I never understood why we need 2 PBS stations, especially with multicasting! If I was was a WQED paying member I would be a bit concerned about them spending that money on an unnecessary weaker channel.

I checked in on channel 50 this morning and it's there but too low to receive (26-28). I don't really care though, since who wants to watch fundamentalist Christian programming. :rolleyes:

We're moving in a few weeks, so I'm switching from DirecTV+OTA to Armstrong cable HD. I shouldn't have to worry about reception problems any more. :)

Kent, the WQEX extension was granted. The application basically said that there were problems when they tried to run both analogs and both digitals at the same time. When all four stations were on the analog 16 picture and power would really mess up. I got the same information from WQED yesterday. That it would be 1-2 years before they go to their maximum facilities, but going from 50Kw to 250Kw and going to 350-400Kw this summer is actually a very good achievment. Since PBS has has experimented with and achieved excellent results multicasting a 1080i with a 480i with no noticable degradition I'm not going to be too concerned when WQED multicasts.

agtiny, you know if WQED would have just sold WQEX instead of holding out for more money they wouldn't be paying to upgrade WQEX. The value of WQEX is falling everyday. WQED should have taken the 17mil from Shooting Star instead of whining because it wasn't the 20mil they wanted. After rejecting Shooting Star, WQEX was listed for sale on the open market. It has been listed for way too long. Today the station is worth 12mil, and since it went on the open market WQED has received 4 offers and rejected them all. Basically WQED has went through anyone even remotely interested in buying WQEX and now no one wants it.

BTW I really liked WQEX for the 10 years it was actually on with it's own programming.

Is anyone having minor problems with CBS? I'm watching CSI and it stutters occasionally. The picture will freeze along with the sound for a second. The signal strength stays at a constant %70-%80. It only happens in prime time and once or twice an hour I lose the signal for about 5 seconds before it comes back. It's quite annoying.

I really hope WQED doesn't start multicasting anytime soon. Some of PBS's HD stuff is already riddled with pixellation during motion, I'd hate to see what happens when they shave 2-3 mbps off of the 19.3.

Does anybody have any idea when WTAE might have their new equipment up and running and broadcasting at full power? I didn't even expect it to begin THIS soon...

Also, do you think maybe we should see if we can't convince the KDKA guys to make the station bug a momentary thing instead of it constantly being there?

I don't see any pixelation on WQED. Technically they already are multicasting. 13-4, 13-5, and 13-6 already show up and even sending a blank channel takes up some bandwidth. WQED will have no problem multicasting a 1080i and a 480i at the same time, if that is what they wish to do.

Not long ago everyone said you couldn't multicast more than 4 channels without degrading the video. Today a station can multicast 6 channels without degrading the video. Not long ago everyone said you couldn't multicast while running 1080i. Today a station can transmit 1080i and a standard 480i without noticably degrading the picture.

Previous conversations w/Paul Byers indicated that they would not include the HD loop as part of the multi-cast. Most likely it would be multi-casting during the day & HD loop at night.

Thank's Kent. That's what I thought they would do, but they could do other things with the signal if they wished.

What WQED could do is not sell WQEX and run the HDTV loop (or whatever HDTV channel PBS puts on in the future) there, give back the analog ch.16 to the FCC (they won't have to simulcast what is on the analog channel since there isn't one), and multicast on WQED.

Just wanted to post my CM4228 results as a follow up to my previous message.

Antenna mounted roughly 25' above deck with CM7777 amplifier.

I was able to increase the signal for WTAE-DT to 75 and WCWB-DT to 65.
All other Pittsburgh station were fine before and remained somewhat the same.

I was surprised to find 2 new DT stations in the process:
WJAC-DT in Johnstown, signal strength about 35 with dropouts.
WWCP-DT in Johnstown, signal strength about 55 with a steady picture.

I scaned for about two hours and found no other digital channels available. It was rather windy over the weekend and since this was just a test I basically just hoisted the antenna up 25' and it was swaying from side to side a little. So, I may have found more.

On the analog side I was really surprised with the results.
WFMJ-21 Youngstown, perfect reception.
WKBN-27 Youngstown, perfect reception.
WYTV-33 Youngstown, somewhat snowy, but very watchable.
????-45 (PBS), I believe in Ohio somewhere, perfect reception.

Thanks again for your time.

--Clint--

Originally posted by c_perrone
????-45 (PBS), I believe in Ohio somewhere, perfect reception.


That would be:

WNEO-45(PBS) Alliance OH it transmits about 15 miles north of Steubenville. It is easily receivable here in the Northern Panhandle and carried on cable. IMHO it is a nice alternative to WQED for those that can receive it. It's DTV channel will be 46.

I was actually pulling in a little bit of signal from 36-WYTV-DT and a DTV 15 from Cleveland the other day, but it wasn't enough to get a lock.

Has anyone else noticed that WCWB and WPGH are off the air this evening? At first I thought it was the antenna, but the signal strength of the other stations are where they usually are.

Bryan,

I just noticed that also. WPGH and WCWB are at zero..


--Clint--

I wonder if they are installing new equiptment (most functions on the STBs are unavailable with WPGH and WCWB). WPGH is licensed at maximum facilities, but WCWB is at a low power STA, perhaps WCWB is going to go to full power.

I hope it isn't something major. IE: they burnt up the transmitter.

Maybe they are installing HD/widescreen equipment. ha ha ;)

what's the word on the possibility of wpgh going widescreen?

also, is it possible to broadcast 480i digitally? i thought the minimum would be 480p.

also, any news on comcast rolling out hd in pittsburgh? it'd be pretty sweet if they concocted a comcast sportsnet for pittsburgh, but then again, they'd have to wrestle just about every contract away from fox. one can dream, though.

MrGonk, yes 480i can be broadcast digitally. This is how PAX is able to multicast 6 channels instead of 4.

I don't know what the word on WPGH is, but they better get back up soon! There will be an increasing amount of viewers like myself that become OTA Digital Only (decide to drop Cable or DBS) and loosing 2 out of 7 channels for this length of time will piss them off.

I'm just jumping into HD this month and am in the process of converting my DirecTV setup. I live in New Castle and am wondering if it's worth trying to acquire OTA HD broadcasts. New Castle is sort of a no mans land between the 'Burgh and Ytown. I remember years ago as a kid my folks had a giant rooftop antenna w/rotor that pulled in Pittsburgh stations fairly well and Youngstown stations perfectly. Then came cable followed by DirectTV. Needless to say, I haven't fiddled with OTA for a long time. Should I expect more or less the same experience in acquiring HD broadcasts? Anyone out there have any experience with this location? Any antenna/preamp recommendations? I'll be running an HD200. Any and all feedback is welcome. Thanks.

generally what really kills ota reception for hd signals is the ghosting caused by reflections. 8vsb is actually very good at fringe area reception--what little signal you need for perfect digital reception would equate to almost unwatchable analog ota. if you've got an antenna big enough on your roof and you're not surrounded by a lot of tall buildings, you should be golden for reception from both youngstown and pittsburgh. you're actually in a really good position, because you can get abc-hd from youngstown (a station that's very hard to get in pittsburgh). you just need a big, high-gain (as many elements as possible) antenna. directional would be best. radio shack has a couple of 100"+ uhf-only antennas that are supposed to work magic for hd. or, if you really want to max out your potential, you could get an 8-bay bowtie antenna from channelmaster. it's supposed to pick up at upwards of 65 miles and it's got extremely high gain and direcitonality. good luck

I tuned in CSI Miami on KDKA this evening and got prolific audio dropouts. This doesn't seem to be getting any better. Anyone else having similar trouble?

No audio problems here during CSI. I'm glad they went back to DD2.0 finally.

Hmmm. Are you still OTA or are you on Armstrong now? This may be a continuing problem with my HD200.

OTA for a few more days...

I watched "King of Queens" last night & yes there was at least 1 major audio disruption.(1-2 seconds) Also, there is still a video problem similar to the one that was supposed to be fixed. It is not as often or as noticable but it's there.

Now this is funny! If you are fortunate enough to receive WTOV-DT do watch it for primetime HDTV programming. WTOV isn't showing local commercials during breaks, just the animated NBC logo that comes over the network feed. I've never seen this on any other channel except for WPXI during Jay Leno, where they play music and have a Jay Leno slide during local breaks.

It reminds me of my old C-Band satellite days.

WPXI used to do that up until a month or so ago when they got their local commercial switcher thing. KDKA also just got one.

Bryan,

I am not able to see even a blip from WTOV-DT 57 here in Wexford. I was under the impression that their digital transmitter is in Burgettstown PA which is only 30 miles away via car, so I assume as the crow flies it would be much less. I do get WTOV channel 9 analog with only a pair of rabbit ears perfectly. Are they up to full power yet? I seem to remember you saying that they were using a "half butterfly" pattern that probably points more toward the Weirton/Stubenville area.

Clint

WTOV is a very strange situation, and we thought WNPA in all it's incarnations was the most moved around station.

When WTOV was first bought by Cox the new owners had the tower moved to Burgettstown where they started transmitting Analog. When it came time to apply for DTV they applied for the new location. WTOV has a DTV construction permit for the Burgettstown tower, however their STA is for the "old tower" in Steubenville. Subsequently they have applied to change their DTV construction permit for the old location and to move the analog back to the old site.

What we have today is the DTV transmitting from 100ft at 116Kw on an uncompleted new tower at the old location using half of a directional antenna array. The current pattern looks like half of a butterfly with the two lobes going North and South. So there is very little going to the East right now. I would say the bulk of their DTV signal is going to unpopulated areas and areas with very few people with STBs.

The analog is being transmitter from Burgettstown, but they have authorization to move to the old site. This is impossible because the new tower at the old site isn't finished and the old tower is being dismantled.

What I think will occur. The analog never gets moved, the DTV goes on the new tower and the analog gets eventually switched off. Cox has wasted enough money with WTOV by building 2 towers and moving stuff around. There is a rumor that the Burgettstown tower will be used for a WTOV DTV Booster.

If you haven't seen it yet I have an image of the area DTV stations and their Digital Contours on my website:

http://wvjw.info/daily-news/Digital-TV.GIF

Bryan,

Very cool web page indeed! It looks like eventually I should be able to receive WTOV-DT and WTRF-DT with out any problems. Thanks for all of the great information. Do you have any way of including more channels in your coverage area maps? It would be neat to see the Youngstown and Johnstown stations. When all is said and done I should be able to get Youngstown/Johnstown and Pittsburgh.

Thanks for the update.

Clint

I have updated the maps to include anthing remotely receivable. The station maps are placed in several catagories.

Pittsburgh Metro:
KDKA, WTAE, WPXI, WQED, WNPA, WCWB, WPCB, WPGH

Pittsburgh East (Johnstown/Altoona):
WWCP, WJAC, WTAJ, WATM, WKBS, WPSX

Pittsburgh West (Wheeling/Steubenville) & Pittsburgh South (Morgantown/Oakland):
WTRF, WTOV, WOUC, & WNPB, WGPT

Pittsburgh North (Youngstown)
WFMJ, WKBN, WYTV, WNEO

Other Stations:
WQEX

I think those 21 stations are the only ones that anyone may receive somewhere in the Pittsburgh Area. Though no one in the area will be able to receive all 21 stations.



http://wvjw.info/daily-news/Digital-TV.GIF

Bryan,

Those maps are great! Thanks so much for your work. Very much appreciated.

--Clint--

Bryan,
You need to get your facts straight....WTOV has never broadcast from Burgettstown. They had a cp for the dtv for there, but there is NO tower at that location. There is a STA for the DTV signal to be broadcast from the Steubenville site and it is temp on the old tower and is only part way up.. (but it is the full antenna, not half)
The new tower has not even begun to go up (waiting on FCC approval).
There is a new solid state transmitter and a new antenna for the analog CH 9 signal also, but it too is waiting for the new tower to go up...the transmitter is installed (at Steubenville) and all the parts and pieces are ready once the tower begins to construct..

Bryan27, the maps look interesting. What does the circle represent? Is it the 41 dbu noise limited contour, f50/50 or f90/10? The contour on the map our consultant filed with our app shows the 41 dbu contour almost touching the south shore of Lake Erie. Your's is a little bit less than that.

Armstrong HD... just got this hooked up yesterday. The 4 local HD channels look the same as OTA and HBO-HD looks no different from on DirecTV.

Pros:
One wire
WTAE reception is perfect of course
Non-HD channels display in 480p mode which allows me to use smart-stretch mode. My DTC-100 always displayed 1080i.

Cons:
DCT5100 has the worst guide ever... ads, pressing guide always shows channel 2 first instead of the current channel, doesn't display 2-hour blocks.
Going from 480p (normal channel) to 1080i confuses my TV and it will often display a wavy line pattern in a 4:3 frame until I power cycle the TV. This is VERY annoying.
Analog channels (<100 which is most of the frequently watched channels) look terrible compared to DirecTV.
No HDNet.
Cost is 67.40/mo (HD+Digital+HBO). On DirecTV this would be about 56.99 (TC Plus w/ locals + HBO + 2nd room). Our daughter will probably want the extra digital channels so we'll have to pay something like $5-7 for a 2nd Armstrong digital box for her.
HBO is activated on analog channel 5 on all TV's. This is very bad since our daughter's TV has no way to block this channel besides removing it from the programming but she's smart enough to get to it. I'm going to call and see if they can disable analog HBO.

My wife told the installer if they didn't have ESPN-HD by football season we were gone, but of course he said they don't tell him anything.

I haven't tested OTA reception here, but as you can see the cons seem to outway the pros at this point. Luckily there is no yearly contract or anything so we'll see how it goes.

Robert, I used the f90/10 contour as the Digital Service Contour. I felt it best represented where reliable reception should occur, instead of the 41dBu noise limited contour. The f90/10 contour is a little more 'conservative' and is a little smaller than the 41dBu noise limited contour.

Let us know when WFMJ goes on the air. It is the easiest analog to receive here in the Wheeling area from Youngstown, so hopefully the digital will be just as easy.

AGTINY: Armstrong is waiting for delivery of the new Motorola box with DVI. Maybe the interface will be better. I can't make any guarantees, but maybe if you ask nicely they will just give you a trap for analog HBO. Then you can install it before your splitter to block it everywhere or just put it on the line to your daughter's room and block it there.

Bryan27: I understand the F90/10 curve. Be advised that our CP is for 460 kw MAX DA. We had to pull in the north to keep the Canadians happy. eh? Also because of our situation here I have no choice but to go on the air at 800 feet with 200 kW. So initially, Wheeling may have some trouble. As I write this I am watching up a rain soaked driveway waiting for my transmitter to be delivered, so hopefully we can have bits on the air in early June.

Hopefully 21 can offer better color quality than that of channel 33. I won't watch OTA HD (and therefor not much HD at all) because of the quality from the station.

Has anyone noticed a difference with WCWB? Last Thursday the signal here was really bad, but it has since improved. Today it is back to it's regular signal level in the middle of "Normal", but there is no picture, just a black screen :( I've checked the antenna, amps, FM block, everything is fine and the rest of the stations are preforming as they usually do.

On the FCC site I noticed WCWB applied for a new STA, but there was no data on what changes they made. Did they change something like their hight or power?

While over at the FCC I noticed that WPCB has filed for their license, looks like another low power license mistake like WTAE. I also noticed that WQEX filed for an STA. Is the station even on? The signal on ch.26 here is 0. Still no FCC action on WNPA's applications :mad: Good news for those east of Weirton. WTOV has also applied to alter their STA. They raised their power. My signal level is double what it once was (though it still isn't as high as WPGH, WPXI, & KDKA).

Atmospheric conditions were really cool this weekend. For nearly 2 days I was receiving excellent signal from ABC and Fox in Cleveland. It was nice to be able to see a Digital ABC station for a change. For a while I was also receiving WB from Columbus, they had all the DTV bells and whistles on in their signal; TV ratings, Show Title & Description, Digital Closed Captions, Multi-language. Why don't our stations do that! What was really weird was having 2 channels mapped to 53-1, at fist I thought WPGH was multicasting.

Robert, I hope construction at WFMJ is going well. I might be able to pick up WFMJ at 800' with 200Kw. I'm at 1280' and could pull in WQED when it was at 20Kw. I have a question for you. Can digital signals pass through analog signals? WKBN is also easy to receive, but in the FCC's excellent wisdom they put WKBN on ch.41. We have a huge 77Kw translator on ch.41. I just wonder if the STBs will pick out the digital transmission if there is an analog on the same channel?

Bryan,

I lost WCWB last week also. Signal level dropped to around 28 or so. I thought it was all the new leaves on the trees. I just checked after I read your post and the signal is now up to about 45, but with no picutre. Did WTOV-DT just increase their signal today. I still don't get a blip here in Wexford.

--Clint--

Clint, thanks that is about what WCWB is doing here about 50% and was doing last week. I wonder what they are doing? It is transmitting something, just not something recognizable for the STB. My STB doesn't do percentage or level numbers. The signal bar just has BAD, NORMAL, GOOD. But based on that I can sort of figure out the percent. 32% and below no lock (Bad), 33-65% Normal, 66-100% Good. KDKA has been hitting 100%!

WTOV went up to 180Kw, but maintains only half an antenna. I think these stations are buying their transmitters and antennas on the installment plan. Get a little money install a bit more. One thing that is nice it doesn't blank out now.

Bryan,
Construction is going well except for equipment delays that might push my air date back until later in June.

To answer your question, I think you'll have trouble with WKBN if that translator is close to you. Even with a good directional antenna it will probably be impossible to get WKBN.

P.S. Read the post from steubtv back on April 30. I know who this person is and you can trust them. They are indeed using a full antenna and not half. In fact I don't even know if you can use half an antenna and still have it tuned and generate any kind of usable pattern.

That's what I call the pattern WTOV is currently using. It is "half" of the pattern on their construction permit. Sorry for the confusion.

Steubtv, I'm just relaying information obtained from the FCC. BTW the new tower (next to the old one) has been approved (actually several weeks, if not months, ago). WTOV had a CP for analog at Burgettstown. It is on record at the FCC that WTOV did do testing at that location shortly after Cox bought WTOV. But that was all several years ago. It's time to look toward the future.

bryan27
We (WTOV)just got our final approval for our tower two weeks ago, it took FAA and FCC approval. The tower is actually being delivered next monday and will begin construction soon after that...we also did not increase our dtv power and it is broadcasting from the same antenna, which is not half an antenna...We had a CP for Burgettstown, but no testing was ever done.. you are not relaying information from the FCC, but adding your own comments...if you want some facts feel free to call, but nowhere in the fcc did it ever say we were broadcasting from 1/2 of an antenna or that our new tower was half erected....

Hey all,

Anyone notice tonight that WQED-DT seems to be off the air. I have a signal strength of 0. Everything else seems fine except for WCWB which still seem to be off the air also.

--Clint--

c_perrone,

Dido here in Cranberry. Might have to make a call, or did somebody already inquire? Also, I did a channel scan on my HiPix card and no signal for the WB, picked up WPCB, channel DT 50 out of Greensburgh, and WTAE was re-routed from 51 to 4..

Clint,

I had the same experience last night - no signal. And a few nights ago 42 had a strong signal reading but no programming.
BTW, I wet to radio shack and got a $1.98 UHF antenna (yeah on sale). Now QED comes in great, these signals are *very* directional and my yagi is fixed so the small $1.98 comes in handy. Once I move out of the townhouse I'll get that larger one you recommended.

Jim

What happened to ch. 42 and 38? On my D6000 setup screen I get about 80% on both channels but neither will lock for more than a second or two.Seems like the transmitters are on but no programming. Anyone know whats going on?

Walt in Penn Hills

42 has been off for days........and 38 seems to have gone down a few days now

Same here re Ch 38 WQED yesterday. Has signal strength of circa 60 but not broadcasting picture for several days.

The stations are transmitting something. The data just isn't recognized by the STBs. WCWB's signal is rather constant. WQED's signal flucuates wildly.

I do know that WQED is scheduled for a power upgrade and equiptment upgrade for multicasting, so this could be what they are doing. Also another problem WQED has had is when they tried to run WQEX-DT. The equiptment of WQED would suffer when they tried to run 2 analog and 2 DTV stations at the same time. The result was that WQED had to purchase more equiptment. WQEX has applied for an STA, so they could be trying to get WQED, WQEX, WQED-DT, & WQEX-DT all to run at the same time.

WCWB appears to be transmitting nothing but non-video/audio data. I don't know what Sinclair's plan for WCWB-DT is, but the way the signal looks right now they may be trying to add a data channel to their SDTV signal.

I spoke with Paul Byers at WQED today. He confirmed that they are off the air. The new part they need is on the way & they should be back in business sometime this week.

Channels 42 and 38 are back up and running.PBS 38 locks on 38 but lists itself as 80 in the D6000
guide, I don't understand that one. Ch 42 UPN now has a better than ever signal here in Penn Hills the max signal before was 50% now it's up to 70% that means the final Smallville will stay locked.

Walt

Same thing here. DTC-100 locks on 38 for WQED and then "remaps" to 80-3. WCWB seems to have a slightly higher signal for me also.

--Clint--

Yesterday when WQED came back on it was mapping all over the place. It was on 13-1 (thru 3), 38-3 (thru 6), 80-1 (thru 3), 80-3 (thru 6) and now just 80-3.

I haven't noticed any signal strength change in WCWB it is still between 50-60%. I have never had any drop outs from WCWB.

I spoke with Kurt Hoss (WTAE-51) today about the focus issues for the basketball game. He informed me that they will be making a "soft" flexicoder adjustment today which should clear up the problem.

any word on wytv in Youngstown?

WYTV or WFMJ? WYTV has been up for a few months on ch.36. WFMJ is soon to be up on Ch.20, and WKBN on ch.41 is ???

WMFJ. Sorry about that, although WYTV is an aweful station to watch. It seems as though they need better engineers or something. Anyone else ever notice how off the colors are in both SD and HD content? It's been that way since I was a boy. Give me a break 33!

The WYTV DTV picture can't be as bad as WTRF's DTV picture. WTRF tends to broadcast in wonderful crystal clear Black & White, or transmit the colors out of phase which looks like a 3-D movie without wearing the glasses, or a B/W picture with bands of yellow, blue, red, and green. They even do a hidious analog up-converted to 1080i which makes the picture fuzzy and the images streched out.

WYTV is bad all-together. I used to think that there was something funny about the picture even in the 80's when all we had was an antenna. It's till just as bad most of the time. The colors stink to say the least. I think they are following some other country's (or planet's) SMPTE guidlines. Who knows.

Tonight (6/12/03) did WPXI 11-1 stop broadcasting in high def for everyone? I put Fraiser on and the screen was froze then for the beginning of ER the same thing, and eventually it was standard definition ER was window boxed and Leno was full screen?

Does anyone know what this is about? I'm assuming the storm is interfering or damaged the tower.

Hey guys, has KDKA OTA been down lately? It's been down on Armstrong for a few days with a 'this channel will be available soon' message that they put up whenever a channel goes offline.

KD has been fine for me.

agtiny,

No problems with KDKA here either.

--Clint--

We're workin' on it. This has been a real pain for some reason getting the last pieces in place. Please be patient. Weather hasn't cooperated either to get the antenna I put up last summer tied into the new building.

P.S. remember when it first goes on it's for test purposes. No telling what kind of video you'll see.

Dan,
If I have a chance today I'll go next door and see what WYTV looks like on cable. WYTV is near impossible to receive here, but I have always been able to receive WFMJ and WKBN.

Agtiny, KDKA has been just fine OTA.

Agent, WPXI was fine down here last night, ER was in HD. I have noticed that thunderstorms and heavy rain affects DTV reception. When it rains or storms I've noticed picture freezes, break-ups, and switching from full screen to windowed. There is no real change in signal level either. It's just weird.

Wow that sucks then... I want my $5 back if they aren't going to keep channels online. :(

wqed still out for everyone ?

WQED has been fine here. They did change back to 13-3 though. I wonder why it was at 80-3? You might need to re-scan to get it to pick up the new channel ID.

Does anyone else get tired of the stations changing their channel numbers? I've seen WTRF on 32-2, 32-1, 7-1, & 7-2. WPGH as 53-1 & 43-1. WCWB as 42-1 & 22-1. WQED as 13-3, 38-3, & 80-3 (which was bizare).

WPGH is the really silly one. It should just be called 43 and the DTV channel promoted as 43. After the transition ch.53 for TV won't exist and WPGH will have to stay on ch.43. May as well start getting people used to it now.

You know, it's ironic that the one city in all of the mainland united states that has the very most unwelcoming combination of weather and terrain for terrestrial broadcast CAN'T GET ANY DAMN HD CABLE!!

::ahem::

Had to get it together there. Has anyone heard more about Comcast? What about the possibilities of WPGH passing the ED widescreen feed or WTAE upping to full power?


Dan

Is anyone having problems with the voice and video not synching properly on WTAE OTA? I was just watching the NBA game last night and noticed that the commentators voices are slightly behind that of the video. I have the DTC-100 too.

I'm still getting WPXI's widescreen broadcast in fullscreen. It went off HD 5 days ago and still isn't back. Any suggestions?

Hmm we had WPXI on tonight during the news and it was normal.

I get the station I'm just not getting a high definition signal from them. Jay Leno wasn't widescreen or high def like he all ways is. It's been like this since June 12th.

They are sending their normal 1080i 16:9 feed with upconverted content. I haven't watched Leno lately so I don't know whether they are passing him in HD or not.

leno was upconvert 4:3 not the ussual widescreen hd :( and it was a new show...

I finally received a response to my email to Armstrong about their future HD plans. This is mostly customer-service-speak but I have faith they will get some new channels soon.


Armstrong has been talking to ESPN, Discovery and HD Net for months concerning their HD channels. Direct TV is the 1st large provider to add a high definition "tier" of services for an additional monthly fee. To date, almost no video providers have agreed to carry ESPN HD (no major cable companies, no Dish Network). This is primarily due to contractual provisions ESPN has insisted upon so far.

Several new HD networks are currently being developed, including one from InDemand. High definition definitely enhances the sports and movie experience. Over the next few months, it will become clearer as to how much HD content is going to be available. That will allow a realistic, long-term HD group of channels to be offered. Armstrong is committed to provide our customers great HD product at the lowest possible price. Please know, we are very aware of the potential value our customers place on high definition content. As I'm sure you are aware, Direct TV does not show any of the major broadcast network programming in HD, so the biggest shows on television (Super Bowl, Monday Night Football, ER, CSI, etc.)are not available in HD through Direct TV. I would ask you to be patient a little longer so we can maximize your future choice and keep costs to a minimum.

Diane S. Wyant
Customer Service Center Supervisor
Armstrong
724-282-5630

All,

I just did my daily channel scan for and picked up WFMJ-DT (20). I realize that it is in the testing stage, but the picture looks just fine and audio seems fine also. Signal strenght in the mid 50's here in Wexford PA. with some minor breakups.


--Clint--

Yes, after almost 20 years of following HDTV, I'm finally watching my station in my home.

It is "unofficially" on the air while I burn it in seeking any infant mortalities that might pop up. I'm going to try to keep it on the air most of the day and probably turn it off after Leno.

Robert,

Congratulations! It looks like the weather finally gave you a break..:) I'm a little surprised at the relatively strong signal I'm getting here in Wexford with my attic antenna. I know you said that you won't be up to full strength for quite some time. Anyway, it's great to have WFMJ-DT on the air.


--Clint--

Originally posted by agtiny
As I'm sure you are aware, Direct TV does not show any of the major broadcast network programming in HD, so the biggest shows on television (Super Bowl, Monday Night Football, ER, CSI, etc.)are not available in HD through Direct TV.

Diane might be interested to know that I watched every one of those shows in HD using DirecTV.:D

Kent,
Do you mind sharing on "how" you watched all these shows via Directv? Unless you are getting some special channel that I am not aware of, I don't see how Directv is letting you watch these.

Originally posted by c_perrone
Robert,

Congratulations! It looks like the weather finally gave you a break..:) I'm a little surprised at the relatively strong signal I'm getting here in Wexford with my attic antenna. I know you said that you won't be up to full strength for quite some time. Anyway, it's great to have WFMJ-DT on the air.


--Clint--

Wow if thats not at full strength, it still blows WYTV's signal strength out of the water!!

Originally posted by debennett2
Kent,
Do you mind sharing on "how" you watched all these shows via Directv? Unless you are getting some special channel that I am not aware of, I don't see how Directv is letting you watch these.

I use an antenna. Don't take my comments so seriously. I am only trying to make a point. Us DirecTV people don't suffer as much as the cable people would have you believe.

I understand that but you must also look at it from their point of view: They don't have to have an antenna, nor point one (not to mention a dish).

Nor can they ever make any positive statement about themselves without slamming satellite. It's annoying.

Everyone always wants to think what they have chosen to use (or not chosen but have to deal with) was the best alternative. No one wants to look foolish with their money. The sooner people get over that, the better everyone else is off... Just my opinion.

I agree with kaa...cable companies and satellite co's are like politicians...here's not why you should go with me, but why you shouldn't go with the other guy.

I've been messing around the last couple days trying to get my closed captioning working. Can you all help me out a little and turn CC on and see if you're getting it OK? My integrator led me to believe some STB's can't get it.

As far as I'm concerned, WFMJ-DT is on the air. We're supposed to run a story in the news sometime in the next week making an "official" announcement. My thanks to all who have let me know they can see us...even the DX'er in Middletown Ohio (240 miles near Dayton) who got about a minute of WFMJ-DT on a bounce.

P.S. To anyone that watched Leno last night and noticed something missing (sound), it was a transmission problem at NBC. I thought I broke a wire in the rack working on closed captioning.

I'm still not getting NBC in high def. I don't know why it's been a while.

talked to an engineer at wpxi a couple of days ago who said a part in the station's NBC-owned HD equipment had failed. This person said the part in question doesn't typically fail, so the network is taking time to see if it can figure out what went wrong before simply replacing the part. Said HD should be back 'within a week' ... we'll see!

I've been messing around the last couple days trying to get my closed captioning working. Can you all help me out a little and turn CC on and see if you're getting it OK? My integrator led me to believe some STB's can't get it.

Robert,
I will try to turn on Law & Order long enough tonight to see if it works with the SIR-T151 and let you know here.

PS why not change your sig to WFMJ-TV/WFMJ-DT ? ? :)

Greetings,

I was happy to find this thread on AVS. I want to say thanks to everyone for posting, as I found it very informative. I'm just about to enter the HDTV arena. I just received my Z1 today and love it. However, I had a few questions regarding OTA antenna's. I live in the Belleuve/Avalon area just a few blocks off of RT 65. I purchased DirectTV back in 1998, and was very happy with it (Not to mention, I'm big NFL fan). However they didn't offer local channels back then so a rep from BB suggested I try an OTA Antenna. I tried a variety of antennas Powered and non powered (but all indoor) and spent many hours trying to get a decent signal without any success. The only station I could get in semi clear was WPXI. This was a major disappointment for me, because my only other options were to order cable with a life line service which I ended up doing for a bit until I switched to DishNetwork because they offered the locals before DirecTV. I ended up switching back to DTV once they offered locals in the Pgh area. I plan on subscribing to their new HDTV package but would like to receive the locals digitally as well. My first question is are the Digital signals OTA much stronger than the analog? Or will I be in the same boat as before with poor reception. I've read some posts on here about people who have had some great success with indoor antenna's. In fact I'm amazed that some people are getting such strong signal strengths and they are located farther from Pittsburgh than me. I'd prefer an indoor instead of an outdoor because my house is a 3 story house with a very steep roof. I think I would have a hard time finding an installer who would want the job without making a premium. I do have a semi-finished attic so putting an antenna up there would be a possibility as well. Can anyone recommend a good indoor antenna? I'm looking forward to the possibility of getting the locals in HDTV. Thanks in advance for any insight and help.

Regards,

Mark

Mark,
I don't think you will have much trouble pulling in local digital signals except for WTAE-51. They are transmitting from Elizabeth, PA which does not help their weak signal.
I would stick with an attic antenna since it will be bigger & it will be much higher than say in the living room. Location of the antenna is key for most of us.
I would recommend using the Channel Master Model 4221 (4 bay bow-tie). You can find it here:
http://www.warrenelectronics.com/Antennas/Chmaster_ant.htm

There are many antennas that could do the job for you...this is one I have had good luck with.
I hope this helps...Good luck & may the signal be with you!

edit=spelling

Thanks for the info Kent. I have a small Window in the Attic, so should that be enough for the reception? Thanks for the help. I appreciate it.

Mark,
No windows needed. I have heard that wet roofs do cause problems but I can not confirm. You are in good shape.

Thanks again for the info. BTW, do you happen to have DirecTV? I'm looking at some DTV receivers right now. I'm thinking of buying a used on off of Ebay to start out with such as the RCA DTC-100 or the Panasonic TU-HDS20 (with the newere firmware program guide update). I don't plan on purchasing any type of recorder so DVI isn't a priority for me. Down the road I'll probably end up going to the new HDTV DirecTivo that is supposed to be released in November.

One other thing Mark, you may want to put that antenna on a rotor for easy aiming. Some of these signals can be highly directional.

I use the Toshiba DST-3000 & have no complaints. I too am waiting for HDTivo. It will change everything!

Well I just purchased an RCA DTC-100 from E-bay and should receive it next week. I'll probably order the antenna next week, and the C Sat kit from DTV as well, so I'll post the results of my signal strenghts once I get everything up and running. Thanks for the help, I can't wait to check out HDTV.

Sorry. One more quick question. Do you think there would be any advantage of me going with the Channel Master model 4228A 8-BAY? It has an extra 15 (total 60) mile range than the 4-Bay. I don't mind spending a little extra money if it will help increase the signal strength. Thanks!

Mark,

I have the 4228 installed in my attic here in Wexford. It works well for me, but you have to remember that what may work for one, may not work for another. I get all the local Pittsburgh stations. WFMJ-DT from Youngstown comes in fine, WYTV-DT only on occasion. I do get reception from Cleveland as well in the early mornings at about 100 miles, but I'm sure that has to do with atmospheric skipping, although it does come in every morning. Anyway welcome to the board and good luck.

--Clint--

Thanks for the info and welcome Clint! Do you have DirecTV as well? If so what model receiver are you using? I've also been reading about people having some success with the Zenith Silver Sensor. I may try one of those out first, just to see if I have any luck before running RG6 up to the attic. Anyone have any experience with the Zenith Silver Sensor? I'm sure everyone probably has checked out this site, but I'll list it anyway. I found www.hdtvpub.com pretty interesting. You punch in your Zipcode and other people posted reviews based upon their location on how they received the signals. Just thought I'd mention it. Thanks again everyone for your help. Much appreciated as I learn more about HDTV.

Originally posted by Mgraham
I've also been reading about people having some success with the Zenith Silver Sensor. I may try one of those out first, just to see if I have any luck before running RG6 up to the attic. Anyone have any experience with the Zenith Silver Sensor?
Radio Shack also sells a good inexpensive TV top antenna. You are on the right track eliminating this possibility first. I would be interested in your results.

Been using the silver sensor off and on in Oakland. I was able to get WPXI, KDKA, and WQED from my 6th floor apartment on Forbes Ave (facing N-NW). Now, in my first floor apartment on Semple St (facing south) I don't get sh!t. That's life in the city, though. Damn Comcast taking their time...

I've heard success stories from guys in the suburbs, including places as far away as Cranberry, which mystifies me because that's getting out there, and some of these guys are getting WTAE-DT... I guess it's just some dumb luck sometimes. Ultimately, the Silver Sensor is a very solid indoor antenna and when not surrounded by walls, and when given a bit of elevation, can easily get you some pretty good signals. It's worth the small cost now that you can't get the Radio Shack double bowties anymore.


Dan

Im going to carnegie mellon this fall and I want to know what kind of antenna I should bring. Will an omnidirectional do or will multipathing mess stuff up? I'm also worried their wireless network might mess things up. Any thoughts on that? I dont know taht I can live without my HD 8 months out of the year :) (Im using a capture card hehe, Not bring an hdtv to my dorm.)

I don't think anyone can tell you what kind of antenna will work for you. I would say bring whatever you already have, and it if doesn't work you can go to a local radio shack and try some other types and return them if they don't work. Wireless networks won't interfere with TV reception. Since CMU is so geek-friendly, maybe you could get them to throw the local HD signals onto the dorm cable system. Who knows, maybe it's already done. :)

I haven't heard anything about cmu having cable in the dorms!! Also, in order to get hd signal over cable you need a qam hdtv tuner which doesn't exist, at the moment.

Most dorms have cable systems...so I'm sure they do. You can put standard 8VSB over cable and it will take up one 6mhz channel, just like any analog channel. You can then plug the cable into any OTA tuner and tune the channel. Some real cable companies actually do this.

Any updates on WPXI? It's been DOA for a while now. I missed watching the NASCAR race in digital quality today :mad:

WPXI-DT is fine on Armstrong cable. I haven't seen any actual HD since I don't watch Leno but the upconversion is fine.

Just noticed L&O:CI is in HD on WPXI-DT.

CMU has cable.

Unless you find an apartment off campus, you're going to have a hell of a time receiving anything at all on CMU's campus. I know a guy over there who gets HD on a modded dual double bowtie Radioshack antenna. He gets CBS and NBC and I believe he has a north-facing window. Don't even try omnidirecitonal, Oakland's buildings and terrain will make it impossible for you to get anything.

If you're high up, you have a much better chance. You will probably only be able to get stuff in the direction your window faces. If you are facing north or west, you'll be able to get CBS, NBC, and probably PBS. If you face south, you MIGHT be able to get ABC (good weather, high floor, and clear line of sight generally required for good reception), and if you face east, say goodbye to HDTV. On the upside, you can pick up MTV 2 for free on analog OTA (I believe it's channel 29)...

I doubt we'll be seeing any HD over campus cable systems anytime soon. Yes, CMU and Pitt have Comcast cable, but it's not normal comcast cable. It's like Pitt has its own facilities serving the dorms, as last I checked, digital cable and many premiums were not available, and many of the channels are actually different. Your best bet is to get an off-campus apartment and hope Comcast comes through with HD sometime this century. But I know that CMU requires all of its freshmen to stay on campus, so you'll be waiting at least a year.

One thing you could try if you really lose your mind is plugging your RF input on your capture card into the building's groundwork, thus using it as a huge multidirectional antenna. DO THIS AT YOUR OWN RISK. YOU COULD FRY YOUR GEAR AND YOURSELF. I tried it once in Tower B at Pitt and I actually got some very good analog reception, but the ghosting caused by all of the interference was too much for me to lock a digital signal.

Welcome to the incessantly frustrating world of HDTV in college. Between living in an urban area, not owning your property, moving every few months, and always being broke, you'll find that this definitely is NOT the hobby for college students. Luckily, I'm finally moving into a house with a good landlord on South Bouquet and we're going to put up a big rooftop antenna. This is after two years of struggling to get anything in campus housing... free at last!


Dan

Might want to try the inexpensive Silver Sensor indoor antenna, which I believe is now marketed under the Zenith name. Some Pittsburghers have reported success using it in difficult reception areas. Even in Oakland, I would think KDKA-DT (CBS) and WPXI-DT (NBC) and WQED-DT (PBS) would be distinct possibilities.

The antenna's so small, it can be moved easily around a room, thus increasing the chances you'll find a spot where it works.

I've tried the Silver Sensor and it definitely does not work as well as my modded dual double bowtie. However, given how difficult it's going to be to find those bowtie antennas at this point, the Silver Sensor will probably be your best bet.

The reception possibilities will depend almost entirely on how high up your room is and which direction your window faces.

Greetings,

Just wanted to update everyone on my HDTV experience. First off thanks to everyone who responded to my questions. It's been a great learning experience.

I ended up going with the Samsung T160 HDTV DirecTV receiver instead of the DTC 100. The person selling me the DTC 100 on E-bay didn't get his shipment in, and cancelled my order. I must say I'm very impressed with the T160. So far I haven't had any problems (that I've noticed) that others have that are posted on the HDTV Equipment forum.

I'm currently using the Zenith Silver Sensor antenna. In my area I've noticed that the SS is very picky about placment including the height of where its placed. After finding a hot spot, I've been able to get WPXI DT, WQED DT, WPGH DT, WB DT, and WQED DT all from the same antenna placement. KDKA I seem to experience quite a bit of dropouts and the unit has to reaquire the signal. The singnal strength fluctuates between 63% & 93% quite often and KDKA seems to give me the most trouble as far as dropping the signal. WQED's HDTV Demo is stunning. I was very impressed. WTAE-DT I can also pick up very well but unfortunately I have to move the antenna direction which knocks out some of my other stations. Currently I have the Zenith SS on my first floor pointing out a window, but the results have been fairly decent. My signal strengths range from %50-100% on the various stations. I just purchased a RS Double Bowtie off of Ebay and I'm hoping I'll be able to get everything in without having to move the antenna to watch WTAE. I'm also thinking about an amp, but I'll wait and see how my results are first.

Thanks again everyone for your help.

PS MrGonk do you have any info about your modified bowtie? I'm curious as to if its something I should try or not. Thanks!

Mark

Hey everyone,

Seems I'm not getting an e-mail when there is a post to the thread. I thought the thread was silent all this time. I'm getting a signal from WFMJ-DT, but not enough to lock. Same with WNEO-DT on ch.46.

WTRF-DT is becomming a bit of a joke. They had no audio for a couple weeks. WPCB-DT hasn't had audio either.

I have actually been receiving WTAE-DT off and on. Which is better than not at all. However, now that WTAE-DT is showing up I rarely get a lock on WTOV-DT, go figure.

The CC feature on WQED-DT and WPXI-DT is now on. I have my CC set for solid yellow text on a translucent blue background. Standard CC with the sentence presented at once is much easier to read than the scrolling 'typing as they talk' that WPXI-DT was experimenting with.

Other than that there is nothing else going on down here.

Bryan

Hey Bryan,

Welcome back..:). When did WNEO-DT (46) go on the air? I can't even get a blip here, although WNEO 45 comes in just fine. Sorry to hear you can't get WFMJ-DT (20). It is 100 times better than WPXI-DT (48) in picture quality AND they don't put a huge station logo on the screen full time. They also now send all of the program information too.


--Clint--

Clint,

Cool! I like having the on screen program information. WNEO-46 went on with an STA tests a few weeks ago. I don't have the transmitting information and they are on and off at different times. They are scheduled to be fully up and running by September 1st.

What I have found really interesting is that once the transition is complete peoples viewing habits are going to change. I receive analog stations that I don't receive digitally and I receive digital stations that I don't receive in analog. 75% of the time I receive WDLI-DT Canton, OH. It isn't excatly programming I like to watch, but it is rather interesting to see a TBN station with 4 simulcasts.

I saw your message to me yesterday. Yes, the Winegard antenna I use is a monster. I also run a small FM Non-Commercial Educational station downstairs. Someone came here a few weeks ago saw the huge antenna, 4 satellite dishes of various sizes and thought we were the Cable Company :)

I have Comcast Digital Cable and on the guide after ch. 592 and before PPV they have HD channels listed, are they available yet in the Pittsburgh area?

Some HD channels are supposedly going to go live on August 15th through Comcast, but judging from the article I read in the Post Gazette this morning, it looks like only local channels are going to have HD, for starters. They are in negotiations with other channels according to the article, so maybe that's why you're seeing those channels out there.

The good news is that Comcast is going to give FREE HD receivers for their customers. (The bad news is that 2 months ago I dumped Comcast for satellite and would have to pay additional for an HD satellite and receiver!)

Nice, I just talked to the director of cable marketing at Armstrong, and he told me their $5 monthly charge is only to cover the cost of the 5100 box, but that in the future they plan to offer all local HD channels "in the clear". I assume this means in 8VSB format so it can be tuned with any receiver. I hope if Comcast can offer the HD receiver for free, Armstrong will do the same. The only problem with cable providers is that their only competitors are satellite, not other cable companies, so they could really care less what other cable co's are doing since I have no choice of cable providers. :(

They still won't reveal any details of new channels and keep telling me the reason for any delay is so they can offer the "best choice and value in HD". He does seem to know what's up though, since he mentioned Bravo HD.


Discussions regarding HD programming continue every week. More services are launching (In Demand has announced plans for a movie and a general entertainment channel to launch in mid-September, Bravo HD launches in a few days). It is my hope that we will be launching additional HD services shortly. Armstrong has built a state-of-the-art distribution system that has as much capability as any cable operator in the U.S. I know it's difficult to be patient (especially when it comes to football in HD). No satellite provider can offer you Monday Night Football in HD (or the Super Bowl!) like we can. I am confident we will meet and hopefully exceed your expectations soon.

Sorry, Armstrong will be processing to 256 QAM.

Could be, he wasn't clear... I guess newer TV's will have built-in decoders for QAM because of the new plug-and-plug regulation.

Greetings,

Did anyone get a chance to watch WTAE-DT's Monday Night Football broadcast last night? It was my first HDTV NFL game, and I must say I was impressed after the straightened out the initial glitch. Can't wait to see the other games in HDTV.

Does anyone know if this Saturday afternoon's steeler game on KDKA will be broadcast in HDTV? I asked them last week if they were broadcasting the game in HDTV via a comment form on the stations website but haven't received a response. I've read some posts I believe in the Pgh comcast forum discussing that comcast will carry a game in HDTV via KDKA (even though KDKA hasn't signed with comcast yet officially for local HDTV). Hopefully that's true. I'm using a HDTV Samsung D* box with a Zenith SS antenna, and my results have been spectacular since locating the antenna in my attic.

There hasn't been any announcement by CBS yet about HD coverage, but most are assuming they will follow suit with ABC and do at least some games (maybe 1 or 2 each Sunday). I wouldn't get my hopes up for a preseason game.

Ugh. It's definitely going to be tougher to watch a SD broadcast after last nights HD game. Especially since its the Steelers on Saturday. I kind of doubt it will be HDTV as well. Just for the fact that this is a local coverage game. Oh well, I guess we'll just have to wait and see. Thanks for the input.

Oh, I didn't know it was a local KDKA production. There is no chance of HD if that's the case.

CBS just announced.

CBS SPORTS AND DIRECTV JOIN TO PRESENT

THE NFL ON CBS& IN HDTV

Primary Game Each Week of 2003-04 Season To Be Broadcast In Highest Definition Television Format; HD Games Also Will Be Available on DIRECTV's

Exclusive NFL SUNDAY TICKET Package

NEW YORK and El SEGUNDO, CA, August 5, 2003 -- CBS Sports and DIRECTV, Inc. will join to present CBS's primary game each week of the 17-week 2003 NFL ON CBS regular-season schedule in high definition television live on the CBS Television Network. The announcement was made today by Sean McManus, President, CBS Sports and Roxanne Austin, President & COO, DIRECTV, Inc.

THE NFL ON CBS's primary game broadcast in digital television's highest definition format, 1080i, also will be made available to subscribers of DIRECTV's exclusive NFL SUNDAY TICKET package throughout the 17-week regular-season schedule. Both over the air and DIRECTV customers must have appropriate HD-enabled equipment to be able to view the games. The HD games will be regionalized on the CBS Television Network, but on NFL SUNDAY TICKET will be subject to the NFL's hometown blackout rule only when the hometown stadium is not sold out. The designation of the HD game will be determined on a week-to-week basis. These games are being offered as part of a five-year agreement with the National Football League for exclusive rights to NFL SUNDAY TICKET. The agreement between CBS and DIRECTV is for the 2003 regular-season only and will be evaluated for renewal after the 2003 season.

The unified productions for the Standard Definition and HD telecasts will feature the same game announcers, camera angles, replays and graphics. Each HD game also will be broadcast in 5.1 digital dolby surround sound. Coupled with the clarity of 1080 lines of picture resolution, the HD broadcast will bring the stadium experience to the viewers' home.

"There is no better sports property than the NFL to showcase what HDTV can mean for viewers," said McManus. "CBS is the undisputed leader in HDTV programming, and we are proud to partner with DIRECTV in furthering our commitment to something that is making sports programming more enjoyable everyday."

"Avid football fans turn to DIRECTV for the most comprehensive football coverage every Sunday during the regular season, and our agreement with CBS to offer NFL games in HDTV for the first time makes our exclusive NFL SUNDAY TICKET package even more appealing," said Austin. "Only DIRECTV has NFL SUNDAY TICKET and only DIRECTV will offer NFL games in HDTV nationwide. Try as it might, cable just can't match us."


CBS Sports was the first ever to broadcast a professional football game in high definition format on Sunday, November 8, 1998 when the historic broadcast featured the AFC East Division co-leaders, Buffalo Bills against the New York Jets live on the CBS Television Network. The game was the first of four high definition games presented by CBS Sports during the 1998 season. The initial game, which served as a test of CBS's HDTV capabilities, was transmitted in high definition only from WCBS-TV New York. The three subsequent high definition match ups were transmitted nationally to all CBS Owned stations and affiliates with digital capability. The live HDTV telecasts were produced and transmitted independent of the regularly scheduled CBS Sports National Football League coverage that was broadcast on the traditional analog network. CBS also had an agreement with DIRECTV to give these games national distribution in HD.

CBS Sports kicks off its 44th season broadcasting the NFL, highlighted by Super Bowl XXXVIII in Houston, on Sunday, Sept. 7 (12:00 Noon) with THE NFL TODAY, the Network's pre-game studio show, followed by a full slate of seven games in Week 1.

This fall, CBS will begin its fifth year of presenting the majority of its primetime lineup in high definition. In June 2001, CBS became the first to broadcast HD in Daytime when it commenced daily weekday HD broadcasts of television's leading daytime drama "The Young and the Restless." CBS is also the leader in HD sports broadcasts. For the last four years, CBS also has produced the NCAA Men's Basketball Final Four and Championship Games in HD, as well as The Masters® Golf tournament in HDTV and the U.S. Open Tennis Championships in HDTV. CBS also broadcast the 2001 Super Bowl and all of the 2003 AFC Playoffs in HDTV. Last season CBS concluded its second season of HD broadcasts of the SEC Game of the Week. CBS broadcasts, on average, 25 hours per week of High Definition programming, more than any other broadcast network, and more original HD programming per week than any other network, broadcast or cable or satellite. One hundred and forty-two of CBS's owned and affiliated stations are currently broadcasting in digital, covering approximately 90 percent of the nation and by the end of the year will reach 95 percent.

Last month DIRECTV launched a new high-definition programming package for $10.99 per month that includes ESPN HD, Discovery HD Theater™, , HDNet and HDNet Movies. DIRECTV also offers HBO® HDTV and SHOWTIME HDTV® as part of their premium packages, as well as HD PPV movies for $4.99 each. To access HDTV channels, consumers may purchase a DIRECTV-enabled high-definition set-top receiver, and a single 18 x 20- or 18 x 24-inch multi-satellite dish with three LNBs. DIRECTV-enabled HD receivers and triple-LNB satellite dishes are available from authorized DIRECTV retailers nationwide.

I got a call from Comcast today and they are coming out tomorrow August 6th to hook up the HD Cable. I can't wait no more OTA drop outs.

Just set up to have my Comcast HD setup. They are going to install it on Aug 16th. I'm lucky I called when I did they only have a few time slots left. Aug 8 8:30 - 12:00 and 12:00 - 4:00. Aug 16 8:30 -12:00 and 12:-4:00. They are also only offering WTAE (ABC), Showtime, ESPN and WQED (PBS).
HBO is not an option at this time. They said they have no idea when or if it would be offered anytime soon. And there may be another station added later this year, but not sure about it either. And no additional cost for the box. They are also waiving the $49.95 install fee. It looks like I will keep my OTA box for now.

I'm a current Comcast standard cable subscriber who signed up for Digital Cable/HD the other day. It's being installed on Monday 8/11 (but HD channels don't go live until Friday 8/15). Supposed to get free 6 months of Showtime as part of the promotion, which should enable Showtime-HD too.

The rep told me, and I've read elsewhere here, that Comcast will be airing the Sat August 16 7:30 p.m. Steelers-Eagles preseason game from Heinz Field in HD. Apparently a one-time deal. I assume it's on KDKA-DT, but I don't know who is producing this or how they are accomplishing this, but that's what they said. We'll see.

I really hope Comcast comes to some agreement with CBS soon. The Super Bowl is on CBS this year.

Huh?? There will be no preseason CBS HD NFL according to their press release. Where else was that mentioned?

Originally posted by hondo21
The rep told me, and I've read elsewhere here, that Comcast will be airing the Sat August 16 7:30 p.m. Steelers-Eagles preseason game from Heinz Field in HD. Apparently a one-time deal. I assume it's on KDKA-DT, but I don't know who is producing this or how they are accomplishing this, but that's what they said. We'll see.

Let me go way out on a limb here & say it's not gonna happen.

It was on a flyer that Comcast sent out

Originally posted by bdeluca
It was on a flyer that Comcast sent out

Can you post the wording of the flyer? Sometimes things sound like it means one thing when it really doesn't.

Front

Hey Steeler Fans!

On August 16, 2003
Catch the Debut of Steelers Football on Comcast HDTV!

Back


See the Steelers Like You've never seen them before

*Wide screen picture for more realistic viewing of your favorite sports, movies and original programming
*Crystal-clear resolution
*Dolby Digital 5.1 sound (when broadcasted)

Watch the Steelers vs. Eagles
August 16,2003
on COMCAST HDTV!

Call Today!
Get HDTV installed in time for the game!

1.800.COMCAST

then its their disclamer

Hmm... looks like it's worded carefully enough to cover their asses when it doesn't actually happen. It never actually says the game itself is being broadcast in HD. However, the real debut of Steelers football is this weekend, so I don't know what they're thinking.

Thanks bdeluca,
Knowing that the game probably isn't in HD let's me read it a different way than intended. It doesn't say the the game is in HD but rather you can watch it on Comcast HDTV. My guess is that a CSR who has good intentions has written a misleading advertisement.

But why would Comcast go to the trouble of showing 1 game on a channel they don't have the permission to broadcast yet? Why do that if it's only an SD broadcast?

It may be that it will be aired in didital but not HD. Witch means a better picture for most people who have Comcast cable

This flyer was written by someone who doesn't know the difference.

I was told once by a DirecTV CSR that everything on HBOHD is shown in HD.

Doesn't the Philly area have a Comcast HD sports package (Flyers, etc.)? Since the game is with the Eagles, is it possible that they are the ones who would produce this supposed HDTV broadcast, and the Pittsburgh area will get that feed as a special promotion to kick off HDTV in this area?

However, the real debut of Steelers football is this weekend, so I don't know what they're thinking.It says "Catch the Debut of Steelers Football on Comcast HDTV!" -- it doesn't mean the debut of Steelers football itself. It means their debut on Comcast HDTV. You can't separate the prepositional phrase at the end.

I don't think the NFL is part of that network. I found this in an article:

Beginning in 2003, the company said it plans to offer about 100 HDTV sporting events a year on Comcast SportsNet in each of the Washington and Philadelphia markets.

Coverage will include games from the Philadelphia Phillies, Flyers and 76ers; the Baltimore Orioles; and the Washington Capitals and Wizards.

this sounds entirely plausible. comcast sportsnet carries a lot of the philly area stuff in HD, and if they decided to allocate their resources to this game in order to offer it in HD in pittsburgh at the rollout, they probably wouldn't need an agreement with CBS, only KDKA itself. but exactly what the parameters of the deal might be is a mystery to me. the only thing i can think is that this is a sign of 1: good faith between kdka and comcast, 2: comcast being serious about promoting hdtv in pittsburgh. i'm gonna bet that it does indeed happen in hdtv, and i'm gonna go out on a limb here... i'll bet we see a deal with cbs within the year. i don't think comcast would let itself be cheated out of carrying the superbowl in hdtv in many of its major markets. they're clearly making a move to be known as the technological visionary and leader in cable, and they're obviously making a very aggressive attempt to court the high-paying dish crowd back to cable, and that means hdtv. but then again, maybe that's just wishful thinking...


dan

by the way, bdeluca and hondo21: please do keep us posted on your progress getting the hd setup from comcast. we're all quite curious what hardware is being used and what you'll be able to do with it in the next couple of days as the service goes live.


dan

I realize that the NFL isn't part of Comcast Sportsnet normally. I just thought maybe preseason is a different thing, where the local channels get involved. If this is what is happening, I wonder who the announcers would be or how good the production will be. Time will tell.

OK, I am the new guy here so here is a little about my setup. I live off Exit 16 off Rt 28, about 20 miles from Pittsburgh. I have a Philips 60 inch tv and dropped the cable and went with Dish Network last Monday. I called Dish Shack last week and bought 6000U reciever for HDVT for $500. When I got it, it was only the 6000 unit but I hooked it up and they are sending my the 6000U soon. Right now the only HDVT channel I get is HBO. I had to call KDKA today and have them fax some info to Dish Network for me to get their eastern feed for HDTV. I should have it in a couple days. I will also be able to get more channels when I get the 6000U. I'm new to this HDTV stuff and have been reading a lot of things and now I am looking at getting a OTA. I want to get one to put up outside and am trying to figure out what to get. It looks like it will take me a while to figure all this out but it will be worth it. I'm glad I found this forum and will be here everyday now. I hope I didn't bore anyone but I just thought I would let you know a little about me.

Iceburg,

Welcome to the AVS forum! Good to see more Pittsburghers around.

You are in a good position to get the east coast and west coast CBS feeds from Dishnetwork, as KDKA is owned and operated by CBS, and one of the ways to get CBS-HD over dish is to live in a CBS owned-and-operated market. You automatically qualify, just as long as you're not within the broadcast range of any other CBS affiliates OUTSIDE of Pittsburgh (like, for example, Johnstown or Youngstown)... I think you're in good shape for that in Natrona Heights. There's more to read about this on Dishnetwork's site.

For more advice on your antenna, go to www.antennaweb.org and follow the instructions on what type of antenna you might want. I'd say considering your location and distance, you'd probably want to get a medium to large directional antenna on your roof pointed approximately at downtown Pittsburgh. Many people on the forum reccommend Winegard antennas, but many others opt for the less-durable but often cheaper Radio Shack yagi-style UHF antennas.

You might also just consider losing the antenna idea and getting cable from Comcast, in which case you'd have to subscribe to the lowest-tier digital cable package in order to get WTAE-DT (ABC HD), WQED-DT (PBS HD), and ESPN-HD. All three of which are not carried by Dish. Or you could just get lifeline cable for a few bucks a month and get the HD box in addition for 6 bucks more a month. You'd get WTAE-DT and WQED-DT in that case, but not ESPN-HD. You'll be able to get CBS-HD, Showtime-HD, HBO-HD, HDNet, and HDNet Movies from Dish (I think. I haven't checked up on Dish's offerings lately).

As I'm sure you can tell by now, there is no quick and easy answer. You have a lot of options but none of them are perfect (as is usually the case when it comes to HDTV availability). I think you'll find these boards an overwhelmingly large source of useful knowledge, so keep reading! And enjoy.

Dan

All,

According to this official schedule of nationally-broadcast NFL games (http://www.nfl.com/schedules/tv/national) , the Steelers will be in CBS's nationally-televised game only once this year. Add on two Sunday Night Football appearances, one special preseason event from Comcast, and one Monday Night Football appearance, and you've got a grand total of five Steelers appearances in HDTV this regular season. Twice in 1080i and three times in 720p. Not bad. Even if you only have Comcast's currently meager HD offering, you still see four of the five.

Of course, this is not counting any possible postseason appearances. Who knows if Comcast will have an agreement with CBS by then. I'm sure the AFC playoffs will be in HD again, as well as the CBS-carried Superbowl. I doubt Fox will have HDTV for live events implemented by the playoffs. Not that it matters to the AFC.

Anyway, here's when you can expect to see 'em Stillurs in HD, just for reference:


-Saturday, Aug 16, 7:30pm - @ Eagles (KDKA - 1080i. Possibly only on Comcast cable)
-Sunday, Oct 5, 8:00pm - v. Cleveland (ESPN-HD 720p)
-Sunday, Oct 12, 4:15pm - @ Denver (CBS-HD 1080i)
-Monday, Nov 17, 9:00pm - @ San Francisco (ABC-HD 720p)
-Sunday, Dec 28, 8:00pm - @ Baltimore (ESPN-HD 720p)

... so there it is, barring any unforseen weirdness.


Dan

Has anybody had any luck getting CBS throught Dish Network not OTA? They say I don't qualify for the feed so I had to call KDKA and get them to fax a waiver to Dish so I could get the Eastern feed. I called KDKA all week and left messages and finally someone called me back today. He said he faxed my waiver to Dish but when I asked if it was for HDTV he said no. Then he said he would have to check on Monday with someone else about their policy on this. If anybody else had any luck doing this, please let me know how.

Iceburg,

Don't take any guff from those swine. Because we live in a market where the local affiliate is owned and operated by CBS, all you need to qualify for CBS-HD over Dish is to be UNABLE to receive CBS digitally over the air from any neighboring affiliate (such as Johnstown etc.) and as best I can tell, in Natrona Heights, you sure as hell shouldn't be able to pick up OTA CBS-HD from any other cities. You need to get on the phone with Dish and complain, and ask them who they think you're supposedly able to receive CBS-HD from outside of KDKA's market.

Dan

I will gladly wash down my "crow" with an Iron City on this news. Bob Pompiani (during today's game) just announced that this game will indeed by an HD game. I took his comments to mean KDKA was producing the game & would be available to all. How far we have come in such a short time. Let the party planning begin.

kaa1954--

good lord, kent! i understand your hometown pride runs rampant at the thought of the steagles game in hd, but that's no excuse to drink i.c. light! not when you have rolling rock and yuengling available!

hehe.

Haha, seriously.. Yuengling baby!

All, I just had my Comcast HD installed. It took a total of 15 minutes. The hardware they are using is the Motorola DCT5100. It does have a DVI interface. The installer said that it is active but they don't have any DVI cables. I'm going to see if I can track one down at Best Buy on McKnight. So far here are the HD channels they are offering:

Showtime Ch: 574 (looks great)
ESPN HD Ch: 773 (NOT all HD programming)
WTAE Ch: 780 (only OTA I couldn't get)
WQED Ch: 790

Doing an A/B comparison with WQED Cable/AIR, there are more artifacts in the cable but it's quite comparable, much better than I expected.

<rant>
The rest of the SD digital channels are amost unwatchable in my opinion. The compression is terrible, I feel like I'm watching a streaming internet video clip on a 56K modem. Ok I'm exaggerating, but I don't know how this is touted as "better". Granted I'm watching it on a 110" screen but as proven above (WQED cable HD quality) it doesn't have to be this bad. With advances like HD, I can't understand how the poor picture quality of digital cable is something a consumer would want. I guess that for many the trade off of picture quality vs. number of channels is acceptable.
</rant>

JAM

Moving back to Oakland soon for the schoolyear and this cable hdtv has me excited. Anyone know the lowest package you have to buy in order to get the local hdtv channels and espn hdtv? Is it extra for the hdtv channels?

JAM - I doubt the installer is right about that DVI interface being active, but let us know what you find if you get a cable for it.

I have the sony xbr 400 (36 in set) i initially got direct tv for ota and since the digital cable looks bad. i have basic cable as well. I am now adding comcast to get abc hd. i cannot get it ota.


I have a denon 3803 reciever. how should i handle switching the component hook up to to set. should i run both hd thought the recieer and then into the set? or switch the dvd and comcast box? or just break down and get a ab switch and then be mad the pronto wont do it?

too bad i dont get wtae ota.

thanks.


THe csr at comcast said that the channels look better though the new box, since i told him the old digital look bad on my tv.

does the 5100 do anything to the signal

thanks again

I'm using only the component output on my 5100 (wife would complain if I used svid or the TV's RF tuner). The SD channels from Armstrong look OK. Analog channels 2-70 look bad but only due to the extra analog noise. These channels look better on our 2 other smaller TV's. Pure digital channels (channels 400+) look great, and look the same or better than DirecTV. I would expect Armstrong can use more bandwidth for these channels than DirecTV can use. HD channels look great of course. :) I only have a 55" RPTV though.

5100 better than old digital box? how to switch hd100 5100 and dvd>, only two in on tv.

The installer told me the DVI was enabled as well, I thought it wasn't but maybe they just enabled so I went to Circuit City and dropped a $100 on a DVI cable just to find out the guy didn't know what he was talking about. Hopefully it will be working soon.

$100?? And I thought I was wasting $15 for a Firewire cable!

Greetings,

Just to make sure that I'm not crazy, but did anyone receive last nights WPGH 53 DT's preseason NFL game last night in Wide screen? I've read other threads from people in other city's that their Fox station showed it in the Enhanced Wide screen.

Also, looking forward to tomorrow nights Steeler's game in HDTV for sure. I read on the Post Gazette website that "KDKA will use Comcast's HDTV production truck to make Saturday's Steelers game available in HD both over the air on Channel 25 and on Comcast cable Channel 775.".

Armstrong cable is also airing promo spots for it being in HDTV on their cable system as well (A friend of mine saw a commercial last night). Anyone know if the game will be in 1080i since its a CBS station?

I don't get WPGH OTA any more, but there is no way they are passing the widescreen content (unless there was some goof at the network and they sent their anamorphic feed as the main feed). Other cities lucky enough to have a good Fox station got to see it in widescreen.

Tomorrow's game will be 1080i! We'll have to wait and see about DD5.1 or not.

weird how its legal to say in all the nespaper ads that you can ONLY get the hdtv feed via comcast........ thats just plain false right? 25-1 will show it right??

speaking of hd football is there any glimmer of hope that WTAE will turn thier signal back up to where it was like a year ago? the first 6 months i had hdtv wtae came in fine now i get almost no signal at all..... none...... with mnf coming up i'm starting to panic...

what the heck are they playing at????

I saw them advertise it during the sports section on the 11pm news last night on KDKA... it will definitely be available on 25. Armstrong has also been promoting that it will be on KDKA channel 102.

The PG article (http://www.post-gazette.com/tv/20030814owentv2.asp) mentioned that it was going to be on 25.

Originally posted by agtiny
I don't get WPGH OTA any more, but there is no way they are passing the widescreen content (unless there was some goof at the network and they sent their anamorphic feed as the main feed). Other cities lucky enough to have a good Fox station got to see it in widescreen.

Tomorrow's game will be 1080i! We'll have to wait and see about DD5.1 or not.

So WPGH definitely doesn't pass any "Enhanced" Wide screen content? Boy what a disappointment.

That's awesome that tomorrow's game will be in 1080i. I'm new to the HDTV scene, and have been very impressed with ESPN HD and MNF's HD broadcasts of the preseason. Only negative is that you kind of hate watching SD NFL broadcasts now.

Anyone see the CBS GB vs CLE game last night on KDKA DT? It looked much better than the Fox WPGH DT Thursday broadcast. Was that in 480p or something?

Overall a very good production! They even had the CBS HD graphics for on-screen text. The audio could have been better (it wasn't really 5.1), and the switch to commercials wasn't very smooth, but I really have no other complaints. The picture looked great and the cameramen seemed to know what they were doing. The same cameras were feeding the SD broadcast so unfortunately there was no 16:9 framing. Well done guys! And I'm happy that the KDKA bug was gone for the game. :)

Yes, overall the game was a good production. It will be hard to go back to watching the Stillers in SD. I'd even put up with Pompeani and Edmund Nelson every game if I could see it this way. I watched on Comcast.

Comments:

- Audio: Although 5.1, it was very odd to have the announcers' voices coming out of the surround speakers. I would much prefer them to be anchored up front with the surrounds just supplying ambient crowd noise.

- Volume: Wow, what a big difference between the game volume (low) and commercials (much louder). I had to adjust all the time, and ended up just hitting "mute" when they went to commercial. Then switching to the other game on ESPN-HD, their volume is really loud. A huge difference from channel to channel on these HD channels on Comcast. I wish they would level out the baseline volume a bit.

- Picture: seemed to be a tad dark (e.g., compared to ESPN-HD) but pretty detailed and acceptable. Maybe the lighting at Heinz isn't as bright as in Tennessee? There were a handful of video glitches (a few brief freeze-ups, pixelizations on replays, etc.), but nothing too bad or persistent. The transitions coming in and out of commercials were a bit jarring. They need to smooth that out for sure.

- Live? Not quite. Switching to the analog broadcast it was apparent that the HD feed was delayed by about 2 seconds. I wonder if this was true OTA or just on Comcast. Not a big deal if you only watch the HD game and don't turn the sound down to listen to Myron. Or if somebody in another room is watching the SD broadcast (why would they?) and starts yelling before you see the play happen.

- The Game: Some things went better this time around, but this team has a long way to go yet. Maddox was mostly out-of-sync and off the mark, but did get a little better later. I don't care what the "rule" says, that Randle El catch should have been a TD. Who cares if the ball slightly bobbles after he hits the ground (and I thought the ground can't cause a fumble - he already had possession for sure)? That's just a bad rule and a bad ruling. I know it's preseason and therefore expect it to be a bit sloppy, but the officials really wanted to get their mugs on camera a lot. Way too many penalties being called on both sides. Veron Haynes looks really good. Fu and his constant injuries is really wearing thin. Plex needs to toughen up and make more of the difficult catches. The defense continues to frustrate with their frequent inability to get off the field on 3rd downs. We need a much better pass rush than I've seen so far.

Originally posted by hondo21
- Audio: Although 5.1, it was very odd to have the announcers' voices coming out of the surround speakers. I would much prefer them to be anchored up front with the surrounds just supplying ambient crowd noise.

Originally posted by agtiny
The audio could have been better (it wasn't really 5.1), and the switch to commercials wasn't very smooth, but I really have no other complaints. . :)

This is the same gimmicky DD5.1 we got for the Grammy's. I called KDKA after the Grammy's to complain & they told me that they were just passing what the networks sent along, meanwhile a lot of other posters from other city's were praising the sound that night. KDKA is synthesizing this audio somehow & it is a major disappointment because they don't know what they are doing to their own sound. I will attempt to call & explain to them that the announcers voices should not come out of the surrounds or the front R & L speakers for that matter. The front situation is debatable I realize but not the surrounds.

One other comment...ESPN's game looked superior to our game IMO. Look out 1080i, 720p is coming to get you.

Volume: Wow, what a big difference between the game volume (low) and commercials (much louder).

Hondo, the audio OTA was the same way (along with the horrible HD -> SD -> HD switching to and from commercials).

Still something of an historic event though, isn't it. Locally generated HD :cool:

it did look great and a channel jump back and forth with the epsnhd game showed how horrifying espn/abc's 780 excuse for hdtv is :(

it was like looking at something with glasses on (cbs) and glasses off (espn)...... i kept asking people whats wrong/different between these pictures as i jumped back and forth....

everybody got it right........ the sea of dancing grass....... same thing that is so noticeable/annoying with espns sunday night baseball games versus hdnets games from last year...... the freaking grass isnt stable..... on hdnet baseball like on this steeler cbs/kdka game the grass is solid and not waving around like a bad mpeg...... on espns baseball and football its like a dancing sea of artifacts..... :(

even people who don't ussually notice anything about a picture spotted the huge difference right away in an a/b of the kdka versus espn hd games last night....

once people really get to see the cbs games this year i don't see how espn/abc will be able to hang onto this horrifying excuse for hdtv....... even the nearly blind will wonder what the f once they get taste of the real 1080.....

I'm a Pittsburgh resident and was hoping some of you may be able to answer a few of my questions.

I bought an HDTV set last year but never shelled out the extra $500 for the HDTV decoder. I currently have Direct TV without hdtv.

Comcast is offering a free motorola HDTV reciever if I switch. They also offer to buy my dish back which will lower my bill to around $48 a month for cable. This will include two regular Digital Recievers and a HD reciever for my hdtv. I'll get the HBO's and Encore's with that package too.

I like my Direct TV, but don't want to spend the $500 for one of their recievers. I called them to ask what they could do for me and they offered a $125 credit if I buy a HD Reciever.

On paper, Comcast seems like the way to go, but I've had problems with them in the past. They were charging me over $60 a month for internet access!!!

Is comcast HD for real? Is the motorola box they are offering any good? Can I recieve OTA stations with this box too or will I have to buy a different one?

Thanks for any input. I'm glad I found this board. There's a wealth of information here.

bochamps -- I just signed up for Comcast last week, and haven't had any satellite/OTA HD experience, so I'm not much help. But you may want to check out the Motorola 5100 thread in the HDTV hardware forum for info on the box (including link to FAQ). It will NOT get HD OTA, only cable.

I'm pretty sure that you'd need a new dish (unless you already have the elliptical one) to get the HD channels on DirecTV, in addition to that HD receiver.

Bochamps, try This Thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=194404) it has a lot of good info.

Are any of you guys checking out the football game 8-18 on ABC? It's 5.1 sound but my back speakers are quiet. I'm using a Dish 6000 OTA. Anyone actually getting 5.1 DD?

I just got my OTA with my 6000 hooked up a couple hours ago and I am watching the game now and am getting a little sound from my rear speakers. It sounds like 5.1 to me. I can't get any sound from KDKA at all. I just got my adapter for the 6000 today and I am using small rabbit ears for reception. I ordered a Channel Master and it should be here in a couple days. I am getting some good readings on some channels so far. I don't know why I am getting no sound from KDKA anymore. I was getting it until they switched to their HD programs.

Ok thanks for the info. I cranked my rear speakers up all the way and I hear a little sound but not much. Usually only when the special effect graphics appear and disappear. KDKA's audio is out for sure. So it's not your set up.

Hello everyone. I am a new member, I have been scanning your posts for a few days, and have learned quite alot. Being from Pittsburgh area and a Sports fan, I am interested in getting a little help, if you would be so kind.

I just purchased a Zenith SAT520 HD Receiver with DirecTV to compliment my Hitachi 57SWX20B Monitor. The HD channels are great, but like many my dilemma is how to best receive the local HD Channels.

I live in Moon Twp, high elevation. approximately 20 miles from downtown. Should I go with OTA or Comcast Cable. I really don't mind paying for what I want as long as it is of good quality.

I presently have Comcast standard cable (Haven't upgraded to digital). Is it possible to go to a low tier digital, and get the HD locals? Will I need to get there HD Box? Do you have to buy it, or do they charge you a monthly fee?

How about OTA, with a quality antenna would I be able to get a quality signal, I know I've read that ABC (WTAE) is not that strong, but even with a small indoor antenna I have been able to pull in the Youngstown affilliate.

I am sorry this is so lengthy, I will keep shorter in the future, but just wanted to introduce myself and identify my situation.

Thanking you in advance for any advice you could render

Hi Jack,

Welcome. I'm new to HDTV as well (almost 2 months), and can give you some of my experience with OTA. I live in Avalon, PA and purchased the Zenith Silver Sensor antenna from Best Buy. I've had excellent results, and I'm able to pick up all the local stations with a signal strength of 77 -100 including WTAE (which is a 77). Originally I had the antenna on my 1st level of my house and was still able to receive all of the OTA channels but with Channel 4 I had to point the antenna to a different location. I recently moved my Zenith SS up in my attic (3rd floor) and I'm able to get everything without any problems. I bought an amp from Radio Shack, but ended up not having to use it.

Moon Twp isn't that far away from my location so hopefully you can get most of the stations without having to foot the bill for HD channels via Comcast. I'm using the Toshiba T160 DirecTV receiver. It integrates the local OTA channels with the regular DirecTV guide. If you read previous posts on this thread (which was very helpful for me) you'll notice that other people are using different antennas (Radio Shack Dbl Bow tie), Channelmaster, etc. I'd suggest going to www.antennaweb.org and key in your address. You can see a map based upon your address of the direction that your antenna should point toward. I found this map very useful during my initial setup. Everyone has different results from different locations and antennas so what may work for someone else may not work for you. Personally, I think the Zenith SS is a good start. If it doesn't work you can take it back, and you have a best buy close by in Robinson Twp.

Good luck, and please let us know how you made out with the solution you choose.

Regards,

Mark

Greetings,

Anyone else see some dropouts with WTAE's OTA broadcast? I just want to make sure it wasn't on my end. I'm running a Samsung T160 D* receiver. BTW does everyone else notice a "click/pop" when WTAE switches to the HDTV feed?

Thanks Mark.

I appreciate the info, sounds like a solid solution to me, at least you don't have to mortgage the house to try it, if it doesn't work, then I will try something else.

Thanks again,

Jack

Last night's game had minor dropouts as well as a loss of HD for about 30 seconds. Yes, I also hear something when the HD kicks in @ the local level.

Originally posted by jack schroeder
Thanks Mark.

I appreciate the info, sounds like a solid solution to me, at least you don't have to mortgage the house to try it, if it doesn't work, then I will try something else.

Thanks again,

Jack

No Problem. If the Zenith SS doesn't work, I'd suggest looking through the posts for the Channelmaster antenna. Many people have had success with that antenna. Of course it's much bigger than the Zenith but if you have room in your attic you maybe able to pull in better signal strength.

Let me know how you make out. Seeing Monday Night Football in HDTV will make it worth the effort.

Originally posted by kaa1954
Last night's game had minor dropouts as well as a loss of HD for about 30 seconds. Yes, I also hear something when the HD kicks in @ the local level.

Thanks Kent. I'm glad it wasn't on my end. The previous MNF game didn't have the amount of dropouts as last night. I must have missed the 30 second loss of HD. I definitely am impressed with the HD quality though.

After receiving some great advice from Mark, I stopped last night after work and picked up the Zenith Silver Sensor. I went home and connected it to my SAT520 (In the basement where I have my gameroom and TV). Did a scan of the digital stations, and I couldn't believe the results. After just a few minutes of adjusting the antenna, I was able to pick up all channels including ABC (WTAE). My wife and I just stood there in disbelief at the beautiful display we were watching.

I still can't beleive that such a small investment could give me the total viewability that I currently have. LIFE IS GOOD IN MOON TWP.

I must again thank Mark, and everyone who has posted. I have found this thread to be a most valuable asset. I hope you all don't mind if I stick around for awhile and become a part of the community.

THANK YOU

That's a keeper!

i am having second thoughts... am i crazy to add digital box for comcast to get wtae hd? ( i currently have d* would have to let denon 3803 switch the hd to the 36xbr400 and really pile high the equipment stack.....

I can sometimes find it ota but not recently....

If you've got no other options like a bigger antenna or something, then I say it's worth it. ABC has a ton of HD programming, not to mention Monday Night Football!

again nobody seems to reply when i ask this.... but is wtae ever going to go back up to signal power that they had most all of last year?

the first 6 months or so i had hd (like july to february this past year) wtae was great got high signal with the silver sensor if i put the antenna in the right spot...

for the past 6 months or so i am lucky to get a 4 or 5 signal and definately no picture... its driving me nuts with mnf coming up :(

has anyone heard anything about why they lowered thier signal so much?? and if its permanent....?

I think they've always had a weak signal. I was OTA from October 2001 to May 2003 and WTAE was always the same signal strength for me. I could get 35-40 with my antenna and 50-60 with a Radio Shack amp on the line.

Originally posted by jack schroeder
After receiving some great advice from Mark, I stopped last night after work and picked up the Zenith Silver Sensor. I went home and connected it to my SAT520 (In the basement where I have my gameroom and TV). Did a scan of the digital stations, and I couldn't believe the results. After just a few minutes of adjusting the antenna, I was able to pick up all channels including ABC (WTAE). My wife and I just stood there in disbelief at the beautiful display we were watching.

I still can't beleive that such a small investment could give me the total viewability that I currently have. LIFE IS GOOD IN MOON TWP.

I must again thank Mark, and everyone who has posted. I have found this thread to be a most valuable asset. I hope you all don't mind if I stick around for awhile and become a part of the community.

THANK YOU

Welcome. Glad it worked out for you! Wait until you see Monday Night Football. It will blow your mind. Only bad thing is you get disappointed when things aren't in HD.

thier signal has always been the weakest.... had to go out and get the zenith silver antenna to get it to come in... but this time last year (from like i said july to maybe february?) i got a perfect singal.... depending on how much i wanted to tweak it... 70's 80's or higher....

its like i said.... same antenna same places i cnt get it to bump over 3 or 4 or 5

something is very very different with thier signal...... no idea why ? :(

was hoping someone could shed some light.... (i mean are they in bed with comcast or something?) its weird..... :) :(

No joke....trees affect the signal...i can get WTAE when there are leaves on the trees, but no signal when there are not.

Currently I an unable to pick up 38, 42 & 43 because of the trees being full of leaves. It starts every year around May. Come the end of September, I'll be back in business.

Mark, Nice job with the game on Saturday.

i've ruled out trees and weather as it was this time exactly last year that it came in perfect :(

i've ruled out trees and weather as it was this time exactly last year that it came in perfect :(

Greetings,

Does WPGH-DT show any of the games in Fox Widescreen? If not, is there a particular reason why? It sucks to see the game in 4:3 480i, after seeing the CBS, ESPNHD, and ABC feeds in HDTV. At least you would think we could see the Fox games in Widescreen.

Nope, Sinclair has no plans to pass the network feeds on WPGH or WCWB. Maybe by the time Fox goes 720p they will feel like doing it. See this thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=287554) for more info.

Thanks for the Thread. Not happy about what I've read so far. Oh well, I have the NFL ST so I'll only watch WPGH when absolutely necessary.

Originally posted by jaquestati
speaking of hd football is there any glimmer of hope that WTAE will turn thier signal back up to where it was like a year ago? the first 6 months i had hdtv wtae came in fine now i get almost no signal at all..... none...... with mnf coming up i'm starting to panic...

what the heck are they playing at????

I haven't been on here in a while but now that football season is upon us I tried tuning in WTAE digital to get the preseason MNF game in HD and, as usual...NO SIGNAL was the message my Sammy TS160 spewed forth.

I'm mad...:mad:

WTAE has long claimed they can't do anything because they're not licensed by the FCC to boost power. Bullsh*t I say...

Several months ago I contacted their consumer reporter and asked her to do a story of complaint on her on station. She tried to discuss the matter with me but since she knew absolutely nothing about HD it was a waste of both our time.

Yesterday, I noticed in the P-G a reporter had a television article called "Tuned In". I sent him a detailed email about this issue of NO power from WTAE. Surprisingly, I have yet to hear back from him.

C'mon folks...the only way to get WTAE off their unresponsive butts is to complain...so won't some of you PLEASE join with me and complain to any and all media?

Thanks...

Originally posted by jaquestati
again nobody seems to reply when i ask this.... but is wtae ever going to go back up to signal power that they had most all of last year?

the first 6 months or so i had hd (like july to february this past year) wtae was great got high signal with the silver sensor if i put the antenna in the right spot...

for the past 6 months or so i am lucky to get a 4 or 5 signal and definately no picture... its driving me nuts with mnf coming up :(

has anyone heard anything about why they lowered thier signal so much?? and if its permanent....?

Friend...

You keep referring to WTAE having greater power a year ago. They never had squat to begin with!! If they reduced power from a year ago, trust me...they would be down to ZERO.

Unless you live on top of a hill/mountain outside of their tower or unless you live right next door to them...you WILL NOT get their signal. And to the few of you that do regardless...great...I'm happy for you but what about the thousands of us that don't?

Read my post above...start complaining folks...NOW before another NFL and MNF season goes by again.

Originally posted by Mark Vidonic
No joke....trees affect the signal...i can get WTAE when there are leaves on the trees, but no signal when there are not.

Yeah, and, if I'm lucky...I can get their signal when it's winter (low clouds that drive the signal downward) or when it thundering out (same reason) or when the stars are perfectly aligned (ok, that last one's stretching it but you get my point)

Actually, my point is that if WTAE put out the power of KDKA or even WPXI we wouldn't be having this discussion. They're too freakin' cheap to do what they need to do and, in my humble opinion, are taking what they perceive to be a short term benefit route. I believe they feel HD and the federal mandate by '06 will go the way of the federally mandated metric system that never happened.

They are wrong and anyone that buys there saying: "Sorry, FCC rules prevent us from pumping up the power" is incredibly gullible.

Start complainin' folks...

Hey guys, here is the skinny from someone (me), that is now connected to the limited HD programming provided by Comcast in the Pittsburgh area now. I live in the Irwin area, and Greensburg is my most immediate Comcast outlet. You CAN get WTAE "HD programs" on Comcast!!! It is cable channel 780. Major problem is that 99.9% of the programs are in 4:3 format. I have a new Panasonic plasma, and that, as most of you know is not good for the TV burn-in problems. There was ONE pleasant surprise: the Monday night football game was in full widescreen 16:9!!!!!!!!!!!! The picture was beautiful!!!!!! I figured that WTAE was NOT able to screw up the broadcast signal. Secondary problem is the audio. It is VERY low when you tune to the station (cable channel 780). You have to really crank up the volumn on your tuner or a/v receiver.

ESPNHD, WQEDHD, ShowtimeHD and the HBOHD ALL come in really well. Have NO complaints there. Comcast is promising to continually add more HD channels. I truly believe that they are trying to do this!!! With AT&T Digital Cable a while back ago, they were doing nothing to enhance our viewing pleasure. My personal opinion!!!!!!!!

Here is a link to the Pgh Comcast thread for members who need more info.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=283087

Need help with Pittsburgh reception. I live in kittanning, about 50 miles northeast of Pittsburgh with a Sony 200 receiver, outdoor anttena with rotor and a mast mounted amp. My reception has been very good on all digital channels for almost a year now, yes even wtae-dt as being the weakest with only a few dropouts. Here's my problem: a storm came through here last week and ever since my reception has been lousy with all the digital channels much weaker with wtae-dt and wpxi-dt just showing a blip on my signal meter and not locking in at all. Even kdka-dt is much weaker. I checked the antenna and amp and both seem to be okay after the storm. I even tried moving the antenna up and down some with no luck. Any input would be much appreciated.

You didn't mention your analog reception. How's it? Originally posted by gmc9512
Need help with Pittsburgh reception. I live in kittanning, about 50 miles northeast of Pittsburgh with a Sony 200 receiver, outdoor anttena with rotor and a mast mounted amp. My reception has been very good on all digital channels for almost a year now, yes even wtae-dt as being the weakest with only a few dropouts. Here's my problem: a storm came through here last week and ever since my reception has been lousy with all the digital channels much weaker with wtae-dt and wpxi-dt just showing a blip on my signal meter and not locking in at all. Even kdka-dt is much weaker. I checked the antenna and amp and both seem to be okay after the storm. I even tried moving the antenna up and down some with no luck. Any input would be much appreciated.

TV21CHIEF,

My analog reception is also worse after the storm.

If you had a lot of lightening, I would have to say that it got into your antenna system. I'm assuming you used a ladder to raise the antenna and didn't climb up a tree branch that was leaning against your house. :) While you think your preamp may be OK, it might be partially blown or the cable or interconnecting equipment damaged (splitters and A/B switches and stuff). If so, you're lucky it didn't blow out the front ends of you equipment. I'd bypass everything I could and try to get my hands on another preamp. Good luck.

TV21CHIEF,

Thanks for your input. I disconnected a splitter that I had splitting the antenna signal to my fm receiver and I did gain some signal strength back, but still not what I had before. I will trace everything back to the antenna. I actually thought that my dss receiver did get fried the night of the storm as the standby light on the front display went off after a power surge and I tried several attempts at rebooting until I finally unplugged it for several hours and then it came back on.

Dave Wittmann, Armstrong's director of programming, had this to say in response to my latest email nag :)


The good news is we plan to launch ESPN HD ASAP, hopefully Thursday or Friday of this week. We're working through details now. College and NFL football never looked better!


No word on any other channel though, I would expect to see InHD and Bravo though since I believe they don't want a subscription fee.

WOOHOO Armstrong now has ESPN-HD on channel 185, and it's included in the $5/mo HD package!

Quick summary:

I live in Pittsburgh, PA. I bought a RCA 36" HDTV last year when I bought a new house. At the time, I got Direct TV, but didn't want to shell out the extra bucks for an HDTV reciever.

With football season coming up, I decided to explore my options for getting HDTV equipped before the start of the season. I called Direct TV and the best they could offer me was a $125 credit towards the purchase of a HD reciever. About the same time Comcast (which is new to my area after buying AT&T), was offering a free Motorola 5100 Hd reciever and a $400 dish buyback deal.

Sounds great right?

So I signed up with Comcast and was originally scheduled to have them come out last Saturday between 8 and 12. No one ever showed up. I called at 1 and was told someone was on their way. I called at 2. I called at 3. Finally around 5pm I was told that there was a computer glitch and that they'd have to reschedule.

So. . . .

I reschedule for Yesterday (Weds, 9/3). The Comcast contractor (not a real comcast employee) shows up to set me up. When he's setting up the HD box, he tells me that he set it at 480i and that it's almost the same as 1080i. Yeah right. So everything is working good for 20 minutes or so until he leaves. I set the pic to 1080i and everything is great, for about 5 minutes.

The HD box starts going crazy, shutting itself off and then turning back on. I call comcast right away and I'm told this is normal because the box is downloading firmware. I check the firmware and it's the latest version (2.5). The box continued to shut itself off every 10 seconds or so, and when it was on, I realized that the analog channels have a terrible picture compared to my old Direct TV.

So I shut the damn box off and let it go until today hoping that it was a download issue, even though I was almost positive this wasn't the case. Today I had the same problem, and one of the regular digital boxes was going crazy as well. So I call Comcast again and request to speak to a manager. This person knew nothing about the 5100 or HD programing. Finally he tells me to drive to the comcast office and swap boxes. I'm happy with this because I have 20 people coming over tonight expecting to see a HD football game! I show up at the office and I'm told they don't have any HD boxes!!

I have a service appt for tomorrow, but if I get the same tech show up I'm pretty sure it will be a useless visit.

Do yourselves a favor and stay away from comcast.

I called Direct TV today and told them I want my D*sh back! ! ! They can't have someone here for 2 more weeks, but they're going to install a new oval dish and 2 regular recievers. They'll then waive all of the installation charges and the cost of the dish and recievers once I buy a hd reciever for $399.

It will be the best $399 I ever spent!!

Screw comcast

Some of you may have read of my recent rantings about WTAE and their non-power digital station.

Anyhow, as previously noted, I contacted Rob Owens, the P-G Television reporter. He contacted WTAE and he sent me an email saying:

"Finally got a response. WTAE was waiting a long time on an FCC approval to boost power. That finally happened and then they ordered the equipment. They expect to boost power by early next year once the equipment is installed."

Check me on this one folks but seems to me we've heard that one before...yes? I could be wrong here and, if so, apologize to WTAE yet I still think it stinks that they've taken this long to have proper power.

Comments?

I live in Springdale and while I can get 25, 38, 42, 43, and 48 perfectly with a Radio Shack double-bowtie antenna, 51 (WTAE) behaves strangely. It will swing between no signal and into the 70s and back again and just keep doing that, it just won't stabilize. Since it seems that I can get a signal since it does jump up so high and actually can be watched for maybe 5 seconds at a time, does anyone have any suggestions for what I can do to make it stable? I suppose I could put up an outdoor antenna and point it that way but is there anything I could try with the antenna I have?

Thanks for your help, I would really love to be able to watch Monday Night Football in HD. I tried watching the game last night, but it's just impossible and a creul joke on me to see flashes of that beautiful picture and then have to go back to SD on DirecTV to actually watch the game. :(

Originally posted by Blitzburgh
"Finally got a response. WTAE was waiting a long time on an FCC approval to boost power. That finally happened and then they ordered the equipment. They expect to boost power by early next year once the equipment is installed."
This is what I understood the situation to be after talking to Kurt Hoss at WTAE a few times. He also indicated that they are building a completely new studio. Regardless, we all have a right to be concerned (pissed) at the current situation. WTAE's digital signal can best be described as ghost like...some days it's here, someday's it's over there. Very frustrating to say the least.
Originally posted by rollins215
does anyone have any suggestions for what I can do to make it stable?.
The only suggestions I have are get a bigger antenna & get it up as high as you can. Surprisingly, attics offer a decent alternative.

Originally posted by agtiny
WOOHOO Armstrong now has ESPN-HD on channel 185, and it's included in the $5/mo HD package!
When I lived in Cranberry, I was an Armstrong customer way before HD. IMO they are one of the better (not perfect) cable operators I have dealt with. Congratulations!
Would you mind posting the current HD line-up for Armstrong?

I agree. They have impressed me so far, although their website could use some updating, and they are missing some great channels I used to get on DirecTV, such as IFC. However, they do have the extra HBO channels DirecTV doesn't have (Zone and Comedy).

HD channels:
102 - KDKA-DT
104 - WTAE-DT
111 - WPXI-DT
113 - WQED-DT
185 - ESPN-HD
190 - SHO-HD
199 - HBO-HD

The US Open on CBS is on right now in HD. The DD5.1 is finally fixed...announcers coming from the center with tennis balls & crowd noise all around you. Check it out, it gave me chills.

agtiny -- when did armstrong get espn-hd? they sound quite well fortified with channels. and here i am happy to be getting half that from comcast. but then again, if inhd is nearly as cool as it seems, it'll beef up their offerings a bit for sure. and from what i hear a cbs deal is not too far off. ::sigh::


dan

They just turned on ESPN yesterday. I expect we'll see INHD as well since they're free.

I posted this as a stand alone separate thread yet if some of you are like me, you oft times go directly to this thread. All of which to say is that in today's P-G, under "Multimedia Answers", it had a Q & A on HD coming through on cable vs. that of the dish. It was informative to me and am passing it along here.


Multimedia Answers: All HDTV not equal among cable providers

Thursday, September 11, 2003

By Don Lindich

Q: I am hearing that a DirecTV HDTV signal is far superior to a HDTV signal from my cable company. Is this true? My cable company is now offering HDTV through its digital service but I understand that this is sometimes a very soft signal. Garbage in and garbage out really has never reached such levels because I know that a bad signal on a great HDTV is only magnified like never before. Can you help? What do you know about this?


-- Mike Freer, Columbus, Ohio

A: The quality of the HDTV signal transmitted over cable systems is wholly dependent on the particular cable company. The quality of the signal will vary depending on the capacity of its system and its philosophy when it comes to image quality and signal transmission. Cable companies have capacity limitations over their cable systems, and an HDTV signal transmitted at full quality takes up a lot of available space. There have been reports that some cable companies offering "HDTV" service are not transmitting HDTV channels at full quality in order to conserve this space for additional pay-per-view offerings, video-on-demand and other similar channels and services.

Digital television signals are composed of millions of digital bits transmitted every second. The more bits, the better the picture. To be considered true HDTV, the signal must be at least 19.4 million bits per second. I recently spoke with a technician installing new capabilities for one of the country's largest cable providers. I asked him what bit rate it was using for HDTV, and he told me it was 10 million bits per second. While such a picture may look good compared with a regular digital channel, it is still well below what a full-quality HDTV signal should be.

A few months ago I received a question similar to yours regarding HDTV via cable. I contacted three cable companies and asked the bit rate being used for their "HDTV." All three said they would get back to me. None of them ever did.

In terms of personal experience, I recently visited a friend who is getting HDTV via cable. She has a Mitsubishi HDTV similar to the one I own. The PBS HDTV demo channel did not have nearly the clarity, vibrancy or visual impact I experience with my Mitsubishi HDTV receiving the same channel via an antenna. While she thought her picture was very good, I imagine she will be disappointed with it when she sees the same channel on my television.

Again, cable companies differ. If image quality is of prime concern to you, I would recommend you stick with HDTV via satellite or via an antenna over-the-air as it is a safe bet. If you would like to give HDTV via cable a try, call and ask a technician what bit rate the company is using for HDTV transmissions. If its HDTV is being broadcast at 19 million bits per second (Mb/s) or greater, you should have picture quality that rivals satellite and over-the-air HDTV transmissions.

Yes, I read that this morning and it caused me a lot of reflection. I had been with Dish for 2 years and suffered through the whole thing with little HD to watch. Sure, I had CBS because the fates smiled down upon me, but it was not enough to make me happy. I subscribed to HBO HD for a year, but that did not help much for I paid an extra $13 and watched movies I had already seen. A subscription to Discovery for a year was even less satisfying. Even though the picture was spectacular, it was not the content I wanted to watch.

That was my situation as D* started a HD package that Dish was in no hurry to match. It was very frustrating and when I saw an opportunity to "jump ship" to Comcast it proved irresistible. They bought back the Dish equipment for $400 in credits (more than I paid) and I sold my 6000 for $250 (more than the cost of a new one with the one year plan just offered.) So what did I gain and what did I lose?

Well, I gained WTAE a local along with WQED another local with National ties. But more than that, I firmly believe that I will soon have WPXI and KDKA as my other locals. That in itself is something very, very desirable. Something that Dish will not match in the future unless new tech changes everything. Maybe, my picture will not be equal to another, but have you seen the content passed along during prime time? Just how would you ever tell that it is not the best that it could be? I refer to it as "Sitcom HD." And yes, it was like that on Dish's CBS also. Only the sports and CSI were special.

So what does all this rambling mean. It means that all is relative to what content do you want, can you compare it something better while you are watching it, and hey, it really is only TV.

That article is pretty unfortunate. Cable currently has a nice bandwidth advantage over satellite, and judging from all the D* compression posts over the last few months, I'm glad I'm with cable now and don't have to worry about them recompressing the channels. Of course the real reason I'm with cable is the local channels.

The degraded DirecTV HD signal is much improved as of late. There is not much to complain about to be honest. Most observers who are able to watch both or even all feeds (Cable, DirecTV, Dish) report no noticeable difference in quality. There is always the exception to this but for the most part it's all good. The author seems to have an agenda.

Originally posted by agtiny
They just turned on ESPN yesterday. I expect we'll see INHD as well since they're free.

Anyone asked Armstrong if they will be carrying INHD?

There are two channels designated "To Be Announced," but they're in the movies tier, not in the HDTV tier.

Originally posted by arobinson
Anyone asked Armstrong if they will be carrying INHD?

There are two channels designated "To Be Announced," but they're in the movies tier, not in the HDTV tier.

I've asked several times. One of the first emails he sent to me when I asked about ESPN and Discovery, he pointed out other channels like INHD and Bravo. I inferred from this he meant they were more likely to be added. The last email I got he only mentioned ESPN though. I will probably email again next week after both INHD channels are live.

The WTAE FCC wait is BS they have had a Construction Permit to upgrade to 1000Kw since 4/23/02. One of the problems with early stations like WTAE (they were awarded their original permit in 1998) was that although lower power would cover the city of license with the necessary signal level on paper maps, it really wasn't known what the signal would do in real world situations. Gambling on that lower power would work several of these early stations applied for lower power and it didn't work. They were licensed and stuck with the lower power, and needed to apply for an upgrade. However, it has been over a year since the FCC granted WTAE a Construction Permit to upgrade it's power. So the waiting on the FCC is pure BS. It is more like waiting to get enough money.

So I don't confuse anybody. The lower power stations applied for wasn't an STA (Special Temporary Authority). The early stations applied for the power that they thought would work.

The data from these early stations have actually helped later stations apply for necessary power levels.

One thing to remember is that all this is still experimental. It is still not known if DTV on Ch.2-6 is feasable. Stations operating DTV on those channels will submit information to the FCC on how well DTV on these channels work. So far DTV on those channels are showing problems with electrical noise.

We still don't know the necessary real world power levels for LPTV and Translator stations. The FCC is proposing power levels of 300 watts VHF and 15Kw UHF. BTW WCWB's STA was for 20Kw and I could receive the STA here in Wheeling. So LPTVs on UHF will probably be able to increase their coverage areas.

Also remember that this is a transition period, and we all need to be patient. Once the transition is complete then we can complain all we want. Just getting these stations on the air is an accomplishment. There are also many things that haven't come into play yet such as on channel booster stations for problem reception areas.

Now a question :) Is anyone receiving audio on 50-WPCB? I haven't received audio on their station for about a month.

Some info:

After WTOV put up their new tower and left the DTV operation on a piece of the old tower I can no longer receive them. WTRF is experimenting with their signal again. Good thing is I receive them all the time now. Bad thing is they have stopped HD broadcasts, convert analog to SD, and compress the signal so much that the digiatl artifacting is so bad to make it unwatchable. Rumor has it that WTRF's owners will multicast a West Virginia News Channel on their digital stations.

Am I the only one in Pittsburgh having problems with KDKA OTA having a video stuttering problem?

I have an RCA DTC-100 and posted about this problem this past April during the Masters. Kent, I believe, spoke to someone at KDKA who verified the problem and a fix was supposed to be on the way.

Does anybody know if this was "fixed" by KDKA?

Anyone else with a DTC-100 having the same problem?

I get other OTA and DirecTv HD without any stuttering of the video BTW.

Thanks.

Jantzen,

I have a DTC-100 and noticed the small freezes on this afternoons HD football game. It's the first I have noticed it though. Just assumed that is was a "CBS" glitch.


Bryan27,

I have noticed that the audio seems to take for ever to come in on WPCB-DT, but it eventually will come on for me.


--Clint--

Clint,

I also noticed it during some of the US Open coverage - though the video "hiccups" seemed worse during the football game today.

I didn't see anybody complaining about any video skipping problems in the main "CBS NFL" thread in the programming forum so I don't think it was a CBS problem - maybe a KDKA one???

Jantzen

I saw a bit of stutter during the first few minutes of the Eagles game on KDKA via cable... so it's not your receiver.

I talked to George again at KD a couple of weeks ago about this unfixed "hitch" in the video. They are aware of what causes it. It is the station "bug" in the corner causing the conflict with the video. They experimented with turning the "bug" off & on during the Comcast HD game which did help. I guess money ultimately will solve the problem. (Duh)

Calling the station to complain may speed things up since KD is under the impression that there just aren't many viewers.

I watched yesterday's game on NFLST on DirecTV & I can attest to some dropouts but only occasionally.

Is there a particular phone number to call at KDKA to complain about this problem? Is George the person to talk to over there or someone else?

Thanks.

Call the main station number & ask for Master Control....Talk to an engineer if possible....George is a go-between.

Speaking of "bugs" has anyone noticed the really bad slide WPXI puts up sometimes for the hourly ID and gets stuck there occasionally. This bug really needs to be cleaned up it has 3 black horizontal lines that aren't supposed to be there and is really bright. When I see it stuck there I watch something else.

Is it really necessary to have 3 ID bugs on the screen?

Hey bryan27...that post you made on WTAE was excellent and informative. Thanks...and insofar as a station without sound...yes, WPCB, CH 50 offers sight but no sound out here in Cranberry.

Thank's at least I know it's not my equipment. Sometimes I'll watch WPCB when there is a Fishing or Cooking show on.

I have completed new DTV Coverage Maps. I guess this is now Version 3.0 Instead of just posting random coverage maps I created a site for them. Also instead of posting coverage of STAs (which are constantly changing), CPs, LICs, etc... I just made maps of stations that are Licensed or have a Construction Permit to Maximized Facilities. For instance instead of a coverage map of WCWB's STA and CP the map only shows the CP, or in the case of KDKA which is licensed for around 700Kw the map only shows their CP for 1000Kw (their Maximized Facilities).

The maps were drawn using the F(50/90) Noise Limited DTV Contour. The contours I previously used were good for when we didn't know much about DTV, but things have advanced and the new maps are more accurate. Since all the stations are UHF the 41dBu signal level was used.

Currently Pittsburgh, Wheeling/Steubenville, and Youngstown are up. Johnstown/Altoona maps are being worked on. Later I may add Erie and Clarksburg/Weston which will cover every station in the region that may be remotely receivable 90% of the time.

Have Fun :)

http://wvjw.info/dtv/

Very much appreciated Bryan. Thanks.

Originally posted by bryan27
Some info:

After WTOV put up their new tower and left the DTV operation on a piece of the old tower I can no longer receive them. WTRF is experimenting with their signal again. Good thing is I receive them all the time now. Bad thing is they have stopped HD broadcasts, convert analog to SD, and compress the signal so much that the digiatl artifacting is so bad to make it unwatchable. Rumor has it that WTRF's owners will multicast a West Virginia News Channel on their digital stations. [/B]

Bryan...again you only have part of the information...WTOV moved the digital antenna from the old tower to the new tower...it was off the air for a couple of days while the move was happening, but the old tower is down and gone..it is still not at the proper height as we are still waiting for the canadians to give permission..plus there is a new analog transmitter and it and the antenna are both installed and up to full power.

if you have any questions ask and you can get correct information...

I'm thinkin' steubtv is a wee bit sensitive here...:D

Ya think?

PS Keep in mind folks that a bb forum of this or any kind is ONE DIMENSIONAL, with respect to communication. We're all in this together for the common good of HD...thanks! And thanks to all of you for the significant help you've been to me personally over the course of the past two years...:)

Steubtv,

Two weeks ago the digital was still on the old tower. The bottom 150' of the old tower was still there with the digital antenna on it. I assumed it hadn't been moved to the old tower yet since I still couldn't receive the digital signal when the new tower went up.

Unless the 150' section of old tower I saw at the site two weeks ago with the digital antenna on it wasn't really there.

I know all about the new analog antenna and transmitter. I can't receive the analog anyway. However, it still doesn't explain the fact that I saw with my own eyes the digital antenna on 150' of old tower two weeks ago and since the new tower went up I can no longer receive the digital signal. It doesn't matter anyway I'll just watch WPXI.

on another note....


why am i not surprised that here it is september 17th and still we don't have the inhd channels on comcast? aaargh, why does it seem like pittsburgh is always the exception to the rule....


dan

Has anyone noticed audio problems on KDKA starting yesterday? The audio cuts out for a split-second or so every 5 minutes.

Yeah, I've noticed it.

Didn't notice any audio dropouts on KDKA last night, but I sure wish they'd get a handle on their Dolby Digital issues. They seem determined to flip the 5.1 switch (or whatever) when the network is not feeding 5.1 audio. They turn on 5.1. when the HD feed(s) start and turn it off before going into local news. But absolultely nothing comes out of the center speaker. *sigh* A lot earlier this summer I remember talking to a KD engineer who wasn't too receptive to the idea that they might not being doing their audio correctly. Oh well, I guess we're set for when CBS actually does start doing 5.1. Just wish KD's engineers would talk to the engineers at WTAE ... they've been doing 5.1. audio correctly for a long time now.

I noticed it last night but not every 5 minutes. Maybe every 10-15 minutes.

When I try to watch WTAE OTA in HD I am getting a delay in the sound. I never noticed this before. Anyone else have this problem. I am getting over 80% on all the local stations and the only one with the delay it WTAE.