeder's Cup HD coverage via Cox. "Horrible". At least most of the featured race at the end was decent. But dropouts and tiling were frequent during a majority of the broadcast. Strange mic setup for the 5.1, also. Interesting, but strange.
Hello McFly... Ya got yer thinkin hat on???
COX doesn't broadcast NBC - KVBC broadcasts NBC. Cox is just a repeater for the local stations. The only thing you would see from a cable point of failure would be the total loss of service if the modulator went down and that would also take down the adjacent HD channel on the same modulator. It was a feed issue.

vegggas

NBC's national HD transmission path is more prone to failure and interruptions than the other networks because they use a Ku band uplink. The "tiling" was probaly caused the lack of bandwidth caused by NBC Weather Minus. I've read in these forums that NBCs in other markets have gotten better after their stations installed new mpeg2 encoders, but I wouldn't count on KVBC having that scheduled in their budgets just yet.

Re: High Definitiopn DVDs

According to Soundvision Magazine, Samsung has announced the release of an HD DVD Player/Recorder which will handle BOTH the Blue-Ray AND HD-DVD formats. As you all know, right now, there is a format war between the two, which is seemingly unresolvable. The release is scheduled for the spring of next year. No price is quoted. But that's good news iin my view. At least we now know that such a player/recorder CAN be created. And if so, competition from Sony, Denon, Pioneer, Panasonic, Mitsubishi, etc, will not be far behind.

The two HD Disk technologies are very similar from a hardware POV and it's been known for a while that manufacturers can and will do this. What you will NOT see is SONY making a HD-DVD compatible player, or Toshiba making a BR-DVD compatible player. You will also not see a BR-DVD enabled PC component for a while as MS is not backing it yet either.
In the end, usually the lower priced hybrids don't seem to fare as well as a dedicated unit. DVD-A vs. SACD is a good example. Low priced SACD or DVD-A players sound very good alone, but low priced combo units (that have to license [pay royalties] to both technologies) often use lesser quality DAC's and other parts to make up for the fees. This puts them in a place to still make a profit and put them into a low price category for sales, albeit, with a lesser quality product. Sony still won't make a DVD-A compatible player, and will not release the high royalty fees associated with SACD. Ths makes good quality hybrid players cost several times more than the good level players of each dedicated design, although the hardware is shared across the two platforms. Because of this and consumer confusion between the formats, high resoultion multichannel music is going toward the Dual Disk formats, which is a hodge podge of CD and often low resolution PCM stereo or Dolby Digital music.

There is a big thread over on the HD hardware section about this...

vegggas

Looks like Cox Communications just got sold!

Cox only sold selected systems:

"The agreement includes cable television systems in West Texas, North Carolina, Humboldt County and Bakersfield, California; and much of Middle America. "

What's the difference if Cox gets sold?

In my view their service and offerings can't be any worse than they are now.

Cox Communications is not being sold, but Cox cable is selling off some of their smaller, geographically remote cable areas to focus on it's regional cable markets with digital plans already in place. Cox is trying to standardize their markets with the same services of Cable, HD & Digital Cable, IP Telephony and High Speed Internet to provide a nationwide similar product. Those markets sold were seemingly not technically able to do so and a third party will be more equipped to handle their progression and Cox can re-invest in the other markets to bring them all together. The good news to Las Vegas is that they will be more focused on our (and others) market than wasting money on analog only or limited systems that need a structure overhaul to accomodate growth.
Cebridge Connections, Inc is buying the package deal of several smaller television markets in a geographic area next year, which would make them the 8th largest U.S. cable operator. Cox will remain the 3rd largest provider behind Comcast and Time Warner.
This is actually good news! Support for so many differnt system and platforms must have been a burdon, but movig forward with similar technologies and platforms will get them to move ahead farther and faster.

Word - He just has no idea how bad other markets are... The Las Vegas Market is actually one of the better markets in the country. It just doesn't have the "All Baseball in HD Channel" that he wants. He should buy the Bakersfield system and make it the way he wants!

vegggas

Anybody watching the Spurs game tonight on TNT-HD? The audio is horrible with a lot of drops. It is almost unwatchable at times.

KTNV got a HD character generator in and now they run a giant "13 Action News KTNV-DT Las Vegas" logo running constantly (even through commercials) in the lower left when you view their digital channels. Between this and the stretch-o-vision I have to wonder if their management policy is simply to piss viewers off.

I like the new "transparant" logo on the Left better than the old. It's not as obtrusive as the hard logo as it appears on the right, but still a bit too large. I wonder if this is part of their studio upgrades, and maybe we will see a non-stretched version soon?

vegggas

Why did Cox sell off some of it's cable systems?
Looks like they just made a major agreement (along with Comcast and Time Warner) with Sprint to offer wireless cable services. You will soon be able to watch your DVR programs on the go, and set up new recordings while away...

Link to AVS press release with links to Sprint and demo, etc (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6461223&&#post6461223)

vegggas

Speaking of Sound and Vision and Blu-Ray...There is an HDTV demo with a BR player put on by Sony and S&V at the RC Willey on Town Center tonight at 7. Sorry for the late notice, I just found it myself!

NBC's national HD transmission path is more prone to failure and interruptions than the other networks because they use a Ku band uplink. The "tiling" was probaly caused the lack of bandwidth caused by NBC Weather Minus. I've read in these forums that NBCs in other markets have gotten better after their stations installed new mpeg2 encoders, but I wouldn't count on KVBC having that scheduled in their budgets just yet.


Actually, KVBC is using the new mpeg2 encoder. The problem is the network is not using enough bandwidth to feed the signal to its affiliates.

Actually, KVBC is using the new mpeg2 encoder. The problem is the network is not using enough bandwidth to feed the signal to its affiliates.

If that's the case, the folks that say Norte Dame football looks fine on their NBC affiliate must be legally blind. KVBC macroblocks so badly that at times on live sports that it looks like an old atari game.

Word - He just has no idea how bad other markets are... The Las Vegas Market is actually one of the better markets in the country. It just doesn't have the "All Baseball in HD Channel" that he wants. He should buy the Bakersfield system and make it the way he wants!

vegggas
Recently moved to Tucson (another Cox market). They offer PBS and CBS HD. No agreement with Fox, ABC or NBC. I do miss Las Vegas HD.

Recently moved to Tucson (another Cox market). They offer PBS and CBS HD. No agreement with Fox, ABC or NBC. I do miss Las Vegas HD.

I have very little to complain about in terms of what Cox DOES offer. But I don't think they offer enough. Las Vegas is the FASTEST growing Metropolitan area in the nation. But still we are treated as second class citizens. The HD offerings in this city should rival those offered in NY, Boston, Chicago, Phila and Los Angeles. And until such time as that becomes a reality, I will be carping and complaining about it.

And telling me what other cities lack is both beside the point and doesn't make me feel lucky or happier. I'm interested in where I live. And nowhere else.

What HD offerings do these markets have that LV does not?


The HD offerings in this city should rival those offered in NY, Boston, Chicago, Phila and Los Angeles. And until such time as that becomes a reality, I will be carping and complaining about it.

Columbia, SC [not exactly a metropolitan hotbed] carried HDNet - not sure why Cox isn't on board, particularly with the new NHL broadcasts.

If that's the case, the folks that say Norte Dame football looks fine on their NBC affiliate must be legally blind. KVBC macroblocks so badly that at times on live sports that it looks like an old atari game.


Again, that is a network issue. Many NBC affiliates have been complaining about the network's HD coverage of live events. The tiling that you saw during the Notre Dame-USC game on KVBC also occurred on the rebroadcast on Universal HD.

I have very little to complain about in terms of what Cox DOES offer. But I don't think they offer enough. Las Vegas is the FASTEST growing Metropolitan area in the nation. But still we are treated as second class citizens. The HD offerings in this city should rival those offered in NY, Boston, Chicago, Phila and Los Angeles. And until such time as that becomes a reality, I will be carping and complaining about it.

And telling me what other cities lack is both beside the point and doesn't make me feel lucky or happier. I'm interested in where I live. And nowhere else.

In order to be fair, why dont you complain about D* also? Didn't you get a dish for baseball coverage?? They have Las Vegas listed as the 48th largest TV market , hence we will have to wait a long time before getting new MPEG 4 service.

In order to be fair, why dont you complain about D* also? Didn't you get a dish for baseball coverage?? They have Las Vegas listed as the 48th largest TV market , hence we will have to wait a long time before getting new MPEG 4 service.

I AM being fair!!!

DirectV has to cover the entire nation (and probably more than that as well). Local Cox Cable has to cover Las Vegas and nearby surrounding communities and NOTHING ELSE.

Hence, it ought to be easier for Cox to provide additional services since the territory they must cover is relatively limited. I got DirectV in order to receive the Fox Regional Networks. (especially during the baseball season). Now that baseball is over for this year, I have suspended ny DirectV service until March 1st, 2006. It cost nothing to do that. All equipment remains in place and may be activated sooner (or later) than March 1st, at my option and convenience.

And finally, I really don't know what MPEG4 service would provide, and frankly I don't care. I have DirectV EXCLUSIVELY for baseball coverage, AND NOTHING ELSE interests me.

I AM being fair!!!

DirectV has to cover the entire nation (and probably more than that as well). Local Cox Cable has to cover Las Vegas and nearby surrounding communities and NOTHING ELSE.

Hence, it ought to be easier for Cox to provide additional services since the territory they must cover is relatively limited. I got DirectV in order to receive the Fox Regional Networks. (especially during the baseball season). Now that baseball is over for this year, I have suspended ny DirectV service until March 1st, 2006. It cost nothing to do that. All equipment remains in place and may be activated sooner (or later) than March 1st, at my option and convenience.

And finally, I really don't know what MPEG4 service would provide, and frankly I don't care. I have DirectV EXCLUSIVELY for baseball coverage, AND NOTHING ELSE interests me.

You really don't care what Cox does or does not provide, as long as it suits YOUR tastes...

You really don't care what Cox does or does not provide, as long as it suits YOUR tastes...

YES!!! That's ABSOLUTELY TRUE.

Why should I worry about satisfying the tastes of other customers?

If there were competing cable systems available, you can be sure that I would use the one that satisfies my tastes most completely. What's wrong with that?? I don't pay your bills and you don't pay mine. Being satisfied with the lowest common denominator and the lowest level of service available is not to my taste.
If everyone had my attitude and was willing to PAY for the desired services, you can bet that Cox (or any other cable company) would be acting like whirling dervishes to satisfy us.

YES!!! That's ABSOLUTELY TRUE.

Why should I worry about satisfying the tastes of other customers?

If there were competing cable systems available, you can be sure that I would use the one that satisfies my tastes most completely. What's wrong with that?? I don't pay your bills and you don't pay mine. Being satisfied with the lowest common denominator and the lowest level of service available is not to my taste.
If everyone had my attitude and was willing to PAY for the desired services, you can bet that Cox (or any other cable company) would be acting like whirling dervishes to satisfy us.

The problem is that you expect the cable companies to cater to YOUR tastes exclusively, not the majority, and not the most lucrative or cost effective way for them. Sucks for you, but the universe doesn't revolve around you. No one said life was fair...

It's often said around here that Cox merely "relays" the signal it gets from the networks and other local broadcasters. I have no doubt that such is indeed the case.

But each month we get a bill from Cox, and it's Cox whom we pay for the services. I believe that Cox has a RESPONSIBILITY to its ratepayers, to agitate the networks and stations on our behalf, in order to improve the quality of the service (audio and video) THEY receive from those networks and stations.

If Cox washes its hands of that responsibility, I don't believe they are completely fulfilling their contract to provide us with the service WE want, AND pay for.

Certainly Cox would have a greater influence with CBS, NBC. ESPN, etal, than would any individual cable user. Cox ought to be consistently HAMMERING the networks and other stations with DEMANDS that they provide the very best in signals for relay to the community. But instead, Cox stands idly by, and delivers to us an often inferior product.

Why is this so????????

Imitation of a certain user on this thread:
HEY! WTF!!! My favorite website of BaseBall statistics is down for maintainance!!! My second favorite website doesn't have the same content as my first choice, so I'm SOL!!! Right!!!
It seems fair that since Cox sells me the internet, I should complain to them so that THEY can tell them to build the website the way I want it to be!!!
I demand that Cox tell those webmasters to make Their websites the way I like them to be. Isn't that what I pay them for??? :D :D :D I'm moving to AOL to get my website - they listen to me!

finis

I can't hold back anymore :) :) :) My belly hurts!!!

It's often said around here that Cox merely "relays" the signal it gets from the networks and other local broadcasters. I have no doubt that such is indeed the case.

But each month we get a bill from Cox, and it's Cox whom we pay for the services. I believe that Cox has a RESPONSIBILITY to its ratepayers, to agitate the networks and stations on our behalf, in order to improve the quality of the service (audio and video) THEY receive from those networks and stations.

If Cox washes its hands of that responsibility, I don't believe they are completely fulfilling their contract to provide us with the service WE want, AND pay for.

Certainly Cox would have a greater influence with CBS, NBC. ESPN, etal, than would any individual cable user. Cox ought to be consistently HAMMERING the networks and other stations with DEMANDS that they provide the very best in signals for relay to the community. But instead, Cox stands idly by, and delivers to us an often inferior product.

Why is this so????????

As has been said before in many places, HDTV brings no measurable revenue to local stations. The local stations down here just got the equipment for Nielsen to track digital broadcast viewers, so up until just recently none of them have even had a reliable estimate of the number of HD viewers, let alone any way to charge advertisers for them. The local HD channels also don't even technically bring Cox any revenue, since they are freely available to anyone who has any level of service and the right equipment.

Furthermore, there is no contract with Cox. If you don't like what you receive, you are free to not use them as a provider. It's not like they lock you into a 2 year contract where it's tough **** if you don't like it (*cough* *cough* D*).

The only reason that it's profitable to sell cable and satellite is that things come in packages. If every single subscriber wanted a la carte channels, the administration would be a nightmare and a lot of channels that have small but measureable interest would cease to exist. It also would have prevented a lot of the fine original programming on cable from ever existing. Shows like The Shield, Rescue Me, Nip/Tuck, Monk, and The 4400 would have been in a chicken-and-egg scenario: no one would want to pay for FX or USA without something there to watch, and no one would put shows on those channels without a guarantee of a decent available audience. When was the last time that a new channel was added on any provider that wasn't owned by someone who already had a few channels going, thus practically guaranteeing them carriage?

I AM being fair!!!


I have suspended ny DirectV service until March 1st, 2006. It cost nothing to do that. All equipment remains in place and may be activated sooner (or later) than March 1st, at my option and convenience.

.


What excuse did you give to "suspend" your D* service? I want to do the same thing after NFL Sunday Ticket runs out. I was told I had to keep the minimum Total Choice package service for 2 years in order to get NFL subscription.

coyoteaz,
That was a well described and thought out response. Much better than my hops originated, frosty beverage induced belching of comments that I now look back and feel some bit of remorse, but never-the-less will never delete. So, on to another beverage
Thanks

vegggas

I recently had DTV install an HD Tivo and antenna, only to find that the local digital channels stopped coming in over the antenna (the cheap antenna they installed on the side of my house isn't doing the trick). After much wrangling with DTV and getting some money back, I now need to hire someone to install a better antenna on my roof. Does anyone have any suggestions as to who might do a good job here in Vegas? Referrals are always better than picking a number out of the phone book. Thanks.

mintgreen, It's not necessarily that your DirecTV installer installed a cheap antenna, it's that their antenna is UHF only. Because, unlike most other markets in the country, most digital stations in Las Vegas are VHF you need an antenna that handles both VHF and UHF.

I'd recommend starting with a pair of bunny ears before going to an outdoor install. Often, especially when KVBC is the problem station, they will be all you need.

What excuse did you give to "suspend" your D* service? I want to do the same thing after NFL Sunday Ticket runs out. I was told I had to keep the minimum Total Choice package service for 2 years in order to get NFL subscription.

I didn't use any excuse at all. I simply told them I was leaving town from today until March 1st. No problems.

Maybe its different where football is concerned, because DirectV has an exclusive on it.


As you already know, that means nothing to me, because I wouoldn't care if football disappeared from the face of the earth. And, in fact, wish that it would.

I was watching the Clippers/T-Wolves game tonight and noticed that the graphics at the very bottom of my screen were cut off at the halfway point. Not the actual score, but the player stats that are displayed below that. Is this a problem originating from my end (i.e., my RP Mits not adjusted correctly) or is it something on the broadcaster's end? I have noticed logos on other stations (most notably Fox) cut off slightly also. That makes me suspect it's on my end. Any suggestions would be welcome.

And by the way, my comment earlier concerning the Breeder's Cup was not to suggest that it was Cox's fault/problem. I was merely mentioning Cox so as to give the source of my programming. I kind of figured this could be a national feed situation. Just wanted to know how others saw it.

That's the way it is on my TV too.....I don't know about the NBATV stat line at the bottom but the FOX5 logo that is cut off is on purpose.

There is always some overscan on RP sets, and very limited to none on plasma and LCD panel sets. There is no set amount of overscan and it's depends on your particular set and the particular person doing it on that particular day, etc.
For what it's worth, when Gregg Calibrated my set and reduced my Overscan, I went from a cut-off Fox 5 logo (just seeing "FOX" with the bottom edge cut and no right side ), to the logo sitting about 2 inches above the bottom of the screen, and the right edge completely visible.

vegggas

JoustGod, I'd recommend getting your set professionally calibrated. If that's not possible than you should at least get a service manual and make the adjustements to the overscan settings yourself. Programmers are using a much smaller "safe area" for HDTV so to get the full picture overscan should be minimal.

Thanks for the responses. I may have to get around to having a pro calibration for my set. While I could probably adjust for the overscan myself (not sure how well!), I should just go ahead and get the whole nine yards taken care of.

And another "middle finger" to NBC. for last nights West Wing and two hour Law and Order

The much ballyhooed "live" debate between Jimmy Smits and Alan Alda, as opposing Presidential candidates on the "West Wing" was NOT in HD. The screen said it should be. But it wasn't. Why wasn't Cox on their case immediately?

The "Law and Order" program, did not go HD until 10 minutes after its start.

And another "middle finger" to NBC. for last nights West Wing and two hour Law and Order
NBC didn't screw it up. It was in perfect HD down here and all across the country. Blame KVBC.
The much ballyhooed "live" debate between Jimmy Smits and Alan Alda, as opposing Presidential candidates on the "West Wing" was NOT in HD. The screen said it should be. But it wasn't. Why wasn't Cox on their case immediately?
Why can't you get the fact that Cox isn't responsible for the content that they pass? They never claimed that every local station would be perfect on HD every night. They merely claimed to be providing the local stations' HD signals to their customers. KVBC still passed a 1080i signal, which Cox passed on to you. The fact that the video on it was upsampled is none of Cox's concern. When D* starts offering HD LIL, they won't be responsible for what gets passed either. Even now with the HD DNS, they aren't responsible when stations screw up. KNBC (LA) is carried as the west NBC channel, and they screw something up at least once a week on average.

Why can't you get the fact that Cox isn't responsible for the content that they pass? They never claimed that every local station would be perfect on HD every night. They merely claimed to be providing the local stations' HD signals to their customers. KVBC still passed a 1080i signal, which Cox passed on to you. The fact that the video on it was upsampled is none of Cox's concern. When D* starts offering HD LIL, they won't be responsible for what gets passed either. Even now with the HD DNS, they aren't responsible when stations screw up. KNBC (LA) is carried as the west NBC channel, and they screw something up at least once a week on average.

And YOU don't seem to understand that I am perfectly able to understand that Cox is NOT responsible for what the stations provide them.
On the other hand, I feel that it IS the responsibility of Cox to alert stations such as KVBC that their signal is NOT being transmitted in HD. They obviously have a better chance of reaching the station at an evening hour than does the average viewer. If indeed, it is merely somebody neglecting to flip a switch at the local station, Cox ought to be able to contact them so that such a switch CAN be flipped. They owe it to the satisfaction of their customers.

Cox should be the viewers advocate, and not simply stand by letting things happen as they may.

And YOU don't seem to understand that I am perfectly able to understand that Cox is NOT responsible for what the stations provide them.
On the other hand, I feel that it IS the responsibility of Cox to alert stations such as KVBC that their signal is NOT being transmitted in HD. They obviously have a better chance of reaching the station at an evening hour than does the average viewer. If indeed, it is merely somebody neglecting to flip a switch at the local station, Cox ought to be able to contact them so that such a switch CAN be flipped. They owe it to the satisfaction of their customers.

Cox should be the viewers advocate, and not simply stand by letting things happen as they may.


Soooo as a non Cox user,as I am who owes me for the non HD signal?

Soooo as a non Cox user,as I am who owes me for the non HD signal?

Since you don't use Cox the responsibility falls on your shoulders to contact the station and insist that they transmit what they should be transmitting, or explain why they can't or won't. I have unsuccessfully attempted to do that many times.

If you tacitly and meekly accept the status quo, stations will NEVER raise their quality standards,. But if you try to reach those stations in the evening,,,FORGETTABOUTIT!!!. Not even ONE person at a switchboard is available to the public. So those of us that DO use Cox, can and should, depend on Cox to be our advocates. If they shun this responsibility, they are NOT serving the Las Vegas community of consumers very well. I cannot understand how you can defend Cox in this, or similar matters.

Since you don't use Cox the responsibility falls on your shoulders to contact the station and insist that they transmit what they should be transmitting, or explain why they can't or won't. I have unsuccessfully attempted to do that many times.

If you tacitly and meekly accept the status quo, stations will NEVER raise their quality standards,. But if you try to reach those stations in the evening,,,FORGETTABOUTIT!!!. Not even ONE person at a switchboard is available to the public. So those of us that DO use Cox, can and should, depend on Cox to be our advocates. If they shun this responsibility, they are NOT serving the Las Vegas community of consumers very well. I cannot understand how you can defend Cox in this, or similar matters.


Look, the only time Cox will contact a television station is if they receive an unwatchable signal or no signal at all. They simply don't have the time or the manpower to respond to requests from people because a HD program is being broadcast in SD.

Unless you would like to get as a job as a master control operator, you need to start accepting the fact that humans will make errors and forget to push a button or flip a switch. We are not to the point where we have a flawless system.

Look, the only time Cox will contact a television station is if they receive an unwatchable signal or no signal at all. They simply don't have the time or the manpower to respond to requests from people because a HD program is being broadcast in SD.

.


That's really too bad. Perhaps the fees they charge us for service aren't high enough?

If they have the time and manpower to answer a call from a viewer 24/7 (which they DO), if that viewer complains about a problem, that phone operator (especially if many calls regarding the SAME problem bombard Cox) , ought to have the TIME, INCLINATION and RESPONSIBILITY to contact the offending station her/himself, or to alert a person in authority to do so. IMO, that's the way a "high class" business should be run.

Remember, THE CUSTOMER IS ALWAYS RIGHT, and MUST BE SATISFIED.