For those of you monitoring DTV status in Northern Illinois, WIFR-DT CBS in Rockford in now up for equipment testing. It may be on and off over the next couple of weeks but should generally be available. There is a little work to be done to switch to and from the CBS HD feed but that shouldn't take more than a week. Until then you will mostly get the standard programming upconverted to 1080i. Please rescan for channels if your receiver requires it. The actual channel is 41, but it should show up as 23-1 after a rescan since we are sending the TVCT PSIP info.

Thanks for watching and please post any reception reports to this forum.

What percent power are you at currently and when are you shooting for a 100% power (pending FCC approval)?

WIFR is operating at 49.6kW which is the maximum allocated for it by the FCC. We are operating under a STA due to an antenna center of radiation which is slightly lower than our allocation (due to the antenna being side-mounted). This is probably the final configuation for WIFR-DT.

Thanks for your interest and again we solicit reception reports from all interested viewers to be posted to this forum.

Swung the antenna around towards Rockford with the hope of getting away from the CBS Chicago fiasco. Sad to report not much luck with WIFR-DT, the signal is there but not enough to lock on to. Likewise nothing from WREX-DT either but can get a decent signal from WTVO-DT.

Originally posted by VP/Engineering

Thanks for your interest and again we solicit reception reports from all interested viewers to be posted to this forum.


I have noticed that the picture is really stretched to fill my screen (16:9)..is this just temporary until you are actually broadcasting hi-def? I guess the
question is how do you plan on broadcasting SD programming..4:3 or a stretched 16:9?

Hello, I just purchased a Hitachi 57 Ultra Digital and would like to see all this TV can do. Will your signal be strong enough to reach Polo if I make the investment in a HD Receiver and antenna?

Originally posted by StormCrow2002
Hello, I just purchased a Hitachi 57 Ultra Digital and would like to see all this TV can do. Will your signal be strong enough to reach Polo if I make the investment in a HD Receiver and antenna?

I couldn't see why not. I've never heard of Polo, IL, so opened up my MS Mappoint software. According to the map Polo, IL is roughly 34 miles straightline to Rockford. You should be within range. If you can pickup the analogs from Rockford with an antenna, it shouldn't be a problem getting the digitals. Only one way to tell, go buy yourself an OTA digital receiver.

Thanks for your response Brad,

I guess I was somewhat hoping that I could know before I purchased so I didn't spend the money when I could not even receive the signal. Also, Do I need to purchase any certain kind of receiver? I was wondering, since I already have DirecTv if I purchased their HD Receiver would I also be able to plug in my HD OTA antenna into it and recieve the local channels that way and the DirecTv HD signal throught he HD dish?

Sorry for asking so many new questions!

Here in Woodstock I get the following signal strengths:
WIFR - 67
WREX - 67
WTVO - 88

So, you're on par with WREX which isnt really a strong signal but at least I can receive CBS now!

It's amazing, I'm within range of Rockford, Madison, Milwaukee, and Chicago and not one has a CBS station on the air that I can receive.

Except now! Woohoo!

dicko2, what is your antenna setup? Your reception (other than WBBM) sounds pretty good, I'm envious. From Milwaukee, digital 8 has signal strength of 6-12 and analog 10 is fuzzy but watchable here in Downers Grove, and that's all I can get -- nothing from Rockford or Madison or South Bend. (I had had some luck in September but it was from tropospheric ducting, and that phenomenon is definitely over for awhile here.)

Maybe I need a pre-amp. I've got a Radio Shack VU-190R on the roof about 30 feet off the ground. Kipp, what do you think? Can you get anything from Rockford, Milwaukee, or South Bend regularly?

During football season, in particular, it would be nice to have the ability to choose from different stations around the area, although the regular season is coming to a close.

Any thoughts or suggestions from any members would be appreciated. I'm in pretty good shape regarding Chicago broadcasts, but I still want more...

Dan, do you always get a 6-12 on the WIS. station? If so then I would think some things can be done to nail it full time.

Originally posted by StormCrow2002
Thanks for your response Brad,

I guess I was somewhat hoping that I could know before I purchased so I didn't spend the money when I could not even receive the signal. Also, Do I need to purchase any certain kind of receiver? I was wondering, since I already have DirecTv if I purchased their HD Receiver would I also be able to plug in my HD OTA antenna into it and recieve the local channels that way and the DirecTv HD signal throught he HD dish?

Sorry for asking so many new questions!

Yes, all HD DirecTV receivers that I'm aware of also have an input for cable and/or OTA. I have a Toshiba DST3000 that I use for DirecTV and OTA. I would say if you connect your antenna to your TV and you can tune the regular analog channels from Rockford you should be good to go with digital.

Brad,

Thanks for your response. The local stations northeast of me now broadcast in HD and your saying I will be able top plug my HD OTA antenna into the HD DirecTv Receiver and receive both DirecTv and OTA HD signals on my new Hitachi 57SWX20B tv? Does your Toshiba receiver have a program guide and when your in the guide can you still see the last channel you were on in a smaller screen?

Look forward to hearing from you, I'm new at this High Def thing and want to do it right the first time and get the best features.

Dan
I dont know what I have up on the roof. I bought it such a long time ago but its for deep deep fringe reception, combined with a channelmaster 7777 preamp. I also, it appears, live at a high point in Mchenry county.

I dont get all the DTV stations from all the cities, just a few from each and its maddening trying to get CBS. I get 3 ABC signals from Milwaukee, Rockford, and Chicago.. Why cant I get CBS?? (crying in my beer here)

Tried WIFR this morning and it was cutting in and out. So I'd say its just on the verge of being receivable here. Funny thing. I get good reception on the analog signals from all the cities. Digital doesnt seem to carry as far.

Part of the problem is the FCC decided to make all these DTV signals co-channel with Chicago,.. WBUW-DT Janesville is co-channel with WFLD. WHA-DT Madison is co-channel with WYCC. WISC-DT Madison is co-channel with WPWR. WKOW-DT Madison is co-channel with WCIU. WMSN-DT Madison is co-channel with WTTW. WBBM-DT Chicago is co-channel with WISC Madison. What were these FCC guys thinking when they made these frequency assignments??

I'm sure the front-to-back ratio of my antenna isnt good enough to reject many of the co-channel signals, though I get WHA-DT quite well even though it's co-channel with WYCC. Reception of WYCC is horrible though, and it didnt used to be. I chaulk this up to WHA-DT coming on line.

Dick

Originally posted by StormCrow2002
Brad,

Thanks for your response. The local stations northeast of me now broadcast in HD and your saying I will be able top plug my HD OTA antenna into the HD DirecTv Receiver and receive both DirecTv and OTA HD signals on my new Hitachi 57SWX20B tv? Does your Toshiba receiver have a program guide and when your in the guide can you still see the last channel you were on in a smaller screen?

Look forward to hearing from you, I'm new at this High Def thing and want to do it right the first time and get the best features.

Yes, all the DirecTV receivers that I'm aware of have both Sat input and antenna input. In the guide, my Tosh has the APG (Advanced Program Guide). It shows the local stations via antenna (analog & Digital) and the Sat data. My guide has a transpearancy, so you can see the show behind the guide screen. I've have tried several receivers and settled on the Toshiba DST3000. This receiver has two sister receivers that have the exact some insides in a different case. I don't have model numbers handy, but one is made my Hughes, and the other is a Mitsubishi. So no matter which you choose, your getting the same insides. I tried the original Sony model I think it was an HD100, and it had a nasty loud fan and the guide was really slow. I returned that unit for a Panasonic (not sure of model), and this thing really bothered me. The guide was deathly slow! So I finally settled on the Toshiba, was has an extremely fast guide and so far has worked out great. There is a new lineup of HD receivers being released as we speak. I just got my Dad to buy the newest Samsung (I think SIR-160). This seems like a really nice box. I wish I could trade him for my Tosh. It has extremely fast response and has DVI outputs as well. There is a new Toshiba, Zenith, & Sony box being are already relased soon. I would probably choose one of these second generation HD receivers if I was going to buy one right now. They don't seem to be giving such a great price break on the first gen units like mine. The new ones seem to have faster processors and have more options as far as outputs go. Some are also supposed to have firewire outputs for future recording options. I'd say either way you look at it, your looking at around $600 for a receiver.

Oh yeah, you need all three LNB's on your dish if you plan to receive all three HD channels on DTV.
HBOHD & HDNET are at 119 degrees
SHOHD is at 110 degrees
Normal broadcast is at 101 degrees

Thanks for the info,

I was looking in the HD hardware forum and it seems that the new Samsung 165? is the latest from them. The local store I bought my TV from has the new Sony Receiver hooked up and they have a RCA brand one sitting there that they used to use. Would it be worth it to try and pick that one up cheap (store display, used)? I have a digital camcorder and wonder if I could just run the firewire straight into it to record if needed. The way to really go is one of those Hard drive recorders right?

I'm pretty sure I would want to make sure it has component out jacks right?

The RCA receiver I think your speaking of is one of the first and oldest HD receivers. It's probably the cheapest model avail right now. I haven't used that one myself, so I can't provide any input.

I know zero about recording HD, although I don't think you can record using your camcorder.

The connector really depends on your TV. Most TV use component jack (three RCA type inputs). That's what my set uses. Some use a VGA type plug(15 pin I think). Some of the newer sets use DVI. You have to look at your TV to decide that.

You should check with that store if your not happy with the receiver (RCA) can you return it. If they don't have a problem with that, I'd go ahead and buy and take it home for a test drive.

I'm trying to receive WIFR-DT here in Lake in the Hills (Huntley area) and I'm having partial success. I receive what appears to be a strong signal and I'm decoding audio just fine. The video, however, is all pixelated and seems to be positioned in the upper left corner of the screen. What I mean by that is if you can imagine the television picture as an American Flag, the blue area where the stars are is a constantly chaging green pixelated picture, the rest of the "flag" is a frozen picture from the previous station I was tuned into. I can receive all the Chicago stations (minus WBBM-DT) and the other 2 Rockford Stations. It is just the CBS station which seems to not be compatible for me. I can hear it, but can't see it, which I think is strange.

I'm using an old Panasonic TU-DST50 which I picked up about 1 year ago for $50 bucks at Circuit City. Could there be an incompatiblity with the modulation of WIFR-DT and my older Pansonic unit?

If you can hear a digital station with no breakups and no problem,
but don't get a perfect picture, something is very seriously wrong
with some piece of equipment, may be yours, may be theirs. The green
pixellated picture is a very common symptom .Try rebooting from being unplugged. This applies to encoders too, not just decoders (well, for encoders it's probably OK just to turn off.)

Doug McDonald

ksorny, what kind of antenna are you using? I'm in Lake In The Hills, but I can't get much of a signal. The strongest signal I get is in the teens...it shows as a locked signal on my Mits SR-HD5 receiver, but no audio or video. I'm currently using a simple powered RCA "rabbit-ears" type antenna. I bought the Zenith Silver Sensor HDTV set top antenna this weekend and tried it out, but still nothing. Both antennas get the Chicago digital channels with great signal strengths (except for Ch 2-1 of course) . I checked Yahoo maps, and the distance between my house and downtown Rockford and my house and downtown Chicago is virtually the same (within a couple miles). However, I'm sure the Chicago stations are transmitting from a much higher antenna.

Has anyone in this area been able to get the Rockford stations with a set top antenna? I'd love to be able to watch the AFC playoffs in HD, and I doubt that I'd be able to get Ch. 2-1 on my RCA "rabbit ears" even if they're transmitting from their new antenna (and I know the Silver Sensor won't work because it's UHF only).

Marc

Marc,
I'm using a roof mounted RadioShack antenna. Something is still severely wrong with either my Panasonic TU-DST50 or with the signal from WIFR-DT. I can hear the audio just fine without any breakups, but the picture is all scrambled. The scrambling is not simply pixelation from lack of signal (as in the case of WBBM-DT that most of us experience), rather, it appears as though my receiver does not know where to place the picture on the screen. It's trying to cram the entire picture in the upper left corner of the screen. There is also a switch on the back of the Panasonic which selects the output mode (480P, 720P/1080I, and All ATSC). If I select 480P as the output mode, the picture fills up the left 2/3rds of the screen with the remaining 1/3rd scrambled video.

All other stations in Rockford and Chicago are received and decoded without this problem, so my guess here is that WIFR-DT is transmitting something that is not compatible with my older HDTV receiver. Strange.

I'm curious if anyone else out there is able to receive WIFR-DT and also using a Panasonic TU-DST50??

Hey is anybody else having problems with WTVO's sound? At home I run all my sound thru my Lexicon processor and when I have channel 17 on I only get sound out of the rear speakers unless I turn it up full blast. At work we have this station playing thru the tv speakers and its ok but there must be something wacky in the signal that goofs up in a surround processor. Anyone?

I get the same audio problems with WTVO - here is the response I got from them over a month ago.

Are you attempting to receive using surround sound? We are still waiting to
get our modifications for it. I have a receiver at home and have not
experienced it yet...Not that it may not be a problem, just that I haven't
experienced it yet. I guess, "Bear with us" doesn't count for much, but
please, bear with us.

Thanks Kuma. I think they just plugged in the wrong audio inputs.

Originally posted by VP/Engineering

Thanks for watching and please post any reception reports to this forum.

Hey VP/Engineering - will you be up and running HD by this weekend
for the AFC football games? - I have yet to see any HD yet all SD.

Can I get some signal strength #'s form you folks out there for WREX? According to antennaweb.org WREX and WIFR are only 1 degree apart and the difference in signal strength for me is like 68 for WIFR and WREX is like 18. I have my antenna pointed between Rockford & Madison (which is NW). WTVO's tower is south of the others and its signal strength is like a 100. Any help would be appreciated.

I get the same problem....

WTVO 100
WIFR 100 No HD content yet
WREX 51

I have two receivers, an F38310 TV and a HiDef TV PC card.
Here are the strengths I get on both:
F38310 HiDef Card
WIFR 28 63
WREX 45 63
WTVO 82 88

I'm in Woodstock, just east of Rt 47. The antenna is pointed due west.
WIFR is undecodable on the F38310 but is the same signal quality as WREX on the HiDef Card. This just shows that two different receivers can have vastly different results from the same antenna.

dickm

Watching tv on a Hitachi 65SWX20B using a Samsung SIR-T160 HD receiver in Rockford, I'm getting the following readings using a Terk TV50 antenna...

WIFR-DT in & out 50% max
WREX-DT 77%
WTVO-DT 100%

WISC-DT 36% Madison!

It may help others if in your posts you show what HD receivers you pair with your antenna. I for one will 'prolly get a Medium Directional w/ pre-amp to get Madison in better.

I'ld also like to hear from others in the *area* to see what signal strength you're getting with receiver & antenna. :)

Last night I had WIFR-DT between 77-85%, this morning it was tough to get in initially, in & out, but at 77%. Guess that's the best it can do for now... :confused:

Originally posted by VP/Engineering
For those of you monitoring DTV status in Northern Illinois, WIFR-DT CBS in Rockford in now up for equipment testing. It may be on and off over the next couple of weeks but should generally be available. There is a little work to be done to switch to and from the CBS HD feed but that shouldn't take more than a week. Until then you will mostly get the standard programming upconverted to 1080i. Please rescan for channels if your receiver requires it. The actual channel is 41, but it should show up as 23-1 after a rescan since we are sending the TVCT PSIP info.

Thanks for watching and please post any reception reports to this forum.

Getting a 100 SS here in Algonquin. Great picture!

I will be buying an antenna specifically for this station! (as my current one needs to point to chicago)

For those interested in DTV reception of Rockord IL
Stations in DeKalb IL, here is my experience:

Antenna: Winegard Prostar 7015 - 88" 31 Element
mounted 14' from ground level
using RadioShack High_Gain Signal Amplifier


TV: RCA F38310 HDTV

Stations:

WTVO-DT ABC 95%
WIFR-DT CBS 75%
WREX-DT NBC 65%

In the last week, I have encountered several problems with
Network and non Network broadcasts from WTVO-DT -
the ABC affiliate in Rockford Illinois.

HD Network broadcasts where transmitted in Standard
Definition even though they have been shown in HD in the past.

Several times when the transmissions where in HD = there was no audio.

The local broadcasts audio is of lower than normal volume.
When I use my surround sound system, dialog is being directed
to the surround sound speakers.

Anyone else having these problems?

Did you check the third post down from the top?;) I still cant get a signal strength that displays a picture for WREX and they are futher north than some of the stations im getting in the 80 to 100 signal strength range. My antenna faces NW between Rockford and Madison.

I could not get WREX either until I added a mast mounted
amplifier. WREX now shows 65% most of the time.
I do have drop outs with WREX but it is quite viewable
most of the time.

As to WTVO, I am hoping the engineer at WTVO belongs to AVS
and reads these posts.

I have called two times and left voice mail
to tell the engineer about the problems.

E-Mail I sent to WTVO

-----Original Message-----
From: cmunroe
Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2003 12:29 PM
To: mmcshane@wtvo.com
Subject: HD TV

Do you have an estimated date when you
be able to resume High Definition broadcasting?

-----Reply Message-----

From:mmcshane@wtvo.com
Subject:RE:HD TV

Not at this time,
but expect to be able to
get back as soon as the
parts come from Canada.

Mac

Thanks for the info and keep it coming. I havent checked in the last day or so but WIFR signal went in the crapper last week.

Has anyone else noticed off and on audio problems - drop outs -
from WIFR during network broadcasts.

The problem goes away during local commercials.
This points to a Network feed problem ?!

I think I have answered my own question about sound dropouts.
I moved the antenna to give WIFR the strongest signal.
The audio problem seems to have gone away.

This cost me 10% on my WREX signal strength.
The reception on WREX seems to be about the same.

Guess I will need to invest in a rotor for the antenna.

I was able to get Patch Adams in HD last night.
Thanks WTVO.
However the quality of the movie as it came from
ABC left a lot to be desired.

Last night - 3/15/03 - the fog rolled in and WREX
"Rolled out" - the signal level dropped to 20%
and my RCA F38310 HDTV could no longer lock
onto the station.

I was still able to watch HDTV from WTVO and
WIFR. The digital picture from WIFR was still strong
and stable even though I could no longer receive
the analog channel - 23.

Today I had the exact opposite with WIFR. Still cant get WREX. I guess i'll have to get a rotor.

I just sent WIFR an e-mail saying I will
be watching CBS programming from WBBM Chicago
on my Directv system. WIFR consistently fails
to send HD from the network and I see no benefit
watching a stretched version of a HD program in
Standard Definition.

Anyone else have an opinion on this issue?!

An e-mail I sent to WTVO.

I would like to thank your station and Engineering staff
for the excellent service you are providing for High Definition
viewers in the greater Rockford area.

In the past, I did not have much of an interest in ABC programming.
I am now a regular viewer of ABC because of the HD service
you are providing.

I agree with you 100% cmunroe, they used to be great with throwing the switch.....they are horrible now. I have sent them numerous e-mails and left voicemails - we missed most of the NCAA tourny in hi-def, the final game was (I left them a voicemail earlier that day), but we did miss the final four in hi-def. I also have sent them e-mails on their logo - which is very annoying - seeing logo on top of logo. The most ironic part of it is, I believe the VP of engineering of WIFR started this thread.

I agree with you on WTVO they are great - they have responded to every e-mail that I have sent them.

I got to see the first two rounds of the Masters
in HD on my Directv channel 198.

I checked in at the beginning of the Masters Saturday - April 12
on WIFR. As expected, NO HD.

I decided not to call this time. Too bad Directv and the USA
network couldn't transmit the entire series !!

Checked back in at 4:30 PM Apr. 12th
for the Masters on WIFR CBS

Someone must have called.
The HD feed is on now.

Lately they do not switch to the HD feed most of the time. I do not understand why because they are surely capable of delivering HD. Most of the time I am able to get WISC out of Madison so I switch to that.

Also WREX (NBC) is pretty bad about changing to the HD feed. This is amazing considering how much money they have spent upgrading their equipment but then do not make good use of it.

I would send the ABC station a paper letter (in an envelope and with a stamp) stating, as cmunroe did, that you now watch primetime ABC because of their HD quality issues. The kick is: cc the other stations.

That should wake up some people at the CBS and NBC affiliates.

I have noticed in the past week that WREX has
gotten MUCH better.

They dropped the Logo and the wasteful Dopplar
Radar sub channel.

The Jay Leno Show looked Great during the Fleetwood Mac
performances !!!

I am beginning to think WIFR is a lost cause for now.

Sorry folks, I haven't been checking this board lately. I spoke to the Chief Engineer at WIFR yesterday to find out why the HD programming has not been available lately. As it turns out, they lost their CBS provided HD satellite receiver due to lightning (they think). CBS will send a replacement and as soon as it comes in, the HD programming will resume. I agree, as the guy who spent all of that money to allow HD programming I want to see that we provide the best possible quality to all of our viewers. I can at least assure you that the problem is technical and not due to failing to push the button or any management decision to withhold CBS HD programming.

We'll get it taken care of as soon as we get the replacement receiver, but CBS has not given the station an estimate of the arrival date.

Sorry for the problem and thanks for hanging with us as we sort it out

Originally posted by VP/Engineering
Sorry folks, I haven't been checking this board lately. I spoke to the Chief Engineer at WIFR yesterday to find out why the HD programming has not been available lately. As it turns out, they lost their CBS provided HD satellite receiver due to lightning (they think). CBS will send a replacement and as soon as it comes in, the HD programming will resume. I agree, as the guy who spent all of that money to allow HD programming I want to see that we provide the best possible quality to all of our viewers. I can at least assure you that the problem is technical and not due to failing to push the button or any management decision to withhold CBS HD programming.

We'll get it taken care of as soon as we get the replacement receiver, but CBS has not given the station an estimate of the arrival date.

Sorry for the problem and thanks for hanging with us as we sort it out

Thanks for the update!

I watched CSI thurdsay and the quality was very poor. Thick bands running through the picture. Hope it all works out soon!

VP/Engineering

Any update on the replacement CBS provided HD satellite receiver?
How about an update every fortnight.

Message I sent to WREX-TV last night:

I was sorry to see you are having problems with
the HD feed during the Tonight Show. I was looking
forward seeing Katie Couric in High Definition.

Hope the problem is resolved soon.

WREX-DT Reply:
Sorry, but our HD satellite receiver has bit the dust!

Now two of the three OTA stations I receive can
not transmit in HD - UGH !!!

WREX-DT Reply May 14, 2003:
HD PROGRAMMING HAS BEEN RESTORED!

Has anyone complained to WREX about the fact that their signal strength still sucks? My wife even says when she sees their commercial for them being the 1st digital station in Rockford, that "yeah but your signal sucks" The signal at my house no matter where we point the antenna goes from the 70's to the 20's to the 50's and so on.

An e-mail I received from wrex months ago confirmed that
they are not planning to up their power in the near
future. They are waiting for their final channel assignment.

Current power:
Facilities: 643' 55.2 kw (STA)

They have a CP: 633' 1000 kw

WREX believes that repairs to their HD
will be made tomorrow - June 4th.

Also DirecTV is getting HDNET-Movies and
Discovery-HD.

Not a bad days news !!!

now we just need WIFR to get going......and get rid of that logo

i have given up on WQRF (FOX) not sure what is going on with them.

What are the other Rockford stations broadcasting at signal strength wise?

Here is where I got my Info.


www.100000watts.com/tv/RFD.html (http://www.100000watts.com/tv/RFD.html)

Would someone please e-mail or call WIFR-DT
to see if there is any news on their HD.

I am afraid I have sent too many disparaging
messages in the past and I no longer receive
a reply.

Thanks

Sure, can you post the email address that I should use?

I have been using talkto23@wifr.com with a request
to pass the e-mail to the engineer.

Using engineer23@wifr.com has always bounced.

Originally posted by cmunroe
I have been using talkto23@wifr.com with a request
to pass the e-mail to the engineer.

Using engineer23@wifr.com has always bounced.

Is the problem that they are still not using a sat receiver for their HD? I quit tuning in because of it and now that we are in reruns....

Originally posted by jldet5
Is the problem that they are still not using a sat receiver for their HD? I quit tuning in because of it and now that we are in reruns....

That was my understanding - CBS provided the receiver and they
are waiting for CBS to replace it.

Whatever they are using for the network feed, it looks awful.
There are horizontal bands showing on their analog and digital.
The digital channel actually makes the signal look WORSE.

I now watch CBS on my old 27" set connected to DirecTV.

Originally posted by cmunroe
That was my understanding - CBS provided the receiver and they
are waiting for CBS to replace it.

Whatever they are using for the network feed, it looks awful.
There are horizontal bands showing on their analog and digital.
The digital channel actually makes the signal look WORSE.

I now watch CBS on my old 27" set connected to DirecTV.


NO REPLY so far

This morning - July 5th - a strong storm hit Rockford.
WIFR lost their tower to 100 MPH winds.

I have been getting a much stronger
signal for WREX-DT recently. I noticed
a jump to 94% while watching Leno
last night - Aug. 14.

Maybe they upped their power
Or it could be atmospheric ?!

I will be moving from California to Rockford, Ill and would like to know what the market is like for HDTV in the area?? Am a novice, but looking to upgrade my system.
Thanks

Well we have the local ABC,NBC and will have CBS again once they get their tower back up (taken down by a storm as mention a couple posts up) I also get ABC,CBS,UPN (just digital for the time being)& PBS (2 channels) from Madison WI. There are a couple more stations that are supposed to be coming from WB and a local FOX station. There is an NBC and Fox station in Madison but they are transmiting at not a high enough signal strength for me to get them right now. Hope that helps.

Thank you for your reply. What do you recommend for reception...cable, Direct or Dish??

RBG

Well the cable here is not even close to going to HD. We are usually the last place on earth to get anything. I like and have had Direct TV for a while now. At present they offer more HD programing but I think I heard that dish is going to offer the same stuff within a few months. Not sure on the price though.

Originally posted by Jeff Whitford
I also get ABC,CBS,UPN (just digital for the time being...

Jeff
What station is UPN on in Madison? I cant get WPWR out of Chicago.

Thanks...

The UPN station in Madison is 3.2,3.1 being the CBS feed in my program guide. It is actually channel 50 when trying to lock the signal on a Hughes E86. I believe the analog channel is 14. Should be at or around 314*for you.

E-Mailed WREX with -
The new switching equipment looks great.
The transition from SD to HD looks transparent.
Several of the show I have watched lately where prefect.
Thought you should know that the last segment of
The Tonight Show - the music segment -
has remained in SD after the local commercials.

WREX Reply -
Thanks again for your e-mail.

The problem we have here is the Tonight show and Conan are seamless and there is not a line in our program event between the shows to do a GPI trigger to drop the HD program. Therefore we are dropping the HD after the last scheduled local commercial break in the Tonight Show. We may run into problems with other seamless shows as well. We'll keep working to find solutions around these little problems.

Thanks but that does me no good. 50 is cochannel with WPWR analog and I cant get it, even with WPWR off the back of the beam. Drat... Looks like I'll have to watch Enterprise on snowy WPWR analog...

In case you missed it WIFR plans on having their new tower up and running in November. No mention of the SAT problem fix but I'm hoping.

WIFR-DT has resumed HD broadcasting.

Originally posted by cmunroe
WIFR-DT has resumed HD broadcasting.

For some reason I can not get their signal on the MYHD card. I use to before the antenna went down. Either the signal is weaker or I think their encoder is off a bit.

The signal strength is alot better than it used to be. Im in the high 90's now.

Here in DeKalb, I receive WIFR-DT at a level
of 85 on my DTC-100 receiver.

It appears they are doing the HD/SD switches
by hand. I hope they get some automated
switching equipment soon !!!

Right now 12/14/03 4:56PM they are sending out
a test pattern instead of the football game.

I live in Janesville, WI 53546 and can get milwaukee, madison and rockford digital and analog signals via antenna. I also pick up WBBM, WLS, WGN out of Chicago. I want to try to get WFLD,WMAQ, WCIU out of Chicago. At what compass direction should I point my antenna?

Chris

All you have to do is type in your zip at this address and it will till you the compass direction to point your antenna
http://www.antennaweb.org/aw/welcome.asp

Chrisj1
You live in Janesville and can get WBBM? Wow! Even the Chicago locals cant get WBBM.

I live in Woodstock Il, about equidistant between Chicago and Madison. But it seems that most the Madison DTV stations are cochannel with Chicago analog stations so I cant seem to get very many of them.

Rockford is another story. While I live closer to Rockford than Chicago, I cant seem to get most of the Rockford stations. I havent tried WIFR since they came back on the air, but I never could pick them up before and I doubt anything's changed. WTVO comes in like gangbusters, and I can just barely get WREX with some pixellation. The rest are too weak.

I cant get WCIU, or WYCC from Chicago either.

dickm

WIFR channel 23 has drastically improved their signal. Actually so has WREX but not as much as WIFR.

Originally posted by Jeff Whitford
WIFR channel 23 has drastically improved their signal. Actually so has WREX but not as much as WIFR.

I use to be able to pick them up on the MYHD tuner card before the tower went down but now I can only pick them up on my old E86 STB. If you can't get them it may be that their encoding is off as I have at least one type of tuner that can not see the signal. I have emailed them several times on this but no response. So I can only assume they really don't care about their digital broadcasting.

They stopped answering e-mail shortly before they
lost their HD receiver from the Network.

I'm just glad I can finally receive HD from CBS again !

It seems WIFR-DT is having problems with HD, AGAIN.

I was thinking about inviting some friends over to
see the Superbowl in HD. Now I am worried it would
be a waste of their time.

When it comes to HD, WIFR-DT does not have people
you can count on !

What problems are they having now?

Chris

The main issue for me is that programs scheduled
to show in HD are not being transmitted in HD over
the last several days.

I also noticed that the large "Bug" of the station logo
is also missing. That is NOT missed. however, I am
assuming that this is not intentional.

I have e-mailed them a number of times on their logo in the upper right hand corner......maybe they got the hint, but like you say the station is not broadcasting hi-def either.

I also have e-mailed WREX about their logo and they appear to have gotten the hint as well, as theirs is gone.

We need to get WREX and WTVO to not stretch their SD programs.....

Good news WIFR-DT has resumed HD broadcasting.
Bad news The bug is back.

Also, the color balance looks MUCH better to me.
CBS programs have always looked too Green on my set.

Is anyone receiving WIFR-DT right now. It seems there is a signal but no picture of audio. No football in high def for me for now. Please answer someone!!!

No they are NOT.
You should call their 24 hour news
phone number and report the problem.

3 PM CST 1/18/04

Reported problem. Called them and they have someone working on it. Just think what would happen if this was the superbowl.

Chris

I can not receive channel 3 from Chicago.
For CBS, it is WIFR-DT or nothing.

I doubt they will be handing out waivers
for DeKalb IL. when DirecTv starts CBS HD.

It seems your call was not in vain. The
station started transmitting in HD.

I guess they just do not have the staff to
monitor their own transmissions ?!

Why are they not braodcasting it in 5.1 though. Don't they normally have the capability of this?

Chris

Anyone else having problems with audio on WIFR-DT.
Last night during Jag and Cold Case it was quite noticeable.

It sounded like an old movie with a warped sound track.

My signal level is rock solid. No other channels seem effected.

Will check this out for you cmunroe later today and post what I find out.

Chris

On the question of waivers again... Has anyone actually gotten a waiver from WIFR? Was there a specific way you contacted them or a specific person you talked to who was effective in obtaining the waiver?

Audio was good Sunday for the part of the Grammy's
I watched.

I hope the problem was with their encoder rather
than a weather related issue for my location.

I have not asked for a waiver Slordak, so I can not help
you.

Originally posted by Slordak
On the question of waivers again... Has anyone actually gotten a waiver from WIFR? Was there a specific way you contacted them or a specific person you talked to who was effective in obtaining the waiver?

I'm in Lake In The Hills and my address shows Grade B coverage for WIFR. After several calls to D* trying to get them to apply for a waiver for me before CBS-HD was available, I finally got someone to apply for it (I think it was the Monday before it became available). Today in the mail I got a postcard from DirecTV saying that the waiver was granted. I managed to talk one of the CSRs into turning CBS-HD on for me the day that it first came on (I was getting the call X721 message but the guy simply added it to my account and it was on) so I was able to get the Super Bowl before the waiver was granted. But now that I have it, I won't worry about them turning it off.

Only one problem...they also turned on channel 380 and 381 (the SD CBS channels) and I now have a $2.00 charge on my bill for the distant CBS network feed. Time to make another phone call...

Marc

you are lucky you got the waiver.....you don't have to view
that obnoxious "23WIFR" logo. It is back again, I have no
idea why. It totally ruins the hi-def experience. I wonder
if the VP of engineering , who started this thread, ever reads this
forum anymore....maybe he can explain to us why they
insist on showing that logo.

I've recently moved out near DeKalb, and have been very frustrated with WIFR-DT. I have never seen them do any CBS HD, it's always upconverted and stretched - totally unwatchable, the analog channel looks way better.
Has anyone seen them ever do HD ?? Also, anybody have a valid email address for their engineering dept??
Thanks

I live in DeKalb. Since the Super bowl WIFR-DT (Channel 41) has transmitted programs in HD during prime time. I do not believe they have
any automated switching equipment to help with the switch
between their SD signal and the HD signal. As a result, they
often fail to cut over to HD and sometimes fail to return to HD
after a local commercial. I also wish I could get a valid email for
their engineering department. The address on the Web Site did not
work the last time I tried. Sometimes you can get a response when
you try the Sales department's email.

Can anyone tell me what the status is on WQRF? Antennaweb lists them as awaiting FCC approval. Are they broadcasting DTV yet, or do they have plans to do so?

Originally posted by cmunroe
I live in DeKalb. Since the Super bowl WIFR-DT (Channel 41) has transmitted programs in HD during prime time. I do not believe they have
any automated switching equipment to help with the switch
between their SD signal and the HD signal. As a result, they
often fail to cut over to HD and sometimes fail to return to HD
after a local commercial.

Thanks for the reply. I'll give them another try. I'm in a townhome in Cortland, using a Silver Sensor with a preamp and an RCA F38310 TV. Antenna placement for WIFR-DT is touchy but at one sweet spot I had a 76 from them. Not bad considering they're 54 miles away and only 50Kw at 750ft.
Looking forward to seeing CBS-HD again.

Originally posted by SleepyBob
Can anyone tell me what the status is on WQRF? Antennaweb lists them as awaiting FCC approval. Are they broadcasting DTV yet, or do they have plans to do so?

Anyone out there with any info on this? Also anyone with current comments on DTV/HDTV reception out of Rockford these days. Considering equipment upgrade for HDTV, and out here in Dixon, Rockford channels are really the only option for me.

WREX - NBC, WIFR-CBS and WTVO-ABC are all on the air.
The service from all three has been quite good in the last
few month. In terms of Transiting HD, I would
give them a 9 out of 10 in the last three months.

Issues:
WREX signal is the weakest of the three in DeKalb.
WTVO has had audio sync problems.

WIFR has weather related audio problems in DeKalb.
also their color balance is towards the green side
compared to ALL other sources I receive.

WTVO-DT definitely has the most potent signal, at least from a DX perspective. I get WTVO-DT 16 about three times weekly on an indoor bowtie antenna in Monee, IL (33 miles SSW of Chicago along I-57).

WREX-DT is tougher to get than WTVO-DT for me (maybe once every two weeks), and WIFR-DT is by far the most difficult. The only time I get WIFR is when the DX is so strong that analog 17, 23, and 39 are crystal clear.

I dont think WQRF 39 will ever go HD

Actually, I don't think WQRF-DT is even on the air yet...

Its not. Thats what I meant.

I was attempting to see the Denver/Tampa Bay game and is was SD! Is the station having more problems? I caught the game via another source and it looked great! :(

I'm looking to buy a good outdoor antenna to pick up the local channels from Rockford and hopefully from Madison and the Quad Cities. What antennas are you guys using (Wineguard, Channel Master) ? I'm looking at the Channel Master 3671. Is this antenna going to be overkill for me or is it really true that bigger is better? I'm just south of Polo, Illinois. Also what type of amp or pre-amp am I going to need or better yet what is the recommended one to purchase? Rotor too if you don't mind?

Hello all,

A guy I know wants to get a DTV tuner and antenna to pick it
up in Belvidere. If he puts a ChannelMaster 4228 (8-bay UHF)
on his roof, and a large VHF antenna, and a CM 7777 preamp to diplex into, I know he'll get Rockford with no problem. Question: will he get
Madison, Chicago or Milwaukee DTV's?

Gilbert

Most of our customers with similar setups in that area get Madison,Chicago & Rockford as long as they are not in a valley and have a rotor.

There is now a thread dedicated to the Milwaukee, WI DMA. Please direct any issues regarding Milwaukee affiliates or Milwaukee area cable issues to this thread: Milwaukee, WI - HDTV (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=463747)

Hey gang,

In case you didn't know, WQRF-FOX 39's parent company bought out
WTVO late in October for a cool $20.6 million. On Friday, November 5th,
a quick call to WQRF confirmed that all their equipment is being moved
over to the WTVO engineering room. They have "plenty of room there"
according to the WQRF engineer, who doubles as the WTVO chief engineer as well.

All this to say: According to the Rockford Register Star newspaper,
the Rockford Park District, which owns the old post office where
WQRF has its facilities in downtown Rockford, has told WQRF it must
be gone by December 31, 2004. And with all this work going on,
I'd venture to say that there will be little if any progress in getting
WQRF-DT on the air anytime soon.

Gilbert

WQRF-DT's 1 MW application was approved this week by the FCC,
according to the FCC database. But I more than bet they'll apply for
a lower power STA (Special Temporary Authority) for the next
2 years until HDTV takes off. But who knows...WTVO is at a
respectable power for their channel, but new owners and their
desires/investment route may not want to put WQRF-DT on the air
anytime soon. I guess we'll see.

WTVO has had a carrier but no signal on both 16-1 and 16-2 today
(12/4, Saturday). What's up?

Gilbert

Just FYI...I emailed WTVO/WQRF's chief engineer. They are rebuilding
WTVO and WQRF's master control, since they merged in December.
WQRF-DT 42 will hopefully go on the air in March, if all goes well.

Thats great news. Considering how long we've waited I'll believe it when I see it.

Would someone please check and verify reception of an OTA guide for WIFR on their analog channel (23-0).

Thanks

So no HD feed AT ALL for the Superbowl this year??

This should be criminal.

Not unless you live in Chicago. If your in Rockford you should be able to get 47.1 out of Madison with a decent antenna. I am and so are my customers.

Fox 47 came in, kind of.
It was on 11.1 or something like that.

Whether or not the FCC is handing out the non-compliance fines, I still can't believe that WQRF isn't on thin ice with Fox for not having facilities to broadcast an HD feed for their sports and prime time programming.
Fox has spent a fortune getting the 2004 World Series, 2005 Superbowl, and the upcoming 2005 Daytona 500....
AND 24 and OC are two of the highest rated shows on TV...
the fact that ANY market has to watch the inferior feed must make them furious.

Maybe we have to write letters to the owners/decision makers at the companies who advertise on WQRF during the Fox prime time shows and sports events and remind them about the situation.

I'm sure that they will be glad to hear that the upscale consumers in their market who own HDTV systems don't see their ads because there is no local feed and they have to watch a Madison feed (with Madison market ads) that drops and hiccups occasionally because it wasn't intended to reach this far.

Cinemascope,

All I can say is that they're basically blowing up both stations
and getting all new equipment for master control, and that will
include the HDTV station. They're actually investing a lot
of bucks into the stations, something you have to agree was sorely
needed, albeit it should have been done sooner.

However, they only have a few engineers, and I'm under the impression
that they will do it right. I do know in the past, they kept filing
delay forms for everything from tower delays to you name it, from what
I understand. But, things have turned around, and the application for their
HD signal was quickly turned into a construction permit, and it will
be built out next month, albeit at lower power to start with.

Remember, all Rockford DTV stations are only running at 5.4% to 17%
of what is the highest power they can go at. When they go full blast,
WQRF will be a 1 million watt blowtorch. So, I'll applaud the owners
for speeding things up. All we can do now is watch and wait. The
better news? They'll obviously be using state-of-the-art, and
hopefully more debugged equipment. In case you didn't hear, WFLD-DT
in Chicago had major problems with their Super Bowl broadcast.
The PSIP generator went kerblooey at 4:15 PM, less than 2 hours
before it started. I feel bad for the engineer...

Well I am certainly optimistic about the future of WQRF,
and the fact that they haved moved into the WTVO facility
makes antenna orientation that much easier.

I expected the Rockford stations to be slow to adopt,
and I guess I was pleasantly surprised at WQRF and WREX
for coming on when they did.

I guess my point is that with all of the money Fox has spent
for the biggest of big ticket events, and plenty of HD trucks
to cover those events, that the affiliate stations aren't
being hammered when they move this slowly.

I remember when WQRF started, and it took a lot of stones
to set it up and broadcast when the only content they had
were syndication programming like Tom & Jerry cartoons
and Andy Griffith re-runs...

Sometimes I think that WQRF are still in that mindset even though
they have arguably the top sports network and consistently
some of the highest rated prime time shows each season,
my point is to step it up.

Cinemascope,
>>I guess my point is that with all of the money Fox has spent
>>for the biggest of big ticket events, and plenty of HD trucks
>>to cover those events, that the affiliate stations aren't
>>being hammered when they move this slowly.

One thing you need to remember, and this is no slam on a city I like,
is that affluent HDTV subscribers aren't as prevalent per capita as
Chicago or New York. The economy has been hammered, and advertising
revenues aren't great. That and it is VERY expensive to set up a DTV
station, much less an HDTV one. Note that a few stations have turned
in their licenses or started up as DTV stations to avoid the conversion
costs.

I know, it would have been nice to see the Super Bowl in local HD.
But at least Daytona will be seen, if all goes well, in HD, as well
as all of Fox's hottest shows.

Gilbert

Originally posted by sebenste
...affluent HDTV subscribers aren't as prevalent per capita as
Chicago or New York.

That's definitely true... but HDTV sales in this area have reached significant
numbers, hell even Insight has an HDTV package, and we all know how far
behind they usually are on technology matters.

Also, Rockford has long been a test market for consumer electronics retail,
and retail in general. The Rockford market has been important to the
big retail giants for many reasons.

Our first Best Buy, next to Lino's, was the VERY FIRST Best Buy in the US
that used the warehouse model and didn't have commissioned sales staff.
Also, the Media Play store was the first one ever, and the very first
standalone music/books/videos/magazines superstore for the
Musicland/Sam Goody group (which is now a division of Best Buy) that had
previously operated predominantly in mall stores to that point.

Part of the reason we get the test stores is that the corporate retailers,
resteraunteurs, etc. can operate a single test store to cover the market
and saturate the local media and appear to be a major operation.


The economy has been hammered, and advertising
revenues aren't great. That and it is VERY expensive to set up a DTV
station, much less an HDTV one. Note that a few stations have turned
in their licenses or started up as DTV stations to avoid the conversion
costs.

My point here is that they (WQRF) finally have never had a stronger
product to sell from a quality of programming standpoint.

As far as the ad market, there has been a downturn across the nation
since 2000, and markets smaller and more isolated than Rockford have
been way ahead of us in getting DTV broadcasts.

The local and regional auto dealers, mega franchise resteraunts,
retail stores, home centers, department stores, video stores, etc.
are the primary purchasers of local ad time, and they have been
expanding in the Rockford viewing area at a significant rate.

Remember that although we are a fairly small market, the Rockford
viewing area still covers multiple communities like Dekalb/Sycamore, IL;
Freeport, IL; Belvidere, IL; Dixon, IL; Sterling/Rock Falls, IL; Beloit, WI;
Monroe, WI; Janesville, WI and dozens of other small communites in
the region that have developing retail corridors and every time another
Applebee's, Subway, Home Depot, Culver's, Panera Bread, Best Buy, etc.
opens anywhere in the region, it makes Rockford TV ads that much
more of a value to them.

These national and regional advertisers are building brand and creating
"top of mind" awareness for a greater number of locations for the
low Rockford ad rates they paid before they opened the additional locations.

The economic indicators for Rockford that show decline are tied to
manufacturing, and the affected companies, although a tragic loss
to the community, never bought any advertised to speak of.

American TV is a big part of the reason the Madison stations came on so
quickly. At one time in the 90's, they bought more TV ad time than
ANYONE else in the state of Wisconsin, including Fortune 100 companies
like Ford, GM, Burger King, Pizza Hut, etc.


I know, it would have been nice to see the Super Bowl in local HD.
But at least Daytona will be seen, if all goes well, in HD, as well
as all of Fox's hottest shows.

Gilbert [/B]

Someday it will happen, when the corporate ownership of WQRF finally
gets the hint that there ARE people waiting for this.

Cinemascope,

Good post and you've given me a lot to think about here. Excellent
points about being a test market. Heck, for my sisters here I had
to drive up and buy caffiene-free Diet Dr. Pepper. They sold it
nowhere else for a long time, to test it out.

Points also well taken about manufacturing losses and how they didn't
advertise, and how many new businesses have come in. I'd love
to see how ad revenues with all of the TV stations in town stack
up. Chicago gets them publishes via the Sun Times radio-TV
critic du jour, Robert Feder. If total revenues have consistently
grown over the past 6 years or so, I'll take the shut up pill
and call you right.

On an unrelated note...I wish WIFR would show their "Storm Team"
radar on 23 and WTVO would add a doppler radar display on, say,
17-2. But being a meteorologist, that's just me. :-)

WQRF on digital cable

I have an LG LST-3410 which is an HD PVR device with analog and digital tuners and it's able to receive clear QAM broadcast which is anything un-encrypted on cables digital tier. I receive Madison and Milwaukee HD locals and some on-demand and music channels in the clear. What's interesting is that during a recent re-scan I started receiving Fox 39's broadcasts The broadcasts are SD content and of relatively poor quality with a lot of pixelation and some picture stutter put still watchable. I guess it's only a matter of time till Fox39 DT will be OTA. BTW I have Charter cable service.. Perhaps we will see HD Bears games in my lifetime, at least we get some but I'd like to see them all.
Later,
john

John,

That's interesting. I just turned my ChannelMaster 4228 towards
Rockford (has a CM 7777 preamp on it) and not even a whisper
of a signal. It MIGHT be on at an obnoxiously low power like
WWTO LaSalle is (55 watts ERP) to test equipment, but I think you'd still
need an STA for that, so nix that silly idea. But even at 100
watts, I'd be able to get something from them, I think. Even to raise
the bar above 0. Every now and then an airplane comes by and
42 spikes slightly from WNDU in South Bend, IN, on the same channel.
It's been doing that for 6 months.

Well, the engineer said March he'd have it on with low STA power.
I asked him to not go the 2 kw ERP route that some stations do.
If he goes 50 kw, I'd get it from DeKalb with no problem. 15 kw
with a 1 kw transmitter power output...maybe. We'll keep watching.

Until "late spring". June 1st begins meteorological summer, June 21
begins astronomical summer. No idea why...no details were given,
but this wet winter we had sure prevents tower work. Just a guess.

Thanks for the update

just FYI...
I'm still receiving wqrf on cadtv channel 90-4 as I stated above...
john

Originally posted by pretzelkid
just FYI...
I'm still receiving wqrf on cadtv channel 90-4 as I stated above...
john

wqrf-dt is gone from my line up on cadtv as of a couple days ago....

WQRF was probably being upconverted on your system as a test
at the head end. Not surprised it is now off the system.

FWIW...WMKB-LP 25 signed on Saturday northwest of Rochelle.
The signal makes it into DeKalb with snow, but watchable on my
TV. It's carrying the America One network. Owned by KM group,
the same folks who bring you WOCH-LP 28 in Chicago, all
ethnic programming.

Hope they know that WMKB-FM is just 30 miles south of them,
owned by a completely different company!

A little birdie just told me that WQRF-DT's sign-on has been delayed
until mid-summer, and it will be at low power. That's all I know...

A question for everyone:

I am moving to Rockford at the end of this month. My first HDTV is being delivered on move in day(Pioneer PDP-5050HD). I am scheduled to have Insight cable installed(originally was planning on VOOM.....oh well). I'm pretty disappointed in the lack of channels including Fox-HD. My house is 40 years old and has a large antenna on the roof(sorry, don't know any details yet).

Can I reliably pick up FOX, PBS, and others from Chicago or Madison? If so what additional equipment will I need?

Thanks for the help.

I pick up HD from both Rockford (13.1 NBC,17.1ABC,17.2UPN,23.1CBS) and Madison (15.1NBC,21.1&21.2 PBS,27.1ABC,47.1FOX) with my roof top antenna. I have it postioned between Rockford and Madison and I get everything but 3.1 & 3.2 which are CBS Madison and UPN Madison and I can get them if use my rotor and point it farther north. But since I get the same things locally I dont change it much. You would have to live on a higher point, be on the very East side of town or both to get Chicago. I cant get them. You could just point the antenna north for the Madison feeds if your going with cable. Does you TV have an HD tuner built in? If not you will need an HD OTA tuner to get Madison. Bear fans will be happy if our local Fox station goes HD sometime this summer but I wouldnt hold my breath. In what general area are you moving to? I.E. major crossroads. If you have any other HD questions or even about the town you can PM or email me.

Jeff,

Thanks for the reply. I am moving to the area just north of Spring Creek Rd and just south of Forest Hills Country Club. It seems like pretty high ground. My TV will have 2 HD tuners built in. Are you able to pick up Madison with the antenna alone, or do you need a pre-amp?

I can get it without but where I have it pointed it helps to have it for 47.1 Fox.

Anyone have any word on FOX 39? Going digital anytime soon?

Per my post on the previous page, WQRF is expected to sign on
at low power in mid-summer of this year.

Antenna web finally shows an October date for digital/HD for WQRF.

FYI...WIFR-DT is now broadcasting at 53 kw, down from their 100 kw they were
at before. The reason? They are now broadcasting from an antenna 200'
higher, so they had to lower their power. I don't know if they raised their
current antenna, or are diplexing off the one on top of their tower.

BTW, kudos to them for showing most of the rest of the CBS affiliates in Illinois how
it is done. Outside of WBBM being stuck on channel 3, getting screwed by the FCC
on that channel, WIFR has blown away the Quad Cities, Peoria and Champaign
CBS affiliates in both power AND HD. Outside of WBBM, they're the only
small market station at their FCC pre-analog shutdown max power AND
broadcasting in HD in Illinois!!! And, I might add, they monitored the board for problems in the past.

Anything new on WQRF?

Well that explains why i have been loosing signal up here in So Beloit. I get a 71 or 73 percent when before i was getting around 80.

WIFR does a fine job outside of that stupid 23 logo that they insist on showing - the general manager told me that they legally have to put it there..I guess all other channels are breaking the law....I will not watch the channel for that reason - I pull CBS from Milwaukee.

As of August 3rd, they have a Special Temporary Authority application pending with the FCC to broadcast at lower power. Dean Turman, the CE there, told me they'd be on the air in August if all went well, and this was late this spring (see post above). Looks like he's gunning to make it! They will be full HD and 5.1 DD sound when they hit the air!

FYI...WIFR-DT is now broadcasting at 53 kw, down from their 100 kw they were
at before.
Is this temporary? I lost them in Amboy. :(

Is this temporary? I lost them in Amboy. :(
It's permanent until analog shutdown around 2009, when they will boost power. What antenna do you have? I recommend a Channelmaster 4228, placed outdoors on a roof or tower:

http://www.warrenelectronics.com/antennas/4228.htm

That's your best shot to get it. A friend I know lives in Waterman and locks it
with no problem.

ALSO: Breaking news: WQRF-DT could be on at any time. They have applied for
2.3 kw of power until July 1, 2006 (their full power will be 1 mw, directional).
Here's a link to their coverage map when they hit the air:

http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=DS1078186.html

Sorry to be a board hog, but I have some updated information on WQRF-DT.
The FCC approved their STA to hit the air at 2.3 KW on Friday, August 5th.
So, next week (August 7-12), check on channel 42 to see if you get anything. The FCC website shows the 41 db contour going through DeKalb, and since I have
a good antenna and preamp, I should be able to at least get a blip when they
sign on...

Gilbert I appreciate all your updates.

has anyone been able to pick up Fox 39 yet? I have 0 for signal.

Tonight in DeKalb I am even receiving:
3.1
21.1
57.1


But NO 39.1

Tonight in DeKalb I am even receiving:
3.1
21.1
57.1


But NO 39.1

Same here. Remember, the engineer said "in August". We still have more than
two weeks of "in August" to go. :-)

BTW, an FCC STA doesn't mean that the station will broadcast at that power or even be on the air, but can. Obviously, it makes little sense that after spending money to the FCC, you wouldn't do it (unless you had technical difficulties). But given that:

1. The FCC app was applied for and quickly approved in late July
2. The Chief Engineer says "in August" is when it will be on
3. Antennaweb says by "October 5"

I bet it will be sooner than later, and the October 5th may be a self-imposed
deadline. Either way, keep checking, and yes, the last two nights I have gotten
those Madison stations as well.

And don't count on WQRF-DT to come in reliably, if at all, in DeKalb.
Especially along and east of the Kishwaukee Glorified Ditch. ;-)

WIFR does a fine job outside of that stupid 23 logo that they insist on showing - the general manager told me that they legally have to put it there..I guess all other channels are breaking the law....I will not watch the channel for that reason - I pull CBS from Milwaukee.

Kuma,

He is right. They have older HD equipment...they were one of the first in HD. If you watch, they can't put a WIFR-TV/DT bug on the screen. When it keys over
the analog signal, it doesn't make it to the digital. That's because it has its own system. And, since they don't have a CG system that can splice into that, they
put a permanent stain on it. When they upgrade eventually, I'm sure that will go away. But the general manager is correct. It's either on all the time, or none of the time, in which case they violate FCC ID rules.

Gilbert

Last night after I fixed my antenna, I noticed that 17 was a black screen with a 90% showing on my Dish 6000. Luckily, I was able to view the game on WQAD out of the QC.

Anyone else seeing (er- not seeing) this?

Also, apparently, 39 will not cover Amboy even though we are in it's DMA. :mad:

Last night after I fixed my antenna, I noticed that 17 was a black screen with a 90% showing on my Dish 6000. Luckily, I was able to view the game on WQAD out of the QC.

Anyone else seeing (er- not seeing) this?

Also, apparently, 39 will not cover Amboy even though we are in it's DMA. :mad:

Yes, they had a failure of some sort. They are back on as of 9 AM. I'm wondering if the WQRF patching had something to do with it. ABC HD will be down the rest of the week as the network is doing HD upgrades.

As for 39, maybe not at low power, but on July 1 of next year, they have to be at full. Any luck with you getting WIFR-DT?

Any luck with you getting WIFR-DT?


It's not great maybe 65-70%. I do get pixelation. The Denver Bronco game is on on Saturday and I'll let you know how aggravated I get.

There's always WHBF-DT! :rolleyes: :D

It's not great maybe 65-70%. I do get pixelation. The Denver Bronco game is on on Saturday and I'll let you know how aggravated I get.

There's always WHBF-DT! :rolleyes: :D

I don't have any problems with it on my Channelmaster 4228 antenna.
If you don't have a preamplifier on it, you might want to get a modest one.
It should help you get the Rockford stations with no problem.

I don't have any problems with it on my Channelmaster 4228 antenna.
If you don't have a preamplifier on it, you might want to get a modest one.
It should help you get the Rockford stations with no problem.

I have a RS VR-190 with a CM 7777. I'm getting 23-1 now, also Fox out of the QC @ 96% and Fox 47-1 out of Peoria @ 92% :D .

I can't wait for WPWR out of Chicago to go 1 meg!

I have a RS VR-190 with a CM 7777. I'm getting 23-1 now, also Fox out of the QC @ 96% and Fox 47-1 out of Peoria @ 92% :D .

I can't wait for WPWR out of Chicago to go 1 meg!

Wow! That's a lot of Fox. :-) A hill about 4 miles south of the city prevents
me from getting WWTO-TV 35 (scratchy as all get out), and anything from
Peoria, even on tropo nights...at least so far. With the calm weather,
the stations have locked higher on my tuner over the last few nights. That
will probably end Friday as we turn warmer and more humid.

WPWR-DT 51 in Chicago is now at 1 mw. I doubt if you can get it that far normally.
However, WFLD is 690 kw, and that's a good station to try for as well (rf 31).
RS VU 190/XR is a good antenna, but the ChannelMaster 4228 blows it out
of the water, from someone who has used both. I have a 4228 in my attic in DeKalb,
and can lock WCIU-DT at 15 kw. A friend who lives 20 miles east of me on a hill
frequently cannot lock it with his VU-190! :eek:

RS VU 190/XR is a good antenna, but the ChannelMaster 4228 blows it out
of the water.

That's the info I wanted! I was hope to find someone that experienced them both. I will get over to Warren Electronics as soon as my wallet allows me to! I was thinking that the two are simular. I will put the 4228 on a mast above the VR190 so that I don't lose anything on the VHF side.

Thanks! :D

That's the info I wanted! I was hope to find someone that experienced them both. I will get over to Warren Electronics as soon as my wallet allows me to! I was thinking that the two are simular. I will put the 4228 on a mast above the VR190 so that I don't lose anything on the VHF side.

Thanks! :D

You're welcome! Also, when you split the signals with the Chanelmaster 7777, you should find that you'll get slightly less noise and FM interference on both VHF and UHF. Dunno why. In any case, the CM 4228 antenna gives about 4-6 dB higher gain
than the VU-190. Every 3 dB of gain doubles your signal.

Greetings,

I'm in the Loves Park area, wondering if anyone else is in the area to share ideas on what antenna they are using, and if it's feasible to get Madison/Janesville stations as well as Rockford if I went with the CM4228 antenna? I have a 40' tower I could throw it on, but the feedline would be longer since it's out behind the garage. Also, you guys feed the antennas with just twinlead, or do you use coax? I tried my amateur radio 2m/440Mhz beam, and I almost got it to lock on 3.1/3.2 up in Madison, but hardly any signal. I have a Samsung HDTV/DirecTV receiver which I also hear isn't the most sensitive, so I s'pose a pre-amp will be required.

Thanks for your thoughts. And I can't wait until FOX39 actually gets a signal pumping out!

I'm in Rockford. Definitely use coax. I point my antenna west nw and I get all the stations from Madison & Rockford pointed in one direction. 3.1 & 3.2 are the most difficult stations to pick up. I do use a CM 7777 preamp.

All,

Authoritative information from their engineers:

WTVO-DT had a tube blow out last night (9/8/05). They are off the air until at
least Saturday, or perhaps Monday, when the new tube comes in.

WQRF-DT is scheduled to hit the air around September 23, but due to unknown
issues, they will NOT be in HD initially, just upconverted SD, at 2.3 kilowatts.
They did say they will be at full power "in 2nd quarter 2006".

Edit: just learned: HD in June, 2006, same time as full power. My guess
is due to the cost. Doing it all at once is probably cheaper.

Brilliant. WQRF missed last year's football season in HD and they plan on making sure that they miss it again.

I am sure that the Fox parent company is just loving this Rockford branch.

I suppose it's a good thing that Rockford is just a small town with little to no HDTV retail market...
no Best Buy, no American TV, no Circuit City, and not even Super Walmarts selling HD equipment for the masses - trying to bring them up to the new standard.
One might get annoyed if Rockford were once considered one of the largest cities in Illinois outside of Chicagoland. One might think that someone in charge of WQRF needs to take a hard look at the techincal management of their business, not because the equipment is expensive - I am sure that is true, but rather because the other excuses have been stacking since spring 2004 (and I am willing to bet that even though they say June 2006, they still find a reason not to broadcast HD until the fall 2006).
I would love to be proven wrong. I would love to see an HD signal long before that, but I guess that I am still stuck with Wisconsin Fox (on days with decent weather that is).

Sorry for the rant, but I cannot imagine I am the only one feeling this way.

I suppose it's a good thing that Rockford is just a small town with little to no HDTV retail market...
no Best Buy, no American TV, no Circuit City, and not even Super Walmarts selling HD equipment for the masses - trying to bring them up to the new standard.

One might get annoyed if Rockford were once considered one of the largest cities in Illinois outside of Chicagoland.
According to the 2000 Census, we are still the second largest City in the State.

I have heard that Aurora has passed Rockford for #2, but I don't have actual data to back that up.

Here are the top 5 from the 2000 Census:
1) Chicago 2,896,016
2) Rockford 150,115
3) Aurora 142,990
4) Naperville 128,358
5) Peoria 112,936

People outside of Rockford are shocked to hear this. It's funny when you ask a resident of Chicago or the 'burbs how big Rockford is... Nobody believes that Rockford is the State's second largest City, almost everyone thinks this is a fairly small farm town with a few factories.

When I tell them that we have nearly TWICE the population as Schaumburg (75,386) then they realize that we really are the second largest City in IL.

TV stations care more about TV households than population, and here are the rankings of IL markets according to Neilsen:

1) Chicago #3 nationwide
2) Champaign-Springfield-Decatur #82 nationwide
3) Quad Cities #94 nationwide
4) Peoria-Bloomington #117 nationwide
5) Rockford #134 nationwide

We still deserve better than what we have been getting...

I suppose it's a good thing that Rockford is just a small town with little to no HDTV retail market...
no Best Buy, no American TV, no Circuit City, and not even Super Walmarts selling HD equipment for the masses - trying to bring them up to the new standard.

I presume you are being sarcastic as Rockford has all of these?

Rick what part of town are you in?

Jeff, check your PM.

Before we get all bent out of shape here, we need to remember a few things.

1. At market #134, we have CBS, NBC and ABC in HD. Quad Cities got their
CBS in HD in the last week of August, and they were also at 2 kw. WIFR has
been kicking butt for 3 years, WTVO for well over a year. WREX, ditto.

2. Champaign-Springfield-Decatur, a much bigger market, only has FOX in HD.
As I type this, they're off the air because of a blown transmitter; they hope to
be back on next week. On Monday, two days from now as I type this, PBS affiliate WILL-DT
signs on for good, in HD. The market will then have TWO stations in HD. U of I basketball games are on CBS in HD. Read the Champaign AVS HDTV board
for utter screamfests on that one, especially when the engineers say that there's not enough HDTV's in the market to justify upgrading.

3. FOX Milwaukee just went HD/high power last week. See http://www.milwaukeehdtv.org for a FOX scream festival that lasted up until recently.

4. Peoria CBS is at 2.3 KW and is not in HD.

5. WQRF was barely scraping along and finally got sold. The reason why they haven't been on the air until now is that the FCC has granted them waivers due to poverty. Literally, buying HDTV equipment and a full power transmitter would have bankrupted them. The parent company is finally giving their engineers money to work with. Up until this year, whenever it hit 90 degrees, WQRF would either go to low power, go off the air, and the picture would have a "fishbone" effect on it
because it looked like it was broadcasting off-frequency. Since WTVO's company
took over, the analog looks and sounds much better, and has actual weather
bulletins now on the bottom of the screen instead of a dumb thunderstorm or
tornado symbol. (All of this is NOT, BTW, the fault of the WQRF engineer!)
They've actually rebuilt the WTVO and WQRF master control
centers from scratch together in one building. The WTVO video and audio quality
(except for the news, the cameras need to be upgraded) has also improved
nicely over the past 2 years.

That's not to say they have a ways to go. Initially, if you scroll up, you'll see that
they did have plans to go HD right away at sign-on, but that was before they
were sold. The engineers have been great and flat-out honest in their timetables,
always noting though, that "corporate can change their minds at any time", and
they do.

The good news is that even though they are broadcasting at 2.3 kw, it's going to be from their 1 mw transmitter. When THAT puppy is fired up, look out! You'll be able to get it from near Chicago to just east of Dubuque. Until then, get a good VHF-HI antenna that picks up channels 7-13; you'll need it to pick up WREX-TV
anyway after analog shutdown, and watch FOX HD from Madison.

And as they say, don't blame WQRF-TV/DT, and especially the engineers, who have done a great job with what they have. It's the men in black suits above them that are calling the shots on this one.

Fox 47 came in, kind of.
It was on 11.1 or something like that.

Whether or not the FCC is handing out the non-compliance fines, I still can't believe that WQRF isn't on thin ice with Fox for not having facilities to broadcast an HD feed for their sports and prime time programming.
Fox has spent a fortune getting the 2004 World Series, 2005 Superbowl, and the upcoming 2005 Daytona 500....
AND 24 and OC are two of the highest rated shows on TV...
the fact that ANY market has to watch the inferior feed must make them furious.

Maybe we have to write letters to the owners/decision makers at the companies who advertise on WQRF during the Fox prime time shows and sports events and remind them about the situation.

I'm sure that they will be glad to hear that the upscale consumers in their market who own HDTV systems don't see their ads because there is no local feed and they have to watch a Madison feed (with Madison market ads) that drops and hiccups occasionally because it wasn't intended to reach this far.


Gilbert, I understand that WQRF was recently purchased and that there have been delays... They missed the freakin' Superbowl, and IMO that is NOT acceptable.

Fox actually has a lineup that people watch.... the old ownership were still in the mindset that they had a small franchise to broadcast syndication shows and one night of network programming consisting of 21 Jump Street, Tracey Ullman, and Married With Children.

They have had the NFL now for 11 years, and the prime time lineup is as strong as any other TV station in town.

the old ownership were still in the mindset that they had a small franchise to broadcast syndication shows and one night of network programming consisting of 21 Jump Street, Tracey Ullman, and Married With Children.

They have had the NFL now for 11 years, and the prime time lineup is as strong as any other TV station in town.

I agree, but the problem is that it cannot be fixed overnight. A lot of money has to be put into place, and the ad money doesn't compare to a top 100 market.

I share your frustration, and the best I can tell you is email or call the station and let them know you want FOX in HD. If the current owners are convinced there's
enough high-end viewers, they'll add it, rather than waiting for a mandatory cut-off date. It won't come as fast as we want, but it may come faster than planned.
Considering that when I worked in the market, the roof of the WTVO studio/ transmitter complex was getting close to collapsing from age and neglect, I'd say they've come a heck of a long way. And, we're still the largest market in the country, IIRC, without a PBS affiliate. The only ones who would probably get
one on the air is NIU, and I know they aren't going to do it. They say it won't
generate enough donations to justify the cost.

I have kept Insight basic cable just because I get two PBS feeds... 02 is WTTW-11 from Chicago and 21 is Wisconsin Public TV.

I love New Yankee Workshop, HomeTime, and This Old House... and now the TOH spin off shows as well.

Rockford area residents are used to being the largest city that still doesn't have ... (fill in the blank).

The fact that we do not have anything close to an expressway system upsets me to no end.

Rockford area residents are used to being the largest city that still doesn't have ... (fill in the blank).
The fact that we do not have anything close to an expressway system upsets me to no end.

Rick you couldnt be more right. Good to hear from you again.

All,

Authoritative information from their engineers:

WTVO-DT had a tube blow out last night (9/8/05). They are off the air until at
least Saturday, or perhaps Monday, when the new tube comes in.




It figures, I just emailed the guy at WTVO about this problem. I should have known I would find my answer here on AVS. I am so used to trolling the Display threads that I forgot all about the HDTV Reception

I'm in Rockton and get
3.1 WISC
13 CBS
17 ABC (used to)
23 NBC
57 WB

All using a $20 RCA ANT1250 from Target.

It figures, I just emailed the guy at WTVO about this problem. I should have known I would find my answer here on AVS. I am so used to trolling the Display threads that I forgot all about the HDTV Reception

I'm in Rockton and get
3.1 WISC
13 CBS
17 ABC (used to)
23 NBC
57 WB

All using a $20 RCA ANT1250 from Target.

Not bad! Are you going to upgrade to get all of Madison and Rockford?

P.S. 13 is NBC and 23 is CBS. :-)

P.P.S. I'm surprised you don't get WKOW-DT (ABC). They are at full power and
get out quite far. I can get them in DeKalb often. Ditto WHA-DT (PBS).

P.P.P.S. It should be interesting to see who gets WQRF-Dt at a scant 2.3 kw
when they sign on. The FCC web site says the main service contour will
go through DeKalb, to south of Rochelle, to just east of Dixon, to west of Freeport.
We shall see...it will likely still look better on my TV than analog because of
a building next to me causing some faint ghosting.

DOH!! OOOPS yeah you're right :p

I was getting WKOW for a while. I'm also getting 3.2 - UPN really strong. UPgrade is in the future I have been pretty happy with the reception I am getting to justify the cost.

Do you guys think I would get a much better signal if I run an antenna in the attic.

SO is it true that FOX will be up and running in Nov? I guess I could search for that answer.

In Rockton, you should consider running two antennas in your attic.

A smaller on facing S/SE for Rockford, and the other facing North for Madison.

Combining these is simple, but notching out the weaker antennas feed on the signals that appear on both is a trickier issue.

I get both Rockford & Madison with my antenna pointed NW only. But mine is outside and has a preamp.

I'll give the attic a try I have the cable and the antennas. I just rescanned and now I get UPN 16 and 17 WTVO. I would really klike to get PBS. I hear they have quite a bit of content.

THanks Guys.

I'll give the attic a try I have the cable and the antennas. I just rescanned and now I get UPN 16 and 17 WTVO. I would really klike to get PBS. I hear they have quite a bit of content.

THanks Guys.

Yes, they do. FOX should be up in SD mode around September 23rd (see my post above).

I'd try the attic; better still, on the roof if you can.

the best I can tell you is email or call the station and let them know you want FOX in HD. If the current owners are convinced there's
enough high-end viewers, they'll add it, rather than waiting for a mandatory cut-off date. It won't come as fast as we want, but it may come faster than planned.

Is that info (email addresses) publicly postable? If not, can you PM them to me?

It was funny last year when I bought all the HD equipment, and then called FOX to see what the status was on their digital transmitter.... The receiptionist (OK, to be fair, I shouldn't expect much from a receptionist on technical things) didn't even know what HD or DTV was or why I'd want to know about when they'd have it. I tried to explain it in basic terms and tell her how much better the quality is for the viewer, but it was lost on her. Still, I tried, and I was polite.

I'll even be happy (well, happier than I am now) to have the SD upconverted signal coming out on DTV transmissions... My analog OTA receptions is OK, but it always looks fuzzy and washed out, and what I get from Insight over the basic cable is even worse.

This weekend I'm putting up the CM4228 (I think that's the number) with a small preamp, and I'm hopeful that I'll get some of the Madison stations. I'm in the bowl of Loves Park, around 725' GEL, so it may or may not be as easy as some who are a bit higher without surrounding terrain issues.

Is that info (email addresses) publicly postable? If not, can you PM them to me?

It was funny last year when I bought all the HD equipment, and then called FOX to see what the status was on their digital transmitter.... The receiptionist (OK, to be fair, I shouldn't expect much from a receptionist on technical things) didn't even know what HD or DTV was or why I'd want to know about when they'd have it. I tried to explain it in basic terms and tell her how much better the quality is for the viewer, but it was lost on her. Still, I tried, and I was polite.

I'll even be happy (well, happier than I am now) to have the SD upconverted signal coming out on DTV transmissions... My analog OTA receptions is OK, but it always looks fuzzy and washed out, and what I get from Insight over the basic cable is even worse.

This weekend I'm putting up the CM4228 (I think that's the number) with a small preamp, and I'm hopeful that I'll get some of the Madison stations. I'm in the bowl of Loves Park, around 725' GEL, so it may or may not be as easy as some who are a bit higher without surrounding terrain issues.

The engineer's email is publicly available on this page under "TV reception questions" on the right side of the page:

http://www.wtvo.com/about.asp

They own WQRF, of course, and their questions are also handled through there.

You should get the Madison stations with that setup. In the "DeKalb bowl"
I can get Madison frequently. You are above line-of-sight at 61 miles, even in the
"bowl", and a preamp will take care of that.

Let us know what you get!

I was flipping around during the presidents speil and spyed 39-1 was broadcasting. Signal meter showed about 50% and in SD upconverted 4:3. I'm in Delavan about 35 miles northeast of Rockford.
:)

Beauty! Got 'em here in Loves Park too. My Samsung SIR-TS360 shows 45% signal, but it shows that for EVERYTHING it seems... Bouncing between 45%, 0%, 10%, 30%, 60%, pointless, really. ;-) No pixellation, dropouts, etc, and the picture is, of course, MUCH better than the analog OTA, which is better than my analog cable feed via Insight.

Now, if I could just figure out why my Samsung box won't see 16-1. I get 17-1 with excellent quality, and as far as I can tell from talking with the engineer over there, it's the same transmitter, 16-1 should be just another virtual channel in that data stream, but my box won't pull it out. I have an engineer friend in Milwaukee who is coming down this weekend with some other receivers and an analyzer to see what's in the PSIP info, although I doubt I'd have much influence to get anything changed.

Everyone else here getting both 17-1 and 16-1, and what receivers are you running?

Right now I get 13-1, 13-2, 17-1, 23-1 and 39-1. Hopefully when the CM4228 goes up Sunday afternoon I'll get a few Madison stations as well, I'll post back results.

Steve

Everyone else here getting both 17-1 and 16-1, and what receivers are you running?


I'm receiving all the Rockford channels when I'm rotored over in that direction. 17-1 is a little different than other channels doing multi-carry cuz when I punch in 16-1(rf) I get the UPN station on 16-1 and then channel up and get 17-1 with ABC. Normally it would work punching in 16-1(rf) brings up 17-1(virtual) with ABC and channel up to get 17-2(virtual) with UPN.
I'm using a Zenith HD-420 receiver and also have an LG 3410 and both work the same with the 16-1 stuff....
Also the signal strength is really steady with my CM 4228 at about 40 feet
:)

Doggone, you guys are good! I flipped through and at 7 PM, they weren't
on, so it happened as the President was speaking tonight from New Orleans.
No sound or video now at midnight, and PSIP is going crazy, so they are
obviously tweaking stuff. But before they did, PSIP was 39.1 with no
subchannels, and I caught a picture of it before they yanked the video.
From DeKalb, 41% signal locks on my tuner, and they are at 41% when my
ChannelMaster 4228 antenna in my attic is pointed towards Chicago,
and 55% when pointed towards Rockford. With mild tropo to the west tonight, these numbers are artificially high by a bit, so I suspect I'll have to point the antenna towards Rockford to see it.

Next step: HD and 1 million watts next year! :)

Hey Steve! The DirecTV HD box won't show 16.1 either. I wonder if the virtual channels each have two .1 endings, the tuner gets confused.

I have been getting that one for a while. Now after my tweaking with my little indoor antenna I get from Rockton all at 70%+. I must be in a good spot.
3-1 WISC
3-2 UPN
13-1 NBC
13-2 NBC
16 UPN
17 ABC
23 CBS
39 - UPN
57-1 - note: really nice picture off of this one.
57-2

Some are just duplicates of the same network in different cities.

Got word that WQRF-DT needs to do more work on guide data, PSIP, aspect ratio, etc, so bear with them through 9/23 until they get all of it taken care of; at times, the signal will be out. Right now, they know PSIP is showing as 42.3. They will be working through the weekend to get it straightened out. They will not be in stretchy-vision; they will stay 4:3, unlike the stations in town.

Update: by the end of the night on 9/16, they hope to have everything functional except guide data; they are still working on that.

OK, got the CM4228 on the roof on a small tripod mount with a 10' mast.

Direct in with no amplification at all with the antenna pointed directly at the madison stations (no compass heading, we used a signal meter on the roof to maximize signal), and putting it direct into the Samsung SIR-TS360 receiver:

3-1
3-2
13-1
13-2
15-1
17-1
21-1
21-2
23-1
27-1
39-1 (on 42-1 right now)
57-1
57-2

What's curious is that 13-1/13-2 is so spotty. Makes me wonder if they are on reduced power or something. I pointed the antenna right at the station and it comes in fine, but I wouldn't think I'd have to do that. I put a 38db amp on the line and still couldn't pull it in properly.

Also, no 47-1 here. They're on RF 11 if my lookup info is right, so that's possibly why, as the CM4228 is really just a UHF antenna. (UPDATE: Later in the evening 47-1 came in, unlikely I'll get it during the daytime, but who knows)

So, doing a scan gets me 9 digital stations. Putting the amp on only returns 8, haven't checked what's going on there, so I'm running it with no amp, direct from the antenna, and everything (except 13) seems stable.

Also, my Samsung DirecTV box *STILL* won't get UPN-16. It mus really hate something in the PSIP data. An engineer friend from Milwaukee brought down a sencore receiver which pulled it right in. We tried looking at the various PSIP info bits, but couldn't put a finger on anything that looked definitely "wrong", but for whatever reason, my box won't let me see that channel. The Sencore pulled it in right away as a secondary program on the RF16 transmitter. Back a while ago they had a "glitch" over there and put UPN on 17-2, and it came in fine here with WTVO on 17-1. When they "fixed" it by putting it back on 16-1 I never saw it again, and hadn't seen it before that point either.

Steve

I attached another antenna to my little RCA 1250 (it was in the basement in a box) Now I can point my antennas in two directions. I am picking up Ch - 19. But very weak What is Ch 19?

3-1 WISC
3-2 UPN
13-1 NBC
13-2 NBC
16 UPN
17 ABC
19 ???
23 CBS
42 - FOX
57-1 - note: really nice picture off of this one.
57-2

19.1 NBC ch 15 from Madison

OK, got the CM4228 on the roof on a small tripod mount with a 10' mast.

What's curious is that 13-1/13-2 is so spotty. Makes me wonder if they are on reduced power or something.

Also, my Samsung DirecTV box *STILL* won't get UPN-16. It mus really hate something in the PSIP data. An engineer friend from Milwaukee brought down a sencore receiver which pulled it right in.
Steve

WREX-DT is at relatively low power, 55 kilowatts, with a whopping 1 megawatt
coming by next summer. The station should be an absolute freaking blowtorch
at that point, and when it moves back to 13 after analog shutdown. As it is,
I have no trouble pulling it in here in DeKalb, with my ChannelMaster 4228
turned east to pick up Chicago stations. Speaking of blowtorches...if the FCC
allows WTVO after analog shutdown to go to 1 mw, it will be a monster. 1 mw
at channel 16 goes farther than 1 mw at channel 54, where WREX-DT is now.
As it stands, WTVO-DT can frequently be picked up in the southern suburbs
of Chicago, and on my antenna...even when pointed east...it pegs my signal
meter.

Also, I have heard reports that particular box, and DirecTV HD boxes also
can't pull in 16.1...I've seen the latter first hand. I personally think that is
a receiver problem. But I've notified the engineer tonight about both issues
again. In either case...WTVO-DT is currently the strongest Rockford DTV
signal as of right now, and by a mile. It rivals WREX-TV analog's monster
signal.

WTVO is now showing UPN 16 as 17.2. Audio levels are low and they
are aware of it. Unfortunately, they just can't turn a dial to increase
the volume.

WQRF-DT is now showing 39.1 once again.

WTVO is now showing UPN 16 as 17.2. Audio levels are low and they
are aware of it. Unfortunately, they just can't turn a dial to increase
the volume.

WQRF-DT is now showing 39.1 once again.

Kudos on both points. I can finally see UPN locally again! :-) I hope they don't FIX it, at least that they fix nothing more than the audio levels.

A little birdie just told me to tune into WREX-DT 13.2 at 9 PM on 10/4/05 (Tuesday).
He couldn't say anything more before he was shot down by hunters. ;-)

You posted that at 1:23 AM on 10/5 (Wednesday). Do you mean 10/5?

You posted that at 1:23 AM on 10/5 (Wednesday). Do you mean 10/5?

No, I posted that at 8:23 PM. Your settings are showing Greenwich Mean Time, not central time; you need to adjust that.

As it turns out, 13.2 will show WB 14's newscasts at 9 PM. They had an audio problem last night which hopefully will be fixed tonight.

No, I posted that at 8:23 PM. Your settings are showing Greenwich Mean Time, not central time; you need to adjust that.

As it turns out, 13.2 will show WB 14's newscasts at 9 PM. They had an audio problem last night which hopefully will be fixed tonight.
Oops. My mistake. :)

I've had problems getting in 13-1 recently (I live 15 minutes south of Madison) so I need to do some antenna tweaking before I can watch it anyway.

Does anyone know if the 39.1 signal is going to get any stronger? I'm in Rockton and I get all the other local's fine (13.1,13.2,17.1.17.2,23.1).

I have moved my antenna as much as possible, and the best I can get the 39.1 signal is 61%. :(
And I think all I need is probably 65%. All of my other signals are at about 80%.

Does anyone know where fox is broadcasting from? Aren't they near all the other Rockford stations? Is it because Fox isn't sending out a strong enough signal?

You may want to point it farther north and try for Madison Fox 47.1 (11) if you dont get anything on 39.1. 47.1 is HD where 39.1 is only digital at this point. At my house in Rockford I point my antenna W- NW and get both Fox stations.

Does anyone know where fox is broadcasting from? Aren't they near all the other Rockford stations? Is it because Fox isn't sending out a strong enough signal?
I'll answer the last three questions:

1. From a tower on the west side of Rockford, just east of channel 23.
2. Yes they are.
3. Yes. They are only at 2,300 watts. WTVO pumps out 196,000; WREX, 55,000
and WIFR nearly the same as WREX.

Fox is scheduled to go 1 million watts on or just before July 1, 2006, and HD as well.

As for me, I am getting them in DeKalb with a ChannelMaster 4228 8-bay UHF
antenna in my 1-story attic, and a ChannelMaster 7777 preamplifier to help overcome the weak signals. Locks fine here. What antenna are you using, and is it an
indoor or outdoor?

Thanks to both of you. I'm finally all set up!!!!! :) :)

I pointed my dish directly north, and I'm picking up all of the Madison stations. Plus a couple of extras.

Wish I would have found this forum earlier.

The stations that I'm getting now include:

(3.1,3.2,15.1,21.1,21.2,27.1,47.1,57.1)

Thanks alot.

WQRF-DT FOX TVCT Ch. 39-01 just went hot. It is broadcasting on ATSC Frequency 42. No HD content yet from what I can see. If I am not mistaken the digital tower is on or near Sandy Hollow Rd. But I am not certain on that.

UPN changing it's TVCT assignment screwed with everyone. My receiver caught this right away and remapped. I have no idea why they changed it.

I have seen WB14 news a few times on WREX subch. 13-02, I am wondering why WREX just doesn't switch that feed 24/7. They could put up a third subchannel for the Live Doppler feed.

Madison comes in OK for me....In Caledonia Area. I do get some Davenport HD channels from time to time. I am considering putting up a rotor, when I spun my antenna around during some rooftop equipment moves I could nail WFLD and WBBM out of Chicago pretty good.

Is anyone in or near Rockford receiving a useable WTTW-DT (PBS) signal from Chicago using a roof top UHF antenna. For the last year I have been enjoying PBS-Hi Def from Wisconsin Public Television broadcasting from Madison Wisconsin. The signal is always above 95% to my Fusion HDTV card (in my computer) using a Radio Shack UHF antenna in the attic. At the end of Sept. WPT dropped the HD service to save money so my only options now are to try receiving OTA DT from WTTW or wait for our local cable company (Insight) to start supplying this signal. I have no reason to believe that Insight will be doing this anytime soon. According to Google Earth the elevation at my house is 817 ft with Rockford's elevation varying from 699 to 889 ft. I estimate a roof top antenna would be approximately 30 ft above ground.

brujoh2, I can not get WTTW with a a big CM roof top ant & preamp. Im right across the street form Rock Valley college.

Jason what Davenport stations are you getting?

WQRF-DT FOX TVCT Ch. 39-01 just went hot. It is broadcasting on ATSC Frequency 42. No HD content yet from what I can see. If I am not mistaken the digital tower is on or near Sandy Hollow Rd. But I am not certain on that.

UPN changing it's TVCT assignment screwed with everyone. My receiver caught this right away and remapped. I have no idea why they changed it.

I have seen WB14 news a few times on WREX subch. 13-02, I am wondering why WREX just doesn't switch that feed 24/7. They could put up a third subchannel for the Live Doppler feed.

Madison comes in OK for me....In Caledonia Area. I do get some Davenport HD channels from time to time. I am considering putting up a rotor, when I spun my antenna around during some rooftop equipment moves I could nail WFLD and WBBM out of Chicago pretty good.

Actually, WQRF-DT has been hot for awhile...see the posts above. You are correct
about the xtmr location...Sandy Hollow Road just east of channel 23's tower by under a mile, south side of the road. HD and full power is scheduled in mid-2006.

UPN was changed because being at 16.1, it violated FCC rules. You can't have
2 ".1" subchannels, even if it remaps to a different starting number.

WB14 is a long term goal. Right now, they don't think it is worth it.

I'd like to know how you got WBBM-DT out there, must have been tropo; many folks 30 miles way from the xtmr can't get it at all!

Thanks to both of you. I'm finally all set up!!!!! :) :)

I pointed my dish directly north, and I'm picking up all of the Madison stations. Plus a couple of extras.

Wish I would have found this forum earlier.

The stations that I'm getting now include:

(3.1,3.2,15.1,21.1,21.2,27.1,47.1,57.1)

Thanks alot.
You're welcome, but are you getting 39-1 now?

Jason what Davenport stations are you getting?I can hit WQAD-DT (ABC) frequently, I can also grab WQIN-DT (PBS) ocassionally.
I have hit KWQC-DT (NBC) once only.

Is anyone in or near Rockford receiving a useable WTTW-DT (PBS) signal from Chicago using a roof top UHF antenna. Yes I have been able to lock it and it's subchannel when I swung my antenna around, overcast day, perhaps Tropo was a contributor. I also can lock a couple other channels from Chicago on good days. I can definitely lock them if I turn my antenna. I know several people in my area (Caledonia area) locking select Chicago and Milwaukee stations. All of them use the same antenna I do, it is the most poplar setup Stateline pushes, I make an exception of one of these guys who uses a Terk. All have rotors, yes even the Terk, which makes it pretty interesting in appearance. I can take a pic if your having trouble picturing it.

I am using Winegard equipment.

I can get the other three local stations in digital. Cannot even see the WQRF station as an offering.

Toshiba HDTV DirecTV receiver with an indoor antenna hooked up to it.
It is located in my basement.

Any suggestions on what to do would be appreciated. If a different antenna or location to put it, please let me know.

I am not looking to pick up the locals from other cities, just my own.

Moving the antenna up stairs may help.

Similar problem with WQRF 39. I have a squareshooter antenna connected to a Zenith HD Directv receiver. I am able to pick up 13-1, 17-1 and 23-1, but cannot get 39-1 at all.

WQRF coordinates are right in the middle of all the rest, but still can't get anything.

Hope I did this right, new to this forum. :)

they are transmitting a very low power signal right now

So, would an antenna amplifier solve this problem?

I thought squareshooters came with an amp but it couldnt hurt if it doesnt come with one.

This model didn't come with the amp. I imagine I will need the pre amp and the amp?

Probably. When was the last time you rescaned the channels on your Zenith? If you havent done one recently that maybe the reason your not getting it.

I did a rescan on both HD units a Zenith and Mitsubishi it did not recognize the channel. I tried putting it in manually, same thing, nothing. Last night I tried unsplitting the signal and ran to one unit, thinking I may be degrading the signal with the splitter, still nothing.

You can try the amp/preamp then. You dont get 47.1 from Madison do you?

(The Square Shooter 2000 comes amped , but not the 1000 model.)

No, I don't get 47.1. Is there a better type of antenna that would maybe help with this problem? I went with the square shooter because it can be hidden, which I have installed in the rafters in my garage.

Since all of my local Rockford channels are broadcast between 275-280 degrees, it seemed like a perfect fit. The 3 other local channels come in crystal clear.

So, I guess I will try getting a pre amp and amp and see if that works; however, I am open to suggestions.

Well omni directional antennas, such as yours dont do well with week signals especially indoors. It might work if you took it outside. Were/what part of town are you in? You know that 39 isnt broadcasting in HD yet. Just digital.

Northeast Rockford (Guilford/Perryville). I thought that they were broadcasting in HD as of 11/5.

I'll have to check but I haven't seen anything in HD on there but I usually watch 47.1 because they do broadcast HD and they also have the games from those 2-7 guys

Northeast Rockford (Guilford/Perryville). I thought that they were broadcasting in HD as of 11/5.
No, some people confuse DTV(ATSC) with HDTV which are two completely different items.

Last communications I had with Mike Real at Fox39 they had said that HD broadcasts were not going to begin right away and he gave me no timeframe as to when they would start on HD broadcasts. Take it into consideration that communication occurred early on this past summer.

Now I can recall that November was the time frame listed as DTV trans.

No, some people confuse DTV(ATSC) with HDTV which are two completely different items.

Last communications I had with Mike Real at Fox39 they had said that HD broadcasts were not going to begin right away and he gave me no timeframe as to when they would start on HD broadcasts. Take it into consideration that communication occurred early on this past summer.

Now I can recall that November was the time frame listed as DTV trans.

As of a month ago, WQRF was slated to go HD *and* full power at about the same time...in June 2006.

BTW, anyone notice that WREX-DT and WIFR-DT are no longer broadcasting in "stretchy-vision"? A 4:3 aspect ratio program is now shown in 4:3! And it looks
better as a result! I wonder if WQRF encouraged that?

As of a month ago, WQRF was slated to go HD *and* full power at about the same time...in June 2006.

BTW, anyone notice that WREX-DT and WIFR-DT are no longer broadcasting in "stretchy-vision"? A 4:3 aspect ratio program is now shown in 4:3! And it looks
better as a result! I wonder if WQRF encouraged that?
The CEA AW .org website showed the FCC approval pending and the forecasted DTV launch date given to the FCC was 11/05. This date was posted on the site most of the year.

The CEA AW .org website showed the FCC approval pending and the forecasted DTV launch date given to the FCC was 11/05. This date was posted on the site most of the year.
True, but I am talking about high def and 1 million watts. That's coming next summer. BTW, WQRF's digital picture quality IS very nice, even if upconverted.

Hey gang,

WIFR-TV has had interference in DeKalb (not bad) with WWME-CA (low power class A) 23 in Chicago ever since they went omnidirectional earlier this year.
You can even see it on the Comcast feed from their antenna, 100' abve ground.

Well, things are about to get much worse. WOCH-LP 28 in Chicago is moving to channel 41 starting 12/22. Guess what? Yep, 41 is WIFR's current digital signal!
Starting by Friday 12/23/05, say buh-bye to them in DeKalb when they sign on at 150 kw, unless I turn my antenna northwest. I am not going to turn my antenna
on my rotor back and forth and back and forth just to watch WIFR and burn out the motor. If they knock out my reception completely, I'm calling them. I can't get WBBM from Chicago here and now I won't get WIFR. CBS via DTV is cursed in this state.

That's really unfortunate. I'm glad I didn't spend any more money trying to pull in WIFR.

I just don't get why the FCC does things the way they do.

Hey gang,

WOCH-LP 28 in Chicago is moving to channel 41 starting 12/22. Guess what? Yep, 41 is WIFR's current digital signal!

I have two antennas. I just checked the Rockford facing antenna
and WIFR-DT is still strong and stable. Looks like I dodged this
bullet. :)


Hey gang,

WIFR-TV has had interference in DeKalb (not bad) with WWME-CA (low power class A) 23 in Chicago ever since they went omnidirectional earlier this year.
You can even see it on the Comcast feed from their antenna, 100' abve ground.

Well, things are about to get much worse. WOCH-LP 28 in Chicago is moving to channel 41 starting 12/22. Guess what? Yep, 41 is WIFR's current digital signal!
Starting by Friday 12/23/05, say buh-bye to them in DeKalb when they sign on at 150 kw, unless I turn my antenna northwest. I am not going to turn my antenna
on my rotor back and forth and back and forth just to watch WIFR and burn out the motor. If they knock out my reception completely, I'm calling them. I can't get WBBM from Chicago here and now I won't get WIFR. CBS via DTV is cursed in this state.

I was just getting WIFR borderline here in Crystal Lake (indoor antenna) - now since just about the time WOCH moved, I can't get it at all. Why would an analog signal interfere with a digital one?

Regardless of how the end product is encoded, it's still the same frequency whether it's an analog or digital.

I was just getting WIFR borderline here in Crystal Lake (indoor antenna) - now since just about the time WOCH moved, I can't get it at all. Why would an analog signal interfere with a digital one?

Reread post 237

Reread post 237
Yeah, whether it's analog or digital, it doesn't matter. Two things broadcasting on the same channel closeby interfere with each other.

Incredibly, WIFR-DT still locks for me in Rockford! Now, when there's tropo or skip from the east, that won't happen. But at least for me this morning, WIFR-DT was a bit lower than usual on the signal strength meter, and higher on the packet error meter, but it's still decent enough to lock. Seriously though, if you aren't getting WIFR-Dt now, you do need to call WIFR and let them know. I wonder
if WOCH-LP is at full power.

I've never been able to watch 23 analog (WIFR/WWME) at all because I'm almost exactly in between both signals. But at least I could get WMME on 26.2. This WIFR/WOCH thing really sucks big time.

So far so good for me out in Gilberts receiving WIFR. I have not noticed any difference in my reception since WOCH moved to channel 41. I was very worried since WIFR is also my only source for CBS HD.

So far so good for me out in Gilberts receiving WIFR. I have not noticed any difference in my reception since WOCH moved to channel 41. I was very worried since WIFR is also my only source for CBS HD.

Actually, I have been busy so I didn't have time to post---they're only at 25 kw
right now, and they are most definitely broadcasting at that power. If they get approved to go to 150 kw as per their FCC application,
however, all bets are off. There is a null to the northwest so Gilberts isn't getting any significant interference with them. I drive by that community a couple of times a week, and I must say, I like the name! :D

It should. Fox 47.1 is VHF where most HD stations are UHF.

I have a JVC HD-52G886 and subscribe to Charter Digital. They don't offer FOX-DT, so I put a bow-tie UHF antenna on the roof to receive Fox 39-DT OTA from Rockford Illinois, 12.7 miles from my home in Rockton. I receive all Rockford analog UHF channels perfectly. I don't get any digital channels however. I scanned for digital ATSC channels but none come in. The signal meter says "weak signal." What am I missing?

Thanks for the help Jeff. I guess I should try reading the "User's Guide" a bit closer.

The Winegard SS-1000 & SS-2000 will not acquire the signal. I have been told that if you are in Winnebago County, you need the Winegard HD7084P antenna. It is a large antenna, may work in attic I'm told by Winegard. Also the Channel Master CM 3020 is supposed to work.
Omni directional antennas like the first 2 dont have very much range but we have had cases where they will pickup 47.1 out of Madison. The other two would be much better choices (if mounted outside)