Originally posted by Calabs
I live in E. Brunswick as well. I used to have my antenna pointed toward PA until NBC and ABC came back on line out of NYC. When I had it pointed toward Philly, I never got WCAU (NBC; 10-1). Fox (29-1) was sporadic as well. I would get a strong signal on some days, and on others, I would either get significant dropouts or no signal at all.


Calabs, thanks for the info. Good to hear from someone else is EB. I am somewhat in the shadow of the towers by the Hilton hotel. I am getting CBS and ABC from NY strong (Sugar Bowl and Castaway looked great in HD.) Can't really get NBC at all, and can't seem to get Fox. Are you getting NBC and FOX strongly out of New York?

Originally posted by dan57
Calabs, thanks for the info. Good to hear from someone else is EB. I am somewhat in the shadow of the towers by the Hilton hotel. I am getting CBS and ABC from NY strong (Sugar Bowl and Castaway looked great in HD.) Can't really get NBC at all, and can't seem to get Fox. Are you getting NBC and FOX strongly out of New York?

I'm getting NBC very strongly, about 70% SS. However, FOX is hit or miss. Some days OK, some days horrible. Usually CBS/NBC/ABC come in very reliably, when they're not working on their transmitters! :eek:

If the towers are in the way, that could put a damper in your reception. I'm further southwest, close to the Brunswick Square Mall. Further away, but a nice line of sight.

I live in East Brunswick, NJ as well. I am using a CM 4248 Antenna plus a CM 7775 preamp in my attic. I'm getting good signals from all the stations coming from NYC (CBS, NBC, FOX, ABC, PBS, etc).

I am off River Road (Windsong development) and have a good line of sight off NYC. Actually I'm getting good OTA signal even before 9/11.

Never tried getting signals from Philly though.


Originally posted by dan57
Calabs, thanks for the info. Good to hear from someone else is EB. I am somewhat in the shadow of the towers by the Hilton hotel. I am getting CBS and ABC from NY strong (Sugar Bowl and Castaway looked great in HD.) Can't really get NBC at all, and can't seem to get Fox. Are you getting NBC and FOX strongly out of New York?

Originally posted by Calabs
I'm getting NBC very strongly, about 70% SS. However, FOX is hit or miss. Some days OK, some days horrible. Usually CBS/NBC/ABC come in very reliably, when they're not working on their transmitters! :eek:

If the towers are in the way, that could put a damper in your reception. I'm further southwest, close to the Brunswick Square Mall. Further away, but a nice line of sight.

I have been going crazy trying to get my Channel Master 3030 working from Mountain Lakes. I have it running into a Terk 5x8 switch (dish) which acts as a diplexer and then into my Hughs HTL-HD receiver.

I have a clear shot at NYC, but still only get junk reception (snow or shadows) on analog, and no signal at all on the digitals.

I was going to put a pre-amp on this, but am not sure if 1) it will make a difference, and 2) will work with the Terk 5x8 switch.

Anyone in the area getting good quality signals?

I live in Freehold, NJ and need to setup an antenna for OTA HD reception. According to AntennaWeb.org I'm 36 miles from NYC. I'm trying to avoid putting an antenna on my roof since i'm in a development and NO ONE has an antenna on their roof - so I don't want to stick out like a sore thumb (unless the antenna is a small one so I can put it on the side of the house)

At any rate, will any indoor antenna work at this distance (Zenith Silver Sensor) or most likely, I'll need to put an antenna in the Attic - therefore what should I get? I hear the RS 15-2160 seems to work good, or do I go with a larger behemoth pointed at NYC from the attic?

Any pointers and suggestions?

The Channel Master 4228 8-bay bowtie antenna is ideal for attic installation since it's compact; with a good preamp it should work fine for you in your situation. Unless your roof has multiple layers of shingles on it, or some heavier shingling like slate, you should be OK.

Originally posted by Chris Cunanan
I live in East Brunswick, NJ as well. I am using a CM 4248 Antenna plus a CM 7775 preamp in my attic. I'm getting good signals from all the stations coming from NYC (CBS, NBC, FOX, ABC, PBS, etc).

I am off River Road (Windsong development) and have a good line of sight off NYC. Actually I'm getting good OTA signal even before 9/11.

Never tried getting signals from Philly though.

I'm....intrigued :p by the fact that you can get PBS....do you mean WNET (analog 13.....digital 61???) I cannot receive that channel....and wasn't "in
the game" pre-9/11.

I will say that on my LCD HDTV setup/CM6041DSB (???) pre-amp/CM4228 I am able to pick up Digital 51 (PBS) out of Montclair pretty reliably now....and they ARE playing the HD segment of PBS's programming on one of their sub-channels.

Also had a pretty decent lock on PBS 8-1/2 last night out of New Brunswick

Edit: While I can get Digital 51 and 8-1/2 on one of my setup's I can't get it on the other TV/Setup. I can't get channel 8 because the pre-amp on that setup isn't a VHF pass through....and Digital 51 isn't strong enough for some odd reason on this same setup.

Both antennas are only about 40 feet apart.....but one is about 3 feet higher than the other. And......the trees....those damn trees.

:D

Originally posted by jaypb
I'm....intrigued :p by the fact that you can get PBS....do you mean WNET (analog 13.....digital 61???) I cannot receive that channel....and wasn't "in
the game" pre-9/11.


:D

I can get WLIW channel 21.1 (another is 21.2). **corrected my post **

Originally posted by Chris Cunanan
I can get WNET channel 21.1 (another is 21.2).

Ahh.,...you mean WLIW-DT...from Long Island.

Nice reach. I can only get those channels (21.1/2) on good tropo evenings.

But, I'm in OTA hell....relatively speaking of course :p

Trees and lack of height above sea level are my albatross's :mad:

Luckily the major NYC OTA stations have resurfaced.

Originally posted by JGDiablo
..... I'm trying to avoid putting an antenna on my roof since i'm in a development and NO ONE has an antenna on their roof - so I don't want to stick out like a sore thumb (unless the antenna is a small one so I can put it on the side of the house)...........

I really would not worry about it. I'm the only one who has one in a 250 home development taking a tour this past holiday. It's been up for about 1.5 years, and it's an old 30 year old antenna that was given to me. It works fairly well as I can get 2.1, 4.1 (mostly), 5.1-2, 7.1-2, and mostly the 21 channel from LI. I may try bigger and higher as I have both a larger CM and a Telves.

During the tour, my wife noted how many DirecTV dishes are now up in our development. There were only a few last year this time.

Tinton Falls
Asbury Ave.

This weekend due to availability and good reviews, I went with a RS 2160 with preamp from my attic. Works like a charm except for NBC-DT from NY. I hear NBC-DT from NYC is on low power and anyone outside of like a 20 mile radius isn't going to get it (for now). So...I have an idea...

Since the 2160's are fairly inexpensive, what do you think are my chances to catch Philadelphia NBC-DT (perhaps more) putting up another 2160 pointing to Philly from my attic and combining the singals down to the tv? I'm in Freehold so that's about 53 miles from Philly. I guess it all depends how strong NBC is being broadcast out of Philly - is it strong or weak?

Anyone with a thought?

Originally posted by JGDiablo
This weekend due to availability and good reviews, I went with a RS 2160 with preamp from my attic. Works like a charm except for NBC-DT from NY. I hear NBC-DT from NYC is on low power and anyone outside of like a 20 mile radius isn't going to get it (for now). So...I have an idea...

Since the 2160's are fairly inexpensive, what do you think are my chances to catch Philadelphia NBC-DT (perhaps more) putting up another 2160 pointing to Philly from my attic and combining the singals down to the tv? I'm in Freehold so that's about 53 miles from Philly. I guess it all depends how strong NBC is being broadcast out of Philly - is it strong or weak?

Anyone with a thought?

WCAU-DT (Digital 67....NBC out of Philly) is a myth for those of us in the Central NJ area.......unless you live in a vertical geographically endowed location :p

I'd bet (if it was even an option I'm not sure) if you tried to get that antenna out of the attic and high enough, you'd get NBC-DT out of NYC. A nice, clean pre-amp (CM 7775 or 7777 or a quality Winegard pre-amp) would most definitely help.

The last 2 weekends have been a FOOTBALL FAN'S DREAM COME TRUE with all the playoff games in either HD or ED. And the happiness will continue next weekend!

Originally posted by JGDiablo
This weekend due to availability and good reviews, I went with a RS 2160 with preamp from my attic. Works like a charm except for NBC-DT from NY. I hear NBC-DT from NYC is on low power and anyone outside of like a 20 mile radius isn't going to get it (for now). So...I have an idea...

Since the 2160's are fairly inexpensive, what do you think are my chances to catch Philadelphia NBC-DT (perhaps more) putting up another 2160 pointing to Philly from my attic and combining the singals down to the tv? I'm in Freehold so that's about 53 miles from Philly. I guess it all depends how strong NBC is being broadcast out of Philly - is it strong or weak?

Anyone with a thought? I get WNBC pretty well here; you might need to just get a better antenna, though the radio shack preamps aren't known for their quality... get yourself a good low noise one, like the Channel Master 7777 or 7775 or one of the Winegards, at least.

After some playing around, I am now getting WNBC pretty strong out of New York here in E Brunswick. I have a channel master (not sure what model) UHF antenna on the roof with a pre-amp.

Originally posted by dan57
After some playing around, I am now getting WNBC pretty strong out of New York here in E Brunswick. I have a channel master (not sure what model) UHF antenna on the roof with a pre-amp.

Glad to hear it! Sometimes all it takes is a slight change in your setup to achieve results. So far, I've had no problems pulling in the majors (CBS, NBC, and ABC). FOX, on the other hand, is either blasting or dead! :(

Originally posted by Calabs
Glad to hear it! Sometimes all it takes is a slight change in your setup to achieve results. So far, I've had no problems pulling in the majors (CBS, NBC, and ABC). FOX, on the other hand, is either blasting or dead! :(

In my vertically challenged environment I'm able to peg 100 on Digital FOX/CBS and ABC out of NYC....with NBC being a shade lower on a consistent basis.

Any idea why the problems with Fox??? I mean....it's right next to ABC'S digital signal (44 vs 45). Think that has anything to do with it??? ABC's signal is interfering with Fox via your antenna/pre-amp ?!?!

When you were pointing towards Philly, did you have issues with Fox (42) and the PBS station (43)??? (IIRC, I think Fox Philly was hit/miss for you right ?)

Originally posted by jaypb
In my vertically challenged environment I'm able to peg 100 on Digital FOX/CBS and ABC out of NYC....with NBC being a shade lower on a consistent basis.

Any idea why the problems with Fox??? I mean....it's right next to ABC'S digital signal (44 vs 45). Think that has anything to do with it??? ABC's signal is interfering with Fox via your antenna/pre-amp ?!?!

When you were pointing towards Philly, did you have issues with Fox (42) and the PBS station (43)??? (IIRC, I think Fox Philly was hit/miss for you right ?)

Yes, I was having problems with Philly FOX as well. I would think that if it was an interference thing, that it would happen all the time. Sometimes I get FOX just fine. Last night, I was picking it up at ~75% SS. It appears that everytime I get (or don't get) FOX, the subchannel follows the same fate (UPN 5-2). That's why I will be very glad when D* includes FOX-DT. :cool:

The Channel Master 7775 that everybody seems to be talking about here; does that have to be mounted up on the antenna's mast, or would I be able to run my cable into it when it comes in my house, then output it to the stb? I have a junky radio shack amp, but it doesn't seem to do much of anything. I'm in a perfect 23 mile location from NYC, but the locals come in rather weak due to their low power signals. I'm guessing a good amp might help me at least boost the signals enough to lock on and hold on to them...
Thanks

Originally posted by tramahound
The Channel Master 7775 that everybody seems to be talking about here; does that have to be mounted up on the antenna's mast, or would I be able to run my cable into it when it comes in my house, then output it to the stb? I have a junky radio shack amp, but it doesn't seem to do much of anything. I'm in a perfect 23 mile location from NYC, but the locals come in rather weak due to their low power signals. I'm guessing a good amp might help me at least boost the signals enough to lock on and hold on to them...
Thanks

I'm no expert, but I *believe* that pre-amps have to be mounted as close to the antenna/mast as possible....I wish I could tell you the technical/scientific reasons why.

Maybe because the powered portion of the pre-amp is to be mounted near the TV set....and putting the pre-amp unit itself so close to the powered portion would cause interference possibly???

:confused:

Originally posted by tramahound
The Channel Master 7775 that everybody seems to be talking about here; does that have to be mounted up on the antenna's mast, or would I be able to run my cable into it when it comes in my house, then output it to the stb? I have a junky radio shack amp, but it doesn't seem to do much of anything. I'm in a perfect 23 mile location from NYC, but the locals come in rather weak due to their low power signals. I'm guessing a good amp might help me at least boost the signals enough to lock on and hold on to them... The Channel Master 7775 and 7777 are 2-piece preamps; the amplifier is mounted as close to the antenna as possible; and the power injector can be mounted anywhere else along the run, before it is split or connected to another device, where power is accessible.

The further away you place the amplifier, the more noise you'll be amplifying relative to the signal you'll be amplifying. Keeping the signal level well above the noise level is the key to getting reception.

ah, there goes the installing it myself idea.
Thanks

Originally posted by tramahound
ah, there goes the installing it myself idea.
Thanks Might be cheaper to buy a ladder than pay an installer. ;) And then you have a ladder, too.

why, is it that easy to install it? just splice it into the wire at any point in the connection?

Originally posted by tramahound
why, is it that easy to install it? just splice it into the wire at any point in the connection? Yep.

The Channel Master one just has two F-connectors; screw the coax coming from the antenna into the one for that signal and screw the coax going to the house into the other. So you'll just splice the cable, put connectors on, and connect them. It comes with a bracket so you can fasten it to the antenna mast.

The power inserter is the same way, but you put that in further down the line, inside the house, and it plugs into a 110v outlet.

So it'll look like:

Antenna --- coax --- Pre-amp --- coax --- Power inserter --- coax --- antenna input on multiswitch or receiver

I just replaced my pre-amp on one of my CM4228 antennas this morning. I swapped out a CMpreamp for a Winegard ap-8700 pre-amp. The old one used twinlead to connect to the antenna, while this new one utilizes coaxial from the antenna to the preamp (through a balun).

YGBSM with this $*(@)# weather!!!!! I've been waiting for 2 weeks to swap out my pre-amp.......and finally decided to "bite the bullet" and get up on the roof and "Do it". My ears still hurt...... :p.......as do my fingers :mad:

Just curious how everyone's signal strength is doing WRT NYC digitals.

Several questions for January 04:

1- Is anyone able to tune in a stable picture on 8-1 or 8-2? I can get video/audio....but I frequently get breakups and dropouts....which I'm *thinking* has to do with the fact that I'm using a pre-amp even though I am so close to the source (15 or so miles ?!?!?) My SS tops out at about 75 no matter how far I rotate my antenna.....

2- WNBC-DT.....the reason I replaced the pre-amp I had up there (CM 0064DSB???) was because I think the pre-amp twinleads were either corroded or faulty....as I was getting SS of near 100 on most all channels....but then they were drop down to 75 or 86 and fluctuate up and down....and I would subsequently see HEAVY pixelation and disturbances in the on screen video-audio. This CM 4228 antenna is lower than my other setup (which DOESN'T exhibit) these characteristics so I'm not sure if it was antenna height,placement of antenna or the pre-amp/connections.

3-WNJN-DT (Digital 51)....are we all "getting it"???

4- Any other channels other than these that everyone can pick up out of NYC/NY area??? I CANNOT get 11-1 or 13-1....but lately I've been picking up "locks" on their signals....but no picture. Same goes for 21-1 out of LI (PBS WLIW_DT).

So....who's getting what now? Especially since I started this thread over a year ago I'm curious to see how everyone is doing.

Also: I haven't rotated back to Philly to see if WCAU-DT's signal REALLY exists! ;)

Hey JayPb long time no hear from boy you picked a great day to go to the roof. This is my latest channel listing.

WCBS-DT 2-1 No problems
KYW.DT 3-1 No problems
WNBC-DT Nothing
WNEW-DT 5-1 No problems
WOR-DT 5-2 No problems
WPVI-DT 6-1 No major problems
WABC-DT 7-1 When there isn’t any work going on
WNJB-DT 8-1 Nothing
WCAU-DT 10-1 Starting receiving since last Monday night 1/19 ss=40
WPIX-DT 11-1 Nothing
WHYY-DT 12-1 Nothing
WNET-DT 13-1 Nothing
WLIW-DT 21-1 50% of the time in the evening
WTXF-DT 29-1 20% of the time in the evening
WNJS-DT 43-1 - 4 No problems
WGSP-DT 57-1 No problems
WUVP-DT 65-1 No problems

from Metuchen I am getting
2-1(56) 100%
4-1(28) 90%
5-1 and -2 (44) 100%
7-1 (45) 100%
8-1 and -2 95%
11-1 (12)10-12% no pic no audio

Stregnths are similar on my Toshiba and LG receivers. Where is channel 8 broadcast from? It only reads NJN and is usually sd

If I could only get channel 11(wpix-dt) and if wor would get its act together, I would get rid of my directtv locals.

It is finally feeling like pre 9/11.

BTW I am using a cm4228 in my attic with a winegrad preamp-amp. It is on a rotator, but I have no need for that anymore.
baimo

P.S. I am still getting full strgnth from NBC, but they appear to have turned off their digital programming this afternoon. ???????? Dunno why

Originally posted by wward
Hey JayPb long time no hear from boy you picked a great day to go to the roof. This is my latest channel listing.

WCBS-DT 2-1 No problems
KYW.DT 3-1 No problems
WNBC-DT Nothing
WNEW-DT 5-1 No problems
WOR-DT 5-2 No problems
WPVI-DT 6-1 No major problems
WABC-DT 7-1 When there isn’t any work going on
WNJB-DT 8-1 Nothing
WCAU-DT 10-1 Starting receiving since last Monday night 1/19 ss=40
WPIX-DT 11-1 Nothing
WHYY-DT 12-1 Nothing
WNET-DT 13-1 Nothing
WLIW-DT 21-1 50% of the time in the evening
WTXF-DT 29-1 20% of the time in the evening
WNJS-DT 43-1 - 4 No problems
WGSP-DT 57-1 No problems
WUVP-DT 65-1 No problems

Thanks for the reply.

Are you still utilizing the SS with the pre-amp or have you moved outdoors/attic based yet???

I'm going to try to rotate back towards Philly in a wee bit to see if the WCAU myth hath been lifted......... :p

Are you able to pick up WPHL-DT at all (54-1??) That was a station that always seemed to be an issue for me on one TV but was never a problem on the TV with the lower height antenna.

Originally posted by baimo
from Metuchen I am getting
2-1(56) 100%
4-1(28) 90%
5-1 and -2 (44) 100%
7-1 (45) 100%
8-1 and -2 95%
11-1 (12)10-12% no pic no audio

Stregnths are similar on my Toshiba and LG receivers. Where is channel 8 broadcast from? It only reads NJN and is usually sd

If I could only get channel 11(wpix-dt) and if wor would get its act together, I would get rid of my directtv locals.

It is finally feeling like pre 9/11.

BTW I am using a cm4228 in my attic with a winegrad preamp-amp. It is on a rotator, but I have no need for that anymore.
baimo

P.S. I am still getting full strgnth from NBC, but they appear to have turned off their digital programming this afternoon. ???????? Dunno why

Baimo,

Channel 8 is broadcasting from either New Brunswick or the Somerset area. I *think* it's the digital signal from the analog New Brunswick NJN channel...but I'm not sure if it's from NB or Somerset physically. When you "stick with" channel 8.....do you get any breakups or shimmering video....or great "blocks" of video??? I was just watching it (This Old House)....and my SS was 72-79 on my E86....yet the video (again I believe it's always SD on 8-1/8-2) was never clean/crisp.....not sure how else to describe it. I also have a cm4228 (roof mounted) with a Winegard AP 8700 pre-amp. I was thinking the pre-amp was overloading the signal....but I'm not sure anymore. May even be my E86's inability to "decode" the signal properly.

Are you picking up 50-1:5 (Digital 51) out of Montclair at all? How about Channel 13 (digital 61??)

I too am still seeing "black" on 4-1. Yet it's at 93 on my E86's meter. And I'm also patiently waiting for 11-1 to get "back" to where it was pre-9/11...but I don't think that will happpen until the ESB combiner "goes live" and that seems to be more difficult than putting a rover on Mars...... ;)

It's amazing to see how much NYC has "gotten done" in a year....and I can only hope that things pick up even more steam as more people hop on board the digital OTA revolution in 2004.

I'm doing my part AFA informing friends and relatives....but there's only so much you can do until the "other side" of the equation (i.e the transmitters power up or go live) gets up to speed.

Originally posted by jaypb
Thanks for the reply.

Are you still utilizing the SS with the pre-amp or have you moved outdoors/attic based yet???

I'm going to try to rotate back towards Philly in a wee bit to see if the WCAU myth hath been lifted......... :p

Are you able to pick up WPHL-DT at all (54-1??) That was a station that always seemed to be an issue for me on one TV but was never a problem on the TV with the lower height antenna.

Yes I am still using the Silver Sensor I have changed the configuration a little adding a second Silver Sensor and a combiner for increased gain and then into the pre-amp included a pic of the setup.

I do plan to try some type of attic mount probably in the spring. WPHL is very tricky for me I pickup the analog with some snow but I was only able to pick up the digital channel once or twice last year during extremely great tropo.

As for WCAU-DT like I said for some strange reason I just started picking it up could also be a result of changing my setup??

WCAU initially boosted power late last year and further boosted the signal within the last 1 week. I now get it without a problem.

Here in Somerset, I receive (without any problems):
2-1, 3-1, 5-1, 6-1, 7-1, 8-1, 10-1, 17-1, 52-1/5, 57-1 and other stations such as PAX and Spanish Channels.

I finally receive every available digital network. It only took over 2 years!

Originally posted by wward
Yes I am still using the Silver Sensor I have changed the configuration a little adding a second Silver Sensor and a combiner for increased gain and then into the pre-amp included a pic of the setup.

I do plan to try some type of attic mount probably in the spring. WPHL is very tricky for me I pickup the analog with some snow but I was only able to pick up the digital channel once or twice last year during extremely great tropo.

As for WCAU-DT like I said for some strange reason I just started picking it up could also be a result of changing my setup??

Man, if my 3 year old saw those 2 SS's sitting on the floor like that he'd have a field day :D

Guess you've got to make sure NOT to vacuum around them either huh?? :eek:

I see that WNBC-DT is STILL not operating eh?? !?!?!

WNBC-DT was out for me in East Brunswick all afternoon yesterday, but was back on yesterday night.

Originally posted by jaypb
Baimo,

Channel 8 is broadcasting from either New Brunswick or the Somerset area. I *think* it's the digital signal from the analog New Brunswick NJN channel...but I'm not sure if it's from NB or Somerset physically. When you "stick with" channel 8.....do you get any breakups or shimmering video....or great "blocks" of video??? I was just watching it (This Old House)....and my SS was 72-79 on my E86....yet the video (again I believe it's always SD on 8-1/8-2) was never clean/crisp.....not sure how else to describe it. I also have a cm4228 (roof mounted) with a Winegard AP 8700 pre-amp. I was thinking the pre-amp was overloading the signal....but I'm not sure anymore. May even be my E86's inability to "decode" the signal properly.

Jay channel 8 comes in very solid for me- no tiling - no breakup- my antenna is facing north to NYC-away from new brunswick and somerset


Are you picking up 50-1:5 (Digital 51) out of Montclair at all? How about Channel 13 (digital 61??)
I pick up 50-1 (51) and (61), but not real solid. However I dont check any of them often. I am not interested in PBS or real local programming.


I too am still seeing "black" on 4-1. Yet it's at 93 on my E86's meter. And I'm also patiently waiting for 11-1 to get "back" to where it was pre-9/11...but I don't think that will happpen until the ESB combiner "goes live" and that seems to be more difficult than putting a rover on Mars...... ;)

NBC came back last night for the awards

It's amazing to see how much NYC has "gotten done" in a year....and I can only hope that things pick up even more steam as more people hop on board the digital OTA revolution in 2004.
agreed
I'm doing my part AFA informing friends and relatives....but there's only so much you can do until the "other side" of the equation (i.e the transmitters power up or go live) gets up to speed.

To all you Central NJ neighbors ---

Where can we buy outdoor antenna's (Winegard or Channel Master) and/or antenna peripherals that allow returns if the setup is not successful.

I'm interested in local places since shipping returns can add up. I'm troubleshooting a WNBC-DT reception issue from my attic, so i'd like to try a different antenna and/or different pre-amp, etc. I don't mind spending money on a setup that delivers, I just don't want to waste money on a combination that doesn't provide the solution.

Originally posted by JGDiablo
To all you Central NJ neighbors ---

Where can we buy outdoor antenna's (Winegard or Channel Master) and/or antenna peripherals that allow returns if the setup is not successful.

I'm interested in local places since shipping returns can add up. I'm troubleshooting a WNBC-DT reception issue from my attic, so i'd like to try a different antenna and/or different pre-amp, etc. I don't mind spending money on a setup that delivers, I just don't want to waste money on a combination that doesn't provide the solution.

I've seen Channel Master large rooftop type antennas at the Lowes on Rte 9 in Marlboro. If you check Channel Masters website they list "local" retailers....I know there is one on Rte 35 or 34 in Hazlet/Howell area ...not sure of the name. You could probably call them and ask what their return policy is.

And, of course, there is ALWAYS Radio Shack. I believe they have a more than ample return policy.

Originally posted by baimo
Jay channel 8 comes in very solid for me- no tiling - no breakup- my antenna is facing north to NYC-away from new brunswick and somerset


What model Toshiba receiver are you using??? The one that is a clone of the Hughes E86?? I was thinking that my STB is the issue WRT the PBS stations....as I've had similar issues with the PBS station out of Trenton when my antenna used to face Philly. Or I was thinking it was due to my proximity to the towers....adding in the fact I'm using a high gain, low noise Pre-amp ?!?!?

I pick up 50-1 (51) and (61), but not real solid. However I dont check any of them often. I am not interested in PBS or real local programming [/QUOTE]

I've come to the conclusion that I watched PBS more often when they had the HD loop than I do now......I remember how everyone was hoping that PBS would improve their HD offerings....guess that's why they say, "Careful what you wish for".... :rolleyes:

I'm interested in hearing from anyone in Morris County who can confirm that WCBS-DT is still being received at the same strength as about 3 weeks ago. I had CBS just touching the threshold of my TV's tuner (sometimes it'd be okay, sometimes not) but I haven't been able to lock it for three weeks straight. The SS is showing 50%. OTOH, WNBC-DT, which took planetary alignment to receive up to then, is now watchable almost all the time.

There's been some recent posts that WNBC-DT was off the air for a good portion this past Sunday, 1/25, then went back on in the evening. Can anyone tell if the signal strength has increased since last night?

It would appear that WNBC-DT was up to some sort of tweaking last night - just wondering if things improved.

WNBC-DT is my only channel I can't lock in on with my HTL-HD - hoping a boost in power from them would help.

Originally posted by jaypb
Man, if my 3 year old saw those 2 SS's sitting on the floor like that he'd have a field day :D

Guess you've got to make sure NOT to vacuum around them either huh?? :eek:

I see that WNBC-DT is STILL not operating eh?? !?!?! Yep on all counts I vacuum around the antennas I pretty much where they should be setup so it’s not a real big thing if she moves them.

Hi all... I'm new to both this forum as well as the "HD" way of life.. but I am a computer and electronic savvy person and a quick learner... however, I did not want to read through all 70+ pages of this thread... :)

I am in the Briar Ridge complex off of Milltown road near the Home Depot... Can you give me any estimate of how well an indoor antenna from BB or CC will work for me ?? With the weather only getting worse the next few days, I will definatly not be able to do anything on the roof and I am eager to get something workin for the Superbowl this weekend...

Thanx for any info you can provide....

Originally posted by wayner
Hi all... I'm new to both this forum as well as the "HD" way of life.. but I am a computer and electronic savvy person and a quick learner... however, I did not want to read through all 70+ pages of this thread... :)

I am in the Briar Ridge complex off of Milltown road near the Home Depot... Can you give me any estimate of how well an indoor antenna from BB or CC will work for me ?? With the weather only getting worse the next few days, I will definatly not be able to do anything on the roof and I am eager to get something workin for the Superbowl this weekend...

Thanx for any info you can provide....

Is that big water tower in your "way" when you face NYC or Philly? You can get your compass headings from www.antennaweb.org

I'm thinking that you *shouldn't* have a problem getting either WCBS-DT or KYW-DT to watch the super bowl with a set top antenna. I was able to using a Zenith Silver Sensor (at Circuit City I believe) on one of my HD setups. CBS from both locales is a boomer compared to the other digitals IMHO.

Or try Radio Shack and see if they have any "Double Bowtie Antennas" in stock. There's a RS on Rte 18 over by Toys R Us and another one in the East Brunswick mall.

Originally posted by jaypb
Is that big water tower in your "way" when you face NYC or Philly? You can get your compass headings from www.antennaweb.org

I'm thinking that you *shouldn't* have a problem getting either WCBS-DT or KYW-DT to watch the super bowl with a set top antenna. I was able to using a Zenith Silver Sensor (at Circuit City I believe) on one of my HD setups. CBS from both locales is a boomer compared to the other digitals IMHO.

Or try Radio Shack and see if they have any "Double Bowtie Antennas" in stock. There's a RS on Rte 18 over by Toys R Us and another one in the East Brunswick mall.

That would be Best Buy or Sears.

Originally posted by wward
That would be Best Buy or Sears.

Which part? For the Silver Sensor ? I could've sworn I picked mine up at CC less than a year ago. :confused:

Originally posted by wayner
Hi all... I'm new to both this forum as well as the "HD" way of life.. but I am a computer and electronic savvy person and a quick learner... however, I did not want to read through all 70+ pages of this thread... :)

I am in the Briar Ridge complex off of Milltown road near the Home Depot... Can you give me any estimate of how well an indoor antenna from BB or CC will work for me ?? With the weather only getting worse the next few days, I will definatly not be able to do anything on the roof and I am eager to get something workin for the Superbowl this weekend...

Thanx for any info you can provide....

I'm just down the road a-piece from you (E. Brunswick). If you're by The Grove, which is where I think the Briar Ridge complex is, the tower should not be in you're line of sight. Even if it was, it's far enough away where it shouldn't affect your reception. I've never tried an indoor from where I am; always had a rooftop antenna. I can pick up CBS quite well. If you're only interested in CBS in the near term, it's worth trying an indoor. NBC may be a little more difficult to pick up from inside, however.

The one thing about your location that MAY give you some problems is the hill. I believe the comples is at the bottom of the hill, correct? If so, that MAY give you some problems with an indoor.

You don't happen to have Directv? They're staring broadcasting of CBS feed starting on the 29th, IIRC.

Originally posted by jaypb
What model Toshiba receiver are you using???....
I believe it is a toshiba dts3000 , butn the signal and picture is just as strong with the new lg3200 i am using in the bedroom. IMO you aint misssing much.
I pick up 50-1 (51) and (61), but not real solid. However I dont check any of them often. I am not interested in PBS or real local programming

I've come to the conclusion that I watched PBS more often when they had the HD loop than I do now......I remember how everyone was hoping that PBS would improve their HD offerings....guess that's why they say, "Careful what you wish for".... :rolleyes: [/B][/QUOTE]

I never liked pbs- i never liked school- just me

baimo

Originally posted by baimo
I've come to the conclusion that I watched PBS more often when they had the HD loop than I do now......I remember how everyone was hoping that PBS would improve their HD offerings....guess that's why they say, "Careful what you wish for".... :rolleyes:

I never liked pbs- i never liked school- just me

baimo [/B][/QUOTE]

That Toshiba is the "cousin" of the E86 (The Toshiba was made by Hughes but badged under the Toshiba label)....so I guess it's not the receiver per se that is having a problem with the PBS stations if you dont see the same symptoms. Must be my proximity/antenna facing/pre-amp........

I *think* I've noticed that 21-1 out of LI seems to (at least according to my D* on screen guide) show a few PBS KIDS shows in HD.....not sure if the guide is accurate, but I've got small kids......and they are AMAZED by HD....Bugs Life the other night was a real treat for my 6 year old. Even gave her some popcorn and sat her down on the couch.....if not for those DAMNED COMMERCIALS.......:D

I *think* Lion King is supposed to be on ABC in 2 weeks or so. Gladiator next Monday night IIRC as well.

It's a shame that Armaggedon wasn't OAR last night. It WAS for the first 5 minutes or so....then after the NYC asteroid assault it switched back to full screen........BOOOOOOOHHHHHHHH!!!!!!

:mad:

Sorry to but in here, but this thread is pretty long and rather difficult to search through.

Looking to attempt to receive CBS from NYC in Warren, NJ. Does anybody have a working antenna setup, preferably indoor/attic (I know, it's rather unlikely, but there is work going on outside the house which makes getting to the roof _very_ difficult).

People have mentioned using the Silver Sensor - any luck with these?

Originally posted by yubyub
Sorry to but in here, but this thread is pretty long and rather difficult to search through.

Looking to attempt to receive CBS from NYC in Warren, NJ. Does anybody have a working antenna setup, preferably indoor/attic (I know, it's rather unlikely, but there is work going on outside the house which makes getting to the roof _very_ difficult).

People have mentioned using the Silver Sensor - any luck with these?

No to be elusive, but isn't here like THREE Warren, NJ's............in New Jersey?? :eek:

Ahh, sorry! Warren, in Sommerset Country.

Edit: added better discription.

Originally posted by yubyub
Ahh, sorry! Warren, in Sommerset Country.

Edit: added better discription.

If you're not in any valley, or have some mountain range between you and NYC, you have a shot at it. Attic is usually better than indoor (a top a TV). Fortunately, CBS is the easiest to pull in. :cool:

Excellent news regarding CBS. Any suggestions on antennas? I've had the TDP MX1500 recommended to me by TitanTV's "antenna finder", but I can't find anywhere to get my hands on the MX1500 before the weekend (yes, you guessed why I'm in a rush to get this setup).

I've heard good things about certain radio shack models (15-2185 and 15-2160), as well as the Silver Sensor...

Originally posted by yubyub
Excellent news regarding CBS. Any suggestions on antennas? I've had the TDP MX1500 recommended to me by TitanTV's "antenna finder", but I can't find anywhere to get my hands on the MX1500 before the weekend (yes, you guessed why I'm in a rush to get this setup).

I've heard good things about certain radio shack models (15-2185 and 15-2160), as well as the Silver Sensor...

Yes, there seems to be a mad rush on this forum to scramble and get CBS-HD for the big game. There's a 30 page (maybe smaller, but it sounds better this way) thread on CBS-HD coming to Directv. Who needs a waiver, who lives in a O&O area, etc? A lot of folks on this forum have had luck with the Zenith Silver Sensor. The antennas that Titan TV suggest are just that...........suggestions. Take a look at the "Type" they suggest as a gauge and find one that is comparable from another manufacturer. Lots of folks on this thread have had success in their attic with the Channel Master bow tie antennas. They may be able to share their experiences with you before Super Sunday. Good luck!;)

Calabs,

Thanks 10e6.

I'm further out then you in warren county everything told me I would not get a signal antennaweb does not even list digital stations for me anymore.Well I went to radioshack and bought a 2160 uhf ant and there $69.00 preamp mounted it on a ten foot mast from my deck,and am very happy to say i am getting New York at 55 miles channels 2-1 , 5-1 , 5-2 , 7-1 , 7-2 at 80% signal unfortunately 4-1 nbc is to weak for a lock need to see daytona 500 in HD next step is to raise it up another 10 feet when the snow clears it is going on the roof.

yubyub-

Go to: http://www.starkelectronic.com/cmuhf.htm and get yourself either the 4228 Channel Master 8-Bay UHF HD TV antenna (more omnidirectional) or one or two CM # 4248 80"LONG FRINGE UHF ANTENNAs. The advantage of two is that you can bring together (using 300 ohm wiring to combine the two on the same pole/tripod) the two directional yagi antennas and point one to NYC and one to Phily. You will have loads of channels including NBC from Phily (NBC from NYC does not reach here). This can be done in the attic as I have done. I live in Basking Ridge. You absolutely will need a preamp. Get the CM 7775. Also, since this is UHF only you won't get over the air vhf analog channels but it is no loss. The digital has better range and once it locks in you won't need analog. If you need before sunday, ship overnight. Also, you'll need the coax runs a few extra peices with 75 ohm conectors. Also, go to http://www.antennaweb.org/aw/Address.aspx to get the main direction to point your antennas; once you lock on the two (Phily, NYC) you won't need to move them again. The Phily stations don't show anymore (they don't show the range they use to but they should be around 210-220 degrees and NYC at around 85-90 degrees. I also get all sorts of stations from Lehigh Valley, Camden, etc, etc.

Hope it helps...

I believe your suggestion to buy two antennas will work only in certain areas (areas where there will be no interference between the two cities (in this case Philly and NYC)). Othewise, I think you will have some reception problems. IIRC, there where some on the forum that ran into this issue with two antennas. I think a rotator would accoplish the same thing you suggest. :cool:

I'm actually just looking to pull in CBS for the game. DirectTV supplies most other needs in terms of HD - it's just the whole O&O thing which is preventing us from getting CBS HD over DirectTV.

So, a single directional antenna might be ideal.

Thanks for the info thus far. Keep it coming!

Originally posted by yubyub
I'm actually just looking to pull in CBS for the game. DirectTV supplies most other needs in terms of HD - it's just the whole O&O thing which is preventing us from getting CBS HD over DirectTV.

So, a single directional antenna might be ideal.

Thanks for the info thus far. Keep it coming!

I was under the assumption that us NYC WCBS viewers WOULD get D*'s HD feed. I *think* WCBS IS O&O. Read this post:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=3231792#post3231792

Originally posted by jaypb
I was under the assumption that us NYC WCBS viewers WOULD get D*'s HD feed. I *think* WCBS IS O&O. Read this post:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=3231792#post3231792 He sounded rather informed so I just assumed he was in NY somewhere that was outside of WCBS's area and was in a different locals market.

But it's true if his locals package from DirecTV is the NYC area stations, he will get CBS-HD since it's WCBS/NY that's being used for the east coast feed. And WCBS would be his local station anyway.

Originally posted by dswallow
He sounded rather informed so I just assumed he was in NY somewhere that was outside of WCBS's area and was in a different locals market.

But it's true if his locals package from DirecTV is the NYC area stations, he will get CBS-HD since it's WCBS/NY that's being used for the east coast feed. And WCBS would be his local station anyway.

What made it even MORE confusing is his area says NY, yet he's in Warren County, NJ. Heh? :confused:

Originally posted by Calabs
What made it even MORE confusing is his area says NY, yet he's in Warren County, NJ. Heh? :confused: Warren County is definitely NYC locals; he'll get CBS-HD via WCBS/NY automatically if he's subscribing to the NYC locals package.

And he should change his location in the profile here. ;)

Originally posted by dswallow
Warren County is definitely NYC locals; he'll get CBS-HD via WCBS/NY automatically if he's subscribing to the NYC locals package.

And he should change his location in the profile here. ;)

I actually have a friend who I just convinced to take the HD plunge who's having his D* system upgraded on 2/6 via the D* $99 upgrade package. The thread is somewhere on the HW forum.

My point is I've heard a lot of folks railing against the CBS HD feeds from D* because most folks should be able to pick up CBS HD OTA. But in my buddies case, he's in a townhouse...and pretty technically deficient. I told him we could try and hook up an OTA antenna in his attic and pick up CBS that way. His wife nixed that when I explained we'd try and feed the RG6 down the walls from the attic (women.....:D)

His HD TV will be in the basement so a STB antenna (based on my trials and tribulations) would probably be out of the question performance wise. So, for him, an HD feed of CBS via D* was his "turning point". Now, if he would've moved his @rse a wee bit sooner he'd have had the setup for the SB this weekend!

Originally posted by jaypb
I actually have a friend who I just convinced to take the HD plunge who's having his D* system upgraded on 2/6 via the D* $99 upgrade package. The thread is somewhere on the HW forum.



Slightly off topic, but does he know if he's getting the Samsung or the new Hughes? Also, can one acquire the upgrade if one already has HD? By that I mean, if I wanted to upgrade one of my STB's to and HD box, can I do that even though I have HD in another room? :confused:

Originally posted by Calabs
Slightly off topic, but does he know if he's getting the Samsung or the new Hughes? Also, can one acquire the upgrade if one already has HD? By that I mean, if I wanted to upgrade one of my STB's to and HD box, can I do that even though I have HD in another room? :confused: Remember that it's really a $399 offer, but that customer retention has some guidelines under which they'll provide a $300 credit to existing customers with accounts in good standing for at least 2 years who want to take the offer.

I don't see why they wouldn't give it to you if you met the guidelines.

Does this mean you're not getting the DirecTV HD DVR? Get that and you'll have a spare HD receiver. ;)

Originally posted by Calabs
Slightly off topic, but does he know if he's getting the Samsung or the new Hughes? Also, can one acquire the upgrade if one already has HD? By that I mean, if I wanted to upgrade one of my STB's to and HD box, can I do that even though I have HD in another room? :confused:

From other threads I read, supposedly you can, as long you haven't taken advantage of a prior HD deal in the last year.

Originally posted by Calabs
Slightly off topic, but does he know if he's getting the Samsung or the new Hughes? Also, can one acquire the upgrade if one already has HD? By that I mean, if I wanted to upgrade one of my STB's to and HD box, can I do that even though I have HD in another room? :confused:

Based on my perusal through all of the upgrade threads over on the HW forum, I don't think you'll know what you get....till it arrives via FedEx or the installer arrives. He wanted a Sony HD box...but when I told him the gist of the deal....compared to the cost of out of pocket purchase of a Sony HD box, he gave up his Sony bent and will be happy with {insert name here} HD receiver :p

AFA you getting in on the $99 deal, I *think* the parameters are: You have to have been a customer for 2+years, with no blemishes on your payment record and spending $40 or more a month. Since you were JUST hooked up to D*, I'd say...you probably wouldnt' qualify. But, you *may* be able to get in on the original upgrade....$399. But, in reality, you'd be better off waiting for open box specials at BB right after the SB....like I am :cool:

I'm contemplating fishing around to see if I can find any OB HD specials for my bedroom TV....and then purchasing {insert 27-30" WS HD TV here} a new TV for the bedroom. That Samsung 27" WS HDTV is back at $599 over at Sears. But, I'm getting off topic.......;)

Originally posted by dswallow
Does this mean you're not getting the DirecTV HD DVR? Get that and you'll have a spare HD receiver. ;)

I've debated calling as well, but I'm going to hold off and *see* if when the HD Tivo comes out they'll offer any upgrade discounts for THAT STB.

And, getting even a wee bit MORE off topic, Doug---I know you post over at TivoCommunity's forum. Are the Tivo units based off of Hughes type menus/functionality/features? By that I mean, do the Hughes Tivo's have the oneline guide? Hughes style signal meters? I only ask because all the info I read on the HD TIVO stated it'll be based on the current Tivo functionality....and I'm a Hughes proponent...and I CAN'T LIVE without the OneLine Guide.

PM me if you want. So as not to cartwheel the OTA nature of this thread even more :p

And he should change his location in the profile here.
It's for my friend's setup. That's why I specifically mentioned Warren, NJ...

Originally posted by jaypb
I've debated calling as well, but I'm going to hold off and *see* if when the HD Tivo comes out they'll offer any upgrade discounts for THAT STB.

And, getting even a wee bit MORE off topic, Doug---I know you post over at TivoCommunity's forum. Are the Tivo units based off of Hughes type menus/functionality/features? By that I mean, do the Hughes Tivo's have the oneline guide? Hughes style signal meters? I only ask because all the info I read on the HD TIVO stated it'll be based on the current Tivo functionality....and I'm a Hughes proponent...and I CAN'T LIVE without the OneLine Guide.

PM me if you want. So as not to cartwheel the OTA nature of this thread even more :p All reports say it's a variant of the DirecTV DVR v3.1 software, so that's mostly what it looks like. There's nothing similar to any of the non-DVR receivers.

Originally posted by yubyub
It's for my friend's setup. That's why I specifically mentioned Warren, NJ... My apologies for jumping on your location, then. :D

My apologies for jumping on your location, then.
No apology necessary. We all just want our HDTV :D

Originally posted by dswallow
All reports say it's a variant of the DirecTV DVR v3.1 software, so that's mostly what it looks like. There's nothing similar to any of the non-DVR receivers.

Which Tivo unit utilizes that SW right now? The current Hughes receivers? How bout the SDDVR40 intro/basic Hughes Tivo. I've noticed that CC carries a SDDVR40 for $99. I was contemplating hoping on that....but I wasn't sure if the price was for new subs or ANY D* sub.

Originally posted by dswallow
My apologies for jumping on your location, then. :D

Me too! It just wasn't clear when you started posting. Our bad! :o

Originally posted by dswallow
Remember that it's really a $399 offer, but that customer retention has some guidelines under which they'll provide a $300 credit to existing customers with accounts in good standing for at least 2 years who want to take the offer.

I don't see why they wouldn't give it to you if you met the guidelines.

Does this mean you're not getting the DirecTV HD DVR? Get that and you'll have a spare HD receiver. ;)

I've only started with D* this month, so it may be difficult to get this deal. But your question regarding the HD Tivo has got me thinking! :cool:

Originally posted by Calabs
I've only started with D* this month, so it may be difficult to get this deal. But your question regarding the HD Tivo has got me thinking! :cool: $899.99 if you put a $100 deposit down. ;)

http://www.*********************/avsTC.htm

Originally posted by jaypb
Which part? For the Silver Sensor ? I could've sworn I picked mine up at CC less than a year ago. :confused:

You probably did I was told this past December when I went to look for one that Circuit City does not carry it anymore. They are only carrying the RCA indoor antenna stuff now.

Originally posted by wward
You probably did I was told this past December when I went to look for one that Circuit City does not carry it anymore. They are only carrying the RCA indoor antenna stuff now.

My the times they are a changin' :D

I know I picked up my first at CC and then I found one at buy.com

They are still in stock over at overstock.com as well.

On a related note, if anyone is looking for/has recently looked for Channel Master pre-amps online I was curious if any of the big Online Retailers have gotten them back in stock. When I was looking for a new pre-amp a few weeks ago the ones I checked online were all OUT of the 7775's...and delivery wasn't expected for a few weeks. So I went the Ebay way and found a Winegard pre-amp.

Originally posted by jaypb
My the times they are a changin' :D

On a related note, if anyone is looking for/has recently looked for Channel Master pre-amps online I was curious if any of the big Online Retailers have gotten them back in stock. When I was looking for a new pre-amp a few weeks ago the ones I checked online were all OUT of the 7775's...and delivery wasn't expected for a few weeks. So I went the Ebay way and found a Winegard pre-amp.

I know a lot of you guys are using the CM preamps with good results, but I think the Winegard Preamps are just as good. I've been using the AP4800 with excellent results thus far. Still hangin' in there in terms of reliability too. I think they're equivalent to the CMs w.r.t. noise level.

Originally posted by Calabs
I know a lot of you guys are using the CM preamps with good results, but I think the Winegard Preamps are just as good. I've been using the AP4800 with excellent results thus far. Still hangin' in there in terms of reliability too. I think they're equivalent to the CMs w.r.t. noise level.

I *think* the AP-8700 Winegard pre-amp I purchased off of Ebay (think it's an older model Year2000 maybe??) was a lower gain, higher noise than the CM7775/7777.


Is the AP4800 a newer model than the AP8700??

Originally posted by jaypb
I *think* the AP-8700 Winegard pre-amp I purchased off of Ebay (think it's an older model Year2000 maybe??) was a lower gain, higher noise than the CM7775/7777.


Is the AP4800 a newer model than the AP8700??

The 8700 is a VHF/UHF preamp (as you probably already know!). The AP4800 is a UHF only preamp. Gain for the AP-4800 is 28 db. Noice in UHF frequency is somewhat similar to the 8700. The 8700 has a noice threshold of 2.8 db and the 4800 is 2.7 db. Check out all the models for comparison.

http://www.winegard.com/offair/pdf/Chart29.pdf

Originally posted by Calabs
The 8700 is a VHF/UHF preamp (as you probably already know!). The AP4800 is a UHF only preamp. Gain for the AP-4800 is 28 db. Noice in UHF frequency is somewhat similar to the 8700. The 8700 has a noice threshold of 2.8 db and the 4800 is 2.7 db. Check out all the models for comparison.

http://www.winegard.com/offair/pdf/Chart29.pdf

The nice thing about the 8700 is that I can *somewhat get* 8-1 out of New Brunswick/Somerset....but she still pixelates and shmears green across the screen....so I gather it's because the pre-amp is overloading the signal and causing the breakups. I can also get a "blip" out of VHF 12 (which I'm assuming is WPIX's signal) on the antenna with the 8700. The CM7775 (which I believe is the UHF only---always get that one and the 7777 confused) x's out the VHF frequency since it's UHF only. It's also nice to get *somewhat* of a picture on the VHF analogs as well especially when D* has issues with the locals...which happened a few times last year after I put up my OTA antenna.

Originally posted by jaypb
I'm contemplating fishing around to see if I can find any OB HD specials for my bedroom TV....and then purchasing {insert 27-30" WS HD TV here} a new TV for the bedroom. That Samsung 27" WS HDTV is back at $599 over at Sears. But, I'm getting off topic.......;)

It looks like the 26" Sammy is reduced FOR GOOD! They don't have a sale price, just the new price! Very nice. Now if we can get one of those 10% off on Saturday sales, we're in business!

Sorry for the off-topic discussion. I'm just too excited! :eek:

Originally posted by Calabs
It looks like the 26" Sammy is reduced FOR GOOD! They don't have a sale price, just the new price! Very nice. Now if we can get one of those 10% off on Saturday sales, we're in business!

Sorry for the off-topic discussion. I'm just too excited! :eek:

I believe the appropriate terminology would be "All geeked up"!

Here's a link to that Samsung thread BTW if you're willing to "relive" the moment:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=329461&perpage=20&highlight=TXN2668&pagenumber=3

Originally posted by jaypb
I *think* the AP-8700 Winegard pre-amp I purchased off of Ebay (think it's an older model Year2000 maybe??) was a lower gain, higher noise than the CM7775/7777.


Is the AP4800 a newer model than the AP8700?? Some info on splitters/diplexers and loss: http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?postid=1657451#post1657451

CM7778: UHF 23db gain, 2.2db noise; VHF 16db gain, 3.0db noise
CM7777: UHF 26db gain, 2.0db noise; VHF 23db gain, 2.8db noise
CM7775: UHF 26db gain, 2.0db noise

AP-2870: UHF 19db gain, 2.9db noise; VHF 17db gain, 2.9db noise
AP-2880: UHF 19db gain, 2.9db noise; VHF 29db gain, 2.9db noise
AP-4700: UHF 19db gain, 2.9db noise
AP-4800: UHF 28db gain, 2.7db noise

Originally posted by dswallow
Some info on splitters/diplexers and loss: http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?postid=1657451#post1657451

CM7778: UHF 23db gain, 2.2db noise; VHF 16db gain, 3.0db noise
CM7777: UHF 26db gain, 2.0db noise; VHF 23db gain, 2.8db noise
CM7775: UHF 26db gain, 2.0db noise

AP-2870: UHF 19db gain, 2.9db noise; VHF 17db gain, 2.9db noise
AP-2880: UHF 19db gain, 2.9db noise; VHF 29db gain, 2.9db noise
AP-4700: UHF 19db gain, 2.9db noise
AP-4800: UHF 28db gain, 2.7db noise

Would you "see" a difference between 2.2 and 2.7? And again, once your gain is up in the 20's, I wonder how much better 28 db is over say 26 db.

Originally posted by Calabs
Would you "see" a difference between 2.2 and 2.7? And again, once your gain is up in the 20's, I wonder how much better 28 db is over say 26 db.

I know, for me, I was always a wee bit more concerned with the DB noise than the gain......only because I knew from reading about my E86 sTB multipath was an issue with the *less than modern* tuners out there.

A crappy signal in would equal a lot more noise with either 26 or 28 DB I guess <G>

But less noise out would be better in my case.....if that makes sense ?!?!

yubyub-

With a lesser setup that I described in my previous message here are the Digital channels I get from Basking Ridge:

CAUTION (In addition to DirecTV HD stations, I am in HD Over-the-Air nirvana):

2-1 ABC WCBS NY HD
3-1 ABC KYW PH HD
5-1 FOX WNYW NY 480P
5-2 UPN NY
6-1,3 ABC WPVI-D1 PH HD
7-1,2 ABC WABC NY HD
10-1 NBC WCAU PH HD
12-1 NJN/PBS-HD WHYY NY HD
17-1 WB WPHL PH HD
29-1 FOX WTXF PH 480P
35-1 WYBE (Educational, Foreign News)
39-1,2,3,4 PBS Lehigh Valley
46-2,3 ACCUWEATHER Forecast & Map Eastern PA
46-4 HD Sports, Programs & Movies HD Eastern PA
50-1,2,3,4 PBS WNJT (sometimes HD)
52-1,2,3,4 PBS (sometimes HD)
57-1 UPN WPSG PH HD
67-1,2 UNI NJ (Spanish)
75-1,2 WB WPHL PH HD

The PBS stations broadcast very similar material although sometimes at different times. They have PBSYOU (learning), PBSKIDS (Cartoons), Regular PBS. WB PH is being broadcast on both 17- and 75- (don't know, why but both my different brand HD receivers pick it up this way). No sign of 4-1 NBC out of NY.

If you want a quick solution to watch the game, pick up a Channel Master PreAmp (similar model but different number as identified earlier on this long thread) at Lowes (off 287 by Piscataway). Get the biggest antenna they have or go to Radio Shack and get their biggest Yaggi (UHF only, it's cheap), the mast and tripod. Point it toward Phily since their CBS signal actually comes in stronger than NYC. You are just a little closer to Phily than I am. If that doesn't work try NYC. I would still come back later and add the Channel Master antenna (I still have RS Yagi) since that will get you incredibly strong reception and you can double them up (forget the antenna interference-multipath theory stuff...for digital it doesn't seem to matter as far as I can tell). I tried all sorts of RS preamps and none worked well. That CM pre-amp made all the difference as half my stations all of a sudden showed up. By the way, I'm sure the Winegard works well but my experience is with CM. The Web site link I provided for the antenna has an 800 number, you can also call them and ask for their recommendations.

One note, I am on a hill area and have good clearance toward Phily. But, I know others who also pick up Phily CBS at lesser locations. Warren is up high. In fact, you probably block some of my signal....

P.S.

Can't beat size (antenna) and power (good preamp)...

Originally posted by Calabs
Would you "see" a difference between 2.2 and 2.7? And again, once your gain is up in the 20's, I wonder how much better 28 db is over say 26 db. If you were dealing with a fringe signal or with interference by something on the same frequencies coming from another direction, it might be noticable, but those should be really rare cases.

Calabs-

You may be right for near angled locations but for looks at Phily and NYC I have no problem or interference (from a digital signal perspective is all I can attest to...lots of snow and ghosting on analog signals but one of my antennas is VHF/UHF and the other is a Yagi). For all practical purposes, yubyub leaves close to me so his directional setup would be similar to mine (minus 5-10 degrees for each). I saw his further post. If he just wants directional for CBS then he can go to Lowes & RS and pick up what he needs, try either direction, and I'm sure after much tweaking (always takes time to get it right) be ready by Sunday.

yubyub-

For reference, I have the CM4228 preamp (from Lowes), Zenith HD-SAT520, and Panasonic TU-HDS20 receivers. The Zenith is outstanding. The Pany has good picture but menus are slow (it's discontinued anyway). The antennas are the Radio Shack VU-90XR VHF/UHF combo and a U-75 (cat 15-2160) UHF only Yagi.

Originally posted by tonyo123
yubyub-

With a lesser setup that I described in my previous message here are the Digital channels I get from Basking Ridge:

CAUTION (In addition to DirecTV HD stations, I am in HD Over-the-Air nirvana):

2-1 ABC WCBS NY HD
3-1 ABC KYW PH HD
5-1 FOX WNYW NY 480P
5-2 UPN NY
6-1,3 ABC WPVI-D1 PH HD
7-1,2 ABC WABC NY HD
10-1 NBC WCAU PH HD
12-1 NJN/PBS-HD WHYY NY HD
17-1 WB WPHL PH HD
29-1 FOX WTXF PH 480P
35-1 WYBE (Educational, Foreign News)
39-1,2,3,4 PBS Lehigh Valley
46-2,3 ACCUWEATHER Forecast & Map Eastern PA
46-4 HD Sports, Programs & Movies HD Eastern PA
50-1,2,3,4 PBS WNJT (sometimes HD)
52-1,2,3,4 PBS (sometimes HD)
57-1 UPN WPSG PH HD
67-1,2 UNI NJ (Spanish)
75-1,2 WB WPHL PH HD

The PBS stations broadcast very similar material although sometimes at different times. They have PBSYOU (learning), PBSKIDS (Cartoons), Regular PBS. WB PH is being broadcast on both 17- and 75- (don't know, why but both my different brand HD receivers pick it up this way). No sign of 4-1 NBC out of NY.

If you want a quick solution to watch the game, pick up a Channel Master PreAmp (similar model but different number as identified earlier on this long thread) at Lowes (off 287 by Piscataway). Get the biggest antenna they have or go to Radio Shack and get their biggest Yaggi (UHF only, it's cheap), the mast and tripod. Point it toward Phily since their CBS signal actually comes in stronger than NYC. You are just a little closer to Phily than I am. If that doesn't work try NYC. I would still come back later and add the Channel Master antenna (I still have RS Yagi) since that will get you incredibly strong reception and you can double them up (forget the antenna interference-multipath theory stuff...for digital it doesn't seem to matter as far as I can tell). I tried all sorts of RS preamps and none worked well. That CM pre-amp made all the difference as half my stations all of a sudden showed up. By the way, I'm sure the Winegard works well but my experience is with CM. The Web site link I provided for the antenna has an 800 number, you can also call them and ask for their recommendations.

One note, I am on a hill area and have good clearance toward Phily. But, I know others who also pick up Phily CBS at lesser locations. Warren is up high. In fact, you probably block some of my signal....

P.S.

Can't beat size (antenna) and power (good preamp)...


75-1 is a national WB feed.

Since I have just started watching WCAU-DT recently I have noticed that the volume levels are VERY VERY LOW!! man I have to lean on the volume to get any usable output.

tonyo123,

Thanks for the info. We're going to try to rig something up this weekend as a backup, in case we can't get CBS-HD over DirectTV.

Thanks again for all the info,

Originally posted by wward
Since I have just started watching WCAU-DT recently I have noticed that the volume levels are VERY VERY LOW!! man I have to lean on the volume to get any usable output.

Funny you should bring up 10-1. I rotated one of my Cm4228'
s around to Philly last night because 4-1 out of NYC was STILL all messed up for me last night----even WITH a signal strength of 79.....so I think I'm getting multipath type effects on 4-1....which isn't surprising since it's low power....and my E86 isn't very efficient at handling deficient signals.

Anyway---10-1 DOES exist. It IS no longer a myth. They MUSt have added 3 or 4 more hamsters to that turbine over there. And the sound IS very low....but I'll tell ya something else....I had the SAME low sound levels on 4-1. Was this during the West Wing that you noticed it? B/c that's when I was tooling around. I didn't go back during the local news afterwards to see if it was a national vs local issue.

I still couldn't pick up 12-1 WHYY though. All the other digitals from Philly were "still there" and viewable. But I turned back around to NYC because I didn't want the wife complaining today if she went to watch the NYC digital locals and couldn't "find them" :p

P.s: Anyone with D* locals have pixelation/freezing/glitches this AM? At around 6:15 AM I noticed it. I think the locals are on Transponder 10---at least the ones I checked were (2,4,5) ?!?! I had a SS of 95 on that transponder and STLL had freezing.

Originally posted by wward
Since I have just started watching WCAU-DT recently I have noticed that the volume levels are VERY VERY LOW!! man I have to lean on the volume to get any usable output.

I was thinking the same thing last night with WNBC. It was so bad, I actually had to change to the analog D* channel (choke....choke....!) to get a respectable volume. When I changed the channel, I almost blew out the TV speakers! :eek:

I was also having this problem with WPVI when I had my antenna pointed toward Philly. Do they still have issues with volumes on HD material. Commercials seemed to be fine.

Originally posted by tonyo123
Calabs-

You may be right for near angled locations but for looks at Phily and NYC I have no problem or interference (from a digital signal perspective is all I can attest to...lots of snow and ghosting on analog signals but one of my antennas is VHF/UHF and the other is a Yagi). For all practical purposes, yubyub leaves close to me so his directional setup would be similar to mine (minus 5-10 degrees for each). I saw his further post. If he just wants directional for CBS then he can go to Lowes & RS and pick up what he needs, try either direction, and I'm sure after much tweaking (always takes time to get it right) be ready by Sunday.

I've heard from others that it was a problem interference. Are your antennas on the same mast? If so, how far apart are they in height?

I was getting nothing from WNBC when I tried to watch Law and Order last night. Had to watch the D* feed.

Originally posted by jaypb
Funny you should bring up 10-1. I rotated one of my Cm4228'
s around to Philly last night because 4-1 out of NYC was STILL all messed up for me last night----even WITH a signal strength of 79.....so I think I'm getting multipath type effects on 4-1....which isn't surprising since it's low power....and my E86 isn't very efficient at handling deficient signals.

Anyway---10-1 DOES exist. It IS no longer a myth. They MUSt have added 3 or 4 more hamsters to that turbine over there. And the sound IS very low....but I'll tell ya something else....I had the SAME low sound levels on 4-1. Was this during the West Wing that you noticed it? B/c that's when I was tooling around. I didn't go back during the local news afterwards to see if it was a national vs local issue.



I noticed the volume problem on the Apprentice as well as the West Wing. I didnt check any local programing may check tonight.

Originally posted by Calabs
I was thinking the same thing last night with WNBC. It was so bad, I actually had to change to the analog D* channel (choke....choke....!) to get a respectable volume. When I changed the channel, I almost blew out the TV speakers! :eek:

I was also having this problem with WPVI when I had my antenna pointed toward Philly. Do they still have issues with volumes on HD material. Commercials seemed to be fine.

They (WPVI-DT) also have a volume issue but not nearly as bad as WCAU-DT.

Originally posted by wward
They (WPVI-DT) also have a volume issue but not nearly as bad as WCAU-DT.

As I said earlier, I rotated around to Philly last night. When the Bachelorette was on 6-1 at 9 or 10pm ish, there was an ABC newsreport on 6-2....showing a time/date stamp of around 6:30 on the lower right hand corner. Anyone else ever see something like that ?!?!?

Damn weird!

6-3 was showing the weather radar screen.

Originally posted by jaypb
As I said earlier, I rotated around to Philly last night. When the Bachelorette was on 6-1 at 9 or 10pm ish, there was an ABC newsreport on 6-2....showing a time/date stamp of around 6:30 on the lower right hand corner. Anyone else ever see something like that ?!?!?

Damn weird!

6-3 was showing the weather radar screen.

Never seen that before but I have seen the weather radar before. Usually 6-2 is the SD version of 6-1.

Originally posted by wward
Never seen that before but I have seen the weather radar before. Usually 6-2 is the SD version of 6-1.

Yup to all the above. That's why I found it so odd. First time I ever noticed a Digital channel playing something different from the non-digital....other than a Saturday AM when ABC-DT was playing an HD loop on 7-1 instead of local news (on 7-2 and analog7/directv 7)

Ok.. Newbie Central time... Sorry to stick this in this thread, but since I am in the area, I figured why not ask a local...
Backround... just got my indoor ant. setup & plugged it into my TV which has a hdtv converter built in... Well, I did the channel scan and it is not finding any stations... I used Ant.org to find out how I should point my ant. for which channels, now I am assuming that I point the rabbit ears in the direction that it states ?? Well, I have tried raising and lowering them, repositioning them etc and I get nothing when I rescan the channels... now i also have gone and manually went from channel to channel and got nothing as well... Is it hit or miss or will I see something on the screen if I am close to a signal ??? Also... the digital signals list the channels as 7.1 or 2.1 etc... Is this the actual channel I need to tune to on my TV ? Or is it just to diferentiate between analog and digital channels ???

Any help you might provide is appreciated. Thanks.

Originally posted by wayner
Ok.. Newbie Central time... Sorry to stick this in this thread, but since I am in the area, I figured why not ask a local...
Backround... just got my indoor ant. setup & plugged it into my TV which has a hdtv converter built in... Well, I did the channel scan and it is not finding any stations... I used Ant.org to find out how I should point my ant. for which channels, now I am assuming that I point the rabbit ears in the direction that it states ?? Well, I have tried raising and lowering them, repositioning them etc and I get nothing when I rescan the channels... now i also have gone and manually went from channel to channel and got nothing as well... Is it hit or miss or will I see something on the screen if I am close to a signal ??? Also... the digital signals list the channels as 7.1 or 2.1 etc... Is this the actual channel I need to tune to on my TV ? Or is it just to diferentiate between analog and digital channels ???

Any help you might provide is appreciated. Thanks. What kind of indoor antenna did you get? The Zenith Silver Sensor is probably your only hope, and you'll be really lucky if that works for you.

All the NYC digital stations are UHF (except for WB11 on VHF 12, but it's very low power right now, and almost no chance you'll get it with rabbit ears in Central NJ). If you're using rabbit ears, nothing you do will help. Those are for VHF.

Originally posted by wayner
Ok.. Newbie Central time... Sorry to stick this in this thread, but since I am in the area, I figured why not ask a local...
Backround... just got my indoor ant. setup & plugged it into my TV which has a hdtv converter built in... Well, I did the channel scan and it is not finding any stations... I used Ant.org to find out how I should point my ant. for which channels, now I am assuming that I point the rabbit ears in the direction that it states ?? Well, I have tried raising and lowering them, repositioning them etc and I get nothing when I rescan the channels... now i also have gone and manually went from channel to channel and got nothing as well... Is it hit or miss or will I see something on the screen if I am close to a signal ??? Also... the digital signals list the channels as 7.1 or 2.1 etc... Is this the actual channel I need to tune to on my TV ? Or is it just to diferentiate between analog and digital channels ???

Any help you might provide is appreciated. Thanks.

I am in Freehold have to tell you rabbit ears are not going to make it. Go to Sears or Best Buy and pick up the Zenith Silver Sensor I use it and am able to pick up the New York digitals except WNBC-DT, WPIX-DT and WNET-DT (theyre at very low power right now).

Also can pick up some of the Philly digitals as well.

Originally posted by wayner
Ok.. Newbie Central time... Sorry to stick this in this thread, but since I am in the area, I figured why not ask a local...
Backround... just got my indoor ant. setup & plugged it into my TV which has a hdtv converter built in... Well, I did the channel scan and it is not finding any stations... I used Ant.org to find out how I should point my ant. for which channels, now I am assuming that I point the rabbit ears in the direction that it states ?? Well, I have tried raising and lowering them, repositioning them etc and I get nothing when I rescan the channels... now i also have gone and manually went from channel to channel and got nothing as well... Is it hit or miss or will I see something on the screen if I am close to a signal ??? Also... the digital signals list the channels as 7.1 or 2.1 etc... Is this the actual channel I need to tune to on my TV ? Or is it just to diferentiate between analog and digital channels ???

Any help you might provide is appreciated. Thanks.

As the kind, gentle, helpful folks above have already stated the rabbit ears probably won't work.

Specifics:

1-Central NJ....where's dat? A more specific location will allow some of the charming people here to point you in the right direction :p

2-Type of TV---maybe someone here has the same one :D

3-As WWard stated the Silver Sensor will probably be your best bet if you're in need of using an indoor antenna. Maybe your lucky and you're in a house that already has an old antenna on it? Or you can run a LOOOONG length of RG 6 outside and pop it out a window and see what happens. STEVE2k....you out there?? :cool:

Originally posted by jaypb
As the kind, gentle, helpful folks above have already stated the rabbit ears probably won't work.

Specifics:

1-Central NJ....where's dat? A more specific location will allow some of the charming people here to point you in the right direction :p

2-Type of TV---maybe someone here has the same one :D

3-As WWard stated the Silver Sensor will probably be your best bet if you're in need of using an indoor antenna. Maybe your lucky and you're in a house that already has an old antenna on it? Or you can run a LOOOONG length of RG 6 outside and pop it out a window and see what happens. STEVE2k....you out there?? :cool:

:) :) Some of HD verterns can sound a little harsh no harm intended on my part wayner. We are just a little exuberant but very nice.

Sorry for the confusion... I am using an RCA Amplified Indoor Antenna with a Mitsubishi ws65713 off of Milltown Road in East Brunswick....

Should I take this back and get a Silver Sensor or should I try this one first ???

Originally posted by wayner
Sorry for the confusion... I am using an RCA Amplified Indoor Antenna with a Mitsubishi ws65713 off of Milltown Road in East Brunswick....

Should I take this back and get a Silver Sensor or should I try this one first ???

I would recommend it also look into purchasiung a pre-amp if possible. Try the Silver Sensor with out one first.

Originally posted by wayner
Sorry for the confusion... I am using an RCA Amplified Indoor Antenna with a Mitsubishi ws65713 off of Milltown Road in East Brunswick....

Should I take this back and get a Silver Sensor or should I try this one first ???

Out of curiousity how high "up" is your TV location? I know for my purposes, when I had my Silver Sensor in the basement with my Rear Projection TV the first time I hooked it up I got nothing. NADA! But when I hooked the Silver Sensor up on my 2nd HDTV and put it in the garage near the roof it pulled ina few stations from Philly.

So---that's something to think about.

Now---with that antenna can you get any analog stations (i.e 29 out of Philly? 17 out of Philly? 50 or 52 out of NJ (PBS)???

Not sure what the back of your TV looks like but do you have the coaxial cable "hooked" up into the correct input?? WWard has a TV (I think) with a builit in HD tuner....he'd be more familiar with that type of setup.

Does the back for the antenna say "for UHF" or Channels 13-69??? I assume it SHOULD pull something other than black screens and static in....but there are obviously LOTS of variables.

See if you can get digital 43 (43-1:5 or 52-1:5)...that's PBS digital out of Trenton.

The TV is on the 1st floor of a story house... I have it hooked up to the Ant - DTV coax line on the back of the TV... I am still a bit confused with the channel you mentioned... Should i be able to tune my TV to channel 43-1 ??? or is it just 43 ?

Originally posted by jaypb
Out of curiousity how high "up" is your TV location? I know for my purposes, when I had my Silver Sensor in the basement with my Rear Projection TV the first time I hooked it up I got nothing. NADA! But when I hooked the Silver Sensor up on my 2nd HDTV and put it in the garage near the roof it pulled ina few stations from Philly.

So---that's something to think about.

Now---with that antenna can you get any analog stations (i.e 29 out of Philly? 17 out of Philly? 50 or 52 out of NJ (PBS)???

Not sure what the back of your TV looks like but do you have the coaxial cable "hooked" up into the correct input?? WWard has a TV (I think) with a builit in HD tuner....he'd be more familiar with that type of setup.

Does the back for the antenna say "for UHF" or Channels 13-69??? I assume it SHOULD pull something other than black screens and static in....but there are obviously LOTS of variables.

See if you can get digital 43 (43-1:5 or 52-1:5)...that's PBS digital out of Trenton.

Good point on the back of mine there are among other things connections for OTA antenna and the sat connection. They can look remarkably alike if you dont look at them closely.

Originally posted by wayner
The TV is on the 1st floor of a story house... I have it hooked up to the Ant - DTV coax line on the back of the TV... I am still a bit confused with the channel you mentioned... Should i be able to tune my TV to channel 43-1 ??? or is it just 43 ?

It depends. Since I'm not familiar with your TV I'm not sure. What does the manual say? I've used OTA only tuners that you simply put in "56" and it will search for digital 56 (which is CBS)...and then remap you to channel 2-1....and then all you'd have to do from that point forward is enter "2"...but that is an ATSC only tuner (digital tuner). Confused yet? :p

Then again, my Directv box allows me to enter "56-1" and then it will remap to 2-1. Then I can always tune back to the station by going to 2-1 or 56-1.

It depends on your Mitsubishi's tuner instructions. Can you do a "scan" from within the menu on the TV for digital stations???

Originally posted by wward
Good point on the back of mine there are among other things connections for OTA antenna and the sat connection.htey can look remarkably alike if dont look at them closely.

Especially since it's usually so damn dark back there as well :rolleyes:

It's happened to me before. It happens to people I wind up HELPING as well. The RCA jacks are NOTORIOUS for stuff like that (Red/Yellow/White).

Been there done that......especially when on the phone with my parents :eek:

Okay.... I have some progress updates for those interested....

I went out and got a Silver Sensor, hooked it up and pointed it to 60 degrees towards NYC... Ran a scan of channels and boom, it picked up 50.1 50.2 50.3 50.4 which are PBS channels... and according to my location on Ant. Org those PBS 50 channels are at a 34degree angle from me, so I am assuming it is my angle direction that needs adjustment to the correct 60 Degrees for my NYC cbs nbc etc feeds...

I think I am understanding it a bit better, although i think i confused you all cuz I dont know the terminology yet.... heh but I think im getting it

Update II

I moved the SS from atop my TV to the floor next to it and I now picked up Fox and UPN.. I also have ABC... Is there anything that can be done to get NBC or CBS or any other stations or should I be happy with what I am getting ???

wayner,

move the antenna around to various spots on the floor or around the room and do a new scan in each location (keeping the antenna pointed in the same direction, though).

uhf signals are notorious for being spotty...and you've got to find the sweet spot! sometimes just a foot or two makes a difference. if there is anyway to put the antenna on top of a cabinet, as high in the room as possible, will usually give better results.

being on milltown road in e.brunswick, that gives a wide range of possibilities regarding your altitude. there are some low spots and that could be problematic. you might want to try checking www.topozone.com and looking to at a topographic map to determine your elevation (if you like reading maps :cool: ) Update: I took a quick look and elevation @Milltown&Ryders is 122' and slopes down to abou 100' over by Rte 18. Not a bad elevation.

Or you can run a LOOOONG length of RG 6 outside and pop it out a window and see what happens. STEVE2k....you out there??

yep, jaypb, i be here.....haven't been around in a while...too busy watching the strong signals from philly (10-1 in particular :D :D ) ouch! i know that hurts:D

anyway, wayner, what jaypb is referring-to is that some of us can actually get decent ota signals from nyc locals using nothing more than a 30' length of rg-6 coax. one end should have a standard f-connector into your receiver, then the other end needs about 10" of the centermost copper wire exposed. works great inside my family room as my alternate antenna for nyc. normally, i use a channelmaster 4228 in the attic with a channelmaster 7775 uhf pre-amp.

even with a silver sensor, you can improve your signal with a pre-amp.

good luck

Originally posted by wayner
Update II

I moved the SS from atop my TV to the floor next to it and I now picked up Fox and UPN.. I also have ABC... Is there anything that can be done to get NBC or CBS or any other stations or should I be happy with what I am getting ???

Now you're getting the hang of this OTA thing!

It's all trial and error. If you are getting Fox I'd gather that you *should* be able to get CBS as well. It BOOMS compared to ABC and Fox if I remember correctly. Fox and CBS are both on the ESB I believe.

WWard can help you with the specifics with that SS. Couldn't hurt to run over to Radio Shack on Rte 18 (in the mall or over by Toys R Us) and check out their amps/pre-amps.

Originally posted by SteveK2
wayner,

move the antenna around to various spots on the floor or around the room and do a new scan in each location (keeping the antenna pointed in the same direction, though).

uhf signals are notorious for being spotty...and you've got to find the sweet spot! sometimes just a foot or two makes a difference. if there is anyway to put the antenna on top of a cabinet, as high in the room as possible, will usually give better results.

being on milltown road in e.brunswick, that gives a wide range of possibilities regarding your altitude. there are some low spots and that could be problematic. you might want to try checking www.topozone.com and looking to at a topographic map to determine your elevation (if you like reading maps :cool: ) Update: I took a quick look and elevation @Milltown&Ryders is 122' and slopes down to abou 100' over by Rte 18. Not a bad elevation.

Sheesh....there's that $(*&(*&# elevation thing again! If it wasn't for the fact that I've come so far in a year, I would've said I'm not only vertically challenged but I'm also elevationally challenged :D

122'........damn. Not bad. Do I still hold the Central NJ thread record for crappy elevation? What was it.......18 feet or so? LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Originally posted by SteveK2
yep, jaypb, i be here.....haven't been around in a while...too busy watching the strong signals from philly (10-1 in particular :D :D ) ouch! i know that hurts:D

Ouch indeed. If I wasn't in therapy that would _REALLY_ hurt :rolleyes:

I mentioned a few days ago that I rotated BACK to Philly and picked up 10-1. It's not a myth anymore in Monroe. It's real. I think we can close that X-file now. :p

Originally posted by SteveK2
anyway, wayner, what jaypb is referring-to is that some of us can actually get decent ota signals from nyc locals using nothing more than a 30' length of rg-6 coax. one end should have a standard f-connector into your receiver, then the other end needs about 10" of the centermost copper wire exposed. works great inside my family room as my alternate antenna for nyc. normally, i use a channelmaster 4228 in the attic with a channelmaster 7775 uhf pre-amp.

even with a silver sensor, you can improve your signal with a pre-amp.

good luck

See what the man is saying...... he's catching all these cosmic rays off an antenna IN HIS ATTIC!!! And I've got to freeze my $*&()@) @$$ off on the roof on a Saturday morning swapping out a corroded twin lead on a pre-amp.....and the new pre-amp STILL doesn't want to lock onto a steady signal for NBC_DT. The man is sitting on the Holy Grail I tell ya, the Holy Grail.

;)

i used to feel guilty....now i'm beginning to think i should play the lottery:eek:

Originally posted by SteveK2
i used to feel guilty....now i'm beginning to think i should play the lottery:eek:

Whataya gonna do? Enjoy it while ya can. I'm working on raising my house up no stilts.......I think about 85 feet should do it.

:D

Originally posted by jaypb
Now you're getting the hang of this OTA thing!

It's all trial and error. If you are getting Fox I'd gather that you *should* be able to get CBS as well. It BOOMS compared to ABC and Fox if I remember correctly. Fox and CBS are both on the ESB I believe.

WWard can help you with the specifics with that SS. Couldn't hurt to run over to Radio Shack on Rte 18 (in the mall or over by Toys R Us) and check out their amps/pre-amps.

Its weird how the Silver Sensor can work pretty well close to floor level. It’s a testament to the wonders of a log periodic design. Having said that keep in mind that the Silver Sensor is a very directional antenna so placement is key try the antenna tilted upwards with the top facing back.

There is a better multipath rejection rate using that type of placement. I use mine in a combined configuration with a high gain variable pre-amp. pic enclosed.

two silver sensors on an A/B switch? what 2 different headings are you using (what ya aiming for)?

Wow.. lemme start by 1 thanking all of you for everything you have said to help me get this going.. I got all the "main" stations coming in quite clearly and should be all set.

I think once the weather gets nice I will look for a more perm. solution and mount something in the attic or on the roof. The fiance' will just have to get used to the "eye sore" as she described it...

Again, thank you all for all the sugestions and help... I'll still be lurking around reading posts, so I'll keep in touch...

Oh, one other problem did come up last night... I find it quite hard to go back and watch other stations that dont broadcast HD now... It truelly is a night / day difference... I'm quite giddy thinking about watching the superbowl tommorow... Once Tivo goes HD I think I am going to consider early retirement so I have more hours in the day to watch...

glad you're getting some good reception.

things are a bit more bountiful on the HD front that about a year ago. In Central NJ, you really had no choice but to hunt for Philly stations because 9/11 wiped out the NYC digitals. Fortunately, they're slowly coming back to pre-9/11 status. And now Directv is carrying HD broadcasts for customers who subscribe to a locals package and live in an area that's exclusive to Owned & Operated (O&O) stations.

So now, I have a choice of viewing the CBS HD feed from either NYC OTA, Philly OTA, or NYC Directv.

The fiance will get used to the 'eye sore'.....especially if she watches one of her favorite shows in HD glory.

Originally posted by jaypb
See what the man is saying...... he's catching all these cosmic rays off an antenna IN HIS ATTIC!!! And I've got to freeze my $*&()@) @$$ off on the roof on a Saturday morning swapping out a corroded twin lead on a pre-amp.....and the new pre-amp STILL doesn't want to lock onto a steady signal for NBC_DT. The man is sitting on the Holy Grail I tell ya, the Holy Grail.

;)

I dont know jaypb i think i can give steve a run for the holy grail status.

wayner read and learn, thanks to all the help and sometimes stupid questions of my own Im pulling in every philly channel (12 of them?)
and most of the NYC's although its been a while since ive swung the channelmaster towards NYC.

And no jaypb i still dont have a rotor or a preamp in fact for my situation i no longer believe a preamp is a necessary purchase. Now if only someone can tell me how to combat the interference that causes drop outs when planes fly over head late at night.

Originally posted by SteveK2
two silver sensors on an A/B switch? what 2 different headings are you using (what ya aiming for)?

I'm running the antennas through a combiner and then into the pre-amp. The net result is increased gain it's like a poor mans phased array setup. I can tweak the antennas in such a way that I can focus as much or as little of the desired signal onto the active elements of the antenna.

This setup is great when there is very little signal or a reflected signal to work with. The New York locals are not a big deal except the real low power ones that are not broadcasting from ESB (WNET-DT and WPIX-DT).

I primarily use this setup to get the Philly signals WCAU-DT and WPVI-DT due to their New York equivalents running on very low power.

Neat trick!

Originally posted by webboy10169
I dont know jaypb i think i can give steve a run for the holy grail status.

wayner read and learn, thanks to all the help and sometimes stupid questions of my own Im pulling in every philly channel (12 of them?)
and most of the NYC's although its been a while since ive swung the channelmaster towards NYC.

And no jaypb i still dont have a rotor or a preamp in fact for my situation i no longer believe a preamp is a necessary purchase. Now if only someone can tell me how to combat the interference that causes drop outs when planes fly over head late at night.

Glad to see the stars have come into alignment for you :D

If you are picking up everything from Philly there's really NO need to pick up NYC locals OTA. Especially with the odd HD broadcast here and there on UPN57. And stupid questions are the norm in hi tech forums like these. Who HASN'T asked an off the wall question. This statement, coming from a guy who thought that trees and leaves DIDN'T cause multipath....... :rolleyes:

On a quasi-off topic note, is your E86 acting odd lately? By that I mean.....scroll through the 600's....do most of them have NO guide info?

:confused:

Update...

As you may recall, I am using a RS 15-2160 in the attic to pull in NYC channels, except NBC-DT. I recently purchased the Winegard AP-4800 pre-amp as well. With my desire to pull in NBC, I decided to go after Philly stations. I purchased another RS 15-2160, went in the attic also, got a Radio Shack splitter/combiner to combine both antennas. Added the AP-4800 to the Philly feed to give it extra boost. At the TV, I am using a 10dB Recoton video amplifier to give it another final boost. Here are my results:

CBS DT (NYC and Philly)
NBC DT (Philly only)
ABC DT (NYC only, Philly is choppy)
FOX DT (Philly only, perhaps NYC issue today?)
UPN DT (Philly only, perhaps NYC issue today?)
WB DT (Philly only)
PBS DT (Trenton only, Newark used to work)

In the end, I'm getting all the channels. I'm just surprised that NYC FOX, UPN and Newark PBS which used to work, no longer do. My guess is that splitter/combiner is putting in too much losses?

I'm happy, but for completeness sake, if someone has an idea on how to further amplify my NYC antenna - can I use another AP-4800? If so, how do I combine using 1 run to the tv?

When you combine two antennas you're introducing all sorts of potential problems into your reception capability.

Here's a discussion on the subject with two 8-bay CM4228 UHF antennas used as the example: http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ANTENNAS/16bay.html

I did use slightly different lengths of cable before the combiner. Sounds like I need to make sure they're the same length. I guess it's worth a try to get 2-3ft pieces at Radio Shack and give it a whirl.

Originally posted by dswallow
When you combine two antennas you're introducing all sorts of potential problems into your reception capability.

Here's a discussion on the subject with two 8-bay CM4228 UHF antennas used as the example: http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ANTENNAS/16bay.html

That's what I'n trying to tell people, but they just don't want to listen. Thanks for putting up the link as proof! ;)

Originally posted by SteveK2
i used to feel guilty....now i'm beginning to think i should play the lottery:eek:


Could be just a Somerset, NJ thing. I get all NYC and Phil DT stations except WNBC, WPIX and PBS-Phil. That is with my antenna pointed towards Philly.

But, if I recall, you had WCAU from the begininning while I finally received it 2 weeks ago.

I recently moved to NJ from Boston.

I have Pio 50", MyHD, RS Double Bowtie, and Silver Sensor. I am on the 8th floor of a 40 floors apartment building. I checked out ant.org to find where I should point my antenna, I suppose I have serious multipath problem because I get Fox from totally different direction than what ant.org says.

I can only get Fox 5.1 and 5.2 There are other stations at the same direction, but I can't pickup any. When I do lock in to 5.1, I get about 80% signal. Beside finding another sweet spot, which I will keep trying, anything I can do? I am thinking of ordering CM 7777 (VHF/UHF) from Warren Electronics. Do you think it will help? Any good/bad comment about Warren Electronics?

Thanks!

P.S. My apartment packaged with DirectTV from Roselink. The Roselink install guy said the DirectTV equipment in the building is not HD equiped. Can Roselink stop me from getting comcast since they said they have exclusive rights but cannot provide what I want? VOOM would be super nice, but I honestly doubt the apartment will let me install a dish outside the building.

Might want to check for a Metro NYC or Northern NJ thread. Most (but not all) folks on this thread are farther west or south (as in "central NJ", like the thread title).

Good Luck with your reception....just don't cheer for no RedSox around here :D

Well, we got the superbowl in HD over DirectTV, so the antennas weren't necessary.

Thanks for the suggestions and knowledge, everybody.

Thanks SteveK2. Now I know there are other NJ threads.

My last post made mention that I had some luck combining two antenna's to one run to the tv set. I wasn't real happy with that setup anyway, so I think I finally have a solution I can live with. I went to Radio Shack and picked up a coax a/b switch. I ran both antenna leads to the switch, one output to the 28db pre-amp, etc. I took the switch and poked it out of the attic cutout in the closet. In position A i get NYC, in position B, I get Philly. It's not a perfect scenario, since it requires a manual intervention, but, until NBC-DT out of NY comes to full power, if I want to watch NBC out of Philly (WCAU-DT), I just run upstairs, flick the switch and enjoy NBC.

Finally!!!! A solution I can live with.

Originally posted by JGDiablo
My last post made mention that I had some luck combining two antenna's to one run to the tv set. I wasn't real happy with that setup anyway, so I think I finally have a solution I can live with. I went to Radio Shack and picked up a coax a/b switch. I ran both antenna leads to the switch, one output to the 28db pre-amp, etc. I took the switch and poked it out of the attic cutout in the closet. In position A i get NYC, in position B, I get Philly. It's not a perfect scenario, since it requires a manual intervention, but, until NBC-DT out of NY comes to full power, if I want to watch NBC out of Philly (WCAU-DT), I just run upstairs, flick the switch and enjoy NBC.

Finally!!!! A solution I can live with.

Well someone DID say necessity is the mother of invention......now you're living proof!

Congrats!

yubyub, jaypb-

Per my earlier posts I do live in Somerest County and have two antennas combines with a splitter and facing NYC and Phily. Works great and see no interference that I can tell. A scan picks up all the stations inclusing NBC, etc....I think it would work better than having to flip and A/B switch every time you channel surf.

I wish I didn't have to use an A/B switch. Living in Monmouth County, if i'm not mistaken a little further out then Somerset, combining both antenna's has proved to cause adverse output. Once I combine antenna's certain channels would get a no signal. Again, this is a temporary solution, until NBC-DT from NY gets to full power after the combiner project.

Aside note: When using the Philly antenna only, I still pickup WCBS-DT and it's not even pointed at NYC - just goes to show what a FULL power station on the Empire State Building can emit.

I am moving to Somerset, NJ soon.. Can anyone tell me what I can catch OTA.... Phily and NYC both obtainable?
Also, who is TV providers there? COmcast? going to comcast web site - nothing...

Just installed 4228 in attic with Zenith 420. +-35 miles from each station. All work well with the exception of NBC (4.1). The audio seems to be out of synch with the video. Like watching Godzilla movie. All other channels are fine. Any ideas on how to resolve or do I have to live with it until they broadcast a more powerful signal?

u got amp?
My pre-pro allows delays..
BTW, Anyone got Patriot Media HDTV yet?

No preamp, do you think that would eliminate this delay? What preamp do you suggest? Winegard AP8700 or Channelmaster 7775 or ??

I heard people like 7775... Wait for more replies, I am not the "expert here", just suggestion...

Have pre-amp. Still have lip sync issues with WNBC-DT.

Originally posted by m2262
Just installed 4228 in attic with Zenith 420. +-35 miles from each station. All work well with the exception of NBC (4.1). The audio seems to be out of synch with the video. Like watching Godzilla movie. All other channels are fine. Any ideas on how to resolve or do I have to live with it until they broadcast a more powerful signal?

How do you have the 420 setup for sound? Are you routing the sound directly to the TV, or through an A/V system. I had some issues with sound on the Zenith C34W23 when routing through an A/V system where I would get delays. If so, try sending the audio directly to the TV and see if it goes away. Good luck! :cool:

My humble for opinion (for what it's worth - probably not much) is this is a broadcast issue and not an equipment or setup issue. I form this belief because I don't have this problem with any other OTA station or any of the D* channels. By the way, sometimes it is so bad as to render NBC unwatchable.

Having a little trouble finding an answer in this forum. My search techniques might not be great, but oh well.

Anyway, moving shortly to Warren Township. The last exit off of 78 (heading west, or away from NYC)- near the Pingry school. Anyway, what are people's experiences in getting OTA. I'm going with D*, as I need my football pckgs and HATE anything Cablevision, so what are the odds I can pull NBC and ABC in over the air? Thanks.

I do have it setup through an A/V system. I will try directly hooking it up to the TV and report if it goes away. Thanks all, for your comments.

Originally posted by gold23
Having a little trouble finding an answer in this forum. My search techniques might not be great, but oh well.

Anyway, moving shortly to Warren Township. The last exit off of 78 (heading west, or away from NYC)- near the Pingry school. Anyway, what are people's experiences in getting OTA. I'm going with D*, as I need my football pckgs and HATE anything Cablevision, so what are the odds I can pull NBC and ABC in over the air? Thanks.

I think you will have much better luck in pointing your antenna towards Philly than towards NYC. I live in Somerset Cty and get better reception going that way..

Good luck .....

Originally posted by arthurvino
BTW, Anyone got Patriot Media HDTV yet?

Attention Central New Jersey Patriot Media cable customers:

Patriot Media is running a promotion on their HDTV PVR. It's free for the first two months, $9.95 monthly after that.

I was only interested in the basic HDTV service but they don't have any basic boxes available for another two months or so.

The PVR is a Motorola DCT6208.

I'm scheduled for installation on Monday, 2/17.

RayN

Nice... How is that motorola unit?

There is a manual posted on the Patriot Media website. The recording capacity is listed at 70 hours for SD programming and 10 hours for HD programming.

It appears to have component, DVI, S-Video and composite video outputs and SPDIF, optical and analog audio outputs. There are also Firewire and Ethernet connectors.

I'll study the manual over the weekend so I'll be prepared when the installer shows.

Ray

10 hours hD = 40 gigs hard drive? no Coax audio out?
I looked @ motorola site - looked good.. Cablevision is going with SA 8000 (at least this is what they r considering)...

Originally posted by m2262
I do have it setup through an A/V system. I will try directly hooking it up to the TV and report if it goes away. Thanks all, for your comments.

Lack of audio sync is, for some reason, a pretty common occurrence on NBC HDTV broadcasts. See it just about every night when watching Leno on NBC out of Philly. Definately NOT an equipment issue.

RayN- what a bullcrap way to make you take a recorder. Why aren't simple tuners available? The 6200 is all over the place. I have a Tivo unit paid for life. I don't feel like paying an extra $20 a month for two HDTV boxes when all I want is the tuner, not a recorder. Who is to say two months does not become 6 and you eat the recorder charge after the first two. I told them come out with a simple tuner of I will D*TV after the first two months. That is just bogus that there are no tuners.

BTW, I am scheduled for a 2/18 install.

Jeff

Originally posted by Jscopus
RayN- what a bullcrap way to make you take a recorder. Why aren't simple tuners available? The 6200 is all over the place. I have a Tivo unit paid for life. I don't feel like paying an extra $20 a month for two HDTV boxes when all I want is the tuner, not a recorder. Who is to say two months does not become 6 and you eat the recorder charge after the first two. I told them come out with a simple tuner of I will D*TV after the first two months. That is just bogus that there are no tuners.

BTW, I am scheduled for a 2/18 install.

Jeff

I didn't want the recorder either but I don't feel that taking the promotion is a big risk. I wanted to get HBO HD in time for the new Sopranos season. If things don't work out, I'll go back to E*.

Ray

I live in Franklin Township, Somerset, NJ. What HDTV channels are being offered by Patriot Media? What is the cost of the package? I've spoken to Pat Media customer service representatives who didn't have a clue.

Lman12

Originally posted by lman12
I live in Franklin Township, Somerset, NJ. What HDTV channels are being offered by Patriot Media? What is the cost of the package? I've spoken to Pat Media customer service representatives who didn't have a clue.

Lman12

Check out

http://www.patmedia.net/patriot/CTV_HDTV_promo.html

and

http://www.patmedia.net/patriot/CTV_Rates_Digital.html

Ray

Originally posted by lman12
I live in Franklin Township, Somerset, NJ. What HDTV channels are being offered by Patriot Media? What is the cost of the package? I've spoken to Pat Media customer service representatives who didn't have a clue.

Lman12

Pretty sad commentary on Patmedia when their customer service people don't know about such a new and exciting package/product.....especially since its advertised on their own website.

Glad I dumped RCN/Patriot in favor of Directv a couple of years ago.

Also, folks, if this gets into a RCN/Patriot/cable discussion, please start a thread on that topic. Note that this is an OTA thread.
:)

I live in Lawrenceville, NJ. Via Antennaweb.org I'm 31.1 miles from the Philly tower. I didn't want to throw a big antenna on the roof and couldn't fit a CM4228 into my attic, so I decided to try the new Winegard Squareshooter. I mated it to the Winegard AP-4700 pre-amp (which has 19dB gain) and I can get everything out of Philly but WTXF FOX-DT 29.1. Here's what I get:

KYW-DT 3.1 CBS Philly
WPVI-DT 6.1, 6-2, 6-3 ABC Philly
10-1 WCAU-DT NBC Philly
12-1 WHYY-DT PBS Wilmington
17-1 WPHL-DT WB Philly
WNJT-DT PBS 52.1, 52.2, 52.3, 52.4, 52.5 Trenton, NJ
WYBE-DT PBS 34.1 Philly
WPSG-DT UPN 57.1 Philly

Unfortunately I can't get WTXF-DT Fox Philly, but since there is no HDTV content on it and I get the SD station off of DirecTV I guess it doesn't matter that much. I would give signal strength info but I have a Samsung TS360 Receiver and the OTA signal meter is worthless as has been discussed at lenght in other threads. I was thinking of upgrading to either the CM7775 or Winegard AP-4800 which are both around 28dB gain pre-amps. Maybe that would be enough to pull in FOX 29 out of Philly. Maybe they will upgrade their transformer later in the year when they go to full use of HD or maybe I will get it off DirecTV when that deal is done. Does anybody know if WTXF-DT FOX 29 is an O&O Fox station? If not, DirecTV may not be able to provide it to folks with the Philly locals.

I've had the 6208 PVR for a week. For HD it is great. It has DVI out, component out (both 1080i) as well as optical audio.

As a PVR it is terrible. The recording functions are not really tied to the guide. The guide just makes it easy to set a "static" start and end time for recording. It has non of the Tivo or ReplayTV like features.

Fast forward and rewind don't always work properly with HD material. There is no display of where you are in the recoded material. No display of how delayed the current show you are watching is. No jump forward.

If there was any other choice for an HD PVR I would certainly not use the DCT6208! But us early adopters have got to take whats available.

Had my install scheduled for today with Pat Media HDTV. They said 2-5 likely late day. Got home 2:15, said they were by at 2:10. Does that stink or what? Next day I am available could be weeks. I think the whole tuner recorder thing is a scam. Why AREN'T there pure tuners with the market flooded? Especially as the PVR portion seems to suck? I am really ticked I missed the hookup. BTW, what are the thoughts as to how many signals you can pull off one trunk. We have a 4 split but need 6. Two are high def. Split at start to get the two HDTV than run a 4 for the rest? Or does it need a boost? Any thoughts/accessories suggested will be appreciated.

Jeff

No offense intended, but what does your question have to do with OTA in Central NJ?

Not a heck of a lot. Sorry. Was more of a petulant rant.

Jeff

When it comes to cable companies, rants are certainly understandable!

Originally posted by SteveK2
When it comes to cable companies, rants are certainly understandable!

How great is it that, for most of us, there's nothing left to rant about with regards to OTA coverage from either NYC or Philly?

:D

I just realized I've been on this forum for a few weeks more than a year. I dipped my toes into HD-ville last February. Now, me thinks I've FULLY covered myself in the HD-waters with an additional 2 HDTV's/STB's.

I say bring on the revolution! Or is that Tivo-lution!!!

Onward and upward!!!!

:p

Originally posted by jaypb

Onward and upward!!!!

:p

Don't tell me you're going back up on your roof to install yet ANOTHER antenna!? :D ;)

Originally posted by Calabs
Don't tell me you're going back up on your roof to install yet ANOTHER antenna!? :D ;)

Nope! No more antennas for me. 3 HDTV's and 2 OTA antennas and 2 D* dish's seem to be enough........for now.

And seeing how I DIDN'T win the (*&$(*&# mega millions lottery, I've got NO MORE fundage to F around with this HD thing.

;)

Originally posted by jaypb
Nope! No more antennas for me. ..... 2 OTA antennas and 2 D* dish's seem to be enough........for now.
;)

I heard a rumor they were going to move the NYC combiner to Monroe..................that wouldn't happen to be in your backyard, would it? ;) :D :eek:

Originally posted by Calabs
I heard a rumor they were going to move the NYC combiner to Monroe..................that wouldn't happen to be in your backyard, would it? ;) :D :eek:

With all of the times he's been on the roof and all of the contraptions he has put on there, I was thinking he was building his own combiner!

Originally posted by pabuwal
With all of the times he's been on the roof and all of the contraptions he has put on there, I was thinking he was building his own combiner!

No combiner construction going on.....but I DO have all occupants of the house wearing tin foil hats......seems to improve digital reception when watching HDTV.

:D

Seems that things must be going "good" in the land of Central NJ OTA reception in light of the deadness of this thread!!!!

Has anyone who was once able to get Digital Channel 8 (PBS out of New Bruswick) noticed that it's gone??? Or is just my setup?

I've been meaning to rotate back towards PHilly to see just how "booming" WCAU is.....and while I have given up UPN and an occasional lock on the WB.....I have gained more reliability on ABC and FOX.

I can't WAIT to check out the mast mounts/bolts on my antennas after the winds we've endured this winter.

Since I installed these things, everytime it gets windy I get worried.......whereas before I could care less!!!
:p

I assume you are talking about NY stations. In Princeton I seem to have lost some of the Philly stations, so am going to have to get on the roof and turn the antenna around - soon as the wind dies down.

Originally posted by jaz50y
I assume you are talking about NY stations. In Princeton I seem to have lost some of the Philly stations, so am going to have to get on the roof and turn the antenna around - soon as the wind dies down.

I had assumed from reading the Philly thread that things were going good in the "area" on the signals out of Philly.......so, in your case, I gather that's not true? :confused:

Right - somehow when ABC split up its signal I lost it, or at least most of the signal down to the 40's according to my Dish receiver. And I had NBC for awhile until it vanished again. Even CBS went from 90's to mid-80's. On the other hand, maybe my antenna has been knocked around a little altho it looks okay from the ground. Like I said I want to get up there and move it a bit, maybe try raising it a couple of feet as well. I also think Princeton is a difficult location anyway.

jaz50y...definately check your antenna alignment. No problems with Philly signals here (still booming on all signals). Things are so good that I eliminated my 'coax' antenna to catch NYC signals. So by taking the A/B switch out of the loop, my signal strengths are even a bit stronger.

Jaypb....yep, been a dead thread and I attributed to the same thing ---> good signals.

Originally posted by SteveK2
jaz50y...definately check your antenna alignment. No problems with Philly signals here (still booming on all signals). Things are so good that I eliminated my 'coax' antenna to catch NYC signals. So by taking the A/B switch out of the loop, my signal strengths are even a bit stronger.

Jaypb....yep, been a dead thread and I attributed to the same thing ---> good signals.

Steve--glad to see the "twilight zone" OTA strength you've enjoyed for awhile has spread to the rest of the general public :D

No more monopoly for you Somerset fellas........... :p

Jaz50y==check your connections as well. It's possible that you've got some water in your fittings......or if you're using a pre-amp check that as well (loose fittings can lead to decreased signal strengths----been there, done that).

I actually noticed that 7-1 out of NYC had their demo loop on---they have a few test signals that, if you have the time, would help to tinker with your 1080i (or really 720p) settings. I was only able to catch a few patterns....but didn't notice an overscan or grid pattern....which is what I'd like to test on my 1080i signal on my HD CRT.

Maybe tomorrow AM they'll do it again............

Originally posted by jaypb
Seems that things must be going "good" in the land of Central NJ OTA reception in light of the deadness of this thread!!!!

Has anyone who was once able to get Digital Channel 8 (PBS out of New Bruswick) noticed that it's gone??? Or is just my setup?

I've been meaning to rotate back towards PHilly to see just how "booming" WCAU is.....and while I have given up UPN and an occasional lock on the WB.....I have gained more reliability on ABC and FOX.

I can't WAIT to check out the mast mounts/bolts on my antennas after the winds we've endured this winter.

Since I installed these things, everytime it gets windy I get worried.......whereas before I could care less!!!
:p

Have not been able to pick up channel 8 at all. The other Philly channels have been ok for most part WCAU-DT has been really decent.

Originally posted by jaypb
I actually noticed that 7-1 out of NYC had their demo loop on---they have a few test signals that, if you have the time, would help to tinker with your 1080i (or really 720p) settings. I was only able to catch a few patterns....but didn't notice an overscan or grid pattern....which is what I'd like to test on my 1080i signal on my HD CRT.

Maybe tomorrow AM they'll do it again............

Did you ever get a chance to test out the patterns on HDNET?

Originally posted by Calabs
Did you ever get a chance to test out the patterns on HDNET?

Negative. I think it's Tuesday AM's.....not sure of any other days. I'll have to check their online schedule.

BTW---anyone else notice that the last few days 50-5 out of Montclair (the PBS HD channel/loop) has had audio but no video???

Not sure if it's my E86's or the signal itself.

:confused:

Originally posted by jaypb
Steve--glad to see the "twilight zone" OTA strength you've enjoyed for awhile has spread to the rest of the general public :D

No more monopoly for you Somerset fellas........... :p


Yeah, but can you guys get all NYC and Philly stations without having to move your antenna?!?

Originally posted by pabuwal
Yeah, but can you guys get all NYC and Philly stations without having to move your antenna?!?

Nope. But I do hear strange voices in my head when I get too close to either one of my antennas.

Does that count for anything?

:p

Anyone have any information if VOOM is successful in getting OTA Philly and/or NYC with their set-up...

Originally posted by flavorguy
Anyone have any information if VOOM is successful in getting OTA Philly and/or NYC with their set-up...

As with most OTA reception, that would depend on a lot of things, like your location wrt towers, etc. Anyone know what kind of antenna they're throwing in with the deal?

Yes and NO.

Where I am I get Philly OTA stations. They are picked up very well with the VOOM installed antenna.

However the VOOM receiver uses premapped stations by zip-code not station scanning. VOOM has northern Somerset Cty mapped to NYC making the whole setup useless.

BTW---anyone else notice that the last few days 50-5 out of Montclair (the PBS HD channel/loop) has had audio but no video???

jaypb....yep, noticed that last week...now, 50-5 and 52-5 broadcast the NJN HD loop even tho the PSIP info lists the national PBS-HD program information.

I really don't watch NJN very much. If the national PBS feed is on, I usually watch 12-1 WHYY-HD out of Philly. The carry 5.1 sound whereas NJN does not.

I haven't tried to get 8-1, but I do get 51-1 that shows the same program as 50-1 and 52-1. So maybe my Samsung TS-160 remaps it from 8-1?

BTW....end of Feb marked 1 year anniversary of my Samsung STB purchase and a couple of weeks before I received a replacement unit from Samsung under warranty. The unit I'd been using since June (also a warranty replacement) would not hold channel info. So, I could channel scan for signals, pickup X number of channels, then later that day I would do channel surf and channels would be missing! I could manually punch them in to view them, but the guide was missing their programming info.

Can't complain about Samsung customer service...and they're located in Secaucus, so UPS delivery is quick (overnight).

Originally posted by SteveK2
jaypb....yep, noticed that last week...now, 50-5 and 52-5 broadcast the NJN HD loop even tho the PSIP info lists the national PBS-HD program information.

I really don't watch NJN very much. If the national PBS feed is on, I usually watch 12-1 WHYY-HD out of Philly. The carry 5.1 sound whereas NJN does not.

I'm not much of an NJN-HD viewer either, but I just happened to notice it the other day.....and noticed the "music" that sounded like the HD loop! But, of course I couldn't verify it since I had no picture! I'm still facing NYC so I can't pick up 43-2 and never was really able to get 12-1 other than uber-tropo nights. Speaking of tropo, can't WAIT to see if anything "blows with the winds" when facing NYC now.

Originally posted by SteveK2
I haven't tried to get 8-1, but I do get 51-1 that shows the same program as 50-1 and 52-1. So maybe my Samsung TS-160 remaps it from 8-1?

I'm not sure which analog channel is NJN out of New Brunswick (I want to say it's 58 but I can't remember). I just know that I was able to get both a signal and a picture/audio on 8-1/2 a few months ago.....but now I have nary a signal.

Originally posted by SteveK2
BTW....end of Feb marked 1 year anniversary of my Samsung STB purchase and a couple of weeks before I received a replacement unit from Samsung under warranty. The unit I'd been using since June (also a warranty replacement) would not hold channel info. So, I could channel scan for signals, pickup X number of channels, then later that day I would do channel surf and channels would be missing! I could manually punch them in to view them, but the guide was missing their programming info.

Can't complain about Samsung customer service...and they're located in Secaucus, so UPS delivery is quick (overnight).

Was the issue with the channel surf a software flaw or just a "bad box"??? I've had numerous issues with my 3 E86's that I have now......but from reading the HW forum I'm able to assume that it's SW/D* related and not just my "set up".

I noticed that the Hughes HTL-HD box is ulta price reduced at both BB and CC. If I had 2 nickels to rub together I *might* pick one up. I'm quite sure I can command a decent price for one of my E86's on Ebay that would absorb the cost of picking up the newer Hughes. Only problem is, it doesn't really match the functions/features that the older E86 has as this newer Hughes is a "rebadged" LG HD box. :mad:

Problem with the STB was strictly a 'bad box'....or rather a box gone bad. It was fine for several months, then the channels would occasionally 'disappear'. I'd re-scan and all would be OK. But that all deteriorated to the point that channels would disappear minutes after being picked up in the scan.

Noticed that last night my E86 seemed to provide both audio AND video on the NJN PBS HD loop channel (Which now seems to show the NJ HD Video continuously.......thankfully it's a GREAT set of footage!)

Not sure "how" things changed from the previous times I tried to view the HD Sub=channel.

But it was working last night.

Does anyone know if Comcast will rent the HD box without having to buying the digital service?

Originally posted by jaypb
Seems that things must be going "good" in the land of Central NJ OTA reception in light of the deadness of this thread!!!!


I've been meaning to rotate back towards PHilly to see just how "booming" WCAU is.....and while I have given up UPN and an occasional lock on the WB.....I have gained more reliability on ABC and FOX.

:p

I know everyone else has stated that the antenna's have moved and are now at full power, but I have noticed **NO** difference in my OTA reception over the past 6 months. CBS comes is strong at an 80-85, PVI and CAU have shown no difference - between None - BAD on my HD200.

Just cant understand, how towers located at the same location, running at the same power have drastic differences in reception values.

Oh well, I guess its either back to the roof, or maybe swing it over to NYC

http://www.globalserve.net/~hepburnw/tropo.html

It's been a LONG time (Sept/Oct???) since I've attempted to pick up ANY distant tropo related signals......and now that I'm facing NYC with my antennas I wonder if the tropo will be as special this spring/summer.....???

Thoughts??

Originally posted by jaypb
http://www.globalserve.net/~hepburnw/tropo.html

It's been a LONG time (Sept/Oct???) since I've attempted to pick up ANY distant tropo related signals......and now that I'm facing NYC with my antennas I wonder if the tropo will be as special this spring/summer.....???

Thoughts??

I didn't realize you were that close to Mr. Tropo for you to use the familiar form of Italian (molto buono!).

Pointing toward the north, we may be able to pick up some CT. stations. Anyone know their frequencies up yonder? :p

Originally posted by Calabs
I didn't realize you were that close to Mr. Tropo for you to use the familiar form of Italian (molto buono!).

Pointing toward the north, we may be able to pick up some CT. stations. Anyone know their frequencies up yonder? :p

I'm sure that popping in a Connecticut zip on antennaweb.org would do the trick. Or using DSwallow's link to the 2150 site and increasing the "radius" would give some channels. I think I still have a folder FULL of papers from last year that have some Connecticut frequencies on them.

I'm pretty sure I posted in this same phenomenal thread that I picked up a PBS station or 2 last year on a tropo night when facing NYC. But, it only lasted for a few minutes. And I wasn't too "crazy" with the tropo when facing NYC (as I only rotated that way for $hit$ and giggles whereas I was ALWAYS facing Philly's direction the rest of the time---and the tropo from Maryland and Delaware BOOMED on some nights).

Senor Tropo is a fine fine fellow......and it looks like Sunday night will be a good night to "see" how he's doing!

Is Comcast scrambling non-premium HD channels in Central NJ? I tried asking them but their customer service reps. have no clue. They said they would have a techie call me back but I'm still waiting. Thanks.

Hi-

I'm in Raritan Township (just outside Flemington) and looking for any experience.

Got a Panny LCD RPTV for myselfr at Christmass in anticipation of my HD Tivo which is pre-ordered. I should be in the 2nd shipment so i am starting to do what i have to to get OTA.
I picked up a CM 4228 and Pre-amp but havent had a chance to fiddle yet - basically thought i would try for the analog uhf channels in from the same locations if i have time before the TIvo arrives.

Anyhow for a variety of reasons my Attic is where i plan to install unless its completely hopeless. So anyone have experience with a 4228 and preamp in an attic in my vacinity? I'm originally from the other side of the sate so I'm more a NY kind of guy so that would be my best bet. From reading the NYC thread it looks like that might by wishfull thinking? I wont die with Philly only- since i will get CBS on D* (and hopefully Fox eventually too) I will catch the only local content i can think of that i care for (Yankees when they get around to HD).

I searched for flemington and raritan but found nothing, sorry if i'm clueless and missed something obvious.

Mike

and while i'm at it, curious if anyone has tried to combine 2 antenna's to pick up both Philly and NYC at the same time so i dont need a Roto and the tivo can get whatever it needs.

Looks like i might be in a spot where it is possible since the directions are so far apart. I read in another thread that as long as you are pointing in 2 relatively opposite directions it might just work to combine 2?

thanks

I live just south of you in Hillsborough Township. Just installed the 4228 and 7775 pre-amp in the attic of my two story house. I am able to get all NY and Philly network stations of reasonable transmission power (no NY WB and no Philly Fox). WCAU (Philly NBC) and WPSG (Philly UPN) break up a little bit, but not too bad. Haven't fooled around too much with trying to get a better lock as I just put the antenna in yesterday. A rotator would be nice, but I expect I'll just point to NY once the combiner is up on the ESB.

so you get NY OR Philly- correct?

You arent getting both at the same time with just one antenna are you?


(at first I thought it impossible but then lately i read that the 4228 gets a decent amount from behind- So i think its possible to maybe aim a little askew towards NY and get Philly on the backend- but mostley thats a dream. )

Someone else let me know they can get philly just fine from Ringos (raritan township) with nothing but a silver sensor in the attic- no amp.

I disected the 4228 i got and fit it through the attic hatch and reassmbled it. I ran the coax and have a 7777 all set to go but still waiting on my HD Tivo to play around. I plan to try and get NY with the 4228 and the preamp. If that works (Its debatable- I have aluminum siding so i have to hope the angles work out the front of the attic)- I'll see if i can get Philly from behind too. If that doesnt work I plan to get a silver sensor and try to combine that for the philly side.

If NY is hopeless i'll just use the 4228 for philly (the back of the house definately aims the right way).

Of course maybe by the time my tivo shows up the combiner will be finihsed and i can just concentrate on NY- wishful thinking.

Just curious if anyone else noticed increased signal quality out of the NYC area/North facing directions last night?

Maybe it's just that I haven't had the time to futz around checking out signal strengths on EVERY available digital channel whilst facing NYC, but I did notice that I was able to pick up WLIW-DT out of LI (21-1/2) last night for the first time in a while........and I also noticed for the first time that 53-1 (WFUT-DT....SPanish??) and 31-1 (PAX-DT) are active on my setup.

The PBS station out of Montclair was stronger than usual as well. If it wasn't for the fact that there is now SO MUCH HD on (either by way of D* or OTA) I would STILL be obsessing trying to rotate my antenna to pick up EVERY digital station out there......like I was a year ago..... :p

And, just for old times sake, I thought I'd mention the fact that we FINALLY got the OK from the township.......they are going to take down the big maple that drove me CRAZY for the better part of early last year when I used to face Philly.....funny, but since I have turned the CM4228's towards NYC I never gave that damn tree another thought.......now if my neighbor across the street would JUST take down those damn scrub pines.....I may have to start obsessing about Philly's digital signals and turn back towards the 255 degree compass heading :D

:cool:

Right. Philly or NY. I have been able to occassionally get ABC 7 from NY on the "backside" while aiming at Philly, but that's about it. I also have trouble getting KYW 3 CBS out of Philly when I am aiming to get the highest signal strength for ABC, NBC, WB and UPN. Don't know why this is, but it doesn't bother me much because I get CBS HD off of the Dish. I can get higher peaks of signal strength from NY (high 80s on the strength meter), but Philly is just a tick less (low 80's). FYI, I am using Dishnetwork's new 811 HD receiver.

Originally posted by michaelk
so you get NY OR Philly- correct?

You arent getting both at the same time with just one antenna are you?


(at first I thought it impossible but then lately i read that the 4228 gets a decent amount from behind- So i think its possible to maybe aim a little askew towards NY and get Philly on the backend- but mostley thats a dream. )

Someone else let me know they can get philly just fine from Ringos (raritan township) with nothing but a silver sensor in the attic- no amp.

I disected the 4228 i got and fit it through the attic hatch and reassmbled it. I ran the coax and have a 7777 all set to go but still waiting on my HD Tivo to play around. I plan to try and get NY with the 4228 and the preamp. If that works (Its debatable- I have aluminum siding so i have to hope the angles work out the front of the attic)- I'll see if i can get Philly from behind too. If that doesnt work I plan to get a silver sensor and try to combine that for the philly side.

If NY is hopeless i'll just use the 4228 for philly (the back of the house definately aims the right way).

Of course maybe by the time my tivo shows up the combiner will be finihsed and i can just concentrate on NY- wishful thinking.

lately i read that the 4228 gets a decent amount from behind-

...where'd you read that??

The 4228 is *highly* directional with exceptional rear signal REJECTION. That's one of the reason's its specs are so good (regarding signal gain).

You said in an earlier post that you have aluminum siding. Any ability to receive signals from the 'backside' of your 4228 is almost certainly a reflected signal (i.e., multipath) and not a direct signal.

actually i never experienced it (still waiting on my HD Tivo and no other STB), but I seem to remember Doug Swallow posting either here or tivocommunity hd forum about the 4228 having a 'sizable rear lobe' or something like that. Doug seems ot know what he is talking about (I might have misunderstood what he meant actually- still learning myself).

I think he used a graphic form HDTVPRIMER.com to illustrate but i cant seem to find it again. When i looked at the picture it showed a big old lobe in front not much at all in the sides and the back but it wasnt 0 either. SO I figured if you happen to live directly between 2 sources it might work.

MonetNJ confirms it is possible in the above post- He gets NYC 7 when aimed at philly. So I suppose to a degree it is possible.

do you have differnet experience with a 4228 in somerset?

It's certainly not as big a rear lobe as some antennas, but it's there, and it provides me a very strong signal from WCBS when pointed almost in the opposite direction, toward Philadelphia.

http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ANTENNAS/cm4228az.gif

Last night I began replying here and got sidetracked, but I had, for fun, tried mapping the signal strength I show for WCBS-DT (being 30 miles south of the transmitter) as I rotated the antenna 360 degrees. It was almost a constant 80-92 except for 2 spots of ~10&deg;-15&deg; ranges. 92 is my peak signal strength when aimed at WCBS; 92 is what I get when aimed 230&deg; away towards Philadelphia. Strong, locked, signal.

The other interesting thing on the page at hdtvprimer.com (http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ANTENNAS/cm4228.html) is mention of a poor feed design, and they suggested replacing it with two baluns and using a splitter to connect them, suggesting as much as a 4db increase. I may try that this week as well.

Tonight I'm going to play with a Winegard SquareShooter antenna, hopefully mounted outside.

I knew doug had all the answers!

:)


Funny how you can get channel 2 when aimed at philly- i would guess they are close to 90 degrees apart from your house (well I guess Brick would be 90 degrees but you aren't that much farther). I would think you are in the blind spot but i guess they aren't situated from you so as to to be in the 10-15 degrees of dead spot?

What about channel 7 - since monetnj gets that on the backside and Hillsborough must be a little farther to the tower than Long Branch I would think you would pick that up also.

Oh and once you figure out how to fix the poor feed replacement- please post some pics or instructions or something! :D


Mike


Originally posted by dswallow
It's certainly not as big a rear lobe as some antennas, but it's there, and it provides me a very strong signal from WCBS when pointed almost in the opposite direction, toward Philadelphia.

http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ANTENNAS/cm4228az.gif

Last night I began replying here and got sidetracked, but I had, for fun, tried mapping the signal strength I show for WCBS-DT (being 30 miles south of the transmitter) as I rotated the antenna 360 degrees. It was almost a constant 80-92 except for 2 spots of ~10°-15° ranges. 92 is my peak signal strength when aimed at WCBS; 92 is what I get when aimed 230° away towards Philadelphia. Strong, locked, signal.

The other interesting thing on the page at hdtvprimer.com (http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ANTENNAS/cm4228.html) is mention of a poor feed design, and they suggested replacing it with two baluns and using a splitter to connect them, suggesting as much as a 4db increase. I may try that this week as well.

Tonight I'm going to play with a Winegard SquareShooter antenna, hopefully mounted outside.

Originally posted by michaelk
Funny how you can get channel 2 when aimed at philly- i would guess they are close to 90 degrees apart from your house (well I guess Brick would be 90 degrees but you aren't that much farther). I would think you are in the blind spot but i guess they aren't situated from you so as to to be in the 10-15 degrees of dead spot?

What about channel 7 - since monetnj gets that on the backside and Hillsborough must be a little farther to the tower than Long Branch I would think you would pick that up also.

Oh and once you figure out how to fix the poor feed replacement- please post some pics or instructions or something! Looking at my printout when I was making notes of signal levels I show the same signal level for WABC-DT facing NYW or facing Philadelphia; I didn't actually tune to WABC though -- I was running through all the channels just to compare signal levels first.

From the look of the CM4228 I'm going to have to drill out rivets to do the balun test, but it looks like I'll be able to reassemble things OK if it doesn't work out. Maybe tomorrow. I have to get another balun and a splitter.

Where did all this wacky wind come from? Rain I can deal with.......but the wind. Holy Moly! Or is it just in my neck of the woods?

Me thinks it's high time to get up on the roof and check all mounts and connections this weekend. :eek:

Originally posted by jaypb
Where did all this wacky wind come from? Rain I can deal with.......but the wind. Holy Moly! Or is it just in my neck of the woods?

Me thinks it's high time to get up on the roof and check all mounts and connections this weekend. :eek: Hey Jay, is WCBS-DT or WPIX-DT off the air for you? I was walking up the stares with a new antenna in hand and WPIX-DT blacked out on me, so I hooked up the new antenna to test anyway and still have 0 signal on either station. Just wondering if it's me or them. :) And you seem to be awake.

There's a very gentle wind here. Little bits of water falling too. Not quite sprinkling, more like dusting. :)

Originally posted by dswallow
Hey Jay, is WCBS-DT or WPIX-DT off the air for you? I was walking up the stares with a new antenna in hand and WPIX-DT blacked out on me, so I hooked up the new antenna to test anyway and still have 0 signal on either station. Just wondering if it's me or them. :) And you seem to be awake.

There's a very gentle wind here. Little bits of water falling too. Not quite sprinkling, more like dusting. :)

Yes---WCBS-DT is dead as a doornail. My E86's show "0" signal strength......while ABC-DT and FOX-DT are pegged at "100". I can't receive boo from PIX-DT.

As for the wind......it's gusting in a big way here. Very strange. Didn't see anything on the weather channels website about heavy winds or rains......just showers.

Damn springtime........ :p

Originally posted by dswallow
.....

From the look of the CM4228 I'm going to have to drill out rivets to do the balun test, but it looks like I'll be able to reassemble things OK if it doesn't work out. Maybe tomorrow. I have to get another balun and a splitter.


I had to pop some of the rivets to split the thing to fit it through my attic hatch.

A dremel tool with cutoff wheel is handy to go along with your drill. The rivets arent so tight as to stay put when you drill 'em and the ones i had to get even had washers so it was worse, so once you get like half way through with the drill they just start spinning madly. I couldnt get a pair of vise gips on the rivet to grab any way i tried so I drilled them as far as i could then sliced the flange that was left in a couple spots with the dremel and pushed them right out.

I, for one, am anxious to hear about experiences with the square shooter in central NJ. The 4228 gives me great signal locks, but it is crazy directional. From the specs, and what I have heard on other boards, the square shooter seems to be more forgiving.

Originally posted by dswallow
It's certainly not as big a rear lobe as some antennas, but it's there, and it provides me a very strong signal from WCBS when pointed almost in the opposite direction, toward Philadelphia.

http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ANTENNAS/cm4228az.gif

Last night I began replying here and got sidetracked, but I had, for fun, tried mapping the signal strength I show for WCBS-DT (being 30 miles south of the transmitter) as I rotated the antenna 360 degrees. It was almost a constant 80-92 except for 2 spots of ~10&deg;-15&deg; ranges. 92 is my peak signal strength when aimed at WCBS; 92 is what I get when aimed 230&deg; away towards Philadelphia. Strong, locked, signal.

The other interesting thing on the page at hdtvprimer.com (http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ANTENNAS/cm4228.html) is mention of a poor feed design, and they suggested replacing it with two baluns and using a splitter to connect them, suggesting as much as a 4db increase. I may try that this week as well.

Tonight I'm going to play with a Winegard SquareShooter antenna, hopefully mounted outside.

Is anyone having trouble receiving WHYY and WCAU lately. For over two years I've had no difficulty with these stations but over the last two weeks WHYY is gone almost all the time and WCAU's signal goes from quite high to unreceivable. None of the other stations have lost any signal strength. I receive all other Philly stations except FOX without any problems. Could my pre-amp be failing?

Similar to problem I posted a while back. I just reoriented my Channelmaster 4228, checked all the connections on it and the pre-amp, and greatly improved my signal for KYW - so I can now get CBS on the Dish, from Philly, and from NYC. I get nothing for WCAU (which used to be occassional) or WHYY. WPVI flickers around 50%, which means frequent breakups, not really watchable most of the time - used to be steady.

Also noticed that antennaweb no longer says I can receive them.

I suppose it may be a consequence of living in "tree city."

Next to KYW, WCAU has been one of my most consistent performers. WPVI and WPHL have occasional break-ups.

It's certainly not as big a rear lobe as some antennas, but it's there, and it provides me a very strong signal from WCBS when pointed almost in the opposite direction, toward Philadelphia.

Hot dang!.....never would've expected this from the 4228 (even in spite of the 'specs'). Strange, though, that while pointed at Philly, beazring 244 degrees at my location, I can pickup Lehigh Valley PBS @bearing 289 degrees, but a blip from any NYC stations.

Well....I stand corrected....thanks doug.

michaelk....you're right, doug usually has all the answers.

makes me want to go in the attic and 'experiment' with my 4228's alignment.....since its not on a rotor.

Just moved to Somerset, Somerset County, by Wawa on Route 27..
thinking of Voom.. 2 obsticles
1) My condo association probably wont allow any big antennas on the roof..
2) Will Voom OTA antenna pick up anything and which way will it face, NYC or Phily?
My questions are: Can antenna be mounted inside the attic and how bad is this gonna be? What antenna would be recommended to catch most NYC and Phily? Can Voom cooperate with all this? Or they just give out their own antennas?

the condo association can NOT legally stop you from putting up an antenna. (but they probably have rules like they can- so its up to you if you want to have a brawl with them- myself i made do with the attic.)

I'm in flemington and i'm still fiddling(just got HD tivo a few days ago...) but i would assume you would have similar results to me since your distances are about the same. It looks like i can get everything out of philadelphia just fine from my attic with a silver sensor and a channel master pre-amp. (this silver sensor is amazing- looks like it cost them all of 38 cents to stamp a couple peices of tin in china then put it on a cheesy plastic stand.)

From New york i can get CBS great with a channlemaster 4228 and preamp, fix is pretty good, abc is on the cusp and nothing for NBC or anyone else. The silver sensor with the preamp will get me CBS pretty good and fox on the edge but pretty much nothing else. I suspect that once they bother getting the combiner all set I should be able to get all of NY just fine with the SS or great with the 4228.

I think you are a little closer to NY and maybe a tiny bit farther to philly, so i would think you might have an easier time with NY and about the same from Philly (since they are all good signals- unlike the silliness coming out of NYC).

Not sure what voom gives out. If you needs to fiddle yourself, I would go to sears and get a silver sensor and try that first. That way you can return it if it doesnt work. The 4228 would be mine plan B- if i knew beforehand how close the perfromance was from the silver sensor was I never would have gotten the 4228.

Also relevant for the attic situation- the silver sensor comes in a box the size of a hard cover book, whereas the 4228 come in a box the size of a large folding card table. I had to drill out some of the rivits and take the 4228 apart to fit it through the attic hatch and then put it back together in the attic with nuts and bolts. No big deal but just some more hassle that wasnt really needed when you can get the silver sensor and probably get FULL Power stations perfectly fine.

Thanks, I have silver sensor already, Will get the amp and will throw it on the attic to see what happens.. Your HD box has separate inputs for 2 OTA signals?

On 2 inputs- nope the HD tivo only has one input, i've been trying all sorts of possibilities, one or the other antenna aimed at one or the other direction, etc. Also I figured i would give a whirl at combining them with a splitter before they get to the box, but that didnt go so well (apparently you can get good results on rare occasions) . NY digital channels except CBS didint have enough power when combined to get a lock (well except cbs but i can get that from D* already), and the NY analog 31 kills the Philly digital 31 (wilmington transmitting from philly). I might later try a jointenna combiner and try that. It might work once NY gets closer to real world power levels.

I'm pretty disappointed NY sucks so bad even reading everything here i was shocked how bad it really is. But I was pleasantly surprised how easy Philly is. I can aim the silver sensor pretty much anywhere in that general direction and get a decent signal.

Last bit of advice about the silver sensor- it was amazing to me how much height is a factor. Like I said I get good philly signals fairly easy but just picking the thing up over my head as opposed to chest height ads like 10 or maybe even 20 points on my signal meter. I took a couple of wood scraps and made a shelf at the peak to hold the little bugger and can get the major stations in the 90+ range.

Originally posted by jaz50y
Similar to problem I posted a while back. I just reoriented my Channelmaster 4228, checked all the connections on it and the pre-amp, and greatly improved my signal for KYW - so I can now get CBS on the Dish, from Philly, and from NYC. I get nothing for WCAU (which used to be occassional) or WHYY. WPVI flickers around 50%, which means frequent breakups, not really watchable most of the time - used to be steady.

Also noticed that antennaweb no longer says I can receive them.

I suppose it may be a consequence of living in "tree city."

I just put a CM4228 in the attic to replace my RatShack V/UHF antenna. With the amp connected I'm still only getting 73% on WPVI-DT (HD Tivo). Nothing much changed by replacing the antenna. Also WYBE-DT (35-1) has a 74% signal but no picture? Is it possible they are not broadcasting programming?

I'm only 8 miles from the Roxborough antenna farm with some trees in the direct path and a bit of a valley. I've always had problems with WPVI-DT not locking. Does anyone think the Square Shooter would be a better antenna than the CM4228?

This might sound counterintuititive, but try disconnecting your pre-amp. Join the coax from the antenna straight to the coax that runs down to your receiver. I recently lost the pre-amp on my CM 4228 because of a lightning strike. Out of curiosity, and necessity, I took my pre-amp out of the loop and then looked at signal strengths for OTA Philly stations on my Dish 811 receiver. I would say I lost about 5% to 7% of my signal strength for WPHL and WPSG, but not even that much for WCAU, and WPVI. I now hover around 73% for all those stations. As a bonus, the locks seems much steadier than when I was using a pre-amp. WPSG used to swing wildly from 72% to 82% with the pre-amp, but not it locks and doesn't seem to move more that 1% or 2% either way. More than enough to get a steady video stream. As a bonus, WTXF now comes in at a barely serviceable 62%-63%. Didn't used to get anything from them before. Now I get video with some drop-outs when the strength drops below 60% but not too often or that bad.

However, what really got my attention is that I now got a very strong signal from KYW (82% or so) when before I got 49% and no video. My guess is that the signal was being overamplified or I was having issues with multipath? Mind you, I am 40 miles from the antenna farm here in Hillsborough and my CM 4228 is in my attic. Of course, I am 103ft above sea-level, but being only 8 miles out yourself, maybe you are also seeing this over-amplification or multipath effect?

Originally posted by whsbuss
I just put a CM4228 in the attic to replace my RatShack V/UHF antenna. With the amp connected I'm still only getting 73% on WPVI-DT (HD Tivo). Nothing much changed by replacing the antenna. Also WYBE-DT (35-1) has a 74% signal but no picture? Is it possible they are not broadcasting programming?

I'm only 8 miles from the Roxborough antenna farm with some trees in the direct path and a bit of a valley. I've always had problems with WPVI-DT not locking. Does anyone think the Square Shooter would be a better antenna than the CM4228?

Anyone having problems with WPHL-DT 17-1, 2? I am getting good signal strength but have no audio or video. I noticed this last night around 11:30pm and the problem still exists this morning.

I am on the south side of Brick near the bay and my house is about 35'-40'
high.
I have a Mitsu 65 RPTV (built in digital hd tuner )
Voom STB (didn't bother having them set up the stealth )
I am looking at the Antennas direct # 91XG long range Yagi

What should I expect in reception( NYC or Philly or both ? )



any suggestions are welcome !

anybody having trouble with locals out of NYC lately? they seem to be very low strengthed these days for me. I'm in fords, about 23 miles from nyc, but get poor reception with a roof antenna and a channel master 7777 amp. what gives? i'm left with nothing else to try buy a rotator it seems...

Originally posted by tramahound
anybody having trouble with locals out of NYC lately? they seem to be very low strengthed these days for me. I'm in fords, about 23 miles from nyc, but get poor reception with a roof antenna and a channel master 7777 amp. what gives? i'm left with nothing else to try buy a rotator it seems...

I am south of you in Mounmouth county I have not had any problems with NYC locals.

Anyone notice the weird flicker during the hickey game on WPVI-DT? I have good signal strength. It was bad enough that there was no audio for the first 10 mins of the game.

great, i'm thinking my antenna is lined up poorly. anybody know how to re-adjust it? i didn't put it up myself so i have no clue. i noticed the other day that birds are using it as a pirch which really ticks me off!

Got my CM4228 today and put it in the attic. I was only able to get WNYW Fox, WOR and a couple of channel 21s. CBS HD kind of came in but I already had it on the dish.

I'm a little disappointed because I can stick some old rabbit ears out the window and get Fox, WOR, and ABC HD. Its the only way I've been able to watch the NHL.

I can't get the antenna much higher, so I don't know if I can do much better. I'm in Belmar by the way. Anyone along the shore have success getting OTA HD?

doug swallow is in long branch IIRC and i think he has figured out how to get most everything from NY with a 4228 or a sqaure shooter. He'll probably reply shortly...

But did you get a pre-amp for to go with the 4228? I think you need that. The other upside is with a preamp i think you might even be able to get philly from your house anyway and they seem to have their act together much more so than the NY stations.

thanks for the reply.

i do not have a pre-amp. i guess i'll have to look into that.

the cm4228 is uhf only and i think abc, nbc, fox etc. are listed as vhf. do i need to get an antenna that is vhf and uhf?

i'll look into the pre-amp first i guess.

Digital Frequency



WABC-TV ABC 45
WCBS-TV CBS 56
WNYW FOX 44
WFTY IND 23
WMBC-TV IND 18
WLNY IND 57
WRNN-TV IND 48
WTBY IND 27
WXTV Univision 40
WNBC NBC 28
WPXN-TV PAX 30
WFME-TV Educational 29
WNET PBS 61
WNYE-TV PBS 24
WLIW PBS 22
WEDW PBS 52
WPIX WB 12

I was playing around with my antenna that past couple of evenings and I picked up WMCN-DT 44 out of Atlantic City NJ. It’s an independent serving lower eastern Philly and southern NJ.

Originally posted by cst3e
thanks for the reply.

i do not have a pre-amp. i guess i'll have to look into that.

the cm4228 is uhf only and i think abc, nbc, fox etc. are listed as vhf. do i need to get an antenna that is vhf and uhf?

i'll look into the pre-amp first i guess.


they are all UHF- see johnfaas's post.

sounds like your confused a little- I know i do when i try to aim my antenna!

BAsically they kept the old channel numbers we all know to try and make it simplier to understand but i think it basically just confuses the crap out of me at some point or another unless you make a big chart with the old number and the new number when you try to aim your antenna- especially when you try to pick up from 2 or 3 markets and you arent used to anything's old number.

anyhow for example- WCBS on the 'old analog tv' was channel 2. But if you look on John's list the digital channel is really 56. So you need an antenna that gets 56- the 4228 does just that. BUT when you tune in on your box you generally need to punch in 2-1 and the box figures out to tune to channel 56 to get that. They can have multiple numbers after the dash for example the pbs's usuallly have 3to 5 numbers after the first number (like 13-1, 13-2, 13-3, etc) these are called subchannels.

well except wpix is channle 12 right now- but read through here some more- i think it is going to a higher number once the combiner gets done.

(and in any even the 4228 reportedly can get 12 fairly well also)

thanks for the feedback.

i ended getting a CM7777 to go with my 4228 in the attic and I get CBS, Fox, UPN and ABC. At one point I got PBSHD, which looked great, a couple of channels showing BBC news and Univision. I don't get any of these anymore, but I haven't seen NBC at all. I'd like to get it for the Olympics because I think its on NBC.

I may have to try and set up the antenna outside, but its going to be a pain.

Hello all. First post, though I have been going through the forums to educate my self.

I am in Watchung NJ 25 mile from NYC on a mountain ridge with a lot of trees. I am currently using a radio shack 2160 on a ten foot mast on the roof sent to a myhd 100 which I view on my crt computer screen. I am in the precess of mounting my sony 1271 to the ceiling after which I will focus and converge it.

After much fiddling I receive the following:

Pax d30 100%
Fox d44.1 100%
abc d 45.1 50-75 %
uni d 53 100%
cbs d 56 100%
nbc d28 nadda zilch nothing

Antenna org recommends a blue rated uhf antenna for nbc nyc. My radio shack is rated to red. I understand nbc is not at full power. I worry a preamp will over attenuating cbs, as it has a monster signal.

Now my questions:

Would a blue rated antenna pull in nbc?

If so, Do I need a square 4228, or a big 4248, or xg42 yagi?

Do I not waste my time and wait for the combined signal. Which sounds like a long wait.

Or is NBC NYC 28 unobtainable?

Thanks in advance.

Originally posted by newhdcrt
Hello all. First post, though I have been going through the forums to educate my self.

I am in Watchung NJ 25 mile from NYC on a mountain ridge with a lot of trees. I am currently using a radio shack 2160 on a ten foot mast on the roof sent to a myhd 100 which I view on my crt computer screen. I am in the precess of mounting my sony 1271 to the ceiling after which I will focus and converge it.

After much fiddling I receive the following:

Pax d30 100%
Fox d44.1 100%
abc d 45.1 50-75 %
uni d 53 100%
cbs d 56 100%
nbc d28 nadda zilch nothing

Antenna org recommends a blue rated uhf antenna for nbc nyc. My radio shack is rated to red. I understand nbc is not at full power. I worry a preamp will over attenuating cbs, as it has a monster signal.

Now my questions:

Would a blue rated antenna pull in nbc?

If so, Do I need a square 4228, or a big 4248, or xg42 yagi?

Do I not waste my time and wait for the combined signal. Which sounds like a long wait.

Or is NBC NYC 28 unobtainable?

Thanks in advance.

WNBC-DT is a real b**** to pickup I would try to pickup WCAU-DT out of Philly.

So what's doing in Central; Jersey HD wise this thread has been kinda quite lately.

Originally posted by wward
So what's doing in Central; Jersey HD wise this thread has been kinda quite lately.

This thread hath died a quiet death :p

Sadly, I haven't really checked for much tropo effects since the major digitals were re-born 7-8 months ago. I do wish WPIX would do something to get it's signal to more people. Even though I'm not a Mets fan, I'd take a gander at some HD baseball (uncompressed at that......ESPNHD still leaves me longing for the HDNET college baseball game I caught the day I upgraded to D* HD.......but that's for another thread :eek:

I notice that 31-1 is all mangled and didn't notice if 5-1 came back on today.

The HD channel on the NJN channels (51-5 or 52-5) seems to have.......disappeared ??? :mad:

Other than that, I can't complain :rolleyes:

Originally posted by jaypb
This thread hath died a quiet death :p

Sadly, I haven't really checked for much tropo effects since the major digitals were re-born 7-8 months ago. I do wish WPIX would do something to get it's signal to more people. Even though I'm not a Mets fan, I'd take a gander at some HD baseball (uncompressed at that......ESPNHD still leaves me longing for the HDNET college baseball game I caught the day I upgraded to D* HD.......but that's for another thread :eek:

I notice that 31-1 is all mangled and didn't notice if 5-1 came back on today.

The HD channel on the NJN channels (51-5 or 52-5) seems to have.......disappeared ??? :mad:

Other than that, I can't complain :rolleyes: I can’t get a lock on 31-1. The NJN HD channel looks ok to me (52-5) the demo loop is gone if that’s what your talking about, they are running NJN programming on that channel in HD.

5-1 did come back this afternoon but I don’t know if this is permanent as 1) I was told by engineering the signal will not be available for a week (could be up & down) and 2) They appear to be trying out a 4x3 stretch mode on 5-1 and 5-2 has video but a test tone playing and I noticed that the signal drops in and out.

So the signal being up could be temporary?? Are you still having WCAU-DT issues? It’s been excellent for me, which is great considering the WNBC-DT is broadcasting their DT signal at low power.

Originally posted by wward
I can’t get a lock on 31-1. The NJN HD channel looks ok to me (52-5) the demo loop is gone if that’s what your talking about, they are running NJN programming on that channel in HD.

AFA NJN......hmmm. It seems that whenever (after 8pm that is) I tune to 52-5 or 51-5....I see a black screen....yet there is other programming on subchannels 1-4. Is my timing just bad?

Originally posted by wward
5-1 did come back this afternoon but I don’t know if this is permanent as 1) I was told by engineering the signal will not be available for a week (could be up & down) and 2) They appear to be trying out a 4x3 stretch mode on 5-1 and 5-2 has video but a test tone playing and I noticed that the signal drops in and out.

Actually, last night I tooled by 5-1 and 5-2....and they were both up. 5-1 was still being stretched. 5-2 even looked less pixelated/crappy. For what it's worth.........

Originally posted by wward
So the signal being up could be temporary?? Are you still having WCAU-DT issues? It’s been excellent for me, which is great considering the WNBC-DT is broadcasting their DT signal at low power.

Honestly, I've been too darn lazy/apathetic to rotate my main antenna back towards Philly only because the NYC locals have been solid since the end of last year. If WNBC_DT was giving me a problem I'd surely migrate back towards Philly....as you seem to have done. The only thing (I think) Philly could offer me that NYC couldn't would be the 57-1(UPN) station. 17-1 was never a *solid* lock for me at that time and neither was 29-1.

Originally posted by jaypb
AFA NJN......hmmm. It seems that whenever (after 8pm that is) I tune to 52-5 or 51-5....I see a black screen....yet there is other programming on subchannels 1-4. Is my timing just bad?
Maybe but I doubt it is bad timing, I was watching 52-5 last night around 10pm it was up and looked great. I noticed a problem a while back with my DTC 100 where that sometimes when NJN went HD at 8pm the HD channel would not show up (Black screen but good signal level). If I did a re-scan all worked well give that try and see if it works.

Honestly, I've been too darn lazy/apathetic to rotate my main antenna back towards Philly only because the NYC locals have been solid since the end of last year. If WNBC_DT was giving me a problem I'd surely migrate back towards Philly....as you seem to have done. The only thing (I think) Philly could offer me that NYC couldn't would be the 57-1(UPN) station. 17-1 was never a *solid* lock for me at that time and neither was 29-1. [/QUOTE] If I fiddled with the antennas I can pick up WPSG-DT 57-1. 17-1 comes in perfect for me I noticed that the have two sub-channels both showing the same programming.

Just curious if anyone else has some time this AM:

Can you get a "digital signal" on 35 and 39......but no picture? I'm getting really high readings......but no picture. Same thing with NBC-DT (28). Decent signal strength......but no picture. Had the same thing last night.

I noticed that i'm picking up WLIW DT (22) at an almost solid 100 clip on my E86......so not sure if Tropo effects are showing themselves. Also able to pick up a SLEW of analog UHF stations this AM. Channel 8 out of what I assume is Connecticut is one of them. Also picked up a new digital spanish Station (23-1) that I never saw before.

But my main concern was NBC-DT. Iwasn't able to get it last night....but I had a decent signal. Was it just me?

Originally posted by jaypb
Just curious if anyone else has some time this AM:

Can you get a "digital signal" on 35 and 39......but no picture? I'm getting really high readings......but no picture. Same thing with NBC-DT (28). Decent signal strength......but no picture. Had the same thing last night.

I noticed that i'm picking up WLIW DT (22) at an almost solid 100 clip on my E86......so not sure if Tropo effects are showing themselves. Also able to pick up a SLEW of analog UHF stations this AM. Channel 8 out of what I assume is Connecticut is one of them. Also picked up a new digital spanish Station (23-1) that I never saw before.

But my main concern was NBC-DT. Iwasn't able to get it last night....but I had a decent signal. Was it just me? Pretty sure it was Tropo I picked a few Connecticut channel 8 being one of them and 32-1 an NBC affiliate out of New haven. I also picked up an analog from Maryland.

21-1 WLIW-DT came in great as well saw on one of their digital channels that there was a station called WLIW Create. It was showing cooking and how to shows.

Anybody know what happend to NJN-HD? Is't been a few weeks since the last time I've seen anything.