Serves them right. KCOP dragged their feet on getting UPN programming in HD for too long, KTLA deserves to carry The CW. KCOP upgraded their transmitter to HD less than a year ago, but still don't relay UPN programming in HD. Looks like the HD upgrade is not necessary anymore for KCOP as they won't have anything HD to show.

They'll just go back to being "Very Independent" :D

Does anyone know why the Laker games on KCAL 9 aren't in HD or when they will be in HD?

Could financial constraints be the reason why?

Also starting in 2006, the Dodgers' over-the-air games moves to KCAL.

from 10/28/2005

http://www.presstelegram.com/search/ci_3157949

Anyone else notice that Channel 4 late-night shows have the audio out-of-sync?
How about the prime-time shows? The picture appears to be ahead of the audio, tonight it was by quite a bit (perhaps 1/3-1/2 second). And the volume is quite low, especially on SNL.
--Gary

Anyone else notice that Channel 4 late-night shows have the audio out-of-sync?
How about the prime-time shows? The picture appears to be ahead of the audio, tonight it was by quite a bit (perhaps 1/3-1/2 second). And the volume is quite low, especially on SNL.
--Gary
I noticed that also as did my wife. I observed that KNBC went from 5.1 to 2 channel audio and back again several times. As another poster noted, 4.1 was the weather channel and 4.2 was the main program. When I tuned 4.2 I then noticed that the channel mapping disappeared and the channel reverted to 36.1. I guess KNBC is doing some strange stuff.

This was with my Dish 6000 STB. If this continues tonight I will try my other OTA only STB.

Rick R

OTA user here w/ Windows MCE. Last night 4.1 was the Weather Plus. Stupid NBC.

Just a heads up, and a request to watch closely and report any visible improvement or deterioration in HD content for viewers of KNBC-DT (digital channel 36 OTA) here in the LA area.

I just had a call from the chief engineer there, who alerted me to the fact that beginning today/tonight we will see the result of brand newly installed and now operational MPEG encoders (from Harmonic). These are supposed to be truly state of the art, and should affect the visual quality of all content on channel 36.

Still unknown is how 50-to-60 fps conversions will look from Turin coupled with this new equipment, especially with high-speed motion (although previous results from Athens, with the previous hardware/software, were not great).

I forgot to ask if this will affect audio as well as video, but I guess we should be able to provide him with some feedback (positive, negative, or neutral) and specifics about any unexpected problems.

NBC's audio is still off sync tonight. But at least it's not the weather channel like last night.

Another Simi Valley resident here (or will be shortly). I'm trying to figure out how I can get ATSC working out there.

Hey Rick_R (noticed your a Simi Valley resident so I'd love some advice :-P)
I'll be living at Stearns/Los Angeles so it'll be in the shadow of that big mountain that's about 35 miles from Mt Wilson. In other words no line of site to the transmitters but I can point to the mountain that's blocking them :-P

I have outside access to the north/north-west and I probably will be able to have near line of site to the 118 as it goes over the mountain. I can't have a huge antenna as I will be living in an apartment.

Here's a list of antenna's I've read others posting about.. please give me some recommendations:
- RS 15-2185 Wing (this one looks cool and visually would work)
- RS 15-2160 Boom (might work outside..kinda big :-/)
- Winegard GS2000a (cools decent..kinda pricey)
- Channel Master CM 4228 (very noticable :-/)

So should I go omnidirectional/directional/amplified? Any info will help.. i'm totally lost at where to start.

I've also heard cable companies can get ATSC signals to you as well over cable.. any info on that?

Audio still way out of sync on KNBC

Can you get the KNBC engineer to fix the dolby digital metadata for Leno, Conan, Fear Factor, etc. These programs all have 2.0 audio but are broadcast w/the 5.1 flag turned on. This causes all audio to be sent to L&R channels only so dialog not centered to screen, etc. Am I the only one that notices this?

There's also an irritating digitial static burst whenever Leno/Conan programs switch from 5.1 --> 2.0-->5.1 for commercial breaks which only happens on KNBC. This would also go away if they would stop erroneously switching to 5.1 for these programs...

Finally, how about getting them to turn down the output level a little bit. KCBS is like 10 decibels louder than every other OTA station...

Steve

BTW, I sent an email to KCBS last week b/c same 2.0/5.1 issue w/Letterman. Someone replied that he'd take a look at it, and it's been fixed for Letterman ever since.

Audio still way out of sync on KNBCI was watching the late night repeats of both Leno and Conan, and the A/V-sync problem was very noticeable. Much worse on Conan (who had beautiful Kate Beckinsale on). I left two phone messages on the KNBC guy's voice mail in the middle of the night, but haven't heard back today. Maybe he'll call me on Monday.

Can you get the KNBC engineer to fix the dolby digital metadata for Leno, Conan, Fear Factor, etc. These programs all have 2.0 audio but are broadcast w/the 5.1 flag turned on. This causes all audio to be sent to L&R channels only so dialog not centered to screen, etc. [B]Am I the only one that notices this? I listen through Dolby Headphones, so it's much harder to observe this type of anomaly (since DD5.1/2.1 sound is always mixed down to 2-channel stereo into my brain and any original multi-channel issues are more "simulated" than "real" by the time I hear them).

I don't have a true receiver and multiple loudspeakers to confirm what you're reporting, although I have observed some kind of difference in the "quality" of the sound on NBC from what I remember it used to be. For example, "Las Vegas" and "Leno" both sound more "hollow" and definitely lower volume to me through my headphones, which could be the Dolby Headphone equivalent of actually missing channels in the mixdown, if DD5.1 was being falsely reported when only PCM 2.0 sound was actually being provided.

There's also an irritating digitial static burst whenever Leno/Conan programs switch from 5.1 --> 2.0-->5.1 for commercial breaks which only happens on KNBC. This would also go away if they would stop erroneously switching to 5.1 for these programs...Definitely hear this too. It's not frightening, just a little "spark". And the DD5.1/2.0 data mode light on my Dolby Headphone box changes when that "click" occurs.

Finally, how about getting them to turn down the output level a little bit. KCBS is like 10 decibels louder than every other OTA station... Don't you mean KNBC and not KCBS here? I don't notice this output level problem.

Don't you mean KNBC and not KCBS here? I don't notice this output level problem.


I also notice that KCBS 2 is quite a bit louder than all the other locals here. It's been like that for quite a while.

Sorry... I thought you were commenting on KNBC-DT. When you mixed in a comment about the audio level on CBS I thought it was just a typo.

However now that we're talking about CBS, I do agree with your observation that at least their DD5.1 shows (e.g. "CSI: Original") are VERY VERY LOUD!

Yep, sorry about that. I meant KCBS 5.1 is way too loud, KNBC. I do, however, notice that Conan on KNBC is way too quiet.

The 2.0 flagged as 5.1 issue is especially problematic for me b/c I have bipolor L&R speakers, which trade-in precise imaging for diffuse soundstage. So when Conan is talking, eg, his voice is basically eminating from all over the front of my room from my L&R speakers, instead of being anchored to the screen via my center channel.

Also, for KNBC, I think it's just the national NBC programming that's out of sync, not local programming like the local news, etc.

KNBC-DT needs to turn the volume up!!
BTW, it's louder on DirecTV which is evidence they are not retransmitting the bits without processing.
KCBS-DT seems to be just the right volume on SD shows and I have no complaints about Letterman either.
--Gary

I agree, NBC should turn the volume up a notch. Every time I watch NBC from a different channel I need to turn up the volume.

KNBC DT's volume levels vary. Network shows volume are too low compared to other ota DT stations. NBC Network commercials volume are too loud and local KNBC inserts and originated are at a different level too.

KABC DT and ABC Network had similar problems they fixed a year ago.

BTW, it's louder on DirecTV which is evidence they are not retransmitting the bits without processing.
--Gary

DirecTV is SIGNIFICANTLY processing the signal, recompressing it to a much smaller MPEG 2 stream than the OTA signal, which is why the picture quality on DirecTV is worse than over OTA. I'm sure they are adjusting the audio levels as well.

KCBS-DT is louder because the CBS network uses a dialnorm value of -31db, which is the loudest setting. The default dialnorm value is -27db, but in theory it's supposed to be set for each program source. All HD CBS affiliates transmitting 5.1 controlled by the network's metadata have this situation, unless they attenuate the actual audio from the network.

That's interesting. So we should be complaining about the volume level to CBS instead of KCBS? I thought the affiliates were responsible for adding the metadata to the signal.

So who is responsible for erroneously flagging many primetime & late night network broadcast programs w/2.0 DD audio as 5.1 DD in the signal metadata? The networks or the affiliates?

The KTTV # I have is 310-584-3335

Hope that's it! Good luck.

I called this number on Wednesday night, because once again signal was low and I was just getting pixels, not full video. The engineer said that the problem must be on my side because nobody else was complaining. I asked him how could people complain? This number isn't posted anywhere on their website. He said that the receptionist keeps a log of complaints, and he hadn't seen any for weeks.

Anyway, the next day on Thursday my signal is back between 75 and 78 for KTTV, so the video is fine now. It is 76 right now, with no dropouts.

Thanks for anyone else that called the number. Somebody must have gotten them to look into whatever the issue might be.

sad NBC considers the harmonic 'state of the art' cheap b@stards

the popping you hear on commercial flip is crap switching equipment and programming - ie NBC just doesn't care. it actually is a dolby error as the switcher just chops off the end causing an error in your decoder which sounds like a pop/click. if you scan the transport stream you see bad DD packets at the switch points.

CBS also seems to be louder as many of their premium programs have aggressive discrete mixed 5.1, whereas nearly all NBC has matrixed 'faux' 5.1 with some shows lightly sweetened in spots - 'criminal minds' on CBS is like that though. it is a world of difference....

the popping you hear on commercial flip is crap switching equipment and programming - ie NBC just doesn't care. it actually is a dolby error as the switcher just chops off the end causing an error in your decoder which sounds like a pop/click. if you scan the transport stream you see bad DD packets at the switch points.I wonder if that's caused by NBC switching between Dolby E for 5.1 and PCM for 2.0 on the input of a DP572 Dolby E decoder as described here (http://www.dolby.com/about/news_events/dtvaudio_update/dau_mar2005_vol6no6.html).

netslayer,

The big 2700' peak, Rocky Peak, is in line with Cochran. Since you are near Los Angeles Avenue you should have a much easier time getting the stations. Another AVSer is at Stearns and Cochran and he reported getting all stations with a Winegard SS1000 with an added preamp. As a result my recommendation is the Winegard SS2000 (with built in preamp) which I expect to get you all stations. By the way, the farther west you are in Simi Valley the better reception you get because even though you are farther from Mt Wilson you are farther from the interfering peaks also.

Directional antennas are absolutely essential so that the direct signal is received and the reflected signals are rejected by the antenna.

Adelphia in Simi Valley has the 4 local network HD channels and maybe 4 other HD channels. I get 8 local OTA HD channels and 20 additional HD channels from Dish Network so Adelphis as not your best choice.

Good Luck,

Rick R

Another Simi Valley resident here (or will be shortly). I'm trying to figure out how I can get ATSC working out there.

Hey Rick_R (noticed your a Simi Valley resident so I'd love some advice :-P)
I'll be living at Stearns/Los Angeles so it'll be in the shadow of that big mountain that's about 35 miles from Mt Wilson. In other words no line of site to the transmitters but I can point to the mountain that's blocking them :-P

I have outside access to the north/north-west and I probably will be able to have near line of site to the 118 as it goes over the mountain. I can't have a huge antenna as I will be living in an apartment.

Here's a list of antenna's I've read others posting about.. please give me some recommendations:
- RS 15-2185 Wing (this one looks cool and visually would work)
- RS 15-2160 Boom (might work outside..kinda big :-/)
- Winegard GS2000a (cools decent..kinda pricey)
- Channel Master CM 4228 (very noticable :-/)

So should I go omnidirectional/directional/amplified? Any info will help.. i'm totally lost at where to start.

I've also heard cable companies can get ATSC signals to you as well over cable.. any info on that?

KCBS-DT is louder because the CBS network uses a dialnorm value of -31db, which is the loudest setting. The default dialnorm value is -27db, but in theory it's supposed to be set for each program source. All HD CBS affiliates transmitting 5.1 controlled by the network's metadata have this situation, unless they attenuate the actual audio from the network.

Yes, but -31db is the setting where it matches the analog channels - and the VU levels on the unit actually match what is coming out in your home.

The default, as you mention, is -27db, but you also loose 4db of dynamic range and the VU meters don't match up with the SPL in your Home Theater or viewing area.

Any station not running with a setting of -31db is limiting the dynamic range you hear.

And yes, the satellite services will compress the audio and change the values - thus all bets are off there.

The audio on KNBC 4.1 was like .5 sec behind last night. It was my first Thursday Night NBC in HD. I love the picture, but the audio was slightly annoying. Anyone else notice?

yes NBC has been out of sync on HD programming for a while although it seems to sync back up for SD and commercials??

Forgive my naiveté but is there anything I (we) can do? I hope this does not continue through the olympics. But I guess it would not matter much, because it is being annouced over. So that might be a moot point.

Ok.. I just got a UHF-only antenna (Terk TV32). I am under the impression that channel frequency and UHF channel number are not the same thing. For example, CBS has frequency of 2.xx and UHF number 60 in my area. So I'm guess CBS is UHF and not VHF even though it's channel 2?

Does anyone have any experience with this odd-shaped antenna? It isn't a fishbone yagi. It's more like a vertical grill.

I live in Glendale up in the hills, and everything points NE. I have been able to get CBS and Fox with an indoor antenna at strength 65. I'm hoping this new rooftop antenna will give me bette stuff.

yes NBC has been out of sync on HD programming for a while although it seems to sync back up for SD and commercials??Just got off the phone with my KNBC-DT head engineer connection about this, and we both had a good laugh. I had left him several late-night voice messages over the past few weeks, commenting on the badly out-of-sync state of the Leno and Conan reruns. He had not gotten back to me yet, and I was following up.

He admitted that they definitely knew they had a problem for a while now, they had been trying to get to the bottom of it, and that it seemed to be show-specific (e.g. I don't notice anything wrong with "Las Vegas") rather than universal. Also, it does not appear on 2-channel stereo audio track, only on the multi-channel digital side.

I also pressed him on the incorrect DD5.1 metadata flag (when NBC is clearly NOT broadcasting in DD5.1), and he laughed like crazy. He confirmed that this WAS being done, per a "political decision" at the network... presumably to try and address some other issues. He understood that this was "fallacious" and "inappropriate" given that DD5.1 is NOT being broadcast (not to mention that it would obviously negatively impact the actual audio produced out of a DD5.1 receiver/speaker arrangement), and could well be related to the lip-sync issue, and could clearly not justify what they were doing. In fact, he seemed a bit embarrassed by what the network had done here, and was obviously in disagreement (along with me) that THIS should have been the network's attempted "solution" to a problem... rather than ACTUALLY FIXING THE PROBLEM ITSELF, especially when this "attempt" was obviously having a strongly negative "unintended consequence" of no center audio out of DD5.1 sound systems.

He agreed that much of the problem is caused by the fact that NBC has come so late to the HD and multi-channel audio game with investment and infrastructure, for which there is no corresponding "additional revenue" stream returned. Also, they apparently don't have a legitimate "monitoring" facility for confirming what is actually going out over the air and what people are actually receiving... other than casual word-of-mouth from employees who have home receiver systems and who might have been watching a particular show, etc. Turns out most viewers (including himself) still listen in "ordinary stereo" (and probably not HD picture) rather than on multi-channel home theater setups with HD screens.

He realizes that the high-profile Olympics are only a week away, and that there is some sense of urgency to try and resolve this problem before then. He said he would immediately email the "top NBC audio engineer in the country" to try and shake things up, and that he presumed he already was aware of the audio problems occurring out here in LA.

Anyway, he much appreciated my input and updates (I always pass on details from posts here, including reading to him from what's been complained about by others) and is certainly aware of the AVS Forum and its membership community. He's very nice, very bright, clearly technical and qualified, and very interested in getting this matter addressed successfully.

More as I find out more.

The audio on KNBC 4.1 was like .5 sec behind last night. It was my first Thursday Night NBC in HD. I love the picture, but the audio was slightly annoying. Anyone else notice?
Yes. The Office was annoyingly out of sync, but not quite 1/2 sec.

I also have been seeing an audio problem on The Tonight Show all this week. It keeps switching between DD5.1 and PCM, every few minutes.

Much appreciated, DSperber. Good to hear that they've got someone who cares and is committed to resolving these issues (lip sync and DD metadata). As long as KNBC is aware of the them then I'm partially satisfied b/c I'm sure they will fix it. Hopefully soon. lol

Is this a public or private number your using to contact this guy? If public, what is it? If not public, then keep it to yourself so it doesn't get overwhelmed and you end up not being able to get through to him.

Ok.. I just got a UHF-only antenna (Terk TV32). I am under the impression that channel frequency and UHF channel number are not the same thing. For example, CBS has frequency of 2.xx and UHF number 60 in my area. So I'm guess CBS is UHF and not VHF even though it's channel 2?

Does anyone have any experience with this odd-shaped antenna? It isn't a fishbone yagi. It's more like a vertical grill.

I live in Glendale up in the hills, and everything points NE. I have been able to get CBS and Fox with an indoor antenna at strength 65. I'm hoping this new rooftop antenna will give me bette stuff.

Don't know anything about that particular antenna, but all the LA OTA stations are in the UHF range. No VHF.

Does anyone have any experience with this odd-shaped antenna? It isn't a fishbone yagi. It's more like a vertical grill.

Sounds similar to a Channelmaster 4221 (4-bay) or 4228 (8-bay) antenna.

At 4:30pm now, I'm seeing Eyewitness News in HD. Anyone else seeing this?

At 4:30pm now, I'm seeing Eyewitness News in HD. Anyone else seeing this?

You bet! Hot dang! This stuff is real! :eek:

I guess the rumors were true about them going HD after getting the new set. They were using the newsroom prior to this makeover. Also there were new graphics and music. Oh, the Burbank camera on the ABC building is HD also; some of the remotes look SD though they are 16:9. The stuff shot and sent directly to the studio (not stuff sent via microwave) are HD. And add to this, the already existing Air 7 HD. Yeah, KABC is THE news leader now.

WOW. Great job, KABC-TV. It looks wonderful. First in LA again.

yep-- HD on channel 7 News but the audio sounds like there's no center channel in 5.1??


when they go to commercials the audio difference is very apparent.

It looks great, but someone needs to tell the weather man that the color of his face and hands don't match! We notice things in HD we didn't see before.

Anybody here in Culver City (which is more Los Angeles than South Orange County, BTW :D ).

I'm looking for advice on what antenna to get for the best OTA HD reception. I'm just south of Sony by a few blocks.

Thanks!

Nobbie :cool:

KABC-DT Eyewitness News HD screencaps.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7064150&&#post7064150

My office is in the Culver City area and we use a Winegard 4400 and have perfect reception on all of the DTV channels.

anyone else get ABC 7 harry potter audio is out of sync?

My office is in the Culver City area and we use a Winegard 4400 and have perfect reception on all of the DTV channels.

Thanks for the info LATV. When you say DTV, do you mean HD-TV? Or DirecTV? I get so confused. Did you get the Winegard locally? Which way did you situate it?

Angels broadcast still up in air

Thursday, January 26, 2006

Team owner Arte Moreno's goal remains the same: to get as many Angels games on TV as possible this season. But even he doesn't know where all of them will appear.

"We're very close. We just have to select which way we're going to go," Moreno said Tuesday after another long day in court in Santa Ana, where the Angels are battling the city of Anaheim over the team's name change.

"When we walked in the door we had 90 games on TV. And the last two years we've had 150-plus. Our plans are to have 150-plus on TV again.

"We're still in negotiations. I can't tell you exactly (which channels)."

This much we know: At least 50 games will appear on Fox Sports Net, with about a dozen more on ESPN and/or Fox/11. That leaves about 100 games. Some could go to FSN, as happened last year. Some could go to a yet-to-be-determined over-the-air partner or partners. KCAL/9 had been the over-the-air home of the Angels until KCAL signed a long-term agreement with the Dodgers that kicks in this season.

Moreno declined to discuss potential over-the-air options. Candidates include KTLA/5 and KCOP/13.

Industry insiders theorize that KCOP is the favorite now that the WB and UPN have merged. Starting in September, KCOP no longer will have UPN programming. (KTLA will be the home of the new CW network.) That creates a need for programming and openings in prime time that KCOP hasn't had. KCOP was the Dodgers' over-the-air affiliate through last season.

Moreno said he is meeting with FSN representatives next week. The team's contract with FSN runs for three more years, and a long-term extension remains possible, Moreno said. The number of games on FSN also is up for discussion.

"It could go from 50 to 150. It could go from 50 to 100. It could go from 50 to 120," Moreno said. "That's really where we are right now, making a decision how we're going to distribute the games."

MIXED SIGNALS

Moreno wouldn't confirm rumors that he is interested in buying radio station KMXE/830, as first reported by fellow Register columnist Frank Mickadeit. Moreno did say the Angels would not try to get out of their deal with KSPN/710. The agreement runs for two more seasons.

Moreno said KSPN does "a very good job of promoting and broadcasting the games," but he complained about the station's signal strength, or lack thereof.

"You can't hear the signal when you leave the parking lot (at Angel Stadium)," Moreno said. "If we're trying to reach the whole metropolitan area and you have a weak signal, eventually you've got to cure that."

http://www.ocregister.com/ocregister/sports/pros/angels/article_967216.php

Anybody here in Culver City (which is more Los Angeles than South Orange County, BTW :D ).

I'm looking for advice on what antenna to get for the best OTA HD reception. I'm just south of Sony by a few blocks.

Thanks!

Nobbie :cool:
You should have a straight shot to Mt Wilson (you might even be able to see the antennas above Arcadia on a clear day), so I bet one of the RS UHF yagis (~$20-25) should work. Or, something like a CM 4221. Check antennaweb.com to confirm what size.

Angels broadcast still up in air...
Isn't Arte an advertising guy? I think he knows the majority of people he's trying to reach either don't have an HD-capable TV yet or don't know how to hook it up properly for HD. So, to him, it doesn't benefit his pocketbook to broadcast more games in HD. IMO, from the name change thing & all the annoying advertising in the stadium, Moreno's about the bottom line not about pleasing the fan, which is just business.

On a side note, I could be wrong, but from checking out the cameras in Angels stadium, they're all badged as "HD" and the screen appeared to be 16x9. But, the screens had vertical lines to show the cameraman the 4:3 view. So, at least the cameras are ready for HD.

I'm a new owner of a Sony 50 inch SXRD, have Adelphia, and live in West LA. I have regular expanded cable. I set up my TV yesterday and found out I get free HDTV on some channels above 100 (like 101.3?) on NBC and CBS and the PBS channel. Is this a free preview weekend or is this permanent? What advantage does a Cablecard have? How much is a cablecard? I'm already paying $52 a month for regular cable and don't feel like spending another $10 a month for HDTV. Also, is ABC broadcasting in 1080i for the Superbowl?

I'm a new owner of a Sony 50 inch SXRD, have Adelphia, and live in West LA. I have regular expanded cable. I set up my TV yesterday and found out I get free HDTV on some channels above 100 (like 101.3?) on NBC and CBS and the PBS channel. Is this a free preview weekend or is this permanent? What advantage does a Cablecard have? How much is a cablecard? I'm already paying $52 a month for regular cable and don't feel like spending another $10 a month for HDTV. Also, is ABC broadcasting in 1080i for the Superbowl?

Congrats on the SXRD!
The built in tuner will capture open HD signals on channels like 110.7 etc. The locals and Discovery are open. Use the "Favorite" feature of the TV to easily queue up the channels.
There is a free preview time coming around the 18th but I think you do need a Digital box for that.
The cable card will put all the channels in the offical Adelphia position ie. CBS-HD will be on 902. It costs $1.75 if it's your only digital device.
As awful as it is your best bet is the Moxi DVR so you can record in HD. There's anothe thread in the HD Recording section of AVS. Also you may get away with the inexpensive Silver Sensor ($20 on Amazon) for over the air HD like from KTLA and KOCE that Adelphia doesn't provide. I'm in West LA and it works great.
It helps if you face East.
Yes the Superbowl is in HD. I think ABC uses 720P.

Thanks, Joe,
Is there any advantage to the Cablecard besides reassigning the channels? Is there an FAQ out there to understand more about Adelphia and HDTV offerings? Is digital cable the same as HDTV? What is DD5.1? I'm clueless.

Also, I bought that fancy $55 RCA HDTV indooor antenna and can't get a thing over the air. I face West but tried aiming the antenna using that antenna (dot) org website. no luck. I'm returning the thing to Best buy.

How much is Moxi? Is it possible to get Moxi without having a set top box? Can you use Moxi with a cablecard? What are the advantages of having moxi besides the DVR?

Thanks!

I am watching the Knicks vs. Rockets game and there is no center channel coming from the DD 5.1. Anyone else notice this?

...and is anyone else missing half of the D from the HD logo on ABC right now...

I noticed this morning that I am no longer getting any audio on channel 28.2. Channel 28.1 audio is good. The only other channel that I have had an audio problem with is 62.2, which has never had audio. Anyone else experiencing these problems?

Thanks, Joe,
Is there any advantage to the Cablecard besides reassigning the channels? Is there an FAQ out there to understand more about Adelphia and HDTV offerings? Is digital cable the same as HDTV? What is DD5.1? I'm clueless.

The CC is great for organizing your subscribed channels, subscribed is the operative word. Adelphia will be having more tiers of service so the may scramble more. Digital is anything above 100 and now many below and soon all will be digital as analog goes to sleep. DD 5.1 you need a home theatre/amp set up. The signal is there you'll be amazed. This is the place for clues! More will help. :D

How much is Moxi? Is it possible to get Moxi without having a set top box? Can you use Moxi with a cablecard? What are the advantages of having moxi besides the DVR?

Thanks!

The Adelphia site has Moxi info. It's worth investigating, it functions as your tuner and recorder, in regular and HD.

Isn't Arte an advertising guy? I think he knows the majority of people he's trying to reach either don't have an HD-capable TV yet or don't know how to hook it up properly for HD. So, to him, it doesn't benefit his pocketbook to broadcast more games in HD. IMO, from the name change thing & all the annoying advertising in the stadium, Moreno's about the bottom line not about pleasing the fan, which is just business.

On a side note, I could be wrong, but from checking out the cameras in Angels stadium, they're all badged as "HD" and the screen appeared to be 16x9. But, the screens had vertical lines to show the cameraman the 4:3 view. So, at least the cameras are ready for HD.

it's true one survey found half of HDTV set owners didn't set them up for HD reception.

on the other hand over half of the commercial showing during today's Super Bowl will be in high def.

and yes they are using HD cameras in Angels Stadium for the visiting teams broadcast/regional sports partners. It is amazing to learn how many other broadcast markets support HD coverage of their professional teams.

The heavy wind in Orange Count today is causing my signal on ABC to go haywire. 70% to 12% to 34%....just stay stable damnit! What a day to be windy. :mad:

NBC 4 audio still out of sync
ABC 7 Harry Potter audio last night out of sync
ABC Superbowl today, pre game show, Stevie Wonder et al, vocals inaudiblen 5.1
ABC local HD news no center channel in 5.1

with all these "improvements" my digital OTA experience is actually getting worse...

rock solid till the last 15 seconds of the 1st half when the picture and audio began busting up. Wish they'd increase the station's power. Too frustrating to watch the 2nd half with it comming and going.

Watching the news after the Super bowl KABC announced that they are the first Los Angeles station to do all its news in HDTV. They did say that sometimes the material that they use from other sources will still be SD but all ther feeds with local news will be in HD. I guess its just building on there AIR7 hd anouncement a few months ago. There President of Operations said they want to be the first in the LA market to offer full HD news coverage.

Watching the news after the Super bowl KABC announced that they are the first Los Angeles station to do all its news in HDTV. They did say that sometimes the material that they use from other sources will still be SD but all ther feeds with local news will be in HD. I guess its just building on there AIR7 hd anouncement a few months ago. There President of Operations said they want to be the first in the LA market to offer full HD news coverage.


Looks great, although I wish ABC would actually use their NBA agreement to air games like NBC used to.

I searched but could not find...how many (if any at all) Clippers games are there on KTLA in HD? I even searched the KTLA website and could not get an answer. Does anyone know?

I live in Arcadia an have a channel master 3016. I can pick up most local channels, 2, 4, 5, 9, 11, 13, 28, and others but cant seem to pick up 7. I have a straight shot at mt. wilson and only about 7 miles away? Anybody live in Arcadia and getting channel 7?

Great job KABC on your HD news. I previously watched KNBC 4 news but they have seen the last of me. I especially like the fact that their SD news feeds are not stretched like KABC does on their SD broadcasts. Great stuff.

Rick R

Check out this website for more detailed info than antennaweb.org. Looks like KABC 7 has the weakest signal which may be my problem. Not sure if a different receiver would be able to pick it up.

http://www.2150.com/broadcast/default.asp

am I the only one who has no center channel 5.1 audio on ABC local news in HD??

they are broadcasting it in 5.1 dolby digital and when they go to commercial, the center channel comes back

looks great sounds bad!

does anyone have an email/phone for their tech dept?

thanks

Yeah, this is a problem for all the stations that drives me nuts. KABC local news is recorded w/only 2 channels (DD 2.0), but broadcast w/the 5.1 flag set in the metadata. So our DD receivers have only audio in only the left and right channels. Very irritating.

http://abclocal.go.com/kabc/story?section=stationinfo&id=3877433

this page can be used to make comments on the Channel 7 HD broadcast

I sent them comments on the no center channel in 5.1 audio issues.

please do the same if you have the issue

thanks!

does anyone have an email/phone for their tech dept?Try 310-863-7467.

This DD5.1 flag wrongly set on in the metadata has also been pointed out as occurring on KNBC-DT, which results in the same flawed audio symptom. Really aggravating, when listening to shows that used to have higher volume and higher quality sound (i.e. true DD2.0 processing), such as "Las Vegas". This has been reported to the KNBC-DT engineer who is fully aware that this was done (for other reasons), and is also fully aware that this cannot be thought of as a "solution" to some other problem if it has this negative consequence. But apparently it's out of his hands, although I can't see why.

The KTTV # I have is 310-584-3335

Hope that's it! Good luck.

Is anyone having issues with KTTV FOX HDTV?

I searched but could not find...how many (if any at all) Clippers games are there on KTLA in HD? I even searched the KTLA website and could not get an answer. Does anyone know?

Here you go my friend.

http://www.nba.com/media/clippers/KTLA_Schedule_0506.pdf

Here you go my friend.

http://www.nba.com/media/clippers/KTLA_Schedule_0506.pdf
Basically all games broadcasted at Staples Center including the ones against the Lakers are in HD. The road games aren't. I guess not all arenas have built in HD cameras like stapels center.

thanks for the info

yes it happened on scrubs last night on NBC but the audio was fine for Law and Order

so with the 5.1 audio issues, under what circumstances does incorrectly flagging the source signal make things better for the viewer??

who can actually get/hear the audio properly?

I tried setting my receiver to different dolby processing, even DD2 but it still didnt sound right at all.

i

Is anyone else having KABC 7.1 problems right now?

Here you go my friend.

http://www.nba.com/media/clippers/KTLA_Schedule_0506.pdf
Thank you so much for that!!!

OTA on my D* H20 I am getting signal strength in the high 70's to low 80's and I am still getting a ton of macro blocking and audio drop out...any one else...I would hate Lost to drop out like this...

NBC 4 audio still out of syncHad a call from my KNBC-DT engineer contact today, in response to my late-night voice mail to him regarding Monday's "Las Vegas" being out-of-sync. He said they had watched it today via HD Tivo (from D*, presumably just retransmitting the OTA signal from LA) and were unable to see any problem.

I asked him how he was listening, and he said "two channel L/R stereo". I asked him if he was listening via the red/white analog stereo outputs of the Tivo box and he said yes. I'm guessing (but am not sure) that this red/white analog output from the D*/Tivo is NOT obtained from the 2-channel PCM digital L/R-stereo imbedded in the digital audio stream, but rather is obtained from the 2-channel MTS stereo audio which would also be available to ordinary TV's capable of providing MTS stereo audio through built-in speakers.

So I'm not sure the fact that they were unable to see a lip-sync problem with that 2-channel stereo analog audio is really relevant. And I told him so, indicating that all of us who were complaining were listening to either (a) multi-channel digital sound falsely identified as DD5.1 when it is only DD2.0 delivered by optical/coax from source STB/DVR device to a multi-channel receiver, or (b) the digital DD2.0 2-channel PCM stereo signal itself, again passed through optical/coax from source STB/DVR device to a receiver. Since the lip-sync was widely observable with both of these digital audio hardware arrangements, that would point to a problem in the underlying digital audio DD2.0 stream, whether it's handled properly as 2-channels or falsely handled as 5.1-channels.

In other words, if they wanted to "chase" the problem, they needed to start with a proper digital audio setup (using the same D* HD Tivo if they wanted)... not analog audio. Since he already knows that the NY network honchos' decision to falsely send out DD5.1-flagged metadata is obviously inappropriate and wrong, he's really inclined to suspect that as somehow the primary cause of the lip-syc problem. But he's mystified as to why it should vary from show to show.

Anyway, there definitely seems to be variability in the degree of lip-sync problem. For example, "Las Vegas" exhibited the problem to a much lesser degree than late-night reruns of Leno or Conan do.

I also reminded him of the false DD5.1 metadata problem, and the fact that now KABC-DT is doing the same thing on their brand new HD news broadcasts. And just like with the KNBC-DT results, where you only hear sound from the L/R speakers and not from the center, the same is true from the KABC-DT news studios. You hear sound from the sides, but not from the center, which sounds hollow and echoic. Unnatural, with the onscreen picture directly in front of your eyes.

He said his next call was going to be to his counterpart over at KABC-DT, to discuss this whole problem... including their decision to also falsely send out DD5.1 metadata on their news broadcasts.

He did say that the NY decision to send out DD5.1 flags was a nationwide decision, so you'd think other city viewers/listeners (e.g. AVS forum members) would have noticed this problem, and not just us LA viewers. Just more mystery.

Is anyone else having KABC 7.1 problems right now?

Video is fine but sound glitches galore via Directv - I assumed it was Directv problem.

28.1, PBS FINALLY HAS AUDIO!

Looks like it only took them a few months to figure out there was a problem and fix it. :rolleyes:

Video is fine but sound glitches galore via Directv - I assumed it was Directv problem.

I noticed a few glitches during Lost using OTA. My signal is generally pretty strong, so I didn't think that was the issue.

I had some pixelization issues during the Grammy's. Anyone else?

I had some pixelization issues during the Grammy's. Anyone else?

Yes there were some breakups. Not massive, though.

thanks for the info etc

I have also noticed the sync issues with some NBC shows and ABC HD news doesnt seem quite right either

it is mind boggling that they do not monitor the quality of their OTA broadcast, especially when they spend big promo $ fanfaring it everywhere.

got a reply from KABC re 5.1 audio issues

"Thank you for telling us. You are the first person to report this.
Please let me know if this continues to be a problem. I will forward
your comments to our chief engineer."

Had a call from my KNBC-DT engineer contact today, in response to my late-night voice mail to him regarding Monday's "Las Vegas" being out-of-sync. He said they had watched it today via HD Tivo (from D*, presumably just retransmitting the OTA signal from LA) and were unable to see any problem.

I asked him how he was listening, and he said "two channel L/R stereo". I asked him if he was listening via the red/white analog stereo outputs of the Tivo box and he said yes. I'm guessing (but am not sure) that this red/white analog output from the D*/Tivo is NOT obtained from the 2-channel PCM digital L/R-stereo imbedded in the digital audio stream, but rather is obtained from the 2-channel MTS stereo audio which would also be available to ordinary TV's capable of providing MTS stereo audio through built-in speakers.

So I'm not sure the fact that they were unable to see a lip-sync problem with that 2-channel stereo analog audio is really relevant. And I told him so, indicating that all of us who were complaining were listening to either (a) multi-channel digital sound falsely identified as DD5.1 when it is only DD2.0 delivered by optical/coax from source STB/DVR device to a multi-channel receiver, or (b) the digital DD2.0 2-channel PCM stereo signal itself, again passed through optical/coax from source STB/DVR device to a receiver. Since the lip-sync was widely observable with both of these digital audio hardware arrangements, that would point to a problem in the underlying digital audio DD2.0 stream, whether it's handled properly as 2-channels or falsely handled as 5.1-channels.

In other words, if they wanted to "chase" the problem, they needed to start with a proper digital audio setup (using the same D* HD Tivo if they wanted)... not analog audio. Since he already knows that the NY network honchos' decision to falsely send out DD5.1-flagged metadata is obviously inappropriate and wrong, he's really inclined to suspect that as somehow the primary cause of the lip-syc problem. But he's mystified as to why it should vary from show to show.

Anyway, there definitely seems to be variability in the degree of lip-sync problem. For example, "Las Vegas" exhibited the problem to a much lesser degree than late-night reruns of Leno or Conan do.

I also reminded him of the false DD5.1 metadata problem, and the fact that now KABC-DT is doing the same thing on their brand new HD news broadcasts. And just like with the KNBC-DT results, where you only hear sound from the L/R speakers and not from the center, the same is true from the KABC-DT news studios. You hear sound from the sides, but not from the center, which sounds hollow and echoic. Unnatural, with the onscreen picture directly in front of your eyes.

He said his next call was going to be to his counterpart over at KABC-DT, to discuss this whole problem... including their decision to also falsely send out DD5.1 metadata on their news broadcasts.

He did say that the NY decision to send out DD5.1 flags was a nationwide decision, so you'd think other city viewers/listeners (e.g. AVS forum members) would have noticed this problem, and not just us LA viewers. Just more mystery.

Forget calling his ABC counterpart... he needs to call his KCBS counterpart b/c they're the ones that got all this DD metadata stuff figured out!!

BTW, I can A/B b/t KNBC OTA vs. DirecTv, and the lip-syncing problem is there on D*, but noticeably less than OTA. The volume is also a bit more normalized (ie. not so low compared to KABC and KCBS) on D*.

This is really disappointing. Aren't KNBC and KABC supposed to be the flagship network affiliates?

got a reply from KABC re 5.1 audio issues

"Thank you for telling us. You are the first person to report this.
Please let me know if this continues to be a problem. I will forward
your comments to our chief engineer."

Where did I you send your comments? I'll be the 2nd to report it...

Re: KABC's HiDef news: I've never seen so much empty space (on the sides) in my life!
Obviously KABC knows that only a handful of their viewers, even those with HD sets, will be watching it in 16:9 correctly. And as to their claim, it will look better even if you don't have an HD set, that's only true if blue is your favorite color! (ie the color of the new set).
--Gary

In Carson with a Terk 55 Outdoor antenna (lil cheapy) I receive the following in HD
CBS 2.1 - No audio prob's, but very small pixelation once in a great while
NBC 4.1 - Bigtime audio lag! Leno just aint as funny with lag!
NBC 4.2 - Nice weather reports. Use this instead of the Weather Channel.
WB 5.1 - Looks to me like that 720p crap that ABC used to have. No A/V prob's.
ABC 7.1 - No A/V prob. Nice pic. if anything a little grainy look. Maybe my Antenna?
ABC 7.2 - Tried to match NBC 4.2, but fails because picture is so small.
KCAL 9.1 - Nothing in HD or ED. Would like to see Jackie Johnson in HD ;-)
FOX 11.1 - No A/V Prob's. Just lame programming. Crap looks better in HD #8-)
UPN 13.1 - Was digging the Dodger games last year no in HD, but a little better looking than through DirecTV. Pixelation comes and goes.
PBS 28.1 - My favorite channel! Nice clean picture except when showing fast moving stuff, no audio prob's, Great HD show-off channel! Problem is that they cut off certain shows with no remorse. You could be halfway a very interesting documentary then BAM! Tavis Smiley. He's great but damnit! Let the documentary on the mating rituals of fish finish! ;-)
PBS 50.1 - This is the OC feed. Nice pic and audio. But wont they ever update their DirecTV listings?
Also would like to see the hot mexican soap opera actresses in HD.
Even just the news people, Ayayai! Mucho Caliente!

;-)

In Carson with a Terk 55 Outdoor antenna (lil cheapy) I receive the following in HD
CBS 2.1 - No audio prob's, but very small pixelation once in a great while
NBC 4.1 - Bigtime audio lag! Leno just aint as funny with lag!
NBC 4.2 - Nice weather reports. Use this instead of the Weather Channel.
WB 5.1 - Looks to me like that 720p crap that ABC used to have. No A/V prob's.
ABC 7.1 - No A/V prob. Nice pic. if anything a little grainy look. Maybe my Antenna?
ABC 7.2 - Tried to match NBC 4.2, but fails because picture is so small.
KCAL 9.1 - Nothing in HD or ED. Would like to see Jackie Johnson in HD ;-)
FOX 11.1 - No A/V Prob's. Just lame programming. Crap looks better in HD #8-)
UPN 13.1 - Was digging the Dodger games last year no in HD, but a little better looking than through DirecTV. Pixelation comes and goes.
PBS 28.1 - My favorite channel! Nice clean picture except when showing fast moving stuff, no audio prob's, Great HD show-off channel! Problem is that they cut off certain shows with no remorse. You could be halfway a very interesting documentary then BAM! Tavis Smiley. He's great but damnit! Let the documentary on the mating rituals of fish finish! ;-)[/I]

;-)Channel Master Split Boom 3019 in Norco. Similar to above. Occasional brief pixilation during Emmys on 2.1. Leno had big time audio lag on 4.1 last night, usually doesn't seem to be a problem. Letterman was in sync. Jackie J is a magnificent test of horizontal expansion - in any resolution :o. Yea, ol Travis on 28 gets overcooked a bit but 28.1 is best of breed in OTA HD PQ.

http://abclocal.go.com/kabc/story?s...info&id=3877433

you can send comments to KABC re the 5.1 audio from this web page

or the email reply was

KABC-TV.MAYOR AT abc.com

I disagree with Stephen in saying the levels at KCBS are correct. They are much higher than every other station and sometimes to the point of distortion when running network shows. Local shows seem to be in the ballpark. CBS net also seems to run the center channel dialog much lower than anyone else on most of their shows. That might be one of those creative decsions and not technical. Alas, unless a person owns a Dolby LM100 test set to measure the signal, this is all one big guess.

I disagree with Stephen in saying the levels at KCBS are correct. They are much higher than every other station and sometimes to the point of distortion when running network shows. Local shows seem to be in the ballpark. CBS net also seems to run the center channel dialog much lower than anyone else on most of their shows. That might be one of those creative decsions and not technical. Alas, unless a person owns a Dolby LM100 test set to measure the signal, this is all one big guess.


Actually, they are the only ones running them correctly with the Dialogue Normalization set at -31db instead of the incorrect default of -27db. The SPL is the only one to correctly match up with the analog channel and gives you an additional 4db of dynamic range - and surprise of all surprises - 0 Vu on meter actually means 0 Vu.

Could you the explain why the network runs so high compared everyone else in the LA market. The network runs at least 10db higher than the local KCBS. CBS seems to be in conflict with their own owned station. Just listening tells you something is wrong.

Is anyone else having massive sound pops and audio / video drops watching the Olympics via KNBC-DT? I've been recording every hour of their coverage and watching it... and it's horrible. I mean, the picture is fine... but it's very awkward. Picture will break up and pixelate here and there. We'll have picture and audio drops / skips at least every few minutes and good God, someone fix the levels between their "DD5.1" audio and their PCM audio for commercials... it's heinous. At least with Tivo'ing I can just flip through the commercials. But if I forget it's like getting blasted out of the house.

Is it just me though?

Is anyone else having massive sound pops and audio / video drops watching the Olympics via KNBC-DT? I've been recording every hour of their coverage and watching it... and it's horrible. I mean, the picture is fine... but it's very awkward. Picture will break up and pixelate here and there. We'll have picture and audio drops / skips at least every few minutes and good God, someone fix the levels between their "DD5.1" audio and their PCM audio for commercials... it's heinous. At least with Tivo'ing I can just flip through the commercials. But if I forget it's like getting blasted out of the house.

Is it just me though?


Not just you. The picture goes to black while the audio continues, or the video pixelates and the audio goes away. I don't know about the commercials because I zip through them all.

Let the video play through a commercial... it's bad. I also like when the sound keeps flipping between -5db and -7db. That's always nice during the broadcast. I'd nag the NBC guy... but like that's going to help?

And, for clarification's sake, we're using an outdoor antenna, have a clear line of site to Mt. Wilson and hold NBC steadily between 82-85. So it's not like it's a flakey signal.

Is anyone else having massive sound pops and audio / video drops watching the Olympics via KNBC-DT? I've been recording every hour of their coverage and watching it... and it's horrible. I mean, the picture is fine... but it's very awkward. Picture will break up and pixelate here and there. We'll have picture and audio drops / skips at least every few minutes and good God, someone fix the levels between their "DD5.1" audio and their PCM audio for commercials... it's heinous. At least with Tivo'ing I can just flip through the commercials. But if I forget it's like getting blasted out of the house.

Is it just me though?

It's that way via Adelphia too, garbage in garbage out. BUT when it's good, my o my! It sure is grand. I guess we're all on the bleeding edge, at least it's not like the last Summer Games that were 24 hours behind in HD, I didn't have my set then, that would have pissed me off!

It's that way via Adelphia too, garbage in garbage out. BUT when it's good, my o my! It sure is grand. I guess we're all on the bleeding edge, at least it's not like the last Summer Games that were 24 hours behind in HD, I didn't have my set then, that would have pissed me off!

You know, I miss having the day-delay channel. :) I liked it... just wish they had a "live" feed plus the day delay feed as well. But I digress.

I was just going to ask if there were people getting KNBC-HD via a non-OTA source who were having the same problems as well? Like via cable or DirecTV. I'd ask about Dish, but I don't know think anyone has a 622 receiver to receive the LA Locals in HD. But if they do, I'd love to know if they're getting it too?

The Olympics A/V problem are coming from the network, not just locally here in LA. Yesterday they had a big blizzard back east and apparently it impacted the HD/digital feed to the rest of the country (although I admit I'm surprised).

The DD5.1 audio is horrible (and horribly horribly low in level, until commercials come on and are 10db louder), and has been complained about nationally. Extremely unimpressive sound quality, poorly conveying surround... almost like half the mikes are turned off.

Visually it looks quite excellent, I must say. Indoor artificially lit events and last night's artificially lit womens' moguls final session looked fabulous! Gorgeously pure and accurate colors, pure white snow, wonderful.

I'm watching both OTA (via roof antenna) as well as delivered via Comcast.

The problem is not just here in LA. Let's hope they fix it soon.

I was just going to ask if there were people getting KNBC-HD via a non-OTA source who were having the same problems as well? Like via cable or DirecTV. I'd ask about Dish, but I don't know think anyone has a 622 receiver to receive the LA Locals in HD. But if they do, I'd love to know if they're getting it too?

I have both Directv and OTA and I recorded a couple of hours using both sources simultaneously. The problems that you see on the OTA signal were replicated exactly in the Directv signal.

Kevin

does anyone else get ABC 7-2 showing heavy pixelation and blocking all the time now?

I've always experience heavy pixelation and blocking on that channel. It is HEAVILY compressed to make room for 7.1.

I've always experience heavy pixelation and blocking on that channel. It is HEAVILY compressed to make room for 7.1.

Same here. It's almost funny to see the extreme degredation in quality the ABC Evening News shows on 7.2 when compared to 7.1.

Could it because that they're offering a third (7.3) channel?

didnt use to get it pixelating/blocking until the HD news came along, now its just awful

however the audio is good...

come on ABC!

No KLCS Digital or Analog OTA here. New sub-band for Create on 28-3 but not showing anything yet. (Create was/is? on 58-3.)

Same here. It's almost funny to see the extreme degredation in quality the ABC Evening News shows on 7.2 when compared to 7.1.

Could it because that they're offering a third (7.3) channel?

My understanding is 7.3 takes very little bandwidth. I haven't noticed the change on 7.2 that everyone else is. It's always been a heavily compressed channel.

Re-- bandwith

28-1 and 50-1 [HD] dont seem to suck the life out of 28-2 and 50-2???


and 58 KLCS has been out since yesterday for me too

And I would argue that 28.1 doesn't look as good as 7.1. I see a lot of artifacting and macroblocking on PBS HD. KABC, in my opinion, has the best HD picture quality in L.A.

And I would argue that 28.1 doesn't look as good as 7.1. I see a lot of artifacting and macroblocking on PBS HD. KABC, in my opinion, has the best HD picture quality in L.A.

Wow...that's not the case for me in West LA at all. 28.1 is consistantly the best picture I get out of 2,4,5,7,9,11,13,28,&50 (the channels I watch OTA).

Go figure!

And I would argue that 28.1 doesn't look as good as 7.1. I see a lot of artifacting and macroblocking on PBS HD.
Same here. Definitely more finicky picture (more sensitive to motion artifacts) on PBS for me.

I sometimes get blocking etc on 28/50, but I thought it was on non HD mat'l that had been up-res'd [if there is such a word] from SD to HD for broadcast.


on what appears to be native HD stuff I find the PQ very good.

Crash: I agree with you....28 has been the standard of hi-def for me for the last 4 months. Watching/checking on 2,4,5,7,9,11,13,18,22,24,28,30,34,46,50,56,58,62.

Who else has 1080i wide screen 24/7?

I really hope I mis-heard this, but I saw a commercial for ABC news in HD. I could have sworn the announcer said "Even without an HD TV, see it in high definition!!". Um... exactly how is that possible? It's entirely possible that I heard wrong. Can someone confirm?

I really hope I mis-heard this, but I saw a commercial for ABC news in HD. I could have sworn the announcer said "Even without an HD TV, see it in high definition!!". Um... exactly how is that possible? It's entirely possible that I heard wrong. Can someone confirm?

I have heard that quote many times and actualy what they said was. " even without an HD TV you can see the difference".
I can tell you from first hand experience that there is a major improvement of PQ even on a Standard TV. I guess its just the old garbage in garbage out philosophy. The source is so much better it looks better even at lower resolution.

I remember that ad as well, however my recollection is that they said "Even without and HD set, you can still see it." I don't believe they said you can see it "in high definition". Their point was that it will be a much better picture with or without an HD set, but without an HD set it will still be SD (just better quality).

I'm glad I was wrong. I've been trying to get a job at ABC and I wouldn't want to have to be the one to call them and tell them their ad campaign was misleading. ;)

Eyewitness News in DVD Picture Quality

I'm glad I was wrong. I've been trying to get a job at ABC and I wouldn't want to have to be the one to call them and tell them their ad campaign was misleading. ;)

It is actually misleading. With the exception of the HD chopper, the studio shots, and maybe a few pieces here and there, the vast majority of their material is still being done at 720x486, only now it's being done anamorphically, so the SD 4x3 viewers are actually seeing LESS resolution.

horrible reception friday 6pm ish

signals all over the place

58 still awol

anyone else?

I checked all the digital versions of channels 2-13 (I forget which UHF channel they are mapped to) and they were coming in fine here in Ventura using my OTA antenna on the roof. The KABC local news in HD looks great and there was no signal breakup while I watched. I have an HD Tivo and Directv, but I can get the locals OTA.

You guys may have already dealt with this problem a few months back, but I haven't been able to find the posts if that's the case.

My reception of KCET (28.1, 28.2) was fine since hooking up in June '05, until around October or November, when 28.1 28.2 just plain disappeared. I assumed it was a transmission problem, and waited quite a while for it to rectify itself. It didn't. I finally emailed the KCET engineering squad and got the following response:

"We had a problem with our encoder about the time you started to have a
problem.
Try to have you receiver re-acquire channels. They often store data that
helps them go to a selected channel more efficiently.

We are still on the same channel, but some of our PSIP parameters changed
after the encoder problem. If you can't get the receiver to see us after
re-setting the channels, you may need to contact the manufacturer for
further instructions."

I have a Dishnetwork 942 sattelite box that allows OTA reception, and a Pioneer PRO-1130HD with an ATSC tuner. I've "re-acquired" channels a bazillion times with no change. Seems odd to contact the manufacturer, since 2 different pieces of equipment with separate tuners have the same problem.

I've got a TERK directional antenna mounted on the exterior 2nd story, in Mar Vista (around Marina del Rey, Culver City). My other HD signals come in strong and true (with the usual, occasional squirreliness).

Any insights?

---Mark

Hi Mark,

I'm in your neighborhood (next to the SM Airport) and 28.1 has been the strongest signal I've been able to receive since I started with OTA in November. I know that doesn't help much, but my advice would be the incredibly unscientific "jiggle and reposition" method. :D

Good luck!

It may not be the signal... it may well continue to be the PSIP DATA.

Try looking at the channel on its actual digital UHF-Band channel (59.) If it shows up there and you still don't have it lock properly on the Point-To channel, you'll probably have to exchange your receivers or get new firmware for the PSIP data to show correctly.

58 KLCS is still out for me? anyone else?

I tried directly inputting the [i think its ] 41 [actual] channel and it "redirects" correctly to 58, shows 80% signal but no picture/sound.


thanks

It is actually misleading. With the exception of the HD chopper, the studio shots, and maybe a few pieces here and there, the vast majority of their material is still being done at 720x486, only now it's being done anamorphically, so the SD 4x3 viewers are actually seeing LESS resolution.

After two weeks of watching Eyewitness News | HD, I'm starting to notice what's in HD and what's not:

16:9 HD: studio cameras, Air 7 HD, Burbank and Long Beach cams, computer graphics (including the 7 day forecast).

16:9 SD component: filed field footage. They use Betacam SX in amorphic 16:9. The footage that is sent as tapes to the studio are better quality than the analog composite microwave transmissions.

16:9 SD composite: live field shots and filed footage sent via microwave (IE bureau chief Bob Banfield can only send stuff via microwave), Air 7, Irvine Spectrum/LAX/Disneyland/Malibu/Big Bear cams, Live Doppler 7000+ graphics.

4:3 SD composite with pillar bars: weather computer graphics and outside video sources, including freelance overnight footage.

After seeing the replay of the chase from Norwalk today, I can see that they do not have in-house HD recording capability for Air 7 HD; the replay was a horrid 16:9 SD composite video. Only the helicopter can record HD - still.

KCET and KLCS works for me. But I've noticed some lip sync issues recently with NBC and KCET. Anyone else notice it?

yes I have various audio sync issues

for example, Castaway on ABC in HD was all over the place. after each commercial break it came back different. sometimes in front sometimes behind, sometimes spot on.

it is astounding that multi billion dollar corporations like GE and Disney can fail so fundamentally on the tech front when PBS stations who scrape by on donations and grants can get it right.

I have had audio sync problems on NBC-HD both OTA and on Directv. KCET-DT and KLCS-DT both are fine. Mark, I had problems with KCET-DT a few months ago. The engineer recommended attenuating? the antenna. Their signal was overloading my Directv receiver. After hooking up our condos community antenna everything worded fine. I was using a Winegard 4 gang bowtie which should have received a much better signal.

(Does anybody know the answer? The following article does not answer the question.)

Dodgers announce 2006 television schedule; KCAL 9, FSN West 2 lead local telecasts
02/17/2006 4:06 PM ET
MLB.com

LOS ANGELES -- The Los Angeles Dodgers will divide their local broadcasts during the 2006 schedule between KCAL's telecast of 49 games and FSN West 2's airing of 100 games, the team announced Friday.

In addition to the KCAL and FSN West 2 airdates, the Dodgers will appear on national/regional telecasts, including FOX Saturdays and ESPN Sunday night games. Currently, the national/regional telecasts include FOX Saturday games against the Angels (May 20 & July 1), Nationals (May 27 & July 29), Phillies (June 3), Giants (July 8 & Aug. 12) and Cardinals (July 15), with additional games still to be announced. ESPN's Sunday Night Baseball coverage currently includes the game of April 16 against the Giants, with additional games to be determined.

"We're really looking forward to our new over the air partnership with KCAL and our continued relationship with FSN West 2," said Dodger Executive Vice President and Chief Operating Officer Marty Greenspun. "We have made a commitment to our fans to have all Dodger games televised and we're pleased that we'll be able to accomplish that goal again in 2006."

"KCAL has enjoyed a long, proud history as Southern California's leading local sports broadcaster," said Don Corsini, President & General Manager, KCAL 9 and sister station CBS 2. "We are committed to upholding this tradition of excellence as we begin our partnership with the Los Angeles Dodgers this season. We were blessed to have Chick Hearn on Channel 9 for 25 years and now we couldn't be more excited to welcome Vin Scully to the KCAL family.

"In addition to our 54 game broadcasts (including 49 regular season contests), we look forward to serving Dodger fans this season with daily comprehensive coverage of the team through our pre-game show and the 70 hours of live local news and sportscasts that KCAL 9 and CBS 2 produce each week."

As an added bonus for Dodger fans, FSN West 2 will televise 17 games in high definition during the 2006 season.

"2006 is FSN's 11th season as the telecast home of the Los Angeles Dodgers," said Steve Simpson, Vice President and General Manager, FSN West and FSN West 2. "Our ability to deliver relevant, entertaining coverage of the team reflects that history, but our passion and excitement continue to be as fresh today as it was on day one. This year, we are looking forward to expanding our coverage of the Dodgers and further serving the true Blue fan."

The Dodger road games for the Freeway Series with the Angels will air on KCAL on Saturday, April 1 at 7:05 p.m. and on FSNW2 on Sunday, April 2 at 12:05 p.m.

Hall of Fame broadcaster Vin Scully, entering his 57th season as the "Voice of the Dodgers," will call all televised Dodger home games and road contests against the team's National League Western Division opponents (San Francisco, San Diego, Arizona and Colorado) as well as this year's June Interleague contests against AL Western Division teams.

For Dodger road games against non-NL West opponents, the broadcast booth will be manned by Emmy Award-winning broadcaster Charley Steiner and former Major Leaguer Steve Lyons, who is returning for his second season.

http://losangeles.dodgers.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/content/printer_friendly/la/y2006/m02/d17/c1313903.jsp

(As an added bonus for Dodger fans, FSN West 2 will televise 17 games in high definition during the 2006 season.

Who offers FSNW2 HD programming in the LA area? Cable only? Not D* AFAIK. I guess most of us will be relegated to the occasional weekend OTA HD game (or maybe ESPNHD).

Last nite just before going to bed I decided to rotate my antenna to the south just to see if I coudl get any San Diego signals and a wierd thing happened. No I could not get any San Diego signal and I did not surprise me but !. All of a suddend when my antenna was pointing nearly due south the LA stations became available and not just one but all of them. I mean I was getting every channel known to man in the LA area it seems like.
At first I thouhgt it must be some kind of freaky propagation or multipath but I get up this morning and try it again and There still there. I even get signals like 66.1 Kcop and 61.1 Kcet and all the lower channels that were not coming in with the antenna pointed directly at MT Wilson are coming in better than I have ever seen them. Is it possile that I am pickin up a better signal off the side lobe of this Cm4228 antenna or is it more likely I just found the right rock to pick a bounced signal off of. All of the signal seem to be in the 70-80% range and a reported 17-22db.
Got to go to work but will anxiosly be waiting any comments.
Dave
Silly question: Which way is your antenna oriented for best results? Like an "arrow" pointing to Mt Wilson area, or like a "funnel"? Or maybe easier, where are the shortest elements of the array, toward the front or rear?

Silly question: Which way is your antenna oriented for best results? Like an "arrow" pointing to Mt Wilson area, or like a "funnel"? Or maybe easier, where are the shortest elements of the array, toward the front or rear?

Well My antenna is a flat panel 8 bowtie chm 4228 design so it has no elements like a combo uhf/vhf antenna.

Presently I am pointed almost exactly 90 degrees south of mt wilson. As I said in an earlier post I am actualy using the side lobe of the antenna ( not pointed directly at Mt Wilson. That will hopefully change soon as I have ordered two antenna Joiners so I can use them to filter out ch 24 analog and 26 digital. This I hope will allow me to point my antenna in the traditional way straight at Mt Wilson. I may try splitting the downlead on the rooftop antenna and then reinserting it onto the antenna joiners with some padding to see if I can get it all to work better.

The answer to this question is probably buried somewhere in the 31 preceding pages of this thread, but let me ask anyway:

What's the deal on DirecTv's guide info for KOCE (channel 50-1)? On the KOCE web site, they have complete listings for everything on this channel, but all I get from DirecTv is repeating 4 hours blocks of "High Definition Programming". Has anyone tried to contact DirecTv and get this resolved?

Silly question: Which way is your antenna oriented for best results? Like an "arrow" pointing to Mt Wilson area, or like a "funnel"? Or maybe easier, where are the shortest elements of the array, toward the front or rear?
Assuming you have a combo antenna, I believe the smaller 'fishbone'-like UHF portion of the antenna should point to Mt Wilson, not the larger VHF section.

The answer to this question is probably buried somewhere in the 31 preceding pages of this thread, but let me ask anyway:

What's the deal on DirecTv's guide info for KOCE (channel 50-1)? On the KOCE web site, they have complete listings for everything on this channel, but all I get from DirecTv is repeating 4 hours blocks of "High Definition Programming". Has anyone tried to contact DirecTv and get this resolved?

Its not a Directv issue, its a KOCE issue. KOCE is not supplying program info to Tribune (or whatever company gives D* the guide data.) I haven't been able to find KOCE 50-1 program infr anywhere other than their website. I contacted KOCE a couple of months ago about this and got a canned answer that was something like "Please check our website for program information".

The graphics for Live Doppler 7000+ looks sharper today than it did yesterday (when it rained). Looks like they upgraded the computer graphics card to output HD finally. I know my ATI Radeon 9600 can output HD via component, I'm wondering if the Live Doppler 7000+ computer (which runs on Win2K) has a Radeon?

http://img136.imageshack.us/img136/3203/livedoppler7000hd2ob.th.jpg (http://img136.imageshack.us/my.php?image=livedoppler7000hd2ob.jpg)

The graphics for Live Doppler 7000+ looks sharper today than it did yesterday (when it rained). Looks like they upgraded the computer graphics card to output HD finally. I know my ATI Radeon 9600 can output HD via component, I'm wondering if the Live Doppler 7000+ computer (which runs on Win2K) has a Radeon?



http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/7132/kabcdt8hu.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

You see anything ATI in the taskbar :D


They'll never live that one down.

Its not a Directv issue, its a KOCE issue. KOCE is not supplying program info to Tribune (or whatever company gives D* the guide data.) I haven't been able to find KOCE 50-1 program infr anywhere other than their website. I contacted KOCE a couple of months ago about this and got a canned answer that was something like "Please check our website for program information".

Good news (I hope). Emailed KOCE about this and got this response:

Dear Steve,

If I understood your question correctly, you have it right. We are channel 50-1, and the guide gives you that 4 hours block message because the HD programming schedule isn't published - yet. The program guide would only be for the "regular" channel, 50. The HD schedule is in the works here, and hopefully it will be up before long. I'll save your email and try to let you know when we are going to launch it.

Thanks again for watching!!

Kindest regards,
Lainie King
Customer Relations Associate

I agree with what has already been observed, namely that KNBC-DT's lip-sync problem is most pronounced on videotaped shows (e.g. Leno, Conan, etc.). It is much less noticeable on filmed shows (e.g. "Las Vegas") but I'm still sure I see it on film as well. I'll re-confirm on Friday night when LV returns.

But right now I'm watching a recording of "Deal or No Deal" (sorry, it's true) from Monday night. I have Comcast, DCT6412. And I must say the lip-sync problem is visible. And again... videotape.

Will they ever fix it?

http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/7132/kabcdt8hu.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

You see anything ATI in the taskbar :D


They'll never live that one down.

Before they shoved Live Doppler 7000 into that little window on 7-3 (back when it was fullscreen), there were times when the system went down and the computer rebooted on air! That's how I know they use Windows 2000.

My Comcast 6412 (or me!) screwed up Sunday night, and it turns out I lost my recording of Sunday night's Olympics closing ceremonies. I really wanted to watch it.

Does anybody still have it on your DVR, or maybe offloaded or recorded to D-VHS, so that I could watch it?

Please PM me.

Thanks.


P.S. - had a call back from KNBC-DT "inside guy" today. They are still trying to locate the cause of the lip-sync problem. Interestingly, they were watching a WNBC-DT newscast feed (out of NY) the other day and saw a very bad example. They've also had feedback from D* engineers from subscribers who've also been complaining.

Plus, I had a response from a Philadelphia forum member who says he sees the lip-sync problem there as well... and again, almost always on videotaped shows.

So NBC is truly aware of the problem, but just can't seem to figure out what's behind it. However they are genuinely working on it.

Is anyone else fed up with having to grab the remote to turn down the audio when tuning to KCBS DT? I know there has been discussion about how KCBS has the only correct audio levels, but, lets deal with some reality...all my HD channels all seem to reasonably match with the exception of KCBS. Could HBO, Showtime, HD net channels, Discovery, and the over the air channels all be wrong? Maybe KCBS is, technically, the only one with the correct audio levels and everyone else is wrong. In the real world, the average viewer doesn't care or know anything about the technical aspects of TV. All the viewer cares and notices is the inconvience of having to adjust their TV sets for only one channel.
For me, I just avoid going there unless I know I have something to watch. It's just easier!
It's amazing they have some of the best looking pictures going and can't seem to get a handle on the audio.

I am looking for a good HDTV-Antanna installer in Orange County (CA)

Can anyone recommend one ?
This is for OTA HDTV broadcast

Find it very hard to find someone in my area (Orange)

Thanks

Ron

Good news (I hope). Emailed KOCE about this and got this response:

Dear Steve,

If I understood your question correctly, you have it right. We are channel 50-1, and the guide gives you that 4 hours block message because the HD programming schedule isn't published - yet. The program guide would only be for the "regular" channel, 50. The HD schedule is in the works here, and hopefully it will be up before long. I'll save your email and try to let you know when we are going to launch it.

Thanks again for watching!!

Kindest regards,
Lainie King
Customer Relations Associate


The lack of a schedule has been an issue for almost a year with KOCE HD...

as of 5pm ABC HD local news seem to have fixed the lack of center channel audio in 5.1 !

just hope its not temporary or a glitch

KTTV ?
I noticed that back in January, there was a problem with KTTV's signal strength, is this still a problem?
I just installed an OTA and 11-1 is the only channel I can't receive.
Any insight would be appreciated!

It was low at one point, but it's been okay for awhile now. I'm in Rancho Cucamonga, and I get that and all the other channels from Mt. Wilson at 85 to 95 signal strength. I'm using the 91XG with terrific results!

I'm trying to get an idea of how good or bad the OTA reception is in Mission Viejo, and specifically around the Pacific Hills neighborhood, around Marguerite and La Paz, etc... Thanks.

I'm trying to get an idea of how good or bad the OTA reception is in Mission Viejo, and specifically around the Pacific Hills neighborhood, around Marguerite and La Paz, etc... Thanks.

Try looking up your address into www.antennaweb.org. It will give you an idea of what size antenna you need at your location- at least its a starting point.

What happened to KCET HD?????

What happened to KCET HD?????

The whole digital channel (both HD & SD) seems to have a fairly longstanding problem. It was still bad as of 9 AM this morning.

Thank you for that confirmation.

I show a very strong signal on both 28-1 and 28-2 but no data. Also 28-3 was there showing "Create" but never any data on that subchannel. Now 28-3 is gone.

I searched their website but there is nothing about any problem.

Analog channel 28 is OK.

Thank you for that confirmation.

I show a very strong signal on both 28-1 and 28-2 but no data. Also 28-3 was there showing "Create" but never any data on that subchannel. Now 28-3 is gone.

I searched their website but there is nothing about any problem.

Analog channel 28 is OK.

My signal from the analog transmitter, when everthing is OK, is just enough to give me a good picture. For several weeks now, after the storm that knocked out some of the Mt. Wilson transmitters, KCET's analog signal has been maginal, I get a somewhat snowy picture. I think they are down in transmitter power since that storm.

My signal from the analog transmitter, when everthing is OK, is just enough to give me a good picture. For several weeks now, after the storm that knocked out some of the Mt. Wilson transmitters, KCET's analog signal has been maginal, I get a somewhat snowy picture. I think they are down in transmitter power since that storm.

The digital transmitter is entirely different than the analog transmitter (chan 59 rather than chan 28) so info about analog just doesn't apply to digital problems. KCET-HD and SD have been fine until sometime yesterday.

In this case, I've looked at the digital stream with VideoReDo and the Audio PID's show as Private PES rather than Audio. I can actually see and play both subchannels with VideoReDo but my Fusion card doesn't show anything and the MYHD card only picks it up intermittently. I'm investigating more with TSReaderLite and I'll try to contact engineering at KCET if the problem isn't fixed soon.

Big Bad:

Google Earth shows the intersection of Marguerite and La Paz to be at 433 feet elevation.

There are some 600 foot elevations to the north of you.

If I was you, I would buy a cheap outdoor antenna and see what you could get. Then you could consider bigger antenna and a preamp if necessary.

I am receiving the LA stations well here in SM. I am at 615 feet above sea level.

In this case, I've looked at the digital stream with VideoReDo and the Audio PID's show as Private PES rather than Audio. I can actually see and play both subchannels with VideoReDo but my Fusion card doesn't show anything and the MYHD card only picks it up intermittently. I'm investigating more with TSReaderLite and I'll try to contact engineering at KCET if the problem isn't fixed soon.

KCET-HD & SD problems have been fixed.

The digital transmitter is entirely different than the analog transmitter (chan 59 rather than chan 28) so info about analog just doesn't apply to digital problems. KCET-HD and SD have been fine until sometime yesterday.

In this case, I've looked at the digital stream with VideoReDo and the Audio PID's show as Private PES rather than Audio. I can actually see and play both subchannels with VideoReDo but my Fusion card doesn't show anything and the MYHD card only picks it up intermittently. I'm investigating more with TSReaderLite and I'll try to contact engineering at KCET if the problem isn't fixed soon.

I'm aware of that, but that is not entirely true. The transmitters share infrastucture (power supply, antenna tower, building etc.). It is also clear that there are some problems on Mt. Wilson whether or not it effects the digital transmitter, it might.

Anyone catch the KABC news this afternoon? I have never seen the picture of downtown, in back of the anchors, look so realistic. Either they replaced the rear screen projector or they changed the camera. In any case it looked like a painting. Very nice.

I'm down in south Orange County. Had a storm rumble thru last night. I just went bring up my HTPC with a MYHD MDP-120 card and it says no signal. I went to the DTC-100 and it too says no signal. Anybody else have reception problems tonight?

Just asking before I get out the ladder and start checking all the cables and amp. First time in 5 years of HD have I ever lost my OTA signal for hours.

Thanks.

Anyone catch the KABC news this afternoon? I have never seen the picture of downtown, in back of the anchors, look so realistic. Either they replaced the rear screen projector or they changed the camera. In any case it looked like a painting. Very nice.

KABC just upgraded the downtown cam to HD last week. Prior to that, only the Burbank and Long Beach cams were HD. When they were working on upgrading the Downtown LA cam, KABC used the Burbank cam as the temporary backdrop of the anchors, which marked the first time an HD backdrop was used, and it looked really good compared to the old SD downtown cam. Now that the downtown cam is in HD, they have the most clearest live HD news studio backdrop. Another first from ABC 7!

I live in Oceanside and use an XG-91 antenna with great results picking up the LA stations. I just moved from Riverside, and with the exception of KABC, I get much better reception than I had before.

I get the following signal strength ranges on my Fushion HDTV card (much better receiver than my old samsung stb & dish 942)

KCBS 90-96
NBC4 83-89
KTLA 87-91
KCAL 77-82
KTTV 82-89

but only 29-34 on KABC? Is this because of their low power transmission? Do they plan on cranking up the signal?

Need my Lost in HD.

Have you tried San Diego's KGTV 10?

We live in Echo Park (near Dodger Stadium) and KABC 7 is problematic for us too. When they launched their HD newscasts I thought what a waste when you can't always pick up their digital signal. The picture comes and goes depending on atmospheric conditions.

Anyone notice the audio for American Idol on FOX KTTV is not 5.1 ch? It's 5.1 during the commercial breaks but when the show comes back on it goes down to 2 ch.

951, look below.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7288917&&#post7288917

I am in Riverside, (close to downtown Riverside) and I now get all Major channels above 89 (mostly 96-99) using an old 50" antenna on my roof... Including KABC which seems elusive for a lot of people.

I just re-pointed my antenna last nite and it changed from barely receiving CBS/FOX/UPN and ABC.. to receiving them perfectly!!! I'll check them again tonight to make sure that it doesn't drop to 30... I Made sure to use antennaweb.org and put in your full address, that way I was able to point my antenna very easily! I am not using an amp for the antenna and I have a VOOM (Motorola DSR550) receiver.. which by the way receives the signals better than an SIR-T451 That I returned last week (if you can go away with the e-guide not working).

4-4 [NBC] appeared last night, looks like a live cam shot? no 4-3 though. and 28-3 has gone.

still have issues with NBC shows mis flagged for 5.1 [like Scrubs]

I have been getting OTA fine for over 5 years. Since I finalized my setup 3 years ago and up until this year I got KABC digital fine. Maybe only seeing conditions that caused it to be marginal maybe twice in 3 years. Now since Jan 1st I get it maybe only half of the time. Has anyone else noticed this or is it something that has happined to my setup?

Any comments would be appreciated.

Rick R

I recently installed the Lacrosse amplified antenna on my roof and all the OTA HD stations are now rock-solid. I have direct view of the Mt. Wilson antenna farm (18 miles away in La Verne) and eye-balled the antenna alignment. I should have done this along time ago instead of fiddling with an indoor antenna. Although the Olympics and CBS-HD are impressive, KOCE HD is truly beautiful.

Rick, my KABC and other channels are fine from Rancho Cucamonga. I use the XG91 and Ratshack STB.

Is there anything we can do to convince 5, 7 and 9 to run their 4x3 programming at a proper 4x3 ratio? I've had it up to here with everybody on these three stations (especially 5!) looking like fat dwarfs. Seems like the newscasters, at least, on 5 and 9 would be up in arms about it, since it makes them look huge.

Or am I the only one who can't stand to watch it? If anyone else is as sensitive to it as I am, then it's GOT to be costing them viewers.

Is there anything we can do to convince 5, 7 and 9 to run their 4x3 programming at a proper 4x3 ratio? I've had it up to here with everybody on these three stations (especially 5!) looking like fat dwarfs. Seems like the newscasters, at least, on 5 and 9 would be up in arms about it, since it makes them look huge.

Or am I the only one who can't stand to watch it? If anyone else is as sensitive to it as I am, then it's GOT to be costing them viewers.
I haven't noticed that at all. What shows? I'll assume you've checked that your TV's not in some 'stretch' mode, right? Only time I've had that problem is some "HD" programs on TNT-HD via D*.

they do show 4/3 wider on some channels, but I think its by zoom/crop, not stretch

[you can tell sometimes because credits/info on screen get clipped]

aspect appears to remain intact

I just installed a winegard PR8800 in my attic pointing to MT Wilson from my house in Glendale. I can't get KABC or KCAL9. Everything else is fine. KCOP and WB occasionally drops. CBS, NBC, FOX, KCET, KPBS are rock solid. All of the mexican stations are clear too... So what is the trick to getting KABC and KCAL? I'm frustrated.

Kelly, you may need some hieght on your antenna or try tilting it up a bit. Do you have a clear shot or do some of the mountains obscure your view?

I did notice the NBC 4-4 channel, but not much on it, its ID is "coming" I guess they use it as a test/future channel

I haven't noticed that at all. What shows? I'll assume you've checked that your TV's not in some 'stretch' mode, right? Only time I've had that problem is some "HD" programs on TNT-HD via D*.

You haven't noticed it on KTLA???? Wow, guess I'm the only one bothered by it then.

It's on *all* program material that's originally 4x3, unless it's something being fed from the network during HD programming. My TV (and EyeTV 500) are definitely not in a stretch mode on just three channels! It's the stations that are doing it, and whereas there may be some cropping going on, a horizontal stretch is also a big part of it.

Do they do this in other markets, or is LA just lucky?

You haven't noticed it on KTLA???? Wow, guess I'm the only one bothered by it then.

It's on *all* program material that's originally 4x3, unless it's something being fed from the network during HD programming. My TV (and EyeTV 500) are definitely not in a stretch mode on just three channels! It's the stations that are doing it, and whereas there may be some cropping going on, a horizontal stretch is also a big part of it.

Do they do this in other markets, or is LA just lucky?

I notice it, I hate it too. :eek:

I actually know one of the KTLA news guys and his head is that shape...

I believe I get 9 as 4:3 [hardly ever watch it

but if i remember correctly, 13 does crop and zoom also

most other SD 4:3 stuff shows up as 4:3 for me. ie 7-2, 28-2, 50-2, 58, 56

is this OTA or via satellite?

Finally, KNBC is back to HD. All this week they have had no HD on Jay Leno and other shows. Last night (Wed 3/22/06) they went back to HD.

Rick R

You haven't noticed it on KTLA???? Wow, guess I'm the only one bothered by it then.

It's on *all* program material that's originally 4x3, unless it's something being fed from the network during HD programming. My TV (and EyeTV 500) are definitely not in a stretch mode on just three channels! It's the stations that are doing it, and whereas there may be some cropping going on, a horizontal stretch is also a big part of it.

Do they do this in other markets, or is LA just lucky?
I hate the stretch on KABC and other stations. I mean I really hate it. I ranted and raved 4 years ago and all it did is get me upset so I quit ranting and raving.

Now I just watch SD satellite if a show is not HD so I do not get the stretch. Even though the satellite is not as good a picture as OTA, it is not stretched.

I WILL NOT watch stretched, that is it.

Rick R

NBC audio is so far out of sync at times [saturday afternoon] it looks like a badly dubbed foreign movie

all these DTV issues are really pathetic for multi billion dollar corporations.

If your STB is connected to your TV via component, you will see many HD programs as being stretched. I think the reason is because the scaling is different for analog interface. I had an STB connected via HDMI and also a TV with built-in tuner, and all the HD programs appear to be correctly proportioned. Almost all news programs are in 4:3, with black bars left and right. Only ABC has proper 16:9 news I think. If you don't believe me, try connecting via HDMI and see. Digital scaling appears to be more flexible.

Kelly, you may need some hieght on your antenna or try tilting it up a bit. Do you have a clear shot or do some of the mountains obscure your view?

It turns out I was 180 degrees off. Ya...I was not aware that my house was facing North until I saw a birdeye view of it on google earth. So I turned the antenna around, and I get ALL the channels at 80%+ strength! The antenna is inside my attic and I am surrounded by tall mountains. The thing that helped me the most is my location: within 10 miles from all the towers.

If your STB is connected to your TV via component, you will see many HD programs as being stretched. I think the reason is because the scaling is different for analog interface. I had an STB connected via HDMI and also a TV with built-in tuner, and all the HD programs appear to be correctly proportioned. Almost all news programs are in 4:3, with black bars left and right. Only ABC has proper 16:9 news I think. If you don't believe me, try connecting via HDMI and see. Digital scaling appears to be more flexible.

Let's back up here a second. Most non-network programming (and some lower-budget network stuff as well) is still produced in 4x3 standard definition. The local news on KABC is a notable exception, but since it's already 16x9 HD to start with, it's not relevant to what we're talking about here. The major local stations (the ones with their analog signals on VHF) all transmit their main channel in HD 24/7, so whenever they show a standard definition 4x3 program, that program is upconverted to a HD widescreen format, with bars on the sides.

When channels 5, 7 and 9 do the upconvert, they are stretching the picture horizontally to widen the picture and shrink the bars. This makes circles look like ovals, Civics look like limos, and Kate Moss look like Anna Nicole Smith. I do not like this.

I'm using a DVI connection, and receiving my signals OTA. My Sony TV does not allow reformatting of HD video, so I'm stuck with the stretch. My only escape is to watch the NTSC channels.

9's stretch is admittedly pretty minimal, and I'm not real sure why they bother, or even if it's on purpose. 7's is annoying, and 5's is ridiculous.

If you don't believe me, try getting a ruler and measuring. You may use 2, 4, 11 and 13 as your control group--they upconvert their 4x3 stuff properly. (Well, 4's is a tad off-center vertically, but that's another topic.)

I'm not accusing anybody of stretching true HD programming. I doubt most of the local stations could do that even if they wanted to. Regarding the channels and subchannels that are transmitted in standard definition (7-2, 56-1 etc.), well, they're in standard definition, so any stretching there would obviously be on the receiving end. That's not what I'm talking about here.

I hate the stretch on KABC and other stations. I mean I really hate it. I ranted and raved 4 years ago and all it did is get me upset so I quit ranting and raving.

Now I just watch SD satellite if a show is not HD so I do not get the stretch. Even though the satellite is not as good a picture as OTA, it is not stretched.

I WILL NOT watch stretched, that is it.

Rick R


If you look at 5 and 7 closely it appears they do more of a crop than a stretch. I rarely see anything, that is of value to the picture, be lost. A slight crop or stretch compared to pictures that have almost no resolution from satellite, I'll stick with the minor crop/stretch and be minorly irriated.

I've been working on building an HTPC based on an Nvidia 6150/430 motherboard, AMD Athlon 64 3700+ processor and an Avermedia A180 ATSC tuner card. With a ChannelMaster 4-bowtie UHF antenna in the attic, all 22 major channels and 47 minor channels are received with excellent signal strength. With the exception of primetime KNBC dramas and KPXT-DT, everything was working well. KNBC 2.1 (1080i) and KPXN 30.2 (480p) tended to have steady video stutter and audio lag. Primetime KNBC dramas (e.g. Law&Order and Conviction) had the worst stutter and lag, but Jay Leno seemed okay!?

From another AVS thread I followed a suggestion of replacing the Avermedia recording/playback application SW with something like BeyondTV. So I downloaded the trial version of BeyondTV 4.2, and no more problems with KNBC last night!

But now I'm seeing new problems with KCOP-DT/LA13/UPN on 13.1. Not only are there random frame freezes, there are occasional pixelation errors. The artifacts are sometimes horizontal lines or sometimes large areas in the lower 2/3rds of the screen. Both the Avermedia and BeyondTV software exhibit these problems on channel 13.1. The only other time I had seen some minor pixelation was during a rainstorm.

During the BeyondTV install all channels reported 98% signal strength, which seems to confirm the Avermedia signal meter.

Is anyone else seeing these issues with channel 13.1?

If you look at 5 and 7 closely it appears they do more of a crop than a stretch. I rarely see anything, that is of value to the picture, be lost. A slight crop or stretch compared to pictures that have almost no resolution from satellite, I'll stick with the minor crop/stretch and be minorly irriated.

Yeah, what is their rationale for this? Is it one of those "common folks will freak out when they see black bars" train of thought, like the rationale for pan&scan? It's very irritating.

If you look at 5 and 7 closely it appears they do more of a crop than a stretch. I rarely see anything, that is of value to the picture, be lost. A slight crop or stretch compared to pictures that have almost no resolution from satellite, I'll stick with the minor crop/stretch and be minorly irriated.
I believe that 5 does more of a crop than a stretch as you say. However 7 does a stretch that makes, as another poster stated, Kate Moss look like Anna Nicole Smith.

Rick R

[snip]But now I'm seeing new problems with KCOP-DT/LA13/UPN on 13.1. Not only are there random frame freezes, there are occasional pixelation errors. The artifacts are sometimes horizontal lines or sometimes large areas in the lower 2/3rds of the screen. Both the Avermedia and BeyondTV software exhibit these problems on channel 13.1. The only other time I had seen some minor pixelation was during a rainstorm.

During the BeyondTV install all channels reported 98% signal strength, which seems to confirm the Avermedia signal meter.

Is anyone else seeing these issues with channel 13.1?

Yes, every day. I see exactly the same thing. KCOP is the village idiot when it comes to digital transmissions.

NBC audio is so far out of sync at times [saturday afternoon] it looks like a badly dubbed foreign movie

all these DTV issues are really pathetic for multi billion dollar corporations.


I'm on Charter Cable in Burbank, but NBC for me has HORRID audio problems. Their levels are never anywhere near close going from program to commercial. And even between commercials.... I'm constantly grabbing the remote to crank down the volume.

The HD feed seems to be rather low, as opposed to being zeroed out.

It turns out I was 180 degrees off. Ya...I was not aware that my house was facing North until I saw a birdeye view of it on google earth. So I turned the antenna around, and I get ALL the channels at 80%+ strength! The antenna is inside my attic and I am surrounded by tall mountains. The thing that helped me the most is my location: within 10 miles from all the towers.

I’m in Diamond Bar and have pretty much a straight shot, but I loose all of the channel 7 digital channels at about 4:30 in the afternoon except on days like this when it’s overcast and/or raining. The channel 28 (PBS) channels go too. My antenna is an ollllld Weinguard, I think.

I’m sure it’s an atmospheric thing. I’ve been contemplating a new larger antenna with more elements might take care of it or is there something else i should be looking at?

Tom, just a heads up for you. I use the XG91 from Cucamonga and get all my Mt. Wilson channels fine.

I'll look into it.

Thanks!

I have been getting OTA fine for over 5 years. Since I finalized my setup 3 years ago and up until this year I got KABC digital fine. Maybe only seeing conditions that caused it to be marginal maybe twice in 3 years. Now since Jan 1st I get it maybe only half of the time. Has anyone else noticed this or is it something that has happined to my setup?

Any comments would be appreciated.

Rick R

with the winds lately, I have noticed that 7 is not as solid as it used to be. it used to be the most solid and now its pretty much the first to lose reception

However, they also heavily trimmed an enormous tree in my building which was between me and MT Wilson .

I thought my reception/stability would improve but its actually gotten worse.

Moreover, my reception used to improve when it rained, now it doesnt

all part of the mystery of OTA DTV

I also noticed that 7.1 (and 5.1, 11.1) have had poor reception lately. Wedesday night things improved somewhat. Maybe the rain was to blame, but this had never been an issue before for me.

I talked with one of the Mt. Wilson RF engineers recently. I described
problems I have with channel 7 (both analog and digital) after a heavy rain.
BTW, the problem isn't at my end as the antenna on which I experience
this problem stays dry in my attic. While he couldn't think of anything
caused by the rain, he mentioned that channel 7's antenna sits behind
other stations on the hill, and channel 7's RF passes through antenna's
of other stations on it's way to my house. The other antenna in the
direct path could be perturbing channel 7's signal, e.g., other antennas
could shunt channel 7's signal down their antenna/feed, then back out.

He also said that if you stood at the base of a transmitting antenna
in the morning, then in the afternoon, you could see the antenna flex
based on heating from the sun. And, that transmitting antenna movement
pretty much negated attempts by viewers to fine tune the position of
their receiving antennas, particularly at UHF frequencies.

I've checked the locals forums as well as elsewhere. I'm curious as to what has happened to KCET HD in LA. I've checked 28-1 and 28-2 and it's the same SD programming on both - haven't seen any PBS HD for several days. If they're dumping HD, why broadcast on two channels?

Anybody heard anything about this?

Anybody having bad breakup on KCBS-DT during primetime?

Last night's Survivor and CSI were essentially unwatchable for me on Comcast DVR, but I only got to discover this after the shows had been on and been recorded. So I didn't have an opportunity to check OTA to see if the problem was from the local network or from Comcast.

Anybody else notice?

This is not the first time I've had the same problem with primetime KCBS-DT. A few weeks back Amazing Race had exactly the same issue.

I don't watch much else on CBS during primetime, but I'll check tonight just to see what's going on.

I don't know how long this has been up. But KTLA has a new sub channel 5.2 called "The Tube" and it's a pretty good music video channel.

Here is a web site I found for this new channel, thetubetv_com

They moved their spanish simalcast to 5.3.

with the winds lately, I have noticed that 7 is not as solid as it used to be. it used to be the most solid and now its pretty much the first to lose reception

Moreover, my reception used to improve when it rained, now it doesnt

all part of the mystery of OTA DTV
Your right, I remember last year where rain improved my channel 7 reception. Now rain destroys it.

Actually lately rain destroys reception and wind destroys reception. Always something.

He also said that if you stood at the base of a transmitting antenna
in the morning, then in the afternoon, you could see the antenna flex
based on heating from the sun. And, that transmitting antenna movement
pretty much negated attempts by viewers to fine tune the position of
their receiving antennas, particularly at UHF frequencies.
There was an article in the N.Y.Times last year where I was quoted as saying at sundown channel 7 reception got lots of breakups. This I believe may explain that.

Rick R

I don't know how long this has been up. But KTLA has a new sub channel 5.2 called "The Tube" and it's a pretty good music video channel.

Here is a web site I found for this new channel, thetubetv_com

They moved their spanish simalcast to 5.3.


The channel has been up in LA since Monday, I sent them an email since I was glad they started to broadcast digital OTA, the channel used to be on KU FTA satellite.

____________________________________________________________ __
Hello Qwert1515,

We will posted our information on the website as soon as we get a confirmation as to the channel information on digital cable.

We just signed with KTLA and plan to have the official launch in May and will update the website around that time.

Thanks for writing. We are all excited to be in LA full power in the next few months!

Spread the word!

Take care,

Ali

I get the 5.2 channel but its in 5.1 audio [and all center channel]and as a music station they should probably be in stereo.

the flag might be wrong?? -- exactly the opposite of the NBC/ABC flag no center channel problems

I talked with one of the Mt. Wilson RF engineers recently. I described
problems I have with channel 7 (both analog and digital) after a heavy rain.
BTW, the problem isn't at my end as the antenna on which I experience
this problem stays dry in my attic.

He also said that if you stood at the base of a transmitting antenna
in the morning, then in the afternoon, you could see the antenna flex
based on heating from the sun. And, that transmitting antenna movement
pretty much negated attempts by viewers to fine tune the position of
their receiving antennas, particularly at UHF frequencies.

That sounds pretty unlikely to me... a movement of one or two degrees maximum is highly unlikely to have any effect. Receiving antennas also are not so precisely directional that a relatively small movement of the broadcast tower caused by expansion/contraction would be noticable.

I'm wondering if you are experiencing multipath, which can become worse during a rain storm. You don't say where you are located, are you close to the foothills? People in those areas seem to have more difficulty because of signal reflection (multipath) issues.

Kevin

That sounds pretty unlikely to me... a movement of one or two degrees maximum is highly unlikely to have any effect. Receiving antennas also are not so precisely directional that a relatively small movement of the broadcast tower caused by expansion/contraction would be noticable.

I'm wondering if you are experiencing multipath, which can become worse during a rain storm. You don't say where you are located, are you close to the foothills? People in those areas seem to have more difficulty because of signal reflection (multipath) issues.

Kevin

My rain issue is "...after a heavy rain", not during a heavy rain. The problem sometimes persists for days afterward. E.g., I see the problem now, and it stopped raining over 10 hours ago. And, since it occurs on both their analog (174-180 MHz) and digital (704-710 MHz) signals, I assumed it to be a channel 7 transmitter/antenna issue. That channel 7's antenna sits at the back of the hill, and that its signal passes through other station's antennas, could be relevant. I do not know.

The separate paragraph on transmitter tower movement was unrelated to my rain issue. My colleague's comments were simply to dissuade users from spending excessive time "fine tuning" the location of their antenna, particularly on a roof, as the RF "hot spot" could change during the day. He also talked at length about looking at Mt. Wilson as a whole, and the "slotting" of signals coming off the hill.

Finally, I don't live "...close to the foothills", nor have I observed channel 7 multipath on a spectrum analyzer. And, FWIW, I am familiar with the RF environment there--I have UHF repeater at the base of Mt. Wilson, and watch my signal (and others) closely. But, I am by no means an expert on Mt. Wilson's analog/digital TV RF issues. I rely on my colleague for that information, which I was simply passing along as a professional courtesy.

Anyone else w/DirecTv notice we finally got guide info for 50-1? Yea!

BTW, the problem isn't at my end as the antenna on which I experience this problem stays dry in my attic.

A dry antenna is no guarantee of good reception if the roof is wet or soaked. Water/moisture will absorb the RF signal, according to
http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ANTENNAS/glossaryA.html#attic


Regards

I've checked the locals forums as well as elsewhere. I'm curious as to what has happened to KCET HD in LA. I've checked 28-1 and 28-2 and it's the same SD programming on both - haven't seen any PBS HD for several days. If they're dumping HD, why broadcast on two channels?

Anybody heard anything about this?

KCET seems to have a unsual transmission schedule; it does not seem to be on 24/7. Occasionally I get black screens for 28.1 and 28.2. Sometimes the analog signal goes dark at midnight or early morning.

Alright, got my first HD capable TV this past weekend. I'm reading and reading, but thought I'd post as I read to see if this is correct.. Is it possible that i can get HDTV channels OTA without an outdoor antenna? Someone mentioned the Zenith Silver Sensor. All I would need is this on top of my HDTV and no outdoor antenna?

I went to antennaweb and seems that I'm 15.5 to 16.9 miles from 20 or so digital channels. Compass orientation is between 286 and 289 degrees.

If this is correct.. anyone know a local retailer that sells the Silver Sensor.. or is my best bet Amazon for $20?

EDIT: Local Sears, Circuit City, no longer carry the Zenith Silver Sensor. I went ahead and ordered it from amazon, hopefully I can get it to work.

Since you are only about 15 Miles away from the transmitters you should be able to get away with an indoor antenna, that is as long as there are no multipath problems (same signals arriving at to the receiver at different times), and your house does not block too much of the signal.

Good Luck

Angels, FSN West Reach Deal
By Mike Reynolds 4/3/2006 6:02:00 PM

After months of trying to negotiate a long-term extension, Major League Baseball’s Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim and FSN West finally inked an agreement Sunday.

Via a 10-year deal, terms of which were not disclosed, FSN will carry 100 games per season, versus the 50 it was slated to carry under a contract that was scheduled to expire after the 2008 season, according to network officials. An additional 50 games will be aired by KCOP.

Published reports had indicated that FSN was willing to pay some $500 million for the long-term pact, which the parties had been close to signing off on since mid-February. Last Wednesday, the Angels broke off negotiations over what published reports described as emerging technologies. Angels owner Arthur Moreno had sought to establish his own network, beginning with the 2009 season.

The first game of the 2006 season on FSN West airs Monday at 2 p.m. (PST) with the Angels visiting the Seattle Mariners.

"FSN is proud to be the local home of the Angels for the 2006 season and beyond. The Angels have been one of baseball's most competitive and best-run teams since Arte Moreno purchased the franchise, and we are happy to continue our long-term relationship with the club," FSN chief operating officer Randy Freer said in a prepared statement.

"FSN West is the home of local sports fans across Southern California,” he added. “We will continue to do our very best to provide the most access, analysis, information and in-depth coverage of Angels baseball."

"We're pleased to announce the completion of this 10-year agreement with FSN West," Angels president Dennis Kuhl said. "This partnership will enable Angels fans to watch at least 150 games on local television. With the addition of national game broadcasts, fans will have the opportunity to watch the Angels on a daily basis."

http://www.multichannel.com/article/CA6321235.html?display=Breaking+News

So will any of this Angel season be in HD? "Emerging Technologies=HD?)
:confused:

We don't even know if any more than 50 games will be shown on TV at all!

Alright, got my first HD capable TV this past weekend. I'm reading and reading, but thought I'd post as I read to see if this is correct.. Is it possible that i can get HDTV channels OTA without an outdoor antenna? Someone mentioned the Zenith Silver Sensor. All I would need is this on top of my HDTV and no outdoor antenna?

I went to antennaweb and seems that I'm 15.5 to 16.9 miles from 20 or so digital channels. Compass orientation is between 286 and 289 degrees.

If this is correct.. anyone know a local retailer that sells the Silver Sensor.. or is my best bet Amazon for $20?

EDIT: Local Sears, Circuit City, no longer carry the Zenith Silver Sensor. I went ahead and ordered it from amazon, hopefully I can get it to work.

I just connected a cheapie $10 rabbit ear antenna and let my TV add/delete OTA channels on its own and it seems I'm getting HD channels already. Some are coming in choppy and audio is sometimes weird. But I guess this will all improve a bit with the Silver Sensor.

I had tried these rabbit ears before but didn't do the Auto add/delete on the TV.

I've noticed people post the signal strength levels in percentages for their OTA digital channels. Anyone know where I can see this info on a Mitsubishi WD-52525?

Should I be posting this here? Maybe I should be posting in the Official AVS Antenna Topic (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=381623).

EDIT: Signal strength on the 52525 is menu 2 4 7 0, but it displays 0-10 instead of %.

I just connected a cheapie $10 rabbit ear antenna and let my TV add/delete OTA channels on its own and it seems I'm getting HD channels already. Some are coming in choppy and audio is sometimes weird. But I guess this will all improve a bit with the Silver Sensor.

I helped hookup a friend's HD setup and so far, using only a cheapie indoor antenna, it does the trick. As you mentioned, some dropouts, but not bad at all considering it saved us a 2nd story antenna install. And, AFAIK, it's the loop and not the "rabbit ears" that give you the UHF reception you need for digital OTA HD signals.

Has anybody heard about KNBC's new subchannel, News Raw?

http://www.laobserved.com/archive/2006/04/knbc_plans_to_get_raw.html

Has anybody heard about KNBC's new subchannel, News Raw?

http://www.laobserved.com/archive/2006/04/knbc_plans_to_get_raw.html

With WNBC in New York using 4.4 for showing amateur films, I was wondering what other NBC O&Os are doing. Looks like this is the answer for L.A.

KNBC-DT has had some problems with lip sync during HD programming, sometimes it's worse than others. I understand they have a new engineering staff coming in. Is this true?

Anybody having bad breakup on KCBS-DT during primetime?

Last night's Survivor and CSI were essentially unwatchable for me on Comcast DVR, but I only got to discover this after the shows had been on and been recorded. So I didn't have an opportunity to check OTA to see if the problem was from the local network or from Comcast.

Anybody else notice?

This is not the first time I've had the same problem with primetime KCBS-DT. A few weeks back Amazing Race had exactly the same issue.

I don't watch much else on CBS during primetime, but I'll check tonight just to see what's going on.
I don't recall normally having problems with KCBS-DT, but for the last couple of weeks or so I've been getting a LOT of breakups. I was wondering if anyone else had this problem. I watch (record) quite a bit of KCBS programming, and much of it has been pretty unwatchable lately.

On another note... We often watch the KTLA Morning News. It seems that lately the in-studio video looks fine, but most of the other video seems to have excessive (and I really mean excessive) edge enhancement. People tend to have bright white outlines around their lips for example. Anyone else notice this?

There have been other recent comments about zooming or stretching on KTLA. A few weeks ago I noticed that nearly every day part of the Morning News would be 4:3 and part of it would be zoomed. They couldn't seem to make up their minds.

I'm watching my Comcast 6412 DVR recording of this afternoon's Master's round, and the digital A/V breakup problems on KCBS-DT are horrible!

I didn't get a chance to watch live this afternoon, so I don't know if the problem occurred on true OTA as well. But it obviously occurred on the Comcast re-transmit.

What a shame. Almost unwatchable and unlistenable (via DD5.1 audio), though not as bad as Survivor and CSI were two weeks back.

I'm calling CBS in the morning.

Anyone have any idea why I can not get KCOP 13.1 to come in well in my house with an OTA. I am getting every other channel fine. I even get a couple of channels from San Diego. I am in West Los Angeles. I know my Antana is pointed correctly towards mount wilson too as I am getting about 30 other channels fine. My signal strength for channel 2,4,7 and 11 are all in there 90+ range acording to my sony box. Channel 13 KCOP signal strength tho is about 50 which is why it not coming in good.

I am using a normal antana could that be the problem? Should I maybe try to get one of the special HD antana's? I bought the big rat shack antana.

I can't get KCOP-DT in Marina Del Rey. Signal strength is about 20, pulled in on a 4th floor rooftop building antenna that gets the rest of LA's digital channels with a strength of 85-95. My two OTA ATSC tuners can't lock on 13.1.

The problem is with 13.1 and KCOP-DT, not your antenna. I've given up on it.

Anyone have any idea why I can not get KCOP 13.1 to come in well in my house with an OTA. I am getting every other channel fine. I even get a couple of channels from San Diego. I am in West Los Angeles. I know my Antana is pointed correctly towards mount wilson too as I am getting about 30 other channels fine. My signal strength for channel 2,4,7 and 11 are all in there 90+ range acording to my sony box. Channel 13 KCOP signal strength tho is about 50 which is why it not coming in good.

I am using a normal antana could that be the problem? Should I maybe try to get one of the special HD antana's? I bought the big rat shack antana.
13.1 was the only channel I couldn't receive until I changed my old UHF/VHF combo antenna for a CM4228 (long directional antenna), even though antennaweb.org says I only needed a medium directional antenna. As mentioned in the above post, I assumed KCOP just had a weak transmitting signal. Funny thing, even after all that work, I don't think I've watched a single show on KCOP for over a year since I changed the antenna. :(

There's no such thing as a "special HD antenna". Don't be fooled by Terk's marketing.

I'm in West LA using a Silver Sensor indoor antenna. I get 13.1 at 75%. The rest are between 85 and 97%.
All are in a lock.

I just connected a cheapie $10 rabbit ear antenna and let my TV add/delete OTA channels on its own and it seems I'm getting HD channels already. Some are coming in choppy and audio is sometimes weird. But I guess this will all improve a bit with the Silver Sensor.

I received the Silver Sensor yesterday, the signal strength levels did improve, was worth the $25

...On another note... We often watch the KTLA Morning News. It seems that lately the in-studio video looks fine, but most of the other video seems to have excessive (and I really mean excessive) edge enhancement. People tend to have bright white outlines around their lips for example. Anyone else notice this?

There have been other recent comments about zooming or stretching on KTLA. A few weeks ago I noticed that nearly every day part of the Morning News would be 4:3 and part of it would be zoomed. They couldn't seem to make up their minds.

By the way, KTLA's news is SD 4:3, like all stations except KABC. The reason why in-studio shots look better than remotes, both microwave trucks and helicopters, is that the cameras in studios are hooked up using SDI (component digital video) while remotes are sent to the station as analog composite video (like NTSC), which accounts for the dot crawls, rainbows, and some noise. Even KABC's remotes are analog 16:9 except Air7HD, which is true digital component HD.

As for KTLA's russian roulette of aspect ratios for their newscasts, it seems that during the weekdays, if the 10pm news follows an HD show, then the news will be OAR 4:3; I noticed on Saturday, they run and SD show at 9pm and the 10pm news would be zoomed 14:9 cropped. KTLA used to run three ATSC modes for upconversion: 4:3 OAR 1080i, 14:9 1080i, and 14:9 480p. It used to be when the 10pm news ended, right before the Tribune Broadcasting credit, KTLA would switch from 4:3 OAR 1080i or 14:9 480p and there would be a slight glitch from the switchover. They don't run 480p anymore, in fact all the "VHF" stations are either 720p or 1080i (KCOP still doesn't run HD from UPN), and most "UHF" stations are SD.

I can't get KCOP-DT in Marina Del Rey. Signal strength is about 20, pulled in on a 4th floor rooftop building antenna that gets the rest of LA's digital channels with a strength of 85-95. My two OTA ATSC tuners can't lock on 13.1.

The problem is with 13.1 and KCOP-DT, not your antenna. I've given up on it.

Really? I get 13.1 w/the same signal strength as the networks (low 80's) using a indoor antennae in Marina del Rey. I'm also surrounded by tall buildings on all sides, so maybe it's an anomoly.

Blah. Conviction on NBC isn't being broadcast in HD right now. Just letterboxed SD meaning horizontally letterboxed vertically letterboxed content :(

I live about 45 miles from Mt. Wilson and I also have occational problems with KCOP 13.1 , dropouts and break ups.

I live about 45 miles from Mt. Wilson and I also have occational problems with KCOP 13.1 , dropouts and break ups.

Whoever the engineer on duty was last night deserves to be shot. The same thing happened to Saturday Night Live but was topped off by two complete segments with the top 1/2 of the screen in black as well. So you saw the bottom half of a vertically AND horizontally letterboxed screen. Truly riveting television.

Got to love those fine, quality folks at NBC.

Anyone else catch the 5.1 audio test yesterday on NBC in the middle of the Kings vs Ducks game? While I appreciate that someone is testing and hopefully resolving the audio problems that NBC has been having on their HD channel, to do it in the middle of the day (like 3pm IIRC) and during a sporting event, I think was probably a poor decision.

Granted, the game wasn't shown in HD (and neither is the Long Beach GP which I'm mighty pissed off @ NBC for) but I still watch in HD on Charter Cable cuz the analog feed is compressed to hell and looks like absolute crap on the HD set.

HD highlights of The Masters was just shown on KABC-DT...pretty kewl :)

Just now getting to play my Comcast DVR recording of today's final round Master's match. And, unfortunately, the picture is totally digitally broken up... much like has plagued my viewing of KCBS-DT for the past month or so.

Strangely, I was watching "live" (also via Comcast) the early morning coverage of the 3rd-round finish and there was no problem. I did not suspect there would be a problem with my DVR recording this afternoon.

But, much to my chagrin...

So, is this problem mine alone? Was the "live" (either Comcast or OTA) KCBS-DT coverage problem free for everyone else?

I can't believe the problem is related to my DVR, as I have no similar digital breakup problem on any other station provided by Comcast (OTA or premium) than KCBS-DT (as has also been reported by other OTA viewers in this thread). On the other hand, I really can't believe they would let the Master's run for five hours like this, digitally unwatchable.

Anybody?


[Bad enough last night's SNL on KNBC-DT was not in HD, and 20 minutes starting with "Weekend Update" was missing the entire upper half of the image, not to mention the fact that the audio level was super-low, coupled with "video garbage" at the top of the screen starting at 1:02 and running for the rest of the show once they finally managed to kick-start the upper-half of the image back onto the screen. But I expect it from KNBC-DT.]

So, is this problem mine alone? Was the "live" (either Comcast or OTA) KCBS-DT coverage problem free for everyone else?

I can't believe the problem is related to my DVR, as I have no similar digital breakup problem on any other station provided by Comcast (OTA or premium) than KCBS-DT (as has also been reported by other OTA viewers in this thread). On the other hand, I really can't believe they would let the Master's run for five hours like this, digitally unwatchable.


Sorry to hear about your problem. We watched the Masters OTA beginning to end today, with no issues at all.

No Masters issues for me either via Adelphia. Who'd a thunk it?! :confused:

HD highlights of The Masters was just shown on KABC-DT...pretty kewl :)

Actually, the highlights are composite 16:9 SD from KCBS-DT; however, nonetheless it shows their effort at getting sports highlights beyond SD 4:3. KABC showed 16:9 highlights before from the NCAA tournaments on KCBS.

On a related note, the LAX cam just went HD this weekend joining the Burbank, Long Beach, and Downtown LA cams; I'm hoping either the Angeles Forest or Big Bear cams go HD, those provide pretty views of the snow packed mountains.

Sorry to hear about your problem. We watched the Masters OTA beginning to end today, with no issues at all.I decided to just let it run while I worked on some other stuff. Remarkably, at about the 1:50 point (about 1:10PM in real time) the digital breakup problem cleared up and picture and sound returned to normal. Remained fine through the end of my recording (4:30PM in real time).

Very strange. I wonder if it's a Comcast re-transmit problem of the local KCBS-DT feed. It's really hard to believe it's the DVR picking on KCBS-DT out of all the Comcast-provided channels I record from.

I'll pay close attention this week, monitoring programs on KCBS-DT through both Comcast and OTA, so that I can call whoever I feel is responsible if this shows up again (as it probably will, given my experience over the past month).

Anyone else lose KTLA 5.2? I think it disappeared yesterday sometime.

Anyone else lose KTLA 5.2? I think it disappeared yesterday sometime.

I have it now... :confused:

I am moving to Yorba Linda, CA and need help on OTA. I checked Antenna Web and there appears to be no luck in OTA HD. Is this true??? For any one familiar with the area, I will be up the hill from Travis Ranch school.

Please let me know if there is anything I can do. I used to live in a condo where I got everything with rabbit ears, then moved to a home in Brea and got NOTHING, hopefully I can get something in YL.

Thanks,


Jeff

Just wandering if anybody else is having problems with KCET-DT 28-1, KCET-SD 28-2 is working. My reliable Voom receiver (OTA) reboots everytime I go to that channel since last night. I tried rescanning my locals, right after it scanned KABC 53 it rebooted again. I have had no problems with either my STB or KCET-DT in the past. I have no problem with any other channels. Thanks for any help.

Just wandering if anybody else is having problems with KCET-DT 28-1, KCET-SD 28-2 is working. My reliable Voom receiver (OTA) reboots everytime I go to that channel since last night. I tried rescanning my locals, right after it scanned KABC 53 it rebooted again. I have had no problems with either my STB or KCET-DT in the past. I have no problem with any other channels. Thanks for any help.

It may be unrelated, but I have been having problems with 28-1 for several weeks. What usually happens is that the screen freezes for maybe half a second. Then I get maybe a half a second of pixelation. Then I get a lock. This happens about once or twice a minute. The sound is fine. Sometimes I will just get some pixelation.

This is OTA. I have no problems with any other OTA channel.

It may be unrelated, but I have been having problems with 28-1 for several weeks. What usually happens is that the screen freezes for maybe half a second. Then I get maybe a half a second of pixelation. Then I get a lock. This happens about once or twice a minute. The sound is fine. Sometimes I will just get some pixelation.Same here. 28.1 is in very bad shape lately. Signal strength is 84 for me (fairly good, but not fabulous) so it must be something problematic in the datastream, or lots of digital errors, or something.

Send an email to their "contact us" link on the KCET-HD web site. Maybe they'll wake up.

Hello I'm pretty new to this HD OTA channels. I'm just curious am I suppose to be getting a picture on all these sub channels All the HD channels like 2.1 4.1 5.1 7.1 9.1 13.1 all come in fine in HD but the .2 and up like 4.2 7.2 7.3 5.2 I get no picture just the audio. I'm wondering am I doing something wrong or do I just need a better antenna.

Hello I'm pretty new to this HD OTA channels. I'm just curious am I suppose to be getting a picture on all these sub channels All the HD channels like 2.1 4.1 5.1 7.1 9.1 13.1 all come in fine in HD but the .2 and up like 4.2 7.2 7.3 5.2 I get no picture just the audio. I'm wondering am I doing something wrong or do I just need a better antenna.Not all of the local networks are broadcasting on the sub-channels higher than .1. Some are but not all.

In general these higher sub-channels are not in 16x9 but rather are 4:3. The content might perhaps be a digital simulcast of what's on their regular SD analog channel (as, for example, digital 28.2 mirrors analog 28 while 28.1 is a totally separate KCET-HD set of program content), perhaps a weather or news sub-channel, etc.

What receiver/STB are you using to receive your HD OTA channels, and where do you live? If you get audio on those sub-channels I would think you're above the digital minimum for your receiver/STB to lock on, so I would think you should also be getting video. But if you describe your hardware setup and location perhaps there might be an explanation. Also, what antenna? And is it aimed correctly?

Incidentally, you did not list 11.1 in your above sequence of channels you can receive, and yet you say you can get 13.1. This is unexpected. I would have expected the reverse for most areas of LA, where 11.1 (KTTV-DT FOX) is almost universally available but 13.1 (KCOP-DT UPN) is mostly non-receivable. You also didn't list 28.1 (KCET-DT PBS), which should be available all over the LA area.

I am moving to Yorba Linda, CA and need help on OTA. I checked Antenna Web and there appears to be no luck in OTA HD. Is this true??? For any one familiar with the area, I will be up the hill from Travis Ranch school.

Please let me know if there is anything I can do. I used to live in a condo where I got everything with rabbit ears, then moved to a home in Brea and got NOTHING, hopefully I can get something in YL.

Thanks,
Jeff
I live in Anaheim Hills and have had great reception off an indoor antenna untill this week when my signal has turned to crap on all my digital stations, don't know if it's wheather related or seasonal. I just started messing with HD OTA in February.

'Course I'm facing Mount Wilson and up on a hillside with no nearby obstructions. I don't know where Travis Ranch school is, but in Yorba Linda you'll be facing the wrong way most likely, so reception will probably depend on how you can situate your antenna.

I'm in Placentia and get great reception. What street intersection are you talking about? Are you too close to the hills so that your line of sight is blocked?