Today I received an update from A-Tech Fabrication with regard to their up coming HTPC case.

No prices yet.

Here's a link with more info...
http://www.atechfabrication.com/products/HTPC_case.htm

That's very impressive. The way it's built it may be the last case anyone needs (as long as the ATX form factor is around, anyway!)

Nice, looks expensive.................

Not only does this case look totally cool, but it will fit on my shelf with room to spare, depth- AND height-wise. The solid construction will help to keep any CPU and video card fan noise inside the case, too. Plus, I think it solves the issue of making the DVD drive look nice by integrating it behind the front faceplate.

As soon as order info is up, I'm in.

- Chris

Man thats beautiful, i might like it better then my Dign case. If I could change only one thing I would make the irman sit in the lcd window so its a cleaner look. Everything else is awesome!

11" depth! I wish these cases would have been available a few months ago. I had to "settle" for a couple of Lian-Lis.

Plus, long PCI cards will fit (e.g. H3D). My compact Lian-Li cases will not accomodate a full-size pci card.

BTW, the guy that created this case, Glen, is a member of the AVS Forum. I can't recall his user name.

Good that they give a tray load option... the slot loaders look cool, but radiate a lot of noise (I have one)... and also they can't handle mini DVDs (3 1/2 inch)... their choice of sound leaves a bit to be desired too, needs 24/192 sound card for the system.

The word 'tank' comes to mind! :D it looks very very nice

ad

If you're interested in this case, you may also want to check out the Matrix Orbital powerbuy (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=176661) thread that just opened.

What fortunate timing!

- Chris

Mane3215,

The IRman can not be placed next to the display without blocking several PCI slots because of the depth of the IRman enclosure. Also, the circuit board of the VFD is wider than the actual display area, so the window cutout would have to be considerably wider.



RSawdey ,

The instructions that come with the Pioneer 106S drive says that it can play 3.5" discs using a adapter (which is not included). I have never tried it since I don't use 3.5" discs for anything right now. There is a utility that you can download to make the drives run much slower which makes them almost silent. I wish you could still buy 1X DVD drives?


Chris,

Yes, the VFD's in the new powerbuy will fit this case.


-Glenn

This does look like a nice case. I notice you were able to squeeze a lot into a small area by using a 200W rackmount power supply.

Question: If I want to use a maxtro maxline disk drive, ati 9700 pro, and a holo3d card, what sort of motherboard/processor/memory can I use. I assume 2GB of DDR 333 with a 3GHZ P4 is out of the question.

Gotcha, maybe if you took the irman apart and had just the snesor there, or had a vfd with the ir receiver built onto it (I think that the one with the dign has this). Either way just ideas, I love the case and will scoop one up if a decent price, and can be had in black.

Keep up the excellent work.

-Chris

work permit,

The case uses a 350watt power supply, more than enough for two HDD's and any size processor. I tested the system with load resistors simulating 8 HDD's with no problems.

I am running a P4 2.26 GHz with RDRAM. With this set up I optimized fan speed at 2350 RPM using a 47ohm inline resistor (stock fan speed is 3200). At that RPM, fan noise barely noticeable. With case cover closed, the case temp is 32deg C with the CPU maxed out using HotCPU test program. With case open, the case temps go up to 40deg C indicating the effectiveness of the cooling system.

The thing to keep in mind is that the more heat you create, the more air you need for cooling. More air equals more noise. So you need to balance the CPU power/noise ratio.

I will be doing a test next with a Asus TUSL2-C running a Celeron 800 and a Celeron 1.2. I will see how much less air is needed in this configuration. This is the setup I have in my old HTPC case. I will basically be reducing the fan speed to maintain a 32deg C case temp.

-Glenn

Glenn,
I was thinking about a config similar to work permit's. How about if I use one of the Enermax power supplies that regulate the fan speed based on temp, and a motherboard/case fans that also change speed based on temperature? I think it's even possible to get a cpu heatsink fan that does this (Zalman?). Wouldn't this solve all the noise/heat problems?
Pete

350watts? Glen, you are a stud. I thought you were using the smallish power supplies that the shuttle uses.

You also mention that your case temp goes up when you remove the cover? Thats a test of a REAL good case design. With my rackmount case, the temp would go down with the cover open. With My coolermaster and Lian-Li case, the temps remain the same.

I want one. Well, at least one

Phoner: Looking at the pics, it doesn't look like an ATX power supply would work.

Pete,

The new Asus MB's can do that with the Q-fan option, but I wish it was a little more configurable. It will control the case fans and the CPU fan. You can also route the power supply fan wire out to the motherboard for controlling the speed. I have done a lot of research on that topic and would like to offer a fan speed controller at a later date, or find one that is already for sale that works well. If anyone knows of some good ones let me know.

-Glenn

Glenn,

Any update on price or availability? Will you be able to include some type of silkscreening or "decals" for logos like Dolby Digital and DTS? Thanks.

Gary

Gary,

I could do logos later, but I did not want to delay the release any longer while trying to work out a logo design that everyone would be happy with (if that is even possible). A clean look can make it easier to fit in with existing components.


All,

Sorry for not getting the ordering information up yet. I have had delays on a current project due to added scope. Once I finish, I can devote 100% of my time to getting these cases built.

-Glenn

Glenn,
I seem to recall several case fans with built-in heat sensors, like these:
http://www.ocsystem.com/coolmas80bal1.html
http://www.coolerstar.com/vanther80cas.html

Unfortunately they all I can find so far after a quick search is 80mm. Can they be shoehorned into your case?

The Zalman CPU heatsinks/fans seem to generate little noise, even for the faster processors.

This leaves the noise from the power supply and the video card. Zalman makes heatsinks for video cards. As to the power supply, I'm sure your 350W is plenty!

So I'm thinking I could put together a pretty quiet HTPC with your case even if I put in a fast processor and videocard. What do you think?

Glenn,

I am also interested in your new case. Looks like a great design.

I agree with you that you should focus on the existing design and manufacturing it first, before making more changes. Given the fit problems that have been reported in the DIGN threads, I hope that you will take extra timeto ensure that whomever builds your panels takes great care to meet the specs and the screw holes line up properly. That is a big challenge once you start a manufacturing operation...

Glenn,

Put me on your mailing list, the clean slot loader front panel is exactly what I've been looking for. Can you provide blue led's for the front panel indicators?

John

Phoner,

The standard type of speed controlled fans could work in the power supply and may become a option. For the case, the fans I am using are very low noise. I have not seen any controlled fans with the temp/rpm range I'm looking for. An adjustable hi/lo controller would be better here.


Rich4av,

That's the problem with stamped and folded cases. My cases are machined to close tolerances.


John,

I plan to have a blue power LED as a option.


-Glenn

Glenn,

Is there a list forming for this case or will you just notify us here when it is available? If there is a list please add me to it.

Gary

Glenn,

I'd like a general idea of the price you're thinking of charging, actually. This seems to be the perfect HTPC case; I'd hate to see that ruined by a USD 500 price tag...

Gary,

I will be taking orders soon. At that time a waiting list may be needed.


I'm trying to keep the price as close to my $250 target as possible. The extra time I am taking now is being spent trying to reduce the cost. Sorry for the delays.


-Glenn

Glenn,

One way for you to reduce cost may be to omit the fans. Many of us case buyers replace the case fans anyway with the ones we prefer. You can always offer fans a la carte along with other options.

Hi Glenn,
What is the approx weight? just the case no fans PSU's etc etc, i need to know how much i'm gonna have to shell out for shipping to the UK.
BTW i notice the little "window" for the IRman will this window be big enough to take my Keyboard infrared receiver (i've stripped the outer cases from both mine & incorporated them in my existing case).
Cheers.
Tim.

Tim,

I will list the weight when I post ordering info.

You can make special requests for custom work. I would need to know dimensions of the receiver.

-Glenn

Hi Glenn,
The receiver PCB has been removed from it's case (as has the irman) the smoked plastic front of the keyboard receiver then being glued into a standard 5-1/4 inch case blank, the irman & keyboard PCB's sit behind this "window"
It's going to be difficult to mount both with the tiny hole already in your case, unless i have another/bigger hole made, & a bracket to mount them.
I should imagine other people are going to want their keyboard receiver & irman inside their machine or is just me ;) how is your keyboard receiver mounted??
Cheers.
Tim.

P.S why do painted cases look sooo bad under flash photography:confused:

The IRman & keyboard receiver PCB's inside the 5-1/4 inch bay

Will your production units come standard with the front USB cutouts (as shown in your CAD model)?

Please put me on your list if you've started one.

This thing is SEXY!

Glenn,

Just my 2 cents, but did you ever consider putting a long piece of fitted colored plexi in that slot in the middle? it would cover the irman hole and the VFD. Would also allow for adding other components behind it like the airboard receiver.

I don't know if it's been asked before, but had you planned on putting a couple of firewire and usb ports on the front somewhere?

I'm really excited about this case. I got in on the Antec retrofit, but I think I'm going to sell it because I'm wanting to go with a larger motherboard than it will take.

If you can, please give us a rough timeframe on availability.

Glenn,
What a nice case!!
I also would like to know when you think the case will be available. It would make a nice X-mas present for me (Of course I would take it earlier as well...)
Any idea on $$ yet?

Thanks!
_____
Axel

Originally posted by Glenn_L

I'm trying to keep the price as close to my $250 target as possible. The extra time I am taking now is being spent trying to reduce the cost. Sorry for the delays.

Glenn,

(these may be applicable to future case versions)

RE: separate IRMAN cutout: I think the fact that it does take away from the appearance of the case remains regardless of the integration considerations. I would consider using a plastic light guide or an optical fiber bundle to direct the IR to / from IRMAN and the faceplate receptor that would then be possible to place in the VFD cutout window.

RE: slot loader for the DVD's. For me who wants to use a specific DVD drive (Pioneer A04 DVD-R) this is a show stopper. I doubt I am the only one to prefer a tray loading solution, with the door or the custom plate / faceplate, or the tray front plate to be attached to the user's standard shaped tray (we know there's super glue ;-).

I see few things wrong with the 5 1/4" drive or two (as well as perhaps 2xUSB + 1xFireWire + 1/4" headphone + 2xRCA, to be connected by the user) being accessible behind a hinged, well dampened door that may also provide an additional acoustical noise barrier.

I am hoping an alternative to the (bulky) IRMAN solution will eventually emerge, such as HTPiC (there's a thread), which would trade a PCI slot for flexible and compact VFD and IR in / out placement, plus custom front buttons, controlled via USB. Then it may be more feasible to provide up to 2 front-accessible 5 1/4" bays (e.g. SoundBlaster Audigy control/connector block, or a 2nd drive (so you e.g. would not have to compromise between your DVD reader and your CD-RW choices but get the most desirable of both).

I would love to see taller case feet, HiFi component style (ideally, with 1 out of 4 being adjustable for maximal stability)

RE: use of AIW9700: Could ventilation holes be cut in the top plate and between the PCI slots (a vertical line of small round or oval openings) to more quickly expunge the hot air generated by this card, emanating from its heat sink / fan, before it heats up other components?

Are there any openings in the bottom plate for the cool air to enter the case? I think providing them behind the motherboard would prove a useful dust trap (some portion of the lifted particles would drop off under the motherboard, rather than making it all the way to the sinks and the fan bearings, destroying efficiency / shortening life / increasing noise).

Alec

My own vote would be to focus on getting your current design done right and out the door. I for one will buy (at least) one and don't care if the price is $250 or $300 or $350. I just want the case to "work".



The $250 target is without power supply i assume?

BTW, IRMAN is the most popular IR receiver, but not the only one out there.

There are smaller receivers such as ir4pc (http://*********-electro.com/) , irben (http://www.ir-ben.de/) , and others that are compatible with girder. If you have trouble finalizing the project because of difficulty with size of IRman, you may want to consider these alternatives.

Another approach to consider would be to use a usb irda (http://www.usbgear.com/usa/usb-irda.cfm) device. To get this to work with girder under windows xp, i think you would need a patch (http://www.btinternet.com/~girder.mirror/IrCommV1011.zip ) to enable infrared support on a com channel.

But as I said, just focus on getting the current design right.

Tim,

I may offer a option for a larger window with a filter. Perhaps you could mount the KB receiver upside down so the sensors are next to each other allowing for a smaller window.

I have been using a USB RF keyboard which IMHO work much better than a IR KB. Since the RF uses a antenna, it must be located outside the case.


KRavEN and monsoon,

I have a module with 2 USB and one FW port. This will be optional.


Alec,

Thanks for the comments.
-optical fiber bundle = $$ for one large enough and too bulky.
-tray load DVD is optional.
-I would like to incorporate HTPiC into this design later as a option.
-Audigy type connector will never happen on this case. Maybe I will make a larger case later, then you can add all the bells and whistles you want.
-Tall feet just make this low profile case look awkward IMO. I'm sure you can replace the feet with whatever you prefer. This case does not need space underneath for cooling.
-Airflow layout is very well thought out, see temps in previous post. GPU temps are dependent on the HS system being used. From what I see, the 9700 uses a fan, so internal air volume will become stirred and mixed in well with the case airflow.


My current project is now finished so I hope to have pricing next week.

-Glenn

Glenn,

One trick I have used in the past to quiet noisy case fans is to wire two identical fans in series across the 12V supply. Or, you can do fun things like wiring a fan across the 7V potential between the 5V and 12V rails. These are just some thoughts which may allow you to get rid of the resistor (which would cut down on power consumption very slightly), and perhaps simplify the wiring. For the fans-in-serial trick, I just brought the wires on either end to a standard single Molex connector, which then powered both fans. They were whisper-quiet.

- Chris

Don't forget to vote ooon hw much you'd be willing to pay for this case
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=181238

I for one am willing to fork over >$250 for this case.

Ordering information will become available either over this weekend or early next week. I just need to create the ordering webpages.

Updates:

1) I am going to offer many different ways to configure this case exactly how you want it. I have had requests for a very plain stripped down front panel (no step-down, no chamfers, no buttons, just a flat panel). So, I am going to offer a option for a blank panel with only the DVD opening (either slot-load or tray-load). From there, everything else will be optional. This way, you can create a case to suits your personal needs.

2) I have decided to eliminate the reset button. With a ON-OFF button, there is no need for a reset. None of my other Theater/Hi-Fi components have reset buttons. If anyone has a reason for a reset button, please let me know.

3) I want to add a option for a volume knob like this: http://www.griffintechnology.com/index.html
I just need to order one and work out the details. This will come after initial ordering information has been posted.

-Glenn

There are times when a reset button is useful. For example, the radeon 9700 pro has problems with some mobo's on a cold boot...they only work with warm boot. I've had machines act flakey like this in the past. Please keep your reset button

Originally posted by Glenn_L
2) I have decided to eliminate the reset button. With a ON-OFF button, there is no need for a reset. None of my other Theater/Hi-Fi components have reset buttons. IMHO, this would be a mistake for an HTPC. Even Macs have reset buttons - as does my Pioneer AV receiver.

I agree. Maybe the reset switch could be moved near the cut out where you have the USB connectors? It could be covered until needed.

Since you can't please everyone, just make the reset button optional. The idea of starting with a base faceplate with the slot/tray cutout, and adding options from there sounds great.

Tom

Are you removing the reset button because of asthetics? Or do you need the frontplate space for something else?

Man, I cannot wait. I am ready to order =]

Nice work Glen.

Will there be an option for airboard module? Or possibly a LED array somewhere and a window so I can reroute the airboard LED's and IR receiver?

Hi Glenn. I've been following this thread since it started, drooling over your very nice case and waiting patiently. Since availability is getting close, I have a couple questions.

1. What is the clearance between the CPU and the disc drive? I am wondering because I'm looking at some exotic heatsinks (like Zalman flowers) and wondering if there is any problem with that fitting.

2. If I follow correctly, it looks like the case does not come standard with a power supply, but that you will make one available. Will any standard ATX power supply fit, or is a particular PSU required?

OK, that's it for now. I can't wait to have the sexiest PC case on the block. (Imagining now the conversation piece it will be at lan parties.)

obezyana

With regards to the reset button --- perhaps you could have one of those pin-hole openings (like on CD-Rom drives) with a button mounted behind the case. This would make it almost invisible, and at the same time make it available should it be needed. Just poke a paperclip or some similar device thru the hole to push the button to reset the machine. Just a thought.

Eagerly waiting the pricing/etc.

The SGI O2's used the pinhole reset concept. Worked great, except for when the machine locks up and you have to go hunting for a paperclip....

I'd vote for a pinhole reset button.

Pinhole reset vote here too. I have to disable any real reset button anyways because of my 2 and 3 year old. :)

I'm curious about the front-buttons that I see on the bezel. I'd -love- to have full dvd transport (play, ff, next chapter, menu) on the front, but would take any. My dream would be to have a mode where the buttons could double as "source" buttons where I could switch from DVD to MP3, send IR codes out a blaster to the receiver --- all from front pannel buttons on the case. Separate buttons for this would be -ideal- too. Talk about having a high WAF!

Have you settled on front pannel buttons The Matrix Orbital I'm looking at allows for 25 keys and I'd love to use as many as possible.

Wow. I can't believe how many different opinions there are on what people want on a faceplate! I would have thought that at least two of us AVS people would have at least wanted the same faceplate.... guess not!

I'm of the crowd that thinks the HTPC should be in a closet, away from everything else, so I guess I agree with Dean Roddery, and perhaps nobody else. :) The HTPC should have a power button, (hidden/pinhole?) reset key for emergency use, DVD tray/slot, and that's it.

Everything is driven from touch pad, ir remote, wireless remote, command kiosk, etc.

Due to VGA wiring lengths, I don't have the HTPC in a seperate room, but if I can manage to sell my <45 day old but > 30 day old bettercables 1m VGA cable, I'd "upgrade" to one long enough to get the HTPC out of my hair.

Poor Glenn. He's going to have one heck of a time pleasing this crowd. I think it'll be a major feat just to ship off the right face plate to the right AVSForum member, let alone actually MAKE the correct faceplate or the case!

Has anyone thought about putting the buttons, LCD/VFD, volume knob, etc. on a seperate panel that can be rack mounted near the HTPC, with cables running to the HTPC?

This would let those of us that wanted a very simple, clean system to get one, while those that wanted more complex features to get a more complex control panel, and perhaps locate it in a better position.

I'm thinking in the context that I want the HTPC out of sight/mind for noise and heat issues, as well as just floor space. But a small panel with the keys, VFD, volume knob in my HT room with the cableing running several feet to the HTPC would be cool.

I know its eating rack space though, and I don't know if others would have the rack space to spare for this to be the way to get these features.

There are lots of things that are nice. Having said that, I think the bare minumum is a power switch, (hidden/pinhole?) reset key for emergency use, DVD tray/slot, space for an ATX motherboard and a hardrive. With just that, I would buy the case. If it had an integrated IRman, I'd buy two.

The other stuff (VFD, DVD shuttle keys, etc) is probably nice as well, and I'd probably add an option. But if it weren't there, I'd still buy the case.

By the way, if you're rackmounting your HTPC and putting it in a closet, then any old 3U (http://www.rackmountpro.com/8productpage.cfm?prodid=1145&u=RM3U3800-P300W) chassis will do, unless you want something less deep.

Ok, the reset button will remain as a option.

There will also be a optional five programmable buttons which interface with the Matrix Orbital keypad input. I just saw the new Girder program has support for this input which will make it very easy to program them to do anything you want.

The input and power button could easily be remote mounted since they are only switch closures.

Wait till you see this order page, it has a LOT of options:)

-Glenn

Originally posted by work permit
By the way, if you're rackmounting your HTPC and putting it in a closet, then any old 3U (http://www.rackmountpro.com/8productpage.cfm?prodid=1145&u=RM3U3800-P300W) chassis will do, unless you want something less deep.

Clearly. I originally got interested in this case design because I wasn't going to rackmount in a closet, but I'm starting to think about it more and more....

Its getting to the point of "do I get a nice pretty case like Glenn's here for $300, or do I get a $300 VGA cable to run the distance between my ugly rackmount and my projector, plus an ugly rackmount case."

For many reasons, I'm starting to lean to the latter.

Make sure you have adequate ventilation in that closet.

I've got my gear in a closet, on custom built shelves. Unfortunately, the closet has no real ventilation (contractor screwed up), so it gets hot (especially since I tend to leave my equipment on). My cable box freezes up at times because it too hot. Worse of all, when I left for vacation over the summer, I had the door closed and air conditioning for the house off. I came home to a couple of fried (ie dead) components.

I'm planning on removing the door to the closet and rack-mounting my equipment on a proper rack in the closet. Since the door will be removed, I do need the equipment to be reasonably quiet and reasonably "presentable".

Its actually my office, so its much larger than a closet. Its got an AC duct, but also two nice big windows. Since I live in upstate NY, winters are nice and chilly, a cracked window can do wonders for cooling this room fast.

In the summer, these windows are often open, and when not, the AC is running pretty hard.

I don't think heat will be an issue.

I just have to figure out how to run the VGA and speakers through the wall.

Glen,
I just noticed this thread and I am very intersted in the case. Are you taking orders now ? Please include me in the list. When will the case be available ?
Thanks,
-Jai

hey, I was here before you!

work permit,

Did you place your order yet? The order form is up.

Just want to let you know that ordering information for "The Heatsink Case" is now posted at http://www.atechfabrication.com/products/HTPC_order_form.htm

The cases are now being built. Since this is the first run on these cases, I can not pin point a delivery time. I expect to start shipping in 4-8 weeks.

You will see in the text on the order form for several options where I indicate that this option or modification can be performed by advanced users, rather than purchasing the item from me. I plan to publish some how-to articles with detailed information and pictures to make it easy for anyone with a soldering iron to perform these tasks and save some money.

-Glenn

The hardest part was figuring out which options I wanted! I finally figured it out, and the order's in.

Actually, the hardest part will be waiting for it to arrive...

- Chris

I'm glad the case is finally available but I must pass. I may be in the minority here but I cannot justify $400 for a HTPC case. I would have easily ordered one if Glenn had made his target price of $250 but $400 is a little too steap. I guess I'll be ordering the DIGN or the new Digitalis when it becomes available.

Do we get to see pictures of the other options any time soon? Particularly the black finish, and the plain faceplate.

obezyana

Wow... probably getting what we pay for, but I'm going to have to hold off until I hear some independant reviews of the case here on the forum or elsewhere. I'd like to see more pics too -- black anodize and some closeups of the DVD transport buttons.

This -is- the case I'm banking on to make my HTPC everything it could be... just not jumping on this quite yet.

So Glenn -- links to 3rd party reviews, when they come in, would be great info.

Just ordered two! If they work, I'm getting a couple more.

This case + holo3d + Radeon + MB/processor/memory = Faroujda NRS

When Immersive comes out with their daughterboard, its equal to a faroujda DCS.

The case is a bargain.

For the USB/Firewire ports option...where's the firewire port? I see the 2 USB ports in the bottom right of the illustration, but the firewire port is somehow eluding me...;)

It's a ton of money, but the design, the size, and the hard anodizing should keep this a workhorse case for a VERY long time to come. When I start to get worried at the amount of money I'm putting into this thing, I just go look at the price tags on the latest Quadscan/etc. scalers, and remember that this will allow me to surf the web and play MP3s too! In light of that, this whole approach really is a bargain.

- Chris

After the first batch of cases have been made, I will have pictures of all the different options. But this will be, as I said, 4-8 weeks down the road. Only thing I can do now is provide 3D renderings. The machine finish will look the same as the prototype case. Black anodize and clear anodize are industry standards. Anodizing actually hides surface imperfections, that is why I am showing you the case in bare aluminum before anodize.

I will be adding the USB/Firewire ports and the DVD buttons to the prototype case before I process the current batch. If anyone wants to change there order at that time (either add the ports, or remove them), it will be ok.

The DVD buttons will look exactly like the reset button in pictures.

I am not trying to compete in price with the other stamped and folded sheetmetal cases with just a machined faceplate. This case is fully machined from thick aluminum plate and TIG welded. The material alone is very expensive. It has features that you will not find on any case.

Thanks for the comments.

-Glenn

Originally posted by Glenn_L
I am not trying to compete in price with the other stamped and folded sheetmetal cases with just a machined faceplate. This case is fully machined from thick aluminum plate and TIG welded. The material alone is very expensive. It has features that you will not find on any case.
-Glenn

Glenn, I just have one question that I haven't seen answered. Forgive me if I overlooked it. What "warranty" are you making on the fit of the case? I don't know what you are using for indexing drill points and such, so are you giving a warranty on proper component fit such as motherboard, expansion cards, etc.?

Originally posted by syberwizard
Glenn, I just have one question that I haven't seen answered. Forgive me if I overlooked it. What "warranty" are you making on the fit of the case? I don't know what you are using for indexing drill points and such, so are you giving a warranty on proper component fit such as motherboard, expansion cards, etc.?

If it's designed to ATX and PCI specs (which I assume it is - it certianly LOOKS well designed!) then there should be no problem with fit whatsoever. Unless of course something being fitted doesn't meet the specs (it's happened before!).

Simple Question

I ordered two cases with the VFD and IRMan options. But how do I connect these devices internally to my motherboard? Most motherboards I know of have external com ports. At most perhaps they have only one external port and one internal com port jumper. So How do I connect these devices internallly?

Do I run the wires outside the case? Do I need a pci card? And if I do, what card has internal jumpers?

Alex,

Glad you brought that up. There is yet another feature that I did not discuss in the text. Next to the fan on the back of case are two small slots. These slots allow you to pass cables for the VFD and IRman to the external connectors. When you remove the fan, you can pass the bulky connectors through, which sometimes won't even fit through a I/O slot. Also I did not want to waste a expansion slot just to pass a couple of cables. I had my cables removed when I took the pictures.

http://www.atechfabrication.com/images/htpc/HTPC_case__015_small.jpg

Regarding fit, I designed the case around the ATX2.1 spec (http://www.formfactors.org/developer/specs/atx/atx2_1.pdf) For processor heatsink clearance see page 17, Figure 7. My case has 3.25" clearance where the minimum is 2.80".

The stock intel heatsink works fine unless you are overvolting the core. I found you can lower the CPU temp about 8deg. C by getting rid of the thermal tape intel uses on their P4's. It uses a thin metal shim which has compound on both sides. The shim seems to act more like a reflector or barrier preventing heat dissipation. Instead get some Artic Silver thermal compound, that stuff works great.

-Glenn

Glenn_L
Is there a way to mill another slot in the front to accommodate a PCMCIA slot adapter. This is becoming the defacto interface and I use it often on my desktops to read Compact Flash cards and Microdrives from my video cameras. here is an example http://www.synchrotech.com/products/card-rw_13.html

Hi Guinn. Thats a nice idea. Is there space in the front to mount that deivice? looks like you would have to move the irman over

Glenn,

Any word on support for the Volume Knob? I'd like to order the case, but want support for mounting the powermate. I intend to use mine to support scrolling through and selecting menu options on the VFD Display, rather than for volume control.

Thanks

Guinn,

Because of the depth, the only place it could fit is where the IRman is now. It would be possible. It could more easily go in the back where the floppy drive option is. There are also external USB versions of the same thing: http://www.synchrotech.com/products/card-rw_04.html


phunge,

I took a closer look at the volume knob specs and found it is really too big to fit anywhere on the deluxe style plate. It could fit on the blank style plate, but I am not currently offering that version with a VFD display. You could program two of the DVD buttons for up-down scrolling?

-Glenn

I took a closer look at the volume knob specs and found it is really too big to fit anywhere on the deluxe style plate. It could fit on the blank style plate, but I am not currently offering that version with a VFD display. You could program two of the DVD buttons for up-down scrolling?
Glenn,
On the deluxe plate, how long is it from the bottom of the recess to the bottom of the case (i.e. area with power, reset etc. buttons) and also from the top of the recess to the top of the case (area with DVD slot)?
On the Powermate specific thread, someone mentioned that taking it apart was a fairly easy job. What I'm thinking would be possible, is to seperate the knob skirt (bottom and blue plastic) from the knob, then mill or cut a hole the diameter of just the knob, place the knob through the front, then reassemble the skirt behind the face plate and affix it to something so it's stable. This would also take care of the USB cable placement problems as well, since it would be behind the faceplate. The knob w/o skirt looks to be only around 1.5-1.6" in diameter instead of the 2.1" w/ skirt. Note that I'm not asking for this as an option or anything, just for the measurement specs so I can hurry up and wait (I'll probably order one of the limited black PowerMates, and "wait and see" what the black anodized A-Tech and some of the options look like once you get the first run out and have some pics of them and the new options). Thanks :D.

I just went ahead and ordered a Griffin Technology volume knob. I will take a look at it next week and see what can be done to get it mounted.

-Glenn

Wow! That is the nicest case I have ever seen. Makes my DIGN look plain.
I want one, but as my main PC! This Case is meant to be seen, not tucked into a theater closet. But Alas..... I have to wait. It's just too steep for my current budget. Hopefully by the time I can afford this, it will be available.

Marc

This was EXACTLY the same line of thinking I had. I think this will be sweet looking and have great functionality. Can have a menu system that won't have to look at the screen for making a few choices that I have planned. Have you gotten your powermate knob yet? Did you order black?

Mike Zemina
mike.zemina@wcom.com


Originally posted by phunge
Glenn,

Any word on support for the Volume Knob? I'd like to order the case, but want support for mounting the powermate. I intend to use mine to support scrolling through and selecting menu options on the VFD Display, rather than for volume control.

Thanks

Glenn_L

When do you expect to have your invoice template setup and send final confirmation of our order details?

This thing is finally starting to move! Too bad the configuration I want will cost nearly $700 (including display, IRman and P/S) before even thinking about motherboard, CPU, Ram, HD, DVD, video, TV Tuner/Capture or anything else. I hope Glenn is still making them by the time I save up enough to get one!

Alex,

Order confirmations went out today.

-Glenn

Can anyone recommend a quiet, clean power supply for this case (2U-shape?) that is around ~450W?

Hi Salsbt.

Here's a 400W supply (http://www.computers4sure.com/Product.asp?ProductID=1080698&iid=342) , but its probably loud.

Unless you're overclocking, you may not need a 450W psu in this case, since you don't have that many drive bays, and you're not driving too many fans.

As point of reference, I have a Soldham pc with a shuttle FS51g motherboard. I'm running a PIV 2.8Ghz processor, AtI radeon 9700, stick of 512MB DDR333 C2 memory, 80gig wd hd, Plextor Plexcombo, case fan, cpu fan...all with a 200W 1U psu. No problems (so far), not even the dreaded radeon cold boot problem

Alex, thanks...that's encouraging!

My inclination to go so high with the wattage is based on two factors:

1) in the reference KBK thread on electrical noise problems (analog video capture/record is very important to me), he recommends 350-450W, and...

2) The machine will have a hipix, Pentium4, MAudio Delta410, XCapture and Radeon 7500ProAgp (with fan, unless I mod it).

However, if 450 is still overdoing it, perhaps the less-noisy built-in 350W that Glenn can provide will be a better choice.

What do you think?

TIA,

Low noise and high power are somewhat mutually exclusive for a power supply. As a modern switching power supply gets hotter, it puts out less power.

The two points you make are valid. I'm planning on trying glenn's power supply. If it proves inadequate, I'll have to start searching.

BTW, I have a delta card in my current HTPC, but for these new machines I was planning on trying the S/PDIF thats built into the motherboard. Yeah, yeah I understand jitter, etc, but I've become less anal about these things over the years

Alex,

I think I'm aiming for two sound devices: one (built-in, no spdif) to receive audio from my cable STB and the other (the Delta) for all output. My reasoning is that the Delta's volume can't be controlled by DScaler as of now... although I might be wrong about that (?).

I'll be using the Delta for digital decoding and analog output, and I don't think I'll get that from an on-mobo sound device!

Anyway, unless anyone else has thoughts to the contrary, I think I'll see if Glenn can revise my order to include the 350W PSU.

Thanks for your input, regards,

Stuart,

I tested that supply while running a simulated 8 HDD's using load resistors. At the same time, I ran benchmarks and torture tests for 24 hours without problems.

All 2U PS I have seen use two high speed 60mm fans (one at each end) to pull hot air out of the case. The fans are intended to cool the entire server case and are very noisy.

Since my case has larger, higher volume, quieter fans for cooling, I do not need to rely on the noisy PS fans to cool the case. My fan mod uses just one fan drawing in cool air at reduced speed using a 80 ohm resistor. This makes the PS almost silent. I have thermal sensors inside the PS when testing. This single fan setup produced the coolest internal PS temps, only 28-30 deg.C. It actually runs hotter when the computer is turned off (35-38 deg.C) This is because the standby circuit is still running.

The PS in the link above does not seem to have a standard 2U screw pattern. Here is a 400watt supply:
http://www.gtweb.net/ps-2u.html

-Glenn

Power supply:
I am now running my power supply fanless. I found the internal PS temps stayed about the same (28-30 deg. C) compared to a single slow running fan. The massive heatsinks inside the PS do a good job of extracting heat. The case fans pull enough air through the power supply without the need for an additional fan inside the PS.

For a very quite setup with my P4 2.26, I am running the two case fans at 2000 RPM with 68 ohm resistors and the the stock Intel CPU HS at 2000 RPM with a 47 ohm resistor. No fans in the power supply.

The case door must remain closed with no power supply fans, since you are relying on the case fans to pull the air in through the PS grill opening. When the cover is opened while PC is running, the PS temps go up quickly to about 48 deg. C.


PowerMate:
I now have a option for mounting a PowerMate. The base flange of the knob must have a flat milled on it to clear the case floor.

-Glenn

This promises to be a great case; I just placed my order.

I know others have commented that the price is high. It is more expensive than other designs but it is well worth it in my opinion. This is a reasonable price for a low volume, machined, and fully customizable case. I've very impressed with the options offered and the overall fit & finish that this case promises. Plus, it can be rack mounted -- thanks Glenn!

I'm glad there is now a PowerMate option. Hopefully more black PowerMates will be available in the future.

Carlton, thanks for the comments. I have now updated the PowerMate option. The new design does not require any modification to the PowerMate knob base, just install your standard knob into the case.

-Glenn

Glenn,

Very nice-looking case - both design and aesthetics. Two questions:

1. Have you done any measurements on noise? Would you please provide dB level of the setup you mentioned two posts above? Does this include a Radeon 9700?

2. Is it possible to extend the faceplate to include the mounting holes to screw it into the side rails on a rack system?

Thanks,

brad

Glenn_L,
Two things 1. will a Holo3D video card fit in the box. 2. You might consider putting you website link in your signature. I will buy one if the card fits. thanks, Shane

Brad,

1. No measurements yet. Noise level is dependent on each particular configuration and what speed the fans are run at.

2. That was the way I wanted to do it at first. To standardize the parts as much as possible, I just have the add-on rack brackets right now. I may consider that option later, but it would require a different face plate entirely.

-Glenn

Shane,

Max PCI card length is 9.5 - 10" with VFD, and 10 - 10.75" without VFD, depending on slot location.

-Glenn

So, does anyone have the dimensions of the H3D card? This a crucial point for me as I am planning to use this card. The Immersive website states that it is a "full size" PCI card. I can't remember that standard dimensions of a full size pci card. Please let it be <10"

Scott

Also, the H3D card has a power connector on its back side (by the CD drive end) which will require additional clearance for the 4-wire power plug. This makes the card require more space, maybe an extra half-inch.

This is really going to bum me out if the H3D doesn't fit. I mean big time. I requested the dimensions at the Immersive forum but I haven't gotten a reply yet. If i don't get an answer I will give them a call tomorrow.

Scott

Thanks Glenn_L and Scott, I'm glad I'm not the only one. I will also call sales @ immersive to see if they would be able to supply the dimensions. I just measured my RAID card which is a FULL 64Bit PCI card. it is 13.5 inches long. Shane

I think we are just under 9.5" long so you should be fine.

This is his reply on the Immersive H3D forums. I went ahead and called him this AM to ask about the HDD power connector. He stated that this does, in fact, add ~ .25 -.50 inches. He thinks we should be fine with 10.5"

My question to Glenn is: If I ordered the VFD option is there still a slot at the very end to fit this card or do I need to amend my order not to include the VFD?

Thanks,
Scott

[QUOTE]Originally posted by nebari
[B]This is his reply on the Immersive H3D forums. I went ahead and called him this AM to ask about the HDD power connector. He stated that this does, in fact, add ~ .25 -.50 inches. He thinks we should be fine with 10.5"

If its a matter of a few cm I have some fan or HDD extension cables with right-angle plugs on them so when plugged in it only sticks out about 1cm. I bought them from CompUS* . I think they were packaged by Belkin. Keep me posted.

Also a word to the wise. Some Mobo manufactures share certain slots with other devices like embedded audio or USB. Just to be sure I would check into that before haphazardly sticking boards in. Just food for thought. Shane

To all who asked.
I just measured my H3d.
From the exterior of the mounting bracket to the end of the card is 9.25"

From exterior of the mounting bracket to end of card with HDD connector installed there is enough space to bend the power wires 90 deg. and be within 10".

Hope this helps you guys out :)

Qyv10,

Thanks for the info. It sounds as though the H3D will fit into the A-Tech case - somehow.

Scott

Originally posted by Qyv10
To all who asked.
I just measured my H3d.
From the exterior of the mounting bracket to the end of the card is 9.25"

From exterior of the mounting bracket to end of card with HDD connector installed there is enough space to bend the power wires 90 deg. and be within 10".

Hope this helps you guys out :)

Is that mearsured to the end of the mounting ear that screws down to the I/O rail? The mounting ear on a typical cards adds almost a 1/2" to the overall length.


These are the internal case dimensions with VFD installed:

9.625 for PCI slots 1,2,3.
9.875 for PCI slot 6.
9.000 for PCI slots 4,5.

PCI slot 1 is nearest the AGP slot.

The difference is because of the com connector and power connector on the VFD. If the power connector on the H3D card is above those, you gain about 3/4" clearance for the wires to bend.

wow, this is close. How high up is the vfd connectors?

Glenn,
My measurements did NOT include the ear.
They were from the exterior face of the connector bracket.

If it helps the power connector is at the top of the card.
I believe the vfd is about in the middle of the case?
Maybe the power connector will clear the top of the vfd.
If not, the 90 deg. connector that someone mentioned earlier should work in all slots but 4 & 5.

I hate to say it but the price and the short depth of the case are the reasons I won't be getting this case.
For me a deep case would be preferred just for the room to work as well as not a concern for my rack.
I made my own rack that is 22" deep 24" wide and can accommodate 18" deep components easily.
It is something like a Salamander but ALOT cheaper. Their equivalent would cost about $800 and mine was ~ $200 and 5 hours of my time.
Uhh, got a bit off topic there :)
Hope this helps out.

Well I'm a little concerned by this, considering that


my Matrix Orbital VFD just arrived today.
I just ordered my Holo3DGraph today.
I ordered the ATech case with lots of trimmings.


Glenn, I would be happy to send you my H3D card if you would like to test-fit it in your case, and perhaps see if any allowances could be made. It sounds like many of us are interested in the outcome.

- Chris

Nice offer, chris.

Holo-3d and this case seem like they're made for each other. I sure hope they are.

Just an idea but if someone is willing, it might be easier to take a couple pictures of the H3D card lying next to a ruler with the measurements clearly visible and send the pictures to Glenn. The other option is to ask Tom for the exact measurement specifications of the card. If that is not sufficient to make a determination, then you could certainly send in your card for a test fit.

Rick,

That is a good idea for a quick check.


Chris,

It would be great if you could send me a card for a more accurate measurement. The VFD connectors align with the bottom 1/3 - 1/2 of the card, so it sounds like there is room for the upper H3D cable connector.


-Glenn

Glenn, H3D is on the way.

I thought of another question. I plan to use this case for quite a long time to come. I was thinking this morning about how I could protect my investment. If the case ends up picking up a couple of nicks and scratches in the course of equipment moves or reinstalls, would you be willing to make replacement panels available to your customers? My Sunfire Cinema Grand amplifier has a nice scratch on the top from my last move, and it bothers me every time I notice it. Given that this case will be actively used and not passively sit there, it'd be nice to know that I'm protected (a bit) from any cosmetic issues that might pop up in the future.

- Chris (anxiously awaiting his case)

Sir Chrispy,

I appreciate you coordinating the H3D card with Glenn. It will be nice to have a definitive answer.

Scott

Chris,

Thanks for sending the card, I just got the tracking number and will let you know when it gets here.

I do plan to continue with development of additional features that could be added or retrofitted to the case in the future (example: PowerMate option was just added). The design of the case allows the faceplate to be easily replaced with a newer version or refinished. If later on you decide you want to add a new feature, you could send me your existing faceplate to be modified or just get a replacement. The top cover could also be removed for repair or replacement. If you wanted to totally overhaul the case, you could strip the anodize, sand out scratches, then re-anodize. This is something you could do yourself locally working with a anodizing shop or you could send it back to me.

-Glenn

Speaking of anodizing, I just got a new customer that does anodizing. They can do about 15 different finishes from nickle to bronze to gold. Silver works for me but if anyone shows any interest I can put you in touch with them. Glenn_L theoretically you could make a new faceplate with a "bubble" or bulge in the front to accommodate the holo3d in the event it is to long. Also I was thinking that this should have a metal tag pop rivited to the side like.
Specially built for Shane White
A-Tech Fabrication 11/02
Serial #25 of 250 limited edition series

Now that would be some serious bragging rights.

Guinn,

I can get all those colors done also, but I don't know if anyone would be interested. I was also considering polishing the cases. Actually polishing and then anodizing black looks really trick, almost like black chrome.

The only issue with fit for the H3D card is when used with a VFD. A simple solution, if there is a problem, is to move the VFD over 1/8" and install the card in slot 6. So for sure it will fit. I don't plan on changing anything until I see the card. The last operation for the face plates are to machine in the custom order options, so moving the VFD will not cause any delays.

Your idea of a name plate is interesting. The only problem with adding any artwork like a logo, is that no one can agree on what looks good. I may be machining a logo on the face plate in the future, but not on this first run. I will however be engraving or stamping a serial number inside the case.

-Glenn

Glenn,

I have also been thinking about a logo or badge. I know it is premature but I am already developing a since of pride concerning this case. I think it would be nice to have the A-tech logo on the face. May I suggest that you make or purchase a simple tasteful plaque with your "logo" with an adhesive backing. You could include this in the package and it would be up to the individual to apply it. That will allow the customer to decide where to apply it or even to decline completely.

As far as the design goes. You pick. I didn't get to chose the logo on any of my other products. Screw 'em, its your case.

Scott

As far as the design goes. You pick. I didn't get to chose the logo on any of my other products. Screw 'em, its your case.

I'm sorry, but that's just dumb.

Glenn

Will a silver-anodized case look silly with the black rack-mount ears?

I already have my powermate, and it's Silver, so I want a silver case, but I need it rack-mounted.

Would it be possible to make aluminum rack-mount ears that could be anodized with the case?

phunge,

Are your rack rails silver or black? The design of the deluxe plate with the side chamfers divides the case from the brackets in appearance. If you are willing to wait for the second batch of cases (expected to ship mid February) I plan to have a one-piece face plate for rack mounting as a new option. If you do not want to wait, you could upgrade a basic case to the newer one-piece rack mount face plate with VFD/PowerMate mounting later. I could probably offer a trade-in.

-Glenn

As for the logo, I will not use any kind of stick-on tag. I think the look and manufacturing quality is enough of a logo to make this case unique.

If I do a logo later, I would CNC the logo into the faceplate.

-Glenn

Thanks Glenn

That sounds great. I think that I will wait, as I need some time to raise the cash anyways. By the time I convert the case to Canadian Dollars, plus shipping and duty, I will be looking at well over $1000

Glenn;

You are offering a REGULAR and a MODIFIED PS on your order page. Could you please clarify the differences? (As you can imagine I prefer a silent operation ;) )

Originally posted by Glenn_L
Power supply:
I am now running my power supply fanless. I found the internal PS temps stayed about the same (28-30 deg. C) compared to a single slow running fan. The massive heatsinks inside the PS do a good job of extracting heat. The case fans pull enough air through the power supply without the need for an additional fan inside the PS.

For a very quite setup with my P4 2.26, I am running the two case fans at 2000 RPM with 68 ohm resistors and the the stock Intel CPU HS at 2000 RPM with a 47 ohm resistor. No fans in the power supply.
-Glenn

What about the current lead time? Back in Oct. you mentioned:
Originally posted by Glenn_L

The cases are now being built. Since this is the first run on these cases, I can not pin point a delivery time. I expect to start shipping in 4-8 weeks.
-Glenn

TIA!

_______

Axel

Glenn;

You are offering a REGULAR and a MODIFIED PS on your order page. Could you please clarify the differences? (As you can imagine I prefer a silent operation ;) )

Originally posted by Glenn_L
Power supply:
I am now running my power supply fanless. I found the internal PS temps stayed about the same (28-30 deg. C) compared to a single slow running fan. The massive heatsinks inside the PS do a good job of extracting heat. The case fans pull enough air through the power supply without the need for an additional fan inside the PS.

For a very quite setup with my P4 2.26, I am running the two case fans at 2000 RPM with 68 ohm resistors and the the stock Intel CPU HS at 2000 RPM with a 47 ohm resistor. No fans in the power supply.
-Glenn

What about the current lead time? Back in Oct. you mentioned:
Originally posted by Glenn_L

The cases are now being built. Since this is the first run on these cases, I can not pin point a delivery time. I expect to start shipping in 4-8 weeks.
-Glenn

TIA!

_______

Axel

The standard power supply has two high speed fans blowing air out. The design intent of the server based PS was to use the fans to cool the entire case, hence the overkill on airflow.

The modified version has the inner fan removed. The outer fan near the back of case is reversed to draw cool air into the case, aiding in the overall airflow through case. A resistor is placed on the fan lead to reduce the RPM for low noise. This is the ideal arrangement since the two case fans handle cooling the case. As I mentioned above, I did extensive thermal monitoring during all tests. Right now, I am using no fans in the PS on my case, the inlet air flow from the case fans is enough to cool the PS.

I am testing a really neat little single fan speed controller right now. If it works good, I will offer it as a upgrade on all fans before I ship the cases.

Since this is the first run, I will not know exactly how long everything is going to take. So far everything is going well. I'm working long days, weekends, and Holidays to get them done. I would like to get them out before Christmas.

-Glenn

Glenn;

Thanks for your feedback.

Do I hear you correctly, that if I placed an order now my changes are high to get one of those beautiful cases for X mas?
Oh, this is so tempting....

______
Axel

The modified version has the inner fan removed. The outer fan near the back of case is reversed to draw cool air into the case, aiding in the overall airflow through case.

Doesn't that mean that the air is heated up by the the psu before entering the case?

I am not an expert but I have some experience with airflow in another industry. Same principles apply.
I personally have never seen a case with this much thought put into airflow and noise.
To me this well thought out solution and a major reason I bought the case, looks great too!

The air flow seems to be designed were the air enters the outer vents of the case and the power supply.

The exhaust is center rear. Closest to the four hottest components, CPU, Hard Drives, Power supply and video card. Awesome! The hottest air never crosses over another hot component or really travels far though the case heating everything else up!

This reduces the need for noisy fans/speed.

It seems we can build a quiet HTPC that doesn't over heat our expensive components.

Hope this helps with your question!

Eddie

After searching and searching, the case being THE component that has prevented me from building an HTPC to this point, I find this wonderful design. Finally, someone is doing this - HURAH! If only I had a machine shop...

Now I'm lining up my options to place an order and and I am curious about a couple of things.

1) The PowerMate knob is mutually exclusive with teh USB/FireWire ports on the bottom corner of the face plate. Is it possible to mount the USB/FireWire ports in the upper part, to the right of the tray door? From the images of the inside of the box, it appears that there is some space there.

2) Is the PowerMate available in anodized black? The key is a black case - it must fit the rest of the stack and I've never been a shiny silver fan and I certainly do not want a silver knob on my otherwise black case.

3) For the PowerMate - will any of the knobs base lighting (which will be inside the case) be visible from the outside, say through the very small space between the front panel and the knob itself (more to those that have put it together and tested it) ?

4) The 5 buttons along the bottom - how can we label them? If they were placed below the VFD (or the VFD moved to where the IR windows is - above the buttons and the IR window to the left where the vfd windows now is), a bottom strip on the VFD could be programmed as button labels. An additional display could be placed above the buttons - 2 vfd's then. Or some sort of machined channel which takes a clear plexi piece that is held in by two screws behind which we can insert a properly printed piece of paper with the labels we deem appropriate - this seems the cheapest solution thats workable. [maybe the 5 buttons above the VFD window? - that would make room for the USB/FireWire and PowerMate to sit side by side? ]

Alex,

Eddie is correct in his assessment of the airflow. I tested it both ways and found the air through the PS is barely heated up. When the fan is set to blow air out, the fan speed must be set higher since the air entering the PS is already hot, also the case fans are working against it. With a more uniform airflow, there is less noise and the fans can run slower for the same given temps.

Glenn

GermanMan,

1. The USB/FW uses a circuit board mounted on stand-offs to the bottom of case. I would have to put a shelf higher up which would interfere with cable routing to DVD and HDD. There is less space than it appears.

2. The black knobs were available, but got sold out. Maybe they will make some more soon.

3. There might be some light seen, but the fit will be close. You can adjust or turn off the light if you want.

4. I did not want labels on the buttons since everyone will want them programmed differently.

Glenn

Originally posted by Axel
Glenn;

Thanks for your feedback.

Do I hear you correctly, that if I placed an order now my changes are high to get one of those beautiful cases for X mas?
Oh, this is so tempting....

______
Axel


Sorry, but your chances would be low, since the first batch is sold out.

Glenn

Got the card today. It fits in PCI slots 1,2,3,5,6 with VFD. COM connector blocks slot 4. Slot 2 would require an angled power plug on H3D to clear the jumper block on VFD. Slots 2,3,5 being directly in front of VFD, would require you to move the faceplate out when installing the card because the BNC connector extends 3/4" out the back of card . Slot 6 is the best location. Since the card almost spans the entire MB, it will make routing cables to VFD and MB connectors (P4T533 has the RAID connectors below VFD) much easier. It also gives you plenty of room for the daughter card (I assume that is what the long header is for) and other connectors on side of card.

Glenn

How problematic is it with routing the cables if you put in an upper shelf to mount the USB/FW card on? If its doable- then I'm all for trying... of course you are the one that has to build it ;)

What about putting the USB/FW port where the buttons are?

What about the notion of a cut-in covered with some plexi, behind which sits each users personal label for the buttons?

If the buttons remain where they are and the display is where it is and there is no mechanism to label the buttons (and I agree, you should not label the buttons - that should be user/owner done) then the keypad buttons are really not a usable option for me. Sure I could probably remember what each of the 5 buttons do - but my wife would kill me as she has enough trouble with the big remote that is labeld! ;) In that case, if I leave out the buttons, what about putting the USB/FW ports where the buttons would normally go along the bottom center?

Attached is the idea I had in mind as a jpg.

I contacted the knob folks and they indicated they would likely make some more black knobs in Q1 of next year - late February at the earliest.

By the way, another question that comes to mind: in the images on the order form, the USB/FW openings appear to be about the size/shape for 2 USB connectors but no FW - or are the two openings such that the 2 USB (or one USB) is accessed via one of the openings and the FireWire through the other?

Griffen Technologies sold all 500 of their Black PowerMates in less than 48 hours. They don't have any solid plans for new black knobs but they are considering another run. If you are interested, let them know. I have. E-mails seemed to be ineffective but phone calls were answered immediately.

Telephone Numbers:
615-399-7000 - voice
615-399-8041 - fax

Mailing Address:
Griffin Technology
1619C Elm Hill Pike
Nashville, TN 37210

Glenn,

On your order form you suggest careful routing and adequate length for the DVD IDE cable given its mounting configuration. I did, in fact, purchase this option.

However, I am curious about the IDE cable for the hard drive. Looking at your pictures you are using a red round cable. More importantly, there doesn't seem to be any excess. Do have any pointers as to specs on this cable? What length would you suggest. Given the size constraints of this case, I assume efficient, organized cabling will be important.

Any other assembly pointers would be great?

Thanks,
Scott

GermanMan,

Cable room is needed for opening and closing the cover.

The MB occupies the space behind the DVD buttons, no room for the depth of the USB/FW board.

I don't really like the look of a Plexiglas label cover. The ideal way would be to CNC some symbols above each button. I don't think everyone can agree on how to label them. Also, you can change to programming of the button for each application, so the possible choices are limitless.

The rendering of the USB/FW opening in not current. At first I was going to have one USB and one FW port as shown. But the board I have now has a double USB jack next to a FW jack. There are still two cut outs, they are smaller and side by side.

Glenn

Carlton,

500? I thought they only made 50? I hope they just make it a standard option in the future.

Glenn

Scott,

The cable I used is 18" long. It is two device with connectors at 12" and 18", ATA 133/100 80 wire (40 pairs), bootless with drain wire. Most of the cables I have seen use large bulky plastic boots, these boots can be cut off easily, they serve no technical purpose.

I will see about ordering some of these and offering it as a option.

Glenn

500 is the quantity I was told over the phone when I called. I thought the quantity sounded high; 50 does sound more reasonable. Regardless, it would be great if more black versions were available. Call Griffin if you agree.

Hm, well, I'm no fan of labeling the buttons via any cnc machined method as that predefines them to a set of functions. The user should be able to somehow lable thier buttons.. but how, if not by a decal or some programmable display?

How are you guys, that have cases with the buttons, labeling them?

On th3e black knobs, I had emailed the folks and they said they have put me on a list to be notified for a new batch of black buttons as soon as they get to it - maybe Feb-Mar 2003 at the earliest. I communicated with Jeff Pack at Griffin.

Glenn, I agree with th edirection you are going (having the buttons as being progamable) and would like to see if at all possible to having the buttons closer to the VFD so the display can show the labels for each of the progammable buttons, like many high end calculators.

Mike

Originally posted by Glenn_L
I don't really like the look of a Plexiglas label cover. The ideal way would be to CNC some symbols above each button. I don't think everyone can agree on how to label them. Also, you can change to programming of the button for each application, so the possible choices are limitless.
Glenn

The buttons will not fit within the width of the VFD. The reset button is already there. There is nothing stopping you from using the VFD to display tags if you want, they just won't line up with the buttons. You would be limited to 3 characters with spaces.

If you really want labels, just design what you want and take the faceplate to a silk screening company and have them apply the lettering. This is probably what I would do later on as a option. Less costly and not permanent as CNCing would be.

Another easier option is to have the lettering made using computer cut vinyl graphics. I have this done for my racecar and is very inexpensive and looks good.

-Glenn

I've started ordering the parts to build my dream HTPC around this beautiful case - Glen, here's hoping that you can get it in time to us for the Holidays?

Since I plan on using the HTPC for gaming as well, I bought an ATI Radeon 9700 Pro, and am looking at cooling / quieting it with the Zalman passive heatsink:

http://www.zalman.co.kr/english/product/zm80-hp.htm

However, looking at the pictures on the ATech web site, it looks like the DVD drive might interfere. According to Zalman's site, the heatsink adds about 15mm thickenss on each side of the AGP slot.

Glen, can you please check your measurements and see if the Zalman heatsink will fit or not? I believe that width around the AGP slot is the only case-related issue created by the heatsink (there are motherboard considerations as well).

Much obliged...

Naval;

Just a heads up. Zalman also released a revised version (ZM80-A-HP) which is AFIK even a bit thicker..

_____
Axel

Clearance to the DVD bracket is .588, 15mm = .591 so it should fit but you would have to try it first.

The big problem is your choice of motherboards that will work using that massive heatsink. Notice how far away they show the CPU in their diagrams, pretty deceiving?? On my Asus P4T533 the clearance to the stock CPU HS is just .401 and the clearance to the extra power connector is 0.000 (it is right against the edge connector). So it would never work on that MB.

I have a new product in the works. It is a large GPU heatsink with horizontal fins which you attach to the video card with spring loaded clips. It uses an air intake duct that occupies the adjacent PCI slot. The cool air in drawn in through the I/O slot passing through the heatsink fins. It keeps the chip very cool. This will work on any case.

-Glenn

Glen,

Does the ram fit under the Irman? I can't tell from the photo's.

The MB I am looking at has the RAM turned 90 degrees from your MB under the area of the Irman.

Eddie

Glen,

Your heatsink sounds great. I think the Zalman will fit on the motherboard that I ordered (forget the exact name, but it's an AOpen on based on the Intel 845GE chipset - I went with AOpen because of their automatic fan control technology), but it'll be a close call. Let us know when you have an expected date for your heatsink - I'd buy.

Thanks,
Naval

Finaly ordered the case.. Cant wait to see it in black!!! Glend do Will i get powerbuy pricing?

Originally posted by fasteddielv
Glen,

Does the ram fit under the Irman? I can't tell from the photo's.

The MB I am looking at has the RAM turned 90 degrees from your MB under the area of the Irman.

Eddie

The RDRAM would fit. There is 1.812" distance from MB top to bottom of IRman shelf. The shelf overhangs the full-sized (9.6 x 12) MB by 1.828". I have not seen many MB's that place the RAM that close to the edge. Send me a link to the MB and I'll take a look.

Just took a look at the ATX spec, max component height for that area is 1.50", the IRman will clear all MB's built within the spec.

-Glenn

I have ordered an ASUS mother board to use in the A-Tech case. It also has the RAM 90 degrees from the mother board illustrated on Glenn's Heat Sink site.

This a look at Glenn's mother board (http://www.atechfabrication.com/images/htpc/HTPC_case__008.jpg)

Here is a picture of the ASUS mother board (http://www.newegg.com/app/Showimage.asp?image=13-131-428-07.jpg/13-131-428-08.jpg/13-131-428-04.jpg/13-131-428-05.jpg/13-131-428-03.jpg/13-131-428-06.jpg)

I agree that the RAM will probably rest below the IRMan shelf. To make sure I installed my Corsair 2700 512MB DDR stick and measured. THe top of the RAM is 1 7/16" or 1.4375" above the surface of the board.

So, at least with the ASUS board, we should be good to go.

Scott

Glen,

So is Santa going to be hauling an A-Tech case down my chimney?

Eddie

Glen

I'm not bugging you at all. But please post here in this thread when you start sending out email that the cases are almost ready and the faceplates are ready to be machined. I don't want to hound you with email, I just get paranoid that you "forgot" me.

Hey, and have a merry christmas. Don't get your wife pissed off at you. I need you around for the next batch as well

Well, I am going to hold off on ordering until I can either get my hands on a black knob or come to some usable resolution on labeling the buttons. As they are positioned now, relative to the display and with no plexi-covered window above to put my own label sheet in, they are of no use. Thus, the only control input is the knob - which I need in black of course. Of course this prevents the use of USB/Firewire. ARGH!

Of all you folks who have ordered the cases, did you order them with buttons and/or knobs? If you got buttons, how are you going to label those buttons?

If you got a knob, do you feel you don't need the FireWire port on an HTPC?

I want to email Glenn practically every day to see where things stand, but I have been forcing myself to hold off. The worst part of this for me is that I have a motherboard, Radeon 9000, Pioneer 106S DVD drive, motherboard and hard drive all ready to go, and no empty ATX cases handy to put the stuff in temporarily! Thus, I can't play with my new toys until this case arrives (with my Holo3DGraph that Glenn also has!).

But then I remember if I keep pestering him, I'll just hold him up from working on the cases... ahh, the irony.

- Chris

Chrispy,

My thoughts exactly. My H3d card arrived 3 days ago and is sitting in a box with the rest of my components. Only a limited amount of enjoyment can be had by reading the manuals greater than 3 times each.

In fact, I think my "signature" is a bit premature

Impatiently patient,
Scott

My H3d card arrived 3 days ago and is sitting in a box with the rest of my components I haven't ordered my equipment yet. I'm waiting to get the case, then I'll get everything else. Everything else can ship in a week or so. But while I wait, processors will get cheaper, maxtor will come out with its 320GB drive, Granite Bay motherboards may become avaialble...

Ya, I got some of the stuff thats not changing, Irman, Matrix Orbital, heat sinks, etc.
But waiting for ship date to order the rest.
I don't know how much a Granite-Bay Mobo or Serial ATA will matter in a HTPC, unless gaming or video rendering. Processors are getting cheaper. Eye balling a P4 2.4 about $ 180,
9700 AIW is down to less than $ 400

So what sound card are you guys getting?

Eddie

I just sent out a detailed status update to everyone that placed a order in the first batch of cases. Since this is the first run, everything is taking a little longer than planned. A lot of tooling needed to be made and I also installed a new milling machine and a new TIG welder. The second run will go a lot easier and faster.


I just picked up a ATI Radeon 9700 pro for testing. I also finally got a chance to try the Holo3D card. I put both into the case last night along with the new fan speed controllers and ran some tests.

I must say, the S-video quality of the H3D is very impressive. The picture looks much better than just connecting the STB directly to my HDTV. It looks far better than the s-video input on my AIW card. This seems to be the ultimate capture card, I have not tried yet, but can capture programs like VirtualDub be used with this card?

Max case temps I reached was 36 deg C with the case fans only running at 2300 RPM with the new electronic speed control (this speed is equal to using 47 ohm resistors). The controllers vary the voltage to the fans from 5-12 volts as the temperature increases. They work very well, nice and linear. I tested with both video stress tests and CPU stress tests to max out the temps. The fans start out at only 1700 RPM, max speed is 3300 RPM, but l only needed to run up to 2300 RPM.

I will post info on the new controller when I get some time. Got to do some Christmas shopping first:)

-Glenn

Glenn, Thanks for the update on the cases. I look forward to receiving my case when it arrives. A slight delay will allow the prices on the other components to come down a bit.

I never replied to the earlier topic of the reset button so this point is being made a bit late. As far as reset button goes, I decided to not get one because every ATX motherboard will power-off if you depress the power switch for 5 seconds. I've never had a PC not power-off using this method. My current non-HTPC case has a recessed reset button that is difficult to press. I've been using the "hold the power button" method for at least 2 years with several different motherboards. I'm more concerned about someone hitting the reset button accidentally than needing to actually use it. But hey, that's just my opinion and that's why Glenn is offering so many options!

Max case temps I reached was 36 deg C
What was ambient temperature?

Originally posted by work permit
What was ambient temperature?

23 deg C. or 73 deg. F.

-Glenn

13 deg rise for case temp sounds like alot. How much power were you consuming?

Glen,

Thanks for the update. Bummer, but good things come to those who wait!

Have a Merry Christmas,

Eddie

Alex,

That is a pretty low temp considering everything that is running in such a compact case, 36 deg is just below body temperature:

P4T533 MB running at 533Mhz bus speed with core voltage at 1.55
256 MB RAMBUS memory
P4 2.26 CPU with stock heatsink and fan
ATI Radeon 9700 Pro
Holo3D card
M-Audio sound card
Network card
VFD display
350 watt power supply
2 hardrives
1 DVD drive

I don'y know how many watts each of these components draw, but you would be hard pressed to draw more power than that. A bigger CPU would add a few more watts.

The power supply temp was 30 deg with 120 ohm resistor with one fan running.

With the fans running at stock speed 3300 RPM, case temp is only 32 deg or 9 deg rise. This is with full load on CPU and video card. If case temp is more important to you than noise, you could put in higher speed case fans and run the power supply fans at stock speed. To me, noise is much more important.

-Glenn

You're right, given the slow fan speed and compact case, those temps are impressive.

My coolermaster midtower case is able to manage about a 7c rise. But it has 2 front fans, a back fan, and a fan on top (in addition to the psu fan). The fans are not loud, but they are noticable. When I disable the two front fans and the top fan, case temp rises about 12c above ambient. Of course, this is a mid tower case...substantiually larger then the atech case.

As a point of comparision, I just checked my Soldham (shuttle form factor) case. After running full load for a few hours, the case temp is 24C higher then ambient temperature. I'll add that the psu on the shuttle sounds like a banshee.

That's a very impressive temperature by itself, Glenn, never mind all the stuff you have crammed into there. Very nice work!

- Chris

Glenn, any update on when we will get final invoices, and when the cases are expected to ship?

- Chris

What has happened since my last update? Well, the holidays have now come and gone and I hope everyone had a good time. I got to spend some time with my family and got a few cool tools for Christmas.

Machining is continuing on the case components. I have also selected my anodizing shop and found them very easy to work with, because of that I have a few new options to announce in a moment. I have submitted many different samples to them to test the anodizing process and the surface finish of the case. I do not care for the machine applied brush finish that I have seen on other cases and faceplate's available, so I will more likely be finishing the cases by hand to get the fine finish I am after. I will have the bulk of the machining completed next week.

New options:
1. The color of the internal brackets will be available in either silver, blue or black. This is for people that want their cases to look good on the inside as well as the outside. You can mix the colors up like silver brackets in a black case or black brackets in a silver case. My personal favorite is blue brackets in a silver case -I think that will look way cool.
2. The color of the push buttons will be available in either silver or black. I had one person request silver buttons in a black case and thought that might be a good option.

The default color will be all parts to match the case color. Anyone reading this can email me their choices otherwise I will send out a email before I do the anodizing to announce the new options. These options are free.

I have also been developing a fan-less heatsink for the ATI Radeon cards. I need to do this development while I still have the 9700 Pro. I found a good heatsink at Alpha (http://www.alphanovatech.com/index.html) (who by the way make very high quality heatsinks) that has a dense fin area and a copper heat spreader. This heatsink will be attached similar to the way Alpha's new P4 heatsink is attached. I hope to have these fan-less video card heatsinks available shortly after the first batch of cases ship.

Speaking of P4 heatsinks, so far the best P4 heatsink is the stock retail HSF made by Intel. This HSF uses a unique stepped fan housing that allows for more airflow at a given RPM. One mod that is required is to remove the thermal tape from the HS and use Arctic Silver 3 (http://www.arcticsilver.com/as3.htm). This will lower your CPU temps about 7 deg. C. The stock thermal tape has a metal shim with a thermal pad on each side, this shim I believe acts as a heat reflector decreasing its efficiency.

I just got in Alpha's new P4 HS, the PAL8942. I will be testing this HS with different fans to see if I can get it to perform better than the Intel HSF.

-Glenn

Thanks for the update Glenn

This may help you in your silent HSF search. Its a rare HSF review that focuses on noise as well as performance
http://www.silentpcreview.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=Sections&file=index&req=viewarticle&artid=57&page=1

Thanks for the link Alex. The OCZ P4 Eliminator Passive looks interesting, I'll have to order one of those. It says it can run fan-less, but with the low profile design, there should be room for a large slow turning fan to use on hot chips. I did test the Zalman flower, it fit into the case, but ran too hot without a fan. The included huge 92mm fan could never fit into this case with the already huge flower heatsink.

-Glenn

The Thermalright AX478 performed better, you may want to try it instead (assuming you think it would fit).

Glenn,

Can you post some pictures of the annodized samples that you've got? It would make it a lot easier to choose colors if we know what our options actually look like ;)

-Dave

Glen,

Thanks for the update. I know it has been mentioned before, and I really don't want to belabor the point, but I am still interested in the prospect of brushed aluminum feet for the case. Any further thoughts or developments?

Thanks,
Scott

Well seems I made my first mistake on component purchases. I have the Zalman FLower sitting in my office waiting for the case. So Glen you say it won't work, bummer. I was wondering if it would fit just looking at it in the package. It's very tall.

Glen, Can you tell us the clearance's between your processor and the top of the case.

Thanks Eddie

Eddie,

Don't feel so bad. You're not alone. My Zalman 6500b AlCu is supposed to be delivered Monday. Oh well. Yet, this is not my first purchasing mistake. I bought the brushed Aluminum feet kit from CRTcinemas.com. The kit ended up being four stickers with no feet at all. It was only 12 bucks but still what a rip off.:(

Scott

I will post some pictures of the anodized colors. I don't have anything anodized blue yet, but it is just the standard blue used on AN fittings.

The Zalman Flower HS does fit into the case if you intend to run it fanless. It is only the included fan that does not fit. I think it may work fanless up to about 2GHz. Beyond that you should look into a better heatsink. You could custom mount a smaller fan, but the huge 92mm fan that comes with the Zalman will not fit. The stock Intel P4 fan/heatsink works just fine. You only need a better heatsink if you want to run fanless. Distance from top of MB to bottom of DVD is 2.94-3.0" (74.7-76.2mm) depending on drive position.

The rubber feet that I use are very low profile and are located away from the edge of case. This gives the case some compliancy for irregular surfaces and also offers some vibration isolation to the entire case. You have to use a flashlight to look under the case just to see them. Maybe later I will offer some other feet that you can swap out if there is enough demand.

-Glenn

Originally posted by Glenn_L
Thanks for the link Alex. The OCZ P4 Eliminator Passive looks interesting, I'll have to order one of those. It says it can run fan-less, but with the low profile design, there should be room for a large slow turning fan to use on hot chips. I did test the Zalman flower, it fit into the case, but ran too hot without a fan. The included huge 92mm fan could never fit into this case with the already huge flower heatsink.

-Glenn

I have tested the OCZ P4 Eliminator, and found that it doesn't really meet its claim of letting you run fanless. Even with a relatively slow/cool 1.6Ghz P4 in a cool room, the cpu temperature quickly rose to 60C (and climbing). At that point I dropped a fan on it.

It is still a pretty good heatsink for use with a fan. Especially if you need something that is fairly low profile.

--Jeff

Would a Swiftech MCX4000-B work for a FANLESS set up with e.g. P4 1.6-A?


Thanks!
_________
Axel

Originally posted by Glenn_L

The Zalman Flower HS does fit into the case if you intend to run it fanless. It is only the included fan that does not fit. I think it may work fanless up to about 2GHz. Beyond that you should look into a better heatsink.

Glenn, could you please specify exactly which model you tried, as there a whole bunch out there: Cu vs. AlCu; CNPS6500 vs. "smaller" models.

Thanks!!
_________
Axel

The Zalman I tested was the CNPS 6500B-AlCu.

I doubt that either the Alpha 8942 or the Swiftech MXC4000-B would work well without a fan. However the more efficient the design the less airflow that is needed. Both these heatsinks should work well with a slow (practically noiseless) fan. The main advantage of both these HS's is that they can draw in air from all around the entire HS. A finned HS can only draw air from two sides.

I have now tested the 8942. At first I tried it with a 70mm x 15mm fan blowing down on the heatsink like Intel's HSF. In this configuration the CPU ran at 56 deg. C. This was much worse than the Intel HSF so I decided to follow the directions and install the fan blowing upwards away from the HS. In this configuration the CPU temps dropped to 44 deg. C and the case temp only 32 deg. C. All tests were done at full CPU load using Hot CPU Tester Pro with ambient air at 22-23 deg. C. I did not have the ATI 9700 Pro installed at the time so I can't really compare the numbers with my last test.

The fan up configuration works extremely well in this case. My theory is that with the fan blowing down, like in the Intel HSF, the CPU fan and the case fans are working against each other fighting for the same air to pull in. This could lead to cavitation and a reduction in airflow. With the CPU fan pointing up, the CPU fan is actually feeding the case fans with hot air to be expelled from the case. The cool air, down low in the case, is being drawn into the CPU HS keeping the CPU supplied with a constant source of cool air. It also helps promote linear airflow throughout the case. With the case fans mounted high in the rear of case, the hot air coming out of the CPU HSF is being expelled immediately keeping the case temps much lower. I am really excited about this new breakthrough in airflow for this case.

This first test was done with a 70x70x15mm fan running at 3300RPM. I ran a second test with a resistor that brought the speed down to 2000 RPM and the CPU ran at 48C with the case still at 32C. Case fans were being controlled by the new fan controller and ran about 1900 RPM.

I have ordered a Sanyo Denki 109P0812M701 80x80x15mm fan, 2000 RPM with sleeve bearings. I got the parts directly from Alpha. I think this fan will move even more air at lower RPM's. You can buy the whole combo here http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/alpalretbox.html

I will do some more tests with the Radeon 9700 installed after I get the new fan.

-Glenn

Glenn

Have you any pictures of a completed anodized ( Black) case with the "5 Facia Button" configuration you could post?

Paul.

Paul,

I should have some color samples posted tonight. Once the cases from the first batch are completed I will have many more pictures of the options. Right now only the computer rendering. The button for the DVD controls is the same as the reset button.

-Glenn

Originally posted by Glenn_L
Paul,

I should have some color samples posted tonight. Once the cases from the first batch are completed I will have many more pictures of the options. Right now only the computer rendering. The button for the DVD controls is the same as the reset button.

-Glenn

looking forward to the Pictures...:)

Anyone have a heatsink recommendation for a > 2GHz Athlon? I was going to go with the Zalman CNPS6500A-Cu (http://www.zalman.co.kr/english/product/cnps6500A-Cu.htm)...

Anyone have a heatsink recommendation for a > 2GHz Athlon?

I use a Thermalright AX-7 with a Panaflo 80mm fan(rated at 21db @ 23cfm @12v) but I have it running @ 5V (approx 750 rpm) almost dead silent, my 2400+ (2 gig Athlon) runs no hotter then 57C, most of the time it runs around 53C, no stability issues because of heat.

Jim

Curious, what exactly do you guys use the vfd for? Im looking at getting a case and trying to figure out all the options.

FYI: Glen posted a picture of the black anodization side by side with the clear anodization.

CV63:
Since none of us have our Atech case yet, we cant say what we are using the VFD/LCD for in this particular instance. Myself; this will be my first HTPC but from what I have read you can use this display for many different things. The people who have purchased the DIGN or the Digitalis cases post that they display various system info i.e CPU temp, fan speed, CPU usage. Others have programed it to display media info via winamp etc like artist/album/title or DVD title. Or you can display banner info. Sure it is an asethic luxury but it is a nice touch for those who are trying to visibly incorporate thier HTPC into thier audio rack. However, the Atech case has gone a step further by taking advantage of the push button programing capabilities of these displays. I don't know of another case that has tried this. It is through the display that the "DVD" buttons will work.

You can read more about the Matrix Orbital Displays here (http://www.matrixorbital.com/) .

vfrjim:
I, like coppit, was planning to use the Zalman 6500b-AlCu. Do you think the Thermalright AX-7 with Panaflo fan will fit in the 3" space between the MOBO and DVD rack?

Patiently,
Scott

Where is that picture posted? I don't see it on the site linked from the first page of this thread.

Recommended fan heatsinks:

For P4:
Intel retail HSF
Alpha PAL8942
http://www.alphanovatech.com/cat_pfe.html
Swiftech MCX4000
http://www.swiftnets.com/products/mcx4000.asp
Fan - Sanyo Denki 80x15mm, 2000rpm, sleeve bearing


For Athlon:
Alpha PAL8045
http://www.alphanovatech.com/cat_pfe.html
Swiftech MCX462+
http://www.swiftnets.com/products/mcx462plus.asp
Fan - 80x15mm, you can try the Sanyo but I'm not sure if 2000rpm will be enough to cool a Athlon

Note- all these heatsinks are about the same height, a 80x15mm fan is the largest than can fit and still have good airflow. 80x25mm fans will not have enough space. Fan should be mounted with airflow upward, as I detailed in a earlier post, this configuration runs the coolest allowing for slower speed fan settings.

Glenn

the Thermalright website lists the AX-7 as 80mm x 80mm x 38mm
the 80mm Panaflo is 80 x 80 x 25mm

So if the fan rests on the heatsink the height would be ~ 63 mm = 2.49 inches, which would fit. However, if one was to employ the air thrust upwards technique, then this hot air would bathe the bottom of the DVD shelf. Since the DVD shelf is, itself aluminum, then I worry about the thermal detriment of the DVD drive. Is this concern unfounded....comments?

The Swiftech MXC4000 (http://www.swiftnets.com/) , which was rated higher than the Thermalright at SilentPC Review (http://www.silentpcreview.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=Sections&file=index&req=viewarticle&artid=30&page=1), is also 39 mm tall and can be fitted with any 70 mm or 80 mm fan.

Just food for thought.

Scott

I now have pictures and info for a fanless heatsink for ATI Radeon cards:
Mass-Air Heatsink System (http://www.atechfabrication.com/products/mass_air_heatsink_system.htm)

and the new Fan Speed Controller (http://www.atechfabrication.com/products/fan_speed_controller.htm)

The picture of the anodizing samples is on the order form where color is selected.

-Glenn

Glen,

Sorry, I posted about a minute behind you. So, disregard the 25mm Panaflo fitting - as Glen states that it will not fit.

Cord:
Look at the HTPC order form page

Scott

I see that I am still about 1 minute behind...story of my life:D

Scott

I am using the AX-7 in my Digitalis Vision 2 with no issues, not sure how the A-Tech would trap heat near the HSF of the CPU, but as long as there is an exhaust fan near the CPU, you should not have a problem.

Jim

Glenn,

Just to clarify: motherboard fan control (e.g. on a Asus A7N8X) is just for the CPU, while your fan controller is also for case fans?

Also, a number of people have complained about the price of your cases, but I believe these are folks who would rather tweak and curse than buy something that just works. "I can't afford to buy cheap." ;)

You've obviously worked hard on choosing the right components for your system. Have you thought about eventually selling complete systems based on your HTPC experience? While I don't mind using your helpful posts here to plan my machine, I know there will be a bit of hassle and a nontrivial chance of mistakes on my part...

Keep up the great work,
coppit

I bet once we start posting beautiful pictures of our anodized cases with our nifty VFD displays and a variety of front port/button configurations, people will realize that it's a worthwhile investment in a room where they've already spent far more than this.

- Chris

I'm more than willing to pay the price, as it should be the 'last HTPC case I will ever buy' .... iff I can get the button/control/io system the way I like it. The hang-up now is a combo of me not being 100% certain what I want and not being able to get the configuration I really envision.

Yikes guys! 11 pages of comments! Why don't we let Glenn finish the first batch of cases before we launch him into the turnkey HTPC business ;)

I for one am trying to patiently wait for my case to arrive, Glenn, do you have an update time line for when you can ship the first ones out?

-Dave

I received they Alpha PAL8942 Heat Sink with Sanyo 80 x 15mm. Looks like it will do the job nicely. Sidewinder had it at the door in three days! The parts pile is every increasing.

Eddie :cool:

New hi-tech fan. Has anyone been able to try the KDE Fan Series in Sunon's fan? The technologies sound very hi-tech: vapo-bearing and magnetic-field impeller. I've read that there is no impeller vibration or sway when rotating at any angle with KDE fans. Is this true? They come in seven models with sizes of 40x40x10-20 mm and 50 x 50 x 10 mm. This fan operates at up to 8200 RPMs, with air delivery of 8.1 CFMs and at a static pressure of 0.19 (inch-H20).

Is this part of the answer to a silent HTPC?

Mike Zemina

I should start shipping in about 2-3 weeks. I will be doing the remaining work in smaller groups of cases and follow them through to shipping. They will be done in order based on date order was placed. I still have welding fixtures to build and I need to work out final surface finishing before anodizing. There is also some final machining to do after welding. Also smaller issues like shipping container and packaging need to be worked out. So there are still some unknowns that have a potential for delays. I am working 14 hour days, 7 days a week until they are finished. Most of my time is spent in manufacturing development, like building tools, fixtures, and working out the best approach to each operation. I am sorry for the delays the people in the first run are facing, but future runs will progress much quicker.

First order to go out?
Chris has the honor of case number one since his was the first order placed. He also provided me with a Holo3D card to test fit into the case. I want to take some pictures of the production case fitted with this card.

Holo3D card:
I do have some more information about the H3D card. Some of you may not know, but the card by itself requires a spare PCI slot in front of the card due to its over-sized component input connector plate. It states this on the install CD instructions. It will overhang the I/O bracket of the card next to it. This is OK for cards with a flat bracket, but a lot of cards have flanges on the I/O bracket that will interfere. The instructions recommend the bottom PCI slot (slot 6). I have also determined this the best position for the card, so I machined some extra clearance in the slot to ensure plenty room for the connectors. Not sure if grounding the outer sleeve of the RCA plug is a issue, but it would touch the case slot on other standard cases I mounted it in unless you push the card to one side when tightening the screw.

VFD and LCD displays:
Thanks to Henry at Matrix Orbital for sending out some displays to try out in the case.
This case will accept:
all VK204-25 4x20 VFD's
all LK204-25 4x20 LCD's
these models also have the 25 key input for use with the DVD control push buttons.

-Glenn

Mike,

Those new fans look interesting, however even the largest one is too small for use on a case or CPU. The 60x60x20 or 60x60x15 would work in the 2U power supply.
http://www.sunonusa.com/ms.htm

-Glenn

Glenn, you once said something about emailing people with some final options before assembly begins. Is that ready to happen soon? One of the things I have been thinking over is how to compensate for the black anodized case I would like and my inability to find a black PowerMate. The more I think about it, the more I think that if all of the buttons were silver anodized as well, it wouldn't look half bad at all. Will that be a possibility, or is it too late?

Color options:
I plan to send out those emails in the next couple days.

Powermate:
I may have a solution to the knob color problem. The only part that is visible from outside the case is the knob itself. This knob just pulls right off and has a plastic insert inside. I can probably have the knobs stripped and anodized in black. I will talk to the anodizer and see what they can do.

-Glenn

Sounds good. The more I think about it, the silver buttons seem attractive in a black case. Its high contrast, which is good for finding them. Once I get the case, I may see what it takes to backlight the buttons with blue LEDs to have them match the Powermate surround. Just got some sample blue surface mount LEDs at work that could do wonders in that arena. Drill a small hole in the center of each button, and epoxy the LED in the center, and I think it would make a nice effect. It all depends on how the button is constructed, of course.

Just posted some testing results for this case and the Mass-Air heatsink system.

Test results here (http://www.atechfabrication.com/tests/testing_mass_air.htm)

-Glenn

Glenn

Any update on matching the color on the powermate. I decided not to get the powermate cutout in my cases, but if you could match the color on the powermate I'd want to get the cutout

Wow. That's a great case.

Despite that, though, it's not entirely perfect for me, and in part because of that I can't justify the cost (though I suspect even if it were exactly what I wanted, I'd balk at the cost -- I don't spend money on Faroudja scalers either, after all)

While I was reading this thread, I couldn't help but get some ideas. I hope you don't mind me airing them.

I've been trying to find an aesthetically pleasing case with two 5.25" bays, for a separate dvd and a cdrw, or possibly dvd and dvd-rw, or even dvd and dvd if you just want a multidisc machine. So what I was thinking was, if you add an extra U of height, you can fit those two devices to the two sides, put an lcd/vfd panel in between them to balance the front out, and even have room for one or two HD's behind that. That in turn would allow you to move the HDs above the power supply away, and allow you to use a regular powersupply, and would also free up a lot of fascia room so more options can be stashed in various places.

All things considered, especially with the cost of shipping to the Netherlands, I suspect I probably won't be buying this case, even if a perfect version came out for me -- I just can't manage to get that sort of cash together for what is after all mainly looks. I'd rather fly to the US to visit some of my friends with that money.

Jasper, just a couple of comments on why this case is right for me:

1. Size - if you look at the dimensions, no other case comes close. Equipment space is a premium in my equipment enclosure, and the very short depth of the case allows plenty of room for easy cable management in the back of the PC. In short, I bought this case because it was so small and well-designed.

2. Noise - the thermal design of the case allows it to be incredibly quiet. With careful CPU selection and some underclocking, you can put together a fanless machine.

3. I am going after the audio component look, not the PC look. I have no desire for CD/DVD burning tasks in the theater, although I respect that you are looking for something like that.

You may want to look at the DIGN. I was turned off by its size, unnecessary extra drive bays that I wouldn't use, and looks, but its extras sound like they're targeted to what you're looking for.

- Chris

Maybe later I will add a larger case to the line for those people who want the Home Theater Computer to also function as a server. My goal with this case was to make it as small as possible without limiting component selection.

For CD burning, I simply transfer files I want to burn over the network to my server where the burner is located. My server has up to six HDD's running and three CDROM drives and a tape backup.

I do have a new case in the works -Mass-Storage. It will be a 1U (1.75") high case built the same as the current case. It will be used for data storage and hold up to four ATA serial HDD's. No fans will be used since the heat will be dissipated into the case. There will be connectors on the back for interfacing with the HTPC. The low voltage power will come from the power supply located in the HTPC. It would be a good way to add mass storage to any existing system. A serial ATA card can be added to systems without the serial device built into the motherboard.

-Glenn

Alex,

I will be going to the anodizing shop next week. I am sure they can do it, the only issue will be cost. They have a minimum charge for each operation or color, so the stripping operation may demand a minimum charge. Maybe if I can do several knobs at once, the cost can be spread out.

-Glenn

I do have a new case in the works -Mass-Storage. It will be a 1U (1.75") high case built the same as the current case. It will be used for data storage and hold up to four ATA serial HDD's. No fans will be used since the heat will be dissipated into the case. There will be connectors on the back for interfacing with the HTPC. The low voltage power will come from the power supply located in the HTPC. It would be a good way to add mass storage to any existing system. A serial ATA card can be added to systems without the serial device built into the motherboard.

Just when I figured I couldn't make this work for HTPC/HDPVR you solved the storage issue.

Is there any way to add rear outputs for all those FW/USB/Serial connectors on motherboards?
or
Is there a way to safely remove stuff like the PS2 connectors and game controllers on the MB to free up space on the back?

I need the PCI slots and it seems I can't find a MB with Gigabit Ethernet, FW, USB2 directly on the panel.

Excuse my ignorance relating to Serial ATA, but...

How many motherboard (or PCI Card) connections would be required for 4 serial ATA drives? Can you daisy chain them like SCSI devices? I thought I remembered reading somewhere that each ATA drive needed its own connection.

Brian

Yes, each S-ATA drive will require its own connection. Luckily, S-ATA is designed with both hotswap and long cable lengths in mind, and it shouldn't be too hard, if you can get the connectors, to have both the case and the mass storage just have standard S-ATA connector so you just plug in a lot of very short standard S-ATA cables (though Glenn may have a different idea in mind). One motherboard manufacturer (Gigabyte, I think) even has a motherboard that comes with a front connector for external S-ATA.

Unfortunately, S-ATA is not exactly taking off like a rocketship, and there is to date as far as I am aware only one model of native S-ATA drive around -- a 40 gigger, IIRC, so not particularly useful.

Most manufacturers seem to be waiting a bit (like mid 2004, so don't hold your breath) for S-ATA2 (at 300 megs per second), which will not only deliver significant performance gains compared to ATA133 and S-ATA 150, which this standard doesn't, but supposedly will also allow daisychaining, which is a big thing, of course. Maybe they're just waiting till there is a decent installed base of motherboards with S-ATA around -- it took quite a while for a decent array of USB devices to hit the market after the motherboard support was already there for a while.

Perhaps if you can find an affordable source for S-ATA<>ATA converters so you can use regular ATA discs inside the storage case, that might be a good idea, to at least offer alongside for people buying the case before S-ATA drives are well-established. Some of these converters, amazingly enough, are not directionally specific (if anyone can check if I'm correct about that..): you can use the Soyo ones to turn ATA drives into S-ATA drives, but also to make an ATA motherboard (or other) connection into an S-ATA connection. If you get for example one of the newer motherboards just now coming out for P4 based on Intel 845 PE/GE, which often have 2 times parallel ATA from the chipset, 2 times parallel ATA raid separate chip, and another 2 S-ATA on another raid chip, you could use the on-chipset ata for dvd and the onboard hard drive(s), and then put the 4 connectors on the two raidchips into the mass storage S-ATA case, for the ATA raid chip via 2 of those converters and the S-ATA directly. It might be cheaper to disable any onboard non-serial raid and just buy a PCI card, though.

Using those converters might be a bit more expensive than, say, running a long rounded ATA cable around, but it should give a more reliable connection (as S-ATA is much better suited to long cable lengths), and will also give you the luxury of hotswapping the storage cabinet out of the way.

Looking around the net a bit, you can probably find those converters for $30 each or possibly less in quantity:


Soyo's:
-----
$30 http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?sku=S450-5050
$30 http://www.discount-crazy.com/t/Computer-Hardware/Computer-Systems-Components/Motherboards/Soyo-Serial-ATA-Upgrade-Kit-EID-S450-5050.shtml
$30 http://www.discount-motherboards.com/Soyo-Tek/Soyo-Serial-ATA-Upgrade-Kit-EID-S450-5050.shtml
$30 http://www.discount-motherboards.com/Soyo-Tek/Soyo-Serial-ATA-Upgrade-Kit-EID-S450-5050.shtml
----

$25, but only to connect ATA harddrives onto S-ATA cable, but smaller than the soyo: http://www.xpcgear.com/idehardrivto.html

----

Another option to get lots of S-ATA connectors: http://www.3ware.com/products/serial_ata.asp

Joseph,

There are three cable slots next to one of the fans (prototype has two - see pictures) to route external cables. These are mainly intended for VFD, Irman, and PowerMate interface, but could be used for any cable.


S-ATA:

Thanks for the info Jasper. Yes, it will take a little while before more hardware is readily available, but it looks like a good direction to take for the future. A good source for bulk cable adapters would be a good way to start. I'm not sure if the data cables will like having the extra connectors required for a panel mount interface, so the cable may have to make a home-run from controller to HDD. That can make connecting the cable difficult in a rack installation since the case will have to be opened. A controller card with external connectors would be ideal, then you could just use a standard cable and pass it though a grommeted opening in the back of the Mass-Storage case.

-Glenn

Dudes,

Serial ATA is a possibility today!

Check out: http://www.tomshardware.com/storage/20030204/index.html for a review of Some Serial ATA raid controllers (including a 4-channel from highpoint) and seagate barracuda drives available in 80 and 120gb version). Note that the highpoint controller also includes 4 converters to go from serial ATA to parallel.

Also, check out the new motherboard from Gigabyte: http://www6.tomshardware.com/mainboard/20030203/e7205-13.html This baby has a bracket to accomodate external serial ATA drives.

That gigabyte external S-ATA bracket is the prime reason I think that at least one connector in the loop should not be a problem. Though two would be better aesthetically, one would be enough to eliminate any inconvenience. Hell, you might even be able to get a number of those brackets from gigabyte, for not too much money. Worth a try, at least. You'd need two for each storage case (there's two S-ATA connections on them), and a bunch of Really Short cables for inside.

As an aside note to conventional case manufacturers: Why haven't you started putting a few slot-bracket slots above the regular slots in any of your cases? More and more motherboards come with so much integrated interfaces the include some of them on slot brackets, in some cases up to three of them. It would be might convenient to be able to just screw those into the empty space on the back there.

Totally tangential: we seem to be getting close to, or even surpassing, the situation as it was at the end of AT -- 2, 3, or more slot brackets with each motherboard. I wouldn't be surprised if by at the latest the end of 2004 there might not be a new version of ATX with a much bigger IO panel, and probably a single power connector with more leads as opposed to the standard plus a few small ones we have now. Possibly even with things like front USB 2, firewire, and/or audio in the standard, and also possibly with one or two slots less.

Completely tangential: drinking a 2-liter of coke starting around 11 pm is not a good way to get to bed early.

Thanks phunge, that bracket is exactly what I'm looking for. I could remove it from the I/O bracket and mount it to the back of case above the power supply or next to PCI slot 6. Then just machine small slots for the connector. Another way is to just have the adapter in the mass-storage case and a pass-though slot on the HTPC case. This would reduce clutter inside the HTPC.

Only issue now would be cable length. According to spec, max length is one meter or 39". I assume that is total length, so all 3 cables would have to be 39" or less. Two 10" internal cables and one 18" external cable would be nice. With just one adapter, one 12" cable and one 24" cable -need to find a source for this?

Jasper,

Some MB makers are freeing up a lot of I/O space. Some have removed the serial, parallel, and PS2 ports. This would make more room for extra FW, USB, SATA. I don't think the ATX spec is going to change much for a while, but making better use of the space can help.

-Glenn

Not to be a pest of anything, but how about focusing on delivering the (now overdue) cases that are in the pipeline instead of designing and external storage array based upon SATA technology that isn't quite ready for prime time?

There will be plenty of time later to tinker with new stuff...

-Dave

Given that the manufacturer 'might' make another batch in black - I think Atec anodizing the Powermate Knobs is a great idea. I would imagine this would give us the best shot at a good color match as well.

If you get this resolved with the folks at the anodizing shop and I would assume you would just supply the Powermates as part of the case order rather than us buying them and sending them in.... then I think my dilema about how to controll the system is solved.

Hi folks,

I have a Powermate, too and I'm currently constructing an HTPC case myself. I also had the idea to mount the Powermate from the back to hide the cable.

However it seems, that the remainder of the knob that would stand out on the front plate is a bit flat to handle it properly.

Could anyone comment on that impression?

Thanks,
Lars

Powermate:
I'll have to wait until Monday to talk to the anodizing guy and show him the part, since my job was not ready yet.

Mass-Storage S-ATA:
I don't plan on building anything until after the first batch of cases have shipped. I did a drawing of it last week, took me 5 min. to modify my 3U case drawing into a 1U. I would like to discuss it to find out if there is any interest and to get help in solving some of the cabling issues.

Lars,
Did not understand your question? But, it does require some careful machining and clearancing.

-Glenn

I understand the case option with the Powermate as follows:
The base plate of the powermate is mounted behind the front
plate so that the cable is hidden behind the front.

On my Powermate, this would leave at most half an inch of the
knob standing out from the front, the part which is above the
cable outlet. This seems somewhat difficult to handle for me...

I just wanted to confirm whether this is true.

Lars

This thread inspired me to buy a Powermate.
Another message suggested yanking the knob off, which I did.
Going one step further, I took a pocket knife and carefully seperated the transluscent base from the aluminum base by cutting the adhesive around the edge. Taking the lock nut off and the gasket lets the electronics board drop. Carefully push the USB cable back into the housing and lift the electronics out. It is then evident that with a little soldering skill that one could cut a hole in the back of the transluscent base, rethread the USB cable through it, and resolder to the correct solder points. You could orient the now not needed USB strainholder hole to the bottom side for low visibility.

I suggest that the transluscent base could be drilled and threaded (4-40?) so that it could be mounted flush to the front panel with small machine screws through the back of the panel.

After drilling and threading, put everything back together and reglue the trans base to the alum base.

Be careful not to yank on the USB as it now doesn't have a great strain relief (unless you reuse the factory one but mounted to the trans base).

I will be trying this tomorrow.

ps... once this is all apart, it should be easier to powder coat any color you want (for a fee!)

Smoothtlk, I have done exactly what you suggest and it worked great!:cool: I actually mounted the volume control to the front of my case with Liquid Nails Clear Seal. No problems so far....

Tim Corn

Here's a pic....

Tim,
Good to hear you found an adhesive that seems to work. I was just thinking about that when you posted. I think I will use Nails to reglue the two bases together, but will try the machine screw idea so that I can remove it cleanly from the panel in the future. I am also mounting to a real nice piece of Cocobolo wood from South America which has a lot of natural oil in it which would probably resist the glue.

tim, you posted your pic when I did. Looks great. I noticed that you mounted the strain relief hole on top? How did you dress it up?

david

Ok,
Modified my powermate for flush mount. It was easy.
Only additional step was I cut a hanging pendaflex plastic label holder and used it as an insulator between the USB wire (now running out the back of the transluscent plate) and the USB surface mount chip. I was concerned about the ground shield on the USB wire shorting a pin on the chip.

I used "Seal All" glue to adhere the trans plate to the aluminum plate.
I reused the strain relief and glued it to the trans plate so that it would act as a bushing passing through the front panel.

I think this is cleaner than drilling a big hole in the front plate for just the knob. Took about 1/2 an hour total.

Try it!

david

The hole is actually on bottom. I popped the two body pieces apart and rotated the hole to the bottom. I wanted the Griffin text on the bottom, but did not what to see the hole on top.

Tim

Hi guys,
This is my first posting to the group.

What brings me here is the A-Tech HTPC case, more specifically, the new Mass Storage case.

My plan is to use the HTPC case as the basis for a portable Digital Audio Workstation. (Most all rackmount cases are far too deep and heavy for a standard SKB case.) The A-Tech HTPC case is the perfect solution and I immediately ordered one with all the trimmings.

The only big problem was the relative lack of mass storage. SATA seems like the perfect solution. (My inspiration came from the demonstrations of naked SATA drives sitting out on the desk, all hooked up and working. ) Glenn was nice enough to take on the project and he came up with a great design to accommodate 4 SATA drives in a single height version of the HTPC.

Glenn, correctly, has brought up the issue of bulkhead connectors on the two cases.

After much thought, for my application (DAW), I don’t want any bulkhead connectors. On the HTPC side, I’ll use an expansion slot bracket and feed the cables (sleeved, of course) through a single hole, plus a pem nut to configure a strain relief. On the SATA Mass Storage case side, a U-shaped slot to feed all the cables through will work. Plus a pem nut installed to attach a strain relief. All the extra SATA cable length (about 15”) will be left between the cases. That should leave plenty of cable to make it easy to move the Mass Storage case out of the rack and replace the drives inside. If it becomes necessary to completely disconnect the two cases, simply disconnect the all the connectors to the drives, remove the strain relief screw, and then lift the entire cable assembly out. The Mass Storage case is now completely free from the HTPC case.

The Gigabyte SATA connector panel is great for demonstrations, but, in my opinion, SATA connectors are too consumer duty-level to survive for any length of time in the back of an active location-recording rack case. For reliably: the best idea is to keep all SATA connections safely contained within the cases.

I also looked at possibly using some configuration of DB connectors. I see no reason why it wouldn’t work, (something like a DB-25 for SATA data and maybe a DB-9 for power) but, again, all that would be added is potential reliability problems, and considerable expense.

My vote is for keeping the cabling as simple and reliable as possible.
DT Fletcher

PS: ordered my case with the WORKS! Including the fluro display, push buttons, IR and firewire ports on the front panel. Also special ordered a polished black anodized front panel. All the buttons are polished silver and the internal panels are blue. Once done, I’ll take pictures to share.

Powermate:
It should be no problem to anodize the knobs black. I left one with the shop to see how it turns out. I may get it back on Wednesday. I will post a picture of it.


Mass Storage -S-ATA:
Welcome to AVS forums DT! I agree a home-run cable run is best. Problem is getting to the connector. You would need 2U of unused space above the case to open the cover enough to reach them. I am going to assume that there is no space available in this design. A few ideas I had are:

1. Make the SATA case so that the bottom and rear panel can be pulled out from the back. They could be supported on some nice drawer guides built into the case. The top, front, and sides are fixed to the rack.

2. Attach the SATA case directly to the bottom of the HTPC and treat it as a single unit. A wire-way could be cut into both cases to pass wires through.

3. Use the Gigabyte adapter and make a wire strain relief clamp on the case to prevent cable from being disconnected.

-Glenn

Hi Glenn and thanks for all your efforts!

You wrote:
<<You would need 2U of unused space above the case to open the cover enough to reach them>>

No, my plan is to remove the case, from the front, and then service the drives. The trick is the extra 15" of cable hanging between the two cases.

Step 1: remove rackmount screws

Step 2: gently pull the Mass Storage case directly out of the rack as far as cables will allow (about 12"-13" and we can make longer cables, if needed) and sit on books or, if cable permits, on work surface. Remember this is all going into a traveling rackmount case with the HTPC on the bottom and the Mass Storage case immediately above.

Step 3: unscrew and lift lid

Step 4: service drives or remove all connectors and strain relief screw and lift entire cable assembly away from Mass Storage Case.

Another option would be to remove the HTPC and Mass Storage case as a single unit.

Other than the nice long SATA cables, nothing else is really needed. The only fancy bit is the open U-shaped slot on the back of the Mass Storage case. This will allow the easy removal of the entire cable assembly, and thus disconnecting the two cases, with relative ease.

DT Fletcher

Glenn, is a cutout for the powermate still an option for those of us on your list who haven't indicated interest yet?

Thanks,

Glenn

I have same question as salsbst. Also, any chance we could pay you, and you would buy, anodize, and install the powermate? Buying and sending you a powermate would be a bit of a pain.

Obviously, I'd expect tyo pay you something extra for your trouble.

DT,

Those steps for removal are not very practical. It may not be a problem for you, but I can't expect it to be convenient for other users. I will work something out when I get time after the first run of cases have been shipped.

-Glenn

Powermate:

I can add it to your case, but I will have to bump you down one group for shipping, this would add a week to your order only, not to others. The cutouts have already been made, but the whole idea with my method of doing the options last allows me to do them rather quickly. I just don't want to change my shipping times to do so now.

I do not want to resell the Powermates. If you want the knob anodized, just pull the knob off and put it in a padded envelope and send it to me, priority mail is only $3.85. I plan on adding a five dollar handling fee for anodizing.

-Glenn

How does the internal Powermate mount work? I have taken my Black Powermate apart with plans to create a rear output.

Would it be possible to have the Firewire option with a hole we can stick the USB cable through before using adhesive to mount the Powermate? or How hard would it be for me to drill my own hole through the faceplate?

Glenn,

I'm pretty sure that my procedure for the Mass Storage case will work just fine, for me or anyone else.

I would like for the first Mass Storage case to be built to my specifications. Then, I will test-run it and report the results.

If you want to try and come-up with something fancy, of course, feel free. Personally, I just don't see any need to go beyond my simple solution.
Thanks,
DT Fletcher

Originally posted by Joseph S
How does the internal Powermate mount work? I have taken my Black Powermate apart with plans to create a rear output.

Would it be possible to have the Firewire option with a hole we can stick the USB cable through before using adhesive to mount the Powermate? or How hard would it be for me to drill my own hole through the faceplate?

The base is too large to mount to front panel. I bore the case to fit the housing with a bevel to clear edge of knob when you push down on it. There is a vertical bracket behind base inside case for support.

-Glenn

PowerMate knob:

I called the anodizer, he ran the black parts, but my clear parts will not be done until tomorrow. He said the knob turned out really nice. I'll post a picture after I pick it up.

-Glenn

PowerMate:

I picked up the knob yesterday. The color looked good, but the stripping process removed the radial surface finish. The finish was kind of matted. I want to polish the part on the lathe to restore the radial finish. Anodizing penetrates about .001 into the surface of the aluminum. The stripping process etches away this layer. I had them etch the part again and took it with me. I will polish it tomorrow and drop it off on Monday to be anodized again. I think it will look better this way.

-Glenn

Glenn,

Would the MA-9700 work with the the ATI 9500 Pro? Don't they have similar pbc layouts? Also, will this be available separately from the case.

Thank you,
Leo

Leo,

I am certain it would fit, but I have not tried yet. I do know that the AIW version will require a different duct that I may develop later. The passive video card cooler will work with any case.

-Glenn

Thanks for the reply Glenn,

When I asked "will this be available separately from the case," I actually meant, "Can I purchase this if I do not purchase the case?" If so, could you estimate when they would be available?

Thanks again,
Leo

This is definitely an interesting case. I'm going to be paying attention to this one until I can save up the money. =)

The mass storage chassis is also an interesting idea. I was going to use a 4-bay external HD chassis that accepted IDE drives and connected to the computer via Firewire. For the matching storage case, are there any huge advantages to using S-ATA over Firewire?

have you all seen the new xserve raid cases from apple? a) too big b) probably too noisy and c) too expensive. but then, it's not intended for ht, and regardless, it looks sweet, and the tech specs are impressive.

what about a quiet 1u version that also incorporated a fiber channel interface? sata wasn't meant for external runs and so it seems kind of ghetto to take a beautiful htpc and file server and use the connection equivalent of ducttaping them together.

of course it's more expensive. but what isn't in home theater? :P and plus, it means you don't need a short umbilical cord to the htpc.