Several folks have noticed a faint vertical bar, maybe 2 inches wide moving across the screen (usually right to left) when viewing 1080i sources. It has been seen using different models of HD OTA or Satellite tuners.

The question is whether or not its common with all the new Sonys, just certain models, or is just a problem with a few individual sets (although I've had two myself).

Once you notice it, its one of those things that can haunt you - so you may not want to check for it if you haven't seen it. If so, don't read any further.

Its been my experience that its most visible during dark scenes - when the credits are rolling after a show for example - and sometimes can be seen in the dark areas of "normal" pictures. As far as I know its only visible when viewing 1080i signals using either the component or DVI inputs.

It can be made more apparent by setting the TV brightness and contrast (picture) controls higher than normal -- although it can also be seen after calibrating the set using the SMPTE color bars' pluge signal -- available from the Video Essentials or AVIA setup disks -- then tuning to a HD channel.

I'd like to know which models have it and with what receiver or other video sources.

It's been in both of my 40XBR800's when driving the component input with a Dish 6000 receiver (both on HD OTA signals and HBO/SHOWTIME HD satellite signals).

Its source is the very slight (1 Hz) frequency difference between the set's horizontal scan rate and the 1080i video's horizontal sync rate.

Yep, I've got it in my set, a 34XBR800. I notice if I change the output from my HD200 to 720P, it goes away. I'm reluctant to do this as a matter of course because I'm afraid the picture quality will suffer.

This sounds like a bug in the design to me...:(

Originally posted by Andy64
Several folks have noticed a faint vertical bar, maybe 2 inches wide moving across the screen (usually right to left) when viewing 1080i sources. It has been seen using different models of HD OTA or Satellite tuners.

The question is whether or not its common with all the new Sonys, just certain models, or is just a problem with a few individual sets (although I've had two myself).

After reading some earlier msgs describing this, I've looked for this on my KV-34XBR800 and not found it. My HD source is Time-Warner cable and a Scientific-Atlanta 3100HD box.

Phil

No problem..whatsoever, with my 34RBR800..purchased in August. I have Directv, cable (free), and OTA. ..with a Mit STB.

Enough of this talk!..I am looking far too hard on my set to find it...........

Originally posted by magic123
Enough of this talk!..I am looking far too hard on my set to find it...........

Yeah .. it is pretty easy to drive yourself crazy looking for little defects :)

Phil

Euratus, yes, I definately think its a design problem - but maybe not visible to most set owners depending on their source of 1080i signals.

magic123, if you need to look that hard - I suggest you stop looking and enjoy your set. BTW, what box do you use to tune to 1080i HD channels?

Its interesting that, so far, I've only heard of it being visible when using Dish 6000 or Sony HD200 boxes. I'm not familiar with the design of HD boxes but it makes me wonder if the Horizontal sync rate coming from the box varies from box to box. I know my Dish 6000 box temporarily changes rate when channels are changed - then goes back to 33.716 kHz (the H deflection in my 40XBR800 is 33.717 kHz, hence the 1 Hz difference). If the h sync rate from other boxes is substantially different than this (or if other individual sets run at a different horizontal rate) the "problem" wouldn't be nearly as noticeable.

I can also see it when I attach a modified NTSC video signal generator (set to run at 16.858 kHz) to the Y component input. As I change the freq of the generator, the bars move more and more rapidly until they are not noticeable.

Finally, I've also been able to see it with my DVD player connected to the component input -- but it looks like noise under those conditions and isn't at all obvious.

Well, it's a problem...but what can we do about it? I suspect nothing...Thoughts?

I would think that, if given enough feedback, Sony will respond - especially since it appears that their HD tuner and TV set combination has the problem. I'm hoping to gather enough data to be able to get their attention - although I haven't quite figured out how yet.

I've spoken with the local dealer where I bought my set(s) and have also spoken to their service tech. Very sympathetic (replaced my 40XBR800 for me) but, without actually seeing the problem its hard for them to get enthused about a fix.

I'll keep looking for a way to get Sony's attention.

I'm not a Sony owner, but I have experienced a similar problem with the new Toshiba 34" widescreens. I bought a 34HD82 and noticed a vertical bar like you describe, but it is stationary in the very center of the screen. Only visible on lighter backgrounds, such as watching a hockey match or football game, golf, etc. I returned the 34HD82 last weekend and tried the 34HDX82- when I hooked it up last night- exact same problem. I wonder if there is some inherent design flaw with direct-view widescreens?

I have a 40xbr800 and an Hd200 and am experiencing exactly what you describe in hd. I too am interested in what can be done to alleviate the problem. Thanks.

I have the 40xbr800 and the hd200 and have the same problem, also.

Perhaps its the HD source (STB) not the TV since several different TV models have been listed. List your HD 1080i source for each case, to look for similarities.

The display on auburn97's Toshiba sounds similar but different (not moving).

I think its in the tv and that it may be more apparent with some STBs than others due to differences in the horizontal syncs rate amongst the various STBs.

My bet is that the flyback pulse is getting into the component and DVI input circuits. With the new digital sets, the horizontal deflection of the TV does not necessarily run at the same frequency as the incoming signal. In the case of 1080i inputs and video from at least some sources (Sony HD200 and Dish 6000) the difference is only about 1 Hz - causing the bar to be easily seen as it moves across the screen in one second. For normal NTSC signals the difference in the TV's horizontal scan rate and twice the NTSC sync rate (its line doubled in the set) is more like 2.5 kHz which looks more like noise than a bar. Its there when playing DVDs through the component input - but difficult to see.

I have driven the TV with a test signal generator and been able to see the same thing. Even used quad shielded coax to connect the generator to the tv and ran the generator off of a power inverter to make certain there was no coupling through the AC line.

addendum:

The bar movement disappears when I switch to 720 p.

addendum:

The bar movement disappears when I switch to 720 p.

The H sync rate at 720p (at least coming out of my Dish 6000) is 48.4131 kHz. This means that the bar is crossing the screen roughly 15,000 times a second (the H scan rate of my 40XBR800 is 33.7 kHz). I suspect the bar is still there but not visible due to the wide frequency difference between the TV's deflection and incoming video.

It would be interesting to use two receivers, one set for 1080i, the other to 720, each connected to one of the component inputs on the 40XBR800, then switch between the two inputs while watching for differences in the image.

I have the same problem with the 34XBR800 using the GI (Motorola) DCT-5100 STB.

With the DCT5100 and the KD-34XBR2 there is a travelling line with the Showtime channel during some dark scenes. It might be there during brighter scenes and on other channels but it is not immediately visible. Setting the output to 720p creates a faint ringing pattern due to the Sony resampling and interpolating to 1080i.

I was having a shading problem on my initial XBR and had it replaced even though the HDTV was "window"-like. The new set wasn't quite as vibrant but there was little or no shading in the corners, so I was very happy...until ER and I noticed what at first looked like the reflection from a white police light; the white verticle line that crossess the screen every second or two! Rats! Has anyone called Sony about this yet? I hesitate to replace this set with another and have the same problem. I'll call Sony this morning and report back. Hopefully it's something that can be tweaked...as well as the picture. I'm surprised that there would be such a difference between two different sets of the same make and model.

Let us know what Sony says!!

It's getting to the point that all I seem to see, in every show, is this moving vertical line. It's like I'm fixated on the problem. Every time a scene changes, I look for it, almost unconsciously. Too often, I see it. During Jay Leno's monologue last night, I could see it it his desk, behind and to his right...it seemed like the desk was pulsating....like to drive me crazy. Enterprise the other night was particularly bad (UPN is still analog for me, but outputting at 1080i brings out that nasty line). There were a couple of dark scenes in CSI last night that were so annoying...

I tried switching the HD200 to 720p output for several hours. At first, it didn't seem bad, but over time I found CBS and NBC too "soft" using this method. I mean, watching CSI (CBS), the signal went from 1080i to 720p back to 1080i in the TV. This has to introduce artifacts. I switched back to 1080i on the HD200 and immediately CSI looked better, crisper somehow. On the other hand, ABC wasn't to bad. The signal is originally 730p and only gets converted once, to 1080i in the TV.

I feel rather cheated. Here I go, spend $3000 on Sony's latest and greatest 34XBR800 and HD200, only to have this line draw my eyes to it constantly.

Okay; I spoke with a wonderful Sony rep, Raquel, who had a really, really sexy voice and who did her job extremely well. She consulted her service manual and asked me to do a few things to the set, some of which I had already tried but one I had not. I am a newbie so I might not be accurate on this and please don't flame Sony if what she said is wrong, but she instructed me to change my advanced video setting to interlaced on 1080i sources. I tried this and it did help. If I look hard enough on the gray display box I can still see traces of the issue, but once the display goes away, so far, I cannot see the white line anymore. As soon as I say this, of course, it will come back, but for now I am at least a little happy.

I am comforted by her renewed commitment on behalf of Sony to help with with this and any other problem I might encounter. From what she said, interlaced keeps the 1080i source in it's native mode; progressive and cinemotion up-convert it when none is necessary; obviously 720p doesn't need any help since the issue is not there (ABC, by the way, currently uses 720p which is why the PQ looks fine on ABC while not great on 1080i sources). Makes sense and it works, at least initially. I'll watch a bit tonight and if it's still there I'll call the Sony authorized warranty dealer that Raquel told me about in my area.

I have been able to tweak the HD image and it now is close to being as good as it was on my previous set, although I may just be getting used to great images...perhaps that "wow" factor subsides after a while. So relax, enjoy and report any problems to Sony. The number is in your manual at the beginning of the troubleshooting section.

Nothing is ever going to be perfect and it's only because we spent so much money that we are being a bit obsessive about it all...speaking for myself anyway. Think of your car or house on which so much more was spent and remember the little problems there. We didn't pay the mega thousands required for truly great home theater systems but even there I bet there are problems; heck, in the movie theater last week I was disappointed in the PQ and thought to myself that direct-view was even better than that (real grainy). Do this, go watch TV for a while on your old set. My Samsung which I thought was great at the time I bought it has several glaring problems, not the least of which is very noticable markings on a dark screen and wavy lines which were very noticable on DVDs. I love my XBR and despite the white line and a few other "minor" issues, it's so much better that what I had. Of course it will be better if the white line is truly gone, but if not, I'll pester Sony until they make it right! Hoowah!

Oh, one other thing; I neglected to add that I use Auto-DVI mode on my HD200 which automatically sets the tune to the source material's signal (1080i for HDNET and CBS/NBC/FOX/UPN/WB and 720 for ABC; 420p for everything on DirecTV other than HDNET). So if you are keeping 1080i for all your viewing you might think about changing it. I use VIVID for my HD content stuff and changed the video mode to interlaced. I switch over to PRO for my non-HD stuff, which is in Cinemotion and Movie for, well, duh, movies, also on Cinemotion. I also found that by turing off the edge enhancer that PQ is better on HD channels; I loved the crisp edges, but it tends to fuzz words and create noise on some edges.

petesimac,

Good words from you. Unfortunately, I have the HD200 connected through the DVI pore (Video 7), which has the Advanced Video option disabled; you can't adjust Interlaced, Progressive, or CineMotion with DVI.

Perhaps I'll hook the HD200 directly to the TV through component (Video 6) and try that. I also thought I'd try going component to my receiver (Sony DA5ES) and then component to the TV. The only problem with that is the 200 pound TV takes two to move out of it's cabinet to monkey with the connections; I'll see if my brother can lend me a hand over the weekend.

Every time I ask him for help, it costs me pizza, root beer, and a movie (on the new HDTV, of course). Maybe not such a bad deal for me...

I have my STB connected to the Video-5 input and the advanced video settings are disabled there as well. Am I missing something?

I have the same line on my 34xbr800. I am using a Samsung SIR-T151 decoder hooked up to component inputs. Sony MUST know about this!How could this of gotten past the testing stage when they designed this set!?!?

I'm calling Sony and my dealer who I have a service contract with to see if there is an update part or fix to deal with this.---- GS kid

Oops, I meant to post my reply here instead of on the main direct-view page, but... Anyway, as I feared, last night while watching the Paul McCartney concert on HDNET the line was back. I immediately phoned the Sony Authorized Service center and put in a request for a service call. I think they were out of the office because I did not get a call back, so likely it will be Monday before I know just when they are coming by -- probably not until after the Thanksgiving holiday :( But the guy on the service line did mention that it was probably the tuner. So I guess that's good news since if they know where the problem is, they can fix it, theoretically anyway. At any rate, Sony is on the line for the next two years and I plan to put them to their word -- they will fix it, I am sure of it or they will replace it. What's the use of a warranty if you don't use it. So I highly recommend to everyone with this problem to call Sony and report it and then contact a service rep. Let's get to the bottom of this thing!

Any updates on this issue? This thread's been dead for several days now but the problem is still driving me crazy. Any "official" word from Sony?

When I set the HD200 to Auto DVI, ABC is sent to the TV as 1080i; I've since switched my HD200 to Variable1 which leaves all the HD signals in their native format. Now ABC is sent to the set in 720p and has no line problem. In moderate to dark scenes from any 1080i channel on the HD200 (NBC, CBS, PBS), however, this line is as bad as ever. I've been unable to get the Advanced Video option to show up either. It is available from the DVD player's input (component Video 6), but this isn't 1080i and does not need any correction. I've Avid-calibrated the Pro mode, which I use on all video sources (HD200, DVD and VHS VCR). Perhaps I should see if one of the other modes, likely Movie, would have the Advanced Video option when fed a 1080i signal from the DH200. I'd sure like to give Sony Raquel's Interlaced "fix" a try.

Ideas?

Unfortunately this is the same guy who I had to literally beg to try something when he came to look at my first set because of the shaded areas; his first words to me when he saw the shaded areas was, "Good luck getting rid of those." So after a set exchange and this new problem I am hoping he'll be a little more aggressive in treating the white line.

It is actually very easty to access the advanced video settings; just turn off the receiver, puch the "TV" button on your remote (gray, not green) and press menu and it should be lighted again. Sadly it doesn't affect anything. I have since found out that the receiver disables this feature and takes over for it so changing the settings doesn't help. I remain convinced that this problem is fixable. If not, Sony will be soon sending me a new set (Circuit City is off the hook; the onus is now on Sony and it will be they, not Circuit City, who is going to jump through hoops to make me happy.)

In the meantime, call Sony, (number on the troubleshooting page of your manual) and get the number, from them, for a local authorized technician. Once they become more aware of the problem, perhaps they will have a quick fix available for all who follow.

I am new to this forum .I have the 36hs500 great tv.I had the bars on mine also I noticed while watching sopranos any how could not figure out what was happening changed component cables,unplug 6000 ird still saw bars with ird unpluged.So i put it in movie mode bars seem to fade.I went back to standard mode adjusted settings on tv to match settings on movie mode.The problem seem to go away as I have been checking all week.For me a big improvement.

Just an update...

My neighbor is an Electrical Engineering professor at the local university. I mentioned to him over the long weekend about my troubles with the 34XBR800 and HD200. He offered to take a look. He brought several pieces of testing apparatus home from the lab and hooked them up to the component jacks of both the HD200 and 34XBR800 (he had no equipment that could diagnose DVI). His findings parallel those of Andy64 reported above. In summary, there is a 1 Hz (approximately...it varied slightly depending on which 1080i channel was tuned to) difference between what the HD200 was outputting and the TV's refresh rate. We were able to vary the input to the TV from one of his boxes and watch the dreaded vertical line stop in the middle of the screen, reverse direction (left to right now), slow down or speed up, change direction again (back to the right to left), depending on how he moved a knob on the box. I felt that this testing corroborated Andy64's earlier work. It was a "fun" hour or so, though I became increasingly more convinced that this is a Sony design problem.

The next morning (Saturday), I spent an hour or so on the phone with "Ed," a second-level Sony tech. The number I called was 1-800-838-7669, then 1, then 0, to get to a live operator. I was on hold less than a minute before a first-level tech answered. It took her two minutes of listening to my explanation before she said she needed to transfer me to the second-level tech. Ed was quite willing to help, but eventually realized that this was more then he could help with and said he'd transfer me to another, higher, level of support. However, these guys apparently don't work weekends and would be in Monday. Ed actually took my phone number to have the tech-level call me back. We'll see what happens.

At any rate, Ed mentioned that there was nothing in his Customer Support database about any problem like this. I assured him that there are many, many users complaining about this issue "out on the Internet forums." He encouraged me to try and get all of you folks to call in and report this problem. The more complaints they receive, the sooner it will bubble up to their tech folks and have something done.

Ed did mention that Sony recently discovered, through a high number of customer complaints, that they had a problem with the DVI boards on some of these new XBR TVs. The symptoms (a pinkish or greenish vertical bar sweeping across the screen) sounded very similar to the vertical bar we're seeing, but it only happens with DVI connections. A replacement DVI board has been designed, is being used in all new production, and can be installed in existing TVs rather easily. Perhaps if we all call them about our issue, something similar will happen...

My brother also sees a vertical bar in the center, but it doesn't move. He's using a DTC-100 with a Daewoo 30" 16:9 (which uses a Toshiba tube). He uses an adapter to RGBHV from the DB-15 connector of the DTC to the TV.

He was able to lessen the bar, maybe even not visible anymore, by turning the sharpness control to 0. Sharpness didn't do much anyway, but turning it up you can see the vertical bar, turning it down it's gone. Maybe someone could try the sharpness control with their Sony.

Not sure if this is related, but here's something I found on another forum without a reply.
----------------------------
This article authored by Glenn on 2/7/02 at 8:53 AM.

I have been using my SAT-HD100 for almost a year now (without any problems) and just last night, on the OTA channels only, a weird transparent white diagonal scrolling cross pattern started appearing. Rather annoying to say the least. Anyone else have this problem?
Thanks!

I have a samsung sirt 150 and sony 40xbr800 and getting the same vertical bars. Sent the stb to samsung repair over 2 wks ago.They say to me every time I call still researching the problem. Should I have them just send it back to me already If there is no fix?

I just got off the phone with Sony support 1-800-222-7669. This is the number in the back of the 36xbr800 & 40xbr800 operating instruction manual. Eventually (about 45 minutes of elevator music) got hold of "second level tech support". About all that was accomplished was that the problem was entered into the data base. She took the information and said she would send it to "engineering". I asked if or when I would hear back - no commitment - maybe a week? In this case, second level tech support was little more than data entry.

I'm glad others have had at least pleasant conversations with support - maybe I'll try again later.

I really encourage others to make the call in order to get enough data into their system to maybe attract attention.

I just got off the phone with Ron, a third-level Sony support technician, reached through 1-800-838-7669. He was a very courteous and knowledgeable tech. He reported that my conversation with Ed Saturday morning was properly relayed to "Engineering" and they have duplicated the problem in their test lab.:cool:

The vertical line transversing the screen at one-second intervals while in 1080i is now an official Sony engineering issue with the XBR800 line of TVs!!:p

Ron mentioned that once it is a recognized, known, hardware problem (as this appears to be) it usually takes several weeks for a fixed board to be engineered, tested, and fabricated. He suggested I call back "every couple of weeks" to receive updates but to not realistically expect anything before the first of the year. At that time, Sony would schedule a "local authorized service facility" to visit my home and replace the offending circuit board in the TV.

Ron mentioned that there has been an "onslaught" of calls the past few days on just this matter. He said the number of complaints, and the very precise frequency info given (thanks to Andy64 and my EE professor neighbor), allowed Engineering to focus in on the problem very quickly.

I am so relieved!!!

I've got no problem using 720p for a few weeks and waiting that long for this to be resolved!:D :D

For those of you still waiting, I highly recommend you call and ask for either Ed (second-level) or Ron (third-level) support. These guys are great to deal with (Ron maybe a little more so than Ed) and both seem to properly understand the problem. If anybody wants more specifics, feel free to e-mail me directly.

This is good news, guys and girls...

Originally posted by Andy64
I just got off the phone with Sony support 1-800-222-7669. This is the number in the back of the 36xbr800 & 40xbr800 operating instruction manual. Eventually (about 45 minutes of elevator music) got hold of "second level tech support". About all that was accomplished was that the problem was entered into the data base. She took the information and said she would send it to "engineering". I asked if or when I would hear back - no commitment - maybe a week? In this case, second level tech support was little more than data entry.

I'm glad others have had at least pleasant conversations with support - maybe I'll try again later.

I really encourage others to make the call in order to get enough data into their system to maybe attract attention. andy64, I just talked with someone from sony who told me they are familiar with the broblem. I asked if there was a fix, He said yes, and gave me the # to call locally to set up repair with tv. He gave me some #s to give to avs who is (I guess) certified sony. Im so bumed that samsung has had my reciever for two wks. But talked to them today and there sending it back.:D Am i really getting this problem fixed or do you think sony is just telling me what I want to here?

Be careful, guys. There is an older known problem with the DVI interface only that has similar symptoms to what we're discussing here. That fix will apparently not fix the 1080i vertical line problem that occurs in both DVI and component.

Just a word of warning...

Yeah, I'm concerned that they may focus on the DVI problem without looking at the component inputs.

Eurastus, did you describe your neighbors tests (on the component inputs only) to Sony? Also, when you guys were running your tests, did you happen to run tests on the video inputs in addition to the component inputs? When I was doing that, the problem was apparent only on the component inputs - not the video inputs. I also didn't have a signal source to test the DVI input.

They asked me how I was conecting the stb and I told them component video. They then said ,they had a fix. So I dont know what the truth is.

Yes...I specifically told Sony I could reproduce the problem at will, component or DVI, from the HD200.

In fact, that's what made Ron suspicious that this was a new problem; the previously identified issue affected the "DVI board" only. My neighbor and I didn't run any tests on either the S-Video or standard composite inputs, only the component inputs...I think Video 5. I have the DVD hooked up through the S-Video just for kicks, but have that input disabled on the TV and have an old VCR (for the kids' tapes) that I never use on the composite...frankly, I didn't care if it had the problem or not...I didn't even think to test S-Vdeo or composite.

I noticed the vertical line on my set again.I have the Kv36Hs500 So i called sony of Canada.I live in Ottawa Canada.They told me there was no reported problem of this vertical line going across the screen.I was given the # of a local authorized dealer>I called them there suppose to set up a time to come out and view the set.The only thing is that I can only see the bar sweeping across at niteI tried in the morning before going to work but with the daylite in the room you can not see the problem.Also there is only demos on in the morning which are very bright.When viewing shows like soporanos and other hd shows in prime time is when I really see the sweep across the screen.
I guess the tech would have to see the problem?
Will post again when the Tech comes to my house.

I called Sony today, got to tier-2, and the guy I spoke with had no record of the engineering issue nor anything in his database about this problem. Does anyone have an ID number for the engineering issue or their case number that we can refer to when we call about this? As of now I've been referred to the local service folks whom I doubt will be able to fix this problem.

I had this problem on day one of the hd-200 release (some may remember me posting on it) I fixed mine and it has not come back!
I returned my Sony 34xbr800 and bought the Sony kp51ws500 and its gone!
I wont chase fixes anymore.
Mike

My service guy also Sony Tech. and was also told that Sony is working on the problem.
2 questions......

Does anybody with a 34xbr800 use a progressive scan DVD player through component? When an interlaced DVD player is put in SLO-MO mode, it's common for scan line artifacts to appear. It looks like moving objects are being ripped apart every other line. Progressive DVD mode makes slo-mo look smooth without this scan line artifacts. This worked on my Proscan 38000 (RCA F38310) 38-inch HDTV with no problem. Silky smooth! Put my same Toshiba Progressive scan DVD player on my 34xbr800 and it looks awful !!! When I watch my skateboard videos in progressive at NORMAL play speed I see these scan line artifacts show up here and there and worse in slo-mo. The scan lines don't show up if I run the player at normal play speed when I set the player to interlaced mode but show up in interlaced slo-mo. Interlaced slo-mo looks the worse of all !!! Progressive worked sooooo well on my Proscan 38000. What's the 34xbr800's problem? Anybody know?!?

2nd Question:
Anybody with a Samsung T151 decoder get faint 1cm wide verticle lines (bars?) in your background fields ?!? It only appears through the component hook up. This is different from the 1080i line sweep we've been having. This almost has a faint screen door look except they are all verticle. It's worse during TRUE 4:3 screens like my multi-cast PBS station. It can still be seen to a lesser extent (smaller, lighter lines) in 1080i upconverts and HD. ----- GS kid

Does anyone from Sony USA or Sony Canada read these messages at the AVS forum?

(nudge, nudge, hint, hint!)

So let me try to understand, my samsung sirt150 w/component video hooked up to 40xbr800 causing bars of light from right to left (verticle) is not the same problem discused in this topic?

If Sony finds a solution to this problem, will they be retrofitting already sold sets with it.

neves,

That sounds like the exact problem (assuming 1080i signals). I'd say its independent of the brand/model of receiver (set-top box) being used.

Andy64, Yes it only happens in 1080i. Whats really strange is that I took the sirt150 stb to where I bought it and those bars where on all of the sony tested including many projection. It was just more noticable with 40xbr. I then went to best buy and they had the sirt150 running on mits projections with no noticable bars. So I dont know what to think,I just hope its somthing sony can do with tv because my stb will be back to me from samsung repair on monday.I got tired of hearing " We are researching the problem".They were letting it sit there and it just seemed to me that they had no clue on how to eliminate the bars.

Well, as promised, the Sony tech came today and, sadly, he was unable to do anything to fix the white line/wave problem. He said that he had never seen anything like it before and that he would have to check a website to see if any new alerts had been posted. He promised a call before the end of the day to follow up on the matter and, of course, didn't call. I'm about to call Sony to see how long it will take to fix/replace me set and I'll report back.

I was about to return my Samsung T151 and get the T160 I think it is. It has DVI port so I thought that might solve the problem. Anybody have a Samsung STB hooked up through DVI?!? Do you see the verticle stripes in the backgrounds?!?
I called Samsung and they said it must be the TV. But I told them it must be the STB cuz the lines start to appear after 10-20 minutes as the STB warms up. I don't want to get their STB w/DVI if it's gonna be the same problem.

I also noticed about the scan line artifacts I have with my progressive DVD player and my 34xbr800. It shows up on my XBOX as well when a 480P game does in-game MPEG video. When I disable 480p in the control panel, the scan lines are gone, but now my game is in 480i and there IS a difference. Anybody have this problem?!?!
I might start a thread on the subject.----- GS kid

Originally posted by Andy64
neves,

That sounds like the exact problem (assuming 1080i signals). I'd say its independent of the brand/model of receiver (set-top box) being used.

Perhaps. But I see none of this on my KV-34XBR800 using the SA 3100HD on Time-Warner cable.

Phil

I contacted Sony again today and related my technician's inability to solve the problem. When I finally reached a level three tech on the phone he took the name of the Sony Authorized repair center that visited on Friday and said that he would forward that info to their Sony Technician liaison guy and that he would call the repair center and brainstorm with them. I am told that either the Sony guy or the repair center will be contacting me by Wednesday to let me know if it can be fixed or if a replacement set is on the way. By the way, not all XBRs have this problem; my initial set did not have the white line and the new set does; both were viewed with the Sony SAT-HD200. I think it is a limited problem, but obviously one that needs to be fixed. As I told the Sony guy on the phone, I bought this set specifically to watch high-def; if there is a problem with that function, it needs to be fixed or replaced and he agreed, so we'll see. I'll report back on Wed. or Thurs.

I have a 34XBR800 and have these faint vertical lines when in 1080i using a General Instrument HDD-201 with component and my Sony HD-200 with DVI. I am still waiting for my Sony tech to take a look. He told me he does not have the equipment to test HDTVs yet. :confused:

I've got problem to called sony they said they have had no reports of this and there going to send a replacement hd200. reading this thread i don't think its going to help but ill try it out. if you look real close when the bar goes over the screen it also discolors everything on screen(faces turn a lite green and so on.) this problem sucks!!!

Congrats on the new HD200 Gashog, but it's not with the box, it's with the TV. I know this because Circuit City replaced my original 34XBR800 because of another problem and I did not have the white bar on that TV; it was only when I received my replacement TV that the problem began. Plus, many of the people who are experiencing this problem have STBs other than the Sony HD200. MrFirster, I would call Sony again and inform them that the tech you called cannot help you; they will give you another name and number of a tech who can at least look at the problem; it's inexcusable for a Sony Authorized repair center not to be up-to-date with their equipment; sounds like a reasonable excuse to drop them from the authorized list. Anyway, I'll let you all know what happens, but I would recommend getting the ball rolling by having a tech come by to verify the problem so that Sony can begin replacing these problem sets.

Sony called me today. We talked for almost 30 minutes. The woman was very nice. She told me that the fix for the right-to-left line sweep should be coming in the next week or so. She's going to call my service tech. guy personally as soon as she has the fix. The way she was talking, it seems they pretty much have a fix and that she seems to think it's an easy one. Let's hope she's right. She gave me her DIRECT phone number to touch base with her in the future. That's what I call service!
I returned my Samsung T151 and got the TS160 instead. Comes in stock next week. We'll see how DVI works out.
---- GS kid

well i hope that everyone will know this at sony seem to be when you can the the standard answer is "we dont have any info in our database" well thats B.S. i know just from reading this forum that there database should be filled with info. i think they tell them theres a problem but to tell customer everything is working fine.

Originally posted by Andy64

Its interesting that, so far, I've only heard of it being visible when using Dish 6000 or Sony HD200 boxes.

I saw it last night on my 34XBR800 before I found this thread. In fact, seeing the bar is what made me search for info on it and how I found this thread.

My STB is a Samsung SIR-T165. I have not calibrated the xbr yet and I saw it while watching Jay Leno last night using the Vivid pic mode with the Samsung on 1080i. I only saw it on one segment where he was standing next to his desk.

When I saw it, I thought it would only be visible if the picture/brightness is too high, and thus it would not be a problem after calibration. Hopefully.

Originally posted by GS kid
Sony called me today. We talked for almost 30 minutes. The woman was very nice. She told me that the fix for the right-to-left line sweep should be coming in the next week or so. She's going to call my service tech. guy personally as soon as she has the fix. The way she was talking, it seems they pretty much have a fix and that she seems to think it's an easy one. Let's hope she's right. She gave me her DIRECT phone number to touch base with her in the future. That's what I call service!

Please keep us posted. If you can, get a reference number. Even though I do not have the problem with my 3100HD, I could with some future STB. So I will want to have it dealt with.

If there is some sort of communications that Sony sends to their service providers, it would be good to be able to refer to it when I call to have my (symptom-free) set modified.

Phil

any more news on this i am waiting for a service tech to come out and look at mine, i dont know what hes going to do maybe sony just wants to here it from a tech that there are line going across my screen. its funny i live 25 mile southeast of dc and all the a.s.c will not come to my home they say its to far ive got 4 less then 30 away. call sony they said they will set a call up and who ever they get will call in a couple of days.

Gashog, I am at the next stage. A tech came out and couldn't remedy the problem, especially since he had never seen such a problem before. He promised to call back after checking the Sony tech website but never did. I phoned Sony to see what would happen next and they said that their tech would have to call the tech that visited so that they could discuss the problem. When he called the tech, he was told the set was operating according to factory specs...which is wrong! I called again to tell the Sony Company tech that there was a problem and that the tech DID see it and they called my tech back again only to be told the same thing again, so again, no action. I finally had to call the electronics company that sent the tech and got a direct number and finally was able to get everyone on the same page. Now I have to wait (perhaps tomorrow) to see what is going to happen next. I'm guessing they will either have a fix for the problem or will want to send someone else out here (maybe the Sony Company tech) or they will simply agree to send a new set. I'll let you all know when I find something out.

thanks

I was thinking about returning my Toshiba 34HD82 and getting a Sony, but it seems the Sony has as many, if not more, problems than the Toshiba. At least I usually do not see the line down the center of the screen in the Toshiba or the slight discoloration on the sides of the screen. I need to make a decision this week because the 30 day return period will be up. Maybe I will just return the TV and wait a couple of years when the technology has been perfected.

You just don't want to spend $2000 on a TV in order to get a great picture and then have to deal with lines and discolorations on the screen.

I'm having a local repair tech come out this week to look at the same problem between my SAT-HD200 and KV-40XBR800 via DVI. I talked to 2nd level Sony support yesterday and they acted like they hadn't ever heard of the problem before.

Overall, I like the PQ of this TV, but the 1080i sweep is distracting enough that I don't think I'll be happy keeping it if it cannot be fixed. I watched the Sopranos last week on HBOHD and the flesh tones were literally pulsing from greenish to redish every 1.5 seconds as a result of this problem.

What concerns me is that this sounds like a problem with all of the 40xbr800 sets, and I really don't enjoy the prospect of repeatedly swapping sets until it's fixed -or- spending more on a different set.

it not just in the 40xbr800 i think its the whole xbr800 series

This thread is about vertical lines, but I was inspecting the Sony at CC today and noticed some really cool horizontal lines about four inches from the top and bottom of the screen. They look similar to the cool lines on my computer monitor.

The lines were not that noticeable, but still there. If it was just the horizontal lines, I would not have a problem, but then combined with the vertical, I am not sure this is the TV for me. I may stick with the Toshiba.

I just got off the phone with a guy that's involved with offering HDTV services to roughly 2 million cable subscribers in the Detroit area. He also noticed the Vertical bar on the Sony's - they have several in their office area and has been talking with Sony about it for some time now. He needs a solution because guess who will get most of the calls when his subscribers start seeing the bar on their Sonys.

The good news is that he just (within the last hour) got a call from Sony saying that yes its in all of the XBR series and that they have a service bulletin to fix the problem. They are to send him some information about it and he agreed to forward the information to me. I'll pass it along here when it shows up.

At this time, the best approach may be to call your local Sony service person and ask him/her to find out about it.

Sony tech called earlier today indicating they now had a solution to the problem. Service technician will be coming Monday to apply the "fix." Will let you know if it works.

lied,

If you get a chance to watch the "operation", I'm really curious as to what he does. I'll be surprised if its a "software fix" done without removing the cabinet. If he opens the cabinet I'm curious about whether a circuit board is replaced, parts (wires) are relocated, or parts are added (maybe a shield or decoupling circuit).

scotty, the horizontal lines on all Sony sets are the tension wires for the aperture grill. it's on every Trinitron tube, and is an intrinsic feature of the design, not a defect.

this is good news i just walked in the door and finally a tech called to talk to me about my tv its to late ill give them a call tomorrow. i will update you guys and hopefully they know about the s.b.

Originally posted by scotty12321
I was thinking about returning my Toshiba 34HD82 and getting a Sony, but it seems the Sony has as many, if not more, problems than the Toshiba.FWIW, it's been my experience that the number of problems reported on HT discussion boards for a particular product is more related to the number of owners than the actual number of problems. There seems to be alot more Sony 34XBR800 owners than Tosh 43HD(X)82 owners (by quite a large margin) ... to me, it's only natural that we're seeing a lot more complaints (for the Sony).

Anyway, just something to think about.

There's actually an up-side to all these Sony owners finding and reporting problems. They're also looking for solutions ... and exposing issues you might not otherwise notice.

BTW, I'm going to be purchasing one of these two sets in the next two weeks ... so I've been doing alot of comparison between the two (still haven't decided ... they both seem like great sets to me).

The Most Complete Update Yet!!! -- OK, so when I read on this thread that a fix might be in the pipeline I decided to call Sony to follow-up. Indeed some action has been taken: a fax has been sent, at least to the Sony Authorized repair center in my area (Norman's Electronics) detailing what needs to be attempted by a tech who is faced with this problem (verticle white line/wave on 1080i). First he/she is to try to fix the problem in the service mode (I asked Norman's Electronics what specifically would be attempted but the woman said she might get in trouble if she told me the codes that required changing); if the service mode changes don't alleviate the condition then the v-board(?) would have to be brought in for a number of changes (the woman said that she counted 35 things that needed to be moved/altered, fixed, etc.); on most of the XBRs, the components needed for these changes are already mounted on the board, but for some of the more recently made sets (manufactured in and after October of this year -- I bought mine in late October, but they had been in the Circuit City warehouse for at least a month), the parts would need to be ordered OR for all sets where the changes do not work or the parts are not mounted, a new board will be available at a later date, but as of right now, there is no estimate on when this new board will be available.

I will be re-visited by my tech on December 31st (and I have specifically requested that he re-read the fax before coming or better yet, bring a copy of the fax so that he won't forget how to fix it) and hopefully he will be able to fix the problem in the service mode. I will endeavour to follow his progress and see what he changes, especially if it works. In any event, I will report back after his visit.

For anyone else who has this problem, call Sony, get the number of an authorized dealer in your area and mention this fax when you call them so that they can be on the right page when they come; simply inform them, if they haven't received this fax, that it is available from their Sony Tech Rep. The best news of all is that Sony is finally aware of this problem and is taking aggressive actions to fix it!

I have had my 34HDX82 for about three weeks now, I too have the lines and they are very apparent during hockey games. Don't seem to notice them on darker backgrounds. I just have a Directv reciever via Svideo, and an OTA. No HD tuner yet. Do not notice these lines at all while playing XBOX through HD1 inputs, could this be an only interlaced problem or do you have progressive scan viewing?

OK, now that a few of you guys have done all the legwork and forced Sony to NOT ONLY admit that a problem exists BUT have (hopefully) engineered a solution AND notified their nationwide service network, it shouldn't now be necessary for AVSForum members whose sets are exhibiting the 'white line' problem to negotiate the Sony Customer Service gauntlet to get their XBR800 units repaired. Somewhere there must be a reference number for the problem and/or the fix that has been issued by Sony to their service techs in the field. Possibly the first XBR800 owner who gets their set repaired could sneek a peek at the tech bulletin and let the rest of us know what the problem/tech bulletin/fax/reference number is. Then we could simply pass that reference number on to the Sony customer service rep who answers the phone and avoid all (most, some) of the hassles?

On the other hand, I have been waiting for a 'reconditioned' 36XBR800 to become available at a good price thru a 'friend-of-a-friend' who works at Sony. Guess what - there are none available! Maybe the 'white line' problem will force an unsuspecting XBR800 owner to return their set to Sony for a replacement, making one available for me (after the fix has been applied, of course :p

Thanks to everyone who got the ball rolling. We all appreciate your patience and tenacity :)

KC

Alright guys... so considering all this BULLS#*T!!... do I really want to go purchase that new 36/34xbr?? I'm rather scared of plopping down 2k for a proven defective hdtv that I am already nervous about (due to visual artifacting and other crap). I understand that if I get it they may "fix" it... but it just sucks to buy something that's already broken... Any encouraging words or alternative sets?? At this rate I'm almost considering the 36 300.... Thanks,

Matt

I have the 34XBR800 and I'm pretty happy with it. I've only seen the vertical bar a couple times and not for long. It seems we'll get a fix sooner than later. So far, the bar hasn't bothered me at all and I've been watching 1080i HDTV on this TV for about three weeks now both over component (initially) and now over DVI.

Schneidr80, what exactly do you mean by "proven defective"? other than this vertical line problem, which varies in frequency and severity, i'm not aware of any other wholesale problems with these sets. i'm not aware of other problems with "visual artifacting" either. check the TV out at a store and see for yourself, the picture on a properly functioning set is excellent with the right material. my 34XBR800 is coming today, HDTV tomorrow.

what are you referring to by "36 300", the 36FV300? i can tell you with certainty that the FV300 doesn't come close to an XBR or HS set in PQ and feature set. if you are going to step down a notch, try a Philips PT8320 set. i had a 32PT8320 which i returned because it was defective, but i think it may have been beat up in shipping across the country. the PQ was really fantastic though - much better than a FV300 set and as good as, maybe better than HS/XBR in some respects. i got fed up with mine because of problems i was having but if you buy from a local retailer you should have no problems.

it is defective because of this vertical line going across the screen!!! it might be worse on some sets than others but it still is broken. defective, broken, not working correctly what ever you what to call it. if your set does the same thing im sure you will be back here singing a different song. i hope you dont have this problem because your right this set is fabulous other than this line, if sony fixes this and im sure they will i would say this is the best direct view tv out there imoa. by the way most stores are not showing programing in1080i in store its most likely a dvd promo, so you would not see these lines on this tv.

i did see some HDNet programming on this set a couple times, but i don't know if it was 1080i or 720p. it was a Notre Dame football game. it looked good though, except colors were a little undersaturated, although the 34" panasonic next to it was way oversaturated. just a setting thing.

1. I'm not saying it isn't an amazing set. All I'm saying is that I have a hard time paying this much for a product with inherent problems. Any product that has a problem off the shelf is cause for concern, no matter the "frequency and severity" of that problem. The reason I'm so pissed off is that I'm totally in love with the XBR series, and I would hate to purchase one and then be disappointed. By artifacting I mean that I have viewed the 36 and 40 at Circuit City, Tweeter, ABT, and several local dealers, and all of the sets I have seen have had artifacting on HD signal and on the in-store dvd. It is not frequent or very noticeable, but around the lettering often times it is apparent. Currently I'm only searching for some reassurances on Sony quality.... etc..

2. I currently have a PS2 w/components. I am considering purchasing either A: PCI to DVI box for PS2 OR an XBOX with progressive output. Anyone have experience/opinions about these setups on HD?


Thanks,
Matt

i've seen artifacts but they seem to be more a function of signal quality than the set itself. usually when i see a bad picture on an XBR, HD or otherwise, it's on every other set in the store as well. that said, i usually don't like the PQ of Sonys that much, but i feel like the 34XBR800 is one of the better ones out there.

what's a PCI to DVI adapter? i don't know of any way at all to get a PS2 to output DVI. same for xbox, you'll have to use component out. nothing wrong with that though.

I just got a call from Sony 2 days ago and they also informed me that they have the fix! My service tech. is coming out a week from today to fix the problem. Now if only they can figure out the little Progressive glitch I've been seeing with my DVD player and XBOX. It's not a huge deal but does bother me.----- GS kid

The service technician is coming out to my house on Monday to look at this problem. I let him know that there is a Sony Service Bulletin out regarding the issue, so hopefully I'll have a good story to report soon.

I had comcast hook me up to HD cable around 6 weeks ago and so far I haven't seen this problem. Maybe it only effect some of the set and not others?

Ufanco: I'm assuming your Comcast box is a DCT-5100. If the output is set to 720p you won't see this problem. If it is set to 1080i you may see it, unless your set does not have this defect. I think you can get to the settings menu by pressing 'menu' when the power to the converter box is off.

Guess I shoulda added all that info in earler post. I am hooked up to a Scientific-Atlanta 3100hd cable box and have not seen this problem. For the members of this forum who are having this issue can you tell me if its something that happens all the time or on and off? Also did you notice the problem right away or after you have owned the tv for a while. Also would like to hear from other owners of the new xbr800 line if there having this problem or not (wondering how widespread this problem is ) Thanks in advance.

It happens all the time but its not always visible due to program content. To me its mostly visible in darker scenes and sometimes in flesh tones. To the best of my knowledge, its only visible when viewing 1080i signals on the component video or DVI inputs. I've had two 40XBR800's and its been visible in both. I noticed the problem within a couple of days of getting the first set. It took a couple of more days for me to decide it was in the TV - not something else in my system.

I talked to a helpful person at Sony today ("Darlene in Florida"), she asked a few questions then told me who to call locally to have it looked at. Unfortunately, they won't be here 'til Jan 2nd.

I've been a lurker here for awhile. I decided to register so I could thank you all for posting your experiences and working so diligently to get Sony to address this problem. I purchased a 34XBR800 a week ago, even after hearing of this issue, because I felt confident that after so many complaints, Sony would be compelled to issue a fix. I don't have an HD tuner and I haven't tried 1080i yet so I don't know if my set is affected. If I do experience the "vertical line syndrome", I'll have a wealth of information at my disposal, thanks to this forum.

Andy64, I live in your area, so I'll be interested hear who does your repair and how it goes. Thanks again.

got my 34XBR800 yesterday, HD-DTV today (scientific atlanta 3100HD). no lines yet, though i haven't watched it too closely yet. i'm not sure which stations are 1080i either... does anyone know what WNET13 (New York PBS) uses for their HD demo station? if that's 1080i, i think i'm definitely in the clear. it's about the clearest HD i've ever seen - my set looks really good, don't seem to have any focus or convergence problems. some minor geometry anomalies that i'm still in the process of tweaking out but otherwise looks fantastic. FYI, my set is very new, manufacture date November 2002, so perhaps it was corrected in the latest production units.

been watching plenty of HDTV on my 34XBR800, including 1080i (PBS, NBC) and no sign of vertical lines. perhaps sony has fixed the problem in newer production units, or i got lucky with my set. i'd be curious to poll what percentage of XBR owners here have the problem and when their sets were made.

this tv is awesome! best picture i've ever seen short of a high-end projector or maybe the Grand Wega II LCD, but that doesn't have as good blacks. ;)

My 34XBR800 was made in Oct. 2002. I have Time Warner cable with the 3100HD box. Haven't seen the described problem while watching prime-time programming on CBS. (Unfortunately CBS is the only network HD channel we get here in Minneapolis with Time Warner.)

I've been following this thread since it started. I'm using my 34XBR800 with a 3100HD (about two and a half months now) and have seen none of this symptom. Apparently it is a compatibility issue with certain STBs, but not (thankfully!) with the 3100HD.

Phil

Not true Phil, at least in my case. My Sony SATHD-200 worked fine with my initial 34XBR800 but my replacement set (replaced for other reasons) showed the defect immediately. It's something in the set that apparently can be fixed. Still waiting for my tech to come on the 31st but waiting even more anxiously for someone else whose tech comes sooner.

Its the horizontal deflection circuit getting coupled into the video signal. In the 1080i case they typically differ in frequency by about 1 cycle per second - hence the moving bar across the screen. For other types of inputs (480i, 480p, 720p) the frequency difference between the horizontal scan and the video sync is much larger (about 2.7kHz for 480i signals). In that case, the coupling is still there but its effect is essentially invisible.

I actually modified the video frequency of a Tektronix TSG-90 NTSC signal generator to check for the effect. With only the generator (and nothing else) connnected to the TV, the problem was still there. I even used quad shielded coax for the connection and ran the generator off of a power inverter so that it would be completely isolated from the TV's ac power source.

Based on comments on this thread, it may not be present in all XBR800 series sets. I've had two 40XBR800s with the problem. Sony claims to have a fix but no one's reported the results back to this thread yet.

You can add me to the list of owner's without the problem as well. I have a E86 stb. I have a concern that this problem may not surface until I am forced to move to a dvi capable stb (at which point my warranty may expire). It sure seems like most of the complaints come from users with the new generation of stbs and cable boxes. Does anyone have this problem with the older stbs? I don't know the build date of mine, but I've had it about 4-5 months.

A very professional and polite service technician came out to my house yesterday and determined (based on the Sony technical bulletin) that he needed to order a replacement board to resolve this problem.

Apparently, sets manufactured from October to December have a different input board that causes the problem. The problem is supposedly fixed in the most recently manufactured sets from December on.

My set was manufactured in September, and the service technician indicated that the bulletin inferred that sets made before October shouldn't have the problem at all, but I have proof sitting in my living room that at least some do. I'd have to assume that this means the manufacturing process was actually changed sometime in late September.

He said that once he had installed the replacement board, he'd have to do some service mode reprogramming for each input mode. He thought the whole process would take about 1 hour.

He estimated about two weeks to get the board from Sony, with the caveat that he couldn't guarantee the part actually exists yet.

does that mean i need a new board too... mine was made Nov 2002 :(
those dates don't seem right though. not only is your Sept. set bad as well, but lots of people here have seen this problem for a while now... i'm sure those sets were made even earlier. hmm. does it affect all boards, or only some of them? i guess if it was all boards then they would have to recall them.

must be a PCB layout problem or something?

The problem affects a single board that can be easily swapped out.

Originally posted by dorkus
does that mean i need a new board too... mine was made Nov 2002 :(

How do you determine when it was manufactured? I suspect by looking at the back somewhere, hard in my set up. But, maybe with a mirror and flashlight ....?

Mine was purchased on Oct 12, so it was likely manufactured in Sept or earlier.

Phil

yup the date is right by the serial number, on the right side (looking from the front) of the set. about the same vertical level as the top of the input jacks, maybe a little higher.

Originally posted by bocktar
The problem affects a single board that can be easily swapped out.

But in an earlier message you said the part may not actually exist. That would make swapping it not so easy :)

It would be nice to know the range of serial numbers affected, if indeed, early sets were OK and some later ones had the problem and newer ones do not.

Maybe you can coax that guy out of a copy of the service bulletin you mentioned.

Phil

FWIW:

The 40XBR800 I currently have is S/N 9008878 and was manufactured in October. The previous one was S/N 9003968 but I don't have the date of manufacture. Both have the problem.

Originally posted by Phil Wheeler
But in an earlier message you said the part may not actually exist. That would make swapping it not so easy :)

Indeed!

Maybe you can coax that guy out of a copy of the service bulletin you mentioned.

I probably won't see him again until he comes to fix the problem, but when he calls back with a better time estimate I'll ask him for the bulletin number.

Bocktar, I had someone read me the bulletin from Sony and it calls for a fix (at least an attempt) using the service mode and then, if that fails, to make a fix on the board or wait until new boards are available (currently no ETA). Did the tech even try to fix it using the service mode? From what I was told there is a whole page of the memo dedicated to a step-by-step service mode fix. I'm eagerly awaiting a visit next Tuesday. Mine too was manufactured in October. The only difference, from what I've heard between those manufactured earlier rather than later, is that those manufactured Oct. and earlier (or perhaps prior to Oct.) have the parts required for the fix (if necessary) on the board already. If the parts are not there, they will have to be ordered. Take heart though, there apparently is a fix!!!!

He did not attempt a service mode fix. He believed that the new board would be required before making the service mode changes.

I'll make sure to mention this when I hear from him again.

If you want to see the problem, you need a 1080i black screen and high brightness and picture settings. You can see it sometimes without a black 1080i screen but it's a lot easier with the black screen. I get a black screen by tuning my Samsung SIR-T165 STB to some digital channel, then I disconnect the antenna and it goes black with a little rectangle moving about that says "no signal." With this black screen, I then go into the menu and increase brightness/picture until I see the bar.

I've noticed that the bar only shows up when brightness and picture are too high.

BTW, I have a 34XBR800.

The service technician called Monday and said he had to order a "part" from Sony headquarters before he could execute the "fix." No indication when the "part" would arrive. Has anyone been successful in getting their vertical bar problem corrected yet?

Well the tech. came and fixed the verticle bar problem. The fix has the tech go into the service menu. Then you send a signal into an input. He then is to change a value. If the screen goes black on the input, then your set doesn't have the components needed inside and a new board will have to be ordered. If the screen stays on after the value change, it can be fixed with a list of service menu tweaks that sony provided. It was a big flowchart of things to be tweaked. The tweaks were first done with my DVI port, then they all have to be done on component input 5 as well. They also have to be tweaked while in a couple different picture modes (Vivid, Standard, etc).
So far I have not seen the verticle bar. Good fix!----- GS kid

Congrats GSKid, I was hoping the service menu fix would work. Hopefully I'll have similar news after my tech's visit on Tuesday afternoon. My luck, I won't have the components necessary for the service menu fix and a board will have to be ordered. When was your set manufactured? About how long did the fix take? I hope my tech is up to snuff; I am already a bit concerned, because when he called to confirm the visit I verified that he would be bringing the bulletin as it had extensive, step-by-step instructions on it; he replied that there was no bulletin; I said, yes there is and that I had spoken to such and such a person in his dept; oh, he said, yeah, I see it, thanks. So I'm dubious already, but hopefully as long as he has the bulletin with him and is fairly competent we can work it out. Congrats again and keep your fingers crossed for me and the rest of us -- gee, what will we all have to complain about once all our sets are fixed?

I have the problem on my KV36-XBR800. I just called to schedule a service appointment, but am using the local dealer tech. Does anyone have a service bulletin number or reference yet? It would be a great help to the rest of us with this problem.

Set Fixed!!!! Okay, my procedure was a bit easier than GSKid's as the tech only had to change one value in the service mode to get rid of the line/impulse. After going into service mode he scrolled through to the code: HDPT (it's very early on in the scrolling process). At the top of the screen are the numbers 4 and 1 in their own little boxes. He changed the 1 to a 0 and then saved (WRITE was the term he used; I didn't see which button he pushed to do any of these so if you want to venture into the service mode make sure you know what you are doing). After making this change we checked and the line was gone on all modes (I triple checked). The service bulletin would have had him do further changes on each mode, I'm supposing, only if the initial change didn't fix the problem. I asked him whether he thought we should do the changes anyway and he said that if it wasn't broken, don't fix it and I guess I kind of agree with that, although I'm really nervous that he was supposed to have done other things but he assured me that the bulletin offered these other changes only if the initial fix didn't work. So, there it is, it's fixable and apparently for some sets, really easy to fix. By the way, my set was manufactured in October 2002. Good luck to the rest of you; I hope the new year finds you free of the dreaded line and many days and nights of enjoyable HD viewing -- Say, does anyone know if the Super Bowl is in HD this year?.

well this setting is in the OP category and its number 4 (hdpt) i tryed this on mine and im going to give it a couple of hours but so far no line anymore. there are only 2 settings for this 1,0 so its not like you can really screw things up and can always put it back to 1. i have the service manual and its on page 122, its the last setting category in service mode.

So are you saying this is an easy fix that I could do myself? I would like to have a Sony person do it, but if it is that easy I would rather not take time off of work to wait for someone to show up.

How do you get in the service mode? Gashog301 can you give simple step by step instructions on how you did it?

Does this problem effect the 40xbr700 model?

so far i have only noticed people having this problem on the XBR800 series.

there is a "write" function in service mode? is this why my settings never seem to stay in place? :p

max99 look up the rest of the thread and some other XBR800 threads on how to use the service mode, it's a little tricky but once you understand how it works it's simple enough. to enter service mode, start with the TV off, and on the remote in quick sequence press "Display" - "5" - "Vol +" - "Power"

Originally posted by dorkus
so far i have only noticed people having this problem on the XBR800 series.

there is a "write" function in service mode? is this why my settings never seem to stay in place? :p

max99 look up the rest of the thread and some other XBR800 threads on how to use the service mode, it's a little tricky but once you understand how it works it's simple enough. to enter service mode, start with the TV off, and on the remote in quick sequence press "Display" - "5" - "Vol +" - "Power"

To save changes the key sequence is Muting - Enter.

Phil

let me give this fix a day of watching to see if it worked i will know tonight when it gets dark because that when i see it the most. ill post my results in the morning.

Originally posted by gashog301
well this setting is in the OP category and its number 4 (hdpt) i tryed this on mine and im going to give it a couple of hours but so far no line anymore. there are only 2 settings for this 1,0 so its not like you can really screw things up and can always put it back to 1. i have the service manual and its on page 122, its the last setting category in service mode.

gashog301,

Is there any chance that you would be willing to share the manual with your 34XBR800 colleagues. PDF...

no scanner

Lots of good information today!

Here's what I've been able to deduce.

I changed HDPT from 1 to zero on my 40XBR800 and, sure enough, the crawling vertical bar went away. I also noticed a slight shift in brightness and color (near the black level).

So I dragged out the test gear again to see if I could find out what was really going on. For those that are interested in the technical details, briefly, here's what I think is happening:

With HDPT set to "1", the set's horizontal scan rate is fixed at 33.716 kHz. The horizontal signal rate of a 1080i is normally about 1 Hz different than that - resulting the in vertical bar scanning across the screen about once per second when the set's horizontal deflection signal interferes with the incoming 1080i video.

When HDPT is set to "0", the tv locks its frequency to that of the incoming 1080i signal. Since they are locked in frequency there is no moving bar. Also, it appears as though the horizontal flyback pulse in the tv is in phase with the sync pulses of the incoming video. That means that the bar is not only stationary, it also occurs during horizontal blanking. So the stationary bar is not visible. FWIW, my guess is that HDPT stands for something like High Definition Phase Tracking.

The down side of this fix is that there will be a slight shift in brightness and/or colorimetry. This is because the dc restorer circuit in the set also occurs during horizontal blanking and now responds to a combination of the incoming video and the interferring deflection signal. At least in my case, this doesn't seem to be a big problem although I'd like to "tweak it out". Keep in mind that this same shift occurs about once per second when HDPT is set to "1" - which causes a slight flicker as the bar dissappears on the left side of the screen.

Seems like a pretty good "fix" to me - even though the fundamental problem (horizontal deflection signals in the set interferring with the incoming video) is still there, its not visible.

Thanks, petesimic, for catching the details of the fix!

emulator, the manual consists of two rather thick books (about 350 pages total) plus many pages of schematics. Also, although it lists all the sevice menu items, it doesn't describe most of their functions so, without a decoder ring, its pretty hard to make sense out of it.

yup it worked for me to i have to put avia in and check it out, its a hell of alot better. thanks for all the info on this hdpt fix!!!!

As a newcomer to this thread, I was excited to see a possible fix. Alas, the HDPT service menu adjustment did not fix the problem in my 34XBR. My set (Dec 2002) must be one of the ones that require a change to the hardware. I'll post back with the results after I attempt to contact service in the next coupe days.

Does anyone have a title or number to reference the service bulletin so that I might short circuit the "we've never heard of that before" syndrome?

Thanks!
Jim

Jwdanie, just try to speak with a level-two tech at Sony; try to bypass the first line of "defense"; if you run into trouble, ask to speak with Lin; she was a tremendous help to me and should recognize the problem once you describe it. Also, don't automatically assume that just because the HDPT didn't fix the problem that further work in the service menu won't. As I stated, there was a whole flow chart of changes in all modes if the initial service mode fix didn't work. Of course I was not able to see the complete chart and even if I had I'd never be able to remember all the data, but call Sony, report the problem, get the number of a local rep in your area and set up a visit. When you make contact with the authorized Sony repair center in your area, make sure you mention that their Sony tech rep (they all have one) should have a bulletin on this problem containing a few service menu fixes and failing that, hardware fixes. This should set you up. Sorry the easy fix didn't work for you, but hang in there; Sony has two years to fix the problem (took about a month and a half for me) and once they do, and they will, you'll enjoy your set for years to come.

Originally posted by petesimac
Set Fixed!!!! Okay, my procedure was a bit easier than GSKid's as the tech only had to change one value in the service mode to get rid of the line/impulse. After going into service mode he scrolled through to the code: HDPT (it's very early on in the scrolling process). At the top of the screen are the numbers 4 and 1 in their own little boxes. He changed the 1 to a 0 and then saved (WRITE was the term he used; I didn't see which button he pushed to do any of these so if you want to venture into the service mode make sure you know what you are doing). After making this change we checked and the line was gone on all modes (I triple checked). The service bulletin would have had him do further changes on each mode, I'm supposing, only if the initial change didn't fix the problem. I asked him whether he thought we should do the changes anyway and he said that if it wasn't broken, don't fix it and I guess I kind of agree with that, although I'm really nervous that he was supposed to have done other things but he assured me that the bulletin offered these other changes only if the initial fix didn't work. So, there it is, it's fixable and apparently for some sets, really easy to fix. By the way, my set was manufactured in October 2002. Good luck to the rest of you; I hope the new year finds you free of the dreaded line and many days and nights of enjoyable HD viewing -- Say, does anyone know if the Super Bowl is in HD this year?.

Thank you so much for the great info! I went into the service menu on my set and changed the setting and it worked for me too!!

Garry

Worked for me too - thanks all.

Great gladness and rejoicing reigns at the Eurastus household. I too applied the HDPT fix. Worked like a charm. I also noticed the brightness and contrast shift mentioned above. A few minutes with the old Avia disk cleaned that right up.

I couldn't be happier...

Isn't this issue, it's detection and fix, a perfect example of what's good about the Internet??

FYI i have the service manual for all XBR800/HS500 models in PDF format... i bought it off this neat service manual site for $9. it's 25MB but the actual service part of it is only 24 pages or so, the rest is all charts and diagrams etc.

The HDPT fix worked on my September 2002 set as well.

glad to here everyone having success with this fix. its very sad when you get better customer service from the web than the company you bought the product from!

dorkus,

Where's this site?

ottodog, for the life of me i can't remember the URL of the site! it's not in my paypal receipts either. i'll get it for you in a little bit.

FYI i found this site thru an ebay auction, you can often find service manuals there for not too much $$$.

the service manual site is http://www.manuals.d2g.com

dorkus,
How valuble is the service manual? Does it contain useful information for owners who like to tweak the set thru the service menu? Or is it a lot of technical mumbo-jumbo that we might not understand?

hmm, hard to say. only the first 24 pages are of much use to us, and i actually only use a couple of those. the other few hundred pages are charts, diagrams, etc. the one page i do find very useful is the listing of the geometry adjustments, and their effect on the actual geometry of the set. i could just take a screenshot of that for you guys though - someone else did that at one point but it was a little fuzzy. does anyone know how to extract certain pages from a PDF document and still keep it a PDF? i don't have Adobe Acrobat (the commercial product). if i could figure out how to do it, i could probably just pull the relevant pages out for you guys.

Originally posted by dorkus
Does anyone know how to extract certain pages from a PDF document and still keep it a PDF? i don't have Adobe Acrobat (the commercial product).Unfortunately, you need the commercial version to do any creating/editing/etc.

Originally posted by dorkus
the one page i do find very useful is the listing of the geometry adjustments, and their effect on the actual geometry of the set. i could just take a screenshot of that for you guys though - someone else did that at one point but it was a little fuzzy.

There is a pretty good image of that in a message in the KV-34XBR800 Service Menu thread; at least it has been good enough for my needs. It is near the bottom of this page:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=203016

Phil

Reading this thread I was also able to fix my 36hs500 that had the vertical bar going across the screen.The bars have dissapeared as i have been watching 1081i tonite.Changing the 1 to a 0 on the hdpt setting worked.Seems like a great fix for this problem.I live in canada and when I phoned sony about this a tech did come out and I have not heard from him since.Thanks alot for the info !

Well the tech cam eout today and fixed up my TV. He had all the info on his laptop (tech bulletin, flow chart and service manuals,) which I asked if I could have to pass along. No go, sorry I tried! Anyway what he did in a nutshell is go into the service menu and make some changes and all is good. Now I wish Sony would address and fix the damn HD-200 audio dropouts. Just a FYI so you guys can relax a little.

Originally posted by Phil Wheeler
There is a pretty good image of that in a message in the KV-34XBR800 Service Menu thread; at least it has been good enough for my needs. It is near the bottom of this page:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=203016

Phil

What post # was it??????

Harley

Originally posted by HuskerHarley
What post # was it??????I think the link is to the wrong thread.

Try this (about post #20/#21)
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=169694

Direct Link:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?s=&postid=1345329&fullpage=1

Originally posted by dt_dc
I think the link is to the wrong thread.

Try this (about post #20/#21)
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=169694

Direct Link:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?s=&postid=1345329&fullpage=1

Thank-You

Harley

Sigh!!!! After arriving home from the office I went straight to the TV to see what the tech did in fact fix the issue and to my dissappointment he did not fix the issue! He said he had the tech bulletin, which I saw on his laptop! I guess I will make another call and give it another shot or do the fix myself. I'm just concerned if I go into the service menu I may screw the TV up beyond repair. What I have read it sounds simple, would you recommend another call or attempt to fix the issue youreslf?


TIA

I too was afraid I would screw something up - but decided to give it a try and it was easy. Here is what I did: I turned on a 1080i program. Then I turned off the TV and turned it on getting into the service menu (Display - 5 - vol+ - power). I hit 4 until I saw the HDPT in the upper left then changed the 1 to a 0 by either hitting 3 or 6 - I can't remember which but there are only 2 options (1 and 0) so you can't screw it up. I then saved it (mute - enter) and turned off the TV to get out of the service mode. Turned the TV on and it was fixed.

There was a slight change in brightness, but I re-ran AVIA and it looks good.

Does that sound like what everyone else did?

Originally posted by Govnah
I'm just concerned if I go into the service menu I may screw the TV up beyond repair. What I have read it sounds simple, would you recommend another call or attempt to fix the issue youreslf?


Give it a try. There is a command to reset to the defaults, so the risk is small.

There is a zipped Excel spreadsheet here with all the menu items listed as well as how to get into the service mode and how to save what you change, etc.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=1453839#post1453839

The file is 34xbr800_service_mode.zip

Phil

Yes it was painless! Thanks for the file!!!

Fixed mine too! I did not really notice the change in brightness - maybe I will buy an Avia disc anyway.. someday.

This is to Phil or anyone else whose set has never demonstrated the white line phenomenon: if you arent' concerned about getting into the service menu, what is your HDPT set to. I'm just curious if your's is set to 0 as well or if the 1 setting is fine for your set. As I said, I'm just curious to see if the sets we have were mistakenly set for 1 or if that is the "usual" setting.

Damn, after going into the service menu and changing the value, I still have the damn line. FYI my set was manufactured in Nov 2002. Guess I will make another tech call!!!!

Did you save it after making the change?

I think so, it said write in top right corner and I pressed enter. I will try it again tonight.

Well I double checked and the value is set to "0" w/ no change I still have the scrolling line. What would happen if I set it back to defaults to undo what the tech did Friday and then make the change. Are the defaults just like when I received the TV?

TIA

You have to hit [MUTE] followed by [ENTER] to save.

Thats exactly what I did, hit "mute" write appears in right corner and then "enter." Maybe I need the new part even though my TV was manufactured in Nov 2002.

Originally posted by petesimac
This is to Phil or anyone else whose set has never demonstrated the white line phenomenon: if you arent' concerned about getting into the service menu, what is your HDPT set to. I'm just curious if your's is set to 0 as well or if the 1 setting is fine for your set. As I said, I'm just curious to see if the sets we have were mistakenly set for 1 or if that is the "usual" setting.

I looked last week and it is set to the default value, which ever that is. I have not tried changing it, since I practice an "if it works don't fix it" philosophy :)

My STB is a 3100HD used with Time-Warner cable. I believe all reports have indicated no problem with this combination. Since I have no plans to use satellite or OTA, I shuld be OK until TW "upgrades" their STBs. I've been watching this thread with interest, because such a change could give me this problem.

Phil

phil, do you know if TWC is planning a HD box upgrade this year at some point? was hoping to get something w/DVI...

Originally posted by dorkus
phil, do you know if TWC is planning a HD box upgrade this year at some point? was hoping to get something w/DVI...

I have no information. Personally, I'd rather see TW expand their number of HDTV channels. There seems to be some disagreement whether DVI will really result in any noticable improvement in picture quality. Plus I'm real happy with how this box works.

I do wish TWC had some of the channels not not available (e.g., HD-Net and Discovery HD), and hope that ESPN-HD will be carried when it is available.

Phil

Phil, I think you're lucky out there in L.A. Here in Minneapolis, the only local HD station we get over cable is CBS. No NBC or ABC. I actually brought the HD box back because just getting CBS wasn't worth it. Everybody Loves Raymond doesn't become any funnier in Hi-Definition. Now I'm just using the PVR (Personal Video Recorder) box from Time-Warner. The recording ability is better than a single HD channel, IMO.

As far as a cable box with DVI, Scientific Atlanta has announced one (http://www.scientificatlanta.com/news/02Dec03-1.htm), but we'll have to see if Time Warner picks it up. For me, the ultimate would be an HD box that also has the PVR capability.

yeah perhaps DVI is not such a big deal. i too am waiting for some more HD stations... both Discovery and ESPN would be awesome as you say. i guess i'm happy to just have the major networks + fox in HD now, since i wasn't really expecting much from the service at the moment... most of the stuff is still slightly zoomed 4:3 anyway but it makes the occassional true HD broadcast that much sweeter. ABC has been particularly good about showing plenty of HD movies, i saw Mrs. Doubtfire a while ago and Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory last night and they looked fabulous. Alias also looked exceptional - it really looks like crap on standard DTV, all that compression is not kind to those dark scenes. i saw ads for Monsters Inc. coming up - looked better than my DVD! i just hope Fox uses all-HD cameras for the superbowl, so far it looks like they've been upsampling standard NTSC cameras for many of the shots, bleh.

Originally posted by DJ_V
Phil, I think you're lucky out there in L.A. Here in Minneapolis, the only local HD station we get over cable is CBS. No NBC or ABC. I actually brought the HD box back because just getting CBS wasn't worth it. Everybody Loves Raymond doesn't become any funnier in Hi-Definition. Now I'm just using the PVR (Personal Video Recorder) box from Time-Warner. The recording ability is better than a single HD channel, IMO.


Yes, we do have pretty good support from TWC here in LA (really in Torrance, a suburb) If I lived 800 ft farther west, I would be in a city that has Adelphia and likely not be so satified! It surprises me that it is so different in Minneapolis.

I bought into a digital package in late 2001, including RoadRunner, and lots of premium channels. So I have CBS, NBC, ABC, FOX, PBS, HBO and Showtime HD channels. HBO is really good, since almost all their movies are done in HD. Showtime has not so many.

I think TWC may be preparing to add HD channels. They recenty renumbered their HD channels, which adds slots for other broadcast channels (e.g., the local WB which is not now available).

TWC is "unpackaging" their billing here, so I expect my next bill to be substantially higher than it has been. Then I plan to unsubscribe from all premium channels which are not HD (i.e., I will keep HBO and Showtime but dump CMAX, TMC, Starz). I will re-subscribe to the latter, or any new offerings, only when they start having HD content. There is plenty to watch on the non-premium digital channels (which we watch more than we watch premium).

I'm not certain TWC offers a PVR here, but I will look over the list of options I received a few weeks ago. They do have Video on Demand (VOD), but I'm not that interested in paying for that. I'm retired and that gives me less need to timeshift (and I mostly watch DVDs, anyway)

Phil

fox does not have the superbowl abc does

Dorkus,

Fox is EDTV at 480p not HDTV and they have no plans to go to HDTV.

ack, bleh, ok thanks for the info anyone b united... i should probably move this discussion to the HDTV area but i'll keep blabbering here cuz i'm lazy. :p if it's 480p though, shouldn't it look pretty decent then? is it being poorly converted to 1080i or something? to me it really looks like cropped standard NTSC, at least on the wideangle shots. maybe they're using a ton of compression or something, but i really suspect it's just those cameras that are still standard def, as the pregame shows look great.

dorkus, you don't have to worry about the Superbowl this year because its on ABC in HD, not Fox like last year!

Dorkus,
You want to really see the difference. Watch the playoff this weekend when CBS shoots and broadcast them in HDTV and Faux(Fox) goes along with their 480p. 480p look better than 480i when movement is involved.

Bought the 40XBR800 one week ago and just this evening
watched my first evening of television and noticed the vertical
bars. Didn't think much of it, then got bored and stumbled upon
this website and this thread and read from start to finish with
much anticipation. Will try the fix tomorrow on my Nov 2002
set.

Thanks for all the great info. I have lots of questions but will
find the appropriate place and ask there...

-pilotdude

Welcome to the best AVS site on the internet, Dude!

Technician arrived today and applied the service menu "fix" that has been described earlier. All is now well with our XBR 40. According to the technician, Andy's diagnosis of the vertical bar problem was correct!

Govnah - I just purchased a KV-36HS500 and SAT-HD200, tried the HDPT fix and it didn't work either. The TV was made Nov 2002 as well. I made a call to Sony yesterday and they (just as I have read here) are stating this problem is a new one. I've mentioned pieces of this thread and it seemed to help escalate the issue to higher levels. (Thanks everyone.) The original tech kept focus on the HD200 which is worrisome. They said I'd get a call today and will keep you posted.

I NEED ADVICE

Sony returned my call and said to call the In-Home service Team. I did and the next available appointment is Feb 4 - that's 3 Weeks out. They also said if the tech cannot fix in-house he'd take the TV for 3-5 business days for service at their service center.
I just bought this TV last Thursday from Good Guys and got a great deal on the Service Plan. Should I wait for the Sony service tech or call Good Guys and ask for a new TV - one that was made in December, perhaps??

cpinckney, the tech should be able to fix in-home so i wouldn't worry about it. how is the tv otherwise - convergence, focus at the corners, color fidelity, brightness? if you feel it's a good set (all TVs vary from set to set) then i would just hold onto it and wait for service; you may end up exchanging it for another set which may or may not have the vertical line problem and may not be as good in other respects, or if your luck is really bad might even be a lemon.

I have noticed on the bottom left hand corner that when ever I have white text that it is actually yellow instead of white. Has anyone else had similar issues with a yellow type spot lower left corner?

Govnah, sound like magnetic interference to me. i have a green tint that comes and goes in the top left of my screen, but it's happened with two different TVs. must be something in my apartment...

Thanks dorkus. The TV is great besides the vertical line. We'll watch TiVo for regular programming (or recorded) and force 720p when watching any HD from the SAT-HD200.

sounds good cpinckney, make sure to still bug Sony for that fix though! ;)

Govnah-

I have the same problem on my 40XBR800 with text, actually on both sides of the screen on the edge. See recent thread on the subject. No solution for me yet...

This thread's been great. Thanks to all the forumers (new word). I was just wondering, has there been any bar, yellow text, fuzzy text problems with the 36XBR800? Mine's delivered Friday. Comments about the set would be appreciated.:D

Beckster13,

You guys have really got me looking hard for fuzzy text, HDTV lines, and ANY anomolies or screen abnormalities. My 40XBR is about 3 weeks old and I've yet to find anything weird...just great PQ! Perhaps I should kiss my lucky stars, but this has been the best TV I've ever owned.

The text problem you described might have to do w/some sort of magnetic field interference in the immediate area of the TV...even inside the wall. I'm certainly no expert, but I would be on the phone to CC or Sony in a heartbeat if I were to experience anything similar on my 40XBR. Tell them to fix it or replace it...period.

yeah, strangest thing, when i had my 34XBR800 temporarily on the floor, when i pushed it a few inches back half the screen turned yellow. when i pulled it back it disappeared. there was nothing magnetic nearby - just bookshelves, a couple computers, a wood dining table, a sofa... i figured it was a steel beam in the floor of my apartment or something. right now on the tv stand i still have that green discoloration fading in and out occassionaly in the top left corner. i really have no clue....

Originally posted by dorkus
yeah, strangest thing, when i had my 34XBR800 temporarily on the floor, when i pushed it a few inches back half the screen turned yellow. when i pulled it back it disappeared. there was nothing magnetic nearby - just bookshelves, a couple computers, a wood dining table, a sofa... i figured it was a steel beam in the floor of my apartment or something. right now on the tv stand i still have that green discoloration fading in and out occassionaly in the top left corner. i really have no clue....

Is it possible that it could be EARTH and it's Magnetic pull:D

Harley

cajieboy-

You're right. For the money I paid, I expect (near) perfection. If I can see something with my own eyes, it should be fixed. First, I'm going to try Avia. If that doesn't fix it, I will call Sony.

Yes, you are very lucky you have no problems, even slight ones, which is what I consider mine to be. Great TV, isn't it?

if you didn't build the home yourself its hard to tell whats in the wall. Ive been around home building and remodeling and i tell you some people do some things that made me scratch my head.

Originally posted by HuskerHarley
Is it possible that it could be EARTH and it's Magnetic pull:DThe service manual actually suggests aligning the picture tube in an East-West orientation while performing service for best results ... man, these big tubes are touchy. ;)

Originally posted by dorkus
right now on the tv stand i still have that green discoloration fading in and out occassionaly in the top left corner. i really have no clue....

When you say "fading in and out ocassionally" do you mean you can sit and watch it coming and going?

I have a very mild discoloration on the right side and in the upper left hand corner that is visible only on a pure white screen. It comes and goes in the sense that maybe 80% of the times I turn on it is not there and stays gone while the set is on. Maybe 20% of the times I turn it on, the discoloration is there and stays until I turn it off.

My suspicion is that the degaussing circuitry does not get it quite right every time, and I'm wondering if you are seeing the same. I'd have a service guy out to check the degausser, but Murphy's law is that it would be the the 80% state that day! Besides, the effect at its worst is not noticable on normal color progamming.

BTW -- when you moved it to the floor, how long was it off before you turned it on while on the floor in the "yellow" postition? If less than 10 min, it likely did not degauss for the new magnetic environment.

Phil

Beckster13,

If I were you, I would not be waiting for the Avia disk to correct this problem. I would call CC or Sony or Both immediately and get those guys to make a service call. Where did you buy your 40XBR?

This problem deserves a Sony Service Tech to check it out and fix the problem. The problem does sound more like a "magnetic" thing, and Phil could be dead on target in regards to the degaussing. Whatever it is, you should have the Sony Tech guy fix it pronto, and this is what warranties are for. While you're at it, have the tech check for the white line thing too.

Is it possible that it could be EARTH and it's Magnetic pull

hmm, good point... i've never seen this phenomenon before until i moved to my NYC apartment so maybe it's my location. even on my old panasonic 27" though the left side of my screen (much more than w/the 34XBR800) would just randomly turn green or purple in the middle of the movie or video game. it was visible whenever certain colors or pure white was on the screen.

The service manual actually suggests aligning the picture tube in an East-West orientation while performing service for best results.

man, you have got to be kidding me... does that mean from left to right is east-west, or back to front? my tube is roughly facing east right now... :rolleyes:

When you say "fading in and out ocassionally" do you mean you can sit and watch it coming and going?

yes, just before my very eyes. while watching the corner will suddenly turn green, stay that way for maybe a minute or two, then slowly fade back to normal. much less bothersome than on my old set, but it still happens. doesn't seem to be much dependent on when the set was turned on or off.

when you moved it to the floor, how long was it off before you turned it on while on the floor in the "yellow" postition?

yes, in fact i was moving the set while it was on, and observed the color change in action. i tried cycling the power a few times but didn't seem to help much. i probably had to leave it there longer, but i was afraid the field might damage the set permanently. i guess it was a floor beam or something, dunno. it really was a matter of just a few inches.

Originally posted by dorkus
yes, just before my very eyes. while watching the corner will suddenly turn green, stay that way for maybe a minute or two, then slowly fade back to normal. much less bothersome than on my old set, but it still happens. doesn't seem to be much dependent on when the set was turned on or off.

yes, in fact i was moving the set while it was on, and observed the color change in action. i tried cycling the power a few times but didn't seem to help much. i probably had to leave it there longer, but i was afraid the field might damage the set permanently. i guess it was a floor beam or something, dunno. it really was a matter of just a few inches.

Good question re E-W. My screen is facing South.

Since yours is varying as you watch it, that is not what I am observing. Makes me wonder if there is some moving mass of metal (e.g., elevator) nearby or some magnetic device that is turning on and off (e.g., refrigerator). I have no idea how close something must be to have an effect.

If you move the set without then degaussing, you can expect the purity to be affected. One poster with a 36XBR800 (I think) had it working fine and then installed it into a niche near or above a fireplace and turned it on: Lots of discoloration. But he then left it off for 10 minutes or so and when turned back on the problem was solved. Apparently these sets are very affected by local and the Earth's magnetic fields -- and the ambient earth field is shaped by any nearby ferromagnetic material.

Phil

We just had a PERFECT LIFTOFF at the Cape!!!! Yippppeeee!

Originally posted by cajieboy
We just had a PERFECT LIFTOFF at the Cape!!!! Yippppeeee!

Good grief! I thought this thread had been wandering off topic (vs. its title) but the last message has been a "liftoff" to new heights of OT :)

Phil

My 34XBR800 has the vertical bar. I emailed this thread to the service tech at Myer-Emco (probably the leading A/V store in DC), who said that Sony is well aware of the problem AND IS REPLACING THE DVI TUNERS (or whatever you call them). He also said that he had done one the fixes on Saturday, but that the replacement part was also defective.

He didn't seem to put much stock in gashog's fix through the service menu. I don't know why.

the problem has nothing to do with the DVI port, it happens on component input as well. i'm not sure the guy you talked to is fully aware of what's going on.

i got the fix from someone else in this thread, dont want to take someone credit. well i dont care how much stock he has in it, the fix worked for me. i have learned one thing from dealing with sony and service shops ITS HARD GETTING A STRAIT ANSWER! imoa i think sony tells there service reps and support people to be hush hush about problems they are having. thank god for this forum or i would still be watching that bar go across my screen and i might have thrown something at the tv by now. because theres nothing worse to me than a broken tv that i paid $2300 for!

cajieboy-

Again, you are probably right. I will call Sony soon to have someone look at my 40XBR800. As for the cause, I have no idea what is in the walls behind my TV. However, I think it is actually something with the TV though, since the slight blur/discoloration appears quite evenly on the left and right sides of the screen; probably extends about 5-6 inches from the sides.

I bought my TV on-line at www.soundseller.com, so I would guess my only option is to call Sony for a service rep visit.

Here's a silly (newbie?) question about the vertical bars this thread is about. I don't have any HDTV input on my TV yet. If I were to have a service call, could he test to see if my TV has the vertical bar problem since I don't have any HDTV programming yet? Might as well take care of both problems at once.

The fix works great, thank you!

Took me awhile to get around to it, the "problem" I could only see why viewing a dark screen in between channel changes.


Tom

check out this thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=217048)

Service manual anyone?

My 40XBR800 was manufactured in November.
I have not decided on which STB to purchase yet
however I have a convergence issue( bowing down of the
right horizontal cross hatch line using AVIA, test patterns,
widescreen enhanced.Color is bleeding into the picture
about an inch in on the right,both top and bottom.)
I purchased this set thru Audio King (Ultimate Electronics)
in MLPS.
It seems to make sense to me to perform the "FIX" at that
visit but will they be able to confirm or will I need to wait
until I purchase my STB to observe if I have a problem?

Is there a fix for the KV 34XBR2. My set has had this problem since I purchased it in the beginning of 2002.Good guys replaced the Sony HD100 3 times and the TV twice to no avail?

ghostdog4

You mentioned that your 40XBR was mfg. in November. Who do you know the date? I'd like to find out the mfg. on my Sony. Thanks.

Originally posted by cajieboy
You mentioned that your 40XBR was mfg. in November. Who do you know the date? I'd like to find out the mfg. on my Sony. Thanks. Look on the back of your TV ... all kinds of good info there. Take a look at where your set was manufactured too ...

Thanks dt_dc, this beast is quite heavy, so I'll have to wait until a strong armed volunteer comes over to give me a hand at pulling the TV out of the corner! So far, no problems w/the 40XBR, just beautiful PQ. Yesterday evening I got a BIG positive reminder of just why I plunked down my bucks on this tube....High Definition Super Bowl!!!!!!!! WOW!!!

Hello. I'm grateful for the information on this thread. This problem was driving me crazy. I have a 34XBR800 manufactured in November. I've set my Comcast Motorola 5100 and Zenith HDV420 STB to 720P as a work-around until my set is fixed or replaced.

I got a brief look at the Sony service bulletin. The event ID is E18728143. This may help you when contacting Sony's service department.

The service menu changes did not fix the problem. The tech who came to the house and the Sony tech he spoke to on the telephone did not seem confident that the replacement board would fix the problem. Instead of taking that chance, I'm trying to get a replacement set manufactured in January.

>The service menu changes did not fix the problem. The tech who came to the house and the Sony tech he spoke to on the telephone did not seem confident that the replacement board would fix the problem.

I had the same issue - the service menu fix did not help at all. The local repair guy was out last Friday and replaced the board and applied numerous service menu adjustments in addition to the HDPT item. The set is now flawless.

I just got a HD receiver this week (Hughes E86) so I just discovered that my 40XBR800 had this problem. Add me to the list of people who were able to simply fix it with the service menu setting. I did also notice the brightness shift. I'll go check it with Avia, but I'm not sure that will help me as this could be something that only affects the brightness when it's in 1080i. Not sure.

Thanks gang!

Chris

Well - The Sony guy who took three weeks to show up spent all of 5 minutes looking at my KV-36hs500. I told him I had information from this forum but he wasn't hearing any of it. Instead he said he needed to order a new board and it would take three more weeks to get.
So the positive note is the Sony guy seemed to know what was wrong.
The bad note is the six weeks it will take to (hopefully) fix.

Guys I'm at my wits end! I have a Sony 40"XBR800 with the dreaded verticle white bar scrolling from right to left. I have called Sony and they dispatched a tech out four times, which he was unable to fix. He did the software fix and replaced the B board with no success. He has reported back to Sony that the TV is back to factory Specs, NOT!!!! He is the only Sony authorized tech locally to me. Sony will not do anything more because according to the tech it is fix and it is not. I can not send the TV back because the place I purchased the TV has a no return policy. I have been dealing with this issue for four months. I am so upset at this point I do not know what else I can do. I still have the verticel scrolling bar and no where to turn. Does anybody here have a contatct or possibly a tech that they know that has addressed the issue that I could get in contatct with. Any help I would gladly asppreciate. Between the Sony TV and the HD-200 is going to be the death of me!!!


TIA

Just curious if the "B" board is the same as the DVI tuner?


TIA

Does anybody know the affected serial number range on the 34XBR800? I'm trying to exchange my November 2002 set for a unit with the fix. Supposedly, Sony corrected this problem sometime in December.

I got through to a level 2 support tech at Sony today but he could not tell me when a set was manufactured based on the serial number. Nor could he tell me the serial number range for this bug. Nor could he give me the date when this was fixed in the manufacturing process.

YoungWeb, apparently Sony has not yet fixed the problem in production -- there may be a lag time between the discovery of a problem and the implementation of a fix; large production process. I know of a set made as recently as January and it also has the problem. Your best bet would be to find one made in October or September of last year -- those, at least, can be fixed, for the most part, with the service menu tweak. Good luck.

I'm planning on purchasing a 34 or 36XBR800.
My local cable co., Cox, provides a HDTV box AFTER the TV's installed.

Should I request the HDTV box before I get the TV? Then, when THEY (the store I'm buying the TV from) hook everything up, including the HDTV cable box, find a possible problem, they'd pick it up right then, and they'd have to deal with it THEN !!

Otherwise, I'd be getting the HDTV box from the cable Co. a week after I have the TV set up, I may realize there's a problem with the set.
Then, I'd be the one having to deal with store to resolve such an issue, instead of them dealing with it from the beginning.

Am I on the right path here or am I missing something?

Cox won't install the HD box unless you have an HDTV already. They want to connect the cables!

Do you know if people here with Cox equipment and the Sony sets have the problems mentioned in this post?

Brentski, the white line issue is not a problem with any set-top box, it is a quirk in the TV. It doesn't matter which set-top box you have. Unfortunately it doesn't appear that the fix has made it into the manufacturing process so your set may have the issue and may require a hardware fix. It might be a good idea to wait a bit and either get an 800 made in March or April or wait until next fall and get the 910.

Here I was. All excited about getting my new TV.

I literally spent months, narrowing down my choices, posting to various boards, getting owners opinions, and finally deciding on the Sony 800 series sets.
Now, I read all this crap and I'm not even sure if I should go ahead lay down the bucks to buy it !!!
I think that there's a point where the amount of information gets so overwhelming that it makes the decision making process harder instead of easier.

Is it suggested to request the store to check the set for this defect (since it now seems to be a known issue in Sony's technical circles) before it's to be delivered?

Or, is their stance on the issue; "we don't know a problem exists until the set's actually hooked up in your house to where we can see if such a problem does exist on YOUR set?

Just wondering if anyone's tried this yet?

I know that it's possible to request this be done, but is it an answer?

Sony In-Home technician scheduled to come out and look at my 34xbr800 on Thursday. The Service Menu "HDPT" fix didn't have any effect on my problem. Set manufactored in January 2003:(

BTW, PQ is generally quite excellent. One thing that did suprise me was, the moire effect of brick and mortar on buildings in 1080i. After the vertical line issue is solved, I'll have the set calibrated, hopefully, that'll square the moire stuff too!

After several discussions with Sony tech support, I got a call back today from Bob, one of their support managers. He told me the problem was fixed in the production process for the 34XBR800 on 12/16/02.

Unfortunately, he could not give me a range of affected serial numbers. The label on the back of the set only lists the month, not the date the set was made. So some of the December 2002 sets have the bug and some do not. You are safe with any set with a January 2003 label or later.

Originally posted by petesimac
Brentski, the white line issue is not a problem with any set-top box, it is a quirk in the TV. It doesn't matter which set-top box you have.

My 34XBR800 was purchased on 10/12/02. I'm using a 3100HD (cable) STB and do not see this problem. So either my set (likely manufactured in Sept or Aug) does not have this problem or it DOES depend on the STB. I've not tried it with an OTA STB nor a sat STB, and have no plans to.

Phil

Originally posted by Phil Wheeler
My 34XBR800 was purchased on 10/12/02. I'm using a 3100HD (cable) STB and do not see this problem. So either my set (likely manufactured in Sept or Aug) does not have this problem or it DOES depend on the STB. I've not tried it with an OTA STB nor a sat STB, and have no plans to.

Phil


You can only see it with a 1080i signal AND with very high brightness and picture settings, such as the default VIVID mode in the 34XBR800.

I bet 10 to 1 that if you follow the instructions I posted a while ago in this same thread, (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=1671848#post1671848) you'll see the bar.

I have my TV configured to the best of my abilities using Avia and can see it without going out of my way to exaggerate any brighness settings. I could see the effects on color tones (especially skin tones), but even then it was really hard to put a finger on what was happening until I used a black background to see exactly what was going on. I set my receiver to a DirecTV music channel that has a black background and Bingo! you could see the scrolling line plain as day. It was in the evening and I had only a lamp on in the room.

Chris

with me and told me that he was convinced that the problem was corrected with the replacement of the "B board". FWIW, my set was made in January 2003.

...four weeks after they visited for 5 minutes to say the Tech would be out in 5 more weeks. How cool is that - To buy a high-end TV in January and have the tech show up to replace the board in April.

On another note - My TV's background gets a little pixelated with dark images. Say, Tom Hanks in Road to Perdition, standing in a dark room with a dark-brown coat on. Everything looks great but the coat has this wierd almost shine quality to it. Like the TV can't decide what to do. It happens with DVD and HDNet. Do you think something like the Avia DVD picture tuning would clear this up? Thanks.

Thanks to Phil and all others here.

My 34xbr800 manufactured in dec 02 was Not corrected by service mode fix.

Ser # 8004144.

default was "0" for all interested.

Any other suggections before I call sony tect to house?

Thanks again!!

I have 34XBR800 made in Dec02. Sony tech came to house for 3rd time yesterday. First time he changed out DVI board which fixed a startup issue and tried to replace/modify the B board. The board he tried to modify was defective so he replaced my original B board and ordered a new one. He got new B board a week later and replaced it. That night I saw dreaded white line/band again. So yesterday he came back out but the service order was input incorrectly at office so he thought he was replacing DVI board again. Bottom line he said he trusted that the 2nd b board he installed had been modified and checked but he had not checked it himself. So he's ordering another B board and going to check it out and then come back out 4th time to install B board.

Good news is I was able to show him the line- all you have to do is go to a black channel, say 803, and you'll probably see it, if you don't turn up the brightness level and it will be there.

So he'll replace it in a week or so and we'll check it out. If this doesn't work I have no idea what next step is- have Sony exchange the TV I guess but doesn't sound like they have resolved the production issue yet. I'd think they'd be trying to get replacement B boards from whoever supplied them before Oct 02.

I'm getting tired of the whole issue. Switching to 720p is workaround but shouldn't need to do that on $2500 TV.

Anybody else have no luck once B board replaced? If you push the techs on the issue they are aware of issue- don't let them deny it or tell you it is a STB or feed signal prob.

Thanks Zachman.

Sony 2nd level techs admit the issue.

Have called Local service and they are ordering a B board.

Will be out 3/14/03 so I will let you know results.

Please, let me know if you hear anything new.

:(

Any news on this issue by anyone?

My repair guy coming this friday.

Also I see a slight line more frequently though on 720P when picture is dark. Anyone else?

I am experiencing this on my Sony 34xbr800 and Sat-HD200 STB. It decreases in intensity with using component cables versus DVI, however the component cables still is noticeable. I hope Sony finds a fix for this soon.

What is your manufacture date on TV lavoiema?

I just had Comcast install their HD service yesterday. I haven't noticed the bar yet. I am connected with component cables, and the box is set to 1080i. (DVI doesn't work yet).

I'll keep an eye out for the problem this weekend, but I didn't notice it last night. Set was made in December 2002.

Service did not show up to fix 34XBR800.

Does anyone know FOR SURE what sets with date of manufacture after 12/02 will not have the problem?

Dealer is going to replace my set.

Thanks.

marathon14,

Better yet, why not ask the dealer to give you a credit towards the new updated Sony model KV-34XBR910 Super Fine Pitch due out in a few months. I recently bought a 40XBR and love this TV, but can't wait to check out the Super Fine Pitch 910's...could be a second TV for me.

I've notice the same thing on my set. Mine was manufactured in November 2002, serial number: 800XXXX. I tried the service menu fix changing HDPT from 1 to 0. No luck. I only have my STB hooked up using the DVI cable, so I don't know if I have the same problem with a component hookup. Has anyone had any luck with Sony getting this fixed?

Thanks,
Mike

The repair guy did not show up. I stayed home to wait for him. Boston area.

Line is really disappointing in a Sony product of this price and caliber.

Cannot use set for purpose that it was intended...1080i viewing of HDTV.

At least the store that I bought it from has integrity and is going to get another set manufactured after January 2003 and I will view to see if problem is fixed before they swap it out. Then he will give me this new one if I am satisfied.

Sony Level 2 guy will not confirm that problem is solved in all later manufactured sets. VERY poor position for Sony to take.

I think they are hoping people will not notice it to prevent a large scale recall.

This is not a good situation.

BTW store will not give me credit towards 910, but is willing to do all necessary to get me a working 800...we'll see.

Marathon14, that's a bummer for sure. The 34XBR800 is one beautiful TV and was my second choice after much deliberation and thought. I'm sure that my decision would have been allot harder had the 910 Super Fine Pitch TV's been on the sales floor. I gonna checkout this little jewel when it finally makes its debut this Summer. Good luck w/your new 34XBR and keep us posted.

you're very lucky your store has been so gracious and seemingly committed to your satisfaction - i know there are a lot of stores out there that woudl not be nearly so accommodating. as for me, i'm lucky that my cut-price XBR800 didn't have the problem! surprised to hear that so many sets still have this defect... sony must have made a real boo-boo with the design somewhere, which is unusual for them.

The Tosh HDX82 has it's own problems but I decided to hold on for a bit before I bought a 34XBR800 for fear of jumping from the frying pan into the fire. At least it's a few hundred dollars cheaper (about $500US cheaper in Canada because Sony for some reason has decided to gouge the Canadian market).

I just got off the phone with Sony. Their in home service team is going to contact me to take a look at the set. I'll everyone know what the outcome is.

Mike

I have an Xbox with Dragon's Lair 3D playing in 1080i. I do not see this vertical scan line problem on my 34XBR800 at all with this game. But the other day I had a friend bring his PC with a HDTV tuner card, and we connected it to the TV to watch some recorded HD broadcasts (antenna reception in my area is not so good).

The pinkish vertical scan line is incredibly easy to see, whether the image on the screen is black or white or whatever. It was so bad that we had to watch the rest of the HD in 720p instead of 1080i. We tried the HDPT fix in the service menu, but it didn't help. Looks like I'm going to have to make some phone calls. Bah. This stinks. It's unbelievable that a set could have passed QA and put into production with such an obvious error.

My set was manufactured in Jan 2003 and serial number starts with 801.

So Time-Warner brought me a SA-3100HD cable box today for HDTV. As soon as the installer left, I punched up one of the local channels that was off the air for a while. Turned the picture mode on my 36XBR800 to "Vivid", killed the room lights and sat two feet from the screen. I couldn't see any vertical line at all (although the "black" picture seemed to have some faint snow speckles of noise in it in "Vivid") so I'm assuming that means I'm free of the problem. I believe this set was manufactured in July, 2002.

Not a good sign that is still there in Jan 03 tv's.

Has anyone else got sony's "Official" response?

I called Sony yesterday and told them about the problem. I spoke with three different people who have never heard of this problem. However I got a call back from the level two tech I spoke with yesterday to setup a in home service appointment, April 12th. He told me to describe the problem as a 60Hz Vertical bar, so i sounds like he found something about it. I definitely did not mention anything about 60Hz, I wouldn't know how to estimate that. I'll let everyone know what happens April 12th.

Mike

i'm sorry i haven't had time to read this entire thread. i have a 34xbr800. originally i had a dvd player and an hdsat200 hooked up to it, both through component inputs. everything was fine. then i got another progressive dvd player and used the second component input for it, hooking the hd receiver up by way of dvi cable. suddenly i had to the white bars running from right to left, at a rapid rate. oh no! i then discovered that if i turned the dvd player while i was watching over the air hd, the vertical lines disappeared. hope this helps.

ed

hope this helps
No, it doesn't help. I don't mean to be rude, but your post doesn't make sense. "I turned the dvd player"?!?! What's that supposed to mean?

I am having the same problem with my 34xbr800 while watching 1080i programs with dish 6000 receiver. My set was manufactured dec 2002 and serial # begins with 801. the question i have is why didnt sony let us know about this? now i have to take off of work and have someone comeout and fix a 2 month old tv ,that is rediculous. i knew i should have bought the panasonic!!!!!!

Originally posted by buttonmasher
No, it doesn't help. I don't mean to be rude, but your post doesn't make sense. "I turned the dvd player"?!?! What's that supposed to mean?

sorry buttonmasher. i should have proofread that post. let me try again.

my original setup had no vertical bars visible when watching 1080i. that setup was: dvdplayer plugged into component input. sat hd200 plugged into component input.

i then changed my setup by getting a 2nd dvd player. new setup is: 2 dvd players, each plugged into component input, sat hd200 connected by dvi cable. i then discovered i could see vertical bars running through the input that was getting the sat hd200 signal.

okay, here comes the point i was trying to communicate: i noticed that the vertical bars are apparent in the signal from the hd200 when the dvd players are turned on. if the dvd players are both turned off, i don't have the vertical lines.

once again, hope this helps
ed

My store had a Dec 02 manufacture date 34XBR800 serial # beginning with 901.

No problem. He exchanged it with my bad one. Great service from him.

Sony fails miserasbly. I am REALLY disapointed with them on this one.

1.) My TV displays Dragon's Lair 3D for Xbox in 1080i with no problem.
2.) When my friend brought over his PC with HDTV tuner card, we connected it to the component video input on my TV. The vertical bars in 1080i were VERY obvious.
3.) Recently I bought the Samsung T165 OTA HD Tuner/Receiver. I don't get any vertical bars in 1080i. This is when hooking it up using either the component video or DVI input.

So I guess for my purposes, the TV is fine for now. If it becomes a problem later on, I can always call Sony later. Good thing there's a 2 year warranty on this TV.

i just think its a problem with certain receivers . maybe diferences with the syncs. For some reason i think my tv is fixed now. or maybe because i went into the service mode and adjusted the red push. That could be causeing it also. because the line is kinda pinkish.