Vertical bar on Sonys when viewing 1080i [Text View] - Page 3

ADU

01-17-04, 04:12 PM

A few random thoughts....1. Select RF input and enter service mode. Change "OP HDPT" to 0. VERY IMPORTANT THAT RF INPUT IS SELECTED BEFORE THIS CHANGE IS MADE. Write data. Go to step 2.
2. Select a 1080i DVI input. Is the vertical bar visible? If yes, go to 3. If no, go to 4.
3. Countermeasure circuitry not mounted or applied incorrectly. Check/add the missing parts listed on the service bulletin or replace the "B" Board. Go to step 2.
4. Is a 1080i DVI source available? If yes, go to step 5 . If no, go to step 9.
5. Select DVI 1080i output on the source. Select Video 7 input on the set. go to step 6.
6. Enter service mode, then choose "vivid mode" in the user menu. Modify the following data: 2170P_3 SHOF=2, 2170P_3 F1LV=2, 2170P_1 CBOF=38, 2170P_1 CROF=38. Write the data. Go to step 7.
7. Choose "standard mode" in the user menu, then modify the following data: 2170P_3 SHOF=3, 2170P_3 F1LV=3. Write the data. Go to step 8.
8. Choose "movie mode" in the user menu, then modify the following data: 2170P_3 F1LV=1. Go to step 14.
9. Connect a component 1080i video source to video 5. Select video 5 input on the set. Go to step 10.
10. Enter service mode, then choose "vivid mode" in the user menu. Modify the following data: 2170P_3 SHOF=2, 2170P_3 F1LV=2, 2170P_1 CBOF=37, 2170P_1 CROF=37. Write the data. Go to step 11.
11. Choose "standard mode" in the user menu, then modify the following data: 2170P_3 SHOF=3, 2170P_3 F1LV=3. Write the data. Go to step 12.
12. Choose "movie mode" in the user menu, then modify the following data: 2170P_3 F1LV=1. Go to step 13.
13. While viewing the 1080i signal in any picture mode, confirm that the following data is correct: CXA2151 YGN=7. CXA2151 CBGN=8, CXA2151 CRGN=8. Go to step 15.
14. Is there a 1080i component source available? If yes, go to step 9. If no, go to step 13.
15. Countermeasure implementation complete.FWIW, these SM adjustments from an earlier post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=2108018#post2108018) in the thread appear to be designed to tweak the PQ of 1080i after the HDPT bypass. They probably won't make a radical night and day difference though. I'm afraid some/much of the Sony signature look on these TVs may come from the A/D/A conversion and DRC/MID circuits which are bypassed after the HDPT 1080i patch. And since the above is old secondhand info, for all we know Sony may have some new procedures that supersede this now.

FWIW, Step #13 effects all the picture modes of 1080i, so that is the most basic adjustment, and it will change saturation a bit. It will also alter color balance slightly. If you have done a red push or grey scale fix on your TV these may need some slight readjustment as well after the above.

If you want to take a crack at self-calibration some of the tips in the xbr910 service menu thread might be worth looking at. Or if you're not that handy, then having the TV ISF'd (to fix the grey scale and red push) after the HDPT bypass (if you're to committed to using it) might be worth consideration.

akadennis

01-17-04, 10:56 PM

Hey ADU, thanks for all the tips. Are those settings for the Sony KV36HS510? If they are then I will give it a try, I hope it works.

ADU

01-18-04, 12:33 AM

See Post #277 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=2108018#post2108018) and the remarks from other HS510 users in the thread, and proceed at your own peril. :)

cajieboy

01-18-04, 10:57 AM

ADU,

It's curious how this verticle line problem is hit & miss. Some folks have it, some don't. I've yet to see it on my 40XBR mfg. in Dec.'02, and I have 1080i HD connected w/component to a Scientific Atlanta 3100HD STB. Thus far, I have not checked out the DVI connection.

davehancock

01-18-04, 12:35 PM

cajieboy,

I sure is hit and miss. Some earlier posts had some conjecture about HV wire placement in the cabinet that make a lot of sense. But there clearly is some variability.

I've had the problem only on DVI, and in my case the line went the other way (left to right). The SM changes did not effect it, but the board replacement (with the SM changes) did. My set (34XBR800) had been isf calibrated and I did not notice the degradation of picture that others have talked about.

DoctorO

01-18-04, 04:47 PM

My line, too, is left to right, and only on DVI, as well. 1080i through component inputs (HD D-VHS) does not show it.

ADU

01-18-04, 05:16 PM

It's curious how this verticle line problem is hit & miss. Some folks have it, some don't. I've yet to see it on my 40XBR mfg. in Dec.'02, and I have 1080i HD connected w/component to a Scientific Atlanta 3100HD STB. Thus far, I have not checked out the DVI connection.It think it's all about the hardware. Some batches of TVs were just mfr'd a bit different than others.

BTW, if there's a loss in sharpness and clarity, then Velocity Modulation might be worth exploring as well on the HS510. Since implementing the bypass, I keep Clear Edge VM around Low to Medium on my 34xbr800, to add a bit more bite back into the images. I don't know if the HS510 has User Menu options for this, but if not, it might be something that could be tweaked in the service menu.

akadennis

01-18-04, 09:18 PM

Thanks for all the advice I read on here. I have made a few changes in the Service menu and all have worked well. I have been switching back and forth from 0 and 1 on the HDPT setting. 1 is definitely clearer, sharper and brighter, the contrast level is near perfect. If it wasn't for that damn vertical bar that I can't seem to not notice. 0 setting on HDPT would have been perfect had I never saw how it looks set to 1 :-). 0 looks almost perfect. If only I could find a contrast setting in the Service menu, maybe i can get the picture to look like HDPT is set to 1 without the vertical lines.

Update :-) I just set the brightness, shapness all the way up and the color level about 3 quaters up while watching a DVD, i did all this from the "user manual" on vivid mode. This is as close to perfect as I can get it while watching a dvd with the HDPT set to 0. Unfortunately this setting only works for DVD movies. I have to tweak my cable connection now, looks a little to bright now with this setting. Damn why can't they work together with the same settings.

Timmer1970

01-19-04, 10:59 PM

Hey, I was just wondering if anyone knew from knowledge or experience whether my kv-30hs510 has the chip mentioned in this thread which is needed to make the hdpt fix? First of all, I have not tried my set with the dvi or component at 1080i so I don't know if it has the scrolling bar problem. Second of all, my set was manufactured in Tijauna, Mexico in September 2003 and has a DA4 chassis. I have looked through the side for the chip but it is hard to see in there and the only thing I have noticed as far as the vertical green board goes is that it is labeled with an A with a circle around it. Sooo, I am wondering if I should force the issue of making sure all is well before my 90 days parts and labor warranty is up? Thanks to ADU and MONTREAL for all the great info so far, this thread rocks!

Timmer

lucius

01-20-04, 08:39 AM

We have the 34HS510 has the same manual as that TV, purchased a few months back the vertical bars come on only during a 1080i cable source, but it is very faint on this TV. It's weird I have hooked up 1080i games to this TV that never show this bar,(I am using component). It's only really noticeable when I switch the cable box off and I look for it for a few seconds, very rarely I can see it on a movie with dark scenes. I tried that service mode fix set it to "O" and that does indeed fix the line going across the screen, but the picture quality isn't as nice, it still looks great but there is a difference. I actually switched it back to the setting "1" the default, I much rather have this better overall PQ with some slight lines that I rarely see. I almost always use vivid or standard mode, pro I use hardly ever for some 480i regular TV. I may not be the most technical guy, but I can tell the difference between S-video source and component pretty quick when going over to other peoples houses. I have been looking for the lines during the CBS HD football games and some CBS HD shows but never noticed it. Someone else in the thread mentioned Road to Perdition and sure enough I did notice it one time but have tried watching the movie again just to look for it but didn't see it, I am starting to wonder if different HD channel broadcasts it will be more noticeable (the same movie). Anyway I think I may be trying to analyze my screen more than watching it lately. I still say this TV is great the picture is superb and would buy it again the positives still out weigh the negatives.

akadennis

01-20-04, 01:19 PM

I am scheduled to have a tech look at my tv tomorrow regarding this vertical bar problem. I wonder if it's even worth it. Maybe they know of another fix that doesnt degrade the PQ. I guess I will have to wait and see.

lucius

01-21-04, 12:11 AM

The big thing for me was if I could see it during other really dark movies or just dark scenes and I am not noticing them, can't seem to reproduce it and I am looking for it. For some reason it didn't like the Road to Perdition black credit screen though, but I have been looking for it in other black credit screens and don't see it. It is kind of strange it is likely partially source dependent, also I am guessing Sony has made adjustments because of what others describe before sound bad. I 'm sure a qualified technician can get it to where PQ is not really noticeable, but I really don't trust too many of them, some of the people on this board I bet know more, you might get a good one though. Also some people seem to like a soft look, I can see why it might be describe as a pure source, kind of like what many movie theaters play the movies at, I however never liked this and like things vivid and a bit sharper.

akadennis

01-21-04, 11:47 AM

Well the tech called and asked what problem I was having, I told him about the vertical bar problem and he said he would have to order a board. I'm not sure what board he said but I will keep all posted. My only concern is I hope I did not void my warranty by telling Sony about going into the service mode and applying the fix I read about. Stupid me did not even think about this when speaking to them on the phone. As soon as I mentioned Service Mode to the Sony rep he began typing what appeared to be our whole conversation, man was he typing fast. I also mentioned to the tech about the fix I read about and he was like oh no don't do that as if you had to be a rocket scientist to do so. I told him I did no such thing, unfortunately I already told Sony I did. Hopefully the board is covered under my warranty and not voided cause I went into the service mode.

Woodrow

01-23-04, 03:13 AM

Originally posted by akadennis
Well the tech called and asked what problem I was having, I told him about the vertical bar problem and he said he would have to order a board. I'm not sure what board he said but I will keep all posted. My only concern is I hope I did not void my warranty by telling Sony about going into the service mode and applying the fix I read about. Stupid me did not even think about this when speaking to them on the phone. As soon as I mentioned Service Mode to the Sony rep he began typing what appeared to be our whole conversation, man was he typing fast. I also mentioned to the tech about the fix I read about and he was like oh no don't do that as if you had to be a rocket scientist to do so. I told him I did no such thing, unfortunately I already told Sony I did. Hopefully the board is covered under my warranty and not voided cause I went into the service mode.

OK. I'll TRY and help out. How long EXACTLY have you owned the set you called Sony about?

From this moment forward DO NOT ENTER THE SERVICE MENU. Others may say it's all right but don't do it again. Find an ISF tech that is also a Sony service tech. They are allowed to go in there AND they know what they're doing. Not all Sony service techs do. You can get in the phonebook and call every place that carries Sony sets, not CC and BB. I'm talking the smaller places that may also carry Rotel or Fujitsu. Or maybe they just sell the regular stuff but have ISF techs on staff. The trick with this approach is to find one of these places that service sony sets that they may not have sold out of their store. Most won't, but I found one that would and Sony never told me this place was available to service my set, or even existed. They kept pushing this crap ass operation run on the BAD side of town who tried to tell me vertical compression was a defect in a TV. Or they pushed the place that sold me the set. When and if you find this dealer you will now have an ISF tech working on your set under warranty. He can and will tell you what is going on with your set when switching from 1 to 0 in HDPT. Plus he won't try and tell you something is "acceptable" with the set when it's not. Have all non-warranty work done by him in the future. Buy your next set from him. Now you have a relationship with an ISF tech that has been mutually beneficial. Let me know how long you've owned it.

Your biggest problems will be with inept service techs rather than with Sony.

Woodrow

01-23-04, 04:57 AM

Akadennis,

Also, if you can only see this bar at closing credits or something like that you are making a big mistake even having the fix done. Besides the possible PQ differences other things can go wrong. Best to leave the set in brand new condition, never having had the back taken off. Just my opinion. I've been through this though. If I only saw it during credits or something like that I'd have been HAPPY. Watch leno's opening monologue. If you don't see the bar during this, your set is in tip top shape as far as the sweeping bar is concerned. I know it's hard to not think about it, but it WILL pass. Go buy a new set of speakers and in your effort to make sure all the drivers are working good and the sound is right, you'll have forgotten all about the bar. Worked for me anyway.

akadennis

01-23-04, 07:31 AM

Hey Woodrow, thanks for your advice. So your saying I should get an ISF Tech to look at it instead of a Sony authorized service center? The guy I spoked to seemed to believe that a new board will take care of the problem. My problem was the PQ after the fix so I changed it back to 1. Unfortunately the bar does bother me, I guess cause i'm looking for it. It's always there but not always noticeable but when i do see it, it can be annoying. I thought about contacting an ISF about the PQ after the fix but I figured let me see if it clears up with the new board. If not then I guess I will have him put the same one back. You think an ISF can get rid of the vertical bar by calibrating my tv with HDTP set to 1?

Woodrow

01-23-04, 07:46 AM

When EXACTLY do you see the sweeping bar?

It's important I know this before going any further.

Also, are you saying a service tech has never been inside your set but that when you changed 1 to 0 in HDPT you saw a change in PQ for sure?

Also, yes you can get an ISF tech to do the work as long as he's an authorized Sony service tech and willing to do it even though you didn't buy the set from his store. If your not happy with the way the PQ is you can have him come out and make any adjustment you can dream up and he'll write it down and not screw up the set.

akadennis

01-23-04, 08:35 AM

Ok I forgot to answer how long i have the set, 2 1/2 months. I see the bar mostly in dark scenes but I can recreate it by just leaving the tv on and the cable box turned off and there it is, the sweeping bar. it's always there but not always visable when viewing a signal. And yes a service tech has not yet been inside the set and yes I noticed the downgrade in PQ after changing hdtp to 0, so i changed it back to 1

Woodrow

01-23-04, 10:03 AM

Originally posted by akadennis
Ok I forgot to answer how long i have the set, 2 1/2 months. I see the bar mostly in dark scenes but I can recreate it by just leaving the tv on and the cable box turned off and there it is, the sweeping bar. it's always there but not always visable when viewing a signal. And yes a service tech has not yet been inside the set and yes I noticed the downgrade in PQ after changing hdtp to 0, so i changed it back to 1

What do you mean by "leaving the tv on and the cable box turned off" You have to feed it a 1080i signal to get the bar? Somehow your set has already had the fix done if you saw a change when switching between 1 and 0. So I don't see the point in letting anyone in your set. If your worried about telling Sony about getting into the service menu one alternative is to try and get the place you bought it to exchange it for another without involving Sony. The new set will be under a new warranty. They can't void a warranty for a set you don't have anymore. From everything you've said so far I think you should sit back and enjoy the set. Your doing what I did when I first got a Sony HDTV. I nit-picked it to death. The Sony service techs and their fixes aren't going anywhere and hopefully neither is your warranty. I swear to god in a few months it'll be summer and it'll be time to mow the lawn and your gonna look back at the way you obsessed over the tv and laugh.

Woodrow

01-23-04, 10:13 AM

Akadennis,

Everything I'm telling you is what I wish someone had said to me here 6 months ago. I know what your doing, I did it. your looking for the bar everytime you turn the channel. Always checking, always looking. Stop. :) :)

And go get a good 480p DVD player. You won't have to worry about seeing a sweeping bar and you can analyze the hell out of the DVD player PQ. I did this too. It got my mind off the bar, I'm being dead serious. A nice 480p DVD player can look damn near as good as movies shown in HD.

akadennis

01-23-04, 10:32 AM

The 1081i signal stays locked as long as my cable box is set to display 1081i, which it is. The reason I want it fixed is because I read about the vertical bar problem on the sony site and it says that service is required to get it resolved, so if sony or whoever can fix it with HDTP set to 1 then i will try it. So do u think there is no fix for this or do you think having it ISF will fix it. Thanks for all your advice :-) As for an exchange I wish I could, I would probably get the XBR Widescreen 34" but i dont think i can since they only have a 30day return policy, bummer :-(

lucius

01-23-04, 02:25 PM

Anyone know whats the danger in switching this HDTP value from 1 to 0 and back again, since one of the posts in the middle of the thread said it was important to have it tuned into RF. I actually switched it once when it was on the cable input signal, I don't notice anything wrong with my TV but anyone know why it suppose to be important to have it on RF when you do the bypass switch?

The bar wasn't really bothering me, just hope I didn't do any damge to my fairly new TV trying to see if it would help.

Woodrow

01-23-04, 03:16 PM

Originally posted by lucius
Anyone know whats the danger in switching this HDTP value from 1 to 0 and back again, since one of the posts in the middle of the thread said it was important to have it tuned into RF. I actually switched it once when it was on the cable input signal, I don't notice anything wrong with my TV but anyone know why it suppose to be important to have it on RF when you do the bypass switch?

The bar wasn't really bothering me, just hope I didn't do any damge to my fairly new TV trying to see if it would help.

Should be fine. Many have done it. Probably best to switch it inputting something into the RF just in case.

Woodrow

01-23-04, 03:23 PM

Originally posted by akadennis
The 1081i signal stays locked as long as my cable box is set to display 1081i, which it is. The reason I want it fixed is because I read about the vertical bar problem on the sony site and it says that service is required to get it resolved, so if sony or whoever can fix it with HDTP set to 1 then i will try it. So do u think there is no fix for this or do you think having it ISF will fix it. Thanks for all your advice :-) As for an exchange I wish I could, I would probably get the XBR Widescreen 34" but i dont think i can since they only have a 30day return policy, bummer :-(

Even though it's past it's 30 day window you can go in and really beg the manager to switch it for you. He may not, but it's worth trying. I really degraded myself and got the guy to do it 7 months after I bought it.

There is no fix that anyone knows of involving leaving the HDPT at 1.
This is the holy grail of the sony direct-view sweeping bar issue, and nobody's found it yet.
You can give an ISF tech a try. Who knows, right?

akadennis

01-23-04, 03:57 PM

Did they come and pick it up? I cant imagine lugging it over there, it weighs a ton, over 250lbs.

Woodrow

01-23-04, 04:25 PM

Yes, if he agrees to do it you guys will come to some agreement about that. Maybe you pay for a new delivery,(maybe 40 bucks), and he switches it out for nothing, just because your such a nice guy in a real tight spot. :)
Remember, it may take some serious sucking up to get it done, but when your home with your new set you won't care.

skersh

01-23-04, 06:56 PM

I have read all 27 pages of this thread and am very grateful that some of you who have the 36 and 40 inch Sony HDTV's have found a fix...but I have a KD-34XBR2 that was purchased in January of 2001. My set was manafactured in December of 2000. I have the same vertical bar when my Dish 6000 is on 1080i programs. What's weird is that I can't see the bar when my local CBS station or PBS station is doing their 1080i broadcasts...so I only see it with the Dish 6000 only. Is there a service menu or a trick that I can do to make the vertical lines disappear on my older set? By the way, my set is older and doesn't have DVI at all....so Sony can't use that excuse on my system.

deeveedude

01-26-04, 04:03 PM

Just curious - did you get the input 5 mod done? I too have a KD-34XBR2 bought in the same time frame as you but I don't yet have an external HD source hooked up. As this is looks like it might be an input panel issue (you say you don't notice it on CBS/PBS which I assume are OTA for you??, and I haven't seen anything odd OTA), I'm wondering if this may be fixed for me because I had the input 5 thing done.

I guess it'll take the release of HD-TiVo for me to find out......

skersh

01-26-04, 07:00 PM

Yes, CBS and PBS HD are OTA and look fine with no vertical bar. The Dish 6000's 1080i is when I notice the vertical bar on the screen. I was watching "Die Another Day" on SHO-HD last night and there it was....going from right to left...very faintly, but there nonetheless.
I guess I didn't read the "input 5 mod"....what is it? The simple answer is, "no" about whether or not I had it done.

deeveedude

01-29-04, 11:44 AM

Apparently, some KD-34XBR2's (and other Sony HD sets around the same time) had a problem accepting a 480p signal on input 5. I found out the hard way. When I connected my progressive scan DVD player to input 5, the set would switch widescreen modes at odd points during a movie. I did some research here and found out that Sony acknoledged the issue and had a fix. The fix involved having an engineer come out and swap out the input panel. I had it done because I wanted to keep input 6 available for HD-Tivo and didn't want to be restricted to using only interlaced into input 5. The thing is, IF this is an input problem (which it appears to be, as this faint line doesn't appear on OTA sources, even when 1080i), I'm wondering if swapping out the input panel may mean I won't experience it???

freddy14

01-30-04, 12:57 PM

Hey Guys! A Sony tech is coming over next Friday to look at my 40XBR800. He's gonna look into the Vertical scrolling bar and a discoloration in the lower left corner. Is there anything I need to know about beforehand or anything I should tell him? I dont want to get taken for a ride. Thanks.........

Woodrow

01-30-04, 03:56 PM

The only thing I'd suggest is if he changes any service menu settings make him write down the original values first. That way if you don't like the way things look you can have him put it back the way it was. Also, be in the room when he works on it so you'll have an idea what's going on.

freddy14

01-30-04, 04:49 PM

Ok!! Has anyone gotten the scrolling bar issue fixed? Is there a fix? Should I demand a new or different set? What do you guys think?

Pocatello

01-30-04, 11:49 PM

This thread was started on November 13, 2002, after there were many reported problems with the vertical bar when viewing 1080i.

It is now 14 months later!

Hey Sony! what is wrong? Why can't this be fixed!

11/13/02!

hey Sony, do you think you have lost one or two customers because of this problem? You lost me. So sad.

freddy14

02-03-04, 05:05 PM

Has anyone had the scrolling bar issue fixed?

GS kid

02-03-04, 06:20 PM

As one of the original posters on this thread, all I have to say is WOW! I can't believe this thread and problem are still around! My problem was fixed a year ago on my 34xbr800. Sony was very helpful to me. Even taking my number and calling me 2 weeks later when they had the fix. The bar is gone except if I put the 1080i source picture in multi-view with the 1080i of course on the left side. It only appears WITHIN the 1080i window. It's fine when put on the full screen. I hope you guys get a fix!

freddy14

02-03-04, 06:50 PM

What was the fix so I can tell the tech coming over on Friday? I hope its not the 1-0 change in the service menu cause it didnt work on my TV.

davehancock

02-03-04, 09:00 PM

Buried deep in this thread is the fact that TWO things are required for the fix. First (and often forgotten) is that the "B" board needs to be replaced with one that has ALL components (Sony tried to get away without some of the parts) and Then make service menu changes to enable a signal path through the B board using the deleted components. It takes both to complete the fix.

I had my 34XBR "fixed" this way last summer and have been happy since.

freddy14

02-03-04, 09:05 PM

Thanks Dave, I'll mention this to the tech and see what he says. Is it an at-home fix, or does he have to take the TV with him?

davehancock

02-03-04, 09:38 PM

It's in-home & takes about 1/2 hr (takes back off set & exchanges the "B" board - the Non-Volatile Memory (IC3089) from your present board should be transferred to the new board). The service bulletin on this is ID E18728143.

DmbFan1

02-20-04, 06:55 PM

Originally posted by davehancock
Buried deep in this thread is the fact that TWO things are required for the fix. First (and often forgotten) is that the "B" board needs to be replaced with one that has ALL components (Sony tried to get away without some of the parts) and Then make service menu changes to enable a signal path through the B board using the deleted components. It takes both to complete the fix.

I had my 34XBR "fixed" this way last summer and have been happy since.

Please post what the service menu fixes were after they fixed your tv. Your telling me they left the HDPT setting at value 1? They didn't knock it down to "0"? I had a service tech come out yesterday and fix my 910 with service menu adjustments only. He had a replacement tuner with him but he made changes in the service menu and he told me if i had the tuner with fewer parts the tv picture would of went out after he adjusted the settings thus meaning he had to replace the tuner. Good news at my end is that I no longer see the vertical bar at 1080I BUT the PQ dropped after the menu adjustments via HDPT set at "0".
Please let me know what he did to your set.......

Everybody can help also if they have the fix with the HDPT setting at 1...

According to my receipt he made me sign he posted which settings he had to change. I can somewhat understand the writing so if any letters or anything else are wrong please bare with me..........

Heres what he did:
Service OP HDPT 1 to 0
1080I Input can be seen NO /change board
Vivid Mode 2170P3 Shof to 2
2170P3 Filv to 2
2170P1 Cbof to 38
Crof > 38
Std Mode 2170P3 Shof 1 > 3
Filv 0 > 3
Movie Mode 2170P3 Filv 1

LVKeith

02-20-04, 07:36 PM

The "fix" requires that HDPT be set to 0. This unfortunately lowers both sharpness and contrast of the resulting picture. You can make a few tweaks in the service menu to get back some of the lost picture quality, but it still is very lacking in my opinion. There is no fix with HDPT set to 1. That's why I returned mine within the 30 day period. I could not tolerate the lower quality picture (or the vertical bar-my choice, I guess) on a set costing $2,000......

Keith

davehancock

02-20-04, 09:30 PM

DmbFan1,

I have a XBR800 - the 910 is somewhat different. The settings that should be there for a 910 after the SM fix) are:
HDPT = 0 ( in all modes with RF input selected (I'll bet quite a few people don't do this).

With 1080i input:

Vivid Mode:
CBOP = 34, CROP = 32
SHOF=3, F1LV=3, LTMD=0

Standard Mode:
SHOF=3, F1LV=2

Movie Mode:
SHOF=2

YGN=7, CBGN=8, CRGN=8

Note: These values are a little different for other models (XBR800, etc.)

LVKeith:

I don''t disagree that brightness and sharpness are DIFFERENT between DPT =1 and HDPT=0, BUT not necessarily more correct. You'd need a calibrated input (calibration DVD such as Digital Video Essentials) to establish "correct". I've done that (done the full ISF calibration, in fact) and found that I could obtain as good ("correct") a picture on HDPT=0 as I could on HDPT=1. The user controls (brightness, contrast, sharpness and DRC) were just different.

P.S. "Lower Brightness" and "Lower Sharpness" are not necessarily worse and do not necessarily equate to "lowered picture quality".

DmbFan1

02-20-04, 10:06 PM

WOW thanks for the fast reply. What is actually better AVIA or Digital Video Essentials? Also, with those dvds do they have you enter the service menu or they have there own? Please bear with me as I'm such a newbie with the service menu thing....

ps did you read my post what settings the service dude changed?
Now he said that's the exact fix Sony had posted on there service web site.
Also, like I mentioned in the other post he said once he changed the HDPT setting to 0 if the tv didnt go black I already had the B board with the more parts and that the settings weren't set correctly. I guess I can believe him cause he did bring a replacement tuner...........

davehancock

02-21-04, 03:53 PM

DmbFan1,

You caught me at the right time - hence the quick response (note it is not too good today).

First, It looks like he made the correct settings (at least per the Service site). The key is the CBOF & CROF settings are supposed to be 38 on the 910s and 37 on everything else (incidently, these figures (CBOF/CROF) are somewhat arbitrary as the relate to color temp offset for the different modes and are best set using instrumentation (colorimeter or spectrophotometer). It looks like your service dude has this info right. However I suspect that he was wrong on another point. If the "B" board is missing components - changing HDPT from 1 to 0 shouldn't result in the picture going black. At least the service information doesn't say it should and I had missing components and changing HDPT to 0 didn't result in the picture going blank. Also you referred to him bringing a "replacement tuner". The "B" board is not considered a tuner (the tuner is on the "A" board). I suspect that he mis-spoke.

There are several "calibration" DVDs out there. I have 4 of them and generally recommend the "Sound & Vision Home Theater Tune-Up" to non-technical users. It does a pretty decent job of leading you through the adjustments. The new "Digital Video Essentials" is also good - but navigating it is not too clear. Either can be purchased at Amazon.com. Neither requires you to get into the Service Menu - they talk in terms of user controls. Generally, getting into the service menu can be dangerous - but lots of people do get in there. ALWAYS write down all the values (which can take some time on a Sony) before changing ANYTHING in the SM! That way you can get back to where you started.

DmbFan1

02-21-04, 05:36 PM

Thanks "davehancock" for responding.
The fix the service guy applied here involves definitely replacing the "B" board with the more components then the service menu adjustments that he exactly did?
I already called back yesterday and he is coming back out to replace the "B Board. Just has to call and confirm the date
On my receipt it does state the B Board as: SNYP B-Board KV36XBR800
So my 910 uses the same B board as the XBR800?
Also, the vertical line problem is fixed once the TV is warmed up BUT when I cold start my television I still do see the vertical bar. That's why I called for him to come back out and replace the B-Board. I'm wondering if that's why I have that problem when power on the tv.

Once again thanks for all of your knowledge

davehancock

02-21-04, 06:57 PM

DmbFan1,

Yes, the 910 uses the same "B" board as the 800.

Best viewing to you!

DmbFan1

02-21-04, 07:27 PM

THE BAR IS BACK!!!!!
THE BAR IS BACK!!!!!
I see it fulltime now

THE BAR IS BACK!!!!!

Will the new board with the same setting as he did correct this for good?

davehancock

02-21-04, 07:34 PM

It should.

DmbFan1

02-21-04, 07:43 PM

I hope it does cause if not I'm goin DLP.
To much money for all of this to happen.....
Although I had this set since 12/9/03 I'm gonna have to argue till I get store credit. I got this set at Tweeter and I sure hope they stand by it...

DLPs seem sweet but as sweet as they seem the bulb life is only 8000 hours, which is not that long to me.....

akadennis

02-22-04, 06:09 AM

I too have the 910 and have begun to notice this vertical bar. This is my second sony set in 5 months. I had the 36 inch 510 which also had the vertical bar. I decided to do a switch for the 910. The average person would probably not even notice this vertical bar. It was more noticable on the 510, not so much on the 910 but i'ts definately there. I'ts most noticable when I turn off my cable box and leave my tv on with no picture and wala theres the bar. It really doesnt bother me as much as the 510 did because it's hardly noticable when i am watching tv. I might see it once or twice during a television program, only if i am looking for it, which in my case is hard not to do :-). I'm curious if changing the board fixes the problem without degrading the picture quality. I was going to have the board changed on my 510 and at the last minute decided to do an exchange. The service center I was dealing with had to return the board. I can't believe this is still going on with sony sets, my set says it was manufactured in January 2004, I would think it would have been fixed by this time. If only Circuit City carried Toshiba sets I would have exchanged it for one of those. I thought Sony was the best, I will never buy a Sony HDTV set again.

DmbFan1

02-22-04, 10:39 AM

Applying the fix does degrade picture quality. I mean still you get a great picture on 1080I channels BUT no where near as spectacular as the factory settings. I to have the same problem as you (read all of the above posts) and I am very disappointed at sony for letting me down after all of these years swearing by and owning Sony TV's....
Still if you look at the latest consumer reports issue and the TV ratings in it the 910 smoked the competition as the best set in it's class so go figure.
Sony has to really figure out a fix though without degrading any picture quality cause if there wasn't the vertical bar issue in the standard factory settings this TV easily would have the best picture of any TV out there bar none. (Plasma, LCD, DLP, CRT, etc.)
Every TV review I read listed the 910 as flawless so go figure.......

akadennis

02-22-04, 02:56 PM

hey DmbFan1, did you have the board replaced on your tv?

DmbFan1

02-22-04, 04:24 PM

no. The service guy had it with him but he didn't change it. He told me to call and request service once again if the bar reoccurs and he'll replace it then, and YES it's back so I already called him once again.......

By the way, anybody wanna chat about this feel free to IM me anytime......

My name AOL IM is: ARJRug
You and anybody also with this problam feel free to IM me anytime.

DmbFan1

02-22-04, 10:25 PM

Since this TV cannot be corrected with HDCP set at 1 I'm seriously thinking about complaining and going back to where I purchased the set at and returning it. How does the Panasonic 34" CT-34WX53 compare to the 910?

DmbFan1

02-22-04, 10:55 PM

davehancock
Quick question?
Since the service guy didn't put the new "B" board in but adjusted the settings correctly do you think that's why my picture quality dropped dramatically? You think when he replaces the B board the picture will be literally flawless like it used to be out of the box?

davehancock

02-23-04, 11:20 AM

DmbFan1,

Again, I do not agree with the statement that the "Picture Quality" has been degraded when the HDPT is set to 0. As I stated in my earlier post - it is just different. I've checked mine both ways with calibration DVDs and instruments and the picture quality (brightness, contrast, sharpness) can be set to be the same at both positions!

In regards to your specific question: I wouldn't think that replacing the board would make a large difference in the picture parameters you are talking about. By the way, the reason for replacing the "B" board is that some of the components that are needed for the picture to properly "synch up" (and thus not show the bar) have been left offf the "B" board. I had thought that the newer sets (910) always had the parts.

For those of you looking at other sets - check around, you will find that the other 34" sets have their problems too! I don't buy everything that Consumer Reports says - but I have checked out (with instrumentation) both the 34" Panny and Toshiba sets and I'll say that the Sony (with HDPT set to 0) is the best.

akadennis

02-23-04, 02:35 PM

Hey Dave Hancock, I have a question for you, and forgive me if this has already been answered. Are there any other values that should be changed when I do the HDPT fix (set to 0)? I have the Sony34XBR910.

Thank you.

DmbFan1

02-23-04, 03:38 PM

Thanks so much davehancock and everybody else for answering all of my questions. I have confidence in this TV and probably if I get another brand such as the Panny or the Toshiba I'd for sure be unhappy since I literally swear by Sony's. Just this problem really shocked me coming from a SONY TV as the past XBR sets I've owned always worked flawlessly (maybe I was young and dumb at that time to see any problems).
I just so wanna get all my brightness, sharpness, and contrast back then for sure I'll be so happy once again with my 910.......
Dave, was there a lot of tweaking to do to almost restore the same picture? Hope not that much........
I need those calibration DVDs already damn it!!!
lol
Thanks once again........

davehancock

02-23-04, 05:09 PM

akadennis,

Yeah, it is kind of difficult to dig through 29 pages on this thread. I did give these values on 2/20 (back a couple of pages). I don't really know what some of these parameters do - just know that is what Sony says that they should be. CBOF and CROF relate to color temp and the "correct" values really are determined as part of an isf calibration.

DmbFan1,

No, there are not a lot of tweaks to be done: contrast, brightness, sharpness. Once you get the cal DVD you'll readily see where the correct settings are.

DmbFan1

02-23-04, 10:14 PM

WOW I'm learning a lot ever since I signed up in here. Once again thanks so much for all the help.

Just tonight I encountered hopefully a reception problem while viewing the 76ers game in HD. While watching the game the screen would slightly unfocus every 30 seconds or so. Hopefully it's not my TV but who knows. I'm wondering because the settings in the service menu have been changed but changed without the B Board.
Maybe that's why?

DmbFan1

02-23-04, 10:34 PM

Dave,
Which Digital Video Essentials would I need to calibrate HD 1080I?
I don't have a D-VHS.

Iceblade

02-24-04, 10:15 AM

DmbFan1,

Without a D-VHS, there is currently no input media (DVD, D-VHS, etc) that provides a 1080i (nor 720p) set of test signals with which to calibrate. DVE exists in DVD format, but that was done in 480p, not 1080i. Basically you are in the same boat as the rest of us unless you want to purchase a very expensive HD signal generator like some of the ISF calibrators use.

Regards,
Jeff

davehancock

02-24-04, 11:26 AM

DmbFan1,

Don't know what the temporary defocussing is about. Doubt if it is anything to do with the B board. Did it just occur during the game?

Regarding "what DVD". Iceblade is only partially correct. Digital Video
Essentials is available in either 1080i or 720p in D-VHS. Further, there are some DVD players out there (Bravo D1, Samsung HD931) that provide either 1080i or 720p output on DVI from a DVD (which has done in 480p).

But with the Sony, the adjustments that I am talking about doing with a calibration DVD are independent of 1080i or whatever - so you can do them with your current DVD player. This statement is not necessarily true on other brands.

The Sound & Vision DVD is more straightforward than the Digital Video Essentials, and is what I would recommend for newbies.

DmbFan1

02-24-04, 05:14 PM

I ordered Avia and Digital Video Essentials just last night and they'll both be here tomorrow (Thursday).
So Dave, to make a long story short, if I use the DVDs correctly and adjust everything according to Video Essentials and Avia my 1080I signal will also look a lot better besides DVDs and Regular programming?

Also, can you adjust the sharpness on the 910 while in 1080I mode?
Service guy told me it's literally useless so leave it turned all the way down. (I hate a soft picture, I like a razor style picture, that's why I'm so disappointed with the adjustments made to my TV with HDPT set at 0)
Can I retain a razor like picture with HDPT set at 0?

davehancock

02-24-04, 05:29 PM

The repair person probably deals with a lot of different brands of TV and in many cases the sharpness should be all the way down. My experience with the Sony XBR800 (and I am sure it is the same with your 910) is that it probably should be around 40%. Anyway the section on sharpness on these calibration DVDs provide a pattern where you are told to adjust the sharpness to just eliminate the fringing around the lines on the test pattern. Once you see this, and the effect the sharpness control has you will understand.

My experience has been that the sharpness is at the same setting for both 480p and 1080i. Remember though, that the effect of DCR is there for 480 so if you have that way up you might end up adjusting sharpness too soft to compensate. I'd suggest starting with the DCR Palette at the "factory" setting (I'm assuming that your XBR910 DCR Palette works the same as my XBR800).

DmbFan1

02-24-04, 06:55 PM

I'll see what happens when I get my hands on those DVDs...
They should improve my picture quality right (after I set it up correctly)

RAVEN56706

02-26-04, 01:38 PM

Ok i had a problem with my service on my 34xbr800.

I had the line issue. He came and fixed it. But now the picture seems alittle grainy and everything appears alittle zoomed.

Does anyone else have this same problem after the service man fixes the problem?

DmbFan1

02-26-04, 08:29 PM

Raven, in what mode are you experiencing a grainy picture?
1080i?
In my case the guy came and applied the correct settings in my service menu BUT he never changed the B board. He'll be back on Monday to do so..
After the service menu fix I still experience the "Vertical Bar" sometimes, but not all the time. After my service menu change (HDTP - 0, etc, etc) I lost a lot of my sharpness and brightness in 1080I mode which stinks now because those channels don't look a whole lot better then the normal digital cable channels (480P, 480I). Put it this way, before the changes he did in my service menu you easily knew you were watching HD programming in 1080I but now it's not 100 times better with all the detail like it used to be.
Before, people would come over and literally drool over the picture (except on dark images when you clearly seen the vertical bar) that's how amazing it was... I could easily brag this set had one the the very best pictures on the market. Even better then PLASMAs, LCDs, and DLPs that's how beautiful the picture was on the HD channels.....
Probably if I have the TV professionally calibrated that would bring back most of the picture quality I had in the past BUT I can't afford it at the present time so I'll just have to get used to it.......

On a last note, the only thing that stands out at the present time is live sports programming which you can still see the better picture in 1080I mode but not as amazing as it was in the past..... Kind of depressing for shelling out almost $2500.00 for a television... I have a life other then looking for flaws in my 34XBR910 but at that steep of a price you kind of keep thinking about it...........

akadennis

02-26-04, 11:08 PM

Hey DmbFan1, have you tried returning it? I'm in the process of returning my second Sony because of this vertical bar problem. I decided to get a refund and wait until the new Samsung DLP sets come out.

DmbFan1

02-26-04, 11:14 PM

Akadennis,
I was thinking about the same thing and waiting for the newest DLP Samsungs to arrive but I've heard 1st generation DLPs have there share of problems (Rainbow effect) since they are still fairly new on the consumer market.....
Also, 8000 hour lamp life doesn't cut it for me........

DmbFan1

02-26-04, 11:16 PM

Davehancock,
Maybe you can help me on this one. As you know the service guy came and changed the settings in my service menu (according to Sony's specs) without replacing the new "B" board yet. I've now noticed that when I turn my TV on sometimes and goto the HD channels displaying 1080I the settings seems to be what they were set at from the factory (HDPT 1, etc). It seems stuck in that mode until the set warms up or I switch from 1080I channels to 480P channels a few times then the settings he did seem like they enable once again. In other words at times I can see the old vertical bar until the new settings kick in. Do you think because he didn't replace the "B" Board but added the service menu changes that's the problem? Kind of hard to explain but maybe you understand.
He'll be here next Monday to put in the new B Board...
as always thanks for your help.........

PS... Yesterday I got AVIA and DVE and I messed with the both of them on basic and the settings in my TV menu. Way to dark for my viewing taste preferences

I probably need a damn professional ISF Calibrator......

akadennis

02-27-04, 07:35 AM

Hey DmbFan1, circuit city has a great sale on the HLN437W. This tv was 3499 and now its 2999 plus u get a 300 merchandise card and free delivery.

davehancock

02-27-04, 10:55 AM

DmbFan1,

If these settings are changing as the set warms up it sounds like something is definitely bad in your set. It may well be in the "B" board. Tell the service guy about the problem (show him if you can) before he replaces the board.

I'm surprised that the cal disks have you setting the picture too dark "for your taste". Let me ask, what picture mode(s) do you usually use. What mode(s) did you calibrate in?

DmbFan1

02-27-04, 03:23 PM

Thanks for your info akadennis. I did purchase my xbr910 at Tweeter but besides that, from all of the reviews I've read about the 910, 9 1/2 out of 10 reviews all rated the 910 as flawless. I've decided that I'm going to keep the 910. I guess when it's finally corrected the set will once again be amazing. I mean most reviewers that reviewed the TV said it had the best picture of any television at any price so I don't know. I've always been a huge fan of Sony televisions (I literally swear by them) so that's why I'm like freaked out over this issue I'm having with the vertical bar. Trust me, if we are having our issues with our current Sony model televisions other name brands are having a lot worse......
Whenever you get a chance stop by a retailer that carries Sony XBR series sets along with other name brands and when you compare them side by side (plasmas, LCDs, DLP, etc.) you will see what television brand stands out as having the most true to life picture........
I'll keep you and everybody else posted when I have my B Board replaced on Monday what the outcome is....

DmbFan1

02-27-04, 03:26 PM

Davehancock,
I did the adjustments in "VIVID" mode. Also, that setting issue I mentioned to you a few posts back, I'll let the guy know come Monday when he arrives to replace the board. In a way it makes sense that if he did the service menu changes without actually changing the B Board I can see an issue like what I'm having to occur....
We shall see.........
Stay Tune.......

davehancock

02-27-04, 03:51 PM

DmbFan1,

The "Vivid" mode is the LEAST ACCURATE (Pro is the most accurate). I suspect that you would not appreciate a isf calibration as it makes the picture more accurate and natural. It sounds like prefer a picture with a lot of "snap" as opposed to a more natural one. This is an old analogy - but it is like comparing Kodachrome to Ektachrome. Kodachrome has tons of "snap" while Ektachrome Color is closer to real life. Among things, Vivid has a higher gamma and will exaggerate the 1080i line.

But still, you should not be experiencing the changes with warm up that you described earlier.

DmbFan1

02-27-04, 04:11 PM

Davehancock
Maybe your around.
Here's one for you. I just turned the TV on about 5 minutes ago. I tuned into a local station (WPVI Channel 6) and then I turned to an HD channel. On the HD channel I noticed the Vertical Bar, so I went back to the local channel and the brightness dimmed on that channel about 5 seconds later. After the brightness dimmed I flipped back to a 1080I channel and noticed it was darker and the Vertical Bar issue was gone (even when I turned the brightness all the way up).
It has to be because of the new service menu settings for the extra parts in the B Board and the B Board is the one that came with the set (fewer parts).. It never did it in the past until he came and made the service menu changes......
I guess I'll know for sure on Monday after he puts the new board in...

RAVEN56706

03-01-04, 07:35 AM

See the problem is now that i have to make certain adjustments to the color settings.

But still, the 720p mode just sucks because the lines look a little bent and the 720 goes alittle off the screen.

DmbFan1

03-01-04, 05:51 PM

Davehancock,
Service guy came today. He brought all of the paperwork he downloaded from the Sony service site. This update was from September of 2003 and it was only for this particular model (910). (I actually read through it)
He made all of the adjustments in the service menu without changing the B Board because once again he said my TV didn't need it. He actually showed me all of the paperwork he had and it listed only some of the 910 models had the board with the missing parts.
The lastime he came he didn't do all of the required adjustments that was needed for the fix cause he had the older posted docs. so that's why my set was so damn dark. This time he sure did though.
It took him about 20 minutes to do all of the setting changes for the fix and in the end, WOW I'm once again impressed. Line is totally gone and I so have all of my brightness and sharpness back like the day I purchased my TV. The documents were about 4 pages long.
Like you mentioned in the previous posts, nothing compares to this picture. I was out over the weekend and took a good look at the Samsung 42" DLP and a few Plasmas, and in the end none of them came close to the picture quality of the 910. Even my wife noticed it cause she said "Don't even tell me your gonna replace our set with one of these"
ha ha
Well I have to say, I'm finally 100% happy. I love this set once again!!!
I'll try and get a hold of the service guy during the week by phone and see if I can get the service listing number where the whole entire fix was posted on Sony's service site.......
Thanks for all of your help Dave and everybody else that was involved with answering all of my posts.

davehancock

03-01-04, 06:15 PM

DmbFan1,

Did you tell the service person about the picture changing when it warmed up or when you changed between SD and HD? I still am suspicious because I doubt if there is anything in the Service Menu that is time dependent.

DmbFan1

03-01-04, 09:39 PM

Davehancock,
I mentioned it to him and all he said was last time he was at my home all he changed was the settings in "Pro" and the settings in "Standard". He said it was either that or just it was the cable reception.
Ever since he left the picture hasn't flickered at all and WOW In 1080I mode, I had to lower my brightness setting to about 55-60% (VIVID Mode) because it was so bright. I like a bright picture but now at around 75-80% it is so bright. He did change a setting in the service menu which knocked the brightness level up bigtime. I seen him do it but I forget what setting it was. I was worried when you said I shouldn't have to crank up the brightness up so high but before when I had the brightness set at 50-60% it was so dark.....
I wish I asked him what the service ID Bulletin number was where he got all the info from cause the new settings left my picture the same exact way as it was when I purchased the TV except now I no longer have the vertical bar problem. All I know like I said in the last post was it was approx. 4 to 5 pages long.
Before I forget he changed the settings in "1080I, 480P, Standard, Movie, Pro, Vivid, and RF"
I will call him in the middle of the week and ask him to give me the Bulletin number so I can post it for everybody. The Bulletin said it was from September 2003 and it was for the XBR910.........

davehancock

03-02-04, 11:13 AM

DmbFan1,

Somewhere in the middle of the 30 pages of this thread is the Servic Bulletin Number. To refresh things, it is:
E18728143 and it's latest update was (not sure if it still is) 9/29/03.
The general public cannot access these files (Sony Confidential) but knowing that number in many instances have been the "key" to getting this problem resolved.

DmbFan1

03-02-04, 05:12 PM

If I can remember correctly that was the exact date that was on the paper. I didn't know it was like 4 to 5 pages long. Wow that was a lot of settings to change that's for sure.
So far everythings A OK here. That flickering problem (Bright to Dim) is my reception on the analog cable. It seems to only be happening on the one channel WPVI. For the last week or so all of my analogs have been pretty crappy but only the one channel has that flickering problem.
I'll keep you posted on that when it's resolved or once the analogs clear up.........

RAVEN56706

03-05-04, 04:53 PM

i am having a flickering problem...... sucks....

bikenski

03-05-04, 07:56 PM

Wow, am I glad I found this thread! I've been going crazy with my new KV-40XBR800, thinking I had some kind of external electrical interference causing the scrolling vertical lines during dark scenes. After manhandling the 304 pound TV (plus stand) around to different locations, flipping off every circuit breaker in the house, swapping the DVI cable, changing input devices, and still having the problem, I was out of ideas.

Reading through all the excellent information in this thread explains why the issue is there, suggests a workaround, and raises a question: Like several others have posted here, my vertical scrolling lines are only visible when using the DVI input, and only at 1080i. With the component input the problem goes away, so that's the way I currently have the STB hooked up. My question is, how will I get the best results: Applying the fix (bypassing the offending circuitry) and using the DVI input? Or leaving the settings alone and continuing to use the component input? I'm not sure if the (possible) better picture quality obtained from using DVI rather than component makes up for what may be lost by applying the fix.

Thanks in advance. Once again I'm amazed at the amount of information on these forums!

neo0285

03-05-04, 08:06 PM

after my fix, my picture on my kv34xbr800 looks grainy and zoomed also liked somebody mentioned here before. And because it is zoomed it overscan a lot, so i dont know whats worst the fix or the goddamn vertical bar!! SONY sucks

DmbFan1

03-06-04, 01:13 AM

RAVEN!!!!!!!
You answered my next complaint I was gonna post that I am currently having here in the Philly area. WTH!!!!

As of the past 2 weeks or so I've been noticing a flickering problem which is most noticeable in the local band of channels. I've been going crazy thinking it was my TV BUT it's not. My standard tv in my bedroom is having the same problem. While I'm watching TV the screen gets bright, then a few minutes later it's gets dim. I was almost in a panic as I just had my set adjusted with the new settings (Vertical Bar Fix). Last night I literally sat in front of my TV about 1 foot from the screen in the bedroom to see if that set dimmed and it also did. I was thinking my new xbr910 was having a problem but in the end I proved it was the cable reception not the tv. Thank god I have cable in the bedroom or I'd be going crazy here thinking it was my HD set. What's going on with the damn reception? Also, on very bright images, such as white backgrounds you see glitching in the whites, and my INHD1 and INHD2 channels keep breaking up every minute or so...
Kind of getting very annoyed with this. Let me know in detail what exactly the problem is at your end and what cable or sat system your running.....
I'm using Comcast here.

DmbFan1

03-06-04, 11:00 AM

Quick question here. Anybody know how to fix the RED PUSH issue on a 910 here? I remember seeing a listing for changing 2 things (very simple) in the service menu but now i can no longer find that listing anymore.

blackngold75

03-08-04, 01:15 PM

Figured I'd add my story, too, for consideration and suggestions. I got the KV-34HS510 a couple weeks ago. Finally got my HD receiver hooked up Friday night - no D* installer arrived yet, so I am watching OTA. Picture is fantastic. However, during a show on ABC (WPVI-HD), I notice what looks like a "discoloration" in the picture. After watching a little longer, I realize it is a bar sweeping right to left across the screen. I see it sometimes during shows, and sometimes I don't. It is annoying, though. So, I tried the component input -- the bar is still there, but not as obvious. Switching the receiver to 720p makes the bar go away, at the loss of some picture quality. So....reading through portions of this thread I thought maybe the problem did not plague the XBR910 (figured I'd upgrade), but sounds like it does.

I called Sony and the 2nd-level tech said "no, we don't have any issues like that. You need to try a different DVI cable, and if that's not it maybe it's your HD box." :mad:

Not sure what course to take next....from what I have read here, the "fix" reduces the quality of the picture, which is amazing except for that bar sweeping through sometimes. I did notice that it isn't only dark scenes where I see this - it can happen at anytime. I even thought I saw this bar switch direction at one point, but it was late and I might have imagined that.

DmbFan1

03-08-04, 05:46 PM

blackngold75,
I had the fix applied to my 910 and from then (actually one week ago today) my TV is running flawless. My local channels (480I) seemed very horrible at first but it was the cable system as I called Comcast and they stated there was a problem in the 19008 area and as of today it's all been fixed. A lot of people were complaining in this forum that the fix really ruined the PQ BUT I have to admit if anything it made my TV brighter. I'm 110% happy with the results. Vertical Bar is gone for good!!!!
I only wish the service guy gave me the documents that fixed the set. All I know is the documents were updated last Sept. of 2003 and the docs were about 4 to 5 pages long.
WORKED for me and once again I'm more then happy.

DmbFan1

03-08-04, 05:50 PM

Neo0285,
Explain Over scan Problems to me. I don't see any but I might not understand what your referring to. I'm still a newbie at diagnosing problems and their correct terms. My 910 after the fix is working flawless here. No Zoom or anything from what I see....

Meteor

03-08-04, 07:31 PM

QUOTE: blackngold75 said: I called Sony and the 2nd-level tech said "no, we don't have any issues like that. You need to try a different DVI cable, and if that's not it maybe it's your HD box."

Well.. point this dumb people to their own website and show them this report:
Sony is clueless (http://www.iq.sony.com/srvs/conversation/externalredirect.asp?src=swupd&modelnum=KV34HS510&prodid=5934&q=vertical%20bar) (searching the xbr910 or xbr800 same result.)
We recently purchased at work the KV34HS510 and KV34XBR910 and both sets exhibit the same problem. The ironic part is I'm in broadcasting and I have access to broadcast equipment tech reports but unfortunately none for consumer gear so we're going to call Sony service.
BTW both sets are excellent in HD, we fed slightly compressed 1080i and it's not visual difference between them, actually some people comment the hs510 picture is better.

davehancock

03-08-04, 08:10 PM

blackngold75,

The solution to this problem has been discussed many times earlier in this thread. It requires a service call and perhaps a replacement of the "B" board in your set. Don't bother with the Sony 800 number. Instead find a GOOD local factory authorized service firm and deal directly with them. Check my post on 3/2 - it has the Factory Service Bulletin ID number. Call the Service firm, tell them about this thread and give them the Sony Service Bulletin ID number. They will be able to check it out and come to your house prepared to deal with the problem.

Best viewing to ya.

blackngold75

03-08-04, 09:35 PM

dmbfan1 / davehancock:
Was your service performed under warranty? Sony says for warranty service, you must bring the set to an authorized service center - this puppy weighs 200 lbs!! That ain't gonna happen.

davehancock

03-08-04, 10:01 PM

I don't know about your Warrenty (an HS has a different warrenty than an XBR) but I'll bet it is "in-home". If Sony tells you to "bring it in" call the dealer and make him swallow the set! I'll bet the dealer will "find a way".

If it was Sony that you talked to - ignore them and find a local AUTHORIZED repair shop from either Sony or the dealer and then, as I suggested, call the shop directly. Ask to talk to the shop manager and explain the problem, this thread and the Service Bulletin number.

DmbFan1

03-08-04, 11:49 PM

blackngold75,
My set was serviced in my home. All I did was call the dealer where I brought the set from (TWE*TER) and they gave me their service center number and they were also a certified Sony dealer. Service was great, and the guy who serviced my set was nice. He literally told me step by step what he was doing and what he was changing. He said to call him anytime (gave me his personal cell phone number) if I ever have any other problems with the set.

PS
Seems that Twe*ter has great service. They not only know what they are selling BUT they also back their product 100%. The other 2 major Audio/Video Stores usually don't have a clue what they are selling you.
Plus they will beat any of the competitors price!!!!

blackngold75

03-11-04, 03:16 PM

Well, I have a call in to a local authorized service center. The first person I spoke with had never heard of this problem before, so now I am brimming with confidence :rolleyes: . However, she advised she was not a service tech and she thanked me for pointing her toward the service bulletin. Waiting for a call back from one of the technicians.

You know, it does look pretty good in 720p, plus no bar. I could almost live with that. However, when you pay that much for something, it should work as it is supposed to.

On a very dark background, I see the sweeping bar and can almost imagine I am playing an old game of "Pong".

bikenski

03-11-04, 04:00 PM

I posted a while back that I only had the sweeping bar when using DVI and not Component, but it turns out that observation was incorrect. While much more pronounced on DVI, I did notice the fleshtone changes and sweeping bar on several programs using Component.

After making this discovery I went ahead and applied the fixes from Page 14 of this thread and switched back to using the DVI connection. It's a bit too soon to say the issue is resolved for good, but I'm hopeful. The only time I see the bar now is when I put the set into "TwinView" mode, since according to earlier posts this bypasses the fix. FWIW this set was manufactured in 1/04 so they are still being shipped with this issue after all this time.

Can anyone confirm that the modifications from page 14 are still the correct ones to use on a KV40-XBR800, and that there haven't been further updates to the procedure since they were posted?

Weaseloid

03-11-04, 05:49 PM

Taking the plunge and have a Sony Auth Service Rep coming Wednesday to look at my 32 HS500. Got the Sweeping bar with component HD signals.

Hope the fix will work and not give me picture degradation.

I mentioned the service bulletin to them and the woman took down the number so I'll see what happens.

I plan to record any service menu changes the service tech makes.

If I can I'll try to get a copy of the service bulletin since I know the guy who is the technician.

Anyone not like the results of Sony's fix for scrolling bar?

Should I cancel before its too late?

AK

DmbFan1

03-11-04, 08:05 PM

Hi All.
Once again (as I'm watching the Flyers/Stars Hockey Game on CSNHD as we speak) I'm more then happy with the fix on my XBR910. Anybody who is wondering about the most current fix, it should be the documents that are dated back in Sept of 03. This is what the service guy had when he did my set almost 2 weeks ago and he stated that they were the most recent.

Now I lucked out in a way. He had the replacement B Board with him BUT my set didn't need it. He said most of the 910s had the correct board in it already (which he showed me where it said it in the documents). I didn't believe him at first but after he got done in the service menu I checked (and still checking to this day) and the line was gone.......

bikenski

03-12-04, 05:00 PM

Originally posted by DmbFan1
Anybody who is wondering about the most current fix, it should be the documents that are dated back in Sept of 03.

Can anyone confirm or deny that the settings in the 9/03 document are the same as the ones listed on Page 14 (which were posted in 4/03?)

montreal

03-12-04, 05:48 PM

Originally posted by bikenski
Can anyone confirm or deny that the settings in the 9/03 document are the same as the ones listed on Page 14 (which were posted in 4/03?)

The document listed on page 14 is for the xbr800 and hs500 series which all share the DA-4 chassis. The XBR910 series also shares the DA-4 chassis, but after the bypass circuit is activated, the settings that fine tune the XBR910 picture in 1080i for different modes may or may not be the same.

The finer pitch tube of the XBR910 generally demands slightly different tweaks since most but not all of the service menu parameters are otherwise identical between the XBR800 and XBR910 series.

I would be very surprised if the secret numbers find their way into this forum as readily as the original bulletin did last year. Furthermore I expect the coming XBR960 to share the same DA-4 chassis and potentially have the same scrolling bar problem.

As long as there are multiple analog signals (for PIP) flowing within the chassis and the display device (CRT) is a high voltage analog transmitter, there will be ghosting (scrolling bar) appearing.

DmbFan1

03-12-04, 09:10 PM

montreal,
Do you have any info on the XBR960? Is there a link where I can go check out the specs of the 960?
If so can you please post?
Thanks

mddoran

03-13-04, 02:22 PM

Originally posted by bikenski
Can anyone confirm that the modifications from page 14 are still the correct ones to use on a KV40-XBR800, and that there haven't been further updates to the procedure since they were posted?

I just had the tech out to perform the "fix" nice guy but clueless until I provided him the info from this discussion and walked him through the steps to eliminate the vertical bar. Set is Nov '03 build and board replacement was not necessary.

The tech changed HDPT from 1 to zero but stopped there and did not make any further service menu changes. Just as well given his competency.

Should I make the balance of the changes to color, sharpness, and contrast settings in service menu and are there updated settings from Sony?

Thanks Mark

blackngold75

03-15-04, 11:45 AM

DmbFan1:

Since I see you're watching the Flyers, I am guessing that you and I are in the same general area - Philly DMA. What authorized service center did your work? I have a call in to the place in Wilmington, DE, but they have not gotten back to me in four days.

DmbFan1

03-16-04, 11:17 AM

blackngold75,
I'm actually right outside of Philly in the Delaware County area. Ok, now what you asked me. All I did was call Tweeter on Baltimore Pike (where I bought the TV from)and they gave me their service number. That's the number I called and they took care of me. Guy that came to my place to perform the fix was great.
What model Sony do you have anyway?

hdnerd

03-16-04, 08:40 PM

Hello !!, does anyone know if the service bulletin listed earlier in this thread (#E18728143, dated 3/4/03) is the same as the "updated" September, 2003 bulletin mentioned later on by some of the members?
If so, do the same service menu tweaks also apply to the XBR910 after HDPT = 0 is applied. I've seen several other models listed in the fix but Idid not see the XBR 910 listed. I would much rather apply the fix myself. A few friends have complained to me that the techs in our area will simply not go beyond the HDPT change!! These are techs I ask you!!!

davehancock

03-16-04, 09:58 PM

hdnerd (I LOVE that name!),

Yes, it is the same but ipdated to include the 910 (with slightly different values). Check my posting on on this thread of 2/20 (should be on page 28). The values are from that bulletin and are for the 910.

Hope that answers your question.

blackngold75

03-17-04, 09:16 AM

Originally posted by DmbFan1
blackngold75...
What model Sony do you have anyway?

I have the KV34HS510. I really like the set, other than that bar sweeping through my HD shows! Finally got in touch with the service center - they "lost" my information under a pile of other papers. Service tech is coming tonight and is aware of the Sony bulletin on this. So, hopefully all will go well.

DmbFan1

03-17-04, 03:59 PM

blackngold75,
Let me know how everything goes after the tech comes out and applies the fix. This service guy I had probably wouldn't of known himself I guess if it weren't for the ID bulletin posting the fix although he accessed the service menu like he's been there many of times so. Still pretty satisfied here and it's over 3 weeks since the fix.

blackngold75

03-18-04, 08:19 AM

The tech was supposed to show up around 6:00 last night. Instead, he rang my doorbell after 9:00! I had to send him away - kids were in bed and all that. I'm starting to think I should try doing this myself.

DmbFan1

03-18-04, 09:23 PM

blackngold75,
You should let him perform the fix just so if he screws up anything it'll still be under warranty. Is your set still under warranty anyway? If so, let him do it cause if you do anything wrongful in the service menu and you screw up your set your literally screwed.........

blackngold75

03-19-04, 08:30 AM

I decided to change the HPDT to 0 as indicated on Page 14 of this thread. I did not make any of the other changes yet. The vertical bar is gone - no noticeable difference in picture quality. I got tired of waiting for those blockheads to decide when they were going to show up.

davehancock

03-19-04, 09:05 AM

As long as you can get into the service menu and feel comofrtable, you might as well do the rest of the changes. None of them will make major changes - they are just "tweaks".

blackngold75

03-19-04, 10:01 AM

Dave

You notice any improvements overall by making the additional "tweaks"? I only watched one 1080i show last night and did not see any obvious change in sharpness or overall PQ after changing the setting to 0. Although, I thought that overall colors may have changed - like it wasn't pushing as much red as before - but then again, someone else at home might have adjusted the color or hue settings and I didn't know about it.

Trashed

03-19-04, 11:21 AM

Blackngold75

I am going to make the HDPT change to my Sony this weekend. I also was wandering if I need to may the other adjustments.

I purchased my KV-34HS510 two weeks ago and notice the same problem. I thought I would see if this fixed it (page 14 info) before I return the TV.

Was the information step by step? I didn't know if the information on page 14 was just for the XBR or applies for all 34" Sonys.

Any insite would be appreciated for this Newbie to HDTV.

Trashed

davehancock

03-19-04, 11:28 AM

blackngold75,

Most of the changes made only minor changes and the effects were subtle. I think that these changes serve to compensate for the different video path that the HPDT setting forces.

blackngold75

03-19-04, 11:42 AM

trashed

I believe davehancock's follow-up probably answers your questions regarding the additional settings. I will probably make the additional changes, but first I wanted to see if only changing HPDT=0 would make the bar go away - it did. It was stressed to be sure you are on RF input before making the HPDT change.

As far as page 14 instructions - they look pretty thorough to me, and it appears that they apply to the KV34HS510 - I scrolled through some of the service menu settings and the ones I checked were in the service menu for this TV.

To emphasize what others have said: be careful in the service menu. When you first get into it, it looks intimidating. :eek: Make sure you feel comfortable with navigating through the menu and it is a good idea to write down original values for everything that you change. There are a lot of numbers that pop up on the screen in the menu. I did read somewhere that there is a command to "reset" to the defaults if you screw it up, but I'm not sure that's really true.

tmauceri

03-19-04, 12:45 PM

I live in Massachusetts and own a KV34XBR800, manufactured in Dec 02. I bought the set at Tweeter in April 03. I noticed the line immediately, but only between HD program source and commercials. Last month Comcast C provided a firmware upgrade to my Moto 5100 that activated the DVI port. I purchased a DVI cable, connected it, and there it was the line. I posted the problem on this sight and someone provided a link to this thread. Glad to know I'm in good company. Tweeter has been out twice each time with a new board. The tech new nothing of this problem and was not inclined to do alot of research. First visit he switched the chip, inserted the new board and the TV didn't work at all. He put the the old board with the new chip and everything was fine (the line was still there, of course). He concluded the chip didn't matter since we were back to the status quo. He ordered another board (board #2) and said he would find out what the chip did. He said when he came back he would put board #2 in but would't switch the chip. When he came the second time he put board #2 in, it worked but the PQ was horrible. He went into service to do the recommended adjustments and lost picture. He put the origonal board back in, back to the status qou. Does anyone know what the chip does? I was under the impression it held allignment data specific to my picture tube. I think he accidently swithed the new and origonal chip up and put the origonal chip back on the origonal board. Since both new boards did not yield a picture. He said his boss would call me. Possibly replace my set with a 910. Any comments, I'm very upset.

davehancock

03-19-04, 12:59 PM

tmauceri,

Go For It! If you can get them to swap your set out for a 910 do it!

If the service person did not go into the service menu to make the needed changes (HPDT=0 is needed, the rest are recommended) he doesn't know what he is doing!! If this is the case, take advantage of the fact that this person is a bozo (or at least ill-informed) and get them to swap out the set.

If they don't go for that, go to a different Sony authorized service organization, describe the problem, tell them that you have seen a discussion of the problem on this web site and give them the Service Bulletin number (E18728143). Only call Sony to find out who in your area is Authorized. According to others in this thread the 1st level support people at Sony are "clueless".

tmauceri

03-19-04, 02:29 PM

He did go into the service menu to change the values, but when he was done there was no picture. He thought this should be a bench job done at tweeter service center. Do you know what the chip does?

davehancock

03-19-04, 02:43 PM

Not sure what "chip" you are talking about. There are 2 possible choices (both actually apply)

1) The "old" B board had been built without some components - the easy way to tell is to check to see if a chip (IC 3414) is mounted on the board. If it is there the board does not need to be changed - it only needs the SM (service menu) changes. NOTE: This is a surface mounted chip and cannot easily be changed (that is why Sony has the board replaced if the chip is missing).

2) The Non Volatile Memory chip (IC 3089) which needs to stay with your set. So when the B board is changed the service person needs to take this chip from your old board and put it on the new board. I suspect that this is the chip that you were referring to.

It could be that something was wrong with the new board - or that he did not install the NVM chip right in the new board.

It should not be a bench job. You don't want to lug that set around when there is a "defined fix" for the problem that involves board replacement. If the new board doesn't work it is bad and they need to try a different one!

tmauceri

03-19-04, 03:13 PM

I just talked to the Tweeter service manager, he said they want to work on the set at the service center. They will pick it up and provide a loaner. Turn around time will be about 1 week. The techs there have more time and don't have to worry about getting to the next service call. I thought that switching that NVM chip was difficult to do at my kitchen table. I assume if they have a problem they will work with Sony. If they screw it up I assume they will get me a new set.

tmauceri

03-19-04, 03:16 PM

I know never assume anything.:confused:

davehancock

03-19-04, 05:30 PM

Is the loaner going to be a HDTV? (Insist on it!)

Go over your set with them and review any damage both when they take it, and when it is returned! A 216lb set (thats about what it weighs) can be a problem.

AGAIN, this is an IN HOME repair. The only reason that they want to take it in is that the GOOD service people apparently stay in the shop.

DmbFan1

03-20-04, 09:30 PM

Hi guys,

How you been davehancock? My 910 is still running flawlessly after the fix. Also, thanks once again for all of your info cause you taught me a whole lot.

Now I my new problem. My cable tv service is taking a dive. Is anybody in the Philly or surrounding area having a flickering problem with Comcast Cable TV service? Local channels (the most) and the rest of the analog channels are the ones that are really being effected. WPVI for instance keeps going bright and dark. Certain images constantly flicker. My cable box is the Motorola 5100 with DVI activated. I use DVI but I tried Component, same problem so it isn't me... Could it be the box or just the service?

hdnerd

03-21-04, 10:39 AM

Hello davehancock, thanks for the info regarding the service menu tweaks for the 910. Just one other question....the different updated value changes in the service menu for the 910 after HDPT=0 is applied(the ones you posted on page 28)....are these the only ones required or are they in addition to some of the other changes found in the original bulletin mentioned on page 14. The reason I ask is because some of the members have said that when their techs showed up to apply the fix for the 910, the bulletin was about 4 to 5 pages long!!!

davehancock

03-21-04, 12:12 PM

DmbFan1,

Happy to hear that your 910 continues to be free of the moving vertical line. Regarding your cable issue, I would suspect Comcast problems. Might be the box - but I would call them. You might also try a different area of the AVSForum.

hdnerd (and others),

There are several parts to the Service Bulletin - the service person might have had as many as 7 pages with him. Only 2 pages actually cover the Service Menu adjustments (remember, some of the sets covered by this bulletin have a "B" board with missing parts and lots of the bulletin deals with that). As the adjustment information is presented in the form of a logic flow diagram (I love those), it takes some space. The diagram also deals with the XBR910 series as well as other sets, which also take additional space. The bottom line is: the data on page 28 is for the XBR910 with both 1080i component DVI inputs. The procedure only has you check the last (YGN, CBGN and CRGN) values with the DVI input.

hdnerd

03-21-04, 04:39 PM

Davehancock, thanks a bunch!!! your info has been very helpful!! I'd be very interested in reading your opinion on what others have said regarding the HDPT =0 change. I've read on this thread that this bypass essentially turns our expensive digital televisions into "expensive" analog sets with no DRC function!! Is this true. Does this change deactivate the DRC scaler built in these sets which smooths out some of the rough edges on a lot of the standard definition (480i) broadcasts? I must admit that most of my viewing occurs in 1080i(and 480P-DVDS) although occasionally a good movie pops up on an SD broadcast and the DRC circuit helps....at least to my eyes!!

blackngold75

03-21-04, 04:49 PM

hdnerd,

have you really noticed a difference with different DRC settings? What settings have you seen results? I've played with it a little bit, but haven't seen a huge difference.

hdnerd

03-21-04, 04:57 PM

blackngold75,

It just seemed to me that the positive effects of moving the digital reality creation graph(you know the one....... one adjusts vertically for reality, and the other horizontally for clarity) aren't there anymore. Maybe you or davehancock can shed some light on this!!

davehancock

03-21-04, 05:29 PM

OK Guys, here is "my take" on the DRC function.

First, the DRC is only used in scaling a 480 line image to 1080i, so it just isn't used with a HD input at all. DRC still works fine when you have HDPT=0 and are looking at a 480 image.

Second, it appears to enhance "sharpness" when adjusted vertically. It does not appear to introduce "ringing" (or shadowing) as a conventional sharpness can but it seems to introduce some degree of artifacts and enhances noise. The horizontal adjustment seems to reduce noise by integrating (averaging) adjacent pixels (remember, it is operating in the digital domain - even if the incoming image is analog). The more to the right the greater the integration. I have found that the "default" setting suits me in most situations, though I do use other settings for tapes and wide screen SD signals (when I use Zoom).

I haven't seen any good explanation of "how" it works so the above is the best of my "guesswork". Anyone with more authoritative information?

Trashed

03-22-04, 09:14 AM

Does anyone know what the additional tweaks are for the 34HS310 HDTV. The data is different on page 14 and 28 of this thread....

Just want the correct tweaks for the KV-34HS310 model.

By the way...the HPDT change did fix my problems... I had the vertical bar with my Samsung OTA HDTV receiver (SIR-T150) but had a horizontal scrolling bar with my RCA DTC-100 HDTV receiver.

sixone

03-22-04, 11:09 AM

First off thanks to everyone who contributed to this thread. I've noticed the vertical line problem for over a year but usually only when the screen was blank (no signal, changing channels, etc.) so I tolerated it. Now that I've been using the STB more I now notice it all the time in dark scenes. A Sony Authorized rep is coming by tomorrow to fix the problem. A couple of questions first:

1) I made changes to the service menu: fix red push, HDPT=0, etc. Should I reset these changes to the factory defaults before he comes? I don't know if this voids my warranty or will give them an excuse to say it was "my fault" even though the problem existed before I made the changes.

2) I've done my best to skim thru the nearyly 3 dozen pages here, however what should I expect/instruct the tech to do? I don't want to have him have to come back because he failed to do something like switch the "B" board.

BTW, the tech was quite surprised that I knew as much as I did (thanks to AVS :))when discussing the problem with him, especially having the Service Bulletin #. He asked me, "Where did you get all this info from?". I let him know that I visit a web site with owners with similar problems...

Trashed

03-22-04, 11:19 AM

Sorry about that.... my earlier post said KV-34HS310.... I meant
KV-34HS510

Any info out there for the tweaks

tmauceri

03-22-04, 11:27 AM

Tweeter service called and said they would give me a 30 in 910 loaner while they fix my 800. Guess that will be OK for a week or so.

davehancock

03-22-04, 01:12 PM

Trashed,

Yeah, your model 310 had me thrown a bit.

The reason you see different numbers between page 14 and page 28 of this thread is that the values on page 14 are for all models (including your HS510) except the XBR910 - which is for the XBR910. The post on page 14 is from early in 2003 (April, I think). The procedure was updated by Sony to cover the XBR910 values 6/23/03 (after the page 14 post).

Sixone,

Good question. There has been lots of debate on the warranty issue. My advice is DO NOT TELL THE SERVICE PERSON that you have been in the Service menu!!!!!!!! That just saves problems. It is unlikely that he will know what the original settings were for red push, etc. So it may be OK to leave them.

You didn't mention in your last post the model of your set and when it was made. The "B" board replacement is for sets built between October and December 2002 when Sony tried to get away without including several parts (including IC 3414). If you have a fully populated "B" board, no change is required - then only the SM changes, starting with HDPT=0.

Tmauceri,

Sounds OK. I suspect that their "good" service guy only works "on the bench" and they want him to deal with it.

tmauceri

03-22-04, 02:15 PM

The set was manufactured Dec 02.

sixone

03-22-04, 02:39 PM

Originally posted by davehancock
Sixone,

Good question. There has been lots of debate on the warranty issue. My advice is DO NOT TELL THE SERVICE PERSON that you have been in the Service menu!!!!!!!! That just saves problems. It is unlikely that he will know what the original settings were for red push, etc. So it may be OK to leave them.

You didn't mention in your last post the model of your set and when it was made. The "B" board replacement is for sets built between October and December 2002 when Sony tried to get away without including several parts (including IC 3414). If you have a fully populated "B" board, no change is required - then only the SM changes, starting with HDPT=0.

Thanks davehancock,

OK that clears up a lot, didn't realize the manufacture date mattered, I have a KV-34XBR800 purchased in Aug '02.

Trashed

03-22-04, 03:47 PM

Thats for all the information...it is much appreciated.

This forum is excellent and the people who post and reply information are the best!!!!!!!

tmauceri

03-22-04, 04:47 PM

I don't understand why Sony hasn't changed HDPT settings on newer sets, to elimiate the line. If the B board has the correct components why not just reprogram the settings.

bikenski

03-22-04, 07:00 PM

It has been nearly two weeks since I made the service menu changes on my KV40-XBR800 and the scrolling vertical line appears to be gone for good!

One other strange thing I have noticed though, and only when watching SD from my Samsung 360 STB (which is output as 480p when using DVI,) is that I occasionally see silver or red streaks in certain places on the screen. The silver lines tend to appear about 1/3 of the way in from the left side of the screen and run vertically. They range in length from about 1 - 6" and last a few seconds before going away again. The few times that I have seen red lines (less common) they have been horizontal and near the bottom of the screen.

I'm not sure if these lines are coming from the STB or if there's an issue with the TV. Has anyone else experienced anything similar? For troubleshooting I may hook up an S-Video cable to force the STB output down to 480i to see if that gets rid of the problem. Using component or DVI cables I can only output 480p, 720p, or 1080i... and using 720p or 1080i activates the 16x9 window, which isn't right for 4x3 programming.

sixone

03-23-04, 11:16 AM

I have a Sony repair person coming by in 4-5 hours. I gave him a call to verify the appointment and he informed me that he'd be replacing my "B" board and making some SM changes. I informed him that according to my info, the bad boards were manufactured between Oct '02 & Dec '02 and he confirmed this. I then said why would I need this if I bought my set in Aug '02 (manufactured Jul '02)? He then began to say that they aren't sure what the problem is, they're just going by the bulletin (which is just doublespeak, because he just logically confirmed that I fell outside the range of bad board dates).

I actually didn't mind that they were switching the board, because for all I know it's an improvement. However, he said that they'd come out today to do the SM changes and take out the board and MAYBE switch it back in a day or 2 when the replacement board comes in from Sony.

Why should I trust my $2K TV to either:
a. A guy who can't follow instructions correctly, and therefore changes my box's hardware for no reason. If he can't figure out that July is before Oct, how can I trust him to perform the fix?
b. A guy who is making TWO trips and leaving me without TV for at LEAST a day? Is he getting paid per trip? Is he getting paid more to install the board vs. just making SM changes? Or is he just clueless?

Please let me know if I'm overreacting/paranoid, but my first impulse was just to cancel the trip and make the SM changes myself. I had planned on doing this before, but I just wasn't sure if the info in
Post #277 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=2108018#post2108018) was correct before I started.

61

tmauceri

03-23-04, 02:08 PM

I have had 2 new B boards installed, both have not worked (no picture at all). I don't blame you for being paranoid. I'm obsessed with this problem and want it fixed. They will pick up my set on Sat. and leave me a 30" 910 loaner. I'm starting to think just give me a new set. Someone else I know had his B board changed on his 34" 510 and it didn't work (no picture at all). He called Sony and they are giving him a new set.

sixone

03-23-04, 04:13 PM

Yeah, I ended up rescheduling for Friday. I'm getting V* installed as we speak, and when he's done I plan on doing the SM changes myself.

hdnerd

03-23-04, 11:32 PM

Davehancock, thanks for the info concerning the DRC. I did a little experimenting and also found the default setting to be best when viewing SD signals. Like you said, DRC is bypassed when I view HD content. I'm sure you've noticed that it's also bypassed when viewing a DVD in 480P mode on input 5. To be honest with you, I kind of miss the increased video fidelity that was present wit HDPT=1. Even though it's not a huge differance, it takes away that "SHOW OFF -JAW DROPPING PICTURE" quality. On the plus side it seems to display a more accurate picture, especially in movies (HDNM, HBO, etc...) What are you're thoughts on this?

DmbFan1

03-24-04, 12:25 AM

hdnerd,
At first. I felt the same way as you did with the "Jaw Dropping Picture" but after awhile you will like the new settings better. When I previously viewed any HD Channel displaying in 1080I I always used the "VIVID" mode over the other three picture modes because of the exaggerated picture but now I find myself using the "Standard" picture mode most because even the SD channels look pretty good in that mode. I myself somewhat favor a bright picture and in standard mode if you set the brightness up a notch you'll see the overall difference.

The service guy I had actually had to come out twice to fix my vertical bar issue because after the first visit I really did see a huge drop in PQ on the HD channels and the vertical bar would appear once again at times. After the second visit he had all of the appropriate service bulletin paperwork, and in the end I got about 99% of my brightness and sharpness back to like the original settings BUT this time without the vertical bar. Overall, I like these new settings better (like I said earlier) and also, on certain nights the HD channels are better then other nights. Use that as a factor also.
Sometimes it's not the TV it's the cable or the satellite signal coming into your set. Trust me, after the fix I literally sat in front of my TV and nit picked at every little glitch or whatever on the picture blaming it on my TV and in the end it was Comcast not my TV.
Here's an example for you: For the past 2 weeks my SD channels have been going dim at times then back to the original brightness I have the TV set at and also I've been seeing a little flickering between the center to the bottom of the screen at times when the displayed image (on every channel) is scrolling down or up. Once again, I blamed it on my TV, called Comcast back up on the telephone to find it's coming from their end once again.
My TV is the 34XBR910...................

hdnerd

03-24-04, 08:01 PM

Dmbfan1, sounds good to me!!! thanks for the input. Did the tech apply the same service menu tweaks as those listed on page 28 for the 910 the second time he came around to get the PQ to your liking after the HDPT=0 was applied?

DmbFan1

03-24-04, 08:15 PM

hdnerd,
To be honest with you I really don't know but one thing I do know for fact, the documents he used were dated Sept. of 03. That much I do know. Actually he was going to leave the docs with me but then he laughed and told my wife he knows the type of guy that I was that as soon as he left I'd be in the service menu messing around and I'd probably end up messing my TV up (which is so true) so he asked my wife should he leave me the docs or not and she told him to please take the docs with him.
All in all he was pretty cool. He even gave me his personal cell phone number and told me to call him anytime if there was anymore problems with my TV.

blackngold75

03-26-04, 10:34 AM

I finally applied the remainder of the service menu "patch" last night - originally I had only changed HDPT. I didn't think changing that one value had affected overall PQ much, but after making the rest of the changes, HD content seems to really have the "wow" factor again.

neo0285

03-27-04, 09:32 AM

Hey guys i need your help. I had the fix applied by a sony tech, but i feel like the picture is missing a bite to it now. what setting can i play around with to bring back my old awesome picture. also on a side note, with hdtp on 1 i was able to use MID3 to completely eliminate overscan down to 0%, but with hdtp on 0 the bset i can do is get down to around 5 or percent, which i guess is normal, i just wanted to know if anybody else is experiencing this. Thanx guys

davehancock

03-31-04, 11:51 AM

Sorry, I've be out of town for nearly a week, so haven't been able to keep up with this thread.

hdnerd,

I liked DmbFan1's response to your note. There's the "wow" or "jaw dropping factor" and there is "natural". That's one reason that most set's have different pre-set "picture" settings. I do isf Calibration on the side and the market for a dead on accurate picture is not all that large. People generally prefer the "wow" picture, until the get used to the accurate one, then the start to see where the "wow" picture is lacking. Problem is: you eventually get to be pretty "picky" and have a problem watching the "ordinary" picture. In just spent 4 night in a Hampton Inn -ughhhhhhhhhhhhhh!

For everyone's benefit, I should mention that (as I understand it) the "other" service menu changes are for minor "tweaks" in picture parameters to attempt to make the picture reproduction the same with HPDT=0 as it was with HPDT=1.

neo0285,

I'm really surprised at your overscan comments. The changes associated with the vertical line should'nt have an impact on overscan. But, to be honest, I'm not sure what the MID3 parameters are for anyway. Overscan & geometry adjustments are normally handled by the 2170D groups. Next time I get into the SM on my set (34XBR800) I'll have the poke around.

DmbFan1

03-31-04, 10:33 PM

davehancock,
How's it going? Welcome back!!!!

Weaseloid

04-09-04, 10:38 AM

Just got my 32 HS500 fixed.

New B Board installed but unfortunately the Service Tech didn't change HDPT 1>0.

I check for the vertical line after he left and sure enough it was there.

SO I went into the service menu and HDPT was still set to 1.

I hope I did things correctly.
I switched to an RF source that being Aux 2.

Then I changed HDPT from 1>0 and wrote the data.
I made all the other changes as per the posted service menu fixes that have been posted and the line seems to be gone.

There seems to be some changes to the vertial and horizontal position of the image on screen with an HD signal.

I recorded all the previous settings BTW. Hope I didn't mess things up.

davehancock

04-09-04, 11:31 AM

Unbelievable that this service person did not change the switch - and did not even make sure the problem was solved.

Was this the first call - or did someone check the set out to verify that the board needed to be changed? It may be that all that was needed were the SM changes.

Weaseloid

04-09-04, 01:54 PM

HE did initially check the board.
I have the old "missing parts" version.

To clarify he did a quick visual check on a component HD source but the scene was too bright to show the vertical bar withthe window light filling the room.

I found the bar again last evening and decided to check the HDPT setting.

The service tech told me he had never done this repair before and seemed a little hesitatant about getting into the service menu.

In any case I think the problem is solved although the image in pro mode is different so I'll use the Avia DVD to try and get things looking as they should.

BTW is the "red push" fix still applicable?

davehancock

04-09-04, 05:55 PM

Weaseloid,

It's clear this guy didn't have a print out of the Service Bulletin with him.

Not sure which red push fix your set needs (AXIS vs RYR,RYB,GYR,GYB) - but it should still be applicable with HDPT at either setting. A "hint" on this is NOT to use the color filters supplied with AVIA (or other "calibration" DVD) - instead turn off the undesired guns. This is done with the RGBS parameter (it is in the 2170P-2 menu on the 34XBR800, I'm not sure on your set).

tmauceri

04-14-04, 12:34 PM

Tweeter took my set into the shop. Service ordered a 3rd B board after the two they tried to install in my home didn't work. The 3rd board also did not work. The service rep got on the phone with Sony after he noticed the picture of the board Sony had posted online differed from the three they had sent. He said there were missing components on the boards. My set was manufactured in Dec 02 so I knew it needed the board with the extra components to make the fix. The service man said he was bounced around the country by Sony operators until he got a parts site in St Louis. They sent the right board. He switched the eprom chip and the new board worked fine. I asked him if he made the service mode adjustments and he said he didn't have to. He said Sony has finally addressed the problem and the board came ready to go. When they delivered the set I plugged in my DVI cable, pushed the brightness all the way and tuned to an HD station that needed a pass code (HBO) to enter. This screen is black and was the best way to demonstrate the vertical line in the past. The line was gone! They had reset the factory color settings, so I turned of the edge enhancement, set picture to neutral and calibrated with the Avia disk. PQ was stunning. I am very happy. I'd like to thank everyone on this site for all the knowledge I gained about this problem. One more note, Tweeter gave me a 30" XBR 910 as a loaner. It too had the moving vertical line!

davehancock

04-14-04, 01:39 PM

Glad to hear that they finally got things squared away. By the way, I'm sure that they at least made the HDPT change to the service menu - the line would still be there if they didn't. The other SM changes are not so critical.

Weaseloid

04-14-04, 03:13 PM

Hi Dave

You mention the following regarding fixing Red push.

"Not sure which red push fix your set needs (AXIS vs RYR,RYB,GYR,GYB) - but it should still be applicable with HDPT at either setting. A "hint" on this is NOT to use the color filters supplied with AVIA (or other "calibration" DVD) - instead turn off the undesired guns. This is done with the RGBS parameter (it is in the 2170P-2 menu on the 34XBR800, I'm not sure on your set)."

For my HS 500 the fix is the (RYR,RYB,GYR,GYB). I'm curious about how to go about using 2170P-2 RGBS and make a corrections turning off the undesired guns. I tried switching for RGBS set to 7 down to 0 and see the effect of each colur being turned off but how do you combine that with adjusting red push etc.

Any hints or suggestions.

Thanks in advance.

AK

tmauceri

04-14-04, 05:00 PM

The service man at Tweeter did not do any service mode adjustments on my 34" XBR 800. He did not change the HDPT value. The board he installed is a newly modified board. It only required switching the EPROM chip. I question him about this because I thought he was doing the fix incorrectly. He told me this was a new board he got from a Sony site in St. Louis (see my earlier thread above). PQ with the Sony factory settings looked great and even better after I calibrated with the Avia disk. The service man said when you order the B board from Sony they will probably send the old board because they don't know what problem you are having with your set. They originally sent him the wrong board and it wasn't until he got bounced around by sony operators that he got transferred to St. Louis where they had these newly modified boards. I hope they are putting these into the new sets. I asume this is the third version of this board the 1st being the one with missing components XBR's manufactured at the end of 2002, the second being the board with extra components needing the HDPT correction and other tweaks, the third with HDPT fix built in. Any comments?

justinto

05-28-04, 06:07 PM

Would you tell me how to access the service menu and what commands you used to save the HDPT change?
Justin

Originally posted by Weaseloid
Just got my 32 HS500 fixed.

New B Board installed but unfortunately the Service Tech didn't change HDPT 1>0.

I check for the vertical line after he left and sure enough it was there.

SO I went into the service menu and HDPT was still set to 1.

I hope I did things correctly.
I switched to an RF source that being Aux 2.

Then I changed HDPT from 1>0 and wrote the data.
I made all the other changes as per the posted service menu fixes that have been posted and the line seems to be gone.

There seems to be some changes to the vertial and horizontal position of the image on screen with an HD signal.

I recorded all the previous settings BTW. Hope I didn't mess things up.

vpn75

06-08-04, 12:17 PM

Has anyone had this problem fixed recently? I ask because I have a had a hard time dealing with Sony service techs in my area. I read through this thread and feel pretty well-informed about the problem. I went into the service menu and set HDPT to 0. This eliminated the vertical bar, but at the expense of PQ.

So, I decided to call Sony and have them send someone out to look at the problem. I thought they might know some service menu tricks to correct the problem while maintaining the PQ. The tech came out the other day and I showed him the problem. He said he had never seen this problem before. I told him that it is a known problem with a number of Sony HDTV sets. I even gave him a printout of the service bulletin posted on this board.

He took one look at it and said he would have to take it into the shop to have the B board replaced. Of course, I knew the B board didn't need to be replaced because the HDPT fix had worked, but I didn't want him to know that I had gone into the service menu. I told him that my B board should have the necessary bypass circuitry. I suggested we try the service menu fixes, but he said he was uncomfortable making any changes without knowing more about the problem. Finally, he took down my information and said he would do some more research and get back to me.

The other morning, he calls me back and says that they will have to bring my TV in to fix the problem. I asked them what they were planning to do and he said they still needed to figure out the problem. He would not listen when I told him that Sony already knows what the problem is and there is a clearly defined repair solution. I am reluctant to have them take my TV in when don't even understand the problem.

I suppose I can just go into the service menu myself and make the recommended changes. I'm just hoping that I can maintain the PQ while doing it. Does anyone know if there is a new B board replacement that corrects the problem with HDPT set to 1? I understand the new HS420 line is free of this vertical bar problem.

RLVTEC

06-08-04, 01:16 PM

im afraid there isnt

montreal

06-08-04, 02:43 PM

Originally posted by vpn75
Does anyone know if there is a new B board replacement that corrects the problem with HDPT set to 1? I understand the new HS420 line is free of this vertical bar problem.

There's nothing your technician can do to correct this problem other than follow the service bulletin and he would be very foolish if he thinks he can bench service this unit, as the root of the problem has to do with the shielding of microscopic components from EMF generated by the high voltage CRT drive circuits.

Go ahead and do the bulletin yourself like the rest of us and then pass judgment on the final PQ. You may be pleasantly surprised.

Above all, don't hand over your set to this amateur.

vpn75

06-08-04, 03:28 PM

Originally posted by montreal
There's nothing your technician can do to correct this problem other than follow the service bulletin and he would be very foolish if he thinks he can bench service this unit, as the root of the problem has to do with the shielding of microscopic components from EMF generated by the high voltage CRT drive circuits.

Go ahead and do the bulletin yourself like the rest of us and then pass judgment on the final PQ. You may be pleasantly surprised.

Above all, don't hand over your set to this amateur.

Thanks for the feedback. Actually, I spoke to Sony today and they were able to locate the bulletin and are going to communicate the fix to my local service care center. I'll wait a few days and see if they get back to me. If not, I guess I'll just go ahead and make the changes myself. It doesn't look like they'll be able to do anything more for me.

Tom in OH

06-08-04, 03:48 PM

Originally posted by vpn75
Thanks for the feedback. Actually, I spoke to Sony today and they were able to locate the bulletin and are going to communicate the fix to my local service care center.

Hi vpn75,
what year and model# Sony do u have - just curious.

Thx, Tom

vpn75

06-08-04, 03:55 PM

Originally posted by Tom in OH
Hi vpn75,
what year and model# Sony do u have - just curious.

Thx, Tom

Hi Tom,
The model# is KV32HS510. The manufacturer date is 3/2004 and serial# is 4000496.

Thanks,
Vamsi

Tom in OH

06-08-04, 04:09 PM

Originally posted by vpn75
Hi Tom,
The model# is KV32HS510. The manufacturer date is 3/2004 and serial# is 4000496.

Ok, thx. Mine is the KP-51WS510 (manufacture date 2/2004) and I'm wondering if the 1080i problem will show up. I haven't connected a 1080i source yet but plan to soon whenever my HDTivo shows up.

Tom

vpn75

06-08-04, 04:42 PM

Originally posted by Tom in OH
Ok, thx. Mine is the KP-51WS510 (manufacture date 2/2004) and I'm wondering if the 1080i problem will show up. I haven't connected a 1080i source yet but plan to soon whenever my HDTivo shows up.

Tom

Isn't yours a RP-CRT set? I think the problem only exists in the direct-view CRTs. Hope you won't notice the problem on your set. It can be very distracting!

Tom in OH

06-08-04, 04:52 PM

Originally posted by vpn75
Isn't yours a RP-CRT set? I think the problem only exists in the direct-view CRTs. Hope you won't notice the problem on your set. It can be very distracting!

Yes, it is an RPTV. I wasn't sure if the problem was limited to directview model #s or not. This is really something Sony should be fixing without any hesitation. Problems like this can really be good for the competition. Plz keep us posted on how Sony handles this.

cheers,
Tom

freddy14

06-08-04, 06:40 PM

I just had my 40 fixed last week. The Sony tech changed my B-board and made NO changes to the service menu. My picture is exactly the same as before but without the annoying vertical line. My advice is to use an official Sony tech and not a "Sony authorized" dealer. Some yahoos showed up at my house telling me they needed to take my set with them and that it would take a couple of days to fix the problem "IF" they had the parts in stock. I quickly showed them the door. I called Sony direct and was able to get them to send me a tech even though I was out of their service area. The tech was courteous and professional and fixed my set at home in about 30 minutes. So far, so good.......good luck

vpn75

06-09-04, 12:26 PM

Originally posted by freddy14
I just had my 40 fixed last week. The Sony tech changed my B-board and made NO changes to the service menu. My picture is exactly the same as before but without the annoying vertical line. My advice is to use an official Sony tech and not a "Sony authorized" dealer. Some yahoos showed up at my house telling me they needed to take my set with them and that it would take a couple of days to fix the problem "IF" they had the parts in stock. I quickly showed them the door. I called Sony direct and was able to get them to send me a tech even though I was out of their service area. The tech was courteous and professional and fixed my set at home in about 30 minutes. So far, so good.......good luck

So, does this mean there is a new B-board that fixes the problem without need for any SM changes? There seem to be conflicting reports from different people on this. I really hope what you are saying is true though!

Freddy14, yours is an XBR set, right? I have the KV32HS510, so it may require a different B-board. I haven't had much luck with my local Sony service care provider either. I spoke to Sony directly the other day and they said they would coordinate with my local office to correct the problem. I'm hoping I can get them to do any repairs in-home.

freddy14

06-09-04, 08:16 PM

VPN, Your set uses a different B-board than mine. I have the 40 XBR800 by the way. You need to replace your board(model #A-1300-325-A) with the new B-board. My tech told me that NO service menu adjustments need to be made after the swap. I told him and showed him threads from this forum and he assured me everything was going to be allright. I guess SONY has addressed this problem and fixed the problem with just a B-board swap. Personally, I dont see any difference what-so-ever with my picture except for the vertical line not being there. Call SONY and tell them to check "Event ID #E18728143". This was the official SONY CONFIDENTIAL REPORT about this problem. Try to get SONY out there to fix your television. By no means does your set need to be taken from you. All they need is access to the back of the set and about 30 minutes to fix the problem. Good luck.........

vpn75

06-11-04, 12:07 PM

Originally posted by freddy14
VPN, Your set uses a different B-board than mine. I have the 40 XBR800 by the way. You need to replace your board(model #A-1300-325-A) with the new B-board. My tech told me that NO service menu adjustments need to be made after the swap. I told him and showed him threads from this forum and he assured me everything was going to be allright. I guess SONY has addressed this problem and fixed the problem with just a B-board swap. Personally, I dont see any difference what-so-ever with my picture except for the vertical line not being there. Call SONY and tell them to check "Event ID #E18728143". This was the official SONY CONFIDENTIAL REPORT about this problem. Try to get SONY out there to fix your television. By no means does your set need to be taken from you. All they need is access to the back of the set and about 30 minutes to fix the problem. Good luck.........

Thanks for the info, freddy! I'm optimistic that this problem can be fixed to my satisfaction. Unfortunately, Sony and my local service care center are insisting that the set needs to be brought into the shop for the repair. No matter what I told them, they wouldn't agree to service my TV in-house. I guess I'll have to trust them to take my TV and return it in good condition with the problem fixed.

davehancock

06-11-04, 01:04 PM

vpn75,

Sounds to me that the reason they want to take the board back to the shop is that the "real Sony expert" there works in the shop (where he can be more productive) and they want him to look at it.

On the other hand, the problem with the "B" board is that some of them were built without parts that Sony (for a short time) decided were not needed. Maybe instead of getting a fully populated replacement board, they intend to put the missing parts in themselves (something Sony says NOT to do). They wouldn't want to do that in your house.

vpn75

06-11-04, 03:35 PM

I suppose they have some rationale for wanting to bring the TV into the shop. My set is quite bulky and it will not be easy to move though, but that is not my problem. Reading through this tread, it sounds like a majority of the people were able to have their board replaced in-home. I don't know why I am not so lucky.

Still, I will just be happy to have this problem fixed once and for all. I've heard from other people that there is some new B-board that fixes the problem without requiring HDPT set to 0 and consequently sacrificing the PQ. I know my current B board has the bypass circuitry because the HDPT fix worked for me. I was not happy however with the resulting change in PQ.

freddy14

06-11-04, 04:42 PM

VPN, I first called the company where I bought the set and they gave me the number to the local SONY authorized repair shop. They sent "movers" basically and not a technician. I spoke to the owner of the shop and he told me they could only repair the set at their facility. After telling him what the problem was(I told him my cousin had the same problem and Sony fixed it at his house)and to send out a tech, he insisted the set be brought to him. I told him "No Way". I then called SONY and they told me this yahoo was wrong and that the set could be fixed at my home. Sony then sent out a tech. As far as the board goes, Its a quick fix with minor soldering of a chip from your old board onto the "New" board and thats it. Put the back cover on and turn on the TV. No tweaks, SM changes, nothing. Just like before with no vertical line.

jbauer

06-21-04, 02:08 PM

I'm just noticing that I have this problem since I just got my HD TiVo.

What's the best procedure for getting this going with Sony? I already tried calling 800-222-SONY but that IVR system gives you the name of the local repair centers and then tries to charge you... I'd like to talk to a person about this, if possible.

Has anyone in the Bay Area (San Francisco) already gone through this pain and know of a local Sony authorized repair shop that is familiar with this issue???

- Thanx
- Jon

Jfalconsfan

06-30-04, 10:39 AM

Does anyone know the sony bulletin number on this issue? I gave the Sony rep the event id mentioned in this thread, E18728143, but he looked it up and said there was nothing wrong with my tv. If anyone has any other number I could give Sony, I would appreciate it. It is a KV-34HS510 manufactured in April 2003. He said to call the DVD manufacturer, Samsung, about this problem.

I don't have another 1080i source to cross check it but may try to find another 1080i DVD player I can use to test it so maybe I can get the TV fixed. This is a bummer because other than this issue it is a great TV.

vpn75

06-30-04, 12:30 PM

Originally posted by Jfalconsfan
Does anyone know the sony bulletin number on this issue? I gave the Sony rep the event id mentioned in this thread, E18728143, but he looked it up and said there was nothing wrong with my tv. If anyone has any other number I could give Sony, I would appreciate it. It is a KV-34HS510 manufactured in April 2003. He said to call the DVD manufacturer, Samsung, about this problem.

I don't have another 1080i source to cross check it but may try to find another 1080i DVD player I can use to test it so maybe I can get the TV fixed. This is a bummer because other than this issue it is a great TV.

I had a difficult time too getting Sony and my local service care center to acknowledge this problem. After a lot of back and forth, I finally got Sony to contact the service care people in my area and communicate the problem to them. Unfortunately, they insisted the TV had to be brought into the shop to fix the problem. They had my TV for a week, but when I got it back the problem was gone and the PQ looked as good as ever. So, I was satisfied!

I think the bulletin# you have is correct. Just tell them it is a known problem and see if they can bump you up to level 2 tech support. They should be aware of the problem and can help you out. I think the fix is to replace the B-board and it can be done in-house in under an hour.

Good luck!

jbauer

06-30-04, 11:00 PM

Quick update for Bay Area Sony 34xbr800 owners:

I called Elite Electronics and asked them to help me fix my 34xbr800 under warranty. I gave them the bulletin number and they pre-ordered the replacement B board before they came. After installing it, the vertical line still existed and they sat there scratching their heads. Of course, I pulled out the OP HDPT change solution and they did it - problem gone.

They couldn't believe that I had the solution. They didn't know about it! They were visibly upset about it. I gave them a copy of the instructions on a floppy. They were gonna go back to Sony and tell them that a customer showed them how to fix this problem!

I also asked them to adjust my slight overscan issue and they fixed a slight discoloration issue in the upper left hand corner.

My set now looks better than ever!

Thank you AVSFORUM!!!!!!

- Jon

RLVTEC

06-30-04, 11:36 PM

wait till u see the pq loss after the HDPT fix

jbauer

06-30-04, 11:42 PM

RLVTEC, I think you are wrong. I'm watching Spiderman in HD now, and the picture quality is perfect! I don't have the most discerning eyes on the planet, but it really looks great to me!

- Jon

RLVTEC

07-01-04, 01:22 AM

if they changed the b board and needed to do the hdpt fix then u will suffer pq loss, ask anyone on here. go into the service menu and vhange hdpt to 1 and youll see the difference

jbauer

07-01-04, 02:11 AM

Ok, so assuming you are right - what's the recommended fix? Live with the sweeping line? Sue Sony? What?

- Jon

Woodrow

07-01-04, 03:59 AM

Originally posted by RLVTEC
if they changed the b board and needed to do the hdpt fix then u will suffer pq loss, ask anyone on here. go into the service menu and vhange hdpt to 1 and youll see the difference

For the most part this is true...was with me, but no everyone feels this way about it. Some even like the PQ more after the change. If he's happy with the PQ, then that's all that matters. Several respected AVS'rs like the PQ better with the value change.

As far as what you should do Jon...decide if you're happy. If so, all is good. If not, sony will eventually replace it for you, it just takes a LOT of hassle. Be prepared to stick it out to the end. You can also try the dealer you got it from. That's what I did. They replaced a 40XBR three times for me. They charged me a re-stocking fee for one of the returns, but they eventually gave it back. Go to the HEAD manager at the store and tell him what you want VERY politely.

Sounds to me like your happy anyway, so I wouldn't worry about it too much.:)

jcardani

07-01-04, 09:16 AM

Since it's reported that the new Sony KD-34XBR960 should be available shortly (as early as next week), can someone please post here if this set still has the vertical bar problem? Or did Sony fix it (using the latest B board)? Hopefully we can find out by next week or so.

Joe

Jfalconsfan

07-01-04, 09:27 AM

The plot has thickened for my KV-34HS510. This may not be useful to anyone, but the red line has gone away. It was VERY apparant in a few dark scenes of the Pearl Harbor DVD the night before last and I could not find it last night. I have not changed anything... well, maybe I dropped the brightness a couple of bars as it was almost at max but it is still very high. It had me really worried and so I purchased the extended onsite warranty from Sony yesterday so that took the immediate pressure off of proving to them there was a problem during the 90 days.

I will check again and post if I see it. Until then I will just 'test' my TV out by watching TV and hopefully not watching THE TV.

I have a DVI-connected Samsung HD931 player and I had just set it for 1080i before watching the movie when the problem appeared in the Chapter called "Dec. 7" in the scenes that show the Japanese commander in a dark room.

Aristotle

07-07-04, 03:33 PM

Originally posted by jjingle1
Service Bulletin Confirmation

I hang out in this forum a bit, but I built a new user ID for this post because I can't figure out how to post anonymously. This data comes from Sony's internal website. I doubt that they'd mind, but one never knows. I don't want to jeapordize the relationship I have with them.

There is a published Sony service bulletin about this problem.

In Sony parlance, it's called a CS3 Service Bulletin or Field Problem Report. The ID given above is correct, E18728143. If you're talking to a Sony employee, they can access it on the Sony Intranet at http://tchnt4.us.sel.sony.com/web/esi/servdocs.html . They will need to key in the model number. It will come up under the models KV32HS500, KV32HV600, KV34XBR800, KV36HS500, KV36XBR800 and KV40XBR800. The bulletin was last updated on 3/14/2003. It was submitted by ZKUA63 and the engineer's initials are DAS.

The problem description on the bulletin is as follows: "Vertical bar moving from right to left. The bar is about 4 to 5 inches wide and goes from right to left across the screen every second. This can most easily be seen in the standard or vivid picture mode. It's also more pronounced when brightness is increased. Happens with either DVI or component input."

The service bulletin is very detailed, with pictures of the "B" Board, a procedure for replacing the "B" board, a flowchart for "DVI Vertical Bar Countermeasure Implementation" and a list of components which should be mounted on the "B" Board. The service bulletin states:

- Some boards manufactured between 10/2002 and 12/2002 may not have these parts.
- Units with the correct parts just need service mode changes (specific changes will be mentioned below)
- boards without these parts should be replaced, adding the parts to the board should not be attempted.
- non-volatile memory (IC3089) should be moved from the old board to the new board during the replacement procedure
- There is also this note: "B Board A1300-327-A Use in models: KV-32HV600, KV-34XBR800, KV-36XBR800, and KV-40XBR800. B Board A-1300-327-A used in models: KV-32HS500, KV-36HS500" (Yes, those model numbers look very similar. This is not my typo, I checked very carefully. I don't know that it's correct, but I copied it letter-for-letter. )

Although there are about 20 differences between new and old "B" boards, the easiest (and recommended) way to identify a new board is to look for IC-3414 mounted under the shield-cover component side of the board. It's a 16-pin dual-inline SMT IC located in the center of the board vertically, toward the right side horizontally. You can find it on the PCB layout in the service manual on page 258, quadrant D-10. This chip should be labelled M52055FP. On faulty boards, it won't be mounted.

For sets that have the correct components on their "B" board, they need to implement the "DVI Vertical Bar Countermeasures." It's difficult to represent a flowchart in these posts, but here's a go:

1. Select RF input and enter service mode. Change "OP HDPT" to 0. VERY IMPORTANT THAT RF INPUT IS SELECTED BEFORE THIS CHANGE IS MADE. Write data. Go to step 2.
2. Select a 1080i DVI input. Is the vertical bar visible? If yes, go to 3. If no, go to 4.
3. Countermeasure circuitry not mounted or applied incorrectly. Check/add the missing parts listed on the service bulletin or replace the "B" Board. Go to step 2.
4. Is a 1080i DVI source available? If yes, go to step 5 . If no, go to step 9.
5. Select DVI 1080i output on the source. Select Video 7 input on the set. go to step 6.
6. Enter service mode, then choose "vivid mode" in the user menu. Modify the following data: 2170P_3 SHOF=2, 2170P_3 F1LV=2, 2170P_1 CBOF=38, 2170P_1 CROF=38. Write the data. Go to step 7.
7. Choose "standard mode" in the user menu, then modify the following data: 2170P_3 SHOF=3, 2170P_3 F1LV=3. Write the data. Go to step 8.
8. Choose "movie mode" in the user menu, then modify the following data: 2170P_3 F1LV=1. Go to step 14.
9. Connect a component 1080i video source to video 5. Select video 5 input on the set. Go to step 10.
10. Enter service mode, then choose "vivid mode" in the user menu. Modify the following data: 2170P_3 SHOF=2, 2170P_3 F1LV=2, 2170P_1 CBOF=37, 2170P_1 CROF=37. Write the data. Go to step 11.
11. Choose "standard mode" in the user menu, then modify the following data: 2170P_3 SHOF=3, 2170P_3 F1LV=3. Write the data. Go to step 12.
12. Choose "movie mode" in the user menu, then modify the following data: 2170P_3 F1LV=1. Go to step 13.
13. While viewing the 1080i signal in any picture mode, confirm that the following data is correct: CXA2151 YGN=7. CXA2151 CBGN=8, CXA2151 CRGN=8. Go to step 15.
14. Is there a 1080i component source available? If yes, go to step 9. If no, go to step 13.
15. Countermeasure implementation complete.

Hope this helps. If so, tell me your name is also John Jacob Jingleheimerschmidt.

After making these changes does the picture quality suffer? I would hate to fix one problem and create another. :mad:

I currently think the 1080i HD image on my XBR800 is stunning, especially for live sporting events, however that scrolling bar is a serious distraction. I noticed it before reading any of these posts and my wife even said it "changed people's faces on the screen"

davehancock

07-07-04, 05:49 PM

A lot of people claim that PQ suffers - but I have seen some say it improves. What is clear is that the signal path in the set has changed and PQ may be different. Note that there are several SM changes, it appears that these are intended to compensate for the different path and, nominally, make the PQ the same as before. Thus all SM changes should be made. I suspect that many who complain about PQ have only implemented the HDPT change.

Personally, I did not experience any deterioration of PQ on my 34XBR800 after the fix.

RLVTEC

07-07-04, 09:00 PM

Originally posted by jcardani
Since it's reported that the new Sony KD-34XBR960 should be available shortly (as early as next week), can someone please post here if this set still has the vertical bar problem? Or did Sony fix it (using the latest B board)? Hopefully we can find out by next week or so.

Joe

nope its still there i even pointed it out to the Sears salesmen who thought i was bring back my 3 rd sony tv because I didnt like, and thought my story was about the verticle line was bs. I also showed them the Sony service bulletin. So the 510 had it and now the 420:p

blackngold75

07-08-04, 08:35 AM

Originally posted by Aristotle
After making these changes does the picture quality suffer? I would hate to fix one problem and create another. :mad:

I agree with Dave - I don't think the PQ decreased at all on my 510. Especially if you consider that vertical bar - man, that was annoying. It really was noticeable on skin tones.

I can't believe this is still a problem even in the newer sets - Sony's been aware of this for awhile.

budrickton

07-11-04, 12:55 PM

I've read as much of the thread as I could, so I apologize if I missed something. Seems this has been a long-running problem.

I've got a KV-36HS500, no clear idea when it was manufactured, but I picked it up, as a matter of fact, exactly one year ago today. And this horrid vertical sweeping line is there, only on 1080i sources as far as I can see. I also have the option right now of whether to go and purchase the 4-year extended warranty covering parts/labour. Perhaps I should do that before I go in and fiddle in the service menu with HDPT 0>1 and all that? Any suggestions for what else to try?

The past few weeks, I've been dealing with my local cable company about this problem instead of realizing it was a problem with my TV. :)

blackngold75

07-12-04, 12:07 PM

If you follow the service bulletin correctly, this is something you should be able to do yourself. The important thing is to follow the instructions exactly - and if your TV has the correct B board, then running through the whole fix should solve your problem. Since setting HDPT causes a shift in brightness on 1080i sources, you will benefit from making the other changes called out in the service bulletin. If you don't like it, you can always reset the TV to factory specs.

NorthJersey

07-12-04, 02:02 PM

cujo

07-12-04, 03:13 PM

I had a service guy comeout and fix my kv34hs510 but I dont think he made all the changes. I need to know 2 things if anyone can tell me:

1) What do I press on the remote to get into service mode?

2) How do I write or save the changes I make?

I searched but couldnt find the answer.

TIA,

Curtis

JBThompson

07-15-04, 03:34 PM

I have a single vertical dark "wave" going from LEFT TO RIGHT, once every second, on my 34xbr910 when connected to a hr250 HD Tivo through DVI. This "wave" is only present when the Tivo is set to 1080i mode. It disappears when the Tivo is set to 480p mode. The wave is only visable on dark scenes like when the credit are rolling against a black background. It make that part of the picture darker as it move across. My question: Is this the same problem as discussed in this thread? I have read most all of this thread and it mostly seems to be described as a "white band" moving from RIGHT TO LEFT although one post suggested that it could also move from left to right. The timing of my "wave" is every second like the one talked about here.

I have placed a call to Sony to get a tech involved and would like to speak with authority as to the problem when actually talking to him or her. Is there a better description of the problem somewhere that I missed? Or, can someone say that what I have is the same problem as what is described in this thread? Thanks!

blackngold75

07-15-04, 04:33 PM

JBThompson

What you are describing sounds almost exactly like how this problem manifested itself on my 34HS510. Line definitely moved from left to right, and was more of a "wave" than a white line - I noticed it most on dark images and also saw it as a discoloration of flesh tones. The service menu fix (I did it myself) is what resolved the problem. I couldn't get any support from Sony until I found this thread and was able to reference the bulletin described here. The line only shows up on 1080i sources. 720p and lower resolutions are not affected.

davehancock

07-15-04, 04:48 PM

It's the same problem. It can show up on just component, just DVI or both component & DVI. It also can occur from right to left, as well as left to right (as in my case).

In some cases, two fixes are required: 1) A change in the "B" board (some were built missing some of the circuitry); 2) Certain several changes in the Service Menu (including HPDT being set to 0). In all cases the Service Menu change is required.

Omen

07-15-04, 07:33 PM

On my 34XBR910 it's definitely a white (albeit dim) vertical line about 5" wide that moves right to left. I see it using 1080i via component from my Motorola DCT5100 HDTV cable box. If I set the box to output 720p, the line goes away. It does not appear at any other resolution (480i, 480p).

So, except for the color of your line, it sure sounds like your seeing the vertical bar problem.

BloatedCorpse

07-15-04, 11:35 PM

..for the poster who asked previously. The infamous scrolling line has not made an appearance on my 960 and I hope it stays that way.
BC

budrickton

07-16-04, 01:29 AM

I had my HD terminal replaced yesterday, and as far as I can see, this wave (yes, I don't believe anyone actually meant a literal bright white line) effect seems to have disappeared. What concerns me though is what someone posted several pages back about the problem resurfacing after awhile. So, in case it does, I'd like to consider this service mode/HDPT>0 change. Can someone point me to the directions to access the service mode, and which changes have proven successful at fixing this problem? And perhaps there are other settings to be optimized? Besides adjusting the very basic settings (like brightness/contrast/picture, etc.) in 'Menu', I haven't calibrated my TV from the original settings it was delivered with.

Thanks for any/all help.

NorthJersey

07-16-04, 09:55 AM

Originally posted by blackngold75
JBThompson

What you are describing sounds almost exactly like how this problem manifested itself on my 34HS510. Line definitely moved from left to right, and was more of a "wave" than a white line - I noticed it most on dark images and also saw it as a discoloration of flesh tones. The service menu fix (I did it myself) is what resolved the problem. I couldn't get any support from Sony until I found this thread and was able to reference the bulletin described here. The line only shows up on 1080i sources. 720p and lower resolutions are not affected.

blackngold, did Sony replace the B board in your TV, or did you just do the service menu adjustments ?

NorthJersey

07-16-04, 09:58 AM

Originally posted by budrickton
I had my HD terminal replaced yesterday, and as far as I can see, this wave (yes, I don't believe anyone actually meant a literal bright white line) effect seems to have disappeared. What concerns me though is what someone posted several pages back about the problem resurfacing after awhile. So, in case it does, I'd like to consider this service mode/HDPT>0 change. Can someone point me to the directions to access the service mode, and which changes have proven successful at fixing this problem? And perhaps there are other settings to be optimized? Besides adjusting the very basic settings (like brightness/contrast/picture, etc.) in 'Menu', I haven't calibrated my TV from the original settings it was delivered with.

Thanks for any/all help.

check out jjingle's post with the fix, Aristotle replied to it on this same page (about 5-6 posts up)

JBThompson

07-16-04, 10:04 AM

Thanks for the confirmation. A Sony rep called my home yesterday to arrange for an "in-home" repair. I have yet to call back.

I am disappointed to hear that it can also occur using component inputs as I was hopeful that a short term solution would be to swap my DVI cable for a component cable. I am reluctant to muck around within the service menus while my TV is still under warranty with a repair pending. For now I just keep my Tivo in 480p output mode and the "wave" disappears. And, I may still try swapping cables this weekend.

When Sony does the repair I will report the results to this thread.

blackngold75

07-16-04, 11:08 AM

Originally posted by NorthJersey
blackngold, did Sony replace the B board in your TV, or did you just do the service menu adjustments ?
My TV already has the appropriate B board, so I just did the service menu adjustments. I had a scheduled service appointment for this from an "Authorized Sony Facility" - but the repair person showed up 4 hours late, and by that time it was 10:00 PM! I decided I didn't want to deal with that repair shop after that, so I just did it myself.

NorthJersey

07-16-04, 01:41 PM

so how can you tell if you have the correct "B" board ? Can you provide Sony your serial # and they would know if it has the right board or not ?

blackngold75

07-16-04, 02:05 PM

My understanding of the fix is that if you don't have a compatible "B" board, that you will not see any picture from a 1080i source when you change the HDPT setting.

geohsia

07-16-04, 05:08 PM

Hi all,
I'm new to this forum, so please be patient. I tried to read as much of this thread as I could and just tried the fix. Apparently I have a compabible B board because when I set HDPT to 0, the scanning bar goes away. I also implemented all of the other fixes listed in the thread a few pages back. I did notice that there is a significant drop in PQ. Some have noted that there is no difference, I suggest for everyone that tries the fix to look through all HD channels. Not all are channels encoded the same way even though they're HD. I use Comcast cable w/ HD and there are 2 channels called INHD and you can tell the difference in quality between that channel and what I see w/ ESPN or NBC. The INHD signal is much crisper, less artifacts and just look really nice. When I switched to HDPT 0, the images are still clean, but no pop. There is some loss in detail. On other HD channels, the difference is less visible. You can't see the detail 6+ feet away, but it is less crisp overall. I'm still waiting for my Zenith DB318. Not sure if it'll be noticeable w/ DVD's. The upsampling might make a difference but my guess is that it won't but we'll see. So here's my question....

Does anyone know how to bump up the sharpness besides: 2170P_3 SHOF=3? Based on the instructions, they recommended 3 except for vivid. I just set it to 3 for vivid too, but still can't squeeze out the detail like when HDPT was set to 1. Anyone have other suggestions to bring the PQ up to when HDPT is set to 1? Thanks.

George

NorthJersey

07-17-04, 09:08 AM

I implemented this fix on my 34HS510 last night, and the vertical line is gone, so I must have the correct B board. I watched Matrix and then Star Wars II after that, and there is absolutely no PQ loss, might even look a little better. I have the Zenith dvb318 set to 1080i. Afterwards, watched inHD on cablevision system, and sportscenter on ESPNHD and PQ looks as good as it did before. I made all the changes recommended by the Sony memo, exactly as such.

thanks to all for the help, and for jjingle for posting the Sony fix

npm

08-02-04, 11:52 PM

geohsia- "Does anyone know how to bump up the sharpness besides: 2170P_3 SHOF=3?"

Try 2170P-3:F1LV=3

I was messing with the 2170P-3 values after reading your post. This one in particular seemed to make a huge difference. Try the others also, there were a couple of others that also affected the sharpness but I cannot remember them.

Please post your results...

eddieg516

08-04-04, 05:08 PM

I'm reading the messages here and want to try the fix with the setup mode, but no where can I find HOW to get INTO setup mode. What is meant by "select an RF input"? Does that mean the video mode for the regular cable (i.e. video 1 or 2)

Thank you,

Eddie G

eddieg516

08-04-04, 05:49 PM

r.e. my last post, I found the info, but it is in regards to a different model than I have. Also, there is mention of running AVIA. What is that?

Tom in OH

08-05-04, 09:12 AM

Originally posted by eddieg516
r.e. my last post, I found the info, but it is in regards to a different model than I have. Also, there is mention of running AVIA. What is that?

Hi,
AVIA is a DVD with video and audio test patterns. It's used mainly for setting the input on your tv that will be used for watching DVDs, but it can be used for other sources as well.

Sound & Video magazine also offers a DVD test disc called, "Home Theater Tune-up".

JayDog_2

08-19-04, 06:54 PM

Okay, So I bought my Sony KV-36XBR800 one year ago... and found this thread a month or two later... Well until a month ago, I didn't have any source to display 1080i material, So I didn't know if my TV had this problem....

Well, it does. I tried the Service menu adjustment, but it didn't work... So I knew I had to have the b-board replaced....

Well, I called a local Sony service center, explained the problem, and told them I need a new board... They said they wouldn't order it until the tech came out to verify that is the problem...

Sure enough, the guy came out today (he hadn't seen this problem before, but I showed him the print-out of the service bulletin - Thanks to this wonderful forum :) ) Anyways, after reviewing it, he says... "Looks like I'll need to order you a new b-board!."

What a waste of time!! So now I have to wait another week for him to order it, and come back out, take more time off of work, blah blah blah....

I wish they could've just listened to me in the first place, and saved their and my time! I do, of course understand that they can't take the word of 'some guy' that he really knows what he's talking about when he calls about a problem, BUT GEEZ!!!!

Okay... done venting now.... :)

Oh, and the tech does frequent this board, so.... Sean, it's nothing against you! :)

jlstang95

08-29-04, 10:21 AM

Hello all. I found this thread last weekend and I have the 36xbr800 that I purchased in Dec 2002. My tv also has the white line problem. I got hdtv through cox cable and original had the motorla dct6200 set top box. I had is swaped out twice thinking it was the problem. When I found this thread I found out it was the tv and scheduled an apt. with sony to come out this friday for a new B board. As it turns out cox just released their new HD DVR and I had it installed yesterday. I think its motorla DCT6400. And guess what no more white line. So what do I do now that sony is coming this friday and the problem is gone, but I don't know will it come back in the future because the root of the problem is still there. Any ideas would be appreciated. Thanks

davehancock

08-29-04, 11:52 AM

How were/are the cable boxes connected to the set? Component or DVI? Both boxes at 1080i (your Sony will display 720p, though 1080i is the correct choice). These can all make a difference.

jlstang95

08-29-04, 12:03 PM

They were both hooked up via DVI. The old box DCT 6200 did not have an output option. I imagine that it was at 1080i because the line was appearing. The new box DCT 6400 does have an output variable and it is currently at 1080i wide and 420i standard. The other options are 720p wide or 420p standard. It came with the 1080i as the factory setting and the line is now gone. The way I would test to see if the line was there would be to turn the cable box off and only a black screen would remain. With the old box the line would be refreshing on the screen. With the new box it is just black. I have watched quite a few shows that are dark and no line. Could an adjustment in the box make a difference.

davehancock

08-29-04, 12:20 PM

jlstang95,

Interesting. I suspect that turning the box off may not be a good test as it might not be sending a signal at all or, if a signal is sent, it could be radically different.

The problem really is/was due to the set (not the box). The problem is that the problem only shows up under certain circumstances. That's why Sony let it go out that way - 95% never saw the problem. Your warranty is running out and you should have the B board replaced with a fully populated one. But it will be difficult to get the tech to replace it if you can't demonstrate a problem.

Fortunately the new box is a DVR so you could record a few movies and carefully review them for dark scenes. Carefully adjust the brightness on your set to give maximum shadow detail (basically you want the blacks on the light side). The problem will be easiest to display when you'r DVR is on pause (freeze frame) - then you can see the line running through it. Sony says the problem is most noticeable with the picture set to "Vivid". If you can find something on the DVR to demonstrate the problem you are more likely to get the tech to replace the B board.

You really want to get that board replaced. For all you know your current box might go bad and be replaced (by cable) with another box that will be slightly different so that the problem becomes more obvious.

NorthJersey

08-30-04, 12:18 PM

jlstang,

did you try applying the fix for the scrolling white bar w/o getting the "B" board replaced ? I first noticed the white bar when I connected my Zenith dvd player by dvi cable and set it to upconvert dvd's to 1080i. I made the settings changes to the tv and the white bar disappeared, meaning that my tv had the correct "b" board. You should give it a try - if you don't have the correct b-board, the directions say one of the first settings won't take effect.

btw, I have the 34HS510

jlstang95

08-30-04, 12:21 PM

I did not aply the 1 to 0 change. I was going to wait for the sony Tech that is coming out this friday before I did anything. And when I got my new HD DVR the line went away. We watched Six feet Under on HBO last night which is a show that I always see the line on. Now its gone. I can't explain why it dissapeared. The only variable I have changed is the cable box. Everything else is the same.

Tom in OH

08-30-04, 12:33 PM

Originally posted by NorthJersey
jlstang,
I made the settings changes to the tv and the white bar disappeared, meaning that my tv had the correct "b" board.

btw, I have the 34HS510

Hi Jersey,
just curious what your 34HS510 manufacture date is if it originally came with the new B board.
Thx, Tom

NorthJersey

08-30-04, 04:02 PM

where would it be listed - on the back of the tv ?

I bought it at CC at the end of July 03

Tom in OH

08-31-04, 10:24 AM

ya, probably on the back somewhere. You did well to receive a tv with the new board in July '03. Maybe I'm mistaken, but it seems several who bought after that date are having the vertical bar prob.

I almost bought your model Sony last Fall but decided on the Tosh 34 HFX 83.

Ronald Lee

09-06-04, 12:44 PM

Wow! it appears that my 3 month saga with the white shadow on my KV34-HS510 is coming to a close since I found a search engine that found this forum! I will give a brief review of the grief I went through and I also have a few questions for anyone who has an answer or opinion.
A. Bought the TV in early June 2004 Great picture! Totally impressed.
B. Noticed white bar on HD tv channels and other satellite channels.
Rex TV said "Cannot be the TV, look elsewhere"
C. Spent weeks on and off with Direct Tv, Samsung, Sony, myself
D. Finally got Sony to say board needed replaced and sent Tech to replace
board.
E. Turns out he put in wrong board and and it took me days to
convince Sony of that. Advanced Sony tech figured it out when
screen options did not come up in menu.
F. tech verified that board was wrong and put in new one.
G. I thought problem was solved but white bar returned.(Was never
gone,probably)
H. Tech said there is nothing more he could do, it would have to be taken
into shop. Gave up and sulked awhile.
I. I found this thread!

Now for the questions.
1. I am assuming he put in new "B" board, but I do not know for sure and I don't really want to take the back off to look. I have done the "OP HDPT to 0" change and the white bar is gone. (The brightness did drop)
Now, Does this prove for certain that the correct board is in place?
2. I have looked through the service mode and have seen that all the current values are not what the Service bulletin calls for. It would appear to me that the tech only swapped out the board but did not know anything about changing anything in the service mode. Should I go through all these changes or leave it alone with the just the OP HDPT change?
3. The set was manfactured in Jan 2004. Is it possible that the board never actually needed replaced but needed the service mode changes only?
4. When going through the service mode I know that to go forward through the menu you press 4. Is there a way to "back up"?
I probably have more but......
Thanks

montreal

09-07-04, 12:03 PM

Originally posted by Ronald Lee
Now for the questions.
1. I am assuming he put in new "B" board, but I do not know for sure and I don't really want to take the back off to look. I have done the "OP HDPT to 0" change and the white bar is gone. (The brightness did drop)
Now, Does this prove for certain that the correct board is in place?
2. I have looked through the service mode and have seen that all the current values are not what the Service bulletin calls for. It would appear to me that the tech only swapped out the board but did not know anything about changing anything in the service mode. Should I go through all these changes or leave it alone with the just the OP HDPT change?
3. The set was manfactured in Jan 2004. Is it possible that the board never actually needed replaced but needed the service mode changes only?
4. When going through the service mode I know that to go forward through the menu you press 4. Is there a way to "back up"?
I probably have more but......
Thanks

1. Yes, you cannot make a bar suddenly disappear unless the correct B board is available.
2. Yes, It makes sense to fine tune your new picture using the parameters that SONY suggests.
3. I think it is highly likely that the original B board could have been the proper board. It is not in Sony's interest to activate the B boards for all sets leaving the factory, since many customers will not experience a vertical line problem and do not wish to be deprived of the particular "look" that an unbypassed picture has. The patch bypasses the digital circuits and creates a "raw" look, that some, but not all owners, prefer.
4. To back up, press "1". Likewise, buttons "2" and "5" are complimentary, as are "3" and "6".

Happy viewing, and make sure you follow the bulletin exactly, particularly in reference to being in RF mode when you change the OP HDPT parameter.

ADU

09-08-04, 01:56 PM

Now, Does this prove for certain that the correct board is in place?
FWIW, if the bypass has been successful, then all the MID/DRC circuits should be bypassed, and geometry controls like the following should have no effect on a 1080i picture.

MID1
MDHP
MDVP
MDHS
MDVS

MID3
VDHP
VDHS
VDVE
VDVS

Do not write any changes to these to memory because they could effect the geometry of some other signals too.

I believe, on the remote, 1 & 4 cycle through the indiviual SM items (or registers). 2 & 5 cycle through the SM registers by category. 3 & 6 change the value of the currently selected item. That's the way it works on my 34XBR800 anyway.

Don't mess with any SM items that you aren't familiar with. Some of the commands work in very complex ways, and can have nasty consequences if you don't know what you're doing.

If you want an official service manual or help from Sony's Non-Authorized Tech Support, there's some info on how to obtain these in my signature.

litzdog911

10-01-04, 01:47 PM

Well, I thought that I had been spared the dreaded "vertical bar" problem with my Sony KV40XBR800 (manufactured March 2003) and my DirecTV HR10-250 HiDef Tivo connected via DVI/HDMI. I've had the HiDef DirecTivo for a five months now and had never seen the vertical bar problem on ANY 1080i programs (both OTA and DirecTV HD channels) .... until last night.

I was watching a recording of "Sunrise Earth" from Discovery HD and immediately noticed the vertical bar scrolling from right to left during the relatively dim early morning landscape scenes. Pausing the Tivo did NOT pause the scrolling bar, so I knew right away it was not in the source recording. I'm puzzled, though, that I've never seen it on any other 1080i shows until this one!

So, after reviewing this entire thread, I have a few questions for those of you who've tried fixing this problem ....

1. With a March 2003 manufacture date, does my KV40XBR800 have the correct version of the "B board" to try the HDPT 1 to 0 fix?

2. Why does the TV need to be set to an RF input when changing HDPT? Is this step just to verify that the correct board version is already installed? It would be nice if I could bring up my recorded HDNet Test Pattern, toggle the HDPT setting, and see if there's any noticable impact on picture quality.

3. If step 2 above shows no changes in picture quality, are the rest of the service menu tweaks outlined in bulletin E18728143 required?

4. If the picture quality is noticably worse, would it be easier to just set my HR10-250 to output 720p rather than 1080i for the rare times that I notice the vertical bar?

5. Has anyone here had recent experience with the latest version of the "B board" that supposedly requires no service menu tweaks after swapping the memory chip?

6. Any ideas why I can't make this problem visible on every 1080i program and only finally saw it on this one particular Discovery HD recording?

Thanks for you help! This thread is awesome.