I read the document yet again and it was as enjoyable as it was the first time. Now heres a suggestion. May i request you to mention the best or the closest to ideal settings for all the options. the array there is mind boggling and for a new comer like me it is very hard to come up with the ideal permutation. obviously we realize this is your choice and our prefernce could well be different. But if you can consider putting up at one place BOTH service and user settings that would be great, for several things in it are greek to most of us. I understand that this are YOUR PERSONAL CHOICES but i would rather go with those than any uninformed settings done by myself.

2)What is dnie ,..should it be on or off?

3)The lamp hrs on it says 118 and says aug, 2003 release date .IS this ok?

4)The service menu has a bewildering array of settings. I think while waiting for it to come on, i accidentally changed something called POS Y to 15? i dont know what this mean or what it should be? Is this number ok? Please help!!

5) I found the user controls but again, dont know what is ideal and what is not?

6) Can you kindly advise what the sound settings would be- should i simply connect the audio out of the DVD to the audio in of the TV or something else?

7)Lastly on most of the regular channels one sees the patterns when we go close- i cant make out the difference between this and other sets. Are there any particular channels one can check out to enjoy real DLP picture quality or is that possible only with DVDs?

thanks again for your time
Rgds

Originally posted by arungupta
1)With just the DVI cable connecting the DVD to the TV theres no sound. I have to separately connect the usual soun cables. Does DVI not support sound? Or should i be connecting my cable box directly to the TV? (Cox tells me that their DVI is NOT active yet)

-- DVI does not include audio. The audio input port that matches DVI is separate. The same audio port is also used for PC input.

2)Apart from when i am playing a DVD, when i go close to the screen i see the usual patterns/pixels. Any suggestions?

-- If you pause your DVD or source, if the pixel pattern pauses, then the pattern is in your source. In dark areas you can still see moving pixels if you are really up close -- that is DLP dark shades dithering used to increase grey levels in dark areas.

3)Im unable to change the brightness and other settings? The picture quality is very different from what i saw at stores.

-- Why are you unable to change? User mode settings has all the controls to change them.

4)My TV came without any box! its a brand new purchase direct from Samsung- who say that it was supposed to be a whiteglove delivery so he didnt send the box! DId anyone else face the same problem- is there any way of distinguishing a refurb from a new model?

-- Check how many hours it has, using the service mode menu. See the HLN guide (my signature) on how to access the service mode.

5)Lastly how do i connect the internet to the TV?I have a IBM Thinkpad t40 with wireless lan access both B/G.

-- You can use a PC/VGA connection. Ideally you should your Thinkpad resolution to 1280x720 (I think Thinkpad T40 supports it). User Powerstrip if you have to. Also changing your TV aspect to TV-wide will give you much more clear picture with 1x1 pixel mapping - but unforunately it will have some overscan.

"3)The lamp hrs on it says 118 and says aug, 2003 release date .IS this ok?"

This is OK if you've used it for 118 hours. If it's fresh out of the box, I wouldn't expect over 100 hours on it. Mine was about zero out of the box

i must have used it for 100 hrs.theres something there called lamp clear...whats that for? can that be iused to clear it?thanks a lot

Originally posted by Bank One
i must have used it for 100 hrs.theres something there called lamp clear...whats that for? can that be iused to clear it?thanks a lot
I would strongly suggest you to get out of the service menu and start reading. And do not go back there until you have a clear understanding what everything is.
No offence, ok? But right now you act like a guy who disassembled his car engine, points to some part and asks what it is.
I really wish you to enjoy your set without breaking it.

i have read the document in detail. what else do you suggest i read? and i thought the forum was to help share experiences and shorten the learning curve, rather than make wisecracks! Am i wrong?

Bank One:

Don't be offended. You are correct that the forum is a place for sharing and learning. I have learned a great deal myself. The point is, service menu tweaking is an advanced skill and if not done correctly can render your set unusable. If this happens, you could be out of luck because the warranty is rendered void if you enter the service menu (debatible). You then have a $5000 paperweight.

In regards to your concern to changing POS Y, it is highly unlikely. The TV will not accept any commands from the remote during the warm-up period (i.e. before the screen comes on).

If you do a search you will find a thread with a spreadsheet of all of the default values on the service menu. ALWAYS WRITE YOUR SETTINGS DOWN BEFORE CHANGING THEM!!!!

Good luck and enjoy your set. Entering the service menu is at your own risk.

I just got my samsung hln4365wx and I'm loving it so far!

I am wondering about the dvi port. Does it support digital and analog signals from it?

It looks like my digital cable box a SA3250hd has a Dvi-I port which is analog and digital (if I'm understanding the DVI spec correctly).

I'd like to know if anyone else has this combo working?


thanks

Samsung DVI port is digital only. Use a DVI-D cable to connect from your cable box.

Arun, I noticed you just posted so I thought I'd ask your advice. I have an HLN 617 on hold at a local dealer. It is the display model - they say for about 1.5 months. It also has a purely cosmetic scratch on the front plastic. As a result of the scratch, they are discounting the set by $1000. My dilemna, after reading way too much on this forum, is whether to purchase now and risk the HLN problems like: fan issue (metal on metal noise) and video delay. Or, would you think I'd be wiser to wait for the HLP where hopefully there are fewer problems with the fan and audio/video sync and I'd get the seventh color on the wheel? Are there any other points of comparison between the two you think I should consider before deciding? Thanks for any input -- I have to decide soon if I want to purchase or relinquish my hold. Also, thanks for all your helpful posts. I read a ton before even getting this far, and your time, experience, and interest in helping others is appreciated.

Fan noise: it is a rare occurrence and fixed under warranty.

Audio/video sync: You should be able to tell quickly enough whether your set has this problem. Only a small percentage of sets are reported to have this problem. Both of my sets don't have a problem.

So if you decide to take advantage of this deal, make sure you have a 30 day return privilege and it is fully covered under warranty. I also generally recommend extended warranty for any new technologies. Also check whether their $1000 discount is from the list price or their regular discounted price.

If you wait about 6 months, then you can get a 56" HLP model with HD2+ chip and a new color wheel which will provide better black levels/dark shades. It will also have an extra HDMI port. But you will probably pay full price for that set.

This Guide has been downloaded 20,000 times.... WOW.....

That's alot of DLP tweakin' :)

Still looking at Sammys trying to get comfortable with the price. I've got a width issue (can't be over 47 inches). the 43, 46 & 50 would fit (50 would be tight). The 46 seems to be a good compromise to give me a little space flexibility. Heres my question: I'm starting to see the 50s in a few CC on sale for @3500. There are no 46s in stores in my area, would have to go order on internet (Cruchfields) for 3,800-3,900. I know the 46 is a little newer (Aug. 03) and maybe a little slicker looking, but is there any technological advantage to that set that makes it worth 3 to 4 hundred more. Thanks for your help.

There is no technological difference between any of the HLN series sets.

Chipden -

I don't know the exact width of the HLN50, but it it almost certainly less than 47 inches.

Chipden -

I don't know the exact width of the HLN50, but it is almost certainly less than 47 inches.

HLN 50" is 46.6"x17.6"x33.8" W x D x H.

Thanks guys!

Chip

What is the difference between the HD2+ chip and the HD3 chip? Couldnt find anything on TI or sammy site.

I was looking at the new 61" which is supposed to use the HD3 chip.

Is the chip the difference between base and Tantus models? What does the Tantus model have the others dont?

I've been looking, and I think I know the answer...

I have a DLP HLN507W with the latest firmware. Does it have discrete codes for ASPECT RATIO available? I just got a Harmony SST-659 remote (works GREAT so far), but there are some activities in which I'd like to set the TV to a specific aspect ratio (for example when watching laserdisc, I'd like it to always go into ZOOM mode).

No can do, right?

-Steve

Originally posted by hyperdyne
What is the difference between the HD2+ chip and the HD3 chip? Couldnt find anything on TI or sammy site.

I was looking at the new 61" which is supposed to use the HD3 chip.

Is the chip the difference between base and Tantus models? What does the Tantus model have the others dont?
See the links in my signature.

Originally posted by Steve O
I've been looking, and I think I know the answer...

I have a DLP HLN507W with the latest firmware. Does it have discrete codes for ASPECT RATIO available? I just got a Harmony SST-659 remote (works GREAT so far), but there are some activities in which I'd like to set the TV to a specific aspect ratio (for example when watching laserdisc, I'd like it to always go into ZOOM mode).

No can do, right?

-Steve
There are no discrete codes for aspect ratio, but it should remember the aspect ratio for each input.

Just bit the bullet and bought my first DLP (43-7W) from CC yesterday. Does anyone have a post about $$ - obviously difficult because it will vary by region and time of purchase.

Thanks!

Jerome

First, I would like to thank everyone here for all the information you have been providing me over the last couple of months. I just joined today, but I've been monitoring the groups since November absorbing all the info you have been posting, while I hemmed and hawed on what to purchase.

Well, here it is, just three weeks old:

Sammy HLN567W
Pioneer Elite DV-59AVI
BetterCables HDMI to DVI Cable and Component Cables
Motorola DCT6200 (I nagged Comcast to give me one even though they insisted that the DVI connector was not enabled).
Gefren 4to1 DVI Switch Box (not installed yet).

Hooked to a Yamaha RX2200 receiver.

Can you tell I've been paying attention? Thanks again for all your posts and suggestions.

It has been a dream to watch and listen to. Am holding off on ISF calibration till after 200 hours, but can tell I would like to get rid of the green push from cable box and from vcr's using composite connections. DVI I do not notice the green push from any DVD's so far.

I do have a few of questions/problems.

1. A few SD stations, one specifically, Channel 11 WTTW Chicago, especially the McNeil News Hour I notice a flickering of the brightness on the screen, about the speed of an heart beat. It is very annoying during interviews, not very noticeable during their news clips. I suspect this is from WTW's equipment and not in my setup. Again only a few stations I've noticed this with. Comments?

2. Since the HLN567W DVI connection only allows PC Wide and Normal Wide options this will force me to watch all SD 4:3 programming stretched when Comcast activates the DVI. Am I missing something in any setting that would allow me to change to 4:3 with DVI connection? Or will I leave the Composite connections for SD viewing and use the DVI for HD viewing?

3. Started watching Top Gun on DVD the other night in wide screen. Had to set the 59AVI to 16:9 Compressed to get rid of the vertical squash that showed in regular16:9 with black bars top and bottom, but 16:9 Compressed leaves black bars on all 4 sides. Again, a setting I'm missing?

Sorry for the long post.

2. Since the HLN567W DVI connection only allows PC Wide and Normal Wide options this will force me to watch all SD 4:3 programming stretched when Comcast activates the DVI. Am I missing something in any setting that would allow me to change to 4:3 with DVI connection? Or will I leave the Composite connections for SD viewing and use the DVI for HD viewing?

- Actually you will be watching it non-stretched as a default. To watch it stretched, you cable box will have to provide an option to stretch it. (make sure you set up your cable box for a 16:9 TV)

3. Started watching Top Gun on DVD the other night in wide screen. Had to set the 59AVI to 16:9 Compressed to get rid of the vertical squash that showed in regular16:9 with black bars top and bottom, but 16:9 Compressed leaves black bars on all 4 sides. Again, a setting I'm missing?

- Have you set up your DVD player for a 16x9 TV?

Originally posted by VinceP
2. Since the HLN567W DVI connection only allows PC Wide and Normal Wide options this will force me to watch all SD 4:3 programming stretched when Comcast activates the DVI. Am I missing something in any setting that would allow me to change to 4:3 with DVI connection? Or will I leave the Composite connections for SD viewing and use the DVI for HD viewing?

Vince, yeah, use the DVI or component connections for the HD, and switch over to S-Video or composite for the SD. That's what I do, and it's somewhat tolerable. Sometimes I switch back to component because the picture is actually better, other times the S-Video picture is better; it really varies on content, even commercial to commercial.

1. A few SD stations, one specifically, Channel 11 WTTW Chicago, especially the McNeil News Hour I notice a flickering of the brightness on the screen, about the speed of an heart beat. It is very annoying during interviews, not very noticeable during their news clips. I suspect this is from WTW's equipment and not in my setup. Again only a few stations I've noticed this with. Comments?


I have this same problem. I live in Dallas and have Comcast's entry level digital cable package w/ the HD channels. I have the Motorola box and have both component cables and coax cable running from the box to my 43" Sammy.

My set has the same flickering on SD stations (doesn't matter if I use the component or the coax cable). Comcast guy came out and switched the box - no help. He has no idea what is causing it.

I have no problem when I run the cable directly from the wall to the television. So the problem has to have something to do with going through the Motorola box.

Any ideas?

So you're not getting the flickering on any other source? VCR, DVD, etc.?

What if you only connected it with coax or component or s-video? In other words, don't have it physically connected with two or more differnet methods.

Originally posted by johnevo
So you're not getting the flickering on any other source? VCR, DVD, etc.?

What if you only connected it with coax or component or s-video? In other words, don't have it physically connected with two or more differnet methods.



No flickering from any other source (DVD or cable directly from wall to TV). I have not tried having only one connection connected. I will try that though I wouldn't think that could cause a problem because you select your input source thereby deactivating all other connections.

Thanks for the suggestion. I would appreciate anything else you can think of.

Originally posted by arungupta
2. Since the HLN567W DVI connection only allows PC Wide and Normal Wide options this will force me to watch all SD 4:3 programming stretched when Comcast activates the DVI. Am I missing something in any setting that would allow me to change to 4:3 with DVI connection? Or will I leave the Composite connections for SD viewing and use the DVI for HD viewing?

- Actually you will be watching it non-stretched as a default. To watch it stretched, you cable box will have to provide an option to stretch it. (make sure you set up your cable box for a 16:9 TV)

3. Started watching Top Gun on DVD the other night in wide screen. Had to set the 59AVI to 16:9 Compressed to get rid of the vertical squash that showed in regular16:9 with black bars top and bottom, but 16:9 Compressed leaves black bars on all 4 sides. Again, a setting I'm missing?

- Have you set up your DVD player for a 16x9 TV?

Arun

Thanks for your response.

-There does not appear to be a setting in the setup of the DCT6200 for the size of TV screen and the tv only allows for wide formats off the DVI connection. Component, Svideo and Composite allow for a 4:3 setting so the image is not stretched to 16:9. I double checked the Sammy manual and it confirms that the only options for the DVI connection are PC Wide and TV Wide.

-Re: Top Gun - Setting the 59AVI for 16:9 the image is stretched with bars top and bottom. Changing the setting on the DVD player to 16:9 Compressed, the other Wide option, allows for the image not to be stretched but there are bars on all 4 sides.

Attached are samples. Sorry for the glare, but I think you can tell the problem. The resolution settings in the 59AVI are for 1280x720.

Here is the Wide attachment.

Vince,

I am afraid both of your source boxes may have problems.

DCT6200 MUST have an option for 16:9 TV, ALL OF MY SOURCE BOXES DO. Maybe someone who knows this box can answer. Try HDTV hardware forum.

And Pioneer DVD player is sending HDMI output, but it doesn't seem to be scaling as it should. So the black bars are coming from the DVD player not the TV. This is a reported issue with a Panasonic upcoming player also. Maybe you can check in DVD player forum if there are any threads that talk about this issue. Also see this thread:

home theater discussion . com
/forums/showthread.php?postid=29198#post29198

Originally posted by VinceP
Here is the Wide attachment.

I have that same issue when I watch Top Gun. I switched over to composite input and zoomed in. The picture gets a little more grainy and the detail isn't as sharp, but it isn't so compressed.

Hi Arun,

Thanks for the great guide. I have recently purchased a HLN437W DLP and 'am very happy with the PQ. I have few questions and thought you would be best to answer them..

1. Does Samsung Cover the cost of the bulbs during the warranty Period.
2. I have bought extended warranty from CC for $600 for 4yrs period and was wondering if I should cancel it and buy just before the Original Manufacturers Warranty Expires ?
3. With <MUTE>-1-8-2-POWERON I was unable to get into the service menu ?
4. While watching a movie, a plain blue shirt shows up as CHECKs Shirt ?
5. Also my major problem I am having is while is SHADOWS ? Lets say there is a display of numbers they are generally followed by 3 or 4 shadows in decreasing brightness ? What are these and how do I get rid of them ? What I am saying is if I am displaying "1" I see a bright digit followed by 3more lighter ones.

Looking forward for your valuable response.

ca_market.

1. Does Samsung Cover the cost of the bulbs during the warranty Period.
- During the warranty period the only reason the bulb would need to replaced would if they were defective, and that is covered.

2. I have bought extended warranty from CC for $600 for 4yrs period and was wondering if I should cancel it and buy just before the Original Manufacturers Warranty Expires ?
- $600 is excessive i think. Do you know that you can negotiate with CC.

3. With <MUTE>-1-8-2-POWERON I was unable to get into the service menu ?
- Hmmm. That is the sequence.

4. While watching a movie, a plain blue shirt shows up as CHECKs Shirt ?

5. Also my major problem I am having is while is SHADOWS ? Lets say there is a display of numbers they are generally followed by 3 or 4 shadows in decreasing brightness ? What are these and how do I get rid of them ? What I am saying is if I am displaying "1" I see a bright digit followed by 3more lighter ones.

- On the last two questions, you haven't said what your source box is, how are you connecting it, what program / channel......... There is a culprit in here, but doing the detective work to figure out the reason requires a full set of facts.

Can you really negotiate with CC for the extended warranty?? I wish I had known that in November.:mad:

ca_market

5. Also my major problem I am having is while is SHADOWS ? Lets say there is a display of numbers they are generally followed by 3 or 4 shadows in decreasing brightness ? What are these and how do I get rid of them ? What I am saying is if I am displaying "1" I see a bright digit followed by 3more lighter ones.

- I've seen the same problem with VGA from my PC, changing the Fine UM setting under the PC setting generally helps, but it doesn't totally eliminate the problem. I have mine set at 4 from the default of 0.

Originally posted by Gilley
Can you really negotiate with CC for the extended warranty?? I wish I had known that in November.:mad:

I suppose you can, or you can buy a repairmaster/warrantech warranty from a third party like many of us did. Somewhere, there's a thread with a link to a place that sells these things at good prices, but I've misplaced my link to them. If somebody still has it, they might want to post it here again.

-David

I bought my HLN507W from Tweeter for the same price CC and BB charge, but the extended warranty goes 5 years, and was only $350.

-Chris

Originally posted by ca_market
...
1. Does Samsung Cover the cost of the bulbs during the warranty Period.
2. I have bought extended warranty from CC for $600 for 4yrs period and was wondering if I should cancel it and buy just before the Original Manufacturers Warranty Expires ?
...
Don't forget to get Samsung's 3 month extension of the warantee period by registering quickly on their web site (or via mail). At $600 per 4 years its worth $38 to you.

If you want the extended warantee (I didn't chose to get one) you should avoid it overlapping with the manufacturer's if you have that choice.

Here is the latest variant on the flickering theme. I hope flicker is the right word, but what happens is that a normal picture gets rather dark only for a second, then reverts to the normal picture. It only happens when I'm watching a DVD. I have the Bose 321 DVD player connected with the S-Video cable that came with the system, so admittedly not the best cable to use with this sophisticated television. Unfortunately, the 321 does not have component video jacks, only S-Video and A/V.

Could my problem be just a cheap S-Video cable? I don't have this problem in any other setting.

Thanks again for everyone's help.

Mo

Originally posted by HLM507WFan
Here is the latest variant on the flickering theme. I hope flicker is the right word, but what happens is that a normal picture gets rather dark only for a second, then reverts to the normal picture.


You're not by any chance running the output of the DVD player thru a VCR, then into the TV? If so, that's your problem, but with the plethora of inputs on the set you shouldn't be doing this in the first place :)

Originally posted by HLM507WFan
Here is the latest variant on the flickering theme. I hope flicker is the right word, but what happens is that a normal picture gets rather dark only for a second, then reverts to the normal picture. It only happens when I'm watching a DVD. I have the Bose 321 DVD player connected with the S-Video cable that came with the system, so admittedly not the best cable to use with this sophisticated television. Unfortunately, the 321 does not have component video jacks, only S-Video and A/V.

Could my problem be just a cheap S-Video cable? I don't have this problem in any other setting.

Thanks again for everyone's help.

Mo
The biggest help you may need is actually in my signature.

"If you use analog inputs with Samsung DLP, please don't post PQ complaints, switch to DVI."

Otherwise, you have wasted a lot of money on your expensive TV. And I hate being impolite, but you are wasting a lot of time of other forum members.

Originally posted by arungupta
The biggest help you may need is actually in my signature.

"If you use analog inputs with Samsung DLP, please don't post PQ complaints, switch to DVI."

Otherwise, you have wasted a lot of money on your expensive TV. And I hate being impolite, but you are wasting a lot of time of other forum members.

Not impolite at all. It wasn't my intent to waste everyone's time. I'll stick to reading the posts instead of posting. Sorry!

Originally posted by arungupta
The biggest help you may need is actually in my signature.

"If you use analog inputs with Samsung DLP, please don't post PQ complaints, switch to DVI."

Otherwise, you have wasted a lot of money on your expensive TV. And I hate being impolite, but you are wasting a lot of time of other forum members.

Not impolite at all. It wasn't my intent to waste everyone's time. I'll stick to reading the posts instead of posting. Sorry!

Arun,

You were right. I just switched from an older Sony DVD player with S-Video output to a Bravo D1 with DVI. Holy Cow what a difference. Before when watching thy opening animations on Digital Video Essestials, I thought "Why would Joe Kane put such crappy transfers on his reference DVD?" Oh, now I see. Amazing.

The biggest difference besides clarity and detail was in properly setting black level (brightness). My Sony did not pass blacker than black on the pluge test. The Bravo does. This allowed me to set brightness to exactly the right setting. Getting very close to the TV, and adjusting brightness downward, you could see the precise moment when all dithering and grey scale left the backgroudn of the test pattern, and the background matched the blacker than black bar precisely. Not one notch too high or too low. Blacks became blacker and shadow detail increased exponentially. I cannot emphasize the difference enough. Dark objects on the reference video on DVE went from black blobs to very detailed objects. A really huge difference.

Wow what a picture. I am so glad I quit waiting and finally bought this set and this DVD player. Spectacular.

Thanks for all the advice.

BTW - the set is ISF calibrated - no clay faces, no green push, no problems.

"Here is the latest variant on the flickering theme. I hope flicker is the right word, but what happens is that a normal picture gets rather dark only for a second, then reverts to the normal picture. It only happens when I'm watching a DVD. I have the Bose 321 DVD player connected with the S-Video cable that came with the system, so admittedly not the best cable to use with this sophisticated television. Unfortunately, the 321 does not have component video jacks, only S-Video and A/V. "

My ISF calibrator described an effect exactly like this caused by the DNIe processing. Try turning this off and see if the flicker goes away.

I said this in an earlier post, but I shall repeat it because it is important.

Samsung DLP owners fall neatly into two camps. Those who follow the DVI adage couldn't be happier. And those who don't - have nothing but PQ complaints.

Originally posted by arungupta
I said this in an earlier post, but I shall repeat it because it is important.

Samsung DLP owners fall neatly into two camps. Those who follow the DVI adage couldn't be happier. And those who don't - have nothing but PQ complaints.

I understand but in fairness to a lot of these DLP owners it's not as simple as hooking up your set to DVI. There are a number of threads about the fact that some setup boxes with DVI do not work well with the Samsung including most offered by cable companies. If word got around that this set only worked with a select few satellite boxes (and no cable boxes) and one or two DVD players with DVI, it wouldn't look too pretty for Samsung.

Arun, in all your research have you posted a list of setup boxes with DVI that work well with this set? I know there are serious issues with Pioneer, Pace and Scientific Atlanta.

Originally posted by arungupta
I said this in an earlier post, but I shall repeat it because it is important.

Samsung DLP owners fall neatly into two camps. Those who follow the DVI adage couldn't be happier. And those who don't - have nothing but PQ complaints.


I agree, but may I add that I dont have any PQ problems with HD via component

My DVI guide (see sig.) did start that list, but I haven't updated it for a while. I am planning to update it soon.

I agree that you DVI is not easy to do for cable subscribers. But when it comes to DBS and DVD playback, it is a no brainer.

And alas, there is only 1 DVI input port. You have these options 1) use VGA for one input (its pretty close to DVI.). 2) switch manually. 3) buy a DVI switch (See my sig.).

I consider the DVI benefit to be a large enough benefit to Samsung DLP owners that I don't mind keep harping on it.

Originally posted by tboo
I agree, but may I add that I dont have any PQ problems with HD via component
That is great. I've heard mixed reports on HD via component.

When I got my new VOOM service, I did a detailed comparison of HD via component and DVI. At least in this case, the difference was very substantial.

I'm using DVI from a HTPC for DVD playback, and component from a Motorola 5100 Cable box. I also don't have any complaints, though if/when Comcast decides to 'permanently' enable the DVI on the box (sounds like they've been playing around with it in some areas), I may have to swap these sources, or use VGA for the HTPC. We'll see how it goes...

This is a little off-topic but I just had an interesting experience with my HLN5065W. I was watching my new, 4:3 aspect DVD set of "Aqua Teen Hunger Force."

My DVD player is a Samsung HD931, which stretches a 4:3 picture sideways on 720p DVI mode. On 480p DVI mode it maps it pixel for pixel in the middle of a black field, making it rather small. So I tend to use the component inputs to watch 4:3 material, because it zooms it proportionally to vertically fit the screen and go sideways as much as necessary to preserve the aspect.

Interestingly, when I set the DVD player to Progressive Scan mode for the component outputs, the picture quality was poor - the effect is hard to describe but it looked like flickering, shifting, blurring etc. of areas of the picture or the whole picture.

When I turned off Progressive Scan mode however, the picture became crisp and clear immediately.

Not sure in cases like this whether it is the TV or the DVD player to blame, or maybe the DVD itself doesn't like to be progressively scanned for some reason, but in this case the solution to my PQ problem on component input was to not use progressive scanning. I have heard that some DVDs "are not progressive" but I honestly don't know what this means, as I have seen little discussion of it that it not very technical.

I use the DVI input for anamorphic DVDs, which is most of my collection other than a few TV shows in 4:3 like Buffy, Angel, Family Guy and ATHF. Fortunately some of the better shows are being made as anamorphic 1.78:1 DVDs, like Stargate SG-1 and Alias, a trend which will hopefully grow. I have not had problems with any anamorphic DVD using DVI, which leaves me doubly unsure what people mean by "some DVDs are not progressive."

chuft, the explanation may be simple. If you set the DVD player to progressive, then the player is deinterlacing the signal. If you set it to non-progressive, the TV is deinterlacing it. Since, the second case is producing a superior picture, the TV is doing a better job of deinterlacing it.

I have generally recommended that the DVD player should be set to non-progressive because the Samsung HLN TV does a better job of deinterlacing than most DVD players.

Why then do the anamorphic movies look so good through the DVI in 720p mode? Is the DVD player using different circuitry for this output than for the component output? Now that I think about it I think the HD931 may indeed use its Faroudja chip only for the DVI output port.

Ahh, the mysteries of these new fangled technologies. Every device seems to have its own mind on how to do things.

It used to be that you would take an S-Video cable from your DVD player and hook it into your TV and you are done.

Now you have to figure out which type of connection to use for each type of DVD, decide on the connection resolution, tell your DVD player what is your TV's aspect ratio, decide between progressive and non-progressive, set the TV to an appropriate zoom and aspect, ....

And its different for each combination of DVD player and TV. And now add the rest of the equipment.......

How will the average consumer understand these mysteries and figure out what to do?

HDMI?

HDMI is DVI phase 2. It is DVI+Audio and a different smaller connector. You can easily connect between DVI and HDMI - just a cable.

For more see:
http://www.digiupdate.com/G002_DVI_HDMI_and_HDCP.html

Even with HDMI you still need to tell your DVD player if your TV is 16x9 or 4x3. Plus, not many of us want to route our audio to our TV. We want it routed to our A/V receiver/pre-pro.

With regards to DVI being a "Eureka! I've found PQ Nirvana" solution. PQ issues happen even in mighty DVI. It's just that in DVI it's generally the source or the limitations in processing of the DLP itself (i.e., dithering, IR, etc.) No one should be fooled into thinking that they'll have no issues when using DVI. Arun might want to amend the interesting line in his signature to say "please don't post PQ complaints, switch to DVI. *Then* post PQ complaints." ;)

Rick

Originally posted by ender21
Arun might want to amend the interesting line in his signature to say "please don't post PQ complaints, switch to DVI. *Then* post PQ complaints." ;)
Rick
Done. :)

My "HDMI" posting was my tongue-in-cheek response to Arun's question.

Has anyone compared the PQ (on a Samsung DLP) of HDTV feeds via DirectTV, using a DVI connection from the STB, to cable HDTV feeds using component connections from the cable STB?

I am currently doing a "test drive" with COMCAST cable in Alexandria, VA, on my HLN617W and the supplied STB is an SA3100HD with component connections. To me, the HDTV feeds via this source look great, and cable does not require the up-front costs of a DBS service, but I don't know whether HDTV signals via DBS/DVI would look even better.

I will say that SDTV feeds are okay, but not great. From what I've read here, I would expect SDTV signals via DBS/DVI to look better than my cable set-up.

Thanks
Bruce

I am about to do that. I am ordering Cablevision service that doesn't have DVI support yet. That's the only way I can get CBS HD in these Connecticut boondocks. I already have DirecTV and VOOM with DVI connections, so this will be my third service. I shall figure out later which ones to drop.

I did make a detailed comparison of HD over component vs. DVI connection using VOOM. The difference was substantial.

Arun,

Thanks, I'll look forward to your impressions of cable/component vs DBS/DVI.

Bruce

Originally posted by johnevo
My "HDMI" posting was my tongue-in-cheek response to Arun's question.
It was my slow day yesterday. I get it now.;)

Why stop there - then we have to figure out lets see -- CableCard, HD-DVD, Blu-Ray, WM9, DRM, HD-PLC, WME, PMC, EPC, 802.11next, HighMAT, .....

What I don't understand is how digital cable with HD can send all the channels over a RF cable, yet to send just one from the tuner box to the TV requires a DVI cable to get good quality. If the RF cable can handle all the channels, sound and video, on the way in without losing quality, why does it take a DVI cable to handle just one channel on its way to the TV?

When RF cable carries a digital signal, it is encoded and compressed stream in packets, with error detection and correction.

DVI is carrying raw display data, already decoded and decompressed, real-time not in packets, and has no error detection / correction. In other words it is ready to go to the display except for any scaling that may be needed.

Since it is digital, it can tolerate a certain level of noise with no degradation of the signal. But if the noise level is excessive, then it cannot handle it because there is no error detection and correction. This is only a problem if the cable length is over 15 feet. At long lengths, you need better cables to reduce the noise level.

Originally posted by arungupta

Audio/video sync: You should be able to tell quickly enough whether your set has this problem. Only a small percentage of sets are reported to have this problem. Both of my sets don't have a problem.



Hi Guys,

Well, its official, I do have the audio/video sync problem. :(

My wife first noticed it and now we're seeing it on many different
channels. We've also seen it on our DVD connection as well.
(The DVD signal is via a DVI connection and cable is via a
component cable connection.)

Does the whole unit have to be exchanged, or can it be "fixed"?

I'm still inside the 30 day warranty.

-Tennis

Originally posted by arungupta
I am about to do that. I am ordering Cablevision service that doesn't have DVI support yet. That's the only way I can get CBS HD in these Connecticut boondocks. I already have DirecTV and VOOM with DVI connections, so this will be my third service. I shall figure out later which ones to drop.

I did make a detailed comparison of HD over component vs. DVI connection using VOOM. The difference was substantial.

Other threads have complained about DVI being darker than component connections. Arun, have you noticed this and if so how do you compensate?

I am currently contemplating a switch from component cable to Directv so I am also interested in your comparisons. I tend to think that some boxes work better with certain TVs and just any box with DVI is not necessarily the answer where our DLPs are concerned.

Further muddying the waters is the fact that Directv is coming out with its own box and I see Samsung will release its latest updated version of its SIR- TS160 box next month which one could assume will work well with a Samsung TV. But will Directv make it easy to use boxes other than their own in the future?

The cable co has hit me with two increases in the couple of months of one form or another, plus they have no DVI that is now compatible with my Samsung so they are "on the clock" with me.

Arun as usual thanks for providing so much great information for all of us.

Originally posted by tennis


Well, its official, I do have the audio/video sync problem.

My wife first noticed it and now we're seeing it on many different
channels. We've also seen it on our DVD connection as well.
(The DVD signal is via a DVI connection and cable is via a
component cable connection.)

Does the whole unit have to be exchanged, or can it be "fixed"?

I'm still inside the 30 day warranty.

-Tennis


I'd definitely get someone from Samsung out to see it right away since you just got the TV and see what they think.

My personal experience is that the sound is out of sync on certain channels with my setup but not all of the channels and it is not in the set. I know this because my surround sound system is always in sync with my TV. NBC in particular is a culprit here. The 11 o'clock local news is out of sync and then the Tonight Show comes in all its glory of HD and the sound is still off, but when I turn up the sound in both the TV and the Surround Sound there is no echo. Since the surround sound bypasses the TV altogether I know the Samsung is not to blame.

Originally posted by Sea Ray
I'd definitely get someone from Samsung out to see it right away since you just got the TV and see what they think.

My personal experience is that the sound is out of sync on certain channels with my setup but not all of the channels and it is not in the set. I know this because my surround sound system is always in sync with my TV. NBC in particular is a culprit here. The 11 o'clock local news is out of sync and then the Tonight Show comes in all its glory of HD and the sound is still off, but when I turn up the sound in both the TV and the Surround Sound there is no echo. Since the surround sound bypasses the TV altogether I know the Samsung is not to blame.

Thanks for the reply Sea Ray,

I'll ping the sales people and have them send out someone from Samsung.

Yeah, I agree the problem seems to be on different channels. Some are worse than others. What I can't understand is, why I didn't see this on my old SD set?

For the record, I have an HNL617.

Originally posted by Sea Ray
My personal experience is that the sound is out of sync on certain channels with my setup but not all of the channels and it is not in the set. I know this because my surround sound system is always in sync with my TV. NBC in particular is a culprit here. The 11 o'clock local news is out of sync and then the Tonight Show comes in all its glory of HD and the sound is still off, but when I turn up the sound in both the TV and the Surround Sound there is no echo. Since the surround sound bypasses the TV altogether I know the Samsung is not to blame.
Your logic is faulty. It is the VIDEO that is being delayed, not the audio. In that circumstance you would not expect to see a difference between the TV and the surround sound system.

do the new pannys DLP use the latest hd2+ or hd3 chips. Thanks, Mikesan1

BTW Arun, Have seen enough to form an opinion? I am interested in thePT60DLD64. Thanks again, Mikesan1

Originally posted by flex727
Your logic is faulty. It is the VIDEO that is being delayed, not the audio. In that circumstance you would not expect to see a difference between the TV and the surround sound system.

You bring up an interesting quandary. Either the video is off or the sound is. I honestly don't know how you can determine which it is. If the sound is only off on certain stations and not all, I tend to think it is the cable box, especially if the coaxial feed does not show this problem.

I admit the possibility of the video being off has merit but how can you be sure that it is the video that's off? I am not even sure if the video is ahead or behind the sound.

I have not had a problem with a DVD of course I am not using DVI either.

Extended warranties for sammy 43 dlp--is it worth doing, the dealer wants 500 for 5 yrs witha 50 % refund if no probs. Help thanks

Extended warranties for sammy 43 dlp--is it worth doing, the dealer wants 500 for 5 yrs witha 50 % refund if no probs. Help thanks

I always recommend extended warranties for these expensive new technologies. But make sure that it has meaning, i.e. the source will stand behind them and knows what to do if something goes wrong.

The price you mentioned is reasonable, also you can probably negotiate.

Originally posted by mikesan1
BTW Arun, Have seen enough to form an opinion? I am interested in thePT60DLD64. Thanks again, Mikesan1
They look very promising. They are HD2+, and you may be better off waiting till they have the seven segment color wheel.

For more on these sets:
http://www.digiupdate.com/105_DLP_RPTV.html

As for the A/V sync issue, there is no doubt that - on my HLN467W at least - the sound is just slightly ahead of the picture. I noticed it first during NFL games when the announcer would call a touchdown just before the player crossed the goal line. Now I notice it all the time.

I run the video directly to the TV and the audio directly to my Yamaha, so I have not yet watched a basic cable channel on the TV using the TV's sound, but I intend to.

Yup, same here. I notice it on cable and DVD. Audio goes through my Yamaha, and video directly to the TV.

Then it would seem that there is a video delay issue with some of the TVs, unless everyone has the same cable box problem.

Not exactly on topic, but I have noticed that the Dish Network satellite feed is about 5-6 seconds behind the live OTA program. I can chalk some of it up to lightspeed delay from bouncing off the satellite, but in 5 seconds you can bounce to the moon and back twice (almost). Is there anything else in the path that can introduce such a significant delay?

-Chris

There is a separate thread on the video delay issue you should check out.
IMO, and I'm *no* expert, video processing...deinterlacing...interpolating...noise reduction will *always* introduce a delay of some sort. It seems Sammys internal spec for this is something like a max of 60 ms. But some people have measured as much as 90 ms. Now, most people will not notice 60-90 ms of sync problems. But...the video feed may have *additional* sync delays due to their video processing...you add the effects together, and you have a noticeable problem. Personally, I can notice a lip-sync problem on the Weather Channel when the weathercasters are in front of the blue screen and I view over my S-video inputs (where the Sammy is using the DCDi Faroudja processing). But switching to component 3, where my cable box is upconverting, I can only *barely* detect a lip-sync problem. In fact, I can see the same (as component 3) delay on my analog TV if I look *really* hard. So...I think the problem is difficult to trace, because there are several contributions to the problem. The Sammy can be a factor...but so can a bunch of over things. Not to mention I've seen delays on regular analog TV now that I'm sensitized to it. Also...some people have even reported the video *ahead* of the audio...no way the Sammy is doing that!

But in any case...I'd suggest trying Component 3 or DVI and letting the cable box do the up-converting if you see a sync problem, and see if things improve. Also....Sammy is reportedly working a "fix" for this. But I think the "fix" might just be to get the measured 90 ms delay back down to 60 ms.....and I'm don't think that is going to completely eliminate the problems many people are reporting!

Hello All, I am a new member enrolle dbut have been a passive reader for many months now before I bought the 50", I ahd teh Comcast gusy hookup the cable today, they gave me the Motorola 6200 receiver set, The TV is connected right now through component 2, with the reciever set to the folowing:

Picture size 16:9 ( options ae 4:3; 4:3 pan scan and 16:9)
PrYB..:1080I( options are 1080I, 720P,I, 480P,i)

My HDTV broadcast looks great but the regular cable like channel 59 (SCifi) and all other channels , I am not sure if they are analog or not, though I have digital cable, looks pathetic, it is pretty grainy, can some of you masters point me in the right direction what I need to do to help it look better, I d appreciate your input on it..

As an aside I (who only have regular analog cable) have noticed that SciFi broadcasts their programming in really washed out colors. It is also often dark, the combination when you are watching something shadowy like X-Files for example really looks bad. But it is their fault, because when a commercial comes on suddenly everything gets brighter and more colorful. The contrast between the commercials and the shows is quite striking. Obviously it is not the TV's fault, it is the cable signal doing it.

I used to think some of these shows were dark and colorless until I got the DVDs and noticed the difference in color intensity. In fact I did not buy Beyond Re-Animator because it looked so bland on SciFi but I have since realized it might look a lot better on DVD.

Ramtajogi:

Everything looks good, except I would switch the output of the cable box to 720p. The sammy outputs all signals in 720p so its one less conversion.

So I get my new Motorolla box from the cable copany today and I switch from coax to DVI into the tv. Looking at some of the HD channles which look great, however 2 problems:

1. When I hit Display on the samsung remote the reolution says 720 X 480. Is that correct?
2. Also the regular digital channels (most of them) look horrible as some have a kind of "double border" around the edge of the screen.

Also, cable company told me this box has no OTA tuner, so even if I hook up an HD antenna I can't get local HD (like the Superbowl)! Is it possible this box has no OTA tuner?

Thanks.

1. When I hit Display on the samsung remote the reolution says 720 X 480. Is that correct?
- No, the resolution should be set to 720p or 1280x720

2. Also the regular digital channels (most of them) look horrible as some have a kind of "double border" around the edge of the screen.
- Make sure that your "aspect", see your Samsung remote, is on TV-wide.

Thanks.

this Motorolla box (DCT6200) is not enable for DVI even though there is a port on the back for it. Damn!

Direct TV here I come!

Originally posted by sage540
Direct TV here I come!
I don't understand why its taking so long for cable companies to introduce DVI boxes. Satellite boxes introduced it ~ 18 months ago. Cable companies, Motorola and Scientific Atlanta all come out looking very bad in this transition.

I think CableCard will come to their rescue just in time. With CableCard, major CE vendors can provide state of the art cable receivers, and get cable companies out of cable box business before they lose too many customers to satellite. Motorola and SA will be the biggest losers in the end.

Originally posted by arungupta

I think CableCard will come to their rescue just in time. With CableCard, major CE vendors can provide state of the art cable receivers, and get cable companies out of cable box business before they lose too many customers to satellite. Motorola and SA will be the biggest losers in the end.

So it's your understanding that with cable card it'll be up to the consumer to go out and buy "state of the art receivers" from major CE vendors rather than the cable co providing them?

In the Central Florida (metro Orlando) area, we are finally getting the Pace cable box with active DVI, but in limited release and usually only if you have a DVI input (which we Sammy owners do). I'm waiting to get one. Then I'll have to get a DVI switch for the Bravo DVD player.

Maybe some of you guys will get Pace boxes in your areas.

Since I can't do DVI from the Motorolla HD cable box I tried component into Component 2 and 3. Both tries were unsucessful. HD channels seem to work but regular are all squished, grainin and lines all over the screen. TV displays a message, "Not supported mode".

??????

Did you try to set your STB resolution to 720p? Can you also post the specific model number of your box, so that someone with knowledge of that STB can help you.

Enable 480p override on the cable box (turn off the box, then hit setup). See the FAQ in the Motorola 5100 thread if you need more info.

http://broadband.motorola.com/consumers/products/dct6200/

Thanks.

On the HDTV Hardware forum they are mentioning that Comcast is now turning on the DVI port on the Moto 5100. It has been done in several parts of the country. I believe they need to upgrade the firmware to 7.xx to activate the DVI port. The rest of the country should also be getting this upgrade. I also believe it activates the firewire port as well.

Originally posted by Gilley
In the Central Florida (metro Orlando) area, we are finally getting the Pace cable box with active DVI, but in limited release and usually only if you have a DVI input (which we Sammy owners do). I'm waiting to get one. Then I'll have to get a DVI switch for the Bravo DVD player.

Maybe some of you guys will get Pace boxes in your areas.

I have the Pace 550 from Brighthouse and the DVI output has a known compatibility issue with Samsung sets. The fix from Pace is supposed to be out in a month or so and then who knows how long it will take Pioneer to test it and release it as an automatic update.

Originally posted by Sea Ray
So it's your understanding that with cable card it'll be up to the consumer to go out and buy "state of the art receivers" from major CE vendors rather than the cable co providing them?

Yes that is exactly the case. Initially, it seems that this Cable plug-and-play capability is coming integrated into TV's. The FCC mandate to build ATSC tuners into large size TV's is causing vendors to include the CableCard tuner into this option as well. Towards the end of the year, standalone CableCard STB's and DVR's should start showing up. Here is some reading on CableCard.

http://www.cnet.com/4520-7912_1-5116394-1.html
http://www.cnet.com/4520-7912_1-5116529-1.html
http://www.motorola.com/mediacenter/news/detail/0,,3674_3074_23,00.html - Motorola HDT300

Incidentally, Samsung DLP 2004 models will have the option of both CableCard and ATSC tuners in the second half of the year. Most of the other vendor DLP sets and other large size TV's from many vendors will have this option also.

I prefer the HD tuner to be in a separate box and not built-into the TV.

Originally posted by Taylormade2
I have the Pace 550 from Brighthouse and the DVI output has a known compatibility issue with Samsung sets. What is the nature of the incompatibility? The SA3250HD cable box that Adelphia supplies also has some compatibility issues with the Samsung DLP. I wonder if these issues are related?

Originally posted by Taylormade2
I have the Pace 550 from Brighthouse and the DVI output has a known compatibility issue with Samsung sets. The fix from Pace is supposed to be out in a month or so and then who knows how long it will take Pioneer to test it and release it as an automatic update.

Oh no. That's bad news. Maybe I should wait a month or so then. Any idea who to contact about this for more info?

For the Motorola boxes (5100, 6200) need to turn off the box and then hit Menu on the remote to access the service menu. There are three settings in there at the top:

1. TV Type - either 16:9, 4:3 Letterbox, or 4:3 Pan and Scan,
2. YPbPr Output - 480i, 480P, 720P, 1080i
3. 4:3 Overide - Off, 480i, 480P

I am not sure what they all do, but the channels are working. Are there any combination of settings that will allow me to view the non HD channels (which are the majority) in Wide mode? Those channels seem 4:3 even when the TV setting is in Wide.

Also, 720P or 1080i, which is better?

Thanks,
MPG

Originally posted by Gilley
Oh no. That's bad news. Maybe I should wait a month or so then. Any idea who to contact about this for more info?

I've got this set-up presently and the DVI is not working. Supposedly, the Pioneer software in the Pace box does not "handshake" properly with the Sammy...but the problem is reportedly on the Pace side and they are working on a fix.

The good news is the component feeds out of the Pace box on the Hi-Def channels produce a jaw-dropping picture.....

Originally posted by Jim Gilliland
What is the nature of the incompatibility? The SA3250HD cable box that Adelphia supplies also has some compatibility issues with the Samsung DLP. I wonder if these issues are related?

The Pace 550 DVI output will not stay active when you switch to a different video input from DVI. When you go back to DVI from the other input, there will be no signal. I spoke with Ken at PaceMicro and he indicated that they are developing a fix that should be ready in a month. He said it then goes to Pioneer who would then test and distribute the fix. He had no idea how long it could take Pioneer to do this.

Hey all,
I have an HTPC question.
I have a Windows XP pc with nVidia 5200 graphics card connected to the HLN4365 set via VGA cable. It seems that only available options are 4x3 resolutions. Like 1024 x 724, 800 x 6000 and so on. Windows screen looks stretched in the Wide PC mode. Is there any way to choose a 16x9 resolution to get rid of the stretching ? The monitor type is set to "Plug and Play Monitor" in the nVidia card properties.

PS. I am trying to reserve DVI output for HD cable.

Thanks

Get Powerstrip and define a custom resolution of 1280x720. http://www.entechtaiwan.com/ps.htm

When you have the resolution working, make sure your TV is in TV-wide mode for 1x1 pixel resolution, though you will get an overscan of the desktop. With PC-wide mode, you don't get the overscan, but the picture will be nowhere as clear.

Originally posted by sage540
For the Motorola boxes (5100, 6200) need to turn off the box and then hit Menu on the remote to access the service menu. There are three settings in there at the top:

1. TV Type - either 16:9, 4:3 Letterbox, or 4:3 Pan and Scan,
2. YPbPr Output - 480i, 480P, 720P, 1080i
3. 4:3 Overide - Off, 480i, 480P

MPG

Since you want the SD channels to default to wide, you should set the Motorola box to
TV Type 16:9
YPbPr Output 720P (native resolution of Samsung DLP)
4:3 Override 480P

You also need the component cable output from the Motorola to go to either component 2 or 3 input on the Sammy.

I have the 4:3 override set to "off" for my setup because I like the 4:3 channels to be shown in 4:3.

Jeff

nm

Originally posted by jedvik
Since you want the SD channels to default to wide, you should set the Motorola box to
TV Type 16:9
YPbPr Output 720P (native resolution of Samsung DLP)
4:3 Override 480P

You also need the component cable output from the Motorola to go to either component 2 or 3 input on the Sammy.

I have the 4:3 override set to "off" for my setup because I like the 4:3 channels to be shown in 4:3.

Jeff

Sage did it improve the quality of ur signal for the SD channels, IF so can you post what you tried and what improved it, I think we both have the same setup, DLP 50", Motorola 6200, Grainy SD and digital but great HDTV, also on setting the override to 480I I think it says "not supported on the TV.

OK, let me see if I understand this. I have a Mot5100 STB and I have never accessed the SM, but I did have the installer set the output to 720p (he originally had it set to 1080i). Now I believe I only have th component outs hooked up on the STB, so is that all I need to be concerned with? I, too, prefer my 4:3 to be displayed in 4:3. As it is now, I have to switch the aspect whenever I switch from a 16:9 HD channel to a 4:3 SD channel. Are you saying the box will do this for me?

Try this link for the Moto 5100 FAQ

http://www.cjhengineering.com/5100faq.htm

Sage did it improve the quality of ur signal for the SD channels, IF so can you post what you tried and what improved it, I think we both have the same setup, DLP 50", Motorola 6200, Grainy SD and digital but great HDTV, also on setting the override to 480I I think it says "not supported on the TV.

Greatly improved the regular channels and the HD looks better in 720P than 1080i.

I got my HLN5065 on Tuesday and my Comcast DTV yesterday. I couldn't find anything that id's the model of my Motorola STB. Two questions.

Does the presence of the two Firewire ports tell me that I have a 6200 vs. the 5100?

I tried changing the setting from 1080i to 720p but I get a Not Supported msg. Do I need to change some other settings? It is connected to Component 2 on my HLN5065.

Originally posted by Your User Name:
As it is now, I have to switch the aspect whenever I switch from a 16:9 HD channel to a 4:3 SD channel. Are you saying the box will do this for me?

If you have the 4:3 override set to "off" then your 4:3 channels will not be stretched.

Jeff

Thanks I was able to do that last night. I feel dumb for not having realized this sooner. I am a happy camper now. For the record here is what I've got set on my 5100->HLN507 via Component 3:

TV Type: 16:9
YPbPr Output: 720P
4:3 Override: Off

Originally posted by Sea Ray
You bring up an interesting quandary. Either the video is off or the sound is. I honestly don't know how you can determine which it is. If the sound is only off on certain stations and not all, I tend to think it is the cable box, especially if the coaxial feed does not show this problem.

I admit the possibility of the video being off has merit but how can you be sure that it is the video that's off? I am not even sure if the video is ahead or behind the sound.

I have not had a problem with a DVD of course I am not using DVI either.

I have a Samsung HLN 46" with a manufacturing date of Oct. 03 and it has a very annoying problem from time to time with the synchronization between the sound and the picture. I've done some testing on my own and basted on my analysis It is clear to me that the video processor is not keeping up with the audio stream.

Here's why:
I find that the delay varies from source to source, and program to program. I Have had my audio out of sync with my video on some programs regardless of the signal source. E.g.:
DVD to TV via DVI and audio to amp (Maranza SR7400) via digital (copper or fiber) sometimes gives me sync problems.
HDTV Cable box on HD channel to TV via component and audio to SR7400 digital and/or analog gives me occasional sync problems.
HDTV Cable box on SD channel to TV via component, s-video, or composite and audio to SR7400 digital and/or analog gives me occasional sync problems.
HDTV Cable box on HD/SD channel to TV via component and audio to TV audio in analog gives me allot of sync problems and
Over Air SD signal from rooftop antenna connected directly to the TV with NO OTHER audio component attached gives me sync problems.

Whether I separate the video signal from the audio signal before they enter the TV and then send it to separate components for processing or they remain all bundled directly to the TV, I still get Audio/Video sync problems on some programs. The only constant here is the TV. Therefore the problem is in the TV--not the external tuner, cable box, amplifier, of DVD player.

The reason I thinks its a video processor problem is that the delay time seems to loosely correlate to the compression of the video signal. I've seen the delay change when a program changes to commercial or on a news broadcast when it goes from a studio shot to an on-location shot.
When the delay is great, it becomes obvious that the video is trailing the audio. I think the processing chip is having problems keeping up with the data flow. I think its a hardware problem.

I'm sure this link has been posted in this thread before... perhaps it's time to add it Arun's signature... or put it in a FAQ for this thread...

Video delay on new Samsung DLP (Old Sound delay thread) (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=295677)

There is a new version of the Samsung HLN guide imminent. It will be in that guide.

It is already in the popular threads for the Rear Projection forum.

Originally posted by Kevin R. Anderson
The Sammy manual says 200 watts.

I researched this issue to purchase a UPS system for my Sammy. With record heat here in Salt Lake City, the power goes out a few times a week. Now, if the power goes out, the UPS will give me a few minutes to turn off the TV and allow the fan to cool the bulb.

Getting a UPS may be a good idea for all Sammy owners.

I'm interested in this issue. I bought a Belkin 800VA UPS on sale, but it's 450 W capacity is apparently not enough for my Sammy, Dish 921, and HTPC all at the same time. As soon as I installed the monitoring software on the PC, it complained the UPS was overloaded and shut everything down, including the UPS. This of couse stopped the Sammy dead in it's tracks. Luckily it had only been on a few minutes, so the lamp wasn't that hot yet.

Then I got to thinking. Is there a way to control the Sammy through the RS232 port? The Belkin is a networkable UPS and has both USB and RS232 ports. If I got a UPS with a little more oomph, could I program the PC to shut off the lamp, and other things on the Sammy but leave the cooling fan running a little while to cool it properly in the event of a power outage?

-Chris

Hi all -

I just had a fairly new Sammy HLN507W repaired for a stuck mirror, and when the repairman put everything back together, I noticed (after the fact unfortunately) that my picture is now off-center. In fact, the picture slowly droops downward as you look from the left to the right side of the screen by about 1/4-1/2". The repairman is coming back tomorrow to fix it, and I was wondering if there are any suggestions as to what I could freeze frame or use as a guide to ensure that my picture is reframed properly?

I don't have Video Essentials, but I certainly have enough DVD's to be able to use something similar to a THX Optidisc program if you think that would be helpful, or any other suggestions to help lend a bit of accuracy rather than just "eyeballing" it would be appreciated. FWIW, I also have a DISH 921 receiver, and a Pioneer Elite DVD player with HDMI/DVI capability if you think either would generate a menu screen or something that would work as well?

Thanks,

RobbW

Originally posted by ryshapiro
Hey all,
I have an HTPC question.
I have a Windows XP pc with nVidia 5200 graphics card connected to the HLN4365 set via VGA cable. It seems that only available options are 4x3 resolutions. Like 1024 x 724, 800 x 6000 and so on. Windows screen looks stretched in the Wide PC mode. Is there any way to choose a 16x9 resolution to get rid of the stretching ? The monitor type is set to "Plug and Play Monitor" in the nVidia card properties.

PS. I am trying to reserve DVI output for HD cable.

Thanks

My son has the GeForce FX 5200 Nvidia card. I downloaded the most recent Video Drivers for this card months ago. The version is 5.2.1.6 and supports every conceivable resolution, including 1280 x 720 and 16x9 viewing.

I have a mere GeForce 2 MX400 and it too can support 1280 by 720. However the TV does not like it and says "unsupported mode" or somesuch if I change the resolution to that. I am using a VGA splitter to run the computer output to both my LCD monitor and to the HLN5065W. 1280 by 720 on my 4:3 LCD monitor looks squished of course but it works. The TV just shows a blue screen and the error message. I think the highest it can handle is 1024 by 768 through the VGA cable and in fact the TV manual says to use this resolution.

I have not fooled around with any tweaking software specifically for HTPCs, I just copy the VGA signal to the TV because it looks cool when I am playing certain games like Starfleet Command (which looks great even when stretched wide) or when I am surfing the web and want to share the information with someone else in the room.

ryshapiro,

I've found and confirmed with several other Samsung DLP owners that the 53.03 and 53.04 nVidia Forceware drivers do not allow selection 1280x720 mode (at least for DVI). The drivers simply don't allow you to see or set this resolution. This appears to be an issue with these driver versions even if you attempt to override the resolution using Powerstrip (it appears be a bug in how they are handling EDID data from the display).

If you are trying to get 1280x720 resolution, try the 52.16 drivers first. For me they work for DVI with no powerstrip tweaks necessary (I'm using a geForce FX 5200). As mentioned above, you should make sure your aspect ratio is set to TV-Wide to prevent the scaler from kicking in.

Once you get this working you can remove overscan if desired by using Powerstrip to create a resolution of 1248x702 (discussed elsewhere in this forum) and setting the Flat Panel Display mode to "centered" (to prevent the drivers from scaling the output).

I have the Sony NS715P DVD player hooked up to my Samsung HLN617. I tried switching from progressive to interlaced to see which way produces a better picture. You can only do this when you are on the menu screen (the DVD is not paying). I found that the letters displayed on the screen from the Sony menu developed jaggies when set to the interlaced mode but disappeared when I put it into the progressive mode. Is there a technical reason for this (i.e. you need a moving object for the Samsung to pick up the interlace) or is the Sony progressive scan built into the DVD player superior?

Originally posted by ambient-sky
ryshapiro,

I've found and confirmed with several other Samsung DLP owners that the 53.03 and 53.04 nVidia Forceware drivers do not allow selection 1280x720 mode (at least for DVI). The drivers simply don't allow you to see or set this resolution. This appears to be an issue with these driver versions even if you attempt to override the resolution using Powerstrip (it appears be a bug in how they are handling EDID data from the display).

If you are trying to get 1280x720 resolution, try the 52.16 drivers first. For me they work for DVI with no powerstrip tweaks necessary (I'm using a geForce FX 5200). As mentioned above, you should make sure your aspect ratio is set to TV-Wide to prevent the scaler from kicking in.

Once you get this working you can remove overscan if desired by using Powerstrip to create a resolution of 1248x702 (discussed elsewhere in this forum) and setting the Flat Panel Display mode to "centered" (to prevent the drivers from scaling the output).

I only tried VGA input and 1280 x 720 worked fine.

Have owned an HLN567W for the past 3 weeks. I have noticed that my DVD player (new Sony) seems to produce a slightly fuzzy picture when in preogressive mode; however when in regular mode the picture is crystal clear. I have turned the progressive mode off on the DVD player and now watch all DVDs this way. Is this a common/uncommon occurence? Thanks for your assistance. This forum has provided me with a wealth of information on my new baby, but could not find a thread addressing the above

Originally posted by TheoMD
Have owned an HLN567W for the past 3 weeks. I have noticed that my DVD player (new Sony) seems to produce a slightly fuzzy picture when in preogressive mode; however when in regular mode the picture is crystal clear. I have turned the progressive mode off on the DVD player and now watch all DVDs this way. Is this a common/uncommon occurence? Thanks for your assistance. This forum has provided me with a wealth of information on my new baby, but could not find a thread addressing the above

This means the samsung is better at deinterlacing than your dvd player. This is common for these sets.

New version 2.9 of the guide is now hosted in an HTML version. No more winzip and MS word issues.:)

http://www.digiupdate.com/P001_Samsung_HLN_DLP_2003.html

I shall post a list of the changes in this version soon. Superbowl guests are arriving - gotta go.

Originally posted by sage540
Sage did it improve the quality of ur signal for the SD channels, IF so can you post what you tried and what improved it, I think we both have the same setup, DLP 50", Motorola 6200, Grainy SD and digital but great HDTV, also on setting the override to 480I I think it says "not supported on the TV.

Greatly improved the regular channels and the HD looks better in 720P than 1080i.

Hello, all just to reverify as I understand the Motorola dct 6200 settings which allow the best HDTV and SD reception is 16:9, 720P, and 4:3 override =0ff.

Also I was watching the Tennis finals last night and I noticed that there was a lot of pixelation effect at the edges where 2 colors would meet, i.e. Safin's red T-shirt and the Green court, whenever Safin the player would move the edges would get blurred and pixalated it would seem only where 2 colors meet ?? is this normal has anyone else seen this, I noticed it on football as well, the edges get blurred against the backdrop when the athelete moves, is there a fix for this Arun that U are aware of, have you seen this problem, I am connected to the HLN5065 using component 2, with the above mentioned settings

Hi Arun,

The new guide is great! Nice!

You might add in your guide (in th Why You May not Buy this TV section) that a reason to think twice about Plasmas is their power consumption. They consume about 600 watts (just feel the screen some time), which can really heat up a room. I considered this a big negative for my environment. I guess you could call it "burn-up" risk :)

New version 2.9 of the guide is now hosted in an HTML version. No more winzip and MS word issues

I'm a little surprised that in the "Threads on Experience of Samsung Owners" you only post positive reviews and fail to mention problems with green cast, poor shadow detail, washed out blacks, IR and AV sync.

Similarly, in the "Picture Quality Complaints" the discussion is a little vague -- you make it sound like all PQ problems are due to owner stupidity (i.e. "operator error") or poor source material -- and fails to discuss the engineered-in shortcomings of the HD2 chip and/or "average-quality vs. premium-quality" parts, ICs, etc -- which result in real (not perceived or imagined) PQ limitiations.

This does a dis-service to prospective owners who may be led to believe that the Sammy HLN is "near-perfect".

To use Fox News bogus-slogan, how about something that's more "fair and balanced"?

Originally posted by CraigSharrow
I'm a little surprised that in the "Threads on Experience of Samsung Owners" you only post positive reviews and fail to mention problems with green cast, poor shadow detail, washed out blacks, IR and AV sync.

Similarly, in the "Picture Quality Complaints" the discussion is a little vague -- you make it sound like all PQ problems are due to owner stupidity (i.e. "operator error") or poor source material -- and fails to discuss the engineered-in shortcomings of the HD2 chip and/or "average-quality vs. premium-quality" parts, ICs, etc -- which result in real (not perceived or imagined) PQ limitiations.

This does a dis-service to prospective owners who may be led to believe that the Sammy HLN is "near-perfect".

To use Fox News bogus-slogan, how about something that's more "fair and balanced"?
Craig, there is a reason this is version 2.9 of the guide, and not 3.0. The main purpose of this version is to go to hosted HTML, and not be exhaustive.

I HAVE BEEN VERY PROACTIVE IN ADDRESSING ALL ISSUES WITH SAMSUNG / DLP ALL THROUGHOUT THE HISTORY OF THIS GUIDE AND MY TIME ON THIS FORUM.

That said, lets address your issues. I think you decided to post before actually reading the guide.
- "poor shadow detail, washed out blacks" is addressed right up front under under black levels when comparing technologies.
- IR (You mean internal reflection?) - covered under problems
- AV sync is addressed under problems
- green cast, i don't have any experience with this topic, because my two sets are fine. Everyone seems to agree that it is a calibration issue. I shall mention it in the next version.
- Picture quality - if you see in my signature, you'll see that I proactively addressed the DLP dithering topic. If I can substantiate other PQ issues, I will address them. I have linked to as many posts as possible, but I don't publish unverified observations.

So of your long list of things, the only one I haven't covered so far is green cast. I will be covering that soon, as soon I've time to do some more research on it.

Like any TV, there will be a percentage of people who will be unhappy with their sets. You are free to, and you absolutely should, share your perspective. I can only share MY perspective, I can't be a medium for yours.

CraigSharrow,

It doesnt take a rocket scientist to see that Arun really likes his Sammy TVs. Arun has in many cases discussed the different problems that this line of TVs experiences. Please read the 1400 or so posts of this thread before making a judgement. Aruns love for Samung is only clouded by his love of his first and second born DLPs.

- green cast, i don't have any experience with this topic, because my two sets are fine. Everyone seems to agree that it is a calibration issue. I shall mention it in the next version.


I really do believe it's a calibration issue. I didn't even think I had much of a green issue at all, but after I got my color analyzer and calibrated my DLP, *wow* there's a world of difference. There is nothing *green* about my set anymore. It's even diminished some of the dithering (though not eliminated since nothing short of an HD2+ can eliminate).

Rick

Originally posted by ender21
I really do believe it's a calibration issue. I didn't even think I had much of a green issue at all, but after I got my color analyzer and calibrated my DLP, *wow* there's a world of difference. There is nothing *green* about my set anymore. It's even diminished some of the dithering (though not eliminated since nothing short of an HD2+ can eliminate).

Rick

I am of the opinion that all of these TVs come from the factory with a green tint issue. In addition to all the comments posted here, just go look at the Samsung along side others at BB, CC etc. You'll see a tendancy towards green in them indeed. However it is eliminated with proper calibration.

WojtekZ Says: It doesnt take a rocket scientist to see that Arun really likes his Sammy TVs. Arun has in many cases discussed the different problems that this line of TVs experiences. Please read the 1400 or so posts of this thread before making a judgement. Aruns love for Samung is only clouded by his love of his first and second born DLPs.

Sadly, I've read most of the posts in this thread, when all I wanted to do was watch a great PQ HDTV. I've also read hundreds of posts regarding IR, AV Sync and other problems that folks have with this set, including Samsung employees who appear to have been left in the dark by their Korean counterparts, so that when we early-adopter owners contact them, often they either haven't heard of the problem or don't know how to address it other than by sending out a clueless Service Technician.

What would happen if you bought a $4000 surround sound processor or a $4000 amp, or a $4000 pre-amp, or a $4000 toilet seat (applies only the US Military) AND!!! you had to immediately spend $300-500 to have it FIXED (the non-euphemistic version of what "Calibrated" means)?

Short answer: you'd be pissed that you'd been sold a product that didn't get adequate QC at the factory.

Can you imagine the uproar that would descend on high-end magazines like Stereophile or The Absolute Sound, as well as on the manufacturer if someone like Krell, or Theta, or Levinson, or Bryston, or Classe were to say, "Sure you've spent a s--tload of money on our product, but you can't expect it to work correctly or deliver a pleasing sound without hiring an professional tuner to adjust the circuits we built into the mother- or daughter-cards; afterall, 120Hz to 250Hz sounds pretty good - you can't expect us to make sure that all the notes in the scale are reproduced accurately." Audio equipment manufacturers can't get away with selling "uncalibrated" products, why should video manufacturers?

-----

I love the great stuff about the Sammy, but not its flaws. I don't subscribe to the "Love it or leave it" philosophy: I think that problems need to be vigorously discussed and rapidly resolved, not glossed over. As I've said before, consumers should not have to pay for the privilege of being beta testers!

A question about watching 4:3 programs.

Why do some channels default to black side bars while others have grey side bars? Most of the local channels on the cable box are black side bars, but a few always default to grey.

While watching the Super Bowl on CBS HD last night, most of the commericals were 4:3 SD and had black side bars. But there was one 4:3 SD commercial that changed from black sidebars to grey in the middle of the commercial and the bars stayed grey for the remainder of the commercials in that string. After the game came back on and the went to another run of commercials, the side bars went back to black for the commercials.

Craig,

You are looking for a perfection that doesn't exist in any of the digital technologies at this point. If were to advise a friend who was looking for such perfection, I would advise them to wait for a year or more. On the other hand, if you want to watch HDTV today on a large sceeen, and are willing to overlook the imperfections and enjoy the picture, then this set is great.

As an example, Internal reflection is part and parcel of all digital RPTV's today. If you can't ignore it, don't buy the set. Trying to fix this fundamental technology issue only make things worse, becuase every service call has the potential to cause more harm than good.

And I can undertand your frustration and have full sympathy for you.

I can also assure you that I try to be very objective and fair when I write a guide. I may make mistakes and inadvertently forget to include things, such as the green cast issue. But I look for my fellow forum members to spot those things and help me correct them without questioning my integrity.

Arun

Don't change a thing!

The guide is great and useful as long as you continue to add updates.

I want to see a celebrity death match between Arun and CraigSharrow!

Ok seriously, Craig go put your time and effort into creating a comparable guide to the HLN series that lists all it’s tragic flaws.

This otherwise excellent thread is starting to read:
Post by random happy HLN owner
Post by Arun offering help
Post by CraigSharrow complaining

Post by a random happy HLN owner
Post by CraigSharrow complaining

Post by another random happy HLN owner
Post by CraigSharrow complaining

Post by random happy HLN owner
Post by Arun offering help
Post by CraigSharrow complaining

…

Originally posted by CraigSharrow
I don't subscribe to the "Love it or leave it" philosophy: I think that problems need to be vigorously discussed and rapidly resolved, not glossed over. As I've said before, consumers should not have to pay for the privilege of being beta testers!


Hey Craig... Did you pay for Microsoft Windows?

Your car? (still evolving)
Your PC?
Your home theater system?
your cellphone?
Dish?
Beta/vhs?
Dialup internet?
Digital camera?
PDA?



Were these all perfected when you purchased them or are you still waiting?

I am another HAPPY HLN617W owner looking to buy the next generation....

Keep up the great and informative work, Arun!




.

Arun, I just want to take a quick moment to *thank you* (and others in this thread) for all the valuable information on the Samsung DLPs. This material was a great resource when I was in the decision making process, and now becomes a certain source of reference. Today, my HLN507W (WX/XAA to be specific) arrived, and the Comcast tech just left. That was a thrill, because the box he left was a Scientific Atlanta Explorer with DVI output. I had been told last week by Comcast that the box would be equipped with a non-operational DVI, but wow - things have changed! Yes, I missed the Super Bowl, but I'm far more of a racing fan and this year the Daytona 500 will be broadcast in HD for the first time. I can't wait!

Thanks again for your efforts and everyone's exchange of info...

Frank

PS - Oh yes, I did have a question - when the Comcast tech was setting up the box, a message appeared on the screen stating "Your TV does not support HDCP. Please connect using component cabling" - then after a few seconds it went away, and all DVI input from the box was fine. Any speculation as to what generated that message?

Originally posted by CraigSharrow
[B]Sadly, I've read most of the posts in this thread, when all I wanted to do was watch a great PQ HDTV. I've also read hundreds of posts regarding IR, AV Sync and other problems that folks have with this set, including Samsung employees who appear to have been left in the dark by their Korean counterparts, so that when we early-adopter owners contact them, often they either haven't heard of the problem or don't know how to address it other than by sending out a clueless Service Technician.

What would happen if you bought a $4000 surround sound processor or a $4000 amp, or a $4000 pre-amp, or a $4000 toilet seat (applies only the US Military) AND!!! you had to immediately spend $300-500 to have it FIXED (the non-euphemistic version of what "Calibrated" means)?

Short answer: you'd be pissed that you'd been sold a product that didn't get adequate QC at the factory.

Can you imagine the uproar that would descend on high-end magazines like Stereophile or The Absolute Sound, as well as on the manufacturer if someone like Krell, or Theta, or Levinson, or Bryston, or Classe were to say, "Sure you've spent a s--tload of money on our product, but you can't expect it to work correctly or deliver a pleasing sound without hiring an professional tuner to adjust the circuits we built into the mother- or daughter-cards; afterall, 120Hz to 250Hz sounds pretty good - you can't expect us to make sure that all the notes in the scale are reproduced accurately." Audio equipment manufacturers can't get away with selling "uncalibrated" products, why should video manufacturers?


Huh? You do that every time you by an A/V receiver, amp, DVD player, or any CAR you've driven, for that matter. That's why *mods* exist and are sold fairly frequently in every one of those examples. It's not *fixing* it, it's modifying it to exploit its potential. And *every* product has its limitations. So be sure to differentiate between the $300-$500 worth of calibration and the issues it can remedy (color/grayscale et al.) versus the basic limitations of a technology (IR/dithering).

I've already spent 8-10 hours on my ONE DLP to calibrate it and tweak it to get it as accurate as possible. Think every manufacturer has that much time to spend on every display their assembly line turns out only to consider it "adequate QC"? Be prepared to pay exponentially greater prices, then. And not just $300-$500 more.

Rick

What kind of AV receiver or Amp or any other device like that needs you to spend 300 to 500 to calibrate it? If by mods you mean all of that stuff like new and better powercords and isolation stuff I dont think thats what he was talking about. I kinda agree, spending this amount of money for a TV, it should be calibrated correctly and you shouldnt have to spend the extra cash to get it to look like its suppose to.

I forgot to mention this. In the past it would be hard to get every set calibrated correctly. Older RPTV would be harder to do. Though companies like Pioneer ELite and some Sony and Toshibas get it pretty close out of the box. But you would think with DLP, the inside of that thing is pretty much a computer. You would think it would be easier. And every set has the exact same insides no matter what the screen size. At least thats what the guy from Samsung Digital told me.

Hey Craig... Did you pay for Microsoft Windows?

Your car? (still evolving)
Your PC?
Your home theater system?
your cellphone?
Dish?
Beta/vhs?
Dialup internet?
Digital camera?
PDA?

You know, with those examples, you pretty much proved his point. Yes tech evolves. But the evolution should be with inovation not just fixing all the bugs. Things should work, then evolve with new and better inovations on what consumers need and want. Not what never worked before or worked poorly being fixed. Windows is the best example of that. Ive had my car, an Acura, for seven years, and besides normal maintenance, it has never acted poorly or needed some kind of fix. How cool would that be if tech stuff like windows, which i dont use, and everything else like that worked as well...

see Punctuated Equilibrium (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Punctuated_equilibrium)
Equilibrium - small evolutionary changes
Punctuation - big revolutionary changes

Consumer electronics had been in an Equilibrium state for some time, where small evolutionary enhancements were happening but otherwise things had been fairly stable.

But now it is in a state of Punctuation, caused by two asteroids hitting at the same time - HDTV and digitization. While some consumers thrive during this punctuation excited by new gadgets of every kind, others seek to return back to the calmer days. So you have to figure out what kind of consumer you are.

Your car? - Equilibrium
Your PC? - Constant state of Punctuation
Your home theater system? - Punctuation
your cellphone? - Punctuation
Dish? - Punctuation
Beta/vhs? - Gone
Dialup internet? - Equilibrium
Digital camera? - Punctuation
PDA? - Constant state of Punctuation

Originally posted by maxvengeance111
What kind of AV receiver or Amp or any other device like that needs you to spend 300 to 500 to calibrate it? If by mods you mean all of that stuff like new and better powercords and isolation stuff I dont think thats what he was talking about. I kinda agree, spending this amount of money for a TV, it should be calibrated correctly and you shouldnt have to spend the extra cash to get it to look like its suppose to.

One opinion that some have stated is that "look like it's supposed to" is a subjective phrase.

In your last post you said that innovations are made based on what consumers need/want which would imply that innovations aren't based on what a product is "supposed" to do, but rather on the whims of the marketplace. Home Theater enthusiasts like us shouldn't be fooled into thinking that our DLPs are "supposed" to be completely calibrated. They're *supposed* to display images. To wit....

Your Acura has lasted 7 years and done just fine. It's gotten you from point A to B. That's what it's supposed to do, right? But if you wanted to you could have gone to an aftermarket company and had them mod your car to give it both better gas mileage *and* more horsepower. Does that mean Acura should have done this for you because it was *possible*? Just because you're completely satisfied with it doesn't mean it's performing to the best of its abilities. And what Craig was suggesting was that TVs should perform to certain specifications (I don't remember him defining *all* of them, but I'm assuming ISF calibration to be one of them), but that they don't. He spoke with such disdain of Samsung that it was as if Samsung was the only company and TVs the only product that don't receive unique top-notch care for each display in service. That doesn't come close to meaning that the TV *isn't* performing like it's supposed to though. It gets images from a source to your eyes and gives you features to change what those images look like. To me it sounds like it's performing just as its supposed to. Reality is more like, it's not performing how it's *possible* to. And some people will pay a premium to make as many of those possibilities a reality as they can, just like I will for the software that gave me 3mpg and 10hp extra in my car, or some will for their Denon DVD players to get better D/A conversions. But that premium would be too much for many consumers to pay who don't care if their set is at 6500K and are just happy without the extra mods to get it there. The man-hours investment per set would be so great that few people could afford them. That's hardly worth it for companies to do when they know that the majority of the marketplace doesn't care if the TV they're buying is properly calibrated anyway. So, make it less expensive to sell more to Joe Six Pack *and* give the videophiles of the world the option to spend more on aftermarket care to exploit their TV to the best of its abilities. I suspect $300-$500 premium for that care is less than they'd be spending if it was happening on the assembly-line.

For reference, check http://www.underwoodhifi.com/mod_denon.html to see just how expensive a product adjusted to its max capabilities can cost versus the same product straight off the assembly line.

As far as actual *defects* are concerned, like a/v sync issues and what/not, I'm all for better checks and balances to fix those problems and *do* think Samsung dropped the ball in a few places. But they're also no different than any other manufacturer of any other product in the world.

But "calibration" and "fixes" should not be considered the same thing.

Rick

Please note this very significant post - new "HLN" model?

NEW Samsung DLP Tantus Model Information
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=361209

Arun, Have you heard anything about this new model? I'm going to try to find out additional info tomorrow, but I am certain the rep I was speaking to was reading from a spec sheet. Perhaps you can also call one of your contacts to get some info.

HLN567W replaced 1/17/04.

Almost looks liek there is a small piece of lint trapped behind the screen. Thought this was not an issue with DLP. Can't rellay see it from normal viewing range, but can see it up to 6 or 7 feet.

Had to return my first set beause of the "3 Blinking light" problem. This one was delivered on January 17th so I am still inside my 30 days. Should I exchange it?

Could this have "developed" in the last 2 weeks? If so, does that mean others could as well?

Thanks.

I guess what I was trying to convey was why arent TV's set to NTSC standards out of the box, and why not have all of the alignment issues taken care of as well. You are right that Samsung is not the only one who doesnt do this. But some manufacturers get it close. As far as mods are concern, I don't think it applies to what I was getting at. I was simply talking about calibration so that the set is at NTSC standards. If people want to upgrade products they buy with more expensive parts...that is up to them. To me, if i wanted to spend that much money on fixing a Denon DVD player, I would just buy a DVD player that maybe fits what I'm looking for. So if the Denon costs 1200 bucks and the mods are like 600...well maybe I will look in the 2000 price range for another brand. And I picked my car because everything that it offered and said it offered I wanted. If I wanted more HP or better gas mileage, I would have bought something else. There is nothing wrong with people wanting to do that, but that is not what I was getting at.

They are shipped at NTSC standards ... Never The Same Color! ;)

Originally posted by sage540
HLN567W replaced 1/17/04.

Almost looks liek there is a small piece of lint trapped behind the screen. Thought this was not an issue with DLP. Can't rellay see it from normal viewing range, but can see it up to 6 or 7 feet.

Had to return my first set beause of the "3 Blinking light" problem. This one was delivered on January 17th so I am still inside my 30 days. Should I exchange it?

Could this have "developed" in the last 2 weeks? If so, does that mean others could as well?

Thanks.
If it is a dead mirror, you should exchange it.

Sorry to break up the fight. Both sides have valid points. Arun has given us every technophiles dream someone with a lot of knowledge we can bug with questions. Thank you Arun for all your efforts. You are to be commended on all you have done. Who else has taken the time to put something together like his manual for nothing in return except our appreciation.

But, the complaints have merits, too. Paying over 4 grand for a TV you would expect it to be pretty close to right on out of the box and a lot of them are not, come on admit it. If there wasn't a problem here there would not be so many people posting abouit the green push.

Which brings me to my subject. I am looking for a ISF Calibrationist in the Chicago area. I have attempted to get in touch with Jim Burns at Burns Digital Consulting, but he hasn't acknowledged my emails and when I did briefly get him on the phone he said he was on another call and would call me back. I am still waiting to hear from him.

Since I do not know him, I don't think is personal, and I did use my anti-perspirant, is there maybe something about the HLN567W that calibrationists don't like?

And can anyone with a Sammy DLP recommend another ISF Calibrationist in the Chicago area with experience on our sets. To get rid of the green push that does bug me and I will drop the bucks to get it adjusted.

Along the lines of what Arun is talking about, HDTV and digital TV (not to mention DVI, etc.) are more discontinuous innovations that we are typically used to in consumer electronics. But there is a defined product lifecycle for technology products and early adopters are necessary for pretty much all discontinuous innovations. And there are defined buyer characteristics for early adopters. They are typically looking for new technologies. They are visionary. In other words, they see the need for a product before it is even introduced and are therefor anxious to purchase it. Because of this, they are also financially agressive nad risk prone. Most technology companies will use these early adopter customers as beta testers. The help finance R&D in exchange for having influence over the product's development. It sounds to me like you're playing in a early adopter playground but don't have the necessary early adopter mindset.

Arun,

Can you provide more information on the new cablecard option on the DLP sets being released toward the end of the year. Is this cablecard option a digital input similar to the DVI and HDMI? I am planning to purchase one of the Sammy HLPs toward the end of the year and from some scattered information, I've heard that a cablecard would replace the set top box.

I've gone into your document on Sammy DLPs and could not find anything relating to this (of course I'm not very audio/video savvy), but if I'm going to spend this kind of money, I like to research everything I can about this product. Thanks in advance.

The Cablecard option will be available for extra $$ ($500?) on all or most sets in the second half of the year.

This is what I have said in "Selecting an HD Display" (http://www.digiupdate.com/100_Selecting_HD_Display.html)so I'll repeat it here:

"Built-in vs. External HD Tuners: All sets, regardless of technology will provide the option of a built-in ATSC high definition tuner and possibly even a cable tuner with CableCard. Since it costs a few hundred dollars for this option, you should select it only if 1) you are not a satellite DBS customer and don’t intend to become one during the life of your TV 2) You don’t need / want an external tuner with a Digital Video Recorder option. Generally, we currently recommend that high definition tuner be in a separate set-top box."

arun and other Sammy owners,

I'm curious, how well does your dlp display a PC game that doesn't support widescreen resolutions the way Halo does? Are you forced to use 800x600? I'm curious how well your sets handles this.

I aplogise if I missed prior discussions on this.

Thanks,

LR

DVI has finally been activated on my Moto 5100 box. One interesting thing on my HLN617 is when you put the Moto 5100 in the mode to display 480i material in the 480p mode instead of shutting the override to off a new menu option appear called "normal" on the Sammy that actually displays the picture at 480p resolution (small but sharp). You still have the TV and PC wide modes which stretch the picture. I even tried the 480i mode and it was somewhat stable. Occasionally you had to shut off the 5100 and turn it back on to resync the picture.

Anyone looking at a new Samsung DLP set should consider this announcement of an upgraded HLN567W1 Tantus model. See the breaking news here:

http://www.digiupdate.com/P001_Samsung_HLN_DLP_2003.html

We don't know yet if there will be an upgraded 46" Tantus model.

Originally posted by PaulGo
DVI has finally been activated on my Moto 5100 box. One interesting thing on my HLN617 is when you put the Moto 5100 in the mode to display 480i material in the 480p mode instead of shutting the override to off a new menu option appear called "normal" on the Sammy that actually displays the picture at 480p resolution (small but sharp). You still have the TV and PC wide modes which stretch the picture. I even tried the 480i mode and it was somewhat stable. Occasionally you had to shut off the 5100 and turn it back on to resync the picture.

The DVI was just activated on my 5100 too. I must say that I was expecting more. It's hard to even tell the difference between DVI and Component 3 as I A/Bed them. I'm probably going to continue using the comp 3 so I don't needed a switch for my Bravo D1. Were you underwhelmed as well?

I have yet to read a post from someone that "had a box activated" that was pleased with the DVI picture. It kind of leads me to believe activation is a complicated and delicate thing and maybe only those that are engineered for Samsungs (such as the STBs made by Samsung) are truly compatible. It's not as simple as seeing a picture thru DVI and saying yep it works. Some work smoothly and some don't work as well as they should.

Sounds more like a Motorola problem to me (maybe why they shipped with DVI disabled) -- I have used a DVI Sony HD DirectTV receiver, PC DVI, and a DVI DVD (Bravo D1). The Samsung had no problems with any of them.

Ditto on Paul_PDX's post... the Sammie will display a proper DVI input, if it gets one. No problems with a Bravo or a Sony 300 with many switches of inputs via manual cable methods! Samsung sure didn't make these LG/Sony/Hughes or Bravo boxes!

Samunsg #5 in global brands.

http://www.brandchannel.com/start1.asp?id=195

"Equally impressive, Samsung shot into the top five from a twelfth place finish in 2002 and 49th in 2001 to finish fifth, behind Coca-Cola, in 2003. This is vindication for a brand that has poured a lot of resources into improving the quality, scope and distribution of its product on the world stage. It beat out Sony (ninth) in the global rankings but came in second behind the Japanese consumer electronic giant in the Asia-Pacific regional ranking. "

Originally posted by Paul_PDX
Sounds more like a Motorola problem to me (maybe why they shipped with DVI disabled) -- I have used a DVI Sony HD DirectTV receiver, PC DVI, and a DVI DVD (Bravo D1). The Samsung had no problems with any of them.

To be clear, it isn't that there is a problem per se, it is more that there wasn't the dramatic pq improvement I saw when I swtiched to a DVI DVD player.

Your User Name,

Do your comments apply to HDTV channels? SDTV? Both?

Thanks
Bruce

Both. I noticed little difference. Period. I left the component 3 hooked up and then did a back and forth A/B check on HD broadcasts, SD broadcast on HD channels and SD on SD channels and I noticed pretty much no difference.

Originally posted by Sea Ray
It kind of leads me to believe activation is a complicated and delicate thing and maybe only those that are engineered for Samsungs (such as the STBs made by Samsung) are truly compatible.

My Sony SATHD300 box via DVI works great on my HLN5065. I tried it via component cables just for grins, and it looked fuzzy and out of focus compared to the DVI feed - although it was most noticeable on the on-screen menus and stuff.

Originally posted by Your User Name:
Both. I noticed little difference. Period. I left the component 3 hooked up and then did a back and forth A/B check on HD broadcasts, SD broadcast on HD channels and SD on SD channels and I noticed pretty much no difference.
Of course make sure that 1) resolution is set to 720p 2) the TV aspect is set to TV-wide.

If you don't see the difference, then I would guess that your STB's DVI out is not a pure-digital port.

Originally posted by jfischer
My Sony SATHD300 box via DVI works great on my HLN5065. I tried it via component cables just for grins, and it looked fuzzy and out of focus compared to the DVI feed - although it was most noticeable on the on-screen menus and stuff.

I honestly haven't read many complaints about the Sony box or the one Voom is using but then there's the Pace and other Pioneer boxes which I haven't heard of anyone saying DVI was better than component and most say it was worse. Some report a snowy interchange inbetween channel changes and a darker picture than component leading me to believe these boxes are not communicating properly with the Samsung.

I'm not saying the STB has to be a Samsung but it has to be a box that will communicate properly with the TV. In other words, not all DVI outputs are equal...

Originally posted by Sea Ray
I'm not saying the STB has to be a Samsung but it has to be a box that will communicate properly with the TV. In other words, not all DVI outputs are equal...

I have a Dish921 hooked to my HLN507 and have no complaints about the PQ through DVI. I can't really do an A/B comparison though, since the 921 disables component output when DVI is active.

-Chris

Originally posted by arungupta
Of course make sure that
1) resolution is set to 720p.

Check!

Originally posted by arungupta
2) the TV aspect is set to TV-wide.

Check!


Originally posted by arungupta
If you don't see the difference, then I would guess that your STB's DVI out is not a pure-digital port.

:(

I sat in front of the 50" HLN last night for a bit at the store, cycling through their DirectTV feeds. Obviously CBS-HD looked great (Pearl Harbor though), but on many of the other channels the digital compression was quite obvious and you could see pixellation all over the place.

I know that this is not really the HLN's fault (its DTV), but my question is will this effect be the same on Digital Cable? (I read that most cable is still bifurcated with the lower channels still analog) I have only analog cable now and most channels are good, while a few are ghosty.

Also, if I were to get the HLN and just stick with Analog cable rather than switching to digital, what will the effect be? Will the picture look a little fuzzy like it does now, but not necessarily "pixellated" because it is not true digital? Or does the HLN convert everything to digital so it will still be pixellated? I'd almost rather have the fuzziness than feel like I'm looking at a rough MPEG movie.

See these two posts:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=3316832#post3316832

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?postid=3315468#post3315468

Question: Can the Samsung convert a plain old analog signal to the various screen formats (4:3 Normal, Zoom1, Zoom2, etc), or only the digital signals?

I hate the Stretch look on SD channels, so I'll want to use one of the other formats. Just wanting to know whether sticking with analog cable will still be an option (I don't really care about all the PPV and whatever extra stuff comes with digital cable) plus my condo has a great deal on analog cable so there is significant expense moving to something else.

Are many SD channels or individual programs broadcast in Widescreen these days?

Originally posted by Hogan
Question: Can the Samsung convert a plain old analog signal to the various screen formats (4:3 Normal, Zoom1, Zoom2, etc), or only the digital signals?

I hate the Stretch look on SD channels, so I'll want to use one of the other formats. Just wanting to know whether sticking with analog cable will still be an option (I don't really care about all the PPV and whatever extra stuff comes with digital cable) plus my condo has a great deal on analog cable so there is significant expense moving to something else.

Are many SD channels or individual programs broadcast in Widescreen these days?

Yes, the Samsung can convert analog signals to the various screen formats. No reason to suffer through stretched 4:3 shows.

However, I think you'll be disappointed in the Samsung if you solely watch analog shows on it. Frankly there are sets that show analog material much better such as non- HD compatible ones.

We "satisfied Sammy owners" merely tolerate analog material so we can enjoy the DVD and D experiences as they happen.

If you use the ANT input you'll get no pixelization of analog material but it'll likely be grainy because you are blowing up and showing all the flaws of an analog feed. That's not a good situation.

Thanks - good to know. I understand that there will be a tradeoff in getting a larger TV at this point -- my current is a 3 yr old Panny 32" 4:3 w/ component input from the DVD. On 4:3 SD it is fine but when I watch DVDs the letterboxing makes the screen somewhat small for my taste.

Perhaps the best way to rationalize a new purchase is compare the big upside of a true 16:9, bigscreen DVD experience with the downside of more pronounced flaws in the regular cable signal. Of course, HD will ultimately solve this but it sounds like we are quite far away from the time when most programs are broadcast in HD.

Q: Are ALL CBS, NBC and ABC prime time programs broadcast in HD as well? How about Fox? I live in Chicago proper so I should have no problem pulling a good HD signal OTA from the Sears Tower. Would you guys suggest buying my own HD receiver or paying to upgrade to digital cable and then renting an HD receiver through Comcast? If you do that, can you still pull HD OTA and run it through the Comcast box or is that redundant at that point (ie the signals coming from Comcast will be as good or better than OTA)?

Originally posted by Hogan
Q: Are ALL CBS, NBC and ABC prime time programs broadcast in HD as well? How about Fox? I live in Chicago proper so I should have no problem pulling a good HD signal OTA from the Sears Tower. Would you guys suggest buying my own HD receiver or paying to upgrade to digital cable and then renting an HD receiver through Comcast? If you do that, can you still pull HD OTA and run it through the Comcast box or is that redundant at that point (ie the signals coming from Comcast will be as good or better than OTA)?

See this thread:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=164671

Originally posted by Hogan

Q: Are ALL CBS, NBC and ABC prime time programs broadcast in HD as well? How about Fox? I live in Chicago proper so I should have no problem pulling a good HD signal OTA from the Sears Tower. Would you guys suggest buying my own HD receiver or paying to upgrade to digital cable and then renting an HD receiver through Comcast? If you do that, can you still pull HD OTA and run it through the Comcast box or is that redundant at that point (ie the signals coming from Comcast will be as good or better than OTA)?

Most primetime broadcasts from the big three are HD but not all. Tonight Show is also in HD.

I would suggest getting the digital upgrade from Comcast and rent the HD box from them. It probably will be about the same rent as they would charge you for the digital box w/o HD. I don't know if they have an HD antenna you can tap into on top of the Sears Tower. If you can, you'd still need to buy an HD box for it which would probably run you $500 or more.

I'll bet you can pull in all kinds of stations with a Sears Tower antenna. How many cities does that reach?

I have just received delivery of a Samsung HLN617W and am trying to figure the best interface with a Comcast HD set top box. I am presently using the component input on the Samsung which works great for the HD signal but does not convert the standard digital channels to a supported format on that input. I am presently using an S-video input for non-HD signals but have to change inputs when I move from one signal to the other. Is there a better way to do this. When I subscribed to Comcast they told me that the DVI output on the box was functional which is not true. Now they tell me sometime in the next 6 months they will retrofit the box to have the output working. I am thinking about returning to Dishnetwork because of this.

Read the thread in HDTV hardware about the Motorola 5100. You need to access the hidden menu on the Motorola 5100 by pressing power off and then menu. You should have it set to 720p and the 4:3 override to off or 480p. If the menu does not display because it is in the wrong mode you can adjust it using the LED display on the 5100. The 5100 thread refers you to a guide that will help you. Comcast should have correctly set the box since all the channels should be viewable through the component output.

Q: what is it called when the picture -- particularly in low light gradients looks like oil on water? I hope you get my meaning by that description; it was the best I could think of. I'm assuming this is a source material issue as it is not on all sources.

Originally posted by PaulGo
Read the thread in HDTV hardware about the Motorola 5100. You need to access the hidden menu on the Motorola 5100 by pressing power off and then menu. You should have it set to 720p and the 4:3 override to off or 480p. If the menu does not display because it is in the wrong mode you can adjust it using the LED display on the 5100. The 5100 thread refers you to a guide that will help you. Comcast should have correctly set the box since all the channels should be viewable through the component output.
If you can't see the menu on your TV screen and have difficulty negotiating the LED display, do this:

Connect to Component 1 on the TV.
Go to the 5100 menu (see above).
Set the output to 480p and override to OFF.
Move the component cables to Component 2.
Go to the 5100 menu again and set output to 720p, leave override set to OFF.

You're done!

My thanks to paulgo and flex727. I will try what you have suggested when I get home this evening. My thanks also to all those who participate in this thread. It has been incredibly helpful.

Originally posted by Your User Name:
Q: what is it called when the picture -- particularly in low light gradients looks like oil on water? I hope you get my meaning by that description; it was the best I could think of. I'm assuming this is a source material issue as it is not on all sources.
See "DLP Dark shades dithering" in my signature.

I am asking all HLN owners who have experienced an a/v sync problem to post in this thread:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=364476

Samsung HLN567W with comcast digital cable/HD motorola 6200. Why do you suggest setting the resolution to 720p vs 1081i?

theo,

i have the sammy dlp hln43 with comcast and motorola 6200 stb.

the reason you should set the box to 720p is because no matter what the sammy can only display ANY hd content in it's native mode: 720p. therefore it will convert any 1080i it gets to 720p. i figure they are saying to set the box to 720p because then you can view 720p stations (espn, abc, fox??) in their true unaltered mode. if you leave the cable box to 1080i, it will change the abc and espn broadcast to 1080i and then your tv will change it back to 720p. setting the box to 720p at least lets the 720p stuff come in to the tv unaltered. obviously all the 1080i stuff (cbs,nbc,hbo,inhd1,inhd2,etc) is going to get converted, in this case it will be done by the box rather than the tv. which i'm not sure if it makes much difference.

Native resolution for HLN567W is 720. Set will just work more converting the 1080 signal to 720.

Thanks

Originally posted by arungupta
See "DLP Dark shades dithering" in my signature.

Thanks Arun, I have read that thread, but it doesn't sound like what I'm talking about. I'll try to findand post a specific example of what I'm talking about.

I had two strange things happen on my tv while I was messing around with various configs. I have a Pioneer HD STB with DVI and component outs. With the dvi set up when I change channels among the hd channels the screen turns to snow for about two to five seconds, then goes black for a second then the picture comes in fine. Is this common?

When I set the tv up through the component outs on the stb and set the box to output in all formats some channels caused the tv to flash green and reds like a freaky light show and I could hear what sounded like the color wheel slowing down. I'm only guessing at that part, but it made a very audible whirring noise that sounded like a spinning wheel decelerating. Then the screen would go blue and say unsupported format. I believe it happened on the fox networks both in the sd and hd channels on my twc in nyc.
Thoughs?
Thanks

Originally posted by plevine
I had two strange things happen on my tv while I was messing around with various configs. I have a Pioneer HD STB with DVI and component outs. With the dvi set up when I change channels among the hd channels the screen turns to snow for about two to five seconds, then goes black for a second then the picture comes in fine. Is this common?

When I set the tv up through the component outs on the stb and set the box to output in all formats some channels caused the tv to flash green and reds like a freaky light show and I could hear what sounded like the color wheel slowing down. I'm only guessing at that part, but it made a very audible whirring noise that sounded like a spinning wheel decelerating. Then the screen would go blue and say unsupported format. I believe it happened on the fox networks both in the sd and hd channels on my twc in nyc.
Thoughs?
Thanks
1st of All, I too am in NYC using the Pio HD STB with DVI to a Sammy DLP. The problem you expereince with activiating the channel guide seems to be a bug with the STB DVI software; I'm experiencing that too, and obviously that should not happen. I have not emailed TWCNYC about this specific problem, though.

Your other question has to do with the Sammy's Component inputs not accpeting 480i - except for component 1, which is supposed to be for DVD player connections only. So when you set the Pio HD STB to output all formats, the Sammy won't recognize any 480i signals, and therefore you get the blue screen error msg.

BTW, for me, I am definetely getting a better PQ with the DVI connection than with component with the Pio HD STB. Not everyone in NYC with the same setup as us are getting the same results - in fact, some TWCNYC Sammy users have gone back to component from DVI because the PQ was worse with DVI. What's you expereince?

I called Samsung yesterday for Tommy Thompson (or is it Tommy Tomas?). Couldn't get him, but was told that they're getting "real close " to releasing the Malibu chassis, which they hope will fix the A/V sync problem many of us with HLN's are experiencing.

When I had spoken with Tommy previously, he also told me I should also get the new E10 lens installed. I have an HLN5065W.

I was much happier with the DVI PQ, the component output was much darker on my tv. Then, when that freaky issue happened, I went back to dvi and left it there. So, I guess if I do use component, I should exclude 480i as an output. Will the box convert it to something else or will the station be unwatchable? I thought I had put the box on 780p, but maybe not.

I do have a few complaints about the dvi output. First, some of the hd channels have a jagged bar of white a couple of millimeters wide running across the top of the image right along the border of the tv. Second, I wish I had more aspect ratio options with the dvi. There are a lot of programs in SD that run in widescreen mode on their network which results in bars all the way around the image and a very small picture in the center. And, you can't use both the dvi and the component, once you plug the dvi in you disable the component outputs. Third, I have the audio/video sinc issue through the dvi, but with respect to that I have to join the club.

Any word on the TWC HD-DVR? I have an unwatchable Tivo image (and sync issue) right now and can't wait to step up.

First, some of the hd channels have a jagged bar of white a couple of millimeters wide running across the top of the image right along the border of the tv.
- Is you aspect set to TV-wide? They may be 'scan lines' that would go away with the overscan. These are generated by your STB not the TV.

I am pretty sure it is set to TV-Wide. Is there something I can change on the STB? It was not noticable during the grammies except during commercials. I looked on the stb menu for picture adjustments but couldn't find any.

Got my 467 yesterday. Had a devil of a time getting the Bravo D1 to send the DVI signal to the TV. Finally it did. I have no idea how it happened except that I also hooked up the s-video cable. Instructions are poor in the Bravo manual. Just hooking the DVI cable up did not do the trick.

Any help as to how to do it in the future?

Stunning picture!

That is all I have hooked up so far. More to come.

The instructions with my Bravo indicated that initial setup required the s-video connection first. Then set the DVI output however you like, and it should stay that way. If you have problems, just repeatedly click the "TV Mode" button on the remote control until the front display of the Bravo shows "DVI 720p" on it.

Also, sometimes, if you have the Bravo powered *completely* down (i.e, *not* on standby), it will forget what TV Mode it was on, so you'll have to cycle through to "DVI 720p" again. I'm not sure if V Inc. has improved on these "features" at all lately, though.

Rick

Rick

Thanks. So the s-video did the trick. I guess I did not read close enough in my excitement to get a picture.

Joe

I keep my Bravo off (totally off) all the time, since I've read many reports that it didn't like standby, so/but I've never lost the 720p setting. Now, mine was a 6/2003 model, so YMMV.

What do you mean it doesn't like standby mode? I've had mt Bravo for a few monthes now and it is ALWAYS in standby. I think I've only completely powered down once or twice. FWIW, I don't lose my 720p mode by powering down either.

Had a mirror stuck on my HLN4365 - 970 lamp hours or so - Called Samsung two days ago -got warranty service through KO Electronics in Dallas (972-233-6600) TODAY - replaced engine and a new lamp to boot! Kudos to both for speed, service, and quality. I am extremely happy with the performance of this set driven by the Samsung TS160 HD receiver and the Panasonic RP-82 DVD.

Originally posted by Jagmin
Had a mirror stuck on my HLN4365 - 970 lamp hours or so - Called Samsung two days ago -got warranty service through KO Electronics in Dallas (972-233-6600) TODAY - replaced engine and a new lamp to boot! Kudos to both for speed, service, and quality. I am extremely happy with the performance of this set driven by the Samsung TS160 HD receiver and the Panasonic RP-82 DVD.

I take it you are using Directv? Are you using DVI?

Originally posted by Jagmin
Had a mirror stuck on my HLN4365 - 970 lamp hours or so - Called Samsung two days ago -got warranty service through KO Electronics in Dallas (972-233-6600) TODAY - replaced engine and a new lamp to boot! Kudos to both for speed, service, and quality. I am extremely happy with the performance of this set driven by the Samsung TS160 HD receiver and the Panasonic RP-82 DVD.

Do you know if the new lamp came with the new Light Engine? If so I need to ask the tech if he could leave the old one (lamp) with me for a back up.
Mine is getting replaced because of issues with the lens reflecting weird line patterns on the screen. :mad:

Thanks for and info.

'pilot

For those considering 61", 43" or 50" HLN, check the breaking news section at:

http://www.digiupdate.com/P001_Samsung_HLN_DLP_2003.html

Using Directv and DVI. I have the same issue with non-HD content and compression as others have reported. I was surprised to get a new lamp, but apparently it was part of the replacement package. I did not look a gift horse in the mouth, although I did think about asking for the old lamp. I am resigned to ordering and keeping a spare on hand.

Originally posted by arungupta
For those considering 61", 43" or 50" HLN, check the breaking news section at:

http://www.digiupdate.com/P001_Samsung_HLN_DLP_2003.html

Has anyone had experience taking these across the border? I live in Vancouver, Canada, but I can get it shipped to Blaine.

(I have posted this question in the dvd thread, but thought it might be a good question here as well... )

A quick question... I have the Samsung 5065w DLP, with an available DVI input. While I am convinced that I need to buy a DVI capable DVD player, as PQ for DVD home theater is my primary concern, I am finding that brand and model choice is a difficult decision, and will not become easier with the introduction of new models in the near future. I am resigned to the difficulty in sorting this out, but do have one question that I have not seen addressed here in the AVS forum. That is...

When connecting to a Samsung DLP, does a Sammy DVD DVI capable player have any advantage in PQ or compatability over other models?

No it doesn't. In fact, of the current models Bravo D1 does a better job than Samsung 931.

However, Samsung 941 appears to be a very good player, but so does Bravo D2 and many other new players.

I have a Sammy 5065W. Why is the Auto Volume feature grayed out in component mode and not grayed out in ANT mode. Is that a Sammy limitation or do I need to change a config? Which inputs have auto volume enabled?

Rad,
Because the only input which actually is capable of being "auto volume" controlled is the normal NTSC ANTENNA input. The compressor/limiter that they use so that the commercials aren't 140dB louder than the normal programs isn't available for anything other than the antenna feed... goofy, but it's what I figured out. Honestly, I think MOST of us are running our sound to home theater systems and not listening to the internal speakers anyway, so fo most it's a moot point.

Hope that helps,
Jeff


Originally posted by MD_RADMAN
I have a Sammy 5065W. Why is the Auto Volume feature grayed out in component mode and not grayed out in ANT mode. Is that a Sammy limitation or do I need to change a config? Which inputs have auto volume enabled?

Thanks Iceblade.
I just moved into the HDTV world so I haven't added a home theater system yet. Are you saying that a home theater system would give me a consistent volume level? If it does I'll have to get one soon because the continual volume adjustment drives my wife crazy.

RAD,

Nope, not saying that at all. Unless your particular receiver/pre-pro or whatever has a built in volume function, you will always have to suffer the "drive the wife crazy" factor. I was just saying that since most of use use home theater stuff for the audio, we never even attempted to play with the "auto volume" functionality of the tv itself. I'd love to help you pick out a home theater receiver or pre-amp that had that compressor/limiter functionality built-in, but I am unaware of any such product. Perhaps post something over in the receiver's forum?

Later,
Jeff


Later,
Jeff
Originally posted by MD_RADMAN
Thanks Iceblade.
I just moved into the HDTV world so I haven't added a home theater system yet. Are you saying that a home theater system would give me a consistent volume level? If it does I'll have to get one soon because the continual volume adjustment drives my wife crazy.

Last night I tried watching a DVD on my Bravo D1 & 467. The DVD said something like 1.2 anamorphic version. It did not fill the screen.

Can I do something to expand it to use all the screen.

Thanks

Ok....I've searched for a little while and can't quite find the answer to my question. I'm sure it's been discussed, but please bear with me here.

I just purchased the 50" HLN. Moving to a new place, and am setting up D*. Now, I have 2 young children so we will be using a fair bit of DVD. But I am also a sports junky, and want the absolute best quality for HDTV.

There is only one DVI input. I may slightly lean towards caring a little more about HDTV than movies- I mean, how much greater is Elmo really going to look?

The question is this- will I tell the difference using DVI over component moreso in one of these formats? And is there ANY way to get them both DVI?

Thanks!

Originally posted by macd23
theo,

i have the sammy dlp hln43 with comcast and motorola 6200 stb.

the reason you should set the box to 720p is because no matter what the sammy can only display ANY hd content in it's native mode: 720p. therefore it will convert any 1080i it gets to 720p. i figure they are saying to set the box to 720p because then you can view 720p stations (espn, abc, fox??) in their true unaltered mode. if you leave the cable box to 1080i, it will change the abc and espn broadcast to 1080i and then your tv will change it back to 720p. setting the box to 720p at least lets the 720p stuff come in to the tv unaltered. obviously all the 1080i stuff (cbs,nbc,hbo,inhd1,inhd2,etc) is going to get converted, in this case it will be done by the box rather than the tv. which i'm not sure if it makes much difference.

I have the 5100 and the HLN507. I just got the DVI working on the 5100. I have the resolution output set to 720p on the 5100. Using the DVI input I now get a smaller window than the feed from my component cables. If I set the 5100 to output 1081i i get a full screen on the Sammy. Is there a setting I need to change on the Sammy to get 720p to display full screen with the DVI input? The 720p signal has about 1" of black on all sides with the DVI.

Gary943

Originally posted by Gary943
I have the 5100 and the HLN507. I just got the DVI working on the 5100. I have the resolution output set to 720p on the 5100. Using the DVI input I now get a smaller window than the feed from my component cables. If I set the 5100 to output 1081i i get a full screen on the Sammy. Is there a setting I need to change on the Sammy to get 720p to display full screen with the DVI input? The 720p signal has about 1" of black on all sides with the DVI.

Gary943

Gary,

Try changing the "ASPECT" on the remote. You'll want to set it on "WIDE TV" instead of "WIDE PC". That should do the trick.

When you use the DVI input, the aspect ratio only has these two options.

Good luck.

Gold23,
There are DVI switches you can buy which will allow you to share the DVI connection. In my opinion, there is a significant improvement watching through DVI on the Samsung DLPs. I suggest you either get a switch, or manually swap the cable between your DVD player and HDTV tuner. I just use a M-F DVI cable that goes to the TV and swap between the two M-M cables from my DVD player and HDTV tuner. It's not very elegant, but it works.

Originally posted by MJConnel
Gold23,
There are DVI switches you can buy which will allow you to share the DVI connection. In my opinion, there is a significant improvement watching through DVI on the Samsung DLPs. I suggest you either get a switch, or manually swap the cable between your DVD player and HDTV tuner. I just use a M-F DVI cable that goes to the TV and swap between the two M-M cables from my DVD player and HDTV tuner. It's not very elegant, but it works.

Gold23,

What kind of D* Set-top-box will you be using? I have a Sony HD200, which in addition to component and DVI, also has a VGA output. While I agree that on these Sammies DVI is the best, for a while there I was watching so much DVD that I went ahead and connected my HD200 up using the VGA cable. It came the closest to replicating what I saw on DVI. Better than component cable did, and nearly as good as DVI (though I could still see a difference). I likely would still be set-up this way if it wasn't for my VGA cable going faulty on me (and my being too lazy to buy a new one!) So I do just what MJConnel said. I swap the cables out depending on which source I use.

Rick

For the last 10 days I've been enjoying my new HLN, with my new cable box DVI to the TVs DVI and my old DVD player to the component 1 input. Ah simplicity! But today my Denon AVR-1804 receiver and a Rocket 5.1 speaker package arrived on the scene to complicate things (in a good way, of course).

My question - obviously I'm going to keep DVI-DVI using the cable box, and it seems logical to me that I'd always want the component out of the DVD player to go directly to the Samsung's component in. But the Denon manual shows VCR, DVD, etc. video signals being connected to the AVR. So I'm asking, why would I ever want to route any video signal through the AVR? I mean, I just can't see what circumstances where this extra step would be beneficial. Yes, I'll want to connect the video out of the Denon to the Samsung for viewing the setup menu and controls, but why else would one put the amp into the equation for the video signal? Am I missing something fundamental? Thanks!

Frank

Originally posted by frank3si
Yes, I'll want to connect the video out of the Denon to the Samsung for viewing the setup menu and controls, but why else would one put the amp into the equation for the video signal? Am I missing something fundamental? Thanks!


This is useful in at least two situations:

1) When you've got more component video devices than you have inputs on your TV.

2) When it's easier for others to simply switch to the component they want to watch on the receiver and not worry about also switching the TV's input to match.

It's probably always best if you can go straight to the TV, but in some cases there are good reasons for using the component switching on the A/V receiver...

Originally posted by frank3si
For the last 10 days I've been enjoying my new HLN, with my new cable box DVI to the TVs DVI and my old DVD player to the component 1 input. Ah simplicity! But today my Denon AVR-1804 receiver and a Rocket 5.1 speaker package arrived on the scene to complicate things (in a good way, of course).

My question - obviously I'm going to keep DVI-DVI using the cable box, and it seems logical to me that I'd always want the component out of the DVD player to go directly to the Samsung's component in. But the Denon manual shows VCR, DVD, etc. video signals being connected to the AVR. So I'm asking, why would I ever want to route any video signal through the AVR? I mean, I just can't see what circumstances where this extra step would be beneficial. Yes, I'll want to connect the video out of the Denon to the Samsung for viewing the setup menu and controls, but why else would one put the amp into the equation for the video signal? Am I missing something fundamental? Thanks!

Frank
In an anlog video path, every extra connection potentially degrades the signal, so the most direct connection is the best. When you have SD video and a small size TV, the degradation is not noticeable. For HD on a large size TV, it is a material issue. You should try it both ways and decide if you see a material difference.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by arungupta
[B]For those considering 61", 43" or 50" HLN, check the breaking news section at:

[

Has anyone order a TV from Amazon and if so how is the service??

dcv_2002

dcv what breaking news? I just purchased a 50" Sammy today so im interested in this breaking news.

Wow i need help. Im in Alaska. I contacted amazon and tried to get the 61inch. They told me that they wont ship to Alaska. What can i do to get in on that price and possibly have the tv shipped to me? It would seem that i could purchase the tv and ship it myself using UPS or something. Can someone help me in this?

Has anyone order a TV from Amazon and if so how is the service??

- try to get your local retailer to price match.

Also Amazon generally has a good reputation for fulfilling your order. But I don't believe they actually service if something goes wrong. You would call Samsung.

Again im in Alaska Bestbuy is the only store in the state as far as i know that has DLP and although i bought the 61inch RCA dlp from them they cant get the 61inch Sammy. I exchanged my RCA today for the 50 Sammy and delivery is in 2 weeks. There is no Sammy DLP available here bigger than 50inch. Im trying to get one of the Amazon 61 Sammies but dont know how to ship it, they wont.
'

Oh and by the way my local retailer would price match but they dont carry the 61 inch.

I bought my HLN4365W at Sears. Don't you have a Sears up there? I don't know if they have the 60" models though. CC has them. What about Circuit City?

If you are willing to pay extra, you might be able to arrange the shipping with somebody like Yellow Freight .. I'd give Jason at onecall.com a call and ask him. (Their web site says large items to lower 48 only, but if anybody will do it, I think it would be them, especially if you are willing to pay for the service.

-David

Hey Arun,

Let me add my thanks for your wonderful Samsung DLP guide. It helped push me over the edge and pick up a 467 at Christmas.

Before I get rid of my box, I thought I would post the shipping box dimensions. If anyone else has any they may want to post them. Perhaps we could add them to the guide.

Anyway, my HLN467W box was:

35 H x 44 3/4 W x 20 3/4 D (all dimensions in inches).

Thanks for the guide. I too am considering ordering the 61" Samsung[Dealer link removed from your post AGAIN] . I'll probably take the plunge later today.

One of my co-workers ordered a big screen a month or so ago. According to him, the delivery service (was some kind of freight carrier) was very professional and it arrived without a scratch. I've also read stories where people had them arrived damaged, but then again, it might just seem that way since people who don't have problems rarely post about it.

So I'll be ordering later today. It shows as not shipping for 1-2 weeks, so I can always cancel in a few days if I have buyers remorse, lol.

Brad

I am still looking for a good calibrationist in the Northwest Suburban Chicago area for my HLN567W. Jim Burns of Burns Consulting has not returned any of my several calls or emails, so I am not sure he is still in business or doesn't want to work on Sammy's.

I can go back to Tweeter's where I bought the set, but from my research I would do better to get someone ISF Certified with the correct equipment.

I even went to the ISF website and emailed several people there, listed in my area, but either they only do professional work or items they sell. It also appears that quite a few the certified calibrationist's listed there are no longer active because the links for their websites or email are broken. Is it that certified calibrationists are over-rated?

Can any one offer any other recommendations?

TW Cable is coming tomorrow with the HD DVR for my HLN507. I have basic analogue cable now. Are they going to split it for analogue and digital? Would that make analogue weaker?

Can we keep the non-Sammie-specific questions in the DBS forum or in the HD Hardware Forum? The above really doesn't belong here...

For what it's worth...

I had asked a random associate at the HHGregg located in the Mall Corners shopping center across from Gwinnett Place Mall (those of you in the metro Atlanta area will prolly know the location) why they didn't currently have any Samsungs out for display.

The reply was that after HHGregg had sold their allotment of the sets, they weren't selling any more of the current models and instead were waiting for the newer models to arrive before stocking them again.

Unofficially, the claim was to have the newer models available for April, 2004 for whatever models they are going to carry. I was told to come back by the end of March to check up on this.

Also, a HiFi Buys in the metro Atlanta area mentioned that their next allotment of Samsungs was supposed to be designed exactly the same as the current crop, with the exception of a "1" at the end of the model numbers (i.e.: HLN617W1). A random associate at the store quoted his "cheat sheet" notes from a training session. Supposedly these "new" models are available now, but the computer at this store didn't show anything warehoused.

Further, at this HiFi Buys location, I've been told twice randomly that the replacement bulbs are $300 (another location quoted me $600).

Interesting stuff.

-Phil

Originally posted by arungupta
Has anyone order a TV from Amazon and if so how is the service??

- try to get your local retailer to price match.

Also Amazon generally has a good reputation for fulfilling your order. But I don't believe they actually service if something goes wrong. You would call Samsung.

Arun,

Apparently Amazon and their "amazin'" prices on Sammy DLPs didn't last long. I had had a 61 incher in my "cart" for the past few weeks with the ~$3750 price and now it's been jacked back up to what most offline retailers offer the system: ~$5000.

I wonder if dear ol' "digiupdate" caused them a "problem" or if they're simply trying to become "authorized?" (it used to be that you had to put the product in the "cart" before seeing the sales price). I called Samsung warranty department and they disclaimed any relationship a few weeks ago with Amazon.

Further, I have yet to see an Atlanta-area retailer match the price; the usual response is the "we-know-what-you're-trying-to-do"-type grin followed by a small monologue on the dangers of buying from unauthorized retailers.

-Phil

It probably wasn't the DigiUpdate site but as Arun has pointed out before, Samsung does monitor this forum. I suspect that pressure was applied on Amazon but of course that's just speculation. Regardless, I hope that people that did order their set through Amazon will get the then advertised price and they don't try any shenanigans. This could create a bit of a stink for Amazon if they reneged. I don't think I'd personally buy something over a few hundred dollars from anyone but an authorized dealer.

Originally posted by arungupta
Has anyone order a TV from Amazon and if so how is the service??

- try to get your local retailer to price match.

Also Amazon generally has a good reputation for fulfilling your order. But I don't believe they actually service if something goes wrong. You would call Samsung.
I ordered an HLN437 from Amazon on Jan. 15, at the time the site said it would ship in 1-2 weeks and it shipped exactly two weeks later. I got a call from a freight company (Eagle USA) and arranged for delivery a few days later (right after the superbowl, of course :( )

The whole transaction went fine.

does anyone think the new panny dlp line can take on sammy in both price and features? Mikesan1

Originally posted by mikesan1
does anyone think the new panny dlp line can take on sammy in both price and features? Probably eventually. They're going to have to establish a track record with this technology before I'd consider them.

Originally posted by jbrennan8
Arun --have you posted the How to Build a HTPC yet? I am considereing modifying an old desktop that is quite powerful to use an HTPC with my Samsnung 43 dlp. Thanks for all your great help
Jim
Jim, sorry it is taking a while. My HTPC guide will be out this thursday -- check www.digiupdate.com late thursday evening.

Originally posted by maestro7
Arun,

Apparently Amazon and their "amazin'" prices on Sammy DLPs didn't last long. I had had a 61 incher in my "cart" for the past few weeks with the ~$3750 price and now it's been jacked back up to what most offline retailers offer the system: ~$5000.

I wonder if dear ol' "digiupdate" caused them a "problem" or if they're simply trying to become "authorized?" (it used to be that you had to put the product in the "cart" before seeing the sales price). I called Samsung warranty department and they disclaimed any relationship a few weeks ago with Amazon.

Further, I have yet to see an Atlanta-area retailer match the price; the usual response is the "we-know-what-you're-trying-to-do"-type grin followed by a small monologue on the dangers of buying from unauthorized retailers.

-Phil
Yes, I know they changed the prices back. Hopefully some of you were able to take advantage of them while they lasted. I don't know why they changed them back, maybe they ran out of inventory. Amazon has been selling Samsung DLP's for quite some time, so I don't what their 'authorized status' is. It will be a little strange if Samsung didn't authorize them, considering they are one of the biggest electronics retailers now.

I have posted a draft version of this guide "DVD players with DVI/HDMI":

http://www.digiupdate.com/251_HD_DVD_Players.html

This guide includes the currently shipping players as well as the announced players. I have made an attempt to incorporate all the information contained in this thread, but I am sure the guide is incomplete and even inaccurate in many areas. I would really appreciate if you can help me in filling in the blanks and correcting any errors. Please post in this thread.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=349741

I shall also try to keep the guide up-to-date as players start shipping, or new ones are announced.

I've got an HLN437W and I've got my HD cable box hooked up via DVI.
Is there any on screen display (or any way at all) for me to find out what the original format of the video signal coming in is (480p 720p 1080i)?
Thanks.