Let me add the following I have a small LCD monitor hooked to the AVIX
showing AVIX operstion. All readings look OK.

I should say I see no difference but have no idear what they mean.

Most SD channels use MPEG audio. Most of the pay channels use Dolby Digital during movies now. It shoul dbe recorded on the tape but your receiver must be capable of decoding mpeg audio.

D* replaced my dish today, and the dropouts are gone. Now back to recording as normal with the 169time! This is a relief, as now I can start working on cleaning up my environment. I am planning on putting the AVX-1 in a closet that is pretty far away from my equipment (~10 feet) and seeing how that affects the recordings. Currently, the AVX-1 only is about 4-5 feet away. I also will be adding ferrite chokes once I can make my way over to Radio Shack and buy some.

I think the avx dosen't want to be close to the other equipment.
Just a suggestion X FACTOR while your at radio shack I bought my 14.5 ft
firewire for only $10.00 was $40.00.
I know they were clearing them out for a low price,it might be worth it that extra couple of feet.
speaking of ferrite chokes they are a little costly at $ 5.00 each.

Good Luck

Everything is still working great here for me.

When you guys are "testing" your equipment, are you using fresh tapes for each recording?

Reply to the advice I received, thanks it all helps.

-"your receiver must be capable of decoding mpeg audio."
What do you mean receiver , my Hughes DirecTV STB which does just fine or the Avix /JVC 30000. I realize that I do not know where the data steam that goes throught the firewire to JVC / Avix comes from and perhaps it is after this point that the Hughes E86 converts the MPEG audio to my TV and so it does just fine. But since the data stream is pulled prior and is sent to the AVIX/JVC3000 the decoding of the MpEG audio is missing, therfore no audio out from JVC 30000 deck. Am I understsnding this correctly ??

I have used fresh tape.

All recordings on HDTV broadcast look great.
I even tested the OTA HDTV and they come through just fine.
NOTE all go through my DirecTV Hueghs E86 STB.

But as previously mentioned I get no sound on non HDTV channels.
Looks to me that DirecTV sends all signals in digital format so why you can not get the non hd channel is a little strange. BUT I am not the expert.

I just noticed this due to the only thing I have recorded is HD movies and yesterday went to channel 99 or 100 , what ever as there was a special , non HD and could get picture output from JVC30000 but no sound. Even tried CNN news and same problem.

Tested again last night and 2 hours of non HD , this time even had picture and sound but a review of tape and 15 mins into program no picture or sound on tape. Avix running and all data streams seem to be coming in just fine. Then tested 4 hourd on HD movie and all perfect.

Strange. Now Rich reccommends that you have "NO OTHER INPUTS TO JVC" when recording , outputs OK as you can check what is going on tape.
I do not like the idea that if I want to record SD progam I have to reconnect / connect cables.

Plan to try adding audio input stright to JVC30000 and see if it screws things up. Probable will, I would guess that with HD fire wire input plus a audio input the JVC 30000 will be confused as to what signal to use.

Also since I never had a problem with HD recordings my Avix is only 5 ft away from rack. I do have high grade Granite firewire cables. But perhap moving the Avix and checking shielding may help with the SD recordings but I do not think that is the problem.

Thanks for the advice.

The big thing to remember with AVX-1, DTC-100, and JVC 30K is that DTC-100 & AVX-1 both use 3 prong plugs. However the 30K (or the Mitsu for that matter) use 2 prong plugs. This means that the DTC-100 and AVX-1 have a different ground than the DVHS units. For those people that still have issues, try this: get a 3 to 2 prong adapters for your 3 prong equipment and connect it that way, thus eliminating ground loops between JVC and AVX-1 etc. See what happens. :)

Leszek

J BARROW
WHY don't you try recording the non- HD coming in to the 3000 using the audio /video analog inputs.
When I record non -HD i have my audio & video cables coming out of the set top box (separate from the firewire)L audio R audio RCA & S -Video
cable going into the back of the 30000 analog inputs.
As far as the sound goes take the audio out into another tv input or your extra audio input of your amp.

YOU WOULD OF COURSE SELECT: LINE 1 OR LINE 2 ON YOUR YOUR VCR OR IF YOU PREFER THE FRONT INPUT.

Did you also try the audio button on your remote when playing back the analog audio?

Also some of the non HD non HBO Sho, & max channels are more then likely non digital audio.

Try my suggestion maybe it might work.

Larry

J BARROW
I read your post & you also mentioned that if you connect analog inputs (audio) into the JVC it might mess things up.

The JVC uses the I numbers for the Digital HD channels (I 1,I 2 I3 etc.)\
When you record non HD use the line inputs Line 1 Line 2 or Front

The JVC will know how to handle that.
I hope you understand what I'm getting at.
As I mentioned when I record I use my LINE 1 Input selection,this will take the analog audio & video out of the set top box into the JVC.
TRY IT BUD
I know it will work.
All the best
Larry

DJ DROCK

I use fresh Maxell 300 minute tapes.
I usally fast foward the tape & rewind it before recording unto it, it packs the tape better,takes away the slack.

Not sure what may be being said, but the avx-1 will not allow one to do Non HD Direct channels. Some parts may work, but its not supported, has never been tested, and wont since 169time is only an HD timeshifting
company.

Dave

Thanks for the info

My main priority is HD recording every thing else is secondary.

I do get perfect HD recording from the HD broadcasts. NO problems. The STB 2 ft from JVC and 6 ft to Avix. I do use granite firewire with the ferrite core on each end. Also I have a strong signal in the 95 range. I have been lucky and have not had the problems others have had.

I find that I delay watching movies until they hit HD.

OK sometimes I do watch the hits when they hit pay for view, as there is a real time lag between the screen to pay for view. However DirecTV does have a HD pay for view channel so I have watched and recorded on that.

BUT I WANT every thing in HDTV. been waiting since 1988.

Thanks for all the ideas I am sure I can work something out.

I hope not to start connecting and reconnecting a lot of cables. Would like to be able to just push my remote and go.

I did note two things the 169 page does clearly state that it is for HDTV and nothing else.
Guess when I saw the avix processing data and I had a picture I just forget that it was not HD. Just wishful thinking.

Also ( I may be wrong ) I read something about the transmission of HD is one format and the standard DirecTV is another digital format.

The next question is in 3 to 5 years ( not sure of the exact time ) when all broadcast has to be in HDTV along side analog, how will that impact the cable only shows like CNN etc. which are carried by the cable companies, DirecTV and Dish. will they have to broadcast a HD signal ???

Again thanks everyone for the advice.

Originally posted by leszek1
The big thing to remember with AVX-1, DTC-100, and JVC 30K is that DTC-100 & AVX-1 both use 3 prong plugs. However the 30K (or the Mitsu for that matter) use 2 prong plugs. This means that the DTC-100 and AVX-1 have a different ground than the DVHS units. For those people that still have issues, try this: get a 3 to 2 prong adapters for your 3 prong equipment and connect it that way, thus eliminating ground loops between JVC and AVX-1 etc. See what happens. :)

Leszek

Or how about this... DTC100 and D-VHS both get grounded through shared audio cables going into a common audio amp... whoops...

How successful have people been with setting a timer to record with the AVX1, dish 6000, and the jvc30K. I read somewhere to use the IR transmitter, but has this been working okay?

Thanks!

JBarrow


What are some of the movies that you have perfect recordings of?

Originally posted by leszek1
The big thing to remember with AVX-1, DTC-100, and JVC 30K is that DTC-100 & AVX-1 both use 3 prong plugs. However the 30K (or the Mitsu for that matter) use 2 prong plugs. This means that the DTC-100 and AVX-1 have a different ground than the DVHS units. For those people that still have issues, try this: get a 3 to 2 prong adapters for your 3 prong equipment and connect it that way, thus eliminating ground loops between JVC and AVX-1 etc. See what happens. :)

Leszek

hmm are you being serious? If so good idea; and this mite explain why i had better results after my ground plug fell off, i thought it was a coincidence.

But some of those adapters are designed to ground the plug still, but to the face plate screw of the outlet, via a little u shaped prong that touches that screw or which the screw it is be inserted/mounted through. If the outlet is up to current code, that screw is grounded, so unless you snip that u shaped prong off the adapter/bend it out of the way so it doesn't contact the screw, you could still have a grounded unit. But possibly not as good/reliably as would be the case with the three prong plug without the adapter

Originally posted by leszek1
For those people that still have issues, try this: get a 3 to 2 prong adapters for your 3 prong equipment and connect it that way, thus eliminating ground loops between JVC and AVX-1 etc. See what happens. :)
Thanks. I went out last night and got 2 of these for $2.49 at Radio Shack. I've been having pretty good luck with DiscoveryHD, but the last movie I taped and watched from HDNet Movies had 5 multiple second lockups in a little over 2 hours (about 1 every half hour). I've taped a lot more from HDNet Movies than I've watched, so they may all have glitches. Anyway, I taped "The Last Tycoon" with the new setup and got done watching it a little while ago. I had one repeatable small picture breakup without any loss of sound. That is better than I would normally expect, but not much proof, yet. I'll try one or two more.

It seems like a lockup that happens at reasonably consistent intervals would be consistent with a grounding type problem, so maybe this will be a big improvement for me/us.

BTW: The little u shaped prongs aren't touching anything in my setup.

--Darin

How successful have people been with setting a timer to record with the AVX1, dish 6000, and the jvc30K. I read somewhere to use the IR transmitter, but has this been working okay?

I'm recording with the Directv DTC-100. AVX-1, and JVC30k. At first it worked great then for some reason everytime I set the timer to record a movie I would lose audio at some time during the movie completely during the recording and it would never come back. This happened on 5 out of 6 movies in a row. Then I then separated the firewire cable from the ir repeater cable moving them each on opposite sides of the JVC30k and have been recording with no audio dropouts since. So that goes to show you that things do interfere with the firewire connections very easily.

Mike

quote:HDNet Movies had 5 multiple second lockups in a little over 2 hours (about 1 every half hour). I've taped a lot more from HDNet Movies than I've watched, so they may all have glitches.


I get the same thing. Ive tried everything in the book. I also just bought into the dish 6000 system and same thing.

Im curious if anyone really has a perfect recording of a complete movie.

I have made three perfect recordings with my 169time DTC-100, HBO via Directv sat and JVC deck. Interestingly, all the movies were shown in their OAR and in stereo (not 5.1). This led me to believe that the audio dropout problem / video glitch problem might be might be related to some kind of buffer overrun in the AVX software / hardware.

The perfectly recorded OAR movies had less audio data (2 channel stereo) and they also had the black bars above and below (more easily compressed "blank" areas).

Alan:

I have had a few perfect movies the last one being U2 Rattle and Hum, but they have been far and few between.

Lon

Anyone make one perfect recording from HD NET Movie channel?

Alan:

I think I may have if I recall correctly Bob Ted Carol And ALice I think.

Lon

Alan:
I believe I had a perfect recording of Bye Bye Birdie over a month ago.

Ron

I thought I also had some perfect recordings until I watched them all the way through. So far all responses are "I think"

Im wondering if anyone can randomly record from HD Net and get a perfect recoding at anytime.

I have not owed my 169time/avx-1 system for very long, and I cannot say that I have the confidence to randomly record an HDNet movie perfectly, but I have formed some preliminary opinions.

I recorded "Whatever Happened to Baby Jane" a few days ago simultaneously on my PC (with DVHSTool) and JVC 30k. I tried many playback options with both recordings, using the MyHD decoder, the DTC-100 decoder and software decoding with DVHSTool. The JVC decoder was by far the best decoder and was glitch free for the two hours that I watched, when played back from the deck. I observed the playback from hard disk through the JVC decoder using DVHSTool for about ½ hour and had one non-repeatable glitch. All other playback options had artifacts or glitches. From now on, I am sticking with the JVC decoder for playback of avx-1 recordings, even though I would prefer to use the DTC-100 decoder for aspect ratio control.

Originally posted by Alan Gouger
Anyone make one perfect recording from HD NET Movie channel?
After floating the AVX-1 and DTC100 grounds I got a perfect recording of "What Ever Happened to Baby Jane" yesterday. So, out of 2 greater than 2 hour recordings since putting in the 3-to-2 prong adapters I have a partial picture breakup for maybe one second and everything else has been perfect. I walked away from the first one for a few minutes while listening to it, so it could have had one more image breakup, but I watched "Baby Jane" from start to finish with no problems.

--Darin

Alan...I have...in fact, several. I've posted this to Richard, and you might want to see the earlier posts concerning my set-up (1411 and 1412), and the modifications that worked for me.

Previous message from stjr:

It was good that in his message that he idenitfied the method of record and play back form tape and then computer.

Many messages just state they canot get a good copy , I always have asumed that they ment to the JVC tape and then there are messages where reading more closely they are refering to transfer from computer.

So the question may be how many people have problems recording to tape (directly from source ) and palyback from tape as opposed to those who have transfered to computer and then did playback, which seems to have more problems.

So it may be helpful if one clearly stated :
1. recorded tape and played back tape
or
2. recorded to computer and palyed back from computer
or
3 recorded tape ,transfer to computer, transfer from computer to tape and then played tape.

I have the same concern as I have recorded to tape all my movies.
An like many have not viewed all of them. I now wonder if I have a bunch of tapes that have problems ? Howerver all I have watched have had no or very manor problems witch may be the signal as opposed to the taping.

I have watched stright HDTV (no recording) and occasionally get a glitz which is very minor and infrequent. But obviously if I was recording the show/movie the same glitz would also show up and would not be related to the recording but the source.

Seems to be more problems going from JVC to computer and palyback as opposed to stright taping to tape and palyback of tape.

Is this correct or am I just lucky not to have problems with stright tape recordings ?

Those of us with no luck are wondering of course why the few that are having good luck are having that luck.

Im trying to get a gage to see is it indeed luck on their end that they may get a good recording once in a while which seams to be the case.

I dont see one person clainming to mention they can randomly at any time record what ever they want knowing the recording will be perfect.

Jay do you feel your system is stable enough to record anything If I were to mention a movie and a HD channel or would be luck of the draw?

Thanks!

Just for FYI, Richard knows some areas in the code where he can improve things to help improve recordings. I just cant get a date to when he will finish and release. So, there is no question that the cleaner your enviroment is, the better the a3 s/w works. Makes it tough since you cant see or easily measure whats going on. This is why is would be sure nice to have a one box solution from the big boys, but .....

Dave

Alan, at this point I think that my equipment is stable enough to record anything glitch free. I have recorded and seen over 20 movies from all channels, as well as 7 hours of insectia from Discovery and Chick Corea and the Jammy's from HD Net. No glitches, no pixilations, no bursts. This is not the luck of the draw, but a modified, repaired and replaced system that worked better than most during the B2 phase, before the components failed. I think it's the environment, more than anything, judging the recent posts. Strong signals, with no fade, a dedicated system with no ancilllary wiring, line conditioning, chokes, and a properly working DTC, AVX-1 and JVC.

I have recorded several movies off of HD-Net Movies latey but I have been so busy that I haven't watched any of them all the way through. I will say this, HD-Net recordings are perfect as I watched 2 hours of programs last night that I had recorded earlier in the day. I will try and watch some of the HD-Net Movies I have recorded to see how they are.

Too much to record and not enough time to watch!!!!

Mike

I must agree with Jay Koz

I was fortunate as my two JVC 30000 were the newer versions with the firmware fix so I did not have to go through that learning curve.

I have a similar rack system and the JVc3000 is one rack above or 15 inch the Hughes E86 STB.

The JVC 30000 feed comes stright out the front to the AVX-1 which is on floor 5 to 6 ft away. I only plug the Avx-1 in when I record.

I am using Granit firewire with ferrite chokes. both form STB to JVC to Avx-1

The two JVC 3000 pluged to one surge protector,; the Hughes E86 STB plug to another surge protector and the two AVX-1 are plug into another (3rd) surge protector. Of couse knowing house wiring I am sure all are pulling from same wire/circuit.

With my 3 -24 inch dish ( one for each sat) I get signal strength arounf 93 to 97 per my Hueges STB.

I Did have one problem with the Hughes E86 after adding firewire. After a week of all ok. Then the Hughes unit went into "will not resopned to remote or front panel" would not even turn off, had to unplug. After an hour pluged in and all OK BUT next day same but the oppsite just would not come one. Advice from 169 was it was probable running hot. Sure enough once I added loud house fan it cooled down and ran just fine. Did some checking, I have two Hughed E86 one with and on without firewire. The non firewire was just as hot on or off but did not exhibit problem. Inside Hughes units is about six chips with large heat sinks and directlky under the firewire card was one of the chips. I may have a unit that was just a little more hot or on the edge ( 169 has not had similar problems with other Hughes E86 but they do RUN HOT ). I have purchased a computer rack fan actual it is flat with 3 - 5 inch fans and QUIT! NO MORE PROBLEMS. The hughes unit is so cool to the touch. Amazing what good air flow does for cooling.

Guys,

With the B3 software, I have had exactly one failure to date, which was on Discovery HD Theater the first day they were on the air. I have recorded several HDNET movies and watched them through and I have never had a blackout or loss of audio or total lockup like we used to get with the original software. I had two units for about a year and then sold the extra one to Mike a few weeks ago. He also has had very good success. My only glitches are the extremely brief microbursts which I seem to get about once in every two or three recordings with none exhibited a great deal of the time.

I also record OTA extremely reliably through the DTC100 for time shifting purposes. My safeguards, if you will, are the ferrite chokes on the firewire cable only and I use the 14.5 foot firewire cables from Radio Shack. The units are in a separate room from each other. My signal strengths are about 75 to 80, but I don't believe that those numbers mean anything at all. I also use the RS attenuator to minimize reflections.

I consider myself extremely fortunate to have a clean environment or whatever as I rarely, if ever, have had a problem with my units. I have had to unplug the DTC100 4 or 5 times over the last year as it will get locked up after long periods of having the AVX-1 connected, but once every month or so is not even really worth mentioning.

Jeff

UPDATE ON RECORDING

I JUST GOT 1 4 SECOND COMPLETE BLACKOUT DROPOUT.
It happened 1 HR. & 34 minutes into the movie.

"City by the Sea"

Blackout dropout meaning ........the audio was completely silent & the picture went completely black.

Did anybody experience this type of dropout?

I was doing good for the last few recordings with no problems, but now I got one.

It could of happened on the broadcast end.
This movie was recorded on HBO.

Will keep recording & try another movie.
Keep you all posted.

LARRY
YRRAL

By the way I have a single dish on the roof with 3 LNB'S
and my signal are in the lower to mid 90's

So the signal would'nt be the cause,unless HBO was messing around.

I would guess that since you have had such good sucess in the past that it was not your equipment or set-up.
Just guessing but could be for 4 second loss
- HBO screw up
- DirecTV screw up
- Bad transponder
- they switched to another transponder
- a tree limb / leaves blocked signal from wind
- an air plane overhead blocked the signal
- Police helicoptor.. is anyone looking for you ?
- a bird who fell in love with your dish
- it was part of the movie of a black cat in a coal mine

But not you set-up
I would let it ride and not worry.
See how things go. If it starts to appear on a frequant bases then start to worry.

The non-expert but learning

Im going to try playing back what Ive recorded using the DTC100 to see if I have better luck.

Problem is I have a separate JVC up in my theater for playback only so I hope this is not a solution for me.

Im also going to move the AVX further away from my equipment and remove the ground from everything in the loop as suggested to see if I have better luck.

My initial tests lead me to believe that the JVC 30k decoder is the best decoder for playing back avx-1 streams. However, I suppose that if a JVC deck is having mechanical difficulties or tape incompatibilities, that might lead to faulty playback. If you (1) record the stream simultaneously to the deck and to a hard drive and (2) play the stream back through the JVC decoder with both recordings, you can compare the results to see if one method works better than the other. The results should theoretically be very close if not identical. In my limited test, the results between both recordings were virtually the same and virtually glitch free.

If the results from tape are better than from the hard disk, then I would suspect problems with my PC’s software or hardware configuration. If the results are better from hard disk than from tape, I would suspect mechanical problems with the JVC deck. Of course there are other variables that can enter into the equation, but I think that hard disk recording can give us additional clues as to what’s going on.

Hi Steve

Makes sense. In my case I have 2 30ks and 2 Mits and the new 40k.
Tape plays identical with the drop outs or freezes on all of them.

Im now moving everything to a different room where I can separate the equipment and leave wires running across the floor to see if I have better luck.

Alan,

If two decks are used for simultaneous recording and have identical dropouts and freezes at the same spot when played through the JVC decoder, then I would suspect that there is a problem with the transport stream (above and beyond the known incompatibilities between the avx-1 stream with other ATSC signals). It seems that a few people, including me, have been getting glitch free recordings and playback (in my case with the JVC decoder) when everything is working properly.

My avx-1 unit sits right next to my HTPC hard disk recorder, while my DTC-100 is about three feet away, and my JVC 30k is approximately eight feet away from both computers. I have taken no special shielding precautions.

In fact, I have monitored the avx-1 stream processing when powering up my HTPC and didn't notice any glitches with the stream, which is strange, because powering on my PC usually causes RF glitches on my other OTA signals. Go figure.

For what it's worth, I am using the alpha avx-1 software in my own PC enclosure.

Thanks Steve

Ive just moved everything and Ill see if I get better results. Yes its a mystery as why some are getting good results and others are not.

There are a lot of mentioned precautions. Use chokes on your cables, unground everything, make sure everything is spaced far apart, use a power stabilizer device, keep the AVX away from any PC wireless devices, use only DVHS tapes, rewind an repack the tapes before use, get the new dtc100 mod and the list goes on.

Ive done everything but get the DTC100 mod but a friend did and it did not help him. He is having the same trouble. Maybe Im to close to our utility pole:)

My third movie from HDNet movies (Moving) after floating the grounds had one of the 3-5 lockups in the first 30 minutes. That is all I've watched of it so far.

--Darin

Alan: What do you mean by "the new DTC-100" mod?

bwooster

I guess there is a mod performed by 169time that adds a few resitors and capasitors. Its been mentioned in this thread by a few who sent their dtc100s in.

Alan,
Please try the 14.5 foot firewire cable.
It may be the key.
When I did it my results are nearly 100 %
99.9%

I did get a BLACK DROPOUT for 4 seconds where the audio & video went
blank. The only way to describe it is that the audio was complete silence
& the video was blacked out.

It happened 1 hour & 35 minutes into the movie "City by the sea"

If anyone reading this post experienced such a blackout and might know the cause please let me know.

Alan give me a call when you try recording with the longer firewire.
I really hope it works for you.
Thanks
Larry

I don't think the length of the firewire cable will change the results. However, the placement of the cable, away from interference may. Ferrite chokes ( some cables come with them) are probably a benefit. The environment will be the main contributer toward success or failure.Separate the three units by placing them between other components (the metal will act as a shield) and isolate the AC circuit of the JVC, DTC, and AVX-1. I have not ungrounded my units and I don't repack the D-VHS tapes, and I am getting 100% clean results.

I don't think the length of the firewire cable will change the results. However, the placement of the cable, away from interference may. Ferrite chokes ( some cables come with them) are probably a benefit. The environment will be the main contributer toward success or failure.Separate the three units by placing them between other components (the metal will act as a shield) and isolate the AC circuit of the JVC, DTC, and AVX-1. I have not ungrounded my units and I don't repack the D-VHS tapes, and I am getting 100% clean results.

Jay makes some very valid points here. When I first started timer recording using the IR emitter plugged into the back of the DTC-100 and then facing the JVC my firewire cable from AVX-1 to front of JVC would hang out a bit and its right next to the Remote window on the JVC. After getting complete audio dropouts during 4 of 5 movies I then moved firewire cable to the side on the JVC and I haven't had an audio dropout since. I haven't ungrounded my units and I don't repack my tapes either. I do use a Richard Gray Power Plant which does clean up the AC. I don't even use ferrite chokes but I am getting 100% perfect results now as well.

Mike

I just went to Radio Shack and purchased 4 Ferrite Data-Line Filters, fitting cables up to 17/64" in diamater. The filters are not snug with the cable, in fact there is considerable space that allows the ferrite filter to move around on the line. This was the only size Radio Shack has.

Are these properly sized? Will they do what I need them to do?

EDIT: Nevermind, I found the answer in a post from yrrral that I can loop the firewire cable so it goes through the ferrite twice, thus eliminating the gap.

( 09-04-03 01:25 AM Posted on a previous page)



I have a 5' component tower with 9 components. JVC on top, DTC in the middle, AVX-1 on the bottom. Firewire connects are drilled through the cabinet from AVX-1 to JVC and from DTC to JVC. Ferrite chokes on firewire connects and Sat cable in. AVX-1, DTC, and JVC are all connected to a Radio Shack surge protector and line conditioner ( inexpensive), and are plugged into a separate outlet. I used the amplifier and pad, but now find I don't need either. My sat cable length in is less than 50'. My signals are in the 80's. I hope this information helps those with problems

I now have my AVX seperated on the other side of the room sitting on the floor about 8 feet and I think I finaly got my first perfect recording off HDNet M.

Seperating the equipment seams to be the key with the AVX.
After Ive watched the entire movie I will report if indeed I have a perfect recording.

So, just talked to Richard for a while again. So, my first suggestion for anyone having issues, please contact 169time, and work with RIchard on it.
As an example, I was the first person he had a while back who had purchased a new dtc100, and with the mod the way he was doing it, it would have glitches once in a while. So, why putting in so more parts, he was able to fix this issue. Others have had this added at 169time to fix.
Not all units need this, but they all behave a little differently.

So, again, if you are having issues, contact 169time and consider sending you dtc100 back so at least Richard can eliminate one piece of the puzzle.

Dave

Dave, that makes more sense than all of us offering advice based upon what has worked for us. When I was setting up my components, I asked Richard if I would have problems with the set-up. He said that it would probably work out , but I would just have to see for myself. At this point Richard probably has the best data-base of information for fixes.

Jay, the problem is, each of the dtc100's can act differently. So, without having the base unit "certified", one could just be missing the root cause.
Again, how many companys will put this much effort into helping someone out? So, as I have always done with Richard, if something doesnt seem to work, I head over to his place with the equipment and let him prove its my fault. ;)

So, if you are having issues, contact 169time. Atleast if you have him "test" the unit, you will have a base line data point!!

Dave

OK, I have some news, particularly for those who want to record to PC. I used to get glitches (pixelations) every five minutes when recording to PC both with B3 and A4 (alpha test software). The fact that these glitches happened exactly every 5 minutes (5 minutes and 2 seconds to be exact) felt strange and could not be explained with incoming signal glitches. I had a suspect and ran the following tests with the following setup:

SETUP:

AVX - RCA (DTC100) - JVC 30K - Laptop
(the RCA is in the middle with both FW ports in use)

Software: B3
Capture to PC with GraphEdit (Tape unit - TSPCAP)
Settings in DVHSTOOL: Single file; Save as tp file; Elecard Video Decoder; Odio Audio Decoder, Default direct sound device.

TEST 1:

I watched a 16 minute Showtime HD movie section through
a) the RGB Monitor port
b) simultaneously through the JVC component ports
(I have two projectors and hooked one up to the RGB port and the other to the component ports).

At the same time I recorded to PC (with GraphEdit) AND to the JVC deck.

Results:

There were no glitches while watching through both the RGB and the component ports. So the incoming signal and the processing of the signal by AVX-RCA-JVC were perfect.

I watched the captured footage through the JVC; there were no glitches, the JVC had a perfect 16 minute recording.

Then I watched the PC file; there were the usual glitches after 5, 10 and 15 minutes.

TEST 2:

I transferred the JVC recording (which was perfect) back to PC by using DVHSTOOL, version 2.13.

Result: Glitches after 5, 10 and 15 minutes.

TEST 3:

I did the following changes in DVHSTOOL: Save to ts (rather than tp); select WINDVD audio decoder (rather than Moonlight Odio); unregister the TSPCAP filter and register the original old TSPCAP filter (I think it is version 2).
Then I transferred the JVC recording back to PC, again using DVHSTOOL (but now with the new settings and the old TSPCAP filter).

Result: No glitches

TEST 4:

I recorded a new 16 minute HBO HD film to PC, using the modified settings.

Result: No glitches

CONCLUSION:

The 169time equipment worked perfectly. Cause of glitches was the software / DirectShow filter setup; the new setup has not caused any glitches so far. I will record a few full-length movies to see whether this was pure coincidence, luck or a problem solution. I'll keep you posted.

Hidef

Does this mean we can playback using the MYHD card?

Great news!

Thanks for the report, hidef1920. I don't think this report means that we will get good results playing through the MyHD card decoder, however.

I need 1080i playback of my recordings for my RPTV. I have not been fond of software decoding at 1080i, probably because video card support is lacking for the playback of 1080i files (I have posted about this a few times). The one time I experimented with software decoding, I seemed to get better results with the WinDVD 4 video and audio filters than with the Elecard filters, but I was not impressed with the overall look of the picture on the 1080i overlay with my admittedly old Radeon 7200 with Cat 3.4 drivers.

I prefer to play back my PC recordings of avx-1 files through the JVC 30k decoder by selecting the "archive" function in DVHSTool. It seems to provide the same relatively glitch free playback as D-VHS tape played through the JVC decoder. I do use the same setup as you for recording, except that I am using a desktop PC.

Has anyone experienced a blackout glitch?
Meaning: The sound will go totally silent & the picture will be blacked out.

This happened to me on 1 movie at 1 hr. & 35 minutes. "City by the sea"
I like to know what was the possible cause of this.

Alan,
I sold my MyHD card, so I don't know whether or not it will work. If you have a powerful PC (e.g. a 3.06 GHZ P4), you can actually play HBO footage as is via Windows Media Player. Showtime footage, though, will push the PC to its limits. The reason is that Showtime continues to broadcast films @ 1920x1088i while HBO has moved to 1280x1088i (which is scaled back to 1920x1088i when played). The lower HBO resolution makes it possible to view the ts files through WM-player. The Zoom player is even better, because it does not use as much resources as WM-player.
I typically timeshift by watching it through the JVC encoder via DVHSTOOL (archive) or by encoding it with WM9 (@ 1280x720) and then play it on any software player.

stjr,
As indicated above, you need a powerful PC to play the ts files directly from PC. It's not so much a graphic card issue but a CPU utilization issue. Next time when you play a file open up task manager (ctrl alt delete), click the right tab and check the CPU utilization. If it goes up to 100% then your CPU is not powerful enough to handle the stream. Even if you encode your footage with WM9 or XVid @ 1920x1080 you need a strong PC to play it. Depending on your PC, I would try to encode to 1280x720, which gives you more or less the same quality as 1920x1080. If you can only play 1080i files, just encode HBO files @ 1280x1080i (i.e. just crop 8 at the bottum of the picture and use the original HBO resolution) and select 16:9 aspect ratio in your software player. You should get fine results.

hidef

Thanks for your follow up. Some of this is a little to deep. Im not a big PC geru which is why I depend on something simple like the MYHD card.

I have finally got my 2nd perfect recording. Again I think keeping the avx as far away from the rest of the equipment is the key and very important.

Maybe the next software drop will allow the avx files or decoder to work with the likes of the myhd and samsung 160 box:)

Alan, not from what I have heard.

Dave

hidef1920,

Thanks also for the follow-up. You raise some interesting issues regarding software playback of HDTV files. I checked CPU utilization on software decoding with several of my HDTV files using an Athlon (Barton) 2500+ chip, both at standard speed and overclocked by about 27% (11x multiplier to 14x). CPU utilization routinely hit 100% with DVHSTool using the WinDVD4 filters and the Elecard filters at both speeds.

I then tried playback of the same files with the DVICO Fusion demo in non-DXVA mode (without overclocking the CPU), and CPU utilization never went above 80%. Quite an improvement. I wish that the DVICO software were available as a standalone player rather than as an integral bundle with the Fusion card. The demo version did not give me enough time (it shuts down after 1 minute) to truly evaluate its suitability to play back avx-1 captured files.

My initial point is that I'm not sure if 1080i display with the Radeon card is equal to the 1080i display of the DTC-100 or JVC-decoders. More specifically, the issue IMO relates to 1080i sourced files played at 1080i or 1080p with the Radeon card in the overlay mode. Even if the the CPU is not over-utilized, there is still is a "half rez" issue as discussed here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=2238217#post2238217).

Alan,

Good news on your recording results. I think it might take a while before avx-1 files can be made fully compatible with the MyHD or Samsung decoders.

Alan and stjr,

You might want to try this player (30 days demo) and play AVX captured ts, tp or trp files:


www.sasem.co.kr/english/news/news_read.html?board=eng_news&ref=32&step=1

stjr,

I don't have the 1080i downrez. problem, but I am using a NVidia card. You might want to check, which Video encoder your system uses (open GraphEdit, click file - render media file - select file - see which encoder is selected in the graph). If it's Elecard, check in properties whether it is set to weave (no deinterlacing). If so, your graphic card must be capable to display an interlaced desktop (which many cards do not support). You might then want to try the deinterlacing options under Elecard properties and see what happens. Whatever video decoder GraphEdit selects, check the properties and play with alternative settings.

hidef1920,

I normally do my avx-1 captures and playback with DVHSToool, not Graphedit, and I can check the properties of the Elecard decoder there. The playback is normally set to "vertical filter deinterlacing," but I don't see much difference between that setting and "field interpolation." Setting the filters to "weave" looks ugly.

I think the problem with Radeon cards and the 1080i overlay is a driver issue. This problem has not been noted with the Nvidia cards, because they can't do a 1080i overlay reliably, at least according to the posts that I've read. I assume that you are doing your software decoding playback at a progressive scan rate, which probably works OK on a computer monitor, but doesn't work for an RPTV that requires interlacing for the best resolution.

stjr,
I guess you are right that it is a driver problem. Since all ATI cards I ever owned had driver problems, I switched to NVidia with no regret. Still, check out this Sasem HD-Editor (see link one post up), which is basically a HD player. It runs very smooth and uses much less resources than the other software players I am using (including DVHSTOOL).

hidef1920,

Thanks for the suggestion on the Sasem player. I had to use it in the non-DXVA mode to get it to work with my video card and 1080i files, but I was able to keep CPU utilization in the 70% or so range. This gives me the incentive to more thoroughly check the software decoding of avx-1 files for display on my RPTV (This PC is not hooked up directly to my set right now). Where are the free standing software decoders with low CPU utilization that don't require you to buy a tuner card?

P.S. - Since I need 1080i support for my RPTV, I would rather have a Radeon card with a faulty 1080i display than a Nvidia card with no 1080i display.

""""""Where are the free standing software decoders with low CPU utilization that don't require you to buy a tuner card?
""""""""""

they are waiting for 5 ghz processors :D

I have been so busy of late, I had been unable to tweak my 169time system. I finally got around to making some changes:

- added ferrite chokes to both ends of the 2 firewire cables
- added 3-prong to 2-prong converters for the STB and the AVX-1.
- separated the AVX-1 from the other components by an additional 2 feet. The AVX-1 now rests 6'8" away from the other components.

I just recorded U2 - Rattle and Hum from HDNet Movies. I have a JVC 40k connected to the AVX-1, which adds an additional variable in the recording process. Although it works well, the boot process can be somewhat complicated. Here is how I am doing it now, although I'm sure there is a better way:

1. Power Up DTC-100, tune to HD station
2. Power Up AVX-1
3. Wait for AVX-1 to load
4. Power Up JVC 40k
5. At this point, the JVC 40k cannot see the AVX-1.
6. Unplug DTC-100
7. Unplug JVC 40k
8. Plug in, power up DTC-100
9. Plug in, power up JVC 40k
10. At this point, the JVC 40k can see the AVX-1, and the picture/sound are available
11. Power down JVC 40k
12. Power up JVC 40k
13. Record show

I hope to find a better boot method for this combo, but the traditional method suggested for the JVC 30k does not work.

______

RESULTS

I only have had the opportunity to watch about 15-20 minutes of the first recording since I made the changes (as stated above, U2 - Rattle and Hum). I saw some blocking for a quick second, but not the traditional blocking I had been accustomed to with the 169time unit. It almost looked like a compression problem on DirecTV's end (something I used to see some on HDNet when there was lots of movement). This cleared up in less than a fraction of a second, and was the only video glitch noted after 15-20 minutes.

There have been a few occasional glitches in the audio playback, although I noticed these during the recording. I was watching the feed through the AVX-1/JVC40k as I was recording and there were a few momentary dropouts in the audio. Of course, those also appear on the recording when I playback. This may very well be attributed to some problems with HDNet, and they are so minor that they do not bother me much. Hopefully, the problem originated on DirecTV's end and not in the processing of the AVX-1. I have tried to get a clean environment, and know it could be better, but if need be I will continue to tweak the system.

Overall, I am quite happy. This is by far the best recording I have made with the 169time system. I believe future recordings will be even better, as the minor faults likely originated on D*'s end.

P.S. It should be noted the AVX-1 did not resync during the entire recording.

I find the further the avx is from the other components 105 & 30000 the less of a chance of dropouts.

I have the avx on one side of the room & the 105 & 30000 on the other side of the room. I bought the Radio Shack 14.5 ft. firewire cable.

I only experienced a 4 second dropout during a recording of City by the sea. This was 1 hr. & 35 minutes into the recording.

This dropout was a first of a kind for me.
I call it the Blackout Dropout,where the audio is silent & the picture just blacked out.

Has anyone ever come across a dropout like this?
I emailed Richard & he told me it probably was in the( Broadcast transmission)change in the incoming signal.This was recorded on HBO.

Quite interesting that many have no or minimal problems and others seem to have significant problems. I AM NOT COVERING THE AREA OF TAPING to or transfer to cumputer which is another issue all together ONLY STRIGHT TAPE RECORDINGS.

I have had no problems with two JVC30000, AVIX-1 and Hughes E86.
The JVC is on a rack 12 inch above Hughes STB and Avix on floor aprox 5 ft away. Both firewire cables are from "Granite" with ferrite chokes at both ends of cable. I have recorded mostly movies and 2 from HDNET but most from HBO and Showtime. All recordings and I have watched,about 1/2, have been great. About 35 movies so far.

The JVC's have the newer frimwire when purchased. So if you have an older unit you may want to check that as it seems there were some problem with earlier units. Same for the Avix-1 softwire, the newest version has eleiminated problems with eairlier versions. I was lucky as I just purchased units within past 5 months and avoided the early problems.
So you need to rule out those old issues.

Another problem seems to be signal strength as some have had problems resolved when signal strength increased for 60 / 70 to 90's. I have high 90's (checked by a "REAL PROFESSIONAL" installer with $$$$ equipment , no rush to slam up dish and hall butt. In addition others have purchased newer STB or had the older ones repaired / replaced and old problems were gone. Obiviously signal strength or STB can be an issue. If you don't get a good signal you are not going to get a good Tape. Even just standard watching of HDTV , from DirecTV, I have occassional encountered glitches ( brief a few seconds) However OTA a major problem based signal . Major glitzes and freezes with satation 38 miles as opposed to 12 miles. Obviously this is due to getting a good signal.

Major issue seems to be many need to place / locate AVIX-1 6 ft to 12 ft from other equipment due to interfrence. I am not a expert on signal interference but some areas to think about.

1. Electrical power QUALITY. I have had computers, which are very sensitive to voltage, surges, cycles to just reboot in the middle of a progarm. Once I had a printer pluged into the same outlet and when I went to print both computers rebooted. Inspite of high quality ACP power supplies the computers saw the quick power drop from the printer and rebooted. Same with power to your house.
Areas to look for:
Power loads from heater/ heat pump, refrigerator, motors coming on. Same for your neighbor's loads. Again if you are getting "non-quality" power form the power company same issue.
Also what I would refer to as radio or Rf interference motors can send out a signal, telephones , other leak electrical components. EVEN your nieghbor could be the source. Years ago my brother was picking up a CB signal on his telephone and TV from an Idiot who boosted his signal way past FCC regulations. ( he seemed to want to be thr DJ for all the truckers) after a few months the FCC got him, he was 10 to 12 miles from my brothers house.

My method of recording:
1. Check out system 20 mins before program, not all ways ,but does not hurt and if you have a loose connection you have time to fix.
2. Turn to station you want to record from.
3. turn on JVC
4. Fire wire from STB to JVC always connected so I check or tune to I-1 which comes right up
5. BOOT AVIX-1, some times I boot first due to time it takes to load and be ready for signal.. " BUT NO CONNECTIONS to JVC, just to power supply" , Booting up an ready to receive signal seems like 2 to 4 minutes, have not timed it but it does take some time. After booting / loading it starts to look for for HDTV signal. It helps to watch Avix-1 vedio output for this. I have a 15' LCD which takes no room and sits on top of Avix.
6. Once the Avix-1 begins to look for incoming signal I plug the fire wire into the front of the JVC.
7. The I-1 , on the JVC, never chages to I-2 by it self . I just hit up or "+" channel and the I-2 is found or turned in an instant, maybe a second.
8. Check output from back of JVC. If you don't have pircture and sound you don't have it on tape.
Ifg I have picture and sound 97% of time all is go. On rare occasions I have had to repeat the process.

Hope this helps.

JBarrow

Thanks for your contribution. Seams to follow what weve been reporting all along.
This is not a product you take out of the box and plug it in and expect it to work. I still cant get my dish 6000 to work and I payed good money.

None of these quirks are listed on the 169time web site. I think they should be added so customers are aware what they are in for.

quote from Dave:Alan, not from what I have heard.

Great another disappointment. It takes a year just to get a software drop and now we find out it wont even have one of the major complaints from those who have reported what part of the trouble is.
Will that fix be 2005?

While this is so far the only product that allows recording the speed at which any improvements are made compared to other companies is very frustrating. It seams all effort is concentrated on getting sales.

Alan, you just have no idea how much work it is to run a company with very few folks. Hye, how long did it take JVC to fix the problems, and they are a large company? And since so many have having perfect results, I dont understand how you imply that any s/w will fix everything. It cant.
Sorry for being honest, but technical reality is what it is. I know Richard has suggested you send your dtc100 back to him just to make sure there are no issues with it. Any reason you havent considered working this out with him yet? Just trying to help. This multi box stuff is a pain, but until there is another choice, its this or nothing.

So, here is the latest FYI from RIchard.

fyi (On the 169time.com web)

In the mean time there are updates including 08A4 for build your own AVX1, expanded PC hard drive recording section, and a Toshiba DirecTV set top box with firewire already installed, plus a $500 discount on several setups.

fyi

Dave

Alan, fyi from RIchard

fyi

Many installations are quite successful.

As Alan's continues to experience problems not seen by others, it would be
best if he'd send both his 6K and Dtc to us for checkout.

Alan's firewire adapters were not installed at 169time's office, so we've
not looked at them at all yet.

169time.com is here to help when you let us.


yi

dave

I personally would like to see a poll done on how many buyers think this works sucessfully. If Alan, who I would think would be taken care of first has problems continually, who has trouble free installations? No ifs ands or buts.

I have only pulled this thead up when he posts here since his theoretically would be fixed first.

If not working reliably it's selling vaporware as a finished product in my book.

If not reliable, a disclaimer should be put on every sales-like post explaining that these products are similar to hair growth products or diet pills until they work reliably for 90% of buyers.

Larry

Larry, Richard has been trying to work with Alan. If he doesnt want to send his equipment back to be checked, what can 169time do. And by the way, Alan did NOT purchase his stuff directly from 169time. He purchased from a distributor back east, so, there may be issues 169time is not aware of. Again, unless Alan sends the stuff to 169time, what else can they do?

Dave

Dave

quote:Alan, you just have no idea how much work it is to run a company with very few folks.

Yes I run one.

Dave

Yes I have been asked to send in all my stuff.
So that means I have box everything up. If Im going to do so Im also going to send in the avx as well. This means downtime as this is the homes only entertainment as well. And paying for the shipping both ways.
Jason and myself have recently just installed HT in our homes and demo our projectors to visiting clients. The same sat box that feeds the AVX also feeds the projectors I demo. One week to/one week back and what ever time it takes for 169time to look at the system. A few weeks is a lot of downtime and an inconvenience.

Just a hassle after I just spend another $$$$.

Yes it is something that needs to be done but I have been putting it on the back burner.

I am not the only one with issues. I know of many who have not jumped in and posted. Bottom line is it is not something you buy and plug it in and it works. Of course I cannot argue that it is the only solution currently available, you are right. I just wish it worked.

I bought the AVX and the DTC100. I have the same trouble everyone else has reported.
I recently bought the dish600 with the 169 mod and Im having the same trouble with that. I could see where one item in my system went defective but not everything. So my alternative is to box up everything and pay for shipping and send it in.
This is not something a customer wants to hear but it does look like it is my only alternative if I want to resolve all this. I wish it was as simple as swapping out the equipment. That would be easier with no viewing downtime.

With all this said, I moved my AVX to the other side of the room and have what I think are 2 perfect recordings so I dont think my system is any different than anyone else. Those reporting good results all say their avx is separate from all other equipment. Now that Ive moved mine I may be having good luck with my DTC100. Ive yet to be successful with the 6000. In order for me to test this again with the new location of the AVX I have to re run my wires through the basement to another room. Again because this is not a plug and play system. If after Ive done this and I start getting perfect recordings with both systems I paid for I will be happy.

Also very frustrating when you ask a company for some sort of time frame on new software seeing as its been months and months and this is avoided. YOu could at least say hopeful in a month or give some sort of time frame. Buy avoiding this to me it looks like what ever software they are working on is not working.

Then you tell me after all this time it still will not work with the MY HD card or the Samsung box. So all this waiting and now that is not even been worked on.

I must say "BIG Disappointment"

Sorry for my rant but this is moving at such a slow pace and whats more frustrating is it is the only game in town which makes it more so.

By the way I was simply told to get my money back if I was not happy. My supplier does not give refunds. I have not heard any other offer to resolve this other than send everything in.

Alan, I had it work with your MYhd card with A4. So, I dont understand.

Not sure what your last paragraph meant. But, if you have spent money on something from 169time and it doesnt work, I would push Richard if wanting your money back is what you want to do. Again, since you have some of your stuff he never built, thats why he wants to take a look at it and see if it works for him.

I am getting a number of folks saying they are getting perfect stuff with the A4 PC s/w. Does this mean the JVC or Mits is causing issues. I have no idea.

The issues folks are having, with what 169time supports, (Which isnt the 165, etc), is basically NOT the s/w from what I can see. So, I cant lie and say new s/w will be coming and it will fix the issues. Now, if I worked for 169time, maybe I would take a different tack. ;)

To be honest, I havent had as much luck with the avx-1 as I feel I should have. But, because I use my dish5000's, I havent had to worry about it.
Now, I know I dont get everything but. So, if and when they turn off the dish5000, you know I will be all over Richards back. It looks like my environment isnt "clean" enough either. And can I get it fixed? Dont know.
All I know is there are some, who dont post either, who are having great success. There are others, some of post, and others who dont, who are not. Bottom line, if I had something from any company that didnt "work", I would just get my money back. This includes HD, which isnt the end of the world. I basically dont watch TV. I dont want to or make the time for it. I see it has a waste of my limited time on this earth. So, I try to take all this stuff in balance. Is it a pain, YEP. Is the an opportunity to come out with something that works "better" than 169time and basically kill the company, Yep. But, with all the parts we have to put together to make this work, for many, it works great.

So, bottom line Alan, is for some it looks like it may never work correctly for reasons I dont understand. Wish I had a better answer.

Dave

I defined the issues here over 15 months ago. I really don't see that definition changed. While the new software has been released, it was indeed slow in coming and the company expanded it's product line as an addition which further complicated the problems one man company has to deal with.
My original description was that this 169Time retrofit to the DirecTV receivers and a few others was a lab bench lever system requiring an experimenter's mindset to use. I said it was not a true consumer level product at that time. I still think this is so today. It was and still is the reason why I did not support Dave's wishes to see the 169Time system be reviewed by WSR. I think Gary actually did 169Time a favor by not reviewing it back then.

Now, considering how well it does work, once you figure out how to deal with all it's idiosyncrasies, dictated by your installation and environment, everyone must admit that without the 169Time recording system, we would have nothing. I agree with Dave that Richard has been quite above and beyond in helping others work out issues as I have heard no negative stories. Only ones like told by Alan where sending the stuff back for Richard's review and updating is a real inconvenience. That is understandable but I see it as the only way. It is the way all companies work except when you buy and pay for those in home service contracts.

Personal example- I suffered an intermittent change in the boot up of the AVX and called Richard for advice. He wanted to see it but I really didn't want to ship it back. After he explained that I was out of warranty anyway, I decided to open the case and discovered what I felt was a design flaw in the way e mounted the 1394 card on the MB. After I fixed it to my satisfaction, it began to boot up consistently and the way I expected. I won't discuss the details here but, the story is a case where I fond Richard quite helpful and cooperative on what ever I wanted to do to get it fixed.

Yes, I still have problems I don't feel should be part of a consumer product. Just last night I, once again got ready to record and the damn AVX was telling me it was not connected and seeing signal. So, I went though the start up process again and began to record but lost the first 5 minutes of the movie. Since the startup process takes me about 6-9 minutes, I simple failed to follow JBarrow's excellent advice and mine too, in #1 thing to do to record with 169Time.- Allow 20 minutes to get things ready! Normally, all I need is 3 minutes to connect the FW and run a quick test and if it passes, fine but if it fails we're into 6-9 minutes to reboot everything in the proper sequence. A consumer product shouldn't work that way although I know most will say computers all work that way. And, this IS a computer! So I suppose we should expect it to operate with much of the same set of idiosyncrasies.

Videohot-
A Poll- Good idea- Want me to do one? I have some thoughts on how to law one out but it WAS your idea. I'd like to see the results.

Id like some sort of time frame for the next software drop. I think myself along with other financial supporters are entitled to that considering its been what seams forever. To tell us I have no idea is not what I want to hear not when my hard earned money is in the companies pocket.

Of course we do not want an exact date but with in a months window I would think is more than reasonable. At least tell us something. That way I can decide to keep the product or sell it and other can decide to buy or wait.
Im in sales and with the forum I see many manufactures that directly communicate with the clients. Those manufactures are my strongest sales.

In this case we have no one from the company participating. We do have you who says your not associated in any way with the company but yet you do seam to respond with inside info at times.
We cant get any answer as to whats being worked on or even an estimate of a guess when the new software is coming. Everything is a secrete.

This definitely does not help the frustration.
And I am stuck with my equipment that does not work.

Don, I have not, and would not call this a "consumer" product. It never will be. Too many parts. So I agree with you that it was, is, and probably will always be an early adopter solution.

As with most internet stuff, you dont get the positive, much. I get lots of PM with folks recording away without any problems.

Again Alan, I wish this was a consumer product, and you didnt have the issues you do. But, what else are we to do. Again, if this was the s/w, how could anyone be having success?

Dave

Okay, Richard just chewed me out, so here is his post to me.

fyi

The truth is that the 169time products works in every case. Your post
contrary to that is not accurate.

169 has never had an instance where a problem could not be solved.

Solving problems is 169time's top priority. Customer cooperation is helpful
to achieve this.

It's like driving a car with a flat tire. Sure you can gripe that the tire
is flat, but until you take it in for service who is really at fault?

Many non-technical people regularly report having excellent results with
169time.com products with all types of receivers and with with no problems.

Although it is known that a software upgrade will improve playback
interoperability with some other OTA only boxes as Samsung 165, there is no
reason to believe at this time that software will correct Alan's problem.

fyi

Dave

PS: I dont believe I have ever said the 169time products dont work.
I have said in my case with the avx-1, I believe I have some "environmental" issues that I have yet to root cause and clean up.
This has nothing to do with the 169time solution per sa. I will be getting to this one day, again, am just too lazy to do now.

Alan,

If I were you I would just send my DTC-100 and AVX-1 in to Richard so he can test it. You say you have lots of movies recorded to hard drive so you can use those to show clients when showing them projectors....right? I know it will be an inconvenience to you but I think that is the solution to rid you of problems. I don't think a software update will fix it. It could mask the problems so they don't show up as much but I am getting perfect recordings now. I watched 3 hours of recorded AVX-1 content yesterday from HD-Net, HBO, and Disc-HD. It all played back perfect. Not one glitch, pixellation, dropout. Just a suggestion.

Mike

In my few weeks with the DTC-100/169time/avx-1(A4 software), recording to both PC’s and the JVC 30k, I am satisfied with my results. I have only watched two films in their entirely at this point, but I feel reasonably confident that if I see the transport stream being processed consistently by the avx-1 (using a separate monitor) while recording, then the playback of that stream through the JVC decoder will be excellent, if not perfect. It took me many months to become confident that my recordings with the Dish 5000/modulator to the Hipix card would be perfect, so my experience with 169time is a good start. The key for me (and I am guessing for most people) is using the JVC decoder. My 2 cents.

Dave- The problem is, and I think you agree with this, is that most people here want to think of it as a "consumer product with no issues"

Don, I agree.

Dave

For some time now I have wanted a way to record and time shift HDTV. I was ready to re-subscribe with my Dish Network 6000 and get the 169time solution when it was first released. I hadn’t looked into any of the details here in this forum – One of the biggest problems I had and really the reason I didn’t pay the big bucks for this was because as I read all the posts here it didn’t seem that the 169time solution lived up to the claims on their web site. Currently the claim is “Available Now! - 169time.com is the only company actually shipping the digital HDTV recording adapters you need to record perfect HDTV and enjoy playback equal in quality to the broadcast.”. Specifically where they say “adapters you need to record perfect HDTV…” keeps my money in my pocket.

I really want it work. I think 169time really wants it to work. It just seems that at least for now it is a long way from “perfect HDTV”. I am a tweaker.. I just don’t think I can spend that kind of money for the hope of getting the occasional perfect recording.

I constantly check here to see if it works yet.. I will continue to check here and will hope to be able to record and time shift with 169times equipment as soon as I can. It will need to work as promised and I would much rather be able to install it myself (I do have the experience and equipment to do it myself).

Hoping for a solution soon,

Mike

Mike,

From my experience, if you have a good satellite signal, a clean but not necessary spotless environment, and a JVC deck, you are very close to perfect, if not perfect recording with the avx-1.

Mike, if you have been on the internet long enough, if you were to read comments about ANY product, you would never purchase anything, since you can ALWAYS find someone who doesnt like something.

Bottom line, for the quantity of product 169time has shipped, I am still only aware of one person, wirehead rick, who asked and got their money back.
Please call Richard at 169time and ask him for data. As well, look at the number of folks who have posted they are fine.

Why did anyone purchase a JVC based on the issues? HOw about the samsung 165. ETc ETC.

It works! And, if 169time cant get it to work, I bet they will give your money back. Give them a chance, you will see what most of us have seen.

Dave

FYI

I just emailed Richard regarding sending my DTC100 for service due to picture freezes once or twice per movie for about one second and this was his response:


"The problem for needing to service the DTC100 is where there is no freezing but instead some pixelation of fast moving scenes. "

----- Original Message -----

A freeze appears to be more of a signal drop occurrence and probably would show up in the signal from the DTC as well. I'm still getting glitch-free recordings since getting my equipment back from Richard and JVC. Did Richard suggest that your problem was possibly a signal fade? Because he will take in anyone's DTC and look at it.

The freeze is not signal related.
I get these on both my dish6000 and my DTC100.
Audio continues uninterrupted. Just the video freezes momentarily numerous times per movie.

Talking to someone else last night who has reported he has been getting perfect recordings I found out he has not watched all his movies but listened to the sound from another room. I told him the audio will be fine but he can still have the video freeze glitch that many of us are having.

Now he is going to go back and watch his movies over again looking for this.

Those having good luck its good encouragement for us on the other side of the fence.

Alan, again, until you send you units to RIchard to be "certified", you may be spending a lot of time on something you can never fix.

Dave

anyone know if the via epia mini itx can run the avx1 software. I want one!

I re ran my wiring tonight allowing me to seperate my dish 6000
but it did not help like it did with the dtc 100. Im getting the video freezes every few minutes regardless what Ive tried.

I will contact Richard and start by sending this one in first.

Originally posted by Alan Gouger
I re ran my wiring tonight allowing me to seperate my dish 6000 but it did not help like it did with the dtc 100. Im getting the video freezes every few minutes regardless what Ive tried.

Alan, Do you have "Ferrite Chokes" on each end of your IEEE1394 cables?

Hi Wendall

Yes I do. Did not make a difference in my case.

Alan It's Larry......How did you make out with the longer firewire cable?

I spoke with Richard today and he was very attentive and concerned and more than willing to work with me to resolve my issues. Thanks Richard.
I am sending in some of my equipment to start the process to recovery.

Dave mentioned the A4 software in another thread and I figured I would ask some questions about it here.

Does the A4 software still have the requirement that you only use a 2 port firewire card? Also, my impression was that people were playing these back with software decoders (like Elecard) and not with decoders with hardware acceleration (like Sonic). On my 3.0 GHZ, 800 MHz bus, hyperthreaded P4 I can see that the framerate doesn't look quite up to snuff with the Elecard decoders and some other 169time recordings. I thought things looked good at first, but then noticed that playback wasn't quite as smooth as playing back through the 30k or other recordings with the Sonic decoders. I probably wouldn't have noticed on a screen smaller than my 116" wide High Power, but once I noticed the somewhat jerky playback it was hard to ignore. So, is this all fixed with the A4 software? Do the Sonic decoders work. Last time I tried the A4 I gave up after a little while and figured it might be because I have a 4 port firewire card in my computer.

Thanks,
Darin

The avx-1 A4 software requires that you use a 2 port firewire card for direct PC recording. You can also use the A4 software to record to a 3 port card if you wire it in line with a JVC 30k. I usually use the A4 software to record to a three port card, because I like to use the JVC 30k to monitor the signal, if not record simultaneously with the JVC 30k and the PC.

As you indicate, there are many software and hardware decoders that can be used to play back avx-1 streams. I have already expressed my preferences and discussed decoding alternatives in this thread. The Fusion and Sasem players seem promising, but they require the purchase of a tuner card, unless you are willing to use their demo software.

In general I get decent results with my 169 setup.

Proscan 105
AVX-1
Mits 2000 DVHS decks

6 ft of sepration for the AVX1 and ferrite chokes on all relavent cables. APC UPS with line filtering powering the above units. My startup process (listed in posts many moons ago) works every time without fail. I play back through the 105 which is connected via RGB to my Sanyo PLV-70 projector. No complaints at all regarding playback process or quality for any "non-glitched" video.

I occasionally pull the recordings off tape (the good ones) to PC using DVHSTool 2.13 and then encode using VirtualDubMod+WM9+AC3 with generally good results. I then put the results on recordable DVD media as files.

I occasionally see glitches but after many hours of trying to correlate what the root component for the glitches is, I have learned to be content and wait for the incremental improvements. I am anxious to get the A4 series software that will allow direct record to my HTPC so I can bypass the tape.

Any chance I can get A4 for testing with Mits 2000 as part of the equation (I know the Mits would not be necessary for PC recording...)?

Regards,
George

AFAIK, the A4 software adds nothing in terms of signal processing over the B3 software. As the web site states, "[T]his version is identical to version 0.8B3 except that it allows the user built AVX1 and it allows recording to PCs without the JVC deck connected."

I believe that you can still record to the PC with the B3 software using the JVC deck, but I can't vouch for the Mits, however.

Dave:

Anyword on adding Rainbow's Voom stb

LJG, whats a Rainbow voom stb?

I am not aware you can go straight to PC with B3. He changed it so the avx-1 looks like a DVHS deck in B4.

I think you should be able to get A4 from 169time. If not, write me and I will tell you where you can down load it from, if I can remember the darn passwords I set up.

Dave

Dave,

I'm referring to these posts about recording to the PC with B3 software. As I stated above, you need the JVC deck to do it, though.

Post 1 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=2284651#post2284651)

Post 2 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=2360269#post2360269)

Dave:

New DBS service starting October 1, see thread below


http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=300651

I saw. I loved Kens comment, it will have firewire in the future.
I just love this future stuff. Again, I have the stock market page.

Dave

I've been trying to follow this discussion, but have met with limited success.

I'm interested in the 169 solution for my E* 6000, but am not interested in DVHS. Based on what I've read, direct to hard drive recording seems to be working decently now, but that those with the most success still include the JVC 30K in the path. So, have people been able to consistently & successfully record from E*6000 to hard drive, without the need for a DVHS?

I'm only curious about recording, as I intend to play back with software via an ATI AIW.

The $1000 'sale' and ability to build one's own AVX-1 is making this a very tempting option.

Thanks!

I just watched entire recording of Windtalkers recorded 8:00 pm 9/13/03 on SHOHD and the entire tape was perfect.

Lon

Machiavelli,

You can record to a PC with a two-port firewire card using the A4 software (in my case with a DTC-100) without the need for a JVC 30k. I have personally recorded to hard disk without the JVC. That said, I prefer having the JVC 30k in the loop to monitor the picture during recording, and the JVC is my preferred decoder for playback. YMMV. If you do buy a system, please post your results.

Edit: PVR has posted good results with software decoding with the Fusion player. You will have to buy the Fusion tuner card to take full advantage of the software, however.

Thanks, yes, I'd read on 169time.com that direct to PC was now supported, I was just wanting to know if people were experiencing any problems with it (jitters, drops, etc, like people have been posting here about). I was particularly concerned about your statement that, "The key for me (and I am guessing for most people) is using the JVC decoder..."

Another question - are files stored on the hard drive as mpeg2 or ts?

Machiavelli,

I posted my first results with hard disk recording here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=2650410#post2650410). My procedures have changed somewhat since then. For some reason, my direct to PC recordings only worked with the lower port of my 2 port card, but Richard suggested that this should not be necessary.

I got the best playback results with the JVC decoder, whether played from tape or from the PC. There are many decoders that you can use, Hipix, MyHD, DTC-100, JVC 30k and many various software decoders. The Fusion software decoder sounds promising, but I don't own it. As I said before, I invite you to test them all and post your results. At least with PC recording, you won't be stuck with those bulky D-VHS tapes if you decide to archive. (I suppose you could always archive to a PC from D-VHS tape, but why bother if PC recording is your ultimate objective.)

Edit: With DVHSTool the file extension can be .ts, .tp or .trp. Also, I don't believe the quality of the PC recording is affected by using the JVC 30k vs. not using the JVC 30k (a stream is a stream), but I have not tested this extensively. It appeared the same in my short tests.

Steve
How do you playback from jard drive using the JVC?


Thanks!

Steve
How do you playback from hard drive using the JVC?


Thanks!

Alan,

My preferred method for playing through the JVC is the same as for playing back through the DTC-100. Please see my linked post above. Just be sure that the JVC deck has recognized the proper I-channel for your PC.

I have the Dish 6000 and AVX-1 and are trying to record LOR the Two Towers on PPV and it seems to be blocked from recording. I'm new at this and wonder if this is common to flag the PPV so they can't be recorded with the JVC 30000? This is my first attempt at recording PPV. Is anyone else experiencing this. I can see and record all other HD over the 6000 but not this PPV. I was under the impression we could record all PPV with this system.

Comments or suggestion??

thanks,
Steve

Maybe this is an old question (the threads have gotten so long its hard to tell): Is 169Time considering taking the software core from the AVX-1 and offering it as a custom PC encoder application for receivers with their 169 modification (thereby eliminating the need for a second PC for users wanting to use PCs for encoding rather than DVHS decks)?

Steve, you can record PPV if you have paid for it.

dave

Originally posted by xsrsmithx
I have the Dish 6000 and AVX-1 and are trying to record LOR the Two Towers on PPV and it seems to be blocked from recording. I'm new at this and wonder if this is common to flag the PPV so they can't be recorded with the JVC 30000? This is my first attempt at recording PPV. Is anyone else experiencing this. I can see and record all other HD over the 6000 but not this PPV. I was under the impression we could record all PPV with this system.

Comments or suggestion??

thanks,
Steve

could describe what is happening, what are you getting on tape, is the vcr shuting off ,does it display and error masages?

The web is wrong, it should say A4 for the s/w you can buy, they will update.

Dave

Originally posted by stjr
hidef1920,

Thanks also for the follow-up. You raise some interesting issues regarding software playback of HDTV files. I checked CPU utilization on software decoding with several of my HDTV files using an Athlon (Barton) 2500+ chip, both at standard speed and overclocked by about 27% (11x multiplier to 14x). CPU utilization routinely hit 100% with DVHSTool using the WinDVD4 filters and the Elecard filters at both speeds.

I then tried playback of the same files with the DVICO Fusion demo in non-DXVA mode (without overclocking the CPU), and CPU utilization never went above 80%. Quite an improvement. I wish that the DVICO software were available as a standalone player rather than as an integral bundle with the Fusion card. The demo version did not give me enough time (it shuts down after 1 minute) to truly evaluate its suitability to play back avx-1 captured files.

My initial point is that I'm not sure if 1080i display with the Radeon card is equal to the 1080i display of the DTC-100 or JVC-decoders. More specifically, the issue IMO relates to 1080i sourced files played at 1080i or 1080p with the Radeon card in the overlay mode. Even if the the CPU is not over-utilized, there is still is a "half rez" issue as discussed here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=2238217#post2238217).

Alan,

Good news on your recording results. I think it might take a while before avx-1 files can be made fully compatible with the MyHD or Samsung decoders.

what is the difference in dvxa mode and nondxva mode, back when the software first appeared it was said that to get full res; and not half res - vertically i believe, that you had to use dxva mode.
so besides the half res problem when using certain ati cards *( the issue talked about in the above link) is there not a half res issue too if the software is used in non dxva mode. this would explain why there is less cpu utilization in non dxva mode with this decoder vs other decoders..

tonyb100,

There is nothing that I can see from my visual observation that shows reduced resolution using the Fusion player in non-DXVA mode when compared to the other HDTV software players. If you can point to a thread that discusses the issue, I would appreciate it. Unfortunately, my video card locked up in the DXVA mode with 1080i source files.

I believe the "half rez" issue is a separate Radeon driver issue that will present itself with any playback of 1080i source files in the overlay mode.

The purpose of my experimentation is to find a decoder that works well for the playback of axv-1 streams. I am posting my results in the hope that other people who have tested various decoders will also post their findings.

h2ofun

All I get is total pixelation or no image or audio at all. If I go to HBO or other HD channels they are just fine and will record just fine. Have rebooted many times and unplagued firewire cables. Nothing seems to allow this video to pass. I get no error messages on the screen and nothing on the recording.

Update: I did get it for a minute after being off for about an hour and only when I put in an SVHS tape. I tried to put a DF420 back in and lost it again. It's over now, so I can't try anything else. I'm assuming since I did get it to show up for a few minutes, I should be able to work with it and get it to record. Will try again another time. It seems to be very sensitive on the PPV versus the standard HD channels.

Steve

Steve, I would take it one step at a time. The last thing I would try is a PPV. So, can you get HBO, SHO? What setup are you using?
Have you called 169time and talked to RIchard?

Dave

Originally posted by stjr
tonyb100,

There is nothing that I can see from my visual observation that shows reduced resolution using the Fusion player in non-DXVA mode when compared to the other HDTV software players. If you can point to a thread that discusses the issue, I would appreciate it. Unfortunately, my video card locked up in the DXVA mode with 1080i source files.

I believe the "half rez" issue is a separate Radeon driver issue that will present itself with any playback of 1080i source files in the overlay mode.

The purpose of my experimentation is to find a decoder that works well for the playback of axv-1 streams. I am posting my results in the hope that other people who have tested various decoders will also post their findings.

yes we are talking about two different things, and i was not sure if the non dxva dvxa res issue was a rumor or not. so thought i would ask.. i will look for the thread it is soooo old tho

h2ofun

I have had the system for about 3 weeks now and have had no problems with any channels or recordings. This is the first time I tried PPV. I have my AVX-1 14' away from the recorder and the Dish 6000. I take no other precautions with power and don't have chokes on the firewire lines. All of my other recordings have been perfect. My JVC30000 is an early unit without the fix. Have never had any recording problems with it over the last year. I don't seem to have recording problems like many others have experienced except for this PPV channel. I will try another PPV in a few days and see if I still have the same problem. If I do, I will call Richard.

Steve

I had a strange occurence. I taped CARNIVALE (sp), which is on HBO, and STREET TIME, which is on SHO, back to back last Sunday evening.

I did not reboot, etc. between shows. When CARNIVALE was over I simply changed the channel to SHO for STREET TIME without stopping the VCR.

I noticed no problems while recording.

Last evening I decided to watch the tape.

My setup to record is via the DTC-100 and MITS. My setup to playback is a second MITS connected via firewire to my MITS 73711.

During playback of CARNIVALE the TV would turn itself off after about two minutes of playback. The TV, after resetting itself and allowing me to turn it back on, would show "Power Failure.......". I would then attempt to play again with the same result. I attempted playback with my 30K with identical results.

The really strange part is that STREET TIME played back w/o a glitch (actually it had the usual periodic audio dropouts).

Steve, sorry, out of ideas at the moment.

Dave

Steves link to a 2 port firewire card. I havent tried.

http://www.acortech.com/.sc/ms/dd/1064606445263076/9/nc/Controller%20Cards--FIrewire%20Card/957/%20VIA%20IEEE%201394%202%20Port%20PCI%20Card%20Retail%20Bo<br%20/>x


dave

For info

Last night at 3 Am recorded "two Towers" from HBO PPV HD channel
directly to HD tape. Hughes E86, JVC 30000 with correct firmwire and Avis-1.

Watched this morning.

Out of 3 hours only 2 freezes of 1/4 second, still had picture and sound.

So brief not a problem or disruption in viewing.

Just adding to knowledge base

I do not have first eposode of the three , so if anyone has the first in HD tape (decent quality), not from computer, I would be interested. email me

Thanks

did the hbo ppv have dd 5.1 sound?

The PPV channel is not affiliated with HBO. Most movies generally are in 5.1 sound, as I assume LOTR would be.

I must be really dense. I can't for the life of me figure out how to order the damn show in advance. I don't want to call it in since they ding you for an additional $5. Can't use the web site since I'm a 'Pegasus' customer and not a real DirecTv subscriber. Long rural cable franchise story. What am I missing?

Sorry my mistake
It was DircTV HDPPV, 5.1 sound and not HBO HD.

I have also recorded some HDnet movies but they do not show logo for HD but per this forum they are all in HD.

I was the one who attempted to record a non-hd broadcast it was DirecTv chanel 103 kind of grouped in with the othr HD channels and get the piucture but no sound.

So question I have noticed that HBO and Showtime HD channels often list movies and no 'HD" logo or these recoredable in HD format or not ???
or due I have to recird in SVHS ??

Quite pis#$$# / upset that we are paying for HBO and Showtime HD channelss and many if not 50% do not have "HD" logo. If thses are not recordeable then these are not broadcast in the HD stream. Right?


Thinks

xfactor: I ordered / taped two HD Directv movies and they were in stereo, NOT in DD 5.1. I was a bit upset after I realised it....

Originally posted by bwooster
xfactor: I ordered / taped two HD Directv movies and they were in stereo, NOT in DD 5.1. I was a bit upset after I realised it....
I know a few months ago they were not 5.1 sound, although it was my understanding that the new movies are all in 5.1. When did you record these movies?

JBarrow,

You can record anything on ShowtimeHD or HBOHD with the 169time regardless of whether it is being shown in native HD. Even the non-HD material is upconverted to 1080i on these two channels, and the 169time system therefore can record this signal.

Thanks for the info on recording of non hd on HBO HD and Showtime HD channels

Just read an article about Directv planning to release a PVR similar to Dish network PVR-921 early 2004.
check out TWICE.com

I received a MYHD card yesterday . So far I am vastly disappointed with its compaibility. I find the fusion 2 HDTV card twice as easy to use and has no dropouts just the picture freezes. I would recommend zoomplayer pro for playing back avx-1 recorded hdtv files because it plays back with no dropouts. It is cheap. Do not waste your money on any HDTV decoder card for playing back avx-1 recorded material as it is useless. The avx-1 must ouput a stream that is not compatible with anything only the JVC 30K except a few software codecs seems to work.

I had it working fine before I sent it to you. I Had to have teh new drivers though. Since you have the card now, I cant return it on to tell you my config.

Dave

Originally posted by wildchild22
I would recommend zoomplayer pro for playing back avx-1 recorded hdtv files because it plays back with no dropouts. Thank you for this report. I was thinking about purchasing the Fusion II card for playing back avx-1 files, but now I won't bother.

Could you give me more specifics on the playback of avx-1 files with Zoomplayer Pro. What filters should be used? What speed processor is necessary? My Atlhon 2500+ Barton PC was not fast enough to decode avx-1 files using DVHSTool, even when overclocked, with either the WinDVD4 or the Elecard filters.

Okay I have a barton 2500+ I am using elecard filters for video playback and nvideo audio filters . I have my amd using a 13.5 multiplier and it shows between 50-72% usage when playing back. I would recommend the fusion 2 for ease of recording to pc hard drive all you have to do is hit dvhs mode and hit play then record and tell it how long. But playback is better through zoomplayer. All i did was install nvida dvd player then after I installed the elecard player 2.1 . After install of the elecard player go in under start menu and unregister moonlight odio dekoda and then zoomplayer will use the nvideo audio filter.

More report info on both the fusion2 and myhd 100.

I have 3 169time products

in under of most compatibility

Directv dtc100 is watchable with the myhd except macroblocking which lasts 1/4 of a sec every 15 secs on the myhd. On the fusion it is almost flawless picture freezes every few mins for under a sec.

Starchoice some channels are almost perfect on the myhd and fusion but others are terrible with blackouts lasting of 30 secs to 1 min and the picture just freezes till the time has past. On the myhd the picture does not freeze just severe macro blocking.

On Bellexpressvu almost all channels are unwatchable at all on the myhd. On the fusion there is a big drop in frame rate probably only viewing 50-70% of the frames.



Perhaps Dave when you were testing with the myhd with directv you were waching on the pc screen where the macroblocking is so quick you wouldn't notice it. I made a VGA break out cable and watched on my hitachi 51swx20B and it is apparent there but not on the small pc window.


In conclusion with my testing the avx-1 playback is best through zoomplayer. Flawless unless you want to use a JVC deck. It can be recorded using dvhs tools and also graphedit but with the fusion 2 card you only have to start the recording and it will stop on a timer. A very nice feature. Just need dvinco to add support to start a dvhs deck recording at a certain time

All my recordings from all systems can be played back though zoomplayer
flawless as with the JVC 30K. If there is a re-sync on the avx-1 during recording zoomplayer recovers quickly where it is software decoded instead of using the hardware decoder on the JVC deck. They are not noticeable by everyone in the room except for you with zoomplayer because if you are like me you see all the imperfections instead of watching the movie you look for how good it looks or how pixelated it is.

I didnt us a PC monitor to watch the HD output of the card since it was RGB and I was lazy. This is why I dont like using PC based solutions. One persons work and another doesnt. Weird

Dave

Wildchild22,

Wow, thanks. I was going to try all kinds of playback combinations, but this has helped me immensely.

I don’t own the Fusion II card for recording to hard disk. I am using DVHSTool for hard disk capture of avx-1 files. Is the quality of a DVHSTool capture as good as a Fusion II capture? If there is a difference, I would consider buying the Fusion II card, but if it doesn’t make a difference, I won’t be in a rush.

I think PC based solutions are good, because you can always copy the media files to different recording media using error correction later. I wouldn’t necessary trust the ability of one D-VHS deck to make a perfect dub to another deck, given the incapability of the various decks. At least with a Windows file, you can have high confidence that you’ve made a bit perfect copy without actually playing back the file.

There is no difference in recording from the fusion or dvhstools or graphedit. I like using the fusion card and hopefully they will improve their software a little bit more.

wildchild22,

Thanks again for the clarification. I've found that graphedit and DVHSTool provide identical performance for recording, but the MyHD software does not work as well for recording or playback of avx-1 files through its own decoder, the DTC-100 decoder or the JVC 30k decoder.

As I've said before, it would be great if someone could create a function for timed recording of avx-1 files to the PC. At least the Fusion software provides some control for now.

Others have reported using PC "macro software" to schedule an "event" that pushes the Fusion software record button at a later time.

I am looking into this, but it may be a way to cobble together a way to schedule future AVX1 recordings without having to wait for DVico to update their software.

Tonight I tried playing avx-1 files with the Zoomplayer pro demo using the Elecard demo filters. It was not pretty. My CPU usage went to 100% and the frame rate dropped to slow motion.

Not so with the Fusion demo that I used to play the same files. CPU usage stayed in the 60% range and played smoothly. I don't get it.

This is a Barton 2500+ processor on an Asus KT-333 chipset motherboard, 256 meg ram. Would an N-force board work better? I'm reluctant to spend money on software that I can't get good results from with a demo version.

I have a abit NF-S board with 512megs of ram.

So my only other possibility for glitch free playback of avx-1 files from hard disk without spending more money is to use the JVC decoder. However, I have noticed a few non-repeatable glitches when playing back from hard disk using DVHSTool that I do not get when playing back from D-VHS tape. I need to test this a little more, because at first I thought that hard disk playback and D-VHS tape playback through the JVC decoder were equivalent.

Originally posted by PVR
Others have reported using PC "macro software" to schedule an "event" that pushes the Fusion software record button at a later time.Macro software would be another incentive to go with the Fusion card for avx-1 timed PC recordings. I still need to find out what software decoder has the best playback for my PC's.

in under dvhs tools make sure to set it to run at above normal pririty that removed all studders from mine.

If you are having high CPU usage by the Elecard filters, try to make sure that the "do postprocess" option (on the filter) is not enabled.

Preferred playback is somewhat VGA card and desktop resolution specific.

My preferred playback using GeForce4 MX440:
#1: DVHStools with Elecard filters
#2: Fusion software in DXVA mode.

Some people swear by the Sonic filters with ATI Radeon cards...

Talk about recording with a non-computer recording system.

Like to get some feedback of good sucesses

Per stjr
Just info, due to the new high speed CPU's over 933 Mhz the bottle neck is hard drive speeds. No more L2 cach accept on the CPU chip.
The problem now is getting data to memory / CPU and both run at high speeds.

It seems you have a pretty good motherboard and chipset as well as CPU speed.

Major reccommendations from many sources is to increase memory for best results. Its cheaper now then years ago. 256 mag memory seems quite low to me, possible below specs for xp and bottom of win98 requirements.

An increase memory will allow much faster processing of data.
You may have noted the new ATA133 and Sata 150 drives which are an attempt to resolve this bottle neck. Another problem is cable length from motherboard to drive ATA66 to 133 limits length to 18 inches. Just a problem of getting signal. Not knowing your hard drive a old EIDE drives were 33 with 40 pin/ wire cables . The new ATA 66,100,133 ALL REQUIRE new 40 pin 80 wire cable.. they needed to ground each pin seperately to improve data transfer/signal.

Of course you could go to SCSI and striped raid drives :)

I run only Asus with P4 of course everone has their choice.
My primary computer is Asus P4C800 , Intel P4 2.8 2 gig DDR memory with
a set of 200 gig mirrored drives ( raid 1) which copies everything to both drives, one goes bad all data also on 2nd drive. I also have a striped set of 4 200 gig drives ( raid 0 ) which splits data up to write & read to multiply drives, for significant speed increase. An example would be a 512 byte file would be written as 4 -128 bytes one set to each drive, major problem if you lose one drive ALL data is lost. Drives can be formated for data or Audio video data.

Back to primary suggestions: increae memory and check out your hard drive speed. If your hard drive is an old EIDE 33 you really need to upgrade as audio video files or long and need to be streamed fast.
Also do not get misled with "bust speed on hard drive" it is only a cache wich runs empty pretty quick and is pretty useless with the need for high speed LONG/BIG files such as audio and video.

Hope this helps




I run Asus , Intel P4 2.6 and have 2 gig memory.

DVR, JBarrow and wildchild22,

Thanks for your suggestions. For what it's worth, the "do postprocess" option is not enabled when I use the Elecard filters, so that is not the solution to my high CPU usage issue.

On the memory side of things, I still notice over 100KB of physical memory still available in Task Manager when I use the Elecard filters, but I will have to examine the page faults a bit more closely to see if virtual memory is slowing me down.

I don't understand how hard disk speed is an issue. I am using a 5400 RPM ATA 100 disk in a PIII 800 PC for recording with my Hipix card and everything runs smoothly.

I tried registering the Elecard video filters and the Nvidia audio filters in Zoomplayer, but I could not get them both registered at the same time. The only audio filters that I could register separately from the Elecard video filters were the Fusion AC3 audio filters. It's somewhat of a moot issue until I get the CPU usage down.

As I said, the Fusion demo player still runs fine on my system with 60% to 70% usage in non-DXVA mode. DXVA mode locks up the system. I have disabled tiling on my Radeon 7200 in order to run a 1080i overlay. Could this be the cause of DXVA incompatibility? Although the Fusion player does not look quite as crisp at 1080i with the Radeon card relative to the other decoders at 1080i, it is not bad. I could live with it if the glitches on playback of avx-1 files are minimal.

Steve, that is one old computer

dave

The PIII computer is old, but it runs relatively coolly and quietly with the Hipix hardware. It also serves as my avx-1 processor when I boot on the avx-1 CD. It's too bad that I can't play avx-1 files glitch free when I boot the PC to the Windows OS. I was hoping to get better success with a 2500+ Barton processor, but as you can see, even that has been problematic for me.

My main HiPix PC is an AMD K6 400MHz... Win98SE. Runs the HiPix just fine.

For software playback I have a 2.4GHz P4 machine (WinXP) with 533FSB, Rambus 1066 memory, and an 8xAGP GeForce 4MX440 card. Having a fast VGA bus, and fast memory helps things quite a bit.

Hard disk is basically never a bottleneck. Any modern hard drive (even 5400RPMs UDMA/33) is fast enough to spool ATSC data.

Originally posted by stjr
The PIII computer is old, but it runs relatively coolly and quietly with the Hipix hardware. It also serves as my avx-1 processor when I boot on the avx-1 CD. It's too bad that I can't play avx-1 files glitch free when I boot the PC to the Windows OS. I was hoping to get better success with a 2500+ Barton processor, but as you can see, even that has been problematic for me.

Steve,
I am convinced that you need to upgrade your PC. Video is the most demanding application for every PC. Just for info, in addition to regular HD Movies I am running 3D video applications with a resolution of 1440x480 (= 720x480 per eye) in mpeg2, quite comparable to HD. I tested several PCs, and it all boils down to CPU power and FAST and a lot of RAM. Here is the order of performance (best first):

1. P4 3.0 GHZ 800 FSB with 1GB of dual channel DDR 400 RAM (Asus P4C800-E), SATA 150, 160GB: CPU utilization 3D and HD ~20-30%

2. P4 3.06 GHZ 533 FSB with 1GB of RAMBUS PC 1066 RAM (IWill MB), ATA 133, 8MB Cache: CPU utilization 60-65%.

3. P4 2.66 GHZ 400 FSB, 1GB Rambus PC 800 RAM (IWill MB), 2xATA 100 striped: CPU utilization: 70-90%

4. P4 2.4 GHZ 533 FSB, 1GB standard DDR PC 2100 RAM (First MB), ATA 133: CPU utilization 95-100, lots of jitter and stuttering.

In all cases I used a NVidia Quadro 750XGL.

This might give you an idea of what to upgrade.

To all who record to PC:

I promised to report back on my tests using the old TSPCAP filter rather than the new DVHSTOOL 2.13 TSPCAP filter when recording to PC. (see my earlier post some pages up). I have watched several full length recording using the changed settings and the old TSPCAP filter. The result is: NO GLITCHES - 100% PERFECT RECORDINGS WHATSOEVER.
I still hope, it's not pure luck, but a glitch has yet to happen.

If anyone ever needs to download my old TSPCap filter, you get get that from the DVHS HOWTO web page. But don't download the TSP2SP from that page, as it is way too old and buggy. ;)

PVR, hidef1920 and leszek1,

This is great information for evaluating what I need to do. My mouth is drooling at the system I will need to put together to get what I hope will be glitch-free recording and playback of avx-1 files at 1080i in software. Since I am not into gaming with my PC's, I have to seriously consider if the $1000 or so of parts I might need is worth the cost, especially since avx-1 recording and playback is the only reason I need the hardware. Maybe I'll purchase a Fusion card and limp along for a while, since the Fusion software doesn't seem to require a super-fast PC.

I could settle for a slightly less perfect solution, or one that would promise glitch free playback of avx-1 files from the PC through the JVC 30k decoder. If worse comes to worse, I could always start accumulating those bulky D-VHS tapes (ouch!), since they seem to have the best shot at glitch free playback with the JVC deck. My first film recorded and played back from D-VHS tape was glitch free.

I didn't realize that there was an old TSPCap filter that was different from the one in DVHSTool 2.13. Is that the filter posted in the paragraph entitled "Creating a filter graph for capturing an MPEG2 transport file from a D-VHS video tape (info mostly for developers)"? If not, could someone post a link?

My avx-1 captures with DVHSTool 2.13 are still pretty good when played back through the JVC 30k decoder, but they are not perfect. I seem to get re-syncs every half hour or so on playback, where the video seems to slow down for about a second. These glitches are not repeatable upon a second playback. If the old filter works better (in graphedit I presume), then I will give it a try.

Originally posted by stjr
I didn't realize that there was an old TSPCap filter that was different from the one in DVHSTool 2.13. Is that the filter posted in the paragraph entitled "Creating a filter graph for capturing an MPEG2 transport file from a D-VHS video tape (info mostly for developers)"?

Yes that's the one. I wrote the original TSPCap. Rick (The author of DVHSTool) took over the filter and added support for multiple files etc. In theory, if you set the new filter to single file mode, you should have the same experience with both filters.

I suppose if I have installed DVHSTool 2.13, then the new TSPCap filters will have overwritten the old ones.

I am currently using a file size of approximately 140 MB with DVHSTool in order to mirror the size of files with my Hipix recordings. If I move to a single file capture mode, the file size will certainly be more unwieldy and I will be forced to use an NTFS partition in order to get a feature length film recording.

Did I get this right? Even if I get the old filters working (or use single file capture mode with DVHSTool 2.13), there is still no assurance that this the solution for glitch free avx-1 PC recording, is there? At least this is an interesting hobby that keeps me out of other trouble.

Does anyone have any feedback from Richard as to whether he intends to "play" with the new HD tivo from DirecTV when it comes out?

He, and I, love to "play" with lots of stuff. He will never officially comment
as to what may happen, since, as many of you know, that got them in trouble a long time ago. I, listening to this forum, try to gather inputs
as to what type of HD products 169time can do that would help both the company and consumers.

Dave

Is there going to be another release of his CD software to help in eliminating dropouts?

OFF TOPIC-

I received a note from tonyb100 today. His health has taken a turn for the worse. Please try to remember him in your thoughts and prayers.

Jim, at some point, but, the dropout issue is not 100% avx-1.

Don, sorry to hear about tonyb. I never heard from him what he was fighting.

Dave

If this has been discussed, my apologies.

I have one of the refurbed JVC 30ks and an extra Dish 6000 from the recent promotional. I am interested in archiving content from HBO, Showtime, HDNet Movies and Discovery HD eventually to Windows Media 9, after first capturing to the JVC with a 169 unit. Does anyone know if the tools and techniques discussed elsewhere on the Forum will work to do WM9 archiving of such HD content to regular DVD-R?

Thanks

Interesting, I just got a PM on this.

The only data point Richard has is one customer tried and said he got some glitches. Neither Richard or I have tried this.

Dave

Originally posted by Joseph Clark
If this has been discussed, my apologies.

I have one of the refurbed JVC 30ks and an extra Dish 6000 from the recent promotional. I am interested in archiving content from HBO, Showtime, HDNet Movies and Discovery HD eventually to Windows Media 9, after first capturing to the JVC with a 169 unit. Does anyone know if the tools and techniques discussed elsewhere on the Forum will work to do WM9 archiving of such HD content to regular DVD-R?

Thanks

Yes it does. Just get the ts files to the PC, then:
- Open WM9 encoder, go to properties, sources
- Click File, browse to location where ts files are saved (you need to select 'All Files' under the 'Files of type' box),
- Import ts file(s), wait up to a couple of minutes until file is loaded
- Click output tab, check 'Archive to file', uncheck 'Pull from encoder', browse and select file name and output location,
- Click Compression, Destination=File download, click Edit, select 'Quality VBR' for Video and Audio, click Quality Based Tab, set Quality to 90 (for me Audio only works with 2 channel 90/44 khz, because I don't have the WINDVD Audio decoder)
- Click ok, go to Video Size, 'Method'- Custom Crop Bottom=8
- Go to 'Processing', click inverse telecine (if HBO or SHT OAR Movie)
- Click Apply, wait and then click 'Start encoding'.
Be sure to slide the lower bar of the TOOLS_OPTIONS_PERFORMANCE to the second mark from the left, otherwise it will take forever to encode.

What you get is a movie in 1280x720 with a quality as good as the original (including glitches if the original had glitches).

hidef1920,

Thanks for the detailed instructions. I should have mentioned that I don't yet have a 169Time mod. Feedback here is going to determine whether I make that investment. I tried your method with some OTA Raymond and Alias ts files I had from my HiPix and WM9 Encoder froze up each time I tried to open the files. Am I missing a step, or is the 169 ts file just very different from an OTA broadcast ts file?

Hi Joseph,

I wrote a very detailed guide on encoding HD with WME9 and posted it in the HTPC forum. It is a soup to nuts treatise, specifying everything you will need to do one and two-pass VBR transcoding of HDTV transport stream sources. It also includes download links for all the software you will need to get started. I have encoded nearly 200 movies in WM9, and not one of them has a single glitch. If you start with clean transport stream files you will get clean results. Glitchy ts sources tend to crash the encoder. But the encoder does NOT introduce glitches if none exist in the source.

Just click the link in my signature for more information.

--Jerome

jsaliga,

Thanks for the work. I've downloaded the guide and the software. I'll be digging in over the next few days.:)

I ordered the 169time AVX-1 and 6000 mods a week ago but fortunately nothing has been built yet. Newbe question: Can all this computer stuff (AVX-1, recording to hard disk, playback using DVI all be done using the same computer??? I know it is possible to dual boot a computer (I guess that means run multiple operating systems concurrently), so should I be considering a high end windows media server with the AVX-1 all on the same computer? I would like to avoid having more than one computer in the target theater since all the hardware (including 50" DLP Sammy are house in a massive amoire. And if this is possible, will I be able to record to Hard Disk and playback another video from Hard Disk at the same time?

you need two computers no way around it.

The avx-1 unit needs to be a PIII class computer with the A4 software, but I am still trying to figure out what CPU is necessary for the PC used to capture the avx-1 transport stream. I have been using a Celeron 1 gig tualatin PC for capture, but there have been a few glitches capturing and playing back to the JVC decoder with DVHSTool, so I will probably substitute my Barton 2500+ PC to see how it works.

My gut reaction is that this is a software issue, but we shall see. At least my Barton PC is using an NTFS partition, so it is more practical to use the old TSPCap filters.

Anyone put a timer on the system to allow recording from 169time to hard drive for WM9 encoding when you're not home? Maybe a macro?

how about some feedback of people that don't use computers to record to?
What about people that only use the 3 piece set up like the set top box ,the avx & the 30000.

never here talk about that

By the way,
Just a note... I've been getting good HDTV recording results when keeping
the AVX as far away as possible from the other units (Set top box & DVHS)

Like to hear results on that from users that have the 3 piece set up.
Not computer recording results.

What does "good" recording results mean?

Yrall

I agree you do not see many posts for this set-up as I expect there are fewer problems. When things go well people don't complain or post.

I use a 3 piece set up.
STB ( Hughes E86) to JVC30000 to Avix-1
No problems all tapes seem very good / excellent.
- I use granite firewire cables with ferrite cores on each end
- Firewire cable from STB to JVC 3 ft long equipment 24 inchs apart
- Firewire cable from JVC to Avix 10 ft but equipment 5 to 6 ft away.
No problems
Recorded "two Towers" 3 hours had 3 very minor like 1/4 second freze but did not distract from movie,,, sound Ok just a brief freze.

I have seen worse at movie theaters. also I have same problem with just standard watching HD movies stright from STB to HDTV. So I expect signal strength may be the promblem

Been reading thread for quite a while and it seems that there may be multiply causes for problems when recording to PC's.
- JVC30000 firmware not upgraded, a problem with early JVC mine were purchased after JVC fixed problem.
- Signal strength
- Interference from other equipment not shielded / giving off IF signal interderance
- Power supply to house , low voltage, power surge .. even a motor starting up in the house , such as a blower for heat/cooling
- Had a friend in a new subdivision and power to house seemed ok BUT his PC would reboot 2 or 3 times per hour. He resoved problem with a backup power supply which also maintained steady voltage and frequence ( 60 cycles) This is a problem that most people would not notice but long runs from substration and can cause this type of problem which impacts very sensitive equipment such as PC's etc.

Moving Avix away to avoid onterference may help or hinder, the longer the cable more signal loss. One may be trading one problem for another. I do not know off hand what the length for firewire is but I think once you go over 10 ft you may have a signal strength loss. This based on PC use of firewire.
Most posts seem to deal with recording to PC's and a lot depends on ability to handle the heavy signal data. Also seems to be various PC cards being used. I only know what I have seen posted and have not attemped to record to PC .. like a dummy I plan to try it out. BUT very happy with TAPE results.


Good Luck

I should of said 100% perfection.
All except sometimes the HD providers decide to mess with the signal.

Ever since I moved the AVX away from the other components,everything is
working great.

I just like to hear from other users that tried this & see what the outcome is.

Note:
when I say "good / excellent" It means either no problems or a few less than 3 and are less then 1/4 second. Primarily it does not impact the enjoyment of the movie.

On a scale of 1 to 10 I rate my tapes at 9 .

I have seen movies at thearter that were worse like lossing sound , picture not focus etc, and would rate thearter at 6 to 8.. remember you have all those other people talking and eating etc.

Just watching HDTV from Directv I have encountered frezes rate it at 9

Watching OTA HD one channel 8/9 another at 4/5 and sometimes -2.


Good Luck

Hello JBARROW
Thanks for the post.
According to Richard at 169,I was told not to exceed 15 feet of firewire.
The one I have is 14.5 feet that I purchased from Radio Shack.
With firewire it itself is internally shielded & should be pretty decent for long
runs.
Glad to see that things are going good for you too.
I did notice a problem when recording on the Panasonic tape that I got from 169.... Color Bar tape I recorded on it a few times & always have a problem with some kind of dropout.

I use the JVC brand 300 minute tape as well as the Maxell 300 minute type.
Usally I repack the tapes before use by fast fowarding & rewinding them to
hopefully might help when recording.(just in case)

Dish network is just about ready to release the 921 PVR,but I keep hearing the
Ieee-1394 firewire won't be in use yet,so I'm happy with my results with this set up,even though it's a 3 piece set up.

JVC & the other DVHS manufacturers should incorporate a full HDTV tuner inside the HDVCRs,this way everything is a all in one deal.
The 921 will take away 1 of the units in the chain but still no guarantee if the firewire port is enabled to record via firewire to the DVHS VCRS,that the signal will be not 100% High Definition because of the precious movie
studios don't want us subscribers to have it.

Any feedback welcomed,

I WONDER HOW ALAN IS DOING OUT THERE?
HI ALAN HOW'S IT GOING/

Originally posted by yrral
By the way,
Just a note... I've been getting good HDTV recording results when keeping
the AVX as far away as possible from the other units (Set top box & DVHS)

Like to hear results on that from users that have the 3 piece set up.
Not computer recording results.

I have been getting better results by putting my avx 12' away from everything laying it in the middle of the floor. Not perfect however I am getting almost perfect recordings.

I also used ferrite's on all of the Fire-wire cables including the power cables.

Another thing I did that helps is I used ground lifter plugs on all the equipment and connected the Antenna ins up to the DTC100 and the recorder. That way the two units get grounded together via antenna cables instead of power cords (No ground loops).

Next I'm going to install the AVX-1 in the basement below the theater. That way I won't have to walk around it in the middle of the floor.

There has to be a way to make the AVX-1 less picky. I think it will take a lot of trial and error to get to the bottom of this problem but feel that it will be fixed.

Just as a note, since installing the antenna in to the JVC, I can now view in fast forward mode during an OTA recording to skip commercials. That was an added benefit I didn't expect. I really enjoy this , especially for Alias, on Sunday nights.

Jeff

Has anyone just left the AVX-1/DCT100 running for a few days without shutting down or rebooting? A friend has loaned me his for a while, and I was taping material so often that I found it to be easier just to let it run. I recorded from different channels on D* for three or four days and the recordings are all perfect.

The AVX-1 will eventually run out of something? but does just quit after a few days. MIne will run sometimes fine for 4 days and then need rebooting, other times I have it running for 7-8 days before it times out.
Keep in mind that I use a MItsubishi and one thing we have learned with these 169Time systems is that they all work differently depending on each configuration. I know that tony100b has confirmed my reports of timing out after an undetermined and variable number of days.

Without shutting down, etc. mine will become unresponsive enough to need a cold boot reset. This seems to occur more with the current software.

Nothing else seems to work except the unplugging.
Jeff

I just thought I would contribute my 2 cents worth here. I set up my 169time system about a week ago , and have had absolutely no problems whatsoever. All of my recordings from my Expressvu 6000 have been perfect so far. I'm using an old Dell Celeron 500Mhz mini-desktop PC, I picked up for about $70US used, and an IOGear 3 port firewire card. I've got my JVC deck on a shelf above my Expressvu reciever, and the celeron 500 about 4 feet away sitting on the floor. The firewire cable that came with the HDVR kit is really long (like 10 feet or longer) so I have it bundled up in back of the receiver since the JVC deck is less than a foot away. I'm using a 6 foot firewire cable between the JVC and the Dell based AVX1. I recorded LOTR: Two Towers the other night, and the 3 hour recording was absolutley flawless. Right now I'm 110% satisfied with the system!

Marc.

Marc,

1. Do you have the older serial number JVC?

2. I see network dropouts all time when viewing the BEV 6000 outputs when in Canada, do you?

No, it one of the newer serial numbers. I haven't seen any drop outs that aren't weather/signal related so far. I'm a happy camper.

Marc.

I may have jinxed my self and spoke too soon. I watched a tape I made from NBC last night and noticed a few 'patches' of metallic looking sparklies occasionally. It was nothing major, but noticeable. None of my PPV recordings have had this. Strange. Does anyone know the cause of this?

Marc.

Originally posted by Marc D Carra
I may have jinxed my self and spoke too soon. I watched a tape I made from NBC last night and noticed a few 'patches' of metallic looking sparklies occasionally. It was nothing major, but noticeable. None of my PPV recordings have had this. Strange. Does anyone know the cause of this?

Marc.
Any chance it was from the broadcast? The 169time system has been EXTREMELY reliable with OTA recordings. If it wasn't in the broadcast, I would not be surprised if your D-VHS deck caused the problem.

Actually, I taped the NBC stuff from the Expressvu sat feed, not OTA. So I'm not sure what it was.

Marc.

Originally posted by Marc D Carra
I watched a tape I made from NBC last night and noticed a few 'patches' of metallic looking sparklies occasionally Marc, could you be more specific about the location of the sparklies? I sometimes see some white flashes of light in the lower right-hand corner of the frame when I play tapes recorded with the avx-1 through the JVC 30k deck. If I had more overscan on my set, I might not even notice the flashes.

Other than these artifacts, the two feature length films from HDNet Movies that I recorded to my JVC 30k have been glitch free when played back through the JVC 30k decoder. IMO, this recording solution has been a good investment.

I think that HTPC enthusiasts will eventually become more interested in 169time, because the PC recording solutions for satellite are drying up. Maybe then we could get some dedicated applications to work with the avx-1, or even get an operating HD-DVR.

They occur in several spots, but not the corners.

Marc

Originally posted by stjr
Marc, could you be more specific about the location of the sparklies? I sometimes see some white flashes of light in the lower right-hand corner of the frame when I play tapes recorded with the avx-1 through the JVC 30k deck. If I had more overscan on my set, I might not even notice the flashes.

Other than these artifacts, the two feature length films from HDNet Movies that I recorded to my JVC 30k have been glitch free when played back through the JVC 30k decoder. IMO, this recording solution has been a good investment.

I think that HTPC enthusiasts will eventually become more interested in 169time, because the PC recording solutions for satellite are drying up. Maybe then we could get some dedicated applications to work with the avx-1, or even get an operating HD-DVR.

I also get these same white sometimes green rectangles in the lower right corner of the screen. I think thats why the AVX-1 recorded tapes only playback glitch free using the JVC's internal decoder. If I use another decoder (DTC100, Panasonic) I get the micro-freezes on the video. I have noticed that using the Panasonic deck through the DTC100 the micro-freezes are every 4 or so minutes. The JVC Deck through the DTC100 the glitches are every 2 or so minutes. I also hear that they don't even play back through the Samsung decoders. These white/green noises appear using the DTC100 and the Dish 6000 and BEV 6000 receivers. The noise is not their if recording an OTA through the DTC100 so it has something to do with the AVX-1.

jrichards,

Thank you for confirming my observations. I have always maintained that the JVC decoder was superior for the playback of avx-1 recordings, but you are the first person who has explicitly confirmed this to my knowledge. I think that 169time needs to know about the flashes in the lower right hand screen as well, although I think this issue is minor. The bottom line IMO is that people should really consider purchasing a JVC deck along with a 169time/avx-1 unit in order to get superior results.

The fact is the JVC decoder isn't that good. The AVX-1 software needs tweeking to work with other decoders as stated before. The noise in the lower right is an indication that something is not right and may help in the road to profection.

Anyone have a Mits integrated set and using its mpeg decoder to play back recordings?

Originally posted by jrichards
The fact is the JVC decoder isn't that good. The AVX-1 software needs tweeking to work with other decoders as stated before. The noise in the lower right is an indication that something is not right and may help in the road to profection.I agree. I want my avx-1 recordings to be fully compatible with my Hipix and MyHD HTPC recordings, but I can live with this for now. I am happy that I made this purchase and will not be rushing to purchase an HD Directivo or Dish 921 when they come out.

Originally posted by mrwilson
Anyone have a Mits integrated set and using its mpeg decoder to play back recordings?

I have a Mits integrated set, but havent tried using its decoder, and have been so busy with other things that my 169time is collecting dust at the moment. Only 1 good reason for winter to get here, I can start using it again! If I get a chance, I will try using the TV's decoder and report.

I first would like to say thanks to the many people here for their informative posts.
I am now the happy owner of the 169time avx-1 and RCA DTC-100 mod.
I've had the unit for a few days now, mostly just trying different setups and software. Last night I recorded Lord of the Rings Two Towers from
Directv HDTV PPV channel and was just blown away by the quality. Only maybe a couple glitches and some may be because I believe my system is a little under powered for playing back HDTV in software. I have a
Athlon2700 and Radeon 9700 and 1 gig ram. I've experimented with many mpeg file players and found the Zoom player with PowerDVD video filter to work the best for me. I get very good playback but certain fast scenes seem a little sluggish at times.
I have my system hooked up as follows: RCA HDVR --> AVX--> 2 port pc card.
I'm using a program called CapDVHS to record directly to the hard drive as
I can't seem to get DVHStools to recognize my avx-1. Actually CapDVHS works very well for such an obscure program. I don't see it talked about much here.
I then can open Zoom and play the file directly. I was surprised how simple it all was. Maybe I just got lucky.
Now I need to go read the thread about archiving HDTV with WMEncoder.

George

As I have stated before, I think that HTPC recording has a lot of promise, but it needs more work. Straight recording and playback through the JVC 30k has given me the best results (for 1080i playback), which I would expect, because most of the tweaking of the avx-1 system has probably been done with this deck. If I were only knowledgeable enough to write code designed for PC recording with the 169time/avx-1 system ..........:(

Originally posted by Schmurgen
I'm using a program called CapDVHS to record directly to the hard drive as
I can't seem to get DVHStools to recognize my avx-1. Actually CapDVHS works very well for such an obscure program. I don't see it talked about much here.
Thanks for directing my attention to CapDVHS. I noticed that it has a built in timer that could be used to schedule avx-1 recordings on a PC. I'll be checking out this capability more closely in the near future.

Steve,
I've scheduled a few timed recordings with CapDVHS and have had good success thus far. Since there's no english documentation, I just played around with the settings until I figured them out. Pretty simple really.

Anybody else have a problem with CapDVHS files being totally fragmented?
I noticed everytime it writes a new file I need to defragment my drive.

George

Hello Everybody

There is a new satellite provider on the block called VOOM

They offer currently 21 High Definition channels for $ 39.90 per month.

I wonder if Richard can work on recording from that box.

Voom is owned by Cablevision.

I am still using my 169 time set up.

I called Voom (www.voom.com) and said the box is from Motorola, and their
coming out a newer one in the near future.

Is anybody out here in HD land up on this new company that just started earlier this month?

Now Directv & Dish Network has some catching up to do.

I would get the Voom service but currently can't record the HD signal unless I use my 169 set up (PSHD-105,AVX,30000)

I wonder if Richard got his hands on one of these Motorola's he can convert it.

Larry,

Apparently you are not familiar with the HDTV Programming Forum . . .

Originally posted by Schmurgen
Anybody else have a problem with CapDVHS files being totally fragmented?Schmurgen, I don't normally defragment the hard drive used for recording high-def files to my PC with the Hipix card, and my results are usually glitch free using the Dish 5000 modulator. In theory then, it shouldn't be necessary to defragment your hard drive for 169time recordings either, but I am curious as to whether it might make a difference. Could you explain the fragmentation issue in more detail?

Then there is the issue regarding what filter CapDVHS is using for recording and whether that makes a difference for glitch-free recording as discussed here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=1823669#post1823669).

I am thinking about moving my 169time setup away from my HT room. The only problem I can foresee in doing this is being able to play D-Theater tapes on my JVC deck still. If I do move the setup, is there any way to stream the output of the JVC over ethernet and convert it back to 1394 for the TV? Or am I able to capture the output of the JVC to a PC with DVHSTools or similar program? I really dont want to switch my 169time setup back to the Mits DVHS, as it just does not work anywhere near as well as the JVC in the setup.

I guess my other option is just to go straight to hard drive recording of the 169time output, either on a HTPC or a hard drive in the AVX-1. But still would like to know if the streaming and or capturing would work.

Go to videolan.org

You may be able to use the free software there to do video streaming.

that software is great, but it cant stream direct from a firewire port (yet). so thus it would require capturing the stream to a file first, which I dont think is possible with a d-theater tape output over the 1394? or is it?

Check out the PC hard drive recording section on the 169time web site here (http://www.169time.com/index.html#PChdtv). D-theater tapes are encrypted and cannot be copied to a PC hard drive, unless someone has found a way to break the encryption.

DTheater tapes have some sort of copy protection....

You should be able to use the videolan solution to stream MPEG2 transport stream files from one computer to another so any recordings of your own that you have made should work.

Steve,
I'm getting almost completely glitch free recordings with CapDVHS and although it seems to write the file fragmented, I have no problems playing
the file back in Zoomplayer.
I was just wondering if someone could confirm this fragmenting problem as
I also notice it with DVD Decyrpter. I was wondering if it could be a problem with my system.

Also I've read a lot about the PC with the AVX1 needing such and such number of firewire ports for it to work and I've noticed mine works with my
2 + 1 port card or the single port on my Audagy 2 sound card.

George

Schmurgen,
I can't advise you regarding fragmentation. I personally would not worry about files being fragmented or the number of firewire ports on my cards if the files play properly. I'm glad that you found something that works for you.

George -

How much free space do you have?

Any computer file system will fragment files written to the last few % of disk, simply because there aren't any large enough areas left in which to write the entire file contiguously.

Hi All

Need help getting the AVX-1 working with C-Band 4DTV receiver/HDD-201.

Computer - AVX-1 with 8B3 Software
DVCR - Mits HS-HD2000U
HD Decorder - HDD-201
TV - Mits Intergrated HDTV WS-55613

Connections:

1. TV to HD Decorder Firewire 4 Pin to 4 Pin 6' length

Netcommand finds the device and calls it 169Time.com HDVR-100-218. I add this to Netcommand and call this connection 169

2. HD Decorder to DVHS Firewire 4 pin to 4 pin 6' length

Netcommand finds the device and calls it HS-HD2000U. I add this digital connection (omitting the analog connection) and call this connection DVCR

3. DVHS to Computer Firewire 4 pin to 6 pin. 15' length with RS RF filters on both ends

When I check the Mits setup menu preview it shows that both devices-- 169 and DVCR--are connected.

In testing the link DVCR records OTA HD (Ant-DTV) just fine off the airways.

I can NOT get 169 to record HD off the Input-DTV. When I hit the record button the TV tells me record has started. The DVHS does NOT start (no d diplayed either) and in several seconds the TV tells me "The digital link to 169.com can not be established." Sometimes the DVHS shows the d and other times no d in the display. When the d is displayed on the DVHS recorder the DVHS is not recording, just showing the d in the display.

I get the following error message sometimes."The 1394 cable may be bad. Disconnect and try another cable. See owners guide." I discount the bad cable because the menu preview shows both digital devices as connected, and "all" cables work fine when recording HD over the airways.

I have no idea how to trouble shoot this. Are my connections right? A problem may be that the Mits TV has to control the DVCR to do digital recordings. Could the Mits HDTV be the problem? It may NOT let you record anything but OTA HD? Does anyone know?

Several Observations: (1) The AVX-1 computer never gets warm. After running an hour or so you can touch the case and it is still very cold.
(2) Since the HDD-201 was modified by 169.time the RGB HV output will not work on the TV. Is this normal? The YPRPB does work. (3) Why is the TV calling the HDD-201 device HDVR-100-218? Is this right? (4) Some times the HDTV locks up and you can not turn it on/off or do any commands. You have to disconnect all Firewires to get it back to life.

I've posted this in the Mits sections at Home Theater SPOT too.

Help Please

Cuba Jim

Cuba, Mo.

The Mits is very picky on how it works. I would suggest you search what Don has written, since hes the expert. Also, did you do the link to the Mits off the 169time web, since, this goes to Dons web site with the instructions.

Also, have you called Richard at 169time?

Dave

h2ofun

Need help getting the AVX-1 working with C-Band 4DTV receiver/HDD-201.

Did a search on Don Landis posts and came up with 54 pages. Checked out ten of them last night and found nothing to help my situation. Will read some more later today.

Do have Don's instructions for the Mits DVHS decks off his web site. It does not really address the Mits HDTV or the HDD-201. I assume most of the other instructions do generally apply.

I will call Richard next week if the masses can't help me get up and running.

Cuba Jim

Jim, call Richard today! Or even Sunday. If hes around, he will give you all the help you need. Find another company that will do support 7 days a week, directly to the main man. ;)

Dave

CJ- I sent you e-mail but to reinforce with others, I do not address any other receiver other than the connection to the 169Time HDVR modified DTC-100.

Ditto what Dave said about the Mits- It is really a tricky connection process but while that is the down side of this VCR and AVX the plus is that it seems to be a very long lasting rugged deck. I have had no issues with mine and it plays just about every tape without issues, unlike many reports from JVC owners.

h2ofun and Don

Thanks for your inputs. I'm going to assume my integrated Mits knows what it is talking about when it tell me I have a bad 1394 connection between the AVX-1 and the Mits DVHS deck. I've ordered a new 4 pin - 6 pin 6' firewire (Vice the 15' I am now using). This will tell me if the firewire cable is bad or the AVX-1 itself is causing this error message. After this firewire swap is completed I will call Richard, if need be.

Thanks

Cuba Jim

CJ - I have an integrated Mits tv as well, and it always complained when the AVX1 was on its firewire chain, and in fact, I was never able to get a working recording when the TV and AVX1/DTC/JVC (or Mits DVHS) were all on the same firewire chain. You might want to remove the TV from the chain.

Yep, I would agree that you want only the minimum stuff needed on the firewire. And a TV isnt one of them.

Dave

How about a Samsung T165??? I'm trying to get a DTC-100 w/ firewire through the AVX-1 and JVC 30K to the 165's DVI outputs to view HD satellite.

Anybody have any luck with this???

Are resyncs normal? I've noticed that I'm getting dropouts when recording lately? The image and sound pause a second and resume with that second being lost. I might get 3 or 4 of these in an hour. They seem to occur mainly on the 3 major network channels. I hooked my AVX1 up to a VGA monitor to see what's going on, and by the end of the night it says that I've had 49 resyncs! Is this normal? I've tried two different AVX1 systems with the same results. There is a wall separating my AVX1 from the satellite reciever and JVC deck. Its in the next room, joined through the wall by a 6 foot firewire cable. What should I do?

Marc.

I just realized (after reading this thread from end to end for the last two hours) that the AVX1 software registers a resync everytime there is a program change, so this would include commercial breaks right? So leaving the AVX1 on for 8 hours of network television, 49 resyncs seems about right I guess. Anyone?

Marc.

Marc,
If you are recording OTA programs, you should not be using the avx-1. Check the 169time web site for instructions.

Dave I have the same combo but the AVX does not support the Samsung.

Theres suppose to be a new software update at some point that will improved the compatibility of these but have not heard anything in awhile.
Hopefully soon.

Thanks Alan, that's what I figured. I tried it for a little while last night to no avail:( I guess the 165 is on it's way back ot the store.

Why didn't they just put firewire on the TS160 and be done with it, I'm so sick of DirecTV, I can't wait for Comcast to add firewire to their boxes!!!

Dont hold your breathe. There are reasons they dont have firewire.

Yep, 169time knows the avx-1 isnt clean with the 165 and will improve it.

Bottom line, is there is only one game in town. And from what I hear of the new designs, they have done a much better job of "hiding" their signals.
So, its possible, the only resonable choice for recoding HDTV will be the products that 169time has now, as long as they can get the boxes.


Dave

Steve, I'm not recording the networks OTA, I'm using an Expressvu sat system, which allows you to subscribe to all major networks in HD via satellite.

Marc.

Kirby, h2ofun, Don

Subject: Need help getting the AVX-1 working with C-Band 4DTV receiver/HDD-201.

You all had me excited for a while...Kirby suggested "You might want to remove the TV from the chain." Dave said so too.

Did just that. Had the Mits DVHS in the center. HDD-201 on one end and the AVX-1 on the other. After the HDD-201 and the AVX-1 signals were up and running several minutes plugged in the 1394 cables into the DVCR and let them set several minutes. Then placed the DVCR is digital mode and hit the record button. It starts recording but 15-20 seconds later it tell me "error CP" Don Landis says this means that the 1394 signal is "copy protected" but in reality the Mits DVHS can not determine why it can not record the inbound signal so it just denotes one name for the cause..."error CP". Don thinks this is saying the HDD-201 is not properly established and that with this satellite signal there is a malfunction of the AVX-1. When I play back the "error CP" tape the DVCR just keeps switching back and forth between the digital and the analog playback modes every few seconds. No output picture or sound. The VCR does not know how to play back this signal...it is confused, just as I am.

When I tried to record OTA signals (No 169 time AVX-1 attached) using the DVCR controls I also got the "error CP" message. Recording OTA signals with the Mts HDTV controlling the VCR everytning records and plays back fine. Is this Mits HD-2000U D-VHS working OK?

Still at square one waiting for the new 1394 cable. I think I also need to purchase a small TV monitor so I can watch the VCR and AVX-1 messages to see what is going on, if anything.

I never did get an answer on the AVX-1 cabinet temperature. My AVX-1 metal cabinet stays cold all the time. Even after hours of running. Is this normal? I would expect it to be warm somplace on the cabinet.

Not giving up yet.......

Cuba Jim

Marc,

Sorry, I should have looked at your location before I posted. I am using the DTC-100 with the avx-1, and I don't record network shows from satellite, so I'm not sure that our results are comparable.

I almost never see a dropout or resync while recording with the avx-1 or playing back through the JVC 30k deck. All I can suggest is to call 169time for troubleshooting tips.

Just a comment here. Since I have been getting glitch free recordings with the AVX-1 and DTC100 , I have started using the signal of the OTA channels through the AVX-1 as well. This eliminates having to turn off the AVX-1 and change the I-Link. Also, I have been using the timer of the DTC to initiate the recordings (code 016 for the JVC 30K). I am now programming a week of recordings and merely change the tapes. Occasionally, I have to reset the AVX-1 (every few days; It forgets the location of the I-link). Incidentally, I moved my complete recording system into another room, but made sure to isolate the firewire from all the other wiring. The AVX-1 as only a few feet from all my other components. Recordings are still glitch- free.

Jay:
Same here. Been using the DTC-100 timer and running OTA material through the AVX-1, with almost glitch free results. An added benefit of using the AVX-1 for OTA, is that you can eliminate unwanted sub-channels that some OTA stations broadcast.

Ron

Tapes made with the AVX-1 will not playback correctly using other decoders including the DTC-100. Thats why I try to record without using the AVX-1. You can do this without disconnecting or turning off the AVX-1. Just select the I-link number for the DTC-100 not the AVX-1.

My tapes play fine on both my JVC 30K's, and since I don't have to change the I-link setting, I can record an OTA program and follow it with a Satellite program without having to reset anything. I don't like the over scan on the DTC decoder, or the color quality through its VGA out, as opposed to watching it through the JVC's component outs. I'm just taking the path of least resistance, here (I don't have enough component inputs on my monitor to use the DTC with a VGA- to -component box).

FYI

The JVC deck's decoder does a good job of playback. This is discussed on
the 169time web page. As you know we are developing improvements to the
AVX1 software so playback on other devices than the deck operates properly.
RIght now it is hit or miss when playing back through other devices,
depending on the program source settings at the broadcaster. The goal is to
make the AVX1 better able to condition the source regardless of source
encoder settings so that more decoders can play back 100%.

For someone that plays HDTV recorded from the AVX1 back through the deck,
this isn't an issue.

fyi


fyi

The customer feedback is that a comparison of many programs played back
through the deck and DTC100 is that the deck does the best job of playback
decoding. This makes sense since the deck is designed to handle variations
better.

After the next revision of AVX1 software, this will be a non-issue.


fyi

Dave

Thats good news Dave. Making the AVX-1 recorded tapes compatible with other decoders is a good move. I moved my AVX-1 to the basement below the theater and leave it run 24 7. The noise and heat from it are not a problem anymore. Also tapes made from it now play almost perfect using the JVC's decoder. When the AVX-1 is updated to work with other decoders 169time will have the market cornered as long as this Copy flag doesn't affect it.

Thanks!
Jeff

We are trying to meet customers needs.

Dave

Originally posted by jrichards
I moved my AVX-1 to the basement below the theater and leave it run 24 7. The noise and heat from it are not a problem anymore. Also tapes made from it now play almost perfect using the JVC's decoder. When the AVX-1 is updated to work with other decoders 169time will have the market cornered as long as this Copy flag doesn't affect it.

Thanks!
Jeff

Richard:

Don't you need to reset the AVX1 often , do you go down to the basement to reset it?

Lon

The AVX-1 I built never needs reset. Sometimes I will shut it down if I will not use it for a week or so.