If anyone can get feedback to WRTV engineering, they seem to have a volume problem on their SD broadcasts lately. This happens on commercials and other non-HD shows -- the volume will be fine, and then it will suddenly drop back. Then it gradually gets louder until the next time it drops back.

It seems to happen every few minutes.

Paul at WRTV is investigating our recent comments about audio volume drops. He's trying to get the station to purchase a new audio processor that would do a better job but in the meantime he'll do what he can.

Steve

Steve,

I have noticed the brief drop-outs on RTV Brighthouse 706. I guess I am just so happy to be getting the station that I can live with the minor annoyances for now. We still need Fox.

Jerry

Jerry,

Thanks for the confirmation. I've only seen these brief dropouts on WRTV-DT via Bright House ch. 706 and not via my STBs (OTA). The cable company might need to recheck their OTA antenna and receiver equipment for WRTV-DT. I did find out from Paul at WRTV that this signal is received by Bright House OTA.

Steve

bclarkso

Hello Brad

The Indy channel's that you should be able to recieve are as follows:

ABC WRTV 6.1 and 6.2
CBS WISH 8-1 thru 8-4
NBC WTHR 13-1 and 13-2
PBS WIPB 49-1 and 49-2
FOX WXIN 59-1
UPN WNDY 23-1

and possibly

PBS WFYI 20-1 thru 20-4
WB WTTK 29-1

coolray

Hey guys, I live in Zionsville and I currently get abc, cbs, nbc, pbs, fox, and upn in HD using my Zenith indoor antenna.

I do not get WB 29.1 ... Any ideas?

Also, I also use to get PBS 20.1 and 20.2 but a few months ago, they stopped, and I only get 20.3... Any ideas?

I also use to get 40.1 in Broadripple. Does that channel exist anymore?

Has anyone succesfully gotten these channels in Zionsville? If so, does that mean I need an outdoor antenna? Thanks!

Paul

balefire

The first thing that comes to my mind, if you are getting 20.3, but NOT getting 20.1 and 20.2 is that you may have those particular channels locked out and that is why they are not displaying. As far as 29.1, it is broadcast from the WXIN 59.1 tower and I would think you could get it as well. You are almost on top of the tower farm.

coolray

I get 29.0 (analog) and it has a lot of static... As for the 29.1, 63.1, 40.1, and 20.1,2, I have tried getting these channels on two different hdtvs in my house and failed. I also have tried pointing my antenna in all different directions and failed. antennaweb.org does not even say that 29.1 exists. 40.1 and 63.1 exist but are very far away from me apparently... any ideas?

paul

balefire

The first thing that comes to my mind, if you are getting 20.3, but NOT getting 20.1 and 20.2 is that you may have those particular channels locked out and that is why they are not displaying. As far as 29.1, it is broadcast from the WXIN 59.1 tower and I would think you could get it as well. You are almost on top of the tower farm.

coolray

I don't believe Channel 29 is currently broadcast from the 59 tower. I think the digital channel is broadcast from Kokomo, as is analog 29.
"WTTV is a WB affiliate in the Indianapolis, Indiana television market. Broadcasting on analog channel 4, the station is owned by the Tribune Company. It is licensed to Bloomington (southwest of Indianapolis), and operates a rebroadcaster (WTTK 29) in Kokomo to serve the northern areas of the market."
Nat Hill IV

I get 29.0 (analog) and it has a lot of static... As for the 29.1, 63.1, 40.1, and 20.1,2, I have tried getting these channels on two different hdtvs in my house and failed. I also have tried pointing my antenna in all different directions and failed. antennaweb.org does not even say that 29.1 exists. 40.1 and 63.1 exist but are very far away from me apparently... any ideas?

paul

WTTK-29 analog transmits with 3090kW (directional antenna) @ 775 feet from a tower site a mile south of Windfall, northeast of Tipton in Tipton County. WTTK-DT 54 (29.1 HD and 29.2 SD), as of August, now transmits from two transmitter sites, on the same channel, as a one-year test granted by the FCC (full story from engineer Rick Poling in an earlier post). One transmitter remains at the Windfall site with very limited coverage area, and the newly-added transmitter site is at the WXIN tower in Indy, just south of the WRTV tower (79th St. and Township Line Road). The new site is operating with 2kW @ approximately 850 feet. Thanks to Rick Poling, I've included a coverage map indicating the areas the two transmitters are serving. Personally, I've tested the Indy signal with mobile equipment using a little Zenith Silver Sensor (indoor antenna) and I've been able to receive it north of Indy around Sheridan and Cicero, and as far south as Franklin and even Trafalgar, just a mile north of the WTTV tower.

WIPX-DT 27 (63.1, etc.) is transmitting with 165kW @ 1017 feet from Trafalgar, next to the WTTV/WTTV-DT tower. WHMB-DT 16 (40.1 and 40.2) is currently operating at low power, 18.6kW @ 460 feet, from the station's old tower at its studios southeast of Noblesville on St. Rd. 238. Eventually WHMB-DT will move to its 1000-foot analog tower at the Indy antenna farm and transmit with 225kW @ 930 feet, according to the CP with the FCC.

BTW, I just checked WFYI-DT and I'm getting all three channels (20.1, 20.2, 20.3) OTA near 106th and Keystone.

Steve

Wow, I stand SUPER corrected!
Great info on WTTK's towers, Steve. Sounds like a funny way to transmit digital signals (instant multipath?). It will be interesting how this all shakes out.
Nat Hill IV

Announced Thursday at AllAccess.com...........


Emmis TV Sales To Gray, LIN Close

GRAY TELEVISION and LIN TV CORP. have closed on their purchases of several TV stations from EMMIS.

GRAY closed on the purchase of NBC affiliate WSAZ-TV/HUNTINGTON-CHARLESTON, WV for $186 million, while LIN closed on the purchase of FOX affiliates WALA-TV/MOBILE and WLUK-TV/GREEN BAY and CBS affiliates WTHI-TV/TERRE HAUTE and KRQE-TV/ALBUQUERQUE; another station, WALA's sister WB affiliate WBPG-TV, will be operated under an LMA while its license renewal is pending. Price for the LIN deal was $260 million.

What company will provide best "quality" in video source in HD? Comcast Cable, TimeWarners, or that lousy annoying Dish? Anybody has good experience in observing Picture qualities in HDs? I need people with extremely sensitive eyes and extremely picky... those who want perfection... Please base your comment fairly, using same hardware and cables...


I did hear that the DishNetwork has lowered their video bit rate and resolutions and other crap to save bandwidth... I hate DishNetwork to death so that is not going to be my choice no matter what(a long..... story, don't ask)..... Any other companies(preferrably the Cable companies) that provide best PQ in HD????

Cable system performance varies by company and service area. What location are you in?

I'm in Indianapolis, IN. Will you help.

Threads merged.

well??? where is my answer. me needs an asnwer

You might want to give the folks in Indy more than an hour to help before jumping down their throats.

Thanks for the map, goldrich. Very strange that I receive 59.1 without any problem at all, but I've never even come close to getting 29.1. Maybe I should try scanning channels again.


Also, I know we have some WISH people around from time to time... does anyone know why they are broadcasting THREE sub-channels? I've been meaning to ask but never got around to it. I don't even see the necessity for one weather sub-channel let alone an additional two that just show the same thing as the analog broadcast.

Those weather channels, in my very humble and independent opinion, just take up space. The few times I've actually tuned to one during severe weather, they've just been showing pre-recorded forecasts and a lot of ads (this isn't just WISH, it's every station with a weather channel). They don't seem to be doing much harm, though... the HD PQ on WISH is usually fantastic.

Per the map, I should be able to get 29.1... I have never gotten it though... Am I in an irea with interference (its pretty flat around here)? Should I invest in an outdoor antenna in the spring?

I have no problems with my reception on channels otherwise, but being a mini plan ticket holder for the pacers, I would really enjoy watching their games in HD. Thanks!

btw, I live at the NW corner of I-865 & I-65...

Back the bus up...

The Pacers games on the WB are in HD?!?!?

well??? where is my answer. me needs an asnwerYou needs to read all this topic.

Here is my $.02 worth. Now if you are truly wanting the best possible picture, you still can not beat going to the source for your video........A 10ft dish and the 4DTV receiver with the
HD sidecar can not be beat. Now, is that something that most people want these days? No. But as a former WRTV engineer, I can tell you that if you buy a signal from Direct TV, Dish or any cable company they are running it through their plant equipment and then not retransmitting it with the quality that a true video nut expects. I refuse to subscribe to either small dish companies because they will not use the required bandwidth needed to transmit all the video data. Cable companies have come a long ways towards a good picture but that varies from area to area and company to company.

I'll probably get beat up for suggesting the C, Ku band system, but it is the only answer
to your question, that is if you want the BEST picture.

Btw, I have a large system and have dropped my subscriptions to all services because the
Insight cable system that we have in Fishers supplies a damn good signal...surprising. Friday I had them install a cable card in my set and subscribed to their HD package. I am on the fence as far as buying the HD sidecar for my 4DTV receiver at this time.

+++ the Insight cable system that we have in Fishers supplies a damn good signal +++

I will admit that Insight in Bloomington sends out a very impressive HD signal as well. My eyes can not really tell any difference between their signals and the ones I get from my antenna, even though as I understand it the transmission signals are totally different.

I guess I should correct myself... I would enjoy watching the pacers in DTV instead of my ugly analog... Any ideas? Thanks!

I guess I should correct myself... I would enjoy watching the pacers in DTV instead of my ugly analog... Any ideas? Thanks!

You might try a 4-bay antenna like a CM4221,either outside or in an attic space.

Here is my $.02 worth. Now if you are truly wanting the best possible picture, you still can not beat going to the source for your video........A 10ft dish and the 4DTV receiver with the
HD sidecar can not be beat. Now, is that something that most people want these days? No. But as a former WRTV engineer, I can tell you that if you buy a signal from Direct TV, Dish or any cable company they are running it through their plant equipment and then not retransmitting it with the quality that a true video nut expects. I refuse to subscribe to either small dish companies because they will not use the required bandwidth needed to transmit all the video data. Cable companies have come a long ways towards a good picture but that varies from area to area and company to company.

I'll probably get beat up for suggesting the C, Ku band system, but it is the only answer
to your question, that is if you want the BEST picture.

Btw, I have a large system and have dropped my subscriptions to all services because the
Insight cable system that we have in Fishers supplies a damn good signal...surprising. Friday I had them install a cable card in my set and subscribed to their HD package. I am on the fence as far as buying the HD sidecar for my 4DTV receiver at this time.
wow.. nice post.

will you please explain to me what "C, Ku band system" is? and why would you get beat up for saying that. Is this something very expensive or.. Can you tell me more about this device? I would like to know more.


so you're getting good performance out of Insight cable huh? sounds tempting based on your findings.. unfortunately Insight doesn't cover my area..:(

Can you also tell me about the funtionality of Cable card?
also, how are the qualities? Will I lose any data signal when going through cable card to view HD videos? or is this purely digital. I'm just totally nuts freak paranoid when it comes to cutting-edge picture quality. Call me a sicko if you want. I won't be offended :)


and what's HD sidecar??

and is this 4DTV receiver really good or something?? is it expensive?

+++ the Insight cable system that we have in Fishers supplies a damn good signal +++

I will admit that Insight in Bloomington sends out a very impressive HD signal as well. My eyes can not really tell any difference between their signals and the ones I get from my antenna, even though as I understand it the transmission signals are totally different.

I had an OTA antenna for all the locals, plus VOOM satellite service for about a year before they shut down. It was considered by many to be the best HD picture available. Since VOOM is no more, I switched to Comcast cable in Indianapolis, and the picture quality on the HD channels, to my eyes and on 'only' a 55" TV, is just as good as the VOOM and OTA channels were.

Combine it with a dual-tuner HD DVR (the Motorola 6412, which is good now, but which should be running TiVO software by next year) and it's a pretty unbeatable home entertainment package. Comcast's HD lineup currently consists of ESPN-HD, Discovery HD, IN-HD1, IN-HD2, TNT-HD, WRTV-D (ABC), WTHR-D (NBC), WISH-D (CBS), WXIN-D (Fox), WTTK-D (WB), PBS-HD (PBS), HBO-D (HBO), MAX-D (Cinemax), SHO-D (Showtime), STARZ-D (Starz), and HD-SE (High Def Special Events).

Jeff

wow.. nice post.

will you please explain to me what "C, Ku band system" is? and why would you get beat up for saying that. Is this something very expensive or.. Can you tell me more about this device? I would like to know more.


so you're getting good performance out of Insight cable huh? sounds tempting based on your findings.. unfortunately Insight doesn't cover my area..:(

Can you also tell me about the funtionality of Cable card?
also, how are the qualities? Will I lose any data signal when going through cable card to view HD videos? or is this purely digital. I'm just totally nuts freak paranoid when it comes to cutting-edge picture quality. Call me a sicko if you want. I won't be offended :)

and what's HD sidecar??

and is this 4DTV receiver really good or something?? is it expensive?


This is the large satellite dishes that you see in some peoples yards. Years ago they were very popular. They still have the best video going, but the convience of Direct Tv and Dish have pretty much killed the large "C"Band dishes. The C, Ku is the frequency band that the dish receives, kind of like VHF and UHF on your TV. You can pick up a Motorola 4DTV used for around $300. I know if 2 or 3 dishes that I could line up up with for free. Subscription service is approx $30 and goes up from there depending upon what you buy.

Can you also tell me about the funtionality of Cable card?
also, how are the qualities? Will I lose any data signal when going through cable card to view HD videos? or is this purely digital. I'm just totally nuts freak paranoid when it comes to cutting-edge picture quality. Call me a sicko if you want. I won't be offended :)

The cable card replaces the cable box that the cable compnay wants to hook up to enable your permium services....ie, HBO, HD channels. I was amazed at the improvement from the cable box to my cable card, big difference. THe cable card is a PCMCIA card (looks like a thick credit card) that is inserted into the television.

and what's HD sidecar??

This is an addtional box that allows HD reception from the Motorola 4DTV satellite
receiver, without it you just get regular analog and digital reception.

and is this 4DTV receiver really good or something?? is it expensive?[/


As I mentioned earlier, used $300-400, new $600.

If you have any more questions please use my personal email, we are kind of off thread here and I don't want to get anybody upset. Mike/KD9RG

reynoldm@iquest.net

The cable card replaces the cable box that the cable compnay wants to hook up to enable your permium services....ie, HBO, HD channels. I was amazed at the improvement from the cable box to my cable card, big difference. THe cable card is a PCMCIA card (looks like a thick credit card) that is inserted into the television.

If you have a cable card, can you receive premium channels such as HBO, Showtime, etc., as well as their HD feeds?

Jeff

If you have a cable card, can you receive premium channels such as HBO, Showtime, etc., as well as their HD feeds?

Jeff


Yes.

Combine it with a dual-tuner HD DVR (the Motorola 6412, which is good now, but which should be running TiVO software by next year) and it's a pretty unbeatable home entertainment package. Comcast's HD lineup currently consists of ESPN-HD, Discovery HD, IN-HD1, IN-HD2, TNT-HD, WRTV-D (ABC), WTHR-D (NBC), WISH-D (CBS), WXIN-D (Fox), WTTK-D (WB), PBS-HD (PBS), HBO-D (HBO), MAX-D (Cinemax), SHO-D (Showtime), STARZ-D (Starz), and HD-SE (High Def Special Events).

Jeff

I wish Comcast would start offering HD here in Muncie but they cant even tell me when it will be available and im getting sick of waiting. I have HD via OTA but I want the other channels.

Does anyone have info on HD in my area concerning comcast?

I wish Comcast would start offering HD here in Muncie but they cant even tell me when it will be available and im getting sick of waiting. I have HD via OTA but I want the other channels.

Does anyone have info on HD in my area concerning comcast?


If your wanting it really bad why not dump Comcast and get the DISH system.....

Bents,

I have been raising hell with comcast as well here in Muncie. I talked to them on saturday and they said they had no plans in the near future to offer hd. I can pick up nbc, wxin, abc, pbs and wb with an indoor ota antenna but cannot get cbs which drives me nuts because of the colts games.

I attempted to switch over to the dish network by purchasing it online. When I got an email showing what I ordered it was all screwed up. I called dish that night and thought I got it all straightened out until I got another email that was still messed up. I called them again and they promised it was corrected. They called me a night before the installation to confirm only to find out they did not have any receivers on my work order. I called dish that night and told them to cancel my order since they had screwed up so many times and they assured me that they would be there in the morning with all the equipment I ordered. They never showed up and never called. I called them back to cancel again and they gave me 6 months free service and promised to be there in the morning only to show up without any receivers. It was a total nightmare. I am a little gun shy about switching now. I did talk to dtv this weekend and they said we are expected to get our hd locals in the spring of 2006. I guess we got that going for us.

I can pick up nbc, wxin, abc, pbs and wb with an indoor ota antenna but cannot get cbs which drives me nuts because of the colts games.

Your mind can rest a little... many of the Colts games haven't been in HD this year anyway, except for the Monday Night games on ABC.

I did talk to dtv this weekend and they said we are expected to get our hd locals in the spring of 2006. I guess we got that going for us.

As of a few months ago, a lot of people were complaining about the quality of the HD on DirecTV. They called it "HD Lite" due to the low bitrates and reduced resolution. Maybe things will be better with their switch to MPEG-4 encoding for the HD locals, but maybe they will be just as compressed and "lite" as their other HD offerings. People with the equipment to measure such things said that cable companies offer the best bitrates, followed closely by Dish Network. DirecTV was substantially reduced.

I'm sure that even HD Lite would look much better than SD, but DirecTV was getting a lot of flak in various forums at the time for their HD decisions.

Jeff

Bents,

I have been raising hell with comcast as well here in Muncie. I talked to them on saturday and they said they had no plans in the near future to offer hd. I can pick up nbc, wxin, abc, pbs and wb with an indoor ota antenna but cannot get cbs which drives me nuts because of the colts games.

I attempted to switch over to the dish network by purchasing it online. When I got an email showing what I ordered it was all screwed up. I called dish that night and thought I got it all straightened out until I got another email that was still messed up. I called them again and they promised it was corrected. They called me a night before the installation to confirm only to find out they did not have any receivers on my work order. I called dish that night and told them to cancel my order since they had screwed up so many times and they assured me that they would be there in the morning with all the equipment I ordered. They never showed up and never called. I called them back to cancel again and they gave me 6 months free service and promised to be there in the morning only to show up without any receivers. It was a total nightmare. I am a little gun shy about switching now. I did talk to dtv this weekend and they said we are expected to get our hd locals in the spring of 2006. I guess we got that going for us.

I'm surprised you're getting any signals from Indy reliably with an indoor antenna.You need to add a VHF highband antenna to receive WISH-DT on CH 9.It might work in an attic space if you don't want to put an antenna outside.

Bents,

. I did talk to dtv this weekend and they said we are expected to get our hd locals in the spring of 2006. I guess we got that going for us.

TPierce, I can't get DTV to commit to anything on the locals in HD, are you fairly certain this is true for spring 2006? Is it true for Terre Haute, but not Indy? I hope this is true, but I need good HD for the superbowl :)

We have DTV and will not give it up for many reasons. We have an HD receiver but have tried 2 indoor antennas and one dish mounted Wineguard antenna DTV installed for us. We can get any of the main channels in HD, but the signal does not hold. Any of them will interrupt about every 3 mins or so.

Most dish people I know in fishers or Carmel can get the stations with an indoor antenna with no issues, but we have a few trees so maybe that is the problem.
I am open to a roof or attic mount. Any of the Carmel users here have any suggestions? I am around 131st and Gray/ Keystone also.

Thanks for the input. I am so glad to find this site. Not getting HD locals haunts me every day.

To the local channel engineers, why can't I just get a waiver? I shouldn't be forced to put a huge antenna on my roof when I can more easily buy the NY feeds. It's like Communism :eek:

WTHI screwed up the VS show tonight. Talk about a fumble. :mad:

Most dish people I know in fishers or Carmel can get the stations with an indoor antenna with no issues, but we have a few trees so maybe that is the problem.
I am open to a roof or attic mount. Any of the Carmel users here have any suggestions? I am around 131st and Gray/ Keystone also.



I live near 131st and Gray and I'm using a Radio Shack model 75 antenna in my 2nd story attic. I've got it aimed at 187 degrees. I get all the local digital channels without any problems. I can even get the WB station (29-1). I tried a Channel Master 4228, but it wasn't as good as the Radio Shack for my location. I mounted it in my attic by buying a mast from Radio Shack and attaching the mast to one of of my rafters. Then the antenna was attached to it using its provided hardware. The Radio Shack antenna seems to be able to pick up signals coming from the backside too. I get Muncie and others. Radio Shack will allow you to return it if it doesn't work, so it might be worth a shot.

Hope this helps.

John

thanks John!

Is that a Model: VU-75 XR -- 50" Boom Length, 18 Element Antenna?


Lori

I live near Stop 11 & Emerson Ave and pick up 6-1 8-1 13-1 20-1 23-1 29-1 59-1 and 4-1 with an indoor antenna on top of my tv.

Bents,

I have been raising hell with comcast as well here in Muncie. I talked to them on saturday and they said they had no plans in the near future to offer hd. I can pick up nbc, wxin, abc, pbs and wb with an indoor ota antenna but cannot get cbs which drives me nuts because of the colts games.


I get the locals in HD via an antenna too including cbs but if you want cbs you need to get an antenna that can get vhf and uhf signals then you will get it fine.

[QUOTE=TPIERCE]Bents,
I can pick up nbc, wxin, abc, pbs and wb with an indoor ota antenna but cannot get cbs which drives me nuts because of the colts games.

Get your VHF antenna ready to receive WISH-DT so you can see the Colts in HD. At least the next two games are scheduled to be in HD on CBS: 12/11 Colts @ Jaguars 1p.m. and 12/18 Chargers @ Colts 1p.m. I can't find any definite HD info
for the Sat. 12/24 game with the Colts @ Seahawks. Let's hope for HD with this big game.

Steve

Your mind can rest a little... many of the Colts games haven't been in HD this year anyway, except for the Monday Night games on ABC.



As of a few months ago, a lot of people were complaining about the quality of the HD on DirecTV. They called it "HD Lite" due to the low bitrates and reduced resolution. Maybe things will be better with their switch to MPEG-4 encoding for the HD locals, but maybe they will be just as compressed and "lite" as their other HD offerings. People with the equipment to measure such things said that cable companies offer the best bitrates, followed closely by Dish Network. DirecTV was substantially reduced.

I'm sure that even HD Lite would look much better than SD, but DirecTV was getting a lot of flak in various forums at the time for their HD decisions.

Jeff


Some of the people in the Detroit local thread who have already received their MPEG-4 boxes say their reception of HD locals in indistinguishable from their OTA counterparts. Sounds encouraging to me since I'm with D*, but time will tell.

[QUOTE=TPIERCE]Bents,
I can pick up nbc, wxin, abc, pbs and wb with an indoor ota antenna but cannot get cbs which drives me nuts because of the colts games.

Get your VHF antenna ready to receive WISH-DT so you can see the Colts in HD. At least the next two games are scheduled to be in HD on CBS: 12/11 Colts @ Jaguars 1p.m. and 12/18 Chargers @ Colts 1p.m. I can't find any definite HD info
for the Sat. 12/24 game with the Colts @ Seahawks. Let's hope for HD with this big game.

Steve

I'm fortunate that I've been able to get perfect local HD reception over my $30 indoor RCA antenna. I'm switching over to Bright House *sigh- I know, I've read all the complaints* because I refuse to pay $400 to upgrade to a DirecTV HD DVR. Bright House is giving me free install on a new HD DVR (it's no D* DVR, but at least I'll have some kind of DVR functionality), plus all their premium packages for $79.00/month for 1 year. After that year, I'll just cancel all the stuff that I would never ordinarily pay for, like HBO, Showtime, etc., and get it down to something manageable.

Considering that I'm paying $62/month for basic D* plus sports right now, with NO HD capability anyway, the option of FREE now w/ package channels from Bright House vs. $400 + increased monthly cost from D*, it's the easiest decision I've made in a long time.

Farewell D*! I'll miss you Sunday Ticket, but I got charged a fortune for that anyway!

[QUOTE=goldrich]

I'm fortunate that I've been able to get perfect local HD reception over my $30 indoor RCA antenna. I'm switching over to Bright House *sigh- I know, I've read all the complaints* because I refuse to pay $400 to upgrade to a DirecTV HD DVR. Bright House is giving me free install on a new HD DVR (it's no D* DVR, but at least I'll have some kind of DVR functionality), plus all their premium packages for $79.00/month for 1 year. After that year, I'll just cancel all the stuff that I would never ordinarily pay for, like HBO, Showtime, etc., and get it down to something manageable.

Considering that I'm paying $62/month for basic D* plus sports right now, with NO HD capability anyway, the option of FREE now w/ package channels from Bright House vs. $400 + increased monthly cost from D*, it's the easiest decision I've made in a long time.

Farewell D*! I'll miss you Sunday Ticket, but I got charged a fortune for that anyway!

I too have Bright House (just south of Carmel city limits) and I really enjoy their HD service along with the HD-DVR. Since you are able to receive the local OTA HD stations, you won't miss WXIN-DT, WTTV/WTTK-DT and WNDY-DT which are currently not offered by Bright House.

The SA 8300 HD-DVR works very well for me. I'm still amazed at its ability to record HD material. I still can't the tell difference between live and recorded material. Also, you can pause live TV broadcasts. Most of the HD broadcasts on ESPN-HD (ch. 760) are simply fabulous on my new 60" set (1080p).

Enjoy the view!

Steve

[QUOTE=Sluggonics]

I too have Bright House (just south of Carmel city limits) and I really enjoy their HD service along with the HD-DVR. Since you are able to receive the local OTA HD stations, you won't miss WXIN-DT, WTTV/WTTK-DT and WNDY-DT which are currently not offered by Bright House.

The SA 8300 HD-DVR works very well for me. I'm still amazed at its ability to record HD material. I still can't the tell difference between live and recorded material. Also, you can pause live TV broadcasts. Most of the HD broadcasts on ESPN-HD (ch. 760) are simply fabulous on my new 60" set (1080p).

Enjoy the view!

Steve

I'm on Carmel's south side as well-- right around 99th & Keystone. I was surprised that the cheap indoor antenna worked so well, but I guess I'm only about 5-6 miles away from the transmitters. I've been totally blown away by the HD programming, particularly the football games I've watched so far. The OTA quality has been great-- if cable can get even close to that, I'd still be happy.

thanks John!

Is that a Model: VU-75 XR -- 50" Boom Length, 18 Element Antenna?


Lori

Yes. Hopefully it will work for you.

John

Bents,

I have been raising hell with comcast as well here in Muncie. I talked to them on saturday and they said they had no plans in the near future to offer hd. I can pick up nbc, wxin, abc, pbs and wb with an indoor ota antenna but cannot get cbs which drives me nuts because of the colts games..

Which antanna do you use? I have thought about switching to satellite too but dont want the troubles of losing my picture when it rains.

bents,

I have a terk hdtvi. I have tried a terk tv5 and a radioshack indoor antenna as well. The terk hdtvi has worked best for me.


Lorimcp,

I am going by what the customer service rep told me. When I asked about getting the new dish and receiver installed she said that the locals where on schedule to become available spring 2006. I hate to go by what anyone says because if you were to go into any local retailer and by a hdtv the people will tell you that comcast is going to offer hdtv the first of the year. The problem is they have been saying that the last two years.

When you guys say I need a vhf antenna I am assuming you mean more than rabit ears. Are attic installations pretty reliable?

It depends on signal strength as to whether or not a VHF specific antenna is needed for WISH. I've been getting it fine with a RS double bow tie UHF only antenna here on the West side. Of course YMMV.

bents,

I have a terk hdtvi. I have tried a terk tv5 and a radioshack indoor antenna as well. The terk hdtvi has worked best for me.


When you guys say I need a vhf antenna I am assuming you mean more than rabit ears. Are attic installations pretty reliable?

My first antenna could only get UHF signals and I wasnt getting WISH so I emailed them and was told to make sure I can receive both VHF and UHF signals otherwise I wouldnt be able to get them because they broadcast differently than the other locals. I changed my antenna and afterwards the channel came in fine and I was able to watch the Colts.

Go get another antenna and you will see them in HD this weekend.

I also live up around Muncie, and this is my HD story... :)

I talked to Comcast right at 2 years ago now and they told me then that it was only a question of bandwidth from Indianapolis and that they were waiting on a new fiber connection to get things going. Apparently they're installing that fiber in 1 foot sections or something, who knows... After giving it about 3-6 months, I switched to DTV.

Right now, with DTV, I'm using their HDTivo box and getting the DTV content plus the OTA locals I can receive. I currently get: WISH, WRTV, WXIN, WTHR, plus our new local PBS and UPN with my antenna. I'm using a Channel Master 3671 Crossfire with a Channel Master 7777 pre-amp. This antenna, however, is not for the faint of heart. It's about 14' long and probably 10' wide. Mine is on top of a 30' tower. I do have a friend who lives a few miles closer than me who is using a Channel Master 4228 with the same pre-amp as me, and he's able to get WISH just as well as I am despite it being a UHF antenna.

As far as DTV's HD offerings go, from what I've seen on the Tivo Community forums, we're probably looking at Spring/Summer 2006 for the Indy locals over the satellite. However, I've seen a few posts that seemed to indicate some markets weren't getting their UPN and WB feeds. They were only getting the "big 4".

I also live up around Muncie, and this is my HD story... :)

I talked to Comcast right at 2 years ago now and they told me then that it was only a question of bandwidth from Indianapolis and that they were waiting on a new fiber connection to get things going. Apparently they're installing that fiber in 1 foot sections or something, who knows... After giving it about 3-6 months, I switched to DTV.

Right now, with DTV, I'm using their HDTivo box and getting the DTV content plus the OTA locals I can receive. I currently get: WISH, WRTV, WXIN, WTHR, plus our new local PBS and UPN with my antenna. I'm using a Channel Master 3671 Crossfire with a Channel Master 7777 pre-amp. This antenna, however, is not for the faint of heart. It's about 14' long and probably 10' wide. Mine is on top of a 30' tower. I do have a friend who lives a few miles closer than me who is using a Channel Master 4228 with the same pre-amp as me, and he's able to get WISH just as well as I am despite it being a UHF antenna.

As far as DTV's HD offerings go, from what I've seen on the Tivo Community forums, we're probably looking at Spring/Summer 2006 for the Indy locals over the satellite. However, I've seen a few posts that seemed to indicate some markets weren't getting their UPN and WB feeds. They were only getting the "big 4".


How often do you lose your signal? Have you had any long outages?

I also live up around Muncie, and this is my HD story... :)

........I do have a friend who lives a few miles closer than me who is using a Channel Master 4228 with the same pre-amp as me, and he's able to get WISH just as well as I am despite it being a UHF antenna.



Thanks for this feedback about using the CM 4228 as a VHF antenna, even considering the distance between the WISH tower and the receiving antenna in the Muncie area. It does back up the test information at this website:
http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ANTENNAS/comparing.html Check out the info and graph near the bottom of the post, "Using A UHF Antenna For VHF."

This might provide some good news for OTA users in this area who are primarily concerned with UHF reception but need to pick up one or two high-band VHF stations. The graph indicates that the peak gain should be for channel 10, but that it is still quiet good for channels 9 and 11, and then appears to improve again for channel 13. WISH-DT is currently on ch. 9 and will remain there after the analog shutdown. WTHI-DT is currently on ch. 24, but will switch back to ch. 10 when its analog on ch. 10 is turned off. WLFI-DT is currently on ch. 11 and will remain there. And WTHR-DT is currently on ch. 46 but will switch back to ch. 13 when its analog is turned off.

As long as you are located in a fairly good signal area near any of the above stations, this antenna might be a good long-term choice. Just my 2 cents.

Steve

After seeing a couple posts here and on Tivocommunity, I called BrightHouse to see what they would offer. Basically for any dish user (you have to prove that) you can get a pretty good package including HD locals, HBO, Showtime, and TMC and a HD DVR for total with tax of $63.00/ mo. No install fee, no contract, 2nd month is free. If we end up getting DTV locals this spring I will cancel then. I'm not cancelling DTV, just using this as my HDTV for now. BH does have ABC (superbowl) NBC, CBS, but no FOX. I think I can live with no FOX in HD.

thanks for all the help here!

As far as my reception goes, I get 6, 13, 23, and 59's digital stations really well. I almost never have any sort of drops. Channel 8's digital station drops for me whenever we have really bad weather. On a normal day, however, I usually have a couple of pixelations every 30 minutes or so.

After seeing a couple posts here and on Tivocommunity, I called BrightHouse to see what they would offer. Basically for any dish user (you have to prove that) you can get a pretty good package including HD locals, HBO, Showtime, and TMC and a HD DVR for total with tax of $63.00/ mo. No install fee, no contract, 2nd month is free. If we end up getting DTV locals this spring I will cancel then. I'm not cancelling DTV, just using this as my HDTV for now. BH does have ABC (superbowl) NBC, CBS, but no FOX. I think I can live with no FOX in HD.

thanks for all the help here!

I got the same deal from Bright House. Upgrading my D*TV to an HD-DVR was going to cost $300 up front, and involve some $200 mail-in rebate which their reps gave me conflicting answers on, so I didn't even want to mess with that.

So Bright House is coming out on Monday with my cable HD-DVR and digital box for my old TV upstairs.

I currently get all the HD locals OTA with a $30 indoor antenna, so I can use those in lieu of the HD locals that Bright House doesn't provide. Considering that my monthly D* bill was $62 anyway, and that was with NO premium channels-- just the base package plus sports, the Bright House deal is just too good to pass up.

I did have NFL Sunday Ticket, but I felt enslaved by it-- every Sunday where I had other obligations that prevented me from watching the games would gnaw at me-- I felt like I couldn't do anything else or I would be wasting money. I'll actually be somewhat relieved to give it up.

Ken-

Is the HD transmitter gonna work for the Colts game tomorrow? Its being broadcast by CBS in HD for one of the rare times this year.

http://www.hdsportsguide.com/

This site now has the 12/24, 4p.m. Colts @ Seattle game listed in HD on CBS. The Colts and the HD broadcasts just keep on coming!

Steve

Ken-

Is the HD transmitter gonna work for the Colts game tomorrow? Its being broadcast by CBS in HD for one of the rare times this year.




Sorry for the delay,
guess you got your answer! :)

Ken

Yeah, I did. Both games looked great!

I see this weekends game is in HD too, yay!

Yeah, I did. Both games looked great!

I see this weekends game is in HD too, yay!


ENJOY!

I live just off the Southwest corner of Bloomington (between Rockport Road and That Road behind Bloomington Country Club Golf Course). While I live near the top of a ridge, there is a tree line that I believe in the spring/summer/fall would prevent any hope of reception out of Indy in addition to all the other wonderful troubles I've read about people trying to pick up Indy from Bloomington OTA. I also figure it would be a fair amount of money to even make the attempt, so I have Insight with the HD pack.

However, I've toyed with the idea for a while of at least trying an attic antenna or something to pick up local OTA, in HDTV if possible. I've got a Hitachi 51F715 which has a built-in tuner, so it really would be considering 2 issues I figure:

1. Whether I can pick up local broadcast with a reasonably priced antenna setup.

2. Whether what I would pick up locally offers anything different than what I get with the Insight and Insight HD.

Can anyone comment specifically on #2? It looks like based on Antennaweb that I could pick up the following pretty easily locally OTA:

WTIU, WPIX, WCLJ and possibly WTTV, but only WTIU and WPIX digital? Are those both HD?

Of those, it only looks like WTIU comes though as part of Insight's HD.

Thanks much for any information or assistance.

I've got a Hitachi 51F715 which has a built-in tuner, so it really would be considering 2 issues I figure:

1. Whether I can pick up local broadcast with a reasonably priced antenna setup.

2. Whether what I would pick up locally offers anything different than what I get with the Insight and Insight HD.

Can anyone comment specifically on #2? It looks like based on Antennaweb that I could pick up the following pretty easily locally OTA:

WTIU, WPIX, WCLJ and possibly WTTV, but only WTIU and WPIX digital? Are those both HD?

Of those, it only looks like WTIU comes though as part of Insight's HD.

Thanks much for any information or assistance.

I live North of Bloomington and have no trouble receiving Indy, but my son lives South of you (Victor Pike and SR 37) and has problems.
You can get WTIU with any cheap indoor antenna you can find. I honestly think you might well get it with a wire hanging out of the antenna input jack.
WTIU has recently started broadcasting three signals. Their HD feed, which is part of your Insight package, their digital feed of the analog channel 30, and a third digital feed (not the greatest resolution - called :TIU2).
I can only guess if you can get the "Trafalgar trio". I would assume you will need a better quality antenna than a wire hanging out of the antenna jack! I really don't know much about indoor antennas and can't offer much advice on that. I'm guessing a larger attic model will be needed.
WPIX and WCLJ both have four standard definition religious (sometimes info-mercial) channels, including a spiffy Spanish model on 42-4.
WTTV sends out only one signal, which is HD when the show is in HD.
I'd say you may indeed have a better chance of getting these than the Indy channels.
Good luck!
Nat Hill IV

It's coming. While we've been moving WNDY's operation to the WISH building, the one thing that isn't working is true HD for WNDY. We're about a week away from moving/installing some equipment that will restore the HD to full operation.

Tom Weber
WISH / WNDY Engineering


Are there any updates on WNDY going back HD, or has it already? I haven't watched anything lately that would be in HD on 23, but am hoping that I can finally see "Everybody Hates Chris" in HD.

bakem

A set of microwave antennas got aimed at each other this week, to get the programming from us to them (right now it's still flowing thru their old studio site), and I'm hoping to get the system up and operational next week.

Tom Weber
WISH / WNDY, etc. Engineering

Is anyone else not getting HDNet or HDNet Movies on TWC in Terre Haute? The Red Wings are finally on for HD, and it doesn't work. :mad:

I happened to be in Best Buy this weekend and was poking around the tv section when one of there sales reps started on me about hdtv. I acted as if I didn't already have one and he went on and on about how Comcast was going to start offering hdtv service in muncie real soon. I told him that was same thing I have heard for the last 4 years and he said he had "inside" information. Man what some people will do to make a sale. I thought Best Buy was a non commission store.

I happened to be in Best Buy this weekend and was poking around the tv section when one of there sales reps started on me about hdtv. I acted as if I didn't already have one and he went on and on about how Comcast was going to start offering hdtv service in muncie real soon. I told him that was same thing I have heard for the last 4 years and he said he had "inside" information. Man what some people will do to make a sale. I thought Best Buy was a non commission store.

It is almost "the first of the year" so who knows. I wouldnt put any money on it though. I wonder how long it will be before Muncie gets the TIVO based DVR that Comcast is supposed to be releasing? Probably years.

Last thing I read about Comcast's Tivo boxes are that they're looking to have them ready this upcoming summer. That is, of course, just in general, not actually in Muncie. I'm hoping they get their acts together and get both HD cable and the Tivo boxes so I can make a good decision about whether or not to switch to the new Ka band Directv when it becomes available for the Indianapolis channels.

Any news on WTWO (36.1) out of Terre Haute? Box locks on a signal, but no video content for over a week. Have been showing SD content for awhile and hoping this may be a sign of advancement (HD finally) or more than likely they're just shutting it all down.

Any news on WTWO (36.1) out of Terre Haute? Box locks on a signal, but no video content for over a week. Have been showing SD content for awhile and hoping this may be a sign of advancement (HD finally) or more than likely they're just shutting it all down.

Yeah, not sure whats goin' on with that. I talked to their C.E. last week about someone complaining about that same thing. I cant seem to get 2-1 <36> or their 38-1 <39> at my house, but can get both just fine at the station using a small UHF yagi and a Sencore DT demod. May have something to do with PID's. I try to look at that on our demod Monday. Maybe they lost TSID or someting.

Just wondering on your unit, can you get the EPG to build on WTWO-DT? How's WTHI-DT where you are? And where are you?

Ken

Now that they finally have WRTV, is there any chance that we'll be seeing WXIN or WTTV/K? I just don't understand why Comcast seems to be so good in offering HD and Brighthouse seems to have no intention of adding stations. It's frustrating!

Now that they finally have WRTV, is there any chance that we'll be seeing WXIN or WTTV/K? I just don't understand why Comcast seems to be so good in offering HD and Brighthouse seems to have no intention of adding stations. It's frustrating!

Comcast is only good with HD if you happen to live in an area where they offer it. Im in Muncie and have been waiting on them for over a year.

Now that they finally have WRTV, is there any chance that we'll be seeing WXIN or WTTV/K? I just don't understand why Comcast seems to be so good in offering HD and Brighthouse seems to have no intention of adding stations. It's frustrating!

It all comes down to dollars and cents, and maybe a little "sense" too! WXIN and WTTV/K are owned by Tribune, so apparently some stumbling blocks remain between Tribune and Bright House.

Steve

Nick,

I think it does help to complain to Brighthouse. Send them emails or call. A friend use to work there and said they have to write down all complaints called in. I know I've given them some breathing room lately since we got WTHR.

BTW, Brighthouse is getting Universal HD before the 1st. This is a good addition.

Jerry

CBS - Channel 8... I usually can get 6, 13, 23, 59 all in HD at 85% or better with my 4228 out of muncie. FOX (59.1) RF - 45 is usually what I watch and its always around 98%. I cannot get CBS though - antennaweb.org doesnt even list CBS 8 in HD for some reason with area code 47304... I moved the antenna and could get it in (RF 9) but then 59.1 wouldnt come in very well.. Any ideas?
What the other website (.gov) that lists all the HD channels instead of antennaweb.org?
Shouldnt I be able to get FOX and CBS pointing the antenna the same direction? When I did get CBS in to watch the Colts, it was pretty choppy and it was only at like 70-80%...
Any thoughts?
Thanks!
Ross

Is the 4228 a UHF-only model? Connect the antenna to a plain-old analog TV and see what the picture looks like on WISH-8 analog. If it's decent, it should do a good job with WISH-DT 9, as well.

Since the WISH and WXIN tower sites are about 1500 feet apart, siting one ought to do the other as well, but you may be receiving different bounces of multipath on the two signals that are on very different frequencies.

Tom Weber
Engineering, WISH, WNDY, et al.

BTW, we did get the WNDY full HD capabilities back up and running last week, so you can once again see the UPN HD programs in full HD glory.

Tom Weber
Engineering, WISH, WNDY, et al.

Thanks for the reply - I think the 4228 is UHF only, but I do have a 9/10 split antenna and of course the amplifier made by channel master. I dont know that the analog stations ever look very good - but im not used to analog OTA so its probably "normal". I have to change the antenna a good 40 degrees or so to pick up RF9, but when im getting FOX and the others in just fine, RF9 doesnt get more than like 30% signal? RF9 is out of Indy right, im not pulling it from another city by chance right?
I did notice that Muncie has a new PBS station broadcasting in HD - if they would only put some "discovery channel" like programs on it I would be happy!

Tom,

Thanks for getting wndy going. I believe the IU/BallState game is going to be televised in sd this coming weekend.

Thanks for the reply - I think the 4228 is UHF only, but I do have a 9/10 split antenna and of course the amplifier made by channel master. I dont know that the analog stations ever look very good - but im not used to analog OTA so its probably "normal". I have to change the antenna a good 40 degrees or so to pick up RF9, but when im getting FOX and the others in just fine, RF9 doesnt get more than like 30% signal? RF9 is out of Indy right, im not pulling it from another city by chance right?
I did notice that Muncie has a new PBS station broadcasting in HD - if they would only put some "discovery channel" like programs on it I would be happy!

Im in Muncie and get all of the locals in HD just fine with very little intereferance at all but my antenna gets both uhf and vhf.

Im right near ball state off tillotson - wondering what direction you point yours at? What kind of antenna do you have and what about the tuner etc?
thanks
Ross

BTW, we did get the WNDY full HD capabilities back up and running last week, so you can once again see the UPN HD programs in full HD glory.

Tom Weber
Engineering, WISH, WNDY, et al.

Happy Holidays and thank you so much for making HD possible (UPN) again.

CBS - Channel 8... I usually can get 6, 13, 23, 59 all in HD at 85% or better with my 4228 out of muncie. FOX (59.1) RF - 45 is usually what I watch and its always around 98%. I cannot get CBS though - antennaweb.org doesnt even list CBS 8 in HD for some reason with area code 47304... I moved the antenna and could get it in (RF 9) but then 59.1 wouldnt come in very well.. Any ideas?
What the other website (.gov) that lists all the HD channels instead of antennaweb.org?
Shouldnt I be able to get FOX and CBS pointing the antenna the same direction? When I did get CBS in to watch the Colts, it was pretty choppy and it was only at like 70-80%...
Any thoughts?
Thanks!
Ross

You have a CM7777 preamp.This scenario sounds like the switch inside the preamp is set to"common" instead of "seperate".If it is set to common,you're only picking up signals from the 4228,hence the skewed angle reception of Ch9 DT.You have the Winegard CC-3190,which is one of the best antennas to use for channel 9 or 10.

If this is not the problem,your only other choice is to turn the VHF antenna on the mast for best signal for Ch9 and re-tighten,even though its pointing in a different direction than the UHF antenna.

I'd come up and fix the problem,but have no reason to go to Muncie anymore.

Greg B

Hey Greg, nice to hear from you. Im abour 99% sure ive got the cm7777 set to seperate as I remember asking which way to set it... Will play with it some more to see what I come up with. if my rotator was reliable it wouldnt be a problem as I could just move it but it still doesnt really work when I want it to- I will probably sent it back to solid signal for repair if possible...

For Christmas I upgraded my dad to HD. He's had a mitsu HD TV for a couple of years now but has never put any HD signals through it. Anyways, so they came out yesterday to install the new dish and receiver and I ask the installer if he thought he would be able to pick up any OTA there (He lives in Edinburgh). And the installer said: "No, there are none available down here yet, he will be able to get them when they become available but that hasn't happend yet". :rolleyes:

So anyways, as soon as he left, I went outside, turned the antenna a lil bit and whaaalaa, HD locals OTA. :D

However, the real reason for my post, is we were only able to pick up ABC and FOX. They came in great. I have no idea what kinda antenna he has, but I do know it is very very old. At least 10 years if not more. And its just an antenna on a short mast and a cable....thats it. Once he saw that, needless to say he got excited and we are planning on repositioning the mast to the north end of the house. But I was wondering what else would you guys suggest in order to get the other networks to come in? Thoughts? Ideas? Suggestions?

Thanks guys!

Definitely get an amplifier - that should help regardless..
Maybe im missing something or just wrong - but I thought you had to have UHF antenna to get HD in? I guess im just suprised you get HD out of an antenna thats so old? How do you know if your getting a VFH or a UHF signal?

Explorher64,

Wow, where do these installers come from? I can't believe the many stories as to how clueless they are about DTV. It's amazing!!

From Edinburgh, you should be able to see the towers for WTTV-DT (48), WIPX-DT(27) and WCLJ-DT (56) in Trafalgar, which is approximately 11 miles, west-northwest. Most of the other Indy DTV towers are near 79th St. and Township Line Rd., approximately 38 miles, north-northwest. This is virtually the same distance to the southside of Kokomo where over this past weekend I was able to receive WTHR-DT (46), WXIN-DT (45) and WRTV-DT (25) with the little indoor Zenith Silver Sensor antenna and no preamp. This antenna is UHF-only so I was not able to receive WISH-DT which is on VHF channel 9. Currently this is the only local DTV station on VHF, as all others are currently on UHF channels.

A decent all-channel (UHF/VHF combination) antenna should work well for you in that location.

Steve

Goldrich,

I dunno where these guys get their training from, he even said he had to take some classes on doing the installs. I just smiled politely and nodded my head and told my dad that I'd get everything figured out when he left, lol.

I never thought of actually trying the other channels (45, 46, 25, etc). I'm sort of a newbie to all of this. I just tried 6.1, 6.2, 59.1 etc etc... I'll have him try these other channels out and see if he gets any response.

As far as uhf/vhf goes...I really have no clue what his antenna is. I just know it is what he used back in the day when he had one of the huge dishs to get our locals in and it picked them up then...so.

OK, I know I probably won't get an answer on this, but I'm going to ask again anyway, if only for my own amusement.

I don't like multicasting, but I realize we have to live with it in some cases. WRTV and WTHR each have a weather sub-channel, and although I'd rather they have no sub-channels, I can live with one.

But good grief, WISH, why why why broadcast THREE weather sub-channels? What amazes me is that they all show something different, yet none of them show anything necessary. One has a radar, one has a loop of someone doing a forecast, and one has some "Weatherbug" gibberish. And the kicker is that everytime we've had severe weather since I got my HD tuner, none of those three channels has actually been adressing the situation. They just keep on keeping on with their looped tape and their temperature gauges. The radar was somewhat useful, but not nearly as useful as a live anchor would have been.

So again, I ask "why?" Is it a political thing with CBS? Is it a marketing thing? Is WISH just testing out the channels so they'll be ready for CBS' rumored and dreadful multicasting plot? Is CBS Nightly News going to play Anchor Idol with different talent on each channel to determine a supreme desk champion?

I just wanna know.

Nick,

I think it does help to complain to Brighthouse. Send them emails or call. A friend use to work there and said they have to write down all complaints called in. I know I've given them some breathing room lately since we got WTHR.

BTW, Brighthouse is getting Universal HD before the 1st. This is a good addition.

Jerry


I always say any HD is good HD, but...

Let's just say I hope you like Law & Order and six-month-old sports repeats. UHD can get a little, um, redundant. ;)

So again, I ask "why?" Is it a political thing with CBS? Is it a marketing thing? Is WISH just testing out the channels so they'll be ready for CBS' rumored and dreadful multicasting plot? Is CBS Nightly News going to play Anchor Idol with different talent on each channel to determine a supreme desk champion?

I guess the question is why do you care? Multicasting is a nice feature of digital TV. Why is having more digital channels available to you causing you stress?

I guess the question is why do you care? Multicasting is a nice feature of digital TV. Why is having more digital channels available to you causing you stress?

More sub-channels equals less bandwidth for the HD channel, and in turn poorer picture quality. I don't think it's a nice feature when it takes something away from the main channel, especially when its implementation is so useless. Honestly, who has an HDTV that doesn't have internet access to get online and look up the weather for themselves?

I just got a HDTV and I live in the West Lafayette Area. I was wondering if its worth it to go buy the over the air tuner. I know that theres is only CBS in HD locally but can I pick up the Indianapolis well? Can I do this is a Indoor antenna or will I need a outdoor?

We feel that we're doing a fairly good job of balancing competing needs.

First, let me say that LWS, the Local Weather Station, has existed for many years now, even before Digital TV came about. It was available on Low-Power Channel 11, then Low Power Channel 17.

Of the 19.4 MBits that are available for digital broadcasting, WISH uses 16 for HD video, 2 for LWS video, and a measly 0.5 for the radar channel. The rest is for audio and other required and necessary digital data. Thus, even eliminating the 2 subchannels would result in only marginal improvement.

The radar is there sort of as a "because we can," but at only 0.5 Mbits (I tweaked it a lot to make it that efficient), it's not hurting anything, and a lot of folks really like it.

As for LWS, it is the only one of the "extra" channels throughout town that is truly "Weather-Only." Another station is News-Only, and still another is some weather, some news, and some infomercials. Our meteorologists can and do go live on the LWS station when weather conditions start to appear threatening, but before they turn truly serious and worrisome.

Hope this helps explain our thinking.

Tom Weber
Engineering, WISH, WNDY, et al.

Tom,
Your picture is fine by me now that the distort-o-vision is gone. The way it's balanced seems to work well and I do like the weather and radar sub-channels.

BTW did something change in the transmitter setup? I noticed a drop in signal from ~95 to 65 or so a couple months back.

Im right near ball state off tillotson - wondering what direction you point yours at? What kind of antenna do you have and what about the tuner etc?
thanks
Ross

My first antenna could not recieve vhf so I wasnt getting wishTV so we switched to the Channel Master 3679 antenna and it is on a tv tower with the channel master 7777 pre amp. My TV has a tuner in it so I just use that and it works and looks great.

I didnt put it up so I dont know about the direction but there wasnt much to do once it was up. The channels all came in including wishTV.

We feel that we're doing a fairly good job of balancing competing needs.

First, let me say that LWS, the Local Weather Station, has existed for many years now, even before Digital TV came about. It was available on Low-Power Channel 11, then Low Power Channel 17.

Of the 19.4 MBits that are available for digital broadcasting, WISH uses 16 for HD video, 2 for LWS video, and a measly 0.5 for the radar channel. The rest is for audio and other required and necessary digital data. Thus, even eliminating the 2 subchannels would result in only marginal improvement.

The radar is there sort of as a "because we can," but at only 0.5 Mbits (I tweaked it a lot to make it that efficient), it's not hurting anything, and a lot of folks really like it.

As for LWS, it is the only one of the "extra" channels throughout town that is truly "Weather-Only." Another station is News-Only, and still another is some weather, some news, and some infomercials. Our meteorologists can and do go live on the LWS station when weather conditions start to appear threatening, but before they turn truly serious and worrisome.

Hope this helps explain our thinking.

Tom Weber
Engineering, WISH, WNDY, et al.


Thanks for the explanation. I didn't mean to imply that the picture quality on WISH-DT wasn't good... it's actually the best of all the local stations IMO, and that's even with three sub-channels, so you guys are really doing a terrific job balancing everything. I watch a lot of football on several channels, and with all the fast motion and cuts, it's pretty obvious that WISH is doing the best job in delivering a high-quality signal.

So I should actually say thanks for working in those sub-channels and keeping the main channel looking great at the same time. :)

Hi,
Could someone give me an update on the best way to get HD locals in Terre Haute? My parents live there and have DirecTV right now and a HD TiVo receiver from DirecTV. Are WTHI-DT and the others broadcasting shows in HD yet or does Time Warner have locals in HD? Thanks.

Dave

Oh, no offense taken. In fact, as more people buy HD sets, and some of them find their way here, it's good to periodically repeat what some of the good and bad points of digital TV are.

As I've re-read the question, tho, it seems like there's some confusion, as we have a total of 3 channels in our digital bandwidth:
8-1, WISH-HD
8-2, LWS, the Local Weather Station
8-3, Radar

I'm not sure where the "third" weather subchannel is that you're seeing.

Regards,
Tom Weber
Engineering, WISH, WNDY, et al.

Nothing has changed in our DTV transmitter setup that I can tell - still chugging away at our full authorized power.

Tom Weber
Engineering, WISH, WNDY, et al.

Hi,
Could someone give me an update on the best way to get HD locals in Terre Haute? My parents live there and have DirecTV right now and a HD TiVo receiver from DirecTV. Are WTHI-DT and the others broadcasting shows in HD yet or does Time Warner have locals in HD? Thanks.

Dave


The current situation here is...

WTHI-DT is currently on the air with reduced power at Farmersburg, IN. We will be at full power sometime this summer. We currently run all available CBS-HD programming. Any other time, we simulcast our CH10 SD signal on WTHI-DT <RF24>.

WTWO-DT <36> is currently simulcasting their SD feed as well as WFXW-DT <39>. I'm not sure if either of those stations have any HD programming to offer.

Not sure if any cable operators are carrying the DT's. I don't believe that DirecTV carries anything from Terre Haute. Echostar is only carrying the SD content from the three stations here.

So, I guess, with all that said, to answer your question... you should probably get a UHF antenna and point it to Farmersburg to catch the OTA feeds. Right now, that's the only way to get the local DT's

Hope this helps, Ken.

Hey Tom, thanks for 8-3. It's nice to be able to see a live radar when I'm at home. Since I cant see my own live radar at my house, it's nice to be able to see another "close" footprint no matter. Maybe we talk shop on this subject on the company email system.

Ken

Nothing has changed in our DTV transmitter setup that I can tell - still chugging away at our full authorized power.

Tom Weber
Engineering, WISH, WNDY, et al.

Notwithstanding the Sunday morning of the 18th from 8-8:30 this month when you were off-air.Always wondered what CPO would look like from here...actually snow-free! :-)

Would be nice to split off the Weatherbug from LWS and put it on 8-3 when the radar is blank for days on end.

Greg B

Nothing has changed in our DTV transmitter setup that I can tell - still chugging away at our full authorized power.

Tom Weber
Engineering, WISH, WNDY, et al.

Thanks. Nothing has changed on my side either as far as I can tell. Maybe something in the intervening miles between Plainfield and the tower.

Oh, no offense taken. In fact, as more people buy HD sets, and some of them find their way here, it's good to periodically repeat what some of the good and bad points of digital TV are.

As I've re-read the question, tho, it seems like there's some confusion, as we have a total of 3 channels in our digital bandwidth:
8-1, WISH-HD
8-2, LWS, the Local Weather Station
8-3, Radar

I'm not sure where the "third" weather subchannel is that you're seeing.

Regards,
Tom Weber
Engineering, WISH, WNDY, et al.


This must be an issue with DirecTV. I have an 8-4 listed on my program guide. Last few times I checked, I had LWS on 8-2, the radar on 8-3, and what I thought was another weather channel on 8-4. It just takes so long to tune from 8-2 to 8-3 and 8-3 to 8-4 that 8-4 looks like it's showing something different, when it's really the same as 8-2.

DirecTV also lists 8-3 and the phantom 8-4 as showing the same programming as the analog channel, so until recently I would flip through the guide and think I had three channels showing the same thing. I recently re-scanned for OTA signals and the receiver didn't make any changes, so it must just be some strange DirecTV guide quirk.

This must be an issue with DirecTV. I have an 8-4 listed on my program guide.

Maybe 8-4 was a "leftover" in the memory from March when WISH-DT expands to four channels to air four playoff games during NCAA "March Madness." During the past 4 years that's the only time I've seen WISH-DT using 8-4. Just a thought.

Steve

Yeah, not sure whats goin' on with that. I talked to their C.E. last week about someone complaining about that same thing. I cant seem to get 2-1 <36> or their 38-1 <39> at my house, but can get both just fine at the station using a small UHF yagi and a Sencore DT demod. May have something to do with PID's. I try to look at that on our demod Monday. Maybe they lost TSID or someting.

Just wondering on your unit, can you get the EPG to build on WTWO-DT? How's WTHI-DT where you are? And where are you?

Ken

Ken, sorry for the late response, got an extended Holiday break. I'm not very technical with this stuff so when you're refering to EPG I'm afraid I have no clue what that stands for. I'll give a shot of what I think you maybe asking.

First I'm using one of the older Samsung models (SIR151) so the strength meter reads bars only and not in %s. I live approximately 12 miles north of Terre Haute and 3 miles south/west of Clinton out in the country. My home is halfway up a hill so my line of site is better than in the valley of Clinton and not as good as homes near the Lilly plant.

As mentioned before WTWO shows 8 bars on my meter (never had a station above 9 bars ever except WTHI) and at this time it attempts to lock on, but there is no video.

FOX shows 8 bars and other than showing SD content only has been steady for a long time.

Finally, WHTI (24-1) comes in at 9 bars and is the only reason I have remained interested in HD at all. Thank goodness for you guys and have especially enjoyed a number of Colts game in glorious HD because of you. By the way, Ken has been a tv star of late. WTHI runs a Happy Holidays piece and Ken M is one of the people on it. We need to let him know not to let the celebrity go to his head. :p

Anyone living in Terre Haute will be able to pickup their local DTs more than likely just using a Zenith Silver Sensor.

Hey guys I have not posted here in a while. Anyhoo, I am suprised to learn that so many people out of Bloomington have a hard time getting Indy Stations. I currently live outside of bloomfield near the Solsberry train Trussel(good sight to see if you haven't). I can not get any of the Indy Stations reliably but I have picked them up from time to time. I can usually get a pixalated picture but no solid lock. Of course I live in the bottom of a valley, right up the road I would think that I could get them. I am looking for a house to buy and may be moving to the town limits of bloomfield. Anybody from around the Bloomfield area have luck picking up Indy stations. I know that I should have no problem picking up CBS-D out of Terre Haute, but I need Indy or Loisville for the rest of my Digital needs. Antennaweb has them pegged at about 70 miles away. Do you guys recommend a UHF only Antenna? I currently have a winegard 8200P. Thanks for everyones comments on the board. It is cool reading about others trials and tribulations in getting OTA.

I can't speak to reception in Bloomfield but one Indy station is VHF. If getting WISH-DT matters UHF only may not be the best choice. If the signal is strong enough it may not matter but at the distance you mention I suspect it would.

The current situation here is...

WTHI-DT is currently on the air with reduced power at Farmersburg, IN. We will be at full power sometime this summer. We currently run all available CBS-HD programming. Any other time, we simulcast our CH10 SD signal on WTHI-DT <RF24>.

WTWO-DT <36> is currently simulcasting their SD feed as well as WFXW-DT <39>. I'm not sure if either of those stations have any HD programming to offer.

Not sure if any cable operators are carrying the DT's. I don't believe that DirecTV carries anything from Terre Haute. Echostar is only carrying the SD content from the three stations here.

So, I guess, with all that said, to answer your question... you should probably get a UHF antenna and point it to Farmersburg to catch the OTA feeds. Right now, that's the only way to get the local DT's

Hope this helps, Ken.

Nexstar, the company who owns WTWO and WFXW have no plans to upgrade to HD. They claim that the market is too small to justify the cost.

DirecTV does not carry Terre Haute locals. They will send you network affiliates from New York if you either 1) don't have a local affiliate or 2) get a waiver from them.

Since Terre Haute has no ABC affiliate, you can get WABC-DT from New York over DirecTV. I called Nexstar about getting a waiver from WTWO and WFXW since they don't plan on broadcasting in HD, and they pretty much told me to go fly a kite.

There was talk last year of a bill sponsored by John McCain that would FORCE local affiliates who don't broadcast in HD to sign the waiver.. but I haven't heard much about it lately. You need to 1) call your congressman 2) call Nexstar and tell them YOU WANT HD NBC AND FOX IN TERRE HAUTE!

As far as WTHI - keep up the good work. PLEASE don't start multicasting... your HD picture quality is the best I've seen anywhere in the country because you don't multicast.

PS - How are things going now that Emmis has sold the TV portion of WTHI? Will HI99 have to change it's call letters? Will Kevin Orpurt still do the weather on Hi 99?

Ken, sorry for the late response, got an extended Holiday break. I'm not very technical with this stuff so when you're refering to EPG I'm afraid I have no clue what that stands for. I'll give a shot of what I think you maybe asking.

First I'm using one of the older Samsung models (SIR151) so the strength meter reads bars only and not in %s. I live approximately 12 miles north of Terre Haute and 3 miles south/west of Clinton out in the country. My home is halfway up a hill so my line of site is better than in the valley of Clinton and not as good as homes near the Lilly plant.

As mentioned before WTWO shows 8 bars on my meter (never had a station above 9 bars ever except WTHI) and at this time it attempts to lock on, but there is no video.

FOX shows 8 bars and other than showing SD content only has been steady for a long time.

Finally, WHTI (24-1) comes in at 9 bars and is the only reason I have remained interested in HD at all. Thank goodness for you guys and have especially enjoyed a number of Colts game in glorious HD because of you. By the way, Ken has been a tv star of late. WTHI runs a Happy Holidays piece and Ken M is one of the people on it. We need to let him know not to let the celebrity go to his head. :p

Anyone living in Terre Haute will be able to pickup their local DTs more than likely just using a Zenith Silver Sensor.
Im out in Village Quarter with a SONY 30" 30HS420 and Time Warner Cable HD box. So your saying all I would need is a Zenith silver sensor to pick up WTHI HD OTA?

I just got a HDTV and I live in the West Lafayette Area. I was wondering if its worth it to go buy the over the air tuner. I know that theres is only CBS in HD locally but can I pick up the Indianapolis well? Can I do this is a Indoor antenna or will I need a outdoor?

I am over by Rossville and get all the Indy HD channels fine, but I have a large antenna on a 36' tower with a pre-amp. Before I got all that setup, I had a small Zenith UHF antenna (that I bought at Menards in Lafayette) about 20' up and got them all but WISH-DT as well. Not sure how much luck you will have inside (even in an attic), but I have the added problem of being within 2 miles of the WLFI tower, so my pre-amp and TV tuners both get hammered by ch18 and 18HD.

I would recommend that you add VHF (at least channels 7-13) to your antennas, for long-term happiness. After analog goes away (about 3 years away), WISH-DT will still broadcast on ch. 9, WTHR will return to 13, and WTHI will return to 10, if all goes as currently planned.

Tom Weber
Engineering, WISH / WNDY / et al.

Ken, sorry for the late response, got an extended Holiday break. I'm not very technical with this stuff so when you're refering to EPG I'm afraid I have no clue what that stands for. I'll give a shot of what I think you maybe asking.

First I'm using one of the older Samsung models (SIR151) so the strength meter reads bars only and not in %s. I live approximately 12 miles north of Terre Haute and 3 miles south/west of Clinton out in the country. My home is halfway up a hill so my line of site is better than in the valley of Clinton and not as good as homes near the Lilly plant.

As mentioned before WTWO shows 8 bars on my meter (never had a station above 9 bars ever except WTHI) and at this time it attempts to lock on, but there is no video.

FOX shows 8 bars and other than showing SD content only has been steady for a long time.

Finally, WHTI (24-1) comes in at 9 bars and is the only reason I have remained interested in HD at all. Thank goodness for you guys and have especially enjoyed a number of Colts game in glorious HD because of you. By the way, Ken has been a tv star of late. WTHI runs a Happy Holidays piece and Ken M is one of the people on it. We need to let him know not to let the celebrity go to his head. :p

Anyone living in Terre Haute will be able to pickup their local DTs more than likely just using a Zenith Silver Sensor.

EPG= Electronic Program Guide.
I was wondering if you can see the EPG that WTWO-DT is sending out. It seems that there are a number of folks that are having trouble with theWTWO-DT stream. Just wondering if you can get the guide info...?? It seems that they may have lost the data that tells your receiver what to receive on their stream. There is a lot of data that rides in the stream that no one ever sees, but the Rx needs this info to "unlock" all the pix and sound information. They may have lost a piece of this data...???

As far a the celebrity thing goes, I really dont like being in front of the camera. Usually, if I'm in front of the camera, there is a BIG problem. Although, if you look real close sometime during our continous severe weather coverage, you might see us engineers under the weather set reviving smoking computers after a lightning hit!!!
Thx, Ken.

...

As far as WTHI - keep up the good work. PLEASE don't start multicasting... your HD picture quality is the best I've seen anywhere in the country because you don't multicast.

PS - How are things going now that Emmis has sold the TV portion of WTHI? Will HI99 have to change it's call letters? Will Kevin Orpurt still do the weather on Hi 99?

Thx for the kind comments about our stream quality. We are currently upconverting ALL of our SD content to 1080. You will notice that our signal remains at 1080 even though the content is still SD. Some newer equipment has increased the quality of our conversion process. So even though our SD stuff is 480, there is absolutely no loss in quality. What you see on our DT is pretty much the way it looks in studio, without transmission loss! Now YOU can see the defects too!!!

Since the sale of the station, we are doing well. LIN has taken us in as one of their own, and we embrace that. LIN takes great pride in quality. They are very aggressive when it comes to cutting edge technology. <I'm not brown nosing here> And the people are great too!

Call letter change for either station is not in the immediate future.

And for now, YES. Kevin will continue to do the weather on HI-99! BTW <OT>, we finished installation of a brand new transmitter for HI-99 earlier this month. The transmitter being replaced was installed in 1981 and is now a backup for the big rig <30KW>. Maybe post some pics somewhere for you all, if interested!

ken.

Hello everyone, I was curious if any other Indianapolis peeps know if Comcast is gonna adopt any of the new MHD channels? I just think it would be a great addition to a decent lineup. Any news?

Hello everyone, I was curious if any other Indianapolis peeps know if Comcast is gonna adopt any of the new MHD channels? I just think it would be a great addition to a decent lineup. Any news?
Excuse my ignorance, but what is MHD?

Ken

Ken Myers,

Im out in Village Quarter with a SONY 30" 30HS420 and Time Warner Cable HD box. What do I need to pick up WTHI HD OTA? A Zenith Silver Sensor? Are there any plans to transmit the HD signal through Time Warner Cable when programming permits?

I just noticed that Bright House (Indy/Carmel) has added WTTV-DT (Ch. 704), WXIN-DT (Ch. 711) and Universal HD (UNIHD...Ch. 754). The Bright House website mentions the addition of Universal HD and has this to say about it..............

Universal HD - Channel 754 (HDTV Choice Pak)
Universal HD offers the best of NBC Universal's library in HD including movies, series, sports, specials and performing arts. Examples of movies include Backdraft, The Fast and the Furious. Television series include “Monk," "Law & Order: SVU" and "Battlestar Galactica".

Here at 12:08 p.m., UNIHD and WXINH are on but WTTVH is currently not on, but the station/info banner is up and current. Looks as though it should be up and running soon.

Happy New Year to all at AVS Forum!

Steve

I just noticed that Bright House (Indy/Carmel) has added WTTV-DT (Ch. 704), WXIN-DT (Ch. 711) and Universal HD (UNIHD...Ch. 754).

So what's the full HD lineup on Carmel/Bright House now, including movie channels (if you don't mind posting it)?

So what's the full HD lineup on Carmel/Bright House now, including movie channels (if you don't mind posting it)?

In addition to the 3 new ones (WTTV-HD, WXIN-HD and UNIHD), these HD channels are available:

706 WRTV-HD (ABC)
708 WISH-HD (CBS)
710 WFYI-HD (PBS)
713 WTHR-HD (NBC)
720 HBO HD
721 HBO West HD
730 Showtime HD
731 Showtime West HD
733 Discovery HD Theater
735 TNT-HD
750 INHD
751 INHD2
752 HD Net
753 HD Net Movies
760 ESPN-HD

Ken Myers,

Im out in Village Quarter with a SONY 30" 30HS420 and Time Warner Cable HD box. What do I need to pick up WTHI HD OTA? A Zenith Silver Sensor? Are there any plans to transmit the HD signal through Time Warner Cable when programming permits?


I would guess that, in that area, you should stand a good chance of getting a decent signal. Even better if you are on a 2nd floor and looking to the south. If you can find a cheapie UHF "rabbit ear" style antenna, I would give it a try. You are about 17 miles from the "farm", but pretty much "line of sight" out there. You can see the towers just fine on Hulman street just east of 46 - near the airport property. Not sure if your allowed any outside antennas, but BIGGER is better!
I can't really give you a good answer on the indoor style antennas. I am acustomed to outdoor yagi's, corner reflectors, and big towers! I know, downtown at the station, we cannot get the signal without using a yagi on the third floor of our building! <RF alley!>

Not sure of any plans yet for TW to carry our DT signal. GL on the signal aquisition.
ken

In addition to the 3 new ones (WTTV-HD, WXIN-HD and UNIHD), these HD channels are available:

706 WRTV-HD (ABC)
708 WISH-HD (CBS)
710 WFYI-HD (PBS)
713 WTHR-HD (NBC)
720 HBO HD
721 HBO West HD
730 Showtime HD
731 Showtime West HD
733 Discovery HD Theater
735 TNT-HD
750 INHD
751 INHD2
752 HD Net
753 HD Net Movies
760 ESPN-HD


That's a pretty impressive list... you usually don't see INHD and HDNet on the same system. I think that's about as good as it gets. The only thing missing and worth having is probably ESPN2 HD.

I would be switching to Bright House from DirecTV if I didn't want NFL Sunday Ticket.

I cant have an outdoor antenna here so that wont work. Ive heard great things about that zenith silver sensor indoor antenna. Since I have the Time Warner HD cable box, how does that silver sensor hook up? Do I have to have an OTA receiver or does the antenna just hook up to the Time Warner HD box or likewise just to the tv?

You need an OTA receiver. If your TV has a HD tuner built in all you need is to connect an antenna. I don't know whether or not your TW box has an OTA receiver or not but doubt it. Cable HD is in QAM format whereas OTA is 8VSB.

Do I stand any chance of receiving the Indianapolis VHF and UHF stations over-the-air from Columbus with an indoor antenna? I'm new to town and would like to try.

I've researched over the web various antennas and ran across high praise for a TERK HDTVa amplified indoor antenna available through Radio Shack and Amazon. A fellow in western Massachusetts wrote a great review of this antenna on Amazon, after testing five different antennas including some outdoor rigs. He said the TERK "blew away" the similar Zenith indoor antenna could even pick up signals from stations in Connecticut some 60+ miles away.

I figure I'm about 50+ miles away from the Indy stations' towers. I live in a brick building and have been advised hooking up a large outdoor antenna would be quite costly. It was suggested I try an amplified indoor antenna first.

I have a one-year old Zenith LCD TV (model Z23LZ5R) that can accept video input via either a) 75-ohm antenna; b) S-video; c) 480i/480p/720p/1080i component video; or d) DVI (RGB).

Unfortunately, I am not savvy enough to understand all these signals nor how I can take fullest advantage of this television should I try to obtain OTA reception, so any clearly-written advice would be most appreciated.

I suppose that a relatively inexpensive adapter of some sort would be necessary to take an OTA signal and convert it to S-video. And I suppose going to component video or DVI would involve an even more expensive piece of equipment between the antenna and the TV.

Can someone sketch out what all will be needed for different OTA set-ups (i.e. resolutions), assuming that I can even get OTA signals with an indoor amplified antenna?

Thank you.

Tom Heller
Columbus, IN

Tom,
In OTA reception there are no guarentees. You can only try. At 50+ miles I'd be surprised if an indoor antenna would work but who knows. If you can get one that is easily returnable if it won't work then it won't hurt to try.

If your Zenith has an OTA HD (ATSC) tuner then the antenna is all you need other then maybe a balun to convert 300 to 75 ohm if you get a 300 ohm antenna. If not there isn't an inexpensive adapter to go from the antenna to s-video. Beside s-video can't carry HDTV. You'll need an external OTA HD tuner and connect through either the component or DVI connectors if you don't have the internal tuner.

I'm not familiar with what Zenith has been shipping so can't answer that question. Even if it doesn't have an HD tuner and you can get the analog broadcast from the Indy stations with an indoor antenna you have a good chance of getting the HD also. Might help you decide if you want to get an external tuner if your TV doesn't have the HD tuner.

I cant have an outdoor antenna here so that wont work. Ive heard great things about that zenith silver sensor indoor antenna. Since I have the Time Warner HD cable box, how does that silver sensor hook up? Do I have to have an OTA receiver or does the antenna just hook up to the Time Warner HD box or likewise just to the tv?


You would probably have to contact TW Cable in order to find out about the Set Top Box hoolup. Not sure if you would get much help though since we are talking cable vs. OTA! If you have a DTV receiver, simply connect to an antenna input on the DTV.
ken

Hello everyone. New to this forum...been posting a little over on the Champaign (IL) thread and thought I'd check in here since I live in Marshall, IL and watch TV in both markets.

First off, let me say though I'm an employee at WTHI, I defer any technical questions to my colleague Ken Myers. Simply put..."he's the man". He'll tell you and I'll admit it...I know just enough techno stuff to be dangerous.

That said, I thought I'd report in with an equipment and signal report of sorts. I'm using a Philips 51" widescreen HDTV (51PP9100D/37). It has a built in dual-tuner (QAM/NTSC). I'm a MediaCom cable subscriber and have added their HD tier of channels (WTHI-DT, ESPN HD, ESPN2 HD, Universal HD, Discovery HD, HD Net, HD Net Movies, INHD, INHD2, HBO HD, and Starz HD). Finally, I'm using a Motorola DCT6412 III HDTV cable box with built in DVR.

One thing I've noticed right off the bat, cables mean everything. The cable folks hooked me up using composite cables. I thought HD looked pretty weak so I started researching and asking questions of some folks. I upgraded to S-Video cables. No better! Then I stepped up to Component cables. Big difference in HD. Wow. Finally, I bit the bullet and plunked down the cash for an HDMI cable. Honestly I don't see $85 worth of difference between Component and HDMI on the HD channels.

My biggest problem is no matter what cables I use, my regular cable tv channels (WTHI, WTWO, WFXW, A&E, Fox News, MSNBC, etc...) look like crap. I mean they are darned near unwatchable they are so blurry, soft and grainy. I had the MediaCom geniouses back out and they tested all sorts of things and said there was nothing wrong with the cable signal, the cable box or the coax and concluded it must just be the TV. Maybe...maybe not. My other standard 4:3 TV in the house is more watchable (because it's only a 25" screen), but the regular cable stuff still looks less than good. And no, I'm not comparing to HD. I know cable will never come close to that quality.

Next, I've been experimenting with indoor HDTV antennas. I started with basic rabbit ears allegedly optimized for HD. It pulled in WTHI-DT and WUSI-DT perfectly, but that was it. Next I went with one everyoine has been raving about...the Zenith Silver Sensor. Yuck! It was deaf (or blind). I could barely pick up WTHI-DT without it cutting out all the time. returned it and got another one many folks have talked about...the Terk HDTVa (amplified version). It's the best so far, though I can't get my own station on it. I now get WFXW (Fox in TH)...WUSI...and WICD-DT (ABC out of Champaign/Urbana). Watching the Notre Dame/Ohio State bowl game in HD right now. WOW!

That's been my HD experience so far. I'm sure there is more to come and I will quietly sit back, lurk and learn.

Thanks,
Doug

That's a pretty impressive list... you usually don't see INHD and HDNet on the same system. I think that's about as good as it gets. The only thing missing and worth having is probably ESPN2 HD.

I would be switching to Bright House from DirecTV if I didn't want NFL Sunday Ticket.

That, and that pesky move to Carmel. :-)

Also, Fox 59 is missing, correct?

My biggest problem is no matter what cables I use, my regular cable tv channels (WTHI, WTWO, WFXW, A&E, Fox News, MSNBC, etc...) look like crap. I mean they are darned near unwatchable they are so blurry, soft and grainy.

I assume you're talking about viewing these "analog" channels (lower numbered) through your Motorola box. I have noticed the same thing here in Indy on Comcast with the Motorola DVR. What I have read is that the Moto DVR box has to convert the analog channels to MPEG in order to be able to record them. The upper channel numbers (the "digital" channels) are already MPEG, so there's no conversion required. So I guess it's the nature of the beast, or the price we pay for DVR capability. One work-around would be to put a splitter before your DVR, and then use the TV's tuner for the lower channels. Of course this would only apply to "live" TV. If you want any of the DVR functions on these channels, you're stuck!

Happy Watching!

Ken

That, and that pesky move to Carmel. :-)

Also, Fox 59 is missing, correct?

Yeah, that Carmel thing would be a problem. But in addition to that list they added WB, Fox, and Universal HD, so they're pretty much set.

Tom,

I live in Columbus. Don't waste your money on an indoor antenna, or anything other than a bigger (+12') outdoor antenna. I have a 16' on a 25' tower. I can pick up pretty much all of the DT in indy except channel 23 and 40. The signal on 23 really is weak. We do get a lot of drop out on ch 8 due to their tower being on the north side of Indy.

Actually. I also have Comcast HD. Although Iamb not really thrilled with the prices, the HD package is pretty good. They have all the locals in HD except 23 for some reason.

Yeah, that Carmel thing would be a problem. But in addition to that list they added WB, Fox, and Universal HD, so they're pretty much set.

D-oh! Yeah, I missed the 3 additions.

Tom,

I live in Columbus. Don't waste your money on an indoor antenna, or anything other than a bigger (+12') outdoor antenna. I have a 16' on a 25' tower. I can pick up pretty much all of the DT in indy except channel 23 and 40. The signal on 23 really is weak.

Thanks for your reply (and to Les, too). Unfortunately, a tower and big outdoor antenna is not in the cards. I live on the second floor of a building downtown and had Keith Coop's Antennas service assess the situation. He was extremely reluctant to undertake mounting an antenna on the building. There are long interior cable runs involved and it would involve switching a line from a D*TV satellite dish, which apparently could bollix up my neighbors' reception. Too much risk. He suggested I try an indoor antenna first.

I found the report from Ken Myers' colleague in Marshall, IL to be encouraging. It looks to me that he's on the order of 60 miles from the ABC station in Champaign and was raving about the Ohio State-Notre Dame game reception he was getting off a TERK HDTVa indoor amplified antenna. I'm on the order of the same distance from the Indy stations, so I'm gonna try the TERK; I think I spotted one at Circuit City the other day. (BTW: the D*TV picture for the Ohio State-Notre Dame game was simply awful yesterday until the last 7 minutes of the game. There were 2 ghosts on the screen throughout until someone finally threw a switch somewhere and the picture became crystal clear.)

Hey you WTHI guys, I just called Time Warner Cable and asked them when they would aquire your HD signal for CBS programming and he told me something about the FCC had regulated by the end of this year that broadcasters are to do a simulcast for the HD and analog feed. Once that happens and WTHI passes thier signal through they would broadcast it in the TW service area around Terre Haute. So my question is when is WTHI going to send that HD feed? :)

I'm using a Motorola DCT6412 III HDTV cable box with built in DVR.

The Motorola box allows all outputs to be active at the same time (S-Video, composite, and component). I would suggest running an S-Video cable from the box to your TV using a different video input on the TV. When you're watching a non-HD channel, change your TV input to the one using the S-Video connection. You should notice a better picture, since all the noise won't be upconverted to 1080i or 720p and you'll be getting a "native" signal.

Also, on the Motorola box, change the 4:3 override setting to "none". You can find steps to do that with a quick Google search ("dct6412 4:3 override change"). This will let the box just pass regular cable channels through to your TV without any kind of upconversion or modification, and should be nearly as good as having a direct cable feed into your TV.

Regarding component vs. digital, most people can discern no difference between the two, so you're not alone. In fact, some think that the analog component looks better.

Good luck,
Jeff

Also, on the Motorola box, change the 4:3 override setting to "none".

Sorry, I meant to write "change the 4:3 override setting to 480i" -- not 'none'. The 'none' setting will convert the SD channels to the native resolution of your TV, which might not look good if you have a so-so analog quality.

Jeff

Next I went with one everyoine has been raving about...the Zenith Silver Sensor. Yuck! It was deaf (or blind). I could barely pick up WTHI-DT without it cutting out all the time.

Thanks,
Doug

Doug, what you may have experienced is the Silver Sensor is VERY Directional. Unlike rabbit ears, with the sensor you have to point the antenna toward the tower sending out the signal.

If ARK27 is still out there and you have found out you have the tuner that will capture OTA please shoot me out a PM. I've got a Sensor you may borrow to see if it's worth your time.

You need an OTA receiver. If your TV has a HD tuner built in all you need is to connect an antenna. I don't know whether or not your TW box has an OTA receiver or not but doubt it. Cable HD is in QAM format whereas OTA is 8VSB.

That was a response to ARK27's query about how to attach the signal to his TV, in particular whether a TimeWarner cable set-top box can accept OTA signal. Apparently the different signal modulation standards between cable (QAM) and OTA (8VSB) might mean the cable set-top box can't deal with an OTA 8VSB signal.

That leads me to ask a very similar question. I currently have a D*TV satellite receiver box that provides two signal input connections, a "Satellite IN' and an "Off Air IN".

My question is whether the D*TV box processes these two signals into each of the box's available outputs, S-Video and composite. That is, will the box convert an OTA input into an S-Video output? If so (and if I am successful in using the TERK HDTVa indoor antenna I just ordered to bring in Indy OTA signals) then I will at least be able to feed my NTSC set with a somewhat better picture (S-Video) than simple composite. Or am I wrong?

T Heller,
Some satellite STB's do accept and decode OTA HDTV. I'm not real familiar with what the different sat box models offer. If your D*TV box only has s-video and composite it is unlikely to do HD. For it to do HDTV also it would have component, RGB, or one of the new digital out connectors like DVI. Most likely the off air in connection is for analog.

In general s-video does have better picture then composite. But it can't carry a true HD resolution picture to your set. S-video out is 480i NTSC. If you had an HDTV OTA tuner that also offered downconversion to s-video the picture might be better then the analog broadcast but it wouldn't be HD.

Even without a HD tuner if you can get the analog Indy channels on the Terk you stand a good chance of getting the digital. No guarentee but the odds are better.

Hey you WTHI guys, I just called Time Warner Cable and asked them when they would aquire your HD signal for CBS programming and he told me something about the FCC had regulated by the end of this year that broadcasters are to do a simulcast for the HD and analog feed. Once that happens and WTHI passes thier signal through they would broadcast it in the TW service area around Terre Haute. So my question is when is WTHI going to send that HD feed? :)

I haven't heard that one yet. But probably when it becomes "must carry". Currently TW is under a "must carry" for our analog signal, but not for the DT signal. There is a whole lot of discussion about the cable operators carrying our DT right now. I'm not real privy to the legal workings of the mess. I just get to put the icing on the cake! If I hear any word on this subject, I'll surely pass it along to guys first.

ken

Thanks again, Les.

I now more fully grasp and understand the limitations I'm working within. In a few days, I'll have the Terk antenna and I'll see how it goes; I'm keeping my fingers crossed. I appreciate the pointers about needing another decoder/tuner for HD. I won't make any outlay for one unless I can get the Indy channels OTA.

RWB, thanks for the offer. I'll have to see if the HD box from TW can do it otherwise I dont plan on buying an OTA receiver just to get programming I should already be paying TW for. ehhehe

So I've had my HR10-250 from DirecTV for about six months now, and just today I figure out there's a problem with one of my tuners, and there has been since I bought the thing. Something somewhere is (and has been) causing a bad connection to my indoor OTA antenna, giving me lower signal strength. Long story short, I messed with the box and got a much-needed boost to my WISH signal, and now I'm picking up signals from WFYI-DT and WTTK-DT that I *never* got before!

I loaded up on Tivo recordings for WFYI (looks like I've been missing a lot), but I couldn't find anything listed as actually being in HD from WTTK. What shows do they broadcast in HD?

I live in Robinson, IL and just got an HD tuner. I have a small outside antenna and can get WTHI in HD no problem but can't really get WTWO or WFXW. What power do the Terre Haute stations broadcast in? Someone told me that WTWO and WFXW don't have HD yet anyway just a digital signal I guess.

I live in Robinson, IL and just got an HD tuner. I have a small outside antenna and can get WTHI in HD no problem but can't really get WTWO or WFXW. What power do the Terre Haute stations broadcast in? Someone told me that WTWO and WFXW don't have HD yet anyway just a digital signal I guess.
WTWO and WFXW are both low power right now, and will be until 2007. I guess they might go to HD when they go to full power. WTWO is probably just happy that they get mentioned on TVguide.com for not showing that religious NBC show. :rolleyes:

So I've had my HR10-250 from DirecTV for about six months now, and just today I figure out there's a problem with one of my tuners, and there has been since I bought the thing. Something somewhere is (and has been) causing a bad connection to my indoor OTA antenna, giving me lower signal strength. Long story short, I messed with the box and got a much-needed boost to my WISH signal, and now I'm picking up signals from WFYI-DT and WTTK-DT that I *never* got before!

I loaded up on Tivo recordings for WFYI (looks like I've been missing a lot), but I couldn't find anything listed as actually being in HD from WTTK. What shows do they broadcast in HD?

Good job finding that problem and increasing your signal input, Alan.

Most of the WB lineup is now in HD and WTTV-DT/WTTK-DT carries it. Even when the station has to timeshift WB programming due to sports (Pacers, IU/Purdue basketball, etc.) I believe they record it in HD for the later playback. Also, this past Monday, WTTV-DT/WTTK-DT presented the Rose Parade in HD from a hookup with sister station KTLA-DT, Los Angeles. This was the same feed sent to Discovery-HD.

Steve

I live in Robinson, IL and just got an HD tuner. I have a small outside antenna and can get WTHI in HD no problem but can't really get WTWO or WFXW. What power do the Terre Haute stations broadcast in? Someone told me that WTWO and WFXW don't have HD yet anyway just a digital signal I guess.


Not sure what WFXW / WTWO DT's are doing. Our DT is running at 24.1 KW ERP right now and expected to go to full power somewhere around June. We recently increased power and altitude from 6 KW and 480 feet in Terre Haute to our current position of 24.1 KW <ERP> and 900 feet at Farmersburg. Hope this helps, ken.

WTWO is probably just happy that they get mentioned on TVguide.com for not showing that religious NBC show. :rolleyes:

It is so embarrassing to be from Indiana sometimes...

Good job finding that problem and increasing your signal input, Alan.

Most of the WB lineup is now in HD and WTTV-DT/WTTK-DT carries it. Even when the station has to timeshift WB programming due to sports (Pacers, IU/Purdue basketball, etc.) I believe they record it in HD for the later playback. Also, this past Monday, WTTV-DT/WTTK-DT presented the Rose Parade in HD from a hookup with sister station KTLA-DT, Los Angeles. This was the same feed sent to Discovery-HD.

Steve


Thanks for the info. I guess my program guide just doesn't show what's in HD for WTTK.

Tom,

I live in Columbus. Don't waste your money on an indoor antenna....


PDuncan: I should have listened to you! I received the amplified indoor TERK antenna (HDTVa) today and tried it out. It did well for the Trafalgar towers 18 miles away, but couldn't pull in acceptable pictures from the more distant Indy stations. Couldn't get Ch. 8 (WISH-TV) at all.

Oh, well...it was probably worth the experiment. I'll have to wait to see what sort of restocking fee I'll suffer on returning th antenna.

WTWO is probably just happy that they get mentioned on TVguide.com for not showing that religious NBC show. :rolleyes:Well they did change their statement on the website today from "we didn't want to air the program" to "we were afraid of being fined by the FCC". (And I wouldn't call it a religious show - more anti-religious if you believe the complaints.) But my local NBC station - one of the few that refused to carry "Coupling" - is refusing to pull the programming. The issue has elevated to the level of "cause" where the stations will no longer listen to callers as individuals - Oh, you don't like a program you've never seen except in promos and on "cause" websites? Don't watch!

Opponents have given NBC and 'Daniel' more press than they could have bought.

But I digress ... it's up to the local station to take the "risk" on community standards. If people in the Terre Haute area believe that WTWO shouldn't block the show they should complain - and turn the antenna/cable box to a different channel.

JL

It is so embarrassing to be from Indiana sometimes...

Yeah, but there really are worse places!! :D

Write the station(s) that censor and object, costs pennies. The stations are finally getting wise to the "mass deluge method" used by some groups to influence policy that a sensible well written non-form letter can actually have more influence as the middle rarely writes. :cool:

PDuncan: I should have listened to you! I received the amplified indoor TERK antenna (HDTVa) today and tried it out. It did well for the Trafalgar towers 18 miles away, but couldn't pull in acceptable pictures from the more distant Indy stations. Couldn't get Ch. 8 (WISH-TV) at all.

Oh, well...it was probably worth the experiment. I'll have to wait to see what sort of restocking fee I'll suffer on returning th antenna.

Sorry T Heller...... It's a bummer at times living this far from Indy. If you ever move to a place that allows an outdoor antenna, you can get Indy and some Cincinnati and Louisville Digital channels, ......most of the time...... Just wished Comcast wasn't do blasted expensive or I would be more content.. I'd switch to dish if I could get DSL or BPL..... Maybe one day....

T Heller: Sorry the Terk antenna didn't do well for you. It works like freakin' magic for me and blew away the others I tried. I'm sure it has lots to do with the TV/tuner itself...one's individual surroundings...and a whole host of other things.

Hope you can find something that work for you.

Doug

drunyon- Which Terk antenna are you using? I know there are at least a couple more. I have a HDTVi and I think there's a TV5 that works well for HD also.

I'm using the Terk HDTVa. I think it's similar to yours, except this one has VHF capabilities...and is amplified.

I'm in Marshall, IL (just across the stateline from Terre Haute) and picking up WICD-DT out of Champaign-Urbana. That's probably close to 60 miles.

Doug

Whoops... I'm an idiot and don't even know which antenna I have. I actually have the TV5. It doesn't do as well with VHF, but since I only have one VHF channel to pick up, it works well enough. I went with it because of the amplifier, but it sounds like the HDTVa works a lot better.

Anyone from MUNCIE willing to go on the record with their frustration concerning Comcast and their lack of HDTV? I have a business reporter that wants to do an article about it in the local paper. If so send me a private message on here and I will put you in contact with him. They want to run it in this weekends paper.

He did an article in the paper about Comcast rate hikes and their offerings and apparently got email about it so he wants to do another article about HD.

So far WTHI is not HD tonight. Flip the switch. :)

Just got off the phone with my station (WTHI) and they are aware of the problem. Engineers on site working on it as I type this. I'm led to believe our HD feed from the network might be the culprit, but I'll leave the technical explanation to Ken should he have some time to explain.

Anyone from MUNCIE willing to go on the record with their frustration concerning Comcast and their lack of HDTV? I have a business reporter that wants to do an article about it in the local paper. If so send me a private message on here and I will put you in contact with him. They want to run it in this weekends paper.

He did an article in the paper about Comcast rate hikes and their offerings and apparently got email about it so he wants to do another article about HD.

DirecTV should roll out Indianapolis local HDTV this year. Comcast will respond.

DirecTV should roll out Indianapolis local HDTV this year. Comcast will respond.

That is NOT a legitimate reason for them not offering us HD right now.

That is NOT a legitimate reason for them not offering us HD right now.

Who said life was fair???

Who said life was fair???

You must have a problem with the english language because the word unfair was not in my response.

You must have a problem with the english language because the word unfair was not in my response.

I'll try again. The "legitamate reason" is that Comcast, like most American companies, is primarily concerned with this quarter's P&L statement, and satisfying stockholders before customers.

When their market postition is seriously threatened, they will respond. I'm sure Comcast is spending millions on adding HDTV channels where they feel most vunerable, and where HDTV penetration levels high.

I guess Muncie is not high on their list. I better shut up now.....

So far WTHI is not HD tonight. Flip the switch. :)

The switch was flipped! Equipment <mainly the computer inside a satellite receiver> was at fault. Sorry for any HD outage. Although I give credit to our operator that he actually noticed the outage, and still gave you an SD pix to look at in the interim.

Ken

DirecTV should roll out Indianapolis local HDTV this year. Comcast will respond.Indianapolis is also on Echostar's (Dish Network) HD locals short list. Four major networks ONLY.

JL

I am in Bedford, IN.... Most of my OTA DT viewing is from Louisville. I'm getting WAVE DT, WLKY DT, WDRB DT, and 58-1 (which I forget the call letters), but no luck with WHAS DT (ABC).

I can get a blip on the signal meter but not enough for a lock. 40' tower. Hughes receiver.
I emailed the station thinking maybe they weren't at full power (altho I'd heard unofficially that they were). Here is the reply:

We are at full power. It could be an antenna, downlead cable, or amplifier problem on your end. However, our antenna is sidemounted on the tower toward Louisville. The tower itself might be blocking a signal toward Bedford. I would really check everything on your end to be sure.

Bill Brown, Asst Director of Engineering

Is there anyone here in this general area that is able to recieve WHAS DT? I'm not sure if I'd be chasing my tail trying to get this channel or not. I pick up WHAS analog absolutely fine (and as I said, the other 'big' networks are coming in fine on the digital side)... but with the Superbowl approaching I'd certainly like to be able to finally get ABC-HD here.

Thanks,
AKH

AKH,

Yes, WHAS-DT is at full power (1000 kW @ approx. 1200 ft) from its tower in Floyds Knobs, IN, which appears to be 50 miles from Bedford, but the bad news is that WHAS-DT has a very directional antenna, which does not favor your direction, to the northwest. Bedford is 318 degrees from Floyds Knobs. Details from the FCC ...........

http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/tvq?list=0&facid=32327

http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/polarplot?temp=19079&rotate=0.00&p0=0.237&p10=0.460&p20=0.668&p30=0.811&p40=0.898&p50=0.951&p60=0.985&p70=1.000&p80=0.985&p90=0.938&p100=0.879&p110=0.844&p120=0.858&p130=0.913&p140=0.972&p150=0.996&p160=0.972&p170=0.913&p180=0.858&p190=0.844&p200=0.879&p210=0.938&p220=0.985&p230=1.000&p240=0.985&p250=0.951&p260=0.898&p270=0.811&p280=0.668&p290=0.460&p300=0.237&p310=0.232&p320=0.392&p330=0.462&p340=0.392&p350=0.232&p360=0.237&

Steve

AKH,

Yes, WHAS-DT is at full power (1000 kW @ approx. 1200 ft) from its tower in Floyds Knobs, IN, which appears to be 50 miles from Bedford, but the bad news is that WHAS-DT has a very directional antenna, which does not favor your direction, to the northwest. Bedford is 318 degrees from Floyds Knobs. Details from the FCC ...........

http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/tvq?list=0&facid=32327

http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/polarplot?temp=19079&rotate=0.00&p0=0.237&p10=0.460&p20=0.668&p30=0.811&p40=0.898&p50=0.951&p60=0.985&p70=1.000&p80=0.985&p90=0.938&p100=0.879&p110=0.844&p120=0.858&p130=0.913&p140=0.972&p150=0.996&p160=0.972&p170=0.913&p180=0.858&p190=0.844&p200=0.879&p210=0.938&p220=0.985&p230=1.000&p240=0.985&p250=0.951&p260=0.898&p270=0.811&p280=0.668&p290=0.460&p300=0.237&p310=0.232&p320=0.392&p330=0.462&p340=0.392&p350=0.232&p360=0.237&

Steve

For what it is worth, my son lives on the South side of Bloomington. He has an antenna probably only 15 feet off of the ground which is looking right through a maple tree towards Louisville.
He gets WHAS-DT just fine, and has for a long time.
Not sure what to make of that..........
Nat

For what it is worth, my son lives on the South side of Bloomington. He has an antenna probably only 15 feet off of the ground which is looking right through a maple tree towards Louisville.
He gets WHAS-DT just fine, and has for a long time.
Not sure what to make of that..........
Nat

Thanks for the info guys...

I just got a further reply from Bill Brown at WHAS:

I suspect that the tower is the issue for you.

Bill

I don't know exactly what to make of that. Is that basically a double-edged sword kind of problem for me? IOW- I'm in a lull due to my location northwest of the directional antenna AND its orientation on the tower (as he considered in the first reply quoted in my first post on this subject)?

I'd emailed him back regarding my further testing and asking if he thought their directional ant vs my location was the source of my problems receiving WHAS DT (which is what he was replying to with the quoted text above).

Until DTV offers digital locals maybe I'm destined to not get ABC digital. :(

-AKH

Do you need a waiver to get ABC HD in Terre Haute (DirecTV)? Thanks.

Dave

Nope... just call DirecTV and they will hook you up with the WABC feed out of New York.

Hey guys,
Just a quick question for you all. I live in Pendleton (46064) and I am trying to pick up OTA channels with my silver sensor. I can get WISH-TV (cbs), WXIN (fox),
UPN, WB, PBS out of muncie to name a few, all with about 75-80% signal strength. However, I am getting no signal at all from WRTV (ABC). The compass orientation for FOX and ABC is within two degrees to each other, and for the distance to towers there is about a 3/10th of a mile difference (according to antennaweb.org). If I am getting fox with no problem, shouldnt I be able to get ABC since they have pretty much the same compass direction and distance? I have tried to move the antenna around in all different directions but still get no signal. The main reason I got the silver sensor was to get ABC to see the state farm figure skating championship in HD this weekend (just kidding...its for the super bowl..Really, it is)
Anyhow, Im just curious what I can do to get ABC. I know its not the best antenna, but its the best I can do for now. I'm kinda a newbie with all the antenna and OTA stuff, so if you can give me a reason on why I cant get abc but can get fox,etc, try not to be too technical :)
Thanks!!!!!

John

John, that's rather puzzling about WRTV-DT 25 (6.1). With almost 900 kW of power from a top-mounted antenna on their tower, this is usually one of the easiest DTVs to receive in this area. Last Summer I tested DTV reception in the Anderson/Muncie area with a mobile DTV setup using a Z. Silver Sensor, and I had no problems receiving WRTV-DT. If anything, I'm actually surprised that this UHF only antenna is allowing you to receive WISH-DT 9 (8.1). A few weeks ago I was able to receive WRTV-DT quite easily with the Silver Sensor in Kokomo, which is farther than Pendleton.

You don't mention what kind of DTV receiver you're using, but some units are more sensitive to various conditions (multipath, weak/strong signals, etc.) than others. I'd try moving the antenna around some more, trying to find the sweet spot for WRTV-DT, and/or try a new channel scan on the receiver. Otherwise, you might need to try a different antenna.

BTW, IMHO, Muncie's WIPB-DT 52 (49.1) has the best HD PQ of any PBS station that I've seen in this area.

Steve

Thanks for the info Steve. I have a sylvaniea hdtv tuner that my wife picked me up at best buy I believe. I was able to receive wrtv downstairs with the antenna that came with the unit, but it wasnt giving me a strong signal at all and I would lose the signal more often than not. I was able to receive most of the other channels I mentioned as well but they too had bad signal strength. With the silver sensor, I am able to receive better signal strenth on the channels I could get previously, just no abc :( I'll have to go play around with it some more later on and see if I can get anything else on it. I might also try to connect it to my dish tv receiver and see if that makes a difference. Currently its upstairs for my projector.
Should the signal be pretty stable most of the time for wrtv, or would there be periods where I wont be able to pick up anything and then all of a sudden be able to pick up a signal?
Thanks again!!

also, what would anyone recommend for another antenna. It would have to be an indoor one for now.

Wow.
I am watching the Bears come from behind and beat Carolina (I hope!) and have certainly had an interesting adventure trying to get it done.
Towards the end of the first half, the digital signal went away and even the analog signal was a complete wreck, unlike anything I've ever seen before.
By the fourth quarter (where we are as I type), order has slowly but surely been restored. First fixed was analog, then digital arrived at standard definition, then finally hi-def digital appeared.
Pray tell, what happened? Was it a Fox nation-wide digital problem, or was it a problem with 59 only?
Thanks for any information anybody can give me.
Go Bears!

I just started getting digital OTA in Southport area using a Samsung SIR-TS360 and wanted to know which 'moderately' priced ($50 +/-) antenna works best. Figured this might be a good place to ask. At times I can get all but the CBS (VHF) with a crappy Turk 'bar' that I've had for years (not sure if it does VHF, but it does get Bloomington in digital). But I need better as FOX was in and out on me today (though it worked last night for the Seattle game). TIA

Not sure what WFXW / WTWO DT's are doing. Our DT is running at 24.1 KW ERP right now and expected to go to full power somewhere around June. We recently increased power and altitude from 6 KW and 480 feet in Terre Haute to our current position of 24.1 KW <ERP> and 900 feet at Farmersburg. Hope this helps, ken.

Thanks for the info. I am thinking about getting Digital Cable through Mediacom. They have added WTHI's HD signal and WCCU Fox from Champaign to the lineup with WICD, WAND, and WBUI soon. I assume we will get WAND for NBC and WCCU Fox until WTWO and WFXW get HD.

Wow.
I am watching the Bears come from behind and beat Carolina (I hope!) and have certainly had an interesting adventure trying to get it done.
Towards the end of the first half, the digital signal went away and even the analog signal was a complete wreck, unlike anything I've ever seen before.
By the fourth quarter (where we are as I type), order has slowly but surely been restored. First fixed was analog, then digital arrived at standard definition, then finally hi-def digital appeared.
Pray tell, what happened? Was it a Fox nation-wide digital problem, or was it a problem with 59 only?
Thanks for any information anybody can give me.
Go Bears!

Wow, I thought that was an issue with my own antenna. My Tivo recording of the game skipped from the end of the 2nd quarter to the middle of the fourth, with poor reception throughout the game. I figured for sure it was a problem with my spotty receiver or antenna placement. Glad to know Fox itself was the root.

Wow, I thought that was an issue with my own antenna. My Tivo recording of the game skipped from the end of the 2nd quarter to the middle of the fourth, with poor reception throughout the game. I figured for sure it was a problem with my spotty receiver or antenna placement. Glad to know Fox itself was the root.

Exactly, it went from the 2 minute warning with the Bears driving for their first score to 23-14 in the 4th quarter. Weird actually, I'd never seen that happen on the HDTivo. It has only ever stopped recording before, never started back up again.

Exactly, it went from the 2 minute warning with the Bears driving for their first score to 23-14 in the 4th quarter. Weird actually, I'd never seen that happen on the HDTivo. It has only ever stopped recording before, never started back up again.

My guess is that the Tivo can tell when the channel isn't getting a signal and just pauses recording until the signal returns. That way if your antenna gets unplugged or blocked without your knowledge, the Tivo doesn't fill up with a bunch of recordings of a blank screen that take up space on the disk.

I actually believed the game had started late. Like I do for a lot of programs I record, I didn't start watching until half the way in so I could skip commercials. When I saw I only had 1:15 between the start and the live show, I thought the game got pushed back. Good thing I was only mildly interested in it...

Someone needs to flip the switch to get Time Warner to carry WTHI in HD. Sick of waiting. :mad:

The switch was flipped! Equipment <mainly the computer inside a satellite receiver> was at fault. Sorry for any HD outage. Although I give credit to our operator that he actually noticed the outage, and still gave you an SD pix to look at in the interim.

Ken

Someone needs to flip the switch to get Time Warner to carry WTHI in HD. Sick of waiting. :mad: I don't understand. If you live close enough to Terre Haute to get Time Warner cable, you should definitely be in range of the tower to pick it up over the air. My sister out in Riley picks up WTHI-DT just fine with amplified rabbit ears.

I don't understand. If you live close enough to Terre Haute to get Time Warner cable, you should definitely be in range of the tower to pick it up over the air. My sister out in Riley picks up WTHI-DT just fine with amplified rabbit ears.
I know this wasn't addressed to me, but I will respond my opinion. I am able to pick it up OTA, but I would rather not do that. It requires me to use an old DirecTV receiver and have the antenna put up for one channel. It would be more convenient to have it with TWC and then I could also record with the DVR.

So you forego watching CBS in HD because you don't want to put up an antenna for one channel? I know it would be more convenient to have it all come in through one pipe, but to miss out on Colts games and CBS programming in HD until TWC gets on the ball?

So you forego watching CBS in HD because you don't want to put up an antenna for one channel? I know it would be more convenient to have it all come in through one pipe, but to miss out on Colts games and CBS programming in HD until TWC gets on the ball?
Was this addressed to me? If so, from above you can see that I do have the antenna. However, I would probably not want to buy an OTA receiver to get one channel. I was lucky that my dad had the old Hughes one for me to use.

Exactly, I dont want to spend money for a receiver and an antenna when it should already come through TWC. Not only the money but also the principle of the thing. Also tired of watching commercials for TWC advertising that they have the most local channels in HD. *cough* BS *cough* :mad:

Zip 47804. I live 3 blocks south of Collett Park in lovely Terre Haute.. Could I get WRTV's HD withan amplified rooftop antenna? Or would I be wasting my time trying? I am about 70-75 miles from Indy.

I recently upgraded my antenna from the indoor silver sensor to a Channel Master 4228. I have it mounted in the attic. I live in McCordsville, about 13-15 miles from the 4 major networks towers (due West nearly). I can get ABC, FOX and NBC perfectly. No hassles at all. I don't even get a blip on CBS though. Nothing at all. I'm assuming this is because CBS broadcasts in VHF while everything else is UHF. The Channel Master is a UHF antenna but it supposedly has good VHF reception, although over what channels I'm not sure. Has anyone managed to get good reception on CBS in the area?

Zip 47804. I live 3 blocks south of Collett Park in lovely Terre Haute.. Could I get WRTV's HD with an amplified rooftop antenna? Or would I be wasting my time trying? I am about 70-75 miles from Indy.

Goldrich has a better handle on this kind of question than I do.
But this link shows that you have a fair chance to get the signal with a good rig and a little topographic luck.

http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=DT401224.html

My son and I both get stations several miles outside of our respective service area maps. He gets a bunch of Louisville stations from his home south of Bloomington and I get 23's digital signal from up around Anderson/Muncie. I live North of Bloomington.

I recently upgraded my antenna from the indoor silver sensor to a Channel Master 4228. I have it mounted in the attic. I live in McCordsville, about 13-15 miles from the 4 major networks towers (due West nearly). I can get ABC, FOX and NBC perfectly. No hassles at all. I don't even get a blip on CBS though. Nothing at all. I'm assuming this is because CBS broadcasts in VHF while everything else is UHF. The Channel Master is a UHF antenna but it supposedly has good VHF reception, although over what channels I'm not sure. Has anyone managed to get good reception on CBS in the area?

I live further away than you do and get CBS fine but it took switching to an antenna that recieved both VHF and UHF signals.

Zip 47804. I live 3 blocks south of Collett Park in lovely Terre Haute.. Could I get WRTV's HD withan amplified rooftop antenna? Or would I be wasting my time trying? I am about 70-75 miles from Indy.

Nathill had some good comments for you. With a very good outdoor antenna setup along with a little help from Mother Nature in the form of some tropospheric enhancement, you MIGHT be able to receive WRTV-DT's 898 kW signal. The FCC coverage map that nathill linked does indicate a fair chance of receiving it, but I certainly wouldn't count on receiving it 100% of the time. With Terre Haute sitting down in the Wabash River valley, the low terrain is not going to help.

I know a few of the AVS Forum members just outside Terre Haute, like to the west and north of there, have had good reception reports with WICD-DT 41 (15.1), Champaign, an ABC affiliate. Here's the coverage map for this station.

http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=DT1031586.html

Good luck. This kind of distant reception is very much trial and error, with some finger-crossing, too.

Steve

I live in rural Morgan county and just setup a HD system. I am using a channel master 3020 with pre-amp and getting everything from indy except wthr. I don't know if it is a multipath thing or signal strength.

Anyone with experience on picking them up in this area would be appretiated.

thanks.

Zip 47804. I live 3 blocks south of Collett Park in lovely Terre Haute.. Could I get WRTV's HD withan amplified rooftop antenna? Or would I be wasting my time trying? I am about 70-75 miles from Indy.
In addition to what has already been said about your chances of receiving WRTV, as I recall, the Collett Park area has lots of trees, so unless your antenna is on a tower above them they would probably add a fair amount of attenuation to the signal received.

Ken

I recently upgraded my antenna from the indoor silver sensor to a Channel Master 4228. I have it mounted in the attic. I live in McCordsville, about 13-15 miles from the 4 major networks towers (due West nearly). I can get ABC, FOX and NBC perfectly. No hassles at all. I don't even get a blip on CBS though. Nothing at all. I'm assuming this is because CBS broadcasts in VHF while everything else is UHF. The Channel Master is a UHF antenna but it supposedly has good VHF reception, although over what channels I'm not sure. Has anyone managed to get good reception on CBS in the area?

I get WISH-DT <9> just fine here in Brazil about an hour west of Indy. Matter of fact, I seem to get everything except 59 and 4. Not sure why. Maybe need to look for them again.

Ken.

Anyone notice the strange atmospheric conditions last night (1/23/06)? I’m in Muncie and I was trying to pull in CBS from Indy. The signal was getting clobbered by WSIU from Carbondale, IL. While trying to get CBS, I was pulling in stations from Champaign, IL and Springfield, IL. Most of those stations were in the UHF low 40’s.

This morning, everything was back to normal. No signals from Illinois and I could receive CBS from Indy. I hope those conditions return so I can watch the Indy 500 live come May.

Anyone notice the strange atmospheric conditions last night (1/23/06)? I’m in Muncie and I was trying to pull in CBS from Indy. The signal was getting clobbered by WSIU from Carbondale, IL. While trying to get CBS, I was pulling in stations from Champaign, IL and Springfield, IL. Most of those stations were in the UHF low 40’s.

This morning, everything was back to normal. No signals from Illinois and I could receive CBS from Indy. I hope those conditions return so I can watch the Indy 500 live come May.

I saw the same thing and was worried I had something wrong with my setup since I just recently put it up. I was getting the same IL stuff. I noticed serious distortion on the normal over the air stuff coming from Indy but I was getting Terra Haute better than ever. I live in morgan county which is south of Indy.

I saw the same thing and was worried I had something wrong with my setup since I just recently put it up. I was getting the same IL stuff. I noticed serious distortion on the normal over the air stuff coming from Indy but I was getting Terra Haute better than ever. I live in morgan county which is south of Indy.

I have a recent setup as well. I bought one of the Wal-Mart Sanyo televisions. I have one VHF and one UHF antenna in an unused bedroom upstairs. They are combined with a CM 7777 pre-amp. I have been using my setup for two weeks now. I had to see my Chicago Bears in HD. Of course the Indy Fox station had issues during the game. When it warms up I may install the antennas on the roof

My local cable system (Comcast) swears they will provide HD signals mid year.
I'm not holding my breath.

Anyone notice the strange atmospheric conditions last night (1/23/06)? I’m in Muncie and I was trying to pull in CBS from Indy. The signal was getting clobbered by WSIU from Carbondale, IL. While trying to get CBS, I was pulling in stations from Champaign, IL and Springfield, IL. Most of those stations were in the UHF low 40’s.

This morning, everything was back to normal. No signals from Illinois and I could receive CBS from Indy. I hope those conditions return so I can watch the Indy 500 live come May.

Same thing here.

Anyone notice the strange atmospheric conditions last night (1/23/06)? I’m in Muncie and I was trying to pull in CBS from Indy. The signal was getting clobbered by WSIU from Carbondale, IL. While trying to get CBS, I was pulling in stations from Champaign, IL and Springfield, IL. Most of those stations were in the UHF low 40’s.

This morning, everything was back to normal. No signals from Illinois and I could receive CBS from Indy. I hope those conditions return so I can watch the Indy 500 live come May.

Thanks to Mother Nature with some nice tropospheric enhancement/ducting, it was a crazy evening for OTA TV reception in the Midwest. During the evening hours as the tropo conditions moved around, I was able to receive WSBT-DT 30, South Bend; WTVG-DT 19, Toledo; several from Dayton and Cincinnati, and most of the DTV lineup from Louisville. A little after 11 p.m. I had KTVI-DT 43, St. Louis locked in and was watching Seinfeld. As a TV DXer, this activity is not very common this time of year. This is much more common during the summer months. More fun and games to come from Mother Nature, especially starting around April/May.

Steve

I recently upgraded my antenna from the indoor silver sensor to a Channel Master 4228. I have it mounted in the attic. I live in McCordsville, about 13-15 miles from the 4 major networks towers (due West nearly). I can get ABC, FOX and NBC perfectly. No hassles at all. I don't even get a blip on CBS though. Nothing at all. I'm assuming this is because CBS broadcasts in VHF while everything else is UHF. The Channel Master is a UHF antenna but it supposedly has good VHF reception, although over what channels I'm not sure. Has anyone managed to get good reception on CBS in the area?

There have been a number of discussions about using the CM 4228 UHF-only antenna as a VHF antenna, especially for channels 9-11. The info at the bottom of this site indicates the gain that can be achieved with this antenna.
http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ANTENNAS/comparing.html

As we usually say, your personal mileage and signal strength may vary. As in real estate, many times it depends on location, location, location. Another thing to keep in mind, you may need to rotate the antenna, or change its azimuth slightly from the other stations, even though most of the Indy station towers are in close proximity.

Thanks to Mother Nature with some nice tropospheric enhancement/ducting, it was a crazy evening for OTA TV reception in the Midwest. During the evening hours as the tropo conditions moved around, I was able to receive WSBT-DT 30, South Bend; WTVG-DT 19, Toledo; several from Dayton and Cincinnati, and most of the DTV lineup from Louisville. A little after 11 p.m. I had KTVI-DT 43, St. Louis locked in and was watching Seinfeld. As a TV DXer, this activity is not very common this time of year. This is much more common during the summer months. More fun and games to come from Mother Nature, especially starting around April/May.

Steve

Hey Steve;
I didn't have time to look for exotic signals last night, but man did my Indy channels take a hit. Analog 13 was unwatchable from Bloomington, and the digital channels were nuts also. What I found strange was that channel 8 analog was terrible, but digital 9 was solid. Weird stuff!
Nat

Hey Steve;
I didn't have time to look for exotic signals last night, but man did my Indy channels take a hit. Analog 13 was unwatchable from Bloomington, and the digital channels were nuts also. What I found strange was that channel 8 analog was terrible, but digital 9 was solid. Weird stuff!
Nat

Bad here in Southport area. I'm still using an old Terk TV50 outside, and since it is crappy in the best of weather, I'm really hoping the 4228 I have ordered is a big upgrade. Hoping I can get by without a pre-amp (17 miles from Indy towers and Bloomington's 4.x stations normally no problem.) I could get PBS last night and that was about it.

Why is it that people around Indiana continue to buy the 4228 knowing it is very likely they wont be able to get all the channels available? I understand that its a good antenna but why even risk having to ship something like that back when you can buy something thats the same brand, just as good and you KNOW it will work and you will only have to do it once.

Do it right the first time.

Why is it that people around Indiana continue to buy the 4228 knowing it is very likely they wont be able to get all the channels available? I understand that its a good antenna but why even risk having to ship something like that back when you can buy something thats the same brand, just as good and you KNOW it will work and you will only have to do it once.

Do it right the first time.

I don't have mine yet, but my understanding was/is that the 4228 does very well with the UHFs here in Indy area. The only station of concern is 9, which is high VHF, which the 4228 supposedly can get. My understanding was/is that it gives us the best chance at 'doing it right the the first time'. To which 'same brand' antenna are you referring? I've looked and looked (and asked) but have not gotten any feedback as to one that is better for this area. So which do you guarantee will work on southside of Indianapolis? (my 4228 is not 'in stock' yet, so I CAN cancel/exchange).

Also, if you're from here, you should realize/know that the topography changes drastically depending on where you are from the towers. Again, to which antenna do you refer ??

I don't have mine yet, but my understanding was/is that the 4228 does very well with the UHFs here in Indy area. The only station of concern is 9, which is high VHF, which the 4228 supposedly can get. My understanding was/is that it gives us the best chance at 'doing it right the the first time'. To which 'same brand' antenna are you referring? I've looked and looked (and asked) but have not gotten any feedback as to one that is better for this area. So which do you guarantee will work on southside of Indianapolis? (my 4228 is not 'in stock' yet, so I CAN cancel/exchange).

Also, if you're from here, you should realize/know that the topography changes drastically depending on where you are from the towers. Again, to which antenna do you refer ??
The Channel Master 4228 has the highest VHF reception of any of the "good" HDTV antenna's I've seen. The problem is it that it has trouble with channels 7.5 to 8.5 and 11.5 to 12. Since CBS broadcasts on 8.1 the 4228 gets a -11db gain on the channel. Meaning it's unlikely to work. I have no idea what Bent's talking about since the best antenna I've seen for UHF/VHF in this range is the Winegard 8880 which is -6 in this range.

Don't pass on the CM. it's a great antenna and you're unlikely to get CBS with any other comparable antenna. You could get a combined UHF/VHF antenna but you'll be giving up gains on the UHF frequencies.

The best bet is probably to get seperate UHF and VHF antennas and combine the signals. That's probably what I'll end up doing.

The CM 4251 may be what Bent's referring to. Unfortunately since it hasn't been manufactured since 2000 it's not really a solution. Not sure what it's VHF gain is. It actually bests the 4228 on UHF gain.

The Channel Master 4228 has the highest VHF reception of any of the "good" HDTV antenna's I've seen. The problem is it that it has trouble with channels 7.5 to 8.5 and 11.5 to 12. Since CBS broadcasts on 8.1 the 4228 gets a -11db gain on the channel. Meaning it's unlikely to work. I have no idea what Bent's talking about since the best antenna I've seen for UHF/VHF in this range is the Winegard 8880 which is -6 in this range.

Don't pass on the CM. it's a great antenna and you're unlikely to get CBS with any other comparable antenna. You could get a combined UHF/VHF antenna but you'll be giving up gains on the UHF frequencies.

The best bet is probably to get seperate UHF and VHF antennas and combine the signals. That's probably what I'll end up doing.

The CM 4251 may be what Bent's referring to. Unfortunately since it hasn't been manufactured since 2000 it's not really a solution. Not sure what it's VHF gain is. It actually bests the 4228 on UHF gain.

Channel 8's digital signal is actually on the same frequency as analog channel 9, not channel 8.
Not sure how that affects this antenna discussion, but I'm sure I'm right.....
http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/tvq?call=WISH
Nat Hill IV

The other thing to remember is that, at least as of right now, WTHR will broadcast their DTV on channel 13, once they turn the analog off, so you'll want something that gets 9 and 13, for the immediate Indy area.

Those closer to Lafayette will want 11, where WLFI will stay, and those closer to Terre Haute will want good reception on 10 for WTHI, again once analog goes away.

Tom Weber,
TV Engineer

Yes, my readout of WISH states a frequency assignment of 9. The next lowest is at 21 (PBS), then 25,27, 32, then 44,45,46, and 48. All of those are within 6 degrees of each other OR just the opposite in Bloomington (two stations). I figured if need be, I'd get a VHF for WISH as Aragon 127 mentioned (though its analog counterpart comes in quite strong for me here.) If there is a better solution, PLEASE let me know about it!
I'm at a loss regarding Bent's quote as I DON'T KNOW of such an antenna. Please let me know of which you speak! The only way I could KNOW is if someone had mentioned it and I've scoured these forums looking for just such 'testament' with no luck. So my answer as to why I went to the 4228 is simple. More positive feedback from users than users of other antennas, plus a look at the gain graphs. From reading others' posts, there does not appear to be a 'universally good' antenna. Location, location, location.

This new CW station that I hear is going to be the combination of UPN and WB. Do we know yet which INDY station is going to go to CW?

I live in Kokomo and I have no problem getting UPN23 digital but I do not get any reception for WB4 digital. I hope that the station that converts to CW improves their Digtial transmission.

I'd be happy if they improved the picture quality. I get WB4 via Bloomington digital on the southside of Indy, but it looks like crap compared to 59's digital. I can't get 23 at the moment (waiting on my antenna to arrive), but hope I won't be disappointed.

This new CW station that I hear is going to be the combination of UPN and WB. Do we know yet which INDY station is going to go to CW?

I live in Kokomo and I have no problem getting UPN23 digital but I do not get any reception for WB4 digital. I hope that the station that converts to CW improves their Digtial transmission.

According to yesterday's press release, it indicates that the Tribune owned stations will be among the first stations to pick up the new CW network, since Tribune is one of the key players in the deal along with CBS and Warner Brothers. Locally, WTTV and translator WTTK are owned by Tribune. Here are parts of the release.

"The combination of Tribune's 16 major market stations and the 12 CBS-owned UPN major market affiliates give The CW instant coverage in 48% of the country. The remainder of the network's distribution system will be a combination of selected current UPN and The WB stations. The full distribution of the new network is expected to exceed 95% of the country."

" The 16 Tribune affiliated stations will include New York, Los Angeles, Chicago, Boston, Dallas, Washington, D.C., Houston, Miami, Denver, St. Louis, Portland, Indianapolis, San Diego, Hartford, New Orleans and Albany. The 12 CBS Station Group television markets will include Philadelphia, San Francisco, Atlanta, Detroit, Tampa, Seattle, Sacramento, Pittsburgh, West Palm Beach, Norfolk, Oklahoma City and Providence. Together, these top two station groups cover the top 13 television markets, 20 of the top 25 television markets and have a total coverage area of more than 48% of the country."

BTW, Tribune has approval from the FCC to move the tower site of WTTK-DT 54 (29.1) from Windfall to Indy, using the WXIN tower, and to increase the power to 1000kW. This setup will send a very strong signal toward Kokomo, the city of license for WTTK. So far no word on when this will happen. Presently, the station is involved with the one year test of using two transmitters on the same channel, with overlapping coverage areas.

Steve

Do you suppose that WNDY will stay on the air? Will it just be an independent, unaffiliated station?

Yes, my readout of WISH states a frequency assignment of 9. The next lowest is at 21 (PBS), then 25,27, 32, then 44,45,46, and 48. All of those are within 6 degrees of each other OR just the opposite in Bloomington (two stations). I figured if need be, I'd get a VHF for WISH as Aragon 127 mentioned (though its analog counterpart comes in quite strong for me here.) If there is a better solution, PLEASE let me know about it!
I'm at a loss regarding Bent's quote as I DON'T KNOW of such an antenna. Please let me know of which you speak! The only way I could KNOW is if someone had mentioned it and I've scoured these forums looking for just such 'testament' with no luck. So my answer as to why I went to the 4228 is simple. More positive feedback from users than users of other antennas, plus a look at the gain graphs. From reading others' posts, there does not appear to be a 'universally good' antenna. Location, location, location.

I'm about 13 miles from the antennas (46038), and I'm using the CM 3016, bought at Lowe's, in my attic. I get everything rock solid, with WTTK-DT out of Kokomo for the WB, instead of WTTV-DT, which I can't get, even since the move to the antenna farm. WTTK is 120 degrees off-axis from where my antenna is pointed, and 24 miles away. I think I get a signal in the 60's on my HDTivo. It's big and ugly, but it does the job very well, and it's in my attic anyhow. :D

I'm about 13 miles from the antennas (46038), and I'm using the CM 3016, bought at Lowe's, in my attic. I get everything rock solid, with WTTK-DT out of Kokomo for the WB, instead of WTTV-DT, which I can't get, even since the move to the antenna farm. WTTK is 120 degrees off-axis from where my antenna is pointed, and 24 miles away. I think I get a signal in the 60's on my HDTivo. It's big and ugly, but it does the job very well, and it's in my attic anyhow. :D

Fishers area. Hard for me to get a real handle since you're north of Indy and I'm south. Kokomo antenna is 48 miles from me. Marion's UPN is 35 miles. I guess I'll know soon enough. I'm hoping I'll be able to put something together with high signal strength so hopefully it will hold in poorer atmospheric conditions. Wish I knew of someone on the south side that was getting everything well so as to know for sure. Oh well.

WNDY-23 will NOT leave the air.

At this point, I have to assume that WTTV will be the affiliate of the new network, the CW. We at WNDY will be interested in picking up some of the programming that WTTV will be unable to air, once they start carrying the 30 hours/week of CW programming. We will explore other programming possibilities as well.

Tom Weber
Engineering
WISH / WNDY / etc.

Hey Bents did you get a chance to read the article in the Star about hdtv/comcast and muncie? If you did, did it give any time frame?

Tom, will WNDY look to broadcast anything in HD? I know there are several syndicated shows and movie packages that are available in HD. Also, I think it's about time WNDY talked to the Simons about Pacer games!

Fishers area. Hard for me to get a real handle since you're north of Indy and I'm south. Kokomo antenna is 48 miles from me. Marion's UPN is 35 miles. I guess I'll know soon enough. I'm hoping I'll be able to put something together with high signal strength so hopefully it will hold in poorer atmospheric conditions. Wish I knew of someone on the south side that was getting everything well so as to know for sure. Oh well.

A friend of mine who lives close to your area (near Five Points Rd. & East Stop 11) is able to pick up all the Indy DTVs, including WTTK-DT 54 (29.1) which is operating with just 2kW @ 850 ft. from the WXIN tower. Also, he is able to receive the new PBS station from Muncie, WIPB-DT 52 (49.1), and most of the time he receives WTIU-DT 14 (30.1), Bloomington, using the little Zenith Silver Sensor with a small Motorola signal booster on the line inside his house. He does seem to be in a very sweet reception spot to receive all of these with this very small antenna. Sometimes it is location, location, location.

He can get WTTV-DT 48 (4.1) from Trafalgar (4kW @ 980 ft.) but he says that WTTK-DT is easier to receive. Although the Silver Sensor is a UHF-only antenna he is able to receive WISH-DT 9 (8.1).

Steve

[QUOTE=goldrich]A friend of mine who lives close to your area (near Five Points Rd. & East Stop 11) is able to pick up ... <snip>

Thanks! 5 pts is farther east than I am (just a few miles maybe), but I do live just barely north of Stop 11, so this may be a good. I know Tom Weber lives south in Greenwood and said he had a VHF/UHF combo that picked up everything, but I didn't get the brand/model number from him (don't know that he even has that info available.) I'm hoping I won't have to shop around for something more, but if so it's good to have a clue as to some other options that might work. Thanks to all. I'll report how the 4228 does for me when I've got things up. Hopefully I'm fretting over nothing.
Funny, we 'complain' here some about picking up all the stations, but I checked towers near my brother in Findlay, OH and they only have ONE digital station within range of him and that is over 35 miles away. I may try OTA for him anyway as I found that I can pull more analog stations with one.

Charlie

Hey Bents did you get a chance to read the article in the Star about hdtv/comcast and muncie? If you did, did it give any time frame?


Quote from the article referencing an interview about HDTV with Comcast's regional director, Mark Apple, dated 1/15/2006.

"Apple said last week that Muncie would be added to the list by mid-year. Digital options for channels above 100 are already high definition on Comcast clickers.
'We are aware that Muncie customers want an HDTV signal; we are getting lots of calls,' Apple said. 'It is the next service you will get, and we have made it a priority.'"

The story wasn't clear whether "added to the list" means we will get HD mid-year or Comcast will add Muncie to their list for cities to be upgraded eventually.

The Business of TV
Identity Crisis

WB and UPN stations are scrambling to find a new model
By Allison Romano Broadcasting & Cable

"With The WB and UPN shutting down next fall to form The CW, dozens of orphaned affiliates are scrambling to align with the new network or find a way to go it alone."


In the same article, here is the part that MIGHT apply to WNDY, owned by LIN..............


"For stranded stations, salvation may come from one of the most affected station owners: News Corp.'s Fox Television Stations unit. At last week's NATPE convention, TV executives were buzzing that Fox may create a second programming service to power its nine UPN outlets that lose their affiliation. Already Fox has begun to remove mention of UPN from the stations.

A “Fox II” service could be first-run shows, such as Twentieth's proposed English-language telenovelas, news from sister Fox News Channel or reruns of Fox shows. The prospect of such a network has other groups, including LIN Television, which owns several endangered UPN affiliates, slightly more upbeat.

“The difference here is that you're not in it alone. You've got Rupert with you,” says LIN Television CEO Gary Chapman, referring to News Corp. Chairman Rupert Murdoch. "

Charlie and others looking at the CM 4228 antenna, here is some new info........


"FCC DTV planning factors are based on antenna gains of 4 dB, 6 dB and 10 dB for low-VHF (Channels 2-6), high-VHF (7-13) and UHF (14-69) respectively. Kerry Cozad of Dielectric measured the Channel Master Model 4228 eight-bay bowtie-with-screen UHF antenna and measured gains of approximately 3 dB, 9 dB and 15 dB for low-VHF, high-VHF and UHF. This UHF-only antenna exceeds the planning factor gain at both high-VHF and UHF!"

http://www.tvtechnology.com/features/On-RF/2006.01.25-f_doug.shtml

Steve

Charlie and others looking at the CM 4228 antenna, here is some new info........


"FCC DTV planning factors are based on antenna gains of 4 dB, 6 dB and 10 dB for low-VHF (Channels 2-6), high-VHF (7-13) and UHF (14-69) respectively. Kerry Cozad of Dielectric measured the Channel Master Model 4228 eight-bay bowtie-with-screen UHF antenna and measured gains of approximately 3 dB, 9 dB and 15 dB for low-VHF, high-VHF and UHF. This UHF-only antenna exceeds the planning factor gain at both high-VHF and UHF!"

http://www.tvtechnology.com/features/On-RF/2006.01.25-f_doug.shtml

Steve

Steve;
That's really interesting information. In the not too distant future, I'm going to need to replace my antenna (they don't do well when the mast falls down). I will hold on to this old one as long as it keeps working, but when (and if) Low-VHF goes away, I'll be much better informed as to what might be a good replacement. I would assume the bow tie models don't catch wind nearly as well as a yagi, and are thus easier to mount higher. Is that correct?
Thanks!
Nat

Can someone explain the access a cable company has to a HD feed from another city? What I would like to know is if TWC in Terre Haute has the ability to carry WRTV-DT out of Indy since that is the ABC affiliate for Terre Haute. I don't fully understand how it works if it is the same station compared to when it is basically the same, but has different call letters.

Freddie... technically, WRTV is NOT the affiliate for ABC in Terre Haute. It is outside of the FCC's definied limit for its service. In reality, ABC has no affiliate serving the Terre Haute area. I believe that WRTV is picked up by TWC on the far east side of town with a large antenna... that's why Channel 6 looks all grainy on Terre Haute cable. I don't think WRTV's digital signal would travel that far without signifiant degrading, however.

For ABC-less TH viewers,I would think WICD on 41 would be much easier to receive than WRTV on 25.It's only a little over 50mi from TH proper.Anyone get reliable reception from them?

I get abc channel 15 with a set of rabbit ears. I live in the southeast side of t.h. and use a hd10-250 tivo.
signal i pretty realiable but not perfect all the time. plan to try moving it around some more to try to increase signal.

I also live on southeast side of TH (I don't think I am to far from you Tim 30th and Wallace) and I can pick up 15 with an indoor/outdoor amplified ant from Rat Shack in my basemant. (plan to put it on the roof tomorrow) I can also pick up WTHI, but I could probably get that with a coat hanger:).Tonight was the first night to watch CSI: Miami in HD it was nice.
Brad

For ABC-less TH viewers,I would think WICD on 41 would be much easier to receive than WRTV on 25.It's only a little over 50mi from TH proper.Anyone get reliable reception from them?

WICD and WTHI have been the only bright spots for those in the Terre Haute area using OTA. Though if you have a decent outdoor antenna the IU station is a constant as well.

I haven't been able to pick up ABC on the east side of Terre Haute. Can you guys tell me what direction the poles or loop needs to be facing? It would be nice to have for Sunday. Thanks for any help.

Steve;
That's really interesting information. In the not too distant future, I'm going to need to replace my antenna (they don't do well when the mast falls down). I will hold on to this old one as long as it keeps working, but when (and if) Low-VHF goes away, I'll be much better informed as to what might be a good replacement. I would assume the bow tie models don't catch wind nearly as well as a yagi, and are thus easier to mount higher. Is that correct?
Thanks!
Nat

Nat, the CM 4228 is a heavy antenna and weighs more than most large yagis. I don't know if the wind factor would be much different under normal conditions, but if we were to get an ice storm, the 4228 would certainly build up a lot of ice and could definitely become a factor in high winds. The yagis would build up with ice but should allow the wind to pass with less resistance. Just my 2 cents.

Steve

I haven't been able to pick up ABC on the east side of Terre Haute. Can you guys tell me what direction the poles or loop needs to be facing? It would be nice to have for Sunday. Thanks for any help.

From a previous post, this map indicates the location of the WICD-DT 41 (15.1) broadcast tower. It looks like you should aim your antenna in the vicinity of NNW.
http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=DT1031586.html

This station has a great signal with 950kW @ 1230 feet. Interesting that "as the crow flies" it is 50 miles from the WICD tower site to DT Terre Haute. At 1230 feet, the line of sight signal from this station is right at 50 miles. With a good antenna, this should be a fairly easy station to receive.

Steve

Thank you Steve

Dish Network's new HD channels in the new MPEG4 format launched today along with distant HD networks from New York. Most of the Terre Haute area qualifies for distant ABC, so those wanting ABC in HD, here is an option.

The distant HD networks and the new HD channels require a new 211 or DVR 622 receiver, both pick up local digital channels, along with a second outside dish pointed at the 61.5 satellite (southeast).

DirecTV will also give you the NY ABCHD in Terre Haute. My sister out in Riley has it.

I had no luck getting WICD tonight. I tried moving the directions of the poles and the loop. I'm not sure if it is UHF or VHF. My antenna must not be good enough. :mad:

I also live on southeast side of TH (I don't think I am to far from you Tim 30th and Wallace) and I can pick up 15 with an indoor/outdoor amplified ant from Rat Shack in my basemant. (plan to put it on the roof tomorrow) I can also pick up WTHI, but I could probably get that with a coat hanger:).Tonight was the first night to watch CSI: Miami in HD it was nice.
Brad

Hi brad,
I live at 31st and washington ave. Your just down the street. Enjoy the super bowl.

Tim

Nat, the CM 4228 is a heavy antenna and weighs more than most large yagis. I don't know if the wind factor would be much different under normal conditions, but if we were to get an ice storm, the 4228 would certainly build up a lot of ice and could definitely become a factor in high winds. The yagis would build up with ice but should allow the wind to pass with less resistance. Just my 2 cents.

Steve

I never thought about the 4228 being heavy, but you make an excellent point regarding the ice acccumulation. There is a lot of surface area on the 4228.
Thanks!
Nat

Hi brad,
I live at 31st and washington ave. Your just down the street. Enjoy the super bowl.

Tim
I was hoping to, but now I can't seem to pick up the station since I moved my ant from the basement inside to my roof! Things sure get wierd with this digital OTA stuff. Oh well, I will keep trying I still have a few day left.
Brad

I need help from anyone in Bloomington with Insight Digital and the HD pack.

Have you had a problem with WTHR's digital channel (761) the last few days?

My picture is jerky, and I am getting correctable error rates between 60 and 100 in the five second sample period. It only happens on this channel, and the analog version doesn't exhibit the same behavior.

I'm trying to determine if it is a system-wide problem for Insight, or if I'm going to have to deal with the repairman...

Thanks,
Bill

I need help from anyone in Bloomington with Insight Digital and the HD pack.

Have you had a problem with WTHR's digital channel (761) the last few days?

Thanks,
Bill

Hey Bill;
I have had the exact same problems. I get the same picture through Insight's Cable Box as I do through my Samsung set top box, which can receive unenecrypted QAM signals.
I'm no engineer, but I'm betting this is an Insight system (at least in Bloomington) wide problem.

Nat

ps. My OverTheAir antenna gets the channel just fine, so it is obviously Insight's problem.

Does anyone have any last minute suggestions on how I can get WICD? Is it still working for everyone else in Terre Haute?

Im looking for a frequency list for the Terre Haute / Clinton area. I need to know what the digital frequency's are before they are remapped and try and find antenna directions from 47854. Antenna web doesn't give but 2 digital stations for the zip 47854.

Thanks

http://www.2150.com/broadcast/default.asp

This site is really awesome for finding tv stations in your area. You just need to find your lat & long, which you can do with the link at the top.

Does anyone have any last minute suggestions on how I can get WICD? Is it still working for everyone else in Terre Haute?

Ok feddie,first thing you do is get rid of the rabbit ears,then go searching for an outdoor UHF antenna like a CM4221,4228 or a U75,U100,U120 at a Radio shack.Check building supply places and hardware stores for the CM antennas.You'll also need a UHF preamp,or V/U preamp,and 50,75,or 100ft of coax to run outside.A short 3ft coax and matching transformer to run from antenna to preamp.Also a short length of coax from preamp power supply to tv tuner.You'll also need some pieces of masting 15-20ft total and hopefully somewhere outside you can lash the masting to something to hold it all up,at least temporarily.

better hurry

I don't have the option of the outdoor antenna because I'm in an apartment. I was hoping to figure out how to get it with the indoor antenna like others have been able to do on here. Thanks for the ideas though.