Thanks for the response. Timmy was right... they don't do that for FOX. Guess I'll just have to wait for KTMJ to go HD. In the meantime, I am able to receive the KC FOX station OTA. although it doesn't come in very well during the daytime.

Anyone know if/when 49 will be going to HD? I thought it was supposed to happen in July.

Thanks for the response. Timmy was right... they don't do that for FOX. Guess I'll just have to wait for KTMJ to go HD. In the meantime, I am able to receive the KC FOX station OTA. although it doesn't come in very well during the daytime.

Anyone know if/when 49 will be going to HD? I thought it was supposed to happen in July.

As you might know, KTKA is passing the HD signal to COX, and it looks very good. I'm not sure when they will eventually send the feed OTA, which is a real shame, but there's probably not much incentive for them to do so, as those of us who want the HD feed OTA are certainly in the minority. BUT, KTKA also gave me an HD waiver from Directv over a year ago, so I've been watching ABC HD programming for quite some time. The process was so pleasant from KTKA that I'd be surprised if they wouldn't give a satellite waiver to anyone asking, until such time as they do broadcast HD OTA. I don't know whether Dish has an HD ABC DNS feed however.
Bish

All viewers, we are in the process of upgrading our Encoders so we can air 13.2
We have experienced some technical problems and apologized for the inconvenient.
We will continue to broadcast in 1081i and dedicate 14-15 Meg for CBS. We realize
that keeping the quality up is a must and will do so until hell freezes over or forced by corporate to change.
I know of the Dolby 5.1 problems of last week and resolved that. Changing
Encoders caused us to completely rewire our transmission rack and audio decoders sorry about the crossed cable.
I appreciate your positive feedback and hope to be your HD station of choice.
I will be checking in on this site to monitor and address your concerns.

Thanks for watching WIBW-TV.

CE

Thanks for keeping us updated. I was scanning last night, and it must have been a PSIP issue, because my Voom box would not scan you in.

Not to be greedy, but.... do you have any input on your quality on Directv. The ghosting is pretty obvious.

thanks again!

Timmy 1376,

We are monitoring three different models of digital off air receivers and both have PSIP programming.
One correction made was service info, making change so our name was displayed.

Thanks

I am actually at home for lunch now, and I just rescanned for channels, and my Voom box stops on 44, but never pulls the station info across. A few days ago, it quit scanning in a WIBW and MyTopTV, then came in as Service, now nothing. I can still get your channel and even the subchannel that now has a video, but when I scan, nothing for 44 is scanned in. Is that different than PSIP? The Voom box doesn't do quide data, but I am told it won't scan in without appropriate data for you guys.

timmy 1376,

Did you try cycle of power? sometimes that works for us on some units. Anyone you know having same problem?

We are aware of ghosting problem working on that.

I tried the power cycle and it still will not scan anything in for 44. Now, I have it scanned in from a previous scan so I am able to watch WIBW, but doing a scan for channels still does not pull anything in.

wibw13, something I have wondered while watching your newscasts is if the backgrounds are HD (more than 480 lines of res). I figure that everything shot with a camera (like the weathermen, anchors, etc.) is still 480, but those background map graphics with all the terrain relief seem more detailed than 480. Or am I so used to looking at "supposed" 480 from DirecTV and analog that to see it in its pure form on your OTA digital signal that even 480 lines impresses me???

Keep up the great work.

I live near Manhattan and have a Radio Shack VU-190XR outdoor antenna with an amplifier. All of my digital stations (13.1, 27.1, etc) are clear, but all of the analog stations (13, 15, 27, 49) have a faint scrolling horizontal line through them. Anyone know what I can do to reduce or eliminate this? Increasing/decreasing the amplifier doesn't have any effect on it (the main purpose of the amp is for FM anyway).

Eldritch

Ok just a few more questions. I live in Manhattan and use DirecTV

1. Can I get waivers for all the locals to get directv to give them to me?
2. I can get 13.1 and 13.2 at 90% strength with a cheap wal-mart indoor antenna, and 49.1 at 40-55% but it cuts out. What antenna are you guys using?
3. How does everyone like the new Bestbuy?

I use a big outdoor antenna(winegard PR 8800) with an amp. That seems to be the most reliable way over here in Manhattan since the towers are so far away.

I like the best buy, seems smaller than the one in Topeka, but nice selection of TV's.

On the waivers, doesn't hurt to try.

I use a big outdoor antenna(winegard PR 8800) with an amp. That seems to be the most reliable way over here in Manhattan since the towers are so far away.

I like the best buy, seems smaller than the one in Topeka, but nice selection of TV's.

On the waivers, doesn't hurt to try.

How much was the antenna, and also is there a compass setting and angle I should have the antenna at for best reception. Oh and what channels do you get?

Ok just a few more questions. I live in Manhattan and use DirecTV

1. Can I get waivers for all the locals to get directv to give them to me?
2. I can get 13.1 and 13.2 at 90% strength with a cheap wal-mart indoor antenna, and 49.1 at 40-55% but it cuts out. What antenna are you guys using?
3. How does everyone like the new Bestbuy?

I use a Radio Shack VU-190XR outdoor antenna (P/N 150-2156, $99.99) with an antenna-mounted amplifier (P/N 150-2507, $59.99) since I'm down in the river valley. All digital channels seem to cut out 2-3 times per hour for a few seconds at a time.

Here are the channels I get with my antenna pointed towards Topeka:

Analog: 11, 13, 15, 27, 49
Digital: 11.1, 11.2, 11.3, 13.1, 13.2, 27.1, 27.2, 49.1
Autoscan detected a few other channels but they were scrambled so I removed them.

I'm not sure of the exact heading of my antenna but it's east southeast. My TV doesn't show signal strength numbers (just a small bar graph) so I haven't done much tweaking with the antenna heading or angle.

The BB is definitely smaller than the one in Topeka, especially the car audio section.

Eldritch

PS - On a side note, I've been reading about the Samsung DTB-H260F ATSC tuner (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=728392&page=1&pp=30). The BB here in Manhattan doesn't have it but does anyone know whether the Topeka or KC stores do?

I have the H-20 for my DirecTV HD, and I must say it is a great ATSC tuner. It pulls station info, and lists the guide and can auto-tune like any other DirecTV channel.

I have the H-20 for my DirecTV HD, and I must say it is a great ATSC tuner. It pulls station info, and lists the guide and can auto-tune like any other DirecTV channel.

If you have KTMJ as your Fox affiliate in Manhatten, then I'd send them an email asking for a waiver for the Fox DNS HD feed from Directv. Their General Manager told me in an email he would grant them for satellite viewers until such time as KTMJ began HD broadcasting. It certainly wouldn't hurt to contact the other local affiliates , CBS, etc. if they aren't broadcasting in HD in Manhatten yet. Or do you get all of your local channels out of Topeka?
Bish

I get all of my locals from topeka, I emailed them all so we will see what happens.

I have a ViewSonic LCD TV which I use for watching the OTA channels. In the guide, all times are 2 hours behind (Pacific rather than Central). I've contacted ViewSonic and they claim that there is no way to change the timezone on the TV and that the times displayed are what is being broadcast.

Are the Topeka OTA stations truly broadcasting Pacific times or is ViewSonic just blowing smoke? My bet is on the latter but I just want someone else to confirm that.

Eldritch

Yes I am now getting the FOX East HD feed from Directv. Costs $1.50/month.
Bish


Did you have to get a waiver from the Kansas City Fox station? I tried to do the waiver thing with both Fox and ABC here in Topeka and at that time DirecTV told me that the Kansas City stations didn't grant my waiver request.

Does anyone have any idea when DirecTV will bring our local HDs to us over satellite rather than having to mess with OTA signals? I was told by the Chief Engineer at KTKA that they would be happy to give DirecTV their HD feed as they currently do with Cox, but DirecTV is simply choosing not to provide it (probably due to the fact that the local HDs haven't been rolled out to our smaller market).

Did you have to get a waiver from the Kansas City Fox station? I tried to do the waiver thing with both Fox and ABC here in Topeka and at that time DirecTV told me that the Kansas City stations didn't grant my waiver request.

You need to talk to someone in the HD DNS dept. at Directv. You do NOT need to get a waiver from WDAF in Kansas City as it is an O+O, (owned and operated), station. Hence a waiver from KTMJ is all you need.
I never had to have a waver from the Kansas City ABC affiliate. You need to tell Directv that you are 60 miles away from the ABC transmitter in K. City, and it is impossible to get a digital signal where you live from that station. If Directv still refuse, demand a signal test at your house for the K. City ABC digital signal.
Hope this helps,
Bish

Just an update on waivers. Fox granted mine and I am getting FOXE on directv. WIBW and KTKA denied the request stating I should be able to pick them up. I can get WIBW just fine, but KTKA I can't get reliably. I guess if I want to watch lost I am going to have to get a big bad antenna. Just waiting to here from NBC and PBS about waivers.

You need to talk to someone in the HD DNS dept. at Directv. You do NOT need to get a waiver from WDAF in Kansas City as it is an O+O, (owned and operated), station. Hence a waiver from KTMJ is all you need.
I never had to have a waver from the Kansas City ABC affiliate. You need to tell Directv that you are 60 miles away from the ABC transmitter in K. City, and it is impossible to get a digital signal where you live from that station. If Directv still refuse, demand a signal test at your house for the K. City ABC digital signal.
Hope this helps,
Bish


I wish I knew who you talked to at DirecTV because they said I do have to get a waiver from WDAF. He said something about some overlap with the information they receive from the FCC and that there was nothing they could do about even though I informed them I was 70 miles away from Kansas City and it was virtually impossible to get their signal. What exactly is a signal test? Does DirecTV come out and try to get the signal? I did go ahead and send emails all of the KC stations just to be on the safe side. I don't really watch anything on ABC, so I don't care as much about it but I would really like to have FOX in HD because there are lots of shows I like to watch on it.

Nope, we are using 12 year old cameras. RGB out to SDI conversion. I hope somday we will
get newer cams.

WIBW: Still having issue with getting you scanned in when I do a scan, but the bigger issue is the sound on the 13.2 subchannel. It sounds like the audio is in a well, and most of the time you can barely hear the dialogue.

BTW: What is up with the Movie Mania stuff?? That is some cheeeeesy stuff.

Timmy 1376 , I adjusted the encoder for Transport ID to match the VCT of
"1195". Please let me know if this helps your decoder. We are aware of the audio
on MyTopeka and are in process of adding new equipment. B-mania was a cheap
programming filler.

I wish I knew who you talked to at DirecTV because they said I do have to get a waiver from WDAF. He said something about some overlap with the information they receive from the FCC and that there was nothing they could do about even though I informed them I was 70 miles away from Kansas City and it was virtually impossible to get their signal. What exactly is a signal test? Does DirecTV come out and try to get the signal? I did go ahead and send emails all of the KC stations just to be on the safe side. I don't really watch anything on ABC, so I don't care as much about it but I would really like to have FOX in HD because there are lots of shows I like to watch on it.

Call back and once again ask to speak to someone in the HD DNS dept. Tell them that not only can you not receive a digital signal from WDAF as it is 70 miles away, BUT that you don't need a waiver from WDAF as it is a FOX O+O station, (owned and operated). O+O stations do not require a waiver. Ask to speak to a supervisor if the first CR you speak to doesn't know what they're talking about.
A signal test is a legal right you have to force Directv to come to your location and see if you can in fact pick up a signal. If they can, then you have to pay the costs involved; if not, they acknowledge that you can't receive a signal.
Don't take no for an answer.

As for KTKA: call them and ask to speak to the person who deals with satellite waivers. When I called over a year ago, I explained that I loved ABC programming but was a huge fan of HD. Ask nicely for a Directv HD waiver for ABC until such time as KTKA begins true 720p OTA broadcasting. The lady who I spoke to was very nice, and sent me a waiver the next day.
Bish

As for KTKA: call them and ask to speak to the person who deals with satellite waivers. When I called over a year ago, I explained that I loved ABC programming but was a huge fan of HD. Ask nicely for a Directv HD waiver for ABC until such time as KTKA begins true 720p OTA broadcasting. The lady who I spoke to was very nice, and sent me a waiver the next day.
Bish


This is what KTKA told me.

I am sorry but per our corporate policy, and for important business reasons,
we cannot grant a waiver (every waiver we grant reduces our market power and
makes it harder to fund things like HD). However, we will work quickly to
get HD on our transmitter. We also can provide our HD signals directly via
fiber to both Satellite providers so you can also ask your Satellite
provider to carry our HD signal as well, this is something they are choosing
not to do at this time. If we grant waivers it also makes it easier for
those Satellite companies not to carry our local HD signal, a second
business reason.

Thank you for your interest in our station,

Michael Liska
Chief Engineer
49 ABC - KTKA TV

WIBW,
Scans in great now.

thanks!!

WIBW

Why wasnt the broncos vs steelers game in HD on 13-1? Was really looking forward to that.


Edit: The second half is in HD

WIBW-

I'm having an issue with the audio and video not being 100% synchronized on 13.1

All programs or just upconverted?

I noticed it last night on Two & A Half Men, and a little bit on The New Adventures of Old Christine. 13 News this Morning looked fine however. It wasn't much, about a half second behind the video.

I'm using a rabbit ear antenna (The $7 Wal-Mart RCA) connected to my Samsung 30" Slimfit TV. However, last night I was getting all kinds of channels including KSNW 3.1, KWCH 12.1, KSAS 24.1 (From KAAS-DT 17) and a lot of Wichita analog stations. I live 7 miles NW of Westmoreland, KS. I get 13.1 and 13.2 fine, and 49.1 fairly good.

PS> Might want to watch the language on some of those movies on 13.2, I heard a not so FCC friendly word dropped on there last night while changing channels.

I'm also having the same audio/video synchronization problem with WIBW.

I get the channel through cable. The problem is with the national high-def feed. It does not happen with local segments. For example, when there's a local commercial or a local newsbrief during a show, the lipsync is perfect. It's only the national feed. It's the same problem dlnester is describing. Audio is about half a second late.

Everything I have watched (on WIBW HD) has had this problem for at least the last 2 weeks. A show that I recorded a few weeks ago does not have this problem, so this problem has started recently.

I'm also having the same audio/video synchronization problem with WIBW.

I get the channel through cable. The problem is with the national high-def feed. It does not happen with local segments. For example, when there's a local commercial or a local newsbrief during a show, the lipsync is perfect. It's only the national feed. It's the same problem dlnester is describing. Audio is about half a second late.

Everything I have watched (on WIBW HD) has had this problem for at least the last 2 weeks. A show that I recorded a few weeks ago does not have this problem, so this problem has started recently.

I noticed it on The Unit tonight.

We are aware of the issue and are in contact with the manufacture. Switching between sources is causing this problem and finding the perfect setting is tedious. Please be patient.
Thank you

i haven't watched Tuesday nights programming but I did not see any problems on Monday night via OTA.

WIBW13,
What happened to the HD on the Georgia Tech/Georgia CBS game saturday? Only 4:3 non-HD OTA. I tried to get an email to engineering by going thru' the news dept., but was unable to do so.
Is there an email address direct to engineering that we could use at times like these?
TIA,
Dave Bishop
Topeka

WIBW13,
What happened to the HD on the Georgia Tech/Georgia CBS game saturday? Only 4:3 non-HD OTA. I tried to get an email to engineering by going thru' the news dept., but was unable to do so.
Is there an email address direct to engineering that we could use at times like these?
TIA,
Dave Bishop
Topeka

I have had this problem as well with some games. I have had games that are HD the first half, then switch to 4:3, and vice versa.

wibw13,
Have you guys talked about this:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=759757

It talks about a station under the Gray umbrella, like WIBW, getting new Harmonic enocders that allows for 2 HD stream, and also a SD stream within the same digital channel. I would love to see, since you are already multicasting, WIBW stay in HD but also show the MyTopekaTv in HD also.

Will you guys be getting this upgrade?

We considered the two HD streams but were forced to only produce a SDI-Digital
due to corporate input. Other problems we see is the switching of HD signals through a SDI plant. In the future when are router and switcher is upgraded to
wideband we will most likely have more HD shows available on both 13.1-13.2.
On CBS HD we must switch directly to the network receiver so we can pass HD
and then upconvert for local station breaks. The operators must set the trigger in automation to change back to the HD receiver that is why the B-Ball game was
in HD in the first half and not in the second. They must have missed the trigger. I try to keep on them so they pass any HD shows. Thanks for watching.

To wibw13, I have to say you guys do a great job with your multicasting. You should go over and give KSNT a few pointers. -Thanks.

To wibw13, I have to say you guys do a great job with your multicasting. You should go over and give KSNT a few pointers. -Thanks.

I wish KSNT would increase their DTV power... only local channel I can't pull in.

I know this topic has been discussed for a long time, but I just want to get some summary input from the experienced members in Manhattan. I moved to Manhattan a little over a year ago, and still struggling to decide how to get HD programming at home.

Here is my situation. I live in Miller Ranch (west of Seth Child) and my TV is in my walk-out basement facing northwest. It is Hitachi 51S700 with ATSC tuner. I tried to pick up OTA signal through small indoor fishbone antenna (Silver Sensor), but the signal meter shows about 15 out of 100 (no picture, no sound). I also tried a big outdoor round antenna from Radio Shack on the outside deck upstairs, but the same result. I read here that most of you are picking up OTA HD signals without much problem, and I guess my location is not quite ideal for picking up HD signals.

Now, my other options are as following. First, I can order HD progamming through DirecTV I already have (I can't switch to cable completely because of NFL Sunday Ticket), but I read here that getting the local channels is a hassle with all the waivers and stuff. The second option is to order Cox cable just for the HD programs. I have a friend who has basic cable from Cox (without a box), and his TV with ATSC tuner picks up all the local HD channels (ABC, CBS, NBC, and PBS). I checked the price for the basic cable service from Cox on the web, and it shows almost $50.

What would be the best way to get HD programming in the long run? More specifically, my questions are like the following.

1. Am I out of luck getting OTA HD? Does a huge outdoor fishbone antenna make a difference? If I'm getting 15 out 100 in signal strength with a round outdoor antenna (amplified), is it even worth trying a large fishbone antenna?
2. Exactly what local HD channels can I get through DirecTV with waivers?
3. Is there any cheaper option offered by Cox cable with local HD programs?

I don't care that much about other HD channels. I just want local networks (ABC, CBS, NBC, FOX, PBS) in HD. I also don't want to spend much money on it only to find out soon a small indoor antenna can pick up all the stations when their signal strengths get powerful enough.

I'd really appreciate your input.

I also want to ask fellow AVSers in Flint Hills area one more question. Is there any regular meet? If so, please send me a PM with the info. If there hasn't been one, I will be more than happy to host one at my place. I moved from Orlando, FL, and we used to have regular meets where we casually got together and talked about HT stuff. Please let me know if you guys are interested. Just an evening with some beer talking HT...

Thanks!
starlite

Hey starlite, welcome to Manhattan. I am just north of the stadium, and get all the Topeka stations, plus KAAS, which is Fox out of Salina. I have an antenna on the roof.

As far as waivers, a few of us have been able to get a Fox waiver, but the rest denied them I guess, as I never heard anything. Cox has everything else, like CBS, NBC, ABC and PBS. What about getting the Fox waiver, then a box to get the unencrypted stuff from Cox? Do you have Cox for anything??

I dont know of any meets.

Thanks for your reply, timmy1376! Unfortunately, I don't have anything with Cox (SBC DSL and DirecTV), so paying extra for local HD would be too much. Since you say FOX is the only station where I can get a waiver from, DirecTV option is out of the window as well... It just leaves me with one option-having an outdoor antenna on the roof. I haven't had much success with all different types of antennas, so I am not sure if an outdoor antenna would work at my location, but I guess I will give it a shot. I will post the result after I play with an outdoor antenna.

Just read that INHD is shutting down INHD2 as of 1/1/07. I was wondering if anyone knew if COX was going to replace it with some other channel.....

I've read that in many markets it is being replaced by ESPN2 HD, but I haven't heard anything about the Kansas markets yet.

I've read that in many markets it is being replaced by ESPN2 HD, but I haven't heard anything about the Kansas markets yet.

The Deuce is supposed to be coming in HD but I haven't been told when. If it isn't Jan. 1 or 2 it should be sometime shortly thereafter.

WIBW:

Any chance of killing the MyTopekaTV logo on 13.2 during programming and commericals and just showing it ever 15 minutes or so? Seems like it is on ALL the time. Also, on the station identifier, it says DIWB instead of WIBW, is that right, and if so, what does it stand for?

thanks!

The Deuce is supposed to be coming in HD but I haven't been told when. If it isn't Jan. 1 or 2 it should be sometime shortly thereafter.

ESPN2HD showed up Jan. 1st.

Anyone know if Cox broadcasts any unencrypted QAM channels in Manhattan?

Mez

They do actually. I can receive KSNT, KTKA, WIBW and KTWU all in HD. You should also get the other channels KTWU multicasts, as well as MyNetworkTV in SD.

All of the above channels are subchannels of QAM channels 114 and 115. They work great. I've got an HDHomeRun into a SageTV machine that does my HD beautifully.

They do actually. I can receive KSNT, KTKA, WIBW and KTWU all in HD. You should also get the other channels KTWU multicasts, as well as MyNetworkTV in SD.

Thanks for the information.

Mez

live 65 miles from kansas city and surprisingly can pick it up with an outdoor antennae when the weather is right. have to manipulate the antennawe and lose signal periodically. now that bowl season is here I've seriously though of trying something to pick up 4.1 much easier then I do now. I really don't want a huge outdoor antennae mast outside. was wondering if anyone knows when will possibly get fox hd over cox and whether there is an outdoor antennae not involving a lot of set up I could mount against the side of my house that is worth a darn. I've seen radioshacks indoor outdoor disc for 89 bucks that looks intriguing. anybody ever use it?

Anyone know when the Topeka FOX station will start broadcasting OTA in HD??
I thought the deadline to start at least digital broadcast was 1/1/07, and they aren't even doing that yet apparently.
Any info would be much appreciated.

Since KTMJ is a low-power station, the rules are a little bit different for them. Last I read, they plan on doing a "Flash Cut" in February 2009.

live 65 miles from kansas city and surprisingly can pick it up with an outdoor antennae when the weather is right. have to manipulate the antennawe and lose signal periodically. now that bowl season is here I've seriously though of trying something to pick up 4.1 much easier then I do now. I really don't want a huge outdoor antennae mast outside. was wondering if anyone knows when will possibly get fox hd over cox and whether there is an outdoor antennae not involving a lot of set up I could mount against the side of my house that is worth a darn. I've seen radioshacks indoor outdoor disc for 89 bucks that looks intriguing. anybody ever use it?

Look into the Channel Master 4228 8-bay UHF antenna along with the Channel Master 7775 amplifier (or 7777 if you want the option to amplify VHF as well).

http://www.pctinternational.com/channelmaster/antennas_outdoor_uhf.html
http://www.pctinternational.com/channelmaster/amplifiers.html#preamplifiers

http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ANTENNAS/cm4228.html

(check out that last site for performance stats on a bunch of other antennas too).

That antenna/preamp will set you back about $120 total (www.warrenelectronics.com, or www.solidsignal.com are good places to order) but is pretty much the best combo for deep fringe reception. No guarantees at 65 miles, but if you can get the antenna up high on the roof with a relatively clear line of site you should do pretty well. You can get 5' mast lengths at Lowe's or Radio Shack.

Good luck... I think it will be a long wait for KTMJ in HD.

On the fringe, you need a directional antenna. The disc-type are omni-directional and don't work as well... I never had any luck with them here in Meriden for getting KC. I have the 4228/7777 combo that luv2chill recommends and I get 4.1 with very few dropouts. The playoff game yesterday and the BCS games have looked excellent. Mine is mounted on a mast just above my gutter line, so you can only see it from that side of the house. My wife lets me get away with it because it means American Idol in HD instead of the SD crap Fox 43 broadcasts.

Welcome to the forum, TopekaHusker! If you'd joined a week earlier, I'd have invited you to my Cotton Bowl party where we watched the game in HD.

I am about 65 miles from KC and have the set up that luv2chill describes and it works well for FOX-KC. It is in the attic of a two story house. It caused some multipath problems with the local stations so I had to use some filters. I only get 4, 29 and 38 from KC. But that is okay because I get everything else I need from Topeka OTA/COX.

I have a new in box Channel Master 4228 and the Channel Master 7777 pre-amplifier referred to above that I never used, (I managed to get all of the networks in HD either OTA here in Topeka, or via Directv). I also have a NIB 'Join-tenna' that allows one to employ two antennas if needed; one for local reception, and one for distant.

All of the above was purchased new from Solid Signal, and have never been used. If someone is interested in the above, (all or part-of), PM me and I'll make you a great deal. I'm in Topeka.
Bish

thebishman,

You have a PM!

starlite

Cox now has a channel 1 but this morning it appeared to just be InDemand commercials. Hopefully that's a sign that we're getting much closer to OnDemand.

Cox now has a channel 1 but this morning it appeared to just be InDemand commercials. Hopefully that's a sign that we're getting much closer to OnDemand.

QAM channel 90.7 is showing ordering instructions for OnDemand. It even says Press Select for On Demand Menu.

I was wondering if anybody had any information about receiving HD signals in Emporia. We get all four of the Topeka stations clearly with analog signals using a Winegard Square Shooter Antenna, but we'd like to be able to watch the CW without cable/satelite fees. I contacted KSNT, but they only told me the CW was broadcast digitally and didn't mention anything about signal strength. When I checked antennaweb only WIBW's digital signal was listed, so it made me wonder if the others were broadcasting at a much lower power than their analog signals.

Thank you in advance for any info you can provide.

Timmy, management wants the logo in all the time. Sorry.

It's me again... I'm in Manhattan (Miller Ranch) and just tried to install CM4228 with CM7777 amp for OTA HD reception. I used to get about 15 in my signal meter with small Silver Sensor indoor antenna, and hoped that CM4228 would get me better reception.

I was wrong... After installing CM4228 on my deck with 10-ft mast facing stations in Topeka, the signal meter shows exactly the same strength (15). Of course I don't get any picture or sound...

Now my question is this. I still can get the antenna a little higher by installing on the roof (about 15 feet higher). Would it help? It's puzzling to me that CM4228 gives me not one point better signal than a Silver Sensor. Am I in an area where no digital signal arrives?

One more thing I found out when I played with antennaweb is that my location seems quite bad for digital reception. When I input longitude and latitude instead of zip code, I get a lot fewer digital stations in the result. I need to input about 200-ft as the height to get the digital stations show up on the list. It sounds like I'm in a low point where there is no line of sight for digital stations. However, my neighbor whose home is a little more elevated than mine can receive WIBW-DT (13-1 and 13-2) and KDKA-DT (49-1) with an indoor Silver Sensor. My roof is in level with where his antenna is, but I cannot believe that a CM4228 about 15-ft lower than his indoor antenna would not give me anything.

Am I doomed for HD? I'd really appreciate any input from fellow Manhattaners.

Thanks!

starlite

...Now my question is this. I still can get the antenna a little higher by installing on the roof (about 15 feet higher). Would it help? It's puzzling to me that CM4228 gives me not one point better signal than a Silver Sensor. What are you getting on analog 27 or analog 49 presently with the new CM? It's easiest to tweak the setup watching an analog picture to get a feel for what is going on.

And do you get anything on 11 or 13 with rabbit ears? When I lived (several places) in town I always got something on 13 with rabbit ears. Of course not exactly watchable, but it should give you some indication of what you are up against at that location.

If your close neighbor is getting 13-1 and 49-1 with a silver sensor you should be able to pull in something eventually, if not easily.

I get snowy, but watchable picture on analog 27 and 49. Analog 13 is as clear as it can be with CM4228 antenna. I get no digital station from rabbit ears or silver sensor antennas.

Any ideas?

starlite

In that case I have to suspect the tuner or perhaps multipath/interference of some kind. Of course they are (all but blowtorch KTWU-DT) on peanut power on the digital side. Still nothing you shouldn't be able to overcome.

I've got a good lock on KCPT-DT (55kW ERP on UHF 18 @ 75 miles) By comparison you are 35 miles from WIBW-DT (193kW ERP on UHF 44) I reliably get KSHB-DT (450kW ERP UHF 42 @ 70 miles) no great line-of-sight here especially. So you really should be able to get some Topeka digitals as close as you are. Your reception on the analogs suggests you aren't in some exceptionally deep hole.

Have you tired different ATSC tuners?

I also believe I should be able to get some digital stations, and cannot understand why I'm getting absolutely zero. I suspected the built-in tuner of my TV, but testing with a samsung stand alone HD receiver gives me the same result. No reception at all. I think the antenna is working because it brings in the analog channels great.

It still puzzles me that my neighbor about 40 yards away at a little higher ground gets 13.1, 13.2, and 49.1 with an indoor antenna, and I cannot get anything with a huge outdoor CM4228 with an amp. There are not that many structures or trees around my house, so I don't see any reason for multipath problem. Intereference is something I cannot tell. What would be the sources of intereference?

Please help...

starlite

I can get 44 with rabbit ears north of the stadium. What's your elevation? I am about 980 ft. I think. If you get really desperate, I can test your STB at my house which I know gets the digital versions of 11, 13, 27, and 49, plus 18 out of Salina.

13 and 49 are putting out pretty good power, and 27 and 11 are kinda hidden from Manhattan because of some hills....

...I think the antenna is working because it brings in the analog channels great.

May be a clue if you are getting snow on analog 49 and 27, using CM 4228 w/ 7777. Both are full power UHF on decent towers. A properly performing 4228 alone should amply pull in 49 @ that distance if everything is even close to par. Since all of your potential digital is (presently) UHF, you'll need to perfect the UHF performance in that range.

It would probably be useful to either trial the neighbors working box in your setup or connect your non-working samsung tuner @ neighbors and/or timmy's location.

Starlite,
Try your reception taking the 7777 out of the pathway. The 4228 may well receive the stations you want perfectly without the need of the amp which may be making things MUCH worse.
Bish

timmy,

Thank you for the offer. I used the STB only to test if the built-in tuner of my TV works. Since STB doesn't get me any stations, I eliminated the possibility of a faulty tuner in my TV.

thebishman,

I tried the connection without 7777 amp. It gives me 7 out of 100 on my signal meter, and if I use 7777, it goes up to 15. So, I am sure the amp is not the problem.

I really appreciate all the help from everyone. I'm convinced that I definitely should be able to receive at least some stations with my 4228 (WIBW for sure), so I have to conclude that I'm doing something wrong... Based on my testing, the antenna works, the tuner works, and the amp works. So the problem must be somewhere else. One option is to put the antenna even higher (on the roof). I'm not going up on the roof under this weather, so I will have to wait until the snow disappears for that trial. In the mean time, I will completely disassemble everything and put it together all over again and try again. I will report back soon. Please wish me luck!

starlite,

I've been following your problems and figured I'd ask the obvious question..are you sure you're tuning the correct channels? For example, WIBW's Digital Signal is on RF Channel 44, not actually 13 (or 13.1). I've seen tuners that don't correctly figure all of that out. Are you doing a channel scan on the receiver when hooked to your antenna? Does anything happen if you try to tune directly to channel 44? I hope you don't take offense to me asking simple questions, because sometimes it is the simple stuff that gets us all.

As a side note, I'm with you..I can't believe you can't receive WIBW's digital signal at the very least...I can receive it with a set top antenna and no amp in the bottom floor of an apartment complex in Manhattan, with a pretty good signal. The others are spotty, but occasionally can be received when the preamp is turned on.

Keep us all posted, I'm sure it will work out for you, at least part way.

brianm66,

OH MY GOD!!! What an idiot I was... Of course I didn't take offense from your suggestion. And now I have tried it, I feel like a real idiot. Yes, it was the problem. I did the channel scan with silver sensor (probably while pointing at wrong direction) with nothing getting caught, so I never tried again with CM4228. I was tuning to 13.1 all the time thinking that I should get at least WIBW. I pointed the antenna with channel 44 on the screen, and did the autoscan again. Now I get clear picture of four stations with the antenna just sitting outside of my walk-out basement. I can't tell you how grateful I am to you for your help.

I am also grateful to everyone who squeezed their brains to solve this idiot's problem. I am quite embarrassed, but can't be happier that I now have HD!

AVS forum rules!

Thank you so much again!

starlite

It's my understanding that Cox is getting ready to beta-test OnDemand with employees in Topeka. I have no idea how long that will last or whether it will eventually be a gradual or instant rollout.

Starlite, sorry it took so long to reply. It looks like you got some help from the AVS community. I do agree this is a cool forum.

Hey guys,

I am new to this site, I do have a few questions. I hope that these questions havent been asked before. My first question is.........does 49 ever plan to broadcast in hd OTA. This is very frustrating to me because I have heard rumors that cox in Manhattan is getting HD feeds from 49.

My seccond question is do i stand a chance to get any of the KC stations. I do live in Wamego. I have just purchaced a directional antenna from Radio shack. It gets all of the Topeka digital stations with about 90-95% signal strangth In my attic. If I moved it to the roof do I stand a chance of getting the KC stations??? Also did I waste my $$ on the Radio shack antenna.

My third question is my grandpa and uncle both live out in Zendale and are next door neighbors my uncle and I just installed the directional antenna from Radio Shack, He gets all of the Topeka stations easily. He does have a samgsung Tubed HDTV with a built in astc tuner.
My grandpa has a samgsung HD ready tv with a Samgsung directv hd tuner. I have installed the antenna "same one from radio shack" with a old cable from his old antenna "probably from the 70s" I can only pull in 13.1 and 13.2 The question is, is it the cable or the old samgsung hd tuner? They have had the samgsung HD directv tuner for about 4 or 5 years.

My last question(i promise) is my Jvc dila is occationaly flickering. this is the best way i can describe it. It only seems to hapen when we have been watching tv for a while. Is this a problem with the lamp because it only startedc when i plugged in the amp for the antenna. But if i unplug the amp for the hd antenna it still does it, and it also does it now on out set top box.


I would be greatfull for any help.

Thanks
and i am excited to be a part of this forum.

Jaritta

Hey guys,

I am new to this site, I do have a few questions. I hope that these questions havent been asked before. My first question is.........does 49 ever plan to broadcast in hd OTA. This is very frustrating to me because I have heard rumors that cox in Manhattan is getting HD feeds from 49.

My seccond question is do i stand a chance to get any of the KC stations. I do live in Wamego. I have just purchaced a directional antenna from Radio shack. It gets all of the Topeka digital stations with about 90-95% signal strangth In my attic. If I moved it to the roof do I stand a chance of getting the KC stations??? Also did I waste my $$ on the Radio shack antenna.

My third question is my grandpa and uncle both live out in Zendale and are next door neighbors my uncle and I just installed the directional antenna from Radio Shack, He gets all of the Topeka stations easily. He does have a samgsung Tubed HDTV with a built in astc tuner.
My grandpa has a samgsung HD ready tv with a Samgsung directv hd tuner. I have installed the antenna "same one from radio shack" with a old cable from his old antenna "probably from the 70s" I can only pull in 13.1 and 13.2 The question is, is it the cable or the old samgsung hd tuner? They have had the samgsung HD directv tuner for about 4 or 5 years.

My last question(i promise) is my Jvc dila is occationaly flickering. this is the best way i can describe it. It only seems to hapen when we have been watching tv for a while. Is this a problem with the lamp because it only startedc when i plugged in the amp for the antenna. But if i unplug the amp for the hd antenna it still does it, and it also does it now on out set top box.


I would be greatfull for any help.

Thanks
and i am excited to be a part of this forum.

Jaritta

ABC already does OTA HD, you should be able to catch it. Before I had Cox I could get it with a set top antenna sometimes, though not perfect.

I also have a HD-iLA and have never seen a flicker from it.

ABC already does OTA HD, you should be able to catch it. Before I had Cox I could get it with a set top antenna sometimes, though not perfect.


ABC in Topeka does not do HD over the air. It is only on COX. They do digital over the air but not HD.

I had heard the COX had an exclusive on it but I don't know how long that will last. I know that the one year anniversary of ABC HD on COX is coming up at the end of the month.

....My seccond question is do i stand a chance to get any of the KC stations. I do live in Wamego. I have just purchaced a directional antenna from Radio shack. It gets all of the Topeka digital stations with about 90-95% signal strangth In my attic. If I moved it to the roof do I stand a chance of getting the KC stations??? Nope not much. At 90 miles you are just beyond where it dramatically falls apart. When I lived in the area the only time I really got any KC (analogs) was during periods of tropospheric ducting. You might have better luck shooting for Salina (65 miles) but even that is a long shot in most of Wamego. Probably requiring a lot of height and additional equipment.

If your are effortlessly receiving all of Topeka from the attic you are doing pretty good. :)
.........does 49 ever plan to broadcast in hd OTA. This is very frustrating to me because I have heard rumors that cox in Manhattan is getting HD feeds from 49. Perhaps not in our lifetime. And it's such a crock. :(

...OH MY GOD!!! What an idiot I was... Perhaps the CM 4228 w/ 7777 is a bit of overkill. But I don't think you can ever have too much reserve signal collecting capacity. ;)

And before you get all settled be sure and swing it to the west and shoot for KAAS-DT. Gonna need Fox HD to round it out!

Perhaps the CM 4228 w/ 7777 is a bit of overkill. But I don't think you can ever have too much reserve signal collecting capacity.

And before you get all settled be sure and swing it to the west and shoot for KAAS-DT. Gonna need Fox HD to round it out!

I agree that 4228/7777 combo is probably overkill, but it is nice to have the stability. And yes, my next mission is to get KAAS-DT from Salina. I briefly tried it yesterday, and guess what? I received, although not watchable, KSAS-DT out of Wichita. I couldn't fine any signal from KAAS, so maybe I have a better shot at getting KSAS...

I will just sit back and enjoy the other channels for now though. I will wait for the weather to warm up a little bit before I tackle FOX HD. It's just too cold to be outside.

starlite

...And yes, my next mission is to get KAAS-DT from Salina. I briefly tried it yesterday, and guess what? I received, although not watchable, KSAS-DT out of Wichita. I couldn't fine any signal from KAAS, so maybe I have a better shot at getting KSAS...You are off to a good start this time, because that's it! Sure helps to scan for channels. ;)

As Timmy could tell you KAAS-DT is a repeater of KSAS-DT so you are getting the identical digital HD as Wichita, but from Vinecreek. So all that's left is to shore it up to stable, and you will be in business.

In the future when you play with that you may be able to shoot west for KAAS and still get some (or all?) of Topeka off the backside of the 4228. If not you'll want a rotor.

I shoot West, southwest, and get 86 on my Voom box for KAAS, which basically IS 24 analog Fox KSAS out of Wichita. Wichita news and all.

I use two antenna together with a splitter reversed, it works for all channels, but occasionally I lose Fox. I used to get 91, but usually only watch Fox for football, so no big deal. You might have some issues with hills to the West. Let us know!

Remember for Fox scan channel 17. It is analog 18 out of Salina, but when it maps on your system, it goes to 24. Confusing enough??

If you go to Channel 1 and press "Select" the OnDemand menu should appear. If you go to 760 and press "Select" the Adult OnDemand menu should appear. It hasn't been that consistent for me yet, but it is there.

As happy as I am to finally have OnDemand, I'm a bit disappointed compared to what I've seen from other carriers in other markets. No Showtime and no HD. Also, no broadcast networks.

Hi, I've been having problems getting WIBW from Topeka. I scan in all the channels easily enough but when watching 13.1 the picture and sound is choppy and stops and starts a lot. 13.2 doesn't do it though and none of the other channels (11 or 49) do it either. Any ideas why just that one channel is causing problems.

Hello Situvux1, did you try a complete power reset on the receiver? Is that a set top box or HDTV with tuner in it?

WIBW

I am using a ATSC tuner card on my desktop PC. At first I thought it was due to a slow processor or slow graphics card but I have more than double the recommended specs. Also I have absolutely no problems watching HD programing on ch. 11, so I don't think it is my computer. All channels I receive are at 99-100% reception, so I can't believe it is my antenna. I've uninstalled and reinstalled the card with no luck. I've gotten high grade Monster cable and an amplifier because I thought maybe signal was being lost, but that didn't work either. When I changed to a very old piece of cable 49 started to do the same thing, so I thought it might have something to do with signal loss between my antenna and the jack, but I've tried the new cable and amplifier to no avail. I'm assuming the receiver powers down with a computer shutdown, but I don't know for sure. If it does then I've tried that too. I have run out of ideas as to why this is happening. Very frustrating as 13 is the channel we wanted in HD the most!!!

situveux1, what type of HDTV Computer card are you using? I have had calls in the past and the older cards were having issues. Did you check on updates/downloads for your product item? Let me know.

Thanks

It is a Geniatech A-8000 that was brand new in the box. I have checked the Geniatech website but I didn't see anything about new updates or new drivers that might be needed. The software that came with the card was call TotalMedia. I am considering selling this card on eBay and getting a different one, perhaps one that runs on it's own graphics card. Would you have any suggestions on a particular product that would perform well with WIBW?

Thank you for your help!

situveux1, i will post a link to a site. You need to decide what will fit you the best.

WIBW

http://fusionhdtv.co.kr/eng/Products/ATSC5Gold.aspx (product)

http://www.digitalconnection.com/products/video/fusion5rt.asp (reseller)

Fusion cards are good ones as wibw13 recommended. It is a card that uses your existing video card though. If you are looking for a tuner card with its own video output, check out MyHD MDP-130. The digital connection page for the card is,

http://www.digitalconnection.com/Products/Video/mdp130.asp.

It bypasses the cpu for video output, so it is less demanding for the system. You need an available component or vga input on your tv to use it. Otherwise, you have to buy the DVI daughter card.

Since your system seems to have enough horsepower, software cards like Fusion, or VBox Cat's Eye-150 would be fine as well. It comes down to how you want to hook up the tuner with your tv-through your graphics card or directly from the tuner.

What puzzles me in your situation though is that the tuner shouldn't be the source of your problem. I would check the codecs installed on your computer first. Sometimes the codec gives you a problem for just a few channels if they are old or corrupted. I had some problems with jerky playback of 49.1 before, and with some codec cleanup/reinstall, now the playback is fine, but no audio. Still working on it... All other channels work fine, so SD OTA 49.1 can wait. FYI, I have Cat's Eye-150 and Beyond TV 4.1.

starlite

Thank you WIBW so very much for your help. I'll look into the two cards you suggested. For now I looked into the codec's starlite suggested and it seems to have cleared up the problem for now with minimal pauses every 20-25 minutes or so. We'll see in the coming days if that works. If not I'll give something else a try.

Thanks again!

Anyone have trouble getting WIBW-HD OTA on Tuesday night? I got a good signal but no picture. A co-worker on the other side of town had the same problem. It was okay on COX.

This was posted on wibw.com

WIBW-TV had a hard drive failure Tuesday night, and it has affected some digital receivers.

If you are having problems receiving the digital signal, re-scan your TV’s or set top boxes. In other words, go back to your initial setup and your set will scan available channels. To do that, use your remote control, go to INITIAL SETUP and follow the instructions.

If you are tuning your digital with an off-air signal, you need to set your receivers to 44.1 to 44.2. In older TV’s, you may need to set 44.3 or 44.4

If you are tuning your digital with an off-air signal, you need to set your receivers to 44.1 to 44.2. In older TV’s, you may need to set 44.3 or 44.4

This sucks! The rescan brought up 44.3 and now my Season Passes and guide info no longer work on my HD-Tivo.

My DirectTv HD-Tivo is doing the same thing, no picture on 13-1 or 13-2. But if I check signal stregnth on dig ch 44 it shows 90 on frequency 44, ch 44-3. I've rescanned OTA channels, doesn't help.

I just tuned to dig ch 44-3 and found ch 13 digital. I guess this screws up my season passes as well.

Hello to all, we lost our hard drive in the PSIP computer which translates the guide and channel information. As you all know we broadcast on 44 UHF and it translates to 13.1 - 13.2. My digital TV needed re-scanned to pick it up on44.1-44.2
Some of the new set top boxes auto-scan and pick it up on 44.3-44.4 We are in the process of rebuilding the drive and programming info. Please be patient. I hope everything will be back on Monday Afternoon. Thank you

WIBW

Anyone else noticing the huge amount of 'interference' with the OTA KSNT 27-1 broadcasts recently? I'm seeing a large amount of white 'sparklies' all over the black areas of the screen at times. Very noticeable with Heros the other night.
Bish

Never mind, it must be a network issue:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=808264

Bish

Been trying to read through the archive, but haven't found what I was looking for. I am finally getting an HDTV and I am interested in upgrading my Cox service to HD. Do their DVR or other settop boxes offer HDMI output? How good is the service? Thanks in advance for any help.

The Cox HD DVR has HDMI output. I have had it a year and the service is good. I would say it has been down a total of 7 days in the last year. That said, when Direct tv offers locals in HD I am going to look into switching. (Who knows when that will be though.) One complaint I do have is small storage capacity of the DVR. HD recorded programing takes a lot of space...

Has anybody tried a cable card in Topeka? I was wondering if they even offer cable card here. I use Directv right now but I just bought a Mitsubishi DVR HD-6000 that has cable card slot, firewire, net command, perfect color etc... and it should be here on the 26th. Since I just got an email from D that the price was going up that it might be good time to switch to Cox if they offer a cable card.

Cox by law has to offer you the option of using a Cable card. Do not take no as an answer. You can search the forum for what other Cox customers are paying to have the card 'installed', as well as what the monthly fees are. Picture 'quality' when the card is placed into the TV itself is said to improve since the STB is by-passed.
Bish

They do actually. I can receive KSNT, KTKA, WIBW and KTWU all in HD. You should also get the other channels KTWU multicasts, as well as MyNetworkTV in SD.

All of the above channels are subchannels of QAM channels 114 and 115. They work great. I've got an HDHomeRun into a SageTV machine that does my HD beautifully.

I have my cable line connected to the cable input on the TV but I can't seem to register any of these channels these using my TV's automatic tuning option. The TV has a digital tuner and picks up the audio only digital channels in the 82.x range and one digital preview channel (79.2) but nothing else. I've tried tuning manually to 114.1 and some others but there's nothing there.

I'm new to this so forgive me if I'm missing the obvious but is there something else I should be doing? I grudge paying COX for the digital gateway / box just to get these channels - I'd love to get this working


Thanks in advance.

Magnie,

What kind of TV do you have? Some TVs do not have QAM tuner. They have only OTA HD (ATSC) tuner. Check the spec of your TV and see if it says QAM with ATSC. If it only shows ATSC, you need a box to get Cox HD or an antenna to receive OTA HD.

Magnie,

What kind of TV do you have? Some TVs do not have QAM tuner. They have only OTA HD (ATSC) tuner. Check the spec of your TV and see if it says QAM with ATSC. If it only shows ATSC, you need a box to get Cox HD or an antenna to receive OTA HD.

Thanks for the reply. The TV is a Sony XBR2, the specs say it has "QAM on Cable" and in the details "ANSI/SCTE 07 2000 (Does not include CableCard functoinality)".

Since I can tune the digital audio channels and the one NBA preview video channel, I figured I should be able to get the others but no luck so far. The auto tuning on cable logs some other channels but the TV reports being unable to decode them and it reports no signal on the channels I thought were the local HD ones.

Thanks again - any suggestions welcome :)

Thanks for the reply. The TV is a Sony XBR2, the specs say it has "QAM on Cable" and in the details "ANSI/SCTE 07 2000 (Does not include CableCard functoinality)".

Since I can tune the digital audio channels and the one NBA preview video channel, I figured I should be able to get the others but no luck so far. The auto tuning on cable logs some other channels but the TV reports being unable to decode them and it reports no signal on the channels I thought were the local HD ones.

Thanks again - any suggestions welcome :)

NM - problem solved. I had the cable line running through the VCR, I didn't realize that this would prevent the TV from tuning the digital channels properly. Duh ...

Has anyone checked KTKA, lately too see when OTA HD is going to be available? For the 50% + folks out there that are receiving HD signal through antenna, methinks this "next year" vaporware answer is getting a touch annoying. I don't watch any ABC national or local programs from Topeka. It has been next year for going on 5 years now.

Has anyone checked KTKA, lately too see when OTA HD is going to be available? For the 50% + folks out there that are receiving HD signal through antenna, methinks this "next year" vaporware answer is getting a touch annoying. I don't watch any ABC national or local programs from Topeka. It has been next year for going on 5 years now.

Considering the station is bleeding money and cannot even keep sales people to bring revenue in (much less the rest of the staff), I am sure its not their top priority.

They spent a chuck of money on their StormTracker hummer.

* yellow - uhf WIBW-DT 13.1 CBS TOPEKA KS 261° 13.8 44
* yellow - uhf KTWU-DT 11.1 PBS TOPEKA KS 24° 3.4 23
* yellow - uhf KTKA-DT 49.1 ABC TOPEKA KS 269° 6.6 48
* yellow - uhf KSNT-DT 27.1 NBC TOPEKA KS 2° 5.0 28 That is all antenna web coughs up for me digitally, before I raise the height option significantly.

If that was really it, I just as well still be in Manhattan. ;)

I've asked andy.s.lee (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/member.php?u=7700156) to run a simulation of my location, maybe determine LOS to Kansas City, and theoretically assess just how difficult those extra stations are from my side of town.

* yellow - uhf WIBW-DT 13.1 CBS TOPEKA KS 261° 13.8 44
* yellow - uhf KTWU-DT 11.1 PBS TOPEKA KS 24° 3.4 23
* yellow - uhf KTKA-DT 49.1 ABC TOPEKA KS 269° 6.6 48
* yellow - uhf KSNT-DT 27.1 NBC TOPEKA KS 2° 5.0 28 That is all antenna web coughs up for me digitally, before I raise the height option significantly.

If that was really it, I just as well still be in Manhattan. ;)

I've asked andy.s.lee (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/member.php?u=7700156) to run a simulation of my location, maybe determine LOS to Kansas City, and theoretically assess just how difficult those extra stations are from my side of town.
Here are the results of the analysis...

In the attached radar plot, longer bars represent stronger signals. Details about each transmitter are given in the table to the right.



My interpretation:

- The good news is that it doesn't look like you'll have that much problem with co-channel or adjacent channel interference. It looks like the Topeka and Kansas City channels are spaced apart and non-overlapping in a good way.

- The not-so-good news is that the KC are pretty far away. The terrain and Earth curvature are limiting the amount of signal strength you'll get out of the KC transmitters. You won't be able to get a line-of-sight path to them because that would require an antenna mast over 100 meters tall. However, even with the Earth curvature and terrain diffraction, you should still be getting enough signal to work with if you make sure to use good antennas.

- If you are only interested in OTA from KC, then that's good since you don't need to combine the strong local channels with the weak distant channels. If you were interested in both sets of channels, you're probably better off with two sets of antenna networks and an A-B switch.

- If your cable run is more than ~30 feet or if you split the signal to multiple destinations, I'd recommend adding a pre-amp like the Winegard AP-2870.

- Since there are some rather strong signals coming from the opposite direction from KC (KTKA-TV-49, KTKA-DT-48, WIBW-TV-13, and WIBW-DT-44), you'll want to use antennas with fairly high front-to-back ratios. This will make sure you avoid any overload problems on the pre-amp.

- To get both high gain and good F/B ratio, the best candidates seem to be the Channel Master 4228, the AntennasDirect XG91, and the Televes DAT-75 for UHF. Your Winegard YA-1713 seems to be a good choice for VHF.



With this kind of setup, I would expect you to be able to receive most of the channels in the -100 to -110 dBm range (under "Rx_dBm"), give or take a little. It seems perfectly reasonable to get the majority of KC channels from your location.



Best regards,
Andy

You are east of the stations. Go to antennaweb.org for map and antenna selector. Many folks are able to get Kansas City from here. We have a 22 element 66" Channel master pointe toward Kansas city and pick up all Topeka Stations and all KC digital stations most of the time with antenna pointed toward KC. '

Thanks Andy. Got to take a look at this, even before forum attachments were corrected. Guess I'm glad I was ignorant of the challenges before securing reception of the KC digitals.

The good news is there's apparently much that can be done to stabilize significantly diffracted signals. :)

I'm actually getting all KC locals rather reliably (even KCPT-DT @-123.5 dbm) in fact I'm primarily watching them for HD and using the Topeka digitals (QAM) mostly for backup. Since the KC affiliates use no (or less) multicasting in every case. For the time being anyway. Even KCPT(HD) looks dramatically better than KTWU (HD) now, perhaps even the 480i daytime version.

And of course Topeka will likely never see a watchable CW or MY, if we ever finally end up with ABC or FOX in HD. :(

That's what really what motivated me here.

But back to the simulation. Looks like it gets caught on outdated STAs and construction permits in the spotty FCC data. Two presently robust KC digitals (WDAF-DT and KSMO-DT) don't show up there. Both went full power and apparently moved their digital antennas above analog, within the last 18 months or so. Making the digital service contour area (http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=DT401543.html) come much closer to me for both of those. They are among the strongest ones I get from KC.

I'm wondering how the Tx_kW get calculated from those parameters? The signal levels look about right to me, but I have to suspect that KTWU-DT is blasting more of it's 960 kW ERP right on top of me than might be indicated by 191.27 Tx_kW?

...back to the simulation. Looks like it gets caught on outdated STAs and construction permits in the spotty FCC data. Two presently robust KC digitals (WDAF-DT and KSMO-DT) don't show up there. Both went full power and apparently moved their digital antennas above analog, within the last 18 months or so. Making the digital service contour area (http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=DT401543.html) come much closer to me for both of those. They are among the strongest ones I get from KC.
Yes, you're right. The FCC database does have some typos, conflicting data, duplicate entries, and flat out errors. I also have to admit that my FCC database snarfing code could use some better heuristics to filter out unwanted entries. Since I've come across a number of these errors in the past, I've actually found it necessary to maintain my own database of FCC database "patches". My local database overrides entries in the FCC database so that I can download new sets of FCC data and keep my fixes in place. I am actually in the process of reworking my FCC database snarfing code to make it more intelligent than it is now.

In the meantime, if there are specific fixes that you think I should add to my FCC patches, please let me know. That way all future simulation runs will be more accurate. With continued help from people like you, I think we can get these tools closer to 99% correct for future analyses.

FYI, the software currently simulates over 12,000 FCC database records, so it may take some time to discover and correct all the errors in there. I have no idea where antennaweb gets their data, but their info seems to have even more omissions, superfluous entries, and errors than the FCC database.



I'm wondering how the Tx_kW get calculated from those parameters? The signal levels look about right to me, but I have to suspect that KTWU-DT is blasting more of it's 960 kW ERP right on top of me than might be indicated by 191.27 Tx_kW?
That's because their antenna pattern blasts mostly in the east-west direction. The FCC has this (http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/polarplot?temp=58982&rotate=0.00&p0=0.566&p10=0.542&p20=0.482&p30=0.418&p40=0.417&p50=0.520&p60=0.683&p70=0.844&p80=0.959&p90=1.000&p100=0.959&p110=0.844&p120=0.683&p130=0.520&p140=0.417&p150=0.418&p160=0.482&p170=0.542&p180=0.566&p190=0.542&p200=0.482&p210=0.418&p220=0.417&p230=0.520&p240=0.683&p250=0.844&p260=0.959&p270=1.000&p280=0.959&p290=0.844&p300=0.683&p310=0.520&p320=0.417&p330=0.418&p340=0.482&p350=0.542&p360=0.566&) antenna pattern on file for them.

The table lists transmitted EIRP in your direction rather than the total ERP of the transmitter.



Best regards,
Andy

Hey WIBW,

If I read the information correctly about March Madness, when KU is playing in the tournament, it won't be in HD because of this constant / flex thing. Can you confirm or deny please?

...That's because their antenna pattern blasts mostly in the east-west direction. The FCC has this (http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/polarplot?temp=58982&rotate=0.00&p0=0.566&p10=0.542&p20=0.482&p30=0.418&p40=0.417&p50=0.520&p60=0.683&p70=0.844&p80=0.959&p90=1.000&p100=0.959&p110=0.844&p120=0.683&p130=0.520&p140=0.417&p150=0.418&p160=0.482&p170=0.542&p180=0.566&p190=0.542&p200=0.482&p210=0.418&p220=0.417&p230=0.520&p240=0.683&p250=0.844&p260=0.959&p270=1.000&p280=0.959&p290=0.844&p300=0.683&p310=0.520&p320=0.417&p330=0.418&p340=0.482&p350=0.542&p360=0.566&) antenna pattern on file for them.Ah ha. Guess I'm lucky to be in the null of the pattern so I'm not getting pounded harder. I can see the tower from my roof and 23 KTWU-DT makes 24 KCTV-DT my most challenging KC digital. But that problem goes away in 2009.

Yes, you're right. The FCC database does have some typos, conflicting data, duplicate entries, and flat out errors. I also have to admit that my FCC database snarfing code could use some better heuristics to filter out unwanted entries. Since I've come across a number of these errors in the past, I've actually found it necessary to maintain my own database of FCC database "patches". My local database overrides entries in the FCC database so that I can download new sets of FCC data and keep my fixes in place. I am actually in the process of reworking my FCC database snarfing code to make it more intelligent than it is now.

In the meantime, if there are specific fixes that you think I should add to my FCC patches, please let me know. That way all future simulation runs will be more accurate. With continued help from people like you, I think we can get these tools closer to 99% correct for future analyses.

FYI, the software currently simulates over 12,000 FCC database records, so it may take some time to discover and correct all the errors in there. I have no idea where antennaweb gets their data, but their info seems to have even more omissions, superfluous entries, and errors than the FCC database.
Yes you're doing much better than antennaweb. I have to raise it 300 feet to see the first KC digital (KPXE-DT) and 500 feet to get several more. I figure for my location, they have it about 300 feet below what I can easily receive with common Shack or Lowe's OTA hardware. I have to raise antennaweb 900 feet to get it to spit out KSMO-DT (http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/tvq?call=KSMO) and 1600 feet before if finds WDAF-DT (http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/tvq?call=WDAF). They are obviously using the old STAs for those two.

Not sure what you have for them, but everything else appears correct to me. I'm curious what you get for the Rx_dBm on KSMO-DT (http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/tvq?call=KSMO) and WDAF-DT (http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/tvq?call=WDAF) if you have time to run those. Not that it's critical since my reception is solid but just to see how they compare to the others. I have every reason to suspect both are 1000kW ERP at 348 and 324 meters AGL, non-directional.

Another thing, how do you calculate the min_h?

Again thanks much. This is the most useful info I've seen on this, illustrating what took hours and hours of trial and error over several years to stumble upon. There will probably never be some magic shortcut to all the trial and error, since sometimes it's more art than science. But (in the right hands) this info comes about as close and personal as anything I've seen. Only thing I still want to do is run some Radio Mobile elevation profiles (of my paths) to get a more graphic view of the obstructions.

Not sure what you have for them, but everything else appears correct to me. I'm curious what you get for the Rx_dBm on KSMO-DT (http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/tvq?call=KSMO) and WDAF-DT (http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/tvq?call=WDAF) if you have time to run those. Not that it's critical since my reception is solid but just to see how they compare to the others. I have every reason to suspect both are 1000kW ERP at 348 and 324 meters AGL, non-directional.
OK. Here's another plot done with my new FCC database parsing routines. The downloadable FCC database is full of holes, has invalid cross-references, has inconsistent data representation, and simply isn't complete enough for what I'm trying to do. So, in an effort to make the most of what's available, I've completely re-written this section of code and I think it will do better job of inferring missing information and identifying the records that agree with the real world. This is all very new and highly experimental, so if you spot any errors, it means I still have some adjustments to make.

With the new code, it looks like it's picking up the full power records for KSMO and WDAF now.



Another thing, how do you calculate the min_h?
It's my own arbitrary lower bound based on my field testing and other people's feedback. I've picked a minimum signal threshold where I believe a "reasonable OTA setup" would have a decent chance at picking up the given channel. What I mean by "reasonable" is something like a 15-20 dB gain antenna installed with a pre-amp on the roof or on a mast. It's an approximation of what I think can be expected from "standard" equipment (e.g., Winegard, Channel Master, Radio Shack, etc.) that a do-it-yourself person could obtain and intall easily without getting too exotic.

The way it's computed is by simulating many points directly above the specified coordinates and finding the altitude (above ground level) necessary to achieve the minimum signal threshold. This takes into account the amount of groundwave / diffracted energy that can reach the antenna. This means that if the terrain obstruction is far away, the min_h will be much lower than the los_h. Conversely, if the house is right next to the obstructing hill, the min_h would have to be nearly the same as the los_h.

I wanted to get a feel for how high someone would need to go if they were blocked by a hill and wanted to install a mast for better reception. My min_h setting should provide a decent working system at a minimum level. Of course, it's always recommended to go higher, if possible, in order to have more margin for error or changes due to trees, bad weather, multipath, etc.

It also helps point out which channels are impossible to get due to really tall obstructions in a particular direction. The los_h also gives some indication of this, but it does not take into account whether the obstruction is near or far.



Only thing I still want to do is run some Radio Mobile elevation profiles (of my paths) to get a more graphic view of the obstructions.
Although not exactly as scientific as Radio Mobile, a more "fun" way to visualize terrain obstructions is something like this (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=9912010#post9912010), if you haven't seen it already.



Thanks for double checking my details and providing the feedback!



Best regards,
Andy

OK. Here's another plot done with my new FCC database parsing routines. Thanks, that looks complete now.

I'm surprised WDAF-DT didn't rank near the top of the bunch from KC. It's definitely the strongest signal of that group, since it went full power. It consistently rates highest (of the KC digitals) on various receiver "signal" meters. I know that generally just means fewer errors, but (although I haven't tried this in a while) WDAF-DT used to be receivable (day and night) with just a simple silver sensor near attic level. It's the only KC signal that would do that with any regularity.

Comparing WDAF-DT and KSHB-DT, 34 is slightly closer, while 42 is only about half the power (although fortunately sending everything it has in my direction) with 42 higher in frequency. Higher LOS for 42 as well. No significant interference issues I'm aware of for either 34 or 42. The only other apparent difference I can think of is the Azim/path. So why is WDAF-DT 34 showing a lower Rx_dBm than KSHB-DT 42?

Different diffraction accumulation because of path? Or is it something else obvious I'm not thinking of? :)

Comparing WDAF-DT and KSHB-DT, 34 is slightly closer, while 42 is only about half the power (although fortunately sending everything it has in my direction) with 42 higher in frequency. Higher LOS for 42 as well. No significant interference issues I'm aware of for either 34 or 42. The only other apparent difference I can think of is the Azim/path. So why is WDAF-DT 34 showing a lower Rx_dBm than KSHB-DT 42?

Different diffraction accumulation because of path? Or is it something else obvious I'm not thinking of? :)
It looks like a difference in the location of the obstructions causing the diffraction. Even though WDAF has a lower los_h, you'll notice that it actually has a higher min_h. That means the KSHB path has a higher obstruction, but further away, while the WDAF path has an obstruction closer to you yet not quite so high.

Of course, we're only talking about a couple of dB or less here, so in the grand scheme of things, I think this distinction is in the noise.

This is one of the reasons I find these tools fun to experiment with. Sometimes they will reveal things you wouldn't have expected. Then, when you actually go and investigate, you realize that there really is something there. It's easier to see when I overlay coverage maps in Google Earth and see it all in 3D.



Best regards,
Andy

Interesting. I have played with google earth, but hadn't maxed the vertical exaggeration before. Makes it more evident.

Looks like my two groups of obstructions are roughly 20 and 30 miles away. My elevation here looks pretty good, nearly on par with my horizon, a little more than half a mile in that direction. I generally park UHF around 92 degrees or a little more. About the only channel that really complains about that is KCWE-DT (86.4 Azim) although I'd expect KCPT-DT to suffer more. Maybe I'm "seeing through" with that heading or getting help from those distant ridges. But I suspect the biggest advantage (from the extra degrees south) is help in nulling 23 and 43 from the KTWU tower, since KCTV-DT 24 is abruptly lost without it. Guess I'll find out in 2009.

Do you really think a silver sensor can receive -110 dBm?

I just checked this again. Nothing but silver sensor (indoors) and I get a solid lock on WDAF-DT with a signal quality of 66. Not a blip on anything else from KC with that setup. Same thing on a different receiver. A quick scan of regular analog suggests no tropo. Analogs are slightly weaker than average at the moment. Seems to be a significant difference (must be more than a few dB) in the reception of WDAF-DT, and everything else in that direction.

Not that I'm complaining about it. :)

...Looks like my two groups of obstructions are roughly 20 and 30 miles away. I was pretty close with that rough estimation. Finally got Radio Mobile up and running and WDAF-DT appears to have 2 groups of obstructions (ridges) at around 15 miles and 25 miles, using a reception height of 10 meters. KSHB-DT just misses the second ridge northeast of Lawrence, so only one range of hilltops blocking it, near the Douglas County line at 15 miles or so. I'll eventually take the time to plot all the interesting KC digitals on the same map. Then it's fairly easy to toggle the elevation profiles and see the differences.

Still doesn't exactly explain why WDAF-DT comes in so much stronger (since everything around 87 Azim seems to be clipped by that same second range northeast of Lawrence) but of course we are only as good as the elevation data and the info filed by the stations. And of course the interaction of all that diffraction. Does seem to confirm nothing major in my way very close, if I'm doing it right.

Just glad I'm able to collect enough signal to reliably tune those channels.

Can you please explain why the second half of the Kansas game was NOT displayed in HD when all of the NCAA games are broadcast in HD by CBS?
Bish

It has to do with Flex and Constant feeds. CBS does not have the capability to send eight HD feeds out at the same time. When the game became a blowout, CBS switched the KU HD feed to a different game. But since WIBW had to stay with the KU game, they had to provide the SD feed. There is several threads about this in the HD Programming forum.

For what it is worth, Directv's March Mega Madness was also effected by this. At one time last night, three of the four games were in SD on the HD channels.

I have had my HDTV for 2 years and same reciever.. i can get 11.1 11.2 11.3 27.1 27.2, but i cant get 13.1 or 49....

Its a indoor Phillips antenna, we are only allowed indoor antenna's at 21st and wanamaker... Any ideas of how to get 13 tonight for some B-ball???

For awhile we were limited to an indoor antenna and I found it best to place the antenna on the side of the house facing the signal (for us north towards Topeka, maybe for you west towards the WIBW tower.) In Emporia, I got WIBW and KTKA both with an indoor at 50+ miles distance. WIBW has a fairly strong DT signal, so you should be able to get it, especially if you get 27. Get as few walls between the signal and your antenna as you can. It helps to get the antenna away from the TV and other electrical devices. You might get more out of it by using a UHF only antenna. A pre-amp on our indoor antenna helped out a lot as well. You can get one at Wal-Mart with a pre-amp for like $20. That's what I used. Hope that helps.

I have had my HDTV for 2 years and same reciever.. i can get 11.1 11.2 11.3 27.1 27.2, but i cant get 13.1 or 49....

Its a indoor Phillips antenna, we are only allowed indoor antenna's at 21st and wanamaker... Any ideas of how to get 13 tonight for some B-ball???

On top of the hill on 21st, bottom of the hill near Wanamaker, or near Westport Drive drive east of Wanamaker?:D

On top of the hill on 21st, bottom of the hill near Wanamaker, or near Westport Drive drive east of Wanamaker?:D

On the bottom, near brookfield street...

Does anyone know if SCI broadcasts the networks in HD via clear QAM in St. George? If so, what are the channel numbers?

Mez

Ok guys, what do you recommend? Put the antenna to the second floor, with 50ft coxial cable running to TV, if i remember correctly the antenna is 50-60db.

When i turn on the AMP i can't catch much, but if i turn off the amp it works perfectly fine.

I also still can't get WIBW 13-1 or KTKA 49-1... What's the problem???

Ok guys, what do you recommend? Put the antenna to the second floor, with 50ft coxial cable running to TV, if i remember correctly the antenna is 50-60db.

When i turn on the AMP i can't catch much, but if i turn off the amp it works perfectly fine.

I also still can't get WIBW 13-1 or KTKA 49-1... What's the problem???

You should be getting WIBW-DT. Try running the set-up again from the TV/STB that you are using, and allowing it to scan for all OTA digital channels.
Bish

Just playing with it, with old rabbit ears i get 49-1, but its really windy today, im going to go get a new antenna i think the amps messed up cause the antenna only works with the amp off....

55db RCA.... also heard wibw is down right now...

New antenna works wonders, but I can't get 13-1, i now get 49-1 perfectly...uh.... i wanna get some bball!!!

At 16:30 I can't receive WIBW-DT from either OTA or Cox. Bad day for basketball fans wanting to see the games in HD.
Bish

yep, tell me about it, i bought my new antenna just for this, to learn after i bought it that wibw's antenna was messed up yesterday.... come on... lol... Just when i get it to work too...

Gee... I thought my HTPC was messed up when I lost WIBW-DT. When are they going to fix it? Will we be able to watch at least the final on Monday in HD?

All i know is that they have engineers fixing as we speak, but they couldnt start until the rain passed...

It's still down now. I bet it won't be back up for tonight.

It will really be nice if WIBW would start treating their HDTV channel like a real channel that needs to be up, instead of something that is experimental. HD should not be experimental at this time. They've had so many problems (lip sync problems, etc.). This is why we need to get rid of all the protectionist laws for broadcast TV. If it weren't for protectionist laws, we'd be able to get all 5 networks in HD over satellite.

I can't believe the Final is not in HD.... Damn!

You know guys I think maybe there is/was something other than just an 'antenna' problem. Why? Well I think that WIBW sends the HD stream to Cox via a fibre-optic link directly; I don't believe that Cox 'captures' the OTA feed and then sends it to its customers. Since WIBW HD on Cox was down for me as well as the OTA feed, it also had to be something at the station; yes? I am not currently in town so don't know if the Cox WIBW HD feed is still down.
Bish

It's definitely something with the station because it's down OTA and on cable.

You know guys I think maybe there is/was something other than just an 'antenna' problem. Why? Well I think that WIBW sends the HD stream to Cox via a fibre-optic link directly; I don't believe that Cox 'captures' the OTA feed and then sends it to its customers. Since WIBW HD on Cox was down for me as well as the OTA feed, it also had to be something at the station; yes? I am not currently in town so don't know if the Cox WIBW HD feed is still down.
Bish

I heard that the 13 News Radio Network is down as well... and that comes via MP3 so who knows. Maybe the studio took a lightning strike?

It's up now, wasn't at 8:30 a.m. is at noon.:D I was just getting ready to send them an email.

I read that FOX 43 is simulcasting WDAF "FOX 4" news from Kansas City at 9:00 PM now, is this true? I see "FOX 43 News at Nine" in the program guide.

Fox 43 is simulcasting news from KC. Don't know why they decided to change.

Is WIBW broadcasting again OTA or just on Cox? I haven't been able to get a signal yet OTA.

Is WIBW broadcasting again OTA or just on Cox? I haven't been able to get a signal yet OTA.

They are on OTA.

Is it possible they're at a much lower power than before, I'm still not picking them up. Maybe it's an antenna thing, but I got them before.

I'm in Manhattan using CM 4228 with an amp.

I think the power of WIBW is not the same as before. I used to get close to 70 on my signal meter, but now it is around 20, too low to display the picture... It is higher than when it was completely down, so I guess it is back on. I hope the power gets restored to normal level before the Masters on weekend. Missing Final Four was enough...

I'm also in Manhattan....I saw that they were on Cox again, but I'm OTA....using an indoor antenna, a Terk HDTVlp. Used to come in solid, after a rescan I get a signal...but all blocks and nothing recognizeable.

When it was working, it was the only station I could get.

The Dreamer.

I'm picking up WIBW at around 60% today, maybe the weather helped things along.

I'm picking up WIBW at around 60% today, maybe the weather helped things along.

Thanks guys, the antenna was the problem, after i got the new antenna with the amp, i recieved every channel OTA, didnt even need an amp, then we tried to use old antenna to get regular analog channels and it couldn't get them, so bad antenna.

And what is up with the fox 4 news on fox 43... i watch KC news in manhattan.. thats crazy... can't wait for 43 to become digital!

Is anyone having problems with WIBW again today? No matter what antenna position I try, nothing comes in. I can get 27, but not 13...very odd.

No problem with 13.1 OTA for me.
Bish

I haven't changed anything to my TV's configuration. I'll have to play around with it some more. Technologies great when it works but when it doesn't...

I checked also and it was fine for me.

I just wish that the news on Fox 43 at 9 had some sports....

FOX 4 only has sports in the 10:00 PM newscast at night.... so no sports for "FOX 43 News" at 9:00 PM.

So.... does anybody think this is the first step to FOX 43 actually launching some kind of local newscast again?

Well I dropped Cox and went with D*. (Very long story.) Obviously I lost the local networks in HD. I am wondering if anyone could tell me:
1) Would a inside antenna get me the locals OTA? (Live Just west of Gage Blvd.)
2) If so, any recommendation on antennas?
Thanks all!

Well I dropped Cox and went with D*. (Very long story.) Obviously I lost the local networks in HD. I am wondering if anyone could tell me:
1) Would a inside antenna get me the locals OTA? (Live Just west of Gage Blvd.)
2) If so, any recommendation on antennas?
Thanks all!


Living that close, I would imagine you will be fine. The Silver Sensor is highly recommended as is the Radio Shack double bowtie.

http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ANTENNAS/silver.html

http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ANTENNAS/DoubleBow.html


Others will chime in for you location I would bet. Good luck.

Well I dropped Cox and went with D*. (Very long story.) Obviously I lost the local networks in HD. I am wondering if anyone could tell me:
1) Would a inside antenna get me the locals OTA? (Live Just west of Gage Blvd.)
2) If so, any recommendation on antennas?
Thanks all!

I use Silver Sensors and they work great with the D HD boxes. You can get Fox in HD if you petition Dave Waters, the GM at KTMJ, and ask nicely for a waiver to enable you to get Fox in HD out of New York. You do NOT need the permission of WDAF in Kansas City, even if D tells you do, as WDAF is an O+O station, (hence no waiver necessary). The only network station that you can't get the HD feed therefore would be ABC, (which only gives an HD feed to Cox cable). I was able to get a waiver from KTKA years ago to allow me to get the HD ABC feed from New York via D, but I've heard that recently, waivers are hard to get from them.
Good luck,
Bish

National Geographic showed up on COX channel 623.

National Geographic showed up on COX channel 623.

I noticed this after Lost. Any idea when it came on?

I noticed it about the same time you did.

I don't know anything so I should probably stay quiet, but I'm sensing that National Geographic might not be the only addition between now and summer. I've got no clue as to what it might be though.

Ok, I have a quick question...I'm new here so please be patient with me. :) I have a D TV HD DVR, and I'm in the basement. I have the Silver Sensor antenna, but I'm just not able to get 13 and 27 without moving the antenna from one direction to another. Any suggestions?

Danaconda, approximately where do you live? The Silver Sensor is fairly directional. Perhaps your location would do better with an omnidirectional antenna (the UFO-looking kind). I live in Meriden, so all the stations are approximately the same direction from me, therefore I don't have to move my antenna.

Also, since you're in the basement, you may want the antenna upstairs (and outdoors) for better reception. In that case, you can diplex (combine) your antenna signal with your satellite signal so there's still only one cable to the basement. Of course, if DirecTV ever starts broadcasting anything from its new satellites, then you won't be able to diplex any more (signal frequencies overlap).

Danaconda, approximately where do you live? The Silver Sensor is fairly directional. Perhaps your location would do better with an omnidirectional antenna (the UFO-looking kind). I live in Meriden, so all the stations are approximately the same direction from me, therefore I don't have to move my antenna.

Also, since you're in the basement, you may want the antenna upstairs (and outdoors) for better reception. In that case, you can diplex (combine) your antenna signal with your satellite signal so there's still only one cable to the basement. Of course, if DirecTV ever starts broadcasting anything from its new satellites, then you won't be able to diplex any more (signal frequencies overlap).

Well I'm near 25th and Wanamaker, and I am wary about the diplex thing if they do start broadcasting. A seperate upstairs and outdoors antenna doesn't really work either ( I rent), it was hell getting the dish installed.

Yeah, your problem is that 27 & 11 are 90 degrees off of 13 & 49. You could do a Google on Jointenna (or search AVS), which allows you to combine signals from different antennas. You also could just take a splitter and turn it around to run cables from 2 different antennas (one facing north, the other west) into your one antenna jack. I've never tried that, tho.

This is a great website for Topeka TV reception by Gary Krohe, a TV engineer:
http://www.krohe.com/Top-TV-recpt.htm

Well I'm near 25th and Wanamaker, and I am wary about the diplex thing if they do start broadcasting. A seperate upstairs and outdoors antenna doesn't really work either ( I rent), it was hell getting the dish installed.

I'm close to 37th and Wanamaker and am able to get all of the local OTA digital channels without moving the Silver Sensors I use for that purpose.
Have you tried this: use your 'dish' receiver to map out what position the Silver Sensor has to be in for maximum reception from 13-1. Then do the same with 27-1. Then place the Silver Sensor in an orientation that 'splits the difference' between those two points. Maybe it might work.
Bish

I'm putting together an easier to use list, for noobs like myself. Let me know if I should add anything or if I need to correct something.

When I'm done I'll stick it on my website, along with a PDF.

I'm putting together an easier to use list, for noobs like myself. Let me know if I should add anything or if I need to correct something.

When I'm done I'll stick it on my website, along with a PDF.

Here is an update to your list:

1. Added KTAJ-DT to your list.
2. Updated Network affiliations

============

Kansas City Digital Stations -

Channel Affiliate Digital Station Band

4-WDAF FOX 34 UHF
5-KCTV CBS 24 UHF
9-KMBC ABC 7 VHF
16-KTAJ TBN 21 UHF
19-KCPT PBS 18 UHF
29-KCWE CW 31 UHF
38-KMCI IND 36 UHF
41-KSHB NBC 42 UHF
50-KPXE ION 51 UHF
62-KSMO MNTV 47 UHF

Topeka Digital Stations –

Station Affiliate Digital Station

11-KTWU PBS 23 UHF
13-WIBW CBS 44 UHF
27-KSNT NBC 28 UHF
49 – KTKA ABC 48 UHF




List partially taken from:

http://www.krohe.com

I use the cheapest cable option that Cox offers, maybe a dozen or so channels. I understand from salesman in the local TV shops that you can receive HD programs from the Cox standard cable, without the use of a (rented) set top box. Is this true? And if it is, is a QAM receiver required in your set?

From what I understand you can receive the local HD channels with that option, which in the Topeka market includes KTKA, KTWU, KSNT and WIBW. I have confirmed being able to receive them on the extended basic plan with no digital cable, but I've never attempted it on the basic plan. From what I've been told, it should work just fine. It will require a QAM reciever, either external or built into your TV.

I use the cheapest cable option that Cox offers, maybe a dozen or so channels. I understand from salesman in the local TV shops that you can receive HD programs from the Cox standard cable, without the use of a (rented) set top box. Is this true? And if it is, is a QAM receiver required in your set?

Good day,
I live in Manhattan Kansas - 66503. I currently own a large Winegard antenna with an amliphier. If I could remember the model numbers I would post them. I just know that the antenna was the largest available.

I have the signal from the antenna running into my DirecTV STB. As weel I have the signal running into my computer with a HD card in it.

I recieve CBS no problem (have for years) however all others are hit and miss. I would like help in getting the following channels to come in.
ABC / NBC / FOX / PBS - any information that anyone can offer would be greatly appreciated.

kttealow1,

Where do you live? I live in Miller Ranch, and with my Channel Master 4228 coupled with CM 7777 amp, I get all stations except FOX without any problem. ABC (KTKA) doesn't broadcast HD over the air though. To get FOX, you need the antenna pointing toward Salina, not Topeka. I have another antenna I bought to get FOX, but haven't had a chance to install it.

Since Winegard is a good antenna, I would expect clean signal for all stations. Tell us where you are at, and I am sure many people in this board can help you. I had trouble getting the channels when I moved here, and with the help from other members, now I get all stations OTA.

I use the cheapest cable option that Cox offers, maybe a dozen or so channels. I understand from salesman in the local TV shops that you can receive HD programs from the Cox standard cable, without the use of a (rented) set top box. Is this true? And if it is, is a QAM receiver required in your set?

The HD feeds of the local networks are included free with the basic cable package for which I pay about $12.50/month. You do need a TV/receiver with a QAM tuner as you stated.
Bish

The HD feeds of the local networks are included free with the basic cable package for which I pay about $12.50/month. You do need a TV/receiver with a QAM tuner as you stated.
Bish

If I have a DirecTV HD DVR (an older one) does this suffice, or do I need something else?

If I have a DirecTV HD DVR (an older one) does this suffice, or do I need something else?

I don't think those contain a QAM tuner, only an ATSC (Over the Air) Tuner. It would be pretty ironic for DirecTV to include a QAM tuner in their satellite package.

I'm in Topeka and using a QAM tuner on my Panny HDTV. Sometime in the last couple of weeks, the HD feed for ABC disappeared. Has anyone else encountered this and know why? I used to pick it up on 115-3.

I can't pick up ABC in Kansas City because it is a VHF station. I turned my antenna so it would pick up ABC in Topeka so I could watch Lost in HD. But, as you say, they aren't broadcasting in HD, just digital. What gives?

I'm in Topeka and using a QAM tuner on my Panny HDTV. Sometime in the last couple of weeks, the HD feed for ABC disappeared. Has anyone else encountered this and know why? I used to pick it up on 115-3.

It's still here on my Pioneer's QAM tuner: 115.003
Bish

Can anybody else verify that ABC is still in HD OTA? Most importantly, is Lost being broadcast in HD?

It's still here on my Pioneer's QAM tuner: 115.003
Bish

where in Topeka are you located? I have lost the feed near 17th and Gage, and so has my brother near Lake Shawnee.

Can anybody else verify that ABC is still in HD OTA? Most importantly, is Lost being broadcast in HD?

ABC does not broadcast in HD OTA in Topeka. It is only available on COX cable at this time. KTKA does broadcast in digital but it is only in SD format.

Maybe you can get KMBC out of Kansas City. They are on digital channel 7.1.

where in Topeka are you located? I have lost the feed near 17th and Gage, and so has my brother near Lake Shawnee.

When I checked over the weekend, I had it at 29th and Arrowhead.

ABC does not broadcast in HD OTA in Topeka. It is only available on COX cable at this time. KTKA does broadcast in digital but it is only in SD format.

Maybe you can get KMBC out of Kansas City. They are on digital channel 7.1.


I had ABC HD on 115-3 as recently as a month ago...is thios a recent change?

The do not broadcast over the air in Topeka. If you are getting it on 115-3, then you are getting it on Cox cable.

The do not broadcast over the air in Topeka. If you are getting it on 115-3, then you are getting it on Cox cable.

ABC does broadcast digitally OTA here in Topeka, it's just NOT HD, only 480i. A terrible shame that after all this time they are still not capable/willing to broadcast in HD, (720p).
Bish

The do not broadcast over the air in Topeka. If you are getting it on 115-3, then you are getting it on Cox cable.

yes this is via a QAM tuner...

We now have Showtime on Demand on Cox, but still no sign of TNT.

We now have Showtime on Demand on Cox, but still no sign of TNT.

Are you looking TNT-HD, or TNT on demand? We have Cox here in New Orleans, and if there is such a thing, I hadn't heard of it. They do have Showtime on demand here.

Are you looking TNT-HD, or TNT on demand?

Just crappy old TNT-HD. I was told we'd have it by the end of April but it isn't here yet. Sorry for any confusion.

For those who haven't heard, ABC and ESPN have agreed to an On Demand package with Cox that will be tested in SoCal. It would include commercials that you couldn't skip. No idea when it might hit Kansas - or New Orleans - but I don't think it's even being tested yet so it will probably be a while.

Just crappy old TNT-HD. I was told we'd have it by the end of April but it isn't here yet. Sorry for any confusion.

For those who haven't heard, ABC and ESPN have agreed to an On Demand package with Cox that will be tested in SoCal. It would include commercials that you couldn't skip. No idea when it might hit Kansas - or New Orleans - but I don't think it's even being tested yet so it will probably be a while.

Thanks for the reply Matthew.

I used to live there, back about 1960. I lived at 921 1/2 Topeka blvd. Right across the street from the state office bldg. It was a real old house back then. I have often wondered if it's still there.

Don H.

TNT-HD is now on. It was first reported last night in the Wichita thread and I confirmed it in Topeka this morning. I forget what channel it was but it was in the 613 range.

If Don from New Orleans is still reading this I've been meaning to drive by 921 Topeka to see what's there but was out of town for a few days and haven't had a chance. I think it would be just north of the Fidelity State Bank branch on Topeka but south of the downtown Pizza Hut.

TNT-HD is now on. It was first reported last night in the Wichita thread and I confirmed it in Topeka this morning. I forget what channel it was but it was in the 613 range.

Looks like its on 618. I forgot they stretch everything, and then list it all in the guide as being in HD. Occasionally its a bit hard to tell what they've done to it, but most of the content seems to be pretty obviously stretched.

However, I'm just happy to have more HD content. They've knocked of two of the top ones on my list, TNT-HD and NGC-HD. I'm hoping that they pick up some of the HD channels that DirecTV is talking about having, like the Weather Channel and a news channel. HDNet also wouldn't be bad, but I'm guessing there's a reason they don't carry it yet.

I forgot they stretch everything, and then list it all in the guide as being in HD.

I won't have a chance to comb through all the TNT-HD posts on the HDTV Programming Forum until the weekend so I'll just ask if anybody knows of a cheat sheet that explains what, if anything, is pure and unstretched. The only thing I know of for sure is the NBA and the playoffs are almost over.

I think the new Law and Orders are all true HD.

I won't have a chance to comb through all the TNT-HD posts on the HDTV Programming Forum until the weekend so I'll just ask if anybody knows of a cheat sheet that explains what, if anything, is pure and unstretched. The only thing I know of for sure is the NBA and the playoffs are almost over.

I haven't found a cheat sheet yet, but from what I've read there is disappointingly little HD content available. It sounds like all of the crime dramas are mostly HD (Without a Trace, Law & Order, etc), and quite a bit of other primetime programming seems to be. It seems that many of the movies are in Stretch-o-Vision, even when HD transfers are available and readily shown on Premium HD networks (HBO, Showtime, etc). It gets better and better all the time though, and I'm still glad to have it.

TNT-HD is now on. It was first reported last night in the Wichita thread and I confirmed it in Topeka this morning. I forget what channel it was but it was in the 613 range.

If Don from New Orleans is still reading this I've been meaning to drive by 921 Topeka to see what's there but was out of town for a few days and haven't had a chance. I think it would be just north of the Fidelity State Bank branch on Topeka but south of the downtown Pizza Hut.

Thanks for the response Martthew. I'll keep and eye on this thread to see what's happened to my old "digs". I lived upstairs. The building was owned by an archteict, Carl Ossman. And the rent was $50 a month. But then we're talking about 1960. Things have changed!

Don H.

I apologize to everyone else, but for Don H. your building is still there. It's bordered on the north by the Pizza Hut parking lot. When you lived there I think the Pizza Hut was a grocery store or pharmacy. As a kid in the '70's I remember it having a moving billboard on the roof where slices of bread left the loaf and landed on a plate or something. According to the county appraiser's website, the building was built in 1860. I don't know what it's being used for now. This link should take you to a picture: http://www.co.shawnee.ks.us/images/ap/wpeg/20020813/13153131.JPG

I apologize to everyone else, but for Don H. your building is still there. It's bordered on the north by the Pizza Hut parking lot. When you lived there I think the Pizza Hut was a grocery store or pharmacy. As a kid in the '70's I remember it having a moving billboard on the roof where slices of bread left the loaf and landed on a plate or something. According to the county appraiser's website, the building was built in 1860. I don't know what it's being used for now. This link should take you to a picture: http://www.co.shawnee.ks.us/images/ap/wpeg/20020813/13153131.JPG

MatthewT.

Thanks so much for the picture and the info. I appoligize to the others for hijacking the thread. I had no idea the building was that old. I thought it dated to the 1880's or 90's. It looks very much as it did in 1960. The building to the right had some cute chicks living upstairs, and I think some lawyers had the first floor.
And, your right, that building on the left where the parking lot is, was a Parkview drugstore.

Again, thanks so much for the info and the pix.

Don H.

I talked to the 49 GM a week or so ago, and she indicated that KTKA would be in HD OTA in a month or two. She said she signed the PO herself and it shouldn't be long. She was very excited about it. I told here when they get finished, I will call and congratulate them..

Looking forward to Saturday Night Football in HD from KTKA.

I'm not holding my breath because we've heard these things from KTKA before, but if true, that will be awesome.

I agree, but I am more hopeful this time. I tend to get really excited, then disappointed....

Hi everyone. I just started as an engineer at KTKA about a month ago. I've always been a fan of avsforum, and now maybe I can help out.

I'm trying to keep everything going forward so that we will soon have OTA HD. I will try to keep everyone updated using this thread.

That's about all that I can say right now, but I would like to thank everyone for their (ongoing) patience.

Good to have you here. For those of us that do not have Cox, we have been waiting for ABC in HD for a while. Any estimate on when you might be passing the HD signal? No plans on a subchannel are there?

I have a lot more faith in KTKA-HD OTA now :)

If I have my way, we will have HD OTA in 30-60 days. I know that HD has been "two months away" for about 2 years now, but I'm trying.

We should have 3 other subchannels also. Hopefully those will be on around 3rd Quarter this year.

It's been a slow rebuilding process, but we are always looking forward. If it were up to me I would have HD all across the board (news and other local shows).

We'll see.

What subchannels can we expect? I sure hope there are good enough encoders that it doesn't detract from the main HD channel, especially for sports like college football.

thanks again.

We should have 3 other subchannels also. Hopefully those will be on around 3rd Quarter this year.



Subchannels are a BAD thing. I have yet and never plan to watch KTWU, KSNT or WIBW's sub channels. Most of what they show is garbage and the picture looks like crap as well as degrades the HD picture. I would think that three subchannels would make the HD picture horrible.

Just my opinion!

I would think that three subchannels would make the HD picture horrible.

I think you represent the majority opinion. If there's going to be three subchannels I'd be willing to bet at least one of them will be a shopping channel and that's not worth sacrificing any bandwith.

We should have 3 other subchannels also. Hopefully those will be on around 3rd Quarter this year.


At what point will you bit shape the HD channel? Right now, KTKA has one of the best looking channels on Cox. When you begin broadcasting subchannels OTA, will the Cox HD channel also be of a lower bitrate? I've seen this done both ways in the past. For example, KTWU used to have a great picture on Cox, but now their biteate is down to 11 megabits or so, I think they've even had to downconvert the picture to a different resolution just to keep it together.

I know some in this forum think we're just being picky, but on a large screen (42" and higher) you really can tell a difference when they start reducing the HD channel's original bandwidth.

Since getting HD in the home 3 and 1/2 years ago my viewing habits have changed. With over 200 channels to watch, now including over 30 HD satellite channels, I've gone from watching only local news weather and sports and an occasional sporting event on broadcast OTA to over 1/3 of all my viewing. In those 3 years I've watched less than 30 minutes of KTKA, no hd no watchee. I think that over half of the HD viewers, in this market use OTA for broadcast, and I am looking forward to KTKA in HD.:D

The Wichita Biz Journal reported this morning that SJL Broadcasting has a bid for the purchase of the KSN stations.

Here is the article:
http://wichita.bizjournals.com/wichita/stories/2007/05/28/daily12.html?jst=b_ln_hl

At what point will you bit shape the HD channel? Right now, KTKA has one of the best looking channels on Cox. When you begin broadcasting subchannels OTA, will the Cox HD channel also be of a lower bitrate? I've seen this done both ways in the past. For example, KTWU used to have a great picture on Cox, but now their biteate is down to 11 megabits or so, I think they've even had to downconvert the picture to a different resolution just to keep it together.

I know some in this forum think we're just being picky, but on a large screen (42" and higher) you really can tell a difference when they start reducing the HD channel's original bandwidth.

Brian,
The other network stations are sending a fibre optic feed to Cox, hence their HD station on cable looks pretty damn good, while sometimes the OTA feed can look crappy, (especially KSNT with close-up fast motion. This is a problem due to low bit-rate thanks to their damn sub-channel stealing bandwidth). Hopefully, KTKA's feed to Cox will also be fibre-optic, hence there should be no loss of bandwidth, as the fibre link is sent prior to bandwidth degradation.

Lordmoose,
Three sub-channels is ridiculous, and the quality of your OTA 'HD' will render it un-watchable for those of us who actually enjoy watching real HDTV. What on earth were management thinking? No-one, and I really mean almost NO-ONE, watches the stupid sub-channels that are currently available in the Topeka market; what makes KTKA think for one minute we'll watch your bit-starved dreck?
Bish

My guess for KTKA....

49.1 - 720p ABC-HD
49.2 - 480i ABC News Now
49.3 - 480i The AccuWeather Channel

http://wwwa.accuweather.com/adc2004/pub/products_services/lawc.asp?partner=accuweather&header=m

Brian,
The other network stations are sending a fibre optic feed to Cox, hence their HD station on cable looks pretty damn good, while sometimes the OTA feed can look crappy, (especially KSNT with close-up fast motion. This is a problem due to low bit-rate thanks to their damn sub-channel stealing bandwidth). Hopefully, KTKA's feed to Cox will also be fibre-optic, hence there should be no loss of bandwidth, as the fibre link is sent prior to bandwidth degradation.
Bish

I've actually noticed that KSNT's Cox feed isn't all that great either, its not quite the full signal. Last time I measured it, it was running 14-15 mbit/s, well short of the 19.2 that 1080i usually demands. The only one running completely unshaped at the moment is actually KTKA. WIBW's is also reduced some on Cox. Next time I get the chance, I'll check again to see what the bitrate is on each of them and post what I find.

When WIBW's HD transmitter went down, they also lost the feed to COX. So maybe they don't have fiber connected.

My guess for KTKA....

That's the primary channel and two subs. That would leave one more bandwidth sucking sub. One more guess?

One more suggestion to KTKA when they start OTA HD... I noticed that KSNT doesn't show their full-length movies in HD while Titan TV and other national program guides show them as HD broadcast. I don't know why it's the case... I hope KTKA doesn't downsample the feed for movies. For example, ABC is scheduled to broadcast Minority Report in HD this Saturday, and if it was KSNT, it would be SD OTA in Kansas. I hope KTKA doesn't do the same when it turns on its HD OTA transmission.

Am I asking too much? I hope not... ;)

The 3rd one could be something as simple as a static radar image that is updated every 15 minutes or something. I've seen this done in other cities. It would have to be something that low bit wise to be able to keep a 16:9 720 p channel.

Also...

When KCTV-DT in Kansas City 2 years ago had 5.1 as the main CBS HD channel, and 5.2 had a 2nd CBS NCAA Basketball game on, and they had 5.3 which had a 3rd game on. 5.3 was unwatchable that year. Last March KCTV-DT added multicast channels again, but only had 5.2 and it was much better this year. Hopefully KTKA can see how bad that 3rd channel is when you're broadcasting in HD on the main channel.

Lordmoose:

I know the last few threads probably sound like we're all coming out of the woodwork to bash KTKA, but really I'm happy to hear they will finally be going HD OTA. I know the sub-channels are probably not your choice, but that of management as I work in a similar work environment myself. I wouldn't take it personally, but maybe something you can give management to see how the viewing public feels about sub-channels.

I'll do what I can to keep the HD bitrate high. Most of the quality of the picture depends on the quality of the encoders though. I've seen 6Mbps HD with one encoder look better than 15Mbps SD with a different encoder.

Lordmoose: We appreciate your efforts and your willingness to join this discussion.

tim

Hello all-
Just found this forum while looking for info on Topeka channels. I live on the south side of Topeka about 81st and Fairlawn. I just purchased a new HDTV and am trying to get the local OTA digital channels since neither of the dishes will get local HD channels. I have a small Radioshack outside antenna and I can get 90% signal strength on PBS, ABC, and CBS. I can't get any signal on NBC 27.1. The analog 27 signal comes in ok, but the digital signal reads 0. Any suggestions? Do I just need to step up to a bigger antenna? If I installed a larger antenna in my attic would it still work OK? I don't have many trees or anything down here and the wind blows constantly, I don't know if I could ever keep a big antenna up mounted outside. Thanks in advanced for all the help.

Ty

The Topeka market is setup a little weird. The KTKA-DT and WIBW-DT signals are located west of town, while KTWU-DT and KSNT-DT are located north of town with KTMJ-TV (Not Digital). I'm sure you've checked to see which direction your antenna is pointing already too. The KSNT tower should be almost the same direction as the KTWU tower. KTWU transmits from the tower just north of I-470 and I-70 (behind the WIBW studios) and KSNT is located farther north from there on US-24 highway.

I don't know if KSNT-DT is at full power or not. I'm going to guess yes, but I could never get it to come in myself. I lived about 60 miles northwest of Topeka in Pottawatomie County.

A new antenna in the attic would probably work fine. Make sure you DO NOT break any of the elements off if you do that. I would add the expense of a rotator if possible. Once you lock in the Topeka market, you might swing your antenna around to the north, northeast and try to get some Kansas City stations.

KSNT reaches Manhattan, so the south side shouldn't be a problem. You are searching on channel 28 correct?

Welcome, Ty. May I ask, what IS your '69 Bow Tie? Camaro? Corvette?


the wind blows constantly, I don't know if I could ever keep a big antenna up mounted outside.

Don't we all live in Kansas? ;) I have a ChannelMaster 4228 (grid-shaped antenna) on a telescoping pole fixed at just above my gutter line... fortunately it's on a convex corner, so the house supports it in 2 directions. No problems so far in over a year.

I live on the south side of Topeka about 81st and Fairlawn.

I looked on Google Earth, and the big hill by Washburn Rural M.S. is DIRECTLY in your line of sight for KSNT. There may be multipath going on. You say you can get 27 analog... are there any ghosts in that picture? If so, those can mess up some digital tuners. www.krohe.com/Top-TV-recpt.htm is an excellent local reception site. You might just email Gary Krohe... he'll probably give you some advice.

Welcome, Ty. May I ask, what IS your '69 Bow Tie? Camaro? Corvette?

It's a 1969 Chevelle painted bright metalic purple, you can't miss it! The personalized tag is 69bowty so thats where my user name comes from.

Thanks for all of the suggestions, here is the info I got from antennaweb org

WIBW-13 17.5 miles @ 286°
KTWU-11 10.0 miles @ 350°
KTKA-49 11.9 miles @304°
KSNT-27 12.2 miles @346°

Also found this information on HDTVmagazine com

WIBW-13 193 Kw
KTWU-11 960 Kw
KTKA-49 55 Kw
KSNT-27 16 Kw

With an indoor unamplified tabletop antenna I can get 80-85% signal strenght on 11, 13 and 49. 27 analog comes in but very snowy. I got a small unidirectional outside antenna from RadioShack and set it up on the roof for testing I picked up a couple of % points in signal from 11, 13 and 49 and the analog 27 came in pretty clear but signal still read 0 on channel 27.1. I returned it since I didn't really gain much. Given the station power info I think I'm just going to have to get a larger antenna. Does anyone here local sell antenna other than Radioshack?

Thanks again for the help.

Ty

That wattage info is old. KSNT-DT 27.1 upped their power almost 2 years ago:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=6447090&highlight=ksnt#post6447090

I don't think power is your issue. Question: when you search for signals, does your tuner look automatically, or do you have to type in frequencies yourself? If so, make sure you look on channel 28, as that is where KSNT's digital signal is located.

From what I can determine, your location requires a red coded antenna (special antenna) to pick up 27.1 at your location. This is probably do to interpathing from KTWU, as they're only about 7 degrees apart. I use a Channel Master 7016, a 5'6" 23 element antenna that should work well for this. Living east of Lake Shawnee, I don't have the issues that you folks in Southwest Topeka have, but that antenna is designed for your situation. I've also noticed on some digital tuners 27 is sometimes a difficult find. You may check that their PSOP is set up properly.:D

Hi guys-
Just an update, I bought a Phillips 20 element antenna at Lowes. Just set it out on my deck and ran the coax through the door to the TV to test it. I manually tuned to 27.1 and got nothing, then tried 28.1 and got NBC at about 85% signal strength. After it tuned in, it changed the channel designation to 27.1, so now I have 27.1 and 27.2. Tomorrow I will test it with the antenna in the attic, or I can mount it low on the north side of my roof where it would get some protection from the wind. Thanks for all the suggestions!
Ty

Just so you know (You might already)

KSNT-DT 28 is....

27.1 = NBC-HD
27.2 = The CW Television Network

Did anyone download the torrent file that Andy posted over in the hardware forum for google earth? What it does is give coverage area for the Topeka stations. I am blocked from torrents and was wondering if anyone could help me get that file?

Timmy, I'm downloading it now. When I get it I'll post it to my web server and pm you the link.

Thanks Brian. I have gotten it downloaded and there is some interesting things on there from some of the KC stations and also a St. Joe station.

Thanks again!

Anyone now what is up with KSNT? Last night Leno and this morning The Today Show was not in HD. Are they giving up since only 25% of NBC's prime time programming is in HD?

Maybe they realized that the The CW has better ratings than NBC and will flip to CW-HD? Okay just joking!

We went to watch National Treasure a few weeks back in HD and it was not. Are they automated to flip to HD?

I know they had trouble remembering to switch during the Stanley Cup. The second to last game was not in HD at all and the last game, they did not switch until the beginning of the second period.

I was just thinking back on the sub-channels that KTKA-DT will have. I just remembered KTKA is owned by the World Company, which also owns The Lawrence Journal-World, Sunflower Broadband, and Channel 6 News.

Does anybody think that one of the sub-channels on KTKA would be Channel 6 from Lawrence? I wouldn't mind that sub-channel as they show a lot of KU sports replays and have some other good shows on and I don't live in Lawrence anymore and would love to be able to watch.

Wouldn't suprise me dlnester. Wouldn't bother me either too much if that was the ONLY sub they were going to do. Three subs is just TOO much.

KSNT's problem has been around for a while... I recorded a bunch of movies (including National Treasure recently) that are supposed to be HD on KSNT, and none of them was when I tried to watch them. The problem during the Stanley Cup finals, I believe, was a mistake, but the movies and other HD programs that are not broadcast in HD seem to be a decision by KSNT. I never understood why... Does someone have an explanation?

Regarding KTKA HD broadcast, does anyone know how much power the transmitter will have? I'm in Manhattan, and would like to know if the power is going to be strong enough to reach us in Flint Hills, with stable and reliable signal...

Regarding KTKA HD broadcast, does anyone know how much power the transmitter will have? I'm in Manhattan, and would like to know if the power is going to be strong enough to reach us in Flint Hills, with stable and reliable signal...

I don't think the power will change. I get it pegged at 99% now.

At my parents house 18 miles Northeast of Manhattan on K-13/16 I get WIBW-DT as the strongest, KTKA-DT as the 2nd strongest, and every blue moon when Jupiter and Saturn align just right I get KAAS-DT. I don't think KTKA will be increasing power.

I've never been able to get KSNT-DT or KTWU-DT.

I have received KAKE-DT from Wichita and KETV-DT from Omaha before.