Not to bust your bubble, but suddenly in the last few days NBC has re-appeared for me. I have done nothing and now it comes in perfectly. For the last several months It was not consistent at all and now its near perfect everytime I tune it in.

Anyone have trouble with FOX? I can get every Philly local now broadcasting with a strong signal except for FOX. I even get 55 which is supposedly the weakest? I can get ABC, CBS, NBC, and WB without any problem all strong. UPN is usually good as well. But FOX is rarely even watchable. Anyone have any insight. I am on the Delaware line about 2 miles west of 1-95 using an attic mounted Silver Sensor.

Thanks

I would suggest a better antenna mounted outside on the roof. Virtually any decent outside antenna would be of great help to you.

Care to recommend a good cheap and hopefully small outside easily mountable antenna?

Thanks for your help!

Here's one suggestion:
http://www.radioshack.com/product.asp?catalog%5Fname=CTLG&category%5Fname=CTLG%5F002%5F004%5F002%5F000&product%5Fid=15%2D2160

The channel master 4 bay and 8 bay bowties are both good.

I use the Radio Shack Antenna and get minimum 75 signal - receive all HD stations

Originally posted by baeverly
Anyone have trouble with FOX? I can get every Philly local now broadcasting with a strong signal except for FOX. I even get 55 which is supposedly the weakest? I can get ABC, CBS, NBC, and WB without any problem all strong. UPN is usually good as well. But FOX is rarely even watchable. Anyone have any insight. I am on the Delaware line about 2 miles west of 1-95 using an attic mounted Silver Sensor.


I am having the exact problem as baeverly describes. I live 10 miles north of Newark, DE in Chester County. I am blaming my Samsung SIR-T150 because the signal strength meter shows a "pulsing" signal but never locks on. All other stations come in 50% or higher. I know folks around me are receiving FOX.

I wonder if upgrading the decoder firmware would help? I have tried moving the antenna to see if multipath was the problem. I use a RS 120" attic mount with a UHF amplifier (and, yes, I have tried with and without the amplifier).

Any other comments or ideas?

I've been receiving signals from the Philly stations since December 1999 and have tracked the progress (or lack thereof) for 3 years.

I think that until Fox either ups their power or moves to a higher location folks in the fringe reception areas will have problems getting a consistent, locked in signal.

I'll check out WCAU-DT toinight to see if they are on-line with their new location. If they are I'll know it in a second, as I've been consistently getting signal strength reading in the upper 20's to low 30's for years.

Brian.

Originally posted by briandx

I'll check out WCAU-DT toinight to see if they are on-line with their new location. If they are I'll know it in a second, as I've been consistently getting signal strength reading in the upper 20's to low 30's for years.

Brian.

Yes, it would be interesting to confirm (preferrably from someone at WCAU) that they are up and running at the new tower. Last night, I got WCAU at ~40% constant where before the channel wouldn't even scan. It was nice to see Leno in HD for the first time. :eek:

I am hoping that WCAU is NOT yet up and running at the new tower, since I am still not getting a useable signal on channel 67 (Samsung SIR-T165 and rooftop antenna with rotor). I do get all of the other local digital channels quite reliably.

Besides WCAU and Fox moving to their new tower and increasing the size of their signal, what other nearby channels are coming online in the near future?

Originally posted by Philly Tim
I am hoping that WCAU is NOT yet up and running at the new tower, since I am still not getting a useable signal on channel 67 (Samsung SIR-T165 and rooftop antenna with rotor). I do get all of the other local digital channels quite reliably.

Besides WCAU and Fox moving to their new tower and increasing the size of their signal, what other nearby channels are coming online in the near future?

I'm with you in hoping they are NOT on the new tower. I still get significant dropouts on various days, so I'm guessing they aren't there yet. I would think we'd be getting a pretty good signal once they bump the power to 1mW.

I believe one of the PAX stations is supposed to be up and running soon.

Hi All,

I am getting the same old signal strength on my Sony HD200 as always. WPHL-DT's signals from the new tower almost pegs the meter so I doubt that WCAU is on the new site yet. I believe that they will be at the top of the tower so signals hopefully will be very strong.

Originally posted by jcardani
Hi All,

I am getting the same old signal strength on my Sony HD200 as always. WPHL-DT's signals from the new tower almost pegs the meter so I doubt that WCAU is on the new site yet. I believe that they will be at the top of the tower so signals hopefully will be very strong.

So it may just be my new STB (HD-SAT520) that's making the difference for me. It's basically the same as the HD200. The DTV1080 I was using before was probably less sensitive. The new model has the new 4th generation 8-VSP chipset that may be pulling in the signal a little better. I'm also picking up FOX better compared to the old STB. More consistent strength, albeit in the 40-50% range. ;)

Hi Calabs,

Exactly. I am located in Voorhees (near Marlton). I had a Panasonic DST52 tuner previously and I could not receive WCAU-DT without constant break-ups even during good weather. I also had many problems receiving WHYY and FOX with that receiver. Using the Sony HD200 all Philly stations are rock solid during good weather and only WCAU-DT has problems in meduim-heavy rain/snow. I can even get channel 53 out of Atlantic City with break ups (but the antenna is facing Philly) I am using the same Channel Master UHF antenna - 80" boom.

The new Sony/Zenith receivers have more sensitive tuners are reject multipath much better than the older models.

Joe

I live in Feasterville, right above NE Philly, and I get everything but Fox, and WCAU breaks up allot.. I mostly watch abc, nbc and cbs.. I rarely watch any local HD OTA programming that's not in HD or at least transmitted in widescreen.. I don't see the point of channel 17, 29 or 57 being on the air.. they transmit nothing that I can recall in HD or widescreen.. just upconvert their lame 4x3 material.. BIG DEAL.. Give me more HD and Widescreen programming..

X01E:

We HDTV enthusiasts have to keep in mind that digital TV is about more than just HDTV. All U.S. TV stations are obligated to begin broadcasting digital signals (their analog channels will be taken away, possibly as early as 2006), but no one is required by law to broadcast in HDTV.

The WB Network (channel 17 in our area) does have a limited selection of HDTV programs. I've seen "Everwood" (pretty good show) and "Family Affair" (ugh!) on HDTV, and I think there may be another show or two that is broadcast in that format.

All of the FOX network stations broadcast pseudo-high-definition programming. Sure, 480p signals are better than standard-definition, but they pale in comparison to true HDTV programming!

I don't know if 57 (UPN) ever broadcasts any HDTV programming, but I am glad that they are broadcasting a digital signal. Where I live, the OTA analog signals are greatly affected by multipath interference from the nearby tall buildings. Lots of ghosting and distorted images, etc. With digital signals, you either get enough of a signal to show the content, or no content at all. There is no "ghosting." Granted, multipath interference can still degrade a signal enough to prevent your digital tuner from rendering it, but it's nice to have a sharp image for a change from our antennas! (not that I watch channel 57 all that much at present anyway!)

We "early adopters" can feel frustrated at the lack of HDTV content, but I prefer to consider the local glass to be half full rather than half empty.

I would quite agree with Philly Tim's assertion that the glass is half full, in fact, given what is currently available from all sources and my available time to watch TV in general the glass is about 60% full.

BTW.. WCAU-DT is still broadcasting at it's old location. Any update on the actual transition date?

Brian.

Originally posted by Philly Tim
X01E:

We HDTV enthusiasts have to keep in mind that digital TV is about more than just HDTV. All U.S. TV stations are obligated to begin broadcasting digital signals (their analog channels will be taken away, possibly as early as 2006), but no one is required by law to broadcast in HDTV.

All of the FOX network stations broadcast pseudo-high-definition programming. Sure, 480p signals are better than standard-definition, but they pale in comparison to true HDTV programming!

We "early adopters" can feel frustrated at the lack of HDTV content, but I prefer to consider the local glass to be half full rather than half empty.

I think your on the right track Philly Tim. :) I'll take the digital stations (especially CBS and ABC) in SD digital over any analog signal any day! Just for clarification purposes, 480p is still considered standard definition, as well as 480i. That's why folks are up in arms over the whole FOX "widescreen" format. It really isn't HD. 720p and 1080i are HD formats. ;)

Originally posted by briandx

BTW.. WCAU-DT is still broadcasting at it's old location. Any update on the actual transition date?

Brian.

Glad to hear THAT! :D Last night when I was watching Frasier, the signal really started breaking up. This was a little strange, since the signal strenght was 40-50%. Don't think it could be multipathing as all other Philly stations come in very well. I too would be interested to hear from an NBC employee as to exactly when they will be broadcasting from the new tower.

I think I heard someplace that 57 has no HDTV material because UPN isn't supplying any yet. Supposedly, next season Enterprise may be in HD.

I noticed that KYW Director of Broadcast Operations & Engineering Jim Chase has posted elsewhere on this forum, so I thought I'd ask a couple of KYW-related questions in case he is monitoring this thread.

First, a comment. KYW's digital broadcast is superb! The network HDTV programming is first-rate, your signal is strong and clear (at least in my area), and all of the little technical details are very smooth and professional (e.g., the transitions from HD widescreen programming to "standard" commercials, the semi-transparent station logo, etc.). Congratulations on a job well done!

My first question is just a matter of technical curiosity. Your studios are in the Historic District of Center City Philadelphia, but your broadcast tower is miles away in the Northwest. What kind of connection do you make between your studios and broadcast facility to carry the large-bandwidth signal that distance? Did you have to install a special fiber-optic cable, or maybe is that kind of data now transmitted via microwave transmission or something? As I said, I was just curious. I've heard that some radio stations lease special phone lines to transfer signal from their studio to their broadcast location, but I would guess that is not enough bandwidth for your digital broadcast signal.

Second question: The local ABC affiliate seems to be the only Philly-area digital broadcast that includes Dolby Digital 5.0 audio signals (when available in the programming). Can you tell us when KYW will begin to broadcast DD 5.0 audio? Is it a matter of getting special equipment that you have not yet installed? If the money guys at KYW are telling you that no one in our region is interested in DD 5.0 audio yet, please tell them that the local digital viewership is growing rapidly, so it's time to bring the audio portion of the digital broadcast up to speed.

Third question: Without committing yourself to any specifics, can you give us a hint on when/whether your local news broadcasts and other local programming will be produced in HDTV? I am sure this requires a major capital investment and was just wondering if KWY is considering it, and when this might happen.

Fourth question: This is a network matter, so I know it's out of your jurisdiction, but why isn't "The Late Show with David Letterman" broadcast in HDTV by now? I can't get the WCAU signal yet, so I am spared the sight of Jay Leno's huge chin on my widescreen TV, but I would sure enjoy seeing Dave's toupee in digital splendor.

Fifth question: All of the local digital channels seem to be neglecting their PSIP data stream. The date/time information is pretty close to accurate for most local stations, but there is still some variation of as much as four minutes. In case you didn't know, some of the new digital TV tuners rely on the accuracy of this information for time-programmed recording. When a station's PSIP date/time info is off, then the timer in the set-top box is also thrown off and the recording will not be accurate. Also, none of the local stations bother to put any program information content in their PSIP signal yet. The next time you get together with all the other local TV engineering executives for poker, could you maybe mention this problem to them?

Last question: Have you ever dated Pat Ciarrocchi? (Nah, just kidding on that last one!)

Thanks for listening to questions from your local TV fans. We all appreciate the good work that you and your team at KYW do, day in and day out.

I can answer the 5.1 question. That comes from CBS. They have not had the equipment necessary to send it out from the network in NY. The last I heard was that it should be installed in December. I am sure that KYW is fully capable of sending 5.1 out once it is available from the network in NY off the sat. I must say, the prologic they use now often sounds great and better than some of the 5.1 I have heard on ABC and PBS.

Philly Tim, yes youre right about Everwood, I've seen it.. looks good. But I still stand with my comments about the other stations.. the digital stations look better because they use good scalers compared to what we use at home. Actually I just wish they would just transmit everything in widescreen, even if it is 480i up-converted material. The majority of HD adoptors have Rear Projection CRT 16x9 TV's that will burn in if you constantly watch with black bars. Yes, I use stretch modes and live with it, but true widescreen is much better (yes, if you have an LCD or DLP set no burn in worries.. but widescreen is just awesome). For example, nightly news broadcasts.. I see no reason why they don't transmit in widescreen.. (heck I can buy a $600 add on lens for my high end consumer Mini DV camcorder that would film in true anamorphic 16x9). With the TV stations pockets they can't spring for new lens's on their cameras, and for the SD transmission, they letter box it.. this way both sides the analog and digital broadcasts have the best of both worlds.

X01E -

We had this discussion when WPHL 17 came up in HD. They were broadcasting a 16:9 signal that was stretched on the sides and cropped top and bottom.

The complaint from some of us (myself included) was that while most 16:9 TV's/projectors can be set to stretch and crop as they wish, it was impossible for those of us who preferred to see the whole picture to do so.

Of course, that takes care of the 4:3 material. Given the opportunity, I would prefer that everything be filmed/taped in 16:9 so that I can use the whole screen. Reality says that they'd get MANY more complaints from people with 4:3 sets who had to see it letterboxed.

MSmith thanks for the info.. and yes unfortunately, I agree with your last statement. Heck, while I'm spending other people's money.. Let's have the stations buy 2 sets of cameras and film both formats at the same time.. Wishfull thinking..

Originally posted by MSmith
X01E -

We had this discussion when WPHL 17 came up in HD. They were broadcasting a 16:9 signal that was stretched on the sides and cropped top and bottom.

The complaint from some of us (myself included) was that while most 16:9 TV's/projectors can be set to stretch and crop as they wish, it was impossible for those of us who preferred to see the whole picture to do so.

Of course, that takes care of the 4:3 material. Given the opportunity, I would prefer that everything be filmed/taped in 16:9 so that I can use the whole screen. Reality says that they'd get MANY more complaints from people with 4:3 sets who had to see it letterboxed.

But the best way to show 4:3 material on the digital channel is to NOT have the station transmit black side bars as part of the picture. That way, those of us with 16 x 9 sets can let the set-top box or the TV stretch it to fill the screen. PBS (WHYY) does this when they show non-HDTV programming. I don't understand why other stations don't do this.

Eric

Caesar,

I agree completely.

I believe the difference is that WHYY uses one set of equipment during the day to broadcast (simulcast) standard-definition digital signals, and another set of equipment to broadcast high-definition signals in the evening. Most digital tuners and HDTV sets currently on the market can change the aspect ratio of a program if it is standard-definition, but not when it is high-definition. I believe newer models may begin to have these advanced features soon.

For the other stations, they broadcast a high-definition signal at all times. Since a high-definition broadcast MUST be formatted for widescreen, the station must always do something to turn the 4:3 material into 16:9. The common solution is to send sidebars as part of the signal.

I don't really understand why there is this fundamental difference between the PBS affiliate and all the other stations. Why is it that WHYY can afford to have the equipment to broadcast 4:3 material properly, but the commercial stations have to process the signal to fit the one-size-fits-all widescreen format?

If I have any misinformation in the above statements, someone please correct me. I am still learning about digital TV broadcasts and I may have some things wrong.

Last night, WCAU was a mess during Ed at 8pm. They showed a blank screen for the first few minutes, then some weird reverse-image with green borders, then a picture with lots of dropouts. It was virtually unwatchable.

Originally posted by MSmith
Last night, WCAU was a mess during Ed at 8pm. They showed a blank screen for the first few minutes, then some weird reverse-image with green borders, then a picture with lots of dropouts. It was virtually unwatchable.

Sounds like you had better luck that I did. ;) I was getting no signal at ALL (OK, I'm exaggerating; it was ~10%). Please NBC, move to the new tower SOON. :(

Yep, same here... WCAU reception was just lousy. On another note, like many other's my 16x9 TV, does lock into FULL mode when it detects a 480P or above signal. However, my STB which is a Dish 6000 receiver, compensates for this with it's own stretch modes for HD sources. It has stretch, partial zoom, full zoom, and gray bars, and it doesn't matter if the broadcast is transmitting black bars or not. I actually found that the zoom mode doesn't degrade the PQ that much.

Philly Tim
First, thanks for the positive comments. From our first venture into DTV in 1998 we have tried to make a professional presentation equal to our analog product even though there were very few viewers. From the beginning our DTV channel has been fully automated with full master control switching, HD satellite distribution, HD tape recorders, HD video file servers, and so on. Believe it or not, I just yesterday got a call from the sales department asking if we could air a Mitsubishi HD commercial. I hated to tell them I had been waiting four years for the call!!!!
I'll try to answer all your questions:

You are correct about the location of our studio at 5th and Market streets in Philadelphia. The transmitter is located in Roxborough. We use a 7ghz microwave STL to get the analog and digital signals to the respective transmitters. The 7ghz channel is 25 mhz wide and we put 2 separate signals in the channel, one analog and one digital. The analog signal is frequency modulated on a carrier located down 4.5mhz from the channel center. Included are 4 audio sub carriers. The digital signal is 8vsb modulated on a carrier located up 3.5mhz from the channel center. The ATSC encoder is located at the studio and the 19.2mb stream is sent by microwave to the transmitter.

JWhip correctly answered your question about the DD audio. The network does not have the routing equipment to distribute 5.1 channels of audio.

There is no plan to produce news programming in HD. We are about to replace all of our Panasonic DVC-PRO equipment and there have been no discussions about a move to 100mb DVC. In fact, we are not considering a move to 50mb DVC. We use 25mb equipment now and plan to continue in the future. As a side note here, and I know you are probably aren't interested in nasty old SD stuff, but, we have just converted to a new video file server for news playback. For news we shoot using 25mb DVC equipment. The digitally recorded tape is ingested at 4 times normal speed into a digital non linear editor. The video is edited and the final cut is FTP'd to a really big SGI video server. The server plays the edited clips to air. The video looks a million times better than the old Sony Beta tape editing stuff looked. Stays digital from lens to switcher, 25mb DVC compression all the way, no generation losses. Take a look and let me know what you think.

Letterman. I believe Letterman’s new contract calls for HD when the equipment now in use must be replaced. Don't know a lot about this one.

I was not aware of the time accuracy issue until I read a thread here on the forum about a month ago. We do have NBS time in the building and are investigating ways to get into the PSIP computer. Getting the program information into the PSIP is something we have been working on for some time now. You have to keep in mind that in order to accomplish something like this it must be automated and require no human intervention. Adding a person to enter information into the PSIP computer is about as likely as a positive answer to your last question. We have been working on an interface between our automation system and the PSIP computer. We actually are quite a way down the road on this and might have something soon. All depends on other priorities.

No, I have never dated Pat, though I have known her for over 20 years. I did take an elevator ride with her once where she told me my cigar stunk and I told her hair looked like she stuck her fingers in a light socket. Does that count?
CUL Jim

James M. Chase
Director Broadcast Operations & Engineering
KYW-TV / WPSG-TV
101 South Independence Mall East
Philadelphia, PA. 19106
chase@kyw.com

Jim:

Thanks a million for the very thorough reply. You're a class act all the way, and that is clearly reflected in the high quality of the KYW broadcasts.

I probably could not have detected the change from the Sony Beta tape system to your new digital video server. Until very recently, I've been watching TV on a 23-year-old Sony 19-incher that refused to give up the ghost. (I had a deal with my wife that we would wait until the old TV died before getting a new one -- as long as *I* get to pick out the new model!) Since I was watching KYW's analog broadcast signal on an older set with lots of multipath interference, it's a wonder I could even tell that Pat was a lady! Now I have a widescreen HDTV and a digital tuner, so I am in television heaven. Whenever I watch the KYW news, I'll now have a new appreciation for the infrastructure behind the pristine video.

Thanks again for all the interesting technical details, and I hope you will keep up posted on any interesting new developments as they occur.

Jim, thanks for your participation here. It was interesting reading your comments. KYW's HD broadcast quality is consistently the best of all the Philly affiliates (for other networks). Would've been great to have DD5.1, but picture quality, programming & great reception more than make up for that.

Jim, I work as an IT Manager, and love what I do. However, anytime you want to trade jobs let me know... He He... I would love to work with that equipment..

Jim,

Let me add my thanks for your involvement and wonderful, detailed explanation of how it works.

Planning on doing any tours? :)

Hi Jim,

Thanks for the very informative answer above! It's great to see you here in the forum!

I believe that you are also in charge of Engineering at UPN57. Are there any plans for UPN to feed you HD any time soon? Also, I believe that UPN has some sort of HD movie package for some its affiliates. Will UPN57 receive this soon?

thanks,

Joe Cardani

Jim,

Thanks for the best OTA HD picture. I live in Jersey and appreciate all the good work you do out there in Philly.

Franzius

Joe
We are working on the WPSG master control switching system. The switcher was delivered a couple weeks ago and is physically installed. We have a good bit of wiring to do. To be honest, it is not one of our top priorities right now, but I would like to see some real HD on WPSG. We have to finish up a new channel 3 alternate-main transmitter and antenna system before we get to finishing the WPSG master control.
I have the Paramount HD movie schedule through the end of 2004. Looks like we won't make Crocodile Dundee in January 2003, and probably Ferris Bueller's Day Off scheduled for Feburary 2003. But we will make Murphy's Law in July 2003.
When we are finished with WPSG-DT, it will use the same automation system we use on WPSG, KYW, and KYW-DT so I expect it to look smooth on the air.

Jim,

You wouldn't happen to know if Comcast is going to carry you guys soon?

I've been hearing that CSI is one of the best things to watch in HD.. and I'm just dying to watch.. :)

If you don't know, that's okay.. I just thought I might get that question in for all the philly area comcast people without antennas. :)

Thank you!

Bronowyn
I really don't know when that will happen. I know that Comcast and Viacom are negotiating carriage of all the CBS and UPN digital stations. This is handled by Viacom in New York and I hear very little on the subject. I do know that CBS and Time Warner cable negotiated a deal that has CBS and UPN digital stations on TW systems where the markets line up. So deals are possible, just don't know what the problem is with Comcast.
You are correct about CSI. It is one of the most stunning examples of the desireability of the new medium. The wide shots of the Las Vegas strip almost take your breath away.
Remember, KYW-DT is free over the air to all who can receive it. Some can't becasue of location and other reasons but most should have no trouble with a very small antenna. I live in Mt. Laurel NJ and use a really small folded yagi antenna. Works great!!!!
CUL Jim


James M. Chase
Director Broadcast Operations & Engineering
KYW-TV / WPSG-TV
101 South Independence Mall East
Philadelphia, PA. 19106
chase@kyw.com

Thank you for your quick response.

:) I might have to convince someone in my house to get me an antenna for Christmas. :)

Thank you!
I know all of us at AVS really appreciate you paying attention to these boards. :) you rock!

From what I have heard, do not expect KYW-DT on Comcast during 2003. Better get an antenna and STB to receive it, sorry to say. Also, if CBS goes through with their ridiculous threat to pull all HD programming with a broadcast flag, I will simply stop watching their programming, plain and simple. Who wants to copy and sell content that it edited and full of commericals anyway! Insane BS is what it is and a money grab if I have ever seen one. Does anyone remember Sisney v. Sony where the movie companies argued that the VCR had to be outlawed or the movie industry would die. Can anyone now imagine where the movie companies would be without home video sales? The same will be true in the digital domain if they would just open up their eyes and keep their hands out of our pockets!

Anyone else now catching WCAU perfectly, are they on the new tower?

Originally posted by X01E
Anyone else now catching WCAU perfectly, are they on the new tower?
Checked this morning. still getting 30-40% signal (that's a GOOD day for me). :(

Is it noticably better than what you've gotten in the past?

I too for the past two or three weeks have been getting WCAU-DT 10.1 with a strong consistent signal. It is noticeably better. Before that it was not reliable some days good some days terrible, I never knew what to expect. It sure seems like they moved or turned up the power to me.

NBC10 is not yet operational on the new tower. Looks like they won't be until the end of January.

Originally posted by JWhip
NBC10 is not yet operational on the new tower. Looks like they won't be until the end of January.
Thanks for the info, JWhip. Did you get your information from WCAU? If so, did anyone give a reason why it was so delayed (~2 months). Quite honestly, I'm breathing a sigh of relief, cause if 30% was all I could get on the new tower (which really doesn't make sense anyway), I'd be SOL. :eek:

While I'm disappointed that WCAU hasn't gotten the new transmitter operating on the new tower yet, I'm not at all surprised. What is their motivation? They've met their FCC obligations. It's too bad you have to almost live physically in Philadelphia to pick up their signal, but from my brief encounters via email, they really don't seem to care that no one outside of Philly is getting their digital signal.

I was told earlier this year that the new tower and transmitter would be up September 1, 2002. Then it slipped to the end of November. Now we're talking the end of January. In all probability, I wouldn't be surprised if they aren't up on the new tower any earlier than May. Just in time for season finales.

It's bad enough I can't pick up UPN57 up here because of the reduced power and transmission pattern they've elected to use. Now I won't be able to get NBC any time soon, either. It's frustrating being on the cutting edge of technology. Unfortunately, NBC doesn't seem to have much of a committment to the technology. Another example you ask? They broadcast the new Muppet Christmas Movie around Thanksgiving in High Definition. While I couldn't watch it in HD, I presume this means 16x9 aspect ratio. I wanted to pick this movie up on DVD, but it's ONLY available on VHS (do people really still buy VHS??) If they processed it for HD transmission, why the hell not put it on DVD??

I just have no faith that NBC (in general) is doing anything but following everyone else. They used to be the leaders. I don't know what went wrong....

I feel your pain, Randy. It's true that NBC has no real driver to move to the new tower since they are already transmitting a DT signal. Us poor slobs that are not within reception distance have to hang on until they get it right. It's too bad we don't have Jim Chase's counterpart in NBC on the forum. Perhaps he/she can listen to what the masses (as small as they may be right now) and learn from it. It's nice to have folks like Jim on ther forum, and the stations they represent and provide quality images for our expensive "TOYS" to display. COMM'ON NBC! To date, there has only been one night where NBC was watchable, and just seeing Leno in HD was enough to get me excited!

...I'm pretty far north in New Hope (18938), I have the 2160 RS yagi in the attic, and got everything except WCAU.
I moved it around, got nothing.
Installed an RS amp, and got nothing.
Bought a Channel Master preamp, and got it.!
It also raised CBS form 80s to 90s and Fox from 40s to 60s.
Not that NBC has anything I was begging for, but I FINALLY got it.

Yes. straight from NBC10. Sorry there isn't better news.

I was able to get WCAU-DT for 3 straight days 2 weeks ago. Now, it all gone. My E* 6000 receiver cycles very quickly form 0%, 40% and 50% and back to 0. And the the cycle would repeat itself at nauseaum. I just can't get a good lock.

Thanks God for KYW-H (CBS), WPVI (ABC) and of course WHYY.

Franzius

I'm about half way between Franzius and Plasma George, near Princeton, NJ. I've been able to get WCAU-DT consistently for the past month with both a Hughes E86 and my current Samsung T-165, losing them only when they were off the air.

I'm using a 20 year old Winegard VHF/UHF yagi with a mast mounted preamp feeding a Blonder-Tongue 15 db gain preamp.

Experimenting with preamps might do the trick for those of us on the fringe.

WCAU-DT came back after I rebooted my receiver. There is a lot of breakups but, I am getting picture and sound. The signal meter is the same as previously reported. As the evening wore on, WCAU has become more and more watchable. Maybe, I will be able to get Leno tonight.

Quick Update. Leno is coming in at 50-54%. No breakups....

Originally posted by Plasma George
Bought a Channel Master preamp, and got it.!


Can you give me a model# and a distributer? Thanks!

...http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=15064&item=802196956&rd=1

I've noticed an intermittent flicker in the video (picture) image on channel 17-1 whenever they broadcast an HDTV program. It was happening steadily last night as I watched "Everwood" (about once every 90-120 seconds, but not on a steady cycle that I could tell).

By "flicker," I mean that the picture signal is disrupted for a fraction of a second and the screen "blinks" black very briefly. It's pretty annoying.

I've never seen this video flaw on any other digital channel, whether standard definition digital or high definition. I've noticed it regularly since I first started watching 17-1 (but I only see it on the HDTV programs). I wanted to wait to see if it persisted before asking about it here. Has anyone else noticed this?

If no one else has noticed this, maybe it's some artifact unique to my reception, perhaps multipath interference or something.

wcau this week... for some reason coming in very well on my Dish 6000 with no changes on my side.

Anyone from Hunterdon/Somerset Counties, NJ get Philly HD reception?

With antenna in crawlspace and properly adjusted, I can get good reception of analog Philly stations. In fact, I get better FOX PHILLY reception than I do NYC occasionally. I'm about to get a Zenith HDV420 and hopefully I can get ABC and NBC until there is a tower in NJ or they are setup at the ESB.

Thanks for any info

Anyone from Hunterdon/Somerset Counties, NJ get Philly HD reception?

I'm in the southern part of Somerset County and I receive HD and analog ABC, CBS, NBC, FOX, UPN, WB and PBS from Philly - all with solid signals.

I have a roof mounted VHF/UHF yagi with preamp and the Samsung SIR-T165.

Originally posted by Philly Tim
I've noticed an intermittent flicker in the video (picture) image on channel 17-1 whenever they broadcast an HDTV program. It was happening steadily last night as I watched "Everwood" (about once every 90-120 seconds, but not on a steady cycle that I could tell).

By "flicker," I mean that the picture signal is disrupted for a fraction of a second and the screen "blinks" black very briefly. It's pretty annoying.

I've never seen this video flaw on any other digital channel, whether standard definition digital or high definition. I've noticed it regularly since I first started watching 17-1 (but I only see it on the HDTV programs). I wanted to wait to see if it persisted before asking about it here. Has anyone else noticed this?

If no one else has noticed this, maybe it's some artifact unique to my reception, perhaps multipath interference or something.

Philly Tim: I see this too. At first I thought it was me blinking or something. But yes, the picture appears to blank out for a brief flash. It is only on Channel 17-1 for me also.

I use a Samsung T151 set top box -- what about you?

Although I don't think it is the set top box, I think it is an issue with 17.

Eric

Eric, mine is a Samsung SIR-T165. I'm glad I'm not the only one seeing this!

I agree it appears to be some problem emanating from the 17-1 signal. I wonder if the station is aware of it?

Ah, well, as long as there doesn't seem to be a problem with my equipment or reception, I guess I'll try to wait until they figure out how to fix their HDTV broadcast.

I wonder if this defect can be seen by those who receive 17-1 via their cable connection?

WHPL-17.1 - I'm seeing the same problem on a Sony HD200. Has anyone tried to report it to them?

whpl-17.1 same flickering seen in atlantic county with samsung sir-t151.

does anyone actually receive WHPL-DT over their cable connection. does time warner carry them.....i know comcast doesn't?

ditto in Voorhees w/ Sony HD200

Joe

Originally posted by jcardani
ditto in Voorhees w/ Sony HD200

Joe

I also see it on my SIR-T165 and my Dish 6000 in Nazareth, PA.

Bob

Flickering on 17-1 here too in Northeast Philly on a Mits SR-HD5

Just got a Zenith HDV420 here in Hunterdon County, NJ..

I'm getting great reception of all channels with the "small" Radio Shack directional outdoor in a crawlspace.

The PBS channel shows up as "80-3" on my Zenith.. what station is this? WNJT?

Also.. I can also receive WCBS-DT and WNYW-DT out of NYC.. is there anyway besides a rotor that I can pick up both philly and nyc stations at the same time?

Originally posted by tfg32
Also.. I can also receive WCBS-DT and WNYW-DT out of NYC.. is there anyway besides a rotor that I can pick up both philly and nyc stations at the same time?

Two antennas?? ;)

Anybody else getting abnormally GOOD reception for WCAU last night? Got to watch ED without a single drop out. Signal strength was a whopping 50%! That's excellent for me.

Jim,

I live in Center City in a row house near 12th & Pine. I have never been able to receive analog broadcasts very well since I live in the "shadow" of Liberty 1&2. Can I expect any better from digital? Is their any way to discern my potential for a solid digital signal other than buying an actual set-top decoder?

Thanks,
Jeff

Jeff:

I'm not Jim, but I can shed some light on your situation. I live in a rowhouse not far from 20th and Pine and have had the same difficulty receiving clear over-the-air analog signals, even though I have a large rooftop antenna and a rotor. The multipath (signals bouncing off of the tall buildings) caused ghosting even on the best reception days.

After I upgraded my TV to an HDTV-ready monitor, I ordered a set-top box because I wanted to see the HDTV transmissions (and I've never been a fan of cable). This tuner is attached to the same rooftop antenna that was not able to overcome the messy analog signal we get in Center City.

I am really glad that I made the transition to digital. I still cannot receive WCAU for some reason (but I fully expect that I will be able to get this signal clearly at the end of January when they will move to their new broadcast tower and increase their signal strength). I get ALL of the local channels broadcasting coming from Northeast Philly strongly. With my rotor, if I point the direction to the East, I can also receive several New Jersey stations. I have had no luck receiving stations from New York City.

The HDTV broadcasts are wonderful, but to my pleasant surprise, even the "standard definition" digital broadcasts are MUCH MUCH clearer than I had ever imagined. I don't have cable or satellite myself, but I have seen it in other homes, and the digital OTA broadcasts are notably sharper than the best cable or satellite signals I have seen.

There is NO possibility of "ghosting" (the usual manifestation of multipath interference) with digital broadcasts. If there is something interfering with your signal, then the worst outcome is that your set-top box will not be able to lock into a signal at all. That has happened maybe two or three times since I installed the digital tuner, and sometimes I suspect the digital broadcast was maybe down temporarily (e.g., for maintenance on the broadcast tower as reported on the early pages of this thread). Other times, adjusting the antenna slightly has brought in the signal. Of course, I can always tune in to the analog broadcast as a backup.

For a digital signal, a "bad" or weak signal shows up as pixellation (I think I spelled that right) of your video image. I have occasionally seen that, but it is very occasionally and not often enough to be bothersome. I've reported here about a "flicker" in the WB17 HD signal, but you have probably read the earlier posts on that problem already.

Even if you don't have an HDTV-ready set, I recommend that it is very worthwhile getting a digital tuner if you don't want to go with cable or satellite. My tuner, for instance, has outputs for "regular TVs" such as component, S-video cable, or even composite. If you already have a rooftop antenna, a digital tuner may be the next logical step for you, in order to get a nice sharp over-the-air signal. Then you will be well positioned when you are ready to upgrade your TV set to an HDTV model. Some online dealers (such as Crutchfield.com) will even give you a 30-day no-questions-asked return.

Good luck and let us know what you end up doing!

I live in Florence, NJ (exit 52B on I-295) and with my cheap ass rca low profile antenna, i'm recieving nbc, abc, and cbs. HOLY ****

I e-mailed WB-17 about the "flicker" problem earlier this week and got a reply today. In my e-mail, I had provided a link to this thread and invited the recipient to address this issues directly if s/he chose to, and indicated that I would share an e-mail reply here if I got one.

I'm assuming this person is not going to post anything here, so I will post the reply. However, out of respect for the individual's privacy, I'm not going to include the name and e-mail address.

Here was the reply:

"Tim,

We do have a software upgrade for our encoder scheduled. It fixes
an EIA-798 captioning problem, and also a re-boot problem with some Samsung receivers. This is the first I have heard of this problem. I hope this will take care of your problem. We will keep an eye out for this, thank you for letting me know."

On wednesday I got good WCAU reception watching West Wing in the weird box :) and Leno in HD... Thursday nothing (was looking forward to ER)... I only slightly changed antenna location so I doubt it's me.. could any one tell me any more info about WCAU-DT..

also.. on wednesday I got a "80-3" which had an HD show about the history of Islam and Muslims today.. is this channel only on when PBS is broadcasting an HD show? (1-2 minutes after show was over the station went off air; thursday had no PBS HD show on)

I'd really appreciate any info on WCAU or this PBS channel (I'm only familiar with the NYC situation)

thanks

tfg32:

There seems to be a similar PBS signal in the D.C.-Baltimore area. See the following thread for more info:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=1635888#post1635888

I don't think you are receiving your signal from Annapolis, but it must be coming from another PBS station closer in. In what direction was your antenna pointed when you tuned in 80-3? If it was pointed in the direction of New Jersey, I would guess it was from one of the many NJN stations. Or maybe you ARE in New Jersey? (your member profile doesn't specify your location)

tfg32 and Philly Tim:

The station at 80-3 is the hidef channel from NJN station WNJT in Trenton. It appears that when they are not broadcasting hidef, the broadcasts are on 43-1. I don't think I've seen them both on at the same time. 80-3 usually broadcasts a HDTV demo program later in the evening. I'm also curious about the ID 80-3. I thought that the assigned channels for digital broadcasts stopped at 69. Any thoughts?

Channel 43-2 is also available. This appears to be a PBS channel. However, I don't know the schedule and I don't know whether the programming is the same as WHYY 12-1.

RayN

80-3 is likely WVIA-44 the PBS station Scranton. They are on UHF 41. I pick them up loud and clear here. They are 80-3 as they do not have their own encoder and simply pass through the PBS feed from Virginia. 80-3 is the designation for the PBS feed.

Originally posted by tfg32
On wednesday I got good WCAU reception watching West Wing in the weird box :) and Leno in HD... Thursday nothing (was looking forward to ER)... I only slightly changed antenna location so I doubt it's me.. could any one tell me any more info about WCAU-DT..

thanks

I had the same thing happen to me Wed. Night. Nothing after that (thur, Fri, Sat; nothing). I wish I knew what was causing this temporary reception, but I can't figure it out. The end of January can't come too fast. ;)

Calabs, it is probably due to atmospheric conditions. This can result in reception of very distant signals of both TV and radio signals. I have heard of reception of TV signals of a thousand miles due to this. Once in Boston I was able to pick up WYSP on my car radio with no static.

I think I've figured it out. RayN's comment about "80-3" being a pass through from WETA (VA/DC) makes sense. That 43-2 you are talking about is also either WNJT-DT. NJN's two live transmitters are on 43 and 51. During the day they multicast two shows (42-3 or 42-4) for WNJT or on WNJN (Montclair), they are on (51-3 or 51-4). They do the regular NJN feed on -3, and do learning shows on -4. At 8:00, 43 goes off the air and the WETA pass through goes live. This is when "80-3" shows up. I'm pretty sure I was getting WNJN Montclair because I get B]perfect[/B] analog reception of this channel, but it's probably on low power and I can only get it when it's cloudy :(

hopefully they will go higher power soon.

I think WNJT is broadcasting on 43.3 (SD main) and 43.4 (SD PBS-YOU) during the day. At night, they add 52.1 with the PBS demo loop.

I sent them an e-mail about setting the PSIP correctly for 43.3 and 43.4 (should be 52.3 and 52.4) but didn't get any reply.

Happy New Year to all the Philly-area digital TV fans. No, don't worry, I haven't been drinking (yet!). :D

Here are a few comments that might get the discussion started again in this thread.

1. Is it just me, or are channels 3-1 and 57-1 missing their PSIP data today? My digital tuner has remapped them to 26-1 and 32-1 (or whatever the real channel numbers are). Maybe someone needs to reboot something over at Fifth and Market. The signal is still coming in loud and clear, though!

2. The channel 17-1 flicker is still with us. I wonder when they will receive and install their new software? More importantly, I wonder if this will alleviate this problem?

3. I honestly don't understand WHYY. Tonight there was a wonderful "Live from Lincoln Center" broadcast that practically BEGGED to be simulcast on 12-1. OK, it was not an HDTV production, and it was not even broadcast in letter-boxed widescreen format (as indicated in TV Guide). But it WAS a great concert and I would have been very happy to have seen a better picture on 12-1 instead of another night of the HDTV demo loop. For those of you who watched this all-Gershwin concert, the soprano with the gorgeous voice, Indra Thomas, has a Philadelphia connection. She studied at the Academy of the Vocal Arts and just graduated a few years back. Anyone who had the pleasure of hearing her sing live at the AVA knows for sure that Indra will be world famous someday soon.

4. I honestly don't understand WHYY, part 2. After the "Live from Lincoln Center" broadcast, 12-0 showed a rerun of the Great Performances production of "Fosse." Now that WAS produced in HDTV. So why not simulcast THAT program on 12-1 in HDTV instead of the demo loop?

5. Isn't January 1 the start date for broadcast by the Camden-based NJN digital channel (WNJS)? I'm going to try to tune it in tomorrow, although I'll have to turn my antenna around and point it east for a change. I'm not sure whether the channel is 22 or something else. Does anyone else have any details? Also, does anyone know what their plans are for programming (i.e., will it be similar to WHYY and will they have subchannels?)?

Happy New Year to one and all,

--Philly Tim

Philly Tim,

Yes I noticed the change of channels for 3-1 and 57-1 ,had me confused.


Happy New Year

Thank's, Steve

Philly Tim,

1. I starting having problems with 3-1 yesterday - keep losing the signal. Today I get CBS on 26-1 and UPN on 32-1.
Now, does any one notice the picture size on UPN today? It looks like they are cutting it (to make it bigger - less of the black bars on the side).

5. I believe Channel 22 has push the start date to May 1st. I notice this on TitanTv.

Glad it's not just me re 3-1 and 57-1.

Thought my T150 went schizo.

Checked it out this morning and 3 and 57 still map to 3-1 and 57-1. They did change something at 57 and now are using a 14:9 picture put are zooming slightly as the very top and bottom of the picture are being cut off. 3-1 is the same as always.

26 and 32 here still. Noticed that yesterday afternoon.

Also noticed the flicker during Everwood the other night. I remember seeing something about that earlier on the forum but couldn't find the reference. PhillyTim - sounds like 17 is/was aware of it according to your post. Wonder if they still know! Did you have a contact?

I'm not getting 3-1 or 26-1.
Tried lastnight and now, also no 57-1 or 32-1.
I'm a little nervous with CBSs NFLHD next weekend.

jkurlanski:

The entire text of the e-mail I received was posted earlier in this thread (posted on 12-20). It looked to me as though the 17 engineer was not previously aware of this "flicker" problem, but he was hopeful that the new software upgrade for their encoder would solve it along with a problem they had with their signal rebooting certain Samsung tuners (mine is a Samsung and has never displayed this problem).

I contacted 17 via the e-mail address listed on their website and was pleasantly surprised to receive a reply within a few days from their head of broadcast engineering. If there is no visible change within a few weeks, I might write back and politely inquire again. Personally, I don't believe in hounding the stations, which I know are staffed with professionals who are very busy and who have a lot of conflicting demands on their time and attention. (You were not suggesting that anyone hound them, of course, but I was just airing my views on the best way to communicate with the staff of TV stations.)

Everyone:

A little while ago, I tuned to channel 32-1 and the mapping automatically switched back to 57-1 on my tuner. Channel 26-1 has not yet switched back to 3-1, but I'm sure it will soon. They must still be working on it over at 5th and Market.

Regarding the channel 57-1 new aspect ratio, I have no problem with it, although to my eye the zoomed-in picture looks softer than the previous full-frame version. It IS kind of nice to have minimized pillars on the left and right.

I noticed on a commercial that some of the text information at the top and bottom of the screen was visibly cut off. How can I mail in for them Ginzu knives (or whatever they were) if I cannot read the ad copy? Heh heh. Seriously, advertisers might reasonably object if it comes to their attention that their ads are being cropped top and bottom.

While I'm writing and ranting, the Rose Bowl parade was indicated on TitanTV.com as High-Definition, but it is definitely not widescreen. I thought all high-definition programming was necessarily widescreen? To my eye it looks like very sharp standard-definition. What are we REALLY seeing? I did not notice any "presented in high-definition" banner at the beginning of the broadcast. (I'm talking about 26-1/3-1 [CBS] and 6-1 [ABC] since I cannot tune in the NBC digital broadcast until they go full power at their new location.)

Thanks Philly Tim - I knew I had seen a reference to the problem before but couldn't remember where. Just had to page back a few days! Just got my OTA receiver so I've been reading a lot of old posts lately. I'm with you on the hounding..wasn't sure how long ago it was that the problem was noticed, but if was only a few days it certainly worth letting them work it out. Could also be a problem with the national feed, right?
I didn't find the Rose Bowl in HD (I'm pretty sure it must be in 16x9 to be HD) so I think we got stuck. From the Rose Bowl thread there was mention that the local affiliate had to be Tribune Broadcasting owned to get the feed . I'm just guessing that we were SOL because of that for OTA.
Also, the 3-1 and 57-1 just remapped for me a few minutes ago. I'm back to the Comcast feed now though because I'm having minor problems with rain and the ABC OTA. Got to watch that Penn State game!

Originally posted by jkurlanski
Thanks Philly Tim...I didn't find the Rose Bowl in HD (I'm pretty sure it must be in 16x9 to be HD) so I think we got stuck. From the Rose Bowl thread there was mention that the local affiliate had to be Tribune Broadcasting owned to get the feed . I'm just guessing that we were SOL because of that for OTA.

Isn't WPHL a Tribune affiliate? I assume since they thought they were going to do the Mummers that they didn't bother with the Rose parade. It sure would have been a nice backup to the rained out Mummers.

BrentHD. You are correct (www.tribune.com) I was thinking they were a Viacom stn, but thats UPN 57. Got my locals mixed up! And you're probably right about the Mummers too.
Think WB has an HD trunk available to do the Mummers in HD on Saturday? Would we really want that? :-)

And I stumbled across something else of interest at wb17.trb.com:

"WB17 is now available on DirecTV channel 906 and Dish Network channel 8154. Select programming from The WB also airs in digital, high definition format on channel 54."

I think (again..lots of old posts I've been reading lately) that there was a complaint about WB programming info not making it to DirecTV and/or Dish? Does this mean its resolved for you guys/gals? Or is this old news/irrelevant/does not apply? Search engine is disabled right now....

A question for those of you who have a choice of OTA and cable feeds for receiving the digital channels:

Is there a noticeable difference in picture quality between the same digital channel received OTA versus the same channel coming over your cable?

If I understand it correctly, the cable company has the option of compressing the digital channel signal somewhat, so I was wondering if that resulted in a visible difference in PQ. Since I only have an OTA tuner, I can't do the comparison myself.

If there IS no difference in PQ, then why bother with OTA at all? Inquiring minds want to know.

I haven't noticed any difference in PQ. Sometimes I'll lose signal due to the weather though.
The reason I finally went OTA is because is got tired of waiting for Comcast to pick up CBS (or is it CBS to pick up Comcast?), and folks on the forum were getting tired of hearing me rant about it. :) The only locals Comcast have are ABC, NBC, and WHYY. Now I can get CBS, FOX, UPN and the WB too.
For non-OTA, Comcast offers me HBO-HD (Showtime-HD if I cared for it), and the rumours are abound about a major annoucement concerning Comcast Sportsnet-HD, HDNet, Discovery-HD, and ESPN-HD. Should hear something in January, and that would pretty much give me all the available HD programming at this time. Not a bad deal.

Originally posted by Philly Tim
A question for those of you who have a choice of OTA and cable feeds for receiving the digital channels:

Is there a noticeable difference in picture quality between the same digital channel received OTA versus the same channel coming over your cable?

If I understand it correctly, the cable company has the option of compressing the digital channel signal somewhat, so I was wondering if that resulted in a visible difference in PQ. Since I only have an OTA tuner, I can't do the comparison myself.

If there IS no difference in PQ, then why bother with OTA at all? Inquiring minds want to know.

The reason to use OTA HDTV over cable HDTV (in Philly), is that Comcast does NOT carry CBS or FOX or UPN or WB (the digital variety). Now of those channels, only CBS broadcasts alot of content in HDTV. FOX has the widescreen football too.

If you have Comcast right now for HDTV (and no over the air), you will not see the AFC playoffs in HDTV (not to mention CSI). You will also not see the FOX widescreen 480p broadcasts of NFL playoffs (while not HDTV, still better than regular cable FOX).

So right now, you can get a lot more digital channels over the air, then via Comcast cable (not including premium movie channels like HBO and Showtime). Comcast may soon carry CBS (been negotiating for over a year, but they are never going to carry FOX).

As far as picture quality, I noticed a lot more pixelation on WHYY-DT at my relative's house that gets HDTV via Comcast. I did not have nearly as much pixelation on the same content at my house (via over the air). Otherwise it is pretty close. My guess is it will always be best via over the air and you can't gain anything via cable, but you can lose something.

Having said all that, we probably will all be getting our HDTV via cable in a few years (rather than over the air), once the cable companies carry all of the local digital channels, plus ESPN HDTV and other cable only channels that we can never receive over the air (Discovery, etc.).

Until then, over the air is best for now (at least in Philly -- the home city of Comcast Corp. -- ironically).

Originally posted by caesar1
Comcast may soon carry CBS (been negotiating for over a year, but they are never going to carry FOX).


Never's a mightly long time. :) I think FOX is on the outs as long as they're only 480p. Although I think that it is better than the analog feed (I'll watch this weekends NFC games OTA rather than the analog on Comcast), I've also got to side with Comcast here: Fox should go 1080i or 720p first before they bother with it.

What are the chances that Comcast is going to bundle the new HD channels( SportsChannel, Espn, HDnet and Discovery) and charge customers a monthly fee to see them? These channels aren't free, DiscoveryHD charges @7 bucks a month on Dishnet. These are not OTA channels and Comcast is not known for it's charity.

There's another thread here about HDNet and a big announcement on 1/15 about being carried on a MAJOR Cable station. I'm crossing my fingers. However, I know that Comcast Sportsnet HD is coming in February (last I heard). I know that WB is HD, too, so I don't know when that is coming. However, last time I talked to the HD dept at comcast, they had big plans and stars in their eyes about how much HD they were going to have. I think that the merger initial put a damper on their expansion of the HD stations. However, now that the merger is settled and they have expanded their "network" hopefully now they'll concentrate on the HD additions (as we are their High-end customers). We'll see.

As I said, I'm not holding my breath. But I'm wishing for WB (and hopefully Angel in HD some day), and CBS so I can see CSI in HD finally. However, I hope for the HDNets, too, as I think that HDNet is going to have a lot of stations to offer us.

THat is exactly what they will be doing, bundling those channges onto a second tier with a monthly fee. I am hoping it will be about $9.95 a month. While Discovery HD is $7.95 on Dish, Charter Cable has it for $4.00 a month and given Comcast's new size, you can expect that to be knocked down to $3.00 per subscriber, perhaps even less. ESPN-HD will be charging aroud $3.00 a subscriber also.

Doesn't discovery hd show a constant loop of 3 or 4 shows for a 24 hr period? I wouldn't pay 7 for that.

Discovery's HD programming is being expanded significantly this year.

I watched James Cameron's Bismark on "regular" Discovery on Dish Network, (which was good), and then also watched it on Discovery HD Theater. WOW!!! There's just no comparison. Until now, they haven't really "simulcast" any of the same programs on both channels. This was an excellent example to compare analog/digital and HD with the exact same program material.

It's definitely worth the $7/mo!!!

Hmm. But what if you had to pay 7 dollars for every network channel. 7+7+7+7+7. after 5 channels you have reached a standard cable bill (at least mine before i went satellite). Maybe i'm being cheap but oh well. I hate comcast from when they downgraded my cable internet. I will never buy another service from them again unless i can screw them over.

I dropped Comcast last April due to poor customer service, I get HD OTA but if the price was right (under $10), I might come back. I miss Comcast Sports Channel and to watch the Sillies in HD, it might just be worth it. I'm going to wait and see. The nice thing about this forum is, if it's a bad deal, you'll find out quick.

why has 57 changed the aspect ratio?

didnt we just go thru that with 17?

17 finally went to the regular aspect ratio.

i'm watching the flyers king's game thursday night and i can not see the bottom and more importantly the top, were the scoreboard is.

this is a joke.

why would they decide it's a good idea to chop off the top and bottom to essen the side bars.

bars are still there so isnt it pointless.

and the image is tons softer due to it being blown up this big.

Originally posted by Philly Tim
I e-mailed WB-17 about the "flicker" problem earlier this week and got a reply today. In my e-mail, I had provided a link to this thread and invited the recipient to address this issues directly if s/he chose to, and indicated that I would share an e-mail reply here if I got one.

I'm assuming this person is not going to post anything here, so I will post the reply. However, out of respect for the individual's privacy, I'm not going to include the name and e-mail address.

Here was the reply:

"Tim,

We do have a software upgrade for our encoder scheduled. It fixes
an EIA-798 captioning problem, and also a re-boot problem with some Samsung receivers. This is the first I have heard of this problem. I hope this will take care of your problem. We will keep an eye out for this, thank you for letting me know."

ok it has been about 1 month for this flicker and i still see it. when will they do the upgrade?

how can they be unaware of a problem like that?
don't these people actually watch the channel in hd at home?

First - I'm having some serious problems getting the game in...reception has been hit and miss, while I'm getting everything in OK.
Second - as Whotony observered: whats going on with the aspect ratio? Missing a bit off the top for awhile (the old 14x9), then they switched it to straight 4x3 for commercials (so I thought) but when it went back to the game it was still 4x3, but the top was lopped off! Like they framed the 14x9 (?is that what it is?) in a 4x3 or something. Whats going on?
WhoTony - you picking it up okay? Its all over the place here.

picking it up no problem in Feasteville.

it was on fine except it looks fuzzy do to being zoomed to 14x9.
or converted or something.

I sent this e-mail to upn57@wpsg.com today:

Dear WPSG:

Recently, you seem to have changed the aspect ratio for your HDTV broadcast. I'm guessing that your aim was to use the full screen.

Unfortunately, your change cuts off the top and bottom of the screen. Last night's Flyers game showed the scoreboard cut off and unreadable.

Please reverse this change. Most 16:9 TV sets allow the user to use zoom and stretch modes to produce the same effect if the viewer desires it. If you broadcast 4:3 material in 4:3 (or streched in 14:9 like channel 6), the entire picture is provided to the viewer. However, if you cut the picture off at the encoder, there is no way for a viewer who wants to see the entire picture to recover it. I personally have a 16:9 TV and prefer to watch 4:3 material in the original 4:3 aspect ratio.

WPHL 17 originally made the same change, and after many complaints changed back to 14:9. I would suggest that you do the same.

I use a Sony HD200 receiver with a Sony 34XBR800 television, should that information help you.

Sincerely,

Mark Smith
[address deleted]

Thanks for the feedback everyone. Reception must've been me then and the weather. I was getting everything else just fine, so I was beginning to think something was wrong at their end. Time to get a "real" antenna since I get them fine when the weather cooperates. Will check again when UPN carries the Bruins game at the end of the month.
Great email msmith. The stretched aspect ratio is tolerable, but I think it preferred to leave 4x3 at 4x3 (as was beaten to death with PHL!)

Originally posted by MSmith
I sent this e-mail to upn57@wpsg.com today:

Dear WPSG:

Recently, you seem to have changed the aspect ratio for your HDTV broadcast. I'm guessing that your aim was to use the full screen.

Unfortunately, your change cuts off the top and bottom of the screen. Last night's Flyers game showed the scoreboard cut off and unreadable.

Please reverse this change. Most 16:9 TV sets allow the user to use zoom and stretch modes to produce the same effect if the viewer desires it. If you broadcast 4:3 material in 4:3 (or streched in 14:9 like channel 6), the entire picture is provided to the viewer. However, if you cut the picture off at the encoder, there is no way for a viewer who wants to see the entire picture to recover it. I personally have a 16:9 TV and prefer to watch 4:3 material in the original 4:3 aspect ratio.

WPHL 17 originally made the same change, and after many complaints changed back to 14:9. I would suggest that you do the same.

I use a Sony HD200 receiver with a Sony 34XBR800 television, should that information help you.

Sincerely,

Mark Smith
[address deleted]


"WPHL 17 originally made the same change, and after many complaints changed back to 14:9. I would suggest that you do the same."

actually didnt wphl change from 14x9 to the proper 4x3 after some complaints of the pick being 14x9 and cutting off the top and bootom.

if that is the email you sent i think you may be confusing it even more.

WPHL was originally using 4:3 zoomed to 16:9, with lots cut off of the top and bottom. They switched to 14:9 which is stretched a little horizontally, but has the same height vertically as 4:3. It's a compromise between filling the screen completely and no distortion. It works well because the overscan on the left and right helps fill the edges (thus, the logos and graphics aren't usually at the extreme left and right of the picture).

i understand what you are syaing mark but 17 didnt switch "back" to a stretched 14x9 image it went to a standard 4x3 image with normal bars on the side for 4x3 material.

Looks like Comcast in Philadelphia is no longer charging $10.95 per month for their HD channels. Now that they have integrated their digital and HD boxes into one box, all you pay for is digital cable and a $18 service charge to hook it up. Although they only offer ABC, NBC, PBS, HBO and Showtime, I will be able to add HBO and Comcast Sportsnet (as of Feb) with my OTA HD, with the hope that ESPNHD is added to their lineup in April.

Anyone else have problems with ABC OTA today with the football games? I never have any glitches with ABC and today there were too many to watch the games OTA. I am in King of Prussia area.

HDTV4 All,

I watched the first half of Packers-Falcons game before losing interest. Didn't notice anything unusual with the broadcast - no pixelation, no flickering, no dropouts. Signal appeared rock solid. I'm located in north Wilmington.

Ch. 6 was solid, as usual.

Absolutely beautiful picture for non-HD.

Solid Picture, here in Feasterville, PA.

I had some reception problems with ABC as well. Switched over to Comcast to watch it. I don't have a robust antenna though, and generally have issues when its raining.

Have to give it up to Fox... they broadcasted the Giants, 49ers game in widescreen Thanks !!!!! Even if only at 480p..

Great game, even though we aren't watching it in Widescreen OTA. :)

Yea its nice to at least we get the Widescreen but its still only marginally better than the normal DirecTV satellite feed. Can't wait for next weekend and the CBS 1080i broadcasts.

I'm kind of upset however as my son has his first basketball game next Saturday at 4:45 and the Steelers-Titans come on at 4:30. Oh well at least I have UltimateTV just won't get to see it in HD. UGH!

GO STEELERS - WHAT A GAME WHAT A COMEBACK.

Go Eagles.

I thought it looked pretty good.. much better than my DISH feed. Can't wait till next week... I wish all stations broadcasted in widescreen on their digital feeds.

I've been off the tread for a while. Has anyone heard any updates on NBC moving to the new tower? Is it still the end of this month? :)

Originally posted by Calabs
I've been off the tread for a while. Has anyone heard any updates on NBC moving to the new tower? Is it still the end of this month? :)

Last we heard, yes. But that will probably change when the end of the month comes.

Unless my eyes are deceiving me, looks like the good folks at 57-1 have abandoned the zoomed-in picture for 4:3 program material. I don't know when the change back happened, since I've not watched much TV in recent days.

I don't fault them for trying it out, since it is a good thing to try out different techniques and presentations from time to time. I am sure that the intention was to make the viewing experience more pleasurable for the digital broadcast viewers, who are generally watching on widescreen TV sets (or HD-capable 4:3 sets with letterboxing). The zoomed-in picture (with a bit of top and bottom cut off) looked okay to me, but it was noticeably a bit softer than the "unzoomed" image. I've gotten used to the black bars, so I don't mind them.

I don't know how much say their chief broadcast engineer Jim Chase had in these decisions (I assume he plays a major role, but there are no doubt other people involved), but from his previous visits to this forum and thread, he is obviously fully committed to quality broadcasting. Perhaps some of the comments made on this thread (and via e-mails) provide some useful feedback on what the viewing consumers prefer in the way of aspect ratios. It's good that they try out something different, but even better when they take the consumer's preferences into consideration.

On another note, it looks like channel 6-1 is missing its PSIP signal today, since my tuner remapped it to the "real" channel. No doubt this will be noticed and fixed soon. If I recall correctly, when 3-1 and 57-1 had an apparent PSIP problem over the holidays, it was fixed within 24 hours. (In my imagination, Jim Chase was taking a few days off and letting the other engineers run the show. He probably sat down with a beer to watch a little digital TV and . . . . "Wha' th'?" . . . ended up running to the phone to call the engineering department. Heh heh.)

Hey, Jim, if you are reading this, please tell your new News Anchor Marc Howard to be more careful when he's jogging around Center City. He almost knocked me over a few months back when he zoomed around a corner. I'm no spring chicken myself, but I could STILL take him out!! (Just a joke. No need to call the police and ask for a restraining order.)

--Philly Tim

Is Fox, transmitting everything in widescreen? I have to applaud them for them if it's true, wish everyone else would do the same.

Is Fox, transmitting everything in widescreen? I have to applaud them for them if it's true, wish everyone else would do the same.

NOpe, the simpsons aren't in widescreen

Is it just me or was the WB17 flicker worse tonight during Smallville? Seemed like it was happening more frequently, and for a fraction of a second longer.

I sent an email to the wb17feedback@tribune.com address on their website. Will let y'all know if I hear anything...

yes i saw that too.

The WB flicker was worse on Monday night during Everwood as well.

Anyone live in florence, bordentown, or fieldsboro,(new jersey) and can recieve nbc 10? wcau-dt?

Philly Tim
I really enjoyed your post but need to set the record straight on the aspect ratio and psip issues. You were close on some of your suppositions about how these decisions are made but let me elaborate.
We had a massive power failure about 4:20pm New Years Eve. Lost both P.E. lines. The generators started and KYW was back on the air in seconds. WPSG had no audio for about 15 minutes caused by a tray of audio DA's being inadvertantly pluged into normal power.
At this time most of the KYW-DT and WPSG-DT equipment is not on emergency power. I'm sure you can imagine that most of our technical effort went into getting KYW back up for a news program scheduled at 5:00pm. With KYW and WPSG back up we checked out the digital stations and left to enjoy the holiday.
Now fast forward a couple days and I am just getting comfortable at home ( you were pretty close except it was a diet coke ) and fire up the computer to check the AVS forum. Search on KYW and WPSG and find the thread about the loss of PSIP mapping. OH crap, didn't check the PSIP computers. Can't remember if they are on emergency power. Call the station and get the maint. tech. to check them out. Good, now we have the correct PSIP mapping back. I read on and stumble on the 14x9 vs. 4x3 discussion. OH crap, the upconverter must be screwed up. I hate that Rhode & Schwartz upconverter. Another call and we're back to 4x3 on WPSG-TV. Gotta be more carefull with this stuff next time the power goes off.
Regarding the aspect ratio issue. There is no controversy at KYW, or CBS for that matter. I consider the alteration of the original aspect ratio nothing more than picture distortion which is avoided at all cost. You will never see that on my stations. The deviation from the 4x3 aspect ratio on WPSG was caused by a very unusual set of circumstances. Stuff like that doesn't happen to me twice!!!
If you ever notice any abnormal operation on either station please e-mail me right away.
Marc Howard's new office is just two doors down the hall from mine so I'll watch out for him running down the hall!!!!
CUL Jim


James M. Chase
Director Broadcast Operations & Engineering
KYW-TV / WPSG-TV
101 South Independence Mall East
Philadelphia PA, 19106
chase@kyw.com

I never thought I'd laugh out loud reading this forum. I stand corrected. Very corrected.
Jim Chase- Thanks for participating! Its a comfort to know that when we notice (ahem, complain about) things, sometimes we are heard. :)

jim thanks for coming by and setting it straight.

any way we could convince channel 6 and 29 to go to a more natural 4x3 ratio. they still seem to be alittle bigger in the image then the other channels.
smaller bars on the sides that is.

Jim,

Thanks for fixing things and stating your policies. Other stations have been less open on their HDTV decisions, and that causes us to believe that we are not being listened to.

I empathize with your vacation interruption problems. Twice between Christmas and New Year's I had to go into work to fix IT problems, even though I was on vacation and someone was supposedly covering for me. It's just a hazard of the job.

On another issue with a different station - Flicker on WPHL was better, but still present, during Birds of Prey last night.

And snoop - I live in Hamilton near the I-195 I-295 intersection. I'm getting WCAU-DT on a silver sensor indoor antenna with a Sony HD200 receiver. The strength is on the border between "Normal" and "High" on my receiver.

After lurking here and on a couple of other forums for about a year and
a half now, I finally got an HD set. My Mitsubishi WS-65511 (built-in
tuner) came today. I'm waiting for UPS to bring my Silver Sensor
antenna so I can decide if I should put up the Channel Master 4228 8
bay bowtie that the dealer gave me with the TV. I'm located in
Harleysville which is near Lansdale and the 1st exit of the NE
extension of the PA Turnpike.

I found that with a cheap set of Radio Shack rabbit ears that were in
the basement that I could pretty easily pull in KYW DT (3-1), WPVI DT
(64-1) and WPHL DT (17-1) with it pointed around 170 degrees. If I mess
with the antenna placement, I can get WTXF DT (29-1) but usually at the
cost of 6-1. I can't get WCAU DT (10-1) or WHYY DT (12-1) for anything.

Here's are my questions. What should I expect from the Silver Sensor
vs. the Radio Shack antenna? If I put the Channel Master in the attic
how much better will I fair? Is there anybody else near here with some
experience they can share? Should I be thinking about a Channel Master
UHF amp with the Silver Sensor?

You guys all seem to have a good amount of experience and I'm hoping to
leverage some of it. Thanks! Feel free to e-mail me off the board.

Cheers,
Dave

Jim Chase:

Thanks for telling us all about the aftermath of your unfortunate power failure. What a nightmare! I shudder to think of all the different pieces of equipment that must be checked and reconfigured after a power disruption in your facility. I grumble even though I only have to reset the alarm clock and those infernal digital clocks in the kitchen appliances after a power outage (my VCR sets its own time automatically from the PBS time signal, thank God!).

It never occurred to me that these problems could have all been the result of one problem. It's great to have this forum so that we can be enlightened and more understanding consumers.

Around the same time as the PSIP and aspect ratio problems, I also had noticed that the volume level output from 3-1 was noticeably higher than before. In fact it was much louder than the other digital channels, which all seem to output approximately the same volume levels (except ABC 6-1, which seems to my ear noticeably lower in volume than the other digital broadcasts). Perhaps 3-1's louder volume was also an aftereffect of the power outage: did your digital equipment revert to some default volume level, which happens to be louder than the level that you would normally choose to send out? I've noticed that since then, 3-1's volume has dropped back to the norm and is sounding good.

I'm glad you are still monitoring this thread, Jim. We'll be sure to keep you on your toes!

===========

DigitHead:

If you are getting useable signals using rabbit ears, it would seem to me that you are in good position to receive all of the local channels using either of those antennas. If you don't get NBC WCAU (10-1), you may have noticed elsewhere on this thread that they are moving soon to a new tower and will be broadcasting at higher power, possibly as soon as the end of January. I can't get 10-1 either (in Center City Philadelphia). WHYY 12-1's signal comes in here, but there is noticeable pixellization (if that's how it's spelled) in some of the HD broadcasts. I don't know if there are any planned changes to WHYY's broadcast specificiations. (They DO split their digital bandwidth into 12-1 and 12-4, so I would speculate that the 12-4 subchannel would affect the amount of available data in the 12-1 broadcast stream, which may affect reception.)

If it were me, I'd go ahead and install the UHF antenna in the attic (and, if there is room, include a rotor so that the antenna can be repositioned remotely in case you ever want to pick up a New Jersey station or point north toward Allentown for any reason). That way, in times of inclement weather, you would have the best chance of keeping a strong signal through all of the interference. Also, a hidden-away antenna is generally better for the home decor, I would think. A UHF amp could always be added later to either antenna if needed.

Welcome to the Philly thread and congratulations on your new TV!!

--Philly Tim

I second the volume issue with KYW-DT. It is always louder than the other stations.

I use a Samsung T151 set top box for over the air HDTV reception. I have an optical cable connection from the T151 to my AV/Receiver.

Originally posted by DigitHead
I'm located in
Harleysville which is near Lansdale and the 1st exit of the NE
extension of the PA Turnpike.

Hey Dave,

Welcome to the Forum from another Harleysville person. I recently moved into a new development near RT 113 and Landis roads. I purchased the CM4228 when we lived in a North Wales townhouse knowing I would put it in the attic of the new place. We receive CBS (3), ABC (6), UPN (57) and WB (17) all at roughly 100% on our Toshiba DST-3000. Fox comes in without a breakup around 60-70%. I don't have my antenna on a rotator, but if I point it at NBC (10) I get a good signal, 90 - 100%. I've decided to leave the antenna pointed at Roxboro (where most of the antennas are located) and will wait until NBC moves to the new antenna instead of trying to use a rotator. I could never get WHYY (12)

Enjoy your new 65" Mitsu! I'd love to upgrade my 42" Toshiba, but a new house, new boat and a baby due in a few months killed any idea of any other purchases. In fact, let me know if you're in the market for a barely used 2002 31' Formula Performance Cruiser! I'll give you a good deal! :)

Just in case I hit the lottery, where did you buy the set?

Keep in touch.

Rob

You know it's wierd. I live even farther out than you, (Sumneytown) and I get all channels. Have the big channel master 60 mile antenna in the attic with the preamp. I get 26,32,42,54,55,62,64,67 all perfectly. I was really surprised that I got 55 (WHYY) after what I read here, but it comes in at about an 80 signal strenght. So does 67 (NBC). The house sits pretty high up, so I'm sure that that has something to do with my good reception. I guess I should be thankful. I have the RCA f38310.

I am extremely impressed that Jim Chase at KYW takes the time to keep all of us in the loop. Thanks Jim!

So that being the case maybe Jim can answere another question. Rumor has that CBS will broadcast the remaining AFC playoff games in Letterbox on the their analog SD broadcasts? Is this this true. I'll be able to get them in HD but I want to record them on my ultimate TV so letterbox would be preferable so I am hoping it is true.

Thanks!

Originally posted by rgc101
You know it's wierd. I live even farther out than you, (Sumneytown) and I get all channels. Have the big channel master 60 mile antenna in the attic with the preamp. I get 26,32,42,54,55,62,64,67 all perfectly. I was really surprised that I got 55 (WHYY) after what I read here, but it comes in at about an 80 signal strenght. So does 67 (NBC). The house sits pretty high up, so I'm sure that that has something to do with my good reception. I guess I should be thankful. I have the RCA f38310.

Until recently, I never knew there was a Sumneytown at the end of Sumneytown Pike! :)

Having the house sit up high is definitely a bonus. I'm sure the preamp helps a bit too. I'm waiting to see what NBC looks like after the move before I pick up a preamp.

Rob

Baeverly
All remaining playoff games will be broadcast in HD on KYW-DT. Pittsburgh @ Tennessee tomorrow at 4:30pm and Jets @ Oakland on Sunday @ 4:30pm are on the schedules I have available at this time.
There will be one production, in Hi Def. Most of the cameras will be HD with some SD cameras mixed in. The truck will have a down converter for the SD feed and graphics will be added to each feed individually. There will be separate HD and SD feeds to TOC in NY. The pregame and half time shows will be upconverted SD.
This will be the first year I can remember that we have actually sold some HD commercials. They are Mitsubishi spots with local dealer tags on the end. They guys are downstairs busily dubbing them into our Pluto Hi Def. server right now. Should be interesting.
I also hear through the CBS grape vine ( one hell of a vine that stretches from NY to my office ) that the March Madness games starting 3 weeks before the final 4, and the final 4 will all be in Hi Def.
CUL Jim

Jim,

This is absolutely great !!!!! I feel like I am getting spoiled rotten, and I love it , I love it.....

Franzius

In Cherry Hill, NJ I have a DTC-100. The antenna I use is the Radio Shack equivalent of the Terk FMPRO. (Radio Shack doesn't sell it anymore).

I get the following signal strengths:

KYW 26 - 86%
WPVI 42 - 82%
WCAU 67 - 25%
WHYY 55 - 76%
WPHL 54 - 82%
WTXF 42 - 64%
UPN 32 - 75%


So, my only beef is with WCAU. Didn't they move to the new tower on 11/30? My signal has ALWAYS been 25% with them. Sometimes in the low 30's. So, I get nothing 90% of the time.

My antenna is mounted in the attic of our condo at the highest point (about 40 feet up). I can't mount outside due to condo bylaws (even though I can put a dish on the balcony).

Since most of the signals are acceptable, I have to believe that perhaps WCAU isn't pushing all the juice yet. Any updates? Or - is there perhaps a better antenna I could get. But if I'm getting all the other stations at decent levels, why would another antenna help me get WCAU any better?

I hooked the u-75r antenna up from radio shack and get wcau fine now. Its a UHF antenna only but i'm geting a lot of analog channels.

WPVI-DT has been showing just the 6 ABC logo along with an audio test tone. Does anybody know what happened? I hope this doesn't occur during the Super Bowl.

Originally posted by BrentHD
WPVI-DT has just shown the 6 ABC logo along with an audio test tone. Does anybody know what happened? I hope this doesn't occur during the Super Bowl.

I hope not either. I'm having a TON of people over.

Anyone?

Oh, i just got abc during the local hours and assumed it was normal. that is bad news.


Did anyone get any drop outs from the steelers titans game tonight? I get about 1 every 20 mins. Just installed a new antenna and was curious if its my reciever/antenna.

Guys,

stupid question. Is fox transmitting in HD???
I'm getting teh eagle/falcon at 16:9 but not HD.
I'm on channel 29-1. Is there another channel or its just not
being transmitted??

thx aceman

fox doesnt broadcast in hd just 480p which isnt considered true hd.

Originally posted by Aceman
Guys,

stupid question. Is fox transmitting in HD???
I'm getting teh eagle/falcon at 16:9 but not HD.
I'm on channel 29-1. Is there another channel or its just not
being transmitted??

thx aceman

29-1 is the correct channel for WTXF-DT

It is a digital signal, 16x9 480P for the football... it is not true HD, but it's the nearest you're gonna get to it from FOX for the forseeable future

Try searching the HD programming forum for FAUX to see how hot under the collar some people around here can get about htis particular subject.

Me... I just enjoyed the game :)

Go EAGLES!!

Guys, I just wanted to give you an update from Harleysville. I got my Silver Sensor and I'm now getting ALL the Philly digital broadcasts. 12-1 is a little flaky as I get frequent audio/video dropouts. Otherwise, it's great. Wow, the CBS playoff game yesterday looked great! Too bad the Birds were on Fox. I can't wait to see the Oakland/NY game today! Thanks for all your replies!

Dave

I too use the Silver Sensor and get all the local HD channels with it with no problem (Most Days). I am right on the PA/DE Line West of 95.

Thoroughly enjoying the CBS broadcast of football. Just wish the Stillers would have pulled it out. No dropouts though just stunning pictures and I even notice an upgrade in sound quality. Looking forward to the 4:30 game today.

Too bad Faux doesn't do HD but at least the 16:9 is nice. Faux looks good until you see the CBS football broadcasts, what a difference!

I noticed yesterday that WB 17-1 has added ACTUAL PROGRAM CONTENT to its PSIP data. On my Samsung tuner, if you press the "guide" button on the remote, the program information for 17-1 now reflects the actual programming.

Tis a small thing, perhaps, and I'm sure that all of the local digital channels will get there eventually, but 17-1 reached the goal first!

=========

baeverly (interesting name! Reminds me of "Beverly" -- are you a guy or a gal?):

I agree with you about the FOX football broadcast. It would probably look really great, if it wasn't for CBS showing us all the way it SHOULD look!

Thank you, CBS! And thanks to Jim Chase and the good people at KYW who work so hard to pass through such a glorious picture!

I enjoyed the first HD commercial immensely, Jim! The picture quality was stunning, but I'm afraid I cannot recall what product was being advertised! (Don't tell your marketing staff that!)

Naw, just kidding. It was for Mitsubishi HDTVs (yawn! I have a Sony!), and the featured performer was Joe Montana. Or Joe Thiesman. Or some other Joe Football personality. LOL!

--Philly Tim (looking forward to the next Eagles game on CBS, even though he's not really a football fan. What time is the game next Sunday?)

"I noticed yesterday that WB 17-1 has added ACTUAL PROGRAM CONTENT to its PSIP data. On my Samsung tuner, if you press the "guide" button on the remote, the program information for 17-1 now reflects the actual programming"

PhillyTim - think that is an indication that WB17 has performed their software upgrade? I'm seeing ratings info now on my Zenith. If so, its bad news, because I just checked in on the Smallville rerun tonight (half-time on CBS! :-) and that filcker is still there....bad as ever. Never heard back from the email I sent them either. Too bad.

I'm a GUY!:D

baeverly are just initials. I should have been more creative.

It's to bad the Eagles are not on CBS all the NFC games are on FOX. We won't get the Eagles in HD until the SuperBowl on ABC.

I also noticed the PSIP Guide data on 17.1, I can't believe the WB is the first to use this, how hard can it be?????:confused:

Just got a email alert from WHYY that they've been asked by the owner of the tower to go offline midnight til 5 am. ... My question is - who is the owner of the tower and what work is underway... By the way, WHYY does a really good job keeping their dtv viewers advised via email. Sure wish other stations would follow suit - or at least post info on their web sites ...

Originally posted by baeverly
I'm a GUY!:D

baeverly are just initials. I should have been more creative.

It's to bad the Eagles are not on CBS all the NFC games are on FOX. We won't get the Eagles in HD until the SuperBowl on ABC.

I also noticed the PSIP Guide data on 17.1, I can't believe the WB is the first to use this, how hard can it be?????:confused:

Did anyone else notice the Guide data on CBS tonight? Jim is the man, ask and you shall receive!

How do you get on the mailing list for WHYY HD viewers?

Also, WPHL was a mess last night. For a while, they were sending a green box that took up the upper left quarter of the screen, and it randomly broke down into gibberish. Later, we had the flickers back worse than before.

And last, on my Sony HD200 I'm getting the guide info from DirecTV, so all I'm getting on 17.1 is the rating now.

Hello all,

I am moving into a new house in New Castle Delaware on the 17th and was wondering what type of signal strength for OTA I can expect. I have comcast setting up digital cable with HD package but was also interested in an antenna. If an outside antenna would be necessary or would indoor be fine. Does anyone know of a good antenna installtion company?

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

This is my first attempt at HD since I now have the room and was able to purchase a new tv. I have been reading these forums for awhile and have really learned a lot.

Thanks in advance.

Marc

MSmith -

I get email info from WHYY and the return address is:

"Dianne Chenault" <dchenault@whyy.org>

Perhaps she can add you to her email list for WHYY Digital TV updates.

constabl,

You should be able to work out OTA with a decent antenna. New Castle, DE is about 40 miles from the Roxborough towers. I'm located in North Wilmington about 25 miles from the towers, and I currently get all the Phila channels with a small multi-directional antenna which is chimney mounted. You'll probably need a little more antenna, but nothing out of the ordinary. Don't have any recommendations for you regarding antenna installers. I ended up installing my own. When I put it up a few years ago, I made some contacts via the yellow pages ... everybody I contacted then knew next to nothing about digital TV. Perhaps now it's different. I ended up installing a Channelmaster 3221 4-bay bow tie antenna. Used their website for locating a dealer in the area which turned out to be Philadelphia. Good luck..

I noticed others posting to this thread mentioning that they are receiving PSIP data from various channels. So far all I'm getting are the channel call letters and numbers - no info yet on schedule, program titles or program descriptions. Are the stations really starting to pass PSIP program information? Does receipt of this info depend on age/type of receiver? Is this data real PSIP data or is it guide info passed by Comcast or DirecTV? thanks...

WPHL-WB17 was UGGGLLLYYY tonight. Started out okay, but sometime during the second half of Smallville that flickering green box appeared in the upper left corner of the screen. Was still there during their news broadcast last I checked, so its not coming from their national feed. Couldn't tell you if the black flicker was still there, because my eyes were bugging out from the green box. Yikes. Whats going on over there? Anyone still have a contact? I'll trade the no PSIP for no green box....

I'm still getting Regular Schedule on my Hughes E86 for 17-1 (WPHL-DT).

baeverly
I was just playing with the PSIP, getting a feel for the automation interface. I'm gathering information on field character count, stuff like that. You'll see stuff in there once and a while.
CUL Jim

In terms of the WHYY DTV mailing list, according to http://www.whyy.org/tv12/dtv/index.html

"If you have additional questions or comments about our DTV service, or would like to be placed on a mailing list for DTV news, email us at dtv@whyy.org."

Originally posted by jim2417
Just got a email alert from WHYY that they've been asked by the owner of the tower to go offline midnight til 5 am. ... My question is - who is the owner of the tower and what work is underway... By the way, WHYY does a really good job keeping their dtv viewers advised via email. Sure wish other stations would follow suit - or at least post info on their web sites ...

No one mentioned this (or it wasn't clear...), but here's the update I got from the runner of the WHYY list.

Dear Dawn:

Thank you for your interest in WHYY DTV, in regards to the restriction, on
Monday evening in order to accomodate another tenent who was experiencing
a transmission line leak, the tower owner requested that we shut down our
DTV power so that the tower workers could do the necessary repairs. Windy
conditions prevented this from happening on Monday, however this work was
able to take place over night on Tuesday into Wednesday morning. There
are no further shutdowns scheduled for repair work.


Regards,
XXX
Technology Services Coordinator

I got an e-mail from WHYY that they are going off TONIGHT, since wind prevented work last night. It was dated 1/15/03 3pm, so I think it really means tonight.

Originally posted by MSmith
I got an e-mail from WHYY that they are going off TONIGHT, since wind prevented work last night. It was dated 1/15/03 3pm, so I think it really means tonight.

Yes, I got this, also. It was only a few hours after getting the email that I quoted from.... She must have too many people responding to her at once. :)

Does anyone know if nbc or wb will get rid of their station names on the left side of their broadcasts ever? To me one dog tag is enough.

Hey, Jim Chase:

I saw the good news on another part of the forum that CBS's digital broadcast of The Grammy Awards will feature a high-definition picture AND Dolby Digital 5.1 surround sound for the first time (in 25 markets). Good work, CBS!

Here's a link to a news article:

http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/030114/140418_1.html

Does that mean that the network has gotten their infrastructure in place to begin passing along DD 5.1 on a regular basis, or is this just a one-time special situation?

Can you tell us whether KYW will be one of the 25 lucky stations passing along the DD 5.1 to their loyal viewers? If so, do you know yet which other CBS-produced shows will have surround sound?

Oh, and as long as you are answering questions, what's going to be the final score of the Eagles-Tampa Bay game on Sunday? And tomorrow's winning lottery number? :)

--Philly Tim

I would like to know this too. Will Dolby Digital 5.1 sound be done by KYW-DT (Philly CBS) for both the grammys and thereafter. Only ABC does it now on a regular basis for HDTV programming.

It looks like we're getting close to seeing WYBE go live with a digital signal. I installed some new drivers for my MyHD card (if you have one check out the Home Theater Computer thread) and rescanned for channels. 34-1 came up fairly strong. TitanTV has this listed as WYBE-DT and the status is "Under Review".

has anyone heard when they might go live?

Does anyone know when WCAU will finally move to the new tower and increase its power? I can hardly ever get it now in Allentown, though KYW, WPVI, WPHL, WTXF, and WPSG in Philadelphia come in strong. Thanks.

Well, THAT was a heartbreaking football game, wasn't it? Sigh.

Oh, well, I guess I'll still watch the Superbowl on HDTV, but it won't be quite as "super" as it would have been with the dear ol' Iggles.

Anyway, back to digital TV talk:

I watched a little bit of WPHL 17-1 tonight, and it struck me:

NO FLICKERS!!!!!

I watched the second half of "Everwood" in HDTV and not so much as a blink!

I haven't been able to watch much TV (ANY channel) recently, so I don't know if this a permanent stability for 17-1 or how long it has been going on. Has anyone else noticed that the 17-1 is now rock-steady? Anyone notice when this started? Maybe they completed their software upgrade or something. I thought it was pretty good news! Congrats, WPHL!

Originally posted by Philly Tim

Can you tell us whether KYW will be one of the 25 lucky stations passing along the DD 5.1 to their loyal viewers? If so, do you know yet which other CBS-produced shows will have surround sound?

Oh, and as long as you are answering questions, what's going to be the final score of the Eagles-Tampa Bay game on Sunday? And tomorrow's winning lottery number? :)

--Philly Tim [/B]


I don't know if any of you remember, but back in 1999 CBS in Philly was broadcasting in DD 5.1, they stopped after a few months. It had some problems with popping sounds in the rear channels. The infrastructure for DD 5.1 is here in Philly and I am sure they fixed the popping in the rear channels by now. It is just a matter of CBS national to pass it in their stream.

Originally posted by Philly Tim
Well, THAT was a heartbreaking football game, wasn't it? Sigh.

Oh, well, I guess I'll still watch the Superbowl on HDTV, but it won't be quite as "super" as it would have been with the dear ol' Iggles.



Yes, it was heartbreaking -- especially being there in person (and all season). Anyone want some season tix ; ) -- just kidding. I'll be in the new stadium next year.

At least now we can invite lots of people over to watch the Superbowl in HDTV, since if the Eagles were in it I didn't want non-football fans yacking it up, (as I would have wanted to concentrate on the game).

Now you can show off your picture, and not worry about the game or people talking.

Originally posted by caesar1
Now you can show off your picture, and not worry about the game or people talking.

That's our plan.. I'm not a superbig fan of football, but I just love watching the superbowl. So, the 14 or so people coming over, may not get to see the home team win, but they sure will see the HD splendor and hear the 5.1 sound.
So, it all works out in the end.

I still think Donovan is the cat's pjs.. so shush to all you nay-sayers out there.

Originally posted by bronowyn
I still think Donovan is the cat's pjs.. so shush to all you nay-sayers out there.

But most people are blaming Reid for a conservative game-plan and play calling (on both offense and defense). Donovan was too restricted by the conservative play-calliing. How about so deep passes in the 1st half?

I'm wondering if that email from WHYY about having to power down their transmission "in order to accomodate another tenent who was experiencing a transmission line leak" had something to do with it. I noticed that it looked good yesterday too, but I didn't happen to catch any HD.

Originally posted by Philly Tim

Anyway, back to digital TV talk:

I watched a little bit of WPHL 17-1 tonight, and it struck me:

NO FLICKERS!!!!!

I watched the second half of "Everwood" in HDTV and not so much as a blink!

I haven't been able to watch much TV (ANY channel) recently, so I don't know if this a permanent stability for 17-1 or how long it has been going on. Has anyone else noticed that the 17-1 is now rock-steady? Anyone notice when this started? Maybe they completed their software upgrade or something. I thought it was pretty good news! Congrats, WPHL!

I was paying attention to WPHL last night , and the flicker does seem to be gone.

Just an FYI - WHYY (12.1) is still being asked almost nightly to shut down between midnight and 5am. They're still trying to get work done on the tower. Given the weather (cold and windy - the Delaware is frozen all the way across at Trenton), it may be a while before the successfully complete the work.

Got that note too from WHYY...pure speculation but could it have somethig to do with the long forecasted NBC move? Same tower?
Also, congrats to WB17 for finally resolving the flicker. Defintly good during smallville last night.

Has anyone else experienced greater-than-usual difficulty tuning in FOX 29-1 in the past week or so? I've been having problems with OTA reception, and I don't think there are any weather-related issues (extreme cold would not affect a UHF signal, would it?).

As far as everyone knows, they are still operating at full strength, correct?

--Philly Tim

Something is going on in Philly -- I think more multipath for some reason.

I have had major trouble with WHYY the past week. I have rarely been able to get it at all the last few nights. When it does come in, the signal strength seems normal for WHYY (about 70%). But since it is hard to acquire and then will disappear shortly after signal acquisition, I think something in the Philly tower region is creating more multi-path.

I have had slight trouble pulling in WPHL (17) lately as well. It just seems to take a few seconds longer to acquire, but it will come in. It is at full strength when I get it. This is how WHYY USED to be for me -- a few seconds longer for my set top box to acquire the signal. Unfortunately, WHYY is now a major problem.

I have not noticed any issues with 29 (FOX).

Note that I have an 80 inch Yagi on my roof (and I'm only 4 miles from Roxborough). Down in a valley though. I'm using the Samsung T151 set top box.

Perhaps the work being done is effecting the signal from many of the Philly stations?

Anyone have an email contact for WHYY?

Originally posted by caesar1
Something is going on in Philly -- I think more multipath for some reason.

I have had major trouble with WHYY the past week. I have rarely been able to get it at all the last few nights. When it does come in, the signal strength seems normal for WHYY (about 70%). But since it is hard to acquire and then will disappear shortly after signal acquisition, I think something in the Philly tower region is creating more multi-path.
Perhaps the work being done is effecting the signal from many of the Philly stations?


I know what you mean I have seen signal drops in 54.1,42.1,67.1, and 55.1. I am about 10 miles form the towers as well.

I have been having problems with FOX since mid November. When it first started I couldn't receive them during the day. Since late November I haven't been able to get them at all. I tried adjust the antenna but that didn't help. I even sent a e-mail to WNJT to find out if they increased their power during this time. I am within three miles of their tower and believe their signal could interfer with FOX. WNJT is on channel 43. FOX was always the weakest signal for me.

I think the cold temperatures are at fault. For those of you experiencing reception problems, keep an eye on the outside temperature. As it warms up, does your reception get better? Let us know. Remember, weather can have an effect on reception of RF signals.

Originally posted by mpg
I think the cold temperatures are at fault. For those of you experiencing reception problems, keep an eye on the outside temperature. As it warms up, does your reception get better? Let us know. Remember, weather can have an effect on reception of RF signals.

I agree weather (such as snow or rain) physical objects in the air -- can cause problems. By why would non-physical objects such as temperature cause multi-path issues?

I don't think 20 degrees (as opposed to 40) would make a difference in OTA reception of HDTV on UHF frequencies???

From my location in NE Hunterdon Cty, I have been unable to receive Fox (29-1/42) for the past few weeks, NBC (10-1/67) for quite some time and WHYY (12-x/55) never. I am glad to see that my situation is not unique. I seriously doubt that the Fox situation has anything to do with cold temperatures affecting reception.

Was ER broadcasted in hd last night?

Originally posted by snooplsm
Was ER broadcasted in hd last night?

NO: it was a re-run from last season

Originally posted by Johnr0836
FOX was always the weakest signal for me.

Fox has always been the weakest signal for me as well. I even get PBS 55 with more reliability and consistency. FOX is really the only station I do not get perfectly. But since they only broadcast 480P and my DirecTV is 480i I really don't care about FOX.

Anyone have an update on WCAU FINALLY getting their signal strength up to full power? I was told originally by Programming that it was going to be Sept. 2002, but obviously that's slipped. Last I heard was end of this month (January), but I'm not at all confident based on experiences in the past with WCAU (plus the cold weather will make any actual tower work difficult)

WCAU is the ONLY Philly station that I cannot lock in (except for WPSG)

And oddly enough, for those of you with problems pulling in Fox, it's my strongest signal up here in the Lehigh Valley.

I agree 100% w/ the fellow HD'r from Easton.
I'm in Whitehouse station NJ (Hunterdon county), 45 miles out.
I've been getting ALL the stations (ABC,CBS,NBC,FOX,WHY, etc.)
till yesterday - NBC was too weak. It has always been my weakest
signal as well and fox has never had a problem.

Aceman

Aceman:

What type of antenna are you using to reach all those channels. Rooftop or indoor mount. I am over in Somerset County and have been trying to get ABC on Sunday (guess why ?)

Gary

Gary,

Are you trying to watch figure skating on sunday :D

I'm using a winegard HD9095 (8ft UHF deep fringe).
www.winegard.com. Ran about $ 85.00

drop me a PM/email if you want to know where to get it
(although they are currently out of stock :mad: )

Aceman

Hello everyone,

I just spoke to Tim Osullivan over at WCAU (10.1/67.1) engineering. He said they are actively working on the problems over there and that they are in a transition stage to the new tower. I also invited him to join the forum so we can get official responses from the station to keep us informed.

Originally posted by DarthJedi
I also invited him to join the forum so we can get official responses from the station to keep us informed.

Rock on!

The more network people the better!

Thanks Darth!

Have had NO luck pulling in WHYY-DT until last night when I was able to get a pretty stable lock with my SIR-T150. I've had it over a year now and this is the first time I was able to get a watchable signal.

I'm in North Wales, about 15 miles from the tower. Did they finally go to full power? 12-1 had the HD travelogue loop and it looked awesome. Only had a test pattern on 12-4. I thought they would have simulcast the Koppel Town Meeting? Hope it stays up!

Also not able to get WCAU-DT last night.
:confused:

Has WCAU-DT been off the air since Thursday night? I've been getting zero signal, not just a weak signal.

If that is NBC-HD............on comcast for the last 24 hrs......I have no signal either.

Count me in. I have no NBC-HD signal on Comcast.

...ABC was pixelating and feezing on me the last couple days.
Superbowl coming up, anybody have this issues.?
Meter is about 60
All the others are excellent, of course NBC is in and out.

...had problems last night with ABC during the 6 o'clock news. Normally, it's been rock solid, and we normally watch ABC for local, then switch to CBS for national news. Last night, the program quide kept appearing - 2-3 times over a 5 minute period. Looked to me like the receiver was close to losing the signal. No loss in pq, just the appearance of the guide. That was enough to make us turn over the CBS for the remaining news/weather info. I'm 22 miles south of the towers in North Wilmington.

Just spoke to a Comcast supervisor who said the tower is down for NBC-HD and they do not have any idea when it will be fixed. On a good note, he said Feb 15th they are starting to carry Sportsnet HD on channel 172, and they are working on Discovery channel HD and ESPN-HD. No word on Fox or CBS (other than they are working on it with CBS).

Ummm...is ABC on that tower? I reallllllly hope this isn't going to be an issue come Sunday!

ABC is NOT on the new tower with NBC. Also, Comcast has a fiber feed right into WPVI so any tower issues should have no effect on the Comcast feed of WPVI-DT!

Also, check out the posts in Programming concerning the NBA AllSatr game on 2/9 and the three pojnt contest etc. on 2/8. Both events will be carried in HD by Comcast on channel 172! Hopefully, Discovery HD, HD NET and ESPN-HD will be up and running by 3/30!

FWIW - I have noticed some definite PQ problems with ABC the last couple of nights also.

And I have not seen NBC since Weds. Still not on now. Sux.

Bob

Checked WCAU-DT 10.1 this evening around news time and it's blank - other channels appear to be a-okay.

On another note, what's with the NJN channels? When is NJN Camden 22-1 coming on line? When I try to tune in 43-1, it flips to 43-4 and PBSYOU. The psip info says, however, that it's WPHL-DT. Strange. Also, from Wilmington I'm surprised that I can pull in independent WWAC-DT on 44-1 from Atlantic City ... and it's solid.

Originally posted by rbtconsultants
FWIW - I have noticed some definite PQ problems with ABC the last couple of nights also.

Bob

I think the problems with ABC are related to the weather and particularly the high winds we were having the last couple of days.

Turns out the transmitter location for WWAC-DT (Atlantic City) is the same as for NJN (Camden). Looks like pulling in NJN 22-1 will be a piece of cake from Wilmington.....

how anout the problem that wcau has been off the air the last 2 days?

anyone?

whotony.........look at my post above. Comcast and WCAU are aware and are working on it. No news as to when it will be fixed. At least it is not ABC and the Superbowl should be ok.

the tower is down?
physically or it's just not working?

Originally posted by whotony
the tower is down?
physically or it's just not working?

I'm pretty sure they mean the transmitter(s) on the tower is not functioning at the moment.

If a large tower fell down in Roxborough I'm sure it would have made the news.

ugh. true.

ignore my previous ridiculous question.

also i just ordered the digital cable for half off for 6 months including hbo and cinemax if you want it.
code was 13002 but it expires today.
also have the hd hook up coming on wed. that was 18.25 to install but no additional charges for the box as it is one box now.

During the superbowl the score and time clock banner were at the very top of the screen on my OTA ABC 6-DT reception. They were so far at the top the clock was actually just slightly cropped off at the top. Did anyone else have this or was it just me. I am praying it was not something with my TV?

Otherwise the picture was awesome!

Originally posted by baeverly
During the superbowl the score and time clock banner were at the very top of the screen on my OTA ABC 6-DT reception. They were so far at the top the clock was actually just slightly cropped off at the top. Did anyone else have this or was it just me. I am praying it was not something with my TV?

Otherwise the picture was awesome!

I was at a friends house watching the first half and I noticed the same thing, he has a Pioneer Elite RPTV. I went home at the half and on my Sony KD-34XBR2 I DID NOT have this problem, the time was clearly visible. We were both watching via Motorola 5100 and Comcast was cable company.

Originally posted by baeverly
During the superbowl the score and time clock banner were at the very top of the screen on my OTA ABC 6-DT reception. They were so far at the top the clock was actually just slightly cropped off at the top. Did anyone else have this or was it just me. I am praying it was not something with my TV?

Otherwise the picture was awesome!

Yes, you were not the only one that had that problem. This effect is do to the natural over scanning in most sets. On another note, The Superbowl was how a superbowl should be broadcast, including the HIDEF movie trailers Like the Matrix ( WOW!!!!!!!!!!! I will be there) but booooooo to the Hulk trailer. It was a great trailer but it should have been in HD.

The super bowl looked great. I didn't have the overscan problem, but I've checked my TV with Avia and I have very little overscan at the top and bottom.

The one thing that ABC didn't do well was upconverting their SD cameras around the field, especially during replays. These were noticeably pixellated - to the point where I could see little squares from 8 feet.

Also, WPVI needs to do some work on audio volume when upconverting an SD signal. On my Sony receiver, -50db is about comfortable for DirecTV and most OTA (some OTA need a few more db - like -45). On WPVI-DT with SD, I need to crank it up to about -36db. On WPVI-DT with HD material, my normal settings are about right. Last night at 6pm when they switched to the HD feed, we were nearly blown out of the room!

Mark

Originally posted by MSmith
The super bowl looked great. I didn't have the overscan problem, but I've checked my TV with Avia and I have very little overscan at the top and bottom.

The one thing that ABC didn't do well was upconverting their SD cameras around the field, especially during replays. These were noticeably pixellated - to the point where I could see little squares from 8 feet.

Also, WPVI needs to do some work on audio volume when upconverting an SD signal. On my Sony receiver, -50db is about comfortable for DirecTV and most OTA (some OTA need a few more db - like -45). On WPVI-DT with SD, I need to crank it up to about -36db. On WPVI-DT with HD material, my normal settings are about right. Last night at 6pm when they switched to the HD feed, we were nearly blown out of the room!

Mark

The audio on the commercials was way louder than the game too. Audio for OTA Hidef was fine once set, but then the commercials would come on and blow you away.

Did anyone notice the audio was out of sync in the late 2nd half
when the ref was making calls and when they took the camera
to the both to show madden and al talking????

God, hope I wasn't the only one.

Aceman

Yeah, we noticed.

There's an entire thread about the superbowl....

It's 30-some odd pages long.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=218476&perpage=20&pagenumber=1

Hey, it was so tough watching the Superbowl! If the Eagles had been there and faced such a lackluster Oakland team, they would have had a breeze! Ah, what might have been.

On my monitor (Sony KV-34XBR800 34" 16:9 FD Trinitron Wega XBR TV), the entire time/score box was visible at all time, but it WAS way up North.

There is a video setting adjustment called "overscan" that can be modified on most TVs, using the service mode. Since the extreme margins of a video picture can be a bit ragged, some of the usable picture extends a bit beyond the visible limits of your screen (overscan). Perhaps the overscan needs to be adjusted on your set. You might be able to find out advice on how to do this yourself on the appropriate "display devices" forum.

Good luck, BA!

--Philly Tim

Originally posted by Philly Tim
Hey, it was so tough watching the Superbowl! If the Eagles had been there and faced such a lackluster Oakland team, they would have had a breeze! Ah, what might have been.

In this "worst case scenerio", though, I was glad Tampa Bay won. I'd rather lose against the winner than the loser, myself.

The consensus of the group in the Super Bowl Thread in the HDTV Programming forum seems to suggest that the clock problem is related to how your set shows 720p broadcasts. If you have the ability to switch to 720p, then you probably were in good shape. Those of us with sets that convert to 1080i, had the overscan problem.

Audio was very soft for me. Usually -35db is about right, but I had it up to -18db during the game. Commercials got louder, as well.

I thought the quality of the picture was slightly below average compared to other HD sporting events. The CBS 1080i quality for the AFC Championship was amazing. Still, this is ABC's first effort in a long time, and hopefully they'll work out the kinks before next season.

Thanks for bringing us the game in HD and for the Dolby Digital, WPVI!

Originally posted by bronowyn
In this "worst case scenerio", though, I was glad Tampa Bay won. I'd rather lose against the winner than the loser, myself.

Normally that holds true, but not this year. Since Tampa ruined our party here in Philly and it was ruined in such a bad way all things considered (last game at the Vet , etc.), I wanted Tampa to lose out of spite -- and lose badly.

Originally posted by DarthJedi
Hello everyone,

I just spoke to Tim Osullivan over at WCAU (10.1/67.1) engineering. He said they are actively working on the problems over there and that they are in a transition stage to the new tower. I also invited him to join the forum so we can get official responses from the station to keep us informed.

Well, with only 3 more days till the end of January, it looks as though there will be a new deadline to "transistion" to the new tower. As with a lot of you out there, NBC is the only station that is pert-near impossible to pull in from my location. :( The waiting continues!

Any news on when FOX will be moving to THEIR new tower? Last I heard was the late spring sometime.

I think is was more of an overscan issue with ABC not putting the clock far enough into the safe area for most displays. I watched the game with my 5100 set for 720p and then 1080i for a comparison and the clock was not cut off on either version. My plasma has almost no overscan.

Originally posted by Calabs
Well, with only 3 more days till the end of January, it looks as though there will be a new deadline to "transistion" to the new tower. As with a lot of you out there, NBC is the only station that is pert-near impossible to pull in from my location. :( The waiting continues!

Any news on when FOX will be moving to THEIR new tower? Last I heard was the late spring sometime.

NBC digital in Philly has been off the air for almost a week now. What is taking so long. It is highly unusual for a major station to not have their HDTV broadcast running for so long.

I just got started into this and the info on this thread has been invaluable. Its good to know about NBC being off the air because I must have spent 2 hours trying to adjust my antenna to pull it in all to no avail. I am also having trouble with FOX. Last week no issues. This week sometimes it will show up mostly not. Everything else is coming in great. I love my new Mitsu 48515 set, but wish it had a signal meter to help me in adjusting for the best signal. Are there any add on meters that don't cost a fortune that can help with this???

Like everyone here, I am really looking forward to seeing WCAU's digital broadcast, but every time I think of someone working high up on a broadcast tower in THIS frigid cold with the recent high winds, I send them a mental message: "Take your time! Next week is soon enough!"

My hat is off to the dedicated broadcast engineers and technicians who brave the elements to bring us Jay Leno's humongous chin in HDTV!

--Philly Tim

In a different time and age (my last year in college 16 years ago) I worked for the company that does most of the high tower installation and maintenance in this country. I was able make some serious money and it wasn't that bad as long as you followed all the safety precautions. But yes it was cold. It was cold on a hot summer day working on top of a 1400 foot tower. I can't imagine today. Thanks for the reply. I'm still looking for the right antenna and amp combo that I should get for the best bang for the buck. I want to keep it in my attic because my wife will have a fit and the neighbors who wouln'd know how to get TV if the cable guy didn't actually put the wire on the set for them would have a field day with me.

Recently put up my OTA and am now getting ABC,CBS,NBC @ 100, WB@75 Fox @ 60-80 but I just cannot get WHYY 12.1? I can get the regular WHYY but not the digital? Would the fact that it is the lowest on the mast cause me not to get a signal at all or should I be able to pick it up if I get everything else from that location?

Acually NBC seems to have dropped off the map at the moment but I see that a lot of others have reported that also but a lot of people here seem to be able to get 12.1.

I've found this forum to be very helpful and interesting so I'm hoping that you might be able to help me.

Regards,

Robin

Originally posted by caesar1
The audio on the commercials was way louder than the game too. Audio for OTA Hidef was fine once set, but then the commercials would come on and blow you away.

BTW... this is happening during all of ABC - HD's broadcasts. I watched two of their new shows last night...

Veritas, which was supposed to be in HD, but the switch didn't seem to get flipped for the widescreen, and Miracles, which was a relatively (audiowise) soft show (However, looking lovely in HD Widescreen). Everytime the commercials came on, I had to quickly press mute, else be blasted out of my living room.

I wrote to Channel 6 to complain about this. I also wrote them to complain about something that wasn't talked about a lot in any thread. Have you noticed all the PSAs? (Public Service Announcements) I have.. just about ruined the Commercials in the Superbowl for me. Last night, while watching Miracles, I noticed there was a lot of them. I switched to the SD channel, and they were showing other commercials during that time. Very weird. Did someone forget to convert the commercials for viewing on HD?

Dawn,

All those PSAs are because ABC couldn't sell the commercial time.

Soft economy and exorbitant (sp?)rates means they were far from a sellout .

Revenue for the game will probably end up far below previous years.

:)

NBC is back on the air. It's coming in good and clear in Marlton, NJ. I am still having trouble with FOX. Does anyone have any info about this or suggestions??

Thanks

the psa's were only on the digital feed not the sd feed.
if you switched over to the sd you could the actual real commercial that was on instaed of the psa.