TV fool gave me this information on my location. I plan on having a large (deep-fringe) antenna mounted about 25 feet off the ground. Does anyone know how to read this and give me a likelyhood of it working for me?
http://img520.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenhunter01apr051139xx6.jpg

TV fool gave me this information on my location. I plan on having a large (deep-fringe) antenna mounted about 25 feet off the ground. Does anyone know how to read this and give me a likelyhood of it working for me?
http://img520.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenhunter01apr051139xx6.jpg

Here's my interpretation:

- A deep fringe antenna mounted above the average roof-line in your neighborhood will usually get channels with "Rx(dBm)" values down to about -105 to -110. This means that you should get almost all of the Indianapolis channels.

- If you have more than about 30 feet of coax between the antenna and your TV or if you plan on splitting the feed to two or more devices, then it's a good idea to get a pre-amp too. This will make sure the channels around -110 dBm don't get lost due to cable losses or splitters. Try to stay with amps that have low noise figures (under 3 dB). Amps that don't quote a noise figure are usually pretty bad (6 to 10 dB) and should be avoided. 10-20 dB of gain is all that you'd probably need.

- All of your channels are coming from Indianapolis with the exception of WLFI and WICD. If you only point your antenna at Indianapolis, WLFI is probably close enough and strong enough to be picked up by the antenna even though it's not in the antenna's main beam width. WICD is probably borderline. You might not get that channel unless the antenna is pointed at it. Since you also get ABC via WRTV in Indianapolis, maybe it's not so important to get WICD. For just the one channel, it doesn't seem like it's worth it to add an antenna rotator to this setup.

- "Deep fringe" antennas like the CM 4228 and the AD 91XG are UHF-only antennas. They still have some gain at VHF, but it's usually pretty low. If you're planning on going with a UHF-only antenna, you might not pick up WLFI (ch 11) and WISH (ch 9). After February 2009, WTHR is planning to move to channel 13, so they'll be affected as well. The CM 4228 "might" get these channels, but if you want to be more certain, you'll want to get a "combo" antenna or combine separate UHF and VHF antennas yourself.



Your best bet seems to be getting a deep fringe combo antenna on the roof pointed at Indianapolis (compass bearing 134), with a pre-amp from either Channel Master or Winegard. That will probably get you all the channels down to WDTI (-107 dBm) except you might lose WICD.

If it's really important to also get WICD, you may need to consider an antenna rotator or use an A-B switch between two different antennas. However, you can try the easier setup first and see what happens. Maybe WICD will come in anyway or you'll realize that it really isn't necessary.

In general, it looks like you're in good shape to get a decent number of channels.



Best regards,
Andy

In general, it looks like you're in good shape to get a decent number of channels.

Indeed! (and much to my surprise, as I thought your distance to Indy's towers was beyond mine - 50 miles - but it apparently isn't).

I'll offer you what my setup is:

Two antennas paired on a mast, feeding a pre-amp and then a RG-6 coax run of ~130 feet to my tuner.

VHF antenna: Winegard YA 1713 (~$55 from Winegard Direct)
UHF antenna: Channel Master 4228 (~$46 from Warren Electronic, plus S&H)

(Together, these are smaller than the combo units, which are real monsters, with 10'+ booms. Maybe you'll feel differently.)

Pre-amp: Channel Master 7777 (~$60; I think it provides 23 dBM gain; original finked out quickly but replacement has been trouble-free)

Set-top box: Samsung H260F

I'm very happy with this setup's performance.

Anyone else with Comcast notice the new HD channels? I've seen Science Channel, AMC HD, and Animal Plannet HD recently added.

It's hilarious that those channels aren't listed on Comcast's current channel lineup on their web site!

Do they have ESPNews HD yet?

Since Comcast took over my high speed Internet from Insight a few weeks ago (coincidence?), three of the digital stations via ClearQAM have been thrown up in to the 80's and 90's -- can't remember the exact numbers (I just set them as favorites on the TV and jump around with the favorite button).

I used to have 6-1 and 8-1 and 20-1 for ABC, CBS, and PBS. Still get NBC, CW, and FOX on 13-1, 29-1, and 59-1, respectively. They're also removed the guide information for those three up in the 80's and 90's showing the show that's currently playing.

Pretty annoying, especially since Comcast decided that I need to pay them more money for the degradation to the service. I'd call their customer service and complain, but I just know their solution would be to rent a HD box and get digital service for who knows how much more per month. So you guys get to hear my complaining :p

Since Comcast took over my high speed Internet from Insight a few weeks ago...
...Pretty annoying, especially since Comcast decided that I need to pay them more money for the degradation to the service. I'd call their customer service and complain, but I just know their solution would be to rent a HD box and get digital service for who knows how much more per month. So you guys get to hear my complaining :p

You'd be lucky if you could get to Comcast CS. Write ups in the local paper down here say that for weeks people weren't able to get through to anything but recordings. Comcast spokespeople said they were overrun with calls and should be back to normal in a few weeks. I guess I'm lucky I didn't have any major issues, but I only get Internet and phone from them. I do TV OTA.

I really do love reading everyone's cable horror stories. I also love living out where cable is not an option. Used to be OTA and C-Band. Now it's OTA HD and little dish. If you don't like what you have, switch. It's wonderful to have options now.

Greg

Indeed! (and much to my surprise, as I thought your distance to Indy's towers was beyond mine - 50 miles - but it apparently isn't).

I'll offer you what my setup is:

Two antennas paired on a mast, feeding a pre-amp and then a RG-6 coax run of ~130 feet to my tuner.

VHF antenna: Winegard YA 1713 (~$55 from Winegard Direct)
UHF antenna: Channel Master 4228 (~$46 from Warren Electronic, plus S&H)

(Together, these are smaller than the combo units, which are real monsters, with 10'+ booms. Maybe you'll feel differently.)

Pre-amp: Channel Master 7777 (~$60; I think it provides 23 dBM gain; original finked out quickly but replacement has been trouble-free)

Set-top box: Samsung H260F

I'm very happy with this setup's performance.

Thanks a lot! I do think going with separate uhf/vhf antenna with tha 7777 preamp/combiner will be the best way to go. Does anyone recommend something different that the two antenna listed for me? I did read the 1713 is recommended for 20-30mi on one site and 40+ on another site. Are there any better uhf/vhf combinations of antenna I should be looking at? Cost is about the same as one of the combo kits and i'm guessing this will perform better anyways.

would something like this antenna (http://www.summitsource.com/product_info.php?ref=1&products_id=6265) provide me with a better ability to tune in the lower channels compared to the YA 1713? Would the CM 4228 uhf, the CM7777 pre-amp and this antenna give me the best results from my location?

Thanks a lot! I do think going with separate uhf/vhf antenna with tha 7777 preamp/combiner will be the best way to go. Does anyone recommend something different that the two antenna listed for me? I did read the 1713 is recommended for 20-30mi on one site and 40+ on another site. Are there any better uhf/vhf combinations of antenna I should be looking at? Cost is about the same as one of the combo kits and i'm guessing this will perform better anyways.

would something like this antenna (http://www.summitsource.com/product_info.php?ref=1&products_id=6265) provide me with a better ability to tune in the lower channels compared to the YA 1713? Would the CM 4228 uhf, the CM7777 pre-amp and this antenna give me the best results from my location?

IMO, it looks like a good plan. I'm using the AntennaCraft equivalent of the Winegard YA1713 @ 27 feet AGL and can receive WLFI-DT-11 @ 40 miles.

The other VHF antenna you posted above is for low and high VHF channels (2-13). This antenna includes some very long elements for the low band VHF channels (2-6). As it stands right now, after Feb. 17, 2009 there won't be any DTV or low power analog TV stations on channels 2-6 in this area. The other antenna (YA1713) is made for channels 7-13 and is made with shorter elements which are more resistant to weather conditions, especially potential ice storms. It should work fine for WISH-DT-9 and WTHR-DT-13 (after 2/17/09).

Steve

Alright well the CM 4228, YA 1713, and CM 7777 will be what I choose to go with. I am planning on running two cables... one to the front of the house and one to the back. I'll run both down the chimney and then split one around the house each way. Is it best to split it close to the preamp or should i split it after i've run a single coax down the chimney?

Alright well the CM 4228, YA 1713, and CM 7777 will be what I choose to go with. I am planning on running two cables... one to the front of the house and one to the back. I'll run both down the chimney and then split one around the house each way. Is it best to split it close to the preamp or should i split it after i've run a single coax down the chimney?

My understanding is that you want to split the signal as late as possible. But I'll let those more technically knowledgeable than I chime in.

The pre-amp's power adapter actually can/will/should draw its power from an outlet inside the house, so I'd say this is the first split location you'd want to consider. But this divides the signal strength to each of the sets. Given the already-attenuated signal you'll be receiving thanks to your distance from the towers (the reason why a pre-amp is advised), splitting the signal too early might inadvertently introduce insufficient signal strength to *both* sets. I'd suggest taking this one step at a time: get one set up & running, then experiment with splitting the signal to another set later.

Alright well the CM 4228, YA 1713, and CM 7777 will be what I choose to go with. I am planning on running two cables... one to the front of the house and one to the back. I'll run both down the chimney and then split one around the house each way. Is it best to split it close to the preamp or should i split it after i've run a single coax down the chimney?

I made a little paint drawing of what I am thinking about trying and dont know if it possible. It is a rental and I cant install the cables where I actually would in a real house. I'll have to run the coax through windows and I need to split them and run one around the house to the front window and one around the back.

Here is the picture (http://img207.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenhunter01apr072125bc6.jpg)

I made a little paint drawing of what I am thinking about trying and dont know if it possible. It is a rental and I cant install the cables where I actually would in a real house. I'll have to run the coax through windows and I need to split them and run one around the house to the front window and one around the back.

Here is the picture (http://img207.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenhunter01apr072125bc6.jpg)

Great graphic and idea, but the signal cannot be split to another TV receiver until AFTER the signal coming from the antenna and outdoor amplifier (mast mounted) is powered through the indoor power supply unit. These diagrams show the basics of the installation.
http://www.solidsignal.com/tech_help_CM777X.asp
http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?PROD=ANC7777#MORE

Steve

Great graphic and idea, but the signal cannot be split to another TV receiver until AFTER the signal coming from the antenna and outdoor amplifier (mast mounted) is powered through the indoor power supply unit. These diagrams show the basics of the installation.
http://www.solidsignal.com/tech_help_CM777X.asp
http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?PROD=ANC7777#MORE

Steve

Winegard makes distirubution amps that use 12v of power sent via RG-6 cable. That would let you leave the amp outdoors if it is well protected from the weather, just like your splitter is going to have to be.
I understand that these are not normally used as preamps, and there may be good reasons for that. But in your unusual circumstances, I'm not sure I'd want a 120 v device outdoors and I think these amps might work for you.
http://www.winegard.com/offair/amps.htm
Just a thought :)
Perhaps others can chime in, especially when it comes to AC/DC passive splitters that might work for you as well with the right setup.
Nat Hill IV

Alright well the CM 4228, YA 1713, and CM 7777 will be what I choose to go with. I am planning on running two cables... one to the front of the house and one to the back. I'll run both down the chimney and then split one around the house each way. Is it best to split it close to the preamp or should i split it after i've run a single coax down the chimney?

My understanding is that you want to split the signal as late as possible. But I'll let those more technically knowledgeable than I chime in.

The pre-amp's power adapter actually can/will/should draw its power from an outlet inside the house, so I'd say this is the first split location you'd want to consider. But this divides the signal strength to each of the sets. Given the already-attenuated signal you'll be receiving thanks to your distance from the towers (the reason why a pre-amp is advised), splitting the signal too early might inadvertently introduce insufficient signal strength to *both* sets. I'd suggest taking this one step at a time: get one set up & running, then experiment with splitting the signal to another set later.

It's important to consider where the power is coming from. The amp will not work (and will block signals) if it is not powered. The power injector units are designed for indoor use and are usually placed near a TV since that's usually the most convenient place to find an AC outlet.

If you are going to split it as you propose, then the power injector will come AFTER the split. This can work, but you must make sure you use a DC-blocking splitter for that junction. It's a special splitter that passes power on one port and blocks it from the other port. This allows power from the injector to feed your amp without sending power to your other TV. Something like this (http://www.pacificcable.com/Picture_Page.asp?DataName=201-232) would do. The alternative is to use a splitter that passes power on all ports (which includes most run-of-the-mill splitters), but put one of these (http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?prod=VB-1000) on the side going to the unpowered TV feed (see attached drawing).

If your split point were indoors, then you could put the power injector before the splitter and you could use any ordinary splitter "downstream" from there. Some people have AC outlets in their attic and find it convenient to put the power injector there and split the signal immediately after it.

Splitting early or late doesn't make much of a difference. The important value to keep track of is the length of cable leading from the amp to your TV and the amount of splitting that has taken place. In this particular case, I think the CM 7777 has plenty of gain to overcome your coax and splitter losses, so it's really up to you as to which method is more convenient. Your choice might be constrained by the availability of AC power or perhaps the need to use pre-existing coax that is already in-place.

This setup will make sure your TVs are able to make the most of what your antennas are able to pull out of the air. It all starts with good antennas, and it looks like you've settled on some good choices.




A few other word of advice...

Try to protect your outdoor coax and F-type connectors from the elements. Any water that gets into the coax or moisture that condenses inside will cut signal strength dramatically. Plus, cable ends tend to be the first point of failure if not protected. A few tight wraps of electrical tape (UV rated) can create an effective barrier.

Strain relief for the connection points is also very important. You should minimize the weight being supported by the connectors themselves. Things will only get worse when wind, snow, and ice start pulling on your connections.



Best regards,
Andy

Which antenna would be recommended over the other?

http://www.audiovox.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10001&storeId=10001&productId=14122&langId=-1

or

http://www.audiovox.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10001&storeId=10001&productId=14204&langId=-1

I'm making these comments because the first unit you posted looks virtually like the Zenith Silver Sensor which is for UHF frequencies. The wavelengths of VHF frequencies are longer than those of UHF frequencies, so the elements on the antenna need to be longer to capture the signal. I'm not sure how Audiovox can label this as a VHF antenna.

The Terk HDTVi is a clone of the Zenith Silver Sensor except that is has a set of rabbit ears on the back. In order to pick up VHF stations, you will need to extend the rabbit ears out to a length that is appropriate for the wavelength of the channel(s) you want.

Of course, attic or roof mounted antennas with more elements can do a better job of pulling signals out of the air. However, as far as indoor antenna performance goes, the HDTVi roughly equals the Silver Sensor at UHF frequencies and roughly equals rabbit ears at VHF frequencies. That's about as good as you'll get for an antenna of this form factor. If it's not enough for your particular situation, your only options are to mount it much higher, switch to a larger antenna, or both. At 6 miles from the transmitters, this antenna might do just fine.

BTW, I would generally recommend against getting the amplified version of the HDTVi, called the HDTVa. Amps cannot improve the intrinsic gain capabilities of the antenna itself. The main purpose of amps is to overcome any signal loss due to cables, splitters, and tuner inefficiencies that occur "downstream" from the antenna. For most set-top uses, the cable length is so short that any amplification circuitry would be a complete waste (and potentially make things slightly worse). These built-in amps are usually low quality and are there for marketing purposes more than anything else.



The other antenna (Terk TV5) looks like an omnidirectional double loop. In contrast, the HDTVi is a very directional antenna (for the UHF portion). The shape of an antenna's radiation pattern and the gain the antenna is able to achieve are interrelated. For this reason, I suspect the gain of the TV5 will be much lower than that of the HDTVi.

The trade-off is that the HDTVi may need to be re-pointed if you want to receive channels coming from different directions, while the TV5 will receive signals from most directions without being moved (and with lower sensitivity).

Since the TV5 also comes with a built-in amp, you're probably paying a premium for a useless feature as per my comment above. You'll notice in the documentation that they specify the gain of the amplifier without telling you the intrinsic gain of the antenna (because it is undoubtedly pretty bad). Boosting a noisy weak signal will get you nowhere.



I think the average user would prefer the HDTVi over the TV5. If there's a channel that's on the borderline of being received, you'll have a better chance of getting the signal to a stable level with the higher gain antenna. When your favorite program is on, you'll want the cleanest picture possible, even if it means getting up and fiddling with the antenna.



Best regards,
Andy

andy.s.lee - Thank you so much for the answer! Now I just have to wait until July to get the new property so I can start tinkering. I'm not sure if it is allowed but where would you all recommend getting the antennas from? Summitsource is about 2 hours from my house. I also keep looking at solidsignal. I am thinking of getting the rg6 from monoprice. Just let me know if there are other places I should be checking out.
Again, if this is against the rules of the forum just let me know and ill delete the post.
Thanks guys for all the help so far!

Alright, I've been thinking and I was wondering what my best option is right now. If i wanted to get the CM 4228 and place it up first pointing at indy I should get all channels except probably wish (ch 9). When wthr goes to CH 13, im guessing the 4228 should still be able to pick it up as it is the upper vhf and even on CH 13 the 4228 has a gain of approx 5db. If i could pick up the local CBS (WLFI), I would have no need for WISH and the extra Antenna. Should i skip the 7777 and go with a single uhf/vhf pre-amp? There is a possibility I will even need a very small uhf antenna for the WLFI channel and I would then need to add a uhf/vhf combiner, correct? Let me know if I am understanding this wrong but here is my proposed idea (to save a bit of money and an extra antenna)
first get the 4228 and a preamp and hope it picks up WLFI and all indys (except WISH)
If that doesnt work for WLFI is there a way to get the antenna pointed at WLFI and just get CH 11 from that antenna and the rest from the CM 4228?

Alright, I've been thinking and I was wondering what my best option is right now. If i wanted to get the CM 4228 and place it up first pointing at indy I should get all channels except probably wish (ch 9). When wthr goes to CH 13, im guessing the 4228 should still be able to pick it up as it is the upper vhf and even on CH 13 the 4228 has a gain of approx 5db. If i could pick up the local CBS (WLFI), I would have no need for WISH and the extra Antenna. Should i skip the 7777 and go with a single uhf/vhf pre-amp? There is a possibility I will even need a very small uhf antenna for the WLFI channel and I would then need to add a uhf/vhf combiner, correct? Let me know if I am understanding this wrong but here is my proposed idea (to save a bit of money and an extra antenna)
first get the 4228 and a preamp and hope it picks up WLFI and all indys (except WISH)
If that doesnt work for WLFI is there a way to get the antenna pointed at WLFI and just get CH 18 from that antenna and the rest from the CM 4228?I would not assume the 4228 will not pick up WISH. It's in the upper bandwidth and VHF signals travel further than UHF.

I would not assume the 4228 will not pick up WISH. It's in the upper bandwidth and VHF signals travel further than UHF.

I'd be fine if it picked up either WISH or WLFI. My concern was that WISH is transmitting at a very low level. They are both CBS affiliates so that doesn't matter. What do the rest of you think? Should I try just the 4228 and hope it gets WISH or WLFI? If I do end up needed another antenna, I'll have to a different pre-amp right? Is there a preamp that will work with just the CM 4228 and then if i need to, it will allow me to add the 1713 for just ch 11 (WLFI)?

If I do end up needed another antenna, I'll have to a different pre-amp right?

No - you will only need one pre-amp. The CM 7777 has two connections, so you can connect two antennas into it. I feed both my YA1713 and my CM4228 into the CM777.

Since most all the digital TV signals are currently & will be in the UHF range, the 4228 willl be the antenna that brings in the majority of your channels. It may or may not bring in the local CBS affiliate; you'll have to test it out first.

Since the YA1713 will only be useful for VHF channels (eg. WISH today and WTHR next February) (perhaps some stations in Lafayette will be on the upper VHF band after next February, I don't know.), the YA1713 would be the antenna that "can wait for now" while you test your reception with the 4228 and the 7777.

But should you decide to add a second antenna later, you can still rely upon the 7777; you *won't* need another pre-amp.

Thanks, I am confused on how the 7777 combines the uhf/vhf signals. If i want to try and use the 4228 to pick up either wish (ch 9) or wlfi (ch 11) will the 7777 cancel all signals in the VHF range if i connect the 4228 to the uhf input and nothing to the vhf?

Thanks, I am confused on how the 7777 combines the uhf/vhf signals. If i want to try and use the 4228 to pick up either wish (ch 9) or wlfi (ch 11) will the 7777 cancel all signals in the VHF range if i connect the 4228 to the uhf input and nothing to the vhf?

There is a switch inside the 7777 that lets you configure it either way.

In "combined" mode, all UHF and VHF are taken from one port (labeled "UHF/Combined"). This is what most people would use if there's nothing connected to the VHF port. You can use the 4228 as if it were a combo UHF/VHF antenna in this mode.

In "separate" mode, the UHF and VHF ports are "band separated", meaning that any only UHF signal will be allowed from the UHF port and only VHF signal will be allowed from the VHF port. If/when you add a VHF antenna, you would use this mode. The band separation prevents the two antennas from interfering with each other on frequencies outside their designated frequency range.



There is another switch in the 7777 that lets you set the optional FM trap. If strong FM signals are causing interference or overload problems for you, then you can set the FM trap "in". If you do not have these problems and want to use your antenna for FM reception, you can leave the FM trap "out".



Best regards,
Andy

There is a switch inside the 7777 that lets you configure it either way.

In "combined" mode, all UHF and VHF are taken from one port (labeled "UHF/Combined"). This is what most people would use if there's nothing connected to the VHF port. You can use the 4228 as if it were a combo UHF/VHF antenna in this mode.

In "separate" mode, the UHF and VHF ports are "band separated", meaning that any only UHF signal will be allowed from the UHF port and only VHF signal will be allowed from the VHF port. If/when you add a VHF antenna, you would use this mode. The band separation prevents the two antennas from interfering with each other on frequencies outside their designated frequency range.



There is another switch in the 7777 that lets you set the optional FM trap. If strong FM signals are causing interference or overload problems for you, then you can set the FM trap "in". If you do not have these problems and want to use your antenna for FM reception, you can leave the FM trap "out".



Best regards,
Andy

Thanks for that info. You're saying that when WTHR switches to CH 13 next February I'll have to point my 1713 towards indy instead of at WLFI if I want to get NBC? Is there any way to have the 4228 pick up CH 13 and have everything else (ch 11) picked up from the 1713?

Sorry again for all the questions! I'm still learning. I'm trying to get educated so I don't look like an idiot with the wife :)

Also, What diameter pole should i use on the chimney? I was thinking of 1.5 OD. Are there chimney mounts that are better than others? They all look very similar.

Thanks for that info. You're saying that when WTHR switches to CH 13 next February I'll have to point my 1713 towards indy instead of at WLFI if I want to get NBC? Is there any way to have the 4228 pick up CH 13 and have everything else (ch 11) picked up from the 1713?


You're laboring under what may be a mis-understanding. (Don't worry, I suffered many.)

Remember, the antennas and the pre-amp -that is, the entire setup- you're currently looking at was determined by your desire to bring in the Indianapolis stations. They will work, if your have them at sufficient height.

You then complicated things by shifting into 'how might I get WLFI?'. Since that channel is in the VHF band, your attention shifted into thinking that you would need to reorient or devote the Winegard 1713 to receive WLFI. Here's where your thinking is leading you down a path you need not go. Because the 4228 may very well be capable of bringing WLFI in, given how close you are to Lafayette's towers (as opposed to the distance to the Indianapolis towers.)

The data in the TVFool table indicates that the YA 1713 will pull in high-VHF stations WISH and WTHR when the latter returns to the VHF band. And if, as is entirely possible, the 4228 pulls in WLFI by itself, even though it's aimed ESE to the UHF stations from Indy, you will *not* need to re-aim the 1713 to receive WLFI. The 4228 will deliver that signal. But you won't know for sure until you try it. That's why I think the 4228 is the first antenna you'll want to try.

I once had the cleanest picture of Cincinnati's NBC affiliate, Ch. 9(?), even though the 4228 was aimed due north to the Indy towers. I think I'm well over 70 miles to Cincinnati. Although my reception was due to tropospheric conditions, the signal I was getting was coming in from *the side* of the 4228.

I may be wrong on this -or over-stating something- so I'd advise you to wait until others chime in. But I don't think I am.

Alright i'll stop worrying :) I'll start with getting the 4228 and the 7777. If anyone has any other advise I have about 3 months before i'll be buying and installing this on my new place. Thanks for everyone's advise so far.

The 7777 states it provides "Full lightning and surge protection. " Should I trust them or should I install my own ground line?

OK.. I have a question for anyone around the lafayette area. I am thinking about installing an antenna on the chimney of a duplex that I'm renting and was thinking of using the y-chimney mount for a nice sturdy but semi temporary solution. The antenna will be a bit above the chimney on the 1 story house. The house is located on beck just east of 231. (southside of lafayette) I was wondering what luck people had with antennas from this area. I would like to know if anyone has any suggestions on what to look for in the antenna or amp, and also if anyone is able to pick up all the indy channels (abc,nbc,fox,cbs are the ones i care about). The install wont happen for about 3 more months, but I'm trying to plan ahead what I will install so i can look around for deals.
I just bought a lot near where you should be. It is in the "Cobblestone" subdivision. I haven't started construction yet (it will be a while). But, I have been studying distances and coverage patterns for the Indy stations. I'm fairly certain that when I get my house built, that I will be able to receive the digital stations by putting up an ~40' tower with a directional antenna on a rotator. Whether a mast mounted rf amp will also be required remains to be seen. Let me know of any further info you may get. Anxious to know more.

P.S.-Have just now read more of the responses from other readers about antenna types and preamps. These have been very helpful for my future installation.

P.S.-Have just now read more of the responses from other readers about antenna types and preamps. These have been very helpful for my future installation.

These last two pages have been the most concentrated, info-wise, in quite some time. (You guys up in Lafayette will be expected to carry the torch in your communities after you're all settled in.) :)

I just bought a lot near where you should be. It is in the "Cobblestone" subdivision. I haven't started construction yet (it will be a while). But, I have been studying distances and coverage patterns for the Indy stations. I'm fairly certain that when I get my house built, that I will be able to receive the digital stations by putting up an ~40' tower with a directional antenna on a rotator. Whether a mast mounted rf amp will also be required remains to be seen. Let me know of any further info you may get. Anxious to know more.

P.S.-Have just now read more of the responses from other readers about antenna types and preamps. These have been very helpful for my future installation.

Yea... You'll be about a quartermile from where i'm at. I dont think you'll need the 40 foot antenna or a rotator. All the indy channels are at around 133-134 on the compass unless you are very concerned with getting WICD or WLFI. I'll be installing my setup in July and i'll certainly post my results. I'll be mounting the antenna on 10-15 ft pole mounted on the chimney of a 1 story house. I estimate the final antenna to be mounted around 25-30 ft. tvfool said that the there isnt much difference in reception between 25 and 35 feet. When are you planning on putting up the antenna?

THeller - I will stay around as the lafayette guru... but all I'll know is if the 4228 will work up here :)

I'm not sure if this is the correct forum to ask this but it seems logical;)

I seem to be having an issue with WTHR HD channel. For whatever reason I've noticed that there's a thin white line that runs vertically on the left hand edge of the screen. What I find even weirder is if a commercial comes on and the commercial isn't in a native 16:9 ratio it will pillar box the screen correctly but the white line is still visible on the left hand side of the picture (not on the left hand of my screen).

I have cable (not OTA so it may be their doing) running through a SA8300HD box and have set the box to pass through the signal to be dealt with by my TV. Every other local displays correctly without the left hand border. All the rest of my HD channels do as well. It's only WTHR.

Any thoughts? Thanks.

The question has cropped up here in the forum again as to why WISH transmits at a lower power than the other DTVs.

The VHF band (2-13) operates far more efficiently than the UHF band (14-69). This is true even in analog. Channels 8 analog and 13 analog operate at the FCC maximum of 316,000 watts. UHF analog stations have an FCC maximum of 5,000,000 watts. Despite the difference in transmitted watts, the coverage areas are roughly the same (In fact, UHF is considered to have very slightly less coverage, even with that higher power. That is due more to VHF signal being able to follow the curvature of the earth a little better than UHF.)

Also, transmitted power vs. coverage distance is an exponential realationship, not linear. If I reduced my transmitted power by half, my coverage radius might reduce from 60 miles to 57 miles.

Finally, the way that the DTV transmitted signal was designed to work, less power is needed overall. So, instead of needing 316,000 watts for analog, I need only about 20,000 watts for digital, and I get the same coverage with only 1/10th the power bill!

Hope this is helpful.

Tom Weber
Engineering
WISH / WNDY / WIIH

The question has cropped up here in the forum again as to why WISH transmits at a lower power than the other DTVs.

The VHF band (2-13) operates far more efficiently than the UHF band (14-69). This is true even in analog. Channels 8 analog and 13 analog operate at the FCC maximum of 316,000 watts. UHF analog stations have an FCC maximum of 5,000,000 watts. Despite the difference in transmitted watts, the coverage areas are roughly the same (In fact, UHF is considered to have very slightly less coverage, even with that higher power. That is due more to VHF signal being able to follow the curvature of the earth a little better than UHF.)

Also, transmitted power vs. coverage distance is an exponential realationship, not linear. If I reduced my transmitted power by half, my coverage radius might reduce from 60 miles to 57 miles.

Finally, the way that the DTV transmitted signal was designed to work, less power is needed overall. So, instead of needing 316,000 watts for analog, I need only about 20,000 watts for digital, and I get the same coverage with only 1/10th the power bill!

Hope this is helpful.

Tom Weber
Engineering
WISH / WNDY / WIIH

Whether we knew it or not, that was a great explanation/reminder.

So, instead of needing 316,000 watts for analog, I need only about 20,000 watts for digital, and I get the same coverage with only 1/10th the power bill!

Plus...you can transmit multiple programs, right? (8-1 (HD), 8-2 and 8-3)


Tom, while you're here, would you care to comment on the fines the FCC levied today on retailers and television manufacturers?

I'm going to leave the commenting to those who have actual knowledge of the subject.

Power levels I know a little bit about. This other situation, nada.

Tom

just spotted this story

Television stations seek cell access
Owners form coalition, push for mobile standard

By RYAN NAKASHIMA
THE ASSOCIATED PRESS

LAS VEGAS -- Owners of more than 800 television stations where ad revenue is plunging steadily said they've formed a group that's testing three standards for sending local digital TV signals to cell phones, laptops and other mobile devices.

The Open Mobile Video Coalition said at the National Association of Broadcasters meeting in Las Vegas that it will push for an open standard by next year that would allow members to bypass cell phone companies and tap into what they think will be a $2 billion market for mobile advertising.

The station owners say transmitting directly to mobile devices would give them a third means of delivering local programming -- and capturing revenue -- along with broadcasting to TVs and streaming it on station-owned Web sites.

"You now have three legs of a stool, whereas, before, you just had one," said Jim Conschafter, senior vice president of broadcast for Media General Inc., which owns 23 network-affiliated stations reaching 9.5 percent of U.S. households.

Ad revenue at the top 100 U.S. stations was down 17 percent in the fourth quarter of 2007, while syndicated TV and networks saw revenue rise, according to the Television Bureau of Advertising.

Local station owners are competing fiercely for viewers against an increasing number of cable channels and video Web sites.

The coalition is testing three technical standards and hopes to submit recommendations to the nonprofit, standard-setting Advanced Television Systems Committee next month. The ATSC requested proposals for a mobile TV standard.

The coalition hopes to have a single standard approved by the time all analog television signals in the U.S. are converted to digital next February.

The coalition said the cost of upgrading each TV station so it can broadcast to mobile devices would be a relatively low $100,000 or less, while chip-set upgrades or add-ons to cell phones, PDAs, laptops or other devices are estimated to cost less than $10.

"We've already got towers out there, broadcasting TV stations since 1948," said Sterling Davis, vice president of engineering for Cox Broadcasting and chairman of the coalition's technical group.

The three standards the coalition is considering are: the MPH (Mobile-Pedestrian-Handheld) system developed by LG Electronics and Harris Corp.; the A-VSB system by Samsung Electronics Co. Ltd. and Rohde & Schwarz; and a third system developed by Thomson and Micronas.

Most cell phones are sold by carriers that offer TV services, and it's unclear if those providers would allow competing content to reach their devices.

The coalition's open approach has the backing of major networks such as NBC and Fox, which have members on the executive committee.

I'm going to leave the commenting to those who have actual knowledge of the subject.

Power levels I know a little bit about. This other situation, nada.

Tom


What about a comment on DirecTV coverage? I don't expect one, but I figured I'd ask.

Not sure if I will even use a DirecTV feed of WISH whenever it finally happens. The only compelling reason is to reduce the size of recorded programming on my DVR. The MPEG2 file sizes are a lot bigger than the MPEG4 off the satellite. But DirecTV's MPEG4 locals also appear to have some quirky problem with pixels jumping around and making the picture look out of focus, so it's a sad tradeoff in the end.

Hello all, been a while since I been on here. (Hi Ken)

I recently purchased a LG 26 inch lcd tv that has 720p. I loved it from just playing my 360 through hdmi on it. Last night I dug out my terk rabbit ears antenna to hook it up this weekend after getting a 2 input to one switch. When I dug it out, I realized it had a input port and a button switch. So I hooked my cable into it, and sure enough, I get cable and HDTV through one cord. What I am wondering, the antenna I have is a cheapy, probalby 20 dollars when I bought it years ago. I only get 10.1, 10.2, and 39 (WFXW). Will a powered rabbit ears antenna improve my reception. I am probably 15 miles from Farmersburg where all the towers are. 10.1 and 10.2 came in clear because they are full power. WFXW was fine when the neighbor was gone and wasn't in the parking spot directly across from the antenna *they are on low power. And I coudln't even get WTWO DT. If I can pick up a ABC station in HDTV, it would be worth it if it wasn't too expensive. I live in apartments so a roof or tower mount antenna is out of the question.

Thanks in advance.

I wouldn't go with powered rabbit ears. I've heard great things about small directional indoor antennas like this one (http://www.amazon.com/Philips-PM-HDTV1-Silver-Sensor-Antenna/dp/B00022O9VM) I'd try that first. I know there is a terk one too

I'm new to the area and just moved to Carmel....Looks like Comcast is the cable provider for my area, but I've heard some bad things about Comcast especially HD quality. I had Cox Communications at my previous residence and loved it. Is Comcast really that bad? Because I'm leaning towards DTV. Any info will be appreciated.

I'm new to the area and just moved to Carmel....Looks like Comcast is the cable provider for my area, but I've heard some bad things about Comcast especially HD quality. I had Cox Communications at my previous residence and loved it. Is Comcast really that bad? Because I'm leaning towards DTV. Any info will be appreciated.
Comcast is over compressing HD because of it's limited bandwidth as of now. Direct or Dish would be a much better choice, but as far as the major networks are concerned, your best picture will always be OTA. Direct has a few more HD channels than Dish at the moment, but they should be neck and neck by mid-summer. Dish is considered to have the best DVR/Receiver equipment.

Direct or Dish would be a much better choice, but as far as the major networks are concerned, your best picture will always be OTA.

Not necessarily.

According to a Comcast engineer friend of mine, in the Indianapolis market, the local OTA HD stations are fed to Comcast over fiber. Since most of the local stations also multicast SD sub-channels, they cannot deliver full bandwith HD OTA. However, they can deliver full bandwith HD over the fiber to the cable company.

FCC regulations essentially prohibit them from (I forget the exact wording) reducing the quality of the signal of the local OTA stations. So you may actually get a better picture of HD locals over cable than OTA.

Unfortunately, I don't know if these fiber feeds in Indianapolis are full bandwith or reduced like the OTA signal.

Do any of our broadcast engineer friends know?

Comcast is over compressing HD because of it's limited bandwidth as of now. Direct or Dish would be a much better choice, but as far as the major networks are concerned, your best picture will always be OTA. Direct has a few more HD channels than Dish at the moment, but they should be neck and neck by mid-summer. Dish is considered to have the best DVR/Receiver equipment.

Yea compressing HD signals is not cool......Well thanks for the info, I was leaning with DirectTV....I've never used satellite before so I was a little apprehensive, but I think I will give them a try.

Yea compressing HD signals is not cool......Well thanks for the info, I was leaning with DirectTV....I've never used satellite before so I was a little apprehensive, but I think I will give them a try.Keep in mind with Direct, you are still going to need a VHF antenna for WISH, which is not carried.

Keep in mind with Direct, you are still going to need a VHF antenna for WISH, which is not carried.

True, but with Dish you get none at all.

Keep in mind with Direct, you are still going to need a VHF antenna for WISH, which is not carried.

I take it WISH is a local channel. That's cool, I don't mind the rabbit ears.

I take it WISH is a local channel. That's cool, I don't mind the rabbit ears.
WISH Channel 8 is the local CBS affiliate. The station is owned by LIN Broadcasting. LIN and DirecTV don't agree on how much a satellite carrier should pay in order to carry a local television station's digital signal. Consequently, WISH Channel 8 is not available on DirecTV in HDTV, however the analog feed is available as part of DirecTV's local package.

Similar situation with WFYI Channel 20, the local PBS affiliate. The PBS broadcasters group and DirecTV recently came to an agreement, so we should see WFYI Channel 20 on DirecTV in HDTV soon.

I believe you said you were in Carmel. I live in a one-story house in Brownsburg. I have an inexpensive antenna in my attic pointed in the direction of 79th Street and Township Line Road where most of the local broadcasters are located. I get good signal quality from all of the locals including the ones broadcasting in HD...including WISH Channel 8 and WFYI Channel 20.

The downside is that I can't record those channels in HD with my DirecTV DVR as seemlessly as I can the channels that DirecTV carries. DirecTV has a solution in the works, though. At CES earlier this year, they announced an outboard off the air tuner that connects to their current HD DVR.

I've been a DirecTV customer since the mid-90s. I tried Comcast for a few months about 5 years ago. It didn't take long for me to dump them and go back to DirecTV. The cable companies seem to have the attitude that they are the only game in town. They aren't. And I've seen too many examples of sloppy cable TV installations including ones that violated the National Electric Code.

Welcome to the area.

question: why is it that all local stations are planning election night coverage on their HD stream...durring the first week of May! SWEEPS

And it is not community service...they sit there for the first 5 hours and speculate...they only get the real news, the results at like 11 or 12PM

and this isnt a general election...it is a PRIMARY...oh well, I guess HBO will have to due that night...good thing I dont like American *******...I mean idol

Alright i'll stop worrying :) I'll start with getting the 4228 and the 7777. If anyone has any other advise I have about 3 months before i'll be buying and installing this on my new place. Thanks for everyone's advise so far.

The 7777 states it provides "Full lightning and surge protection. " Should I trust them or should I install my own ground line?

Sorry if I'm late to the party on this - haven't been on this board for a couple months.
Anyway, I live just north of McCutcheon High School and have had an OTA setup for what will be 2 years this August.
First let me say thay you can get anything you might possibly need, including advice, custom length RG6, etc., from Lafayette Electronic Supply on north Earl. You can probably get things cheaper online if you look, but I'm just throwing it out there.
What follows is my setup, and there is certainly more than one way to skin a cat as far as the hardware goes (but no animals were harmed in the assembling of this system).
O.K. - I have a 1-story, steep pitched roof and on the peak, a tripod holding a 10' mast with a rotator. So that puts the total height around 25'. On top is a Winegard HD9095P for UHF and about 4-5' below it, a HD4053P for VHF. They join on the mast at a Winegard AP-2880 preamp. That comes down to a grounding block which is grounded via copper rod, then through the wall into the great room to the preamp power block, then to a splitter.
My antenna is almost always pointed at Indy. Even with that being the case, I can get WLFI and even WICD (which is a monster, it would seem) almost all the time without rotating.
In less than idea atmospheric conditions, WFYI is generally the only one to drop out. I blame this on their directional transmission pattern, which is weakest northwest, and while I do not know that is the issue, it makes me feel better to have someone else to blame.
Right now I am getting "typical" signal strengths while aimed at Indy, using a Dish DVR 622 as an ATSC tuner:
6.1 - 93
8.1 - 64
13.1 - 78
15.1 (WICD) - 65
18.1 (WLFI) - 76
20.1 - 67
59.1 - 70

I generally MUST rotate and have favorable conditions to get 4, 23, or anything from Bloomington.
On an aside, this morning was extraordinary for some reason. I first noticed Fox 59 was near 100, and then so was WFYI. The highest I had ever seen. So I started tuning channels and inadvertently came across 3, which is WAVE. Huh - never heard of them before, and they are talking alot about the Kentucky Derby. Well gee, maybe because they are in Louisville!
Of course, as the sun rose higher they faded into the ether, but it was certainly fun while it lasted!

You'll also need an AM21 (something like $50 or $100) and a DVR since DirecTV's receivers don't have antenna connections anymore, and the AM21 only supports the HD DVR and not the HD receiver. Dish's HD receivers and HD DVR have integrated OTA antenna support.

Also, DirecTV only carries NBC, ABC, and Fox on the satellite - you'll need the antenna for PBS, UPN, MyNDY, local weather stations, and other digital channels.

I generally MUST rotate and have favorable conditions to get 4, 23, or anything from Bloomington.
On an aside, this morning was extraordinary for some reason. I first noticed Fox 59 was near 100, and then so was WFYI. The highest I had ever seen. So I started tuning channels and inadvertently came across 3, which is WAVE. Huh - never heard of them before, and they are talking alot about the Kentucky Derby. Well gee, maybe because they are in Louisville!
Of course, as the sun rose higher they faded into the ether, but it was certainly fun while it lasted!

I got Channel 12 out of Flint MI on Saturday, and it was booming! Color and very watchable.

I can't speak for any of the other stations, but we give the same bitstream to the cable companies and to our own transmitters - the same 19.4 Mbits/second that contains WISH-HD, LWS, and Radar on WISH-DT, for instance.

Tom Weber
Engineering
WISH / WNDY / WIIH / LWS

Do you guys thing the CM 4228 is a better choice than the Winegard HD9095P?

Also, Is the CM 7777 preamp going to be a better choice than the Winegard AP-2880 preamp?

WISH Channel 8 is the local CBS affiliate. The station is owned by LIN Broadcasting. LIN and DirecTV don't agree on how much a satellite carrier should pay in order to carry a local television station's digital signal. Consequently, WISH Channel 8 is not available on DirecTV in HDTV, however the analog feed is available as part of DirecTV's local package.

Similar situation with WFYI Channel 20, the local PBS affiliate. The PBS broadcasters group and DirecTV recently came to an agreement, so we should see WFYI Channel 20 on DirecTV in HDTV soon.

I believe you said you were in Carmel. I live in a one-story house in Brownsburg. I have an inexpensive antenna in my attic pointed in the direction of 79th Street and Township Line Road where most of the local broadcasters are located. I get good signal quality from all of the locals including the ones broadcasting in HD...including WISH Channel 8 and WFYI Channel 20.

The downside is that I can't record those channels in HD with my DirecTV DVR as seemlessly as I can the channels that DirecTV carries. DirecTV has a solution in the works, though. At CES earlier this year, they announced an outboard off the air tuner that connects to their current HD DVR.

I've been a DirecTV customer since the mid-90s. I tried Comcast for a few months about 5 years ago. It didn't take long for me to dump them and go back to DirecTV. The cable companies seem to have the attitude that they are the only game in town. They aren't. And I've seen too many examples of sloppy cable TV installations including ones that violated the National Electric Code.

Welcome to the area.

Thanks for the info BB37. I get my DTV installed on Friday so I'm going to pick up an antenna sometime this week....There are to many good shows on CBS not to catch them in HD. I hope the local affiliate and DTV resolve their issues soon. It's going to suck not being able to use my DTV-DVR for CBS HD shows.

Do you guys thing the CM 4228 is a better choice than the Winegard HD9095P?

Also, Is the CM 7777 preamp going to be a better choice than the Winegard AP-2880 preamp?When in doubt, go with Channel Master, especially for preamps.

cterrell73, If you have a dtv hd dvr installed, you can record WISH 8 OTA signal through it. Try to get the hd 20. The hd21 doesn't include the ota turner. Call whoever is doing your install and ask if they have the hd20.

tim arnett

Model number of the DirecTV receiver is actually HR-20, but yes, get that instead of the HR-21 if possible.

Anyone having problems with RTV-6 today? My signal strength bounces from the mid 80s, to the 70s, back to the 80s, then down to zero. It cuts out several times a minute.

What can cause this? Today is the first day I've ever had a problem with channel 6.

Jeff

Anyone having problems with RTV-6 today? My signal strength bounces from the mid 80s, to the 70s, back to the 80s, then down to zero. It cuts out several times a minute.

What can cause this? Today is the first day I've ever had a problem with channel 6.

JeffThe weather. I have the same problem with 13, especially when it's windy. I can not say I watched 6 at all yesterday, but 13 was funky.

anyone having trouble with nbc HD, in west lafayette. on my panny plasma it used to be 13-1 but that channel doesnt work anymore. i havent done another scan for channels, but just wondering if you guys know whats up?

i have the cable plugged directly into the tv with out the cable box.

Anyone notice on WXIN-59.1 last Sunday night for the Simpsons, Family Guy, and American Dad that there were artificial black bars on the Hi-Def signal?

The bars did not quite go to the top of the screen, so I could clearly see 16x9 content behind the black bars.

Just curious why the don't show the program in 16x9.

-- Sorry if this has been discussed, I didn't scan all 161 pages here. --

Thanks,

- dk

Any updates on WISH-TV in HD on DirecTV? This is getting somewhat ridiculous.

Anyone notice on WXIN-59.1 last Sunday night for the Simpsons, Family Guy, and American Dad that there were artificial black bars on the Hi-Def signal?

The bars did not quite go to the top of the screen, so I could clearly see 16x9 content behind the black bars.

Just curious why the don't show the program in 16x9.

-- Sorry if this has been discussed, I didn't scan all 161 pages here. --

Thanks,

- dk

I know that the Simpsons is not available in HD, which I believe is also the case for Family Guy and American Dad.

Steve

Anyone notice on WXIN-59.1 last Sunday night for the Simpsons, Family Guy, and American Dad that there were artificial black bars on the Hi-Def signal?

The bars did not quite go to the top of the screen, so I could clearly see 16x9 content behind the black bars.

Just curious why the don't show the program in 16x9.

-- Sorry if this has been discussed, I didn't scan all 161 pages here. --

Thanks,

- dkOccasionally I will notice similar 4x3 content on the South Bend Fox affiliate's HD signal.

When displayed in widescreen mode, the top of active video seems to have scan lines that extend the full width, sitting atop black bars on the sides.

Their movement gives the illusion that widescreen video is being obscured by the black side panels beneath.

But upon closer inspection those top two or three lines are actually "stretched" video of the central 4x3 content.

It seems that whenever the Fox Network distributes 4x3 content in HD the very top lines are stretched into widescreen.

The program isn't available in 16x9, there's just some bug or gremlin that is accidentally stretching the top couple of lines of active 4x3 video content into widescreen.

More people don't notice this because the top of their screen may be hidden by overscanning or by gray panels to prevent burn-in when 16x9 content is being viewed on a 4x3 display.

anyone having trouble with nbc HD, in west lafayette. on my panny plasma it used to be 13-1 but that channel doesnt work anymore. i havent done another scan for channels, but just wondering if you guys know whats up?

i have the cable plugged directly into the tv with out the cable box.

I'm in West Lafayette and having the same problem receiving this channel with clear QAM from Comcast. Its been going on for a couple days now, I and just talked with tech-support. They claim that since I'm not a digital-cable subscriber per se, that they can't do anything about it. What a bunch of crap.

Are you receiving through cable or OTA?

I'm in West Lafayette and having the same problem receiving this channel with clear QAM from Comcast. Its been going on for a couple days now, I and just talked with tech-support. They claim that since I'm not a digital-cable subscriber per se, that they can't do anything about it. What a bunch of crap.

Are you receiving through cable or OTA?

I'm having the same issue in Fishers.

EDIT: Try channel 85.50

I'm having the same issue in Fishers.

EDIT: Try channel 85.50

I'm not seeing any 85.5. Are you receiving OTA or through the cable?

EDIT: Ok. As stated in the next post, I found the new mapping. In the West Lafayette area the channel is now coming in as 70.1 from Comcast.

I talked to Al G. at WTHR about the Comcast issue. He asked me to pass the following to the forum:

Without any warning to customers or stations Comcast has suddenly changed the digital RF lineup on most of the former Insight systems north of Indy. Among other things that have been discovered is that WTHR HD has been moved to digital channel 85.1 on at least several systems and Comcast did not get remapping to 13.1 set up correctly. In addition, a number of customers have lost some service due to services being moved to digital channels that are trapped out at the customer’s service location. Comcast asks, if you are unable to find and restore the channels by having your set do a new digital channel scan, that you call their customer service and report the problem as they have to run a tech to each customer who reports this problem to remove a trap.

I'm using my TV's built-in tuner(atsc and qam) with comcast(no top set box) and i sometimes get some random on-demand channels in the 87-89 range. If i watch them for more than about 10-20 minutes, then they dissapear.

Just something weird i've noticed.

My real question is did anybody else's ESPN dissapear? it used to be 72-something, but now its just gone. Did anybody find a way to get it back?

Oh yea, and i found this website, but i don't get half the channels it says i should...
I don't get any channels under 70.
http://www.silicondust.com/hdhomerun/lineupui?Cmd=LocationProgramsWeb&Country=US&Postcode=46234

forgot to mention, i'm in indy.

I just realized that i don't have an antenna, so there's no way i'm getting any channels that aren't from comcast... i feel kinda stupid.

But my question about ESPN still stands...

I lost WTHR on Comcast via clearQAM in Fishers (46038) today. I've had the TV scan for channels twice and it hasn't come back. It was just on 13-1, then 114-1 or something, and this past weekend it went to 85-1. And today, between noon and 1, 85-1 completely disappeared. Since I made it through the switch that Bubba Jr mentioned, I kinda doubt that it's a trap outside my apartment.

I live in Bloomington, IN, where Insight just sold out to Comcast.
My cable card that had worked perfectly for years has suddenly failed. I would assume this has to do with Comcast changing something.
Is anybody else having this problem?
I guess the obvious "solution" is to call Comcast, but I'm dreading that.

Any updates on WISH-TV in HD on DirecTV? This is getting somewhat ridiculous.

Anyone?

I live in Bloomington, IN, where Insight just sold out to Comcast.
My cable card that had worked perfectly for years has suddenly failed. I would assume this has to do with Comcast changing something.
Is anybody else having this problem?
I guess the obvious "solution" is to call Comcast, but I'm dreading that.

I live in New Castle. The switch from Insight to Comcast went pretty well for my Tivo Cable Cards. I did have an instance of the two not receiving the same channel lineup back in April. I called and confirmed the proper channel lineup that I wanted and they hit the cards with the new info and everything was fine. Or so I thought.

Later I discovered they had given me Digital Preferred + Sports Entertainment Package. I had some difficulty getting that switched back. After asking for a superviser, she transferred me to a CSR in Ft. Wayne who was extremely knowledgible about the Insight -> Comcast Indiana offerings. You may need to ask for an Indiana specialist.

I would start with a call and ask them to rehit the cards.

I haven't been able to get HD WTHR broacast through QAM for almost a month now. Anyone else in the Lafayette Area still having a problem?

I live in New Castle. The switch from Insight to Comcast went pretty well for my Tivo Cable Cards. I did have an instance of the two not receiving the same channel lineup back in April. I called and confirmed the proper channel lineup that I wanted and they hit the cards with the new info and everything was fine. Or so I thought.

Later I discovered they had given me Digital Preferred + Sports Entertainment Package. I had some difficulty getting that switched back. After asking for a superviser, she transferred me to a CSR in Ft. Wayne who was extremely knowledgible about the Insight -> Comcast Indiana offerings. You may need to ask for an Indiana specialist.

I would start with a call and ask them to rehit the cards.

A wonderful lady named Kathy from Comcast was able to fix me up over the phone in about five minutes.
She had to talk to her supervisor, but together they got me fixed right up.
I want to tell the world that (at least on this one occasion) Comcast did a great job!:)

Anyone?

What did DirecTV tell you?

The standard "We are working hard to get you all of your local channels in HD soon" non-answer.

WTWO news
http://mywabashvalley.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=439&sid=1cf414a3a928c3e6a739c53616a9e633

They will be testing the HD signal this week. Full power for WFXW and WTWO is anticipated by October.

WTWO is HD using my QAM tuner and Time Warner in Terre Haute. It's been a long wait for HD, but I can't wait for the Olympics and ND football (I'm an optimist).

Wow I need to check this thread a little more often. Yes indeed WTWO was finally in HD last night when I looked. :)

I lost WTHR on Comcast via clearQAM in Fishers (46038) today. I've had the TV scan for channels twice and it hasn't come back. It was just on 13-1, then 114-1 or something, and this past weekend it went to 85-1. And today, between noon and 1, 85-1 completely disappeared. Since I made it through the switch that Bubba Jr mentioned, I kinda doubt that it's a trap outside my apartment.

Quoting myself.. I emailed Comast about WTHR HD this week. First the gal said they had made no changes to the station number and told me to ask WTHR what they'd done. Then I told her about the 114 to 85 change that was mentioned, and she then comes back and says that she double checked and they had indeed made a change. So the first time she was just making the answer up. Her solution was for me to scan for channels again, which I had already told her I'd done several times. Oh well.

So, tonight I do the nightly scan. I now have stuff on 6.1, 8.1 and 20.1, instead of up in the 80's and 90's. And I have the guide information back. Still no WTHR HD on 13.1 or 85.1 or anywhere else though.

Quoting myself.. I emailed Comast about WTHR HD this week. First the gal said they had made no changes to the station number and told me to ask WTHR what they'd done. Then I told her about the 114 to 85 change that was mentioned, and she then comes back and says that she double checked and they had indeed made a change. So the first time she was just making the answer up. Her solution was for me to scan for channels again, which I had already told her I'd done several times. Oh well.

So, tonight I do the nightly scan. I now have stuff on 6.1, 8.1 and 20.1, instead of up in the 80's and 90's. And I have the guide information back. Still no WTHR HD on 13.1 or 85.1 or anywhere else though.

I'm having the exact same problem. I can't seem to find WTHR HD at all anymore. Comcast certainly has changed the lineup at least 3 times since they "came to power" in Lafayette. I remember even getting a letter in the mail saying they were changing their stations on May 1st (which definitely happened). I still scan every few days for channels and haven't gotten WTHR for a couple months now. Something is definitely up.

Crap! Now I seem to have lost all my HD channels through QAM! Anyone else in the Lafayette, IN area not getting any HD channels with a QAM tuner? I need to see if it is my TV or Comcast that is the problem.

Edit - I was able to get my HD channels back through QAM, but I still can't get WTHR in HD. Anyone else?

Crap! Now I seem to have lost all my HD channels through QAM! Anyone else in the Lafayette, IN area not getting any HD channels with a QAM tuner? I need to see if it is my TV or Comcast that is the problem.

Edit - I was able to get my HD channels back through QAM, but I still can't get WTHR in HD. Anyone else?

Yesterday, all my channels were returned to "normal" -- 6.1, 8.1, 13.1, 20.1, 29.1, and 59.1. Yes, I even got WTHR HD back. And the guide info.

I'm getting them all except for 13.1 (which I assume is WTHR). Comcast is supposed to send a tech on Friday (yeah 5 days from now) to come take a look because they were saying signal strength to my home is weak. I'm also have intermittent Internet issues, so I guess the two could be remotely related.

Anyone in the Terre Haute area have trouble with locals tonight (WTHI, WTWO, etc...)

I recently installed a VIP622, and my usual Terk42 antenna diplexed into the line, yesterday was getting great signal from both WTWO and WTHI, but tonight is very sporatic at best??

Anyone in the Terre Haute area have trouble with locals tonight (WTHI, WTWO, etc...)

I recently installed a VIP622, and my usual Terk42 antenna diplexed into the line, yesterday was getting great signal from both WTWO and WTHI, but tonight is very sporatic at best??

No problems watching the Stanley Cup last night...
However, I hope that they fix their 5.1 sounds sometime soon. Sounds like they have all channels coming out of all speakers. It is LOUD.

No problems watching the Stanley Cup last night...
However, I hope that they fix their 5.1 sounds sometime soon. Sounds like they have all channels coming out of all speakers. It is LOUD.


Do you live in Terre Haute? What type of OTA antenna are you using? I'm using a Terk42 (which DishNet said wasn't compatible with the Dish1000), however is working fine for WTHI, WICD (ABC Sprinfield, IL), WTWO (except today after the storm). Prior to installing the Dish1000 & VIP622, i could get WFXW, but haven't been able to tune it since the upgrade I made. I live on the north end of TH.

I sort of new to HDTV, but I have a question. Why do some of the local channels switch ratios during weather alerts (running crawl)? In fact these interuptions should not be happening, when they could be running a crawl. I'm in Indy and had to turn of WISH (total interuption and switched to 4:3) and watch WBBM-HD to finish watching my shows. I checked out some other CBS affilates in the area. This is what I found: KMOV-HD 4:3 and crawl), WTHI just a weather bug, WCIA total interuption, WHIO (crawl), WKRC (crawl), WSBT (normal programming), WANE (normal programming), WLKY (crawl), WTOL (normal programming), WEVV (normal programming).

I think the issue is they lack the correct equipment to generate the crawl in full HD thus they put it up in the older 4:3 format using their old existing equipment and upconvert to HD.

I sorta recall this has been talked of before so you might search back in this thread. Maybe one of the station engineers has explained.

Do you live in Terre Haute? What type of OTA antenna are you using? I'm using a Terk42 (which DishNet said wasn't compatible with the Dish1000), however is working fine for WTHI, WICD (ABC Sprinfield, IL), WTWO (except today after the storm). Prior to installing the Dish1000 & VIP622, i could get WFXW, but haven't been able to tune it since the upgrade I made. I live on the north end of TH.

Yes, I'm in Terre Haute... North End, near Clay County line..
I use Channel Master 4221 antenna with a Channel Master 7777 pre-amp.
I have the Dish 1000, and the 622 receiver as well.
I can't get WICD consistantly, because I have to point straight at trees.
I believe that I'm going to add another CM 4221 (or more bays), and add a rotor to my setup so that I can get WICD and others.
If I'm setup right, I can get WUSI, and WTVW (Fox) out of Evansville! I'm hoping to pull in some Indy channels as well, but I'm again pointing right at some trees when I point that way.

As of today, I get 80%+ signal strength from WTWO, but no programming... black screen, no sound, etc.

No problems watching the Stanley Cup last night...
However, I hope that they fix their 5.1 sounds sometime soon. Sounds like they have all channels coming out of all speakers. It is LOUD.

I agree the audio for NBC's Stanley Cup coverage is very challenging. It was the same last year. I often have difficulty understanding the commentators. This may in part be due to the crowd noise -- hey, it's the playoffs!!

I think the issue is they lack the correct equipment to generate the crawl in full HD thus they put it up in the older 4:3 format using their old existing equipment and upconvert to HD.

I sorta recall this has been talked of before so you might search back in this thread. Maybe one of the station engineers has explained.No need to search. That is exactly the reason. Once all station have full HD studios, it will cease. Case in point, WTHR which has HD studio can run HD crawl. So, if a station does not originate any of it OWN HD programming (news), they have to go to 4:3.

What the hell is WTHR doing tonight? My goodness...yes...we know there is weather. It's currently outside of your viewing area. Pull the map down folks. Game six of the Stanley Cup Finals......

I just noticed something else. It appears that this storm is moving NE...further from the WTHR viewing area.


update...now they drop the map and go back to the game in HD. The did this of course...after the first period had ended and during the intermission report.

I have an antenna pointing/reception question.

I am in the Noblesville area - near Verizon Wireless. I have a CM3016 up in the attic with preamp. Currently I have it pointing generally in the direction of WTTV (48). However originally I had it pointing at the group of antennas in Indy and in that direction I did get WTTK (54). I thought originally the WTTK would only be at the Indy site temporarily - is that true or will it be there permanently ? Basically which site should I be pointing at ?

I do get currently (just looking at digital)
WTHR (46)
WISH (9)
WFYI (21)
WIPB (56)
WIPX (27)
WNDY (32)
WRTV (25)
WTTV (48)
WXIN (45)

I don't really watch anything on WIPX - primarily just getting WTTV and WIPX is also in that direction. So if WTTK is going to stay where it is I would think I would be fine (if not better) pointing at Indy instead ?

I have an antenna pointing/reception question.

I am in the Noblesville area - near Verizon Wireless. I have a CM3016 up in the attic with preamp. Currently I have it pointing generally in the direction of WTTV (48). However originally I had it pointing at the group of antennas in Indy and in that direction I did get WTTK (54). I thought originally the WTTK would only be at the Indy site temporarily - is that true or will it be there permanently ? Basically which site should I be pointing at ?

I do get currently (just looking at digital)
WTHR (46)
WISH (9)
WFYI (21)
WIPB (56)
WIPX (27)
WNDY (32)
WRTV (25)
WTTV (48)
WXIN (45)

I don't really watch anything on WIPX - primarily just getting WTTV and WIPX is also in that direction. So if WTTK is going to stay where it is I would think I would be fine (if not better) pointing at Indy instead ?

A couple years ago WTTK-DT 54, Kokomo, was conducting a test by utilizing two transmitter sites (Indy and Windfall) simultaneously. Last year WTTK-DT dropped the test and went back to broadcasting from its main tower in Windfall (3.3kW @ 499 feet). As approved by the FCC, in Feb. 2009 when WTTK-29 goes off the air, WTTK-DT 54 will switch to channel 29 and will also move its transmitter site from the tower in Windfall to the WXIN tower (near 79th and Michigan Rd.). At that time WTTK-DT 29 will be operating with 624kW @ 935 feet.

Meanwhile, WTTV-DT 48 will continue operating with 870kW @ 1043 feet from Trafalgar after Feb. 2009. Sometime after WTTV-4 signs off, per a CP with the FCC, the top-mounted WTTV-4 antenna on the tower will be removed and the WTTV-DT antenna will be moved to the top of the tower instead of its current side-mounted position. WTTV-DT 48 will then operate with 750kW @ 1171 feet.

Steve

Any updates on WISH-TV in HD on DirecTV? This is getting somewhat ridiculous.

Anybody?

Yes, LIN and DirecTV finally have an agreement. We do not yet have deatils as to when we will appear, but the contract has been signed!

Tom Weber
Engineering
WISH / WNDY / WIIH / LWS

LIN, DIRECTV SET RETRANS DEAL FOR HD SIGNALS
TVNEWSDAY, Jun. 9, 8:54 AM ET
The satellite provider will carry both analog and high-def signals of LIN’s stations in 15 markets.
By Staff

LIN TV and DirecTV today announced an agreement for the retransmission of LIN TV's broadcast stations in both analog and high-definition. The deal covers television stations owned and/or operated by LIN TV in 15 markets.
Story continues after the ad
Revised Roche & Company Business & Finance News Display

The agreement covers KRQE-KASA Albuquerque, N.M.; KXAN, KNVA and KBVO Austin, Texas; WIVB-WNLO Buffalo, N.Y.; WDTN Dayton, Ohio; WANE Ft. Wayne, Ind.; WOOD, WOTV and WXSP-CA Grand Rapids, Mich.; WLUK Green Bay, Wis.; WTNH-WCTX Hartford-New Haven, Conn.; WISH-WNDY Indianapolis; WALA-WBPG Mobile, Ala.; WAVY-WVBT Norfolk, Va.; WPRI-WNAC Providence, R.I.; WWLP Springfield, Mass.; and WUPW Toledo, Ohio.

"We are pleased with the outcome of our negotiations," said LIN CEO Vincent Sadusky. "Our stations are leaders in their markets and we've made substantial investments to bring our viewers high definition digital programming. The agreement reflects fair value to both parties and is in the best interest of the consumer."
"With this agreement, DirecTV will continue to enhance its industry leading HD offer, enabling us to add more HD channels in existing DirecTV HD local markets and set the stage for roll out of more HD local channels this fall," said Dan Hartman, senior vice president, programming, DirecTV.

"We're extremely happy with this agreement that is both beneficial for our business and our customers."

Thanks Tom....Good to hear this!

Anyone else get a low level hum on WISH TV's local news on 8.1?

I have always gotten a low level hum, sounds like the HVAC system in the news room is coming through.

I have noticed this for the last couple years and it drives me crazy! I don't ever get it on anything else besides live studio shots.

You have good ears! Or, you've cranked your subwoofer <g>. We don't like it, but it's what we've got.

Tom Weber
WISH Engineering

WTHR 13 had a similar problem a few years ago. An engineering friend of mine at the station told me they installed a low cut filter on the line and that eliminated it.

Per the FCC, I just found a new CP for WTTK-DT. Some changes in ERP and antenna height have been made.

http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/tvq?list=0&facid=56526

Steve

Is anyone else having a problem with WTWO digital in Terre Haute?
I was getting NBC in HD for about 4 days before the video/sound just quit. I still receive a "signal strength" of 89% on UHF 36... but when I tune to it, I get nothing.

http://mywabashvalley.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=439&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=15

WISH-TV is now in HD on DirecTV!!!

I think it JUST happened...there were soaps on earlier that weren't, but Family Feud is letterboxed, and Criminal Minds is showing up on tonight's guide in HD. Sweeet!

Anybody been having weaker than normal signal on WISH DT 8-1?

I'm in Columbus (OTA fringe) and the past two days have seen marginal signal strength, with consequent picture problems. I checked my antennas and connections - they're all fine and no other channel is displaying weaker than normal signal strength.

Another day of US Open coverage on WTWO and no HD. Has anyone seen anything in HD on this channel recently? I really hope they get this figured out by football season.

Anyone else lose WTHR OTA? I just lost it during the US open coverage, using DISH STB. It was working fine, and all my other OTA locals come in fine, but WTHR is gone now

directv has posted a sign that says wthr has lost it's signal.

Anyone else lose WTHR OTA? I just lost it during the US open coverage, using DISH STB. It was working fine, and all my other OTA locals come in fine, but WTHR is gone now

Yea, seemed to come and go. Also weaker than normal, some of my tuners would pick it up while a newer one wouldn't. :confused: Still not coming in on the one tuner. Located just North of Anderson.

It's a shame WTHR can't notify people of technical problems, so we all won't bang our heads against the wall. I guess that shows how much they care about their viewership. Tom Weber from WISH posts here quite often, when something is going on. We thank him for that. :D

My WTHR signal is all over the map tonight. It goes from high 60s to mid 80s and is constantly changing with occasional dropouts.

Yea, seemed to come and go. Also weaker than normal, some of my tuners would pick it up while a newer one wouldn't. :confused: Still not coming in on the one tuner. Located just North of Anderson.

It's a shame WTHR can't notify people of technical problems, so we all won't bang our heads against the wall. I guess that shows how much they care about their viewership. Tom Weber from WISH posts here quite often, when something is going on. We thank him for that. :D
There were storms in the area on Sunday evening. If that HD transmitter take power hits, it will take a few minutes to reset. I am sure that's what happened. Looks good today in Indy.

I finally broke down and picked up a channel master 3010 or as I call it, The Batwing. I got it from Amazon, but, it shipped from Crutchfield, I've always been a fan of their shipping as they box the devil out of stuff.

Once it arrived I opened the big box and pulled a smallish box out of the peanuts and put it together. I wanted to get it out of kids /pets reach so I went ahead and hung it in the garage in a place that "could" work. That was Friday, my RG6 finally came on Tuesday from Monoprice so I hooked it up to see what would happen... I was not expecting much.

It seemed to work perfectly, upon the inital scan I had 18 channels, I only had 8 with rabbit ears AND I did not have CBS channels. The rabbit ears NEVER held a signal and would drop out every few moments. I got up into the attic and ran the wire, got it properly installed, back to the couch to scan again and everything was good. Saved what I wanted to my favorites list and started watching.

Letterman looked much older was one of my reactions, with SD you just can't tell.


This morning I got up to watch the news and I'm not able to get the NBC channels so I don't know what's up with that, it just says signal stregenth 0, everything else is hitting pretty decent levels and it was working just fine last night. Are dropouts a common thing?

BTW, I have the 3010 wired into a Dish box, it's the VIP 722 or something like that, my tv is a Samsung 5034

I finally broke down and picked up a channel master 3010 or as I call it, The Batwing. I got it from Amazon, but, it shipped from Crutchfield, I've always been a fan of their shipping as they box the devil out of stuff.

Once it arrived I opened the big box and pulled a smallish box out of the peanuts and put it together. I wanted to get it out of kids /pets reach so I went ahead and hung it in the garage in a place that "could" work. That was Friday, my RG6 finally came on Tuesday from Monoprice so I hooked it up to see what would happen... I was not expecting much.

It seemed to work perfectly, upon the inital scan I had 18 channels, I only had 8 with rabbit ears AND I did not have CBS channels. The rabbit ears NEVER held a signal and would drop out every few moments. I got up into the attic and ran the wire, got it properly installed, back to the couch to scan again and everything was good. Saved what I wanted to my favorites list and started watching.

Letterman looked much older was one of my reactions, with SD you just can't tell.


This morning I got up to watch the news and I'm not able to get the NBC channels so I don't know what's up with that, it just says signal stregenth 0, everything else is hitting pretty decent levels and it was working just fine last night. Are dropouts a common thing?

BTW, I have the 3010 wired into a Dish box, it's the VIP 722 or something like that, my tv is a Samsung 5034

WTHR has had problems dropping out lately. Just just OTA either. Their SD feed is fine, but the HD feed has just disappeared from time to time in the last few weeks.

That would make sense, everything else seemed to be fine. Thanks!

WTHR has had problems dropping out lately. Just just OTA either. Their SD feed is fine, but the HD feed has just disappeared from time to time in the last few weeks.Whenever it's windy, I have problems with it.

Whenever it's windy, I have problems with it.

Me too. I don't understand why, especially since I don't have problems with any other channels!

This morning I got up to watch the news and I'm not able to get the NBC channels so I don't know what's up with that, it just says signal stregenth 0, everything else is hitting pretty decent levels and it was working just fine last night. Are dropouts a common thing?Like someone said in another thread: "OTA reception is not an exact science". And to think we have to switch over and some of the digital channels wimper-out at the slightest breeze. That can be frustrating....especially when you're trying to record.

Are your antennas outside? Could the wind be moving the antenna on it's mount?

I don't use OTA much anymore but don't recall that wind had much an impact with my attic mounted antenna. Just some seasonal especially with WRTV. Leaves on the trees or something. The setup is still all there so I'll try and remember to check.

My antenna is indoors and any of the digitals can be affected by wind/rain (trees?). Can't say the same for analog, though. I wish there were a way for the locals to boost digital power. Especially WTTV.

Are your antennas outside? Could the wind be moving the antenna on it's mount?

I don't use OTA much anymore but don't recall that wind had much an impact with my attic mounted antenna. Just some seasonal especially with WRTV. Leaves on the trees or something. The setup is still all there so I'll try and remember to check.

Mine's in the attic, so it's not being blown around. It's very odd... but 100% reproducible. Maybe something at WTHR's transmitter site is being blown around? It's odd that only channel 13 is problematic.

Rain certainly makes sense as it would attenuate the signal. Don't understand wind though without it moving something at one end or the other or in between.

Rain certainly makes sense as it would attenuate the signal. Don't understand wind though without it moving something at one end or the other or in between.Think of this as a complex geometry or calculus problem.

The direct signal travels from WTHR tower to receiving antenna over distance A which is so many wavelengths at WTHR's digital frequency.

A bounced signal travels from WTHR tower to a reflector over distance B1 which is so many wavelenths and from the reflector into receiving antenna over distance B2 which is so many wavelengths.

When the signals from path A and path B1+B2 arrive at the receiving antenna "in phase" they add constructively and your digital decoder can produce a picture.

When wind causes path B1+B2 to alter, the difference in wavelengths causes the received signal to shift "out of phase" which adds destructively with signal from path A and the decoder crashes.

The reason you only see on WTHR is because it's transmitting frequency's wavelength is different from all other stations and is the only one affected by this particular reflective path.

This problem can be corrected by reaiming the receiving antenna to minimize pickup from the unwanted reflection. Or, you could try an antenna with a tighter beamwidth, too.

This particular phenomenon is called "dynamic multipath."

If this comes in the spring and goes away in the fall, you can assume it's caused by leaves on trees.

Or, the reflector may only affect WTHR's frequency when wet due to rain.

I've also noticed a drop in signal from WTHR here, just North of Anderson. I have 3 Zenith boxes DTT900's. Two of them, the ones with LG tuners, are too weak to show a picture. This seemed to start about 1 or 2 weeks ago. I've tried moving the antenna...no joy.

Does anyone from WTHR monitor this Forum? Got your ears on? :D
Hows about a heads-up, if you do?

No problem receiving WTHR-DT via an old RS VHF antenna (no preamp) in the attic at my dad's house in Kokomo (37 miles) Friday evening. Signal level was virtually where it has been for several months. Even Indy's WDTI-DT 44 with only 28kW (@ 38 miles) was occasionally decoding using the same VHF antenna. If I had a good UHF antenna in his attic, most of the Indy stations would be close to pegging the signal meter. I've tried four different CECB receivers (Zenith DTT900, Insignia NS-DXA1, Digital Stream DTX9900, Magnavox TB100MW9) with virtually the same results.

Directional antenna, to help block interference from co-channel stations (ch. 46 in the case of WTHR-DT) and correct aim of the antenna can be very critical in maximizing the signal.

Steve

Relating to ERP of DTV stations, here's a filing that will be very interesting to watch. The current maximum ERP for a UHF station, per the FCC, is 1000 kW. WTHR-DT's sister station in Columbus, OH, WBNS-DT 21 (CBS), has filed an application with the FCC requesting a power increase from 1000 kW to 1700 kW! If this gets approved, this would certainly set a new power standard for DTV stations. That kind of power would certainly turn this station into a powerhouse. Please stay tuned..........

http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/tvq?list=0&facid=71217

http://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/cgi-bin/ws.exe/prod/cdbs/pubacc/prod/eng_tv.pl?Application_id=1248285

Steve

Thanks to Trip's hard work at this site http://www.rabbitears.info/dtr.php , here are the current transition plans for WTHR-DT (from ch. 46 to ch. 13), WTTK-DT (from ch. 54 to
ch. 29), WCLJ-DT (from ch. 56 to ch. 42) and WIPB-DT (from ch. 52 to ch. 23).

http://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/prod/cdbs/forms/prod/getattachment_exh.cgi?exhibit_id=619743

http://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/prod/cdbs/forms/prod/getattachment_exh.cgi?exhibit_id=619582

http://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/cgi-bin/ws.exe/prod/cdbs/forms/prod/cdbsmenu.hts?context=25&appn=101234265&formid=387&fac_num=68007 (see Exhibits section at bottom)

http://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/cgi-bin/ws.exe/prod/cdbs/forms/prod/cdbsmenu.hts?context=25&appn=101231790&formid=387&fac_num=3646 (see Exhibits section at bottom)

Steve

Thanks to Trip's hard work at this site http://www.rabbitears.info/dtr.php , here are the current transition plans for WTHR-DT (from ch. 46 to ch. 13), WTTK-DT (from ch. 54 to
ch. 29), WCLJ-DT (from ch. 56 to ch. 42) and WIPB-DT (from ch. 52 to ch. 23).

http://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/prod/cdbs/forms/prod/getattachment_exh.cgi?exhibit_id=619743

http://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/prod/cdbs/forms/prod/getattachment_exh.cgi?exhibit_id=619582

http://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/cgi-bin/ws.exe/prod/cdbs/forms/prod/cdbsmenu.hts?context=25&appn=101234265&formid=387&fac_num=68007 (see Exhibits section at bottom)

http://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/cgi-bin/ws.exe/prod/cdbs/forms/prod/cdbsmenu.hts?context=25&appn=101231790&formid=387&fac_num=3646 (see Exhibits section at bottom)

Steve

Looks like WNDY (http://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/cgi-bin/ws.exe/prod/cdbs/forms/prod/cdbsmenu.hts?context=25&appn=101234453&formid=387&fac_num=28462) is ready to go to Channel 32.

Looks like WNDY (http://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/cgi-bin/ws.exe/prod/cdbs/forms/prod/cdbsmenu.hts?context=25&appn=101234453&formid=387&fac_num=28462) is ready to go to Channel 32.

I bet this whole switch-over doesn't go as smooth as Y2K did! :D

I've not posted on here in a long time, but was wondering if there's any information on when WTTV, WFYI, WTIU or WNDY would be coming to U-Verse in HD in Indy/Greenwood. Just had the service installed and was wondering if anybody have any information. The people I've talked to at AT&T say they are rolling out more local HD city by city, but no specifics.

Is anyone here a customer who was with Insight, but was taken over by Comcast? I have some interesting info...

Here in Greenfield we have a situation that I like to call...an information black hole. Of course, Comcast has taken over the local Insight customers and the transition has progressed slowly during the last several months. We are still serviced by the same employees out of Anderson in this area. They just answer the phones with a different tag line now. The former Insight employees are incredible. They treat you like they are your neighbor and they are so honest and realistic when giving you information. They tell you things that other Cable companies probably wouldn't tell customers. Comcast is slow in getting the information about changes to these employees and if you call a traditional Comcast office...they hardly even know we exist.

Anyway...enough with my rant. I spoke with several people yesterday (in Anderson) regarding upcoming changes in the service for our area. I was told more than once that there is a meeting held each week in the local (former Insight) offices. They ask their supervisors they same questions that we call and ask them. When will we get more HD? They were told this week that several more HD channels would be added in July. They have not yet been told how many, which ones, or on when in July. I have two thoughts on what may happen...

1. Many, many, many of the former Insight customers are located in what are basically suburbs of Indianapolis. Indianapolis customers have several HD channels which we do not have:

NFL-HD
DSC-HD (we already have Discovery HD Theater...this is Discovery HD)
APL-HD
SCIFI-HD
USA-HD
TBS-HD
HDDM (HD On Demand)
SCI-HD
HSTRY-HD
MAX-HD

I can't think of anything off the top of my head that isn't in that list...that could be added locally. I wonder if any or all of these are planned for July? Some of these channels are included in my next thought.

2. There are several channels in particular which we already have and are digital, but not HD. On particular shows on these channels (programs which are available in HD) there is a very interesting set of letters included in the "info". It says, "HD". This notation does not appear on all channels which have an HD version/twin...only a few:

DSC-HD
APL-HD
SCIFI-HD
USA-HD
TBS-HD
SCI-HD
HSTRY-HD

I have not checked NFL Network or Cinemax.

Could it be that these channels are being prepped for HD and that is why "HD" is listed at the being of the info for some programs? I'd be happy to gain one or two of those if I get to keep HDNet Movies. I'm paying $6.99 or $7.99 just for HDNet and HDNet Movies.

A couple of questions and comments:

I, too, am a former Insight customer in New Castle.

Did you get additional channels May 1st with a new rate structure April 1st? We did. I know we are served from the Anderson headend but I am not sure that Greenfield is. Of course you can still receive customer service from the Anderson office without being on the Anderson headend. We used to receive customer service from the Richmond office while being fed from the Anderson headend.

My transistion has gone rather smoothly except for some billing issues. They closed the New Castle office and left us with a converter and bill pay drop box. How do you contact the Anderson office? We have never been provided with their number and only have access to the national call centers.

Once when calling about billing issues, I was finally transferred to a former Insight employee in Ft. Wayne. And yes, the Insight employees are wonderful. She understood my problem and took care of it immediately.

At least some of the new HD channels you listed are being transmitted on a 3:1 QAM from HITS in Denver to SOME Comcast systems as detailed in this thread: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1008271 The last time I spoke (a couple of months ago) to a Comcast buddy of mine in Indianapolis, he was unaware of any systems in Indiana that had been converted to this system. This is an extremely long and highly charged thread and I hope we don't have to deal with this issue after any "upgrades". Recent posts to the thread don't seem to address the quality reduction issue so it is possible that Comcast has taken steps to reduce the effects of the 3:1 compression.

According to the new rate bill stuffer and the new programming package stuffer I received, HDTheater and HD Net Movies are included in my normal rate and are no longer charged extra as was the Insight policy.

And speaking of rates.... I received plenty of info from Comcast about changes to the TV programming packages and rates, info about how to transistion my internet from Insight to Comcast, but absolutely nothing about changes to internet service rates. My last bill dropped the $10 tv/internet bundle discount with no warning. I called and asked about this and they said they would mail me the appropriate notification of internet rates. I have not received it yet and I still haven't received a reprint of my April bill which I had asked for (twice) after not receiving it.

This is interesting news. I wouldn't mind receiving a few more digital/HD channels, particularly the ones you listed.

A couple of questions and comments:

I, too, am a former Insight customer in New Castle.

Did you get additional channels May 1st with a new rate structure April 1st? We did. I know we are served from the Anderson headend but I am not sure that Greenfield is. Of course you can still receive customer service from the Anderson office without being on the Anderson headend. We used to receive customer service from the Richmond office while being fed from the Anderson headend.

My transistion has gone rather smoothly except for some billing issues. They closed the New Castle office and left us with a converter and bill pay drop box. How do you contact the Anderson office? We have never been provided with their number and only have access to the national call centers.

Once when calling about billing issues, I was finally transferred to a former Insight employee in Ft. Wayne. And yes, the Insight employees are wonderful. She understood my problem and took care of it immediately.

At least some of the new HD channels you listed are being transmitted on a 3:1 QAM from HITS in Denver to SOME Comcast systems as detailed in this thread: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1008271 The last time I spoke (a couple of months ago) to a Comcast buddy of mine in Indianapolis, he was unaware of any systems in Indiana that had been converted to this system. This is an extremely long and highly charged thread and I hope we don't have to deal with this issue after any "upgrades". Recent posts to the thread don't seem to address the quality reduction issue so it is possible that Comcast has taken steps to reduce the effects of the 3:1 compression.

According to the new rate bill stuffer and the new programming package stuffer I received, HDTheater and HD Net Movies are included in my normal rate and are no longer charged extra as was the Insight policy.

And speaking of rates.... I received plenty of info from Comcast about changes to the TV programming packages and rates, info about how to transistion my internet from Insight to Comcast, but absolutely nothing about changes to internet service rates. My last bill dropped the $10 tv/internet bundle discount with no warning. I called and asked about this and they said they would mail me the appropriate notification of internet rates. I have not received it yet and I still haven't received a reprint of my April bill which I had asked for (twice) after not receiving it.

This is interesting news. I wouldn't mind receiving a few more digital/HD channels, particularly the ones you listed.

I am almost positive that Greenfield is served from the Anderson headend as well. We received the new lineup on May 1st as well. However, that was just a few days after our service was installed so I hadn't had it long enough to notice the changes from before and after. (We did have Insight once before about 2 years ago and the went to Dish for a while) FYI...they also told me that Big Ten Network is coming in August, but couldn't tell me if we are getting the SD & HD feed or just SD.

As far as billing is concerned...I'm hardly paying anything right now. The technician screwed up the install so much that I now have credits everywhere. I haven't seen a paper bill yet. (my wife gets the mail and all I see is the junk mail)

As far as calling is concerned I don't bother with the toll free number. The Comcast/Insight office in Anderson is listed in the phone book (411.com for me) as Insight and the local number is listed. I just call them directly.

Does heat and humidity affect OTA signals?

Anyone know why the DT channels OTA come in much better after dark??

I usually get signal strengths from 75-95% from WICD, WTHI, WTWO, but all of them are very sporatic dropouts during the heat of the day. But after the sunsets and it cools a bit, never a problem??

I really can't see the stations power outputs fluxuating that much.

TV stations operate with the same power day and night. The changes you are seeing relate to signal propagation, where changes in weather and atmospheric conditions can affect the signal between the TV tower and your receiving antenna. For more information go here http://www.dxfm.com/ and then click "Signal Propagation."

Steve

Indy's WHMB-DT 16 (40.1, 40.2) has filed an application with the FCC to switch to channel 20, (following the sign-off of WFYI-20) and to raise the power from 225 kW (with a directional antenna) to 530 kW (with a non-directional antenna).

Indianapolis, IN
WHMB 40 16 16 284m 225. kW DA 20 302m 530. kW ND

Steve

Another night of storms and our nasty locals are at it again. LIN-TV's WISH-HD is the worst of the bunch completely interupting CBS programming and down converting HD. Their weather team constantly covers weather and warnings that are completely out of their viewing area. Lucky I have many choices for CBS and am confortably watching WBBM-HD that is not down converting.

Looking at upgrading my antenna from a Terk Clip-on to either the DB4 or Square Shooter.

I really don't want an antenna w/ rotor.

I'm located at 47804.

WTHI, WTWO, WFXW -- all at 180 degrees (18 mi.)
WICD -- at 329 degrees (48 mi.)
anything else (perhaps in Indy would be bonus)

** Would one of these be better than the other?? I can get all 4 now, if conditions are right. TWO & FXW will be going full power in October.

I usually get WICD at 60-75%, but with excessive dropouts during daylight hours. The Terre Haute Stations are not an issue, really thinking I could point the antenna towards Champaign and still pick up Terre Haute on the back side? Sound doable?

This is listed as being in HD. I am getting 5.1 audio, but no HD video...just 4:3 SD. Anyone else?

UPDATE:

I called our local affiliate and they have no clue. They said they are looking into it. They said that the movie may not be in HD. I doubt that since I am still getting the 5.1 audio.

It's also 4:3 on the Elkhart-South Bend FOX affiliate.

Afterwards I noticed the commercials were widescreen.

Is anyone else having massive problems with WFYI? I've had great reception until about a week ago and now I cannot record anything via OTA as the signal is too weak. I've got an antenna on my roof and am about 20 miles from the tower. Haven't had a problem since going OTA, but now it's garbage.

Another windy day and WTHR is breaking up like crazy with lots of signal loss. Last night the signal was a steady 85% on my Dish 622. Today, with the wind, it's bouncing around from the upper 60s to the mid 80s (and the antenna is in the attic).

Could this be a problem with trees? And why only WTHR - all the other stations are pretty solid (with 2% or 3% variation at the most)?

Extremely windy over the last few days; having some problems with most channels. Nearby trees probably don't help....I'd knock 'em all down if I could.

It sounds like you're experiencing an issue with multipath. The strong signal bounces off of trees, buildings, etc. between the TV tower and your receiving antenna. The stronger the signal, the more chances it will bounce around, and within the immediate Indy city limits, WTHR-DT has the most powerful signal at 1000 kW. A combination of the right antenna, to help tame the multipath by rejecting the reflected signals, and one of the newer receivers which does the best at handling the remaining reflected signals, is the best solution. Antenna aim is also very important. Sometimes the multipath signal can be as strong as the true non-reflected signal.
http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ANTENNAS/glossaryG.html#multipath

If you're using an outdoor antenna and have multipath issues, the yagi-type antennas usually handle multipath better than the bowtie-type (dipole) antennas. The more directional the antenna, the better it will reject multipath signals (from the sides and rear).
http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ANTENNAS/types.html

Steve

I am in Indianapolis on the far Northside and have been using an amplified indoor antenna. I get the usual catches. I put the indoor antenna by a window and I now receive WIPB 49.1 & 49.2, WTIU 30.1, 30.2 & 30.3, WLWT 5.1 & 5.2 & WKRC 12.1 & 12.2. This also improved 63.1, 63.2, 63.3, 63.4, 42.1, 42.2, 42.3, 42.4, & 42.5. My question if I put up a good rooftop (2 story) antenna (Channel Master 3671 or Winegard HD8200U) with amps and rotor, what should I expect to find? I hear that WLFI & WICD might come in. Anyone in Indy with a Deep Fringe antenna please chime in on what you can pull in. I would imagine Cincinnati, Dayton, Louisville, ???. I was just wondering if the money spent would be worth it. Thanks

Anybody else still having trouble with WTHR? I can't get through a full 30 minute show without some sort of break up, but, my signal strength never seems to drop below 75, it's at 84 now and still breaking up. When it's good, it's a beautiful picture so I assume I'm getting a good enough signal.

Should I look at some sort of amp or just try a different mounting location? It's just for 1 channel, but, we watch WTHR a LOT.

I am in Indianapolis on the far Northside and have been using an amplified indoor antenna. I get the usual catches. I put the indoor antenna by a window and I now receive WIPB 49.1 & 49.2, WTIU 30.1, 30.2 & 30.3, WLWT 5.1 & 5.2 & WKRC 12.1 & 12.2. This also improved 63.1, 63.2, 63.3, 63.4, 42.1, 42.2, 42.3, 42.4, & 42.5. My question if I put up a good rooftop (2 story) antenna (Channel Master 3671 or Winegard HD8200U) with amps and rotor, what should I expect to find? I hear that WLFI & WICD might come in. Anyone in Indy with a Deep Fringe antenna please chime in on what you can pull in. I would imagine Cincinnati, Dayton, Louisville, ???. I was just wondering if the money spent would be worth it. Thanks

On a regular basis, don't EXPECT daily reception of stations much beyond the line-of-sight range from the transmitting tower. For most stations around here that would be approximately 45 - 60 miles. Stations from Cincinnati, Louisville and Champaign are in the neighborhood of 95 - 115 miles away. They can be received from time to time when signal propagation is up, usually courtesy of tropospheric enhancement.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_propagation#Diffraction

With the right location, antenna and receiver several of the area stations outside Indy are possible to receive in the Indy area, including WIPB-DT, Muncie, WLFI-DT, Lafayette and WTIU-DT, Bloomington.

Steve

Okay, before I go one way or the other...

Anyone in Terre Haute using either a DB4 or Square Shooter SS2000?

All I want to receive is the 3 TH stations and WICD from Champaign, wondering which would be better?

Any input at all is always appreciated.

I think I am going to try and roof mount my antenna and see if there is any improvement. What should I use for a grounding block?

I think I am going to try and roof mount my antenna and see if there is any improvement. What should I use for a grounding block?

Something like this http://www.radioshack.com/sm-2-4ghz-single-grounding-block--pi-2150597.html Should be available at Lowes, Menards, hardware stores, etc. I bought one at Ace Hardware yesterday for a new install at my location.

Steve

Great, thanks!

Besides the application from WHMB-DT 16 to switch to channel 20 post-transition and increase power (posted above), ten other area DTV stations recently filed applications with the FCC for power increases.

WTTV-DT 48 @ 1171' from 750 kW DA to 1000 kW ND
WRTV-DT 25 @ 964' from 898 kW ND to 1000 kW ND
WISH-DT 9 @ 932' from 19.5 kW ND to 22.8 kW ND
WTHR-DT 13 @ 981' from 15.1 kW ND to 22 kW ND
WDTI-DT 44 @ 961' from 28 kW ND to 1000 kW DA
WTTK-DT 29 @ 984' from 410 kW ND to 780 kW DA
WCLJ-DT 42 @ 1030' from 391 kW ND to 900 kW ND
WTIU-DT 14 @ 725' from 224 kW DA to 1000 kW DA
WIPB-DT 23 @ 807' from 79.1 kW ND to 250 kW ND
WTHI-DT 10 @ 961' from 14.18 kW ND to 30 kW ND

DA = Directional Antenna
ND = Non-Directional Antenna

Steve

WTTV-DT 48 @ 1171' from 750 kW DA to 1000 kW ND
Good.

I'm going thru FIOS withdrawal after having moved from Fort Wayne to Carmel. Sadly you never know how good you've got it until it's gone.

I should have checked this site earlier before signing up with Brighthouse as it appears Comcast is now an option after they bought up Insight. Is it worth switching to Comcast or waiting for the supposed new and improved channel guide from Brighthouse/roadrunner?

I'm going thru FIOS withdrawal after having moved from Fort Wayne to Carmel. Sadly you never know how good you've got it until it's gone.

I should have checked this site earlier before signing up with Brighthouse as it appears Comcast is now an option after they bought up Insight. Is it worth switching to Comcast or waiting for the supposed new and improved channel guide from Brighthouse/roadrunner?

Have you had a chance to see the channel lineup for Comcast customers in former Insight territory? I am one of those customers and here is my lineup:

906 NBC HDTV-WTHR HD
908 ABC HDTV-WRTV HD
910 FOX HDTV-WXIN HD
912 CBS HDTV-WISH HD
914 CW HDTV-WTTV HD
916 PBS DIGITAL-WFYI HD
9?? - another PBS channel was just added
919 CNN HD
921 VSGLF HD
922 FSNHD
923 ESPN HDTV
924 ESPN2 HD
925 TNT IN HD
927 NGCHD
*928 HD Net
930 DISNEY HD
931 FAMILY HD
935 Discovery HDTV (HD Theater)
937 UNIVERSAL HD
940 A&E HD
942 HGTV HD
943 FOOD HD
945 MHD
946 MOJO
*949 HD Net Movies
951 AMC HD
952 HBO EAST HD
953 STARZ HD
954 Showtime East HD

HDNet and HDNet Movies are part of a seperate "HD" package @ $6.99/month

I wouldn't be surprised if something else was added in the next month or two. We are getting NFL Network HD and Big Ten Network HD in August.

Keep in mind that those in Indianapolis are getting a few additional channels. (such as TBS-HD, USA-HD, SCI-HD, SCIFI-HD, Discovery-HD, etc.)

Also, we do not currently get HD On Demand, but Indianapolis does. The channel lineup on comcast.com is incorrect and has not been updated.

What are you getting with Brighthouse? (I'm editing this to answer my own question)

It appears that this is your current lineup:

High Definition TV**

704 WTTV-HD (CW)
706 WRTV-HD (ABC)
708 WISH-HD (CBS)
710 WFYI-HD (PBS)
711 WXIN-HD (FOX)
713 WTHR-HD (NBC)
720 HBO HD
721 HBO West HD
723 TBS HD
730 Showtime HD
731 Showtime West HD
732 Discovery HD
733 Discovery HD Theater
734 A&E-HD
735 TNT-HD
738 CNN-HD
751 Animal Planet HD
755 History Channel-HD
760 ESPN - HD
761 ESPN2-HD
767 National Geographic-HD
770 HGTV-HD
774 MHD(Music:High Definition)-HD

HD Choice Pak**

750 Mojo
752 HD Net
753 HD Net Movies
754 Universal HD
797 HD Showcase On Demand

Is this correct?

I'm going thru FIOS withdrawal after having moved from Fort Wayne to Carmel. Sadly you never know how good you've got it until it's gone.

I should have checked this site earlier before signing up with Brighthouse as it appears Comcast is now an option after they bought up Insight. Is it worth switching to Comcast or waiting for the supposed new and improved channel guide from Brighthouse/roadrunner?

Carmel is served by Bright House (formerly TWC, not Insight), as are some areas in Indianapolis/Marion Co. Some areas of Carmel are also served by AT&T's Uverse, which is similar to FIOS.

Steve

Carmel is served by Bright House (formerly TWC, not Insight), as are some areas in Indianapolis/Marion Co. Some areas of Carmel are also served by AT&T's Uverse, which is similar to FIOS.

Steve
It appears that Comcast is available in parts of Carmel as well.

That's true, I live in Carmel...well Carmel address but actually in the Westfield area by Walmart, and I have Comcast. I have the HD channels that jrcorwin mentioned 906 - 954. I'm new to the area, but i'm surprised how comcast has different HD programming for various areas around Indy. Just seems wierd to me.

That's true, I live in Carmel...well Carmel address but actually in the Westfield area by Walmart, and I have Comcast. I have the HD channels that jrcorwin mentioned 906 - 954. I'm new to the area, but i'm surprised how comcast has different HD programming for various areas around Indy. Just seems wierd to me.

Well, we used to be serviced by Insight Communications in these areas. I'm assuming that Indianapolis, Carmel, and Greenfield will have identical channel lineups in the future. Who knows though...Comcast is horrible about communicating information to employees, let alone customers.

Cterrell73, that's very similar to Bright House, too. There are various BH service areas in the Indy area and the channel line-up varies from location to location. I live in Hamilton County, have an Indy address but receive cable service from Bright House (Carmel). Some of the service boundary lines are very fuzzy.

According to the BH website, there are some additional HD channels coming soon.
http://www.mybrighthouse.com/about_us/press_releases/hdindiana.aspx

Steve

I see.....well... I will just wait patiently........It would be cool to have discoveryHD, HistoryHD and SciFi HD.

Hell's Kitchen is not widescreen tonight on WXIN (59). It's not filmed in HD, but is WS SD. It's the season finale...what a joke guys.

UPDATE: I sent a message to WXIN complaining and I also called last night. They also found it necessary to have 4 bugs on the screen at all times. I can understand the weather information, but come on...

I see.....well... I will just wait patiently........It would be cool to have discoveryHD, HistoryHD and SciFi HD.

Well honestly, don't just sit and wait patiently. Everyone one of us who lives in the Comcast area that is in Hamilton County are considered "transition" folks from Insight. Therefore, we have typically less HD channels than other areas do. For Example, I used to live just south of 96th ST on Allisonville in Castleton and IN ADDITION to the HD channels i have here in Fishers on Comcast, I also had NFL Network HD and the ones you mentioned among others.

So, being patient and waiting doesn't do anything. I call them at least twice a month and ask when are we getting more HD channels...when are we getting the channels you specifically stated in HD b/c those are 3 we should be getting for sure. Are we going to get NFL Network HD? are we getting Big Ten Network HD?

We should be getting these channels and we aren't. If we the customer don't call and bitch or at least question it, then they are never going to be concerned about bringing us those channels b/c they can get away with providing us with what they have now. Since the transition and they added some additional channels a couple months ago, I have called at least 6 times about this and spoken to a supervisor and have told them it is becoming a concern that I'm not getting the HD channels I could get though DirecTV, DISH or UVerse...you have to make it known that their failure to provide these channels could cost them a customer. The more of us that call about it, then the more customers they might lose and actually listen and begin to think about doing something about it.

Well honestly, don't just sit and wait patiently. Everyone one of us who lives in the Comcast area that is in Hamilton County are considered "transition" folks from Insight. Therefore, we have typically less HD channels than other areas do. For Example, I used to live just south of 96th ST on Allisonville in Castleton and IN ADDITION to the HD channels i have here in Fishers on Comcast, I also had NFL Network HD and the ones you mentioned among others.

So, being patient and waiting doesn't do anything. I call them at least twice a month and ask when are we getting more HD channels...when are we getting the channels you specifically stated in HD b/c those are 3 we should be getting for sure. Are we going to get NFL Network HD? are we getting Big Ten Network HD?

We should be getting these channels and we aren't. If we the customer don't call and bitch or at least question it, then they are never going to be concerned about bringing us those channels b/c they can get away with providing us with what they have now. Since the transition and they added some additional channels a couple months ago, I have called at least 6 times about this and spoken to a supervisor and have told them it is becoming a concern that I'm not getting the HD channels I could get though DirecTV, DISH or UVerse...you have to make it known that their failure to provide these channels could cost them a customer. The more of us that call about it, then the more customers they might lose and actually listen and begin to think about doing something about it.

Ok, I'll share with you what I have been told. I have had some communication with a gentleman by the name of Mark Apple. He a Regional Vice President for Comcast...our region. I got a little angry one day and emailed everyone at Comcast I could and he happened to respond. I'll post some of his messages below...

Here is his first response.

from Apple, Mark <Mark_Apple@cable.comcast.com>
to J###### ##### <#####@gmail.com>
date Thu, Jul 3, 2008 at 11:01 AM
subject RE: An Unhappy Customer
mailed-by cable.comcast.com

Jul 3 (7 days ago)



Thanks for your e-mail. I’m sorry that you haven’t received entirely accurate information to date. Please be assured that Comcast is making HDTV a priority for ALL of our systems in 2008. However, offering HD On Demand in the former Insight systems isn’t as simple as flipping a switch. While I can’t give you a timetable for offering HD On Demand in Greenfield, it is something that we are committed to. When we have an announcement, you will receive information via mail and, hopefully, local media.



Thanks,


Mark Apple

I then asked specifically about the deployment of new HD channels.

Second response.

from Apple, Mark <Mark_Apple@cable.comcast.com>
to ######## ###### <#####@gmail.com>
date Thu, Jul 3, 2008 at 1:24 PM
subject RE: An Unhappy Customer
mailed-by cable.comcast.com

Jul 3 (7 days ago)


Mr. #######,

Please correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe we added 10 HD channels in Greenfield on May 1. We will also add NFL Network and Big 10 Network in HD next month. More is planned for later in the year, but I can’t be more specific at this time.

Thanks,

Mark Apple

I then mentioned that I believe those new channels were added in March and not May.

Third and final response.

from Apple, Mark <Mark_Apple@cable.comcast.com>
to ####### ###### <#####@gmail.com>
date Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 8:20 AM
subject RE: An Unhappy Customer
mailed-by cable.comcast.com

Jul 7 (3 days ago)



Mr. #####,

I confirmed with our Marketing Dept. that we added 11 HD channels on May 1 (A&E HD, ABC Family HD, CNN HD, Disney Channel HD, Food Network HD, MOJO HD, Versus/Golf Channel HD, AMC HD, HGTV HD, National Geographic HD, STARZ HD). The other channels you mention are likely to be added later this year, although a date has not yet been set.



Have a great week.


Mark Apple

So, there you have it...

Thanks jrcorwin for the info.

I then mentioned that I believe those new channels were added in March and not May.


I can confirm that those HD channels were added on May 1 in New Castle as promised in an earlier letter from Comcast.

Thanks jrcorwin for the info.

You are very welcome. I've also been in communication with someone else, but this person works out of Anderson. This person is going to let me know if any news floats their way. I'll keep you posted.

I can confirm that those HD channels were added on May 1 in New Castle as promised in an earliear letter from Comcast.

Alright, well that settles that I guess. My first thought about May 1 was that I should take it easy on them in that case. Then, I had a second thought...hell no. I don't blame the former insight employees who now service us out of Anderson. They have been wonderful and very helpful. They are always willing to give out information, but unfortunately Comcast doesn't often give them much to work with. I will be happy once we have what the Indianapolis customers have. If they can't provide us with that yet...I wish they would at the very least tell us what they are doing about it and what kind of time line they are working with. I can't tell you how much respect I would have for a company who provided their customers with updates like that. So that we would at least know that they are working on it.

How has OTA been for everyone the past few days? My biggest issue has been WTHR and since the storm a few nights ago it's been crystal clear with hardly any drop outs... wonder if a tree in the path got knocked over or if something got fixed? All I know is I am tired of paying for locals but have to continue doing so as I cannot rely on ota for the dvr.

Alright, well that settles that I guess. My first thought about May 1 was that I should take it easy on them in that case. Then, I had a second thought...hell no. I don't blame the former insight employees who now service us out of Anderson. They have been wonderful and very helpful. They are always willing to give out information, but unfortunately Comcast doesn't often give them much to work with. I will be happy once we have what the Indianapolis customers have. If they can't provide us with that yet...I wish they would at the very least tell us what they are doing about it and what kind of time line they are working with. I can't tell you how much respect I would have for a company who provided their customers with updates like that. So that we would at least know that they are working on it.



Thanks for the PM, I'm glad you brought my attention to this and thanks for sharing the information you have received. I can also confirm the HD Channels were added May 1st. Personally, I'm not too concerned about the HD OnDemand stuff. I'm more interested in getting the channels themselves, specifically the ones you mentioned.

I'm glad they are bringing NFL HD and BTN HD on board in August, I had been told that once as well, but could never confirm it with anyone. I agree, Comcast's information dissemination to the front line employees and customer service reps is very poor. I certainly don't blame the front line employees for lack of information, but Comcast itself. I really don't like being on Comcast to be honest. But, the problem is a neighbor has UVerse and their PQ is very shoddy HD wise. I could go DISH, but the only way that works out the same price for my phone/internet/TV package is if I go with their DSL service and I really don't want to go DSL. I could go DirectTV, but then I'd lose the discount for Internet service through Comcast and the pricing of those services combined would be about $30 per month more based on the programming I want.

So, it would be nice if Comcast would get it together and get the HD channels that other systems have to us as well. I realize this is a bandwidth issue for them and from what I understand Insight's network was not very well planned from the point of being able to expand in this area. So, they basically need to upgrade the network quality here to provide us those channels. Well, the way I look at it is, they bought it, so they should provide it. My bill has already gone up $17 from what it was when I was with Insight, so if I'm paying more, I expect more programming.

I was on here about 3 months ago looking at an antenna setup to install on my house. I am currently up in lafayette (47909) and my plan is to put a CM 4228 about 25-28 feet off the ground. It will be run to a CM 7777 pre-amp. Hopefully it pulls in the upper VHF channels as well or else i'll need to add another antenna. My question now is... what is the best (least loss) cable for me to run. I will end up having about 150 feet of cable run. Half of that is pre-run under the house and is rg-6. I don't know what kind, but at least its not rg-59. I am wiring up the outside of the house from the antenna to the cable box outside which splits 2 ways. One is for the living room and one is for the master bedroom. I read that db loss is around 6 per 100' of cable so i should be looking at 9db of cable loss and 3.5 of splitter loss. The 7777 pre-amp is rated at 22 and 26 db amplification on UHF and VHF, so i was thinking that would be plenty to cover the losses I had. If I am misinterpreting that please let me know. I will have a DC block on one of the cable runs at the splitter which is .75 db loss so it should still be around 10 db loss for that run. Anyways... that the background and what i'll be ordering this week unless anyone has any suggestions or comments. My main concern now is with the long (150 ft) cable run, but there isn't really a way around that unless i run wire up through the windows :)

Good news for those with expanded basic cable on Avenue in Vincennes/Washington, IN area. I discovered my HDTV picked up some network HD feeds:

FOX WTVW-DT Evansville ch 7-11 720p 16:9
CBS WTHI-DT Terre Haute ch 10-1 1080i 16:9
NBC-WFIE-DT Evansville 14-11 1080i 16:9
PBS-WVUT-DT Vincennes 22-1 and 22-2 1080i 16:9
ABC-WEHT-DT Evansville 25-1 720p 16:9
WEHT Weather Evansville 25-2 480i

I was on here about 3 months ago looking at an antenna setup to install on my house. I am currently up in lafayette (47909) and my plan is to put a CM 4228 about 25-28 feet off the ground. It will be run to a CM 7777 pre-amp. Hopefully it pulls in the upper VHF channels as well or else i'll need to add another antenna. My question now is... what is the best (least loss) cable for me to run. I will end up having about 150 feet of cable run. Half of that is pre-run under the house and is rg-6. (...) My main concern now is with the long (150 ft) cable run, but there isn't really a way around that unless i run wire up through the windows :)


For what it's worth, my cable run is ~130', without any junctions between CM7777 and the tuner. No splitter, either. My cable is RG-6.

I'm not experienced in the math of signal loss; all I can offer is that you'll just have to see how everything works out. Hopefully, it will be for the best!

I’ve read through about the last year of posts here, so forgive me if I missed the answers to these questions.

I will be moving to West Lafayette in a month or so from California. I am interested in getting Direct Tv (I currently have it with a roommate here in CA, so I know the basics). However, I will be setting up a new account in West Lafayette. I will be living just north of Purdue near the US 231 and RT 52 intersection.

I am in a major market here in CA, so my locals in HD are included through my dish (no OTA needed). I do have a cheap OTA indoor hooked up to the TV, but I live very close to the tower, so I never have to worry about signal.

1) I follow Purdue and recall on their message boards some problem with the locals being on direct tv due to one of the local CBS affiliates? I guess that the rest of the affiliates that D* would put on come from Indy, but the local Lafayette CBS didn’t like this and somehow blocked things? IS this correct? Have they resolved this issue?

2) If I cannot get locals in HD from Direct TV, how are the signals OTA? Will I need an outdoor antenna or will a amplified indoor do ok?

3) Will the new Direct tv satellite being turned on in Aug/Sept 2008 bring in the locals in HD to Lafayette?

4) What RSN (regional sports network) is included with the standard Direct tv package in West Lafayette? Basically, I’m looking for Comcast Sports Net Chicago. Since the Cubs MLB territory includes IN, MLB extra innings will not carry the games (they will be blacked out). That means I would need to subscribe to a package that gets CSN Chicago. I’m just trying to see if I can get CSNC on my standard package or have to order the sports package (which includes all the RSNs).

Thanks

Anyone hear of any updates on WRTV or WISH going HD for local news?

No wonder WTHR consistently comes out on top...

I have a question, I would like to recieve more HD channels. I currently have just a terk rabbit ears with pass through button. I only get 10.1 and 10.2, and would like to get 2.1 and 38.1 and more if I could. But I live in a apt., so I can't put anything outside. I live up about 10 miles (or 15, haven't really seen how many) north of 70 basically just of 41. My bedroom does face west, if that matters.

I have a question, I would like to recieve more HD channels. I currently have just a terk rabbit ears with pass through button. I only get 10.1 and 10.2, and would like to get 2.1 and 38.1 and more if I could. But I live in a apt., so I can't put anything outside. I live up about 10 miles (or 15, haven't really seen how many) north of 70 basically just of 41. My bedroom does face west, if that matters.
To tv insider:

You should be able to pick up WICD-DT easily, and perhaps on a good night WCIA-DT from the Champaign area. WICD's transmitter is located between C-U and Danville near Fithian Illinois and broadcasts from an antenna at around 1300 feet. WCIA is further west near Seymour, west of C-U, and has a much shorter antenna position. WICD is at 950 kw, and WCIA is at 1000kw.

Good luck.

Alright, first... i feel like a few posts have been deleted from the past week or two. Anyone else notice this?

Anyways... I've had some problems picking up WTTK in the past week or so. I looked it up on wiki and it has the same tower location as WXIN and has a more powerful transmitter, but I still cannot pull in WTTK but WXIN is flawless (around 80-90% strength) Does anyone know why I'd have problems getting it from the southside of lafayette with a CM 4228?

Thanks,
Tom

Alright, first... i feel like a few posts have been deleted from the past week or two. Anyone else notice this?

Anyways... I've had some problems picking up WTTK in the past week or so. I looked it up on wiki and it has the same tower location as WXIN and has a more powerful transmitter, but I still cannot pull in WTTK but WXIN is flawless (around 80-90% strength) Does anyone know why I'd have problems getting it from the southside of lafayette with a CM 4228?

Thanks,
Tom

Yep, there was a big system crash at the beginning of the month. A few days' worth of posts were lost.

Alright, first... i feel like a few posts have been deleted from the past week or two. Anyone else notice this?

Anyways... I've had some problems picking up WTTK in the past week or so. I looked it up on wiki and it has the same tower location as WXIN and has a more powerful transmitter, but I still cannot pull in WTTK but WXIN is flawless (around 80-90% strength) Does anyone know why I'd have problems getting it from the southside of lafayette with a CM 4228?

Thanks,
Tom

Per IndyJeff's comment, one of my recent comments relating to this station was also deleted.

WTTK-DT 54 (29.1) is still operating at very low power and tower height ( 3.3 kW @ approx. 500 ft.) from the WTTK-29 tower just south of Windfall in Tipton County. WTTK-DT does have a CP (construction permit) from the FCC to move from the Windfall tower site to the WXIN tower in Indy but this will not happen until around July-Aug. 2009, according to the lastest FCC filing I've seen.

In addition to moving the tower site, this station is required to transition from ch. 54 to ch. 29 on Feb. 18, 2009 when WTTK-29 (analog) goes off the air.

Steve

Besides the application from WHMB-DT 16 to switch to channel 20 post-transition and increase power (posted above), ten other area DTV stations recently filed applications with the FCC for power increases.

WTTV-DT 48 @ 1171' from 750 kW DA to 1000 kW ND
WRTV-DT 25 @ 964' from 898 kW ND to 1000 kW ND
WISH-DT 9 @ 932' from 19.5 kW ND to 22.8 kW ND
WTHR-DT 13 @ 981' from 15.1 kW ND to 22 kW ND
WDTI-DT 44 @ 961' from 28 kW ND to 1000 kW DA
WTTK-DT 29 @ 984' from 410 kW ND to 780 kW DA
WCLJ-DT 42 @ 1030' from 391 kW ND to 900 kW ND
WTIU-DT 14 @ 725' from 224 kW DA to 1000 kW DA
WIPB-DT 23 @ 807' from 79.1 kW ND to 250 kW ND
WTHI-DT 10 @ 961' from 14.18 kW ND to 30 kW ND

DA = Directional Antenna
ND = Non-Directional Antenna

Steve

Steve. (or anyone for that matter)
Why is there such a wide range (22 kW to 1000 kW) of post transition transmitted power amongst all the stations listed above? Why wouldn't each station want to transmit at maximum allowed power? Thanks for your reply

Alan

Steve. (or anyone for that matter)
Why is there such a wide range (22 kW to 1000 kW) of post transition transmitted power amongst all the stations listed above? Why wouldn't each station want to transmit at maximum allowed power? Thanks for your reply

Alan

Most are asking for the maximum power. For stations on channels 7-13, the federal limit in Indiana is 30 kW. For 14-51, it is 1000 kW.

As for WCLJ and WTTK, I heard from one engineer that it's possible to use just one transmitter tube to achieve those power levels, and installing a second tube ($$$) just to get to 1000 kW... it's less than a 2 dB gain in signal, not worth the effort. Similar story for WIPB, to go from 250 kW to 1000 kW would only be a boost of 6 dB, and would likely require another tube as well as a much increased power bill. For a little PBS station, what they have asked for makes plenty of sense!

- Trip

Steve. (or anyone for that matter)
Why is there such a wide range (22 kW to 1000 kW) of post transition transmitted power amongst all the stations listed above? Why wouldn't each station want to transmit at maximum allowed power? Thanks for your reply

Alan

In addition to what Trip said above...

Due to differences in the way different frequency electromagnetic waves propogate, it takes more power at UHF frequencies to cover the same territory as lower power VHF frequencies.

All stations, whether VHF or UHF operating at full power will cover approximately the same territory. That explains the difference in maximum legal power.

Thanks Trip and Alan for answering my question. I appreciate your replies. In my own little mind I couldn't understand why, but what you each said makes complete sense. Thanks again.

Mine's in the attic, so it's not being blown around. It's very odd... but 100% reproducible. Maybe something at WTHR's transmitter site is being blown around? It's odd that only channel 13 is problematic.

I thought I'd post the resolution of this issue for closure in this thread. Maybe it will be useful for others someday.

The problem was that on windy days, my WTHR signal was bouncing around all over the place, from the 80s to the 60s to zero and back up to the 80s. Even on calm days, a signal strength higher than the mid-70s was rare.

It turns out this was caused by interference from a separate antenna I had installed just to pick up channel 4 (WTTV). It was combined with my main antenna for the rest using a filter, but as long as this antenna was in the mix it was causing interference problems with WTHR.

We ended up removing this extra antenna (sacrificing channel 4), and now WTHR's signal is rock solid and in the mid- to upper 90s all the time.

Jeff

I recently moved to Crawfordsville, and am looking at a fiber to the home service run by the local electrical utility, called "Accelplus". Their pricing looks pretty good, and I'm ready to make the move from Comcast. The URL to their website is http://www.accelplus.net/

Anyone have any experience with this system?

Thanks in advance.

Ken

Is it worth switching to yet. The lousy program guide and operation of "Not So" Brighthouse has me ready to jump assuming Uverse is less buggy.

Hello.

Anybody heard of or tried Cinergy Metronet? They recently started offering FIBER OPTIC HDTV/TV/Internet service in my area (Vincennes, IN). Just wondering how good it is. Thanks.

Is it worth switching to yet. The lousy program guide and operation of "Not So" Brighthouse has me ready to jump assuming Uverse is less buggy.

I know a few people who have it and they all like it. But people on most Internet forums say the HD quality is quite poor compared to satellite and most cable systems.

I have comcast here and was getting all the locals in hd with the Quamm tuner. WTHR 13 HD is gone. I have scanned the the channel and it doesnt show up. Is anyone else having this problem with Comcast.

Thanks
Brad

I have comcast here and was getting all the locals in hd with the Quamm tuner. WTHR 13 HD is gone. I have scanned the the channel and it doesnt show up. Is anyone else having this problem with Comcast.

Thanks
Brad

WTHR is also gone from my QAM comcast lineup in Bloomington. 13-1 nice right in the middle of the olympics. :mad:

Still get it on the cable box downstairs just not on the HD tuner on the TV upstairs.

WTHR is also gone from my QAM comcast lineup in Bloomington. 13-1 nice right in the middle of the olympics. :mad:

Still get it on the cable box downstairs just not on the HD tuner on the TV upstairs.

My Bloomington situation EXACTLY. Comcast stinks. Thanks for over the air!:)

Yep, there was a big system crash at the beginning of the month. A few days' worth of posts were lost.

Glad there's confirmation! I was just starting to freak out that I had only dreamed I posted previously :eek:

An update from my install just outside Kokomo that I promised. Right now the antenna's on the peak of my two-story house, on a 5' mast with 3' tripod so I'd estimate the height to be about 30' from street level, which is another 8'-10' above the ground level in the woods behind the house.

I put in the CM 4228 and CM 7777 and its getting the following reception:
18.1/2 - 76
23.1 - 84
59.1 - 76
40.1/2 - 69
6.1/2 - 85
20.1/2/3 - 87
13.1/2 - 95
32.1 - 85

I still want to mess with aiming it a bit, but the wife made me stop while she was home so she could watch some Olympics action.

It took me waaaay too long to figure out how to hit the rafters :mad: The rafters on the house were 24" OC which was challenging since the Radio Shack tripod is built for 16" OC. And now that I finished all this we're going to have to move thanks to the Delphi layoffs :( At least I could provide a new data point to the AVS community from Kokomo. I'll be happy to entertain any questions on my install and reception.

Point of interest: I noted that some channels had zero reception when I located the antenna at the same end of the roof as my Dish and I wondered if there possibly could have been any interference from that. I doubt it since I know there are masts that fit right onto a dish mast and presume the frequencies are vastly different, but thought it would be interesting to know.

fOX 59HD is off as well.

Brad

fOX 59HD is off as well.

Brad

True dat. Bears play tonight.
Comcast stinks X 2!:)

I talked with someone that works at comcast. " All local HD will be movied to there HD package and the only way to get them is with a cable box or over the air."

Comcast stink x3.

Brad

True dat. Bears play tonight.
Comcast stinks X 2!:)

Since you all have been commenting on that and my OP got tossed in the great outage of 2008, I moved to Dish because I was fed up and got a better monthly rate. 'Course, then you either pay $5/mo for locals or put up your own antenna and get more options than they'd have provided.

But haven't you seen the ads? Comcast is now claiming they have 500 channels of HD! Of course, they are counting all of their VOD offerings.

In the Indianapolis market, DirecTV now has WRTV 6, WISH 8, WTHR 13, and WXIN 59 all in HD.

I talked with someone that works at comcast. " All local HD will be movied to there HD package and the only way to get them is with a cable box or over the air."

Comcast stink x3.

Brad

I will show my ignorance here, but I thought there was some sort of law, or rule, or at least an understanding that a CATV company had to send out at least one digital channel (in the clear) from each local broadcaster.
But Comcast could probably care less.:mad:

I will show my ignorance here, but I thought there was some sort of law, or rule, or at least an understanding that a CATV company had to send out at least one digital channel (in the clear) from each local broadcaster.
But Comcast could probably care less.:mad:

I thought the same thing. I have 3 of the HD box so I can still get the locals in HD. I do have an HD tv thats just hooked up with the cable. I dont watch it to much but now no HD from the quamm tuner.

It would be nice if comcast would spend some of there advertisement money on more HD channels instead of tell people they have 500 channels:confused:.

Brad

Good new I scanned my tv today and 13 HD is on 80-1 and FOX HD is on 80-3.

Brad

Good new I scanned my tv today and 13 HD is on 80-1 and FOX HD is on 80-3.

Brad

Comcast has closely monitored this forum and has responded appropriately.
Every man must have a dream!:)

Anyone else here with TW in Terre Haute? I've had my HD setup with them for ten months now. Have always had minor issues with pixelation and signal drop on the Hd channels but lately it's gotten a lot worse. This weekend (Labor day), the ESPN channels, occasionally ABC (WRTV) and of course the Nexstar stations HD transmissions were, for the most part, virtually unwatchable. Broadcast transmission of WTHI (received via indoor loop antenna) was fine. Just wondering if any other TW customers are experiencing similar problems?

Anyone else here with TW in Terre Haute? I've had my HD setup with them for ten months now. Have always had minor issues with pixelation and signal drop on the Hd channels but lately it's gotten a lot worse. This weekend (Labor day), the ESPN channels, occasionally ABC (WRTV) and of course the Nexstar stations HD transmissions were, for the most part, virtually unwatchable. Broadcast transmission of WTHI (received via indoor loop antenna) was fine. Just wondering if any other TW customers are experiencing similar problems?
I've noticed the same issues as well. I receive TW HD qam channels thru my HTPC and had to get rid of a splitter because the picture was so bad. Last week I bought a motorola signal booster - which has helped with dropouts but is still not good enough to use my splitter. Like you, I get WTHI-HD with no problem using an antenna.

OK, check out our Noon News.

It's taken longer than we've wanted, but we're about 2 minutes away from -finally- being in HD for News.

Field cameras are being switched to 16x9, other changes will be coming in the next few months, but we're taking a giant step!

Tom Weber
WISH Engineering

Thanks for the update Tom. Looking forward to the 11pm broadcast.

Brad

OK, check out our Noon News.

It's taken longer than we've wanted, but we're about 2 minutes away from -finally- being in HD for News.



I saw this just in time to see the last 1 minute of the cast. Congratulations! It looked great.

Great job, Tom. Glad to see WISH news in HD. I really liked the weather shots. Keep up the good work.

Jim

Meanwhile, I can see WTHR's promotions department scrambling to pull or re-edit their spots touting themselves as "Indiana's only HD newscast." :) For the record, they still used a bumper mentioning this during the open for the second half of their noon newscast today, although understandably, it may take a day or two for word to spread.

Well done, Tom!

OK, check out our Noon News.

It's taken longer than we've wanted, but we're about 2 minutes away from -finally- being in HD for News.

Field cameras are being switched to 16x9, other changes will be coming in the next few months, but we're taking a giant step!

Tom Weber
WISH Engineering
Miracles can happen.

OK, check out our Noon News.

It's taken longer than we've wanted, but we're about 2 minutes away from -finally- being in HD for News.

Field cameras are being switched to 16x9, other changes will be coming in the next few months, but we're taking a giant step!

Tom Weber
WISH Engineering

Fantastic! I missed the Noon News, but I'm already for 5 o'clock.

Great news to hear! Now that "other channel" won't get to brag like they've been doing...... for oh-so-long.

Congrats to you and the team, Tom!

Meanwhile, I can see WTHR's promotions department scrambling to pull or re-edit their spots touting themselves as "Indiana's only HD newscast." :) For the record, they still used a bumper mentioning this during the open for the second half of their noon newscast today, although understandably, it may take a day or two for word to spread.

Well done, Tom!
Well, they will still be able to tout their ratings lead. That two year head start in HD helps as well...

Better late than never I guess.

OK, check out our Noon News.

It's taken longer than we've wanted, but we're about 2 minutes away from -finally- being in HD for News.

Field cameras are being switched to 16x9, other changes will be coming in the next few months, but we're taking a giant step!

Tom Weber
WISH Engineering

Awesome - it looks great. Seems like there's a lot more HD content in news stories than on the competition too.

This is probably not the appropriate forum for my questions-but I don't see one listed--so here goes:

Due to recent HD signal and customer service problems with my TW setup--I've begun considering bundling phone, high speed internet and DirectTV via Verizon. I've found that it looks like i'd actually save about $70/mo for the same levels of service by doing this.

I'm in Terre Haute and Direct does not offer locals here. I've no problem with that as I intend to retain basic cable. My big question though is will I have access thru Direct (as long as I have an HD package) to HD network feeds for NBC,CBS.ABC and Fox? I've asked two different Verizon Crs this question and received an unqualified "yes you will". As this deal requires an 18month agreement with Direct, I want to be darn sure of what I'm getting before I order the service, so I called Direct and ask the same question of two different Csrs one said "yes you will" and the other one said "no you will have to apply for waivers".

Anyone here got the true skinny on this or can point me in the right direction?

This is probably not the appropriate forum for my questions-but I don't see one listed--so here goes:

Due to recent HD signal and customer service problems with my TW setup--I've begun considering bundling phone, high speed internet and DirectTV via Verizon. I've found that it looks like i'd actually save about $70/mo for the same levels of service by doing this.

I'm in Terre Haute and Direct does not offer locals here. I've no problem with that as I intend to retain basic cable. My big question though is will I have access thru Direct (as long as I have an HD package) to HD network feeds for NBC,CBS.ABC and Fox? I've asked two different Verizon Crs this question and received an unqualified "yes you will". As this deal requires an 18month agreement with Direct, I want to be darn sure of what I'm getting before I order the service, so I called Direct and ask the same question of two different Csrs one said "yes you will" and the other one said "no you will have to apply for waivers".

Anyone here got the true skinny on this or can point me in the right direction?

You should be able to receive the East/West feeds of ABC, CBS, etc. Do a check on the D* website: http://www.directv.com/DTVAPP/global/contentPageIFnorail.jsp?assetId=P4880022#h:553.902

- dk

Good new I scanned my tv today and 13 HD is on 80-1 and FOX HD is on 80-3.

Brad

I am having to do this all too often with Comcast. Channels jump around pretty much randomly. I have the tv doing a scan right now because 13-1 was showing up blank for me for a couple days straight. Comcast just needs to let me watch TV in peace!

I noticed the WISH HD newscast on Tuesday evening - normally watch WTHR, but see above - and wondered, "When did this start? Am I on 8 or 13?" Nice to have another choice!

I'm in Terre Haute and Direct does not offer locals here. I've no problem with that as I intend to retain basic cable. My big question though is will I have access thru Direct (as long as I have an HD package) to HD network feeds for NBC,CBS.ABC and Fox?
Probably best to call DirecTV about this rather than Verizon just to get it from the horse's mouth, so to speak. According to DirecTV's web site, you should be available for what they call Distant Network Service since they don't offer your locals. Whether or not the DNS would be in HD, I don't know. You may also want to ask in the DirecTV Programming forum at www.dbstalk.com.

I've been a DirecTV customer off and on since about 1997. I currently have one of their HR21 HD DVR receivers and I'm reasonably happy with it. I'm in the Indianapolis area and can get most of the local broadcast network afilliates from DirecTV in HD, except PBS. I also bought the AM21 off-the-air receiver which plugs into the HR21 so I can get PBS in HD and also the digital subchannels from the locals. The HR21/AM21 combo seemlessly integrates the satellite and OTA feeds and also provides programming guide information for the OTA channelsr.

Due to recent HD signal and customer service problems with my TW setup--

I'm in Terre Haute and Direct does not offer locals here. I've no problem with that as I intend to retain basic cable. My big question though is will I have access thru Direct (as long as I have an HD package) to HD network feeds for NBC,CBS.ABC and Fox?

Aren't the HD locals included with Basic? I am not sure if you are saying that the HD signal problems affected your HD locals as well. I may not be understanding you correctly.

Why isn't CBS broadcasting the US Open tennis championship game? The paper says they should be as well as the CBS website.

Found it on the CW.

Alright, I remember reading about some WTHR problems on stormy days a few months back. I am having some trouble getting WTHR when it becomes windy/rainy in recent days. I did read that it could be due to multipath because they have a strong signal, but I'm up in lafayette with very few trees/buildings around so I don't think that should be the issue. WTHR is usually around 80% signal strength here, but during the storms it drops down between 0-20. Channels like WISH that are usually lower signal (50-60) are fine through the storms. Is there anything I can do to fix the problems with WTHR through the storms?

Also... Does anyone know what comcast QAM is like up here in lafayette? I was thinking about getting basic cable in order to pick up some QAM channels. Hopefully the locals will be available in HD, but I was wondering if ESPN would be in HD as well. I really miss monday night football.

I believe the cable company is only required to provide the locals in QAM. I'm in Carmel and have Bright House and only get CBS, ABC, NBC, PBS, and FOX via QAM.

I believe the cable company is only required to provide the locals in QAM. I'm in Carmel and have Bright House and only get CBS, ABC, NBC, PBS, and FOX via QAM.

That's pretty much how it is here in Bloomington (Comcast) as well.

2 things:

Tom,

Can we get the newscast to come from the center channel instead of right and left of the 5.1? When you guys drop to commercial it goes to center channel audio. Also I have brought this up before, please do something about the A/C noise in the studio. It seems to be getting worse, at least since the HD feed started. The low hum is most pronounced when Angela is up there doing the weather in front of the blue/green screen.


Fox 59:

Why on earth did they drop from HD feed to 4:3 letterbox to show the weather crawls and the go back to HD feed for their commercials! The weather crawls are huge too! The lower crawl would cover almost the lower half of the screen!

I understand people need to be alerted to the weather, but why on earth does it need to be up there during the entire show? Why not pop up every 10-15 minutes and then go away!?

Fox 59:

Why on earth did they drop from HD feed to 4:3 letterbox to show the weather crawls and the go back to HD feed for their commercials! The weather crawls are huge too! The lower crawl would cover almost the lower half of the screen!

I understand people need to be alerted to the weather, but why on earth does it need to be up there during the entire show? Why not pop up every 10-15 minutes and then go away!?

Fat chance there. WISHTV and WRTV might have given WTHR a two year head start on HD news, but WXIN is way, way behind. They apparently do not have the ability to show weather info or a news ticker over a 16:9 HD program. It always gets dropped to its 4:3 version. They also leave this on for the entire evening rather than only when needed. It's annoying...

WXIN cannot run crawls without dropping out of HD. The Fox splicer, used for showing HD, does not allow station overlays. It's a limitation of the technology, nothing that WXIN or any other Fox station can do about it at this time.

- Trip

I am trying to split the signal from my OTA antenna on three TV's. I bought a 4-way signal splitter from Radio Shack. However, no digital signals come thru, and the analog is fuzzy at best.

I am running coax cable from the roof top antenna to the TV. What do I need to make this happen??

Thanks

I am trying to split the signal from my OTA antenna on three TV's. I bought a 4-way signal splitter from Radio Shack. However, no digital signals come thru, and the analog is fuzzy at best.

I am running coax cable from the roof top antenna to the TV. What do I need to make this happen??

Thanks

I believe you need a high quality signal amplifier in the line before the split. The four way splitter is costing you around 7dB at each of the four outlets. Winegard makes a nice 15dB amp, the HDA-100. I have had very good luck with it.
Or if you don't already have one, an amplifier placed near the antenna would help.
I wouldn't get a great big amp (like 36 dB), but the right sized one should work.

I believe you need a high quality signal amplifier in the line before the split. The four way splitter is costing you around 7dB at each of the four outlets. Winegard makes a nice 15dB amp, the HDA-100. I have had very good luck with it.
Or if you don't already have one, an amplifier placed near the antenna would help.
I wouldn't get a great big amp (like 36 dB), but the right sized one should work.

Yep, that did it. I already had a RS Amp. I just did some re-wiring, and it works great. Thanks for the help:)

Tom Weber-

I am curious why Ch. 8 must revert to standard def when scrolling local information across the bottom of the screen? During this afternoon's wind event, I noticed the constant transition back and forth between HD and SD, made further annoying when the return to HD was delayed after the information scroll ended. I noticed Ch. 13 does not suffer from this issue as they were scrolling similar weather information across the bottom of their HD output this afternoon during the MotoGP race.

Thanks,

Yea...kind of distracting ain't it.

Tom Weber-

I am curious why Ch. 8 must revert to standard def when scrolling local information across the bottom of the screen? During this afternoon's wind event, I noticed the constant transition back and forth between HD and SD, made further annoying when the return to HD was delayed after the information scroll ended. I noticed Ch. 13 does not suffer from this issue as they were scrolling similar weather information across the bottom of their HD output this afternoon during the MotoGP race.

Thanks,

Probably because they haven't upgraded 100% of their equipment yet to handle HD. WTHR only recently added this capability to their broadcasts.

Probably because they haven't upgraded 100% of their equipment yet to handle HD. WTHR only recently added this capability to their broadcasts.

WTHR just added this capability...then give WISH at least two years before they begin to do it. That's a safe bet.

Interesting that LIN is about to pull all programming from Brighthouse. Of course I don't know the whole story, but LIN management sure seems like the schoolyard bully of broadcasting corporations.

Bully or fair share.

You pay cable company, cable company puts out local tv stations signal, the local stations get no money from the cable system putting over the air. Is not a big deal until for most stations until they invest millions for digital and high definition signals being put over the air for the cable company to provide to its customers but does not pay for. Think of this in another way, say you own Comendy Central.....a cable system is putting out your programs but not paying you any money, you would want compensation.

TV stations broadcast their signal over public airwaves for free. So think of this another way, say you own the (public, free) airwaves, a local tv station is broadcasting using your airwaves but not paying you any money. Should the public want compensation from the stations?

Local stations benefit by increased viewership which translates into more advertising revenue.

But that's what negotiations are all about...

WTHR just added this capability...then give WISH at least two years before they begin to do it. That's a safe bet.WTHR can now change their promo to 1st HD news cast, and only HD newscast to broadcast information scrolls in HD. This way they still get to say "only HD newscast" for a while. :D

Bully or fair share.

You pay cable company, cable company puts out local tv stations signal, the local stations get no money from the cable system putting over the air. Is not a big deal until for most stations until they invest millions for digital and high definition signals being put over the air for the cable company to provide to its customers but does not pay for. Think of this in another way, say you own Comendy Central.....a cable system is putting out your programs but not paying you any money, you would want compensation.

I don't think you can compare Comedy Central to a television station that is licensed the use of the public airwaves. Since LIN has a nation-wide history of being disagreeable, I'm inclined to take Brighthouse's side without knowing all the details.

WTHR can now change their promo to 1st HD news cast, and only HD newscast to broadcast information scrolls in HD. This way they still get to say "only HD newscast" for a while. :D

This is true.

I have noticed lately that my WISH HD 5.1 audio on Comcast Anderson/New Castle drops out frequently. Occasionaly, there will also be a minor simultaneous breakup in the video.

Is this a problem originating at the station, Comcast headend, cable plant to the house, or worse yet, in my Tivo? I am not noticing the same frequency of dropouts on other stations. Can this be a bandwith issue caused by transmitting too many sub-channels?

Perhaps Tom can comment.

My tuner has ratings for both quality and strength. What factors influence signal quality? On my channels signal strength is always 70+ buy sometimes signal quality drops down to 25 on a sunny day and 0 on a stormy day. I know the storms affect the signal, but on a sunny day I would think the signal quality should be fairly high. Even during storms, the strength meter is around 70. What can I do to increase signal quality? I have a CM 7777 pre-amp so it should have low noise and I have only 1 splitter (also CM).
Any Ideas?

Anyone else getting a ton of pixelation for this game? I switched back and forth between DirecTv and OTA and have the same issue.

The previous game - Bengals @ Giants had no issues. :confused:

Yes, getting a lot of pixelation for the Colts game on WISH. I have OTA only. Likely something at WISH since it happens in commercials as well.

Hope someone at WISH notices soon!

It was a CBS problem.

We had the same issue up here in Fort Wayne. Looks to be fixed now.

Yeah it's fixed now. Yay!

Cool! Glad they took care of that - it was driving me crazy. :)

Back from a week of vacation, stepping into a nice little kettle of fish....

Late Friday afternoon, part of the WISH link from the studio to the transmitter failed. This appeared to have been the cause of some audio dropouts, and finally really completely bit the dust. Unfortunately, the backup system was out at the manufacturer, also being repaired.

The staff re-assigned transmitter links, and in the process WNDY-digital has been doing some non-standard stuff for the weekend. That appears to have caused problems for some receivers, even at cable companies. We think that is now fixed. However, re-scans may be necessary if you're having any problems getting WNDY-digital.

Tom Weber
Engineering
WISH / WNDY / WIIH / LWS

We have the equipment in-house to get bottom-of-the-screen crawls in HD. However, the company that writes the automation software to control the box is on an 8-week backlog. In the meantime, people seem to want the feature, and sponsors have paid for it, so we're getting it on the air in the manner we are able to

It's only going to get better, but it's NOT instant gratification. Good things take time and hard work.

Tom Weber
Engineering
WISH / WNDY / WIIH / LWS

Thanks for the update...Good to read this.