Has anyone tried the FusionHDTV3 with QAM on Cox? Are there many unencrypted channels? Does Cox do anything to the line, or can it just plug in and go? Do you need a subscription to the digital cable service?

Unencrypted QAM channels are as follows:
MOD1 103.1 ABC
MOD1 103.2 PBS
MOD2 106.1 CBS
MOD2 106.2 NBC
There are a few static screens and previews, but nothing else worth watching. If you have a full digital connection with no filters in place, you should be able to pick them up on any QAM tuner. If you are paying ONLY for Basic service, then your line may be filtered to only get those channels. If you pay for Basic with HD, they may put a trap filter in place to only remove the expanded service channels.

YMMV

vegggas

Just a reminder that, if you have Digital cable, you can access the recent convention speeches with EOD on channel 998 for free. This includes Ron Regan's landmark speech.
It's not in HD, but it is noteworthy and available for free. If anyone is interested, they should check it out as a preview for when HBO, SHO and others may provide HD on demand shows.

NOTE: Please don't post political comments here. This post was for informational purposes only for the anticipation of HD EOD sometime in the future and a free service that is available to all digital customers right now.

vegggas

Hence, the use of the word "landmark" ;)

Just kidding!



Originally posted by vegggas


NOTE: Please don't post political comments here. This post was for informational purposes only for the anticipation of HD EOD sometime in the future and a free service that is available to all digital customers right now.

vegggas

Channel 10 and Tribune finally worked out the bug and the HD signals are broadcast on 10-1 and 10-2 where the guide says they are.

Yeah I know I found out this morning when my TiVo was recording something from PBS. I don't know if it was my email I sent last week or not.

I picked up a HD DVR from Cox on July 24th, got it hooked up and activated with no problems. It was working fine until Sunday, August 1. I had the Padres channel on watching the game. I went upstairs for a couple of minutes and when I came back downstairs, the picture was frozen. I tried to change channels and got a blank screen on every digital channel. I could tune in channel 96 and below, but nothing above that. I called Cox and they tried sending a signal to the box. I could see the box reboot, but it did not fix the problem. I will be returning this unit for a different one. Hopefully the replacement will last longer.

I'm all for broadcasters using subchannels responsibly to add content (Although I'm not a USDTV fan because it's taking away the opportunity for WB HD OTA), but the loss of the SD simulcast means we have to watch the ugly distorted hd upscan in Las Vegas when ABC isn't broadcasting in HD. Could the KTNV people get their equipment to sidebar like KLAS does?

They could if they wanted to. They just think that people want the picture to fit the screen.

Got an email from Fox 5's engineering dept. regarding FoxHD and Cox:

We are trying to make the Sept. 12th game as the first HD program.
I hope COX will carry us. We are working on it!

Jack Smith

Great!! Sounds like positive news. Football and HD were made for each other....heck, i think a football gridiron is a 16X9 aspect ratio!:D

I haven't noticed HD testing yet, but I think I spotted their HD bug in the corner of SD programming. I'll be crossing my fingers that everything runs smoothly and is ready in time for the NFL. Does anybody know if Fox will be using true 60fps cameras?

I'm buying a used Samsung 165 at a good deal and hooking up to my PJ. So the question I have for those of you using OTA is which antenna are you using locally? My house is at Windmill and Green Valley Parkway and I have a clear view of Black Mountain. I read another thread regarding a Terk and a Radio Shack antenna. I'm leaning towards the RS since it gets both UHF and VHF. Also, depending on your antenna, how well does it work in various places in the house? Is it better in the attic as many have said in other threads. Thanks!

Pat

I'm using a Zenith Silver Sensor right now. It's an unobtrusive indoor antenna and will get all the channels except KVBC. I'd like suggestions on what indoor antenna people have had success with on that channel. if you recieve KTNV with whatever you have now, turn on the football game!

if you recieve KTNV with whatever you have now, turn on the football game!

On the SD analog broadcast, the audio and video is really out of sync at 7pm!!

George- the Silver Sensor is designed to pick up UHF signals. Our digital channels in Las Vegas are VHF. I recommend a powered VHF antenna. Any brand should do, just go to wal-mart and pick one up from the antenna section.

Demodave, analog bad, 720p digital good.

TheNatural, I know, if you've had luck with a specific brand pass it along. KVWB (WB), KFBT (Gold 33) and the spanish channels are UHF and I presume KTUD (UPN) will be when the FCC makes them go digital. So UHF reception is somewhat important (unless you don't watch the SD digital channels). The SS does do an acceptable job of receiving high VHF (7-13), so before I go shop for an antenna I'd like to be sure it will pull in KVBC on channel 2.

PS. Glad we finally got to see some action in the game with the interception.

The Natural, I made a post-game run to Wal-mart to do some grocery shopping and picked up a Philips MANT310 amplified indoor antenna. I can get channel 2 (3-1) on the signal meter now, but after an hour of fiddling and googling for the scientifically optimal dipole positioning I can safely say that KVBC is not going to happen with an indoor antenna. Multipath is just too much of a problem with all the skyscrapers I'm shooting my antenna through. The UHF loop is not effective at recieving many of the UHF dtv channels and the dipole must be adjusted for each VHF channel. I have to recommend the Silver Sensor as the only usuable indoor antenna for many people in the valley. For me, I just point it at Black Mountain and get all the channels minus KVBC. Now, has anybody here done a self install on an outdoor antenna?

Maxthesilent,
After I got my DirecTv HD Tivo, I picked up an open box Jensen TV630 at Best Buy for $9.95, marked down from $19.95. The BB droid told me that only a Terk antenna (~$59) would work, lol, because it was an HDTV antenna.
I am directly north of Black Mountain about 7 miles away, and I get consistently good reception on all the majors, 3, 5, 8, 10 and 13 plus UPN.
The reception on both the digital and analog broadcasts are good. I also get a bunch of other channels that I really haven't watched.

Thanks for the responses! I initally thought I was going to have to go with an outdoor antenna, but it doesn't seem that way. Are any of you placing the antennas in the attic, or are they all near your sets?

Pat

As mentioned a few weeks ago, HBO and Cinemax On Demand service will be added in September to all Cox LV Customers who subscribe to those services. There should be over 100 shows and moves available per channel at no additional cost that can be accessed at any time.
There is no talk of HD VOD at this time, but it would be the next logical step (next year?). It is already known that you can record the VOD to VCR or external devices, but not to the DVR.
More details later.

vegggas

maxthesilent, try an indoor antenna, but buy it from some place you can return it if it doesn't work (i.e. Wal-mart). I'm going to need to install an outdoor antenna eventually to get KVBC. Positioning an indoor antenna is almost completly random because of so many interference causing features of your house. For my situation I get the best reception from on top of a bookcase in my room. In other rooms in my house DTV reception is marginal to non-existent. (Another reason for an outdoor antenna, feed multiple tvs)

Has anyone heard what KVBC's HD coverage of the olympics is going to be? Are they going to show the opening ceramonies at 6:00 or do we have to wait until 9:00. I sent them an email yesterday, but haven't heard back from them.

NBC HD will have a 1 hour delay from the SD coverage. The HD content is a completly different production than the SD production and will have 399 hours of HD viewing.
There will be 1200 hours of Olympics SD coverage on NBC, MSNBC, CNBC, USA, Bravo and Telemundo. AFAIK, BravoHD will only be showing SD coverage and the HD coverage will only be on NBC's HD feed.
On the West coast feeds, all content will be delayed three hours from East coast feeds.

BTW, the coverage will be available on EOD to local digital (COX) customers to view what they want, when they want.

vegggas

- Full 24 hour coverage -
For the first time by a U.S. broadcaster at a Summer Olympics, NBC will provide high definition coverage. NBC's separate, unique HDTV coverage on NBC's digital affiliates, presented by Sony Electronics Inc., will provide HDTV coverage on delay of six sports from the only main Olympic venues provided in high definition by the Olympic host broadcaster. Those sports include swimming, diving, gymnastics, track and field, medal rounds of basketball and the men's soccer gold medal final. The HDTV coverage will total 399 hours and is a completely different production from the standard definition broadcast on the network. NBC has 124 HDTV affiliates with the potential to cover 86 percent of the country.

I had read that there was only one HD feed which would mean to me that if NBC wanted to they could throw the switch at 6:00 and we could watch the Opening Ceramonies before it shows on the analog channel.

They are using both East and West coast feeds for distribution distributed in the US. The single feed you may have heard about may have been the single feed of HD they were sending out of Greece to the NBC studios. The West coast feed is, of course, delayed by three hours. The HD feed is delayed one additional hour on each coast. This applies to the land based OTA and cable stations based on geography. I'm not sure what D* is providing for it's customers for the "Olympic only" NBCHD feed. It may be the East coast feed for the whole US, or a seperate West coast feed - I haven't been following those threads since we can't get the feeds here anyway.

vegggas

lvthunder, more specific to your question, the NBC Olympics thread is thinking that the opening ceremonies are delayed East and West feeds and that there may be a single feed during regular events.
Here is the NBC Olympics thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=4183490#post4183490)

vegggas

Channel Master Model 4030 amplified indoor works very well for me. KVBC ~80% from Silverado Ranch/Spencer. I think your cross streets are even closer to the towers.

Interesting, but we do get the Olympic feed from Directv on channel 84. It's even in DD5.1 which KVBC is not. I figured we would get blacked out of this, but I guess not.

Originally posted by jflatt
Channel Master Model 4030 amplified indoor works very well for me. KVBC ~80% from Silverado Ranch/Spencer. I think your cross streets are even closer to the towers.

Where did you get that and what do they cost? You're further south, but I'm further east, probably a wash!

Perhaps someone can advise me here; I'm wondering what I'll lose (miss).
Moving shortly out of Whitney Ranch to west a few miles near Russell and Pecos. Will have a "side" window whose view contains Blk Mtn; slightly SE.
Would an either indoor or outdoor antenna pick up OTA broadcasts and what's not available?? Broad question, I know......maybe someone lives near there, or can reasonably provide expectations?? There are SOOOOO many pages to this thread I'm overwhelmed, and cannot do Satellite.....
Thanks guys!

Now that the opening ceremonies have played (still looping on HD) and coverage of swimming is being shown, I wanted to provide a summary of what we can get here for coverage.

NBC OTA/Cable CH3 Analog is showing the delayed games - Currently swimming events.
NBC Digital Cable CH 123 - Same as the OTA and Cable Analog feed on Channel 3, but in Digital format. There is no OTA subcarrier for digital OTA - SD, and it's only on cable 123. Unless you have a lot of interference on analog ch 3, this feed looks the same as analog. YMMV.
NBC OTA/Cable HD 2.1 / 733 are showing the OC (Opening Ceremonies) loop for the first 24 hours of additional delay. The local station has Dolby ProLogic equipment, and not DD5.1, so adjust your receiver accordingly.
NBC DirecTV ch 84 is showing the OC (Opening Ceremonies) loop for the first 24 hours of additional delay. DirecTV does have the 5.1 feed, which sounds great on the drum sequence and music being piped around the stadium.

PQ Issues. There have been dropouts on the HD OC, but they appear to be from the source material and are seen in all available feeds.
I'm looking at the OC loop on Direct, cable and OTA. It appears that with clean signals, they are all identical. YMMV with respect to your setup, cabling issues, and signal strength. The DD5.1 direcTV signal sounds the best, but PQ is the same.
Macroblocking seems to be in the original source material of the OC, especially during horizontal panning during vivid scenes. It is very faint, but visible on larger sets. We were able to see it on my 65" from OTA and Cable, and my friends 60" on DirecTV and OTA, but NOT on his Phillips 30" HDTV or 480i HD downconverted material on a SD 52" set.
The HD broadcast is a completly different production from the SD broadcast. During the HD OC we heard the "B" team broadcasting with far less on screen graphics than the SD version. Since this is a different production, we are seeing shots framed for 16x9, but the graphics are still 4x3, except for the NBC logo in the upper right corner of the screen.
Recording looks like a crap shoot right now. Yes, you can record the events in their timeblocks, but under the generic guise of all the events for that time block. for HDTivo users, can you update this post if you get any "specific" data, especially women's beach volleyball which I'm watching right now in Digital SD! :D It "should" be 24 hour delay, but I'm still not sure Who's 24 hour delay that is supposed to be yet.
BTW, for those only watching the HD version later, during the Norway vs. USA game, the commentators discussing the gorgeous Norwegian sand as opposed to the Greek sand is hilarious. I hope to watch this in HD!

vegggas

What's up with the HDTV 733 not showing prime time schedule.

Originally posted by mseagrov
What's up with the HDTV 733 not showing prime time schedule.
In case you haven't already heard, The olympics have started and NBC is doing Olympic coverage from now until August 31. There is no other programming available from NBC. Chanel 733 is a second production channel different from the NBC analog and will televise Olympic coverage delayed 24 hours due to restrictions and national viewing rights. This has been known for several months.
Go to http://www.nbcolympics.com for more details.

vegggas

A data point -

I bought the $30 Channel Master at Fry's - 27 elements. I mounted it on my roof, two stories...it is very important to point it in the correct direction - I am near Eastern and Flamingo, and so need to point at 150 degrees.

Such information is to be had at antennaweb dot org.

I am using a DVICO fusion III QAM, and have a expanded basic COX connection. I get all of the local english OTA with >100% signal, and the unencrypted cable stuff. The other OTA digital stuff can be 100% if I wished to point the antenna that way.

I recorded the Olympics opening ceremony, and 45 minutes of HD made about 6 GB of file.

Hope this is useful.

Any one out there using an HD-Tivo getting audio & video breakups on channel 3.1. I am getting a signal of 83-86 on the meter in the box. Could it be a channel 3 problem because of weather as the first time it was really bad was during the storms on Thursday and it has been doing it on & off all day today. Also i checked the internal tuner on my TV and was also getting breakups but not as bad as the HD-Tivo

Is there a place on this forum board where I can list my TV for sale? I have to sell my 2003 65" Mitsubushi Diamond 65711. I can't find a "For Sale" or "Classifieds" section.

Thanks!

Toby

Toby you can list it in the special Videgon section.

I sold a receiver and a couple of ReplayTV units there.

Are you going to replace the Mits with a projector?

Steve

Originally posted by vegggas
DVI will not be released by SA until September or October.

Will the patch come over "naturally" or will we have to do something specific at some point and time?

I live in an apartment on Washington and Buffalo. I recently purchased a
Toshiba 36", 4:3 ratio, HDTV monitor
I decided I didn't want to go through Cox in order to explore the OTA world of HDTV. I bought a Samsung SIR-T150 Decoder for $150.00. It arrived today, so I went to Radio Shack and picked up the antenna #15-1880. I have experimented with this darned antenna, and I can't get anything except for 11-1 and 5-1. I didn't realize that Las Vegas uses VHF until I figured out that only by moving the rabit ears I was able to affect reception. I live in an apartment that only has western exposure. I can't affix an external antenna. What would you guys do if you were me? I have Cox basic cable, but I am weary of how much more it would cost to get HDTV through cox. I would appreciate any suggestions.

Originally posted by HiHoStevo
Toby you can list it in the special Videgon section.

I sold a receiver and a couple of ReplayTV units there.

Are you going to replace the Mits with a projector?

Steve

No...But I'm getting a smoking deal on an '04 Mitsubishi 50" plasma. The room my wife let me have for my home theater will not accomodate the 65711. I had Greg from Lion AV calibrate it so I'm having to eat that extra cost :( It's hard downsizing though...I love the big picture on the 65".

Toby

Toby,

Good luck with the Plasma... most of those I have seen have beautiful pictures!

Steve

RogersRanger, I just got my outdoor antenna installed. They will look really obtrusive to the eye for about a day or so, but then they'll blend into the scenery. Still you might not be out of luck on VHF reception just yet. I'd try the cheapest pair of bunny ears possible placed as high in the tv room as you can (and extend the dipoles fully horizontally.) If you're lucky you'll get 3-1, and 8-1, 13-1, otherwise it's time to get an outdoor antenna. Go to antennaweb to find out what size you'll need and which direction to point it.

P.S. Does anybody know if KTUD is anywhere close to turning on their digital signal? I hope they'll get to it sometime before the FCC makes them do it.

Unfortunately, KTUD is exempt from having to put out a DT signal as they are licensed as a low power station. LP Stations are not yet required to go digital. And being as they run on a shoestring budget, they will never spend the money. They don't even pass stereo audio, and that's been around for 21 years! Also, Jack Smith at KVVU tells me they have their HD encoder ordered, and will install probably next week. They expect to switch to 720p HD Sept. 12th.

hdtvxpert, that's too bad to hear that we likely won't be getting UPN digital ota in the valley before the FCC deadline. KINC (Univision) hasn't sold their bandwith to USDTV yet so they could theoretically multicast the signal, but I doubt KTUD cares enough about the currently incredibly small audience to try and make a deal.

KTUD was recently purchased by a group that also has interests in the Las Vegas Sun. It's 50/50 as to what that means...

http://www.klas-tv.com/Global/story.asp?S=1790175&nav=168XMLPi

http://www.lasvegassun.com/sunbin/stories/consumer/2004/aug/12/517328119.html

gworkman, well I guess we can try writing letters to the editor to get hd UPN now. :)

Hey guys,
Any new info on Fox?

Originally posted by tazlv
Got an email from Fox 5's engineering dept. regarding FoxHD and Cox:

We are trying to make the Sept. 12th game as the first HD program.
I hope COX will carry us. We are working on it!

Jack Smith

Well, so far nothing but irritation with the new STB and antenna. I can only receive 5-1, 21-1 and 33-1. None of the others. I moved the antenna, the Radio Shack 15-1880 all over the room, the house and into the attic with no luck. Actually, the attic got no reception. I think I shall try another antenna tomorrow!

Originally posted by GeorgeLV
gworkman, well I guess we can try writing letters to the editor to get hd UPN now. :)

The Sun story talks about the new ownership wanting to create "new" programming. Hopefully, they don't turn this station into a "community interest" station and drop the UPN affiliation. We'll have to wait "shortly" for what they mean by "new programming".

I am thinking about buying a HDTV (mitsubishi) with a built in digital hdtv tuner that accepts cable cards rather than using the hdtv box from Cox. Is the cable card option available yet from Cox, and , if so, has anyone here attempted to go that route yet and , if so, any problems using the card vs the standalone hdtv cox box? thanks

My dad is thinking about buying a TV with cablecard in it too. How much does it cost. I know Cox has cablecard because they have used it at CES in the past. Vegggas might know more. He seems to know about everything from Cox.

I don't know the prices for cablecard rentals, but they should be much cheaper than STB's or practically free once you order the premium services that you are wishing to descramble. They are owned by the cable company and leased to users and must be returned when you cancel your subscription, just like a STB.
Cable card is NOT needed for HD locals. They are unencrypted already and available if you have a QAM tuner and full access to the system.

Quick reference notes about cable cards:
They are not magic devices and do not do anything your TV doesn't already do. A card enabled device only allows decryption of scrambled content. Think of a similarity to D*'s smartcard/access cards.

Their ONLY job is decrypt the digital transport stream that your TV tunes and sends to it. There is no tuner or any PQ effecting components inside.

The local Cable Co has to authorize the card to decrypt the certain streams that you subscribe to.

As far as quality goes, it is wholly and totally dependent on your DTV tuner inside the TV and the way it handles the transport signal. The decryption process in the cable card does not affect PQ.

Current cablecard technology standards are 1-way only. There is no provision for any 2-way information, such as the interactive program guide (IPG), PPV purchase, EOD or other services. The standards are just now becoming finalized and Panasonic has a lab demo of 2-way communication, but don't expect products available until the end of 2005 next year.

Current 1-way TV's and cards are NOT upgradeable to 2-way communication in the future.

Channel mapping "may" be affected by the way your TV set tunes digital channels. By default, your TV will tune major and minor channel numbers, such as 103.1 for ABCHD, 103.2 for PBSHD, etc. The card should be able to "remap and overlay" the digital channel lineup that is the same as the cable systems lineup, but there have been a few problems between cards and sets displaying that information.

Cable co's can't "see" the cable card from the Headend (1-way limitation). They have to send a tech to install the card then send a download to the serial number, then verify that it got the correct channels requested.


My opinion is that it does work, costs less than STB rentals and eliminates the STB from the PQ issues where a TV will not adjust an HD input.. If you think the STB is the weak link in the PQ, then this will ultimately let your own equipment be the determining factor. The downside is that your TV is just a TV. It is not capable of interactivity with the cable system yet, so if you use any of those features, they are not available. The only features available are what came with your set.
I like and own Mits products, but Panasonic is the leader in this particular field and is months to years ahead of everyone else in development and applications.
If you are ready to buy a set and this is available, go ahead and try it. You can always use a STB if you don't like it. If you are only thinking of getting a set because of this technology, you may want to wait for the next generation 2-way card enabled sets next year.

vegggas

Originally posted by maxthesilent
Well, so far nothing but irritation with the new STB and antenna. I can only receive 5-1, 21-1 and 33-1. None of the others. I moved the antenna, the Radio Shack 15-1880 all over the room, the house and into the attic with no luck. Actually, the attic got no reception. I think I shall try another antenna tomorrow!

Ok, I got rid of the RS and got a Jensen and a Terk at Best Buy. The Jensen is working real good so far, it just has to be moved around a lot. The Terk wasn't bad, it was just too cumbersome-it kept falling over and the cable came out from an under it, so it toppled it over. The Jensen should do until I go to an outdoor.

Pat

maxthesilent, I'm suprised you spent money on a Terk antenna with their bad reputation. Once you get an outdoor pointed adequately you won't need to worry about fumbling things around. An outdoor should also give you good analog reception of KVBC (NBC-HD olympics are very out of date and loop several times a day) and KTUD (UPN-no digital signal) as well.

Vegggas, nice summary about cablecard. I'm looking at the Mits xx515 TVs. It sucks about the no two-way thing. Still I'm betting I'd rather get a 8000 HD and hook it up via firewire than go cablecard right now....

Originally posted by GeorgeLV
maxthesilent, I'm suprised you spent money on a Terk antenna with their bad reputation. Once you get an outdoor pointed adequately you won't need to worry about fumbling things around. An outdoor should also give you good analog reception of KVBC (NBC-HD olympics are very out of date and loop several times a day) and KTUD (UPN-no digital signal) as well.

The Terk is going back today, I'll hang onto the Jensen. George, you said you had an outdoor installed, can you give me the info on who did it for you? And as a general question, where is PBS's antenna? I've gotten everything else in one form or another except PBS. I seem to recall it was in an odd location.

Pat

maxthesilent, it's odd you don't get PBS, since it and Fox are the two channels I can get with a coat hanger. Anyhow, anybody that does satellite dish installs should be able to install an outdoor VHF/UHF antenna for you, or you can sign up for USDTV and they'll do it for you at a heavily subsidized price, but you have to use their service for 12 months (rent to own a receiver) or pay $199 for the equipment to break the contract. You may be able to find a similarary subsidized deals if you sign up for DirecTV of Dish HD service (because for obvious reasons HD locals can't be carried by sat anytime soon).

maxthesilent, btw, all of the digital stations are on Black Mountain and Potosi. From most locations in the valley they're in the same general direction (a few degrees apart) so a single directional antenna pointed between them should have no excuse for not picking up all of them. There are a few odd ball low-power analog stations that aren't pointed that way, but I'd doubt they watched by many, if any, people.

I wonder if we can get a list together of all the ongoing and persistent glitches the digital stations in Vegas have. What I've noticed:

KVBC 3-1 (NBC): None so far, but I've only had reception of this station since the 3rd day of 24hr HD olympics coverage.

KVVU 5-1 (Fox): No current issues, but upgrade to HD is coming soon.

KLAS 8-1 (CBS): No current issues.

KLVX "10-1" (PBS-HD): Bad program guide data, channel not remapped from 11-1.
KLVX "10-2" (PBS Local): Bad program guide data, channel not remapped, stops broadcasting sometimes even though there is analog programming that it should be simulcasting.

KTNV 13-1 (ABC): Bad program data. HD programs apparantly switched manually and the operator is often a minute late.
KTNV 13-2 (ANN): Bad program guide data.

KINC "15-1" (Univision): No program guide data, channel not remapped from 16-1, empty subchannel on 16-2.

KVWB 21-1 (WB): No current issues.

KFBT 33-1 (Ind.): No current issues.

KBLR 39-1 (Telemundo): No current issues.

If anybody has recurring issues that aren't on this list I'd like to hear them.

KLVX has fixed the channel not being remapped. At least on the HDTiVo. The guide data appears to be good too (at least on 10-1). Haven't looked at 13 because I don't get it at my house.

lvthunder, are you sure you HDTiVo is getting its guide info from the PSIP data and not the net? The PSIP guide data my tuner displays is an hour behind what's actually showing. The channel remapping is broken for me even if I delete the channel and add it again. At least the KLVX guide data is wrong in a consistent manner, KTNV is totally broken.

I think the TiVo gets its guide data for the local channels from Directv. If it's an hour behind maybe it will be correct when time changes.

I just flipped to 3-1 and noticed the womens soccer games was on in SD. Did the program director get fed up with the loop?

EOD - Cox news -
I just noticed that you have a chance to win a Philips 46" HDTV set when ordering some of their movies before the end of the month.
Other than that, here is some more news:
The Republican convention events will be available on EOD if you care to watch them for free.
On the first of the month, the EOD channel will move to chanel 1. If your STB defaults to 1 when powering up, you may want to change that in the settings.
HBO and Cinemax EOD are supposed to start Sept. 13th and will be available alongside the current HBO and Cinemax digital channels. This is an EXTRA channel dedicated to those services for no extra charge. If you subscribe to HBO, you get HBO EOD for free. Looks like I may be able to catch up on the Sopranos after all.
NO word on HD EOD availability, but widescreen versions are common on the main EOD channel, so we should see the same here.

The Sept 13th date of adding those EOD channels makes me wonder if the FOX HD signal will added at that same time. It is slated for ch 734 and they don't typically have more than one channel lineup change every quarter.

vegggas

vegggas, will KVVU and Cox be ready by then? I haven't seen the upconverting to 720p yet, so I wonder if Cox will be willing or able to add them before they have something they can work with and test for at least a week.

vegggas, have you heard anything on the mystery network, CSTV, that bought up the Mountain West rights? The quotes from the Cox people in the paper indicated there was a possibilty that it could be added in HD.

CSTV is available on D*..They also broadcast thier HD games on INHD (They will be showing BYU vs. Stanford on Saturday, September 11th at 7pm)....Ive seen a couple of College Baseball games but haven't seen the College Football coverage....You can also get it on MobiTV the Sprint PCS Vision app. (Thats where I can see it.....frame by frame...lol)
www.collegesports.com

KVVU has mentioned (although not directly to me, but to others in this forum) that they should be able to go live for Sept 12th. There is no testing needed for rebroadcasting a local HD signal over Cox. They already have a QAM Modulator and the space reserved for Fox. All that is needed is for the two to agree to retransmit the signal and it's passed through to the cable viewers.
Haven't heard anything on CSTV, but things are still forming. If Cox Corporate makes a decision, it will be in the news and we should hear something. If select games are on INHD, then that will give us the minimal HD coverage until something is announced. My question is what percentage of HD coverage is CSTV going to have for the next year or two? If it's less than 5 -10%, then their SD channel with INHD showing the HD games would make more sense until they can launch a full HD channel on their own sometime in the future.

vegggas

vegggas, Sam Boyd's wiring will be upgraded to support HD (if it doesn't already) in the for the Vegas Bowl, so when the CSTV contract starts they should have another venue if they're willing rent a truck for a Rebels game.

Hi Folks,

Just thought I would summarize my attenna reception near Anasazi and Summerlin Parkway with an indoor antenna.

I got a Phillips set of rabbit ears and could get virtually nothing digital ota with my HD-Tivo and DirectV.

With a Terk 55 I get 3.1, 5.1, 10.1, 13.1 and 13.2.

The following are the OTA antenna signals with the DirectV test.

Ch

Hi Folks,

Just thought I would summarize my attenna reception near Anasazi and Summerlin Parkway with an indoor antenna.

I got a Phillips set of rabbit ears and could get virtually nothing digital ota with my HD-Tivo and DirectV.

With a Terk 55 I get 3.1, 5.1, 10.1, 13.1 and 13.2.

The following are the OTA antenna signals with the DirectV test.

Ch

Hi Folks,

Just thought I would summarize my attenna reception near Anasazi and Summerlin Parkway with an indoor antenna.

I got a Phillips set of rabbit ears and could get virtually nothing digital ota with my HD-Tivo and DirectV.

With a Terk 55 I get 3.1, 5.1, 10.1, 13.1 and 13.2 quite well. No CBS.

The following are the OTA antenna signals with the DirectV test.

Ch Input 1 Input 2
3.1 59 60
5.1 51 51
8.1 Nothing Nothing
10.1 76 73
13.1 88 89
13.2 50 50
33.1 50 50

Interestingly enough the signal on the OTA test did not correspond directly to these channels but generally to a channel or two below what I listed, but obviously the signals are tied to the digital channels coming in.

Whatever bad you can say about Terk it works for me and I don't have to fit an outdoor or inattic antenna. This simply lays in the back of the space for my TV on the floor and works swimmingly well for now.

Perry

Sorry for the truncated early messages.

PK

Cox San Diego is beta testing the DVI port and other software for the 8000HD box. Expect a minimum of a few weeks of testing before it can be released or tweaked enough to be put out for testing in other markets.
No details yet, but pass through and Auto-DVI are some of the current features being tested.
San Diego and Phoenix are sister Cox companies under the same high level corporate management (regional) as Las Vegas. Phoenix should release their 8000HD box in September, probably with all the newer software.
I'm thinking that we will get updates after the channel lineup changes for Fox and EOD are done in the middle of September.

vegggas

Originally posted by vegggas
Cox San Diego is beta testing the DVI port and other software for the 8000HD box. Expect a minimum of a few weeks of testing before it can be released or tweaked enough to be put out for testing in other markets.
No details yet, but pass through and Auto-DVI are some of the current features being tested.
San Diego and Phoenix are sister Cox companies under the same high level corporate management (regional) as Las Vegas. Phoenix should release their 8000HD box in September, probably with all the newer software.
I'm thinking that we will get updates after the channel lineup changes for Fox and EOD are done in the middle of September.

vegggas

Good news vegggas...been waiting to get the 8000HD box until the DVI connection was ready and tested. Will be on my way to Rancho as soon as the new software is ready

:D

Opinion - editorial-
If the DVI was the only thing you were waiting for, then you may have been missing out on a lot. The 8000HD, even with any bugs or problems it may have or features it may be lacking - has taken over my other DVR units, my HTPC, and even to a high degree, my DVD players. I've now become the new version of the internet surfer, the "movie surfer".

While watching one movie, I'll segue into a similar movie, genere or actor and do a search on the unit and record another movie I wouldn't have bothered to watch. Sort of like a "six degrees of ---" or something. My wife and I will disagree about so-and-so being in a movie or playing a part, and we search for it and BAM it's recorded. I then start winning all bets between the two of us - Hee hee hee.

Like the Tivo and Replay units before it, it's just an adaptation to the way you watch TV. If the picture quality of the Tivo was like this (and I'm not comparing the HDTivo) when I had it and if I had every channel possible with it, I might have done this earlier. The sheer volume of content and movie channels now make it so that at any given time, your bound to find most titles you look for.
Too bad the Replays are analog only. I really did like their interface best. It was a pain to have it tethered to the STB for digital recording, and now the PQ is no longer an issue. The Replays are going to be retired soon, especially once the 8300 is here. They are sitting virtually unused, except for the hard drives just getting fuller and fuller everyday.
Some like this unit, and some always find fault - YMMV
End - editorial - and opinion

vegggas

My sources are getting word that Fox is not quite ready for the end of month testing other markets may be doing right now. The good news is they are dedicated and committed to getting HD to Las Vegas for the Kickoff on Sept 12th! It sounds like the worst case scenario is that we will get HD for the game from the Fox network, and then there will be some tweaking needed afterwords to do local feeds and upconversion.
I have no problem with that scenario if they let the network control the HD feeds while it takes a few extra days to get the local feed nailed down. The unknowns are if Cox and Fox have an agreement in place yet for distribution (no public announcment yet). On top of that if Fox only has Network HD feeds, will they be able to supply Cox with a digital feed, complete with local programming and station advertising as a complete product or will they have to wait until the station is finished with all the conversion before cable distribution.

It sounds like everyone is working hard and we are hoping for the best.
Thanks KVVU and Fox5 guys!

vegggas

Glad to hear that DVI maybe available soon.... it was not a quality issue for me (although that extra is nice), but rather that I already have all 3 component inputs filled up on my reciever... I do still have a couple of open spots on the DVI switcher............

Ps. Did anyone else experience numerous audio (and occasional video breakups) on the HD version of Monday Night Football?

Steve

Originally posted by HiHoStevo


Ps. Did anyone else experience numerous audio (and occasional video breakups) on the HD version of Monday Night Football?

Steve

Yes, glad to hear it wasn't just me. Does anyone know how to record monday night football and start watching like halfway through (when i get home from work) while it's still recording?

I had to hit rewind and rewind all the way through to the beginning (while not looking at the TV so i dont see the score!) ANy help with this one??

Seems there have been breakups quite a bit since Saturday, started with Olympics HD on 733, then last night with MNF. In fact, the beginning of the game on 732 was in the local network's usual blurry, upconverted(stretched 480i???), unwatchable picture. I turned away to a movie for a while, then switched back around the middle of 1st quarter and voila, the HD feed was working.

As an aside, this morning had absolutely no digital or HD channels (I live near Hollywood and Charleston). Cox was working on the problem, and feeds came back around 5:45am.

I had some pretty bad audio and video breakups, especially in the 3rd and 4th quarters. I checked the levels on the box and they were fine (tuner=+2db), but the number next to the levels (don't know what this means, ?/sec) was in the red, but only for 732 and 733. When tuning to other HD channels and other digital or analog channels, everything was fine, so it seemed like this was some type of issue with the equipment modulating those channels only. I guess it could also have been a problem with Cox's reception from Channel 13....

Keith

Yep, that's what I saw also.......All other HD stations were okay, in fact we decided to watch Ice Age on HBO 710, great picture and sound, no problems. Ah, all this new technology, ain't it great?

I am finally ready to take the HD plunge, but I have a question regarding SD picture quality since much of my TV viewing is on those channels. I had read in other forums that for whatever reason, SD PQ is poor on many of the channels after passing through the STB. Thats why I am interested in a Digital Cable Ready HDTV using the CableCARD technology. I read that SD pic quality is much better when the signal is directly fed into the HDTV bypassing the STB. Can any of you confirm this for the Las Vegas Cox Cable market analog signals? Thanks for your help :)

I watch mostly SD channels on my HD set, and the PQ is acceptable for me, I was far more worried about the set PQ than of the STB. Though I'm sure the less crap you do to the signal the better it looks.. from coax to composite to the set is probably not as good as coax to cablecard. The only thing about cablecard is what vegggas mentioned previously.

in addition to the cablecard statments earlier in this thread at This Post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=4231752#post4231752) I have a few other comments.
You are basically right that the TV should show better PQ than any other STB tuner device. The main reason is that most TV's will have circuitry that scales the image and smooths out analog signal imperfections. The biggest problem with the HD STB's, specifically the 8000HD, is that the analog signal is usually passed to the TV via the component cables in an upconverted signal, like 1080i with very poor scaling from the STB. Most TV's will not apply any of their proprietary signal conditioning and line doubling, to any signals other than 480i native signals.
When watching analog recordings, I typically change the output of the 8000 to 480i widescreen out the component jacks. This gives me a decent 4x3 image that my TV will line double and I can use my TV's 3/2 pulldown circuitry to make the image much cleaner. I can then use the TV to stretch the image how I want, if I want. In HD modes, the TV will not alter the incoming signals. Last warning, not all digital sets are equal when showing analog signals. When shopping, ask to look at analog signals from cable or OTA (not digital) to get a better feel for the set.
Oh yeah, once you start watching a lot of HD, especially with a DVR, you may not watch as much analog anymore..., But all the analog channels are in the clear and can be tuned by any modern tuner.

vegggas

Just out of curiosity, how many of us are watching on front projection setups?

Me........ BenQ 8700+

Thanks Vegggas for your expertise. You generally tend to explain things in a way that most average users can understand pretty well. You almost have to be a rocket scientist to buy a TV these days :rolleyes:

Since the SD PQ can be a bit modified if needed, as you indicated, then I see no real advantage at this point to go the CableCARD route and lose the extra interactive features from Cox. But, it may be more useful for a second TV in another smaller room when they come out with smaller CARD ready sets. I think I read elsewhere that Cox charge for cableCARD is $2/month.

I don't understand why there has to be a monthly charge for the cablecard. If I understand it correctly it is just a smart card like the access cards for Directv and Dish Network. The card probibly only costs 50 cents or so. To me it seems it would be like a credit card company charging you $2 a month to get a credit card. If you read the back of your credit card it claims that the card belongs to the bank and you must give it up upon request. Also if you had two of these cards would you still be charged a $5 a month mirroring fee like it is now if you rent two STB's.

Cable cards are effectively the same as a PCMCIA card that a laptop would use, and the same form factor. These devices are similar to a smartcard in what they do, but much more secure. The transport stream is derived from the TV tuner and passed through the card for authorization and decryption (or something like that) and then sent back to the TV.
I'm not sure what Cox is charging, but I'm under the impression that there is no charge if you subscribe to any level of digital service, other than just a digital gateway. So if you order HBO or something, it is most likely included with that service.

GVC, The benefit of Cable card is that you use all your own equipment, don't have to deal with all the cables and remotes, and PQ will be determined by your set for both analog and digital channels. The STB allows all your other features, but you can still route all the SD Analog signals to your TV if you want to, since none of them are scrambled.

vegggas

are ALL the digital signals scrambled on Cox Las Vegas including the non-premium ones? If so, then splitting the cable directly into a digital cable ready hdtv will still only be able to pick up the analog stations (channels 1-99) unless a cableCARD is used ?

The local HD stations aren't encypted. There are a few other but they are those channels that nobody watches. So basically it's 1-99 and 730-733.

Originally posted by vegashomes
Just out of curiosity, how many of us are watching on front projection setups?

I have a FP, but I'm not using it as much as my RPTV right now. Anyway, it's a Marantz VP-12L2 throwing a 92" diagonal image. Here's some pics. (http://members.cox.net/maxthesilent/midvale_home_theater.htm)

Pat

I have confirmed with Cox Las Vegas that the CableCARD rental will cost $1.99 per month.

Noticed that Cox has added 4 EOD channels on 199 , 239, 298 and 498 any word on if those channels will be special EOD channels or all the same as 998. Also why is KTNV (ABC) stretching all its non HD programming,it looks horrible.

The streching is KTNV's preference. I agree it looks horrible that's why I only watch HD on that channel. As for the EOD I don't know but it might be EOD for the movie channels. I don't get any of those so I have no idea.

Anybody else notice it took KVBC 45 minutes to flip the HD switch for Hawaii?

Not yet. It's on my TiVo though. Was it any good?

lvthunder, it was basically CSI: Hawaii, with the CSI prefix removed so NBC doesn't get sued. Even it's it's not exactly dramatic excellence, the tropical landscape should make good demo material if you want to show off HD to your friends.

Originally posted by tazlv
Noticed that Cox has added 4 EOD channels on 199 , 239, 298 and 498 any word on if those channels will be special EOD channels or all the same as 998. Also why is KTNV (ABC) stretching all its non HD programming,it looks horrible.
Currently these are standard EOD added in, but they will be the movie channel EODs that will be included with your subscription to HBO and Cinemax.
From the earlier post -
HBO and Cinemax EOD are supposed to start Sept. 13th and will be available alongside the current HBO and Cinemax digital channels. This is an EXTRA channel dedicated to those services for no extra charge. If you subscribe to HBO, you get HBO EOD for free. Same with Cinemax.

You should have had your STB royally screwed up by now, because they are moving things around. They were putting the EOD on 1 and other places and resetting and locking up a lot of boxes. They are pushing the EOD really hard because they are removing a majority of the PPV channels to make way for more (HD) channels and services. Fox should start next week, but without any confirmation, I'm not sure about TNT and Bravo starting yet.

NBC had some problems with the West coast feed, making the Hawaii episode 16x9 in a 4x3 window until about the 40 min mark. Same thing happened the previous night with Father of the Pride, etc. There are some other problems going on too.

vegggas

The Charger Game on Fox Sports West (49) is not being shown. Now, I know that the Chargers are not considered a local team under the NFL rules (unlike Baseball). Is the local blackout because the local ABC affiliate is showing the Raider game?

Can anyone reccomend an outdoor antenna to get OTA HD channels? I am in Green Valley Ranch (Valle Verde/Paseo Verde area), no more than 3-4 miles from the antennas on Black Mountain. We have tried both a Terk and RCA indoor antenna, but don't get all the stations. We have DirecTV and I have heard there are antennas that connect directly to the satellite. Also I was told that we might be too close to the towers and either the signal is too strong or is shooting over us. Either way I am looking where I can get a decent outdoor antenna.

I have seen outdoor antennas at Lowes or Fry's. Which stations are you getting now. I live on Horizon Ridge and Gibson and the mountain blocks the transmitters from seven hills which means no ABC or CBS for me. I doubt the signal is too strong but to be sure you can buy an attenuator at Radio Shack.

Depends. Sometimes we couldn't get 13 and 3 and other times we couldn't get 8. How are the outdoor ones hooked up to the satelitte? Are there any extra cables you need to run inside to the receiver?

Rick, you could be at a weird orientation where the stations on Potosi (that's what my installer said, lvthunder just called them Seven Hills) are more than a few degrees apart from the towers on Black Mountain. I'm far enough away in the center of town that I can get all of the OTA stations in by pointing my antenna in between the two tower sites, but you may need a two antennas and a combiner. First I'd try to figure out where to point your antenna by looking at what the analog signal is doing on your set with the exception of KVVU which has their digital on the KLVX tower.

lvthunder, have you tried aiming for reflections? If you have a rotator it should be easy enough to test out (turn to analog 8 or 13 and see which orientation has the fewest multipath distortion then check and see if the digital has enough strength to come in.)

Yeah I've tried looking for reflections. I've never seen the signal meter above 0 on those stations.

I was under the impression that the towers for channels 3, 5, 8, 10, and 13 were all atop Black Mtn. I think going with an external antenna connected to our satellite will be our best bet. Can someone explain how they are connected to the satellite? Do you need to run any extra cables inside?

No only 3,5, and 8 are on Black Mountain. 10 and 13 are to the west of black mountain. As for the sat antennas from what I heard they are bad. You can try one though. How they hook up depends on the multiswitch. Some have a spot for them and some don't.

If you have not done so yet, I suggest that you go to www.antennaweb.org (http://www.antennaweb.org) . From there you choose an antenna and put in your address and zip code. It will show all the OTA stations and where they are located according to your location.

vegggas

I, too, have DirectV and the Hughes Tivo and use an OTA antenna.

I tried the Terk 55 for a bit and it worked nicely but never got 8 and 3,13. I could orient it for one or the other (8 or 3 and 13 but not both).

I took the 55 back and got the 44 which fits to the HDTV dish.

It was an incredibly ez install. Simply fit the antenna over the dish and moved the cables from the LNBs into the 4 antenna out male fittings and fitted the short 4 extensions from the antenna to the LNB male fittings. Took about 5 minutes. No other wiring, as it pulls power off the dish. Hooked up the diplexer (4 supplied, only needed one for my only HDTV of my 4 TVs) and voila, could get with modest tweaking 3, 5, 8 and 13 very well. In the process I lost a strong signal on 33, but got all the major players.

Question, does 33 broadcast the Cardinal games in HD. If not I won't even worry about a UHF loop to reacquire 33-1. If it does I will add a UHF loop for that channel.

Perry

I am in Summerlin near 315 and Summerling Parkway.

I noticed today that fox 5 is broadcasting two stations today. 5-1 is 720p and 5-2 is 480i. 5-1 doesn't have any sound. How long has this been going on? I guess they will be ready for football season.

Either today or yesterday is when they started that. I had checked on Tuesday and 5.1 was 480i.

I wonder why they are multicasting though. I hope they don't do that when the true HD is going

Ugh, channel 5 is on stretch-o-vision. Hopefully I we all complain fast enough they'll pillarbox it. (More tv/stb can strecth/zoom pillarbox then can pillarbox stretch-o-vision). I won't dock them for the subchannel if it's true that the Fox will compress the network feed at 15mpbs.

lvthunder, I'm pretty sure KVVU's digital is not on black mountain and that they are sharing a tower with KLVX for digital transmission.

(From Doug Lung's RF Current Issue 235)
"KVVU Broadcasting Corporation, licensee of station KVVU-TV, NTSC Channel 5 in Henderson, Nevada has requested the substitution of DTV Channel 9 for its assigned DTV Channel 24. KVVU stated the change would allow it to replicate 99.9% of the population and 108.8% of the area currently served by KVVU-TV. It will also enable it to share an antenna and transmission line with KLVX-DT, channel 11 in Las Vegas and reduce its operating costs for electric power usage."

Some more FCC notes that shed light on why we have some many VHF stations and DTV assignments that are next to a station's analog assignment. For some reason the FCC has been very receptive in making allocation changes that allow our local broadcasters to save a lot of money by diplexing.

(From Doug Lung's RF Current Issue 221)
"FCC Grants Change to DTV Table of Allotments in Las Vegas, Nevada (June 29)
The FCC has granted the request of Journal Broadcast Corporation, licensee of KTNV, NTSC Channel 13 in Las Vegas, Nevada, to substitute DTV channel 12 for channel 17. Innovative Technologies, Inc., licensee of LPTV station KEEN-LP, Channel 17 in Las Vegas filed comments supporting the channel change request.

The FCC agreed the public interest would be served by the substitution since it could enable KTNV to achieve a net gain in interference-free television service. The technical parameters of the Channel 12 DTV allotment to Las Vegas specify an effective radiated power of 26.4 kW at a height above average terrain of 610 meters serving a population of 738,000."

ft800, KVVU isn't quite ready, the strech-o-vision should be gone during network programming if the splicer is turned on. No dice today, but hopefully it will be done by the 12th.

Didn't notice this on Thursday during the national splicer testing... It must have just started Friday...
Is it me, or are the only stations doing the upconverted stretch the 720P stations? I've only noticed ABC, ESPN, and now FOX doing the stretch. We will have to give them some more time to see what happens.
AFAIK, they were trying to be online by the 12th to show the games and anything before that is just "testing". I don't think the Fox network will be sending anything over 480P until then, so there shouldn't be any HD content except for possibly a "test" loop or feed from the network.
The good news is that they can start testing the ad-insertion and other local feed stuff now, before the season kicks off. If all that works, there is a greater chance of being fed to the cable company for redistribution on their network too.

vegggas

I noticed today while watching the ESPN gameplan games that the Picture-in-Picture window will not show a pay per view event. I was trying to watch two games at once but only the main window event showed up. Swapping was allowed but the PIP window still didnt show the PPV event channel when swapped. So, if you wanted to keep an eye on a PPV ESPN game while watching a game on ABC or whatever, it wont work. :mad:

Anybody else getting dropouts in pic and audio and also pixilation? Also any broadband drops as well?
Thanks Steve

PS I am over in the Rainbow Gowan area.

Any specifics? Which STB? Not seeing problems in my area, but each area is different.
You mention your broadband is having problems too. That could point to an RF problem either in the home or locally after the node.
Sent you a PM too.

vegggas

These questions may have been covered, but is Fox HD channel on Cox yet and are the 8000HD boxes pass through feature working?

No FoxHD yet on Cox. I'm hoping for sept 12...

Originally posted by gergg
These questions may have been covered, but is Fox HD channel on Cox yet and are the 8000HD boxes pass through feature working?
Fox has a signal that many of us have been monitoring since they started upconverting on Friday, but They are not finished yet. Cox should have a feed next week to rebroadcast so that when Fox does actually show HD content it should be available. As a reminder, all content right now is upconverted and stretched to widescreen, like ESPN was and ABC appears to do now, and no network HD is scheduled until the 12th. The local station is, AFAIK, not doing any HD content, other than what the national network feeds are showing.
The 8000HD has been going through beta testing locally of the latest software with DVI and passthrough features. Go to the thread for the 8000HD on SARA and Cox (in the recorders section) for more info on results. My current testing shows the passthrough and DVI is identical to the 3250's operation.

vegggas

vegggas, I suspect KVVU has to fix the sporadic flashing to color bars on 5-1 (the 720p upconvert) before the splicer install can be completed. I'm not a tv engineer, but the only thing I can think could cause it is a loose connection or stuck switch between feeds. I haven't noticed it yet today (but I've mostly been watching the US Open) so it may already be fixed. Anyhow, we should be able to check whether the splicer is on by see what happens with North Shore tonite.

Good news everyone, MisterDTV (a Sinclair rep) posted this reply to a rather pointed question a posed (venting on USDTV).

Originally posted by MisterDTV
Coming soon to Las Vegas..."the WB in HDTV". Folks there will get their HDTV for FREE, OTA!

At this point I don't know if any of the USDTV subchannels will remain on the frequency, but it's good to see that Sinclair didn't abandon HD when it made a deal with USDTV.

That's great news about WB. What channel are they on again? I might have to mess around with the antenna to see if I get it OTA or not.

lvthunder, their DTV frequency is 22, your reciever should remap it to 21-1 once it locks the signal. Parsing the FCC filings I think they're operating at 4.4 kW ERP with a construction permit for 630 kW ERP when they go full power. Even if they're not yet at full power, their signal seems to be among the least challenging to receive among the posters to this forum.

FoxHD now on channel 735! (minus the HD til Sunday at least)

FoxHD now on channel 735! (minus the HD til Sunday at least)

And a few days ahead of schedule too!
Whoo hoo!
Let's see how they do...

vegggas

FAntastic!! Now i need to look up which shows on fox are in HD...

Looks like all the Fox programs were stretchovision tonight (which looks better than KTNVs stretchovision). I noticed "Quintuplets" was supposed to be widescreen....but it was stretched as far as I could tell.

Thanks to all, especially Vegggas for this fantastic thread, appreciate the notification about Fox HD! You rock!

I'll second that. Vegggas is giving us terrific info. Greatly appreciate it.
It'll be nice to see any Fox program, sports or otherwise, clearly. As long as I have lived here (since '87), KVVU has looked dark and fuzzy, cable or OTA.

Actually Trevor_2k started this thread. I just jumped on board and sort of started throwing out things I was hearing locally with Cox employees. It's amazing what info you can get when you buy a Cox engineer a beer or two!
FoxHD guide data is now available on 735.
With channel 734 being blank and George's information about WB going HD sometime in the future, I'm starting to wonder if that is a reserved spot for them or not... Guess I'll have to buy more beer...

vegggas

When did our thread title change?

It used to be the Quasi-official Las Vegas area thread and now it's The Las Vegas, NV thread.

Must be a moderator thing. All the other area threads are also in this format.

vegggas

I don't know but someone had a lot of free time to change all the thread topics.

It appears that the FoxHD stretch-o-vision is now gone. Everything is now 4x3. Less than a week without ANY HD yet, and they surpassed passed ABC, who still can't do it right after many years. :D

vegggas

I miss the ol' thread title. Now it seems....sanctioned. ;)


Originally posted by vegggas
When did our thread title change?

It used to be the Quasi-official Las Vegas area thread and now it's The Las Vegas, NV thread.

Must be a moderator thing. All the other area threads are also in this format.

vegggas

It's great to see how responsive the folks at KVVU were to reconfiguring their upconversion to from stretch-o-vision to pillar box. Hopefully KTNV will eventually follow and OAR will reign supreme in Las Vegas. But enough talk about SD upconversion. The new season is starting to gather steam and we're getting a lot of new HD. My thoughts so far (on NBC since they've premiered first):

Hawaii: the pilot was pretty weak, but the followup episodes have a nice, cheesy buddy cop action film vibe. Eric Balfour is carrying the show right now and the way NBC is scheduling it I wouldn't be suprised if he ends up moving back to the O.C. before season's end.

Joey: Has it's moments. Some of laugh out loud, but others are cringe inducing. I suspect it will work out for a healthy run, but it's no Fraiser.

Medical Investigation: This should be a nice formula hit for NBC, but their scheduling is puzzling. The pilot seems to have achieved a perfect balance between ER and CSI, yet it has been meekly relegated to a Friday night death slot. It doesn't help that the promos make the lead appear very unlikable.

vegggas, I'd be suprised if the forthcoming KVWB HD signal will appear on Cox given the difference in perspective between Sincalir and the cablecos on appropriate compensation for HD programming. See one of the Sinclair threads for details. The moderators have made clear that MisterDTV is a real deal Sinclair representative so expect KVWB in HD OTA in any case.

Thought I would throw my 2 cents in on FOX HD on 735 versus ABC HD on 732.....I've been watching HD since I bought my set in May, and the ABC signal, when not in HD, is absolutely horrendous in stretch mode. It is simply unwatchable. The most recent example is the opening night NFL concert which ABC showed after the Pats-Colts game last night. After 10 seconds of watching Elton John, I was nauseated. I cannot believe this continues day after day, is it the local station or what? Even when they have a 4:3 picture, it is stretched and looks like garbage too.

Fox looks damn good for a non-HD signal in 4:3, now they have their act together; in fact the signal looks better than SD Channel 5. I guess it is not worth it to call the local ABC station and complain??? Does anyone know how long 732 will continue to broadcast non-HD crap? Sorry for the rant......

If I remember right ABC is using what they call 14x9. Which is the zoom the picture instead of stretching it. So they are cutting the top and bottom off the picture reducing the resolution even more. I don't know if they are still doing that as I only watch stuff on that channel when I know it is true HD. NBC SD, Fox SD, and CBS SD looks about as good as SD is going to get. I think ABC might get the picture someday. Who knows.

lvthunder,

Agree. What the heck, I just sent an email to KTNV's general manager with my views on his non-HD transmissions so we'll see if I get a reply. I'll give the forum an update if I hear from them.

lvthunder, no, I think KTNV used to use 14:9 back when 13-2 was a simulcast, but they've been stretching to 16:9 (which some boxes can at least correct) since ANN took over the subchannel. Their newscasts are in 14:9, however. I think they achieve their almost widescreen effect by going outside the 4:3 safe area in the studio shots, but the news footage seems a little off (I think they do a nonlinear strech on that).

What does anyone make of the lighter sidebars on FoxHD 735?

First, let me say that this 8000HD is the greatest home electronic device since the VCR. A very nice evolution from VCR. Much credit is deserved for TiVO (originator of DVR?) and Cox (for bringing it to us cheaply for rental).

But has anyone else noticed that the picture quality of HD is 'softer' with the 8000HD than the 3250? I just did the trade about a month ago and it was noticeable to me at the very moment I went to the HD channels. Same cables, same TV, etc. A search of this has come up with same in other markets.

Could this be because the 8000HD doesn't use passthrough and the 3250 did? Maybe a firmware issue?

If you think the 8000HD is great you should really look at the 10-250 (HDTiVo). From what I've heard about the features of the 8000HD the TiVo blows it out of the water. The only downside is the cost, but what isn't expensive in HD. Once they get the cost down it will even be better.

Back to an earlier topic about CSTV, it looks like CSTV partnered with INHD to show their HD after all. Looks like maybe no HD channel of their own in the near future. SD and partnered HD coverage is one way of getting the games.
Link to CSTV and INHD thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=443870)

About the 8000 and PQ. Back when I was testing the unit, I saw no difference in A/B/C comparison tests with the 3250 and OTA on several different types of displays. Recently though, I have noticed a few channels looking blurry at times and not to their full potential. I swear it comes and goes at times and makes me wonder if Cox is starting to stat mux the channels to fit more stuff in (DON"T THINK SO!). It has been a while since I mapped out the modulators to see where they are now. Oh yeah, I'm also still on the DVI / passthrough test version, so that MAY be an issue for me, unless that was pushed out this morning to everyone else.
I did hear tonight that there are supposed to be a lot of changes (not just HD) by Monday morning and through the next week. With that in mind, I'm gonna wait it out and see what happens.

vegggas

For those with QAM demodulators...

102.03 - ABC
102.05 - NBC

103.01 - CBS
103.02 - PBS

106.03 - Fox

Looks like they're not launching the game today in HD. Oh Well :(

Not in HD on Cox anyway. Is it HD OTA??

Keith

Not here in Henderson. Channel should be 5-1 for HD ?

I know their aren't too many baseball fans left. Especially when football season has arrived.


But I attempted to watch the Padres game on their HD station today.
Yesterday and the day before it was in true HD (1080i) standard - no stretch, full screen. Those broadcasts looked and sounded just great.

But today, it still was 1080i-Standard, but in the Stretch mode and not true HD. I could not access the true HD picture if it was being transmitted at all.


Whats wrong?? Is it my equipment? Is it Cox Cable?? Or is it the broadcasting station?? Please help.

Thanks

The game wasn't scheduled for HD broadcast by Channel 4 San Diego.....I guess the trucks are on there way back to the west coast.
We will get to see NFL here on FoxHD today..........thru highlights on ESPN SportsCenter and NFL Primetime. Looks pretty good.

KVVU obviously hasn't completed their splicer install, hopefully they'll get it done sometime this week. The new bug in network programming should make it really obvious when they have it up.

Closing comments on the Fox Post-Game Show claimed 6 games broadcast in 720p; will continue that amount and format all season........(need a new set!!!)

Originally posted by citizen
Closing comments on the Fox Post-Game Show claimed 6 games broadcast in 720p; will continue that amount and format all season........(need a new set!!!)

Why would you need a new set? Doesn't the 8000HD upconvert all 720p signals to 1080i? And if the box won't do it your YV probably will.

Am I wrong in that assumption?? I sure hope not.

I can't figure out why NFL on FOX HD channel was 4:3 for me today and looked like it was just standard broadcast put onto the HD channel, but while watching the NFL ESPN GameDay on HD later on I saw highlights of the same game which looked gorgeous. The Fox HD was true 4:3 for me. I had the Gray bars on the sides not black. Like Cox (or the 8000HD) was sending a 420i signal on the 725 channel. I know FoxHD is only a week or so old here, but this was bad.

Also, Cox's (VERY rude CS) told me on phone today that in order to get HD, you MUST rent a box from them for $5/mo (he is digital subscriber already) even though my friends TV has an integrated HDTuner. They said they encrypt even the local HD channels and that the built in tuner is only good for OTAHD.

At that point, since he already is digital, it is basically getting local HD for free and paying $5 more for four additional HD channels that Cox Provides (ESPN,etc). But what good is the built in tuner for? Is it mostly geared for the people who would rather not pay for cable or the FORCED Digital upgrade to get HD? I don't understand why someone would choose OTA even though Cox can get expensive but you get OTA + bonus HD's from Cox along with the fairly decent 200+ digital channels.

One more thing I want to Vent. Does Cox even hold Tech meetings or anything and also relay the info to people who might have missed them? They are SO inconsistent among different techs. One person SWEARS to me DVI has been enabled from day one on the new HDDVR's (even though it blatently says otherwise in the welcome package next to DVI as "For Future Use") and another says it won't be ready until end of year. I asked about Firmware upgrade so I can get DVI/passthrough and one tech had no idea what I was talking about. UGH

Word Maestro-
I'm confident you're correct; I was lamenting the fact that I lack an HDTV set....(still!)

Emailed KVVU Fox 5 Engineering last night and got a response this morning:

FOX is installing their equipment this week. We should be able to
pass the FOX HD by the end of the week.

Jack Smith

Jack, great news. Since you have contact with KVVU engineering could you ask them to set the gray pillarbars back to black? While infinitely better than stretch-o-vision, the gray bars are slightly distracting because they don't quite match up with the border of the 4:3 picture, leaving a black space that really stands out.

Jack Smith is in the Engineering Dept at KVVU

looks like HBO and MAX on demand has been added..ch 214/234. HBO has several categories to choose the reruns from..."kids movies", "series", etc.
MAX even has an "max after dark" category for all you horny bastards out there ! :D

Got an e-mail reply today.

FOX is currently installing the equipment needed to broadcast FOX sports & prime programming in HD. We are hoping it will be active by this weekend.

Leilani Molinaro (Lani)
Exe. Sec./Programming Asst.
KVVU FOX5
25 TV5 Drive
Henderson, NV 89014

Now I'm set for the rest of the season!

Quick question on the EOD -HBO and Cinemax. If you subsrcibe to both channels, is the EOD free?

No only the HBO and Cinamax are Free.

Be careful! The first selection is EOD movies, which are individually charged and the price is shown when selected. The HBO and Cinemax EOD is included with your subscription to those service and is no charge, so you should see the price as $0.00.
Too bad the Sopranos selections are all from season 2. I was hoping to catch up on the last episodes. The Kids stuff is nice though.

vegggas

Veggas...

What channel is HBO EOD?

Tx,

Steve

Ps. how is the DVI working on the DVR?

Originally posted by HiHoStevo
Veggas...

What channel is HBO EOD?

Tx,

Steve

Ps. how is the DVI working on the DVR?

Looking at the guide, it says 215 HOD HBO On Demand

I don't use DVI and prefer the analog component on a CRT scanning projector. On some testing, I noticed a bit more blocking from a digital source to a digital display. YMMV with the type of set used, etc.

vegggas

I called KVVU late this afternoon (Friday) and was told by the receptionist that HD was "supposed" to be ready this weekend, but they were still working on it so she could not say for sure. For what it's worth, she didn't sound very positive...

Keith

Vegggas,
Any info on when "pass through" will be pushed to the boxes? It's the tail end of Sept and I thought by now the powers that be would have given us back that much needed feature.
PT

The original date for DVI and passthrough was end of Sepember or early October. I've been testing it and it is the same as the 3250, but it does hang once in a while. I still used fixed at 1080i for almost everything, and go to 480i standard when I watch a "widescreen" not in HD show on upn, so that my set can do the conversion. I don't like the fact that my set takes 3 seconds to change resolutions each time either.

FoxHD is still doing splicer testing. The color bars are up right now with a Dolby Digital signal (beeeeeep!) and the splicer logo way down in the lower right corner. I recorded a few minutes of it to have as test material for calibration. :D Looks like it is partially installed and they are just trying to get the feeds set up.

vegggas
edit: My OTA Samsung box will hang and reboot if I try to hit the display button for the HD or SD fox channel. All others appear ok.
Edit again: As of 11:00 AM, no more reboots, but PSIP info is Central time.

Edit again: 11:28 FOX HD back on the air!

veggas, yeah can see a buggy looking Fox bug in the gray sidebars now, I'm taking that to mean that the engineering folks at KVVU are doing everything they can to get the splicer up tomorrow.

I noticed today's MLB on Fox Game (SD at SF) had black sidebars and the SD picture looked really nice.

The splicer is up and the NFL pregame looks very pretty.

Yes it does...........the program before the pregame show....Fox News Sunday looked very good.

Hmm... let the comparisons begin!
So far so good - What was that scratchy sound and audio change with the ref?
Only getting DD2.0 not DD5.1 Can anyone else confirm?
I'm not getting any sound at all through the rear speakers and the center is much louder than the fronts.
Update - Ouch! Lud commercials. The intro graphics going back to the game had rear sound??

vegggas

FoxHD WOW!!!!! what a picture. that overhead camera is great...makes you feel like you're sitting right there in the stadium

At 10:30, we got some surround info after returning from commercials.

Vegggas

Now, I wonder if Speed will be in HD on Fox tonite.

Originally posted by GeorgeLV
Now, I wonder if Speed will be in HD on Fox tonite.
They had the perfect opportunity to show the CSI Pilot last night as a network HD feed. The splicer was in the mix and we saw that logo in the lower corner during CSI, but it appeared not to be set in HD.
We have two movies tonight, Star Trek and Speed, We will have to see what they do...

vegggas

vegggas, I haven't heard of any syndication programming being in HD anywhere yet. I doubt KVVU has an HD tape system yet, so I don't even think it's possible unless Fox bought the national syndication rights.

I was just wondering, because CSI premiered last night on FOX with the Pilot episode and continues tonight after primetime. This was a national feed through the splicer, so it would have been possible if FOX had the rights to do so. FOX as a network, would have had a great way to showcase HD if they had picked it up, but it appears that their HD will be only available for native programming. As for syndication in HD, other than Hogans Heros, I haven't heard of any syndicated program in HD either - Just wishful thinking.

vegggas

Does anyone know the QAM channel number Fox is on? I tried what it was on last week(105 or 106 or something) and it wasnt there. I'd scan it myself but it takes a good 15-30 minutes to go over the whole 135-channel spectrum, and I dont want to miss that much football.

Originally posted by doormat
Does anyone know the QAM channel number Fox is on? I tried what it was on last week(105 or 106 or something) and it wasnt there. I'd scan it myself but it takes a good 15-30 minutes to go over the whole 135-channel spectrum, and I dont want to miss that much football.
Following the tried and true formula for american RF channel frequencies:
Target Freq= 723Mhz(FoxHD) - 51Mhz (start of RF channel frequencies[ch2]) = 672 Mhz
672Mhz divided by each 6Mhz channel alocation (6Mhz each) = Channel 112
I would try channel 112 to see what you've got.

vegggas
edit - Frequency for any channel is found in the diagnostic menu page 1

v

Star Trek is not in HD on FOX right now, but many think Speed, a FOX movie, WILL be in HD tonight... Voom has it listed as HD in their guide.

vegggas
edit: East coasters say it's not in HD, even though it's through the splicer.
v

What CSI is on Fox? Is it the syndicated series?

Originally posted by Tallen234
What CSI is on Fox? Is it the syndicated series?
Fox is promoting the syndicated CSI: Las Vegas. They had the premier Saturday Night with the pilot episode of CSI: Las Vegas from the first season. Tonight they have the second episode and so forth.

vegggas

Why was CBS NFL Football not in HD today???

Steve

First game at 10am on CBS locally was HD (Indy @ Tenn)....one of two 10am CBS HD games...the 2nd game was not HD....the only HD game at 1pm was Cleveland @ Dallas. We got the Buffalo @ Oakland game.
CSI is not being promoted by the FOX network, it is being promoted by KVVU locally. I think its going to be a while until local affiliates of any network in any city show anything syndicated in HD.

Yea,

It was kinda frustrating. That game was shot in HD and avail on Directv as HD, but was blacked out here since it was carried as the local CBS main game.....and it wasn't in HD. Presume that is the fault of the local station.

Perry

Perry, the Buffalo/Oakland game wasn't available in HD on DirectTV, or anywhere else. CBS is currently only capable of producing 3 HD games a Sunday and this week they were:
Indianapolis @ Tennessee 10 AM (shown in Vegas)
Pittsburgh @ Baltimore 10 AM
Cleveland @ Dallas 1:15 PM

I think there's contractual nonsense with the NFL that prevented Fox from showing a late game this Sunday. (for the same reason I guess there will only be one CBS game next week)

Next weeks games for Las Vegas should be all be HD (according to TitanTV)

Fox
Bears @ Vikings 10 AM
Packers @ Colts 1:15 PM

CBS
Chargers @ Broncos 1:15 PM

Each network trades off doubleheader weeks.......this week was CBSs turn for two games.

I didn't see anyone comment on it yet....But thru Cox HD, Speed on Fox was not shown in HD (had the gray sidebars); and Titanic on NBC was not in HD. I really thought that both of these would be in widescreen HD.

Personally, I'd rather watch a blank screen than watch either "Speed" or "Titanic" in ANY form.

But I do have a technical question.

Suppose you record the picture from ESPNHD, while it is NOT transmitting in HD. Those aluminum appearing sidebars are produced in the picture. Which frankly, I do NOT find objectionable.
When that picture is recorded on a VCR or DVD Recorder, I am quite sure that those bars will appear when I play back that recording on my HDTV.

But after finalization of the DVD, will those sidebars appear in the picture on an SD 4:3 TV, when I send that copy (either VHS or DVD) to another person, that does not own an HDTV monitor.?

Demodave, those movies were not show, yesterday in HD anywhere.

Word Maestro, yes those bars will appear unless you zoom in on the 4:3 area during recording. However, many dvd players have a 4:3 zoom button so your friend should be able to zoom past the sidebars anyways.

Ok did the quality of MNFootball from Cox suck for anybody else? Pixilation and huge Audio drops? If not I will need to call Cox, and should have done that, but my show schedule has kept me from home most of the last few days.

The first 10 minutes or so seemed to be in SD..... after about 10 minutes or so my projector switched from 480 to 720 and then it looked great.

Steve

Originally posted by HiHoStevo
The first 10 minutes or so seemed to be in SD..... after about 10 minutes or so my projector switched from 480 to 720 and then it looked great.

Steve

I found that exactly to be the case in my home as well. Except that ABC did the switching to 1080i. It looked great after that.

PS- I don't know of ABC switched to720P or 1080i. But I never enabled 720p on my 8000HD. So if ABC sent it in 720p, my TV (or the 8000HD) must have upconverted it to 1080i. But as I said, it looked great.

Originally posted by Word Maestro
I found that exactly to be the case in my home as well. Except that ABC did the switching to 1080i. It looked great after that.

PS- I don't know of ABC switched to720P or 1080i. But I never enabled 720p on my 8000HD. So if ABC sent it in 720p, my TV (or the 8000HD) must have upconverted it to 1080i. But as I said, it looked great.

Word..........

ABC is probably sending out 1080i... I just have my box set to output all HD programming at 720p as that is the native resolution for my projector.

I just noticed the jump about 10 minutes into the game... the picture flickered and then the 720p notification box appeared on the screen indicating the resolution change.... and of course immediately the picture looked about 20 times better.

Steve

This issue of the lousy SD picture for the first few minutes of MNF is apparently a network issue, it has been happening throughout the U.S. for the last three broadcasts (check out the HDTV Programming thread). Don't even bother contacting the local network, I sent an email (very civil I thought) over 10 days ago to the General Manager regarding the poor quality of the stretched out picture on Cox HD 732 and haven't heard anything in return. Anyone try to watch college football on Saturdays on 732? You would think you are losing your vision from the blurriness.

ABC and its affiliates could care less what the public wants when it comes to HD quality. Except for ESPN, of course.

Umm, KTNV always sends out a 720p signal. If the source is SD locally it will be stretched to fill the 16:9 frame and make everybody look fat, but it will be upconverted to 720p at all times. If the first 10 minutes of MNF was pillarboxed it was a network problem, if everyone looked fat KTNV either had trouble acquiring the HD feed or somebody fell asleep at the switch. I almost wonder if HiHoSteve is trolling since with a post count that high he should know that ABC is a 720p network, not 1080i. He should also know that the broadcasters for all intents and purposes never switch what format they're sending. (The last switch in Vegas happened about 3 weeks ago when KVVU put up their 720p signal. It's something that happens once in a blue moon [when a new station goes HD] and often requires a reset on many STBs)

No George.... not Trolling... but as I have my 3250 set to output at 720p I have not really kept up with what signal the local stations are broadcasting...but I can tell when the signal is or is not HD.

However, on the MNF broadcast when I first tuned in the screen flashed 480p and looked horrible! It did fill the 16x9 screen, but the resolution looked just awful. After about 10 minutes the screen flickered and the 720p boxed appeared on screen and the picture was gorgeous.

I too noticed the 6 to 6:10 SD content. Was about to turn it off when it got better (DirectV OTA).

Also when I got the "not available in this market" message on DirectV channel 96HD for the titans/colts game (NFL Sunday Ticket) I went to CBS OTA and also got SD. Did turn it off, couldn't stand it. If it was in HD on local CBS it too wasn't switched til later in the game. That game I am sorry I missed.

Perry

HiHoStevo, I agree that KTNV's SD upconverts look like you're seeing through cataracts. I just don't see how you projector got confused. The signal they send is always 720p 24 hours a day. I suppose it is possible tha Cox or the Scientific Atlanta box is doing something weird that I don't know about.

pkincy, the Titans/Colts game was in HD OTA. I was watching Fox because their pregame was in ws, it's possible KLAS flipped the switch a few minutes late, but whenever I switched over from the Falcons game I assure you it was in HD. (Do you receive your locals from DirecTV or OTA? The DirectTV local channel package only delivers heavily compressed SD--360x480i at that)

HiHoStevo, come to think of it if your SA 3250 is set to output 720p how can your projector's 720p light not be on? Are you sure it wasn't another indicator? I think you might have seen the DD 5.1 indicator turn on on one of your pieces of equipment. That would have fit the rest of the description you provided, KTNV passes through DD 5.1 during the network HD feed and lots of a/v equipment have some indicator for that.

Gentlemen,

I am confused. While watching the latter parts of MNF, I checked my onscreen format (I have a Mitsubishi DLP-51'). It clearly stated 1080i.
I received that game in Standard 1080i- Full Screen HD. I was offered an option of 1080i-Wide Expand. Of course I chose the standard 1080i, and it was beautiful. I have my STB (8000HD) set to output, 1080i, 720i, 720p. 480i and 480p. And while I have my STB set to all those options, I have yet to see an indication that 480i,480p, 720i or 720p is being outputted by the box.

Is it possible that my STB was outputing 720p, while my TV was upconverting it to 1080i? I can't think of any other explanation. But in any event the picture was gorgeous.

One other question: In watching NBC (channel 3- analog). The side bars appear gray. When I change to NBC HD (channel 733) the sidebars appear black. YET. although the WIDTH of the sidebars, the image betwen those sidebars is slightly wider on Channel 3 than on Channel 733.



What's up???

As far as I know the sidebars for Channel 3 are made by your TV set. So they would be whatever color your TV set would output (I have a choice of gray or black on my set-the default is gray). On channel 733, the sidebars are not made by your TV set and are sent out as part of the digital 16x9 picture by channel 3. So those should always be black unless channel 3 would change them for some reason.

My sizes on those channels are just the opposite of yours. My picture is larger on 733 (and sidebars smaller) than it is on channel 3 or even channel 123.

On a similar topic, does anyone know what's up with the HD Fox logo on 735? On my set the logo is pushed way off the bottom right portion of the picture. Only a small part of the "F" and the "O" is visible. I have checked my set for overscan at it is very minimal (about 3%). All other HD logos (ABC, PBS, NBC, CBS) are well withing the boundaries of my picture. The fox HD logo is well outside though. I have tried every resolution and aspect ration on the SA800HD box as well as my TV, but no matter what I use I cannot get the FOX HD logo to display completely.

Is everyone else seeing this or is it something on my end??

Keith

Word Maestro, your description strongly indicates that you actually have your cable box set to only output 1080i. The last I heard (I'm on OTA guy so I'm not sure) Cox hasn't activited pass-through yet so the box will only output the format you select, not the format the station is broadcasting. For most fixed pixel displays, like yours, 720p will produce a better picture, but sometime the tv has better format conversion circuitry than the STB. Try to change the setting in the menu and see what looks better for you.

Keith, Re: the Fox HD logo. I suspect KVVU hasn't set up their splicer bug yet and is displaying the default. That it why is looks ugly and is positioned wrong. If you check out the main splicer thread you should be able to see what it will look like when they correct it. BTW, the bug is off during sporting events so it won't intrude if you have company over to watch the NFL.

Word, Keith,
The 4x3 content will have side bars created by the STB if you view it in 4x3 mode on a 16x9 set. You can adjust the side bars in the 2nd settings menu from light to gray, depending on your preference. The HD channel will show the complete 16x9 image, but the local staton has no video for the sides, so it appears black with no video in those areas.
The 8000 should not have passthrough out yet, so output is usually set to fixed, and by default, it is 1080i. If you enabled all the resolutions, you can go into the first settings menu and choose your fixed output resolution. On 720 native DLP sets, ABC, ESPN, and FOX would look best if you change the STB resolution to 720P so it does no conversion. All other channels may look worse at 720P due to the scaling of the box down to that resolution. They should be best viewed at 1080i and the TV can do the scaling. Try it out and compare, but the diferences may be marginal on sets, and dramatic on others.

vegggas

Kudos to whoever at KVVU changed the pillarbars back to black.

Anyone catch Cox cable 732 last night? It seemed the non-HD transmission looked a lot sharper than the usual blur, especially the local news at 6 pm. The HD transmission of "Lost" seemed pretty good and was in 5.1 also.

One new issue on 732 I noticed is the unbelievably loud volume on local commercials....comments?

The loudnest of commercials is a common problem. Audio in 5.1 is usually lower than stereo broadcast. Commercials are primarily done in stereo.

If I decide to go the "Cable Card" route, I know of course that I will lose the DVR capabilities of my SA 8000HD.

Is there a way to configure the cables and associated equipment to connect a TiVo or other external recording/replay device with no loss of picture quality?

PS . I realize that I probably will not be able to record in HD, but that is of no consequebce to me. SD is fine for such purposes.

Thank You.

COX is about to lose my biz. I had a tech out to check on the internet and Hi Def. The cables coming into my house had great signal he said. But sure enough the modem dropped out several times while he was here. He chalked it up to a bad power supply. He gave me a new one and that seemed to fix it, until about 10 mins after he left. Then it started reseting again. This was a Terryan(sp) from Cox. I went into replace it and because it is a purchased modem from Cox they wont replace, we bought it in June. So I bought a new one from BB. Seems to be ok now.

Then the drop out issue with the HD. He said he wasnt much of a vid tech but called his "best guy" who said the STB was bad because of the signal to noise ratio. Well I replaced it while at the Cox office with a new one. Same problem today while trying to watch football or listen to music. Drop outs and lockups of video.

So I am going to give them one more shot to see if they can pinpoint the problem, then I am going to dump them. I already have Direct TV and Sunday ticket and a tevo. So I would just upgrade that system to HD, and get DSL for internet.

Speco, former cable Tech here. Sounds to me like Cox should replace your modem. I've replaced many that were bought from Cox. I don't understand why they wouldn't replace it as it's under warranty. But I suspect that it's not the modem or the STB but a signal issue as they very well could be related. The both need two way communication so have similar needs. While the technician reports a incoming good signal I wonder about the downstream signal.
Tell us about your inhouse cable system.
How old is your house?
Do you have a smart box?
How many active outlets?
How many TV sets?

There are many possibilities as to why your having issues. Also as you neighbors if they have a modem or cable box and if it works correctly.
One final bit of advise, check if DSL is available in your area before you drop Cox.

Eddie

Its a rental that I think was built in 2000

we have the HD outlet downstairs. The internet outletr upstairs and in the bedroom a tv outlet. None have splitters on them. All the cables going to tv etc from wall have been replaced at least 3 times. The drops are now only in the HD stations even if its not HD content, ie 60 mins tonite. And also the music choice stations.

If I decide to go the "Cable Card" route, I know of course that I will lose the DVR capabilities of my SA 8000HD.

Is there a way to configure the cables and associated equipment to connect a TiVo or other external recording/replay device with no loss of picture quality?

PS . I realize that I probably will not be able to record in HD, but that is of no consequebce to me. SD is fine for such purposes.

Thank You.

Word Maestro, the only way to record HD with full quality is with the recorded integrated with the tuner (SA 8000HD, HD DirecTiVo) or with firewire out (DVHS). For really good SD quality recordings a dvd recorder will probably do component, but other recorders (regular TiVo, SVHS) will likely do s-video at best. AFAIK, Cox doesn't have 2-way capability with cable cards so you'll only be able to receive very limited services.

GeorgeLV,

I'm sorry, but you are a bit confused as to my question.

I am fully aware that the "Cable Card" does not have two-way capability. I have no desire to utilize any pay-per-view or "In Demand" services. The baseball season is now ending and the only "In-Demand" feature that I have been using is the "MLB Package". I no longer need that (at least until next April). All the movie channels and all HD stations are available using the "Cable Card".
I understand that the "Cable Card" provides the best HD and SD pictures possible. And that is what I seek. I am perfectly satisfied to RECORD any program in SD, whether or not I view it "live" in HD.

Using the "Cable Card", I want to know if there is any configuration that I can adopt using a "TiVo" or "Replay TV" unit to record what I desire. If that is indeed possible, then Cox Cable and its "cable boxes" can go where the sun don't shine. As far as I have been able to determine, those boxes are nothing but causes of aggravation and frustration.

Perhaps by next April the SA8300HD will be available? And I have been assured by Scientific Atlanta, that those boxes will represent a large improvement in capability and dependability, over what is currently available.

Word Maestro, sorry, I thought they were independent questions. AFAIK, a cable card is only designed to interface with the cable card slot in your television so it won't have any extra interfaces you can acquire a signal to record from. I don't see how you could record from it unless your tv has video out or something. (Does any set have this? What does people with integrated ATSC recorders do to record?)

WM, it is rumored that Tivo is coming out with a cable card capable Tivo, I would expect an announcement at CES, if you can wait 6 months. Otherwise, you would need a TV with a output of the currently tuned channel (w/ audio) and a IR blaster from the Tivo to your TV.

If your TV has firewire ports, and supports AVHDDs, you can go down that route, but I have no idea how the user experience is with AVHDDs, nor can I find one. You could turn a PC into a AVHDD with Vividlogic's Firebus DTV Recorder Version 1.0. I have no idea how well it works (check in the HTPC forum). It could record SD and HD TV too.

Hi,
I see a problem arising from these CableCARD's, at least in these early days of product release. like the ability to do a timed recording, using the TV's output you would have to leave it on for the signal to be sent to your recording device, and from what I hear TV programming is encrypted with copy protection or will be in the near future, so I don't think the newer TV's will pass a digital premium channel thru it's monitor output, maybe I'm wrong? Also, if there's a problem with tiling or audio dropouts a cable tech can access the diagnostic screen built into the cable converter to monitor bit error rates, with these new Tv's there would be a liability issue with the cable tech working on troubleshooting the TV's tuner, Currently if there's a tuner problem the box would be swapped out for a new one, but if it's integrated into the TV you'll have to find an authorized service tech from the TV manufacturer. Yikes! I can just see circuit city sending out a tech to check the digital tuner. I would think twice before I'd get one, and also the cable card is supplied by Cox, for $4.95/mo. + programming charges, so you don't really save any money. It great if your going to hang a tv on the wall and use it for viewing live tv only, it eliminates the clutter of cables and box's.

Just my thoughts........

Lonnie

Pardon my stupidity. But just what is an IR Blaster?

I thought the cablecards are $2 a month. As for tuner problems I have had plenty of other products and not had any "tuner problems". Maybe that's why people would want to go with a cbalecard. If Cox is using stuff that breaks all the time. I think the cable guys sometimes replace stuff that isn't broken anyways.

Maestro............

An IR Blaster is a small cable that runs from the back of your Tivo/ReplayTV/VHS or other recording device to your cable/satellite receiver. The Blaster has a small Infa-red signal emitter on the end that has "sticky" stuff on one side. This device is attached to the front of the receiver in the area of the receiver's IR sensor.

This allows the external recording device to send an Infa-red signal which can change the channel on the receiver to record the program you are interested in.

Steve

Originally posted by speco2003
. And also the music choice stations.

Wow, someone actually listens to those?


I had the same problem in my previous home, about 6 months ago. At the time, I didnt have HD, but I did have problems with my Cable Modem losing signal intermittantly. All of the other SD signals were fine. After what seemed like the bazillionth time of having someone out to check the system, the tech checked the point where cable enters the house, and found what he described as rust and corrosion. After cleaning it all out, everything worked fine... including the eventual addition of HD.

music choice is better than radio in this town and the wife likes to put it on while working

londawg, cableCARD service is $1.99 per month. The CARD would be programed to provide whatever service you currently have on that particular outlet. As you indicated, additional program charges would apply for adding other services requested, such as $7.95 for adding an additional digital service in another room if needed.

Sorry, I was mis informed, thanks for the correction.

Originally posted by speco2003
and get DSL for internet.

Sprint seems to be getting competitive in this market. I had a telemarketer try to sell me the 512/128 service for $34.99. I told her I was happy with Cox's 1.5/128 for $39.99. I was then offered their 1.5/256 for $34.99, free self-install and one year price commitment.

I had been paying Cox for cable/internet and Dish Network for their service. I reasoned out that the extra Cox chans were worth the extra $25.00.

Point is, if you're gonna go with DSL, do some negotiating with Sprint before saying "I do".

Remember that Cox's speeds are going up next monday, 1.5/128 becomes 4/512, and 3/256 becomes 5/768.

Originally posted by doormat
Remember that Cox's speeds are going up next monday, 1.5/128 becomes 4/512, and 3/256 becomes 5/768.

Wow that's gggggrrrrrrrrrreeeeeeeaaaaaaattttttt!

For Broadband I use Keyon. I get 1.5 for $25. Say I referred you and I'll split the referral fee with you.

Originally posted by vegashomes
For Broadband I use Keyon. I get 1.5 for $25. Say I referred you and I'll split the referral fee with you.

I wish I could get keyon. There is no signal at my house. They said they would call me when I could get a signal.

I know this has been discussed, but our ABC afflilate is really ticking me off on their local commericals. I was roused from sleep a few nights ago when a commerical (that sounded like it was 50% louder) than the regular show that was on (I can't remember what show).

Is there anything that they can do? Although it did make a good alarm!

;)

Originally posted by Tallen234
I know this has been discussed, but our ABC afflilate is really ticking me off on their local commericals. I was roused from sleep a few nights ago when a commerical (that sounded like it was 50% louder) than the regular show that was on (I can't remember what show).

Is there anything that they can do? Although it did make a good alarm!

;)

I'm getting ticked by our ABC affilate not switching to HD for the primetime lineup. Wednesday, the entire primetime lineup was shown in SD strech-o-vision instead of HD. This is a least the fifth time this month that this has happened.

The perception I have of the the local ABC station is that it is run by a bunch of morons. I sent an email to the general manager a few weeks ago with some constructive criticism (I thought!) about their poor quality picture and sound problems. No answer yet and I don't expect one. They also have a lip sync problem in SD which a lot of folks have commented on thinking it is their HDTV monitor, most notably Samsungs. However, I was over at my cousin's house the other day watching the local news on 13 and saw the same lip sync problem on his 32 inch analog TV. It wasn't as noticeable, but it was there. HDTV large screen monitors just amplify this problem.

Bottom line, I won't watch the local station unless it's a sure shot that the program will be in HD...anything else isn't worth watching.

Well my internet problem is fixed.Modem was bad, and after being told they wouldnt replace it, I told them I would just drop them and wala a new modem from them. But 4 techs and 2 boxes later my HD is still not fixed. Supposedly the best tech they have is here at my house now. So if they cant fix this today I am going to upgrade my directv to HD and try over thr air for locals. What are my options for recording over the air local HD?

Originally posted by speco2003
Well my internet problem is fixed.Modem was bad, and after being told they wouldnt replace it, I told them I would just drop them and wala a new modem from them. But 4 techs and 2 boxes later my HD is still not fixed. Supposedly the best tech they have is here at my house now. So if they cant fix this today I am going to upgrade my directv to HD and try over thr air for locals. What are my options for recording over the air local HD?

Best thing I would try is to get a cheap antenna from anywhere and hook it up to the TV and look and make sure you can get the analog channels. While there is no guarentee you'll be able to pick up the HD channels if you get the analog but there is little chance of you getting the HD channels if you DON'T get the analog.

speco2003, you can buy a STB with firewire out and record in full HD glory with a DVHS deck. lvthunder is mostly right about using analog as a test of digital, except in the case of the Fox affailiate, KVVU, which has their digital broadcast on KLVX's antenna so you'll need to check reception for channel 10 instead of channel 5.

P.S. Anybody know if KVVU is close to getting their splicer bug fixed? The neon day-glo default bug in the corner is really distracting. (think goodness it's disabled during football)

As far as recording OTA HD with Directv you could get the HD10-250 (the HD TiVo unit). It can record two things at once. Either Directv, OTA, or both. I have one and I think it's great.

Has anyone had problems on the 8000HD with channel 707 (INHD2)? The channel seems to be very pixelated (or no picture at all) and when I turn to another digital channel (100 and above) I lose audio to all digital channels, so then I have to reboot the box.

Thats very close to my problem, happens on all numbers above 100 I think, These guys were out here all day with 2 big trucks scratching their heads. Declared it fixed at 4 pm and left. Well guess what about 10 mins after they left it all starts again. I am in the Cheyenne Durango area. I have had it, Cox gets a call on Saturday and I want a refund of some kind. I even said hey maybe its the DVR boxes lets try a regular HD box but they said noooo cant be that. Also what really sent me over the edge was when the supervisor that came out said well how long have you had that cheap Radio Shack cable on there. I said well since last night when I discovered the cable your guy left had loose ends. I am a live audio engineer, but I freelance at a very large hotel here that has alot of video guys, and well I know a bit about coax cables from working with them and know that my Rat Shack cable is good. These guys tried to bullshit me on the audio drops being my problem with my RCA cable on the digital out. I said fine guys and showed them how I knew how to look at the diagnostic page on the DVR unit and said now look at your S/N and tell me its my problem. That stopped them cold, they didnt think I should know how to do that.
So now who can recommend me a good antennae?

Pardon any spelling I have a few beers tonite.

Originally posted by tazlv
Has anyone had problems on the 8000HD with channel 707 (INHD2)? The channel seems to be very pixelated (or no picture at all) and when I turn to another digital channel (100 and above) I lose audio to all digital channels, so then I have to reboot the box.


If you were looking for the Oakland vs Anaheim game on INHD, I too was disappointed. It was "blacked out" in the LV area. Don't ask me why.

Originally posted by speco2003
<snip> These guys tried to bullshit me on the audio drops being my problem with my RCA cable on the digital out. I said fine guys and showed them how I knew how to look at the diagnostic page on the DVR unit and said now look at your S/N and tell me its my problem. That stopped them cold, they didnt think I should know how to do that.
So now who can recommend me a good antennae?

Pardon any spelling I have a few beers tonite.

The Signal to noise is a measurment AT your STB. 95% of the time it is good at the street, but as it enters the homeowners wiring, the leaks, ingress, and backfeeding of customer equipment, reduce the S/N to poor levels. If you are worried about S/N levels, have them check them at the street. If they are below acceptable limits, they have to fix them, but everything after the street is yours. You can check close to the street level yourself by taking a digital box and portable TV to the location where it enters the house. There are still losses between the steet and the house, but you shouldn't go messing with the lines connected there because they will be powered at the street, and may result in a shock, and/or destroying the equipment.
To put it in similar terms of Audio, it would be like you feeding a perfect audio signal to a set of speakers from source to destination and approving it. Then the speaker owner uses their powered home AC wiring, going to an air conditioner unit, to get the signal to the speakers and blames you because the speakers sound like crap. It leaves your area ok, but the speaker owner's transport causes the problems.
Every single splitter, connector, barrel in a wall plate, thin or poorly shielded cable (rat shak), VCR, etc, will increase the noise over the existing signal, causing problems. Adding an amp at the end only amplifies the noise. You would have to add an amp where it feeds the house to overcome noisy home wiring.

vegggas

Speco, did any of these tech's tried a jumper directly from the side of the house (demark) to the STB?

So vegggas are you saying that the cable running from the street to the cable box on the outside of the house is my responibily. Every time it rains here I have to call Cox because the cable modem doesn't work and the picture on the TV is really bad. The guy comes out takes a reading at the house and says wow that's really bad goes to the street and cuts the end off that runs from the house to the street and puts a new one on. That fixes the problem until it rains again. The funny thing is they always put some goop on it and say that it will fix it. I've tried asking for them to run a new line but they won't. By my estimate another 5 or 6 rains and they will have to run a new cable because it won't be long enough anymore.

Speco2003's problem sound like the main problem I have with Cox. Custamer Service. My parents cable modem went bad and they replaced it. After that they couldn't send email to anyone that didn't have cox.net as the domain name. After about 5 or 6 calls and emails to Cox I found out that they really didn't care if it got fixed or not. I ended up finding out that you can still use the old email server and that one worked. So I gave up on Cox support and just changed the outgoing mail server back. I even talked to a supervisor and asked for a credit for all the hassel and she said email is a service they provide for free. The $60 a month is just for the connection. So they wouldn't give a credit.