maxvengeance111,

I know that's confusing, but apparently they both are electronically identical. Marketing brochure-wise and aesthetically, they are different.

Ha! Well that makes sense. I don't know why they would want to confuse people like that. Probably made new brochures for the 437 and never went back to change the 4365 brochure. Thanks alot...I was about to call up my OneCall salesman and give him grief.

My Bravo has had no problems with aspect ratio - anamorphic DVDs fill the screen etc. And the picture is great. I just hope it doesn't keep locking up. Because that will kill it for me.

I've yet to experience a single glitch with the Bravo. The icing on the cake was when I received a CDR filled with jpegs from a photographer friend. I popped it in the Bravo and was treated to a terrific slide show on the 567!

IMO, the D1 is the best $200 investment I've made in a while. It doesn't have the build quality of my Sony, but it's also one third the price and much, much more versatile.

Originally posted by maxvengeance111
Ha! Well that makes sense. I don't know why they would want to confuse people like that. Probably made new brochures for the 437 and never went back to change the 4365 brochure.

Samsung does this so that budget chains like Best Buy and HH Gregg can sell the 4365 for one price and upmarket chains like CC and Magnolia can sell the 437 and not have to price match against the other guys because the two sets are different models. However, I've found that CC is willing to price match their 437 versus the 4365 at other stores, in case that helps anyone.
- Craig

For the 10,000,000th time (sales have been good for Samsung!) there is no difference. :D

The brochures are different for marketing and licensing fee reasons.

does anyone have the samsung 931?? i can get this through tweeter for $250.00 and if i have a problem i can just drive over. it makes sense to me.

I have the 931 and while it is not a perfect player, it does display an exceptional picture when connected to the Sammy DLP via DVI.

The remote is not great and you have to point it directly at the player to get a response. I fixed this by using the Pronto universal remote. It is also very slow to load and respond to commands such as going to the menu screen or getting past those stupid copyright warnings. Its fast forward and reverse are also less than smooth, and sometimes it gets out of sync when using the DTS soundtrack.

Nonetheless, with all of these shortcomings, I still love it. It is one of the few players with a DVI output, and the picture quality is so outstanding that it approaches HDTV (check out Star Wars II, Lost in Space, Toy Story II, or Shrek).

I bought mine at Ultimate Electronics. For $60, I can return it within two years and receive a full credit for the $299 purchase price. By then, I'm sure Sammy will have substantially improved on the 931.

Wait...you bought it for 60 bucks...but you can return it for 299? How do they make money on that deal? Or did it fall off the back of a truck?

Sounds like he's renting it for $60 for two years, then gets the $299 back, great deal as there's gotta be better players on the market by then.

Hehe...there is a period after electronics you know.

Oh...got it...Didn't know that company did that...

Originally posted by Kevin R. Anderson
I have the 931 and while it is not a perfect player, it does display an exceptional picture when connected to the Sammy DLP via DVI.

The remote is not great and you have to point it directly at the player to get a response. I fixed this by using the Pronto universal remote. It is also very slow to load and respond to commands such as going to the menu screen or getting past those stupid copyright warnings. Its fast forward and reverse are also less than smooth, and sometimes it gets out of sync when using the DTS soundtrack.

Nonetheless, with all of these shortcomings, I still love it. It is one of the few players with a DVI output, and the picture quality is so outstanding that it approaches HDTV (check out Star Wars II, Lost in Space, Toy Story II, or Shrek).

I bought mine at Ultimate Electronics. For $60, I can return it within two years and receive a full credit for the $299 purchase price. By then, I'm sure Sammy will have substantially improved on the 931.


Is the "Pronto" a universal remote? Will it work with the Bravo D1.....AND the Samsung HLN467w?

Sorry about the misunderstanding. I paid $299 for the player plus $60 for an "option" to upgrade the player within 2 years. When I return the player, I'm given a credit of $299 to apply toward the purchase of a new DVD player. Ultimate Electronics has been doing this for some time. I used this option a while back to upgrade a pair of car speakers. The only risk is whether Ultimate Electronics will be in business in 2 years.

The Pronto is perhaps the most popular universal remote that will learn any command from any remote. Go to www.remotecentral.com and read all about the Pronto and other learning remotes. You can also download configuration files created by other users. I would guess someone has already created a config file for the Bravo and Sammy DLP.

Arun,

Just finished reading throught the latest version of the Unofficial Guide. Awsome job as usual.

Since you seem to be the central spot for all info DLP, any chance of putting up a spreadsheet of each firmware version's standard SM settings. It seems with more people attempting to tweak these days before recording the OOTB settings, that this would be very useful to have. I think I have seen some spreadsheets floating around for 209, 211, and 214. That would probably be a good place to start. I;m not sure if the OOTB SM settings are the same for each firmware version, but it would be interesting to find out.

Thanks for all the effort!

andwhite1,

Last year I compared OOTB settings with a couple of people who had the same version as me, HLM437W version 107. There were differences from set to set. If the 2xx versions are equally varied, we'll have to hack Samsung's database and post a seperate page for each individual DLP!

Get typin' Arun!

Originally posted by andwhite1
Arun,

Just finished reading throught the latest version of the Unofficial Guide. Awsome job as usual.

Since you seem to be the central spot for all info DLP, any chance of putting up a spreadsheet of each firmware version's standard SM settings. It seems with more people attempting to tweak these days before recording the OOTB settings, that this would be very useful to have. I think I have seen some spreadsheets floating around for 209, 211, and 214. That would probably be a good place to start. I;m not sure if the OOTB SM settings are the same for each firmware version, but it would be interesting to find out.

Thanks for all the effort!

It seems to me that Samsung could and SHOULD make it so that the "default" OOTB setting are stored in some kind of a "permanent" memory such as ROM. That way one would never "lose" his/her original settings and you could "play around" to your hearts content. If one is not satisfied one could always count on getting back to the original settings. Then again, its possible this solution would be too simple for a bureaucratic orgainization. Furthermore, Sammy could install a bunch of settings that the user could select. I don't know how to phrase it but the settings would be a complete list or "macro" if you will. This may serve to give us the choice of a "bunch" of "pre-programmed settings that we could change with the proverbial "touch of a button". Do any of these suggestions make sense, if not, why?

Originally posted by andwhite1
Arun,

Just finished reading throught the latest version of the Unofficial Guide. Awsome job as usual.

Since you seem to be the central spot for all info DLP, any chance of putting up a spreadsheet of each firmware version's standard SM settings. It seems with more people attempting to tweak these days before recording the OOTB settings, that this would be very useful to have. I think I have seen some spreadsheets floating around for 209, 211, and 214. That would probably be a good place to start. I;m not sure if the OOTB SM settings are the same for each firmware version, but it would be interesting to find out.

Thanks for all the effort!

It seems to me that Samsung could and SHOULD make it so that the "default" OOTB setting are stored in some kind of a "permanent" memory such as ROM. That way one would never "lose" his/her original settings and you could "play around" to your hearts content. If one is not satisfied one could always count on getting back to the original settings. Then again, its possible this solution would be too simple for a bureaucratic orgainization. Furthermore, Sammy could install a bunch of settings that the user could select. I don't know how to phrase it but the settings would be a complete list or "macro" if you will. This may serve to give us the choice of a "bunch" of "pre-programmed settings that we could change with the proverbial "touch of a button". Do any of these suggestions make sense, if not, why?

:)

I guess if the settings vary from set to set, then this would be an impossible task...even for Arun!

Guess writing them down (or taking a digital snapshot) is still the best bet prior to tweaking.

A lot of devices do provide a hard reset that returns the device to it's original settings. It is puzzling that something like this isn't included in the service menu. But hindsight is always 20/20. Just chalk it up there with many details that were overlooked (seperate audio inputs for VGA/DVI, multiple DVI inputs-for Samsungs OWN set top box and DVD player, audio outputs, better remote reception, a serial port firmware update or cd updateable firmware, etc, etc, etc.....)

I've had a 617W on order for the past month and half. Today I noticed that on the samsungusa website, the 617W has a "limited availability" tag on it. It appears it is the only model that has that tag. Don't tell me they plan to discontinue this model. What other reason could there be for the tag?

http://www.samsungusa.com/cgi-bin/nabc/product/b2c_product_detail.jsp?eUser=&prod_id=HLN617WX%2fXAA

Originally posted by vblyth
I've had a 617W on order for the past month and half.
Who did you order from? They are available in our area.

Available here also

wait'n on mine too... but should be here in "a week or two" (just ordered it friday)

Originally posted by zielin
wait'n on mine too... but should be here in "a week or two" (just ordered it friday)

Proabably a good thing you have to wait. Better chance of getting firmware 214.

Does anyone have an Idea when there will be a replacement for the HLN617W ?

I posted on this thread for possible inclusion in Aruns DVI guide

This is quoted from page 4 of the Samsung HD931 manual


HD(1080i/720p) DVI(Digital Visual Interface)
Output
HD(High Definition) Video has 1080i or 720p
picture quality and 16:9 aspect ratio.
The DVD SD video signal is converted to a
720 line maximum HD format to provide a
higher picture quality than existing DVDP.

This is quoted from page 5 of the same manual.

2. DVI VIDEO
The button will change color each time it is
pressed to indicate the mode. 480p(Red),
720p(Blue) and 1080i(Green) modes are
supported.

Are these a contradiction or am I missing something.
Can the DVD signal be scaled to 720P AND 1080I?

Has anyone found any information about the 50LC13 on Panasonic's website? I was looking for the detailed specs, and a PDF of the manual. You would think Panasonic would have made these public since the sets have hit the stores...

sorry, wrong thread!

Originally posted by gusK
sorry, wrong thread!
You can delete your messages with the edit button. ;)

Howdy all,

I was looking at potential threads to assist me with my current issue and after reading through most of this one it appears that this may be the best place to get the answer.

My apologies ahead of time for spinning this thread back about eight pages or so.

I recently took ownership of the new 567 and bought the 931 DVD player. All I can say is WOW! I'm using the Sony HD100 STB for HD and SD viewing and this is where my problem comes in. My plan was to hook the STB up via the VGA output, but when I go this route the picture is off center. When I enter the "MENU" under PC, everything is grayed out. I cannot change the Aspect ratio either(wide PC or Wide TV). I'm not sure what the issue is. COuld this be that since I am forced to output 1080i VGA from the STB, and the TV is 720p, the connection source doesn't scale the picture?

With the Sony HD100, you only have one choice to output with the VGA and that is 1080i. Thanks.

Cabber,
I had the same problem. Ultimately I'm not going to use the HD100's VGA out except occasionally on an actual PC monitor, since I also have a HD200, but I was just testing various schemes on my DLP. I saw no immediate remedy either.
Sorry I couldn't help more but at least misery loves company!

Rick

Ender21 and Cabber,

Unfortunately it looks like I am in a similar boat. I currently use the Samsung TS160 STB via DVI in 720p mode. That works just fine and with a single tick of the raster centering controls on the 160 I can get a great centered picture. However, if I keep the 160 as is and switch to use VGA instead of DVI everything goes straight to hell as far as centering. I have maxed out both the 160's raster centering controls as well as the Fine and Coarse adjusts on the tv itself. So far no one has a solution or a clue as to what may cause this. I plan on trying to connect my old laptop to the VGA input this weekend now that I have Powerstrip, but that's 3 days away at least. I plan on posting a question in regards to this issue over in the HDTV hardware forum when I get a chance. You might want to start a thread on this issue in the RPTV here as well.

Later,
Jeff

My first guess is that Samsung is saying "sorry, this is for PCs at specific resolutions only" to us, limiting the flexibility just like they did with PIP & Component inputs with 480i/p.

Rick

FWIW, just started a new thread dealing with this issue here. (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=2545076#post2545076)

We'll see if anyone else has the issue.

Later,
Jeff

Has anyone found any product or home made item that is particularly suitable for positioning a center speaker on the slightly backward sloping top of the DLP's? I know the simple answer is to grab a piece of plywood and start whittling, but I am looking for something a little more elegant to match the TV and the Audes Sentral speaker.

Thanks.

Tobin,

Even if such a product does exist it is VERY MUCH frowned upon with these sets. The cabinet used with these TV's is VERY flexible and generally not very sturdy. Unless you are using something like a satellite sized center channel (something like the Klipsch Promedia 5.1 ) I would recommend doing one of two things.

1.) Buy a stand for the tv that can accomodate a full size center channel speaker above or below the tv.

2.) Purchase a shelf and some shelving brackets and construct a shelf that goes right above the top of the tv, mounted to a rear wall or something equally sturdy.

The cabinet flexes so much with just finger pressure that it can actually cause your image to change slightly to drastically depending on the amount of pressure applied.

Regs,
Jeff



Originally posted by Tobin44
Has anyone found any product or home made item that is particularly suitable for positioning a center speaker on the slightly backward sloping top of the DLP's? I know the simple answer is to grab a piece of plywood and start whittling, but I am looking for something a little more elegant to match the TV and the Audes Sentral speaker.

Thanks.

Well, kids... color me a REFORMED TS160 Problem child. As of 5 minutes ago I just plugged the same VGA cable I used before into my HLN set from the TS160 and everything was nice and centered. I switched channels between SD and HD both on OTA and D* and everything looked fine. Granted, there was a noticeable difference in the pics... but that was mostly due to the fact that I have not done calibration of any kind on fhe PC input. We'll see what the old laptop looks like once I install Powerstrip on that sucker.

See ya,
Jeff


Originally posted by Iceblade
FWIW, just started a new thread dealing with this issue here. (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=2545076#post2545076)

We'll see if anyone else has the issue.

Later,
Jeff

Originally posted by Iceblade
Well, kids... color me a REFORMED TS160 Problem child. As of 5 minutes ago I just plugged the same VGA cable I used before into my HLN set from the TS160 and everything was nice and centered. I switched channels between SD and HD both on OTA and D* and everything looked fine. Granted, there was a noticeable difference in the pics... but that was mostly due to the fact that I have not done calibration of any kind on fhe PC input. We'll see what the old laptop looks like once I install Powerstrip on that sucker.

See ya,
Jeff

Jeff,

Do you notice any improvements over component inputs and VGA? I'm still looking for a solution to my VGA issue, and curious what the upside looks like.

Thanks

Originally posted by cabber
Jeff,

Do you notice any improvements over component inputs and VGA? I'm still looking for a solution to my VGA issue, and curious what the upside looks like.

Thanks

Cabber,

I haven't A-B tested component vs. VGA at this point. I won't get a chance to calibrate any of this stuff until most likely this weekend. I just had a break between baby bathtime and stuff and ran upstairs to do the VGA-TS160 thing. The part that sucks the most about A-B testing with the TS160 is that it requires you to crawl behind the unit and flip a hardware switch to enable component vs. VGA/DVI. So by the time you extract yourself from behind your gear rack, flip the tv to the other input and sit down to compare... well, you've forgotten what the hell the OTHER input looked like. :(

I'll let you know what I find though.

Later,
Jeff

Originally posted by Chip E
Does anyone have an Idea when there will be a replacement for the HLN617W ?

Chip - do a search (on this forum or in Google) on HLN619W. Supposedly has an integrated HD tuner (which frees up your DVI input for the DVD player). There also seems to be discussion as to whether it includes another DVI input, firewire, etc., but nothing definite. Not being "in the business" I have no idea when this set will actually be available. I've seen posts that state as early as Fall 2003 to first quarter 2004. Given the availability of the current sets, I'd say it will be towards the latter date.

Originally posted by Tobin44
Has anyone found any product or home made item that is particularly suitable for positioning a center speaker on the slightly backward sloping top of the DLP's? I know the simple answer is to grab a piece of plywood and start whittling, but I am looking for something a little more elegant to match the TV and the Audes Sentral speaker.

Thanks.

Tobin - I'm not going to totally disagree with Iceblade - the HLN cabinet is flexible. However, I have an older Infinity center channel mounted on top of my 617W that does not seem (to me) to be causing any problems. I actually have tried two speakers - this older one, which has an adjustable "foot" in the back that can be extended to support the speaker, and a new Alpha center which does not have this foot, and is balanced on the top. I will admit that I am a little apprehensive about leaving the newer speaker up there.
That said, I DO plan to buy a stand that allows me to place the center channel below the TV - once I find a stand I like. I'd also like to get the Infinity Alpha 37C, but it's pretty damn big, and I'm not sure I really need it over the plain Alpha Center.

Originally posted by gakon
Chip - do a search (on this forum or in Google) on HLN619W. Supposedly has an integrated HD tuner (which frees up your DVI input for the DVD player). There also seems to be discussion as to whether it includes another DVI input, firewire, etc., but nothing definite. Not being "in the business" I have no idea when this set will actually be available. I've seen posts that state as early as Fall 2003 to first quarter 2004. Given the availability of the current sets, I'd say it will be towards the latter date.


I could be mistaken but I think the integrated tuner is supposed to be OTA ATSC only, *not* DirecTV or E*. So if you want more than just OTA then you're still going to have to use either a DVI input or Component input to provide it. It'd be nice if it's more than that, though.


Rick

Gakon,

Just an FYI in case you haven't seen this stand. I've found it for $388 shipped on the web and several people are now using them with their 61" sets. I plan on ordering it once I make sure of how I want the front of my theater setup.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=289223

Have a good one,
Jeff


Originally posted by gakon

That said, I DO plan to buy a stand that allows me to place the center channel below the TV - once I find a stand I like. I'd also like to get the Infinity Alpha 37C, but it's pretty damn big, and I'm not sure I really need it over the plain Alpha Center.

Were did you find it for $388 shipped?

standsandmounts.com was mentioned in another thread.

See this great post on custom PC resolution using Powerstrip on Samsung HLN to avoid overscan. I shall be home from my travel on Sunday and I am going to try it out.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=2546094#post2546094

Jeff - thanks for the link to the stands. I'm going to post my thoughts there.

GK

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Tobin44
Has anyone found any product or home made item that is particularly suitable for positioning a center speaker on the slightly backward sloping top of the DLP's? I know the simple answer is to grab a piece of plywood and start whittling, but I am looking for something a little more elegant to match the TV and the Audes Sentral speaker.

Thanks.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Tobin - I'm not going to totally disagree with Iceblade - the HLN cabinet is flexible. However, I have an older Infinity center channel mounted on top of my 617W that does not seem (to me) to be causing any problems. I actually have tried two speakers - this older one, which has an adjustable "foot" in the back that can be extended to support the speaker, and a new Alpha center which does not have this foot, and is balanced on the top. I will admit that I am a little apprehensive about leaving the newer speaker up there.
That said, I DO plan to buy a stand that allows me to place the center channel below the TV - once I find a stand I like. I'd also like to get the Infinity Alpha 37C, but it's pretty damn big, and I'm not sure I really need it over the plain Alpha Center.

______________________________________________________

I must put my center apeaker on the TV, as there is no space for one of those large racks. It is sitting there now, fairly stable, but tilted slightly backwards because of the slope of the top of the set. You are going to put your center speaker below the TV?

Thanks

I think I'm going to put it below the TV. Right now the tech craft stand looks good - unfortunately, the center is the only thing that will fit. After just a couple of days with the Infinity Alpha Center (16 lbs) on top, I think it might have actually depressed the center of the cabinet a little - not enough to affect the picture, but enough to get me to move it to the floor. The older center channel I had was 11 lbs and the rear foot distributed some of the weight to the rear cabinet, not just the bezel frame. I wouldn't mount anything more than 8 - 10 lbs on the top (not based on any science, of course), and I'd find a way to take some of the weight off the bezel. If you just have one of those satellite type centers, as was mentioned earlier, you probably won't have a problem, since they're pretty light. Mounting the center underneath seems to be common - search for the threads on stands for the HLM/N's, and you'll find some pictures.

My Unofficial Guide V2.0 to Samsung HLN Series DLP Sets

I can't seem to open this following your instructions. What happened to the old easily downloadable pdf? version? Thanks.

The new HLN507 is less than a day old - I haven't even entered service mode yet. The bottom line - I am very, very happy.

TVA delivered on schedule and Neil helped me with several unpacking and set up questions (I am using the 165 Samsung Tuner; they should have a manual addendum specific for this kind of Sammy/sammy set up - why not?). Everything arrived in good working order.

I hooked up my BUD 4DTV satellite and VCR to the tuner to make it easier to switch among them for others, and all go through DVI/PC audio to the set. The DVD player (not DVI yet) goes right to the set component 1.

Biggest surprise - analog and SDTV OTA reception and PQ was always equal, but more often BETTER, at 10' viewing distance than my 32" Toshiba. Yes, I can see some dithering up close on some, but OTA is generally very good. And the 165 tuner is way more sensitive than the old set - I get analog channels, as well as their clear digital counterparts, I never got from fairly distant broadcasters. Indeed, we in central Carolina appear to have DTV stations coming out of our, uh, ears. Three CBS, three ABC local, two distant, 2 NBC etc etc, even some of the minor networks. I still haven't seen PBS, but nothing up right now and I am close to their tower.

No surprise, but the analog, and especially Sdigital PQ from the C-band satellite is better than I recall seeing when looking at SD small dish in stores (two stores let me do that), with the obvious exception of HD signals - I don't have the box for that yet. I mean not just watchable, but quite good.

In anycase, Arun, if you're interested, I'd be glad to write a CBand version of your Dish and Direct TV satellite summaries in the guide. I now believe the old dinosaurs are well worth considering again if you want the best in SDTV and analog PQ and are willing to put up with the downsides in terms of capital, a BUD, and switching satellites.

As expected, the full screen HDTV signal (the trains thing) was just fabulous and even upconverted DTV CBS football was good (i.e. better than analog, but not spectacular). In general, my OTA DTV picture from Fox and CBS will give me overall better PQ than I'm used to from the old analog set. Again, this is partly due to the tuner/signal thing, but I am now in a sweeter spot all the way round.

Rainbows - I've always known how to move my eyes quick to make them happen, but I don't do that watching the set.

Fan sound - way less than my hard drive, but there if no sound on TV or other ambient room noise - no hassle. No internal reflections yet, but give me some time.

Yuck factors. I was a quarter inch off on how much my rug would compress under the set and stand, and I can't move the set as far back in it's cubby hole as I'd planned - yet. Bigger black bars on LOTR DVD than I expected. The zoom hurt PQ, so I'm going to search to see if I've maximized the picuture size without that. Gray bars on 4:3 for non-DTV inputs? I want black. Is this adjustable in the service menu or elsewhere? If anyone has a quick answer to save me the search on this one, please RSVP. I'll want to mess around with PQ tweaks, but it's darn good right OOB - again, darker scences/black-gray are as I have seen in stores.

I still don't know firmware, but I'll eventually get in there find out. At this point, I don't care, because of how well everything else is working. Thanks Arun and everyone who wrote so much about their experiences with this set, all of whom who helped push me over the edge - and land on my feet!

Jbach, have to agree on the yuck factor. have the 567w at home with the samsung 931 dvd through dvi. all widescreen dvds take full adv of the screen during the intro, then when i actually hit "play movie", I get the bars. haven't found a way around it. any help would be appreciated.
picture oob has been incredible, min. fan noise, no rainbows.
can't wait for the surround sound to show up. thanks to all for helping me pick an awesome set.

Originally posted by Jbach
In anycase, Arun, if you're interested, I'd be glad to write a CBand version of your Dish and Direct TV satellite summaries in the guide. I now believe the old dinosaurs are well worth considering again if you want the best in SDTV and analog PQ and are willing to put up with the downsides in terms of capital, a BUD, and switching satellites.

JBach, please do. You can post it here, and I can then add it to the guide. It is more convenient for me if it is in word format. Thanks.

Originally posted by Jbach
Yuck factors. ... Bigger black bars on LOTR DVD than I expected. The zoom hurt PQ, so I'm going to search to see if I've maximized the picuture size without that.

Gray bars on 4:3 for non-DTV inputs? I want black. ... If anyone has a quick answer to save me the search on this one, please RSVP.
Arun, can you answer the gray bar question? Jbach has a Samsung STB but I don't know which model.

Jbach,

The size of the top and bottom black bars you see when playing LOTR are determined mathematically based on what the director preferred for his film. See if this helps:

Aspect Ratio: (Writen refering to a 16*9 DLP TV)

If you are watching a movie then the aspect ratio will depend on the original film. Your TV will have a fixed aspect ratio of 16x9 (1.77:1) or 4*3 (1.33:1). Some movies are made to be displayed on a 1.77:1 theater screen. Those movies will fill your 16*9 TV screen when the display mode is set to normal. If you display the same film on a 4*3 TV there will have to be black bars at the top and bottom of the screen to preserve the movie's original aspec ratio.

The aspect ratio of a film like "The King and I" is 1.85:1 so it is a little wider than a 16*9 (1.77:1) TV screen. The only way to see a 1.85:1 film without stretching or cropping it is to leave small black bars at the top and bottom of the screen to make up for the fact that you are watching a film image 16 units wide by 8.6 units high on a screen 9 units high. The difference between 9 and 8.6 is so small that you may not even notice the black bars.

As the difference in the ratio of width to height increases the black bars at the top get bigger. Moulin Rouge (2001) has an aspect ratio of 2.35:1 or 16x6.8 so the black bars will be noticeable on your TV. In theaters they have screens big enough to display any film. They also have "black masking" that moves into place to hide the unused portion of the screen -- better black bars.

An older movie done in 4x3, which is what your older TV was patterned after, will have the black bars on the side if you view it on a 16x9 TV.

The stretch and zoom modes protect CRT based RPTVs from burn-in and keep those owners who feel cheated if any of their TV screen isn't used happy. You don't need to protect your DLP set so it's a matter of what you like best.

Don't forget to take into account DVDs that are anamorphic...
http://gregl.net/videophile/anamorphic.htm

Originally posted by Jbach
Gray bars on 4:3 for non-DTV inputs? I want black. Is this adjustable in the service menu or elsewhere? If anyone has a quick answer to save me the search on this one, please RSVP.
On Samsung STB's, there is a bar color option in perferences. You can change it to black or gray.

If the bar is added by the Samsung HLN TV, it is always black.

Thanks to all for your responses. Arun, I somehow missed the color option for the bars in the STB (a 165 model). I'll reexamine this when I get home - all I recall was picking a format like pillbox etc., but not bar color.

HT, thanks for reviewing the bar aspect ratio issue and lmychajluk
for the link on anamorphic. I've understood the basics, but it is nice to have such a coherent synopsis. My ignorance was in how many DVD/films turn out not to fit straight into the 16:9 format (my duh), and what automatic adjustments would or would not be made depending on input DVD. In any case, this is another argument for the biggest screen possible - and the resultant image is still much bigger than my old set - even if it doesn't fill the screen.

Arun: it may be a couple days or so for the C-band satellite summary, but I have Word and will try to use the same terse summary format you used.

For my next trick, I'm going to try to get the tuner power button to power both tuner and TV at the same time (the dreaded discrete code issue on a non-Tantus). My wife just can't believe she needs to press three buttons to turn the TV on or off. I don't blame her.

Hi All,

Just received my HLN507 to replace an older one I had (that had problems) Build date was July and firmware version is 311 (I think or 301) but definitely 3xx. Looked at it this morning when I was still half asleep. Got it Friday, but did not hook up till late Sunday night.

Question: I noticed the vertical bars on 4:3 ratio, that left one is quite larger (wider) then right one, probably by at least 1/2 to 3/4 inch. Is this adjustable using SM? I assume if you could adjust this with older versions of firmware, you could adjust it with theis version.

Is that newer then 2.14?

cmxchuck,

You need to give us some more info. What are you using as your video source? If you are using a STb like the TS160 via the PC or DVI inputs on your set, there is a raster centering setup screen in the TS160 menu. You can adjust the picture to the right and left in order to center it. If you are using some other source please let us know what it is and via what input you are connected.

Later,
Jeff


Originally posted by cmxchuck
Hi All,

Just received my HLN507 to replace an older one I had (that had problems) Build date was July and firmware version is 311 (I think or 301) but definitely 3xx. Looked at it this morning when I was still half asleep. Got it Friday, but did not hook up till late Sunday night.

Question: I noticed the vertical bars on 4:3 ratio, that left one is quite larger (wider) then right one, probably by at least 1/2 to 3/4 inch. Is this adjustable using SM? I assume if you could adjust this with older versions of firmware, you could adjust it with theis version.

Hi Iceblade,

Just component video (480i/p) from Comcast HDTV cable box (Motorola 5100). My older TV (which is in house, but have to ship back tomorrow had side bars of equal width.

So, nothing was changed, except TV. Do you know if this can be adjusted in SM?

Thanks,

Chuck

Originally posted by cmxchuck
Hi Iceblade,

Just component video (480i/p) from Comcast HDTV cable box (Motorola 5100). My older TV (which is in house, but have to ship back tomorrow had side bars of equal width.

So, nothing was changed, except TV. Do you know if this can be adjusted in SM?

Thanks,

Chuck

There are "POS-Y" & "POS-X" settings in the DDP1010 section of the SM which should help.

Jeff

Originally posted by Jbach
For my next trick, I'm going to try to get the tuner power button to power both tuner and TV at the same time (the dreaded discrete code issue on a non-Tantus). My wife just can't believe she needs to press three buttons to turn the TV on or off. I don't blame her.
Be careful. You don't want the power to the HLN turned off abruptly. It needs to go through it's normal shut down routine. :)

HT - I was about to respond with befuddlement to your post when I realized I had overlooked the meaning of the emoticon at the end. Nice one - I'll try it on my wife until I figure out how to use a discrete power code.

JBach,

Unlike Samsung's T160, the T165 does NOT have a gray/black bars option. Wish it did, since I have one too.

Doug - thanks - I guess I wasn't as dumb as I thought when I couldn't find it in preferences! But too bad. Interestingly, it doesn't happen on DTV OTA, just analog OTA and satellite 4/3. But this tuner is so darned good at picking up distant signals I never could get before (this on NTSC TV), I'll learn to live with it.

Jbach, totally agree about the tuner's sensitivity, that's why I kept it despite a couple of user un-friendly oddities.

The reason DTV has black bars is that they're broadcast by the station as part of the signal. Analog broadcasters don't do that of course, so we're stuck with the gray ones generated by the 165. I hardly notice them any more.

BTW, if you're using the DVI output of the 165 to your TV, try setting your DVD player to 480i and plugging its component cables into the 165. We found it made a slight improvement to DVD PQ. Not as good as a DVI player of course, but worth trying.

Originally posted by Jbach

[B But this tuner is so darned good at picking up distant signals I never could get before (this on NTSC TV), I'll learn to live with it. [/B]


What is the "this tuner is ......" your referring to?

We're discussing the Samsung SIR-T165, an OTA-only STB. (We're also hijacking Arun's thread, and really ought to be over at the HDTV Hardware forum.)

kmil: Doug is correct on both points. But, Doug and Arun, I think the subject of STB (and other) hookups to the Samsung DLP could remain on point in this forum for the following reasons:

1) Arun's guide is by all accounts a valuable addition for those who are hooking up their sets, as well as prospective buyers. It has info not easily gleaned from the manuals or Sammy sites
2) Conspicuous by its absence from Samung is a guide aimed at those who buy a DLP and a Samsung STB. In fact, TV authority is considering collecting pieces of wisdom about that issue and doing their own. If not TVA, it might be a useful addendum to Arun's guide - including tips on how best to hook up a 165/160 or for that matter Sony or whatever other STB is popular.

I got the idea to route things through the STB from TVA, and it seems to work, especially because everything works off a single remote. But I sometimes have a lip synch issue with sound going through the PC sound inputs. What' my alternative to fix that? If anyone knows, it might be useful for the guide.

How would I have known to expect gray bars from 165 without your post - or what about DVD's might look better through the 165 than the set itself. That's useful info. Yes, some of that might go to HDTV hardware, but some of it is the connection between Samsung STB and Samsung DLP. Just a thought.

JBach, I agree with you. The guide's purpose is twofold:

- To help a prospective buyer decide if this is the right set, and to select the right model

- To help an owner of a Samsung HLN set maximize the use of the TV. That is why I have included essential information on selecting and hooking up DVD players, STB's, HTPC etc.

Posts on these topics are fine in this thread, as long as they relate to the use of this set, and don't become completely off topic discussions.

JBach, if you want to contribute an expanded section on hooking up STB's, you are welcome to do so.

Haha....in that light, does anyone know what the difference between the T165 and the newer T351 besides price. It also has DVI out but is $300 cheaper. Why is that?

Thanks!

Arun - if I ever figure it all out, I'll be glad to write up something. Right now, I'm just collecting info in the dark and trying some alternatives. If anyone wants to PM me with suggestions, tips, experiences or provide them here, please do. I'll start a collection.

andwhite1 - expect the 165 to come down in $, but the T351 actually has additional cable tuning capability. I'm expecting overall sensitivity and quality to be better on the 165, and I'm not sure the T351 has firewire (I plan on getting DVHS at some point). But this discussion does belong on the hardware thread.

Originally posted by Doug Deacon


BTW, if you're using the DVI output of the 165 to your TV, try setting your DVD player to 480i and plugging its component cables into the 165. We found it made a slight improvement to DVD PQ. Not as good as a DVI player of course, but worth trying.

I used to have my DVD player going into the 165 via component so that I could output via the DVI.
PhilB later told me that he had noticed definite color problems when using this configuration. Now I tend to agree. The color setting on my 507 using Avia with my RP82 plugged into the component in on the 165 was only around 30. My color setting using a Sammy HD931 hooked directly to the DVI input is now 52, which is much closer to what others are getting. My OTA HDTV now looks much better with the higher color setting.
I am now using my DVD player via component 1 on the 507 & it still looks really good (with a color setting ~50).

Jeff

Jbach,

I was just trying to stop being so helpful and get some work done. ;)

Arun's good example and gentle manners are too inspiring. :)

Originally posted by jedvik
The color setting on my 507 using Avia with my RP82 plugged into the component in on the 165 was only around 30. My color setting using a Sammy HD931 hooked directly to the DVI input is now 52, which is much closer to what others are getting. I've found a similar difference with my Phillips DV724/165/437W setup. I use a lower color setting when watching a DVD then when watching OTA TV. My Avia color decoder settings (for DVD) are spot on, within 1-2%. I have no way to judge except by eyeballing how good they are for OTA. We still prefer the slightly greater stability that we get running thru the 165, YMMV I guess.

FWIW, I also need different Brightness settings, lower for analog OTA, higher for DVD, highest for digital OTA and all varying depending on time of day/ambient light. Pain in the neck but we do end up with decent PQ after the appropriate fiddling.

Originally posted by Jbach
kmil: . In fact, TV authority is considering collecting pieces of wisdom about that issue and doing their own. .


Arun

Better copyright your guide :D :D :D

Originally posted by arungupta
JBach, I agree with you. The guide's purpose is twofold:

- To help a prospective buyer decide if this is the right set, and to select the right model

- To help an owner of a Samsung HLN set maximize the use of the TV. That is why I have included essential information on selecting and hooking up DVD players, STB's, HTPC etc.

Posts on these topics are fine in this thread, as long as they relate to the use of this set, and don't become completely off topic discussions.

JBach, if you want to contribute an expanded section on hooking up STB's, you are welcome to do so.


Arungupta: You recently mentioned you'd have an update of your excellent HLN Guide. When might we expect that update?

Thanks!

I just read arungupta's outstanding epistle on the hln series. I wish I would have read it 9 months ago and saved myself a lot of time and hair.
I'm looking forward to his opinion of the OmniView 4 port DVI switch.
Great Work!

Doug Deacon: "I was just trying to stop being so helpful and get some work done.
Arun's good example and gentle manners are too inspiring."

Ah, but Arun is not only nice but clever with annoying pests like me:

"JBach, if you want to contribute an expanded section on hooking up STB's, you are welcome to do so."

In other words (certainly not any Arun would use), put up or shut up!"

Darn, and I was hoping just to get all this insight with no work on my part.

Hi, I think I have some updates for the wonderful Sammy DLP Guide. I have a HLN507W. Am I the only person that experiences the following problem?

1)
Lets say I am watching a movie using DVD via DVI connection (I have the Sammy 931 and I decide to pause a movie to switch to my PC (connected via VGA port).

I work on the PC a while... then decide I can go back to my movie. When I switch back to the DVI port all I get is static. I can return to the menu, pause, stop and start.. nothing returns the picture unless I turn the player off and on again. This has happened 3-4 times.

2) I was watching "Band of Brothers" and was playing with the DVD players DVI rez output button.. when I changed it to 1080i I got a line on the bottom of the picture... I guess its not necessary to really do anything but 720p but I just thought I would mention it.


Also, yes, please update us on the DVI switch! I want a DVI HD Sat and/or OTC receiver.. I dread swapping cables.. I remember having to do that with S-video was kinda new. Wish the STB had DVI "in and out" ports. :(

Thx,

Eric

Yes, this happens to me under the same circumstances (I switch to the PC input to watch HDTV). I think the DVI and Sammy get out of syn.

The solution is to cycle through the scaling button on the DVD player (the one that selects 480, 720 and 1080 output). When you come back around to the 720p output (the blue light), the picture is back (at least on mine it is). Its one of many minor annoyances with the 931 player, but you just can't beat the picture.

I just ordered a HLN617W from Circuit City and they had no clue on the date of arrival. I have done lots of research. I hope I did not make a mistake in buying this new technology. Do you all like the Samsung DLP Television? Are you happy with the performance compared to the typical projection TVs? Anyone knows whether the 61 inch is currently available or the date of arrival in the marketplace?
Also, I am looking for the Samsung Stand for the 61 inch. Anyone knows where to buy one and for how much? Please advise. I thank you in advance for your kindness.

Alex.
My e-mail address is wdcholyman@aol.com

The 61" Samsung has been in the market place since December or before.

You might want to do what a lot of CC customers have been doing in the forum -- check with Keith! He will give you a price delivered through your local CC. You can then either ask for a match or cancel and let Keith place the order for you. It's worth a call.

*******************

Circuit City
Boca Raton Fl.
Keith
(561)368-3871

hey guys it's keith. sorry i haven't been availbe lately but if i am not at the store owen, bob, or jason can help you get the tv set up. the best way to get hold of me is on my cell phone at 561-628-5540

"rkpriddy33"

********************

Alex - you don't say where you live, but the HLN617W is available. I'm surprised CC didn't give you an estimated delivery, but they may just be a little wary of promising something. I did wait a little over 6 weeks for mine, but received it at the beginning of August (Denver, CO). They're probably still just trickling in.
I haven't seen the stand for much less than retail anywhere ($550 - 600). You should be able to buy it through CC, or search for the TR61L2S on Google. There are other stands available (one of the best matches appears to be a TechCraft stand). Search the threads and you'll find pictures of other Samsung DLP owners' stands.

I am in Columbia, Maryland (between Baltimore and DC). I just ordered a HLN617W from Circuit City and they had no clue on the date of arrival. The rpice was $4,999. I have done lots of research. I hope I did not make a mistake in buying this new technology. Do you all like the Samsung DLP Television? Are you happy with the performance compared to the typical projection TVs? Anyone knows whether the 61 inch is currently available or the date of arrival in the marketplace?
Also, I am looking for the Samsung Stand for the 61 inch. Anyone knows where to buy one and for how much? Or, can you give another brand or model number for an alternative stand? Please advise. I thank you in advance for your kindness.

Alex.
My e-mail address is wdcholyman@aol.com

Originally posted by alexjameskurien
The rpice was $4,999. Alex.

I think you can get a better price from CC by making use of Keith. :D

I called CC in Boca and they told me that the HLN617W is on back order for 9/30 delivery. Wow!!! This is just crazy. Anyone knows another safe and secure location to buy this 61 inch dlp systm???? I am in Columbia, Maryland.

Best Regards
Alex

Apparently Keith does not work there any longer. I would appreciate advise on price????? Keith, if you are reading this e-mail, can you advise?

Thank you in advance,
Alex

Originally posted by alexjameskurien
I called CC in Boca and they told me that the HLN617W is on back order for 9/30 delivery. Wow!!! This is just crazy. Anyone knows another safe and secure location to buy this 61 inch dlp systm???? I am in Columbia, Maryland.

Best Regards
Alex

You anywhere near Gaithersburg? Great Indoors carries them. Mine was delivered in a week. Sears also carries them

http://www.thegreatindoors.com/tgi/sitehelper/TGI_Selected_Store.jsp?BV_SessionID=@@@@1114206950.106140527 2@@@@&BV_EngineID=ccceadcjefkgilgcehgcemgdffmdfim.0&unitnum=0001917

Alex -
There's also a Tweeter in Rockville, which is where I purchased my HLM617 back in January. Give them a try as well!
Rob

Alex:
Try Neil Kusens at TV Authority. He has a very good reputation on this forum.

Originally posted by alexjameskurien
Apparently Keith does not work there any longer. I would appreciate advise on price????? Keith, if you are reading this e-mail, can you advise?

Thank you in advance,
Alex
Did you get to talk to any of his salesmen (Owen, Bob, or Jason)?

The HLN617 may be in short supply because of the large numbers of HLN467/567 sets that arrived recently. Other dealers have them in stock in our area including CC. I just called CC and they can deliver tomorrow. That "might" be true.

Magnolia Hi Fi has them and I'm more confident that their information is correct.

Another dealer that never knows when they will get shipments of any product still has their demo for sale.

The current supply seems to be spotty in our area but it is available.

htwaits, well I ordered my pt-50lc13 from owen today, and he said that keith woul dbe in tomorrow so I do not think he was fired or anything, hell he proably is being promoted to CEO :)

Friends-
I tried everyone in the DC metro. No one seems to have the HLN617W in stock. If anyone knows of someone or some store and a price, please advise ASAP.

Any information on the Samsung Stand for the HLN617W????

Thanks much,
Alex

Originally posted by J. Reed
htwaits, well I ordered my pt-50lc13 from owen today, and he said that keith woul dbe in tomorrow so I do not think he was fired or anything, hell he proably is being promoted to CEO :)
I agree that he should be promoted but somehow I didn't give CC that kind of credit.

I got interested in how available the HLN617 is in our area so I called CC. The first "*****" on the line told me that they didn't carry any Samsung HLN sets. I had him try three times because they had one on display Sunday. When I ask to talk to the manager I was disconnected.

I called back via a different option in their phone system and found someone who could deliver the HLN617 tomorrow.

Who does one believe? :confused: :rolleyes: ;)

Hello

First off, kudos on the guide - Thank you

I was reading that you picked up a Belkin SOHO (DVI switch) and were getting it around mid-August.

So, how does it work? Does it degrade the picture quality at all?

Thanks

Did you guys not see a few posts up that Keith just posted today??? It's pretty funny. Everyone's asking if Keith is still around and he already answered your questions.

Originally posted by brvheart
Did you guys not see a few posts up that Keith just posted today??? It's pretty funny. Everyone's asking if Keith is still around and he already answered your questions.
I think you are referring to my post which quotes Keith from 08/16/2003 in the "Panasonic PT-50LC13 Availability" thread. That's the only post "search" finds for him this week.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=2571886#post2571886

In any event, the report of his demise seems to have been premature. :D

He makes it better for everyone. Long live Keith!

I didn't go far enough.

Keith for governor ... of California. It's clear we need him more than Florida. :rolleyes:

Originally posted by htwaits
I didn't go far enough.

Keith for governor ... of California. It's clear we need him more than Florida. :rolleyes:

Sorry Les, but we'd like to keep him (he's currently working on the hangng chad issue, which is why he has been unable to post :) ) Besides, you've got about 3000 choices for governor right now. Surely one of them is ok ?:p :D

Mike

Originally posted by Mike_in_FL
Sorry Les, but we'd like to keep him (he's currently working on the hangng chad issue, which is why he has been unable to post :) ) Besides, you've got about 3000 choices for governor right now. Surely one of them is ok ?:p :D

Mike
We lost one yesterday. It turned out he was a murder suspect. :rolleyes:

Originally posted by Kevin R. Anderson
Yes, this happens to me under the same circumstances (I switch to the PC input to watch HDTV). I think the DVI and Sammy get out of syn.

The solution is to cycle through the scaling button on the DVD player (the one that selects 480, 720 and 1080 output). ..... Its one of many minor annoyances with the 931 player, but you just can't beat the picture.

Humph, I think I tried that each time and it didn't help.. I'll try again next time. Yes I love the picture.. I can't imagine what those with HTPCs can see (T2 - WMP9 etc)... then again, I'm trying to get OTC too but haven't gotten a tuner yet... :(

Originally posted by Professor Dave
I was reading that you picked up a Belkin SOHO (DVI switch) and were getting it around mid-August.

So, how does it work? Does it degrade the picture quality at all?

I am sorry to say that I haven't yet received it -- and I don't even have a definite answer on when I shall receive it.

buy.com is selling the Belkin 2 port Switch for $99

I'd be real curious if it degrades the signal at all.

For what it's worth,

I purchased a HLN617w on AUG. 10th from the CC in Sarasota,FL. At the time they told me they had 17 back ordered and it might be 4-6 weeks before delivery. They had 21 arrive yesterday, all pre-sold, I get mine Friday. The manager I dealt with thinks they might receive 20-25 61's a month, in our area. I can't wait till Friday to try out all the great features on this set.

Thanks for all the great information already shared on this and many other threads.

David

Has anyone been able to compare the various HLN models (43"-56")side by side to see if there is any perceptable difference in the brightness levels?

I am just currious since they all use the same 100w bulb, my assumption would be that the smaller models would appear to be brighter.

Thanks........Dustyn

Originally posted by DustynW
Has anyone been able to compare the various HLN models (43"-56")side by side to see if there is any perceptable difference in the brightness levels?

I am just currious since they all use the same 100w bulb, my assumption would be that the smaller models would appear to be brighter.


This was a major concern of mine before ordering the 567. I haven't seen them side-by-side, but I can't imagine anyone wanting greater brightness than the 567 is capable of. The longer life and lessened heat make the use of the 100w bulb a plus in my view.

Originally posted by DustynW
Has anyone been able to compare the various HLN models (43"-56")side by side to see if there is any perceptable difference in the brightness levels?
Thanks........Dustyn
I have, but I wasn't focusing on brightness. For me there wasn't a significant difference. I'm going with the HLN567. :)

Friends-

I am still looking around for a HLN617W in the Washington DC Metro area. I have this one in order from CC and they have no clue on arrival date. Anyone knows a reasonable price for the system from a similar store. I found that the internet price from crazy stores without this item in stock is not really rependable. I got burnt once before on another item.

I am also looking for a comparable stand for the TV??? What are your thoughts on a Bose AM 15 II Surround system with a Onkyo 6.1 Receiver?? compared to a all in one box system??? I am sorry for asking all these questions. I am a full novice when it comes to technology.

Thank you all in advance for being patient with me.

Alex

Arun, or anybody else with good technical contacts at Samsung, Pioneer is starting to become aware that the Sammy DLP sets don't work with the DVI out on Pioneer's HD cable STB (the 3510HD & 3500HD).

This post/thread explains it:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=2545922#post2545922

Please, if anyone can lend their extensive experience or knowledge to this matter, you'd have my sincerest gratitude. TIA.
- Craig
p.s. I posted here because I also thought it might be FAQ-worthy information.

Ok here is a thought...I thought I saw on one of threads about the Pioneer 3510 that the native output resolution for DVI was 1080i. I know in the case of component 2 output it says initially 1080i when you hit the settings. I remember reading in one of the Bravo D1 review that when they attempted to use the Bravo in 1080i on the Samsung through DVI it wouldn't work. Could their be some fundamental compatability issue with the Samsung DVI port and 1080i. Could this be the same issue for the Pioneer/Samsung?
Shawn

The Pioneer 3510HD allows you to set the HD output to any ED or HD format (480i/p, 720p, 1080i), so I don't think this is the problem.

Shawn,

Not really sure about that... what I CAN tell you is that 1080i being output from my TS160 STB via DVI looks just fine on my HLN617... though I do think that 720p looks better.

Later,
Jeff




Originally posted by shawn67
Ok here is a thought...I thought I saw on one of threads about the Pioneer 3510 that the native output resolution for DVI was 1080i. I know in the case of component 2 output it says initially 1080i when you hit the settings. I remember reading in one of the Bravo D1 review that when they attempted to use the Bravo in 1080i on the Samsung through DVI it wouldn't work. Could their be some fundamental compatability issue with the Samsung DVI port and 1080i. Could this be the same issue for the Pioneer/Samsung?
Shawn

[QUOTE]Originally posted by alexjameskurien
[B]Friends-

I am still looking around for a HLN617W in the Washington DC Metro area. I have this one in order from CC and they have no clue on arrival date. Anyone knows a reasonable price for the system from a similar store. I found that the internet price from crazy stores without this item in stock is not really rependable. I got burnt once before on another item.
:confused: Alex, I'm also in the DC area and have been considering one of the HLN sets. Unfortunately, it seems that most (all?) of the dealers in this area are not up to speed on these sets, and can't seem to provide much in the way of real information about availability. A couple of the BB stores have the 50" set and the smaller one, but haven't seen the 46, 56, or 61" sets anywhere, and don't believe much that the stores tell me.

Ben

Originally posted by cmf
Arun, or anybody else with good technical contacts at Samsung, Pioneer is starting to become aware that the Sammy DLP sets don't work with the DVI out on Pioneer's HD cable STB (the 3510HD & 3500HD).

This post/thread explains it:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=2545922#post2545922

Please, if anyone can lend their extensive experience or knowledge to this matter, you'd have my sincerest gratitude. TIA.
- Craig
p.s. I posted here because I also thought it might be FAQ-worthy information.
I don't have any direct contacts at Samsung. Maybe you can PM Alan Gouger, David Bott or Ken H and see if they provide any contacts.

I believe this is the first compatibility issue reported on this set. I will add a compatibility section to the guide and add this as an open issue.

I couldn't determine from the other thread if pioneer works well with other displays and only has issues with Samsung - or does it have compatibility issues with other sets as well.

Originally posted by arungupta
I don't have any direct contacts at Samsung. Maybe you can PM Alan Gouger, David Bott or Ken H and see if they provide any contacts.

I'll give this thread some time -- David Bott, at least, seems to read these fairly regularly.


I believe this is the first compatibility issue reported on this set. I will add a compatibility section to the guide and add this as an open issue.

Cool...thanks.

I couldn't determine from the other thread if pioneer works well with other displays and only has issues with Samsung - or does it have compatibility issues with other sets as well.

I've heard of a Sony LCD RP owner and a CRT owner (don't remember which brand) both say it works for them either on this list or in RL, so I have to believe that [gulp] it may be our sets. eek!
- Craig

So does anyone see any benefits in getting a normal Satellite receiver that has component outputs as opposed to S-video outputs? Samsung has a new receiver thats only 100 bucks that has this feature.

If you are hooking it up to a Samsung HLN, then you should get one with DVI output.

Ditto on the DVI output for the STB. I've tried S-video, component and DVI from my STB to my DLP. The PQ improves, in that order.

I am hooking up to Samsung DLP, but I don't think there is a normal, noHD sat receiver with DVI. But they do have ones with component out. Thats why I asked if there would be a difference in PQ with that compared to a S-video sat receiver.

Well, as I said, component beat S-video in my setup. In theory it should, although it may vary depending on the receiver.

What receiver are you using?

Samsung SIR-T165, OTA only with DVI. My trees are too tall for satellite reception. FWIW, we run the component cables from our DVDp into the T165. All signals go to the TV via the DVI cable, except for the once a year we watch a VHS tape.

Hi all

I'd appreciate any help with my problem.

I got the samsung HLN617W about a month ago. I just noticed a problem. I cannot see the color tone option in the user menu when I am watching TV, including HDTV. I am connected through component 3. Also, the "film mode" is greyed out. When I play the DVD player through component 1, I have these options. I could swear that I have adjusted the color tone for regular TV before....

I called Samsung tech support and they told me that the color tone and film mode are disabled in the component 3 connection and all others should have it. I connected the cable box to component 2 but still do not have the options. Is this the way it is supposed to be?

Ravi

Maybe the tech miss-spoke. Component two and three are identical. I don't have a set but it makes sense to me that they would be the same.

Then, is it normal not to be able to adjust the color tone for these inputs?


Ravi

Samsung tech thought so. Maybe someone here can confirm. It's only been an hour and a half.

Ravi, except for the first 2 weeks of owning this set, I have not used component inputs. If no one posts any info by tomorrow, I'll change my connections and check.

This is an excellent board. I bought an HLM507W at the end of April...Ultimate Audio was closing out them out in anticipation of the HLN's. They still haven"t gotten any in stock.

I just downloaded the guide, and I want to thank you so much for it...it is infinitely more informative then either the owner's manual or the Samsung web site.

I have a lot of questions about the TV, but before I just start posting them, can anyone advise on etiquette? Subject matter of questions, etc.? Also, since my set is an HLM, am I technically Off Topic in this thread?

Thanks again for all the great info.

Ahh...I see...I just purchased a normal Non-HD sat receiver that has component outputs. That is what I was asking about. If you have a HD box then it is different. Does anyone have a normal nonHD sat receiver running component outputs?

Originally posted by HLM507WFan
I have a lot of questions about the TV, but before I just start posting them, can anyone advise on etiquette? Subject matter of questions, etc.? Also, since my set is an HLM, am I technically Off Topic in this thread?

Thanks again for all the great info.
Yours is the first post that I can remember on this forum of somebody asking about etiquette. With manners like yours, we need you just to raise the civility level on this forum. ;)

Of course you are invited - post your experiences, ask questions, make comments, get into arguments, help others. If you are asking questions, be as specific as you can -- those type of questions get the quickest and the best responses.

Welcome aboard!

I've looked through your guide and didn't see any mention of PiP if your TV is connected to a cable box. The Samsung site says you can't get PiP this way. Does anyone know of a way to make it work? I miss PiP.

The DLP's PIP capabilities are... to be nice... subpar.

Regardless, I still want my PiP.

PIP is covered in section 7. I have excerpted it here:

-- PIP can be either side by side, or in a PIP window in the bottom right corner in multiple sizes. When in "Large" or "Small" PIP mode you can use the "Locate" button to move the picture around the four corners of the screen.

-- DVI, VGA and Component inputs other than 480i can only be used as the main image; they cannot appear side by side or in the PIP window. Antenna/RF-A, Composite/S-Video, and Component 480i sources can be used side by side or in the PIP window.

How you connect to the cable box is material in how you use PIP.

I currently have analog cable running thru a stand-alone TiVo, but I'm looking to upgrade to HDTV and digital cable (thru Comcast in the SF Bay area). I've seen the DLP's at CC and was very impressed by the picture quality, but what they were showing was, of course, HD. They did also have an analog line coming in (thru the RF jack) and, in my mind, the picture was less than stellar (borderline unacceptable). That's not too surprising based on what I've seen here, which is that the verdict on SDTV and the Sammy DLP is pretty mixed and PQ appears to be largely dependent on signal quality. So, some questions I have that I'm hoping some TiVo-loving DLP owner can answer are:

1. This one is non-TiVo specific: all things being equal (i.e. signal strength) how does PQ compare for normal analog cable vs. digital cable?

2. How does the DLP do with TiVo'ed shows given that TiVo's compression results in further degradation of quality? I generally record in "high" quality since that looks perfectly adequate to me on my 25" analog TV.

3. I've read about the DCDi capabilities of the Samsungs and wonder how, if at all, that affects analog signals from either TiVo or directly from a cable box. (Since my TiVo only has S-vid and composite out I assume there's no help here since my understanding is that the DCDi only operates on the 480i component input).

4. Given that TiVo doesn't do HD, how would you recommend I setup my system to continue to use TiVo for most programming but, for sports and other HDTV programming, make use of the sets features? My current thinking (based on the TiVo forums) is to have two cable boxes: one SD and one HD, the former going to TiVo via S-vid and then to the TV and the latter connected to the TV directly. Any other suggestions?

Thanks for the info -
Ken

I've had my 5065 W for three months and it looks like the bulb is defective. The picture is on for 30-60 seconds and then it goes dark and I get the three flashing lights below the screen. I'm surprised that this would happen. I'm used to Microsoft rushing software to market that is full of bugs, but haven't experienced this with other tech products. This is a pretty expensive gadget and to have problems this soon is a little disconcerting

Tobin, I agree that this problem is disconcerting. Luckily the solution for the problem is relatively easy - replacing the bulb. But I agree that Samsung should've addressed this problem by now. I am hoping that Samsung has indeed licked this problem with their more recent production runs.

I wonder if Samsung is even at fault with the bulbs. Almost sounds like poor QC on the part of the bulb makers. Hopefully that is being resolved as replacing a burnt out bulb with another bad bulb would be even more frustrating and of course more expensive.

Originally posted by korion
I currently have analog cable running thru a stand-alone TiVo, but I'm looking to upgrade to HDTV and digital cable (thru Comcast in the SF Bay area). I've seen the DLP's at CC and was very impressed by the picture quality, but what they were showing was, of course, HD. They did also have an analog line coming in (thru the RF jack) and, in my mind, the picture was less than stellar (borderline unacceptable). That's not too surprising based on what I've seen here, which is that the verdict on SDTV and the Sammy DLP is pretty mixed and PQ appears to be largely dependent on signal quality. So, some questions I have that I'm hoping some TiVo-loving DLP owner can answer are:

1. This one is non-TiVo specific: all things being equal (i.e. signal strength) how does PQ compare for normal analog cable vs. digital cable?


In my experience, and this sound typical of most others, it varies greatly from channel to channel. I'm on TWC and some channels are utter garbage (Bravo) and some are just gorgeous (Discovery, non-HD). Those are both analog channels. Most digital channels are very decent -- few I've seen are as bad as the worst analog channels, but most have minor artifacting in them from time to time. Of course, this answer has nothing to do with the TiVo...

2. How does the DLP do with TiVo'ed shows given that TiVo's compression results in further degradation of quality? I generally record in "high" quality since that looks perfectly adequate to me on my 25" analog TV.

We were compressing stuff at "Good" quality (3rd down the list of 4 options...one up from the highest compression / lowest quality) when we had our 27" CRT Sony. When we got our 43" DLP, we immediately had to increase the quality setting to "Better" (one down from "Best") in order to keep me from running screaming from the room. On these TV's TiVo adds noticeable compression, IMO, so you'll likely want to use "Best" quality if you can deal with the lost of recording space. I'm *eagerly* awaiting an HD TiVo (or equivalent from TWC), one with at least 20 hours of space using the lowest compression rate, so that I can go back to using the TiVo as our default viewing mode. My wife doesn't care -- to her, TiVo is the only way to watch TV. For me, however, the degradation in PQ is enough to get me to watch "live" stuff directly off the STB.

3. I've read about the DCDi capabilities of the Samsungs and wonder how, if at all, that affects analog signals from either TiVo or directly from a cable box. (Since my TiVo only has S-vid and composite out I assume there's no help here since my understanding is that the DCDi only operates on the 480i component input).

I've messed around with DCDi a bit and find that it modestly improves the PQ to my eyes. I don't think I'd miss it if it wasn't there, but since I have it, I use it.

4. Given that TiVo doesn't do HD, how would you recommend I setup my system to continue to use TiVo for most programming but, for sports and other HDTV programming, make use of the sets features? My current thinking (based on the TiVo forums) is to have two cable boxes: one SD and one HD, the former going to TiVo via S-vid and then to the TV and the latter connected to the TV directly. Any other suggestions?

Hmm...can't help you there. I haven't gotten around to trying to get the TiVo (series 1) to record anything but analog cable coming directly out of the wall (everything the wife cares about is on analog and it is *her* TiVo (an anniversary gift from me) after all).

If you figure out a good setup, post it somewhere, would you? Thanks.
- Craig

See Loyd's Home Theater Journey (http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,3973,1229772,00.asp) at ExtremeTech.

This 6 page article describes ExtremeTech editor Lloyd Case's experience with his home theater set up centered around a Samsung 50 inch DLP. It is a very informative article for prospective and current owners of this set.

Originally posted by arungupta
Yours is the first post that I can remember on this forum of somebody asking about etiquette. With manners like yours, we need you just to raise the civility level on this forum. ;)

Of course you are invited - post your experiences, ask questions, make comments, get into arguments, help others. If you are asking questions, be as specific as you can -- those type of questions get the quickest and the best responses.

Welcome aboard!

Thanks for the encouragement!

I guess my first question is whether my HLM507 has DNIe (I dont think it does) and if not, am I missing that much?

Also, I was really disappointed in the owner's manual that came with the TV -- really didnt have a lot by way of technical info...for example, I had to learn about the Mute-1-8-2-Power from the internet, and still cant find that specific information at any Samsung official web site.

So, can anyone give me a shorthand education (or refer me to someplace here where it's already been done) that explains what information is available and adjustments can be made when I go into that mode? Also are there other such "secrets" that an owner should know about but isnt informed of by way of Samsung literature?

Thanks for any help anyone can give!

The HLM's do not have DNIe. Samsung doesn't want you in the service menu, which is why they don't put the access code in their manual. There are plenty of threads on tweaking the DLP's. The search engine should help you find them.

HLM507WFan,

Andrew67 was correct. Before you change anything in the Service Menu (SM):

1) Know that the SM settings are different for each input. Whatever input you're on (DVI, Component 1, S Video 2, etc.) when you enter the SM, you're only changing the SM settings for that input

2) WRITE DOWN YOUR ORIGINAL SETTINGS BEFORE YOU CHANGE ANYTHING!!! There is NO WAY to reset the TV, except by manually changing anything you've fiddled with back to where it was. If you forget/lose your original settings, they're gone. Each HLM was set differently from the next, even if they share the same firmware version and build date. You have been warned.

3) If you combine 1 and 2 above, you'll note that you'll have to keep a separate SM list for each input. Don't neglect this.

Having said all that, the most important SM tweaks for any HLM set are these:
- on the DDP1010 submenu, change Gamma to 0 (default is probably 5)
- on the MN82860 submenu, change BKAKOU, BLIM and BSTPO all to 0.
These will noticeably improve black levels and shadow detail.

Beyond that there are a couple of threads you should read. I'll go find them and post them, since they're rather old, sort of like our HLM TV's ;)

Doug and Andrew..."Thank you" doesnt seem to go far enough...Thanks for the warnings about SM...I dont think I will venture any changes at least for now...you sufficiently scared the daylights out of me!!!

Am I missing much by not having DNIe?

Here are some HLM-related threads:

Samsung DLP suggested SM tweaks
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=181149&highlight=bkakou+blim

KenLand’s final PRE-upgrade settings
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=287481&highlight=bkakou+blim

Colorfacts calibrated HLM results
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=196287&highlight=bkakou+blim

I'll leave the rest of the hunting to you. Enjoy the show!

HLM,

You're welcome. I learned so much here last year it seems only right to give a little back.

Don't be afraid to try the four tweaks I suggested. They really do help and are pretty universally agreed upon by HLM users.

Since I have an HLM also, I don't have DNIe. I've read mixed reports, it gives somewhat better detail for some, yet others complain of slightly excessive edge enhancement. Seems the jury's still out.

Originally posted by HLM507WFan
Thanks for the encouragement!

I guess my first question is whether my HLM507 has DNIe (I dont think it does) and if not, am I missing that much?

It might have DNIe if it's one of the last HLM sets built. Check in the SM for the Faroudja menu item. If it's the 2200 version then you don't have DNIe, but if you have the 2300 Faroudja menu you have DNIe.

If you don't have it then you can use the original tweak threads. If you do have it you will need to look for tweaks compatible with the version of firmware that you find in your set. The last three numbers in the long ID at the bottom of the first screen is the firmware version number.

Good point, Les.

HLM507WFan,

If you can't find the FL2200 and MN82860 submenus then you have a "hybrid" set, ie, HLM designation (old) with HLN internals (new). There were a few of these produced in late 2002/early 2003 when Samsung had used up all the original chipsets but still had some HLM cases left.

If that's what you have, the HLM tweaks won't work. You'll have to read this thread and ask Arun Gupta and others for help, since your set will be more like theirs.

Here's a question concerning bulb life: Is it best to turn the DLP off if the set is not going to be watched for the next hour, or is the bulb life shortened more by cycling the power on and off?

Originally posted by Doug Deacon
Good point, Les.

HLM507WFan,

If you can't find the FL2200 and MN82860 submenus then you have a "hybrid" set, ie, HLM designation (old) with HLN internals (new). There were a few of these produced in late 2002/early 2003 when Samsung had used up all the original chipsets but still had some HLM cases left.

If that's what you have, the HLM tweaks won't work. You'll have to read this thread and ask Arun Gupta and others for help, since your set will be more like theirs.

Very interesting...the date at the bottom of the SM says November 30, 2002...i wrote down the firmware number but left it on the kitchen table...I will post it shortly...I did find the FL2200 and MN82860 submenus.

Now for the funny part...I made the tweaks to the Gamma and other Black settings that were suggested a few posts ago...and the picture went crazy!! I was watching Monday Night Football (just a coax cable transmission, not in HD) and the blacks were dancing and bleeding all over everything...it scared the hell out of me!! you couldnt read the black "scorecard" that ABC puts in the upper left corner with the MNF logo...so I changed back to the original settings. Did I do something wrong? Should I just mind my own business?

Thanks again everyone for all of your very informative posts!!

Originally posted by HLM507WFan
Did I do something wrong? Should I just mind my own business?

Tweaks may not work correctly if there is too much difference in firmware versions. It sounds like you applied the HLN tweaks to a HLM set.

Here is the first HLM thread that I noticed:

"Samsung DLP suggested SM tweaks"

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=181149&perpage=20&pagenumber=1

Here are some other HLM tweak threads.

" ColorFacts calibrated HLM507 results"

http://archive2.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=196287

"DLP setup using Avia"

http://archive2.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=2030980#post2030980

"Gamma Settings on HLM507"

http://archive2.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=231055

"HLM437W Colorfacts Calibration, Round 2"

http://archive2.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=224870

Spad: this is a classic question, and while I'm not sure anyone knows about these particular bulbs, I know we have at least one lamp expert prowling these pages who developed a statistical model of lamp failure based on some broad experience in the industry. I hope he or someone else will give some general guidance, because we are asking the same question at home. At this point, we're not turning the set off if unattended for as little as 15 to 30 minutes, but if we know it's an hour, that seems like a long time of wasted power - also that's not like a rapid on off sequence. I know I'd be switching it off more often with an LCOS.

What I recall from my electrical / electronics engineering training, most component failures happen during power on / power off cycles. I don't know if it applies to this bulb.

For those of you who may be waiting for a report on the Belkin 4 port DVI switch that I ordered more than a month ago, I am sorry to say that I am still waiting for it. I came back from a trip today and I expected to see it, but no cigar. Next tuesday, I am leaving for a 5 week trip abroad, so it is unlikely that I will be able to receive and report on it before I leave. Does anyone else want to volunteer to test it in this duration? I am still hoping that it will be available soon.

Did you ever get the X2vga? I received mine. So far its pretty great. Though I am waiting for a better cable. Right now I am using a cheap VGA cable, want to see if their is a difference with a thicker SVGA cable.

Quick question...and I know this sounds a little odd..but does anyone hear their tv make noises that can only be described as "creaky"? Like creaking noises. It almost sounds like the stand might be making the noise, or it sounds like the noise that might be heard if the weight of the TV was too much for the stand. I have a 43 inch, and the stand that is made for it. Does anyone have any idea about what I am talking about or do I need to check myself into a mental ward?

Originally posted by arungupta
Does anyone else want to volunteer to test it in this duration? I am still hoping that it will be available soon.

I can test it, but I don't have one, and I haven't ordered one.

I do have a 2 week old HLN4365, a cable box with dvi out and a bravo d1. I haven't connected the d1 yet because of the switching issue. However, I did buy all the recommended cables for doing the manual switching, so I have the cables in house to test it if one were to show up at my door. :)

I'd be willing to order one, provided I can return it, no questions asked, if it doesn't work out.

-David

Originally posted by maxvengeance111
Quick question...and I know this sounds a little odd..but does anyone hear their tv make noises that can only be described as "creaky"? Like creaking noises. It almost sounds like the stand might be making the noise, or it sounds like the noise that might be heard if the weight of the TV was too much for the stand. I have a 43 inch, and the stand that is made for it. Does anyone have any idea about what I am talking about or do I need to check myself into a mental ward?

I wouldnt have admitted it but I've heard the same thing. I have a 617 but no stand. It is built into the wall, sitting on a heavily reinforced base. Figured I'd juat wait until the whole thing collapsed. :D :D

I don't hear any creaking, but the dull hum of my 617 might start driving me nutzo one of these days. It's not really *that* loud, but the frequency is noticeable when I'm using little (or no) volume...

I was able to produce the sound. If you lightly press down on the top of the set, that is the noise I hear all the time. Very strange.

I've been testing out a couple of PVR programs, specifically SnapStream and ShowShifter, to view DirecTv from the composite video out of my receiver. My HLN507 is connected via DVI to my HTPC. I can compare the signals with the S-Video input directly to the HLN507. Although the direct connection looks better overall, there are still aspects of the HTPC video that are nicer. I'm currently using SnapStream with the nvDVD software MPEG-2 codec.

Reading through some of the PVR sites, the Hauppauge PVR-250 capture card (with hardware MPEG coding) gets high marks for PQ.

Just wondering if, with the right capture card, one could get as good or better composite video quality on the Samsung DLPs using HTPC w/DVI vs a direct composite connection to the TV.

Originally posted by maxvengeance111
I was able to produce the sound. If you lightly press down on the top of the set, that is the noise I hear all the time. Very strange.

Me too. My HLN617 is actually on two separate stands placed next to each other (they do support the entire base) - I haven't purchased my final stand yet. So it does creak a little - maybe the stands shift on the carpet and the weight re-distributes. I don't think there's reason to be concerned, unless you have some large unsupported section.

Originally posted by marcInNH
I don't hear any creaking, but the dull hum of my 617 might start driving me nutzo one of these days. It's not really *that* loud, but the frequency is noticeable when I'm using little (or no) volume...

Again, me too. If there's a little ambient noise in the house (i.e., kids, air conditioner, etc.), it's not noticeable, but without any background noise, it is annoying. I wonder if people who use theirs just as PC monitors (not for gaming) notice this. Volume turned up to about 10 or higher is enough to mask the noise. I know there was another thread on this, and some people apparently don't have this noise at all.

With respect to the humming (fan?) noise, I wonder if some people don't have it at all or if it's that they just don't seem to notice it personally...? I'm gonna go search for that thread now...

I don't hear the fan or humming sound at all at my normal viewing distance (8-9'). I can hear the fan if there is no sound coming from the set and I have my head over the screen. I do hear the cracking noise once a while. I think this is due to the temperature changes inside the cabin when the lamp is heating up in combination with cooling from outside of the cabin. That is, the sound is from expanding/contracting of the cabin due to the temperature variations between inside and outside of the cabin.

In addition to the creaking sound I occasionally hear something that sounds like a relay switch clicking. Not 100% sure if it is coming from the TV, but it seemed to start after the back of the TV was opened for service. Does anyone else hear a relay switch clicking sound?

Arun -

I'm surprised you haven't posted (or updated your guide) concerning the exciting overscan workaround developed by Googer and posted here. (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=283340&perpage=20&highlight=pixel%20mapping&pagenumber=5)

I know you're excited too, so I can only assume that you haven't had an opportunity to test it, or (much worse) that you had no success or were otherwise dissapointed in some way.

Your guide is the best place for this information, since you have taken the responsibility to inform and educate we Sammy brethren. Thanks. :cool:

LCH, the truth is that I haven't had a chance to test it because this has been a summer of constant travel for me. I just came back from a trip yesterday, and I am going for another 5 week trip next Tuesday.

I hope to be able to test it this weekend though. Thanks for the reminder. It will now make my to do list. Are there any other omissions that you or anyone else can point out?

During my upcoming long trip, I will be able to continue my participation in the forum and keep the guide up to date, I just won't be able to test anything myself.

It would be cool if someone would post some instructions on changing out the bulb, and also a good place to purchase them at a reasonable cost.

Originally posted by Icarus
I can test it, but I don't have one, and I haven't ordered one.

I do have a 2 week old HLN4365, a cable box with dvi out and a bravo d1. I haven't connected the d1 yet because of the switching issue. However, I did buy all the recommended cables for doing the manual switching, so I have the cables in house to test it if one were to show up at my door. :)

I'd be willing to order one, provided I can return it, no questions asked, if it doesn't work out.

-David

Arun .. I ordered one tonight from PC Connection for $220 + 2 day shipping. I'll try it out when I get it. Supposedly they claim to have it in stock "today". (It is the 4-port version.)

http://www.pcconnection.com/scripts/productdetail.asp?product_id=337973

(The picture looks like the 2-port version, but the text and model number are the 4-port version. They have the two port version for $155.)

-David

Thanks, David.

I ordered mine from NeutronExpress and they are still showing Sept. 6 ETA. I shall change my order to PC connection today -- but I doubt I shall get it in time to test before I leave for my trip.

Be aware that this switch doesn't come with any DVI cables, so you have to order any hookup cables separately. I am keeping my cables as short as possible to not introduce extra noise.

Someone had tested the 2 port Belkin switch before and reported that the signal flashed for seconds before showing white noise. (I shall try to find the link to that post.) Non-HDCP compliance was the suspected cause. I was going to test with non-HDCP enforcing boxes (Bravo D1, HTPC) to see if that was the case. In my view, HDCP shouldn't have been an issue in a passive switch like this. Because this is a computer KVM switch, you will probably have to connect a keyboard and a mouse to make it work.

I placed my order for Belking 4 Port DVI switch with PC Connection, and it is supposed to be delivered Monday. So I may have just have enough time to do a quick test. David, we can compare notes.

Sounds good .. I have all the cables because I bought the recommended cable set for manual switching. :) At least I think I have all the cables I need. (I may need a M-M, I have at least two of them and an M-F. I have to check, I may have three M-Ms, all dual link, nothing over 2m.)

-David

You can see that while the bt14 protrudes a bit from the top of the set, you can't really notice it that much. It's a pretty good match if you have a 10lb or under center channel.

http://www.flex.com/~dmk/hln/tv1.jpg
http://www.flex.com/~dmk/hln/tv2.jpg
http://www.flex.com/~dmk/hln/tv3.jpg


One of these days I'll get the rest of it all hooked up. :)

-David

Icarus

What brand are your TV and audio stands?

I'd still worry a little about putting my cc (15 lbs - the max for this "stand") directly on top of my HLN617.

VTI ... more specifically:

http://www.racksandstands.com/asp/show_detail.asp?sku=VI1018

The also make a $30 cc wall mount bracket, for speakers up to 25 pounds.

http://www.btech-usa.com/bt15.html

Racks and stands also has several cc speaker stands in their listings.

-David

One Call finally got a couple of HLN61's in! I have been waiting since the middle of June. I am supposed to have it by the end of next week. I searched all over the place, 50" models were available, 55" is still hard to find, and the 61" availability seems limited at this time.

Dan

I just posted a quick report on the Belkin 4 port DVI switch:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=2621637#post2621637

Watch for an update tonight.

Dr Gupta: Like many, thanks for your pioneering efforts with the Samsung DLP units. Are you saying that a set top box WITH DVI makes for significantly better image quality only on hd sources-----or also on sd sources?

I have an older Directv/Hughes E86 hd box (but it has NO dvi port!). I'm very happy with dvd quality - - but normal sd/digital signals from Directv are barely acceptable (especially sports). I would be willing to replace my Hughes with a DVI-enabled set top box if it would meaningfully IMPROVE SD quality on normal television. Any ideas or suggestions anyone?

The improvement is on both HD and SD, but it is more meaningful on HD. On SD signals, there is improvment, but it doesn't change the basic fact that some programs and channels are basically poor picture sources.

If you are getting enough HD channels, then I recommend switching to a DVI equipped box at some time anyway.

Originally posted by Icarus
Arun .. I ordered one tonight from PC Connection for $220 + 2 day shipping. I'll try it out when I get it. Supposedly they claim to have it in stock "today". (It is the 4-port version.)

http://www.pcconnection.com/scripts/productdetail.asp?product_id=337973

(The picture looks like the 2-port version, but the text and model number are the 4-port version. They have the two port version for $155.)

-David

Just thought you'd like to know; according to "Professor Dave" in this forum, Buy.com has the Belkin 2 Port DVI Switch for: $99.00! Now that is a much more reasonable price.

Originally posted by kmil
Just thought you'd like to know; according to "Professor Dave" in this forum, Buy.com has the Belkin 2 Port DVI Switch for: $99.00! Now that is a much more reasonable price.
The question is: does this switch work flawlessly?

I'm going to put this Q here and in the 214 tweak forum. It's time for me to do some optimizing to standards - mostly no problem, but it would be nice to have incremental improvements. First step will be AVIA, and my question is whether AVIA adjustments will all come from the user menu, or will I need to open up the service menu - if so what will I be looking to change? (yes I'll look at the official tweaks, but if I start with only AVIA, where does that lead?) I've done a search, but the threads are either very long or about other TV's, and I want specific experience with AVIA and the Samsung DLP.

I'm going to put this Q here and in the 214 tweak forum. It's time for me to do some optimizing to standards - mostly no problem, but it would be nice to have incremental improvements. First step will be AVIA, and my question is whether AVIA adjustments will all come from the user menu, or will I need to open up the service menu - if so what will I be looking to change? (yes I'll look at the official tweaks, but if I start with only AVIA, where does that lead?) I've done a search, but the threads are either very long or about other TV's, and I want specific experience with AVIA and the Samsung DLP.

I'm also interested in the AVIA/DLP experience (5065 arrives tomorrow!). Digital Video Essentials is also coming out which I've heard good things about also but it's not in peoples hands yet. AVIA vs DVE for the DLP is my question...goal being ease of use for a newbie.

Originally posted by Jbach
First step will be AVIA, and my question is whether AVIA adjustments will all come from the user menu, or will I need to open up the service menu
The user menu.

HT Thanks, as usual. I'm obviously more comfortable starting with the comparatively easy stuff.

Originally posted by Jbach
HT Thanks, as usual. I'm obviously more comfortable starting with the comparatively easy stuff.
Me too.

I used the Avia disc with my 567 and found the setup almost dead-on. The only tweaking I did consisted of very minor adjustments, all more personal preference rather than corrective.

I must say that this set has exceeded all my expectations, particularly after reading the "reflections" thread. I have zero complaints at this point.

Spad

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Spad
[B]I used the Avia disc with my 567 and found the setup almost dead-on. The only tweaking I did consisted of very minor adjustments, all more personal preference rather corrective. I must say that this set has exceeded all my expectations, particularly after reading the "reflections" thread. I have zero complaints at this point.

Spad

I plan to get a 467 in the very near future. Please give us/me as complete as possible personal review on your 567. The more the merrier. I am VERY interested in your personal opinion in all areas including PQ on regular analog cable (I believe its referred to as "SD").

Thank You and have a nice weekend!

I think Video Essentials was harder to use than AVIA - not sure if that will remain true for DVE. The thing is though AVIA is not made for digital sets like the DLP, so you really will want DVE in theory. I have AVIA, and used it on my DLP, but you can just as well eyeball the adjustments you end up making with it since most of the things it fixes are issues with analogue sets.

I can't say how valuable DVE will prove to be but in theory its the better choice if you haven't bought either yet. Both isn't a bad choice either.

To really get the most out of your set you'll want to do a lot of reading here, quickly upgrade yourself from newbie to intermediate, and tackle some of the service menu tweaks you'll find on this board.
enjoy,
jb

Arun,

I've searched, but I can't find what I'm looking for. At one time, did you post some specific measurements of screen height's vs. unit height's to help determine where the exact vertical center's were for the various Sammy models? (This took into account bezel width, speaker screen height, etc.) With some other information in the post, it would allow someone to use measurements of viewing distance and eye height to compute correct stand height for a particular model.

Could you point me to that post/thread, please? And maybe adding it to the Unofficial Guide would aid other new buyers.

Originally posted by leshalfhill
Arun,

I've searched, but I can't find what I'm looking for. At one time, did you post some specific measurements of screen height's vs. unit height's to help determine where the exact vertical center's were for the various Sammy models? (This took into account bezel width, speaker screen height, etc.) With some other information in the post, it would allow someone to use measurements of viewing distance and eye height to compute correct stand height for a particular model.



This post of Arun's deals specifically with the HLN617, but it may help you until Arun can respond to your question.
click here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=2514945#post2514945)

Jeff

Originally posted by Tobin44
I've had my 5065 W for three months and it looks like the bulb is defective. The picture is on for 30-60 seconds and then it goes dark and I get the three flashing lights below the screen. I'm surprised that this would happen. I'm used to Microsoft rushing software to market that is full of bugs, but haven't experienced this with other tech products. This is a pretty expensive gadget and to have problems this soon is a little disconcerting

Samsung says there are no lamps for this TV and none available for the forseeable future --anywhere. Their solution is to provide me a new TV --in 3 to 4 weeks. As you can imagine the family is not happy with this considering that football season has begun. I am going to try to use this opportunity to pay a little more and get the 56 inch HLN5615 Tantus. What does "Tantus" mean and are there any problems peculiar to the 56 inch (that are not present in the 50 inch)?

Thanks

I have a hard time believing there really are no replacement bulbs and all are (I guess) reserved for new sets. If all of this is so, wouldn't it be better from Sammie's POV to pull a bulb from a new set instead of losing the margin on that set?

Originally posted by Tobin44
I am going to try to use this opportunity to pay a little more and get the 56 inch HLN5615 Tantus. What does "Tantus" mean and are there any problems peculiar to the 56 inch (that are not present in the 50 inch)?

Thanks
Tantus has no real meaning in this case. If you have seen the HLN567 you know it looks different. It's a little less than 50" wide due to it's thin bezel.

Internally they are the same except that you should get firmware version 214 or later. There were a few sets that came with firmware version 211. Samsung upgrades the 211 sets as a warranty item.

If your viewing distance is OK for a 56" screen then the later firmware will give you discrete commands and perhaps better PQ OOTB.

I think I know this, but. Tantus means nothing anymore except as an artificial model designator (like the different 46s, etc.)? At one point didn't it give you a better warranty or something?

Originally posted by leesweet
I think I know this, but. Tantus means nothing anymore except as an artificial model designator (like the different 46s, etc.)? At one point didn't it give you a better warranty or something?

Not from Samsung. You may have gotten a better warranty from the store that sold it, but the manufacturer warranty was the same no matter which set you bought.

Originally posted by leesweet
At one point didn't it give you a better warranty or something?
Nope. The original HLM617(Tantus) was the first Samsung DLP set to have the current version of the Faroudja chip. Now all Samsung DLP sets have that chip. Then the HLN467/567 were labeled Tantus, but the only difference was their thin bezel case.

Thanks! That's what comes from reading old posts on the DLP! :)

You are welcome. I've read way too many posts in the last year.

finally got the HLN61!
I received it on Friday. On my first HD monitor, a Toshiba 57" rear projection, the shipping guy would not even think of helping me move it into the house, much less move it into a viewing position. The weight of the Samsung and configuration of the packing box made it easy to move, unpack and move into position! (The shipping guy helped me at no charge, saying it was so light that we could do it quickly--I tried to tip him, but he would have none of that).
As for the set itself, it is spectacular! I am happy with the screen expansion modes, the setup menus, and the number of inputs available. I have not had to tweak anything in the color, contrast, hue, or sharpness realm, all are near perfect in default.
Now, if I could just get the local stations without so much interference (I live outside of Missoula, behind a hill) or guff from CBS about a waiver on Direct TV service. Nonetheless, it would be nice to pick up local broadcasts. I am looking at roof top antennas, but need to consult with some local authorities on configuration and height.

So happy!

Dan

Arun's guide talks about viewing distances. I am trying to decide between a Samsung HLN567 and HLN617. My viewing distance will be nine feet (no variance possible). Who has or is viewing either of these sets at that distance? Is there a problem with screen-door at 9'? Any other cautions?

I don't see screen door at that distance. I like the HLN567 but thought the HLN617 was just a little too big at 9'. I took a tape measure to our dealer and watched a movie for quite a while at 9'.

I agree that everyday viewing at 9' is probably too close for a HLN617. However, I've had occasion to do just this when playing XBox. I'll place a chair in front of my couch and play that way, and at that point my viewing distance is probably 8 to 9 feet, and I don't see any screen door.

Rick

I should have also said that with the HLN617 at 9' I tended to move my head to see everything. I don't do that with the HLN567.

At 9 feet you want the 567. My new set arrived yesterday, and I had to do some adjusting of furniture to maximize the distance to get to 9 feet. Much better than the 7.5 to 8 feet (depending on how I sat) distance.

Viewing distance of 9' or 10' with the 617 has been fine for me. The HLN-617W is the best choice I found for any HDTV; I'm thrilled with it.

Er, okay, straighten me out. I thought the 'screen door' effect was an LCD one, and DLP didn't have it. Perhaps you can see pixels if you are close enough, but that's not 'screen door', right?

Originally posted by leesweet
Er, okay, straighten me out. I thought the 'screen door' effect was an LCD one, and DLP didn't have it. Perhaps you can see pixels if you are close enough, but that's not 'screen door', right?
If there are pixels there are spaces between them. That's the screen door. The point is for those spaces to be small enough that you don't see them at a normal (for you) viewing distance.

Ah, I thought it was always applied to LCD and meant the 'visible wires' effect. Okay, thanks!

I noticed that Pacific Cables sells a DVI splitter cable (M/F/F). Has anybody tried this method for connecting 2 DVI inputs to a Sammy? The cable is $50, but would not require switching cables back and forth.

Here is a link:

http://www.pacificcable.com/Picture_Page.asp?DataName=DVIY-2

There have been dozens of threads on this...

Because you are going the wrong way (two devices, one display) and because it's not exactly the same as a PC DVI display (HDCP, etc.), you have to use a DVI electronic switch. A couple of new ones are coming out soon that are less expensive than the current crop and are made for HT (vs. PC) use.

Originally posted by tmtcox
I noticed that Pacific Cables sells a DVI splitter cable (M/F/F). Has anybody tried this method for connecting 2 DVI inputs to a Sammy? The cable is $50, but would not require switching cables back and forth.

Here is a link:

http://www.pacificcable.com/Picture_Page.asp?DataName=DVIY-2
Yes it's been tried. You are the 1,000,000th person to ask that question. :D

The splitter does not work. Sounds great but it fails the test. One reason is that it is intended for one source (PC) into two monitors. You can't reverse the flow! :(

Thanks guys for saving me $50. I thought it was too good to be true. I did a search but did find anything on it (probably didn't go back far enough).

I will stick to switching cables for now. I did see a DVI switch that is coming out this month for $250. Anything less expensive coming out?

Originally posted by tmtcox
Thanks guys for saving me $50. I thought it was too good to be true.
I will stick to switching cables for now.

The above switch you referred to should be considered as a "solution" in search of a problem (your TV) IMHO!



I did see a DVI switch that is coming out this month for $250. Anything less expensive coming out?

What switch ($250) do you refer to and do you know if it works?

Originally posted by kmil
What switch ($250) do you refer to and do you know if it works?

Here is the link:

http://www.ramelectronics.net/html/hd-DVI-2x1.htm


I have no idea if it works, but it is specifically for HDTV.

I am being told by several on-line dealers that they will not have 467s until November/December.

Is the 467 worth the wait over the 437/4365?

Originally posted by joenash
I am being told by several on-line dealers that they will not have 467s until November/December.

Is the 467 worth the wait over the 437/4365?

I haven't seen the 467...but when I bought my HLM507 I happened to see an HLM4365 at Sears at the same time. The 4365 was beautiful, but I went with the 507 because of the 50" screen. I dont think you'll go wrong with whatever you do...what the heck, you might as well just move up to the 507/5065!!

[QUOTE]Originally posted by joenash
[B]I am being told by several on-line dealers that they will not have 467s until November/December.



Like many others here I need to plan in advance so I'll need a fairly accurate "guesstimate" as to when these "several on-line dealers" you refer to will most likely have the HLN467w in stock for sale. I need to plan for the sale of my current TV and the scheduling of a technician to come to our house. What is the newest info/chat on the availability of the HLN467w?

I have only heard of one online store with either the HLN467 or HLN567 available for delivery at any time since their introduction.

http://www.crutchfield.com/

Their prices seem to be high.

In our area Magnolia has them and in other areas Tweeter (or their affiliates) should have them.

The HLN467 is a bigger screen in a cabinet that is about the same width as the HLN4365 and HLN437. Other than that and the "look" of the cabinet there are no differences.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by htwaits
[B]I have only heard of one online store with either the HLN467 or HLN567 available for delivery at any time since their introduction.

http://www.crutchfield.com/

Their prices seem to be high.


htwaits: Thanks for your response. It looks like I may have to postpone my newspaper ad to sell my current TV. I called Crutchfield (very nice & very helpful folks) this Monday and they said they had 28 HLN467w's in stock ready for delivery................HOWEVER, they would not budge a penny so NO sale. What are YOU hearing, if anything, on the deliverys of the 46 incher? Inquiring minds would like to know.

Thanks!!!

Based on your location there must not be a local B&M that carries the HLN467/567.

Crutchfield wasn't picking on you personally. They don't seem to deal on anything.

Our Magnolia Hi Fi stores have been delivering them from their fist large shipment. They co-hosted the Samsung booth in June at the San Francisco Home Entertainment Expo so they may have a jump on other dealers. They are the only ones carrying those two models from here to Seattle.

Sorry I can't be more help.

Originally posted by joenash
I am being told by several on-line dealers that they will not have 467s until November/December.

Is the 467 worth the wait over the 437/4365?

If you really want the 467, did you try the Tweeter in your area? I don't know what their price is, but I've seen people get pretty good deals on these sets. I only see the HLM617W on their web site for $5200 (an older model, for $200 more than MSRP of the HLN617W), but you could do much better at the store, if other posts are any indication. My HLN617W was significantly cheaper from my local Soundtrack (Ultimate Electronics). Soundtrack does carry the 467 and 567.

kmil - there is an Ultimate/Soundtrack in Fairview Heights - is that anywhere near you?

Good luck.

Tweeter had the 467 and 567 on their website last week. Maybe they sold out? Give them a call anyway. It couldn't hurt.

-- Kirk

Is there any kind of adjustment to lessen the "rainbow effect"?
I have a 567 and I see it more everyday. Of course it only happens on dark images. I have to turn away during closing movie credits. The white letters on black is the worst.

kmil - there is an Ultimate/Soundtrack in Fairview Heights - is that anywhere near you?

Good luck. [/B][/QUOTE]


Just off the proverbial "cuff" Fairview Heights sounds like its in New Jersey.
I am in Illinois and do NOT want to pay Illinois or any taxes on the set, therefore I will not buy one here in Illinois.

Originally posted by kmil
Just off the proverbial "cuff" Fairview Heights sounds like its in New Jersey.
I am in Illinois and do NOT want to pay Illinois or any taxes on the set, therefore I will not buy one here in Illinois. [/B]

Well, off the cuff as well, that is pretty stupid. Not willing to pay taxes is just absurd. Don't you enjoy having schools in your state, police and fire protection, city services, roads? It all comes from taxes. Or do you want to get everything for free somehow, or let others pay for you? Even if you have a philosophical problem with taxes, it does not justify tax dodging. (Which is illegal by the way.)

Sorry for the rant.

Originally posted by mike_pro
Well, off the cuff as well, that is pretty stupid. Not willing to pay taxes is just absurd. Don't you enjoy having schools in your state, police and fire protection, city services, roads? It all comes from taxes. Or do you want to get everything for free somehow, or let others pay for you? Even if you have a philosophical problem with taxes, it does not justify tax dodging. (Which is illegal by the way.)

Sorry for the rant.

Mike -- your rant aside (with which I agree, by the way) I wanted to thank you for the links at the end of your note. I have an un-upgraded HLM507 (I didn't know enough to get the upgrade in time) so obviously the tweaks probably wont work for me, but all info helps, and makes me glad I founf this site. I wish I'd found it a little sooner, though, so I could get my set upgraded. Thanks again!

Originally posted by mike_pro
[
Sorry for the rant. [/B]


Mike_pro: Your opinion, as are all opinions, is appreciated! Thanks for the reply.

Originally posted by HLM507WFan
... I have an un-upgraded HLM507 (I didn't know enough to get the upgrade in time) so obviously the tweaks probably wont work for me, but all info helps, and makes me glad I founf this site.
You can still match your set's firmware version and use other HLM tweaks.

Here are some of the older tweak threads.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=196287
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=212350
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=2030980#post2030980
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=231055
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=2601084#post2601084
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=224870
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=2598523#post2598523

Originally posted by jollyrodger
Is there any kind of adjustment to lessen the "rainbow effect"?
I have a 567 and I see it more everyday. Of course it only happens on dark images. I have to turn away during closing movie credits. The white letters on black is the worst.

How long have you had the 567? I've had my 507W for about 7 weeks and I'm now seeing rainbows less often. I was pretty paranoid at first after reading all of the posts about this, but I think my eyes have adjusted or else I just learned how to watch without rainbows being much of a problem. Even closing credits aren't as much of a problem for me as they used to be. Maybe I'm just one of those lucky people that aren't too bothered by them.

BTW, the worst I've seen is in "Men In Black II."

Tim

Well, perhaps you could lessen it if you turned down contrast and black levels. But then everything would be muted. I see rainbows very frequently. But, it is almost always when I am turning away from the screen and catch them out of the corner of my eye. Or sometimes in a dar scene with a bright object moving quickly. I've come to accept them as just a side effect of this TV's technology. When I see one now, I barely register the thought "Hmmm... there's a rainbow".

Originally posted by mike_pro
Well, perhaps you could lessen it if you turned down contrast and black levels. But then everything would be muted. I see rainbows very frequently. But, it is almost always when I am turning away from the screen and catch them out of the corner of my eye. Or sometimes in a dar scene with a bright object moving quickly. I've come to accept them as just a side effect of this TV's technology. When I see one now, I barely register the thought "Hmmm... there's a rainbow".


"Somewhere.......over the rainbow........". Sorry, but I couldn't resist the urge.

Another (slightly modified) song:
"Why are there so many posts about rainbows?"

I have had my 567 for almost a week and I have never seen a rainbow even when I tried to look for one with your prescribed head motions.

I'm 1 week + with my 467. I'll admit I had a bit of evening "viewing fatigue" for the first few days, and I catch the occasional rainbow when it gets late and my eyes get a bit twitchy. I've worked out some backlighting that alleviates the former, and I figure I just need not to drink as much to prevent the latter. :)

Anyway, it's not been enough to distract me, definitely not "rainbows everywhere", and I wouldn't have even noticed them if it weren't for the fact that I've read about them here.

I'd really appreciate if you can give us a complete "satisfaction" report on the 46, including OOTB satisfaction and all the "particulars" about the set that we drool over. I hope to be getting a 46 in the very near future.

Thanks!

I've had a HLN 467 for a whole week and a half now….

I was a bit worried after the first time I spent a couple hours staring at it, on Saturday morning, that I had a very mild headache… Then again the next morning I noticed the same thing... upon reflection though I think that both headaches were actually just a mild hang-over from the preceding night (too much sake Friday night and too much wine Saturday night)

Seriously though last night was the first time I spent a couple hours watching in the dark and had no eyestrain at all, and now I think part of the headache / eyestrain issue (in addition the the wine and sake) was too much ambient light in the room reflecting off the screen.

I've adjusted it's position so it tilts down slightly (the bottom sits about 4' off the floor). I'm thinking that backlighting it slightly might help even more, so eventually I’ll try that. I haven’t searched for “backlighting solutions” yet, but if anyone has any please point to the appropriate info.

After the first few days I wasn't sure I was going to keep it... A month ago I bought a 46” PDP which I haven’t been 100% satisfied with. So I’ve got both now sitting in my living room while I decided which one gets returned. While my opinion is still varying on a daily basis (down from changing hourly) I think after last nights viewing I've decided on plan "C" which is to return them both and bring home an HLN 567 instead. I'm sufficiently happy with the PQ/Technology/etc of the DLP's. I picked up the 467 because on chance I happened into a local B&M store just as one had been returned open box because it “didn’t fit in the customers entertainment center.” Personally I think it’s more likely the customer wasn’t “happy with the set” and the salesperson didn’t want to give me that reason…who would haul that big a set home and into the house with measuring it first? Regardless, it was a good opportunity to get a set that’s back-ordered for 10% off retail (which covered the extended warranty). Now I just need to figure out how far back-ordered the 567 is… and how I’m going to return all this stuff and get what I want an HLN 567.

-Jon

P.S. What does OTTB and OOTB mean? not familiar with those acronyms and their not in the glossary...

Out-of-the-Box.

JB510..............how was the 46 PQ (picture quality) Out Of The Box........was it "right on" or close?

out of the box.

I have had my 43 for less than 1 week and can say that I am almost completely satisfied.

I think the PQ - overall - is superior to the mits 42 I had previously. I am happy with my analog PQ . . . for the most part. However, it is still better than crt rptv.

The set is wonderful - VERY attractive and, I can't mention this enough, its weight (and dimensions) are a big PLUS in the purchase. I can easily move it to get access. That's something I couldn't even do easily with the mits and something that would be impossible with a large direct view.

No concern about burn-in whatsoever so I can watch in OAR all the time if I wish.

What I do not like:

Limitations on PIP. The mits blows the dlp away. I can't do side by side with vga/component2+3/DVI.

Inability to rename inputs. I have to remember what each input is for. Also, despite having what appears to be 3 coax video inputs and 3 s-video inputs, there are really only a total of 3 since you cannot connect something to s-video 1 and video 1 and have the set accept a signal.

Poor manual. They could have told me in the manual the above so I didn't spend 1/2 hour trying to figure it out.

1 DVI input.

Slight pincushioning on 4:3 tv.

Despite the shortcomings, the set's advantages make it outshine the competition easily. Only wish I could have found a 46 with anything near the deal I got on my 43.

I've had my 567 for just over two weeks. I sit about 10' away. It will go back another 2' if we decide to keep it and rip apart the built in wall unit.
I am very pleased with the video quality. Even my ReplayTV is very acceptable. The HD channels on Comcast are amazing. Two new channels went on yesterday, INHD1&2 and they look great.
My only drawback is that I am one of the ones complaining about audio/video sync. I see it on many analog stations and it does get worse as you watch a show. I had a Tweeter guy look at it. He called Samsung who is sending out a new digital circuit board. I don't expect it to help.
My wife is most dissatisfied with the sound coming from the TV speaker. She says it's very hard to understand voices. I think the bass is weak but I'm getting used to it. She says "it's a TV." (ARGH)
I'm pretty sure we will keep it. Two weeks ago the screen looked HUGE, but now it looks like my old 36".
Hopefully I will see less rainbows as time goes on. Unfortunately I do say to myself, "there's another rainbow."

Well there you have it . . .

An excuse to be using home theater audio.

I've never heard what the set sounds like and could care less. I'd venture to say that at least 80% + on here feel the same.

My wife is most dissatisfied with the sound coming from the TV speaker. She says it's very hard to understand voices. I think the bass is weak but I'm getting used to it. She says "it's a TV." (ARGH)

Try changing from Dolby to BBE, the voices seem to be a lot clearer.

I have Dolby and BBE off. BBE sounds so tinny and weak.

I hooked a powered sub-woofer up to my HLN617 and it sounds very good. The only way I could do it for all sources (without routing all the sound through a separate amplifier) was to open up the set and using solid telephone wire insert it into the connector that goes onto the circuit board that goes to the speakers. Since the sub-woofer speaker input is a high impedance it draws virtually no current so telephone wire works fine.

Is $3300 plus $160 for shipping a good price for a 467?

That is a good price. If you are not paying sales tax, it is an excellent price.

I have had my hln61 for a couple of weeks now and have not done any tweaking of any parameter on the new set. I have seen fleeting rainbows only once, and they were brief periods (less than a millisecond) when I thought I saw a single color flash across the screen. I thought they were an illusion, but they did occur during "rapid eye movement". When I attempted to recreate the problem, I could not. So, I guess I cannot really see the things that a couple of others see on a continuous basis... which, of course, is good for me.

Dan