That's funny Haley...I can't imagine they are spending taxpayers money to put analog back up for a year. The funniest part is suggesting people tune to their digital transmission. Well, people would if they would turn up the power a little. So instead of spending money to power up the digital, they are going to buy a channel 2 antenna and transmitter for a year? Just doesn't make sense.

And a paltry 3-5 hours of HD programming a week. Pathetic. Plus resurrecting analog is going to ruin my DXing this summer!!! (bet AETN gets lots of complaints about their low power analog signal getting hammered by sporatic-E (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E-skip#Sporadic_E_propagation_.28E-skip.29) interference this summer :D )

Yea, I've logged channel 6 from Miami and ch 2 from Cuba. At one time, AETN used to shut down in the afternoons, and Cuba came booming through.

That is just a state run office for you, waste more of the damn taxpayer money when they don't have to. I wonder how many digital set top boxes they could buy with the money they are wasting, or how much more power they can afford to buy with that money. I mean, COME ON! That is just nuts.

And my other question is where is Comcast getting their PBS HD feed from if its apparently not coming from AETN itself???

That's funny Haley...I can't imagine they are spending taxpayers money to put analog back up for a year. The funniest part is suggesting people tune to their digital transmission. Well, people would if they would turn up the power a little. So instead of spending money to power up the digital, they are going to buy a channel 2 antenna and transmitter for a year? Just doesn't make sense.

It almost sounded like somebody donated it to them when they used the word "arranged". It still makes no sense putting time and money into something like this at this point. Better to make the upgrades on the digital side and just inform viewers on the digital end what the deal is and maybe get clear channel to make some public service announcements to get the word out where to point your antenna for DIGITAL OTA service.

I doubt you could even fit the antenna for PBS HD in your attic. The antennas for low band VHF are very large... and you need a very large one, since they are only transmitting about 2KW, while most others on low band are at least 50KW. UHF HD would be no problem in the attic. My antenna is outside, on the roof, and one of the larger Channel Masters, and I only get 70 % plus or minus from PBS. Being on low band means you need a very low bit rate error (or on the meter, an above average or greater than 60 signal) to keep car ignitions, light switches at your neighbors, and lightning, from trashing the data flow causing picture freezes, pixelation, and audio dropouts.
If you want PBS HD right now, plan on spending about $70 for the antenna, and mounting it at least 30' above ground outside in Maumelle.

I am picking up KETS-DT from Maumelle with a very cheap homemade attic antenna. The signal strength is low but stable. It could probably be improved with a few minor tweaks. See my previous posts for more details and pictures.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=11502504#post11502504

That's funny Haley...I can't imagine they are spending taxpayers money to put analog back up for a year. The funniest part is suggesting people tune to their digital transmission. Well, people would if they would turn up the power a little. So instead of spending money to power up the digital, they are going to buy a channel 2 antenna and transmitter for a year? Just doesn't make sense.It's not that easy. First of all, the D-to-A converter boxes for analog OTA viewers--and the $40 coupons to buy them--won't even ship till next month (reportedly on 2/17, exactly one year before the shutoff), so not everyone can "go digital" just yet. In addition, KETS can't turn up the power on their DTV transmitter without interfering with WMC-TV Memphis--which not only is still on channel 5 analog, but will move its out-of-core digital signal there in '09. (Wow, NBC-HD on VHF-low? Memphis is worse off than we are.)

Your best hope for getting a better KETS digital signal is for KATV's analog signal to stay off the air; KETS' permanent digital frequency is none other than...channel 7. Once KATV relinquishes channel 7 permanently, KETS can move its DTV signal there and finally go full-power.

And my other question is where is Comcast getting their PBS HD feed from if its apparently not coming from AETN itself???

PBS-HD is a satellite channel. Since many cable operators can't reconfigure their digital systems on-the-fly whenever PBS stations switch from the usual SD-multiplex feed to HD, PBS has a national agreement with most big cable operators (including Comcast) where they provide PBS-HD in exchange for letting cable off the hook.

If you look at AETN-DT on Comcast (channel 201) during an HD program, you see only occasional frames cutting in and out; it's unwatchable. (The other AETN multiplex channels are completely off the air; most PBS stations don't multiplex while in HD.) However, the same program can also be seen on PBS-HD at the same time. Obviously, AETN gets its HD feed from PBS-HD; it doesn't have any other HD equipment.

I started looking at the different options for me on D* today. I want to see the Cardinals games as well as the Rangers games. Those people are telling me my assign RSN's are FSN Rocky Mountain, FSN Southwest, and FSN South. I was like what in the hell when they said that. We are no where near the areas that Rocky Mountain or South covers.

Rocky Mountain does Nebraska, Kansas, parts of Montana, Idaho, Colorado I think, and a few others.

And South is from Atlanta and covers those areas around it, but interestingly enough says you can see the St. Louis Cardinals on it. I am still wondering how they can carry them as well as FSN Midwest.

When doing the zip code check for the RSN's, for the longest time it showed FSSW and FSMW along with FSRM of which I just shrugged off as being wrong. It doesn't show FSMW any more. I wonder what changed. I don't really want to have to pay the big amount for MLB Extra Innings, but I want to make sure I get to see the Rangers and the Cardinals games.

Does anyone have any experience with sports reception like I am mentioning through D*? If you do, can you tell me what I am needing to know about what to get and what not to get? I would appreciate it.

Directv just picks up AETN digital signal and chops off the sides and sends it out. I was checking tonight. The "TV-G" logo was cut in half, and at the bottom is said S.ORG (presumably should have been PBS.ORG).

Never gave a thought to WMC. I should have known that. Well, guess it will depend what 7 does. If they go digital only, maybe we will get PBS on ch 7 at full power a year earlier... Wish they would have used the analog money to buy a HD recorder to time shift tho so we could get some more good shows in HD..

Steveken, We get FSSW and FSH (Houston Astros and Texas Rangers). If you do subscribe to Extra Innings, expect to see some Cardnals games blacked out. Equity usually buys the rights to several games, and actually had them in HD last summer.

Thats not what D* says. This is a direct copy/paste from the email from them....

"Based on your zip code 72211, you have been assigned Fox Sports Rocky Mountain (ch.645), Fox Southwest (ch. 643 carries Houston Astros and Texas Rangers) and Fox Sports South (ch. 630) as your local RSNs. You are authorized to view the pro and college games shown on those channels. Due to contractual broadcast rights between the networks and the leagues, those who live outside of your area are not authorized to view the same games.

Unfortunately, the St. Louis Cardinal games are considered out of your market. However, most of our sports subscriptions are showing available games in HD, including MLB EXTRA INNINGS."

Now, when I go to their website and put in my zip code to check RSN's, it lists the same thing except FSN South is not there.

Well, if you believe Directv, try tuning in those RSN's and report the "service not authorized" message and see if you have any luck getting them turned on. Been there, done that. Arkansas gets FSSW and FSH..and a couple others depending on your base package.

I have never gotten FSH. I got STO for a little while, but its gone now and I am not sure why it was on, but have never gotten FSH nor do I know anyone that has gotten it. I know Dish gets FSMW for some reason (at least my dad does. I am not sure if he gets FSSW).

When I turn to those channels it just says "Channel not purchased". I am thinking if I really am supposed to get even FSRM like the website, then I should be seeing it on, but I am not. Not real sure if its worth calling them up about it or not.

check 610, 639, and 639-1, 643. Might be FSH is only available in Mena area.

whats the mena zip?

Channel not purchased 610, nothing at all on 639 or 639-1, and of course I get the 643.

You will have to check FSH when there is a program on. They only come on for games. I have no idea what my zip code is :)

If we are supposed to get FSH as well, I wonder why it isn't listed on the D* page when you do the zip check.

I called em about a month ago because a game was blacked out on FSSW and they tried telling me I got all those other RSN's. I asked why I got a error on them, and he basically told me it was controlled by the uplink center, and his data was probably inaccuate. I don't think anyone knows. I do know he said he couldn't turn them on for me, even though he said he showed I should get them. He tried, wouldn't turn on.

I called em about a month ago because a game was blacked out on FSSW and they tried telling me I got all those other RSN's. I asked why I got a error on them, and he basically told me it was controlled by the uplink center, and his data was probably inaccuate. I don't think anyone knows. I do know he said he couldn't turn them on for me, even though he said he showed I should get them. He tried, wouldn't turn on.

Nice attic antenna pix too. 1/2 wave dipole for channel 5 ??? Not bad. Didn't think that low a reading would be stable.

Nice attic antenna pix too. 1/2 wave dipole for channel 5 ??? Not bad. Didn't think that low a reading would be stable.

It reads in the 40's on a DirecTV HR20 after being spliced with the feed from my CM4228. I only notice occasional dropouts mostly when I switch a house light on or off. If I were to make the antenna over again I would definitely use wood instead of PVC pipe. It really bows in a hot attic.

Just curious if you were to run each side of the dipole diectly off the 300 ohm feedpoint of the UHF antenna if you would get better results not using the combiner. Theoretically, that's the same way the do it with multiband antennas.

Since katv is already back on the air, on a digital sub-channel of an equity-owned station in LR , and
KETS-DT is also still on the air.

And since KETS-DT was going to change to katv's VHF channel 7 post analog:

It would be in the best interest of both stations to abandon analog now. They should heavily promote digital OTA TV and inform viewers how to get cheap digital TV converters with the coupon program.

Then ASAP, build a brand new state of the art digital-only transmitter site (preferably at Shinall, where the other LR stations are located).

End result would be:
katv-dt on channel 22 at full power
KETS-DT on channel 7 at full power
Less antenna headaches for the LR area OTA viewers.

It would save allbritton and Ark. taxpayers a ton of money.

whats the mena zip?71953

That's good and all except the converters aren't exactly available yet.

Just as I thought, the Mena zip lists the same RSN's as I saw with the LR zip. I think that maybe Dave gets FSH by accident. I won't know until 7:30 tonight though when some content shows up on it.

Just curious if you were to run each side of the dipole diectly off the 300 ohm feedpoint of the UHF antenna if you would get better results not using the combiner. Theoretically, that's the same way the do it with multiband antennas.

I haven't thought about that. I might try it if this was a long term solution, but I will be pulling it down in a year when KETS-DT moves to 7 full power. Hopefully my 4228 will get it then since it will be high-band VHF.

... I will be pulling it down in a year when KETS-DT moves to 7 full power. Hopefully my 4228 will get it then since it will be high-band VHF.Before seven's tower became "seven on it's side" (sorry, couldn't resist), could you get their blurry analog channel 7 broadcast with your 4228? If so, you should be able to get KETS-DT 7 whenever they get on the air. Only possible problem might be impulse noise that plagues digital channels in the VHF band. Not quite as bad on 7 -13 as lowband VHF (chs 2 -6), but it's annoying just the same. Especially when the audio drops out.

I can get KOAM, a snowy analog 7 from Pittsburg KS/Joplin MO with my 4228. But it's about 63 mi away and I've got some major hills in that direction in the way. I also get KTUL analog ch 8 from Tulsa when the wind's right. It's over 100 mi away.

VHF chs 9, 10 & 13 come in perfectly with that antenna. Channel 10 is 71 mi away in Springfield, MO, but I have clear LOS.

That's good and all except the converters aren't exactly available yet.Coupon applications are being taken now. Converters should be available within the next few weeks. And certainly before they can construct another tower. Unless they do something really makeshift.

Regardless, rebuilding an analog KETS is costing you and me, the taxpayers, money. Money that shouldn't be wasted on it.

Some stations in Calif. and all of Western Kansas' public tv stations have already shut down analog.

Could someone check their Comcast QAM feed of Channel 11 HD feed (kthv). Mine went dark or to a sputtering audio only. Was wondering if they scrambled it in error or there is something wrong with my tuner.

Before seven's tower became "seven on it's side" (sorry, couldn't resist), could you get their blurry analog channel 7 broadcast with your 4228? If so, you should be able to get KETS-DT 7 whenever they get on the air. Only possible problem might be impulse noise that plagues digital channels in the VHF band. Not quite as bad on 7 -13 as lowband VHF (chs 2 -6), but it's annoying just the same. Especially when the audio drops out.

I can get KOAM, a snowy analog 7 from Pittsburg KS/Joplin MO with my 4228. But it's about 63 mi away and I've got some major hills in that direction in the way. I also get KTUL analog ch 8 from Tulsa when the wind's right. It's over 100 mi away.

VHF chs 9, 10 & 13 come in perfectly with that antenna. Channel 10 is 71 mi away in Springfield, MO, but I have clear LOS.

I never checked any of the analog channels. If it doesn't work I will probably just make a new cut length antenna.

wxguy, KTHV-DT and THV2 are both showing no signal on my clearQAM TV. I am thinking that either they changed the frequencies they are running on, or there is something wrong with their feed into Ccast.

Since katv is already back on the air, on a digital sub-channel of an equity-owned station in LR , and
KETS-DT is also still on the air.

And since KETS-DT was going to change to katv's VHF channel 7 post analog:

It would be in the best interest of both stations to abandon analog now. They should heavily promote digital OTA TV and inform viewers how to get cheap digital TV converters with the coupon program.

Then ASAP, build a brand new state of the art digital-only transmitter site (preferably at Shinall, where the other LR stations are located).

End result would be:
katv-dt on channel 22 at full power
KETS-DT on channel 7 at full power
Less antenna headaches for the LR area OTA viewers.

It would save allbritton and Ark. taxpayers a ton of money.

Someone seriously needs to do an FOI request on AETN on the costs of this temporary analog transmitter. Unless the equipment is being donated, AETN should not spend ONE PENNY on restoring channel 2 analog service. From what I've been able to see, this will have less coverage than the crippled Ch5 digital assignment AETN swapped Equity for.

If only AETN had built KETS-DT on Ch 47 in the first place....

wxguy, KTHV-DT and THV2 are both showing no signal on my clearQAM TV. I am thinking that either they changed the frequencies they are running on, or there is something wrong with their feed into Ccast.

Thanks for the feedback. I rescanned the channels earlier to see if they had changed freqs. Same dead result. I gave my boxes back to Comcast so don't have a way to see if they are actually sending/decoding anything.

What height on Clear Channels tower is KETS-DT running at? Anyone know? I went out east today, and I didn't start seeing any antennas pointed toward Memphis til I was around Brinkley. I don't see how running more than 2KW from Redfield would cause any interference to WMC, rather I would expect WMC would cause problems with KETS-DT.

What height on Clear Channels tower is KETS-DT running at? Anyone know? .

KETS AR LITTLE ROCK USA (Digital)

Licensee: ARKANSAS EDUCATIONAL TELEVISION COMMISSION
Service Designation: DT Digital television station

Channel: 5 76 - 82 MHz Licensed
File No.: BLEDT-20041213ABI Facility ID number: 2770
CDBS Application ID No.: 1034571

34° 26' 31.00" N Latitude
92° 13' 3.00 " W Longitude (NAD 27)

Polarization: Horizontal (H)
Effective Radiated Power (ERP): 2.1 kW ERP
Antenna Height Above Average Terrain: 548. meters HAAT -- Calculate HAAT
Antenna Height Above Mean Sea Level: 631. meters AMSL
Antenna Height Above Ground Level: 528. meters AGL

TV Zone: 2
Frequency Offset: 0 (zero)

Directional Antenna ID No.: 59247 Pattern Rotation: 0.00
Antenna Make: AND Antenna Model: ALB1V1-HSCX-5

Relative Field values for directional antenna Relative Field polar plot
Relative field values do not include any pattern rotation that may be indicated above.

0° 0.509 60° 0.204 120° 0.850 180° 0.960 240° 0.834 300° 0.839
10° 0.388 70° 0.262 130° 0.971 190° 0.939 250° 0.732 310° 0.924
20° 0.336 80° 0.336 140° 0.996 200° 0.806 260° 0.807 320° 0.996
30° 0.262 90° 0.388 150° 0.926 210° 0.733 270° 0.938 330° 0.973
40° 0.204 100° 0.509 160° 0.838 220° 0.832 280° 0.961 340° 0.849
50° 0.221 110° 0.680 170° 0.875 230° 0.907 290° 0.875 350° 0.681

Source: FCC TV Query.

(http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/tvq?list=0&facid=2770)

Thanks Haley... That what, about 1600 ft?? If they are running a directional antenna, obviously pointing away from Memphis, why the low power restriction? Protection for WMC or just bought a cheap low power transmitter since they knew they wouldn't be staying on ch 5? Can they even run more power if they got FCC permission?

Steveken, Looks like I'm getting FSH but the pro games are blacked out...Imagine its so Ill buy their premium package. 639 and 639-1 coming in fine, but got a "not subscribed" during the game itself. Bitched to Directv and they gave me a 6 month $10 credit for my inability to watch the game...go figure....Sounds like those clueless CSR's.

Has anyone by chance noticed any audio/video sync issues with Fox the last week? I strongly suspect it's my HTPC, but I just wanted to confirm it wasn't the feed. I noticed it during this weekend's football (namely commercials) and even moreso while my wife and I watched a certain popular show last night that will not be named for fear of getting flamed. :)

I haven't noticed anything lately. I watched both of the terminators on sunday and monday and there wasn't anything wrong. Of course, I didn't watch commercials as I hate them, so I don't know on that part.

As far as the flaming, you will only the flames of hell licking at your heels for watching American Garbage. Just kidding, while I can't stand the show, I will not condemn anyone for watching it. I just can only hope the further stupification of America by that show will stop soon. :) Its just how can one be an "Idol" just by singing alone? Doesn't it take more skill and talent other than singing to be truely considered an "artist"? I haven't watched the show much at all, so I don't know what else they emphasize in the process. And the fact that people are willing to get on national television and mess up on purpose and to make a complete ass out of themselves on purpose is just something that just boggles my mind.

I still haven't heard anything back about my waiver for ABC HD DNS, but its only been 2 days. Anyone else heard anything about 7's current plans for erecting new equipment? Or any kinds of rumblings around the engineering community?

Has anyone by chance noticed any audio/video sync issues with Fox the last week? I strongly suspect it's my HTPC, but I just wanted to confirm it wasn't the feed. I noticed it during this weekend's football (namely commercials) and even moreso while my wife and I watched a certain popular show last night that will not be named for fear of getting flamed. :)

I watched our OTA digital last night via a Dish 622 and did not notice any sync issues. I also watched the games this weekend and did not see any problems. I am pulling a copy off our confidence recorder also, just to check, but I am pretty sure my phone would have been lit up had there been a sync issue.

E

I watched our OTA digital last night via a Dish 622 and did not notice any sync issues. I also watched the games this weekend and did not see any problems. I am pulling a copy off our confidence recorder also, just to check, but I am pretty sure my phone would have been lit up had there been a sync issue.
Thanks for the response guys. Like I said, I figured my HTPC was the culprit, but I wanted to confirm 100% before I went chasing a problem that perhaps didn't exist.

Again, thanks.

I watched our OTA digital last night via a Dish 622 and did not notice any sync issues. I also watched the games this weekend and did not see any problems. I am pulling a copy off our confidence recorder also, just to check, but I am pretty sure my phone would have been lit up had there been a sync issue.

E

Meaning you work for KLRT?

Is there any chance that DTV would let me have the HD national PBS because our local station does so little HD broadcasting?

Directv doesn't have a PBS HD national. Yet. If you want to spend about $500, you can get it direct from PBS with a 3' dish and HD FTA receiver. I just can't justify it until I see what Directv is planning on doing when their next HD sat launches.

Directv doesn't have a PBS HD national. Yet. If you want to spend about $500, you can get it direct from PBS with a 3' dish and HD FTA receiver. I just can't justify it until I see what Directv is planning on doing when their next HD sat launches.Well, crap. Nope, don't want to spend $500 either. When's the launch of the next HD sat?

If anyone is interested Direct tv DNS elegibility page is showing ABC as elegible for HD access. I live in Searcy and show to have a B grade moderate signal. Hopefully that will help fast track the paperwork.

If anyone is interested Direct tv DNS elegibility page is showing ABC as elegible for HD access. I live in Searcy and show to have a B grade moderate signal. Hopefully that will help fast track the paperwork.

Unfortunately, that isn't correct for me. They are not showing ABC as eligible because they still show KATV as being on the air with a Grade A signal for me. Does it actually show eligible beside the line for KATV? I ask because the rule has always been if you have a Grade A or B signal, you have to file for a waiver which is rarely granted, according to that page, for people with A or B.

I already have my waiver in to KATV, but don't expect a response on it for quite some time as I am but a lowly customer and they have much much bigger fish to fry. I WISH they had it listed as eligible on that page, but they don't. Oh well.

Got a response to my email suggestion a full power digital on Shinall Mt. They basically said they had not made any decisions regarding the location yet. At lease that sounds to me like it POSSIBLE they are considering alternatives. All you guys write em and put in your suggestions. I used the contact page on their website. Wish allenf was still active on here. One of you guys that talk to him, invite him back on.

Johnny, they just launched the satellite that was in line before Directv11. That puts its launch in about two months. It will be a direct launch into geostationary transfer orbit, unlike Directv10 that took a month just to get there...SO, maybe late spring, early summer?

Johnny, they just launched the satellite that was in line before Directv11. That puts its launch in about two months. It will be a direct launch into geostationary transfer orbit, unlike Directv10 that took a month just to get there...SO, maybe late spring, early summer?
Ok, thanks.

Got a response to my email suggestion a full power digital on Shinall Mt. They basically said they had not made any decisions regarding the location yet. At lease that sounds to me like it POSSIBLE they are considering alternatives. All you guys write em and put in your suggestions. I used the contact page on their website. Wish allenf was still active on here. One of you guys that talk to him, invite him back on.

See this link for a story about the subject in the paper:

http://www.masonatkinson.org/post/23950719

Ok guys, the article says they are considering Shinall...Get those emails sent....

Meaning you work for KLRT?

Yes, I work for KLRT and KASN.

E

Ok guys, the article says they are considering Shinall...Get those emails sent....I've missed some posts here. They, meaning katv or KETS?

According to Earl Bonovich, moderator at dbstalk.
Thread posted HERE (http://www.dbstalk.com/showpost.php?p=1393985&postcount=422).

What height on Clear Channels tower is KETS-DT running at? Anyone know? I went out east today, and I didn't start seeing any antennas pointed toward Memphis til I was around Brinkley. I don't see how running more than 2KW from Redfield would cause any interference to WMC, rather I would expect WMC would cause problems with KETS-DT.KFSM-5 in Ft. Smith also has interference protection. Their signal reaches all the way to at least Russellville and nearly to Hot Springs. I doubt the FCC will allow KETS-DT5 to increase power at all.

If AETN had kept their original UHF channel 47 assignment, they would already had an interference-free, full power DT on the air.

Sounds like a winner. Just as long as its the same height as KLRT, KTHV/KARK's tower and not KWBF.

Plus WABG-DT would likely keep some of those newly gained HDTV OTA viewers in eastern Drew, southeast Lincoln, and Desha County ;) If only WABG and KARK weren't on the same channel...

See this link for a story about the subject in the paper:

http://www.masonatkinson.org/post/23950719

Wow, for an AP story, they sure did a crappy job when reading over it for grammar.

"REDFIELD — A television tower that for more than 40 years was one of the tallest structures in the world(,) will not be replaced by a mast of similar height."

"The station knocked out the ABC affiliate’s analog and digital signals and also disrupted the analog signal of KETS, a Public Broadcasting Service station." Really? The station knocked it out? Don't they mean "The collapse"? Or "The collapse of the tower"?

"The station is considering whether to rebuilt at Redfield, about 20 miles south of Little Rock, ". Okay, how do you "rebuilt" something? "The station is considering whether to rebuild at Redfield,...." is the proper grammar for that sentence. :)

I mean, come on! This is a professional organization and they let crap like that out? I know my opinion of the first sentence my be off, but I think the other two examples are pretty dead on. :)

Unfortunately, that isn't correct for me. They are not showing ABC as eligible because they still show KATV as being on the air with a Grade A signal for me. Does it actually show eligible beside the line for KATV? I ask because the rule has always been if you have a Grade A or B signal, you have to file for a waiver which is rarely granted, according to that page, for people with A or B.

I already have my waiver in to KATV, but don't expect a response on it for quite some time as I am but a lowly customer and they have much much bigger fish to fry. I WISH they had it listed as eligible on that page, but they don't. Oh well.

Yeah that is what it said ABC was listed as eligible but nbc cbs and fox was listed as grade b moderate. here is the text from the chart.

Digital (HD) Distant Network Service
Network Affiliate Status
ABC Eligible
CBS KTHV-DT Grade B (moderate signal)
FOX KLRT-DT Grade B (moderate signal)
NBC KARK-DT Grade B (moderate signal)

I don't understand why your listed as eligible while I am not. I wonder if their assuming that people in town are able to get it easier than people out in surrounding areas. Its just really weird. You are in luck though cause you don't have to apply for a waiver anymore. All you have to do is call them and tell them to turn it on.

You say you live in Searcy? Hmmm, maybe if I change my address to my Grandparents house I can do it too. They live in Higginson.

Edit: Nope, I just put in their address with 72068 and it shows this:

Digital (HD) Distant Network Service
Network Affiliate Status
ABC KATV-DT Grade B (moderate signal)
CBS KTHV-DT Grade A (strong signal)
FOX KLRT-DT Grade A (strong signal)
NBC KARK-DT Grade B (moderate signal)

Well, my FTA receiver came in, and it appears my LNB is bad, won't pick up a signal anywhere in the sky. Perfect 10 in town wouldn't sell to me because I wasn't a dealer, so tomorrow I'm gonna use my bosses business info and sign us up to be a dealer. They have Channel Master and all sorts of goodies. Once set up, if anyone around here needs anything, Ill be able to get it, hopefully.

At least Mississippi Public Broadcasting (MPB) gets it concerning the Analog Shutdown. Link to the post (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=12855479#post12855479) I made over on the Greenwood/Greenville board.

Per the masonatkinson.org article, tower heights of 2,000 feet or more are obsolete, said Debbie Hook, an assistant to KATV president Dale Nicholson.

Am I missing something or did the laws of physics change? Last I heard, increased tower/antenna height means increased distance. Guess they mean by obsolete that everyone should just have a dish or cable, and not use OTA. If that is the case why bother with a tower at all?

steveken,
An address in Mena will get you all the NY HD big 4 (abc, cbs, fox, nbc), plus LR SD locals on D*.

Don't ask me how to "move" your service address, though. A little googling will find the answer.

In a perfect world...

KATV abandons Analog and builds 1000' tower on Shinall, while using KWBF's tower temporarily to run KATV-DT on ch 22 at full power.

KETS decides to use the money they were going to waste on resurecting Analog for 12 months, and put up a full power transmitter on ch 7, and use the extra money to buy a HD recorder so they can show NOVA and reruns in HD...

Directv announces D11 will carry LR Locals including all 4 PBS stations as well as THV2.

KLRT upgrades to HD newcasts and shocks viewers by showing the storys rather than telling you what you are going to hear about in 30 minutes after 20 commercials.

Hank's Fine furnature actually starts selling some.

Car dealers' spokepersons all come down with a sore throat and can't yell anymore.

Congress recinds previous law, and allows cable and sat companies to offer packages of networks stations, and allows subscribing to the opposite coasts feeds. A $5 per month surcharge goes to the local stations for possible lost ad revenue.

Neighboring Locals within spot beam reception range can be subscribed to.

Well...one can always dream.

The FCC mandates UHF for all digital TV broadcasting

The FCC reimposes ban on program-length commercials, and revokes E/I requirements for subchannels.

Subchannels are only permitted on 720p stations

Full power DTV stations located within 220mi of each other cannot use the same channel assignment.

KATV dumps LFS/Raycom/Jefferson Pilot SEC sports and KWBF carries them

KATV purchases DD 5.1 equipment and proper HDTV time shifting equipment

D.N.sr Retires

okay, its a start...... :D

Let's see...

Collect insurance for 2000 foot tower. Replace with 1000 foot or less tower.

Any ideas how the leftover money will be spent?

Digital storage for infomercials?

Is it me, or is 42-1 actually showing "Bad Girls" in HD? Its pretty nice looking too. And I can actually receive it. :)

They showed Cards games in HD last summer. If it was a MY feed, it could have been HD. They can do HD.

Yeah, 42-1 added the ability to air HD right about the time MyNetwork cut back the amount of HD they aired. Back when they started the networks programming was actually all HD, of course it was nothing but recycled Mexican soap operas.

Wonder if they will let KATV show "lost" premier in HD?

Sorry guys, noob here and late to the fight.... without going through 150 pages of posts, can someone explain to me why my little-old-lady mother can't get HD locals living in Hot Springs? She upgraded to a HD-DVR (the non-OTA version) and is ticked that once again (just like the old days of D* not carrying SD locals) she is getting shut out of HD programming. She can't believe that hooking up her 12 year old antenna, that's just been collecting rust since D* started carrying locals way-back-when is hard at work again carrying the latest HD signals to her ATSC tuner LCD flat panel.

I mean, frankly, with 2009 fast approaching, why does my Mom's roof have to look like NORAD just to get HD?

We applied for a waiver, but I figure that's going to be futile.

What's this A and B quality signal and where do I find it?

Is there any hope for ABC in HD in Hot Springs?

-fate

PS, she's actually out in Diamondhead if that helps anyone.

steveken,
An address in Mena will get you all the NY HD big 4 (abc, cbs, fox, nbc), plus LR SD locals on D*.

Don't ask me how to "move" your service address, though. A little googling will find the answer.I entered a Mena zip code and sure enough, eligible for HD! Hmmmm.

Fatespawn...Welcome.

As for Directv, they will start carrying LR HD as soon as they launch the satellite to carry them, scheduled launch is in 2 months.

No one can get ABC in HD right now, unless they get it from Directv via New York (with waiver). OTA should be avaiable in Hot Springs if she could previously receive the analog signals. If she got the HR21 or H21 directv receiver, she will have to plug the antenna coax into the tv and use its built in ATSC tuner, or purchase a ATSC add on box for her Directv receiver (available in a month or so).

Hope that answers your questions.

Sorry guys, noob here and late to the fight.... without going through 150 pages of posts, can someone explain to me why my little-old-lady mother can't get HD locals living in Hot Springs? She upgraded to a HD-DVR (the non-OTA version) and is ticked that once again (just like the old days of D* not carrying SD locals) she is getting shut out of HD programming. She can't believe that hooking up her 12 year old antenna, that's just been collecting rust since D* started carrying locals way-back-when is hard at work again carrying the latest HD signals to her ATSC tuner LCD flat panel. They should have installed an HR20, which has an OTA tuner, so she could record the HD locals received with antenna.

To see if she qualifies for the NY networks in HD, enter her address at:
http://directvdnseligibility.decisionmark.com/app/AddressForm.aspx
If so, just call D* and ask for the HD DNS department. Tell them the address qualifies and she'd like the channels turned on. If qualified, they're free, with subscription to LR SD locals.

She'll be glad that antenna's still connected to her TV when the first hard rainstorm comes along and she loses D* reception :)

Just a note, KATV from Galaxy10 looks pretty good. Not much pixellation, and video levels appear good. And K2 Cheyenne Wyo ABC affiliate looking good too. Lots of stuff on G10, all SD of course, but pretty fun looking around.

Is channel 7 or 2 going to be on the air again at some point? Or are they the new pioneers of Local Cable TV stations? ;)

Channel 7 is on the air on digital channel 44 subchannel 3, and Channel 2 is on the air on digital channel 5. Neither has analog in operation. Ch 7 has not announced any plans to put one back on. Channel 2 plans to attempt putting analog back on at reduced power and height. Go digital man. Its the "very near" future.

Is channel 7 or 2 going to be on the air again at some point? Or are they the new pioneers of Local Cable TV stations? ;)Welcome to the forum.

If you don't yet have a digital TV and don't want to replace a TV you already have, I stongly suggest you apply for rebate coupons for digital converters to update your analog TV(s). You're going to have to go digital sometime in the next 13 months, you might as well get ready ASAP. And you can be watching KETS & katv long before they get back on the air in analog (if ever).

Order coupons here: https://dtv2009.gov
Digital converters should be available in stores within the next few weeks. Coupons will be sent out about the time converters are in stores.

Another option is go to wallyworld and pick up one of these digital VCR/DVD recorders and use the tuner in it. Connect it to your analog TV:
http://i.walmart.com/i/p/00/05/38/18/57/0005381857045_215X215.jpg (http://i.walmart.com/i/p/00/05/38/18/57/0005381857045_215X215.jpg)

Cost: $159.88 Click HERE (http://i.walmart.com/i/p/00/05/38/18/57/0005381857045_215X215.jpg) for specs.

Just got a new receiver (audio), and hooked it all up...

Is KTHV-DT not doing Dolby Digital? Receiver switches to prologicII when I tune in 11-1. KARK and KLRT show DD. I'm really surprised...thought 11 was the leader...

I've been wanting a new receiver for a while. The one I have is from 99 or 98. It only has Pro Logic, no Pro Logic II, and Dolby Digital. It's pretty antiquated by todays standards. Just having a real hard time trying to figure out which one to get. Would love to have one that takes HDMI in....maybe two of them. Would be nice to have a couple of Optical In's as well....well, I guess I would really only need 1 if the receiver could take in the HR20's signal through HDMI. I just have NO clue what to get.

Well, I decided this time to buy something different. Always bought Pioneer, but this is the second one in 10 yrs that failed with "Poweroff" & failed to restart. I bought a Denon this time. I couldn't justify the extra $200 for the HDMI input model, so I just use it for audio...and use Toslink...its got two optical and two coaxial. Got it at Circuit City for $269. Have my HR20, HTPC, DVD recorder hooked up digital, and FTA, and H20 hooked up analog. I'd hook the H20 digital too if I could find a toslink to coax adapter.

Just got a new receiver (audio), and hooked it all up...

Is KTHV-DT not doing Dolby Digital? Receiver switches to prologicII when I tune in 11-1. KARK and KLRT show DD. I'm really surprised...thought 11 was the leader...

What was on when you checked KTHV-DT? They have been doing Dolby Digital since March of '06 I believe, about the same time KARK-DT started HD and Dolby Digital. Before then, only KLRT-DT had 5.1 audio. KASN-DT is still just stereo, and of course, KATV-DT was as well, so maybe they will upgrade whenever they get a new transmitter up.

Edit: Just checked and the football game on KTHV-DT is Dolby Digital 5.1.

I was watching the pregame show. It was DD5.1 on WCBS, but you are right, its on during the game.

I've been wanting a new receiver for a while. The one I have is from 99 or 98. It only has Pro Logic, no Pro Logic II, and Dolby Digital. It's pretty antiquated by todays standards. Just having a real hard time trying to figure out which one to get. Would love to have one that takes HDMI in....maybe two of them. Would be nice to have a couple of Optical In's as well....well, I guess I would really only need 1 if the receiver could take in the HR20's signal through HDMI. I just have NO clue what to get.

Steveken - I just bought the Onkyo TX-SR605 for myself this past Christmas. This is the first A/V receiver I have purchased. Previously I had a Pro Logic Pioneer system. I did all the research and for the money (under $400) you get the most bang for you buck with this receiver. See the specs here http://www.onkyousa.com/model.cfm?m=TX-SR605&class=Receiver&p=i

Welcome Movieboy_hd. Nice to see all these new people posting.

You know, Davenlr, that is a good point. I didn't realize that was all the HDMI inputs on a receiver were for mainly was a video switcher. I guess that is a very valid point. If I am really wanting to concentrate on multiple audio sources, then I don't really need to concern myself with one with HDMI inputs, just multiple TOSlink or Digital Coax connections.

Incidentally, what do you use for your digital coax feeds to the receiver? Like I have said before, I just use a regular rca cable that I had extra and it seems to work for the most part. Just wondering what others use. I think, for right now at least, if I had one with 2 TOSlink connections on it and had another cable for it, I would be golden for my setup as I have 2 TOSlink devices, but only one cable and one input on my current Kenwood receiver.

Movieboy_hd, that link didn't work for me for some reason.

Channel 7 is on the air on digital channel 44 subchannel 3, and Channel 2 is on the air on digital channel 5.

Thanks, so much. I'll go rescan for those right away.

This isn't on antennaweb, is there some online resource that has this information? I looked all over the katv website but I could not see where they mentioned on what channel they were broadcasting.

I was still looking for 7 on 22.1 and 2 on 2.1.

Where are they broadcasting from? Not that I have many options for my antenna pointing, if I move it to much I lose KTHV ( 11.1 ).

Squidi

Well, HDMI carries digital audio as well as video, so you could use it with the amp, I just preferred to keep my video switching in the monitor and audio in the A/V receiver. My problem is I have more toslink devices than inputs. I'm going to see if my monitors toslink output sends whatever is coming in on the hdmi cable through, or if its "redigitized" after the monitors own audio amp. If the former, I'm gonna run one toslink from my monitor to my amp, and free up the two digital inputs I need.

I just use standard RG6 video cables with rca connectors for the coax.

KATV is broadcasting using KWBF's digital transmitter from Shinall Mt in W Lr. It should show up as 42-3. KETS is VERY low power digital on channel 5 from Redfield on the CW 38 tower.

If you have a Free to Air setup, KATV is on Galaxy 10 also.

Free to Air = FTA
It is a satellite dish system, not to be confused with Over The Air (OTA).

KWBF-DT's tower (the station KATV-DT is being multicast on) is located HERE (http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=DT657998.html).

If you're having problems with KTHV-DT, it may be the antenna you're using. They're on VHF. Most digital channels are on UHF (where they belong).

Is KASN-DT transmitting at full power OTA?

Is KASN-DT transmitting at full power OTA?

Yep...KASN (both transmitters) is running at full power.

E

errett, thanks for taking the time to share your knowledge and giving us answers to our questions.

You may not know the answer to this but maybe someone will. On the D* HR20 OTA signal meter, what information am I seeing when I look at "signal meter" information and see a reading of 100 to 95 and sometimes it is changing like going from 95 to 93, then back to 95 and then to 98? Am I seeing RF signal strength, or some digital information?

Thanks again.

So when is KATV expected to be back to "normal"? I can't receive 42-3 in Searcy. However, I was receiving KATV-DT just fine before the tower fall.

I'm not going to tune my antenna just to pick up 42-3, as it took forever to get it tuned to a point where KARK-DT, KATV-DT, KTHV-DT, KLRT-DT and KASN-DT all come it a reasonable strength without drop-outs.

Welcome to the forum.

I heard about a year for katv to get back on their allotted digital channel (22) at full power on a new antenna. They may relocate to Shinall Mtn., where all the other central ark. stations (except kasn) are located.

You might try moving your antenna in favor of Shinall stations just to see if you can get katv. You should be able to, since KWBF is supposedly getting all the way out past Heber Springs. You may need to rescan. Of course, you may lose KASN.

http://www.fcc.gov/ftp/Bureaus/MB/Databases/fm_tv_service_areas/maps/DT657998.gif


What antenna are you using?

On the D* HR20 OTA signal meter, what information am I seeing when I look at "signal meter" information and see a reading of 100 to 95 and sometimes it is changing like going from 95 to 93, then back to 95 and then to 98? Am I seeing RF signal strength, or some digital information?BelElDel, I would think would just be the RF signal strength. I know it doesn't show SNR or errors, etc.

If you're some distance from LR, the changes you're seeing in signal strength may be due to changing weather conditions. If it's jumping back & forth, it could be caused by multipath or some type of RF interference.

Welcome to the forum.

I heard about a year for katv to get back on their allotted digital channel (22) at full power on a new antenna. They may relocate to Shinall Mtn., where all the other central ark. stations (except kasn) are located.

You might try moving your antenna in favor of Shinall stations just to see if you can get katv. You should be able to, since KWBF is supposedly getting all the way out past Heber Springs. You may need to rescan. Of course, you may lose KASN.

What antenna are you using?

In Searcy, I'm using a Wineguard HD VHF/UHF antenna mounted in my attic (hence the not wanting to adjust it). However, I can't even receive 42-3 in Conway using a "medium-size" unidirectional antenna (again all other stations come in just fine).

It may just be my location either way. I'm assuming 42-3 KATV-DT is not as powerful as the previous 22-1 tower was?

An entire year? That's very disappointing. I guess the majority of KATV's viewers are cable-based. Therefore, OTA is not a huge priority. :(

katv-DT (http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/tvq?state=&call=katv&arn=&city=&chan=&cha2=69&serv=&type=0&facid=&list=2&dist=&dlat2=&mlat2=&slat2=&dlon2=&mlon2=&slon2=&size=9) transmitter (ch 22) at Redfield, was 750kW Effective Radiated Power
KWBF-DT (http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/tvq?state=&call=kwbf&arn=&city=&chan=&cha2=69&serv=&type=0&facid=&list=2&dist=&dlat2=&mlat2=&slat2=&dlon2=&mlon2=&slon2=&size=9) transmitter (ch 44) at Shinall is 1,000kW ERP

Until recently, OTA became more and more of a stepchild, with cable and sat in the majority of homes. However, with digital tv's excellent picture quality, I think people will begin rediscovering free tv again. Especally people who only subscribe to basic cable for better local channel reception.

I doubt katv's parent company (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allbritton_Communications_Company) realizes that though. They probably only do what they have to do, as far as OTA is concerned. Whatever is the minimum needed to continue being an ABC broadcast affiliate, meet FCC requirements and cable must carry rules.

Thanks for the information. I'm assuming 1,000kW ERP is better than 750kW? I don't know why I can't pick up 44-3 at least in Conway.

Re-aligning the antenna did no good. I even went in my backyard with a notebook (using a Hauppauge TV tuner), antennaweb.org instructions and a medium directional antenna. Again, I found every single major station but KATV-DT.

By the way, I can receive all of those stations (and the old KATV-DT) at roughly 70-85 percent signal strength, 100 percent signal quality (according to the TV Tuner card) indoors using a medium-sized multidirectional antenna with all kinds of potential interference.

I just don't get it why I can't get 44. I get absolutely nothing.

IIRC, KWBF-DT tower's height (above average terrain) is lower than all of the other LR stations' towers. But according to the FCC maps, they should still be getting out as far as Heber Springs and almost to Clarksville.

It could be the tuner(s) you're using, and/or the antenna(s). Some receive certain channels better than others.

Other people in Searcy are using the Channel Master CM 4228 (http://www.warrenelectronics.com/antennas/4228.htm) antenna (http://www.warrenelectronics.com/antennas/4228.htm) and CM 7777 preamp (http://www.warrenelectronics.com/antennas/7777.htm), and they get all the LR stations, plus the four Mountain View PBS channels. Consider adding a preamp if your reception is marginal. Or get the antenna out of the attic. Attics reduce signal strength dramatically in some cases.

I might just purchase a new UHF-only antenna like the one you suggested. I have a Channel Master 4221A in Conway (looks similar to the one you suggested, just much smaller), and a Wineguard HD7082 in Searcy.

Maybe I will start with a pre-amp, as neither antenna has a pre-amp.

A CM 7777 preamp (http://www.warrenelectronics.com/antennas/7777.htm) might might be all you need. Don't waste your time on a cheap noisy amp from ratshack, walmart or other chain stores.

Well, It may "say" 1000kw erp, but I can see the towers on shinall from my location, about 20 miles away, and KWBF is the lowest reading I get...Im guessing they are authorized for it, but not running it.

BTW, I was told the meter or the Directv receivers were reading a reverse bit rate error...Ill have to try to find out...Im curious now.
Was watching your little Harrison/Springfield station this weekend...they had on star Trek TOS, and Max Exposure :) Couldn't find anything on Directv, so watched some old equity... FTA looks pretty good, but I can tell they need another transponder. All those stations on two transponders causes some gross looking soccer matches.

Jaw04005..welcome. If you are out in the country, away from city multipath, an amp will probably do you well. Getting your antenna out of the attic would probably really improve your reception as well.

You are out of my area but it doesn't look like the locals say much. I hope you don't mind if I make a few comments and then bow out.

First on the comments about it may take a year for KATV to build a new tower. That isn't surprising at all. Towers are built to order, so they aren't lying around in stock somewhere. Each one is built specifically for the load it is to hold up, so no two are exactly alike. KATV's is the third tall tower to fall in the last 30 days, so tower steel in stock is going to be in short supply. The biggest hold up is the timing of the accident. There are only so many tower companies in the US capable of handling a job that big. This year they are really booked up with all the DTV stations that are swapping out analog and digital antennas and quite a few are building new towers. Also Sprint/Nextel is in full swing replacing all of broadcasters 2Ghz remote pickup equipment (live truck microwave and relays) so we will give up one of our channels to them for cell phones. The FCC has set a time limit for that project which in itself is tying up all the tower crews changing out that equipment. I mean, tower companies are booked up tight. Then on the red tape side, they will have to obtain a no hazard certification from the FAA if the tower is to be over 200 feet tall (it doesn't matter that they are replacing one even taller). The last time I had to do that the FAA took four months. If they relocate to Shinall Mtn and don't use an existing tower, the government is just getting started. It doesn't matter if there are already 20 towers in the area. Environmental impact study, Native American and Historic notifications. Any Indian tribe that has ever visited the site must be notified and given 90 days to object. An archaeologist must examine the proposed tower site and declare it clean. With all the other stations there, microwave paths to get the signal from the studio to the transmitter becomes a problem. A frequency search must be done by a company that specializes in that to find them a relay channel they can use that doesn't cause interference to anybody else already there. Notifications must be sent to everybody that could possibly receive any interference and wait 90 days for objections. They will have to do a radiation hazard study to see if adding their transmitter would create a combined level higher than EPA and FCC standards for people in the area. Then other stations would be notified and given 90 days to object to their relocation plan. All this has to be done before the FCC will even give them a construction permit. They cannot start construction until they get a permit either.

I've also seen a couple of questions concerning a stations power output. Generally the comments were that the stations were licensed for a certain power but you thought the station had chosen to run at a lower power level. We can't do that. The power level you see in our license is the power level we MUST run at, no if, ands, or buts. We have no choice. If we can't maintain power within 10% of licensed value we have to apply for an STA to run lower power, and you would see that on the FCC license search. Also right now if a DTV station is not running full authorized power, they could permanently loose their protection from adjacent cities. That is something we definitely don't want to happen. About power, we did not choose our power levels. The FCC dictated our power levels based on our proposed antenna height to give us a signal strength for DTV that made DTV cover the same area (in theory) as our analog signal. This August, the FCC will lift the freeze on those power levels and we can request higher power to the point were we cause interference to .05% households of someone else or 1,000 KW whichever comes first. We have to pay for the study first.

Third and last, then I'll shut up. Any time you see a DTV signal meter swinging wildly, it is most likely multipath. I wish all new receivers had multipath indicators. That is actually more important that signal strength. I have seen beautiful OTA DTV with a clean 30 signal strength. Actually, the higher your strength the more likely you are to have multipath problems unless you have a very directional antenna. A good discussion is at //http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=366850

Larry Friddle, CE
KHBS/KHOG DT
Fort Smith/Fayetteville

Hey, thanks for stopping by with all the good info. Lots I didn't know there. Reason I thought they might be using lower power was the prctice when dtv first started up, a couple stations would lower power at night, but they were probably still running on their temp license or permit.

WOW, lots of great information there. A lot of stuff I had no idea went on. Thanks for that, Larry. All I can say is that if KWBF is indeed running their 1000KW, then there is something else pretty wrong with their setup if most of us have trouble getting a good, reliable signal from them.

On a separate note, I was setting up my dad's new 50" rear projection bravia tonight and let it scan for OTA channels to see what he could get, when lo-and-behold I saw color bars on 7. It was weak as hell, and obviously no digital on it, but it was there none-the-less.

I don't know if anyone else saw that up there or was even looking for it, but I thought it was a good signal of something going on. Maybe they have gotten something in the works to use that offered tower space that was made to them. I am sure there would have to be all kinds of paperwork for that too, so I don't know how they could possibly be getting a signal on.

I do suppose that that might not have even been from KATV in the first place, but I figured it might since it was on analog 7 with a VERY VERY VERY cheap pair of rabbit ears on his tv.

On a completely different note to ORPhD, has either KTHV channel ever shown back up for you on Comcasts feed? I am still seeing "No Signal!" when looking at 2-1 and 10-1. EDIT: Nevermind, just did a rescan for them and they came back up as 10-1 and 10-2. Channel 16 is showing up twice for me as 13-1 AND 13-3 with the same apparent content on both.

Steven,

That image you saw *was* KATV. I had the antenna pointed toward Monroe yesterday morning and last night did a manaul bandscan in the hamshack after work and the pc analog tuner found a weak signal on ch7. I knew of course it wasn't KNOE-DT Monroe and then thought 7 did cobble together something after rotating and seeing the bars/test pattern...a few minutes later a female newsreader and the circle 7 logo appeared....snowy picture with fading every so often.

OT: At least I might be able to log KNOE-DT (or even KLTV, or <gasp> KOAM with a huge trop duct before KETS-DT moves next year--that puny KATV "signal" won't be blocking much DX, that is for sure.

so, where's this weak analog signal coming from?

Ch 7 coming in here in NLR too. A bit snowy, but using a UHF bowtie pointed at Shinall mt...which isn't very directionally accurate on VHF. Interesting indeed. So much for KETS moving to ch 7 early :)

... Generally the comments were that the stations were licensed for a certain power but you thought the station had chosen to run at a lower power level. We can't do that. The power level you see in our license is the power level we MUST run at, no if, ands, or buts.
Larry, thanks for the information and your comments. I was hoping one of y'all at 40/49 would reply.

I have some questions, though. Of course, the station must operate at the authorized power - at least legally, of course. But who checks to see what power they are really broadcasting at? Does the FCC go around and actually do this? I ask because:
1. There are so many people who should be able to, but cannot receive this "1,000kW" station very well if at all.
2. This is an equity station being discussed. Although I know you're not at liberty to comment on that. Their past shenanigans, just in the NWA market alone, is enough to make them suspect of their operations.

Any time you see a DTV signal meter swinging wildly, it is most likely multipath.Could this also be caused by some sort of intermittent RF interference? Just curious, because where I live there is a lot of RFI (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_frequency_interference).

I have seen beautiful OTA DTV with a clean 30 signal strength.Wouldn't it depend on the relative reading of SS meter in the tuner one uses? I have one tuner that will lock on a ~20, but another one needs 50.

Thankfully, most newer tuners are very very good at ignoring multipath, so it's not nearly as much of an issue as it was early on. And multipath is supposedly not an issue with the coupon-eligible converters available soon, either - at least from what I've read.

I'm *assuming* its Shinall. The signal seems strongest where I can get max signal from KWBF analog. Its weaker than KWBF-42, but stronger than KKYK (CA)-20. This is with the CM7777 preamp, and the 4 element log-periodic (located below the CM4228) connected to the VHF input

... So much for KETS moving to ch 7 early
AETN: Analog Educational Television Network. :rolleyes:

I want to add a thanks to Larry for all the great info, don't be a stranger around here. I do agree with other folks though about KWBF-DT. I have my antenna pointed at least more or less toward Shinall, and can get 4, 11 & 16 just fine, but haven't been able to get 42 in months (digital, that is, I can get them in analog, but with ugly ghosting, so that could be a multipath problem. Also, I am getting KATV in analog as well, looks better than it's looked on Dish the last several days. Gives me a little hope that we might actually get HD in time for lost (not likely I know.)

I've been wanting a new receiver for a while. The one I have is from 99 or 98. It only has Pro Logic, no Pro Logic II, and Dolby Digital. It's pretty antiquated by todays standards. Just having a real hard time trying to figure out which one to get. Would love to have one that takes HDMI in....maybe two of them. Would be nice to have a couple of Optical In's as well....well, I guess I would really only need 1 if the receiver could take in the HR20's signal through HDMI. I just have NO clue what to get.
I'm not sure how much cost is a consideration, but there is an excellent HTIB alternatives thread here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=809777). Discussion there often focuses on inexpensive solutions.

I've been following the thread for a while (my receiver is needing an upgrade, but it is a very low priority), and for bang for the buck, there seem to be two recurring suggestions people there have:
1) At shoponkyo.com, join Club Onkyo and keep your eyes open for refurbs with what I think are called Special Club Prices (some EXCELLENT deals there)
2) Go to Harman Kardon's ebay store (also for refurbs).

While you do only get refurbs from both, they are straight from the manufacturer and come with 1 year warranties (minimum...I think some come with 2). And the savings can be quite large (Onkyo periodically has the TX-SR505 for $125).

My understanding is that there can be wide variance in exactly how HDMI is handled by a receiver (passthrough only, processing of a 5.1 signal [possibly "crippled"], full processing [Dolby TrueHD, etc]). Obviously you would certainly want to research that for the specific model you are interested in prior to purchase.

Heh, I know this isn't the "receiver" forum or anything, I just figured it would be okay if we talked a little more about it here since there really isn't anything HD going right now.

Well, cost is a consideration to a point. I mean, you never want to spend a lot. I think a lot might be over $200 or $250. I don't need a HTIB because I already have a dvd player (more than 1 in fact) and speakers and a sub.

The Kenwood receiver and speakers set that I have came as a HTIB back in like '99 or so. I am just wanting to upgrade to something that will be able to handle more of the more current things that my old one doesn't like PLII and DTS maybe and whatever else newer receivers can do.

I thought I wanted one that can do HDMI inputs, but I don't know if that is really true when all I am really concerned with at the present time is audio decoding and don't really care about the video portion of the signal on an HDMI cable. I can let the TV handle the video part for me as it seems to be doing a pretty good job at that. I just want something to give me better sound options through the various updated decoding packages that newer receivers have.

I only have really one HDMI source device and that is my HR20 which I feed to my current receiver by digital optical for audio and the HDMI to the TV's HDMI input for the video portion only. I don't think I will get another HDMI item for a long time as everything I have covers everything I want to do nicely. So, all in all, I don't really think I need a receiver with HDMI inputs/output if it means that I can save a few bucks on that part and maybe make up the cost difference in improvements in the components inside the receiver or extra digital optical inputs or something.

The Onkyo TX-SR505 would be a good choice and still supports HDMI if you ever wanted to use it. It falls in the price range you listed as well

It will be interesting to see how many more towers will be built on Shinall. There is a new residential area that goes halfway up the mountain & I am sure they would be a problem in the future with interference complaints. That whole area out there is booming with construction.

Although it shouldn't take a rocket scientist to know you're going to get all kinds of signals 1/2 mile away from (in some cases) 5 million watt transmitters. And you can obviously see them...

The Onkyo TX-SR505 would be a good choice and still supports HDMI if you ever wanted to use it. It falls in the price range you listed as well

In the email I got notifying me of your post I saw a partial url. It didn't have the middle part between the www and .com. Looking on this page itself to see the url again, I see its not there. If you wouldn't mind posting that up again, maybe putting some spaces in it or something in case this thing filters you, I would appreciate it.

Is this something you can get at best buy or whatever? Or, you know, I can use google. (geez I forget sometimes)

It will be interesting to see how many more towers will be built on Shinall. There is a new residential area that goes halfway up the mountain & I am sure they would be a problem in the future with interference complaints. That whole area out there is booming with construction.

Although it shouldn't take a rocket scientist to know you're going to get all kinds of signals 1/2 mile away from (in some cases) 5 million watt transmitters. And you can obviously see them...

I didn't know any more housing was being built "halfway up". I know there is that building that I think is an old persons retirement apartment building kinda thing on that same side of the street, and on the other side of the street is that subdivision with all the rich people houses there. Those are still pretty far away from the tower sites themselves (like you said, maybe 1/2 a mile, but thats still far enough I would think). You think those will be enough to pose a problem? You would think that if it would be a problem, since the towers were all already there, they wouldn't have let them build anything more that close to there.

Just a question about something. "5 million watt"? Really? You mean all the transmitters combined? I would hope so anyway. That seems awfully high of a number for transmitting power. :)

I don't really understand "HDMI Pass Through (2in/1out , 1080P compatible) — A separate audio connection is necessary". Can someone explain the different HDMI connection options on receivers?

And, what good does it do to have the HDMI connection on the unit if you still have to connect up another set of cables for audio? Shouldn't it be able to get it all from the HDMI? I guess in this case with the 2in/1out, if your tv has only 1 HDMI input, but you have 2 HDMI devices, this will help keep both connected to the tv. But again I have to ask whats the point if you have to run separate audio connections?

Wow, that is a bit expensive isn't it. And this is one that would be a solid enough of an upgrade to an old Kenwood VR-405? I just want to make sure that this would be a really good choice and would be great for HD DVD, HD TV, and HD gaming. I just don't know jack about these things anymore and need all the input I can get.

Just a question about something. "5 million watt"? Really? You mean all the transmitters combined? I would hope so anyway. That seems awfully high of a number for transmitting power. :)

When KLRT Channel 16 (analog) went on the air in the early 80's the transmitter was a 110kw into an antenna that developed 5,000kw ERP. The Klystrons in the transmitter were water-cooled.

At the time, KLRT Channel 16 put more RF into central Arkansas than all the other radio and television stations combined and could be received by attaching a small UHF loop antenna to the terminals on the receiver.

By comparison, KTHV's 316KW ERP (analog) power output is small. However, since KTHV Channel 11's operating frequency is lower, they are able to broadcast and cover approximately the same distance as KLRT Channel 16 with 5,000KW. The only difference in the area covered would be the radiation pattern that the broadcaster selects to have their antenna favor from their transmitting site.

steveken,

I wish I could help you on the HDMI receiver stuff, but I'm almost as confused as you are. To be honest, I have had nothing but bad experiences with HDMI (neither audio nor video ever worked right on my HTPC, and my TV downconverts everything to 2 channel audio). I know I'm going to need it at some point, but whether that is now or not I haven't determined.

RE: prices, I just sent a PM

When KLRT Channel 16 (analog) went on the air in the early 80's the transmitter was a 110kw into an antenna that developed 5,000kw ERP. The Klystrons in the transmitter were water-cooled.

At the time, KLRT Channel 16 put more RF into central Arkansas than all the other radio and television stations combined and could be received by attaching a small UHF loop antenna to the terminals on the receiver.

By comparison, KTHV's 316KW ERP (analog) power output is small. However, since KTHV Channel 11's operating frequency is lower, they are able to broadcast and cover approximately the same distance as KLRT Channel 16 with 5,000KW. The only difference in the area covered would be the radiation pattern that the broadcaster selects to have their antenna favor from their transmitting site.

You know, I have to admit that my remarks were completely stupid because I didn't think about it at all. 5,000kW is indeed 5 million watts. When I saw your post I was like "GEEEEEEEEEZZZZZZZ!! Think man!".

steveken,

I wish I could help you on the HDMI receiver stuff, but I'm almost as confused as you are. To be honest, I have had nothing but bad experiences with HDMI (neither audio nor video ever worked right on my HTPC, and my TV downconverts everything to 2 channel audio). I know I'm going to need it at some point, but whether that is now or not I haven't determined.

RE: prices, I just sent a PM

Dave,
Thanks, but I am not sure that really helps me. :) I am one of those type of people that when it comes to stuff like this that I am not real sure about, I HAVE to touch it and play with it. I don't know if I would be willing to trust something from that page you linked me to, but I will watch it closely and do more research on it.

As far as your experiences with HDMI with your HTPC, how were you trying to use it and what was the setup? I have used it with my HP that came with all the stuff to make it a HTPC and it works wonderfully and simply. I bet with all of us on here, we might be able to figure it out if you care to try to bounce it off us.

As far as your TV, there is probably something in the settings that you haven't found yet that is making it downconvert to 2-channel. People said that my dad's new Bravia 50" rear projection did that same thing, but when I hooked it up and got everything going, it didn't do that at all and everything was perfectly fine and in full surround.

Dave,
Thanks, but I am not sure that really helps me. :) I am one of those type of people that when it comes to stuff like this that I am not real sure about, I HAVE to touch it and play with it. I don't know if I would be willing to trust something from that page you linked me to, but I will watch it closely and do more research on it.

As far as your experiences with HDMI with your HTPC, how were you trying to use it and what was the setup? I have used it with my HP that came with all the stuff to make it a HTPC and it works wonderfully and simply. I bet with all of us on here, we might be able to figure it out if you care to try to bounce it off us.

As far as your TV, there is probably something in the settings that you haven't found yet that is making it downconvert to 2-channel. People said that my dad's new Bravia 50" rear projection did that same thing, but when I hooked it up and got everything going, it didn't do that at all and everything was perfectly fine and in full surround.
For me, HTPC HDMI involved constant dropouts on the audio side, and weird video "jumping" on the video side (like the whole image would jump up one row of pixels, then come back down). Since I switched from the HDMI port to the DVI port for video and the SPDIF for audio, it fixed everything. I somewhat suspect my motherboard had a faulty HDMI port as no one else seemed to have this problem, but since at this point there would be absolutely zero benefit to using another method, I'm just going to leave it alone. The 2-channel downconversion on the other hand is a confirmed limitation of my Samsung plasma. Unless it is something they can (and do) fix in updated firmware, it's simply not going to work.

Last I checked, the big red electronics chain sold Onkyos. So if checking them out in person is a must, you may want to give them a shot (the website probably would tell you which were stocked).

After Collapse, KTHV Lends KATV Tower Space
By Arkansas Business Staff
1/22/2008 3:36:01 PM

Competition continues to take a backseat among Little Rock market television stations, with KTHV-TV, Channel 11, offering tower space to restore rival KATV-TV, Channel 7's analog signal.

KATV's analog signal has been off the air since the Jan. 11 collapse of its 2,000-ft. broadcast tower near Redfield. The ABC affiliate's cable and satellite service was restored shortly after the collapse, but options to deliver its analog signal to those viewers without cable or satellite were limited. It's estimated that between 10 percent and 15 percent of the station's viewers tune into the analog signal.

"That's how much we believe in local TV," said Larry Audas, general manager at KTHV in a news release. "We go nose to nose with KATV every day in news, sales and every competitive aspect of broadcasting. But THV's first obligation is to Arkansas viewers ... . Competitive results will take care of themselves."

KATV is broadcasting its analog signal from KTHV's auxiliary tower and antenna, which was normally reserved as a back up for the CBS affiliate's maintenance and emergency use.

"This kind of cooperation between KTHV and KATV is most appreciated and evidence broadcasters are here to serve the community," said Dale Nicholson, general manager at KATV, in the news release.

Steveken... Onkyo's are at Circuit City. Several demos too since new models came out...

How can ch 7 use an antenna with a frequency cut for channel 11? Wouldn't the SWR be outrageous, or can they just run the power down until the tubes quit glowing?

"You know, I have to admit that my remarks were completely stupid because I didn't think about it at all. 5,000kW is indeed 5 million watts. When I saw your post I was like "GEEEEEEEEEZZZZZZZ!! Think man!"."

steveken, Don't worry about it, we've all been there. :)

In the email I got notifying me of your post I saw a partial url. It didn't have the middle part between the www and .com. Looking on this page itself to see the url again, I see its not there. If you wouldn't mind posting that up again, maybe putting some spaces in it or something in case this thing filters you, I would appreciate it.

Is this something you can get at best buy or whatever? Or, you know, I can use google. (geez I forget sometimes)

I tried to post a link, but the system filtered it out. I guess those are not allowed.

It was a link to o n e c a l l . c o m :D

http://www.*******.com

heheh,
http://i28.tinypic.com/2mpimuc.png
is on the list of sites AVSForum won't let you post :)

How can ch 7 use an antenna with a frequency cut for channel 11? Maybe they added tin foil to make the lobes or whatever the right length. :)

I bet the VSWR was high without some sort of matching unit. I don't imagine a commercial transmitting antenna (even a low-gain backup) will work by itself on a lower channel without some sort of transmatch. Probably not using all the available transmitter output to keep from blowing the finals.

With all your complaints about KWBF I decided to check the FCC database for myself to see what is going on.
1. They are not licensed for 1MW. They have a construction permit for 1MW which apparently they have not began construction on because they say the tower they want to locate on is stuck in red tape and engineering studies. I didn't dig deep enough to find out where that was.
2. They have an STA (Special Temporary Authorization) to operate at 6.7 KW on a temp tower and location. That isn't much and explains the reception problems. They have been granted several extensions of that STA by the FCC so they can get the problems solved and build to full power. The last extension was given the last of December.
When you do a license search, don't just stop at the page with a couple of things listed. Go to one of the licenses and click on the link that says application list. There is much more there than on the main page and it makes interesting reading and would answer just about all your questions. In fact, there are applications granted there that aren't on the main page. The FCC falling down on the job I guess.

2. They have an STA (Special Temporary Authorization) to operate at 6.7 KW on a temp tower and location. That isn't much and explains the reception problems. That only leaves more questions. Because most people on this thread know they are no longer broadcasting at that temporary downtown (6.7kW) location any more.

They are broadcasting from Shinall, not downtown where the 6.7kW xmtr was.

When KLRT Channel 16 (analog) went on the air in the early 80's the transmitter was a 110kw into an antenna that developed 5,000kw ERP. The Klystrons in the transmitter were water-cooled.

A 110KW transmitter is the standard output power for a 5Mw ERP antenna. The largest transmitter I have ever seen in my 30 years of broadcasting is a Harris 220 which puts out 220 Kw. The FCC will license you to radiate 5Mw vertical polarity and 5MW horizontal polarity, thus a total of 10Mw is the maximum possible (interference permitting). I'm talking analog. The electric bill would have been huge.

Klystrons are always water cooled. They stand 4 feet tall, weigh about 600 pounds and need special lifts or hoists to handle. One costs $70,000 and a 110 transmitter uses three of them. At about 55% efficiency, as much electric goes out as heat as goes to the antenna.

IOT transmitters used in digital are usually water cooled although they don't generate quite as much heat. Any time you have a transmitter with a power output over 10KW you can pretty much bet that it is water cooled. My 10.5 KW solid state at KHOG is air cooled but it needs so much air it sounds like a tornado.

That only leaves more questions. Because most people on this thread know they are no longer broadcasting at that temporary downtown (6.7kW) location any more.

They are broadcasting from Shinall, not downtown where the 6.7kW xmtr was.

I didn't read through all the applications so I dont know which STA is current. I'm not interested. You know where to look and how to find it. Go have a ball.;)

When they were broadcasting from the STA downtown, I could see the buildings, and with a 16db gain yagi, got a signal of 3 out of 100 hahaha. I'd believe they probably are still running the low power, but think they moved to Shinall to their analog channels tower. Whether the fcc approved or not, well, who knows.

...I'd believe they probably are still running the low power, but think they moved to Shinall to their analog channels tower. Whether the fcc approved or not, well, who knows.FCC approval? We don't need no stinkin' FCC approval :)

KWBF's current power is probably the last STA on this page (http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/tvq?list=0&facid=37005). But then again, it is an equity station. So, like 4029 said, "who knows"....

Those GPS coordinates are about right, and height abovw ground is about right, but HAAT seems a little low. Isn't Shinall about 1000' elevation?

Looks like that is correct.
Your right Sam. I can't explain it. I know I wouldn't mess with te FCC. What would be the point? They would be just as willing to give them a 6Kw STA and make them legal as to give them a 580 Kw and not do it. They do have up to 30 days without notification for equipment failures but I gather this has been going on longer than that. If caught, they could loose their license completely. A fine up to $20,000 per day. That would be my incentive.

When KLRT Channel 16 (analog) went on the air in the early 80's the transmitter was a 110kw into an antenna that developed 5,000kw ERP. The Klystrons in the transmitter were water-cooled.

At the time, KLRT Channel 16 put more RF into central Arkansas than all the other radio and television stations combined and could be received by attaching a small UHF loop antenna to the terminals on the receiver.

By comparison, KTHV's 316KW ERP (analog) power output is small. However, since KTHV Channel 11's operating frequency is lower, they are able to broadcast and cover approximately the same distance as KLRT Channel 16 with 5,000KW. The only difference in the area covered would be the radiation pattern that the broadcaster selects to have their antenna favor from their transmitting site.

Yep - KLRT was the one I was thinking of. I remember their commercials when they went live, telling everyone to look for the TALL tower on Shinall, and they were 5 million watts. They didn't bother to say that the transmitter was actually 110kw with high gain antenna to get 5 million watts ERP. :)

Going in that vein, my Home Theatre is 1600 watts per channel (100w into a 101 db speakers)...Sure cheaper to run that an actual 1600w amp into 89db radio shack speakers (which would melt anyway) haha.

Sam, what are your readings on 103s on Tp2,4, and 6? I am reading 100 on all three. Is that Memphis or Tulsa? Didn't think HD spots were that wide. I'm 150 miles from the closest city...

Longview/Tyler Tx DMA #109 just got HD locals, guess that's what I am seeing. Guess little ole us DMA 57 just got forgotten.

Has anyone else noticed lower signal strengths on KARK lately? I'm in Greenbrier with a RS VU190 pointed at Shinall and I'm getting strengths on my Dish 211 of 85 on KLRT, 91 on KTHV and even 70 on KASN. On KARK I'm only getting about 72. I used to get KARK with signal strengths of 90-92 consistently and nothing has changed on my end.

Any thoughts from anyone?

Your results match mine. KARK is usually at 100 here along with KLRT. Tonight they were down to 78, about equal to Equitys signal.

And speaking of KLRT, did anyone happen to catch last Thursday's The Office? I finally watched it last night, and it was obvious that the whole image was zoomed in or something. Text in advertisements was getting chopped off bad. It seemed to be fixed when I checked last night.

Isn't Shinall about 1000' elevation?Antenna height above ground level, according to the FCC is:
137.2 meters, or ~450'
According to GoogleEarth, elevation at the base of the KWBF tower is is 1054'.
See: http://i32.tinypic.com/ok36ew.jpg

Yep - KLRT was the one I was thinking of. I remember their commercials when they went live, telling everyone to look for the TALL tower on Shinall, and they were 5 million watts... heheh, I remember the commercials promoting "towerful, powerful" KATV and their 2,000 footer (RIP). "New Tower! New Power!"

Well, I guess that shows my age... LOL

Sam, what are your readings on 103s on Tp2,4, and 6? I am reading 100 on all three. Is that Memphis or Tulsa? Didn't think HD spots were that wide. I'm 150 miles from the closest city...103s? Is that 103a or b?

On 103a, I get: 2-95 4-96 6-87
On 103b, I get: 2-84 4-86 6-87
FWIW, LR's 119 xpndr25 is only 62%, but it comes in fine up here. Only problem is it suffers from rain fade more frequently than normal. I rarely watch any of them.

Also, I have never peaked my 5LNB dish, I only aligned it for the 101 & 119, so, YMMV.

Tulsa and KCMO are on 99b, xpndrs 4 & 6. I get those @ 100%. What SS do you show for those in LR?

Looks like that is correct.
Your right Sam. I can't explain it. I know I wouldn't mess with te FCC...If caught, they could lose their license completely. A fine up to $20,000 per day. That would be my incentive.Maybe the FCC is uderstaffed and swamped right now, and the equity knows it.(?) Maybe the FCC is more interested in catching "wardrobe malfunctions."

There was an LPTV station broadcasting in Eureka on the same channel (18) as KFSM-DT, and within KFSM's protected coverage area. Interference prevented everyone around here from receiving KFSM-DT. Area residents filed written complaints with the FCC and the station finally moved to ch 22. But AFAIK, they never got a fine or anything. Would that be similar? Just curious...

Your results match mine. KARK is usually at 100 here along with KLRT. Tonight they were down to 78, about equal to Equitys signal.Perhaps some tower work going on at Shinall?

Davenlr, I wrote to D* AGAIN about this whole RSN thing. I finally got an answer back about it. In regards to FSN Southwest and Houston, he said:

"Based on your zip code you have been assigned FSN Southwest. This RSN will provide you with Astros and Rangers baseball. FSN Southwest will also provide you with the alternate channels associated to it. The alternate channels are 667 (FSN Southwest Plus), 639 (FSN Houston – overflow Houston games). These channels will be available when FSN Southwest owns the rights to broadcast more than one game at the same time."

That would explain why you are seeing Houston sometimes cause its an overflow from Southwest. I was told that they told me incorrectly about the other RSN's I am able to get. I am NOT eligible for Rocky Mountain or South, but for FSN Midwest instead which I thought to be right the whole time.

What I can't seem to get out of them is what other channels besides the FSN will I get if I buy the Sports Pack. I mean, I just don't want to spend another $12 a month for ONLY FSN Midwest.....you know? I just want to know if its going to include stuff like ESPNU and whatever else they throw into the Sports Pack.

As far as blackouts go, I still am a little confused about that. He said that if I got Sports Pack, I would see every single Cardinals game that FSN Midwest paid for showing and everything else (like Cardinals playing the Angels out in Anaheim) would be blacked out.

What I am wondering is if a person really wanted to see EVERY Cardinals game for instance and they bought both MLB:EI AND Sports Pack, that should essentially give them EVERY single game that the Cardinals play because if they are at home Midwest would carry it, if they are away MLB:EI would carry it, and if it was a nationally televised game THAT network would carry it. Is that sounding about right to you?

So, basically, buying only Sports Pack would get me the Cardinals games that FSN Midwest pays to carry as well as whatever else they show on that channel and the games that are on the national networks like Fox or NBC or whoever? I really want to get this nailed down before the season starts. It sounds like that is what I am going to do (get the Sports Pack), but I just want to make sure what I am going to get before I pay for it.

Sorry for the whole D* questions again everyone. I just figured with all the people we have here, SOMEONE should be know something about this and help me figure it out. Its obvious the CSR's can't do it. Hell, the people I got today don't even speak English as their first language.

FWIW, LR's 119 xpndr25 is only 62%, but it comes in fine up here. Only problem is it suffers from rain fade more frequently than normal. I rarely watch any of them.

For me, 119 tp25 is 96%. My signals go like this (only the last two lines are here for obvious reasons :) ):

n/a n/a n/a n/a n/a 98 35 100
96 100 98 100 0 100 100 100

103s? Is that 103a or b?

On 103a, I get: 2-95 4-96 6-87
On 103b, I get: 2-84 4-86 6-87

These are from my H20-600 here in the computer room.
103a, I get: 2-100 4-97 6-94 17-97
(the numbers for the tp's I get came up really really slow. was thinking I had 0's on them until they finally decided to register. even going to the signal meters screen didn't help cause it showed 0's for the longest time)

103b, I get: 95 95 91 91 93 93 90 90
93 91 95 94 94 94 n/a n/a
96 n/a n/a n/a n/a 95 n/a n/a


Also, I have never peaked my 5LNB dish, I only aligned it for the 101 & 119, so, YMMV.

Thats about 10 minutes of self aligning my dish. I think I did pretty well. :)

Tulsa and KCMO are on 99b, xpndrs 4 & 6. I get those @ 100%. What SS do you show for those in LR?

99b, I get: 0 on all 6. That just shows how narrow that spot beam is I guess.

errett, thanks for taking the time to share your knowledge and giving us answers to our questions.

You may not know the answer to this but maybe someone will. On the D* HR20 OTA signal meter, what information am I seeing when I look at "signal meter" information and see a reading of 100 to 95 and sometimes it is changing like going from 95 to 93, then back to 95 and then to 98? Am I seeing RF signal strength, or some digital information?

Thanks again.

Sorry for the delay in replying, we have had some issues giving us grief in the building. Unfortunately, I am not sure what the signal meter is based off of in the DTV boxes. You do have me wondering now though.

E

Questions for anyone around the Russellville area picking up HD channels.

I live in Pottsville and use a VU-190 antenna from RadioShack and a 24db amp from Lowes. I have it mounted in my attic and am currently getting these stations:

KARK - 80 to 90%
KATV(was) - 65 to 70%
KTHV - around 90% constant
WB(not sure of the station id -channel 38.1) - 65 to 70%
KLRT - 65%

I usually don't have any problems except with fox and most of those are during the daytime when it can't see to hold the lock. I thought there tower was by the KTHV tower? Just wondering why I would get such a strong signal from one and not another?

Also I have a friend who lives about 5 miles west of me and he just bought a Phillips 51 element antenna from Lowes and a 28db amp with a preamp. We hooked it up last night and were getting CBS and NBC. CBS was around 80% and NBC at 65%. Wouldn't pick up fox at all. Analog was coming in on all stations, but only 2 in HD. No big hills or anything between his house and mine, so I am wondering if that antenna is any good?

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

(the numbers for the tp's I get came up really really slow. was thinking I had 0's on them until they finally decided to register. even going to the signal meters screen didn't help cause it showed 0's for the longest time)That is absolutely normal for the MPEG4 sats on the HR20-600. It takes a long long time for the numbers to appear. Just wanted you to know it's not just your receiver that does that....

Thats about 10 minutes of self aligning my dish. I think I did pretty well.No, not bad at all. I plan to fine tune mine eventually. But not in this weather!


99b, I get: 0 on all 6. That just shows how narrow that spot beam is I guess.Interesting. Thanks for the comparison. I guess the MPEG4 spot beams drop off fairly rapidly at some point, outside the intended coverage area. If I was any farther north, I probably couldn't receive the LR locals either. It will be interesting to see if I can receive the LR MPEG4 HD locals on D*.

Questions for anyone around the Russellville area picking up HD channels.

I live in Pottsville and use a VU-190 antenna from RadioShack and a 24db amp from Lowes. I have it mounted in my attic and am currently getting these stations:

KARK - 80 to 90%
KATV(was) - 65 to 70%
KTHV - around 90% constant
WB(not sure of the station id -channel 38.1) - 65 to 70%
KLRT - 65%

I usually don't have any problems except with fox and most of those are during the daytime when it can't see to hold the lock. I thought there tower was by the KTHV tower? Just wondering why I would get such a strong signal from one and not another?

Also I have a friend who lives about 5 miles west of me and he just bought a Phillips 51 element antenna from Lowes and a 28db amp with a preamp. We hooked it up last night and were getting CBS and NBC. CBS was around 80% and NBC at 65%. Wouldn't pick up fox at all. Analog was coming in on all stations, but only 2 in HD. No big hills or anything between his house and mine, so I am wondering if that antenna is any good?

Any suggestions would be appreciated.JCK77, a lot of the OTA antenna stuff you get from chain stores is not very good, and quality varies widely. In fringe areas:
1. Stick with antennas and preamps with a proven track record.

2. Don't install in the attic and put the antenna outside as high as possible. The higher the better.

KLRT is on the same Mtn as KARK, KTHV and KWBF. The antenna/preamp setup you have may just not work well for the RF channel KLRT-DT is on. Or, it may be your tuner's sensitivity. Too many variables to tell.

all zeros on 99 here, but occasionally get a 0 bouncing to 25 and back to 0 on one of them.
Why are we getting spot beams in LR? And strong one too! Doesn't make sense.

Steveken, all I know is my dad is always bitching about games being blacked out. I don't uinderstand the FSN Midwest, if we are supposed to get it, why can't we? I have no answers about sports. Seems the rules change every week.

LR gets FSN SW ch 643.

You may be seeing the MEM or Tyler spots. You could check in their local forums and see if anyone knows what sat their locals are on.

Or maybe they've LIT up a spot on D10 for, uh, LIT. Some of those spots were supposed to go to the coasts but they had problems w/ using them there. There is still a lot of vacant capacity on D10, so who knows.

Another possibility is the LA HD DNS, which D* is moving to MPEG4 very soon. Those cannot be on spot beams when they go MPEG4.

Steveken, all I know is my dad is always bitching about games being blacked out. I don't uinderstand the FSN Midwest, if we are supposed to get it, why can't we? I have no answers about sports. Seems the rules change every week.

We are supposed to get it IF we pay for the Sports Pack to get them. Otherwise, its SW and Houston (overflow) only.

Sorry for the delay in replying, we have had some issues giving us grief in the building. Unfortunately, I am not sure what the signal meter is based off of in the DTV boxes. You do have me wondering now though.

E

errett, thanks for your response. I understand your not being sure what the signal meter is based off in the D* boxes since you are on the transmitting end of this.

I would expect a D* CSR to know the answer but they don't have an answer, at least the ones I spoke to didn't.

As always, thank you for taking time to respond to our questions.

Beleldel

This is a bit off-topic, but I was wondering...

Are there any HDTV and audio dealers in the Little Rock area (other than Best Buy and Circuit City) that have a showroom and are open on Saturday?

Thanks.

I was hoping it might be LIT LIL but surely one of the engineers on here from one of the local stations would know...Or maybe not. I'm thinking if it was a conus beam, it would be on 103c not 103s... Guess we just wait and see.

toakley: Check Custom Audio and Video...they used to have a showroom and were open weekends, but they are $$$. Haven't checked in several years, so they may not.

Thanks. They were the only place I could think of, but they are no longer open on the weekends. I drove in last weekend just to check them out, only to find a closed store.

Audio Dimensions at the corner of Bowman and Kanis has a fairly nice selection and a pretty big showroom area. Go check them out. I think they are open on Saturdays because I believe that is when my wife and I went in. They are in the shopping center with Senior Tequila's and next to the Subway just down the hill from CompUSA.

Hey thanks! I know exactly where that shopping center is. I'll check it out this weekend.

Has anyone else noticed lower signal strengths on KARK lately? I'm in Greenbrier with a RS VU190 pointed at Shinall and I'm getting strengths on my Dish 211 of 85 on KLRT, 91 on KTHV and even 70 on KASN. On KARK I'm only getting about 72. I used to get KARK with signal strengths of 90-92 consistently and nothing has changed on my end.

Any thoughts from anyone?

I am not familiar with the area and how close the towers are together, but my thought is that if KATV or for that matter anybody else has a tower crew working on a tower to rig temp antennas, coax, so on (and that could take days on a tall tower) everyone in the area has to lower power until the combined radiated level is safe for the tower workers while they are on the tower. They probably want all this finished before ratings start next week. Nobody wants to be at low power then.
Then there is always a chance of a transmitter problem. With their power level I would imagine they are using a two cabinet (two IOT tubes) in parallel. It wouldn't talke full capacity so they aren't running at 100% capacity to make licensed power normally. If one cabinet were off line they would probably drop output to 60%-70% on one tube instead of 50%. I don't know if they have a backup transmitter. Probably waiting until next year like I am.

Maybe the FCC is uderstaffed and swamped right now, and the equity knows it.(?) Maybe the FCC is more interested in catching "wardrobe malfunctions."
They do seem to get by with a lot of stuff nobody else would dare to do.

There was an LPTV station broadcasting in Eureka on the same channel (18) as KFSM-DT, and within KFSM's protected coverage area. Interference prevented everyone around here from receiving KFSM-DT. Area residents filed written complaints with the FCC and the station finally moved to ch 22. But AFAIK, they never got a fine or anything. Would that be similar? Just curious...

That is why this is called a transition period. The FCC gave the LPTV time to find and relocate to another channel. It seems to me they bend over backwards for LPTV's. For example, the 2/17/09 date doesn't apply to them. Things will be quite different after 2/09.

With any luck, KATV might be hanging their HD antenna on it :)
I can't imagine how pissed off all those LOST fans will be watching analog for the season premier. I wonder just how many people get their HD off OTA...

I am not familiar with the area and how close the towers are together, but my thought is that if KATV or for that matter anybody else has a tower crew working on a tower to rig temp antennas, coax, so on (and that could take days on a tall tower) everyone in the area has to lower power until the combined radiated level is safe for the tower workers while they are on the tower.KARK & KTHV share a main tower on the western end of Shinall Mtn. IIRC, their much smaller backup tower is just a few yards away behind the main tower in this pic. You can guesstimate the distance by using the scale at the bottom of the pic. Also note the difference in the tower heights, indicated by the lengths of the shadows on the ground behind the towers.
http://i28.tinypic.com/2whin0h.jpg


It would be nice if one of their employees (who are members on here) would post an update on what's going on up there.

I wonder just how many people get their HD off OTA...
Or Comcast :P

To the Torrents!

KARK & KTHV share a main tower on the western end of Shinall Mtn. IIRC, their much smaller backup tower is just a few yards away behind the main tower in this pic. You can guesstimate the distance by using the scale at the bottom of the pic. Also note the difference in the tower heights, indicated by the lengths of the shadows on the ground behind the towers.
http://i28.tinypic.com/2whin0h.jpg


It would be nice if one of their employees (who are members on here) would post an update on what's going on up there.
Hey Sam! Sorry for the absence. It has been a little busy. What would you like to know?

Allison,

Is KATV moving their digital tower to shinall?
Has KARK been at low power recently? And if so, is it due to KATV tower work?
Which tower above is your backup tower?

More questions by others on previous pages.

Thanks for checking in.

Hello,

I am looking for some antenna pointing/purchasing advice. For clarity, I am talking about digital only. I currently have a DB4 from antennasdirect mounted on a 10ft pole on the highest point of my house. I used to get the digital equivalents of 4,7,11,16,32, although 32 was spotty sometimes. I live a little south of little rock, so I used to be able to get channel 7 without an antenna ( and I occasionally would hear it without a tv... ). Currently my DB4 is pointed a little left of chenal, this allows it to get all of the chenal stations ( although 11 is weak, due to the whole "it's really VHF thing" ) plus 32 coming in off a bounce or the side or something.

So, the problem is, KATV on 42-3 is to weak for me to lock. I figure if I swing my antenna directly at it ( 320 degrees ), I can probably get it ( i'll go fiddle with it this weekend ). However, this keeps me from getting the KASN(CW)(38.1). Do I need two antennas and some sort of signal combiner? ( A link to which one would be great ). I also have a radio shack "little rock special" on the roof that I used to use for analog.

Thanks for any advice, sorry for the novel. Here is my location printout from antenna web:

* yellow - uhf KASN-DT 38.1 CW PINE BLUFF AR 153° 10.3 39
* yellow - uhf KATV-DT 22.1 ABC LITTLE ROCK AR 142° 8.8 22
* yellow - vhf KETS-DT 2.1 PBS LITTLE ROCK AR 153° 10.3 5
* red - vhf KTHV-DT 11.1 CBS LITTLE ROCK AR 321° 19.3 12
* red - uhf KARK-DT 32.1 NBC LITTLE ROCK AR 321° 19.3 32
* red - uhf KLRT-DT 16.1 FOX LITTLE ROCK AR 322° 19.0 30

Allison,

Is KATV moving their digital tower to shinall?
Has KARK been at low power recently? And if so, is it due to KATV tower work?
Which tower above is your backup tower?

More questions by others on previous pages.

Thanks for checking in.

1. They really haven't made long term plans yet for the tower I am pretty sure. That process will take quite a while. They still have many disaster recovery issues to attend to for the here and now. It has been a horrible experience, but I am impressed with their response.
2. As far as I know KARK is running at full on analog and digital. I have visited with the CE and actually was in their building two days ago...all systems are on go.
3. KATV tower work on Shinall shouldnt affect KARK at all at this point.
4. Our back up tower is to the North and East of the big tower, KARK's is to the North and West of the big tower.

Hope that helps!

from KATV's website (on the "Back on the Air" page):

Will I get both digital (High Definition) and analog signals?
If you are served by the Comcast cable system in Little Rock, you should be able to receive a high definition signal in the next few days. Our hope is to obtain a digital transmitter and antenna and be on the air with high definition programming within several weeks. This will provide high definition service to most of the other cable systems as well.

so maybe Comcast subs will have it back before LOST returns....

Alison,

I have a question for you, do you think they are so busy that they can't approve waiver requests for those of us on DirecTV so we can get ABC HD via DNS? I figured that with it being completely off the air HD wise that they would approve waivers pretty quick, but so far I haven't gotten anything. My wife is feeling pretty anxious about Lost for next week and would have a golden egg if she has to watch it in SD. :)

And, is there anything you might be able to do for those of us wanting a waiver? Like can you call up Mr. Tidwell and ask him if he has time to approve them all so we can hurry the process up? I didn't know how close of a relationship you guys have in those regards. Even though I can get my ABC HD programming over the Internet, which I am sure you guys would not like it if I did that with CBS programming, I would rather just get it the right way.

And, just on a side note, how is KATV's analog signal being output? I have seen previous posts here say that your backup transmitter is most likely set for 11 and (from what I understand) not able to be tuned down easily for 7 and the matching done on the antenna would be difficult as well since it is already made for 11. I just figured that your setup for the backup system might not be very well suited for their frequency. Just curious how its working. I am not able to get 7 analog very well at all and I am only about 2 miles max from the top of the mountain.

with max amplification on my indoor antenna with it in the setup for the Shinall channels (where I get best reception for the three there), I can barely make out some of Jeopardy. I'm in Benton, ~20-25 miles away.

If any Comcasters get KATV's HD signal, please let me know. My dad's office has Comcast and I'll take my laptop up there next Thursday to record LOST (assuming KATV will be in clear QAM; I just don't feel 100% right about using torrents)

Well, unless they do something different for KATV when they get the HD feed up for it, it will be. I am currently able to get all the locals in HD free and clear (except 7 obviously) as well as PBS HD. This is all through my TV of course. Its possible through a tv tuner on a computer, but its much harder.

from what I've read, you can never be sure what exactly will be in the clear, though locals should always be.

my TV tuner for my laptop does QAM. Since I don't have cable, I haven't gotten to play with it much. It can be a little touchy with the signal strength, there's a strict minimum it requires so if the signal is split too much, it won't work. I may need to buy an in-line amp...

Alison,

I have a question for you, do you think they are so busy that they can't approve waiver requests for those of us on DirecTV so we can get ABC HD via DNS? I figured that with it being completely off the air HD wise that they would approve waivers pretty quick, but so far I haven't gotten anything. My wife is feeling pretty anxious about Lost for next week and would have a golden egg if she has to watch it in SD. :)

And, is there anything you might be able to do for those of us wanting a waiver? Like can you call up Mr. Tidwell and ask him if he has time to approve them all so we can hurry the process up? I didn't know how close of a relationship you guys have in those regards. Even though I can get my ABC HD programming over the Internet, which I am sure you guys would not like it if I did that with CBS programming, I would rather just get it the right way.

And, just on a side note, how is KATV's analog signal being output? I have seen previous posts here say that your backup transmitter is most likely set for 11 and (from what I understand) not able to be tuned down easily for 7 and the matching done on the antenna would be difficult as well since it is already made for 11. I just figured that your setup for the backup system might not be very well suited for their frequency. Just curious how its working. I am not able to get 7 analog very well at all and I am only about 2 miles max from the top of the mountain.

Hello! I will try to answer all your questions. Yes, they are way too busy to deal with waivers. There are so many systems, such as the Studio to Tx link, that have to be reconstructed from scratch it is over whelming. I think you will have to be patient. I would not presume to call Mr. Tidwell unless it was an absolute emergency. I know a waiver is important for you, but it is way on down the food chain for them now. KATV's signal is being output from a Harris ch. 7 transmitter that was installed in our transmitter building just this past Sunday. You are correct, a transmitter set up for analog channel 11 is not typically frequency agile. Now the antenna they are using is a different story. Our backup antenna is a high band VHF antenna is flat across the band. It was "swept" this past Friday and cleared for use on ch. 7. As for reception, it looks good at my house and downtown. You may need to tweak your antenna perhaps. Some folks have their home antenna channel 7 peaked out in the Redfield direction not Shinall. Could that be your situation? Just a guess.

so maybe Comcast subs will have it back before LOST returns....
That would be soooooo nice. It still is somewhat surreal to me that this is even an issue. Here I was thinking the writers' strike was the only thing that was going to interfere with my enjoying Lost this year.

I know. And to think at this time last year I had never seen LOST in HD and I was watching it via VHS (it was a dark time, lol). Now I can't seem to get my head around not watching it in HD...

Comcast: KATV HD Signal Back Up
By Arkansas Business Staff
1/25/2008 2:38:01 PM

Comcast of Arkansas announced Friday that KATV-TV, Channel 7's high-definition signal has returned to channel 431 on Comcast's HD line-up.

"Reestablishing the KATV high-definition signal for our central Arkansas customers was made possible by a direct fiber optic link between the Comcast facilities and KATV's control room," said Gary Massaglia, Comcast's vice president and general manager. "The KATV and Comcast engineering teams worked together to restore this very popular channel."

KATV's analog and HD signals were knocked off the air when its broadcast tower in Redfield collapsed earlier this month. Since then, KATV has been working with Comcast and even broadcast competitors such as KTHV-TV, Channel 11, to get its various signals back up and running.

"We are grateful for the cooperation Comcast staff and management provided immediately after the tower collapse and for their on-going support as the recovery process continues, said Dale Nicholson, KATV's president and general manager. "We are especially appreciative for Comcast working to get our high definition signal back to their customer base."

Squidi...combining two uhf antennas in different directions through a combiner usually doesn't work. Pointing your antenna directly at Shinall will be your best option. A VHF/UHF combiner with the vhf side hooked to your LR special might dramatically improve your CBS and PBS signals. Adding an amplifier (good one from channel master) might also help you out there.

Comcast: KATV HD Signal Back Up
By Arkansas Business Staff
1/25/2008 2:38:01 PM

Comcast of Arkansas announced Friday that KATV-TV, Channel 7's high-definition signal has returned to channel 431 on Comcast's HD line-up....


fantastic! I'll have to see if my laptop's tuner will work with the signal...

Wow, if 8-1 that my tv is decoding is that "HD" signal that the story is talking about, I am wondering what it will look like on an HD show. It doesn't look very good. I switch up to 93-4 (the area where all other other digital, non-hd local channels are) and it looks much better. We will see come time for Grey's or Desperate tonight I guess.

Well, I'll be darned! It really is in HD on 8-1!

3. KATV tower work on Shinall shouldnt affect KARK at all at this point.Is katv looking at a permanent move to Shinall for DTV 22?

4. Our back up tower is to the North and East of the big tower, KARK's is to the North and West of the big tower.Thanks. I thought it was those towers, but wasn't sure. About how far off the ground is your backup antenna that katv is using for analog 7?

FWIW, I am picking up KWBF-DT in Benton tonight for the first time in months. Not very good, about 55%, but I've not seen anything on it in a while. Must be the weather. :)

Maybe ice caused it to bend over pointing more signal at you...

I just checked, still 82 here in NLR, but KARK is back up to almost 100. Its been in the 80's the last few days...maybe I have an ice cube on MY antenna acting like tin foil on rabbit ears hahaha. I did an install today out in Springfield north of Conway, and they had a rabbit ears with gawdy tin foil all over it. I asked her what the tin foil was for, and she said she couldn't get channel 7 so thought it might help. hahaha

I did an install today out in Springfield north of Conway, and they had a rabbit ears with gawdy tin foil all over it. I asked her what the tin foil was for, and she said she couldn't get channel 7 so thought it might help. hahaha

OMG, I thought tin foil on rabbit ears went away with the stone age. ;)

Things have a way of returning. Long ago, channel master made an antenna that looked like two yagi's with the front connected and the back about a foot separated, to form a very tight < shape. Worked great. I noticed the other day some company has come out with an almost duplicate.
Channel Master discontinued the Quantum line. It is STILL used up in the mountains of NWA almost exclusively...see em everywhere. Managed to find one myself on a closeout sale. Best antenna I've ever owned. Don't understand why Channel Master drops their best products and has only cheap run of the mill vhf antennas now. Happened when they were bought out.

I can promise if my Quantum ever meets its demise, I will be making a copy of it. I go up every spring and put silicone on all the rivets and bolts to keep it from rusting or losing contact. Winegard used to have some high gain high windload designs too. I miss the selection that was available in the 70's.

I've been having problems with my outdoor setup today... could be a result of the ice.... but my signal on all the analog stations from Monroe are gone.... KTVE on CH 10 is still there, but a little snow... I'm 25 miles from the tower and it's usually clear. However, I can turn to CH 3, and I still get the usual weak signal from KTBS in Shreveport. My UHF stations seem to be affected too, but not as bad. For example, KARD analog on CH 14 is still watchable, but the signal isn't as strong..and I cannot receiver KARD-DT at all, when there's usually a good enough signal for a lock. I still receive KTVE-HD on CH27, although it's not @ 100%... more like 85-87% range. The real mystery though is that, when I turn my 4228 towards Shreveport, I still could get a semi-watchable signal from KMSS CH 33. I couldn't get KMSS-DT whenever I checked.... but I would think if I had a loose connection up there I wouldn't even get a signal from KMSS or KARD at all. I guess whenever tomorrow rolls around and it's warmer, I'll go up there and see... I'm hoping it's just the ice accumulation on the antenna. Anyway, just wanted to see if any of you had some ideas or input as to what the problem could be.

Have a great weekend guys!

Why doesn't KATV have their own backup transmitter? It would seem like common sense for a TV station to have an auxiliary transmitter for situations like the one they experienced. In fact, I thought all stations had a backup.... KATV is the first one I've seen that doesn't have one. Just something that crossed my mind.

Hope y'all didn't get too much ice down south. We dodged the bullet up here (this time).

Keith, sounds like ice might just be shorting out your insulators. Will probably return to normal when it melts.

Squidi...combining two uhf antennas in different directions through a combiner usually doesn't work. Pointing your antenna directly at Shinall will be your best option. A VHF/UHF combiner with the vhf side hooked to your LR special might dramatically improve your CBS and PBS signals. Adding an amplifier (good one from channel master) might also help you out there.

Thanks!

Is this is a good combiner? ( http://www.antennasdirect.com/antenna_combiner.html )

I couldn't say, there are no specs listed. If you were thinking about an amp, I believe channel master has one with vhf and uhf separate inputs, which would save you the 3db or more loss most combiners/splitters introduce. If you are just wanting to see if it works, get one at radio shack (combiner not amp). Sorry I couldn't help on that specific unit, but specs and inputs vary widely. I'm guessing your LR special has 300 ohm twinlead? If so, you would need a balun on it if your combiner has 75 ohm coax input, or a combiner with a 300 ohm input...The less stuff in the line the better your results.

"Why doesn't KATV have their own backup transmitter? It would seem like common sense for a TV station to have an auxiliary transmitter for situations like the one they experienced. In fact, I thought all stations had a backup.... KATV is the first one I've seen that doesn't have one. Just something that crossed my mind."

Maybe the tower fell on the building where it was housed. Don't know.

I couldn't say, there are no specs listed. If you were thinking about an amp, I believe channel master has one with vhf and uhf separate inputs, which would save you the 3db or more loss most combiners/splitters introduce. If you are just wanting to see if it works, get one at radio shack (combiner not amp). Sorry I couldn't help on that specific unit, but specs and inputs vary widely. I'm guessing your LR special has 300 ohm twinlead? If so, you would need a balun on it if your combiner has 75 ohm coax input, or a combiner with a 300 ohm input...The less stuff in the line the better your results.

What? You mean you can't tell from the tiny picture! ( joking, of course ). I thought you might be familiar with the brand. The LR special has one of those matching transformers on it, so it is coax into the house. I'll fiddle with a cheaper combiner and see what shakes out. Thanks for the assistance.

Yea, that's what I'd do before ordering stuff you can't return easily. From your distance, and the comment that pointed at shinall you lose KASN almost sounds like you might need a little more height. I don't know about your specific UHF antenna, but can the reflector on the back be removed?

...I don't know about your specific UHF antenna, but can the reflector on the back be removed?From where he is located between redfield & shinall, that's an excellent suggestion, if it's easily done. From the looks of it, it may be:
http://i26.tinypic.com/2md5f2t.jpg

It may not be as easy to try as with a CM 4221 or CM 4228.

Be cool if he could mount one reflector on the front, since its split in the middle, and have a bidirectional. Wonder which way would work best?

Be cool if he could mount one reflector on the front, since its split in the middle, and have a bidirectional. Wonder which way would work best?Another option (if it's easy to do) would be to remove just one of the two screens on the DB 4. May or may not work, but it's certainly worth a try. Wouldn't cost anything.

Why doesn't KATV have their own backup transmitter? It would seem like common sense for a TV station to have an auxiliary transmitter for situations like the one they experienced. In fact, I thought all stations had a backup.... KATV is the first one I've seen that doesn't have one. Just something that crossed my mind.

You must have only lived in big market areas then. For some of us it simply costs too much, not only to buy, but also maintain. A market the size of Little Rock should have though. Usually stations have two transmitters at one tower since that is the most difficult thing to duplicate. If that was the case with KATV, they have transmitters but nothing to hang an antenna on to use them with. Also during the transition period, some are waiting until they shut down the analogs and then will replace them with a backup DT. That's my plan with KHBS.

My experience is that either the one thing you don't have a backup for will break, or the backup won't work when you need it!:(

4029, if a similar catastrophe happened to either KHBS or KHOG before 2/17/09, do y'all still plan to abandon the analog ship early?

4029, if a similar catastrophe happened to either KHBS or KHOG before 2/17/09, do y'all still plan to abandon the analog ship early?

KHOG, If the FCC would let us. KHBS isn't likely. The transmitter was just installed in 2004 and is new. In fact we will change its channel and reconfigure it to digital as the backup in 09.

Question...a transmitter is a rf amplifier correct? What's the difference between analog or digital, rf wise? Doesn't it just boost whatever signal you put in, or is ATSC so different? is it not sent on a carrier?

I believe KATV has a back up transmitter, but it is in Redfield. The VHF channels in LR all have back up transmitters/exciters for analog.

... What's the difference between analog or digital, rf wise?Evidently, not much, as far as the transmitter is concerned. The digital signal is split in two chunks and converted to analog by a D/A converter and transmitted.

KOLR-DT in Springfield, plans to reuse their VHF ch10 analog transmitter/antenna for digital after Feb 17, '09. They are currently on UHF ch52, which is an out of core channel that's being auctioned off and must by vacated.

I hope this isn't too far off-topic. I've got a set of fancy rabit ears for my OTA HD reception which works well for 11 and 16. I was watching the Buick Open yesterday when the pic began to break up and then I noticed my wife's cell phone was ringing. As soon as it stopped ringing, the picture righted itself and it coincided exactly with the phone ringing stopping.

Can a cell phone interfere like that?

I hope this isn't too far off-topic. I've got a set of fancy rabit ears for my OTA HD reception which works well for 11 and 16. I was watching the Buick Open yesterday when the pic began to break up and then I noticed my wife's cell phone was ringing. As soon as it stopped ringing, the picture righted itself and it coincided exactly with the phone ringing stopping.

Can a cell phone interfere like that?

Yes. Because the phone transmits digital RF packets back and forth. Mine will get RF into the set of computer speakers (if placed close to them) of the living room PC when "ringing" or receiving alerts of emails/text messages. A cell phone is a digital radio transceiver.

As for the rabbit ears, I'd dump them and go with a "old-school" outdoor antenna if possible. Or plain ones that are *not* amplified.

is there an approximate range for cell phone interference with indoor antennas? if the amplification is up does that extend the radius of interference?

a group at church is having a Super Bowl party and we discovered the interference when we were making sure we could receive FOX (analog) in our church. I'm going to test it Sunday afternoon to see how far of a "no cell phone" radius we need to put in place

I hope this isn't too far off-topic. I've got a set of fancy rabit ears for my OTA HD reception which works well for 11 and 16. I was watching the Buick Open yesterday when the pic began to break up and then I noticed my wife's cell phone was ringing. As soon as it stopped ringing, the picture righted itself and it coincided exactly with the phone ringing stopping.

Can a cell phone interfere like that?Was the cellphone plugged into a charger?

I spent most of the evening after work "in the shack" (and this morning) observing the tropo via analog and digital and a few observations between ham radio contacts.

WKNO-DT 29 (10-n) PBS Memphis seems to have a balance between mulitcasting and HDTV. They run two streams but one is HDTV, but its not a 24/7 PBS-HD feed.

WLMT-DT 31 CW Memphis airs the VTV channel, same as KASN on its 30-2 subchannel. VTV seems to be a Clear Channel O&O channel.

The TBN station there, WBUY-DT 41 (Holly Springs MS, actual COL) 40-n airs *five* SD streams, making even SD look like a bad E* SD feed (and this was observed downconverted on a analog TV--only one HDTV in this house).

WBBJ-DT 43 ABC Jackson TN (7-n) had a HD, SD, and static radar channel. The SD channel seemed redundant.

Noticed strong analog KETK-56 (Tyler TX area, actually Jacksonville TX), and scanned in 22 on the DTV box and it came in with a HD channel (no hd programming though, its NBC), Weather Plus, and a blank channel--not even a slide. Logged KPLC ch7 analog minutes later (weak with katv CCI).

[KLTV ch7 analog Tyler TX ABC came this morning briefly. 2 down on the analog 7 list, now looking for KOAM next time :D ]

WMAB ch 2 analog Starkville MS PBS/MPB (COL actually MS State) stayed in all evening, to the point of being watchable, albit snowy. MPB digitals wouldn't lock though yesterday although if WMAO-DT 25 had been at full power, it could have blasted though KVTN (I did get a ping or two from weakling WXVT-DT 17 CBS Greenville MS, but no lock).

The TBN station there, WBUY-DT 41 (Holly Springs MS, actual COL) 40-n airs *five* SD streams, making even SD look like a bad E* SD feed (and this was observed downconverted on a analog TV--only one HDTV in this house).


Most TBN O&O stations run the five digital feeds (according to the Wikipedia page for Dallas' KDTX). Don't know how that will change when TBN HD eventually goes live. Three of them are niche channels that may not have a big audience anyways (a channel with 24/7 church services? I'd get tired of that within five minutes unless it's an engaging service which are few and far between + a Hispanic channel + a teens channel).

... WBBJ-DT 43 ABC Jackson TN (7-n) had a HD, SD, and static radar channel. The SD channel seemed redundant.I've long wondered why some stations do this. It seems like a complete waste of bandwidth.

Perhaps someone from a station will post their opinion on why this is sometimes done.

I spent most of the evening after work "in the shack" (and this morning) observing the tropo via analog and digital and a few observations between ham radio contacts.

WKNO-DT 29 (10-n)
WLMT-DT 31 CW Memphis
The TBN station there, WBUY-DT 41
WBBJ-DT 43 ABC Jackson TN (7-n)
Noticed strong analog KETK-56
Logged KPLC ch7 analog
KLTV ch7 analog Tyler TX
WMAB ch 2 analog Starkville MS PBS/MPB

Looks like it was the perfect night.... and I could tell, becuase it was quite foggy here. Unfortunately, I'm still having problems with my connections so I didn't get to really check anything out. I've replaced the 7777 with another, I've changed out all the coax coming from the preamp, but I am just stumped. I guess I'm not quite as big an expert with this than I thought I was. I can get a snowy KTVE, KTVE-DT (at a lower SS), KARD analog (quite snowy) and that's about it.

You must have only lived in big market areas then. For some of us it simply costs too much, not only to buy, but also maintain.

The biggest market I've lived in is Shreveport... I'm not sure if they have backups, I know that KTVE, the NBC affiliate here, has a backup transmitter in El Dorado that only reaches about 25 miles out. I just figured if they had one, everyone else did :)

Question...a transmitter is a rf amplifier correct? What's the difference between analog or digital, rf wise? Doesn't it just boost whatever signal you put in, or is ATSC so different? is it not sent on a carrier?

Analog has to have a flat bandwidth out to 4.5 MHz. Digital has to be flat for the entire 6MHz. Digital has to fall off sharply outside the channel boundry (something like 40db instantly) and analog doesn't. Other than that, they are the same.

Changing channels is harder. Most of the transmitter parts are frequency dependent.

Looks like it was the perfect night.... and I could tell, becuase it was quite foggy here. Unfortunately, I'm still having problems with my connections so I didn't get to really check anything out. I've replaced the 7777 with another, I've changed out all the coax coming from the preamp, but I am just stumped. I guess I'm not quite as big an expert with this than I thought I was. I can get a snowy KTVE, KTVE-DT (at a lower SS), KARD analog (quite snowy) and that's about it.How high is your antenna?
Which antenna(s) are you using?
What kind of connectors are you using?
Compression (not crimp or screw-on) connectors are best.

Do you have splitters? If so, where are they located? The power supply brick for the 7777 should be installed between the coax run to the antenna and the splitter. IOW, the splitter should be on the "Out to TV" side of the preamp power supply.

Sam,

The antennas are a CM 4228 and a Radio Shack VU-190 XR about 25 feet up. I'm using the screw-on connectors... and yes I'm using a two way splitter rated for digital/satellite. I've used the same setup for over a year now, and everything has worked fine until Friday afternoon during all the ice. I've even replaced the splitter, I've replaced the coax going from the 7777 mounted outside to the power supply, because when I pulled on the coax, the picture would improve to normal for a couple seconds, so I thought it must have been the coax run. Still the same thing with the new coax. It's almost like reception is messed up only on certain channels, because I still get a weak KTBS channel 3 from Shreveport (even with the antenna aimed at Monroe) I get nothing on CHS 7-13, With the exception of a snowy CH 10, which is 20 miles away. I've lost KETZ-DT (AETN) on CH 12.... located on the same tower as KTVE. Not a blimp of signal. I turn to UHF, and KARD analog 14 from Monroe (70 miles away) comes in, but worse reception than usual. When aimed towards Shreveport, CH 24 doesn't come in at all, while CH 33 has the same amount of snow that it usually does. That's what baffles me, the signal problem isn't across the band...

I just received word that KHBS/KHOG , KATV, along with ABC and all other ABC affiliates have been fined $27,500 each for airing female nudity in a 2003 episode of NYPD Blue.

Oh my...not nudity. Wow, BBC would be broke. This has got to be the most prudish nation on earth. Its ok to show people getting mutilated, but show a breast and all hell breaks loose... Its laughable.

I just received word that KHBS/KHOG , KATV, along with ABC and all other ABC affiliates have been fined $27,500 each for airing female nudity in a 2003 episode of NYPD Blue.Meanwhile, they can show all sorts of graphic violence on CSI and not a peep outta the FCC. Thank god this administration's days are numbered.

I'm sorry, 40/29, but at least you can't say i didn't warn you:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=12916240#post12916240

I just received word that KHBS/KHOG , KATV, along with ABC and all other ABC affiliates have been fined $27,500 each for airing female nudity in a 2003 episode of NYPD Blue.katv can probably get out of it by claiming they were showing their regular programming (infomercials). But the real abc affiliates, like 40/29 are just stuck.

keithar2002,
So, you're having the same problem on both TVs?

And the splitter is located downstream of the power brick (on the "TV" side?

For some reason tonight my HR20 tv is having trouble with 4-1. The HR20's meter says its fluctuating between 38 and 57. Thats using the half-baked antenna thats been working find for the longest time getting 70's to 80's on 4-1. In the computer room, the H20 is getting it at a solid 70 - 75 with no bad drops. I wonder what the deal is with that. Nothing has changed on the HR20 antenna, its still in the closet like it always has been and hasn't been moved. Its weird how things fluctuate like that.

I just received word that KHBS/KHOG , KATV, along with ABC and all other ABC affiliates have been fined $27,500 each for airing female nudity in a 2003 episode of NYPD Blue.

Seems in recent years, the FCC's sole purpose has been to look for "porn" while it allows religious FM broadcasters like American Family Radio to operate a quasi-commercial station (KANX 91.1) on the non-com portion of the FM bands without any sanctions, and lax technical standards for broadcasters in general. Hopefully our next President will appoint those to the FCC that gives a tinkers damn about being the Federal Communications Commission and not the "Federal Cleveage Checkers" they are now.

The analog shutdown isn't the only thing I'm looking forward to in 2009 :D

"steveken 07:56 PM Today
For some reason tonight my HR20 tv is having trouble with 4-1. The HR20's meter says its fluctuating between 38 and 57. Thats using the half-baked antenna thats been working find for the longest time getting 70's to 80's on 4-1. In the computer room, the H20 is getting it at a solid 70 - 75 with no bad drops. I wonder what the deal is with that. Nothing has changed on the HR20 antenna, its still in the closet like it always has been and hasn't been moved. Its weird how things fluctuate like that."

For what it's worth, I talked with a tech in the "Advanced Tech" department at D* today and he said that "its a measurement on how well the signal is read with regard to error correction required. It's not really about strength but quality. 100 required no error correction." Does that make sense to anyone?

In that light, I have seen KARK-DT with a black screen (gray on some sets) and no program audio while showing a solid 98 to 95 on the "Signal" meter. There again, I think some LR stations do not monitor their OTA signal and don't know when their digital transmitter is off the air, or they simply forget to switch back to HD after a local cut-in until a viewer calls in and tells them. I have been told that KARK has employees in their "Engineering" department that don't even know that KARK has a UHF digital transmitter. I just can't imagine that.

If a digital transmitter looses the input signal from the studio, it will just output black and no audio too. I am having a heck of a time with the microwave units between the studio and transmitter myself. I have had as many as three fail in one day.

If the transmitter stops putting out power, that's easy. If it just starts outputting black and the master control switcher has a picture, now you have a problem. Which one of a dozen boxes quit passing the signal, and what is the work around? That is over the head of the typical operator who must then call in a maintenance engineer. Factor in the time it takes for him to isolate the problem and patch around it. :confused:
In fact, I have never seen a case where I needed a viewer to tell me I was off the air. The computer alarms sound like a Star Trek red alert on steroids. Usually their phone calls only serve to further delay me in getting it fixed. Factor in the two or three I get every day insisting I'm off the air and refuse to believe that I'm setting there watching it on a regular TV set on an antenna, so it's not us. Then there's the little old ladies that want to know when we will be back on the air because she is missing "HER STORY" which it turns out is on another channel but I'm wrong because she knows darn well she watches it on us every day.:eek:

Heck, at any one time we might have 100.000 viewers. Let's all call at the same time! I guess the only thing worse is really being off and nobody calls. That means no one's watching.:(

Most of the people you have dealt with are operators, not engineers. A station only has three or four engineers. An engineer will certainly know if they have a UHF transmitter. The operators aren't technical, they just push buttons. Most are college students. If something doesn't work all they know to do is follow a flow chart or call an engineer. Sometimes they may forget to "press the button". If they are working for me, after about the second time I'll be sending them down to LR to find a job at one of those sloppy stations!:p

4029,

Yeah, that sounds about right with the college student, button pusher, not really knowing or caring whats going on around them and trying to learn about it. And you know what the real shame about it all is? Its the fact that people who actually know SOMETHING (not saying they know much, just something) at all about all this stuff, who would actually go out of their way to learn, and who actually gives a rats ass about it all can NOT get a job around here to save his life!

I am speaking from my own experiences on my side of course. I tried to get a job with Alison back in February of last year at KTHV, but I guess there was someone with a little more experience or something that got the job instead of me. It wasn't a job nearly as important as what we are talking about here (it was a Computer Specialist Technician), but still, it was a job that I thought I could have done very well.

I just wish more companies around here would take the amount of desire to do the job into account along with their educational background and other work experience when choosing the person to hire. In my case, sadly, the work experience is what is hurting me the most I think (long story). But you gotta do what is best for the company and pick who will fit the best. I just wish that one time I could get the job that I really want. I have gone to several job interviews where I am just really hoping I get the job only to be disappointed. I feel like the lonely girl in the big city looking for "Mr. Right", going on dates, hoping and praying I get called the next day and maybe being asked out for a second date, only to be forgotten about very quickly.

*Note to Alison if you read this particular post: I am in no way complaining or bashing your decision for that particular job vacancy. I do understand you gotta do what you gotta do to make the ship float as well as possible. Please don't take any offense to it. I am just speaking in general about every place I have tried to find a job at for the last year (yeah, its been a year since graduation from college and I still am looking for that "right job" to come along).

It is tough to get an IT job. Too much competition. Every time I post an engineering opening, I'll get at least a dozen out of work IT resumes. Pay is too low for the operators jobs although I imagine it is better in LR than here. You would qualify for that but we have waiting lists for those jobs and you wouldn't be doing IT. Here engineers handle IT as a collateral duty under direction of the Hearst data center in Charlotte. If you really want to break into an engineering slot I would suggest a 2yr electronics certificate from someplace like Ark Vo Tech. Then you would still have to get experience at a small market like NWA before you could get on in LR.

I decided to edit and talk about your statment concerning taking your desire into consideration when hiring. I have never conducted an interview where the person I was interviewing didn't tell me he was the going to be the best employee I had ever hired. How do you tell? I don't know. Wish I did.

You mean a 4 year M.I.S. degree won't get me anywhere? I have to go get a 2 year community college degree? LOL And 4 years as an Aviation Electronics Technician in the Navy won't help either? :) Sorry, but most of the time I find that education and just knowledge in general doesn't get you jack around here. You have to know too many people to be able to get a job, much less a break into a specific field.

I just really want to move to a real city in a real state where damn near everything and everybody's life in the entire state doesn't circle around one specific thing or group and you don't have to know a guy who owes another guy a favor kinda thing to get a job.

The meter being a bit rate error meter makes sense. On my FTA receiver, I have both. Often, Ill get a 90 signal strength and 40 quality (errors). Usually turns out to be interference from a neighboring satellite, or cross polarization, which to OTA means multipath or noise. The newer receivers (not HR20) actually computer the multipath, and Delay the main signal to ADD the multipath to increase the quality.
This is noticed by the signal taking a longer than usual time to lock on. Makes sense to me.

I agree with you 100%, steveken! You hit the nail on the head...your statement about sums up this entire area.


You mean a 4 year M.I.S. degree won't get me anywhere? I have to go get a 2 year community college degree? LOL And 4 years as an Aviation Electronics Technician in the Navy won't help either? :) Sorry, but most of the time I find that education and just knowledge in general doesn't get you jack around here. You have to know too many people to be able to get a job, much less a break into a specific field.

I just really want to move to a real city in a real state where damn near everything and everybody's life in the entire state doesn't circle around one specific thing or group and you don't have to know a guy who owes another guy a favor kinda thing to get a job.

I've checked both TV's that are connected, and I have the exact same problem. I'm thinking their may be some kind of interference nearby, because I took out a portable tv and walked around the property, and had the same problem with reception.... CH 10 @ 20 miles away coming in barely watchable... and a translator station for CBS 1/2 mile away really snowy. I took the portable tv around in my vehicle for a few blocks, and as I left my immediate block, reception improved... to the point that I was able to receive KNOE CH 8 with a snowy picture, but it's 78 miles away. CH 10 was perfect... but as I came closer to my block, reception dropped to almost nothing. I simply cannot understand it. I don't know who to call, because I don't know where the problem is coming from! It just started Friday afternoon... :confused:

keithar2002,
So, you're having the same problem on both TVs?

And the splitter is located downstream of the power brick (on the "TV" side?

I'm thinking their may be some kind of interference nearby

Bahhh.... I just figured it out :rolleyes::o

I got to thinking about the interference problem... I have a little transmitter that broadcasts my Directv feed in the living room to CH 22, with a range of 500 feet. I went and unplugged it. Wal-lah.... CH 10 is perfect... KNOE is good... I have KETZ-DT back, along with all my Shreveport DTs. KARD-HD is back. I have no idea why the transmitter would have caused that much trouble after working so well for over a year... and I don't know why it decided on Friday afternoon to start messing with my reception... but everything is normal now!

This has to be the strangest thing I've heard of.

Just thought I'd pass this oddity around to all of you. :)

Keith,
Always be suspect of any wireless device you or your neighbors are using. That's the first thing to disconnect if you're having reception problems with another wireless device (e g, OTA TV).

If the FCC spent less time regulating the nation's morals and more time regulating wireless devices like the one you purchased, these kinds problems wouldn't be as common.

You mean a 4 year M.I.S. degree won't get me anywhere? I have to go get a 2 year community college degree? LOL And 4 years as an Aviation Electronics Technician in the Navy won't help either? :) Sorry, but most of the time I find that education and just knowledge in general doesn't get you jack around here. You have to know too many people to be able to get a job, much less a break into a specific field.

I just really want to move to a real city in a real state where damn near everything and everybody's life in the entire state doesn't circle around one specific thing or group and you don't have to know a guy who owes another guy a favor kinda thing to get a job.

steveken, I think you will find that the "Peter Principle" is alive and well in broadcast stations. Some stations have incompetent people working in a high-level job that is way above their level and are relying on subordinates to do the thinking for them. That is why in many cases if you can't be replaced, you can't be promoted.

The FCC has turned what used to be a highly-skilled vocation (Broadcast Engineer) into a plug and play occupation with its lax restrictions. One that comes to mind is that a person with a First Class Radiotelephone license ( now issued for life and known as a General license) is no longer required to monitor a television transmitter and log readings on a regular basis. A person can walk in off the street, get hired by a station, and immediately control a high-power television transmitter with no license and very little training necessary. It's a management's dream. Also the remote control never has to be paid, never takes vacation, and no retirement plan.

You mean a 4 year M.I.S. degree won't get me anywhere? I have to go get a 2 year community college degree? LOL And 4 years as an Aviation Electronics Technician in the Navy won't help either? :) Sorry, but most of the time I find that education and just knowledge in general doesn't get you jack around here. You have to know too many people to be able to get a job, much less a break into a specific field.

stevenken, Check your PM

Was the cellphone plugged into a charger?No, it wasn't.