Hi all,
I would like to make a connection between my NEC MT1045 which has HD-15 input (which can be used as HD-component video input) and my progressive DVD player which has component video output

So at the HD-15 end, I'll connect the CAT5 as MrWigggles' description. But at the component end (3 rca plugs), how can I connect to have sync_on_green? Which sync should I use ? H or V ?

In other word, which pin # on HD-15 should be connected to prong and sleeve of three R, B, G component end?

Thank you
Thuan

Thanks for the feedback, love to see your summary Mr. Wigggles.

I think there is a real market here for a proven cable and adapters, wish I could order them today.

I called the company mentioned and they do not have a prebuilt RJ45 to HD15 adapter, but could custom build one, I'm checking on the price. Of course it may not work due to shielding issues. I'd like to find a proven solution.

The pictured black box product solution is very expensive, over $700 US, for sender and receiver.

I'm really just looking for a low cost way to pass a cable with a XGA signal down one level and drill the smallest opening possible. I do not want to cut an opening for a HD15 head.

I love to be able to buy a proven prebuilt cable with small form factor connector like RJ45 and attach them to a proven HD15 adapter.

Does it exist?


***
Another possibilty just came to mind. To use HD15/BNC breakout cables and link them together with couplers. That way a hole would only have to fit the size of the BNC connector, and pass them through one at a time.
***

It is just some balunds that are needed? From what I know about balunds (which is not much) they are not that complex to make. Why are these Component or RGB twisted pair balund systems so expensive?

OK, alright already :)

Next week I'll post the new AMP connector assembly part # and photos we've developed. All you'll need to terminate a shielded CAT5E cable to the connector is a knife to strip off the outer jacket, your fingers to push it together and a pair of cutters to trim the excess. Thats it! Perfect HD-15 connections...its even color coded. The performance is very good; better at 40' than our reference RGBHV/5-core quad-shielded cable (won't mention the brand but it costs over $400). At 40' 1600x1200@75 is darn near perfect...its extremely difficult to see the difference from a standard 6' VGA cable even from a few inches from the screen.

I won't get into any arguements here with EEs on cable/hardware impedance/mismatches. Suffice it to say the charactaristic 100 ohm twisted pair impedance of short haul CAT5 when unbalanced at the connectors [properly] yields an impedance approximately between 71 and 74 ohms which is well within the tolerance limits of 75 ohm source/load hardware.

BTW, I don't recommend using RJ45 [shielded] connectors in the loop. For best performance the link should have as few transitions as possible. I prefer the Cat5/VGA connector being inserted directly into the projector input and at the source with a simple gender changer (point-to-point). The cable exits the Cat5/VGA connector at a right angle which means you only need a little over 1" total clearance (including changer) from the PJ to something like a hush box wall.

More to come...

Thumper

Found a pdf regarding baluns.

Could anyone comment on the VGA2 and the bandwidth, claims standard cat 5 is all that is needed.

http://www.intelix.com/library/data_sheets/balun_ds.pdf

Here's the support for the VGA2, even has the wiring, and suggests using STP..

http://www.intelix.com/library/manuals/vgaBalunManual.pdf

Another, looks good for XGA to 250ft, notes if PC and monitor are grounded only UTP is needed...

http://www.almexltd.com/nhc/500010.pdf

$120 CND

JackLT,

These work very well for medium and long haul apps. I've installed the Intelix along with a few other makes and they all work reasonably well (great for getting the signal around a convention center). But for short haul apps [typical HT] why would one want to soften the signal by reducing bandwidth with such a product?

And spend the extra $$?

And have to find a place to plug in the wall warts?

Thumper

Thanks Thumper, I look forward trying the AMP connector.

As far as the basic unpowered baluns (1 PC to 1 Monitor) are concerned, are they simply passing the raw signal over the cat 5 without any additional components besides the connectors?

If that's the case then for short runs if shielded cat5 and connectors are used wouldn't the picture be fine at XGA resolution?

I found them as low as $76US.


Here's a very good information link for anyone thinking of a balun:
http://www.muxlab.com/assets/files/application_guides/VE_VGA_Balun.pdf

Also, if you need shielded cat5 it gives the Blackbox part numbers.

Hi all,
I'm still wait for response. I have whole weekend to build one. Please help
on my post at begin of this page.
Thanks
Thuan

Thuan,

I have a Dish 6000 with 3 connector component out. I use a standard HD15/5 BNC breakout cable with rca/bnc adapters.

I connect 3 of the breakout lines, the R G B leads to the 6000's component then HD15 to the Nec 150LT.

You can add to the lenght at either side via component cables or HD15.

That may not directly answer your question but it seems all you have to connect is the R G B and return lines into the projectors RGB/return lines and the NEC projector handles the rest.

jack

Originally posted by Thumper
OK, alright already :)

Next week I'll post the new AMP connector assembly part # and photos we've developed. All you'll need to terminate a shielded CAT5E cable to the connector is a knife to strip off the outer jacket, your fingers to push it together and a pair of cutters to trim the excess. Thats it! Perfect HD-15 connections...its even color coded. The performance is very good; better at 40' than our reference RGBHV/5-core quad-shielded cable (won't mention the brand but it costs over $400). At 40' 1600x1200@75 is darn near perfect...its extremely difficult to see the difference from a standard 6' VGA cable even from a few inches from the screen.


More to come...

Thumper

Thumper,

I need to run Component not RBGHV. What do you recommend to do this? The amp connectors with break out cables? For this use would you still recommend shielded cat5 for this or is standard cat5e ok for component? I want to run ~80 - 100 feet from a Audio Authority Universal Distribution Amp model 985U. It would be much easier to run some 1 or 2 cat5 runs, I was thinking I would need to run at least 4 RG/6 or rg59 runs, (3 for component and one for SPDIF). Since I would need only 3 pair for video could I use the 4th pair for running the SPDIF, off of the break out cable?

Thoughts?

For those who are interested about running component on UTP cat5e.

I went to radio shack and bought some female RCA connectors. Attached them to an ~80ft coil of cat5e UTP. Picture looked just as good as it did through my 30ft rg6 runs. When I added the spdif on the 4th pair and that introduced noise on the picture. This was tested with a Hughes e86 and a JVC DVD player, attached to a 10ht projector.

Conclusion: You can run component video over cat5e, and the picture looks good. I ran 1080i and 480p with out problems. You can run spdif for the same distance but it causes noise on the picture if run over the same cable, so you will need to run a separate run of cat5e for the spdif. I would like to test the same configuration with Leviton RCA-110 connectors but I can't find them anywhere. If anyone knows where to find them please let me know.

Regards,

Brian

Does it make a difference whether the Cat 5 cable is stranded or solid core?

Thumper, you're killing me, when will we get the AMP part# and pics, and how shortly after your announcement will the product be actually available.

Anybody with a good place to order AMP connectors, Newark? or somewhere else?

I am looking to setup my projector in the next few weeks and the projector cabling is the next item on my todo list.

All the best,
Ricardo

I plan on making a 5bnc to 5bnc cat5e cable for my switcher to my projector. Which cable do i need to ground if it is needed at all.

I just went through the same thing...

Found that soldering the HD15 was too difficult, so thought of the BNC to BNC, you need 10 wires, cat5e has 8 and shielded has 9. You could just splice the grounds as needed.

I found a RBG cable with a small HD15 head and just drilled a hole. Perfect picture, no soldering. I used the Cat5 to run audio.

I'll try the new AMP connector for another run, when it arrives.

Back at the beginning of this thread was a brief discussion of the high cost of matrix switchers. Matrix switches allow the user to send one or more RGB (15 pin) input sources to one or more RGB (15 Pin) monitors. Since this threads inception, the cost of those switches has come down. If you want to have one display device switch 4 input sources Milestek.com has a KVM switch for $155.99. If you want to switch eight sources to 2 monitors its $778.96, and eight sources to 4 monitors is $986.96. Also Cat5 extenders are $229.

So these type switches may fit into your needs, especially if you want to send an HDTV boxes signal to several areas of your house, over shielded Cat5.

hermann

Last night I soldered my first HD15 connector. The first one I made was alright, learned a lot, then just snipped it off because I knew the second time around I would be a pro. I can see why that new AMP connector that Thumper was talking about will be a total lifesaver and really eliminate anybody's need to do this tedious soldering and stripping of tiny wires.

Little tips to help out with soldering a HD15:

* picked up Dsub 15 pin male connectors & hoods at radio shack
* bought "Helping Hands" vise from Radio Shack to help hold connector and wire, while my two hands held solder gun and solder
* used 0.032" solder from Radio Shack and
* I actually ordered Shielded Cat5 patch cords with ethernet connectors on the ends to the length I needed, this turned out to be cheaper than buying 100ft or 500ft of shielded Cat5 cable. I just cut off the shielded Cat5 jacks on the end and ended up with the 50ft of cable I needed.
* I had a small soldering iron from Radio Shack but I bought a new tip for it that had a sharp point. Get the smallest tip soldering gun you can at Radio shack if you don't have one, it's only $5-$10

1) start your soldering with the grounds in the middle tall row of pins
2) I twisted all the grounds together, soldered the twist, then I soldered the tips of the twisted grounds into their appropriate pin locations. This seemed to be easier than trying to jumper the pins together with a separate wire after all the grounds are in place.

I haven't had a chance to check up on my work yet, I'm still waiting on my HD stb, but will probably try my dreamcast VGA adapter with it.

Thanks to everyone on this thread for sharing all the info.

All the best,
Ricardo

It is quite often a misconception that you need the smallest tip possible to solder intricate parts. This is not the case. I use a medium size tip to solder with.

You always need good heat transfer in the soldering process that is the real key to good and quick solder joints.

I simply wanted to add that tidbit.

-Mr. Wigggles

Would these adapter combos work?

RJ45 to DB9-F (http://www.pccables.com/cgi-bin/orders6.cgi?action=Showitem&partno=01910) and DB9-M to HDDB15-F (http://www.pccables.com/cgi-bin/orders6.cgi?action=Showitem&partno=00350) and HDDB15-M to HDDB15-M (http://www.pccables.com/cgi-bin/orders6.cgi?action=Showitem&partno=00331)

or

RJ45 to DB9-M (http://www.pccables.com/cgi-bin/orders6.cgi?action=Showitem&partno=01911) and DB9-F to HDDB15-M (http://www.pccables.com/cgi-bin/orders6.cgi?action=Showitem&partno=00351)

If so, is one better than the other?

Could the ground wires in the RJ45 adapter simply be stripped and twisted together?

Eric,

Simebody used those with very little success.

-Mr. Wigggles

Erik,

I know I described soldering the HD15 connector as tedious but it was not that bad and when complete you do get a sense of satisfaction having done it all yourself. It is also best to keep the number of connectors down to a minimum.

I think around $20 at radioshack will get you everything you need to try and solder some cables yourself. Just remember that you heat up the wire/pin joint and let the solder melt on the wire-pin joint and NOT on the soldering gun tip that is heating everything up. It does take a few moments for the joint to heat up and once it does, the solder just flows and with that you are done.

The Dsub 15 pin male connectors at Radio Shack have "hollow pins" to solder to, so that the CAT5 wires fit perfectly inside this mini tube, which makes things very easy.

The hardest part for me was getting the wires stripped, and getting all the wires to the correct length. I had stranded cable which I had to twist once I had the insulation stripped. Then I would clip the exposed wire to the correct length.

I really wish a good write up existed like the one on how to make your own Canare RG6 cables for audio/video/antenna. I will try and take some pictures with the next one I do, get approval from Mr. Wiggles to make sure my technique is right and then post it. But that won't be for another few weeks. Hopefully the AMP connector will be available by then but even after that I know some folks may still want to solder their own for whatever reason.

All the best,
Ricardo

I've provided the information for the new connectors here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=168118

Enjoy :p

Thumper

Hopefully Mr. Wigggles can condense the threads on this subject??

Originally posted by Thumper

Hopefully Mr. Wigggles can condense the threads on this subject??

I was saving that for you :p

-Mr. Wigggles

How about with standard RCA component video connectors on the ends? It would be really cool if I could run cat5 cables to a shielded cat5 jack near my projector, with a short cable to reach the projector. (I have a table-top setup where the projector is frequently removed..) On the other end, it would be nice to have another rj45 jack that I could plug in either a HDTV tuner or my DVD player component output. No need for an expensive component video switcher!


Originally posted by MrWigggles
Man E,

It should work really well with component. I have to disagree with Thumper about the use of any coaxial connectors on one side or even both sides. I think it would work fine. Just make sure you solder the cat 5 shield wire to one of the three coaxial grounds on the coaxial end (preferably the Y channel). I haven't done it but I think it would work just fine.

-Mr. Wigggles

------------------
The Mothership is now boarding.

MrWizard,

That is exactly what I'm doing. Sort of the old telephone operator style of video switching.

Keep your cable lengths reasonable and this should work fine.

-Mr. Wigggles

Question,

I have been trying to make a breakout cable from STP Cat 5 cable. I am trying to go from Component out on my DVD to VGA in on my projector. I have a Sharp M20X projector which actually has DVI input but came with a DVI to VGA cable.

I have read the Cat 5 success thread numerous times. I have seen the comments that it can't be done with a DVI input and I have seen the comments about Component not working over Cat 5. It appeared that Robert_S had some success with Component signals and you can but DVI to VGA cables and VGA to Component cables so I don't really see a reason why you cannot make a Component to VGA cable.

You may ask why I am not making a DVI to Component cable. Well the projector comes with a DVI to VGA cable and finding a DVI plug that I can solder onto seems to be nearly impossible. I am only looking for about 22' feet here, but for the price people want for the breakout cable or DVI to Component is insane.

Anyway, I am looking for help making a Component to VGA cable and I'm hoping someone out there can help me solve my problem. I have done the soldering (see below) and get a good picture (better than my S-video) but, the picture appears to only have the green component because the picture only has different shades of green. The blacks are much deeper and the picture seems to have better contrast with what I have now with the green only. This may just be the fact that Green and Blue are missing but I may be really close to getting an even better picture that I am now used to.

This is my setup for soldering.

VGA pins
1 Red
2 Green
3 Blue

6 Red ground
7 Green ground
8 Blue ground

I've only got three wires left (one twisted pair and the shielding wire)

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Richard

You need a transcoder, like the one from Audio Authority to convert Component to VGA.

Prior posts mentioned using Cat5 for Component, but that's to go component-to-component.. You are missing some signals on the VGA interface, which can only be generated by a transcoder...

mrwizard,

thanks for the input. I actually talked to Sharp today. Aparently the DVI input has three modes. DVI in, RGB Component in and RBG Analog in. I just need to switch to the proper mode on the projector. I'll try that tonight and see what happens.

Rich

Oh, I see.. You are using a VGA connector, but it is carrying Component signals.... (through the VGA-to-DVI adapter into the DVI connector on your projector, right?)

That should work without a transcoder... Be sure to connect the cable shield to one of the grounds, though. This will reduce the impedence mis-match of the cat5 cable..

Good luck!

Whew! I can't believe I read the whole thing!

I believe that my projector (TW100) also uses a connector to perform triple duty. And it is this very port that I hope to somehow connect one of three devices to. Using STP Cat5e of course. If I could only solder.

pwsharpe

I've just made a HD15--->DB9 25' cable for my HTPC/CRT connection based on this thread and it looks the same as a $200 6' MC VGA break out cable. I'm returning the MC. Thanks to Mr. Wiggles and Thumper.

Just a bump for an interesting thread.

Hello

I just built my first "cheap" VGA cable using the Stonewall STP Cat5E and radio shack DB15s. It is 25ft in length. Perfect at 1024x768 at 75Hz. A little ghosting at 1600x1200 at 85Hz. We're talking very high frequencies here. Not bad! I highly recommend the Stonewall STP to all.

Steve H

I just made a cable using cat5e UTP just for testing and it worked better than I expected. :) I expected multiple ghosting all over the place but there's only one ghost 5 pixels to the right at 1024x768 60Hz. At 800x600 60Hz it's very faint, although that could also be a result of the scaling in the projector.

It is 10m long and I combined all the ground wires in both ends. The reason I tried UTP is I can't find STP anywhere in Norway but I will have to now. This is fun! :) EDIT: Found a dealer, ordered 10m!

Here's a picture of the ghosting, I raised the gamma to 3,1 to make the ghost visible. Sorry about the convergence error, I'm getting a replacement projector tomorrow (again): :D
http://home.c2i.net/ahustvedt/images/ghost01.jpg




Tor Arne

I decided to try making a cable for my friend using the cat5e so I cut the cable to 4,5m and soldered the connector on it again.

The result is pretty outstanding! At 1024x768 60Hz I don't see the ghosting unless I go over to the screen because there's only one ghost a couple of pixels to the right and it's very faint.

My FTP (shielded) is on the way. BTW, what's the difference between FTP and STP cat5?


Tor Arne

there is shielded and then foil sheilded TP. The foil stuff is just another type of shielding. Has to do with different types of application (network) requirements

Bump for my norwegian friends.


I got the FTP cable now, but I sold my projector so I can't test it yet. :D


Tor Arne

One year ago I used shielded cat5 for cabling my livingroom.
There I use it for computer networking, SPDIF digital audio and
video transmission. I decided to use cat5 because I wanted to be more flexible in the use of cable after it has been installed. A friend of mine who's company projects television studios gave me that tip. The max length I used are about 18 mtrs and I have no problems at all.

Regards,
Frank.

Great post!!! Thanks Mr. Wigggles, Thumper and everyone else.

I've finished building a 36' RGBHV cable running over CAT5 STP from Mohawk (http://www.controlcable.com). I soldered all the wires based on Mr. Wigggles' original instructions (separate grounds). I am testing it right now, and I can practically see no ghosting at all at 1360x768x72Hz, however I get a very thin line on the right hand side beyond the addressable space. No power cables close by.

Any ideas what can be causing this?

GB

If it is beyond the addressable space, How do you see it? You make it sound as if there is a line in the image where there aren't any pixels?

I am a little confused on the issue you are having.

-Mr. Wigggles

Yes that's right. The line is visible outside the Windows Desktop. I've tried different resolutions and it's more noticeable at the lower resolutions.

Last night I tried watching a movie (Amadeus) with my new cable connected to the Computer 1 input of my G10. The vertical line wasn't visible there but I had a considerable amount of horizontal banding up to the point that I had to go back to the RGBHV breakout cable.

Bad ground? bad quality cable?. Tonight I'll try a shorter version.

Thanks!,
GB

Can I create a component to VGA cable with this wire?
If so can some one list in detail the wire connections needed to do this on both ends?
I am purchasing an X1 and need a cheap 35ft cable to run from my reciever to the projector. My reciever will be the switcher for Svideo, composite, and component.
If this can't be done with this wire, can someone recommend an easy DIY method so that I can keep my expenses at a minimum.

I appologize if this has been covered. I printed and read the whole thread.
Thanks a million.

DVI... Possible?

Some say it is, and some say it is not!

I must know.

See my new thread here...
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=2130770#post2130770

Bump

Maybe someone can offer me a little assistance to an issue that I am currently having after making a cable using Cat5e. After putting the cable together, I installed the cable from my HD Satellite receiver to my CRT projector using a RGBHV breakout cable (needed for my projector). The picture looked great without issue (25 foot cable). Excited about the results, I plugged the regular VGA cable back into the satellite reciever and connected my new Cat5e cable to my HTPC (VGA out - had a VGA cable running out from here already). No picture. Plugged the standard VGA cable back in and I had a picture. I can not get it running on my HTPC at any resolution (standard is 1280 X 720 @ 59.934hz).

Any reason it would work on the satellite dish, but could not get it to work at any resolution on my HTPC?

- Jay

http://63.90.33.38/hubbellpremise/images/PlatesOutletFrames/IM15ST1OW.jpg

Being a fellow AVSer I thought you guys would like this. I'm an engineer for Hubbell Premise Wiring. This product was developed to meet the RGHV over Cat5 requests we were getting from installers. Decided to give a little back to the AVS community after lurking for a couple of years.

The spec sheet is here:
IM15ST1OW Specs. (http://63.90.33.38/hubbellpremise/datasheet.asp?PN=IM15ST1OW&FAM=PlatesOutletFrames)

And a place to purchase it. Thanks!

http://www.twacomm.com/Catalog/Model_IM15ST1OW.htm

This Amp product was co-developed by Thumper here on AVS forum.

http://www.ampnetconnect.com/documents/SL%5FSeries%5FSVGA%5FModule%5F%28100402%29.pdf

It is designed to be used with shielded Cat 5 cable and works very well. The 35 foot limit is very conservative. With Shielded cat 5 these connectors have been used at up to 50 feet with UXGA resolution.

-Mr. Wigggles

Originally posted by MrWigggles
This Amp product was co-developed by Thumper here on AVS forum.

http://www.ampnetconnect.com/documents/SL%5FSeries%5FSVGA%5FModule%5F%28100402%29.pdf

It is designed to be used with shielded Cat 5 cable and works very well. The 35 foot limit is very conservative. With Shielded cat 5 these connectors have been used at up to 50 feet with UXGA resolution.

-Mr. Wigggles

Mr. Wiggles,

Could you please explain to a non-engineer (namely me) whether I can use this Amp product simply by plugging in a shielded cat5 cable? Or do I have to cut off the connector and do something with it (like solder or crimp or something)? I really want to try this out, but I don't have a soldering iron and couldn't use it if I did have one.

If Thumpers Amp product is available and the one from Hubble why is everyone doing all this soldering? Do these two items not work as well or can't you buy shielded Cat 5 with ends already on them.
-Dan

DB,

Look at the dates on the posts in this thread. When this thread started these products simply were not available. Partially as a result of this thread the need was created and these products were eventually developed.

A testiment to the power of the AVS forum :)

Thumper

Thumper

I understand why you would tie the grounds together on either cable end, but why the shield? I would think you would leave this tied to shield of either both devices, or just one or the other, but not inherently shorted to ground.

Thanks,
Ray

At $25 each, it's not cheap. I think the whole point of this thread was to build a product with cat5 that was inexpensive. If you're paying $50 for connectors, and $20 bucks for cable, it might be more cost effective to just purchase a complete cable system. I built my 20ft cat5e VGA cable for ~$30. And it works great!

Steve

Try and pull your complete cable through 40 feet of conduit. :)

BB

occammd,

The reasoning behind tying all the grounds & shield together is simple:

Not all video driver output boards and projector input boards are the same. They can and do have varying connecting trace paths, lengths & widths for each return conductor. In a few cases they don't even have all the ground paths for some of the circuits brought out to their connectors!

This method insures the lowest possible return resistance in just about all circumstances because it includes the board traces as a limiting factor. The shield then has the lowest resistance attainable between the source & load power supplies which is required to attain the near 75 ohm impedance needed.

Oh, and BTW I've heard of forum members obtaining these connectors for a lot less than $25 each.

Thumper

I'm interested if anyone has found a cheaper place to get these connectors. I've always found the AMP ones in packs of 10. Has anybody found a place that sells singles of them? If you've found single ones cheap(er), please post or PM me.

I've got a small ghost on my cable that I'd like to fix, but it's not a big enough problem to resolder things, and I don't want to shell out a lot for the pre-fab connectors. If I can fix it easily and cheaply, I'd be happy ;)

Thanks

This may not be the right thread to post this. I am copying the posting I did in another thread here hoping to get a quicker help.

Making a component to VGA cable for Infocus X1.

I made two cables using broken computer monitor cable (as one end) and solder 3 RCA plugs on the other end. It works just fine. The second cable I made is much longer than the first, about 28'. The first one is about 6' (minimum RCA cables). There is not apparent differences, but I think the longer cable has a little worse result (as you can imagine). I measured the resistance of the two ends. For the shorter cable, each wire is about 1-1.5 Ohms. The longer cable has 6 to 10 Ohms (don't know why the three wires have so much differences). The ground is about 6 Ohms. I *feel like* with the longer cable, the picture is not as bright and sharp. So, I am considering making another cable using CAT 5 ethernet cable as discussed here. The RCA cables I used are just cheap audio cables I bought from Dollar Stores (very thin copper wires inside). Will the CAT 5 cable give better results? Will it has less resistance than the RCA cable? CAT 5 cable has 8 wires in it, so it can't be that thick either. BTW, my longer cable has about 5' monitor cable plus 23' RCA (3 RCA wires bundled together, unshielded). Will the shielded ethernet cable significantly improve the image? I will not bother to make another one if there will not be big differences (maybe I should not expect big differences because I don't experience big difference with short and long cables :-)). During playing the movie, I don't really see the degradation of image quality, but I think when the player displays its logo (when not playing), the image is not as bright or clear) and some colors are not accurate.

The question is improving which one is more important, resistance in the wire or the shielding? I spent $4 dollars making 2 component to VGA cables and still left me with a bunch of spare RCA plugs :-). That's really cheap!

OK - simpleton here. I have very little space in my wall, so I need to make my VGA cable out of Cat-5. I am connecting my RCA DTC100 to my Panasonic L300U. Would rather not solder, but the Hubble product seems to offer just a female out, and I'll need the male version - would a simple converter do the trick? Also, never saw an answer to this:

***

Mr. Wiggles,

Could you please explain to a non-engineer (namely me) whether I can use this Amp product simply by plugging in a shielded cat5 cable? Or do I have to cut off the connector and do something with it (like solder or crimp or something)? I really want to try this out, but I don't have a soldering iron and couldn't use it if I did have one

***

Any help would be great! I need about a 25ft run, and this looks to be the way to go. Thanks!

To use the AMP product you will need to strip the wires but no soldering is necessary.

-Mr. Wigggles

HI,

I have a question about using a VGA extension cable. i had one laying aroung and has VGA HD-15 connections on both ends (1 side M and the other F). If I remove the male HD-15 and and solder the male RCA connectors based on the original specs
1 & 6 to Y-R (Pr)
2 & 7 to Y
3 & 8 to Y-B (Pb)

wouldn't that work as well? Would the qualitiy of using the VGA Extension cable be better or worse.

The reason for asking is 1/2 the work is already done.... Thanks.

What a great idea! I just bought a 1000' box of shielded Cat5 to wire the house, and was wondering what I could do with the extra. :)

Where do you buy the amp connectors? Even google is baffled.

Jim

Great ideas...!
Can one splice the DVI and/or RGB cables without too much of the loss in signal parameters? (- tight space in conduit).

Thanks,

Jacek

Now I'm begging. Where can I get these magic connectors?

Jim

Is this L-com piece a reasonable alternative, albeit not as nice but significantly more available?

http://www.l-com.com/jump.jsp?lGen=productleader&itemID=7166&itemType=PRODUCTLEADER&iProductID=7166

Jim

The AMP PDF is at:

http://www.ampnetconnect.com/docume...28100402%29.pdf

You could call them and ask if the product is in production.

-Mr. Wigggles

I ordered some cable to try this out:

"Thomas & Betts P/N 26-4-SC-5-PCH 4PR 26 AWG SCREENED TYPE CM/MP (UL) 75C LL702046 CSA TYPE CMH -
- ScTP CATEGORY PATCH [footage marking] 08/11/98"

35.00 / 1000' roll. The guy has a few more if anyone is interested.

Anyone try this with a DVI->DVI connector?

Man, I was hoping to do a 100' run. Looks like the cheap solution will have too much ghosting.

-Ed

if i missed this in the thread please forgive me... i think it was asked but never answered. i have run into a snag.. i have an Infocus X1. i bought a BNC to VGA breakout cable from pccables.. problem is i cannot get it pulled through my wall because of the thickness. i have run 2 CAT5 cables, one UTP and not sure about the other, but it would be easy to rerun an STP. i was going to make a Component to VGA cable using CAT5 but since I have purchased the component to VGA adapter from Infocus can I just make a component cable using the CAT5 and some male RCAs? i can't find any wiring info on this or maybe it is not possible.... thanks. btw the run is about 30-35'

check out post 34 and 35:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=172139#post172139

basically you use the same rgb wiring configuration and just leave the sync wires off.

I think that later in the thread someone posted pictures of a cable using rca connectors - not sure if that was another thread or not.
(edit/find is a good way to scan thru large posts like this.)

made my cable this weekend. could not find STP in Austin, so used my UTP CAT5e. i used the unused pair for my sync. it seems to work fine. i have not done a comparison yet against my pccables breakout. i'll let you know when i get my screen material in this week.

After discovering this thread yesterday I tried the s-video to cat-5 and it worked awsome. I used a $10, 25 foot utp cat-5 cable and a $5, 5 foot s-video cable and it worked perfectly from my xbox to my 56" rptv. Next up going to try 25 foot vga over cat-5.

Just like to thank everyone for this thread and all of the help and hints that were provided.

Cheers,
Zed

Who has done this with UTP?

My house is totally wired with UTP and so is my theater.

This url says UTP works fine, but I am reading here it doesn't.

http://www.myhometheater.homestead.com/vgacable.html

i used UTP and it seems to work fine. i did a comparison w/ a $45 VGA breakout. unfortunately i could not run that big cable down my wall so UTP was the only viable option for me.

I am pretty sure they carry STP at Fry's.

Best Regards,
Doug

Hi; I'm not sure why people are concerned about getting to 75ohm Z for the cables. RGB has a spec of 75ohm Z, but I'm not sure how it maintains this spec when it is using db15 connectors which are hardly 75ohm Z. As well, svid also has a 75ohm Z spec, again how is this maintained with the 2bit connectors that are used. As far as know, only a 75ohm BNC can maintain the proper Z.
Maybe someone could enlighten me on this one.
Thanks.

use liberty cables 'truphase' UTP cable. all conductors are twisted at the same ratio, so that timing is kept correctly. it is a little bit more expensive, but worth it.

also if you want an even better picture, look up ETS lan for their video baluns. I can get perfect 1600x1200 on an LCD display.

-matt

Originally posted by WTS
Hi; I'm not sure why people are concerned about getting to 75ohm Z for the cables. RGB has a spec of 75ohm Z, but I'm not sure how it maintains this spec when it is using db15 connectors which are hardly 75ohm Z. As well, svid also has a 75ohm Z spec, again how is this maintained with the 2bit connectors that are used. As far as know, only a 75ohm BNC can maintain the proper Z.
Maybe someone could enlighten me on this one.
Thanks.

75 ohm transmission is not a all or nothing thing.

The greater percentage of your link that is not 75 ohms the better chance you have for waveform distortion and thus image degradation.

So using 75 ohm connectors for a small portion your cable is not as bad as using non-75 ohm cable to begin with.

The secret to all of this is that when using shielded twisted pair, using the shield as an additional conductor helps to lower the effective impedance of the cable from 100 ohms to near 75 ohms. It thus becomes a shielded cable.

-Mr. Wigggles

Hi MrWigggles; Granted, you want to get as close to 75ohms as possible, but how much is the db15 connector skewing the Z at both ends. I don't understand why the industry went with a db15 connector for RGB in the first place and have an impedence of 75ohms when everyone knows(well maybe not everyone) that a db15 can't possibly maintain that impedence. There is a Z mismatch, but how much effect it has seems to be small by all the positive results people are getting.

Good product for those who can't/won't solder:
Radio Shack # 64-029
Silver-Bearing Paste
Solder Weld
5 times stronger than ordinary solder - 10,000 to 25,000 psi
Ideal for making connections where soldering irons won't fit
Syringe for efficient solder application.

Heat with lighter, torch or solder iron.

I'm still in the middle of making my 25' VGA Cable from Cat5e (I also want to add the 8pin coupler like orignal post for easy diconnect - but later), and the solder paste does apppear to work (I hope). Very strong joint. It takes some practice not to melt the wire's plastic. But I have liquid electrical tape to fix that problem. :)
Wish me luck!

BTW I ruin two HD-15 connectors yesterday. I forget that I don't know how to solder!!! :P

Hi; Instead of going thru all that , why don't you take all your parts and the wiring diagram, go down to your local TV repair shop and ask the service tech if he would mind soldering a few wires for you, pay him 20 bucks and you're done and chances are it will be done right.

or just buy these and no soldering
http://www.l-com.com/jump.jsp?lGen=productleader&itemID=7166&itemType=PRODUCTLEADER&iMainCat=35&iSubCat=181&iSubSubCat=0&iProductID=7166
worked great

Originally posted by Ken Greene
or just buy these and no soldering
http://www.l-com.com/jump.jsp?lGen=productleader&itemID=7166&itemType=PRODUCTLEADER&iMainCat=35&iSubCat=181&iSubSubCat=0&iProductID=7166
worked great

Interesting and nifty product but...

How do you house/enclose those $10 wired terminals? I might consider them in the future. And where is the male version?

I tried the cheaper products to save $$. I got my wire from work (normal 5e), the crimper tool from work, the 8wire connectors from work, the hd-15 plastic housings from work, solder iron and solder from work all for free...
I bought normal m/f HD15's from rat shack, the solder paste, as well as the 8pin inline coupler.
-----------------
HMMM TV repair guy might work, but again that's $20 more dollars. I know someone at work that could solder them but I wanted them done this weekend and he might want to charge me as well.
-----------------
BTW
My 30' VGA-VGA Cat5e with plastic housing and very ugly solder job seem to work just great! I haven't added the 8pin connectors yet... I still need to build my movable computer cart and fully test the new wire with my projector.
----------------
Great topic! Thanks for the idea and tips in the first 18ish pages (OUCH).

the l-com product fits nicely in a LV wall box esspecially when you use its wall plate to cover the box

can someone draw the layout digagram for this? with the proper shielding wires hooked up?

I tried to make a vga cable yesterday. I used soldering vga-connectors in both ends and a cat5 cable. The cable has a shielding of metallic foil, ie not the threaded one. I have seen cables which has both the foil and a threaded shield but couldnt find a supplier that would cut them to my length (only 100m packages).

Is the threaded one what you all consider a "shielded" cat5, or cat5e? I have also seen references to this cable as "FTP/S" or "S-FTP", is that the same.

Also, I'm a bit confused about how to connect the shielding in the connectors. At one side of the cable I have a HD26 D-sub to connect to my projector (an old ASK Impression A9). At this side I don't have pin 10, "Ground". Should I connect the shield to one of the RGB-grounds?

Thanks for your time.

/Bo Mellberg, Sweden

Hi; As far as the grounds are concerned, if I remember correctly, the middle row of pins(hd15 connector) can all go to ground, tie them together at both ends as well as the shield drain wire.

I have now followed all grounding advices on this thread, but to no avail.

I have 30 ft cat5e foil shielded cable.

I have tied together R-, G-, B- and shield drain wire and soldered them to the connector metal chassi. This is done at both ends. I use metal housings for the connectors.

At 1024x768@60Hz I get ghosting. 4-5 repetitions of the mouse pointer are clearly visible with say 8-10 pixels between them.

I have also tried to change the phase or "tune" of the projector (an old ASK impression A9), but I could not get rid of the ghosting effects.

Can this be caused by impendance mismatch? It seems like the signal is travelling back and forth in the cable until it has dimished enough to not be noticeable.

Please help!

/Bo Mellberg, Sweden

MrMayhem,

My guess is you ASK projector might be part of the problem, the other could be the type of cable you are using. If you see the first post, I stated I got mine at Fry's. Ask members who got good results which brand they used.

-Mr. Wigggles

MrWigggles,

thanks for the reply. I am currently comparing the picture with the home made cable to the picture with the ASK supplied 15 feet cable and the difference is like night and day. So I know that the projector can produce a nice looking picture.

My guess is the cable as you say. But it would be nice to be able to fiddle with the cable impedance. My fear is that I will try different cable manufacturers until my hair is gray. :-)

/Bo

the cable we used is from olimpic cable in NJ
http://www.olympicwire.com/

I need a little help. Before I begin, let me state that I have read every post in this thread from the beginning, so if this has been explained forgive me -- I missed it, but I'm not lazy. ;)

I built a cable using instructions I found on the web (before reading this thread) that did not include using the ground wire (or STP). I did, however, use shielded cat5 - just didn't connect the #10 spot. I got my cable free from a friend who owns a telecom servicing company. I also had him terminate the cables with standard rj45 connectors. I'm running two cables into two keystone jacks connected on either side of a wall (one floor apart). The connectors and keystones are not shielded.

This setup works surprisingly well, but still gives me two slight ghosts. Like any DIYer, I'm sure I could do better.

Here's what I don't understand -- if I get shielded connectors and shielded keystone jacks, how does this carry the ground? From what I've found the connectors and jacks (or a MrWriggles-style junction box, for that matter) are 8-pin connectors. Doesn't the ground wire have to be soldered on both ends and connected continuously in-between?

Any help will be much appreciated.

Interesting new product for Cat5 cable:

http://www.knollsystems.com/baluns.htm

Hi all,

I just read through this entire thread, and there are a few things I'm still unclear of. Will VGA => Component over Cat5 work? I was referred to this thread by http://www.myhometheater.homestead.com/vgacable.html which claims that it will. Has anyone here gotten this to work? Forgive me if it's been mentioned, but it IS a long thread thats been going on for nearly 2 1/2 years. I'm a bit disappointed that the gentleman who tried running SPDIF on the fourth pair encountered interference, because I was hoping to do the same thing.

Also, there's been some talk about people getting crazy resolutions like 1280 x 1024 @ 60Hz. Are these connections to projectors? It would seem to me that a hookup to a lower-end HD monitor (read: $1500 rear-projection TV) that doesn't support 720p would be limited to 1080i (1920 x 1080 @ 30Hz) which incidently is a valid setting on my video card. Am I even on the right track to understanding the possibilities of connecting a computer to a HD monitor?

Basically, I'm trying to connect my computer to my HDTV in a different room. Since I'm in an apartment, I can't run anything through the walls, and I basically had to run cable along the wall under the door and back along the wall on the other side. Needless to say, running 4 lenghts of coax would look very ugly, so I figured CAT5 would be a bit more aesthetically pleasing. Does anyone else have any ideas how to hide these connections? Are there any reasonably priced Component video / SPDIF wireless senders / receivers out there?

Thanks!

TGP

Hi all

I have been trying to make up a 15 Metre cable from the instructions listed
here:

myhometheater.homestead.com/vgacable.html


But no matter what I do the picture is always green so I must be missing something here..

Can someone give some pointers as to what would cause the green picture??


Thanks,


Paul

After two weeks of resoldering and swearing, I finally got around to try another cable type. I bought an S-FTP, double shielded (foil + threaded one) and I now have a super picture!

If I open a windows window and move it around I can see some banding effect, but thats noticeable even with the supplied VGA-cable.

Here's the setup:

R- G- and B- connected to each other and to pin 10

Threaded shield soldered to pin 10 and to connector housing.

Works great!

/Bosse

Just reporting a success using SFTP shielded 5e (braided) cable in a 10m length running SVideo.

I used the orange/orange-white and green/green-white pairs, and did not cross or bridge the earths. The shield wire is crimped in the cable-holder.

Works brilliantly. I dragged an extra length of SFTP through for future XGA input to the projector.

Regards,

Michael

Hey i made the wire on this website cause i wanted to hook my computer up to my hdtv also.....but i can't get it to work...it won't even show up in green.......any ideas?

Same 'green screen' problem as a poster a few posts ago. Is this probably a bad connection or will this just not work on my pj?
This was a bad blue connector. Resoldered and works fine!


Concerning using the cat5 shield drain ... am I grounding this correctly for a RCA to HD-15 breakout?:

I am using STP cat5e with foil and braided shield. I have RCA/Component on the output and HD-15 on the input (the pj is a VT540k that accepts component via the HD-15 connector). I have not seen drain grounding explicitly stated for this component to HD-15 scenario, just RCA to RCA and HD-15 to HD-15 ... however I believe the only thing I need to do, besides connect the RGB and RGB grounds to their respective terminals, is to connect the shield wire to pin 10 on the HD-15 side and then to the 'Y' ground on the component side. Is this correct????

Thanks!
-Mike

Well, my first attempt ended up with a chewed up cable when I tried to fish the cable through the walls (lots of pre-existing wiring). My guess is that compromising the outer jacket will compromise the cable, so I'm abandoning my first attempt. As a result, I would have to say that I have not yet even gotten started on this, yet. However, next weekend I'll definitely have to give it another try.

Since I'm aiming for around 50', I am curious about what the maximum distance that someone has transmitted good quality video (DIYer, not pro...)?

Later,
Bill

i did 50 no problem
I'm a serious DIYer

Alright, so rather than go back to Fry's to find my new cable, I searched through the thread and looked at the various links to cable sellers. These guys appear to be the cheapest (especially for 1000' solid core for <$100):

http://www.national-tech.com/cgi-bin/search.cgi?text=stp&type=all&x=21&y=14

Does anybody have any experience with their cable quality? I paid ~$20 shipped for a 75' patch cord, so I am pretty happy if their quality is good.

Later,
Bill

Well, it turns out that National Tech, like most others, is selling stranded core STP in its patch cords. Does anyone want to split a 1000' roll of STP? :D

Or does anyone know where to get solid core STP...?

Later,
Bill

PS: Cool. Post 888.

I did 180' to a Samsung 757NF (DiamondTron), You can see everything on those tubes. At 1024x768 @ 60hz the picture was good in colors but had a vage ghost. At 4' from the screen the ghost wasnt visible.

I'll put an oscilloscope on to see the amplitude drop but im short of soldering tin.

ups!

Originally posted by raoul
makes you wonder what you could do with a simple hub http://www.avsforum.com/ubb/wink.gif

I apologize that I've come late to this thread, and please forgive me if this has been pointed out already, but I figure that an extra post can be ignored more easily than a non-existant post can be imagined.

A hub wouldn't work because a hub is not simply a passive repeater/amplifier. Although an Ethernet hub is often considered to be a passive device, in reality, it locks onto the clock that is embedded in an Ethernet signal and regenerates the signal, amplifying it and retiming it in the process. In addition, if the clock is lost or corruption is detected, the hub performs a behavior known as "bit-jamming", in which the hub transmits a pre-defined sequence of bits onto all ports. I predict that, if you attempted to plug a cat-5 cable carrying video into a hub, either 1) nothing would happen, or 2) the hub would repeatedly bit-jam on all ports.

In addition, a hub would only repeat signals on the pins that are used for Ethernet. 10/100 Ethernet uses two pairs or four pins, while RGBHV would require... more pins than four? I think so, but I'm not 100% sure.

My $0.02.

Well the hub thingy is completely out of the question first of all signals are digital. RGBHV is analoge. An Hub broadcasts packets to all of it ports except the transmitting port. Collision detection is handled by your ethernet card and not the hub. The protocol that handles collision detection is called CSMA/CD in IEEE 802.3.

bump1

bump2 : sorry, but must have 3 posts prior to being enabled to end urls

bump 3

bump3

Thought I might give you pros out there a new challenge on this old warn-out thread!!
Has anyone ever tried using shielded cat5 to connect vga to rgb-scart?
I know it can be done with unshielded, but think it might be better with shielded. Just don't know how to connect the shield?
Some links:
http://utopia.knoware.nl/users/eprebel/SoundAndVision/Engineering/SCART.html about scart pinout
and:
http://www.idiots.org.uk/vga_rgb_scart/ and linking ati cards to scart

http://www.intelix.com/

An easy solution for video and audio over cat5

see Audio/Video Baluns

I guess it needs to be repeated every page, but baluns are an option, but an unneeded expense because we are talking shielded cat-5 here.

-Mr. Wigggles

MrWiggles,
What about the post before? any idea?

m@rteko,

The Red, Green and Blue and the sync are mandatory with Scart. I don't know if the RGB status is necessary.

Regardless, I bet you can put the "sync (composite) in(or out)" line on the brown wire of the Cat 5 shielded and the "RGB status in (or out)" on the brown striped wire.

Give it a shot.

-Mr. Wigggles

Ps. I can't believe this thread has lasted this long. I started this thread three years ago!!!

good ideas/things tend to last longer than most run of the mill stuff.

No chance that this Cat 5 cabling method will work with DVI? :p

Ok probably not, but I can dream!

I was just wondering the same thing myself (use of DVI). Of course I assume you would need more than one run of CAT5.

-Suntan

I work at a church where we recently hired a company to run S-Video from the sound booth to the foyer. They chose to do this via Cat-5 cable with S-Video baluns on each end. this worked fine with a borrowed rear-projection Sony tv, but has not worked with a Zenith plasma edtv we recently purchased. The Zenith flashs "S-Video Input - No Signal", and the picture comes and goes with alot of noise. Any ideas? Also, could we run a 150' length of standard S-Video cable instead? Would the results be any different? - Thanks, CB.

Ok, I must be retarted, could someone please help me!!!, I have tried making this cable twice using my X1 projector with no sucess. I am using the Hi Def kit for the Xbox with the component connections to the VGA port on my X1 with this cable and I cannot get any picture at all.

Has anybody used this kit with the xbox before?? if not can someone try??

Here is what I did and let me know if the browns need hooked to anything or not

VGA
Pin 1 = Orange
Pin 2 = Green
Pin 3 = Blue

Pin 6 = Orange/White
Pin 7 = Green/White
Pin 8 = Blue/White

For Brown I have tried both

Pin 13 = Brown
Pin 14 = Brown/White

since that didnt work I tried

Pin 4 = Brown
Pin 5 = Brown/White

and I even tried not connecting them at all since they arent connected on the other side.

On the other side I used 3 phono connectors from radio shack, the inner piece used the solid colors and the shell used the grounds, Brown on this connected to nothing. Am I suppost to hook brown somewhere?

Where am I going wrong?? Or is it not possible with the xbox? or is my VGA connector I picked up from Radio Shack at fault. I am about to give up and shell out alot of money for some stupid cables and I want to avoid that.

brkc- I've only just seen this, so it's probably too late.

150' is quite a run for s-video. I suggest decent 75 Ohm coaxial cable. I'm not surprised that Cat5 cable didn't work (apologies to those who are fond of it).

Hi

I have a question

Is it somehow possible, if you switch the places of the horisontal or vertical Synchronization connections on the VGA part of the cable, to make the picture turn upside down? Im asking because I want to make this CAT5 RCA to VGA cable for my self.

The thing is that I own a SONY VPL_CX1 projector and it is not capable to turn the picture upside down to enable ceilingmount.

If yes how?

if no, how is it possible to achieve a rotated picture? do I need some kind of selfmade converterbox or what?

Hope somebody is able to answer my question.

Thanks in advance :-)

Are you running a HTPC? If so, there is a program called "Pivot pro" (search google) that can rotate the picture 180 degrees for you. Havent tried it myself though.

No my source is a Pionner DV-470 (european model) almost equvilant to DV-363 (US Model) but with a 12-bit/108MHz Video D-A converter and DIVX compatibility. But after a little research i kind of figured out that it is not possible to fix the wiring in the cable.

but if anybody knows how to do it feel free to tell me :-)

Hi!
Yesterday I tried to connect my Samsung TS-360 HD receiver to my JVC plasma (using VGA to Component) and it didn't work (green picture). I didn't wire the H and V signals since I dont't think they are needed, but maybe I'm wrong. Can anybody tell me if what I'm doing is possible or not?
Maybe I'm missing something here ..... :confused:
If I use a regular male to male VGA cable it works and I have 2 sets of inputs on the plasma 3 BNC for component or 5 BNC (same + V and H signals)
Thanks !

Angel

Whew...what a read. Ok, I've gone through this entire thread and I have a few questions.

1) I'm about to wire my home computer network with CAT6 cable and I was wondering if this cable is ok to use for carrying the video signal to my projector. Everyone has pretty much discussed using CAT5/CAT5e in this thread.

2) If CAT6 is a viable choice, do I still need to look for STP? Or does CAT6 contain enhanced shielding already?

Thanks.

You have to use shielded cat 5 and only some brands work well.

The secret is that the overall shield for the shielded twisted pair helps lower the effective impedance of the entire cable down to near 75 ohms.

Personally I would use Belden cable (7919A or 7929A). The cable I mentioned at the beginning of the thread (which I found at Fry's) is a little hard to come by.

Remember, try to keep the thing to a 35 feet or less due to Skew reasons from pair to pair. Belden also make a specific video nano-skew cable, 7987R, but they inexplicably left it at 100 ohms. I don't know how well it will work since it isn't 75 and there is no shield to help drop it to 75, but a tight 100 ohms (not 100 +/- 15 like most) might be good enough

-Mr. Wigggles

Mr Wiggles,

For my own understanding, can you explain why shielded CAT5 cable is better than shielded CAT5e or shielded Cat6 cable.

Also, thanks for the skew tip. My run will be approximately 20 feet so skew shouldn't be an issue.

Thanks again.

I recently used regular cat5 for a 30' S-Video cable as per mysphyt's instructions on this page http://www.myhometheater.homestead.com/vgacable.html and am quite happy with the results.

Why not use coax? I just don't get the logic of this. I may as well start replacing wires with bits of wet string.

On longer runs, coax is expensive. Here are the numbers in regards to cost savings based on Intelix baluns:


Audio- cheaper to use Cat 5/baluns over 1000 feet
Coax- cheaper to use Cat 5/baluns over 350 feet
Audio & Video- cheaper to use Cat 5/baluns over 300 feet
VGA- cheaper to use Cat 5/baluns over 100 feet

And for the most part, these baluns are passive with no power required....

Thanks to all who have contacted me about this information

What about that balun that was for in wall installations with a wall plate. The one with screw terminals?

I can't find that one. I know there was info here somewhere.

-Ed

Originally posted by kcautodoc
Question,

I have been trying to make a breakout cable from STP Cat 5 cable. I am trying to go from Component out on my DVD to VGA in on my projector. I have a Sharp M20X projector which actually has DVI input but came with a DVI to VGA cable.

I have read the Cat 5 success thread numerous times. I have seen the comments that it can't be done with a DVI input and I have seen the comments about Component not working over Cat 5. It appeared that Robert_S had some success with Component signals and you can but DVI to VGA cables and VGA to Component cables so I don't really see a reason why you cannot make a Component to VGA cable.

You may ask why I am not making a DVI to Component cable. Well the projector comes with a DVI to VGA cable and finding a DVI plug that I can solder onto seems to be nearly impossible. I am only looking for about 22' feet here, but for the price people want for the breakout cable or DVI to Component is insane.

Anyway, I am looking for help making a Component to VGA cable and I'm hoping someone out there can help me solve my problem. I have done the soldering (see below) and get a good picture (better than my S-video) but, the picture appears to only have the green component because the picture only has different shades of green. The blacks are much deeper and the picture seems to have better contrast with what I have now with the green only. This may just be the fact that Green and Blue are missing but I may be really close to getting an even better picture that I am now used to.

This is my setup for soldering.

VGA pins
1 Red
2 Green
3 Blue

6 Red ground
7 Green ground
8 Blue ground

I've only got three wires left (one twisted pair and the shielding wire)

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Richard

i have a sharp pg-m25x, did you get this to work?

//Micke (Sweden)

Originally posted by Edwood
What about that balun that was for in wall installations with a wall plate. The one with screw terminals?

I can't find that one. I know there was info here somewhere.

-Ed


Anyone have a link for this?

I'd rather not spend so much money on a VGA Balun Cat 5 extender.

-Ed

http://www.twacomm.com/Catalog/Model_IM15ST1OW.htm

That be the one. Thanks!!

How long a run could I do with Cat6 wiring do you think?

-Ed

sheilded cat 5e i did 50' with no problems

cat 6 will not give you any more appreciable distance. the wire is the same. however the twist ratios are different so there is the possibility of seeing what looks like a misalignment.

All of htis is using SHIELDED cat 5. UTP will not work.

has anyone tried using this with an NVidia video card?
As far as I've read the only problem is how to make the composite synch signal.
I've found the following site
http://www.sput.nl/hardware/tv-x.html
which offers a very simple scheme that creates one composite synch signal from the HSynch(13) and VSynch(14) of the VGA RGB.

Here is the scheme

-VS ------------------------+
|
|
| /
+-----+ |/
-HS --+ 3k3 +-----*-----| BC 548 B
+-----+ | |\
| | \|
| -| +-----+
| *-----+ 68 +----- -CS 0.3 Vpp
| | +-----+
+++ +++
| | | |
| | | |
+++ +++
| |
GND --------------*---------*----------------- GND
1k2 820


do you think that this can work?

Merry Christmas to all!!!

I finally found some time during the weekend and tried to make VGA to RGB-CSynch with my NVidia GeForce4 Ti4200.
My TV is Panasonic TX-29AS1P QuintrixF (29" CRT 4:3 50Hz SDTV) and I've connected it to the VGA output of the VC while I keep my PC monitor connected to the DVI output using a DVI-RGB dongle.
I can say that it's working... well I have some problems and I hope someone can help me with them.

I used a 5m STP cable wired in the following way:

VGA SCART
1 ----------------------------- 15
2 ----------------------------- 11
3 ----------------------------- 7
6 ----------------------------- 13
7 ----------------------------- 9
8 ----------------------------- 5
9 ----------- R1 -------------- 16
CS ----------------------------- 20

R1 = 100Ohm

After configuring PowerStrip to output 720x576i I got a pretty nice picture on the TV.
:)
But now let's start with the problems though:
1.
The first thing that I saw was that my TV stopped showing any cable TV (connected to the RF input). On any channel I saw a scrambled (not synched) picture of my desktop and the sound of the selected channel !?!?!? First I worried that I've damaged the TV but then I disconnected the RGB cable and everything was back to normal. Then I tried other inputs - Composite or S-Video in the second SCART on the back and they worked fine either with the RGB cable connected or not. Now I'm very confused what's happening. I haven't connected anything to pin 8 (Audio/RGB switch/16:9) of the SCART so this should be OK.... but it isn't.
Do you have any idea what could be wrong? Do I have to wire pin 18 (Blanking ground) of the SCART to something? or is it just fine to leave it unconnected?.... btw I'll try connecting it later today to see if there is any difference

2.
The second problem is that the mouse pointer shown on the TV is bigger - in fact I think it's exactly double sized. This is not a big problem if it wasn't also that it actually points on a different place. And I mean a big difference. I'm sensing that it has something to do with the interlaced signal because the difference in the place where it points with the place where it's displayed increases when I move down the screen. And when it points exactly in the middle (289) it is just going off the TV screen. And I'm sure that it's not an overscan issue because everything else is in place. I even see my taskbar...if I put it on the secondary monitor.
Any ideas what can I do to fix this?

3.
Using PowerStrip I've almost managed to eliminate any underscan of the picture but I'm on the edge with the frequencies and there are still a little black bars on both left and right sides. If I try to increase the picture even more I lose synch :(
Any advices? What resolutions do you try and with what timings?
I'm asking this because I think that mine are pretty off the specs for PAL and this is disturbing me (not the TV for the moment)
here are my settings:
PowerStrip timing parameters:
720x576=720,80,16,112,576,35,5,47,14850,2062

Generic timing details for 720x576:
HFP=80 HSW=16 HBP=112 kHz=16 VFP=35 VSW=5 VBP=47 Hz=24

Linux modeline parameters:
"720x576" 14.850 720 800 816 928 576 611 616 663 interlace -hsync -vsync

4.
One thing that disturbs me is that I hear a very light high frequency buzz from the TV. And it changes when I change the Pixel Clock or the Scan rates. Can you tell where this comes from? And is it dangerous for the TV?

5.
The final problem (.... for the moment :-) ) is about a strange blinking of the PC monitor when I start different applications. For example if I start PowerStrip, UltraMon, CompareIt! my monitor goes off for a sec and then is back on again. I suppose with PowerStrip and UltraMon it's OK - they are all about monitors but CompareIt! is a simple text processing application that compares text files and shows the differences. !?!??!
Any ideas?

Do you have or did you have similar problems?

I'm about to try to make this cable.

Projector VGA to VGA about 10m/30feet away...

I notice MrWigggles used a shielded cat5 junction box...

What i want to do is similar...

Run the cat5 STP from the projector on the roof, down to where the DVD player etc.. will sit.. My projector has VGA and component input via its HD15 connection, switchable by the menu...

For neatness and to make it easier to swap the connections, i want to run the cat5 STP from the projector to a RJ45 plate on the wall, then have a couple of STP patch leads made up that go RJ45 <--> VGA and RJ45 <--> Component... and plug in which ever i'm using....

Problem is i can't find a Shielded RJ45 wall plate - I'm in Australia so would be much better if i could find one locally? If they are only available in the USA i have friends there i could get to mail me one...

EDIT:
Thinking about it some more, is it necesary to use STP for the RJ45 <--> VGA and RJ45 <--> Component leads to go from the wall plate to the source? Could i use UTP? (Do i need to pass the ground/shield line from the source to the STP run... to the projector? or is it enough having the STP ground wire running the 30feet from the projector to the wall plate mounted near the source DVD player etc..?)

Ran the cable from projector to source units, ran 3 lots of STP from my projector

1 for Composite
1 for SVID
1 for VGA/Component (15HD)

Wired up the VGA last night, plugged laptop in, perfect, no ghosting as far as i could see, only using 800x600 res... Wired the ground to pin 10 as Mr Wiggles said, didn't need to short the (-)'s to the ground pin....

Next steps are to wire the SVid and Composite, should be easy right?

Pin 1 = Y gnd (Use Green/White)
Pin 2 = C gnd (Use Orange/White)
Pin 3 = Y (Use Green)
Pin 4 = C (Use Orange)

And Composite just use 1 of the pairs, say green for the centre prong and greenwhite for the ground/outside...


And I'd still like to get my hand on a shielded RJ45 wall plate....

sheild rj 45 cat 6 keystone
http://www.l-com.com/jump.jsp?lGen=crossSell&itemID=7546&itemType=PRODUCT&iProductID=7546&iMainCat=102&iSubCat=61&iSubSubCat=64

Ken: What does the 8x8 mean on that product?

To pass through the 9th wire (sheild/ground bare wire) wouldn't it need the extra pin?

I've also read THumpers original response :

[To crank up the performance yet another notch, solder all the "grounds" and shield together (inside the shells) at both ends even though the video card & projector combine these grounds on their circuit boards.]

a few times and i'm not sure if he means don't bother soldering the (-)'s/grounds to the pins 6,7,8 and just solder them all to pin 10, or if he means solder them to pins 6,7,8 AND jumper them to pin 10, so pin 10,6,7,8 all connect

I'm assuming the 2nd option of jumpering 6,7,8,10 together

My laptop gives me no ghost as far as i can see, but plugging a VGA->component breakout lead to my xbox gives me a tiny ghost i think... so not sure if this will help... The XBOX is 2 prong power plug, ie no earth, so thinking anything without an earth socket may end up causing a bit of ghosting...

ferni,
its a coupler. That means it will take an RJ45 plug into both ends and it will transfer all 8 pins straight through. Also for your second question the shielding is passed by the sheild of the jack ( the metal that the jack is wrapped in).

As for the ends i used a solderless connector but did connect all grounds and it worked great. I did not compare the two versions

Thanks for that Ken,

I know what a coupler is... the shielding I've never worked with before hence the silly questions... So the shield wire is connected to the RJ45 plug itself which its metal not plastic?and that passes through the 9th wire (shield?)

When you say you did connect all grounds, did you solder them to each other AND the 6,7,8,10 pins? or just solder them together and then to pin 10?

I've also found that when my xbox is on connected via component breakout lead to my projector, the TV gets interference, as soon as I disconnect the xbox video cable (or turn the xbox off) the interference disappears... Xbox is 2 prong power plug, i.e. no earth, so thinking connecting pins 6,7,8,10 together may help...

i jumped all the ground pins

hello there MrWigggles, i was curious about your experiment here, i want to know if there any possibilities from using the cat 5 cables to connect the vga connector (male) to the component cables (Y Pb Pr), because i want to connect the pc to the plasma/lcd tv at component in or opposite from it from dvd player component out to the vga in at the plasma/ lcd tv, and could you tell me how to do it and the schematics/diagram for rigging it, and one thing please send me the picture to explain the installation for the cat 5 cable at my email : svetlana12ax7@yahoo.com

best regards,
svetlana:confused:

Could you just remove and separate wires from a standard cat5 cable. From there measure all the cables to make sure they are the same lenghts. Then braid the cables together so they are tightly twisted. Wrap the wires with teflon tape and then wrap that in foil tape for shielding. Then spiral a bare copper wire around the foil tape. Then wrap that with teflon tape and then heat shrink the entire cable. Does anyone think that this would work any better?

Another success story here. I am using standard Cat5e to do VGA to VGA. No shield required. I do have some very minor ghosting but nothing that I cant handle. Not gonna pay for STP when I pretty good picture at 30ft with free stuff : ). Thanks Wiggles and Thumper!!!

Earlier in this thread Mr Wiggles had recommended that I use one of the following Cat5e cables...

Belden 7919A

Belden 7929A

...since the type he had originally used was difficult to obtain.

I live in Toronto and I've have had a difficult time tracking down distributors that carry either cable in selectebale lengths as the default spool is 1000ft and I'm only looking for around 200-300 ft.

However, I'll be in Los Angeles and then Las Vegas next week (for the Superbowl mayhem of course) and I was hoping someone might know of a local distributor that carries either of these cables in varying lengths.

Thanks

You guys are very impressive. I know all of this is over my head. Has anyone stepped up to be willing to build these cables for a reasonable price for those like me who aren't up to the task?

Carl

Well, I tried it out too, but no dice.

The picture shimmers and flickers very badly. It's my guess that I had the wrong kind of Cat5 cable - I just tested with some stuff I found lying about the house. It said STP Cat5, but apparently it didn't have whatever it takes ...

Since I live in Switzerland and can't find any of the recommended Cat4 types, I'm giving up on this line of experimentation.

* * * *

Question: What I'm thinking of trying now is cutting a good but short VGA cable in half then joining up the ends using multiple strands of rg6. Anyone with some knowledge of a project along those lines?

Peace,

Mike Gray

Been using mine now for 6 months, built with 40 feet of standard Fry's off the shelf STP CAT 6 cable and it's still flawless.

Guys, don't buy Dayton Audio HD-15 VGA wall plate from Partsexpress.com. It's cheap, but that's because it's just a gender changer.

Sheesh, if it at least had solder cups or tabs, I could've soldered the wires there. :rolleyes:

-Ed

I know someone mentioned this before, but has anyone actually tried the Muxlab 500021 for unspecified Component video (or 500002 for RGB, for limited 480i/P)? The manufacturer's product spec (http://www.muxlab.com/french/assets/files/datasheets/VE_VGA_Component_fr.pdf) and at least this (http://www.asihome.com/ASIshop/product_info.php?cPath=40_41_224&products_id=1149) reseller was found.

Yeah, except that would require six of those suckers. And then the price is no longer so nice.

-Ed

Couple quick questions.... read through most of the thread and may have missed this but....

You can make the VGA cabel without the shielded ends (RJ45) correct? Just make a shielded cable from one DB15 end to another DB15 end.... no shielded rj45 coupler or ends...

Has anyone tried to make one in this scenario.... run a 20' or greater shielded cat 5 cable fomr one location to another.... Use two shielded couplers on each end and then use the DB15 to shielded RJ45 on each end. Kind oflike making wall jacks with the couplers.....

Or has anyone just done db15 to db15 and then used an extension cabnle on top of that almost liek using the DB5 end as the wall jack type....

Last is toward s-video and stereo audio dist using the same shielded cable... has anyone done this if so any pointers I plan on doing a pretty large project in my home so any advice is welcome on this side of things...

run 50' HD15 on both ends then used HD15 cables from wall plates for Computer and Monitor no problems what so ever

awesome... simply awesome :)

found some stuff that might peak other intrests :D

Shielded RJ45 wall jacks $5.99
http://www.cablestogo.com/product.asp?cat%5Fid=2202&sku=03783

1000' Shielded CAT 5E $139.99
http://www.cablestogo.com/product.asp?cat%5Fid=303&sku=27432

8 port VGA splitter / Amp Boosts up to 210 feet up to 200MHz 1600x1200 $109.00
http://www.kvms.com/nav/item.asp?item=1385


if anyone else comes across stuff like this :) post it here as it would be nice to have a central location for all fo this stuff.

<MrWigggles>
or whomever can answer this for me.... awsome read by the way.
can i use something like rj174 coax cable to make this HD-15 break out cable?
reason i ask is this, i build a breakout cable using reg. cat5 and it works fine, so then i thought maybe if i use some shielded cable it should work better, so built it the same way, except for the pin 10 which is not being used at all,( the damn cable did not work) i checked for continuity all good. I'm not a videophile or anything, so the reg. cat5 breakout cable looked fine to me...its just that i want to get the best video quility possible from my projector.


thanks in advance

Hi there!

How do i create a vga to rgbhv break out cable using a sheilded cat5?

I know that the vga 15 pin has two wires for each color (r,g and b) for the positive/negative but what about the horizontal and vertical?

the vga 15 pin only has one connection for the horizontal and another for the vertical.

I wanter to connect the rgbhv on my plasma recievers vga input.

do you have any kind of wiring diagram or even a theoretical diagram for this project?

thanks a bunch. :)

I built two 40ft CAT5 UTP based VGA cables and while this works just fine between my PC and monitor, it doesn't work so well when connected to my Infocus X1.

The project shows the screen correctly for about half a second before it blanks out the screen (with a message that it is detecting the computer source). After about a second of this, the screen shows up and then blanks again -- this goes on in a cycle.

Anyone have any idea why this would happen?

My PC resolution is set to 1024x768 at 75Hz (but I also tried 800x600 with the same results).
Pin connections on the HD15 connectors: 1,2,3 - Orange/Green/Blue wires, 6,7,8 - corresponding white wires, 13,14: Brown/BrownWhite.

TIA,
Ramesh.

may have to use Shielded Twisted pair for this as it has the sheilding that makes the biggest difference. THis is soldered to pint 10

Originally posted by valadorf
Hi there!

How do i create a vga to rgbhv break out cable using a sheilded cat5?

I know that the vga 15 pin has two wires for each color (r,g and b) for the positive/negative but what about the horizontal and vertical?

the vga 15 pin only has one connection for the horizontal and another for the vertical.

I wanter to connect the rgbhv on my plasma recievers vga input.

do you have any kind of wiring diagram or even a theoretical diagram for this project?

thanks a bunch. :)


Not sure if anyone's posted this link yet but it will answer your questions.

VGA or Component from CAT5 (http://www.myhometheater.homestead.com/vgacable.html)

Originally posted by rameshv
I built two 40ft CAT5 UTP based VGA cables and while this works just fine between my PC and monitor, it doesn't work so well when connected to my Infocus X1.

The project shows the screen correctly for about half a second before it blanks out the screen (with a message that it is detecting the computer source). After about a second of this, the screen shows up and then blanks again -- this goes on in a cycle.



Update:

I tried switching to STP as suggested above.

This works if I boot with a regular cable and later switch to the STP cable. But if I boot with the STP cable connected to the projector, the picture is ghosted plus shaking like crazy.

I wonder if this is because of "sync" problems on the infocus X1 (which seems to think that the PC output is at 60Hz even though it is at 75Hz). I'll try upgrading the firmware to see if that fixes it.

Otherwise, I'll be forced to use a temporary monitor for booting my PC :-(

(Sorry, I haven't read all 12 pages of this post, but wanted to provide some feedback nonetheless)

I read this thread a while ago. Made me a 12 meter VGA cable from cat5e FTP (Foilshielded-Twisted-Pair). First I tried without connecting the shield, and results were horrible with a lot of ghosting.
But with shield connected at both ends, I got a very good image, so this seems to agree with the original poster that using the shield lowers the impedance. But makes me wonder how that can be any good for it intended purpose - 100ohm twisted pair for ethernet ???

Up to 1600x1200 60hz, I was unable to tell the difference between this and my regular VGA-BNC monitor cable on my 19" CRT. At higher refresh-rates some ghosting bacame aparant on the cat5e cable.

* Big thanks to the original poster *

I put these cables in the walls of my new home for use with a TV and/or projector and an alternate location for an extra HTPC touch-screen.

------------------

One other tip: If in doubt, also pull 3 or 5 lengths of regular RF antenna cable. Although 5 lengths will be around 2-3 times the price of FTP-cat5e, it is still very cheap for a video-cable. Should be the ultimate way to cable VGA or component. It is well shielded and it is 75 ohm. I did this in adittion to the cat5e for the most critical lenghts - TV and projector.

If You want SVHS, use 2 of these.

Only problem will be making 5 of these fit in a 15-pin sub-D for VGA or 2 into a mini-DIN for SVHS. This will probably require a small circuit-board at each end. But for component, just add RCA or BNC-connectors to each of 3 cables.

Think about the fleksibility 5 x RF plus one FTP-cat5e gives. For example, VGA+SVHS+Component, or 2xVGA, or VGA+2xSVHS+Composite, etc. etc.

And for hdmi or dvi, use 3 cat5e ;)

I haven't read all +400 posts either, but why not CAT6? Actually, one can now buy off the shelf of Fry's a pair of CAT5 multimode ransceivers for $80/each. Unfortunately, its only CAT5, meaning 100mbps, and not 5e.

I am still wondering why consumer-grade SMF transceivers are not affordable considering the cables have come down in pricing (http://www.americantechsupply.com/singmode.htm).

so this seems to agree with the original poster that using the shield lowers the impedance.

No, the characteristic impedance of the cable is dependant on it's construction and materials. There is nothing you can do to change this...BTW, its impedance is 100 Ohms, video circuits are designed to drive a 75 Ohm cable.

I made one of these about 30 feet long ages ago and it has worked great. I remember the big problem was always finding shielded cat5e that was proven to work well and that you didn't have to buy 1000 feet of it. Does anyone know where you can get proven shielded cat5e for 75 ohm video without having to purchase a 1000 feet of it now? It has been so long since I have looked and I am not sure if everyone is having luck with a particular type that can be easily purchased at custom lengths. Just having a few 50 foot runs would work for me.

Thanks.
JP

Hey I was wondering if I could get some help....

My goal is to have a slideshow constantly running on an LCD monitor located in my office's waiting room, which will display information about the company, yatta yatta yatta, you get the idea. The source of the slideshow will be a server, way off on the other side of the office in the server room, whose only purpose is to run that slideshow.
Someone has already pulled a CAT6 cable above the ceiling from the lobby to the server room. Unfortunately, it is about 65-75 ft in length. Before I go through all the trouble of soldering on the heads....can anyone tell me if there is a way to make this work???

No, the characteristic impedance of the cable is dependant on it's construction and materials. There is nothing you can do to change this...BTW, its impedance is 100 Ohms, video circuits are designed to drive a 75 Ohm cable.

Are you sure about that? This process was measured by AMP many moons ago to make a CAT5 shielded cable 78 ohms which is not bad at all.

-Mr. Wigggles

The cable impedance is irrelevant if you use the proper balun . Only a fool would argue against connecting a 300ohm tv antenna to a 75ohm coax cable through a good balun.

In its day, this project led to passive baluns by AMP and other companies.

Now there are many large semiconductor companies working on active interface circuits for sending high-frequency video over cat5 cable. Here's the state of the art in sending SXGA video over 1000 feet of cat5: article (http://www.videsignline.com/howto/164301672)

They are also working on circuits to compensate for the time-skew between the different pairs, and circuits for sending pristine S-Video over 500 feet of cat5.


--Dan

Just wanted to step in and talk about my success with a 50 ft VGA cable using shielded Cat5E. It actually only took me about a half an hour to build.

The picture is solid on my TV. I am running HD15 male connectors on both ends of the cable straight from the video card to the tv. Resolution is set at 1920x1080i. DVD's look great, but there is slight flicker on a static desktop (this is not due to the cable I built, but rather the timing parameters which still need to be fine tuned with Powerstrip.)

Components used:

Power Color Radeon 9600 SE (connected to VGA HD15 Connector)
64" Pioneer SD-643HD5 (Connected to the RGB HD15 Connector)
Cat5E Shielded Twisted Pair ( http://www.cablewholesale.com/prodimages/10x6-521.jpg )
HD15 Male Solder Cup Style Connector ( http://www.cablewholesale.com/specs/3530-11115.htm )
HD15 Metal Hood with Thumb Screws ( http://www.cablewholesale.com/specs/3512-009.htm )

Good Luck. I recommend this to everyone!

The cable impedance is irrelevant if you use the proper balun . Only a fool would argue against connecting a 300ohm tv antenna to a 75ohm coax cable through a good balun.

In its day, this project led to passive baluns by AMP and other companies.

Now there are many large semiconductor companies working on active interface circuits for sending high-frequency video over cat5 cable. Here's the state of the art in sending SXGA video over 1000 feet of cat5: article (http://www.videsignline.com/howto/164301672)

They are also working on circuits to compensate for the time-skew between the different pairs, and circuits for sending pristine S-Video over 500 feet of cat5.


--Dan

The reason this thread has survived for so long is that people aren't reading the entire thread, the first post etc.

By using STP versus UTP and having the shield as a ground you LOWER the characteristic impedance from 100-110 ohms down to something in the neighborhood of 75 ohms. Thumper reported a few pages ago that AMP measured the impedance at 71-74 ohms on post #254 which is very good.

Skew is also not a problem for fairly short runs like those involved here.

Baluns, active circuits etc (which cost $$) are all discussed in this thread.

-Mr. Wigggles

The reason this thread has survived for so long is that people aren't reading the entire thread, the first post etc.

By using STP versus UTP and having the shield as a ground you LOWER the characteristic impedance from 100-110 ohms down to something in the neighborhood of 75 ohms. Thumper reported a few pages ago that AMP measured the impedance at 71-74 ohms on post #254 which is very good.

Skew is also not a problem for fairly short runs like those involved here.

Baluns, active circuits etc (which cost $$) are all discussed in this thread.

-Mr. WiggglesI've followed this thread from the beginning, built a cable way back when with excellent results, and understand the science behind it in exquisite detail. I was just taking a shot at the kooks that show up in every cat5 thread and say cat5 is the wrong cable for video/audio because it isn't 75ohms. Cable impendence is irrelevant when using the proper interface.

What almost nobody realizes is that this design IS a passive balun (crude but effective). cat5 is designed for sending balanced differential signals over twisted-pairs. By grounding one wire in each pair, to send unbalanced single-ended video, you've created a balun and obviously changed the impendence.

The active interface circuits coming onto the market now are converting unbalanced single-ended video into balanced differential signals which are a perfect match for cat5. Skew is a problem at very high resolutions even for short cables (50-100ft.). Intersil now has an ad in trade magazines with a test pattern that clearly show the effect of skew on separate vertical R, G, B lines.

--Dan

Hello, I just found this post and have read most of it. I made a 35' cable out of Cat5e stp. I am still getting ghosting and it is not as good as the VGA cable I was using before. I am trying to connect hd15 to hd15. Anyway I was reading that I could soder all the grounds together then to their repective terminals. Would this fix the ghosting. forgive the unclarity but it is very late and I really want this to work. What do you think? Anything else I can do to make the picture clearer?

-recordsmith

i connected all teh wires to there proper locations then made jumpers to connect all teh grounds. I had no ghosting over 50' of STP. Hope that helps
I did not test without tying all teh grounds together so i don't know if that made teh diff

Thanks, it really worked. It should be said that if you are going to do this DIY cable you MUST combine the grounds!

Thanks
-recordsmith

When you say you made jumpers does that mean you took a striped wire and soldered all the grounds to that. Does it matter if the jumper touches the metal connector casing. What did you do with the foil shield that sheaths all the wires?
Thanks
Lewis

teh foil sheild on teh wire i used was wrapped with a bare wire
i used this bare wire as a ground tehn made small wires that went from ground post to ground post
so on so on
thast what i did

Out of curiousity it would be interesting to know if this is the oldest active thread on this forum.

The thread number is 23,850 and most threads are in the 500,000+ range.

-Mr. Wigggles

And for hdmi or dvi, use 3 cat5e ;)

Hi is it possible to do a DVI - HDMI with cat5?

I havn't found and DVI or HDMI contacts to buy....

Te reson why i want to do my own cable is that i want to place it the wall and the HDMI contact is to thick (20 mm must be < 18 mm).

Or is it possible to buy a HDMI - HDMI cable, cut it and when add the DVI contact?

Robert,

I think Car_rod is joking.

You are going to have serious skew problems using any type of Cat cable for HDMI. (Low skew Cat5 from Belden MIGHT work.)

I would use an HDMI cable and an adapter. Monoprice sells some good stuff cheap and it will probably work well for you. Here's the adapter:

http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=104&cp_id=10419&cs_id=1041902&p_id=2029&seq=1&format=2&style=

be careful HDMI "female" actually has male center. Here's a picture of the adapter's center section:

http://www.monoprice.com/productlargeimages/20292.jpg

and the DVI end:

http://www.monoprice.com/productlargeimages/20291.jpg

-Mr. Wigggles

An alternative to the monoprice adapter is this one from totalsignal.com . It is marginally more expensive, but it was worth it to me to avoid those screw ends that require a mini screwdriver to tighten or loosen.

http://www.totalsignal.com/store/images/fs/f-hdmi-dvi-adapter.gif

tantalus,

Good point. Those screw ends are little annoying when you are trying to attach them to a projector that is on the ceiling.

A couple bucks is probably worth it.

-Mr. Wigggles

I found a solution.

I will buy a HDMI/HDMI cable and a DVI contact from Supra. This is the first contact that make it possible to solder a HDMI - DVI cable. Before solder i will cut one of the HDMI contacts and put the cable in the 20 mm plastic tube in the wall.

According to Supra, if the solder is done properly then it is better then using a HDMI/DVI adapter. According to Supra, to solder a DVI contact is more easy compared to VGA contact.

For more inf. see jenving.se/image/dvi-d.jpg (new aug 2005)

"Another new product of SUPRA’s new connector design. The world´s first rewireable DVI connector. Until now it has been impossible to install DVI cables in conduits, but now Supra makes it possible. The connector is fully shielded by the aluminium housing."

Mr wiggles,

"What Thumper is saying is you need to jumper all of the grounds together with a few small pieces of wire. I don't think it is necessary because the signals are undoubtedly all connected together on the actual graphics card or whatever device you are plugging into that has an HD-15 connector. Soldering all of the little jumper wires wouldn't be that difficult but would require a little finesse and of coarse little more time."

I think i will do a VGA-VGA cable after all. Is it enough to make the cable using only 6 of 8 wires?. I want to use 2 wires to my IR transmitter/receiver

only 6 of 8 from the cat 5: I will do same wirering in both ends,

1. Red
2. Green
3. Blue
4.
5.
6-7-8 and 10 are connected with a small wire and only 10 is used
9.
11.
12.
13. H sync Brown
14. V sync Brown stripe
15.

ok?

Intelix offers a DVI over Cat 5 balun (http://www.avovercat5.com/products/dvi.htm). They will also be releasing an HDMI over Cat 5 balun in early January.

Full product details on the existing line is available at www.avovercat5.com. You can search by signal format.

Squid

squid,

It can not be a balun. There is too much skew in Cat 5 cable for a balun to work - there is no concievable way around this.

They call it a balun but it is an active circuit and probably doesn't have a transformer in it - so it is not a balun. In fact DVI and Cat5 use the same impedance and balanced transmission scheme so on physical layer a balun isn't technically necessary.

The avovercat5 product should be termed a "repeater", "Line Driver" or something similar.

Sorry to be picky but but I don't want any rumors to be spread that all it takes is a couple cheap baluns to transmit DVI over Cat5.

-Mr. Wigggles

Mr. Wiggles,

You are completely correct. The Intelix DVI is not a "balun" but an all digital "extender."

A true balun couldn't handle the juice.

It's called a "balun" to fit in with their other Cat 5 transmission devices.

2. Thumper mentioned early on in this post that he has done quite a few of these and he says for a performance increase go ahead and tie all the grounds together as well as the shield and the ground wire. I assume this one ground would be designated on just one pin of the hd15 plug. Is the consensus that this is worth the effort? I would think it would actually be easier to go through only one solder connection rather than 4 but I haven't gotten my hd15 plug yet so I might be wrong. Any thoughts on this are greatly appreciated.

This is the same question as mine. I have read all 400+ posts but i can't found any answer is it ok to use 6 wire insteed of 9?

hello all, i''m new here. i wanna ask you some question
can i make VGA to component cable to connect form VGA onboard (VGA onboard use chipset intel 815) to my TV
if not, can you tell me which VGA card can work on VGA to component cable ???????

Hey all, I stayed up literally allll night searching for something to fit my needs.....and if you'll bear with me (thank you thank you thank you) maybe you can help me:

1) I have Cat5e UTP (mohawk 57553) running into every room in my house.

2) I just bought a toshiba DLP projection tv with an hdmi, like 3 component inputs, 28 rca inputs...yadda yadda

3) I have a pretty good computer my dad is into all that stuff.

The problem is I like playing games and using msn on computer and when I learnt I could use my tv as a monitor I was all excited; sooo I was wondering if I could comehow hook up my tv in another room as a monitor or secondary monitor to the computer in the other room. I'm actually right above the computer so I'm not worried about keyboards and mouses i just want to know......CAN I DO IT?!?!? I have a computer, a tv with every input immaginable and a house full of cat5e wires....my head hurts....PLEASE help me!!!! :confused: :confused:


Lowered_lifestyle@hotmail

Thinking out of the box a little. The X-Box has a HDTV cable that houses component and audio wires in it. Is it possible to somehow use two of these on each end with cat5e in the middle? A little help and any ideas would be great.

I am not sure how to break out the end that goes to the xbox? If I can find some connector from the xbox end to cat5 this would save breaking out the RCA's.

I read the first 5-pages of this thread, then skipped to the end, please forgive me. One question:

Has anyone tried this with a Leviton face plate in the middle? I'm assuming this would work, because Wigggle originally use the in-Line Splitter, but just wanted to verify.
Edit: I started looking at the leviton quick port inserts, and see a cat 5, cat5e, and cat6 port. I'm assuming that I would want the cat5e version? This won't effect the impedance will it? Or should I just feed the cable through an empty hole in the face plate, and then solder on the HD-15 connector?

Another newbie question. In the first post, Wigggles says what wire gets soldered to what pin. However, I have never done this before, what pin is number 1, and what pin is number 15?

Often, the pins will be numbered adjacent to the pin positions, on one side of the connector. Usually it is in very small raised numbers that are only on one side of the connector.

Describing the positions, and even providing a schematic, can be rather tricky, since you can look at different sides of the connector and get confused by the mirror image, etc.

Your best bet is the numbering present on the connector, if it is there.

Best Regards,
Doug

I would really appreciate help on this. I want to use my BigScreen as a Monitor.

So I work at Radioshack...I was surfing the interent and found this web page. Since I am a new subscriber I can not put links in my replys. If you google search How to make a VGA to Component cable and click on the first link that goes to "myhometheater" it will explain what I did.

I built a VGA to Component cable using regular Cat V cable. Hooked it up to my Nividia GeForce FX 5200 video card and the other end to my Hitachi Big Screen Component Input. I got nothing except for a Blury Screen. Is there any sugestions? Am I doing something wrong? I wired it just for the Pictures show on that link.

You probably need Powerstrip to correct the timing you are sending to your bigscreen.

I found Powerstip's web site. How would I use it to modify the output to be displayed on to my Big screen?

Go into the Powerstrip forum or here at avs and see if anyone has specific timings for your tv. The Powerstrip website should give you the info you need to use the program.

I just finished my cable, and amazingly it works! It is a bit blurry however. I did go longer than what was recommend (40-50 ft). Would this cause the blurryness?

As I was typing this, I was measuring how long my cable was the the picture got really bad shadows (the buttons have a shadow about 1/2 the width of them to the right). Would just moving the cable around while measuring cause this?

Anyway, the cable I have is is about 65' long. I knew it would be long when I made it, but I figured it was easier to shorten it if I had to. I just measured, and I can remove about 9 1/2 feet, and the cable will still be long enough. Would shortening the cable to 55' make a difference, or would it still be too long?

I do have a 25' VGA cable that I could use for part of the distance...would 25' VGA, a female-female adapter, and then 30' of Cat5e STP, cable work better?

Any other ideas?

In regard to the X-Box question....

Sure, take a look at the V3AD (http://www.avovercat5.com/products/v3ad.htm). It is less expensive than the HDMI and it has the component HD performance.

There are diagrams that should give your the basic idea for the setup.

Do you think that I would be ok, if I used a 25' VGA cable and 30' cat5e STP? Or do you think that that would be too long?

Hi MrWigggles

I just wanted to say thanks for the great idea.

I built a 12.5m (41ft) VGA cable using the instructions on the first page. I used cat5 STP and metal dsub hoods as suggested. I also terminated the STP shield wire to pin 10 on both ends.

I have tested the cable on two projectors and a 42" LCD TV, I used a PC (1280x1024x60Hertz), DVD player and XBOX to drive the image and the quality was exceptional. There is no noticeable ghosting, ringing or banding what-so-ever. I blind tested this cable for a couple of video-phile friends and they immediately demanded that I build replicas for them.

The total cost of building the cable (15m STP patch cable, 2 dsub connectors, 2 shielded metal dsub hoods, 10mm heatshrink wrap) was less that £10! (that's about $17.55 for you foreigners :) )

A few tips for other Brit's planning to build these:

1. Buy STP patch cables, it's actually cheaper than buying a reel of STP! I got 15m cables from expansys for £2 + shipping.

2. Twist and tin the wires before soldering.

3. Use a pair helping hands to hold the dsub connectors while soldering.

4. Buy metallised hoods, the ones from Maplin are of a very high quality.

5. Use 10mm shrink-wrap to strengthen the last 2-3 inches of cable as it enters the hoods, this really makes a difference.

6. Use a continuity tester to check each pin before using the cable. The metal hoods should act as a shied so check that too.

I read this thread completely a month or so back...I don't have time to go over it again and just have a quick question. Will this cable wired as spec'd support 1280x768 and 1920x1200? Cable is about 30' in length...
Thanks,
Brendin

xnaron,

1280X768 over that distance should work fine, but the 1920x1200 might be pushing it. You will get something, but I can't guarantee the resulting quality.

-Mr. Wigggles

xnaron,

1280X768 over that distance should work fine, but the 1920x1200 might be pushing it. You will get something, but I can't guarantee the resulting quality.

-Mr. Wigggles


What if I used 5 RG6 cables and connected one of these onto either end http://www.cablesnmor.com/vga-to-5-bnc-cable.html. I have a compression tool and bnc ends. Would this be a better solution? I am running a 42" lcd that has component, hdmi, and pc input. I want to be sure I have the right cables in the wall. I want to be able to support PC output at up to 1920x1200. I've got everything else covered (I think :).

Thanks,
Brendin

Also, please bear in mind this Cat 5 technique is generally meant for cables that use HD-15 connectors on one or both ends. If you have a component output and a component input, I would recommend miniature bundled coax over what I have described here in a heart beat. Belden makes some good cable as well as others.

Wow, what a thread. Still going strong after several years. A surprisingly low number of total posts for a thread that has been in existence this long. I managed to skim through the thread, and the above note (post #188) caught my eye.

Is there are reason that one would be better off using a component cable rather than the STP techniques described herein? I know there are some people in this thread who have used the technique for the 3 compenent video signals, apprently with success.

My main reasons for wanting to try this are: (a) I'm a cheap bastard and (2) I want something relatively thin and flexible. My intended application is a ~30' run of component video from my receiver to my projector. How thick is the mini bundled coax mentioned above in coparison to standard STP? Where can I see it and/or buy it? Most of the compenent cables I have seen are rather thick and unwieldy. If there is a slim solution/alternative available, I would be interested. Especially if it is a cheap solution.

Is there are reason that one would be better off using a component cable rather than the STP techniques described herein?

Unbalanced video circuits are designed to use coax, with a 75 Ohm characteristic impedance.
The capacitance between the center conductor and sheild (ground) is maintained.

STP consists of twisted pairs, with a characteristic impedance of about 110 Ohms, the parallel capacitance between these two conductors and the sheild will vary along the length of the cable, and will change with the geometry (sharp bends etc).
There is an impedance mismatch, when used in a 75 Ohm video circuit as well.

If you can't see any defects in the resulting video signal, then, by all means, use it.

Unbalanced video circuits are designed to use coax, with a 75 Ohm characteristic impedance.
The capacitance between the center conductor and sheild (ground) is maintained.

STP consists of twisted pairs, with a characteristic impedance of about 110 Ohms, the parallel capacitance between these two conductors and the sheild will vary along the length of the cable, and will change with the geometry (sharp bends etc).
There is an impedance mismatch, when used in a 75 Ohm video circuit as well.

If you can't see any defects in the resulting video signal, then, by all means, use it.

Sorry, I should have made my question a little clearer. In post #188 by Mr. Wiggles, it is implied that Cat 5 with cables that use HD-15 connectors is desirable, but that Cat 5 is not desirable when used for component video. So, my question really should have been: "Is there a reason STP is a good idea for HD-15 (VGA) connectors, but not for component video (RCA) connectors?"

My (limited) understanding is that both VGA and component video are spec'd at 75 Ohm impedance, and that the technique described using STP and grounding the shield results in an impedance that approaches 75 Ohm. There may or may not be a slight degradation in the signal, but my understanding is that for certain situations, the diminished video may be worth it for the gains in the flexibility of and ease of installing/fishing Cat 5 cable, and the reduced cost. Doesn't this still hold true, at least to some extent, for component video?

I guess what I really want to know is what is different between the HD-15 connector/VGA and the RCA connector/component video that makes Cat 5 desirable for the former, but not the latter. Or did I just misinterpret Mr. Wiggle's comment?

My secondary question is where I can see (and ultimately buy) thin/flexible coaxial component video cables approximately 30' in length to see if they would be appropriate for my application. Thanks for any help!

"Is there a reason STP is a good idea for HD-15 (VGA) connectors, but not for component video (RCA) connectors?"


No, COmponent video and VGA are very similar, the type of connector doesn';t really matter, neither RCA connectors or HD15 connectors are speced at 75 Ohms. They are used for convienence, not quality.

the technique described using STP and grounding the shield results in an impedance that approaches 75 Ohm

It doesn't though, cat5 is designed to be 110Ohms, between conductors, Grounding the sheild doesn't make it 75 Ohms, and could introduce other problems.


I guess what I really want to know is what is different between the HD-15 connector/VGA and the RCA connector/component video that makes Cat 5 desirable for the former,

Nothing makes cat5 desireable for use in a 75 Ohm unbalanced video circuit....which is what VGA and component are. The only thing I can think of is it's cost, although 3 runs of RG59 isn't that expensive.

Cat5 was designed to be used with differential transmitters and receivers, which can make use of the twisted pairs. Unbalanced video drivers don't.

No, COmponent video and VGA are very similar, the type of connector doesn';t really matter, neither RCA connectors or HD15 connectors are speced at 75 Ohms. They are used for convienence, not quality.



It doesn't though, cat5 is designed to be 110Ohms, between conductors, Grounding the sheild doesn't make it 75 Ohms, and could introduce other problems.
Are you an EE, math major or physicist?
Do you reach that conclusion by transmission line calculation of the complex geometery of the conductors as we are describing? Do you not think that the addition of the shield as a signal ground will not effect the transmission characteristics of the cable?
Better yet do you have network analyzer to test your statement?

In post #254, Thumper stated the following:

OK, alright already

Next week I'll post the new AMP connector assembly part # and photos we've developed. All you'll need to terminate a shielded CAT5E cable to the connector is a knife to strip off the outer jacket, your fingers to push it together and a pair of cutters to trim the excess. Thats it! Perfect HD-15 connections...its even color coded. The performance is very good; better at 40' than our reference RGBHV/5-core quad-shielded cable (won't mention the brand but it costs over $400). At 40' 1600x1200@75 is darn near perfect...its extremely difficult to see the difference from a standard 6' VGA cable even from a few inches from the screen.

I won't get into any arguements here with EEs on cable/hardware impedance/mismatches. Suffice it to say the charactaristic 100 ohm twisted pair impedance of short haul CAT5 when unbalanced at the connectors [properly] yields an impedance approximately between 71 and 74 ohms which is well within the tolerance limits of 75 ohm source/load hardware.

BTW, I don't recommend using RJ45 [shielded] connectors in the loop. For best performance the link should have as few transitions as possible. I prefer the Cat5/VGA connector being inserted directly into the projector input and at the source with a simple gender changer (point-to-point). The cable exits the Cat5/VGA connector at a right angle which means you only need a little over 1" total clearance (including changer) from the PJ to something like a hush box wall.

More to come...

Thumper
Those are the measurements that AMP made with a network analyzer and partially why they created the product in the first place.

Nothing makes cat5 desireable for use in a 75 Ohm unbalanced video circuit....which is what VGA and component are. The only thing I can think of is it's cost, although 3 runs of RG59 isn't that expensive.

Cat5 was designed to be used with differential transmitters and receivers, which can make use of the twisted pairs. Unbalanced video drivers don't.
Transmission impedance is transmission impedance. You can use 300 Ohm strip-line antenna cable (remember those?) or 75 ohm coax to carry a RF signal. The 300 ohm is not shielded so it is not perferred. The outer shield STP changes a lot of that. Also 5 RG59 caox lines is overkill for the 30 foot sections we are talking about here and it is thicker.

The strengths of using STP for unbalanced video are similar today as they were 5 years ago when this thread started. The main difference is now DVI and HDMI are typically the ways to go and via companies like monoprice.com we finally have inexpensive versions of them. For soldering your own HD15 connectors, the STP method described herein is pretty darn good.

-Mr. Wigggles

I think we need to put this in context. Targus is taking the same position as I did very early in this thread. This is not an accepted practice in professional circles and I agree 100%. However I do understand Mr. Wiggles points that the charasteristic impedance could approach 75 ohms and for home or non critical commercial applications this may be just fine.

Look, if it works for your eyes there is no harm in doing this and it is a lot cheaper than coax. Persoanlly I would never so it in my work for program grade signals. But for some crappy VGA menu that needs to go a hundred feet I just might try it some day. Can't be any worse than the off the shelf KVM extenders that convert the 75ohm unbalanced to balanced 110ohm - or do they really do that? Hmmm... with some of these boxes I have used, I suspect they don't. Just shove the video over plain CAT5 pairs.

I think we need to put this in context. Targus is taking the same position as I did very early in this thread. This is not an accepted practice in professional circles and I agree 100%. However I do understand Mr. Wiggles points that the charasteristic impedance could approach 75 ohms and for home or non critical commercial applications this may be just fine.
I certainly wouldn't do it commercially in an HD broadcast truck or studio. Not so much for quality but you don't want someone saying at the end of the day, "Can you believe that guy used CAT5 for the HD signals?" The fact we are talking about HD15's should shed a little bit of light on the target market. (However, I wouldn't call a RCA connector a professional connector either since it is no where near 75 ohms (by its geometry alone), yet it seems to work pretty darn well for our <50MHz signals.)

As far commercial applications, it is worth noting that Thumper was (and probably still is) a commercial installer and he used this technique in many offices, schools, churches etc with identical results to bundled coax. In some cases the applications were plenum and the cost of bundled plenun coax is not cheap.

I've said it many time, if you are making RCA to RCA cables then don't mess with this stuff, but if you are doing HD15 to HD15 then some applications it can be rewarding.

-Mr. Wigggles

-Ps. Going to NAB next week?

Are you an EE, math major or physicist?


EE, what are you?

My occupation, as stated in my public profile, is Electrical Engineer.

-Mr. Wigggles

That's interesting.

I think MrWiggles is pretty much correct, and besides this is all empirical. If STP does the job, then use it. I'm a EE as well, and many years ago did multichip packaging for a company in SJ. We had a TDR to measure Tline impedances on silicon substrates. Since I was an AV guy and for grins, I tested things like speaker wire (14 gauge zip cord) which was 100-110ohms. I didn't test cat5. I would not doubt for a minute that the ground shield would reduce the impedance of STP to 75-80 ohms. Maybe someone out there at Tek or Agilent could verify this. A network analyzer is Ok to use but freq domain measurements are difficult to interpret since we work in the time domain, i.e. skew, ghosting (reflections due to Z mismatch), slew rates, etc. This is all about tline behavior and signal propogation. Discussion of RCA vs HD15 vs BNC is pointless since the prop speed thru a 1/2 inch long jack is about 100ps. And we're using 50 ft runs which will be close to 80-100ns! I'd love to test STP with and w/o the shield but our company doesn't have a TDR. :(

if you are making RCA to RCA cables then don't mess with this stuffDoes that apply to (signal-level) audio as well? (I'm not loooking for audiophile-grade performance - just "TV audio".) If there are issues with running audio signals over CAT5, what are they? Impedance mismatches? Crosstalk? Degraded/diminished signal?

Also, what about s-video over STP?

Donny,

You can still do RCA to RCA cables using Cat 5 shielded (or heck unshielded for simple audio) it is just that the advatanges in terms of simplicity aren't as great as when HD15s are on both ends.

-Mr. Wigggles

Good to hear. Thanks! What about s-video? (I'm thinking about s-video + stereo audio over STP.)

S-video + stereo audio: http://www.avovercat5.com/products/avosva2.htm

Plus, an update:
A new HDTV over Cat 5 product is now available: http://www.avovercat5.com/products/avov3ad.htm

Next week at InfoComm in Orlando we are releasing decora wall plate versions of the baluns.

Tell me, please:

Is it possible to make DVI-I single link cable with 3 STPs?
If not, what kind of cable use best for this?

I am trying to make the VGB to YPrPb, and am having difficulty.
this is what i have done, pins 1-6, 2-7,3-8, and all connect for the y,Pr,Pb. but i dont know what to do with pin 10, 13, 14. i am very confused.

Hi all,
yesterday I built my vga-vga cable (about 4 mt) from a cat.5 utp cable.
Then I connect my pc (radeon x550) with my Loewe LCD Xelos A32: well the quality is good.
But I have a problem.
If I set the resolution 1024x768 60 Hz all is ok and I see my desktop on my LCD.
But if I set the resolution 1360x768 (my lcd panel is 1366x768) I can't see anything to my LCD. :mad:
Is a cable problem?
Should I force the refresh rate to 50 Hz?

I am trying to make the VGB to YPrPb, and am having difficulty.
this is what i have done, pins 1-6, 2-7,3-8, and all connect for the y,Pr,Pb. but i dont know what to do with pin 10, 13, 14. i am very confused.

To my understanding 10, 13 & 14 are not used for a component to HD15 cable. You should be good with the six pins that you already have connected. Someone found that if you connect all three grounds ( pins 6, 7, 8 ) to pin 10 also it improved the signal but it was hit and miss on who saw an improvement. Pins 13 & 14 are used if you are making an RGBHV, which would be 5 RCA/BNC connector instead of the 3 used for component. I hope that helps

Zaner21

Has anyone tried making a single-link DVI-D cable with shielded Cat 5? I want to try it but I'm not sure if it's ok to join the shield pin for the TMDS 1 and 2 together, the pairs are individually shielded and insulated in the DVI-D cable I dismantled. I don't want to short anything.

Here's how I thought I'd connect it:

1 TMDS Data 2- - brown
2 TMDS Data 2+ - brown/white
3 TMDS Data 2/4 Shield - shield wire
4 Not used
5 Not used
6 DDC Clock - green
7 DDC Data - green/white
8 Not used
9 TMDS Data 1- - orange
10 TMDS Data 1+ - orange/white
11 TMDS Data 1/3 Shield - shield wire
12 Not used
13 Not used
14 +5V Power - blue + blue/white

Any suggestions? Am I wasting my time? :)

I measured the opposite end of a cable connected to the PC and the two shielded wires are connected together in the video cars so at least I won't break anything by trying.

Has anyone tried making a single-link DVI-D cable with shielded Cat 5? I want to try it but I'm not sure if it's ok to join the shield pin for the TMDS 1 and 2 together, the pairs are individually shielded and insulated in the DVI-D cable I dismantled. I don't want to short anything.

Here's how I thought I'd connect it:

1 TMDS Data 2- - brown
2 TMDS Data 2+ - brown/white
3 TMDS Data 2/4 Shield - shield wire
4 Not used
5 Not used
6 DDC Clock - green
7 DDC Data - green/white
8 Not used
9 TMDS Data 1- - orange
10 TMDS Data 1+ - orange/white
11 TMDS Data 1/3 Shield - shield wire
12 Not used
13 Not used
14 +5V Power - blue + blue/white

Any suggestions? Am I wasting my time? :)

If the cable is short it might work, but it won't work for longer cables for the following reasons:

1. DVI/HDMI require very tight timing requirements. In CAT5 cable, each pair is turned at a different twists per meter ratio which effectively makes some pairs longer than others. Over 10 meters, that small ratio difference might make a few centimeters difference between one pair and another and thus create out of sync timing. This is known as Skew.

2. You could get low-skew or no-skew cables but then you are more likely to encounter interference problems from adjacent pairs. And a shielded low-skew cable doesn't really solve the problem because the individual pairs aren't shielded which is what you need.

You really need no-skew cable where each pair is individually shielded. The only cables I know that are manufactured that way are DVI/HDMI cables.

I would strongly suggest saving yourself a lot of money and buy a HDMI cable from monoprice dot com. (which is a forum sponsor). They have some great HDMI cables that are really cheap and work really well. I hope they ship to Norway. Even if you needed the bulk cable for some reason, I would still recommend Monoprice cables and just cut the end(s) off as necessary.

-Mr. Wigggles

Ah, I see. My old RGBHV Cat 5 works fine so I'll just use that for now (Benq PE8700+). The main reason for me for using Cat 5 is that it's thin enough to hide and can go around tighter corners than other cables.

Im thinking of this as a cheap way to watch hd on my tv from my pc upstairs. 360 extender looks great, but doesnt support all formats.

Only issue i would have is how the hell would i get sound down from the pc. Would this be possible in the same cable, or would i need 2 seperate cables, and also end up loosing any multi channel benefits.

Im thinking of this as a cheap way to watch hd on my tv from my pc upstairs. 360 extender looks great, but doesnt support all formats.

Only issue i would have is how the hell would i get sound down from the pc. Would this be possible in the same cable, or would i need 2 seperate cables, and also end up loosing any multi channel benefits.

IMO the best way to accomplish this is to run 3 lines of cat-5 through the wall and 1 digital for the audio (granted you must have a digital out audio card and a reciever). This is what I did and I happy to say it works very well. Use some open source pvr software and boom you have video on demand setup.

Why did I do 3 cat-5 lines? 1 was for the vga over cat-5. 1 was for my Remote, and 1 for a spare (which I currently use to play ps2, xbox online).

I do not remember the total cost of the supplies but I am positive it was less than $200 and to me that is a very cheap effective way to accomplish what you were asking.

Hope that helps.

Murd0ck

I'm so glad that I find this thread... I need a 2 in 1 out DVI-I cable cause my display only has 1 DVI-I input!! I have posted a thread in Cable, Digital Cable section: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=755537 May be you guys can give me some advices.

I would need this cable for very short-length, probably around 20cm. Is that a good idea?

This thread is like an old friend that pops up every once in awhile. I was still tweaking my G11 with VGA inputs when this was first posted 5 and 1/2 years ago. In that time it's been viewed over 150,000 times. You have to hand it to Wiggles for creating one of the first timeless posts in AVS history.

This thread is like an old friend that pops up every once in awhile. I was still tweaking my G11 with VGA inputs when this was first posted 5 and 1/2 years ago. In that time it's been viewed over 150,000 times. You have to hand it to Wiggles for creating one of the first timeless posts in AVS history.

Yeah, pretty cool thread. I have something to add to it...

Ok, first I'll point out that I'm not an EE or anything related :) I did read the entire thread (whew!) and I didn't see my question listed anywhere. So go easy if I've misunderstood impedance or any other cable characteristics or terms :)

Before skipping my post, this isn't another standard "Can I use UTP" post but it is related :)

Firstly, I can't find anyone that will sell lengths of STP or FTP here in Aus (plenty of places will sell me 300m boxes though!) and the pre-made STP cables are all quite short (shorter than my requirements anyway). Also, I have a large amount of unused UTP available.

Given that, from my understanding, the shield on the S/FTP is only used to reduce the impedance of the cable and NOT for noise reduction, can I run UTP with a single extra ground wire (of whatever gauge), taped alongside the UTP and soldered to all the other ground wires and soldered to the D-sub shell at each end? Like I said, I'm not an engineer, so I'm not sure about the details of how it works. Will a separate line work or does it have to be in closer proximity (i.e. like the shield is inside S/FTP)?

Cheers,

Scott.

Actually, I found a source of shorter cables, but I'd have to join two of them end-to-end. Can I splice two shielded cables by cutting the plug and soldering them, and joining the shielding? Would that be better or worse than using one of those RJ45-to-RJ45 junction box things? I think I'm pushing it already with the distance that I want to achieve.

Cheers,

Scott.

probably an obvious answer, but it depends a lot on your soldering skills. I am currently using a very nice sony 21" crt monitor I got for $10 because the permanantly installed cable was damaged. I fixed it, being very carefull to rebuild the shields for each signal and such. The end result was very nice monitor that looks as good as the same monitor with an undamaged cable.

I would probably try the connector block first, as it's simple, and if it dosn't work you can try splicing. Once cut, you can't go back.

BTW, I am running my projector using Fry's cat 6, shielded, with a shielded junction box, works great, and the wife really liked the small holes once I explaned the alternitive.

Best of luck!
Ken

RobertSmith888...wrote.........[about what thumper wrote].......
"What Thumper is saying is you need to jumper all of the grounds together with a few small pieces of wire. I don't think it is necessary because the signals are undoubtedly all connected together on the actual graphics card or whatever device you are plugging into that has an HD-15 connector. Soldering all of the little jumper wires wouldn't be that difficult but would require a little finesse and of coarse little more time."
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I have read all 494 posts but i can't found any answer for the question in #443 and #447,
which is ...................."how well does it work to use 6 wire instead of 9 pins [wires etc[B].]"............?

The peeps that tried it or know probably abandoned this thread already...... : [[

Thanx MrWigggles for the monster thread.........tipgrd

Hi

I've made a 10m vga to vga cable from shielded cable. It works fine from my computer monitor to my Macintosh but when I connect from my Mac to my LCD tv there is no signal. A regular 'shop bought' vga cable works fine though.
Any suggestions?

I'm using two Cat5 STP VGA cables in my HT, and yesterday I made two more 6.5 m long cables for audio/video between my HTPC and receiver using Cat5 STP. The first cable carries SPDIF, composite video (Receiver OSD), subwoofer and center channel. The second cable carries L/R fronts and L/R rear channels. It works very well. I bet UTP would have done the job just as well though.

Has anyone tried using STP CAT5 for distances longer than 50'? I see many posts of folks that are using 25 - 50' lengths but nothing longer. I have purchased a 75' manufactured VGA cable, but I am getting severe ghosting. I have read MrWiggles post on creating a VGA cable out of STP CAT5 and gave it a try but when I plug the cable into the LCD TV I get no signal (and yes, I have the other end plugged into the PC) This is roughly a 75’ STP CAT5 cable. ....ANY SUGGESTIONS???

Hi,

I recently bought a pair of AVO-V3AD (made by Intelix) and run CAT6 50 feet to two room from my Comcast HD DVR location. One of them went to Sharp 37" LCD and other to my home theater front projector. I could see the shadow on the right side of the image line, so the picture is not sharp. The text shows the clear shadow on the right. 37" sharp looked ok, since it's smaller size, but the front projector (92") is the worst. I called Intelix and the engineer told me the image should be crispy for 50 feet. My problem might be a grounding problem. I tried to ground Comcast, but no improvement. Did anyone has experience for these. Please help!

Xiaoyu,

Following the instructions given in this thread - I've wired up some Cat5e (Foil Shielded Twisted Pair) cable with three phono/rca plugs (Red Green & Blue) each end to carry Component video around my room (approx 15 metres).

I've noticed slight ghosting on my screen and after reading further it seems like I should "wire my grounds together" to make this disappear.

Before I blow up my new Projector - please confirm that I am doing the right thing.

1) The Grounds of each Phono plug are the outer tube section of the plug (rather than the central pin) - correct?
2) By wiring the Red Green & Blue grounds together I'm not in danger of damaging my equipment am I?

I know this is an old thread and I am a new poster - but 10 seconds of your time would really help put my mind at rest.