Wilmington, NC - HDTV [Text View] - Page 5

foxeng

05-07-08, 12:52 PM

FCC Sets Wilmington, N.C., as Digital-Switch Test Market, Sources Say

By Michele Greppi and Ira Teinowitz

Federal Communications Commission Chairman Kevin Martin is set to announce Thursday that it will run a test of the switch to digital broadcasting signals in Wilmington, N.C., the smallest TV market in the Tarheel state, sources said.

The congressionally mandated national switch to digital takes place Feb. 19. The FCC didn't return multiple calls seeking comment.

The test in North Carolina, Mr. Martin's home state, is likely to take place before the November sweeps ratings period. If things do not go smoothly during the trial run, it could affect stations’ revenues during one of the months used to set advertising rates for the next fiscal quarter.

The Wilmington market, served by affiliates of all the major networks, is the 135th largest measured by Nielsen Media Research, which says 179,760 of the 182,500 homes in the area have televisions.

WWAY-TV, owned by Morris Multimedia, is the ABC affiliate in the area. NBC-affiliated WECT-TV and Fox-affiliated WSFX-TV are owned by Raycom Media. WILM-TV is the CBS affiliate owned by Capitol Broadcasting Co. WMYW-LP is the MyNetworkTV affiliate, and The CW has a cable-only affiliate. The market gets its public broadcast signal from WUNJ-TV.

Local broadcasters did not return calls seeking comment.

FCC Commissioner Michael Copps has been pushing for a test in a small market that met certain criteria, including that all broadcast stations’ digital signals already are on the air on the same channels where they will be found when the official digital switch takes place.

The idea is to learn, among other things, how many TV homes may be unprepared for the transition, which will require viewers to have digital sets, boxes that can convert digital broadcast signals to analog on older sets, or delivery of programs by cable or satellite services.

The sources who confirmed the announcement of the test weren't able to say when it may begin. However, the trial run will be preceded by a big education campaign by local stations about converter boxes and the availability of coupons worth $40 toward the purchase of the converters through local retailers.

Throughout the country, some 1 million coupons have been used as part of the National Telecommunications & Information Administration’s converter box coupon program, according to recent information.

http://www.tvweek.com/news/2008/05/sources_fcc_sets_wilmington_nc.php

jspENC

05-07-08, 04:11 PM

Billy if you're still with us...

I haven't been receiving PSIP on WWAY for quite a few weeks. Might need to kick the generator. ;)

Ken H

05-07-08, 10:45 PM

Wilmington DTV Switch: Sept. 8, 2008
135th Largest DMA To Become First Transition Test Market
By Ted Hearn -- Multichannel News, 5/7/2008 7:09:00 PM
Washington—Wilmington, N.C., will become the first market to switch to all-digital broadcasting on Sept.8, 2008, Wilmington Mayor Bill Saffo said Wednesday.

“We'll be the first in the country,” Saffo said, adding that he was “honored” to have his city take the lead.

The test is slated to begin Monday Sept. 8, a week after Labor Day.

The Federal Communications Commission is planning to announce Wednesday afternoon that Wilmington will be selected as the TV transition test market, an FCC official said.

By law, all full-power TV stations need to terminate analog service on Feb. 17, 2009. FCC Chairman Kevin Martin has been coming under pressure to find a test market to determine the level of preparation in a typical market prior to the national switch over.

FCC Democrat Michael Copps has been nagging Martin for months to find a test market.

"This is very good news for the DTV transition. Real-world experience is an extremely important step—although only one of many—that will help minimize consumer disruption next February. Broadway shows open on the road to work out the kinks before opening night. The DTV transition deserves no less," Copps said in a statement Wednesday night.

Saffo said he is optimistic that his city will be ready to conduct a smooth transition soon after Labor Day.

“The FCC has assured me that they are going to come down here and do everything in their power ...to make this as smooth as possible,” Saffo said. “We look at the FCC as being a partner in this.”

According to Nielsen Media Research, Wilmington is the 135th largest TV market out of 210.

Saffo said he was well-aware that the eyes of the nation would be following DTV developments in his coastal city.

“It's a huge opportunity for Wilmington to pave the way for the rest of country,” Saffo said. “I am looking forward to working with [the FCC] and honored to be the first community in the country to do it.”

Nielsen has cable and satellite TV providers serving 92.6% of Wilmington area households, leaving just 7.4% relying exclusively on free TV. Nationally, the broadcast-only audience ranges from 11% to 19% of households, depending on source of the data.

According to the Center for Public Integrity's media ownership database, the Wilmington market has 10 licensed TV stations.

The city of Wilmington, situated close to the Atlantic shoreline, has a population of 91,137, according to U.S. Census Bureau data for 2003.

Analog TV sets that rely exclusively on free over the air broadcasting will cease to function unless they are adapted to display digital signals.

The federal government plans to spend up to $1.5 billion to subsidize consumer acquisition of digital-to-analog converter boxes. The program allows each household to receive two $40 coupons to defray converter box costs. On Tuesday, the U.S. Commerce Department announced that 1 million coupons had been used since people began applying on Jan. 1.

Saffo said that ensuring broadcast-only viewers were not left behind was essential.

“Obviously we have some concerns,” Saffo said. “Our concern is at those folks who do not have a converter box are going to be given those converter boxes ...”

In theory, cable and satellite TV homes won't be affected by the transition unless they have analog TV sets not connected to one of the pay TV services.

KML-224

05-08-08, 02:36 PM

I wish the broadcasters in Wilmington the best of luck with this one! Don't you think they should work on getting a full-powered CBS station first though?

fosdick1

05-08-08, 04:13 PM

Directv D-11 satellite is not active yet and until it starts programming, I don't think we will get HD locals. Expected date for the satellite is Sept. 2008.

jspENC

05-08-08, 04:27 PM

I wish the broadcasters in Wilmington the best of luck with this one! Don't you think they should work on getting a full-powered CBS station first though?

WRAL and it's parent are the ones holding out on that. It is shocking how they have not tried a bit harder for Wilmington. Maybe someone else should step up and answer the call.

foxeng

05-08-08, 04:55 PM

FCC Confirms Wilmington as Digital Test Market
By Ira Teinowitz and Julieanne Smolinski

Federal Communications Commission Chairman Kevin Martin has formally selected Wilmington, N.C., as the test market for the digital transition.

“It will help us spot issues that we need to address throughout the country,” Mr. Martin told a Washington news conference today, surrounded by the mayor of Wilmington and local broadcasters.

The announcement confirms TVWeek’s report that Mr. Martin would select his home state for the dry run of the congressionally mandated switch.

Nielsen ranks the Wilmington market as the 135th largest of major-network affiliates. Beginning at noon on Sept. 8, WWAY-TV (ABC), WSFX-TV (Fox), WECT-TV (NBC), WILM-LP (CBS), and W51CW (Trinity Broadcasting) will broadcast only digital signals to their viewers in the five North Carolina counties that make up the market.

Wilmington PBS station WUNJ-TV will continue to broadcast in both analog and digital until the national transition, set for Feb. 17. The station is part of UNC-TV, the state’s public TV network; it said today that it was concerned that turning off its analog signal in the midst of hurricane season might deprive viewers of needed emergency information.

Mr. Martin said today that the FCC would have full-time staff in Wilmington through the transition to speak and attend events ranging from the riverfront festival to the blueberry festival. He said the agency would prepare public service announcements, outdoor billboards and posters promoting the transition.

Wilmington was chosen for the test run because all of its commercial stations have completed construction of their DTV channels and are operating at full post-transition power.

Jonathan Collegio, the National Association of Broadcasters' VP of the digital television transition, said in a statement: “The FCC-initiated experiment in Wilmington can shed light on a number of issues surrounding the national DTV transition in February 2009. The results must be objectively reviewed to determine how or whether the findings can be applied nationwide. NAB will be fully supportive of our local television broadcasters in this effort."

FCC Commissioner Michael Copps, who had been to England to watch its switchover, had pushed for a test before the national switch. Today he praised both the FCC and local broadcasters for voluntarily agreeing to it.

“It’s not risk-free. It’s not problem-free,” he said.

While Mr. Martin suggested Wilmington’s switch would offer valuable information, Commissioner Jonathan Adelstein said he was concerned that Wilmington would be more a showplace than a real test. The kind of effort the agency is putting into making sure Wilmington goes right is unlikely to be there when the rest of the country switches.

“The question is whether it is a real test or a staged dress rehearsal,” said Mr. Adelstein.

Broadcasters said they expected some disruption in advertising and viewership during the switch, but that it would have occurred anyway in February.

“Whether we do the transition in September or we do it in February, we are going to have some disruption to work through,” said Jim Goodmon, president-CEO of Capitol Broadcasting, which owns WILM-LP.

“If you don’t know the transition is coming in Wilmington, you won’t be breathing. But I don’t know how we are not going to have a disruption. We are going to have a disruption. We are going to make it as small as we can.”

Paul McTear, president-CEO of Raycom Media, which owns WECT-TV, said the high level of cable and satellite households in the market—93%—together with the number that already have requested discount coupons for converter boxes, meant few households would lose TV service. He predicted the biggest problem would be with second sets.

http://www.tvweek.com/news/2008/05/fcc_confirms_wilmington_as_dig.php

narkspud

05-08-08, 06:11 PM

I'm confused. Is WILM-LP on the air with digital or not?

jspENC

05-08-08, 06:19 PM

I'm confused. Is WILM-LP on the air with digital or not?
I was wondering that as well...?

I'm also wondering what the cable companies in Fayetteville and Jacksonville are going to do about the WECT signal? They both carry 6 on analog cable, and their signal doesn't reach either city...

Do any experts think those areas will lose this channel?

KML-224

05-08-08, 07:12 PM

I thought Fayetteville, NC was in the Raliegh/Durham DMA?

Daryl L

05-08-08, 07:18 PM

I thought Fayetteville, NC was in the Raliegh/Durham DMA?
They are. They get both WNCN 17 and WECT 6. So do we in Lumberton/Pembroke also.

jspENC

05-08-08, 08:29 PM

The WECT analog signal is one of the largest television signals you will ever find. It covers great areas of four different markets, and is on some of the cable systems in each of those markets. Their current digital signal doesn't really cover half of what the analog does, that's why recently they applied to move. I guess their analog tower is so antiquated that it isn't able to house a digital antenna.

http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=TV32560.html

foxeng

05-09-08, 01:10 PM

NEWS
Federal Communications Commission
445 12th Street, S.W.
Washington, D. C. 20554
This is an unofficial announcement of Commission action. Release of the full text of a Commission order constitutes official action.
See MCI v. FCC. 515 F 2d 385 (D.C. Circ 1974).
News Media Information 202 / 418-0500
Internet: http://www.fcc.gov
TTY: 1-888-835-5322

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE: NEWS MEDIA CONTACT:
May 8, 2008 Clyde Ensslin, 202-418-0875
Email: clyde.ensslin@fcc.gov

DTV Transition Premiers in Wilmington, North Carolina
DTV Test Pilot Program to Begin September 8, 2008

Washington, DC – Federal Communications Commission (FCC) Chairman Kevin Martin today
announced Wilmington, North Carolina, will be the first market to test the transition to digital
television (DTV) in advance of the nationwide transition to DTV on February 17, 2009. The
commercial broadcasters serving the Wilmington television market have voluntarily agreed to
turn off their analog signals at noon on September 8, 2008. Beginning at 12:00 pm on
September 8, 2008, these local stations, WWAY (ABC), WSFX-TV (FOX), WECT (NBC),
WILM-LP (CBS), and W51CW (Trinity Broadcasting) will broadcast only digital signals to their
viewers in the five North Carolina counties that comprise this television market.
Representatives of each local affiliate, Donna Barrett, President and CEO of Southeastern Media
Holdings, Inc. (WSFX (FOX)), Andy Combs, Station Manager of WWAY (ABC), Jim
Goodmon, President and CEO of Capitol Broadcasting (WILM-LP (CBS)), Paul McTear,
President and CEO of Raycom Media Inc. (WECT (NBC)), and Colby May, Esq. on behalf of
Trinity Broadcasting (W51CW) made the announcement along with the Mayor of Wilmington,
Bill Saffo, and the President and CEO of the Wilmington Chamber of Commerce, Connie
Majure-Rhett.

The DTV transition for the whole country will take place on February 17, 2009, when all
full power television stations must turn off their analog signals and broadcast only digital signals.
This test market will be an early transition that will give broadcasters and consumers a chance to
experience in advance the upcoming DTV transition. The Commission is coordinating with local
officials and community groups to accelerate and broaden consumer education outreach efforts.
The outreach will focus on the special transition date for Wilmington and the steps viewers may
need to take to be ready by September.

In making the announcement, the Chairman said: "On March 3, 2008, my colleague,
Commissioner Michael Copps, suggested that the Commission engage in real-world experience
readying broadcasters and consumers in advance of the upcoming digital transition, including
test markets that would switch to all-digital service before February 17, 2009. I commend the
Wilmington broadcasters for their pioneer spirit to go first to help the entire country prepare for
the final transition to digital on February 17, 2009. This experience will help us to spot issues
that we need to address elsewhere in the country before next February.”

The Commission identified Wilmington as one of a limited number of potential test
markets to test the transition because all the commercial stations in the market have already
completed construction of their DTV channels and are operating at full post-transition power.
The Wilmington PBS station, WUNJ, will continue broadcasting in both analog and digital. One
other low power station has its digital channel assignment, but will continue broadcasting an
analog signal. The Commission will use the test market as an opportunity to work very closely
in advance with broadcasters, viewers, cable companies and others who will be affected to
anticipate and address any problems. The Commission is also coordinating with NTIA and local
retailers to be sure that digital-to-analog converter boxes are readily available in local stores for
consumers who rely on over-the-air service and have analog televisions.

-FCC-

News about the Federal Communications Commission can also be found
on the Commission’s web site www.fcc.gov.

foxeng

05-09-08, 01:10 PM

CHAIRMAN KEVIN J. MARTIN STATEMENT REGARDING
WILMINGTON, NORTH CAROLINA EARLY TRANSITION

Thursday, May 8, 2008

Wilmington, North Carolina…..
“First in Flight, First in Digital”

(As Prepared for Delivery)

Good afternoon everyone and thank you for being here today. I would like
to give special thanks to Bill Saffo, the Mayor of Wilmington, Connie
Majure-Rhett, President and CEO of the Wilmington Chamber of
Commerce, Acting Assistant Secretary of Commerce, Meredith Baker, and
especially all the Wilmington, North Carolina broadcasters, specifically,
Donna Barrett, President and CEO of Southeastern Media Holdings, Inc.
(WSFX (FOX)), Andy Combs, Station Manager of WWAY (ABC), Jim
Goodmon, President and CEO of Capitol Broadcasting (WILM-LP (CBS)),
Paul McTear, President and CEO of Raycom Media Inc. (WECT (NBC))
and Colby May, Esq. on behalf of Trinity Broadcasting (W51CW) for
participating in this important event today.

Few moments in history have done more to capture the heart of the
American spirit than the Wright brothers' momentous first flight at Kitty
Hawk, North Carolina on December 17, 1903. Just as the year 1903 became
a year for the history books, the year 2008 looks to be another trail-blazing
year for the State of North Carolina.

In the same vein of American spirit, I am pleased to announce that
Wilmington, North Carolina will be the first market in the country to make
the transition to digital television (DTV).

The commercial broadcasters serving the Wilmington television market have
agreed to step up to the challenges of premiering the nation’s DTV
transition. They will all turn off their analog signals at noon on September
8, 2008. Beginning at 12:00pm on September 8, 2008, these local stations,
WWAY (ABC), WSFX-TV (FOX), WECT (NBC),WILM-LP (CBS) and
W51CW (Trinity Broadcasting), will broadcast only digital signals to their
viewers in the five North Carolina counties that comprise this television
market.

The DTV transition for the whole country will take place on February 17,
2009, when all full power television stations must turn off their analog
signals and broadcast only digital signals. This test market will be an early
transition that will give broadcasters and consumers a chance to experience
in advance the upcoming DTV transition. This early test will help us
minimize potential burdens for viewers and maximize their ability to benefit
from it. The Commission is coordinating with local officials and community
groups to accelerate and broaden consumer education outreach efforts. The
outreach will focus on the special transition date for Wilmington and the
steps viewers may need to take to be ready by September.

On March 3, 2008, my colleague, Commissioner Michael Copps, suggested
that the Commission engage in real-world experience readying broadcasters
and consumers in advance of the upcoming digital transition. Specifically,
he suggested test markets that would switch to all-digital service. I
commend the Wilmington broadcasters for their pioneer spirit to go first to
help the entire country prepare for the final transition to digital. This
experience will help us to spot issues that we need to address elsewhere in
the country before next February.

The Commission identified Wilmington as one of only a limited number of
potential test markets because only all the commercial stations in the market
have already completed construction of their DTV channels and are
operating at full post-transition power. The Commission will use the test
market as an opportunity to work very closely in advance with broadcasters,
viewers, cable companies and others who will be affected to anticipate and
address any problems. The Commission is also coordinating with NTIA and
local retailers to be sure that digital-to-analog converter boxes are readily
available in local stores for consumers who rely on over-the-air service and
have analog televisions.

The Wilmington PBS station, WUNJ, will continue broadcasting in both
analog and digital. One other low power station that has its digital channel
assignment will continue broadcasting an analog signal.

I’d like to take a few moments to explain what the FCC plans to contribute
to this effort.

First, we are working closely with all the broadcasters in the Wilmington,
North Carolina market to ensure that they are technically ready to transition
early.

Second, a Wilmington team, comprised of FCC staffers, is poised to be on
the ground in every county of the Wilmington, North Carolina DMA starting
next week for the months leading up to the transition to educate consumers
about this early transition. In addition, others from the Commission plan on
traveling several times to Wilmington, North Carolina in the next few
weeks, July, and again in August to do public events and promote the
transition via the local media.

Third, Ketchum, our outside PR consultant is in the process of developing
15, 30, and 60 second radio and TV PSAs, and outside billboard advertising,
specific to the Wilmington market, highlighting the early transition.

Fourth, we are tailoring specific posters and FCC publications for the
Wilmington, NC market that we will distribute to local county officials and
city government officials, library systems, faith-based organizations,
hospitals, sports leagues, senior centers, and other local grass roots and
community-based organizations.

Finally, we are already planning to participate in the following local events
in the Wilmington, North Carolina area in the near future:

· We'll be onsite at all locally sponsored events where people gather to
discuss the DTV transition, and assist interested consumer in applying
for the converter box coupon program. For example, the River Front
Farmer’s Market, or the Blueberry festival in Pender County which is
held on June 20 and 21.

· We will be making a presentation at the Wilmington City Council
meeting on May 20th.

· We have an exhibit booth space set for the White Lake Water Festival
held in Bladen County on May 16, 17, and 18. At this event we will
pass out flyers and educate people about the transition, especially the
converter box program.

· In Elizabeth Town, we’ll have a table onsite at the 30th birthday party
celebration for their public library on June 26. At this event FCC staff
will pass out flyers, demonstrate the converter box and help people
enroll in the converter box coupon program.

· We already have an agreement with the Director of the Senior Center
in New Hanover to (1) do a workshop at the Senior Center, (2) attend
the May 28 Annual Health & Fitness Fair, and (3) provide literature
for the Home Delivered Meals Program which delivers 312 meals a
DAY to seniors.

· We are setting up “FCC Town Halls” in each county to discuss in an
open format the specifics of the early transition.

· We are working with the retailers with the purpose of hosting “Ask
the FCC” sessions at consumer electronics retailers where consumers
will go to buy digital equipment, including converter boxes.
The FCC is committed to ensuring that no American in Wilmington, North
Carolina is left in the dark. Each of us here today wants to be sure that every
consumer in Wilmington, North Carolina continues to receive their
programming on September 8th, 2008. I look forward to continuing to work
with the local Wilmington broadcasters, the local government in
Wilmington, the NTIA, the cable companies, the satellite companies, the
retailers, the manufacturers, and the consumer advocacy groups during the
coming four months. And I stress that a successful early DTV transition
requires the commitment and cooperation of all of us.

Thank you all for your time and please join me in helping to get the word
out.

foxeng

05-09-08, 01:11 PM

STATEMENT OF COMMISSIONER JONATHAN S. ADELSTEIN ON DTV TEST
MARKET – PRESS CONFERENCE

May 8, 2008

I’m pleased that broadcasters, businesses and elected representatives – especially
Congressman McIntyre and Mayor Saffo – have volunteered their beautiful city of Wilmington, North Carolina, to be the first U.S. city to cease analog broadcasting and go all digital on September 8th – exactly four months from today. I want to thank the outstanding leadership of my colleague, Commissioner Copps, for pressing this excellent idea forward, and Chairman Martin for helping to make it happen.

The Commission has acted on several helpful suggestions made by me, Commissioner
Copps and Members of Congress. With my urging, the Commission has resurrected our internal DTV task force that was misguidedly dismantled two years ago and is now permitting Commission staff – the real experts – to take more of a proactive role in reaching out to communities across the country. With prodding from Congress, the Commission has developed consumer education requirements for broadcasters and others in private industry.

Some would say that the City of Wilmington is quite brave for volunteering to be the test market of an uncoordinated DTV transition process. But the truth is that by completing their transition to digital TV five months before the deadline for the rest of the nation, Wilmington is providing itself and the entire country with a great service.

As somebody who’s played in rock bands, I know that every good band rehearses and
gets it right before it goes on the main stage. In this rehearsal, I hope the FCC will coordinate with not only local broadcasters, but also with local cable operators, DBS operators, state and local governments, local community groups, and local consumer electronic retailers. Significant local involvement supported by the federal government is critical to a successful transition.

Equally important is the Commission’s coordination with the National
Telecommunications Information Administration (NTIA) to make sure that sufficient converter boxes with and without analog pass-through capability are available, that coupons are delivered in time to Wilmington households, and that direct technical assistance is available to senior citizens and other vulnerable populations.

Such level of coordination will truly be unprecedented and, I hope, will give the
Commission a wake-up call of how daunting of a task lies ahead before February 17, 2009. In light of the considerable time and resources the Commission will dedicate to Wilmington, we must address the difficult question of whether we have a similar or comparable plan for the rest of America.

Do we have a coordinated plan? Have we allocated our resources to target the priority or high-risk markets in a comprehensive manner? Are we going to be assigning full-time staff from the Media and Public Safety Bureaus to Wilmington, and if so, will we do so for every other community in America? Will we study what makes Wilmington unique, and not misapply lessons learned there to, say, more mountainous regions? If the answer to these questions is “no,” the real question becomes whether this is a truly representative test case, or just a staged dress rehearsal under false conditions.

If we put massive resources into making this succeed, all out of proportion to what we do elsewhere, will we gain a false sense of complacency? I sure hope not. Ad hoc efforts are not a substitute for a thoughtful, coordinated plan. Every community in America deserves nothing less than what we will put into Wilmington. A failure to plan is a plan to fail.

Perhaps today will be the beginning of the Commission developing a coordinated plan for
all media markets in America.

incus

05-09-08, 06:34 PM

Guess I'll have to still keep my VHF antenna up for snowy analog football games from CBS.

Come on WILM-LP, stop dragging your feet! Your in the national spotlight now.

Incus

jspENC

05-10-08, 12:40 PM

From www.tvtechnology.com

FCC Shutting Off Analog TV Early in Wilmington, N.C.—Is it a Valid Test?

by Doug Lung, May 9, 2008

By now you’ve probably heard about the FCC plan to complete the DTV transition early in Wilmington, N.C. All commercial full power analog stations, WWAY (ABC), WSFX-TV (FOX), and WECT (NBC) will cease analog broadcasting on Sept. 8, 2008.

The FCC news release indicated low-power stations WILM-LP (CBS) and W51CW (Trinity) would also broadcast only digital signals. While it took a little searching, using the FCC’s TVQuery Web page, I found WILM has a CP for a 7.5 kW ERP DTV on Channel 40. W51CW has a CP for a maximum power 15 kW DTV on Channel 51, the same channel it is using for analog. Given that WILM-LP has only 7.5 W on Channel 10, I suspect viewers are having a lot better luck with their DTV signal. WILM has its HDTV program guide posted on its Web site, which proudly proclaims “First in Flight, First in Digital”

The public broadcasting station, WUNJ, will not be turning off its DTV signal. The reason—September is near the peak of hurricane season in North Carolina. This makes sense—there are very few portable TV sets available able to receive DTV and the one I tried didn’t work that well. USB tuners work very well with battery powered laptops, but even with the wide assortment of inexpensive USB tuners available today it is unlikely a significant number of viewers have laptops with one of them installed.

I used www.antennaweb.org to see what other TV stations may be available in Wilmington, NC using the UNC campus as the address. It appears that the only other analog stations that might be receivable are WCTI, Channel 12, the ABC affiliate in New Bern, N.C. and WUNM, the North Carolina Public Broadcasting station in Chapel Hill, N.C. According to AntennaWeb, WPXU in Jacksonville, N.C., is available, but only on its digital Channel 34.

Because all the full power stations and WILM-LP will already be broadcasting a digital signal, they won’t provide any insight on potential problems with digital converter boxes that lack the ability to receive or pass analog TV signals. Depending on when the Trinity station W51CW decides to flash-cut to digital, it may provide some insight on how serious a problem this is, especially with the extensive DTV education effort in Wilmington prior to the September analog turn-off.

Over all, I think this is a good idea. While research tells us how many households rely on over-the-air TV reception, the number of extra TV sets in households with cable or satellite that are being used for over-the-air reception isn’t as clear. Another potential problem involves master antenna systems in hotels, hospitals and apartment houses. If they are processing analog over-the-air TV signals and putting them on different channels for display on analog TV sets or converter boxes, broadcast TV will disappear from these systems when analog is shut off. Wilmington’s early transition should give us an idea if these systems will be a major problem. The FCC news release didn’t indicate the market would turn analog back on if there was a major problem, but I think most readers who have worked with transmitters, especially tube transmitters, know that if they are turned off for an extended period of time they many not turn back on without some problems!

**********************

Some info is incorrect, that being WPXU is only available in digital, and that WILM DT is already on the air.

foxeng

05-10-08, 01:22 PM

The FCC news release didn’t indicate the market would turn analog back on if there was a major problem, but I think most readers who have worked with transmitters, especially tube transmitters, know that if they are turned off for an extended period of time they many not turn back on without some problems!

Sometimes 24 hours is too long of a period for tube transmitters to be off. Once things cool down, it is a crap shoot if it will even turn on, much less go back on the air.

jagmonster

05-13-08, 11:06 AM

Guess I'll have to still keep my VHF antenna up for snowy analog football games from CBS.

Come on WILM-LP, stop dragging your feet! Your in the national spotlight now.

Incus
Exchanged some emails with both WRAL & WILM over the last couple of days about their plans to deliver OTA HD programming to this area. Engineer at WRAL said the goal now is to have the new antenna installed and working by sept 8th instead of year end. Station manager at WILM said she also expected a sept 8 digital launch. SO WE SHALL SEE!!!

nc88keyz

05-13-08, 06:39 PM

Interesting enough, they are only doing it because they are forced to. Otherwise it would have been 2010 for WRAL to take care of its sister station in ILM>

I have a huge bad taste in my mouth for WRAL and the way they handle things in ILM. Directv says you are ineligable for DNS due to the DT-10 LP CBS. What a crock. CBS is only HD on Cable for TWC and Charter.

Even though they sent me an antenna to try and get greenville. After exhausting those options they should have done the right thing and granted a waiver.

I just torrent my CBS HD shows ....Eitherway WRAL Sucks.

You are right because they are being spotlighted they are doing what should have already been done.

Figures.

jspENC

05-13-08, 07:28 PM

I have a huge bad taste in my mouth for WRAL and the way they handle things in ILM. Directv says you are ineligable for DNS due to the DT-10 LP CBS. What a crock. CBS is only HD on Cable for TWC and Charter.

Makes one wonder what kind of deal they have with the cable companies there. Maybe they had an under the table type of deal. They knew they had a sure monopoly by keeping a digital or higher power CBS off the air. There is no other choice this way. It wouldn't surprise me a bit, especially the way "some" of these big companies operate.

nc88keyz

05-13-08, 07:32 PM

Winners find a way to win!

Obee_Juan

05-13-08, 08:34 PM

Howdy all. Having an aggravating experience with the Scientific-Atlanta set top box I have with my TW cable service. Basically, when I first turn the set on, if I access the guide menu or PVR menu, the show being broadcast that shrinks up into the corner to accomodate the menus... stays in the corner when you exit the menu. Only way out is to change to another channel that is broadcast on a different resolution (720p vs 1080i, for ex.). This is with all the supported resolutions checked. Now... if I check only 720p (my TV's native resolution), then I have no way to get that box back to full-screen... ever.

My wife had TW come out today to service the problem, and I'm fed up because he fed her a load of baloney... claimed I had wrong cables (they are new HDMI 1.3a compliant from Blue Jeans Cable), then claimed the box doesn't support HDMI (so why are there HDMI ports?), and told her it HAD to be set to the option for "Wide" because those gray pillar boxes aren't coming from their box (no, I don't want to distort my 4:3 content, tyvm).

Currently, his other solution was to set it to only 1080i resolution. I haven't been able to see if this really solves the problem yet since I'm at work, but anywho...

Has anyone else experienced this problem? And if so, any solutions? And are there any 3rd-party set-top boxes that support digital, HDTV, and dual-PVR that I could consider buying that will work properly? We've generally been aggravated with the experience with this so far (new to HDTV here for 2 months now) and are open to just flat out buying a new set-top box if it works out better.

Rich in ILM

05-13-08, 11:20 PM

Obee_Juan

05-14-08, 12:23 AM

I have 2 set top boxes (HDTV DVR 8300) here and have helped numerous other people around the neighborhood, at various times, get set up and make adjustments. I have never seen this problem. My first 2 guesses would to try changing the HDMI cable as it could be some kind of handshake issue. Second have they tried switching boxes? Which model do you have the 8300 DVR? This is the only box I have had experience on as it seems everybody wants the DVR function. Finally, do you have a neighbor's TV you can try it on?

Hey ya... thanx for replying. This is an odd issue, indeed. Well I foolishly threw away the original HDMI cable that came with the box (which is an 8300HDC), but I only replaced the cable two weeks ago with this new one from BJC and this particular issue has been going on longer than that... it seems for as long as we've had this (2 months or so). I had ordered the new cable because I felt I was getting some signal artifact that could be resolved with a "better" cable, and that much seems to be resolved now. So... I'll see about getting a new pair of cables to try out, but I'm largely skeptical on that one.

My wife had called me while the service guy was here, and all the changes she said he said he had to make... well he didn't make them (or they got reset somehow). My wife had also asked him about replacing the box, which he said he could do. I added yes, please do so but with some other comparable brand/model preferably since we are largely unhappy with this so far. Well that didn't happen either. Needless to say, TW is getting another call from me tomorrow. I don't think this guy did anything about another issue (UniversalHD going AWOL for no real reason hours at a time), or what the customer support person by phone said was clearly an issue with our end when he inspected something remotely.

I don't know anyone offhand who has an HDTV we can try this on. In fact, we've had a parade of people over the first couple weeks to "check it out"... seems I'm an early adopter among the general stragglers out there!

beazster

05-14-08, 12:55 PM

Alternative set-top boxes for Time-Warner?

Ugh! Don't get me started on the incompetence of Time Warner. To your original question about an alternative box- yes and no. You need a cable card to receive digital cable. TWC and other cable companies are using switched digital video (SDV) which allows cable companies to offer more HD channels. SDV requires 2 cable cards which means you need a DVR box that is compatible with SDV and has 2 cable card slots. TWC only offers the 8300HDC. The TIVO HD box is probably the best HD DVR on the market right now but its has only once cable card slot and is not compatible with SDV but they are in the process of releasing an adapter for SDV. In the future there will be more options available to us from other manufacturers.

On to the 8300HDC, just get used to rebooting it every now and then. If you search avs forums you'll notice threats about how buggy this box is. Your problem about the picture not returning to fill the screen sounds like a box problem more so then a cable problem. I would reboot the box and see if it happens. If the problem goes away after a reboot then it is a bug with the box. At this point I would take the box to the TWC store in the mall and switch it with a NEW, not used, box. Do not believe everything you hear from someone at TWC. They are very uniformed about certain things they should be informed about. I have called several times about getting the Discovery Channel in HD and they insist that they offer it. Little do they know they offer HD Theater not the actual discovery channel in HD.

Satelite looks more appealing every day. I got to play with Dish Networks service a few days ago at a friends place and that box could do circles around the 8300.

Obee_Juan

05-14-08, 05:51 PM

Ugh! Don't get me started on the incompetence of Time Warner. To your original question about an alternative box- yes and no. You need a cable card to receive digital cable. TWC and other cable companies are using switched digital video (SDV) which allows cable companies to offer more HD channels. SDV requires 2 cable cards which means you need a DVR box that is compatible with SDV and has 2 cable card slots. TWC only offers the 8300HDC. The TIVO HD box is probably the best HD DVR on the market right now but its has only once cable card slot and is not compatible with SDV but they are in the process of releasing an adapter for SDV. In the future there will be more options available to us from other manufacturers.

Hmm... I'll have to double-check when I get home tonight, but I don't recall seeing CableCards in the back of the device. I do recall the slots though. You do say they must be present though? If they are... that leads me to another question. My TV (Pioneer PDP-5080HD) has a CC slot... do you know if I can simply pop one into the TV and use that? I had first inquired about those since I'd just as soon not have a set top box (never had one before with regular cable), but they claimed that my area doesn't support Cable Card data, or something to that effect.

On to the 8300HDC, just get used to rebooting it every now and then. If you search avs forums you'll notice threats about how buggy this box is. Your problem about the picture not returning to fill the screen sounds like a box problem more so then a cable problem. I would reboot the box and see if it happens. If the problem goes away after a reboot then it is a bug with the box. At this point I would take the box to the TWC store in the mall and switch it with a NEW, not used, box. Do not believe everything you hear from someone at TWC. They are very uniformed about certain things they should be informed about. I have called several times about getting the Discovery Channel in HD and they insist that they offer it. Little do they know they offer HD Theater not the actual discovery channel in HD.

Unfortunately, rebooting the box doesn't fix the problem. I'm wondering now if possibly the problem is my TV, or a combo of the two devices now. We're going to go ahead and return the box for a new one tomorrow and go from there. But yeah, no worries about me believing what they say. When my wife was relaying the tech's claims on the problem (for ex, he said I didn't have the right HDMI cable), I immediately called BS on that, along with the other "fixes" he said were needed. He actually recommended and set the set top boxes to "stretch" the picture so the screen is full when we first got it. I was like "But that distorts the picture. Why would I pay more money to get a screwed-up picture?" Oh yeah... and this time around, he had apparently set the box for 1080i-only, then changed my TV to leave the signal alone. My wife thought it looked wrong... he said it was fine. I get home... find what was wrong is I have the 1080i signal on my 720p TV not being downconverted, so the broadcast was clipped on 4 sides! Even the station logo was half-hidden... shoulda been an obvious clue there.

Satelite looks more appealing every day. I got to play with Dish Networks service a few days ago at a friends place and that box could do circles around the 8300.

I may be looking into that also. I'm downright surprised, if not annoyed, over how little HD content TW actually has. The only thing we're really hesitant over is the poor performance satellite has during bad weather.

Obee_Juan

05-15-08, 11:35 PM

Ok... update. My wife took the SA 8300HDC back to Time-Warner and requested a new box. They only had refurbished ones... oh well... so we settled on that. They were supposed to give her a new HDMI cable... instead gave her component cables *sigh*.

Ok... so with the replacement box, the problem didn't go away. But the box is behaving slightly differently now in other ways... partly for the better... partly not. Additionally... since I didn't get a new HDMI cable, I tried it with the component cable instead... same problem. So without question, the problem isn't the cable OR the connection (digital vs analog).

I've made a few new observations... I'll cut to the chase:
a: When turning on the set top box, if the startup channel is an HD channel (1080i or 720p), the TV's info box shows that the resolution it is getting is actually 480i. And judging by the pixellation of the station logos, that is in fact 480i I am seeing.
b: When I have the above problem, it only goes away when I change to a station that is in a different resolution. For example... changing from a station that is supposed to be 1080i to a station that is supposed to be 720p will result in normal resolutions now and for future channel changes on all channels.
c: As long as an HD channel is incorrectly being sent to the TV as a 480i signal, I get the problem with the picture-stuck-in-corner when accessing the guide menu or other similar full-screen menus.
d: If I set the set top to only support 720p output, then when I turn the box back on, I ONLY get 480i output from it, and no channel changing will fix it.
d: I have no issues of any kind on the normal 480i channels, except as on d.

So the bottom line... the set top box is incorrectly downconverting on startup any channel that is supposed to be 720p or higher, and that problem is only resolved by forcing a resolution change, typically by changing to a channel that is broadcast in a different resolution from the channel that first came up. In situations where 720p or 1080i is the only allowed resolution, then the box is stuck sending 480i only. As long as the HD channel is being incorrectly downconverted, it will get stuck in the corner when accessing a full screen menu.

So offhand, an interim solution would be to set the set top box to a startup channel that is NOT an HD channel, and NOT set 720p as the only selected supported resolution (though doing so normally makes for a smoother channel changes). Ideally though, I'd like to stop the set top box from downconverting HD channels to 480i when first turned on.

Obee_Juan

05-16-08, 12:51 AM

I had a dog... and his name was BINGO!

Ok... I haven't fixed it yet, but now I know what was causing it. I've found that when I use my Harmony Remote to turn off the set top, the resolution drops to 480i, according to the display on the front of the panel. When I use either the TW remote or merely press the on/off button on the set top, the resolution stays where it was beforehand. So the root of the issue is my Harmony remote. Not sure why that is the cause yet... will have to dig into that this weekend, but it should be real easy to sort out now. Thanks for the help.

EDIT: it turns out that if the TV is powered off before the set top box is, then the set top drops to 480i and sticks there, as described earlier. So it's not the Harmony remote per se, but the order of how the devices are turned off, though I don't see why it should matter. Any idea how to stop that from happening?

Oh.. BTW... just HOW do you enter the advanced menu on the 8300HDC? Supposedly you press and hold the Guide and Info buttons while it is turned off, but that gets me nothing. I'm guessing Time-Warner fiddled with it and changed the way you get there?

jspENC

05-18-08, 07:02 PM

I had PSIP for 3.1 for a few days, but it didn't last long.

wdbjbob

05-22-08, 12:17 PM

Are any of you guys old enough to remember when the Wilmington DMA was considerably larger than it is today? Counties are assigned to a particular DMA based on which stations the county's viewers watch. Wilmington historically had a disadvantage because there was no local CBS affiliate. But WECT and WWAY were very popular with people out in the boonies, so the DMA included a number of outlying counties.
If I remember my facts correctly, a New Jersey Air National Guard airplane clipped the top of the tower of whichever was then the ABC affiliate. The tower came tumbling down, and it took forever to get a replacement tower up. Meanwhile the Wilmington market had only one OTA station to compete with multiple OTA stations in adjacent markets. A number of counties switched and never came back.
My in-laws were from New Hanover and Brunswick counties. You folks are living in a beautiful part of the world over there.

foxeng

05-22-08, 01:00 PM

The Wilmington market used to cover up to Fayetteville in the old days. WECT had NBC as primary and CBS secondary for years with WECT taking "As the World Turns" and a few CBS specials a year up until WJKA (now WSFX) went on the air with the short lived CBS affiliation. Most people in the market got their CBS from WNCT Greenville, WTVD Durham (pre-Cap Cities/ABC merger) or WBTW Florence anyway depending on where they were located (in Fayetteville we got both WTVD and WBTW as well as WRAL and WWAY for ABC and WECT was NBC. It was years later with WRDU built the 2000 footer that came down with WRAL's tower in the 90's and changed call letters to WPTF-TV (now WRDC) did we get channel 28 in Fayetteville for NBC but WECT remained THE NBC station.). WILM-LP is a "recent" addition.

There used to a radio station on 980 that had the call letters WILM for years until the Dawson's of Fayetteville (who owned WFNC/WQSM) bought WGNI/WAAV and bought WILM to upgrade WAAV's signal. WAAV was originally a Class IV 1 kW fulltime on 1340, if I remember correctly and WILM was an undeveloped Class II daytimer that, with a city of license change, got to go full time with a bigger signal than the old Class IV frequency. I was working in Fayetteville at the time and had some engineering friends involved in all that change. It seemed wrong at the time because of legacy to change the city of license of a station just to get a authorization change. Of course now it happens all the time. How perception has changed in 20 years.

Anyway, the WWAY tower at Calabash (WECT's analog tower is still the same 2000 ft tower built in the early 60's with no elevator and painted at White Lake) was the tower the ANG plane clipped and brought down. This was either 1978 or 1979 (79 if I am remembering correctly, I was finishing HS at the time and broadcasting was not top of mind :) ) and it took about 3 years to rebuild. The plane made it back to to base in NJ.

jspENC

05-22-08, 03:49 PM

The Wilmington market used to cover up to Fayetteville in the old days. WECT had NBC as primary and CBS secondary for years with WECT taking "As the World Turns" and a few CBS specials a year up until WJKA (now WSFX) went on the air with the short lived CBS affiliation. Most people in the market got their CBS from WNCT Greenville, WTVD Durham (pre-Cap Cities/ABC merger) or WBTW Florence anyway depending on where they were located (in Fayetteville we got both WTVD and WBTW as well as WRAL and WWAY for ABC and WECT was NBC. It was years later with WRDU built the 2000 footer that came down with WRAL's tower in the 90's and changed call letters to WPTF-TV (now WRDC) did we get channel 28 in Fayetteville for NBC but WECT remained THE NBC station.). WILM-LP is a "recent" addition.

Never knew that. Thanks for sharing these points. I think some of the market boundaries need to be addressed again today, but with cable having the upper hand, it's hard to know what exactly people would watch more of since they don't have a second CBS, FOX, ABC on Fayetteville cable today. The only out of market channel they get is 6--The Raleigh channels, particularly 5 & 17, concern themselves as far as news goes with their immediate area (triangle) a lot more than Fayetteville when it comes to local news and weather. WECT back in the 90's (and before)had a news office in Fayetteville and gave good coverage to that community.

MarcS

05-24-08, 09:20 AM

MJinNC

05-28-08, 11:09 AM

When are we going to get more HD channels on TWC??

Rich in ILM

05-28-08, 04:58 PM

Well, we're going on 17 minutes now that WWAY has been playing an old HD test loop, with channel ID, lip synch, etc...

left surround, right surround, left, right, center
left surround, right surround, left, right, center
left surround, right surround, left, right, center

:confused:

What's that control room number again?????

And, now, it seems to be down totally, and has been for several hours. This is via TWC. Can anybody comment on off air. Is WWAY HD on of off?

Billy are you around?

jspENC

05-28-08, 06:22 PM

WWAY HD OTA is not working. Maybe they are working on getting WECT up and running?

butterbars

05-28-08, 06:30 PM

No WWAY-HD ota.

Hope they are back in time for LOST tomorrow.

jspENC

05-28-08, 08:12 PM

WWAY OTA HD is back up.

Handy Mann

05-28-08, 10:27 PM

What's up with WECT OTA? I'm only getting 25% signal. Stanley Cup is unwatchable. :(

Still getting 90-100% on all other OTA channels.

jspENC

05-29-08, 08:44 AM

What's up with WECT OTA? I'm only getting 25% signal. Stanley Cup is unwatchable. :(

Still getting 90-100% on all other OTA channels.

I am in Jacksonville, and was getting a 30% signal in daytime, but lately it has been freezing at times. At night sometimes the signal goes up to near 80%. I had to get a longer mast to get it at all. Antenna is at 30 ft on a rotor, so adding more mast wasn't too difficult, but a very hard station to receive. When they move to WWAY's tower, that should change.

beazster

05-29-08, 10:40 AM

When are we going to get more HD channels on TWC??

I feel your pain and would be surprised if we get anything soon. If we do get anything soon I would bet its gonna be only 2-3 channels. I recently submitted an email to TWC as follows:

Hello, I really feel our Wilmington market is lacking in HD channels. I understand the bandwidth issues and also understand Switched Digital Video technology is the working solution. Is Switched Digital Video currently being used in the Wilmington area? If so, when can we see an expansion in HD channels? A month? Six months? A year? Two years?

Id like to request any of the following; The CW-HD, Travel Channel-HD, Discovery Channel-HD, History Channel-HD, Science Channel-HD, CNN-HD, Weather Channel-HD and HD on-demand movies.

The longer I go without these basic HD cable channels the closer I am getting to switching to satellite.

I appreciate and look forward to your response. Thanks

Response from TWC:

Thank you for contacting us. At this time we have no further information as to if/when additional HD channels will be added to our service. Once further information is made available to us this will be posted on our website at twcnc.com

Please let us know if we can be of any additional assistance.

Thank you for using Time Warner Cable.
Michael
Time Warner Cable Support
Raleigh, NC
919-595-4892
1-866-489-2669

I am getting pretty serious about making the big switch...not analog to digital but cable to satellite. Dish Network has a great deal I think - An HD only package for 29.99. Comes with 40 or so of the top cable channels in HD and thats it and honestly only the channels I personally want. With the DVR service and taxes it will be around $40 a month. Sure beats TWC $80+ package with "free" hd! Ill have to get an antenna to get the locals in HD which leads to the biggest con of this idea...no CBS-HD. Oh Well

MarcS

05-29-08, 09:17 PM

I believe CBS will be going digital along with the other stations in September... (if I correctly recall some previous posts), so I assume it will also be HD, since they now provide an HD feed to TW Cable... (i.e., they have the equipment?)

The question will be of course, will they have enough power? Or will you need a 1kW preamplifier for reception? :)

DirecTv still has more HD channels right now, but their DVR's aren't as user friendly as Dish's (that's based on all the user feedback in the satellite forums at SatelliteGuys). But I think Dish charges more for DVR's...maybe more so in the future due to their legal loss against Tivo?

Oh well, you can go back and forth on that one. If only the satellite receivers had QAM capability, you could go with basic cable for $8 and get all the locals in HD...and not worry about an antenna...

Handy Mann

05-29-08, 10:50 PM

When they move to WWAY's tower, that should change.

I'm getting a 50% signal now. Good enough, but I usually see 80+% from WECT.

WWAY, WSFX and WUNJ all at 100% tonight down here close to Carolina Beach. I thought WECT was already on that tower. Shows what I know.

jspENC

05-30-08, 08:18 AM

Nope, WECT is on the PBS tower in Columbus county where the intersection of 87 and US 74/76 (I think) intersect.

beazster

05-30-08, 10:20 AM

MarcS

05-30-08, 11:00 AM

Known problem... their radiation pattern has a big suckout over parts of Wilmington...

According to posts in this forum, that will be fixed when they both/either change antenna type and relocate? Sorry, didn't pay that close attention to the details, except to note that they are trying to fix the problem...

David-the-dtv-ma

06-01-08, 12:28 AM

I am doing a little experimenting if I can tolerate over the air and I went to Best Buy last night and got myself a cheap $20 indoor non amplified antenna to see what I could get with the bare minimum. I am kind of located in the middle of town by hugh mcrae and I am getting crystal clear WWAY-DT, WSFX-DT and WUNJ-DT. I am wondering whats up with WECT-DT? I couldnt pick up the digital channel at all nor could I pick up the analog signal. According to antennaweb.org and jspENC, WECT-DT comes from the same tower as WUNJ-DT which is why I'm confused as to why PBS is crystal clear and NBC is nowhere to be found. Also 6.1 is the right channel correct? I saw that it will be changing to 44.1 in the near future.They are now on the air as channel 44. But their antenna is on the side of the WUNJ tower at Delco. They did not want to waste any signal into the ocean. Thus the antenna is mounted on the west side of the tower. The tower does such a good job blocking the signal from going into the ocean that from what you say it even keeps it out out the city of Wilmington. They are to share the WWAY antenna on top of the 2000 foot tower. When the spare transmitter is put on the air on the WWAY tower you shouold be able to receive WECT. I they hope to have the low power spare on the air in a month or to some where around July. Then they are going to move the high powered from Delco & have it on the air over the WWAY 2000 tower by the 9-8-08 analog shut down in Wilminton

Trip in VA

06-02-08, 12:21 AM

http://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/cgi-bin/ws.exe/prod/cdbs/forms/prod/prefill_and_display.pl?Application_id=1248155&Service=LD&Form_id=346&Facility_id=167819

WILM-LD has filed to do 15 kW from the tower currently used by WUNJ-DT and WECT-DT (although on the east side of the tower and not the west like WECT-DT).

Finally, a respectable signal for CBS in Wilmington. Not fantastic, but certainly better.

- Trip

MarcS

06-02-08, 09:05 AM

jspENC

06-02-08, 09:11 AM

Not to bad at all. It will cover all of Pender, New Hanover, and Brunswich counties, and most of Bladen and Columbus, with a small part of southern Duplin and Sampson.

beazster

06-02-08, 09:36 AM

Man, that is great news. Just in time for me too. As of this weekend I am cable free and am loving Axe Men and Ice Road Truckers on History-HD through Dish. I guess its now safe to say Wilmington will be enjoying all four digital networks by the time the fall TV season begins and the Sept 8th switch. HD just might turn me into a couch potato. yikes

fosdick1

06-02-08, 10:09 AM

Not to bad at all. It will cover all of Pender, New Hanover, and Brunswich counties, and most of Bladen and Columbus, with a small part of southern Duplin and Sampson.
I currently have Directv and get the Wilmington locals through them. I also get the Hd feeds from a set of rabbit ears.
My question to you is will I lose the locals via Directv when the Sept. transition begins?

jspENC

06-02-08, 10:16 AM

I currently have Directv and get the Wilmington locals through them. I also get the Hd feeds from a set of rabbit ears.
My question to you is will I lose the locals via Directv when the Sept. transition begins?

I suspect not. Directv antenna's are at WECT I believe, and they will upgrade to HD equipment I'm sure before the analog cut-off in the Wilmington market. You should even be able to get the HD signals via D* at that time, if not before with the right box.

Rich in ILM

06-02-08, 10:20 AM

You should even be able to get the HD signals via D* at that time, if not before with the right box.

I'm sorry but I will be amazed if DTV ever gets around to carrying local HD. Have you seen anything to indicate this will happen? Would love to see it but remain skeptical. I have wanted to drop TW ever since they deicded they know better than the customer on things like NFL. BTW TW told me they would have NFL last season!

beazster

06-02-08, 10:55 AM

I currently have Directv and get the Wilmington locals through them. I also get the Hd feeds from a set of rabbit ears.
My question to you is will I lose the locals via Directv when the Sept. transition begins?

They will still be there. DirecTV already broadcasts them in digital. See here (http://www.directstartv.com/directv_local_channels/directv_local_channels.html?zip=28403).

I'm sorry but I will be amazed if DTV ever gets around to carrying local HD. Have you seen anything to indicate this will happen? Would love to see it but remain skeptical. I have wanted to drop TW ever since they deicded they know better than the customer on things like NFL. BTW TW told me they would have NFL last season!

I wouldn't be so pessimistic. Both satellite companies are launching multiple satellites this summer. DirecTV has already expanded their national HD lineup so the new satellites will be dedicated for local HD market expansion. My dish installer said to expect local HD feeds by the 1st of the year 09. He said dish network had sent him upgrade equipment for locals in HD to be added this summer but the first satellite had failed so thats why they are delayed till 09.

jspENC

06-02-08, 11:37 AM

MarcS

06-02-08, 12:40 PM

Let's not get mixed up between digital and HD.

The mandate is for digital, not HD.

A satellite company could carry the locals (whether digital or analog), but that doesn't mean they have to broadcast the HD digital signal... that is all dependent on how much bandwidth they have on their satellites... and because of limited bandwidth for all the locals they carry, usually the signal is compressed.

You're almost always better off with OTA for local HD, IF you can pick up all the locals. The satellite boxes seamlessly integrate OTA into the program guides and channel selection...

With WECT fixing their antenna, and WILM going with some decent power, I'll bet most will be able to get consistent OTA for local HD...

Rich in ILM

06-02-08, 01:10 PM

Directv and Dish will have NO CHOICE but to offer the HD locals, because analog will be off the air Sept 9. They have got to upgrade to digital whether they want to or not.

I'd call them or WECT / WWAy etc and ask what they know about this.

I disagree on no choice. They can just rewrap the digital on their existing SD channels and ignore the HD. I am under the impression they aren't eager, at all, to add HD. Maybe bandwidth? And from what I have seen, in larger markets where they do have local HD a highly compressed picture.

jagmonster

06-02-08, 02:02 PM

I'll believe it when I see it as far as HD locals being transmitted over Directv but really don't care as long as they're available OTA. That is why WILM coming on board with a signal upgrade is SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO important!! So happy since I switched to Directv from TW 18 months ago. Lucky for me I never watched much on CBS before the switch. Now then guys, just get the damn thing working!!!!

foxeng

06-02-08, 02:03 PM

And from what I have seen, in larger markets where they do have local HD a highly compressed picture.

Then you would be mistaken. The HD OTA vs D* HD LIL signals are almost identical. The difference being the MEPG2 to 4 conversion which is more than tolerable. The SD OTA vs SD LIL is a total different story.

MarcS

06-02-08, 02:34 PM

Then you would be mistaken. The HD OTA vs D* HD LIL signals are almost identical. The difference being the MEPG2 to 4 conversion which is more than tolerable. The SD OTA vs SD LIL is a total different story.

You can go to satelliteguys.us and argue that point with all the satellite viewers...

Also depends on what size tv you are viewing. I've got a 58"--big difference between what the signal looks like at that size versus the 40 some inch screens...

foxeng

06-02-08, 04:06 PM

You can go to satelliteguys.us and argue that point with all the satellite viewers...

Also depends on what size tv you are viewing. I've got a 58"--big difference between what the signal looks like at that size versus the 40 some inch screens...

I don't have to. I have D* with the HD LIL and OTA. I have eyes and I can see.

jspENC

06-02-08, 04:10 PM

I don't think there is any question that the bigger the screen is, the worse it's going to look, HD or no HD. Am I wrong on this? I mean you take an image and stretch it to humongous proportions, and it's going to get distorted to some degree....

MarcS

06-02-08, 04:43 PM

I don't have to. I have D* with the HD LIL and OTA. I have eyes and I can see.

And that means you can see the signal quality in all the other cities with HD LiL?

I've got no stake in it--I can only go by what people post...

Trip in VA

06-02-08, 05:10 PM

:eek::eek:

A whole 15kW! I'd better get prepared... (BTW, that is not me, it's an image off the web...)

But your are right, much better than the single digit kW from basically ground level antenna...

15 kW is the maximum amount of power the FCC will allow low-powered stations like WILM-LD to use, and they are not allowing new full-service stations to be allocated at this time... no word on when the FCC will allow such applications.

- Trip

fosdick1

06-02-08, 05:17 PM

Where are you at that you can get Hd locals on D*?

foxeng

06-02-08, 07:39 PM

And that means you can see the signal quality in all the other cities with HD LiL?

I've got no stake in it--I can only go by what people post...

I have seen other markets as well and they look as good as my own market.

Rich in ILM

06-02-08, 08:00 PM

I have seen other markets as well and they look as good as my own market.

I'm not usre there is any real dedication to HD when a weather crawl still brings any HD event down to SD on 2 channels in Wilmington. I mean how long had HD been up here 3 years?

Last summer I was watching football on Direct TV (bar in Chicago) and it was much worse than OTA. It was quite easy to switch back and forth as a coat hanger did quite well for OTA.

jspENC

06-02-08, 09:10 PM

Yea, WECT and WFSX go to SD to put that little flag in the corner that you can't hardly make out from any distance.:rolleyes:

WWAY doesn't even seem to care if you get the warnings or not, and at least their text you can read. One weekend they had a little map with my county in yellow... Was I supposed to be able to know kind of warning that was meant to be?

incus

06-03-08, 12:36 AM

Triple overtime and WECT loses it's HDTV:eek::mad:.

Incus

foxeng

06-03-08, 07:04 AM

I'm not usre there is any real dedication to HD when a weather crawl still brings any HD event down to SD on 2 channels in Wilmington. I mean how long had HD been up here 3 years?

Last summer I was watching football on Direct TV (bar in Chicago) and it was much worse than OTA. It was quite easy to switch back and forth as a coat hanger did quite well for OTA.

Stations dropping out of HD for weather crawls has nothing to do with D* HD LIL PQ..

Rich in ILM

06-03-08, 08:59 AM

Stations dropping out of HD for weather crawls has nothing to do with D* HD LIL PQ..

But, as mentioned, there was quite a difference DTV and OTA in Chicago late last fall.

And I just can't get over, after 3 years of HD, that 2 local stations haven't provided for crawls in HD. Again, IMO it shows how little HD means to WECT and WSFX. I wonder if either studio even has HD monitors set up. Also what the schedule is for HD local origination.

Rich in ILM

06-03-08, 09:00 AM

Triple overtime and WECT loses it's HDTV:eek::mad:.

Incus

Did it drop at midnight?

foxeng

06-03-08, 09:34 AM

And I just can't get over, after 3 years of HD, that 2 local stations haven't provided for crawls in HD. Again, IMO it shows how little HD means to WECT and WSFX. I wonder if either studio even has HD monitors set up. Also what the schedule is for HD local origination.

You only talking about $30k just for the HD crawls. It has to be budgeted just like everything else and with the majority of viewers still watching HD, a station has to ask itself is spending $30k on a HD crawl generator that isn't used everyday worth it for less than 15% of viewing audience. It is a strickly business decision that each station has a different answer for.

And as far as the HD LIL, the earlier markets used some first gen MPEG4 encoders that did have some issues. Those have been changed out and the equipment they are using now is much better and you can see it on air.

Rich in ILM

06-03-08, 09:59 AM

You only talking about $30k just for the HD crawls. It has to be budgeted just like everything else and with the majority of viewers still watching HD, a station has to ask itself is spending $30k on a HD crawl generator that isn't used everyday worth it for less than 15% of viewing audience. It is a strickly business decision that each station has a different answer for.

My thought is it should have been budgeted for the day the encoders were put on line which was 3 years ago.

But I'm from the big city and, I guess, don't understand what it is like to run a station on a shoestring budget.

bstratton

06-03-08, 05:45 PM

I was here when WWAY went digital/HD back in 2002 and although I left for a year or so, I know of about $1.5 ~ $2 million that has been put into going digital and HD here. Its not so much a shoestring budget as is it is impossible to recover the money spent on equipment needed to do this. We are a small market here, 135 at last count, and we don't bring in the money a larger market does like Chicago, so things that seem simple and easy to put into place often is not cost effective for us. So if you had a TV station in Wilmington and the FCC declared that you would have to go digital by 2008, and to do this you would be spending around $1million... You operate day-to-day on your usual budget and you rely on Corporate to budget for the digital conversion. Well they are not into throwing money away either... so you plan on doing your project in phases. You must be legal first, then you can add and improve as your funds allow. We can't charge a penny more for a digital commercial than we do for an analog commercial, so there is no real means to make up the lost funds you put into it. Now I'm sure down the road things will change on that end with various things we can do with the data and other features, but that is not cost permissive at this time (at least for us).

Off on another subject, I think the D* and E* customers will be seeing LIL digital, not HD, here by mid July or so. I would not expect to see local HD on satellite for some time yet... but that is pure speculation on my part.

Obee_Juan

06-03-08, 06:48 PM

Rich in ILM

06-03-08, 08:04 PM

I was here when WWAY went digital/HD back in 2002 and although I left for a year or so, I know of about $1.5 ~ $2 million that has been put into going digital and HD here. .

I guess this the part I don't understand. If $2 million has gone into digital/hd at WWAY I can't believe it cost much less down the street with the other guys. If that's true how did they miss on a $30k character gen? Spend $2 mil on HD you might want it to stay up for major sporting events e.t.c.

Trip in VA

06-03-08, 08:49 PM

This morning I had great DX!

I had an odd window which resulted in no signals from Greensboro or Richmond, relatively weak Raleigh (still enhanced but not as much so as when, say, Florence is coming in) and amazing signal from Greenville and Wilmington. Decoded WITN-DT, WUNK-DT, WCTI-DT, WUNJ-DT, and WECT-DT. Came so close on WWAY-DT but no cigar. I was surprised to not receive WNCT-DT, since that signal had obliterated 10 analog here, but it never even showed signal on my receivers. Also saw signal but never decoded WUND-DT, WYDO-DT, WFXI-DT.

(WUNM-DT shares channel 18 with a local, as does WSFX-DT 30 and WPXU-DT 34, thus I never expect to decode them.)

WCTI's info has already shown up on my site, but I have yet to deal with WECT and WUNJ and WUNK. All of those will be added in the next few days.

- Trip

fosdick1

06-03-08, 10:47 PM

Off on another subject, I think the D* and E* customers will be seeing LIL digital, not HD, here by mid July or so. I would not expect to see local HD on satellite for some time yet... but that is pure speculation on my part.[/QUOTE]

That is not welcome news.
Are those of us receiving their locals via directv getting analog signals currently?

foxeng

06-04-08, 08:14 AM

I guess this the part I don't understand. If $2 million has gone into digital/hd at WWAY I can't believe it cost much less down the street with the other guys. If that's true how did they miss on a $30k character gen? Spend $2 mil on HD you might want it to stay up for major sporting events e.t.c.

I can't speak for Billy or WWAY, but an issue you don't seem to be catching is that while that $2 million purchase is a one time purchase, the monthly operating cost of the station has now dramatically increased because of that purchase. The average monthly cost to operate a VHF transmitter is around $3000. To operate a two tube IOT UHF transmitter (which is the normal size for a 700 kw to 1,000 kW station) is about $12,000 to $15,000 a MONTH, not a year. To put this into some kind of perspective, the average VHF transmitter site only needs a 600 amp 208v connection. To run a 2 tube IOT UHF transmitter you need a 600 amp 480 connection, there is no 208v connection possibility because of the current draw required, the wires would be unrealisticly HUGE and they are big enough now for 480v. This starts to compare to a small factory in power consumption used. For a small market station, that is a considerable chunk of their monthly operating budget that doesn't bring in dime one of additional revenue. While $30,000 seems like chump change to you, to a small station spending $15,000 a month just to keep a license (and that is what it costs in electricity) because if the station goes dark, they loose the license. That is before ANYTHING else is paid for, like taxes, salaries, other accounts payable or capital expenditures and that is what this HD graphics generator is, capital expenditures, and then you must have something to connect to it that will format the crawls correctly and enter the information. It is a lot more than just a graphics generator that puts out 720p or 1080i. And with the economy in the condition it is in, nationally, ad buys are down so the accounts receivable are down as well.

And those are the issues all stations, major or small market, have to deal with. As one example that has gotten a lot of play in the trade papers in the last month, CBS is dealing with the economy issue by sacking a large number of employees at their O & O's and the names that are now gone are not just behind the camera, but big names in front of the camera as well. And as you know, CBS is not a small company. As I said before, money drives the industry no matter what size station it is.

Something else you don't seem to be picking up on is that only 15% of the audience watches in HD. Again, as I said before, based on all the other financial issues a station has to deal with, is that $30k money well spent? I could tell you if you don't like what WWAY is doing, go watch some other station, but they are in the same position WWAY is in and in the end, you wouldn't be watching much TV at all. You can complain and not like it and that is your right, but that is the state of affairs currently and all the complaining in the world isn't going to change it.

It took 20 years before color TV took hold and that transition didn't require a full plant change out of equipment including new transmitters, antennas and many cases, towers. We have done it with digital in half the time and that isn't shabby at all.

jspENC

06-04-08, 09:45 AM

beazster

06-04-08, 10:06 AM

Well I got fed up with Time-Warner after all the aforementioned and unresolvable hassles since going HD and we switched to Dish Network this weekend. So far, sooooooo much the better!

A couple questions about local HD service. My understanding of the HD set top that DN provides is that it is equipped with an antenna to capture local OTA channels and integrate them into the satellite channel listings. What I'm wondering firstly is if I am understanding this correctly, then does the box support ATSC and/or QAM (HD) signals, or just the analog ones that are being phased out? As for the local switch to digital, I realize that "digital" doesn't necessarilly mean "HD". Are the locals broadcasting OTA in digital AND HD, or one or the other? I read that Time-Warner may have an exclusive on HD content with the local stations, further muddling my understanding of the local options here.

I'm largely interested in using my Dish Network box to capture the locals in HD so I can use its DVR features, though if that's not an option, my TV does have a QAM tuner. Any thoughts/experiences with this stuff, or with Dish Network in particular?

ATSC Tuner = Decodes digital OTA TV signals - Required on all digital TVs and Digital tuner boxes.

QAM Tuner = Decodes Cable TV signals - Not required anywhere.

Your dish network box has a ATSC tuner in it but not QAM for obvious reasons. Just hook up an antenna to your dish network box and in the menu go to "Local Channels" and choose the search/scan digital stations option. It will scan for a few minutes and find what it finds. I'm guessing FOX, ABC, and a bunch of PBS stations and seamlessly incorporate them into the program guide. My box picks up 9 digital stations with a cheap $17 antenna.

You will get your HD from Fox and ABC just like you did from TWC - during primetime hours, high rated shows or daytime sports events.

PS - How do you like the ViP722 box? Its a beauty isn't it?

Daryl L

06-04-08, 11:26 AM

Hehe, I'll be doggone if Billy Stratton finally crawled out of the lost & found box. Good to see your still lurking Billy. :)

MarcS

06-04-08, 11:37 AM

Didn't y'all see him on TV????????????

He was explaining some of the DT transition issues...

jspENC

06-04-08, 12:08 PM

I saw Billy. :)

Daryl L

06-04-08, 05:04 PM

Missed him.

Rich in ILM

06-04-08, 05:42 PM

I can't speak for Billy or WWAY, but an issue you don't seem to be catching is that while that $2 million purchase is a one time purchase, the monthly operating cost of the station has now dramatically increased because of that purchase. The average monthly cost to operate a VHF transmitter is around $3000. To operate a two tube IOT UHF transmitter (which is the normal size for a 700 kw to 1,000 kW station) is about $12,000 to $15,000 a MONTH, not a year. To put this into some kind of perspective, the average VHF transmitter site only needs a 600 amp 208v connection. To run a 2 tube IOT UHF transmitter you need a 600 amp 480 connection, there is no 208v connection possibility because of the current draw required, the wires would be unrealisticly HUGE and they are big enough now for 480v. This starts to compare to a small factory in power consumption used. For a small market station, that is a considerable chunk of their monthly operating budget that doesn't bring in dime one of additional revenue. While $30,000 seems like chump change to you, to a small station spending $15,000 a month just to keep a license (and that is what it costs in electricity) because if the station goes dark, they loose the license. That is before ANYTHING else is paid for, like taxes, salaries, other accounts payable or capital expenditures and that is what this HD graphics generator is, capital expenditures, and then you must have something to connect to it that will format the crawls correctly and enter the information. It is a lot more than just a graphics generator that puts out 720p or 1080i. And with the economy in the condition it is in, nationally, ad buys are down so the accounts receivable are down as well.

And those are the issues all stations, major or small market, have to deal with. As one example that has gotten a lot of play in the trade papers in the last month, CBS is dealing with the economy issue by sacking a large number of employees at their O & O's and the names that are now gone are not just behind the camera, but big names in front of the camera as well. And as you know, CBS is not a small company. As I said before, money drives the industry no matter what size station it is.

Something else you don't seem to be picking up on is that only 15% of the audience watches in HD. Again, as I said before, based on all the other financial issues a station has to deal with, is that $30k money well spent? I could tell you if you don't like what WWAY is doing, go watch some other station, but they are in the same position WWAY is in and in the end, you wouldn't be watching much TV at all. You can complain and not like it and that is your right, but that is the state of affairs currently and all the complaining in the world isn't going to change it.

It took 20 years before color TV took hold and that transition didn't require a full plant change out of equipment including new transmitters, antennas and many cases, towers. We have done it with digital in half the time and that isn't shabby at all.

Geez! All this over $30K! Are we about to see small market TV stations around the country fail? It sounds like dire times are ahead!
Sorry to see such good guys locked up in such terrible businesses!

Obee_Juan

06-04-08, 09:06 PM

ATSC Tuner = Decodes digital OTA TV signals - Required on all digital TVs and Digital tuner boxes.

QAM Tuner = Decodes Cable TV signals - Not required anywhere.

Your dish network box has a ATSC tuner in it but not QAM for obvious reasons. Just hook up an antenna to your dish network box and in the menu go to "Local Channels" and choose the search/scan digital stations option. It will scan for a few minutes and find what it finds. I'm guessing FOX, ABC, and a bunch of PBS stations and seamlessly incorporate them into the program guide. My box picks up 9 digital stations with a cheap $17 antenna.

You will get your HD from Fox and ABC just like you did from TWC - during primetime hours, high rated shows or daytime sports events.

PS - How do you like the ViP722 box? Its a beauty isn't it?

Ah... thanks for the clarification. I thought QAM was specific to HD resolution OTA. It looks like they have some sort of antenna on the back and I had thought the installers had set up the locals that way, but I briefly tried to scan for locals and had zero results. I'll double-check that antenna and run a new one if need be.

We are very satisfied with the box. The menus and general remote control operation is much more intuitive than Time Warner's box was. I use a Harmony remote, and with the TW box in use, I had to extensively customize some menus/buttons on the Harmony to be able to get all the needed remote features. No such problems when switching to Dish Network's box.

BTW... that fast-forward and rewind speed on the ViP722 is mad CRAZY! Holy cow... we got dizzy trying to keep up with it!

foxeng

06-05-08, 06:28 AM

Geez! All this over $30K! Are we about to see small market TV stations around the country fail? It sounds like dire times are ahead!
Sorry to see such good guys locked up in such terrible businesses!

TV stations don't print money as some people think. Here is one of the many articles on the CBS layoffs:

http://www.tvweek.com/news/2008/04/layoffs_restructurings_hit_cbs.php

MarcS

06-05-08, 09:07 AM

TV stations don't print money as some people think. Here is one of the many articles on the CBS layoffs:

http://www.tvweek.com/news/2008/04/layoffs_restructurings_hit_cbs.php

And I bet all the top level execs at CBS took pay cuts or freezes, or dropped their perqs, right???? LOL They'll probably get an extra nice bonus due to cost cutting...

bstratton

06-05-08, 03:06 PM

Geez! All this over $30K! Are we about to see small market TV stations around the country fail? It sounds like dire times are ahead!
Sorry to see such good guys locked up in such terrible businesses!

Actually Rich, you are partially correct. In the grand scheme of things, $30k is chump change to a TV station when you figure in the fact that they have spent upwards to $2Million on the digital conversion. What I think you are not seeing in this is that it don't stop with a $30k character generator. I could give you a list today of things we need in order to be completely ready for an all digital/HD plant. Test equipment alone would cost around $300k, or more depending on brands. Monitors, 16x9 format HD/SDI monitors throughout the station, a backup antenna and transmitter, backup microwave gear or even a backup encoder! All these things that would make everyone's viewing more enjoyable and hassle free don't come free. (Although we do have plans to get a backup transmitter this fall)

In a comparison example... Lets say you make $40k a year at your job. You have a house, a car, a cell phone and all the necessary things that go along with these items that you MUST have to maintain your way of life like insurance and electricty. Your budget is $3,333 per month to operate from. It cost you $2,333 per month for all these things you have, and that leaves you about $250 a week for spending on upgrades, repairs and eating dinner out. Well, one day the Govt says you need to add a pool and another story onto your house. The pool don't have to be any certain size, and the extra story to your house only has to have 1 room. Sure, it would be nice to have an olympic size pool and a huge Recreation Room with its own bath plus another bedroom.. but your job still pays you $3,333 per month and you can only do so much or else you will lose your house and car to the bank. So you do the minimum to keep the Govt happy until such a time that you can upgrade to the other things you would like to have.

I can't speak for the other local stations here in Wilmington, although the engineers all are helpful of each other and in some cases very close friends... but here at WWAY, we are doing everything we can to make sure our viewers are getting the best viewing experience possible. Yes, we may have to take down the HD ballgame to post a weather alert crawl right now, but that is something that will be taken care of when it becomes financially practicle. As Foxeng said, right now the economy is a big problem for local television, just as it is for most other businesses. We are not exempt, because when the economy goes down... people stop advertising. When advertising goes down, our revenue goes down... so on and so on. Plus, the price of equipment is dropping on a daily basis... so we could have bought that CG back 2 years ago for $75k, today it may be $30k, next summer it may be $8k. Just figure what you would do if you were in the same shoes as our Corporate folks are. Think from the head and not the heart. We would love to have all the bells and whistles, but if we did that we would have to shut our doors because we couldn't afford to operate anymore.

I think that the TV industry has done an exceptional job in getting to this point as well. This is the most massive industry change of operation that has ever been seen in the US.

And PS... I'm sorry to those of you that had to see me on that spot. It is a clash of cultures... Hic vs Technology! :D

MarcS

06-05-08, 03:31 PM

You did ok on TV... :)

jspENC

06-05-08, 04:51 PM

One thing that I think needs to be addressed that seems to be left out (unless I missed that part) is the antenna portion of the equation when it comes to these converters. I have family over in Sampson county that have a CM 4242 (I believe it is) over their roof that they got after Fran came through and tore down their previous model. They ordered their coupons and had my uncle hook up a converter he already had expecting to see all the same channels they get now, which includes 6. They do not receive 3 off the back of their antenna, as they have it pointing towards Chapel Hill. When they hooked the converter up, they were disappointed that they could not get 4, 6, 7, and 12. I tried to explain to them that the signals are now UHF for those channels and that they would have to have the narrow end of their antenna pointing at the channels they wanted to view, and that they would need either another antenna joined on pointing toward Wilmington for UNC 39 or would need a rotor. They didn't like that idea at all, and told my uncle to take the converter out. LOL - They were surprised at how well channel 9 from Greenville came in with digital, because with analog it looked pretty bad ( it is VHF with DT also). Anyway what I am getting at is folks will need to make adjustments to their antenna in many cases before they are going to get what they want.
My aunt still hasn't made up her mind whether or not to get cable, directv or use the coupons for the converters. I told them I would fix their antenna up, but so far I haven't gotten word whether or not they still want to use it...

Digital isn't just as easy as hooking up the converter in this case. LOL!:eek::rolleyes::D

Rich in ILM

06-06-08, 08:52 PM

I noticed TW rolled out HD movies on demand (pay) today. That will keep me out of Blockbusters for awhile!

fosdick1

06-08-08, 09:08 AM

I noticed TW rolled out HD movies on demand (pay) today. That will keep me out of Blockbusters for awhile!

I sure hope that you have a better selection of movies than Directv provides.

Rich in ILM

06-08-08, 09:24 AM

I sure hope that you have a better selection of movies than Directv provides.

I watched I am Legend last night. Great sound and good video. I would guess about 40 movies available. May be less.

fosdick1

06-08-08, 01:12 PM

I watched I am Legend last night. Great sound and good video. I would guess about 40 movies available. May be less.

Did it cost you anything extra? If I watch it via directv on demand it would cost $3.99

Rich in ILM

06-08-08, 03:07 PM

Did it cost you anything extra? If I watch it via directv on demand it would cost $3.99

Older films are $2.99 newer are $4.99 and some that release with the theater are $9.99 whatever that means.

Rich in ILM

06-08-08, 05:00 PM

.

I think that the TV industry has done an exceptional job in getting to this point as well. This is the most massive industry change of operation that has ever been seen in the US.

Billy,
As you know I think you have done a great job since you returned to WWAY. Quite frankly, IMO, WWAY HD was an ignored mess until you dug into it. Hats off to all the engineers responsible for signals in Wilmington.

What I don't understand is why this has been such a crisis of budget? If I did my research correctly it's been over 10 years since DTV was mandated. Also some fairly local exposure was available as WRAL HD was on the air in 1996!

I can't think of any business planning I was involved in where we had that long to plan for a transition. I know this is nothing that the engineers could of done about this but that was an amazing amont of time to plan and finance a transition. Even if real standards weren't finalized (but I think they were?) I would think a healthy reserve could of been built in that time to correctly fund a complete transition.

Also the industry was blessed with decades of standards not changing and limited (public licenses) competition. Sorry but few businesses have had such a stable platform to work off of. I could give examples of all kinds of industries that have had to be far more agile.

To take this to an extreme point, the guys that pay the bills should of known an HD title generator would be needed since 1997!

jspENC

06-09-08, 03:59 PM

By Press Release

(WASHINGTON, D.C.) – A second FCC-appointed arbitrator has found Time Warner Cable guilty of discrimination against an independent sports network and has ordered that the network be carried by the cable company to more than one million North Carolina households.

The second consecutive arbitration decision against the cable operator dramatically punctuates its years-long campaign of discrimination against MASN, the Mid-Atlantic Sports Network, and paves the way for the return of Major League Baseball and North Carolina sports programming to more than one million North Carolina Time Warner cable subscribers.

The Arbitrator’s decision came after two days of testimony, with a full presentation of evidence and the examination of witnesses. It further builds the case against Time Warner Cable in its efforts to deny local sports programming to its customers that is available on other cable and satellite services in North Carolina.

The Arbitrator denied Time Warner Cable’s request to vacate the previous Arbitrator’s decision that Time Warner Cable discriminated against MASN in favor of its own affiliated programming. In addition, the Arbitrator supplemented the record with new findings of discrimination against MASN, while rejecting Time Warner Cable’s attempted business justification for treating MASN differently than one of the cable giant’s own affiliated networks.

For more than three years, Time Warner Cable has refused to carry MASN, which airs more than 320 Baltimore Orioles and Washington Nationals and more than 200 NCAA Division I college football, basketball and lacrosse contests.

In the historic award, the Arbitrator wrote:

“For the reasons stated above, and based on the applicable standards of federal law, the Arbitrator concludes that TWC did discriminate against MASN.”

“The Arbitrator hereby awards carriage of MASN on TWC’s cable systems in MASN’s North Carolina MLB television territory.”

MASN’s exclusive television territory in North Carolina includes the five eastern Designated Market Areas (DMAs). The network shares telecast rights in two DMA’s in the western-central part of the state.

MASN’s exclusive television territory in North Carolina includes the DMAs of Norfolk-Portsmouth-Newport News, Raleigh-Durham, Greenville-New Bern-Washington, Wilmington, and Florence-Myrtle Beach.

MASN’s shared territory includes the DMAs of Charlotte and Greensboro-High Point-Winston-Salem.

As part of the 2006 Adelphia Order, federal regulators allowed some independent programmers to seek arbitration as a remedy to fairly settle carriage disputes.

“Not one but two impartial arbitrators have now ruled that Time Warner should carry MASN. For the good of North Carolina collegiate sports, the fans and the national pastime, it’s time to move beyond the lawyers and litigating, and get on with delivering this important local programming,” said David C. Frederick, MASN's lead attorney.

“We are ready to make MASN available immediately to all of Time Warner’s North Carolina customers.”

In January, the first Arbitrator appointed by the FCC found overwhelming evidence of Time Warner Cable’s malfeasance towards the independent sports network, MASN.

In the interim award in January, he wrote, “The conclusion that Time Warner deliberately discriminated against MASN is inescapable from the documents and testimony.” He noted that Time Warner “had both motive and opportunity to discriminate” adding that “all of TWC’s efforts went into figuring out ways to avoid putting MASN on the air.”

After Time Warner Cable’s lawyers complained that the first Arbitrator somehow showed bias by speaking to the media after rendering his decision, a replacement Arbitrator was named. After the second two-day arbitration, the replacement Arbitrator reached the same conclusion.

Four of the five largest pay-television providers in North Carolina (including DirecTV, Dish Network, Mediacom and Charter) presently carry MASN on the same terms and conditions as the Arbitrator ordered Time Warner Cable to carry MASN.

For more information, www.masnsports.com and www.playballnow.org

http://www.wnct.com/midatlantic/nct/news/local_news.apx.-content-articles-NCT-2008-06-09-0034.html

fosdick1

06-11-08, 05:05 PM

jspENC

06-13-08, 09:25 AM

Don't forget or (if you didn't know) miss the free premier package weekend on Directv. All the premiums are on, and whatever package you don't pay for in the basic line-ups.

fosdick1

06-13-08, 09:45 AM

Don't forget or (if you didn't know) miss the free premier package weekend on Directv. All the premiums are on, and whatever package you don't pay for in the basic line-ups.

Thanks for the reminder would have missed them.

Rossaq

06-14-08, 10:48 AM

I made the switch from TWC to Dish, saving money and Vip722 instead of sa8300hdc with Navigator. I'm loving it more HD and quality is the same. Only trouble is the locals were in HD with TWC. I need Antenna suggestions. Did a indoor one once and got all the channels but it was just ugly and had to be turned to get some stations. So any low profile indoor or an attic or roof mount suggestion. Model number and place to buy would be nice. Antennaweb shows all the stations in yellow btw.

Thanks.

David-the-dtv-ma

06-15-08, 01:10 AM

I can't speak for Billy or WWAY, but an issue you don't seem to be catching is that while that $2 million purchase is a one time purchase, the monthly operating cost of the station has now dramatically increased because of that purchase. The average monthly cost to operate a VHF transmitter is around $3000. To operate a two tube IOT UHF transmitter (which is the normal size for a 700 kw to 1,000 kW station) is about $12,000 to $15,000 a MONTH, not a year. To put this into some kind of perspective, the average VHF transmitter site only needs a 600 amp 208v connection. To run a 2 tube IOT UHF transmitter you need a 600 amp 480 connection, there is no 208v connection possibility because of the current draw required, the wires would be unrealisticly HUGE and they are big enough now for 480v. This starts to compare to a small factory in power consumption used. For a small market station, that is a considerable chunk of their monthly operating budget that doesn't bring in dime one of additional revenue. While $30,000 seems like chump change to you, to a small station spending $15,000 a month just to keep a license (and that is what it costs in electricity) because if the station goes dark, they loose the license. That is before ANYTHING else is paid for, like taxes, salaries, other accounts payable or capital expenditures and that is what this HD graphics generator is, capital expenditures, and then you must have something to connect to it that will format the crawls correctly and enter the information. It is a lot more than just a graphics generator that puts out 720p or 1080i. And with the economy in the condition it is in, nationally, ad buys are down so the accounts receivable are down as well.

And those are the issues all stations, major or small market, have to deal with. As one example that has gotten a lot of play in the trade papers in the last month, CBS is dealing with the economy issue by sacking a large number of employees at their O & O's and the names that are now gone are not just behind the camera, but big names in front of the camera as well. And as you know, CBS is not a small company. As I said before, money drives the industry no matter what size station it is.

Something else you don't seem to be picking up on is that only 15% of the audience watches in HD. Again, as I said before, based on all the other financial issues a station has to deal with, is that $30k money well spent? I could tell you if you don't like what WWAY is doing, go watch some other station, but they are in the same position WWAY is in and in the end, you wouldn't be watching much TV at all. You can complain and not like it and that is your right, but that is the state of affairs currently and all the complaining in the world isn't going to change it.

It took 20 years before color TV took hold and that transition didn't require a full plant change out of equipment including new transmitters, antennas and many cases, towers. We have done it with digital in half the time and that isn't shabby at all.

Just wondering, How much is the electric bill to run the 5000000 watt erp analog UHF tv transmitter. Then how much is the electric bill to run a 1000000 watt erp digital UHF tv transmitter?

foxeng

06-15-08, 09:09 AM

Just wondering, How much is the electric bill to run the 5000000 watt erp analog UHF tv transmitter. Then how much is the electric bill to run a 1000000 watt erp digital UHF tv transmitter?

These are generalizations and may not be accurate for EVERY single case but it makes the point.

A 5,000 kW analog UHF ERP antenna system will usually run 4 tunes of visual and one tube of aural but some transmitters, like common mode Harris transmitters only run 4 tubes for around 220 kW TPO (transmitter power output) and they run around the $15,000 to $20,000 a month depending on age, tube type and other things. 500 kW to 1,000 kW digital usually runs 2 tubes in the $12,000 to $15,000 a month range. The reason for the difference is the duty cycle on the transmitter.

In analog, the power varies depending on the brightness of the picture. More dark the picture, more power is used. Brighter the picture, less power used. This is called peak power and the average power is called the sync only power and this how analog is measured. But since in analog there is very few times and for short durations does an analog transmitter stay in black, so the transmitter rarely pulls full power for any length of time. When we measure sync only power, we are not in regular programming because it can't be accurately measured in programming due to the varying power output. In digital, the power doesn't vary on average, but the instantanous peaks take more power. 8VSB produces a square wave that is the same power level no matter if you have valid data coming in or not. You can accurately measure it anytime you want and therefore a higher duty cycle that pulls more power constantly.

Most tubes will run 120 kW absolute peak power no matter mode, analog or digital. In analog the "average" power level is higher, in the 60 kW range where in digital the same tube, same channel can only do 25 kW of "average" power because the analog peak power is only 2 times more than "average" where the digital instantanous peaks are 4 times more so you have to have the additional headroom for them.

Also remember the UHF tubes cost around $35k EACH and have average life of 4 to 7 years analog or digital.

Trip in VA

06-17-08, 12:28 AM

Not that it'll probably make too much of a difference, but WUNJ-DT has filed to boost power from 700 kW to 1000 kW, from the same tower and antenna.

- Trip

David-the-dtv-ma

06-17-08, 12:54 AM

These are generalizations and may not be accurate for EVERY single case but it makes the point.

A 5,000 kW analog UHF ERP antenna system will usually run 4 tunes of visual and one tube of aural but some transmitters, like common mode Harris transmitters only run 4 tubes for around 220 kW TPO (transmitter power output) and they run around the $15,000 to $20,000 a month depending on age, tube type and other things. 500 kW to 1,000 kW digital usually runs 2 tubes in the $12,000 to $15,000 a month range. The reason for the difference is the duty cycle on the transmitter.

In analog, the power varies depending on the brightness of the picture. More dark the picture, more power is used. Brighter the picture, less power used. This is called peak power and the average power is called the sync only power and this how analog is measured. But since in analog there is very few times and for short durations does an analog transmitter stay in black, so the transmitter rarely pulls full power for any length of time. When we measure sync only power, we are not in regular programming because it can't be accurately measured in programming due to the varying power output. In digital, the power doesn't vary on average, but the instantanous peaks take more power. 8VSB produces a square wave that is the same power level no matter if you have valid data coming in or not. You can accurately measure it anytime you want and therefore a higher duty cycle that pulls more power constantly.

Most tubes will run 120 kW absolute peak power no matter mode, analog or digital. In analog the "average" power level is higher, in the 60 kW range where in digital the same tube, same channel can only do 25 kW of "average" power because the analog peak power is only 2 times more than "average" where the digital instantanous peaks are 4 times more so you have to have the additional headroom for them.

Also remember the UHF tubes cost around $35k EACH and have average life of 4 to 7 years analog or digital.

I am sure that is a very high bill for the stations that are running 5000000 erp UHF analog & a 1000000 erp. I am surprised that Columbia S.C. did not volunteer to be the fist city to shut down the analog tv since they have 3 UHF stations running 5000000 watts erp. That will sure to be a savings when the shut the analog down. Those that really came out a winner were the stations that will have high band frequencies for the digital broadcast. According to the FCC site there are very few that are going to put digital on low band. The signal to noise radio is so bad at those frequencies & the FCC has the low band digital erp so low I do not think on a 2000 foot tower it would go more that 25 miles except for on a farm alone in the rural area. Even then if there were an electrical storm the picture would be going in an out every time lighting strikes. If WECT tried to put digital on the current channel 6 antenna & tower I do not think you could be able to receive it in Wilmington. So I can understand the decision to turn the VHF low band channels into the FCC when analog is shut down. Maybe the FCC will add the channel 5 & 6 to the FM radio band to open up for new stations. To me that would be an excellent use for them since they are not good for digital TV.I am not sure about the high band channels but I know they must cost less to run VHF high bands digital transmitter at 47000 watts erp that UHF at 1000000 watts erp. I think that UHF will have a better signal to noise ratio that the VHF high band when using those ERP. From me right now that is just a guess because In Myrtle Beach we have only one VHF high band station currently. That is WHMC on channel 9. When WBTW shuts down their analog that is now currently on channel 13 down & puts digital on channel 13 I will see how VHF high band compares to UHF for digital TV broadcasting. So I guess we will see.

foxeng

06-17-08, 08:24 AM

VHF high doesn't have the same S/N ratio problems VHF low does so it is thought that VHF is the place to be but the problem is the FCC has set the interference levels so tight that many stations in VHF high couldn't go back at a meaningful power level if they wanted to. The power cost requirements of VHF high for digital is about 1/5 the cost of UHF operation.

MarcS

06-17-08, 09:16 AM

Not that it'll probably make too much of a difference, but WUNJ-DT has filed to boost power from 700 kW to 1000 kW, from the same tower and antenna.

- Trip

Is that recent? I thought they already had increased their power last year or earlier--I was very marginally involved through the former chief engineer at UNC-TV when their first request for higher power was made...

On a side note, OTA related, I just had a Dish 722 installed, and it seems to have a really good OTA tuner compared to the MyHD MDP-130 I have in my computer.

Using a cheap Radio Shack combo VHF/UHF antenna in the attic (a full size roof antenna), I am receiving all the locals with very high signal strength on the 722, whereas on the MPD-130 both WECT and Fox were sometimes spotty. WUNJ is extremely strong...

Really looking forward to WILM getting their signal out... anyone know when they might start testing? Surely they will test before Sept. 8th...?

jspENC

06-17-08, 09:41 AM

I don't understand WUNJ wanting more power, since there are other PBS outlets around them, one in Jacksonville (Trenton Actually) and one in Lumberton.

The only place I can think that it might be helpful is for folks up in the Clinton area, and Myrtle Beach area.

Rich in ILM

06-18-08, 06:03 PM

I am sure that is a very high bill for the stations that are running 5000000 erp UHF analog & a 1000000 erp. I am surprised that Columbia S.C. did not volunteer to be the fist city to shut down the analog tv since they have 3 UHF stations running 5000000 watts erp. .

But the chairmen of the FCC, Kevin Martin, is a native of Wilmington!

Rich in ILM

06-18-08, 06:05 PM

MarcS

06-18-08, 08:22 PM

I am surprised that Columbia S.C. did not volunteer to be the fist city to shut down the analog tv

But the chairmen of the FCC, Kevin Martin, is a native of Wilmington!

Don't know about Columbia, but Wilmington has a very high penetration of cable and satellite, and being a small DMA, I think the FCC figured the early switch would impact the least number of people in Wilmington.

I thought I heard a figure on tv of something like an 80% penetration...

jspENC

06-18-08, 08:30 PM

Even higher than 80% I believe. More like 93% because there is no CBS on the air with any power. Hopefully cable subscriptions will fall in the future.

Falcon_77

06-18-08, 08:42 PM

Even higher than 80% I believe. More like 93% because there is no CBS on the air with any power. Hopefully cable subscriptions will fall in the future.

92.3%, according to TVB:

http://www.tvb.org/rcentral/markettrack/Cable_and_ADS_Penetration_by_DMA.asp

I don't know how accurate it is, but I have not seen any official government info on rates of subscription vs. OTA television.

beazster

06-19-08, 06:29 AM

I read an article on the FCC site a couple weeks back (cant remember link) and it stated Wilmingtons OTA market was only 17%. One of the lowest in the country. Like jspENC said, probably because of no CBS and issues with NBC.

MarcS

06-19-08, 08:26 AM

Even higher than 80% I believe. More like 93% because there is no CBS on the air with any power. Hopefully cable subscriptions will fall in the future.

So, how do you feel about cable??? :rolleyes:

foxeng

06-19-08, 08:31 AM

The numbers have nothing to do with the number of stations in a market but the number of households with TV's and how they view TV. There are many small to medium markets that do not have all the networks on OTA and they have a smaller number of homes connected than Wilmington. The national average of homes connected to a MVPD is 85%. Wilmington has a higher than the national average

foxeng

06-19-08, 08:33 AM

So FOX and NBC will be saving money when they can shut down their analog transmitters?

Yes. Any station running multiple transmitters will save when they can turn them off.

Rich in ILM

06-22-08, 12:20 PM

Yes. Any station running multiple transmitters will save when they can turn them off.

Just trying to dispell some of the gloom and doom that the industry has had a decade to plan for.
Gotta think it means something to see HD quality stuff going out with the station's logo on it. It's certainly a step forward after close to 50 years of stagnated standards.

jspENC

06-22-08, 01:42 PM

WWAY got their super doppler radar working again. :) Looks like it will be needed today too. Now if they can just get it to display in HD!

foxeng

06-22-08, 07:57 PM

Just trying to dispell some of the gloom and doom that the industry has had a decade to plan for.
Gotta think it means something to see HD quality stuff going out with the station's logo on it. It's certainly a step forward after close to 50 years of stagnated standards.

Something you need to remember is that a piece of equipment costs the same in New York and Wilmington. But the available Accounts Receivable in New York is about 100 times more than Wilmington and I don't care how many years you count, it still doesn't work out the way you are trying to make it. That is the law of economics. One commercial in New York would pay for a months worth in Wilmington. It is that different.

Rich in ILM

06-22-08, 08:16 PM

Something you need to remember is that a piece of equipment costs the same in New York and Wilmington. But the available Accounts Receivable in New York is about 100 times more than Wilmington and I don't care how many years you count, it still doesn't work out the way you are trying to make it. That is the law of economics. One commercial in New York would pay for a months worth in Wilmington. It is that different.

I'm sorry but there still has been a 10 year window to plan for this. A reserve could of been taken each year since the FCC made the ruling. Very very few industries have had this kind of warning or stability. If this market isn't viable just sell the station. My guess is somebody will snap it up in a heartbeat. Final, last time I looked at the finacials, for a TV sation, the biggest expense item by, quite a bit, was the payroll and that is signifigantly reduced as market size goes down. I don't know how, even the major personalities get by in some of these small markets.

bstratton

06-24-08, 04:34 PM

Rich in ILM

06-24-08, 05:10 PM

Rich, I don't want to try to talk you out of your opinion cause I know it can't be done. Sure, the industry as a whole has been planning on this for a long time... but the FCC changes the things in the middle of the game somtimes... closed captioning, PSIP, EAS...etc. I'm not going to make any excuses for why we don't have an HD character generator... we just don't see that its as important as operating legally and putting out a good quality product. Like I said before, I would love nothing more than to have all the neat little boxes and things that would make us have a live HD newscast, as well as putting up syndicated programming in HD. But like the HD character generator, they have to wait until we have the $$ to purchase them.... in order of importance.

Billy,

I can understand both sides of this but what is ironic is all this money has been spent to support HD and yet hours of programming goes SD because of something, imo, should have been budgeted for in the planning process, and a very small percentage of the total.

BTW your station and WILM seem to be much better than WECT and WSFX in this matter. Yours and WILM seem to take a break where the HD comes back. WECT and WSFX just seem to post the warning and leave it on for the whole evening.

Anyway in the scheme world events it's not a big deal.

P.S.

I just saw you on TV! You are a star!
But you didn't even give the secret nerd wave!
Also you guys seem to have the Meghan reporter market covered. Not a bad thing!

jspENC

06-24-08, 08:13 PM

Billy,

I can understand both sides of this but what is ironic is all this money has been spent to support HD and yet hours of programming goes SD because of something, imo, should have been budgeted for in the planning process, and a very small percentage of the total.

BTW your station and WILM seem to be much better than WECT and WSFX in this matter. Yours and WILM seem to take a break where the HD comes back. WECT and WSFX just seem to post the warning and leave it on for the whole evening.

Anyway in the scheme world events it's not a big deal.

P.S.

I just saw you on TV! You are a star!
But you didn't even give the secret nerd wave!
Also you guys seem to have the Meghan reporter market covered. Not a bad thing!

At least the WILmington stations do get the word out for HD viewers... The Greenville/New Bern stations never give the warnings on the main channels to their digital viewers, unless the programming happens to be Standard def... They do however, put the warnings on the secondary channels on 9.2 and 12.3, but 7 WITN never does. So the WWAY and WECT stations are doing better than the higher market 105 in this aspect I believe. I don't see why WSFX doesn't just put a First Alert Radar on 26.2 and give the warnings there instead of that stupid tube TV message.:rolleyes: Then perhaps they could leave WSFX in HD.

I did notice during this last event that WTVD and WRAL stations both now have HD character generators.

David-the-dtv-ma

06-25-08, 12:59 AM

Just wondering. If a tv transmitter is running channel 8 ERP of 316 kw from an bat wing channel 8 broadcast antenna on a 800 foot tower. Also an single channel antenna cut for 8 is measured at 40 foot high at 50 miles out from the tower over generaly flat land. Lets say the signal is an -7 db. Then Both antennas and the transmitter are changed to channel 13 with the same ERP and all things equal, how much lower would the singal be because of the higher frequency. Is there more lost in miles through the air over channel 13 than there is channel 8?

foxeng

06-25-08, 06:36 AM

David-the-dtv-ma

06-27-08, 06:04 PM

The difference between 180 MHz (channel 8) and 214 MHz (channel 13) is not worth fighting over.

Then maybe you can give your view of what took place on a story I am about to tell. In 1954 a station went on the air with a brand new transmitter tuned & tested to channel 8 at the factory. It was connected to a bat wing antenna on at 800 foot tower. The signal was so strong that on some antennas 50 miles out at 40 feet up that the rotor was never used. I know from my own experience that the antenna we had used the V shaped orientation dipoles & the antenna received channel 8 on the side on a Muntz black & white TV better than channel 6. The antenna was pointed with the front to the channel 6 tower that was 57 miles away. Some folks have single channel antenna. They had a channel 8 antenna & a channel 6 antenna connected to a high/low a channel master antenna joiner. The 8 antenna received a –7 on a dB signal meter. As I recall the V shaped elements antenna received about a –11 on the side. In 1962 the owners of the station decided to build a new station. They found that they could not use channel 13 where the wanted to build the new station but the could use channel 8. So they applied with the FCC to change to 13 thus freeing up 8 to be used at the new station. It was approved for the changed by FCC. So the station installed a temp 8 antenna on the side. Then they took down the 8 antenna & installed a 13 antenna on the top. Then at midnight in October in 1962 they disconnected the wave-guide from the temp 8 antenna & connected it to the new 13 antenna. The after a perfectly good transmitter that had cooked in running 8 years on channel 8 was tuned & aligned to run channel 13 in eight hours. The were back on the air the next morning running channel 13.The V shaped antenna did not get 13 at all on the side. It was like they were off the air. Then with the antenna turned & pointed to the 13 tower it barley got 13. But it was so weak to Muntz TV horizontal & vertical were rolling & making it not watchable. But the signal dropped down the –19 off the front of the antenna. The cheap Muntz TV had only 2 IF tubes & was not really intended for weak TV reception. Our neighbors across the street had an RCA with 4 tubes for the IF & it would receive 13 but it so snowy you could barley see the program. The chief engineer tried to convince me that the drop in signal was the higher frequency was all the blame. First he went on to say it was the VHF antennas do not have as much gain on the top channel on the end of the band width of the antenna. So in believing we went & bought a single channel 13 antenna. That brought the signal to a –17 but still very snowy. They claimed that the still had a 316 kW ERP & said they went out & made measurements to confirm the ERP at several locations near & far from the tower. They said that pine tree needles & oak leans attenuate 13 more than 8 & that even the clear air in miles attenuates 13 more than it did 8. They also said that 13 are almost UHF so it will act more like UHF that VHF. I do not claim to be the sharpest knife in the kitchen; But I can read the FCC spectrum chart & 13 is not 462 MHz under 14 [that is at 470 MHz as he would like to have me believe] but 13 is at 214 MHz. The bat wing antenna even though is was an Omni antenna there was some peaks on the pattern. So in 1973 they turned the antenna to send us 5 dB more gain. Then the signal went to a –15.By that time we had a color TV & the snow looked worse in a color TV. I had a TV with a good RF amp in the tuner. The antenna line loss & the signal to noise ratio & sensitivity of the tuner were good enough; therefore the pre amps I tried did not help. So I went & bought a channel master single channel antenna 1013. It had 2 driven dipoles with 7 directors & one reflector. With about a 17 dB gain. This brought the signal to about –11; about where is was when 8 were on the air on the side of the V shape dipole antenna. My calculations are that at the worst case would be between 8 & 13 should have only been a drop of 5 dB.
My guess is that if the either the transmitter was faulty & really way down in out put or the top half of the antenna was bad thus only bottom bays were radiating any signal. I know that channel 12 in Augusta GA had no problem because of the frequency getting into Columbia 60 miles over an 800 foot tower away or did 13 out of Asheville NC. Before I go any more on the story I would like to get your opinion of what you think really happened. I did not believe the stories the engineer told me.

foxeng

06-27-08, 07:57 PM

David-the-dtv-ma

06-27-08, 10:48 PM

You answered your own question by saying other channel 12's and 13's out performed this station on channel 13. My WAG would be that either the channel 13 antenna had a problem, the feed line lengths were incorrect for channel 13 but worked fine for channel 8 (remember, TV stations in VHF use solid copper "coax" and they are usually around 20 ft lengths, I say around because they will have to be certain lenghts more or less 20 ft depending on the channel used, I know 20 ft WILL work for channel 8 but I never checked to see if 20 ft would work for channel 13) or the transmitter was never set up correctly. My guess would be antenna. You see that more than you might think, even today.

What was so strange was they let the transmitter run like that for 18 years knowing is was so much stronger when 8. Like I said they just blamed the frequency & more less said that is the best can do. The carried some of the best of ABC's shows. So when they went to 13 we lost getting to see the shows. But good news did come. While 13 did have 5-dB gain going away from us; In 1964 WWAY 3 went on the air. I am not sure but I heard a major person in our town had part owner ship in WWAY. Then from what I heard WWAY went on the air with an antenna that had an oval shape pattern. To keep most of their signal from going west away from interfering with WBTV 3 & also to keep the signal from going out over the ocean they had the gain going NE to Wilmington & SE straight to us. They also went on the air with a color transmitter. There were not many color TV stations on the air then. Some did add in later but they did not look as good as WWAY. Also WWAY was on a 1200-foot tower. Its signal was about as good as 8 were in its day. I remember then getting those ABC shows back like my 3 sons. But the channel 3 transmitter was not changed to a different channel that the 8->13 transmitter was. Back in those days I put up a lot of TV antennas at the TV shop I worked at. We never had any complaints about getting channel 3. We had complaints all the time about 13 thou. We had customers asking us to fix the TV or the antenna. We would tell them it was the station. You can see what we heard [what I posted earlier] when we tried to get them to fix the station. We had TV cable in town but not many had TV cable service. Most folks thought they did not have the money for the added monthly expense. But I think what we charged for a complete antenna installation would have paid for TV cable for 2 or 3 years. But also some folks got a loan to pay for a new TV some times got he TV antenna installation on the loan too. It is strange how different folks were about monthly bills & money out of their budget in those days. But they considered that once the antenna paid for it self, then from then on the signals were free. By today’s standards I think the antenna would pay for it self in less than a year if it were a turn key antenna job like we did. You would think that with folks in debt, over spending their budget & with the high cost of gas they would be turning off the TV cable & using antennas like we did not many years ago. We may see a return to antenna for free TV signal soon with the current situation in the economy.

foxeng

06-28-08, 01:07 PM

Back in those days you had two issues. One was the cost of the television equipment. It was HUGE compared to radio all because it WAS TV and RCA could charge what they wanted since they held the patent on it and was pretty much the only place you could get it. You literally bought a whole TV station from RCA from the cameras and mics to the antenna and tower!! The station I work for now was one of the "turn key" TV stations from RCA. Right down to the transmitter building layout.

Second was the lack of engineers who understood TV at the time. You could get a 1st Class License easily and didn't have to know anything about electronics. Just memorize the possible questions from what was called "Quicky Schools" or "90 Day Wonder Schools." And with the number of stations that were coming on the air at the time, many a 90 Day Wonder was in charge of radio and TV stations. It was so bad and the state of the art had progressed to the point, that you didn't need the number of engineers as in the past, so the FCC change the way it tested in the 1980's by giving out the actual multi hundred question pools and put the 90 Day schools out of business and we actually started getting a group of good engineers. Then the ownership consolidation in the 90's began and cut the engineer ranks even more and here we are today.

foxeng

06-28-08, 01:16 PM

DO'H!! I just realized which station you are talking about!! WBTW. Yeah, it did start out on channel 8 in the early 50's and the story I heard was that it went broke and dark and the channel went back to the FCC and the new company was issued channel 13 in return. Channel 8 went to High Point and is the station I work for now, WGHP, channel 8, High Point. Just not thinking I guess.

bdfox18doe

06-28-08, 03:25 PM

DO'H!! I just realized which station you are talking about!! WBTW. .

Ah yes.. WBTW.. back when I was at WBTV many years ago..before network distro by satellite..WBTW got CBS from us via microwave..used the old dish on the roof pointed at a flyswatter..

David-the-dtv-ma

06-29-08, 09:38 PM

Ah yes.. WBTW.. back when I was at WBTV many years ago..before network distro by satellite..WBTW got CBS from us via microwave..used the old dish on the roof pointed at a flyswatter..

Yes that is right. That ch 8 antenna that they installed is a good antenna or it was when it was taken down from the tower in Florence. The engineer told me they when the ch 8 antenna was taken down it went the new ch 8 station at the time to go on the air in NC. I was just amazed that they left the coverage problem like that for 18 years. You would have thought that by 1964 they would have known something was wrong. But their engineers were even convinced them selves that the frequency was the cause of the problem. Therefore in 1968 they begain the process to get an 2000 foot tower. They must have not had the funds for it or the FCC must have really move slow. They did not go on the air until 1980. I do not know the design of the 1954 VHF transmitter but I do know about the 1950 era VHF low band two way FM radios. Of course they worked their best as they were delivered from the factory exceeding the specifications. I would say if less that a year or two you could change the frequency & still work like new. But when there were as old as that TV transmitter was [8 years] it was very difficult to get it any where near the specifications if you changed the frequency from one end of it’s operating band to the other. Of course when new or l less than a year they would tune right up. But after the years of heat from those tubes running cooking those coils & the IF transformers tuning slug at the same position it may not work as good after the change. To realign the 2 way radios like when changing the frequency of course you changed the crystal. & According to the Motorola manual you would first screw the tuning slugs all the way out to the edge as wells as the pre-selectors & tuned cavities. Then with the set up meter you would follow the procedure tune one at a time until you completed the alignment. The radio did work but usually not quite as good as it did before.
To many years of heat cooking in these coils transformers cavities & etc at that old frequency with out being moved. I may be totally wrong here may be the 1954 transmitters could run 10 years & be just as good as new & then be returned to a new channel & it still run like new. But I know with those old tube two way radios it was Good luck Ha Ha. Back to the TV in those days, Folks would watch a poor signal, get by & live with it. In 1964 some folks were watching WWAY almost prefect instead of the snowy 13. You would have thought that would have been a wake up call to get the stations fixed. But it went on like that even then for 16 more years. There is enough overlap in signal coverage now. Thus if that happen now the folks would just turn the antenna to the other station & stop watching the weak station. It is interesting to see if any one else was aware of the 8->13 situation or even any one who worked with the station during the change. I know of only one engineer that was at the station before & after the change that is around today. He was the one contacted in the 1960s that blamed the frequency as you saw on my earlier posting on the subject.

jspENC

06-29-08, 10:29 PM

If anyone gets the scoop on when WECT gets going on the WWAY tower, let us know so us distant viewers can give a report. :) I am getting the current WECT signal at 30 percent in the day.

foxeng

06-30-08, 07:51 AM

Yes that is right. That ch 8 antenna that they installed is a good antenna or it was when it was taken down from the tower in Florence. The engineer told me they when the ch 8 antenna was taken down it went the new ch 8 station at the time to go on the air in NC.

I can tell you with the utmost confidence THAT DIDN'T HAPPEN. The antenna that WGHP installed in 1963 when the station went on the air was a NEW antenna, and I have the documentation to prove it. As a matter of fact, that antenna is STILL in service as an auxiliary antenna and had been in main service and the ONLY antenna WGHP had until 2006.

But when there were as old as that TV transmitter was [8 years] it was very difficult to get it any where near the specifications if you changed the frequency from one end of it’s operating band to the other.

That isn't true. You would be surprised the number of 1950 era transmitters that are still operational today in auxiliary service that meet their original specs. You get someone who knows those transmitters and they can make them sing. They won't look as good as a modern transmitter, but handled properly, they will make their original spec. Case in point, the local CBS station has a RCA A Line transmitter from the 1950's at their backup site at the studio that they used in 2001 when they reconfigured their main tower antennas for DTV. They used that transmitter for almost a month and for its age, it looked good on air. Not as good as their RCA F line they bought in the 80's but unless you had an antenna that you had to repoint, you never knew the difference. In order to get that old beast up and running, they had one of the engineers from the 60's come in and refurb that transmitter and he got it looking sweet.

I may be totally wrong here may be the 1954 transmitters could run 10 years & be just as good as new & then be returned to a new channel & it still run like new. But I know with those old tube two way radios it was Good luck Ha Ha.

TV transmitters of that era are not like GE Pre-Progs or Motorola TU-144's and that vintage 2 way radio gear. Because of the cost of transmitters, they are built to last at least 20 years of service if you don't take care of them at all and most transmitters from that era were pampered and that is why you still find some around today.

Retspin

06-30-08, 11:31 AM

[QUOTE=foxeng;14179295]Back in those days you had two issues. One was the cost of the television equipment. It was HUGE compared to radio all because it WAS TV and RCA could charge what they wanted since they held the patent on it and was pretty much the only place you could get it. You literally bought a whole TV station from RCA from the cameras and mics to the antenna and tower!! The station I work for now was one of the "turn key" TV stations from RCA. Right down to the transmitter building layout.

Foxeng,
What ever happened to RCA Broadcast? I was wondering why they got out of the broadcast equipment business since they had transmitters all over the place.

foxeng

06-30-08, 12:06 PM

Foxeng,
What ever happened to RCA Broadcast? I was wondering why they got out of the broadcast equipment business since they had transmitters all over the place.

Back in the 80's you had several things happen. One, David Sarnoff who had run RCA for years died in 1979 and his son was put in charge and made some pretty bad business decisions. RCA got into a law suit with a station on how an antenna was modeled for coverage area. RCA lost big time on that one. Combined with the increase in other broadcast manufacturers and RCA's arrogance and high pricing, RCA got pushed out of the transmit end of the business. By 1983, what was once a huge broadcast interest was all but a shell having sold the RCA consumer name to Thomson and running NBC and its broadcast stations. GE bought RCA in 1985 and the rest is history.

Rich in ILM

06-30-08, 12:43 PM

Back in the 80's you had several things happen. One, David Sarnoff who had run RCA for years died in 1979 and his son was put in charge and made some pretty bad business decisions. RCA got into a law suit with a station on how an antenna was modeled for coverage area. RCA lost big time on that one. Combined with the increase in other broadcast manufacturers and RCA's arrogance and high pricing, RCA got pushed out of the transmit end of the business. By 1983, what was once a huge broadcast interest was all but a shell having sold the RCA consumer name to Thomson and running NBC and its broadcast stations. GE bought RCA in 1985 and the rest is history.

I, briefly, dealt with both RCA's computer and cable TV entry attempts. It was second rate and late in both cases with sales people ill equipped to deal in the real world.
IMO IBM would of faced the same fate if they didn't have such huge installed base and brainwashed IT managers. Even though IBM survived, and still has market share, they sat with their hands securely plugging their ears as several companies blew by them. It used to be high comedy to watch IBM roll out their "better than Cisco" marketing plan.

David-the-dtv-ma

06-30-08, 12:45 PM

II agree. I do know something was wrong with their coverage after the change thou. I still do not belive that the frequency was the blame as the engineer told me. What he told me was mostly wrong any way like what he told me happend to the ch 8 antenna. As strange as it be thou the ovwners believed the engineers also. Instead of getting what was ever wrong corrected the belived 13 was almost UHF so it acted like UHF. UHF does seems to preform better from more height than from more power. They believed him & went about getting an 2000 foot tower. that did correct the coverage problem . But it sure was an expensive fix to the prroblem and it took them 18 years to do that. But tyou answered my question about the strange part here is what you said about some of low quality engineeers you said weere out there in the 1950s. If the had of waited much longer than they did the former CBS in Wilmington NC would have had a strong hold on the market here. Not long after ch 26 went on the air WCSC went up on a 2000 foot tower. Both of those stations had a better signal than the old weak 13. But by the time those 2 stations were covering this area 13 was over their 2000 tower & already covering this area, but with competion. But like I said on an earlier post then folks had no other choice, they watched the snow signal & griped to the TV repairman why the station was the closer than 6 & 3 [13 was 47 miles, 3 was 53 miles & 6 was 62] & 13 was the worst looking one of the 3 stations.

nc88keyz

07-02-08, 09:06 PM

ITS WECT 6.1 DT off the air???

I havent gotten it in like 6-8 days.

Or is something up with my antenna.

everything else is working just fine.

Cant get it on any of the dvrs.

jspENC

07-02-08, 09:25 PM

WECT is on the air. I'm getting them at 40% right now. I haven't noticed them being down at all.

nc88keyz

07-02-08, 10:11 PM

I found the problem. I just assumed it was WECT due to my viewing selections. Im not really watching anything else right now. Turns out all my OTA channels are down. Starting to wonder whats going on now. Bad, Cables, Preamp, Antenna?
Not sure. Will take some days i think

nc88keyz

07-06-08, 06:57 PM

can someone confirm WECT is on the air right now on 6.1

I found the faulty connector on the coax going to the amp. Its been fixed. I can get fox, abc, pbs. but not nbc (6.1)
its fluxing but nothing more than 20%. I have gone the whole dial on the rotor.

I thought NBC would be one right now at 7pm but i could be wrong i suppose on sunday night. Olympic trials i think is one.

Anyone chime in.

thanks.

nc88keyz

07-07-08, 06:49 PM

whatever it was its gone now.

I was getting crap last night and all the signals this evening are 90-100.

NBC is 100% now vs. 22-15 last night. I know we had some storms, wonder if this had anything to do with it. I wish one of you had chimed in last night when i was sweating it out in the attic. :(

I did find a faulty coax connector though so it wasnt a total loss.

NBC goes out a lot come to think of it during storm times - wonder if they took it off line for some reasonl

jspENC

07-07-08, 08:49 PM

I didn't watch last night, but at least you have a good signal now.

I was afraid when I first read the post before last you made, that when you started disconnecting things from your amp that you had forgotten to unplug the power supply before hand... I know that not doing this can short out the pre-amp sometimes.

I am getting WECT 6.1 at about 50% tonight.

I often get stations way off out of Charleston, Florence, and even Augusta Georgia last week on a Digital Stream converter I bought from Radio Shack.

I haven't given a signal report for my location in a while, so I'll do it now, as folks from around here seem to check the Wilmington topic more than they do the Greenville one.

3 WWAY - 92%
6 WECT - 50%
7 WITN - bouncing from 40-70%
8 WFXI - 30%
9 WNCT- 90%
12 WCTI - 91%
19 WUNM - 87%
26 WSFX - 58%
My Network 35 - 80%
39 WUNJ - 91%

No distant channels tonight though.

nc88keyz

07-07-08, 08:55 PM

hard to say what all i did. ill keep that in mind for next time though :)

i played with a silver sensor and got flashes of nbc last night but it was very low signal power and it doesnt make sense to get fox, pbs and abc, but not nbc i know its a more unidirectional than the others but it wasnt clicking for me last night so i assumed there was a power issue with the storm or such.

Tonight its going in at 97-100% so it seems we are back online at least near ashley high school :)

thanks for your feedback.

Rich in ILM

07-11-08, 04:22 PM

There are a lot of storms and potential storms in the summer in this area. Warm air comes up from the gulf and collides with cooler air from the western moiuntains. It happens all summer here. WILM and WWAY seem to understand this and periodiacly put up warnings. Sadly this takes the HD down to SD but they do alternate so we get HD some of the time. We have already beat to death why they don't have HD generators for full HD viewing so I'll let that one go.

But why does WECT and WSFX just tack their storm warning up and leave it on, constantly, for the whole evening?

Here's a heads up for the people in the WECT control room. The olympics are coming, you might want to make a little more effort to provide some HD for those people that just bought HD sets and are all keyed up for the olympics!

I mean the network did spend a skillion dollars to provide HD didn't they? If you aren't going to spend $30K for an HD generator maybe a little extra effort in the control room? Just a suggestion. Maybe even a keyed timer?

jspENC

07-12-08, 05:57 PM

What's up with WAY HD and WAY WX? No picture, but the signal is showing 92%

But why does WECT and WSFX just tack their storm warning up and leave it on, constantly, for the whole evening?

I noticed that it depends on who is in the weather lab. If George Elliot is there, they don't leave it up constant. I think they should get rid of that little flag, or either make it slightly larger, it's hard to read on smaller TV's.

Wilmington_Ed

07-12-08, 10:35 PM

Maybe one of the station engineers can answer this one.

I bought a new $2000+ HD TV, plus have computers, surround sound, etc in the house. Was listening to some of these Progress Energy commercials for surge protection and started to get me thinking about getting their service. However in my development it's all underground wiring, so do I need to worry much about that? Granted the meter is above ground, so possible a strike could hit meter directly, but with underground wiring, would I be paying $6 per month for something that's unlikely I'd ever have an issue with?

I just moved here from up north, so am not use to as much thunder storms as you get down here, so makes me worry a bit more, but am I pretty much risk free with underground wiring. Granted somewhere downstream, there is above ground wiring, but would that disapate out before ever reaching my house?

ILMRay

07-13-08, 09:47 PM

Just wanted to say hi to everyone in the Wilmington area. I work in Engineering in one of the Wilmington stations and look forward to discussing DTV with you all.

Ray

MarcS

07-13-08, 11:47 PM

... but am I pretty much risk free with underground wiring. Granted somewhere downstream, there is above ground wiring, but would that disapate out before ever reaching my house?

Ha ha ha... ;)

A close strike will generate such a large EM pulse that it, or conduction through the ground, will affect your wiring whether underground or not, and induce a surge through your house anyway.

Then, you've got cable and phone coming into the house, with cable going to the tv? Going to the computer? Phone line hooked up to a satellite receiver?

A power company surge protector behind your meter won't help you there...

I had an A/V receiver damaged from a strike miles from my house...

I haven't looked at Progress Energy's guarantee lately, if you use their whole-house surge protection, will they pay for appliance replacement if damaged? Other electronics? If so, then you're essentially making a $6/mo insurance premium payment... Homeowner's insurance should also cover that stuff, but you'll have the deductible to deal with.

Never mind... from Progress Energy's web site:

Will the Meter-Based Surge Protector protect all my equipment?

No, not by itself. The meter-based device offers excellent protection for non-electronic equipment such as dishwashers, washing machines, dryers, refrigerators, freezers, non-microwave ovens, air conditioners and pool pump motors. While the meter-based device offers protection from powerful surges, a small portion of a surge can still pass through interior wiring, where it can damage sensitive electronics. For these sensitive electronics we offer our premium plug-in protectors which are up to six times stronger than some found in retail stores.

I found no warranty for damages if using their service...

All that said, I use basic surge strips, and a bit better one for my A/V equipment...

A few years back the transformer for my house (you know, that big green box that sits above ground) exploded--at about 3-4 AM. Yes, it woke me up because I can see it from my bedroom window. My cable pod is about 2-3 feet away from the xformer, and the pulse was big enough that it knocked it out (I think it damaged some of the inline filters they use to block programming)--the xformer serviced about 4 houses I think, same for the cable pod. They couldn't replace it until about 3 pm later that day--which was so pleasant because it was early June, hot, and I was recovering from knee surgery, so I sat in the dark in pain with no electricity, no A/C, no internet... happy happy joy joy!!! :)

MarcS

07-14-08, 12:29 PM

Just wanted to say hi to everyone in the Wilmington area. I work in Engineering in one of the Wilmington stations and look forward to discussing DTV with you all.

Ray

Since we've had postings from engineers at WWAY, WECT/WSFX--does this mean you're from WILM??????

Sure would be nice to know when the xmitter will go live without checking every day...

jspENC

07-14-08, 12:53 PM

We've had postings from engineers at UNC too. I imagine I'll be able to view WILM for the first time when their digital gets up, since I can view stations from Charleston almost every evening, along with Florence. :D

MarcS

07-14-08, 01:26 PM

So sorry to leave out Wayne Estabrooks from UNC TV... but he's retired now...

I asssume WILM will be testing their xmitter before the official switch date... I'm anxious to see how well I'll be able to receive them... should be ok at 15kW...

It'll be the final piece for integration of recording Hi-def programming seamlessly of both network OTA and satellite--up to now I've been using my computer to record network HD with TW cable for CBS--the only way to get it HD in Wilmington... looking forward to that...

ILMRay

07-14-08, 04:33 PM

Since we've had postings from engineers at WWAY, WECT/WSFX--does this mean you're from WILM??????

Sure would be nice to know when the xmitter will go live without checking every day...
Nope, I work at WWAY. Actually Billy is my boss.
I didn't know he was on this board until this morning.

Ray

Daryl L

07-14-08, 04:52 PM

Just wanted to say hi to everyone in the Wilmington area. I work in Engineering in one of the Wilmington stations and look forward to discussing DTV with you all.

Ray
Welcome Ray. Good to have u around.

fosdick1

07-15-08, 08:38 AM

Just wanted to say hi to everyone in the Wilmington area. I work in Engineering in one of the Wilmington stations and look forward to discussing DTV with you all.

Ray

Is the signal that WWAY transmits to Directv analog or digital? The reason I ask is that the picture is terrible and am hoping for an improvement come September.

bstratton

07-15-08, 03:17 PM

WWAY does not currently have fiber going to the satellite receive sites so they are using our OTA analog signal. In the near future, they will be taking our digital signal over the air, and we hope to have a fiber feed to them later this year.

Wilmington_Ed

07-15-08, 11:00 PM

Yeah, I didn't see anything about any kind of guarentee either. I was wondering if that was covered under homeowners minus the deductable.

jspENC

07-16-08, 10:03 AM

Rich in ILM

07-16-08, 05:03 PM

ILMRay

07-17-08, 09:37 PM

A lot of people have been talking about losing 3 and 6 on cable up here in Jacksonville, but according to what was put in the last cable bill, those stations won't go off when analog is cut, so they must be setting up to receive the digital of those and break it down to analog for the basic cable tier. People would be outraged I'm sure if they didn't keep those channels, because often times you get better weather coverage from them. I haven't heard if they will add the HD versions to cable here, but I doubt it. WWAY's picture used to look really faded and have sparkles in it, but they seem to have corrected this after looking at a neighbors picture.
Currently the cable folks around ILM are receiving our signal via fiber optics. It is a standard def. signal.

I can't speak for the cable companies but I understand they will continue to offer our main channel as part of their basic package in standard def.. If you want the additional channels (in our case 24/7 weather) and HD you will need to upgrade.

Ray
WWAY Engineer

ILMRay

07-17-08, 09:49 PM

Just curious what antennas you guys are using?

I would love to know the antenna height and signal strengths for the area stations. You location would also be helpful.

Ray

jspENC

07-18-08, 08:27 AM

Currently the cable folks around ILM are receiving our signal via fiber optics. It is a standard def. signal.

I can't speak for the cable companies but I understand they will continue to offer our main channel as part of their basic package in standard def.. If you want the additional channels (in our case 24/7 weather) and HD you will need to upgrade.

Ray
WWAY Engineer

Thanks Ray.

My neighbors have cable still. I have D* and an antenna (Radio Shack U-75R) mounted about 28 feet high on a rotor with a Channel Master pre-amp. I posted my signal strengths toward the top of this page.

Fiber optics makes sense because there is no more sparkling on your channel or WECT like there used to be when cable was still using sorry 30 year old antennas up here.

rynouncw

07-18-08, 11:58 AM

Hi Ray-

I'm new here too...just found this awesome forum. Anyway, I'm off of Gordon Road between Eaton Elementary and Lewis Farm. I'm using a radio shack U75-R in my attic which is roughly 15 feet above ground level. It's pointed roughly west-southwest, and since my TV doesn't show signal levels, I get WWAY, WECT, WWAY, WSFX, UNC, AND ION/ION LIFE/QUBO (ch 35) consistently. From time to time, I get the affiliates out of New Bern and Florence (WFXB, WITN, others I can't remember). I did get the stations out of Raleigh one night, but I think it was a fluke tropo opening.

bstratton

07-18-08, 04:14 PM

WWAY will continue to send our SD signal to both Time Warner and Charter cable so their basic package customers should continue to receive our channel as you do now, without the "center cut" format.

ILMRay

07-19-08, 09:15 PM

Rich in ILM

07-19-08, 10:04 PM

Looks like everyone is doing well as long as the antenna is 15 to 20 AGL. A preamp really helps to overcome line losses. I think on my next antenna I will use good old 300 ohm twin lead. It works will if you have a direct shot out of the house and can keep it away from wires, gutters, etc.

Ray

But tough to protect from induced (near area) lightning strokes. Also do alot of twists or you won't have a balanced line. (Remembering the days of ham radio with 300 ohm driven arrays)

jspENC

07-20-08, 03:59 PM

Ray,
I posted somewhere, (think Mryrtle Beach topic) that I changed from RG-6 to twin lead from antenna to mast mounted pre-amp and it made the difference between not getting WECT and getting them, so twin lead worked better for me. From the amp, to inside I am still using RG-6 though.

David-the-dtv-ma

07-20-08, 08:10 PM

MarcS

07-20-08, 09:44 PM

Too many questions........ :)

http://home.earthlink.net/~marcpilot3/images2/PULLHAIR.jpg

Rich in ILM

07-21-08, 06:25 PM

I have some old channel master spec & it shows at UHF the loss to be much more in RGt6 than 300 ohm. But you had to be more careful with 300 ohm. Did any one know how many twist per foot to give 300 ohm so it will reject noise & stray rf signal. Can you twist it too mcuh that the twist becomes a coil & weaken the signal that you are wanting the wire to pass? Also what is the effect of the twist on the VHF High Band signal if you has it twisted for UHF.

The max frequency for UHF TV is 800 MHZ so 468/800*12 is a 1/2 wave length of around 7 inches. That means 3 turns per foot will (4 inches) should be more than adequate. That is to say any frequency above that shouldn't be an issue as current receivers have pretty efficient bandwidth skirts. I don't remember that twist density of being much of a problem on attenuation at these frequenices so you should be fine.

hphase

07-21-08, 10:22 PM

Where is WECT's DTV transmitter really located? I'm having a hard time picking it up in downtown ILM.

Rich in ILM

07-21-08, 11:32 PM

Where is WECT's DTV transmitter really located? I'm having a hard time picking it up in downtown ILM.

According to my Delorme Street Atlas the transmitter is in Empire Park just west of Independence and Park Ave.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WILM-LP

foxeng

07-22-08, 07:25 AM

Where is WECT's DTV transmitter really located? I'm having a hard time picking it up in downtown ILM.

WECT-DT is located south of Wilmington near Calabash. The analog is at White Lake, northwest of Wilmington towards Fayetteville.

Rich in ILM

07-22-08, 09:30 AM

WECT-DT is located south of Wilmington near Calabash. The analog is at White Lake, northwest of Wilmington towards Fayetteville.

I am surprised about White Lake. That doesn't sound like an LP to me, and it doesn't show that location on the license. It shows the cordinates as I previously indicated:

http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/tvq?call=WILM

MarcS

07-22-08, 09:37 AM

Where is WECT's DTV transmitter really located? I'm having a hard time picking it up in downtown ILM.

Don't feel bad, last time I talked with the engineer there (Dan Ulmer?) a year or so ago, he had some trouble picking up the signal too (at their studio)... :)

It's the antenna orientation on the tower that causes a signal suckout over Wilmington...

jspENC

07-22-08, 09:48 AM

I am surprised about White Lake. That doesn't sound like an LP to me, and it doesn't show that location on the license. It shows the cordinates as I previously indicated:

http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/tvq?call=WILM

There seems to be some confusion...

WECT - 6 Analog TV is the only antenna at White Lake. It is a very old tower, at over 2000' that was placed there when Fayetteville was part of the Wilmington market to provide good coverage to both communities. The signal almost reaches Raleigh even...

WECT digital is on the UNC - DT tower west of Wilmington at Delco where 74 and 87 intersect. They haven't moved to the WWAY tower in Bolivia yet I don't think...

WECT ANALOGhttp://www.fcc.gov/ftp/Bureaus/MB/Databases/fm_tv_service_areas/maps/TV32560.gif

WECT DIGITAL http://www.fcc.gov/ftp/Bureaus/MB/Databases/fm_tv_service_areas/maps/DT990128.gif

Rich in ILM

07-22-08, 09:50 AM

Don't feel bad, last time I talked with the engineer there (Dan Ulmer?) a year or so ago, he had some trouble picking up the signal too (at their studio)... :)

It's the antenna orientation on the tower that causes a signal suckout over Wilmington...

75 watts ERP isn't a lot to work with.

beazster

07-22-08, 09:54 AM

Someone talked about this in the past but I believe WECT is currently reconfiguring there transmitters. They are installing a new one on WWAYs tower and putting the old one somewhere in Wilmington if I remember correctly. I am in right in the middle of Wilmington and get zero signal too. I hope they get this stuff up and ready before The Office begins again...

foxeng

07-22-08, 11:07 AM

Rich in ILM

07-22-08, 11:19 AM

The OP asked about WECT and you posted WILM. WECT is a full power station. WILM is a LP.

My bad! I saw ILM and the end of the sentence and took off! Brain not engaged!

fosdick1

07-22-08, 03:37 PM

Hey what happened to Channels 3-1 and 3-3? They are no longer listed or viewable via Directv

David-the-dtv-ma

07-22-08, 03:46 PM

The max frequency for UHF TV is 800 MHZ so 468/800*12 is a 1/2 wave length of around 7 inches. That means 3 turns per foot will (4 inches) should be more than adequate. That is to say any frequency above that shouldn't be an issue as current receivers have pretty efficient bandwidth skirts. I don't remember that twist density of being much of a problem on attenuation at these frequenices so you should be fine.

I remember some one telling me to put the twist in the flat lead in the days before we had any UHF stations around here. I did not pay much attention to the difference to what effect it had. But the when 26 went on the air I found that you would pick up signal with the wires disconnected from the antenna. When the wire had a horizontal run like across an attic the signal was kinda strong. It seemed to be stronger that what you would receive from the antenna. But was not useable because it would have lot of ghost & distortion. It also would be going in & out with the signal going up & down thus was unusable. An easy fix was to not use 300 ohm but use 75-ohm coax instead. But then the coax had more loss than the 300 ohm & made the pitchure a littler snowy. So then you needed a preamp to make up for the loss of the coax. But all I had to do was to just put twist into the 300 ohm & then I would have had a stronger signal with out the preamp. I did find out that with an indoor bow tie antenna that I could twist the lead & it would give a better analog the picture. When using my dtv converter box I found that with the twist I could get the stations & with the 300-ohm lead laying flat I could not get the dtv stations. But I was not sure how many twists to get it until what you said. Inside an attic I just laid the lead flat on the attic floor. I never thought it was necessary to use stand off inside of the attic. I but now I understand I will need them to keep the twist equal across the span. From what you are saying that 4 twist will not act like a coil & begin to react with the VHF high [170mhz-220hms] or the UHF [470mhz-700mhz] as to pass or attenuate the signal. I just want to make sure so that after going in the attic I do the project only one time & do not have to go back & re do it second time with less or more twist. You would think that with so many ging from VHF 3 & 6 to UHF 44 & 46 on OTA antennas with flat lead this would be brought up at the big switch at the station’s web site as well on the news. Thanks for your advise

fosdick1

07-23-08, 12:34 PM

never mind found the problem

term2003

07-23-08, 05:58 PM

Daryl L

07-23-08, 06:30 PM

No 1080p transmission plans.

jspENC

07-23-08, 06:34 PM

1080i on CBS and NBC

You will be watching CBS from Florence and will need a rotor for you're antenna I believe. I suggest a combo VHF/UHF mid size because WBTW will be on 13 again next year, right now they are on 56

David-the-dtv-ma

07-24-08, 01:40 PM

Hi - we are moving to Bay Tree Lakes in Bladen County and are buying a new HDTV. I wonder what the transmission is out there. We won't have satellite or cable, just over the air. Is the HD signal 720p? Are there any 1080p transmissions or does any station shave plans for 1080p?

thanks for your help and sorry to butt in....

term

If you have a indoor tv antenna I would try it first on a analog portable tv & check to see what you can receive. You should receive now CBS WBTW analog 13,, ABC WPDE !5, CW WWMB 21 & FOX WFXB 43.You are not far from their towers. PBS WHMC 23 is near that direction. Then try for WSFX 26 or WUNJ 39 out of Wilminton NC & check to see how well you receive them. You may need to turn the antenna on way or the other & check each time to see what you receive. If you receive even a snowy picture on analog TV on your indoor antenna you should be able to receive HDTV with a roof top antenna. I would try that before you get a antenna to check to see what you need. NBC we will not know until WECT has moved to the 2000 foot tower at Winnabow. But if you receive WSFX 26 ok then you should receive WECT HDV ch 44 after they move.

To answer your question about 1080p. All of the US DTV stations are all the same & here should be the same as any HDTV stations any place else. The resolutionis determind by the camera. that made the show. All of the major networks are passing the full bandwidith to show a HD show. But some of the sub channels like MYTV WBTW 13-2 only pass the SD -> 480i because CBS is running as high as the resolution as the feed from CBS is . Thus, the bandwidth is needed for the CBS feed. I am watching the network stations in HDTV from my antenna & they look as good as going to see a movie.

ILMRay

07-24-08, 09:36 PM

ILMRay

07-24-08, 09:40 PM

Term,

ABC runs HD at 720p. I am not sure about the other networks.
Currently we run GMA, The View, and some prime time at 720p.
Everything else is standard def.

Ray
WWAY Engineer

ILMRay

07-24-08, 09:46 PM

Hey what happened to Channels 3-1 and 3-3? They are no longer listed or viewable via Directv
Currently Direct TV is airing our analog signal. They will transmit our digital signal when our analog goes dark on Sept. 8.

jspENC

07-25-08, 08:57 AM

WECT's digital antenna is in Delco right off US 74. They have a side mount antenna that is on the opposite side of the tower from Wilmington, so they have some pattern distortion I'm sure. I can't remember the height ASL, I think it's around 1000 ft. Their ERP is around 600 KW.

Ray

Ray,

Are they still planning to move to your tower before Sept? How do you get three antennas at the top of that tower? Candelabra?

fosdick1

07-25-08, 03:22 PM

Currently Direct TV is airing our analog signal. They will transmit our digital signal when our analog goes dark on Sept. 8.

Will the signal then be in HD?

ILMRay

07-27-08, 09:06 PM

Ray,

Are they still planning to move to your tower before Sept? How do you get three antennas at the top of that tower? Candelabra?
That's a good question JSP. I really don't know the answer. Those discussions are above me. I can tell you that our digital antenna is on the top of the tower, and our analog bays are on all three sides just below the digital antenna. That being the case they would have to side mount. I don't have a map of all the antennas on that tower, but I can tell you it's pretty crowded.

Ray

ILMRay

07-27-08, 09:21 PM

Will the signal then be in HD?
Fosdick,

Initially Direct TV will recieve our signal OTA with a digital receiver. As they will receive the same signal as everyone else they will receive the network HD feed. You would have to ask them if they plan to uplink in HD. I know we may install a fiber feed later. At the present, fiber would be a standard def. signal.

I really get the feeling that a lot of discussions will occur in the stations regarding SD vs HD. I know Billy and I have had quite a few. Most of us Tekkies would love to see it although it can create a lot of headaches for Engineers and Production folks. Currently, there seems to be a lot of questions, but not many answers. I think a lot of it hinges on the viewer's (and advertisers) response to HD. Personally, I think once a viewer sees a good HD pic, he will not be satisfied with SD. Most broadcasters aren't coming out of the box with a lot of HD. It costs a lot. But if the clients and viewers demand it, or if the other guy does it, everyone will get on board. (IMHO)

Ray

jspENC

07-28-08, 09:11 AM

That's a good question JSP. I really don't know the answer. Those discussions are above me. I can tell you that our digital antenna is on the top of the tower, and our analog bays are on all three sides just below the digital antenna. That being the case they would have to side mount. I don't have a map of all the antennas on that tower, but I can tell you it's pretty crowded.

Ray

I just checked the FCC website, and WECT gave an update on the 21st, saying that they have not started operating the STA yet, but will around Sept 8, and as soon as the analog stuff for I guess WSFX and WWAY is moved out, they will start working on the high powered transmitter. From what I can tell, they are going to use the same antenna as WSFX is using for digital.

jspENC

07-28-08, 09:13 AM

David-the-dtv-ma

07-28-08, 12:04 PM

I just checked the FCC website, and WECT gave an update on the 21st, saying that they have not started operating the STA yet, but will around Sept 8, and as soon as the analog stuff for I guess WSFX and WWAY is moved out, they will start working on the high powered transmitter. From what I can tell, they are going to use the same antenna that WSFX is using for digital.

Ray, has the WECT crew installed their low powered digital transmitter at WWAY's 2000 foot tower yet? If so, is it on the air yet. From what I understood they had a broad band UHF antenna on the top for all the UHF stations at the site to share. Last time I talked with Dan at WECT he was really busy. He was working on getting microwave from the WECT studio to your 2000 foot tower, ordering equipment & a low powered transmitter for the new location. So I want to avoid bugging him about the status of the project. So Ray can you give us an update of the status if you know about WECT's new transmitter progress. Thanks

fosdick1

07-28-08, 03:54 PM

Well Directv just issued their list of Cities where they are adding local HD service by the end of the year and Wilmington is not on the list. New Bern is however and Myrtle Beach.

nc88keyz

07-29-08, 08:25 AM

I need some help,

for the past month 1/2 I have not seen WECT 6.1 DT. I dont know what would have happened in that time frame. I am locking all the other stations at around 88-100 % on all directv recievers. 6.1 will not go above 16 and if it does it peaks at 100 and then drops back.

Have they changed the height of the tower or location?

Did a tree grow where it wasnt supposed to in the last month?

Did they reduce power significantly. I about 2 miles south monkey junction just behing ashley.

I have a remote rotor and have spun the dial???

If a cable was loose on the antenna somewhere the other stations would be affected too.

This is really strang. I have locks on all the others with exception to WECT 6.1 DT>

HELP!!!

fosdick1, i saw that report too over at dbsforum. Not suprising though.

fosdick1

07-29-08, 09:04 AM

jspENC

07-29-08, 09:17 AM

As you all probably know, I didn't get WECT for the longest time, while I was getting everything else on the air in the eastern part of the state...

A few months back, I bought a Digital Stream to replace my Motorola that died in the back room. When I hooked up the D.S. WECT was cutting in and out as opposed to nothing from the old Motorola. I had some foam twin lead, and a slightly longer mast and decided to give it a shot. Just a few feet higher and the foam twin lead (about 6 ft) from antenna to mast pre-amp gave me 6.1 at 30-35% in the daytime.

I have not had one problem with their signal being absent, or pixelating since doing this. I do not have trees in the path of 6.1 though... I think possibly the Directv tuner isn't as good as some tuners. On my Samsung HDTV the tuner isn't quite as good as the Digital Stream, because at times the picture won't be there when it is still there on the D.S.

Also it could be interference from another station on channel 44 in a different market. Folks are having problems with WCTI out of New Bern at times because of channel 48 in Winston Salem roaring in here.

nc88keyz

07-29-08, 06:22 PM

Its is bouncing from 0-100 to 30-90-0 ...I cant tell you whats up. Gordon road is complete opposite side of town though. Be curious if those in the ashleuy highschool area are still able to get it. Something changed and I cant figure this out. Checked all the wiring with exception of the antenna itself. Im gonna remove the 10cut shortly here that I was using to get CBS out of greenville, that never panned out.

Im also cutting down huge pine tree thats branches extended out closer to the antenna over the last 6 months.

We were getting WECT fine up end f the prime time season. I would say when boston legal ended or there abouts.

This is crap.

Who is the engineer for WECT digital?
I would like to ask them what changes have been made in power, location, height etc.

incus

07-30-08, 12:21 AM

I live just across the street from Ashley HS. I'm at 77% for WECT on my Panny plasma with tuner and my stand alone Samsung HDTV receiver is roughly the same. My antenna has shifted northward in the wind so I know it's not positioned correctly as I'm usually higher for WECT. WWAY 100%, WFSX 100% and PBS 100%, Using a roof top channel master 4221 (from a fellow board member :)).
No pre-amp or rotator. I just positioned it and left it alone.
Just waiting for WILM aka CBS football now!

Hope this helps.
Incus

jspENC

07-30-08, 08:24 AM

You will more than likely need to aim dead-on for WILM, so if you can wait till they get on the air to adjust, try to so you won't be on the roof more than you can help...

When WILM turn off analog, the 10 cut antenna may work. If not maybe someone on the north end might try it... if they want two CBS stations and a CW Stand. Def.

jagmonster

07-30-08, 03:51 PM

I'm in monkey junction (1/2 mile north on college) getting WECT6.1 on directv HR20 boxes at 44 to 48 level, same as the last 20 months.All the other OTA signals are close to 100%. I have a DB4 attic antenna without any power to it. Can't count on directv having locals in HD anytime soon which is why WILM coming up to speed is so important.

nc88keyz

07-31-08, 12:49 AM

everything points to faulty antenna wiring but that would not be the case for the others coming in at over 85 to 95%. Its just WECT.

beazster

07-31-08, 04:25 PM

Here is an interesting online article I came across. Nothing really new but looks like if everything is still going on schedule we should have a new WILM and an improved WECT somewhere around the middle of august.

"WECT has bought a new Harris transmitter and is planning to piggyback on the same transmission line and batwing antenna that WWAY and WSFX are using.

Raycom expects much improved digital coverage on the Winnabow tower. Right now, it employs a side-mounted antenna on the 900-foot Delco tower. At Winnabow, it will be atop a 1,800-foot antenna.

The new transmitter is expected on July 22 and ERI is scheduled to arrive on Aug. 4 to begin the installation process, Ullmer says. If everybody does their job, the move should be completed by the middle of August.

The engineering analysis shows that the Winnabow signals cover better and so does the anecdotal evidence, Ullmer says. WECT has received hundreds of complaints about its digital reception, while Winnabow-based WSFX has only gotten a handful, he says."

On the technical front, WILM-LP has the most work to do.

When the FCC came calling for volunteers, the CBS affiliate's plans called for going digital in December or January. Those plans have now been accelerated.

According to Capitol's Greene, the station has ordered a new transmitter from Harris and a pre-fab building to house it and expects to have them in place at the tower in Delco, N.C., by the second week of August, according to Capitol's Greene.

At that point, a tower crew is expected to hang a new ERI antenna and have the facility online well in advance of the transition.

http://www.tvnewsday.com/articles/2008/07/17/daily.5/

foxeng

08-01-08, 07:52 AM

Looks like ERI is going to be pretty busy in August.

jspENC

08-01-08, 09:37 AM

MarcS

08-01-08, 10:16 AM

I don't have any problems with WECT reception anymore--I just keep this guy up in my FROG... (image linked, but Earthlink has been flaky lately...)

http://home.earthlink.net/~marcpilot6/images/analog2.jpg

But seriously, WECT has been coming in ok for me using a cheap Radio Shack UHF-VHF combo antenna in the attic, no amp, Dish 722 receiver...

beazster

08-01-08, 12:58 PM

WECT has been coming in ok for me using a cheap Radio Shack UHF-VHF combo antenna in the attic, no amp, Dish 722 receiver...

Where abouts are you located in Wilmington? I have the same exact set up as you. $15 combo radioshack indoor antenna in the attic hooked up to Dish 722. I am by Hugh McCrae park and have never been able to pull in WECT at all. A couple of times I have received the Jacksonville ION stations at 40-45%. I get WSFX at about 80% and WWAY at 100%.

David-the-dtv-ma

08-01-08, 12:59 PM

I was quite surprised at how weak WSFX is, at only 80 kW, but yet it is stronger than WECT's 575 kW signal. The side mount definitely is what causes a null in their reception. It would have been interesting to see what an analog signal would have looked like from that exact spot up here and in Wilmington. (probably real snowy) At least WILM plans to mount their signal on the east side, and the null will be in an area that can turn to another channel for CBS service.

I guess they will tear down the analog tower in White Lake... It's kind of sad to see it go after all these years..

If some one wants to apply with the FCC for a FM radio freq 87.7 over their 2000 foot tower they can because the freq & the tower will be avaiable soon. I have read that there is a push to add the ch 6 & 5 VHF tv channel freq bands into the FM radio band. If some one did get a an FCC app for this, the antenna, tower & feed line would be ready. The only thing they would need would be an FM radio transmitter & a microwave link to a studio.

I also felt the same way about WECT DT. I woundered what an analog UHF ch 44 would have looked like. When using UHF freq ,how high the antenna is , is more effective than how much power.

If the WILM folks have thought about it they could save some money. They could use WECT's feed line after WECT DT move the the 2000 foot tower. They would just need to run a jumper from the location of WECT to the east side for the WILM location. Since copper is so high now I am sure that the line would account for a lot of money.

Also after 2-19-09 there will be a lot of UHF tv transmitter antennas & UHF frequencys available